September 14, 2025 • 34 mins
In 1993, an elderly couple along with their adult son lived peacefully in Spartanburg County. The mother, Mary, served as a care taker and was beloved in her small community. That's why it was all the more shocking when tragedy befell their household.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
For over three hundred and fifty years, the state of
South Carolina has been the setting for some of the
most horrendous crimes ever committed. Some have gained global notoriety,
some have been forgotten, and others have been swept under
the rug completely. Now, two South Carolina natives and true
(00:25):
crime enthusiasts have teamed up to examine these heinous acts
in detail, giving their perspective of the evil that has
resided in the Palmetto State. You're listening to Carolina Crimes.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
And welcome back to Carolina Crimes episode two thirty nine.
Speaker 3 (00:47):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Not until we finished recording last week did I realize
I was calling last week's episode two thirty seven and
we'd already done two thirty seven. Yeah, it was actually
two thirty eight. It was labeled correctly on website and
on all the podcast platforms where you lovely people listen
each week. But yeah, it's two thirty nine this week. Well,
(01:10):
I'm one of your hosts, Matt Hyres, along.
Speaker 3 (01:12):
With Danielle Myers, and we're over the moon.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
Thrill that you joined us here this week for episode
two thirty nine. Yes, yes, she keeps mouthing it across. Yes.
Uh but thank you so much for all of you
that reached out about last week's tragic episode. Just a
wild RV trip from Hell, yeah is what the title was.
Speaker 3 (01:33):
And man, just a lot of crazy things happened in
such a short amount of time.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Yeah, I mean sex, drugs, murder, hitchhikers, RV's pulling over
on the side of the road.
Speaker 3 (01:48):
I mean changing up stories.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Wild stuff, wild stuff. But thank you for reaching out
to us about that. Also, if you want to reach
out to us, probably Facebook Messenger is the best way.
We appreciate that. I know I need to catch up
on a few of those get back to some folks.
But if you're not already following us on Facebook, check
us out at Carolina Crimes Podcast. Also over on Twitter
at sc crimes Pod. Also, if you're listening on Spotify, Apple, iTunes,
(02:15):
Apple podcast, that was a five star review, mash that
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hoodies for fall falls coming Yeah, false, we're in false
fall right now. Yeah, but it's false fall is gonna
be over and well we probably back in the nineties
(02:36):
a little bit here in September.
Speaker 3 (02:38):
They won't say that, we will.
Speaker 2 (02:40):
It always happens.
Speaker 3 (02:42):
It was in the nineties yesterday.
Speaker 2 (02:44):
Yeah, read your Farmer's Almanac. It's coming back. And then
we're gonna get cooler. Get you some hoodies over at
Carolina crimestore dot com. Look good, look good look fly
this fall. But we certainly appreciate that. And uh, Danielle,
this week you told me about the episode, and it's
coming out of Spartanburg County, South Carolina. We were just
(03:06):
there a couple episodes ago. We've been there several times,
one of the more populous counties in South Carolina. So
the more people you pile on top of each other,
the more crime's gonna occur. It is just the way
it is. I mean, few bad apples spoil a bunch,
and you get more and more bunches, you get more
and more bad apples. That's what you got going on.
(03:27):
But Spartanburg, South Carolina, for those of you not familiar
with the state, is located in northwest South Carolina. It's
home to three hundred and seventy thousand residents. What a
lot of people. Of course, Spartanburgh was nicknamed the hub city,
one of the world's leaders in textile production at one time.
(03:50):
And like I said, we've given the backstory in history
quite a few times, so we're not going to go
into that again. And Danielle, we're going to hop right
in this week. Okay, Yeah, So let's go ahead and
dive in headfirst into what you got for us from
Spartanburg County.
Speaker 3 (04:08):
Well, I know that you when you've done a lot
of this area in the history, you talk a lot
about how textiles was a big industry.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
Yes, in South Carolina, in the upstate it was king,
and starting from the late eighteen hundreds all the way
up to really the nineties, I mean, textiles were king.
I'll work in an old refurbished textile mill, one of
the first carhart mills in South or in the world,
(04:40):
and it was built in eighteen eighty one, and it's
a bear to keep up with every day.
Speaker 3 (04:45):
I bet.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (04:47):
Well, I know that you talk a lot about that.
And so this story the beginning, like a little history,
delves more into the whole textiles instead of just brushing
over it a little bit. So in Spartanburg in the
late eighteen eighties, textile mills were built on the banks
of Help me pronounce this the paco Lit river packlet
(05:10):
packlet Okay, let's close.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
Pack lit pack not paco Lit've made that mistake before
and got corrected, but it's packlet.
Speaker 3 (05:18):
Packlet like chick lit. Okay, I can remember that river.
Right outside of the established towns and mill owners. They
ended up building villages around the mills to house employees
and their families. So instead of having to go into
town into Spartanburg every day, you know, to go back
(05:41):
home and then you come back out here outside, just
on the outskirts of town to work in the mill,
they decided we're going to create a village around this mill,
so you guys don't really have to go anywhere and
you can be available to work anytime.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
And those they really exist. They called them mill villages
or the mill hill in the fifties, sixties, seventies, and
I guess essentially that might be what my house is
described as. I mean, it was right here in the
center of all kinds of mills, and my home was
built in the thirties and it, I mean it's a
(06:21):
nice home, nice street. Yeah, I mean it is good,
good families, but we yeah, I think mine would be considered.
And I've delved into the history of this a little bit,
and they had like their own money. Each mill you
had like a company store, and they would give what
they call company script, and you know, you'd get this
(06:42):
extra little bonus of where you'd okay, you'd spend money
at their company store and buy their goods with your.
Speaker 3 (06:49):
Basically you're treating everything right back in yeah, to the mill, yes,
and not taking that money to outside, which is technically
the town right right.
Speaker 2 (07:01):
Right corner, right, But that was that was mostly prevalent
in the eighteen hundreds early.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
Nineteen well, where it was workers lived in single family homes.
Sometimes they were duplexes, just depending and they were built
in rows, and higher ranking managers would live in the
larger houses of course that were closer to the mills.
And employment contracts were signed with the entire family, including children,
(07:29):
which I thought was pretty interesting. It was to ensure
that the mill had a steady supply of workers. So
I guess you signed this contract like you can't leave,
and I guess it would basically be if you leave,
you're going to be leaving your kids and stuff without
a home. Yeah, it's just a way to kind of
(07:50):
grant better ensurrety that you're not going to just quit.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
Yeah, they wanted everybody wrote in. And like you said, well,
there were a lot of children that worked in the mills.
Sometimes not a lot of child labor laws were forest
store present. So yeah, you had a lot of families
that you know, your daddy worked in the mill, you're
gonna work in the mill. Two.
Speaker 3 (08:13):
Yeah, And I knew that. I just I thought it
was interesting that you're having kids signed these employment contracts.
But it just shows the time period we're in. But
the ones that you know, and these were all over,
but the ones that were focusing on they were called
Clifton mills, and they had Clifton Mills one, two, and
three that were built between eighteen eighty one and eighteen
(08:35):
ninety five, but all three, along with their accompanying villages,
were destroyed in a flood in June of nineteen oh three.
In nineteen oh seven, everything was rebuilt and they were
in steady operation until the early nineteen nineties, going along
with your timeline, and though the mills have since all
(08:56):
been torn down in that area, these Clifton mills in
a large part has been put where they were. It's
actually a place that you can I would think it
kind of be like a river walk, so you can
go out there, picnic, ride bikes. It's still a place
that you can be around and have these old buildings.
We've got one in Columbia.
Speaker 2 (09:14):
That's nice apartments in Columbia as well. And I love
to see the old buildings repurposed.
Speaker 3 (09:20):
And yeah, and you can go in there and kind
of see what it looked like at that time and
then still get to walk along the river. It's really nice.
It's that's what they have it set up. But the
village is still there, the homes and everything, even though
the mills are not. And one of those mill families
was the Johnson family, which consisted of Thomas and Mary Johnson,
(09:42):
who both worked and eventually retired from Clifton Mills Number
two and lived in the mill village for over thirty
five years.
Speaker 2 (09:54):
Wow.
Speaker 3 (09:55):
They had four sons, Charles, Edwin, da and Keith. Unfortunately,
this family did encounter some tragedies. Charles died just before
his first birthday. Edwin ended up dying in a car
(10:15):
accident at the age of twenty two in nineteen seventy six,
and Keith, who was the youngest, lived close by with
his own family, so he was still in the area.
And David, who was the second oldest, was living at
home with his parents. It was said he had some
kind of undisclosed illness that kept him from working, living alone,
(10:40):
or driving, so he relied heavily on his parents.
Speaker 2 (10:47):
Well.
Speaker 3 (10:47):
Eighty one year old Thomas, the dad, had been in
a nursing home. He had had some health problems. Once
he started to I guess be a little bit better,
Mary decided that she didn't want him living in these
nursing this nursing home. She decided to bring him home.
Speaker 2 (11:04):
Yeah, you don't want a I mean, you don't get
married to live apart from somebody. Yeah, so that would suck,
but definitely, I mean, if they're if they're back on
the mend, if they're able to be ambulatory getting around,
I mean, yes, please.
Speaker 3 (11:22):
Yeah, she wanted to bring him home, and that's where
she decided to care for him, and not only him,
but her son. And even though she herself was suffering
from emphysema, she was still kind of the head of
the house, making sure everybody was well taken care of
just a very good caretaker.
Speaker 2 (11:42):
Possibly emphasema induced by working in the.
Speaker 3 (11:45):
Mid that's very possible. Well, though she had her hands full,
Mary still found time to take care of herself, and
on most Saturdays, Mary would go to the local hair
salon where a good friend of hers, Mattie Thornton, and
her daughter in law who was married to her youngest Keith, Elizabeth, worked,
(12:06):
so she could probably go there, get her hair done
and get some time to herself, probably gossip, not have
to worry about anything. It was just a great I
can just see it'd be in a great way for
her to just unwind and not have to think about anything.
Speaker 2 (12:20):
I'm imagining something like Truvi's Yeah on steel mag.
Speaker 3 (12:23):
Yes, Yeah, that's yeah, that's a good, good visualization. Well,
on the morning of January ninth, nineteen ninety three, when
Mary failed to show up for her appointment or failed
to call to even say she would be late or
she wouldn't be there, which was something that she never
did miss Thornton, her friend, called the home several times
(12:47):
trying to get a hold of her and make sure
everything was okay, and got no answer, and the two
of them, her and Elizabeth knew something wasn't right, but
they needed to continue their day working there. And so
after they got done around six point thirty that evening,
Maddie and Elizabeth went over to the house to see
what was going on and why Mary hadn't shown up,
(13:09):
why she hadn't been answering, And they noticed that all
the doors were locked, and they knocked several times, called out,
nobody answered. So Elizabeth had a spare key, so she
ran home because she's right up the street, grabbed her
spare key and came back and decided, you know, I'm
just going to enter the house because then you wonder,
(13:29):
at this point did someone fall something happened.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
Yeah, she knew they were elderly, and she was concerned.
Speaker 3 (13:35):
Yeah, So she decides to use the spare key and
enter the home. And that's when the two of them
walked inside and made a gruesome discovery. And we're gonna
take a quick break and then get into what exactly
it was they found inside this home.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
All right, folks, we'll be right back after this quick
word from our sponsors. Hi friends, Matt Hires here. One
of my favorite parts of bringing you Carolina Crimes each
(14:15):
week is spotlighting the many wonderful towns and communities within
our great state, and today I'm proud to encourage you
all to check out one of my personal favorites. Rather
on a road trip or a weekend getaway, discover Mullins.
Once a vibrant depot town and the former tobacco capital
of South Carolina, Mullins is a hidden treasure in the
(14:37):
PD region. Explore our offerings by savoring a cup of
coffee at our delightful coffee shop, enjoying lunch at any
of our charming restaurants, visiting old Brick Square, and shopping
at our quaint retail stores, which include an antique market
located in a repurposed tobacco warehouse. Your visit would not
(14:57):
be complete without a stop at the South Carolina to
Tobacco Museum, situated in the historic train depot in downtown Mullins,
South Carolina. Here you can explore various exhibits such as
models of tobacco plants at each growth stage, a blacksmith shop,
a log tobacco barn filled with cure tobacco, a farmhouse
(15:17):
kitchen showcasing vintage equipment, and a photo gallery highlighting contemporary
tobacco practices. The Mullins Room honors our town's origins and
its swift growth driven by the railroad and the tobacco industry. Additionally,
in late June twenty twenty five, the Reverend Daniel Simmons
Museum will open its doors to the public. Within the
(15:39):
Tobacco Museum, Reverend Simmons was one of the victims of
the Mother Emmanuel nine tragedy, and he spent his childhood
in Mullins and worked in its tobacco warehouses. Thanks to
a generous loan from his daughter Rose, we will exhibit
many of his personal belongings, including his beloved Bible. The
documentary of his life, One Last Breath, will be continuously
(16:01):
streamed in the museum. Rather it's for a road trip
or a weekend getaway, Mullins is a perfect place to
visit and a place to call home. Visit Mullins, South
Carolina and welcome back to Carolina Crimes Episode two thirty nine.
(16:41):
Here out of Spartanburg County And when we left off
Mary Johnson, two of her friends hairdressers. She had not
shown up for her appointment that day and they were concerned,
so they stopped by our house and he said that
they had an extra key and they stumbled up on
something awful.
Speaker 3 (17:03):
Well, Elizabeth and Maddie walked into the house. The family,
I believe the living quarters were all downstairs, or at
least because there were some disabilities mixed with being elderly,
they chose to make one of the rooms downstairs where
they all kind of just cohabitated or slept. And when
(17:26):
they walked in, Elizabeth noticed that Mary's glasses were on
the floor, which immediately triggered that something wasn't right because
she couldn't see without our glasses. She always had them. Well,
inside they found Thomas who was eighty one, Mary who
was seventy seven, and David who was forty three on
(17:50):
a bed in a downstairs bedroom and they had all
been stabbed to death.
Speaker 2 (17:54):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 3 (17:57):
Bloodstains were found in the kitchen, in the living room,
around the telephone and on a chair. There were signs
of a struggle, but that struggle was just in the bedroom.
It didn't go throughout the house, okay, And there were
(18:17):
no signs of force entry force entry, and it was
clear that this was not a robbery because nothing had
been taken. The house had not been ransacked, everything had
kind of been in this one area.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
So somebody wanted them dead.
Speaker 3 (18:31):
Yes, And because there was no force entry, police were
looking around and we're not able to fully determine how
this person got into the house, which makes you wonder
did they have a key?
Speaker 2 (18:42):
Mm hmm, Well, her hairdresser and friends had a key.
Speaker 3 (18:45):
Yeah, yeah, so they you know. But robbery was ruled
out and the only piece of evidence found at the
scene was a well worn dark blue or black with
orange lettering Detroit Pistons hat that was in the bedroom.
And what year was this It was in nineteen ninety three, okay,
(19:09):
and it was confirmed that it did not belong to
any of the Johnson family, so this could be something
that the perpetrator was possibly wearing. Maybe they could try
to get some DNA off of it. So that's pretty
much out of everything. The only piece of evidence that
they had. Autopsies were conducted and it showed the extent
(19:33):
of the brutality of these murders. All three victims had
each been beaten, they had suffered broken ribs, and were
killed by multiple stab wounds. It was never put out
to the public how many times they were stabbed or
what the murder weapon actually was, and they had a
(19:54):
question of did the suspect bring this weapon with them
to the crime scene to commit this crime or was
this something that they showed up and got it from
the house, from the kitchen. It was determined that they
were all killed within a short period of time of
each other. So though it was a brutal attack, it
was a very quick attack. It wasn't something that was
(20:16):
drawn out.
Speaker 2 (20:17):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (20:19):
Well, this mill village of two thousand residents were immediately
thrown into a panic. Before this, no one ever locked
their doors. There were no street lights, and then afterwards
people began locking their doors. Lights were put up on
the street and everyone began to look at each other
with suspicion. Is this someone that we know, Is this
someone that's fled town, or is this someone that lives
(20:43):
here and we see every day. This created a lot
of rumors as well, maybe you want to say the rumor.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
Mill Ah, I'll see what you did there.
Speaker 3 (20:53):
And including many that pointed to David being the one
who did this, with people saying they believed he killed
his parents and then killed himself. Many people said David
had experienced a drastic change to his personality over the years.
He had previously been a high school football star or hero,
(21:16):
but he had had a difficult time after his brother
Edwin's death in nineteen seventy six in that car accident,
and he just never was the same after that.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
Yeah, I mean I could see that.
Speaker 3 (21:28):
And there were they said, where he was once outgoing
and friendly, was now a person who didn't want to
be around anyone and stayed home. People never really said
exactly some of the symptoms or the way that he acted,
but they said it could be a mixture of grief, depression,
a lot of these things that just probably didn't get handled.
Speaker 2 (21:52):
Yeah, and we talked about it in last week's episode.
I mean, mental health treatment was not something many people
talked about until just here recently. I mean really if
you think about it, until COVID, Yeah, that it started
becoming prevalent and people were like, hey, I might need
some help with these thoughts.
Speaker 3 (22:12):
Well, especially when you have people who are going to
they probably are getting help going and speaking in groups
or talking to somebody regularly. And then COVID shut it
down and they couldn't do that. True, So that was
something that people started realizing that we probably do need
to be paying a little bit more attention to this
than we have previously. But there was never any record
(22:36):
at all that David had ever been violent, and a
few days after the murders, investigators were able to determine
that all three victims were murdered. This was not a
murder suicide, and David was not responsible for it. He
was a victim. They now had to focus on others
that could possibly have had a motive. The only survivor
(23:00):
surviving member of the Johnson family at this point was
Keith and his wife Elizabeth, who were interviewed at length,
to the point where Elizabeth said sometimes she felt like
they were not looking anywhere else. They weren't allowing themselves
to focus on stuff. And this is gonna go cold
(23:21):
because you're putting so much attention on us. But you
have to think, you know what you're looking at a motive,
You know where you set to gain anything.
Speaker 2 (23:31):
That dreaded tunnel vision to come into play, because.
Speaker 3 (23:35):
You also don't want to pull there. It goes back
to they say there's a lot of stranger on Stranger
crimes are not as prevalent as people think they are, right,
and those are the worst ones to solve, and so
you got to think, please away, there's no way this
could be just some random person who came in here
and did this and left. There was another murder not
(23:56):
too long after this one, and two people were killed
in their home, and people started to believe could this
be a serial killer? There were rumors about that, but
the person who perpetrated that crime ended up being found
and they found out it didn't have anything to do
with this one. But it just showed how many, you know,
little things just set people off. So between that between
(24:21):
interviewing Keith and his wife Elizabeth calmbing the house in
the surrounding area, days, weeks, and eventually months passed and
no motive could be determined and no arrests were made.
But there was a little bit of hope that came
some years later. But we take a short break and
(24:44):
then we'll see if maybe they could come up with something.
Speaker 2 (24:47):
Okay, well, we'll talk about that and hopefully come to
some kind of conclusion. After this quick word from our sponsors,
we'll be right back and welcome back to Carolina Crimes,
(25:21):
episode two thirty nine out of Spartanburg County, South Carolina.
In this inexplicable murder of Thomas and Mary Johnson and
their son, their second oldest son, David, back from nineteen
ninety three, and it seemed like authorities had kind of
hit a dead end when we left off and trying
(25:45):
to make sense of this. All they had was a
pistons at yeah, well pasted the pistons Heyday of eighty eight,
eighty nine or eighty nine ninety so somebody was holding
on to that. Well.
Speaker 3 (25:56):
It's interesting that with not one but three stabbings. We've
talked about this numerous times in the past about how
when people are attacking someone in the manner of stabbing
that their hands slip because the bloody the blood and
(26:16):
then they cut themselves. The DNA gets mixed. And I
know that DNA technology was still in its infancy at
that time, but you wonder, like, is there any reasons
like why they couldn't find anything that looked like a
foreign DNA that was something that was different than the
three family members. So then you wonder, I was the
(26:39):
person wearing gloves something protective, or maybe it was just
something that didn't get caught.
Speaker 2 (26:47):
But at the same time they weren't nothing was taken.
Speaker 3 (26:49):
M hm, and so then and when and I've heard too,
you know, we've talked about this as well. Stabbing deaths
are a lot very very personal, just like strangulation. It's
very personal as opposed to just shooting someone.
Speaker 2 (27:04):
Well.
Speaker 3 (27:04):
In nineteen ninety four, a reward was a fifty thousand
dollars reward was put out by the Spartanburg County Sheriff's Department.
It came the funds came from assets that had been
forfeited and were eventually awarded to the Sheriff's department, and
they decided to use that money and it was a
part of a call for information on more than two
(27:27):
dozen unsolved cases from Spartanburg County. So they take this
fifty thousand dollars reward. We're like, look, these are all
the unsolved cases that we have. We have over two dozen.
Anything to try to bring forth anybody with some kind
of information on any of these cases, hoping that it
(27:47):
would bring something up. It was only going to be
available for thirty days, so people had to act quick
if they were gonna say anything.
Speaker 2 (27:54):
Yeah, they wanted to get some information quick.
Speaker 3 (27:57):
Yeah, They're like, this is what we'll do. It's a
little sweep and Nfortunately nothing ever came to light on
the Johnson family murders. I can't speak on any of
the other cases. And in nineteen ninety seven, the Spartanburg
Public Safety Director Tony Fisher created a special unit to
study old homicide cases and he said that recent developments
(28:19):
in DNA testing and the use of lasers to lift fingerprints,
this could possibly help solve a lot of old cases,
including the one of the Johnson family. And then in
January of twenty two, so now a lot of years
have passed, not too many, but a few years of pasted,
the press conference was held and a new reward was announced.
(28:41):
This one was through the family. An electronic billboard was
placed on East Main Street in Spartanburg County asking for
any information that anybody might have, and it also announced
the press conference also announced that there was new evidence
that was being examined by SLED because new technology had
(29:01):
become available at this point. This was brought on by
an unsolved case from nineteen eighty eight that had been
solved in twenty nineteen with the help of DNA evidence,
and we actually covered this case. It was one where
Larry Smith, who was forty four had been brutally beaten
with a hammer on December third of nineteen eighty seven,
and he ended up passing away in nineteen eighty eight,
(29:24):
and the killer ended up being Larry's neighbor, Roger Wayne
Sweitzer Switzer and by time they discovered who it was
through this DNA technology, they found out that he had
already passed away in two thousand and eight, but they
were able to say for sure this is a person
who did it. So again, this new technology is bringing
(29:45):
up new hope that this one could also solve this case.
But to this day, no suspects where persons of interest
have ever been named. It has now been thirty two
years since this awful murder occurred and police still don't
have a person that they can say is going to
(30:06):
be held responsible for this Wow, And a lot of
the people who work the case, a lot of the
witnesses are not in the industry anymore. They've moved or
they've passed away. So the longer the longer that times
are going. It is not only so you do have
to rely more heavily on that DNA because that's something
(30:28):
that is absolutely for sure, and you know it's it's
unfortunate that they haven't been able to come to a conclusion.
But it has been stated and put out by the
Spartanburg County Sheriff's Department that they are not letting this
one just sit. They are still doing what they can
(30:50):
and there is still a lot of talk about hopes
of the DNA and until then, if anything comes up,
you know, to contact the Sheriff's department and we'll put
up pictures of that billboard and pictures of the family
and some of the mill pictures so that you can
kind of see a little bit of the layout. Yeah,
but yeah, unfortunately this one doesn't have a conclusion. But
(31:14):
it was one that I'd never heard of this, and
I was just like, it was a very brutal attack
on a whole family. And people would say, you know,
this was a very good family, very close family. They
were quiet, they kept to themselves. Someone goes and they
were elderly, they weren't doing anything. They're not out causing
(31:36):
problems with people, and so you know, it's still left
the community and even the police department and family very
confused as to why this happened, especially because not, like
you said, nothing was taken, so that's not the motive,
and it just it brings a lot of speculation, questions
(31:56):
and hopefully at some point an answer, sir.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
Yeah, and we say it's unsolved for now.
Speaker 3 (32:04):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:04):
Yeah, we hadn't got any more clues yet, but I
got a feeling with it. Advances in technology and you know,
we've got our friend Bill Ryan over there, our new
sheriff in Spartanburg County. We'll open this back up and
we'll get this thing complete. But yeah, just a tragedy
(32:26):
too harmless. Old people, their their son. Yeah, they were
taking Mary was taken care of as well, just for
no reason. Nothing was taken. That's horrible.
Speaker 3 (32:37):
And I have and I do have some confidence that
this could come to a conclusion because there are a
lot of things because it's unsolved that for now that
this they haven't completely disclosed all the information, and I
know that police like to keep things close to their
vest until because they want to make sure that they
get the right person. So there could be more information
(32:59):
that they're sitting on, and they have a lot better
clues and evidence. Yeah, and there's just only been a
little bit that has been released, and that's you don't
want to jeopardize the investigation, because I get that.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
Yeah, certainly not. But if you have any information, contact
South Carolina Law Enforcement Division or also Spartanburg County.
Speaker 3 (33:24):
Sheriff's offices And like I said, I'll put that billboard
up and there's a number.
Speaker 2 (33:28):
Fantastic, fantastic. Well, Danielle, thank you for bringing us this
one this week. Thank you all for listening. As well.
As we close out every episode, we want to encourage
you to follow us on social media. You'll see those
pictures that Danielle was alluding to on our Facebook at
Carolina Crimes Podcast. Also over on Twitter at sc crimes Pod.
(33:48):
If you're looking to support the show, we'd love for
you to throw throw us a five star review over
on Apple, Apple iTunes, Apple Podcasts, Spotify. Danielle is going
to figure that out. Also, if you're looking to support
the show and get some nice hoodies for this fall
weather that we are greatly anticipating, check us out at
Carolina Crimestore dot com. But until next time, thank you
(34:12):
for listening to this week's episode of Carolina Crimes
For over three hundred and fifty years, the state of
South Carolina has been the setting for some of the
most horrendous crimes ever committed. Some have gained global notoriety,
some have been forgotten, and others have been swept under
the rug completely. Now, two South Carolina natives and true
(00:25):
crime enthusiasts have teamed up to examine these heinous acts
in detail, giving their perspective of the evil that has
resided in the Palmetto State. You're listening to Carolina Crimes.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
And welcome back to Carolina Crimes episode two thirty nine.
Speaker 3 (00:47):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Not until we finished recording last week did I realize
I was calling last week's episode two thirty seven and
we'd already done two thirty seven. Yeah, it was actually
two thirty eight. It was labeled correctly on website and
on all the podcast platforms where you lovely people listen
each week. But yeah, it's two thirty nine this week. Well,
(01:10):
I'm one of your hosts, Matt Hyres, along.
Speaker 3 (01:12):
With Danielle Myers, and we're over the moon.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
Thrill that you joined us here this week for episode
two thirty nine. Yes, yes, she keeps mouthing it across. Yes.
Uh but thank you so much for all of you
that reached out about last week's tragic episode. Just a
wild RV trip from Hell, yeah is what the title was.
Speaker 3 (01:33):
And man, just a lot of crazy things happened in
such a short amount of time.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
Yeah, I mean sex, drugs, murder, hitchhikers, RV's pulling over
on the side of the road.
Speaker 3 (01:48):
I mean changing up stories.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Wild stuff, wild stuff. But thank you for reaching out
to us about that. Also, if you want to reach
out to us, probably Facebook Messenger is the best way.
We appreciate that. I know I need to catch up
on a few of those get back to some folks.
But if you're not already following us on Facebook, check
us out at Carolina Crimes Podcast. Also over on Twitter
at sc crimes Pod. Also, if you're listening on Spotify, Apple, iTunes,
(02:15):
Apple podcast, that was a five star review, mash that
purple subscribe button and tell us a little something you
like about the show. And in addition to that, if
you'd like to support the show and get some nice
hoodies for fall falls coming Yeah, false, we're in false
fall right now. Yeah, but it's false fall is gonna
be over and well we probably back in the nineties
(02:36):
a little bit here in September.
Speaker 3 (02:38):
They won't say that, we will.
Speaker 2 (02:40):
It always happens.
Speaker 3 (02:42):
It was in the nineties yesterday.
Speaker 2 (02:44):
Yeah, read your Farmer's Almanac. It's coming back. And then
we're gonna get cooler. Get you some hoodies over at
Carolina crimestore dot com. Look good, look good look fly
this fall. But we certainly appreciate that. And uh, Danielle,
this week you told me about the episode, and it's
coming out of Spartanburg County, South Carolina. We were just
(03:06):
there a couple episodes ago. We've been there several times,
one of the more populous counties in South Carolina. So
the more people you pile on top of each other,
the more crime's gonna occur. It is just the way
it is. I mean, few bad apples spoil a bunch,
and you get more and more bunches, you get more
and more bad apples. That's what you got going on.
(03:27):
But Spartanburg, South Carolina, for those of you not familiar
with the state, is located in northwest South Carolina. It's
home to three hundred and seventy thousand residents. What a
lot of people. Of course, Spartanburgh was nicknamed the hub city,
one of the world's leaders in textile production at one time.
(03:50):
And like I said, we've given the backstory in history
quite a few times, so we're not going to go
into that again. And Danielle, we're going to hop right
in this week. Okay, Yeah, So let's go ahead and
dive in headfirst into what you got for us from
Spartanburg County.
Speaker 3 (04:08):
Well, I know that you when you've done a lot
of this area in the history, you talk a lot
about how textiles was a big industry.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
Yes, in South Carolina, in the upstate it was king,
and starting from the late eighteen hundreds all the way
up to really the nineties, I mean, textiles were king.
I'll work in an old refurbished textile mill, one of
the first carhart mills in South or in the world,
(04:40):
and it was built in eighteen eighty one, and it's
a bear to keep up with every day.
Speaker 3 (04:45):
I bet.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (04:47):
Well, I know that you talk a lot about that.
And so this story the beginning, like a little history,
delves more into the whole textiles instead of just brushing
over it a little bit. So in Spartanburg in the
late eighteen eighties, textile mills were built on the banks
of Help me pronounce this the paco Lit river packlet
(05:10):
packlet Okay, let's close.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
Pack lit pack not paco Lit've made that mistake before
and got corrected, but it's packlet.
Speaker 3 (05:18):
Packlet like chick lit. Okay, I can remember that river.
Right outside of the established towns and mill owners. They
ended up building villages around the mills to house employees
and their families. So instead of having to go into
town into Spartanburg every day, you know, to go back
(05:41):
home and then you come back out here outside, just
on the outskirts of town to work in the mill,
they decided we're going to create a village around this mill,
so you guys don't really have to go anywhere and
you can be available to work anytime.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
And those they really exist. They called them mill villages
or the mill hill in the fifties, sixties, seventies, and
I guess essentially that might be what my house is
described as. I mean, it was right here in the
center of all kinds of mills, and my home was
built in the thirties and it, I mean it's a
(06:21):
nice home, nice street. Yeah, I mean it is good,
good families, but we yeah, I think mine would be considered.
And I've delved into the history of this a little bit,
and they had like their own money. Each mill you
had like a company store, and they would give what
they call company script, and you know, you'd get this
(06:42):
extra little bonus of where you'd okay, you'd spend money
at their company store and buy their goods with your.
Speaker 3 (06:49):
Basically you're treating everything right back in yeah, to the mill, yes,
and not taking that money to outside, which is technically
the town right right.
Speaker 2 (07:01):
Right corner, right, But that was that was mostly prevalent
in the eighteen hundreds early.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
Nineteen well, where it was workers lived in single family homes.
Sometimes they were duplexes, just depending and they were built
in rows, and higher ranking managers would live in the
larger houses of course that were closer to the mills.
And employment contracts were signed with the entire family, including children,
(07:29):
which I thought was pretty interesting. It was to ensure
that the mill had a steady supply of workers. So
I guess you signed this contract like you can't leave,
and I guess it would basically be if you leave,
you're going to be leaving your kids and stuff without
a home. Yeah, it's just a way to kind of
(07:50):
grant better ensurrety that you're not going to just quit.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
Yeah, they wanted everybody wrote in. And like you said, well,
there were a lot of children that worked in the mills.
Sometimes not a lot of child labor laws were forest
store present. So yeah, you had a lot of families
that you know, your daddy worked in the mill, you're
gonna work in the mill. Two.
Speaker 3 (08:13):
Yeah, And I knew that. I just I thought it
was interesting that you're having kids signed these employment contracts.
But it just shows the time period we're in. But
the ones that you know, and these were all over,
but the ones that were focusing on they were called
Clifton mills, and they had Clifton Mills one, two, and
three that were built between eighteen eighty one and eighteen
(08:35):
ninety five, but all three, along with their accompanying villages,
were destroyed in a flood in June of nineteen oh three.
In nineteen oh seven, everything was rebuilt and they were
in steady operation until the early nineteen nineties, going along
with your timeline, and though the mills have since all
(08:56):
been torn down in that area, these Clifton mills in
a large part has been put where they were. It's
actually a place that you can I would think it
kind of be like a river walk, so you can
go out there, picnic, ride bikes. It's still a place
that you can be around and have these old buildings.
We've got one in Columbia.
Speaker 2 (09:14):
That's nice apartments in Columbia as well. And I love
to see the old buildings repurposed.
Speaker 3 (09:20):
And yeah, and you can go in there and kind
of see what it looked like at that time and
then still get to walk along the river. It's really nice.
It's that's what they have it set up. But the
village is still there, the homes and everything, even though
the mills are not. And one of those mill families
was the Johnson family, which consisted of Thomas and Mary Johnson,
(09:42):
who both worked and eventually retired from Clifton Mills Number
two and lived in the mill village for over thirty
five years.
Speaker 2 (09:54):
Wow.
Speaker 3 (09:55):
They had four sons, Charles, Edwin, da and Keith. Unfortunately,
this family did encounter some tragedies. Charles died just before
his first birthday. Edwin ended up dying in a car
(10:15):
accident at the age of twenty two in nineteen seventy six,
and Keith, who was the youngest, lived close by with
his own family, so he was still in the area.
And David, who was the second oldest, was living at
home with his parents. It was said he had some
kind of undisclosed illness that kept him from working, living alone,
(10:40):
or driving, so he relied heavily on his parents.
Speaker 2 (10:47):
Well.
Speaker 3 (10:47):
Eighty one year old Thomas, the dad, had been in
a nursing home. He had had some health problems. Once
he started to I guess be a little bit better,
Mary decided that she didn't want him living in these
nursing this nursing home. She decided to bring him home.
Speaker 2 (11:04):
Yeah, you don't want a I mean, you don't get
married to live apart from somebody. Yeah, so that would suck,
but definitely, I mean, if they're if they're back on
the mend, if they're able to be ambulatory getting around,
I mean, yes, please.
Speaker 3 (11:22):
Yeah, she wanted to bring him home, and that's where
she decided to care for him, and not only him,
but her son. And even though she herself was suffering
from emphysema, she was still kind of the head of
the house, making sure everybody was well taken care of
just a very good caretaker.
Speaker 2 (11:42):
Possibly emphasema induced by working in the.
Speaker 3 (11:45):
Mid that's very possible. Well, though she had her hands full,
Mary still found time to take care of herself, and
on most Saturdays, Mary would go to the local hair
salon where a good friend of hers, Mattie Thornton, and
her daughter in law who was married to her youngest Keith, Elizabeth, worked,
(12:06):
so she could probably go there, get her hair done
and get some time to herself, probably gossip, not have
to worry about anything. It was just a great I
can just see it'd be in a great way for
her to just unwind and not have to think about anything.
Speaker 2 (12:20):
I'm imagining something like Truvi's Yeah on steel mag.
Speaker 3 (12:23):
Yes, Yeah, that's yeah, that's a good, good visualization. Well,
on the morning of January ninth, nineteen ninety three, when
Mary failed to show up for her appointment or failed
to call to even say she would be late or
she wouldn't be there, which was something that she never
did miss Thornton, her friend, called the home several times
(12:47):
trying to get a hold of her and make sure
everything was okay, and got no answer, and the two
of them, her and Elizabeth knew something wasn't right, but
they needed to continue their day working there. And so
after they got done around six point thirty that evening,
Maddie and Elizabeth went over to the house to see
what was going on and why Mary hadn't shown up,
(13:09):
why she hadn't been answering, And they noticed that all
the doors were locked, and they knocked several times, called out,
nobody answered. So Elizabeth had a spare key, so she
ran home because she's right up the street, grabbed her
spare key and came back and decided, you know, I'm
just going to enter the house because then you wonder,
(13:29):
at this point did someone fall something happened.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
Yeah, she knew they were elderly, and she was concerned.
Speaker 3 (13:35):
Yeah, So she decides to use the spare key and
enter the home. And that's when the two of them
walked inside and made a gruesome discovery. And we're gonna
take a quick break and then get into what exactly
it was they found inside this home.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
All right, folks, we'll be right back after this quick
word from our sponsors. Hi friends, Matt Hires here. One
of my favorite parts of bringing you Carolina Crimes each
(14:15):
week is spotlighting the many wonderful towns and communities within
our great state, and today I'm proud to encourage you
all to check out one of my personal favorites. Rather
on a road trip or a weekend getaway, discover Mullins.
Once a vibrant depot town and the former tobacco capital
of South Carolina, Mullins is a hidden treasure in the
(14:37):
PD region. Explore our offerings by savoring a cup of
coffee at our delightful coffee shop, enjoying lunch at any
of our charming restaurants, visiting old Brick Square, and shopping
at our quaint retail stores, which include an antique market
located in a repurposed tobacco warehouse. Your visit would not
(14:57):
be complete without a stop at the South Carolina to
Tobacco Museum, situated in the historic train depot in downtown Mullins,
South Carolina. Here you can explore various exhibits such as
models of tobacco plants at each growth stage, a blacksmith shop,
a log tobacco barn filled with cure tobacco, a farmhouse
(15:17):
kitchen showcasing vintage equipment, and a photo gallery highlighting contemporary
tobacco practices. The Mullins Room honors our town's origins and
its swift growth driven by the railroad and the tobacco industry. Additionally,
in late June twenty twenty five, the Reverend Daniel Simmons
Museum will open its doors to the public. Within the
(15:39):
Tobacco Museum, Reverend Simmons was one of the victims of
the Mother Emmanuel nine tragedy, and he spent his childhood
in Mullins and worked in its tobacco warehouses. Thanks to
a generous loan from his daughter Rose, we will exhibit
many of his personal belongings, including his beloved Bible. The
documentary of his life, One Last Breath, will be continuously
(16:01):
streamed in the museum. Rather it's for a road trip
or a weekend getaway, Mullins is a perfect place to
visit and a place to call home. Visit Mullins, South
Carolina and welcome back to Carolina Crimes Episode two thirty nine.
(16:41):
Here out of Spartanburg County And when we left off
Mary Johnson, two of her friends hairdressers. She had not
shown up for her appointment that day and they were concerned,
so they stopped by our house and he said that
they had an extra key and they stumbled up on
something awful.
Speaker 3 (17:03):
Well, Elizabeth and Maddie walked into the house. The family,
I believe the living quarters were all downstairs, or at
least because there were some disabilities mixed with being elderly,
they chose to make one of the rooms downstairs where
they all kind of just cohabitated or slept. And when
(17:26):
they walked in, Elizabeth noticed that Mary's glasses were on
the floor, which immediately triggered that something wasn't right because
she couldn't see without our glasses. She always had them. Well,
inside they found Thomas who was eighty one, Mary who
was seventy seven, and David who was forty three on
(17:50):
a bed in a downstairs bedroom and they had all
been stabbed to death.
Speaker 2 (17:54):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 3 (17:57):
Bloodstains were found in the kitchen, in the living room,
around the telephone and on a chair. There were signs
of a struggle, but that struggle was just in the bedroom.
It didn't go throughout the house, okay, And there were
(18:17):
no signs of force entry force entry, and it was
clear that this was not a robbery because nothing had
been taken. The house had not been ransacked, everything had
kind of been in this one area.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
So somebody wanted them dead.
Speaker 3 (18:31):
Yes, And because there was no force entry, police were
looking around and we're not able to fully determine how
this person got into the house, which makes you wonder
did they have a key?
Speaker 2 (18:42):
Mm hmm, Well, her hairdresser and friends had a key.
Speaker 3 (18:45):
Yeah, yeah, so they you know. But robbery was ruled
out and the only piece of evidence found at the
scene was a well worn dark blue or black with
orange lettering Detroit Pistons hat that was in the bedroom.
And what year was this It was in nineteen ninety three, okay,
(19:09):
and it was confirmed that it did not belong to
any of the Johnson family, so this could be something
that the perpetrator was possibly wearing. Maybe they could try
to get some DNA off of it. So that's pretty
much out of everything. The only piece of evidence that
they had. Autopsies were conducted and it showed the extent
(19:33):
of the brutality of these murders. All three victims had
each been beaten, they had suffered broken ribs, and were
killed by multiple stab wounds. It was never put out
to the public how many times they were stabbed or
what the murder weapon actually was, and they had a
(19:54):
question of did the suspect bring this weapon with them
to the crime scene to commit this crime or was
this something that they showed up and got it from
the house, from the kitchen. It was determined that they
were all killed within a short period of time of
each other. So though it was a brutal attack, it
was a very quick attack. It wasn't something that was
(20:16):
drawn out.
Speaker 2 (20:17):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (20:19):
Well, this mill village of two thousand residents were immediately
thrown into a panic. Before this, no one ever locked
their doors. There were no street lights, and then afterwards
people began locking their doors. Lights were put up on
the street and everyone began to look at each other
with suspicion. Is this someone that we know, Is this
someone that's fled town, or is this someone that lives
(20:43):
here and we see every day. This created a lot
of rumors as well, maybe you want to say the rumor.
Speaker 2 (20:51):
Mill Ah, I'll see what you did there.
Speaker 3 (20:53):
And including many that pointed to David being the one
who did this, with people saying they believed he killed
his parents and then killed himself. Many people said David
had experienced a drastic change to his personality over the years.
He had previously been a high school football star or hero,
(21:16):
but he had had a difficult time after his brother
Edwin's death in nineteen seventy six in that car accident,
and he just never was the same after that.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
Yeah, I mean I could see that.
Speaker 3 (21:28):
And there were they said, where he was once outgoing
and friendly, was now a person who didn't want to
be around anyone and stayed home. People never really said
exactly some of the symptoms or the way that he acted,
but they said it could be a mixture of grief, depression,
a lot of these things that just probably didn't get handled.
Speaker 2 (21:52):
Yeah, and we talked about it in last week's episode.
I mean, mental health treatment was not something many people
talked about until just here recently. I mean really if
you think about it, until COVID, Yeah, that it started
becoming prevalent and people were like, hey, I might need
some help with these thoughts.
Speaker 3 (22:12):
Well, especially when you have people who are going to
they probably are getting help going and speaking in groups
or talking to somebody regularly. And then COVID shut it
down and they couldn't do that. True, So that was
something that people started realizing that we probably do need
to be paying a little bit more attention to this
than we have previously. But there was never any record
(22:36):
at all that David had ever been violent, and a
few days after the murders, investigators were able to determine
that all three victims were murdered. This was not a
murder suicide, and David was not responsible for it. He
was a victim. They now had to focus on others
that could possibly have had a motive. The only survivor
(23:00):
surviving member of the Johnson family at this point was
Keith and his wife Elizabeth, who were interviewed at length,
to the point where Elizabeth said sometimes she felt like
they were not looking anywhere else. They weren't allowing themselves
to focus on stuff. And this is gonna go cold
(23:21):
because you're putting so much attention on us. But you
have to think, you know what you're looking at a motive,
You know where you set to gain anything.
Speaker 2 (23:31):
That dreaded tunnel vision to come into play, because.
Speaker 3 (23:35):
You also don't want to pull there. It goes back
to they say there's a lot of stranger on Stranger
crimes are not as prevalent as people think they are, right,
and those are the worst ones to solve, and so
you got to think, please away, there's no way this
could be just some random person who came in here
and did this and left. There was another murder not
(23:56):
too long after this one, and two people were killed
in their home, and people started to believe could this
be a serial killer? There were rumors about that, but
the person who perpetrated that crime ended up being found
and they found out it didn't have anything to do
with this one. But it just showed how many, you know,
little things just set people off. So between that between
(24:21):
interviewing Keith and his wife Elizabeth calmbing the house in
the surrounding area, days, weeks, and eventually months passed and
no motive could be determined and no arrests were made.
But there was a little bit of hope that came
some years later. But we take a short break and
(24:44):
then we'll see if maybe they could come up with something.
Speaker 2 (24:47):
Okay, well, we'll talk about that and hopefully come to
some kind of conclusion. After this quick word from our sponsors,
we'll be right back and welcome back to Carolina Crimes,
(25:21):
episode two thirty nine out of Spartanburg County, South Carolina.
In this inexplicable murder of Thomas and Mary Johnson and
their son, their second oldest son, David, back from nineteen
ninety three, and it seemed like authorities had kind of
hit a dead end when we left off and trying
(25:45):
to make sense of this. All they had was a
pistons at yeah, well pasted the pistons Heyday of eighty eight,
eighty nine or eighty nine ninety so somebody was holding
on to that. Well.
Speaker 3 (25:56):
It's interesting that with not one but three stabbings. We've
talked about this numerous times in the past about how
when people are attacking someone in the manner of stabbing
that their hands slip because the bloody the blood and
(26:16):
then they cut themselves. The DNA gets mixed. And I
know that DNA technology was still in its infancy at
that time, but you wonder, like, is there any reasons
like why they couldn't find anything that looked like a
foreign DNA that was something that was different than the
three family members. So then you wonder, I was the
(26:39):
person wearing gloves something protective, or maybe it was just
something that didn't get caught.
Speaker 2 (26:47):
But at the same time they weren't nothing was taken.
Speaker 3 (26:49):
M hm, and so then and when and I've heard too,
you know, we've talked about this as well. Stabbing deaths
are a lot very very personal, just like strangulation. It's
very personal as opposed to just shooting someone.
Speaker 2 (27:04):
Well.
Speaker 3 (27:04):
In nineteen ninety four, a reward was a fifty thousand
dollars reward was put out by the Spartanburg County Sheriff's Department.
It came the funds came from assets that had been
forfeited and were eventually awarded to the Sheriff's department, and
they decided to use that money and it was a
part of a call for information on more than two
(27:27):
dozen unsolved cases from Spartanburg County. So they take this
fifty thousand dollars reward. We're like, look, these are all
the unsolved cases that we have. We have over two dozen.
Anything to try to bring forth anybody with some kind
of information on any of these cases, hoping that it
(27:47):
would bring something up. It was only going to be
available for thirty days, so people had to act quick
if they were gonna say anything.
Speaker 2 (27:54):
Yeah, they wanted to get some information quick.
Speaker 3 (27:57):
Yeah, They're like, this is what we'll do. It's a
little sweep and Nfortunately nothing ever came to light on
the Johnson family murders. I can't speak on any of
the other cases. And in nineteen ninety seven, the Spartanburg
Public Safety Director Tony Fisher created a special unit to
study old homicide cases and he said that recent developments
(28:19):
in DNA testing and the use of lasers to lift fingerprints,
this could possibly help solve a lot of old cases,
including the one of the Johnson family. And then in
January of twenty two, so now a lot of years
have passed, not too many, but a few years of pasted,
the press conference was held and a new reward was announced.
(28:41):
This one was through the family. An electronic billboard was
placed on East Main Street in Spartanburg County asking for
any information that anybody might have, and it also announced
the press conference also announced that there was new evidence
that was being examined by SLED because new technology had
(29:01):
become available at this point. This was brought on by
an unsolved case from nineteen eighty eight that had been
solved in twenty nineteen with the help of DNA evidence,
and we actually covered this case. It was one where
Larry Smith, who was forty four had been brutally beaten
with a hammer on December third of nineteen eighty seven,
and he ended up passing away in nineteen eighty eight,
(29:24):
and the killer ended up being Larry's neighbor, Roger Wayne
Sweitzer Switzer and by time they discovered who it was
through this DNA technology, they found out that he had
already passed away in two thousand and eight, but they
were able to say for sure this is a person
who did it. So again, this new technology is bringing
(29:45):
up new hope that this one could also solve this case.
But to this day, no suspects where persons of interest
have ever been named. It has now been thirty two
years since this awful murder occurred and police still don't
have a person that they can say is going to
(30:06):
be held responsible for this Wow, And a lot of
the people who work the case, a lot of the
witnesses are not in the industry anymore. They've moved or
they've passed away. So the longer the longer that times
are going. It is not only so you do have
to rely more heavily on that DNA because that's something
(30:28):
that is absolutely for sure, and you know it's it's
unfortunate that they haven't been able to come to a conclusion.
But it has been stated and put out by the
Spartanburg County Sheriff's Department that they are not letting this
one just sit. They are still doing what they can
(30:50):
and there is still a lot of talk about hopes
of the DNA and until then, if anything comes up,
you know, to contact the Sheriff's department and we'll put
up pictures of that billboard and pictures of the family
and some of the mill pictures so that you can
kind of see a little bit of the layout. Yeah,
but yeah, unfortunately this one doesn't have a conclusion. But
(31:14):
it was one that I'd never heard of this, and
I was just like, it was a very brutal attack
on a whole family. And people would say, you know,
this was a very good family, very close family. They
were quiet, they kept to themselves. Someone goes and they
were elderly, they weren't doing anything. They're not out causing
(31:36):
problems with people, and so you know, it's still left
the community and even the police department and family very
confused as to why this happened, especially because not, like
you said, nothing was taken, so that's not the motive,
and it just it brings a lot of speculation, questions
(31:56):
and hopefully at some point an answer, sir.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
Yeah, and we say it's unsolved for now.
Speaker 3 (32:04):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:04):
Yeah, we hadn't got any more clues yet, but I
got a feeling with it. Advances in technology and you know,
we've got our friend Bill Ryan over there, our new
sheriff in Spartanburg County. We'll open this back up and
we'll get this thing complete. But yeah, just a tragedy
(32:26):
too harmless. Old people, their their son. Yeah, they were
taking Mary was taken care of as well, just for
no reason. Nothing was taken. That's horrible.
Speaker 3 (32:37):
And I have and I do have some confidence that
this could come to a conclusion because there are a
lot of things because it's unsolved that for now that
this they haven't completely disclosed all the information, and I
know that police like to keep things close to their
vest until because they want to make sure that they
get the right person. So there could be more information
(32:59):
that they're sitting on, and they have a lot better
clues and evidence. Yeah, and there's just only been a
little bit that has been released, and that's you don't
want to jeopardize the investigation, because I get that.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
Yeah, certainly not. But if you have any information, contact
South Carolina Law Enforcement Division or also Spartanburg County.
Speaker 3 (33:24):
Sheriff's offices And like I said, I'll put that billboard
up and there's a number.
Speaker 2 (33:28):
Fantastic, fantastic. Well, Danielle, thank you for bringing us this
one this week. Thank you all for listening. As well.
As we close out every episode, we want to encourage
you to follow us on social media. You'll see those
pictures that Danielle was alluding to on our Facebook at
Carolina Crimes Podcast. Also over on Twitter at sc crimes Pod.
(33:48):
If you're looking to support the show, we'd love for
you to throw throw us a five star review over
on Apple, Apple iTunes, Apple Podcasts, Spotify. Danielle is going
to figure that out. Also, if you're looking to support
the show and get some nice hoodies for this fall
weather that we are greatly anticipating, check us out at
Carolina Crimestore dot com. But until next time, thank you
(34:12):
for listening to this week's episode of Carolina Crimes
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