Moon of the Wolf (Podcast/Discussion)

This week we have a look at the 1972 TV film MOON OF THE WOLF.  This is Episode #464! 
Moon of the Wolf is an American TV movie broadcast on September 26, 1972 on ABC Movie of the Week. It stars David Janssen, Barbara Rush, Geoffrey Lewis and Bradford Dillman, with a script by Alvin Sapinsley (based on Leslie H. Whitten's novel of the same name). The film was directed by Daniel Petrie and filmed on location in Burnside, Louisiana. All of the downtown footage was from Clinton, Louisiana.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:08):
Welcome to Castle of Horror, the show dedicated to horror
movies and awesomeness. We are a feat Spot top one
hundred horror podcast. This week we have a look at
the nineteen seventy two TV film Moon of the Wolf.
This is episode four hundred and sixty four. Bear in
mind if you haven't seen today's movie, we're going to
be talking about it from the perspective of horror fans

(00:28):
who have seen it. So warning. Spoiler's ed. From Denver, Colorado,
I'm your host, Jason Henderson, publisher at Castlebridge Media, home
of the Castle of Horror anthology. With me from Austin
is Tony Subaggio, lead singer and bassis of the band
Deserts of Mars and lead guitarist of the band Rise
from Fires. Hello, Tony, Howdy Howdy. Also in Austin. Mister
Drew Edwards, freshly back from Comic Con, is the writer

(00:50):
creator of the long running underground comic Halloween Man, which
you can find at Global Comics. He is a Best
Writer Ringo nominee, Austin Chronicle Best of Austin Award winner
and member of the Pen American Fellowship. Say Hello, Drew.

Speaker 2 (01:03):
The notorious, Drew Edwards.

Speaker 3 (01:06):
Yes, indeed, I will just I will from henceforth to
declare that everybody should just announce me as notorious. Because
Julia was correcting me before we started recording that notoriety
and fame were not the same thing, and I was saying,
I kept saying notoriety, and so I will, I will henceforth.

(01:27):
I decided, if I'm not going to be famous, I'll
be infamous. So there you go, or notorious notorious.

Speaker 1 (01:37):
Yes, my, my, My favorite quotation from Doctor Doom is
always in this one where he goes android. Would you
please play back that last soliloquy of mine? I found
it particularly inspiring and like I love this character like
that that is that is wonderful.

Speaker 2 (01:57):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (01:58):
And finally, also in Denver, commentary from Julia Gusmond of
Gasmond Immigration of Denver, Chair of the American Immigration Lawyers
Association of Colorado.

Speaker 4 (02:07):
Oh yeah, say hello, I knew she was pregnant. I
was third in my class.

Speaker 1 (02:12):
What a strange line. My goodness, this is this is
a movie made up entirely of character actors. It's the
weirdest thing. And like it's when the when the most,
the least character. Actory character actor is David Jansen, because
at least he was the lead of the Sorry of
the Fugitive all right. Moon of the Wolf is an

(02:34):
American TV movie broadcast on September twenty sixth, nineteen seventy
two as an ABC Movie of the Week. It stars
David Jansen, Barbara Rush of Peyton Place, Jeffrey Lewis of
Salem's Lot, Bradford Dillman. I was what was the He
did a Dark Shadows remake for Aaron Spelling. And it's

(02:54):
based on a book by Leslie H. Whitten, which I
have ordered from my library because I want to read
this book because it's it's Southern Gothic.

Speaker 2 (03:01):
The film is.

Speaker 3 (03:02):
I am fascinated that although it makes perfect sense for
you that you think of her as from Peyton Place,
and yet for me she is from it came from
outer space.

Speaker 1 (03:14):
Oh my goodness. All right, Well, I haven't seen it
came from outer space since the eighties, so I guess.

Speaker 2 (03:20):
We may we may have to do an episode on
it just for.

Speaker 1 (03:23):
That, you know it. Yeah, A lot of this film,
this movie was made in Burnside, Louisiana and the downtown
of Clinton, Louisiana, and so it's a it's a very
very much location heavy film in Louisiana. The sweat on
these actors is real, and I mean I think it
lends something to the performances. I'm not even being sarcastic.

(03:45):
I mean, seriously, there's something heavy about this. So all right,
let's get her opening thoughts Drew, Julia Tony, and then
off we will go. Drew lay it on me, Moon
of the You were the one who suggested this as
one of your suggestions.

Speaker 3 (03:59):
Yes, I have only seen this movie one time before.
I watched it on tub the other time before because
it was a movie I remember seeing pictures from in
Fangoria magazine when I was a kid. But surprise, surprise
to those of you who were only born this century,

(04:23):
all of pop culture didn't used to be available at
your fingertips, and sometimes movies were hard to find and
you had to wait to see them. But as a
werewolf movie aficionado, I was very very happy to find
finally be able to see it, and it is a

(04:44):
lot of fun. A friend of mine, another comic book
industry gentlemen, recently likened it to a check Culchak episode
minus Culchak, and I think that it is is a
very good description of it. I think it would be
very easy to imagine Carl kind of dropped into the

(05:08):
action of this movie.

Speaker 2 (05:11):
But I do love the the whole vibe of it. It.
It has a.

Speaker 3 (05:18):
Great Southern Gothic feel, and I do think a lot
of that is because it was actually shot in Louisiana.
You know, Tony and I were actually talking on our
group chat about how this has a very authentic, authentically
Southern feeling that I don't necessarily think you would have

(05:41):
in a modern movie. And in fact, you know, the
last Texas Chainsaw massacre movie that was made was filmed
in Bulgaria, So contrast this with that and you'll see.

Speaker 2 (05:52):
What I mean.

Speaker 3 (05:53):
This has an incredibly stellar cast, in considering the fact
that it's mostly character driven. It's you know, the werewolf
stuff because it is a TV movie, it's it's kind
of backloaded. You really don't get a lot of werewolf
action until the very end, and all of the werewolf

(06:14):
kill scenes kind of take place of off screen.

Speaker 2 (06:19):
What kind of sells.

Speaker 3 (06:20):
This movie is you get invested in the small town
politics of it all, which feel very very real, particularly
the class politics of it so I think this.

Speaker 2 (06:35):
Movie is a lot of fun.

Speaker 3 (06:36):
And I think if you are a fan of watching
old TV movies, which I know everybody on this podcast is,
and a lot of the people who listen to this
podcast are fans of that as well, I think you'll
get a lot of enjoyment out of it.

Speaker 1 (06:52):
Wonderful. Thank you so much, Julia. I don't know if
you're as huge a TV movie fan, although I we
certainly watch a lot of them because I drag you
into it, unless of not being fair, But what are
your what are your thoughts?

Speaker 4 (07:06):
No, I definitely have some all time favorite movies that
were TV movies, like Fatal Vision. Do you remember I
loved them?

Speaker 1 (07:14):
Oh?

Speaker 4 (07:14):
Absolutely, yeah, Yeah, There's there's so many actually, But anyway,
this was Yeah, this was an ABC wide World of
Mystery UH series movie, and it came out the week
before I turned three years old. So I did not
see it when it came out. You don't know, Yeah,

(07:34):
knowing my dad, I might have very well been sitting
on his lap watching it. So and then the other
thing I was going to say about it is that, yeah,
that the mansion, the plantation house that it's filmed at,
it's called the Humus Plantation House. And it was also
in Hush Hush, Sweet, Hush Hush, Sweet Charlotte and Fletcher.

Speaker 1 (07:53):
Which we did an episode on.

Speaker 4 (07:54):
We did not Fletch List, though we haven't done that one.
I do you like fleshlift Let's it's interesting. I think
it is, you know, as long as you know it's
TV movie going in, so your expectations aren't, you know,
like you know, cinema level. It's a fun film. But
you know, I did find myself a lot trying to

(08:14):
figure out, you know, who's the werewolf? And I my
first guess was the right one, but then I did
go through a few others before we actually came around
to who it was. But the first, the first character
I guessed was the right guess, the right one. But
it was Yeah, it was fun. I mean, I think
I'm looking forward to talking about it because I kind
of feel like I haven't really thought through my opinions
on it yet, and I think they'll come out as

(08:35):
we as we started talking.

Speaker 1 (08:37):
Wonderful. Okay, thank you very much, Tony. What do you got?

Speaker 5 (08:41):
Yeah, I hadn't seen this before, but spotting all of
the character actors in it and there's just a bunch
kind of diving back into that realm where a lot
of these actors and you know, actresses would appear in
various TV movies. I just that was great. I thought,
I'm yeah, I want to talk more about it. But
there was a time period that just where they did

(09:03):
more on location, and I guess it was probably pretty
inexpensive to shoot in Louisiana, you know, and I there's
something really it felt really authentic, it felt really lived in.
You know, I've passed through the area. I've lived close
to the area for a long you know, large parts
of my life. And you know, there's kind of a
blend that's there's like a gradation of East Texas into

(09:23):
Louisiana and then back into Mississippi. There's kind of the
borders of all that into Louisiana also kind of have
the same similar feel and the politics are very similar
that it's the Deep South.

Speaker 1 (09:34):
You could.

Speaker 5 (09:34):
I was saying also, like it's a little bit intense,
and I didn't want to watch another intense movie, but
I would. I would pair this up with maybe Southern Comfort, uh,
you know, which is also you know, really good film
as far as flavor and vibe. But yeah, I in
fact that you know, I kept the more we were
talking about it. I also I wonder, you know, you
could just as easily make a Dark Shadows, a deep southern,

(09:58):
deep Southern Gothic Dark Shadows, uh, you know, soap opera
out of this town or a town similar to it,
and I.

Speaker 1 (10:05):
Would watch that.

Speaker 5 (10:07):
Yes, I think the closest we had we got is
like what True Blood, right, like that in Louisiana. But
this has such a different flavor. And I also want
to talk about that because and you're describing.

Speaker 1 (10:18):
In the heat of the night with werewolves really.

Speaker 5 (10:20):
Yeah, sort of yeah, but like you know, supernatural, Like
if you did it like Dark Shadows, it would be all.

Speaker 1 (10:26):
Kinds of supernatural.

Speaker 5 (10:27):
Yes, and yes, I would totally watch that.

Speaker 1 (10:30):
That would be good.

Speaker 5 (10:30):
But I I enjoyed this movie. But I found myself
really the cultural aspects of it all and all of
the again, the class system that's here and how the
relationships are, like you know, from from the doctor who's
kind of too good to be there but he stuck there,

(10:51):
to just the you know, the people living in the
swamp and then there's people living in town, and then
the all that class system. Stuff is just perfect, and
I want to talk more about that as we go along.
But I really enjoyed this for a lot of reasons. Yes,
it's a lower budget affair by nature, but you know,
I'd stack it against a lot, like there's a lot

(11:13):
worse movies than to spend your time on. And I
was kind of drawn into it. And the mystery is cool,
like Julia said, like I wonder like like the fact
that was you know ABC mystery movie. That's pretty good
and somebody took a chance instead of doing like a
traditional mystery. They're like, Okay, so this this week's mystery
movie is were Wolf. Yeah, pretty cool. I gotta say.

Speaker 1 (11:33):
We were talking to John Logan a couple of weeks ago,
a couple of episodes ago, and I said something about
Royal Dano Like, what's that Royal Dano were wolf movie?
He goes, you mean Moon of the Wolf.

Speaker 5 (11:44):
Like, yeah, this is just so many good actors.

Speaker 1 (11:50):
Yeah, you know, I want to go straight into the topics,
but the only thing I'll say is that this is
this is a really well made film, and you raised
a really interesting issue, like there's a TV budget, right,
but if you're making a TV movie at least in
nineteen seventy two. If you're making a TV movie and
you know what your limitations are, you can film around

(12:12):
it so that you wind up with something that looks
like a movie. You know, that looks basically like you
know it because it's a procedural and a lot of
it is the sheriff trying to solve this mystery. You
don't have to go crazy, you know. The toughest thing
they're going to deal with is, of course the werewolf effects.
But other than that, you know, it's you know, there

(12:33):
are some really great like Salem's Lot, of course, was
a TV film, you know, and yeah, I thought this
was fantastic. Okay, the first thing I'd like to get
into I want to talk about the cast, but I
think first we should talk about Southern Gothic and the
world of this film. So for the listener, if you
want to see a Moon of the Wolf, it is

(12:53):
free lots of services, so you can see it on TV.
If you have a subscription to YouTube like just You
two Premium, then you can watch it on YouTube and
there's no ads, or you can watch it on two
B it has ads. But the point is there's lots
of places where you can see this movie.

Speaker 5 (13:07):
Did you watch it on YouTube or TV?

Speaker 1 (13:10):
I saw it on YouTube?

Speaker 5 (13:11):
Yeah, oh boy boy? Is it macro blocked it? It
doesn't look good at close to the end on TV.

Speaker 1 (13:17):
The one that I saw it didn't look that bad.
But but there might be also multiple versions of it uploaded,
so who knows. No.

Speaker 2 (13:26):
On t B.

Speaker 5 (13:27):
On t B, the print was, I don't think it's
my it was my connection. It was no, I'm sure
you're rough. I mean, it's still look good, but like
that's why I was curious.

Speaker 1 (13:39):
You might have bet on YouTube. Yeah, but all right,
so the Southern Gothic thing as a concept, and we
don't actually get a lot of Southern Gothic stories anymore.
And Drew pointed out this movie really takes advantage of
shooting in a southern count But the whole Southern Gothic
thing is you're living in a world that is It's

(13:59):
like the lumpiness of the of the atmosphere is pulling
the world apart. So everything's old, everything is sweaty, every
and and the the things that define it are usually
family secrets, family shame, uh, severe gradations in the community,

(14:20):
like Tony, you were pointing out all the different layers,
like all the layers, because you got the rich guy
who lives with his rich sister in the plantation, and
then you've got you know, middle class people and like
the doctor, and then you've got civil servants like the sheriff,
and then you've got like hillbillies, you know, in in

(14:40):
the in the swamp, you got swamp people and they
all know one another, and they all move amongst one another,
and it's just interesting watching. Like I would say, Tony
that we know what those gradations are. The movie shows
them without even bothering bothering to explain them generally, you know,
because it's just part of the atmosphere.

Speaker 2 (15:00):
Uh.

Speaker 5 (15:00):
You know Quaudia McNeil, who plays what's her Sarah, Like
you know she's lives adjacent and you know she talks
about like, you know, my grandfather worked for your you know,
like's and you know they're with the hill abilities. But
like how that all plays out, how race relations work

(15:22):
and everything, like every there's all this well there and
because I don't.

Speaker 3 (15:28):
Because this is Louisiana, there's there's another cultural layer because
they they call the area and the swamp where all
the poor people live french Town because that's where all
exactly Cajun people live. And you know that's while you know,

(15:48):
I grew up in Texas, not Louisiana. You know, there
definitely was cultural and class divides like that.

Speaker 5 (15:55):
And well the further you go to East Texas, the
more you get that absolutely absolutely.

Speaker 2 (16:02):
And.

Speaker 3 (16:04):
The the you know, the the other thing that I
think is interesting about setting this in in this particular
because with were wolves, you know, in the rural South,
in this particular region of the United States, like there
is you know, I almost wish that the movie could

(16:24):
have spent a little bit more time on it. But
there's very specific were wolf mythology of the rugaroo, which
is like a swamp were wolf or a sugarcane were wolf.

Speaker 5 (16:35):
And not to be confused with the rugaroo with an X,
which is when you had flour and butter and make
a creamier are no talking about rude?

Speaker 2 (16:47):
I got, I understood what you were saying.

Speaker 3 (16:50):
It was anyway, well, you know, the the you know,
they they don't deal with it too much. I mean,
they have the bit about sulfur in the movie, which is,
you know, again it's very specific to this particular type
of were wolf mythology, which is like something that was

(17:12):
imported from from both you know, you have thelu Guru,
which is you know, imported from from France. And then
of course there were were German immigrants who brought their
own werewolf mythology and this all met in you know,
Louisiana and Mississippi in East Texas and became this own

(17:32):
specific you know, I hate to say.

Speaker 2 (17:35):
This, but American were wolf And I lied. I didn't
hate saying that at all.

Speaker 3 (17:43):
And you know, it's it's not something we see represented
in pop culture, but it still has a lot of
you know, in in you know, folklore today and there's
even in in I forget the town in Louisiana, but
there's even particular town in Louisiana and Louisiana that every
October has a rugaroo festival.

Speaker 2 (18:06):
So what would you call.

Speaker 4 (18:08):
An American werewolf in Paris?

Speaker 2 (18:10):
Uh?

Speaker 1 (18:11):
I don't know what I mean, what's what?

Speaker 2 (18:13):
Uh? What would I call it?

Speaker 4 (18:15):
Would it be a rugaroo or or garoo?

Speaker 3 (18:20):
Or I think I think that it's just a werewolf
at that point?

Speaker 2 (18:28):
What what? Wow? Now my ice a crusted.

Speaker 3 (18:33):
I but you know, the context of the Southern gothic thing.
I think that added layer of sort of folk horror
kind of adds to this.

Speaker 2 (18:47):
Well.

Speaker 5 (18:47):
Also you have the guy who's you know, in his deathbed,
who's has the gap, and they just that's just part
of like everybody's you know, if you if you're around
enough people and especially uh you know, the lower class,
you go or somebody will be like, oh, yeah, well
you have an aunt who has the gift, or I
have a my grandfather would say, you know, like the

(19:08):
tales that add to that folk horror. That's part of this.
He knows things that other people don't. They're like he
just knows, like what do you mean? And the share
kind of doesn't want to believe it, but also he
knows like yeah, I've dealt with that, you know, like
how that all those interactions are really great and adds
so the really grounds it in that Deep South folk
horror tradition and that I think that stuff is awesome too.

Speaker 1 (19:32):
The it's I want to read this book because it
just strikes me has it's so neat that they decided
to set it here, because it just it's such a
cliche to say that the setting is almost a character.
But just think about it if you had set this
in like downtown Toronto or something, you know, and so
you got these I don't know, you've got the rich

(19:55):
couple and a bunch of people of rich siblings and
a bunch of people who are not rich. It just
wouldn't have the flavor that it does, you know. And
same thing if you had put it in the French
Quarter instead, you know, being in these backwards and in
these you know, if you look at the house, the
buildings outside, the old man, you know his where he's convalescing,
those buildings are falling down, and it's amazing looking, you know,

(20:17):
it really real place.

Speaker 3 (20:19):
I also think the relationships in this, you know, follow
that certain Southern Gothic tradition and it adds because like, really,
if you were to just do this as a random
werewolf movie, it would feel quite generic.

Speaker 2 (20:39):
So what you're saying about.

Speaker 3 (20:41):
The the place making it giving it character.

Speaker 2 (20:47):
Like I really love.

Speaker 3 (20:49):
I talked about this with Tony before we started recording,
but one of the things I love most in this
movie is when the cop, the sheriff, the sheriff, yeah,
goes the visit the the you know, the rich, the
rich gentleman and the Southern gentleman and his sister and

(21:09):
in in you know, their home, and the sister reveals
that she used to have a crush on on the
sheriff when they were in junior high. And then he said, oh, well,
I had a crush on you too, And then after
she goes back in the si back inside, in the
most genteel Southern way possible, he says, essentially, no, I

(21:31):
am not letting my sister, who is from a good family,
data policeman, and that that is so, you know, that
sort of upper crusty southernness, like, oh no, you have
to be with somebody from a good family. Yeah, you know,
it doesn't matter that you're the top cop of this town.

Speaker 2 (21:52):
Like that's not good enough. You could see you.

Speaker 4 (21:58):
Could see the disdain on his face immediately. At first
I didn't know there was there were I didn't know
they were siblings. I was like, is this her husband,
and she's just like flirting in front of him, and
I was like, oh no, it's the brother.

Speaker 1 (22:10):
He just really is disgusted by the idea.

Speaker 2 (22:12):
You're the help. You're the help. My sister is not
going to date the help.

Speaker 3 (22:16):
And that still goes on, like if you were to
be if you were to go to a small southern
town right now, that pattern of behavior still exists, and
there's this very polite way of telling someone to fuck
off without actually saying fuck off, and that actor nails

(22:38):
it like it's it's so let's talk.

Speaker 4 (22:40):
About Yeah that is it's the Blessed, It's the Blessed,
bless his heart.

Speaker 5 (22:46):
Yeah, Yeah, there's so much really great dialogue that this
is something I'm you know, sorry to know on this
a little bit longer, Jason, But I don't know. I mean,
we're we're what fifty years out from this is the.

Speaker 1 (23:02):
Seventies, Yeah, this nineteen seventy two.

Speaker 5 (23:05):
So yeah, so we're we're you know, but it's it's
more rare now in my opinion, that you see that
you have dialogue that's written. And I don't know if
it's just people like maybe the writer knew either ay
either the really good writers, or they knew the area
in a way, you know, like they knew how to
build this. And I don't know if it's just you

(23:27):
get a bunch of people who aren't as familiar and
maybe don't know, like it's like if you tried to
ape Stephen King, you're gonna have a hard time unless
you kind of know that. But I was really struck
by all of those layers that Drew's been talking about.
But also there there was a lot there's there was
a lot more of this in the seventies and into
the eighties. And even though it's done kind of hamp bistedly,

(23:51):
like there's a even if you go with like the
dukes of Hazard Route, there's still like a touch of
the flavor that's still.

Speaker 2 (23:57):
There, you know that.

Speaker 5 (23:59):
I mean, it's hazard, but it's still had. There's there's
stuff there that that touches in the Deep South in
a way that I think modern stuff that I've seen
is kind of set in Louisiana or around there doesn't
feel as authentic. And I'm really, I still really curious
what that is, Like, is it familiarity that was there before?
Is it just you know, being steeped in that, Like

(24:20):
I'm unsure, But all the dialogue that takes place in
the and the layers that are there really work, And
then you know, I and I really like actually their
interaction was just really charming. That's why I thought about
the soap opera aspect. Yes, you know, they're kind of
going back and forth, and oh, you know, I wish
I would have known that you had a crush. But
now that there's there's a lot there, like, I think

(24:42):
that elevates it beyond kind of like there's a bunch
that's not when you when you say.

Speaker 2 (24:46):
Oh, movie of the week.

Speaker 1 (24:47):
Yes, I think.

Speaker 5 (24:49):
There's a there's a lot of it's multi layered in
a way that you wouldn't expect when you when you
hear movie of the week as a as a term
for this.

Speaker 1 (24:56):
Okay, I agree with that. I mean, you're right because
a lot of times it will be sort of generic
because it's just taking place in and around, in and
around a city like Los Angeles or what have you.
Whereas this, yes, this knows a lot about that world.
And by the way, to answer your question about you know,
how familiar is the writer? So I don't know much
about Leslie H. Whitten. He's the one who wrote the book.

(25:18):
But the director is Daniel Petrie. Now he is not
part of this world at all. He was a Canadian
and he came to the United States and taught at
Northwestern and directed Raisin in the Sun, which by the way,
starred Claudia McNeil, so he brings her over from having
directed Raisin the Sun, which I think is awesome.

Speaker 5 (25:36):
I mean that might be part of the foundation for it,
right because.

Speaker 1 (25:39):
It's, yeah, he's aware of how to play all these
characters from different parts of life off of one another.
For sure. I think we can linger on all of
that because I want to talk about some of these
actors in particular, because we'll get to Bradford Dillman, but
David Jansen. I wish I understood how people thought about

(26:02):
David Jansen, because David Jansen is the star of this movie,
and he's the one with the romantic storyline, and he's
the one who's investigating, and yet with the hair that
he has and the sideburns and the paunch and the
slumping and the grumbling, I'm always liked, did anybody go
David Janssen sex god like that? It was there was?

(26:22):
You know, have things changed so much since the seventies
that back then David Jansen was a heart throb or
was always just a character actor that people just that
was beloved of people, You know what I mean?

Speaker 4 (26:33):
Both things can be true because there's plenty of character
actors that a lot of people find really attractive. Like
there's a lot of movies where Yeah, I mean, I
was telling I was joking when we were leaving we
went to see Weapons last night. I was joking seeing
all the posters that Pedro Pascal is on and by
the way, he was meant to be in Weapons also,
But I was joking that it's like that Jonathan episode

(26:58):
of Buffy where the reality he has shifted to the
Jonathan's the center of the universe, and I'm like, it's
Pedro Pascal. Pedro Pascal is not traditionally just hot, but
he's very sexy because of how he is, you know,
so he's become this heart. But if you were to
look at a picture of Pedro Pascal and a picture
of Chris Almans and Chris Hemsworth, you'd be like, Okay,

(27:18):
I get those two, but that guy really like how
he was like the center of.

Speaker 2 (27:22):
The universe in twenty twenty five.

Speaker 4 (27:25):
So, I mean, I feel like that's kind of what
it is.

Speaker 3 (27:27):
I don't Jamie thinks he's he's really hot, so I
I'll have to ask about it.

Speaker 4 (27:33):
Yeah, everybody thinks he's hot, but I don't think that
if you just looked at a picture of him.

Speaker 3 (27:38):
I mean, I think he's better looking than I think
he's better looking than me, but that doesn't say anything.

Speaker 2 (27:42):
He's also a movie star.

Speaker 4 (27:44):
I will I will not comment on this.

Speaker 2 (27:46):
I'm just saying that I'm not asking you too. That
would be.

Speaker 4 (27:49):
Awkward, Pascal for coming next to like the traditional you know,
just like hot guy.

Speaker 1 (27:57):
I don't know that you would recognize.

Speaker 3 (27:59):
And the super in the sphere of superhero movies. I
will say this, it does help that he is playing
a character that's his biggest muscle is his brain, like
he's not supposed to be He's not supposed to be
thor I think Jami actually just.

Speaker 2 (28:20):
Walked Jimmy actually, Jimmy actually just walked in here, hold
on here. Never mind.

Speaker 1 (28:25):
Then, I don't necessarily want us to go off on
a pedro Pascal hunt. I'm curious about David Janssen.

Speaker 5 (28:33):
So Jason, I think to your point, though, I think
that also in this era, the heart robby kind of actors,
or the actors who were considered attractive, I think they
did also skew older. When you think of TV like
look at look at what's out right? Like you're like
heart heart and you know whatever, like you name it.

(28:55):
There's a bunch of older actors and acts.

Speaker 1 (28:57):
That's a good point because Darren McGavin also is kind
of a krusty you know.

Speaker 5 (29:01):
Yeah, but like I just I just pulled one.

Speaker 3 (29:04):
Out, like hold hold the phone, like whatever you think
about this Sky Jason, he's better looking than Darren McGavin.

Speaker 1 (29:12):
I love David Jensen, don't get me wrong. And I
loved The Fugitive by the way, David Jensen not for nothing,
forty one years old in this movie forty one or
that one.

Speaker 5 (29:23):
You're more so at the same time, you have like
so you have like the other end of the spectrum,
be like hardy boys, right. Yeah, But I would say
that in general during this time period, you do have
a lot of older actors who are considered the heart
props and less and you and it's kind of like,
now we kind of reached this like oh, well, you

(29:44):
got to have hot person of a certain age with
a certain look. And I also that that well hold up.
I think also that gets typecast because you have the
other thing where you have oh, it's a CW cast, right,
and that became like the movies like oh, it's like
looks like c W. Right, Yeah, young attractive people.

Speaker 2 (30:02):
Well, I mean think about the Fog remake where.

Speaker 1 (30:06):
We had yes, exactly exact guy from.

Speaker 3 (30:10):
From Smallville playing right like, but I mean, of course
that's now twenty something.

Speaker 1 (30:16):
But they took you're right because the original The Fog
has all the character actors in it and did not.

Speaker 2 (30:22):
Yeah, but like.

Speaker 3 (30:25):
My point about this guy is that he is good
looking in a way that he would be considered good
looking in a small town, right, but he is also
believably a sheriff, Like he looks like he could do
the job, which, to Tony's point, I do think they
used to care a lot more about that authen like

(30:48):
you can believe that this this attractive you know, well
to do woman is attracted to him because he's handsome
and charismatic enough. Yes, you know, like I never once
questioned that she she has a thing for.

Speaker 2 (31:04):
Him, mamily. I mean he's like yeah, yeah.

Speaker 5 (31:07):
Yeah, and that you know again when we are introduced
to them, they have a history, yes, so that and
that makes a lot of sense.

Speaker 2 (31:14):
But I also, like Julia just hit something on the head.

Speaker 3 (31:17):
Manliness is its own kind of attractiveness, Like, like it's
not you know, like it's why we say certain people
look rugged, you know, like that's not you know, like
like Clint.

Speaker 4 (31:30):
Eastwood, why there's fireman calendars? You know, yeah, well just
and they go, yes, please, And it doesn't matter what
the guy looks like.

Speaker 2 (31:38):
He's fireball.

Speaker 3 (31:39):
And I mean even in in gay culture, you know,
which is generally more physically fit than than heteros. The
uh you know you have bear you know, which are
big burly dudes, and so like, you know, like it's
it's it's not as improbable as you think it is.

Speaker 2 (32:00):
Jason, I don't.

Speaker 1 (32:01):
Think it's improbable. I asked the question more to sort
of take a look at at sort of how things
have changed. I feel like there was room for David Jansen,
a forty one year old guy who looks about fifty eight,
to be the star of and romantic lead of this movie.

(32:21):
And thank god for the rest of us poor well.

Speaker 3 (32:24):
You know he I think you're doing him at disservice.
I don't think he looks fifty eight, but.

Speaker 2 (32:31):
You know, I.

Speaker 1 (32:34):
Well, look fifty, look fifty. Something is different now from
what it was in nineteen seventy.

Speaker 2 (32:39):
That is true. That is true because he.

Speaker 1 (32:41):
Can get his hair different into you know, blah blah blah.

Speaker 3 (32:44):
But he would look also look less like a small
town cop if he for sure.

Speaker 1 (32:48):
Oh yeah, well that's that's exactly the fog problem is
once you get rid of the lived in sorts of actors,
then it feels more like like a CW show would have.

Speaker 3 (33:00):
You would have a scene, you would have the obliglatory
scene where he shows off his Jim jim perfectly sculpted
apps and you know, like.

Speaker 1 (33:10):
But only one guy.

Speaker 5 (33:12):
Yeah, there's there's a big difference though, too. Like Rain
was watching some man I can't remember the name of it,
but it's a you know, thriller mystery soap opera show,
and you know, all the guys have like a generic
facial hair and very are very chiseled, and they're the
bad guys and they're the cops, and they're like, all
these guys look really similar and you know, and by

(33:37):
the standards today, they're all attractive guys, right and and
they but I'll be damned if I know who like,
I'll pass by and watch it. I don't know, like
they don't have the real Another reason why we keep
saying lived in is they everybody looks everybody looks like
the character, and that's part of like, hey, let's hire
a bunch of good actors who also happen to be

(33:57):
character actors. We're gonna put him in this thing. And
I think, yeah, I think if you you, I think
you hit on the head with the difference between original
fog and the new fog. Like that, we tend to
get more of what the new fog looks like in
in conventional cinema as it is now conventional.

Speaker 2 (34:15):
Yeah, I mean I also.

Speaker 5 (34:18):
Think it's the same, right.

Speaker 2 (34:20):
I think there's.

Speaker 3 (34:20):
Also a homogeny of what you're supposed to think is attractive.
Now you know, you're you're only allowed one or two types.

Speaker 1 (34:34):
Interesting.

Speaker 2 (34:35):
Yeah, but Barbara.

Speaker 3 (34:38):
Rush, getting this into the direction that Jason wants to go,
is the most movie star looking person in this movie.
She's she's stunning, she's on her clothes. But yeah, continued,
she works because of where her social standing is, like
she should be a little bit more glamorous because she's

(35:01):
supposed to be well off.

Speaker 2 (35:03):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (35:03):
Yeah, what Jason was saying, I did feel like all
of the clothes and I don't know if it's just
the clothes of that time, they all look like somebody
made them out of one of those patterns that you
could get at the you know, at the local fabric store.

Speaker 5 (35:18):
Yeah, I mean I do think. I think that that's
probably pretty close from I mean, yeah, that is the
disservice of the Stephanie. There's a lot of fashions like, oh,
why is everything drapes right?

Speaker 2 (35:33):
Her hair is? Her hair is amazing?

Speaker 1 (35:35):
Though.

Speaker 4 (35:36):
Oh yeah, yeah, she's beautiful.

Speaker 5 (35:39):
She's supposed to be because she's you know, her standing
is head and shoulders above pretty much everybody else in
the movie.

Speaker 3 (35:48):
And I also really like that this is a romance
that is, first of all played very sweet and almost yeah,
and it's between two people in their forties, which I
don't think you would see now.

Speaker 1 (36:06):
Isn't that great? I mean it is. It's it's it's
kind of cool. Well, I mean I say this as
an older person, you know, but it is. It's it's
cool to see them sort of fumbling their way through
this this romance. They're sweet, her in her pants suits,
it's it's it's really neat. Bradford Dilman, who plays the douchebag,
who says, well, you don't suppose that my sister was

(36:28):
seriously flirting with you. Blah blah blah. That guy plays
a douchebag in every single thing I've ever seen him in.
I I it's like it's on his punchable face that
like some some casting director said, yep, get me a
Bradford Dillman.

Speaker 5 (36:45):
I always wonder. I'm sure there's a bunch of people
who are just great people, but there's certain actors who
always play that. Yes, I kind of you start you
do start to wonder, like are you how close?

Speaker 1 (36:57):
Is that sucks?

Speaker 5 (36:59):
I because you know, I there's there's several people who
just like when you ever see him, you're like, oh,
they're gonna play the guy you just want to hate.

Speaker 1 (37:06):
Yeah, and they never they.

Speaker 5 (37:08):
Seem to get a lot of work there. But then
I wonder, like, how long can you were they that person?
And how long can you be that character in all
these movies and not have it rub like at least
a little bit. I'm always curious about you.

Speaker 2 (37:22):
Know, he probably was a great guy, like I.

Speaker 6 (37:25):
Always assume, But then, like you know, it's it's always
it's always strange when you have a character character actor
who's like very specific, like.

Speaker 5 (37:35):
It's not like villain villain, but like a really like, oh,
that guy just gets he's it might be his general
upper crusty southernness in this movie.

Speaker 2 (37:47):
I would describe this guy as a cat.

Speaker 1 (37:51):
That is, that is delightfully punishable. He uh. In real life,
so he had two marriages, one from fifty six to
sixty two, and then he married again in sixty three
and remained married until two thousand and three when his
wife died. So so I don't know, you know, somebody
could stand him for a long time. Probably this is
acting and he's like, you know, but boy, he's good

(38:14):
at playing a smug asshole.

Speaker 2 (38:17):
Yeah, I mean, in fairness, he's the title character.

Speaker 3 (38:20):
Yes, which I know that this is supposed to be
a mystery. Yeah, but not once did I think anybody
else was the werewolf the first time I saw this,
like I knew.

Speaker 4 (38:34):
Well, I was hoping, Yeah, he seemed obvious, But then
I was hoping that he was too obvious, Like I
was like, maybe it's that turns out to be the sister,
or maybe it turns out it's actually the sheriff, or
maybe it turns out it's actually the doctor. You know,
because it seemed too obvious.

Speaker 3 (38:48):
For it's it wasn't, because this is a Southern Gothic
it had to be somebody that was rich like that
could have been the sister if they wanted to be
even you know, something more tragic, but it was going
to be somebody. And indeed, like when we when we
learned the origin of the lycanthropy, it's it's something that's

(39:12):
apparently passed down through the family line, so like it's
it's you know, it's it's almost as if there were
wolf ism and their their affluence are kind of tied together,
and they're they're literally feeding on the poor, which is
probably it's it's probably you know that that's probably more

(39:37):
of a high falutin idea than anybody involved with this
was thinking. But you know, I mean it is it
works very well within the Southern Gothic framework.

Speaker 5 (39:49):
I mean, if it was you know, close, and that
would be close to reality. In fact, the closest reality
would be if somebody else knew, the doctor or a
judge or somebody. Yeah, we know that they're we know
that they're rich, and they are also wear wolves, but
they only kind of eat the poor, so we kind
of let them like that. That would definitely happen, no

(40:12):
doubt about in my mind that if if it came
out like yeah, but they gotta let him eat the
poor because like that that absolutely, hands down, there would
be some people who knew and just look the other
way that I'm convinced.

Speaker 3 (40:27):
The Jeffrey Lewis character is definitely set up as like
a red herring, like right down to the fact that
his name is Lawrence y you know, and.

Speaker 1 (40:37):
And lewis playing the same part that he plays in
Salem's Lot more or less.

Speaker 3 (40:44):
And he's even left handed, which is a bit of
where wolf folklore, because where wolves, people who are left
handed were thought to be where wolves.

Speaker 1 (40:55):
So you know that's really they're they're stress this family.

Speaker 2 (41:00):
Yeah, well, you know the.

Speaker 1 (41:04):
Jeffrey Lewis, let's linger on him for just a moment,
because he's another just ultra reliable. Look, David Jansen's a star. Okay,
he's not a character actor. He's he was the lead
of a bunch of TV shows, including The Fugitive. But
Jeffrey Lewis is a character actor. Tried and true. He
he and when I was a kid, he was everywhere

(41:25):
like he just yeah, he's on so many movies and
he's wonderful. I have no idea what he was like
as a person, you know, which is true of several
of these people, because I feel the same way about
Royal Dan, and I've got no idea like but Jeffrey
Lewis is so good at playing these sort of rough
around the edges, although not typically malevolent characters, you know,

(41:46):
And and like I guess Juliet Lewis could tell us
what he was like. But yeah, it's so good seeing him, and.

Speaker 3 (41:54):
Yeah, well he he has a very very very interesting
look about him that could imply malevolence, which is why
he makes such a striking vampire in Salem's Lot, and
so you can kind of believe that he's a were wolf.

(42:14):
But I again, I never would have suspected him because
I just you just know, it's not going to be
one of the poor people.

Speaker 2 (42:20):
You know.

Speaker 1 (42:22):
That did not even occur to me. But I guess
you're right that that I didn't really suspect him of
being a were wolf. I knew it was gonna You're
exactly right. I didn't even think about it. You're articulating
something that was going on without my actually thinking it aloud,
which there was no way it was going to be
anybody but essentially part of the upper crust.

Speaker 4 (42:41):
Or I was hoping it would be the doctor maybe
because I thought that would have been fun.

Speaker 1 (42:45):
That guy's from General Hospital, by the way, and doctor
doctor werewolf EMPD Yes.

Speaker 4 (42:50):
Doctor doctor third in my class, m d. Doctor knocked
out the dead woman.

Speaker 3 (42:57):
Yeah, that doctor third in your class is not the
flex you think it is.

Speaker 1 (43:03):
What an amazing guy. That was where I thought this
script is a little funny because this actor saying these
lines like I couldn't stay away from this young woman.
Then I gave her a bubble too of a musicer
like it that I like this guy being here. There's
something funny and counterintuitive about it.

Speaker 2 (43:22):
But who starts their life over at fifty?

Speaker 5 (43:26):
Yeah, well I think he's also like I like that
once because he's trying to just, you know, I gotta
do my doctor thing. And then the more he talks,
the more you realize this is a man trapped in
a place he did not see himself being trapped in, yes,
and he just kind of well, I'm stuck in you know,
b F Louisiana, and that's my lot in life. And

(43:49):
that's why eventually he comes to this lee. They can't
start over in the city at fifty. Nobody's you know,
but his life the.

Speaker 1 (43:57):
Word fifty by the way, because well I think he
left behind a few years ago.

Speaker 5 (44:03):
Well but but you know, his whole thing is I'm
stuck with these rubes.

Speaker 1 (44:09):
Yeah, but also I'm not.

Speaker 5 (44:10):
I'm not much better, but I have my you know,
I feel like I am because I'm a doctor.

Speaker 1 (44:15):
Right, He's this giant fish in a little pond. And
if and that's kind of what he really means is
that he has station here.

Speaker 5 (44:21):
You know, if he but suck, it's a cage. It's
like it's a cage for him as well as you know, Hey,
he's the he gets respect in ways that he might
not elsewhere. Certainly not like you know, go to the
city is what he's talking about. Third year class as
a matter in the city, right, and probably if you're
starting over well yeah, but but you know, like so

(44:42):
he's he's comfortable. And that's part of why, you know,
why he's got the young girl and and all of
you know, all these all this stuff that's happening is
because he's definitely in a place he never envisioned himself.
And throughout the movie, it's just getting worse.

Speaker 1 (44:58):
Yeah, you know that that is a that is a
really cool character and it makes me want to read
this book even more. And as you're talking about it, Yeah,
this is a procedural so setting up these different, these
different you know, possible culprits. Right, because the Sarah, the nurse, says,
find out who made the girl pregnant. That's going to

(45:19):
be your your bad guy. And but David Jansen.

Speaker 4 (45:23):
Essentially why I wanted him to be the werewolf because
I wanted her to be right that he's the one
I knocked her up, so therefore he killed her.

Speaker 1 (45:29):
Right, But no, it was it wasn't that at all.

Speaker 5 (45:33):
And you know, also the the the other part of
the dynamic in this is when she's talking to the sheriff.
Because of the politics of the town, not the sheriff
has to listen because he knows he's got to be everywhere.
But she also knows that. The part of the reason
she hasn't said anything elsewhere is because she knows her
voice won't be heard. Yeah, the sheriff is the only

(45:53):
person by by default, even though he's like a nicer guy. Yeah,
you could play this a bunch of ways. You know,
he could be much worse, but you know he's there
to listen to everyone. Yeah, And so part of the
reasons she's cagey in the way that she is until
she's talking to him is because you know, in this
town she doesn't have any or doesn't have as much hand,

(46:15):
you know, because like it's certainly, certainly she's not the
one who can speak against the doctor.

Speaker 1 (46:22):
Right, that's right, and there's a there's a thing. So
you could present the sheriff in a lot of different ways,
because he could be an evil, corrupt sheriff, but in
this case, you have a good sheriff. And in a mystery,
typically and usually it's a pi. What what distinguishes the
hero in one of these stories is that they're kind
of an insider outsider. They're an insider that can move

(46:44):
through all They can move up and down, they can
go to the lowliest cabin, they can go to the
biggest house. They can kind of put up with people
being snied to them no matter what, you know. And
that's a cool character that you know, and it's true,
like everybody knows they can talk to this guy. Look,
he's he's investigating this murder and he's hanging out with
all the people who might be the culprit, like all

(47:07):
the way through which I which I find strange and
comforting really that that he's like, yeah, well, why don't
you come along? It's it's right, yeah.

Speaker 3 (47:16):
Well, and apparently this guy does know he's a were
wolf because he kept a gun fully loaded with silver
bullets in his home, so like he's he's really only
hanging out with the sheriff, either to find out how
much the sheriff knows or I don't know.

Speaker 2 (47:35):
Convenient meal, I don't know.

Speaker 4 (47:39):
The lord doesn't include silver bullets in this one. It's
blessed bullets because I don't think.

Speaker 2 (47:43):
Well she said blessed blessed silver bullets.

Speaker 4 (47:46):
Oh doesssed silver bullets?

Speaker 3 (47:50):
Okay, but burning or blessed silver bullets either. Either way,
he knows he's a were wolf. He's got he's got
he's got a gun loaded up with with the magic
bullets in the in the in his home.

Speaker 1 (48:04):
So yeah, in a sense, he's biding his time until
he finally reveals himself and and and gets himself killed
by his sister, which by the way, is also wonderfully
she she's great.

Speaker 2 (48:19):
In the last scene though, like is harrowing? Is that
all is yea for her?

Speaker 3 (48:26):
You know, like she's not exactly a shrinking violet like
she becomes you know, like she becomes basically the hero
and the last section of the movie, you know, like
she's taken care of taking care of business what.

Speaker 1 (48:45):
Barbara Stanwick wasn't available and and so you know we
have we have Barbara Barbara Russia. But that's exactly a
Standwarik kind of thing.

Speaker 3 (48:53):
She What's interesting to me is like the mixture of
like classic where we'll movie lore with like the the
you know, the Rugarou stuff, because like you have this
guy having a seizure because he smelled the sulfur. But
also you know, they mentioned the whole bit about you know,

(49:16):
him seeing a pentagram in the palm of his next victim,
which is is you know, a straight lift from the
wolf Man. You know, it's not it's not something from
Rugaru stuff. So like it's like sort of like mix
mix and match where wolf folks, which is fine, you know,

(49:37):
like it's it's okay, I'm not complaining. I just I
just find that they use like were wolf shorthand for
one thing, but then they'll introduce something completely you know,
specific to the setting, like the sulfur, and you know
that that's.

Speaker 2 (49:57):
Cool to me.

Speaker 3 (49:59):
She does try to burn her brother alive, which is
a lot dark like he he ends up getting shot,
which is a is a much nicer way to go that,
presumably even if you're a werewolf.

Speaker 5 (50:12):
Yeah, this is I do kind of like that, and
we kind of know we know why he's having the
seizure or we're pretty sure, but I do like the
in world story where it's also could just be like, well,
you know the rich are kind of weak bread like
there's a yeah, well, well there's there's always the like, yeah,

(50:35):
well the rich folks are kind of have their their problem.
Their blood problems are their face like like all the
kind of in breeding slash, you know, all the maladies
of the rich. It kind of makes sense to like, yeah,
it was always a sickly one, you know.

Speaker 3 (50:49):
Well, and he's even he's even saying that his sister
is sickly. You know, like yes, you half expect him
to go, well, I how to how to touch us
the vapor buzz right, right.

Speaker 2 (51:01):
But.

Speaker 5 (51:03):
Yeah, we we're okay with that given the you know,
royalty just sometimes as these maladies.

Speaker 1 (51:10):
Isn't that wild? Like once this world fantastic? Yeah, I
mean you accept it because you're in this Southern Gothic world.
Anytime there's these weeping willows around everywhere, suddenly it's you
can hear people talk about these sort of silly nineteenth
century ideas of medicine and everything, and you go, yeah, okay, sure,

(51:32):
because we've suspended all all scientific rules and we're we're
in weird Southern Gothic lands now.

Speaker 5 (51:39):
So yeah, I you know, I also like the werewolf,
and again they're smart. We only kind of see the
wholf and it's a very human looking werewolf. But I
also liked the jail break in yes it and I
guess you know so also I was thinking the closest
I think we've had to like a Precinct thirteen with

(52:00):
werewolves's probably dog soldiers, right. But I would also totally watch,
and I don't know if I've seen it, a oopster
happens to be a werewolf in prison. That that is
a movie I would also watch. That would be cool.

Speaker 1 (52:15):
Well, that sounds like alien in a prison.

Speaker 5 (52:17):
Yeah, but you could do a lot with that. But anyway,
I was like, I was it made you know, that
said all kinds of wheels in motion, Uh seeing that
because you know, we don't I guess, you know, I
guess the original world, you know Werewolf movies, he's he
hides in the in the jail to try to like, hey,
lock me in here. We have the opposite where he's
trying to cover up you know, the Werewolve's trying to

(52:38):
cover up his trail. Yeah, totally busting into the like
all that. That's that stuff was cool. It's you know,
strong as hell, like, yeah, that's and that's at the
point where they know, like this isn't just a murderer.
This this whatever is going on, can rip the whole
you know, doors off of a cell.

Speaker 1 (52:56):
All because none of them are strong enough to tear
out iron bars.

Speaker 5 (53:04):
I thought that was that was cool. That was unexpected
and interesting and made me think about a lot of
stuff that could be written then would be awesome. But
I think in here it's really solid. Plus they have
the you know, before this, they do have the like, yeah,
sleep it off kind of the almost Maybury.

Speaker 1 (53:24):
Like yes, yeah we know you're here, but.

Speaker 5 (53:26):
You know we know you and that that stuff is
truly only really happens in small towns because everybody knows
each other and like, yeah, like we got to keep
you here, but we all kind of know. Yeah, I
thought that all that stuff, all that stuff is really great, wonderful.

Speaker 1 (53:42):
Is We've been all over the place, mainly making our
way through by talking about themes and actors. But is
there anything that we should bring up that that that
I've missed, because I, you know, my main thing that
I wanted to make sure. Oh yeah, Royal Dano. Royal
Dano here plays you know, the Tom Germandy's this this

(54:05):
grumbly old guy in the in this shack with his
son played by John Davis Chandler. And I think it's
hilarious by the way that on the night of the
murder he had gone to the movies, which I thought
was was great. You know that this this guy, you know,
he's he's such a strange character with his grumbling voice
and everything. I don't know what Royal Dano was like.

(54:28):
He may have been a really wonderful, genteel person. He
always plays this cantankerous country.

Speaker 2 (54:34):
Except when he's Abraham Lincoln.

Speaker 1 (54:37):
Except for when he's Abraham Lincoln. And that's the thing
that makes it really interesting, like I want to know
more about Royal Danel.

Speaker 3 (54:45):
Royal Royal Dano has one of the best exchanges with
the sheriff in this movie because the sheriff asks him
where you know, did you He's asking him if he
he put his son, his adult son to bed that night,
and the Royal Dane points out, no, my son is

(55:07):
a grown up.

Speaker 2 (55:08):
I don't I don't check in on.

Speaker 5 (55:09):
All of that. All that was great, like.

Speaker 3 (55:14):
The he is the sort of actor though, like the
exact sort of actor that we're talking about.

Speaker 2 (55:21):
That just adds like.

Speaker 3 (55:23):
You believe that he is this guy that lives in
a shack on the side of a swamp, you know, like.

Speaker 5 (55:29):
Yeah, and again the people they got and the dialogue
and how it all works together, like you get that
they live out here and they deal with all this
stuff all the time. I also like that interaction because
the subtext is, look, man, we live in the swamp,
but we're not stupid, right weirdos like give me a break,
go back to town, you know, like come on, Like

(55:53):
but there's that that you know, look, I know how
you think of me, but come on, and that it's
it's just layered so well, I just keep as I
was watching it, it just felt it's so lived in and believable,
and that doesn't I don't think that that happens as
much as people would like in cinema these days. And
I don't again, I don't know exactly what. And then

(56:16):
there's there's good examples of that, and there's just good storytelling,
but there's just something about this period of time and
kind of how this all works again that's elevated, I think,
beyond a TV movie. Not that, and like I said before,
like you don't expect it because of the usual budgets
and stuff that you get, or that that maybe a
lot and also you know, in a lot of TV

(56:36):
movies it's kind of a more more overly dramatic. There's
a certain style and I kept coming back to it
in this movie that just you could take the work.
You could even it could be a different mystery. It
could be a murder mystery without the werewolf. I think again,
I love that it has the werewolf, but it could
be a murder mystery. It would be just as effective
and probably not as memorable, maybe, I think, because that's

(56:58):
part of what the charm. Yeah, yeah, the werewolf aspect
is a supernatural aspect that makes it different. But you
again when you said, like, oh, you want supernatural plus.

Speaker 1 (57:09):
In the heat of the night, Like, yeah, yes, but
in the it does work a lot better when you
go ahead and and like I like Peyton plays. But
one of the big problems was that they cut out
the poor people. They decided, for whatever reason, that the
audience wanted to watch the middle class and the rich.
And what it made the book really saucy was all

(57:31):
of that class stuff, and you know, and they cut
all that out of the TV series until much much later,
several seasons and so but in the Heat but you
can do it, and you should and it makes it memorable,
but you got to be kind of brave to deal
with all of that stuff. Dano, by the way, was
in Messiah of the Evil, which I can't remember what

(57:52):
year that came out, but he plays He plays the
father of the main character is trying to this woman's
trying to figure out why there's this weird zombie outbreak
in California, and he shows up halfway through just to
warn her to leave. And he's just it's not even
a very big part, and he's so memorable. He just
elevates everything that he's in. And yes, he is memorialized

(58:13):
now as a robot at Disneyland or wherever.

Speaker 2 (58:15):
Wherever Robo Lincoln Lincoln.

Speaker 1 (58:22):
I mean, gosh, would it be neat by the way,
if there were an emergency at Disneyland, and so robo
Lincoln comes comes to life at night and goes and
and and solves it all.

Speaker 3 (58:32):
And it's I think Robo Lincoln should come to life
and become president.

Speaker 5 (58:38):
Yeah, I mean it sounds like it's a j like
Magnola adjacent what you're talking.

Speaker 1 (58:45):
About, Like, yeah, I was gonna say it's the screwing head. Yeah.
So anyway, all right, having having but also.

Speaker 5 (58:58):
Watch a film full of animatronics, like all the all
of the animatronics walk off and they become assassins.

Speaker 3 (59:09):
It's a it's a it's it's a reverse five Nights.
Instead of being up to evil, they're they're doing uh,
they're gonna do good.

Speaker 1 (59:22):
Yeah, they just wander around doing good. They break they
break into Congress and give them a lot of advice
and how to write legislation. And then yeah, the whole
of the the idea of the Hall of Presidents just
wandering off to do good in the land is a
hilarious is a hilarious idea.

Speaker 5 (59:38):
That's just where my head is. I I just pictured
an army of Lincoln's killing Nazis or you know, white supremacists.
Oh my god, oh my god, this army of robo
Lincoln's has invaded our clan rally.

Speaker 2 (59:54):
I love that.

Speaker 5 (59:54):
I like, I like, I mean, I like the idea
of doing good. That's probably a better thing. But also
I would watch.

Speaker 1 (01:00:04):
You can do both. I guarantee you. We can fit
all of this in.

Speaker 5 (01:00:08):
Maybe maybe the Benjamin Franklins go to Congress and help
and then robo Lincoln's take up their axes an.

Speaker 1 (01:00:15):
Idea because they also invariably have robo Mark Twain voiced
by Hal Holbrook.

Speaker 5 (01:00:20):
And and oh, I think he's the I think robo
Mark Twain is the one that's fousing.

Speaker 1 (01:00:25):
Well, he's the lead.

Speaker 5 (01:00:27):
I think he's the general, remarks as the robo Lincoln
just pull uh the robot.

Speaker 4 (01:00:35):
Isn't there a Lincoln Vampire hunter already?

Speaker 1 (01:00:37):
So just there is. But luckily it's about ten years back,
so we got plenty of room.

Speaker 2 (01:00:43):
We actually did that one on the show a million
years ago.

Speaker 3 (01:00:49):
Yes, all right, I met somebody at a baby birthday
party who their husband and does a horror movie podcast,
and she was saying, Oh, yeah, he's got it. He's
got a he's got a lot of episodes. He's he's
just done like his hundredth episode. And I I swear

(01:01:13):
I'm not a prick, but in the back of my mind,
I was like, Oh, how quaint.

Speaker 5 (01:01:20):
No, you got a leadist in your mind about the show.
I don't know, that's funny.

Speaker 3 (01:01:26):
I felt slightly ashamed, but not so ashamed that I
won't be confessional about it.

Speaker 2 (01:01:36):
The uh.

Speaker 1 (01:01:37):
By the way, Abraham Lincoln Vampire Hunter. So our friends
over at Mounster really Happy Hour did an episode on that,
and I think the funniest thing was hearing them remark
in the kind of sense they were like, you know,
I think the history I'm paraphrasing, but it was like,
the history is a little problematic in this film.

Speaker 2 (01:01:57):
That there weren't vampires involved the war.

Speaker 1 (01:02:00):
Well, actually it's less that and more that they just
kind of jumbled up a whole bunch of stuff involving
both the Civil War and the President of the United States.

Speaker 3 (01:02:08):
And I remember, I just remember that that movie was
very divisive when we recorded an episode on it like
that was like strangely heated. I may be misremembering, but
I remember that Tony and I liked it, and you
and Julia very much did not like it, and I

(01:02:28):
and I remember that being one of the more device like.

Speaker 1 (01:02:32):
I don't remember.

Speaker 2 (01:02:33):
I could be mis remembering. I could be misremembering.

Speaker 3 (01:02:37):
I kind of want to go back and re listen
to it now, even though I'm sure even well, like
when I do go back and revisit our old episodes, inevitably,
I am always shocked at how terrible the sound on
my recording sounds. But you know, and hopefully it's better now.

Speaker 5 (01:02:57):
But you get to four score, the less you remember, Jason.

Speaker 1 (01:03:00):
Oh my god, Yeah, I'm I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:03:05):
There were top hats and there was an axe, and
there was.

Speaker 1 (01:03:08):
Probably a lot more pretentious several hundred episodes ago.

Speaker 3 (01:03:12):
Uh, once you, once you've done Vampire Hookers, all bets
are off.

Speaker 2 (01:03:18):
See.

Speaker 1 (01:03:18):
The funny thing is that's why there's no consistency in
my in me on this show, because I'll at once
go this Abraham Lincoln Vampire Hunter is preposterous, and then
like two weeks later Ago Vampire Hookers actually has a
lot to recommend it.

Speaker 3 (01:03:36):
I think, I think, I think that I think that
that also speaks to horror phantom at large in a way.

Speaker 5 (01:03:47):
Yes, I'm with you that.

Speaker 1 (01:03:49):
I mean, it did have John Kerry. So that's but
all right, getting back to for for those like three
listeners who are left, getting back to the Moon of
the Wolf, we should get our final thoughts and then
go to endorsements. So Drew, Gosh, this was fun to
talk about. Give me your final thoughts on Moon of

(01:04:11):
the Wolf.

Speaker 3 (01:04:12):
I am glad that we came back on this obscure
nineteen seventy two TV movie because somehow, when we started
coming to this discussion about what our first episode back,
I somehow decided I was going to send a fourteen
movie long list to everyone on our group chat, and

(01:04:36):
after much debate, we somehow ended on this movie. And yet,
and yet, through that somewhat convoluted system, this ended up
being the right decision because this conversation was a joy,
and I think that is what I needed tonight of
all nights, is to dissect this wonderfully wacky TV movie with.

Speaker 5 (01:05:02):
Y'all thinks like trust the system, system work from the
outside it may look like chaos, but look look where
we always get.

Speaker 1 (01:05:13):
Julia, what are your thoughts.

Speaker 4 (01:05:15):
I think this has been a fun conversation. Yeah, I
think the characters are interesting. Uh, but I do feel
the TV movie of the weakness of this film. I
do think that there's it's got a lot going for it,
apparently more than the Abraham Lincoln Vampire Hunter, given what
Drew has said that we said about it, and uh yeah,

(01:05:39):
but it's mostly just been great to be back with
you guys chatting since we've been away for a summer hiatus.
So it's been it's been.

Speaker 1 (01:05:47):
Good, wonderful, Thank you very much. By the way, can
you actually build address with a macrome chest? Is that
a thing that?

Speaker 4 (01:05:55):
Yeah? Yeah, they just they just whatever you call it,
and it I guess the little I really do feel
like the costume people just made her dresses because they
do seem very you know, like straight out of a
pattern book. But yeah, I think that they macro made
that little chest piece and then just sewed it onto them.

Speaker 1 (01:06:14):
Oh cool, I mean that's just really neat. I like
all that stuff. Okay, Tony, what about you?

Speaker 5 (01:06:21):
Yeah, I mean, if I think it's obvious, I really
like the setting, and I think it's yeah, the budget
is what it is because you do a lot off camera,
but I was I just really dug it. I think
you could add in a bunch of different features that
kind of feel like this, and you'd have a whole
night of deep Southern mystery and loathing if you want to.

(01:06:41):
And that's good. But I you know, it's probably the
fact that I'm older, but there's a certain there's There's
also the aspect of how much this is a character
actor driven film that I probably have some nostalgia for,
with a bunch of character actors.

Speaker 1 (01:06:56):
That I recognize.

Speaker 5 (01:06:59):
But saying that everybody's just super solid and everybody elevates
this in unexpected ways. I'm with Drew that I'm glad
that we picked this one because it kind of came
out of left field and it was the one I
didn't know I needed to see, And yet here we are, wonderful.
I really enjoy it.

Speaker 1 (01:07:16):
I'm really glad that we watched it as well. I really, honestly,
I am just thrilled anytime we can return to nineteen
seventies TV movies. For some reason, this is a special
happy thing for me.

Speaker 2 (01:07:28):
So there we go and.

Speaker 1 (01:07:31):
That's good enough for me. Let's get our endorsements. I'm
dying to know, and to be honest, I'm not even
sure what I'm going to say. It's like we're ordering
at a restaurant and I'm just hoping that I'll know
what I'm going to say by the time the white
person gets around to me. Drew, what do you have
for us? Well, well, you just got here from comic Con,

(01:07:51):
so you might not know either.

Speaker 3 (01:07:52):
I well, no, I want to recommend a graphic novel
called by Eric Powell of The Goon fame, But it
is not like The Goon.

Speaker 2 (01:08:07):
I have to stress that it is called.

Speaker 3 (01:08:11):
Look What Eddie Gean Had What Eddie Gean Had Done?
And as you can guess by the name, it is
a biographical comic that is about the notorious grave robber
Cannibal maybe serial killer at Geen and it is one

(01:08:35):
of the most disturbing things that I have ever read.
So your mileage may vary because I am not normally,
despite my general interest in creepy things, I am not
always a true crime guy. But this is this is
a part of a series that Powell is doing. He

(01:08:58):
actually just put out out the second part, which is
about Frederick Wortham, the infamous psychiatrists that had people burning
comic books in the streets, and that one's called Doctor Worthless,
and I'm going to eventually get around to getting that
one is as well. But it's incredibly creepy. The artwork

(01:09:27):
is beautiful. If you are interested in true crime, I
think you will like it. But even if you are
just have a general interest in the macabre and pop culture,
I think that you'll find it interesting. But also I
want to recommend that everyone listening to this podcast go

(01:09:51):
to their local bookstore or local comic book shop. Take
a moment, and you should say, hey, clerk working behind
the counter, no doubt, working hard. I would like to
order a copy of the Halloween man Omnibus Volume one
from Red five Comics, because that is coming out on
September thirtieth. So I am now full on in the

(01:10:14):
hype train right now, and I have.

Speaker 2 (01:10:18):
Seen this thing now. I saw copies of it at
San Diego Comic Con. It is beautiful.

Speaker 3 (01:10:26):
All the pages have been remastered, like the coloring and
the artwork has been you know, tuned up, so like
with you know, it's it's it's hard to describe. But
it's the same coloring but just refined to a point
and the same thing with the lettering. So this is

(01:10:49):
the best these pages have ever looked in print. And
if you are people are always like for decades now
they're like, oh, why can't we get a mass market
Halloween Man paperback?

Speaker 2 (01:11:04):
Well here you go.

Speaker 3 (01:11:05):
If you want further volumes, please support this now because
I really want there to be volume three, Volume two,
volume four. Uh you know like this, this is this,
The time is now.

Speaker 2 (01:11:19):
Show your support.

Speaker 3 (01:11:20):
This book is worth It also has an all new
intro by friend of the podcast, John Logan, So oh cool,
yeah worth it worth every penny.

Speaker 2 (01:11:33):
And that's that's me for this week.

Speaker 1 (01:11:36):
I guess wonderful. Thank you so much. That was that
was fantastic. Uh, Julia, I don't know what do you
got to what do you what do you have to endorse?

Speaker 4 (01:11:43):
We're going to make our the third reference to our
friend John Logan in this episode and recommend if you
have the opportunity to see the live touring production of
Mulin Rouge that was written that the book is written
by John Logan, actually do so because it is brilliant.
It's so good, so fun, and exciting and interesting, lots

(01:12:05):
of great music. It's very funny in the first act
and very moving in the second act. Really really good show.
So and I know it'll be coming around near many people,
so if you have the chance, go and see it.
I also want to endorse Weapons, starring Julia Garner and
Josh Brolin. It is so scary.

Speaker 2 (01:12:27):
Oh my gosh.

Speaker 4 (01:12:27):
We were talking about how scary it was. I couldn't
sleep last night. I'm like dragging today because I had
not sleep after watching it. So yes, those are my two.

Speaker 1 (01:12:37):
Fantastic Tony, what do you got. I've been watching a lot.

Speaker 5 (01:12:40):
Of TV, and you know there's movies I've seen that
I really enjoyed. We actually, we actually enjoyed the New
Naked Gun. It was really funny. It was fun to
version good crowd. The draft House has also been showing
a Samurai the new game Ghost to Go Tie, the
sequel to Ghost Tushima is coming out, and we've been

(01:13:03):
showing Samurai movies. So I got to see the first
Zatuichi movie in the theater, and this past week was
Lady Snowblood and I really I recommend that in the
Stray Cat Rocks movies. Even though they're kind of pinky
violence movies. I don't I don't know if they're for everyone,
but you know, in accuracies in Lady Snowblood is in that.

(01:13:25):
I think Arrow may have still had the Stray cat
Rocks set in print. But I just I've been really enjoying.
There's been really good crowds. It's kind of cool to
see Samurai cinema. They're gonna do Thirteen Assassins, they're gonna
do Lone Wolf and Cub and then I'm linking back.
They're also doing Ron so I think it's through all

(01:13:47):
the Criterion. You know, Janis Productions nice, so they looked. Man,
it was beautiful to see Lady Snowblood on a big
screen with a good crowd. So I do recommend, if
you're like minded, check out the Samurai series that's going
on at the Draft House. And if you can't catch that,
then definitely pick up the Criterion ones and you know,

(01:14:08):
do your own screenings at home. I've also been enjoyed
the new season of Twisted Metal. They finally go into
the in San via the video game, and I think,
I don't know, I didn't expect it to work, but
it's actually I really like. It's got a good cast
and I really like what they're doing, even though it's

(01:14:28):
you know, over the top and bloody, so maybe not
for everyone.

Speaker 1 (01:14:31):
But it is.

Speaker 5 (01:14:32):
I've been really enjoying Twisted Metal as well. There's some
screeners I need to catch up on too, so hopefully
I'll have some recommendations next time as I catch up
on some of that stuff. But yeah, that's been that's
been me as well as just some random Discothech Media
puts out a lot of old school anime, so I've

(01:14:52):
been also revisiting the eighties nice wise and that's that's
always good. This latest one SBT Lasner. Oh, and I've
also Hulu has a Macross series and I just finished
Macross Frontier and I thought that was really solid. So
I'm all over the map these days awesome.

Speaker 1 (01:15:12):
I'm going to sign on to everything that Julia said
because we've been hanging out a lot and we went
to Mulin Rouge. I actually I enjoyed this like even
more than the film, and I was just really just
really moved by it and then weapons I was jumping
out of my seat. It was so scary, I mean, honestly,

(01:15:35):
like embarrassingly going like making noises and jumping like it was.
It was a really solid jump scare movie and I
seldom encountered that, Like.

Speaker 4 (01:15:46):
The I didn't have my own popcorn, so I knocked
over my daughter's popcorn.

Speaker 1 (01:15:53):
Like the last time I went to a movie that
made me jump scare like that was The Nighthouse, which
has got to be like three years and so this
was this was really really solid and yeah, so cool. Well,
I'm so excited we got a chance to come back
and start out with a bang, exactly where I love

(01:16:15):
to be. I'm so happy that we watched the nineteen
seventies made for a TV film And I'm not the
one who came up with the idea. I that just
that's a gift. It's manna from heaven. I definitely am,
honestly because I always feel yeah, because I hate to
foist these things on you, but I'm happy when somebody
else voices.

Speaker 3 (01:16:36):
This time we can we can all blame me and
my extensive list making.

Speaker 1 (01:16:42):
I guess I love it. So I'm I'm super excited.

Speaker 5 (01:16:48):
Me and you, so everybody.

Speaker 1 (01:16:54):
Thank you so much. Be kind to one another. Let
us know what you thought or or new directions or
if there's other certainly if there's obscure films, especially like
nineteen seventies, you know, forgotten TV films, and you're like, oh,
you'll love this. Let us know. We might do an
episode on it, but at least I will watch it
at the very least. So thank you so much and

(01:17:18):
we can't wait to be back soon. Bye guys, Bye night.