Episode 410: Where Is Holly?

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:24):
Hi, Christina, Hey, Chelsea, Hey, Now, how's it going.

Speaker 2 (00:32):
How's it going, dude, I'm great, I'm fine.

Speaker 3 (00:35):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (00:36):
Yeah, not many deep thoughts, to be honest. We talked
a lot about cleaning, said, we.

Speaker 3 (00:42):
Talked fur babies who accumulate much fur.

Speaker 2 (00:46):
Yeah, I'm just that's honestly, that's what's in my head.
I was like, what should I clean next? What would
be efficient? You know, stuff like that.

Speaker 3 (00:52):
It's hard. The office is one of the hardest places
to clean because there's so much ship in here.

Speaker 2 (00:56):
But also the office is where the least fur is attracted,
which is we because I don't think that's true.

Speaker 3 (01:01):
I think it's I think it's all trapped in little
nooks and cranky.

Speaker 2 (01:05):
It's just out of view. Yeah, that.

Speaker 1 (01:08):
Was the noun side of having many things like I,
as you both know, my maximalist, I also have much stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:14):
You have, We all have much staff people.

Speaker 3 (01:16):
I don't having makes sense to me.

Speaker 1 (01:18):
No, I need some stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:19):
What are they called keys?

Speaker 1 (01:20):
Chat keys? Yeah, knickknacks, chrach keys, the good stuff and dusting.
It is a nightmare. Yes, that is the thing where
it's like, I love having all of these possessions, but
God do they get dusty.

Speaker 2 (01:33):
We just found a hand one, like a swift bought
and only.

Speaker 3 (01:37):
Just found it. I don't know how long we've had it.

Speaker 2 (01:39):
I think had since we moved here.

Speaker 1 (01:41):
Yeah, there was a thing I was reading and it
sparked a memory for me when I was much like
my my childhood days in the nineties, when there was
somebody was talking about like old TVs and how it's wild,
like like the like the cathode rate like tube TVs. Yeah,
and how wild it was that like that was a

(02:02):
technology we just had in our houses because of the
radiation they were giving off, like not a lot of it,
but certainly some. And then talking about how there was
like old TVs would just build up a static and
you could feel it if you touch the screen. And
I'm like, I do remember this. I do remember having
the TV and having like that crackle in. But also

(02:24):
there was apparently a device. It was like it was
a duster that was specifically designed to pick up a charge.
If you rubbed it over the screen, it would pick
up the static from the TV so it'd be easier
to pick dust up. Oh, it was a more efficient
duster that they specifically made so that it's like, Okay,
turn your TV on, wipe it over the screen so

(02:45):
that it will pick up the electricity from the TV,
and then clean the rest of your house.

Speaker 2 (02:50):
And you're gonna have to dust your screen anyway.

Speaker 1 (02:51):
You have to dust your screen anyway.

Speaker 3 (02:53):
Ye had siblings, did you ever do the thing where
you like you have a sibling like I did?

Speaker 1 (02:57):
I had I sibling.

Speaker 3 (02:57):
Did you ever do the thing where you collected the
static just to show.

Speaker 1 (03:01):
No, that wasn't so much this. The warfare in my
household was much more like psychological.

Speaker 2 (03:08):
No.

Speaker 1 (03:08):
There, we punched each other so so it was it was.

Speaker 3 (03:13):
Tyler got taller than me very quickly, and the only
leverage I had, And I'm I'm like ashamed to say
this because obviously like siblings do things to each other
that they shouldn't. But the only leverage I had was
pulling his hair, because it's like I couldn't, I couldn't
beat him size wise. He was bigger than me. So
I'm like, well, pulling hair hurts.

Speaker 2 (03:35):
So I think you saw all I got, Christine, you
sent in a previous episode that you very quickly grew
taller than your sibling.

Speaker 1 (03:42):
I know if it was quickly because I grew I
was fourteen when I when I outgrew her quickly. But
I was a freshman in high school. Tyler in elementary school.
I'm pretty sure.

Speaker 2 (03:52):
Yeah, your family line is.

Speaker 1 (03:54):
And also you were small.

Speaker 2 (03:55):
You're still small, and I'm still small. You're small, I
mean Tyler's small technique, I mean is average height for
a man. It's weird because in my hometown, I'm small.

Speaker 3 (04:04):
In your average height. I don't think an inch taller
than the average.

Speaker 2 (04:08):
And don't I don't believe you too. You're like five
foot nine, right, yeah, yeah, that's like the advertising. Yeah,
but everyone in my hometown's like six foot.

Speaker 1 (04:15):
Five in the water in Presno.

Speaker 2 (04:18):
Yeah, Tyler's the shortest.

Speaker 3 (04:20):
On my mom's side of the family. Because on my
mom's side of the family, all the women are short
and all the men are like over six feet and
then there's Tyler, who's like five ten.

Speaker 1 (04:27):
My sister is five three. I'm five to five. But
both of us were very small. Yeah, both of us
were very small. I was smaller growing up. I didn't
get taller until later in life. She grew to the height.
She was going to be faster than I was. Yeah,
so like she very much used her larger size to
destroy me as a child.

Speaker 2 (04:47):
Yeah, like I pick you up in wrestling style destroy you. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (04:51):
But also like when I have a distinct memory of
being like four and her being six and her shoving
me down and making me give her a pony ride
when she was twenty pounds heavier than Jesus and I
was four years old, and that was a routine thing.

Speaker 2 (05:05):
Wow.

Speaker 1 (05:06):
Uh No, Like I said, there was, there was some
some furious bullying in my household to Tyler, but that
was not that bad.

Speaker 2 (05:13):
I gotta ask the times that you do see your sister, Now,
do you both ever lock eyes and just the memory
flashes between you both at the same time, Like, do
you ever get that feeling?

Speaker 1 (05:21):
There was a time, There was a period of time
because I think I've mentioned this again when I was
a freshman in high school, I outgrew her. I was taller,
I weighed more, I also had a black belt in
taekwondo by that point, excellent, And there was a moment
where I did just pick her up and like throw her,
and I think at that moment she realized there was

(05:41):
like a flash of true fear where she was like, oh,
I can't do this anymore.

Speaker 2 (05:46):
I can't.

Speaker 1 (05:47):
Things have got to change.

Speaker 2 (05:48):
I can't time out. Yeah, hold.

Speaker 1 (05:52):
No, we don't. We have a very good relationship now.
My sister and I we do not actively wrestle anymore.

Speaker 3 (05:58):
Well, you're in your thirty so I hope you.

Speaker 1 (06:00):
Would be wild. I mean some people still do. Some
you just don't have like a very horse horse and relationships.

Speaker 2 (06:06):
Yeah no, my brother and I, we can't. He's ripped.
We can't do that. Yeah, he's he's strong unnaturally, so
sometimes don't.

Speaker 1 (06:15):
Like when we first started dating.

Speaker 3 (06:16):
There, you guys were in your twenties and you still
had like brotherly like tension where it would like boil over.
But now that you're both in.

Speaker 2 (06:23):
Your thirties, why did you say we used to it's
still attention. No, but it was like it was worse.

Speaker 1 (06:28):
It was so much worse.

Speaker 3 (06:29):
Yeah, I know you're both married now, like you both
settled down a bit. You still like go at each other,
but like with words, not with fists.

Speaker 2 (06:38):
I feel like if you give them long enough in
each other's proximity. That's why I don't visit home for
long periods of time.

Speaker 3 (06:44):
You gotta put Luna in the middle as a buffer
because then Luna's there, You're not going to do anything
to each other.

Speaker 2 (06:49):
Oh yeah, we spent a prolonged period of time with Luna,
my niece. She's five now.

Speaker 1 (06:54):
Yeah, time pass I remember the birth of that child exactly.

Speaker 2 (07:00):
Time passes.

Speaker 3 (07:00):
Well, we have we have videos because she when we
first met her, not when we first met her, but
like shortly after she was born, a few months after
she was born, she came her parents and her came
to visit, and Minda was We had just gotten Mina,
So we have videos of them together. When Minna is
a puppy, it's like an infant.

Speaker 2 (07:18):
They're just like happy. Yeah, Minna, you were once happy.

Speaker 3 (07:22):
She is happy.

Speaker 2 (07:23):
She's laying down now.

Speaker 1 (07:24):
This is welcome everyone to cult cryptids and siblings, where
some of you have them. Some of you were the
aggressor and some of you were the aggressie.

Speaker 2 (07:33):
Yeah, listen, siblings are overrated.

Speaker 3 (07:35):
Were the aggressor and some of you were the victim.

Speaker 1 (07:38):
Some of you learned how to had the experience that
I did where you became larger and stronger and you
annihilated your older siblings. Yeah, and the dynamic swiftly changed
that happens sometimes, Yeah, flash of a moment. I am
the older sibling who got the turntables. The tables do
be turning sometimes, listen, that's just the way of it.

(08:00):
Sometimes the younger sibling gets good.

Speaker 3 (08:04):
I knew it would happen, so I had to put
all my bullying in early.

Speaker 1 (08:12):
Savage savagery.

Speaker 2 (08:14):
But anyway, welcome, This is us going on tangents like usual.

Speaker 3 (08:18):
Yeah, we do that.

Speaker 1 (08:19):
Yeah, I thought your chair was spreeaking. I thought it
was cinder, and I thought like she was actually why
she why she's screaming, But it was not cinder. I
don't know if it's ever made a sound in my presence.

Speaker 3 (08:28):
Hello.

Speaker 2 (08:30):
You know. The thing is sometimes we'll like look at
her and be like hello, like you just said, and
she will respond yeah, but it's so rare.

Speaker 3 (08:37):
She's not as vocal as well. She's definitely not as
vocal as Stitch. As was Stitches would have full conversations
with you. She's not as vocal as Spock is.

Speaker 1 (08:46):
Spock is so vocal val will he'll like, we talked
about this last time. He just comes up beings yeah
and constantly.

Speaker 3 (08:53):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (08:55):
I feel like she's not very vocal. Oh no, he is, Oh,
he is. He is only at certain times. He yells
when he doesn't know where Spock is and he wants
Spock to be there. He yells when he first wakes
up and Spock is not as close to him as
he wants him to be, like they'll still be next
to each other. But if he wakes up and Spock
is away from him, he just goes and he sounds
so sad. He yells if I'm not in bed when
he wants to go to bed, and he'll come and

(09:16):
yell at me. Sometimes he just yells for no reason.

Speaker 2 (09:21):
Yeah, he'll walk up.

Speaker 1 (09:22):
To you and yell, and then you pet him and
then he looks at you like you've disgusted him because
you touched him, and it'll run away to clean himself.
And I'm like, you came and yelled at me, what
do you want?

Speaker 3 (09:31):
And then Egg. I've heard Egg before, but he's not
nearly as well.

Speaker 2 (09:34):
Yeah, but the noise as he makes are usually sneezes
and coughs.

Speaker 1 (09:39):
He's an ill little man.

Speaker 3 (09:40):
Cinder only does the where are you noise if she
like falls asleep in the same room as Minna and
wakes up and Minna's not there, which doesn't happen very often.
But when it happens, I'm always I always have that
like panic response at first, because it doesn't happen very often.

Speaker 1 (09:55):
Right, So you're like, oh no, because it sounds like
something's wrong. Whenever they make that noise, it's like, oh,
this is a clear sound of distress, which is as intended,
like they're making that noise because they want you to
find them. Yeah, because they're like, oh no, I'm alone.

Speaker 3 (10:09):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (10:10):
Cats. Anyway, we normally don't talk about siblings and cats.
I mean, we talk about that actually cast for this log.
We that's not the point of.

Speaker 2 (10:18):
This podcast this time.

Speaker 1 (10:21):
The point of this podcast is to talk about cult, scriptids,
and conspiracies. Those are normally the topics that we discuss,
as well as sometimes we talk about science or history
or weird phenomenon or mysterious disappearances or strange objects or ghosts. Shot.
Oh snap.

Speaker 2 (10:37):
Also, you said this week's a bummer.

Speaker 1 (10:39):
It is, you did mention it, but it's super interesting.
That is kind of the thing is like, listen, sometimes
it's a bummer, but it's fun in the way.

Speaker 2 (10:49):
It's like these things are horrible, but I enjoy the
process of learning.

Speaker 3 (10:53):
Yeah, this one's fascinating. I think so you were saying
you thought I said that this would be two episodes.
I think it was possible, but when I started researching it,
I was hoping it was two episodes. There's not as
much information on an aspect of it as I thought
there would be. A nice to get there will explain.

Speaker 1 (11:08):
Okay, okay, but before we get to there, I'm going
to throw to sponsors. Does anyone speak now and hold
your piece?

Speaker 3 (11:16):
I can't think of anything besides just the general horrors
of the world that we could update on, so we.

Speaker 1 (11:21):
Don't need to acknowledge the horse. We don't need to
acknowledge the horse.

Speaker 3 (11:24):
Is there anything that has happened that would would fall
into the purview of this podcast that isn't QAnon related?

Speaker 1 (11:32):
I feel like there was something that.

Speaker 2 (11:35):
It's like, I mean, not related at all. But again,
it makes you think of the conversation we had once.
It was like try to find me in Final Fantasy.
I'm just so everyone knows the latest patch content came out.
Make sure to do your weeklies.

Speaker 1 (11:49):
That's all hang on, I want know your dailies and
weekly Is everyone watching for anything we don't need to.
We don't need to.

Speaker 3 (11:56):
I don't for week and stuff because I feel like
there was an alien thing.

Speaker 1 (11:59):
I don't remember hearing about an alien thing.

Speaker 2 (12:01):
Maybe you should put your ear to the ground more.

Speaker 3 (12:03):
Maybe maybe here is the thing. Okay, I'm not crazy.
Although this is from the Sun, so I'm not going
to click on it.

Speaker 2 (12:11):
So this might be the bumbers. Sometimes the part of
the podcast we talked about updates about past topics.

Speaker 3 (12:21):
This is not an update on a past topic. This
is just a fun little book.

Speaker 2 (12:24):
Oh so this sometimes is going off rails.

Speaker 3 (12:26):
Well, it's just astronomers suggests new interstellar object that is
hurtling toward the Earth could be advanced aliens. Yeah, but
that's from the Sun exactly, So it's stupid.

Speaker 2 (12:36):
Yeah, the news article, it's fun. The actual or.

Speaker 1 (12:40):
Yes, the saucial body, the Sun tells us the news agency,
Yeah you know.

Speaker 3 (12:47):
It's not a news agency, it's a tabloid.

Speaker 2 (12:48):
What it must have been like to actually worship the Sun?
You still could? I mean, not socially acceptable, it says,
who says Jesus? Apparently, Well screw him.

Speaker 1 (13:00):
Yeah, you're so right, he's dead. What's he gonna do
about it?

Speaker 2 (13:03):
Jesus, you're so right and God made.

Speaker 3 (13:08):
If I'm wrong, may God strike me down?

Speaker 1 (13:10):
Hey, but do you know I'm still here anyway. Now
that we've gone into the blaspheming part of the podcast,
let's let's move on to a word from our sponsors.
All right, Yeah, we.

Speaker 3 (13:27):
Start our story, okay, in Harris County, Texas.

Speaker 2 (13:30):
All right, I feel like I've heard of this county before.

Speaker 3 (13:32):
You probably have. It's a big county in Texas. So
we start a story in Harris County, Texas in January
of nineteen eighty one. Okay, on January fifth of nineteen
eighty one, a man was out with his German shepherd
in the forest and.

Speaker 2 (13:46):
As one does, as one does.

Speaker 3 (13:48):
His dog ran off and came back with a human arm.
How much of a human arm? Quite a bit of
a human arm, like with like flesh still on.

Speaker 1 (13:59):
Yes, don't like that. I mean like I didn't like
any of it.

Speaker 3 (14:02):
Not a bone, but like like you're looking.

Speaker 1 (14:06):
On, yeah, flesh and all ooh boy howdy.

Speaker 3 (14:10):
And because yeah, sometimes you hear about these stories and
it's like they came back with a bone and oh
no that bone is human. No, this was just a
full on.

Speaker 1 (14:17):
Human arm paid that that yeah, paid great, called the
cops as as human does, as one does.

Speaker 3 (14:24):
And the cops came and a few days later, on
January twelfth, they discovered the bodies of two unidentified individuals.

Speaker 1 (14:32):
Okay, one was male and one was female.

Speaker 3 (14:35):
They got a kind of like average of their ages,
but they couldn't quite pinpoint it. The woman they figured
it was between like fifteen and twenty okay, and the
male was probably between like eighteen and twenty five. Okay,
So but they they didn't know. They couldn't figure much
else out about them. They got a composite sketch of

(14:56):
their face that they posted over the county to try
and figure out like if anyone had reported anyone missing
or knew who they were. And they determined that the
man was beaten to death blood force trauma and the
woman was strangled.

Speaker 2 (15:14):
Ooh, no good.

Speaker 3 (15:15):
They got causes.

Speaker 2 (15:16):
Yeah, they got to call to death serial killer? Is
that what we're starting with this? Jeez?

Speaker 3 (15:19):
Yeah. So they put their faces all over the county
trying to figure out if anyone knew who they were.
They didn't get anything back. They were just labeled does
what you was this again? Nineteen eighty one, Thank you.
They were labeled dose and they were buried in an
anonymous grave. So there's like there's several of these like

(15:40):
Potter's graves, Yeah, around the country where it's like unidentified bodies.
They still want them to be buried. Sure, the case
goes cold because they can't They don't even know who
these people are. How could they possibly figure out what
killed them or who killed them?

Speaker 1 (15:54):
I mean there's a lot of ways, but.

Speaker 3 (15:55):
There's a lot of ways, but this is the nineteen eighties. Yes,
we're limited in the scope of what we were able
to do. Thirty years later, in twenty eleven, the bodies
are exhumed to gather some DNA evidence because at this
point there's a lot of services that still operate obviously
that are trying to solve cold cases.

Speaker 1 (16:16):
And there's also like those the I think twenty eleven
they had like ancestry databases and stuff like that. They
were starting to have.

Speaker 3 (16:23):
Stuff like that, especially Yes, so they exhumed the bodies.
They were able to determine that the two were at
least not related, okay, so which is something that they
weren't sure about. However, they couldn't really find anything else,
so they reburied the bodies, and then another ten years later,
in twenty twenty one, another group came forward saying that

(16:46):
they wanted to try and find the identities of dose
that had been buried in Harris County specifically. The funding
for it came from a true crime podcast somebody called
audio Check. Oh pay okay, listen, use your powers for good,
all right, And the Harris County Police Department actually identified

(17:10):
these bodies as being like good candidates because they they
had been found fairly soon after they had died, so
their bodies were fairly well preserved. You could still get
DANA evidence from them. So they got the DNA evidence
from them, and through the genealogical records that was online,
using the same database that they used to find the
Golden State Killer, they got a ping on the man.

Speaker 2 (17:31):
Okay, I find that again. The story of the Golden
State Killer catching it was so cool.

Speaker 1 (17:34):
Yeah, but also cool wild, crazy wild. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (17:38):
They got a ping there. John Doe had a.

Speaker 1 (17:42):
Sister, oh, in Florida, Okay.

Speaker 3 (17:46):
And so the police department then contacts this person in
Florida and says, hey, do you have or I actually
don't know if they knew it was a sister yet,
but they knew it was a relative in Florida, and
they said, hey, do you have a relative that went
missing about forty years ago?

Speaker 1 (17:59):
You speaking? Depending upon there you can make assumptions with
reasonable amounts of certainty based on the similarity of the genetics.
So they probably did know it was a sister.

Speaker 3 (18:09):
Okay, So they asked, did you have a relative that
went missing about forty years ago? And she says, yes,
my brother went like with his wife, went to Texas
and disappeared. We haven't heard from him. And they're like, well,
we found your brother. We had found him forty years ago,
but we were just able to identify him and he

(18:29):
was with an unidentified female and she says, that must
be my wife. Yeah, and she says her brother Dean
had moved there with his wife Tina. They were able to,
through more testing, confirm that the other body was Tina Nice.

Speaker 2 (18:45):
Nice no longer does.

Speaker 1 (18:47):
That's no longer does.

Speaker 2 (18:49):
This is a great story.

Speaker 3 (18:49):
However, in talking with the sister, a greater mystery ended
up coming up because the sister says, well, you found
Dean and Tina.

Speaker 2 (18:59):
Where's Oh no, Their daughter.

Speaker 3 (19:03):
Tina had moved to Texas with their newborn daughter.

Speaker 1 (19:06):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (19:07):
Yeah, And the bodies were not found with any other
remains near them. There was not a body of a
child found. So now the question is what happened to Holly.

Speaker 1 (19:22):
Yeah, but also the question of how these two died
is still un answered.

Speaker 2 (19:26):
It's also true, are we gonna We'll see what you
have to tell me.

Speaker 3 (19:30):
All right, So let's go back again. Let's talk about
Dean and Tina.

Speaker 1 (19:34):
Okay, tell us about Dean and Tina.

Speaker 3 (19:36):
So Dean Dean Klaus was fairly good student, kind person,
but was known to make not great decisions.

Speaker 1 (19:45):
Okay.

Speaker 3 (19:46):
He liked to pick up hitchhikers and it was the eighties. Yeah, well,
seventies because they disappeared in nineteen eighty right, Oh, if
I was eighty one, they were found in eighty one.
That's right, because it was January. That makes sense. That
makes sense. He liked to pick up pitchhikers, and he
liked to dabble in drugs. He also joined a cult
at the age of sixteen.

Speaker 2 (20:06):
Oh boy, know, is it what we know?

Speaker 3 (20:09):
Or I'm sure I'll get to what's sort of unsure
about that in a second. And this is according to
his mother, Debbie, who was interviewed for the Houston Chronicle
in twenty twenty two. Okay, so by the time all
of this was answered, the mother was still alive, so
she did end up getting answers as to where her
son had gone.

Speaker 1 (20:28):
At least that's nice. She gets some closure, She gets
some closure.

Speaker 3 (20:31):
So Dean ended up joining a cult at the age
of sixteen or seventeen, but he ended up coming back
to his family in Florida. So his family lived in Florida,
and he ended up coming back to Florida, like leaving
the cult and coming back. We're not sure. There is
some like different reports on the cult that he joined, Okay,
and it's either irrelevant or very relevant, is the problem.

Speaker 1 (20:54):
Okay.

Speaker 3 (20:55):
Yeah, So when he came back, he ended up meaning
Dean was twenty one. At twenty one years old, he
met Tina, uh huh, who was seventeen.

Speaker 1 (21:05):
A little bit of a problematic age gap.

Speaker 3 (21:07):
A little bit of a problematic age gap, but at
the time the families were all for it. Sure, Dean
actually met Tina because Dean's sister was married to Tina's brothers.
They're already in loss.

Speaker 1 (21:16):
Interesting Okay, Yeah, it is legal.

Speaker 3 (21:19):
They're not.

Speaker 1 (21:20):
They're not ask like genetically related related.

Speaker 3 (21:23):
It's just kind of weird.

Speaker 1 (21:25):
It's just a little weird, that's what that feels. Weird.
It's like there have been those instances where like people
will get married and then their single parents will meet
because their children get married, and then the single parents
start dating, and it's like, if you get married, that
makes your your children who are married technically stepsiblings. Please
don't do that. But then they do it anyway. They like,
that's not illegal. It's just weird. It is.

Speaker 3 (21:44):
At least don't grow up because then they're okay, no, they.

Speaker 1 (21:47):
Do not grow up together. No, that's the thing. But
in this instance, it's like, so you're you're crushing on
your sister in law, Yeah, who is seventeen. Yeah, but
they have a happy, wholesome relationship.

Speaker 3 (22:01):
Who was just One day, Dean and Tina walked into
the house and announced that they had gone to the
courthouse and gotten married.

Speaker 1 (22:07):
Oh that's sue, that's some young, useful impulsivity.

Speaker 2 (22:11):
There was it a shotgun wedding.

Speaker 3 (22:14):
It turned out it was yep, Tina was already pregnant.

Speaker 1 (22:18):
Okay, all right, well you know what yep, Oh, boy, Yeah,
and soon after gave birth to their daughter, Holly Marie.

Speaker 3 (22:26):
Tina was a very doting mother. She carried around this
baby book with her everywhere to like record all of
Holly Marie's firsts. She by all accounts, was a super
doting mother, super loved her daughter, just overjoyed at being
a first time mother. Shortly after hollymood Ree was born, Dean,

(22:48):
who was actually a pretty skilled carpenter and was really
good at making like cabnetry nice, was offered a better
job in Texas. Louis in Louisville, I think it is Louisville. No,
it's not. It's Louisville.

Speaker 2 (23:02):
Why.

Speaker 3 (23:03):
That's a good fucking question, because I thought it was
Louisville too when I was listening to podcasts that I
looked at the spelling. Nope, Louisville.

Speaker 1 (23:08):
Well, just because it's spelled Louisville doesn't mean you pronounce
it that way.

Speaker 3 (23:11):
With a W L E wis v I L L E.

Speaker 1 (23:16):
Why? Yeah, yeah, all right, yeah, trust me, I went
through the same thing you're going through. Okay, listen, if
you're from Texas and you know better, let us know.
But also if you if you can explain.

Speaker 2 (23:30):
Why I would like to know.

Speaker 3 (23:33):
I would also like to know honestly anyway, So it
was offered a better full time position and more money
to move out to Louisville, Texas, And so Dean and
Tina took Dean's mom's car, like she let them borrow
it and was like, just we'll figure it out later.
Just get your family out there. And they moved out

(23:54):
to Texas with Holly Marie and all of their belongings
in one car. And this is the so this is
the time before cell phones, so communication was somewhat limited.
Mostly they communicated via letters. So Dean and Tina would
write letters back to their families in Florida to let
them know how everything was going, and by all accounts,

(24:15):
everything seemed to be going pretty well. They moved out
in the middle of summer, so Holly Marie was only
a few months old, and Dean's mom would still receive
occasional letters. But the letter stopped in October of nineteen eighty.
And at first it wasn't weird because communication wasn't consistent.

Speaker 1 (24:35):
Okay, it was. I mean they had phones. I know
they could have called, they could have, but they didn't.
But they didn't, but they didn't.

Speaker 3 (24:45):
So we know that the last known letter was received
by Debbie Dean's mom in October of nineteen eighty, but
at the time they didn't realize it would be the
last letter. In November, Debbie got a weird phone call
from a man saying that he had her car in
Los Angeles, California. Okay, Debbie was like, Okay, where Dean

(25:07):
and Tina?

Speaker 1 (25:08):
Yeah, why would my car be in LA Yeah?

Speaker 3 (25:11):
And the man was like, well, if you give me
a thousand dollars, i'll give you your car back, all right. Yeah,
And she's like, the thing is in her head. She's like, well,
he must not be bluffing because he must have gotten
my information from like the car registration.

Speaker 1 (25:25):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (25:26):
So, but she's just really confused. I think there was
another report because so some of these things, like, there
are several different accounts that some of them fit together,
some of them don't. One of the things I read
said that this man was saying that he was a
police officer that had found the car.

Speaker 1 (25:42):
Yeah, but he's also then saying, give me a thousand
bucks and I'll give you your car pack.

Speaker 3 (25:46):
Yeah. So we also don't know necessarily if the car
was ever in Los Angeles, Okay, but he says, if
you give me a thousand dollars, I will return the
car to you.

Speaker 1 (25:58):
Like drive it back to her.

Speaker 2 (25:59):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (26:00):
Yeah, So the one thousand dollars was literally for the
cost of driving it back.

Speaker 1 (26:03):
Okay.

Speaker 3 (26:04):
She and it was it wasn't like wire me the
money and I'll give you your car. It was we're
gonna pick up the car. We're gonna meet together here.

Speaker 1 (26:13):
And you'll hand me the money.

Speaker 3 (26:14):
You'll hand me the cash, right. And they were to
meet at the Daytona Raceway, okay, because that's around where
they lived, and it was gonna be like in the
middle of the night. And Debbie at the time was
where he had like a waitress and cops in the
area were like her regular customers, and they were like, yeah,
you're not going there by yourself.

Speaker 1 (26:33):
Good yeah, safety and numbers.

Speaker 3 (26:35):
Yeah. So she ended up going to meet to get
the car back with some cops with her at the
middle of the night and Daytona Space Spaceway Daytona Raceway.
The car was there as well as three women dressed
in all white and barefoot, uh huh, and one of
them introduced themselves as Sister Susan, Okay, she was the
only one that talked. Debbie asked, Hey, where are Dean

(26:59):
and Tina and the group of women, So Sister Susan
is the one that's speaking for all of them, basically
says the couple had joined their religious group and they
no longer wanted to have contact with the family.

Speaker 1 (27:12):
Mm hmmmm.

Speaker 3 (27:14):
And the problem is they're like Dean had done this before. Right.
The thing that comes up is we don't know if
it's the same religious group that Dian had joined before
or not. Right, That's that's the confusion.

Speaker 1 (27:27):
I mean, there is a thing I've heard from testimonials
from people who have left cults talking about how being
in a cult once sometimes makes you susceptible to being
in a cult again because the need that you were
seeking to fulfill by joining the cult the first time
often is still present. Yeah, and so you try to
fulfill it spiritually in other ways and can fall victim

(27:49):
to cults once more.

Speaker 3 (27:50):
It's possible it's the same cult, but it's also possible
it's the type of things we just don't know.

Speaker 1 (27:55):
We don't know, but just yeah, him having already been
in a cult at one point does make it seemed
pausible that he would fall into another one or fall
back into the same one. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (28:05):
So even though police was there with Debbie when she
gets the car, like all the police can say is,
you don't have to give them a thousand dollars. I
actually don't know if she ended up paying them or not.
Unclear I hope not. Eh, But the cops couldn't really
do anything else. They had the car registration. They weren't
like ransoming money because like if they didn't get the money,

(28:26):
they were still gonna leave her with the car, right, So,
like it wasn't like they were trying to extort her.
The cops had nothing to go on, and Dean had
done this before, so there they were, like, there's nothing
we can do.

Speaker 1 (28:38):
And there he and his wife are at this point
both legal adults, and there's no sign that they are
in distress. They're just not speaking to anyone at this point.

Speaker 3 (28:47):
Well, and Sister Susan says they're not speaking to them
because the religious Order says that they're not going to right,
So all right, Debbie can't do anything at this point.
The cops lightly question Sister Susan while they're there at
the space, spaceway, speedway. I don't know why I keep
saying spaceway.

Speaker 1 (29:05):
You want to say raceway and speedway the same time.

Speaker 3 (29:07):
Yeah, that's why. Yeah, it's speedway. The cops lightly questioned
sister Susan while they're there. They find out that like
part of their religious order is they they don't wear
shoes because they don't use any animal products. Which I'm like,
they're shoes that don't wear weather.

Speaker 1 (29:23):
You can have shoes with no animal products in them, and.

Speaker 3 (29:26):
Yet no shoes barefoot okay, and they're vegan. Sure, So yeah,
that's that's kind of all they get from from this interaction,
and the cops let them go. Debbie has her car back,
and Debbie files a missing person's report in Texas, in Florida,

(29:47):
and in California since the car was supposedly in La.

Speaker 1 (29:51):
Right, and yet despite fiying the missing persons report in Texas, Yeah,
there's the police just don't they don't nay anything.

Speaker 3 (30:01):
Yeah, nothing happens with this missing person's report, right.

Speaker 1 (30:03):
Because it's like at this point, you or at least
very soon you will have the bodies yep.

Speaker 3 (30:10):
So like and they went unidentified for forty years. Yeah,
so it's like, are you just not because they were
both adults and Dean had a history of joining a
cult before, so they just assumed face value.

Speaker 1 (30:23):
But she'd filed the missing person's report yeap. So it's
like you have this in your database that there's these
people with these faces who are missing, they have these
descriptions and you're just not connecting those dots, and that
happens so often, and it's just it's just frustrated.

Speaker 3 (30:37):
Yeah, nothing happened in California, Texas or Florida. These missing
person cases were not going forward. Obviously the family is
still like both families are sure like trying to figure
out what the fuck happened to their their relative. Yeah,
but nothing, nothing comes of it. And of course where's Holly? Yeah,
because that's the question it has not been answered.

Speaker 2 (30:55):
Feel like I'm going to make that the name of
the episode, Where's Where's Holly?

Speaker 3 (31:00):
Well, I have an answer for.

Speaker 2 (31:01):
You, Luckily, I don't know why. I don't feel good
about that.

Speaker 3 (31:04):
Five years after they file the missing person's report, they
actually ended up checking the Social Security Administration to see
if their numbers had been used. I'm sure if they
were able to get answers there.

Speaker 2 (31:13):
Actually, that's actually I didn't even think about that's what.

Speaker 3 (31:15):
Yeah, I'm sure if she was able to get answers there,
because that's not confirmed. But they ended up also filing
a missing persons with the Salvation Army, which is apparently
a thing you can do. Okay, so specifically, what's.

Speaker 2 (31:28):
The Salvation Army gonna do for you?

Speaker 1 (31:29):
Yeah, what's a Salvation Army?

Speaker 3 (31:31):
We all know the Salvation Army sucks ass. Yeah, but
apparently part of their services is like you can like
and a lot of them are like people who will
join cults and their families will file a missing persons
with the Salvation Army presumably in case like when they
leave the cult, they go to a Salvation Army center
like a shelter.

Speaker 1 (31:50):
Yeah, I mean, I guess.

Speaker 2 (31:51):
I've never thought of Salvation Army as a shelter, though.

Speaker 1 (31:54):
They have shelters. Their shelters suck, but they have them.

Speaker 3 (31:57):
Yeah, so I mean it's not like a bad idea.
But also fuck the Salvation Army.

Speaker 2 (32:02):
Yes, are they privatized.

Speaker 1 (32:04):
They are. They are private charity, I believe, I mean
like a religious charity for sure, private in the sense
that they're not government. That's what I think, yeah, it's
not a government organization.

Speaker 2 (32:12):
That was the question y.

Speaker 3 (32:13):
Yeah, yeah, no, no, but they are a charitable organization
that ends up turning down people that they decide they
don't want to they don't want to see because they
suck ass. Anyway, we're back where we started twenty twenty two.
Where is Holly? Well, the police end up kind of
looking into like, hey, we got to find out where

(32:35):
this kid is. Several agencies then joined together to try
and find out what happened to Holly Marie.

Speaker 2 (32:40):
Okay, does this mean the cold case is officially fully
opened again? At this point, I think they're.

Speaker 3 (32:44):
Still technically considered cold cases, but they have opened it
to try and find Holly, right, because like this is
now a pressing concern, Like it's been forty years, where
the fuck is Holly Marie?

Speaker 2 (32:53):
And they have no idea what she looks like to no.

Speaker 3 (32:55):
No idea.

Speaker 1 (32:56):
Yeah, they found her.

Speaker 3 (32:59):
She's forty one years old and living in Oklahoma.

Speaker 1 (33:01):
How did they find her? All?

Speaker 3 (33:03):
Right? So they ended up figuring out They ended up
so Holly Marie had a birth certificate registered in Florida,
but it was sealed.

Speaker 1 (33:13):
Okay, I think most birth certificates are. I know nothing
about that, and I don't know what it means to
be sealed us.

Speaker 3 (33:20):
There's like a couple of different so I think it was.
There's a couple of different reasons it could be sealed.

Speaker 1 (33:24):
What does it mean that it's sealed.

Speaker 3 (33:27):
They had to get a warrant in order to get
access to it. Okay, interesting, And there's two reasons for that.
One of them is a juvenile record, which it was
sealed in like nineteen eighty one. They're like, well, she
was one, so I don't think there's a juvenile record.

Speaker 1 (33:40):
The other is adoption, so that you did to protect
the birth parents, presumably from contact. Yeah, okay, So.

Speaker 3 (33:47):
What happened to Holly Marie is in November of nineteen
eighty in.

Speaker 2 (33:52):
Arizona, Okay, not Texas.

Speaker 3 (33:54):
Not Texas. In Arizona, this group of women in and
barefoot walk up to a pastor in a church. I
did find out their Seven day Adventists. So I'm like
out of the frying pan into the fire, but walk
into a church. The pastor is there and says take
this baby, and he's like excuse me, and they're like, yeah,

(34:17):
we were part of a religious organization that separates the
sexes and also does not allow children.

Speaker 1 (34:25):
Okay, so they're surrendering a child. The senta they had
done this before. Okay, not to the same pastor. They
had done this before. They had left a child at
a laundromat.

Speaker 3 (34:35):
In the area.

Speaker 1 (34:36):
Jesus.

Speaker 3 (34:37):
Yeah, they really do not give a shit about children.
They're like, children are a burden, we don't want them.
More nomadic so we travel. We don't want children.

Speaker 1 (34:47):
Okay. Uh.

Speaker 3 (34:49):
The pastor who ended up with Holly says that Tina
was one of the women that was part of the
group of women that had surrendered Holly over. That's not
been confirmed. What is confirmed is they had a letter
signed by Tina and Dean, Yeah, Dean saying that they

(35:10):
were voluntarily giving Holly up. And they also had Holly's
birth certificate, so they had all the information needed to
legally adopt Holly Marie out. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (35:21):
Yeah, for the pastor.

Speaker 3 (35:22):
And I don't remember his name, but he is the
one that ends up adopting Holly, like.

Speaker 1 (35:26):
He becomes the new parent. Yes, oh dang, Because I
mean I know that there are instances of that where
like there are specific people who legally you can surrender
children to or like there will be shelters or whatever.
That's like you can surrender kids to these places like
fire stations. Yeah yeah. Yeah. It's interesting though, when you're saying,

(35:46):
like about confirming whether one of the women was Tina,
I am assuming that this investigator, this part of the
investigation is happening in the present day, like in twenty
twenty one. So at that point, there is no way
in hell that I believe that that pastor remembers the
faces oh yeah, of all of those women. Like if

(36:07):
you just showed him a picture of Tina and was like,
was she one of these women, I can see him
like thinking that, yeah, she probably was.

Speaker 3 (36:14):
The way is that one of them like possibly introduced
herself as like the mother of the child that she
was giving up.

Speaker 1 (36:22):
Uh huh. But that doesn't mean that's true, Yeah, exactly.
She could have been lying. She could also the letter
signed by them, yeah yeah, also could have been written
under duress or faked.

Speaker 2 (36:33):
Yeah. Yeah, I'm curious about that too, because like, but
they had.

Speaker 3 (36:35):
Her birth certificate, that was what was important.

Speaker 1 (36:38):
But if they yes, legally speaking, but none of that
proves that these two people willingly gave up.

Speaker 2 (36:43):
Their child, because what could have happened is that they
were I don't know, ambushed and then murdered and then ransacked. Yeah,
and then.

Speaker 1 (36:50):
They could have had a copy of their daughter's birth certificate,
their newborn daughter's birth certificate on them when they were moving, yeah,
or in their house, which.

Speaker 2 (36:57):
Is what makes sense that would have been the case.

Speaker 1 (36:59):
Yeah, yeah, who knows.

Speaker 3 (37:00):
Well, I have theories actually.

Speaker 2 (37:02):
Okay, well, yeah, I'm glad to talk about the theories.

Speaker 3 (37:04):
And we'll get to that. So the according in accordance
with the law, they did have to put in the
newspaper for six months like hey, we have this baby,
this is her name, we're reaching out to try and
find her parents, just like just in case. They had
for six months, like reaching out to try and find
her parents. Well, after six months, nothing happened.

Speaker 1 (37:21):
Yeah, probably those two were dead because they were dead.

Speaker 3 (37:24):
Yeah, at this point, they were dead. So the pastor
ends up adopting Holly Marie. There is lightly some stuff
about her life that ends up coming to light that is,
like she she didn't have as nice of a life
as like her biological family that is now finding her
wishes she had. But at the time they found her
at forty one years old, mother of five. She was

(37:45):
fairly happy.

Speaker 1 (37:46):
I mean, they're probably the families just stoked she's alive.
I bet yeah.

Speaker 3 (37:50):
On June seven, twenty twenty two, investigators walked into Holly's
pace of employment and surprised her by saying, Hey, we're
here to talk about a murder investigation from nineteen eighty one.
And she's like, I was.

Speaker 1 (38:02):
A baby, yeah, and they're like, yeah, the the victims
are your biological.

Speaker 3 (38:07):
Parents, and she was like, excuse me. She had actually
grown up, so she had known she was adopted. She
had known like the whole story of like how she
had come in to be adopted by the pastor, like
her dad had been fully transparent with what had happenedact.

Speaker 2 (38:24):
Said, you had been surroundered by women wearing white who
were bare for that just strolled into.

Speaker 3 (38:28):
My So she was actually convinced that her parents had
died in the Waco, Texas siege.

Speaker 1 (38:33):
She thought that they were They were Brand Davidians.

Speaker 3 (38:35):
She thought they were because she knew they were from
some kind of fringe culture Christian cult. And so when
she heard about what happened in text, because I guess
she also knew like they were connected to Texas somehow.

Speaker 1 (38:45):
Uh huh.

Speaker 3 (38:46):
So when the Branch Davidian siege happened in nineteen ninety three,
she was like thirteen fourteen years old at this time,
as we did.

Speaker 1 (38:54):
Now insert the episode we did about the Branch Davidians here,
sounds very relevant.

Speaker 3 (38:58):
Yeah, I think I did it, and it was an
early episode.

Speaker 1 (39:00):
You did do it, and it was in the first hundreds,
I believe, Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (39:03):
And that would be episode thirty four.

Speaker 3 (39:06):
So when she heard about the seed, she was absolutely
convinced that her biological parents were in that siege and died,
which was better for her psychologically because then she wasn't
thinking like her birth parents were going to come find
her at any point. She she was wrong in how
and when they died, but she wasn't wrong in that
they were dead.

Speaker 1 (39:25):
And also that's good for her in the present being
told by these people like, hey, we're here to investigate
the murder of your birth parents, because she's already under
the assumption that they're dead. Yeah, so it's not like
the hope of like, oh, they're out there somewhere was
crushed or anything like that.

Speaker 2 (39:40):
And it does. I am glad that the pastor the
adoptive father kind of like did explain things very clearly, which,
by the way, I think you should do. For I mean,
everyone's family is different than these are decisions, but I
do think it's important to tell your children that they're
adopted or not.

Speaker 3 (39:53):
Yeah, I think it is.

Speaker 2 (39:54):
I think it's very important because then that did let
her have a childhood where she had the correct expectations.

Speaker 3 (39:59):
Unfortun she generally, it did give her abandonment issues which
led to her Yeah, when she was sixteen years so
very lightly into Holly's life. When she was sixteen years old,
let's actually start when she was very young, her adoptive
parents ended up divorcing. She ended up staying with her father.
They went to Oklahoma, So from Arizona to Oklahoma, and

(40:21):
when she was sixteen years old, her father was going
to move in with his new wife, but she wanted
to stay and finish out school where she was. So
she ended up making a deal with her dad that like,
if my grades stay up, I can stay with my
boyfriend and his family. Her boyfriend ended up being a
meth at it, and in order to make sure that
he wouldn't leave her, she also ended up getting addicted

(40:43):
to meth, and then he left her anyway with a
drug addiction, she ends up meeting another guy who also
is addicted to meth. They moved to California. She ends
up her last hit of meth, collapses a vain and
sends her in like excruciating pain for like three days.
She refuses to go to the hospital because hospital means
like the cops get cold and all that kind of stuff.

Speaker 1 (41:05):
But that actually which is not necessarily true now, just
for anybody out there who doesn't.

Speaker 2 (41:09):
Know, ye, no, if you need assistance, you can seek assistance.
Wall so staying silent.

Speaker 1 (41:13):
Yeah yeah.

Speaker 3 (41:13):
And also the hospital, even with the ice raids now,
the hospital is very much like get the fuck out
of my hospital. Yeah. So, nurses and doctors are very
much like fuck you. So that ends up getting both
of them to get sober, though, and that was still
That second boyfriend that she gets sober with is the

(41:34):
one she ends up marrying and having five kids with.

Speaker 2 (41:36):
Okay, were they still married, yes, I believe so.

Speaker 1 (41:39):
Oh that's nice.

Speaker 2 (41:40):
You know, you met together, you live together for a
long time. I think as you get sober together, you
you live together for a long time. That's not the
more of the story I'm hearing.

Speaker 3 (41:48):
I don't know why the story, I'm hearing.

Speaker 2 (41:51):
All the story.

Speaker 1 (41:52):
She's saying, Yeah, were you were you zoning out for
the second half of the story.

Speaker 2 (41:55):
Oh no, I'm just being difficult.

Speaker 1 (41:57):
I know now I'm being difficult back at you.

Speaker 3 (42:00):
So they end up moving back from California to Oklahoma
to be closer to like both of their families, and uh, yeah,
they have five kids together. They seem fairly happy, and
then June seventh, twenty twenty two, the investigators come in
and drop a fucking bombshell on Holly Marie.

Speaker 1 (42:13):
Yeah, that your parents were murdered.

Speaker 2 (42:15):
Yeah, how do you How do you have afford five kids?
That is my question also, but also local living.

Speaker 1 (42:21):
But still.

Speaker 2 (42:24):
It's a lot of it's a lot of kids, kid.

Speaker 3 (42:27):
And her dad's still around because he was interviewed after
all this happened. So it's it's it sounds like it's
fairly possible that, like the families are very supportive and
they're there for them, and it also sounds like the
dad is not a Seventh day Adventist pastor anymore. So
that's good. Yeah, who buddy, Yeah, So Holly Marie's life
is a lot, but she actually agrees to go on

(42:52):
a zoom call with their biological family. Like the day
she finds out about the murder.

Speaker 2 (42:56):
Dang, I mean it's answers. It is an opportunity for
all the answers you've ever been wanting are there.

Speaker 3 (43:02):
She ends up on a zoom call with them. She
has met them in person since then. There's video of
like it happening. It's very sweet, like she's very happy
to be able to have found her biological family, and
she says it's enriched her life. She is now very
involved in trying to She's very involved in organizations trying

(43:23):
to find answers for like other Jane and John does
like trying to find who they are and close their
cases as well, because.

Speaker 2 (43:32):
There's a there's a whole story to each of them
and the fact that they the fact that you find
someone who is unidentified says so much about the story
that they had. This isn't just a normal person who's like, oh,
we don't who you are. There's a reason we don't
know who you are.

Speaker 3 (43:45):
Yeah. The police also end up exonerating like her adoptive
family as being a part of any of their murder,
because it's like their whole story checks out that it
seems to be pretty legit that like they were just dropped,
especially because like the description of the women matched what
Debbie had encountered when she got the car back, so
all of it seemed like her adopted parents were very

(44:07):
much like exonerated from being a part of anything that happened.

Speaker 1 (44:09):
Yeah, I know, suspicion on that.

Speaker 2 (44:11):
Do you mean that in the sense that, like, at
least for a couple of minutes they were like, did
this pastor seal this child?

Speaker 1 (44:17):
Yeah, they questioned just to make sure, just to make
sure pretty quickly determined that that was not the case.

Speaker 2 (44:23):
Okay, he was just curious, Yeah, definitely question if you're
just like, if your story is like barefoot women came
into my church and handed me a baby, Yeah, that
is kind of suspicious.

Speaker 3 (44:33):
But it ends up matching with what Debbie said, right,
So that's the reason that they were like, well, all
this kind of matches up, so it seems like you're
you're telling the truth, and the adoption process was all
up and up, and that's like how eventually they were
able to find Holly Marie because her adoption was totally legal.

Speaker 2 (44:50):
I mean that's I mean when you first started the story,
I was just like, and then they never found her,
but so.

Speaker 1 (44:55):
So they because you were saying that her birth sets
of her birth records were sealed.

Speaker 2 (44:59):
Because of a option.

Speaker 1 (45:00):
Yes, so what was the thing? How did they find
this guy? Beginning they got a.

Speaker 3 (45:05):
Warrant to unseal it because it was part of a
murder investigation.

Speaker 1 (45:08):
Got it, And then they were able to then track
the bureaucratic records of who had adopted her.

Speaker 2 (45:13):
Yeah, and probably find like you said, there was like
six months of the newspaper. It's like looking for their parents.
Probably the baby's name was in the newspaper.

Speaker 1 (45:21):
So yes, there was Marie nineteen eighty one. Yeah, and
this is this is twenty twenty one.

Speaker 3 (45:26):
Yeah, but those those records are a lot of those
records are not digitized, and like, yeah, it's.

Speaker 1 (45:30):
Just it probably wasn't the newspaper that they fell.

Speaker 3 (45:33):
It was definitely like the unsealing of the birth certificate
the way. Yeah. Yeah, So this story, even me just
explaining the story to you, obviously very interesting. So it
becomes a news story, of course, and it's still like
a fairly prominent news story, because like especially when there
was a time between like them finding out the identity

(45:54):
of the parents and then realizing Holly Maray is still missing.
There was actually like a couple months of time where
the Attorney General of Texas I think it's No Abbott
is the governor, No Paxon, who I fucking hate as well,
But he went on the news and said, like we're
looking he sucks. We're that like we've we've identified this
John and Jane Doe as Dean and Tina Klaus and

(46:18):
now we're looking for Holly Marie Klaus. And then a
couple of months later comes for a press conference sing
we found Holly Marie. So like it's a huge news
story in Texas. Holly Marie ends up doing interviews and
the pastor her dad does some interviews, the adoptive family
or the biological family does interviews, and in one of
these interviews, a man named Rick Alan Ross catches it.

Speaker 1 (46:41):
That name is also familiar.

Speaker 3 (46:42):
We've probably talked about him before. I mean he is
he is a cult expert.

Speaker 1 (46:48):
I we may have done an episode mentioning this guy
possibly pop because we did an episode on cult deprogramming
that I think he was mentioned in mal Will inserted
that episode here.

Speaker 2 (46:59):
It was a good episode, and that would be episode one.

Speaker 3 (47:02):
The subsequent interviews, and I believe the press conference was.

Speaker 2 (47:05):
He the guy there was like they put a like
a bomb in his mailbox or something that was a lawyer,
that was a lawyer, a different guy everything, and it
was like a snake. Yeah, it was a snake. Yeah, okay, yeah, anyway, sorry,
it's fine.

Speaker 3 (47:18):
So Rick Allen Ross ends ends up seeing these interviews
and through because he knows a lot about cults and
you know, like he knows of the existence of a
bunch of different cults. Through the explanation of what had
happened to Holly, Marie and Dean and Tina, he ends
up figuring out that the group that they had come
into contact with was called Christ Family. They were the

(47:40):
only group operating at that time in that area with
that description.

Speaker 2 (47:43):
I've heard of this name.

Speaker 3 (47:45):
So the Christ Family is actually the Christ Family is
who I thought I would find more information on, and
I didn't, unfortunately, But I do have some information on
Christ Family.

Speaker 2 (47:56):
So but do you think that if you had more
time to do more research about the family you would
find stuff.

Speaker 3 (48:01):
I've tried I don't think there's a whole because it
was a smaller cult. Okay, I don't think there's as
much information.

Speaker 2 (48:07):
Okay, I was just want to be a fight because
I tried.

Speaker 3 (48:09):
And it's possible that more information could come out because
obvious because like, we still don't know who killed Dean,
and Tina had like why they don't kill No, we
still don't know.

Speaker 1 (48:19):
Oh dang.

Speaker 2 (48:20):
Interesting.

Speaker 3 (48:21):
So Rick Ross says there aren't any other groups that
wore white robes and went around barefoot other than Christ's family,
and the locality would match as well. The timeframe also matches,
so Rick Ross also says that they had at the
time when Dean had decided at like sixteen seventeen to
join a cult, the Christ family had also been operating
in Florida at that time, so it's possible that it
was the same cult that Dean left and then went

(48:43):
back to when he when he moved his family to tell.

Speaker 2 (48:44):
That happens, Yeah, we've seen that happen. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (48:48):
Well, it's a similar thing to like people in abusive relationships,
where like it takes a while to fully leave. Sometimes
even if you leave the cult for a little bit,
sometimes he would d up going back.

Speaker 2 (48:58):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (48:59):
So Christ Family was led by a man named Charles mceugh.
I just want to brace you guys for the name
that he went by. Okay, Okay, Lightning Amen.

Speaker 1 (49:10):
I was for sure because you said his name was
like Charles mceugh. I thought this was gonna be enlightening
the queen joke, like I had to swallow down the cochaw.

Speaker 2 (49:21):
Yeah, it would have fit.

Speaker 1 (49:24):
Lightning Amen.

Speaker 2 (49:26):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (49:27):
I mean, listen, if you gotta pick a cult name, yeah,
it's your favorite element and then some kind of religious phrase.
So I would be fire. Hallelujah is a good one.

Speaker 3 (49:43):
Haliah Oi is just a thing that you say. I
don't think that that's not a religious thing.

Speaker 1 (49:49):
I don't believe.

Speaker 2 (49:50):
No, I mean that's the name of God.

Speaker 1 (49:53):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (49:54):
I feel like it's a little bit a little bit
pous to be.

Speaker 3 (49:59):
I mean that one does say he's the vessel of God.

Speaker 2 (50:01):
I mean, I mean, how many cult leaders say that
the vessel of God are our God, are born of God,
their homies with God.

Speaker 3 (50:09):
Yeah. Yes, So Christ Family, per its name was supposedly
based in the Bible, but the real truth about the
group is that it was based on the interpretation as
delivered by its leader, ros said, which can describe every cult.

Speaker 2 (50:22):
Yeah, yeah, that's every cult.

Speaker 3 (50:24):
So the Clauses were last seen in Louisville, Texas in
late nineteen eighty and then their bodies were found like
two hundred and fifty miles away in Houston.

Speaker 2 (50:34):
Jeez, I mean two hundred I don't like and do
you just said we don't really know what happened to
the family, fully, but if I was a murderer, I'm not.
If I was a murderer, driving two hundred and fifty
miles to dispose of a body away from the scene
of the crime or where they were known to be
the victims is a smart move. And people did that,

(50:56):
and people did that, people still do that consciously.

Speaker 1 (50:59):
Was like it was a wooded area.

Speaker 3 (51:01):
It was a wooded area, it was not it was
like not developed at all.

Speaker 2 (51:05):
So they were just abandoned to the wilds.

Speaker 1 (51:07):
Yeah yeah, I mean that is the thing that like,
especially with people who know and to their credit, like
it worked, not to their credit, but you know what
I mean, where it's like they they know that the
second you cross county lines back in the day, even
to a certain extent, now it becomes infinitely harder for
the police to find someone because they just don't talk

(51:29):
to each other apparently.

Speaker 2 (51:31):
No, I mean, we have plenty of stories on our
podcasts where it's like, due to police or bureaucractic jurisdictions
and issues, a crime goes unsolved. Yeah, so many cases
of that.

Speaker 3 (51:42):
Ross actually does believe that the classes got recruited because
it's not within the christ families mo to just like
ambush and murder someone and steal their child. And again,
Dean had a history of joining cults. And there here's
the thing. I want to know what the fuck happened
to that child the laundromat, because we now kind of
know what happened in a baby Holly, and we don't
necessarily know what happened to her parents.

Speaker 2 (52:04):
At the end, we have suspicions.

Speaker 3 (52:06):
We have suspicions, But it does sound like it's possible
that like Tina and Dean gave her up to join
this cult. But that even then, like I can't even
fucking fathom that there is more. And that's the thing.
Here's the thing, their child too, like what about their parents.

Speaker 1 (52:21):
You started this off by saying that Tina was an
incredibly doting mother, Yeah, was like kind of obsessed with
her daughter.

Speaker 3 (52:29):
That's what confuses me too.

Speaker 1 (52:31):
I don't I don't feel conflicted about this. I don't
believe that these two would have willingly given up their child.

Speaker 2 (52:36):
I don't think. I think what may have happened. My
speculation is that again Dean was into this cult before
they he leaves, gets his life, I don't know together,
you know, gets a woman pregnant, has a shock on
a wedding, and they want to move to Texas to
start their own life, and the cult finds them again.
I think it could have been a situation where it
was like you have to either a you join us

(52:57):
again or Dean's like, why don't we join them again?
And I think Tina was like, no, we don't want
to do that. I think it came to blows because
I think they've tried to continue to just leave the
cult and not be involved. Yeah, and I think the
cult wasn't okay with that.

Speaker 3 (53:10):
So here's my thing. I think it's quite possible that
they tried to join the cult, because Dean had a
history of doing that before. I think possibly there there
was some disagreement on whether or not they should give
up their child. I don't think Tina was part of
the women that dropped Holly off.

Speaker 1 (53:25):
I don't believe so either.

Speaker 2 (53:26):
It doesn't make sense.

Speaker 3 (53:27):
Here's my thing that no one else brought up, but
I want to bring up because it was a thing
for me. They described partially what they were wearing.

Speaker 1 (53:36):
They were not.

Speaker 3 (53:37):
Wearing cult garments when their bodies were found, so I
think I think definitely they were trying to leave.

Speaker 2 (53:44):
I think they were an escape possible.

Speaker 1 (53:47):
I also don't know if you again are an intelligent
murderer in this case, and it's it feels semi gross
to speculate, but like, just from the point of view
of the evidence, the evidence, I don't know if I
would have buried them in coult garments because that feels
more connecting if anyone it's like, oh, yeah, they were

(54:09):
wearing weird white robes. Who do we know who wears
weird price.

Speaker 3 (54:13):
But the thing is they were buried in clothes they
were left they had it on.

Speaker 1 (54:18):
Yeah, but you can buy clothes, but they were Like.

Speaker 3 (54:21):
My thing is like you can tell if clothes are
put on post.

Speaker 1 (54:25):
Mortem, can you?

Speaker 3 (54:27):
I think I think it's well because here's the thing, like,
especially because Dean was beaten, yeah, and Tina was strangled,
So I feel like their clothing would have evidence of.

Speaker 1 (54:38):
His, would possibly have blood on it. But also these
were bodies that were dumped in the woods for a
period of time.

Speaker 3 (54:46):
True, I don't know. I feel like we should have more.
I feel like there should have been more. I wanted
more information on like their clothing, because I feel like
that's a big tell onto them.

Speaker 2 (54:57):
Well, can you tell me if if you know, if
they were found to have been like because we see
in some serial killer esque behavior where there's a certain
kind of not deification, but the way that bodies are
disposed of sometimes has a big tell on the killer.
Were these bodies buried ceremoniously or just don't just don't.

Speaker 1 (55:19):
I don't think they were buried at all because the
dog had just like.

Speaker 2 (55:24):
I think what it was is. I think that they
were just trying to escape the cult. I do not
think they were members of the cult whatsoever. I think
they wanted to not be members of the cult.

Speaker 1 (55:31):
I mean, it sounds like I don't want to get
too deep into speculation. If you're not done with them.

Speaker 3 (55:35):
I'm not quite done. But also, like I said that
it's like, we don't know what happened.

Speaker 1 (55:40):
From what it seems like to me, and this is
just again, this is all speculation. This is all just
trying us trying to wrap our heads around what possibly
could have happened. It sounds to me, based on what
you've said about, you know, Tina being a very devoted
mother and you know, just knowing the nature of cults,

(56:00):
the fact also the fact that the two of them
were not killed in the same way. Yeah, I can
very much imagine that in many cases with colts, disobeying
the cult comes with some level of punishment. Yeah, I
can see it being a situation where they joined this group,

(56:20):
possibly not knowing that they may would be forced to
give up their daughter. And then because I also can
see the cult not telling them immediately that they can't
have their kid. Of course, they wait until you're entrenched
before you know, then pulling all that crap on you.
That happens very frequently.

Speaker 2 (56:36):
So they probably would have said that, well, we don't
want to do that, and then we're punished.

Speaker 1 (56:40):
And then one of them was punished and the other
possibly was like, then well we act. I do think
that the first person who died possibly dean if he
was beaten, might have been an accident. And then after
you kill one person, you can't let the other live. Yeah,
this is speculation. Yeah, it seems likely to me. I

(57:01):
don't believe they were willing to give up their daughter.
And also the way that their bodies were just kind
of like dumped, because if this group, if they were
like members of this group and willingly and then gave
up their daughter, then like what happened to get them
both killed later and then dumped cremoniously.

Speaker 3 (57:19):
Yeah, and here's the thing, there's also theories that their
murder was not done by the cult.

Speaker 2 (57:26):
That's possible.

Speaker 3 (57:27):
I'll explain that one a little bit too. Rick Ross
says that this cult is not known for murders like
it is known for tearing families apart. Because so Ross says,
Amen was known for twisting the meaning of individual scripture,
individual verses in order to manipulate and control his followers.
Mckhugh was a very bad man. He was a psychopath

(57:50):
and he hear many people. He was dangerous. The group
shredded families, which like, yeah, if you're forcing them, like,
first of all, not only you're forcing them to give
up children, which by the way, children teenage girls were fine.

Speaker 1 (58:03):
Yep.

Speaker 3 (58:04):
Yeah, so you're forcing them to give up children. You're
also forcing wives and husbands to be.

Speaker 2 (58:11):
Separated again, just cult tactics.

Speaker 3 (58:14):
Yeah, because no one's allowed to have sex except for McHugh.

Speaker 2 (58:19):
You mean Lightning Amen, Yeah, call him by his title.

Speaker 1 (58:23):
Or not or not.

Speaker 3 (58:26):
Charles McKee ended up being convicted of three counts of
child molestation.

Speaker 2 (58:30):
Oh so, I mean, I'm glad he got convicted.

Speaker 1 (58:33):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (58:34):
The group kind of fizzled out when he was arrested
in nineteen eighty seven.

Speaker 2 (58:39):
Oh good.

Speaker 3 (58:39):
I think he was paroled, but then he ended up
going back to jail in two thousand and one, and
he died in twenty ten.

Speaker 1 (58:45):
Okay, so he did.

Speaker 2 (58:47):
Did he die in jail or he did he.

Speaker 3 (58:49):
Died in jail.

Speaker 2 (58:50):
Hell yeah. It's good, but bad because then he can't
be questioned about this. It's is true. Yeah, yeah, I
mean I don't you know, I don't know anything about
this man, but I imagine that they questioned him. He
probably his response could have been I don't remember.

Speaker 1 (59:03):
I mean, it could have been, well, you know, the
death of some people is a fairly impactful thing to
happen in life.

Speaker 2 (59:09):
I don't know if this is a controversial statement or
I could be wrong, but if you mess with kids,
I don't think you care about all these other concepts
of life.

Speaker 1 (59:17):
No, I don't think he cares, but I do think
he remembers.

Speaker 3 (59:21):
Yeah, especially like if they this group was not known
for murder, It's possible this is the only kind of
murder that happens.

Speaker 1 (59:28):
Uh huh.

Speaker 3 (59:30):
But so McHugh was also like his actual original so
I think it was. He was convicted of the child
molestation in two thousand and one and that's what ultimately
sent him to jail that he ended up dying in
jail for. In nineteen eighty seven, he ended up going
to jail for drug trafficking. Okay, his group was known
for drug trafficking, obviously marijuana being the big one, because

(59:53):
this is the nineteen eighties, but apparently the group themselves
did a lot harder drugs as well.

Speaker 2 (59:58):
Like math.

Speaker 3 (59:59):
Probably.

Speaker 2 (01:00:00):
So there's another thought too, because again, my brain collapsed.

Speaker 1 (01:00:04):
That's only the daughter. Huh Holly, the daughter, are you thinking?

Speaker 2 (01:00:08):
No, No, it's gone, okay.

Speaker 1 (01:00:09):
Gone, there it goes. But no, I think what Chelsea
is lating to is if the group is known for
being involved in drugs, that in itself could have been
a potential cause for these two to get killed if
they if they were somehow running a foul with other
people who were running drugs.

Speaker 3 (01:00:28):
That, yes, that is another theory that it's possible that
they weren't killed by members of the cult, but they
were killed by people who bought drugs from members of
the cult, which is a possibility, and it's not something
you can necessarily like strike out. That would suggest that
the group. So that would suggest that when Holly was

(01:00:49):
given to the pastor, and also when they returned the car,
that Dean and Tina were still alive at that point.
They can't necessarily determine when they died. They know is
some somewhere between October and January. A lot of places
are putting their deaths in December, okay, which I'm curious
as to why that is. But that would be after

(01:01:11):
that would be both after they give the car back
to Debbie and after Holly had been given to the pastor.

Speaker 2 (01:01:16):
What if Holly's given to the pastor without their knowledge,
And that's another theory too, Yeah, because again it sounds
like they wouldn't have wanted to give other kid, right, Yeah,
what if it was just like they were told, oh,
someone else has taken care of your kid, because again
the sex have to be separated. Your kid is being
taken care of by these women in the cult without
knowing that their kid has just been given up.

Speaker 1 (01:01:36):
Or they are leaving their child with somebody they believe
that they can trust while they go and do something.

Speaker 2 (01:01:40):
Yeah. And then and then that do something is them
being ambushed potentially by drug drug buyers.

Speaker 1 (01:01:47):
Yeah, possibly, because it sounds like this. You said this
group was a traveling group, they were nomadic. Yes, that
Holly was abandoned in Arizona, and that she's not.

Speaker 3 (01:01:58):
The only child. But we don't know about the other
children that were possibly abandoned. We just know that it
happened at least one other time.

Speaker 1 (01:02:04):
Yeah, so's it is possible that they did not willingly
give up their daughter. It's possibly they weren't aware that
their daughter was being given up. Yeah, there's a lot
of things that we just don't know, and it sounds
like we might not ever.

Speaker 3 (01:02:17):
Well, so they're looking for a specific woman. I can't
remember her name. I feel like it was Gloria Hernandez
or something. Like that that is possibly connected. That could
be like sister Susan possibly so looking for her and
her three children whose names I can't remember, but they
all started with a J. They were known as the
three Js.

Speaker 1 (01:02:35):
Okay in the cult.

Speaker 3 (01:02:37):
Okay, and anything that they possibly know more about what
may have happened to Dean and Tina. But as far
as the Christ Family goes, like the minimal information that
I have about them is they were about two thousand
members strong in the nineteen Eightiesang, they weren't not a
very small group.

Speaker 2 (01:02:54):
But yeah, and they're nomadic.

Speaker 3 (01:02:56):
Yeah, oh damn yeah, so there.

Speaker 2 (01:02:59):
Are still do they just like roll up into random
towns being nomadic and being like we live here for
three months now.

Speaker 1 (01:03:04):
I don't know if it was a centralized group. It
may have been different groups spread out over the country.

Speaker 3 (01:03:08):
Now Charles Mchew was the leader of the whole group
of two thousand people. So, like I said, the group
ends up sort of disbanding in nineteen eighty seven, but
there's still like pockets of followers that even are still
around today that post in message boards. It's not the
two thousand strong that they had in the nineteen eighties.
So they weren't hard to spot. They wore white robes,

(01:03:30):
walked barefoot, They carried all of color army blankets to
sleep on. They picked food out of trash cans, and
liked to argue about religion. And the members assumed the
surname of Christ. Some changed their first names, so there
was Abraham Christ, Michael Christ, and Jacob Christ, but for
the most part, the Christ family stay out of the
headlines until nineteen eighty. They were actually one of the

(01:03:51):
groups that attended the Washington for Jesus rally in Washington, DC,
which is not something we've covered on this podcast.

Speaker 1 (01:03:57):
I want to know more about.

Speaker 2 (01:03:58):
Okay, interesting.

Speaker 3 (01:04:00):
Washington for Jesus is a prayer rally organized by John
Jimminenz Jimz a Pentecostal evangelical.

Speaker 2 (01:04:07):
Do you mean him andez he Meenez Humenez Jays are
silent in many Hispanics or it's pronounced like an h yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:04:16):
Human Anyway, John Jumenez a Pentecostal evangelist and a TV preacher,
and it's credited for giving rise to the modern Christian Conservatives,
with the first rally being held in late April of
nineteen eighty. Conservative Christians from across the country United against homosexuality,
teenage pregnancy, abortion, divorce, and the Women's Liberation movement.

Speaker 2 (01:04:35):
Hold on, if you're against teenage pregnancy but also against abortion,
what do you expect the answer to be? There?

Speaker 3 (01:04:41):
Total celibacy until marriage. I know it's stupid.

Speaker 1 (01:04:45):
It doesn't work. Oh no, it doesn't work.

Speaker 2 (01:04:47):
Yeah no, I just think it's funny.

Speaker 1 (01:04:49):
It's dumb.

Speaker 3 (01:04:50):
Yeah it's funny, but not a haha way because it's
actively hurting people.

Speaker 1 (01:04:55):
And yeah, no, it's funny in a painful way. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:04:58):
I have a different kind of a thing feeling about
it being funding because again I grew up in like
a lot of this kind of stuff, Whereas like the
way absence worked for me, it was like, so what
is absence? Is just like you just don't do it? Yeah,
what else do we talk? Just go okay, so what
what instead? Or like what about it? Or why you
just don't do it?

Speaker 3 (01:05:17):
I remembering, So I actually went to a school because
I grew up in California. I grew up in the
Bay Area, So I went to a school that had
a pretty comprehensive sex at like teaching, And even then
I remember being really pissed off because one of the
questions on the test was what's the best way to
prevent pregnancy and STD or I don't know it was
specifically pregnancy, and I had answered an IUD and I

(01:05:40):
got it wrong because they're like, no, it's abstinence, and
I'm like, that's fucking stupid. And I argued about it
because it is stupid because you're asking me what's the
best way to prevent pregnancy if you're like sexually It
didn't say if you were sexually active, but I had assumed,
so it was like, an IUD is the best way
to prevent pregnancy.

Speaker 1 (01:05:55):
It's the most I mean, technically speaking, the best way
to prevent pregnancy is a hysterectomy. Just scooped that thing
out and then you can't.

Speaker 2 (01:06:01):
I mean, yeah, there you go out, that's true.

Speaker 1 (01:06:02):
There you go.

Speaker 2 (01:06:03):
We were talking about tying tubes earlier today.

Speaker 1 (01:06:05):
We were yeah, vasectomy, just cutting down v sectamy.

Speaker 3 (01:06:10):
Is actually better than tube tying because it's less invasive
and it can be reversed. Just yep, get rid of it.

Speaker 2 (01:06:18):
Anyway and you get a couple weeks off work.

Speaker 3 (01:06:20):
So the Christ Family cult were actually among the most
liberal people in the audience because they forbade drinking, but
praise tobacco and marijuana because both plants were God given herbs.

Speaker 2 (01:06:32):
You know, when we talk about cults who have that perspective,
I do find it oddly refreshing in a weird way.

Speaker 1 (01:06:38):
There's so much There is so much happening, according to
police in Florida, California, and Arizona, where they were known
the group, So like, we don't know for sure that
the car was in Los Angeles, but it was an
area that the group was like to be known to be.

Speaker 3 (01:06:54):
Yeah. So the group was strange but harmless. They struck
to strict vegan diets and didn't wear shoes because leather
was the product of captive animals.

Speaker 1 (01:07:02):
There are shoes that are not made of leather. Yeah,
there are many cultures that are shoes that are made
of weather. You could have shoes made of wood. You
could people make shoes out of likes, you could have clogs,
people make sandals out of like reeds and whatnot.

Speaker 2 (01:07:14):
You can have plant based shoes.

Speaker 3 (01:07:16):
Yeah, Nope, no shoes.

Speaker 2 (01:07:18):
But no, they had to have them feet out, put
your grippers away.

Speaker 1 (01:07:21):
No on wants to see that.

Speaker 3 (01:07:23):
But perhaps the most important tenet of the Christ's Family
cults was that the children were strictly forbidden because kids
were a distraction. They were a hindrance to the cult's
nomadic lifestyle. Mothers stopping to breastfeed and caring for babies
would only slow them down. It is believed that Dean
and Tina joined Christ's Family in late nineteen eighty, sometime
around October when the letters stopped coming in. If they

(01:07:44):
wanted to stay in the cult, they'd have to get
rid of baby Holly, and lucky for them, a priest
in Yuma, Arizona was happy to take her in. So
this is a lot of people are still like suggesting
that they gave Holly up willingly, which again it just
like I know what happens, but it just feels wrong
to me.

Speaker 1 (01:08:02):
I mean, regardless of whether they did or not, like that,
they were still killed somehow.

Speaker 2 (01:08:07):
They were both still killed and influenced, yes, one way,
whether or not they were influenced to give a hop
Holly or influence that they were like you should and
they denied it. There was factors that were in their
lives that were making their life more and more difficult
and dangerous.

Speaker 1 (01:08:22):
The cult kind of forced this decision to happen, regardless
of whether they willingly gave up their daughter.

Speaker 2 (01:08:27):
And I do fully believe that the cult is involved
in the fact that they're dead. Maybe again, the cult
members themselves didn't do the murder, but I do think
because the fact that the cult was around them and
they supposedly rejoined that cult that led them to their deaths.

Speaker 3 (01:08:42):
And that's all the information we have about the disappearance
of Dean, Tina, and Holly and the resurgence of finding
out where they are in the last couple of years.

Speaker 2 (01:08:51):
I'm excited to see if we like hear in the
future anything more about this cult because this is.

Speaker 3 (01:08:56):
Technically an ongoing investigation because we still don't know who
ca Dean and Tina. They are looking for a woman
that they believe was Sister Susan Right and her children
to try and because like sister Susan's most likely dead,
but her children are still alive, and they're just trying
to figure out what the fuck happen. They're like, someone
out there knows something.

Speaker 2 (01:09:13):
Yeah, John, Jacob and Jimmy.

Speaker 3 (01:09:15):
I think they're all girls. So it was like Jill said, okay,
jail Jay and something else.

Speaker 1 (01:09:21):
It's frustrating, especially this is a situation with cold cases
in general, where especially when this amount of time has passed,
that often the witnesses or the perpetrators or the people
who would be able to tell you what happened are
dead and or.

Speaker 2 (01:09:38):
Old and just can't correctly say.

Speaker 1 (01:09:41):
Or the evidence has disappeared or been destroyed over time,
or there were no good records being kept.

Speaker 3 (01:09:48):
At the time Jayan, sorry, I just found it.

Speaker 1 (01:09:51):
Or the records were not being kept properly at the time,
because it doesn't seem like anybody was caring about anything
like as far as actually investigating this or the whole
situationuition with like these people who had the mom's car.

Speaker 2 (01:10:05):
And these people like I get the necessity.

Speaker 1 (01:10:09):
And I am in favor of people being able to
anonymously surrender children because I do think that that, you know,
because the option is just like there are people who
will just leave kids to die, and I would much
rather you safely anonymously surrender a child that you do
not feel capable of raising them, just abandon them, that is.

Speaker 2 (01:10:32):
I don't know, maybe this is too much word, but
noble in a way to just understand the better you
can't give that child what they need, So you are
surrendering giving someone that child a chance.

Speaker 1 (01:10:42):
Yeah. I'm not going to shame a person for doing that. Yeah,
but it is frustrating that, like in this instance, the
parents either right before this or very soon after died,
were killed, and the people who gave this child up,
who actually presented her to this this priest, whomever who

(01:11:04):
ended up adopting her, likely knew more information about it.
And because there was no kind of record keeping about that,
we will not be able to find them likely and
that's frustrating.

Speaker 3 (01:11:16):
So the attorney the Texas Attorney General's Office has been
looking for a woman named Rosemary Garcia or her daughter's
Jill Joy and jan They believe they might know something
about what happened. Specifically, they likely knew Tina, but they
would likely know what happened between October of nineteen eighty
and January of nineteen eighty one.

Speaker 2 (01:11:37):
So if you're listening to this, then for some weird reason,
you know more about this than we should. Yeah, contact
your local to the police dept. Or no, I guess
contact the Texas.

Speaker 3 (01:11:47):
The Texas Attorney General's this and also possibly the FBI.

Speaker 1 (01:11:50):
At this point because it's a multi state investigation.

Speaker 3 (01:11:52):
Yeah, yeah, Actually there are other people who think that
it's possible. So there's no evidence so far that the
cult is linked to the murders, like directly, right, there
also is a possibility that, like someone was saying, like, well,
Dean used to pick up hitchhikers, maybe they were hitchhikers,
were picked up and killed by whoever picked them up.

Speaker 1 (01:12:11):
But they didn't have the car. Or are you saying
they were the hitchhikers, they were the hitchhikers.

Speaker 3 (01:12:16):
It's possible that again, like someone who had just joined
the group and was maybe more in it for the
drugs than anything else killed, Like, there's a lot of
different because the murder is not within them of this cult,
of what we know of the cults. The definitely were
dangerous in other ways, like obviously with the child molestation
charge and with the drug trafficking charges which which went

(01:12:39):
outside of marijuana even though marijuana was like the big one,
which we all have our own opinions on that, but
like murder was not their amo for sure.

Speaker 2 (01:12:48):
And also you didn't mention there being any like suspected
murder or any like this is the.

Speaker 3 (01:12:54):
Only murder just no one that could possibly be connected.

Speaker 2 (01:12:56):
Yeah, so it just doesn't sound like it's.

Speaker 1 (01:12:59):
Literally there's too many unknowns. I mean, we could speculate
all day and never really it's not like we're going
to solve this here sitting here talking about it. But
it is something that there is that desire to want
to know and to want to try and fix it.
That was why I was speculating like maybe, like if
Dean was beaten, his death was an accident, right, because

(01:13:20):
I like something that's something that's very like easy act
to go too far. If you're trying to hurt somebody badly,
it's very easy to go too far.

Speaker 2 (01:13:29):
And then you don't want you to find out about it.
You just dump them two hundred fifty miles away. And
having the baby is a liability too.

Speaker 3 (01:13:37):
So I'm ending this episode with As of twenty twenty four,
there are over fourteen five hundred Jane and John does
in the United States, and Holly wants to make a
difference and is urging others to donate their DNA samples
to ged match, which is the service that is used
to track down the Golden State Killer and was used
to track down the identities of Dean and Tina. That

(01:13:57):
being said, I can understand not wanting to.

Speaker 1 (01:14:00):
Yeah, if there are people who have issues, especially with
like medical genetic privacy, because places like this do work
with the police and do release that information to the police,
and it's understandable for somebody to be like that feels
like a violation of my privacy. Yeah, But when it
comes to situations like this, it can help because you

(01:14:22):
could be related to somebody who did something bad like
that was the case with the Golden State Care, wasn't
it where it was like a third cousin or something. Yes,
where it's like, oh, hey, we know you're related to
this person. Yeah, you didn't do anything, but maybe you
know who it is, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:14:35):
Yeah. Yeah, So during the time of the Golden Stick Killer,
was there anything suspicious?

Speaker 1 (01:14:39):
And yeah, did you have a weird relative who was
doing something who lived in this state at this time? Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:14:45):
So Holly ends up helping open up the Dean and
Tina Lynn Klaus Memorial fund.

Speaker 1 (01:14:52):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 3 (01:14:53):
There is a GoFundMe campaign that goes towards supporting genetic
genealogy investigations. Let's see if that go fund me still up. Nope,
Disabled New donations. Uh did it reach its goal? It
only it only got twenty seven hundred dollars. But as
far as I know, she, like Holly, is still out
there advocating for trying to find the identities of Jane

(01:15:14):
and John Doe's throughout the United States. She doesn't seem
as focused on like the cult aspect or the or
even necessarily like I think she is somewhat focused on
the murder aspect. She does want to know what happened
to her birth parents, sure, but she is really interested
in trying to find the identities of like missing persons.

Speaker 1 (01:15:32):
I mean, I'd be pissed off about that. Also if
it took forty years.

Speaker 2 (01:15:35):
Yeah yeah, yeah, that shouldn't have happened. Yeah, so yeah, yeah,
thank you. Well, all right, I think the moral of
the story, I mean.

Speaker 3 (01:15:46):
A takeaway real quick, I'd like to think the uh
the places that I got my information from. There was
I Didn't Know I was missing, which is a podcast,
There is I've got this all written down. There is
a podcast called and Then They Were Gone, which is
where I got a lot of my information from. There
was an interview with Rick Allen Ross on the news,

(01:16:06):
and there was also a sorry. There's a YouTube channel
called true Crime Recaps who I also got a lot
of information from, So thank you to all of those people.
And then also what is this? The Cult Education Institute
also had a lot of information, very very good. There
was also so this one was interesting. There's a website

(01:16:28):
called muck Rock. I didn't get any information from this website,
but I wanted to bring it up anyway because someone
filed in November of twenty twenty four. So last year,
someone filed a Freedom of Information Act for records about
the Christ Family cult. Okay, and it is still a
waiting response. So MuckRock was able to tell me that
someone filed this freedom of Information Act and they're still

(01:16:52):
a waiting a response about it. Interesting, Okay, So I
just thought that one was interesting.

Speaker 2 (01:16:57):
Let's see take away, I mean.

Speaker 1 (01:17:00):
Takeaway, I think now we have better technologies, We do
have better systems in place. Not to say that police
incompetence doesn't happen to this day and age, because very
much do.

Speaker 3 (01:17:13):
I mean literally, the Golden State killer ended up being
a cop.

Speaker 1 (01:17:16):
Yeah, it's a situation where it's not to blame any
of the victims because it's none of their fault. It's
one of those situations where I'm glad that we have
better ways of kingdom communicating now, I'm glad that we
have better ways of expressing like, Hey, my loved ones
went missing and they disappeared around this time and in

(01:17:37):
this place.

Speaker 2 (01:17:38):
And by saying that nowadays, there's better things in place,
police intervention or not, government or not that help us
to find people, yes, more faster, more reliably.

Speaker 1 (01:17:48):
It's frustrating that we don't know anything more about the situation,
and it's I can't imagine how frustrating it is for
the family. That's my biggest takeaway is like, God, that must.

Speaker 3 (01:17:57):
Be horrible for the family because years they didn't even
know like what happened. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:18:02):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:18:03):
It also makes me think of that documentary are watching
about Amy Bradley. Amy Bradley. If you, as a person,
are out there in the world and you think you
saw something, you should say something.

Speaker 1 (01:18:14):
M h.

Speaker 2 (01:18:15):
Even if you're like it's probably not them, or it's
highly unlikely or it makes no sense, you should still
say something because that may mean that they find someone
who's missing.

Speaker 3 (01:18:25):
Well, because there was an Amy Bradley's case, there was
a man who was a Navy sailor at the time
who says that he saw Amy Bradley in I think
it was the Bahamas or somewhere around there and didn't
report it because he didn't want to get in trouble.

Speaker 2 (01:18:40):
It's yeah, it's just you should say something, yeah, because
it could change someone's life.

Speaker 1 (01:18:44):
Hopefully we get more information about this, at least for
the family's sake, because I'm glad that they are reconnected
with Holly and glad that they have this person back
in their life who they thought that they had, because
I can't imagine how devastating that was to not only
lose your children, but your grandchild also, so you're like
newborn grandchild.

Speaker 3 (01:19:02):
Imagine being the investigators though, that are finally telling like, hey,
we did find your your missing brother.

Speaker 1 (01:19:09):
Yeah, it's like who Yeah, they should have known that
these kids.

Speaker 2 (01:19:15):
I'm sorry.

Speaker 1 (01:19:15):
I'm just mad at cops perpetual, but that's that's what
we got. Thank you, Chelsea for this, which is gonna
plague me now, but thank you for this story. You're welcome.

Speaker 3 (01:19:25):
I mean, I mean honestly, like I know, like this
is technically still ongoing, but I just don't know if
the murder itself will ever be solved, so I thought
we might as well talk about it now, because like
the core aspects of it have been solved, it is
interesting if we end up finding out more information about
Christ family. But finding information was also hard because when

(01:19:45):
you search Christ Family, unfortunately the Family International ends up
coming up in a lot of searches.

Speaker 1 (01:19:51):
Gosh, dang, they're seo.

Speaker 2 (01:19:52):
Yeah, thanks so much, Chelsea.

Speaker 1 (01:19:55):
We are going to move on to the final section
of our podcast, which is Correspondence and correction.

Speaker 2 (01:20:00):
But first let's have a brief word from our sponsors.

Speaker 3 (01:20:10):
So let's start with the Blue Sky.

Speaker 1 (01:20:12):
The Blue Sky.

Speaker 3 (01:20:14):
First, we got blank Spaces eighty four, who sends us
a TikTok about some they look like earrings, but they're cryptids.

Speaker 1 (01:20:23):
They can be crypted earrings.

Speaker 3 (01:20:24):
I know, but it's like they do look like earrings,
but I also want them to be pins.

Speaker 1 (01:20:28):
Oh I see, I see, I see. We also have
American Rando who has some turtle info for us. Start out,
I have stopped on the side of the road smooth
turtles that are in the middle of the road to
the side that they're headed towards. However, if I saw
a five hundred pound finger snap and bowser in the
road or in a lake, it would definitely be you're
on your own homie. Yep, this sounds like Lake Placid

(01:20:48):
with a snapping turtle with no cursing. Betty White. Betty
White was in Lake Placid.

Speaker 3 (01:20:52):
I have not seen that movie in decades.

Speaker 1 (01:20:54):
Well, put it back on your with I don't know
if I want to also rip to the guy who
owned the Serpent Tarium and Willing Wilmington. That place was
awesome among the tanks of poisonous snakes and gaiters. He
also had a big old bowser. I don't think five
hundred pounds, but pretty good size. That place also had
a plaque in front of the crocodile exhibit with the
myth of the World War II battle where crocodiles eight

(01:21:16):
hundreds of Japanese soldiers. I read it. Then I looked
up and found one of the crocodiles staring directly at me.
Pretty cool, but good thing the glass was there.

Speaker 3 (01:21:25):
I have this issue where I see any creature that
is not a spider and I'm like, pet.

Speaker 2 (01:21:32):
Dude, that is a problem. A problem.

Speaker 1 (01:21:34):
It will be the end of you.

Speaker 3 (01:21:35):
Where However, there was this video from Australia. This snake
swimming in the water and approaching a surfer, and it
was actually saying like, if this happens to you, you
should just let the snake like sniff you and be
still and be friendly and then let it go on
its way because it probably it doesn't really want to
have anything to do with you. But if you fight back,
it's going to fight as well. And I'm sitting there like, yeah,
that would not be my problem. My problem would be

(01:21:58):
like friend, and.

Speaker 1 (01:22:00):
Then I would leave you alone. I'd be like, well,
that's on you.

Speaker 3 (01:22:05):
At blank Space's eighty four sends it's the TikTok from
someone who says, my uncle is the leader of scientology.
So her name is Jenna Miskavich.

Speaker 1 (01:22:13):
We're gonna have to follow up on a bunch of these.
These are some blank spaces.

Speaker 2 (01:22:17):
Eighty four cents is a lot of very interesting TikTok.

Speaker 3 (01:22:19):
I love it. I gotta be back on TikTok.

Speaker 1 (01:22:22):
Were you ever on TikTok?

Speaker 3 (01:22:23):
I was often on TikTok.

Speaker 1 (01:22:25):
It seems like so long ago. It was so long ago,
so so so long ago. At Hinarashi says, just realized
you miss the opportunity to cover a missing person for
episode four oh four and title it not found Is.

Speaker 3 (01:22:38):
This episode four oh five?

Speaker 2 (01:22:39):
No, this is episode like four h nine.

Speaker 1 (01:22:41):
Oh, this is well, this person this time, this one
is very much not like it's been. It's been several
episodes since then.

Speaker 3 (01:22:49):
Oh, dear at Chili. Hibiscus sends us two things. One
very sorry to hear about Chelsea being laid off. Hope
you find something else soon where you can put your
wonderful town to use. Thank you, Yes, I appreciate that.
And then the story about malin abortion was very sweet.
He really is a walking green flag. Aw Also the yes. Also,
the very small kernel of truth behind the abortion causing

(01:23:12):
breast cancer is that some studies have shown that breastfeeding
can reduce the risk of breast cancer. Some from a
pre tortured perspective, abortion does increase the risk of breast cancer,
but in the same way not getting pregnant in the
first place, or giving the baby up for adoption and
not nursing them would interesting. I have heard the thing
about breastfeeding can reduce breast cancer.

Speaker 1 (01:23:31):
Interesting. Interesting. The human body is so confusing to me.

Speaker 3 (01:23:35):
Oh, and they sent us one more thing, Yes, not
me misreading the episode description and thinking we were going
to do go to India, not Indiana on this cryptid hunt.
Now we got to do an Indian.

Speaker 1 (01:23:44):
I did love to listen. We can look into some
more because we've we've done international cryptis before. I'd be
happy to talk about an Indian cryptid. They're fun. The
world's got weird creatures in it.

Speaker 3 (01:23:54):
As at tax for posting at you several times in
a row. Here is Watson sleeping in a shoe box.

Speaker 2 (01:24:00):
Widow Kidy, I cra have more cats.

Speaker 3 (01:24:02):
I know me too, such a sweet baby. All right,
we have time for an email.

Speaker 1 (01:24:08):
Let's yeah, I can read you an email.

Speaker 3 (01:24:09):
I would love for you to read me an email.

Speaker 1 (01:24:11):
I would love to read you an email. So we
got a couple of shorties, ill at least one shorty
and then one more longie, but I can read it longy.
So if this one is called episode three ninety three,
Colts and shit suggestion zor Robinhood here again listening to
the new episode, and you're all discussing cults, which made
me think about a book I just finished that would

(01:24:31):
I would really suggest you read about the subject Uncultured,
a memoir by Daniella Young. She was born to the
children of God. Now insert that episode here and.

Speaker 2 (01:24:40):
That would be episode one thirty one, and.

Speaker 1 (01:24:43):
After leaving joined the military and posits that it is
just another cult. I would highly suggest it, although I
would give a trigger warning for talks of sexual assault.
Also for pet tax. Please accept these pictures of my
mother's dog, Chompy. He's not photogenic, not even when she's asleep,
but she's very sweet. Ah show us the dogs.

Speaker 3 (01:25:03):
Are never photogenic. As far as I'm concerned.

Speaker 1 (01:25:06):
I have always this. This looks like an alien.

Speaker 2 (01:25:10):
This looks like this.

Speaker 1 (01:25:11):
Look I was gonna say, this is like a freaking
e walk. Look at this dog, this creature.

Speaker 2 (01:25:17):
Yeah, great, gaze upon it, gaze upon chombie. I must
have hurt my eyes.

Speaker 1 (01:25:26):
Thank you very much.

Speaker 3 (01:25:27):
Mal told me yesterday, He's like, you know, I'm not
a dog person, right.

Speaker 1 (01:25:30):
I just stared at him.

Speaker 2 (01:25:31):
I don't like dogs. I like my dog. I don't
like dogs.

Speaker 3 (01:25:34):
He agreed to get a dog.

Speaker 2 (01:25:35):
This is a joint decision for us to get me
and it was a tough call for me.

Speaker 3 (01:25:39):
Okay, and now you want more dogs.

Speaker 2 (01:25:41):
I want more of this kind of dog. No, you
don't I want more of fluffy dogs. Okay, fair.

Speaker 3 (01:25:49):
Familiar, no one, No one needs several border collies unless
you have sheep.

Speaker 1 (01:25:55):
We have an email if you allow, from our fluffy
chicken correspondent for your love. It always we love to
hear from Fiona. So this was called talking weather with Chelsea.
Thank you. So this is Fiona speaking through me towards you. Hello, ladies,
mal and other biologicals Chelsea. I feel this email was
directed mostly at you, Christina. I realized whether discussions aren't

(01:26:17):
always your favorite.

Speaker 3 (01:26:18):
It's fascinating.

Speaker 1 (01:26:20):
Well, it's been an active first quarter here both meteorologically
and seismologically TDLR. We had flooding, then an earthquake. We
aren't in a normally seismically active area, and now more
flooding cult recommendation Timtamoffer and chicken pictures. You've activated Chelsea
with everything you said, she is now so activating. We

(01:26:41):
had the highest recorded February rainfall at the start of
the month. Overall, we had more than two is March.
By the way, we are, yes this was sent in March,
because I was like, we're in August, but no, but
you were saying the email was sent in March, which
is correct, yes is yes, sorry.

Speaker 3 (01:26:52):
We have overall fully in August.

Speaker 1 (01:26:54):
We are very firmly. In August we had more than
twelve hundred millimeters, that's forty seven plus inches. The first
three feet happened in the first three days of the month.
Jesus I and most of the town got stood down
from work. Many road schools and businesses closed. Highway both
sides of town and the train line were impassable. Slash

(01:27:15):
some damage, lots of houses flooded, rivers broke their banks,
small communities, smaller communities cut off, mud slips, slash slides,
et cetera. Oh, and crocodiles and bear offish and people's
flooded backyards.

Speaker 2 (01:27:28):
Gott a love Australia.

Speaker 3 (01:27:29):
Just from contacts, I know baryfish are probably deadly, but
also what the fuck is a baryfish?

Speaker 1 (01:27:35):
You could google this, couldole we could google this, just
the idea and this is very much like a thing
that we in the United States don't have to worry about,
except if you're in Florida, wherein like, yeah, your yard
floods and there's just a giant lizard in there now
that will kill yours. Are you looking at barfish they're huge.
That sounds about Australia. That's a big fish doesn't eat you.

(01:27:57):
I don't know. I feel like it would try. Oh
like Bira Mundi. Yeah, I know of Barra Mundi. Apparently
they're tasty.

Speaker 3 (01:28:04):
Oh okay, so I mean there you go.

Speaker 1 (01:28:07):
Then on March first, there was a cyclone off the coast,
but it skipped us, so instead we had an earthquake. Jesus,
we don't usually get earthquakes. I was only a little
in It was only a little one in California terms,
just four point four.

Speaker 3 (01:28:20):
Ope, that's a big truck passing by your street here.

Speaker 1 (01:28:22):
But for other people, you don't normally have earth guys. True,
that's a big deal. The epicenter was about twenty kilometers
from my place and only only ten kilometers deep.

Speaker 3 (01:28:34):
That's sixty shallow for an earthquake.

Speaker 1 (01:28:36):
It lasted only a few seconds, but we got the
sonic boom that sometimes happens, which led to the local
Facebook pages blowing up with conspiracy theories secret military testing
tunnels under the mountain, collapsing Chinese warships off the coast
as it was initially picked up near the military training grounds,
then as more data came in and I was and
it was triangulated. It was found to be closer to

(01:28:56):
the dam. Initially people thought it might have been a
meteorite strike or a stolen car crashing into their home
due to the boom.

Speaker 3 (01:29:04):
Yeah, like I said, like a lot of times smaller
earthquakes here in California, like I will think, oh, big
truck is just passing the street, and it's like, oh no,
that was an earthquake. Yeah, so yeah, But Geosciences Australia
pretty quickly confirmed it was an earthquake. I was almost
asleep when it happened nine point thirty one and thought
it may have been a helicopter crash as we are
under the route they take from the airport to the

(01:29:24):
military training grounds. Here's some security footage I found in
the moment the earthquake happened. Turn on the sound to
hear the boom. Earthquakes are fascinating.

Speaker 1 (01:29:32):
Then the rain came back, flash flooding took over lots
of suburbs again. We had twelve inches three hundred millimeters
on the nineteenth of March, and that's more than the
usual average March rainfall, which can you imagine getting the
more than the average total month rainfall in one day.
That's insane. Crazy with road cut again and houses inundated again.

(01:29:54):
My place is fine. Luckily, they're saying one more system
is to come through and it will drop up to
two hundred millimeters a day over a few days. The
ground is so soaked that there's just nowhere for it
to go. Maybe we'll get another earthquake. God, I hope not.

Speaker 3 (01:30:06):
This is in March, so I don't remember hearing about
another earthquake in Australia.

Speaker 1 (01:30:11):
I am so over the mud, and so are the chickens.
Although these silkies are or silky crosses, they do just
like standing in the rains the attached pictures. I'm trying
to work out if it's an earthquake sandwich on floods
or just flood and earthquake soup. Anyway, the three Days
can find a home. Glad me to catch up on
the podcast listening and instagram squalling in between bomb watching, bo.

Speaker 3 (01:30:35):
M watching BOM, dot gov dot AU.

Speaker 1 (01:30:37):
Hold on, gotta load this up now and figure out
what that is.

Speaker 3 (01:30:40):
Oh, it's like weather. Okay, all right.

Speaker 2 (01:30:43):
I was about to say, you clicking on unverified links
right here now.

Speaker 1 (01:30:46):
I trust, Fiona.

Speaker 2 (01:30:47):
Yeah, that's fair.

Speaker 1 (01:30:48):
And I stumbled across a doomsday cat coult led by
a lady called Cheryl Ruthven. That may interest you. Oh boy, Pas,
I can hook you up with some tintams if needed.
Just give us some time to get the road clear
so that can mature it into down anyway, gotta go.
It just started raining, your fluffy chicken correspondent, Fiona. And
then there are some attached pictures of soggy versus fluffy

(01:31:12):
chunk and one of the voids, Marty the rooster and Honey. No,
they chose to stand in the rain. They have undercover
areas to keep their dry. They just didn't want to
use them.

Speaker 3 (01:31:20):
Though someday. Isn't a myth that chickens will drown in
rain because they'll just stare up at the sky.

Speaker 1 (01:31:26):
I know, I heard that from chickens. Also because chickens
are stupid. Chickens are pretty dumb. Chickens are very still
though they can be both. You do not have to
be smart to be a niacle, right, You can be
stupid and have mouse in your heart.

Speaker 2 (01:31:41):
That's so right.

Speaker 1 (01:31:43):
I don't know if that's a real thing that chickens do.
And my mom actually grew up with chickens, like her
family had chickens growing up, so she would know more
about that than I would. But she's also told me
stories about hypnotizing chickens, So I think they are pretty stupid.
Your mom on the podcast, just get my mom on
here and be like tell us about it.

Speaker 2 (01:32:00):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:32:01):
Anyway, silkies are the ginger cat of the chicken world,
one brain cell between them. So here's a bunch of
pictures that we have been sent of all of these
almost the cats.

Speaker 2 (01:32:10):
These chickens.

Speaker 1 (01:32:11):
Yeah, weird cats, These weird cats in their fluffiest and
wettest forms.

Speaker 3 (01:32:16):
I love it.

Speaker 1 (01:32:17):
I love the note where they chose to do this,
choose to be out, they could be in the dry area, they.

Speaker 2 (01:32:23):
Chose not to.

Speaker 3 (01:32:24):
Yeah, I love it.

Speaker 2 (01:32:26):
Thank you so much, Fiona.

Speaker 1 (01:32:27):
I hope that the times in between it's been months
since you sent that, Yeah, I hope that it has
been wetter, not wetter, drier and more stable.

Speaker 2 (01:32:35):
I hope I bless you with more wet chickens.

Speaker 1 (01:32:38):
I hope the ground has been stable and the sky
has been clear.

Speaker 3 (01:32:42):
Also, if you're if your offer of Tim Tams still stands,
I have like just the normal flavored tim Tams. I
am interested in exotic Timtams.

Speaker 1 (01:32:54):
What does that mean?

Speaker 3 (01:32:55):
Just remember when we got our first box of tim Tams,
there were a whole bunch of other flavors in there
that were like, I want to know more about the
different kind because we've got like a salted caramel, and
the dark chocolate and the milk chocolate.

Speaker 2 (01:33:05):
There was an orange one, there was a raspberry one.

Speaker 1 (01:33:07):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:33:08):
Yeah, but also the salted caramel's my favorite.

Speaker 1 (01:33:12):
Thank you very much, Fiona, Thank you very much everyone
through also the original I think it was when Robinhood
also sent us the email. Thank you everyone who sends
us something we beat either I can't talk, be it
the emails or social media, whatever, we appreciate it very much.
When you correspond with us, it brightens our days so
so so much. And if you have something that you

(01:33:34):
would like us to know about this, if you know
more about the topic that Chelsea presented today, or if
you have a suggestion for a future topic, or if
you want to show us pictures of your pets, feel
free to do so. You can email us at.

Speaker 3 (01:33:46):
Cult Scripted's Conspiracies at gmail dot com.

Speaker 1 (01:33:49):
Alternative Well, you can go to our social media is
where you can contact us. That way, we have a
Blue Sky.

Speaker 3 (01:33:54):
At C three podcast and we also have a Patreon
Patreon dot com slash Cold Scripted's Conspiracies.

Speaker 1 (01:34:00):
Alternatively, you can go directly to our website where we
have everything linked for your convenience, and there is a
submission forum on there too if you want to chat
with us cult Scriptedconspiracies dot com or what you could
do is I'm trying to think of something to join
a cult. Don't join a cult, that's fairly standard.

Speaker 3 (01:34:15):
Don't give up your children.

Speaker 1 (01:34:16):
Don't do that either unless you know you Sometimes you
have to use there's various circumstances. We're not going to
shame you or give blanket advice about how you should
handle your life. I mean sometimes we do, but in
this instance there's nuance. We recognize that. However, what you
should do isn't.

Speaker 3 (01:34:36):
What okay, cam, Yeah, well, as long as your own
speaking terms with her.

Speaker 1 (01:34:41):
You gotta go to relationship with your mom. You've got
no care relationship with your mom calor mom. The person
in your life who fills the mom niche, who fills
the mom niche, Maybe that's not your mother. Maybe it's
someone else.

Speaker 3 (01:34:52):
There is the friend, There is the.

Speaker 1 (01:34:53):
Ecological niche in your life that is mom shaped, and
somebody lives there. Call them, call your mom friend.

Speaker 2 (01:34:59):
That's what we got for you today.

Speaker 1 (01:35:01):
We'll be back next week with a completely different topic,
and we hope that you enjoy it. When that happens.

Speaker 3 (01:35:08):
Hopefully it won't be a bump.

Speaker 1 (01:35:10):
It might be I have I have no control.

Speaker 3 (01:35:12):
Yeah, I mean you do, I nope, turn my hands.

Speaker 2 (01:35:16):
I can't.

Speaker 1 (01:35:17):
I can't say.

Speaker 3 (01:35:18):
All right, who's to say what will happen where? Who's
to say where the wind will take you?

Speaker 1 (01:35:22):
Indeed?

Speaker 3 (01:35:22):
All right?

Speaker 1 (01:35:23):
All right? Well, goodbye Chelsea, Bye, Christina? Bye. Now I
can still hear his voice.

Speaker 2 (01:35:27):
Bye, ladies, I'm sleepy, so Christina, Yes, hello. If you
have an object, an air purifier okay, that pulls dust
and like pet danner stuff like out of that air,
out of the air and filters it wouldn't it also
standar reason that it will also pull fur out of
the air.

Speaker 1 (01:35:47):
If it can small amounts.

Speaker 2 (01:35:50):
Why would it be small? It would just suck in
the air, and the air.

Speaker 1 (01:35:53):
It's not the air is not fur in the air. Yes,
But the thing is what you have to take into
account is the air purrefire is creating like an air channel.
It's it's creating a very some amount of suction to
cause air to pass through it. But fur that is
not suspended in the air won't be pulled towards it
as well. I mean a little bit probably, but not as.

Speaker 2 (01:36:15):
Much I see.

Speaker 1 (01:36:16):
So if the air is small enough that it is
suspended in the air, or that it can be you know,
pulled by that force, sure, but larger, larger bits of
fur would not necessarily be sucked in.

Speaker 3 (01:36:27):
He want an air perier fire that also will clean
our house of fur?

Speaker 2 (01:36:31):
Yeah, I want to. I want to sweep less.

Speaker 1 (01:36:33):
There is a thing I saw that I want desperately.
It's in some houses where there's like a little on
the on the floor, like as a running board kind
of thing. There's like a little slip of vacuum thing,
and so when you sweep, you just pop this thing
open and it turns a vacuum on and.

Speaker 2 (01:36:47):
You just sweep everything into it and then you just
close it.

Speaker 3 (01:36:50):
And it's yeah, I want you can get installed in
your house.

Speaker 1 (01:36:52):
Yeah, so you have to have it installed, Yeah, you do,
But I want that I want there to just be
like a vacuum hole that I can sweep things into.

Speaker 2 (01:37:00):
Where is it where empty at that point? Yeah, that's
the I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:37:04):
I don't I imagine that you can set up a
tube to somewhere.

Speaker 2 (01:37:07):
Because I'm wondering, like what if it gets clogged or
what if the disposal gets full? Like do you then
have to go under your house? Like I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:37:14):
I don't think you would, because if it's a vacuum
then you could potentially have the bag the receptacle wherever
be like an accessible place. Yeah, yeah, so that like
it would fill up unless it's somehow set up like
a laundry shoe where there's just like a hole that
dumps right into your garbage can. That would be pretty great,
that would be.

Speaker 2 (01:37:31):
That would be pretty great.

Speaker 3 (01:37:32):
That would be except that, because like a laundry shoe,
laundry is heavy, and we'll just go into the whatever
where dust isn't like heavy. I feel like it would
be messy to try and have it directly into the
garbage can.

Speaker 1 (01:37:46):
It would just like it would, it would float about.

Speaker 2 (01:37:49):
Whatever the shoot is that is going down to the
trash has to be like sealed to the trash or
else it's just going to push out all over let's
say the hypothetical basement.

Speaker 3 (01:37:58):
But then it's like at that point you're you're it's
still like a separate trash can that like.

Speaker 1 (01:38:05):
War it has like a sensor, Like wherever you have it,
it's got like a sensor where once it's filled, these
little things come in the side. They compress it into
like a tube and then you just shoot the dust
tube as a solid mask or like a square or
a cube. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:38:19):
I do like that trash compactor, but for dust, for
dust and fur.

Speaker 1 (01:38:24):
Yeah, and firstly, Fur's an interesting side effect of air
pureifiers I learned recently is that they will cool the
room that they're in.

Speaker 3 (01:38:31):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:38:32):
I did not know that was a side because they're
not intended for that.

Speaker 3 (01:38:35):
No, it just will happen because that Yeah, because I
have to have air purifiers around well, because especially when
we had stitches and for a while when with cinder,
I was allergic. Mm hmm, thank you allergy shots.

Speaker 2 (01:38:48):
Yeah, you're actually not allergic. It's funny because when we
started doing those shots, they were like, well, there's really
no proof that this is really gonna help. That's mostly
going to help your tree allergies, and two years later
you're not allergic to cats. No, and the.

Speaker 3 (01:39:01):
Tree allergy is also lessened quite significantly, which is great.

Speaker 2 (01:39:05):
I'm happy. Yeah, I'm so happy for my ability to sleep.

Speaker 1 (01:39:10):
Yeah, me too.

Speaker 2 (01:39:11):
Well, thank for answering my science question.

Speaker 3 (01:39:14):
It wasn't as he asked me, and I was like,
I have an art degree.

Speaker 2 (01:39:17):
Yeah, that was her response, and it was like, I know,
just the person.

Speaker 1 (01:39:22):
It's just a little bit like, yes, it will suck
up some amount of ferbit house. It's whatever suspended in
the air or is light enough to be affected by
the very light suction.

Speaker 2 (01:39:31):
There is nothing in the world that's going to totally
eliminate my need to sweep the floor. I understand this.

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