June 23, 2020 • 18 mins
Join Steve Sjogren and Jeff Hoglen in this captivating podcast episode as they dive into Scott Thomas' thought-provoking article, "20 Questions for Potential Church Planters."
With passion and insight, they explore the essential characteristics of a successful church planter.
Beginning with the significance of being a devoted Christian and assembling a strong core team, they navigate the delicate balance of maintaining standards while embracing all individuals. The conversation then turns to the vital role of being spirit-filled, spirit-directed, spirit-led, and spirit-controlled.
Drawing from their own experiences, Steve and Jeff emphasize the power of obedience and faithfulness in following God's guidance. As the episode draws to a close, they leave listeners with uplifting words of encouragement and a reminder to explore the website for additional valuable resources.
With passion and insight, they explore the essential characteristics of a successful church planter.
Beginning with the significance of being a devoted Christian and assembling a strong core team, they navigate the delicate balance of maintaining standards while embracing all individuals. The conversation then turns to the vital role of being spirit-filled, spirit-directed, spirit-led, and spirit-controlled.
Drawing from their own experiences, Steve and Jeff emphasize the power of obedience and faithfulness in following God's guidance. As the episode draws to a close, they leave listeners with uplifting words of encouragement and a reminder to explore the website for additional valuable resources.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
You know, in my mind whatit comes down to is if I am
passionately in love with Jesus, everythingelse is going to line up, equipping
and encouraging church planters everywhere. Thisis the Church Planting Today podcast with Steve
Chagrin and Jeff Hoagland. Useful conversationsfor those aimed at winning others into relationship
with Christ. Hey, everyone,Welcome to church plan Today, the podcast
(00:23):
for church Planning dot Com. Churchplan dot com is for current and future
church planners, existing church leaders,and those wanting to see renewal within the
local church. My name is JeffHoagland and I am joined by my partner
in crime, Steve Schobrin. Hey, mister Jeff, gonna be with you
right on fun Today. Man,it's been a while. Excited, Yeah,
it's been a while that too,Gee, was this COVID thing is
(00:47):
nuts? And yeah, But anyways, Steve, you know, I was
looking at some of the upcoming postson church plan dot com and there's one
that I'm actually reposting originally posted intwenty thirteen, and it's by brother.
By name is Scott Thomas, andhe was heavily involved in the Acts twenty
(01:11):
nine movement, and he's just seemslike a very well balanced fella. And
he put out this article called twentyquestions for Potential church Planters, and I
just thought it'd be cool if wewent over these and just kind of unpacked
(01:33):
them and kind of see if they'rethere's still for today or or maybe you
know from our different contexts, youknow how how they resonate. So I'm
with you right on. So anyways, we're going to start off again.
This is This is an article byby Scott Thomas, and he starts this
(01:59):
article off by saying, you know, there's a lot of a lot of
different positions and ways that a personcan serve either an established church or a
church plant Not everyone has to bethe lead pastor. And then he moves
on to say that, you know, if you feel like you're called to
(02:21):
be a church planter, and especiallyin that the capacity of a lead pastor,
there's some things that you need toconsider. But you know, with
that being said, Steve, Ithink some of these would be for the
church planting core team as well.Yes, because yeah, and there's gonna
(02:43):
be some things on here, justso you know, we're not we're not
speaking down on this brother or praisingeverything. He says, we're just we're
just having a discussion. Yeah,and I think that's what's missing in our
world today, actually, just usbeing able to sit down and talk about
things. So anyways, he summarizedthe twenty characteristics of a church planter,
(03:07):
and number one was am I aChristian? And I would say if if
you're the lead pastor probably you needto be, that would be most helpful.
That's you know, it's like wehave all thing on driving and you
say, first of all, Iam okay with cars, you know,
(03:28):
right, right right? That's notright? Then forget the whole list.
Yeah, but you know when itcomes to the church planting team, Well,
what is your thoughts on that?Oh? Absolutely, I you know,
I believe in teams certainly, butI that this is a whole other
rabbit pat trail to go down.But I think with the a core team
(03:50):
of whatever size it is, Iwould say manageable size less than ten in
my mind, absolutely essential that they'reon the same page. And okay,
so they need to be believers.Oh golly, yeah, yeah, okay.
Absolutely. You know, here's afunny thing is we've had a number
of people even on our core teamwhere they didn't move there, but they
were there in Ohio at the time, and these spouses came to the Lord
(04:15):
and they came and they were partof the core team. It was it's
contagious just thing of you know,coming to the Lord. Yeah, yeah,
yeah, absolutely, very cool.Yeah. I know some folks that
they it would be on the samepage as far as the pastor and the
core team, but then when itcomes to other areas well, and so
(04:39):
kind of the worship team is oneof the first things you develop when you're
church planning, and then they kindof loosen that that dogmatic approach that they
say that you know, if youwant to be part of something within that
that church plant, you don't haveto be. And they go back and
(04:59):
say, you know, when theycalled, when Jesus called his first disciples,
he says, you know, comefollow me, and through following you
see, you witness, you becomea part, you feel the love,
and and then through that there's aheart change. Yes, And so that's
the way I was for a longtime as far as the the worship team,
(05:23):
especially because you know, coming froma musical background, I attracted musicians
and some of them weren't weren't weren'tsaved, or if they were saved,
they they definitely were a work inprogress. Yeah yeah, yeah, so
I'm rambling now. Anyways, Ithink it's important that that each church plender
(05:49):
UH kind of determining his heart wherehe stands as far as those things go.
You know, within your core team. We we highly recommend that your
core be believers. But then youknow where do where do you stand with
regards to your your your worship teamor your your small group attendees and that
(06:14):
sort of thing. We had ayou know, it's always the drummer that
isn't a believer. Is that accurate? And if you you think spinal tap
the movie was true, then youneed several drummers on and by something happened,
you know. But any one ofthe guys was a fantastic drummer and
had kind of the soft touch whennecessary. That's a hard parts finding a
(06:38):
drum who can do the soft touch, you know. But anyway, we
had a Christian group and a couplethat were doing UH there in the area
from Nashville said this'm seeing between beingany services anyway, So they did that.
They are talking after the service.This guy says, I love this
church, and really, what's whatdo you like about it? Because I've
been living with my girlfriend for yearsand they don't even care. Oh well,
(07:03):
yeah, I didn't know that partanyway. So I mean, not
that we would ostracize a guy likethat, but maybe you got to decide
to see okay to be on stage, you know, maybe you know,
depending on if you didn't talk toanybody new, maybe that's okay. Yeah,
And so so church planters, youneed to decide where you stand prior
(07:27):
to launching. Yes, you knowthat one question got us off into a
whole different direction. Didn't you knowthat that direction is good though, Jeff?
You know, because it really doessay we are where do we stand
on the not yet believer people?Yeah? Yeah, And I think of
it as is it this is ita line in the middle that you come
(07:48):
the closer you get to that linesegment, you really are a believer,
you really are a part of whatwe're doing, et cetera. Or is
it a box and when you havea box it becomes legalistic. Yeah,
and so you got to you know, you got to mind that that difficulty
is you get to the edge,you're no longer really a part of us.
You no longer believe, So amen, Amen, I believe that,
(08:09):
And I hate to put it onhim if if he didn't say it,
but I think Andy Stanley actually saidthat sometimes we get it wrong. You
know, we ask people to believein order for them to belong and we'll
accept them. Christ and he comparedit to Jesus had follow and through following,
(08:31):
you believe, you follow, andthrough following you've already kind of accepted
into that belonging part, and throughthat you believe. Anyways, I don't
want to I don't want to attributeto him and lie because it's been a
long time. Anyways, let's moveon, Steve. Yeah, twenty characteristics
(08:56):
have a church planning. This isthis is his number Tuesday. Here my
deeply and passionately in love with Jesusand is he the lord of area of
my life? And so you andI spoke right before we started the recording,
and you had a different kind oftake on it. You kind of
wish that he would have phrased itjust a smidge differently. Yeah, I
(09:20):
would have said the first part isfantastic. Am I deeply and passionately in
love with Jesus. Absolutely, that'sessential. Is he the lord of every
year of my life? You know? I think that if you're a little
bit obsessive, compulsive thinker like Iam, you can drill down and then
it becomes a deal where well,I don't know that you're constantly second guessing
(09:41):
yourself. And you know, inmy mind, Jeff, what it comes
down to is that first part,if I am passionately in love with Jesus,
everything else is going to line up. Yeah, and the bad things
are going to disappear, the goodthings are going to grow. We like
somebody has said, you know,you don't have time or money for addictions
(10:03):
any longer. You have to pourit into something in to their right to
focus, you know, so anywayyou do better. I believe that.
And uh, I feel your hearton that, Steve, as far as
the is he lord of every areaof your life? And so I feel
(10:24):
like what you're saying is that thatthat is our desire. But you know,
if if we have true self awareness, we we can say that uh
every area, you know, Yeah, because we're all work in progress,
(10:45):
you know, and we we definitelyall fall short. And so with that
in mind, I don't know ifwe could ever live up fully too?
Is he the lord of every areaof our life? But again something to
strive for. Yes, absolutely,Again, the positive outweighs the negative.
(11:07):
The positive will overwhelm the negative,and it takes care of itself. Yeah,
yeah, here's it. Here's agood one. Oh, actually,
I'll go to number three. DoI believe is in error? Infallible?
Inspired? Word? And does itaffect my life deeply? It's funny that
(11:31):
my daughter, and I won't embarrassher by saying her name, but anyways,
she was working for a church andthey have they had a a new
new pastor come in, young youngfellow m hm, and he told her
(11:52):
that he doubted most of the OldTestament, if not all. Yeah.
Wow, I was like, ohmy wow. I was blown away.
And so I'm such a gracefield guythat I asked her, I said,
I said, no, you misunderstoodhim. Maybe maybe he said that he's
(12:16):
he's he wrestles with some things.And I asked her to go back and
just get some clarification on that,and sure enough he came back and said,
now he doesn't. In seminary whateverseminary that was, he learned that
there's some things that probably shouldn't havebeen included, and this and that,
(12:37):
and so he doubted a lot ofit. I was like, oh,
well, you know, I usuallysay I'm not really qualified to you know,
to be that smart or to whatever. And what would Gee was my
mind's blanking for a second. Butone of my favorite authors, he was
an annivarsity guy. He says,you know, when he comes to scripture,
the real liabilate scripture, the beliefthe scripture is I choose, no
(13:01):
matter what the other evidence is.And you know there's some conflicts of scripture.
They went up meeting, they wentdown, they went north when it
probably was south, and you knowthat has zero effect on the whole story.
He says, I choose to believethat it is all true, and
I don't have time for the otherstuff. Amen, there's some bloody perhaps,
(13:24):
but I'm not going to go there. I don't. You know.
It didn't affect me. Yeah,yeah, hey. And you know,
rather than being dogmatic, you know, studied out, look at both sides,
see what they have to say,go to the original. I mean,
my goodness, I remember back whenI was in Bible college, just
studying. It took a whole deskworth of books to decipher stuff. And
(13:50):
now you can just jump online andI use Bible Gateway a lot now and
they have so many different commentaries onthere, dictionaries and Mexicans and different different
resources. Man, it's just rightthere. And so if you really want
to dig in, you sure could. Or you wait, just three hands
(14:11):
up and say I don't believe it. The source I quoted with John Stott
s g Oh, yeah, yeah, he's a great guy. But again,
when I run to an atheist onoccasion, and if they're under about
one hundred years old, I'll say, you know, that's really amazed.
At age nineteen, you've already outweighedthe intellect of about ninety nine percent of
(14:35):
the world. And I go,you know, this is fantastic. You're
so smart. Maybe you can educateme too. I have a lot of
fun with these guys, but kindof exploring atheism or whatever. Oh,
you know, right on, righton, all right, see, I
think we have time for one more, okay, and let's just go right
(14:58):
down the list. Number four.Am I a spirit filled, spirit directed,
spirit led in spirit controlled am Ispirit field, spirit directed, spirit
led, and spirit controlled. Wow. That's a mouthful. Well, that
goes back to what you said earlier, Jeff, you know about deeply passionately
in love with there's it's a spectrum, you know, there's not a black
(15:20):
and white and uh am, Ione of those would be spirit controlled.
You know. I'm not sure exactlywhat he meant, but I think at
times I am absolutely At other timestoday probably I won't be not that at
all, depending if I'm driving inLos Angeles or not, you know,
And is that helpful? It is? That's that's very real, you know.
(15:46):
And uh and I think that isa It's one of those funky things
where you know, people have thisidea about ministers, pastors, church leaders
in general and think, you know, they're a certain way and they're always
let But I've never been one ofthose those guys that that says, you
(16:08):
know, you know, when Iwas taking to share this morning, the
Lord said to me, you knowor you know everything that the Lord spoke
to me and told me this,And I mean he does, but it's
not every second of every day.And and a lot of people think we
(16:30):
have this hotline or something, andyou know, I just kind of lived
my life the best way I canscripturally, biblically, and then I keep
on doing the last thing that Iknow that the Lord directed me to do,
and until he says otherwise, Ijust keep doing what I'm doing.
(16:52):
John Wember said, old marching ordersare good marching orders. Yeah. Ooh
like that a little bit of Wimberright there. Yeah, I like that.
It's a little bit of John,And I think there is a lot
I mean right there. That isa good one right there, Jeff,
Yeah, it's worthy stopping on here. Yeah, absolutely, And so actually
that is going to do it forus. And guys, we have been
(17:17):
looking for this this outro. SoI don't even know what to say right
now, but until next time,I'll be having Steve Schogrin and myself.
We want you to know that webelieve in what you're doing. We believe
that you're doing the very best thatyou can for praying for you. Keep
on keeping on, as Steve says, because we believe that you're making a
(17:38):
difference. So until next time,Goblin. You've been listening to the Church
Planting Today podcast with Steve Chagrin andJeff Hoakland. Be sure to share and
subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts.Connect for free outreach, articles, ideas,
and resources at kindness dot com andchurch planting dot com.
You know, in my mind whatit comes down to is if I am
passionately in love with Jesus, everythingelse is going to line up, equipping
and encouraging church planters everywhere. Thisis the Church Planting Today podcast with Steve
Chagrin and Jeff Hoagland. Useful conversationsfor those aimed at winning others into relationship
with Christ. Hey, everyone,Welcome to church plan Today, the podcast
(00:23):
for church Planning dot Com. Churchplan dot com is for current and future
church planners, existing church leaders,and those wanting to see renewal within the
local church. My name is JeffHoagland and I am joined by my partner
in crime, Steve Schobrin. Hey, mister Jeff, gonna be with you
right on fun Today. Man,it's been a while. Excited, Yeah,
it's been a while that too,Gee, was this COVID thing is
(00:47):
nuts? And yeah, But anyways, Steve, you know, I was
looking at some of the upcoming postson church plan dot com and there's one
that I'm actually reposting originally posted intwenty thirteen, and it's by brother.
By name is Scott Thomas, andhe was heavily involved in the Acts twenty
(01:11):
nine movement, and he's just seemslike a very well balanced fella. And
he put out this article called twentyquestions for Potential church Planters, and I
just thought it'd be cool if wewent over these and just kind of unpacked
(01:33):
them and kind of see if they'rethere's still for today or or maybe you
know from our different contexts, youknow how how they resonate. So I'm
with you right on. So anyways, we're going to start off again.
This is This is an article byby Scott Thomas, and he starts this
(01:59):
article off by saying, you know, there's a lot of a lot of
different positions and ways that a personcan serve either an established church or a
church plant Not everyone has to bethe lead pastor. And then he moves
on to say that, you know, if you feel like you're called to
(02:21):
be a church planter, and especiallyin that the capacity of a lead pastor,
there's some things that you need toconsider. But you know, with
that being said, Steve, Ithink some of these would be for the
church planting core team as well.Yes, because yeah, and there's gonna
(02:43):
be some things on here, justso you know, we're not we're not
speaking down on this brother or praisingeverything. He says, we're just we're
just having a discussion. Yeah,and I think that's what's missing in our
world today, actually, just usbeing able to sit down and talk about
things. So anyways, he summarizedthe twenty characteristics of a church planter,
(03:07):
and number one was am I aChristian? And I would say if if
you're the lead pastor probably you needto be, that would be most helpful.
That's you know, it's like wehave all thing on driving and you
say, first of all, Iam okay with cars, you know,
(03:28):
right, right right? That's notright? Then forget the whole list.
Yeah, but you know when itcomes to the church planting team, Well,
what is your thoughts on that?Oh? Absolutely, I you know,
I believe in teams certainly, butI that this is a whole other
rabbit pat trail to go down.But I think with the a core team
(03:50):
of whatever size it is, Iwould say manageable size less than ten in
my mind, absolutely essential that they'reon the same page. And okay,
so they need to be believers.Oh golly, yeah, yeah, okay.
Absolutely. You know, here's afunny thing is we've had a number
of people even on our core teamwhere they didn't move there, but they
were there in Ohio at the time, and these spouses came to the Lord
(04:15):
and they came and they were partof the core team. It was it's
contagious just thing of you know,coming to the Lord. Yeah, yeah,
yeah, absolutely, very cool.Yeah. I know some folks that
they it would be on the samepage as far as the pastor and the
core team, but then when itcomes to other areas well, and so
(04:39):
kind of the worship team is oneof the first things you develop when you're
church planning, and then they kindof loosen that that dogmatic approach that they
say that you know, if youwant to be part of something within that
that church plant, you don't haveto be. And they go back and
(04:59):
say, you know, when theycalled, when Jesus called his first disciples,
he says, you know, comefollow me, and through following you
see, you witness, you becomea part, you feel the love,
and and then through that there's aheart change. Yes, And so that's
the way I was for a longtime as far as the the worship team,
(05:23):
especially because you know, coming froma musical background, I attracted musicians
and some of them weren't weren't weren'tsaved, or if they were saved,
they they definitely were a work inprogress. Yeah yeah, yeah, so
I'm rambling now. Anyways, Ithink it's important that that each church plender
(05:49):
UH kind of determining his heart wherehe stands as far as those things go.
You know, within your core team. We we highly recommend that your
core be believers. But then youknow where do where do you stand with
regards to your your your worship teamor your your small group attendees and that
(06:14):
sort of thing. We had ayou know, it's always the drummer that
isn't a believer. Is that accurate? And if you you think spinal tap
the movie was true, then youneed several drummers on and by something happened,
you know. But any one ofthe guys was a fantastic drummer and
had kind of the soft touch whennecessary. That's a hard parts finding a
(06:38):
drum who can do the soft touch, you know. But anyway, we
had a Christian group and a couplethat were doing UH there in the area
from Nashville said this'm seeing between beingany services anyway, So they did that.
They are talking after the service.This guy says, I love this
church, and really, what's whatdo you like about it? Because I've
been living with my girlfriend for yearsand they don't even care. Oh well,
(07:03):
yeah, I didn't know that partanyway. So I mean, not
that we would ostracize a guy likethat, but maybe you got to decide
to see okay to be on stage, you know, maybe you know,
depending on if you didn't talk toanybody new, maybe that's okay. Yeah,
And so so church planters, youneed to decide where you stand prior
(07:27):
to launching. Yes, you knowthat one question got us off into a
whole different direction. Didn't you knowthat that direction is good though, Jeff?
You know, because it really doessay we are where do we stand
on the not yet believer people?Yeah? Yeah, And I think of
it as is it this is ita line in the middle that you come
(07:48):
the closer you get to that linesegment, you really are a believer,
you really are a part of whatwe're doing, et cetera. Or is
it a box and when you havea box it becomes legalistic. Yeah,
and so you got to you know, you got to mind that that difficulty
is you get to the edge,you're no longer really a part of us.
You no longer believe, So amen, Amen, I believe that,
(08:09):
And I hate to put it onhim if if he didn't say it,
but I think Andy Stanley actually saidthat sometimes we get it wrong. You
know, we ask people to believein order for them to belong and we'll
accept them. Christ and he comparedit to Jesus had follow and through following,
(08:31):
you believe, you follow, andthrough following you've already kind of accepted
into that belonging part, and throughthat you believe. Anyways, I don't
want to I don't want to attributeto him and lie because it's been a
long time. Anyways, let's moveon, Steve. Yeah, twenty characteristics
(08:56):
have a church planning. This isthis is his number Tuesday. Here my
deeply and passionately in love with Jesusand is he the lord of area of
my life? And so you andI spoke right before we started the recording,
and you had a different kind oftake on it. You kind of
wish that he would have phrased itjust a smidge differently. Yeah, I
(09:20):
would have said the first part isfantastic. Am I deeply and passionately in
love with Jesus. Absolutely, that'sessential. Is he the lord of every
year of my life? You know? I think that if you're a little
bit obsessive, compulsive thinker like Iam, you can drill down and then
it becomes a deal where well,I don't know that you're constantly second guessing
(09:41):
yourself. And you know, inmy mind, Jeff, what it comes
down to is that first part,if I am passionately in love with Jesus,
everything else is going to line up. Yeah, and the bad things
are going to disappear, the goodthings are going to grow. We like
somebody has said, you know,you don't have time or money for addictions
(10:03):
any longer. You have to pourit into something in to their right to
focus, you know, so anywayyou do better. I believe that.
And uh, I feel your hearton that, Steve, as far as
the is he lord of every areaof your life? And so I feel
(10:24):
like what you're saying is that thatthat is our desire. But you know,
if if we have true self awareness, we we can say that uh
every area, you know, Yeah, because we're all work in progress,
(10:45):
you know, and we we definitelyall fall short. And so with that
in mind, I don't know ifwe could ever live up fully too?
Is he the lord of every areaof our life? But again something to
strive for. Yes, absolutely,Again, the positive outweighs the negative.
(11:07):
The positive will overwhelm the negative,and it takes care of itself. Yeah,
yeah, here's it. Here's agood one. Oh, actually,
I'll go to number three. DoI believe is in error? Infallible?
Inspired? Word? And does itaffect my life deeply? It's funny that
(11:31):
my daughter, and I won't embarrassher by saying her name, but anyways,
she was working for a church andthey have they had a a new
new pastor come in, young youngfellow m hm, and he told her
(11:52):
that he doubted most of the OldTestament, if not all. Yeah.
Wow, I was like, ohmy wow. I was blown away.
And so I'm such a gracefield guythat I asked her, I said,
I said, no, you misunderstoodhim. Maybe maybe he said that he's
(12:16):
he's he wrestles with some things.And I asked her to go back and
just get some clarification on that,and sure enough he came back and said,
now he doesn't. In seminary whateverseminary that was, he learned that
there's some things that probably shouldn't havebeen included, and this and that,
(12:37):
and so he doubted a lot ofit. I was like, oh,
well, you know, I usuallysay I'm not really qualified to you know,
to be that smart or to whatever. And what would Gee was my
mind's blanking for a second. Butone of my favorite authors, he was
an annivarsity guy. He says,you know, when he comes to scripture,
the real liabilate scripture, the beliefthe scripture is I choose, no
(13:01):
matter what the other evidence is.And you know there's some conflicts of scripture.
They went up meeting, they wentdown, they went north when it
probably was south, and you knowthat has zero effect on the whole story.
He says, I choose to believethat it is all true, and
I don't have time for the otherstuff. Amen, there's some bloody perhaps,
(13:24):
but I'm not going to go there. I don't. You know.
It didn't affect me. Yeah,yeah, hey. And you know,
rather than being dogmatic, you know, studied out, look at both sides,
see what they have to say,go to the original. I mean,
my goodness, I remember back whenI was in Bible college, just
studying. It took a whole deskworth of books to decipher stuff. And
(13:50):
now you can just jump online andI use Bible Gateway a lot now and
they have so many different commentaries onthere, dictionaries and Mexicans and different different
resources. Man, it's just rightthere. And so if you really want
to dig in, you sure could. Or you wait, just three hands
(14:11):
up and say I don't believe it. The source I quoted with John Stott
s g Oh, yeah, yeah, he's a great guy. But again,
when I run to an atheist onoccasion, and if they're under about
one hundred years old, I'll say, you know, that's really amazed.
At age nineteen, you've already outweighedthe intellect of about ninety nine percent of
(14:35):
the world. And I go,you know, this is fantastic. You're
so smart. Maybe you can educateme too. I have a lot of
fun with these guys, but kindof exploring atheism or whatever. Oh,
you know, right on, righton, all right, see, I
think we have time for one more, okay, and let's just go right
(14:58):
down the list. Number four.Am I a spirit filled, spirit directed,
spirit led in spirit controlled am Ispirit field, spirit directed, spirit
led, and spirit controlled. Wow. That's a mouthful. Well, that
goes back to what you said earlier, Jeff, you know about deeply passionately
in love with there's it's a spectrum, you know, there's not a black
(15:20):
and white and uh am, Ione of those would be spirit controlled.
You know. I'm not sure exactlywhat he meant, but I think at
times I am absolutely At other timestoday probably I won't be not that at
all, depending if I'm driving inLos Angeles or not, you know,
And is that helpful? It is? That's that's very real, you know.
(15:46):
And uh and I think that isa It's one of those funky things
where you know, people have thisidea about ministers, pastors, church leaders
in general and think, you know, they're a certain way and they're always
let But I've never been one ofthose those guys that that says, you
(16:08):
know, you know, when Iwas taking to share this morning, the
Lord said to me, you knowor you know everything that the Lord spoke
to me and told me this,And I mean he does, but it's
not every second of every day.And and a lot of people think we
(16:30):
have this hotline or something, andyou know, I just kind of lived
my life the best way I canscripturally, biblically, and then I keep
on doing the last thing that Iknow that the Lord directed me to do,
and until he says otherwise, Ijust keep doing what I'm doing.
(16:52):
John Wember said, old marching ordersare good marching orders. Yeah. Ooh
like that a little bit of Wimberright there. Yeah, I like that.
It's a little bit of John,And I think there is a lot
I mean right there. That isa good one right there, Jeff,
Yeah, it's worthy stopping on here. Yeah, absolutely, And so actually
that is going to do it forus. And guys, we have been
(17:17):
looking for this this outro. SoI don't even know what to say right
now, but until next time,I'll be having Steve Schogrin and myself.
We want you to know that webelieve in what you're doing. We believe
that you're doing the very best thatyou can for praying for you. Keep
on keeping on, as Steve says, because we believe that you're making a
(17:38):
difference. So until next time,Goblin. You've been listening to the Church
Planting Today podcast with Steve Chagrin andJeff Hoakland. Be sure to share and
subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts.Connect for free outreach, articles, ideas,
and resources at kindness dot com andchurch planting dot com.
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