Ep. 1092: Hot Take Sunday: MSU football pain and coaching flubs; and the Lions live on (sort of)

We dug into our takes and yours — on Michigan State football, a frustrating loss to Iowa, Jonathan Smith's future, what J Batt might be thinking, MSU basketball and the shooting guard position, concern over the Lions and more.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:13):
H m hm, all up, pull up wow hood, blow

(01:43):
down up, do loo dow no.

Speaker 2 (01:55):
Poun up conc.

Speaker 3 (02:03):
What do you get when you cross a know it
all newspaper columnist with an awkward, unsophisticated every man.

Speaker 1 (02:13):
Yeah, well, I'm just not sure about that right.

Speaker 2 (02:18):
Now, Welcome to couch.

Speaker 4 (02:29):
And the room.

Speaker 5 (02:31):
Welcome to couch in the room our Sunday night show
like old times Sunday Night show, presented by our friends
at Muskox Quality Flannels. Look and feel your best with
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(02:51):
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Speaker 6 (03:02):
Like me.

Speaker 5 (03:03):
Muscox Quality Finel is gonna go Muskox dot com and
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you're doing brother, Peacock, Go Lions, restore the roar.

Speaker 6 (03:23):
Iguna Yaba Gita Jared.

Speaker 7 (03:26):
Code, Hey man, what am I doing here? Is Jonathan
Smith fired? Yet he is not? Okay, So what are
we doing here? I thought that was why we were
doing the show on Sunday.

Speaker 5 (03:39):
No, it's because I'm going to Florida to cover the basketball.
Oh right, yes, so you're there the whole week. Yeah,
so you're spending Thanksgiving in Florida.

Speaker 7 (03:47):
Yes.

Speaker 5 (03:47):
Nice, Yes, it's a good deal by yourself. Well, my
wife is taking the trip. She always looks at this trip.
Last year was Maui, this year Fort Myers. Where are
we going? Because she gets to work from wherever? Right right?
And I think she's actually taking some time off. But yeah,
she she, uh she takes along and and uh it's
a good deal.

Speaker 7 (04:04):
Oh. I thought we were here because it was going
to be the announcement of Jonathan Smith being fired.

Speaker 6 (04:09):
No, after that great performance. No, it's our only show
of the week. Oh yeah, damn. Okay, but I kind
of liked it this.

Speaker 5 (04:15):
I mean, we did a lot of years, not a
lot of years, a couple of years where we were
coming in every you know, three nights a week, and
it was just us, us in downtown Lansing. We had
the whole place to ourselves.

Speaker 7 (04:24):
We had no excuse to get rid of some of
the Twitter questions or takes, the saying Ebling was coming
in or something.

Speaker 5 (04:30):
There was no show after us, absolutely no parking meters
to pay, nothing.

Speaker 6 (04:34):
Do a five hour show if we wanted to. I
loved it.

Speaker 5 (04:37):
Yeah, there's a lot of a lot of good stuff
with that. But yeah, know we we we wanted to
get one in this week. We wanted to have a
good show. And I just thought there were gonna be
a lot of a lot of people will takes on
their minds that we we we should get to and uh,
I thought we'd have some ourselves. And I was worried
about you during this Lions game.

Speaker 6 (04:54):
You should have.

Speaker 7 (04:55):
Been I was worried about myself. I was worried about
having to come in and do this podcast after an
interim coach and Jamis Winston come into ford Field and
run some trick fucking plays and Derek Barnes loses Jockstrap.
I mean, come on, there are some plays I have
to say that you should have to retire, right, Like
if you get dunked on by a five foot eight
guy or something. If you're one Biama, you just have

(05:17):
to walk out of the stadium like that's your career.
I think Derek Barnes should have to retire after that game.
I love Derek, I guess, you know, because he's a lion.
But Jesus h getting shook by Jameis Winston, who's like
forty years old. It was just an unbelievable game that
took years off my life.

Speaker 5 (05:33):
Jamis is one of those quarterbacks I forgot he was starting,
Like I wouldn't. You don't bet against that guy for
because a one game scenario, Jamis can just do like,
you know, three hundred and fifty yards, four touchdowns. He
might throw six interceptions to the next week you'll be awful.
What a bizarre team that they have going on. And
then you have Russell Wilson overtime coming out and flipping
the coin. It's like, what is going on here? I mean,

(05:53):
you just have to give Russ something to do. So
I'm at the Michigan State Women's NCAA Tournament soccer game today.
They won in the sweet sixteen, advanced to the lead
eight was wrote ahead all right?

Speaker 6 (06:03):
Happy for Sparty Barb.

Speaker 5 (06:04):
Yeah, wrote a column about that before I before I
came in, and but I'm there and I look at
Twitter and there's Jason just I just see the text
eighty MG's. I'm like, how better? I better check the
lion score. What's going on? To figure speech? Yeah, yeah,
but but it usually means something's gone wrong. It's more
of a figure of speech and kind of say like
where I'm going to have to be. I knew I
would have to drive at some point later eight mgs.

(06:26):
You can't drive on that.

Speaker 7 (06:27):
But anyway, Yeah, definitely thank God for weed because I
was flowing this afternoon watching that ship show.

Speaker 6 (06:33):
Yeah, that was all right?

Speaker 7 (06:35):
Are you and you're almost lyons? I gotta say, I'm
calm a little bit. I know we're excited about that victory, Graham,
are people? Are we?

Speaker 4 (06:57):
Well?

Speaker 7 (06:58):
You got to you know, you're supposed to be excited
about a win, right, A win is a win, and
you're gonna get that football bullshit talk. But you know,
a win is a win, a gritty win, and we
you know it's not how we wanted to do things.
But my god, that whole game did not give me
confidence going forward. I mean, I don't care what you
say about a win as a win and how great
Jamiir Gibbs was, But the holes on that, especially the

(07:19):
way the defense played right, I mean, are we feeling confident?
I mean the double pass trick, touchdown play, I mean,
it's it just reminded me. And I hate the same
old Lion shit, I really do, but this game today
reminded me of some of the same old Lions shit. Well,
there's a lot of it on second, but there's a
lot of people want, you know, Dan Campbell to call plays.

(07:40):
But I just had a lot of speculation going on.
I was like, maybe there's too much on Dan's plate
right now, and it appears that that might be true.
But also this is somewhat of Brad Holmes's fault here.
I mean, are we really gonna go with brock Right
the rest of the way here? We're gonna try to?
I mean, God bless brock Right. I mean, he can definitely,
you know, get on that line and block it with
the best of them. But we miss Sam Laporto like

(08:02):
nobody's business. And there was just especially with a d
and a guy at an interim coach and Jameis Winston coming
in there, and you were down ten late and you
had to come back. Thank God, that's what Jameis Winston does.
It'll give you some excitement, but then at the end
he's gonna let you down. But I got to say, Graham,
looking at the schedule and we played, you know, the
Packers on Thanksgiving. But I just how confident should we

(08:24):
feel after a game like that? Not at all?

Speaker 4 (08:27):
Right?

Speaker 5 (08:27):
Like, to me, that's not a team that's gonna win
a Super Bowl, not with the rest of them. I mean,
I hate this feeling. It's just I mean, And maybe
that's if the Lions had already won a Super Bowl,
people would be able to deal with the years like
this where it just doesn't come together. A few injuries, yes,
of course, but because it hasn't happened, and because they
were fifteen and two and it didn't happen, and they
were up seventeen in the NFC Championship Game and it

(08:48):
didn't happen, these sort of things is like wait, wait,
wait the time. You can't go backwards yet because you
haven't done it yet. And you bring up the same
old Lions. The difference is the same old Lions. Don't
get that. Jamier Gibbs run in overtime and win it, right,
And but I do see the tenant of it. You
go back to that Minnesota game, which had some of

(09:10):
the same old Lions stuff in there, and it's just
it's not I'm not saying it's in the DNA of
this team or this this era of Lions football, but
when you see it, you recognize it because we went
through so much of it and you don't like it,
and it and you know what it means when you
see it. You know it means that's not a team
that's gonna win three straight playoff games and get to
a super Bowl the way they look right now, and

(09:31):
when you have something like Sam Laporter out for the year.
And again, if they hadn't played until Week twelve, he
wouldn't be out for the year. But for some reason,
they we couldn't get to the quarterback today.

Speaker 7 (09:40):
And I know everybody's talking about, you know, the Giants
offensive line, but they come on, the Giants are still
a shit team. And I know that hutch had the
great sack at the end and he had what six
quarterback pressures or whatever stats you want to give somebody
to make you feel better. I thought he played a
good game, but he needs some help on the defensive line.
And I just feel a lot of this falls on
Brad Holmes. I'm sorry, he's made some knock it out

(10:01):
of the park draft picks, but some of this stuff
where you just sit back and go, I don't see
with this offensive line, I know, next man up and
all that shit. And I do enjoy some of that,
but sometimes you have to just accept it and realize
that you need some help here. I mean, God, damn
Graham Glasgow is terrible. I mean, come on, I mean
we knew that going into the season.

Speaker 5 (10:21):
If you don't win a Super Bowl, all the fancy
drafting doesn't matter. None of it matters, right, And so
he's got to remember that. And sometimes people want to
hang on to their draft picks, and I.

Speaker 7 (10:32):
Look, I.

Speaker 6 (10:34):
Scott Harris syndrome.

Speaker 5 (10:35):
I respect the idea of trying to build something that sustainable,
and you need good drafting continuously to do that. And
maybe this year wasn't to go for a moment because
you know, here's the other problem. They would not have
known they were gonna lose La Porta by the deadline.

Speaker 7 (10:52):
So what do you do.

Speaker 5 (10:52):
I mean, they're not gonna win Super Bowl a tight
end of Laporter's caliber. I don't think I think that's
I think that's a death blow that this team needs
that kind of guy. You don't believe in brock Wright
and Ross Dwelly. Not the way this No, no, this
offense is not set up to win without an elite
tight end. And maybe they got to do with the
what did the Kansay Chiefs went out and got like

(11:12):
Noah Fense or whoever it is, they went out and
got another one because it's like, oh, Kelsey's getting old. Maybe,
you know, maybe you draft another tight end number eight.
I know people hate doing that stuff, but maybe that's
what you do.

Speaker 6 (11:21):
I don't know.

Speaker 7 (11:23):
You got a draft offensive lineman. I don't know why
you don't draft offensive lineman the first three rounds of
your draft.

Speaker 6 (11:29):
Boom boom, boom. Give me depth.

Speaker 5 (11:31):
I want extreme depth on the offensive. I mean, God,
bless them. The hard thing about the NFL is it's
just a league of heartbreak. It's a league where shit
goes wrong more than it goes right. And the NFL
is ridiculous. And they can come back on Thursday on
Thanksgiving and play the game of their lives and make
you look like you're an idiot and go like, well,
what was I worried about with the Giants. I'm just
saying it currently as we speak, if you watch that

(11:51):
game today, you cannot be excited about going forward. I
just winning fifteen games last year and getting home field, like,
you know, like it just seems like it's all fucking worthless.
And I just like my Michigan fan friend Jordan always says,
you like, just give us one of these so we
can just go away.

Speaker 6 (12:06):
And I believe that wholeheartedly.

Speaker 7 (12:08):
Just give me one. I want it, and then I'll
just go away. You know, you have to worry about
the referees too. I mean, my god, m but the
defense getting tricked like that, it was just fucking embarrassing.
That was the same old Lion's part. Like you said,
Jamiir Gibbs doing what he did in the offensive, you know,
offense kicking in here in the end of the game.

(12:29):
But Jesus H Man, that defense kind of scared me today.

Speaker 5 (12:34):
Yeah, it's not it. Look it's it's not promising anyway.
Michigan State football, how was that going? It's yeah, yeah,
let's go from let's go from let's go from to
uh to worse.

Speaker 6 (12:46):
Oh man, all right.

Speaker 5 (12:48):
Let's use some memory football. I did not make the
trip to Iowa, as I've said multiple times, including one
rather weirdly way by saying who's not going to Iowa?

Speaker 4 (12:59):
This guy?

Speaker 6 (13:00):
Yeah, which is a weird, weird way to do it.
But that's what happens. That's me. What are you going
to do?

Speaker 7 (13:04):
Glad?

Speaker 6 (13:05):
I didn't go?

Speaker 7 (13:05):
Uh.

Speaker 5 (13:06):
It was interesting watching it, though, because there was a
minute where I really thought they were going to win
that game. And I've watched this team play enough this
year that I never think they're going to win the game,
even when the things are going okay, and so that
told you that things were really going okay. It says
some things about Iowa, which if I were an Iowa fan,

(13:27):
I'd be frustrated by their ceiling and Kirk Farns and
just their inability. He's the most overrated coach of all time.
In some ways, he's the most underrated. In other ways,
he's the most overrated because what he has done throughout
time is something very difficult to do. He keeps like
he has lost it several times, like they've fallen off
as a program, and he's gotten it back, and coaches
will tell you the hardest thing to do is ever

(13:49):
get it back once you've lost it, right, and you
just fire your son. The problem. The problem is like
they're one of these teams that can constantly because they're
they're solid and sound and there's you know, good depth.
They can play with Indiana, they can almost They were
like two plays away from being a college football plaoff conversation,
and yet they don't have enough playmakers to separate themselves

(14:11):
from Michigan State. They don't have the quarterback play to
do it. Michigan State. The best unit on the field
for three quarters was Michigan State's defense. The better quarterback
Michigan State's quarterback, I mean, the better playmaker, Krishawn McCrae,
best playmaker on the field, better tight ends Michigan State's guys.
And where has that been? Jack Velling? And I mean

(14:32):
that again, he has had an underwhelming career. We've talked
about that and really showed up and you felt good
for those guys, and they screwed it up. They screwed up. Now,
part of it is they're not good enough to easily
close a game like that. The defense is gonna wear down.
And it didn't just wear down because it's not capable
of finishing the game. It wears down because it's on

(14:53):
the field all the time, because the offense and the
offensive line has us limitations and you can't get no
rhythm when you can't tchive quarterback in the pockets, collapsing and.

Speaker 6 (15:01):
All that stuff.

Speaker 5 (15:04):
But all of that said, that loss didn't have to happen,
just like the Nebraska loss didn't have to happen. This
is one of those games where you simply make different
decisions at a few key times, like not punting to
the most elite punt returner in college football repeatedly.

Speaker 6 (15:21):
You win the game. You win the freaking game, and
then we're taking some body blow you'd go.

Speaker 7 (15:27):
You know.

Speaker 6 (15:27):
The weird thing is, is he having a presser tomorrow?
He is?

Speaker 7 (15:31):
Is anyone going to ask him about why they kicked
it that mfor over and over again.

Speaker 5 (15:35):
I think he was asked that at Iowa and he
again Ryan Eckley was I think it fault for the
last one. That was not the intent. They didn't say
to Ryan Eckley, Hey man, we'd like to see how
good we are in coverage. So if you would kick
to this guy. He was supposed to kick that last
one out of bounds and did not. And that for
a guy who's been an elite punter most of the year.
He did not have a good day at the worst

(15:56):
possible time. And he's had a couple of games that
haven't been great. And yeah, I think he's probably leaving
for the NFL, But when he gets to the NFL,
he's gonna have to unerstand. You cannot screw that up
very often because there are lots of guys trying to
be a punter in the NFL, and the separation between
the top guys is not all that much, and so
you can't you can't make that mistake. So I'm not
putting that one.

Speaker 7 (16:14):
Does that come off your foot wrong? Like I need
to know from Ecley, Like, how do you screw something
like that up? If the coach came up to you
and said, hey, don't kick to that white guy down there,
kick it out of bounds, and what it just goes
off of your.

Speaker 5 (16:25):
They shouldn't have kicked him previously. They had film on
the guy. You know, It's not like I gotta kick
that thing out of bounds, not keep it away. From him,
not like he's out of nowhere, you know what I mean,
Like there was just no point ever kick, especially he
returns it for a touchdown and then you kicked him again.
They kicked him four times in the game, and three
of them were returns and pretty long returns. What are
you doing? So that makes no sense. The other thing

(16:47):
that I thought was was just a weird call is
so at the end of the first half, you go
for it, when you're on your own side of the fifty,
you take it time time out with twelve seconds ago.
You're trying to I understood what they were trying to do.
They're trying to get one more play in the field
goal range and not give Iowa much time. If something

(17:09):
goes wrong, you get a turnover there. They got lucky,
Iowa missed a field goal. I don't think that was
the right decision, given they were getting the ball at
the end of the half, given that line can't protect.
But I didn't hate that decision as much as I
hated the decision at the end of the game when
it was tied and you had a fourth and two
and you're zero to seven in the Big ten, You're
not going anywhere herm Edwards at play to win the game.

(17:32):
That is the moment to go for it. It's a
good ball club. You're around midfield, it's fourth and two.
You've been doing well with the tight ends and other
things like find a way to get two yards there.
Don't give the ball back to Iowa certainly, and give
yourself a chance to get in field goal range and
try to win a game and play to win what
I mean, what are you scared of in that moment?

(17:52):
That decision bothered me a little bit. I think that
the just the shame of it is it went from
being one of those games that should have been the
new signature win of the Jonathan Smith era, which I
don't think is gonna be around that much longer, but
a game that people could feel good. I can't promise
you anything that they would feel good about that the
players deserved. They went in Iowa City and did something

(18:14):
that people would remember. They looked prepared, they played hard.
The defense has come a long way, Like they went
from this moment that should have been a great feeling
to the same feeling they've had and losing a game.
They've lost a lot of these games, and it didn't
have to happen. And one of the things that has
been one of the great struggles of the Jonathan Smith
era is losing games in ways you didn't have to

(18:36):
lose them, or having performances you didn't have to have,
or having finishes that just weren't very strong. I mean,
you go back to a year ago against Purdue, they
won the game, but it was like they were hanging
on at home against a bad Purdue team. This year,
there's just been a number of them, and it's been
it's just something that I think people can't take anymore.

(18:57):
And I understand I am more a week. Yeah, I
understand some people think, well, he's going to stick around.
Look at all these other programs and other things like that.
You know what, Jay Batt hasn't done what the ad
at Maryland and Wisconsin and a few other places is done.
Come out and said he's coming back. And I'm not
saying it can't happen to this point, but if Jay

(19:20):
Batt brings Jonathan Smith back, that is his show is over.
It's his first hire, it's the end of the pike.
It's him saying this, you know. And again, if it
happens because of financial limitations, and all that stuff. That's
even worse because then you're just doing something that you
don't want to do because you have to do it.
And that's no way you're.

Speaker 6 (19:39):
Talking about this as a possibility.

Speaker 5 (19:41):
I don't think it's going to I don't think it's
going to happen. I will be very surprised if we
are sitting here a week from now, very surprised, very surprised,
shocked and he's and he's still the head coach. I'll
be very surprised. All right, that makes me feel better.

Speaker 7 (19:54):
I got to say, after all of that, though, I
think I'd rather be in a position of Michigan State
as a Michigan State fan than an Iowa fan, because
I've had enough of kirk ference and this fucking thing
about he's some legendary coach. He's had the stranglehold on
these on the fan base, Iowa fan base for so
long of like oh this guy, oh yeah, we love punts,
and I just am so sick of it.

Speaker 6 (20:15):
I have fourth down play.

Speaker 7 (20:16):
He just I don't know, like with Smith and everything
he had going on, I just focused so much more
on kirk Ference and how long he's been getting away
with this BS well you.

Speaker 5 (20:24):
Know, what Iowa doesn't have is Michigan in their backyard.
So Iowa is what if you're wondering what it would
be like to exist if you didn't have the anks
that came with a rival right next door that was
Michigan in that relationship and how it and all the
dynamics out.

Speaker 7 (20:38):
They have some pride though, I mean the offense that
they've trotted out, how in fuck embarrassing with your son
as the OC have some pride Whether you don't have
a rival or not, I don't care. I mean, the
Iowa State game is a big game, right, It's a
rivalry game for them. I just don't know why you
would sit back go you know Kirk ference he gets
us to ten wins, I mean, who gives a shit?
But what I mean is you don't know you're not
winning a Natty.

Speaker 5 (20:58):
You don't have somebody Historyley in your backyard that's been
just rubbing in your face, that's been better than you
and you have. That's what I mean. You live in
They live in a different kind of bubble out in
Iowa because I mean we have Scott Doctrman all the time,
you know, like I love Scott Docs he's great. Yeah,
and but you can tell from the tone of the
people he writes for that even though they get frustrated

(21:19):
with the offense, it's a pretty happy life out there,
even though they're not that good.

Speaker 6 (21:23):
Oh no, Scott Doc goes after his fan base.

Speaker 7 (21:25):
Well he did on Twitter. It's my favorite thing in
the world here. But yeah, I don't know, okay, but yeah,
if you want to sit there and put up with
it and deal with it, I just I don't know.

Speaker 6 (21:33):
I've cover like, so it's just.

Speaker 7 (21:34):
Amazing going through all of this with the you know,
Michigan State University in the football program, and I'm sitting
there going like, ah, man, it must suck to be
an Iowa fan.

Speaker 5 (21:41):
I remember being at Iowa in two November of two
thousand and seven, the first time that people were upset
with Kurt parents, like after he got it rolling and
then fell off a little bit. I was covering a
five and seven Western Michigan team that went to Iowa
and won twenty eight nineteen because they had playmakers and
I would didn't it was the same shit. Then you're
talking eighteen years ago, Iowa had the same problems and

(22:04):
the Western Michigan went there and said, you know, they
had like two or three borderline NFL guys and that
was more than Iowa had. And boom, Iowa just has
a couple of great white guys, you know, overachieving white guys.
They do manage to find unbelievable white kick returners. I mean,
it's there have to be like, there's like one of
them in the world. And Iowa somehows too.

Speaker 4 (22:22):
I know.

Speaker 7 (22:23):
I saw Cooper dejen like he was playing basketball. They
were doing some pickup thing and someone threw it off
the backboard and he did a reverse. I was like,
holy shit, look at that guy. That's a white guy anyway,
pretty remarkable. Now, it's great when white he's good at something,
you know.

Speaker 5 (22:36):
Yeah, yeah, alright, all right, you got anything else before
we do these takes? No, okay, I think we're good.
All right, Well let's dig into these listener takes.

Speaker 7 (22:45):
All right, give me give me some off maybe no, no, yes, hmm,
I got you. Eric Schultz here is uh number one.
Get this clown off my campus to a real coach
with this exact same roster is sitting in at six
and five right now.

Speaker 5 (23:04):
I think that the frustrating thing for a lot of
people is very easily. This Michigan State team is good
enough to be six and five. That's the problem. It's
not again that we have talked about. I've said again
is like a preference to the beginning of a sentence
twelve times without having said anything before. Want people listen. Well,
the problem with again is you have to have said

(23:24):
it before. I actually haven't actually said it before, and
I keep saying again. I'm just not very good at this.

Speaker 7 (23:29):
But when you do a two hour show with one
three minute break, you can tend to say a lot
of different things.

Speaker 5 (23:34):
We're in the first like fifteen minutes of it, though,
that's not great, not great.

Speaker 6 (23:37):
I'm trying to help you out. Thank you.

Speaker 5 (23:41):
If you just look at Michigan State like they have
not had the resources they have not had. He has
not had a fair run up. A lot of things
have not been fair for Jonathan Smith in terms of
trying to build a program and do it the way
he wants to do it. But there's no excuse to
be three and eight. There's no excuse for the way
they lost the Rutgers last year, and so basically the

(24:03):
either way they finished last year and the way they've
done this entire Big Ten season. There's just no excuse
for it. Because Eric's right here. I mean, they should
have beaten Minnesota. They're as good as Minnesota. They should
have beaten Nebraska. I would argue, pound for pound, they're
actually better than Nebraska Ucla. That was a weird day
and Ucla is fire. But they had a chance to

(24:24):
put their foot on UCLA's throat there then Iowa hear.
I mean, they're just a number of games that so
you're saying give them one more year. That's not see
what happens now, you just can't. Yeah, at some point
you have to win the games you have a chance
to win, and that has not happened. And I think
that's that's the most damning thing. Dominic number one.

Speaker 7 (24:44):
When Smith gets fired, David Harns will say the following, congratulations,
Michigan State, you just created a million Jonathan Smith's and
two on my dad's grave. If I'm at an event
and they show Alan Haller and I see Couch try
to start a slow cl app with a nod, I
swear to God I'll contact Kalamazoo County's Sheriff's office and

(25:05):
have them reopen your gay stairway, cold case, try me,
Gramminito and three. Dan Grave taking shots at MSU, saying
it's ironic that MSU had wins vacated and not Michigan.

Speaker 6 (25:17):
You're right, Dan, cheating is hilarious.

Speaker 7 (25:19):
Tie. Enjoy your fake title and bonus. I have big
news to announce next show. No, I'm not going to
be a dad. I didn't throw a gay guy down
the stairs, nor am I going to the athletic.

Speaker 6 (25:32):
So we have to wait for the next show.

Speaker 7 (25:33):
Dominic, Well, if you got a new job, don't tell
Couch because he's gonna get out here and tell everybody
where you work and what the address is.

Speaker 5 (25:39):
Yeah, your home address, no phone number, whatever it is. Congrats, Yeah, yeah,
it's uh. I apologize, Yeah, yeah, thank.

Speaker 7 (25:47):
You, Dominic. Kurt was Newski. MSU's collapse with three minutes
left is not just another loss. It's the final nail
in the coffin of Jonathan Smith's tenure at MSU. It's
impossible that this administration can justify keeping this staff.

Speaker 5 (26:03):
I mean if the cough, I don't know what, Like,
if they win the game, does it change it to me?
It doesn't like it's a great moment late in the year,
and you feel good for everybody involved because they've gone
through a lot of misery. I just don't think it
changes anything. I don't think you're still playing. I think
that the cakes baked at this point.

Speaker 7 (26:20):
I hope so. Spartan Johnny very excited for a Sunday
evening show, even if it means you leave us for
a week. Thanks, boys, appreciate you. Man. Well, I'll be here.
Couch is the one leaving the apologies, Yeah, can't you.
Fourth and two with forty seven seconds left was a
great time to snap it to the running back when
Alessio drops back to Pooch. Punt would have won this

(26:41):
game easily, though, if you just don't kick it to Wetchin.
This is the most in up coaching staff except ROSSI
I've ever seen an MSU and I was here for
Muddy Waters.

Speaker 5 (26:52):
And it says and from well, I think I moved
somebody else's yet or I deleted to take whatever it is.
You never know, there have been I don't think this
is and an app staff.

Speaker 6 (27:05):
I don't. I think they'll Rossy well period.

Speaker 7 (27:08):
I don't.

Speaker 5 (27:08):
He just I don't think Jonathan Smith's in an app coach.
He's a good guy beyond that. Whatever he is, I
mean I think he was. I just should have six wins.
But it is, it is. He has made decisions time
and time again that haven't worked, and some of them
have been questionable, and he just yeah, it is what
it is. At this point, I don't even know what
to say. You know, where do we go from here?

(27:30):
It is what it is. This is why I didn't
go to exactly this is why I didn't go to Iowa.
The reason I didn't go to Iowa. I remember I
was talking about editor and I was like, the hell
am I going to write that's any different than what
I've been writing? Like that, I don't need to drive
six hours each way to write the same shit I've
been writing. You know, It's like, nothing to me is
going to change to the point that it's I just
didn't see the storyline changing.

Speaker 7 (27:51):
Much Ryan Rockwell Number One, Wait, how does MSU do
the exact same thing at Iowa and kick to Wegen
after they did it two years ago with for de
Jon Two. I've given up on MSU football. From the
top of the administration down, it seems like no one
actually cares about how the university is seen or how
alumni feel, maybe because they have no emotional connection to

(28:13):
the university.

Speaker 5 (28:15):
So I think this is a little premature. What can
seem to be true doesn't mean it's true. You have
a relatively new ad who's just you know, rounding out
his staff at this point, who is about to make
a massive decision. Let him make it. Like to me,
you know again, I see I said again again. If
they keep Jonathan Smith, that is the first big decision

(28:37):
by Jay Batt and essentially it becomes his Jonathan Smith
becomes his higher next year. Right, that's his decision. And
even if if I think if he made that decision
he'd be a little hamstrung and doing it, that would
be the only reason he did it. But so let
let's see what the decision is. Let's see where they
go from here. You know, Kevin Guskowitz made the move

(28:57):
to get rid of Alan Haller because he thought something
needed to be done and he didn't like the direction
certain things were going in with football, especially and Jay
bat was brought in. So let's let that happen. Let's
let the decisions may be made. I don't let the
bushes be pounded. I don't think there's I don't think
there's lack of care behind this right now.

Speaker 6 (29:16):
I don't.

Speaker 5 (29:16):
I don't think that's what's what's happening. I mean, I
understand the football season can be long and frustrating, but
let's see what Jaybatt does.

Speaker 7 (29:22):
But you're saying there is care, there's someone caring about
the situation.

Speaker 5 (29:26):
Yeah, all these guys care. You don't cannot care, and
you know, I mean, of course they care, now do they?

Speaker 6 (29:32):
It feels like.

Speaker 5 (29:33):
Some don't care sometimes though you have to admit well,
I mean there might be a difference between the difference
between like bleeding for the university like some people do,
and taking as a job that you care about and
you want to get right. I mean, that can be
a difference. But I don't. I don't think what's happening
right now is a lack of care. It's not like
Jay Batt's at home right now going man. I would
fire Jonathan Smith, but there's a Hallmark movie marathon on

(29:55):
right now, and I'd rather do that.

Speaker 7 (29:59):
Heyja bb next, Hey, Jason Smith is a nice guy
presented by Graham Couch, Great guy, oh Man taking body
blows manh.

Speaker 6 (30:08):
Jeff Dylon, Conspiracy take.

Speaker 7 (30:09):
I can't wait to not like to stop hearing about
how great of a guy Jonathan Smith is. It give
me the best.

Speaker 5 (30:14):
Person I am looking for. I don't want anybody to
be fired because of this show, HM, but I am
looking forward.

Speaker 6 (30:22):
To having Jonathan Smith fired because the show.

Speaker 5 (30:26):
Turning the page on the takes in the conversation, Yeah.

Speaker 6 (30:29):
Yeah, Jeff Dillon conspiracy take.

Speaker 7 (30:32):
Jay Batt was in NYC and that's New York, New
York on Tuesday night for the basketball game. It was
then reported that Pat Fitzgerald was at the Giants practice
on Wednesday supporting Mike Kafka.

Speaker 6 (30:43):
Let's see it, Graham, blink twice.

Speaker 7 (30:45):
If Jay Batt and Pat Fitzgerald had a secret meeting
in New York, Blink blink Jeff Bully Next, Trey Ford,
Kurtang and Jordan Scott were a combined two and fifteen
on field goals and one ten on three pointers against Detroit.
We should start Jordan Scott for his defensive length and
rebounding and accelerate the freshman's scoring ability and confidence. And

(31:09):
from Professor, the key to the basketball season is Jordan
Scott becoming a reliable shooter from the outside. His defense
is already better than Fort and Tang and Bonus Alessio's
ice pack and ibuprofen budget might set school records.

Speaker 6 (31:23):
That guy takes some blows. Uh you know what I mean?
He hits? Oh yeah, that's all you give kids?

Speaker 7 (31:29):
Now?

Speaker 6 (31:29):
Is ibuprofen the good drugs anymore? They probably take shots? Right?
I want to.

Speaker 5 (31:33):
I'd want some sort of needles stuck in my ass
to make the pain go away to the basketball points.
I do hear your voice in my head when I
take a shit?

Speaker 6 (31:45):
Yeah?

Speaker 7 (31:47):
Yeah, I'll be.

Speaker 5 (31:48):
Curious how this plays out. I think Jordan Scott has
certainly maybe the highest well, he has the highest potential
as an all around player of those three two guards
because of his defense and other things. If we start shooting,
but you don't have to give him that job before
he's earned it.

Speaker 6 (32:03):
It's just you.

Speaker 5 (32:04):
You can disperse the minutes based game the game who's
playing well. If Kerk Tank's playing well, play more Kurt Tank.
If Jordan Scott's playing well, play more George Scott. If
Trey Ford winds up doing that, let it be more
Trey Fort. You can who starts is really isn't that relevant? Eventually?
If Jordan Scott emerges as that guy. You can reward
him and it's better to have that for your If
it's better for your team to have him start, that's fine.

(32:26):
You saw that with Jace Richards in a year ago,
and eventually it was like, this guy's got to start.
They're not starting games. Great, this is the best player
on the team. It's got to start. I don't think
it matters whether he starts or not, but I do
think him like you're looking at a guy who's like
plus seventeen plus eighteen plus nineteen plus minus half the
time he's in the game. He's fantastic freshman year so far,

(32:46):
doing all the little things. If he can also shoot,
it changes this team considerably because you're right, he is
the best at everything else, and so it's something to watch.
It's it's one of those things in the games they're
playing East Carolina, like on Tuesday, that's what you want
to happen. Jordan Scott hit some threes, right. It's it's
not that you don't want it happening into North Carolina

(33:07):
IO or do. But when they're playing these lesser teams,
if somebody can get some shooting confidence and a guy
like that especially. I think that would that would go
a long way.

Speaker 7 (33:15):
Ralphie next, Okay, be honest, what did you think of
drafting a running back with a twelve pick at the
time and no MSU football comments? Hope you guys have
a great week. We'll miss the shows. How are you
are you taking miss Graham anywhere nice on Thanksgiving Eve?
Sunset on Santa Bel I don't know.

Speaker 6 (33:34):
We'll figure that out. We haven't.

Speaker 5 (33:35):
We haven't really discussed it yet, but I didn't even
know where Sanibal Sannabel must be an island and that's
right there on next to four Myers.

Speaker 6 (33:42):
You don't want a sunset on Santa Beel.

Speaker 5 (33:45):
Yeah. Whatever she wants to do is great by me.
We're looking to get in the warm weather and she
doesn't have to host Thanksgiving when when she goes with me?

Speaker 6 (33:53):
Oh and what did we think about the twelfth pick
at the time?

Speaker 7 (33:55):
Oh? Yeah, yeah, I mean Jamiir Gibbs running back at twelve.
I wasn't super excited about it, but it was one
of the those things you're like, all right, well, Brad Holmes,
it's his draft, let's see what happens with it. What
are you supposed to say.

Speaker 5 (34:05):
He's been pretty good with those first round picks. Yeah,
it's that's not been an issue for him. He well,
does he have a first round miss since he's been there?

Speaker 7 (34:13):
You want me to give you some off?

Speaker 4 (34:14):
Yeah, hold on, I am the passenger.

Speaker 7 (34:25):
That's crazy and I ride and ride, ride through this
all right.

Speaker 5 (34:32):
So well, Talik Williams, you know you can't say that
too early. Rely too early. So Terry and Arnold twenty
fourth when he gets down there, I guess, yeah, maybe so.
But Jamir gives Jack Campbell and then Sam Laporta thirty four,
Brian Branch forty five the two thousand and three draft
until Hendon Hooker. But those first four guys, Gibs, Campbell, Laporta,

(34:56):
Branch is one of the great drafts you'll ever have.
That's a great first in the second round, that's that's
pretty unbelievable. Aiden Hutchinson, James and Williams been pretty good.
Kirby Joseph was a third round pick in that draft,
so I mean he's had some rippin a sewel obviously
the rest of that. Alee McNeil was in that draft
in the third round. Saint Brown is in the fourth round,

(35:17):
so twenty one was a really good draft, twenty two
pretty good, twenty three great, but yeah, I know it's
yeah at twenty twenty five is a little concerning. Actually
is a draft.

Speaker 7 (35:28):
But Joe Lyons restore the roar. David Jackson. Next, this
punter is going to the NFL. Since we didn't trust
him to kick high thirty five yard punts requiring a
fair catch, we had to use a quarterback to do
a sneak punt. Everyone can return kicks except us MSUs.
The worst special teams coaching in America are serb deserved

(35:50):
better and too. If he gave me a second take,
it would be about how Nick Marsh quit on his
team a month ago. He'd have likely left the team
except he wants his final nil pach. He can't leave
soon enough. Don't put him on the travel squad versus
Maryland play someone who wants to compete.

Speaker 5 (36:08):
So I'm torn on Nick Marsh a little bit here.
I'm torn between quitting's way too strong a word. Is
he a guy who's looking forward to the season being over?
I wouldn't be surprised like the rest of us. Yeah,
I wouldn't be surprised if that's the case. I also
think that there are parts of his game that aren't
that polished yet, and we're seeing it like he gets

(36:30):
a lot of attention and he doesn't know how to
deal with it. And now he had a really bad
drop in the Iowa game, and he's had some moments
that aren't great. But there are times out there you
see some of the blocks he makes and you're like, man,
that guy's still doing it. He's still working. I just
think there are elements of his game that aren't actually
that great yet. You think of a guy like Jayden
Reid when he was at Michigan State and the way
he could go high point a ball and catch it

(36:51):
in traffic and things like that. That's not who Nick
marsh is right now, and he's got to work on.
He's got a ways to go. Like I thought at
the beginning of this year, I suck for him that
he had to do two more years at college. That
guy needs more time before he's an NFL receiver. He's
an incredible physical speci when he has a chance to
be a good receiver, but he's not a great receiver
right now. He's just he's a great athlete as an

(37:11):
okay receiver, and that would.

Speaker 7 (37:14):
Put him on a team that's well then well and
it isn't an absolute shit show, And I will show
you a Nick Marsh that's unbelievable.

Speaker 6 (37:21):
Yeah it's possible, you know, yeah, it's possible.

Speaker 7 (37:23):
I mean, you know, we try to devalue Nick Marsh
so no one will come snack snatch him up.

Speaker 6 (37:27):
Is that what we're trying to do here. I don't
care what he does. I know you don't care.

Speaker 7 (37:30):
I'm just saying, is that what we're trying to do
is like, let me come on, money bag number one.
When Nick Marsh asks for another raise, we shouldn't give
it to him. And to Michigan Ohio State is a
fake rivalry they lean into for football because of national
media attention. It's telling that they don't care about each other.
And sports like basketball basketball where media doesn't care about them.

Speaker 5 (37:55):
Well, I think they Football just is king at those
two schools. It's not they don't care about those rivalry.
They don't care as much, there's no doubt. But football
is just king. It's not a it's not a fake rivalry.
It's just not it's it's it's a rivalry that defines
ten years entirely. I mean their football coach. If if
Ryan Day loses this game this year and then wins

(38:19):
another national title, they may fire them. I don't know,
you know, like I mean, I just don't like that
it matters so much to people.

Speaker 6 (38:27):
That's when college football should just explode.

Speaker 5 (38:29):
Yeah everything, And I love that that there are games
that mean so much within a season, because that's one
of the problems of an expanded playoff is you lose,
you lose some of the regular season.

Speaker 7 (38:38):
Meaning c dubs ninety one hot take. If a team
has to vacate wins, players should be allowed to count
that as a red shirt year if they weren't the
reason for the vacated wins and baked the Big ten
is telling officials to purposefully miss calls to make MSU lose.
Missed off sides on the punt, touchdown and pass interference
was brutal.

Speaker 5 (38:59):
It's I'm not like officials are not the reason MSU
is three and eight. However, there are several calls this
year that if they had gone differently, ms you might
have two more wins.

Speaker 7 (39:11):
I was about to say they're responsible for at least
four losses, right the refs, but then you know.

Speaker 5 (39:15):
I mean everybody wants Jonathan Smith going. Jonathan Smith would
be coming back for sure. Fire the refs, I mean
pick one, Okay, I'm willing yeahs fire those games if
they had, like Michigan State was five and five or
five and well they're five and six, yeah, five and six.
If they were six and five, he'd be coming back
for sure. I think five and six would be. The

(39:35):
whole conversation would be different. But such a shame. I like, uh,
the first one here, because there's something to do. This
idea that if you, you know, if the win, if
the game doesn't exist, if you vacated, there's no record,
if it didn't happen, then why should I have to
have you taking away a game I played in? Then
why should I? Why should that count towards my eligibility?

(39:59):
You said it didn't happen, that win did not happen. Now,
if you play more than four games, right, it's not
a it's not a red shirt year. So you would
need it to be you would need it to be
something where you didn't lose so many games, because those
losses weren't vacated, they just they just lost those games.

Speaker 6 (40:17):
So I'd like where.

Speaker 5 (40:20):
Your head's at, though, And I think in court you
might actually have a case if you were like you know,
you vake. I only actually played in three or four
games where there's an actual record of these games ever happening.
Because these were vacated, that doesn't count towards me. I look,
NCAA's not winning a single court case right now. If
I wanted to play another year, I would, I would
take a stab at it.

Speaker 7 (40:41):
Chris Eastlick next number one. By delaying the Smith decision,
regardless of whether he stays or goes, you're doing more
harm than good. Clarity cannot be understated as you head
into the portal and signing day, and two. An ill
support does not change bad in game in game coaching decisions,
timeout usage, bad play calls, and clock management, et cetera.

(41:02):
These two years haven't looked anything like what I expected
from Smith.

Speaker 6 (41:08):
None me either.

Speaker 7 (41:08):
But he's a really good guy. Chris.

Speaker 5 (41:10):
I thought he was going to be I thought he
was gonna bring competent Stemasu football. I thought they were
going to look like a competent team out there and
a competent staff all the time. And I think that's
been the most for everybody watching it the most disheartening
thing because if it had been if it had been
what people thought, it would have been very interesting to

(41:30):
watch how people to dealt with his lack of fire
and all that stuff, and they were doing some frustration,
and I know people probably would have been out on
him and all that stuff. But if you felt like
that guy was bringing competence to your program all the time,
most people would be okay with it, and they'd get
used to the different personality and all that stuff.

Speaker 7 (41:49):
DNB Number one. College football is increasingly harder to gamble on.
Super conferences have led to diluted betting lines. Lucky schedule
goes a long ways, and two if if comes back,
I will give up my season tickets. It's financially and
emotionally the only logical option. I've had them since twenty
eleven and traveled from Wisconsin for ten of those years. Wow. Three.

(42:13):
Alesso aka the Russian has a very high ceiling. He
is elite and staying in the pocket and progressing through
his reads. Solari and I disagreed about this the other day.
I think I think Alessio is, I think he's got
I think he's got some real elite traits, and it's
not just hanging in there. I think I do think
the way he gets through his reads to second and

(42:34):
third reads is something that not a lot of quarterbacks to.
Now some of the hass to his ability to hang
in there, Chris pointed out there were some happy feet.
I think you get hit enough, you start to lose
your confidence a little bit. In Michigan, State's got to
be careful with that. But I think he's a guy.
You obviously got to build an offensive line, you got
to work on the line of scrimmage in the offseason.
But whoever the coach is should want that guy back.

(42:57):
And I think MSU fans can appreciate somebody getting knocked
down like that and keep getting up and some of
the some of the traits he has the tip man
driving Wisconsin though for ten years, that's a long that's
a lot of commitment, and then driving right bag or
you stay at someone's house or that's wild.

Speaker 5 (43:14):
This is this is the question though, when people talk
about money and the financial ramifications of firing a coach
and keeping them, and while there are it is costly
to get rid of a coach, it can be it
can be really costly to keep one, and if you
lose people and they don't easily come back. Once you
give up your season tickets, once you have a year
where you watch games and the comfort of your home,

(43:36):
like the room over here, and you realize, man, I.

Speaker 7 (43:39):
Got Graham over there, or yes, that guy's not going
to Iowa over there, fair.

Speaker 5 (43:43):
Enough, and you've got forty MG's in your system, you know,
and and life is good. You got a bathroom right
around there.

Speaker 7 (43:49):
Three TVs going, you're golf on today.

Speaker 5 (43:52):
You're doing your part by paying for Infinity, for example,
because that's part of the TV deal, right. It's it's
like when you when you pay for Infinity, you're helping MSU.
That's part of the deal. You're paying for NIL or
the the rev share and all that stuff. Right, you
get that great experience for yourself and you're and you're
helping your your school. But when you let when you
do that for a while, when you get away, when
you give up tickets, the odds that you come back,

(44:13):
I don't know, especially if you're driving from Wisconsin, I
don't know if you might really not want to do that.
I think there is a cost of keeping somebody. I
think it's a pretty high cost.

Speaker 7 (44:22):
Bebe plum next colonoscope without sedation is less crappy than
the MSU game. The last five Lions games I have
watched live have also been losses, so I must be
asked for that. I will not watch the rest of
the year.

Speaker 5 (44:34):
What's one game Saturday night? So stop going oh yeah,
oh you're talking about the Lions games?

Speaker 7 (44:40):
Y yeah, watch last five Lions games I've watched live
have also been losses. So stop watching.

Speaker 6 (44:46):
Yeah, yeah, I can't sorry, bebe Yeah, it's rough.

Speaker 7 (44:49):
Yeah, you're a mush fortunate Spartan doc ninety seven. Nobody
on the beat asks Smith hard questions, and it's infuriating.
Why did no one ask what have you've seen this
season that contributes to the vision you have for the program?
Why were no questions about whether Chad Wilt or Lingren
are a part of that vision? Jay Batt is at

(45:10):
every press conference. Why is he not asked about Smith's future?
If he refuses to comment, that should be included in
the story you write. Everyone just lets him repeat the
same phrases over and over. If you want to participate
in phony journalism, at least cash that AI pack while
you still while you do it.

Speaker 5 (45:29):
Well, these are fair questions, I'll say on the Jay
Bat front. And I wasn't in Iowa, but I know
some of the guys were looking at I think he
slipped out the back door before before they could talk
to him. But he also has been through at least
through a spokesperson, asked for comment and has been. We've
been told he's not going to comment on the season.

Speaker 7 (45:49):
See go back to Chris Easlick's first take, though, isn't
he right about that? Isn't it almost detrimental to your team,
like to keep a guy like Jonathan Smith as a
dead man walking, Because that way, if there was a
we're an interim coach, you would have all the relief
of not worrying about is this guy coming back? And
then Jay Bad wouldn't have to sneak out the back door.
I just feel it would make it much easier if

(46:10):
Rossi was the head coach, knowing full well he wasn't
coming back next year, Like we're moving on, so people
have to sit there and threaten their season tickets and
all this other shit when we don't want to. We
don't want to.

Speaker 5 (46:20):
Do that, right, No, I see what you're saying. I
think as long as it happens at the end of
the year, it's fine. I don't and I again, I
go back to the what years are like when coaches
are fired in season and the disruptive nature to that
and what seasons usually become. And it's not it's not great,
and it's not a great experience for players. I understand
that for fans. Sort of the angst and anxiety of

(46:42):
where this is going is.

Speaker 7 (46:44):
So Jay Bass is there, like, man, I gotta sneak
out of this, MF or I hate Jonathan Smith.

Speaker 6 (46:48):
So much, right Like, well, I don't. I don't know
if he did I don't know if Jonathan.

Speaker 7 (46:51):
Smith did this to me. And then Alan Haller did
this to me.

Speaker 6 (46:54):
I don't know if he did it intentionally or he
just well, yeah, he.

Speaker 7 (46:57):
Did it intentionally. Why would you want to sit there?
What do you what are you supposed to say? I
wasn't a dead man walking coach. Again, I wasn't there yesterday,
so I don't. I don't know the exact sert you
weren't there, but these are these are fair points and
and the questions about Wilton Ling like to me, however,
like I don't think Jonathan Smith is part of Michigan
State's future. Is the football coach, So what's the matter

(47:18):
about lndrin or will? However, that said, you're right that
there probably haven't been enough questions about what's your vision
going forward, like how does this like sell? You know,
and it's gotten more in that direction because everybody's curious
and you're putting us through this, we want to, you know,
ask them question.

Speaker 5 (47:33):
I think Monday's press conference this week will be interesting
in that front. I will not be there, of course
in Florida, but so I apologize for that. But I
guess who's not going to be there?

Speaker 6 (47:43):
This guy. This guy in Florida, Spartholomew.

Speaker 7 (47:47):
Everything that's transpired in the past few months tells you
all you need to know about this MSU brass money
above all, not fighting the n C double A to
not pay Tuck, not fighting the pe deal because need
you need money, and not firing your head coach because
you either think someone else will do your dirty work
or you're just playing cheap u Okham's razor. Sometimes the

(48:10):
most obvious answer is in fact the answer, and bonus
stuff Brad Holmes into a fucking locker. They're pathetic, good
never great. Approach is punching them straight in the dick.

Speaker 5 (48:20):
Do you think this will be all? Do you think
this will be an off season that makes them change
any of their approach? I'm talking Brad Holmes in the
Lions here.

Speaker 7 (48:29):
If you haven't changed before this, what I mean, I
don't understand what's this soft season gonna bring?

Speaker 5 (48:35):
I mean, and so what I mean? What happened last year?
So what should that approach be different? How should the
approach be different?

Speaker 6 (48:40):
Like your depth?

Speaker 7 (48:41):
Get depth. Don't think all of your guys are gonna
stay healthy. It's fucking impossible. I get everybody has injuries,
but when you see your guys going through it's just like, dude,
there's no way I understand you. Next man up. It's
just impossible to do in the NFL. You have to
make some moves. The Eagles have made you the They've
shown you the blueprint of how to do it. You
don't have to mortgage your future. I can understand you

(49:02):
don't want to sit there and give four first round
picks for this guy or this guy, but you have
to make some little small moves to get you some depth.
I mean, Jesus, get some help for your guys, is
all Matt C. Not only is Jabatt working a deal
to ship Jonathan Smith back to Oregon State to avoid
the buyout, he's also got urban Meyer locked up to
replace him. The only explanation on the silence, and sly

(49:24):
grins herb, Yeah, it's good to have that. That is
I'm telling you.

Speaker 5 (49:30):
The the Oregon State thing is the ideal situation, right,
the perfect world for MSU and I'm not.

Speaker 6 (49:37):
So ideal for Jonathan Smith though, yeah, probably coming back.

Speaker 5 (49:40):
Yes, the ideal thing for everybody to just stock some situation,
including for Oregon State, because Oregon State is now a
high mid major, and so the Oregon State's ability to
recruit a coach who's a proven coach who's wonted their
school and done is much less than it would have
been before. And Oregon State's a place that has not
won that often, and they won with Jonathan Smith, and

(50:03):
they may there may be some hurt feelings that they'd
have to get over. The best thing that could happen
for all parties. Best case scenario is Smith goes to
Oregon State, which has struggled mightily since he left Michigan State.
Waves the buyout because they don't, you know, they're happy
to facilitate it, and so there's no buyout for organ
State to pay Michigan State. But then Michigan State doesn't
owe Jonathan Smith anything either, because they're not firing him.

(50:26):
He's just leaving for Oregon State. That would be the
ideal situation in all of this, and if that is
the play. Again, I don't know that that's the play,
but I do think that there are people in the
world who are hoping that's the play that aren't just
me right, and aren't just that are around MSU. If
that were the play, that would be I'm not saying

(50:47):
it would be the equivalent of Chess, but it would
be a really savvy, perfect situation like candy Land for
all parties involved.

Speaker 7 (50:56):
Matt ce Graham check the tape, I said after is
Oh and the Big ten and made the Elite eight.
I'd never say Izzo was washed again on this pod.
Do not dishonor me twenty twenty one to twenty twenty
three were terrible. All right, We're not gonna check the tape.
I will just have to trust you.

Speaker 6 (51:12):
Mats.

Speaker 7 (51:12):
The American way, except America has gotten.

Speaker 6 (51:15):
Soft Parks Peyton.

Speaker 7 (51:18):
Since wisc Wisconsin stormed the field after beating Illinois, we
should storm Ford field if we beat Maryland it would
be a signature win and baked. The NCAA should let
us play Perdue for the Big ten toilet Bowl. It
must be outside on a really cold day and Chiles
has to start.

Speaker 5 (51:36):
Oh wow, sounds like fun. Yeah no, no, that's nobody.
It was with the Red Box. It was weird to
see what's happening with Wisconsin here, and it is interesting
to watch how little separation there are between some of
these teams in terms of overall talent, because Wisconsin was
awful for a while. This season in Illinois was pretty good.
And then you watched that game and you're like, how
are those teams at one point so different? And now

(51:57):
you know it's it's yeah, it's interesting.

Speaker 7 (51:59):
Brett Nate next. Smith made a mess of both end
of half clock management situations. As another j Smith once said,
the kids are playing their tails off and their coaches
are screwing it up. Bonus, we will not be giving
hallor a standing ovation in ten years.

Speaker 5 (52:17):
Sorry Graham, you know what ten years, Yeah, there'll be
a small ovation. I didn't say it was standing ovation.
It's going to be just it's golf collapse. When they
see his people will appreciate what you stand. I would
not stand. I wouldn't start the clapping. Will you stand
like when Izzo retires? Will you stand for that? No,
that's not my job.

Speaker 7 (52:36):
I don't know. Are you out of your mind? You
better stand? Why would I stand? What are you talking about?
Make me?

Speaker 4 (52:42):
Made?

Speaker 7 (52:42):
You? Didn't? How did it?

Speaker 6 (52:44):
Don't make me? It don't make me? It's the American way,
except America has gotten soft.

Speaker 7 (52:50):
He made me.

Speaker 6 (52:53):
Fucking aim, But I didn't know that was going to
touch a nerve.

Speaker 4 (52:57):
Made me?

Speaker 7 (52:58):
Oh you mean me? You're the one that made me
do a show on a Sunday night. This is your fault.

Speaker 6 (53:02):
I apologies, all right, Alexis.

Speaker 7 (53:06):
Of course, it's frustrating for our spartan football team to
be this awful. But where does the entitlement come from
that MSU football is supposed to be a top twenty
five program. It sounds like Uncle rico delusions of grandeur,
clinging to coach d'antonio's outlier success from fifteen years ago.
This arrogant disconnect from reality fuels that fringe blood lusting

(53:28):
rage you've written about some fans need to calm down
and come to terms with the fact that the college
football landscape is hyper competitive. All seventy Power four programs
are trying to improve, but there will always be programs
on the bottom of the Big ten and in that
fifty to seventy range and power four in ps still
randomly laughing at the Susie Merchant story from a couple

(53:49):
episodes ago.

Speaker 5 (53:50):
Yeah, you know what I didn't have when Susie Merchid
saw me as at two hundred and eighty four pounds,
a Muskox flannel. That would have helped, cause then it
would have. It would have just if you balloon up,
you put on a few pounds over Thanksgiving, over the holidays.
Another thing the Muskox is here for. It helps you
hide it. It really does. I mean, I'm telling you a
lot of my shirts I put them on, and when
I've gained a few, you can see every line. If

(54:12):
I start to sweat, you can see it right under
my under my breast, you know, like it's just not great.
But you don't see any of that with a Muskox flannel.
It just covers up your worst parts. Accentuate your best
and you're comfortable and you're confident again, go Muskox dot com.
Use the promo code peacock for fifteen dollars off your purchase.
And right now, if there's somebody you're thinking, I need

(54:34):
a great gift for somebody and you want to show
them you care this holiday season, a Muskox flannel again,
go Muskox. Lots of great offerings there and show the
people you care in your life, you care how they
look and how they feel with a Muskox flannel.

Speaker 7 (54:47):
Is it really entitlement? Though? To Alexis's number one, what
are you suppose how are you supposed to feel? You
have to have some sort of pride and thought that
your football program is good. You can't sit there and
be like, oh, whatever, right, we get it's fine, great, Like, no,
that's not how you want to be.

Speaker 5 (55:03):
There's nothing wrong with wanting improvement and striving to be
Now there's no national championship swaged by any means. But
you want to sit there and think that your football
program can you know, can be elite And there's the hope.
There's a difference between hope and entitlement. And I think
that that's you know, I don't know that that Michigan
State fans are entitled. I think they're frustrated and they've

(55:27):
seen something work really well just a decade ago, and
it sucks right now and they're sick of it, and
so I think that's more what it comes what it
comes down to. I do agree that there is a
discussion to Alexi's point, not supposed to be a top
twenty five program, And I think Dan Grave brought this
up in a previous episode, like in this modern era,

(55:47):
is Michigan State a Top twenty, a top thirty?

Speaker 7 (55:49):
Like?

Speaker 5 (55:49):
What what is it anymore? Do we really know? Because
you look Indiana, which was nowhere near that. Nobody would
argue that they're not one of those programs now and
a lot of different teams can be that. You have
to nurture it, and you have to create it, and
you have to create that momentum and everybody moving in
the same direction on your campus. And Michigan State has
failed to do that. So what you're supposed to be
who the hell really cares? And you are up against

(56:11):
everybody wanting to do this, especially in this new year,
people like Vanderbilt see an opportunity. I totally get that,
but the frustration, and it's not all on Jonathan Smith,
it's just been exacerbated and he's been the wrong personality
for the wrong time, and the execution results have obviously
hurt as well.

Speaker 7 (56:30):
Rich Seirian Number one, Nebraska, Minnesota and now Iowa all
games we could have and should have won, even with
the pathetic offensive line.

Speaker 6 (56:38):
That would have been six wins.

Speaker 7 (56:40):
That's on the coaches, poor clock management, poor play calling,
and terrible halftime adjustments. No more excuses for Smith. You
can't explain this away anymore. And two, with this roster,
Antonio wins at least six, maybe even eight games. I
know his era ended with a thud, but even that
wasn't his this bad. I feel sorry for these players

(57:01):
and next year, I'm sure no matter who we get,
it will be an uphill battle when our best guys transfer.

Speaker 5 (57:06):
What Michigan State football really needs for next year, though,
is they need somebody that people like and believe in.
You can put up and I know that fans, it
feels like you can't put up with another bad year
or years of rebuilding and it just feels like they
keep going. But you can put up with a little
bit of pain on the field if you believe in
the person who's on the sideline, and right now people don't,

(57:28):
and that's the hard thing. You don't see it getting better,
you don't see how it would get better in the future,
and so you just want to make that move and
get on with it. I think if you have somebody
you know there's very unlikely that next year is going
to be a really smooth MSU football season. Doesn't mean
they won't get a good person who will bring in
some people and they're overachieved. It will be a little
fun here and there, but there are gonna be some hiccups.

(57:52):
People just need to be able to believe in the
person who's running the show and the possibilities for the future.
And I think that's the hard thing when you lose hope,
and I think people just lost hope. And there's nothing
that Jonathan Smith has said that produce more hope like it.
It would be one thing if you could really explain
it well and this is the vision and this is
why it's been It's tough, but here's how it's going

(58:14):
to happen. But that has not been a strength. That's
not something he's been able to do until there is
no hope.

Speaker 7 (58:19):
Cooper next number one couches, keep your donut out where
I can see it from Monday's show needs to be
a drop on Jason's board. And to lost to Iowa
was entirely Smith created loss, not even a talent issue.
Inexcusable game management all around.

Speaker 5 (58:35):
Speaking of donuts, do want to let people know that
Groovy Donuts has different hours this week for Thanksgiving. They'll
be closed Thursday and Friday so their team can celebrate
Thanksgiving with family and friends, but will be open Saturday
and Sunday seven am and one pm as usual with
all promotions available this weekend again Groovy Donuts dot com.

(58:57):
Place your order today, Make Groovy Donuts part of you
your Thanksgiving weekend. And if you're if you're at home
on Saturday, like Saturday, you've got Michigan State or sorry,
you got Michigan Ohio State. Lots of stuff going on,
probably some good Premier League soccer in the morning, got
Infinity on, You're good to go, and at night you've
got to watch this MSU Maryland game in front of

(59:19):
twelve thousand people at Ford Field. That's a thousand that's
a situation where you want a Musco's flannel, a box
of groovy donuts, and just a way to.

Speaker 6 (59:27):
Get through it.

Speaker 7 (59:27):
Are they bo going these tickets? How many people one?
You can bring whoever you want.

Speaker 6 (59:31):
That's pretty much what it is right now.

Speaker 5 (59:33):
I mean twelve What would what would what would it
take for you to go to Ford Field this weekend?

Speaker 7 (59:40):
Mushrooms?

Speaker 6 (59:41):
That's it?

Speaker 7 (59:42):
Yeah, well that would be the start. Okay, some monetary
Uh uh, you'd have to be paid, Bob you for
baseball car and can I just go to Greek Town instead?

Speaker 6 (59:54):
Go to the casino part of the I have to
go to the game to actually go to the game.
How much money with somebody?

Speaker 7 (59:59):
Have need? Mushrooms and one thousand dollars? Okay, yeah, that's
my appearance fee. Uh, Izzo's no longer got to go.
Tuesday was glory MSU basketball, Red Wings Pistons USA soccer
win uh this weekend opposite, solely because MSU football is
the black hole of doom that sucks the life, energy
and light out of everything. It doesn't matter who comes

(01:00:21):
in as coach, he will be sucked into the black hole.
A little upside there at the end.

Speaker 5 (01:00:28):
Yeah, you know, it's not not great. It just feels
that way.

Speaker 7 (01:00:31):
Matter.

Speaker 5 (01:00:31):
Ye, yeah, that's I think that when you get a
decade into struggling, it feels like a black hole to people.

Speaker 7 (01:00:36):
Yeah, so Urban Meyer, you don't care, bring them in
herb Sparti byerb bonus take I separated her too, Sorry Spartan.
Thank you MSU Women Soccer for saving my Spartan Sports Weekend.
So proud of this team. Grand This team is one
hundred percent worth not going to Iowa four. Let's get

(01:00:57):
the Final four appearance.

Speaker 6 (01:00:59):
It is if if.

Speaker 7 (01:01:01):
Anybody say hidi today, go up to you and go
hey man. A couple people, yeah, yeah, the back Yeah,
it was. It was.

Speaker 6 (01:01:06):
It was fun to be anything. Nobody threw anything, which
is nice.

Speaker 7 (01:01:09):
It was nice.

Speaker 4 (01:01:09):
It was.

Speaker 5 (01:01:09):
It was fun to be there. Like it's I I
really enjoy watching soccer from a field level, which I've
been fortunate to do it at the level that that
they play it. It's it's one of the better entertainment values.
And I'll tell you if if Stanford loses to BYU
tomorrow afternoon Monday afternoon, then Michigan State would host BYU

(01:01:30):
on Saturday at noon at the Martin Stadium. So if
you don't want to watch that uh Michigan Ohio State game,
if that's just going to make you feel all sorts
of ways and unhappy, you could go to the Martin
Stadium and watch Michigan State women in the Elite Eight
against b YU. If Stanford wins the game, Michigan State
will be at Stanford next weekend. But yes, still a
very very cool run for a program that's got it rolling.

(01:01:51):
This is how this is how good they have it
going with MSU women's soccer Jason. Today, they were saying
that they finally got over the Sweet sixteen curse. They
couldn't get past the sweets. Like their curse is the
Sweet sixteen. It's like ah gets stuck at the Sweet
sixteen every year. Like that's if you're if every year
you're stuck at the Sweet sixteen and that's your curse.

Speaker 6 (01:02:09):
Life is good.

Speaker 7 (01:02:10):
Scotty Green's al Camino Joe Rossi deserves a ton of
credit that defense has shown significant growth. Call me simple,
but I like a coach who shows some emotion and
visibly congratulates his players. En Bonus, Fat Couch and Zion
Williams Center both two hundred and eighty four pounds trick question.
Something tells me he carries it better. Susie Merchant would

(01:02:31):
probably agree.

Speaker 5 (01:02:32):
I think fat Zion is quite a bit heavier into
eighty four. That man is like, what six foot ten, six',
nine he's got to be. THREE i Mean sion was
a big deal because he was a huge. Guy AND
i just broke my. Chair that was Not zion who
blew out a, chair by the, way that Was Graham.
Couch i'm Sure zion has blown out a chair in his.
LIFE i Mean sian was a big deal because he's
a huge.

Speaker 6 (01:02:51):
Guy the.

Speaker 7 (01:02:53):
Chair listen to how that blows. Out hold.

Speaker 5 (01:02:55):
ON i Mean zion was a big deal because he
was a huge. Guy AND i just broke my. CHAIR
i Mean zion was a big deal because he was
a huge. GUY i just broke The.

Speaker 6 (01:03:02):
Yeah, NO i.

Speaker 5 (01:03:02):
DO i do want to, say Like Zion williamson to
me is still one of the most disappointing stories coming
out of AN nba. Drafter GUYS i wanted to watch.
Play there are very few people that, LIKE i will
pay to watch that. Play guys that like.

Speaker 7 (01:03:16):
Kind of like Job morant now too, Right, yeah.

Speaker 6 (01:03:18):
Yeah and it just hasn't. Same was the same draft?

Speaker 4 (01:03:21):
Too?

Speaker 6 (01:03:22):
Not can't know it was The zion was number wasn't?

Speaker 5 (01:03:24):
Job? No, yeah the same draft one and? Two, right
hold on off second old guys, here no fucking Memory.

Speaker 2 (01:03:32):
Scott, yeah the bride and Hollow. Scott you know it
looks so good to.

Speaker 1 (01:03:40):
Nice let's Go, green Go, god.

Speaker 5 (01:03:47):
There we go one and. Two it Went, Zion, Williamson
Job morant and Then, Narjia, Barrett DeAndre, hunter so on
and so on and so.

Speaker 7 (01:03:56):
Fourth, Yeah monfield cag next or WATCH msu bring Back
smith and then some other school comes and coaches. Rossy
If smith does come, back there is no way you
bring back every, coach, Right.

Speaker 5 (01:04:09):
I'd start With Chad. Wilt, well you're in charge of special.
TEAMS i think your job has to probably be a
little bit of a little bit of peril right. Now look.
There that's the other problem is at some point people
on the, staff if you do have good, coaches start
to think this guy's a dead man walking, eventually and
they start to look around for other. Jobs it just

(01:04:31):
it's going to happen. EVENTUALLY i don't see how you
don't get it done.

Speaker 7 (01:04:35):
Now so When Nick marsh doesn't feel like, playing it's on.
Him but when coaches are sitting there, going, oh, Man
i'm working with a dead man walking, guy why WOULD
i want To, well, Yeah i'm, sorry you're just Giving
nick Marris a was Gi, YEAH i think, So LIKE
i just. DON'T i, MEAN i can't, imagine like WHEN
i watch this, Team i'm just so disgusted with the.
PROGRAM i could imagine being on the team and then go, like,

(01:04:55):
oh by the, way and watching a lessio get, hammered
like you, know like you just know you're not gonna
get the. Ball it's not gonna be fun For. Marsh
he had a big drop on third. DOWN i give,
THAT i get, it but just morale. Blows AND i
just can understand being that young and talented that you're just,
Like i'm not. Listening i'm not trying to say that
you shouldn't give your all one hundred percent of the
time when you're out on the, field but, MAN i

(01:05:16):
get it.

Speaker 5 (01:05:16):
Sometimes but he went from being the most entertaining guy
on this team to watch to somebody who's barely a.
Factor and and but.

Speaker 7 (01:05:24):
You have to put some players around him to make
him exciting as. Well you can't fucking throw the ball to.
Yourself you can't block guys and then throw the ball to.
YOURSELF i don't.

Speaker 5 (01:05:32):
Know by the, way the most entertaining person on the
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(01:05:53):
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Speaker 7 (01:06:13):
Next THIS msu football team is seven and four right
now if they had better coaching and. Bonus Mike elko
was a fan of this podcast WHEN msu was looking
for a new.

Speaker 6 (01:06:21):
Coach that's, it that's the.

Speaker 7 (01:06:23):
Take that's.

Speaker 5 (01:06:25):
RIGHT i forgot about The Mike elcoe. Situation he was following. Us,
yeah he wanted to be he wanted, this but you
know it's his. Biot the thing About Mike elco Is
mikelco wound up at a place that has an eight
million dollar defensive. Line, yeah and so that worked out
well for. Him so he's never coming here, THEN i would, say,
now ALTHOUGH i you, know if you, Look Mike elco

(01:06:47):
is kind of a should we do A TEXAS a
AND m? Podcast just change it? Up yeah the other,
both you? Know can we still talking ABOUT msu hoops?

Speaker 4 (01:06:54):
There?

Speaker 6 (01:06:54):
Right, yeah here's the.

Speaker 5 (01:06:56):
Thing Mike elco is built sort of like, me, right
a little bit, pudgy sweat in the. Face could he
use A musco's final all that stuff that guy is
living in like the armpit Of. Texas you, know how much
you must, sweat how much you must smell? Bad LIKE i,
LOOK i know at certain point it's just not worth it.
ALL i would rather be up north losing and h

(01:07:16):
or was that's a live? READER i don't, know it.
Was it was just. Me it was just me thinking
about trying to live in nowhere In.

Speaker 7 (01:07:22):
Texas benja Mister benjen mashed potato face should have been
fired before the game ended for not going forward on fourth.
Down guy is blander than plain ass boiled potatoes with
no salt or. Nothing damn, dude let him have. It Ben.

Speaker 5 (01:07:38):
Jim, yeah people getting. Frustrated he's got a stupid looking. Face,
hey that's not.

Speaker 7 (01:07:42):
Nice he's a great, guy great family. Man kevin From
Rochester Hills smith will be back next year and TAKE
msu to the. Playoffs, sorry this is. Stupid The lions
d is not. Good it was not good. Today it
was not fun to. Watch it was so. Dumb some
of those. PLAYS i cannot. Believe, ah, man it's Fucking Derek. Barnes,

(01:08:03):
YEAH i, mean are we doing in? Anzeloney fuck? Me Jack?
CAMPBELL i Love Jack, campbell, though what are.

Speaker 6 (01:08:09):
The, okay so a year ago they're on the way
to fifteen to two.

Speaker 7 (01:08:13):
Seasons, YEAH i was.

Speaker 5 (01:08:14):
There the odds that you would say they would make
The Super bowl were what in your?

Speaker 6 (01:08:17):
HEAD i don't do. That, OKAY i can't do that.

Speaker 7 (01:08:19):
Anymore. OKAY i take. EVERYTHING i respect every team. Before
that's ALL i was doing when we were. There we
went to The washington the playoff. Game we were there
four hours ahead of time you, were and we were
just walking around LIKE i was telling everyone how MUCH
i Respect. Washington i'm not overlooking them and all. That you,
Know Jane daniels great, rookie blah blah. Blah you.

Speaker 6 (01:08:36):
Know, YEAH i can't just don't do.

Speaker 4 (01:08:38):
THAT i.

Speaker 7 (01:08:39):
Can't, no, YEAH i just want to win one Man
nestley's Quick hotel number. ONE i submitted a hot take
that pointed out the obvious conflict of interest these large buyouts.
Create graham responded with some nonsense about. Passion Jay smith
and passion have ever been in the same. Room, YESTERDAY
i was vindicated this man is coaching to get. Fired and,

(01:09:01):
two let me be, Clear i'm not Saying Jonathan smith
through the, game but it's clear he lacks any motivation
or drive to improve this. TEAM i don't care what
talking points he sheepestly mutters. Postgame he's clamoring for that
meeting with bat so he can start cashing those.

Speaker 5 (01:09:18):
CHECKS i think he wants to keep his career, going
AND i think that's the best thing that can happen FOR.
MSU i think an underrated part of the storyline when
people talk about Firing Jonathan smith and Is Jonathan smith's
career and where he may be trying to go and all.
THAT i think that's something to keep an eye on
and SOMETHING msu may be aware of because that matters

(01:09:39):
for the finances of all, This right if you cannot fire,
him or if you can fire him and he winds
up with a soft, landing he winds up somewhere else
and mitigates the amount of money you have to pay,
Him all that stuff, Matters AND i think that's just
something that can Sid CAN i go to the press or?
Tomorrow are you? Going you can? GO i don't have to,
Go you're welcome to.

Speaker 7 (01:09:56):
Go CAN i? Go ask the first? Question like who
asked the who's the New? Hondo is that it's off In,
lindsey Uh.

Speaker 5 (01:10:04):
Huddleston, yeah he still goes to. Those he gets the first. Question,
well not all the, time but sometimes he. DOES i
just want to, add just feel Like solari gets it a. Lot,
jonathan what are? You what are you passionate?

Speaker 7 (01:10:14):
About?

Speaker 5 (01:10:14):
Mmm that's. It he would say, this what do You
what is it you are passionate? About he would say this,
team but he would do it in a voice that
was sort of Like yoda you know he has the
sentence backwards a little. Bit, Yeah, jason do you think,
that Uh Bill. Beakman if you want me to play,
it just say, So Dan. Gray number, One graham shouldn't cover.
Football it shows in his writing that he is more

(01:10:35):
passionate about other sports and he's more knowledgeable in basketball
by a mile to the.

Speaker 7 (01:10:41):
More is that a.

Speaker 5 (01:10:42):
Compliment it's part of a, compliment but it's also. Not you,
know it's also a little. True it's, not you, know
entirely basically your football writing shit because you don't care.

Speaker 7 (01:10:49):
To the more Impressive alessio, plays the higher chance he's
gone if and when there is a coaching. Change and,
THREE msu fan base is going to be pissed when
they end up With nardoozie Or. Fitzgerald neither would be
a bad. Hire BUT i also Thought smith was a good.

Speaker 5 (01:11:03):
Hire, YEAH i, Mean nardozzi has at pretty good bye out.
HIMSELF i don't Think nardoozy is going to, happen BUT
i don't Think narduzi would be a bad. Higher and
if you wanted the perfect situation for a lot OF msu,
fans which Involves Max, bulla and you Had nardouzi as
your head coach And Max bulla as your defensive. COORDINATOR
i think people would be okay with. That it would

(01:11:23):
feel like an heir apparent of, sorts you, know and
a guy who was, sixty who's younger Than signetti and you,
know would be motivated to prove that that he could
get that job. BACK i, DON'T i. DON'T i do
not Think nardozzi. WOULD i don't know What nardoozi's ceiling
would be AT msu, entirely BUT i did not think
he would fail AT. Msu AND i don't Think fitzgerald would.
Either fitzgerald would Be fitzgerald might be my top. Pick

(01:11:47):
what do you mean by? Fail Like nardozzi wouldn't fail
like What smith's Like smith is? Failing, yeah, Right BUT
i mean it would have to get this. Bad you
don't think he would be this? Bad BUT i mean,
No but WHAT i mean not? FAIL i, mean you
know he would get the Program i'm going and to
the point that they were in the playoff conversation at
some point while he was the coach pretty you, Know
and BUT i don't know, that like you, know are

(01:12:08):
there is there magic in a bottle out?

Speaker 7 (01:12:10):
There Like?

Speaker 5 (01:12:10):
Signetti you, know that's that's hard to hard to? Find
is magic in a bottle is a PHRASE i don't.
Know lightning in a, bottle lightning in a. Bottle there you,
go you could.

Speaker 7 (01:12:17):
Do magic in a. Bottle it's a new couches.

Speaker 5 (01:12:20):
Here do you know WHAT i was thinking about to
right After? Thanksgiving the next show we do will Be.
December you know What december means For? Hoff Jonathan smith's,
Fired Felice.

Speaker 6 (01:12:30):
Navid that is.

Speaker 7 (01:12:31):
True, Yeah, Spartan, johnny The bills head coach has got to.
Go we have squandered yet another year Of Josh, allen
no wide receiver one Since Stefan. Diggs Keon coleman blows
and our O c draws up only sideways. Throws McDermott
is a defensive coach and the, defense uh defense is.

Speaker 6 (01:12:53):
Atrocious move On Buffalo bill's podcast?

Speaker 7 (01:12:56):
Here what's going on With Keon? Coleman by?

Speaker 6 (01:12:58):
THAT i don't.

Speaker 7 (01:12:58):
Know it's, Weird. Ben he doesn't want to a healthy,
scratch not great and show it for meetings not? Great?
Great yeah all, right, yeah Big John. Hogg the MHS aa.
Sucks where hemorrhaging kids to other. States think of all
the talent that's gone elsewhere over the years just for. Exposure,
also we need a separate division for private. Schools there

(01:13:20):
are eight percent of, schools yet make up forty four
percent of football.

Speaker 6 (01:13:24):
Finals it's unfair to.

Speaker 5 (01:13:26):
Public's, YEAH i, mean this is a conversation that's had
a lot of. Places you, KNOW i don't. KNOW i
kind of like the idea that if you win your,
division you've beaten the best and and and. Everything BUT
i understand, that you, know the private schools have an
advantage of the recruiting and the school choice world though
everybody can, recruit, Right SO i don't. Know it's the

(01:13:49):
stuff with basketball and losing top talent to other. States
that's a real, thing and that's that's THE MHA mhsa
is sort of chosen that has made the choice to
make it hard on schools to do certain things like
travel out of state and do all sorts of stuff
that you can argue isn't always best for, kids but
it is when you have a great, player and sometimes
it helps you keep that. Guy and that's just the

(01:14:11):
way the. WORLD i do think they should probably relax their,
rules AND i think they should play more. Games they
play twenty games high school basketball In, michigan and you
know In, illinois it's like what seventy, Four it's not really,
that but it's a lot more games these kids have to.
Play it's a lot more and they all like. It
nobody can. PLAINTS i tried to do the story In
freeport years, ago and years as long ago as, that

(01:14:33):
well it's like two thousand and three or something like.
That but because they got their basketball season starts before
football is, over like half the teams still playing, football
and you got your basketball, teams you got Pre thanksgiving,
tournaments Post thanksgiving, tournaments Pre christmas, tournaments Post christmas. Tournaments
everybody plays in all of. Them and In michigan maybe
you play in one showcase game around one of the
holidays or something like. That AND i went AND i

(01:14:55):
wanted to talk to parents because like My Aunt, claudia for,
Example Aunt, claudia she used to get really frustrated because
their kids were in high level high school hockey and
they couldn't travel in Upstate New york around the holidays
because they had to be in all these. Tournaments and
SO i, thought parents must be. Frustrated you can't go
anywhere while you got a kid playing high school sports
In illinois because they're playing sixty five million tournament. Games

(01:15:18):
not one person complaining this is just what you. Do
i'm telling you nobody's upset about. It And michigan they
could do a little more That that is a story
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Speaker 7 (01:15:39):
Company Alex Mayor Jeremy fears is the best passer in the.
Country if he continues to hit open shots and make
buckets in the, paint he is by far the best
point guard in the.

Speaker 5 (01:15:49):
Country, well he's got a chance to lead the nation and.
Assists AND i say that only even though it's, early
because it's been very. Consistent like it's one, thing if
you were five games in and you have like a
seventeen assist game and or, something you're usually around, six
and that's bumping up your. Numbers he's at at least
nine in every game and he's, averaging you, know like

(01:16:10):
close to eleven per. Game that that's telling that he's
going to be up there all. Year whether that makes
him the best passer in the country or point, GUARD
i don't, know but it certainly if he continues to
have the assistant turnover ratio he does and take care
Of Michigan state the way he. Is the step he's
taken has been, significant no, Doubt.

Speaker 7 (01:16:28):
Scot you number one, Fears kohler And cooper give this
team a consistently high. Floor need to keep them healthy
as our strength is the point and front court this,
season and, two our ceiling will be how Consistently car
plays and the three point shooting we get at the
two and.

Speaker 6 (01:16:43):
Three it's basketball all the.

Speaker 5 (01:16:45):
WAY i think people are ready to ready to move
On bull in A china. Closet the health is key
for This Michigan state basketball. Team it is for a
lot of. Teams but like last year's team really did
have strength in numbers, right you could argue their reserves
are better than their. Start that is not the case
now and The detroit game was a great example of.
This at one point the plus minus the core four

(01:17:07):
guys were all, like you, know plus fifteen to plus twenty.
Eight you, Know Tang kertanng And Trey ford were like
in that plus ten range or a little, below and
then everybody else is like minus.

Speaker 6 (01:17:19):
Three to plus.

Speaker 5 (01:17:21):
Two and you can see it in those, days and
they were playing a lot of those lineups, together the
core four, together the other guys, together and you can
just see the. Difference and so this is one of
those years where they've got a number of guys they
cannot afford to have get. Hurt let's take a really quick.
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Speaker 7 (01:21:30):
Peacock some dude number. One having a game at the
at a pro stadium Like Ford field is the only
way to keep this team fired up for the last
game of the. Season even Though smith has done a
great job on this so, far and To couch he's
a good, guy aw, Shucks BUT i can't say that
he's a good coach, ever considering that in game stuff
AND i WISH i. Could and three spent the week

(01:21:52):
the weekend In Kansas, city the birthplace Of. Hallmark hell,
ye was constantly on the lookout for a pantless couch
at The Hallmark. Museum that's not really how that. Goes
that where you beat, off that's not how that Goes, yeah,
no IT'S i didn't know The Hallmark medium can Everybody?

Speaker 6 (01:22:07):
Masterbach it's?

Speaker 5 (01:22:09):
True, yeah well the museum, Though, yeah you don't want
to do it at The Hallmark. Museum BUT i, mean fucking, Everybody. Masterbach,
yeah it's the, yeah, yeah, no, No, look What's smith?

Speaker 7 (01:22:20):
Done?

Speaker 5 (01:22:20):
Well he has gotten them playing. WELL i, mean you've
gotten them playing. HARD i should send the scale of
one to one thousand, thousand being like you're just over? It,
yeah are you just over talking About Jonathan? SMITH i would,
Say i'm in like a thousand and one thousand and.

Speaker 6 (01:22:34):
ONE i gotta say it's.

Speaker 5 (01:22:35):
Amazing WHEN i first, realized like we were talking late last,
week BECAUSE i the weeks go by quickly In, november
there's a lot going. ON i didn't even realize this
Was thanksgiving week till about four days.

Speaker 7 (01:22:46):
Ago, dude it's really come out of.

Speaker 5 (01:22:48):
Nowhere and THEN i was, like, well, shit that Means
I'm i'm gone all week In florida to cover this
basketball that's the next. Week so for the, show it's
going to impact. Us and THEN i started to think
about it later when we said we're just gonna Do somenday,
SHOW i was, like so there's no More Jonathan smith
takes until maybe after it, happens which is, uh Which
I'll i'll take and if it, doesn't we'll deal with

(01:23:08):
that when when it.

Speaker 7 (01:23:08):
Happens Richard Kane number, one that was some of the
dumbest fucking Coaching i've ever. Seen keep punting it to
the star returner who already burned you badly, twice snatching
defeat from The jaws Of victory second game lost directly
by special, teams and. Two If Lance stone is five,
Eight Jeremy fears is seven feet and, Baked i'm Surprised

(01:23:30):
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Speaker 6 (01:23:45):
Spirit that's not what we do.

Speaker 7 (01:23:46):
Here. Disgusting come, on be. Better this couch, says do.
Better chris can't do ALL.

Speaker 6 (01:23:54):
I read off. THAT i thought about it for a.
MINT i just can't do.

Speaker 7 (01:23:56):
It, Good. Chris the losses, blow but look at the
team and who's. Performing tuck left us with a rotten.
Core smith's a talent, developer and he's found some stud
Recruits Lesso Fraser Aiden west that are in close games
to decent teams and a NEW. Oc give, me coach
m time to developed the line and this team will have.

(01:24:17):
JUICE i just love being told just give it.

Speaker 5 (01:24:21):
Time, YEAH i, mean the problem is things do take.
Time the problem is there's been no evidence that if
you give them, time it'll. Work that's that's ultimately the.
Problem you have to in this day and, age a
show of good. Faith here's here's how we don't blow
a game At, nebraska a game Of, minnesota the game In.

(01:24:42):
Iowa you, know if if you're playing The, nebraska's The
iowa's and the in The minnesotas of the, world you
know that mid level talent and you got them where
you you, know you GOTTA i don't know what to.

Speaker 6 (01:24:54):
Say tom is maybe a crazy.

Speaker 7 (01:24:59):
Take Apparently Joe rossi at the very least needs to
an interview for the head coach. Job he's clearly a great,
motivator and the defense is the only unit we've seen
improved this season For Joe.

Speaker 5 (01:25:11):
Rossie LIKE i think you interview everybody we talked About Max,
bulla you should Interview Joe. ROSSIE i doubt he'll get
the job because he's part of this, staff and that's
not usually how it, works but you always you want
to interview people that interest, you and here's. Somebody i'd
want to Interview Joe rossi for a couple. Reasons, One
i'd want to just see what he had to, say
see if he could sell me on the idea that
he should be a. Candidate i'd also want to know

(01:25:31):
why a guy like that thinks this didn't work With Jonathan,
smith because he's not A Jonathan smith. Guy he's not
part of that. Tree he didn't come From Morgan. STATE
i want to know why this why he thinks it didn't,
work and what the less Like If i'm an ad
And i'm hiring a new, coach not only WOULD i
want to maybe Consider rossi as an Outside canada if you,
really if he he just blew you, away but ALSO

(01:25:53):
i want to know what are the pitfalls for this?
Job what are the things to? Know what are the
things that are a real, Problem what are the things
that limit coaching apps and make this job? Difficult AND
i Think Joe, rossi more than, anybody could tell.

Speaker 7 (01:26:03):
You That john. Naughty Joe rossi is lobbying hard on
the sidelines For smith's. Job AND i wouldn't be surprised
If Jay batt is trying to Find smith a new
job to avoid paying out his. CONTRACT i think in
the corporate world it's called out. Counseling AND i agree
one hundred percent Of Jason college football will never again
feel like twenty. Thirteen back then there was money, involved

(01:26:25):
but it was all about pride in. School now it's
all about money pretending to be about pride and.

Speaker 6 (01:26:30):
Schools fans feel the.

Speaker 5 (01:26:32):
Difference, yeah, look it's not the, Same and the question
is can people love it? Anyway and that's really what
it will come down to in the decades. Ahead there's enough.

Speaker 7 (01:26:44):
Interest well, now you, know If Michigan state hires the
right guy and turns this thing around and becomes fun.
Again i'm just saying as far as looking at the
college football slate on A saturday AND i look at
games AND i, go, HEY i can miss.

Speaker 6 (01:26:56):
THOSE i, mean, well that's the.

Speaker 5 (01:26:57):
Problem so the question, is twenty years from, now are
a lot of people being, like, eh that's not really
part of.

Speaker 6 (01:27:02):
IT i feel like our way to the playoff or.

Speaker 7 (01:27:03):
Something. RIGHT i Watch Michigan state AND i watch some,
other you, know other. GAMES i STILL i love the
game of. FOOTBALL i love college. Football it's just not
as much where you, know Every saturday you were sitting
down watching. Games UH sparti party ninety. Four THIS msu
football team hasn't, quit which counts for. Something but the
talent gap is so huge and with the dud recruiting

(01:27:23):
class coming, in it's not getting fixed anytime. Soon another
three to four years of paying. Ahead hopefully women's soccer
keeps rolling for your, Sake, graham.

Speaker 4 (01:27:34):
It.

Speaker 5 (01:27:34):
DOESN'T i, MEAN i think they're a good. STORY i
like Think Jeff howler is a great.

Speaker 6 (01:27:38):
Coach to, Me.

Speaker 5 (01:27:41):
Michigan state has almost everything going for it except. Football
and if you're in my, ROLE i, mean don't get,
WRONG i get a little tired of writing about the
Same jonathan's. Storylines but and that's only because the season
went south so, quickly and it's there are reasons for that.
Dynamic but so, really if you're going to be a
local columnist in a market where primarily what you cover

(01:28:04):
Is Michigan, state and you've got a basketball program that's supremely,
relevant that's interesting to people right, Now you've got a
women's basketball program that looks like it's on the rise
that people are curious. About you've got a volleyball team
that's on the verge of maybe making THE ncaa. Tournament
you got a women's soccer teams that's really. Interesting And
i'm not saying all those things are the same in
terms of level of. Care i'm just saying there are
a lot of things like In Michigan, sate the hockey

(01:28:25):
didn't bring up, hockey which is the number. One, well
they lost To wisconsin obviously, twice and they'll lose probably
that number one. Ranking but you got A Michigan state
hockey program that's as good as it's been in you,
know maybe forty. Years there's just a lot of really
good stuff going that just the problem FOR. Msu and
this is What hallard did, though And hallard knew that
every ad knows. This if you don't have football, right

(01:28:48):
you don't have. It because look where we are with
the conversation. Today michigan say basketball is, unbeaten and they
beat In arkansas And, kentucky AND i get The kentucky wasn't.
Great Michigan state hockey AND i know they just lost To.
Wisconsin those at the top of the, world and it
feels like that's a team that could win the whole.
Thing there are non revs that are really intriguing and

(01:29:08):
interesting and entertaining for, people but largely people are concerned about.
Football and the timing of this show makes a little,
different makes it like if normally the way The lions
came ended just like an hour before we did the.
Show we don't have as Many lions tanks because it
usually those are get sprinkled in as. Well So i'm
not saying everybody's just focused ON msu, football but this

(01:29:30):
speaks to where people's heads are and how much that actually.

Speaker 4 (01:29:32):
Matters back to the white elephant in the.

Speaker 7 (01:29:34):
Room they don't want to deal with the white elephant
in the. Room maddie b next number, One someone Get
linger in a. Diaper i'm so tired of this dude
shitting down his leg at every critical. Moment we run
toss sweeps twelve yards deep in our own territory on
fourth and, one but now on fourth and two to
win the, game you, Fold holy, shit get these guys
out of. Here. Two If bat brings this clown, back

(01:29:56):
no more hiding behind, statements get your face out in
front of a podium and playing while you're going to
tie yourself to this broken down car for another. Year,
yeah he'll have to do.

Speaker 5 (01:30:04):
It if if they Bring Jonathan smith, back and, AGAIN
i don't think that's the direction they'll wind.

Speaker 6 (01:30:09):
Up just when you say, it it makes me. Sorry.

Speaker 5 (01:30:12):
Ah if they were like he would, REALLY i, mean
that would have to be account.

Speaker 7 (01:30:15):
If you just say, it like out, loud like there's
no Chance Jonathan smith's coming, back you just say.

Speaker 5 (01:30:19):
It i'm not gonna say there's no, chance BECAUSE i
don't want to say SOMETHING i don't. KNOW i don't
think he'll be.

Speaker 7 (01:30:24):
BACK i know you don't, know all, Right spartan eighteen
seven seven zero number. One after the first five minutes
of The maryland, Game ford field officials will be letting
people in free from off the. Streets and, two if
you think That smith should be, retained ask yourself one,
question what is the identity of this?

Speaker 6 (01:30:40):
Team it's a weird team, too like they take body blows. Man,
well it's a.

Speaker 5 (01:30:46):
Weird team because you think about the beginning of the
season where the defense was just you, know on skis
getting you, know run, over and yet THE i, MEAN i,
mean if you think about THE usc, game the defense
was like they just couldn't do anything, right and that
people really. Frustrated the offense showed a ton of. Potential
the special teams was was great and looked like the
real strength of the. Team and now you fast forward

(01:31:07):
to the end of the, year the offense is just
is just kind of you, know the offensive line at
least doesn't give them a chance to have any sort
of regular. Production the receivers that were gonna be the
strength of the team really haven't. Been and then you,
know special teams has gone to, hell and then defensively
they've shown life and it's a. Weird it's just a
weird team and a weird season in that.

Speaker 7 (01:31:26):
Sense the com for what is this word comb? For
for close, Enough Combe ferrari Of Southern. MAINE i THOUGHT
i was dead inside and that this team losing wouldn't bother.
ME i was. WRONG i allowed myself to be, angry
And i'm more disappointed in me THAN i am in
whatever coaching decisions were. Made.

Speaker 6 (01:31:46):
Hm that's mature right.

Speaker 5 (01:31:48):
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Speaker 7 (01:32:26):
There Ryan schultz next would have been happy For hall
and A lesso if they had, won but that was
a predictable way to blow it and probably a good.
THING a win would have led to murmurs of, well
they haven't given up on. Him maybe he deserves another.
Year get this clown out of el asap and. Bonus
the problem With Jonathan smith's Program identity is that it isn't,

(01:32:48):
big big ten.

Speaker 5 (01:32:49):
Tough it's Specific northwest, Tough portland. Tough portland. Tough doesn't
do it. RIGHT corvlli is tough. To, yeah there isn't
really an identity team and that's ultimately the. Issue there
hasn't been one for two years and so THAT'S i
thought they were going to have one at the beginning
of this, year looked like they had one in the
passing game and A heell apartment Curtin.

Speaker 7 (01:33:10):
Chicago, respectfully do you guys really think The Michigan state
head coaching job is better Than? Northwestern northwestern is bowling
and was also bowling in twenty twenty. Three they're opening
a one billion dollar donor funded football, stadium and they
practice in a new three hundred million Dollar Lake michigan waterfront.
Complex we can't finish The izzo football. Complex Jay batt's

(01:33:31):
new East Side plaza is the most embarrassing Thing i've ever.
Seen and we can't host games in Late november in
fear of our dumpy stadium's water and plumbing creating a
public health, biohazard and athletic department dysfunction has alienated our mega.

Speaker 5 (01:33:45):
DONORS i still think it's a better job Than. NORTHWESTERN
i just do Because northwestern is just a school without
a fan. Base they just, are they really.

Speaker 4 (01:33:53):
Are.

Speaker 5 (01:33:54):
Now i'm not saying they don't have some mega donors
in this age that can do a lot for. You
that you know for, Years they've been in Worship Iago's
big ten, school and yet there are at least eight
fan Bases big ten fan bases In chicago.

Speaker 6 (01:34:06):
That Are Northwestern's mega Donors.

Speaker 7 (01:34:10):
Louis. DREYFUS i mean.

Speaker 5 (01:34:12):
Just because we don't know the names, though doesn't mean
most people don't know the names Of Michigan state's. Donors,
yes we, do they don't most people outside Of.

Speaker 7 (01:34:19):
MICHIGAN i, Know, Bush, Oh Jim, hayos who is The
Jim hayos Of? Northwestern until you get one of Those
Michigan state Above. Northwestern there you. Go made some great, points,
though neurotic. PANTS i know it won't, happen but in
a just, world the university would Reduce smith's pay or
ask him to return some of. It Over paid loser

(01:34:39):
coaches have zero accountability and make even more money when
they are asked to go.

Speaker 5 (01:34:44):
Away the problem with being a good guy who's not
a successful coach somewhere is that you don't have the
ability to fire them for just cause THAT i, mean he,
is But i'm still a good. Guy, Yeah but THAT'S i, mean,
ultimately that's the advantage of the Mel tuckers is they're
going to do something that makes you not have to pay.

Speaker 7 (01:34:58):
Them so five years from not, like, God Jonathan, smith
what a shit? Show but, hey good, guy right about
what they did to that?

Speaker 5 (01:35:05):
Guy, Well, no nobody's gonna feel bad For Jonathan. Smith you,
WILL i won't you feel a little bit? Bad, Well i'll,
not not, REALLY i mean the guy this is this
is what they choose and and this is this is
the profession they. Choose you, know if you're a, coach
even if you're a, coach is not who's you know
down the ladder On Michigan state staff and you're gonna
have to move your family again and you don't get
paid as much officially.

Speaker 7 (01:35:26):
Over coaches out On Jonathan.

Speaker 5 (01:35:28):
Smith, well you you choose this life and this is
you know, There, yeah it is what it.

Speaker 7 (01:35:33):
IS i choose this. Life Skyler verden Next Michigan stage
should hire a w W e, wrestler as it's front
facing A d who can give the fans what they,
want like saying that they're gonna put the big ten
in the headlock and then he's gonna pile DRIVE. Cmu
then we have a, secret real A d behind the
scenes who does the actual.

Speaker 5 (01:35:52):
Job this would be actually funny because you're you're right
in some, ways you need somebody who's actually doing the.
Work and then but what people really want is somebody
to just tell everybody to fuck the hell, off and
that's not always the best way to get things. Done
so but it would Be, yeah have a front facing,
person you, know like a uh who'd be the best
personality Around Michigan? State like is oh? Unhinged you, know

(01:36:14):
sort of that person he's too, old he can't keep?
It can be is though. Himself you don't want you
need it somebody to. Like, YEAH i don't know who
that would be in the National Matt, larson but, yes,
spokesperson here Go matt ruin your.

Speaker 7 (01:36:26):
Career, ah finally the jerk guy number. ONE i hate
to agree with, you but raps do need to be
made available for postgame questions for the. Media and to
milk toast is a word that needs to be used
more in current sports.

Speaker 5 (01:36:40):
Writing it's a good. Word i've used it a. LOT
i used to misspell. IT i used to spell like
milk and toast for a long. Time nobody told ME
i was like in my thirties BEFORE i rubed. It,
YEAH i rubed it for a long long. Time yeah
it was a bad. Deal what are you gonna? Do
i'm not that good at. This we appreciate all of.
You thank you for producing our. Show sticking with us
when our schedule, changes we. Do we do appreciate, you

(01:37:01):
and hopefully the conversation will change by the time we're
back with. You we hope you have a Great thanksgiving as.
Well we Appreciate. Exfinity Go atfinity dot, com type in your,
address check out the Deals Black friday deals coming here On.
Infinity of, course we Appreciate Midtown Brewing, company and of
course our friends At muskox. Qualityflannels Go muscos dot. Com

(01:37:24):
it's all right, there peacock for fifteen dollars. Off have
a Good thanksgiving, man good job, man catching the.

Speaker 1 (01:37:30):
Room