Chris Paul Calls It a Career & NBA Cup Preview

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
This is the Drive and Dish podcast, and.

Speaker 2 (00:07):
Welcome to to start it off and let's go listen.
You talk about the upgrades in the background and letting
you know who he's rooting for right away. If you're
watching on video, you see my guy, Carlton k B
is joining us on this episode. I mean, one of
Miami's finest and you got not one, but all four

(00:29):
of the Miami teams behind him right now. Marlin's Heat, Dolphins,
and Panthers Gans.

Speaker 1 (00:34):
This Panthers didn't stee wins.

Speaker 2 (00:37):
That's true, I mean, but I mean we've talked. I
feel like we talked about this last time you were
on the episode. But I mean, yeah, I mean talk
about a golden era of a franchise right now. The
Panthers back to back Stanley Cup champions, went from having
zero Stanley Cups to having to Stanley Cups in two years.
You know, we're we're we'll gett we'll get into a
hockey a little bit later. You know, I know a
little bit of a rougher start for the Panthers right now.

(00:59):
They're kind playing all right, but like you know, back
to back Cups. I think the fatigue starting to get
in a little bit there. We're definitely going to talk
Carleton's heat a little bit later on an NBA Cup
we got the the groups are all set, or the
brackets are set, I should say group play is done.
So we're gonna do previews for all that. But first
we got to talk with the big news, Chris Paul
officially announcing his retirement. And I mean, look, this is

(01:21):
something that I feel like he's flirted with this past offseason.
He kind of set the table for it a little bit,
maybe even set the table a little bit more this
season when he goes back home to the Clippers. We
spent you know, I guess the majority of his season
or his tenure with I know, I mean, he's been
on a bunch of different teams. It's not like, give
it was a large majority, but and I mean maybe
that's one of the questions I'll ask you, is you know,

(01:42):
where do you remember Chris Paul the most? But I mean,
of course, you know, twenty plus seasons in the league,
twelve time All Star, All Rookie Team and Rookie of
the Year in five oh six, nine time All Defensive Team,
won the All Star Game MVP in twenty twelve twenty
thirteen Pelicans, Clippers Rockets that season with thunder Sons of

(02:03):
course going to the finals, Warriors Spurs, and now back
to the Clippers. So jumping around laid here a little bit.
I mean, obviously it's hard to and we will talk
a little more later on down the line when he
officially retires. Of course, Chris Paul has still the rest
of the season to go. But yeah, I mean, what
else do to say Carlton, I mean, one of the
most influential players of the two thousands. The point god,

(02:26):
I mean, I guess in all these eras that I
just mentioned, where do you remember him the most?

Speaker 3 (02:33):
Yeah, it's got to be the Clippers, even though there
was the epic arguments.

Speaker 1 (02:37):
I wish we knew each other at the time.

Speaker 3 (02:39):
That it's funny to say now, but Chris Paul versus
Darren Williams was a legit, legit argument man, and when
he was with New Orleans, and it's got to be
the Clippers. You just it's a shame he didn't get
a ring. I I don't remember. I wish I should
have looked it up. I wish I remember where the
series was and everything.

Speaker 1 (03:00):
But I vividly. Remember just DeAndre Jordan.

Speaker 3 (03:02):
You remember the play where DeAndre Jordan thought the shot
clock with the game clock and he gets the rebound
and it's like you literally just he has to put
it back in and they win, and then he thinks
that time expires this that, And then there's the the
Rockets verse.

Speaker 1 (03:19):
Was it the was it?

Speaker 3 (03:20):
The Warriors were where they just have the worst shooting
night history.

Speaker 1 (03:29):
I just drew a blank on his name.

Speaker 3 (03:30):
How could I mean? That was the double Trump Resa
the Trump? Yeah, yeah, he goes what one for eleven from.

Speaker 2 (03:37):
Theresa Eric Gordon Harden All them were ice cold. I
mean that series is extra I mean, if you want
to talk about the light because I think injuries are
unfortunately a part of the playoff legacy, and we'll talk
about that a little bit, but I mean you want
to talk about, like straight up one of his better
chances to win, Yeah, that's he with Houston where they
had the Warriors on the ropes, like the KD Warriors

(03:59):
that were and everybody. They win that epic Game five
and again have them right there, but Chris Paul's hamstring
gets hurt at the end of that game. He tweaks
it a little bit, so he's not even one hundred percent.
Then the rest of the series, like you said, Ice
Cold Game six, Ice Cold Game seven, the rest is
history of the Warriors going to win the championships. And
I mean that Rockets team is probably I mean, if

(04:22):
you want to talk about one of the best teams
to never win in my lifetime, like I put that
Rockets team right there with like the Kings in the
early two thousands. They're probably like the strongest examples of
where you go, man, yeah, where you're just surprised they
didn't break through. And I mean, yeah, that's the unfortunate

(04:44):
because a lot of times too, I mean it's a
combo of things, right because like with the Clippers, with
with the Lob City teams, like you have that season
where it is on them a little bit where it's like, hey,
they had that lead against the Rockets and then blew it,
like they had that thirty point lead in the elimination
doc blows that ends up blowing the three to one lead,
Like that's one of the og DOC blown leads. So

(05:04):
you have that there. You also have you know, I
think of that seven game epic series where he knocks
the Spurs out in twenty fifteen where he hits the
game winning layup and then he gets hurt, like he
just immediately is out and the team gets eliminated after
you take the defending champs out, like that's a big
what if? But I mean he at the same time, though,
you got to respect a lot of these run because
they happened everywhere, like they were in you know, those

(05:24):
Hornets teams with David West won a lot of games
and made the playoffs and went further than that franchise
had been at the time. He got to the finals
with Phoenix, and I mean that again double sided coin.
They were up two to one in that series to
Milwaukee and then they totally lose the next three games.
And you know it, that clearly the closest chance together
the ring was that season.

Speaker 1 (05:43):
That's the one he had to win. That was his
year right there.

Speaker 3 (05:47):
All right enough, that's the one I told you about
that I you know a lot of people give it
to the Bubble season.

Speaker 1 (05:52):
That's the season I get. I give the Asters too.

Speaker 3 (05:55):
You remember you had the Bucks playing the Hawks and
the Eastern Comfort finals and I forgot who who phoedi
to beat. But yeah, that was the year you're up
to one that you have Devin Booker playing good. Chris
Paul was as healthy as we seen him because he
always gets at the wrong time.

Speaker 1 (06:10):
That's the one you gotta finish.

Speaker 2 (06:12):
Yeah, I mean they were and like you said, eight
and was clicking. Like Bridges was still great that year,
like that was kind of his breakout season. And right,
like they just they had him on the ropes and
and just unfortunately blew. You know, even that Game five
was close, they still could add the three to two lead, like, right,
like that's the one where and that Bucks team was great.
Like I don't want to say that Sun's team was
definitively better than that Bucks team, but right, they certainly

(06:35):
had a chance to go out and win that series.
And didn't you know the next few years, I mean,
obviously the ending in Phoenix a little was pretty ugly,
just getting obliterated that what like fifty point beat down
at the hands of Dallas where it's like, you know
the meme where it's like Chris Paul hits the big
key three to cut the lead of forty seven or
something like that, just insane.

Speaker 1 (06:53):
I'm gonna bring up, like it's such a shame.

Speaker 3 (06:56):
Like when you hear Chris Paul, you gotta think it's
a big because it's used as use universally round sports,
Like when a team scores a touchdown in football.

Speaker 1 (07:03):
They I've seen that means used.

Speaker 2 (07:07):
And it's funny because I feel like he's one of
those rare players where Chris Paul is pretty beloved at
every stop, Like I mean, you know, maybe the Golden
State in San Antonio tenures, they kind of go, man whatever,
But like Clippers, he's arguably the greatest player in that
franchise is history. I feel like you gotta love him.
With the Hornets rookie again, Rookie of the Year, Chris Paul,

(07:27):
the Rockets tenure, they were really close in the conference finals.

Speaker 1 (07:30):
Shoot.

Speaker 2 (07:30):
Even that year in ok See, he would they basically
like they they sent him as the exile out of Houston.
It was basically like hardener Chris Paul, Like, oh Chris
is the problem. We sent him to Okay See. That
team wasn't expected to win anything that year. He had
those boys in the playoffs as a low seed, like
he was phenomenal. I mean, that's what springboarded him to
Phoenix then to be like Hey, Chris Paul is still
a very viable competitive player. You can win at a

(07:52):
high level with this guy. So it is a bit
of a it's a weird legacy, and it's unfortunate because
I think, you know, when you talk about point guards,
Chris Paul has got to be right there in the conversation.
I mean, top five point guards ever to me, I mean,
I think the only reason, if anything, I think Steph
has just stolen the Thunder a little bit, and that's

(08:13):
kind of maybe it's a little bit of victim and
steel in the Thunder too, right, because like Steph has
taking the point guard mantle and has won all those titles,
and so I think people gravitate to him more. And
I think in the longevity front, like again, Chris Paul
is forty years old. He's been in the league since
two thousand and six. Like a lot has changed in
two thousand and six in the NBA, But because Lebron

(08:33):
is still around, we all really pay attention to because
it's just like Lebron is still allowed doing Lebron's stuff,
Like it overshadows a little bit. So I think that's
a little unfortunate. I don't think his longevity probably and
I think it will over time, but I think right
now it's probably not appreciated the way it should be.
But yeah, it's tough though, because like right when you

(08:54):
also mentioned the playoffs, like you have to put him there.
He's one of the greatest players in the NBA to
never win a champion and ship it's like up there
with you know him and Barkley and Malone and Stockton
and Patrick Ewing. It's like that's kind of you're you know,
those are the guys that are gonna think of right away.
And it's unfortunately, I know that's the name that you know,
that's the list that Chris Paul doesn't want to be

(09:14):
associated on though at least on the you know, I mean,
he's you know him and the Banana boat boys like
him and Wade and Lebron and Mello obviously super good friends.
Like that was one of the things too, is the
closeness of that relationship, you know, at least in that
front he can say with Mellow, like because Mello never
won an NBA title. Now Mellow, I'm coming back and
I'm saying, yeah, but I got that c S Run.

(09:35):
Like listen, that Qus run is the equivalent of an
NBA title to me. But no, and you know, I
think that's always an unfortunate conversation be a part of too,
because he's gonna be he's gonna be remembered, is in
a league that values winning and where in the past
I think, you know, we talked about the League of
parody a little bit more recently, but this has largely
been a dynastic sport. Chris Paul just unfortunately wasn't on

(09:57):
the right squads a lot of these years, right.

Speaker 3 (10:00):
And it's it's a shame because you know, you mentioned
him where he ranks in the point guard and stuff
like that, and of course, you know, uh, it's getting
the point where we're all our mid thirties now where
we could say we've seen different generations, so we've seen
basketball change, but when we were kids like this that
Chris Paul is the last of that era, the non
shoot first point guard and stuff like that, where you
where you wanted fifteen assists and two shots. You know,

(10:21):
the Steve Nash we if he would have played, you know,
he's one of the players we would have loved to
see because you could shoot so well. But then point
guards weren't shooting, you know, the Steve Nash and Jason kidds.
I think Chris Paul is the last of that that
type of point guards. Now we're starting to see, you know,
of course Steph is on a different level, but the
Trey Young's and the point guards who want to who
want to shoot first and things like that, or even

(10:43):
you know, the athletic types where the John Morns and stuff.
But we're not seeing the true true you know, past
first pass only point guards no more. It's like we
almost have combo guards now, which he also you know,
vaulted position was basketball. But I think Chris Paul is
the last one, you know, hopefully we'll see it again.
I don't see why we wouldn't because I think, you know,
there's always going to be a room for past first

(11:03):
point guard, but it's there has there been one since,
like since Chris Paul did that that stuck around. There's
been a couple, of course, but none really stick around.
And I could think of like no past first skill.

Speaker 2 (11:16):
Not in that true sense, I think, because you're right,
like a lot of them, like I even think of
like with Dame for example, Dame is obviously much more
of an offensive player, and I mean Chris is probably
an underrated three point shooter in the grand scheme of things,
Like he was always covering around thirty eight thirty nine
percent give her take like a couple of seasons over forty.
But you're right though, like in terms of the assists,

(11:38):
like he was just racking up ten eleven a game
like every single year, I mean even late like that
his his season with Phoenix. He's thirty six years old,
he's averaging ten point eight assists a game, like, you know,
and still giving you you know, he's still giving you
twenty points a game a lot of these times. Like
he was never going to be that you know, big
fifty point score the way you know, you talk about
Banana Boat, the way that Mellow and Wade could be

(11:59):
a times. But you're right, like he was always putting
guys in a position to win, and as a point guard,
you know, that's been the role traditionally is to do that,
and it elevates the play of the guys around you.
And I think basically every situation that Chris Paul went into,
he elevated the play of the guys around And I
mean not to think about all the great players he
played with over this tenure. It's you know, playing with Harden,

(12:21):
playing with play Griffin and Peaked DeAndre Jordan. You know
in Phoenix we talked about the guys, but like playing
with Devin Booker, I mean even playing with Steph for
a little bit that that year in Golden State. It's
been quite the tenure for Chris Paul. The other thing
we'd be remiss to mention, as you know we talk
about Chris Paul again, will have a lot of more
to go over, is like Chris Paul is also a

(12:42):
part of one of the greatest what ifs in NBA
history that David Stern veto with Chris going to Lakers
originally to go play with Kobe, like the Palgasol trade
was happening, and he, you know, David Stern stepped in
and said, no, actually it's not. And obviously you know
that's where re routed to LA to go to the
Clippers and where Lobb City born. But I mean, we

(13:02):
haven't really seen a situation like that since then, where
the NBA is a straight up veto to trade like that.

Speaker 3 (13:09):
Right, right, And there was that weird thing where wasn't
it like at the time, the league owned the Cone.

Speaker 1 (13:15):
The hornets and stuff, so they had the veto.

Speaker 3 (13:17):
But yeah, that is the big what if, because you know,
Kobe still had some Kobe years after that, like you said,
the Palkasaul trade was happening. So yeah, that's that's probably
what Chris Paul looks back on and it's mad about.
And then it's just like like you mentioned Blake Griffin
and DeAndre Jordan in their prime and stuff like that,
Like that's probably the biggest compliment to Chris Paul. There's

(13:38):
no player, even if as recent as Winby like he was,
you could tell he made Winby better.

Speaker 1 (13:43):
You have little.

Speaker 3 (13:44):
Plays where he showed a touch where he tells me
he's tying up a guy and he tells Winby to
come and do the jump ball so so Winby can
jump instead of him. So yeah, it's those Clippers teams, man,
one of those. To be a Clippers fan, I know
you look back because that's like you said, doctor Doctor
is the coach to Doc was in Doc fashion. We
both feel the same, I am, But yeah, those teams

(14:06):
were supposed to win. And I don't know if anybody Griffin,
me and I kind of have debates. You know, you know,
he's number one pick, obviously had Karl Malone comparisons. Coming guy,
he was athletic, but did he ever really put it together?
But I don't know what I jokingly said this, but
without Chris paulis de Andre Jordan Javelle McGee. Now, of

(14:28):
course it's funny say that because now he's still in
the league shooting threes and he's he's a sniper.

Speaker 2 (14:34):
But him, him and Drummond hitting threes is like unsettling
to me. Like I remember when we were talking, like
having debates early in the podcast because Andre Drummond was
shooting like twenty five percent from the line, and we
were like, is this guy gonna shoot himself out of
the league? And now like Andre Drummond is a I
think a thirty two percent three point shooter, Like wow,
like you want like truly one of the most remarkable

(14:55):
developments in NBA history.

Speaker 1 (14:58):
It is insane.

Speaker 3 (15:00):
Like you said, you almost expect like you expected to
go or you expect to at least have a chance
to go in where like you said, Andre Andre Drummond
was airball and rebounds.

Speaker 2 (15:11):
We would have had if we saw Andre Drummond or
DeAndre Jordan put up a three pointer that wasn't at
the end of the quarter to heave back in twenty fifteen,
we would have had an aneurysm. Like I would have
been like its it is. And I mean it's funny
because like you can track almost to a season where
that shift started. I mean, go look at brook Lopez's

(15:32):
basketball reference and like pull that up and like you
see the clip like very quickly where it's like, no,
he started to take them, and you know, all of
a sudden, the big guys are go from taking maybe
like one a game if that, to take in like
six or seven in some cases. And yeah, I mean
you want to talk about the styles changing, that's probably
the biggest one. The center position more than any effected.
But yeah, I mean it really is though, going back

(15:54):
to that last few years with Kobe, because like, right,
that team had just won two championships in three years.
They had you know, were coming off the title to
the Celtics, but that following year when they lost to Dallas,
like they lost in the second round to the to
the Dallas team with Dirk that ended up going to
win the title that year, and you know that they
were kind of at a crossroads, right because like bying
them was still healthy and hadn't dealt with the injuries

(16:15):
yet and Powell was there, but like they were getting
ready to move on, Like that was the thing. Is
like they were gonna move on from Powell and Odom
who were huge parts of them winning those championships. But
like right, like that's the refreshm because you said Kobe
was still Kobe at the time, Like Kobe, I mean
it was the Achilles is what really did Kobe? And
in twenty thirteen is where like you can see the
decline after that, but he was still like the best

(16:37):
one of the one of if not the best probably
pure scorer in the league at that point. So yeah,
I mean, who knows.

Speaker 3 (16:44):
How it would have changed if you know, Dallas ended
up beating us in the finals, but we not only
do you get a get the Kobe versus Lebron finals
that we never got, Yeah, you got you got Kobe
and Chris Paul versus Lebron in the way that that
would have.

Speaker 2 (16:59):
Been acting, Yeah, that would have been a lot. I
mean truly, like one of the regrets is now and
Lebron admits it is never seen that Kobe Lebron Finals.
That was so unfortunate because that was always I mean,
you want to talk about the debates, like the like
that's what I remember in high school growing up, Like
that was a hot topic, was the Kobe and Lebron
debate at the time. That's like where you know, I
feel like those are the debates that like rounded me

(17:21):
into NBA form, Like you want to talk about getting
ready for the podcast, Like the pod is nothing after
those like you know, that's where it all started, you know,
back in the day. You gotta love that. It's funny,
like and one more with Chris Paul before we got
out here and start talking NBA Cup a little bit though,
is you know that Lob City team. You're right, I
think the impact where you know, didn't get over the hump,

(17:42):
but I think they're gonna be one of those teams
that people really look fondly on over the future, just
because of the style and the impact they had in
the game, and the fact that just like their highlights
are super watchable, like they're really exciting. Like, man, I
remember one of those pre one of those peak process
games against the Sixers were the Clippers beat us by
like fifty and they were legitimately back to back plays

(18:05):
where Chris Paul and Blake Grippon had like, ali, you
windmill two on ones just because the sixers were given away.
It was just so but it was crazy, like you know,
it's so insane that you can't be mad at it.

Speaker 3 (18:17):
So it's worth mentioning too, Like the Clippers were to
laughing Stock, like you know for years, like not only
were they the Lakers little brother because they both playing
as staples, but the Clippers were pretty much a guaranteed win.

Speaker 1 (18:33):
At least that's what you thought.

Speaker 3 (18:34):
Obviously they didn't go on into but you never were worried
about the Clippers. And then you know they they drafted
Sean Livingston, who had so much promise and you thought
maybe he could turn them around.

Speaker 1 (18:42):
He has one of the most gruesome injuries we've.

Speaker 3 (18:44):
Seen and you're like, yeah, this franchise is cooked, Like
this is just a Kirch franchist. You don't ever believe
in it. So that's probably his biggest resume he made.
He made the Clippers relevant. He made it to where
you know, you didn't just look at them as the
Lakers little brother are easy when you know of course
they never got a but he made the Clippers and
respectable franchise, and growing up who we never would have

(19:06):
been able to say that.

Speaker 2 (19:07):
There was nothing respectable about the Clippers growing up. And
I mean part of that, obviously, when you really look back,
was all the Donald Sterling chaos. But uh yeah, I
mean they're You're right, I mean they were, and I
mean they still that. I respect the Clippers fan base
a ton for that reason because listen, you could go
root for the Lakers, like the Los Angeles Lakers, you
have a geographical reason to go root for one of

(19:28):
the best franchises in NBA history, if not the best,
and you choose to go root for the Clippers, who
have never won anything like respect You gotta be dedicated
to do that when you have that choice. Like we're
stuck with our teams now. Now your basketball team has
been a little more successful over the years than mine
in terms of recently. But yeah, I mean, you know,
we're born into it. They had they have a rare

(19:50):
instance where y'all have the choice and you chose to
be a Clippers fan, So you know, shouts all those guys,
shouts Chris Paul too. We'll give a full we'll take
one last last longer look back at it too once
he officially hangs it up at the end of the season,
But it would be kind of funny. I mean, I
don't think he's going to because it's you know, Chris
Paul can kind of do whatever he wants at this point.
But like with the OKC connection, maybe go ring you know,

(20:13):
if you're gonna go Ring Chase, that's a hell of
a place to go Ring Chase right now, Like they
a better roster, Like he was great over there. He
kind of helped build that legitimacy to turn it around.

Speaker 3 (20:21):
So all right, well you mentioned it earlier that that
Okay say team was just you know, sort of meddling
in becoming what they're becoming now. They had no plans
on winning. You know, you got the young SGA. That's
the year we kind of seen. We're like, oh, yeah,
they got something with that. Chris Paul helped with his development.

Speaker 2 (20:37):
From basically yeah, I really think that may even be right,
like a more appreciated element of his career as it ages,
because obviously, you know, we're gonna talk thunder here in
a little bit with the NBA Cup. But again needless
to say that the fruits of their labor are paying
off recently. Welcome everybody the Driving Ish NBA Podcast. My
name is Kevin Rayfeus, joining me as always my co

(20:59):
host Justin Who's art? Who is off? This week? Of
course filling in our guy Carlton KB at Carlton underscore
KB like the letters K and B on Twitter. Uh,
you know, Carlton, you got anything? I mean, you gotta
talk about the clone page too? Real quick off top
it smells good. Chronicles on Instagram. Listen, it's wintertime, bro,
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(21:19):
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what are we smelling like in the winter time?

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(22:40):
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Speaker 2 (22:47):
But it's great though, but in a weird way though,
as crazy as it sounds, like the thirty degrees in
Jacksonville feels a lot colder than it does in Philly
because when I was a jack Like bro, there was
there were mornings, Like there was one morning where I
was working early morning and Carlton as Carlton was working
overnight hours. It's like I was coming in at like
three in the morning at that point, and I just
remember getting my car. I looked at the thermometer and
I'm like, it is twenty nine degrees out right now,

(23:08):
Like I'm sorry, where did I move? Like what is happening?
Like Jacksonville is the one area of flarer Jacksonville and
like the few areas up north up there where you'll
get legit like frost below freezing temperatures and occasionally get
a taste of it, Like yeah, I mean Orlando, it's
getting to forty I think is the coldest ever down Orlando. Obviously,
you get down to you know, South Florida, you're getting

(23:30):
the fifties and sixties, people start losing their mind down there,
So it's a little bit different.

Speaker 3 (23:34):
Mind me is in a real place camp we're at
the we're at the station at five in the morning, freezing,
like you said, twenty nine. And then you see a
forecast of Florida and it's blue blue, blue, blue, blue day.
You get down South Florida in it and it's seventy eight,
and it's how does Miami, Yeah, like I know they're
not close, but five hours it's enough for a fifty
degrees different like what is going.

Speaker 1 (23:55):
On in Miami.

Speaker 2 (23:56):
But it really is drastic though, Like that's the thing
is because it's like right, like if you're up here,
I mean, realistically, you could get to Boston in about
five hours from Philly and it'll be colder in Boston.
It's not gonna be that much colder. Like we're talking
like a couple degree different. It's talking like maybe ten
at the most where it's gonna be different that Jackson
to Florida like Miami, Like they're right, they are five

(24:17):
hours away by car basically straight down ninety five, and
it's just wildly different, like it's now like quickly it
changes like that, like that you get down to that
tropical zone and like listen. It is just different down there.
If you feel like we're different, leave us a review
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what you're thinking. If you're not an Apple user, Google Play,

(24:38):
story Speaker, Spotify, tune in, Amazon Music player, FM, anywhere
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And now we'res more sponsors. All right, So NBA Cup
group play has officially wrapped up as of last next week,

(25:01):
so we're straight into the brackets now. Quarterfinals are gonna
be happening about a week on the ninth and the
tenth semi's on December thirteenth. In the championship will be
on December sixteenth. It's the third edition of the NBA Cup,
of course, the Lakers winning the initial one the Milwaukee Bucks,
but Giannis winning last year a chance for the Lakers
to get number two. The Bucks are not in the
final four this year. Your group winners in the East

(25:25):
where Orlando, Toronto, the Knicks and the or excuse me
not the Group winners by bad. The four teams are
you got Magic, Heat, you got the Raptors and the Knicks,
and then out West you got thunder Suns and you
got Lakers Spurs. Of course we're gonna start in the
Eastern Conference. I can't have Miami guy, and I start
with Orlando Miami. I kind of like, I mean, see,
and I love this too with the intrigue right away,

(25:45):
because it's like, look, I know they're not like hardcore
arrivals necessarily, but like this is the closest one we
got geographically. I kind of like this little Florida battle
going off top of the NBA Cup.

Speaker 1 (25:56):
Right And I think this could be the start of
a rivalry.

Speaker 3 (25:59):
And like you said, gradually, it's a shame that we
don't have a robbery with the Magic, and I guess
because we've never been good at the same time, you know,
we come into the league at the same time.

Speaker 1 (26:08):
There was potential.

Speaker 3 (26:09):
You know, back in the Big three years when dwhite
House was there, it just never happened.

Speaker 1 (26:13):
But especially with.

Speaker 3 (26:14):
This year, with the Heat playing so well, it looked
like the Magic We're about to take take over the
Vision and run away with it, you know, with you
always got to respect the Hawks, but you know, nobody's
ever taken the hornet seriously. So it looked like the
magic We're gonna run away, and then the heat find out, Oh.

Speaker 1 (26:30):
You could play fast.

Speaker 3 (26:32):
I don't know if you see it too, Okay, if
they take a low key jab at Jimmy Butler every
chance they get, every time they talked about the pace,
stuff like oh, we don't have our best guys flowing
down the tempo anymore. It's like the more they go out,
I'm almost convinsed. They asked the writers to ask them
about it, they could take a.

Speaker 1 (26:50):
Low key shot at Jimmy.

Speaker 2 (26:51):
So I wasn't gonna I mean, this word's going We'll
get back to it in a second, but I do
gotta ask because it's like, you're right, Miami's off to
a pretty i would say, surprising starts so far, I
think better than most people expected at this point in
the post Jimmy era. You know, Jimmy has been responsible
for a pretty fun area or era of Miami basketball.
Obviously two finals appearances. I know they never got done,

(27:12):
but it's like it's hard to really blame Jimmy for that,
Like they just kind of ran up against two better teams,
and I mean even then they they had the Lakers
more on the ropes than I think people give them
credit for in that series. But regardless, is it acrimonious now?
Like what is the temp down there? It's like, is
this gonna be like time heels are a little bit
or is like they're kind of like beef here now

(27:34):
a little bit.

Speaker 3 (27:35):
It's the weird thing is you know, and Jimmy has
done this everywhere, so it's kind of me Me and
you have talked about it, you know, Jimmy does Jimmy things.
I think the weird thing about it was usually it's
an organization versus player, and the teammates stay out of it.

Speaker 1 (27:51):
The players still have their respect the player.

Speaker 3 (27:55):
It's kind of lost respect from Jimmy starting with Mam
to Tyler herroll down, and I think that's kind of
where the beef starts. Like, you know, it's one of
the things where we've seen spo you know how big
both of us are fans of spoe Is and Jimmy's like, yeah,
spose drawn up plays where I'm just standing in the
corner and we're like Eric Sposter.

Speaker 1 (28:14):
And then of course the players are just like Jimmy,
you realize we know these plays, right, So I think,
like you.

Speaker 3 (28:20):
Said, everything time heals all. Especially with my Heat organization.
We have Michael Jordan's Jersey retired, Shacks Jersey retired. You
know that was a nasty ending. They're gonna retire Lebron.
So this is an organization that forgets everyone. So I'm
actually surprised at this point. Like you said, there is
low key beef there and I didn't expect it, and
I feel like that's part.

Speaker 1 (28:40):
You know, of course you want to play.

Speaker 3 (28:41):
Good anyway, but like I think the Heat came into
this off season like he's put the Warriors, so they're
gonna be They're gonna be good. You know, we'll know
how good and stuff like that. But you know, Steph,
they're gonna be good. We can't have him say look
look what I left, and you know what I'm saying,
look what they were doing with me, And I think
they took it personal. And that's why you see the
like them in the NBA Cup and stuff like that

(29:03):
was supposed to. Clin completely went and did his homework
and revamped this whole Heat team to where it's like
I don't know how long this is sustainable, but man,
I'm not gonna lie. Like you said, those playoff teams
and Jimmy Butler, I loved it, But regular season basketball.
I can't tell you last time I enjoyed regular season
basketball and that yeah, Justin did tell me, and I

(29:23):
know you mentioned it too. I didn't know Dorman Powell
was good. I knew he was good, but man, he
has been. He has been phenomenal.

Speaker 2 (29:31):
I mean, he essentially like and he even talked about
this pretty openly in the interview, like he was a
victim because he's one of those like mid middle class,
if you will, NBA players where it's like he's not
a bona fide superstar, but he's not a like benchwarmer either,
exactly like normOn. Powell was a borderline All Star last year,
like which is surprising again just because of his age.
Like Norm Powell's always been a good NBA player, but

(29:53):
like he's really come on here that year at the
Clippers and it's continued to do with Miami, Like he
pretty openly talked about it, like the Clippers wanted him back,
they just could afford him. They got priced out of him,
and it was that weird, like just with the with
the apron and everything in the new cap so I
think that became an issue. But like, right, that's the
perfect example of a guy going into Miami and just
it being blatantly obvious that he was going to succeed there.

(30:16):
And I think that's why it's weird. Like the weirdest
thing with Jimmy being contentious with Miami is because and
you're right, Jimmy does Jimmy things, Like I think I
don't think we should be surprised necessarily when this is
the fourth organization necessarily that has happened with. But it's
more of just like Miami is a serious organization, Like
they have Eric Spolzer who just won his eight hundredth
game the other night. Incredible locker room video by the way,

(30:38):
him getting soaked in him having no idea what's happening,
Like not even know he's winning his eight hundredth game.

Speaker 1 (30:42):
I did not know that this is your.

Speaker 2 (30:44):
Eight Yeah, that might be the one thing where I'm like,
come on, you know, somebody had to tip you off there.
Nobody in the arena told you that was gonna be
eight hundred to night. But like, no, that's That's why
it's because, like I mean, look at the franchise, right,
like Chicago not exactly been the best round franchise here
in a little bit. The Sixers. You know, we don't
need to hear me hard about the Sixers anymore. The

(31:05):
Timberwolves pretty known as the dysfunctional franchise at that point,
So maybe you're not surprised with those teams. Miami's not
the one you see people exit from that often. Like
I know Lebron left, but like Lebron left to go home,
like that wasn't us. That's probably the only place he
would have left for at that point, Like that wasn't
some like weird acrimonious breakup, Like it really like there
was beef here with Jimmy Butler. And that's why it's

(31:27):
just surpot any I mean, I'm with you. I think
they're gonna like Jimmy Butler's jersey should be retired to Miami,
like he's one of the best players in franchise history.
It's just surprising because like that's not the organization, like
and and just because like yeah, it felt like especially
when he got moved there, like it felt like that
was gonna be Jimmy's forever home, like that was we're
gonna just ride this till the end. And I mean, look,

(31:48):
the team probably hit its peak. Like I don't even
necessarily think like blowing that team up was the wrong decision. Again,
just surprised. It was so acrimonious because it felt like
they were working to get him to a place where
he wanted. Like he's getting what he wants right, like
they say, to play with Steth Curry.

Speaker 3 (32:02):
It really beat that and even that, you would think
that things would have then because you remember Mephis.

Speaker 1 (32:09):
It really wanted them.

Speaker 3 (32:10):
There was rumors that they were gonna trade the mephis
and he was like, oh, I don't want to go
to Memphis, and that's one of those things where they're
better than me.

Speaker 1 (32:15):
I ship him the Mephis.

Speaker 3 (32:18):
You're going where the picks are and stuff like that.
But yeah, that is a surprise. And I know you
mentioned the NBA Cup the Bam Man, Like we mentioned
Andre Drummond and DeAndre Jordan shooting threes earlier. You know,
people make jokes that area Wilson so good Maam had
shot up, but like he's another one. I don't know

(32:41):
how much you've seen him with his three point shooting.
But that shot looks good. And like you said, the
one thing you can always say about the Heat is
they know their identity. They get guys that the guys
that's gonna play well. So, like you said, Norman Powell
was expected match made in heaven.

Speaker 1 (32:57):
Davion Mitchell.

Speaker 3 (32:58):
I don't know why he's bounced the round, but he's
come in and he is fit perfectly.

Speaker 1 (33:02):
He of course asked defense and stuff like that, but.

Speaker 3 (33:05):
He's he's getting assists, he's being unselfish, He's that was
the one biggest question with this team, like who's doing
wrong point guard?

Speaker 1 (33:11):
You know you have Howards, Norman Poalan tal Hero gonna
play together.

Speaker 3 (33:14):
That's still that question is kind of starting to get
answered because Hero was back, but it was still a
big question mark. But the reason why it's looked seamlessly
not only because of the pace, but because Daveyon Mitchell
has sort of been able to help, you know, point
guard the office and let everybody see the see the
see the ball and stuff like that.

Speaker 1 (33:32):
So yeah, this is gonna be good.

Speaker 3 (33:35):
Like I said, I think that he was just like nah, Magic,
y'all are still little brothers and stuff like that. I
know Magic fans say bon Carroll's the most read superstar,
but I'm still not convinced he's better than the Wagner.
I know they want him to take that jump, but
every time we play the Magic, it's it's friend who
I'm more scared of than than Pablo.

Speaker 2 (33:57):
Well, so like we're starting to see the whispers, right
is like I'm excited for this matchup because Orlando has
been playing great. Like Orlando was five and six, they're
thirteen and eight right now, like Miami obviously fourteen and seven,
so a really pretty even matchup. But Carlton, right, like
that's been the weird conversation that we're starting to happen.
It's like, Yo, bn Caro went down and miss time
and they started getting better, like they are, Like, you know,

(34:19):
Franz is playing great, Suggs is playing great. You're starting
to see some life at Anthony Black, like desm Ban
is somebody that I did think was gonna play better too,
Like Desimban also just couldn't hit the broadside of a
barn to start the season. It's like, hey, a career
elite three point shooter probably isn't going to totally regress
off the cliff for the entire season, So I think
that is clearly super helpful as well there. But like, yeah,

(34:41):
this team is playing, They're playing well defensively, Like it
just feels like they're starting to find their stride a
little bit. And this is a team in Orlando that
I think people had real and like valid expectations for
in a wide open Eastern Conference, like they expected them
to be competing for a serious spot. It feels like
they're starting to become that team. And I think this
is a really good test for them, playing the Miami

(35:02):
team who started strong in a meaningful matchup for.

Speaker 3 (35:05):
Sure, for sure, And like I said, I think this
is gonna these two teams are gonna bat all year.
I do think we'll see how things match up, but
I think we find I think this is the year
we start to see that robbery going. I don't know
how things have to match it to where it's in
the playoffs, but yeah, this is gonna be interesting because
like you said, they're starting to heat up the playing
so well, and then of course you got you got Expoe,

(35:26):
who's who always I just want to see how serious
supposed takes this NBA Cup which we've seen no reason
why the Heat wouldn't like the Heat. We're trying to
trying to play serious before it, which is Jimmy Butler
didn't care about it.

Speaker 2 (35:38):
I mean, this is this is exactly the thing though,
like right, like when you think about the NBA Cup, though,
isn't this the type of thing that like a heat
team like that is made for where it's like, no,
this is absolutely a squad like that could get hot.
Take this seriously when maybe other ones aren't, and you know,
you go out and get something like I think that
was kind of the purpose of when you know, Adam
Silver had this idea and thought to you know, to

(35:59):
execute on this that you know, you get teams like
that who wouldn't necessarily have the shot to go win,
but then they you know, you win an NBA Cup
and maybe look at the season a little differently. I mean,
I know that was I mean, it's ended up being
the case with the Lakers and Milwaukee so far. I mean,
okay See was in it last year too. Of course
they ended up going to win the whole thing, but still,
and I mean, we'll see if okay See runs it

(36:20):
back this year. Before we get over to the West though.
The other one is the Raptors and Knicks. You know, again,
you know we talk about the surprises justin I talked
about this a little bit last week, but you know,
the Knicks not necessarily as much, but kind of expected
them to be Eastern Conference favorites. The Raptors group winners
fourteen and seven. Like, you know, I know losers are
too straight going into this podcast, but you know, you

(36:41):
want to talk about the surprises so far. You know,
brandon Ingram has been phenomenal for them to start the season,
so you know they're looking to keep that going. I
think that's another one. You know, when you look at
who could jump up and snag a playoff spot from
teams that we wouldn't expect. You know, Toronto looks like
they're going to make some noise this.

Speaker 3 (36:58):
Year, right right, and you and you named them like
I think we were all we're all kind of waiting
for Scottie Barnes to take the jump or you know,
he had that great rookie year and it's kind of
been like, okay, what's going on since?

Speaker 1 (37:09):
But brandon Ingram, this is the brandon Ingram we thought
we were gonna.

Speaker 3 (37:12):
See, Like you know, if you remember, Brandon Ingram was
getting legit Katie comparisons coming out of Duke.

Speaker 1 (37:18):
Yeah, and like he was.

Speaker 3 (37:20):
He's always been a weird case to me because like
when you watch him, you could see the talent.

Speaker 1 (37:24):
So it's just like is it the is it the team?
Is the play style? Like how is this guy not better?

Speaker 3 (37:30):
Like he was picked one pick ahead of Brown out
of from Boston. You know, the Lakers get Brandon Ingham
Brandon Ingram and the Celtics get Jalen Brown and it
was just like there was no question what the better
person was. And it's like that never should have been
the case. So I'm super happy to see him, see

(37:50):
him finally flourish in there, and like you're right that
that Toronto's team a little scary because they have everything.

Speaker 1 (37:55):
They're very well rounded. Didn't see it coming.

Speaker 3 (37:57):
But this is what happens when you have and open
Eastern Conference, like you said, with the with the patients
going down and with the patients and Celtics having injuries,
like you have teams wind upen where it's no tanking,
at least not yet from the top half.

Speaker 1 (38:11):
This is what you can expect. Like they're as scary
as anyone in the East.

Speaker 2 (38:15):
Yeah, and I mean, like you said, just a lot
of quality players on that roster, like beyond Ingram, you know,
yaka pertl is still there. R J Barrett is there.
Emmanuel Quickly's a guy that I really like, is still there.
You know, you mentioned Barnes. Barnes has been the centerpiece
of this rebuild, and like, I don't really know that
it's been a full rebuild necessarily. It's kind of like
a weird retool a little bit. I mean, they got
some some young players on that roster, but for the

(38:36):
most part, I mean these guys are a little more established.
You know. I'm interested to see kind of what they
do with the deadline given that fact, with everybody ball in.
But like you're right with Ingram, it was one of
those moves where Frankly at the time, I mean I
think my reaction was like, well, yeah, that makes you better,
But like, why what's the point here? He's played well,
I mean he's twenty eight years old still, so in

(38:57):
theory he says prime right now, I think Ingram has
been it's a weird case. I think he's missed time
for sure. Like obviously the big one was the blood clots,
but like even just in general, he's always had a
bunch of random injuries. But you're right, like he that
all start You're in New Orleans at twenty two and
then just kind of never like he's always given you
twenty a game. I mean, he's averaged over twenty three

(39:20):
points a game every year since twenty nineteen. But it's
just like a I don't know, it's like an empty twenty.

Speaker 3 (39:27):
Yeah, you know, see you did seem like empty stats
and that's I think that's the question we both had,
like does he need to be your number one? Does
he need a two point guard? Like what do we
have to see to get brandon Ing grown? And like
like you said, this Toronto has figured out. You mentioned
r J. Barrett, who also has you know, had a
shaky start, you know with the expectations coming out, and

(39:47):
do you know, I love bringing it up like ESPN
had him ranking higher than than Zion coming out. You
know at Duke we've immediately seen that one in the case.
But I think there is somebody that you know quickly,
like you sa it has always had.

Speaker 1 (40:00):
Talent as Barnes putting together.

Speaker 3 (40:02):
So yeah, that that team is well coaching and finally
getting to see and put together. But yeah, I enjoyed
watching them. They are another one who's who's really enjoyed
to watching. Like you said, Brenda Ingham, the stats aren't empty.
Like you can see. This is the first year where
you can like really see him making a difference on
the court. Yeah, making winning plays.

Speaker 2 (40:20):
Yeah, for sure, early league past starlings definitely will be
intriguing to see if they keep it up the rest
of the way. I like it again a little bit
of that Eastern Division match up there as well with
them in the Knicks. I think that'll be fun all right,
going out West. We got ok C and Phoenix and
you got the Lakers and the Spurs. Uh, you know
obviously Lakers Spurs. You just it's gonna be is gonna

(40:42):
be playing. You want to see what's happening there. I
think that you know, we unfortunately take the steam out
of it there, but I mean, look, the Lakers, you know,
full hitting their full steam right now. You've obviously got
Lebron back in the lineup. Seems to be in a
great mood. The you know, kind of the transition and
handing the keys to the car over to Luca is
going well, I mean, yeah, this this team looks energized

(41:04):
right now. They look like they're having fun.

Speaker 3 (41:06):
Yeah, and it's gonna be fun. It's gonna be interesting.
Like one thing about Lebron, like you said, he's cheap
and he knows, he knows, he knows the importance of things.
So Lebron realistically knows, you know, in the seven game series,
they're not beating. Okay, see, but this NBA Cup, if
Lebron can throw another NBA Cup on his resume, yeah, listen.

Speaker 2 (41:25):
Two of the first three. Listen, you can get two
half of titles. Maybe he got five hour what.

Speaker 3 (41:30):
Hey, we're about to see We're about to see some
some some of the best Lebron we've seen from in
this later half of the year.

Speaker 1 (41:37):
We're gonna see the best Lebron to see that. This
is low key probably what he's what he was resting for. Like, hey, Luca,
go ahead and trail water for me. I'll be back
a couple of weeks then.

Speaker 3 (41:47):
So yeah, that Lakers team, Okay, so it's just a
juggernut and I don't know how much you want to
talk about them later, Like it's unfair, like even in
this coming up draft they got like I've seen random
things where they have like the Clippers picks, Like what
in the world when they do it, Like, was it
just like, oh, let's trade every pick.

Speaker 2 (42:06):
I mean, yeah, hindsight, it really is crazy at hindsight,
Like I think the Clippers deserve more revisionous history because
it was essentially a trade for PG and for Kawhi,
Like you're getting you don't get Kawhi without making that
PG trade. But yeah, it's really wild when it's like, yeah,
the defending NBA champion might have the number four pick
in the draft to this year when they've hit on
all these picks, like at some point, it's gonna start

(42:26):
to be like, do you have too many like lottery
guys in the room? Like we have to almost pick
and choose our guys and find a way to you know,
and listen. That's a great problem for anybody to have.
But you're right, I mean, this team is the teams
a juggernaut. Right now. They've lost one game, it was
by two points to the Trailblazers and oh, by the way,
Jalen Williams has just started playing. They haven't basically had

(42:47):
their either second or third best player depending on how
you feel about Chet like for most of the season,
and they're still steamrolling these teams, Like, yeah, you have
to be you can only be impressed with what Case
has done so far. I mean just absolutely phenomenal work.
You know, people have been saying, and rightfully so, that
this team is in a better position to defend the

(43:09):
title than most teams have been in a long time.
And they seem to have very much taken that to
heart and look ready to defend this right.

Speaker 3 (43:16):
Right, and that I can't wait to hit a second half,
you know, after trade Dadline an All Star game, you
and justin show because they're one hundred percent gonna be
on Warriors Warriors Record Watch, and you know in okay
see fashion, of course they have the Sons, Like how
are you playing the Sons in the third?

Speaker 2 (43:33):
Well that's the I mean listen, that's the scrappy underdog
in the tournament, right, Like that's that. Those are the
teams where it's like Adam Silver's like, look we got
Phoenix here. I mean, you know, listen, Dylan brooks Lee
and the guys. He was drawn and Brown the other night.
He's kind of going off. I gotta give him that
big win for them thirty three points. Uh, Dylan Brooks
runs his.

Speaker 1 (43:51):
Mouth and everybody pays attention to that. But he low
he's low key hooping when he runs his mouth with something.

Speaker 2 (43:56):
Dylan Brooks is a good NBA. But like that's what's
crazy is because of how the and like look Dylan
Brooks has drawn way too much of the Warriors when
he was playing for Memphis, Like it's a lot, but like,
Dylan Brooks has been good everywhere he went, Like they're
they're because like because he wasn't Lebron or Clay Thompson,
people started equating Dylan Brooks. They're like, oh, he's some scrub,
he's actually bad. Like no, Dylan Brooks has been good

(44:17):
everywhere he's gone and internationally for a team Canada, Like
there's a reason, guys what, Like he plays hard, he
plays good defense, Like he gets involved. I mean he's
second on Phoenix in points right now. Like guy's averaging
twenty two a year. You know book right now is
leading the way there obviously, But I mean you talk
about surprising teams that you know you wouldn't necessarily expect,
I mean, not really getting much out of Jalen Green

(44:39):
this year, he's only played in two games. Like, but
these lineups with Dylan Brooks, with Grayson Allen, like with
Mark Williams and Royce O'Neill, like they've been hanging tough.
Like I give him his credit there. We expect that
from out of these Phoenix squads.

Speaker 3 (44:51):
And like you said, with that, Devin book is doing
what you expect Devin Booker to do. But yeah, Dylan
Brooks and Grace Allen even last year with graceon Allen,
it's just like, yo, this he's a legit player, Like
he's bombing Phoenix.

Speaker 2 (45:04):
Got has some luxury too, in the sense that, like
Devin Booker just genuinely seems content there in Phoenix, Like
that team is not really built to win anything right now,
Like you know, you obviously got to hit the hard
reset post those finals teams that we talked a little
bit about earlier in post Kevin Durant, Bradley Beal where
that didn't work out. Like book is twenty nine years

(45:24):
old right now. He's obviously been pretty excellent since he's
entered the league here, but it's been ten seasons. You know,
you start to wonder, you know, they made the finals run,
but they haven't really been competitive since then, so you
start to wonder, like does he get the wandering eyes?
And Devin Booker the whole time, pretty consistently he said, no,
I'm cool here in Phoenix, like I'm gonna sign the

(45:45):
max deal, I'm gonna spend most of my career here
and try to make this work. So like it's just
you know, it's it's a luxury that they have. And
give book a lot of credit for that, like gott
respect the loyalty.

Speaker 1 (45:56):
Yeah, you don't see that often. Like you said, he's
not a diva. You don't really see him John on
the court the most.

Speaker 3 (46:02):
The only thing we've seen where we laugh at him
is that that one offseason where he was complaining when
they were playing pickup.

Speaker 1 (46:07):
He was complaining about being double team.

Speaker 2 (46:10):
Yeah, even when we picked double team in the pickup game, Like, dude.

Speaker 3 (46:14):
You're Devin Booker, like you get you Like of course
you're absolutely it was double team to pick up game.

Speaker 2 (46:19):
It was that it was the early start with that,
and then was when he scored seventy but they lost,
and so it was kind of crazy because like they're celebrating.
It was also weird because it was like, yo, y'all
lost the game. Though, that's crazy. It's like, y'all let
Booker score seventy points and you didn't win the game,
Like that's so unfathomable. No, honestly, no where. I gained
a lot of respect for Booker too the Olympic year
with teams because Booker was doing all the like dirty

(46:41):
work on that play, like he was setting screens, he
was making the right pass, he was playing good defense,
like he didn't remotely like you need someone on that
team with all the and on that team, there's a
clearly established alphas when you have Steph Curry and Kevin
Durant and Lebron James, like you kind of know what
it is. And Poker just never made a people. He's like, no,

(47:01):
I'm just gonna play my role here. I don't think
people expect this out of me, Like they kind of
expect me to be like they need the ball on
my hands type guy. And no, he played really solid
basketball for TMOSA. He deserves a lot of credit.

Speaker 1 (47:14):
Well is it like it's you know, it's one of
the big complaints.

Speaker 3 (47:17):
Obviously, you guys got Maxie and one pick ahead that
he get pressured to it. But it's like, went in doubt,
just pick a damn John Calipari guard, like he has
no miss.

Speaker 1 (47:26):
Like you know what, I'm saying, what you want about
Tyler hero but if you tell me what you.

Speaker 3 (47:30):
Expect Tyler Heerro to be when he gets drafted, he's
that Like it's not his fault.

Speaker 1 (47:34):
He needed him to be more than once Tyli hero is.
But like Cali, part doesn't miss when it comes to.

Speaker 2 (47:39):
Guard, it really is. It's one of the few like
guarantees I'm taking a chance there every time. Crazy back
to back too with Maxie and Desmond Bane both of
them just slipping, and then going back to back with
Memphis and Philly, like just one of those where it's like,
how are both of those guys in the twenties? Just
where the draft doesn't make sense sometimes. But yeah, I

(48:00):
mean in terms of favorites here, yeah, I mean it's
hard for me to say anything against OKAC right now. Uh,
the way they're just locked in it and feels like
they're taking this seriously. You know, the Lakers to me
would be the team if they're going to beat them
in the West out East. I don't know. I feel
like whoever wins that Magic Heat Game is gonna win

(48:24):
the East. But I feel like Okac is gonna win
this championship.

Speaker 1 (48:28):
Yeah. That and that's the.

Speaker 3 (48:30):
Thing, Like I do think we'll they need to beat
the Magic I would guess that the Knicks just because
of course we're still not used.

Speaker 1 (48:38):
To picking the Raptors and things like that.

Speaker 3 (48:41):
But it's just like you're basically playing to lose to
the Okay, see that's I would look especially with like
Wimby's definitely out right.

Speaker 2 (48:48):
Oh yeah yeah. So I mean I guess he could
come back. I guess because it's it's in a few
little bits still, like I don't think it's what I
say was nineteen sixteenth. The championship is sixteenth, So like
there's a there's an time in there where Wenby could
come back. And at that point, yeah, I think he's
I mean, if they get that far, Wemby is taking
everything super seriously. So I think you got to feel

(49:09):
good about that, and that'd be super league would be
thrilled about that. But I mean, look listen, okay, see
I mean even and then again you go back to
the money, Like I do think we underestimate how much
these stars want to play for like the other guys
on the roster, like the you know, the twelve to
fifteen men where it's like, yeah, these guys are on

(49:29):
two way contracts, Like one hundred grand take home means
a lot like that, that means something to them. And
so I think, like I mean sga in comments basically
alluded to that. He's like, no, we want to like
win that money for these guys too. So yeah, they
just feel motivated. I think that's the biggest thing is
it's like, look, and it's nice to see, Okayc's plan

(49:49):
come together, Like give them a lot of credit for
sticking to their guns and having this play out, But
it's like they do they just seem like they they're
not bored of playing with each other yet, like they're not.
They want to check the boxes. They want to be
this dynasty and this all time team. Like it's gonna
be tough out West, but it's hard to really find

(50:09):
a flaw there right now. I mean, and again, I
like the Lakers a lot, I like Denver a lot.
I think Houston is going to be great for the
rest of the season. Like there are multiple teams, like
it's not just gonna be some rollover. It might low key,
like I don't know, we're starting to get there, Like
I keep wonder like it's like are we playing. It
reminds me because like it was always with those years
of the Warriors in KD is where it's like there

(50:31):
is that general like attitude around the league right where
it's like, no, we're all kind of playing for second
right now, Like y'all know that, right even with the
Cavs teams, like with those Calves teams were so good,
Like even like that Calves team that lost to the
first KD team was probably better than the team that
actually beat the seventy three win Warriors. But it's just
was he at KD. There's no chance, like it just

(50:52):
it took everything out of it. Okay, sees not to
there yet where I'm like, nah, where I'm like they're
completely bulletproof, but like we're getting there, like we'll have.

Speaker 3 (51:02):
To see like you said, history never remembers it because
they know winning. But like you mentioned the rockets with
that Warriors team earlier and things like that, they'll have
a kryptonite that they'll struggle against.

Speaker 1 (51:13):
We just don't know who that's gonna be yet.

Speaker 3 (51:15):
I'm always good for mentioning Denver just because how how
big of Joki fans we are, and like it's it's
just hard to turn down.

Speaker 1 (51:23):
But he's just out there doing everything.

Speaker 3 (51:25):
But they'll be a team that they'll struggle against and
be like whoa, Okay, that's it. But I guess it
has to be the Spurs, Like the Spurs, healthy Spurs
team is probably.

Speaker 1 (51:34):
The team is gonna be.

Speaker 3 (51:35):
But yeah, it's just like it's hard to imagine anyone
beating Okay see him for in a seven game series.

Speaker 2 (51:42):
No, I mean I'm with you on Denver as well.
I mean even going back to the playoffs last year, Like,
Denver's the team that pushed them to seven. They really
had them on the road. I mean other than India obviously,
but they were the one that had them on the
ropes the mo doubt. Like you said, Ki is the
best player in the league, playing probably the best basketball
of his career. He is the one guy who could
take over a series and just win it on his own.

(52:03):
I like Denver supporting cast too more than I have
in the past little bit. That's kind of why I'm
more bullish. Like Denver was a team whose window I
kind of felt was closing, and they I think they
did a good job of prying it right back open
a little bit, Like it's never fully closed with Yokic,
but it's like, you know, you could go competitive, or
you kind of go the way that Milwaukee has with
Giannis now right where it's like they're just not really

(52:25):
gonna win anything, like you've already won, so it's not
a failure, the same way Denver's already won with Jokic,
Like you're never gonna call it a failure, but yeah,
is it gonna be you know, multiple titles or is
it gonna be one? I certainly feel better about their
chances here in Denver than I have in a little bit.
But again, it's just it's looming for the first time,
like even these teams have won the past few years.

(52:47):
Like other than maybe maybe I'm wrong there actually, because
Boston two years ago was pretty consistently the best team
from start to finish. They just they had those weird
hiccups in the playoffs occasionally where they would just lose
games that they had no business losing at all.

Speaker 3 (53:04):
I think because they couldn't be they people see them
struggle versus the Heat, So it's just like how good
is this team really when they're struggling versus Jimmy Butler.

Speaker 2 (53:13):
I just remember like they had that series against the
Pacers too, where it was like Halliburn got hurt pretty
early in that series and they just were struggling to
beat this team, and it was more like, no, the
Pacers are beating themselves at this point, like how are
you You're like you're You're Boston. You should be win now.
To their credit, getting Presingis back in the lineup helped
a lot too, like prezingis miss time, and then once

(53:33):
once kp was there, that lineup was just so versatile
you could they could beat you in so many different ways.
But I mean, really though, like none of these it
doesn't feel like there's been that inevitability. I guess that's
the point that I'm trying to make since since the
Katie Warriors teams like they that was the last team
that like truly felt inevitable. We're like, OKC feels like

(53:54):
the first one in a little bit where it's like, hey,
yeah they just might beat this might be like this
may be a fourgone conclusion, Like I don't see who's
beating this team in a seven game series and obviously
a lot and change, but you know, right now, like
we said, the fact that they played this good too
without such a key piece in Jalen Williams, you know,
you just got to give it up. It sometimes like.

Speaker 3 (54:16):
Right right, it almost seems like their follow up is
gonna happen till they have to start paying people and
seeing who they're gonna love.

Speaker 2 (54:24):
Yeah, and that's the big so like you know, with Hartenstein,
for example, with lou Dort, who's been there for so long,
like those are the guys you start to wonder about, like, right,
can you get priced out? But that's just where there's
so much again, there's so much leeways. They have all
these picks. It's like you guys get like you price
sending these guys out. I mean even guys now where
it's like, yo, look at Cason Wallace, who was a
pick for them recently, who's already came in and played

(54:44):
big minutes for them on a team that won the
finals last year, Like they're you know, it'd be one
thing of their track record with drafting was bad, but
their track record with drafting is excellent. Like they They've
been on every pick basically, so it's like, you know,
there it's extremely enviable situation, and you know, you got
to give them credit for uh finishing the job. But

(55:07):
I mean, beyond the NBA Cup, you know early on,
we're about a quarter into the season. Now, are there
any other teams that have really like caught your eye
that you've enjoyed watching so far or that have just
kind of surprised you and are playing better than you expected.

Speaker 3 (55:22):
So I have to say better than expected, because they
started to they started towards last year they started to
play well. But I'm loving the Pistons man, like you
like how you mentioned with Devin Booker, with Kaid cunning
him number one pick was not going good at all
from him, and he's always had the type of game
where he elevates everyone else and they just didn't surround
him with the I guess maybe the talent was too

(55:44):
young at the time, but he's never complained, Like I
barely know what kid cunning him sounds as far as interviews,
But man, the Pistons, they got my boy Duncan Robinson
over there where.

Speaker 1 (55:54):
It still looks weird seeing him in a jersey.

Speaker 3 (55:56):
Not that he does, but they are balling like it's
if I had if I had the gas.

Speaker 1 (56:03):
Right now, where it would be. You know, obviously it's
early and you know injuries, it's okay.

Speaker 3 (56:08):
See Pistons from what I'm seeing, like that's how I
am on Detroit, Like they're Hooper. You know, you got
Jalen Derden who's always been playing well, but you got
the you know, the Thompsons and like that's just such
a fun team.

Speaker 1 (56:20):
Duncan Rominson's putting the ball on the ground driving like that.

Speaker 3 (56:23):
That whole team finally is yelling together and like you said,
changing and you know, we we grew up. The Pistons
recently have been bad, but you know that's growing up.

Speaker 1 (56:34):
The Pistons were always good.

Speaker 3 (56:35):
You got that team that of course that beat the
beat the Lakers and things like that, but even before then, like.

Speaker 1 (56:41):
They were always there.

Speaker 3 (56:43):
The Chauncey billups, the bend the wall is like the
Detroit basketball They've always been a problem.

Speaker 1 (56:48):
So it's good to good to see them back. And yeah,
I'm just loving, loving watching them right now.

Speaker 3 (56:53):
I'm not gonna love it when he have to play them,
but they've definitely been enjoyed to watch it and you man,
I like you young guys, man, Maxy guys. You guys
got something there of course, and being in the injuries.

Speaker 1 (57:07):
And things like that. But I'm letting sleep on you guys. Man.
I know no how Fuily is, but you guys definitely
have hit on some picks.

Speaker 2 (57:16):
I'm fast asleep, but I mean, I you though like
I because I do. I like VJ a lot. I
think Vj's a great pick. Obviously, Max, he's playing out
of his mind this year. He's really just become the
superstar that we thought he could be. It's just an awkward,
weird situation right now because it's like you don't know
if Mban's gonna play on a nightly basis. Frankly, he's
been kind of bad when he's played this year, Like

(57:37):
he just defensively isn't nearly the difference maker he's been.
The lifts just isn't there. I feel like it's just
a bunch of injuries. Like he just looks like he's
been hurt a lot. He doesn't look like the MVP
that he was even two years ago. And again, like
Paul George is here, it's like, well, this contract makes
no sense of we're trying to win now. So it's
like it is it's like that awkward two timelines you've

(57:57):
got going on right now, where it's like they've got
good young players that people should be excited about, Like
Jared McCain is coming back. He looks like he's finally
starting to settle in. Like they've got even like the
dem Bona's and the Justin Edwards of the world, Like
there's guys there. But it's like it's almost like they
need to just blow it up kind of, but they
can in a way because nobody's taking Mbad's contract right now,

(58:20):
Like same thing with Paul George. Like it's just I
don't know, it's a weird situation because like they'll go
out and they'll lose games that you know, they lose
a game to Atlanta the other night in double overtime
that they have no business winning. Then they'll just go
smoke Washington tonight. But it's also like, right, like it's
Washington and you're really reading that much into it. But
so it's it's a weird, awkward spot. I mean, they're

(58:40):
gonna better than they were last year, obviously kind of
a low bar there, but the young guys are worth watching.
Like I don't want to sound like I'm slandering. I
am very high on them. I think they're all gonna
be excellent. VJ was the right pick, like we finally
hit on a high traff pick for once. But Detroit
though back to them yet, Like yeah, I mean defensively
they've been great too, and you know, more OKC propaganda

(59:02):
cleaning the glass if you look at the defensive rating, okay, see,
is so much higher than everybody, like they're like in
their own stratosphere. But number two on top of everybody
else is Detroit. And I think more importantly last year,
you know, with that playoff experience, like getting that seasoning
under the belt a little bit, like you know, a
tough first round lost to the Knicks, who they really pushed.

(59:24):
And I think that was a Knicks team that most
people thought was better than Detroit, and Detroit had him
on the ropes, like they were really like there's a
great chance that was going to Game seven outside of
like a little bit of Detroit fumbling and some Nicks
heroics Jalen Brunson heroics in particular in Game six. But yeah,
I mean now that, like you said, you know, Cade
has blossomed into the superstar that you hope they would be.

(59:46):
There's a lot of depth there with some of these
younger guys as well, who have really come into their
own and yeah, they just they're gonna play. It's just
so fun. It's such a wild turnaround because this team
was so bad, like I mean two year years ago,
like we're talking about a bottom three team in like
NBA history, Like it was that bad. I mean, and

(01:00:07):
Monty Monty Williams man, you want to talk about a
coaching job is aged like milk, Like it was already
aging like milk at the time. But like, oh my god,
they got it. They got literally just by getting rid
of Monty, they got a little more competitive, Like they
didn't even change the roster. They just that was truly
like where it's like, man coaching is actively hurting this team.
You know, Jamie Bickerstaff is a guy now who you know,

(01:00:27):
I have reservations about how far you can go with JB. Bickerstaff.
But Jamie Bickerstaff has also gotten a lot of teams
the playoffs. He's he's taught a lot of foundations, Like
I feel like he set the foundation for a lot
of franchises and just like taught them good habits in
a way. That's what we're seeing now in Detroit. Like
they're they're certainly competitive, right Like you look at this
Eastern Conference, they got to be right there in terms

(01:00:49):
of teams that are have a chance to win the
whole thing, especially if they keep up this defense they've
been playing.

Speaker 1 (01:00:53):
For sure, for sure they may have been saved.

Speaker 3 (01:00:55):
Because you remember what that historically bad team on bad
Pistons team was the year that Winby was coming out.

Speaker 1 (01:01:01):
So can you imagine this this Piston team with Wimby.

Speaker 2 (01:01:04):
Caateen Wemby's nice like that was. And that's also and
Kate is another point to the development where it cracks
me up because it was like Kate Cunningham was a
consensus number one pick. It's not like he came out
of left like he was projected by everyone to be
the number one pick that year.

Speaker 1 (01:01:18):
He got a look of comparisons.

Speaker 2 (01:01:20):
Yeah, like he shined his rookie year. He's pretty good.
He showed you all the flashes he needed. He had
a really bad second year playing for an absolutely horrible team.
He dealt with some injuries and everyone was so ready
to Bury. This kid, it felt like they were talking
about like worst number one picks ever and stuff, and
it's like he's been nothing but a superstar for the
past two years, and it's like, maybe don't hit the
eject button on a number one overall pick two years

(01:01:41):
into his career, Like it has to really go catastrophic
or they have to completely how to you know, forget
how to shoot when they go sign with the Philadelphia
seventy six ers.

Speaker 3 (01:01:50):
Right right now now. Of course, like you said, Jista,
is the is the question?

Speaker 1 (01:01:55):
Mike?

Speaker 3 (01:01:55):
You know, me and Lewis have a running joke because
I don't know if you remember, Man a couple of
years is back, he was like interim coach, Like it
was almost a guarantee that whoever staff he was on,
the head coach was getting fired. Sure, what's the point
where like, dude, you can't be on my staff like
every every coach, everybody.

Speaker 2 (01:02:13):
Yours open you just know what's coming.

Speaker 3 (01:02:17):
Yeah, like you got you gotta go coach on someone
else's staffs. So it is good to finally see him
get get his chance. It's it's like we'll see, like
you said, come playoff time, how much of a difference
you can make because yeah, that, like you said, that
should have at least went to seven.

Speaker 1 (01:02:33):
Like do you point the coaching is it inexperience.

Speaker 3 (01:02:35):
We'll speed a little bit more this year, but he's
definitely the biggest question mark for the for the Pistons.

Speaker 2 (01:02:41):
Yeah, And I mean I think it's too just because
I think the recency is that those calves seems underachieved
in the playoffs and I think that's the knock with
them in general, right, But to be fair, they did
it with Kenny Atkinson last year too, So I think
at that point I go, hey, maybe that's where you
give JB a little tip of the hat and say,
you know, we give him a little bit of credit there.
It's like cause I thought Atkinson did a phenomenal job

(01:03:02):
coaching and it did matter come playoff time. Like that,
maybe it's maybe at some point you start to put
the blame on the players there a little bit. And
I mean that's one of the teams too where it's
you know, we've done a deep dive on Cleveland really
this year, but like that's one of the teams where
they're firmly in the like we got to see it
in the playoffs. Camp and you know we'll see they're
gonna be competitive again. They certainly are again in this
wide open Eastern conference. Thank you everybody for listening to

(01:03:25):
this episode of Driving Dish NBA podcast. Appreciate you guys.
As always, my guy Carleton KB filling in. Make sure
you followm on Twitter at Carlton Underscore KB. Like the letters,
you've heard him here on the podcast A Bunch, make
sure you follow on Instagram to Smell Good Chronicles. Listen, guys, girls,
whatever is going on if you listen to this podcast. Listen.
It's the winter time. Christmas coming up, y'all know you

(01:03:46):
want smell good. You got all these holiday gathering and stuff.
Carlton is the way to go. Truly, he smells good
in real life. I can attest to that, so, like,
you know, because that's the thing is, like, listen, you
can't just have a smell Good page like you have
to actually walk the walk in real life. So you know,
always plenty of good stuff. There a lot of different
reviews and stuff like that. You can get into the
dupe wars and all that too if you want, I mean,

(01:04:09):
what else you got anything? You want to plug where
you get out of here.

Speaker 1 (01:04:13):
No, I was I was gonna get your I do
want to hear a little bit. Get get sixty seconds
of Eagles. Man. I think y'all are just bored.

Speaker 3 (01:04:20):
Well, the Bear's legit good. The Cowboys was inexcusable, but
the Bears, the Bears are legit good. Caleb Williams is
showing why he was number one pick the Bears budget. Jaye,
I should have text you, Jalen, I almost get a
sack Phillips.

Speaker 1 (01:04:34):
He's been like that since the University of Miami. He
will get to the quarterback, he might not get the sack,
and it's gonna restate.

Speaker 2 (01:04:41):
Jalen philis has been. It's funny. He is amazing. First
game with us, like I mean, just like people were
it was. He was the best thing since slic spread.
After that first game, he's been way more good than bad.
I'm happy with that trade so largely overall, I'm interested
to a kind of contract he gets. It depends how
the season will finished. The defense is good. I mean
Chicago's the first game where it was like, look Chicago,
they did you said a great game plan. They ran
the ball over us. The Eagles. I think it's like

(01:05:03):
the most rushing yards they've given up in a game
since like the eighties or something like that, Like the
combo of DeAndre Swift and Manong Guy. Just you know,
hat tip to them. They scheme their ass off and
deserved it. The offense is a knemick and that's the
problem is like, look, certain things, maybe you could expect
more than others. The Saquan regression after his heavy use
last year, the two K yards, all that stuff, maybe

(01:05:25):
that's not that surprising. The offensive line has taking a
big step back. I think that's probably the bigger issue
here too, is that like, look, Lane Johnson has missed
a ton of time, Landon Dickerson's been playing through injuries.
Cam Jurgens has been playing through injuries. I think both
of them don't look quite the same as they did
last year. Tyler Steen has been good, he hasn't been
quite as good as Makai Becton was, so like that

(01:05:47):
matters a lot too, But like, look, for me, what
it all comes down to at the end of the day,
it's like it's all about Kevin Bittulo, like the offensive coordinator.
Like multiple way smarter people than me with NFL have
broken down that the scheme is just bad, Like we
don't scheme receivers open, which is remarkable when you employ
aj Brown and Devonte Smith and then even Dallas Goddard

(01:06:07):
at the tight end position like a really good tight end.
They just aren't getting the ball in their hands and
they aren't letting their playmakers make plays. And even more
with that as well in terms of the predictability with
the offense, they for some reason have also completely decided
to take Jalen Hurts runs out of the like design
Jalen Hurts runs out of the offense, despite the fact

(01:06:27):
that it's been pretty successful even when we ran it
this year. Like, and it's just weird to me because
Nick Siriani has just tethered himself to Kevin Bittulo to
the point where it's like, you know, the Eagles job
is a tough job, there's no way around it. But
like my man, Nick just won the Super Bowl last year,
Like we are still within a calendar year of the
Eagles winning the Super Bowl, and Nick has just decided

(01:06:50):
to burn all his good will on Kevin Bittulo and
just said, no, I'm not making changes, even though like
they so clearly desperately need a change, like Carlton, they
have les projected expected big plays in the Jets offense
and the Saints offense too, Like that's so unexcusable right now,
Like the Jets have scored more points in the past
two or three weeks. I think the Jets have scored

(01:07:11):
seventy eight points in the past two or three weeks.
The Eagles have scored sixty seven in that time. Like
look at who you employ on this roster, Like when
you look and the amount of money that's being put
into it, and I think at the end of the day,
like what I think is the most frustrating. Again, these
are all like play the world's smallest violin. Like we
just won the Super Bowl. I'm not really complaining that

(01:07:31):
hard about it, but it's like because the NFL is
so wide open.

Speaker 1 (01:07:37):
This year, Yeah, you want to take advantage.

Speaker 2 (01:07:39):
It's right there, like the Eagles are. If the Eagles
offense is average, they could win the Super Bowl again
this year. Like it's right like other than maybe the
Rams who just lost to Carolina on the road, Like
there's no real team that has jumped off the page
at all. Like, if anything, all the teams we thought
were gonna win have been kind of disappointing, Like the
Bills look mediocre as hell on defense, The Ravens and

(01:08:01):
Lamar have totally crashed out this year and haven't been
anything near what we expected. A lot of injuries on
that defense as well, Like the NFC, just like it's
a lot of teams that you know have been good,
but it's like I'm too early to put the stock
in them, Like with Drake may and the Patriots, who
have been great, but it's like, am I picking? Am
I really picking them to win the Super Bowl? Right now?
Am I picking the Colts to win the Super Bowl?
Am I picking like Sam Darnold and the Seahawks to

(01:08:24):
win the Super Bowl? Like there's just not that team
where I'm like, yeah, no, that's it, that's gonna happen.
Or like even in the past, like you know, the
past two years of KC obviously being there every year,
but like those San Francisco teams with us like there,
it feels like there have been multiple teams that are
capable of winning the Super Bowl. I feel like there's
like maybe one or two teams that can win the

(01:08:45):
Super Bowl this year.

Speaker 3 (01:08:47):
Well, it's so wide open, and that's the thing like
you said, like I feel like the past wee like
last year, Egles and Eagles and chiefs and good guests,
you know what I'm saying. That's that would have been
a lot of people to guess. Of course, it's the
are the Bill's gonna get over the hump? The raven
stuff like that, like you said, the forty nine ers.
But you had an idea this year, I have no clue.

Speaker 1 (01:09:07):
That's why I think.

Speaker 3 (01:09:08):
I kind of think it's kind of you guys getting
bored and this time you want to do it. You know,
this stagnan in the middle of the middle of the year,
turning on when the playoff time comes. But like I said,
the Bears wasn't good like you said, a good scheme
and stuff like that. The Cowboys, I ain't gonna lie,
bro not to get your excuse me, watch it like
I've seen you. Twenty one nothing and that's that.

Speaker 1 (01:09:28):
Yeah, okay, And they had.

Speaker 2 (01:09:29):
An interception after that, they were up twenty one nothing
and had an interception. They Dallas was driving and they
picked the ball off in the red zone reblanket ship did.
And they still find a way to lose that game,
like they did everything possible, and I think looked like
that's why it's so odd, because like, and that's been
the roller coaster of Eagles football the past two years,
three years. Right, it's like Super Bowl appearance twenty twenty three,

(01:09:50):
They're ten and one and then have the worst collapse
I've ever seen, I mean, like lose five straight to
the likes of like Drew Lock the four win Cardinals,
I mean it was, and then get totally dog walked
by the Bucks in the playoffs, which is like unsurprising
to anyone to watch that season, then come back and
win the Super Bowl the next year, and now this year,

(01:10:11):
I think because of how twenty three ended, and because
so many of these games this year have been close
games that they could have frankly gone either way. That
we've won the Rams game, the Chiefs game, the Buccaneers game,
where it was like, you know, they pulled it off,
but like they exactly like slammed the door there either,
Like they left a lot of these games open. So
I think there are a lot of people who are
jaded from twenty three and see some of those habits

(01:10:32):
starting to creep back in where it's like listen, I'm
with you. I hope that they are bored and not
you know, are are gonna turn it on come playoff time.
I just don't think they are. I haven't seen any
indication that this offense has any idea how to turn
it on. And that's my problem. Was, like the defense
might win them a game or two come playoffs off.
That defense is great, Like I really, you know, there

(01:10:54):
are things that could be better there, but as an
overall unit, they're playing pretty good. Like last week in Chicago,
end the game against the Giants a few weeks, like
the Thursday night game they lost, but like those are
the only two games where I'm like, no, they got
just smoked on defense, like Chago. I mean you I
really give them credit. Like that's the like I haven't
seen many teams just take it to the Eagles like

(01:11:15):
that A was Chicago did like that that game. That
final score was not nearly as indicative of how lopsided
that game was. I say all that to say they're
probably not winning the Super Bowl this year. I hope
they can get recharged, you know, reset recharge. You know,
maybe you're like the you know, totally different sport, but
like the San Francisco Giants and baseball won every other year.

(01:11:36):
You know, maybe that's the Eagles thing. We're gonna decide
to like take every other year seriously. But yeah, it's definitely,
like again, prospective matters. But it's it's disappointing seeing them
lose some of these games, the way they're losing these games,
and just in the fact the offense just looks so inept,
Like it's not even like they're just average and losing games.
It's like, no, they look bad right, right, And.

Speaker 1 (01:11:58):
That that's what's surprising. Like you expect Jalen Hurts and
the boys to at.

Speaker 3 (01:12:01):
Least I'll have a have an offense with the chemistry
that these aren't new pieces at this point, like other
than Sakwan regression even then, you still expect him to
be solid.

Speaker 1 (01:12:11):
But yeah, that's what's surprising. You got a J. Brown
crying crying every other every other game and things like that.

Speaker 2 (01:12:18):
So he's kind of right though. That's the thing is,
it's like, yo, I want to I want to get
him on you. I know, the AJ Brown is a
diva thing, but like he's kind of right here, Like
the scene is terrible and we don't get him the ball.
He's really good what we get him the ball, so like,
I don't know, it's hard to I've a a fatigue,
I think at this point, I think I'm just like,

(01:12:38):
you know what, just it's fine. He goes, go ahead,
like just do whatever you're doing for the rest of
the season. Just leave me out of it.

Speaker 3 (01:12:44):
You could be a Dolphins fan, man, you see you
see where you see we're pulling that crap again?

Speaker 1 (01:12:48):
One game win, one game? What one and six? Fire
a GM. Now we won four straight?

Speaker 2 (01:12:54):
Like what what?

Speaker 3 (01:12:55):
What?

Speaker 1 (01:12:55):
What are you doing now? Now you're runing your draft picks.
We're gonna live in the middle of the draft, like, yeah, doing.

Speaker 3 (01:13:00):
This, it's funny. We finally fired Chris Greer, who's been
the problem that GM. He's been the problem. You know,
Chris Greer left the Patriots in two thousand and two
and came to the Dolphins. The Dolphins has been bad
ever since. He literally started the Patriots dynasty by leaving
their organization, and it took us so long to fire him.

Speaker 2 (01:13:19):
It really is like it's going under I think people
have picked up on it recently, especially this year with
just how bad it's kind of been for Miami. But yeah,
the Dolphins have been in that. You know, I had
the quote for the longest time in the intro of
the show where it was like you never want to
be in the middle or whatever I said back in
the day about you know, it's the worst place to be.
That's kind of where the Dolphins have been. Like, Dolphins
have never been other than that one in fifteen year.

(01:13:40):
They haven't really been like terrible, terrible, but never terrible.

Speaker 3 (01:13:44):
And we drafted left tackle when we went one to
fifteen because that's so Dolphins over Matt.

Speaker 1 (01:13:49):
Ryan the biggest thing.

Speaker 3 (01:13:51):
You know, I've always been neutral and I've always kind
of been to a fan. I wanted them badly out
of Alabama.

Speaker 1 (01:13:56):
We saw how big he was.

Speaker 3 (01:13:58):
I've been new to to it just doesn't have but
like you say what you want about him, Like some
of the things were overblown, like the deep balls and
stuff like that. He didn't have the best deep ball,
but he was always accurate. He always made the right
decisions and stuff like that. Like I don't know where
this tour turn turnover thing came from, Like it wasn't
till two years ago. Last year when he really turned
the ball over. He didn't turn over enough. He would
hold on to the ball so he wouldn't turn the

(01:14:19):
ball over.

Speaker 1 (01:14:20):
But Two, it's just like you watch him.

Speaker 3 (01:14:23):
Two has always been someone who's who's thrived off his
confidence and stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:14:27):
Like that, and he just doesn't have his confidence, his hip,
his hip. He lost all mobility.

Speaker 3 (01:14:32):
He used to be able to escape sacks and things
like that. Like I'm seeing him take sacks that too.
It didn't take I'm out on.

Speaker 1 (01:14:39):
Him man like.

Speaker 3 (01:14:40):
And that's why I don't want to win these damn games,
because I don't want Like I don't know how much
of the Saints game you lost you watched last week,
but it was it was just so Dolphins, like they're
they're handling the Saints easily.

Speaker 1 (01:14:54):
The Saints score touchdown.

Speaker 3 (01:14:56):
Minka Fitzpatrick of all people, get to pick two on
the two point conversion to put us up for instead two, and.

Speaker 1 (01:15:02):
Then the Dolphins give up the on side kick.

Speaker 3 (01:15:04):
We call the time out before the because we don't
have the on side kick team out for whatever reason.
It's a minute left and you're down for Oh, why
wouldn't you think the team's gonna kickick? So we call
it on side kick to I guess put the hands
team out there, and then you still have Oneman looking
at the ball to let the says get the on
side kick. I'm just like, why am I watching this
game and I'm watching just expecting the Dolphins to lose

(01:15:26):
this game.

Speaker 1 (01:15:27):
Well, of course, not because that will give him a
better draft pick. It's when they win.

Speaker 2 (01:15:30):
It really is unfortunate because I think it's it's like
every Dolphins fan wanted to y'all are right and wanting to,
and it just hasn't worked like I think it's. It's
it's not even like it was the wrong pick. I
don't think there's any buyer's remorse there. It just stinks
because it doesn't work. Like sometimes. It's to a lesser
extent what I think Jags fans are dealing with with
Trevor Lawrence right now. It's like you really thought, I
mean Trevor three and four. I get they have to

(01:15:55):
there's not really an option.

Speaker 1 (01:15:56):
I wish you were in Jacksonville, keV.

Speaker 3 (01:16:00):
I am John Snow, But when you pull that out,
tell him your guy is trash.

Speaker 2 (01:16:06):
If you like it, I love him, but your guy
I think it's crazy too, because I think, like you're right,
the rest of the roster is good enough to prop
it up and if he's okay, they'll compete. But it's
like I need I just need him to not throw
three or four interceptions and they'll be But it just
stinks because, like everybody I knew how it is that
college people were rejecting Trevor Lawrence fet generational, and he's
just been like he's been okay, like he's been fine,

(01:16:27):
I guess, but real average. Hopefully you think this episode
was real average. Shout out to my guy Carlton again.
We'll talk to you guys soon.

Speaker 1 (01:16:36):
I think he's done dance today. Want to dance Wednesday?
See your star side?

Speaker 2 (01:16:41):
Okay, money are I think they can

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