September 5, 2025 • 20 mins
Ben Criddle talks BYU sports every weekday from 2 to 6 pm.
Today's Co-Hosts: Ben Criddle (@criddlebenjamin)
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Apple Podcasts:
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
You were listening to Cougar Sports with Ben Krettle, and
it's time for a Cougar insider report. Now, let's get
that for a prietary inside scoop on Cougar Sports from Cretele.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Welcome back Cougar Sports one O three nine ninety eight
point three ESPN The fan. I've been grittle broadcasting from
our Bantererwill Studios Banterwell dot com. Get out a free
Q and a O obligation to a vest QNA with
our tax more World Advisors or Certify Financial Planners. Nobody
does it better than band or Well. Shout out to
Sean Walker, Kasel dot com. By my side, Ronald the
Three Man Weaver executive producer. Shout out to Jack Robinson
(00:33):
as well as Brad Always bring the hammer Brett Hammer
and Bicker reward to Vic Kram. It is a segment
of insider knowledge we're gonna provide for you. It's gonna
be brought to you by Big o'tires in American Fork.
If you're looking for an honest, hardworking, cost transparent mechanic
who's also a big BU fan, let my guy Ryan
Eldrits earned your business today. Nobody does it better than
Ryan Eldridge. Uh look not just tires, full service mechanic shop,
(00:55):
VIP products, VPP service, VP discounts. Give him a call,
set up an appointment, get your vehicle checked out today
at Big O'tires in American Fork. Let him know I
sent you. He'll take care of you. Let's get out
to the hotline. Welcome in college basketball, college football insider.
A man that knows how to delve into the data.
He's a man of metrics as well as a man
that likes to get into the minutia of college athletics.
(01:15):
Nobody doesn't better. Let's welcome in Matt Brown of Extra Points.
Speaker 3 (01:18):
Matt, how you live in?
Speaker 1 (01:20):
I'm tellings, I'm doing great. Great to be here. Happy
week two. Thanks for having me.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
Hey, Always a pleasure, always a blessing talking with you.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
Over the last year and a half two years, you've
become the video game expert, the college football game expert,
now the college basketball game expert. And we advise everyone
if you want to stay up to date on all
the video games, and we do have a good segment
of our fan base that loves the video games.
Speaker 3 (01:46):
You gotta follow Matt Brown.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
You gotta subscribe to his newsletter Extra Points at Extra
Points ab dot com. Matt, what's the latest right now
on the college basketball video game?
Speaker 3 (01:58):
Is it coming to our homes too?
Speaker 1 (02:01):
There will be college basketball content on video game systems
in your home soon. Will it be the game that
many people in this market wanted? No, and I have
to apologize. It is kind of my fault. And that's
that's unfortunately not a joke. Uh what what? What? What
happened here? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (02:22):
What did you do? Why?
Speaker 1 (02:24):
Why would I do it? Because?
Speaker 3 (02:25):
Enough?
Speaker 1 (02:26):
Not enough you people listen to subscribe to Extra Points.
I had to burn the whole thing down. No, So
here's what happens. The CLC, the organization that handles like
the IP licensing for just about every major college program,
puts out this RFP saying, all right, we want to
make college back, We want to make college basketball game developers.
If you want to get the licenses for all these
(02:47):
schools and all these conferences, you send us your best
pitch and we'll make a recommendation. So there were there
were three companies that bid. The two biggest ones were
EA Sports and two K. Two K of course, the
company that makes the NBA two K series, among other games.
EA said, hey, if you pick us, we will make
(03:08):
a game that includes every single Division one men's and
women's basketball program, including Utah Tech in Utah Valley. You
got to wait till at least twenty twenty eight because
we haven't made a basketball games in since twenty eighteen,
and we haven't made a good basketball game and a
decade longer than that, so we need some time to
build the whole thing from scratch. But we'll include everybody.
(03:29):
And two K said, well, we've been making really good
basketball games for the last fifteen years. Now we can
go to market much faster, but we're not going to
include every single program because we don't think that that's
going to be profitable. What we'll do is we'll create
a DLC downloadable content segment involving college basketball programs within NBA.
(03:51):
Two K we can begin to at college basketball IP
as early as this year. So if you bought the
NBA TWOK last week or this week, I'm I'm gonna
spoil something for you come February. There's going to be
college basketball teams in it, and there'll be a lot
more of them and next year's release, but it won't
have everybody. And two K said, listen, if we get
(04:12):
enough people to buy this thing, if we can get
some better data to show that there's enough commercial demands,
we will make a standalone college basketball game. Enough big
schools said, you know what, I want to trust two
K because I'd rather have some money next year then
wait three years to maybe have some money in case
in case EA can't fix it, you can't get this
thing done on time. And then EA said, enough for you.
(04:34):
Guys picked two K. So wehere withdrawing our offer because
we only want to do this if we can get
an exclusive license. So that's where we are. Two K's
making the college basketball game. BUYU will be in it.
What other schools in Utah will be in it other
than Utah unclear. I always feel very confident that Southern Utah,
Utah Tech UVU they will not be in the game
at launch, and I don't know if they're going to
(04:55):
be in the game in year two or year three.
The reason this is kind of my fall is because
I broke the news back in July that EA Sports
had had had put out this RFP and and indicated
they wanted to be involved. And I reached out to
EA for comment and Rather than talking to me, EA
decided to publish a tweet confirming that they were going
(05:16):
to bring back the game. Uh, four minutes after I
wrote my story as a way to make sure that
I didn't get I didn't get to own the scoop.
Speaker 3 (05:23):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
And they did that before they had, you know, a
basketball game ready. Like most people at EA didn't even
know they were going to make a basketball game at
that point. Uh. It was it was a rush announcement.
Two K saw that announcement and went, we could beat
these guys to market, came out with a better proposal,
won the bid. So, I mean, it's really EA's fault
that that you're not getting a game with everybody. But unfortunately,
(05:45):
I think I played at least a small role in that.
Speaker 2 (05:48):
Man the weeping, the whaling the nation your teeth is
there enmity now between the video game college basketball fan
and Matt Brown of Extra Points?
Speaker 3 (06:02):
Have you received hate mail? Have you seen dms? Is
the truth? You know?
Speaker 2 (06:06):
Allowing for the the the dregs of the college basketball
world to come after you.
Speaker 1 (06:15):
I mean, of course they are right, because because look,
I love college football fans. I've been writing for college
football fans for the last fourteen years of my life.
And we know that there are segments of college football
fans that are real stupid and they're gonna they're gonna
be scream at you on social media because they think
you call the plays or that you make the recruiting decisions.
And as insane as college football fans can be on
the internet, college is video game people are an order
(06:40):
of magnitude worse. So yeah, I'm getting I mean, I
was getting a lot of this just because people can't
read or don't want to read, and they just assume, like, oh,
like Matt Brown decided that we shouldn't get to play
a college basketball game with Western Illinois. Do you want
to talk about ednity? Though? That's with me and Ea.
We used to have a good professional relationship. At this point,
(07:00):
I don't think I'm on their Christmas card list anymore.
I'm hopeful that someday that that gets resolved, But right now,
I don't think I'm a popular guy in Orlando.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
Man, Well you're a popular guy here on Cougar Sports.
It may not seem like much, Matt, but we love you,
we meet you here.
Speaker 1 (07:19):
I appreciate that. It is nice to know I still
have some brothers and sisters in Utah County.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
Amen. Amen, Matt.
Speaker 4 (07:26):
I'm not gonna lie that this whole conversation has made
me want to go buy another subscription to Extra Points
extra Points mb dot com for our listeners who don't
and may it almost makes me not want to pick
up a copy of NBA two K or whatever College
Basketball two K ends up being based off of this
little minor beef. But you did touch on something right
there that I kind of want to follow up on,
(07:48):
So just jokes aside, And you mentioned this a little
bit in your newsletter. It was either today's or the
one earlier in the week. I can't remember. It was
one of the one of the two this week where
it sounds like, uh two K maybe leaning towards uh
kind of a popularity drive for lack of a better term,
in terms of who to introduce in this college basketball game,
(08:11):
how many like licenses to go out and get uh
that sort of thing. Could fans maybe help dictate content
of this new college basketball two K in terms of
playable teams, playable characters, that kind of thing. And by that,
I'm saying like, if if enough, uh, we'll keep it local,
if enough Utah Valley fans tweet at two K and
(08:33):
maybe download some DLC to try to make their own
UVU roster and that kind of thing, could that potentially
influence how two K kind of goes about building out
their game and or their roster.
Speaker 1 (08:46):
No, so this is a good question, Like what what
I can share with you guys based on based on
what I've been told so far, is that the two
reasons why two K doesn't want to include everybody from
the jump is one they don't actually know know how
commercially viable or successful a standalone college basketball game is.
And this is a reasonable question, right. The college football
(09:08):
games back in the twenty tens, before the Ed Obannon
case and before the EA, before the NCAA pulled the series,
those were all very commercially successful. They all sold hundreds
of thousands and millions of units. The college basketball games weren't.
Two K made a college basketball game for a while,
EA made a college basketball game for a while, and
(09:28):
they were but they were both suspended before at Obannon
because the games weren't selling. College basketball is a great sport.
There's a lot of people, especially in this market that
care about it. But it is unquestionably a niche product
compared to college football, so I can understand why two
K's like, I don't know if I want to spend
forty million dollars acquiring the licensing rights for all of
(09:49):
this for a game that might only sell seven hundred
thousand units, and then we won't make our money back.
So let's let's dip our toes in the water. Let's
test it. What I would tell people is the love
of God, do not tweet me. If you want to
go tweet or try to go push two K. My
social avatar is My handle is mat Is Matt Brown EP,
(10:11):
do not include me. I do not work for either
of these companies. I do think that if you were
somebody that really wanted to signal the two K that
there should be a standalone college basketball game and that
people should invest in this, you should buy the DLC
when it comes out. I don't want to get anybody's
hopes up that you can have a mass social campaign
(10:33):
and bully you know, this huge company to include the
Big Sky, But whatever you want to do online to
signal that people care about college basketball video games will help.
I have some small amount of hope that maybe consumers
can bully two K into pursuing a more expansive definition
of college basketball earlier rather than later. But you never know.
(10:59):
It's not just about what going to get the most
retweets and saves. It's about what's going to deliver shareholder
value for these guys.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
There you have it, breaking it all down, Matt Brown
here on esp and the fan. Matt, let's recalibrate here
for a moment, best way to support to what you do,
how you do it. For all of our listeners that
do want to get into the minutia of these type
of topics, let's do a brief reset.
Speaker 3 (11:20):
Where can they find all of your content?
Speaker 1 (11:23):
You bet you can find the Extra Points newsletter at
extra points mb dot com. There is a free version
available you get two newsletters a week. There is a
premium version where you get four and access to the
computer game that we made. It is used in athletic departments,
conference offices, academic departments, and college sports industry leaders throughout
(11:45):
the country and throughout the state of Utah. So if
you wanted to read what the people at Utah and
Big Sky and to PAC twelve, what everybody else is reading,
you can check it out at Extra Points MB dot Com.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
I got to get your thoughts on something here, Matt.
We've been talking Fine Twine Lennon's. You know I'm a
fan of Find Twine Lennon's. Okay, we discussed Rider Lions
yesterday the news that under Armor has signed him. Found
that very interesting that Rider Lions a high school athlete,
five star quarterback lds.
Speaker 3 (12:15):
Uh he's now with under Armor. Uh.
Speaker 2 (12:18):
But you know, the apparel world, it's something that you've
really gotten into over the years at Extra Points and
understanding the B to B interactions between these big brands
and the respective university, who's getting paid, how the players
are also integrated into these deals. Now it's a new
world with nil which is intriguing in of itself. We've
(12:41):
seen Cooper Flag have new Balance but playing Nikes even
though Anyway, recently I think you covered the Penn State
and Adidas move here, Landmark partnership in Tennessee. What's going
on here? Can you give us a little brief Synopsters
about the the the changes the landscape in the apparel
world as it pertends at these universities.
Speaker 1 (13:03):
Yeah, so this is Lord, We're coming into a really
interesting time in the college sports apparel world because a
lot of really big programs are kind of hitting the
free agency market all at the same time. Between two thousand,
between you know, the this year and early next year,
I want to say that there's like nine of the
top twenty five athletic brands have their contracts expiring. And
(13:27):
that doesn't happen very often. The big three companies have
been preparing for this for a couple of years. It's
why they've been renegotiating deals. That's why they've dropped some people,
because everyone wants to have as much you know, salary
cap room available to go after some of these big
these big schools didas right now has been the big
winner they just they're going to They just swiped Tennessee
and signing them to a massive new deal, and then
(13:49):
Penn State, Nike, you re signed LSU and Kentucky. But
USC has a contract expiring, Ohio State has a contract expiring, Iowa,
West Virginia, a few other you know, pretty pretty major programs.
South Carolina just flipped from under Armour to Nike, and
this I think it's important for people to understand how
this stuff works because when a school signs a deal
(14:13):
with with with a major company, you're often going to
see a really big number in the headlines, but that's
not what's really happening. For most schools in the country,
you don't actually get any cash from Nike or Adidas
or under Armour. What you get is millions and millions
of dollars of discounted stuff or free stuff, and then
(14:34):
the ability to uh produce original uniforms or or alternate
uniforms or are selling a one off kind of things.
If you are a really big company, really big school,
it's your Ohio state, if you're Michigan, if you're Texas,
then you also get cash. What is changing right now
and the after the nil world here is that Adidas
(14:55):
in particular, but really everyone's going to be moving in
this direction. Is it's allocating some additional money to give
directly to the athletes beyond just what they'd be giving
to the school. I would say a school of BYU's
caliber and market and reach if they hit free agency
right now, not talking about BAU specifically, but I would say,
like an athletic department peer, you might be getting less
(15:18):
than two million dollars a year in cash, if anything,
and you might be okay with that. If you're getting
enough free stuff and then the ability to be able
to get some money for some of your athletes, that
doesn't count against the salary gap. And that's a big
driving force. So what's happening right.
Speaker 4 (15:32):
Now, Well, let's dive into that a little bit, Matt,
because I did kind of want to follow up on this.
I think it's really interesting this NIL component of these
new apparel contracts we saw with Tennessee. They were one
of kind of the early adopters of both university a
peril or sponsorship if you will, and also that NIL component.
(15:54):
Penn State just said in their release all eight hundred
plus of their athletes across all sports, even down to
volleyball and wrestling which has some pretty significant heavy hitters
in that space, will be eligible for NIL deals with
with Adidas. They'll be part of Adidas Ambassador network they're
calling it. Is this probably more likely to be a
(16:16):
trend or because I think I remember I remember reading
it when Tennessee made the switch of like maybe this
is a one off, Maybe this is where the biggest brands,
the biggest universities that kind of thing. But could this
maybe be more of a trend where schools start looking at,
you know, when they're when their licensing rights are up
and their apparel rights are up, they start looking at
(16:36):
which school is not just going to pay me, but
which one is going to pay my athletes or or
kind of could that be sort of something that they
that they shop around in addition that makes sense, I think, yeah, I.
Speaker 1 (16:48):
Think that is going to be a part of the consideration.
I want if I'm if I'm remembering this correctly, and
nobody please you know, tar and futther me if I
get this wrong. But I believe the Adidas Ambassador program
is something that is actually open to any athletes at
any sport at an Adida school, even if you're at
a low major that's using Adidas through like a bs
(17:11):
cent or a game one like I don't know off
the top of my head if you tad Tech, is
Nike or a Didas whoever, But if you were Adidas,
you would be eligible for this, which is basically an
affiliate marketing program. Right if you want to talk about
and endorse a Dida stuff on your Instagram page, model
it and have people use discount code, then you get
a pretty you get a nice check from a didas
for people buying you know, shoes or soccer or sweatbands
(17:32):
or something, and that's great. But the way that those
affiliate marketing campaigns work is that you have a very
small number of people who are overwhelmingly making all the
money and everybody else making you know, twenty six bucks
or something. And that's fine. Like that's that's how affiliate
marketing works in other industries too well, places like tenn
State and Tennessee and some other really big markets. You're
(17:53):
going to have a different kind of nil pool where okay,
let's go feature somebody at Penn State in a national
television campaign. Let's go, let's go feature somebody from Tennessee
in magazine ads in uh, you know, to do if
we still had those right right in glossy mags throughout
the country, or in an internet video campaigns or something,
(18:14):
and then we can pay both Tennessee and pay the
athlete for that. That is something that I think is
going to happen and to kind of bring this full circle.
That's also something that some you know, these big apparel
companies recognize. I don't have to work with the school
at all for that, right If I think that doing
a deal with Writer is going to help me sell
(18:34):
merch and for under Armor. I think that's important because
under Armored does not typically have a good reputation among
young athletes for anything other than like you know, performance
you shirts or something. Yeah, you don't have to pay
BYU at all. By You can still remain in Nike
school and Writer will have to wear Nike when he's
on the field, but he can wear whatever he wants
on his own Instagram page. And that's a lot cheaper
(18:55):
than having to commit to getting BYU five and a
half million dollars in discounted box and sweatbands or whatever
it is that they're doing. And that you are seeing
more and more from companies that are too poor or
small to signing the entire athletic department, but still want
to get involved with Appley Walking.
Speaker 2 (19:12):
Sure, Matt Brown, Ladies and gentlemen follow him on x
subscribe to his newsletter Extra poismb dot com. We appreciate you, Matt,
great content as always, brother, We'll catch up in again.
Speaker 3 (19:23):
Have a great weekend.
Speaker 1 (19:24):
Okay you two fellas, take care my guy.
Speaker 2 (19:27):
Matt Brown, Ladies and gentlemen, that was a great segment.
They're brought to you by Big O' Tires and American Fork.
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Nobody does it better.
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VP products, VP service, VP discounts. Not just tires, but
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to break. Let's talk stats. On the flip side. This
is Cougar Sports on one O three nine ninety eight
point three r E SPN
You were listening to Cougar Sports with Ben Krettle, and
it's time for a Cougar insider report. Now, let's get
that for a prietary inside scoop on Cougar Sports from Cretele.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Welcome back Cougar Sports one O three nine ninety eight
point three ESPN The fan. I've been grittle broadcasting from
our Bantererwill Studios Banterwell dot com. Get out a free
Q and a O obligation to a vest QNA with
our tax more World Advisors or Certify Financial Planners. Nobody
does it better than band or Well. Shout out to
Sean Walker, Kasel dot com. By my side, Ronald the
Three Man Weaver executive producer. Shout out to Jack Robinson
(00:33):
as well as Brad Always bring the hammer Brett Hammer
and Bicker reward to Vic Kram. It is a segment
of insider knowledge we're gonna provide for you. It's gonna
be brought to you by Big o'tires in American Fork.
If you're looking for an honest, hardworking, cost transparent mechanic
who's also a big BU fan, let my guy Ryan
Eldrits earned your business today. Nobody does it better than
Ryan Eldridge. Uh look not just tires, full service mechanic shop,
(00:55):
VIP products, VPP service, VP discounts. Give him a call,
set up an appointment, get your vehicle checked out today
at Big O'tires in American Fork. Let him know I
sent you. He'll take care of you. Let's get out
to the hotline. Welcome in college basketball, college football insider.
A man that knows how to delve into the data.
He's a man of metrics as well as a man
that likes to get into the minutia of college athletics.
(01:15):
Nobody doesn't better. Let's welcome in Matt Brown of Extra Points.
Speaker 3 (01:18):
Matt, how you live in?
Speaker 1 (01:20):
I'm tellings, I'm doing great. Great to be here. Happy
week two. Thanks for having me.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
Hey, Always a pleasure, always a blessing talking with you.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
Over the last year and a half two years, you've
become the video game expert, the college football game expert,
now the college basketball game expert. And we advise everyone
if you want to stay up to date on all
the video games, and we do have a good segment
of our fan base that loves the video games.
Speaker 3 (01:46):
You gotta follow Matt Brown.
Speaker 2 (01:48):
You gotta subscribe to his newsletter Extra Points at Extra
Points ab dot com. Matt, what's the latest right now
on the college basketball video game?
Speaker 3 (01:58):
Is it coming to our homes too?
Speaker 1 (02:01):
There will be college basketball content on video game systems
in your home soon. Will it be the game that
many people in this market wanted? No, and I have
to apologize. It is kind of my fault. And that's
that's unfortunately not a joke. Uh what what? What? What
happened here? Yeah?
Speaker 3 (02:22):
What did you do? Why?
Speaker 1 (02:24):
Why would I do it? Because?
Speaker 3 (02:25):
Enough?
Speaker 1 (02:26):
Not enough you people listen to subscribe to Extra Points.
I had to burn the whole thing down. No, So
here's what happens. The CLC, the organization that handles like
the IP licensing for just about every major college program,
puts out this RFP saying, all right, we want to
make college back, We want to make college basketball game developers.
If you want to get the licenses for all these
(02:47):
schools and all these conferences, you send us your best
pitch and we'll make a recommendation. So there were there
were three companies that bid. The two biggest ones were
EA Sports and two K. Two K of course, the
company that makes the NBA two K series, among other games.
EA said, hey, if you pick us, we will make
(03:08):
a game that includes every single Division one men's and
women's basketball program, including Utah Tech in Utah Valley. You
got to wait till at least twenty twenty eight because
we haven't made a basketball games in since twenty eighteen,
and we haven't made a good basketball game and a
decade longer than that, so we need some time to
build the whole thing from scratch. But we'll include everybody.
(03:29):
And two K said, well, we've been making really good
basketball games for the last fifteen years. Now we can
go to market much faster, but we're not going to
include every single program because we don't think that that's
going to be profitable. What we'll do is we'll create
a DLC downloadable content segment involving college basketball programs within NBA.
(03:51):
Two K we can begin to at college basketball IP
as early as this year. So if you bought the
NBA TWOK last week or this week, I'm I'm gonna
spoil something for you come February. There's going to be
college basketball teams in it, and there'll be a lot
more of them and next year's release, but it won't
have everybody. And two K said, listen, if we get
(04:12):
enough people to buy this thing, if we can get
some better data to show that there's enough commercial demands,
we will make a standalone college basketball game. Enough big
schools said, you know what, I want to trust two
K because I'd rather have some money next year then
wait three years to maybe have some money in case
in case EA can't fix it, you can't get this
thing done on time. And then EA said, enough for you.
(04:34):
Guys picked two K. So wehere withdrawing our offer because
we only want to do this if we can get
an exclusive license. So that's where we are. Two K's
making the college basketball game. BUYU will be in it.
What other schools in Utah will be in it other
than Utah unclear. I always feel very confident that Southern Utah,
Utah Tech UVU they will not be in the game
at launch, and I don't know if they're going to
(04:55):
be in the game in year two or year three.
The reason this is kind of my fall is because
I broke the news back in July that EA Sports
had had had put out this RFP and and indicated
they wanted to be involved. And I reached out to
EA for comment and Rather than talking to me, EA
decided to publish a tweet confirming that they were going
(05:16):
to bring back the game. Uh, four minutes after I
wrote my story as a way to make sure that
I didn't get I didn't get to own the scoop.
Speaker 3 (05:23):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
And they did that before they had, you know, a
basketball game ready. Like most people at EA didn't even
know they were going to make a basketball game at
that point. Uh. It was it was a rush announcement.
Two K saw that announcement and went, we could beat
these guys to market, came out with a better proposal,
won the bid. So, I mean, it's really EA's fault
that that you're not getting a game with everybody. But unfortunately,
(05:45):
I think I played at least a small role in that.
Speaker 2 (05:48):
Man the weeping, the whaling the nation your teeth is
there enmity now between the video game college basketball fan
and Matt Brown of Extra Points?
Speaker 3 (06:02):
Have you received hate mail? Have you seen dms? Is
the truth? You know?
Speaker 2 (06:06):
Allowing for the the the dregs of the college basketball
world to come after you.
Speaker 1 (06:15):
I mean, of course they are right, because because look,
I love college football fans. I've been writing for college
football fans for the last fourteen years of my life.
And we know that there are segments of college football
fans that are real stupid and they're gonna they're gonna
be scream at you on social media because they think
you call the plays or that you make the recruiting decisions.
And as insane as college football fans can be on
the internet, college is video game people are an order
(06:40):
of magnitude worse. So yeah, I'm getting I mean, I
was getting a lot of this just because people can't
read or don't want to read, and they just assume, like, oh,
like Matt Brown decided that we shouldn't get to play
a college basketball game with Western Illinois. Do you want
to talk about ednity? Though? That's with me and Ea.
We used to have a good professional relationship. At this point,
(07:00):
I don't think I'm on their Christmas card list anymore.
I'm hopeful that someday that that gets resolved, But right now,
I don't think I'm a popular guy in Orlando.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
Man, Well you're a popular guy here on Cougar Sports.
It may not seem like much, Matt, but we love you,
we meet you here.
Speaker 1 (07:19):
I appreciate that. It is nice to know I still
have some brothers and sisters in Utah County.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
Amen. Amen, Matt.
Speaker 4 (07:26):
I'm not gonna lie that this whole conversation has made
me want to go buy another subscription to Extra Points
extra Points mb dot com for our listeners who don't
and may it almost makes me not want to pick
up a copy of NBA two K or whatever College
Basketball two K ends up being based off of this
little minor beef. But you did touch on something right
there that I kind of want to follow up on,
(07:48):
So just jokes aside, And you mentioned this a little
bit in your newsletter. It was either today's or the
one earlier in the week. I can't remember. It was
one of the one of the two this week where
it sounds like, uh two K maybe leaning towards uh
kind of a popularity drive for lack of a better term,
in terms of who to introduce in this college basketball game,
(08:11):
how many like licenses to go out and get uh
that sort of thing. Could fans maybe help dictate content
of this new college basketball two K in terms of
playable teams, playable characters, that kind of thing. And by that,
I'm saying like, if if enough, uh, we'll keep it local,
if enough Utah Valley fans tweet at two K and
(08:33):
maybe download some DLC to try to make their own
UVU roster and that kind of thing, could that potentially
influence how two K kind of goes about building out
their game and or their roster.
Speaker 1 (08:46):
No, so this is a good question, Like what what
I can share with you guys based on based on
what I've been told so far, is that the two
reasons why two K doesn't want to include everybody from
the jump is one they don't actually know know how
commercially viable or successful a standalone college basketball game is.
And this is a reasonable question, right. The college football
(09:08):
games back in the twenty tens, before the Ed Obannon
case and before the EA, before the NCAA pulled the series,
those were all very commercially successful. They all sold hundreds
of thousands and millions of units. The college basketball games weren't.
Two K made a college basketball game for a while,
EA made a college basketball game for a while, and
(09:28):
they were but they were both suspended before at Obannon
because the games weren't selling. College basketball is a great sport.
There's a lot of people, especially in this market that
care about it. But it is unquestionably a niche product
compared to college football, so I can understand why two
K's like, I don't know if I want to spend
forty million dollars acquiring the licensing rights for all of
(09:49):
this for a game that might only sell seven hundred
thousand units, and then we won't make our money back.
So let's let's dip our toes in the water. Let's
test it. What I would tell people is the love
of God, do not tweet me. If you want to
go tweet or try to go push two K. My
social avatar is My handle is mat Is Matt Brown EP,
(10:11):
do not include me. I do not work for either
of these companies. I do think that if you were
somebody that really wanted to signal the two K that
there should be a standalone college basketball game and that
people should invest in this, you should buy the DLC
when it comes out. I don't want to get anybody's
hopes up that you can have a mass social campaign
(10:33):
and bully you know, this huge company to include the
Big Sky, But whatever you want to do online to
signal that people care about college basketball video games will help.
I have some small amount of hope that maybe consumers
can bully two K into pursuing a more expansive definition
of college basketball earlier rather than later. But you never know.
(10:59):
It's not just about what going to get the most
retweets and saves. It's about what's going to deliver shareholder
value for these guys.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
There you have it, breaking it all down, Matt Brown
here on esp and the fan. Matt, let's recalibrate here
for a moment, best way to support to what you do,
how you do it. For all of our listeners that
do want to get into the minutia of these type
of topics, let's do a brief reset.
Speaker 3 (11:20):
Where can they find all of your content?
Speaker 1 (11:23):
You bet you can find the Extra Points newsletter at
extra points mb dot com. There is a free version
available you get two newsletters a week. There is a
premium version where you get four and access to the
computer game that we made. It is used in athletic departments,
conference offices, academic departments, and college sports industry leaders throughout
(11:45):
the country and throughout the state of Utah. So if
you wanted to read what the people at Utah and
Big Sky and to PAC twelve, what everybody else is reading,
you can check it out at Extra Points MB dot Com.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
I got to get your thoughts on something here, Matt.
We've been talking Fine Twine Lennon's. You know I'm a
fan of Find Twine Lennon's. Okay, we discussed Rider Lions
yesterday the news that under Armor has signed him. Found
that very interesting that Rider Lions a high school athlete,
five star quarterback lds.
Speaker 3 (12:15):
Uh he's now with under Armor. Uh.
Speaker 2 (12:18):
But you know, the apparel world, it's something that you've
really gotten into over the years at Extra Points and
understanding the B to B interactions between these big brands
and the respective university, who's getting paid, how the players
are also integrated into these deals. Now it's a new
world with nil which is intriguing in of itself. We've
(12:41):
seen Cooper Flag have new Balance but playing Nikes even
though Anyway, recently I think you covered the Penn State
and Adidas move here, Landmark partnership in Tennessee. What's going
on here? Can you give us a little brief Synopsters
about the the the changes the landscape in the apparel
world as it pertends at these universities.
Speaker 1 (13:03):
Yeah, so this is Lord, We're coming into a really
interesting time in the college sports apparel world because a
lot of really big programs are kind of hitting the
free agency market all at the same time. Between two thousand,
between you know, the this year and early next year,
I want to say that there's like nine of the
top twenty five athletic brands have their contracts expiring. And
(13:27):
that doesn't happen very often. The big three companies have
been preparing for this for a couple of years. It's
why they've been renegotiating deals. That's why they've dropped some people,
because everyone wants to have as much you know, salary
cap room available to go after some of these big
these big schools didas right now has been the big
winner they just they're going to They just swiped Tennessee
and signing them to a massive new deal, and then
(13:49):
Penn State, Nike, you re signed LSU and Kentucky. But
USC has a contract expiring, Ohio State has a contract expiring, Iowa,
West Virginia, a few other you know, pretty pretty major programs.
South Carolina just flipped from under Armour to Nike, and
this I think it's important for people to understand how
this stuff works because when a school signs a deal
(14:13):
with with with a major company, you're often going to
see a really big number in the headlines, but that's
not what's really happening. For most schools in the country,
you don't actually get any cash from Nike or Adidas
or under Armour. What you get is millions and millions
of dollars of discounted stuff or free stuff, and then
(14:34):
the ability to uh produce original uniforms or or alternate
uniforms or are selling a one off kind of things.
If you are a really big company, really big school,
it's your Ohio state, if you're Michigan, if you're Texas,
then you also get cash. What is changing right now
and the after the nil world here is that Adidas
(14:55):
in particular, but really everyone's going to be moving in
this direction. Is it's allocating some additional money to give
directly to the athletes beyond just what they'd be giving
to the school. I would say a school of BYU's
caliber and market and reach if they hit free agency
right now, not talking about BAU specifically, but I would say,
like an athletic department peer, you might be getting less
(15:18):
than two million dollars a year in cash, if anything,
and you might be okay with that. If you're getting
enough free stuff and then the ability to be able
to get some money for some of your athletes, that
doesn't count against the salary gap. And that's a big
driving force. So what's happening right.
Speaker 4 (15:32):
Now, Well, let's dive into that a little bit, Matt,
because I did kind of want to follow up on this.
I think it's really interesting this NIL component of these
new apparel contracts we saw with Tennessee. They were one
of kind of the early adopters of both university a
peril or sponsorship if you will, and also that NIL component.
(15:54):
Penn State just said in their release all eight hundred
plus of their athletes across all sports, even down to
volleyball and wrestling which has some pretty significant heavy hitters
in that space, will be eligible for NIL deals with
with Adidas. They'll be part of Adidas Ambassador network they're
calling it. Is this probably more likely to be a
(16:16):
trend or because I think I remember I remember reading
it when Tennessee made the switch of like maybe this
is a one off, Maybe this is where the biggest brands,
the biggest universities that kind of thing. But could this
maybe be more of a trend where schools start looking at,
you know, when they're when their licensing rights are up
and their apparel rights are up, they start looking at
(16:36):
which school is not just going to pay me, but
which one is going to pay my athletes or or
kind of could that be sort of something that they
that they shop around in addition that makes sense, I think, yeah, I.
Speaker 1 (16:48):
Think that is going to be a part of the consideration.
I want if I'm if I'm remembering this correctly, and
nobody please you know, tar and futther me if I
get this wrong. But I believe the Adidas Ambassador program
is something that is actually open to any athletes at
any sport at an Adida school, even if you're at
a low major that's using Adidas through like a bs
(17:11):
cent or a game one like I don't know off
the top of my head if you tad Tech, is
Nike or a Didas whoever, But if you were Adidas,
you would be eligible for this, which is basically an
affiliate marketing program. Right if you want to talk about
and endorse a Dida stuff on your Instagram page, model
it and have people use discount code, then you get
a pretty you get a nice check from a didas
for people buying you know, shoes or soccer or sweatbands
(17:32):
or something, and that's great. But the way that those
affiliate marketing campaigns work is that you have a very
small number of people who are overwhelmingly making all the
money and everybody else making you know, twenty six bucks
or something. And that's fine. Like that's that's how affiliate
marketing works in other industries too well, places like tenn
State and Tennessee and some other really big markets. You're
(17:53):
going to have a different kind of nil pool where okay,
let's go feature somebody at Penn State in a national
television campaign. Let's go, let's go feature somebody from Tennessee
in magazine ads in uh, you know, to do if
we still had those right right in glossy mags throughout
the country, or in an internet video campaigns or something,
(18:14):
and then we can pay both Tennessee and pay the
athlete for that. That is something that I think is
going to happen and to kind of bring this full circle.
That's also something that some you know, these big apparel
companies recognize. I don't have to work with the school
at all for that, right If I think that doing
a deal with Writer is going to help me sell
(18:34):
merch and for under Armor. I think that's important because
under Armored does not typically have a good reputation among
young athletes for anything other than like you know, performance
you shirts or something. Yeah, you don't have to pay
BYU at all. By You can still remain in Nike
school and Writer will have to wear Nike when he's
on the field, but he can wear whatever he wants
on his own Instagram page. And that's a lot cheaper
(18:55):
than having to commit to getting BYU five and a
half million dollars in discounted box and sweatbands or whatever
it is that they're doing. And that you are seeing
more and more from companies that are too poor or
small to signing the entire athletic department, but still want
to get involved with Appley Walking.
Speaker 2 (19:12):
Sure, Matt Brown, Ladies and gentlemen follow him on x
subscribe to his newsletter Extra poismb dot com. We appreciate you, Matt,
great content as always, brother, We'll catch up in again.
Speaker 3 (19:23):
Have a great weekend.
Speaker 1 (19:24):
Okay you two fellas, take care my guy.
Speaker 2 (19:27):
Matt Brown, Ladies and gentlemen, that was a great segment.
They're brought to you by Big O' Tires and American Fork.
If you're looking for an Audi his hard working, cost
transparent mechanic who's also a big BYU fan, hit up
my guy, Ryan Eldritch.
Speaker 3 (19:40):
Nobody does it better.
Speaker 2 (19:41):
VP products, VP service, VP discounts. Not just tires, but
full service mechanic work is what he provides, mentioned myself
for ESPN the Fan, and you're gonna get the best
service and the best discounts known to man. Let's go
to break. Let's talk stats. On the flip side. This
is Cougar Sports on one O three nine ninety eight
point three r E SPN
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