September 11, 2023 • 30 mins
The Tyler's Place Podcast is the official monthly podcast of the Scottish Rite Southern Masonic Jurisdiction. The host, Bro. Maynard Edwards and producer, Bro. Matt Bowers join us for a candid conversation that covers "secrets" of Freemasonry, the Point Within A Circle, and what the biggest challenge is facing our Ancient and Gentle Craft.
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(00:14):
Welcome to the Craftsman Online Podcast,the only five star rated Masonic podcast endorsed
by the Grand Lodge, New York. I'm your host, Brother Michael Arsay,
co founder of Craftsman Online dot com. The comments, opinions, and
views shared during this program are thoseof individual Freemasons and do not reflect the
official position of a Grand Lodge,Concordant Body, a Pendant body, or
Masonic authority. A quick reminders youcan now listen early and add free to
(00:38):
our episodes with our news subscriber offer. Get the link to start your seven
day free trial and the show notesfor this episode. You've joined us for
a talk on the Tyler's Place podcast. It's hosted by my guest this week,
Brother Maynard Edwards, and produced byBrother Matt Bowers. It's the official
podcast for the Scottish Writes Southern MasonicJurisdiction. There's something that's really impressive about
(01:00):
this podcast. They've been doing thisfor almost ten years. They started in
twenty fourteen and have produced about onehundred and sixteen episodes at last count.
We're going to get a link foryou to join and tune in and listen
to their program. This is aunique episode for me. I very rarely
get a chance to interview other hostbrother Maynards. So looking back at the
(01:23):
deep library that you have your catalogof episodes, was there a Tyler's Place
podcast episode that for you stecks outas being the most powerful? Were you
really were able to connect with eithera guest or a topic. That is
a really great question. I thinkthe one there's one that stands out in
my mind just there was a statementthat I kind of carry with me even
(01:46):
now. It was past Grandmaster Rogervan Gordon, who he was a past
Grandmaster, and I want to say, Indiana, I'll probably Roger, I'm
sorry. I know you're listening.He's now one of the heads of the
Masonic Renewal Committee of the Conference ofGrand Masters. One wonderful guy, wonderful
friend and mentor. First time Iinterviewed him, we were in a hotel
(02:08):
in Alexandria in the lobby, havinga cup of coffee, and I literally
interviewed him on my phone, andhe was frustrated with the state of Masonry
in that people were dismissing men whohe knew would be good leaders because they
didn't memorize thirty minute lectures in ourfraternity today, we would dismiss George Washington
(02:36):
as a leader because he didn't havetime to memorize a thirty minute lecture.
Think about that for a minute,and he's right. You know, I'm
a big believer in ritual as theeasy part, Like stop whining and memorize
the lecture, to shut up amemorize the lecture, man up, memorize
your ritual, and move on withyour business. I know it's sometimes it's
challenging, that's not that, that'sthe truth, But you can just get
(03:00):
it over and done with, becausewhen if you're really going to be an
effective leader of a lodge or ofanything, the ritual and that part of
it really is the easy part becauseall you have to do is regurgitated.
It doesn't require any thought. Itjust requires simple muscle memory. And you
know, I kind of carried thatwith me. The other one was just
recently, I sat down for avery long time with past Grandmaster of Washington,
(03:23):
DC, brother ackerm Elias, andI've known Ackerham for a couple of
years now, and he's he's awonderful guy. He showed it up on
the History Channel all the time,and you know, he's he's he's such
a good speaker, but he reallyand truly is a true believer at the
highest level of the power that masonryhas to unite and transform people. And
(03:49):
I really it wasn't any one thingthat he said in the interview, and
again it was only a couple ofmonths ago, but it was something,
you know, just his entire approachto it just really struck me. As
you know, this is a guywho spent a good chunk of his life
as a Freemason. He's dedicated,he was a grand Master, He's dedicated
(04:10):
so much of his life to it. And that was that was that that
one really got to me. Sothat and and there's one I recorded just
recently with with my brother Hank Griffin, and I call Hank the Garrison Keeler.
A Freemasonry Hanks doing a podcast aswell, but it's very different from
what we're doing. He tells thesehomespun stories, just like a prairie home
(04:32):
companion and back at freemasonry. Andhe's he's just gotten started in the last
three or four months, and heis the Grand Chaplain in Maryland, and
he's just I didn't know him beforethis year and I was having a tough
time back in February. I wasat a Masonic meeting. I got a
phone call, got some bad news, and I went to Hank as the
grand chaplain. I said, brother, I know you don't know me that
(04:55):
well, but you know, wouldyou would you say a prayer with me?
And U? Now I get chokedhim. Now surprising to no one,
but Hank and I are now reallygood buddies. And I sat down
and talked to him, you know, talk about the real deal, the
guy that walks the walk and talksto talk. How about how about you?
Is there one that gets you inthe in the fields? It's weird
(05:17):
living in this time where you canmake connections like like you haven't like in
person, which those are magical specialmoments. But now because of this technology
in this world we live in,you can get an email from somebody and
that's literally where the friendship begins toblossom. Right. And we had done
(05:38):
a podcast on to me. Thetitle was the fun part was and practicing
safe Masonic intercourse UH in New YorkState. That's how we refer to when
it comes to interacting with Clandessin's thatwe're not supposed to be performing Masonic intercourse
with him, and it's I've neverseen a brother gun through the obligation that
doesn't have a little smile in hisface when when that line comes out.
(06:00):
But the brother that was the gueston the podcast, you know, shared
his story, which, in allseriousness, you're like, oh my gosh,
I can't believe that this happens.And what led to a brother who
reached out to me and said,Hey, I am a clandestine Mason and
I prefer to look at myself asan irregular Mason, and I want to
become a regular Mason. Here's mystory, here's where I am. Can
(06:25):
you help me? And Louise andI have become very close friends. He
lives in Texas. I was tryingto help him find a lodge. She
eventually did find a lodge that hecould affiliate with. They have they're having
him go back all the way throughall of the degrees because he came from
a jurisdiction in Mexico that was notrecognized and didn't have amity with many Grand
(06:51):
lodges. But a lot of theirritual was so similar, and the difficult
part was, you know, wantingto have those conversations with him to find
out where the differences are. Butobviously those to be the secrets that we
can't reveal, even to people whoreally should be brothers. But they just
joined a group that wasn't trying totake his money. They weren't doing the
wrong thing. They just weren't recognizedby other grand lodges but for the way
(07:14):
that they were quote unquote practicing freemasonry. He's now an entered apprentice, so
he's a Mason. I was soexcited to have a conversation with him,
to get him on the podcast foran episode and just stay with them and
track with him through his progress.But through all this time, which would
literally started out with an email abouttwo years ago, he's you know,
had a daughter, He's gone throughcareer changes. I've gone through career changes.
(07:39):
I moved from upstate New York toDC. We've become like long distance
friends, and to me that special. I don't remember really having those kind
of relationships with radio listeners. It'ssomething unique that we can do as Freemasons
and really kind of speaks to thatbrotherhood slash fraternity aspect of the craft that
(08:00):
sometimes goes overlooked when you look outover the horizon of freemasonry, and it
is the thirty foot question. Whatis the challenge do you think for us
in the craft as we look outat the next let's say five years and
then ten years, what are thechallenges that we really have in front of
us to deal with? I thinkthe immediate challenge that we have right now,
(08:20):
and like, no joke, butwe have to be better than Netflix.
I had a phone call with aguy who is the current what's what's
Greg? He's a senior steward inour lodge. Ere Matt got up.
Yes, Greg calls me and hegoes, man, I'm listening to this
audio book and these guys. Hewas listening to the Hey Dad audiobook,
which is the audiobook Matches did forthe Demla about frank Land and excellent,
(08:43):
excellent audio book, by the way, if you want to listen to it.
The golden tones of that bowers andhe goes, man, I'm listening
to this and these guys they wentand they got entered, past and raised
and they did it all within likethree weeks. How the heck did they
do that? I was like,yeah, they didn't have Netflix, and
uh, you know, I thinkI actually said an adult website. I
said, they didn't have any ofthat to contend with, so they didn't
(09:05):
have anything else to do, sothat would And it's the truth. You're
right, that's one hundred percent.We got to be better than Netflix.
So I remember sitting in lodge recentlyand going, why am I spending a
Friday night sitting in here for abusiness meeting? Like I could be home
with my wife watching a Netflix showright now, as much as that's boring
(09:26):
and sucked, like three years agoduring the pandemic, I'm like, I
don't have to be dressed up ina tuxedo. And I think that that's
the immediate challenge that we have isgetting past the boring business meetings. I
don't see the membership decline as acritical issue. I do think the consolidation
that's eventually going to have to happenwith many lodges coming back down to what
(09:50):
is a reasonable size. I personallyhold the opinion that you know, freemasonry
is not right for every man,just like every man's not right to be
a Freemason. I give this talkevery brother, bring a friend night.
I say, look across this room, how many of us are sitting here.
There's like twelve or thirteen, right, how many men do you know
in your life? And how comeyou're the one that's in this room and
(10:11):
more of the people you know aren't. It's a small circle. We also
are living in a time where wefeel that the problems that we face are
so unique, and it's not.There's actually been harder times in the history
of the world than where we areright now. And when it comes to
defending the craft, for lack ofa better term, and promoting the goodness
(10:33):
of the craft, we're facing thesame problems that our brothers did in the
eighteenth century when with the advent ofthe printing press and the pamphlets and the
expose's and trying to shout down allthe detractors. So really, I think
that the issue that we have rightnow are more self inflicted problems so to
(10:54):
speak, where it's we have menwho are turning to the Internet and a
Google search to find a lodge andget there, and we just don't know
how to bring him on the boat, so to speak, from from being
caught in the ocean. Well,I think one of the big things that
we face, and you know,having gotten to the privilege of working with
the Northern Massan Jurisdiction and the Shrineand and of course the Southern jurisdiction discuss
(11:18):
right on to be a Freemason projectis that what happens is that we get
these inquiries for lack of a betterword, that you know, I'm interested
in joining a lodge, I'm interestedin freemasonry, and then we send them
to the local lodges and the ballgets dropped. And it's easy to get
frustrated by that, but I asa lodge secretary now and a past master
(11:43):
and having sat in every chair andall that, it's a volunteer army,
and so you know, right nowtonight, you and I are doing this
out of the love for the craft. And because another brother doesn't have the
time to do this doesn't mean thathe doesn't love the craft. But maybe
he just doesn't have the time.And maybe the lodge secretary is dealing with
fifteen other things. And you know, somebody's not hand walking a petition into
(12:07):
him and saying here's the petition,here's the check. They're just you're just
getting an email with a name andan email address on it. You know,
I can tell you right now isas busy as you get. Sometimes
that goes to the bottom of thestack, and and it's unfortunate, but
it's not done on a malice,It's just it is what it is.
Where very few men get paid todo this. It's a you have a
(12:28):
finite amount of time in your day, and so do I tell my wife
I can't have dinner with her tonightbecause I'm instead going to go and answer
these fifty emails. And the otherissue to that is is that when do
you get a chance during a Masonicmeeting to say, oh, by the
way, I'm a certified Digital MarketingSpecialist, or hey, by the way,
I have a CPA, or Ihave a lot of great Like when
(12:52):
do you really get a chance toshare your portfolio, your skills, your
talents with the other brothers that thatall happens in outside of the lodge events.
And if we're not having those,then you really don't see the talent
that's waiting for you. And Ithink a lot of that is being missed
in the craft too. So yeah, like I said, I think a
lot of the issues that we're havingis just organizational. It's not the outside
(13:15):
world. It's us just trying tofind a way to transform, to be
more efficient and be able to provideto keep retain the people that we have
and still have an onboarding process,a smoother process, a better defined process
for those that are interested in joiningus. What I have found is that
the public's curiosity, if for masonry, is equal to the craft's curiosity for
(13:39):
masonry. You know, there's somany misconceptions and things out there. I
have stayed away from discussions of thetopic of Albert Pike and specifically his statement
on Lucifer that everybody misconstrues and takesout of context, and just today recorded
(14:00):
a segment that will be part podcast, part YouTube video with doctor Brent Morris
and Brent he does a talk onLeo Taxil and the Taxil hoax and how
it plays into Pike and the statementon Lucifer and things like that. And
so I've stayed away from it becauseI can't resist feeding the trolls and I
(14:22):
have to stop it. I'm Ineed like I need Matt and Brother Dean
Alban They they they try their hardestto whisper good counsel and tell me to
stop, but you know, peoplepost things and I just I just need
to delete it and move on withmy day. But I feel this.
I don't even know what the rightword is. It's it's would it be
a vice or a super fluidy?Which one do you think it falls under
(14:45):
that category? I think it's superstucoditty, is what it is. Like.
I know, like, there's thisguy right now who's just just as
we were starting this discussion tonight,he's you know, you guys are Luciferry
and hear this to hear that,and it's like, I don't, Yeah,
I mean, any how many timesI've typed out these very long responses
about how Lucifer is not even reallyin the Bible and it's actually you had
(15:07):
one the other day that was prettyshort and sweetened to the point, you're
a Satanist, you're a child molester, and you're this, And I'm like,
wow, okay, satanist was worsethan the way he ranked it,
like satanist was worse than pedophile.And I was like, no, no,
no, When do you hear theword the secrets of Freemasonry? What
(15:35):
what does that evoke to you?And I don't mean to discuss specifically,
I mean I'm of the opinion thatthere are very few secrets, and I
hate the word secrets of freemasonry.I think it's misplaced, is don't I
don't. I prefer the term private, And I've talked about this in the
(15:56):
past, is that when you arein the bathroom, what's happening is not
really a secret. We all kindof know, but it's private. You
are alone with your wife, yourpartner, whatever it's you know, what's
happening in your bedroom is not reallya secret, but it's private. I
think freemasonry in much is much thesame way. There is that private initiatory
(16:18):
experience, and there are some thingsthat we kind of keep between members and
brothers, but we don't. Butit's not secret. There's nothing nefarious about
it. And I think the wordssecret, even though it has many definitions,
and the old definition is the onethat we're really using when we say
the secrets of freemasonry, I thinkin a modern context it does give that
(16:41):
nefarious, nefarious connotation, so Itry and avoid it. I don't think
we're a secret society. So doyou look at masonry as inherently a secret
society? No, And then it'skind of build on that, like so
the other line is old where asociety with secrets though, and I'm with
you, like, the secrets areno longer the passwords, the grips.
(17:03):
You can look all that stuff up. Hell I did. I read everything
I could about all of the degreesbefore I even took them. I wouldn't
say that I was minimally minimally surprised, because there is a lot of that
whole experience that you're still having nervoussweats and freaking out about because you're like,
wait a second, this wasn't inthis Duncan's ritual book that I just
(17:25):
spent seven dollars on Amazon for thatwas supposed to have all the secrets from
these guys. This wasn't in thatHistory Channel expose that I watched where they
talk about the secrets of the degree. I'm with you, where I think
the true meaning of the word secretsis really the unknown. It's the parts
of the ritual that and this isyou know, I kind of gravitate over
(17:45):
into the dark corners with the esotericeyes where they're like, well, hey,
did you know that the chakra?And you're like, whoa wait,
where did you get this chakra thing? Because nowhere in this ritual book that
I've been given. Did we talkabout this all, like, where did
you guys get? But I thinkit's that, and not to bust on
them, but I'm just saying thatI think that the secrets are the search
for those unknowns. That's the readingbetween the lines. It's what do these
(18:07):
words really mean? It's one thingthat you know I've talked a lot about
on our podcast is I probably stoppedreading the Bible when I was in fifth
grade because I stopped going to churchwith my parents. And now I'm actually
buying I'm looking at it now.Roget's the source of the Bible, so
I can go and look for certainwords because now they have a deeper meaning
as a mason. So I thinkthat the secrets are the our pursuit or
(18:33):
our testing of the theories of theunknown. And the danger is is that
just like our friend Joe Rogan,somebody's gonna say something that's going to be
pretty close to being right, andthat's going to freak a lot of people
out. And that's why it's asecret to me. The secret, and
I mean is it's less about somethingthat we're hiding from from people and more
(18:56):
about something that is what's the work, Ash. I can't think of the
involuble. It's it's that that spacebetween brothers, that that bond that exists,
that that invisible bond that forms betweentwo people who would have otherwise never
met one another. Some of mybest buddies in the world. You know,
(19:17):
Matt and I. You know,we were friends before we were Mason's
for many many years, and wewere we worked together, as you know,
in a band for a long longtime. And you know he became
a Mason from that. It wasn'tme who asked him, by the way,
or or who he said, hey, are you you know, thinking
about joining a lodge. That wasmy one brother, Pete, and Pete
(19:38):
passed away last year, and youknow there is that that connection between myself
and Pete, this guy who Iwould have never known, and you know,
had it not been for my relationshipwith Pete, Matt would have never
known him. And it's like there'sthis invisible thread that can of and that
is that's the secret. And Idon't mean that like you know, the
eleven rbs and spices. It's thethere's this un communicable thing that I can't
(20:04):
tell you what that connection between usis but there is something there. I
can't put my hand on it.I couldn't even define it, but it's
beyond being friends. And we're certainlynot related by blood, but we are
one hundred percent brothers and that thatbond is not So that's the secret of
Masonry. And you can tell peoplethat all you want, and it doesn't
make a whole lot of sense unlessyou're a Mason who has one of those
(20:26):
relationships. Is really kind kind ofgotten into it. And I always hate
when people, Oh, you getinto it, what you put, you
get out of it, what youput into it. But the truth is
that you really do if you ifyou give yourself into this a little bit.
And I have to say watching Matt, you know, old mister Bowers
can be a little bit of acurmudgeon in life, and you know,
but seeing him with the men whohe came through his Catechism class with and
(20:51):
seeing those those friendship forms, thosefriendships form from complete strangers to now guys
that he talks to on a prettymuch daily basis, is a really kind
of a cool thing to watch fromfrom this perspective, and you know,
I know, I know it's impactedhis life as as a human being.
I know, you know, hiswife is even saying I got sometimes Matt's
(21:11):
like a whole different person. I'mlike, yeah, he's even less likable
now than he always was. Butyou know, it's it's it's kind of
a really neat thing to see.And I think that's the secret of freemasonry.
But it's not a secret. Butyou know, if it doesn't,
if that makes sense, you makemention about secrets, and then you were
(21:33):
talking a minute ago, it's notor talking a little bit ago. To
chip away at the at the roughashler, you don't use a you know,
a giant sledgehammer. You use usea gabble, a small instrument.
And it just it just dawned onme all the times that that Pete came
up to me asking me if Iwas ready for a petition that was his
that his question was the gabble.Each and every time that just chipped away
(21:56):
and chipped away. You know,I mentioned I think of masonry as being
something that should be very practical ina man's life. One of the first
lessons you have to learn is thatyou have to ask to be a mason.
And I think that lesson is oneof masonry and life. Being a
proactive team sport. You have tostep forward and say I'm ready, coach,
let's do something to walk in andsit on the sideline, walk in
(22:18):
and say, hey, where canI help? What can I do?
Where can I be a part ofthis? And and And that's hard for
some guys to do that. Notevery man can walk in and do that.
What's a wishless guests? Who's oneperson you wish you could get on
the podcast? I'm working I'm workingon one of them. Yeah, John
Petrucci, who's a guitar player forDream Theater. There's a there are a
couple of Dream Theater songs that appearto have Scottish Right influence, and so
(22:44):
we'd like to get from the horse'smouth whether or not that's true. Yeah,
I'd love to talk to Bob Dylan. I don't think most people even
realize he's a Scottish Right Mason,but I would love to talk to him.
I don't know what state he's inat this moment in time in terms
of his mental capacity. One minuteI read that he's still sharpest attack and
the next minute I read that youknow he's he's having some difficulties. I
(23:06):
mean, he's he's eighty one maybe, so love to chat with him.
I'd love to talk to some morePrince Hall brothers. You know, our
Grand Commander, Grand Commander Cole,wonderful guy to work for and work with.
He brought all four of the GrandCommanders in Northern MASSI jurisdiction and both
Prince Hall Grand Commanders to the Houseof the Temple last September for a statement
(23:27):
of unity. We're basically saying PrinceHall Scottish right, we're all brothers and
we all you know, we welove and embrace each other. And I
thought that was really cool, andI really want to get some more of
them to join us and have thoseSo those are some of the basic ones.
But how about you wishless guest,Well, I would need Doc Brown's
(23:48):
time machine. I'd want to grabPreston and Webb and bring them together and
to be like dudes, these lecturesthat you wrote that are now part of
arbitual like, what does really allthis mean? Where did you get the
inspiration for this? What are youreally trying to tell us for people that
have really studied it, because allwe have now is kind of their works
(24:11):
and their writings that they've made onit. But yeah, if I could
travel back in time and have adiscussion, thirty minutes would seem like a
lifetime. Yeah. If I werein the DeLorean and me and Marty ended
up somewhere, I would go seebrother Pike and it'd be like, do
not write that sentence. Put yourpen down, don't write about that.
I would. You have no ideahow much aggravation that has cost. I
(24:34):
would do that. I got intomasonry because of Washington. When I got
done being a radio host, Ithought, well, my next step will
be run for public office or somethinglike that. And I didn't get to
go to college as a younger man, so I thought, well, I
need some kind of leadership training.And it looks like masonry. A lot
(24:55):
of great leaders came from that.So and Washington's the guy. So you
know, obviously a few minutes withGeorge. I'd like to talk to Ben,
but I feel like he'd drinking.There'd be a lot of women around.
So those revolutionary Arab brothers, Iwould because I think the charges that
we read now, especially the onesto talk about being a good citizen and
not uprising against that was a byproductof what happened with the American Revolution.
(25:18):
But I would love to hear yeahthat thought of like, okay, so
first of all you were a citizen, well not, it wasn't even a
country at your under the crown.And then what were you thinking like in
you were able to pull all thisoff? Like we just had brother Kenneth
Joel Ginn, who's the Master ofSaint John's Number one in New York City
(25:40):
with the Washington Inaugural Bible, andhe was kind of painting the picture of
what that first inauguration for Washington waslike. And the two other men that
were on the balcony that were thereadministering the first ever oath of office were
Freemasons, And kind of going toyour point about some of the Dan Brown
or conspiracy theory, like oh,what's up with these Freemasons and their secrets?
(26:02):
It's like, well, once youunderstand how good freemasonry is, wouldn't
you want to surround yourself with abunch of people that are also a part
of this group that you can trust, Like I wish there were more of
us that we could kind of bringinto that picture. How do you think
we and I know we gotta wrapthis up here before too long. How
do you think we combat the trollswithout doing the stupid thing that I do,
(26:27):
which is engaging with each and everyone of them. And I feel
like there's always something that I couldsay, If there's always if I just
make this one point, he'll believeme, even though I know that high
arrogance. But how do we combatthe misconceptions that we are facing? I
just ignore them, honestly, youknow, I kind of have like three
rules in life, and like rulenumber one is they just don't argue with
(26:48):
stupid people because you're never gonna win. They're just gonna beat it out of
you and you're just gonna so Andunfortunately I have not and I please don't
send them my way. I've hadlimited interaction with these haters, these detractors.
I commend you for wanting to tryto instill some light into these poor
(27:10):
folks that just feel like if theyjust cast another rock, they're going to
be the one to try to knockdown this tower. But it's just it's
just not going to happen for them. But yeah, I just I know
that there's nothing I could say tothem that's going to get them to see
things my way. In my brainI know it too, but in my
heart there's this I can save them, I can fix this person. Yeah.
(27:33):
It's the ones that don't say anythingthat I'm most concerned about, because
you know, the crazy ones thatyou know have their conspiracy theories and whatnot.
It's the ones that when you tellpeople, hey, I'm a Freemason,
or you don't feel comfortable sharing thatinformation with somebody, and they're like,
oh, and it's like everybody elsegives you the Oh, my grandfather
or my uncle or my father orsome other you know man that was important
(27:56):
in my life and my family wasa Mason. They're good people. It's
like, oh, you're a Freema. So it's like, oh, did
I offend you with something that Isaid? Like, those are the people
that I'm always worried about that wecould be doing more. And when it
comes to just Masonic pr visible prwith our grand lodges and our lodges and
all the jurisdictions of just letting peopleknow the wonderful amount of charity, the
(28:17):
difference that we make in the communitythat we are, in the community that
they live in. Where those guysthat a freemasonry didn't exist, we'd still
be those quiet men behind the scenesthat see something that needs to be done
and we do the work to fillthe need. You're one hundred percent right
and that that is always going tobe our challenge. But then there's the
school of thought and masonry that ifyou if you do any charitable work and
(28:41):
you get credit for it, thenand it's not really charity, you're getting
something in return. And I hearthat. But at the same time,
I think we do need to raiseawareness, and I'm you know, I'm
certainly in the business of trying toraise some of the awareness for the craft.
And I appreciate what you got.You know, I've enjoyed all your
(29:03):
episodes that I've had a chance tolisten to. I'm I'm excited that there
are people out there that are doingwhat you do, you know, Connor,
for the love of the game,because I think it's just such an
important thing that the people are havingthose discussions in there's that content available.
I just want to say, youknow, it was a real honor.
I was really just blown away whenthe producer Matt reached out and said,
(29:26):
hey, we'd like to have youon for the you know, the Scottish
Rite Southern Masonic jurisdiction. I'm like, is this a joke? They want
to have me come on their podcasts, Like you have a low bar for
what you consider to be an honor, My brother, this has been the
Craftsman Online podcast Again. Big thanksto my guest brother Maynard Edwards and his
(29:48):
producer brother Matt Bowers from The Tyler'sPlace podcast for coming on. If you've
enjoyed our podcast and you want tohear more, you can tell Siri or
Alexa to play. The Craftsman Onlinepodcasts were available on all all streaming platforms,
with new episodes every Monday morning untilnext time. Let peace and harmony prevail.
Welcome to the Craftsman Online Podcast,the only five star rated Masonic podcast endorsed
by the Grand Lodge, New York. I'm your host, Brother Michael Arsay,
co founder of Craftsman Online dot com. The comments, opinions, and
views shared during this program are thoseof individual Freemasons and do not reflect the
official position of a Grand Lodge,Concordant Body, a Pendant body, or
Masonic authority. A quick reminders youcan now listen early and add free to
(00:38):
our episodes with our news subscriber offer. Get the link to start your seven
day free trial and the show notesfor this episode. You've joined us for
a talk on the Tyler's Place podcast. It's hosted by my guest this week,
Brother Maynard Edwards, and produced byBrother Matt Bowers. It's the official
podcast for the Scottish Writes Southern MasonicJurisdiction. There's something that's really impressive about
(01:00):
this podcast. They've been doing thisfor almost ten years. They started in
twenty fourteen and have produced about onehundred and sixteen episodes at last count.
We're going to get a link foryou to join and tune in and listen
to their program. This is aunique episode for me. I very rarely
get a chance to interview other hostbrother Maynards. So looking back at the
(01:23):
deep library that you have your catalogof episodes, was there a Tyler's Place
podcast episode that for you stecks outas being the most powerful? Were you
really were able to connect with eithera guest or a topic. That is
a really great question. I thinkthe one there's one that stands out in
my mind just there was a statementthat I kind of carry with me even
(01:46):
now. It was past Grandmaster Rogervan Gordon, who he was a past
Grandmaster, and I want to say, Indiana, I'll probably Roger, I'm
sorry. I know you're listening.He's now one of the heads of the
Masonic Renewal Committee of the Conference ofGrand Masters. One wonderful guy, wonderful
friend and mentor. First time Iinterviewed him, we were in a hotel
(02:08):
in Alexandria in the lobby, havinga cup of coffee, and I literally
interviewed him on my phone, andhe was frustrated with the state of Masonry
in that people were dismissing men whohe knew would be good leaders because they
didn't memorize thirty minute lectures in ourfraternity today, we would dismiss George Washington
(02:36):
as a leader because he didn't havetime to memorize a thirty minute lecture.
Think about that for a minute,and he's right. You know, I'm
a big believer in ritual as theeasy part, Like stop whining and memorize
the lecture, to shut up amemorize the lecture, man up, memorize
your ritual, and move on withyour business. I know it's sometimes it's
challenging, that's not that, that'sthe truth, But you can just get
(03:00):
it over and done with, becausewhen if you're really going to be an
effective leader of a lodge or ofanything, the ritual and that part of
it really is the easy part becauseall you have to do is regurgitated.
It doesn't require any thought. Itjust requires simple muscle memory. And you
know, I kind of carried thatwith me. The other one was just
recently, I sat down for avery long time with past Grandmaster of Washington,
(03:23):
DC, brother ackerm Elias, andI've known Ackerham for a couple of
years now, and he's he's awonderful guy. He showed it up on
the History Channel all the time,and you know, he's he's he's such
a good speaker, but he reallyand truly is a true believer at the
highest level of the power that masonryhas to unite and transform people. And
(03:49):
I really it wasn't any one thingthat he said in the interview, and
again it was only a couple ofmonths ago, but it was something,
you know, just his entire approachto it just really struck me. As
you know, this is a guywho spent a good chunk of his life
as a Freemason. He's dedicated,he was a grand Master, He's dedicated
(04:10):
so much of his life to it. And that was that was that that
one really got to me. Sothat and and there's one I recorded just
recently with with my brother Hank Griffin, and I call Hank the Garrison Keeler.
A Freemasonry Hanks doing a podcast aswell, but it's very different from
what we're doing. He tells thesehomespun stories, just like a prairie home
(04:32):
companion and back at freemasonry. Andhe's he's just gotten started in the last
three or four months, and heis the Grand Chaplain in Maryland, and
he's just I didn't know him beforethis year and I was having a tough
time back in February. I wasat a Masonic meeting. I got a
phone call, got some bad news, and I went to Hank as the
grand chaplain. I said, brother, I know you don't know me that
(04:55):
well, but you know, wouldyou would you say a prayer with me?
And U? Now I get chokedhim. Now surprising to no one,
but Hank and I are now reallygood buddies. And I sat down
and talked to him, you know, talk about the real deal, the
guy that walks the walk and talksto talk. How about how about you?
Is there one that gets you inthe in the fields? It's weird
(05:17):
living in this time where you canmake connections like like you haven't like in
person, which those are magical specialmoments. But now because of this technology
in this world we live in,you can get an email from somebody and
that's literally where the friendship begins toblossom. Right. And we had done
(05:38):
a podcast on to me. Thetitle was the fun part was and practicing
safe Masonic intercourse UH in New YorkState. That's how we refer to when
it comes to interacting with Clandessin's thatwe're not supposed to be performing Masonic intercourse
with him, and it's I've neverseen a brother gun through the obligation that
doesn't have a little smile in hisface when when that line comes out.
(06:00):
But the brother that was the gueston the podcast, you know, shared
his story, which, in allseriousness, you're like, oh my gosh,
I can't believe that this happens.And what led to a brother who
reached out to me and said,Hey, I am a clandestine Mason and
I prefer to look at myself asan irregular Mason, and I want to
become a regular Mason. Here's mystory, here's where I am. Can
(06:25):
you help me? And Louise andI have become very close friends. He
lives in Texas. I was tryingto help him find a lodge. She
eventually did find a lodge that hecould affiliate with. They have they're having
him go back all the way throughall of the degrees because he came from
a jurisdiction in Mexico that was notrecognized and didn't have amity with many Grand
(06:51):
lodges. But a lot of theirritual was so similar, and the difficult
part was, you know, wantingto have those conversations with him to find
out where the differences are. Butobviously those to be the secrets that we
can't reveal, even to people whoreally should be brothers. But they just
joined a group that wasn't trying totake his money. They weren't doing the
wrong thing. They just weren't recognizedby other grand lodges but for the way
(07:14):
that they were quote unquote practicing freemasonry. He's now an entered apprentice, so
he's a Mason. I was soexcited to have a conversation with him,
to get him on the podcast foran episode and just stay with them and
track with him through his progress.But through all this time, which would
literally started out with an email abouttwo years ago, he's you know,
had a daughter, He's gone throughcareer changes. I've gone through career changes.
(07:39):
I moved from upstate New York toDC. We've become like long distance
friends, and to me that special. I don't remember really having those kind
of relationships with radio listeners. It'ssomething unique that we can do as Freemasons
and really kind of speaks to thatbrotherhood slash fraternity aspect of the craft that
(08:00):
sometimes goes overlooked when you look outover the horizon of freemasonry, and it
is the thirty foot question. Whatis the challenge do you think for us
in the craft as we look outat the next let's say five years and
then ten years, what are thechallenges that we really have in front of
us to deal with? I thinkthe immediate challenge that we have right now,
(08:20):
and like, no joke, butwe have to be better than Netflix.
I had a phone call with aguy who is the current what's what's
Greg? He's a senior steward inour lodge. Ere Matt got up.
Yes, Greg calls me and hegoes, man, I'm listening to this
audio book and these guys. Hewas listening to the Hey Dad audiobook,
which is the audiobook Matches did forthe Demla about frank Land and excellent,
(08:43):
excellent audio book, by the way, if you want to listen to it.
The golden tones of that bowers andhe goes, man, I'm listening
to this and these guys they wentand they got entered, past and raised
and they did it all within likethree weeks. How the heck did they
do that? I was like,yeah, they didn't have Netflix, and
uh, you know, I thinkI actually said an adult website. I
said, they didn't have any ofthat to contend with, so they didn't
(09:05):
have anything else to do, sothat would And it's the truth. You're
right, that's one hundred percent.We got to be better than Netflix.
So I remember sitting in lodge recentlyand going, why am I spending a
Friday night sitting in here for abusiness meeting? Like I could be home
with my wife watching a Netflix showright now, as much as that's boring
(09:26):
and sucked, like three years agoduring the pandemic, I'm like, I
don't have to be dressed up ina tuxedo. And I think that that's
the immediate challenge that we have isgetting past the boring business meetings. I
don't see the membership decline as acritical issue. I do think the consolidation
that's eventually going to have to happenwith many lodges coming back down to what
(09:50):
is a reasonable size. I personallyhold the opinion that you know, freemasonry
is not right for every man,just like every man's not right to be
a Freemason. I give this talkevery brother, bring a friend night.
I say, look across this room, how many of us are sitting here.
There's like twelve or thirteen, right, how many men do you know
in your life? And how comeyou're the one that's in this room and
(10:11):
more of the people you know aren't. It's a small circle. We also
are living in a time where wefeel that the problems that we face are
so unique, and it's not.There's actually been harder times in the history
of the world than where we areright now. And when it comes to
defending the craft, for lack ofa better term, and promoting the goodness
(10:33):
of the craft, we're facing thesame problems that our brothers did in the
eighteenth century when with the advent ofthe printing press and the pamphlets and the
expose's and trying to shout down allthe detractors. So really, I think
that the issue that we have rightnow are more self inflicted problems so to
(10:54):
speak, where it's we have menwho are turning to the Internet and a
Google search to find a lodge andget there, and we just don't know
how to bring him on the boat, so to speak, from from being
caught in the ocean. Well,I think one of the big things that
we face, and you know,having gotten to the privilege of working with
the Northern Massan Jurisdiction and the Shrineand and of course the Southern jurisdiction discuss
(11:18):
right on to be a Freemason projectis that what happens is that we get
these inquiries for lack of a betterword, that you know, I'm interested
in joining a lodge, I'm interestedin freemasonry, and then we send them
to the local lodges and the ballgets dropped. And it's easy to get
frustrated by that, but I asa lodge secretary now and a past master
(11:43):
and having sat in every chair andall that, it's a volunteer army,
and so you know, right nowtonight, you and I are doing this
out of the love for the craft. And because another brother doesn't have the
time to do this doesn't mean thathe doesn't love the craft. But maybe
he just doesn't have the time.And maybe the lodge secretary is dealing with
fifteen other things. And you know, somebody's not hand walking a petition into
(12:07):
him and saying here's the petition,here's the check. They're just you're just
getting an email with a name andan email address on it. You know,
I can tell you right now isas busy as you get. Sometimes
that goes to the bottom of thestack, and and it's unfortunate, but
it's not done on a malice,It's just it is what it is.
Where very few men get paid todo this. It's a you have a
(12:28):
finite amount of time in your day, and so do I tell my wife
I can't have dinner with her tonightbecause I'm instead going to go and answer
these fifty emails. And the otherissue to that is is that when do
you get a chance during a Masonicmeeting to say, oh, by the
way, I'm a certified Digital MarketingSpecialist, or hey, by the way,
I have a CPA, or Ihave a lot of great Like when
(12:52):
do you really get a chance toshare your portfolio, your skills, your
talents with the other brothers that thatall happens in outside of the lodge events.
And if we're not having those,then you really don't see the talent
that's waiting for you. And Ithink a lot of that is being missed
in the craft too. So yeah, like I said, I think a
lot of the issues that we're havingis just organizational. It's not the outside
(13:15):
world. It's us just trying tofind a way to transform, to be
more efficient and be able to provideto keep retain the people that we have
and still have an onboarding process,a smoother process, a better defined process
for those that are interested in joiningus. What I have found is that
the public's curiosity, if for masonry, is equal to the craft's curiosity for
(13:39):
masonry. You know, there's somany misconceptions and things out there. I
have stayed away from discussions of thetopic of Albert Pike and specifically his statement
on Lucifer that everybody misconstrues and takesout of context, and just today recorded
(14:00):
a segment that will be part podcast, part YouTube video with doctor Brent Morris
and Brent he does a talk onLeo Taxil and the Taxil hoax and how
it plays into Pike and the statementon Lucifer and things like that. And
so I've stayed away from it becauseI can't resist feeding the trolls and I
(14:22):
have to stop it. I'm Ineed like I need Matt and Brother Dean
Alban They they they try their hardestto whisper good counsel and tell me to
stop, but you know, peoplepost things and I just I just need
to delete it and move on withmy day. But I feel this.
I don't even know what the rightword is. It's it's would it be
a vice or a super fluidy?Which one do you think it falls under
(14:45):
that category? I think it's superstucoditty, is what it is. Like.
I know, like, there's thisguy right now who's just just as
we were starting this discussion tonight,he's you know, you guys are Luciferry
and hear this to hear that,and it's like, I don't, Yeah,
I mean, any how many timesI've typed out these very long responses
about how Lucifer is not even reallyin the Bible and it's actually you had
(15:07):
one the other day that was prettyshort and sweetened to the point, you're
a Satanist, you're a child molester, and you're this, And I'm like,
wow, okay, satanist was worsethan the way he ranked it,
like satanist was worse than pedophile.And I was like, no, no,
no, When do you hear theword the secrets of Freemasonry? What
(15:35):
what does that evoke to you?And I don't mean to discuss specifically,
I mean I'm of the opinion thatthere are very few secrets, and I
hate the word secrets of freemasonry.I think it's misplaced, is don't I
don't. I prefer the term private, And I've talked about this in the
(15:56):
past, is that when you arein the bathroom, what's happening is not
really a secret. We all kindof know, but it's private. You
are alone with your wife, yourpartner, whatever it's you know, what's
happening in your bedroom is not reallya secret, but it's private. I
think freemasonry in much is much thesame way. There is that private initiatory
(16:18):
experience, and there are some thingsthat we kind of keep between members and
brothers, but we don't. Butit's not secret. There's nothing nefarious about
it. And I think the wordssecret, even though it has many definitions,
and the old definition is the onethat we're really using when we say
the secrets of freemasonry, I thinkin a modern context it does give that
(16:41):
nefarious, nefarious connotation, so Itry and avoid it. I don't think
we're a secret society. So doyou look at masonry as inherently a secret
society? No, And then it'skind of build on that, like so
the other line is old where asociety with secrets though, and I'm with
you, like, the secrets areno longer the passwords, the grips.
(17:03):
You can look all that stuff up. Hell I did. I read everything
I could about all of the degreesbefore I even took them. I wouldn't
say that I was minimally minimally surprised, because there is a lot of that
whole experience that you're still having nervoussweats and freaking out about because you're like,
wait a second, this wasn't inthis Duncan's ritual book that I just
(17:25):
spent seven dollars on Amazon for thatwas supposed to have all the secrets from
these guys. This wasn't in thatHistory Channel expose that I watched where they
talk about the secrets of the degree. I'm with you, where I think
the true meaning of the word secretsis really the unknown. It's the parts
of the ritual that and this isyou know, I kind of gravitate over
(17:45):
into the dark corners with the esotericeyes where they're like, well, hey,
did you know that the chakra?And you're like, whoa wait,
where did you get this chakra thing? Because nowhere in this ritual book that
I've been given. Did we talkabout this all, like, where did
you guys get? But I thinkit's that, and not to bust on
them, but I'm just saying thatI think that the secrets are the search
for those unknowns. That's the readingbetween the lines. It's what do these
(18:07):
words really mean? It's one thingthat you know I've talked a lot about
on our podcast is I probably stoppedreading the Bible when I was in fifth
grade because I stopped going to churchwith my parents. And now I'm actually
buying I'm looking at it now.Roget's the source of the Bible, so
I can go and look for certainwords because now they have a deeper meaning
as a mason. So I thinkthat the secrets are the our pursuit or
(18:33):
our testing of the theories of theunknown. And the danger is is that
just like our friend Joe Rogan,somebody's gonna say something that's going to be
pretty close to being right, andthat's going to freak a lot of people
out. And that's why it's asecret to me. The secret, and
I mean is it's less about somethingthat we're hiding from from people and more
(18:56):
about something that is what's the work, Ash. I can't think of the
involuble. It's it's that that spacebetween brothers, that that bond that exists,
that that invisible bond that forms betweentwo people who would have otherwise never
met one another. Some of mybest buddies in the world. You know,
(19:17):
Matt and I. You know,we were friends before we were Mason's
for many many years, and wewere we worked together, as you know,
in a band for a long longtime. And you know he became
a Mason from that. It wasn'tme who asked him, by the way,
or or who he said, hey, are you you know, thinking
about joining a lodge. That wasmy one brother, Pete, and Pete
(19:38):
passed away last year, and youknow there is that that connection between myself
and Pete, this guy who Iwould have never known, and you know,
had it not been for my relationshipwith Pete, Matt would have never
known him. And it's like there'sthis invisible thread that can of and that
is that's the secret. And Idon't mean that like you know, the
eleven rbs and spices. It's thethere's this un communicable thing that I can't
(20:04):
tell you what that connection between usis but there is something there. I
can't put my hand on it.I couldn't even define it, but it's
beyond being friends. And we're certainlynot related by blood, but we are
one hundred percent brothers and that thatbond is not So that's the secret of
Masonry. And you can tell peoplethat all you want, and it doesn't
make a whole lot of sense unlessyou're a Mason who has one of those
(20:26):
relationships. Is really kind kind ofgotten into it. And I always hate
when people, Oh, you getinto it, what you put, you
get out of it, what youput into it. But the truth is
that you really do if you ifyou give yourself into this a little bit.
And I have to say watching Matt, you know, old mister Bowers
can be a little bit of acurmudgeon in life, and you know,
but seeing him with the men whohe came through his Catechism class with and
(20:51):
seeing those those friendship forms, thosefriendships form from complete strangers to now guys
that he talks to on a prettymuch daily basis, is a really kind
of a cool thing to watch fromfrom this perspective, and you know,
I know, I know it's impactedhis life as as a human being.
I know, you know, hiswife is even saying I got sometimes Matt's
(21:11):
like a whole different person. I'mlike, yeah, he's even less likable
now than he always was. Butyou know, it's it's it's kind of
a really neat thing to see.And I think that's the secret of freemasonry.
But it's not a secret. Butyou know, if it doesn't,
if that makes sense, you makemention about secrets, and then you were
(21:33):
talking a minute ago, it's notor talking a little bit ago. To
chip away at the at the roughashler, you don't use a you know,
a giant sledgehammer. You use usea gabble, a small instrument.
And it just it just dawned onme all the times that that Pete came
up to me asking me if Iwas ready for a petition that was his
that his question was the gabble.Each and every time that just chipped away
(21:56):
and chipped away. You know,I mentioned I think of masonry as being
something that should be very practical ina man's life. One of the first
lessons you have to learn is thatyou have to ask to be a mason.
And I think that lesson is oneof masonry and life. Being a
proactive team sport. You have tostep forward and say I'm ready, coach,
let's do something to walk in andsit on the sideline, walk in
(22:18):
and say, hey, where canI help? What can I do?
Where can I be a part ofthis? And and And that's hard for
some guys to do that. Notevery man can walk in and do that.
What's a wishless guests? Who's oneperson you wish you could get on
the podcast? I'm working I'm workingon one of them. Yeah, John
Petrucci, who's a guitar player forDream Theater. There's a there are a
couple of Dream Theater songs that appearto have Scottish Right influence, and so
(22:44):
we'd like to get from the horse'smouth whether or not that's true. Yeah,
I'd love to talk to Bob Dylan. I don't think most people even
realize he's a Scottish Right Mason,but I would love to talk to him.
I don't know what state he's inat this moment in time in terms
of his mental capacity. One minuteI read that he's still sharpest attack and
the next minute I read that youknow he's he's having some difficulties. I
(23:06):
mean, he's he's eighty one maybe, so love to chat with him.
I'd love to talk to some morePrince Hall brothers. You know, our
Grand Commander, Grand Commander Cole,wonderful guy to work for and work with.
He brought all four of the GrandCommanders in Northern MASSI jurisdiction and both
Prince Hall Grand Commanders to the Houseof the Temple last September for a statement
(23:27):
of unity. We're basically saying PrinceHall Scottish right, we're all brothers and
we all you know, we welove and embrace each other. And I
thought that was really cool, andI really want to get some more of
them to join us and have thoseSo those are some of the basic ones.
But how about you wishless guest,Well, I would need Doc Brown's
(23:48):
time machine. I'd want to grabPreston and Webb and bring them together and
to be like dudes, these lecturesthat you wrote that are now part of
arbitual like, what does really allthis mean? Where did you get the
inspiration for this? What are youreally trying to tell us for people that
have really studied it, because allwe have now is kind of their works
(24:11):
and their writings that they've made onit. But yeah, if I could
travel back in time and have adiscussion, thirty minutes would seem like a
lifetime. Yeah. If I werein the DeLorean and me and Marty ended
up somewhere, I would go seebrother Pike and it'd be like, do
not write that sentence. Put yourpen down, don't write about that.
I would. You have no ideahow much aggravation that has cost. I
(24:34):
would do that. I got intomasonry because of Washington. When I got
done being a radio host, Ithought, well, my next step will
be run for public office or somethinglike that. And I didn't get to
go to college as a younger man, so I thought, well, I
need some kind of leadership training.And it looks like masonry. A lot
(24:55):
of great leaders came from that.So and Washington's the guy. So you
know, obviously a few minutes withGeorge. I'd like to talk to Ben,
but I feel like he'd drinking.There'd be a lot of women around.
So those revolutionary Arab brothers, Iwould because I think the charges that
we read now, especially the onesto talk about being a good citizen and
not uprising against that was a byproductof what happened with the American Revolution.
(25:18):
But I would love to hear yeahthat thought of like, okay, so
first of all you were a citizen, well not, it wasn't even a
country at your under the crown.And then what were you thinking like in
you were able to pull all thisoff? Like we just had brother Kenneth
Joel Ginn, who's the Master ofSaint John's Number one in New York City
(25:40):
with the Washington Inaugural Bible, andhe was kind of painting the picture of
what that first inauguration for Washington waslike. And the two other men that
were on the balcony that were thereadministering the first ever oath of office were
Freemasons, And kind of going toyour point about some of the Dan Brown
or conspiracy theory, like oh,what's up with these Freemasons and their secrets?
(26:02):
It's like, well, once youunderstand how good freemasonry is, wouldn't
you want to surround yourself with abunch of people that are also a part
of this group that you can trust, Like I wish there were more of
us that we could kind of bringinto that picture. How do you think
we and I know we gotta wrapthis up here before too long. How
do you think we combat the trollswithout doing the stupid thing that I do,
(26:27):
which is engaging with each and everyone of them. And I feel
like there's always something that I couldsay, If there's always if I just
make this one point, he'll believeme, even though I know that high
arrogance. But how do we combatthe misconceptions that we are facing? I
just ignore them, honestly, youknow, I kind of have like three
rules in life, and like rulenumber one is they just don't argue with
(26:48):
stupid people because you're never gonna win. They're just gonna beat it out of
you and you're just gonna so Andunfortunately I have not and I please don't
send them my way. I've hadlimited interaction with these haters, these detractors.
I commend you for wanting to tryto instill some light into these poor
(27:10):
folks that just feel like if theyjust cast another rock, they're going to
be the one to try to knockdown this tower. But it's just it's
just not going to happen for them. But yeah, I just I know
that there's nothing I could say tothem that's going to get them to see
things my way. In my brainI know it too, but in my
heart there's this I can save them, I can fix this person. Yeah.
(27:33):
It's the ones that don't say anythingthat I'm most concerned about, because
you know, the crazy ones thatyou know have their conspiracy theories and whatnot.
It's the ones that when you tellpeople, hey, I'm a Freemason,
or you don't feel comfortable sharing thatinformation with somebody, and they're like,
oh, and it's like everybody elsegives you the Oh, my grandfather
or my uncle or my father orsome other you know man that was important
(27:56):
in my life and my family wasa Mason. They're good people. It's
like, oh, you're a Freema. So it's like, oh, did
I offend you with something that Isaid? Like, those are the people
that I'm always worried about that wecould be doing more. And when it
comes to just Masonic pr visible prwith our grand lodges and our lodges and
all the jurisdictions of just letting peopleknow the wonderful amount of charity, the
(28:17):
difference that we make in the communitythat we are, in the community that
they live in. Where those guysthat a freemasonry didn't exist, we'd still
be those quiet men behind the scenesthat see something that needs to be done
and we do the work to fillthe need. You're one hundred percent right
and that that is always going tobe our challenge. But then there's the
school of thought and masonry that ifyou if you do any charitable work and
(28:41):
you get credit for it, thenand it's not really charity, you're getting
something in return. And I hearthat. But at the same time,
I think we do need to raiseawareness, and I'm you know, I'm
certainly in the business of trying toraise some of the awareness for the craft.
And I appreciate what you got.You know, I've enjoyed all your
(29:03):
episodes that I've had a chance tolisten to. I'm I'm excited that there
are people out there that are doingwhat you do, you know, Connor,
for the love of the game,because I think it's just such an
important thing that the people are havingthose discussions in there's that content available.
I just want to say, youknow, it was a real honor.
I was really just blown away whenthe producer Matt reached out and said,
(29:26):
hey, we'd like to have youon for the you know, the Scottish
Rite Southern Masonic jurisdiction. I'm like, is this a joke? They want
to have me come on their podcasts, Like you have a low bar for
what you consider to be an honor, My brother, this has been the
Craftsman Online podcast Again. Big thanksto my guest brother Maynard Edwards and his
(29:48):
producer brother Matt Bowers from The Tyler'sPlace podcast for coming on. If you've
enjoyed our podcast and you want tohear more, you can tell Siri or
Alexa to play. The Craftsman Onlinepodcasts were available on all all streaming platforms,
with new episodes every Monday morning untilnext time. Let peace and harmony prevail.
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