March 5, 2025 • 25 mins
Why can some people eat gluten in Europe but struggle with it in the U.S.? With the help of Werner Forster, the co-founder and CEO of Revival Einkorn, Dr. Falquier delves into the fascinating history of wheat, and the nutritional benefits of einkorn wheat. Did you know that einkorn wheat is considered the original wheat, dating back over 10,000 years? Whether you’re gluten-sensitive, a history buff or simply curious about real food and traditional grains, this episode is packed with insights into the past, present and future of wheat.
In this episode you’ll hear:
2:00 – Why can some people eat gluten in Europe and not in the U.S.?
3:00 – What happened to our wheat?
4:40 – Difference between natural fermentation and using yeast?
6:30 – The Werner Forster and Revival Einkorn story.
11:00 – Einkorn vs. modern wheat.
12:45 – Einkorn wheat history.
14:40 – Einkorn wheat benefits.
16:15 – Can someone with Celiac Disease eat einkorn wheat?
17:10 – Can someone gluten sensitive (non-celiac) eat einkorn wheat?
18:00 – How is einkorn wheat grown?
23:00 – Revival Einkorn products.
Guest link: https://revivaleinkorn.com/
Resources
Credits:
Host - Dr. Sabrina Falquier, MD, CCMS, DipABLM
Sound and Editing - Will Crann
Executive Producer - Esther Garfin
©2025 Alternative Food Network Inc.
In this episode you’ll hear:
2:00 – Why can some people eat gluten in Europe and not in the U.S.?
3:00 – What happened to our wheat?
4:40 – Difference between natural fermentation and using yeast?
6:30 – The Werner Forster and Revival Einkorn story.
11:00 – Einkorn vs. modern wheat.
12:45 – Einkorn wheat history.
14:40 – Einkorn wheat benefits.
16:15 – Can someone with Celiac Disease eat einkorn wheat?
17:10 – Can someone gluten sensitive (non-celiac) eat einkorn wheat?
18:00 – How is einkorn wheat grown?
23:00 – Revival Einkorn products.
Guest link: https://revivaleinkorn.com/
Resources
- Delicious Einkorn Pasta Recipe You Need to Try Now!
- Receta Deliciosa de Einkorn pasta que tienes que probar ahorita
Credits:
Host - Dr. Sabrina Falquier, MD, CCMS, DipABLM
Sound and Editing - Will Crann
Executive Producer - Esther Garfin
©2025 Alternative Food Network Inc.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
It's such an incredible story to think that mother Nature
created the first we to create. It was a perfect week,
and it's a bit of a shame that it wasn't intentional,
but the fact that these weats got hybridized and then
all of a sudden, it created this relationship we have
with wheat today where basically causes massive gluten free category
to develop. Discovering that there's actually a wheat that would
solve all these wheat problems and looking at the nutritional
(00:23):
benefits of this week and the flavor, it just was
pretty overwhelming. It it was something we almost felt obligated
to do.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Welcome to Culinary Medicine Recipe. I'm so happy you're here.
I'm your host, doctor Saprina Falke. I was a primary
care doctor for sixteen years and went to school for
four years to specialize in culinary medicine. In this work,
I get to combine my passionate expertise in both medicine
and food to teach people about food is medicine and
to empower them to understand what ingredients optimize health and
(00:53):
also how to cook those ingredients to make delicious meals.
On the show, I interviewed top chefs, doctors, health care visionaries,
and food service professionals who are making great strides in.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
The field of culinary medicine.
Speaker 2 (01:05):
Join me as we continue to explore the amazing world
of culinary medicine, where I will empower you to make
changes to your health and wellness with great food right away.
Have you ever been to Europe and been pleasantly surprised
that you can eat gluten products there like pasta and
bread without feeling bloated or sick. In this episode, we're
(01:25):
going to explain why with Guest Werner Forster, who is
the co founder and CEO of Revival Eincorn. He's on
a mission to bring back eincorn wheat, which is a
certain kind of wheat celebraty for its purity, nutrient density
and yes, easier on digestion. As a bonus, you can
go to Alternative Food Networks YouTube channel to see me
back in the kitchen cookie with Eincorn Pasta, where I've
(01:46):
made a delicious and easy pesta pasta recipe. There's a
video in both English and Spanish for you. Thank you
Warner for joining us today. Will you start by telling
us where are you physically located right now geographically.
Speaker 1 (02:00):
I am in the north of Spain in Billbao, near
the ocean.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
So with that in mind, and with what we're talking
about today, why can some people eat gluten in Europe
but not in the US.
Speaker 1 (02:11):
There's a few reasons, but there's definitely a difference. The
main wheat that's consumed in the US is different than
what's consumed in Europe. We consume a soft wheat. In
the US it's a hard wheat, which works better for
certain baking use, but it's got a stronger gluten, if
you will. There's more glyphysate usage in the US. There's
certain areas in Europe we almost have none, no glyphasaate usage,
(02:34):
which is a definitely contributing factor. And then traditionally people
naturally ferment. When you naturally ferment, you get the results
that help with digestion versus using starters. I mean, depends
on the grains you're eating as well, the types of wheat.
There's quite a different amount of varieties that you consume
both in the US and in Europe. That plays a role.
I mean, that's probably the number one factor. From our perspective.
(02:56):
What we're trying to do is it's such an incredible
story to think that mother Nature created the first we
to create. It was a perfect wheat, and it's a
bit of a shame that it wasn't intentional, but the
fact that these weats got hybridized and then all of
a sudden it created this relationship we have with wheat
today where basically causes massive gluten free category to develop.
You have a lot of young people growing up not
(03:18):
enjoying wheat anymore. They kind of lost that, you know,
when we started this project, one of the things we
realized that there's a sense of nostalgia here as well
to eat wheat. So for us, the beautiful thing is
to be able to bring back Mother Nature's original wheat
and slowly try to do our best in educating people
about it because it is the perfect food and it
is the best thing you could raise your kids on
(03:40):
and you yourself be eating as well.
Speaker 2 (03:42):
So when you're growing hard wheats like we do more
in the US than in Europe, what is that affect
as far as flavor profiles?
Speaker 1 (03:50):
You know, it's folks who come to Europe you always
start to experience the slight differences, you know, maybe the
pasta taste a little different, croissants might taste a little different,
and it's not necessari all, it's just the week. In
the States. You know, the States, you have massive production
for supporting different food systems. I think it has a
little bit to do also with being able to get
(04:11):
the yields, get the cost where you need it to be,
and get plants to be able to produce the product
they need at the volumes they need. That is a
really important part in the background. As a consumer you
really never think about, but that's what affects a lot
of times the ingredients that are in the foods that
we eat. Is try to create something that's tasty, whatever
it is, but then you got to make it work
in the production lines, and that's where you start seeing
(04:33):
these odd ingredients or you know, different choices around ingredients happening.
Speaker 2 (04:40):
Can you describe what is the difference between natural fermentation
like using a starter versus already made yeast and what
does that lead to as far as digestion or availability
of bioonutrients or the gluten itself.
Speaker 1 (04:54):
Yeah, so, I mean yeast I think was innovated in
the late eighteen hundreds, but it was a way to
get what they were looking for back then, they weren't
necessarily looking at the various health aspects of naturally fermenting.
They were just looking again at performance. Because I'm doing
naturally ferment it takes a longer period of time, there's
more risk because I need to get my temperatures right,
I need to get my humidity right, and I'm using
(05:16):
naturally occurring bacteria in my environment. I'm just creating the
conditions for that bacteria to really grow. But it is
more sensitive. There are situations to where it's harder to
control the outcome. So for large scale manufacturing, it's you
want to try to reduce those things that have too
many changing variables. And that's really what thrusted the use
of yeast. Forward, it makes sense. The problem is when
(05:39):
you're using yeast, you're not doing You're not fermenting the
way you need to, especially the period of time required
to actually create those lactic acids and really get that
lack the vacillous population up and convert certain fibers, creating
more prebiotics. I mean, all these things that are super
healthy about naturally fermented breads, if you rent the long
enough period of time, are not happy. And we just
(06:01):
throw east in there and go for a couple hours
and then throw it in the oven. You get the rise,
but you don't get all the other benefits.
Speaker 3 (06:07):
Including the flavor.
Speaker 2 (06:08):
I'm a baker myself, so hearing all this, I recently
baked my starters. I was restarting it accidentally, so I
had to start from scratch.
Speaker 1 (06:16):
Wow, you see right there?
Speaker 3 (06:18):
Yes, easy?
Speaker 2 (06:20):
So all right, I want to dive into your story
because just geographically of being a Southern California born and
raised and traveling in different parts of the world, and
before we get into the eincorn story specifically, I'd love
to hear where where did food come into your existence?
This wanting to go really granular and ultimately leading to
(06:42):
your current work.
Speaker 1 (06:43):
I mean, I've always I grew up I was very
fortunate growing up with a mom was an amazing cook
at home, so you know, I grew up one of
those homes where everything was cooked at home. And then
we had a my mom's from Ecuador, from South America,
and my father's from Germany. We traveled a lot as
a kid, and then growing up in southern California. My
first job outside after university was working at a big
(07:04):
food service distributor, so I had a bunch of restaurants
that were my clients, and then I got into the
natural foods industry. So I've always worked in foods. I've
worked in different facets, from farming organic tropical food bananas
and mangoes in Ecuador and shipping up to Whole Foods
and Trader Joe's and the like, and then farming California
Abalona down in Chile near Patagonia, you know, And that's
(07:26):
all what we processed and shipped to Asia and then
came over to Portugal because as with my wife and I,
we wanted to experience Europe when the kids were still young,
with the idea of maybe returning to California. And I
dabbled a bit in aquaculture, so you know, can we
do aquaculture in Europe and get into sort of an
(07:48):
innovative area, which is land based farming, And then where
are we going to go? Well, Portugal looks like the
California of Europe. It's got kid waves. Let's go check
that out. And literally that's we just arrived, checked out
the coast, decided to move there, and then built up
our activity developing land based aqua farms for dover, soul
and other things just always remain in the food industry,
(08:09):
you know. So I've not really ever worked outside of food.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
So how did then icorn become the one piece that
you wanted to really go into.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
My wife's from Bulgaria, which has to do with why
where we discovered it, right, And when she when I
met her, she had not been in the States too long,
and she was enjoying the palm trees lining Santa Monica
Boulevard and I told her, you know, I'm planning to
move to South America. So anyways, off we went on
this long, you know, tour doing different projects, and along
the way we took a few trips back to Bulgaria.
(08:41):
Having worked in the natural fluze industry, you learn a
lot about nutrition. I worked in dietary seven months for
about seven years. You learn you really learn a lot
about nutrition, right if you're really taking it serious. So
when we discovered eroincorn, we started to research it and
we're pretty blown away. If you read up on eincorn,
it's fascinating. At first, it seems like a little too
much because you're talking about wheat, but the reality is
(09:03):
it's just an incredible story. At many angles, but from
the nutrition standpoint. So having the background that we had
and having experience in launching and developing brands in the
natural products industry, and then discovering that there's actually a
wheat that would solve all these wheat problems and looking
at the nutritional benefits of this week and the flavor,
(09:23):
it just was pretty overwhelming. It was something we almost
help obligated to do, you know. So we started with
us just consuming the wheat. We got rid of all
our other flowers in the house as about twenty years ago,
so my children grew up on iincorn. My wife also
is amazing in the kitchen, loves baking, loves all these things.
So we used it personally for about ten twelve years,
(09:46):
made everything under the sun with it. Then started to
take it a bit more serious and looking at, you know,
the farming side and what varieties we should have and
the genetic purity, and then commissioning some very deep studies
around exact at the molecular level, various components that make
up this week versus other wheats and other drains. And
(10:06):
we've published a book on it called Aincorn Explained. Fun
Reading for the nutritionis or the dietician. But it was
important for us to really develop sort of a scientific
platform that we could communicate from. As we realized along
the way, Wow, this is potentially an important thing we're
going to introduce the industry. You better know what we're
talking about. Type of thing.
Speaker 2 (10:28):
Yes, I have been reading. It's been my bedside reading
for the last couple of months. Is exactly this. Yes,
but I'm one of those people. I'll be reading a
book and learning about different salt crystals and my husband
will laugh. He's like, I'm as enthrall with that as
a murder mistress, Like did you know this?
Speaker 3 (10:46):
So I'm right up your alley.
Speaker 2 (10:48):
So one of the big picture is kind of cliffs
notes version that comes up as hybridized versus non hybridized,
and assuming our listeners don't know anything about those terms,
could you give us a definition or an ex explanation
that might help people understand. Part of the reason that
iincorn is what you chose to really dive personally and
into your work.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
So you're not to confuse with genetically modified you reaction.
You're removing a gene from one plant or our animal
and putting it into another plant or animal. Here, you're
just cross breeding something that typically in nature would never
happen either because they're not endemic in the same location.
Seeing they're not from the same location. So you're taking
a plant or a grass from China and you're crossing
(11:31):
it with a wheat somewhere in Europe. That probably would
never happen in nature, or it's unlikely to happen. But
you're not modifying directly the genetics. It's the entire plants combined.
But they do result in a change in the molecular
structure of many of the components. Now, having said that, though,
depending on the category that you're working with plants, I
(11:51):
you know, stone fruit, avocados versus grasses, versus macrology in
the ocean, when these things cross, they don't necessarily always
have as much of a change occurring. And grass and
wheats are one of those things actually change a lot.
So unfortunately, you know, when they were hybridizing for good reasons,
to try to create wheat that would generate more protein,
(12:12):
more food per acre or per hector, and grow in
a way that was easier to harvest because that back
then they were trying to get more more yield. Well,
they were also dramatically changing the starches and the peptides,
the proteins, the glutens, all these things changed quite a bit.
But you know, that's that's what's you know, we've come
to get to know so well over the last fifty years.
Speaker 3 (12:35):
So tell us about eincorn. Is it hybridized? Is it not?
And what is that? What does that.
Speaker 2 (12:41):
Lead to as far as the quality of the product.
Speaker 1 (12:45):
Yeah, so it's not hybridized. It's the only one that's
not hybridized. Now, there's currently considered to be about four
hundred varieties of incorn. We only know of about twenty
three that are considered genetically pure. So there are some
incorns that might have have some components of other grasses
or wheats. There's some we've trapped in the States, for example,
(13:05):
that have m or it's another type of wheat right,
CoCom is the scientific name. But they can find some
of that in some of the roincorn that you might
have in certain markets or up in Canada as well,
for example. So if you can get genetically per inencoren,
you know that that's never been hybridized and only has
one set of chromosomes, and so it's not it's a
(13:27):
very simple plant, and it's something that us humans have
been consuming for a very long time, so our bodies
are well adapted to digest and assimilate it. Every other
wheat on the planet has had some level of hybridization.
Ninety five percent of what we consume has had enough
of a hybridization to where we have three sets of chromosomes,
and it's that second and third set of chromosomes they're
(13:47):
called BBDD be a little technical, but those are the
ones that really where you find you find the problems basically,
you know. So it's it's very interesting. It breaks down
to the molecular structure of the plant.
Speaker 3 (13:59):
And you mentioned problem.
Speaker 2 (14:00):
So if we're looking at solutions, it sounds like iron
corn is one of those. So what does hybridization due
to the nutrients, the ability to digest, and the flavor
of the wheat.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
So it changes all of those. I think the most
important one, one of the most important ones is the
amount of say, antigens that you find present. And some
of these, most of the hybridized wheats spelt modern wheat
are are very commonly consumed, you know, in the States,
and those are ones that the antigen levels are quite high,
which directly leads to inflammation though, so it's really especially
(14:31):
after the pandemic, we're all much more aware of the
importance of keeping inflammation low in our diets. And roincorn
is showing indications in its whole state, wholemeal state to
actually show some potential anti inflammatory properties, which is amazing.
The nutrient levels, there's maybe some nutrients that are just
not there, there's some types of fibers that are not
there anymore. You have a nice breadth of total nutrients
(14:52):
and minerals. Then on some key nutrients like protein, you
have say sometimes up to forty percent higher protein in
roncore genetically pure Iincrn versus all other wheats. If you're
farmed exactly the same way. That's important because obviously you
can put fertilizer in one and not in the other
and get more protein. But if they're farmed the same way,
their natural ability to convert into nutrient and density up
(15:13):
to forty percent more protein, up to three hundred percent
more antioxidants, which is huge, and again a slightly different
profile of fibers, seeing more prebiotic fibers as well, so
and it's a great source of a lot of central
minerals as well, So it's I mean, we consider it
the perfect food. I don't know, I grew up with
thinking about flour is something that you just added butter
(15:36):
and sugar to and never really something too nutritious. But
the reality is is all flowers have important levels of
nutrition in them. The very first one it wasn't hybridized.
It's really it's not the original superfood. Really, it's it's
it's impressive.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
And I really appreciate that you're talking about protein. We
tend to have these, you know, square off, like I
need my protein, I need my grain, that those are
often separated, and bringing up the fact that there is
in whole grains there is protein in it innately.
Speaker 3 (16:09):
So it's not one or the other.
Speaker 2 (16:10):
So I'm glad that you pluck that out specifically, and
the micronutrients that you're mentioning as well. So if somebody
has sealag disease, can they can they eat on corn wheat?
Speaker 1 (16:21):
Legally you cannot recommend it right in the States, just
just for starters, and in most countries in Europe or
all of Europe can't do it. What we've seen in
research is delayed reactions or no reaction. There's three things
you need to develop Celiac diseases we understand today. One
of those is the genetic propensity. The other one we
mentioned was like life, I say, and the other is
the strong glutens. With those three you're highly likely to develop. Right,
(16:43):
So the genetic propensity could just be unlucky. It's a
bit like being allergic to other foods that are good
for you. I can't eat keep my wife canny kiwi
for example, a kiwi is super nutritious. So however, it
is true that if the celiac give different levels of
seliac two, so those severe, I wouldn't recommend it. We
do know if plenty who have tried it tried it
(17:04):
lightly and can actually but stage before that, the non
cell act gluten sensitive can consume it, and that's scientifically validated.
But we have thousands of consumers who eat big bowls
of pustin have absolutely no reaction whatsoever. But in our
Ondcorn Explaining booklet we go into going to that a
(17:25):
bit deeper as well, which you can find on the website.
Speaker 2 (17:29):
Yeah, and to emphasize the doctor Folkey had oncoming here
of really the difference between gluten sensitivity versus celiac disease
and making sure that you work with your healthcare provider
and specialists in this and to take this information as
informational only and not medical advice. So how is eincorn
wheat grown? Because in my head, okay, so you have
(17:52):
not just one of the reasons of hybridization again was
for yields, but also to resist maybe environments that weren't
as hospital for certain certain things that you were growing.
So how has it grown? And how have you in
this process found the space where it can thrive and
it's absolute natural environment.
Speaker 1 (18:13):
That's another one of the really cool things about I Corn.
It's one of our farmers. I love that he's always
called it the Savio. You know, you speak Spanish and
it's the one that knows. And they liked the way
they call it. I got off. It kind of sets
its roots into the soil exactly, you know. And they're
working all the crops, right, these guys who worked a
lot of different crops, all certified organic lands for decades.
(18:35):
These are small families or sometimes families have bigger land
that they manage. So those the kind of things that
they pay attention to, right, And then they may have
areas of land that don't have irrigation or don't get
good rainfall, or maybe the nutritional level and the soil
isn't where it should be. So it just they just
can't get the yields with other crops that they need
(18:56):
to get. And we've actually been able to have some
decent success, which makes sense when you think of this particular.
If you have a genetically pure one, it's dating back
beyond fourteen thousand years, it's a survivor. It know satisfied.
It doesn't get great yields, but it also gets you
a yield. So even if you have a drought season
or you have a cold winter or a very hot
whatever you have, it tends to get a fairly predictable yield.
(19:20):
It really knows how to take advantage of what's in
that soil. At the farm level. You know, regenative farming
is big today and it's just going to keep getting
bigger and bigger. Cert of organic super important. Reginative farming
makes a ton of sense since you're also protecting the soil,
reinvigorating the soil really right, so you're going to get
the maximum out of the plant, and you allow that
soil to take care of itself. Ironcorn fits perfectly into
(19:42):
that because it doesn't need at least our experience. It
doesn't need any inputs from a farming perspective, means no fertilizer,
you don't need to deal with the past. Ironcorn naturally
is a competitor against weeds, so you don't have to
worry too much about from the herbicide perspective, it's a
natural competitor, right, that's its roots, it's going to grow,
it's going to be sort of the dominant plant in
(20:03):
that area, so it makes the farmer's job easier from
that perspective. And then it's really nutrient efficient. So if
you're rotating like they did in the early Neolithic period,
rotating with garbonzos and lentils that are setting nitrogen, well,
that's all mutably need to do. I mean, you need
to manage in a regenitive way, so you've got the
soil retaining water enough and holding a certain amount of
(20:26):
nutrient or nutrient forming microiganisms. Not to get too technical
on this, but then you're going to have good consistent
yields that allows it to be economically sustainable as well
for the farmers in this market that we work in.
Speaker 2 (20:39):
It really is a sense of working with nature rather
than against it.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
The cool thing about that is, look, farmers are growing
up in sort of a very conventional way. They've had,
you know, two three generations ahead of them, farming in
ways that they've sort of been taught over the years.
They're not getting into it necessarily on the per product
basis like what we're looking at eincorn. They're looking at
trust trying to feed their families with their land. And
(21:06):
when we start to work with them on eincorn, they
become really engaged because they start to see what you
just mentioned. They start to see whether nature take over
and every year and they feel a part of it.
The head of the Organic Farming Association and under Lucia
in the South of Spain is one of our head
farmers and he's absolutely thrilled. In the beginning, he was
very nervous because it's all a bit new. It's a
(21:28):
very nice experience to get a farmer on the program
and let them see how that fits into their whole plan.
Speaker 2 (21:35):
Even this, when you're talking about I can see you
light up with the relationships that you've built and had
to build because there has to be this trust with
the farmers, especially if they're switching over from a different commodity.
I can only imagine when that whole cycle is feeding
on itself, pun intended of how that plays out on
(21:57):
multiple levels.
Speaker 3 (21:58):
It's really fantastic to hear.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
Can you paint a picture of what is the land like?
What's a temperature like? Is there seasonality where iincorn grows best?
Speaker 1 (22:09):
Yeah, it doesn't from our experience at least, it doesn't
grow great where all wheat grows necessarily, I think it
has to do with a variety member. These are not hybridized.
So one of the reasons you do hybridized we too,
is you try to get it to do better in
other parts of the world. And these come originally from
sort of the Crescent Valley, coming across west all the
way to say Portugal, So in that Mediterranean climate zone,
(22:32):
it does very well. In Spain where we're farming it,
I would say it's just a few degrees warmer overall
than the typical Mediterranean climate. So like us, it loves
great climate.
Speaker 2 (22:46):
Again, working with nature and out against it. So now
we talked about it, and I'm happy to say that
I have experienced and tasted the amazing products that you make.
So this is growing in Spain you're bringing into the
US and what is that looking like and what are
the products that you have?
Speaker 1 (23:04):
So yeah, the idea is that is people get to
like iincorn, which I'm happy that you are in a serena.
You know, they just want to start eating things with ininencorn,
which we figured is going to happen. You know, it's
like what happened with quinoa and these other grains. And
so we started with pasta figuring like we've got to
make things that people actually can eat and want to
eat on a regular basis. So we have a line
(23:24):
of Italian pastas that we make with one hundred percent
whole meal incorn. And then we've introduced also a line
of crackers. Those are also they's sour oat crackers, handmade
and four different flavors. We've got a spicy garlic flavor,
We've got the original flavors all made with all one
hundred percent organic ingredients and organic olive oil, only organic
(23:46):
sea salt, and then the various ingredients for those four flavors,
with other flavors to come, other types of pasta to come.
But then we also want to get into other categories.
We're even looking at frozen sliced bread, you know, of course, pizza, breakfast, cereal. Obviously,
we're going to continue working as hard as we can
to keep growing the supply and building other exciting products
(24:07):
and bringing them to market. But it's worth we're parents,
we've got kids, educate ourselves on food. It's worth spending
a little bit of time, whether it's our eye corn
or anybody else's eye corn. I get asked many times,
are you going to patent your seed your variety, and
said no, that kind of defeats the purpose. If we
just do what we're doing, what we should be fine
as far as a business, But we want everybody farming
and eating iron corn. It's like an essential food, right,
(24:29):
so that's our goal.
Speaker 3 (24:31):
How can people find you.
Speaker 1 (24:33):
On our website revival eincorn dot com. It's got loads
of information there, and then the classic Instagram revival Linecorn
is the handle on that.
Speaker 2 (24:42):
Thank you so much more for your expertise and for
your passion that has led to this work that so
many of us get to benefit from. From the farmers
to us, they get to enjoy the product.
Speaker 1 (24:52):
Thank you, Thanks for having us.
Speaker 3 (24:56):
I hope you.
Speaker 2 (24:56):
Feel motivated by this episode. Please leave us a rating
and end a review and mention our show to others
who you think could use this information. That could be
your doctor, It could be somebody who works in the
food service industry who's interested in the health components.
Speaker 3 (25:10):
It could be a.
Speaker 2 (25:11):
Friend that is working on their health journey. If you
want to hear more, please remember to follow Culinary Medicine
Recipe on your favorite podcast listening platform. Until next time,
Sandu and Bona Pettie. All content provided or opinions expressed
in this episode are for informational purposes only and are
not a substitute for professional medical advice. Please take advice
(25:34):
from your doctor or other qualified healthcare professional.
It's such an incredible story to think that mother Nature
created the first we to create. It was a perfect week,
and it's a bit of a shame that it wasn't intentional,
but the fact that these weats got hybridized and then
all of a sudden, it created this relationship we have
with wheat today where basically causes massive gluten free category
to develop. Discovering that there's actually a wheat that would
solve all these wheat problems and looking at the nutritional
(00:23):
benefits of this week and the flavor, it just was
pretty overwhelming. It it was something we almost felt obligated
to do.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Welcome to Culinary Medicine Recipe. I'm so happy you're here.
I'm your host, doctor Saprina Falke. I was a primary
care doctor for sixteen years and went to school for
four years to specialize in culinary medicine. In this work,
I get to combine my passionate expertise in both medicine
and food to teach people about food is medicine and
to empower them to understand what ingredients optimize health and
(00:53):
also how to cook those ingredients to make delicious meals.
On the show, I interviewed top chefs, doctors, health care visionaries,
and food service professionals who are making great strides in.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
The field of culinary medicine.
Speaker 2 (01:05):
Join me as we continue to explore the amazing world
of culinary medicine, where I will empower you to make
changes to your health and wellness with great food right away.
Have you ever been to Europe and been pleasantly surprised
that you can eat gluten products there like pasta and
bread without feeling bloated or sick. In this episode, we're
(01:25):
going to explain why with Guest Werner Forster, who is
the co founder and CEO of Revival Eincorn. He's on
a mission to bring back eincorn wheat, which is a
certain kind of wheat celebraty for its purity, nutrient density
and yes, easier on digestion. As a bonus, you can
go to Alternative Food Networks YouTube channel to see me
back in the kitchen cookie with Eincorn Pasta, where I've
(01:46):
made a delicious and easy pesta pasta recipe. There's a
video in both English and Spanish for you. Thank you
Warner for joining us today. Will you start by telling
us where are you physically located right now geographically.
Speaker 1 (02:00):
I am in the north of Spain in Billbao, near
the ocean.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
So with that in mind, and with what we're talking
about today, why can some people eat gluten in Europe
but not in the US.
Speaker 1 (02:11):
There's a few reasons, but there's definitely a difference. The
main wheat that's consumed in the US is different than
what's consumed in Europe. We consume a soft wheat. In
the US it's a hard wheat, which works better for
certain baking use, but it's got a stronger gluten, if
you will. There's more glyphysate usage in the US. There's
certain areas in Europe we almost have none, no glyphasaate usage,
(02:34):
which is a definitely contributing factor. And then traditionally people
naturally ferment. When you naturally ferment, you get the results
that help with digestion versus using starters. I mean, depends
on the grains you're eating as well, the types of wheat.
There's quite a different amount of varieties that you consume
both in the US and in Europe. That plays a role.
I mean, that's probably the number one factor. From our perspective.
(02:56):
What we're trying to do is it's such an incredible
story to think that mother Nature created the first we
to create. It was a perfect wheat, and it's a
bit of a shame that it wasn't intentional, but the
fact that these weats got hybridized and then all of
a sudden it created this relationship we have with wheat
today where basically causes massive gluten free category to develop.
You have a lot of young people growing up not
(03:18):
enjoying wheat anymore. They kind of lost that, you know,
when we started this project, one of the things we
realized that there's a sense of nostalgia here as well
to eat wheat. So for us, the beautiful thing is
to be able to bring back Mother Nature's original wheat
and slowly try to do our best in educating people
about it because it is the perfect food and it
is the best thing you could raise your kids on
(03:40):
and you yourself be eating as well.
Speaker 2 (03:42):
So when you're growing hard wheats like we do more
in the US than in Europe, what is that affect
as far as flavor profiles?
Speaker 1 (03:50):
You know, it's folks who come to Europe you always
start to experience the slight differences, you know, maybe the
pasta taste a little different, croissants might taste a little different,
and it's not necessari all, it's just the week. In
the States. You know, the States, you have massive production
for supporting different food systems. I think it has a
little bit to do also with being able to get
(04:11):
the yields, get the cost where you need it to be,
and get plants to be able to produce the product
they need at the volumes they need. That is a
really important part in the background. As a consumer you
really never think about, but that's what affects a lot
of times the ingredients that are in the foods that
we eat. Is try to create something that's tasty, whatever
it is, but then you got to make it work
in the production lines, and that's where you start seeing
(04:33):
these odd ingredients or you know, different choices around ingredients happening.
Speaker 2 (04:40):
Can you describe what is the difference between natural fermentation
like using a starter versus already made yeast and what
does that lead to as far as digestion or availability
of bioonutrients or the gluten itself.
Speaker 1 (04:54):
Yeah, so, I mean yeast I think was innovated in
the late eighteen hundreds, but it was a way to
get what they were looking for back then, they weren't
necessarily looking at the various health aspects of naturally fermenting.
They were just looking again at performance. Because I'm doing
naturally ferment it takes a longer period of time, there's
more risk because I need to get my temperatures right,
I need to get my humidity right, and I'm using
(05:16):
naturally occurring bacteria in my environment. I'm just creating the
conditions for that bacteria to really grow. But it is
more sensitive. There are situations to where it's harder to
control the outcome. So for large scale manufacturing, it's you
want to try to reduce those things that have too
many changing variables. And that's really what thrusted the use
of yeast. Forward, it makes sense. The problem is when
(05:39):
you're using yeast, you're not doing You're not fermenting the
way you need to, especially the period of time required
to actually create those lactic acids and really get that
lack the vacillous population up and convert certain fibers, creating
more prebiotics. I mean, all these things that are super
healthy about naturally fermented breads, if you rent the long
enough period of time, are not happy. And we just
(06:01):
throw east in there and go for a couple hours
and then throw it in the oven. You get the rise,
but you don't get all the other benefits.
Speaker 3 (06:07):
Including the flavor.
Speaker 2 (06:08):
I'm a baker myself, so hearing all this, I recently
baked my starters. I was restarting it accidentally, so I
had to start from scratch.
Speaker 1 (06:16):
Wow, you see right there?
Speaker 3 (06:18):
Yes, easy?
Speaker 2 (06:20):
So all right, I want to dive into your story
because just geographically of being a Southern California born and
raised and traveling in different parts of the world, and
before we get into the eincorn story specifically, I'd love
to hear where where did food come into your existence?
This wanting to go really granular and ultimately leading to
(06:42):
your current work.
Speaker 1 (06:43):
I mean, I've always I grew up I was very
fortunate growing up with a mom was an amazing cook
at home, so you know, I grew up one of
those homes where everything was cooked at home. And then
we had a my mom's from Ecuador, from South America,
and my father's from Germany. We traveled a lot as
a kid, and then growing up in southern California. My
first job outside after university was working at a big
(07:04):
food service distributor, so I had a bunch of restaurants
that were my clients, and then I got into the
natural foods industry. So I've always worked in foods. I've
worked in different facets, from farming organic tropical food bananas
and mangoes in Ecuador and shipping up to Whole Foods
and Trader Joe's and the like, and then farming California
Abalona down in Chile near Patagonia, you know, And that's
(07:26):
all what we processed and shipped to Asia and then
came over to Portugal because as with my wife and I,
we wanted to experience Europe when the kids were still young,
with the idea of maybe returning to California. And I
dabbled a bit in aquaculture, so you know, can we
do aquaculture in Europe and get into sort of an
(07:48):
innovative area, which is land based farming, And then where
are we going to go? Well, Portugal looks like the
California of Europe. It's got kid waves. Let's go check
that out. And literally that's we just arrived, checked out
the coast, decided to move there, and then built up
our activity developing land based aqua farms for dover, soul
and other things just always remain in the food industry,
(08:09):
you know. So I've not really ever worked outside of food.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
So how did then icorn become the one piece that
you wanted to really go into.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
My wife's from Bulgaria, which has to do with why
where we discovered it, right, And when she when I
met her, she had not been in the States too long,
and she was enjoying the palm trees lining Santa Monica
Boulevard and I told her, you know, I'm planning to
move to South America. So anyways, off we went on
this long, you know, tour doing different projects, and along
the way we took a few trips back to Bulgaria.
(08:41):
Having worked in the natural fluze industry, you learn a
lot about nutrition. I worked in dietary seven months for
about seven years. You learn you really learn a lot
about nutrition, right if you're really taking it serious. So
when we discovered eroincorn, we started to research it and
we're pretty blown away. If you read up on eincorn,
it's fascinating. At first, it seems like a little too
much because you're talking about wheat, but the reality is
(09:03):
it's just an incredible story. At many angles, but from
the nutrition standpoint. So having the background that we had
and having experience in launching and developing brands in the
natural products industry, and then discovering that there's actually a
wheat that would solve all these wheat problems and looking
at the nutritional benefits of this week and the flavor,
(09:23):
it just was pretty overwhelming. It was something we almost
help obligated to do, you know. So we started with
us just consuming the wheat. We got rid of all
our other flowers in the house as about twenty years ago,
so my children grew up on iincorn. My wife also
is amazing in the kitchen, loves baking, loves all these things.
So we used it personally for about ten twelve years,
(09:46):
made everything under the sun with it. Then started to
take it a bit more serious and looking at, you know,
the farming side and what varieties we should have and
the genetic purity, and then commissioning some very deep studies
around exact at the molecular level, various components that make
up this week versus other wheats and other drains. And
(10:06):
we've published a book on it called Aincorn Explained. Fun
Reading for the nutritionis or the dietician. But it was
important for us to really develop sort of a scientific
platform that we could communicate from. As we realized along
the way, Wow, this is potentially an important thing we're
going to introduce the industry. You better know what we're
talking about. Type of thing.
Speaker 2 (10:28):
Yes, I have been reading. It's been my bedside reading
for the last couple of months. Is exactly this. Yes,
but I'm one of those people. I'll be reading a
book and learning about different salt crystals and my husband
will laugh. He's like, I'm as enthrall with that as
a murder mistress, Like did you know this?
Speaker 3 (10:46):
So I'm right up your alley.
Speaker 2 (10:48):
So one of the big picture is kind of cliffs
notes version that comes up as hybridized versus non hybridized,
and assuming our listeners don't know anything about those terms,
could you give us a definition or an ex explanation
that might help people understand. Part of the reason that
iincorn is what you chose to really dive personally and
into your work.
Speaker 1 (11:09):
So you're not to confuse with genetically modified you reaction.
You're removing a gene from one plant or our animal
and putting it into another plant or animal. Here, you're
just cross breeding something that typically in nature would never
happen either because they're not endemic in the same location.
Seeing they're not from the same location. So you're taking
a plant or a grass from China and you're crossing
(11:31):
it with a wheat somewhere in Europe. That probably would
never happen in nature, or it's unlikely to happen. But
you're not modifying directly the genetics. It's the entire plants combined.
But they do result in a change in the molecular
structure of many of the components. Now, having said that, though,
depending on the category that you're working with plants, I
(11:51):
you know, stone fruit, avocados versus grasses, versus macrology in
the ocean, when these things cross, they don't necessarily always
have as much of a change occurring. And grass and
wheats are one of those things actually change a lot.
So unfortunately, you know, when they were hybridizing for good reasons,
to try to create wheat that would generate more protein,
(12:12):
more food per acre or per hector, and grow in
a way that was easier to harvest because that back
then they were trying to get more more yield. Well,
they were also dramatically changing the starches and the peptides,
the proteins, the glutens, all these things changed quite a bit.
But you know, that's that's what's you know, we've come
to get to know so well over the last fifty years.
Speaker 3 (12:35):
So tell us about eincorn. Is it hybridized? Is it not?
And what is that? What does that.
Speaker 2 (12:41):
Lead to as far as the quality of the product.
Speaker 1 (12:45):
Yeah, so it's not hybridized. It's the only one that's
not hybridized. Now, there's currently considered to be about four
hundred varieties of incorn. We only know of about twenty
three that are considered genetically pure. So there are some
incorns that might have have some components of other grasses
or wheats. There's some we've trapped in the States, for example,
(13:05):
that have m or it's another type of wheat right,
CoCom is the scientific name. But they can find some
of that in some of the roincorn that you might
have in certain markets or up in Canada as well,
for example. So if you can get genetically per inencoren,
you know that that's never been hybridized and only has
one set of chromosomes, and so it's not it's a
(13:27):
very simple plant, and it's something that us humans have
been consuming for a very long time, so our bodies
are well adapted to digest and assimilate it. Every other
wheat on the planet has had some level of hybridization.
Ninety five percent of what we consume has had enough
of a hybridization to where we have three sets of chromosomes,
and it's that second and third set of chromosomes they're
(13:47):
called BBDD be a little technical, but those are the
ones that really where you find you find the problems basically,
you know. So it's it's very interesting. It breaks down
to the molecular structure of the plant.
Speaker 3 (13:59):
And you mentioned problem.
Speaker 2 (14:00):
So if we're looking at solutions, it sounds like iron
corn is one of those. So what does hybridization due
to the nutrients, the ability to digest, and the flavor
of the wheat.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
So it changes all of those. I think the most
important one, one of the most important ones is the
amount of say, antigens that you find present. And some
of these, most of the hybridized wheats spelt modern wheat
are are very commonly consumed, you know, in the States,
and those are ones that the antigen levels are quite high,
which directly leads to inflammation though, so it's really especially
(14:31):
after the pandemic, we're all much more aware of the
importance of keeping inflammation low in our diets. And roincorn
is showing indications in its whole state, wholemeal state to
actually show some potential anti inflammatory properties, which is amazing.
The nutrient levels, there's maybe some nutrients that are just
not there, there's some types of fibers that are not
there anymore. You have a nice breadth of total nutrients
(14:52):
and minerals. Then on some key nutrients like protein, you
have say sometimes up to forty percent higher protein in
roncore genetically pure Iincrn versus all other wheats. If you're
farmed exactly the same way. That's important because obviously you
can put fertilizer in one and not in the other
and get more protein. But if they're farmed the same way,
their natural ability to convert into nutrient and density up
(15:13):
to forty percent more protein, up to three hundred percent
more antioxidants, which is huge, and again a slightly different
profile of fibers, seeing more prebiotic fibers as well, so
and it's a great source of a lot of central
minerals as well, So it's I mean, we consider it
the perfect food. I don't know, I grew up with
thinking about flour is something that you just added butter
(15:36):
and sugar to and never really something too nutritious. But
the reality is is all flowers have important levels of
nutrition in them. The very first one it wasn't hybridized.
It's really it's not the original superfood. Really, it's it's
it's impressive.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
And I really appreciate that you're talking about protein. We
tend to have these, you know, square off, like I
need my protein, I need my grain, that those are
often separated, and bringing up the fact that there is
in whole grains there is protein in it innately.
Speaker 3 (16:09):
So it's not one or the other.
Speaker 2 (16:10):
So I'm glad that you pluck that out specifically, and
the micronutrients that you're mentioning as well. So if somebody
has sealag disease, can they can they eat on corn wheat?
Speaker 1 (16:21):
Legally you cannot recommend it right in the States, just
just for starters, and in most countries in Europe or
all of Europe can't do it. What we've seen in
research is delayed reactions or no reaction. There's three things
you need to develop Celiac diseases we understand today. One
of those is the genetic propensity. The other one we
mentioned was like life, I say, and the other is
the strong glutens. With those three you're highly likely to develop. Right,
(16:43):
So the genetic propensity could just be unlucky. It's a
bit like being allergic to other foods that are good
for you. I can't eat keep my wife canny kiwi
for example, a kiwi is super nutritious. So however, it
is true that if the celiac give different levels of
seliac two, so those severe, I wouldn't recommend it. We
do know if plenty who have tried it tried it
(17:04):
lightly and can actually but stage before that, the non
cell act gluten sensitive can consume it, and that's scientifically validated.
But we have thousands of consumers who eat big bowls
of pustin have absolutely no reaction whatsoever. But in our
Ondcorn Explaining booklet we go into going to that a
(17:25):
bit deeper as well, which you can find on the website.
Speaker 2 (17:29):
Yeah, and to emphasize the doctor Folkey had oncoming here
of really the difference between gluten sensitivity versus celiac disease
and making sure that you work with your healthcare provider
and specialists in this and to take this information as
informational only and not medical advice. So how is eincorn
wheat grown? Because in my head, okay, so you have
(17:52):
not just one of the reasons of hybridization again was
for yields, but also to resist maybe environments that weren't
as hospital for certain certain things that you were growing.
So how has it grown? And how have you in
this process found the space where it can thrive and
it's absolute natural environment.
Speaker 1 (18:13):
That's another one of the really cool things about I Corn.
It's one of our farmers. I love that he's always
called it the Savio. You know, you speak Spanish and
it's the one that knows. And they liked the way
they call it. I got off. It kind of sets
its roots into the soil exactly, you know. And they're
working all the crops, right, these guys who worked a
lot of different crops, all certified organic lands for decades.
(18:35):
These are small families or sometimes families have bigger land
that they manage. So those the kind of things that
they pay attention to, right, And then they may have
areas of land that don't have irrigation or don't get
good rainfall, or maybe the nutritional level and the soil
isn't where it should be. So it just they just
can't get the yields with other crops that they need
(18:56):
to get. And we've actually been able to have some
decent success, which makes sense when you think of this particular.
If you have a genetically pure one, it's dating back
beyond fourteen thousand years, it's a survivor. It know satisfied.
It doesn't get great yields, but it also gets you
a yield. So even if you have a drought season
or you have a cold winter or a very hot
whatever you have, it tends to get a fairly predictable yield.
(19:20):
It really knows how to take advantage of what's in
that soil. At the farm level. You know, regenative farming
is big today and it's just going to keep getting
bigger and bigger. Cert of organic super important. Reginative farming
makes a ton of sense since you're also protecting the soil,
reinvigorating the soil really right, so you're going to get
the maximum out of the plant, and you allow that
soil to take care of itself. Ironcorn fits perfectly into
(19:42):
that because it doesn't need at least our experience. It
doesn't need any inputs from a farming perspective, means no fertilizer,
you don't need to deal with the past. Ironcorn naturally
is a competitor against weeds, so you don't have to
worry too much about from the herbicide perspective, it's a
natural competitor, right, that's its roots, it's going to grow,
it's going to be sort of the dominant plant in
(20:03):
that area, so it makes the farmer's job easier from
that perspective. And then it's really nutrient efficient. So if
you're rotating like they did in the early Neolithic period,
rotating with garbonzos and lentils that are setting nitrogen, well,
that's all mutably need to do. I mean, you need
to manage in a regenitive way, so you've got the
soil retaining water enough and holding a certain amount of
(20:26):
nutrient or nutrient forming microiganisms. Not to get too technical
on this, but then you're going to have good consistent
yields that allows it to be economically sustainable as well
for the farmers in this market that we work in.
Speaker 2 (20:39):
It really is a sense of working with nature rather
than against it.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
The cool thing about that is, look, farmers are growing
up in sort of a very conventional way. They've had,
you know, two three generations ahead of them, farming in
ways that they've sort of been taught over the years.
They're not getting into it necessarily on the per product
basis like what we're looking at eincorn. They're looking at
trust trying to feed their families with their land. And
(21:06):
when we start to work with them on eincorn, they
become really engaged because they start to see what you
just mentioned. They start to see whether nature take over
and every year and they feel a part of it.
The head of the Organic Farming Association and under Lucia
in the South of Spain is one of our head
farmers and he's absolutely thrilled. In the beginning, he was
very nervous because it's all a bit new. It's a
(21:28):
very nice experience to get a farmer on the program
and let them see how that fits into their whole plan.
Speaker 2 (21:35):
Even this, when you're talking about I can see you
light up with the relationships that you've built and had
to build because there has to be this trust with
the farmers, especially if they're switching over from a different commodity.
I can only imagine when that whole cycle is feeding
on itself, pun intended of how that plays out on
(21:57):
multiple levels.
Speaker 3 (21:58):
It's really fantastic to hear.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
Can you paint a picture of what is the land like?
What's a temperature like? Is there seasonality where iincorn grows best?
Speaker 1 (22:09):
Yeah, it doesn't from our experience at least, it doesn't
grow great where all wheat grows necessarily, I think it
has to do with a variety member. These are not hybridized.
So one of the reasons you do hybridized we too,
is you try to get it to do better in
other parts of the world. And these come originally from
sort of the Crescent Valley, coming across west all the
way to say Portugal, So in that Mediterranean climate zone,
(22:32):
it does very well. In Spain where we're farming it,
I would say it's just a few degrees warmer overall
than the typical Mediterranean climate. So like us, it loves
great climate.
Speaker 2 (22:46):
Again, working with nature and out against it. So now
we talked about it, and I'm happy to say that
I have experienced and tasted the amazing products that you make.
So this is growing in Spain you're bringing into the
US and what is that looking like and what are
the products that you have?
Speaker 1 (23:04):
So yeah, the idea is that is people get to
like iincorn, which I'm happy that you are in a serena.
You know, they just want to start eating things with ininencorn,
which we figured is going to happen. You know, it's
like what happened with quinoa and these other grains. And
so we started with pasta figuring like we've got to
make things that people actually can eat and want to
eat on a regular basis. So we have a line
(23:24):
of Italian pastas that we make with one hundred percent
whole meal incorn. And then we've introduced also a line
of crackers. Those are also they's sour oat crackers, handmade
and four different flavors. We've got a spicy garlic flavor,
We've got the original flavors all made with all one
hundred percent organic ingredients and organic olive oil, only organic
(23:46):
sea salt, and then the various ingredients for those four flavors,
with other flavors to come, other types of pasta to come.
But then we also want to get into other categories.
We're even looking at frozen sliced bread, you know, of course, pizza, breakfast, cereal. Obviously,
we're going to continue working as hard as we can
to keep growing the supply and building other exciting products
(24:07):
and bringing them to market. But it's worth we're parents,
we've got kids, educate ourselves on food. It's worth spending
a little bit of time, whether it's our eye corn
or anybody else's eye corn. I get asked many times,
are you going to patent your seed your variety, and
said no, that kind of defeats the purpose. If we
just do what we're doing, what we should be fine
as far as a business, But we want everybody farming
and eating iron corn. It's like an essential food, right,
(24:29):
so that's our goal.
Speaker 3 (24:31):
How can people find you.
Speaker 1 (24:33):
On our website revival eincorn dot com. It's got loads
of information there, and then the classic Instagram revival Linecorn
is the handle on that.
Speaker 2 (24:42):
Thank you so much more for your expertise and for
your passion that has led to this work that so
many of us get to benefit from. From the farmers
to us, they get to enjoy the product.
Speaker 1 (24:52):
Thank you, Thanks for having us.
Speaker 3 (24:56):
I hope you.
Speaker 2 (24:56):
Feel motivated by this episode. Please leave us a rating
and end a review and mention our show to others
who you think could use this information. That could be
your doctor, It could be somebody who works in the
food service industry who's interested in the health components.
Speaker 3 (25:10):
It could be a.
Speaker 2 (25:11):
Friend that is working on their health journey. If you
want to hear more, please remember to follow Culinary Medicine
Recipe on your favorite podcast listening platform. Until next time,
Sandu and Bona Pettie. All content provided or opinions expressed
in this episode are for informational purposes only and are
not a substitute for professional medical advice. Please take advice
(25:34):
from your doctor or other qualified healthcare professional.
Popular Podcasts
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.