July 30, 2025 • 23 mins
Tonight we’re chatting with director Chuck Russell, whose new film Witchboard which is out August 15 and is a re-imagining of the 1986 classic. The new film stars Madison Iseman, Aaron Dominguez, Melanie Jarnson, Charlie Tahan, Antonia Desplat, and Jamie Campbell Bower. Russell is a horror veteran, having directed the films A Nightmare on Elm Street 3: Dream Warriors (1987), "the highest grossing independent film ever made" at that time, The Blob (1988), which was itself a re-imagining of a film made 30 years before that, The Mask (1994), Eraser (1996), and The Scorpion King (2002).
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:08):
Hello, and welcome to Castle Talk, where we talk to
writers and creators of today's genre worlds. I'm your host
Jason Henderson, publisher at castle Bridge Media, home of the
Castle of Horror anthology series. Tonight, we're chatting with director
Chuck Russell, whose new film Witchboard is out August fifteenth.
It's a reimagining of the nineteen eighties classic. The film
(00:29):
stars Madison Eisman, Aaron Dominguez, Melanie Jansen, Charlie Tahan, Antonio Displatt,
and Jamie Campbell Bauer. Now, Russell is a horror veteran,
having directed the films, and we're going to talk about
some of these Nightmaron Elmstreet three, Dream Warriors, which was
the highest grossing independent film horror film ever made at
(00:50):
the time, The Blob Remake, which was itself a reimagining
of a film that had come out thirty years before that,
The Mask for nineteen ninety four, a racer score, and King.
It is really exciting to talk to. Welcome Chuck, Thank
you for having me.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Glad to be here.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
Oh, absolutely, Okay, this film takes place. This is a
for people who remember which Board. This film takes a
lot of the same themes, but it's in It's set
in present day New Orleans, and in this case, a
cursed artifact, which we'll get into, is not quite the
Wisi board we remember, unleashes a witch's power, drawing this
(01:25):
couple who are involved in trying to launch a new
restaurant into a deadly spiral of possession and temptation and
occult terror. So my first question is, does this the
original blog came out in nineteen fifty eight and your
blog came out in eighty eight, and you must have
I'm looking at you right now. You must have been
a child when you directed that movie. But there's thirty
years between those and to me, those two movies both
(01:49):
exist in a very similar world. It's this analog world
and small talents and cops and everything. Whereas which Board
came out in eighty seven, I guess, and that's thirty
eight years ago and the world is vastly different. But
I just thought it was interesting that this is the
second time that you've taken a piece and then tried
(02:10):
to rip it forward thirty years then and now nearly
forty years in time.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
Well, it was my intention for me.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
This is the third in a trilogy of reimagining classic horror.
When I went to do Nightmare on Elm Street three,
New Line wanted a whole new direction. They actually didn't
think they were going to continue with the Elm Street
series after number two, which would have been a shame.
So Frank Dearborn and I came in and took that,
took that property into a new space. That became the
(02:38):
format for it in the future. And kudos to Wes Craven.
He was a genius and my biggest challenge was my
first directorial gig was emulating him. Then The Blob was
similar in that I felt it required reimagining. It was
the kind of film where it was great part of
pop culture, is iconic, but yet it didn't hold up.
And I thought, there's so much more I can do
(03:00):
with this fascinating idea, very simple idea of unstoppable evil,
and we challenged ourselves.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
With physical effects. That was that it was a comedy.
Speaker 3 (03:09):
If you did a film of filming the Blob, it
was it was pretty wild and now here was here
became one more opportunity. I had not wanted to return
to horror before now and I thought, well, I can
do here what I did with the previous films. Take
take a film that has very been very resonant in
pop culture, reinvent it brings something the audiences have never
seen before, but honor the original film.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
And that's interesting.
Speaker 3 (03:32):
You should mention Kevin Tenny to me earlier because he
was the director of the original and I was very pleased.
He just saw the film for the first time last
week and he really loved it. So it means maybe
I did my job well in that I was honoring
the memory of his film without actually making a really
specific remake.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
That's interesting that that I want to I want to
double tap on that just a little bit, because when
somebody approaches a remake and and by the way, people
complain about remakes, but they actually love right, they love
them because it's like, oh, there's a new version of
The Big Sleep. I'm gonna go watch it because you
know what it is. And it seems to me you've
(04:09):
always got this sort of when you sit down, you're like, Okay,
this is the thing I'm gonna do. Are you going
to a whiteboard and going what do we keep? What
do we throw away? Is it el?
Speaker 2 (04:18):
No? I mean, how do you do it? Of what?
Speaker 3 (04:20):
I it starts with do I want to do this project?
Which board had been offered to me years prior, and
I thought there've been too many Wiji board movies. Realized
I think it was around twenty sixteen or twenty seventeen,
I'd been doing notes on a horror film.
Speaker 2 (04:33):
About pendulum boards.
Speaker 3 (04:35):
I'm fascinated with pendulum boards much the way I was
fascinated with the Mask of.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
Low Key in my movie with Jim Carrey. The mask.
Speaker 3 (04:42):
I like what Hitchcock used to call mcguffin movies where
it's all about the Maltese falcon, or my case, it
was the mask, it's all about a magical prop. And
I took the original pendulum board and the history plum boards.
I don't want to bore your audience, but it's mind blowing.
It goes all the way back to ancient Egypt. It's
spell casting, it's for connecting with spirits. It can be
(05:04):
used in number of ways, and they're an amazing art form.
The pendulum boards don't necessarily have letters on them like
a Ouiji board. There could be astrological signs and symbols,
all of which we did in the witchboard we designed,
and they predated Ouiji boards, and in fact Wuiji boards
evolved directly from pendulum boards because the Pope in the
seventeen hundreds outlawed pendulum boards and they were burning women
(05:25):
at the stake who had them as witches. So it
quickly made them unpopular to have. So that's really the story.
I realized, Wait, there's a connection here. What if I
did witchboard emphasized the amazing things about witches I wanted
to get into, and the pendulum board I wanted to
put on film. It's just a very interesting visual for
a director to play with. So that combined with the
(05:47):
great original iconic say it was three films actually in
the eighties, Well, this is this is meant to be.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
I was going to ask you, you've got you mentioned
the witches, and you have these wonderful opening scenes that
are taking place during this sort of this program against
against witches, and it's all it's it's in French.
Speaker 4 (06:10):
And it's really cool and very violent and very scary.
Speaker 1 (06:14):
And what is your what is the film's sort of
attitude towards witches? I mean, what does it have to
say in terms of our like our witch is a
benevolent forest? Are they just something not to be reckoned
with what what what is it?
Speaker 4 (06:28):
Because it's a big deal, and.
Speaker 2 (06:29):
Yeah, of course it's a big deal.
Speaker 3 (06:30):
And there there's a whole lot of contemporary people who
are interested in Wicca and the beliefs of earth magic
and you know, white witches, but there's also dark magic.
So it all depends on the intention what we call
a witch. I think what I tried to dramatize, why
is our queen of witches back in the seventeen hundreds, What.
Speaker 2 (06:50):
Happened to her?
Speaker 3 (06:51):
Why did she go from frankly being a good person
medieval times to going to the dark side as a
witch for vengeance?
Speaker 2 (06:58):
And what does that do to a human? I thought
that was a.
Speaker 3 (07:01):
Wonderful thing to dramatize in a horror film, so I
wanted to get more into the actual I use history
to create.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
Horror, and it's much more resonant.
Speaker 3 (07:11):
So strangely enough, everything you see in the film has
historical roots in fact, how they were persecuting witches at
that time. And of course we go further into the supernatural.
But I believe we live in a spiritual world, so
we have bad intentions and practice magic. I think your
karma is going to get you, and that is one
of the things we deal with in the show. But
people who have good intentions in the spiritual world through
(07:32):
meditation or prayer, possibly white witchcraft. I don't recommend it,
but you know, I respect people who believe in that.
I wanted to suggest that this isn't just a shadow
witch and you're supposed to be scared because it's a
loud sound effect and.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
A pop scare.
Speaker 3 (07:46):
I think the most effective villains in cinema are ones
we understand are unstoppable and why they have a vengeance.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
So, you know, number one thing. I made sure it's
a quick paced film with great scares, but also characters
that run a little deeper than you normally see in
these films.
Speaker 4 (08:03):
I love that you would choose.
Speaker 1 (08:04):
You know, you go from a French speaking world in
the seventeen hundreds and you wind up in New Orleans,
which always has this incredible French influence, so it gives
you all of this, like just stylistic stuff, and I
feel like I haven't been seeing New Orleans in recent
films as much as we were like in the nineties,
so you know, like it's a good opportunity to It's
(08:26):
called the most haunted city in America.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
You know. I happened to be there for a week.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
Well, one of my relatives was in a hospital there,
and I was acting as a guardian for my relative.
So I'm wandering around New Orleans by myself, not there
just to have not to party or something. And I
was wandering through a couple of the cult stores that
are not tourist stores.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
But this place has legitimately dark roots.
Speaker 3 (08:50):
There's a very dangerous side to spiritualism, and that sense
of really haunted spaces and haunted objects, yes, stayed with me.
Contrasting to the colorful this and the and the the
blues and jazz music of New Orleans. It's a very
interesting mix. So I thought it was a wonderful rich
palette for a film.
Speaker 4 (09:07):
That's fantastic. I love that.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
I want to you mentioned practical effects and and uh,
you know in the Blob, the one that pops into
my head instantly, by the way, is this is this
stunt where the blob encompasses a phone booth and then
and then just sort of explodes into it, like and
you know, it's just just an amazing effect. And I
don't really know how that was done. But we live
(09:32):
in a world now where uh many times effects are CG.
Even blood it will be CG. You know, gunshots will
be CG. Uh when you're approaching putting all this together,
Uh do you do a little bit of both?
Speaker 4 (09:44):
Do you? And and what's your attitude about that?
Speaker 3 (09:46):
I think for horror, practical effects are essential in my work,
so I use CG. Look, I helped pioneer CGI with
the mask. It was a brand new technique. In fact,
I was putting a lot of trust in me at
the time because CGI was was very much on tech,
particularly on what was essentially a low budget film. So
you know, that was a wonderful experience. So I respect CG.
(10:06):
It's a wonderful tool, but there's something about it. Great
for sci fi, great for a lot of films, but
there's something about it in horror. Where As a filmmaker,
I prefer practical effects. I might enhance them with CGI,
which I did in this film because I'm eracing and
fixing mistakes and things like that. A physical effect is
by nature more kinetic and more frightening on field. There's
(10:26):
something I still think in our subconscious almost that you
recognize the CGI effect, and I find myself saying, Wow,
what a beautiful CGI design, rather Oh my god, I
hope the hero isn't killed, you know, I want to
cut people's head in the game. Part of the reason
practical effects are so wonderful, in my opinion, is, honestly,
(10:47):
the cast is a little scared they're on my set knowing.
You know, for me, it's safety first. I've never got
anybody hurt. But it's a little bit like being d
David Copperfield. I have to storyboard these things, work out
how each element is done in camera, live on set
and done safely, and we create these illusions. Then I'll
go back and clean up the wirework or any any
flaws in the in the effect.
Speaker 2 (11:09):
With CGI, it's a wonderful tool. But if the.
Speaker 3 (11:11):
Cast has that tension in them when they're walking down
a hall and know one of my effects is going
to explode up out of the.
Speaker 2 (11:16):
Floor, it's a different performance.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
It's it's something you can't get on a green screen, right,
So that that is a fear, is a herd instinct,
and being in a theater, it's one of the reasons
I still love the theater experience a scary movie. There's
nothing like it because the whole audience, you can feel
the tension from the audience if you're if it's reflected
by my cast, then you can end up with with
a peak experience in a horror film.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
That's it's funny that that's what, in a in a sense,
horrors for is to make us feel this sort of
visceral thing. And I like what you're saying about how
the actors. You know, the actors have to be able
to get into it. They have to feel that visceral
thing themselves. They have to feel the tingle of of
kind even though they know it's pretend. Kids pretend and
they get scared. I mean, they can live on.
Speaker 3 (11:58):
It's set and the bell rings and it's quite on
the set and you're walking down a hall the floorboards
are really creaking, and you know you can see in
the corner of your eye twenty effects people ready to
pull the switch or whatever the heck that.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
Particular effect requires.
Speaker 3 (12:10):
I did a bedroom set in whichboard and Madison Eisman
is an extremely brave, a wonderful young actress. She's already
a star from Jumanji and Annabelle, and she was fearless.
We had what happens on the bed, and I think
there's even a bit of this in the trailer. We
had nineteen puppeteers under the set sets feet in the air.
That's all real time. No elements were added later. And
(12:33):
those hands burst out of her bed and grab her.
They were bursting up out of the bed and grabbing her.
So you can't quite duplicate that with a bunch of
little shots in CGI. Yeah, so everything you see in
her character's home is on an eight foot set, including
the bathroom. We had an infinity bathtub.
Speaker 4 (12:52):
That's so wild that you're building an entire you're building the.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
House or at least the portion of the house that
you're in, up on things that people could be walking
around underneath it.
Speaker 4 (13:00):
That's that's that's really great.
Speaker 3 (13:02):
This is how we lay our plans in advance, and
it's it's pretty unique for an independent film that that
was That was a reach, but it looked beautiful.
Speaker 2 (13:09):
It was worth it. Wow.
Speaker 1 (13:10):
Do you think when it comes to director and I
know that you've been doing a lot of adventure and
action and stuff like that, which I love, but this
is a return to horror. Is there anything different about
getting I know you said you want to have a
project that you want.
Speaker 4 (13:26):
To do right. You have to be interested in it.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
But is there but as the director, is it different
today than it was during Dream Warriors? To get a
picture made? To get a horror picture made, is it
easier or harder?
Speaker 2 (13:37):
Like? How's a change right now? It's easier?
Speaker 3 (13:39):
But you know that's why horror goes in cycles and
then too many horror films, and the powers that be
may decide, well, horrors going out of fashion? Well were
those good horror films? The ones you might feel failed?
You know, that's the real question. I think it's about.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
Genre and more about the medium of television movies, you
know how how oror films being consumed.
Speaker 3 (13:58):
Who's our audience. I try to be true to my audience,
and honestly, I'm true to myself. I have a short
attention span, so I get bored watching other films. Then
my number They ask what I'm scared of? I'm scared
of being boring. I want to engage my audience. Yeah,
the I need characters we care about. So it's not
just about pop scares. So it's about caring about what's
(14:18):
happening in this It's a deeper story than I think
you'll find in most horror films. Yeah, the characters seem
to connect a little better, so I'm told from the
audiences that have already seen it, which I'm really I'm
thrilled about.
Speaker 2 (14:29):
So you know, there you have it. It's timing for me.
Speaker 3 (14:32):
It's returning to horror with something I really believe in,
because I didn't want to go back to horror unless
I had something I could really please international audiences with.
Speaker 1 (14:40):
You said in an interview, I've put something like that
you wanted to put in everything you hadn't tried before.
Speaker 4 (14:45):
What did you mean by that?
Speaker 3 (14:47):
Basically, Look, I'm fascinated with pendulum boards. I'm fascinated with
what are witches, what what is magic? Even our intentions
and how it connects to dreams. I think what we
call magic, what we ca all dreams and cinema are
all extremely similar manifesting. We're creating powerful imagery in people's imaginations.
(15:08):
So I'm also very cautious about what I'm sending out
there into the world. I want to scare the hell
out of my audience, but I like films that have
some element of.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
Hope in them.
Speaker 3 (15:16):
I personally don't like the trend of I mean, I
admire all forms of cinema, but some filmmakers choose to
just do despair.
Speaker 2 (15:24):
That's lazy.
Speaker 3 (15:25):
Frankly, I think it's lazy because I like having the
protagonists be represent the audience do my job. The audience
is sitting there thinking how would I think my way
out of this? How would I face unstoppable, noble evil.
The trick has come up with something that is satisfying
to the audience, but a great surprise that's character based.
So if that sounds a little technical, all I'm really
(15:46):
saying is I like seeing the hero I like seeing
normal people rise up into being heroes because I think
that's human nature. I see the side of human nature.
So if I can show by wit guts them facing
a great evil, there's the catharsist that I think horror
films are all about.
Speaker 1 (16:03):
That was really interesting, you know, because you're talking about
this trend towards misery in horror, and when I think
back to Texas Chainsaw Massacre, everybody remembers the very visceral,
like like just skin itching fear that you feel.
Speaker 4 (16:17):
When you're watching that original movie.
Speaker 1 (16:19):
But I think one of the reasons it resonates is
that at the end, when she gets in that pickup
truck and gets.
Speaker 4 (16:25):
Away, you are so thrilled that she made it through.
Speaker 2 (16:29):
It's an epiphany. It's an epiphany.
Speaker 3 (16:31):
I'm not saying, you know, horror films need to have
a happy ending, mind doesn't The cost, the cost of
facing that level of evil is great in horror film,
so I think it you can be really end up
being corny if you try to be too sweet. On
the other hand, there are films that are modern films
that are the equivalent of Texas Chainsaw where the final
girl dies too. I mean, I'm not saying one is
(16:52):
better than the other, but personally I find the others.
When I use the word lazy, what I really mean
is as a creator, the writer, the director, I think
it's more satisfying to have them outwit a situation at
great cost. So there's no right or wrong to film.
That's what's beautiful about film. I'll always see I'll see
a film I love that breaks all the rules. My
favorite film that I would call horror this year has
(17:14):
Ben Sinners, which used which used music and horror the
way I've not seen it used before. Amazing, amazing. Yeah,
So I don't think there's any rules people need to
go by. I'm just telling you my personal take is
I find constant despair a bit boring, you.
Speaker 1 (17:29):
Know, I know, and and and I don't think anybody
should be offended by that, because you're absolutely right. I
will always defend everybody's got to be you know, Rob
z Ogdby's gotta have his whimpering people wandering across the floor.
That's his art and that's what he's gonna do, right.
But I like how all of these pieces of art
are in dialogue with one another. And and uh, and
(17:51):
you're being true to your vision. That absolutely absolutely makes
sense about getting Montreal and New Orleans to work together.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
In the development of any film.
Speaker 3 (17:58):
Uh. Whatever you're lands might be tend to shape up
or to go to the next level of development when
you pick your locations. So I actually once I saw
it was available in Montreal. Old Montreal is almost like
a Disneyland, but an authentic one in that those are
buildings over three hundred years old in this one area
of Montreal. What you'll see in Witchboard there's dungeons and
(18:23):
very frightening places that were very frightening places. We shot
it at old fort that I personally found myself alone
doing notes after the crew left one night, and I thought, what,
you know, what am I doing here? People really were
killed here. You know this is not a Ghost Hunter show.
Let me get back to my van and get out
of here.
Speaker 2 (18:39):
You know. So Montreal itself was why we use some
French language. It's authentic to the history of witches.
Speaker 3 (18:47):
Some of the worst atrocities were done in the sixteen
and seventeen hundreds in France, and the history of our
Queen of Witches is based on a real witch. Literally
every event is based on what is more than legend,
what is history of some of the some of the
horrible stories about witches. That becomes a basis. So that
affected the film.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
We use a little friend.
Speaker 3 (19:07):
I got to use amazing, amazing production values. As we
were burning our witches and showing dungeons. Those were the
real places. And of course in New Orleans is New Orleans,
so we shot the streets of New Orleans. Our wonderful
production designer made our interiors in Montreal look like New Orleans.
We even did a storefront. People have complimented us how
much you know look, and my job is to make
(19:29):
it all match. Yeah, we'll shoot one angle in the
actual streets of New Orleans and another angle going into
a building in Montreal. And believe it or not, that's
one of the most amazing common visual effects in any
film is when you open a door and end up
another location. I'm still a little kid when I put
that cut together. I know intellectually it's going to work,
but it's the fun of creating a world in film.
Speaker 4 (19:51):
That is so funny.
Speaker 1 (19:52):
Yeah, we were watching my wife and I were watching
an old star trek from the sixties, right, and you know,
they're on the Paramount back lot, and they walk in
so place that looks just like Earth because it's cheap
because it's the Paramount back lit. And so they walk
into the building and then we were looking at the
studio set on the inside, which looked nothing. The windows
looked nothing like the building that Kirk had just walked into.
Speaker 2 (20:12):
And it's a it's a you know those mistakes.
Speaker 3 (20:16):
I there was a Lee Marvin Sissy space space movie
many years ago, and as a kid, I happened to
see this and I realized one angle was a huge
storm storm front, and another angle in the same scene
in what was real movie time was a bright sunny
day and was the first time as a child they thought,
oh that's how they shoot it. It may it may
(20:36):
have been hours later, and I got more and more
fascinated with filmmaking. So that listen, every one of these
shots is a form of an illusion, trying to make
an event that takes this all day to shoot part
of appear to be happening in real time.
Speaker 4 (20:49):
Yeah, yeah, that is, that's wonderful.
Speaker 1 (20:51):
I love I love that idea of an illusion and
putting on a show and having it all be one thing,
one coherent piece. This film releases August fifteenth, correct, And
so you know, I always try to think of like,
like what, because who knows how much you can actually
control pr and publicity and all that stuff. But if
(21:12):
people were going out looking for it, what would you
want them to do beforehand?
Speaker 4 (21:16):
Like would you want them to like, go to.
Speaker 3 (21:19):
The website, you look up Which Board Movie twenty twenty five.
Our stuff is apparently all over the socials, TikTok and Instagram,
but check out which Board twenty twenty five or Which
Board Movie twenty twenty five.
Speaker 2 (21:31):
Yeah, it's in that world.
Speaker 3 (21:32):
I've had fun with our internet team that does all
that the Great five. The clips are really quick, which
again I kind of have a short attention span anyway. Yeah,
so a trailer is great, but to see these little
flashes of your movie on the Internet, it's it's the
new way of presenting your film.
Speaker 2 (21:46):
So if they're looking for it, they'll find it. They'll
find it there you're look. It's going to be in
every major city. So it's a somewhat limited release, but
it's a good big release.
Speaker 4 (21:55):
I have a subscription to AMC. They're not a sponsor
or anything.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
I just I And so the cool thing is you
just go down on a Friday and and uh.
Speaker 4 (22:03):
And and watch whatever's new. It's like the eighties basically,
and so this will.
Speaker 3 (22:07):
It's the fun of a multiplex and it's great fun
that people are coming back to the movies now. A
lot of us are very relieved after the whatever, the
fear mongering of COVID that we can go back and
enjoy a movie experience now.
Speaker 1 (22:19):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely all right. I have been speaking to
Chuck Russell about the new film, whichboard It is very
exciting to see this and and and get another movie
where you're where you're reinterpreting something from from decades before.
Speaker 4 (22:36):
I feel like I could talk to you all night
about some of that stuff.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
And I feel the same, you know, I feel thank
you so much.
Speaker 3 (22:43):
The message I have is that that I wouldn't have
done this movie if if I wasn't bringing something to
audiences I personally never seen before. So you know, we're
getting a lot of compliments on some of the power
of our what we call set pieces.
Speaker 2 (22:55):
They wouldn't be powerful if you didn't care about the characters.
Speaker 3 (22:57):
So those are the two things that I really went
into this film knowing important well.
Speaker 1 (23:01):
It is a very solid cast. They they are they
are believable and and and intense and and and ye.
Speaker 3 (23:08):
Damy gamble Bauer, who's famous from Stranger Things already does
it does an amazing job. He is He is one
of the typical of the great quality of certain English actors.
Speaker 2 (23:18):
So I consider him very much a rising star.
Speaker 4 (23:20):
Thank you very much. All Right, have a fantastic release.
Speaker 1 (23:23):
I hope it goes great, and I hope I get
a chance to talk to you on the next
Speaker 3 (23:28):
One, you know, or anytime anytime there
Hello, and welcome to Castle Talk, where we talk to
writers and creators of today's genre worlds. I'm your host
Jason Henderson, publisher at castle Bridge Media, home of the
Castle of Horror anthology series. Tonight, we're chatting with director
Chuck Russell, whose new film Witchboard is out August fifteenth.
It's a reimagining of the nineteen eighties classic. The film
(00:29):
stars Madison Eisman, Aaron Dominguez, Melanie Jansen, Charlie Tahan, Antonio Displatt,
and Jamie Campbell Bauer. Now, Russell is a horror veteran,
having directed the films, and we're going to talk about
some of these Nightmaron Elmstreet three, Dream Warriors, which was
the highest grossing independent film horror film ever made at
(00:50):
the time, The Blob Remake, which was itself a reimagining
of a film that had come out thirty years before that,
The Mask for nineteen ninety four, a racer score, and King.
It is really exciting to talk to. Welcome Chuck, Thank
you for having me.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Glad to be here.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
Oh, absolutely, Okay, this film takes place. This is a
for people who remember which Board. This film takes a
lot of the same themes, but it's in It's set
in present day New Orleans, and in this case, a
cursed artifact, which we'll get into, is not quite the
Wisi board we remember, unleashes a witch's power, drawing this
(01:25):
couple who are involved in trying to launch a new
restaurant into a deadly spiral of possession and temptation and
occult terror. So my first question is, does this the
original blog came out in nineteen fifty eight and your
blog came out in eighty eight, and you must have
I'm looking at you right now. You must have been
a child when you directed that movie. But there's thirty
years between those and to me, those two movies both
(01:49):
exist in a very similar world. It's this analog world
and small talents and cops and everything. Whereas which Board
came out in eighty seven, I guess, and that's thirty
eight years ago and the world is vastly different. But
I just thought it was interesting that this is the
second time that you've taken a piece and then tried
(02:10):
to rip it forward thirty years then and now nearly
forty years in time.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
Well, it was my intention for me.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
This is the third in a trilogy of reimagining classic horror.
When I went to do Nightmare on Elm Street three,
New Line wanted a whole new direction. They actually didn't
think they were going to continue with the Elm Street
series after number two, which would have been a shame.
So Frank Dearborn and I came in and took that,
took that property into a new space. That became the
(02:38):
format for it in the future. And kudos to Wes Craven.
He was a genius and my biggest challenge was my
first directorial gig was emulating him. Then The Blob was
similar in that I felt it required reimagining. It was
the kind of film where it was great part of
pop culture, is iconic, but yet it didn't hold up.
And I thought, there's so much more I can do
(03:00):
with this fascinating idea, very simple idea of unstoppable evil,
and we challenged ourselves.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
With physical effects. That was that it was a comedy.
Speaker 3 (03:09):
If you did a film of filming the Blob, it
was it was pretty wild and now here was here
became one more opportunity. I had not wanted to return
to horror before now and I thought, well, I can
do here what I did with the previous films. Take
take a film that has very been very resonant in
pop culture, reinvent it brings something the audiences have never
seen before, but honor the original film.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
And that's interesting.
Speaker 3 (03:32):
You should mention Kevin Tenny to me earlier because he
was the director of the original and I was very pleased.
He just saw the film for the first time last
week and he really loved it. So it means maybe
I did my job well in that I was honoring
the memory of his film without actually making a really
specific remake.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
That's interesting that that I want to I want to
double tap on that just a little bit, because when
somebody approaches a remake and and by the way, people
complain about remakes, but they actually love right, they love
them because it's like, oh, there's a new version of
The Big Sleep. I'm gonna go watch it because you
know what it is. And it seems to me you've
(04:09):
always got this sort of when you sit down, you're like, Okay,
this is the thing I'm gonna do. Are you going
to a whiteboard and going what do we keep? What
do we throw away? Is it el?
Speaker 2 (04:18):
No? I mean, how do you do it? Of what?
Speaker 3 (04:20):
I it starts with do I want to do this project?
Which board had been offered to me years prior, and
I thought there've been too many Wiji board movies. Realized
I think it was around twenty sixteen or twenty seventeen,
I'd been doing notes on a horror film.
Speaker 2 (04:33):
About pendulum boards.
Speaker 3 (04:35):
I'm fascinated with pendulum boards much the way I was
fascinated with the Mask of.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
Low Key in my movie with Jim Carrey. The mask.
Speaker 3 (04:42):
I like what Hitchcock used to call mcguffin movies where
it's all about the Maltese falcon, or my case, it
was the mask, it's all about a magical prop. And
I took the original pendulum board and the history plum boards.
I don't want to bore your audience, but it's mind blowing.
It goes all the way back to ancient Egypt. It's
spell casting, it's for connecting with spirits. It can be
(05:04):
used in number of ways, and they're an amazing art form.
The pendulum boards don't necessarily have letters on them like
a Ouiji board. There could be astrological signs and symbols,
all of which we did in the witchboard we designed,
and they predated Ouiji boards, and in fact Wuiji boards
evolved directly from pendulum boards because the Pope in the
seventeen hundreds outlawed pendulum boards and they were burning women
(05:25):
at the stake who had them as witches. So it
quickly made them unpopular to have. So that's really the story.
I realized, Wait, there's a connection here. What if I
did witchboard emphasized the amazing things about witches I wanted
to get into, and the pendulum board I wanted to
put on film. It's just a very interesting visual for
a director to play with. So that combined with the
(05:47):
great original iconic say it was three films actually in
the eighties, Well, this is this is meant to be.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
I was going to ask you, you've got you mentioned
the witches, and you have these wonderful opening scenes that
are taking place during this sort of this program against
against witches, and it's all it's it's in French.
Speaker 4 (06:10):
And it's really cool and very violent and very scary.
Speaker 1 (06:14):
And what is your what is the film's sort of
attitude towards witches? I mean, what does it have to
say in terms of our like our witch is a
benevolent forest? Are they just something not to be reckoned
with what what what is it?
Speaker 4 (06:28):
Because it's a big deal, and.
Speaker 2 (06:29):
Yeah, of course it's a big deal.
Speaker 3 (06:30):
And there there's a whole lot of contemporary people who
are interested in Wicca and the beliefs of earth magic
and you know, white witches, but there's also dark magic.
So it all depends on the intention what we call
a witch. I think what I tried to dramatize, why
is our queen of witches back in the seventeen hundreds, What.
Speaker 2 (06:50):
Happened to her?
Speaker 3 (06:51):
Why did she go from frankly being a good person
medieval times to going to the dark side as a
witch for vengeance?
Speaker 2 (06:58):
And what does that do to a human? I thought
that was a.
Speaker 3 (07:01):
Wonderful thing to dramatize in a horror film, so I
wanted to get more into the actual I use history
to create.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
Horror, and it's much more resonant.
Speaker 3 (07:11):
So strangely enough, everything you see in the film has
historical roots in fact, how they were persecuting witches at
that time. And of course we go further into the supernatural.
But I believe we live in a spiritual world, so
we have bad intentions and practice magic. I think your
karma is going to get you, and that is one
of the things we deal with in the show. But
people who have good intentions in the spiritual world through
(07:32):
meditation or prayer, possibly white witchcraft. I don't recommend it,
but you know, I respect people who believe in that.
I wanted to suggest that this isn't just a shadow
witch and you're supposed to be scared because it's a
loud sound effect and.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
A pop scare.
Speaker 3 (07:46):
I think the most effective villains in cinema are ones
we understand are unstoppable and why they have a vengeance.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
So, you know, number one thing. I made sure it's
a quick paced film with great scares, but also characters
that run a little deeper than you normally see in
these films.
Speaker 4 (08:03):
I love that you would choose.
Speaker 1 (08:04):
You know, you go from a French speaking world in
the seventeen hundreds and you wind up in New Orleans,
which always has this incredible French influence, so it gives
you all of this, like just stylistic stuff, and I
feel like I haven't been seeing New Orleans in recent
films as much as we were like in the nineties,
so you know, like it's a good opportunity to It's
(08:26):
called the most haunted city in America.
Speaker 2 (08:28):
You know. I happened to be there for a week.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
Well, one of my relatives was in a hospital there,
and I was acting as a guardian for my relative.
So I'm wandering around New Orleans by myself, not there
just to have not to party or something. And I
was wandering through a couple of the cult stores that
are not tourist stores.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
But this place has legitimately dark roots.
Speaker 3 (08:50):
There's a very dangerous side to spiritualism, and that sense
of really haunted spaces and haunted objects, yes, stayed with me.
Contrasting to the colorful this and the and the the
blues and jazz music of New Orleans. It's a very
interesting mix. So I thought it was a wonderful rich
palette for a film.
Speaker 4 (09:07):
That's fantastic. I love that.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
I want to you mentioned practical effects and and uh,
you know in the Blob, the one that pops into
my head instantly, by the way, is this is this
stunt where the blob encompasses a phone booth and then
and then just sort of explodes into it, like and
you know, it's just just an amazing effect. And I
don't really know how that was done. But we live
(09:32):
in a world now where uh many times effects are CG.
Even blood it will be CG. You know, gunshots will
be CG. Uh when you're approaching putting all this together,
Uh do you do a little bit of both?
Speaker 4 (09:44):
Do you? And and what's your attitude about that?
Speaker 3 (09:46):
I think for horror, practical effects are essential in my work,
so I use CG. Look, I helped pioneer CGI with
the mask. It was a brand new technique. In fact,
I was putting a lot of trust in me at
the time because CGI was was very much on tech,
particularly on what was essentially a low budget film. So
you know, that was a wonderful experience. So I respect CG.
(10:06):
It's a wonderful tool, but there's something about it. Great
for sci fi, great for a lot of films, but
there's something about it in horror. Where As a filmmaker,
I prefer practical effects. I might enhance them with CGI,
which I did in this film because I'm eracing and
fixing mistakes and things like that. A physical effect is
by nature more kinetic and more frightening on field. There's
(10:26):
something I still think in our subconscious almost that you
recognize the CGI effect, and I find myself saying, Wow,
what a beautiful CGI design, rather Oh my god, I
hope the hero isn't killed, you know, I want to
cut people's head in the game. Part of the reason
practical effects are so wonderful, in my opinion, is, honestly,
(10:47):
the cast is a little scared they're on my set knowing.
You know, for me, it's safety first. I've never got
anybody hurt. But it's a little bit like being d
David Copperfield. I have to storyboard these things, work out
how each element is done in camera, live on set
and done safely, and we create these illusions. Then I'll
go back and clean up the wirework or any any
flaws in the in the effect.
Speaker 2 (11:09):
With CGI, it's a wonderful tool. But if the.
Speaker 3 (11:11):
Cast has that tension in them when they're walking down
a hall and know one of my effects is going
to explode up out of the.
Speaker 2 (11:16):
Floor, it's a different performance.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
It's it's something you can't get on a green screen, right,
So that that is a fear, is a herd instinct,
and being in a theater, it's one of the reasons
I still love the theater experience a scary movie. There's
nothing like it because the whole audience, you can feel
the tension from the audience if you're if it's reflected
by my cast, then you can end up with with
a peak experience in a horror film.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
That's it's funny that that's what, in a in a sense,
horrors for is to make us feel this sort of
visceral thing. And I like what you're saying about how
the actors. You know, the actors have to be able
to get into it. They have to feel that visceral
thing themselves. They have to feel the tingle of of
kind even though they know it's pretend. Kids pretend and
they get scared. I mean, they can live on.
Speaker 3 (11:58):
It's set and the bell rings and it's quite on
the set and you're walking down a hall the floorboards
are really creaking, and you know you can see in
the corner of your eye twenty effects people ready to
pull the switch or whatever the heck that.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
Particular effect requires.
Speaker 3 (12:10):
I did a bedroom set in whichboard and Madison Eisman
is an extremely brave, a wonderful young actress. She's already
a star from Jumanji and Annabelle, and she was fearless.
We had what happens on the bed, and I think
there's even a bit of this in the trailer. We
had nineteen puppeteers under the set sets feet in the air.
That's all real time. No elements were added later. And
(12:33):
those hands burst out of her bed and grab her.
They were bursting up out of the bed and grabbing her.
So you can't quite duplicate that with a bunch of
little shots in CGI. Yeah, so everything you see in
her character's home is on an eight foot set, including
the bathroom. We had an infinity bathtub.
Speaker 4 (12:52):
That's so wild that you're building an entire you're building the.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
House or at least the portion of the house that
you're in, up on things that people could be walking
around underneath it.
Speaker 4 (13:00):
That's that's that's really great.
Speaker 3 (13:02):
This is how we lay our plans in advance, and
it's it's pretty unique for an independent film that that
was That was a reach, but it looked beautiful.
Speaker 2 (13:09):
It was worth it. Wow.
Speaker 1 (13:10):
Do you think when it comes to director and I
know that you've been doing a lot of adventure and
action and stuff like that, which I love, but this
is a return to horror. Is there anything different about
getting I know you said you want to have a
project that you want.
Speaker 4 (13:26):
To do right. You have to be interested in it.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
But is there but as the director, is it different
today than it was during Dream Warriors? To get a
picture made? To get a horror picture made, is it
easier or harder?
Speaker 2 (13:37):
Like? How's a change right now? It's easier?
Speaker 3 (13:39):
But you know that's why horror goes in cycles and
then too many horror films, and the powers that be
may decide, well, horrors going out of fashion? Well were
those good horror films? The ones you might feel failed?
You know, that's the real question. I think it's about.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
Genre and more about the medium of television movies, you
know how how oror films being consumed.
Speaker 3 (13:58):
Who's our audience. I try to be true to my audience,
and honestly, I'm true to myself. I have a short
attention span, so I get bored watching other films. Then
my number They ask what I'm scared of? I'm scared
of being boring. I want to engage my audience. Yeah,
the I need characters we care about. So it's not
just about pop scares. So it's about caring about what's
(14:18):
happening in this It's a deeper story than I think
you'll find in most horror films. Yeah, the characters seem
to connect a little better, so I'm told from the
audiences that have already seen it, which I'm really I'm
thrilled about.
Speaker 2 (14:29):
So you know, there you have it. It's timing for me.
Speaker 3 (14:32):
It's returning to horror with something I really believe in,
because I didn't want to go back to horror unless
I had something I could really please international audiences with.
Speaker 1 (14:40):
You said in an interview, I've put something like that
you wanted to put in everything you hadn't tried before.
Speaker 4 (14:45):
What did you mean by that?
Speaker 3 (14:47):
Basically, Look, I'm fascinated with pendulum boards. I'm fascinated with
what are witches, what what is magic? Even our intentions
and how it connects to dreams. I think what we
call magic, what we ca all dreams and cinema are
all extremely similar manifesting. We're creating powerful imagery in people's imaginations.
(15:08):
So I'm also very cautious about what I'm sending out
there into the world. I want to scare the hell
out of my audience, but I like films that have
some element of.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
Hope in them.
Speaker 3 (15:16):
I personally don't like the trend of I mean, I
admire all forms of cinema, but some filmmakers choose to
just do despair.
Speaker 2 (15:24):
That's lazy.
Speaker 3 (15:25):
Frankly, I think it's lazy because I like having the
protagonists be represent the audience do my job. The audience
is sitting there thinking how would I think my way
out of this? How would I face unstoppable, noble evil.
The trick has come up with something that is satisfying
to the audience, but a great surprise that's character based.
So if that sounds a little technical, all I'm really
(15:46):
saying is I like seeing the hero I like seeing
normal people rise up into being heroes because I think
that's human nature. I see the side of human nature.
So if I can show by wit guts them facing
a great evil, there's the catharsist that I think horror
films are all about.
Speaker 1 (16:03):
That was really interesting, you know, because you're talking about
this trend towards misery in horror, and when I think
back to Texas Chainsaw Massacre, everybody remembers the very visceral,
like like just skin itching fear that you feel.
Speaker 4 (16:17):
When you're watching that original movie.
Speaker 1 (16:19):
But I think one of the reasons it resonates is
that at the end, when she gets in that pickup
truck and gets.
Speaker 4 (16:25):
Away, you are so thrilled that she made it through.
Speaker 2 (16:29):
It's an epiphany. It's an epiphany.
Speaker 3 (16:31):
I'm not saying, you know, horror films need to have
a happy ending, mind doesn't The cost, the cost of
facing that level of evil is great in horror film,
so I think it you can be really end up
being corny if you try to be too sweet. On
the other hand, there are films that are modern films
that are the equivalent of Texas Chainsaw where the final
girl dies too. I mean, I'm not saying one is
(16:52):
better than the other, but personally I find the others.
When I use the word lazy, what I really mean
is as a creator, the writer, the director, I think
it's more satisfying to have them outwit a situation at
great cost. So there's no right or wrong to film.
That's what's beautiful about film. I'll always see I'll see
a film I love that breaks all the rules. My
favorite film that I would call horror this year has
(17:14):
Ben Sinners, which used which used music and horror the
way I've not seen it used before. Amazing, amazing. Yeah,
So I don't think there's any rules people need to
go by. I'm just telling you my personal take is
I find constant despair a bit boring, you.
Speaker 1 (17:29):
Know, I know, and and and I don't think anybody
should be offended by that, because you're absolutely right. I
will always defend everybody's got to be you know, Rob
z Ogdby's gotta have his whimpering people wandering across the floor.
That's his art and that's what he's gonna do, right.
But I like how all of these pieces of art
are in dialogue with one another. And and uh, and
(17:51):
you're being true to your vision. That absolutely absolutely makes
sense about getting Montreal and New Orleans to work together.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
In the development of any film.
Speaker 3 (17:58):
Uh. Whatever you're lands might be tend to shape up
or to go to the next level of development when
you pick your locations. So I actually once I saw
it was available in Montreal. Old Montreal is almost like
a Disneyland, but an authentic one in that those are
buildings over three hundred years old in this one area
of Montreal. What you'll see in Witchboard there's dungeons and
(18:23):
very frightening places that were very frightening places. We shot
it at old fort that I personally found myself alone
doing notes after the crew left one night, and I thought, what,
you know, what am I doing here? People really were
killed here. You know this is not a Ghost Hunter show.
Let me get back to my van and get out
of here.
Speaker 2 (18:39):
You know. So Montreal itself was why we use some
French language. It's authentic to the history of witches.
Speaker 3 (18:47):
Some of the worst atrocities were done in the sixteen
and seventeen hundreds in France, and the history of our
Queen of Witches is based on a real witch. Literally
every event is based on what is more than legend,
what is history of some of the some of the
horrible stories about witches. That becomes a basis. So that
affected the film.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
We use a little friend.
Speaker 3 (19:07):
I got to use amazing, amazing production values. As we
were burning our witches and showing dungeons. Those were the
real places. And of course in New Orleans is New Orleans,
so we shot the streets of New Orleans. Our wonderful
production designer made our interiors in Montreal look like New Orleans.
We even did a storefront. People have complimented us how
much you know look, and my job is to make
(19:29):
it all match. Yeah, we'll shoot one angle in the
actual streets of New Orleans and another angle going into
a building in Montreal. And believe it or not, that's
one of the most amazing common visual effects in any
film is when you open a door and end up
another location. I'm still a little kid when I put
that cut together. I know intellectually it's going to work,
but it's the fun of creating a world in film.
Speaker 4 (19:51):
That is so funny.
Speaker 1 (19:52):
Yeah, we were watching my wife and I were watching
an old star trek from the sixties, right, and you know,
they're on the Paramount back lot, and they walk in
so place that looks just like Earth because it's cheap
because it's the Paramount back lit. And so they walk
into the building and then we were looking at the
studio set on the inside, which looked nothing. The windows
looked nothing like the building that Kirk had just walked into.
Speaker 2 (20:12):
And it's a it's a you know those mistakes.
Speaker 3 (20:16):
I there was a Lee Marvin Sissy space space movie
many years ago, and as a kid, I happened to
see this and I realized one angle was a huge
storm storm front, and another angle in the same scene
in what was real movie time was a bright sunny
day and was the first time as a child they thought,
oh that's how they shoot it. It may it may
(20:36):
have been hours later, and I got more and more
fascinated with filmmaking. So that listen, every one of these
shots is a form of an illusion, trying to make
an event that takes this all day to shoot part
of appear to be happening in real time.
Speaker 4 (20:49):
Yeah, yeah, that is, that's wonderful.
Speaker 1 (20:51):
I love I love that idea of an illusion and
putting on a show and having it all be one thing,
one coherent piece. This film releases August fifteenth, correct, And
so you know, I always try to think of like,
like what, because who knows how much you can actually
control pr and publicity and all that stuff. But if
(21:12):
people were going out looking for it, what would you
want them to do beforehand?
Speaker 4 (21:16):
Like would you want them to like, go to.
Speaker 3 (21:19):
The website, you look up Which Board Movie twenty twenty five.
Our stuff is apparently all over the socials, TikTok and Instagram,
but check out which Board twenty twenty five or Which
Board Movie twenty twenty five.
Speaker 2 (21:31):
Yeah, it's in that world.
Speaker 3 (21:32):
I've had fun with our internet team that does all
that the Great five. The clips are really quick, which
again I kind of have a short attention span anyway. Yeah,
so a trailer is great, but to see these little
flashes of your movie on the Internet, it's it's the
new way of presenting your film.
Speaker 2 (21:46):
So if they're looking for it, they'll find it. They'll
find it there you're look. It's going to be in
every major city. So it's a somewhat limited release, but
it's a good big release.
Speaker 4 (21:55):
I have a subscription to AMC. They're not a sponsor
or anything.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
I just I And so the cool thing is you
just go down on a Friday and and uh.
Speaker 4 (22:03):
And and watch whatever's new. It's like the eighties basically,
and so this will.
Speaker 3 (22:07):
It's the fun of a multiplex and it's great fun
that people are coming back to the movies now. A
lot of us are very relieved after the whatever, the
fear mongering of COVID that we can go back and
enjoy a movie experience now.
Speaker 1 (22:19):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely all right. I have been speaking to
Chuck Russell about the new film, whichboard It is very
exciting to see this and and and get another movie
where you're where you're reinterpreting something from from decades before.
Speaker 4 (22:36):
I feel like I could talk to you all night
about some of that stuff.
Speaker 2 (22:39):
And I feel the same, you know, I feel thank
you so much.
Speaker 3 (22:43):
The message I have is that that I wouldn't have
done this movie if if I wasn't bringing something to
audiences I personally never seen before. So you know, we're
getting a lot of compliments on some of the power
of our what we call set pieces.
Speaker 2 (22:55):
They wouldn't be powerful if you didn't care about the characters.
Speaker 3 (22:57):
So those are the two things that I really went
into this film knowing important well.
Speaker 1 (23:01):
It is a very solid cast. They they are they
are believable and and and intense and and and ye.
Speaker 3 (23:08):
Damy gamble Bauer, who's famous from Stranger Things already does
it does an amazing job. He is He is one
of the typical of the great quality of certain English actors.
Speaker 2 (23:18):
So I consider him very much a rising star.
Speaker 4 (23:20):
Thank you very much. All Right, have a fantastic release.
Speaker 1 (23:23):
I hope it goes great, and I hope I get
a chance to talk to you on the next
Speaker 3 (23:28):
One, you know, or anytime anytime there
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