Building the perfect Buffalo Bills 2025 NFL Draft class | DC - Disguised Coverage

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
It's thirty eight.

Speaker 2 (00:00):
All bills can win In here, Wake puts it down.
The kick is on the way, and his dock and
the bill good one?

Speaker 1 (00:07):
How the hell that one.

Speaker 3 (00:11):
Home?

Speaker 2 (00:11):
How one?

Speaker 3 (00:13):
They were a party one not party way?

Speaker 1 (00:16):
Incredible?

Speaker 2 (00:17):
Why not combat by my bell?

Speaker 3 (00:19):
Jacksonville's perfect record on the line right here, quick.

Speaker 4 (00:30):
Kicking, look excited. Touchdown Kyle Williams touchdound.

Speaker 3 (00:46):
Amazing, unbelievable. They puttied william who's has to full back
and he scores a touchdown. It's wealthier to face tackle.

Speaker 1 (01:16):
What's good? Folks, Family, Friends, loved ones, enemies, friendemies, wizards
which is Muggles, mud bloods, people of Middle Earth. To
another episode of Disguised Coverage. The only podcast that gives
you an equal amount of blueberries in each muffin, presented
by the best Pizza in Buffalo, New York that is
one PI Pizza. Find the online menu in the episode
show notes. Whether you're here on YouTube or whichever podcasting
Apple platform you are listening to this show on. I

(01:38):
am your host, Anthony Prohaska. Find me on Twitter at
pro Underscore Underscore an that's pro two underscores a n T.
Find me on Blue Sky at pro ant. No underscores,
there just p r O A N T over on
the blue sky. In this episode of Disguised Coverage, we
are forty less than forty eight hours away from the

(02:00):
official start of the twenty twenty five NFL Draft. Round
one is this upcoming Thursday night, and then we've got
rounds two and three on Friday night and then the
rest of the draft on Saturday. And in accordance with that,
we are going to be diving into a theme in
this episode that we did last year with the exact
same guest. I'm excited to run back this year. And
if you didn't know what was happening based on the

(02:21):
title or the episode description, or you know, if you
didn't know who the guests was by ringing the episode description,
you will see that shortly. What we're going to be
doing in this episode is building the perfect and or
ideal whatever verbide you want to use. Buffalo Bills twenty
twenty five NFL Draft Class. We will be diving into
specific players, positional needs for this team, positional values, juxtaposing

(02:43):
you know, if you go at this position here, what
does it look like to go down the board. Later,
our evaluations rankings, anything and everything that would lead us
to have a discussion of how and why we would
come to the conclusion of what our perfect Buffalo Bills
twenty twenty five NFL Draft would look like and having
that conversation. As I mentioned, this person was my guest
last year for this same topic. He is my guest

(03:04):
again this year for this topic. Welcoming to the show,
mister Joe Marino of Locked on Bills. Very busy man
this time of year. So Joe, like I said to
you offline, I'm very grateful that you took the time.
Welcome to the show. How you doing.

Speaker 2 (03:19):
I'm good man, Good to be with you. Good for
it to be draft week, Good for the hours to
be passing us by, to get closer to this thing. Man,
I'm ready for these players to be picked, Ready to
relearn the league. You know, I understand the direction of
the Bills. One thing that you said there, I totally
remember doing this last year. I don't remember what I said.

(03:40):
Is there any chance that you had, like the the ideal?
I hate to put you on the spot right now,
but I love funny. I'd love to know what I said.

Speaker 1 (03:48):
You know what's funny. I don't remember what I do remember,
and I thought it was this draft, but it wasn't
because the years were different. Actually think this is the
third consecutive year we did it, because I remember the
first time we did it, we disagreed on Tank Dell
and that's the only thing that reminds well, not really disagreed,
but we talked about like I like him a bit more.

(04:09):
We talked about the outliers, how small he was, YadA YadA.
So I think this is actually the third year in
a row that we've done it. But my brain, my
brain is like fried now at this point. So no,
and I thought of going back and looking at it,
but then I was like, well, if it's not great,
then I have to know that internally I'm lying about it.
So I kind of kept my head in the sand
on this one. So no, I did not go back.

Speaker 2 (04:30):
All Right, well, now I'm gonna have to do that
is part of my killing time between now and Thursday night.
See what I said last year and compare that's very ye,
We'll go.

Speaker 1 (04:41):
Through uh and do that and see I feel like
you're going to it in two minutes and be like, oh,
this is terrible. I don't want to know this at all.

Speaker 2 (04:45):
Oh, yeah, I might turn that off real quick, but
if it sounds good, I might some receipts, you know
what I mean?

Speaker 1 (04:51):
Look at the look how predictive I was and how
well this worked out? Look at me?

Speaker 2 (04:56):
Right?

Speaker 1 (04:56):
Oh it turns out So I guess in accordance with
that for this episode, this draft class and going into
the twenty twenty five season, how did you you know,
do you have a starting point for building your ideal
or perfect Bills draft class? Did it start with a
particular like player in mind? Or did it start with

(05:16):
a specific positional hierarchy or kind of the value propositions
of positions versus different positions. How did you start? You know,
kind of high level without giving too much away, you know,
how did you kind of put your board together for
this episode?

Speaker 2 (05:30):
Yeah, it's mostly leaning into my own personal preferences as
to certain players at positions that I think are most important,
while being mindful of kind of the depth of the
class and where I think the talent cliffs are at
those positions, so prioritizing needs but also factoring in talent

(05:53):
cliffs so that way I can position myself to get
exactly what I want and that's really went into it's
a lot of personal bias. I'm not gonna lie to you.
I think that's something that was weighing heavily on the
way that I'm building my own personal ideal bills draft.

Speaker 1 (06:11):
Yeah, that's that's one for me that I think is
such a core And really, anytime I do, even if
it's like a mock that I'm just doing for fun
while I'm like waiting in line at the at the
car washer or something like that, Like everything for me
is like you said, tied to you know what the
bills need, or like a specific player that you might like,
but it's all you call it tail, you call it
talent cliffs, which I love. I always call it the
value proposition and it but it's essentially it's literally not

(06:33):
even essentially. It's the same thing like, Okay, if I
need these two positions, how can I get the best
value out of both of them? If I go position
A right now, that means I gotta go B later.
What does be look like later? And then you might
have somebody a position A that you like a lot,
but the value is still good later. So you're like,

(06:55):
you know, even though I love this guy, at this position.
I'm gonna go with position because I can still kind
of mitigate the difference between who I like in a
and what that And it's these exercises are always so fun,
but it I can't imagine being in like an actual
like war room in the draft, Like it would just
stress me out to like no degree. Like even just

(07:15):
preparing for this, I was like I kind of knew
where I was going, but like putting it officially on
the record for myself, I was like stressed out and
I can't imagine like my actual livelihood being attached to it.

Speaker 2 (07:26):
Well, you just naturally fall in love with different prospects too,
and you there's the hard reality of you're just not
gonna get them all. You're not even gonna get most
of them. You're only gonna get some maybe a couple, right. Yeah,
So that's the other reality of this is you put
so much work into it and ultimately you're only going
to get a few few players hopefully that you really like.

Speaker 1 (07:44):
Yeah, quick question for you offer all of a sudden,
you just said, And because I think about this for
myself all the time, you know, there's how would you
juxtapose or kind of work in not necessarily biased, but
what you like or what you look for individ juli
or personally in a prospect versus like kind of what
is objectively good Like I'll give you an example, like

(08:05):
receiver for instance, Right, Like I tend to gravitate towards
guys like with really great stem work and great release packages.
Now I also value other things like, oh sweet, can
you you know whin contesta catches downfield? What kind of
long speed you have? So on and so forth. But
I gravitate towards guys, and I always have to not
necessarily fight, but make sure like I don't overvalue those
guys on my board because of my personal preference. Is

(08:27):
that I mean, and you've been doing this for so long,
is that something you kind of just figured out how
to compartmentalize or does it work into your overall evaluations
kind of naturally or purposefully at this point.

Speaker 2 (08:36):
Yeah, there's definitely going to be my own preferences at
each position that are going to factor in. Just there's
nothing I can do about it. But I think what
I always try to go back to is for as
much as I might prefer different styles or different body types,
the reality is that every position there's a lot of
different ways to get it done. And so what I
try to do is I look at my scouting process

(08:58):
very much through the lens of risk assessment, and so,
what about this player, what characteristics do they have? And
then from there comparing it against historical norms and then
giving myself the most likely outcome that's going to lead
to a hit. And so of course I'm going to
care most about the things that I care most about,

(09:20):
but I still have to foil it all together to
ask myself the question does this track like, does this
skill set? Does this profile work in the NFL? And
if it does, how valuable is it? And then that's
how you get to your grades. So I think I
think that's my best way of certainly being mindful of
the things that I care most about, but being mindful

(09:42):
of what works in the NFL. And I think, particularly
like a pass rusher, where I think we love dude.
Is there anything more sexy than a guy getting off
the ball quick bending and running a circle around an
offensive tackle? Is there anything better than that? Well, guess
what doesn't really happen in the NFL? That, right, You
gotta be able to shave angles. You gotta be able
to play through contact and play through blocks. So it's

(10:05):
it's hard sometimes to be like, oh, I think this
pass rusher is really stiff. Okay, well, can they play
through angles? Do they have good contact balance? Do they
have length? Could do they have a natural feel for
angles in how they rush? Because that's really important. It's
probably matters a lot more than the guy that can
just run a circle around a guy, because that doesn't
really translate to the same degree. So it's just it's

(10:27):
a lot of that man figuring these guys out and
how valuable whatever they do is.

Speaker 1 (10:31):
Very well said I I operate with a similar philosophy
to a degree of kind of I always look at
a guy and it's similar to kind of what I
do in fantasy football. I'm very much like a like
a high floor type of guy. And when it comes
to prospect evaluation, alway's like, okay, like if this player
comes in to the league or to a team, what
do I think they are, like, you know, no quote unquote,
but what do I think he can hang his hat

(10:51):
on forever or immediately? Is it one thing? Is it
two things? If it's just this one thing, Okay, Like
I know he can be great at this thing without
thinking of anything else, oh his ceiling or if he
goes to the right landing spot or if he connect
forget all that. I always think of, like what can
what can this player hang his hat on? And then
that kind of factors in as well, And I always
just chalk it up kind of like a high floor

(11:12):
because there's just there's so much and it gets talked
about every cycle, but there's, man like the amount of
variables that go into what a player becomes, like their
individual makeup, the makeup of the organization they go into
both culturally and schematically, and then everything that just snowballs
from there, positively and negatively. There's so much that goes

(11:33):
into what a guy ends up becoming that it's so
I mean, if it's why coaches and gms and scouts
get rotated around in different spots, like the draft is
such an inexact science in every way, shape and form
and it Yeah, but it all goes back to the man.
I just can't imagine having to be like, yeah, man,
I'm betting my job on this like twenty one year

(11:54):
old to come out and do this thing that I
need him to do.

Speaker 2 (11:57):
For my job. Yeah, and there's so much that goes
into that. I love how you made this bigger than
just what you can learn from watching tape looking at
measurables athletic profiles, production profiles, because these are real people,
and real people are all different, and we've all worked
jobs in our life. You've seen how even you might

(12:20):
interview somebody or meet somebody, and you see the way
that they work. It's different, right, And that's not different
in football, right. These are still regular people that have tendencies,
and you know, we don't get to really meet these guys.
You know, we don't really get to find out what
their football IQ is talk to people that have been
around them for the last few years. And the thing
that nobody knows is what's going to happen when you

(12:41):
are all of a sudden, a young twenty year old
man and you suddenly have more money and time than
you've ever had in your entire life. How do you
respond to that? Nobody? Nobody knows, man, And all of
those things are very critical in determining what type of
professional football player they're going to be. And so that's

(13:02):
why I give myself a lot of grace man. You know,
like do I get it all right? No, I certainly don't.
But there's also a lot of layers to this that
I don't have that makes it very difficult for me
to you know, really really project guys. And so I
think it's important that people know, like, hey, these opinions
and these evaluations are based on film measurables, athletic testing,

(13:23):
production profiles, and that's it. I don't know anything about
these people as people. You read stuff, but you don't know.

Speaker 1 (13:29):
It's funny too, I've said what I'm about to say.
I've said this so much this draft cycle, I feel
like more than previous ones, even though I know I've
said it in previously too. And you know, we watch
the tape, we get the ALL twenty two, and we
dive into it. I wish I had like ALL twenty
two for the top thirty visits or the interviews of
the combine, or like anything that could just give me

(13:51):
a peek into a player's character makeup or personality makeup,
because that is what separates them once you get to
the league. Like in granted, everybody he's got, you know,
hands in different buckets, but once you get to college
and then further when you get to the NFL. Everybody's
good at football, everyone's big, everyone's fast like, everyone's strong like.
But it's that mental makeup that separates the like the

(14:14):
bad from the math, the math from the good, the
good from the great, and the great from the hall
of fame. And it's just it's tied to so many things,
like how you see the game, how you understand it,
but your work ethic, like do you already have a
routine tied into it? Does the team that brings you
in like support that routine? Do they have to instill it?
Do you clash with your position coach? Does your position
coach not like you as a person like that gets

(14:35):
lost so much too, Like at the end of the day,
it's still like it's still a job. And just like
regular people with regular lives, you might hate your boss.
Your boss might hate you, and in this case, your
boss might be your position coach. Or maybe your boss
loves you but his boss. You know, you're a CBR,
your direct report, your secondary coach, he loves you, but

(14:57):
his boss the defensive coordinator hate your gut maybe more possible, Yeah,
like all those little layers, and then does that sour
you a little bit? And would Oh. There's just so
many layers from that aspect, and that's why I always yeah,
every year, I'm always like, man, I wish I just
I love the post draft content when teams select guys
and then they put out the videos of what their

(15:19):
h you know, interview look like with them at the
combine the little nuggets and we've seen the Kyank homing ones,
the Kyrie reelam so on and so over all these
teams do it. I wish like there was like a
black market film for that, like in February and March
and April, to help us further our evaluations and round
everything out to really know what these guys are between
the years, because there's so much of that that we'll

(15:40):
never know just by watching the tape and breaking it down.
It's a great point.

Speaker 2 (15:43):
Yeah, the Gruden QB camps, have you get a chance
to watch any of them? Brother, just need one of
those on every single player. We'll be fine. We'll get
a figure it out real quick, man. So those are awesome.

Speaker 1 (15:53):
I was watching who I think it was. I was
watching Kyl McCord break down their RPO stuff and how
like everything is adjusted based on like if the if
the receiver gets pressed, and how he stems the route
and changes it from a slant. And then but even
if they're if the corners like impress, if he takes
an inside release and the corner tries to mash it,
he converts that slant to a go and just how

(16:14):
reactive it is. And then I think it was Riley
Leonard who is breaking everything down on like the cadence
with the claps and how fake it was and all
the details. Man, Yeah, that so good, Oh so good,
so so good. Joe, I hope this episode goes so
so good. We're gonna pivot now to the meat of
this episode. The crux of this episode, for those who
don't know, Joe and I will be building our perfect

(16:35):
and or ideal Buffalo Bills twenty twenty five draft class.
For those of you joining us live here. If you
are joining us live one, thank you very much for
being here live two drop alike on this video if
you are willing and able and would be so kind
like so the lifeblood of these streams. And also, if
you are watching live, feel free to play along with us.
Let us know who are your ideal targets, what your

(16:56):
ideal draft class looks like what you think of our
picks as we go throughout the rounds and the days
and the players and all of that. Whether you got
positional likings, player likings, preferences, priorities, whatever you got, put
it up into the chat. Let us know, billt engaging
with the chat, and then I will pull up anything
and everything as physically possible for us to engage with
as we go forward. Joe, you are the guests. The

(17:18):
floor is yours. We are going to start with pick
thirty in round one. Obviously, what does that pick in
round one look like for you when you were starting
out building your perfect Buffalo Bills twenty twenty five draft class.

Speaker 2 (17:32):
Well, obviously the perfect pick would be a dual Carter
falling to number thirty. But with that out of the way,
am I silly joke? Sorry? Like, yeah, that was lame,
Travis Travis Hunter be fine too, Yeah, that's I'll take
of It's okay, Yeah, it'd be good picks. So, of course,
having a level of reality to this conversation, yes, I

(17:54):
do look at this Bills team with three primary needs,
and you can debate the order, but detackle a corner
and d end I think are the most important things
for this football team. And that's how I want to
see the Bills attack these first three picks and being
mindful of talent cliffs and in the way that I
see it, I think there's a lot of value at

(18:15):
the defensive end position. That's kind of the one I
feel comfortable waiting on and feeling like at sixty two,
I can get a player that I'm gonna like. Where
I get a little bit more nervous is at dtackle
and corner. But I have a little bit more depth
at corner in terms of players that I really like.
And so with this being Joe Marino's ideal scenario for

(18:37):
the Bills, I want to get this defensive tackle situation
figured out ap if the Bills played a game right now,
and they don't. They're not playing a game right now.
Let's establish that sure. But with Larry hug and Joby
suspended for the first six games of the season, this
d tackler rotation is at Oliver Deiquon, Jones, Zion Logan,
Dwayne Carter. We can't go to war with tech. We

(18:57):
cannot go to war with that, you know what I mean? Actually,
because Ed's gonna play sixty percent Dakwon's gonna play fifty
to fifty five percent. There's a lot of snaps right
there for Carter and Logan, and I just feel like
those players have not shown me enough to feel comfortable.
So I have a lot of concern for this detackle position.
And really what I'd love to do is be able

(19:18):
to get somebody that can pair with Daikwon Jones this year,
you know, to round out all those one tech snaps,
but then have a successor in place with Daikwon aging
last year of his deal. You like to be able
to kind of help yourself now and in the future,
and so I would love for the Bills to get

(19:39):
that type of player. Now, I'm a little particular about
that type of player. I don't want to get just
a big guy that can't move or defend the you know,
not just a run defender. Of course I want run defender,
but I want a guy that can do the most
important thing, which is make plays behind the line of scrimmage.
And I know this is a player that we might
not see eyd eye on, but this is my ideal
draft and I'm picking Kenneth Grant okay out of Michigan.

(20:02):
I'm telling you right now. I'm fully prepared for Kenneth
Grant to be on the board to pick thirty and
the Bills not to pick them like I'm not exactly
I'm not exactly sure or convinced that this is a
player that the Bills like as much as I do.
For me, he's the number fifteen player on my board,
so you can understand why I'd be as static about
him at pick thirty. I think he's just really unique.
He is huge, he's three hundred and thirty pounds, but

(20:24):
he's got a lot of movement skills that really get
me excited, particularly lateral movement skills. And you know, I
love watching him pursue backside and get outside the tackles
and make these plays down the line of scrimmage. And
you know, I think that there's an unrealized pass rush
ceiling that he has as well, where you know, I
don't want to get nuts, but there's the there's different
types of nose tackles, and the ones that you want

(20:46):
are the DJ Readers, the Vita Vegas, the Dexter Lawrence,
you know, those types of guys, those are the ones
that are really valuable. And I think that Dexter Lawrence
has a ceiling that can kind of give you that
type of player if it all comes together. I'm not
going to sit here and act like everything is great
and amazing. With Kenneth Grant, I think he's got to
play with better pad level to really maximize his power

(21:08):
at the point of attack. I do think he has
to flesh out his past rush repertoire. But I love
the package here. I love the ceiling. I love the
physical upside, and that's what I'm looking for. I want
guys to have a chance to be a difference maker,
and I feel like Kenneth Grant does have that type
of ceiling, and so for me, that's that's a direction
I would just be over the moon with. If that's

(21:29):
where the Bills went with pick thirty. Predictively, I don't
think they're going to, but that's my ideal first round
pick I.

Speaker 1 (21:36):
It's fine, you know, it's I'd always I'm very I
don't like to kind of think about like, oh, who's
someone going to take or who's someone of the picks.
I don't want to influence anything from me, But in
my head, like all day, I was like, I feel
like he's gonna have Grant in round one. It's kind
of like where my head was going. And I avoid,
Like I said this on the show before, I avoid
as much draft content from the world as I can

(21:58):
because I don't want anyone to infl wins, like even
if it's conscious or like subconsciously, I don't want anyone
to influence my thoughts or my evaluations or my board.
So I avoid everything from the world until I'm done.
And I'm a little late this year, so I've avoid
kind of everything. But yeah, I thought I had a
feeling you would go with Grant a little bit because
we I DMD you about him a couple weeks ago.

(22:18):
I like Kenneth Grant, and I've said it on the show.
You know, honestly, I agree with your evaluation completely. The
thing I disagree with, and it's not necessarily from you,
I get. I hear a lot from fans and even
from evaluators that talk about him like he's just this,
like drop him in, drop him in the middle of
your defense, and he's a cure all for like everything

(22:40):
you have going on against the Run in the past.
And I don't think he is that specifically from the
Run standpoint. I think he plays more towards for being
a bigger guy. He plays towards more of the penetration
and the athleticism that he can kind of have, which
is also awesome, Like watching him hit that quick swim
move that he seems to do like every single game

(23:02):
on the snap and you just watch some guard face
plant and then he takes two steps and explodes into
the backfield. Is making a play. It's just it's it's
really nice to see. And there are times I've watched
so many games on him. I watched nine games on
him because every time I think I'm solid, I see
somebody like I get in the back of my mind. Man,
if I really seen everything, am I off on this?

(23:24):
And I like him. I think the ceiling is exciting,
like you talked about, because he has traits that you
shouldn't be able to move like that at like three
hundred and thirty pounds, and it's not like a fake
three hundred and thirty, like oh, but he really weighs
like three fifteen. Now he hits a real three thirty.
He plays at that three thirty, and he moves. He's
got good lower body like flexibility to be able to

(23:45):
like turn and move. He can adjust. There was one
that I posted today against oh I don't remember who
was against, but him and Mason Graham met at the
quarterback and he goes through the center, but the center
tries to like push him out towards the right guard,
and he's able to put his left foot in the
ground and have some ankle flexion and repivot and instead

(24:06):
of getting kind of ridden upfield and around the quarterback,
he's able to turn and then go through the guard
on his way to the QB. And it's just that
type of movement with the size that's so intriguing. I
like Kenneth Grant, I don't love him as much as you.
I would not be disappointed if they took him at thirty.
I've always just kind of thought, I guess as we've

(24:28):
gone forward, I think it's been a higher there's been
a higher chance in my mind that I think he
could be there. I always just kind of thought both
he and Derek Harmon would be off the board by thirty,
and now that we've gotten closer, I think there's a chance.
I still think it's a smaller chance that Harmon is there.
I do think there's a chance that Grant is there
at thirty. But to your point, I think I could
see the Bills passing, which is also intriguing, and I

(24:50):
feel like so many fans of that. I feel like
that would kill the fan base. So many things would
be on that train and could at nite one if
he's there and they pass on him, I feel like
that would set people.

Speaker 2 (25:00):
Yeah, I think Bill's mafia get prepared for that. I mean, honestly,
it's pick thirty, like don't be married as certain outcomes,
that's just a sure fire away to get yourself disappointed. Man.
So I mean, I feel like I'm probably one of
the leaders in the clubhouse for the excitement over Kenneth
Grant and maybe that there's a lot of influence there,
And I mean, I can't deny the way that I feel,

(25:23):
But I also I also am not fully convinced he'll
be the Bill's pick, even if they have the opportunity
to pick him.

Speaker 1 (25:29):
Yeah that's fair, But yeah, I would not be opposed
to him, you know, being there around one my two
biggest things, and you mentioned both of them. Just playing
a bit high and or like upright at times, I
think gets kind of caught with a narrow base as well,
and I think that kind of like results in like
some of the horizontal displacement you get from him, and
then you have a pass rush plan piece he'll stall
out as a rusher if he doesn't kind of win
with that initial move, then he kind of stalls out,

(25:51):
and you're kind of looking for more development from a
plan perspective, but in getting through more tape. I just
I also think too from a schematic standpoint, playing within
Wink Martindale's scheme. I don't want to say it did
him a disservice in twenty twenty four, but I feel
like he was doing stuff that wasn't I want to
see him just I don't want to do a lot
of games with him, and like, Okay, we got a
five down front and we're dropping Josiah Stewart into coverage

(26:14):
and we're gonna have Grant kind of loop around and
go one on one with the tackle. Same thing with
Mason Graham, Like I want him going one on one
on the interior with guards or centers and just let him.
Let him play in a one gapping front and just go.
And I think he can anchor well enough. I don't
think he's the run defender he gets made out to be.
But I mean, he's a guy who offers you some
pass rush upside, some run defense upside, all in this

(26:37):
size and athleticism package that is rare from a traits piece.
So yeah, I could get on board with that if
he was the guy at thirty. I'm still wrestling with
mine right now because of kind of what you said.
So the two for me, I'm in a very similar
boat with your initial lead in I think you know,
defensive tackle, corner, edge are the big three right now

(26:58):
at this point, I feel very comfortable with the I
feel most comfortable, i should say, with the edges that
I think would be available in round two. That for me,
in round one, I'm focused on corner or defensive tackle,
and everything for me comes down to the talent cliffs
for you, value proposition for me, how much I like
the corners that I think will be there at thirty

(27:19):
versus how much I like the corners at fifty six
or sixty two. And then the same thing for the
defensive tackle piece. In an ideal world, for me, the
most ideal, the most perfect. If Derek Harmon falls to thirty,
I would go with that. I don't think he's gonna
be there. I think there's a chance kind of grant
is there, but I feel like he might not be

(27:39):
there yet. I'm gonna stick with my initial gut, and
I'm not just sticking with this because I've been on
it for so long. I've been a fan of this
player since a week before the combine. He's gained more
traction as we've gone along. I feel like he's kind
of I feel like he's a big bandwagon pick from
a corner perspective right now, I'm gonna go with tray
Amos to start somebody who just fits what I want

(28:02):
the Bills to gravitate towards when it comes to a
corner two. I want somebody who can squeeze passing windows,
restrict airspace. And his comfortability and effectiveness when playing press
is just something I gravitate towards. And his ability to
stay in phase to a combination of length and footwork
I like as well. My biggest questions on him were

(28:24):
change of direction and long speed. I still do think
there's some change of direction questions, and even though he
ran like a four four three, I still don't I
don't necessarily know if he plays the at that speed,
but I'm not overly too concern And it's the combination
of his ability again to play that press, to play
man stay in phase, but then also the zone coverage capability,
his ability to fall off and collect when you know,

(28:47):
based on the route distribution, to be able to play
match coverages against a variety of body types. You know,
you're watching him cover Mason Taylor downfield against LSU, and
then he's covering you know, kind of smaller type of
scat type of receivers outside. Then he's covering your typical
protipic like X or even ZS and he can do
a lot of things from a coverage standpoint. The size
and frame are intriguing. I don't think he's the most

(29:07):
physical or you know, dominant run defender as a corner,
but he's solid enough, he's willing, and he is technical
to a degree in terms of his force and his fits.
And a lot of this too comes down for me
the corners that I think will be available, like if
you could guarantee me, like the next person I'm about
to say has some off the field stuff, which kind

(29:27):
of money's like, if you could guarantee me that, like
Maxwell Harriston would be there at fifty six, or like
Savonnervel would be there at fifty six. This might change
my tune a little bit. And there are other corners
that I like, like I do like A Z Thomas,
and I do think Ben Morrison is a fun one.
And I have somebody who I really really really really
really love who I'm not going to mention right now

(29:48):
that like has been climbing up my board as we've
gone higher in this draft process. But I just really
love Trey Amos's game, and I think how he fits
his corner too, alongside Christian Benford. And then what I
think the Bills could still get from an interior defensive
line standpoint based on the role I would like them
to cove it in round two. So I'm going to
lead off here with Trey Amos for pick thirty.

Speaker 2 (30:11):
Trey Amos if it was my other choice, if I
didn't go with Kenneth Grant. But what's interesting, and certainly
when I get to my analysis for my pick at
fifty six, there's a lot of parallels and the reasons
why you pick Tree Amos for the reasons that I'm
going to pick the corner that I'm going to pick
eventually here, but if the Bills do pick a corner
in the first round, I think the realistic one that

(30:33):
you'd like to get is Trey Amos because I think
he is the most appropriate value if he were to
make it to pick thirty, and I do love the
versatile skill set that he offers. It's funny that you
mentioned that he doesn't necessarily play to the time speed.
I chalk that up to I think he loves to
play from the trail and bait throws because I thought

(30:54):
there was some vertical separation, but it almost felt intentional
to me, where he's like, okay, yeah, go ahead and
shoot this on the field. I'm going to make a
play on the ball.

Speaker 1 (31:01):
I also think he's a he's a smooth strider, and
those type of guys who have that smooth of a gate,
it makes me feel like, are you like not really
running Like I remember one of my notes that I
was like, is he not yes? Like that, yeah, yes,
And but then you see him stay with guys and
it's like, yeah, oh, okay, I guess it's fine. So
some of it's the stride and the trail piece that's
a good call, but.

Speaker 2 (31:23):
I would love that selection, and I think the Bills
will like his story as well as a Louisiana Sunbelt
player that levels up and proves it in the SEC,
which is exactly what Ocyrus Torrance did with Louisiana to Florida.
So I think this is a very realistic player and
that the scenario that I'm preparing myself for is literally
Kenneth Grant to be there at thirty in addition to

(31:45):
Treemos and the Bills picking Tremos. I I feel like
that's kind of a buzzy trajectory for this pick, but
it just it makes a lot of sense, and I mean,
I hope it happens like that. That would that would
be a scenario that I'd be very, very satisfied with
because I do think you're getting appropriate value where I

(32:06):
just don't know if that would be the case for
other corners in this range.

Speaker 1 (32:10):
Yeah, That's where I'm at, Like I draw the line.
There was times where I've kind of flirted back and
forth with Okay, like if they had to go corner
round one, would I'd be happy if it was literally
anyone else other than Amost and the two that I
came around most with were Revel and Hairston, but Hairston's
got some size and frame and tackling concerns that bother

(32:32):
me aside from off the field, Like I want to
put that out there so people know that we're aware
of it, but also like I don't know what if
there's fire to that smoke, what the interview process has
been like so all we can do, like we talked
a eartlier, is just great what the tape is, but
some of the size and frame and tackling stuff concerns
me a bit. Revel is somebody who I like, but
and this is a personal preference type of thing, but

(32:53):
I think it shows on the tape. High cut guys
in general kind of scare me. And then how high
cut he is as a corner I think that lead
you see him not kind of be able to sink
the hips at times to the top of breaks, and
it leads to separation. These pockets of separation get created
against him because he is a high cut guy. But

(33:13):
on the you know, the inverse of that, he's got
this long stride that allows him to kind of, you know,
make up ground if he does get beat or separation
does occur. Those are the other two corners that I
flirted with, like would I be comfortable with these guys
in round one? And I've got to the point where
if it was one of them, I wouldn't hate it,
But I'm if it's not Amos in round one, I

(33:34):
would probably not look corner. It's kind of where I've
settled now at this point.

Speaker 2 (33:40):
I tend to agree with that. Yeah, other corners just
figure it out in the second round. Amos are I mean,
of course Jay Baron if he hits thirty man, so
we'll see. I don't know, I think that guy's going
to go in the top fifteen.

Speaker 1 (33:55):
But yeah, yeah, I'm interested to see what he what
he comes like. If there is any do teams view
Barons as an outside guy who can live on a help.

Speaker 2 (34:04):
So he had his past year as an outside corner
this past year.

Speaker 1 (34:09):
I would love him to go to like a team
that like I think of what the Cardinals do with
their DBS, and I'd love him to go to like
a team like the Cardinals that does like just puts
do like goes dime a bunch and just doing crazy
things with Buddha Baker and Garrett Williams and like see
what Baron could do is inside outside, dime linebacker, all
this stuff. But yeah, his tape of him playing on

(34:31):
the outside this year and then what you could do
again with him on third downs. I feel like that.
I think he's an outside corner who can do the
creative schematic things, which is such a fun option. Yeah.
I don't see him falling, but I would you is there?
I'll say this and then we'll move on to the
round two. Guys, is there anyone you would trade up

(34:54):
for in round one? And if you did, like, how
close would it like? Ok, if Baron's there at pick
twenty or Mikel. Well, I'm just throwing out names from people.
They if Mikel Williams is there at like twenty or
something like that. Is there anybody for you that you
would be like, Okay, I'll trade up? Or are you cool?
Just sitting? No matter what?

Speaker 2 (35:12):
So what did what? Did Charles Robinson come out today
and say that if Baron gets to twenty one that
the Bills could trade up with Pittsburgh and the deal
would be thirty. It would be twenty one and eighty
three for thirty and fifty six. I do that for
Baron at twenty one, so thirty and fifty six for

(35:36):
twenty one and eighty three. I do that bad at all. Yeah,
I would do that.

Speaker 1 (35:40):
Yeah, you get a third, you lose one of your seconds,
but you move up, you get baron, you get a third,
and you still have.

Speaker 2 (35:46):
You still have three picks in the in the day one,
day two, right, Yes, you.

Speaker 1 (35:50):
Still have three picks in the top eighty eighty eighty three.
And the strength of this draft is right there, in
my opinion, between rounds two, three and like the start
of four. So you're still in the meat and the crux.
You can still address other things. Yeah, I would do that.

Speaker 2 (36:00):
And you still have one on nine and one thirty two.
If you wanted to trade up into the third round again,
do that Dawson Knox trade. So so I like that.
The other thing is less complicated. My willingness to move
up in the first round is connected to how high
up does one O nine get me? And the math
on that and the one and the math on that

(36:20):
says about pick twenty six, that's fair. So that would
be my appetite. And I can understand, like there's some
teams with similar needs right around the bills, So I
could understand how that would be a useful trade up,
so that that's my trade up appetite for the bills
in round one.

Speaker 1 (36:38):
That's fair. I'm in a similar quote. I I'm also
torn again like gin it just over my overall philosophy
with how inexactive a science the draft is. I prefer
as many swings at the plate as possible, So I
like to keep all of like the picks. But if
you can in a draft like this where you have
so many Day three guys, I don't mind, or Day
three picks, I should say, I don't mind trying to
sacrifice some of that capital to get more Day two

(37:00):
who picks or move up slightly in round one. So yeah,
Baron was there in the early twenties, or I'm gonna
similar if somebody is there that you really like it
twenty five or twenty six, I'm comfortable doing that. I
don't want to sacrifice too much, just because again the
inexact nature of everything, and I don't want to put
too many eggs in one basket, even though it's a
different situation it kind of had. I'm just I'm hesitant
of all time von Miller all the eggs in that basket.

(37:21):
That basket broke, Like what happened? I don't know. I
just sketched out, sketched out any other thoughts on round
one before we move on to a round two.

Speaker 2 (37:28):
No, I think we see it pretty similarly. And I
think this is where it gets interesting because now you're
kind of getting away from the first round and maybe
there's some personal flavor that'll trickle into these sticks.

Speaker 1 (37:43):
Yeah, yes, yes, let's move on to round two where, yeah,
there is some personal flavor that can kind of trickle
in here. And I also think an interesting piece as well.
The So what I want to do here, let's talk
about pick fifty six. First, you do your pick fifty six,
I'll do mine. Then we'll go to sixty two. What
I do think is interesting here, and I kind of
want to ask you this question before you give your answers,

(38:03):
because the bills right as of right now don't have
another pick between sixty two and one oh nine. Does
that kind of influence you at all in your preference
in terms of like reaching for somebody, like is there
somebody who you think, like, man, this guy is a
higher ceiling, but I think he's more of like a
round three type of guy. I think he's a guy
that I wouldn't really necessarily initially take a sixty two,

(38:25):
but because they have to wait so long, screw it,
I'll take it. Is there kind of those reachie, are
there more reach possibilities for you at sixty two because
there's that gap between that and one o nine?

Speaker 2 (38:34):
Yeah? Probably so. But I think this is where you
can talk yourself into trading out of thirty, trading back.
You know, there's a good chance that Trey Amos is
not there at pick thirty or kind of Grant and
we're really kind of ciphering through the prospects that you
and I would probably say, yeah, you wouldn't love him
at thirty, right, And I think that's what we liked
about Grant and Amos is it's like, okay, yeah, that

(38:57):
would be a you feel like you're getting a first
round player. I think there's a good chance the Bills
won't get a first round player at pick thirty, And
that's why trading out makes a lot of sense to me,
because that would give you that would potentially fill in
that void of you said sixty two to one o
nine that he'll gets you back in the third round.
Brandon means never not had a third round pick, by
the way, good point. And every time that he entered

(39:19):
a draft not having a third round pick, he got
one to one and it's happened. It's happened three times.
So like it Like this is he wants to pick
in the third round, he's going to And so I
think you could just like last year's trade back with
KC that got them the third round pick that they
traded away for Rasoul Douglas. Right, So move back from
thirty if certain players aren't there you don't want to

(39:41):
trade away from. You know, there's certain plays you want
to trade away from. Yes, so move back, get yourself
at three, and then you kind of fill in that void,
and you're still wind up with probably a similar player
to what you would have got at thirty. Plus you
have now three picks or well I guess it would
be four picks on day two.

Speaker 1 (39:58):
Yes, I'm the scenario that I keep thinking that I
would like from a value perspective, I love the idea of,
like again, just making up spots. But if you can
trade back from like thirty into like from literally thirty
into like the mid thirties or late thirties and then
get a third rounder. I'm like, oh, I'm all about that.

Speaker 2 (40:13):
It's the Saints. The Saints at forty. They got to
come up and get the quarterback, go to forty. I'd
do it. Let them do it.

Speaker 1 (40:18):
Oh you guys want Jackson Dark Cool, here you go.
But I the chaos of like this the perfect storm scenario.
I think of Kenneth Grant being there at thirty and
the Bills trading out of it. Just the doom that
would exist with the fan base for like the second
year in a row, a trade back and they're number
one guy on the board. I just think of like

(40:40):
this perfect storm of chaos that would result if that happened.
But from a brass tax perspective, I would take it like,
give me, give me that third pick, especially if you've
got like a handful of dudes and okay, we're okay.
If we think these guys will still fall with maybe
the value isn't right here. I think that's a very
very fair point. Yeah, but this day too is really interesting,
even as just as it sits right now with the
Bills at fifty six and sixty two. So you let

(41:02):
off with Kenneth Grant being your start to this draft
at pick thirty. Now we're sitting here, it's pick fifty six.
What do you got here is we continue to build
out your perfect Buffalo Bills draft class in twenty twenty five.

Speaker 2 (41:14):
This might be a little bit of a surprise, but
it's my personal flavor, okay. And this is the spot
where I want to pick the corner.

Speaker 1 (41:21):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (41:22):
And you talked about picking Trey Amos because of some
of the signals it would give you about how the
Bills could use them and what it means for the
coverage schemes. It may be being a little bit more
aggressive and tighter in coverage. Well, that's exactly why I'm
going to go with the corner that I'm picking here.

Speaker 1 (41:41):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (41:42):
Jacob Parrish, Oh yeah, okay, I love it.

Speaker 1 (41:46):
I'm on board, okay.

Speaker 2 (41:48):
Jacob Parrish out of Kansas State for two primary reasons.
Number one, I love Jacob Parrish. I think he's a
freaking good football player. He's young, just turned twenty one
in February. My comp for him is DJ and oh,
Kansas State as well, so you kind of get that parallel.
But you know a player that some people might get

(42:09):
lazy and say, oh, this is a nickel. It's not
he's not. He wasn't a nickel corner at three years
of Kansas State. He's played on the outside, and people
think he's small. He's not small. He's just a little short.
He's on hundred ninety one pounds with thirty one inch arms. Yeah,
he's just a tick under five ten.

Speaker 1 (42:23):
So he's just a share against Oklahoma State and against Arizona,
two teams with big wide receivers. He battles against him.
He makes plays like, yeah, he can live on the outside.

Speaker 2 (42:32):
I love that, you see that. I'm I'm sorry to you.
I'm very excited, one hundred percent. Yeah, it's a lazy take,
but so I love him. And he's a corner with
a wrestling background, so surely Sean mcdermot's gonna love that.
But so the player aside, I love the player sticky, right,
that's also this dude in man coverage is sticky and

(42:54):
you want to take the air out of routes. It's
just like Jacob Parrish. Okay, he can he can do that.
The other piece is what this would mean schematically. You know,
if the Bills and were to invest a pick like
this in Jacob Parrish, they're telling us that they're gonna
play tighter, right, they're gonna you'd be silly. You're not
gonna play You're not drafting. You're not drafting Jacob Parish

(43:14):
for him to sit in the half turn and play
cover three.

Speaker 3 (43:17):
Man.

Speaker 2 (43:17):
You know, like you want to get in the face
of guys. You want him to play mirror match. You
want he's you know, he's a physical downhill player as well,
that could tackle. You want to tap into all the
things that he would bring. So I love the player,
but I also love what the player would mean for
the scheme. And so if you're gonna wait on the corner, boy,
give me this guy. I mean, there's other guys that'd

(43:39):
be happy with, but realistic, I think you can get
him at fifty six. I'd be over the moon if
that's the direction the Bills went with their high pick
at corner.

Speaker 1 (43:48):
Oh man, So I'm I oh, I think I posted
him being like one of my guys that I love,
And I think you commented like last week, I say,
I think we talked about Paris a little. But yeah,
I was on Twitter when that happened. He's somebody who
I came on to two weeks ago, three weeks ago,
as I was kind of finishing corner, and initially when
I watched him, he was like, my my perfect hope

(44:12):
is okay, you take a corner on day one or
day two. And then this was before Trey White, even
though I don't think that necessarily holistically changes how you
should be the corner room, but my thoughts going into
this draft at that time was get yourself a corner early,
get yourself another corner on day three. And my perfect
like my dream scenario was Amos at thirty and then
Jacob Parrish at like one oh nine. And then as

(44:32):
I started going forward, I was like, you don't think
he's gonna be there in round four? And then I
watched more and I was like, okay, you don't have
to get a third round pick. And now so I
literally have in my notes written here for the second round,
I wrote, if they GOCB at fifty six or sixty two,

(44:53):
you know, and and and it's the most ideal world
maybe potentially savone novel or Maxwell Harriston fall, but my
the deal target based on evaluation plus realistic shot of
being there is Jacob Parrish.

Speaker 2 (45:05):
I just trust it, brother, Trust it the tape.

Speaker 1 (45:10):
And so those who don't know Joe gave some some
piece of formc SO five ten one hundred and ninety
one pounds four three five forty good explosion and speed
testing as well. Eighty eight percentile on the broad jump,
seventy second percentile on the vert seventy fifth percent out
for his ten yards split. Uh, somewhat shorter arms, but
not too short. He's in the twenty eight percent out
for arm length. My comp for him because of the

(45:31):
inside outside and the tenacity. They're not the same body
type of the same necessarily like frame fit. I mean
this in a very very positive way. I keep calling
him a poor man's Trent McDuffie, but Trent McDuffie's an
all pro corner, so a poor version of that.

Speaker 2 (45:46):
Mcduffey wishes he had Jacob Parrish's length.

Speaker 1 (45:49):
That's fair, Nick, Yeah, I was say mcduffey's got him
and my Creer are both like the t Rex arms
Kings in that draft class. The one the first game
I watched of his was against Arizona State, and watching
him fit on duo and sticks scataboo in the hole
the first time he gets different. That's different he fits

(46:11):
The first time he fits him, it's chest on knee,
beautiful formed up tackle gets him. He's down. The second one,
it's a third and one, and he meets him at
the line and drops him like full body shoulder into
same like, same same leg, same shoulder bang, pops him,
drops him down. I think Scat falls forward and gets
the first down by like a half an inch, but

(46:33):
Paris popped him, and I it like pirked me up
big time. And I just kept watching more and more
and more the inside, outside, versatility, the just everything that
he brings. I also like he's got good feet, he's
got calm, quiet feet, he's got a good kickstep even
when he's in off, and he's kind of like backing
up and playing zone a little bit. His ability to

(46:54):
locate the football, I just I feel like in my notes,
I kept writing like physical and tenacious, over and over, real, twitchy,
good breaks on the ball, He drives and he closes quickly.
And then yeah, like you put him in press and
the lethleticism, the feet translate like he can soft shoe
press all day. But then he also likes physicality, so
he'll give you a true press. He'll jam you, like
he'll stick a hand or two right in your chest,

(47:17):
so you got to chop him off to get him
off you, but then he's still right there in your
pocket and in phase and attached to you. I like
his tape so much. The biggest concerns I have for
him or and again I hate going with this because
because he's smaller, it's necessarily not Bigger bodies at times
give him issues on blocks and then the breaks and routes,
like there's times where bigger receivers kind of like go

(47:38):
through him at collision points and he goes down a bit.
And then every once in a while on his footwork,
I call it like he double clutches at times when
planning and driving, Like he'll be in like a pedal
and he drops and instead of just like singing the
hips and going, it's almost like he bang bang and
then goes forward. But then there's good explosion coming out
of it. He's one of my favorite players in this

(47:59):
entire class. I love him tremendously, and this is yeah,
if that I've he's crept up. So I'm gonna finish
my corner rankings and put it out either tomorrow or
probably Thursday, morning or afternoon. He's crept his way significantly
into my top ten. I just need to figure out
where just I just love his game so much.

Speaker 2 (48:19):
Sounds like you should be pretty high. You've just salivated
over this that Gigs guy for like five minutes.

Speaker 1 (48:25):
He's so good. It's just it's just and you don't
get that type of it's the coverage ability with like
the ability to play the run. And I feel like
he gets used so much because oh, you're talking about
him as a good run defender. That means because like
he can't cover, like no, he can cover and fit
in the run is freaking important now in football, especially

(48:45):
when you're trying to play these two high structures like
the Bills doing cool. You want to play some cover two.
That means that cloud corner is your force defender on
the outside. He got to come up and fit the run.
And you're gonna play these teams that want to run
duo and they want to get that outside corner to
be the block guy and let their running back bounce
it cool. Can you're running back outside or I'm sorry,
can your corner outside come up and stick somebody? Paris

(49:07):
can stick anybody like it doesn't matter how big they are.
Oh man, yeah, oh, I like that a lot. I'm
super happy that you said, parish Man, I.

Speaker 2 (49:16):
Think we're good here. I mean sounds like yell, you
both love this one at fifty six. That's a good pick.

Speaker 1 (49:21):
I like that. Well done, all right, So I'll go
with my fifty six and so again I went with
Trey A. Mos at thirty. So here is where I'm
looking for interior defensive line. Now at this point you
talked about it with Kenneth Grant, like, obviously you want
somebody who's you know, a run defender, but you want
somebody who can still you know, penetrate make plays behind
the line. And you still obviously get somebody who can

(49:42):
still be some semblance of or have some semblance of effectiveness,
I should say, in rushing the quarterback in a super
super ideal world. I'm gonna talk out of both sides
of my mouth a little bit here. If Tyleek Williams fell,
I'd be all over this. I don't think he's gonna fall,
even with the injury concerns. I love Tyleek william what
he is as a run defender from a physicality standpoint,

(50:03):
but also from a block, recognition and scheme understanding standpoint.
I love like you watch like his hit, the guard
in front of him is pulling, He's immediately getting his
eyes to the tackle, and he recognizes the scheme. He
flows down the line, makes the stop like. He's a
very heady player in addition to being a mountain of
a man, physical, violent inside. Not the best pass rusher,
but I think he has more athleticism in juice than

(50:25):
he gets credit for. Not like Kenneth Grant, but he
can create some knockback. He can compress the pocket or
compromise the depth of the pocket a little bit, but
he's still primarily a run defender. All that being said,
if he fell, I'm jumping at him at fifty six.
I don't think he's gonna fall. Also, somebody who I'd
be very interested with at fifty six is Darius Alexander
from Toledo. I don't think he's gonna be there either.

(50:48):
His I initially thought of him like, okay, the length
and the size and what he can do as a
pass rusher, but he was a much better run defender
than I thought he was gonna be. I know the
game I keep going to I know Mississippi State isn't
a pot, but they're still a team with the SEC
and some size and talent on the offensive line, and
watching him drop the knee and anchor as a run
defender inside really got me excited for what he could be.

(51:11):
I think he's better as a three tech and primarily
in that role, but with his size and length and
frame and what the Bills have done primarily at one tech,
I could see him being a one for the Bills
dayway he's at three hundred and five pounds. They had
daikuon shed weight to be basically between three oh seven
and three ten for his ten year here with the Bills,
so I don't think it's out of the realm of
possibility that he plays one. In him and Ogunjobi, who

(51:34):
Ogunjobe can play someone a little bit, although I think
he's more of a three as well, but I think
he could get by this year still have some effectiveness
geared more towards penetration, and then you have Alexander being
the three next year. If Ogun Joey has a caback
or whatever, I think both of those guys would be
really fun. I don't think they're going to be there,
so my pick at fifty six based on need and
the most realistic option, I think Alfred Collins from Texas.

(51:57):
Now I'll start with the negative because this is what
concerned the most. There's just not really anything from a
pass perspective with Alfred Collins. He's got this spin move
that he just doesn't do any like. He just stands
in place as he spins. He doesn't go anywhere with it.
There's not a lot of plan moves, skill set anything
from a pass RUSS perspective. It's more of, Okay, can

(52:18):
I use my very long arms and just knock somebody
back and kind of do something with that. So you're
not gonna get a ton of pass rush pop from
Alfred Collins. But what he is as a run defender prototypical,
one tech textbook stack and shed, the hand placement, the
violence in his hands, the pop in his hands, and
just with those extremely long arms eighty five inch wingspan.

(52:39):
It's the second largest for any defensive tackle measured at
the combine in the last three years, and his arm
length is the seventh largest for any defensive tackle measured
in the last three years. And he plays to it power, leverage,
strength inside, He's just chucking dudes to the ground left
and right when he's shutting them like chuck and tackles
and guards the violence on the inside. He's just the

(53:00):
nass kicker against the run. And what he could bring
from a force multiplier standpoint, this is the way I
kind of like reason it, like, okay, because you're not
gonna get a ton of pass rush pop. But I
think what he could do in terms of helping the
Bills defense from a light box perspective is I think
it's a bit of a force multiplier aspect, and so
you're playing numbers in coverage, relying on the other three
guys to kind of generate some pass rush. But just yeah,

(53:23):
what he does on or against the run, against the
ground game, just everything for him is just he's limiting
displacement and he's literally throwing guys out of gaps while
not getting moved out of his I think he's a
real plus plus plus run defender. If he was just
average as a pass rusher, I think he'd be a
first round player like Solid. If he was just average,

(53:44):
he's unfortunately, in my estimation, below that. But I think
he fills a niche role which could help them now
and beyond. So he would be my pick at fifty
six based on his skill set and the realistic nature
that he's there.

Speaker 2 (53:56):
What I'd love about Alfred Collins is how much I
think the rest of the front the front seven in general,
could benefit from him. You know, obviously the Bills like
to play like boxes, but they also play with a
lot of lighter players on the second level. I mean,
where you know, Terran's gonna have to fill the b
gap at times. Torel Bernard's not big. He's two hundred
and twenty load, two twenty five something like that. Milano's

(54:18):
not huge, and so I think when you have this
type of presence that you know, not only is a
space eater that can occupy blocks and be firm, but
you know, really allow those guys to run to the football,
I think you're going to get more out of those players.
And like you said, not a huge pass rush profile,
but if you do want to have him as the
guy that can kind of like cave and create lanes

(54:39):
and angles for other guys, like I think he can
be a pocket pusher to get some value there. Well,
you know he's not going to be a good one
v one, you know, beating guys. I think he can
help the rest of the rush group at times. Of course,
you know too many you're not putting this guy on
the field, but you know there's situations where he can
help you. He's not a complete loss cause on passing downs.
I wonder if the Bills are in on him. I

(55:01):
don't you know what I mean, Like, I wonder.

Speaker 1 (55:03):
But he's a guy that again, like doesn't necessarily fit
the profile from a style standpoint, because they want again
if it needed to put in perspective, they're getting displaced
left and right last year on the interior and you
have Ileankhu sitting there. They didn't care. They were like, no,
give me Quittin Jefferson, give me Jordan Phillips, give me
the pass rush over the run defense. Which is why again,
like someone like Darius Alexander, I think like fits their profile,

(55:25):
even though people will be like, but he's only three
oh five, he's more of a three. But the Bills
would play a guy like that at one.

Speaker 2 (55:30):
Yeah. Josh Farmer, I think is another guy that really
fits the Bills in terms of their their one tech preferences.

Speaker 1 (55:36):
Yeah, I agree. I agree. Farmer's a guy who I
I like him, but I have more of a hard
three on him. But I can understand him creeping into
the second round because again, you have that gap between
fifty six and sixty two and one oh nine, and
he's just I described Josh Farmer as being literally like

(55:56):
a battering ram with arms attached to it. I just
think of like what the Orcs tried to do in
the second Lord of the Rings, where they're trying to
bash down a battering ram forward back, and that's just
what Farmer is. This linear, straight line, get off explosion.
He's gonna run through you, and it's terrifying when it happened.
He plays like King Kong thirty man yep, long arms,

(56:17):
which fits the profile. They like it can anchor a bit,
but also can get some penetration and some juice. I
do think, yeah, he is h Yeah, he's in that
realm as well for them, all right. I like where
we're at right now. I like the Parish pick. I
kind of don't want to do anything after that because
my excitement will not.

Speaker 2 (56:31):
Yeah, I don't know, I feel like that was the
we peaked right ter. I was like, I don't know,
the rest of the show is not going to be
that good, there's nowhere to go but down. I thought
you might have been a little surprised that I did that.
So yeah, I.

Speaker 1 (56:42):
I just I don't get it's cool to see again
because I keep my head in the sand on like
everyone's analysis, like I'm not. I'm not consuming any draft
content aside from watching tape and doing my charts and
evaluations and building out my board. So all these thoughts
I had have art to myself, like and and so

(57:03):
I'm sitting here having conversations with myself at midnight watching
Kansas State versus Oklahoma State, and I'm like, man, I
really like Jacob Parrish. I think he's going to be
in my top ten. And I'm like, is that crazy?
But I don't have anyone to talk to about it
because I don't want to be spoiled. So it's cool
to see someone who I respect organically be in that
realm with me. And it was, yeah, it was super cool.
I've yeah, it was very very pleased with that.

Speaker 2 (57:24):
All right.

Speaker 1 (57:25):
So we've gone thirty and fifty six, We've each gone
corner and defensive tackle, and now we sit here at
pick sixty two for the Bills, their second pick in
round two. What do you got for pick sixty two?

Speaker 2 (57:38):
AP I want upside, you know, That's what I'm looking for.
I want these defensive players to not only help the
Bills evolve schematically, but have a ceiling that's exciting to
develop into, not baseline and you can get a solid player.
I want chances to get some real, real impact guys.

(58:00):
And so we're going to take a swing here. And
maybe this is a player that kind of fits into
the pitfall that you were talking about, where maybe you'd
rather pick him in the third, but you're kind of
without the third, so you kind of have to pick
him a little bit higher.

Speaker 1 (58:12):
I think your answer is what my answer is, I
can I I'm sorry to continue. I think I kind
of want to guess it.

Speaker 2 (58:18):
You can guess it. I'll tell you.

Speaker 1 (58:20):
Is it all the day?

Speaker 2 (58:20):
Ho oh brother olu Ola day who ho? Sorry, UCLA.
The ceiling here is just really high. Is six three
two sixty thirty three and three eights on the arm length.
This guy played stackbacker firm up until two games into

(58:41):
the season this year, and he goes in, he transfers, transfers,
transitions down to playing on the edge, and what this
guy showed in you know, the back ten games or
whatever of the season is just really really tantalizing, and
it's about upside. I mean, what's very impressive of what
he put on tape. He's quick, he's long, he's bendy,

(59:04):
he's got power at the point of attack. He's got
a dense build. I think he might have the best
motor in the class. I think that maybe Josiah Stewart
and ty Robinson and maybe even Tyleek Williams might have
something they want to say about the motor. But this
guy's off the charts man, an unrelenting football player, and
of course he's a work in progress. He's not even

(59:25):
played a season on the edge. But that's what I'd
love about him as the idea here that the need
that the Bills have on the edge is not really
about anything right now. It's about Joey Bosa as an
expiring contract in ajpiness as an expiring contract, and the
boast of things is gonna go one or two ways.
It's either gonna not work and the Bills are not
gonna want him back, or it's gonna work and he's
gonna hit age thirty one in free agency. With his

(59:48):
last chance to get a big deal, and he's gonna
go get a big deal and it's not gonna be
from the Bills. So it's a one year thing with
Bosa at Panessa. Is he gonna get a third contract
from the Bills?

Speaker 3 (59:58):
You know?

Speaker 1 (59:58):
What I mean?

Speaker 2 (59:58):
Is like a like a perfectly fine, like rotational fourth
defensive end. Is that a three contract player? So I'm
thinking about this guy really for twenty twenty six. And
this is the type of player that I mean. If
this player, this guy spent his entire college career on
the edge, we might be talking about Michael Parsons or
Jamin Walker. So let's go ahead and pull the trigger

(01:00:21):
here at the end of the second round, even if
it's a red shirt year. But I feel confident this
guy could play teams. Yeah, I mean, Javon had Solomon
was like a four phace teams player. Surely, surely this
guy could be. He's actually played in space, yep. So
it's all about stealing an upside a swing athletes potential
high impact. That's that's what this comes down to for me.

(01:00:43):
And is it early maybe, But I don't care.

Speaker 1 (01:00:47):
Man, I love the guy, so I I really don't
have too much to add. You essentially said everything. It's funny.
It's funny too because some of what you said, you
and I talked about when I was last time locked
on with you, and we talked about that Bosa proposition,
like if I did the too likely outcomes, he either
balls out and gets back to form, and then he

(01:01:09):
leaves on probably like a two year thirty six million
dollars two year forty million dollar deal that the Bills
aren't bringing him back on, or he gets banged up again.
And then if you're the Bills, do you really want
to dip back into that water again next year? And
then aj Panessa is a UFA. Next year, You've got
like just this interesting edge grouping that technically, on paper,

(01:01:31):
you don't need anyone for twenty twenty five, but you
kind of do because you know what are getting out
of Solomon Hoyts got that suspension, You've got aj Panessa.
But then next year, even more so, like you said,
and for a guy who, yeah, moved from off ball
backer to edge mid season, you let him continue to
simmer and develop a little bit. What I really liked

(01:01:51):
about his tape was watching him be able to put
things together and learn on the fly in games, but
also through this and like watching him play edge in
is what like week two or three when he first
started versus watching him play edge towards the end of
the year. The difference in recognition and an angles and understanding,

(01:02:13):
like there was real practical application to him starting to
understand how to play the edge position from a mental standpoint.
That gave me a ton of hope. So I was like,
it's not just traits, like this is an example of
a guy like and you could see it in games,
like he'd get beat on a run or a play
early in the first quarter and a team would come
back to in the third and wouldn't happen again. Or

(01:02:33):
he'd get beat on that concept in week two or three,
they'd run it early in like week eight or week nine,
not getting beat anymore. And then you add that with
just the length, the strength, the power, the pad level,
eighty second percentile for his vertical jump, seventy second percentile
for the broad jump, forty fifth percentile for arm length.

(01:02:54):
There's just explosion and athleticism within his game. They also
did really cool stuff with him at U say similar
to him, like what the Rams did with Hoyt like
that's spinner type of role where you're lining him up,
you know, inside in the a gap or they're lining
him head up on the center. I also think from
an athleticism standpoint, he fits in very nicely with I'm
a huge fan of simulated pressures and creeper pressures. As

(01:03:16):
you know, now you got this really fun outside you
know player at edge who you can do some spinner
stuff with, but also is functional enough as a low
hole player or a spot dropper at certain elements for
you know, creepers and sims. I just I really like
his game. And then even just the technicality of him
throwing that cross chop that he does, and it varies
in effectiveness, but him throwing it, the timing was good,

(01:03:38):
and then as the season went on he got more
effective with it. And you you know, you do need
to see more development from a plan perspective with the
pass rush or his pass rush arsenal, But I just
have fate. I do have faith that that will happen
as he moves forward, because he is so new to
the position and you saw real tangible improvement from him

(01:03:59):
in this past year. And yeah, and then like you said,
I love the idea of he's the perfect guy to like,
let simmer and let's sit for a year, continue to
learn and develop, play here and there as you need
him to, and then twenty twenty six you really let
him hit the ground running. And Yeah, also, like you said,
he's a guy who I have more. I have more
of a third round grade on him. But because of
the upside and because of the big gap between sixty

(01:04:23):
two and one oh nine, he's somebody that I I
shot up my board a bit and would have no
problem with taking him at sixty two. The only other
edge that I have there that who I really like,
But I think there's a chance he probably goes before
I do. Like JT. Twoey Molowile from Ohio State. Yeah,
and he also fits their mold like power compression, plays

(01:04:44):
the run, but he's not. What I like about him
is he's not completely stiff. There is some lower body
flexibility and movement to his game. There is some juice
that pairs with that power, which is why he's so
effective as a speed to power guy. He's got some
length with him, he's got some hand usage. I like
the that he you know, you have that level of
competition that he's faced for years at Ohio State, the

(01:05:06):
effectiveness that he had within that defense. I think he
I like his play style. I think his play style
fits in with what the bill's like. I think there's
a chance he's there at sixty two, and if he
and and Oladeho were both there, it's a bit of
a fight in my heart. But I really do think
he's going to be gone ahead of there. I think
his floor is like a high end EDGE three, and

(01:05:27):
I think his ceiling is like a mid or a
high tier EDGE two, which is awesome. And that just
makes me think he's gonna go earlier than sixty two.

Speaker 2 (01:05:34):
I wrestled with that as well. My my list, my
short list for Edge was JT. T am Moloau out
of Ohio State and Landon Jackson as well. And I'm like,
those guys are they're not getting sixty two? Yeah, Like
I got I gotta I gotta be real here, So
that's saying. I was like, I gotta go with with
Ola Dejo and I can you know, get in get
into this soapbox about upside So yeah, that's fair.

Speaker 1 (01:05:58):
Yeah, I uh yeah, I like the for like, oh
the most idea, Well, I don't think that's gonna happen.
And yeah, I like that. We're interesting on the same page.

Speaker 2 (01:06:05):
I like it.

Speaker 3 (01:06:05):
I like it. I like it.

Speaker 2 (01:06:06):
All right. Let's so, was that your pick for sixty two?

Speaker 1 (01:06:09):
Yeah? All the day?

Speaker 2 (01:06:10):
Okay, so we were aligned there, all right? So we
you went corner dtackle, I went d tackle corner, and
then we both landed there. That's fun.

Speaker 1 (01:06:19):
Yep. I like that, and I think that's I do
think that, not just kind of patting ourselves on the back,
but I do think that makes a lot of sense
from i'm i'm I could see the alternating either way.
Could be cornerd tackle, could be detackle corner. I think
that could happen either way. I think edge makes the
most sense with that third pick in the first three
picks that they got, just based on who's going to
be there, and I do I think all the day

(01:06:40):
he was a very realistic shot of being there, and
then you pair him with the need and everything. I
think that could be a slam dunk pick.

Speaker 3 (01:06:47):
Oh.

Speaker 1 (01:06:47):
I like that. Yeah, I like to. We're on the
same page there.

Speaker 2 (01:06:49):
All right.

Speaker 1 (01:06:49):
Now, let's pick or anything else on day two before
we move to day three.

Speaker 2 (01:06:53):
I'm good cool.

Speaker 1 (01:06:54):
All right, Now we're gonna move to day three because
of the wealth of picks that the Bills have. On
day three, we're going to talk about Day three more
in terms of high level broad like kind of the
positions we'd like address. We will, you know, mention some
specific players if there's really anyone on our mind that
we really gravitate towards. But this is more of a
high level discussion on day three because I don't want

(01:07:14):
to keep Joe here for four hours while we break
down every single possible pick the Bills have. So, Joe,
when it comes to day three, where's your head at
in terms of the Bills kind of bringing home your
you know, perfect or ideal draft class for them here
in twenty twenty five.

Speaker 2 (01:07:28):
Yeah, we got boxes to check here on day three,
and I think a lot about filling out the roster
and roster ability and just some holes that exist that
are not glaring, but stuff that's worth talking about. So
I'll give you my inventory and I'll try to shoot
some names in along the way here. I would like
to see the Bills out a receiver and a meaningful

(01:07:48):
receiver in terms of skill set. I want speed. I
love for them to get a field stretcher, and based
on the guys they've been meeting with, that's clearly what
they're looking at. They're looking at day three speed receivers. Yeah,
but you can't just be a fat man that doesn't
do anything for me. You got to be able to
do something else. Of course, you got to be fast
and track the ball down the field and give a
legitimate vertical receiving skill set. But there has to be

(01:08:10):
something else because or else your Marquez veled the scantling
and you're just not rosterble. You can't just be the
guy that runs down the field. You have to play
teams or have a return value, be a physical blocker.
So I'm looking for a receiver that can win down
the field and then either provide return upside. Because I

(01:08:33):
don't think Brandon Codrington is safe on this team, and
I think he's a good player. There's a great trade
for the Bills, but I think in Sean McDermott's heart,
he hates that there's no there's nothing else that he gives,
you know, Like even towards the end of the year,
they were moving towards Johnson and Davis on kick returns.
You can't just be a part return ye, Like, there's
no value on playing corner. He doesn't cover kicks and punts.

(01:08:57):
You can't just be a put return.

Speaker 1 (01:08:58):
It's tough.

Speaker 2 (01:08:59):
So if you give me a field stretcher that can
also be the punt returner. Hi Tory Horton out of Colorade. Yeah,
you know, Hi, come on down, you can come do this.
That'd be great. Will trade one nine thirty two to
get you at eighty five, right, that'd be perfect there. Yeah,
Or like an Isaac Tesla out of Arkansas that I
think vertical receiving ability all the confidence in the world. Yeah,

(01:09:22):
might be the best blocking receiver in the class. But
also I have total confidence in his ability to cover
kicks and punts and walk I'll kick some putts, so
that's valuable. That's so wide receiver five like beautiful. I
need that.

Speaker 1 (01:09:33):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:09:34):
I think the Bills need a tight end three. I
think they need a draft a tight end three that's
going to make this roster. Quentin Morris has kind of
been that guy, and maybe he's the fallback, like if
maybe if the draft doesn't go a particular way, he'll
come back to Buffalo. But I think he was probably
looking for an opportunity, right like, yeah, you know it's
it's a He's been a great forface special teamer, gets
on the field a little bit, catches some crazy touchdown

(01:09:55):
every single year. But you know, I think that right
now it's Zach Davidson. Zac Davidson then ring year five.
The dude hasn't done anything in the NFL. I know
he's a fun training camp, preseason guy, and that's great.
Maybe he'll be awesome, but he's uncompeted with right now
to be the tight end three. So draft some tight
end that I think gives you in lineability but has
a special team's profile. Some names I like Mitchell Evans
out of Notre Dame. I like Thomas Faddona out of Nebraska.

(01:10:20):
All right, so you like him too. Those are some,
don't the u c l A kid? The kid names
hard to pronounce. Modivallo.

Speaker 1 (01:10:28):
Yeah, I give up. I've said so many names wrong
this cycle. His name is one I'm going to go with.

Speaker 2 (01:10:32):
So those are some names that I like at the
tight end position. I want a defensive tackle double dip.
You know, I talked earlier about what this rotation looks like.
Right now, give me one give me two right, and
I'd love what I'd love though the guy really love
give me Ty Robinson out of Nebraska. I think he's
I think he's Taylor made for the the duan smooth

(01:10:53):
shack losson role where he can you know, play the
five tech on rundowns and then reduce inside and rush
and the guy's award Daddy Man. Just a player that,
like from a play demeanor standpoint, you love. You'll just
love the way he plays. So I'd love that type
of player to be added, especially if they go with
more of a nose tackle. You know, I think that

(01:11:14):
type of player, So give me the defensive tackle double dip.
I'd love to draft a linebacker that can bump Bayalen
Spector off this roster and give them even more intriguing depth.
If this is Milano's last year, I think Dorian Williams
is in line to be the starter in twenty twenty six,
but I'd like there's to be some good competition there
and and depth. Right, Like, Dorrin Williams has had to

(01:11:36):
play a lot, so somebody needs to be Dorian Williams.
If Dorin Williams is now going to be a starter, sure,
so that's a box I'd love to check. I'd love
to get an into your offensive lineman. Maybe get ahead
of some some needs there. Connor McGovern David Edwards, both
expiring contracts. Did not love what mister McGovern said to
you and Eric Turner there at the end of the
episode that had some contract discussions those have been tabled.

(01:11:58):
Would love to stay in buff but business is business,
and said he left money on the table to come
to Buffalo originally. Look at the center market, man, Look
at what Cam Jorgen just got seventeen million a year,
Drew Dolman got year for me, You have a governent's
better than those guys, so or he's at least in
the ballpark, right, This is probably every bit.

Speaker 1 (01:12:17):
Of a still the ability to get like ten to
eleven mil twelve million year like with what the market's
been yet salary keeps going up, so the chance he
could be at that next year well.

Speaker 2 (01:12:26):
And then so you have Edwards and mcgovernor on the
last year of the deal. And then you have Osirius
Torrens who's extension eligible after this year.

Speaker 1 (01:12:32):
Yep.

Speaker 2 (01:12:33):
And the guard market is booming crazy last year and
this year. Everybody had d so you could be he
could push twenty million a season. So well, here's what
I do. An INTI your offensive line, I say, ay Cromer,
who you want? Yes, okay, cool, we'll pick that. We'll
get them. We got whatever one you want. That's that's
that's my solution there. And then give me a punter, man,

(01:12:54):
give me a punter. Okay, you know we got we
got Jake Camarda and Brad Robbins. Brad Robbins is the
worst punter in the league in twenty twenty three, like
literally the worst punter in the league. And I it's funny.
I actually put out a tweet early in the season.
I get twenty twenty four, I said, I think the
biggest positional upgrade in the entire NFL was the Bengals
going from Brad Robbins at punter in twenty twenty three

(01:13:15):
to this It was Sam Recouliser punter this year. I said,
that's the biggest positional upgrade any team's made in the league.
And so and then he gets he gets cut in
twenty twenty four and doesn't get another opportunity. Jay Camarta
cut in twenty twenty four, doesn't get another opportunity if
those are the two players right now, that could be

(01:13:36):
the Bills punter, get one, you know how don't get one?
Get one in the draft, and I don't it probably
cut Brad Robbins. And because Kmart at least had two
seasons of like pretty good punter, I don't know if
he got the yips. I don't know what happens. That's
crazy to be a fourth round punter, to be perfectly
good for two years and then four games into year
three you're cut for performance nuts and the next thing

(01:13:58):
you know, you're you. You don't even have it, you
don't get another chance.

Speaker 1 (01:14:00):
I know. Like that the fact that he like didn't
pick up again with somebody else right away, I thought
that was so super weird.

Speaker 2 (01:14:07):
But these are the guys right now, you know, So
that's that's the piece. Is the punter. So a speed
receiver that does something else besides vertical receiving, tight end
three double dip at D tackle, linebacker for depth with
some upside. I didn't give any names there. I love
Jeffrey Bassa out of Oregon UH safety convert matchup stylebacker

(01:14:29):
poop Paul ole Miss. I think he's I mean, I
don't think he's gonna fit a lot of teams because
of the size profile. But he's literally the same size
as uh to Lbernard Sean Dolac Buffalo. I think is
another guy like those types of players, like not necessarily
my favorite, but they're billsy so they would make sense
to me. I'm punter. That's I think that, that's that's

(01:14:50):
my that's my day. Three boxes a check right there.

Speaker 1 (01:14:53):
I like it a lot, and I this will be
a decently short segment because it's essentially what I got.
I wouldn't I still wouldn't mind them getting another corner
at some point, I'll add, just because Trey is on
one year deal, Dan Jackson's on one year day.

Speaker 2 (01:15:09):
And did you hear the way Bean talked about Dane
Jackson today?

Speaker 3 (01:15:11):
No?

Speaker 2 (01:15:12):
I did not, Oh brother, it was just an absolutely
he said he can go for go on in an
hour about Trey White and Dan Jackson. What these guys
mean and so great?

Speaker 1 (01:15:21):
Yeah, which is nice, Like I'm happy that both of
them came back. I think their quality depth, good.

Speaker 2 (01:15:26):
Guys the rooms, you know, like kyri Elon didn't play teams.
I thought JaMarcus Ingram was the best special teamer this
team had last year.

Speaker 1 (01:15:33):
He played well, and I like some of what Ingram did.
But even even if you think Trey and Dane are
the answer this year, they're both on one year deals.
JaMarcus Ingram is an RFA next year. So you're outside
corner room. Even if you take Amos, so you take
Parish or whoever, if it's Ramel or Harriston, whoever the hell.
If you take an outside corner, you need another corner.

(01:15:53):
So I like the idea of them, you know, grabbing
another corner here somewhere on day three. And then I'm hoping,
I don't know, maybe they turn into another Christian vnfor
so on and so forth. You get some kind of
good value out of that. So I would like another
corner on day three. It really kind of depends on
where you go on day three, you know, kind of

(01:16:14):
throwing out some names. I initially thought, I mean here,
I thought, no, Williams would be like a solid pick
in round four. I don't think he's gonna be there,
going okay, So that's fair. So yeah, and then you're
you're sitting in a lot of like I don't mind
Zia Alexander from LSU, but I prefer more like a
fifth or later. But if he creeped into like the fourth,
I wouldn't I wouldn't hate that. Dorian Strong from Virginia

(01:16:36):
Tech does some fun things that I like. I also
like the other cal corner Marcus Harris watching really nice
juice like he plays fast, good feet, physical him and
uh their safety Craig Woodson number two are just out
like level and dudes like left and right. There was
a big hit initially that I thought it was Woodson

(01:17:00):
and I read the number wrong because bringing the all
twenty two camera angle looks like it's from the NASA
space station with how far it is, and it was
five not two, because Harris came over and just clocked
and I was like, oh so, Marcus Harris is somebody
who I like. Laid on day three from a corner
perspective receiver, you hit it. I like Tory Horton two
years ago. I watched him on with Colorado State this year.

(01:17:22):
Banged up limited in some action, but you still see
that vertical stretchability in what he offers. I also liked
them when he gets the ball in his hands, you
see some of the pump returner aspect show up he's
got some shake. He can juke some guys. It's not
just like always fast. So let's get him the ball
on a drag and see if he can outrun somebody.
Like he can put his foot in the ground, he
can shake guys. Also has a little bit of a
nastiness to him, like he'll plant some guys as a blocker.

(01:17:43):
If you're not looking, he'll crack on a linebacker or safety.
And then, yeah, the specialties value. So give me somebody
that can be the field stretcher with some yards after catch,
slash shake potential when he gets the ball, but also
be the punt returner. I'm all aboard on that. I
also like Kaya Williams from Washington State, and I know
a lot of people are high on I just think
he's gonna I mean, even to your point Horton though,

(01:18:05):
like you mentioned the trade upiece, I think Horton and
Kyle Williams with this receiver class probably going round three.
H Like, I don't think they're gonna be there at
one O nine, So then you got to trade up
to kind of get one of those guys and then
into your O line. You said it perfectly like there's
a chance we're sitting here next year and both Connor
McGovern and David Edwards are both gone, And then are
you starting Alec Anderson at guard? Are you starting Cedric

(01:18:27):
van pran Grainger at center?

Speaker 2 (01:18:29):
Like?

Speaker 1 (01:18:29):
What's the depth look like behind them? Even if even
if you keep McGovern and Anderson takes Edwards's spot, Okay,
who's taken the Anderson spot? It'd be nice if they
kind of had that guy already been in the building.
And I love your tap of just you're sitting there
on day three and being like Cromer, it's our pick.
Who do you want? Like, we're gonna taken into your
offensive lineman here, grab whoever you want. I also would

(01:18:51):
like another interior defensive lineman. I've been banging the drum
for this guy. I would like him to cut a
little bit of weight, just so he stops teetering as
much when he moves. But I really like Jamari call
Well from Oregon.

Speaker 2 (01:19:01):
Oh I love him. Yeah, yeah, I think you get
I think he get eighty five ninety percent of Ti
Leak Williams in him. Wow, high praise. Yeah, that's not crazy.
He's dropped hundred player for me. I like him at all.

Speaker 1 (01:19:11):
Oh, he his ability to limit displacement and like he
drops that knee and it is picturesque. Like his ability
to reduce his surface area and split a double team
and or anchor against it is great. And then at
three hundred and thirty pounds, the one that you know,
just the movement for him, the one that really got me.
When they play Michigan and they sub in Orgy, super

(01:19:35):
mobile athletic quarterback, and granted it's into the boundary, so
it's not a huge run, but Orgie keeps it on
like a read. Caldwell sees it and he chases Orgy
down to the sideline and pops him and knocks him
ont of bounds. And I was like, I'm in sign
me up. And there's so many. Every time I was
watching for Harmon or trying to see what, you know,
Birch was doing on the defensive line, I just kept

(01:19:55):
noticing ninety and Caldwell kept popping and flashing, and I
really do think he can be a quality rotational body
in this league. And again, short arms I don't love,
but he just does so many other things so well
that I think he would be a real quality rotational
guy this year and going forward, so he again interior
defensive line. In general, he's a guy I would really like.
Ty Robinson's a cool one that you mentioned. I remember him.

(01:20:18):
I watched some tape him obviously as well, but I
remember watching Nebraska versus Colorado live, and he just ate
Colorado's offense alive from the interior, from the five chasing
down schadur left and right like Wardad, he's a great
way to label him. And even though he's under like
three hundred pounds, he's just he's built so thick and stocky,

(01:20:38):
Like it's just because it's.

Speaker 2 (01:20:40):
It's a refrigerator and you put a helmet on top
of it. That's what he is. Bang And he's literally
a refrigerator.

Speaker 1 (01:20:47):
So yeah, literally it just yeah, solid steel. Like there's
nothing like Denton him or anything. It's he's just a
monster of a dude. Give me that linebacker, like you mentioned,
I'm in on board on that as well. A couple
guys that I would like later on day three. I
like Jack Kaiser from Notre Dame. I like Cody Simon
from Ohio State, just physical downhill, better in coverage than

(01:21:10):
I think he gets credit for. Not necessarily a plus
guy there but his ability to just diagnose what's happening
in front of him. Granted, he's got a lot of
talent playing in front of him at Ohio State, but
if you turn on Ohio State tape, for as much
as Jtt's popping and Tyleek is popping and Caleb downs
is popping, wats zero, Cody Simon just run all over
and chase things down sideline a sideline and make plays

(01:21:30):
in the backfield. I like him as well. I also
wouldn't hate the idea of another later developmental edge, but
I don't think it necessarily a huge need if we
go there early in the first three picks, which I
think they will. And yeah, so those are just a
couple of little my sie ancillary notes, but I was
pretty much at a lockstep with you for the entirety
of those Day three aspects. And it's nice that they
have all the wealth of those picks. I really do

(01:21:52):
think they could address a lot of depth or some
future things, or some good special teams value. Like there's
a lot of good opportunity I think on day three
for them to address a multitude of needs for twenty
twenty four and twenty twenty five and maybe hit on
some high upside guys, depending on how the board falls.

Speaker 2 (01:22:09):
By how many how many picks they actually make. You
know it won't be ten. I don't think it'll be ten.

Speaker 1 (01:22:14):
Yeah, I'm going with eight. I'm going like eight or seven.

Speaker 2 (01:22:17):
Yeah, I would say seven or eight, Yeah, which.

Speaker 1 (01:22:20):
Would be fun. I watch. I'm waiting for like some
kind of a lot of just chests. If they trade
down and then trade up, and then trade up again,
so they end up with like, oh man, they have
eleven picks and then they get that eleven shaved down
to like seven, but they end up with I don't know,
like five picks in the first one hundred and forty
or one hundred and thirty or something like that, or
it just kind of increase the value.

Speaker 2 (01:22:41):
What would be do that bears trade again where you
trade out, trade out of that pick and whind it
be in like sixty spots higher or something like that.
Something crazy.

Speaker 1 (01:22:50):
So yep, what a good opportunity and potential there Anything
else on your mind when it comes to this draft
class or building the perfect draft for you, anything else
that you might have your notes or anything you want
to unload out of the chamber before we let.

Speaker 2 (01:23:03):
You go here, No, I think. I think the thought
I would leave with is just I know we're excited
about the draft, and we all have the players we
love and the ones we don't like. Let it play out,
you know, it's the Bills are picking thirty, they're picking
ten times. There's gonna be a picture you like. There's
any picks you don't like, there's any picks you don't understand.
You know, Let's see the whole picture and don't get

(01:23:25):
married to any one particular outcome, because that's just a
recipe for disappointment.

Speaker 3 (01:23:29):
So and I.

Speaker 2 (01:23:32):
Implore you to not define the careers of these players
man after one season, because how many times we have
to watch Josh Allen or Dawson Knox or Spencer Brown,
et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. Figure it out, Dion Dawkins,
whatever player there's been great development, James Cook, Kalil Shaker,

(01:23:54):
how long you want to go. Let's give these kids
a chance, man, Give these kids a.

Speaker 1 (01:23:59):
Chance, either what positively or negatively. I think that the
biggest thing is always that initial someone gets drafted. This
guy's can't miss, this is gonna be amazing. That's too
extreme and the same thing on the other end, Tull
this guy sucks. I can't believe they took him. That's
also too extreme. There we talked about in the lead,
and there's so many variables that goes into what a
player is. And another good example right now Kean Coleman.

(01:24:22):
How many people last year he got drafted. Nope, he's
this ball winner, he's gonna be amazing. Nope, he can't
run routes. He sucks. And then his year one happens
and we're having some similar conversations about him now, which
I don't know why this is a surprise for everyone.
You mean to tell me this raw guy who just
just recently committed to playing football fully, he still needs

(01:24:42):
some more development. And also he got hurt in his
rookie year, which also hindered some of that development. And
you think he's a finished product or everybody's ready to
concrete judge him. No, he's done, write him off. What
are we doing? Like he already had a like a
work in progress trajectory, and then he got banged up,
so if anything he does, there's more of a work
in progress trajectory. But well, we got to take a

(01:25:03):
receiver because Keyon Coleman's a bus What are we doing?
And it would be the opposite if he balled out
as a rookie. Everyoneen like, well, we don't need a
receiver because Keyon Coleman is going to be a true
number one. That's not true either. It's just.

Speaker 2 (01:25:17):
We have the entire history of the NFL at our disposal.
We can learn things if you like it. It's all right,
it's all right there. I mean a sample size, it's
all the whole history. It's right there.

Speaker 1 (01:25:28):
Play opportunity to learn, and then take that learn and
put into practical application. Oh yeah, but I want to just.

Speaker 2 (01:25:33):
Be mad and yell at clouds Man.

Speaker 1 (01:25:35):
Yeah, which is fine.

Speaker 2 (01:25:37):
Yeah, that's strangers, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:25:38):
And that's how it was last year with I remember posting.
I posted a thread because I liked Keyon Coleman in general.
I thought he had a big a big range of
outcomes in the NFL. If like you told me that
he became a high end two or a low end one,
I would believe it. If you told me he was
out of the league by the end of his rookie contract,
I believe if you told me he's the guy who's
living off one year deals because different teams keep thinking

(01:26:00):
they can finally be the one to tap into him.
I'd buy it, and I said that as much when
the Bills drafted him and I posted he was my
wide receiver nine and so I had a ton of
clips and I posted him on social and I just
didn't win with that post at all, because I was
gonna yell at from both ends. The people who thought
he was the people who thought he was the worst
yelled at me for being too high, and the people

(01:26:22):
that thought he was this giant ball winner, amazing downfield
guy yelled at me for being too low. And all
I did was just get yelled at NonStop, like there
was nobody who was like, oh yeah, cool, even keeled. Nope,
it was I was too high and I was too
low and everyone yelled at me for like a week
and a half in that post, and it just it
was so upset.

Speaker 2 (01:26:43):
Welcome to sharing football opinions on the internet.

Speaker 1 (01:26:47):
The best it was the best of times.

Speaker 2 (01:26:49):
It was the worst times.

Speaker 1 (01:26:50):
Yeah, good times. I'm sure none of that will happen
this time with Bills. I'm sure everything would be level
headed and even keeled and uh, concrete known right out
of the gate and yeah, we will dance with that
dragon here on the show. You will obviously be diving
into a multitude of everything that Bills do with all
the content that you have going on there at locked
On and Joe, you were amazing tonight. Again, I greatly

(01:27:13):
appreciate you taking the time just in case people somehow
do not know who you are or what you do
or all that stuff. The floor is yours, plug away
with the multitude of projects that you are involved in.

Speaker 2 (01:27:23):
I'll tell you what, I got a lot going on,
very lucky to have so many different opportunities and Locked
on Bills is kind of my main thing. But on
my social media on x Twitter at Lee Joe Marino,
I put out a graphic today that shares all the
content that I have coming up over the next few days,
and it feels like a lot, but it's actually pretty

(01:27:46):
much the normal week that I have. And if you
look at that graphic, you'll be aware of all the
things that I have going on. If you want to
be able to follow more of my work.

Speaker 3 (01:27:55):
I like that.

Speaker 1 (01:27:55):
I'm literally I pulled it up right now. Let me
present and share a screen. Yeah, this is a this
is a packed schedule, right.

Speaker 2 (01:28:07):
It's I shared it because it's it's draft week, but
I mean, honestly, like that's pretty much.

Speaker 1 (01:28:13):
Nor like your your regular kind of day to day.

Speaker 2 (01:28:16):
Yeah, I watch football, I develop opinions, and I produce
content in a lot of different places. So I like
that there, it is, there, it is.

Speaker 1 (01:28:25):
I like the Yeah, very busy man, very busy schedule.
And uh, it's just yeah, you do so much good work.
It's nice to see for the volume of content that
you put out, the quality is maintained across the multiple
avenues that you dive into, regardless if it's solo or
you know, whoever you're working with. There's just a lot

(01:28:46):
of quality that is in everything you do. So I
appreciate you as the person you are, the work that
you do, and again you taking the time, good luck
with the rest of the week, staying up late for
the draft, doing all the content with life, the hack
the time.

Speaker 2 (01:29:02):
I wish you the best, good thanks, I appreciate it. Anthy,
always a pleasure talking with you, and I'm sure we'll
collaborate several times between now and the time the Bills
kick off this twenty twenty five Super Bowl run.

Speaker 1 (01:29:14):
Absolutely, I look forward to it every time we get together,
whether it's here on your locked on Bill's turf, and
enjoy the rest of your Tuesday, enjoy the rest of
your week. I'll see on the show, Sols and yeah,
appreciate you having a good night.

Speaker 2 (01:29:25):
Thanks brother, We'll see you later.

Speaker 1 (01:29:28):
Mister Joe Marino, tremendous guest. Really wanted to bring him
in and solidify as Argie says, Joe's must follow. Absolutely,
he is a must follow. Yeah, I wanted to, as
we talked about, you know, with on this show the
past several weeks, I wanted to dive into the major
positions of need, which we did several weeks ago at

(01:29:49):
Edge when we had James Foster on the show. Then
we dove into Corner with Russell Brown, then we dove
into the interior defensive line last week with Daniel Harms,
and I wanted to put a bow on all of
it by having Joe on for this episode, which has
been yeah, now a bit of a yearly reoccurrence. I
know for a fact we did it last year. I
think we did it two years ago too. I think
I just called it something different at that point, but

(01:30:13):
it was the same idea or semblance of idea I believe.
So yeah, this has been three years in a row
with me and Joe doing this here on the show,
and his work speaks for itself. I know you folks
know him and everything he does and everything I said here,
so yeah, give him a follow, check out all the content.
Everything he does does really good stuff. I hope you
folks enjoyed this episode. I brought this up earlier, Carl,

(01:30:33):
and I answered you in the chat, and I wanted
to answer it here again. Thank you very much for
being here, Carl, Thank you very much for the super chat.
Carl said, Anthony and Joe my favorite yappers. If I
don't tune into the draft until Friday, do you think
that I will miss anything? Will being start in round two?
I think there's a chance, like I said in the
chat to you, Carl, but just in case anybody didn't see,
I do think there's a chance to be trades being

(01:30:54):
trades back out of round one. But I think that
he makes that pick in round one. I think there's
gonna be somebody that's too tantalizing to pass up there
in round one on either the interior defensive line or corner,
or maybe even something wild that we're not considering based
on how the board may fall. But again, thank you
very much for being here, and thank you for the
super chat. I appreciate that. I'm gonna throw the banner

(01:31:16):
that says two as folks because we're gonna start to
wind out here. Actually kidding, I'm not gonna do that.
We're gonna talk about one pie. Pizza for a little bit.
Sponsor the show the best pizza in Buffalo, New York.
And I don't say that because they sponsor the show.
They sponsor the show because I think they are the
best pizza in Buffalo, New York. Sweet sauce, pie cup
and char pepperoni, homemade blue cheese, a variety of toppings

(01:31:36):
options that they dice up and sprinkle individually or individually
what technically individually, but evenly amongst the entire pie. They
also have a variety of catering options as well. They've
started diving into other foods and that stuff is just
as good as the pizza is. They have a pizza
that's named after the show and the brand. They also

(01:31:57):
do a ton of good for the city of Buffalo
in the community at large with all their different partnerships
with various charities and foundations, the Alzheimer's Foundation, the SPCA,
Toys for Tots partnering with Roswell to try and knock
out cancer. They do a ton of good for the
city and the community at large. So go get yourself
to one Pi pizza, treat yourself and your family and
your taste buds to the deliciousness that they have, and

(01:32:19):
also do some good for the community and the city
of Buffalo while you are at it. I hope you
folks enjoyed this episode. If there was anything I didn't
answer for anyone, I know some comments. I saw some
comments from people saying that they came in a bit
late and asking questions about different picks. I'll be putting
time stamps in this episode so you can go back
and kind of see what we landed on for pick one.

(01:32:41):
The round two stuff are the higher level conversations. I'll
be putting time stamps in for anything. But if there
is anything specific that you wanted answered that I didn't
get to or that I didn't see again, get at
me on Twitter Pro Underscore Underscore A Pro two underscores,
a NT that's the Twitter Blue Sky, It's Pro a,
no underscores, just p r oh A n T. If
there's anything that I didn't get to on this episode

(01:33:03):
you have a question about, I apologize for that. So
get at me on social or get at me on
the discord. If you're a Cover One insider, message me.
Dming me is the best way because I'll see it immediately.
So if there's anything I didn't answer, get at me.
I apologize for that, and I will get at it
as soon as I can. Really hope you folks enjoyed
this episode. It was nice having Joe on again and

(01:33:24):
having this conversation. It was cool seeing all the engagement
with you folks with each other in the chat with
myself and Joe, the questions, thoughts, comments, concerns, all that
stuff that I was able to catch and see. This
is a really fun conversation. It's a really fun time
of year. I appreciate you, Lou. Thank you very much, Lou.
I see you on Blue Sky all the time. You're awesome.
I appreciate you, Lou, and thank you very much for

(01:33:45):
being here and watching, and thank you for the kind words.
It's very nice to hear. I appreciate that. Yeah, fun
time of year. A lot of content coming out this week.
I will be doing a post draft show each day
and night with gregt. So once round one is done,
Greg and I will be going live Thursday night late
Thursday night. As soon as round two is done, Greg

(01:34:07):
and I will be going live Friday night. Then we'll
be going live at some point on Saturday to recap
day three pieces. We'll see what Eric and I put
out from a film perspective this week. Might put some
stuff out Saturday. I have the day off on Friday.
There's a chance I might put out something early Friday morning,
depending on who the bills pick. But there's a lot
of content coming from myself as we go forward. So

(01:34:30):
I am strapped in and I have coffee on deck,
and I am ready to not get any sleep and
just have a chaotic week, but in the best way,
in the most fun way possible. So I hope you
folks enjoyed the content. If you did, tell your family, friends,
loved ones about the show, about the channel, about the brand.
If you're watching here on YouTube, whether live or post live,
please please please and thank you. If you have not
already drop a like on this video. Please Likes are

(01:34:53):
the lifeblood of these streams. If you have not dropped
a like on this video already, please go ahead and
do so. It goes a sincerely way to telling myself
and the entire team. If you're listening one of the
podcasting apps or platforms, that's cool too. Please rate and
review and subscribe to disguised coverage. Tell your family and
friends and loved ones about the show, about this episode,
about the brand, about the channel, all that good stuff.

(01:35:14):
If you hated this episode, or if you hate this
show or you hate me, tell your enemies about all
of that stuff and make them potentially ruin their day
by watching me or the show or the channel. Whatever
you got. I'm excited for this week. Hope you folks
have enjoyed the content this what is it? Since the
Bills got eliminated from the AFC Championship and I've been
full scale and free agency and draft stuff, all the

(01:35:37):
film breakdowns on social and all the episodes and the
conversations here. I hope you folks have enjoyed all of that.
Thank you for riding with me through this episode in
this draft cycle. It'll continue as we go forward through
the rest of the week. Keep an eye on my
blue sky and my Twitter for communication about extra content
coming this week, because there will be extra content coming
this week, like I mentioned, And yeah, Lou, like you said,

(01:35:59):
beats the heck out of being able to start preparing
in October. And that used to be the life of
Bills fan man, when the Bills will be sitting there
like one in six or one in seven and I'd
be like, oh, let me start putting my board together
and seeing who I like come draft time. Yeah, it's
a different time now with the Bills being what they are,
but it definitely up beats the hell out of the
drought times. That is very well said. Enjoy the rest
of your Tuesday night, folks, and yeah, thank you for

(01:36:22):
riding with me on this episode. Whether you watch live,
watch later, you know, listen later, whatever form or fashion
you consume the content in. I greatly appreciate it. The
team greatly appreciate it, appreciates it. Thank you very much
to Joe Marino for joining me. And I hope you
and your family and friends and loved ones are all
doing well and staying safe. Be kind of one another,
take care of one another. I will see you when
I see you. Enjoy the draft, Enjoy the week, godspeed,

(01:36:46):
and as always go Bills.

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Building the perfect Buffalo Bills 2025 NFL Draft class | DC

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Building the perfect Buffalo Bills 2025 NFL Draft class | DC