September 30, 2024 • 64 mins
In the latest episode of Columbia House Party, hosts Jake Goldsbie and Blake Murphy are joined by their first four-time guest, Sarah MacDonald (@sarahsmacdonald, sarahsmacdonald.com), to discuss Britney Spears' debut album ...Baby One More Time. That's probably enough appearances to just call Sarah a co-host, right? Cassie Leigh Clancy (@cassleigh, co-host of the @restingonpod podcast) also joins for a segment to talk jean suits and other fashion. Find out more about why Sarah's Britney interest is strong enough for her to be back dealing with Jake and Blake, what big Britney single one host has a curious blank spot for, and how Y2K fashion is a part of the Britney cultural imprint on this week’s podcast.
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While you're there say hello to @BlakeMurphyODC and @JGoldsbie.If merch is your thing, be sure to check out the store: http://bit.ly/chpmerchOr reach out to the show and say hey: podcast@columbiahouseparty.com
If you enjoyed today’s show, please rate Columbia House Party 5-Stars on Apple Podcasts.
See you next week for another episode of CHP.
Sick of hearing all the ads? Subscribe to Soda Premium on Apple Podcasts to get rid of them!Follow @ColumbiaHP on X!
While you're there say hello to @BlakeMurphyODC and @JGoldsbie.If merch is your thing, be sure to check out the store: http://bit.ly/chpmerchOr reach out to the show and say hey: podcast@columbiahouseparty.com
If you enjoyed today’s show, please rate Columbia House Party 5-Stars on Apple Podcasts.
See you next week for another episode of CHP.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
Oh, baby baby. How was I supposed to know that
something wasn't right here? Oh baby baby, I shouldn't have
let you go. And now you're listening to the latest
episode of Columbia House Party. I had no idea how
to do that introduction. Everyone has the exact tone and
sound of that line in their head embedded already. There
(00:47):
was no way to do that. That wasn't weird.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
I mean yeah, I think it's it's rare that we have,
like the first track being the one that not only
everyone knows, but like maybe literally everyone Boddy knows.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
I can't imagine anyone would find this podcast and not
know that song short of the bajillion people that found
us because Spotify linked us to Lord on year ends,
which was a nice boost. So thank you to Spotify.
You're evil, but we appreciate the bump and listenership.
Speaker 2 (01:19):
Even more so. I think all the people who listened
to Lord and found us that way, of which I'm
sure many people listened to Lord also know this song.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
So yeah, yeah, and surely stuck around for the rest
of that podcast episodes. Jake, we're bringing back two Columbia
House Party traditions from the in person era today. The
first is you being late? Which bad commute? What's the
what's the deal here?
Speaker 2 (01:51):
I was working. I was finishing my work, all right.
I have responsibilities and things to do.
Speaker 3 (01:58):
All right.
Speaker 4 (01:58):
Well.
Speaker 1 (01:59):
The the second, the second in person tradition is saved
for later. And I might not even say it because
it runs the risk of our final segment guests just
pivoting the segment to roast me back. So I might
just leave that one in the holster. We'll see Jake.
(02:19):
Today we're talking about one of the most successful pop
albums ever and one of the industry's most popular and
controversial stars. She also happens to be, according to my mom,
my first ever crush, although I believe Alex Mack from
the Secret World of Alex Mack technically has her beat.
She is one of the highest and fastest selling artists
of the last twenty five years, with six number one records,
(02:41):
five number one singles, and immense cultural influence. Today, we're
going back to where it all started for Britney Spears
with Baby One More Time.
Speaker 5 (03:02):
I'm how was I suppose you know.
Speaker 6 (03:08):
That something wasn't round?
Speaker 7 (03:12):
Oh, I'm better, I shouldn't remember you.
Speaker 5 (03:19):
And now you're right, A side should me? How do
you want it to me?
Speaker 8 (03:26):
Sell me?
Speaker 5 (03:27):
Bay dousn't need to know now.
Speaker 8 (03:32):
I don't do this.
Speaker 9 (03:34):
Excuse me, I'm still still stays like mine.
Speaker 10 (03:46):
Give me a side, giving me.
Speaker 8 (04:13):
Time.
Speaker 1 (04:14):
I have it in my notes here, Jake, say the
name of the song in all caps. You donce because
I always forget, and the first time I remember to
do it in several episodes is the one time absolutely
nobody needs me to name the title track off Britney
Spears Baby one more Time, Baby, one more Time, Jake,
if it's not immediately clear five minutes in here, we
(04:35):
need a guest to help us through this one and
just in general, so to help us contextualize Britney Spears
Baby One more Time, we bring on our favorite regular
guest and just generally the coolest, most pleasant person, Sarah McDonald.
What's up, Sarah?
Speaker 10 (04:51):
Hi?
Speaker 4 (04:52):
How are you guys?
Speaker 1 (04:55):
I'm good, Jake's married.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
I like that we were both just like we're not.
We're not going to answer Sarah because we know whatever
we say is going to cause her to make fun
of us. So yes, I'm not going to say that.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
I can make fun of you.
Speaker 4 (05:11):
For that, I can make fun of you for the silence.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
It just see.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
How are you, Sarah?
Speaker 4 (05:18):
I'm okay. I'm staring out at darkness at five twenty
in the evening, which is absolutely crushing, So, you know,
like happy to be here.
Speaker 1 (05:27):
I guess, well, better this than just sitting there in
the darkness. I guess marginally, marginally better to be doing
this with us.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
Why are you sitting in the dark? Well, like cool?
Speaker 4 (05:38):
I mean, there's I'm sitting in my office with a
light on, but it's just dark on the other side,
and it's just a little like I'm happy to live
in a place where I have windows again, which is wonderful.
It's been such a lift. But then the downside is
that it gets dark earlier and it's five o'clock and
I'm like, yeah, it's time for bed. This checks out.
Speaker 1 (05:58):
Yeah, you did post the very nice sky photo shortly
before he came out, though, so at least he got
that going.
Speaker 2 (06:05):
I will say, as someone who lives in a different
building but apparently a very similar looking apartment, as I
messaged Sarah a little while ago being like, do we
live in the same building and found out that was
not the case, I do understand that window layout that
you have, which is very similar to ours. How now
that it gets dark at four point thirty, how it's
(06:25):
just like, oh, it's nighttime and time for bed.
Speaker 4 (06:28):
Immediately, I got actually very excited thinking that Jake lived
in the same building as me, because I think I
would be a good neighbor because I would I would
be like, I'm so excited that you're here, but I
would never bother you because I would never want to
be bothered.
Speaker 2 (06:41):
That's the perfect neighbor.
Speaker 3 (06:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:43):
Plus co cat people, so you always have someone to
feed your cats.
Speaker 4 (06:47):
Yeah, like she's so low key. Yes, I would never.
I would be like, I wouldn't even look you in
the eye if we were in the elevator together. No,
I'm kidding, I would at least acknowledge you.
Speaker 2 (06:55):
No, absolutely not. It's like the like the Friends thing
where they're just like freely going into each other's houses.
Speaker 4 (07:01):
That's crazy concerning and like, I hate Friends so much,
but I obviously grew up watching it, but like that
left such an impression on me, being like, who are
these people who do not respect boundaries? Like that's insane.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
It could be my closest friend in the world living
across the hall from me, and I would always at
least call first.
Speaker 4 (07:20):
I mean, I text my partner in the other room,
like I can't even be bothered to get up and
talk to him in person. So like, oh yeah, that's
the kind of friend I would be in a building
with you.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
So our apartment is basically one room with sliding doors
some places, and I'll still message Cassie if I need something.
Speaker 4 (07:36):
Oh man, I love aren't you?
Speaker 1 (07:38):
Guys? Lovey with windows and windows and partners and cats.
Speaker 2 (07:43):
You have so many windows?
Speaker 1 (07:45):
What are you talking in the common area? Not in
my bedroom where my office also is.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
I guess that's true. You have a window in there,
don't you.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
Well yes, but again it's an alleyway window, so it
gets no way. I can though open the open the
window to get that nice smell from the garbage bins
that are right outside of it.
Speaker 4 (08:00):
Oh yeah, gotta live living in the city, all right.
Speaker 1 (08:04):
Guys, If you are a longtime listener, even a medium
time listener, you know Sarah by now. Sarah's a freelance
music and culture writer and one of our favorites. She's
had bylines everywhere, and most recently she's taken that to
a newsletter at Curullian dot substack dot com.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
C E R U L e A N.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Make sure to check that out and subscribe. It's wonderful.
You can follow her on Twitter at Sarah s McDonald
as well, and find her work at Sarah s McDonald
dot com. We'll also tweet out all those links and
everything because cerulean is hard to spell.
Speaker 4 (08:37):
It's kind of funny making the jump to substack when
everybody else is making the jump to substack. So it's
just like you're pushing your own voice down and it's
like a nice little personal project. I have such a
weird relationship to my work now, and you know, being
like quote unquote like a public figure writer type of person.
So it's just been nice to do this at my
own pace and to think about things from why I
(08:59):
love them versus I need to have a voice about them,
which I think can happen when it comes to culture writing.
And I don't want to be that person. I was
that person like four or five years ago. My therapist
was actually like, hey, have you considered not thinking about
music to enjoy it more? And I was like, ooh,
this is why I pay you all the money.
Speaker 10 (09:16):
I do.
Speaker 1 (09:18):
As someone who turns every hobby into work. I completely understand,
and I would not listen to your therapist were it me.
Hence hence the existence of this podcast.
Speaker 4 (09:30):
I mean, like I forget forever ago you talked to
me about like music writing, and I was like, yeah,
you should do it. I would be so happy for
you to do this, Like I really want to read
your thoughts, and then I think about the work involved
and I'm like, ah, god, I just like I don't
wish that on anyone, and yet here we are.
Speaker 1 (09:45):
Yeah, it's the exact opposite of when Zoobs told me
not to go into sports writing.
Speaker 4 (09:52):
Quick zub story. We recently followed each other on Twitter,
and man, it's been a delight, like a real delight,
just having another friend in and around the Waterloo regions.
Speaker 2 (10:10):
If we're another region podcast, I am leaving. I already
do one of those a week with Zoobs.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
I don't mean Barah Lauren. We talked about constantines, Zoobs,
there's a there are no there's no end to the
region content.
Speaker 4 (10:28):
Well, you know what to do, Jake, Like, when it's
time to leave Toronto, that's where you go.
Speaker 2 (10:34):
I might as well be Detroit to Jake, Oh, buddy,
I don't know if I don't know if you guys
know this, but there is a running joke amongst my
friends that my southern Ontario geography is basically non existent.
Speaker 1 (10:50):
Come up on this podcast multiple times.
Speaker 4 (10:52):
You mean you've only been like in and around Toronto.
Speaker 2 (10:54):
No, I've been to all the places. I just don't
know how to get there where they.
Speaker 4 (10:57):
Are the four A one, it's just so easy.
Speaker 1 (11:00):
Yeah, but what those in two directions? Sarah?
Speaker 2 (11:02):
Right, Ye, I don't know what's I don't know what's
east and what's west. If it's coming up in this
podcast before, and you've listened to this and heard that
I was going to apologize, but also you should know
better by now. And also whatever time is fake.
Speaker 1 (11:16):
We're gonna take a break and we're gonna talk about
baby one more time after this. Britney's history is very
well known and we have a lot to talk about
(11:38):
in the back end of this podcast, so we're going
to zoom through it very quickly, if that's okay with
the two of you, and even if it's not, because
I'm I'm in control here. I got the steering wheel. So,
as a lot of people know, Britney Spears was a
child star of sorts. She started performing in dance as
early as three and as song as early as five.
She did the talent show circuit, which is just very
(12:01):
sad to think about anyone doing. She tried out for
the Mickey mouse Club revival and was rejected, and then
went to a professional performing arts school. The family moved
to New York to put her in that program. She
was cast in Off Broadway and then went on Star Search,
was in a bunch of commercials, and then finally got
cast on The Mickey mouse Club. Now check out this
(12:23):
draft class. This is like the Lebron Dwayne Wade, Carmelo, Anthony,
Chris Bosch, Darko milicic draft class for the Mickey mouse Club.
Britney Spears, Christina Aguilera, Justin Timberlake, Ryan Gosling.
Speaker 2 (12:35):
Carrie Russell, who's the Darko?
Speaker 1 (12:39):
I guess Krrie Russell is the only one of those
who hasn't done music stuff.
Speaker 4 (12:43):
I think, Yeah, she's in Star Wars, so like.
Speaker 2 (12:46):
Oh no, she's great, but it's the worst Star Wars.
But she was in the Americans and Felicity, so like
and Felicity.
Speaker 1 (12:54):
Yeah, you asked who's the Darko, I mean the other four.
She's the fifth most successful of those people. Darko had
ten year NBA career and made like twenty five million dollars.
It's not being the dark Oisn't that bad? All right?
Because we need another music clip. Here is a clip
of childhood Britney Spears seeing some covers. I left this
one up to Dylan. I'm very excited to see which
(13:16):
of the covers I sent Dylan he chooses to include here.
Speaker 8 (13:34):
No battle.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
So the more important note than Britney Spears being this
budding child star through the Mickey mouse Club was that
she was also a starting point guard on her basketball team.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
Wow, Her and averall secret sports stars.
Speaker 1 (14:37):
After the Mickey mouse Club stuff, Britney Spears was supposed
to be in a female pop group called in a sense,
yes not Innocence in a sense that name reminds me
of I'm sure you guys have seen, but maybe not recently,
that thing you do where the one guy in the
band is obsessed with coming up with like a really
bad punny name for the band.
Speaker 2 (14:57):
This is why I.
Speaker 4 (14:58):
Hated pop music for such a long time time as
a teenager, Like I can't forgive this of pop music.
I really can't.
Speaker 2 (15:04):
Just like the names.
Speaker 4 (15:06):
Yeah, just like the like doubling down on really corny names,
the puns, just like thinking that they're being clever but
they're not. It's just drives me crazy.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
You weren't a sole decision, fan, I can't.
Speaker 4 (15:23):
I won't say anything to that.
Speaker 1 (15:25):
I receive it, okay. So Brittany was saved from in
a sense by a family friend named Larry Rudolph, who
instead had her do a demo to pitch the labels.
She was turned down by multiple labels who only wanted
boy bands and girl bands, until Jeff Finster of Jive
Records was impressed, had her audition and signed her. So
they got her working with producer Eric Foster White, who
(15:48):
Jake you mentioned Max Martin earlier. Him and Eric Foster White.
Basically they weren't the only two writers on this album,
but they split the heavy part of the workload. Brittany
originally wanted to be like a Cheryl type, but realized
that it made more sense to go pop and as
she put it, that would allow her to dance more,
which was more in line with her personality, so worked
with Eric Foster White, worked with Max Martin worked with
(16:10):
a few other producers to release this album in January
of nineteen ninety nine. Now a very of the time
thing is that maybe one more time. The single had
come out four months prior, three months prior in October.
I'm bad at calendars. Apparently it was massive, so it
was one of the biggest singles ever. We played it
off the top, you know, the song ten million in
(16:31):
sales as a single worldwide, platinum everywhere, number one everywhere,
So expectations are obviously very high at that point. So
then Sometimes was the second single, and I don't remember
Sometimes being a single, Like, I don't really remember that.
Speaker 2 (16:49):
Song much at all.
Speaker 4 (16:50):
I do really the video and this is of a video,
like this is the video age, right, Like when I
think of these songs, the first thing I'm thinking is visually,
because they were on the countdown?
Speaker 2 (16:59):
Yeah, yeah, agreed.
Speaker 1 (17:01):
Is this the one with the like, uh the like
viewfinder thing?
Speaker 4 (17:04):
Yeah, and she like is like she's swerved so innocent
in this video, you know, like wearing the white or
like baby blue and stuff and looks looks very much
like a young woman versus like, I guess whatever sort
of age A fied person she was in Baby One
More Time with like the tied up shirt and stuff.
Speaker 2 (17:24):
You're very right about it being entirely visual because as
someone who had not listened to the rest of this record,
like obviously my Britney Spears knowledge is limited to her singles,
but I can tell you what each one from this
era is based on what's happening in the music video.
Speaker 4 (17:41):
Yeah, And I don't know if we can say the
same like the now, Like I'm sure like there are
music videos now, but it's not like how how ubiquitous
is it seeing that on the countdown for like two
three months straight?
Speaker 2 (17:53):
Right? If you say to me, like like she's standing
on the cliff, that's I'm not a girl, not yet
a woman, a song I've not listen to in twenty years.
But I remember the video.
Speaker 1 (18:04):
Yeah, yeah, yes, So that was the number two single,
and for whatever reason, I have this incredible blank spot
for it. Apparently the next single, though, I do not,
and I absolutely remember the video because it had Springing
to the teenage Witch in it and Vinny Chase pre
(18:24):
Viny Chase. The next single was You Drive Me Crazy say.
Speaker 5 (18:30):
I'm soolutely to you. You got that something? What can
I do send me.
Speaker 7 (18:43):
There's moving, but I can't do it that time Mahat
was jump in.
Speaker 5 (18:54):
It's easy to see.
Speaker 8 (18:58):
So well the dang I am.
Speaker 5 (19:07):
I just think.
Speaker 8 (19:10):
I'm so excited, but it meives me all night.
Speaker 1 (19:46):
A great movie, yes, yes, a great movie as well.
I guess I want to ask, like going back to
the videos, especially like sometimes to You Drive Me Crazy,
there is like, even though these songs are off the
same album, there's like this weird growing up in how
Britney is presented and obviously like she was like very
sexualized for a teen in the Maybe One More Time video,
(20:09):
but the Crazy video kind of like dials that up.
I don't know, Jake, you have you have thoughts on
this song, don't you.
Speaker 2 (20:15):
I don't really have thoughts on any like individual song,
but I do remember this song really and I remember
the video. But to your point that you were saying
about like not as many singles as you would have thought,
I this. I didn't realize there were two early Britney albums.
I didn't realize that oops, I did it again, was
(20:35):
not this album.
Speaker 4 (20:37):
I thought they were, Yeah, because it came out the
year after, Like they really went back to back with it.
Speaker 2 (20:41):
Yeah, like I thought lucky and oops, I did it again,
and I guess I'm not a girl. Is that the
Crossroads one?
Speaker 1 (20:47):
I think that's the next See, so I have no idea.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
They're all one album to me. And then she made
Toxic and it was different. That's how I think of Brittany.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
I think that's kind of fair. I guess at this point,
like we're going to talk about how this album was
received in a little bit, but obviously, like when you
go single, the single, the single, like this, the expectations
kind of become their own thing. Sarah, I know this
is one of your favorite songs on the album, but
you were you? I guess what I'm trying to get
(21:18):
at is like were you you bought this album for
the single and then liked everything and then we're excited
to see the singles roll out or how did you?
How did you kind of consume this over the Like
albums had like a two year life cycle at this point,
which is really weird to think back and remember like
singles coming out six months apart, but that was the case.
Speaker 4 (21:37):
Yeah, I mean, like this was like right in my
sort of pop heyday as a child, Like I was
an actually boys girl for life at that point, and
like InSync could like, you know, drop into a hole
and I would be so happy about that. Like it
was really like divided in my household, and because.
Speaker 11 (21:52):
Like what.
Speaker 2 (21:55):
What, I'm on the other I'm on the other side
of that argument.
Speaker 4 (21:59):
Fun fact, I've interviewed justin Timberlake and it was like
one of the best things to be on the other side,
being like you don't impress me and I'm going to
hold that petty thought for the rest of my life
because I'm a scorpio.
Speaker 2 (22:11):
But so what, so what you're justin Timberlake.
Speaker 4 (22:14):
Yeah, I was like, literally who cares? Who cares? But
I loved you know, like I loved Backshet Boys, and
they were always like my kind of entry point into this.
But because Baby One More Time was always on TV,
was always on every countdown that I watched, and like,
I was just mesmerized by that video because I was like,
what ten years old, and I think my sister had
just gone into high school and I always thought I
(22:34):
was older than I actually was. So I really wanted
to be like that. I really wanted to be this
like feminine child, and I felt like Brittany could be
my guiding light with that, and then that changed over
the next few years. But like, I really loved the
record when I bought it, but I bought it off
the strength of one single, which is how you know,
I always bought music as as a child, even when
(22:56):
I was downloading stuff on LimeWire, like six seven years later,
is off the strength of a single. And then maybe
I would like the record. I wouldn't spend so much
money as I did I would be buying I would
be getting it for free. But yeah, I mean it's
one of those albums that I think is I think
(23:16):
maybe one more time, the song is indicative of Brittany
and a time period and not so much the album,
if that makes sense, Because the song is so removed
from this record, to me, it will always live above it.
It will always live in its own kind of space
and time.
Speaker 2 (23:37):
I think I agree with that, even without having attachment
to the record itself, because it was like this stratostrophic
like thing for me, especially because it's sort of I'm
going to get my timeline wrong. Also, but like I
feel like that really kicked off the sort of like
pop boom.
Speaker 3 (23:54):
Of that time.
Speaker 4 (23:55):
It did right, like you had Christina Aguilera after that,
and you know, justin Simpson and stuff like that, and
you know, like that competitiveness. Like I think, yeah, you
had the boy bands like, but then when you had
like the pop solo women, it was a totally different conversation, right.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
And I feel like there's pre maybe one more time
and post big one more time in terms of that.
So I think I think that makes sense that being
sort of a separate.
Speaker 1 (24:19):
Thing, Sarah. I just wanted to dig in on one
other thing that you mentioned. You said that kind of
like this album or that the timing of this album
was kind of connected to your like I guess early feminism,
and then you said that that shifted, and I just
want to dig in more on how that shifted a
(24:40):
couple of years later and whether the liner notes you
have from this album are still in good shape.
Speaker 4 (24:45):
Oh okay, So, like I said, I think when I
was a kid, I saw this as like, this is,
you know, the kind of woman I'm supposed to be,
this pristine white kid and who's blonde. And I was
going through puberty and it was not fun and I
didn't look like that. But I started to have different
(25:07):
feelings about Baby one More Time, just kind of outside
of whatever tragedies and miseries that puberty brought upon me.
And then I just like felt really defeated by it,
that it was hollow, Like I just remember listening to
Baby One More Time, Like I said, Baby one More
Time is the only song that after I bought this
record I could listen to. But then when I listened
(25:28):
to the rest of it, like Sometimes or Email my
Heart or like Soda Pop, which was like such a
trip to listen to the other day, like these these
also feel so of like a specific time, I just
got really mad. I got really resentful of the fact
that this is what I was supposed to be and
I didn't feel like I had I could be this person.
(25:49):
So I started to black out Brittany's eyes and her smile,
and I ripped up the liner notes and I destroyed
thet I cracked it in half and I threw it
in the garbage.
Speaker 12 (26:03):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (26:05):
Yeah, uh didn't there. Yeah it was.
Speaker 4 (26:10):
It was like the most I guess aggressive rejection of
uh this idea of womanhood, which is what Brittany was in,
which I think led to her down downfall, because she
became the vessel of everybody's ideas that like even she
couldn't even uphold or didn't even want to uphold, and
(26:30):
that's what happened to that CD. So now I don't
have it and the liner notes are not intact.
Speaker 2 (26:35):
It is a lot.
Speaker 4 (26:35):
It's been twenty years since I've done that, so and
then I've fully moved on to my Michelle Branch phase
of life and then onward a dog.
Speaker 1 (26:43):
So yeah, what a great shirt, that Michelle Branch shirt
I had. I should have worn it, you know, that
was one of my options.
Speaker 4 (26:50):
Like if you ever want me back to talk about
Michelle Branch, like the years I spent trying to perfect
those glossy lips that she has, Like it pains me
to think that I'll never achieve that. Look, it really
pains me.
Speaker 1 (27:01):
Well, I mean there's still time. Its pivot us back
just a little bit, so you drive me crazy. I
kind of remember it being bigger than what not that
a top ten single isn't big, But it only hit
number ten on the Billboard chart, and I would have
swore it was number one. I mean she performed it
on Sabrina the Teenage Witch, which coming you know, the
(27:23):
TGIF lineup right after the Munch Countdown on Fridays. Boy,
I didn't think a song got bigger than that.
Speaker 4 (27:30):
Do you guys watch like Angel and TGIF two, Like
if you're going to commit to t G if you
commit to TGIF, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:37):
I feel like my TGIF experiences were pre that, Like
I was very much in the Boy Meets World years
and then Sabria. Sabrina to me is like a Saturday
Morning show, not a not a TGIF show. Am I wrong?
Speaker 11 (27:52):
No?
Speaker 4 (27:52):
She was definitely TGIF yeah, like prime Time?
Speaker 1 (27:56):
Yeah, you're wrong. Maybe maybe I'm wrong, idiot. One of
the other songs you mentioned, Sarah that I want to
take us to because not only is this album full
of bangers, it's also quite prophetic. As you wrote in
a Vice article in twenty sixteen about the song email
my Heart.
Speaker 5 (28:23):
It's been out since a day since you went away,
and not I do Jack the scream to see it? You? Okay,
you don't it so because you want to be left alone,
(28:43):
So up sending your mad mussle And this is what
else say I'm sorry, I'm so sorry.
Speaker 8 (28:54):
Can't you get me.
Speaker 5 (28:57):
Check to make.
Speaker 8 (29:04):
You and say.
Speaker 5 (29:11):
I know you love them and I know what you
still kill.
Speaker 8 (29:19):
Me and say.
Speaker 1 (29:36):
Email, So Sarah, I won't do that awkward thing of
reading your article back to you on the air, but
run us, run us through a little bit of how
email my heart predicted the future.
Speaker 4 (29:53):
Yeah, it's it's pretty it's pretty clear. It's I am
going to read my own own stuff. I hate reading
my own stuff, but I also hate more. Just like, hey, Blake, listen,
I also wrote something that has to do with this
podcast episode, like one day, I want you to choose
something that I've never written about but only think about.
(30:14):
It would bring me such great joy.
Speaker 1 (30:16):
But yeah, I just sorry, Sorry, put me on blast
for trying to bring you on to episodes that I
know you're passionate about. Okay, we'll bring you on for
an episode you don't you haven't cared enough to write about.
Speaker 4 (30:30):
Just bring me like I'm upset you didn't bring me
on olymp Biscuit episode. Like I could just talk about
fred Durst all day. Also, Brittany dated Fred Durst? Did
do we mention this at all?
Speaker 1 (30:39):
Are we going to talk about this?
Speaker 2 (30:41):
What I didn't say that?
Speaker 4 (30:43):
I just didn't know that that they absolutely phone down.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
Okay, I have two questions. One, what's the age difference
there and two when did this happen?
Speaker 4 (30:55):
It was definitely in the early two thousands. I think
it was like post two thousand and three, justin Yeah,
it was after the breakup?
Speaker 2 (31:01):
Is that post k fed or pre k fed pre
k fed? Wow? What a I mean you would have
thought that.
Speaker 1 (31:08):
You can go downhill after Fred Durst?
Speaker 2 (31:11):
You know what, though, that's like a good transitional bridge
to go from Timberlake and then like Durst to Fetterline.
That's I see the path there. That makes sense.
Speaker 4 (31:20):
Yeah, I guess I'll circle myself back to my own article.
Speaker 1 (31:24):
Sure, so you.
Speaker 2 (31:27):
Brought up Fred Durst. We can't not talk about it.
Speaker 1 (31:30):
I was, yeah, I'm gonna I'm gonna call culling in
right now for his tea.
Speaker 4 (31:36):
Yeah. No, I So I wrote this article because it
was it was it was in twenty sixteen. I started
twenty nineteen or twenty sixteen, because it was right around
the twenty aniversary of the record, and I was like,
what's a fun thing that anybody like that? Like, what's
a fun angle that no one's gonna think of? And
I was like, email, my heart seems very of the moment,
but also super predictive. Because like I basically wrote this
(31:56):
article to think thinking that. You know, when I was
a kid, all I could think about was just like
writing emails and being in the chat room with other
kids talking to them other kids quotation marks, but just
like communicating digitally that way, and that felt comfortable and safe.
And I think that Email my Heart was really like
the catalyst for how we talk to each other today,
(32:17):
you know, like sending these long emails to each other,
sending long dms to each other. Like I can count
on my hand to the number of people who text
me or call me, versus sending me messages in Instagram
dms or Twitter dms and stuff that. And it's just
a pop song. I realized this. I realized that it
doesn't need to be as deep as it is. But
(32:39):
I don't know. I think Email my Heart is is
it perfectly? It perfectly captures the last twenty years, and
I think the next twenty years of how we are
going to profess our feelings for one another. And this
weird song that starts with like an Elton John like
piano intro, it just it's so cheesy.
Speaker 1 (33:00):
No pressure, sixteen year old Britney, You're just dictating the
next forty years of human communication. Okay, so as much
as that seems exaggerative, people did absolutely treat Britney Spears
like she had that much power and was that important culturally.
Baby One More Time got mixed reviews and was kind
of derided a little bit as silly or childish. She
(33:21):
got Girl next Door version of Madonna, but the top
forty readiness got it some decent reviews as well as
some of the truly awful kind of reviews that I'm
sure you can imagine about a teenage pop star at
the turn of the century. Now, Brittany had a lot
of success as well. Obviously, she won Billboard Female Artist
teen Choice Album. She was nominated for an AMA and
(33:44):
a Blockbuster Entertainment Award. She was also nominated for that
Foreign Juno category that doesn't even make sense, since why
why the Canadian Music Awards have a highest selling foreign album. Anyway,
she was nominated for a Juno. She sold one hundred
and twenty one copies in her first week, broke a
bunch of records along the way, A ton based on age,
(34:04):
a ton for overall success, a bunch for having the
chart topping single and album at the same time, and
eventually Maybe One More Time became the fourteenth album of
the nineties to sell ten million copies plus it was
certified diamond. It spent fifty one weeks in the top ten,
beaten only by Millennium from the Backstreet Boys. It had
(34:25):
one hundred and three weeks on the chart in total,
and as of two thousand and three, had sold twenty
five million copies. In time, it's been given kind of
iconic status, credited with helping usher in the revival of
teen pop, and Billboard listed it as the number forty
one of their top two hundred albums of all time. Jake,
(34:46):
I'm curious as to your take on when we you know,
obviously with something like this, there's gonna be mixed reviews
no matter what, and there's gonna be mixed retrospectives on it.
But I'm curious as to your take on whether Britney
would be received differently today, given that you know, the
climate now is maybe a little more like poptimism friendly
(35:07):
to use a very broad term.
Speaker 2 (35:10):
I mean yes and no, I think, And the only
reason I say no is because the reason that all
that one of the main reasons that all that stuff
is better received now is because of her, So like,
I don't think the love for pop music that exists
for our generation as older thirty year old Ish millennials
(35:35):
could exist without the pop foundations that Brittany and Christina
and en Sync and etcetera, etcetera, etcetera did back then.
So it's one of those like I don't know if
it's just because we've been rewatching loss so so my
brain is at but it is one of those like
things where if we're talking technically, yes, she would be
(35:56):
better received now, but she also but it also wouldn't
exist without her. But if we're just talking this hypothetical
world where everything goes the same, just Brittany comes out
now and all music sensibility is exactly the same, I
think she would be hugely well received now because I
think now it would be like, oh, it's a throwback
to because it is more like the pop of today
(36:17):
for the most part, is a little less bubble gum
to paint with a reductive term, I think, but also
it's still the same kind of craft. I think, like
there's obvious links between Carl Ray or a dua Lipa
and this album, and I think I think I also
think even regardless of how it would be received, it
(36:39):
definitely wouldn't be as quickly dismissed as it was back then,
Like it was very much all pop music then was
very much from the like in Giant Air quotes cool kids,
like completely derided and dismissed, like there's no I was reading, uh,
pitch Works one hundred Best Songs of the Year today
(37:02):
and like, no judgment on what's in there or not,
but like the amount of pop that's in there top
hundred would not have been in the top hundred of
Pitchfork in nineteen ninety nine, And I think I just
think that she would have. I'm not sure exactly how
it would have been received, but I definitely don't think
it would have been so derided and dismissed as pap
(37:27):
that pop music of that era was by like the
rock kids or the hip kids or whatever you want
to call it.
Speaker 1 (37:33):
Yeah, I'm not sure i'd use the word PAP, but
I get what you're saying.
Speaker 2 (37:36):
Otherwise, it's an old phrase, sure, And.
Speaker 1 (37:42):
For anyone who hasn't seen Lost, what Jake is trying
to describe is that contextualizing if Britney came along now
gets us into a hot tub time machine situations. That's
surely the more culturally relevant way to phrase that than
Looper or lost or anything like that. There was also
so as Britney's career rolled on, I think probably a
(38:02):
little bit of Brittany fatigue. She followed with Oops, I
Did Again in two thousand, which sold twenty million. We
number one was certified diamond. She had Britney in two
thousand and one nine million in sales, four times platinum,
number one, and in the Zone in two thousand and
three six million in sales, two times platinum, number one.
All very successful albums, but you see them kind of
(38:23):
going on the downswing. Finally, she takes an actual gap
in between albums and releases Blackout in two thousand and seven,
which is probably the album of hers that I think
is the biggest victim of Like people had preconceptions about
Brittany and weren't willing to give new stuff from her
(38:44):
a chance. I think that album's actually good. I know
Sarah does as well. This is give me more off
that album.
Speaker 11 (38:50):
It's Britney, bitch. Fritz and some the lightest just want
(39:16):
to go the extra mole for you problem to display
of a faction feels like no one else someone can
you do ro the snow allow you don't.
Speaker 5 (39:32):
Give me her rocket?
Speaker 8 (39:33):
Do not get your rocket?
Speaker 13 (39:35):
Calls a flash and away the band See I can't.
Watching rocket Watch feels like a brodishly make me, can
make give me, can.
Speaker 8 (39:53):
Look to me.
Speaker 5 (39:55):
And make me.
Speaker 1 (40:28):
So Sarah, you will argue for that album, right for Blackout?
Speaker 4 (40:32):
Yeah, I mean I argue that like more than anything,
I want Britney Spears' legacy not to be baby one
more time. You know it's Britney Bitch, Like that's it's iconic.
I was reading I think it was like Rob Schaffield
or something that this is her most punk album, and
I would agree that it's like it's the one where
she really let you know, herself be in control, as
(40:57):
chaotic as that time is for her. I was, I
was reading like these they're just like it's such like
it's such a obviously tragic arc that she has over
the past like twenty years, but like reading the massive
essay and Rolling Stone of like the tragedy of Britney
Spears and all the people who were around her as
she's making this record, and like the writer being like
(41:17):
told that she can't interview Brittan unless there's like a
million in cash and stuff like that, and just the
tension between Brittany and the paparazzi and the way that
we look at her, Like this album obviously wouldn't exist
without all of that, which is I think the hardest
thing to reconcile as much as I love it, but
it is. It's I think, to Jake's point that you know,
(41:40):
if Britney were successful now, it's it is on the
strength of people accepting pop music because the craft itself,
like it's pretty easy to it's not pretty easy to
write a pop song. It can be, but it's pretty
formulaic and people can kind of get on board with that.
And I think here, I don't know, I think I
get like shades of Billy Eilish from Blackout, you know,
(42:02):
like there's there's a rawness to it over this pop sound,
over obviously this immense amount of hurt that she has.
And I don't know, I think I think Blackout is
her best one and obviously super underappreciated.
Speaker 1 (42:15):
Yeah so so naturally it being the best and most
interesting and stuff. It's her first album not to go
number one and the worst selling of her first six albums.
Sarah has mentioned a couple times now kind of what
has happened to Britney, since that's beyond the scope of
this episode, both because we're talking about her very first
album and because to do that sensitively we'd need, you know,
(42:37):
thirty forty fifty minutes, So recommend that Rolling Stone profile.
Recommend Jezbel essay from November from Emily Alfred as well.
In twenty nineteen, Brittany did go on an indefinite work hiatus,
canceling one of her Vegas residencies. There's been a lot
of unfortunate stuff back and forth with her, her father
(42:58):
Jamie and his handling of her and his public comments,
and then the you know, the conservatorship and that being
contested in a very public way. So you can find
lots of that in the Rolling Stone article, in the
Jezebel essay, lots of other places. Brittany did have four
more albums after that. She was also a fembot in
(43:19):
Austin Powers three, which I only mentioned because I rewatched
the first Austin Powers because it hit Netflix and it
actually held up okay, And the third Austin Powers is
probably the worst movie I've ever seen. We are not
going to talk much more about Austin Powers, but after
this break, we're going to bring on another guest, the
(43:41):
I think the first ever two guests on the same episode. Yeah,
we'll see after this, all right. So here to help
(44:03):
us through some of the fashion and cultural influence of
this era of Brittany is Jake's wife.
Speaker 6 (44:09):
Hi, Cassie, Oh hello, how's it going?
Speaker 1 (44:12):
Well?
Speaker 6 (44:12):
How are you trying to get into the chair? Because
Jake kind of just snapped at me.
Speaker 2 (44:17):
I was really.
Speaker 1 (44:18):
Exciting your intro. I was really dragging your intro out
because it sounded like you guys were having trouble.
Speaker 6 (44:25):
Well, yeah, because we have like the one mic, so
we've never had to do something at the same time before.
So it makes it really complicated, does it, though?
Speaker 1 (44:33):
Because what is Jake and to have to contribute to
this section?
Speaker 6 (44:35):
No, he just walked away. He's not even in the
room anymore.
Speaker 1 (44:39):
Ran he ran away, all right then, So, Cassie, at
the risk of you turning this around on me, The
second Columbia house party tradition from the in person episodes
that I wanted to bring up the earlier one was
Jake being late. The second one is you continued our
earlier tradition of someone being too hungover to do their notes,
So thank you for that. It feels like a throwback episode.
Speaker 6 (45:02):
That was absolutely me. I was I was pretty hungover,
but I did it and they're better. They're better than ever.
So yeah, get ready because I have some stuff for you.
Speaker 1 (45:12):
Yeah, I don't uh, you know, I don't want to
be a third cook here too much. So basically, what
Cassie brought to us, Sarah, is that or what you
want to talk about was that the videos and we
touched on this a little bit earlier, is that the
videos and the fashion and everything around Brittany and Sillery
to the music is very pivotal to getting Britney. So Cassie, Sarah,
(45:35):
I'm just going to kind of hand it to you
guys for now. So Cassie, if you want to, if
you want to lead us through this, it's all you perfect.
Speaker 6 (45:41):
Thank you. So, first of all, I want to do
a little bit of a summary about what why two
K Aesthetic is because I think that's really important to
understanding who Britney is. So Why two K Aesthetic kind
of started in nineteen ninety eight, and went to about
two thousand and three, and it was really because people
(46:01):
were experiencing this anticipation and joy with the rise of technology.
So we have we have cell phones coming out that
aren't like the ridiculous Zach Morris phone, and we have
the Internet, which is like a real thing now. But
then we also have the threat of the end of
the world, so everybody's kind of gripped in that. So yeah,
I mean, we've kind of gone full circle at this point.
(46:28):
So the year two thousand was kind of sold to
us as this entirely new era, like a time of
rich prosperity or possibly the end of the world. So
you could go either way, so spend, spend, spend because
you don't have a lot more time, and the culture
kind of continued on with that, so it was it
was all shaped by luxury. It was a futuristic trends
(46:49):
and like a real push to inform the mass is
that you need to own this. So when it comes
to the actual esthetic, like frankly, it's a little bit
of a mess. It's it's a lot of rich stuff,
but done so that any consumer could get it. So
they wanted to make it a lot easier for everybody
(47:11):
to buy. And uh, I mean it's it's a lot
when you look back on it. But in my own opinion,
I don't think that there's an era that gave us
so much fun as Y two K and like just
generally how you got to yeah or.
Speaker 4 (47:28):
Many dot but cracks I think, or thongs for that matter,
or hip bone.
Speaker 6 (47:33):
Yeah all so important, or like like the mess shirts
that I tried to rock all of the time that
I could absolutely not pull off. But uh, but we
we got to have like a lot of fun with fashion.
It was a lot. It was a lot of shiny metal,
a lot of low rise jeans, it was thongs sticking out,
which we absolutely have to credit to Grassy for being
(47:53):
the show to really bring that to the forefront of culture.
I want to say so thank you to a great
for giving us Britney's ass.
Speaker 1 (48:03):
Cassie. I'm just gonna jump in here and we're gonna
talk about Britney's ass and everyone's ass a little bit more.
I asked you before you came on, what you think
the song on the album that kind of best goes
with what we're talking about here. I'm gonna play it
for everyone now, just just as you You've set the
scene so well for Y two K just gonna play.
The beat goes on, so get it in the proper mood.
(48:25):
The the cover of the Sonny and Chare song with
help from all seeing a britt electronic group, this is
the beat goes on.
Speaker 5 (48:53):
Reached the page. We still want to hear nothing of her.
We do so nothing. Emma grows up.
Speaker 12 (49:19):
And they grows up, and they grows up, and they
throws off and they grows up. Canna be brows.
Speaker 5 (49:36):
I don't know rem to lady Lady him, Lady Lady.
Speaker 1 (49:45):
Downsdayday alway, Okay, Cassie, So where does where does Britney
(50:14):
fit into all of this? Because she's not exactly you know,
when when you came on our No episode to talk
about Gwen Stefani, you use the term I think style
icon or fashion icon, and you don't feel that way
about Brittany really.
Speaker 6 (50:27):
So it's it's kind of difficult because she is and
she isn't. She she's a style icon because we made
her one, but she's not stylist.
Speaker 4 (50:38):
I mean then that makes sense, right, Like that's.
Speaker 6 (50:41):
Like, oh yeah, and I have I have a background
for you that you're going to just eat up. It's fantastic.
But I would say that she's she's the real embodiment
of this hole aesthetic because she made the look something
accessible we could run out as thirteen year olds and
buy everything she was wearing at Zeller's or Clare's. Like,
(51:02):
this wasn't a difficult look to pull off. It might
have been a bit inappropriate looking back, but it was
absolutely something that like I myself as a thirteen fourteen
year old girl, could go and do. It was really easy,
and we get the mid drift tops, we get the
accessibility of who she was as a person, and she
was who I personally really wanted to be. She was
(51:26):
that sweet girl next door with like a little bit
of country with her personality, but then this air of
high fashion in what she wore, with these bright colors
and these vibrant, flowing things and always an exposed mid drift.
So it should come as no surprise, and I don't
want to shock anybody, but she did not dress herself
in these years. She obviously had a very large team
(51:50):
to prepare her image and get us all out to
the store to buy the replicas, and they really set
the scene for this innocent versus sexy, like they wanted
to embody the virginal, the very sweet, but also someone
that was really, really hot. And I think that both
men on this podcast can attest to that.
Speaker 8 (52:15):
Little bit.
Speaker 4 (52:16):
Where's Jake because he's still in the other room.
Speaker 6 (52:19):
Yeah, he's hiding. He's looking at pictures of Brittany.
Speaker 1 (52:24):
Look, it's obviously it worked and it served its purpose.
What I'm more upset with is that I didn't live
in a or you know, at this time, I was
a preteen, Like I just wore whatever my parents bought me.
I wasn't into buying my own clothes yet. I just
I feel like me missing the era where the new
(52:45):
fee tuxedo, like the whole denim outfit was cool. It's
just like a missed opportunity, Like, honestly is that is
the garment of my people and Justin Timberlake brought that
to the to the masses, and I didn't get to
be a part of that. And I don't think I
have the influence to bring it back, you know.
Speaker 6 (53:06):
Well, And that's what's so interesting because now I look
back on those infamous photos. So for any reference points
that you guys are looking for out there. This is
the two thousand and one American Music Awards red carpet
look of Justin Timberlake and Britney Spears wearing the complete
gene outfits. And you're crazy if you don't know what
(53:29):
that is, because it's the most iconic look perhaps of
the decade.
Speaker 1 (53:34):
Yeah, question, denim, It's got to be the only denim hat, right.
Speaker 6 (53:40):
So, I mean like it's it's been reinvented by several people.
We have a Victoria's Secret Model, supermodel Devin Windsor, who
did it with her boyfriend, and probably more memorably, Katie
Perry and Riffraff in twenty fourteen replicated the look on
the red carpet. So I was MTV Awards, I believe.
So let's talk about those looks a little bit, because
(54:03):
that's why we're really here, honestly. So there's a lot
of speculation that went around with these Gene looks because
like who did it? Why did you do it? And
like how come a lot of a lot of upset,
I would say, in confusion. So about two years into
(54:23):
their two year reign as the Pop Prince and Princess
Brittany and then boyfriend Justin Timberlake approached Justin's stylist with
en Sync and his name is Stephen Gerstein. So Steven
had been working with encinc for quite a while and
he was he started kind of in costume design, which
is why all of their looks were so interesting. For
(54:46):
lack of a better word, so Brittany had basically had
this dream of an all denim look for the Red Carpet,
and Gerstein had made himself known that he could kind
of make things happen, like when the boys would be
on tour, it would be like, oh, I like this
leather jacket, Like can you get me that? And then
build a look around that. So he was very approachable
when it came to creating looks that you wanted to do.
(55:08):
So basically what he did for Justin's suit, the suit
that Blake wants to reinvent. They took the suit that
he wore for the Celebrity album cover and just remade
it in Denham. He basically sent his people out to
buy fifty pairs of vintage Levi's and then they were
stitched together by a woman named Linda Stokes. And she
(55:30):
was this little old lady who worked twenty four hours
a day, and if it weren't for her, a lot
of la wouldn't have gotten dressed. It seems she did
all of the stitch work for everybody's Red Carpet looks.
For Brittany, her dress was a little bit more interesting,
I think because she was then working with Curtain Bart
(55:51):
and so they're costume designers who had their beginnings in
the nineteen eighties in the club scene with people like
Warhol and then later on Bowie and they more recently
designed the looks for the Hunger Games, which is pretty
cool because those looks are pretty crazy. So they put
(56:12):
all of this together and basically what it is. The
suit itself featured like a lightwashed denim blazer with a
gene back pocket in place of a standard chest pocket,
with matching multi tone jeans and a studded waistband, topped
off with that beautiful jean cowboy hat. Brittany was matching
in a strapless denim dress with a similar patchwork throughout
(56:34):
and then finished of course with a small denim purse.
So a lot of people wondered kind of what happened
to these looks and like where the outfits went, because
usually when you do a red carpet. You'll either send
it back to the designer or it'll be gifted to you.
So after a little bit of research, it looks like
Britney's dress sold at the Nate D. Sanders Auctions for
(56:58):
seven one hundred ninety nine dollars.
Speaker 4 (57:02):
That seems low.
Speaker 6 (57:05):
You're okay, thank you for saying that, because it it's
a hilarious dress, but it's also not it's it's I
would wear it.
Speaker 4 (57:17):
I think, like and yeah, I would wear it somewhere
or just like wear it to wear it because you're like,
this is so this is so ridiculous that seven thousand.
Speaker 6 (57:26):
Dollars soeous, that's so low. Yeah, and for Britney memorabilia,
But you could.
Speaker 1 (57:32):
Buy fifty pairs of vintage Levis for way cheaper than that,
couldn't you.
Speaker 6 (57:36):
Well, I mean that's the thing, Like Kirstine kind of
gave away a secret there, so maybe we're just going
out to buy a bunch of jeans. If you want
to recreate either of these looks, Blake, that's what you.
Speaker 10 (57:46):
Have to do.
Speaker 1 (57:47):
I don't think I would do the hat, but you
have to do.
Speaker 6 (57:51):
And like some of the outfit, I just don't.
Speaker 1 (57:54):
I just don't like functionally know how to do it?
Speaker 4 (57:57):
Wear a hat?
Speaker 1 (57:58):
No, make a hat?
Speaker 6 (58:00):
How to wear a hat?
Speaker 1 (58:00):
I thought we were talking about Golden. I thought we
were talking about doing this, doing this ourselves.
Speaker 6 (58:05):
I mean it could be like, if you need help sewing,
I'm happy to help.
Speaker 4 (58:08):
Your lockdown this sequel project. Like you can do this
into twenty twenty one, like we like, I'm gonna knit,
You're gonna make a denim outfit, a denim tuxedo, like
you can do it.
Speaker 6 (58:20):
Think it's a good plan for twenty twenty one.
Speaker 1 (58:23):
And then I'm gonna wear it to officiate your wedding. Cassie.
Speaker 6 (58:26):
Yeah, well that I didn't want to say that, but yeah, obviously.
Speaker 1 (58:32):
Okay, before we pivot out here and get back to
the album just a little bit, Cassie, is there anything
more on the fashion side we've got to touch on,
or maybe just Justin and Brittany, Yeah.
Speaker 6 (58:43):
Just I mean, like, I mean, we're never going to
get over it, really, but no, I think I think
the most important thing predominantly about these Gene looks is
that it embodies Brittany to her core, because we have
that kind of crazy country fashion of what she had
much later on and kind of what she does now,
(59:05):
but it's still so glamorous, like there's it's it's the
perfect mix of who she is and and I think
that kind of transcends time.
Speaker 4 (59:14):
That's perfect. Those genuinely wonderful. I was like sitting here
just completely mesmerized by this.
Speaker 6 (59:21):
Thank you it was it was really fun to research.
Speaker 1 (59:26):
Yeah, that was great, So we need to, I guess quickly.
I mean we kind of punted on the song ranking
or album ranking segment to do this fashion segment, but quickly, Sarah,
do you want to give us maybe your top three
favorite songs off of Baby One More Time? And then, Cassie,
get ready because the question is coming to you next.
Speaker 4 (59:44):
So it's definitely going to be Baby one More Time
is number one, and then you drive me crazy and
then I'm gonna go with sometimes because in my heart
I know that that's the kind of person I am like.
But what she sings sometimes I run, sometimes I hide.
I'm like, oh yeah, no, that's relatable. And then she's
like but like sometimes I'm scared, but I just love it,
(01:00:06):
and I'm like, oh, that's deeply relatable as a scorpio.
So I'm gonna go with the very wispy song that
somehow you forgot was on Much Music, Blake, I'm that's unforgivable.
Speaker 1 (01:00:17):
Yeah, I don't know, it's I had a weird blank spot.
Speaker 3 (01:00:20):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (01:00:22):
Sorry, Cassie. Do you have a favorite couple songs off
this album?
Speaker 3 (01:00:27):
Oh?
Speaker 6 (01:00:27):
You bet I do, So I'm gonna switch it up
a little bit. I'm gonna say my number one is
you Drive Me Crazy. I just there's something about the
song that's so catchy, like I can't help but get pumped.
Then I'm gonna go Baby one more Time. But then
for my third one in a similar way, but a
different song, I'm picking up from the bottom of my
(01:00:50):
broken heart.
Speaker 4 (01:00:51):
Yeah, that's another scorpio.
Speaker 6 (01:00:52):
It's just there's so much feeling in it, just a
lot of as much emotion feeling just the whole record.
Yeahsing out Ski, but in a pretty way.
Speaker 1 (01:01:03):
Jake, Do you have anything to contribute to the top
songs Discussionaire?
Speaker 2 (01:01:07):
Sorry, we have the one mic that we just scrambled
again too.
Speaker 5 (01:01:09):
What was that?
Speaker 1 (01:01:10):
Yes, Baby one more Time and you Drive Me Crazier
on all three of our top threes, and then the
third one has been different. My third one, by the way,
would be Email my Heart. That song is so cheesy
and it's wonderful Jake.
Speaker 4 (01:01:25):
Sometimes.
Speaker 2 (01:01:27):
Uh yeah. I think my three would be the singles,
purely because I have the most familiarity with them, But
in an order, I think I would probably go Babe
one more Time first, uh sometimes second, and you drive
Me Crazy.
Speaker 9 (01:01:42):
Third.
Speaker 1 (01:01:44):
I'm surprised. I'm really surprised you didn't have the Vinnie
Chase one number one.
Speaker 2 (01:01:48):
Well, if we're going by the video, obviously Vinnie Chase wins.
Speaker 1 (01:01:52):
But so, Sarah, this is where we get into a
bit of a complicated wrinkle. You obviously know that we
pick one of the songs from the mixtape, and we
all have Baby One More Time at or near the
top of our lists, But you kind of made the
point earlier that it exists separate of the rest of
the album a little bit for you. So I'm curious
if you think baby that makes maybe one more Time
the obvious pick for the mixtape, or if that means
(01:02:15):
we should go in a different direction.
Speaker 4 (01:02:16):
With the different direction and I know which song you
guys should pick, What song you drive me crazy?
Speaker 1 (01:02:22):
All right, Okay, no arguments. I'm not gonna argue with
the guests.
Speaker 2 (01:02:27):
I mean, you could, and you do, especially in huts, Sarah,
She'll make you pay for it.
Speaker 10 (01:02:31):
I will.
Speaker 1 (01:02:31):
Yeah, all right, Well that's that's on the mixtape. Then
I also want to thank producer Dylan, who is probably
gonna have to cut like fifteen twenty minutes from this episode. Sorry, Dyl,
but it's you know, just make sure you cut me
and Jake talking and not Sarah and Cassie because they
were obviously the highlights. And thank you to you, Sarah.
We always love having you on, to the point that
(01:02:52):
I feel like I've probably asked you on too many
times now and you're gonna start saying no. But we
really appreciate it, and it's always a lot of fun
when you'm on, even though Jake is a little terrified
of the roastings that are.
Speaker 4 (01:03:03):
I mean, honestly, I can't wait to hug the shit
out of the both of you when I can see
you in person, so like that's what's keeping me going here.
You're both amazing.
Speaker 2 (01:03:12):
Ah, that's so nice.
Speaker 4 (01:03:14):
Sorry, sorry to be genuine on Maine.
Speaker 1 (01:03:16):
No, it's it's a helpful end here. And you can
follow all of Sarah's stuff on social at Sarah s
McDonald or Sarah smcdonald dot com and subscribe to her
newsletter Cerulean dot Substack dot com. We'd also like to
thank Jake's wife or better. I hate saying it like that.
I know I'm trying to make the sports felder wife
(01:03:37):
guys jokes, but I don't like the possessive phrasing of it. Anyway.
Thank you to Cassie, who you can follow at Cassie
She's my Cassie. If you are still near the mic
or the headphones, thank you so much for coming on.
We appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (01:03:51):
Blake, thank you. She said you're welcome.
Speaker 3 (01:03:56):
Okay, please try the fish.
Speaker 11 (01:04:41):
It's Brittany bitch
Oh, baby baby. How was I supposed to know that
something wasn't right here? Oh baby baby, I shouldn't have
let you go. And now you're listening to the latest
episode of Columbia House Party. I had no idea how
to do that introduction. Everyone has the exact tone and
sound of that line in their head embedded already. There
(00:47):
was no way to do that. That wasn't weird.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
I mean yeah, I think it's it's rare that we have,
like the first track being the one that not only
everyone knows, but like maybe literally everyone Boddy knows.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
I can't imagine anyone would find this podcast and not
know that song short of the bajillion people that found
us because Spotify linked us to Lord on year ends,
which was a nice boost. So thank you to Spotify.
You're evil, but we appreciate the bump and listenership.
Speaker 2 (01:19):
Even more so. I think all the people who listened
to Lord and found us that way, of which I'm
sure many people listened to Lord also know this song.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
So yeah, yeah, and surely stuck around for the rest
of that podcast episodes. Jake, we're bringing back two Columbia
House Party traditions from the in person era today. The
first is you being late? Which bad commute? What's the
what's the deal here?
Speaker 2 (01:51):
I was working. I was finishing my work, all right.
I have responsibilities and things to do.
Speaker 3 (01:58):
All right.
Speaker 4 (01:58):
Well.
Speaker 1 (01:59):
The the second, the second in person tradition is saved
for later. And I might not even say it because
it runs the risk of our final segment guests just
pivoting the segment to roast me back. So I might
just leave that one in the holster. We'll see Jake.
(02:19):
Today we're talking about one of the most successful pop
albums ever and one of the industry's most popular and
controversial stars. She also happens to be, according to my mom,
my first ever crush, although I believe Alex Mack from
the Secret World of Alex Mack technically has her beat.
She is one of the highest and fastest selling artists
of the last twenty five years, with six number one records,
(02:41):
five number one singles, and immense cultural influence. Today, we're
going back to where it all started for Britney Spears
with Baby One More Time.
Speaker 5 (03:02):
I'm how was I suppose you know.
Speaker 6 (03:08):
That something wasn't round?
Speaker 7 (03:12):
Oh, I'm better, I shouldn't remember you.
Speaker 5 (03:19):
And now you're right, A side should me? How do
you want it to me?
Speaker 8 (03:26):
Sell me?
Speaker 5 (03:27):
Bay dousn't need to know now.
Speaker 8 (03:32):
I don't do this.
Speaker 9 (03:34):
Excuse me, I'm still still stays like mine.
Speaker 10 (03:46):
Give me a side, giving me.
Speaker 8 (04:13):
Time.
Speaker 1 (04:14):
I have it in my notes here, Jake, say the
name of the song in all caps. You donce because
I always forget, and the first time I remember to
do it in several episodes is the one time absolutely
nobody needs me to name the title track off Britney
Spears Baby one more Time, Baby, one more Time, Jake,
if it's not immediately clear five minutes in here, we
(04:35):
need a guest to help us through this one and
just in general, so to help us contextualize Britney Spears
Baby One more Time, we bring on our favorite regular
guest and just generally the coolest, most pleasant person, Sarah McDonald.
What's up, Sarah?
Speaker 10 (04:51):
Hi?
Speaker 4 (04:52):
How are you guys?
Speaker 1 (04:55):
I'm good, Jake's married.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
I like that we were both just like we're not.
We're not going to answer Sarah because we know whatever
we say is going to cause her to make fun
of us. So yes, I'm not going to say that.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
I can make fun of you.
Speaker 4 (05:11):
For that, I can make fun of you for the silence.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
It just see.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
How are you, Sarah?
Speaker 4 (05:18):
I'm okay. I'm staring out at darkness at five twenty
in the evening, which is absolutely crushing, So, you know,
like happy to be here.
Speaker 1 (05:27):
I guess, well, better this than just sitting there in
the darkness. I guess marginally, marginally better to be doing
this with us.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
Why are you sitting in the dark? Well, like cool?
Speaker 4 (05:38):
I mean, there's I'm sitting in my office with a
light on, but it's just dark on the other side,
and it's just a little like I'm happy to live
in a place where I have windows again, which is wonderful.
It's been such a lift. But then the downside is
that it gets dark earlier and it's five o'clock and
I'm like, yeah, it's time for bed. This checks out.
Speaker 1 (05:58):
Yeah, you did post the very nice sky photo shortly
before he came out, though, so at least he got
that going.
Speaker 2 (06:05):
I will say, as someone who lives in a different
building but apparently a very similar looking apartment, as I
messaged Sarah a little while ago being like, do we
live in the same building and found out that was
not the case, I do understand that window layout that
you have, which is very similar to ours. How now
that it gets dark at four point thirty, how it's
(06:25):
just like, oh, it's nighttime and time for bed.
Speaker 4 (06:28):
Immediately, I got actually very excited thinking that Jake lived
in the same building as me, because I think I
would be a good neighbor because I would I would
be like, I'm so excited that you're here, but I
would never bother you because I would never want to
be bothered.
Speaker 2 (06:41):
That's the perfect neighbor.
Speaker 3 (06:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:43):
Plus co cat people, so you always have someone to
feed your cats.
Speaker 4 (06:47):
Yeah, like she's so low key. Yes, I would never.
I would be like, I wouldn't even look you in
the eye if we were in the elevator together. No,
I'm kidding, I would at least acknowledge you.
Speaker 2 (06:55):
No, absolutely not. It's like the like the Friends thing
where they're just like freely going into each other's houses.
Speaker 4 (07:01):
That's crazy concerning and like, I hate Friends so much,
but I obviously grew up watching it, but like that
left such an impression on me, being like, who are
these people who do not respect boundaries? Like that's insane.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
It could be my closest friend in the world living
across the hall from me, and I would always at
least call first.
Speaker 4 (07:20):
I mean, I text my partner in the other room,
like I can't even be bothered to get up and
talk to him in person. So like, oh yeah, that's
the kind of friend I would be in a building
with you.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
So our apartment is basically one room with sliding doors
some places, and I'll still message Cassie if I need something.
Speaker 4 (07:36):
Oh man, I love aren't you?
Speaker 1 (07:38):
Guys? Lovey with windows and windows and partners and cats.
Speaker 2 (07:43):
You have so many windows?
Speaker 1 (07:45):
What are you talking in the common area? Not in
my bedroom where my office also is.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
I guess that's true. You have a window in there,
don't you.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
Well yes, but again it's an alleyway window, so it
gets no way. I can though open the open the
window to get that nice smell from the garbage bins
that are right outside of it.
Speaker 4 (08:00):
Oh yeah, gotta live living in the city, all right.
Speaker 1 (08:04):
Guys, If you are a longtime listener, even a medium
time listener, you know Sarah by now. Sarah's a freelance
music and culture writer and one of our favorites. She's
had bylines everywhere, and most recently she's taken that to
a newsletter at Curullian dot substack dot com.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
C E R U L e A N.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Make sure to check that out and subscribe. It's wonderful.
You can follow her on Twitter at Sarah s McDonald
as well, and find her work at Sarah s McDonald
dot com. We'll also tweet out all those links and
everything because cerulean is hard to spell.
Speaker 4 (08:37):
It's kind of funny making the jump to substack when
everybody else is making the jump to substack. So it's
just like you're pushing your own voice down and it's
like a nice little personal project. I have such a
weird relationship to my work now, and you know, being
like quote unquote like a public figure writer type of person.
So it's just been nice to do this at my
own pace and to think about things from why I
(08:59):
love them versus I need to have a voice about them,
which I think can happen when it comes to culture writing.
And I don't want to be that person. I was
that person like four or five years ago. My therapist
was actually like, hey, have you considered not thinking about
music to enjoy it more? And I was like, ooh,
this is why I pay you all the money.
Speaker 10 (09:16):
I do.
Speaker 1 (09:18):
As someone who turns every hobby into work. I completely understand,
and I would not listen to your therapist were it me.
Hence hence the existence of this podcast.
Speaker 4 (09:30):
I mean, like I forget forever ago you talked to
me about like music writing, and I was like, yeah,
you should do it. I would be so happy for
you to do this, Like I really want to read
your thoughts, and then I think about the work involved
and I'm like, ah, god, I just like I don't
wish that on anyone, and yet here we are.
Speaker 1 (09:45):
Yeah, it's the exact opposite of when Zoobs told me
not to go into sports writing.
Speaker 4 (09:52):
Quick zub story. We recently followed each other on Twitter,
and man, it's been a delight, like a real delight,
just having another friend in and around the Waterloo regions.
Speaker 2 (10:10):
If we're another region podcast, I am leaving. I already
do one of those a week with Zoobs.
Speaker 1 (10:17):
I don't mean Barah Lauren. We talked about constantines, Zoobs,
there's a there are no there's no end to the
region content.
Speaker 4 (10:28):
Well, you know what to do, Jake, Like, when it's
time to leave Toronto, that's where you go.
Speaker 2 (10:34):
I might as well be Detroit to Jake, Oh, buddy,
I don't know if I don't know if you guys
know this, but there is a running joke amongst my
friends that my southern Ontario geography is basically non existent.
Speaker 1 (10:50):
Come up on this podcast multiple times.
Speaker 4 (10:52):
You mean you've only been like in and around Toronto.
Speaker 2 (10:54):
No, I've been to all the places. I just don't
know how to get there where they.
Speaker 4 (10:57):
Are the four A one, it's just so easy.
Speaker 1 (11:00):
Yeah, but what those in two directions? Sarah?
Speaker 2 (11:02):
Right, Ye, I don't know what's I don't know what's
east and what's west. If it's coming up in this
podcast before, and you've listened to this and heard that
I was going to apologize, but also you should know
better by now. And also whatever time is fake.
Speaker 1 (11:16):
We're gonna take a break and we're gonna talk about
baby one more time after this. Britney's history is very
well known and we have a lot to talk about
(11:38):
in the back end of this podcast, so we're going
to zoom through it very quickly, if that's okay with
the two of you, and even if it's not, because
I'm I'm in control here. I got the steering wheel. So,
as a lot of people know, Britney Spears was a
child star of sorts. She started performing in dance as
early as three and as song as early as five.
She did the talent show circuit, which is just very
(12:01):
sad to think about anyone doing. She tried out for
the Mickey mouse Club revival and was rejected, and then
went to a professional performing arts school. The family moved
to New York to put her in that program. She
was cast in Off Broadway and then went on Star Search,
was in a bunch of commercials, and then finally got
cast on The Mickey mouse Club. Now check out this
(12:23):
draft class. This is like the Lebron Dwayne Wade, Carmelo, Anthony,
Chris Bosch, Darko milicic draft class for the Mickey mouse Club.
Britney Spears, Christina Aguilera, Justin Timberlake, Ryan Gosling.
Speaker 2 (12:35):
Carrie Russell, who's the Darko?
Speaker 1 (12:39):
I guess Krrie Russell is the only one of those
who hasn't done music stuff.
Speaker 4 (12:43):
I think, Yeah, she's in Star Wars, so like.
Speaker 2 (12:46):
Oh no, she's great, but it's the worst Star Wars.
But she was in the Americans and Felicity, so like
and Felicity.
Speaker 1 (12:54):
Yeah, you asked who's the Darko, I mean the other four.
She's the fifth most successful of those people. Darko had
ten year NBA career and made like twenty five million dollars.
It's not being the dark Oisn't that bad? All right?
Because we need another music clip. Here is a clip
of childhood Britney Spears seeing some covers. I left this
one up to Dylan. I'm very excited to see which
(13:16):
of the covers I sent Dylan he chooses to include here.
Speaker 8 (13:34):
No battle.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
So the more important note than Britney Spears being this
budding child star through the Mickey mouse Club was that
she was also a starting point guard on her basketball team.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
Wow, Her and averall secret sports stars.
Speaker 1 (14:37):
After the Mickey mouse Club stuff, Britney Spears was supposed
to be in a female pop group called in a sense,
yes not Innocence in a sense that name reminds me
of I'm sure you guys have seen, but maybe not recently,
that thing you do where the one guy in the
band is obsessed with coming up with like a really
bad punny name for the band.
Speaker 2 (14:57):
This is why I.
Speaker 4 (14:58):
Hated pop music for such a long time time as
a teenager, Like I can't forgive this of pop music.
I really can't.
Speaker 2 (15:04):
Just like the names.
Speaker 4 (15:06):
Yeah, just like the like doubling down on really corny names,
the puns, just like thinking that they're being clever but
they're not. It's just drives me crazy.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
You weren't a sole decision, fan, I can't.
Speaker 4 (15:23):
I won't say anything to that.
Speaker 1 (15:25):
I receive it, okay. So Brittany was saved from in
a sense by a family friend named Larry Rudolph, who
instead had her do a demo to pitch the labels.
She was turned down by multiple labels who only wanted
boy bands and girl bands, until Jeff Finster of Jive
Records was impressed, had her audition and signed her. So
they got her working with producer Eric Foster White, who
(15:48):
Jake you mentioned Max Martin earlier. Him and Eric Foster White.
Basically they weren't the only two writers on this album,
but they split the heavy part of the workload. Brittany
originally wanted to be like a Cheryl type, but realized
that it made more sense to go pop and as
she put it, that would allow her to dance more,
which was more in line with her personality, so worked
with Eric Foster White, worked with Max Martin worked with
(16:10):
a few other producers to release this album in January
of nineteen ninety nine. Now a very of the time
thing is that maybe one more time. The single had
come out four months prior, three months prior in October.
I'm bad at calendars. Apparently it was massive, so it
was one of the biggest singles ever. We played it
off the top, you know, the song ten million in
(16:31):
sales as a single worldwide, platinum everywhere, number one everywhere,
So expectations are obviously very high at that point. So
then Sometimes was the second single, and I don't remember
Sometimes being a single, Like, I don't really remember that.
Speaker 2 (16:49):
Song much at all.
Speaker 4 (16:50):
I do really the video and this is of a video,
like this is the video age, right, Like when I
think of these songs, the first thing I'm thinking is visually,
because they were on the countdown?
Speaker 2 (16:59):
Yeah, yeah, agreed.
Speaker 1 (17:01):
Is this the one with the like, uh the like
viewfinder thing?
Speaker 4 (17:04):
Yeah, and she like is like she's swerved so innocent
in this video, you know, like wearing the white or
like baby blue and stuff and looks looks very much
like a young woman versus like, I guess whatever sort
of age A fied person she was in Baby One
More Time with like the tied up shirt and stuff.
Speaker 2 (17:24):
You're very right about it being entirely visual because as
someone who had not listened to the rest of this record,
like obviously my Britney Spears knowledge is limited to her singles,
but I can tell you what each one from this
era is based on what's happening in the music video.
Speaker 4 (17:41):
Yeah, And I don't know if we can say the
same like the now, Like I'm sure like there are
music videos now, but it's not like how how ubiquitous
is it seeing that on the countdown for like two
three months straight?
Speaker 2 (17:53):
Right? If you say to me, like like she's standing
on the cliff, that's I'm not a girl, not yet
a woman, a song I've not listen to in twenty years.
But I remember the video.
Speaker 1 (18:04):
Yeah, yeah, yes, So that was the number two single,
and for whatever reason, I have this incredible blank spot
for it. Apparently the next single, though, I do not,
and I absolutely remember the video because it had Springing
to the teenage Witch in it and Vinny Chase pre
(18:24):
Viny Chase. The next single was You Drive Me Crazy say.
Speaker 5 (18:30):
I'm soolutely to you. You got that something? What can
I do send me.
Speaker 7 (18:43):
There's moving, but I can't do it that time Mahat
was jump in.
Speaker 5 (18:54):
It's easy to see.
Speaker 8 (18:58):
So well the dang I am.
Speaker 5 (19:07):
I just think.
Speaker 8 (19:10):
I'm so excited, but it meives me all night.
Speaker 1 (19:46):
A great movie, yes, yes, a great movie as well.
I guess I want to ask, like going back to
the videos, especially like sometimes to You Drive Me Crazy,
there is like, even though these songs are off the
same album, there's like this weird growing up in how
Britney is presented and obviously like she was like very
sexualized for a teen in the Maybe One More Time video,
(20:09):
but the Crazy video kind of like dials that up.
I don't know, Jake, you have you have thoughts on
this song, don't you.
Speaker 2 (20:15):
I don't really have thoughts on any like individual song,
but I do remember this song really and I remember
the video. But to your point that you were saying
about like not as many singles as you would have thought,
I this. I didn't realize there were two early Britney albums.
I didn't realize that oops, I did it again, was
(20:35):
not this album.
Speaker 4 (20:37):
I thought they were, Yeah, because it came out the
year after, Like they really went back to back with it.
Speaker 2 (20:41):
Yeah, like I thought lucky and oops, I did it again,
and I guess I'm not a girl. Is that the
Crossroads one?
Speaker 1 (20:47):
I think that's the next See, so I have no idea.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
They're all one album to me. And then she made
Toxic and it was different. That's how I think of Brittany.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
I think that's kind of fair. I guess at this point,
like we're going to talk about how this album was
received in a little bit, but obviously, like when you
go single, the single, the single, like this, the expectations
kind of become their own thing. Sarah, I know this
is one of your favorite songs on the album, but
you were you? I guess what I'm trying to get
(21:18):
at is like were you you bought this album for
the single and then liked everything and then we're excited
to see the singles roll out or how did you?
How did you kind of consume this over the Like
albums had like a two year life cycle at this point,
which is really weird to think back and remember like
singles coming out six months apart, but that was the case.
Speaker 4 (21:37):
Yeah, I mean, like this was like right in my
sort of pop heyday as a child, Like I was
an actually boys girl for life at that point, and
like InSync could like, you know, drop into a hole
and I would be so happy about that. Like it
was really like divided in my household, and because.
Speaker 11 (21:52):
Like what.
Speaker 2 (21:55):
What, I'm on the other I'm on the other side
of that argument.
Speaker 4 (21:59):
Fun fact, I've interviewed justin Timberlake and it was like
one of the best things to be on the other side,
being like you don't impress me and I'm going to
hold that petty thought for the rest of my life
because I'm a scorpio.
Speaker 2 (22:11):
But so what, so what you're justin Timberlake.
Speaker 4 (22:14):
Yeah, I was like, literally who cares? Who cares? But
I loved you know, like I loved Backshet Boys, and
they were always like my kind of entry point into this.
But because Baby One More Time was always on TV,
was always on every countdown that I watched, and like,
I was just mesmerized by that video because I was like,
what ten years old, and I think my sister had
just gone into high school and I always thought I
(22:34):
was older than I actually was. So I really wanted
to be like that. I really wanted to be this
like feminine child, and I felt like Brittany could be
my guiding light with that, and then that changed over
the next few years. But like, I really loved the
record when I bought it, but I bought it off
the strength of one single, which is how you know,
I always bought music as as a child, even when
(22:56):
I was downloading stuff on LimeWire, like six seven years later,
is off the strength of a single. And then maybe
I would like the record. I wouldn't spend so much
money as I did I would be buying I would
be getting it for free. But yeah, I mean it's
one of those albums that I think is I think
(23:16):
maybe one more time, the song is indicative of Brittany
and a time period and not so much the album,
if that makes sense, Because the song is so removed
from this record, to me, it will always live above it.
It will always live in its own kind of space
and time.
Speaker 2 (23:37):
I think I agree with that, even without having attachment
to the record itself, because it was like this stratostrophic
like thing for me, especially because it's sort of I'm
going to get my timeline wrong. Also, but like I
feel like that really kicked off the sort of like
pop boom.
Speaker 3 (23:54):
Of that time.
Speaker 4 (23:55):
It did right, like you had Christina Aguilera after that,
and you know, justin Simpson and stuff like that, and
you know, like that competitiveness. Like I think, yeah, you
had the boy bands like, but then when you had
like the pop solo women, it was a totally different conversation, right.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
And I feel like there's pre maybe one more time
and post big one more time in terms of that.
So I think I think that makes sense that being
sort of a separate.
Speaker 1 (24:19):
Thing, Sarah. I just wanted to dig in on one
other thing that you mentioned. You said that kind of
like this album or that the timing of this album
was kind of connected to your like I guess early feminism,
and then you said that that shifted, and I just
want to dig in more on how that shifted a
(24:40):
couple of years later and whether the liner notes you
have from this album are still in good shape.
Speaker 4 (24:45):
Oh okay, So, like I said, I think when I
was a kid, I saw this as like, this is,
you know, the kind of woman I'm supposed to be,
this pristine white kid and who's blonde. And I was
going through puberty and it was not fun and I
didn't look like that. But I started to have different
(25:07):
feelings about Baby one More Time, just kind of outside
of whatever tragedies and miseries that puberty brought upon me.
And then I just like felt really defeated by it,
that it was hollow, Like I just remember listening to
Baby One More Time, Like I said, Baby one More
Time is the only song that after I bought this
record I could listen to. But then when I listened
(25:28):
to the rest of it, like Sometimes or Email my
Heart or like Soda Pop, which was like such a
trip to listen to the other day, like these these
also feel so of like a specific time, I just
got really mad. I got really resentful of the fact
that this is what I was supposed to be and
I didn't feel like I had I could be this person.
(25:49):
So I started to black out Brittany's eyes and her smile,
and I ripped up the liner notes and I destroyed
thet I cracked it in half and I threw it
in the garbage.
Speaker 12 (26:03):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (26:05):
Yeah, uh didn't there. Yeah it was.
Speaker 4 (26:10):
It was like the most I guess aggressive rejection of
uh this idea of womanhood, which is what Brittany was in,
which I think led to her down downfall, because she
became the vessel of everybody's ideas that like even she
couldn't even uphold or didn't even want to uphold, and
(26:30):
that's what happened to that CD. So now I don't
have it and the liner notes are not intact.
Speaker 2 (26:35):
It is a lot.
Speaker 4 (26:35):
It's been twenty years since I've done that, so and
then I've fully moved on to my Michelle Branch phase
of life and then onward a dog.
Speaker 1 (26:43):
So yeah, what a great shirt, that Michelle Branch shirt
I had. I should have worn it, you know, that
was one of my options.
Speaker 4 (26:50):
Like if you ever want me back to talk about
Michelle Branch, like the years I spent trying to perfect
those glossy lips that she has, Like it pains me
to think that I'll never achieve that. Look, it really
pains me.
Speaker 1 (27:01):
Well, I mean there's still time. Its pivot us back
just a little bit, so you drive me crazy. I
kind of remember it being bigger than what not that
a top ten single isn't big, But it only hit
number ten on the Billboard chart, and I would have
swore it was number one. I mean she performed it
on Sabrina the Teenage Witch, which coming you know, the
(27:23):
TGIF lineup right after the Munch Countdown on Fridays. Boy,
I didn't think a song got bigger than that.
Speaker 4 (27:30):
Do you guys watch like Angel and TGIF two, Like
if you're going to commit to t G if you
commit to TGIF, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:37):
I feel like my TGIF experiences were pre that, Like
I was very much in the Boy Meets World years
and then Sabria. Sabrina to me is like a Saturday
Morning show, not a not a TGIF show. Am I wrong?
Speaker 11 (27:52):
No?
Speaker 4 (27:52):
She was definitely TGIF yeah, like prime Time?
Speaker 1 (27:56):
Yeah, you're wrong. Maybe maybe I'm wrong, idiot. One of
the other songs you mentioned, Sarah that I want to
take us to because not only is this album full
of bangers, it's also quite prophetic. As you wrote in
a Vice article in twenty sixteen about the song email
my Heart.
Speaker 5 (28:23):
It's been out since a day since you went away,
and not I do Jack the scream to see it? You? Okay,
you don't it so because you want to be left alone,
(28:43):
So up sending your mad mussle And this is what
else say I'm sorry, I'm so sorry.
Speaker 8 (28:54):
Can't you get me.
Speaker 5 (28:57):
Check to make.
Speaker 8 (29:04):
You and say.
Speaker 5 (29:11):
I know you love them and I know what you
still kill.
Speaker 8 (29:19):
Me and say.
Speaker 1 (29:36):
Email, So Sarah, I won't do that awkward thing of
reading your article back to you on the air, but
run us, run us through a little bit of how
email my heart predicted the future.
Speaker 4 (29:53):
Yeah, it's it's pretty it's pretty clear. It's I am
going to read my own own stuff. I hate reading
my own stuff, but I also hate more. Just like, hey, Blake, listen,
I also wrote something that has to do with this
podcast episode, like one day, I want you to choose
something that I've never written about but only think about.
(30:14):
It would bring me such great joy.
Speaker 1 (30:16):
But yeah, I just sorry, Sorry, put me on blast
for trying to bring you on to episodes that I
know you're passionate about. Okay, we'll bring you on for
an episode you don't you haven't cared enough to write about.
Speaker 4 (30:30):
Just bring me like I'm upset you didn't bring me
on olymp Biscuit episode. Like I could just talk about
fred Durst all day. Also, Brittany dated Fred Durst? Did
do we mention this at all?
Speaker 1 (30:39):
Are we going to talk about this?
Speaker 2 (30:41):
What I didn't say that?
Speaker 4 (30:43):
I just didn't know that that they absolutely phone down.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
Okay, I have two questions. One, what's the age difference
there and two when did this happen?
Speaker 4 (30:55):
It was definitely in the early two thousands. I think
it was like post two thousand and three, justin Yeah,
it was after the breakup?
Speaker 2 (31:01):
Is that post k fed or pre k fed pre
k fed? Wow? What a I mean you would have
thought that.
Speaker 1 (31:08):
You can go downhill after Fred Durst?
Speaker 2 (31:11):
You know what, though, that's like a good transitional bridge
to go from Timberlake and then like Durst to Fetterline.
That's I see the path there. That makes sense.
Speaker 4 (31:20):
Yeah, I guess I'll circle myself back to my own article.
Speaker 1 (31:24):
Sure, so you.
Speaker 2 (31:27):
Brought up Fred Durst. We can't not talk about it.
Speaker 1 (31:30):
I was, yeah, I'm gonna I'm gonna call culling in
right now for his tea.
Speaker 4 (31:36):
Yeah. No, I So I wrote this article because it
was it was it was in twenty sixteen. I started
twenty nineteen or twenty sixteen, because it was right around
the twenty aniversary of the record, and I was like,
what's a fun thing that anybody like that? Like, what's
a fun angle that no one's gonna think of? And
I was like, email, my heart seems very of the moment,
but also super predictive. Because like I basically wrote this
(31:56):
article to think thinking that. You know, when I was
a kid, all I could think about was just like
writing emails and being in the chat room with other
kids talking to them other kids quotation marks, but just
like communicating digitally that way, and that felt comfortable and safe.
And I think that Email my Heart was really like
the catalyst for how we talk to each other today,
(32:17):
you know, like sending these long emails to each other,
sending long dms to each other. Like I can count
on my hand to the number of people who text
me or call me, versus sending me messages in Instagram
dms or Twitter dms and stuff that. And it's just
a pop song. I realized this. I realized that it
doesn't need to be as deep as it is. But
(32:39):
I don't know. I think Email my Heart is is
it perfectly? It perfectly captures the last twenty years, and
I think the next twenty years of how we are
going to profess our feelings for one another. And this
weird song that starts with like an Elton John like
piano intro, it just it's so cheesy.
Speaker 1 (33:00):
No pressure, sixteen year old Britney, You're just dictating the
next forty years of human communication. Okay, so as much
as that seems exaggerative, people did absolutely treat Britney Spears
like she had that much power and was that important culturally.
Baby One More Time got mixed reviews and was kind
of derided a little bit as silly or childish. She
(33:21):
got Girl next Door version of Madonna, but the top
forty readiness got it some decent reviews as well as
some of the truly awful kind of reviews that I'm
sure you can imagine about a teenage pop star at
the turn of the century. Now, Brittany had a lot
of success as well. Obviously, she won Billboard Female Artist
teen Choice Album. She was nominated for an AMA and
(33:44):
a Blockbuster Entertainment Award. She was also nominated for that
Foreign Juno category that doesn't even make sense, since why
why the Canadian Music Awards have a highest selling foreign album. Anyway,
she was nominated for a Juno. She sold one hundred
and twenty one copies in her first week, broke a
bunch of records along the way, A ton based on age,
(34:04):
a ton for overall success, a bunch for having the
chart topping single and album at the same time, and
eventually Maybe One More Time became the fourteenth album of
the nineties to sell ten million copies plus it was
certified diamond. It spent fifty one weeks in the top ten,
beaten only by Millennium from the Backstreet Boys. It had
(34:25):
one hundred and three weeks on the chart in total,
and as of two thousand and three, had sold twenty
five million copies. In time, it's been given kind of
iconic status, credited with helping usher in the revival of
teen pop, and Billboard listed it as the number forty
one of their top two hundred albums of all time. Jake,
(34:46):
I'm curious as to your take on when we you know,
obviously with something like this, there's gonna be mixed reviews
no matter what, and there's gonna be mixed retrospectives on it.
But I'm curious as to your take on whether Britney
would be received differently today, given that you know, the
climate now is maybe a little more like poptimism friendly
(35:07):
to use a very broad term.
Speaker 2 (35:10):
I mean yes and no, I think, And the only
reason I say no is because the reason that all
that one of the main reasons that all that stuff
is better received now is because of her, So like,
I don't think the love for pop music that exists
for our generation as older thirty year old Ish millennials
(35:35):
could exist without the pop foundations that Brittany and Christina
and en Sync and etcetera, etcetera, etcetera did back then.
So it's one of those like I don't know if
it's just because we've been rewatching loss so so my
brain is at but it is one of those like
things where if we're talking technically, yes, she would be
(35:56):
better received now, but she also but it also wouldn't
exist without her. But if we're just talking this hypothetical
world where everything goes the same, just Brittany comes out
now and all music sensibility is exactly the same, I
think she would be hugely well received now because I
think now it would be like, oh, it's a throwback
to because it is more like the pop of today
(36:17):
for the most part, is a little less bubble gum
to paint with a reductive term, I think, but also
it's still the same kind of craft. I think, like
there's obvious links between Carl Ray or a dua Lipa
and this album, and I think I think I also
think even regardless of how it would be received, it
(36:39):
definitely wouldn't be as quickly dismissed as it was back then,
Like it was very much all pop music then was
very much from the like in Giant Air quotes cool kids,
like completely derided and dismissed, like there's no I was reading, uh,
pitch Works one hundred Best Songs of the Year today
(37:02):
and like, no judgment on what's in there or not,
but like the amount of pop that's in there top
hundred would not have been in the top hundred of
Pitchfork in nineteen ninety nine, And I think I just
think that she would have. I'm not sure exactly how
it would have been received, but I definitely don't think
it would have been so derided and dismissed as pap
(37:27):
that pop music of that era was by like the
rock kids or the hip kids or whatever you want
to call it.
Speaker 1 (37:33):
Yeah, I'm not sure i'd use the word PAP, but
I get what you're saying.
Speaker 2 (37:36):
Otherwise, it's an old phrase, sure, And.
Speaker 1 (37:42):
For anyone who hasn't seen Lost, what Jake is trying
to describe is that contextualizing if Britney came along now
gets us into a hot tub time machine situations. That's
surely the more culturally relevant way to phrase that than
Looper or lost or anything like that. There was also
so as Britney's career rolled on, I think probably a
(38:02):
little bit of Brittany fatigue. She followed with Oops, I
Did Again in two thousand, which sold twenty million. We
number one was certified diamond. She had Britney in two
thousand and one nine million in sales, four times platinum,
number one, and in the Zone in two thousand and
three six million in sales, two times platinum, number one.
All very successful albums, but you see them kind of
(38:23):
going on the downswing. Finally, she takes an actual gap
in between albums and releases Blackout in two thousand and seven,
which is probably the album of hers that I think
is the biggest victim of Like people had preconceptions about
Brittany and weren't willing to give new stuff from her
(38:44):
a chance. I think that album's actually good. I know
Sarah does as well. This is give me more off
that album.
Speaker 11 (38:50):
It's Britney, bitch. Fritz and some the lightest just want
(39:16):
to go the extra mole for you problem to display
of a faction feels like no one else someone can
you do ro the snow allow you don't.
Speaker 5 (39:32):
Give me her rocket?
Speaker 8 (39:33):
Do not get your rocket?
Speaker 13 (39:35):
Calls a flash and away the band See I can't.
Watching rocket Watch feels like a brodishly make me, can
make give me, can.
Speaker 8 (39:53):
Look to me.
Speaker 5 (39:55):
And make me.
Speaker 1 (40:28):
So Sarah, you will argue for that album, right for Blackout?
Speaker 4 (40:32):
Yeah, I mean I argue that like more than anything,
I want Britney Spears' legacy not to be baby one
more time. You know it's Britney Bitch, Like that's it's iconic.
I was reading I think it was like Rob Schaffield
or something that this is her most punk album, and
I would agree that it's like it's the one where
she really let you know, herself be in control, as
(40:57):
chaotic as that time is for her. I was, I
was reading like these they're just like it's such like
it's such a obviously tragic arc that she has over
the past like twenty years, but like reading the massive
essay and Rolling Stone of like the tragedy of Britney
Spears and all the people who were around her as
she's making this record, and like the writer being like
(41:17):
told that she can't interview Brittan unless there's like a
million in cash and stuff like that, and just the
tension between Brittany and the paparazzi and the way that
we look at her, Like this album obviously wouldn't exist
without all of that, which is I think the hardest
thing to reconcile as much as I love it, but
it is. It's I think, to Jake's point that you know,
(41:40):
if Britney were successful now, it's it is on the
strength of people accepting pop music because the craft itself,
like it's pretty easy to it's not pretty easy to
write a pop song. It can be, but it's pretty
formulaic and people can kind of get on board with that.
And I think here, I don't know, I think I
get like shades of Billy Eilish from Blackout, you know,
(42:02):
like there's there's a rawness to it over this pop sound,
over obviously this immense amount of hurt that she has.
And I don't know, I think I think Blackout is
her best one and obviously super underappreciated.
Speaker 1 (42:15):
Yeah so so naturally it being the best and most
interesting and stuff. It's her first album not to go
number one and the worst selling of her first six albums.
Sarah has mentioned a couple times now kind of what
has happened to Britney, since that's beyond the scope of
this episode, both because we're talking about her very first
album and because to do that sensitively we'd need, you know,
(42:37):
thirty forty fifty minutes, So recommend that Rolling Stone profile.
Recommend Jezbel essay from November from Emily Alfred as well.
In twenty nineteen, Brittany did go on an indefinite work hiatus,
canceling one of her Vegas residencies. There's been a lot
of unfortunate stuff back and forth with her, her father
(42:58):
Jamie and his handling of her and his public comments,
and then the you know, the conservatorship and that being
contested in a very public way. So you can find
lots of that in the Rolling Stone article, in the
Jezebel essay, lots of other places. Brittany did have four
more albums after that. She was also a fembot in
(43:19):
Austin Powers three, which I only mentioned because I rewatched
the first Austin Powers because it hit Netflix and it
actually held up okay, And the third Austin Powers is
probably the worst movie I've ever seen. We are not
going to talk much more about Austin Powers, but after
this break, we're going to bring on another guest, the
(43:41):
I think the first ever two guests on the same episode. Yeah,
we'll see after this, all right. So here to help
(44:03):
us through some of the fashion and cultural influence of
this era of Brittany is Jake's wife.
Speaker 6 (44:09):
Hi, Cassie, Oh hello, how's it going?
Speaker 1 (44:12):
Well?
Speaker 6 (44:12):
How are you trying to get into the chair? Because
Jake kind of just snapped at me.
Speaker 2 (44:17):
I was really.
Speaker 1 (44:18):
Exciting your intro. I was really dragging your intro out
because it sounded like you guys were having trouble.
Speaker 6 (44:25):
Well, yeah, because we have like the one mic, so
we've never had to do something at the same time before.
So it makes it really complicated, does it, though?
Speaker 1 (44:33):
Because what is Jake and to have to contribute to
this section?
Speaker 6 (44:35):
No, he just walked away. He's not even in the
room anymore.
Speaker 1 (44:39):
Ran he ran away, all right then, So, Cassie, at
the risk of you turning this around on me, The
second Columbia house party tradition from the in person episodes
that I wanted to bring up the earlier one was
Jake being late. The second one is you continued our
earlier tradition of someone being too hungover to do their notes,
So thank you for that. It feels like a throwback episode.
Speaker 6 (45:02):
That was absolutely me. I was I was pretty hungover,
but I did it and they're better. They're better than ever.
So yeah, get ready because I have some stuff for you.
Speaker 1 (45:12):
Yeah, I don't uh, you know, I don't want to
be a third cook here too much. So basically, what
Cassie brought to us, Sarah, is that or what you
want to talk about was that the videos and we
touched on this a little bit earlier, is that the
videos and the fashion and everything around Brittany and Sillery
to the music is very pivotal to getting Britney. So Cassie, Sarah,
(45:35):
I'm just going to kind of hand it to you
guys for now. So Cassie, if you want to, if
you want to lead us through this, it's all you perfect.
Speaker 6 (45:41):
Thank you. So, first of all, I want to do
a little bit of a summary about what why two
K Aesthetic is because I think that's really important to
understanding who Britney is. So Why two K Aesthetic kind
of started in nineteen ninety eight, and went to about
two thousand and three, and it was really because people
(46:01):
were experiencing this anticipation and joy with the rise of technology.
So we have we have cell phones coming out that
aren't like the ridiculous Zach Morris phone, and we have
the Internet, which is like a real thing now. But
then we also have the threat of the end of
the world, so everybody's kind of gripped in that. So yeah,
I mean, we've kind of gone full circle at this point.
(46:28):
So the year two thousand was kind of sold to
us as this entirely new era, like a time of
rich prosperity or possibly the end of the world. So
you could go either way, so spend, spend, spend because
you don't have a lot more time, and the culture
kind of continued on with that, so it was it
was all shaped by luxury. It was a futuristic trends
(46:49):
and like a real push to inform the mass is
that you need to own this. So when it comes
to the actual esthetic, like frankly, it's a little bit
of a mess. It's it's a lot of rich stuff,
but done so that any consumer could get it. So
they wanted to make it a lot easier for everybody
(47:11):
to buy. And uh, I mean it's it's a lot
when you look back on it. But in my own opinion,
I don't think that there's an era that gave us
so much fun as Y two K and like just
generally how you got to yeah or.
Speaker 4 (47:28):
Many dot but cracks I think, or thongs for that matter,
or hip bone.
Speaker 6 (47:33):
Yeah all so important, or like like the mess shirts
that I tried to rock all of the time that
I could absolutely not pull off. But uh, but we
we got to have like a lot of fun with fashion.
It was a lot. It was a lot of shiny metal,
a lot of low rise jeans, it was thongs sticking out,
which we absolutely have to credit to Grassy for being
(47:53):
the show to really bring that to the forefront of culture.
I want to say so thank you to a great
for giving us Britney's ass.
Speaker 1 (48:03):
Cassie. I'm just gonna jump in here and we're gonna
talk about Britney's ass and everyone's ass a little bit more.
I asked you before you came on, what you think
the song on the album that kind of best goes
with what we're talking about here. I'm gonna play it
for everyone now, just just as you You've set the
scene so well for Y two K just gonna play.
The beat goes on, so get it in the proper mood.
(48:25):
The the cover of the Sonny and Chare song with
help from all seeing a britt electronic group, this is
the beat goes on.
Speaker 5 (48:53):
Reached the page. We still want to hear nothing of her.
We do so nothing. Emma grows up.
Speaker 12 (49:19):
And they grows up, and they grows up, and they
throws off and they grows up. Canna be brows.
Speaker 5 (49:36):
I don't know rem to lady Lady him, Lady Lady.
Speaker 1 (49:45):
Downsdayday alway, Okay, Cassie, So where does where does Britney
(50:14):
fit into all of this? Because she's not exactly you know,
when when you came on our No episode to talk
about Gwen Stefani, you use the term I think style
icon or fashion icon, and you don't feel that way
about Brittany really.
Speaker 6 (50:27):
So it's it's kind of difficult because she is and
she isn't. She she's a style icon because we made
her one, but she's not stylist.
Speaker 4 (50:38):
I mean then that makes sense, right, Like that's.
Speaker 6 (50:41):
Like, oh yeah, and I have I have a background
for you that you're going to just eat up. It's fantastic.
But I would say that she's she's the real embodiment
of this hole aesthetic because she made the look something
accessible we could run out as thirteen year olds and
buy everything she was wearing at Zeller's or Clare's. Like,
(51:02):
this wasn't a difficult look to pull off. It might
have been a bit inappropriate looking back, but it was
absolutely something that like I myself as a thirteen fourteen
year old girl, could go and do. It was really easy,
and we get the mid drift tops, we get the
accessibility of who she was as a person, and she
was who I personally really wanted to be. She was
(51:26):
that sweet girl next door with like a little bit
of country with her personality, but then this air of
high fashion in what she wore, with these bright colors
and these vibrant, flowing things and always an exposed mid drift.
So it should come as no surprise, and I don't
want to shock anybody, but she did not dress herself
in these years. She obviously had a very large team
(51:50):
to prepare her image and get us all out to
the store to buy the replicas, and they really set
the scene for this innocent versus sexy, like they wanted
to embody the virginal, the very sweet, but also someone
that was really, really hot. And I think that both
men on this podcast can attest to that.
Speaker 8 (52:15):
Little bit.
Speaker 4 (52:16):
Where's Jake because he's still in the other room.
Speaker 6 (52:19):
Yeah, he's hiding. He's looking at pictures of Brittany.
Speaker 1 (52:24):
Look, it's obviously it worked and it served its purpose.
What I'm more upset with is that I didn't live
in a or you know, at this time, I was
a preteen, Like I just wore whatever my parents bought me.
I wasn't into buying my own clothes yet. I just
I feel like me missing the era where the new
(52:45):
fee tuxedo, like the whole denim outfit was cool. It's
just like a missed opportunity, Like, honestly is that is
the garment of my people and Justin Timberlake brought that
to the to the masses, and I didn't get to
be a part of that. And I don't think I
have the influence to bring it back, you know.
Speaker 6 (53:06):
Well, And that's what's so interesting because now I look
back on those infamous photos. So for any reference points
that you guys are looking for out there. This is
the two thousand and one American Music Awards red carpet
look of Justin Timberlake and Britney Spears wearing the complete
gene outfits. And you're crazy if you don't know what
(53:29):
that is, because it's the most iconic look perhaps of
the decade.
Speaker 1 (53:34):
Yeah, question, denim, It's got to be the only denim hat, right.
Speaker 6 (53:40):
So, I mean like it's it's been reinvented by several people.
We have a Victoria's Secret Model, supermodel Devin Windsor, who
did it with her boyfriend, and probably more memorably, Katie
Perry and Riffraff in twenty fourteen replicated the look on
the red carpet. So I was MTV Awards, I believe.
So let's talk about those looks a little bit, because
(54:03):
that's why we're really here, honestly. So there's a lot
of speculation that went around with these Gene looks because
like who did it? Why did you do it? And
like how come a lot of a lot of upset,
I would say, in confusion. So about two years into
(54:23):
their two year reign as the Pop Prince and Princess
Brittany and then boyfriend Justin Timberlake approached Justin's stylist with
en Sync and his name is Stephen Gerstein. So Steven
had been working with encinc for quite a while and
he was he started kind of in costume design, which
is why all of their looks were so interesting. For
(54:46):
lack of a better word, so Brittany had basically had
this dream of an all denim look for the Red Carpet,
and Gerstein had made himself known that he could kind
of make things happen, like when the boys would be
on tour, it would be like, oh, I like this
leather jacket, Like can you get me that? And then
build a look around that. So he was very approachable
when it came to creating looks that you wanted to do.
(55:08):
So basically what he did for Justin's suit, the suit
that Blake wants to reinvent. They took the suit that
he wore for the Celebrity album cover and just remade
it in Denham. He basically sent his people out to
buy fifty pairs of vintage Levi's and then they were
stitched together by a woman named Linda Stokes. And she
(55:30):
was this little old lady who worked twenty four hours
a day, and if it weren't for her, a lot
of la wouldn't have gotten dressed. It seems she did
all of the stitch work for everybody's Red Carpet looks.
For Brittany, her dress was a little bit more interesting,
I think because she was then working with Curtain Bart
(55:51):
and so they're costume designers who had their beginnings in
the nineteen eighties in the club scene with people like
Warhol and then later on Bowie and they more recently
designed the looks for the Hunger Games, which is pretty
cool because those looks are pretty crazy. So they put
(56:12):
all of this together and basically what it is. The
suit itself featured like a lightwashed denim blazer with a
gene back pocket in place of a standard chest pocket,
with matching multi tone jeans and a studded waistband, topped
off with that beautiful jean cowboy hat. Brittany was matching
in a strapless denim dress with a similar patchwork throughout
(56:34):
and then finished of course with a small denim purse.
So a lot of people wondered kind of what happened
to these looks and like where the outfits went, because
usually when you do a red carpet. You'll either send
it back to the designer or it'll be gifted to you.
So after a little bit of research, it looks like
Britney's dress sold at the Nate D. Sanders Auctions for
(56:58):
seven one hundred ninety nine dollars.
Speaker 4 (57:02):
That seems low.
Speaker 6 (57:05):
You're okay, thank you for saying that, because it it's
a hilarious dress, but it's also not it's it's I
would wear it.
Speaker 4 (57:17):
I think, like and yeah, I would wear it somewhere
or just like wear it to wear it because you're like,
this is so this is so ridiculous that seven thousand.
Speaker 6 (57:26):
Dollars soeous, that's so low. Yeah, and for Britney memorabilia,
But you could.
Speaker 1 (57:32):
Buy fifty pairs of vintage Levis for way cheaper than that,
couldn't you.
Speaker 6 (57:36):
Well, I mean that's the thing, Like Kirstine kind of
gave away a secret there, so maybe we're just going
out to buy a bunch of jeans. If you want
to recreate either of these looks, Blake, that's what you.
Speaker 10 (57:46):
Have to do.
Speaker 1 (57:47):
I don't think I would do the hat, but you
have to do.
Speaker 6 (57:51):
And like some of the outfit, I just don't.
Speaker 1 (57:54):
I just don't like functionally know how to do it?
Speaker 4 (57:57):
Wear a hat?
Speaker 1 (57:58):
No, make a hat?
Speaker 6 (58:00):
How to wear a hat?
Speaker 1 (58:00):
I thought we were talking about Golden. I thought we
were talking about doing this, doing this ourselves.
Speaker 6 (58:05):
I mean it could be like, if you need help sewing,
I'm happy to help.
Speaker 4 (58:08):
Your lockdown this sequel project. Like you can do this
into twenty twenty one, like we like, I'm gonna knit,
You're gonna make a denim outfit, a denim tuxedo, like
you can do it.
Speaker 6 (58:20):
Think it's a good plan for twenty twenty one.
Speaker 1 (58:23):
And then I'm gonna wear it to officiate your wedding. Cassie.
Speaker 6 (58:26):
Yeah, well that I didn't want to say that, but yeah, obviously.
Speaker 1 (58:32):
Okay, before we pivot out here and get back to
the album just a little bit, Cassie, is there anything
more on the fashion side we've got to touch on,
or maybe just Justin and Brittany, Yeah.
Speaker 6 (58:43):
Just I mean, like, I mean, we're never going to
get over it, really, but no, I think I think
the most important thing predominantly about these Gene looks is
that it embodies Brittany to her core, because we have
that kind of crazy country fashion of what she had
much later on and kind of what she does now,
(59:05):
but it's still so glamorous, like there's it's it's the
perfect mix of who she is and and I think
that kind of transcends time.
Speaker 4 (59:14):
That's perfect. Those genuinely wonderful. I was like sitting here
just completely mesmerized by this.
Speaker 6 (59:21):
Thank you it was it was really fun to research.
Speaker 1 (59:26):
Yeah, that was great, So we need to, I guess quickly.
I mean we kind of punted on the song ranking
or album ranking segment to do this fashion segment, but quickly, Sarah,
do you want to give us maybe your top three
favorite songs off of Baby One More Time? And then, Cassie,
get ready because the question is coming to you next.
Speaker 4 (59:44):
So it's definitely going to be Baby one More Time
is number one, and then you drive me crazy and
then I'm gonna go with sometimes because in my heart
I know that that's the kind of person I am like.
But what she sings sometimes I run, sometimes I hide.
I'm like, oh yeah, no, that's relatable. And then she's
like but like sometimes I'm scared, but I just love it,
(01:00:06):
and I'm like, oh, that's deeply relatable as a scorpio.
So I'm gonna go with the very wispy song that
somehow you forgot was on Much Music, Blake, I'm that's unforgivable.
Speaker 1 (01:00:17):
Yeah, I don't know, it's I had a weird blank spot.
Speaker 3 (01:00:20):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (01:00:22):
Sorry, Cassie. Do you have a favorite couple songs off
this album?
Speaker 3 (01:00:27):
Oh?
Speaker 6 (01:00:27):
You bet I do, So I'm gonna switch it up
a little bit. I'm gonna say my number one is
you Drive Me Crazy. I just there's something about the
song that's so catchy, like I can't help but get pumped.
Then I'm gonna go Baby one more Time. But then
for my third one in a similar way, but a
different song, I'm picking up from the bottom of my
(01:00:50):
broken heart.
Speaker 4 (01:00:51):
Yeah, that's another scorpio.
Speaker 6 (01:00:52):
It's just there's so much feeling in it, just a
lot of as much emotion feeling just the whole record.
Yeahsing out Ski, but in a pretty way.
Speaker 1 (01:01:03):
Jake, Do you have anything to contribute to the top
songs Discussionaire?
Speaker 2 (01:01:07):
Sorry, we have the one mic that we just scrambled
again too.
Speaker 5 (01:01:09):
What was that?
Speaker 1 (01:01:10):
Yes, Baby one more Time and you Drive Me Crazier
on all three of our top threes, and then the
third one has been different. My third one, by the way,
would be Email my Heart. That song is so cheesy
and it's wonderful Jake.
Speaker 4 (01:01:25):
Sometimes.
Speaker 2 (01:01:27):
Uh yeah. I think my three would be the singles,
purely because I have the most familiarity with them, But
in an order, I think I would probably go Babe
one more Time first, uh sometimes second, and you drive
Me Crazy.
Speaker 9 (01:01:42):
Third.
Speaker 1 (01:01:44):
I'm surprised. I'm really surprised you didn't have the Vinnie
Chase one number one.
Speaker 2 (01:01:48):
Well, if we're going by the video, obviously Vinnie Chase wins.
Speaker 1 (01:01:52):
But so, Sarah, this is where we get into a
bit of a complicated wrinkle. You obviously know that we
pick one of the songs from the mixtape, and we
all have Baby One More Time at or near the
top of our lists, But you kind of made the
point earlier that it exists separate of the rest of
the album a little bit for you. So I'm curious
if you think baby that makes maybe one more Time
the obvious pick for the mixtape, or if that means
(01:02:15):
we should go in a different direction.
Speaker 4 (01:02:16):
With the different direction and I know which song you
guys should pick, What song you drive me crazy?
Speaker 1 (01:02:22):
All right, Okay, no arguments. I'm not gonna argue with
the guests.
Speaker 2 (01:02:27):
I mean, you could, and you do, especially in huts, Sarah,
She'll make you pay for it.
Speaker 10 (01:02:31):
I will.
Speaker 1 (01:02:31):
Yeah, all right, Well that's that's on the mixtape. Then
I also want to thank producer Dylan, who is probably
gonna have to cut like fifteen twenty minutes from this episode. Sorry, Dyl,
but it's you know, just make sure you cut me
and Jake talking and not Sarah and Cassie because they
were obviously the highlights. And thank you to you, Sarah.
We always love having you on, to the point that
(01:02:52):
I feel like I've probably asked you on too many
times now and you're gonna start saying no. But we
really appreciate it, and it's always a lot of fun
when you'm on, even though Jake is a little terrified
of the roastings that are.
Speaker 4 (01:03:03):
I mean, honestly, I can't wait to hug the shit
out of the both of you when I can see
you in person, so like that's what's keeping me going here.
You're both amazing.
Speaker 2 (01:03:12):
Ah, that's so nice.
Speaker 4 (01:03:14):
Sorry, sorry to be genuine on Maine.
Speaker 1 (01:03:16):
No, it's it's a helpful end here. And you can
follow all of Sarah's stuff on social at Sarah s
McDonald or Sarah smcdonald dot com and subscribe to her
newsletter Cerulean dot Substack dot com. We'd also like to
thank Jake's wife or better. I hate saying it like that.
I know I'm trying to make the sports felder wife
(01:03:37):
guys jokes, but I don't like the possessive phrasing of it. Anyway.
Thank you to Cassie, who you can follow at Cassie
She's my Cassie. If you are still near the mic
or the headphones, thank you so much for coming on.
We appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (01:03:51):
Blake, thank you. She said you're welcome.
Speaker 3 (01:03:56):
Okay, please try the fish.
Speaker 11 (01:04:41):
It's Brittany bitch
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