December 23, 2024 • 50 mins
After garnering attention from her debut 'Same Trailer Different Park', the small-town-Texan continued her observationalist approach to song writing with Pageant Material. It was certainly a new challenge for both Blake and Jake, as the album leans country and it isn't exactly the 2000s emo we're all used to, but there are a lot of familiar connections to be found when digging around Kacey's upbringing, her mid-teen fashion choices and even her musical inspirations. It's one of our favourite episodes yet, and we hope you enjoy it!
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While you're there say hello to @BlakeMurphyODC and @JGoldsbie.If merch is your thing, be sure to check out the store: http://bit.ly/chpmerchOr reach out to the show and say hey: podcast@columbiahouseparty.com
If you enjoyed today’s show, please rate Columbia House Party 5-Stars on Apple Podcasts.
See you next week for another episode of CHP.
Sick of hearing all the ads? Subscribe to Soda Premium on Apple Podcasts to get rid of them!Follow @ColumbiaHP on X!
While you're there say hello to @BlakeMurphyODC and @JGoldsbie.If merch is your thing, be sure to check out the store: http://bit.ly/chpmerchOr reach out to the show and say hey: podcast@columbiahouseparty.com
If you enjoyed today’s show, please rate Columbia House Party 5-Stars on Apple Podcasts.
See you next week for another episode of CHP.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
It's high time to slow my role. Let the grass
just go lean way back. Turn on an episode of
Columbia House Party. Jake, what's going on?
Speaker 2 (00:34):
I like that you couldn't help but have a little
bit of twang in there.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
Man, I'm from small town, Ontario. A little bit of
a emmy that drumbo accent.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
Yeah, that's fair. I mean, I don't know what that is,
but it's not.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
A thing that exists. Okay, it's really hard to talk
about Casey Musgraves with a little twang.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
You know, that's fair. Moha moha.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
We're going to be talking about an album that is
not her most popular album, certainly not the album that
brought her to the foremost of our music. It's kind
of a transition album as you start to see where
Casey Musgraves is going to go as an artist and
where she begins to veer from the genre that she
came up in through that lens. It's very interesting, and
(01:12):
because what's most interesting about this album is that it
is a transition to where Casey Musgraves eventually ends up.
We're going to talk a little bit more around the
album than about this specific album than we normally would,
but we also found in researching for it and going
back to this album, there are some interesting discussions to
be had about country as a genre that's pretty siloed
(01:32):
off from everything else, about the little bits of country
and emo overlap that Casey has kind of jokingly made
a part of her personality and her brand appeal, but
also is really legitimate. And we're going to talk about
Pageant Material as well, because Pageant Material itself is a
pretty good album. Jake, you, I don't think you agree
to the extent that I do, but I have like
(01:53):
a little bit more time for country music.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
Then I'm actually a huge like I don't like the term,
but it is the name of the genre, so it's
I'm a huge alt country guy. Like Sturgle, Sturgio, drive
by Truckle, Sturgle drive by Trucker.
Speaker 1 (02:05):
We're on a It's it's a lot of episodes.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
But yeah, like dry By Trucker is old ninety seven,
Sturgil Simpson, Jason isbel the High Women like Wilco. Like
I love alt country. It's one of my favorite A
lot of my favorite bands come out of country. I
am not a for lack of better term, mainstream country fan, which.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
I think is fair. So for me. I talked a
lot in this podcast about how in high school all
my friends were into hip hop and I was kind
of the other as someone who listened to emo and
punk stuff. As my friends have gotten older, being smaller
town on Taria guys, their tastes have mostly shifted toward country.
Even like in university age, I would go to visit
friends at in St. Catharine's and it was always the
(02:46):
country bar and it was always country music playing. And
then when I played like fairly competitive slow pitch, it
was always the country bars on the road and it
was always country music playing. And that kind of carried
over to where, you know, in my mid to early
to mid twenties, I was like, I really don't like country,
Like I'm over here. Everyone else likes country. It's different.
And then slowly over time, like you know, you go
(03:08):
camping enough times, you play in enough softball tournaments, and
you have enough beers in your hand in the summer,
and just like that energy kind of grew on me
a little bit.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
Yeah, I get that. I completely understand that, and I
don't think there's anything wrong with it. That being said,
the idea of going to something like Boots and Hearts
makes me want to jump off the bag.
Speaker 1 (03:26):
That's fine. I could do standalone country concerts, yeah, oh yeah, yeah,
for sure. I will say also that having just laid
that out and explained it, I think that you could
do that for any type of music. And if the
vibe is consistently right and it's tied to nice summary
things and things you enjoy doing, like you could. I'm sure.
Had I had control of the ox Court and just
played Slip not and disturbed all those times, my friends
(03:49):
would be like, oh yeah, Like, as long as I
have a beer in my hand and it's nice and
summary out, I love Slip.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
I mean you and I were outdoors in the summer
drinking many beers watching blinkoy Ay two and we had
a great time. So it it works exactly.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
We're gonna talk about a pretty country album by both
of our standards. That is pageant material from Casey Muskers.
Speaker 2 (04:07):
It's hard.
Speaker 3 (04:12):
Time.
Speaker 4 (04:14):
Just sloan Morrow, let the grass just grow and clean
way back.
Speaker 3 (04:23):
It's a fun time to let it all though.
Speaker 4 (04:33):
I've been too so time time the bits and marots.
I'm getting rid of the flash. Nobody needs the thousand
nos suit, just to take out the trash and gotta bed.
(05:02):
I'm going to turn off the phone, start catching up
with the people.
Speaker 3 (05:10):
Me.
Speaker 5 (05:11):
It's hot to slow mo, let the grass just prove be.
Speaker 3 (05:27):
It is a fun.
Speaker 4 (05:34):
To let it all happen to Loo.
Speaker 3 (05:38):
So it's hot.
Speaker 4 (05:42):
I'm going to let it all go happen too Lo.
So it's hot time.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
It's just so difficult we usually do. She's gad she is.
I like Casey Muskers.
Speaker 1 (05:57):
I just She's Golden Hour was my find an album
of the decade.
Speaker 2 (06:01):
I find it. I find this album more interesting than
I like it, if that makes sense.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
Yeah, again the transition that she's going through here, take
us through it, man.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
All right. Casey Musgraves was born on August twenty first, nineteen.
We're going way back. I just found interesting that she's
I'm like thirteen days older than her, which is really depressing.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
No offense. One of you is aging more gracefully than
the other.
Speaker 2 (06:22):
Absolutely true, also more successfully. She was born in Golden, Texas.
She began songwriting at the age of eight, and then
she wrote a song called notice Me for her elementary
school graduation. She first began learning the mandolin and started
taking guitar lessons at twelve, and she calls this one
of the most important things that has ever happened to her.
She began singing at local music festivals in and around Texas.
(06:43):
Along with Alena Tatum. She was part of a country
music duo called Texas Two Bits, which toured throughout Texas
and released an independent album in the year two thousand.
She then earned an invitation to George W. Bush's Black
Time Boots Inaugura Ball, which is super gross. At fourteen,
her family funded her first solo, self released album, and
then when she graduated high school at eighteen, she moved
to Austin, Texas because that's where all the cool stuff is.
(07:05):
She was discovered professionally in two thousand and eight in
Austin by producer Monte Robinson from the independent label Triple Pop.
She released two covers for the label, one of Miley
cyrus to See You Again and the other of One
Republic's Apologize And this is the first time of many
that we're going to come up with that. I was
completely blinded to how successful country music can be, or
at least not blind how success can be. How just
(07:27):
like unaware of it, I am her cover of one
Republics Apologize hit number twenty three on the Billboard Singles Chart.
It has been streamed over thirty one million times on Spotify,
which probably earned her like eight bucks. In Marchy eighteen,
Triple Pop released the Acoustic Remixed EP, which featured newly
remixed and digitally remastered versions of these original recordings. In
(07:49):
twenty twelve, she sort of took off when she opened
for Lady Antebellum on their tour. She released her solo
debut single, Merry Go Round, which is sadly not a
Replacements cover, but it sounds like this.
Speaker 4 (08:00):
You ain't got two kids by twenty one, you're probably
gona dilone is. That's what tradition told you, And it
don't matter if you don't believe. Comes Sunday morning, Usb
there in the front row like you're supposed to, same
(08:24):
hurt and every heart, same trailer.
Speaker 3 (08:30):
Different part.
Speaker 4 (08:33):
Mama's Updom, Mary, Kay, Brother's Updom, Mary, Jane, Guy's up,
Tom married to doors down, marry and married wuckin trail
we get boards, so we get married just like us.
We settle in this sound on this brook and Mary
(08:58):
go round around. He goes where he stop nobody knows
and it ain't slow.
Speaker 6 (09:06):
And now it's Mary go around, Marry Mary quackin trary.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
We're so bored until we're buried.
Speaker 3 (09:26):
Just liked us.
Speaker 6 (09:27):
We settle in this town.
Speaker 4 (09:31):
On this broken Mary go man, Mary go around. Jack
and Jill went up the hill. Jack burned out on
booze and pills and Mary had a little and Mary
(09:54):
just don't give a damn.
Speaker 7 (09:56):
No.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
It's a great opening there.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
It's a very wonder Yeah it is. We'll get into
this mora. But I think people have stereotypes of what
country music is lyrically, and one of the most interesting
things about Casey's career path is how she's like bumped
up against like should this be the standard? Should we
lean into this?
Speaker 2 (10:12):
Yeah? And I don't want to skip to for ourhead,
but yes, I agree with you.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
That is I'm twenty six. All the people I graduated with, yeah, jobs,
I've just it's just people.
Speaker 2 (10:22):
That's just a music industry sound. She released her debut album,
Same Trailer, Different Park, Great Name on March nineteen, twenty thirteen.
The album debuted at number two, selling forty two thousand
copies in its first week. It produced the single follow
Your Arrow, which Rolling Stone named the thirty ninth greatest
country song of all time, and in that they said
that Casey musk Graves is one of the loudest symbols
(10:43):
of young country musicians with progressive values, which is a
thing I have always liked about Casey Muskraves, and the
fact that she very loudly proclaims her progressive views on
things which I think we took for granted in like
the indie hipster world, where it's just like expected almost
that you're probably left wing and progressive, but in country,
very much not. I definitely was surprised when she turned
(11:05):
up as a guest judge on RuPaul's Drag Race a
couple of years back. Same Trailer, Different Park was nominated
for four Country Music Awards in twenty twelve, including Female
Vocalists of the Year. It was also nominated for four Grammys,
including Best New Artist or She was I guess for
Best New Artists, Best Country Album, and Best Country Song
for Mama's Broken Heart and for Maria Go Round Marry
(11:25):
Go Round one Best Song at the Grammys, and the
album one Best Country Album, again extremely successful, completely out
of my view or sphere. She albed for Katie Perry
on her world tour in twenty thirteen, and did a
tour with Willie Nelson and Alison Kraus, which actually sounds
like it would be a really really good show. Cool,
same trailer, different park, one album of the Year from
(11:45):
the Academy of Country Music, and further to her sort
of left wing progressive things that I just found this
really interesting. In twenty thirteen, she was named the twenty
thirteen Spirit Day Ambassador by GLAD and has become the
first country music artist to perform at the GLAD Awards,
which makes sense that there aren't a lot of country
music performers at those awards, but I thought that was interesting. So,
(12:07):
after all, this success brought her to recording pageant material
we're talking about today. It was recorded live in Nashville's
(12:30):
historic RCA Studio. A previous record ease which is a
word I made up, include The Beach Boys, Tony Bennett,
Joe Cocker, Waylon Jennings, BB King, Loretta Lynn, Dolly Parton, Paramore,
William Shatner, and Chris Stapleton have all recorded in this studio.
Casey said about the Colin Casey like we're buds. She said,
(12:50):
about the recording process. We recorded most everything in a
big circle in one of my favorite old studios on
the planet, historic RCA Studio A in Nashville, that lent
itself to the record having the concise feel that we wanted.
Then we added a ten piece string section later, you know,
just as like a little addition as you do. She
told Entertainment Weekly that Pageant material was really inspired by
a lot of classic records and artists. I love Glenn Campbell,
(13:13):
Jim Crochy, Bobby Gentry, Marty Robbins, Roger Miller, Charlie Pride Records.
That said, and even Tall.
Speaker 1 (13:19):
All records that we've talked about is huge influences on
other albums that.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
Oh yeah, lots of Gli, a lot of Jim Croche.
Speaker 1 (13:24):
Right in the emo tree from the subreddit.
Speaker 2 (13:27):
Let's see if we can make our emo meltdown on
this one by talking about Casey records. That said, and
even Tone throughout are ones that I usually gravitate towards.
So recording this record was really fun and exciting for
me because I knew exactly what I wanted to go for.
Consistently touring and playing with my great band has made
me a better singer and player and has helped me
defind my vision, so there was less guesswork this time around.
(13:48):
We dressed the space with my signature neon cacti and serapes,
and everyone wore plastic crowns. The musicians were made of
a mix of my band and some of my other
all time favorite musical personalities. It was important for me
to implet how I sound on the road to this project.
I've been really blessed to find a unique group of
people to create with. Most of them wrote everything on
the last record with me and I just love our
song so much that I didn't want to fix what
(14:10):
was broken.
Speaker 1 (14:10):
What wasn't broken?
Speaker 2 (14:11):
Yes, yes, but wasn't broken. That is exactly what it says.
Thank you, Blake. I think you can really hear that
sort of free wheeling live in the studio, kind of
like a song that I think sounds like a bunch
of musicians standing in a circle and playing the song.
Is this song called biscuits.
Speaker 4 (14:39):
Taking down your neighbor won't take you any harm, A
burn low damn thing broken, someone else far never gotten
tom making someone else feel small. If you ain't got
nothing nice to say, you don't say nothing at.
Speaker 7 (14:56):
All, just your own rope and raise your own babies,
smoke your own smoke, didn't grow your own daisies ma,
your own fences, and own your own crazy.
Speaker 4 (15:13):
Mind your own biscuits. In all we'll be greedy, Yeah,
mind your own biscuits.
Speaker 3 (15:20):
In all lit we'll be gravy.
Speaker 4 (15:23):
Pouring salt in my sugar won't make yours any sweeter,
pas it in my arnic, or make yours any greener.
And I wouldn't know about the rocks.
Speaker 3 (15:36):
In your shoes.
Speaker 4 (15:38):
I'll just do mean, honey, you can just do you so.
Speaker 7 (15:44):
Oh your own rope, and raise your own babies, smoke
your own smoke, and grow your own daisies ma, your
own fensis in, own your own crazy.
Speaker 6 (15:58):
My dron.
Speaker 3 (16:06):
Well be.
Speaker 2 (16:18):
That sounds like a live off the ground, like a
live off the floor.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
Like someone starts strumming yeah, and someone else picks it
up and it's a.
Speaker 2 (16:26):
Nice little tune. All of her songs are nice little tunes.
That's the kind of her things.
Speaker 3 (16:29):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:29):
It's also the thing about like getting into this, is
this as our first kind of country album that we've done,
is it's pretty pretty pop accessible.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
All the songs were produced by Casey Muskgraves and and
written by Casey Muskraves and Shane mcinnally, with contributions from
the other producer of this record, Luke Laird. He wrote
like half the songs with them, it seems. Musgrave said
in regards to lyrics, I love words. I love how
intricate they get, even in simple conversation. I like it
when the language is colorful. And I think that's an
(16:59):
interesting cause because I find a lot of her lyrics
very simplistic, but not I don't mean that in a
negative sense. They're just very much like, here's some stuff
I'm thinking about today, which I think is a talent
in and of itself. To yeah, I mean it will
be interesting and compelling.
Speaker 1 (17:12):
Yeah, to make that, to make a good song, approaching
it from a pretty simple way. But I don't know
that that's true all the time. It's more true on
this album. I think there's nothing. Yeah, there's not a
lot that's crazy, challenging or whatever.
Speaker 2 (17:25):
But yeah, I think she expanded more on Golden Hour.
Speaker 1 (17:28):
And Yeah that pop, which is something we're going to
say a couple times on this episode.
Speaker 2 (17:32):
About her writing process, she said, when I first started
writing my own songs. They were pretty bad. I hadn't
found my own voice.
Speaker 1 (17:39):
I started writing our own songs at eight years old.
Of course they were bad. I had like a country
take on the it'sy Bitsy Spider or something I.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
Would love to hear that. I hadn't found my own
voice yet. But it made me appreciate the creative process,
and it made me better. I learned to not be
scared to just throw an idea out there. I had
no clue how useless would be. When I moved to
Nashville and signed a publishing deal, my homework was essentially
the same. Write songs, bring them in, put them on tape,
and have them critiqued. It's the exact same thing that
John had me do, which was her teacher when she
(18:06):
was younger. This album sort of also positioned her uniquely
in the country music scene. I would say, not just
her politics, but also her views on country music itself,
which is a recurring theme it seems lately with a
lot of country It's like you see it all the
time with Sturgil, and you really saw it. I thought
(18:27):
last year in sort of the treatment and quote unquote
controversy around Old Town Road and about how country music
very clearly likes it one way siloed.
Speaker 1 (18:39):
Yeah, it's it's like I know I used that term earlier,
but to me, country music has had an issue at
times with accepting breakout artists. Yeah, who can push the
genre a little bit. And I don't know if it's
a if it's a protective thing. I don't know if
it's the way country radio stations work or whatever. But
like Goldenauer did not do it hit number one on
(19:00):
the country charts, but I think it finished the year
in the thirties.
Speaker 2 (19:02):
Yeah, right, that's insane and like I don't and like
Sturgill has gone and just stop making country music. She
was like fuck you guy.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
Taylor Swift too, Yeah, as she started to get out
of it, it was like no, like it was a
hard line of like you have crossed from country to pop. Yeah,
you and are on that side. And I don't think
even like I remember like people not liking that, like
Sam Hunt would warm up with Drake songs into Drake
covers that's right, yeah, and like Sam Hunt, you don't
have to worry about him not being country.
Speaker 2 (19:30):
And like the Old Town Road was like the biggest
song of the year, but it was country was like nout.
Speaker 1 (19:35):
And why wouldn't you want association with it and that
representation in the pop culture and the Hey, if you
like that, you might also like, like, if you were
going to design a pop star who could get more
people into country and like roots country, it would be
Casey Musgraves. I honestly, as I was prepping for this
(19:56):
and I was trying to like find some of the
numbers on how Golden Now were and stuff like that,
I thought I was going crazy. And it wasn't released
in twenty eighteen because it was just not coming up
on lists. And I'm like, how, I don't think there
are any country like purists or diehards listening to this podcast,
But I don't know how anyone listens to that album
and it's not just like a great album anyway.
Speaker 2 (20:14):
Yeah, but there is this insular thing I think in
mainstream country and in country radio, which I think is
a very good point that the big country acts now
seemed like Willie Nelson takes out people like Casey musk Graves,
people like Cirtle Simpson on tours and it's like Willie Nelson,
It's like the country musician. Yeah, And like I just
think it's so interesting and also just baffling of like
(20:35):
the lack of experimentation that it'll not in the genre
that the genre itself allows and the industry allows. Like
even the Dixie Chicks got like ousted from it when
they just said George Bush sucked.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
I get it that that's where most of the listenership
is demographically or whatever. Yeah, but also like this isn't
accurate financially because country music is still very successful as
country music, but like it almost feels like the attitude
is behind the era we're in, where like the entire
opportunity the streaming era presents is you can reach new
(21:08):
audiences and if you have these gateway tracks or gateway artists,
it's a great way to easily introduce new people to
music that they wouldn't hear your music otherwise, Like where
am I hearing Jason Aldan If it's not I fire
up Casey on the Spotify and three clicks later or
you know, on YouTube, and it's like, oh, you might
also like Jason Alden's a bad example because he's so
(21:28):
big that you could not avoid him. But like some
other country act that.
Speaker 2 (21:31):
I do, but I mean, it's also not necessarily bad example,
because like Jason Aldan is one of the most by
the numbers successful recording artists in the world. I could
not name one song I've never heard of Jason Elden
song before in my life. I think part of that
is my own like not having an interest in it,
But I also think it's part of because exactly what
you're saying, like it's kept in this sort of like
country music vault, so to speak, and if you're not
(21:54):
into the genre, there's just blinders to it. It's the
only genre left where the crossover does, isn't there?
Speaker 3 (22:00):
You know what.
Speaker 1 (22:00):
Chris Stapleton's another good example of like someone now. He
is maybe the best example of someone who has straddled
that because he has had some mainstream access and he
was still you know, his album Traveler in twenty fifteen,
it was.
Speaker 2 (22:11):
Like headlining Wrigley Feel This Wee.
Speaker 1 (22:13):
But I'm interested to see if he continues to be
like a borderline rock artist like Circle, Why do you
keep doing it? I did it once? And yeah, but
even like Caine Brown is a guy that like I
just brought up like the top country albums of the
decade or whatever. He is a young guy with tattoo
sleeves and a backwards trucker hat and had this immensely
(22:34):
popular album that was like the number two album of
up to twenty eighteen or something like that. And I
don't know who he is, and he's like, he doesn't
look like me, look like me because he's attractive and young.
But that should be the type of accessible country artist
that like is helping you get mainstream appeal. And I
(22:55):
don't mean to say that like you have to be
young and good looking at tattooed, but like, if you're
trying to grow your genre and grow your sound and
introduce new new people to your audience, like that guy
and Sam Hunt and people like that would seem to
be pretty good options. And then when you have a
Sam Hunt or at Casey Musgraves who starts to do it
a little bit, it's like, well, hold up.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
Hold up now, you're not country enough now.
Speaker 1 (23:16):
Yeah, And it's like it's something that Casey on this
album more than Golden Hour, actually, I think she explores
Golden Hour is a lot more personal and cultural aspiration
of like, you know, how how we were all raised?
Is that is that?
Speaker 2 (23:28):
I think it's also interesting how all this is true,
Yet the institution of country music seems more open than
the industry. Like Jason isbel is alt country for sure,
and is not I don't believe successful in a mainstream
country sense. But then then you like the Grand Ole
Opry in Nashville or Rhyme and Auditorium, which are these
(23:52):
like historic country grounds, invite him to play like five
night sets there, and so it seems like there is
a desire for this crossover, but the industry itself is
just like absolutely not.
Speaker 1 (24:05):
Look, it's also possible we're reading this wrong on the
way the chants work and the way that it feels
is just off. But like, there's no way that with
how much music we consume and how online we are,
and how much digital music we consume, and like festivals
and concerts and stuff like that, that finding the world's biggest
country acts doesn't happen naturally.
Speaker 2 (24:25):
For sure. I couldn't name five.
Speaker 1 (24:27):
Like I think if you pulled a parent, Like if
you pulled someone who's sixteen, twenty five and forty off
the street right now and had no music tastes, like
they would know obviously they would know pop acts. I
think they'd have a better shot at like knowing that
the top hip hop acts than the top country acts,
which like, maybe that's that's a geographical thing.
Speaker 2 (24:46):
Yeah, they're also the only people who sell records really
anymore as well, and we just don't It's Niven in
our frame of reference.
Speaker 1 (24:53):
So maybe every other genre is doing it wrong.
Speaker 2 (24:55):
Maybe, but to this point of Casey Musker's being separate,
apologies for the enormous case.
Speaker 3 (25:02):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:02):
Pitchfork called her Country's Kendrick Lamar, which I thought was interesting.
Relax She says that not everyone is going to be
on the same page, but these things are all just
normal things to me that made an impression on me somewhere.
All these hot button issues that people pull out of
my songs in pinpoint, They've never been something that I've
considered being progressive. I just want to write fun, little
country anthems. But it's brought a lot of love our
(25:24):
way and has opened a lot of people's minds. She also,
though criticizes just how country works. She told Spin Right
before performing at a country music festival. She said, the
way these things work is that the first football field's
worth of audience space goes to the VIPs, and most
of them don't show up until the headliners on You're
mostly playing to empty crowd for miles. She also wrote
(25:44):
a song on this record that is a thinly veiled
metaphor about the country music record industry. The song is
called Cup of Tea, and the lyrics say, you can't
be everybody's cup of tea. Some like it bitter, some
like it's sweet. Nobody's everybody's favorite, so you might as
well just take it.
Speaker 1 (26:00):
You please, spill that teacase, spill that tkse.
Speaker 4 (26:03):
Maybe your jacket is a hand lead down. Maybe you
slept with happy your hometown in a world of squares.
Maybe you're just round.
Speaker 3 (26:15):
You can't be.
Speaker 4 (26:18):
Everybody's covered same.
Speaker 8 (26:22):
Some like look better, so the sweet.
Speaker 4 (26:25):
Nobody's everybody's favorite, so you might as well just make
a alley. Maybe you married the wrong person first. Maybe
your hair is way too long, your sister's in jail,
or maybe you failed out of college.
Speaker 3 (26:45):
But hey, life goes home.
Speaker 8 (26:49):
We've all got the right to be.
Speaker 3 (27:01):
Because you can't be.
Speaker 4 (27:04):
Everybody's cupuli.
Speaker 8 (27:08):
Some lack black, some like it.
Speaker 4 (27:11):
Nobody's everybody's favorite, so you might as well just.
Speaker 6 (27:15):
Make it hell.
Speaker 4 (27:17):
Because you can't be everybody's copy.
Speaker 3 (27:25):
I would you walking?
Speaker 2 (27:49):
I like that, so that's redious, She said. It was
never my intention to jump in and save anybody. All
I've ever intended to do is make music that spoke
for me. In my perspective, A lot of times in
this genre, people are so focused on being cool rather
than country. To me, the coolest thing in country music
is country, which I think is also really interesting that
she's sort of shunned by them, despite the fact that
(28:10):
she's just like, I just want to make country, Like,
why don't you let me?
Speaker 1 (28:13):
Since I was a literal child.
Speaker 2 (28:14):
Yeah. She told Noisy that she didn't really grow up
listening to country, however, and isn't steeped in it. Therefore
she doesn't have the huge reverence for the past that
a lot of country artists do. So said, I grew
up singing Western swing and very traditional music, but I
also listened to n Sync or Spice Girls, like every
like whatever everybody else was listening to. I don't even
know how I grew up singing it. It just happened.
And then I kind of moved away from that in
(28:36):
my teen years, and I didn't think it was very cool,
and I got into a really emo phase. Then as
time went on. Then as time went on, I got
closer to the age I am. Now I've really been
listening inspired by digging up these old school country records
that I sang as a kid and bringing them back.
Country music, to me has always been a genre that's
just straight up real shit, real life, real people, heartbreak,
you know, whatever, life, And so that's what drove me
(28:57):
to the genre.
Speaker 1 (28:58):
Did you know Casey Muskers was a scene kid I did?
Speaker 7 (29:00):
Well.
Speaker 2 (29:01):
I learned this prepping for this episode. Yeah, it's great
half for Twitter. It's just like all these emo bands
she loves. Yeah, I think it's great.
Speaker 1 (29:10):
Yeah, Hawthorne Heights, Let's go.
Speaker 2 (29:13):
She also sort of I think a lot of country
is like self referential to itself, and this album has
like one reference to Willie Nelson and that's it, which
I think is interesting.
Speaker 1 (29:22):
Yeah, like such a successful Oh yeah, like you mean
like a lot of country albums talk about listening to
other country albums.
Speaker 2 (29:26):
Yeah, yes, exactly. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (29:28):
I think there's one song on this album that, I mean,
We've touched on a lot of this, but I feel
like the song that is maybe she doesn't really start
to let the emo influences happen until Golden Hour love. Yeah,
but there's an interesting I made the Wonder Years joke
earlier about that opening line, but I think Dimestore Cowgirl
(29:51):
is kind of the song that does that best, where
it's like this, instead of lamenting your suburban upbringing and
whether that's the right fit for you, it's this kind
of well the southern standard, is that the right fit
for me? And it's like, I just love that no
matter what genre you get to, there's this specter of
you are where you come from, and as much as
you push back against that, like it's all like you
(30:13):
can't escape that. It's a part of you. Yeah, And
I think Cowgirl is like one of my favorite songs
on the album, if not my favorite song on the album.
And it's probably because of that, because like that, to
me is like an extremely relatable thing to go through
and to hear it told from, you know, a southern
country perspective instead of a suburban punk slash emo perspective
(30:33):
is a it's nice, it's a nice, nice mix.
Speaker 2 (30:36):
It up, funny, you should bring that song up. I
have a quote here that she said to The Fader
about this song, Dimstoric Cowgirl, that it comes from an
experience she had with her sister Kelly when they're performing
as kids. And she said when when she was nine,
she and her younger sister Kelly used to come to
the stockyards on Sundays to sing in a kid's band
called the Buccaroos. It was run by this group of
(30:56):
older people that just really loved country western music. They
would mentor young kids together their shells and sing old
Roy Rogers songs they'd literally never know otherwise. There was
required uniform, high waisted blue jeans, a white button up,
a red bandana, and a cowboy hat. I would wear
my hat kind of calk back retro like Dale Evans
pin up cowgirl style. This other girl I would sing
(31:16):
with would wear hers down really low, Terry Clark style,
real people, I guess. One day, right before we were
about to go sing somewhere, her mom came up to
me and hissed, don't you wear your hat like that?
You're just gonna look like some dime store cowgirl.
Speaker 1 (31:30):
And that experience sounds like this.
Speaker 4 (31:34):
Henna picture made Billy Now stay in a hotel with
a pool driven through the lexic corder's world. Captus grown
no really smart No Rushmore and Amazing all the Way Past,
(31:55):
also City Limits, A baby for minute, too big for
my breeches. But I'm just a dumstore calder. That's all
I'm never gonna be. You can take me out of
the country, but you can't say the country at me
(32:21):
because I'm still the girl from Golden I had to
get away so I could grow it.
Speaker 7 (32:26):
In my way.
Speaker 3 (32:27):
I'm going. I'll still call my hometown home.
Speaker 6 (32:33):
I'll still call my homesound.
Speaker 1 (32:52):
So this album dated in a hotel with the pool.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
What a dream being uh the Buffalo Marriott Man.
Speaker 3 (33:00):
What is it?
Speaker 1 (33:00):
Simcoe had a wheels in that wheels in slide?
Speaker 3 (33:04):
Wow?
Speaker 2 (33:04):
What a name. To our point about having sort of
a blind spot to the success of country music, this
(33:25):
album was ridiculously successful, debuted at number three on the
Billboard two hundred's, nominated for Best Country Album. The twenty
sixteen Grammys. Hits Daily Double called it an album for
the ages, comparing it to Adele's twenty one. All Music
gave it a four out of five and said pagic
material favors softness, sometimes nearly swooning in its slowness, especially
on the gorgeous Keynote High Time and The Closer Fine
(33:46):
both so deliberate and hazy. They evoke memories of lazy
high school dances, which I feel like is very much
what Casey Muscove's music sounds like. They got a B
plus from The av Club and eight from Pitchfork, a
nine from Spin, four point five from Billboard three point five,
and Rolling Stone. It was named the best Country album
of the Year by the Guardian, the twenty seventh best
album of twenty fifteen by Pace, the eighth best album
(34:07):
the year by Spin, sixth best of the Year by Time,
fiftieth by Noisy, and one of the fifty best albums
of the Year by NPR.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
She also did the Late Night Circuit and did that
Miguel remix. That's right, that was the Miguel remix. Was
my first introduction to Casey.
Speaker 2 (34:20):
Must I think it's probably my two actually waves after
this album. As we've sort of alluded to, Kasey musgraves
career has kind of blown.
Speaker 1 (34:27):
Up, blown up so large that my mom wanted tickets
to go see her with Harry Styles. She toured with
Harry's Really Yeah.
Speaker 2 (34:34):
I guess that pairing does make sense if like, the
more I think of.
Speaker 1 (34:38):
It does, but only once Casey gets out of the
country thing. But yes, you want to talk about lyrical
content and the type of audience they reached to and
the type of audience that Casey has, whether intentionally or unintentionally,
reached outside of the normal country lyrical sphere. Yeah, there's
some overlap there. And then also just like you had
some nice radio jams and my mom wanted to see them.
(35:01):
It was a really nice concert.
Speaker 2 (35:02):
Oh that's really what you Oh you went?
Speaker 1 (35:03):
Yeah, I took my mom to see Casey and Harry's
side was it was great. One of the production trucks
got held up at customs, so like the concerts started late,
and then Casey had to tighten her set. Oh, play
as much. But it was really lovely.
Speaker 2 (35:14):
That's fun.
Speaker 1 (35:15):
My mom had a nice time, my mom.
Speaker 2 (35:17):
That's what's important.
Speaker 1 (35:18):
My mom may not have the stamina for arena concerts.
I mean she certainly couldn't do a small venue concert,
but I don't know that. Like it was a long concert.
Speaker 2 (35:28):
Yeah that's fair. I guess two big acts. It's like
they're not.
Speaker 1 (35:30):
Playing even like a condensed Casey one.
Speaker 2 (35:33):
Right, it was great.
Speaker 1 (35:34):
She was awesome.
Speaker 2 (35:35):
So Serry styles so as we said. She released Golden
Hour in twenty seventeen twenty eighteen, which is a much
more pop accessible album than her previous ones. It was
also extremely well received. It received an eight point seven
from Pitchfork, an a mis from Consequence of Sound, a
four from Rolling Stone, a B plus from Wece. It
won Album of the Year, Best Country Album, Best Country Song,
(35:55):
and Best Solo Performance of the twenty eighteen Grammys. The
best Country Song was Space Cowboy. That soul performance was Butterflies.
My favorite song for that record, because that record actually
haven't bitess is this one?
Speaker 4 (36:08):
Born in a hurry, always late, haven't been rely since
Saty Texas is hid.
Speaker 3 (36:22):
I can be called Grandma.
Speaker 4 (36:25):
Crowd went up here, s my nose, good in a glass,
good all green, good winter, putting your hands all over me.
Speaker 3 (36:45):
I'm all right with a slow bur.
Speaker 4 (36:52):
Taking my time at the world turn.
Speaker 3 (36:59):
I'm going do it my way.
Speaker 4 (37:01):
It'll be all right if we burn it down and
it takes a lot. It's just so burn. Yeah, old
(37:26):
soul waiting mo turn. I know a few things, but
it still got a lot to learn. So I'm alright
with slow Burn.
Speaker 2 (37:47):
That song is, of course slow Burn, which if you
follow case of must Graves at all, you've definitely heard
it before.
Speaker 1 (37:52):
Golden Hour is so good as an album. It's like
I said earlier, number eleven on my own that Kuld
list when we did.
Speaker 2 (37:57):
That, I came, Yeah, I came to what late. I remember, like,
I know you and our friend Jacob Kramer and a
few other people were like all about it, and I
just didn't get to it that year. Like I got
to it very late in the year when I was
sort of trying to make my year end list, and
I was surprised by it. It wasn't at all what
I was expecting it to be. This isn't going to
make sense, but it makes sense in my head. It
(38:19):
was somehow more country than I expected to be, but
also more pop than I expected it to be. Okay,
Like I feel like she's really found more so than
any of the other sort of country country adjacent artists
I listened to, She's really found that like tonal balance
between the two.
Speaker 1 (38:36):
Like, yeah, it's certainly less of a country album than
Pageants Show, although like going back and listening Pageant material
more after finding that album and then prepping for this one,
I really think that anyone who liked Golden Hour would
like Pageant Material even though that's back more in the
country sphere, because like, all the things you like about
Casey are still there. Yeah, I think that's like the songwriting.
(38:57):
Her voice was obviously the biggest thing, but even just
like kind of like the lyrical aesthetics she creates. The
lyric aesthetics not the right way to say, I don't.
Speaker 2 (39:04):
Like that hazy high school dance.
Speaker 1 (39:07):
Yeah, yeah, it's just I don't know it's it's also sweet.
Speaker 2 (39:09):
Yeah, it is sweets. Sweet's the right word.
Speaker 1 (39:12):
Yeah, she's the best.
Speaker 2 (39:13):
So the other thing about Casey musk Gray is outside
of her country thing that I wanted to talk about,
you want to talk about it? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (39:20):
Well, by the way, sorry, before we move on, should
we give a favorite song just to stick with the
format of having our segment? Do you have one from
pagiet Material.
Speaker 2 (39:28):
Mine's probably Dime Store Cowgirl. I think that's probably the
it's the most interesting song in the record lyrically and musically.
Speaker 1 (39:36):
I think it's my favorite. I will say Somebody to
Love Miserable and Diyphon is a really good seven eight nine.
Like for that to be late middle of the album,
I don't love Difon, I won't, Okay. I think it's
kind of as Somebody to Love. By the way, is
also probably the closest to an Emo Casey song on
that album. Yeah, that then kind of signals where Golden
Hour might go, because I'd imagine like us throwing the
(39:57):
emo term around, you know what we mean, it's not
Casey will throw it around.
Speaker 2 (40:01):
Two, which, well, that's what we're gonna talk we want
to talk about. So I think there's two parts of
this that I want to discuss. One is what she
calls yemo, which is a mix of yeeha and Emo.
Speaker 1 (40:13):
Which I came across. I still think ye moha.
Speaker 2 (40:18):
Mohaw is better. It's better, But also then are we
talking about omaha? Like what's going on there? I also
think it's really interesting and we've sort of talked around
this so far what I like to call the rise
of the Yeehaws, which is sort.
Speaker 1 (40:30):
Of this or the yeeha agenda if you or.
Speaker 2 (40:33):
That's better this like mainstream acceptance of these alt country people,
or like not mainstream necessarily, but like the Pitchfork crowd,
like the Jason Isbel's, the High Women's.
Speaker 1 (40:46):
The festival bookers.
Speaker 2 (40:47):
Yeah, I feel like Casey Sturgill is Belle High Women,
Chris Stapleton to an extent, guys like Corey Brannon, who
has songs with like Laura Jane Grayson Dave has on
his record. Like, there's a lot more crossover I think
in the indie country world or in Casey's case, pretty
much mainstream country world. Yeah, then there used to be,
(41:08):
and I find it really interesting.
Speaker 1 (41:10):
Yeah, but I think this is to my earlier point
about like what the streaming era, and I don't want
to chalk everything up to streaming, but like it has
made music kind of borderless across genres if you want to,
and I think what you come across is artists like
kzy Musgraves who have country and emo influences, or you
(41:30):
have people who like different types of songwriting and different
types of music who want to work together. Like it's
very much. I remember not all that long ago, you know,
Nelly does a song with Tim McGraw and it's like,
what the hell, this is like the weirdest thing, but like.
Speaker 2 (41:44):
Let's let's not forget the classic that is accidental racist
with Brad Paisley and Aloo. No I can do a
whole episode just on that.
Speaker 3 (41:52):
NOE.
Speaker 1 (41:52):
Let's not please never suggest that for a bonus episode, guys.
But like that was so weird and so bizarre, and
like Lincoln Park and ja Z did the collaboration album
and it was such a weird thing. But now like it's,
like I said, it's kind of gotten borderless, where not
only because of the accessibility of music can you be
introduced to new things, But I think there's just like
(42:14):
there's less kind of siloing of the genres, and because
we're in twenty twenty and music started so long ago,
and if you were to draw out the emo tree
for every genre, like nothing is anything that's true really,
So yeah, there's country that's country, and there's rap that's rap,
and there's punk that's punk. But most bands exist somewhere
between multiple genres. And I think that just makes crossover
(42:36):
peel and crossover collaboration a lot more open. It's also
just way more interesting when you have these really talented
musicians and it doesn't really matter what their background is,
they just are really talented and make good music together.
Speaker 2 (42:46):
Yeah, I'd like it.
Speaker 1 (42:47):
Like from a consumer perspective, it's just obviously it's it's
awesome for us.
Speaker 2 (42:50):
Yeah, I mean to this point that we started talking
about with the country record industry, it exposes you to
more stuff. Yeah, I wouldn't have listened to something like
The High Women had I not seen Amanda Shires play
with Isabel like obviously they're married, but it's like, it's
just that, like you also mass consumption and mass exposure
and it's it's a good thing.
Speaker 1 (43:10):
Yeah, and you also get stuff. And this is I
think the second point that we were going to go
into is that a guy like Rustin Kelly, who I
never would have found his country music had he not
done a bunch of country emo covers.
Speaker 2 (43:22):
Which I love that he calls it dirt emo.
Speaker 1 (43:24):
Dirt that's better than eemo or EMOHI I think is
dirt emo. So rust and Kelly, for anyone who doesn't know,
is Casey Musgrave's husband. He's also a pretty good country
artist who I never would have checked out his country
stuff had I not heard him covering screaming infidelities with
Chris Garabba, a machine.
Speaker 9 (43:42):
Bird voiding spurs weed up speak in the Spottle Beest
is taking me up.
Speaker 3 (43:59):
Good on blankets and sheets. You are not alone you
are not a scream make sure no taking you home.
I'm reading you all. Oh, there's not a word a
(44:23):
comprehend except when you signed it. I love you always
and forever. We're asking no.
Speaker 4 (44:53):
Sad sound, sitting and wonder.
Speaker 3 (45:00):
How are you making it.
Speaker 7 (45:05):
As wish yow wash Jedy, any one making.
Speaker 4 (45:23):
You're screaming?
Speaker 3 (45:32):
Do tagging it? So?
Speaker 1 (45:38):
As Rustin Kelly told Billboard, it's really simple. Growing up,
we always had folk Americana country instruments in the house.
My dad's a steel guitar player. That's the first instrument
that I remember hearing. He's the one that taught me
how to play guitar and we would jam together. But
when I was coming of age, like thirteen, fourteen, fifteen,
all I wanted to play was emo and scream. Oh,
and my instrumentation for those songs just naturally lent themselves
(46:00):
to more of the folksy vibe. It's just natural for me.
So now having the ability to put it on a record,
it's really cool because I've been playing these songs like
my whole life.
Speaker 2 (46:08):
Yeah, and Casey like this my whole life. Casey Musgraves
has sort of alluded to her past as well, there
was a whole thing where she posted a picture of
herself wearing earrings and someone came at her for having
hanging ear lobes, and she tweeted, some of y'all never
were in engaging your ears in your early high school
years until your nana found your plugs and threw them away,
and it's really showing.
Speaker 1 (46:28):
Oh boy.
Speaker 2 (46:28):
She's also shared clips herself singing along to Good Charlotte's
The Anthem. She's covered Weezer's Island in the Sun on tour.
She has taken soccer Mommy out on tour before.
Speaker 1 (46:38):
She also in Something that Almost made My Heart explode.
Her and Hailey Williams were on Instagram story together singing
dashboard just too much.
Speaker 2 (46:45):
That's like, if we could curate a Blake thing, I
think it would be that on.
Speaker 1 (46:49):
An e red carpet. At one point before Golden Hour
came out, she described the album as emo country interesting,
and it's like it's not it's not literally that, but
it's not far.
Speaker 2 (46:59):
It's no more emo then you know, the world's a
beautiful place, yeah, or less emo rather, that's yeah, that's
what I mean. Like, it's I think, as all genres go,
there's just experimentation happening in EMO now it wasn't before.
Speaker 1 (47:13):
And I think that that's great, and I think there
should be experimenting in I mean, look again, that don't
tell anyone how to do their music and what they
like creatively, but I think that kind of experimentation is great.
Like I used the Russell Kelly example. I found Sam
Hunt's country stuff because he was messing around with Drake's stuff. Right,
Even someone like Orville Peck is like up for an
alternative juno, but like that's I mean, he's a eeho agenda,
(47:36):
he's an m yeho agenda.
Speaker 2 (47:38):
But but and he's a fashion icon yeah, and he's
like a queer icon. Yeah he's and he's great and
he's awesome.
Speaker 1 (47:43):
Yeah, And like he's adjacent enough that like that maybe
gets you to check up some other stuff in that
totally more typical genre. But there's still this weird like, yeah,
like why why siloed off? But I don't know, you know,
I'm not well versed enough in country to know whether
that's an industry factor or a genre fact or a
demographic factor or what or what's going on there.
Speaker 2 (48:02):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (48:03):
Yeah, so the eeeh agenda.
Speaker 2 (48:05):
Agenda is here.
Speaker 1 (48:06):
Oh also, I don't have the context for this. Casey
Musgraves tweeted in twenty eighteen, welcome to the EE Club, bitch.
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (48:14):
I'm gonna assume that's I don't know what that is.
I was gonna assume, and I'm not gonna because I
don't know.
Speaker 1 (48:19):
That's what I'm gonna start referring to our Patreon supporters
as the EE Club bitch. I think that something that
an episode like this does is by exploring music outside
of the genres we normally do. You see a lot
of the similarities, and then the contrasts between genres become
interesting things to think about, like why is country operating
a little differently? Is it operating differently or.
Speaker 2 (48:41):
Are we just like blind to it.
Speaker 1 (48:43):
Yeah, so I look forward to the discord discussions about
this and the feedback on this episode. Before we go,
we have to pick a song for the mixed thing.
Oh yes, of course, I mean we both have the
same favorite song. I think cow Girl time started. That's
easy enough. Yeah, we have to stop agreeing on that.
Speaker 2 (48:59):
I know people want the blood.
Speaker 1 (49:02):
Yeah, I don't think people recommended a Casey Muscrave's album
to hear Us Fight. That's true, just so we don't
really sweet and soft. He's also just a little unclear
about where you fit in your hometowns.
Speaker 2 (49:15):
It couldn't get more email than that.
Speaker 1 (49:16):
Checks every box checks, every box, chake anything else on
Casey before we wrap it up.
Speaker 2 (49:21):
I think so. I think that's I'm about all countried out.
Speaker 1 (49:24):
Not mean I'm gonna fire up Colden now on the
way to the arena.
Speaker 2 (49:27):
Fair enough. Think going my way home, I'm going to
start prepping for what recording next week?
Speaker 1 (49:31):
What are don't say?
Speaker 2 (49:33):
I'm not I'm not gonna do.
Speaker 1 (49:34):
I gotta double check what we're doing next week.
Speaker 2 (49:36):
I ain't saying nothing, all right, Oh yeah.
Speaker 1 (49:38):
Now I know, not because of your weird country voice,
but
Speaker 2 (50:13):
Crash on, please try to fish
It's high time to slow my role. Let the grass
just go lean way back. Turn on an episode of
Columbia House Party. Jake, what's going on?
Speaker 2 (00:34):
I like that you couldn't help but have a little
bit of twang in there.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
Man, I'm from small town, Ontario. A little bit of
a emmy that drumbo accent.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
Yeah, that's fair. I mean, I don't know what that is,
but it's not.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
A thing that exists. Okay, it's really hard to talk
about Casey Musgraves with a little twang.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
You know, that's fair. Moha moha.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
We're going to be talking about an album that is
not her most popular album, certainly not the album that
brought her to the foremost of our music. It's kind
of a transition album as you start to see where
Casey Musgraves is going to go as an artist and
where she begins to veer from the genre that she
came up in through that lens. It's very interesting, and
(01:12):
because what's most interesting about this album is that it
is a transition to where Casey Musgraves eventually ends up.
We're going to talk a little bit more around the
album than about this specific album than we normally would,
but we also found in researching for it and going
back to this album, there are some interesting discussions to
be had about country as a genre that's pretty siloed
(01:32):
off from everything else, about the little bits of country
and emo overlap that Casey has kind of jokingly made
a part of her personality and her brand appeal, but
also is really legitimate. And we're going to talk about
Pageant Material as well, because Pageant Material itself is a
pretty good album. Jake, you, I don't think you agree
to the extent that I do, but I have like
(01:53):
a little bit more time for country music.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
Then I'm actually a huge like I don't like the term,
but it is the name of the genre, so it's
I'm a huge alt country guy. Like Sturgle, Sturgio, drive
by Truckle, Sturgle drive by Trucker.
Speaker 1 (02:05):
We're on a It's it's a lot of episodes.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
But yeah, like dry By Trucker is old ninety seven,
Sturgil Simpson, Jason isbel the High Women like Wilco. Like
I love alt country. It's one of my favorite A
lot of my favorite bands come out of country. I
am not a for lack of better term, mainstream country fan, which.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
I think is fair. So for me. I talked a
lot in this podcast about how in high school all
my friends were into hip hop and I was kind
of the other as someone who listened to emo and
punk stuff. As my friends have gotten older, being smaller
town on Taria guys, their tastes have mostly shifted toward country.
Even like in university age, I would go to visit
friends at in St. Catharine's and it was always the
(02:46):
country bar and it was always country music playing. And
then when I played like fairly competitive slow pitch, it
was always the country bars on the road and it
was always country music playing. And that kind of carried
over to where, you know, in my mid to early
to mid twenties, I was like, I really don't like country,
Like I'm over here. Everyone else likes country. It's different.
And then slowly over time, like you know, you go
(03:08):
camping enough times, you play in enough softball tournaments, and
you have enough beers in your hand in the summer,
and just like that energy kind of grew on me
a little bit.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
Yeah, I get that. I completely understand that, and I
don't think there's anything wrong with it. That being said,
the idea of going to something like Boots and Hearts
makes me want to jump off the bag.
Speaker 1 (03:26):
That's fine. I could do standalone country concerts, yeah, oh yeah, yeah,
for sure. I will say also that having just laid
that out and explained it, I think that you could
do that for any type of music. And if the
vibe is consistently right and it's tied to nice summary
things and things you enjoy doing, like you could. I'm sure.
Had I had control of the ox Court and just
played Slip not and disturbed all those times, my friends
(03:49):
would be like, oh yeah, Like, as long as I
have a beer in my hand and it's nice and
summary out, I love Slip.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
I mean you and I were outdoors in the summer
drinking many beers watching blinkoy Ay two and we had
a great time. So it it works exactly.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
We're gonna talk about a pretty country album by both
of our standards. That is pageant material from Casey Muskers.
Speaker 2 (04:07):
It's hard.
Speaker 3 (04:12):
Time.
Speaker 4 (04:14):
Just sloan Morrow, let the grass just grow and clean
way back.
Speaker 3 (04:23):
It's a fun time to let it all though.
Speaker 4 (04:33):
I've been too so time time the bits and marots.
I'm getting rid of the flash. Nobody needs the thousand
nos suit, just to take out the trash and gotta bed.
(05:02):
I'm going to turn off the phone, start catching up
with the people.
Speaker 3 (05:10):
Me.
Speaker 5 (05:11):
It's hot to slow mo, let the grass just prove be.
Speaker 3 (05:27):
It is a fun.
Speaker 4 (05:34):
To let it all happen to Loo.
Speaker 3 (05:38):
So it's hot.
Speaker 4 (05:42):
I'm going to let it all go happen too Lo.
So it's hot time.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
It's just so difficult we usually do. She's gad she is.
I like Casey Muskers.
Speaker 1 (05:57):
I just She's Golden Hour was my find an album
of the decade.
Speaker 2 (06:01):
I find it. I find this album more interesting than
I like it, if that makes sense.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
Yeah, again the transition that she's going through here, take
us through it, man.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
All right. Casey Musgraves was born on August twenty first, nineteen.
We're going way back. I just found interesting that she's
I'm like thirteen days older than her, which is really depressing.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
No offense. One of you is aging more gracefully than
the other.
Speaker 2 (06:22):
Absolutely true, also more successfully. She was born in Golden, Texas.
She began songwriting at the age of eight, and then
she wrote a song called notice Me for her elementary
school graduation. She first began learning the mandolin and started
taking guitar lessons at twelve, and she calls this one
of the most important things that has ever happened to her.
She began singing at local music festivals in and around Texas.
(06:43):
Along with Alena Tatum. She was part of a country
music duo called Texas Two Bits, which toured throughout Texas
and released an independent album in the year two thousand.
She then earned an invitation to George W. Bush's Black
Time Boots Inaugura Ball, which is super gross. At fourteen,
her family funded her first solo, self released album, and
then when she graduated high school at eighteen, she moved
to Austin, Texas because that's where all the cool stuff is.
(07:05):
She was discovered professionally in two thousand and eight in
Austin by producer Monte Robinson from the independent label Triple Pop.
She released two covers for the label, one of Miley
cyrus to See You Again and the other of One
Republic's Apologize And this is the first time of many
that we're going to come up with that. I was
completely blinded to how successful country music can be, or
at least not blind how success can be. How just
(07:27):
like unaware of it, I am her cover of one
Republics Apologize hit number twenty three on the Billboard Singles Chart.
It has been streamed over thirty one million times on Spotify,
which probably earned her like eight bucks. In Marchy eighteen,
Triple Pop released the Acoustic Remixed EP, which featured newly
remixed and digitally remastered versions of these original recordings. In
(07:49):
twenty twelve, she sort of took off when she opened
for Lady Antebellum on their tour. She released her solo
debut single, Merry Go Round, which is sadly not a
Replacements cover, but it sounds like this.
Speaker 4 (08:00):
You ain't got two kids by twenty one, you're probably
gona dilone is. That's what tradition told you, And it
don't matter if you don't believe. Comes Sunday morning, Usb
there in the front row like you're supposed to, same
(08:24):
hurt and every heart, same trailer.
Speaker 3 (08:30):
Different part.
Speaker 4 (08:33):
Mama's Updom, Mary, Kay, Brother's Updom, Mary, Jane, Guy's up,
Tom married to doors down, marry and married wuckin trail
we get boards, so we get married just like us.
We settle in this sound on this brook and Mary
(08:58):
go round around. He goes where he stop nobody knows
and it ain't slow.
Speaker 6 (09:06):
And now it's Mary go around, Marry Mary quackin trary.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
We're so bored until we're buried.
Speaker 3 (09:26):
Just liked us.
Speaker 6 (09:27):
We settle in this town.
Speaker 4 (09:31):
On this broken Mary go man, Mary go around. Jack
and Jill went up the hill. Jack burned out on
booze and pills and Mary had a little and Mary
(09:54):
just don't give a damn.
Speaker 7 (09:56):
No.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
It's a great opening there.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
It's a very wonder Yeah it is. We'll get into
this mora. But I think people have stereotypes of what
country music is lyrically, and one of the most interesting
things about Casey's career path is how she's like bumped
up against like should this be the standard? Should we
lean into this?
Speaker 2 (10:12):
Yeah? And I don't want to skip to for ourhead,
but yes, I agree with you.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
That is I'm twenty six. All the people I graduated with, yeah, jobs,
I've just it's just people.
Speaker 2 (10:22):
That's just a music industry sound. She released her debut album,
Same Trailer, Different Park, Great Name on March nineteen, twenty thirteen.
The album debuted at number two, selling forty two thousand
copies in its first week. It produced the single follow
Your Arrow, which Rolling Stone named the thirty ninth greatest
country song of all time, and in that they said
that Casey musk Graves is one of the loudest symbols
(10:43):
of young country musicians with progressive values, which is a
thing I have always liked about Casey Muskraves, and the
fact that she very loudly proclaims her progressive views on
things which I think we took for granted in like
the indie hipster world, where it's just like expected almost
that you're probably left wing and progressive, but in country,
very much not. I definitely was surprised when she turned
(11:05):
up as a guest judge on RuPaul's Drag Race a
couple of years back. Same Trailer, Different Park was nominated
for four Country Music Awards in twenty twelve, including Female
Vocalists of the Year. It was also nominated for four Grammys,
including Best New Artist or She was I guess for
Best New Artists, Best Country Album, and Best Country Song
for Mama's Broken Heart and for Maria Go Round Marry
(11:25):
Go Round one Best Song at the Grammys, and the
album one Best Country Album, again extremely successful, completely out
of my view or sphere. She albed for Katie Perry
on her world tour in twenty thirteen, and did a
tour with Willie Nelson and Alison Kraus, which actually sounds
like it would be a really really good show. Cool,
same trailer, different park, one album of the Year from
(11:45):
the Academy of Country Music, and further to her sort
of left wing progressive things that I just found this
really interesting. In twenty thirteen, she was named the twenty
thirteen Spirit Day Ambassador by GLAD and has become the
first country music artist to perform at the GLAD Awards,
which makes sense that there aren't a lot of country
music performers at those awards, but I thought that was interesting. So,
(12:07):
after all, this success brought her to recording pageant material
we're talking about today. It was recorded live in Nashville's
(12:30):
historic RCA Studio. A previous record ease which is a
word I made up, include The Beach Boys, Tony Bennett,
Joe Cocker, Waylon Jennings, BB King, Loretta Lynn, Dolly Parton, Paramore,
William Shatner, and Chris Stapleton have all recorded in this studio.
Casey said about the Colin Casey like we're buds. She said,
(12:50):
about the recording process. We recorded most everything in a
big circle in one of my favorite old studios on
the planet, historic RCA Studio A in Nashville, that lent
itself to the record having the concise feel that we wanted.
Then we added a ten piece string section later, you know,
just as like a little addition as you do. She
told Entertainment Weekly that Pageant material was really inspired by
a lot of classic records and artists. I love Glenn Campbell,
(13:13):
Jim Crochy, Bobby Gentry, Marty Robbins, Roger Miller, Charlie Pride Records.
That said, and even Tall.
Speaker 1 (13:19):
All records that we've talked about is huge influences on
other albums that.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
Oh yeah, lots of Gli, a lot of Jim Croche.
Speaker 1 (13:24):
Right in the emo tree from the subreddit.
Speaker 2 (13:27):
Let's see if we can make our emo meltdown on
this one by talking about Casey records. That said, and
even Tone throughout are ones that I usually gravitate towards.
So recording this record was really fun and exciting for
me because I knew exactly what I wanted to go for.
Consistently touring and playing with my great band has made
me a better singer and player and has helped me
defind my vision, so there was less guesswork this time around.
(13:48):
We dressed the space with my signature neon cacti and serapes,
and everyone wore plastic crowns. The musicians were made of
a mix of my band and some of my other
all time favorite musical personalities. It was important for me
to implet how I sound on the road to this project.
I've been really blessed to find a unique group of
people to create with. Most of them wrote everything on
the last record with me and I just love our
song so much that I didn't want to fix what
(14:10):
was broken.
Speaker 1 (14:10):
What wasn't broken?
Speaker 2 (14:11):
Yes, yes, but wasn't broken. That is exactly what it says.
Thank you, Blake. I think you can really hear that
sort of free wheeling live in the studio, kind of
like a song that I think sounds like a bunch
of musicians standing in a circle and playing the song.
Is this song called biscuits.
Speaker 4 (14:39):
Taking down your neighbor won't take you any harm, A
burn low damn thing broken, someone else far never gotten
tom making someone else feel small. If you ain't got
nothing nice to say, you don't say nothing at.
Speaker 7 (14:56):
All, just your own rope and raise your own babies,
smoke your own smoke, didn't grow your own daisies ma,
your own fences, and own your own crazy.
Speaker 4 (15:13):
Mind your own biscuits. In all we'll be greedy, Yeah,
mind your own biscuits.
Speaker 3 (15:20):
In all lit we'll be gravy.
Speaker 4 (15:23):
Pouring salt in my sugar won't make yours any sweeter,
pas it in my arnic, or make yours any greener.
And I wouldn't know about the rocks.
Speaker 3 (15:36):
In your shoes.
Speaker 4 (15:38):
I'll just do mean, honey, you can just do you so.
Speaker 7 (15:44):
Oh your own rope, and raise your own babies, smoke
your own smoke, and grow your own daisies ma, your
own fensis in, own your own crazy.
Speaker 6 (15:58):
My dron.
Speaker 3 (16:06):
Well be.
Speaker 2 (16:18):
That sounds like a live off the ground, like a
live off the floor.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
Like someone starts strumming yeah, and someone else picks it
up and it's a.
Speaker 2 (16:26):
Nice little tune. All of her songs are nice little tunes.
That's the kind of her things.
Speaker 3 (16:29):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:29):
It's also the thing about like getting into this, is
this as our first kind of country album that we've done,
is it's pretty pretty pop accessible.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
All the songs were produced by Casey Muskgraves and and
written by Casey Muskraves and Shane mcinnally, with contributions from
the other producer of this record, Luke Laird. He wrote
like half the songs with them, it seems. Musgrave said
in regards to lyrics, I love words. I love how
intricate they get, even in simple conversation. I like it
when the language is colorful. And I think that's an
(16:59):
interesting cause because I find a lot of her lyrics
very simplistic, but not I don't mean that in a
negative sense. They're just very much like, here's some stuff
I'm thinking about today, which I think is a talent
in and of itself. To yeah, I mean it will
be interesting and compelling.
Speaker 1 (17:12):
Yeah, to make that, to make a good song, approaching
it from a pretty simple way. But I don't know
that that's true all the time. It's more true on
this album. I think there's nothing. Yeah, there's not a
lot that's crazy, challenging or whatever.
Speaker 2 (17:25):
But yeah, I think she expanded more on Golden Hour.
Speaker 1 (17:28):
And Yeah that pop, which is something we're going to
say a couple times on this episode.
Speaker 2 (17:32):
About her writing process, she said, when I first started
writing my own songs. They were pretty bad. I hadn't
found my own voice.
Speaker 1 (17:39):
I started writing our own songs at eight years old.
Of course they were bad. I had like a country
take on the it'sy Bitsy Spider or something I.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
Would love to hear that. I hadn't found my own
voice yet. But it made me appreciate the creative process,
and it made me better. I learned to not be
scared to just throw an idea out there. I had
no clue how useless would be. When I moved to
Nashville and signed a publishing deal, my homework was essentially
the same. Write songs, bring them in, put them on tape,
and have them critiqued. It's the exact same thing that
John had me do, which was her teacher when she
(18:06):
was younger. This album sort of also positioned her uniquely
in the country music scene. I would say, not just
her politics, but also her views on country music itself,
which is a recurring theme it seems lately with a
lot of country It's like you see it all the
time with Sturgil, and you really saw it. I thought
(18:27):
last year in sort of the treatment and quote unquote
controversy around Old Town Road and about how country music
very clearly likes it one way siloed.
Speaker 1 (18:39):
Yeah, it's it's like I know I used that term earlier,
but to me, country music has had an issue at
times with accepting breakout artists. Yeah, who can push the
genre a little bit. And I don't know if it's
a if it's a protective thing. I don't know if
it's the way country radio stations work or whatever. But
like Goldenauer did not do it hit number one on
(19:00):
the country charts, but I think it finished the year
in the thirties.
Speaker 2 (19:02):
Yeah, right, that's insane and like I don't and like
Sturgill has gone and just stop making country music. She
was like fuck you guy.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
Taylor Swift too, Yeah, as she started to get out
of it, it was like no, like it was a
hard line of like you have crossed from country to pop. Yeah,
you and are on that side. And I don't think
even like I remember like people not liking that, like
Sam Hunt would warm up with Drake songs into Drake
covers that's right, yeah, and like Sam Hunt, you don't
have to worry about him not being country.
Speaker 2 (19:30):
And like the Old Town Road was like the biggest
song of the year, but it was country was like nout.
Speaker 1 (19:35):
And why wouldn't you want association with it and that
representation in the pop culture and the Hey, if you
like that, you might also like, like, if you were
going to design a pop star who could get more
people into country and like roots country, it would be
Casey Musgraves. I honestly, as I was prepping for this
(19:56):
and I was trying to like find some of the
numbers on how Golden Now were and stuff like that,
I thought I was going crazy. And it wasn't released
in twenty eighteen because it was just not coming up
on lists. And I'm like, how, I don't think there
are any country like purists or diehards listening to this podcast,
But I don't know how anyone listens to that album
and it's not just like a great album anyway.
Speaker 2 (20:14):
Yeah, but there is this insular thing I think in
mainstream country and in country radio, which I think is
a very good point that the big country acts now
seemed like Willie Nelson takes out people like Casey musk Graves,
people like Cirtle Simpson on tours and it's like Willie Nelson,
It's like the country musician. Yeah, And like I just
think it's so interesting and also just baffling of like
(20:35):
the lack of experimentation that it'll not in the genre
that the genre itself allows and the industry allows. Like
even the Dixie Chicks got like ousted from it when
they just said George Bush sucked.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
I get it that that's where most of the listenership
is demographically or whatever. Yeah, but also like this isn't
accurate financially because country music is still very successful as
country music, but like it almost feels like the attitude
is behind the era we're in, where like the entire
opportunity the streaming era presents is you can reach new
(21:08):
audiences and if you have these gateway tracks or gateway artists,
it's a great way to easily introduce new people to
music that they wouldn't hear your music otherwise, Like where
am I hearing Jason Aldan If it's not I fire
up Casey on the Spotify and three clicks later or
you know, on YouTube, and it's like, oh, you might
also like Jason Alden's a bad example because he's so
(21:28):
big that you could not avoid him. But like some
other country act that.
Speaker 2 (21:31):
I do, but I mean, it's also not necessarily bad example,
because like Jason Aldan is one of the most by
the numbers successful recording artists in the world. I could
not name one song I've never heard of Jason Elden
song before in my life. I think part of that
is my own like not having an interest in it,
But I also think it's part of because exactly what
you're saying, like it's kept in this sort of like
country music vault, so to speak, and if you're not
(21:54):
into the genre, there's just blinders to it. It's the
only genre left where the crossover does, isn't there?
Speaker 3 (22:00):
You know what.
Speaker 1 (22:00):
Chris Stapleton's another good example of like someone now. He
is maybe the best example of someone who has straddled
that because he has had some mainstream access and he
was still you know, his album Traveler in twenty fifteen,
it was.
Speaker 2 (22:11):
Like headlining Wrigley Feel This Wee.
Speaker 1 (22:13):
But I'm interested to see if he continues to be
like a borderline rock artist like Circle, Why do you
keep doing it? I did it once? And yeah, but
even like Caine Brown is a guy that like I
just brought up like the top country albums of the
decade or whatever. He is a young guy with tattoo
sleeves and a backwards trucker hat and had this immensely
(22:34):
popular album that was like the number two album of
up to twenty eighteen or something like that. And I
don't know who he is, and he's like, he doesn't
look like me, look like me because he's attractive and young.
But that should be the type of accessible country artist
that like is helping you get mainstream appeal. And I
(22:55):
don't mean to say that like you have to be
young and good looking at tattooed, but like, if you're
trying to grow your genre and grow your sound and
introduce new new people to your audience, like that guy
and Sam Hunt and people like that would seem to
be pretty good options. And then when you have a
Sam Hunt or at Casey Musgraves who starts to do it
a little bit, it's like, well, hold up.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
Hold up now, you're not country enough now.
Speaker 1 (23:16):
Yeah, And it's like it's something that Casey on this
album more than Golden Hour, actually, I think she explores
Golden Hour is a lot more personal and cultural aspiration
of like, you know, how how we were all raised?
Is that is that?
Speaker 2 (23:28):
I think it's also interesting how all this is true,
Yet the institution of country music seems more open than
the industry. Like Jason isbel is alt country for sure,
and is not I don't believe successful in a mainstream
country sense. But then then you like the Grand Ole
Opry in Nashville or Rhyme and Auditorium, which are these
(23:52):
like historic country grounds, invite him to play like five
night sets there, and so it seems like there is
a desire for this crossover, but the industry itself is
just like absolutely not.
Speaker 1 (24:05):
Look, it's also possible we're reading this wrong on the
way the chants work and the way that it feels
is just off. But like, there's no way that with
how much music we consume and how online we are,
and how much digital music we consume, and like festivals
and concerts and stuff like that, that finding the world's biggest
country acts doesn't happen naturally.
Speaker 2 (24:25):
For sure. I couldn't name five.
Speaker 1 (24:27):
Like I think if you pulled a parent, Like if
you pulled someone who's sixteen, twenty five and forty off
the street right now and had no music tastes, like
they would know obviously they would know pop acts. I
think they'd have a better shot at like knowing that
the top hip hop acts than the top country acts,
which like, maybe that's that's a geographical thing.
Speaker 2 (24:46):
Yeah, they're also the only people who sell records really
anymore as well, and we just don't It's Niven in
our frame of reference.
Speaker 1 (24:53):
So maybe every other genre is doing it wrong.
Speaker 2 (24:55):
Maybe, but to this point of Casey Musker's being separate,
apologies for the enormous case.
Speaker 3 (25:02):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:02):
Pitchfork called her Country's Kendrick Lamar, which I thought was interesting.
Relax She says that not everyone is going to be
on the same page, but these things are all just
normal things to me that made an impression on me somewhere.
All these hot button issues that people pull out of
my songs in pinpoint, They've never been something that I've
considered being progressive. I just want to write fun, little
country anthems. But it's brought a lot of love our
(25:24):
way and has opened a lot of people's minds. She also,
though criticizes just how country works. She told Spin Right
before performing at a country music festival. She said, the
way these things work is that the first football field's
worth of audience space goes to the VIPs, and most
of them don't show up until the headliners on You're
mostly playing to empty crowd for miles. She also wrote
(25:44):
a song on this record that is a thinly veiled
metaphor about the country music record industry. The song is
called Cup of Tea, and the lyrics say, you can't
be everybody's cup of tea. Some like it bitter, some
like it's sweet. Nobody's everybody's favorite, so you might as
well just take it.
Speaker 1 (26:00):
You please, spill that teacase, spill that tkse.
Speaker 4 (26:03):
Maybe your jacket is a hand lead down. Maybe you
slept with happy your hometown in a world of squares.
Maybe you're just round.
Speaker 3 (26:15):
You can't be.
Speaker 4 (26:18):
Everybody's covered same.
Speaker 8 (26:22):
Some like look better, so the sweet.
Speaker 4 (26:25):
Nobody's everybody's favorite, so you might as well just make
a alley. Maybe you married the wrong person first. Maybe
your hair is way too long, your sister's in jail,
or maybe you failed out of college.
Speaker 3 (26:45):
But hey, life goes home.
Speaker 8 (26:49):
We've all got the right to be.
Speaker 3 (27:01):
Because you can't be.
Speaker 4 (27:04):
Everybody's cupuli.
Speaker 8 (27:08):
Some lack black, some like it.
Speaker 4 (27:11):
Nobody's everybody's favorite, so you might as well just.
Speaker 6 (27:15):
Make it hell.
Speaker 4 (27:17):
Because you can't be everybody's copy.
Speaker 3 (27:25):
I would you walking?
Speaker 2 (27:49):
I like that, so that's redious, She said. It was
never my intention to jump in and save anybody. All
I've ever intended to do is make music that spoke
for me. In my perspective, A lot of times in
this genre, people are so focused on being cool rather
than country. To me, the coolest thing in country music
is country, which I think is also really interesting that
she's sort of shunned by them, despite the fact that
(28:10):
she's just like, I just want to make country, Like,
why don't you let me?
Speaker 1 (28:13):
Since I was a literal child.
Speaker 2 (28:14):
Yeah. She told Noisy that she didn't really grow up
listening to country, however, and isn't steeped in it. Therefore
she doesn't have the huge reverence for the past that
a lot of country artists do. So said, I grew
up singing Western swing and very traditional music, but I
also listened to n Sync or Spice Girls, like every
like whatever everybody else was listening to. I don't even
know how I grew up singing it. It just happened.
And then I kind of moved away from that in
(28:36):
my teen years, and I didn't think it was very cool,
and I got into a really emo phase. Then as
time went on. Then as time went on, I got
closer to the age I am. Now I've really been
listening inspired by digging up these old school country records
that I sang as a kid and bringing them back.
Country music, to me has always been a genre that's
just straight up real shit, real life, real people, heartbreak,
you know, whatever, life, And so that's what drove me
(28:57):
to the genre.
Speaker 1 (28:58):
Did you know Casey Muskers was a scene kid I did?
Speaker 7 (29:00):
Well.
Speaker 2 (29:01):
I learned this prepping for this episode. Yeah, it's great
half for Twitter. It's just like all these emo bands
she loves. Yeah, I think it's great.
Speaker 1 (29:10):
Yeah, Hawthorne Heights, Let's go.
Speaker 2 (29:13):
She also sort of I think a lot of country
is like self referential to itself, and this album has
like one reference to Willie Nelson and that's it, which
I think is interesting.
Speaker 1 (29:22):
Yeah, like such a successful Oh yeah, like you mean
like a lot of country albums talk about listening to
other country albums.
Speaker 2 (29:26):
Yeah, yes, exactly. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (29:28):
I think there's one song on this album that, I mean,
We've touched on a lot of this, but I feel
like the song that is maybe she doesn't really start
to let the emo influences happen until Golden Hour love. Yeah,
but there's an interesting I made the Wonder Years joke
earlier about that opening line, but I think Dimestore Cowgirl
(29:51):
is kind of the song that does that best, where
it's like this, instead of lamenting your suburban upbringing and
whether that's the right fit for you, it's this kind
of well the southern standard, is that the right fit
for me? And it's like, I just love that no
matter what genre you get to, there's this specter of
you are where you come from, and as much as
you push back against that, like it's all like you
(30:13):
can't escape that. It's a part of you. Yeah, And
I think Cowgirl is like one of my favorite songs
on the album, if not my favorite song on the album.
And it's probably because of that, because like that, to
me is like an extremely relatable thing to go through
and to hear it told from, you know, a southern
country perspective instead of a suburban punk slash emo perspective
(30:33):
is a it's nice, it's a nice, nice mix.
Speaker 2 (30:36):
It up, funny, you should bring that song up. I
have a quote here that she said to The Fader
about this song, Dimstoric Cowgirl, that it comes from an
experience she had with her sister Kelly when they're performing
as kids. And she said when when she was nine,
she and her younger sister Kelly used to come to
the stockyards on Sundays to sing in a kid's band
called the Buccaroos. It was run by this group of
(30:56):
older people that just really loved country western music. They
would mentor young kids together their shells and sing old
Roy Rogers songs they'd literally never know otherwise. There was
required uniform, high waisted blue jeans, a white button up,
a red bandana, and a cowboy hat. I would wear
my hat kind of calk back retro like Dale Evans
pin up cowgirl style. This other girl I would sing
(31:16):
with would wear hers down really low, Terry Clark style,
real people, I guess. One day, right before we were
about to go sing somewhere, her mom came up to
me and hissed, don't you wear your hat like that?
You're just gonna look like some dime store cowgirl.
Speaker 1 (31:30):
And that experience sounds like this.
Speaker 4 (31:34):
Henna picture made Billy Now stay in a hotel with
a pool driven through the lexic corder's world. Captus grown
no really smart No Rushmore and Amazing all the Way Past,
(31:55):
also City Limits, A baby for minute, too big for
my breeches. But I'm just a dumstore calder. That's all
I'm never gonna be. You can take me out of
the country, but you can't say the country at me
(32:21):
because I'm still the girl from Golden I had to
get away so I could grow it.
Speaker 7 (32:26):
In my way.
Speaker 3 (32:27):
I'm going. I'll still call my hometown home.
Speaker 6 (32:33):
I'll still call my homesound.
Speaker 1 (32:52):
So this album dated in a hotel with the pool.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
What a dream being uh the Buffalo Marriott Man.
Speaker 3 (33:00):
What is it?
Speaker 1 (33:00):
Simcoe had a wheels in that wheels in slide?
Speaker 3 (33:04):
Wow?
Speaker 2 (33:04):
What a name. To our point about having sort of
a blind spot to the success of country music, this
(33:25):
album was ridiculously successful, debuted at number three on the
Billboard two hundred's, nominated for Best Country Album. The twenty
sixteen Grammys. Hits Daily Double called it an album for
the ages, comparing it to Adele's twenty one. All Music
gave it a four out of five and said pagic
material favors softness, sometimes nearly swooning in its slowness, especially
on the gorgeous Keynote High Time and The Closer Fine
(33:46):
both so deliberate and hazy. They evoke memories of lazy
high school dances, which I feel like is very much
what Casey Muscove's music sounds like. They got a B
plus from The av Club and eight from Pitchfork, a
nine from Spin, four point five from Billboard three point five,
and Rolling Stone. It was named the best Country album
of the Year by the Guardian, the twenty seventh best
album of twenty fifteen by Pace, the eighth best album
(34:07):
the year by Spin, sixth best of the Year by Time,
fiftieth by Noisy, and one of the fifty best albums
of the Year by NPR.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
She also did the Late Night Circuit and did that
Miguel remix. That's right, that was the Miguel remix. Was
my first introduction to Casey.
Speaker 2 (34:20):
Must I think it's probably my two actually waves after
this album. As we've sort of alluded to, Kasey musgraves
career has kind of blown.
Speaker 1 (34:27):
Up, blown up so large that my mom wanted tickets
to go see her with Harry Styles. She toured with
Harry's Really Yeah.
Speaker 2 (34:34):
I guess that pairing does make sense if like, the
more I think of.
Speaker 1 (34:38):
It does, but only once Casey gets out of the
country thing. But yes, you want to talk about lyrical
content and the type of audience they reached to and
the type of audience that Casey has, whether intentionally or unintentionally,
reached outside of the normal country lyrical sphere. Yeah, there's
some overlap there. And then also just like you had
some nice radio jams and my mom wanted to see them.
(35:01):
It was a really nice concert.
Speaker 2 (35:02):
Oh that's really what you Oh you went?
Speaker 1 (35:03):
Yeah, I took my mom to see Casey and Harry's
side was it was great. One of the production trucks
got held up at customs, so like the concerts started late,
and then Casey had to tighten her set. Oh, play
as much. But it was really lovely.
Speaker 2 (35:14):
That's fun.
Speaker 1 (35:15):
My mom had a nice time, my mom.
Speaker 2 (35:17):
That's what's important.
Speaker 1 (35:18):
My mom may not have the stamina for arena concerts.
I mean she certainly couldn't do a small venue concert,
but I don't know that. Like it was a long concert.
Speaker 2 (35:28):
Yeah that's fair. I guess two big acts. It's like
they're not.
Speaker 1 (35:30):
Playing even like a condensed Casey one.
Speaker 2 (35:33):
Right, it was great.
Speaker 1 (35:34):
She was awesome.
Speaker 2 (35:35):
So Serry styles so as we said. She released Golden
Hour in twenty seventeen twenty eighteen, which is a much
more pop accessible album than her previous ones. It was
also extremely well received. It received an eight point seven
from Pitchfork, an a mis from Consequence of Sound, a
four from Rolling Stone, a B plus from Wece. It
won Album of the Year, Best Country Album, Best Country Song,
(35:55):
and Best Solo Performance of the twenty eighteen Grammys. The
best Country Song was Space Cowboy. That soul performance was Butterflies.
My favorite song for that record, because that record actually
haven't bitess is this one?
Speaker 4 (36:08):
Born in a hurry, always late, haven't been rely since
Saty Texas is hid.
Speaker 3 (36:22):
I can be called Grandma.
Speaker 4 (36:25):
Crowd went up here, s my nose, good in a glass,
good all green, good winter, putting your hands all over me.
Speaker 3 (36:45):
I'm all right with a slow bur.
Speaker 4 (36:52):
Taking my time at the world turn.
Speaker 3 (36:59):
I'm going do it my way.
Speaker 4 (37:01):
It'll be all right if we burn it down and
it takes a lot. It's just so burn. Yeah, old
(37:26):
soul waiting mo turn. I know a few things, but
it still got a lot to learn. So I'm alright
with slow Burn.
Speaker 2 (37:47):
That song is, of course slow Burn, which if you
follow case of must Graves at all, you've definitely heard
it before.
Speaker 1 (37:52):
Golden Hour is so good as an album. It's like
I said earlier, number eleven on my own that Kuld
list when we did.
Speaker 2 (37:57):
That, I came, Yeah, I came to what late. I remember, like,
I know you and our friend Jacob Kramer and a
few other people were like all about it, and I
just didn't get to it that year. Like I got
to it very late in the year when I was
sort of trying to make my year end list, and
I was surprised by it. It wasn't at all what
I was expecting it to be. This isn't going to
make sense, but it makes sense in my head. It
(38:19):
was somehow more country than I expected to be, but
also more pop than I expected it to be. Okay,
Like I feel like she's really found more so than
any of the other sort of country country adjacent artists
I listened to, She's really found that like tonal balance
between the two.
Speaker 1 (38:36):
Like, yeah, it's certainly less of a country album than
Pageants Show, although like going back and listening Pageant material
more after finding that album and then prepping for this one,
I really think that anyone who liked Golden Hour would
like Pageant Material even though that's back more in the
country sphere, because like, all the things you like about
Casey are still there. Yeah, I think that's like the songwriting.
(38:57):
Her voice was obviously the biggest thing, but even just
like kind of like the lyrical aesthetics she creates. The
lyric aesthetics not the right way to say, I don't.
Speaker 2 (39:04):
Like that hazy high school dance.
Speaker 1 (39:07):
Yeah, yeah, it's just I don't know it's it's also sweet.
Speaker 2 (39:09):
Yeah, it is sweets. Sweet's the right word.
Speaker 1 (39:12):
Yeah, she's the best.
Speaker 2 (39:13):
So the other thing about Casey musk Gray is outside
of her country thing that I wanted to talk about,
you want to talk about it? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (39:20):
Well, by the way, sorry, before we move on, should
we give a favorite song just to stick with the
format of having our segment? Do you have one from
pagiet Material.
Speaker 2 (39:28):
Mine's probably Dime Store Cowgirl. I think that's probably the
it's the most interesting song in the record lyrically and musically.
Speaker 1 (39:36):
I think it's my favorite. I will say Somebody to
Love Miserable and Diyphon is a really good seven eight nine.
Like for that to be late middle of the album,
I don't love Difon, I won't, Okay. I think it's
kind of as Somebody to Love. By the way, is
also probably the closest to an Emo Casey song on
that album. Yeah, that then kind of signals where Golden
Hour might go, because I'd imagine like us throwing the
(39:57):
emo term around, you know what we mean, it's not
Casey will throw it around.
Speaker 2 (40:01):
Two, which, well, that's what we're gonna talk we want
to talk about. So I think there's two parts of
this that I want to discuss. One is what she
calls yemo, which is a mix of yeeha and Emo.
Speaker 1 (40:13):
Which I came across. I still think ye moha.
Speaker 2 (40:18):
Mohaw is better. It's better, But also then are we
talking about omaha? Like what's going on there? I also
think it's really interesting and we've sort of talked around
this so far what I like to call the rise
of the Yeehaws, which is sort.
Speaker 1 (40:30):
Of this or the yeeha agenda if you or.
Speaker 2 (40:33):
That's better this like mainstream acceptance of these alt country people,
or like not mainstream necessarily, but like the Pitchfork crowd,
like the Jason Isbel's, the High Women's.
Speaker 1 (40:46):
The festival bookers.
Speaker 2 (40:47):
Yeah, I feel like Casey Sturgill is Belle High Women,
Chris Stapleton to an extent, guys like Corey Brannon, who
has songs with like Laura Jane Grayson Dave has on
his record. Like, there's a lot more crossover I think
in the indie country world or in Casey's case, pretty
much mainstream country world. Yeah, then there used to be,
(41:08):
and I find it really interesting.
Speaker 1 (41:10):
Yeah, but I think this is to my earlier point
about like what the streaming era, and I don't want
to chalk everything up to streaming, but like it has
made music kind of borderless across genres if you want to,
and I think what you come across is artists like
kzy Musgraves who have country and emo influences, or you
(41:30):
have people who like different types of songwriting and different
types of music who want to work together. Like it's
very much. I remember not all that long ago, you know,
Nelly does a song with Tim McGraw and it's like,
what the hell, this is like the weirdest thing, but like.
Speaker 2 (41:44):
Let's let's not forget the classic that is accidental racist
with Brad Paisley and Aloo. No I can do a
whole episode just on that.
Speaker 3 (41:52):
NOE.
Speaker 1 (41:52):
Let's not please never suggest that for a bonus episode, guys.
But like that was so weird and so bizarre, and
like Lincoln Park and ja Z did the collaboration album
and it was such a weird thing. But now like it's,
like I said, it's kind of gotten borderless, where not
only because of the accessibility of music can you be
introduced to new things, But I think there's just like
(42:14):
there's less kind of siloing of the genres, and because
we're in twenty twenty and music started so long ago,
and if you were to draw out the emo tree
for every genre, like nothing is anything that's true really,
So yeah, there's country that's country, and there's rap that's rap,
and there's punk that's punk. But most bands exist somewhere
between multiple genres. And I think that just makes crossover
(42:36):
peel and crossover collaboration a lot more open. It's also
just way more interesting when you have these really talented
musicians and it doesn't really matter what their background is,
they just are really talented and make good music together.
Speaker 2 (42:46):
Yeah, I'd like it.
Speaker 1 (42:47):
Like from a consumer perspective, it's just obviously it's it's
awesome for us.
Speaker 2 (42:50):
Yeah, I mean to this point that we started talking
about with the country record industry, it exposes you to
more stuff. Yeah, I wouldn't have listened to something like
The High Women had I not seen Amanda Shires play
with Isabel like obviously they're married, but it's like, it's
just that, like you also mass consumption and mass exposure
and it's it's a good thing.
Speaker 1 (43:10):
Yeah, and you also get stuff. And this is I
think the second point that we were going to go
into is that a guy like Rustin Kelly, who I
never would have found his country music had he not
done a bunch of country emo covers.
Speaker 2 (43:22):
Which I love that he calls it dirt emo.
Speaker 1 (43:24):
Dirt that's better than eemo or EMOHI I think is
dirt emo. So rust and Kelly, for anyone who doesn't know,
is Casey Musgrave's husband. He's also a pretty good country
artist who I never would have checked out his country
stuff had I not heard him covering screaming infidelities with
Chris Garabba, a machine.
Speaker 9 (43:42):
Bird voiding spurs weed up speak in the Spottle Beest
is taking me up.
Speaker 3 (43:59):
Good on blankets and sheets. You are not alone you
are not a scream make sure no taking you home.
I'm reading you all. Oh, there's not a word a
(44:23):
comprehend except when you signed it. I love you always
and forever. We're asking no.
Speaker 4 (44:53):
Sad sound, sitting and wonder.
Speaker 3 (45:00):
How are you making it.
Speaker 7 (45:05):
As wish yow wash Jedy, any one making.
Speaker 4 (45:23):
You're screaming?
Speaker 3 (45:32):
Do tagging it? So?
Speaker 1 (45:38):
As Rustin Kelly told Billboard, it's really simple. Growing up,
we always had folk Americana country instruments in the house.
My dad's a steel guitar player. That's the first instrument
that I remember hearing. He's the one that taught me
how to play guitar and we would jam together. But
when I was coming of age, like thirteen, fourteen, fifteen,
all I wanted to play was emo and scream. Oh,
and my instrumentation for those songs just naturally lent themselves
(46:00):
to more of the folksy vibe. It's just natural for me.
So now having the ability to put it on a record,
it's really cool because I've been playing these songs like
my whole life.
Speaker 2 (46:08):
Yeah, and Casey like this my whole life. Casey Musgraves
has sort of alluded to her past as well, there
was a whole thing where she posted a picture of
herself wearing earrings and someone came at her for having
hanging ear lobes, and she tweeted, some of y'all never
were in engaging your ears in your early high school
years until your nana found your plugs and threw them away,
and it's really showing.
Speaker 1 (46:28):
Oh boy.
Speaker 2 (46:28):
She's also shared clips herself singing along to Good Charlotte's
The Anthem. She's covered Weezer's Island in the Sun on tour.
She has taken soccer Mommy out on tour before.
Speaker 1 (46:38):
She also in Something that Almost made My Heart explode.
Her and Hailey Williams were on Instagram story together singing
dashboard just too much.
Speaker 2 (46:45):
That's like, if we could curate a Blake thing, I
think it would be that on.
Speaker 1 (46:49):
An e red carpet. At one point before Golden Hour
came out, she described the album as emo country interesting,
and it's like it's not it's not literally that, but
it's not far.
Speaker 2 (46:59):
It's no more emo then you know, the world's a
beautiful place, yeah, or less emo rather, that's yeah, that's
what I mean. Like, it's I think, as all genres go,
there's just experimentation happening in EMO now it wasn't before.
Speaker 1 (47:13):
And I think that that's great, and I think there
should be experimenting in I mean, look again, that don't
tell anyone how to do their music and what they
like creatively, but I think that kind of experimentation is great.
Like I used the Russell Kelly example. I found Sam
Hunt's country stuff because he was messing around with Drake's stuff. Right,
Even someone like Orville Peck is like up for an
alternative juno, but like that's I mean, he's a eeho agenda,
(47:36):
he's an m yeho agenda.
Speaker 2 (47:38):
But but and he's a fashion icon yeah, and he's
like a queer icon. Yeah he's and he's great and
he's awesome.
Speaker 1 (47:43):
Yeah, And like he's adjacent enough that like that maybe
gets you to check up some other stuff in that
totally more typical genre. But there's still this weird like, yeah,
like why why siloed off? But I don't know, you know,
I'm not well versed enough in country to know whether
that's an industry factor or a genre fact or a
demographic factor or what or what's going on there.
Speaker 2 (48:02):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (48:03):
Yeah, so the eeeh agenda.
Speaker 2 (48:05):
Agenda is here.
Speaker 1 (48:06):
Oh also, I don't have the context for this. Casey
Musgraves tweeted in twenty eighteen, welcome to the EE Club, bitch.
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (48:14):
I'm gonna assume that's I don't know what that is.
I was gonna assume, and I'm not gonna because I
don't know.
Speaker 1 (48:19):
That's what I'm gonna start referring to our Patreon supporters
as the EE Club bitch. I think that something that
an episode like this does is by exploring music outside
of the genres we normally do. You see a lot
of the similarities, and then the contrasts between genres become
interesting things to think about, like why is country operating
a little differently? Is it operating differently or.
Speaker 2 (48:41):
Are we just like blind to it.
Speaker 1 (48:43):
Yeah, so I look forward to the discord discussions about
this and the feedback on this episode. Before we go,
we have to pick a song for the mixed thing.
Oh yes, of course, I mean we both have the
same favorite song. I think cow Girl time started. That's
easy enough. Yeah, we have to stop agreeing on that.
Speaker 2 (48:59):
I know people want the blood.
Speaker 1 (49:02):
Yeah, I don't think people recommended a Casey Muscrave's album
to hear Us Fight. That's true, just so we don't
really sweet and soft. He's also just a little unclear
about where you fit in your hometowns.
Speaker 2 (49:15):
It couldn't get more email than that.
Speaker 1 (49:16):
Checks every box checks, every box, chake anything else on
Casey before we wrap it up.
Speaker 2 (49:21):
I think so. I think that's I'm about all countried out.
Speaker 1 (49:24):
Not mean I'm gonna fire up Colden now on the
way to the arena.
Speaker 2 (49:27):
Fair enough. Think going my way home, I'm going to
start prepping for what recording next week?
Speaker 1 (49:31):
What are don't say?
Speaker 2 (49:33):
I'm not I'm not gonna do.
Speaker 1 (49:34):
I gotta double check what we're doing next week.
Speaker 2 (49:36):
I ain't saying nothing, all right, Oh yeah.
Speaker 1 (49:38):
Now I know, not because of your weird country voice,
but
Speaker 2 (50:13):
Crash on, please try to fish
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