Ep. 1087: MSU basketball lands an important recruit; and Nick Baumgardner on the Lions, MSU football

We opened with a conversation on new Michigan State basketball commitment Jasiah Jervis and what landing him means to MSU's program. Then a conversation with The Athletic's Nick Baumgardner on the Lions' Super Bowl prospects and the state of MSU and Michigan football (22:00). Plus, this week's football picks and best bets with Harry Gagnon (42:00).

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:09):
A ship.

Speaker 2 (00:20):
S S.

Speaker 3 (01:12):
S S.

Speaker 4 (01:24):
S sh.

Speaker 1 (01:39):
Bull sh allah.

Speaker 5 (02:22):
Pull up, wow.

Speaker 1 (02:28):
All blow.

Speaker 5 (02:42):
Oulo now pound up, ownc.

Speaker 6 (03:02):
What do you get when you cross a know it
all newspaper columnist with an awkward, unsophisticated every man.

Speaker 7 (03:12):
Yeah, well I'm just not sure about that right now.

Speaker 4 (03:26):
WELLO, Couch and the Room.

Speaker 7 (03:29):
Welcome the Couch in the Room. Our Wednesday show presented
by our friends at Front forty three, neighborhood pub and
Cask and Company Kitchen and bar that is just north
of Frandor on East Saginaw to the East Lancing border.
The original Couch in the roof sponsor because they fit us,
Because it's an awesome meal, because it's a great drink selection,
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used to watch a game or chill chase and how
you doing? Brother? Ass the you're a portal? Really good? Penis?

Speaker 4 (04:10):
That's crazy? Hey what's going on? Man? You're good? Yeah?
I think so?

Speaker 7 (04:14):
All right?

Speaker 4 (04:14):
Why no, no, why do you keep asking me that
you asked me that at like fifteen minutes ago.

Speaker 3 (04:18):
I think I'm good. I don't know why, because the
Lions trade deadline bullshit. Yeah yeah, woh yeah, I worry
about you. Nah, come on, don't worry about me anymore.
Worry about me. If they lose this weekend. They lose
to the Commanders, then I'll worry about it, then worry.

Speaker 4 (04:32):
About Monday show. It's not gonna be fun.

Speaker 3 (04:35):
But after that yesterday, I mean, well, it was to
be expected, I guess, but you know, a little surprising.
I think that it would be nice for one of
my favorite teams that I read for to uh, I
don't know, maybe pick up a big in the portal,
or maybe pick up a bat at the deadline, or
some pitching help or some offensive line help. Because I'm
staring at Dan Skipper right in the face as we

(04:57):
go into this game against Washington, and we we've kept
Jared Goff upright for this long and by the way,
I don't know if people realize that if Jared Goff
goes down, we're playing with fire with this offensive line.
If Jared Goff goes down, this season's over anyway, right,
We're fucked, So screw the deadline, right.

Speaker 4 (05:14):
I don't know.

Speaker 3 (05:14):
I wasn't expecting the Lions to make any big swings,
because I guess that's not what Holmes does, but to
not make a move whatsoever, to have a practice squad
offensive lineman or some shit.

Speaker 7 (05:27):
I thought they might make a move on the offensive line.
I thought it was that just precarious.

Speaker 3 (05:31):
Well, and we said it on Monday Show. It is
easier said than done to find the right fit for
the offensive line.

Speaker 4 (05:37):
But why not try? Why not be the Eagles who try.

Speaker 3 (05:40):
They go out there and they get players that fit,
they get rid of players that don't fit, and they
keep it moving.

Speaker 4 (05:45):
They win super Bowls. They've been to Super Bowls.

Speaker 2 (05:49):
You know.

Speaker 3 (05:49):
I don't know why we can't be something to that effect.
I understand you don't want to make big Jerry Jones
like swings. Is I don't want to I don't want
that kind of ownership or you know, moves made for
my favorite football team like that, like Jerry Jones.

Speaker 4 (06:02):
But I just standing, Pat is just wild to me.

Speaker 7 (06:06):
I'm sorry, No, I agree, and especially when they've missed
on some recent you know, third round guys, and well.

Speaker 4 (06:13):
What do you mean, well, how recent we do.

Speaker 3 (06:15):
I know Tesla was talked about yesterday because they traded
up to get it, But I just feel it's too
in a twenty twenty five pick. It's too early, I feel,
to start criticizing those. If you want to go back
to twenty twenty one, twenty two, something like that, I
can understand that. I don't know why we're diving into
Brad Holmes draft. Whatever issues he's had, He's the reason
why we're here percent, you know, like, I'm not mad

(06:36):
at him. I don't want him fired any stupid nonsense
talk like that. I can understand if you want to
go through some of his picks and criticize those, because
he's not going to hit one hundred percent of these,
I understand that, but I don't think that is the
issue some of his draft problems. So I think it's
out the better. You know, the draft picks that he's
made out weigh the bad ones, and Scott Harris is
not Brad Holmes's fault. That's something you have to sort

(06:57):
of separate, you know, it doesn't help Brad, that does
not help Scott Harris. And then Tom Izzo being stubborn
as hell to if you are a fan of Michigan
State hoops, you're a fan of you know, Tigers baseball
and Lions. You're going, all right, what do we have
to do to get into the mix here? I just
want to be in the mix.

Speaker 7 (07:12):
Well, speaking of MSU basketball, they they had a pretty
good afternoon here start.

Speaker 4 (07:18):
Jasiah jervis white elephant in the room. They don't want
to deal with the white elephant in the room.

Speaker 7 (07:23):
Jasiah jervis a top forty recruit kid who's you know,
a two way guard. I mean to me, he defends
pretty well. He good good player, good player who's going
to play right away. Like there are guards that you
bring in, you go, maybe that guy is a contributor.
We don't know that. This is a guy. When you
watch him, you know he's gonna play right away. Is
your starter? I don't know, but he is a member
of the rotation the second he comes in. Based on

(07:44):
everything I've seen and heard, and the most lofty comparison
from somebody who's seen him quite a bit was was
Gary Harris in terms of MSU and the sort of
things he can provide. Now, Gary Harris was right away
an impact player. So we'll see if he's he's able
to do that. There is another you talk about big
men and the portal and all that, there's another guy,

(08:05):
Ethan Taylor that they're hoping to get a seven footer
this week. And if you start to if you even
forget Taylor, you start to put together the potential for
next year's roster, if guys come back who have eligibility remaining,
you can see how it's a pretty dynamic group potentially
one through four. Now again that five spot is Jesse
McCullough and who else is Ethan Taylor? Like what they're

(08:26):
going to have to do something there, But you can
see how the future is pretty bright there. And I
think the most consequential thing about what's happened here in
this recruiting class for Izzo is at age seventy, you know,
he still kind of has it.

Speaker 4 (08:40):
He still has his fastball, right.

Speaker 7 (08:41):
You see a lot of guys, the Jim Bayheims of
the world sort of peter out at the end, and
you just and it shows they have enough resources to
compete for these guys, and it shows that you know,
his cachet still matters, and I think it matters, and
just getting a sense of some of these recruits. I
think it matters more than ever in certain ways because
he's the last, really one of the last guys of

(09:03):
an era, legends of that era, so he his name
comes with more than and now a lot of those
guys are out. And what's also interesting is a lot
of the players he's recruiting now, their parents were coming
of age when he won his first national title, Like
he's a legend to them, right. It's sort of like
what I thought would be the impact of Juwan Howard
coaching Michigan with the Fab five and the age of

(09:23):
parents and recruits and how big a deal that.

Speaker 4 (09:25):
Was kids listen to their parents anymore.

Speaker 7 (09:27):
That I don't know, but I do know, you know,
with Julius Avin, the guy who the power forward they
got early October, that was somebody whose dad came on
the visit. I think it was a big deal to
meet Izzo, you know, or to be there for it.
I probably met him before, but you know what I'm saying,
like it, I think there is something to that. Carlos
Medlock Senior Junior is the point guard who's in this class,

(09:48):
who a lot of people like, and I think might
be even underrated. You know, I covered the mac when
he was playing there in like two thousand and five
through two thousand and nine at Eastern Michigan. So like
these guys are the age of their parents now is
like the sweet spot of is O basketball for some
of these guys. So I think that that makes a difference.
But in an age I think the most important thing

(10:09):
is in an age where we're talking a lot about
rev Share dollars and who has what and can you
still get these guys and Michigan State's able to play
ball here and I don't know what they're doing with
their freshmen versus the guys who are staying. I mean,
I have an idea what's happening to the guys who
are in their third year the cohen Cars, or the
fourth year the the Jackson Cohlers. And it's a pretty

(10:32):
sizable sum of money. It's maybe tripled.

Speaker 4 (10:36):
And is it like aiden child's money.

Speaker 7 (10:39):
I don't know if it's quite child's money, but it's
good money. It's really good money. And so well, the
question is now, with the rev share, what does basketball have?
How is that funded? And I think a lot of
basketball programs are going to struggle with this a little bit,
but ms U is clearly playing ball. They're going out
and they're putting together a class that if they were
to land Taylor the Big Guy becomes one of is

(10:59):
Oh's best classes of all time. Right now, it's probably
more similar to like Jade Naken's Max Christie Pierre Brooks
level class. Good class. But and especially if you can
get a guy. You know, if the problem Max Christy
had was not Max Christie was that he came into
a roster where he had to be the guy. And
so if you can avoid that with with young players,
what about Pierre Brooks, Well that didn't work it. Yeah,

(11:21):
I mean the problem with doing all these exercises you
look at rankings and you're like, well, the group with
Xavier Booker, you know, it's like the best, one of
the best classes of all time. But Xavier Booker was
over ranked and wasn't ready, and so how do you
even factor that in? Like Jaren Jackson Junior was way
more ready then than Booker. So I mean some of

(11:44):
that stuff with the rankings.

Speaker 3 (11:45):
But you're telling me if you watched Jaron Jackson Junior
and Booker play at that time, back when they were
both you know you could tell the difference, right.

Speaker 7 (11:53):
Yeah, one d yes, you could. That's not me, That's
all you could. It didn't mean that. I mean I
thought Booker would be more ready than he was early
and I think they did too. It doesn't mean that.
Like I there was a lot I liked about Xavier Booker,
and some of it is just like, you know, tenacity,
And it wasn't just a thize. We talk about that
all the time, but it wasn't just a thize. But
what I didn't realize is that sort of the absence
of tenacity he had early on and how much that

(12:15):
would affect him and and the love. I don't know
if that't okaya?

Speaker 4 (12:20):
Is that is that? It okay?

Speaker 7 (12:21):
So anyway, look, I think this is a good gift
for Michigan State. I think it's important to and it's
so hard with basketball recruiting now in the age where
you don't know what next year is going to look like.
Like everybody talks about Carlos Medlock and now Josiah Jervis
being the back court of the future. But you know
who's got three years of eligibility left?

Speaker 4 (12:44):
A guy like.

Speaker 7 (12:46):
Jeremy Fears, Like that guy is going to be around
for a while, and so he was a red he's
a red shirt sophomore. So I mean again, if he
comes back and he plays out his eligibility in the
NBA doesn't want him, and he feels like Michigan State's
a good situation. He's taken care of. There, you could
have a really good veteran point guard along with some

(13:08):
you know, some other good pieces of Cohen Carr comes
back for another year. But in this day and age,
you just don't know. But at least there's the potential
for it. And I think one of the cool things
for MSU fans out of this is we've had years
in covering this team where there was a lot of
angst about the recruiting and it seeped into the season.
So you go back to the best example, this is
twenty thirteen fourteen, when they had maybe Iszo's best team

(13:31):
that I've covered, with Harris and Carrie Harrison, Appling and
Brandon Dawson and Payne and Denzel Valentine as the starting lineup.
But everybody was scared that he had lost his ability
to recruit. And this is twelve years ago almost now,
and you know it was Tom tum Nairn was planned
c that they were bringing in. It was, you know,
a bunch of guys who weren't the guys that weren't

(13:55):
the big names, and he was missing out on those guys.
So it put pressure on that year. And I don't
think you can ever say two year group again, like
I used to say in this era, because you don't
know who's coming back, who's staying, what it's going to
look like. But you can at least say this isn't
the end all be all, This isn't the last group.
If it doesn't happen this year, that's it. And I
think that's important for people to sort of see a path.

(14:16):
If this year winds up being a you know, a
seven seed, six seed NCAA tournament year that lands in
the round to thirty two, or even if it gets
to the sweet sixteen, doesn't feel like a team that's
in contention. It doesn't feel like, well, that's it, And
that just changes the vibe for a fan base. And
I think that's one of the things you're seeing now
with the way they're recruiting. And also, I'll say this,

(14:38):
people talk about my the word pledge for its commitment
and what's real and what's not. Basketball is different than
football to begin with. And the other thing is this
is a week before signing day, so you can actually
call this a commitment. When a guy holds a press
conference at his school a week before signing day, that's
generally a good sign in basketball the odds, and.

Speaker 3 (14:56):
That's like a lot of time. Still though, whole week
we change your mind, that would be it would be
a big I know, when you came into and said
that to me, I'm like, well, what is that? You know,
because you were kind of like, all right, we're gonna
talk about this. I'm like, does that mean he's gonna
commit or what's going on here? So yeah, I mean, yeah,
I know it's different than football, but I still just
if you look at the history.

Speaker 7 (15:13):
Of basketball, those guys usually usually you know, wind up
coming and wind up playing, and they play earlier, and
so I think it's it's it's a big day. The
tailor get would be just enormous, not only just because
he's a seven footer, but all of a sudden you
could just see next year's roster. It takes the pressure off,
you know, a young guy like Jesse McCullough to develop
into a guy who's a starter already and pushing that

(15:35):
is a retirement back and back. He's going to coach
till he's like eighty five. Well, he probably wants at
least teen cleves junior. You know, that's probably what he's
he's planning on at least. The thing about is tho.
When you know, we see the pictures of Saban and
his birthday and on the recliner and watching Monday night
football or something that get up, yeah or sit up
or whatever it was. Yeah, it is, and it's so weird.

(15:57):
Does he save it just to snap to attentionally? He
does look like a man who's who's content and retirement right,
Like life is pretty good for that guy. I don't
know if he's truly happy. He was just told to
sit up, but they did bring him a cake and
he's watching Sunday at football. He's under a.

Speaker 4 (16:08):
Blanket and I was watching the game this at halftime.
What are we doing here?

Speaker 7 (16:13):
But like, I don't I don't see that for Izzo yet.
I just don't see that's the way he's been. I
don't feel like he doesn't feel like he's done it.
He doesn't feel like he's finished and he also if
he had Saban's resume may be done now too. I mean,
Saban won a lot. Saban and Isoh are close friends.
Saved obviously began at Michigan State. But Saban is, you know,
one at a level. He's arguably the greatest college football

(16:33):
coach of all time. And Izzo is one of the greats,
but he's not that. So that's that's a little bit.

Speaker 3 (16:40):
Loope would have to move out of the house if
Izzo retired, though, I just imagine him around the house
all the time.

Speaker 7 (16:46):
Jesus, I can't imagine he'd be uh, he'd be a
joy to be around. So yeah, that's that's. That's Big
dues for Michigan State, which won it's opener against Colgate
on on Monday.

Speaker 4 (16:57):
Oh yeah, how was How was the crowding?

Speaker 3 (17:00):
See any of it because I refuse to pay eleven
ninety nine for Big ten plus.

Speaker 7 (17:04):
Yeah, you know, the crowd was decent. The crowd was good,
and the crowd was really into it. After that. Cohen
carr Uh dunk off the backboard from and Jeremy Fears,
who really got things going for them in the second half,
and and Cook has a couple guys including Jalen Cox
that that point guard he could play anywhere, and like
the and they got a chance to be in the
NCAA Tournament, so that there is there a respectable side.

(17:24):
But you know, I think there's some concern with Michigan
State in terms of their ability to oppose their will
in certain areas. They were very good on the glass,
and that's we'll learn a lot more about them against
Arkansas on Saturday in that realm, because Arkansas is big
and skilled inside and has a dynamic freshman guard as well,
and Darius A. Cuff as a Detroit kid. But like
I do think that you know, when you look at

(17:45):
the shooting guard position and you look at Cohen Carr
trying to find his way offensively a little bit early on,
there are some things there that and there's time. That's
the great thing about college basketball is there's time to
grow into something. But they're not there right now, and
that you know, they struggle to sort of they're not
defending at a high enough level to play offense at
the level they're playing, and some of that's one leads

(18:07):
to the other, right, But like this, this Michigan State
team I think is gonna have to be not just
an elite rebounding team, but pretty close to an elite
defensive team, unless something happens offensively that we're not seeing,
like a Kurr tank just starts burying threes and that's it.
You know that guy there you go, or just somebody
offensively really finds it or just starts to come together.

(18:29):
That's still not that fluid. And I know some people
thought it was a better offensive performance than I did.
And they did get to the line. They beat him
up nineteen to three on the offensive glass, all good stuff,
But I think I think they're gonna lose Darkansas probably
now that's it. I Arkansas beat up on Southern. They've
got a freshman point guard now he's a really talented kid,

(18:50):
and they've got some good bigs inside like they I
don't think there is complete is Yukon who they played
in the exhibition, And it will be at Breslin and
so be a good test. We'll have a really good
feel for this MSU team, uh, sort of a real
time feel after that game Saturday night against against Arkansas
and what should be fun. I mean, I'm glad they're

(19:11):
playing a home and home series. I'm glad Duke's playing
it at Bresla. I mean, these are these are the
games that I mean, they used to happen way more often.
I know they're somewhat hard to do, but this is
where Izo can also lean into people. And Calipari's the
one who wanted this, and that's that's that's great for
great for baskets.

Speaker 4 (19:26):
Coach my team.

Speaker 7 (19:27):
All right, let's let's take a really quick break and
we come back. Nick bomb Gardner from the Athletic we'll
talk Lions, little MSU football, you little um football as well.
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Now to have the great Nick bomb Gardner from the
Athletic On covers football in the NFL draft there and
knows the Lions, Michigan State, Michigan. It just knows football
better than most of us yahoo's in this business who
pretended no football. And so that's why I like to
have mine.

Speaker 4 (23:56):
Nick.

Speaker 7 (23:56):
How you doing man, good, I'm good, I'm good. How
surprised were you that the Lions stood pat this this
week at the trade deadline.

Speaker 8 (24:06):
Not I mean not surprised just because of you know
what Brad Holmes has has not done, I guess over
the years at the deadline, and really it's just never
even been I'm trying to think. I was trying to
think all the way back now to like the very beginning,
if there was ever a time that he was ever
interested And unless I'm missing something here, did they get

(24:29):
when did they get to Zarias Smith? I guess he
might have been the one. Was he a deadline guy?
I can remember, But like so there's this not much there,
So like I didn't think it was gonna happen, and
especially because they didn't have any of those third round
picks this year, they traded them all to get to
Slaw in the draft. And you know, I wasn't surprised
that it didn't happen. It doesn't mean that I didn't

(24:50):
think it was that. I think it was the right,
you know, just I think they kind of hamstrung themselves
this year and tried to take care of everything in
free agency. But at the same time, you know, Mike
Grape was to have been at another edge rusher, maybe
another pass rusher, But they're bigger problems that they have
that I think people want to see solved, Like the
offensive line issues maybe that need to be retooled. I
don't think you're going to fix that at the deadline,

(25:11):
so you know, some of those are gonna have to
wait and you just have to make do with what
you got.

Speaker 7 (25:16):
So there that's the next question. Then can and can
they win a Super Bowl with this offensive line? Yeah?

Speaker 8 (25:26):
I mean I think in a year like this, honestly,
if guys are healthy at the right time, yeah, probably,
because I think that it in a one game situation.
You know, if they can get it together, They've shown
when it's worked, it's looked really, really good. It's just
a matter of what are you getting on which day apparently,
you know, that's that's what's I think what you're dealing
with with the young guys, especially like with Ratledge and

(25:47):
Mahogany's now hurt, which might end up, you know, being
a situation where they retool some things and move some
guys around.

Speaker 4 (25:52):
I guess we'll see.

Speaker 8 (25:53):
I know a lot of people want to point to
Glasgow as a struggle spot just because he's old and
he has struggled in the past, and you know he's
not Frank Ragnow, but I think Glasgow has been more
or less fine. The issues have been, you know, these
guards not knowing what to do in critical spots and
critical moments. And then the other thing too to add
on to that, especially in this last game, was I

(26:15):
think the play calling and in the game plan in general,
not the play calling, but the the plan in general,
which I would put on Campbell and John Morton needs
to be less like it was when they had Frank
Ragnow in there it could bully everybody, and more like
it was when they had Jamal Williams and DeAndre Swift

(26:35):
and they had to be really creative with every single
thing that they did. And so I think that they
need to go back to the drawing board with some
stuff a little bit on offense, because that was pretty good,
you know, that didn't need to happen the other day.
That was not a good loss. That was not a
good day against a team that they should have eaten.

Speaker 7 (26:49):
It felt very like the best of the nineties Lions.
Like you could it was exciting, there was talent on
the field, but like it, you knew they weren't going
to win it in the end, you know, it was not.

Speaker 4 (27:02):
It was not.

Speaker 7 (27:03):
I was like looking for Brett Parraman everywhere. I was like,
it's going on out here, and they do having Look,
they ought to beat the Commanders on the road. The
Commanders are in the worst way than with them. Then
you get the Eagles, you get the Giants at home,
another game they should have went. I mean, there's some
real winnable games lying Cowboys at home coming up, and
then you know, sprinkled in between, you got some some
doozies that'll that'll be telling whether they can you know,

(27:25):
have any shot at the one seed and all that.
What like when you when you watch them right now
relative to like relative to the rest of the best
that you've seen in the NFC, where do they stack
up and what would what would concern you?

Speaker 8 (27:40):
Yeah, So I think that if if we're looking around
the rest of the conference at the moment, you look
at your team, like Seattle's playing super you know, good football,
but they but they're also a team that has questions
about whether or not this is just like a really
good stretch or is this who they are?

Speaker 2 (27:56):
You know?

Speaker 8 (27:56):
And I think that that's you know, Philly has just
had to make a bunch of deals at the deadline,
and they've been fighting all year and you know, doing
their thing and everything else. The Lions, I think, are
right there in that group with just about everybody else
in that On any day, they could beat anybody in
the league. And their best is more than good enough
to beat anybody in the league. But at the same time,

(28:18):
there are you know, real concerns here that they're going
to have to deal with, and I think for me,
it's not what we maybe thought it would have been
at the beginning of the season. I actually think the
defense has a chance to be molded up, you know,
shaping up to be really good by the end of
the year. They're going to get guys healthy. They're like
some of these guys coming back or almost like free
agent you know, additions or something like that, or you know,
you're get Malcolm Rodriguez back at some point. I think

(28:41):
Davin Boord's going to come back and maybe he'll stay
healthy for more than five minutes. I guess we'll see
DJ Readall be back here in a couple of weeks.

Speaker 3 (28:48):
Uh.

Speaker 8 (28:48):
You know, I'm not sure about Pascal, but you know,
some of these other guys you know are going to
come back and play, and they've been really good. Kirby
Joseph will be back everything else, So you know, they've
been good when they're healthy, and I think that the
defense has a chance to be one of the better
ones on this side of the league. But the problems
that I see are if you're going to try to
just line up and bully people the way that you
have in the past without sort of being more creative

(29:11):
about it, it's going to be a problem because I
don't think that they scare people the way that they
used to over the ball. And Jared Goff is also
being you know, we saw a more erratic, a more
like happy footed Jared Goff the other day because he
was getting pressured and hit constantly. And if that starts
to be a thing, you're not going to see the
same Jared Goff that we've seen. So they need to
do some things to change some things to get golf

(29:35):
you know, a little bit more comfortable, but also to
get the run game going and get back to doing
the way that they know do things. It's not impossible.
It's just a matter of calling different stuff and kind
of working on different stuff. So we'll see what happens,
but right now they're just not ready to handle everything
from a past pro standpoint, I don't think with the
youth up there.

Speaker 7 (29:51):
Yeah, the defense. You stuff about the injuries, I think
the best thing that can happen to a team is
a six week injury in week five, because these guys
are going to get hurt at some point, might as
well have it happen early.

Speaker 4 (30:00):
Yeah, off season injury.

Speaker 8 (30:01):
Yeah, right, that's what they That's kind of what like
a Lee McNeil, What did he come back in like
week six?

Speaker 4 (30:06):
Perfect?

Speaker 8 (30:06):
It's like it's like a trade.

Speaker 4 (30:08):
Yeah, it's perfect, perfect, Right.

Speaker 7 (30:10):
You know what you don't when somebody who's been healthy
all year in week thirteen they're just due, Like that's
not that's not that's not good.

Speaker 4 (30:16):
Yeah, yeah, exactly. All right.

Speaker 7 (30:18):
Let's let's uh talk a little little ms U in
Michigan here. When you watch Michigan State football these days
from a talent Stanlepoy, how how far away are they?
Like just where do you see just issue after issue?

Speaker 8 (30:35):
Well, I mean yeah, there are ways away. I think
that that's that's probably the best, the best way to
put it, and they just haven't been able to keep
a roster together, and I think that that's what's killing
them here. It's hard to say. It's hard for me
to say that they are ways away because you know,
I say this all the time when I talk about
Michigan State, because I cover the draft now, like there
are prospects all over the country for teams all over

(30:57):
the SEC. Jeremy Bernard, Zion Young. You know all these
guys that played it that were at Mischigan State, that
were there, you know, that were good, So like they
can get players, but right now they don't really have
a whole lot if some but.

Speaker 6 (31:11):
It's not enough.

Speaker 8 (31:12):
And you know, they're also just kind of like an
identity lists group. And I watched them in that Michigan
game especially, and it was like, you know, I grew
up in Michigan. I think you guys did too. That
reminded me of Michigan State when I was a kid
from the nineties and like the late eighties, it was
just like liftless. There was nothing there. They were light
in the lines. They didn't have enough.

Speaker 4 (31:34):
You could tell that.

Speaker 8 (31:35):
You know, they don't really want to be super physical upfront.
They'd like to do other things. And I don't that
to me, is not them. They need to be and
they can be better upfront on both sides of the ball.
There's no reason for them to have offensive lines as
week as or and defensive front as weak as as
we've seen the last couple of years. And you know,
that's how they win. That's the program and to me,

(31:55):
I think that that that, to me, has been sort
of evidenced more anything else is what is what D'Antonio
established from a physical standard, how you win there like
that blooprint I think could still work and they've they
strayed from that. So that's I mean, it's a lot
of stuff for him. It's just when you watch them,
because it's just I think it can be a lot better.
How great I don't know in this era right It

(32:17):
all depends how much money you can raise. But they've
brought people here before. I think it's a matter of
keeping them and I think that that's another question for
fundraisers and everybody else there that they have to answer.

Speaker 7 (32:27):
Yeah, I mean, I think there is there are questions
about how fair the judgment on Jonathan Smith has been.
How fair do you think it's been? I mean, you
know they're probably you don't do for a four and
eight season right now if you had to guess, and
it's yeah, after a five and seven year and lost
a lot of games, and they're just not you know there,
there doesn't seem to be a trajectory up. But in
the old days, you know, year two would this would

(32:50):
wouldn't be great, but it wouldn't be the death there
that it seems to like it's going to be here.
I'm how much blame for what they've been able to
do given what they took over? Do you think is deserved?

Speaker 8 (33:01):
I mean I think that you know, it's more than nothing.
You know, it's more than I thought it was at
the beginning of the year, probably because like like I
just said, there's not there's not an identity here, you
know when you watch them, I mean, it's and they
don't get better offensively, they just leave a lot. They're sloppy,
you know. It's it's one of those that it would
be one thing if he walked in here with you know,

(33:24):
a scheme that was ready to install and a quarterback
that was ready to take it over, and away we
go and we're going to do this and that and okay,
and that would have been fine. And I actually kind
of thought that was what was gonna happen, and it didn't,
and it's just been this this kind of just blah
of nothing, where some weeks it might work and you
get a couple of big plays if the balls on
the money. I mean last week, you know, he put
a new quarterback in there, and he gives them a spark.
Maybe we'll see what happens happens there down the road.

(33:47):
I don't know, but like there's not enough of that
toughness to win in this league. And I think everybody's
been around this league long enough to know that that's
you can't play like that and beat even like some
of the middling teams in this league. If you're not
going to be tough against the run, you're not gonna
be tough upfront, and you're gonna get pushed around like that,
like Michigan is not even that good, you know, And
that was kind of that was kind of my sort

(34:08):
of thing. So I think that there's blame there. You know,
they could have done a better job of that, They
could have done more there. But at the same time,
it's hard to make that full judgment and I would
and I don't know what they're going to do. I mean,
you don't better than I, but I would hesitate to
fire him after this year. I mean, look at the
rest of look at the country right now, look at
all these other jobs that are open, and if you
don't have a plan of where you want to go,
then don't fire him. You got to get a plan together.

(34:29):
They know that they've been through this before, Like you
got to get a plan together where you want to
go and what you want to do before you get
rid of this guy. So I think that they're better
served probably giving them a chance and seeing what happens here,
But not much more than the other year. I wouldn't think.
But you know, it's a little bit of both. But
I think that you know, they're in a tough spot
with maybe if they want to get rid of him
right now too.

Speaker 7 (34:48):
Yeah, fundraising if you keep them is I think going
to be very very difficult to build a roster that. Yeah,
that would be the challenge in that, you know, I
don't know if he's warranted, that's true. A lot of
confidence Michigan. You mentioned them not being very good. The
Big ten's ever, I mean, Minnesota is six and three,
Nebraska is six and three. These teams suck like it's
just it's it's pretty it's not good for the league.

(35:10):
Have a CBS, NBC and Fox most people, and what
the hell? We gotta got a primetime game in this
every year we.

Speaker 8 (35:15):
Got a playoff game. Going to elimination game. I saw
somebody say to Day, like, what are you talking about?

Speaker 7 (35:21):
Like, what the it's they're not great. So Michigan's not great,
but they're not you know, look, they're they're gonna you know,
they're gonna probably play Ohio State for a playoff berth.
And that's that's There are worse places on earth to be,
especially with their track crek against track rerekeeting against Ohio State.
And I can think that Ohio State's gonna drub them
this year, but I've thought that other times too, So

(35:43):
you know, who knows what they'll do. The state of
Michigan's programming team, I know there's some anks towards Shroan Moore.
And do you think that that whole thing is is
on the right path.

Speaker 8 (35:57):
Yeah, that one's really interesting because the quarter back as
the real deal, Bryce Underwood is, I mean, he's legit.
I did not think he was going to be ready
to be as good as he's been this year right
out of the shoot. And I think if you look
at you know, say two years down the road, with
fifteen more or ten more pounds of muscle on this guy,
this is you know, we're talking about, you know, a

(36:18):
possible number one draft pick, you know that type of stuff.
Like he has all of it, I mean, and that's
for real. He is incredibly young. To be able to
handle all this as fast as he has, I think
has been a huge, huge thing for them, obviously, But
then you look at the rest of it, and they
are a young team, and I think that's part of
it too. Their offensive line has been up and down,
and they're really young. I think they should be better
in time as well. But there's really no reason for

(36:41):
their defense to be as sloppy as it has been.
They still have no receivers at all to speak of.
And I think that the fear around whether or not
Shroan Moore is really going to be able to take
advantage of everything Bryce Underwood provides for you. And time
is a legitimate concern because there are days more days

(37:03):
than not where I look out and I watch Michigan
play and I see a head coach out there trying
to be Jim Harbaugh junior, and I still don't really
know who sir owned More is. So that's you know
what I mean? Like that, that, to me is what's
going on here. And I feel like at some point
rubber is going to meet the road on that one
and it's gonna be jiggers up. You got to do
something here. We don't know what you. We know that
you want to run the ball, but like we really
don't know much else.

Speaker 4 (37:23):
So what is this?

Speaker 8 (37:25):
And I think that that's still a question. And you
have this super talented quarterback and I think people look
at that and they say, Okay, in a year or two,
they're gonna you're gonna be expected to win a national title,
Like are you ready to do that? And I'm not
sure that that's been answered quite yet. So it's like
it's kind of like the Smith thing and but a more.
He's obviously safer, but it's like he hasn't really done

(37:45):
a whole lot yet, but he's also not done a lot,
you know. It's like it's one of those things where
it's like I don't you know, I don't know. So
there is there's a right to be concerned, but there's
also like he's he needs some time to see what
happens here too.

Speaker 7 (37:57):
Yeah, it'll be interesting to see if they get creamed
by Ohio State. All the sudd and the off season
is kind of.

Speaker 4 (38:01):
Dark, and you know if they change a lot.

Speaker 7 (38:05):
Nick, I appreciate you man, thanks for bringing your wisdom
and and and fitness in and hope to chat soon.
That's the great Nick bomb Gardner from the Athletic Jason.
Anything you take away from that conversation.

Speaker 4 (38:18):
Michigan blows apparently sherean moo're not coming back?

Speaker 7 (38:23):
Yeah, I think he's coming back. I think, yeah, I
can't imagine now.

Speaker 3 (38:26):
And I thought Nick was going to Jonathan Smith like
next year, like he's coming back next year. He's just
saying like keep him.

Speaker 7 (38:31):
For the rest. I don't see. I don't think he's
coming back. There's no way he can bring. But I mean,
I do understand the the argument that if you don't
have what you're going to do together, like you're not
helping the next coach, like they're in a spot like
once you decide to move on from Jonathan Smith or
once you do, that's that's fine. But a big part
of the equation now is what you do next and and.

Speaker 4 (38:53):
And I think that you don't think they've been talking
about that.

Speaker 7 (38:56):
Well here here's what I think. If they do move on,
I don't think I think you have to have certain
things in place, but you also and you have to
have a direction and a plan. I don't think you
have to have it all humming along. What you have
to have is a guy that everybody's on board with.
Because if somebody comes in next year and it's like,
you know, we're working to get the resources this person
needs to be, you know, the top tier. This is

(39:16):
somebody people respect and they like, and the football is
still just average, next year, people will understand, like, you're
not going to go from this rostered Indiana's now. Maybe
some people are expecting that, and that's going to be
a rough life for people who want that, you know,
year after year.

Speaker 3 (39:29):
But I think, but you would have to say, it's
easier to turn a program around in today's football thing.
Oh sure, like we should have the resource this kind
of level of utility for your football team next year,
you're kind of pissed if we're in the same position.
No matter if there's a new coach, and.

Speaker 7 (39:44):
You shouldn't have UCLA happen, right, You shouldn't have the
way Nebraska unfolded. You shouldn't have some of these games
unfold the way to have others of them? Are? Are
you know understandable for the talent level at hand? I mean,
and we've talked about.

Speaker 3 (39:56):
This competent football, That's what we always say, and so
about some competent full ball where you're competing. And I
think people can play along. I mean, hell, people are
playing along with the possibility of Jonathan Smith coming back
and keeping that the buyout and putting it towards players.
I don't you imagine if he was just competent. I
think you can be competent somewhere else too, Like I think,

(40:16):
where where do.

Speaker 4 (40:18):
You think he could go?

Speaker 3 (40:19):
I don't know if it's since you like him so much,
I mean, like I'm not obviously as a person you
can't sit there and shit it on the guy.

Speaker 7 (40:25):
But as a football coach, I just don't know where
this whole stick works. I don't think he's nationally perceived
as poorly elsewhere as he is here. And so if
I were Michigan State, this is all something to consider,
and you decide you want to move on. You want
to help him move on. You don't want to shoot
on the guy. You want this to be a five
and seven finish where you know this didn't work out.

(40:45):
He went five and seven twice, and he leaves somewhere else.
He goes somewhere else, he finds a fit for him,
he doesn't. And and you know, whereas you fire somebody
in November, there's like a scarlet letter on their chest. Right,
it's just a different I don't that would be my
I would be trying to play some chess here a
little bit. If I were in that would be in
deep chess, yeah, deep chest. All right, we are going

(41:08):
to take another quick break. When we come back. The
Great Harry Gagnan is with us. We will we will
pick some games. Get his best bets up next couch
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Speaker 7 (43:27):
Addict Couching the Rube our Wednesday afternoon show brought to
you by our friends at Front forty three Neighborhood, Puff
and Cask and Company, Kitchen and bar. Very please now
have the Great Harry Gagnan on from Still Against All Odds,
the Great podcast and big Al dot Com, where he

(43:50):
is giving away picks at worth your time because just
on this show seven to two to one last week
with picks with us, one loss was a munthy homer
and of course he ate one of the next game.
So Harry is rolling if you're just taking what he's
what he's doing here, Harry, how you doing?

Speaker 3 (44:06):
Man?

Speaker 2 (44:07):
Hey, what's up?

Speaker 7 (44:07):
Guys?

Speaker 2 (44:08):
I'll good, I'll good.

Speaker 3 (44:09):
Thanks, glad to hear. All right, Well let's we don't
even need our picks, just let's ask Harry.

Speaker 7 (44:14):
Yeah. Yeah, and my picks were not not great last week.

Speaker 2 (44:18):
Michigan State game, guys, last week, that was a tough one.

Speaker 7 (44:20):
Yeah. It's a bad way. Yeah, bad way to lose.
And uh yeah it's storty cover right they did cover right?

Speaker 4 (44:27):
Well?

Speaker 7 (44:27):
No, wait, what was the final score? Yeah they did cover.
Yeah we push three, it was three right three? Yeah?
All right, first game this week, we'll do some college
games from NFL and then get get any best bets
from from Harry here as well. Indiana minus fifteen at
Penn State. I think Indiana is interesting because they will

(44:51):
clob our teams if you're not ready for them. And
Penn State's coming off playing Ohio State, and obviously Penn
State plays Michigan State the next week. Indiana Penn State.
I physically still has some tools, and we saw that
early against Ohio State. I have a sense that this
one is about two scores, and this one's a little rich.
And I'm scared to help, Scared to death to bet

(45:12):
against Kurt Signetti. I just wouldn't tell him I was
doing it, and so I'm here. I'm on Penn State.
Don't tell Sigy that where are you? Yeah, I mean,
fifteen is a big number, but Penn State is asked,
and if I'm going to give fifteen, it's going to
be with a team that averages forty six and a
half points per game. Harry the fighting Siggy's I can't
go against Signetti. I hate this game, but give me

(45:33):
Indiana and I'm laying that lumber.

Speaker 4 (45:35):
What do you got?

Speaker 2 (45:37):
I'm with you. I'm on the Fernando Mendoza train. I mean,
Penn State played, didn't played tough for the first half
last week against Ohio State, but just offense is soft.
I know they got the two stud running backs, but
just when you have no passing game, really they're they're
kind of insignificant. Indiana can roll at any time. You
you can't risk going against them. So yeah, I'm with Yah.

Speaker 7 (46:00):
I'm on Indiana all right. Next game, this one I
like a lot. Oh yeah, it's not good. Oregon minus
six at Iowa. I love the Hawkeyes here. I don't.
I think Oregon's good, but they're not like Indiana physically
can play with you. They can play. I mean, they're
not a perfect team, and I get that, but in
in Kinnick Stadium, Oregon coming east, I man, I really

(46:24):
like Iowa here at six. If we got inside of
a you know, we got down to four and a half,
four or something like that, I get a little. It
may not feel as good because I think this could
go could go either way in terms of winning. But
I'm gonna sprinkle on Iowa on the on the money
line as well, and give I didn't think Oregon looked
that great against Wisconsin last week.

Speaker 3 (46:42):
Give me, give me the Hawkeye Jase, what is Oregon's
best win this season? It was it Northwestern? Is that
what we're gonna So.

Speaker 7 (46:50):
They cream Rutgers fifty six to ten on the road,
which is something. They beat Penn State on the road
when Penn State was still Penn State. That would be it.
Because Penn State was like one of the top coup
teams in the country. People thought from a talent standpoint,
they still had their quarterbacks, still had their coach. So
I think that would be that's it. I don't know, Harriet.
I mean Oregon three and two in their last five
against the spread. I think I think unfortunately Graham's onto

(47:13):
something here in six I just as much as I
despise Kirk Farrens.

Speaker 3 (47:16):
And then Iowa team. Give me Iowa at Kinnick at
home with the six points?

Speaker 7 (47:21):
What do you got?

Speaker 2 (47:23):
Yeah, I'm with you, guys. Look Iowa. Their last loss
by more than five points in Iowa City was November
twenty fifth, twenty twenty two. And if you guys remember
a while ago before the season started, when we did
some over unders, I did give out Oregon under ten

(47:44):
and a half wins for the season. Yeah, I guess
the best win is at Penn State when they were
when Penn State was Penn State. Now they're not, so
I'm on Iowa to give me the six at home?

Speaker 7 (47:55):
All right, next game, last college game before we get
to the pros. It's a really good pro slate this
week Navy plus twenty six and a half at Notre Dame.
Seven and o. Navy against Notre Dame on the road,
and obviously this is, you know, a team that runs
the ball and does Notre Dame want to make them
look bad, but they are seven and no. But they
beat Temple by one, they beat Air Force by three,

(48:19):
they beat Rice by a single score, like you know,
they're seven to oh because they finish games the way
Michigan State does. Not I four touchdowns is a lot, though,
in a game where you're gonna do a lot of
running the football to get the over. Twenty six and
a half, this is a pretty good line. I think
I am gonna be on Notre Dame here. I think
they've got a little too much for Navy. I don't

(48:39):
think Navy's very good, but I am cautious of the
fact that nobody ever tries to run the score up
on Navy, and that makes me a little nervous.

Speaker 3 (48:47):
Yeah, when you talk about Navy's record. I mean, but
we're just talking about them covering this twenty six and
a hook and I just think, you know, if we're
gonna talk about Indiana and Signetti covering that lumber with
fifteen because they score forty two points a game, I
can I'm gonna I'm gonna take Navy to cover this
twenty six and a half because they've run for three
hundred and seventeen yards per game.

Speaker 4 (49:05):
Harry and Blake Horvath, I just think that they can.

Speaker 3 (49:08):
You know, to cover twenty six and a half, you
gotta have enough time and enough offense to get that score.
And I just think Navy runs the ball well, it
keeps it away from Notre Dame and covers that twenty
six and a half.

Speaker 7 (49:18):
What do you got?

Speaker 4 (49:18):
Hear you?

Speaker 2 (49:20):
You know, I hear you, guys, I get it. But
this just, you know, it seems like Notre Dame lately
just has a Navy's number. They've beat them by thirty
seven and thirty nine the last two years. You know,
Notre Dame is still fighting for a playoff spot too,
So I'm gonna lay the lumber here. I think Notre
Dame continues to roll. What they're doing to pretty much everybody.

Speaker 7 (49:42):
Now, all right to the NFL. Good slate, Falcons plus
six of the Colts. Colts coming off just a disastrously
stupid week. Falcons have been very not a team you
want to bet on the road, and I love the
Colts here. I know this is six and it feels
like a lot, but I think the Colts are gonna
get their offense going again. I don't like Pennix on
that team on the road. Give me the Colts. Jason Warrion,

(50:04):
this game is in Berlin, correct, so take this off completely.
We'll do other games. Sorry, we don't. You're the one
that put this game in here. Sorry, says Berlin game.

Speaker 3 (50:14):
I'm sorry, fuck Berlin. No, no, we don't do Berlin.
That's fight bet. I'm taking Falcons plus six. Fuck the Colts.

Speaker 4 (50:21):
Do you have something for this, Harry?

Speaker 2 (50:23):
I was going to take Indy too, like I know
they slipped last week against Pittsburgh, but I can't trust Atlanta.

Speaker 7 (50:29):
The only way we get the NFL to stop these
international games is if the whole gambling industry just shuts
down and stops betting them, and there's like a lot
fewer eyeballs and people realize, well, there's a waste of
time because that that's you just never know what's going
to happen there.

Speaker 4 (50:40):
It's it's it says Berlin, Berlin game in here.

Speaker 7 (50:43):
So I'm sorry, it's all geared that up. Ye, the
book I was looking at I did not specify that,
and they need to get better at that. Ravens minus
four Vikings really interesting game. The Vikings. Obviously JJ McCarthy
had some good moments. Defense can look incredible. The Ravens
are essentially I don't say every week's a playoff week,
but you know they got to get on a run here.

(51:06):
Picked it up last week minus four in Minnesota. Give
me the Vikings here. I think that, I think, I
think that defense is for real. I think it's gonna
be a really competitive game. And four is too many
points to be it to be a home dog. Yeah,
I don't get this game whatsoever. But I hate the Vikings.
So give me the Ravens minus four. It just seems
four just seems like a weird number to me. This
is weird.

Speaker 4 (51:25):
Give me the Ravens. Harry, what do you got?

Speaker 2 (51:28):
Well, you know last week from more guys, I did
give out a couple of pointers. Why. I like the
Vikings and that was pretty impressive win. That was the
best thing looked all season, I think. And they are
four and four right now, Hotkinson, McCarthy, Aaron Jones, all
looked great and all are healthy. I know what we
saw out of the Ravens against Miami. They dominated, and

(51:50):
they beat the Bears the week before, but Miami's one thing.
Minnesota is different at home four points. Still, don't trust
the Ravens defense in full getting more than a field
goal at home. Give me the Bikes.

Speaker 7 (52:10):
M Yeah, yeah, all right, game. I'm really intrigued. Patriots
plus two of the Bucks. Patriots have been really good
this year, and I think they're, you know, looking at
their schedule, probably a playoff team. Bucks, you know, banged
up Baker Mayfield. I like the Weirdly, I like the

(52:32):
Patriots here, and I don't I don't know that I
trust myself here on this and exactly why. I just
I I'm not as high on the Bucks right now
as I was a few weeks ago. Give me the Patriots.

Speaker 3 (52:42):
Yeah, the Buccaneers coming off of bye, but man, those injuries, Harry.
I just I think that the Patriots are homing along.
I like Drake may give me the Patriots plus two
and a half on the road.

Speaker 7 (52:51):
What do you got?

Speaker 2 (52:53):
Yeah, some injuries for Tampa coming off the bye week,
like you said, But you know, Patriots still at seven
and two. I think they can allow a loss. Year
Tampa Bay kind of needs this one, considering the next
two games are both on the road. At Buffalo at
the Rams just got to win by a field goal.
They've been very close in some games and they've been

(53:15):
pulling these out Tampa. I think they pull this one
out at home too.

Speaker 7 (53:18):
I'll lay the two and a half, all right, Lions
minus nine at Commanders a get right game. Marcus Mariota
is the quarterback for the Commander's Lions obviously need to.
They're gonna be ornery after last week's game. I expect
them to go and plus this is the Commander's team
that knocked them out of the playoffs. I expect the
Lions to go and take care of business here. I

(53:38):
think the Commanders are in a bad way. You know,
nine is a big, big, big number in the NFL.
It's a huge number on the road. I like the
Lions here. The Seahawks are fantastic defense, and they used
to overwhelm the Commanders. I think the Lions may not
have that defense, but they've got more juice on offense
against this Commander's team, and they'll cover Jason.

Speaker 4 (53:58):
Wry What about our injuries though? For the Lions.

Speaker 3 (54:00):
I just at nine number and Marcus Mariota, I understand,
but if you give him time to throw, he can
carve you up. I'm sorry, I just I can't be
a homer. I want to say the Lions are going
to kick their ass, but it's at Washington. We have
a lot of injuries. I'm going to take the Commanders
and the nine points.

Speaker 7 (54:17):
What do you got here?

Speaker 2 (54:20):
Well, I'm done with this Commander's team. Done with his Commanders,
their garbage. They're trash, whether Daniels is in there or not.
Their defense, I mean that Sunday Inn game, It's pathetic.
The Dallas game a couple weeks before was awful as well.
I understand the injuries for Detroit. They have some too,
but this is payback from last year in the playoffs

(54:40):
and Detroit needs this after last week's loss at home
against the Vikings.

Speaker 7 (54:44):
Role job by Detroit. Glad you guys trust the offense.

Speaker 4 (54:49):
I hope you're right. I hope I'm wrong.

Speaker 2 (54:52):
Doesn't need to look a little golf. It's been haven't
done fantastic, that's for sure. He needs a bounce back
game himself.

Speaker 3 (54:57):
Yeah, so does the offensive line. And the play calling
from Morton would be great too. But yeah, I hope
you guys are right.

Speaker 7 (55:03):
All right?

Speaker 4 (55:03):
Last up?

Speaker 7 (55:04):
Eagles plus two and a half at Packers, good National
TV game at night. But you know, the Packers are
hard to trust week to week. I you know, I
don't know. They're no longer one of the teams like
I look at Seattle as a team that if I'm
the Lions, I'd rather not face them on the road
in the playoffs. And the Packers see Seattle's become that
team Philadelphia because they make moves at the trade deadline.

(55:27):
Give me, give me the Eagles. Here is a road
dog and what I think would be a really competitive game. Jason,
were you Yeah, I'm with you. Eagles plus two and
a half.

Speaker 3 (55:35):
That Packers loss to Carolina kind of just changed my
old thought process with the Packers. So give me the
Eagles who make trades at the deadline. Harry and at
two and a half, what do you got?

Speaker 2 (55:46):
Yeah, I just think overall, you're looking at the better
team in Philadelphia than Green Bay. I trust hurts more
than I do love and Gleen based losses to Cleveland
and Carolina and given a forty in a tie the Dallas,
a game they definitely should have won. Not sold on
Green Bay Right now, I'm taking filling mhmm.

Speaker 3 (56:09):
Isn't it crazy how things change in the NFL? I mean,
Packers were after the Parsons trader, but he was scared
as ship from Green Bay.

Speaker 7 (56:17):
How about how about after?

Speaker 2 (56:18):
How about?

Speaker 7 (56:18):
Yeah? How about even before?

Speaker 2 (56:19):
How about when? Uh?

Speaker 7 (56:21):
When?

Speaker 2 (56:22):
Or a week one when when Detroit lost in green Bay?
Everybody penciled green They were penciling green Bay already. It's
the best team in the NFC and maybe in the NFL.
Just after that game too, Right, every week is different.

Speaker 4 (56:35):
Go Lions, restore the roar?

Speaker 7 (56:38):
All right, Harry, you have a by the way, let
me just.

Speaker 2 (56:41):
Throw in there, guys, throw them that by the way,
just just throw this in there. Just just I know
you guys and everyone's Detroit fans and I get it.
But what we saw last week out of Minnesota, I've
seen to win the North and they weathered the storm
with their injuries, and there are two games they had
to play in Europe, and all this stuff was with
McCarthy getting into their four and four to fourteen to

(57:04):
one to win the NFC North fourteen to one.

Speaker 3 (57:09):
Interesting, Graham, since you like to gamble against Detroit teams
and Inner Division.

Speaker 7 (57:15):
I'm not going to do it. Seattle's my team. Seattle's
the team that's.

Speaker 2 (57:21):
That's value.

Speaker 7 (57:22):
It is value. Seattle's my team. That's the team that
I think has real, real chance. And the thing about
Seattle too great ticket, that's a great ticket. The thing
I always getting nervous about is a team that's relying
heavily on a defense that hasn't been hit with injuries.
And it's this point in the season, like they're going
to have seven or eight season any injuries in the
next four weeks, So like, what will their defense actually

(57:44):
look like by the time it comes up. You'd rather
have Josh Allen and the quarterback and be able to
with stand the defensive back injury. But that's just my
own Uh yeah, neurosi or whatever whatever it is, Harry.
You also, you have a college game that you really like,
You like Mississippi State plus eight and a half is
one of your best bets this week.

Speaker 2 (58:03):
Correct over Georgia and even i'd really, I'm really, I'm
gonna put some money on the money line here too,
because look, both teams lost in overtime to Tennessee. Assuming
not both teams, but Georgia won in overtime against Tennessee.
Mississippi State lost to Tennessee in overtime. Georgia last three

(58:29):
wins have been by a grand total of twenty two
points against Auburn, Mississippi and Florida. Mississippi State should have
beat Florida, they lost that in the swamp at the
end a couple of weeks back. Gunnar Stockton for the
Bulldogs only one game this season where he's had passed
two passing touchdowns in a game. And Mississippi State. They
got their win in the SEC last week at Arkansas

(58:54):
late in the game, put up thirty eight points. They
should have beat Texas the week before when they're up
eighteen with like ten minutes.

Speaker 7 (59:01):
To go in the game.

Speaker 2 (59:03):
I think they got a heck of a lot of confidence.
I'm not sold on this Georgia team. They could have
easily lost in Mississippi could have lost in Tennessee. Like
I said, I think Misssippy State comes in here at
home in Starkville. The Kyle Bells are going crazy, and
I think George is in for a world to hurt
and this suit is gonna be I love the cover
here with zig Nav and again maybe money line with

(59:25):
the Bulldogs, the Mississippi.

Speaker 7 (59:26):
State bull ducks the other MSU. It must suck to
be Missipi State? Do we like the second MSU and everything?
I wonder if anybody down there knows, Harry you are
a beautiful, beautiful man. We appreciate your wisdom. Well, we'll
talk next week.

Speaker 4 (59:38):
Thanks man.

Speaker 2 (59:40):
All right, guys, thank guy.

Speaker 7 (59:41):
That is the great Harry Gig now from big al
dot com and still against all odds the podcasts.

Speaker 4 (59:48):
Can we do it? Are we done? We did it?

Speaker 7 (59:49):
We're done. We got through it. Good stuff.

Speaker 4 (59:53):
Man.

Speaker 7 (59:53):
Did we all agree on those pigs? No, not all
of them, all of them, but it felt it felt
pretty close. We appreciate Harry coming up. We appreciate Nick
bomb Gardner and his wisdom on football. It was uh.
We appreciate, of course, our friends at Front forty three
and Cask and Company. The original sponsor of couching the Room.
We'll be back on Friday with Groovy Donut. Twitter questions,

(01:00:14):
good show, many couch in the Room.