December 12, 2024 • 61 mins
My guest, Bob Spearing, MUFON's Director of International Investigations, offers explanations for the mysterious drones seen in NJ, PA, in Europe and elsewhere. Are the drones a part of a psyop program, or do we need to worry about a foreign adversary? According to Bob, the drones problem is not a new one. We also discuss hypotheses for UFOs/UAP that are alleged to be not of this Earth. Bob brings years of experience and insight to a topic that is rich in history, and never more relevant than today.
Bob Spearing graduated from Fordham University in 1981 with a B.A. in Communications with Journalism, Advertising, Public Opinion, Propaganda, and Film Production as major concentrations. Bob retired from the Port Authority of New York & New Jersey in 2019 after 34 years of service. His many duties included being an FRA licensed Rail Traffic Controller and Locomotive Engineer.
Bob Spearing joined The Mutual UFO Network (MUFON) in 2014 as a Field Investigator and is currently Director of International Investigations. Bob has appeared in several episodes of the 2019 Travel Channel television series “UFOs: The Lost Evidence” as a photo analyst. In a February 2023 Ancient Aliens episode on the History Channel in February he appeared as a MUFON field investigator. Bob had 3 UFO sightings himself and it was enough to capture his interest and research the phenomenon.
He will be in a 2024 Netflix Documentary called The UFO Game and is filming a segment for Ron James’ movie sequel An Accidental Truth NEXT. Bob was MUFON’s Field Investigator of the Year in 2018 and Volunteer of The Year in 2023.
He has had numerous articles published in various UFO related magazines around the world like Outer Limits Magazine, Shadows of Your Mind Magazine, UFOTruth Magazine and the MUFON Journal.
He also writes articles for the MUFON Newsletter and their website MUFON.COM and speaks at various UFO conventions around North America specifically on Patterns in UFO Reports.
Bob lives in eastern Pennsylvania’s Pocono Mountains with his wife and twin boys.
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Bob Spearing graduated from Fordham University in 1981 with a B.A. in Communications with Journalism, Advertising, Public Opinion, Propaganda, and Film Production as major concentrations. Bob retired from the Port Authority of New York & New Jersey in 2019 after 34 years of service. His many duties included being an FRA licensed Rail Traffic Controller and Locomotive Engineer.
Bob Spearing joined The Mutual UFO Network (MUFON) in 2014 as a Field Investigator and is currently Director of International Investigations. Bob has appeared in several episodes of the 2019 Travel Channel television series “UFOs: The Lost Evidence” as a photo analyst. In a February 2023 Ancient Aliens episode on the History Channel in February he appeared as a MUFON field investigator. Bob had 3 UFO sightings himself and it was enough to capture his interest and research the phenomenon.
He will be in a 2024 Netflix Documentary called The UFO Game and is filming a segment for Ron James’ movie sequel An Accidental Truth NEXT. Bob was MUFON’s Field Investigator of the Year in 2018 and Volunteer of The Year in 2023.
He has had numerous articles published in various UFO related magazines around the world like Outer Limits Magazine, Shadows of Your Mind Magazine, UFOTruth Magazine and the MUFON Journal.
He also writes articles for the MUFON Newsletter and their website MUFON.COM and speaks at various UFO conventions around North America specifically on Patterns in UFO Reports.
Bob lives in eastern Pennsylvania’s Pocono Mountains with his wife and twin boys.
Please help the channel grow.
☕️ SUBSCRIBE, like, comment, and click the YouTube Notification Bell so you don’t miss a show.
Thank you! https://www.youtube.com/mysticlounge
HALF LIGHT documentary: https://tubitv.com/movies/678744/half-light
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:14):
However you are and whenever you are, welcome back to
Coffee and UFO's. I'm Alan B. Smith, your most grateful host.
And tonight we have an esteemed guest that I'm really
excited to have on, Bob Spearing. He is the director
of international Investigations for Mofon organization, which I'm very proud
(00:35):
to be a field investigator for. Before we bring on Bob,
I do want to mention a few things. So the
new social media handles across the board go like this
blue Sky. You're at Coffee and UFOs on Threads and Instagram,
(00:55):
it is at Coffee and UFOs podcast, and now on
Facebook you can go to the Coffee and UFOs group,
join their share your comments and everything else that you
have to share regarding the UFO phenomena. Tonight, in particular,
we will be focusing on the UFOs the drones, so
(01:21):
they are unidentified, but we do know that they are drones.
The question is where are they coming from? Why do
we see this in New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Germany, England. And
this is not the first time we've seen a cluster
of drones in the sky before. In fact, a recent case,
(01:42):
my most recent case for move On, and someone did
report drones off of Long Island, so totally different location.
But we've also had drone reports in South Carolina, so
this is really really interesting. I think Bob is particularly
to discuss this, so very briefly, let me read you
(02:04):
his bio. Bob Spearing graduated from Fordham University in nineteen
eighty one with a BA in communications, with journalism, advertising,
public opinion, propaganda, and film production as major concentrations. Bob
retired from the Port Authority of New York and New
(02:25):
Jersey in twenty nineteen after thirty four years of service.
His many duties included being an FRA licensed rail traffic
controller and locomotive engineer. While in management, he was a
safety investigator and a contract administrator who prepared multi million
dollar budgets. He had three UFO sightings himself and it
(02:49):
was enough to capture his interest and research in the phenomena.
Bob joined the Mutual UFO Network MOFON in twenty fourteen
as a field investorator and is currently Director of International Investigations.
Bob has appeared in several episodes of the twenty nineteen
travel series UFOs The Lost Evidence as a photo analysist.
(03:11):
In February twenty twenty three Ancient Aliens episode on the
History Channel, he appeared as a Mufon field investigator. He
will be in a twenty twenty four Netflix documentary called
The UFO Game. I don't know if that came out yet,
but I haven't seen it if it has, and is
filming a segment for Ron James' movie sequel, An Accidental
(03:32):
Truth Next. Bob was Moufon's Field Investigator of the Year
in twenty eighteen and Volunteer of the Year in twenty
twenty three. Bob has long been involved with Mouffon's of
various special projects, including Project Aquarius Digital Library, Historical Reports
Archiving Project Very Important. I have used it in my
own research, the Pinebush, New York UFO Museum, and the
(03:56):
Moufon Members social network. He has had numerous article was
published in various UFO related magazines, including UFOE Newsletter, a
Muffon Newsletter, and he speaks at various UFO conventions around
North Caro America, specifically on patterns in UFO reports. And
he lives in Pennsylvania's Pocono Mountains with his wife and
twin boys. Bob, how are you welcome to coffee and
(04:19):
new folks.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
Hi, good to see Alan, How are you.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
I'm great, I'm I'm so happy to have you on,
particularly because what is going on in the news as
we speak. I do want to mention quickly that I
didn't know that you were involved in the pine Bush,
New York UFO Museum.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
Yeah. Muffon helped get it started probably four years ago now.
They had the pine Bush Festival every year. Muffan always
had a table at it. Yeah. The New York state
director for Muffon, Christoperno, got involved with pine Bush and
we provided an enormous amount of information for their exhibits
(04:58):
at the At the museum, it's i only a UFO museum.
It sort of gets into the Power Normal and ghost
type things too, but there's an entire room dedicated to
UFO sightings. And they did a really, really fantastic job
with the stuff that we gave them.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
Oh yeah, it looks great. I didn't realize how how
crucial it was that that move On was involved. I
know you guys had tables there for years. I actually
got to do a talk there when I titled the
Importance of the Power Normal and then this past summer,
I did a tent talk outside about UFO debunkers, so
(05:37):
you know, we're not that far from fun Bush, so
we try to go every year. There are patterns that
we are beginning to see regarding drones. And since patterns
is something of a specialty for you, what are you seeing?
Speaker 2 (05:54):
Well, I can tell you this that it's not a
new phenomenon. I say, initially a little bit of it
right now is hysteria because now everyone is seeing drones
everywhere they look, so you have to have a certain
filter to read out you know, what might just be
actual airplanes that people are seeing and just people's imaginations
(06:17):
running away with them. But for people that don't really
follow this on a regular basis, like we do the
people in the UFO community, several years ago we had
the mysterious UFOs over Colorado that those drone swarms were
never solved. So this isn't new what's going on. It's
(06:38):
been happening for several years. And now what are the possibilities?
I mean, people have been photographing, videotaping them, So either
you can certainly rule out that it's not aliens at
this point all right, by any stretch of the imagination,
But the question is who do these objects belong to
(06:59):
and what did they do with So you know, there's
pretty much two answers. I guess one would be it's
either ours and we don't want to tell people, or
it's some foreign state doing whatever they're planning on doing.
So there's an overwhelming amount of evidence coming in now
(07:20):
and for you know, John Kirby, the Biden administrator spokesperson, saying, well,
we don't know what they are, but there's nothing to
worry about. It's sort of like one of the craziest
things I ever heard, like a in a presidential press conference.
They don't know what they are, but nothing to worry about.
And we heard this before last year with the Chinese balloon.
(07:44):
All right, so you got to you gotta figure out
what do they know. The Pentagon is denying that it's
it's ours, but you know that could be misinformation. And
then you have the senator from New Jersey I think
his name is Jeff Van Drew who is claiming it's
it's Iranian stuff out at sea, a mothership out at
(08:08):
sea launching these things. So you know, it's either ours
or it's theirs. That's that's my impression. A good friend
of mine at Move On, our media director Ron James,
positive a third theory and that maybe our government is
actually trying to see what our reaction would be to
UFOs to possibly prepare us for disclosure. So I thought
(08:31):
that was a very interesting take that Rod had.
Speaker 1 (08:34):
Yeah, I think that's interesting. Actually, Ron's going to be
on next week. I have a theory. Let me propose
it to you, and I'm sure you've heard it before.
Could it be that these are ours and what they're
trying to do is muddy the waters, obfuscate the UAP
discussion so that the media when they cover this, just
(08:57):
like they did with the Chinese balloon, it just becomes
because like you said, now we've had a hysteria pointed
that people are in they see in the sky, Oh,
it's a drone. It's a drone, and shift the psychology
away from taking UAP too seriously as something perhaps non human,
and now journalists local media can just go, oh, it's
(09:19):
probably just a drone, Just like the Chinese balloon. When
we're talking about the objects that we're seeing in Yukaton,
in Canada and in Alaska, the immedia assumption becomes oh,
it's probably a balloon just like that Chinese one they
shut down. That that's my guess if it's ours, and
what the kind of syops would be there.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
Well, I absolutely think that that's very, very plausible because
they think that people have short memories. Okay, so they
remember that nobody would have ever known about the Chinese
balloon unless that guy in montanas or flying by, and
then you know a problem for the administration. But you
have to wonder why the administration would ever let the
(10:04):
Chinese doing flyover all of our military installations, including NORAD,
go clear across the country then shoot it down, claiming
that it was for safety's sake that they waited till
it hit the ocean. And then on the eleventh, twelfth,
and thirteenth of February, I believe a week or two later,
they shot down three objects. The one ova the Yukon Forest,
(10:25):
the one up near Barrow, Alaska that interfered with the
pilot's cockpit instrumentation, and the one that I found the
most interesting of wool was the one they shot down
over Lake Uran that was an octagon shaped object, and
MUFAN actually investigated and found a tremendous amount of octagon
(10:47):
shaped objects after that, and he actually submitted a report
to I believe it was Kirstin Jilibrandt's office on all
of the octagons that we found, and then in all
three of those instances they gave up after a week
looking for those things.
Speaker 1 (11:03):
You found? What do you mean by that? What do
you mean in the case reports?
Speaker 2 (11:08):
Oh? Yeah, we found that there was a pattern with
octagon shaped objects over a number of years over the
United States and England, mostly near strategic military installations, including
special war ops in San Diego. And all of the
objects were the same size, approximately thirty to sixty feet
(11:30):
in diameter, all had orange, yellow and white lights on
the bottoms of them, and the press basically buried that
story all right after they shot down these things. It's
like they couldn't find these things in one hundred and
forty feet of water in Lake Huron, but they could
find the Titan submersible in twelve thousand feet of water
(11:54):
in a search field the size of Massachusetts. All right,
so they lie to you and hope it goes away.
So yes, So they trying to maybe desensitize us with
this round of drones. Yeah, that's totally possible.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
Yeah, that's a good word to desensitize us. But like,
for instance, this drone that was captured, this is alleged
to be a car sized roughly. I mean, and you know,
you know as an investigator, how hard it is to
kind of investigate estimate size when you don't have, you know,
another object nearby to ask to compare it to. So
(12:33):
do you think that these are actually car sized objects
that people are seeing?
Speaker 2 (12:37):
Our our state director in New Jersey, David Fritz, saw one.
He was in close range of it act and he
said that he thought it was the size of a desk,
a big desk. He said it was very loud, and
he thought it had five quad copter propellers to it.
But he's a seasoned field investigator, and if he says
(12:59):
that it's, you know, the size of the desk, I
would tend to think that he's accurate, and they're actually
if a person has a certain amount of distance acumen,
all right, maybe you can't see in the video some
sort of landmark, but the person could see and estimate
how far away the object he thought it might be.
(13:21):
There is a way that our photo analysts at Lufon
can actually take all of the pixels in the horizontal line,
isolate the pixels amounts of the object, and then they
do some trigonometry and they can actually come up with
a fairly good estimate of the size of an object.
So I do believe that some of these might be
(13:43):
big objects that you definitely do not buy at Walmart.
Speaker 1 (13:49):
So here's a map. I got this from the New
York Post. So these are some of the hotspots in
New Jersey. You know, Morris Counties. We've heard a lot
of them out of Morris County, hundred and Somerset. Wow,
it's it's amazing. In Monmouth County so a month county,
you know, you have Air Force military bases. Is there
(14:09):
is there a reason to believe that these are coordinated
around military instlutions because I don't see it necessarily a
pattern there.
Speaker 2 (14:18):
I do. In England, the military base, I tho at
the name of it something edge something it was. It
was a strategic base that had be fifty two bombers
that were capable of carrying like nuclear missiles. Also at
the same base with F thirty five's and F fifteen
fighter jets. So think about it. You have this, you know,
(14:39):
maybe twenty thousand dollars drone that can you know, blow
up a half a billion dollar airplane. That is a
lot of issues that the United States would have to
deal with. Okay. So when you look at the Morris
County of incursions, some of them were near Trump's properties.
And you know that the Iranians I've tried to infiltrate
(15:01):
the United States with that resurface to air missiles to
try to take down Trump's plane. According to the FBI
that there may be as many as five TEBRA cells
and five surface to air missiles, so it would seem
logical that you might see them near Trump's properties. Also
in Morris County you have Picatinny Arsenal, which is a
(15:22):
really really interesting place. All right. They have nukes stored there,
they have biological weapons and chemical weapon development. They test
out all sorts of ordinances. Okay. And what's interesting about
Picatinny also is that over the past decade there were
a series of high profile military suicides at the facility.
(15:47):
And move On actually has a report that in the
nineteen sixties, a general who's dating a woman that was
at Picatinny would get drunk and start crying talking about
that they had intact UFOs or in the basement of
Picatinny Arsenal. So Picatinny's interesting for any number of reasons.
(16:10):
What wasn't in your map down there is that there's
also a string of drone sightings going essentially from McGuire
Fort Dick's joint of base all the way over to
basically Philadelphia. Philadelphia. The Philadelphia corridor near the airport near
the Delaware River has always been a hot spot for
(16:30):
orbs and drone type objects. So they're all over the
place and the question is where are they coming from what?
And can you believe everybody that's seeing them? And my
answer to that is if you don't believe anybody else.
There was the Coastguard cutter off the coast of New
(16:50):
Jersey that was being trailed this week by fourteen objects.
So I don't think they're mistaken what they're seeing. I
don't think it's hystere on a coast cutter. So if
you believe one report only, yah, you have to believe
that one.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
Well, like you mentioned earlier, Jeff Andrew, you know, speculated
or he seemed very confident in his assertion that there
is a mothership from Iran. But then you had Deputy
Pentagon Press Secretary Sabrina Singh refute that, and she said
there's absolutely no evidence to support that, But then she
offered no answers. And there are local government leaders that
(17:33):
are getting upset. Right So in Pennsylvania, like you said,
the Bucks County area, we're getting more reports, and Brian
Fitzgerald said, quote, I am calling on our federal agencies
to immediately increase resources dedicated to investigating this escalating issue.
Transparent transparency is not optional, it is a necessity. This
(17:56):
is being taken very seriously by government officials, especially local
Why why can't the Biden administration at least say, do
we have tracked some of these things, or we have
some idea or some inclination. Why would they deny the
(18:17):
three thousand reports? I mean, that's obviously a lot of that.
Speaker 2 (18:20):
There's a lot of I could give you. I think
I can give you a good reason, the same way
they obfuscated the Chinese balloon shootdowns, do week after the
Chinese the other objects after the Chinese balloon shoot down
and hope that it will go away. They only have
thirty eight days left of their administration. I don't think
(18:40):
they care. I think they would prefer to just drop
it in the lap of the next presidential administration.
Speaker 1 (18:45):
Interesting, okay, so they're trying to kick the can as
far as they can. The holiday season is coming up
and about a week and a half, people are going
to be really distracted. Okay, just one more cade here.
Belleville Township Mayor Michael him said, this is interesting. They
operate in a coordinated manner. The lights are usually on
(19:07):
and they're blinking. When our helicopter, our state helicopter has
gotten close, lights go off and they go away. And
that that brings us to the other question. So you've
got people with cell phone cameras that are able to
capture these things. How are they able to do that?
And yet our helicopters or other deployed aircraft are unable
(19:31):
to catch up, track trail these things.
Speaker 2 (19:35):
Oh, because I think they are tracking them and trailing them,
all right. The Coast Guard cutter alone is the perfect
example that that they they you know, have seen these
things and have used you know, technology to track them.
It's it's it's interesting that when they know they're being watched,
these particular drones, they know how to go dark. Okay,
(19:56):
which shows a sophistication level that you'd never find it
Walmart or rate Yoshak, so you know. And then the
other statement that they made is that they have no
credible evidence of any sort of mothership along the Atlantic coast.
(20:16):
And that's a very very specific statement because they're not
saying that they could they couldn't be coming from somewhere else. Basically,
you know, they're coming from a warehouse somewhere, you know, or.
Speaker 1 (20:30):
Or could be something that's already in the Chesapeake Bay
or something.
Speaker 2 (20:34):
So they're not addressing the whole thing. And just to
go back to last year with the with the with
the octagons in Lake Uron, they called off the search
after a week in all three spots. I mean, Barol,
Alaska was on the tundra. I don't care if there's
a half foot of snow on top of the thing.
A couple of days later, the United States government can
(20:55):
find a needle in the middle of the Sahara Desert
if they wanted to, from ten miles up in space.
So they just lie, all right, And I've always believed that.
And the other interesting thing about the Lake Uron story
is right after that, two stories came out where they
suddenly found shipwrecks in Lake Uron that were over one
(21:18):
hundred years old. So if they weren't looking for something
on the bottom of Lake Uron in one hundred and
forty feet of water and not being able to find it, well,
they certainly found other shipwrecks. And you got to put
the two together that they never pulled off the search.
They were still looking for those objects well.
Speaker 1 (21:34):
And as far as the capabilities of tracking and detecting
the difference between objects that are submerged and or stationary
compared to these drones that can go dark and they're maneuverable,
it's got to be difficult, you know. It's kind of
like when people say, you know, like you got the
telescopes here that pointed towards the stars, and people say, well,
(21:58):
why can't you just zoom it on the moon. It's
not designed, you know, to focus that on that close.
So could it be an issue of that, or it's
like with the balloons where they were like, oh, we
didn't have the right filter on our flear or the like, right.
Speaker 2 (22:15):
No, red changed the parameters of what they look for
in disguise right after that. By the way, the perfect
example to answer that question is I believe they do
have the technology all right, And that would be because
maybe three or four years ago, Chris Mellon, the former
under Secretary of Defense under Trump, him out with a
(22:36):
report where he actually listed all of the assets that
the United States government has that can be used to
track UFOs, and it was an astonishing paper. So I
absolutely believe that the United States government does know what
these things are, at least some of them. Some of
its story is some of it people were taking pictures
(22:57):
of airplanes, but I heard one incident where it was
an airplane that wasn't actually moving. It was suspended in
the air, which I found interesting. But I haven't been
able to find that report again.
Speaker 1 (23:07):
But uh yeah, you might remember actually in the in
the nineties, there were some reports like that here in
the like the the New Jersey New York border area,
where people were reporting seeing what looked like planes. It
almost sounded like planes, but and we're not talking about parallax.
(23:27):
Apparently you know that it would, but it would just
kind of hover and but not a helicopter. It sounded
like a plane, looked like a plane, had the correct lights,
but it didn't move. Those were those were reports that
we've heard before, and that brings us to another speculative
theory that people have been putting out there is, are
these things maybe e t but they are purposely guised
(23:53):
as drones or otherwise.
Speaker 2 (23:57):
Uh just my opinion, but I would say no. But
I do like what ron said that maybe it's possibly
trying to gauge the public's reaction to see how they
might feel about actual ets arriving. So this may be
like a test run. I also suggested to Ronn the
(24:18):
other day, says, could we be seen like practice runs
for Project Blue Being? If Project Blue Being does exist,
the fake Allian invasion could just be some sort of
preparatory work to see how the public would react. My say, yeah,
anything's possible. I could tell you stuff. It's like, I
still don't think Starlink is for internet service, or at
(24:40):
least internet.
Speaker 1 (24:41):
So we have to go there. What's your What's okay?
Speaker 2 (24:46):
If you have a sort of deployed Starlink satellite and
there's now a network of them spanning the globe, they
look sort of like cylinders with the solar panel array. Okay,
almost like a vin blind opening up. So you picture
this oval shaped object that, when fully deployed with like
a big screen that sort of beveled. All right. If
(25:09):
you go back to Ronald Reagan's Star Wars program in
the early eighties, even earlier, one of varm Braun was
involved with it. Oppenheimer was involved with it, and they
had a design for satellite killing satellites and it was
called Operation Brilliant Pebbles. And all you've got to do
(25:33):
is do a Google search, photo search drawing search image
search for a fully deployed Starlink satellite and compare it
to the conceptual drawing for an Operation Brilliant Pebbles satellite,
and you can find that on Wikipedia. They're exactly the same.
And then when you see the actual dispersion map of
(25:54):
where the Project Brilliant Pebbles satellites was supposed to go,
it's identical to the Startlink dispersion around the globe. It's identical,
the satellites themselves identical, the dispersion patterns identical. It's a weapon.
Starlink is a weapon waiting to be used.
Speaker 1 (26:13):
That's a bold statement.
Speaker 2 (26:16):
Just look at the two pictures side by side and
you'll go wow.
Speaker 1 (26:19):
Yeah, yeah, Okay, here's another thing. Since we're on Starlink,
so Elon Musk, You know, when he does interviews and
people ask him about aliens or extraterrestrial Oh, I don't
see evidence for that. Blah blah blah blah blah. My
suspicion is one, as a businessman, you're getting government money
(26:40):
to explore space using conventional rocketry, So it would behoove
you to admit that there could be anti gravity technology.
Right even if he knew, even if he walked into
a UFO had seen one, you know, maybe you've been
on some special access program access and new about it,
(27:00):
it would he wouldn't release that because he can't make
money off of that.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
Sure, and he never does. He only says he doesn't
think there aliens. He has never seen any evidence of aliens.
But there's there's like several other theories about what UFOs
might be. So like, maybe he's just giving you the
most restrictive answer, and he does know something about what
they are and they're not alien. Maybe the time travelers
are into dimension or something, and he's not gonna he's
(27:27):
not gonna spill the beans on that one. Do you
know the story between the link between him and Werna
von Braun, No word of von Braun when he came
over in Operation paper Clip was working in Mexico on
a secret weapons program during Nicole War before him to
(27:47):
pass it, and he wrote a novel and it was
all about the colonization of Mars, okay, and in I
think it's chapter twenty eight, it's a very technical, boring.
I think it's like Project Mars or something that's called.
In chapter twenty eight he describes what the government of
(28:08):
Mars would be like when it's colonized, and the leader
of the Martian colony his title would be the elt Eln,
which means oak tree in Hebrew. And obviously Elon Musk
wants to colonize Mars. So this very interesting time travel
type thing going on there.
Speaker 1 (28:29):
Do you subscribe to the time traveling theory?
Speaker 2 (28:32):
That's my favorite one?
Speaker 1 (28:33):
Actually, yeah, yeah, you think? Do you think there is
more evidence for that?
Speaker 2 (28:38):
I definitely think. I've gone through the history of the
planet basically, and I can pull out dozens of incidences
where I think that there's been timeline interference on Earth,
sort of guiding us in a designer history type of way.
History is not random going forward. I definitely think somebody
is trying to manipulate it to go a certain way
(28:59):
more than one group. Actually, that's just my theories.
Speaker 1 (29:03):
I'm think of a James Joice kind of a way.
Speaker 2 (29:07):
Or oh god, I hope not Gravity's End by Gravity's
Rainbow by Thomas Finching. Oh no, that'd be too complic
that'd be the multiverse theory.
Speaker 1 (29:17):
Yeah, but I do want that. That fascinating. So if
they are, if there is time traveling, is it us?
Speaker 2 (29:27):
I believe it's us.
Speaker 1 (29:27):
Yes, Well what about their grandfather?
Speaker 2 (29:31):
Paradox though, well, you know, the question is when it's
the time travel machine built? All right? Is the professor
I can't think of his name. His father died when
he was young. He always want to go back in time,
So theoretically he's got the idea to build the time
machine Mickey Cruccio, I can pronounce his name. That we
(29:53):
already know how to do it. It's just it's just
a problem of building the technology. So the problem is
you can only go forward, at least the way we
know now, from the time the machine is built, and
then come back to the time the machine is built.
So that wouldn't explain all through history to time travel
unless sometime in the future we overcome all of these
(30:15):
paradox problems, or what I think is more likely is
that the time machine is built thousands and thousands of
years ago, and that's where maybe ellience might be involved.
Speaker 1 (30:24):
Okay, that's a whole other rabbit hole.
Speaker 2 (30:27):
We can I love rabbit holes, all right.
Speaker 1 (30:30):
We can save that for another day, for sure. I
do want to get back to this. So this was
just yesterday. You may have heard this. Kristin Gillibrand, go
New York, Chuck Schumer, Cory Booker, Andy Kim. He's the
Senate elect in New Jersey because the current senator is
stepping down to allow him to come in early. They
(30:51):
co signed a letter to the FBI, the Department of
Homeland Security, and the Federal Aviation Administration to demand investigation
and identification of these drones. So this, you know, this
is a bit odd, right, But the interesting thing is
(31:12):
that Schumer and Jilibrand really seem intent on revealing what
the UAP enigma is. So I wonder if they're looking
at this as somehow related to the UAP phenomena.
Speaker 2 (31:31):
I definitely think that that's that's a possibility. I think
that uthology's greatest congressional advocates would be Nancy Mace cursing
gilibrand Tim Burchette and Andre Carson the Congressman Richet, Mace
and Carson being the congress people, and Jilli Grea being
(31:55):
the Senator. She I think has her site zeroing in
on the with Terry that they're hiding stuff, and I
believe that's actually true. But it seems like when they
have these congressional hearings every couple of decades, it's like
they're starting from scratch and everyone forgets what happened twenty
years ago, and it's like it's just this revolving door
(32:15):
and we're not getting anywhere. There's got to be a
different approach. I don't know what it is, but you know,
I'm very proud of people like Jill Brandt and Mace
and they're Shed and Carson because they're really trying to
get to the bottom of it.
Speaker 1 (32:30):
Yeah, I mean, they tend to be a little bit
more out front, but I would guess that someone like
Chuck Schumer is doing more silent work behind the scenes,
you know, working the aisles. I mean, that's what they do.
I think that I might disagree a little bit with
the revolving door because there is a more frequency of
(32:55):
media attention on the subject than we've ever had, so
that's more consistent.
Speaker 2 (33:00):
And that's because the Internet, Yes, it can't hide stuff anymore.
It goes all over the place in the day, right.
Speaker 1 (33:07):
So it's easier to kind of string the narrative and
hold on to that narrative. I mean, every time there's
a report, they replay the gimbal, the go Fast video,
the Nimetz video over and over again, which just reminds
people of that thing that they've heard about years ago,
and that all ties together. So I think we are
(33:28):
in a really good place. Do you think that we
will actually get disclosure within our lifetime.
Speaker 2 (33:35):
I'm not optimistic, but I think that if we do
get this closure, it's going to be not from the
government at all. I think it's because it's going to
be because they can't hide it anymore. I think at
some point, when you when you look at all of
the reports that NUFON has, that Newfork has, the Nightcap chronology,
the historical ones, all of the appro reports from the past,
(34:00):
all of the thousands and thousands of books that have
been written, a Lottery Hatch database, the Kuthos chronology, at
some point AA is going to be able to crunch
all of that stuff, but I think sooner rather than later,
and it's going to be from the public private sector.
I think disclosure will come if it comes at well.
Speaker 1 (34:20):
So you think public use of AI can do the
heavy lifting there. I was gonna ask you about that
because in the last hearing with Jilli Brand and Kazlowsky,
he was talking about the director of a ARROW was
talking about a new reporting system through ARROW, and I
(34:40):
know that Arrow as at least intimated my understanding. There's
some there has been some conversation between like Muffon and
other organizations with ARROW. If they have their own reporting CMS,
then does that kind of separate all the reports or
(35:04):
are they gonna go and backlog past reports? Because the
problem we have now is some people might report to
move on and some people might report yes Fork and
and and so on, and are they going to aggregate
all of that information?
Speaker 2 (35:19):
You know? They this is what Apro and Moufon and
New Fork and Kufos tried to do decades ago and
it didn't work. So but we have all of that
historical data and even the Muffon's project, the Quarious Digital
Database has two terrorbytes by the time we're done of information. Uh,
(35:41):
the problem isn't the historical stuff, it's it's the current
stuff all of a sudden, it's it's just spreading out
to all different places where you can report things to
this the new pilot database, NASA wants things. There's the
private cooperation. Enigma Labs has has a database you move
on f U fork and right now nobody's talking to
(36:02):
each other. And I think it's because everyone wants it
to be proprietary. All right. Moufon at the press conference
after the confessional hearings that they did with Ron James,
Dave McDonald from MUFON and Damie Sheen from the Paradigm Institute,
I think he's the first hint that you may start
to see organizations working together again. All right. I don't
(36:26):
know if you're going to get Enigma a private corporation
because they've got their own values and goals, but you know,
on the public side, I think that, yeah, maybe maybe
things might start brightening up.
Speaker 1 (36:39):
I've heard, you know, very gossipy kind of things about
Enigma being like anti Moufon and trying to you know,
supplant it. Do you think there's any validity in that sentiment.
Speaker 2 (36:51):
Well, I don't think they're anti Moufon. I just think
their corporation doing what they they were put together to do.
And if you know, I don't think they're trying to
you know, do win move on. But I'm sure that
if they started getting all the reports and move on didn't,
it's not gonna it's not gonna make them unhappy, you
know what I mean. I just think it's a short thing.
Speaker 1 (37:11):
Although move on. You have boots on the ground investigators.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
That's something that nobody else has. We have seven hundred
field investigators. And the people will say, oh, we're an
amateur organization. We're not. We're a volunteer organization about seven
hundred field investigators. And if you saw the credentials of
some of these people, most of them have forensic backgrounds.
They're airline pilots, retired fighter jet pilots, retired homicide detectives,
(37:37):
photo analysts, lab technicians, statisticians, biology. I could go on,
all right, so we know what we're doing.
Speaker 1 (37:46):
Yeah, regarding the drones, who who should be tracking these?
If they are ours, if they are UF citizens of FAA, FCC,
where they where are they logged?
Speaker 2 (38:00):
Well? I can tell you right now that these drones
are flying illegally, all right, because there's the If you
ever saw the the the tests to become an FAA
licensed drone pilot, you'd know that there's different levels that
drones are allowed to fly at, depending on air space
if they need an airport. These drones are all over
(38:24):
the place there, way above the limit that they should
be altitude wise, So they're rogue. Okay, They're definitely not
legal drones whatever they are. So who would track them?
I think it's going to be a combination of federal,
state and local authorities, the FAA, ARROW or state police
(38:48):
in New Jersey, the FBI. I think it's going to
have to be all of the above in order to
track them.
Speaker 1 (38:57):
Of these drones that we're seeing, what percentage you I
think are legit mystery drones?
Speaker 2 (39:03):
Legit mystery drones because there's so many cases right now,
and if you take out the hysteria, my best, my guestimate,
i'd say that it's a real phenomenon. Probably less for
fifty percent, but I definitely think something very very interesting
is going on. I'd like to bring up one thing
(39:24):
that I before we go off the drone topic. Back
in on December ninth, twenty seventeen, the Muffon and Newfork
got over seventy six reports of lights in the sky
going across the continental United States, basically from South Carolina
all the way to California and up into Vancouver. And
(39:47):
what it turned out to be was a joint military
exercise designed to test using a blunt force to enter
a cont using CE seventeens and fighter jets, and this
is what people were seeing across the United States. Muffon
ended up writing like a thirty page report on this
(40:09):
because we got we did fourier requests, and we got
the radar data, and God bless his soulis to cease. Now,
Guy Glenn Schultz, who was big with the Stephenvill lights,
he had forty years of radar expertise, and he tore
these reports apart and basically approved that there was a
military exercise across the United States that night. But what
(40:32):
the radar data found was that under these C seventeens
were multiple objects traveling at slow speeds at sixty to
fifty miles an hour. Our conclusion back in twenty seventeen
was that they were using sea seventeens as motherships to
control drone swamps. So what we're seeing now isn't new,
(40:58):
all right? Why there may it's so obvious. If it
is a military exercises, be fuddling. And if it is ours.
My conclusion is that if they're being seen over military bases,
over reservoirs, over you know, strategic areas, maybe it's us
practicing if we had to go into another country and
(41:22):
take out their air fields and their reservoirs, and it
would make sense. And maybe in the near future the
government will come out and tell us what's going on,
but right now they can't.
Speaker 1 (41:33):
Would we be collaborating with our allies then in England
and Germany because there's drones there.
Speaker 2 (41:40):
Too, Yeah, And I think that maybe because things are
so compartmentalized, maybe in some of these cases, one part
of our military doesn't want the other part of our
military to know what they're doing. Okay, So we just
recently had the Coastguard cutter this week being monitored by
all of these drums. That was happening several years ago too,
(42:01):
those linking triangular drones that were reported over battleships. Maybe
one part of our government is testing another part of
our government just to see, you know, what they can
and cannot do operationally.
Speaker 1 (42:15):
And is there any chance that I wish there was
a lighter I can think of a lesser version of
false flag, because that's not what I mean. But it
is it possible that they want us psychologically, they meaning
whomever you know, black ops operations, want us to think
(42:37):
that it is China or it is Russia, to prime
us psychologically to think of them more adversarily.
Speaker 2 (42:46):
Yes, you know, and I don't want get into politics,
but you know, the Bide administration is very you know,
into giving stuff to Ukraine and poop. In turn is
escalating people saying NATO is you know, preparing for war,
and they bring them back the draft and the Scandinavian
countries and in the United Kingdom and in the United
(43:06):
States here they want to make if a draft ever
came back, women would have to be eligible for the draft.
So there's something going on that's sort of war monitoring.
And people may say, oh, it's you know, it's the
industrial military machine just looking to make money at the
cost of lives. But yes, I definitely think that that's
a possibility. I don't know if that will change with
(43:29):
the new administration. But right now I think everybody in
the United States is Iran and China as are competitors
at the very least, and adversaries at least militarily. Think
of just Taiwan. Right If they take over Taiwan and
they close the straight in between the major shipping channel
in the world and get control of all of the
(43:51):
you know, semiconductors that are manufacturing in China, we're sort
of screwed, all right. So I think that they want
us to general public to believe that I ran on
China or the enemy, And especially when when economies aren't
doing good or governments are failing, they want the people,
the citizens to look to an external enemy to take
(44:12):
the heat off the government itself.
Speaker 1 (44:15):
Well, that makes it interesting. Now I have to look
into the background of Jeff Andrew to see who his
donors are, because it makes me wonder. You know, he's
so very sure an adamant about it. It does it
did get this, I did get the sense of fear
mongering from him.
Speaker 2 (44:33):
Well, do you remember a couple of months back when
they got the I guess it was a year ago
Senator Kennedy when he came out of the Secret hearing,
he says people you should just lock your doors at night.
That was a very ominous thing to say. So I
don't know what they told him there or whether it
was just fear mongering, but that was the most curious
statement I heard anybody make, with Senator Kennedy's.
Speaker 1 (44:54):
As a chilling statement as well. If you are an investigator,
move on or otherwise, and you get a report and
it's most likely a drone or one of these mystery drones,
how do you purchase differently or don't you.
Speaker 2 (45:08):
Well, you know, I guess it comes down to whether
or not there's footage or photos of it as opposed
to nothing. We don't investigate UFOs. We investigate UFO reports
because it's usually we get the report long after the
UFO is gone. Okay. Where we can make tremendous strides
(45:29):
in identifying drones is when there's visuals. Because drones more
than likely a fly below radar or they don't have
a transponder that will show up on flight Radar twenty four,
So you have to go with the visual evidence. And
there's certain things that are specific to drones, and that's
their red and green lights. The green lights are almost
(45:52):
a lime color, a phosphorescent lime color when seen at
a distance, and the reds are almost a phosphorescent cherry
red as compared to an airplane. So there's a very
distinct light signature to drones. Also, in a lot of
these cases that we get with video footage, you'll see
different types of blinking patterns, and those blinking patterns are
(46:15):
significant because they're telling the operator on the ground you're
going out of range, the batteries draining. Okay, so yeah,
Marked Antonio, you know, markdi Antonia probably better. He's better
at this than probably anybody else in the world because
he's a drone fanatic himself. But he can tell you
exactly what each of those light patterns is. And when
(46:38):
we see them in video footage that people submit, we
almost know right away that it's a drunk. Also, people say, oh,
it's took off at tremendous speeds, and it's actually just
that the thing has the ability to maneuver in a
way that people perceive that it's doing these things, but
it's really only going forty miles an hour.
Speaker 1 (46:55):
Sure, yeah, yeah, I mean that's normal. What is the
What do you enjoy the most about volunteering for Moufon
and investigating UFO reports.
Speaker 2 (47:10):
They just I love Moufon all right. They have been
very very good to me. They have let me see
things that just nobody has seen before. And one of
my jobs at Moufon is with the Project a Queer's
Digital Library, getting out the information that was on paper
(47:31):
decades ago that has been scanned and digitized, and their
stuff that the public has never seen. Right now, the
Mars Project, part of the Project Queer's Library, we scanned
all of the paper reports from the sixties, seventies and
eighties that the public's never seen. So it's like it's
a whole another six thousand reports waiting out there, and
(47:54):
right now they're letting me and a team of five
other people scan and re that the Leonard Stringfield Diaries,
Leonard Stringfield being the consummate cresh retrieval guy from the
fifties to the nineties. When he died, he had sixty
five diaries typed over fifteen years by his private secretary,
(48:15):
totaling twelve thousand pages. And I'm telling you, some of
the stuff we're reading is beyond scary. And he had
a lot of sources in the CIA, and I just
want to I've been telling people this one story. The
people are named in the diary, so we have to
remove their names. And one of them was a CIA
bureau chief and he was begging Len Stringfield to not
(48:39):
release report. He goes, Len, if they're not afraid to
kill Kennedy, they won't be afraid to kill a CIA
bureau chief. That's how scared this guy was. All Right,
So we anticipate at the Newfound Symposium this coming in July,
that'll be in Covington, Kentucky, we're going to be dropping
some big bombshells at the symposium Saturday night, So I
(49:03):
think you want to stay tuned for that.
Speaker 1 (49:07):
That sounds interesting anybody that we know, no.
Speaker 2 (49:13):
I really can't tell you, but the US government if
you think they were hiding stuff from you now and
they've hiding stuff from you for a.
Speaker 1 (49:22):
Long time, Well, in the last symposium there was some
information about the meta material material. Yes, do you feel
like that was as groundbreaking as people expected it to be?
Speaker 2 (49:36):
Or I absolutely do. It is so brown groundbreaking that
Saturday night, along with the Stringfield diaries, we're going to
be doing Unknown Materials Part two, all right, And we'll
be giving an update on the Russian sample, and that's startling.
I'm going to be getting the report from our lab
(50:00):
uh probably within the next week or two, and I
already know what's in it, and it's it's the real deal.
And Ron James has even more bombshells he may or
may not tell you.
Speaker 1 (50:15):
I'll press him next week and see what we can get.
I'm sure he'll be pretty tight lived the David marl
the library that David Marler had just just worked on
and opened up. Did you coordinate the move on coordinate?
Speaker 2 (50:30):
No? No, we did not. And I do want to
give him credit because he just got that mythical lost
appro file cabinet. There apparently were three apro file cabinets.
One of them is in the public domain, I think,
thanks to people like Isaac Koy and the plus spawn
and the fellow who's scared that I can't remember his name,
(50:52):
phenomenal newspaper clippings collection. The second cabinet I believe is
permanently lost. But the third cabinet was taken by a
family put in their garage and then they refused to
do anything with it for like forty fifty years, and
people would offer them tens of thousands of dollars, and
(51:13):
somehow Marler got the cabinet last year. And the difference
between Marlar's collection and Rufan's digital library project to Purius
is that we're we're all digital. Everything he has is physical.
He's got the file cabinets full of stuff, he's got
(51:34):
you know, all sorts of crazy stuff in his in
his collection, but he's not digitized. And I hope at
some point him and whoever he's working with and getting
grant money from, they digitized that third file cabinet because
I can't wait to see it's in it.
Speaker 1 (51:49):
All right, let's get that digitized because it's a that's
a national treasure. And the fact that it survived as amazing. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (52:01):
I never I never thought we were ever gonna that
was ever gonna see the light of day. I'm so
happy about that. Kudos kudos to him.
Speaker 1 (52:08):
And you know, accidents happen, you know, and it's like,
just get it done before it's too late, because once
it's digitized, then then you're safe. You're gonna go. You
mentioned earlier time traveling, right, do you think that these
are also possibly extraterrestrials? E we're seeing.
Speaker 2 (52:27):
Yes, I believe anything's possible. I mean, if you take
I think that aliens are possible. I think the time
travelers are possible. I think into dimensional it's more and
more evidence to suggest that that might be going on.
The Solaurian theory, that we've got another civilization on Earth
slightly ahead of us, but hidden from us somehow, maybe
at the bottom of the ocean. I believe all of explausible.
(52:49):
I just favor because of what I've been finding the
time travel theory. I'm big into portals, and I have
a collection of portal report that would scare you of
triangles and stuff coming out of portals in the sky.
And I mean I'm going back, you know, five hundred
years reports of triangles coming out of what seemed to
(53:11):
be portals. And I could also tell you certain accounts
of ancient battles that changed the course of history, where
there may have been modern fighter jets taking out one
particular army to ensure that say a very very famous
(53:31):
religious person would be born.
Speaker 1 (53:34):
Okay, well, you know, as far as the extratrustural theory,
there is the you know, the Star investigators with Mouffon.
So we do take abduction seriously. We do take those
close contact reports seriously. It just seems odd to me
(53:55):
then that, based on the descriptions of contact ease, that
would be from the future, because you know, some of
these these entities that people see are quite strange, and
I don't think can always be explained as a future
human or human that's evolved in something that's just a
(54:16):
little bit different.
Speaker 2 (54:18):
Well, let's say it's us. Right, we know that the
CIA has the ability since the nineteen sixties to pretty
much mess with people's brains and what they see. That
they have the ability now to make an entire army
become lethargic or depressed, right, just based on sound waves
and stuff, and then got the Havanah thing going on.
(54:42):
So one of my theories is that perhaps what people
are seeing in their bedroom is what's actually going down.
That it's some sort of technology, it's some sort of
masked memories. Okay, but let's say that it is real. Okay,
Let's say there are little grays materialized on people's bedrooms.
A lot of times they eat their orbs and they
(55:03):
turn into these creatures. That's very interesting because it would
suggest that there's something into dimensional about it. Okay. The
other theory that I've heard from somebody I can't tell
you who is is that they may be plant based
and that in the future they may be some sort
of soulless biological drones where through genetic experimentation, you know,
(55:26):
plant and you know human hybrids were created to do
a certain job. If not by say, time traveling humans
are into dimensionals from somewhere, but actually by say, let's say,
told Nordics from you know, another planet, and they actually
work for the Nordics. What's interesting. One of the things
I always like to talk about is the difference between
(55:47):
drays and Nordics. All Right, humans and Nordics are basically humanoid.
All predatory animals have eyes facing forward, and sometimes the
toll Nordics aren't as nice as they seem. They can
beguiling and then a trick, all right, So could they
(56:07):
be apex predators? And the other interesting thing is that
with grays, their eyes are black and go around to the
side of their head. Think of the deer. A deer
is a prey, all right, So could the Nordics have
domesticated a type of gray like the way we would
(56:28):
we would domesticate the.
Speaker 1 (56:29):
Dog I hope not, because because that would mean there's
a superior predatory species behind the phenomena that's going on
in chat Alien Love says, well, what about future AI?
In what sense these these beings that people are seeing.
Speaker 2 (56:51):
That there's some sort of computer generated and like the matrix.
Speaker 1 (56:55):
Theory artificial intelligence, but in the future coming back or
time traveling?
Speaker 2 (57:02):
Well, sure, I mean, is the theory that aliens that
they were coming here the distance is so bas that
it wouldn't be some sort of biological entities and it'd
be some sort of machines or drones. All right, But
I think that the physicist Eric Davis has already written
papers basically saying that you know, if it takes if
(57:22):
the universe is forty seven billion light years wide, but
you're able to bend space and time with the right technology,
you could go from one end of the University of
Yodel like that. So why would you need drones to
be building galaxy by galaxy? If you could just get
here in two seconds from anywhere, then you would be
dealing I think with biological entities, either for a looking
(57:45):
for resources or like or just explorers. The curiosity of explorers.
Speaker 1 (57:51):
Bob if you can leave us with one thought, what
would it be?
Speaker 2 (57:57):
Grassroots Uthology is the way to go. If Grassroots youufology
dies and it's left up to Arrow and NASA and
private corporations. I don't think we're ever going to get
the answer. All right, You got to keep mof on,
You got to keep New Fork going even though we're
sort of competitives. You got to keep the Paradimond Institute
going because we'll lose everything if Grassroots goes down and dread.
(58:21):
And the best thing I ever did was to become
a field investigator. Some of the stories you will hear
can make your hand stand up, but the fun and
excitement of investigating UFL reports is one of the greatest
things I ever did. And New Fund is always looking
for field investigators and so just www dot moufon dot
(58:42):
com you can join. You can become a field investigator.
I guarantee you it would be the most exciting thing
you ever did.
Speaker 1 (58:49):
Yeah, I agree with you. One of the present. Thank
you so much for your insight, your breakdown, and Bob,
I hope that you'll come back to coffee and UFOs
I'm in the future. It'd be great to have you
on and I do want to say I agree with
you one percent. Earlier you'd mentioned something about amateurs you
(59:11):
move on being, you know, a volunteer organization. But you know,
I think the term of the amateur is okay because
there's all kinds of people that are interested in this subject.
And part of that grassroots is everyone on that spectrum
who cares about this subject and is interested in it.
So I think I encourage everybody. Bob that I lose you.
(59:34):
It looks like Bob froze. All right, Well that's it anyway, everyone,
thank you so much for joining. Hopefully we'll see Bob
in just in a minute when I sign off. Here,
as a friendly reminder, if you like this podcast, please
subscribe coming down below, share your thoughts. I'd really appreciate
any support that you can give because your actions really
(59:56):
are what make the channel grow and this podcast grow.
So wherever you listen to podcasts, please rate and you
share your thoughts and commentary. This podcast is rebroadcast on
the UNEX Network every Thursday night at eleven pm Pacific
time two am Eastern time Fridays. Until next time, everyone,
(01:00:21):
I will see you all on the flip side. It's
good to be in personally, and I wish more of
us would think of ourselves that way. I don't have
(01:00:41):
a problem with skeptics, it's debunkers that are on some
other level that I don't understand.
Speaker 2 (01:01:06):
Essentially, an inference of a change in local gravity, saucer
shaped craft and they're hovering over the water.
Speaker 1 (01:01:25):
Bluebook Special Report fourteen. The better the quality of the sighting,
the more likely to be unexplainable.
However you are and whenever you are, welcome back to
Coffee and UFO's. I'm Alan B. Smith, your most grateful host.
And tonight we have an esteemed guest that I'm really
excited to have on, Bob Spearing. He is the director
of international Investigations for Mofon organization, which I'm very proud
(00:35):
to be a field investigator for. Before we bring on Bob,
I do want to mention a few things. So the
new social media handles across the board go like this
blue Sky. You're at Coffee and UFOs on Threads and Instagram,
(00:55):
it is at Coffee and UFOs podcast, and now on
Facebook you can go to the Coffee and UFOs group,
join their share your comments and everything else that you
have to share regarding the UFO phenomena. Tonight, in particular,
we will be focusing on the UFOs the drones, so
(01:21):
they are unidentified, but we do know that they are drones.
The question is where are they coming from? Why do
we see this in New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Germany, England. And
this is not the first time we've seen a cluster
of drones in the sky before. In fact, a recent case,
(01:42):
my most recent case for move On, and someone did
report drones off of Long Island, so totally different location.
But we've also had drone reports in South Carolina, so
this is really really interesting. I think Bob is particularly
to discuss this, so very briefly, let me read you
(02:04):
his bio. Bob Spearing graduated from Fordham University in nineteen
eighty one with a BA in communications, with journalism, advertising,
public opinion, propaganda, and film production as major concentrations. Bob
retired from the Port Authority of New York and New
(02:25):
Jersey in twenty nineteen after thirty four years of service.
His many duties included being an FRA licensed rail traffic
controller and locomotive engineer. While in management, he was a
safety investigator and a contract administrator who prepared multi million
dollar budgets. He had three UFO sightings himself and it
(02:49):
was enough to capture his interest and research in the phenomena.
Bob joined the Mutual UFO Network MOFON in twenty fourteen
as a field investorator and is currently Director of International Investigations.
Bob has appeared in several episodes of the twenty nineteen
travel series UFOs The Lost Evidence as a photo analysist.
(03:11):
In February twenty twenty three Ancient Aliens episode on the
History Channel, he appeared as a Mufon field investigator. He
will be in a twenty twenty four Netflix documentary called
The UFO Game. I don't know if that came out yet,
but I haven't seen it if it has, and is
filming a segment for Ron James' movie sequel, An Accidental
(03:32):
Truth Next. Bob was Moufon's Field Investigator of the Year
in twenty eighteen and Volunteer of the Year in twenty
twenty three. Bob has long been involved with Mouffon's of
various special projects, including Project Aquarius Digital Library, Historical Reports
Archiving Project Very Important. I have used it in my
own research, the Pinebush, New York UFO Museum, and the
(03:56):
Moufon Members social network. He has had numerous article was
published in various UFO related magazines, including UFOE Newsletter, a
Muffon Newsletter, and he speaks at various UFO conventions around
North Caro America, specifically on patterns in UFO reports. And
he lives in Pennsylvania's Pocono Mountains with his wife and
twin boys. Bob, how are you welcome to coffee and
(04:19):
new folks.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
Hi, good to see Alan, How are you.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
I'm great, I'm I'm so happy to have you on,
particularly because what is going on in the news as
we speak. I do want to mention quickly that I
didn't know that you were involved in the pine Bush,
New York UFO Museum.
Speaker 2 (04:37):
Yeah. Muffon helped get it started probably four years ago now.
They had the pine Bush Festival every year. Muffan always
had a table at it. Yeah. The New York state
director for Muffon, Christoperno, got involved with pine Bush and
we provided an enormous amount of information for their exhibits
(04:58):
at the At the museum, it's i only a UFO museum.
It sort of gets into the Power Normal and ghost
type things too, but there's an entire room dedicated to
UFO sightings. And they did a really, really fantastic job
with the stuff that we gave them.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
Oh yeah, it looks great. I didn't realize how how
crucial it was that that move On was involved. I
know you guys had tables there for years. I actually
got to do a talk there when I titled the
Importance of the Power Normal and then this past summer,
I did a tent talk outside about UFO debunkers, so
(05:37):
you know, we're not that far from fun Bush, so
we try to go every year. There are patterns that
we are beginning to see regarding drones. And since patterns
is something of a specialty for you, what are you seeing?
Speaker 2 (05:54):
Well, I can tell you this that it's not a
new phenomenon. I say, initially a little bit of it
right now is hysteria because now everyone is seeing drones
everywhere they look, so you have to have a certain
filter to read out you know, what might just be
actual airplanes that people are seeing and just people's imaginations
(06:17):
running away with them. But for people that don't really
follow this on a regular basis, like we do the
people in the UFO community, several years ago we had
the mysterious UFOs over Colorado that those drone swarms were
never solved. So this isn't new what's going on. It's
(06:38):
been happening for several years. And now what are the possibilities?
I mean, people have been photographing, videotaping them, So either
you can certainly rule out that it's not aliens at
this point all right, by any stretch of the imagination,
But the question is who do these objects belong to
(06:59):
and what did they do with So you know, there's
pretty much two answers. I guess one would be it's
either ours and we don't want to tell people, or
it's some foreign state doing whatever they're planning on doing.
So there's an overwhelming amount of evidence coming in now
(07:20):
and for you know, John Kirby, the Biden administrator spokesperson, saying, well,
we don't know what they are, but there's nothing to
worry about. It's sort of like one of the craziest
things I ever heard, like a in a presidential press conference.
They don't know what they are, but nothing to worry about.
And we heard this before last year with the Chinese balloon.
(07:44):
All right, so you got to you gotta figure out
what do they know. The Pentagon is denying that it's
it's ours, but you know that could be misinformation. And
then you have the senator from New Jersey I think
his name is Jeff Van Drew who is claiming it's
it's Iranian stuff out at sea, a mothership out at
(08:08):
sea launching these things. So you know, it's either ours
or it's theirs. That's that's my impression. A good friend
of mine at Move On, our media director Ron James,
positive a third theory and that maybe our government is
actually trying to see what our reaction would be to
UFOs to possibly prepare us for disclosure. So I thought
(08:31):
that was a very interesting take that Rod had.
Speaker 1 (08:34):
Yeah, I think that's interesting. Actually, Ron's going to be
on next week. I have a theory. Let me propose
it to you, and I'm sure you've heard it before.
Could it be that these are ours and what they're
trying to do is muddy the waters, obfuscate the UAP
discussion so that the media when they cover this, just
(08:57):
like they did with the Chinese balloon, it just becomes
because like you said, now we've had a hysteria pointed
that people are in they see in the sky, Oh,
it's a drone. It's a drone, and shift the psychology
away from taking UAP too seriously as something perhaps non human,
and now journalists local media can just go, oh, it's
(09:19):
probably just a drone, Just like the Chinese balloon. When
we're talking about the objects that we're seeing in Yukaton,
in Canada and in Alaska, the immedia assumption becomes oh,
it's probably a balloon just like that Chinese one they
shut down. That that's my guess if it's ours, and
what the kind of syops would be there.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
Well, I absolutely think that that's very, very plausible because
they think that people have short memories. Okay, so they
remember that nobody would have ever known about the Chinese
balloon unless that guy in montanas or flying by, and
then you know a problem for the administration. But you
have to wonder why the administration would ever let the
(10:04):
Chinese doing flyover all of our military installations, including NORAD,
go clear across the country then shoot it down, claiming
that it was for safety's sake that they waited till
it hit the ocean. And then on the eleventh, twelfth,
and thirteenth of February, I believe a week or two later,
they shot down three objects. The one ova the Yukon Forest,
(10:25):
the one up near Barrow, Alaska that interfered with the
pilot's cockpit instrumentation, and the one that I found the
most interesting of wool was the one they shot down
over Lake Uran that was an octagon shaped object, and
MUFAN actually investigated and found a tremendous amount of octagon
(10:47):
shaped objects after that, and he actually submitted a report
to I believe it was Kirstin Jilibrandt's office on all
of the octagons that we found, and then in all
three of those instances they gave up after a week
looking for those things.
Speaker 1 (11:03):
You found? What do you mean by that? What do
you mean in the case reports?
Speaker 2 (11:08):
Oh? Yeah, we found that there was a pattern with
octagon shaped objects over a number of years over the
United States and England, mostly near strategic military installations, including
special war ops in San Diego. And all of the
objects were the same size, approximately thirty to sixty feet
(11:30):
in diameter, all had orange, yellow and white lights on
the bottoms of them, and the press basically buried that
story all right after they shot down these things. It's
like they couldn't find these things in one hundred and
forty feet of water in Lake Huron, but they could
find the Titan submersible in twelve thousand feet of water
(11:54):
in a search field the size of Massachusetts. All right,
so they lie to you and hope it goes away.
So yes, So they trying to maybe desensitize us with
this round of drones. Yeah, that's totally possible.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
Yeah, that's a good word to desensitize us. But like,
for instance, this drone that was captured, this is alleged
to be a car sized roughly. I mean, and you know,
you know as an investigator, how hard it is to
kind of investigate estimate size when you don't have, you know,
another object nearby to ask to compare it to. So
(12:33):
do you think that these are actually car sized objects
that people are seeing?
Speaker 2 (12:37):
Our our state director in New Jersey, David Fritz, saw one.
He was in close range of it act and he
said that he thought it was the size of a desk,
a big desk. He said it was very loud, and
he thought it had five quad copter propellers to it.
But he's a seasoned field investigator, and if he says
(12:59):
that it's, you know, the size of the desk, I
would tend to think that he's accurate, and they're actually
if a person has a certain amount of distance acumen,
all right, maybe you can't see in the video some
sort of landmark, but the person could see and estimate
how far away the object he thought it might be.
(13:21):
There is a way that our photo analysts at Lufon
can actually take all of the pixels in the horizontal line,
isolate the pixels amounts of the object, and then they
do some trigonometry and they can actually come up with
a fairly good estimate of the size of an object.
So I do believe that some of these might be
(13:43):
big objects that you definitely do not buy at Walmart.
Speaker 1 (13:49):
So here's a map. I got this from the New
York Post. So these are some of the hotspots in
New Jersey. You know, Morris Counties. We've heard a lot
of them out of Morris County, hundred and Somerset. Wow,
it's it's amazing. In Monmouth County so a month county,
you know, you have Air Force military bases. Is there
(14:09):
is there a reason to believe that these are coordinated
around military instlutions because I don't see it necessarily a
pattern there.
Speaker 2 (14:18):
I do. In England, the military base, I tho at
the name of it something edge something it was. It
was a strategic base that had be fifty two bombers
that were capable of carrying like nuclear missiles. Also at
the same base with F thirty five's and F fifteen
fighter jets. So think about it. You have this, you know,
(14:39):
maybe twenty thousand dollars drone that can you know, blow
up a half a billion dollar airplane. That is a
lot of issues that the United States would have to
deal with. Okay. So when you look at the Morris
County of incursions, some of them were near Trump's properties.
And you know that the Iranians I've tried to infiltrate
(15:01):
the United States with that resurface to air missiles to
try to take down Trump's plane. According to the FBI
that there may be as many as five TEBRA cells
and five surface to air missiles, so it would seem
logical that you might see them near Trump's properties. Also
in Morris County you have Picatinny Arsenal, which is a
(15:22):
really really interesting place. All right. They have nukes stored there,
they have biological weapons and chemical weapon development. They test
out all sorts of ordinances. Okay. And what's interesting about
Picatinny also is that over the past decade there were
a series of high profile military suicides at the facility.
(15:47):
And move On actually has a report that in the
nineteen sixties, a general who's dating a woman that was
at Picatinny would get drunk and start crying talking about
that they had intact UFOs or in the basement of
Picatinny Arsenal. So Picatinny's interesting for any number of reasons.
(16:10):
What wasn't in your map down there is that there's
also a string of drone sightings going essentially from McGuire
Fort Dick's joint of base all the way over to
basically Philadelphia. Philadelphia. The Philadelphia corridor near the airport near
the Delaware River has always been a hot spot for
(16:30):
orbs and drone type objects. So they're all over the
place and the question is where are they coming from what?
And can you believe everybody that's seeing them? And my
answer to that is if you don't believe anybody else.
There was the Coastguard cutter off the coast of New
(16:50):
Jersey that was being trailed this week by fourteen objects.
So I don't think they're mistaken what they're seeing. I
don't think it's hystere on a coast cutter. So if
you believe one report only, yah, you have to believe
that one.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
Well, like you mentioned earlier, Jeff Andrew, you know, speculated
or he seemed very confident in his assertion that there
is a mothership from Iran. But then you had Deputy
Pentagon Press Secretary Sabrina Singh refute that, and she said
there's absolutely no evidence to support that, But then she
offered no answers. And there are local government leaders that
(17:33):
are getting upset. Right So in Pennsylvania, like you said,
the Bucks County area, we're getting more reports, and Brian
Fitzgerald said, quote, I am calling on our federal agencies
to immediately increase resources dedicated to investigating this escalating issue.
Transparent transparency is not optional, it is a necessity. This
(17:56):
is being taken very seriously by government officials, especially local
Why why can't the Biden administration at least say, do
we have tracked some of these things, or we have
some idea or some inclination. Why would they deny the
(18:17):
three thousand reports? I mean, that's obviously a lot of that.
Speaker 2 (18:20):
There's a lot of I could give you. I think
I can give you a good reason, the same way
they obfuscated the Chinese balloon shootdowns, do week after the
Chinese the other objects after the Chinese balloon shoot down
and hope that it will go away. They only have
thirty eight days left of their administration. I don't think
(18:40):
they care. I think they would prefer to just drop
it in the lap of the next presidential administration.
Speaker 1 (18:45):
Interesting, okay, so they're trying to kick the can as
far as they can. The holiday season is coming up
and about a week and a half, people are going
to be really distracted. Okay, just one more cade here.
Belleville Township Mayor Michael him said, this is interesting. They
operate in a coordinated manner. The lights are usually on
(19:07):
and they're blinking. When our helicopter, our state helicopter has
gotten close, lights go off and they go away. And
that that brings us to the other question. So you've
got people with cell phone cameras that are able to
capture these things. How are they able to do that?
And yet our helicopters or other deployed aircraft are unable
(19:31):
to catch up, track trail these things.
Speaker 2 (19:35):
Oh, because I think they are tracking them and trailing them,
all right. The Coast Guard cutter alone is the perfect
example that that they they you know, have seen these
things and have used you know, technology to track them.
It's it's it's interesting that when they know they're being watched,
these particular drones, they know how to go dark. Okay,
(19:56):
which shows a sophistication level that you'd never find it
Walmart or rate Yoshak, so you know. And then the
other statement that they made is that they have no
credible evidence of any sort of mothership along the Atlantic coast.
(20:16):
And that's a very very specific statement because they're not
saying that they could they couldn't be coming from somewhere else. Basically,
you know, they're coming from a warehouse somewhere, you know, or.
Speaker 1 (20:30):
Or could be something that's already in the Chesapeake Bay
or something.
Speaker 2 (20:34):
So they're not addressing the whole thing. And just to
go back to last year with the with the with
the octagons in Lake Uron, they called off the search
after a week in all three spots. I mean, Barol,
Alaska was on the tundra. I don't care if there's
a half foot of snow on top of the thing.
A couple of days later, the United States government can
(20:55):
find a needle in the middle of the Sahara Desert
if they wanted to, from ten miles up in space.
So they just lie, all right, And I've always believed that.
And the other interesting thing about the Lake Uron story
is right after that, two stories came out where they
suddenly found shipwrecks in Lake Uron that were over one
(21:18):
hundred years old. So if they weren't looking for something
on the bottom of Lake Uron in one hundred and
forty feet of water and not being able to find it, well,
they certainly found other shipwrecks. And you got to put
the two together that they never pulled off the search.
They were still looking for those objects well.
Speaker 1 (21:34):
And as far as the capabilities of tracking and detecting
the difference between objects that are submerged and or stationary
compared to these drones that can go dark and they're maneuverable,
it's got to be difficult, you know. It's kind of
like when people say, you know, like you got the
telescopes here that pointed towards the stars, and people say, well,
(21:58):
why can't you just zoom it on the moon. It's
not designed, you know, to focus that on that close.
So could it be an issue of that, or it's
like with the balloons where they were like, oh, we
didn't have the right filter on our flear or the like, right.
Speaker 2 (22:15):
No, red changed the parameters of what they look for
in disguise right after that. By the way, the perfect
example to answer that question is I believe they do
have the technology all right, And that would be because
maybe three or four years ago, Chris Mellon, the former
under Secretary of Defense under Trump, him out with a
(22:36):
report where he actually listed all of the assets that
the United States government has that can be used to
track UFOs, and it was an astonishing paper. So I
absolutely believe that the United States government does know what
these things are, at least some of them. Some of
its story is some of it people were taking pictures
(22:57):
of airplanes, but I heard one incident where it was
an airplane that wasn't actually moving. It was suspended in
the air, which I found interesting. But I haven't been
able to find that report again.
Speaker 1 (23:07):
But uh yeah, you might remember actually in the in
the nineties, there were some reports like that here in
the like the the New Jersey New York border area,
where people were reporting seeing what looked like planes. It
almost sounded like planes, but and we're not talking about parallax.
(23:27):
Apparently you know that it would, but it would just
kind of hover and but not a helicopter. It sounded
like a plane, looked like a plane, had the correct lights,
but it didn't move. Those were those were reports that
we've heard before, and that brings us to another speculative
theory that people have been putting out there is, are
these things maybe e t but they are purposely guised
(23:53):
as drones or otherwise.
Speaker 2 (23:57):
Uh just my opinion, but I would say no. But
I do like what ron said that maybe it's possibly
trying to gauge the public's reaction to see how they
might feel about actual ets arriving. So this may be
like a test run. I also suggested to Ronn the
(24:18):
other day, says, could we be seen like practice runs
for Project Blue Being? If Project Blue Being does exist,
the fake Allian invasion could just be some sort of
preparatory work to see how the public would react. My say, yeah,
anything's possible. I could tell you stuff. It's like, I
still don't think Starlink is for internet service, or at
(24:40):
least internet.
Speaker 1 (24:41):
So we have to go there. What's your What's okay?
Speaker 2 (24:46):
If you have a sort of deployed Starlink satellite and
there's now a network of them spanning the globe, they
look sort of like cylinders with the solar panel array. Okay,
almost like a vin blind opening up. So you picture
this oval shaped object that, when fully deployed with like
a big screen that sort of beveled. All right. If
(25:09):
you go back to Ronald Reagan's Star Wars program in
the early eighties, even earlier, one of varm Braun was
involved with it. Oppenheimer was involved with it, and they
had a design for satellite killing satellites and it was
called Operation Brilliant Pebbles. And all you've got to do
(25:33):
is do a Google search, photo search drawing search image
search for a fully deployed Starlink satellite and compare it
to the conceptual drawing for an Operation Brilliant Pebbles satellite,
and you can find that on Wikipedia. They're exactly the same.
And then when you see the actual dispersion map of
(25:54):
where the Project Brilliant Pebbles satellites was supposed to go,
it's identical to the Startlink dispersion around the globe. It's identical,
the satellites themselves identical, the dispersion patterns identical. It's a weapon.
Starlink is a weapon waiting to be used.
Speaker 1 (26:13):
That's a bold statement.
Speaker 2 (26:16):
Just look at the two pictures side by side and
you'll go wow.
Speaker 1 (26:19):
Yeah, yeah, Okay, here's another thing. Since we're on Starlink,
so Elon Musk, You know, when he does interviews and
people ask him about aliens or extraterrestrial Oh, I don't
see evidence for that. Blah blah blah blah blah. My
suspicion is one, as a businessman, you're getting government money
(26:40):
to explore space using conventional rocketry, So it would behoove
you to admit that there could be anti gravity technology.
Right even if he knew, even if he walked into
a UFO had seen one, you know, maybe you've been
on some special access program access and new about it,
(27:00):
it would he wouldn't release that because he can't make
money off of that.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
Sure, and he never does. He only says he doesn't
think there aliens. He has never seen any evidence of aliens.
But there's there's like several other theories about what UFOs
might be. So like, maybe he's just giving you the
most restrictive answer, and he does know something about what
they are and they're not alien. Maybe the time travelers
are into dimension or something, and he's not gonna he's
(27:27):
not gonna spill the beans on that one. Do you
know the story between the link between him and Werna
von Braun, No word of von Braun when he came
over in Operation paper Clip was working in Mexico on
a secret weapons program during Nicole War before him to
(27:47):
pass it, and he wrote a novel and it was
all about the colonization of Mars, okay, and in I
think it's chapter twenty eight, it's a very technical, boring.
I think it's like Project Mars or something that's called.
In chapter twenty eight he describes what the government of
(28:08):
Mars would be like when it's colonized, and the leader
of the Martian colony his title would be the elt Eln,
which means oak tree in Hebrew. And obviously Elon Musk
wants to colonize Mars. So this very interesting time travel
type thing going on there.
Speaker 1 (28:29):
Do you subscribe to the time traveling theory?
Speaker 2 (28:32):
That's my favorite one?
Speaker 1 (28:33):
Actually, yeah, yeah, you think? Do you think there is
more evidence for that?
Speaker 2 (28:38):
I definitely think. I've gone through the history of the
planet basically, and I can pull out dozens of incidences
where I think that there's been timeline interference on Earth,
sort of guiding us in a designer history type of way.
History is not random going forward. I definitely think somebody
is trying to manipulate it to go a certain way
(28:59):
more than one group. Actually, that's just my theories.
Speaker 1 (29:03):
I'm think of a James Joice kind of a way.
Speaker 2 (29:07):
Or oh god, I hope not Gravity's End by Gravity's
Rainbow by Thomas Finching. Oh no, that'd be too complic
that'd be the multiverse theory.
Speaker 1 (29:17):
Yeah, but I do want that. That fascinating. So if
they are, if there is time traveling, is it us?
Speaker 2 (29:27):
I believe it's us.
Speaker 1 (29:27):
Yes, Well what about their grandfather?
Speaker 2 (29:31):
Paradox though, well, you know, the question is when it's
the time travel machine built? All right? Is the professor
I can't think of his name. His father died when
he was young. He always want to go back in time,
So theoretically he's got the idea to build the time
machine Mickey Cruccio, I can pronounce his name. That we
(29:53):
already know how to do it. It's just it's just
a problem of building the technology. So the problem is
you can only go forward, at least the way we
know now, from the time the machine is built, and
then come back to the time the machine is built.
So that wouldn't explain all through history to time travel
unless sometime in the future we overcome all of these
(30:15):
paradox problems, or what I think is more likely is
that the time machine is built thousands and thousands of
years ago, and that's where maybe ellience might be involved.
Speaker 1 (30:24):
Okay, that's a whole other rabbit hole.
Speaker 2 (30:27):
We can I love rabbit holes, all right.
Speaker 1 (30:30):
We can save that for another day, for sure. I
do want to get back to this. So this was
just yesterday. You may have heard this. Kristin Gillibrand, go
New York, Chuck Schumer, Cory Booker, Andy Kim. He's the
Senate elect in New Jersey because the current senator is
stepping down to allow him to come in early. They
(30:51):
co signed a letter to the FBI, the Department of
Homeland Security, and the Federal Aviation Administration to demand investigation
and identification of these drones. So this, you know, this
is a bit odd, right, But the interesting thing is
(31:12):
that Schumer and Jilibrand really seem intent on revealing what
the UAP enigma is. So I wonder if they're looking
at this as somehow related to the UAP phenomena.
Speaker 2 (31:31):
I definitely think that that's that's a possibility. I think
that uthology's greatest congressional advocates would be Nancy Mace cursing
gilibrand Tim Burchette and Andre Carson the Congressman Richet, Mace
and Carson being the congress people, and Jilli Grea being
(31:55):
the Senator. She I think has her site zeroing in
on the with Terry that they're hiding stuff, and I
believe that's actually true. But it seems like when they
have these congressional hearings every couple of decades, it's like
they're starting from scratch and everyone forgets what happened twenty
years ago, and it's like it's just this revolving door
(32:15):
and we're not getting anywhere. There's got to be a
different approach. I don't know what it is, but you know,
I'm very proud of people like Jill Brandt and Mace
and they're Shed and Carson because they're really trying to
get to the bottom of it.
Speaker 1 (32:30):
Yeah, I mean, they tend to be a little bit
more out front, but I would guess that someone like
Chuck Schumer is doing more silent work behind the scenes,
you know, working the aisles. I mean, that's what they do.
I think that I might disagree a little bit with
the revolving door because there is a more frequency of
(32:55):
media attention on the subject than we've ever had, so
that's more consistent.
Speaker 2 (33:00):
And that's because the Internet, Yes, it can't hide stuff anymore.
It goes all over the place in the day, right.
Speaker 1 (33:07):
So it's easier to kind of string the narrative and
hold on to that narrative. I mean, every time there's
a report, they replay the gimbal, the go Fast video,
the Nimetz video over and over again, which just reminds
people of that thing that they've heard about years ago,
and that all ties together. So I think we are
(33:28):
in a really good place. Do you think that we
will actually get disclosure within our lifetime.
Speaker 2 (33:35):
I'm not optimistic, but I think that if we do
get this closure, it's going to be not from the
government at all. I think it's because it's going to
be because they can't hide it anymore. I think at
some point, when you when you look at all of
the reports that NUFON has, that Newfork has, the Nightcap chronology,
the historical ones, all of the appro reports from the past,
(34:00):
all of the thousands and thousands of books that have
been written, a Lottery Hatch database, the Kuthos chronology, at
some point AA is going to be able to crunch
all of that stuff, but I think sooner rather than later,
and it's going to be from the public private sector.
I think disclosure will come if it comes at well.
Speaker 1 (34:20):
So you think public use of AI can do the
heavy lifting there. I was gonna ask you about that
because in the last hearing with Jilli Brand and Kazlowsky,
he was talking about the director of a ARROW was
talking about a new reporting system through ARROW, and I
(34:40):
know that Arrow as at least intimated my understanding. There's
some there has been some conversation between like Muffon and
other organizations with ARROW. If they have their own reporting CMS,
then does that kind of separate all the reports or
(35:04):
are they gonna go and backlog past reports? Because the
problem we have now is some people might report to
move on and some people might report yes Fork and
and and so on, and are they going to aggregate
all of that information?
Speaker 2 (35:19):
You know? They this is what Apro and Moufon and
New Fork and Kufos tried to do decades ago and
it didn't work. So but we have all of that
historical data and even the Muffon's project, the Quarious Digital
Database has two terrorbytes by the time we're done of information. Uh,
(35:41):
the problem isn't the historical stuff, it's it's the current
stuff all of a sudden, it's it's just spreading out
to all different places where you can report things to
this the new pilot database, NASA wants things. There's the
private cooperation. Enigma Labs has has a database you move
on f U fork and right now nobody's talking to
(36:02):
each other. And I think it's because everyone wants it
to be proprietary. All right. Moufon at the press conference
after the confessional hearings that they did with Ron James,
Dave McDonald from MUFON and Damie Sheen from the Paradigm Institute,
I think he's the first hint that you may start
to see organizations working together again. All right. I don't
(36:26):
know if you're going to get Enigma a private corporation
because they've got their own values and goals, but you know,
on the public side, I think that, yeah, maybe maybe
things might start brightening up.
Speaker 1 (36:39):
I've heard, you know, very gossipy kind of things about
Enigma being like anti Moufon and trying to you know,
supplant it. Do you think there's any validity in that sentiment.
Speaker 2 (36:51):
Well, I don't think they're anti Moufon. I just think
their corporation doing what they they were put together to do.
And if you know, I don't think they're trying to
you know, do win move on. But I'm sure that
if they started getting all the reports and move on didn't,
it's not gonna it's not gonna make them unhappy, you
know what I mean. I just think it's a short thing.
Speaker 1 (37:11):
Although move on. You have boots on the ground investigators.
Speaker 2 (37:14):
That's something that nobody else has. We have seven hundred
field investigators. And the people will say, oh, we're an
amateur organization. We're not. We're a volunteer organization about seven
hundred field investigators. And if you saw the credentials of
some of these people, most of them have forensic backgrounds.
They're airline pilots, retired fighter jet pilots, retired homicide detectives,
(37:37):
photo analysts, lab technicians, statisticians, biology. I could go on,
all right, so we know what we're doing.
Speaker 1 (37:46):
Yeah, regarding the drones, who who should be tracking these?
If they are ours, if they are UF citizens of FAA, FCC,
where they where are they logged?
Speaker 2 (38:00):
Well? I can tell you right now that these drones
are flying illegally, all right, because there's the If you
ever saw the the the tests to become an FAA
licensed drone pilot, you'd know that there's different levels that
drones are allowed to fly at, depending on air space
if they need an airport. These drones are all over
(38:24):
the place there, way above the limit that they should
be altitude wise, So they're rogue. Okay, They're definitely not
legal drones whatever they are. So who would track them?
I think it's going to be a combination of federal,
state and local authorities, the FAA, ARROW or state police
(38:48):
in New Jersey, the FBI. I think it's going to
have to be all of the above in order to
track them.
Speaker 1 (38:57):
Of these drones that we're seeing, what percentage you I
think are legit mystery drones?
Speaker 2 (39:03):
Legit mystery drones because there's so many cases right now,
and if you take out the hysteria, my best, my guestimate,
i'd say that it's a real phenomenon. Probably less for
fifty percent, but I definitely think something very very interesting
is going on. I'd like to bring up one thing
(39:24):
that I before we go off the drone topic. Back
in on December ninth, twenty seventeen, the Muffon and Newfork
got over seventy six reports of lights in the sky
going across the continental United States, basically from South Carolina
all the way to California and up into Vancouver. And
(39:47):
what it turned out to be was a joint military
exercise designed to test using a blunt force to enter
a cont using CE seventeens and fighter jets, and this
is what people were seeing across the United States. Muffon
ended up writing like a thirty page report on this
(40:09):
because we got we did fourier requests, and we got
the radar data, and God bless his soulis to cease. Now,
Guy Glenn Schultz, who was big with the Stephenvill lights,
he had forty years of radar expertise, and he tore
these reports apart and basically approved that there was a
military exercise across the United States that night. But what
(40:32):
the radar data found was that under these C seventeens
were multiple objects traveling at slow speeds at sixty to
fifty miles an hour. Our conclusion back in twenty seventeen
was that they were using sea seventeens as motherships to
control drone swamps. So what we're seeing now isn't new,
(40:58):
all right? Why there may it's so obvious. If it
is a military exercises, be fuddling. And if it is ours.
My conclusion is that if they're being seen over military bases,
over reservoirs, over you know, strategic areas, maybe it's us
practicing if we had to go into another country and
(41:22):
take out their air fields and their reservoirs, and it
would make sense. And maybe in the near future the
government will come out and tell us what's going on,
but right now they can't.
Speaker 1 (41:33):
Would we be collaborating with our allies then in England
and Germany because there's drones there.
Speaker 2 (41:40):
Too, Yeah, And I think that maybe because things are
so compartmentalized, maybe in some of these cases, one part
of our military doesn't want the other part of our
military to know what they're doing. Okay, So we just
recently had the Coastguard cutter this week being monitored by
all of these drums. That was happening several years ago too,
(42:01):
those linking triangular drones that were reported over battleships. Maybe
one part of our government is testing another part of
our government just to see, you know, what they can
and cannot do operationally.
Speaker 1 (42:15):
And is there any chance that I wish there was
a lighter I can think of a lesser version of
false flag, because that's not what I mean. But it
is it possible that they want us psychologically, they meaning
whomever you know, black ops operations, want us to think
(42:37):
that it is China or it is Russia, to prime
us psychologically to think of them more adversarily.
Speaker 2 (42:46):
Yes, you know, and I don't want get into politics,
but you know, the Bide administration is very you know,
into giving stuff to Ukraine and poop. In turn is
escalating people saying NATO is you know, preparing for war,
and they bring them back the draft and the Scandinavian
countries and in the United Kingdom and in the United
(43:06):
States here they want to make if a draft ever
came back, women would have to be eligible for the draft.
So there's something going on that's sort of war monitoring.
And people may say, oh, it's you know, it's the
industrial military machine just looking to make money at the
cost of lives. But yes, I definitely think that that's
a possibility. I don't know if that will change with
(43:29):
the new administration. But right now I think everybody in
the United States is Iran and China as are competitors
at the very least, and adversaries at least militarily. Think
of just Taiwan. Right If they take over Taiwan and
they close the straight in between the major shipping channel
in the world and get control of all of the
(43:51):
you know, semiconductors that are manufacturing in China, we're sort
of screwed, all right. So I think that they want
us to general public to believe that I ran on
China or the enemy, And especially when when economies aren't
doing good or governments are failing, they want the people,
the citizens to look to an external enemy to take
(44:12):
the heat off the government itself.
Speaker 1 (44:15):
Well, that makes it interesting. Now I have to look
into the background of Jeff Andrew to see who his
donors are, because it makes me wonder. You know, he's
so very sure an adamant about it. It does it
did get this, I did get the sense of fear
mongering from him.
Speaker 2 (44:33):
Well, do you remember a couple of months back when
they got the I guess it was a year ago
Senator Kennedy when he came out of the Secret hearing,
he says people you should just lock your doors at night.
That was a very ominous thing to say. So I
don't know what they told him there or whether it
was just fear mongering, but that was the most curious
statement I heard anybody make, with Senator Kennedy's.
Speaker 1 (44:54):
As a chilling statement as well. If you are an investigator,
move on or otherwise, and you get a report and
it's most likely a drone or one of these mystery drones,
how do you purchase differently or don't you.
Speaker 2 (45:08):
Well, you know, I guess it comes down to whether
or not there's footage or photos of it as opposed
to nothing. We don't investigate UFOs. We investigate UFO reports
because it's usually we get the report long after the
UFO is gone. Okay. Where we can make tremendous strides
(45:29):
in identifying drones is when there's visuals. Because drones more
than likely a fly below radar or they don't have
a transponder that will show up on flight Radar twenty four,
So you have to go with the visual evidence. And
there's certain things that are specific to drones, and that's
their red and green lights. The green lights are almost
(45:52):
a lime color, a phosphorescent lime color when seen at
a distance, and the reds are almost a phosphorescent cherry
red as compared to an airplane. So there's a very
distinct light signature to drones. Also, in a lot of
these cases that we get with video footage, you'll see
different types of blinking patterns, and those blinking patterns are
(46:15):
significant because they're telling the operator on the ground you're
going out of range, the batteries draining. Okay, so yeah,
Marked Antonio, you know, markdi Antonia probably better. He's better
at this than probably anybody else in the world because
he's a drone fanatic himself. But he can tell you
exactly what each of those light patterns is. And when
(46:38):
we see them in video footage that people submit, we
almost know right away that it's a drunk. Also, people say, oh,
it's took off at tremendous speeds, and it's actually just
that the thing has the ability to maneuver in a
way that people perceive that it's doing these things, but
it's really only going forty miles an hour.
Speaker 1 (46:55):
Sure, yeah, yeah, I mean that's normal. What is the
What do you enjoy the most about volunteering for Moufon
and investigating UFO reports.
Speaker 2 (47:10):
They just I love Moufon all right. They have been
very very good to me. They have let me see
things that just nobody has seen before. And one of
my jobs at Moufon is with the Project a Queer's
Digital Library, getting out the information that was on paper
(47:31):
decades ago that has been scanned and digitized, and their
stuff that the public has never seen. Right now, the
Mars Project, part of the Project Queer's Library, we scanned
all of the paper reports from the sixties, seventies and
eighties that the public's never seen. So it's like it's
a whole another six thousand reports waiting out there, and
(47:54):
right now they're letting me and a team of five
other people scan and re that the Leonard Stringfield Diaries,
Leonard Stringfield being the consummate cresh retrieval guy from the
fifties to the nineties. When he died, he had sixty
five diaries typed over fifteen years by his private secretary,
(48:15):
totaling twelve thousand pages. And I'm telling you, some of
the stuff we're reading is beyond scary. And he had
a lot of sources in the CIA, and I just
want to I've been telling people this one story. The
people are named in the diary, so we have to
remove their names. And one of them was a CIA
bureau chief and he was begging Len Stringfield to not
(48:39):
release report. He goes, Len, if they're not afraid to
kill Kennedy, they won't be afraid to kill a CIA
bureau chief. That's how scared this guy was. All Right,
So we anticipate at the Newfound Symposium this coming in July,
that'll be in Covington, Kentucky, we're going to be dropping
some big bombshells at the symposium Saturday night, So I
(49:03):
think you want to stay tuned for that.
Speaker 1 (49:07):
That sounds interesting anybody that we know, no.
Speaker 2 (49:13):
I really can't tell you, but the US government if
you think they were hiding stuff from you now and
they've hiding stuff from you for a.
Speaker 1 (49:22):
Long time, Well, in the last symposium there was some
information about the meta material material. Yes, do you feel
like that was as groundbreaking as people expected it to be?
Speaker 2 (49:36):
Or I absolutely do. It is so brown groundbreaking that
Saturday night, along with the Stringfield diaries, we're going to
be doing Unknown Materials Part two, all right, And we'll
be giving an update on the Russian sample, and that's startling.
I'm going to be getting the report from our lab
(50:00):
uh probably within the next week or two, and I
already know what's in it, and it's it's the real deal.
And Ron James has even more bombshells he may or
may not tell you.
Speaker 1 (50:15):
I'll press him next week and see what we can get.
I'm sure he'll be pretty tight lived the David marl
the library that David Marler had just just worked on
and opened up. Did you coordinate the move on coordinate?
Speaker 2 (50:30):
No? No, we did not. And I do want to
give him credit because he just got that mythical lost
appro file cabinet. There apparently were three apro file cabinets.
One of them is in the public domain, I think,
thanks to people like Isaac Koy and the plus spawn
and the fellow who's scared that I can't remember his name,
(50:52):
phenomenal newspaper clippings collection. The second cabinet I believe is
permanently lost. But the third cabinet was taken by a
family put in their garage and then they refused to
do anything with it for like forty fifty years, and
people would offer them tens of thousands of dollars, and
(51:13):
somehow Marler got the cabinet last year. And the difference
between Marlar's collection and Rufan's digital library project to Purius
is that we're we're all digital. Everything he has is physical.
He's got the file cabinets full of stuff, he's got
(51:34):
you know, all sorts of crazy stuff in his in
his collection, but he's not digitized. And I hope at
some point him and whoever he's working with and getting
grant money from, they digitized that third file cabinet because
I can't wait to see it's in it.
Speaker 1 (51:49):
All right, let's get that digitized because it's a that's
a national treasure. And the fact that it survived as amazing. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (52:01):
I never I never thought we were ever gonna that
was ever gonna see the light of day. I'm so
happy about that. Kudos kudos to him.
Speaker 1 (52:08):
And you know, accidents happen, you know, and it's like,
just get it done before it's too late, because once
it's digitized, then then you're safe. You're gonna go. You
mentioned earlier time traveling, right, do you think that these
are also possibly extraterrestrials? E we're seeing.
Speaker 2 (52:27):
Yes, I believe anything's possible. I mean, if you take
I think that aliens are possible. I think the time
travelers are possible. I think into dimensional it's more and
more evidence to suggest that that might be going on.
The Solaurian theory, that we've got another civilization on Earth
slightly ahead of us, but hidden from us somehow, maybe
at the bottom of the ocean. I believe all of explausible.
(52:49):
I just favor because of what I've been finding the
time travel theory. I'm big into portals, and I have
a collection of portal report that would scare you of
triangles and stuff coming out of portals in the sky.
And I mean I'm going back, you know, five hundred
years reports of triangles coming out of what seemed to
(53:11):
be portals. And I could also tell you certain accounts
of ancient battles that changed the course of history, where
there may have been modern fighter jets taking out one
particular army to ensure that say a very very famous
(53:31):
religious person would be born.
Speaker 1 (53:34):
Okay, well, you know, as far as the extratrustural theory,
there is the you know, the Star investigators with Mouffon.
So we do take abduction seriously. We do take those
close contact reports seriously. It just seems odd to me
(53:55):
then that, based on the descriptions of contact ease, that
would be from the future, because you know, some of
these these entities that people see are quite strange, and
I don't think can always be explained as a future
human or human that's evolved in something that's just a
(54:16):
little bit different.
Speaker 2 (54:18):
Well, let's say it's us. Right, we know that the
CIA has the ability since the nineteen sixties to pretty
much mess with people's brains and what they see. That
they have the ability now to make an entire army
become lethargic or depressed, right, just based on sound waves
and stuff, and then got the Havanah thing going on.
(54:42):
So one of my theories is that perhaps what people
are seeing in their bedroom is what's actually going down.
That it's some sort of technology, it's some sort of
masked memories. Okay, but let's say that it is real. Okay,
Let's say there are little grays materialized on people's bedrooms.
A lot of times they eat their orbs and they
(55:03):
turn into these creatures. That's very interesting because it would
suggest that there's something into dimensional about it. Okay. The
other theory that I've heard from somebody I can't tell
you who is is that they may be plant based
and that in the future they may be some sort
of soulless biological drones where through genetic experimentation, you know,
(55:26):
plant and you know human hybrids were created to do
a certain job. If not by say, time traveling humans
are into dimensionals from somewhere, but actually by say, let's say,
told Nordics from you know, another planet, and they actually
work for the Nordics. What's interesting. One of the things
I always like to talk about is the difference between
(55:47):
drays and Nordics. All Right, humans and Nordics are basically humanoid.
All predatory animals have eyes facing forward, and sometimes the
toll Nordics aren't as nice as they seem. They can
beguiling and then a trick, all right, So could they
(56:07):
be apex predators? And the other interesting thing is that
with grays, their eyes are black and go around to the
side of their head. Think of the deer. A deer
is a prey, all right, So could the Nordics have
domesticated a type of gray like the way we would
(56:28):
we would domesticate the.
Speaker 1 (56:29):
Dog I hope not, because because that would mean there's
a superior predatory species behind the phenomena that's going on
in chat Alien Love says, well, what about future AI?
In what sense these these beings that people are seeing.
Speaker 2 (56:51):
That there's some sort of computer generated and like the matrix.
Speaker 1 (56:55):
Theory artificial intelligence, but in the future coming back or
time traveling?
Speaker 2 (57:02):
Well, sure, I mean, is the theory that aliens that
they were coming here the distance is so bas that
it wouldn't be some sort of biological entities and it'd
be some sort of machines or drones. All right, But
I think that the physicist Eric Davis has already written
papers basically saying that you know, if it takes if
(57:22):
the universe is forty seven billion light years wide, but
you're able to bend space and time with the right technology,
you could go from one end of the University of
Yodel like that. So why would you need drones to
be building galaxy by galaxy? If you could just get
here in two seconds from anywhere, then you would be
dealing I think with biological entities, either for a looking
(57:45):
for resources or like or just explorers. The curiosity of explorers.
Speaker 1 (57:51):
Bob if you can leave us with one thought, what
would it be?
Speaker 2 (57:57):
Grassroots Uthology is the way to go. If Grassroots youufology
dies and it's left up to Arrow and NASA and
private corporations. I don't think we're ever going to get
the answer. All right, You got to keep mof on,
You got to keep New Fork going even though we're
sort of competitives. You got to keep the Paradimond Institute
going because we'll lose everything if Grassroots goes down and dread.
(58:21):
And the best thing I ever did was to become
a field investigator. Some of the stories you will hear
can make your hand stand up, but the fun and
excitement of investigating UFL reports is one of the greatest
things I ever did. And New Fund is always looking
for field investigators and so just www dot moufon dot
(58:42):
com you can join. You can become a field investigator.
I guarantee you it would be the most exciting thing
you ever did.
Speaker 1 (58:49):
Yeah, I agree with you. One of the present. Thank
you so much for your insight, your breakdown, and Bob,
I hope that you'll come back to coffee and UFOs
I'm in the future. It'd be great to have you
on and I do want to say I agree with
you one percent. Earlier you'd mentioned something about amateurs you
(59:11):
move on being, you know, a volunteer organization. But you know,
I think the term of the amateur is okay because
there's all kinds of people that are interested in this subject.
And part of that grassroots is everyone on that spectrum
who cares about this subject and is interested in it.
So I think I encourage everybody. Bob that I lose you.
(59:34):
It looks like Bob froze. All right, Well that's it anyway, everyone,
thank you so much for joining. Hopefully we'll see Bob
in just in a minute when I sign off. Here,
as a friendly reminder, if you like this podcast, please
subscribe coming down below, share your thoughts. I'd really appreciate
any support that you can give because your actions really
(59:56):
are what make the channel grow and this podcast grow.
So wherever you listen to podcasts, please rate and you
share your thoughts and commentary. This podcast is rebroadcast on
the UNEX Network every Thursday night at eleven pm Pacific
time two am Eastern time Fridays. Until next time, everyone,
(01:00:21):
I will see you all on the flip side. It's
good to be in personally, and I wish more of
us would think of ourselves that way. I don't have
(01:00:41):
a problem with skeptics, it's debunkers that are on some
other level that I don't understand.
Speaker 2 (01:01:06):
Essentially, an inference of a change in local gravity, saucer
shaped craft and they're hovering over the water.
Speaker 1 (01:01:25):
Bluebook Special Report fourteen. The better the quality of the sighting,
the more likely to be unexplainable.
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