February 6, 2025 • 47 mins
This Thursday I'm welcoming Katherine Carver to talk about her new book, "Abandoned: Chronicling the Journeys of Once-Forsaken Dogs." This book is a photographic journal of dogs that were in a shelter/rescue and what their outcomes were, whether they were adopted or not. We will talk about how Katherine was trying to shine a light on these dogs to bring more awareness to animals in the shelter environments. So if you would like to learn more about Katherine and her book please check out the episode after it's uploaded!
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
Good evening everybody, and welcome to Calling All creatures tonight.
My podcast is about a book called Abandoned Chronically Ended
Journeys of One's Forsaken Dogs, and I had the photographer
author of the book I'm with me to talk about it,
Katherine Carver, and she's going to give us some more
(00:25):
insight into the book and about the dogs and what
the UH book is all about. So I am really
glad you could jourin me tonight. Catherine. It's it's great
to talk with you about this.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Thanks for having one.
Speaker 1 (00:42):
Alrighty, So maybe we could just kind of start out
with UH having me tell us just a little bit
about yourself. I mean, how did you get into uh
photography and then when did you kind of start photog
uh photographing animals.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Yeah, that's that's This book came about actually from our
first rescue dog.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
His name was Biscuit, and he was a shelty found
abandoned by a Good Samaritan in North Carolina and was
eventually taken to a a breed specific shelty rescue in
Maryland where we reside, and we ended up being able
to adopt him and for my husband and myself.
Speaker 4 (01:23):
We had never had a dog in our.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
Lives before, we didn't have them growing up, and it
was just such a magical experience.
Speaker 4 (01:32):
And I witnessed him really come out.
Speaker 3 (01:36):
Of his shell, you know, he changed emotionally, physically. He
was a different dog within a few short months.
Speaker 4 (01:44):
And it really got me thinking.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
About other dogs like him.
Speaker 3 (01:50):
And got me thinking about this project which is now
the finished book.
Speaker 5 (01:56):
But what I did was I reached out to local
rescues and shelters to see if they might want to participate,
and he you.
Speaker 4 (02:06):
Know, sharing my getting some background, sharing.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
The story about Biscuit, which led me to this project
and led me to much awareness of that there are
many dogs in need.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
And Biscuit really brought me back to photography and something
Fortunes and High School had was placed in it.
Speaker 6 (02:28):
I needed a dark credit and I fell in love
with the dark room and it just changed my life.
I went into went on to college and I was.
Speaker 3 (02:39):
A business major, and I was fortunate enough in college
to be able to get into some photography dark room
classes and have some of the prerequisites like three metasis
that I would not be good at doing. They weighed
those for me, fortunately, and I was able to keep working,
(03:01):
working on this passion.
Speaker 2 (03:03):
Which I love. I it's very visual and I love
I love making bodies of work.
Speaker 3 (03:10):
And I went on to law school, and like I said,
I had, I had taken some more forces. I did
not go to school for photography, and I had always
promised myself in law school that I would try to.
Speaker 2 (03:24):
Do something with it.
Speaker 3 (03:25):
I had no idea what that would be, but it
was very clear once Fiska entered my life that this
project came about.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
And in this project, which.
Speaker 4 (03:35):
Is now the finished book, I.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
Photographed dogs while they were in a shelter rescue environment,
and then I photographed them. I filled these dogs and
got the requisite permissions and that the adopters and photographed
these dogs again.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
And no one has quite done a project like this.
It's kind of a longitudinal study, if you will, of
these dogs.
Speaker 4 (03:59):
And my hope was I didn't know if I'd be
able to do this.
Speaker 3 (04:02):
This is kind of this concept that I had and
trying to be able to show some emotional or physical change.
Speaker 2 (04:10):
With the dogs.
Speaker 4 (04:11):
And each photograph is accompanied by.
Speaker 3 (04:14):
A narrative through interviews with shelter and rescue personnel for
the first.
Speaker 4 (04:18):
Image, and then of course the adapters on the second image.
Speaker 3 (04:21):
And they're all square of black and white images with
black background.
Speaker 4 (04:27):
So that's kind of a little bit of how this
product came to be.
Speaker 1 (04:33):
So Biscuit was really kind of the beginning of all
of this then with you adopting them.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
Oh, yes, this was.
Speaker 3 (04:40):
If it were not for Biscuit entering my life, I
don't think this project would have ever occurred to me.
Speaker 4 (04:46):
He just really opened something within me that I became.
Speaker 3 (04:51):
Very very curious about what was happening to these dogs
like him because he was, just, like I said, left and.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
He changed our lives as as much as his life.
Speaker 3 (05:01):
Changed from having you know, a loving home and being
part of the family. So it was it was just
a very interesting experience from never having an animal in
my life and he just really changed everything.
Speaker 1 (05:15):
Well, that's awesome. Seems like it was a really good
experience having him come into your life and getting you
to do this project. So so the dogs and the
dogs shelters rescues that were in your book, now these
that were rescue shelters and stuff that were like local
(05:36):
to you that you used for the book.
Speaker 3 (05:39):
Yeah, so originally, so I live in the mid Atlantic, DC, Maryland, area,
and so all the dogs initially were from like the
DMV area out here to start with.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
However, you know, once these.
Speaker 3 (05:54):
Dogs were adopted, they did move, so I did have
to kind of go along the east to get them
again in some instances.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
But yes, they were originally local to to where I lived.
Speaker 1 (06:07):
Okay, awesome. It's always nice when some of the you know,
the local rescues and shelters get to have some get
to be showcased a little bit, you know. M So,
did you have any kind of a criteria for choosing
which dogs that you were gonna photograph?
Speaker 2 (06:25):
Not? Really.
Speaker 3 (06:26):
The only thing I've really that was very important to
me in this book, which for those who have seen
it or have it or hopefully will get it, I
wanted to make sure that the book was the diverse
in respect to breeds, ages, sizes.
Speaker 2 (06:42):
I wanted people to be very aware that.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
There are it is more than the typical pitbull dog
when a lot of people think of a shelter or
rescue dog.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
There are many different dogs.
Speaker 3 (06:55):
That find themselves in these deplorable situations, and so I
really wanted to have.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
A diverse sampling. I had really no control over what dogs,
you know, I really photographed it happed.
Speaker 3 (07:11):
It was a really happenstance in a lot of situations
who happened to be there and available. So it really
just kind of unfolded organically in that way, and I
just made sure when I knew i'd come to kind
of having enough and diverse, I kind of just it
was kind of just kind of like a smell test
to just kind of knew that you had I had
(07:33):
captured hopefully what I wanted at that point.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
I'm glad that you, you know, went to the trouble
to uh show the diversity of the breeds and types
of dogs that the shelters get because people don't realize
that you can have. I when I was running and
managing the shelter that I managed, I had dogs that
(07:58):
were turned into me that I had that were AKC
papered d y. So yeah, we've had, I mean, we
give pure bread dogs in here and sometimes AKAC papered dogs,
which you know, it's no god anymore because they have
to be needed when they leave the shelter. But uh
or or spade whichever. But uh yeah, so you can
(08:20):
find a lot of what you may be looking for
when it comes to that, Yeah, and I.
Speaker 3 (08:26):
Really wanted to open people's eyes literally and and with
the narratives from the adopters and kind of as much
as possible that I could find out from the shelter
and rescue organizations, you know, about how they happened to
be living in this situation, as much as we could know,
Like some dogs came from other states, and I had
(08:48):
more information than others, but just really wanted to show
not only the benefits to the dogs of giving them
a second chance by dog rescue and adoption, to also
how much the lives of the adopters changed as well.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
So it was really a twofold kind of inquiry, right, right.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
So when for the follow up visit that you did
to photograph the dogs after they were in the adoptor's home,
how did you kind of come to the decision and
how long with the timeframe you should wait before you
followed up with them.
Speaker 4 (09:23):
I'm not you know, I don't really I don't really recall.
Speaker 3 (09:28):
I I mean, I photo out the dogs between two
thousand and thirteen and two thousand and fifteen.
Speaker 2 (09:32):
This was an over a decade long product to put
this together. So I think I think I just said
about a year.
Speaker 4 (09:38):
I think that's just kind of what made made sense,
given that.
Speaker 3 (09:42):
Some of these dogs at the time were older. You know,
I wanted to be sure that I could do my
best to get to the dog's age. Dog again that were,
you know, willing to participate with.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
The adopts, and and most of them didn't participate fortunately.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
Well well, well though I know I did see is
that some of the dogs that were in the book
more a little older. It wasn't just all a bunch
of young dogs and stuff. So w again, you know,
went to THEO. You did a great job of the
diversity for the dogs. So when you did you follow
up photo sessions, what pain the changes did you actually
(10:16):
noticed in the dogs when you were there doing it.
Speaker 3 (10:21):
I think I think, you know, speaking weldily and overall,
you could just see in their eyes and I hope
that that I hope the.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
Soul of the dog concerned these images.
Speaker 3 (10:32):
I know it's hard because you're talking about this family
versus actually seeing these images while I'm talking about it
the book, But it was my hope that people could
see see some sort of change.
Speaker 4 (10:44):
Like I said, at the outset and when I met
the dogs again, the most.
Speaker 3 (10:48):
Of them physically it worked in much better condition than
when I met them originally, just more full of life, happier.
I say, the dogs can't cannot you know, talk, but
this is what I felt when when I met them again.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
So it was really quite rewarding to be able to
witness that, you know, after.
Speaker 3 (11:14):
You know, initially meeting each dog, you know, and not
in the best of circumstances that they found themselves in.
So so it was quite beneficial. And it was interesting
to see that my experience with Biscuit was mirrored with
with the adopters, how their lives were, you know, drastically changed.
(11:36):
And there was also a unique circumstance in the book
with the dog named Dad Would He was actually adopted
by an assisted living facility. It was one of the
only rescues that would agree for like a corporation to
adopt a dog. And it was just quite heartwarming in
that he came in with a lot of anxiety and
(12:00):
he was pleased with like a whole bunch of grandparents
if you well, and.
Speaker 6 (12:04):
He became the resident dog and it worked out well,
and he was really beneficial with bonding with those especially
those who had very many friends of him.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
That were able to visit consistently. So it was it
was quite interesting.
Speaker 3 (12:18):
It was a very interesting project and very complex on
on a lot of levels to to finish it.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
Right, right, and it's finny And well you said something
about noticing the change in their eyes, Cause as I
was going through your book, that's what I was noticing
between the before and the after pictures was the changes
in their eyes. How much there was there was so
much more relaxed in their eyes than the year when
(12:45):
you when your before pictures or when they were still
have to shelter those pictures. So yes, you can, you
could really tell. I. I'm I really recommend you guys
getting this book because it was really good to go
through and see. And when you look going through the bog,
(13:05):
watch the pictures and watch the eyes and the dogs,
and you will see what we mean and you can
see the changes. So why did you decide to do
the photos in black and white instead of color?
Speaker 3 (13:19):
Yeah, So when this project literally came to me one
summer day, I kind of saw the concept in my
mind and I always thought that it would be I
prefer black and white.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
It really gets to the essence of what you're trying.
Speaker 4 (13:35):
To get at and image, I hope, and they all
have black background as a common thread.
Speaker 3 (13:43):
So I wanted to find a way to do where
I could do this while keeping consistency, while getting you know,
really getting to the essence of each dog.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
And I thought that.
Speaker 4 (13:56):
The black and white would make it just aesthetically made
the most sense.
Speaker 1 (14:01):
Yeah, I I I I liked it in the black
and white. It it kind of I don't know what
I'm what I'm looking for with that, but uh, an
more striking movie.
Speaker 3 (14:12):
Yeah, they're different, right, I mean it it's a little
different than what people are accustomed to seeing. And I
mean people see images of these dogs and like looking
really awful.
Speaker 2 (14:23):
In my book, it's it's not like that.
Speaker 3 (14:25):
So on the first image, it's it's these are like
s depending on the dog, more subtle changes and some
of them are more over. But the dogs themselves, I
wanted to honor them and capture them even in the
first image, their essence as well and their being.
Speaker 2 (14:46):
So so I hope people you know see between the two.
Speaker 3 (14:51):
Images, you know, the change, but they I wanted to
honor them, you know, out.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
Of the e those first images as well, we we
we and I and it was.
Speaker 1 (15:06):
I mean, I I thought it was a good thing.
I the the contrast between the two. I thought it
was it was good too.
Speaker 4 (15:15):
I liked it.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
So what were some of the uh comments that you
got from the adopters and the dogs that they adopted?
I mean, what were they kind of like? I mean,
were they positive comments, negative comments about getting this, you know,
with this dog and what they had to do to
(15:38):
I guess, uh, finally bring it out of a shelter
or anything like that.
Speaker 3 (15:43):
I mean, I think a common theme from the adopters
were like a lot of these dogs at the time were.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
Like posted somewhere online, and they felt.
Speaker 3 (15:54):
Some connection to the dog for some reason, whether it's
reminded of a former dog that they had r or
just something struck them about.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
The dog and they wanted to meet him or her,
you know. And I mean it's very similar to my
experience with Biscuit.
Speaker 3 (16:10):
You know, I couldn't imagine my life without him and
he was such a gift to me and I hope.
Speaker 2 (16:17):
That his legacy will be live on in the book.
Speaker 3 (16:21):
But the doctors felt very similarly, you know this dog,
these dogs have a way of coming into your life
and just you know, making it such a wonderful experience
that these people cannot or could not imagine not having.
Speaker 2 (16:36):
That particular dog in their life.
Speaker 3 (16:38):
So it's very life changing for both the humans and
the dogs, and quite a learning experience too. I mean,
no dog is is the same. No dog has the same.
Speaker 4 (16:49):
Background or trauma that might have happened to them.
Speaker 3 (16:51):
They're all different, and it I think it requires a
lot of patience and dedication to bring these you know,
animals into our homes and work with them on their terms,
you know, and just see how this this friendship and
loyalty and companionship all all of ogs, right right.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
Yeah, it's and and I kind of saw that with
some of this you know doctor's comments myself. You know,
it was like a lot of like you said, a
lot of 'em had saw the dog online and just
connected in some way and and got 'em. So I
think that's maybe one of the better things, you know,
as when they actually connect like that, or they or
even when they come in in person and and see
(17:35):
the dog and connect. That's also it's just trying to
get him to connect with the right dog sometimes cause
they you you, it's so funny. I've seen so many
people come into their shelter and you know, I'm I'm
seeing their personalities, I'm listening to them, and I'm thinking,
when I get this dog over here in this kennel,
that would be like the perfect fit for them. But
(17:57):
they want this dog over in this kennel, that's not
going to be a good fit for them. So, you know,
sometimes you almost feel like you're like a dog salesperson.
Speaker 3 (18:11):
I mean, it's kind of it's kind of like I found,
especially with the rescues, especially with those dogs who have
been fostered and have spent some time you know, you know,
out of that type of setting in a home, and
the foster person can really get to know the dog
and get to know that what they need and what
(18:32):
the right you know, what the optimal setting would be,
as kind of working as like a matchmaker to get
the dog set up in the best environment possible for success.
And unfortunately, in some of the shelters, due to funding constraints,
staff constraints, that isn't always possible. Studies have proven out
(18:53):
that the dogs who are fostered generally have better outcomes.
Speaker 1 (18:59):
Yep, uh, that that is true, and it is because
they get so much information to help the shelters find
them the right home.
Speaker 2 (19:07):
So, yeah, this is really important. It is really important.
Speaker 1 (19:11):
It is very important. That's it's well, I mean, people
come in and looking for a dog, is that? Can
you know kind of listen to what the staff retaining
you because they really do. I you know, I spent
so much time w I mean, obviously I didn't know
how those dogs were stay in the home environment because
we were in the shelter environment and kennels and stuff.
But I wasn't when it took the dogs out of
(19:31):
the kennels to play to them outside and photograph them
and took 'em to the adoption events, walked 'em, you know,
stuff like that. So I knew the most about their
personalities and what they were like. So you know, you
get to know them on a pretty intimate level when
you take care of them every day.
Speaker 4 (19:51):
So right, exactly what which is so important that information
is so vital?
Speaker 2 (19:56):
Yep?
Speaker 1 (19:56):
Exactly. So do you think in your opinion, if you
were to go back now, say, you know, eight or
nine years later, would do you think that the ones
that you know weren't seniors or older at that time
that are still with us? Do you think they would
still be with us adopts that took them at that time. Yeah,
(20:17):
they are.
Speaker 3 (20:18):
There's about there's about ten of them that are still
living out of all the out of all fifty nine dogs.
Speaker 4 (20:25):
And I've kept in touch over the years with all
the adopters on the project.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
Yeah, so so yes, yeah, the answer is, you know, yes.
Speaker 3 (20:34):
I fortunately was able to see all the living dogs
photographed with the book, which is really nice.
Speaker 4 (20:43):
So yeah, the adoptors were were quite supportive.
Speaker 3 (20:47):
I couldn't never have done the project without the house
of so many people that you know, really made it possible.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
Right.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
That is really cool that they kept in touch with
you and kept you updated so that you knew the
outcome of the dog. That's really awesome. Sometimes that happens.
Speaker 2 (21:03):
I did.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
I had people every once in a wived when they
would adopt for me. They would do that. They would
contact me or post something on Facebook and and tag
me so that I saw that the saw the dog
read run in terminal store or something somewhere.
Speaker 3 (21:15):
Right.
Speaker 1 (21:15):
Yeah, So it it's kind of nice to to know
that you know, you had dogs. And it's so funny
cause I'm so anal. I just I would watch all
the other pages and and shelter pages and rescues and
stuff like that to just see if I ever saw.
Oh yeah, I well, you know, cause I'm on Facebook
and I I cross posts. I have a page of
(21:37):
that cross post for a lot of the shelters and
rescues and stuff, so uh it try to help, you know,
get the word out about 'em. And uh so yeah,
so I would just kind of always keep my eyes
open cause I've had that happen where I would adopt
out and since I you don't do the animal control
and I worked for the county and stuff like that,
I actually had dogs that I already adopted out that people.
Speaker 3 (21:56):
Took to.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
Uh the county when county shelters. Wow, and so the
county officer just happened to real recognize the dog as
being one that came from my shelter and they would
call me and I'd.
Speaker 2 (22:09):
Get it back. But wow.
Speaker 1 (22:11):
Yeah, so, cause uh i'd we had the shelter more
or less. I the statistics made it a no kill shelter.
So yeah, but uh so, yeah, so I would kind
of want I don't think I really have any dogs
left much out there now that I would have adopted, cause,
like I said, it's been over almost nine years ago now,
(22:35):
so I mean there may be some that are up there,
but any yeah, it's interesting to to find out about 'em.
Speaker 3 (22:42):
And yeah, and similarly, there were dogs in this project
that were surrendered multiple times before they found their forever
home in this project. So I guess it's not as
uncommon as we think because I are in this, you know,
in this sampling of dogs that I worked with, that
definitely happened to multiple dogs in the project.
Speaker 1 (23:04):
Yeah, it does. It happens quite a bit. And you
know what, can you see? It's a thrower way society
nowadays and the worst person And it's so funny cause
I w I'm I'm sorry, I'm some sometimes I'm a
little more blunked than I probably should be. But either
people who come in and they would turn their dog
into me for this reason or that reason and that look,
(23:24):
I was just looking and you go, okay, so, cause
I mean, we don't have time to say, well, okay,
so you're basically now passing your problem off to someone else.
That's pretty much what you're doing here, cause you don't
wanna take the time to correct the problem.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
Yeah, So like in the in in the book.
Speaker 3 (23:41):
I mean that really everything really goes to our human actions, right,
so for better fare worse, we.
Speaker 2 (23:48):
Can do harm or you know, we can help these dogs.
And that's you know, especially with the complic the.
Speaker 3 (23:56):
Complicated reasonings behind the overpopulation probably that we have with
dogs and animals and shelter. I my hope is the
way that uh, the timing of when Abandoned came out.
Speaker 4 (24:09):
This past fall hopefully shed flight on this overpopulation crisis
that we we all find ourselves in.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
And I hope it's an important dog.
Speaker 3 (24:20):
They're just schedulous dogs, and they will really change your life,
you know.
Speaker 1 (24:24):
And and it's and it is, it's a horrible problem
right now. I've and I have had, you know, just
in the last say month, a couple of people contact
me going, Hay, do you know anybody that can that'll
take the d dog? And I'm like no. One person's like, oh,
this is like a hang dog, she's pregnant, she's gonna
(24:45):
have puppies in any Rescues are d well, No, I'm
know the rescuers are full. They're pulling from shelters. Shelters
are full, rescues are full, and so and then and
this person's in this situation cause they were trying to
do the right thing and the dog was running use
And I don't know if I got pregnant for it
came to them, were pregnant after it came to them.
Speaker 2 (25:06):
I'm not sure.
Speaker 1 (25:07):
With one of their lives, I couldn't tell you. But yeah,
so now they're looking at having puppies and uh yeah,
I'm just say, there's no way for any of these
dogs to go. What are you guys doing?
Speaker 3 (25:18):
You?
Speaker 2 (25:18):
Uh right?
Speaker 1 (25:20):
And then and and I gotta say this because I
see this so much of the time. Everybody says, you
need to get your dog's spade and muted. Because that's
the biggest problem. Yes, that is one of the biggest
problems is not enough people get their animals fixed. But
another big problem that I see is nobody goes to
(25:41):
pick up their animals after they get out of their yard.
I wanna make goodness, Yeah, I I will notice. I
mean a lot with the dogs that I, you know,
keep track of. I don't keep track, but I help post.
Like I said, and you have a in Tucson. You know,
it's a larger city, a larger shelter and so they
(26:02):
have all these dogs that come in, you know, especially
during certain times of years. We all know this Fourth
of July years when people are doing frameworks and stuff
like that. But uh, I keep seeing all these dogs
coming in and a good part of them are going
up for adoption because no one ever comes.
Speaker 2 (26:20):
To get them.
Speaker 4 (26:22):
Oh my gosh, that's really sad.
Speaker 1 (26:24):
Yeah, So I don't know if people aren't realizing that.
That's another big problem. And a good part of the
time these shelters sinster're so overcrowded in food, they're just
giving the dogs. Fact, they're not charging any feesista like
a lot of people think, and you're not getting sold.
I mean, fix the problem, please, that's the big thing.
Just fix the problem in your yard and you know,
and your dogs are getting out, and keep them in.
(26:46):
That's what an any animal control officer will tell you.
And that's what all they want is for you to
fix the problem. Keep your dogs in, keep them at home.
We don't want them in the shelters because yeah, they're
taking up kennels, so they m You may need for
you know, al a literal case that really need it,
but uh yeah, go ahead.
Speaker 2 (27:08):
And r t to that point.
Speaker 3 (27:10):
When you do adopt a dog from a shelter and
a rescue, you are also saving another dog's like as well,
like ya, cause.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
They're space issues.
Speaker 4 (27:19):
So it is really a ripple effect by doing this.
Speaker 1 (27:23):
Yeah, it is, And I do understand there are people
out there that are just adam they want to go
to a breeder and pay and get the dog from
a breeder. Okay, just please, when you're doing that, make
sure it's a real beautiable breeder that it takes care
of their dogs and does what they're supposed to be
doing with them, getting them their shots and you know,
(27:43):
if they did dogs with hip problems, getting those X
rays and stuff like that done, making sure those dogs
are in good hats before they sell them to you.
Because there's so many backyard breeders out there that don't
do that. So if you can shut down a good
part of the backyard breeders, that would be wonderful. But
you know, yeah, so there's so many things that need
(28:05):
to happen for this pet over population thing to actually
stop and and go down. But people really need to
work on it and quit making excuses and quit being
at there a way society. That's the biggest thing. And
being responsible peniminers. Y, I think we have.
Speaker 3 (28:26):
I think we all as a society have the responsibility
to help these animals in need, and if.
Speaker 2 (28:31):
More of us do it, it will it will also help.
Speaker 3 (28:34):
That will help with uh over population and it will well,
it will help, but it may it's a complex issue.
It is.
Speaker 1 (28:43):
It just really comes down to being responsible. I mean
that's the biggest mood for any of it when you
really stop and think about, is being responsible. So, uh,
back to your bigness. So I also wanted to ask
you what your feels were when you found out some
of the dogs that you photographed had actually ended up
(29:06):
haf with the euthanized instead of actually being adopted out.
Speaker 2 (29:11):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (29:12):
So in the book, there's nearly sixty dogs and they
overwhelmingly have one unquote happy ending.
Speaker 7 (29:20):
But it was important to me to also include in
this book a handful of dogs that were euthanized because
these dogs, you know, based life and death on a
daily basis, and I thought it was important to include
these dogs.
Speaker 4 (29:36):
In the project, showing the real reality you know, facing
these dogs on on a daily basis.
Speaker 3 (29:44):
So of course it's heartbreaking, it's sad, but I hope
people see in the images of these dogs.
Speaker 4 (29:54):
The second image for these dogs is a black square,
and hopefully it.
Speaker 3 (29:58):
Will make an impact them people when they see these
Imma kids that there is no second image.
Speaker 2 (30:05):
Yeah, of that's of that specific dog.
Speaker 1 (30:09):
Yes, I hope so too, cause you know, I J
and I just saw another one either today or yesterday
as I was cross posting, uh the description of saying
that the owner turned the dog into the shelter because
they didn't have time because they were working too much.
Any hm, I'm okay. Yeah, most dogs sleep while you're
(30:35):
at work during the day, just saying most dogs sleep,
so they really don't care that you're not there during
the day. So if you can take the time to
take them for a walk or play with them after
you get home from work, you know, things like that,
to some quality time with them, that's a much better
scenario than putting him in an animal shelter, especially the
(30:56):
one that's really overcrowded and may be one that's a
higher UH with the major rate, because that your dog
may not stand as good of the chance as you
think of getting out into a new home, especially once
they go into the shelter, because now you got all
these dogs are doing panels and the shelter barking, and
there's a lot of stress and a lot of anxiety.
Speaker 4 (31:17):
Are very stressful. It's so stressful for these dogs to
be in that enpartment.
Speaker 3 (31:21):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (31:22):
And now your dog is stressed and overwhelmed and he
has anxiety, And how do you think your dog is
gonna act when it's like that? So again, maybe you
do work a lot of hours, but again you you're
you're a much better scenario for your dog than putting
it in an animal shelter. Just just saying, so you know,
(31:42):
those excuses are kind of getting old of that kind
of stuff. Cause, yeah, what are your overall feelings about
animal shelters and animal rescues?
Speaker 2 (31:56):
Well, I think they're vital.
Speaker 3 (31:58):
Mard We we need we need them because these animals
need a place to live, hopefully temporarily before they get adopted.
Speaker 4 (32:09):
Like I said earlier, my experience with the rescues and
the volunteers there is that they had more capacity to put.
Speaker 2 (32:17):
Dogs into.
Speaker 8 (32:19):
Foster scenarios, where like I said, they did learn more
about each job to help set the dog up for success,
kind of matching them with the right right people, the
right environment.
Speaker 3 (32:32):
The shelter, totally different environment and situation, you know, the smells, barking,
just the whole environment.
Speaker 4 (32:42):
It was I can't imagine myself living in that, you know.
Speaker 2 (32:46):
And it's sad and it's hard, and we still need that.
Speaker 3 (32:51):
We obviously need the shelters, but like I said, for
certain constraints of staff funding, et cetera, these dogs don't
necessarily get a foster environment all of them, which really
will help get them acclimated and socialized and more time with.
Speaker 2 (33:08):
That particular dog toy figure out what would work best
for you know, him or her, you know, home with
other animals, home.
Speaker 3 (33:16):
With children, you know, just it gives more anecdotal information
to help place the dog. And that's kind of a
missing link at the at the shelter that that I
worked with in and are part of my project. But
it's it's I don't want to be remiss in that.
(33:37):
You know, this is tireless, This is very important work,
and we need these these people who are on the
front lines because you know, where would these.
Speaker 2 (33:48):
Dogs be without at least the shelter and or rescued.
Speaker 1 (33:51):
Right, Yeah, exactly, I mean how many dogs? Just ask
you how many dogs? Uh do you know how many
dogs are abandoned or displaced a new United States each year.
Speaker 4 (34:01):
Yeah, so last year, so I know, last year, statistics
showed that.
Speaker 3 (34:09):
Three million dogs and our shelter and rescue organizations in
twenty three and two million of those dogs found homes.
Speaker 2 (34:19):
However, that left one million dogs who did not find homes.
So it's quite astronomical.
Speaker 6 (34:25):
Yeah, it is.
Speaker 1 (34:26):
I I knew it wasn't the millions. I just wasn't
sure what it was. Uh here just really recently, I
haven't checked the stats in quite a while. So yeah,
it's it's it's it's quite high for you know in
you know, like we we were talking about here just
a minute ago. You know, some of the things people
can do to kind of help end just sew to overpopulation,
(34:48):
you know, adopt foster, uh even if you can't adopt
a foster, cause it's at every situation you may be in,
even just helping to spread the word cause you just
never know who might.
Speaker 2 (35:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (35:01):
Yeah, and also just like you're able to, you know,
donate money and or supplies.
Speaker 2 (35:08):
Shelters are in dire need of supplies.
Speaker 3 (35:10):
There's just a right away you can help, Like you said,
you can volunteer, you can foster, you can you can help, you.
Speaker 2 (35:20):
Know, get the get the word out when you can.
Speaker 3 (35:22):
But you know, donations are extremely helpful. That obviously adapting
U into a permanent situation is.
Speaker 2 (35:32):
Is obviously ideal, the most ideals.
Speaker 1 (35:34):
Yep, yeah, yeah it is. Would be lovely if we
could get every dog we'll need to a home.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
Yes, wouldn't it be kids to kids?
Speaker 1 (35:44):
Do you have kids deserve places too? Hum So, also
in doing this project just out of curiosity, what did
you kind of learn about yourself doing this as well?
Speaker 3 (35:59):
Yeah, it was quite a journey. I mean, this was
a ten year project. I at the outset, I didn't
really know how long it would take. I wasn't even
I didn't quite comprehend at the time I started. While
all was you know, going to be involved. It was
got much bigger than I you know, when the concept
(36:21):
kind of came to me. So it was quite a
learning experience, overcoming you know a lot of obstacles, persevering
just you know, trying to keep hope that my goal
was to finish it.
Speaker 2 (36:35):
My second goal was to find a publisher to get
it published.
Speaker 3 (36:38):
And you know, with the impetus always behind this to
all these dogs and need that was really really always
at the back of my mind, and even after Biscuit died,
we only had in two and a half years.
Speaker 2 (36:53):
We adopted through.
Speaker 3 (36:56):
The rescue where we got Biscuit through a shelter to
rescue actually in Michigan.
Speaker 2 (37:03):
We adopted Victory.
Speaker 4 (37:04):
She came with the name and she was a constant
companion while working.
Speaker 2 (37:09):
On this work. Biscuit excuse me a Biscuit was.
Speaker 3 (37:15):
Was with me at the very beginning, but he unfortunately
passed away from a rare cancer.
Speaker 2 (37:21):
And Victory was just always there. And every time I
felt either scared that I was never going to.
Speaker 3 (37:27):
Finish or how this would if, if this project would
either come together, there's no guarantees. It's it's quite a
different way of working, but really a lot of faith
and trust in the process, which which is hard at
times for sure, But I'm grateful that I was able
to finish it and get it published.
Speaker 1 (37:48):
When you starated, did you think it was going to
take you a decade to to do the project?
Speaker 3 (37:52):
Oh no, I'm not sure I ever really contemplated how
long it would take.
Speaker 2 (38:01):
It just really felt this whole time, no matter what,
I always just felt really compelled that I needed to
do it, and that really cut me going through you
know nothings. This is far from.
Speaker 3 (38:14):
Perfect, very nonlinear process, so that just really cut me,
you know, going as just the belief that.
Speaker 2 (38:23):
You know, and and a also honoring Biscuit. I felt
like I owed it to him to finish it. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (38:31):
Yeah, well it's it's I it like I said, I
I liked it.
Speaker 2 (38:33):
I thought it was.
Speaker 1 (38:34):
It was a good book with the pictures and and
the l you know everything and uh the adopters comments
and everything with the dogs after they'd had 'em for
a bit and things like that. So you think it
came out well, thinks so, n I just kind of
(38:55):
a recab just in case, uh somebody missed it. What
was the message that you were trying to convey with
the book?
Speaker 3 (39:02):
I mean, the I just I think the overall just
awareness of these dogs and just the just wanting to showcase.
Speaker 2 (39:13):
How vital and.
Speaker 3 (39:15):
Important dog rescue and adoption is to these animals and
to the life changing at you know, intact on on
the human companions. It just is such a rewarding relationship
and experience.
Speaker 4 (39:31):
That you know, I W I cannot imagine not having.
Speaker 3 (39:34):
A rescue dog in my life ever. I you know,
I just can't imagine life without one.
Speaker 2 (39:40):
And I think even though they can't speak, I think
they're so grateful.
Speaker 3 (39:45):
And they're just they're so present and they're just they're
just it's unconditional.
Speaker 2 (39:51):
Love and all they really want is, you know, love
in a warm's warm home and care.
Speaker 3 (39:58):
And how easy it is that in and within you know,
such a short time, your life will be ever changed.
And what's been so great is that about I think
it was about five years after we adopted Victory, our
second sheltery, after Biscuit passed, our daughter was born, and
(40:20):
so she's an only child, only human child, and she's
gotten to grow up with Victory, and it's just made
her more.
Speaker 2 (40:29):
Aware of animals. She loves animals, she loves dogs, and
just like really early education and having her exposed to
that has been really really beautiful.
Speaker 1 (40:41):
Right, Well, well that's in and it's it's a great
message to get out there to people and stuff like that, cause, yeah,
there's so many dogs out there that need homes, that
are such good dogs, and you know, so if you can, yeah,
go out and adopt, and if not, at least try
to help spread the word around and uh, let people
know about you know, these dogs that are in the
(41:02):
shelters or foster if you can a foster, even if
you're in the foster for a short time, just giving
them the break out of the shelter is nice for them.
Speaker 2 (41:11):
So oh yes, it is so important.
Speaker 1 (41:14):
Yeah, well, maybe you can tell us now where people
can actually go and buy your book and also maybe
give us your uh website information in case any of
the listeners would like to know more about you and
your works.
Speaker 4 (41:33):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (41:34):
So the book is available wherever books are sold, and
a portion of my royalties are being donated to the
SPCA International, which is going to a specific fund to
help dogs around the globe who are in need. And
my website is Katherinecarver dot com and that's k A
t h E r i n E. Carver c A
(41:55):
R visin Victor er dot com and you can specifically.
Speaker 4 (42:00):
See all the places or most of the places.
Speaker 2 (42:03):
Where the book is available.
Speaker 3 (42:06):
Yeah, and it's kind of come full circle with having
the involvement of the SPCA International, bringing everything.
Speaker 4 (42:13):
Full circle, cause without these dogs, the stook would not exist.
Speaker 3 (42:16):
And so my hope is with the book that it
causes the positive ripplefect for dogs in need.
Speaker 1 (42:24):
Awesome, awesome. MSPCA Internationals been doing some great work, so
it's really nice that you're contributing some of the royalties
to them to help out to help the other dogs
around the globe. So that's really nice because there's so
many dogs around the globe that do need help. I
don't know how many people who are aware of some
of the dire straits that some of the dogs and
(42:45):
some of these other countries are in, like Turkey and
and uh Involgim and stuff like that. It's it's just crazy.
So anyway, well, Catherine, I really appreciate you coming on
today and talking with this about your new book. Again,
for those of you that might have missed it, the
the UH title of the b UH book is Abandoned
(43:07):
Chronicling the journeys of once forsaken Dogs, and it is
UH kind of uh. I guess what you would say,
a photographic type of UH timeline with the dogs. It's
kind of cool. Katherine went in photographed them and the
shelters before to start with, and then look back a
(43:28):
bit later and photographed them after they were adopted in
the new homes for a bit to kind of show
the differences and show how these dogs friends uh had
some great news starts in life. Most of them did anyway.
So but again, thank you so much for being on
tonight and talking with us. I really appreciate it. And
uh uh hopefully people go out and uh get your book.
Speaker 2 (43:51):
Thanks so much for having me.
Speaker 1 (43:53):
Really well, I am going to give you the choice
of either staying on why I announced my h next
couple of podcasts coming up. Well you can jump off,
cause I know you are busy and have things to
do and it's up to you. But that's all I'm
gonna be doing is just announcing those next couple podcasts.
Speaker 2 (44:10):
Okay, Well, thanks for your your help. I really appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (44:14):
Well, thank you so much, and uh, if you decide
to do any more projects like this, let me know
will have you on again to talk about the new ones.
Speaker 4 (44:22):
Alright, take care of Thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (44:24):
You have a givna.
Speaker 2 (44:26):
Okay, bye buddy.
Speaker 1 (44:30):
So, uh that was a great podcast. I enjoyed talking
with her about her book. It was a really good book.
So do you uh, I do rghly recommend getting it
if you guys get the opportunity uh to to pick
it up, cause it's really nice. So the next day
podcast they'll be coming up are uh let me see
here fair would be wearing twentyeth. I am going to
(44:55):
be doing a podcast about walco. Yes, we're going to
be learning about raccoons with Sarah Holmes bookbinder, and you're
going to find out all sorts of really cool facts
and and uh tips and all sorts of new things
about raccoons, and and there's mischievous little bandits that they
(45:19):
are and all their little antiques and stuff which are
really kind of cool. So I am looking forward to
having Sarah come on the podcast and talk with me
about raccoons. So on Uh, that one's gonna be a
good one February twentieth, and then on March sixth, I'm
(45:41):
gonna have Shanning them on their Benedictus uh on with me.
Shannan is a producer, director, and she has uh been
in Church area or on many different really cool projects
for National Geographic uh in all sorts of different uh
(46:04):
sh uh TV shows and stuff like that, and in
articles and things. So uh, that's gonna be a really
interesting podcast to talk with Shannon to find out you
know how she got into UH, what she's doing and
what she's been doing and all these really great documentaries
(46:25):
and stuff like that she's been involved with. So I
can't wait to talk with her, and that'll be on
March sixth. So with that being said, do you guys
now know what my UH next upcoming podcasts are. I
hope you guys enjoyed UH tonight's podcast. I thought it
was really quite interesting to talk with Catherine, and I
(46:47):
hope you guys will be back in a couple of
weeks for the next podcast. And I also hope you
guys stay safe out there this weekend and don't get
into too much trouble. All right, Hopefully you'll be back
in a couple of weeks by I know
Good evening everybody, and welcome to Calling All creatures tonight.
My podcast is about a book called Abandoned Chronically Ended
Journeys of One's Forsaken Dogs, and I had the photographer
author of the book I'm with me to talk about it,
Katherine Carver, and she's going to give us some more
(00:25):
insight into the book and about the dogs and what
the UH book is all about. So I am really
glad you could jourin me tonight. Catherine. It's it's great
to talk with you about this.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Thanks for having one.
Speaker 1 (00:42):
Alrighty, So maybe we could just kind of start out
with UH having me tell us just a little bit
about yourself. I mean, how did you get into uh
photography and then when did you kind of start photog
uh photographing animals.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Yeah, that's that's This book came about actually from our
first rescue dog.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
His name was Biscuit, and he was a shelty found
abandoned by a Good Samaritan in North Carolina and was
eventually taken to a a breed specific shelty rescue in
Maryland where we reside, and we ended up being able
to adopt him and for my husband and myself.
Speaker 4 (01:23):
We had never had a dog in our.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
Lives before, we didn't have them growing up, and it
was just such a magical experience.
Speaker 4 (01:32):
And I witnessed him really come out.
Speaker 3 (01:36):
Of his shell, you know, he changed emotionally, physically. He
was a different dog within a few short months.
Speaker 4 (01:44):
And it really got me thinking.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
About other dogs like him.
Speaker 3 (01:50):
And got me thinking about this project which is now
the finished book.
Speaker 5 (01:56):
But what I did was I reached out to local
rescues and shelters to see if they might want to participate,
and he you.
Speaker 4 (02:06):
Know, sharing my getting some background, sharing.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
The story about Biscuit, which led me to this project
and led me to much awareness of that there are
many dogs in need.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
And Biscuit really brought me back to photography and something
Fortunes and High School had was placed in it.
Speaker 6 (02:28):
I needed a dark credit and I fell in love
with the dark room and it just changed my life.
I went into went on to college and I was.
Speaker 3 (02:39):
A business major, and I was fortunate enough in college
to be able to get into some photography dark room
classes and have some of the prerequisites like three metasis
that I would not be good at doing. They weighed
those for me, fortunately, and I was able to keep working,
(03:01):
working on this passion.
Speaker 2 (03:03):
Which I love. I it's very visual and I love
I love making bodies of work.
Speaker 3 (03:10):
And I went on to law school, and like I said,
I had, I had taken some more forces. I did
not go to school for photography, and I had always
promised myself in law school that I would try to.
Speaker 2 (03:24):
Do something with it.
Speaker 3 (03:25):
I had no idea what that would be, but it
was very clear once Fiska entered my life that this
project came about.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
And in this project, which.
Speaker 4 (03:35):
Is now the finished book, I.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
Photographed dogs while they were in a shelter rescue environment,
and then I photographed them. I filled these dogs and
got the requisite permissions and that the adopters and photographed
these dogs again.
Speaker 2 (03:52):
And no one has quite done a project like this.
It's kind of a longitudinal study, if you will, of
these dogs.
Speaker 4 (03:59):
And my hope was I didn't know if I'd be
able to do this.
Speaker 3 (04:02):
This is kind of this concept that I had and
trying to be able to show some emotional or physical change.
Speaker 2 (04:10):
With the dogs.
Speaker 4 (04:11):
And each photograph is accompanied by.
Speaker 3 (04:14):
A narrative through interviews with shelter and rescue personnel for
the first.
Speaker 4 (04:18):
Image, and then of course the adapters on the second image.
Speaker 3 (04:21):
And they're all square of black and white images with
black background.
Speaker 4 (04:27):
So that's kind of a little bit of how this
product came to be.
Speaker 1 (04:33):
So Biscuit was really kind of the beginning of all
of this then with you adopting them.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
Oh, yes, this was.
Speaker 3 (04:40):
If it were not for Biscuit entering my life, I
don't think this project would have ever occurred to me.
Speaker 4 (04:46):
He just really opened something within me that I became.
Speaker 3 (04:51):
Very very curious about what was happening to these dogs
like him because he was, just, like I said, left and.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
He changed our lives as as much as his life.
Speaker 3 (05:01):
Changed from having you know, a loving home and being
part of the family. So it was it was just
a very interesting experience from never having an animal in
my life and he just really changed everything.
Speaker 1 (05:15):
Well, that's awesome. Seems like it was a really good
experience having him come into your life and getting you
to do this project. So so the dogs and the
dogs shelters rescues that were in your book, now these
that were rescue shelters and stuff that were like local
(05:36):
to you that you used for the book.
Speaker 3 (05:39):
Yeah, so originally, so I live in the mid Atlantic, DC, Maryland, area,
and so all the dogs initially were from like the
DMV area out here to start with.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
However, you know, once these.
Speaker 3 (05:54):
Dogs were adopted, they did move, so I did have
to kind of go along the east to get them
again in some instances.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
But yes, they were originally local to to where I lived.
Speaker 1 (06:07):
Okay, awesome. It's always nice when some of the you know,
the local rescues and shelters get to have some get
to be showcased a little bit, you know. M So,
did you have any kind of a criteria for choosing
which dogs that you were gonna photograph?
Speaker 2 (06:25):
Not? Really.
Speaker 3 (06:26):
The only thing I've really that was very important to
me in this book, which for those who have seen
it or have it or hopefully will get it, I
wanted to make sure that the book was the diverse
in respect to breeds, ages, sizes.
Speaker 2 (06:42):
I wanted people to be very aware that.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
There are it is more than the typical pitbull dog
when a lot of people think of a shelter or
rescue dog.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
There are many different dogs.
Speaker 3 (06:55):
That find themselves in these deplorable situations, and so I
really wanted to have.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
A diverse sampling. I had really no control over what dogs,
you know, I really photographed it happed.
Speaker 3 (07:11):
It was a really happenstance in a lot of situations
who happened to be there and available. So it really
just kind of unfolded organically in that way, and I
just made sure when I knew i'd come to kind
of having enough and diverse, I kind of just it
was kind of just kind of like a smell test
to just kind of knew that you had I had
(07:33):
captured hopefully what I wanted at that point.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
I'm glad that you, you know, went to the trouble
to uh show the diversity of the breeds and types
of dogs that the shelters get because people don't realize
that you can have. I when I was running and
managing the shelter that I managed, I had dogs that
(07:58):
were turned into me that I had that were AKC
papered d y. So yeah, we've had, I mean, we
give pure bread dogs in here and sometimes AKAC papered dogs,
which you know, it's no god anymore because they have
to be needed when they leave the shelter. But uh
or or spade whichever. But uh yeah, so you can
(08:20):
find a lot of what you may be looking for
when it comes to that, Yeah, and I.
Speaker 3 (08:26):
Really wanted to open people's eyes literally and and with
the narratives from the adopters and kind of as much
as possible that I could find out from the shelter
and rescue organizations, you know, about how they happened to
be living in this situation, as much as we could know,
Like some dogs came from other states, and I had
(08:48):
more information than others, but just really wanted to show
not only the benefits to the dogs of giving them
a second chance by dog rescue and adoption, to also
how much the lives of the adopters changed as well.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
So it was really a twofold kind of inquiry, right, right.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
So when for the follow up visit that you did
to photograph the dogs after they were in the adoptor's home,
how did you kind of come to the decision and
how long with the timeframe you should wait before you
followed up with them.
Speaker 4 (09:23):
I'm not you know, I don't really I don't really recall.
Speaker 3 (09:28):
I I mean, I photo out the dogs between two
thousand and thirteen and two thousand and fifteen.
Speaker 2 (09:32):
This was an over a decade long product to put
this together. So I think I think I just said
about a year.
Speaker 4 (09:38):
I think that's just kind of what made made sense,
given that.
Speaker 3 (09:42):
Some of these dogs at the time were older. You know,
I wanted to be sure that I could do my
best to get to the dog's age. Dog again that were,
you know, willing to participate with.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
The adopts, and and most of them didn't participate fortunately.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
Well well, well though I know I did see is
that some of the dogs that were in the book
more a little older. It wasn't just all a bunch
of young dogs and stuff. So w again, you know,
went to THEO. You did a great job of the
diversity for the dogs. So when you did you follow
up photo sessions, what pain the changes did you actually
(10:16):
noticed in the dogs when you were there doing it.
Speaker 3 (10:21):
I think I think, you know, speaking weldily and overall,
you could just see in their eyes and I hope
that that I hope the.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
Soul of the dog concerned these images.
Speaker 3 (10:32):
I know it's hard because you're talking about this family
versus actually seeing these images while I'm talking about it
the book, But it was my hope that people could
see see some sort of change.
Speaker 4 (10:44):
Like I said, at the outset and when I met
the dogs again, the most.
Speaker 3 (10:48):
Of them physically it worked in much better condition than
when I met them originally, just more full of life, happier.
I say, the dogs can't cannot you know, talk, but
this is what I felt when when I met them again.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
So it was really quite rewarding to be able to
witness that, you know, after.
Speaker 3 (11:14):
You know, initially meeting each dog, you know, and not
in the best of circumstances that they found themselves in.
So so it was quite beneficial. And it was interesting
to see that my experience with Biscuit was mirrored with
with the adopters, how their lives were, you know, drastically changed.
(11:36):
And there was also a unique circumstance in the book
with the dog named Dad Would He was actually adopted
by an assisted living facility. It was one of the
only rescues that would agree for like a corporation to
adopt a dog. And it was just quite heartwarming in
that he came in with a lot of anxiety and
(12:00):
he was pleased with like a whole bunch of grandparents
if you well, and.
Speaker 6 (12:04):
He became the resident dog and it worked out well,
and he was really beneficial with bonding with those especially
those who had very many friends of him.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
That were able to visit consistently. So it was it
was quite interesting.
Speaker 3 (12:18):
It was a very interesting project and very complex on
on a lot of levels to to finish it.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
Right, right, and it's finny And well you said something
about noticing the change in their eyes, Cause as I
was going through your book, that's what I was noticing
between the before and the after pictures was the changes
in their eyes. How much there was there was so
much more relaxed in their eyes than the year when
(12:45):
you when your before pictures or when they were still
have to shelter those pictures. So yes, you can, you
could really tell. I. I'm I really recommend you guys
getting this book because it was really good to go
through and see. And when you look going through the bog,
(13:05):
watch the pictures and watch the eyes and the dogs,
and you will see what we mean and you can
see the changes. So why did you decide to do
the photos in black and white instead of color?
Speaker 3 (13:19):
Yeah, So when this project literally came to me one
summer day, I kind of saw the concept in my
mind and I always thought that it would be I
prefer black and white.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
It really gets to the essence of what you're trying.
Speaker 4 (13:35):
To get at and image, I hope, and they all
have black background as a common thread.
Speaker 3 (13:43):
So I wanted to find a way to do where
I could do this while keeping consistency, while getting you know,
really getting to the essence of each dog.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
And I thought that.
Speaker 4 (13:56):
The black and white would make it just aesthetically made
the most sense.
Speaker 1 (14:01):
Yeah, I I I I liked it in the black
and white. It it kind of I don't know what
I'm what I'm looking for with that, but uh, an
more striking movie.
Speaker 3 (14:12):
Yeah, they're different, right, I mean it it's a little
different than what people are accustomed to seeing. And I
mean people see images of these dogs and like looking
really awful.
Speaker 2 (14:23):
In my book, it's it's not like that.
Speaker 3 (14:25):
So on the first image, it's it's these are like
s depending on the dog, more subtle changes and some
of them are more over. But the dogs themselves, I
wanted to honor them and capture them even in the
first image, their essence as well and their being.
Speaker 2 (14:46):
So so I hope people you know see between the two.
Speaker 3 (14:51):
Images, you know, the change, but they I wanted to
honor them, you know, out.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
Of the e those first images as well, we we
we and I and it was.
Speaker 1 (15:06):
I mean, I I thought it was a good thing.
I the the contrast between the two. I thought it
was it was good too.
Speaker 4 (15:15):
I liked it.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
So what were some of the uh comments that you
got from the adopters and the dogs that they adopted?
I mean, what were they kind of like? I mean,
were they positive comments, negative comments about getting this, you know,
with this dog and what they had to do to
(15:38):
I guess, uh, finally bring it out of a shelter
or anything like that.
Speaker 3 (15:43):
I mean, I think a common theme from the adopters
were like a lot of these dogs at the time were.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
Like posted somewhere online, and they felt.
Speaker 3 (15:54):
Some connection to the dog for some reason, whether it's
reminded of a former dog that they had r or
just something struck them about.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
The dog and they wanted to meet him or her,
you know. And I mean it's very similar to my
experience with Biscuit.
Speaker 3 (16:10):
You know, I couldn't imagine my life without him and
he was such a gift to me and I hope.
Speaker 2 (16:17):
That his legacy will be live on in the book.
Speaker 3 (16:21):
But the doctors felt very similarly, you know this dog,
these dogs have a way of coming into your life
and just you know, making it such a wonderful experience
that these people cannot or could not imagine not having.
Speaker 2 (16:36):
That particular dog in their life.
Speaker 3 (16:38):
So it's very life changing for both the humans and
the dogs, and quite a learning experience too. I mean,
no dog is is the same. No dog has the same.
Speaker 4 (16:49):
Background or trauma that might have happened to them.
Speaker 3 (16:51):
They're all different, and it I think it requires a
lot of patience and dedication to bring these you know,
animals into our homes and work with them on their terms,
you know, and just see how this this friendship and
loyalty and companionship all all of ogs, right right.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
Yeah, it's and and I kind of saw that with
some of this you know doctor's comments myself. You know,
it was like a lot of like you said, a
lot of 'em had saw the dog online and just
connected in some way and and got 'em. So I
think that's maybe one of the better things, you know,
as when they actually connect like that, or they or
even when they come in in person and and see
(17:35):
the dog and connect. That's also it's just trying to
get him to connect with the right dog sometimes cause
they you you, it's so funny. I've seen so many
people come into their shelter and you know, I'm I'm
seeing their personalities, I'm listening to them, and I'm thinking,
when I get this dog over here in this kennel,
that would be like the perfect fit for them. But
(17:57):
they want this dog over in this kennel, that's not
going to be a good fit for them. So, you know,
sometimes you almost feel like you're like a dog salesperson.
Speaker 3 (18:11):
I mean, it's kind of it's kind of like I found,
especially with the rescues, especially with those dogs who have
been fostered and have spent some time you know, you know,
out of that type of setting in a home, and
the foster person can really get to know the dog
and get to know that what they need and what
(18:32):
the right you know, what the optimal setting would be,
as kind of working as like a matchmaker to get
the dog set up in the best environment possible for success.
And unfortunately, in some of the shelters, due to funding constraints,
staff constraints, that isn't always possible. Studies have proven out
(18:53):
that the dogs who are fostered generally have better outcomes.
Speaker 1 (18:59):
Yep, uh, that that is true, and it is because
they get so much information to help the shelters find
them the right home.
Speaker 2 (19:07):
So, yeah, this is really important. It is really important.
Speaker 1 (19:11):
It is very important. That's it's well, I mean, people
come in and looking for a dog, is that? Can
you know kind of listen to what the staff retaining
you because they really do. I you know, I spent
so much time w I mean, obviously I didn't know
how those dogs were stay in the home environment because
we were in the shelter environment and kennels and stuff.
But I wasn't when it took the dogs out of
(19:31):
the kennels to play to them outside and photograph them
and took 'em to the adoption events, walked 'em, you know,
stuff like that. So I knew the most about their
personalities and what they were like. So you know, you
get to know them on a pretty intimate level when
you take care of them every day.
Speaker 4 (19:51):
So right, exactly what which is so important that information
is so vital?
Speaker 2 (19:56):
Yep?
Speaker 1 (19:56):
Exactly. So do you think in your opinion, if you
were to go back now, say, you know, eight or
nine years later, would do you think that the ones
that you know weren't seniors or older at that time
that are still with us? Do you think they would
still be with us adopts that took them at that time. Yeah,
(20:17):
they are.
Speaker 3 (20:18):
There's about there's about ten of them that are still
living out of all the out of all fifty nine dogs.
Speaker 4 (20:25):
And I've kept in touch over the years with all
the adopters on the project.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
Yeah, so so yes, yeah, the answer is, you know, yes.
Speaker 3 (20:34):
I fortunately was able to see all the living dogs
photographed with the book, which is really nice.
Speaker 4 (20:43):
So yeah, the adoptors were were quite supportive.
Speaker 3 (20:47):
I couldn't never have done the project without the house
of so many people that you know, really made it possible.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
Right.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
That is really cool that they kept in touch with
you and kept you updated so that you knew the
outcome of the dog. That's really awesome. Sometimes that happens.
Speaker 2 (21:03):
I did.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
I had people every once in a wived when they
would adopt for me. They would do that. They would
contact me or post something on Facebook and and tag
me so that I saw that the saw the dog
read run in terminal store or something somewhere.
Speaker 3 (21:15):
Right.
Speaker 1 (21:15):
Yeah, So it it's kind of nice to to know
that you know, you had dogs. And it's so funny
cause I'm so anal. I just I would watch all
the other pages and and shelter pages and rescues and
stuff like that to just see if I ever saw.
Oh yeah, I well, you know, cause I'm on Facebook
and I I cross posts. I have a page of
(21:37):
that cross post for a lot of the shelters and
rescues and stuff, so uh it try to help, you know,
get the word out about 'em. And uh so yeah,
so I would just kind of always keep my eyes
open cause I've had that happen where I would adopt
out and since I you don't do the animal control
and I worked for the county and stuff like that,
I actually had dogs that I already adopted out that people.
Speaker 3 (21:56):
Took to.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
Uh the county when county shelters. Wow, and so the
county officer just happened to real recognize the dog as
being one that came from my shelter and they would
call me and I'd.
Speaker 2 (22:09):
Get it back. But wow.
Speaker 1 (22:11):
Yeah, so, cause uh i'd we had the shelter more
or less. I the statistics made it a no kill shelter.
So yeah, but uh so, yeah, so I would kind
of want I don't think I really have any dogs
left much out there now that I would have adopted, cause,
like I said, it's been over almost nine years ago now,
(22:35):
so I mean there may be some that are up there,
but any yeah, it's interesting to to find out about 'em.
Speaker 3 (22:42):
And yeah, and similarly, there were dogs in this project
that were surrendered multiple times before they found their forever
home in this project. So I guess it's not as
uncommon as we think because I are in this, you know,
in this sampling of dogs that I worked with, that
definitely happened to multiple dogs in the project.
Speaker 1 (23:04):
Yeah, it does. It happens quite a bit. And you
know what, can you see? It's a thrower way society
nowadays and the worst person And it's so funny cause
I w I'm I'm sorry, I'm some sometimes I'm a
little more blunked than I probably should be. But either
people who come in and they would turn their dog
into me for this reason or that reason and that look,
(23:24):
I was just looking and you go, okay, so, cause
I mean, we don't have time to say, well, okay,
so you're basically now passing your problem off to someone else.
That's pretty much what you're doing here, cause you don't
wanna take the time to correct the problem.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
Yeah, So like in the in in the book.
Speaker 3 (23:41):
I mean that really everything really goes to our human actions, right,
so for better fare worse, we.
Speaker 2 (23:48):
Can do harm or you know, we can help these dogs.
And that's you know, especially with the complic the.
Speaker 3 (23:56):
Complicated reasonings behind the overpopulation probably that we have with
dogs and animals and shelter. I my hope is the
way that uh, the timing of when Abandoned came out.
Speaker 4 (24:09):
This past fall hopefully shed flight on this overpopulation crisis
that we we all find ourselves in.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
And I hope it's an important dog.
Speaker 3 (24:20):
They're just schedulous dogs, and they will really change your life,
you know.
Speaker 1 (24:24):
And and it's and it is, it's a horrible problem
right now. I've and I have had, you know, just
in the last say month, a couple of people contact
me going, Hay, do you know anybody that can that'll
take the d dog? And I'm like no. One person's like, oh,
this is like a hang dog, she's pregnant, she's gonna
(24:45):
have puppies in any Rescues are d well, No, I'm
know the rescuers are full. They're pulling from shelters. Shelters
are full, rescues are full, and so and then and
this person's in this situation cause they were trying to
do the right thing and the dog was running use
And I don't know if I got pregnant for it
came to them, were pregnant after it came to them.
Speaker 2 (25:06):
I'm not sure.
Speaker 1 (25:07):
With one of their lives, I couldn't tell you. But yeah,
so now they're looking at having puppies and uh yeah,
I'm just say, there's no way for any of these
dogs to go. What are you guys doing?
Speaker 3 (25:18):
You?
Speaker 2 (25:18):
Uh right?
Speaker 1 (25:20):
And then and and I gotta say this because I
see this so much of the time. Everybody says, you
need to get your dog's spade and muted. Because that's
the biggest problem. Yes, that is one of the biggest
problems is not enough people get their animals fixed. But
another big problem that I see is nobody goes to
(25:41):
pick up their animals after they get out of their yard.
I wanna make goodness, Yeah, I I will notice. I
mean a lot with the dogs that I, you know,
keep track of. I don't keep track, but I help post.
Like I said, and you have a in Tucson. You know,
it's a larger city, a larger shelter and so they
(26:02):
have all these dogs that come in, you know, especially
during certain times of years. We all know this Fourth
of July years when people are doing frameworks and stuff
like that. But uh, I keep seeing all these dogs
coming in and a good part of them are going
up for adoption because no one ever comes.
Speaker 2 (26:20):
To get them.
Speaker 4 (26:22):
Oh my gosh, that's really sad.
Speaker 1 (26:24):
Yeah, So I don't know if people aren't realizing that.
That's another big problem. And a good part of the
time these shelters sinster're so overcrowded in food, they're just
giving the dogs. Fact, they're not charging any feesista like
a lot of people think, and you're not getting sold.
I mean, fix the problem, please, that's the big thing.
Just fix the problem in your yard and you know,
and your dogs are getting out, and keep them in.
(26:46):
That's what an any animal control officer will tell you.
And that's what all they want is for you to
fix the problem. Keep your dogs in, keep them at home.
We don't want them in the shelters because yeah, they're
taking up kennels, so they m You may need for
you know, al a literal case that really need it,
but uh yeah, go ahead.
Speaker 2 (27:08):
And r t to that point.
Speaker 3 (27:10):
When you do adopt a dog from a shelter and
a rescue, you are also saving another dog's like as well,
like ya, cause.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
They're space issues.
Speaker 4 (27:19):
So it is really a ripple effect by doing this.
Speaker 1 (27:23):
Yeah, it is, And I do understand there are people
out there that are just adam they want to go
to a breeder and pay and get the dog from
a breeder. Okay, just please, when you're doing that, make
sure it's a real beautiable breeder that it takes care
of their dogs and does what they're supposed to be
doing with them, getting them their shots and you know,
(27:43):
if they did dogs with hip problems, getting those X
rays and stuff like that done, making sure those dogs
are in good hats before they sell them to you.
Because there's so many backyard breeders out there that don't
do that. So if you can shut down a good
part of the backyard breeders, that would be wonderful. But
you know, yeah, so there's so many things that need
(28:05):
to happen for this pet over population thing to actually
stop and and go down. But people really need to
work on it and quit making excuses and quit being
at there a way society. That's the biggest thing. And
being responsible peniminers. Y, I think we have.
Speaker 3 (28:26):
I think we all as a society have the responsibility
to help these animals in need, and if.
Speaker 2 (28:31):
More of us do it, it will it will also help.
Speaker 3 (28:34):
That will help with uh over population and it will well,
it will help, but it may it's a complex issue.
It is.
Speaker 1 (28:43):
It just really comes down to being responsible. I mean
that's the biggest mood for any of it when you
really stop and think about, is being responsible. So, uh,
back to your bigness. So I also wanted to ask
you what your feels were when you found out some
of the dogs that you photographed had actually ended up
(29:06):
haf with the euthanized instead of actually being adopted out.
Speaker 2 (29:11):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (29:12):
So in the book, there's nearly sixty dogs and they
overwhelmingly have one unquote happy ending.
Speaker 7 (29:20):
But it was important to me to also include in
this book a handful of dogs that were euthanized because
these dogs, you know, based life and death on a
daily basis, and I thought it was important to include
these dogs.
Speaker 4 (29:36):
In the project, showing the real reality you know, facing
these dogs on on a daily basis.
Speaker 3 (29:44):
So of course it's heartbreaking, it's sad, but I hope
people see in the images of these dogs.
Speaker 4 (29:54):
The second image for these dogs is a black square,
and hopefully it.
Speaker 3 (29:58):
Will make an impact them people when they see these
Imma kids that there is no second image.
Speaker 2 (30:05):
Yeah, of that's of that specific dog.
Speaker 1 (30:09):
Yes, I hope so too, cause you know, I J
and I just saw another one either today or yesterday
as I was cross posting, uh the description of saying
that the owner turned the dog into the shelter because
they didn't have time because they were working too much.
Any hm, I'm okay. Yeah, most dogs sleep while you're
(30:35):
at work during the day, just saying most dogs sleep,
so they really don't care that you're not there during
the day. So if you can take the time to
take them for a walk or play with them after
you get home from work, you know, things like that,
to some quality time with them, that's a much better
scenario than putting him in an animal shelter, especially the
(30:56):
one that's really overcrowded and may be one that's a
higher UH with the major rate, because that your dog
may not stand as good of the chance as you
think of getting out into a new home, especially once
they go into the shelter, because now you got all
these dogs are doing panels and the shelter barking, and
there's a lot of stress and a lot of anxiety.
Speaker 4 (31:17):
Are very stressful. It's so stressful for these dogs to
be in that enpartment.
Speaker 3 (31:21):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (31:22):
And now your dog is stressed and overwhelmed and he
has anxiety, And how do you think your dog is
gonna act when it's like that? So again, maybe you
do work a lot of hours, but again you you're
you're a much better scenario for your dog than putting
it in an animal shelter. Just just saying, so you know,
(31:42):
those excuses are kind of getting old of that kind
of stuff. Cause, yeah, what are your overall feelings about
animal shelters and animal rescues?
Speaker 2 (31:56):
Well, I think they're vital.
Speaker 3 (31:58):
Mard We we need we need them because these animals
need a place to live, hopefully temporarily before they get adopted.
Speaker 4 (32:09):
Like I said earlier, my experience with the rescues and
the volunteers there is that they had more capacity to put.
Speaker 2 (32:17):
Dogs into.
Speaker 8 (32:19):
Foster scenarios, where like I said, they did learn more
about each job to help set the dog up for success,
kind of matching them with the right right people, the
right environment.
Speaker 3 (32:32):
The shelter, totally different environment and situation, you know, the smells, barking,
just the whole environment.
Speaker 4 (32:42):
It was I can't imagine myself living in that, you know.
Speaker 2 (32:46):
And it's sad and it's hard, and we still need that.
Speaker 3 (32:51):
We obviously need the shelters, but like I said, for
certain constraints of staff funding, et cetera, these dogs don't
necessarily get a foster environment all of them, which really
will help get them acclimated and socialized and more time with.
Speaker 2 (33:08):
That particular dog toy figure out what would work best
for you know, him or her, you know, home with
other animals, home.
Speaker 3 (33:16):
With children, you know, just it gives more anecdotal information
to help place the dog. And that's kind of a
missing link at the at the shelter that that I
worked with in and are part of my project. But
it's it's I don't want to be remiss in that.
(33:37):
You know, this is tireless, This is very important work,
and we need these these people who are on the
front lines because you know, where would these.
Speaker 2 (33:48):
Dogs be without at least the shelter and or rescued.
Speaker 1 (33:51):
Right, Yeah, exactly, I mean how many dogs? Just ask
you how many dogs? Uh do you know how many
dogs are abandoned or displaced a new United States each year.
Speaker 4 (34:01):
Yeah, so last year, so I know, last year, statistics
showed that.
Speaker 3 (34:09):
Three million dogs and our shelter and rescue organizations in
twenty three and two million of those dogs found homes.
Speaker 2 (34:19):
However, that left one million dogs who did not find homes.
So it's quite astronomical.
Speaker 6 (34:25):
Yeah, it is.
Speaker 1 (34:26):
I I knew it wasn't the millions. I just wasn't
sure what it was. Uh here just really recently, I
haven't checked the stats in quite a while. So yeah,
it's it's it's it's quite high for you know in
you know, like we we were talking about here just
a minute ago. You know, some of the things people
can do to kind of help end just sew to overpopulation,
(34:48):
you know, adopt foster, uh even if you can't adopt
a foster, cause it's at every situation you may be in,
even just helping to spread the word cause you just
never know who might.
Speaker 2 (35:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (35:01):
Yeah, and also just like you're able to, you know,
donate money and or supplies.
Speaker 2 (35:08):
Shelters are in dire need of supplies.
Speaker 3 (35:10):
There's just a right away you can help, Like you said,
you can volunteer, you can foster, you can you can help, you.
Speaker 2 (35:20):
Know, get the get the word out when you can.
Speaker 3 (35:22):
But you know, donations are extremely helpful. That obviously adapting
U into a permanent situation is.
Speaker 2 (35:32):
Is obviously ideal, the most ideals.
Speaker 1 (35:34):
Yep, yeah, yeah it is. Would be lovely if we
could get every dog we'll need to a home.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
Yes, wouldn't it be kids to kids?
Speaker 1 (35:44):
Do you have kids deserve places too? Hum So, also
in doing this project just out of curiosity, what did
you kind of learn about yourself doing this as well?
Speaker 3 (35:59):
Yeah, it was quite a journey. I mean, this was
a ten year project. I at the outset, I didn't
really know how long it would take. I wasn't even
I didn't quite comprehend at the time I started. While
all was you know, going to be involved. It was
got much bigger than I you know, when the concept
(36:21):
kind of came to me. So it was quite a
learning experience, overcoming you know a lot of obstacles, persevering
just you know, trying to keep hope that my goal
was to finish it.
Speaker 2 (36:35):
My second goal was to find a publisher to get
it published.
Speaker 3 (36:38):
And you know, with the impetus always behind this to
all these dogs and need that was really really always
at the back of my mind, and even after Biscuit died,
we only had in two and a half years.
Speaker 2 (36:53):
We adopted through.
Speaker 3 (36:56):
The rescue where we got Biscuit through a shelter to
rescue actually in Michigan.
Speaker 2 (37:03):
We adopted Victory.
Speaker 4 (37:04):
She came with the name and she was a constant
companion while working.
Speaker 2 (37:09):
On this work. Biscuit excuse me a Biscuit was.
Speaker 3 (37:15):
Was with me at the very beginning, but he unfortunately
passed away from a rare cancer.
Speaker 2 (37:21):
And Victory was just always there. And every time I
felt either scared that I was never going to.
Speaker 3 (37:27):
Finish or how this would if, if this project would
either come together, there's no guarantees. It's it's quite a
different way of working, but really a lot of faith
and trust in the process, which which is hard at
times for sure, But I'm grateful that I was able
to finish it and get it published.
Speaker 1 (37:48):
When you starated, did you think it was going to
take you a decade to to do the project?
Speaker 3 (37:52):
Oh no, I'm not sure I ever really contemplated how
long it would take.
Speaker 2 (38:01):
It just really felt this whole time, no matter what,
I always just felt really compelled that I needed to
do it, and that really cut me going through you
know nothings. This is far from.
Speaker 3 (38:14):
Perfect, very nonlinear process, so that just really cut me,
you know, going as just the belief that.
Speaker 2 (38:23):
You know, and and a also honoring Biscuit. I felt
like I owed it to him to finish it. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (38:31):
Yeah, well it's it's I it like I said, I
I liked it.
Speaker 2 (38:33):
I thought it was.
Speaker 1 (38:34):
It was a good book with the pictures and and
the l you know everything and uh the adopters comments
and everything with the dogs after they'd had 'em for
a bit and things like that. So you think it
came out well, thinks so, n I just kind of
(38:55):
a recab just in case, uh somebody missed it. What
was the message that you were trying to convey with
the book?
Speaker 3 (39:02):
I mean, the I just I think the overall just
awareness of these dogs and just the just wanting to showcase.
Speaker 2 (39:13):
How vital and.
Speaker 3 (39:15):
Important dog rescue and adoption is to these animals and
to the life changing at you know, intact on on
the human companions. It just is such a rewarding relationship
and experience.
Speaker 4 (39:31):
That you know, I W I cannot imagine not having.
Speaker 3 (39:34):
A rescue dog in my life ever. I you know,
I just can't imagine life without one.
Speaker 2 (39:40):
And I think even though they can't speak, I think
they're so grateful.
Speaker 3 (39:45):
And they're just they're so present and they're just they're
just it's unconditional.
Speaker 2 (39:51):
Love and all they really want is, you know, love
in a warm's warm home and care.
Speaker 3 (39:58):
And how easy it is that in and within you know,
such a short time, your life will be ever changed.
And what's been so great is that about I think
it was about five years after we adopted Victory, our
second sheltery, after Biscuit passed, our daughter was born, and
(40:20):
so she's an only child, only human child, and she's
gotten to grow up with Victory, and it's just made
her more.
Speaker 2 (40:29):
Aware of animals. She loves animals, she loves dogs, and
just like really early education and having her exposed to
that has been really really beautiful.
Speaker 1 (40:41):
Right, Well, well that's in and it's it's a great
message to get out there to people and stuff like that, cause, yeah,
there's so many dogs out there that need homes, that
are such good dogs, and you know, so if you can, yeah,
go out and adopt, and if not, at least try
to help spread the word around and uh, let people
know about you know, these dogs that are in the
(41:02):
shelters or foster if you can a foster, even if
you're in the foster for a short time, just giving
them the break out of the shelter is nice for them.
Speaker 2 (41:11):
So oh yes, it is so important.
Speaker 1 (41:14):
Yeah, well, maybe you can tell us now where people
can actually go and buy your book and also maybe
give us your uh website information in case any of
the listeners would like to know more about you and
your works.
Speaker 4 (41:33):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (41:34):
So the book is available wherever books are sold, and
a portion of my royalties are being donated to the
SPCA International, which is going to a specific fund to
help dogs around the globe who are in need. And
my website is Katherinecarver dot com and that's k A
t h E r i n E. Carver c A
(41:55):
R visin Victor er dot com and you can specifically.
Speaker 4 (42:00):
See all the places or most of the places.
Speaker 2 (42:03):
Where the book is available.
Speaker 3 (42:06):
Yeah, and it's kind of come full circle with having
the involvement of the SPCA International, bringing everything.
Speaker 4 (42:13):
Full circle, cause without these dogs, the stook would not exist.
Speaker 3 (42:16):
And so my hope is with the book that it
causes the positive ripplefect for dogs in need.
Speaker 1 (42:24):
Awesome, awesome. MSPCA Internationals been doing some great work, so
it's really nice that you're contributing some of the royalties
to them to help out to help the other dogs
around the globe. So that's really nice because there's so
many dogs around the globe that do need help. I
don't know how many people who are aware of some
of the dire straits that some of the dogs and
(42:45):
some of these other countries are in, like Turkey and
and uh Involgim and stuff like that. It's it's just crazy.
So anyway, well, Catherine, I really appreciate you coming on
today and talking with this about your new book. Again,
for those of you that might have missed it, the
the UH title of the b UH book is Abandoned
(43:07):
Chronicling the journeys of once forsaken Dogs, and it is
UH kind of uh. I guess what you would say,
a photographic type of UH timeline with the dogs. It's
kind of cool. Katherine went in photographed them and the
shelters before to start with, and then look back a
(43:28):
bit later and photographed them after they were adopted in
the new homes for a bit to kind of show
the differences and show how these dogs friends uh had
some great news starts in life. Most of them did anyway.
So but again, thank you so much for being on
tonight and talking with us. I really appreciate it. And
uh uh hopefully people go out and uh get your book.
Speaker 2 (43:51):
Thanks so much for having me.
Speaker 1 (43:53):
Really well, I am going to give you the choice
of either staying on why I announced my h next
couple of podcasts coming up. Well you can jump off,
cause I know you are busy and have things to
do and it's up to you. But that's all I'm
gonna be doing is just announcing those next couple podcasts.
Speaker 2 (44:10):
Okay, Well, thanks for your your help. I really appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (44:14):
Well, thank you so much, and uh, if you decide
to do any more projects like this, let me know
will have you on again to talk about the new ones.
Speaker 4 (44:22):
Alright, take care of Thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (44:24):
You have a givna.
Speaker 2 (44:26):
Okay, bye buddy.
Speaker 1 (44:30):
So, uh that was a great podcast. I enjoyed talking
with her about her book. It was a really good book.
So do you uh, I do rghly recommend getting it
if you guys get the opportunity uh to to pick
it up, cause it's really nice. So the next day
podcast they'll be coming up are uh let me see
here fair would be wearing twentyeth. I am going to
(44:55):
be doing a podcast about walco. Yes, we're going to
be learning about raccoons with Sarah Holmes bookbinder, and you're
going to find out all sorts of really cool facts
and and uh tips and all sorts of new things
about raccoons, and and there's mischievous little bandits that they
(45:19):
are and all their little antiques and stuff which are
really kind of cool. So I am looking forward to
having Sarah come on the podcast and talk with me
about raccoons. So on Uh, that one's gonna be a
good one February twentieth, and then on March sixth, I'm
(45:41):
gonna have Shanning them on their Benedictus uh on with me.
Shannan is a producer, director, and she has uh been
in Church area or on many different really cool projects
for National Geographic uh in all sorts of different uh
(46:04):
sh uh TV shows and stuff like that, and in
articles and things. So uh, that's gonna be a really
interesting podcast to talk with Shannon to find out you
know how she got into UH, what she's doing and
what she's been doing and all these really great documentaries
(46:25):
and stuff like that she's been involved with. So I
can't wait to talk with her, and that'll be on
March sixth. So with that being said, do you guys
now know what my UH next upcoming podcasts are. I
hope you guys enjoyed UH tonight's podcast. I thought it
was really quite interesting to talk with Catherine, and I
(46:47):
hope you guys will be back in a couple of
weeks for the next podcast. And I also hope you
guys stay safe out there this weekend and don't get
into too much trouble. All right, Hopefully you'll be back
in a couple of weeks by I know
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