Episode 397: The Philosophers Science (Part 1 of 2)

Have you ever read Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality?? Perhaps spent too much money on a self help workshop seminar? Join us as we talk about Eliezer Yudkowsky and his masterpiece of fiction. Where will this story truly lead us in this tale of rational magic and science.

Thanks for listening and remember to like, rate, review, and email us at: [e-mail] or tweet us at @C3Podcast. We have some of our sources for research here: http://tinyurl.com/CristinaSources

Also check out our Patreon: www.patreon.com/cultscryptidsconspiracies. Thank you to T.J. Shirley for our theme

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:28):
Christina. Hey, Chelsea, how's it going. You're leaving me?

Speaker 2 (00:32):
Yes, forever, you specifically you specifically, I'm leaving forever and
ever and never coming back. Yep, yep, yep, yep, yep.
Goodbye everyone. That's that's the end, the end, that's it. No,
I'm going on vacation.

Speaker 1 (00:46):
Yeah, yeah, and then gonna be with my maam for
a bit and it'll be it'll be a good time.
You're braver than I.

Speaker 2 (00:56):
I'm aware we've Chelsea did an episode about fear cruises. Yeah,
I think it was a couple. I remember one which
maw will insert here.

Speaker 1 (01:04):
And that would be episode ninety six.

Speaker 2 (01:07):
Yeah, I don't.

Speaker 1 (01:07):
I don't remember if that was more than one episode,
but I definitely had spoken many times about how much
I hate cruises because they are unnatural. Well, okay, that's
not the right term.

Speaker 2 (01:19):
I also, I don't I think that they are. You know,
we have a longer history of being at sea than
we do most forms of transit.

Speaker 1 (01:26):
That's true, Yeah, that is very true. I don't trust them,
and that's fine, yeah and fair. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:34):
Yeah, but I'm sure you'll have fun. I think I will.
I think it'll be a good time. Now, My only
fear is will I get seasick? And odds are yes,
But everybody tells me that a couple of days and
you stop feeling the ship move.

Speaker 1 (01:47):
I mean. Also, drama means pretty great.

Speaker 2 (01:49):
Okay, I don't have any, so not really the goal. Also,
that'll make me very sleepy. They have non sleepy ones, now,
do they?

Speaker 1 (01:59):
Yeah? Yeah, okay, I have to take them if I'm
in the airplane for long. I just feel like you
need an ambient like level of being sedated as a person.

Speaker 2 (02:10):
I feel like you, as a person need an ambient
level of sedation.

Speaker 1 (02:13):
And you know what, I actually have something that you
can borrow, and it's these things. You're supposed to put
them on your wrists.

Speaker 2 (02:17):
Oh no, I've tried those and there there bs they don't.

Speaker 1 (02:20):
They worked for me. Okay, you know occasionally.

Speaker 2 (02:23):
I have heard that it's more of a Cibo effect
than anything.

Speaker 1 (02:28):
Whatever work.

Speaker 2 (02:29):
Here's the thing. The placebo effect works even if you
know it's a placebo. Yeah, so like gods speed if
it works or worse, I'm assuming you're making eye contact
with your cat. I am okay. Chelsea just looked away
from me and kept looking back at a specific spa
the room I could not see and here.

Speaker 1 (02:43):
Comes a cinder, Here comes a cinder.

Speaker 2 (02:45):
Hi, little girl, I'm gonna be on a cruise. Welcome
to colds, cryptis and cruises where we're hitting the high seas. Everyone.
It's like Sweet Life on Deck.

Speaker 1 (02:55):
Watched that.

Speaker 2 (02:56):
I saw maybe like three episodes of that enough to
get the premise. Yeah, And basically it's a similar premise
where it's like, you know this podcast, but it's see
but at sea. You know, there's always like, what's that
new show that's like medical Procedural but on a cruise.

(03:16):
Oh yeah, Doctor Odyssey.

Speaker 1 (03:19):
The lead character is Pacy from Dawson's Creek.

Speaker 2 (03:23):
Okay, all I heard about it was that it was
silly and fun. They were on a cruise and they
were flirting with the idea of there being a throuble
for a while. But apparently the throuble plot line has
now ended, and I'm just like, cowards, cowards, cowards.

Speaker 1 (03:38):
There. Everyone is always too scared to do polyamory, and honestly,
they're too scared to commit to PolyAm Yeah, like commit,
just commit to it, commit to it, like.

Speaker 2 (03:50):
In your fiction. Yeah, just because I feel like that
opens up so many more opportunities. I also saw somebody
talking on TikTok about like, no, everybody dunks in the polycule,
but in this eccon to me like, yeah, just get
fifty people, figure out what all your dynamics are as
far as who's kiss and who, and then pull all

(04:11):
your money to buy an apartment building.

Speaker 1 (04:12):
We have friends who are raising kids in a polycule,
and I'm like, that's the way to do.

Speaker 2 (04:18):
It, if you if you can manage it, if you
can make it work. I say, it's an asexual person
who's never been in a relationship. Eh, I'm just present.

Speaker 1 (04:25):
You've been in plenty of relationships, just not romantic ones.

Speaker 2 (04:30):
Fair, I guess in the broad sense, I have friendships
and people I am related to. Yeah, yep, and also
some arch nemesis in relationships that I have had in
my life.

Speaker 1 (04:44):
Yeah, I have, and are also very important been a nemesis. Yeah,
and that is important to me in my war, I think,
so yeah.

Speaker 2 (04:51):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (04:52):
I was also just thinking like you and Bitter are
like a duo.

Speaker 2 (04:55):
At this point. Yeah, yeah, essentially basically posonic life partners
situation exactly.

Speaker 1 (05:00):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah yeah. Sinder wants so badly to
be on your lap, but you have knitting there. Well,
the thing is she she has the means of still
being on lap. She does, but she's just not sure
about it. Hi, I'm just watching her debate whether or
not she wants to jump on your lap.

Speaker 2 (05:17):
I think she's mostly she's mostly just inspecting my items.

Speaker 1 (05:20):
Yeah, and its marketing herself on your leg. Yeah, as
cats do. As cats do. Your pets love me, they do. Yeah,
for better or worse.

Speaker 2 (05:28):
For better or worse. MINDA jumped on me downstairs and
made me spill hot coco whatever we.

Speaker 1 (05:31):
Did do that, and I'm so sorry. It's it be
what it is. She's also just a menace. Yeah. You
say we're.

Speaker 2 (05:39):
Trying, and I'm like, Chelsea, you've been trying for several
years now. I don't know. I don't know how successful
that's trying. Okay. Welcome everyone to Cults, Cryptids and Conspiracies,
the podcast where we talk about cults, criptis and conspiracies.
Also things adjacent to that, like ghosts or other things

(06:00):
that go bump in the night. Said.

Speaker 1 (06:04):
Crypts already mythical creatures. Sometimes sometimes there's the overlap is
strange and floggy. We talk about politicians. Sometimes we do.

Speaker 2 (06:13):
We talk about cursed objects, mysterious disappearances. Sometimes there's some
true crime in there. Yeah, Sometimes there's some fun science
stuff in there.

Speaker 1 (06:21):
Sometimes it's fun. And sometimes we're on the train of Bombersville.

Speaker 2 (06:24):
Are we in the train of Bomberial today?

Speaker 1 (06:26):
Eventually?

Speaker 2 (06:28):
Okay, yeah, so at some point we will be on
the train to my beautiful town of Bummersville.

Speaker 1 (06:33):
It's an electioneer everyone. I say that there is no
other option for mayor.

Speaker 2 (06:38):
Yea, but it is an election.

Speaker 1 (06:41):
He now wants to run against you. He can try,
he can try. Mal's not even here right now.

Speaker 2 (06:48):
He's where the people of Bummersville going to vote for me?
The constant presence of authority in their life or Mal
who sometimes falls asleep during the episodes.

Speaker 1 (06:59):
He does have ultimate authority over this though, since he's
the one who edits the episodes. Yeah, but I feel
like I could take him in a fight, all right.
I feel like that's part of the Bummersville election processes.
We do get out, we do get out.

Speaker 2 (07:09):
I don't think it's like the final say, but I
think that there's points involved. Yeah, yeah, you know.

Speaker 1 (07:14):
Yeah, I get that.

Speaker 2 (07:15):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (07:16):
Yeah. In the lore in the law, in the law
of Bumbersville. Yeah, will be will be mostly not super
in Bummersville. Maybe on the train.

Speaker 2 (07:23):
Uh, and then we're just off the train.

Speaker 1 (07:26):
Yeah, there will be a bit of a bummer at
the end of this when I touch on some current events.

Speaker 2 (07:34):
Okay, but she jumped up, she did.

Speaker 1 (07:36):
But for the most part, we're not going to be super. Well, no,
that's not true. I just realized there was other things,
all right, Chelsea's anyway, she's couching so much. I don't
want to give it away.

Speaker 2 (07:46):
She's she's being very vague about many things.

Speaker 1 (07:50):
Well, the Giants are winning, so that's nice.

Speaker 2 (07:52):
What does that have to do with this?

Speaker 1 (07:53):
Nothing? I just came up on my.

Speaker 2 (07:55):
Phone listeners listeners. I don't know sport. I'm no, I
don't know or care about sport, and I recognize that
people do no and care about sport, and I respect that.
Our group chat with our friends, it's just been for
several days.

Speaker 1 (08:11):
There's three of us who are really into baseball and have.

Speaker 2 (08:14):
Just not shut up about it, to the point where
Jen very kindly offered, do you want to make a
channel for sport? Just for sport too? Well, actually, what
they said was do you want to make do you
want to make a channel for like baseball smack Talk?

Speaker 1 (08:29):
And I was like to quarantine it and they were
like yeah, basically, yeah, so now we have the sport
channel for sport.

Speaker 2 (08:35):
Yeah. So I am not scared and confused all the time.

Speaker 1 (08:40):
Yeah, I am not a big sport person, but I
do love baseball. Baseball is the only sport. Okay, well
and rugby. Okay, Yeah, I'm squint. I'm squint.

Speaker 2 (08:52):
Is it side eye? If I'm looking.

Speaker 1 (08:54):
Directly at you, you were kind of whatever I'm facing you,
I'm squinting in doubt, Yeah, in doubt over the I'm
not a I guess it comes to me the way
I grew up. It's like sport was football, and I
really fucking hate football.

Speaker 2 (09:11):
But there's many sports.

Speaker 1 (09:12):
There's many sports.

Speaker 2 (09:13):
There's so many sport Yeah.

Speaker 1 (09:14):
Yeah, I really like rugby and I really like baseball.
Baseball's fun and this year I have like the the
MLB TV for free for the whole season, so I've
gotten mall into sport. It's been really fun.

Speaker 2 (09:25):
I'm glad that you have this to share.

Speaker 1 (09:27):
Yeah, you can share.

Speaker 2 (09:28):
The sports shared sport experience.

Speaker 1 (09:30):
One day, I'm going to come on here and talk
about someone dying of heatstroke in the ACE press room
as like a topic. I know, I need to explain
what is going like real quick.

Speaker 2 (09:39):
Okay. So the A's, I hope you can hear mafear
in my voice, listener.

Speaker 1 (09:43):
The A's, who were my team my whole life because
they are Oakland. Yeah, they are dead to me now
because I've always been both Oakland and San Francisco fan
because I grew up in the Bay Area. But Oakland
the team moved to Vegas, and so they are dead
to me until the owner decides to sell them, which

(10:05):
it sounds like he never will and he can go
fuck himself.

Speaker 2 (10:08):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (10:08):
So, but the thing is, their Vegas stadium is not
ready yet, so they are playing at their minor league
field in Sacramento. Now, the minor league team does not
have a press room like the major league stadiums do,
so instead of like an official press room, they have
like a home depot shed set up outside of the stadium.

(10:29):
Like how big a shed? No, I mean enough to
hold I think like ten to twenty people, like packed
in like sardines.

Speaker 2 (10:38):
Okay, so it's a shed.

Speaker 1 (10:42):
Yeah, in Sacramento in the summertime. Yeah, So I just
nothing has happened yet. I just feel like, okay, so nobody,
no one has died of heats trying. No one has done.

Speaker 2 (10:55):
You're speaking it into existence.

Speaker 1 (10:57):
I just feel like it's gonna happen.

Speaker 2 (10:58):
She is, She is blobbing her dodge ball of prophecy. Yeah,
to see if it hits somebody dying of heatstroke in
the minor league press room and Sacramento for the A's well,
major league press room, my apology. Yes, but technically it's
the minor league field.

Speaker 1 (11:15):
It's the minor league field, and the minor league teams
don't have a press room, so they had to set
up a home depot shed.

Speaker 2 (11:20):
Will they get to keep the shed? I don't know,
because if they get to keep the shed, then I
think it's the minor league shit, that's true, that's my thought. Yeah,
I think the A's are just borrowing it in that case.

Speaker 1 (11:31):
Yeah, but in Sacramento in the summer, I just do
not feel, at the very least someone's going to pass out.

Speaker 2 (11:38):
So this is my question, based off what you just said.
Your allegiance to this team is purely regional. It has
nothing to do with the players on it.

Speaker 1 (11:48):
No, I mean I still kind of care about them.
It's just like it's a betrayal. It's a really like
harsh betrayal for them to move. It's not entirely regional.
And also I've always been the Giants and an A's fan.
It's just I was always an A's fan first, and
now I'm a Giants fan first. I see, Yeah, I
still care not watching their games.

Speaker 2 (12:10):
There's no wrong answer to this question. It was mostly
just me being like, is it just because of the
location of the team.

Speaker 1 (12:17):
It's because I'm not it's there's no to do.

Speaker 2 (12:20):
What I was asking is if it's about the players,
if there is allegiance to specific players or not.

Speaker 1 (12:26):
No, I'm actually really bad about remembering players.

Speaker 2 (12:29):
So it is it's about the team as a unit,
but mostly about.

Speaker 1 (12:32):
The regionality of the team, not even that necessarily it's
and I'm not going to get into it now, but
the whole process of how the A's got moved to
Vegas is real fucked up.

Speaker 2 (12:42):
Well, I'm sure it has something to do with blatant capitalism.

Speaker 1 (12:45):
Yeah, I mean that's one for sure. That's a big
one for sure. But it was such a slap in
the face to Oakland who have already lost their football
team and their basketball team, and so the A's were
all they had left. Uh, and it was it was,
it was a whole thing. I don't want to get
into it, but it's a betrayal, all right.

Speaker 2 (13:04):
So we'll come back in a year maybe, and we'll
see if Chelsea's dodgeball prophecy has landed.

Speaker 1 (13:10):
It only take a few months because the season ends
in like October.

Speaker 2 (13:13):
We'll come back in like some amount of months and
we'll see if Chelsea's dodgeball prophecy is landed.

Speaker 1 (13:19):
Yep, but yes, before we do real quick the dodgeball
or before we do the episode, before we do the episode, okay,
very very quick. Bummers will sometimes all right in a sense, Okay,
I know that we said we're going to try and
stop doing current events, like current political events.

Speaker 2 (13:42):
I said that, and you said yeah. But then every
time you've said yeah, you've lied. So I don't I.

Speaker 1 (13:47):
No longer hold you to that promise because I don't
expect you to fill I've been trying very hard. I
need to respect your effort because there have been a
lot of times when I haven't done it. But this time,
I just it's important you are in If you are
in the United States, you need to call your congress
person and your senator because you remember how they wrongfully

(14:11):
deported someone to an El Salvadorean prison yep, and the
Supreme Court was like, you need to bring him back.

Speaker 2 (14:16):
Yep, they're not yep.

Speaker 1 (14:18):
So uh and Trump was on camera heard saying to
the L Salvadorian president President, President's, well, technically he's kind
of like a dictator basically.

Speaker 2 (14:29):
I know his his official title was president, Okay.

Speaker 1 (14:31):
I wasn't sure what his official title was president, telling
him he needs to build more prisons because they're going
to start deporting every kind of criminal, not just the
ones who are here illegally, because already we were deporting
people to El Salvador who weren't even from El Salvador.
Also who weren't even illegally here, who had done no crimes.

Speaker 2 (14:53):
Yeah. And also, the act of being here without a
visa is technically not like a federal offense.

Speaker 1 (15:01):
It's not.

Speaker 2 (15:02):
Yeah, I mean, like, isn't it just like a misdemeanor yep?

Speaker 1 (15:04):
Yeah, so yeah, yeah, hellish it's uh we live in
hell were Yeah, So if you are in the United States,
you need to do that like this, you need you
need to call and there's a script. I'm gonna rot retweet, retweet.
Is it still a retweet? Who fucking cares? Are you
on blue Sky?

Speaker 2 (15:23):
Then just repost it.

Speaker 1 (15:24):
It's going to repost it on blue Sky so that
you know y'all can see it. But yeah, this is
this is horrifying, truly, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (15:33):
No, it is. It is a blatant violation of human
rights and is just fragrantly disgusting behavior, and it is
also catapulting us into this authoritarian constitutional crisis where there
they're masks. The mask's not even on anymore. Like they're
blatantly uh and outwardly disregarding the rule of law and

(15:55):
always have been somehow. It's just that people didn't believe
that they were. And it's like, no, but they always have.

Speaker 1 (16:01):
Been, and the Democrats are doing fuck all about it.
So you know, so no matter who your representative is,
call them both representative and senator. Just call them repeatedly,
repeatedly anyway. So that's that's all. That's all I wanted
to give an update on for this bummers. Well, sometimes
because I felt like it's important to you know, it's important.

(16:24):
But let's move on, okay, to the top to the
today's main topic, which.

Speaker 2 (16:29):
Is Chelsea's, which is mine.

Speaker 1 (16:31):
Yes, but first let's have our sponsors, all right, Christina. Yeah,
how do you feel about self help seminars? Bad? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (16:48):
Hate them? Yeah, not to say that I think that
they don't help people. This is a personal feeling. There's
like a vibe that I get whenever I'm in one
of those ones, like I've had this. I've had this
in voice acting classes. When they start getting a little
too like self help feely, I'm like, you're not my therapist.

Speaker 1 (17:07):
Yeah, I didn't pay for you to you didn't go
to school for this.

Speaker 2 (17:10):
I don't want you coming in here and trying to
like improve my mood like this. Also, I'm fine, leave
me alone. Yeah, But that is to say that I
know that there.

Speaker 1 (17:20):
Are people who do get a lot of value out
of them. Sure, I'm just a little jaded asshole over here.
I'm also generally against but also no, some of them
are fine, like cringey and overall not really helpful, but fine.
And some of them are.

Speaker 2 (17:39):
Cults occasionally, Yeah, occasionally they're cults.

Speaker 1 (17:43):
Considering this podcast, obviously, the one we're going to be
talking about today, leans more into the latter.

Speaker 2 (17:49):
Can I make a shot in the dark?

Speaker 1 (17:52):
You can? Because of a thing that I know recently,
you shared a video in the group chat about something
which was unreally to this, but it was by a
specific creator. Okay, that has me suspicious. Then yeah, I
think you know exactly what this is going to be.
I didn't want you to say it. Well, I'm sure
you're going to have to immediately say no, I'm not

(18:14):
well then maw, now can bleep that out? I guess
bleep that out because the way I'm going to reveal it.

Speaker 2 (18:20):
Is okay, fun to me.

Speaker 1 (18:22):
All right, all right, So first I'm going to read
from an article called The Happiness Code from the New
York Times. Okay, it was published in twenty sixteen. Okay,
this is by Jennifer Kahn and it starts last summer.
Three dozen people, mostly programmers in their twenties, gathered in
a rented house in San Leanrew, California, a sleepy suburb
of San Francisco, for a lessoning comfort Zone expansion. An instructor,

(18:45):
Michael Smith opened the session with a brief lecture on identity,
which he observed, can seem immutable. We think we behave
in certain ways because of who we are, he began,
But the opposite is also true. Experience can edit identity.
The goal of the Coz exercise, Smith explained was to
peek over the fence to a new self by doing
something that makes you uncomfortable and then observing the result.

(19:07):
There was an anticip anticipatory hush, and then the room erupted.
One person gave a toast. A product manager a dropbox
broke into song in a corner. A programmer named Brent
took off his shirt, revealing a milky chest in back,
and then sat with his head bowed. He would later
walk around wearing a handwritten sign that read please touch me.

Speaker 2 (19:27):
Oh.

Speaker 1 (19:28):
The exercise went on for an hour, and afterwards participants
gitaly shared their stories. One person described going onto the
patio and watching everyone else through the window in order
to experience the feeling of exclusion. Another submerged his hand
in a pan of leftover chicken curry to challenge his
natural natural fastitiousness. Unexpectedly, he enjoyed the experience. It felt playful,

(19:49):
he said. At the end, Smith led everyone in a
group cheer. The coz exercise was part of a four
day workshop offered by this Center for Applied Rationality in Berkeley,
and each of the workshop sessions invariably finished with participants
chanting three two one victory, a ritual I assumed would

(20:11):
quickly turn half hearted. Instead, as the weekend progressed, it
was performed with increasing enthusiasm. By the time COSE rolled
around late on the second day, the group was nearly
vibrating when Smith gave the cue. Everyone cheered wildly, some
astatically thrusting both fists into the air. So that seems

(20:31):
pretty normal for you know, especially tech self help ut workshops. Yeah,
these workshops apparently are like nearly four thousand dollars a weekend.

Speaker 2 (20:42):
Yeah, that's the whole thing with those also is they
tend to be incredibly expensive for what they are.

Speaker 1 (20:47):
And not to belittle.

Speaker 2 (20:49):
The concept of this again, because when it comes to
like specifically the example you gave of like a comfort
zone expansion thing where you are opening the idea, it's
basically like it's what's it called exposure therapy. Yeah, we're
opening the idea of somebody's like do something that you're
not comfortable with in a safe environment and find out

(21:09):
maybe it's fine actually, and maybe you don't have to
be weirded out by it or uncomfortable with it, which
that seems fine to me.

Speaker 1 (21:17):
Yeah on paper, Yeah, a lot of the stuff is
like m cringey but overall pretty harmless.

Speaker 2 (21:24):
Dude walking around with a sign and says, please touch me,
I'd be like, I'm no, not going to absolutely not
please return your shirt to your person.

Speaker 1 (21:33):
So it may surprise you to then hear that this
story starts with Harry Potter fan fiction and ends with
six people dead.

Speaker 2 (21:42):
It doesn't surprise me specifically because I know exactly what
you're about to talk about. But also, yeah, it's a lot.

Speaker 1 (21:49):
It's a time wild fucking right. So here's the thing. Yes,
I was saying earlier that we're not going completely into Bumbersville,
and the reason is because the six pe dead part
is actually an offshoot of the cult we're going to
be talking about, which is the cult of rationalism, rationality,
rationalism whatever. Uh, And the part of it that killed

(22:13):
six people is actually an offshoot that has separated themselves
from rationality.

Speaker 2 (22:19):
Yes, and they're the ones.

Speaker 1 (22:20):
Who murdered that border patrol pa. Uh. Like Border Patrol
agent earlier this year. The group is called the Zizians.
They so they do not call themselves that, no, but
death that is that is the name that has been
given to them. And there's a lot that goes into
that that I decided I'm not going to do that
one because we actually had said this year when some

(22:42):
when we saw the news article that we didn't really
want to do it until there was more information out.

Speaker 2 (22:47):
Yeah, and I still believe.

Speaker 1 (22:48):
That more information is going to come out, especially if
like a like the trials happen and whatever. But also
just the Zizians was a four part podcast episode from
behind the Bastards.

Speaker 2 (23:01):
There's a lot going on there becuse there's a lot
of history with the people and like the backstory behind
them breaking bad essentially. Yeah, but I.

Speaker 1 (23:10):
Thought for this series of episodes, because I think this
will be about two we can talk about basically what started,
what was the origin of this cult that ended up
murdering six people, and that is the Cult of Rationality,
which starts with a Harry Potter fan fiction called Harry
Potter and the Methods of Rationality. I will say calling

(23:31):
this a cult is sort of strong. I so we
watched the same YouTube video from strange aon strange A
ons Yes, when they were reluctant to call it a cult.

Speaker 2 (23:44):
I would also because I have not just like I've
seen that video as well, but like looking into other
parts of it, I would also be reluctant to call
it a cult.

Speaker 1 (23:55):
See after I looked into other parts of it, I disagree. Okay, well,
that's gonna be an interesting conversation. Then, So Harry Potter
and the Methods of Rationality. It was written by a
man called Elizar Yudowski. His big thing is that ever
since two thousand and nine he has been convinced that

(24:15):
we need to stop the threat of AI. Now, when
I say we need to stop the threat of AI,
I don't mean the threats in which we know are
present today, which is that they're stealing content, They're trying
to take over creative jobs. They are putting a lot
of people in those jobs out of work, not just
creative jobs, with other jobs as well.

Speaker 2 (24:35):
And when Chelsea says they, she's referring to corporations who
are creating generative AI yes, and corporations who are heavily
using generative AI.

Speaker 1 (24:44):
Yes. Yes, it's a problem with art it's a problem
with functional with a functional Internet, because a lot of
big corporations like Meta and Google, they're using AI, generative AI,
and even just general AI in order to have certain
parts of their business's function, which makes things not function.

Speaker 2 (25:06):
Yeah, to a certain extent. Yeah, the conversation about AI
is more nuanced, and I think I've spoken about it
on the podcast before. It's more nuanced than you can't
the pop culture definition of AI that they keep using
as a shorthand is too large of an umbrella term.

Speaker 1 (25:24):
Yes, because AI in which we now know of it
in twenty twenty five isn't really AI.

Speaker 2 (25:30):
Well, it's generative AI, which is a different thing. It
is a form of artificial intelligence, but it is a
specific form of artificial intelligence.

Speaker 1 (25:38):
It's not independently intelligent.

Speaker 2 (25:40):
Well, no, AI is independently intelligent. There is not it
currently existing, independently intelligent AA, like the kind of AI
that we think of from like science fiction stories.

Speaker 1 (25:49):
That's not that doesn't exist.

Speaker 2 (25:51):
That doesn't exist. No, No, there is no artificial consciousness. Correct.

Speaker 1 (25:57):
However, Eliza Yudowski was I meant that it would happen
eventually because he, I assume was really really into the
Terminator because literally everything he talks about like it's very
Terminator esque. But anyway, in two thousand and nine, he
started a blog called less Wrong, which is where like

(26:18):
the Rationality cult kind of centralizes around is this blog
called less Wrong, where he contributed once daily. I don't
know if he still contributes once daily to it. I'm
not really sure like how often it still gets updated.
He's not the only contributor, but he is the main owner. Okay,
there's a lot of other people that contributed to it.

(26:41):
And he also decided, I believe, in twenty ten, to
start writing Harry Potter fan fiction. Now he decided to
rewrite the first Harry Potter book. So Harry Potter and
the SORCER's Stone or Philosopher's Stone, depending on where in
the world you are, there's going to be quite a
bit of talk Harry Potter in this episode. So if

(27:01):
that's something that you really don't want to hear about,
and I totally understand, I'm sorry this episode may not
be for you. That's fair, but for reasons that are
just ellude me. Harry Potter fan fiction has started three
cults now, and this is one of them. I remember,

(27:22):
because there's a Snap Piss, there's the Snapewives.

Speaker 2 (27:24):
Yeah, who's the second cult?

Speaker 1 (27:26):
So I didn't actually look into them. But when I
watched Strange Eon's's video, are you.

Speaker 2 (27:31):
Talking about the Dade Group? Yeah? Okay, technically that it
was that one guy pre existed in the Lord of
the Rings fandom first, Okay, okay, and then moved into
the Harry Potter fandom after the Lord and Rings fandom
kicked him out. Was it the way around?

Speaker 1 (27:44):
No?

Speaker 2 (27:44):
I think it was that way around. I think was
Lord of the Rings first. Okay.

Speaker 1 (27:48):
I mean I haven't looked into that one yet, but
I am curious to look into it. But also generally speaking,
we have talked about fan fiction leading to cults at
least twice on this podcast. Yeah, but what happens this
will be the third time because one was the Final
Fantasy House.

Speaker 2 (28:00):
One was the Final Fantasy House. Ma'll insert that episode here. Yeah,
and that would be episode one sixty.

Speaker 1 (28:05):
So Eliza wrote this fanfic and it's like six hundred
thousand words, which is longer than the first like three
Harry Potter books put together. People go crazy with that,
bro go nuts. You gotta respect the hustle. I do
respect the hustle for most fan fiction writers. I don't
know if I respect it for Eliza for reasons that

(28:27):
are sort of biased, for sure. But I did not
read this strange eons. And then another person that i'll
talk about, David, you did read it. I did not
want to subject myself to this. My TVR is already
too long, and I do not want to waste my
life reading something that I know I'll hate. But in
this version of Harry Potter, Eliza writes Harry as coming

(28:49):
from a loving family. Petunia is still one of the
people that raises him.

Speaker 2 (28:54):
But she's not.

Speaker 1 (28:55):
Married to Vernon. She's married to some fucking like astrophysicist
or something. I don't remember. He I don't know, I
kind of scientists.

Speaker 2 (29:02):
He's I think he's referred to as like the professor
or something where it's like it's basically, yeah, she has
Mary Vernon, she marries a science guy.

Speaker 1 (29:08):
Also, they yaifier for some reason, it's.

Speaker 2 (29:12):
That yeah, that does happen.

Speaker 1 (29:14):
And I guess Dudley doesn't exist well because she's not.

Speaker 2 (29:17):
Married to Vernon.

Speaker 1 (29:18):
So like they don't have a kid. If they didn't
have a kid, it probably wouldn't be deadly. But so
Harry grows up in a loving household with two adoptive parents,
one of which is Aunt Petunia. But for some reason,
before Lily died, she made Petunia hotter. I don't know
why that had to be included, but anyway, the whole
thing is basically that Harry grows up with science being

(29:38):
the forefront of everything that happens around him, and so
when he gets his letter from Hogwarts, is like, the
fuck is this and has to rationalize magic existing for
six hundred thousand words. And again I didn't read it,
but from excerpts that were read aloud, not just by Strange,
but also I did into the Behind the Bastards four

(30:01):
part series. It's not well written. It doesn't the dialogue
does not sound like humans spoke it. The dialogue is.

Speaker 2 (30:12):
Basically like, ah.

Speaker 1 (30:14):
Yes, indubitably, ah, I see what you did there? They
are eleven.

Speaker 2 (30:17):
It's very smug. Yes, they're eleven, it's very it's.

Speaker 1 (30:22):
Very somebody who definitely is There's this sort of way
that people speak when they are trying to sound intelligent, yep,
and that that seems to be the vibe. And the
thing is Eliza I don't want to say this disparagingly,
but Eliza apparently did not go to university, and in
fact did not he had no formal education past middle school.

Speaker 2 (30:44):
It sounds like dang.

Speaker 1 (30:45):
So it is kind of tell like there's a sense again,
not disparaging anyone who was not able to get a
full education, because that is most likely outside of your control,
but there is this sort of vibe of like, this
is what Eliza thinks intelligent people sound.

Speaker 2 (31:03):
Like, or like highly educated people sound like. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (31:06):
So he's written that into the story and that has
caused it to not sound like a person actually has
spoken these words. It just is lecture after lecture. Every
single chapter is named after some lesson of rationality that
he wants to talk about. It's basically Eliza preaching rationality

(31:28):
under the guise of Harry Potter fan fiction.

Speaker 2 (31:30):
Well, it's sort of from what I understand, that was
the point of it, right, Like it was. The advertised
point was like, I'm using Harry Potter as a medium
through which to teach rationality.

Speaker 1 (31:41):
To his credit, he admits that, yeah, but that's the
only credit I'm going to give him. Okay, fair, Now,
when you call something rational Obviously, it's to make it
sound better in the eyes of general public, because if
something is rational, then therefore it is good, right because

(32:04):
things that are rational are therefore objectively good. I don't
know if I agree with saying that that's entirely true.
I'm saying that that would be a public perception of
something called rational.

Speaker 2 (32:14):
I don't know if I agree with that statement. Really,
to me, rational just means like thought through. Okay, So
if we're also, I have had enough experiences of people
calling something like this is just like the irrational, you
know whatever, Like people using the word rational to try
and I guess to that point as an attempt to

(32:37):
make themselves sound like objectively good that I personally don't
necessarily trust it. But also when I hear something described
as rational, to me, that just means that's like, this
was a logical thought process. It doesn't necessarily mean that
it's good or bad or anything.

Speaker 1 (32:54):
Okay, Yeah, again, I don't disagree with you. I just
think that calling someone rational is the same as like
calling something scientology, where you call it that because science
is objectively good, right, Like sure, but that's the intent,
that's the intent. And obviously Eliza and Eliza thinks that

(33:15):
he is being rational. He's being objectively rational because all
of these things are like, of course people should believe
this because of course.

Speaker 2 (33:22):
Well, can you describe what the rational Can you define
what the rationalist movement is? What that is?

Speaker 1 (33:28):
I have a definition?

Speaker 2 (33:30):
Can you can you talk to us about what it is?
When we're talking about what the rationalist ideas are? What
that means?

Speaker 1 (33:39):
So the rationalist ideal hang on the dictionary definition. But
I'm going to go to like the Wikipedia article is
a belief for theory that opinions and actions should be
based on reason and knowledge rather than a religious belief
or emotional response. So essentially, like, oh, instead of like
this thing is the way it is because of my
belief in my religion or because I personally feel this way,

(34:01):
it's like, no, this is this is objectively how you
should feel about this, because.

Speaker 2 (34:05):
Well, I don't think it's about feeling at all. I
think it's about actions. It's about not believing things unless
there is proof. Yeah, it's about not basing I like
decisions on faith or on feeling, but rather on what
is proven and what can be seen to be true.

Speaker 1 (34:24):
Right, So that is here's the thing the sort of
like dictionary definition of rationalism. And also if you do
read into the history of it, it goes back to
like things on the Enlightenment and goes back to, for
some reason, a lot of stuff on Francis Bacon.

Speaker 2 (34:39):
Oh yeah, he's one of like the major formative voices
of the rationalist movement.

Speaker 1 (34:43):
Yeah, yeah, there's you could you can use rationalism and
go back quite a while in order to get more
like a concrete of like, yes, it's it's you should
be doing things based off of like information that you've gathered,
not just the feel your feelings on this subject at hand. However,
this version of rationality that we will be talking about

(35:04):
today is a lot well, that is definitely the basis
of it, and that is what Eliza and a lot
of the people surrounding him will say, like this is
the goal. The actual like modern version of rationalism seems
to be mostly centered on the fact that AI is
going to take over the world at some point soon

(35:24):
and we need to be vigilant about it because we
could either make because we're going to make a god
and we could either make an evil god or a
good god. Okay, yeah, so that is actually the crux
of like everything Eliza does. There is this six hundred
thousand word Harry Potter fan fiction where they're like, oh,
but also you need to be able to like describe

(35:47):
all of your thoughts and feelings into rationalism and blah
blah blah. But the main lesson that he wants people
to take from it, and the thing that he still
writes articles about and goes on podcasts about to this day,
is that we need to start thinking about the actual
threat of AI and how it's it's possible that it

(36:07):
takes over and murders all of us like it does
in The Terminator. Even in the Harry Potter fanfick he
talks about AI, I don't actually know if he doesn't
in the Harry Potter fan pick. Is the thing, Okay,
I'm saying that the Harry Potter fanfick is getting people
into rationalism, but as soon as you're into Eliser's version
of rationalism, it's all about the dangers of AI.

Speaker 2 (36:27):
Sure, Okay, his personal writings aside from that, ye are
focusing on that point.

Speaker 1 (36:32):
Yeah, Okay, So it's like and a lot of the
people who weren't I don't even necessarily say anymore because
a lot of them have abandoned it in the years
that generative AI has come up. There were people like
Peter Thal that were very in teal sorry, we're very
into rationalism, and he was in like Eliza actually ended
up being pretty influential in the tech community within California,

(36:55):
which is insane for someone who does not have a
formal education past middle school, which is what those things
where it's like, again, God.

Speaker 2 (37:02):
To sort of kind of respect the hustle is it's like, clearly,
you were able to speak on certain subjects well enough
that you got people to listen to you.

Speaker 1 (37:12):
He was able to speak on them well enough for
people to listen to him. However, there is a review done,
and she talked about strange talked about this, and I
decided to look at up. His man named Daniel U
or Dan Lou did a whole review of Harry Potter
and the Methods of Rationality, and he is an actual
scientist and he goes through bit by bit for all

(37:34):
of the scientific methods that Eliza writes about in his
fanfic and is like, this is why Eliza is full
of shit, Essentially, like the things he is saying don't
make sense. So it's a pretty long review because he
goes through it chapter by chapter. But hang on, let
me see if I can get a quote from the

(37:54):
fan fix, so you can kind of hear about, like
how stilted this dialogue kind of is? Hm, Harry said
his mind elsewhere. Hold on, I'm doing a Fermy calculation.
What said Professor McGonagall is sounding somewhat alarmed. It's a
mathematical thing named after Enrico Fermi, a way of getting
rough numbers quickly in your head. It's like, what why?

(38:17):
What does that have to do with any like what
is happening here?

Speaker 2 (38:20):
And again?

Speaker 1 (38:21):
These people that they're supposed to be eleven.

Speaker 2 (38:23):
Right, Well Perry is supposed to be, well Harry.

Speaker 1 (38:27):
The main characters are like Harry, Draco and Hermione uh Ron.
At some point like Ron is introduced, but is introduced
as like Harry meets him and then says about him.
I don't know why he exists.

Speaker 2 (38:41):
I don't care why people hate Ron's character so much.

Speaker 1 (38:45):
Yeah, maybe it's because people see their own flaws reflected
in him.

Speaker 2 (38:49):
I guess maybe that's.

Speaker 1 (38:51):
Kind of the point. Well, not to give j k
Rowling any credit, because fuck her.

Speaker 2 (38:55):
So I mean, listen, there's there's it kind of also
sounds like you don't like Ron and I just don't
like Harry.

Speaker 1 (39:02):
I don't like J. K Rowling.

Speaker 2 (39:03):
But I'm fair. That's fair. Listen. We can all agree
that jk Rowling is ass and her opinions are asked.
But I had I.

Speaker 1 (39:12):
Loved Ron, Okay, I yeah, I don't know why there's
like all this hate for him. I think because like
he did have he he said things in the books
that were considered like racist or speciesis but like that
was the point, is like he grew up in this yeah,
and Harry didn't, and so he's reflecting like the attitudes
of the general wizarding population. At the end of the book,

(39:33):
he does not have those beliefs anymore. Yeah, like that's
the point. Yeah, Yeah, But yeah, I I could get
into Harry Potter's stuff, but I don't. We're not going
to do that. I mean, you're you're opening the door
to it already. We're talking about Harry Potter fan fiction
right now, Chelsea. You've put us here. We are going
to be talking about Harry Potter. Is such Harry Potter
lore in my brain that I've been ignoring for the

(39:56):
last like five years. We're we're going to be talking
about it aware because you brought us here. Listen, I
know that.

Speaker 2 (40:04):
Okay, So why are you saying that you don't want
to talk about it.

Speaker 1 (40:07):
I'm saying I don't want to talk about the extens
of war that is in my brain that has been
locked behind a door. Okay, all right, but it's gonna
happen anyway. I feel like I need to be like,
we need to get a SETI and so that you
can stretch out and I can be like and how
does that make you feel? Anyway? There's also like another
part where like immediately after arriving at Hogwarts, Harry hears

(40:31):
about quiddage and like makes fun of it. Uh huh,
which I do love that strange in her YouTube video
or their YouTube video. I don't know what strangest gender is.

Speaker 2 (40:38):
I think I think at least she pronouns are used
she heard.

Speaker 1 (40:42):
But because in this video specifically, they just kept referring
to themselves as a boy. But like I think it's
bo I, like, okay, like, okay, I'm just a bully, Okay,
but I uh.

Speaker 2 (40:53):
Who's to say?

Speaker 1 (40:54):
I feel like he's safe.

Speaker 2 (40:57):
Strange as pronouns are strange and strange.

Speaker 1 (40:59):
She was the same.

Speaker 2 (41:01):
A great video.

Speaker 1 (41:01):
By the way, I've been watching a lot of their
videos now and they are excellent. No, yeah, I again,
please recommend please watch the Croaker series. I need to
infect all of my friends with this. Here's another one
from the first chapter. Mom Harry said, if you want
to win this argument with Dad, look at chapter two,
the first book of the Faban Lectures on Physics. There's
a quote there about how philosophers say a great deal

(41:23):
about what science absolutely requires, and it is all wrong
because the only rule in science is that the final
arbitra is observation, that you just have to look at
the world and report what you see again eleven.

Speaker 2 (41:33):
Mostly my thing here with the quotes and whatnot is
that there's reference to things, but there's no explanation.

Speaker 1 (41:41):
Of why that's relevant. Well, that's another thing that Dan
you actually, Dan Lou, I keep you said, Lou, Yeah,
that's another thing that Dan lou actually gets into where
and it's like he's referencing a lot of these things
essentially to sound smarter because he doesn't actually expand upon
what those things are. And it's like the whole thing
is supposed to be like, Oh, you're supposed to look
it up yourself, but in looking it up yourself, I

(42:02):
think that Eliza wants you to go to his own
website to read about this stuff. And what's interesting is actually, like,
this is a Harry Potter lore thing that I have
internalized and pissed me off for reasons that are stupid.
But one of the things that Harry actually references within
this text of fan fiction is a book that was
not published until nineteen ninety seven, but the book is

(42:25):
supposed to be taking place in nineteen ninety one, Right,
we're time traveling. Yeah, so that's like a little thing
that doesn't matter. But personally I.

Speaker 2 (42:34):
Was annoyed, like a true fan wouldn't do this, Yeah,
saying speaking no longer as a fan, Yeah, yeah, from
my understanding of what this is, and I'm sure that
you're going to go into this further, but correct me
if I'm wrong. The idea is that these the story,
this frame using Harry Potter as like a frame to

(42:55):
draw people in. Yah is supposed to be, as you said,
in every chapter, going over a different concept in rationality,
which is like talking about, for instance, the scientific method
got brought up. You mentioned but like using the method,
which is it's the steps for those of you who
have heard the term scientific method, but maybe like you know,

(43:16):
it's been a long while since you had that class
in school, or maybe you didn't have that class in school.
In a very basic sense, it's the steps by which
one tests a hypothesis or a theory. It's like we
get an idea, and these are the steps we take
to see if that idea is right or not. So

(43:38):
it is using this story as using Harry Potter as
a vehicle to explain these concepts that this guy Eliza
is thinking that everyone should be using more in life
as part of the rationalist movement. But what it sounds
like is that's heavily colored by his own agenda and opinions.

Speaker 1 (44:00):
He's also using it to solicit donations for his nonprofit,
which is called the Center for Applied Rationality, which is
where a lot of the stuff about AI really gets
into it. Okay, now, when I say that this is
a popular fan fiction, I literally mean that Harry Potter

(44:20):
and the Methods of Rationality, a fan fiction which ended
ten years ago like this year, is the third most
reviewed Harry Potter fan fiction, and in fact, if you
look up rationality, it's still like the third result in Google.

Speaker 2 (44:36):
Dang, that's kind of funny though, Yeah, that's Harry Potter.

Speaker 1 (44:40):
There is fan art. There is fan fiction of the
fan fiction. People are writing rationality stories about other fandoms.

Speaker 2 (44:49):
What did she say?

Speaker 1 (44:50):
It was called It was called a rat rat fen
or rat them or something like that. It was like,
because it's rat is short for rationality. It's like, hey,
you sure about that? There are like the fandom, but
the radom.

Speaker 2 (45:04):
I kind of love that idea though, but just in
the literal sense of it being rats. Yeah, the ratdom.

Speaker 1 (45:09):
And someone is currently like creating a graphic novel adaptation
of the of the fan fiction of the fan fiction.

Speaker 2 (45:18):
Okay, interesting yeah, interesting.

Speaker 1 (45:22):
Now, as far as the fan fiction community goes, it
was actually like at the time and still is fairly
controversial because when it started getting more and more like views,
and it started getting popularity, and it started getting like
publicity because like even in twenty eleven, I think it
was there was actually an article about him in the

(45:43):
Atlantic about how Harry Potter and the Methods of rationality
caused uproar in the fan fiction community, drawing both condemnations
and praise on online message boards for its blasphemous or
brilliant treatment of Cannon. And then there was another article
in twenty fifteen on Vice that described The Fick as
the most popular Hary Potter book you've never heard of,
and claimed most people agree that it's brilliantly written, challenging,

(46:05):
and curiously mind altering. I would like, actually to be
against that, because there is actually a lot of reviews saying,
like a lot of reviews that are praising that are
praising Eliza, saying like that rationality is great and they're
so glad they read this, but they're also saying that, like,
it does read like not a final draft. It does

(46:26):
read very clunky, and like, what's funny is a lot
of people will describe it as fan fiction for people
who don't like fan fiction.

Speaker 2 (46:32):
But it's fan fiction, right, What do you do?

Speaker 1 (46:35):
You think fan fiction is just like people writing about
like two care like Harry, Harry and Draco fucking like
is that? I think that? Is that what you think
all fan fiction is? Because let me tell you, I've
read some fan fiction that's better than the text. It's
it's based on.

Speaker 2 (46:49):
I mean definitely, that is a thing. There's also like
the wonderful genre of spiite fanfic, which exists to like
as like a fix it to the original that it
is based on.

Speaker 1 (46:58):
I don't remember. I don't know if this is still
the case, but I know in on AO three, the
highest rated Riilo fan fiction. I don't think this is
still true. But for a while it was literally like
two sentences that was like and then Ray killed Kylo ret.

Speaker 2 (47:16):
People write stuff out of spite, yeah, I mean yes,
it is like any work of fiction. We have read
published works that are horrible for this podcast, we have
read unofficial works that are very well done in our
private lives. Like it's like all literary merit, you know,
there's grades of it. Yeah, And when it comes to fanfic,

(47:40):
it is very often that people don't put as much
time into it as one would for a published work.
But also frequently it's because, like a published work often
has another person looking at it to edit it and
telling you when things don't sound like what an eleven
year old would say, right.

Speaker 1 (47:57):
And then also fan fiction is free. Fan fation fiction
is done for free. Yeah, and that's something that you
know is true because in essence, fan fiction is copyright infringement,
and some authors have come out against it. Anne Rice
over the years to the point where it's like on

(48:17):
fanfiction dot net for sure. I don't know if AO
three is still like this because I grew up on
fanfiction dot net, which is actually where this fix started,
because AO three wasn't really a thing at the time.
M hm, you know, that was like fandoms would disappear
because of authors copyright strike against the parts of the website.
Generally speaking, a lot of authors are fine with it.

(48:38):
A lot of authors have come out and said, like,
they don't They don't mind because it's just their fandom expanding.

Speaker 2 (48:44):
Right, It's not infringing upon the actual work because and
that's the whole point of it being free, is that
nobody's nobody else is making a profit off it.

Speaker 1 (48:51):
However, Eliza constantly used his fanfic to solicit donations for
his nonprofit, and he also during the final he wrote
a whole plea saying that he was trying to get
a hold of J. K Rowling and for some reason
Daniel Radcliffe to try and convince jk Rowling to let
him traditionally publish this. He's basically like, I'm sure if JK.

(49:13):
Rowling read this, she'd understand why it needs to be published,
why it's so brilliant, like tuning his own horn really hard. Yeah,
it's like, okay, but fan fiction authors have already decided
that this is not something we do because we do
not want scrutiny upon us by the actual copyright holders, because.

Speaker 2 (49:32):
We don't want lawsuits. Yeah, we don't want to be sued. Yeah,
so like, shut the fuck up, dude. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (49:38):
It's also deeply funny to me for to realize because like,
apparently some of the proponents of rationalism were like Peter
thal Elon Musk like people like that, And I'm just
sitting here, like imagine those people reading Harry Potter fan fiction.

Speaker 2 (49:50):
I mean, freaking Elon Musk a furry so like why
not I forget that?

Speaker 1 (49:54):
Yeah, I don't wish to acknowledge that about him, because Furrey's,
as far as I'm concerned, are fine. There's a It's
like any It's a vast community exactly like any any.

Speaker 2 (50:03):
Group of people. There is a myriad of different types.

Speaker 1 (50:07):
I know that, but I just hate the man.

Speaker 2 (50:10):
That's fair he's very bulliable for good reason.

Speaker 1 (50:13):
I know you said at the beginning of this that
you were unsure about calling this a cult. Yes, and
now that we've sort of very briefly talked about the
fanfic that started at all, I want to get more
into the cult itself, okay, and why I believe it
does deserve to be called a cult.

Speaker 2 (50:30):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (50:31):
Now, first of all, this fanfic is the first recorded
incidents that I know of. I could be wrong, and
if someone out there knows if I'm wrong, let me know.
Of referring to like people as NPCs, basically, like you're
an NPC, you're a non playable character if you are
someone who like the person who calls you that deems

(50:53):
you like you only have a few things you say,
like on a loop, and you don't really have much
thought behind your head, like you're not really thinking about things.

Speaker 2 (51:02):
And it's a way of devaluing the personhood of other people. Yes,
you are relegating them to the same realm as basically
like computerized characters whose only purpose is to help the
main characters of a story. Yeah, that is a whole thing.

(51:22):
Like there's I know that online. There is this trend
on like TikTok. It's like an NPC thing where people
act like NPCs and it's like a humor and.

Speaker 1 (51:30):
Like, oh, it's kind of it's like whatever.

Speaker 2 (51:32):
It's like a weird surrealist thing. But there is a
mindset separately of people who like have this kind of
weird lack of empathy where they relegate other people to
the realm of NPC as a way to dehumanize them. Yes,
I no longer have to think about you as a
full and you know, feeling human because you're just an NPC.

Speaker 1 (51:52):
It's currently like really popular among communities like QAnon and.

Speaker 2 (51:56):
Also like red Pill communities too.

Speaker 1 (51:58):
Yes, a lot of this stuff really is like a
lot of that. You can see the remnants of it
in like QAnon and the red Pill community, and I
didn't realize how much of it is, like how much
of those communities have actually been influenced by rationality to
the point where people who are in those communities now
probably have no idea about that. I would assume that
a lot of the people who are current, especially the

(52:20):
ones who are currently joining communities like that they are.

Speaker 2 (52:22):
Which rationalist communities are Quanon communities.

Speaker 1 (52:25):
Q Andon and red pill communities don't realize that a
lot of the stuff, a lot of their beliefs actually
have a basis that started within the rationality movement, and
I certainly.

Speaker 2 (52:37):
Didn't know that.

Speaker 1 (52:38):
And I have done both of those cults on this podcast.
So and it's really interesting because a lot of that
stuff that I was reading about when I were not
not just reading, when I was reading and listening about
stuff for this podcast, for this topic, I realized, like,
oh wow, a lot of this stuff is like where
like the gamer Gate people got this idea, Like I
have been called an NPC before by people that are

(53:00):
in the q and on community because I'm like, you
all are fucking stupid. Like it's crazy to me that
it's like it's always but it's like always like that
where it's like you suddenly realize that all of this stuff,
all this terror, all of these terrible communities have their
basis in one that started a while ago. It's kind
of like how when you realized for the first time
that a lot of the problems in America started with

(53:21):
Reagan sure.

Speaker 2 (53:23):
Or like how a lot of cults that we have
talked about, Doomsay cults especially, yet have a similar origin
with like Seventh day Adventist. Yes, there are concepts that
people take and spin out for a variety of reasons.
And from my understanding, like part of the rationalist movement,
it was kind of like a counter culture movement, yeah,
because a large part of society even today is founded

(53:46):
on these ideas of like religion as a as a
cornerstone of life. Yeah, and ever going all the way
back to as you mentioned earlier, like the Enlightenment that
was in part also like a pushback against religion and
embracing more like scientific thought as a way of framing
your life as.

Speaker 1 (54:06):
Opposed to religion. Which isn't to say that the two
can't coexist, because they absolutely can. But when you are
a counterculture, people who feel disenfranchised for whatever reason will
kind of flock to the counterculture. Yeah, and then those
people who maybe they become disenfranchised even from that counterculture group,

(54:27):
spin off and make their own counterculture groups, and then
you get.

Speaker 2 (54:29):
Like these cesspools essentially on the internet.

Speaker 1 (54:32):
So the thing about rationality, while we are starting with
Harry Potter fan fiction and that's very fun, I already
talked about how it has currently devolved into very much Aliko,
we need to protect ourselves from AI. And that's kind
of where we get into how this definitely has become
more cult like. And that's not even that's not even

(54:53):
including the like offset that happened that ended up with
six people being murdered. That's just like the evolution of
the last ten years into how rationality has become like
the main thing is to separate itself and try and
protect humanity from artificial intelligence. Okay, and we are going
to get into that in the next episode. Oh we

(55:13):
already are already at an hour.

Speaker 2 (55:15):
Oh dang, yeah crazy. Well all right, well, thank you
for giving us this little setup.

Speaker 1 (55:21):
Yeah, Chelsea, it's gonna next episode's gonna suck. Okay, I'm sorry.
Oh all right, I'll gird myself then I will be girded.
Any takeaways so far, I.

Speaker 2 (55:34):
Mean, I definitely can see. My takeaway so far from
our conversation is that when it comes to any movement
created by humans, it's going to be colored by humans.
And I do think it's really interesting this whole vehicle,
because this is not the first time of people trying
to use fiction as a way as like a gateway

(55:56):
to their ideals. Because that's you even mentioned si intology, Yeah,
which was a similar thing like freaking l Ron Hubbard
was a science fiction author, Yeah, and he wrote his works.
He based his world building on the concepts of science
fiction and that's how he drew people in. And it's
it's I didn't.

Speaker 1 (56:16):
Even get to there's like a whole thing in this
fanfic that is reminiscent of Enders Game, but like taking
the exact wrong lesson from Anders Game. Yeah, I don't
even think Enders Game is that good, like fuck Orson
Scott Card, but like, damn, it's one of these things
where it's.

Speaker 2 (56:29):
It's And also when you were talking about how like
they I didn't want to say it at the time,
when you're talking about like why they yesified between you
and I was like, well, it's because it's a dude,
bro who wrote it. Like that's why. Absolutely, It's like
it's because it's that whole thing where it's like, well,
obviously she is hot, so she's able to get this
guy who's not Vernon.

Speaker 1 (56:44):
There's also this line apparently where like Draco says something
again eleven year old Draco says something about how he
can't wait till he's older so he can rape someone. Okay, Yeah,
Like that's in the text. That's like a line in
one of the earlier chapters, all right, which is a
setup for the shit that we're going to have to
get into in the second part.

Speaker 2 (57:04):
It's this concept that exists of people who view themselves
as intellectually superior for whatever reason, saying, because I.

Speaker 1 (57:13):
Am so smart, the things that I am saying are right,
and the things that I believe are right, even if
I can't necessarily explain to you why, But because I'm smart,
they're better. And that kind of is funny in the
context of the rationalist movement, because the idea is that
you should be able to explain everything. So that whole
idea of like, well, I'm so smart that all of

(57:33):
my feelings are correct, even the feelings that I have
that are not based on like actual fact.

Speaker 2 (57:41):
Yeah, it's silly to me, and it does. It does
go to show that, like all systems created by human
beings are going to be flawed in some way or
another because human beings are flawed.

Speaker 1 (57:51):
So the problem that ends up happening is that while
a lot of the ideas we're talking about right now
are kind of silly, like the whole thing. It's like,
oh my god, this tech thing, like this tex self
help workshop that costs nearly four thousand dollars started from
Harry Potter fan fiction.

Speaker 2 (58:06):
I don't know if that statement's true.

Speaker 1 (58:08):
Well, but so I'm saying, like, wait, what part of
that statement?

Speaker 2 (58:12):
The tech self help thing didn't start from a Harry Potter.

Speaker 1 (58:14):
I mean these specific workshops, right, but they didn't Elizar
started them. Well not, Actually it was not Elizar specifically. Yeah,
it was someone that he had employed that then took
his ideas and made the workshop with his blessings. So
it still has its basis.

Speaker 2 (58:33):
It's in the same way Twilight the book series exists
because nine to eleven happened. Okay, in that same way.
It's like a domino effect occurred.

Speaker 1 (58:41):
They promoted the fan fiction at these workshops though, true,
But that doesn't mean the fan fiction started the workshop. Well,
the workshop started because of Eliza's popularity, because of the
fan fiction. He existed before the fanfag He existed before
the fanfic, but his popularity didn't grow until the fanfic
game popularity.

Speaker 2 (59:00):
Okay, sure, but I guess from my understanding and maybe
I am wrong. I'll totally agnowledge this because you're the
one who did the deeper research on it. From my understanding,
he was speaking on these topics before he wrote the
fanfic as a way to try and get people's attention
onto him his blog, and everything took off because of
the popularity of the fanfic. Yeah, he was involved in

(59:20):
a nonprofit that was trying to do rationalist education essentially,
which a member of that spun off to create a
different nonprofit that was doing these workshops.

Speaker 1 (59:32):
So the nonprofit that Eliza had, because it wasn't that
that was a nonprofit that he owned that he started.

Speaker 2 (59:39):
Yes, and then an employee, Yeah, that nonprofit created a
different nonprofit for the workshop for the workshops.

Speaker 1 (59:47):
Yes, yes, but that employee, like that whole structure existed
because of Eliza's popularity because of the Harry Potter fan fiction.

Speaker 2 (59:55):
Right, which is why I'm saying it's like the the
nine to eleven Domino effect.

Speaker 1 (59:59):
I think it's a little bit more more related than that.

Speaker 2 (01:00:01):
Okay, I can understand why you think that, Yeah, because.

Speaker 1 (01:00:05):
They're still like the workshops still like reference the fan fiction.

Speaker 2 (01:00:11):
People who took the workshops without knowing that, yes, but
the workshops existed.

Speaker 1 (01:00:17):
Because of the fan fiction in a sense, yes, okay, yes,
in a sense, yes, okay, yeah, that's yeah. We're gonna
we're gonna get into correspondence and corrections. Yeah, but first
quick words. So first, the Blue.

Speaker 2 (01:00:39):
Sky guy, Chelsea, your mom messaged us.

Speaker 1 (01:00:43):
We've talked about that last time, did we not? We did?

Speaker 2 (01:00:47):
Okay, so sorry, I thought so where we were starting. No,
you're right, yes, we did talk my brain she no, good.

Speaker 1 (01:00:54):
That's okay. You're gonna be traveling very soon across the
international date line, so I'm sure.

Speaker 2 (01:01:00):
You would think that that's what I need my brain
the most. I'm going to be going to a foreign country,
so this is a bad sign. Actually, that's what I
was getting at, Okay, So that I should be worried
is what we're getting ash here.

Speaker 1 (01:01:12):
Maybe you're just a little scattered from you know, packing
and planning.

Speaker 2 (01:01:15):
I think a lot of the anxiety, Yeah for sure.
But yeah, so Rosary Snow says, just finish re listening
to episode one oh six, where are you From?

Speaker 1 (01:01:26):
Where'd you Go?

Speaker 2 (01:01:27):
And just Christina saying if.

Speaker 1 (01:01:29):
A ghost can punch me, then I can punch a
ghost in the most ferrol Way filled me.

Speaker 2 (01:01:34):
With great joy, love that. I'm glad that that could
help you, inspire you, make you happy, because I still
think that's true.

Speaker 1 (01:01:41):
Turbo Turtles sent to us a TikTok link and it
says it's a TikTok link but it's a perfect shirt
for y'all. And now I got to see what it is.

Speaker 2 (01:01:48):
Oh boy, here'll we go.

Speaker 1 (01:01:51):
What the fuck? It's a Mothman shirt. Apparently Mothman aiate
my entire ass set a Denny's. Fantastic. I love it, fantastic.
Mothman ate my entire ass at Denny's at a Denny's amazing.

Speaker 2 (01:02:08):
Yep, Master you know, says Pope Amon gotta bless slash
molest them all. Depending on how you're feeling about the church.
I feel like it depends on who's producing this, because
if it's a church produced production, then you have the
new Pope mascot, whose name I believe is Luce blessing

(01:02:30):
them all. If it is not a church production, then
who's to say at.

Speaker 1 (01:02:35):
Blank Spaces eighty four also gives us a Mountain Dew
conspiracy oh on a YouTube video about it.

Speaker 2 (01:02:41):
Which putting that on the tool watch list. Thank you.
Issa Fox sends us a.

Speaker 1 (01:02:49):
I hope this isn't a real thing, but it probably
is anyway, It's really funny, but it is funny the layers.

Speaker 2 (01:02:54):
So it is a screenshot from a service that uses
AI to detect the of images.

Speaker 1 (01:03:01):
Which horrifying if real. As a concept, the flawed in
so many ways. But somebody has put a hairless feathered
I can't even talk fatherless chicken.

Speaker 2 (01:03:13):
A feather was chicken. A chicken has been plucked an
image of that into it and it says with ninety
one point six six percent confidence, it is me mad,
which is hilarious to me.

Speaker 1 (01:03:24):
If you know the behold man, yes, the man.

Speaker 2 (01:03:27):
The whole thing with yeah, uh god, that's funny as
an idea. I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:03:36):
I hope that this is not Yes, I hope it
is and isn't real for I think some more reasons
to you. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah yeah. Tamaradlon said sorry
at C three podcast, but the bottomy was invented in
nineteen thirty five, so while the damage they did was massive,
they weren't commonly used for that long, having a massive
spike in the nineteen forties, but from the fifties were
already being abandoned.

Speaker 2 (01:03:57):
That's good.

Speaker 1 (01:03:57):
Mental health treatment in the eighteen hundreds consist mostly out
of twenty four hour restraints, electroshock treatment, icepaths, and sedation.
So definitely not a good time and completely useless. They
did try to become more humane, but overcrowding off. But
overcrowding I think it's supposed to be often meant that
they would revert back to earlier practices. Oof.

Speaker 2 (01:04:17):
I mean, I'm glad that it wasn't, you know, Comparatively speaking,
it was a fairly short period of our history.

Speaker 1 (01:04:23):
Yeah, glad for that.

Speaker 2 (01:04:25):
Still too long, Still too long, agreed. American Rando says.
The woman digging under her house might be motivated by
meth to find a dragon and see God. Someone needs
to check the local National Guard armory to make sure
the tanks are all locked up, because there's precedent for
these things.

Speaker 1 (01:04:41):
The nineteen ninety five San Diego tank rampage link to
the tank rampage. Who boy, people died.

Speaker 2 (01:04:47):
Yeah. I was there for that. Yeah, not like in
the sense that I'd watched it happened, but in the sense.

Speaker 1 (01:04:52):
That I was nineteen five, so you were three.

Speaker 2 (01:04:54):
I was depending in May, I would have been two. Yeah,
not yet two. Oh, I would have been I would
have been turning two that year. Okay, so i'd have
been one and some change. Existing in San Diego at
the time. How old my sister is two and a
half years old than me.

Speaker 1 (01:05:11):
Yeah, she's younger than me. I keep she would have
been forgetting she's younger than me.

Speaker 2 (01:05:14):
She would have been four at the time.

Speaker 1 (01:05:15):
Yeah, I was five, but I don't remember it happens.

Speaker 2 (01:05:20):
And also you weren't in San Diego.

Speaker 1 (01:05:21):
I wasn't, but I was in California, so it was
like reported on Yeah, no, for sure. Also the Catholic
church handing over any sort of criminal to the real cops,
like ever, surely you just I don't do that now
if they can get away with it, and oh boy,
they can, they get away with it, sometimes with help
from the New Orleans Saints.

Speaker 2 (01:05:40):
I oh boy, there's a whole Yeah, that's a whole thing.
Oh boy. Blank Spaces eighty four says there were up
where the juceppe is supposed to overlook the convent, or
are they supposed to oversee the convent? I may have
said overlook, but I meant to say oversea. Yeah, because
the argument could be made that they did in fact
overlook great many things. That's true, which is very fair. No,

(01:06:03):
I definitely meant to say oversea, but you are right,
they did in fact overlook quite a lot.

Speaker 1 (01:06:09):
Ye at niblic. The third says, I can cope with
the fact that two of my siblings were born after
nine to eleven and are fully adults. The part that
really f's me up is my other sibling doesn't remember
because he wasn't quite three. The idea you could have
existed in the world and be unaware throws me off entirely.
I was twelve and a half and it is seared
so fully into my brain. I just never thought he
wouldn't have any memory until we went to New York

(01:06:29):
several years ago and we had two very different experiences
of the memorial. Oh boy, yeah, I was eleven.

Speaker 2 (01:06:34):
I remember. It's one of those things which is very
interesting because I was. I was young when it happened,
and so like I also, my memory sucks, so I
don't have like a vivid memory of like where was
I on the day, but I definitely it shaped my
life happening, and I remember like a pretty vivid memory.

Speaker 1 (01:06:52):
But I was in seventh grade. Yeah, like you were.
You were like fully a little person. Yes, like you
were an adult, but you were like a fully functional
little I was a fully functional little person.

Speaker 2 (01:07:02):
Yeah. I don't know if I'm even seventh grade a
fully functional person to this day. Yeah, both of us
over here doing our best. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:07:10):
This is another TikTok video.

Speaker 2 (01:07:12):
This is a This is from Blake Space is eighty
four and it just says rage.

Speaker 1 (01:07:17):
Oh it's people talking about how if it's a series
or anthology, the spines need to match. I agree with that. Yes,
I agree with that. I know that, Like, I don't
know if this is one of them, but I yeah,
that's so annoying. But I remember someone saying, like every
single one of the Twilight books do not match. It's
one of those things where like if all of them
don't match, fine, but if one of them doesn't match,

(01:07:40):
that's more egregious than if.

Speaker 2 (01:07:42):
That's that's a sin. I'm gonna throw hands.

Speaker 1 (01:07:44):
I'm just watching this. I want to see if they
bring up the Twilight one.

Speaker 2 (01:07:48):
No they don't, but yeah, I think that they're going
along with the idea of like some of them matching
but some not. Mostly just the idea of like books being.

Speaker 1 (01:07:56):
Different sizes as like far as the height of the
book goes, so like with the Twilight books, Midnight Sun
does not match the height of the rest of them,
which is a sin.

Speaker 2 (01:08:05):
Yes, that's that's an affront to God.

Speaker 1 (01:08:07):
Yeah, so at American Random or aw electric says big
Mood and it's a retweet from an ouder news And yeah,
it's just an odder yelling big mood. Know, worry about it, malice,
like concerned when you when you start shouting, he becomes worried,

(01:08:28):
and you know what, good on him? Good on him.
Shall I read you an email? Child? I'd love for
you to read me an email.

Speaker 2 (01:08:34):
Then I will do so.

Speaker 1 (01:08:36):
Before we get to the rest of the emails, our listener,
James keeps sending us emails from the federal government.

Speaker 2 (01:08:44):
I don't think we're supposed to say that. James doing
it right.

Speaker 1 (01:08:46):
James said it was fine to name them, Okay, never mind.
Then I don't think James is their real name. James
has been forwarding us all the like emails from doge. Yeah,
it's been a time.

Speaker 2 (01:08:58):
Oh boy. Yeah, it's a lot of this stuff about
Like there's for for one thing. The most recent one
was about a lot of people who are rumored to
be letting getting let go the reduction in force that's coming,
and how it's going to affect a lot of people.
It's really depressing because they're trying to get people to

(01:09:18):
voluntarily resign again and like, don't do it if you
work in a government job, and they're just like, oh, yeah,
we'll pay your severance or whatever, like voluntarily leave your position, don't.

Speaker 1 (01:09:29):
Don't do it.

Speaker 2 (01:09:30):
They won't pay you, but they're not going to do it.

Speaker 1 (01:09:32):
They're not going to pay you. And also like just yeah,
it's yeah, I do not trust those people to pay
out the seference they're supposed to, or at least they
will fight to do because they have to because of
the union. They're like they're going to fight not to
because yeah, whatever they already defined the Supreme Court.

Speaker 2 (01:09:50):
Whatever they promised you that is above what is like
legally they're supposed to give you, you're not going to get.
And then whatever they're legally supposed to give you, they're
not going to try. They're going to try and avoid
giving you. Yeah, any who shall I read you an
email from I believe Yolanda is where we are? Uh
the episode two ninety seven? Yeah, all right, so here

(01:10:11):
we go. Hi, y'all wanted to add a little to
the discussion you had at the end of episode two
ninety seven about men's rights. It's something that has been
popping up a lot more in recent years due to
growing extremism, and I wanted to share my experience with
it as someone who's quite outspoken about feminism in my small,
conservative enough town. You are one hundred percent on the
mark with the it's used as a gotcha. One thing

(01:10:34):
that a lot of everyday men don't seem to understand
is that if they want change, they have to be
the ones that make it. There is International Men's Day,
but there but because there are no large amounts of
men stepping out and speaking about it. It's only the
red pill men that say, you don't want a quality.
You didn't talk about Men's Day. There's still an expectation
that women will organize solution to men's problems. One thing

(01:10:57):
we have here in Australia not sure about other countries.

Speaker 1 (01:11:00):
Is November. We have that too. I thought it was
no or is this a different thing? This is a
different thing.

Speaker 2 (01:11:06):
Oh, men grow mustaches or mows and campaign for men's
health mental or physical. Because yeah, I'm not thinking of
no shave.

Speaker 1 (01:11:14):
November, which is like you're thinking of no not November.

Speaker 2 (01:11:17):
I was not thinking about non November.

Speaker 1 (01:11:20):
I do know that one there is no shave November.
The same thing, yea, the same thing, just with a
slightly different name. But I've also heard I've heard it
in the US referred to as November as well.

Speaker 2 (01:11:31):
Okay, that's good to know. However, there's still quite a
bit of pushback about it from other men, with comments
about how it's not right for men to talk about
his feelings just to say that.

Speaker 1 (01:11:40):
The idea about advocating.

Speaker 2 (01:11:42):
For men's health is good, but until the general male
population can stop bullying each other, I don't think it's
going to be it's going to go very far. The
biggest thing is be the change you wish to see
in the world, and that's absolutely the thing. The patriarchy
hurts everyone because the patriarchy is also telling men they
can't express their feelings, even if they're feelings are being
in pain or suffering because they're being mistreated. It's like

(01:12:04):
you're allowed to say that you're being mistreated and the
fact that, you know, when you're younger, if you said that,
if you were allowed to say that more often, then
maybe you wouldn't feel so bad as an adult, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:12:17):
Maybe, Yeah, just talk about our feelings. I should get
everyone a couch.

Speaker 2 (01:12:21):
How does that make you feel?

Speaker 1 (01:12:22):
Group couch, group couch.

Speaker 2 (01:12:24):
Thanks for being a bright spot in this world that
in this world that's crumbling so far. Attempted coup in
South Korea. German government has fallen apart.

Speaker 1 (01:12:33):
This is December.

Speaker 2 (01:12:34):
Yeah, French government has fallen apart. Billionaires getting shot in
the street and the many continuing wars.

Speaker 1 (01:12:39):
Yeah, but the billionaires getting shot in the street isn't
like a bath.

Speaker 2 (01:12:41):
It's not. I mean like we're here for that party.
And also I feel like the German government kind of
is coming back from it. I don't know about France. Actually,
the Korean government corrected. The Korean government correct Korean. No,
France corrected too, because France just prosecuted they're far right extremists.

(01:13:02):
Oh nice, leader of the far right extremist party. I
think campaign finance crimes.

Speaker 1 (01:13:08):
People are working on it, just not us. People are
working on it without just not us. Yes, it's been
a tough and crazy year, but the episodes, while sometimes suppressing,
keep me going. Anyways, Sorry for the long email, Yolanda,
and this was not a long email.

Speaker 2 (01:13:23):
You're doing great, Yolanda. Thank you very much.

Speaker 1 (01:13:25):
Thank you.

Speaker 2 (01:13:25):
Photos are photos are deer that turned up in my
very suburban town. My cat taking full advantage of me
dropping the cat biscuits. Aunts cat sitting on an ice
cream truck.

Speaker 1 (01:13:36):
I love this.

Speaker 2 (01:13:37):
I want to see all of these images.

Speaker 1 (01:13:39):
Show me this aw cute kitty. Oh, dear, is actually
pretty cute.

Speaker 2 (01:13:45):
Sorry, I'm just looking at this cat going to town
on all of these kiddy biscuits.

Speaker 1 (01:13:49):
Love it. Stitches used to punch the food robot I
do when she would full body attack it. Yeah, because
she knew that she was stronger. Yeah, she knew she could. Meanwhile,
Cinder will just sit by her food bowl quietly and
patiently until I see her, and then I'm like, oh,
I'm sorry, Are you asking for me to feed you polite?

(01:14:11):
She has polite? It's weird.

Speaker 2 (01:14:13):
Uh?

Speaker 1 (01:14:13):
Do we have time for another one? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:14:15):
This one's short, okay, So, dear Chelsea, Christina and mal
this is my name and a Slovenian topic suggestion so
this is from your and h They helpfully give me
an anime reference for how it's supposed to be said,
which is, I guess how I need to be taught,
because it is successful.

Speaker 1 (01:14:32):
It's me.

Speaker 2 (01:14:33):
You're from Slowenia, since you would like to know. My
name is pronounced to Dusley. The ju are part is
pronounced the same way as the 're from ury on ice.
Thank you.

Speaker 1 (01:14:43):
The e is pronounced like the e in a you know,
like when you make a noncamental sound, so kind of
like ury with a silent h ury.

Speaker 2 (01:14:53):
Good to know. Thank you, it does help. Hope this helps.
It does. Thank you.

Speaker 1 (01:14:57):
Now on the topic suggestion, which is we will read
this on air. A nineteen ninety five artifact found in
a cave in northwest Slovenia, which is either a musical
instrument or a piece of trued up bone. You decide
that's fun.

Speaker 2 (01:15:12):
The houses did the diva baba flute bebe flute?

Speaker 1 (01:15:17):
That is no idea.

Speaker 2 (01:15:19):
Ooh, this is very cool.

Speaker 1 (01:15:22):
This is neat. These holes look way too precise to be.

Speaker 2 (01:15:24):
I was just thinking that they look really regular. Yeah,
the holes look incredibly regular for.

Speaker 1 (01:15:31):
That to be just unintentional. Yeah, yeah, but who's to say,
who's to say?

Speaker 2 (01:15:39):
This is interesting to us?

Speaker 1 (01:15:40):
Thank you, thank you your and that is it for today. Yes, uh,
thank you, thank you. Listeners sending thing.

Speaker 2 (01:15:50):
If you have something that you would like us to know,
if you want to correct our pronunciation about something, if
you want to talk to us about your feelings or
your area of expertise.

Speaker 1 (01:15:58):
If you have read this fan fiction yep, and you
have opinions about it, please tell us. Please, We would
love to know them, because I didn't read it again
because I love.

Speaker 2 (01:16:07):
My Hey, here's the thing. I don't think you need
to subject yourself to that.

Speaker 1 (01:16:11):
Thank you. I think that you should be able to wife.
Is way too short for you to look at all
of that and.

Speaker 2 (01:16:16):
Be like, yeah, I'll read this. Don't do that to yourself, Chelsea,
I understand.

Speaker 1 (01:16:20):
Thank you. We have experts for that. Who did read it.
They did that burden. It's the guy with arms, spreads
and knives coming down into his back, you know what
I mean. Protecting the sleeping child, yes, yes, except it's
it's for the night, protecting the mating yes.

Speaker 2 (01:16:38):
Yeah, except that it's it's Dan lou and protecting you
from from Harry Potter and Dan.

Speaker 1 (01:16:45):
Lou for the for the work you've done for your
good works.

Speaker 2 (01:16:50):
Anyway, if you have thoughts, feelings, opinions, questions, comments, or concerns,
feel free to email us at.

Speaker 1 (01:16:56):
Cult Scripted Conspiracies at gmail dot com. Alternative you can
go two hours. Social media is we have a blue
sky at C three podcast. We also have a Patreon
Patreon dot com, slash cult Scripteds Conspiracies or alterna well,
you can go directly to our website where we have
everything linked for your convenience, which is cult Scriptedsconspiracies dot com.
Or what you could do is you could write your

(01:17:17):
own fan fiction that is pushing your own ideology, but
in the way of like you pick a popular media
and then say, I'm going to take this, but I'm
going to use this to write my bible. Whatever. It's
a one hundred thousand word bible.

Speaker 2 (01:17:30):
Yeah, whatever it is. It doesn't have to be about
like your thoughts about like philosophy or whatever. It could
be about anything you could decide in a very like
delicious in Dungeon way you want to write this is
like a really long form way of getting people to
read your recipes.

Speaker 1 (01:17:44):
I love that shit, though, Like, yeah, I just read
a book that the end of every chapter had a
recipe from something that appeared within the chapter, and I
think you mentioned that to me screenshot at all of them.

Speaker 2 (01:17:53):
Nice, very good. I think that that would be fun.
Just write more books as vehicles talking about your hyperfixation.

Speaker 1 (01:18:02):
That's my opinion about Hell yeah. We'll be back next
week with the continuation of Chelsea's topic on the rationalist
movement a cult. Who's the same question Chelsea is the
one to say next time? Goodbye Chelsea by Christina byel
and still hear his voice