Episode 245 (Cheeseburger of Their Dreams)

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:15):
Hello, and welcome to Deep Blue Sea the podcast. I
am Mark, I Don't want to die half myre.

Speaker 2 (00:21):
And I am Jay Monkey dars Clue.

Speaker 3 (00:24):
Welcome to Board Deep see the podcast. On this show,
we've been through the entire Deep Tragy.

Speaker 1 (00:29):
In this scene, Jay, so I I kind of made
it like help to help me?

Speaker 3 (00:33):
Yeah, go go go, go go this On this show,
we've been to the entire Deep Turgy scene by seeing
me again, all new wonderful guests, excuse me. And this
is Deep one chapter twenty. What happens in Deep one,
chapter twenty. Let's have a listen. The shark bursts through
the door from the wet entry room into the maintenance shot,
causing water to gush in rapidly.

Speaker 4 (00:56):
Go Go, Go, Go, Go, keep going.

Speaker 3 (01:02):
Oh. Carter climbs down to level two, whilst the others
continue to climb up. Reaching level two, Carter burns his
armor for him to break. He pulls at the shut doors,
ramming his knife into the gap and wrenching it, snapping

(01:25):
the blade off, opening the doors just enough to get
his fingers in. He struggles and heaves at the doors,
eventually getting them open just as the shark nears him.

Speaker 2 (01:44):
On the rapidly ascending north level.

Speaker 3 (01:53):
Carter barely mounts the ladder as the shark lunges for him.

Speaker 5 (01:57):
Ha ha.

Speaker 3 (02:00):
Kah an external support struck buckles, causing reverberations within the
maintenance shot. A section of the ladder comes loop, dangling
Scoggins and Susan above the water and dropping Janets into it.

(02:27):
Jean Scoggins and Susan Jim Nass moved themselves onto the
top of the ladder, whilst Carter scrambles up and across
the ladder, reaching down for Janets, who reaches right back up.

Speaker 5 (02:38):
Jan stay there, he.

Speaker 4 (02:47):
Give me over your corner.

Speaker 1 (02:49):
I don't want to die. Graub my hand. Come on,
grab grab on.

Speaker 4 (02:54):
I can't, I can't, I.

Speaker 3 (03:00):
H Janice disappears into the water, then reappears, propelled upwards
by the shark that has her gripped at the waist.

(03:35):
She and the shark descend once more and are gone.
Hard to gets on top of the ladder, Susan cries.
Scoggins looks stunned.

Speaker 1 (03:47):
Scars Yeah, can you reach that door above you?

Speaker 3 (03:52):
Scoggin's importantly reaches for a ledge that's far far out
of his reach.

Speaker 1 (03:56):
It's too high it's too high.

Speaker 3 (04:01):
Susan lies in the ladder next to cart. Bang always
resonates from the floor above, and again.

Speaker 2 (04:12):
And again.

Speaker 3 (04:15):
They look up in terror and apprehension.

Speaker 2 (04:18):
The banging continues.

Speaker 1 (04:22):
Sharks probably flooded that level too.

Speaker 3 (04:30):
Then the door opens, Trivial Preacher standing on the ledge.
He salutes them as we cut to a makeshift for
rope ladder being pulled up from the water level and
through the door. And that was the was he one

(04:58):
chapter twenty. We have a wonderful new guests are joining
us all the way from a whole different continent inside
of the world from me at least. She's a writer,
she's a film director, she's a been on many other
podcasts and a deep sea for where she can.

Speaker 2 (05:13):
It's Maria Lewis. Maria, welcome to the show.

Speaker 4 (05:15):
Thank you so much for having me Deepest Bluest. My
head is like a sharks pin, so I'm really honored
to be here, you know, to quote, I guess it's
not really in this scene, but I just it's one
of my favorite things about Deep Blue c is the
theme song.

Speaker 2 (05:30):
So he crops us at the end.

Speaker 3 (05:32):
But yes, in your your book, The Graveyard Shift, you
talk about Deep Sea you talk about the song Deepest Bluest.
I was already looking forward to invuting on the show,
and then when I started reading that and you talk
about it's I was thrilled, just overjoyed when it came
up in your book. So I I gotta know, like,
was that the only choice of the song that the

(05:53):
first choice.

Speaker 4 (05:55):
For context? The novel that you're talking about, The Graveyard Shift,
is about a woman who runs a horror themed radio show.
Ah Legend's got our physical copery and everything. So it's
about a woman who runs a horror themed radio show
and during one of her broadcasts, a listener gets killed
live on air. So all of the songs that she
plays are either used in horror movies or tie back

(06:18):
to horror movies in some way. And one of my
favorite sort of like sub subgenres of hip hop and
pop culture is essentially called horror core, and so it's
things like ghetto boys, Bone Thumbs, and Harmony with more
Murder and Beth song Deepest Bluest by Elle cool J
was sort of just on the other side of horror core.

(06:40):
And when Ello cool J was coming up, horror core
was like really having a moment, and it's just always
been a song.

Speaker 6 (06:46):
That I found so interesting.

Speaker 4 (06:47):
I think particularly the video clip where he is in
leather overalls while like synchronized swimmers essentially, you know, like
screen sirens doing really intense like routines behind him, and
at end of the video clip he anamorphs into a shark.
Whilst I just had always been obsessed with it, it's
just so cool. And I when I used to be

(07:09):
a reporter before I became a author and screenwriter and
just general like pop culture entomologist, but I wanted to
do a story on Deepest Bluest, kind of the last
rap horror movie theme song. And I called a local
jay's manager every day for six months, requesting an interview
specifically about Deepest Bluess, so the point that his manager

(07:31):
asked me to stop calling, and he never did an
interview with me about it. But I love, I genuinely
love Deep Blue Sea, and I love the show, and
Deepest Bluest is just like a nice little additional tack
on thing that I've always been obsessed with. And of course,
like really he has a line in his sort of

(07:52):
big first hit I'm Bad where he says that his
hat is like a Sharks fan. So it was like
sort of all these like connective tissues of hip hop
and culture and horror at the same time. And so
when it came to writing the book, she plays deepest
Bluest and that is like one of the sort of
pieces of trivia that somebody has to call in to
get tickets too.

Speaker 6 (08:11):
And it was a little little bit of.

Speaker 4 (08:13):
A reference to a reference to a reference, which yeah,
is kind of my bag.

Speaker 1 (08:17):
I love it. I want to know like the law
logistics of that song, because he's like, I'm gonna turn
into a shark, swim out in the ocean and murder people.

Speaker 4 (08:25):
Yeah, And then when you actually listen to the thematics
of the song, it really does tie in quite well
to his character because that's the last long line really
from Preachers, is like I miss the ghetto, right, And
so it's this all these like stereotypes and icronography of
like all the quote unquote sassy black character lines that
white screenwriters would give them. I was like, ah, man,

(08:47):
you see nothing yet, like blah blah blah. And so
it's very rare that the characters if you're a black actor,
especially if you're like a hip hop star transitioning into acting,
and you came from horrorcre even horror would be the
genre you would start in. Obviously you have like ice cube,
iced tea exhibit buster rhymes like everybody's done it, you know,

(09:08):
rah digger for goodness sakes quickly.

Speaker 6 (09:11):
Ah, you name it right.

Speaker 4 (09:13):
It was such an interesting, like traditional trajectory. But when
you listen to Deepest Bluist, he is kind of talking
about like moving through the streets and the world and
how it is like it's animal eat animal out there
and shark's eyes are all black and like not knowing
where the predators are going to come from. So he's
making these comparisons between street life and shark, you know,

(09:34):
shark predatory behavior in a way that's extremely you know, interesting,
but also then quite hilarious once you pair the visuals
of the video clip with it, and it's you know,
people trying to make synchronized swimming look cool as they've
got like nose plugs, and it's just like, I'm so sorry,
Like it's a very hard sport, but it is just
one thing synchronized swimming will never be is cool.

Speaker 1 (09:57):
I just think of how hard it would be. The
whole time. I'm never like that looks like that looks awesome.
I'm like, I'm tired doing that.

Speaker 4 (10:03):
And the song samples one of the best things about
d BUC which is the incredible score, like one of
the great Like I really truly think that score is
so special, and they sample that in the song, but
kind of like with a VI like like with a violin,
you know, ensemble to try and so the poor synchronized
swimmers are trying to match what's happening with the string instruments,

(10:26):
and it's just like it's so they Man, I hope
they got paid really well for that gig, because it's yeah,
I really felt for them.

Speaker 1 (10:34):
Work in music videos is terrible. I worked a few
and I retired from them. But I would have liked
to have been like an ad or like just a
art department on that video, just to sit there and
watch it.

Speaker 4 (10:45):
You don't want to be a You don't want to
be a woman on a music video set, you know,
it's the general rule of thumb. Being a woman on
a set's never fun, but especially in a music video
sien Era, you know, yeah.

Speaker 1 (10:57):
But it's just just like we have a tank full
of water lls and wellies just os.

Speaker 6 (11:05):
For some reason, when I.

Speaker 1 (11:08):
Was listening to Grave Shift, you mentioned raw that made
me really happen. I just want to throw that in
there before I forget, because that movie.

Speaker 4 (11:14):
Rules, great movie, And I mean Graveyard Shift was truly
like what book was it?

Speaker 6 (11:20):
It was my tenth novel.

Speaker 4 (11:22):
So before that, I had written a series of eight
books as part of a fantasy series that was horror,
different types of classic horror monsters with a feminist twist,
if you will, And then I'd done a book for
Marvel and a book for Assassin's Creed and the Graveyard
Shift was at the end of that, and it's something
I'd always wanted to write.

Speaker 6 (11:38):
It, always wanted to do a literary.

Speaker 4 (11:40):
Slasher because I was a big fan of things like
I Know what you did Last Summer originally a book
and that sort of like post Nancy Drew era where
there was some really interesting like babies, first slashes, peeping
tom stuff like that, and they just were not in vogue.
And so it was sort of this thing where there
was this few like literally slashes starting to come out
like this somebody inside you house and final girls that

(12:02):
were gaining traction.

Speaker 6 (12:03):
That the fact I was even able to.

Speaker 4 (12:05):
Sell one was great, but also it was able to
put in all of like my horror movie loves and references,
and the book is set in Australia, in a very
specific city in Australia, which is the birthplace of the
very first feature like film, which is called The Kelly Gang,
which is obviously about Nick Kelly, because you know, Australians
love like crime and like don't forget where convicts and

(12:27):
it's you know, like let's not examine who was actually
here first, you know.

Speaker 6 (12:32):
All of that stuff.

Speaker 4 (12:33):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, And so that was like the
perfect outlet for me being able to work in a
lot of pop cultural history and Australian history and iconography,
but also so much great horror movie law, whether that's
creature features like Deep Blue So or whether that's a
French feminist movie about cannibalism.

Speaker 1 (12:54):
Rules.

Speaker 6 (12:55):
Yeah, like you can go the gambit, you know.

Speaker 3 (12:57):
Yeah, and you point you'd list down one of your
character's top ten horror.

Speaker 6 (13:03):
Films is the murder character Actually.

Speaker 3 (13:06):
Yes, yeah, a mirror Brown's character does that time with
your own top ten number one lad two block the two.

Speaker 4 (13:15):
I mean I only put movies in there that I liked.
Let's put it that way. I only put movies in
the book that I like or that I felt like
didn't have some kind because you know, lots of there
are genuinely some quite like insidious or misogynistic horrors out there,
especially for a woman, especially for a woman of color.
So I tended to only reference movies that I liked
in the book period, but mayor brand specifically her choices.

Speaker 6 (13:39):
There are movies that I like.

Speaker 4 (13:40):
Attack the Block is truly like one of my favorite
films of all time, and literally working on a movie
that's we call it, we jokingly call it Attack the
croc It's called The Black Talons, which is about a
girl's netball team who have to fight crocodile monsters in
a Captain Cook themed housing tower, which is very like
Attack the Blox inspired.

Speaker 6 (13:59):
But you know, silence a little. I have a Silence of
the Lambs tatter.

Speaker 4 (14:02):
It's like one of my favorite movies Blade to all time,
all times, like can't be Denied, perfect film, one of
the great my daughter o joints.

Speaker 6 (14:09):
But for that specific character, her top ten was.

Speaker 4 (14:13):
I was trying to choose films that would say something
about her specifically and also trying to find a way
that hypothetically, like in the book, the host is trying
to get her audience to relate to this woman who's
passed away, to see her as more than just the
quote unquote dead girl, which is one of the classic
sort of horror movie tropes. So by her sharing the

(14:33):
things that this character loved who was tragically killed, she's
trying to create this like connective tissue, which I feel
pop culture can do so well in our lives. It's like,
you can feel super isolated and alone and that people
don't get you, and then somebody likes the same weird
movie as you, or you find somebody's really into you know,
Gialdo films or whatever it is, whatever your niche thing is.

(14:56):
Pop culture is such a great shortcut to friendship in
many ways, or great shortcut to connection.

Speaker 1 (15:03):
I mean, that's all G and I bonded. We're like
I like Deep Blue Sea, like I like Deep Blue See.
And then.

Speaker 4 (15:10):
Yeah, it's it's really fascinating because I like, I love
that there's a deeply cy podcast exists, but Deep Blue
See people are specific people, do you know, like there's
this it's really a specific group of people, like when
you meet someone there like I like Deeply C. And
I'm like, no, but I really like Deeply see, like
not even ironically, Like it's the best die hard but

(15:32):
wet movie ever made.

Speaker 6 (15:33):
Do you get it?

Speaker 4 (15:34):
Do you get what I'm saying, Like that whole sub
genre of you know, post die Hard, everybody was trying
to make a die hard butt. So Speed was die
hard on a bus, Cliffhanger was die hard on a mountain,
Deep Blue Sea was die hard but wet, and so
it just like adding all of these little like additions
to like a die hard but a die hard but
you know, And I always thought Deeply C was one

(15:56):
of the best examples of those die hard but movies
and that it's just a great like it's just an
extremely serviceable, great action horror movie. It has just the
most amazing devices with the structure of the lab slash
set up and the characters, and it's just like it
is if you break that thing down structurally of like

(16:18):
all the little pieces they thread in and where they
thread them in. Everything is so carefully and beautifully thought out.
And yeah, I'm always gonna have notes on like Digital Sharks.
It's like one of my pet Peeves, but like it
is what it is, you know, and it's always like
there's some things that are never going to age great,
which is like I feel like digital Blood never works
super well, digital Fire never works well. But there's just

(16:40):
some amazing stuff in this movie, especially like being on
the other side of it and making movies now, it's like,
how the hell did they do that? Like you can
never do that again, you know. I just like I
think of it would be Ready Harland. Do you know
it would be the exactly who has worked on Diehard stuff,
who has worked Cliffhanger, who has done the die Hard

(17:02):
with her. It's like, yeah, give it to the die
Hard with a guy you know, like he's the perfect
person for it. And it's just that you think about
trying to make a deep blue sea now and it
just it feels impossible because it probably would be.

Speaker 1 (17:15):
And I like what you're talking about too, because we're
to the scene we're talking about today. There's the sea
giant blood, there's a Seagi fire, but they built a
forty foot tall elevator just in a in a sound stage,
and even the setup is smart, Like I love that
the shark batters the door open, the water's rising and
then they have to you know, climb this elevator shaft
with fire above them, and Thomas Jane does get hit

(17:37):
by one of those on accident because that like fire
thing nails them, and I think he looks at the
special effects guy pretty pissed off, but like it's a
great setup, like, you know, the water's coming up, you know,
the sharks in it. It's like really easy to figure out.
You know, he's got to get that door open, which
causes more problems and also too we're talking about Deep
Blue Sea. With the writing of Hello, cool Jay. I
love when he saves the day at the end of

(17:58):
this when he opens up the door, or he doesn't
have a stupid one liner, like he's not like y'all
just have your little salute, Yeah you guys just hanging around,
or don't just sit there, Like I like this movie
has some restraint in it, which makes me happy because
he could have easily have said something dumb, but instead
they all look at him and they're happy, and like
then he's happy, and it's just a good, well played scene.

Speaker 4 (18:18):
It's a perfect moment because it comes after what I
feel personally is like in a movie full of horrible deaths.
It is getting bitten in the badge by a shark
is like all time, all time, like one of.

Speaker 6 (18:32):
The worst tests.

Speaker 4 (18:34):
And also specifically her because I, you know, shout out
to like we're gonna shout out and AUSSI shout out
to Jacqueline.

Speaker 6 (18:40):
It's just like, oh wait, I've never never met her.

Speaker 4 (18:43):
Have always wanted to meet her because I guarantee, like
there's one thing's Australians don't give it about.

Speaker 6 (18:48):
It would be Deep Lucy.

Speaker 4 (18:50):
And I've always wanted to meet her for whatever show
she's working on and be like yeah, yeah, like that's great.
Canngrat some of the awards or whatever? Can we talk
about Deep Lucy and how You're character has literally like
one of the funnest visual deaths but also one of
those horrible ones because you've just she's gone through the
absolute trauma and horror of watching you know, Chief Scars

(19:11):
Guard get absolutely like killed sixty times, six different times,
that poor man. Oh my god, it's the worst that
he has the worst death, but you know she has
in a way, her death is worse because she's seen
the most horrible thing happen and seen all these other
horrible things happen, and so for your death to come

(19:31):
at the end of that, it's worse.

Speaker 6 (19:33):
It's like quint right in Jaws.

Speaker 4 (19:35):
Part of the reason his death is so traumatic and
I think so scary, is because it's his greatest fear
because he's done the Indianapolis speech and you have all
this context for it, and it's this thing he's been
trying to stay afloat and stay away from and survived
his whole life and it comes to a head in
the worst possible way. And that's why in part I

(19:55):
think her death is so horrible, because it's like the
worst thing that for her compossible happen happens. And it's
just that like as she comes punches back up out
of the water and she's reaching for the art, that's
what happens.

Speaker 1 (20:09):
Yeah, that's why we.

Speaker 6 (20:10):
Go to the movies.

Speaker 4 (20:11):
You know, I've never seen a shark bider woman in
the vagina before.

Speaker 1 (20:14):
Like she's in that shark. She's in that shark like
it's not a yeah, she sat in that shark, raising
up in the air like good Olney does that.

Speaker 4 (20:23):
It's it's also that's in part I think why maybe
Deep Blue se when there are the digital sharks. That
it creaks for me a little bit more than other
movies is because the practical sharks I think work really
well in this.

Speaker 6 (20:35):
I'm always going to be a fan of something tactile.

Speaker 4 (20:38):
Yeah, And it just like, really those moments where it's
a physical shark are so good that when it switches
to a digital it really feels quite jarring, and you
always wish that. I'm just like, oh man, I just
wish they kept that. You know, you can't do it
for the things I wanted to do, but you do
sometimes just wish it was a physical shark the whole

(20:58):
way through.

Speaker 1 (20:59):
You know, the delete scene with her in it. There's
a deleted scene with she's pregnant. Yeah, she's pregnant. I'm
glad they cut that out because that would have been
spectacularly cruel. I think if they left that in.

Speaker 4 (21:14):
It's already a pretty cruel money to women because obviously,
like you know, the whole story with the Saffron Barrows,
and they did the you know, audience tests and everybody
hated her so much, and they're like another scene in
where she dies and it's like okay.

Speaker 6 (21:26):
Fit Like story wise.

Speaker 4 (21:28):
You can make a case for it because she's essentially
your doctor Frankenstein, right, so there needs to be some
kind of like karmic justice with nature blah blah blah.

Speaker 6 (21:38):
But at the.

Speaker 4 (21:38):
Same time, it is like incredibly like no woman makes
it out of this a lot, including the macro sharks
you know, sure, yeah, they're no the Og Girls, Og,
Charlie's Angels, those three, you know, they all get it
as well.

Speaker 1 (21:52):
They're just trying to get out of there. This is
kind of a prison break movie.

Speaker 4 (21:56):
They're just trying to be free. It's always men trying
to keep women in cages, and whether those are literal
women or giant like scientifically modified maker shark women, it's
like tomato tomato, you know there.

Speaker 1 (22:08):
I love that Mcallisher was too successful in this, Like
it's kind of like a oops moment where like we
tried to make them smart, but well we overshot that
and we created this, And I love woops moments in movies.
We're like, you made it, like we never thought this
would happen. This kind of makes me happy. But yeah,
I've never you know, with McAllister, I never she's the villain,

(22:31):
but she's not like a mustache twirling villain either.

Speaker 4 (22:36):
That I can understand her reasoning, right, Like the great villains,
you have to believe that they think they're the hero
and their story and well, geez, she wants to kull
the world of alzheimers.

Speaker 6 (22:45):
Like, give me a break.

Speaker 4 (22:46):
It is a pretty giant like she yeah, like you
can really justify her reasons.

Speaker 6 (22:51):
I'm like, yeah, okay, bitch, I get it.

Speaker 4 (22:53):
Like that's that's a really good reason. I've seen worse,
you know. It's like it makes perf truly make absolute
perfect sense to me, especially when you think of something
like the recent Jurassic Park movie, or really any movie
where it's like we meddled with a creature for x
y Z aims. It's like the og Jurassic Park. They
meddled with creatures to create a new music amusement park,

(23:15):
like hard sort of villain trajectory to really like reconcile with.
And you get into those later movies, it's like to
cure a disease of some nondescript origin and you're like, yeah,
that is a good thing. I guess question Mark, whereas Deepliss,
it was very clear it was like sharks equals this.
We make them bigger, we get this brain protein, we
cure alzheimers X amount of people well changed.

Speaker 6 (23:37):
I'm like, I get it, I fully get it.

Speaker 1 (23:39):
She didn't meet like I don't think they intended the
results to be that good. And then she's not like
a saying she doesn't become like a Carter Burke, like
she rolls with them the rest of the way. She helps,
like she's like she's not a hindrance to that. So yeah,
I never had.

Speaker 6 (23:54):
A good comparison. Yeah, she's no pole Resa, that's for sure.

Speaker 1 (23:58):
You want him to get got real bad. But yeah,
like we have people who are at that screening, that
press screening, and they said, yeah, people were just screaming feedback. Yeah,
and we're like no, like it's I don't know, but
I do think. You know, I was working in a
theater in ninety nine and no one really cheered when
she got killed. People just cheered for LL in that movie,

(24:19):
So like people no one knew Thomas Jane's name at
the time, but everyone's like, go LL go well, and
then like when Thomas James there, everyone's like, guy, like
come on. Everyone was So I guess maybe after reshoots,
like we got something here, because you know, LLL. He
is one of the greatest side quests ever in like
horror cinema. He lives, you can't kill him these three

(24:39):
and No. One horror movies, and and like I think
maybe they wanted to beef up his role a little bit. Yeah,
I don't know, Like No One, I never really had
it out against MCALLISR because it makes sense, I don't know.

Speaker 4 (24:51):
Just well, it's also really interesting they're like false kind
of pop cultural laws because people credit Deep Blue c
with being the first movie where a black character first
horror movie where black character survives to the well, and
also Ice cuban Anaconda, you know, like which is only
a few years earlier, and like is he plays like

(25:13):
a really significant role. It's not just like Ella cole
j is very much a supporting character and has quite
minimal interactions with cast until halfway even beyond really like
the final third of the movie, whereas Ice Cubes involved,
it's him and you know Jenny from the block out
there and just being a crete sorry yeah, exactly, exactly exactly.

(25:37):
So it's really interesting that it's like people love Ella
cole Gene. He has clearly such a specific screen presence
and magnetic screen presence that people really like they needed
him to survive this movie because otherwise that the death
toll is.

Speaker 6 (25:54):
Is super crazy.

Speaker 4 (25:55):
But it's also really fun because again, like all great
die Hard but a thing movies is, you know, an
amazing ensemble, and it's like, imagine, it feels like such
a fumble to have Peters Kaska, like, my god, besides
giving us eleven twelve foot Viking sons or whatever how
many kids eat, But he's like such a great actor

(26:15):
and you see him in it and you're like, oh,
he's gone all the way, you know. And then you
have Sam Jackson. You're like, oh, that person's gone all
the way. And then you have nondescript guy with a
goadie and you're like, well, he's going to be gone,
and he makes it so much further than you think.
And oh there's that lady from Sopranos. It's like all
these little pieces where they do such a good job
of sort of playing with those kind of slasher dynamics

(26:36):
where it's like you had these people are going to
get picked off one by one, and they do such
a great unexpected job of taking people out in places
that you don't necessarily expect.

Speaker 1 (26:47):
Oh man, that death is an old sam zag But
you know, I think I love Gym's more because, like
you said, he dies eight times in that scene, and
it's one of.

Speaker 2 (26:57):
Those chapters to die.

Speaker 4 (26:58):
Yeah, feels so truly feels so bad for him. I
think about that, Like, you know, sometimes you can't slate
anythink about horror movies and you're like, what would I Well,
maybe this is not what other people do, but I do.

Speaker 1 (27:09):
That with zombie movies all the time.

Speaker 4 (27:11):
Yeah, I'm like what would I do to get out
of this scenario? Or like how would I do X
Y Z thing? Blah blah blah. His is the death
I always think about. I'm like, oh, what would I
do in this? Like there's nothing you can do. That's
why it's so scary. It's like sailor me.

Speaker 1 (27:24):
Yeah, if you have a sixth sense of humor, you're like,
this has gone really far.

Speaker 3 (27:30):
At what point does he actually die?

Speaker 2 (27:32):
Because he's still he's still.

Speaker 3 (27:36):
Yeah, yeah when the phones in a couple of a
couple of weeks time.

Speaker 1 (27:43):
And I also feel bad for Jannis in this scene too,
because she's like like she has, like poor Jacqueline Mackenzie
has so much like expository dialogue to drop. I know,
just like they just handed it to her on set,
Like who do we got We can't have Carter doing it.
McAllister won't talk. We're not having Rappaport do it.

Speaker 3 (28:06):
You know, Jim her own death, did she have like
continued explaining Cutter, I'm in the water. The water.

Speaker 4 (28:16):
This is also like this is genuinely again while like
I really love her and I really love her performance,
and I think it's such an underappreciated and thankless role.
Is like she's got so much, Like she has to
sell the brilliance of Scars guard who first time you
meet him is literally pissing in the wind.

Speaker 6 (28:33):
She has to sell their love story.

Speaker 4 (28:35):
She has to sell the righteous indignation of that you
tampaed with this, you stupid bitch, Like she has to
do so much of the selling of the film, And
I maybe I think that's why, like when we first
chatted about like what scene do you want to do?
I was like her death because she was genuinely like
one of the most interesting characters I think, And it's
not necessarily like a Veronica and like alien type thing

(28:58):
where she's like, wow, that It's great, isn't it. You know,
like you can really you can really understand her panic
because she's done a lot to show us, like emotionally
and intellectually, why she's such an important character. So when
she does get got, it's, man, you really feel it.
I really felt it.

Speaker 3 (29:16):
She's dealing with the loss of her partner, but also
that her partner has been lying to her. He's been
doing with this experimenting on sharks and she doesn't know,
and now it's probably gonna kill her and he's dead,
and she like when when she says, cause Susan a
stupid bitch, does she then like, oh no, wait, that
means that Jim is also a damn and he's Yeah.

Speaker 2 (29:35):
It's just so much she's going through, goes through. Yeah,
the movie's great. It's a rough one.

Speaker 4 (29:43):
It's such a good movie. But also the macro sharks.
I think as like, I'm a surfer, I've spent my
whole life in and around aquatic environments where sharks are.
When I was a reporter, I covered multiple sharks shark attacks,
both fatal and non fatal, and I've all loved shark
movies like Jaws was the first movie I ever saw

(30:04):
back when I lived in rural New Zealand and I've
never even seen the beach, but it was so Maco
sharks are such an interesting shark to use, and I
think it was like such a nice visual point of different.
You know, you actually love the tiger sharks stuff in
there too, because I think tiger sharks are like visually
great in the same way that everybody wants to do

(30:25):
a movie with a hammerhead, but hammerheads their mouth is
too small, so it's actually not a compelling and tagines
is when the little like cute weirdo can't get its
mouth open all the way or like, oh, a bonnet
shark would be cool. They're vegetarians, Okay, so that doesn't work.
So a thrasher would be sick because they've got the point.
You know, you start doing all this like math of
like what kind of shark you could use, and maco sharks,

(30:46):
you know, inherently not really a super violent shark, like
they're not known for they're not predominantly like when you
look at the attack registers, it's like great White tiger Ball,
you know, maker a quite low down on the list.
When you start getting to human shark encounters, but visually
they make for such an interesting point of difference compared
to most of the shark movies you've had up until

(31:08):
this point.

Speaker 1 (31:10):
Yeah, and Kanti's work is great in this. I was
watching this what marine biologist watches shark movies, and there's
a lot of commentary about it. But then when this
shark popped up during the testing scene, the person was like,
that looks great. Oh my gosh, I got the teeth right,
and I don't think I've ever been had. That made
my day because I went, yes, the thing.

Speaker 4 (31:29):
It's the teeth and the snout is so specific in
a mako shark, like it's really clear, and you know,
just when you're watching other shark movies, I'm always looking
at that because there's such a I think, a desire,
like a real real temptation from a design perspective to
just start merging different elements of sharks to create whatever

(31:51):
works better visually.

Speaker 6 (31:52):
It's why you get a lot of great white sharks and.

Speaker 4 (31:54):
Movies that look nothing like a great white shark from
the front right or a size wise or body don't
necessarily make sense. And the mako looks so much, so
much like a mako shark. Even the color like making
them they're almost like bluish black at some point, you know,
which isn't necessarily super accurate, but they do look distinctly different.

(32:15):
Their their skin is distinctly different from other shark species.
So when you have the scene with the tiger and
you've like you've made a point to show you all
these different species of sharks, then when you see the
mako visually as an audience, you're training to be like,
that's different from these other sharks that have been shown,
And I think that's that's really cool, that's good storytelling.

Speaker 1 (32:34):
Do you so they fed sharks a tiger shark. Is
that sustained? Like remember in Jurassic World they're feeding great
whites to the mosasaurus. That's gonna be kind of tough, right,
that's not a sustainable method, Am I wrong?

Speaker 4 (32:48):
It does? Like most I do, I say most sharks,
but it's mainly bull sharks that are the most like
cannibalistic of species. Because bull sharks, as I'm sure shuys don't.
I don't know how much you know, they swim up river, right, Okay,
So bull sharks can have essentially like evolved to be
able to navigate and survive in fresh and saltwater. And
so female bull sharks, when they get pregnant, they swim

(33:11):
up river or upper canal or an stue system and
give birth to their pups. The gestation is like between
ten and twelve months, so if you've been pregnant.

Speaker 6 (33:19):
For like nearly a year, you would be pissed.

Speaker 4 (33:21):
And so they give birth to these pups and then
the pups have to like bang it further up river
or away from their mother because the mum will eat them.
And so they are cannibalistic species. And that's not to
say that most sharks aren't sharks all. Pretty much, especially
tiger sharks will eat anything. And tiger sharks, my favorite

(33:43):
fact about them is that they're bullimic. So they have
a thirty day digestion cycle, and so if they eat,
they eat something and they see something that they like
better that actually, you know what, that looks tastier.

Speaker 5 (33:55):
Fuck.

Speaker 4 (33:55):
I've got no room in my stomach though, because I've
got this thirty dight digestions, So they will vomit it
up eat the better thing. So that's why you always find,
like Injaws, when they cut open that tiger shark and
it's got like a number plate in this and that.
It's like a really you know, Peter Benchley was a
shark guy, so it's like a nice little like reference
to his knowledge. But that is so, you know, with

(34:16):
the macro sharks being as big as they are, sharks
generally speaking, like a larger shark will eat anything. So
if you come across a smaller shark and it's hungry,
it will eat it, like totally doesn't give it's any
predators a predator. Any predator will seek out prey regardless
of what it is, but generally speaking it's like not
their preferred meal. But as a way to show the

(34:38):
audience how vicious these things are and how we should
again training the audience thinks they should be afraid of
what they should look out for.

Speaker 6 (34:45):
Having the Charlie's Angels maco.

Speaker 4 (34:47):
Sharks eat a tiger shark is like a cool way
to be like, these guys are tough. We spend this
opening setting up how scary this tiger shark is, and
then here's a scary thing getting torn apart by something else.
It's like it's the classic like velociraptor, tr reenosaurance Rex,
drassic Park thing is like these things are so scary,

(35:08):
but then we introduce this other thing which like then
immediately like depowers or repowers based on what the scale
is of the monsters that you've created.

Speaker 1 (35:18):
I know this goes into horror movies and another thing.
But it's like in Star Trek how warf always got
beat up, Like.

Speaker 4 (35:22):
Yeah, Fast and Furious mechanics.

Speaker 6 (35:28):
It's like there's a yes, okay.

Speaker 4 (35:29):
It is like the Rock and Vin Diesel having like
a pissing contest. But the same time it is like
there is they negotiate who wins a fight and where
and how for a reason, right, because you're trying to
establish who's the most powerful and this hashtag family dynamic
that you need to have like each person on a
certain run, this person can do X y Z level
of thing, and this person's less powerful and so on

(35:52):
and so forth.

Speaker 1 (35:53):
Yeah, oh man, it makes me happy.

Speaker 3 (35:56):
You're seeing the Phostopheious franchise and the Jurassic Park franchise.
You're you're making great headway with both me and momk
your head off our favorite franchises.

Speaker 4 (36:05):
And my Fast and Furious Universal movie Monsters number one franchise,
Full time Back, close second for me is fast and furious.
I feel like it all comes back to fast. I
love it if you try hard enough.

Speaker 1 (36:15):
I've had so much faster. I got hired. I don't
know if you know Film Theory with Matt pat Yeah, yeah,
yeah yeah. I wrote for them for a while, a
well a few years, four years and uh I wrote
one of his final ten episodes. He asked me to
do it and I had to count all the Co
two emissions in the Fast and Furious world and so.
But but before I'd done all, I figure out Fast
and Furior six was the most fast and Furious. Then

(36:37):
I had to do another assignment for fandom where I'd
like analyze every frame of it and then like rotten
to it. So I've like spent I know almost every
frame of that franchise. But I almost went and singing
counting all the CO two emissions in the But I
did it and it was awesome, right.

Speaker 4 (36:50):
I know, this is like a deep like so sorry
to put like take a hard swerve off top three
Fast Inferiors movies.

Speaker 1 (36:57):
Oh so too Fast, Tokyo Drift and six six because
I think six has the best action set pieces, but
two and three are it for me that rhymes. And
then six but two right at the end, they make
a huge jump and then they're so injured they can't

(37:19):
get out of their boat their car, so Evelia has
to kill cool Houser or knock them out. Like I
love that, Like they're like, we got to make this
jump and then they're too injured to get out of
their car. Like it makes me so happy. And also
I grew up in Florida, and it's it's very Florida.
It's a movie where you're like, this is Florida. And
I appreciated that. So yeah, two, three and six, what
are yours?

Speaker 4 (37:41):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (37:41):
Next, this is it's not I've seen them move, but
I've seen a lot of them only want so this
isn't my friend. I'm sorry, but I put five the
best because I'm just populous everyone does it rocks? Yeah,
And then I really like seven. Stathan's my guy side
of Stathan, and I just love the scene in eight
would stay them on the plane with the baby five seven, eight,

(38:06):
but great where kids four getst a lot of hate.

Speaker 2 (38:09):
I do really like four.

Speaker 4 (38:11):
Fours four is really good. And this the thing I
love about that franchise is you can see all the
pieces of them figuring things out, so like, I think
five is the best Fast and Furious, but my favorite
is two right, so too Fast, Too Furious, But there's
something with like John Singleton is such an incredible director
and the way he's adding pieces to that film that

(38:33):
become inherently part of the iconography of First infuri.

Speaker 6 (38:39):
Right Suki Like even though.

Speaker 4 (38:42):
Having this idea of like the things that Fast and
Furious like offered in terms of female characters into verse
who my characters are so exciting, But then Fast and
Furious for three like Tokyo Drift, which many people consider
the worst one, is so interesting because it also adds
things to the franchise.

Speaker 6 (38:59):
That become inherently part of it forever. And like, what's the.

Speaker 4 (39:03):
Most famous audio from the Fast and Furious franchise is
like when You're see in Turkey plus the Few Eus,
Like it's that Tariarchy Boys song, which is still memed
to this day. So I would go from my personal
order not best, my personal favorite, it's two five and
probably either Fate of the Furious. I think Fast eight

(39:25):
is again really underrated, and I also love toubson Shore.
I've really loved, really loved it and like on Polynesian
So getting to see one hundred million dollar plus movie
set and filmed in Samoa was huge and like salmon
and culture be such a big part of it was
really fascinating.

Speaker 6 (39:44):
But yeah, anyway, sorry hard pivot off.

Speaker 3 (39:47):
We're going to get you in touch with the hosts
of the Too Fast, Too Forever podcast. They've been on
hair Marks on there a bunch of times. They're just
going through the films again and again and again and
again forever. They're on Lap fifteen at the moment of going,
oh my god, they would love to have you on.

Speaker 2 (40:02):
So we'll put you guys into it.

Speaker 1 (40:04):
Like, uh, let's see, I moved to I got a
job in Tokyo because of Tokyo Drift, but then it
canceled four days before I left, and I ended up
getting a job in South Korea. But then also, uh,
like the day of my wedding, No, the day before
my wedding, I got called and they're like, Mark, we
need you on Furious seven. I'm like, well, I can't,
and so.

Speaker 4 (40:23):
I'd be like, honey, I love you, but I love this.

Speaker 2 (40:28):
I still get married, but then I gotta go.

Speaker 6 (40:31):
I just went.

Speaker 1 (40:33):
I was like, I love to you, but I can't so,
but yeah, I almost got on seven and So because
I moved to Atlanta just as five was wrapping, and then
six I was working on I think one of the
Hunger Games or something when six was filming, so I
didn't get a chance to work on that. And then
seven came back, and then I missed that. I never
got a chance to shoot on those when they were
in Atlanta. But I would have loved to have, like
my brother and I want to be in one of

(40:54):
those party scenes.

Speaker 4 (40:55):
Oh that was my dream. Okay, anti feminist to say,
but my dream was to be one of the faceless asses.
I was like, I've got a great ass, why couldn't
it be me, Like you never need to see my face,
just like put have my ass, be one in the crowd,
Like that is the dream, to be honest, just to
be one of the mini cheeks in like just a

(41:16):
huge crowd of people as some like bizarre song from
Fat Joe or whoever is playing. That's like that's all
I want. That's perfect, That's a dream.

Speaker 2 (41:24):
You know.

Speaker 4 (41:24):
He didn't want to play a cadaver in Laura and Order.
I just want to be an ass and a face
in purists.

Speaker 1 (41:31):
That's a dollar shot goes by, you know, like that's
like the setup that they have for it.

Speaker 2 (41:37):
And was speaking of asses.

Speaker 3 (41:39):
In this chapter, we get a prime view of Carter's
ass when he's when he's lying on the ladder about
three minutes and after Janie has perished, he's like lying
face down. The camera is right behind about to give
him a colonoscopy. And I don't think it's a great
Like he's the bonnest Thomas Jane looks fantastic in this.
The wet suit is doing him no favors.

Speaker 4 (42:01):
I think, Well, it's the thing with wet suits and asses,
I will say, is like it really, I honestly feel
like this caters to maybe thirty percent of the audience
who tune in and watch the WSL the World Surfing
League Live. Is like, men's asses look great in wetsuits.
Like that's just the truth. Like it's the thing that
bikinis do for women. Men get done to them with wetsuits,

(42:23):
and so it is one of those things where I'm like,
I just think they're in the wrong wetsuit. You know,
they're in a like a like a you know, a
scuba diving wetsuit. We get him in a good RIPKL
suit and he's looking like, you know, beefed and caked
up in a way that would be really have endured
through the franchise.

Speaker 1 (42:40):
I was reading a review just to do a little
research again, just reviews I haven't read before and variety,
so that Jane emerges best of all with the fewest
lines and surfaces, are the genuine new action star of
vincing an ideal blend of brawn and charisma. That's the
one line I found.

Speaker 3 (42:55):
From this, that's intest lines. He has so many lights.
He has they say in the film. They say in
the film he asks no questions and he just may
kind of grun does so much Dinald and all he
does is ask questions all the time.

Speaker 4 (43:08):
I was just about to say he's continually asking questions.

Speaker 6 (43:12):
He's like, can I get you a drink? Can we talk?
What can like?

Speaker 4 (43:16):
What did these things you do?

Speaker 6 (43:17):
Where are we going?

Speaker 4 (43:18):
Like? How did you survive this thing on the mound?
I think he's really good in this. I think he's
really really good in this, and I think it's such
a hard thing.

Speaker 6 (43:26):
To be good at.

Speaker 4 (43:27):
Is that sort of like he's got to be hot
but stoic, but like a driver of plot. And he's
sort of this, like the common phrase was like a
Mary Jane, like a character that is good at everything.
And he's sort of that guy in the context of this.
And it's really hard to make a character like that
quite interesting, especially him also being the like the comp

(43:49):
for the working man. It's like you have all these
like Okay, Ivy League, Eh Smiley, mixed signist pants and stuff.

Speaker 6 (43:55):
He's supposed to be like the former Krim.

Speaker 4 (43:57):
He's just trying to get by, keep his head down
and blah blah blah. And it is really interesting that
the two surviving characters are your quote unquote like working
class characters, whereas all of the intellectuals end up intellectuals
and billionaires end up dying. Horror collection of horrible deaths.

Speaker 1 (44:15):
Yeah, it's what preacher and h him alive at the end.

Speaker 7 (44:20):
Yeah, sorry, Brenda is Brenda a secret doctor or secret
billionaire that we just don't know about She she dies as.

Speaker 1 (44:30):
Well, independently wealthy and we just don't know about it.

Speaker 6 (44:34):
Yeah, she had stocks.

Speaker 1 (44:36):
So this is really random, But I want to get
this other way. So I was listening to the Graveyard Shift,
and there were some questions and you could win you know,
prize packs like the Jordan Peel Triple Pack stuff like that.
So I have five questions.

Speaker 4 (44:47):
That was originally a Jordan Peel double bill and then
he put out another movie in between the editing and
I was current.

Speaker 1 (44:56):
Yeah, okay, I got five questions.

Speaker 3 (44:58):
If you get if you get these right, will send
you a deeply oh my god.

Speaker 6 (45:02):
My dream.

Speaker 1 (45:03):
Okay, okay, Lo, this is We'll just send it to
you anyway.

Speaker 4 (45:07):
God amazing, Okay, send me that.

Speaker 6 (45:10):
That's incredible.

Speaker 4 (45:11):
I will slip that my my six wax mister Zog
sticker on the back is going off.

Speaker 6 (45:15):
That's amazing.

Speaker 1 (45:18):
Even if you'll you'll get one of these rights. So
that's good.

Speaker 6 (45:20):
That's okay.

Speaker 1 (45:21):
So in nineteen ninety nine, Llo cool j appeared in
three films, Deep Blucy, where he plays a caled Preacher,
a guy called Preacher Any Given Sunday where he plays
for the Sharks, and an Into Deep he plays a
character called God. So I love that. I just love
I say that every episode because I love it. But
which which film soundtrack doesn't feature a song from l O.

Speaker 2 (45:43):
Cool Jay.

Speaker 6 (45:45):
I feel like it's any given Sunday.

Speaker 1 (45:48):
Is that your final answer?

Speaker 6 (45:49):
Yeah, let's go with it.

Speaker 1 (45:50):
It Yeah, yeah, it's it's into deep. He has a
song called shut Him Down from Any Given Sunday, which
you should listen to. He sings really fast.

Speaker 6 (46:00):
I was like, I feel because I no disrespect.

Speaker 4 (46:02):
I hate any given Sunday so much as I film,
but it does feel like the most logical place you
would put an ellcal j song. So I was like,
let's not go with logic, you know, let's go with
something else.

Speaker 1 (46:13):
Gosh, I started off rof here. Okay, I have another
really weird one for you. But I'm a huge fan
of jet ski action scenes in cinema.

Speaker 6 (46:21):
Okay, it's your too fast, too piace.

Speaker 1 (46:23):
Like only one movie features like the trifecta of like awesome,
no two, So if water World in The Mermaid they
feature jet ski action scenes, sea creatures and catapults, like
that's my scale of greatness only triple okay, which Shark
film doesn't feature a jet ski, so doesn't doesn't feature

(46:46):
so it doesn't have to be an action scene, it
just has to be a jet ski. So Bait, which
I was filmed on the Gold coast, right.

Speaker 4 (46:52):
I'm I'm like, this is going to blow your minds,
but I'm sitting in the car park where the tsunami hits,
so like yeah, yeah, yeah, so anyway, sorry, so just
it's just separate zepbub Like I couldn't be in more
bait territory where the tsunami hits and the wave washes
into the supermarket.

Speaker 6 (47:09):
That supermarket is literally like just off camera.

Speaker 3 (47:12):
If you're recording in this in the car park underneath
the supermarket, maybe slightly more bait. That's as close you
can get.

Speaker 6 (47:19):
Ironically, it doesn't have a car park underneath. It just
the supermarket.

Speaker 4 (47:23):
It's but you know that was a build obviously for
the film, but that actual supermarket doesn't have a car
park underneath, but separate it has one up But anyway, sorry,
off to make okay doesn't feature Jetski.

Speaker 1 (47:33):
Sharnie Vincent is really good in Your Next, by the way,
and she's in Beat.

Speaker 4 (47:37):
She's also blue cush too, which is and step up
three like I got a lot of times Shindy Vincent.
I think she's I think she's really like quite like
commanding leading lady.

Speaker 1 (47:48):
I think Your Next rules Aaron's Aaron's Great Kitchen Flake
okay by Base, Shark Knight three D Okay, Meg to
the Trench, Sure, yeah, Shark Bait, Ghost.

Speaker 4 (48:04):
Shark, I Ghost Shark has Christy Swanson in it? Does
it not?

Speaker 6 (48:11):
Or is that swamp Shark?

Speaker 4 (48:12):
I think that Damn I'm always confusing those three?

Speaker 2 (48:18):
Is anyone big in it?

Speaker 1 (48:19):
Megalodon, Shark Attack three, Megalodon with one of the greatest
lines ever, and then random lines ever and then the
Black Demon. So which one of all those does not
feature a jet ski?

Speaker 5 (48:31):
Well?

Speaker 4 (48:31):
I can This is tricky because I can only go
off the ones of sane. Black Demon has a jets ski.
Bait has a jet ski at the start when they're
doing the shark attack scene. So what was there was
one in between? Can you just go through them again?

Speaker 2 (48:45):
Sorry?

Speaker 1 (48:45):
Bait three D? No, not sho meg too. The trend
shark bait is It's hard to explain because if.

Speaker 4 (48:55):
You just I haven't seen that, so that might be
it for me. So yep, keep going. I'm gonna go
with one of the ones I haven't seen, go.

Speaker 1 (49:00):
Shark Shark Attack three, Megalodon or the Black Demon.

Speaker 6 (49:05):
I'll go with shark Bite.

Speaker 1 (49:07):
That's like those take place on jet skis.

Speaker 4 (49:11):
Supposed to know that Jesus Christ, it was really.

Speaker 2 (49:17):
Cooled jet ski.

Speaker 1 (49:18):
Yeah, yeah, black human, I've seen Black Demon.

Speaker 4 (49:22):
I swear. Don't they take a jet ski out to
the oil rig where the shark's.

Speaker 1 (49:25):
Attacking little boots?

Speaker 4 (49:27):
Oh okay, well okay, I'm killing you here. It's been
tough for me. It's going tough for me. Yeah, really tough.

Speaker 1 (49:32):
Which Jaws? Okay, So in which Jaws film has the
highest kill count? Jaws, Jaws, Jaws two, Jaws three, or
Jaws Revenge.

Speaker 4 (49:42):
I feel like it's one of the latest sick Well, okay,
so this is true. Okay, So we are we defining
kill cat by animals?

Speaker 1 (49:51):
So the shark it has to be a kill from
the shark, and it could be animal or human.

Speaker 4 (49:55):
Okay, because I was like, if you go kill cat,
you're say the first one, because any he talks about
the Indianapolis, So like, would you say that was part
of my on screen?

Speaker 1 (50:05):
If you see it dead, if that makes it like
if you see a floating head later, you know it
was probably from the shark. Or if you see a
dead uh killer whale, you know I'm.

Speaker 4 (50:14):
Going to say I'm gonna say one of the later
franchises because they were panicking and whenever they didn't know
how to end and act, they kept adding like deaths
or just like a random like, ah, this thing blew
up and there's six people or whatever. And also I
will have to say, I was listening to your Jaws
Kill draft and you guys had Quin's death, Like that

(50:34):
should have been the first one to go for the
reasons I was previously discussed. But Jaws two is such
an interesting movie because I was obsessed with it growing up.
I remember loving it so much cute because it was
it's the kids, it's the teens. It's like blah blah blah.
And I went and rewatched it recently and I was like, oh,
this is not good, like genuinely like it is. I

(50:55):
always has a place in my heart. And I have
a bunch of Jaws two collector cards that I bought
animally from like a toy collector on Instagram that I
was like, I'll change these forever. But Jos too is
not good. I'm just gonna say Jews three. I had
no idea, but I'm going Jews three.

Speaker 1 (51:11):
You're gonna kill me two?

Speaker 4 (51:13):
Shut up?

Speaker 1 (51:15):
Yeah, because like the lady in the beginning on the
thing that the divers in the beginning, the kids a
lot of kills and the helicopter only has four.

Speaker 4 (51:25):
Yeah, does it really woll okay, yeah, there we go.
All right, that stick is looking worse and worse for me.

Speaker 1 (51:30):
Still you got this? So in Deep Blue sy Doctor
Susan McAllister, you just mako sharks's test subjects and Deep
Blue cy too carled around uses what species of sharks
test subjects?

Speaker 6 (51:39):
I haven't seen it. I didn't want to.

Speaker 4 (51:40):
I never wanted to tarnish the treasure of Yeah. No,
I've never seen any of the sequences.

Speaker 2 (51:45):
I guess it's kind of you have mentioned.

Speaker 3 (51:47):
You've mentioned the kind of shock head shark, A different one,
an angrier one.

Speaker 6 (51:53):
Oh bull sharks.

Speaker 4 (51:54):
Yes, it's compelling. That's interesting.

Speaker 2 (51:58):
Okay, but because it's the most agressive one.

Speaker 4 (52:01):
Yeah, and yeah, that's makes sense.

Speaker 3 (52:05):
Two is a lot of fun. It's it's kind of
the same story as DeepC one, but with uh cold around.
He's like making sharks more intelligent so that he can
get a serum to make himself smarter so he can
survive the robot pocket.

Speaker 2 (52:21):
It's bug nuts.

Speaker 4 (52:24):
You guys ride for Deep Blue Sea three, Right, You're yeah, Okay, No,
I I honestly like I've been really intentional to try
and not watch them because I just, I honestly love
Deep Blue Sea one so much, and so I just
I never I never did it. And then I was
had been listening to like different episodes of the show,
and you guys mentioned Deep Blue Sea three, which should

(52:46):
have been called Deep Blue three quite a bit, and I.

Speaker 6 (52:51):
Was like, do I do it? That's so interesting that
it's bullshaks.

Speaker 4 (52:54):
Now I might watch because I loved Fear Below and
that was I thought, such a good mechanism of that movie,
was it being one singular shark and it being a
bull shark and it being in a river, and like
it had a really good like plot mechanic for the
reasons why the people were in the scenario and why
they had to keep getting back in the water. Because

(53:15):
that's always the thing with shark movies is you have
the problem is you have this hard line between safety
and danger. So you know, obviously safety is land and
water is danger. So trying to find ways where you
can merge the two of them together is the thing
that's always tricky. With a shark movie Deep Blue see
perfect example, because they merge them together, so they put
the danger and the safety in the same environment. So

(53:37):
it's like, okay, brilliant, perfect. At the end of Jaws,
they're putting them out on the orca and the orca sinky. Yep,
you get the same vibe jewels too. They're all strapping
the boats together. But that is such a tricky thing
with shark movies is trying to come up with a
conceit as to why you would constantly be in the
shark's environment and why characters would constantly be in peril.

Speaker 3 (53:59):
They just say, oh, saying we're stuck in the water
and there's sharks around this point.

Speaker 4 (54:04):
Yeah, what that I always consider like survivalist shark movies,
I think are a subgenre into themselves. So like your reefs,
your open waters, your reef two? No, is it reef two?
Storks yet? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (54:16):
Two storks?

Speaker 4 (54:17):
Yeah, but even like Open Waters one through three, but
just so crazy when you think about the horrible true
story that's based on and they're like, hell.

Speaker 1 (54:27):
Yeah, let's get easy, yeah, trauma, yeah.

Speaker 6 (54:31):
Open water three, cage dive, let's fucking go.

Speaker 4 (54:34):
But it is so interesting because in those they usually
do have to be based off a true story because
you need some reason. Shallows is also like an example
too of like what's a how do we find a
scenario where we can put somebody in the shark's environment
for the duration of really can't exceed ninety minutes because

(54:55):
you don't have as much length on that rope before
you just lose.

Speaker 1 (54:59):
The tension you And this is my last question for it.

Speaker 6 (55:02):
Yes, let me. I'm only a chance to get one.

Speaker 4 (55:05):
Honestly, why they get this.

Speaker 6 (55:07):
Check on the podcast?

Speaker 4 (55:08):
She knows nothing.

Speaker 1 (55:09):
It's like, I'm kicking myself here. But I thought that
was like the a fun question.

Speaker 4 (55:13):
No, they are really fun questions. They're just I know nothing.

Speaker 6 (55:16):
Apparently.

Speaker 1 (55:16):
I always think like very left of center, so I
think when I think something's normal, it's just chaos. So
uh yeah, all right. So on a scale from one
to ten, this is subjective, but it's very important. On
a scale from one to ten, how much of a
jerk is a shark?

Speaker 2 (55:29):
From the Shallows?

Speaker 4 (55:31):
Oh okay, good, well, okay, so ten being most jerk
and white being least jerk. Yeah, yeah, and it is
a great white shark from memory in the shallows, isn't
it Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (55:43):
Okay, and it has a whale folding buy and it's like.

Speaker 6 (55:45):
Yes, okay.

Speaker 4 (55:47):
So this is I feel like a subject I'm quite
qualified to discuss because we have where I live in Australia,
in the southeast Queensland, we have a problem.

Speaker 6 (55:58):
I don't want to say it's a problem.

Speaker 4 (56:00):
Shark attacks happen, you know, I don't say fairly regular here,
but it's a very populated shark population here. They're always
around your seem all the time, but particularly around areas
like Ballana, which is like a juvenile breeding ground for
great white sharks.

Speaker 6 (56:15):
And when we have more and we have lots.

Speaker 4 (56:18):
Of canals and seaways and river mouth, so you have
a big bull shark population and great whites. And part
of the reason that you have increased shark activity in
this area at certain times of the year is because
we are humpback whale migration sort of pathway, and so
you will get sharks, particularly juvenile great white sharks, following

(56:42):
the whale migration, waiting for ideally a whale to get
sick or for somebody to break from the herd and
then they can attack them and blah blah, blah, and
lots of whales as part of this will wash up
on the beach and get beached or diet or get
trapped in shark nets. Shark nets, as I'm sure you
know uppler cebos, they don't actually work, and they just

(57:03):
like track different bits of marine life. And so there
was this thing where they were burying whale carcasses in
the sand dunes at certain beaches quite high up. But
because there had been different storms and cyclones and tidal movements,
there had been shark attacks sort of along that stretch
of coast, and people had theorized that it was because

(57:23):
the buried whale carcasses were attracting the sharks, which ended
up kind of being just proven in like four out
of the five cases. And then in one of the
cases they buried the whale too close to the water
and that did attract sharks. So all that to say,
I feel like if ten is most jerk and one
is least jerk, I feel like the shark from the
shallows is probably an h like closer to a ten

(57:46):
because great white sharks they only eat every two weeks,
so once they get a meal, they're like selav babes
off we go, they have a whole whale carcass to
try exactly. They're not vomiting it in perpetuity. They have
they get as much and like a whale.

Speaker 6 (58:05):
Blubber is like.

Speaker 4 (58:06):
They're like like that's their cheeseburger of their dreams, right,
So they have the maximum amount of food they could
get and they still eat the drunken guy who goes
out to get the camera or the surfboard, and it's
the other two surfers. It's still going for her, and
there's somebody else who gets eaten in between there. I
feel as well, the two guys at the start, like

(58:29):
at the very very start, so I think it hasn't
it is a higher deathcount than Bloody draws for so
it's all of those people and it has a whale
still going. So at that point it's like it's there
out of spite rather than longer. So yeah, But at
the same time, I'm always on the shark side in
a way because it is they are in its environment,

(58:50):
you know. So I can't give it a full ten,
but it is definitely like it is so full and
doesn't want to eat anymore, and yet and yet and
yet and yet.

Speaker 6 (58:59):
So definitely, like it's a personal by this point, you know, I.

Speaker 1 (59:03):
Want to get this lady like but real.

Speaker 4 (59:06):
Yeah, I really like I understand him by that point.

Speaker 1 (59:09):
Well, you did it, We'll get you the sticker. I
might just send your bonus. Fine. Yeah, yeah, that was
a good answer right there.

Speaker 6 (59:16):
Anyeah.

Speaker 4 (59:16):
I worked in some real history stuff as well. Really
earned that sticker.

Speaker 1 (59:19):
You know what, though, you can leave this episode and
be like I learned some things today.

Speaker 6 (59:22):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (59:23):
Yeah, I learned some stuff about whales and where they're
buried in Australia that I didn't want to know.

Speaker 1 (59:27):
That was awesome. No, it makes it. That's something i'd
want to research, like why are they here? What's around it?

Speaker 4 (59:32):
There's a TV series, like a documentary TV series where
they're trying to make it like sharks, as I called
Shark three sixty and it's a bunch of like shark
researchers talking about different cases and blah blah blah, and
they do it like let's go to the computer and
the computer's like, well I calculated sharks blah blah blah.

Speaker 6 (59:50):
And it's there's parts of it that.

Speaker 4 (59:52):
Are like really daggy and you know, kind of technologically
like odd. But the very first episode of Shark three sixty,
which is on if you have a stream services, it's
on Disney Plus, is about specifically the burying whale carcasses
and whether that attracts sharks or not. So if there's
ever a thing that you've wanted to know about, if
I do xyz thing, will I be attacked by a shark?

Speaker 6 (01:00:14):
That is the series to watch.

Speaker 4 (01:00:16):
And also while I'm here, I just want to say
that shark deterrence don't work. If you're ever buying some
braceletter or a band doesn't deter sharks. It is a
place ebo. It does not work.

Speaker 1 (01:00:28):
I've learned that what mosquitoes, most of those things don't work,
So I doubt a bracelet's going to work on a shark,
you know what I mean?

Speaker 4 (01:00:34):
Like size wise, literally buying a magnet from your hardware
store for three bucks and strapping it to your ankle
would just be as effective, which is to say, not
effective at all, because it's just like sharks don't work
through magnets.

Speaker 6 (01:00:48):
It's actually ridiculous.

Speaker 4 (01:00:49):
Like essentially, if you were going to create a deterrent
of some kind, it's essentially you would need to be
playing you need to zero dark thirty the shark, which
is to say, water board them, which is like turn
up a version of heavy metal music to essentially affect
their electronic sensory sets. It's e SS whatever that stands

(01:01:10):
for electronic sensory something else, and that is the thing
that would like repel them as opposed to a magnetic field.

Speaker 6 (01:01:17):
Is not work contracts.

Speaker 4 (01:01:18):
But there's also a lot of interesting research that they're
doing about essentially putting strips of lights on the base
of surfboards because sharks c and contrast, so obviously like
which is the same, not quite black and white, but
as close to black and white as you can get.
So if you're coming from the depths up and a
surfer or like a surfboard is essentially then like backlit,

(01:01:40):
that is a contrast to the light above.

Speaker 6 (01:01:43):
So that's the target that you go for.

Speaker 4 (01:01:45):
And so by having the strips of lights essentially like
breaking up what they can perceive in a way that's
really fascinating. So that will be really interesting to see.
And also jewelry. They'll go for anything magnetic or shiny,
So I don't know, maybe don't go surfing with a
bunch of hoop ear rings. I I guess, I don't know,
I say with a nose ring. I'm not serving face forward.

Speaker 1 (01:02:05):
So you know, get the Devil's Candy soundtrack.

Speaker 4 (01:02:08):
Blare it board, all time, all time, great reference.

Speaker 6 (01:02:13):
And also Sean did a shark movie. Yeah, very good.

Speaker 1 (01:02:18):
You're talking about Makos and I just want to say,
Cheetahs of the Sea. That made me really happy.

Speaker 4 (01:02:22):
Man Cheaters of the Sea, but that was actually dangerous.
Animals is also filmed on the Gold Coast, which is
where I am at the moment, in the same place
as Bait and yeah, and Shark's Paradise.

Speaker 6 (01:02:36):
You guys have got to do that one next. Sharks Paradise,
So it's terrible.

Speaker 4 (01:02:42):
It's from nineteen eighty six and Australia wanted to do
a Miami Vice spin off and so they did this
TV movie called Shark's Paradise set on the Gold Coast,
where a madman tries to hold the city hostage by
threatening shark attacks and essentially like staging shark attacks. Now
there are quite few shark attacks for a film that

(01:03:05):
is called Shark's Paradise and supposed to be based around
various shark attacks, but it is very funny and interesting
in lots of ways because they are very clearly trying
to make Miami vice, so it has all of that
sort of very specific lighting, and the Gold Coast is
like very Miami, kind of Florida adjacent, Like if Miami
and Florida like sort of had a baby, you would

(01:03:26):
get close to what the Gold Coast is.

Speaker 6 (01:03:28):
And it is goofy as hell.

Speaker 4 (01:03:30):
Has an incredible soundtrack, like one of the most amazing
Australian soundtracks and is quite bad.

Speaker 2 (01:03:39):
I love it. It's on the list great, it's on YouTube.

Speaker 4 (01:03:41):
It I was just no, I was just going to say,
you can find it on YouTube. The National Film and
Sound Archive, which is a scene is an actual place
that exists in Australia where I said a murder from
the Grave had shift. But they have the actual they
have a print of the film. It's coming up on
the fortieth anniversary next year, but it is It's just
one of those shark films that's like wow. They there's

(01:04:03):
amazing car chases in it, and like so many resources
thrown at it, and so many random characters with there's
like a black widow type character who her third husband
has died mysteriously and she just carries around the spear
gun the whole time and has like a like slutty
little wetsuit zipped halfway down, and she's a hoot and
like it's just yeah, it's a real fun goofy time.

Speaker 1 (01:04:23):
I love it.

Speaker 2 (01:04:27):
Would that be in your top four shark movies or
do you have?

Speaker 4 (01:04:29):
Oh my god, I'm so glad you asked. I prepped these.
Hang on, let me let me bring up.

Speaker 1 (01:04:33):
The Lestat transition.

Speaker 4 (01:04:35):
Smooth, smooth, Okay, So obviously it's Jaws number one. Like this,
this is the problem with shark movies. I feel, is
the good, the good is so good, and then the
next degree of quality is so far away. It's either
like it's five stars or it's two and a half
at best. Right, So Jaws number one, Deep Blue C

(01:04:58):
for me is number two, And I would put those
in the category of like they're like it's Jaws as
five stars, but like Deep Blue C is like four stars.

Speaker 6 (01:05:08):
It's a really good movie.

Speaker 1 (01:05:10):
Movie's Jaws is a five star film. Deep Blue Season
as a five star movie. That's the way I kind
of like explain it.

Speaker 4 (01:05:17):
Well, you know that saying where they're like there should
be a descriptor for the perfect five star three star movie.
It's like Deep Blue c is the perfect five star
three star movie. And then I would put dangerous animals,
and then I would put the shallows after that, but
I would put special mention or like honorable mentions to

(01:05:38):
the creature.

Speaker 6 (01:05:39):
Pete eventually is the creature.

Speaker 4 (01:05:40):
Which do you define that as a clear shark movie
when he has abs I don't know, and forty seven
meters down, which I thought was a really great concept,
Shark Knight three D, which is goofy but I think
really cool and lots of ways like just interesting stuff
Jesskei action, but also just like the mix of species

(01:06:02):
and the actual environment, Like it's very high concept and
just the conceit, you know, and there's like there's really
good actors in that, like really like Sarah Paxson's great,
but like a bunch of people from those c W shows,
which I don't necessarily think those people get credited with
being amazing actors. But grinding it out for twenty two

(01:06:22):
episodes a season for you know, eighty seven seasons on
Arrow or OC or whatever whatever is really hard work.
Like it takes a very specific type of actor and
they have a really unique toolbox, and then Shark's Paradise
would be the other reference. But the Shallows I was
really hesitant to put in there because the surfing really
pisses me off in the movie, which is always my beef.

(01:06:45):
I'm always like ah because and also anything that filmed here,
it's in many ways like you feel like you know
too much about it. But I never quite understood why
you would film why you would film a Shark movie
on the Gold Coast. The Gold Coast has a world
heritage stretch of surfing beach and literally has both more
world champion and professional surface than anywhere else in the world.

(01:07:07):
So I don't understand why you would set a surfing
movie on the Gold Coast and then film the surfing
in North Queensland and put like a CGI wave. North
Queensland is like what is all protected by reef basically
for those who don't know, So there.

Speaker 6 (01:07:19):
Is literally no surf.

Speaker 4 (01:07:20):
It is flat as flat can be and crock country right, jellyfish, stingers.

Speaker 6 (01:07:25):
The whole thing.

Speaker 4 (01:07:26):
So that annoyed me. And also the surfing annoyed me
because she's like, this is technical, like just being a netpicker.
But when you ride a wave, you choose a direction.
You're going left or you're going right. And in the Shallows,
she's riding a wave across the left side of the wave,
and then the next scene is she's riding a wave
right and it's supposed to be the same wave, and
it's like the stance has changed, you know, You've gone

(01:07:49):
from a goofy to anyway whatever. So the surfing annoys me,
but I think the actual and I think the shark
looks quite bad, but I actually think the idea of
like one woman v thing or like a one setting
v X y Z thing is so cool to do
with a shark. And I also loved all the stuff,
like where you're calculating how long it would take to

(01:08:11):
swim here and like doing the count. There was lots
of like very like plot mechanical stuff that I was like, No,
this deserves to be in the four because it's I've
never there's no other shark movie that quite has done
that in the same way Shark Night three D. I
guess you would compare to Dangerous Animals because it's doing
sharks and serial killers, but Dangerous Animals is so different

(01:08:36):
to that. It's basically like give me buffalo bill on
a boat, and I think that's like such a great
hook for a film like that. And yeah, I don't
know that Bait is one that I was almost I
was tempted to put in there. There's a guy called
doctor Darryl McPhee who I would say is one of
the Australia's leading shark experts slash one of the world's

(01:08:56):
leading shark experts. And he's a consultant on the shark
movie I'm working on at the moment, which is called
untitled Shark movie.

Speaker 6 (01:09:03):
And he told me that his favorite shark movie is.

Speaker 4 (01:09:06):
Bait, and I just find that so like that really
tickles me pink because it's like the most factual, like
logic research focused person and their most their favorite shark
movie is the one that's got ten plots.

Speaker 6 (01:09:21):
It's got a it's got like a shark, it's.

Speaker 4 (01:09:24):
Got a tsunami, it's got an robbery happening, market, a couple.
It's crazy, it's strange, father, daughter, a dog, a Pomeranian.
Like it's so crazy, Like it has like too much,
it has eighty percent too much story. But you know,
you can just put sharks and supermarkets. But it also

(01:09:46):
does so many fascinating things. Bait was built like such
a great built movie, like the way that they built
the shopping aisles and flooded the water and the stuff
is like such a technically challenging movie, and they did
so much tracing stuff in it.

Speaker 3 (01:10:01):
Yeah, two people have put it in the top four,
and you're the first. You're the first person to put
dangerous animals when it's it's.

Speaker 4 (01:10:07):
New, it's a recentcy bias, recency bias. I think it
was a great that great.

Speaker 1 (01:10:12):
Shark, that great way. When it comes up, I was
just like, wow, really.

Speaker 4 (01:10:16):
It's also he I saw it at a cast and
crew screening that Sean was that and you.

Speaker 6 (01:10:23):
Know, obviously Castle grew bunch of cast, bunch of crew.

Speaker 4 (01:10:25):
But it was so interesting talking to him afterwards because
I wanted to know about the sharks, right. That's one
of the hardest things with shark stuff is how do
you film the sharks?

Speaker 6 (01:10:34):
Do you do digital? Do you do practical?

Speaker 4 (01:10:36):
Do you do something in between the actual Like that
is the toughest thing about filming a shark movie is
figuring out what you're going to show and how much
of it you're going to show and how you can
feasibly do that. In Sharks Paradise, for example, they use
they have like a dorsal fin or like prop dorsal
fins probably plural, that they keep using, and at one
point the dorsal fin gets caught in the wind, so

(01:11:00):
it flaps in a way that like shark fins don't
flap obviously, and it just always cracks me out because
they don't have enough weight in that fin. It was
so funny to me, But Sean was talking about how
they used stock footage of sharks and basically like put
a color grade over it so that it had consistency
with the rest of the film, and then essentially like
reinterpreted all like sort of like wrote action and set

(01:11:23):
pieces around that. And that was a really interesting approach
to take. But I also thought paid a lot of
credit to Andrew Trackie, who did The Reef and Reef
Stalked but also did Black Water, which is one of
the best creature features ever made. It's about based on
true story about three people who get attacked by crocodiles

(01:11:43):
while out doing a sight seeing tour, but he filmed
real crocodile footage and then essentially like had the actors
react or interact in and around that, and it was
so in that film and that budget space, so incredibly
effective that I found that I was like, of course Burn,
you know, a student of like of the genre, and

(01:12:04):
him and Andrew Trackie would be peers and he would
know how he shot that, and like loved Ones was
coming out not that differently from you know, Blackwater and
the Reef, which was sort of like back to back,
and it was really interesting that that was the approach
that he used. I thought that was really quite fascinating.
I will say I did miss I think underrated about
Sean Byrne is. He's a really great visual filmmaker, and

(01:12:27):
so much of his the praise about him is his aesthetic.
But I do think he's a really brilliant writer. And
that was the one thing that I missed with Dangerous Animals,
as I missed the sharpness of his pen that you
really get with loved Ones and you really get with
Devil's Candy. I felt the absence of his like pensmanship
to it.

Speaker 1 (01:12:48):
Do you yeah, because yeah, someone else wrote it right
and he said he was having trouble getting stuff off
the ground, So I think you know, like fear Below,
the director of Samba, how his producer was like, he
just write a shark movie, so you like, yeah, I
think he just took a cool script with a serial
killer because you know, like that's kind of his theme
with a lot of other themes, resourceful blonde people and

(01:13:10):
like uh and like but like but then he made
it awesome. Like I feel like some directors could just
be like I got the Shark movie, but like he
found this one. And you're right, I don't think it's
as like Sharper, like you know, Devil's Candy, you love
that family like Ethan Embry, Yeah, gets like the perform
he's great and cheap thrills, but like you like the performance,
but like, yeah, no, I see what you're saying. It's
not as like sharp.

Speaker 4 (01:13:30):
There there's yeah, and there's some And I honestly, when
I saw the movie, I didn't know that he hadn't
written it, and it was I was watching the movie
and I was like, there's something missing about him here,
And it wasn't until afterwards I looked at up I
was like, oh, yeah, he didn't write it, Okay. I
felt his absence of his pen because he's a very
specific singular voice, but fear below as well, besides just

(01:13:51):
like being a great movie and incredible, credible performances around
really small contained cast where they shot that is actually
the Australian Shark Attack Registry is right near the location
of one of the very first or the first sorry
recorded shark attack in Australian history, which was an Indigenous
woman who got bitten in half swimming across that river.

(01:14:13):
So really like, I don't know if even they know that.
It's just immediately I was like, oh, I know where
that is. That's really intriguing, and not buy a ball shark.
If you get bitten in half, usually it's a great
white shark because of the bite diameter, or a tiger
shark at least. But it also I think features the
first Aboriginal actor in a shark movie, wow, which is well,

(01:14:34):
I mean I need I need to go and check that,
like actually factually check that, because I'm like, is there
an os ploitation movie that I've missed somewhere in between?
But all the oz ploitation creature features, I know, like crocodiles,
like dark Age obviously is like indigenous culture and Aboriginal
actors such a big part of that movie, and that's
in part what makes it so special is that it

(01:14:56):
really was just like we just stopped including indigenous people
in movies after a certain point in Australian culture, Like
you know, once the land rights and civil rights movie
kicked up, They're like, no more of this, we don't
want people to have equal rights, So they just stopped
having representation and like a chunk of stuff from the
nineties and two thousands, and it's only sort of starting
to swing back again. But I was watching that and

(01:15:18):
I was like, he's so amazing and it's such a
great performance. But I was also just thinking. I was like,
I was really like truly trying to think. I was like,
I cannot think of another Shark movie that had an
Aboriginal actor in it. There's been plenty that have had
pacifica actors in it, but yeah, I couldn't think of one,
and so I need to go on the research hole

(01:15:38):
and start trying to look that up. Because Shark's Paradise, No,
they have an African American man as one of the characters, but.

Speaker 1 (01:15:46):
Crocodile, but I don't think that has no shark film.
Rogu rules by the way, I just want to throw.

Speaker 4 (01:15:52):
That out there.

Speaker 6 (01:15:53):
Oh you're a big row guy, Yeah, I just.

Speaker 1 (01:15:56):
Like giant alligators. I'm so forgiving personally.

Speaker 4 (01:16:00):
It's a crocodile for us, and it's a real point
of contention for Australians. They'll come for you, they'll come
for you. My problem with rogue well is literally like
it's shut up in it's set and shot up in
arnham Land, which is a very specific part of Australia.
And the fact that you have a cast of like
twenty five people and not a single Aboriginal character in

(01:16:22):
it is actually in two thousand and seven or whatever
it is, is so impossibly hard to do and such
a like actual effort to exclude rather than include, especially
when those types of crocodile.

Speaker 6 (01:16:38):
So there was a coal of crocodiles in the seventies.

Speaker 4 (01:16:42):
And so the population went way down and there hasn't
been a cull since, right, So lots of crocodiles up
in that area are basically like the oldest you get
is essentially fifty years old because the majority of the
population was killed, right. And the crocodile and rogue, because
of its size and scale, is something that either like
completely survived.

Speaker 6 (01:17:02):
The cull or was.

Speaker 4 (01:17:03):
Like deep deep deep in anamland, which is where they
say a lot of those really big, huge, one hundred
plus year old crocs went. And it's just something that
it's like, that's like dark Age is such a good
We'll probably one of my favorite crocodile movies. But the oh,
it's so freaking good. It's weirdly like a Tarantino favorite.

Speaker 6 (01:17:21):
I don't know.

Speaker 4 (01:17:22):
It's part of that oz plantation era and it has
John Jarrett from Wolf Creek in it, so lots of
people have seen it for that reason. But it's essentially
like people always compared it to it's from the eighties,
nineteen eighty four, I believe they were saying, oh, it's
Australia's answer to Jaws, and it's using a crocodile instead
of a shark.

Speaker 6 (01:17:39):
But what this in the story.

Speaker 4 (01:17:41):
It's there's all these Aboriginal characters and they talk about
essentially what this crocodile is doing and how it's the
manifestation of a very specific type of spirit that is
trying to like equalize a balance in nature. That was
really fascinating and like gave much more intention and motivation
to like thing killing things for killing sake's reason. So Rogue,

(01:18:04):
the exclusion of indigenous people when it's like so specifically
like their lands, their world, their creatures is tough. But
also just the fact that the cast is so big
and by the time you get to the end of
the movie, it's like five six people die, like the
only reason, like Aliens rules, right, So the reason you
have a cast that big in Aliens is that you're like,

(01:18:25):
they're going to kill these people and fascinating in amazing ways.

Speaker 6 (01:18:29):
And so I remember watching Rogue for the first time.

Speaker 4 (01:18:31):
I was like, oh man, the only reason you have
a cast is big, so you have lots of people
to chump. And then it got to the end of
the movie and I was like they didn't kill Like
they didn't even kill half of them, you know, like
Mia Wrekowsca and her parents are like still chugging along,
and it's just like damn yeah, rather like you know,
she gets like she goes through a tough time, but

(01:18:51):
the fact that majority of those characters survive is so
crazy to me.

Speaker 6 (01:18:56):
But you know, deaths are expensive, so I get it.

Speaker 5 (01:18:59):
I just like big crocodiles, Well, you're gonna love dark
Age then, because that crocodile is humongous and it was
so heavy when they built it that they had a
problem because it.

Speaker 4 (01:19:10):
Kept sinking in the lagoons where they were filming it.
So they kept like building this crocodile and getting it
moving and then it would sink and then they would
have to send people down to get it up from
the from the bodom of the lagoon.

Speaker 1 (01:19:21):
Alligator and Deep Star six had those problems too, They're
like made them and then they.

Speaker 2 (01:19:25):
Just went.

Speaker 6 (01:19:27):
It's cool. Dark Age is really cool.

Speaker 4 (01:19:29):
It's got some gnarly death and it's also got a
really great truck chase, a truck croc chase that is
just in classic Australian film fashion.

Speaker 6 (01:19:39):
It's got a really cool chase.

Speaker 1 (01:19:40):
Yeah, I can't see it's on YouTube. I'd buy it,
but I can't.

Speaker 4 (01:19:43):
See any I would It might be on Oh there's
a I don't know if you guys can get the
streaming service Brolly where you are b R I L
L E. So it's the streaming platform for Umbrella, which
is a quite famous and cult genre distributor and real
like John your champions here, but they started their own

(01:20:04):
streaming service which is basically a lot of horror and
a lot of documentaries, but a lot of classic and
unseen and just like forgotten odsploitation films, and so dark
Age is up on Brolli. If you have a VPN
you can access it, and Brolly is a free service.
So it's honestly, I really do feel like they're doing

(01:20:25):
the Lord's work there in terms of just like we
just want people to be able to see these films
however they can see them, and so we will make
this available on a platform for people for free, and hopefully,
you know, you get some idiot on a deeply See
podcast they're talking about.

Speaker 6 (01:20:39):
Dark Age and how people should watch it.

Speaker 1 (01:20:41):
You know, I have it and I can watch it.
I'm on the website right now.

Speaker 6 (01:20:45):
Beautiful BROLLI.

Speaker 4 (01:20:46):
Yeah, gem, you guys are going to go deep down
the rabbit hole on Brolly.

Speaker 6 (01:20:49):
There's some banger.

Speaker 2 (01:20:50):
Stuff razorbacks on there as well.

Speaker 6 (01:20:53):
Dude. It's so and a lot of those like horrors
as well.

Speaker 4 (01:20:57):
They many of them have accompanying documentaries that have been
as part of like the re releases or special features
and stuff. So it's something like The Tunnel, which is
a found footage buzzy horror film. They have a documentary
about making the tunnel on there, and you're like, oh, okay, amazing.
Not only can I get to see this obscure film,
I can then also watch an obscure film about the
obscure film.

Speaker 1 (01:21:17):
So as a researcher, I love that. I love learning
stuff like that.

Speaker 6 (01:21:21):
So good.

Speaker 4 (01:21:22):
Yeah, that's a great resource. I hope your listeners get
a lot from Brolli.

Speaker 3 (01:21:26):
So I joined tell us a little bit about untitled
shark movie and when we can expect to.

Speaker 4 (01:21:30):
See it, yes, well, hopefully you'll get to see it
in twenty twenty six.

Speaker 6 (01:21:35):
We are currently in pre production at the moment.

Speaker 4 (01:21:37):
It is my feature film debut as a director, and
it's inspired by well, you know, things that I saw
growing up as a surfer and being a reporter and
covering things.

Speaker 6 (01:21:48):
But also one of my closest friends and.

Speaker 4 (01:21:51):
Co writer on the film, Kimi Sukakochi, who was in
a film called Great White, which you guys have spoken about.

Speaker 8 (01:21:58):
Sorry positively, Yes, there was inspired by experiences that she
had working on shark movies and things that I saw,
you know, covering shark movies and sort of thinking like,
you know what happened if you were making a shark
movie and there was an attack on a shark movie, Like,
how would you know the difference?

Speaker 4 (01:22:16):
Because there's so much gore and effects and everyone's expecting attacks.

Speaker 6 (01:22:20):
And it's a found footage shark movie.

Speaker 4 (01:22:22):
So the cell is really Jaws meets Bloywitch Project, and
it's about an ePK crew shooting behind the scenes footage
on a shark movie that ends up turning into a
real life attack. So very inside baseball and you know,
very cathartic for a lot of things that we've seen
and experience in the film industry. And Kimmy's the star

(01:22:43):
of it and my co writer, and we're producing it
as well, and I'm directing it. So it's yeah, so
it's found footage horror, creature feature, you know, comedy for
comedic elements, but pretty pretty, pretty pretty excited. It's been
really fun process so far. And I love shark movies

(01:23:04):
and I love creature features, and so trying to find
ways to merge all of those passions and create something
that feels really dynamic and in the found footage space
as well is something that's really exciting because I love
found footage movies. But one of the things I always
get annoyed about is where the camera's positioned, like why, yeah, exactly,

(01:23:27):
Also like why are you filming now? Like drop the
camera and run damn it, like Clover films.

Speaker 2 (01:23:31):
Don't want to die.

Speaker 4 (01:23:33):
I know, it's so crazy. So it's like the best
find footage movies have a really great hook for why
the characters are filming, like Blue Witch Project, like Cannibal Holocaust,
like ghost Watch, even even though it's a TV series
broadcast rather than an actual thing, but you know, reck,
you know all of those things. Finding me, Find Me
a really great promise of the premise, and then I

(01:23:55):
will like follow you to the ends of the Earth
if you can execute so troll Hunter, troll Hunter, they
go troll Hunter though so expensive. Sorry sorry to sound
like so much like somebody who's currently in production on something.
I was like, oh my god, that feels unattainable, you know,
whereas so much found footage and horror is oftentimes the

(01:24:16):
genre that people get their start in and then they
fick off out of it and go make the melodrama
they've always wanted to make, which like live, Laugh, Love.
Good for them, but for me, It's like this, all
I've ever wanted to make is just horror films all
the time, forever.

Speaker 1 (01:24:28):
Always same monster movies.

Speaker 4 (01:24:31):
Monster movies, which is so tough because they're so hard
to make because of the creatures.

Speaker 1 (01:24:37):
Random story. I was working on a reality show in
the Everglades of Florida and we were walking through the
swamp and I had a dead alligator. I'd to keep
placing on logs to get a buroll of it, which
is kind of crazy, and then they got a western
diamond back and not an Eastern whatever. But I was
walking with the camera on my shoulder and I stepped
into this thing and this thing jetted out, and like

(01:24:58):
I almost fell, and like the producers like, don't drop
the camera. But then I was talking to somebody like, yeah,
you're probably on a gator hole, like where the gators lie,
and I knew something flew away from me and I
almost fell. But I love that the producer's first reaction
was don't drop keep filing.

Speaker 6 (01:25:15):
Yeah, Like I remember that.

Speaker 4 (01:25:17):
Oh. I don't know if you guys watched Jaws at fifty,
which is a really interesting documentary and lots of stuff
in it that I'm like I kind of want to
hear the real story of this, and maybe there's too
many people who made the film who took close to
this documentary, and so you can't get all the goths
that you want to get. But when the Orca was
sinking in real life, I did find it so funny

(01:25:37):
when they're talking about the sound recorders. Who's like holding
all his equipment up and he's like me, like, get
get this, get this equipment because this is worth so
much money, and I was like yeah, and then too,
you know, it's like not to say that stuff isn't
expensive now, but you know, they were already by that point,
I think like forty days over about to be an

(01:25:58):
under twenty days over, So I could just imagine how
goddamn stressed you were and you're trying to get the audio,
and they had this great shot of him completely submerged,
just holding this heavy ass piece of machinery above his head.

Speaker 1 (01:26:11):
I need to watch that doc. I haven't got into
it yet.

Speaker 4 (01:26:13):
It's definite. It's for a Shark movie fan or like
movie making fan. It's like just one of those essential
docs that you gotta watch. I found it interesting but
not um surprising that Richard Dreyfus wasn't in it, considering
that he's the only one of the original three men
still alive. But you know, obviously famously quite an asshole
and very prickly, and so was not in the documentary.

(01:26:35):
And I was like, damn, they even got Robert Shaw's son,
but no Richard Dreyfus.

Speaker 1 (01:26:39):
Yeah, wherever he goes, he says something. He always drops something.
Richard Dreyfus said this, and you're like Jesus with He was.

Speaker 4 (01:26:46):
On a pop culture convention that I was a guest on,
and so you travel with those people for like two weeks,
and yeah, it was a time. It was you know,
not to say that you know celebrities and people too,
you never get their characters or whatever. But at this
time it was sort of just probably I think maybe
six or seven months before he had his own Me
Too scandal, and it was like in hindsight, I was like, oh, yeah,

(01:27:09):
you can see sometimes things coming on. Malloy.

Speaker 2 (01:27:12):
Yeah, well this is awesome.

Speaker 1 (01:27:13):
I can't wait to see your movie. And good luck
with the pre pro It's a lot of work, I know,
you have a lot of strip boarding and like everything
ahead of you and scheduling and all that.

Speaker 4 (01:27:22):
So yeah, well the most exciting thing or like there's
lots of exciting things, and the scheduling and always the
financing is a scary thing. And like some of the
people we're talking to for creature effects worked on Fear Below,
so that's really cool. And like every almost everybody on
this movie has worked on a shark movie. And that's
the like rad thing about being in Australia and the
Australian film business and Gold Coast specifically, is like everybody

(01:27:45):
kind of has a story about Oh I worked on this,
I worked on Shallows, I worked on Bait or yeah, yeah,
we're trying to make some really cool crew match, but
it's we also have, like you know, we're trying to
create red sense for why the cameras would be in
certain places, and so it's a plot mechanic that our
characters are surfers, because then you have all these different

(01:28:09):
types of cameras and pieces of equipment that were specifically
designed for surfing, right and designed to be in aquatic
environments like for instance, like the goproun It.

Speaker 6 (01:28:21):
Troko. This makes terrible audioce so.

Speaker 4 (01:28:25):
People at home, I'm showing them it's essentially a GoPro
that has like a mouthguard attached and it's a bite mount,
so when you're surfing, it's in your mouth and you
can be hands free.

Speaker 6 (01:28:35):
Right, So doing lots of stuff like that.

Speaker 4 (01:28:37):
But part of what's fun is we need a surfing
stunt double, and so that gets to be me because
we're on we're on a budget, so it's just like
if we haven't the time, time of money to train actors.
So it's like, as long as we have a board
that visually is the same, but it's like, hell, yeah,
it's my dream.

Speaker 6 (01:28:55):
Is just to get paid to surf. So you find
a way to make it work.

Speaker 1 (01:29:00):
All day right there, direct and then surf.

Speaker 4 (01:29:03):
Yeah, stunt body double. I probably end up getting attacked
about Shark Midsea.

Speaker 1 (01:29:08):
Better story, you know, it would be it would.

Speaker 6 (01:29:11):
Their film would sell itself, the film. If I survived,
it would be better.

Speaker 4 (01:29:14):
But if I died, then at least, you know, the
residuals for everybody else who busted their ars or took
a low rate would be worth it.

Speaker 3 (01:29:21):
You know, Well, I think we've kept you long enough.
We could talk it this for hours, I think, But
anything else you want to you want to plug you
other than Total Sharp movie The.

Speaker 6 (01:29:30):
Black Thank you so much for having me on the show.

Speaker 4 (01:29:36):
I'd like Deep Lucy is one of my favorite, my
second favorite shark movies of all time, but one of
my favorite like Die Hard with such and such movie,
and if you're into neath niche pop culture stuff and
pop culture automology, I worked on an audio documentary called
The Phantom Never Dies, which is about the very first superhero,
the Phantom, and sort of the history of that character
and how it tied into the American civil Rights movie

(01:30:00):
and then the you know, Billy Zaane movie and all
sorts of stuff and weird pop culture journey. So if
that sounds like something that would tickle your pickle, it's
available on every single podcast platform that you can imagine.

Speaker 6 (01:30:13):
However you would listen to it, you can check that out.

Speaker 1 (01:30:15):
I think, yeah, I just got I got a bunch
of good stuff to listen to and watch. This is
cool man.

Speaker 4 (01:30:21):
The Phantom Show was a dream come true because the
Phantom is obviously a huge pop culture figure in Australia,
but is also just a massive It's basically the Phantom
is Superman too. Pacifica and Papua New Guinea and Indian
and like just very like.

Speaker 6 (01:30:37):
Specific indigenous communities globally. The phantom really matters.

Speaker 4 (01:30:40):
And it's so funny in a way because it is
a white guy in a jungle story. But the way
that people can like absorb and absolve and create characters
that have meaning and importance to them that ends up
going echoing back and reshaping those characters is just like
endlessly fascinating stuff.

Speaker 3 (01:30:59):
That's awesome, fantastic, great listeners. You can follow this podcast
deliver social media at deep Sea pod email at gmail
dot com. Next week, I've got a new film for you,
Hot Spring Shark Attack, a new classics.

Speaker 4 (01:31:17):
Is there a jet ski in it?

Speaker 1 (01:31:18):
There is now jet ski.

Speaker 3 (01:31:20):
There is a there is a submarine and the submarine
sandwiches on a submarine.

Speaker 1 (01:31:24):
Yeah. It's an incredible episode where Jay and I were like,
I love this scene. I love this scene. That scenes great,
this scene's good.

Speaker 2 (01:31:29):
Favorite film, Yeah, haven't so much.

Speaker 3 (01:31:33):
It's genuinely I have watched it twice since in the
past week. It's incredible and it's like seventeen minutes long.
So yeah, Hot Spring Shark Attack next week, so come
out for that one.

Speaker 2 (01:31:45):
Anything else to plug Mark.

Speaker 1 (01:31:46):
Yeah, just my other show movies, so on the flicks.
And then I don't know if I just really I
analyzed the movie Barbarian. I figured out this the square
feet that would have been added to the house had
you been able to finish, so right, read that, just
type in like Barbarian square feet and I figured out
what a.

Speaker 2 (01:32:05):
Like.

Speaker 1 (01:32:05):
Yeah, it was a lot, it was fun. It was
a lot of work, but I figured it out. So
just type that in you can. You can read it
so good.

Speaker 6 (01:32:11):
That's one of the great cinema gags.

Speaker 1 (01:32:14):
I haven't laughed harder that. I laughed so hard in
the theater when he was like researching it and then
he got the tape measure. I don't And I couldn't
sleep that night because the movie was like so uncadite.
I love Barbarian, So yeah, yeah, Barbarian rules. But that's it.

Speaker 3 (01:32:29):
Great, Well, that will do it for Denz one Chapter
twenty dive two. Thank you once again to an incredible guest,
Maria Lewis.

Speaker 4 (01:32:36):
Thanks so much for having me. Jacqueline Mackenzie's the goat
best death RP.

Speaker 1 (01:32:42):
That character legend.

Speaker 3 (01:32:43):
Ay man, I've been Jake Klut and I'm markof Myra
and we'll deep lucy you next week.

Speaker 6 (01:32:49):
Such a good

Speaker 4 (01:32:49):
Side to put it out

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Episode 245 (Cheeseburger of Their Dreams)

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