March 17, 2025 • 29 mins
WB Gregory J. Knott retired May 1, 2023, after 35 years of combined service in the University of Illinois System. He's now a public school substitute teacher and in this episode, takes us back to school for an honest perspective on what's changed in the classroom and how what's old is now new again.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
The Commons. Opinions and views shared during this program are
of those individual Freemasons and do not reflect the official
position of a Grand Launch, Concordant Body, a pendant Body,
a Masonic authority, or Craftsman Online dot com.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
Hey, welcome back to the Craftsman Online Podcast, the only
Masonic podcast.
Speaker 3 (00:32):
Endorsed by the Grand Lodge of New York. I'm your host, Wright,
worshipful Brother Michael.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Arsa and a cool episode this week is we get
to the classroom and we talk a little bit about
how Masons served their community by helping the next generation.
A very interesting episode as we get into it with
a brother that has a lot of Masonic titles. He's
a past master, he's a shriner, he's a thirty third
(00:55):
degree Scottish write. Illustrious brother, worshipful not and close friend
of mine. Welcome to the Craftsman Online Podcast.
Speaker 4 (01:04):
My brother Michael, great to be with you. Like you say,
those titles, they're important part of the craft. But that's
enough of them. Deal.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
I love brother too, but you have such an illustrious background,
past master, shriner, You're an Illinois and a DC Freemason,
Naval Launch. Love that we mentioned the thirty third degree Scottishred.
But there's one accomplishment that you have listed on your
resume that it always makes me smile when I hear it,
and that's Eagle Scout. Take us back to the days
(01:34):
of scouting and how that kind of you know, crafted
your life to become a freemason.
Speaker 4 (01:38):
Well, there's a direct correlation. You know. I was in
scouting as a Cub Scout, came up into boy Scouts,
as you say, I were in the Eagle Scout, and
you know, I'm probably more proud of it today than
I was then, because I think with time you appreciate more.
But as I looked back, all of those experiences in
scouting directly shaped who I am today. And the correlation
(02:02):
between freemasonry and scouting. There's so much, you know, you
could do entire episodes, but the value system is very
much the same. And it's funny. I really wasn't in Scouts,
you know. I aged out as a youth, and then
my own son he joined Cub Scouts, and so I
came through with him in the last few years and
he is also an Eagle Scout and earned out about
(02:23):
three years ago, and he aged out, But I stuck around.
So I'm still involved to this day and I'm on
the council board, you know, which is the governing board
for our area. So it's just I so believe in
the movement of Scouting that I just I don't see
me ever not being involved in It's it's actually why
(02:43):
I became a Freemason in a sense, because I missed
a lot of those things that we did in scouting.
You know, it's Scouting is similar to freemasonry, and that
there's so many things you can learn. It's how you
apply yourself and you create your own path in a sense,
and that's you know, those value systems I think are
more needed now than ever.
Speaker 3 (03:04):
I wish that I had stuck with scouting. I think
I did it for like one weekend. And when I
was growing up, scouting was for camping, very outdoors people,
which I am not one of. And that continues to
this day where you know, for me, roughing it is,
you know, the fourth floor of the Hilton. When you
talk about all of the other things with scouting, the
(03:25):
kind of the introduction to like what it means to
be a brother, a friend, to be a trusted member
in society, to think about your community first, to have
a love for country. Yeah, those things are ingrained in freemasonry.
Some of them we do talk about, but it all
starts there. The seed for it is in the Scouts.
Speaker 4 (03:43):
The seed is there. And if you think about at
least in Scouting especially, we talk about this is character development.
Is that, especially when you're a youth. You know, there's
so many things you can be influenced by, and we
hope that Scouting does a positive influence. I've seen it
first the kids who were in my den, my Tiger Din,
which is the beginning for Cub Scouts. Today, they've all
(04:07):
a lot of them graduating college now and they're engineers
and they're you know, they're in the trades, and but
you know, they're still all upstanding, great kids without adults.
And I see that influence. And I see the same
thing in the craft. You know, there's a lot of
men sometimes when you knock on that door, you're not
exactly sure why, but you just over time you learn more,
(04:29):
you apply it more. You have positive influences of the
multi generations and things, of course, and I think we're
also a character development organization.
Speaker 3 (04:37):
Now you are one of the brothers who I feel
like I've known for some time, we've never met in person.
I think this is the extent with computer screens and
technology today. I hear your voice with the podcast that
Meet Act and part with Brother Darren. I've always wondered,
and we were talking about a dear friend of ours,
brother RJ. You know how you're able to do all
of the things that you do in freemasonry and still
(05:01):
be able to do things like scouting and be involved
in the community.
Speaker 4 (05:04):
I've always been very calendar oriented, and so even in
my career, I really didn't like anybody else control of
my calendar because that meant I could do more things
if I was controlling, you know, to a reasonable degree
to do it. And so I just I've been always
one of those I even look back to my scouting career,
I was the same, you know, I was. I knew
(05:25):
how long it took to get from say, one rank
to another, and what I needed to do in there,
and I just I planned it accordingly. And in many
ways my career reflected those kind of same kind of skills,
and so I was a good multitasker. You could you
could also maybe attributed to I have so many interests
to keep my my boredom level in check, and so
(05:48):
I think that's part of it, and it's just, you know,
I know limits though within things as well. You know,
I don't aspire to be in grand lines or any
of those. I've not done any of that because for me,
I'd rather do it locally and then that means I
can have actually I think more of an impact locally
than you can, and other things other people excel at that.
Speaker 3 (06:10):
Yeah, You've got a really interesting background and we're going
to get to it on this episode.
Speaker 4 (06:13):
I know.
Speaker 3 (06:14):
The episode title says why I retired and became a
substitute teacher, and we'll get to that, trust me.
Speaker 4 (06:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (06:20):
Yeah, going back to Scouts and that calling for public
service and helping other people, is that what kind of
planted the seeds again back when you were young to
get into education and teaching.
Speaker 4 (06:32):
No question, public service has been a hobby, an aspiration,
something I've spent thousands of hours on. And it's just
I think when I grew up, most of my role
models were World War Two, the greatest generation folks men
and women both both especially my relatives. I saw them
serve on, including my dad though he was the next generation.
(06:56):
But library boards and village boards and townships and forest
preserve boards and all that, and just I just thought,
that's just what you did. I just saw it as
a sense of duty. And you know, when I look
at the craft, I see all the things that we
can learn in a lawge room. But to me, if
we don't take those out and externally apply them in
(07:16):
whatever way that you know, find is you can do
it in the community, I think it's a lost opportunity.
We talk a lot about citizenship and scouting, and there's
no question that had a huge impact on me. One
of the things you do as an Eagle Scout as
an Eagle Scout project. And so my project, which is
really the capstone of your youth scouting career, was I
(07:41):
planned and we created this marker which was a tribute
to Abraham Lincoln on a on a trail at a
state park here in Illinois, and it was just it
was fascinating to learn about his history he had. He
had a local connection in my area here in Illinois,
and I just think it's a sense that you can
help the community and you can accomplish something. You know, again,
(08:02):
at the local level, I'm on a forest preserve board now,
so we have several properties in our county, and I
can see tangibly the work we do as a board
helps the environment, helps the public. They get out and
they recreate in our public spaces and all that kind
of stuff. And I guess, I guess if I had
a wish, I wish more people would be involved into it,
(08:23):
that would be you know, I know not everybody's wired
like I am, but there's so many places you can
contribute in. Public service doesn't have to be on a
governing board. Our communities need you.
Speaker 3 (08:35):
I've known you from our days back with the Midnight Freemasons.
That was before the COVID pandemic. I'm like, well, finally
somebody that I knew before COVID. I also know you
as one of my Midwest brothers, as you mentioned Illinois.
And it's interesting in the craft, you meet these men
and you're like, oh, cool, we are like minded. We
have a lot we called a public service, for example,
(08:55):
involved with our community, involved with our lodge. We love
this craft. And then you start connecting with him outside
and in a personal level, and on LinkedIn, I was like, wow,
he works for the University of Illinois. He's really involved there.
So tell us a little bit about your time and
hire ed before we get to why you left it
to become a public school teacher.
Speaker 4 (09:15):
You've heard the term military brat. M I think I
was a higher ed brat in a sense. So I
grew up only ten miles from the University of Illinois.
My mom and dad worked there, my grandfather attended there,
my great grandfather attended there, and there's just always been
all these family connections, and so I think it was
natural that I had this interest in education, and so
(09:38):
I was drawn to higher education. I worked on the
grounds crew, I worked on the farm. You worked in
the retirement system part of it. And it was an amazing
career because each step I got to do more and
more things, and I traveled overseas, went to China, help
recruit students, capped it out with I was secretary for
(09:59):
the Order Trustees for the University of Illinois system, which
is we have three campuses of Springfield, Chicago, and or
Bannon's the Big ten university. But it was just you know, again,
I was always fascinated with learning. I think I think
that was the key that's always kept me going. You know,
I got to guest lecture. I was not a faculty member.
I was always an administrator. You know. It's funny you
(10:20):
can go from one job, one career, to the other,
but you're still all within the same you know, family,
so to speak. And I just that the people I
got to work with PhD is some of the smartest
people in the world. And one of my units that
I worked in food science and human Nutrition, we ran
a cafe, and so every day I would eat lunch
(10:41):
in this cafe. And the conversations you could have with
just anybody from the university president to you know, the
youngest faculty member to a graduate student to an undergrad
you know, and and hearing what their stories were and
what they were trying to accomplish or had already impacted
(11:02):
in many cases, to me that that was exciting. I
spent thirty five years in all those roles. It's funny.
My last role as Secretary of the university, it was
I took it on, you know, a while before COVID,
and so I had to as many people. I managed COVID,
and so my job was to manage the board of trustees.
So I arranged the meeting. I went through the agendas
(11:25):
with them. I dually reported to the university president and
to the board chair. You know, it's interesting with trustees.
They're volunteers. You know, they're appointed by the governor in
our state, but they're volunteers. They're not paid. So you know,
in one case, I worked with literally a rocket scientist,
President Clean is a rocket scientist, great guy. But I
(11:46):
also worked for a volunteer chairman Edwards. But so you
learn to balance those things. I would find things that
I learned in the craft and in scouting applied directly
to what I was doing, and higher, ed there's twelve
points of the scout law. I would just print those
out and I would have those either you know, on
my Boeton board or on my desk, because to me,
(12:07):
they were like guideposts of how I could, you know,
navigate the system. But that comes a time when you
know you're you know, it's time to change, and I
had done you know, I couldn't go any higher. I
was one of the university officers. I would tell somebody,
if you want to know what my job is, I said,
if you ever look at your diploma, said, you know
those signatures on the bottom of them. Yeah, I was
(12:29):
one of those guys. So my name's on thousands of diplomas.
The autograph, yeah, my autograph. So I'll cap the story
off a little bit with one one personal story. My daughter,
she graduated high school, went to our local community college,
and I was on the board of that community college
and I was chairman, and so I got to sign
her diploma as chair That's awesome. She transferred to the
(12:52):
University of Illinois, got her undergraduate degree, and I got
to sign her diploma. She stayed, got her g graduate
degree and I signed that diploma. So dad got to
sign three college diplomas for his daughter. And that's I
don't know the very many people ever get to do that.
Speaker 3 (13:08):
Most of us just get to pay for them. We
don't get to sign them.
Speaker 4 (13:11):
So yeah, that's right. I'm still paying on all that.
Don't get me wrong.
Speaker 3 (13:39):
This is the coolest thing. It was a few months ago.
I was on my lunch break. I'm scrolling through my
phone on LinkedIn and I see this post from breg
Not and he's talking about and it was this rather
lengthy post. I opened it up and I'm reading all
of this and one of the quotes that stuck to
me had just jumped out and said, I left working
the forty hour plus week job and retired about eighteen
(14:00):
months ago and became a substitute teacher for Saint Joseph
Ogden High School in Illinois. What compelled you to do
that after thirty five years, as you said, at the
University of Illinois, to go back to the classroom.
Speaker 4 (14:12):
I attended Saint Joe Ogden. We're a very small rural
school in east central Illinois, about four hundred and fifty
high school students. And when I was in high school,
always want to be a high school teacher, a history teacher.
Just for whatever reason, I got onto other things in
my career, and so that, you know, that always kind
of was still there in my mind. You know, as
I was winding down those thirty five years, I was like, well,
(14:34):
what in the world am I going to do? You know,
it's you listen off all this stuff. I'm involved mysonically,
but I'm like, what about the daytime? You know, I
got to have something to do with the ore of
the day. And you know, it just clicked one day
I was like, well what am I thinking. I think
I'd read somewhere about the need for substitute teachers, and
I contacted our school district and they're like, yeah, we'd
love to have you. So in Illinois, you you need
(14:55):
a four year degree, you get a teaching subst sub license,
and so they have me. So I retired on April thirty,
and by May second of that of twenty three, I
had already substitute taught, you know. And so because I
told m I one to see if it was for me.
(15:16):
And it was funny, it was just like, in some ways,
I felt like I'd never left. And then I remembered
all those positive influences though teachers had on me that
directly correlated to the success I had, and I'm like,
you know, maybe there's a little bit I can do
to still help my home school district and to become
a sub So it was just that that long term
(15:39):
desire and love of education I think was my core motivation.
Speaker 3 (15:43):
Maybe the listener heard, oh school teacher, he teaches history. No,
he's a substitute. And I think about it this way,
like I remember when I was a kid, especially in
high school. Oh yeah, if we knew we had a
substitute teacher, that's like a free day in class, Like
we weren't doing anything absolutely, so has that changed?
Speaker 4 (16:00):
No, No, No, it's just I spent a big chunk
of my career I always had an HR role in
that aspect. You learn a lot about people. And probably
the other thing was I can't imagine they could do
anything that we didn't do maybe forty years ago. And
we could talk about change in a minute here. But
I told the school and said let me. It was
(16:21):
at the end of a schooler said let me do
a couple of days, make sure this is for me,
and I was like, well, it's fine. You know, we've
got a good school district. And you know. The key is,
like any meeting, there has to be an agenda, in
this case a lesson plan, and you have to execute
it as long as you keep control of the classroom
and things like that. And I'm not afraid to speak up.
(16:43):
You know it goes well. And so I've had an
extremely positive experience. I'm now in my third parts of
my third school year of doing it.
Speaker 3 (16:50):
Take me through an average date, like you have a
set schedule. I'm guessing it's you know, three days a
week or four days or however many, and then what
you get a phone call in the morning that says,
be at the school and you're teaching this today. Is
it just that simple?
Speaker 4 (17:02):
It is? And so two things are some they'll they'll
know some teachers are going to be gone in advance,
like for example, I helped cover the agriculture classes. They
do a lot of things with the FFA, which is
the youth group, and so they know that the teacher
knows she's going to be gone to contests, so those
will be known, they'll be scheduled. And the course, there's
the other days, like you say, it's like, hey, somebody
(17:22):
called in sick today, can you come cover? So the
full time teacher's responsibility is to leave a lesson plan
for the sub You know, I always get there early
because I want to make sure technology works. I want
to make sure, you know, I read through the lesson
plan and you know, I've done it so many times now.
The kids they know me, even though I may I
float around, you know, different topics. But you know, some
(17:44):
days it may be as simple as we're showing the movie.
Other days were engaged. We had a couple of days
we were doing parliamentary procedure with the FFA kids, and
so well, gee, that's no different run of a Masonic meeting, right.
I engage the kids. I asked them questions. You know
a lot of them, I know their parents, but I'm
curious about what do they think? You know, what do
(18:06):
you learn it? And there's some you know, they're struggling.
They probably don't want to be there in particular, but
I try to get them to open up a little bit,
you know, in that short period of time I have
with them. And the key is with anything is to
talk to them. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (18:20):
The reception that you get from them, because I mean,
well you're talking. I'm thinking my son is a senior
in high school. He'll graduate this may. There's a few
times that I walk into that school and I'm like, wow,
it's like walking into a time machine. I didn't go
to that school. But they all kind of have this
like still they look the same from like the eighties
movies that we might remember. I have found the kids
(18:43):
are different, and I'm like, well, maybe it's because I'm
getting older and they're afraid to talk to me, But
what are those conversations like with young people these days?
Speaker 4 (18:51):
You hit it right on the head. It is different
as much as it is the same. It's still different.
You know. One of the reasons I want to engage
them is because I believe verbal communication is so important
now we spend so many time, so much time on
devices and things. That was one of the early things
(19:12):
I noticed. What was the difference. I literally graduated forty
years ago, So what is that, you know, I mean,
classrooms are pretty much the same. We've had a couple
of new additions, and you know, still feels the same
to me. School day is pretty similar, but the learning
environment is different, the kids environment is different, their home
home environment is different. A lot of that has been
(19:33):
influenced by technology schools in across the country today. Most
of them have a no cell phone policy. Now that
can vary in enforcement from hey, just keep it in
your pocket to you can't even bring it in the building.
In our case, the kids have them. It's a constant,
you know, case of me reminded them to put them away,
(19:54):
which you know, that's just part of it. But what
I what I get concerned about is and I'm just
as guilty, you know, I'm including myself. We spend so
much time I get concerned about the ability to interact
with each other. Now that's not saying they don't because
they do, and they're giggling in the hallways and all
(20:15):
that's the same. But a lot of their communication because
they're texting. Because a lot of times we get done early.
I'm like, okay, and get your cell phones out, and
it's like a race to open up whatever app they're using.
But that's how they're communicating. I see. The learning style
is different. That's funny. One of the first times I
went into a classroom and I had been in this
(20:37):
classroom as a student, I'm like, oh, well that, you know,
chalkboard's now a whiteboard. That's good. Well, they don't use
a whiteboard anymore because there's a big TV monitor in
front of it because everything's online now, you know, students
students today, at least, you know, from what I'm familiar with,
there are lesson plans maybe on Google classroom, you know.
So we come in, we open that up and and
(21:00):
I'm telling them put away their phone, and the next
sentence out of my mouth is get your grown book out.
And it's not worse, it's just different than forty years ago.
But what I get concerned about is that ability to
one to one interact with each other, you know, on
an interpersonal basis that I can send you an emoji
on a text of a smile or a frown, but
(21:21):
it's different than when I can see your eyes and
read your you know, your personal action or reaction to
our conversation. And that's one of the biggest things I
think over time. You know, educators have had to learn
how to use technology too, you know, not just how
to open up the device, but their teaching style is different.
(21:42):
It has to be, and in many ways the students
can benefit from the technology. All the information of the
world is there. And I saw this quote the other
day that really hit home with me. We're training them
how to go look up the information. You know, it's limitless, right,
you know, Google, chat, g or whatever you use, But
do they know how to use it. One of my
(22:05):
degrees I got was in library and information science, so
always I knew how to research, or I do know
how to research, and then I know how to apply it.
And it's so easy today to look up something. Okay,
one of my funniest examples is we were doing a
feed ration for an animal science project in myClass. I thought, oh, yeah,
I've done these, well, yeah, forty years ago. They couldn't
(22:27):
use Google, but I could. I opened up chat GPT.
In this case, I asked how do the equation? Popped
it out. We worked through the worksheet. I guess my
point is learning is there. I worry about fundamentals. I
worry about the stress and the anxiety, especially that come
from devices. When I talked to school administrators, when I
(22:47):
talked to our school teachers, they see the stress and
the kids. I see the stress in the kids. The
anxiety levels today. I don't have a way to measure
it from forty years ago, but my perception is they're
much higher. I think the pressure they're also underto perform,
you know, for us, it's like hope you graduate, you know,
and if you don't, we'll probably past you. We'll pass
(23:09):
you along, right pretty much. Well, today, you know, the
state and the public is demanding, you know, accountability more
in the schools, and that's a whole topic itself. But
all of that pressure and anxiety is both on the
students and on the teachers. It's more so, and I
think it's more intense than it was in my era.
Speaker 3 (23:54):
I want to talk about this because I see this
with my son as well, and I'm like Wow, how
fortunate you are to live in an era where if
you ever had a question for anything, you can just
open up this little device in your pocket and instantly know.
Like you, as you were saying, you can know anything.
But there's massive things that he doesn't have that I
(24:15):
did when I was his age, and one of them
are like these they call them soft skills now, the
personal interaction skills, And it's really interesting to watch him,
I feel like sometimes struggle to interact with other adults
or even kids that he doesn't know in unfamiliar settings
because again, they're just kind of not used to being
in that world where that was all we did growing
(24:38):
up in the eighties and nineties.
Speaker 4 (24:40):
What we have, you know, the set of encyclopedias that
may have been out in the hallway that you run
out your reference that was our internet, so we had
no choice but to interact. I know what I see
teachers doing today, though, is they're trying to do group
projects all the time within the classroom to get the
students to interact. They're still using the computer, but it's fine,
(25:01):
you know, and there's there's a concerted effort to make
sure they're engaging with each other. You know more and more.
But that's only at school. The kids that go home
and you know, can immediately get on the devices, and
it's the collective of all that that's the anxiety.
Speaker 3 (25:17):
I want to talk about the conversations. I'm wondering what
it's like from what you discuss in the teacher's lounge
to the lune parking lot conversations that you may have.
Do any of those crossover they do?
Speaker 4 (25:31):
You know, One good example I had was I was
in a i think a history class or social studies whatever.
We're talking about town history. But somehow one of the
students asked me goes essentially his question was what was
it like with growing up without technology? It's like he
knew he was missing out on something, you know, and
whatever that was, you know, the personal interactions and all that.
(25:53):
So they're very cognizant of what in a sense they've
had to give up in terms of those you know,
different kind of relationships and we had in the eighties
and nineties untill today. And so yeah, that's you know,
that's a parking lot kind of style conversation. And you know,
that was like off the whatever the lesson plan was
that day. But I just I thought it was so
(26:15):
insightful that the student or too, they recognized it. And
then when we talked about it with others in there,
I could see the headshake and they didn't say much,
but I could I could see they they knew. I
didn't know what it was they were missing, you know, exactly,
but but like that, you know how their parents grew
up versus how they grew up, but they knew it
was different.
Speaker 3 (26:34):
I've thought a lot about it in life. I've wanted
to go back and become an adjunct professor at one
of the community colleges in my area. Hasn't happened, and
I keep applying, but they want this thing called experience.
It's like trying to get credit. How do you get
teaching credit without getting a chance to teach. It's it
can be a little frustrating, but the idea of being
a substitute teacher in as a retirement career. I think
(26:56):
about that as well. In the mornings when I see
the school bus go down the street and it's you
usually driven by you know, a retired gentleman who's this
is his thing. He brings the kids safely to school
every day. I don't think a lot of folks think
about that as an option, either one as a part
time job that they can do or two as a
part time job but also as a full time way
(27:17):
to give back.
Speaker 4 (27:17):
To the community.
Speaker 3 (27:18):
So what advice would you give or what words do
you have to share it to someone listening to this
episode that's thinking I never thought about this.
Speaker 4 (27:26):
I think one, if you have an interest in young people,
if you have an interest in education the schools, every
school needs substitutes, and what you contribute by relieving the
teacher of their duty for that day to maybe go
on that field trip or whatever, you're directly contributing to
the success of those students. And to me, that's the
(27:48):
whole motivating factor. It's such an easy way to give back.
It's not for everybody, but I think if you have
any desire to see what's going on in classroom today
with all theism of public schools, you'll be surprised that
it's way different than probably what you're hearing on social
media and other places. And it's a wonderful way to
(28:09):
get back to the young people because we're helping shape
them like other people help shape you. And you know,
if it's not for you, you can try it for
a while and leave. That's the beauty of it. It's
very flexible and it pays okay, but it's it's it's
the joy of walking through a University of Illinois football
(28:30):
game tailgate hearing my name across the parking lot and
it was one of the kids I've got in the classroom.
Speaker 2 (28:38):
I want to thank my guest again this week for
popping on with us, Worshipful brother Greg Notts. If you've
enjoyed this episode of the Craftsman Online podcast, you can
open up that player. Oh yeah, go ahead and click
follow on Spotify, subscribe on Apple Podcasts. That will you
get the freshest episode every Monday morning. And if you've
really enjoyed this podcast, man, you can do me a
favor right now. Let a friend or brother know your
(29:00):
review helps them connect with this podcast. I'm right worship
for brother Michael Arsay. I always enjoy our time together.
Already looking forward to the episode that we have planned
for you next week. Until then, let peace and harmony prevail.
The Commons. Opinions and views shared during this program are
of those individual Freemasons and do not reflect the official
position of a Grand Launch, Concordant Body, a pendant Body,
a Masonic authority, or Craftsman Online dot com.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
Hey, welcome back to the Craftsman Online Podcast, the only
Masonic podcast.
Speaker 3 (00:32):
Endorsed by the Grand Lodge of New York. I'm your host, Wright,
worshipful Brother Michael.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Arsa and a cool episode this week is we get
to the classroom and we talk a little bit about
how Masons served their community by helping the next generation.
A very interesting episode as we get into it with
a brother that has a lot of Masonic titles. He's
a past master, he's a shriner, he's a thirty third
(00:55):
degree Scottish write. Illustrious brother, worshipful not and close friend
of mine. Welcome to the Craftsman Online Podcast.
Speaker 4 (01:04):
My brother Michael, great to be with you. Like you say,
those titles, they're important part of the craft. But that's
enough of them. Deal.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
I love brother too, but you have such an illustrious background,
past master, shriner, You're an Illinois and a DC Freemason,
Naval Launch. Love that we mentioned the thirty third degree Scottishred.
But there's one accomplishment that you have listed on your
resume that it always makes me smile when I hear it,
and that's Eagle Scout. Take us back to the days
(01:34):
of scouting and how that kind of you know, crafted
your life to become a freemason.
Speaker 4 (01:38):
Well, there's a direct correlation. You know. I was in
scouting as a Cub Scout, came up into boy Scouts,
as you say, I were in the Eagle Scout, and
you know, I'm probably more proud of it today than
I was then, because I think with time you appreciate more.
But as I looked back, all of those experiences in
scouting directly shaped who I am today. And the correlation
(02:02):
between freemasonry and scouting. There's so much, you know, you
could do entire episodes, but the value system is very
much the same. And it's funny. I really wasn't in Scouts,
you know. I aged out as a youth, and then
my own son he joined Cub Scouts, and so I
came through with him in the last few years and
he is also an Eagle Scout and earned out about
(02:23):
three years ago, and he aged out, But I stuck around.
So I'm still involved to this day and I'm on
the council board, you know, which is the governing board
for our area. So it's just I so believe in
the movement of Scouting that I just I don't see
me ever not being involved in It's it's actually why
(02:43):
I became a Freemason in a sense, because I missed
a lot of those things that we did in scouting.
You know, it's Scouting is similar to freemasonry, and that
there's so many things you can learn. It's how you
apply yourself and you create your own path in a sense,
and that's you know, those value systems I think are
more needed now than ever.
Speaker 3 (03:04):
I wish that I had stuck with scouting. I think
I did it for like one weekend. And when I
was growing up, scouting was for camping, very outdoors people,
which I am not one of. And that continues to
this day where you know, for me, roughing it is,
you know, the fourth floor of the Hilton. When you
talk about all of the other things with scouting, the
(03:25):
kind of the introduction to like what it means to
be a brother, a friend, to be a trusted member
in society, to think about your community first, to have
a love for country. Yeah, those things are ingrained in freemasonry.
Some of them we do talk about, but it all
starts there. The seed for it is in the Scouts.
Speaker 4 (03:43):
The seed is there. And if you think about at
least in Scouting especially, we talk about this is character development.
Is that, especially when you're a youth. You know, there's
so many things you can be influenced by, and we
hope that Scouting does a positive influence. I've seen it
first the kids who were in my den, my Tiger Din,
which is the beginning for Cub Scouts. Today, they've all
(04:07):
a lot of them graduating college now and they're engineers
and they're you know, they're in the trades, and but
you know, they're still all upstanding, great kids without adults.
And I see that influence. And I see the same
thing in the craft. You know, there's a lot of
men sometimes when you knock on that door, you're not
exactly sure why, but you just over time you learn more,
(04:29):
you apply it more. You have positive influences of the
multi generations and things, of course, and I think we're
also a character development organization.
Speaker 3 (04:37):
Now you are one of the brothers who I feel
like I've known for some time, we've never met in person.
I think this is the extent with computer screens and
technology today. I hear your voice with the podcast that
Meet Act and part with Brother Darren. I've always wondered,
and we were talking about a dear friend of ours,
brother RJ. You know how you're able to do all
of the things that you do in freemasonry and still
(05:01):
be able to do things like scouting and be involved
in the community.
Speaker 4 (05:04):
I've always been very calendar oriented, and so even in
my career, I really didn't like anybody else control of
my calendar because that meant I could do more things
if I was controlling, you know, to a reasonable degree
to do it. And so I just I've been always
one of those I even look back to my scouting career,
I was the same, you know, I was. I knew
(05:25):
how long it took to get from say, one rank
to another, and what I needed to do in there,
and I just I planned it accordingly. And in many
ways my career reflected those kind of same kind of skills,
and so I was a good multitasker. You could you
could also maybe attributed to I have so many interests
to keep my my boredom level in check, and so
(05:48):
I think that's part of it, and it's just, you know,
I know limits though within things as well. You know,
I don't aspire to be in grand lines or any
of those. I've not done any of that because for me,
I'd rather do it locally and then that means I
can have actually I think more of an impact locally
than you can, and other things other people excel at that.
Speaker 3 (06:10):
Yeah, You've got a really interesting background and we're going
to get to it on this episode.
Speaker 4 (06:13):
I know.
Speaker 3 (06:14):
The episode title says why I retired and became a
substitute teacher, and we'll get to that, trust me.
Speaker 4 (06:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (06:20):
Yeah, going back to Scouts and that calling for public
service and helping other people, is that what kind of
planted the seeds again back when you were young to
get into education and teaching.
Speaker 4 (06:32):
No question, public service has been a hobby, an aspiration,
something I've spent thousands of hours on. And it's just
I think when I grew up, most of my role
models were World War Two, the greatest generation folks men
and women both both especially my relatives. I saw them
serve on, including my dad though he was the next generation.
(06:56):
But library boards and village boards and townships and forest
preserve boards and all that, and just I just thought,
that's just what you did. I just saw it as
a sense of duty. And you know, when I look
at the craft, I see all the things that we
can learn in a lawge room. But to me, if
we don't take those out and externally apply them in
(07:16):
whatever way that you know, find is you can do
it in the community, I think it's a lost opportunity.
We talk a lot about citizenship and scouting, and there's
no question that had a huge impact on me. One
of the things you do as an Eagle Scout as
an Eagle Scout project. And so my project, which is
really the capstone of your youth scouting career, was I
(07:41):
planned and we created this marker which was a tribute
to Abraham Lincoln on a on a trail at a
state park here in Illinois, and it was just it
was fascinating to learn about his history he had. He
had a local connection in my area here in Illinois,
and I just think it's a sense that you can
help the community and you can accomplish something. You know, again,
(08:02):
at the local level, I'm on a forest preserve board now,
so we have several properties in our county, and I
can see tangibly the work we do as a board
helps the environment, helps the public. They get out and
they recreate in our public spaces and all that kind
of stuff. And I guess, I guess if I had
a wish, I wish more people would be involved into it,
(08:23):
that would be you know, I know not everybody's wired
like I am, but there's so many places you can
contribute in. Public service doesn't have to be on a
governing board. Our communities need you.
Speaker 3 (08:35):
I've known you from our days back with the Midnight Freemasons.
That was before the COVID pandemic. I'm like, well, finally
somebody that I knew before COVID. I also know you
as one of my Midwest brothers, as you mentioned Illinois.
And it's interesting in the craft, you meet these men
and you're like, oh, cool, we are like minded. We
have a lot we called a public service, for example,
(08:55):
involved with our community, involved with our lodge. We love
this craft. And then you start connecting with him outside
and in a personal level, and on LinkedIn, I was like, wow,
he works for the University of Illinois. He's really involved there.
So tell us a little bit about your time and
hire ed before we get to why you left it
to become a public school teacher.
Speaker 4 (09:15):
You've heard the term military brat. M I think I
was a higher ed brat in a sense. So I
grew up only ten miles from the University of Illinois.
My mom and dad worked there, my grandfather attended there,
my great grandfather attended there, and there's just always been
all these family connections, and so I think it was
natural that I had this interest in education, and so
(09:38):
I was drawn to higher education. I worked on the
grounds crew, I worked on the farm. You worked in
the retirement system part of it. And it was an amazing
career because each step I got to do more and
more things, and I traveled overseas, went to China, help
recruit students, capped it out with I was secretary for
(09:59):
the Order Trustees for the University of Illinois system, which
is we have three campuses of Springfield, Chicago, and or
Bannon's the Big ten university. But it was just you know, again,
I was always fascinated with learning. I think I think
that was the key that's always kept me going. You know,
I got to guest lecture. I was not a faculty member.
I was always an administrator. You know. It's funny you
(10:20):
can go from one job, one career, to the other,
but you're still all within the same you know, family,
so to speak. And I just that the people I
got to work with PhD is some of the smartest
people in the world. And one of my units that
I worked in food science and human Nutrition, we ran
a cafe, and so every day I would eat lunch
(10:41):
in this cafe. And the conversations you could have with
just anybody from the university president to you know, the
youngest faculty member to a graduate student to an undergrad
you know, and and hearing what their stories were and
what they were trying to accomplish or had already impacted
(11:02):
in many cases, to me that that was exciting. I
spent thirty five years in all those roles. It's funny.
My last role as Secretary of the university, it was
I took it on, you know, a while before COVID,
and so I had to as many people. I managed COVID,
and so my job was to manage the board of trustees.
So I arranged the meeting. I went through the agendas
(11:25):
with them. I dually reported to the university president and
to the board chair. You know, it's interesting with trustees.
They're volunteers. You know, they're appointed by the governor in
our state, but they're volunteers. They're not paid. So you know,
in one case, I worked with literally a rocket scientist,
President Clean is a rocket scientist, great guy. But I
(11:46):
also worked for a volunteer chairman Edwards. But so you
learn to balance those things. I would find things that
I learned in the craft and in scouting applied directly
to what I was doing, and higher, ed there's twelve
points of the scout law. I would just print those
out and I would have those either you know, on
my Boeton board or on my desk, because to me,
(12:07):
they were like guideposts of how I could, you know,
navigate the system. But that comes a time when you
know you're you know, it's time to change, and I
had done you know, I couldn't go any higher. I
was one of the university officers. I would tell somebody,
if you want to know what my job is, I said,
if you ever look at your diploma, said, you know
those signatures on the bottom of them. Yeah, I was
(12:29):
one of those guys. So my name's on thousands of diplomas.
The autograph, yeah, my autograph. So I'll cap the story
off a little bit with one one personal story. My daughter,
she graduated high school, went to our local community college,
and I was on the board of that community college
and I was chairman, and so I got to sign
her diploma as chair That's awesome. She transferred to the
(12:52):
University of Illinois, got her undergraduate degree, and I got
to sign her diploma. She stayed, got her g graduate
degree and I signed that diploma. So dad got to
sign three college diplomas for his daughter. And that's I
don't know the very many people ever get to do that.
Speaker 3 (13:08):
Most of us just get to pay for them. We
don't get to sign them.
Speaker 4 (13:11):
So yeah, that's right. I'm still paying on all that.
Don't get me wrong.
Speaker 3 (13:39):
This is the coolest thing. It was a few months ago.
I was on my lunch break. I'm scrolling through my
phone on LinkedIn and I see this post from breg
Not and he's talking about and it was this rather
lengthy post. I opened it up and I'm reading all
of this and one of the quotes that stuck to
me had just jumped out and said, I left working
the forty hour plus week job and retired about eighteen
(14:00):
months ago and became a substitute teacher for Saint Joseph
Ogden High School in Illinois. What compelled you to do
that after thirty five years, as you said, at the
University of Illinois, to go back to the classroom.
Speaker 4 (14:12):
I attended Saint Joe Ogden. We're a very small rural
school in east central Illinois, about four hundred and fifty
high school students. And when I was in high school,
always want to be a high school teacher, a history teacher.
Just for whatever reason, I got onto other things in
my career, and so that, you know, that always kind
of was still there in my mind. You know, as
I was winding down those thirty five years, I was like, well,
(14:34):
what in the world am I going to do? You know,
it's you listen off all this stuff. I'm involved mysonically,
but I'm like, what about the daytime? You know, I
got to have something to do with the ore of
the day. And you know, it just clicked one day
I was like, well what am I thinking. I think
I'd read somewhere about the need for substitute teachers, and
I contacted our school district and they're like, yeah, we'd
love to have you. So in Illinois, you you need
(14:55):
a four year degree, you get a teaching subst sub license,
and so they have me. So I retired on April thirty,
and by May second of that of twenty three, I
had already substitute taught, you know. And so because I
told m I one to see if it was for me.
(15:16):
And it was funny, it was just like, in some ways,
I felt like I'd never left. And then I remembered
all those positive influences though teachers had on me that
directly correlated to the success I had, and I'm like,
you know, maybe there's a little bit I can do
to still help my home school district and to become
a sub So it was just that that long term
(15:39):
desire and love of education I think was my core motivation.
Speaker 3 (15:43):
Maybe the listener heard, oh school teacher, he teaches history. No,
he's a substitute. And I think about it this way,
like I remember when I was a kid, especially in
high school. Oh yeah, if we knew we had a
substitute teacher, that's like a free day in class, Like
we weren't doing anything absolutely, so has that changed?
Speaker 4 (16:00):
No, No, No, it's just I spent a big chunk
of my career I always had an HR role in
that aspect. You learn a lot about people. And probably
the other thing was I can't imagine they could do
anything that we didn't do maybe forty years ago. And
we could talk about change in a minute here. But
I told the school and said let me. It was
(16:21):
at the end of a schooler said let me do
a couple of days, make sure this is for me,
and I was like, well, it's fine. You know, we've
got a good school district. And you know. The key is,
like any meeting, there has to be an agenda, in
this case a lesson plan, and you have to execute
it as long as you keep control of the classroom
and things like that. And I'm not afraid to speak up.
(16:43):
You know it goes well. And so I've had an
extremely positive experience. I'm now in my third parts of
my third school year of doing it.
Speaker 3 (16:50):
Take me through an average date, like you have a
set schedule. I'm guessing it's you know, three days a
week or four days or however many, and then what
you get a phone call in the morning that says,
be at the school and you're teaching this today. Is
it just that simple?
Speaker 4 (17:02):
It is? And so two things are some they'll they'll
know some teachers are going to be gone in advance,
like for example, I helped cover the agriculture classes. They
do a lot of things with the FFA, which is
the youth group, and so they know that the teacher
knows she's going to be gone to contests, so those
will be known, they'll be scheduled. And the course, there's
the other days, like you say, it's like, hey, somebody
(17:22):
called in sick today, can you come cover? So the
full time teacher's responsibility is to leave a lesson plan
for the sub You know, I always get there early
because I want to make sure technology works. I want
to make sure, you know, I read through the lesson
plan and you know, I've done it so many times now.
The kids they know me, even though I may I
float around, you know, different topics. But you know, some
(17:44):
days it may be as simple as we're showing the movie.
Other days were engaged. We had a couple of days
we were doing parliamentary procedure with the FFA kids, and
so well, gee, that's no different run of a Masonic meeting, right.
I engage the kids. I asked them questions. You know
a lot of them, I know their parents, but I'm
curious about what do they think? You know, what do
(18:06):
you learn it? And there's some you know, they're struggling.
They probably don't want to be there in particular, but
I try to get them to open up a little bit,
you know, in that short period of time I have
with them. And the key is with anything is to
talk to them. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (18:20):
The reception that you get from them, because I mean,
well you're talking. I'm thinking my son is a senior
in high school. He'll graduate this may. There's a few
times that I walk into that school and I'm like, wow,
it's like walking into a time machine. I didn't go
to that school. But they all kind of have this
like still they look the same from like the eighties
movies that we might remember. I have found the kids
(18:43):
are different, and I'm like, well, maybe it's because I'm
getting older and they're afraid to talk to me, But
what are those conversations like with young people these days?
Speaker 4 (18:51):
You hit it right on the head. It is different
as much as it is the same. It's still different.
You know. One of the reasons I want to engage
them is because I believe verbal communication is so important
now we spend so many time, so much time on
devices and things. That was one of the early things
(19:12):
I noticed. What was the difference. I literally graduated forty
years ago, So what is that, you know, I mean,
classrooms are pretty much the same. We've had a couple
of new additions, and you know, still feels the same
to me. School day is pretty similar, but the learning
environment is different, the kids environment is different, their home
home environment is different. A lot of that has been
(19:33):
influenced by technology schools in across the country today. Most
of them have a no cell phone policy. Now that
can vary in enforcement from hey, just keep it in
your pocket to you can't even bring it in the building.
In our case, the kids have them. It's a constant,
you know, case of me reminded them to put them away,
(19:54):
which you know, that's just part of it. But what
I what I get concerned about is and I'm just
as guilty, you know, I'm including myself. We spend so
much time I get concerned about the ability to interact
with each other. Now that's not saying they don't because
they do, and they're giggling in the hallways and all
(20:15):
that's the same. But a lot of their communication because
they're texting. Because a lot of times we get done early.
I'm like, okay, and get your cell phones out, and
it's like a race to open up whatever app they're using.
But that's how they're communicating. I see. The learning style
is different. That's funny. One of the first times I
went into a classroom and I had been in this
(20:37):
classroom as a student, I'm like, oh, well that, you know,
chalkboard's now a whiteboard. That's good. Well, they don't use
a whiteboard anymore because there's a big TV monitor in
front of it because everything's online now, you know, students
students today, at least, you know, from what I'm familiar with,
there are lesson plans maybe on Google classroom, you know.
So we come in, we open that up and and
(21:00):
I'm telling them put away their phone, and the next
sentence out of my mouth is get your grown book out.
And it's not worse, it's just different than forty years ago.
But what I get concerned about is that ability to
one to one interact with each other, you know, on
an interpersonal basis that I can send you an emoji
on a text of a smile or a frown, but
(21:21):
it's different than when I can see your eyes and
read your you know, your personal action or reaction to
our conversation. And that's one of the biggest things I
think over time. You know, educators have had to learn
how to use technology too, you know, not just how
to open up the device, but their teaching style is different.
(21:42):
It has to be, and in many ways the students
can benefit from the technology. All the information of the
world is there. And I saw this quote the other
day that really hit home with me. We're training them
how to go look up the information. You know, it's limitless, right,
you know, Google, chat, g or whatever you use, But
do they know how to use it. One of my
(22:05):
degrees I got was in library and information science, so
always I knew how to research, or I do know
how to research, and then I know how to apply it.
And it's so easy today to look up something. Okay,
one of my funniest examples is we were doing a
feed ration for an animal science project in myClass. I thought, oh, yeah,
I've done these, well, yeah, forty years ago. They couldn't
(22:27):
use Google, but I could. I opened up chat GPT.
In this case, I asked how do the equation? Popped
it out. We worked through the worksheet. I guess my
point is learning is there. I worry about fundamentals. I
worry about the stress and the anxiety, especially that come
from devices. When I talked to school administrators, when I
(22:47):
talked to our school teachers, they see the stress and
the kids. I see the stress in the kids. The
anxiety levels today. I don't have a way to measure
it from forty years ago, but my perception is they're
much higher. I think the pressure they're also underto perform,
you know, for us, it's like hope you graduate, you know,
and if you don't, we'll probably past you. We'll pass
(23:09):
you along, right pretty much. Well, today, you know, the
state and the public is demanding, you know, accountability more
in the schools, and that's a whole topic itself. But
all of that pressure and anxiety is both on the
students and on the teachers. It's more so, and I
think it's more intense than it was in my era.
Speaker 3 (23:54):
I want to talk about this because I see this
with my son as well, and I'm like Wow, how
fortunate you are to live in an era where if
you ever had a question for anything, you can just
open up this little device in your pocket and instantly know.
Like you, as you were saying, you can know anything.
But there's massive things that he doesn't have that I
(24:15):
did when I was his age, and one of them
are like these they call them soft skills now, the
personal interaction skills, And it's really interesting to watch him,
I feel like sometimes struggle to interact with other adults
or even kids that he doesn't know in unfamiliar settings
because again, they're just kind of not used to being
in that world where that was all we did growing
(24:38):
up in the eighties and nineties.
Speaker 4 (24:40):
What we have, you know, the set of encyclopedias that
may have been out in the hallway that you run
out your reference that was our internet, so we had
no choice but to interact. I know what I see
teachers doing today, though, is they're trying to do group
projects all the time within the classroom to get the
students to interact. They're still using the computer, but it's fine,
(25:01):
you know, and there's there's a concerted effort to make
sure they're engaging with each other. You know more and more.
But that's only at school. The kids that go home
and you know, can immediately get on the devices, and
it's the collective of all that that's the anxiety.
Speaker 3 (25:17):
I want to talk about the conversations. I'm wondering what
it's like from what you discuss in the teacher's lounge
to the lune parking lot conversations that you may have.
Do any of those crossover they do?
Speaker 4 (25:31):
You know, One good example I had was I was
in a i think a history class or social studies whatever.
We're talking about town history. But somehow one of the
students asked me goes essentially his question was what was
it like with growing up without technology? It's like he
knew he was missing out on something, you know, and
whatever that was, you know, the personal interactions and all that.
(25:53):
So they're very cognizant of what in a sense they've
had to give up in terms of those you know,
different kind of relationships and we had in the eighties
and nineties untill today. And so yeah, that's you know,
that's a parking lot kind of style conversation. And you know,
that was like off the whatever the lesson plan was
that day. But I just I thought it was so
(26:15):
insightful that the student or too, they recognized it. And
then when we talked about it with others in there,
I could see the headshake and they didn't say much,
but I could I could see they they knew. I
didn't know what it was they were missing, you know, exactly,
but but like that, you know how their parents grew
up versus how they grew up, but they knew it
was different.
Speaker 3 (26:34):
I've thought a lot about it in life. I've wanted
to go back and become an adjunct professor at one
of the community colleges in my area. Hasn't happened, and
I keep applying, but they want this thing called experience.
It's like trying to get credit. How do you get
teaching credit without getting a chance to teach. It's it
can be a little frustrating, but the idea of being
a substitute teacher in as a retirement career. I think
(26:56):
about that as well. In the mornings when I see
the school bus go down the street and it's you
usually driven by you know, a retired gentleman who's this
is his thing. He brings the kids safely to school
every day. I don't think a lot of folks think
about that as an option, either one as a part
time job that they can do or two as a
part time job but also as a full time way
(27:17):
to give back.
Speaker 4 (27:17):
To the community.
Speaker 3 (27:18):
So what advice would you give or what words do
you have to share it to someone listening to this
episode that's thinking I never thought about this.
Speaker 4 (27:26):
I think one, if you have an interest in young people,
if you have an interest in education the schools, every
school needs substitutes, and what you contribute by relieving the
teacher of their duty for that day to maybe go
on that field trip or whatever, you're directly contributing to
the success of those students. And to me, that's the
(27:48):
whole motivating factor. It's such an easy way to give back.
It's not for everybody, but I think if you have
any desire to see what's going on in classroom today
with all theism of public schools, you'll be surprised that
it's way different than probably what you're hearing on social
media and other places. And it's a wonderful way to
(28:09):
get back to the young people because we're helping shape
them like other people help shape you. And you know,
if it's not for you, you can try it for
a while and leave. That's the beauty of it. It's
very flexible and it pays okay, but it's it's it's
the joy of walking through a University of Illinois football
(28:30):
game tailgate hearing my name across the parking lot and
it was one of the kids I've got in the classroom.
Speaker 2 (28:38):
I want to thank my guest again this week for
popping on with us, Worshipful brother Greg Notts. If you've
enjoyed this episode of the Craftsman Online podcast, you can
open up that player. Oh yeah, go ahead and click
follow on Spotify, subscribe on Apple Podcasts. That will you
get the freshest episode every Monday morning. And if you've
really enjoyed this podcast, man, you can do me a
favor right now. Let a friend or brother know your
(29:00):
review helps them connect with this podcast. I'm right worship
for brother Michael Arsay. I always enjoy our time together.
Already looking forward to the episode that we have planned
for you next week. Until then, let peace and harmony prevail.
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