Nico Harrison & Willie Green are Headed for Unemployment

On this episode of The Drive & Dish NBA podcast, hosted by Kevin Rafuse (@rafusetolose) and Justin Cousart (@JustinContheAir), the guys start the show with the Pelicans firing Willie Green as coach. A discussion if Willie was the scapegoat and what the Pelicans should do next with Zion Williamson continuing to deal with injuries. Next, Bradley Beal is out for the season with a hip fracture. How the Clippers can potentially replace his production and if they need to make a move now. A quick look at the West then before the guys dive into Nico Harrison getting fired as GM of the Mavericks after a 3-10 start to the team. A final look at his tenture and the Luka trade and if post-Nico firing, the Mavs are likely to trade Anthony Davis and Kyrie Irving. In Who's Ballin Who's Fallin, Steph Curry leaves Under Armour, Christian Braun will miss 6 weeks with an ankle sprain, the surging Pistons and Pat Bev's arrest. Finally, the return of Immaculate Grid. Listen to the show wherever you get your podcasts and watch the show on YouTube!

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
This is the Drive and Dish podcast. There was the
Drive and.

Speaker 2 (00:07):
Welcome to you.

Speaker 1 (00:10):
To start it off.

Speaker 2 (00:11):
It's Kevin and let's go. So I guess you could
say a slow news start to the NBA season. I know,
at least for me, this is my first podcast since
the NBA season has started. What we're like fourteen to
fifteen games in. I only had to disappear for three weeks.
No big deal?

Speaker 1 (00:30):
Are you here about this season?

Speaker 2 (00:32):
I guess. I guess I feel like I haven't been
able to talk basketball in like years because of it.
And it's so funny because I had to teach a
class down in Flagler about podcasting and the whole thing
was like, consistency is key, and I'm like, I'm such
a fraud for saying that that's consistency is key. I

(00:53):
haven't been on the podcast in three weeks. No big deal.

Speaker 1 (00:56):
Well that's all right. I over or underpromised an over
delivered because at the end of last episode with Chasing
and shout out to our guys Nick Renowitz and Chase
Bunker for filling in the last two episodes, But at
the time I didn't know if our schedules were going
to link up and I and I misread your one
text you had sent me, like right at the end
of the episode, you sent me a text and I

(01:16):
was like, I told the listeners. I was like, oh man, bummer,
I don't think Justin's going to be back next week,
but now here we are a new podcast. Justin is
indeed back. So how about that talk about over delivering
for your listeners.

Speaker 2 (01:26):
We're finally We're finally back and and you know, I
joked slow start, but a lot of NBA news, especially
one that just happened this morning as of we were
starting to record this. But you know, we're going to
talk about Bradley Beal being being out, We're going to
talk about the Nico firing. But before we get into that,

(01:48):
I guess the most recent news is this Willie Green news.
They've they've fired him and they started the season two
and ten. It hasn't been a great start. You know,
the ownership in front office came out saying this is
a difficult decisions blah blah blah. But but to that,
it has felt like the Pelicans have been in this

(02:09):
weird like can't really win, don't really make an impact
in the NBA season weirdness for the last few years. Really,
the last time we were hyped about the Pelicans is
when they got Zion, and even that hasn't really like
become a thing. And I know injuries are a part

(02:29):
of that and whatnot, but but yeah, here we are.
You know, do you see this as like a throw
in the towel for the season already type move?

Speaker 1 (02:43):
I mean, it might be the the Pelicans are just
so disappointing, and like part of this is Willie Green,
I guess, but like a lot of it comes down
to the fact that you're right, it's injuries. It's their
guys haven't been playing. I mean, you look in Zion now,
who's dealing with a hamstring injury here yet again, he's
only played what five games this season so far? This
is his fourth straight season now that he's been dealing
with Like it just feels like somebody is always missing

(03:06):
on this roster, like they're never at full strength. And
they made the playoffs twice under Willy Green's tenure. But
even then, like I remember, they got out of the
playing game and it felt like they were really turning
the corner. And it's the exit that inspired that famous
Charles Barkley, like we got to send him to Gavelston,
not can kuon rant because they looked so lifeless against

(03:27):
the Lakers when they got eliminated. And you know, again,
I don't know how much of this I place on
Willy Green. I'm not necessarily surprised, like somebody has to
be escaped. Go Willy Green's been here for five years now,
he's one hundred and fifty and one hundred and ninety overall.
You know, this team has never just accelerated the way
they wanted to. But it's hard for me to necessarily

(03:49):
look around in what's happened in New Orleans during those
five years and go, yeah, it was coaching that was bad.
It's like, no, they just aren't hurt all the time.
That's what's going on. Zion Williamson, who's supposed to be,
you know, one of the premier talents in the NBA,
can't stay on the court. Like we've seen that. We've
seen enough of that at this point.

Speaker 2 (04:07):
I feel like scapegoat and being injured, not being able
to stay on the court are really gonna be the
topics we keep bringing up this entire podcast. I'm not
lying like that is very much where I think we're
going with this. But obviously, you know, they got a
new EVP last year, so I wonder if that's a
part of it too, finding a coach that maybe Joe

(04:31):
sees more eye to eye with. I don't know if
there was any you know, back and forth on that,
but that also kind of feels like a little bit
of what this happens because he took over in April
of what was that April of last year or this year,
I should say last season, So maybe there's a little
bit of that as well. But then it does it
goes back to the like this kind of feels like

(04:53):
it closes the window on whatever this attempt was.

Speaker 1 (04:58):
Hey, you know, the Pelicans should fully by at this point,
like they're not playing for anything this season. This roster
is going nowhere fast. This is projected to be you know,
I feel like we say this every year, but the
twenty twenty six draft is projected to be loaded and
filled with talent, but it actually is. Though there's no
benefit to them winning games right now, especially if Zion's
not healthy. And Zion's unhealthy, this roster is going nowhere.

Speaker 2 (05:21):
Do you think they should consider trading Zion.

Speaker 1 (05:28):
What's his value? Like that's kind of my problem with
Zion is, like what do you even get for Zion
Williamson at this point? Like Zion, I hate saying this,
but like he feels like a concept more than a
player at this point, Like we're just we keep talking
about something that is just never consistently happened, Like why
would I give up anything of value for Zion Williamson
at this point? I mean, that's something we're going to

(05:49):
talk about, not to the Zion extent. It's not that bleak,
but like that's I think that's what we're going to
talk about a little bit with Anthony Davis. So when
we get to the Mavericks talk a little bit later, No,
I think the Pelicans should. I don't know if you
trade Zion on just because again the value is so
up in the air right now. But like I look
at the rest of this roster and it's like, yeah,
you bet the John Ta Murray. You've got Jose Alvarado,

(06:10):
You've got Herb Jones. Like those are guys who have
value and maybe you can go get something for like
maybe you move a Cidik Bay and he gets you
something like those are the guys that you should be
blowing it up where they genuinely still are like players
who are in they're probably all these players with the
exception I mean Murray's twenty nine, but like these are
all guys in their late twenties, Like they're very much
still in their prime. I think they could go to

(06:31):
other rosters and make an impact right now. Like that's
what the Pelican The Pelicans should be stripping this for
parts right now and trying to give their young guys
more minutes.

Speaker 2 (06:39):
Well, I guess that's the weird That's where the weird
part with Zion for me comes in, right, Like you're
if you're stripping the team and not trading Zion, I
guess that tells me a little bit you're still trying
to build or be around Zion because when he is
healthy and players like he's good. You see the numbers,
he's he's a good player, and he's young. So again,

(07:00):
and like you could still potentially do that, but even
with the guys you have now where you go trade
and get guys, if Zion can't be healthy and on
the court, you don't necessarily know what you need to
build him around him with.

Speaker 1 (07:13):
Yeah, well, right, I mean, the most positive thing you
can say for Zion is he's still twenty five years old,
Like because Zion came in the league at nineteen, like
he was super young. But the most he's ever played
in the season was two years ago, and when they
were he played seventy games two years ago. Beyond that,
I mean when he his twenty twenty one season, he
played sixty one games. He was an All Star that year.

(07:34):
But like we're looking at twenty four twenty nine thirty
games last year and so far just five this year,
Like it, what else there's that? I mean, you're right,
he's objectively good when he plays, like he's had over
He's averaged over twenty two points ever in the league.

Speaker 2 (07:48):
And that's why I wonder if there's a team that
would be willing to pay maybe a little bit higher
than his diminished value is right now for that.

Speaker 1 (07:57):
I just thought of a disgusting trade in my life head,
and I don't think there's any value to it, but like,
could you imagine if like Memphis and New Orleans swap
Job and Zion, Like do you think either of those
teams would do that? And that is gross? But it
feels like that's the ultimate reset for both of them.
I don't know, I'm not saying I endorse this for
either side, but like that's the type of like weird

(08:20):
swap I feel like you could get with Zion right
now where it's like, yeah, you know what, what other
disgruntled star can we take on our hands?

Speaker 2 (08:27):
Well? And I wonder if there's like a like to me,
you know, like a team that it would have to
work money wise, So like that's a big part of it, right,
and we're not diving into that bit of it, but
like what about like a team that already has like
a top maybe three people on their team, you know,
score wise, that they are not worried about that, so

(08:49):
like the pressure on Zion wouldn't be there, like like
to me, like like what if it was like a
Timberwolves or like a Knicks or something like that where
they pretty much have the score figured out and whatever
you think can come in and contribute would obviously make
big sense. I just would depend on what would have

(09:10):
to be sent obviously to get them. And I don't
think there's anything like that or is it like because
you know, again back to the Zion wanting to be
in a bigger market type thing. I think that was
a rumor for a while there too. Is it like
a Knicks thing where or of not mixing a Nets
thing where like I don't know, you find a way
to just two teams that probably aren't really doing much

(09:31):
this year just swap things to try to save some
money or figure out how to get people out of contracts,
or swap some picks to maybe clean slate, if that
makes sense.

Speaker 1 (09:40):
I'm trying to. I feel like Portland inquired about Zion.
I don't remember when I could. I don't think I
would make the mission. Yeah, but that's the type of
team where I think that makes sense. Like Brooklyn two,
I think you mentioned makes sense, like they have a
ton of assets. They're not necessarily but you know again,
I mean I think they're all relatively doing the same
thing this year anyway. Less of Portland obviously, but like Brooklyn. Yeah,

(10:00):
they're told they're all for sure playing for the lottery
this season, so I mean.

Speaker 2 (10:03):
So like maybe there's a way to do that. And
then it's like cool, we'll take a we'll take a
swing on a low value for Zion and and you know,
we didn't think whatever pick down the line would pan
out anyway, So let's do that. Let's be bad this
season and kind of get some more stuff. I don't know,
it just it's gonna be a bummer season, I think
for the Pelicans, who probably had playoff aspirations this year.

(10:28):
And I know we don't like jumping to conclusions this
early on in the season, but I mean, you know,
two in whatever it was, I forget the record off
the top of my head, but that's not great and
not a great start, and at this point probably tells
you all you need to know.

Speaker 1 (10:42):
Yeah, I mean, they're the only reason. I think it's
it's crazy that there are three teams that somehow have
a worse record than two and ten right now at Brooklyn, Brooklyn, India,
and Washington all at a cool one and eleven right now.
Washington currently has lost ten in a row as we
record this podcast. Yeah, it's you know again, I feel like,

(11:02):
you know, Willie Green definitely may have been the scapegoat here,
but it's not necessarily a surprise. They have to pick
a direction. But I think, like you said, with the
new management coming in, you know, they're they were going
to want their people that it's usually how that works, so,
but right, a little bit, a little bit disappointing because
you thought, you know, the Pelicans have been playing for
picks for a while now, like they've gotten a taste

(11:22):
of the playoffs and never have gone any further of it.
So it's like that is disappointing when you draft somebody
who had as much hype as Ion does. It's like, man,
you go back and you watch those Dukes Ion tapes
and it just like looks like another planet at this point,
and it's a shame like because it is. It is
all injury based. It is essentially really you know, it
feels like in the past few seasons especially, he's lost
the weight, he's taken the fitness part seriously. So that's

(11:45):
where it's just still his body is not cooperating. That's
extremely unfortunate. Speaking of bodies not cooperating, Bradley Beal is
now out for the season. It's hip prasture. Yeah, and
so this is crazy, Like I mean, basically, they initially
said he had hip soreness he was out for They
had ruled him out against back on November eighth against Atlanta,

(12:08):
and then they ended up going to do an MRI
and it was way worse. It was this fracture, which
again has now knocked him out for the rest of
the season. I mean, you talk about teams that have
disappointed in the West, the Clippers are one of them
so far. You know, we an excellent season last year.
We're currently they're four and eight as of recording this podcast.
Now again losing a major contributor in Beal, ironically against Phoenix,

(12:31):
the team that you know, he came over from this
past season, and now you're, you know, only six games,
you get a Bradley Beal again, you know, averaging just
a modest eight points a game. He was only playing
about twenty minutes, but still like he was somebody that
was expected to really uh you know, to give them
a lot of punch off the bench. And with a
team that's already missing Kawhi Leonard. The good news there

(12:52):
is that one that ankle injury doesn't seem to be
too serious. But again, like they're they're lacking firepower right now.
This is tough. It's gonna be you know, tough sledding
a little bit right now for the Clippers.

Speaker 2 (13:03):
Yeah, and and and it does open up the conversation
with Bradley Beal too a little bit like we were
just talking about with Zion, is is like injury risk
with Bradley Beal. Though I will admit this one is
like a one off freak, injury have started to become
a very consistent thing with him as to if he's
going to be healthy enough to be on the court.

(13:27):
Like you said, in the six games that he did play,
who was supposed to be a good offensive punch for
the Clippers, he had career lows. But yeah, I think
we're at the point with with Bradley Beal is like,
you know, they didn't need him to be the Bradley
Beal in Washington, but they did need him to be
the scoring punch. And now he's out, and now this

(13:49):
injury history really becomes a conversation as to what to
expect from Bradley Beal for the rest of his career.
Career Really obviously we most see them this season, but
but like going forward, No.

Speaker 1 (14:01):
It's super valid. I mean, he's thirty two years old
at this point. And it's funny because he dealt with
injury so early on in his career, and that was
one of the early questions in Washington. You know that
twenty twelve to twenty fifteen season, he never really played
a full year, but then he was, he was pretty healthy.
I mean he played all eighty two games in twenty
eighteen or twenty seventeen season, and then the twenty eighteen
twenty nineteen season he played all eighty two for Washington.

(14:24):
You know, even his latest twenty twenty he's still playing sixty.
But really it's like, you know, you get to the
post COVID era and those last two seasons of Washington
forty and fifty games. Both seasons in Phoenix he only
played fifty three, Like he's obviously of only gonna played
six this year for the Clippers when all said and done, Like, yeah,
it's valid. Like again, you talk about guys where their
body has betrayed them a little bit, and I think

(14:45):
that's definitely true here with Bradley Beal. You know, shooting
a career low field goal percentage of this year overall,
his three point shot is dipped a little bit. His
effective field goal percentage was way down, Like we're talking
forty four percent down from even the to Phoenix siares
he was a fifty eight to fifty seven percent. So
like I think the decline was already on a little

(15:06):
bit for Bradley Beal, but yeah, I mean there's gonna
be you know, it's gonna be what you have left
in the tank. Like it's again that's part of Lebron
still playing, Like the Lebron impact, right is, like we
expect these guys to get well into their late thirties.
But yeah, it's there are valid questions to ask what
type of you know, he has going forward and what

(15:26):
can he contribute? And for the Clippers right now, like, yeah,
they're a bit of a mess. They got to figure
it out. Like you know, Bogdanovics has kind of been
out of the rotation. He hasn't played the last two games.
Really for them, maybe he gets back in. Is they
need a little bit more scoring punch. But you know,
for as as much as we talk about that, it's
their defense has been terrible too. Their defense is twenty
six in the league right now.

Speaker 2 (15:47):
Yeah, and and you know another note, I guess with
Bradley Bial being out because like a big part of
it too is those three, like all their their stars.
Essentially we talk about load management between j Hardened Kawhi, Leonard,
Bradley Bial and now with Bradley out like that kind
of has to go a little bit out the window,
especially with the record already slipping a little bit, Like

(16:09):
you're gonna have to push on this a little bit
to stay in contention. And with a team like Bradley Bill,
James Harden, Kawhi Leonard on paper, that's a team that's
a win now team, right, that's not a figure it
out down the line, start building some talent teams. So yeah,
I think they are gonna have to lean on, you know,

(16:31):
Zubac and Derek Jones Junior a little bit more. And
like you said, Bogdanovic, you know, and and and see
what they can get out of some of these guys
to help at least this season obviously, because because Bradley
Bill is gone, he's not coming back this season.

Speaker 1 (16:47):
So no, And I mean this is the risk too
with with having one of the older rosters in the league.
I mean, look, you know, Chris Paul is forty, Brook Lopez,
James Harden, Nick Batuam, Kawhi, Bogdanovich, like even Chris don
Now is thirty one. Like you've got the for guys
that are getting major minutes. It's like you've got the
new addition in John Collins is twenty eight. Derek Jones
and Zubach are still both twenty eight as well. You know,

(17:10):
you've got a few other guys contributing, but largely their
bigger minutes are going to older guys, and so that
was kind of the risk here. I mean, they've already
been mentioned in trade rumors a little bit, like I've
already seen you know, them getting floated as baby a
potential Anthony Davis souiter. We'll see if they get involved
in that market. And I mean, look, it's I think
it's a lot less bleique for them than the Pelicans obviously,

(17:32):
Like you know, we're looking at the standings like they're
four and eight, but they're right there with Utah right
now for that playing position.

Speaker 2 (17:37):
In their scenario. We can still pull the like hey,
it's still real early in the season conversation like we
were not having with the Pelicans. But to that point,
you know, some some advanced stats like the Clippers are
the worst team in the league for opponents points off
turnovers too, so like no ball security should I mean

(17:58):
it's James Harden, so like you kind of expect that
a little bit more, but like you asked, you know,
Chris Paul's it like you got guys that should be
able to protect the ball a little bit more so,
just a kind of little little side note on that.

Speaker 1 (18:10):
Yeah, And I mean, look like we talk in the
Western Conference all the time too, like the separation is
already beginning a little bit, and that's gonna matter when
this conference is so loaded. I mean, Okay, se is
twelve and one right now, Denver is nine and two,
Houston is eight and three.

Speaker 2 (18:25):
Sorry to your conversation with the separation, I would say
we've almost already seen it in the East, Like there's
already separation. It's Hornet's nets, Pacers, Wizards, nothing. The rest
are at least in contention right now. Celtics surprisingly the
bottom of that list, understandably with the Jason Tatum injury.

(18:46):
But I didn't think they would slip that bad.

Speaker 1 (18:48):
Interesting, well, like we're not going to pivot this into
a full Celtics conversation about that, not to cut you
off justin, but like the Celtics are top ten and
I saw this on the Ringer. They're top ten in
offense and defense right now, and they're six and seven
because they just have been horrible in the clutch and
so many of these games. I mean even a game
they they their NBA Cup game against the Sixers. They

(19:09):
did so much to give that game, but they ended
up winning the game by one point. But they had
like a nine point lead or something with a minute
and a half left and just did everything possible to
lose that game. The Sixers just missed a shot at
the end of the game. It's like, it's so odd
for them to be like, you know, you look at
that roster and the way they're playing right now, and
it goes you know, I think there were a lot

(19:29):
of people and they you know, we talked in the
offseason about them getting rid of some of their older guys.
It felt like they're restarting a little bit. But the
way the roster's playing right now, I think you look
around and you go, hey, we're gonna ad Jason Tatum
to this roster next year, Like we might just you know,
hang on for a year, like give us a suck,
we might be ready to attend and be just right.

Speaker 2 (19:47):
Back at and not even that to your point is
like if the games are like that, like you know,
if if the the pendulum this sway to the losing
side of that ratio, Like you would imagine that will
swing back and they'll start getting some of those wins,
be right back in it. And I'd say that to
be like two more wins and they're sitting at like fourth,
you know what I mean, Like it is very close.

(20:07):
The Knicks, like to put it in perspective, the Celtics
star six and eight, the Knicks, who are second are
eight and four. Like, it's very close. Still, Pistons run
like already look like they might be running away with
the number one spot. Why does that feel very similar
to what the Cavs did last year? But I'll just.

Speaker 1 (20:24):
Business later you're already shading them. Wow, that's crazy. We
didn't even exet to that yet.

Speaker 2 (20:29):
But I'm not going to bring up the fact that,
you know, the Sixers are are higher than the Magic
I did mention that to Chase in the hall the
other day.

Speaker 1 (20:37):
You know, I don't even want to talk about that though,
because how can I be talking smack right now? You
talk with the Pistons. They just beat the Sixers last
night and they even have all their players and they
want to talk about I don't know, Well, we'll talk
some more east here in a little bit that's come
a little preview for Who's balling, Who's falling. Welcome everybody
to the Driving Ish NBA podcast. My name is Kevin Rafuse,
joining me as always my co host Justin Khuo's art.

Speaker 2 (20:58):
I've done the podcast so long, I forgot to get
a stat.

Speaker 1 (21:02):
Oh. I thought you were gonna say you forgot what
the intro is, and I'm like, oh, I problemise, like, buddy,
come on, for twelve years, I know you forget it
that way.

Speaker 2 (21:10):
No, I literally forgot to grab his stat. So here
we are. Thanks for having me back.

Speaker 1 (21:15):
Let me see if I can find it out here.
I'll pull up brad I saw got Bradley Beal's page up.
Let me see if I'll pull up a Bradley Beal's
stat here real quick. Let's see his advance is. Bradley
Beal's best overall box plus minus was three point four
in twenty twenty and twenty twenty one with Washington.

Speaker 2 (21:37):
Yeah, sixth.

Speaker 1 (21:39):
His WARP was two point nine. I mean he made
he was an All Star that year. He made All
NBA third Team. That's actually he's only ever made one
All NBA team and that was that third team in
twenty twenty, twenty twenty one.

Speaker 2 (21:49):
Okay, I'll dig it. Listen, Bradley Beal on Washington because
Washington was bad will always be like underrated.

Speaker 1 (21:58):
Oh dude, that's always well, that's like their old bright spot.
Like you look back at the past fifteen years of
Wizards basketball and you have that that John Wall Bradley
Beal duo is pretty much the only little bit of
light in the darkness. It's been pretty miserable other than that,
including this season. Now where again one and eleven currently,
So yeah, I think a lot of Wizards fans will

(22:18):
very fondly reminisce on John Wall and Bradley Beal.

Speaker 2 (22:22):
I find it interesting that under the clutch category for
teams this season, Oklahoma City Thunder lead the league in
clutch points with eighteen point three in clutch time situations.
The bottom interesting, well, they haven't done a lot, so
I guess that's it's a weird stat to kind of

(22:43):
look at. But the Knicks are at the bottom.

Speaker 1 (22:47):
Yeah, I mean it's early. The Knicks now too. You
gotta worry about Brunson, Like that's the big thing too,
is now Brunston Seale with that ankle sprain like that
to me is more stuff you don't want to You
don't want to rush him back there obviously, And knicks
are fine, Like I'm not really worried about the Knicks
at this point.

Speaker 2 (23:03):
No, I agree with you. I'm fine with that too.

Speaker 1 (23:07):
So especially in the East, Like I said, you know,
we talked about the West and the standings figuring itself out,
like the East has a lot you have a lot
more leeway to figure it out, to say the least.

Speaker 2 (23:15):
So, yeah, is there is there a team in the
West that's kind of surprised you at least record wise
so far.

Speaker 1 (23:22):
Yeah, Phoenix probably at eight and five. They've had a
really nice start there, nobody really besides I mean, they're
they're kind of teams that we expected. It's good to
see the Spurs doing you know, we again we've challenged
wenby a little bit. You know, it's good to see
him starting to take the leap in this team taking
the leap.

Speaker 2 (23:40):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (23:41):
I don't want to say Utah is a surprise At
four and eight that feels like disingenuous a little bit.

Speaker 2 (23:45):
Mean, at five hundred six and six, it feels feels
better than I probably would have given them credit.

Speaker 1 (23:50):
And especially given the fact that their head coach got
arrested for gambling at the start of the season. So yeah, no,
I'm pretty impression with the job Tiaco splitters doing that
right now.

Speaker 2 (24:00):
Actually, that's my that's my favorite. What was the what
was the tweets going on? Be like super bummered and
see that my team isn't involved in any of the
gambling issues. We're just actually bad.

Speaker 1 (24:15):
What a world? Leave us a review on iTunes, good
or battle read them on the podcast if you're not
an Apple user, Google Play Store, speakers, Spotify, tune in,
Amazon Music, Player, FM, Spotify. I think I said that
I don't remember anywhere you can find a podcast, though
you can find.

Speaker 2 (24:28):
Us yep and find us on YouTube. We have a
video version of the podcast. If you would like to
comment chime in, you can do so there as well.
Just search driving Dish NBA podcast on YouTube. You can
sign up and you will get notifications when new episodes
are coming out. Just it's like you can on the podcasting.

Speaker 1 (24:45):
Platforms now words more sponsors.

Speaker 2 (24:49):
To Scapegoat being the name of really the podcast Scapegoat
and injuries.

Speaker 1 (24:56):
Pretty much you are shooting Nico so much bail by
get him scapegoat credit right off the rip. I mean, really,
are we calling the like? I guess a little bit, but.

Speaker 2 (25:07):
Really, I mean, think about it this way. There's no
way Nico just did that trade without getting any kind
of permission somewhere else. Yeah, no ownership did, I say, scapegoat.

Speaker 1 (25:20):
No, And I'm with you, owner, Mavericks ownership absolutely should
be just as much or get as much for Nico
the way they did, because you're right, I agree that
trade does not get signed off on without ownership.

Speaker 2 (25:30):
Like.

Speaker 1 (25:30):
I don't think Nico Harrison just went rogue here and
called the like. I think he orchestrated the trade for sure.
But I'm with you. The Mavericks ownership absolutely deserves a
ton of flak forgetting and probably don't get. I mean,
the problem is you can't go fire ownership unfortunately, and
to that, you.

Speaker 2 (25:45):
Know, the only thing you can do from an ownership
level to try to get the fans at least bought
back in is get rid of the main focal point
that they're clearly frustrated with, which was Nico. So that's
why I say scapegoat, Yes, did he build the grave
that he is in now pretty much, yeah, he did.
But I say scapegoating the fact that like if fans

(26:08):
are like, cool, the problem's fixed, it's like you might
be uh, you might have the wool over your eyes
a little bit there.

Speaker 1 (26:15):
Well, it's like, look, I feel like Nico got shot
a lifeline obviously over the summer when you get the
number one overall pick and you get the right to
draft Cooper Flag.

Speaker 2 (26:23):
But that's the crazy part to me, is like, you
guys have Cooper Flag and the vibes around the Mavericks
are still so terrible.

Speaker 1 (26:29):
Yeah, well, and that's the thing is, it's like, look,
it's just it still remains baffling. And the Luca trade is,
if not already it's certainly a top three bad trade
in NBA history. It could very well be number one
by the time all said and done. Honestly, it doesn't
look great. Of course, then when you look over at
Luca and you look over at the Lakers and say, hey,

(26:50):
they're nine to four right now. Luca's basically averaging forty points,
just absolutely phenomenal right now. And Dallas with Cooper Flag
is at the bottom of the Western Conference. This is
a team that was in the finals two seasons ago. Like, yeah,
the vibes are bad, and part of it is, you know,
part of it is injuries. They missed a lot of
time this year. You know, Anthony Davis has been hurt.
You know, Daniel Gafford has been hurt, Derek Lively has

(27:11):
been hurt. Like that adds up to a little bit.
There was a learning curve for Cooper Flag, Like there's
just a lot going on. Obviously Kyrie Irving hasn't played
all season, but this was again it just goes back
to the point that it was like Nico blew this,
blew up the luke a roster, Yeah, for an extremely
short window that now already appears closed. Like this was

(27:32):
a team that was supposed to be nowhere near the
lottery at this point. They were supposed to be making
a run back to the finals, and instead it doesn't
look like anything like it. And so yeah, I think
Nico should have been fired the day after he made
that trade, like point blank period, like that was so unforgetable.
It also just doesn't help either that like other little
moves didn't work, like, for example, the Quinn Grimes trade,
Like Quinn Grimes moving right after that trade, you know,

(27:54):
they sent him to the Sixers for Caleb Martin. Quinn
Grimes has been pretty good since coming to the Sixers,
Like he's been a super great spark off the bench.
It's been a punch that they need where you know,
Caleb Martin hasn't really done much for the Mavericks at all.
Like it just it's bad trade after bad trade. It
needed to be done. You were at the point too
with the Luca trade where you more damningly you've lost

(28:15):
all credibility with your fans, like you've lost like you
run the risk of building apathy around the franchise, which
is crazy. When you have somebody of the talent that
Cooper Flagg is coming in, you have to start over.

Speaker 2 (28:27):
And you like, like the other way you start potentially
winning the fan base back is like getting Dirk involved
a little bit more because even Dirk's making some comments.
You just get some of the legends in there. Maybe
it's just some kind of like I don't know, weird
role that just gets them in there to make them
happy with them, you know what I mean. But like
even Dirk's making comments like bro, this is bad.

Speaker 1 (28:50):
Like I mean, Dirk went to Luca's first game out
and now, yeah, like that's that says so much without
actually saying anything, like and look, I think there werelationship
with the Maps and their fans will heal over time.
I think this will get better at the start of
it by firing Eco. But like, I get it, dude,
that that is such a like And I've seen the

(29:10):
sixs in my fan hood. Do some mind numbingly yeah,
just silly things over the past fifteen twenty years of
my life. I went bowling last night. I remember when
Andrew Bindham got hurt bowling like that. But like, buddy,
that is a walk in a park compared to a
Luca trade. I would wish a Luca trade on anybody.

Speaker 2 (29:29):
Dude, I saw there's a I think it's actually here
in Jacksonville. I gotta look it up. There's a bowling
alley here. And I really don't want to say this
with confidence because I'm not confident now, so I'm a
little nervous to say I'm pretty sure there's a bowling
alley here that's doing a special. If you go on
this certain day and pay to play and bawl over

(29:51):
a two hundred, they'll give you one hundred and fifty
dollars sick, okay, right, Like I'll take that risk. I'll
go have a few bruise and hopefully win one hundred
and fifty bucks.

Speaker 1 (30:00):
No, yeah, I would definitely take that chance. Like, I mean,
what's the highest you've ever bowl?

Speaker 2 (30:04):
Maybe broken like two hundred ones? Like I definitely don't
think I've ever broken two hundred. But like I wonder
what the math is on that, because there's no way
they're not doing that knowing that'll be profitable, you know
what I mean?

Speaker 1 (30:14):
I mean two hundred is hard, like like it is
hard to get to two hundred.

Speaker 2 (30:18):
I know, But I think it's the same thing with
Curtis Devora Kieran Jacksonville. I might have told you about this,
but he he owns.

Speaker 1 (30:26):
This island where it's.

Speaker 2 (30:28):
It's a drive. It's like I think it's like one
hundred and twenty five island, Little Green. He puts it
out in the water and you could buy I think
it's six balls to hit for ten bucks. If you
get a hole in one, he'll pay you ten thousand dollars.

Speaker 1 (30:42):
That's so much harder, right, and like because.

Speaker 2 (30:45):
He because he knows the math on it, and he's
like one in every Like, however, many's going to go
in and he'll still be profitable that way. And so
he went out and got a loan for you know
whatever it is, fifty thousand dollars to get those first
five winners thing. But after a while, he's just going
to be profitable, and so the bowling alley has to
have that number two whatever it is, Like the average

(31:07):
bowler can't get over one twenty five or something like that.

Speaker 1 (31:10):
I mean, I was not close to two hundred last night.
I think the best I've ever bowled in my life
is maybe like and so for some perspective, I bowlt
like maybe two or three times a year, Yes, and
I enjoy it, but I don't know, like a one
eighty one ninety like I've been close. I've definitely been
close to two hundred before, but I've never I've never

(31:32):
cracked two hundred.

Speaker 2 (31:33):
So here you go for this is chet GPT, so
take it with a grain of salt. For casual non
league bowlers, the average score is typically one twenty to
one fifty.

Speaker 1 (31:44):
Okay, yeah that sounds right.

Speaker 2 (31:47):
Yeah. Yeah. They said once you get into like a
league bowler, you're consistent. You're playing, you'll get closer to
one sixty one ninety. But then a good competitor bowler
is two hundred plus. So that's why they're doing it.
They're they're betting that maybe ten people max will get
we'll get that two hundred level. Yeah, because I'm guaranteed,
guaranteed the bumpers have to be down for that.

Speaker 1 (32:09):
No, no, you ain't getting the money. If you're doing
it with the bumpers. You don't deserve the money. That's crazy.
You can't use the bumpers.

Speaker 2 (32:15):
That'd be wild. But either way, I mean, that's a
cool idea. Like, I love that idea. I might might
actually see if I can find out when that's happening.

Speaker 1 (32:23):
Go there.

Speaker 2 (32:24):
My wife like refuses to bowl with me. It's kind
of funny. Wow, she literally hates bowling. She hates it,
and she won't go with me, and I all I
want to do is take her and Quinn bowling, and
she won't do it. But then like her titleist rep
Subtle flex Will, will will invite the titleist people of
Northeast Florida out for a bowling thing and she'll go,

(32:44):
And I'm like, this is not fair, Like all I
want to do is bowl.

Speaker 1 (32:49):
I'm starting to take this person like I don't ask
for much.

Speaker 2 (32:53):
I just want to bowl with my family. Is that
too much to ask?

Speaker 1 (32:58):
Oh my gosh, her message all these days and be like,
don't ball take your boy bowling.

Speaker 2 (33:06):
Also like beach Bowl in Jacksonville's reopenness super nice now
like it's fun. There's like a really good barn there.

Speaker 1 (33:11):
I'm gonna Loki said, you have a gift card, and
then she's not gonna have a choice. So it'd be
like you to go in there too. At fun at
the bumpers, you can band it and it's like a
you know, branded is a family activity, dude.

Speaker 2 (33:23):
She she loves going there just to go into the arcade.
And what's even better is I don't have to pay
for it. She just hits the buttons and thinks she's playing.

Speaker 1 (33:33):
That's like, because she's going to clean you out in
three years once she starts.

Speaker 2 (33:37):
The two biggest like white trash parenting hacks I could
ever give you is one take your kid to the
arcade when they're young, because they won't realize they're not playing.
They just like pressing the buttons. There's a lot of lights.
The other one is tell your kid you're taking them
to the zoo and go to like pets Smart and
just let her look at the birds.

Speaker 1 (33:57):
I mean, hey, no, I get it. It makes it honestly.
The fish too.

Speaker 2 (34:02):
She's all in on it. And my wife is like,
you are such a white trash like taking your kid
to the PetSmart?

Speaker 1 (34:09):
Have you seen this economy out here?

Speaker 2 (34:11):
Right?

Speaker 3 (34:12):
Like?

Speaker 2 (34:12):
I don't have time for a Zoom membership? Are you
kidding me? I say that I do have a Zoom
membership also subtle flex, but I was gonna say, but
I feel like you're at the zoo like every week.

Speaker 1 (34:21):
What do you mean?

Speaker 2 (34:22):
Quinn and I went the other day, and I think
the I think the monkeys are starting to recognize Quinn
because they come to the because they come to the
glass and they bang on the glass adder.

Speaker 1 (34:33):
She's gonna start freedom like Harry Potter.

Speaker 2 (34:35):
Yeah, dude. She was like freaked out this one, like
like literally like jump like I mean full on jumped
into the glass adder. And I was like, oh my god.

Speaker 1 (34:44):
I thinks great, No, I'll joke the side hold the
monkeys jumping at me. It'd be kind of crazy too.

Speaker 2 (34:49):
That's serious. Like my my initial reaction was to back
away and I did not grab Quinn, and I felt terrible.
I was like, oh, I'm a bad parent. I didn't
grab her. She was about to get rid actual by
that thing man. But either way, so I guess, I
guess what I'm what I'm trying to say, as like
a last thought with Dallas is like, even though it's bad,

(35:10):
I guess you still have the potential, depending on where
he is, to trade Anthony Davis to try to get assets.

Speaker 1 (35:17):
Yeah, they do.

Speaker 2 (35:18):
Have very limited flexibility right now because of past trade,
which is also objectively hilarious. Like seriously, I don't think
they have control of their first round picks for a while,
and so maybe Anthony Davis can alleviate some of that.
So like, if you can do that, get like this
year's pick back or whatever, get a pickback for this

(35:39):
year because this year is not going to be good.
You get another person to put around Cooper flag. You know,
maybe there's a thing with Kyrie. I don't know what
you do there, Like, you know, so there's a lot
of options, at least in the now aspect, for the
players that are your win now players to potentially keep

(36:00):
building around Cooper flag, which is what you have to do.
I just hope they do the right step back rebuild
properly processed, which is not in Dallas's forte obviously, you know,
and I know Mark Cubans made comments about the salary
and cap mask management for Harrison, which is another big

(36:20):
part of it. And what we were just referencing not
having a lot of the picks is a big part
of that too. So yeah, I think it's not gonna
be a fun season, but we kind of joked about
that being the case when they traded Luca. Anyway, I
think you used Anthony Davis to try to get some
kind of assets back since Anthony Davis may want to

(36:40):
go somewhere. That is a win. Now the Clippers kind
of make sense now potentially with Bradley Beal being out,
like you could get a third potential scorer in that option.
It would be an interesting fit to see how he
fit there. But that would be maybe somebody to go
look at, because I would imagine they're potentially going to
be looking as well.

Speaker 1 (37:00):
Yeah, I mean it's and again it's what is the
value of Anthony Davis right now? Like this is a
guy in his thirties, who's dealt with a big injury
history over his career. He's got a ton of mileage
on his tires. He's still Anthony Davis when he's healthy. Like,
don't get me wrong, he's one of the best defensive
players in the league, one of the better bigs we've
ever seen. Like, there's still value out there. I think
the Clippers package I keep seeing floated is like John Collins,

(37:22):
Brook Lopez, and like maybe Bogdanovic they think would maybe
get it done. But yeah, I mean I think Dallas
probably now is in a position which is so bitter
for their fans to take again after they were so
close to being in the finals. But like they probably
are in a position where it's smarter to tear it
down and build around Cooper Flag like Anthony Davis will
get you something back, maybe recoup some of that draft

(37:44):
capital that you just mentioned that they've lost over the years.
Like somebody trading like Kyrie can still maybe get you
something like even I mean, you know Klay Thompson would
be another trade candidate as well. But I think that's
that's a situation too, where obviously he's been off to
a rough start, to say, the least this year, so
you wonder what that is there. But yeah, I mean,
it feels like at this point they should just try

(38:05):
to surround Cooper Flag with as much young talent as
possible and start building up for another run because the
short window that they already had is just kind of
closed given the injuries.

Speaker 2 (38:17):
Yeah, yeah, I agree. I just had a weird thought
and I'm almost in my head, I'm almost positive the answer. No,
I'm very positive the answer is Anthony Davis. But if
you're a team looking two injury prone bigs that could
potentially be on the market, and we've talked about both
of them, Anthony Davis and Zion, which one would you consider?

(38:38):
I'm I'm I'm very positive Anthony Davis is the answer.
But Zion's upside from being so much younger and potentially
able to put it together and get healthy.

Speaker 1 (38:49):
What team am I? I guess that's the question that's fair.
If I'm the Clippers, is Anthony Davis? I'm not. I'm
trying to win now, like trying to actively win should
be going for Anthony Davis.

Speaker 2 (38:59):
Like, even with the injurally risk doesn't need the ball
and potentially helps Kawhi and and Harden a lot more,
if that makes sense, Like he doesn't need the ball,
but he's going to command attention, and so that will
alleviate the pressure on on Zion, on uh On Kawhi
and and and and Harden and really any of the
other guards, but but those two guys specifically. So I

(39:20):
agree with you. I just feel like if there's a
team who feels like their window might be a little
more like two to four years, maybe his Ion's more
of a consideration at that point.

Speaker 1 (39:31):
I don't know, Like that's just like so tough for
me to consider Zion because Zion.

Speaker 2 (39:34):
Doesn't play, Like, yeah, yeah, how can I expect it?

Speaker 1 (39:37):
If I'm a contender and I'm playing meaningful minutes, how
can I expect this guy to hold up on a
playoff run. We've never seen it?

Speaker 2 (39:43):
Yeah, no, I know, it's all I risk like, and
that's risky. Yeah yeah.

Speaker 1 (39:48):
I just think Anthony Davis we've seen make deeper playoff
runs for like, I've seen Anthony Davis win a title.

Speaker 2 (39:53):
Yeah he literally won.

Speaker 1 (39:54):
Yeah, yeah, I like, I just haven't haven't seen it
as much with Zion, So it's it's unfortunate. But all right,
who's ballin? Who's wall on our NBA version of the
stock market. We always like start with the good before
we start with the bad, So justin, I'll start with
you this week. Who is ballin?

Speaker 2 (40:11):
Who's ballin? For me? Is gonna go to under Armor?
Or I guess technically Steph Curry, who is agreeing to
end their thirteen year partnership with under Armor. The announcement
came out just the other day for a Curry brand
to now like go out and I guess find a

(40:31):
new sportswear brand that wants to get things going. I
guess this opens up a potential bigger conversation whereas I'm not,
you know, a big shoe guy like that. But it
does feel in general, maybe even jerseys included that like,

(40:52):
sportswear doesn't seem to be as popular as it once was,
if that makes sense, especially from basketball shoes side of things.

Speaker 1 (41:05):
Yeah, I think I don't know. No, I don't fully
disagree there, And I mean, look, this is a big
bet for Steph Curry obviously, and a big loss for
under Armour. I mean, you want to talk about under
Armour and their you know, entrance into the basketball market.
You know, under Armour has been around for ages. They
you know, would talk about their base layers and for
running and for you know, stuff like that. I think

(41:25):
they've had a lot of impact. I mean, they're big
entrance into the basketball world was with Steph Curry, Like
that was a very lucrative, profitable partnership. So it'll be interesting.
I mean, Curry still has ownership of his own side brand,
so that'll be cool. You know, we're interested to see
what they do. I'm interested to see if he can
you know, build that into its own thing for under Armour, Yeah,
this is a big like I got to pull up

(41:47):
their roster actually under.

Speaker 2 (41:50):
All you do that. I just looked up I just
looked up sports where where like data in terms of sales,
and it says global sports where market is actually up
seven percent in reaching recent years, but it's projected to
slow now through twenty twenty nine about six percent, which
it's still expanding, just not not as much as it did.

(42:11):
They're they're pulling numbers. They said during like the COVID
stuff was a big boom of this, Yeah, which I
guess kind of makes sense but also doesn't. At the
same time, we're all stuck inside who cares what shirit
you're wearing. But either way, I guess they said Puma
lowered its sales outlook, but like JD's Sports is up,
so like it's kind of across the board, like up

(42:32):
and down depending on the brand.

Speaker 1 (42:34):
But either way, yeah, I mean it's interesting. So Dearon
Fox is probably the biggest athlete that under Armour has
left now basketball wise, which Joelle obviously left too with
with Joel going to Sketchers recently, And I mean that's
part of it. Like I think there's all sorts of
factors in there. There's you know, there's more brands than ever,
you know, I mean you talk about overseas like you
talk about Leaning, you talk about Anto, which Klay Thompson

(42:56):
has been super involved with, and you know, just sneakers
go through trends right now, like it's crazy. I mean,
you know, you talk about Jordan's, for example, Jordan Brand
and the retro ones which have been such a money
printing machine, especially when you release any og colorway you
see them in outlets now like shattered backboard ones were
in the outlets, Like that's such an unfathomable sentence for

(43:17):
people who are in the sneaker community, like and it
all just goes through cycles. I think right now it's
just comfort is in, like Cozy Boy is in essentially
like you just which makes sense. You want to be
as comfortable as possible. Like that's where I think you're
seeing brands like Hoka like on running like Brooks like
a six a little bit. I kind of taken, you know,
new balance with all their dad shoes, Like that's what's

(43:38):
kind of been in right now. I mean even you know,
more than than some of the traditional markets, right like
like with Nike, it feels like Nike stock, I mean Nike,
or with Nike where they've been succeeding Mores with the dunks.
I feel like in the sb's like it feels like
those are back in where like air Forces have taken
a step back, Jordan's and the air Maxes have all
taken a step back, like Adida has had with Ultra boots,

(44:00):
and now it's kind of pivoted to the Sambas a
little bit or more in. Yeah, I think it's a
factor of things, but like I don't think. I don't
think your intuition there is wrong in the sense that
you know, the more traditional sneakers, Like there's just more
competition out there. It has changed a little bit, and
even with a peril like I think Apperil, there's a

(44:20):
lot of different options out there now for sure. And
I mean on the workout front, like you know, you
think about even the more the quote unquote like luxury
fitness brands that have jumped into more like think like
the Lulu Lemons and like the Aloes and the Viory's
of the world and such like, there's just there's more
out there than ever. And also the economy is kind
of crazy right now, so like I think people are tight,

(44:42):
Like I'm not even trying to like say that to
be political. I just think the economy is extremely tight
right now. And so I think you're gonna see that
coming up a little bit. Like people, you know, if
I'm spending, you want it to be quality.

Speaker 2 (44:54):
Yeah, I uh. I think Chris Paul should come out
with a USB charger, a CP three USB. Yeah, print money,
bro print money.

Speaker 1 (45:09):
I mean, Chris might be all right at least, don't
I don't think he's one of the tart Our endorsements.
I mean he's he's the Jordan brand too, I think. Anyway,
So he's extra good.

Speaker 2 (45:16):
Well and he does the he does the endorsements with
like State Farm too.

Speaker 1 (45:20):
Yeah yeah, yeah, I forgot about that. Geez yeah there.

Speaker 2 (45:25):
Or get like Alan Iverson can do he he really
if he isn't already, and maybe he is, but like
AI needs to get involved with AI in some sort
of sponsorship or like.

Speaker 1 (45:39):
All those teats still make me, all those tweets still
make me laugh when it's like AI is gonna lay
off nine million jobs and it's like, why would Alan
Ierson do this? Dude?

Speaker 2 (45:47):
Think about it though, like an AI AI custom shoe,
like the shoe scan, like the AI scans your foot
makes you a custom shoe. But it's like Alan Iverson
endorse like, dude, I'm telling you, Like and then he
can come out and tell people how it's gonna make
him better at basketball or something like.

Speaker 1 (46:04):
He's been on. Ah, he's been on kind of a
media blitz recently. He's been doing a lot of podcasts.
He's been doing a lot of like I knew, I
think he just had a book come out. Let's good
see AI out there. I know. I know he's been
sober too. The last like year or so. He was
talking about so that's great. We love to see that.
For Ai, my favorite Sixer ever, I feel like that
goes without saying all right, ballin for me is the Pistons,

(46:25):
winners of nine straight, who we talked a little bit
earlier at the top of the Eastern Conference as we speak,
and really impressively, you know, doing it without Kate Cunningham
and portions of this time. Like they haven't had a
full season from everybody really, you know, I think even
last night against the Sixers maybe their most impressive win
of the season. But you know, it's everybody stepping up. Uh,

(46:48):
you know, between you want to talk about, like uh,
Jalen Duran continuing to take steps, like Osar has been
really solid. The Duncan Robinson pickup has been pretty decent
for them so far. I mean, obviously it's all about
kid still like K two at the end of the day,
has just continue to play at that superstar level. But
it is the fact that like they've got a lot
of depth here, like with Holland still with Isaiah Stewart,

(47:10):
with Javonte Green, with Carouse Lavert in there now, like
they're running nine to ten deep every night essentially, and
for a team that you know, obviously broke out a
little bit last year. You know, the question is like
with a little bit of a tough exit against the Knicks,
but you know, can you maintain that momentum? Yeah, so
far for the Pistons, the answer has been a resounding yes.

(47:33):
Super encouraging start to the year for them. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (47:36):
And honestly, what's kind of surprising too, at least from
the evanced stats side of things, like about average offensive rating,
but defense has really been showing up. They got six
point one net rating with an average offensive rating, So
like that tells you all you need to know about
the defense. Top three in the league. I agree with you.
It's very exciting to see and happy to see that

(47:58):
they're up there. It just be because it's a new
team at the top, is why it gives me a
little bit of Calves vibes. Like last year. So maybe
it's because we got burned on that last year. It's like,
let's see it in the playoffs. We did see the
Pistons in the playoffs and it was good. So like,
maybe that that's a good counter argument, But.

Speaker 1 (48:15):
Mike, yeah, my counter argument is that I've only had
you know, the Calves last year we've seen them now
or going into last year, we'd seen them kind of
flame out of the playoffs in three straight seasons, and
so like, yeah, it really was tough to see them
go out like that. Again, the Pistons had a very
competitive series against the Knicks. I mean, if anything, I
feel like the Pistons feel like they left it on
the table. They still stood have been playing game seven

(48:37):
in that series. I don't really look at that as
a flame out. Like I felt like that Knicks team
was better than that Piston's team, So you know, I
don't think there was any shame in that. I guess
I think this year will be the first year where
there's some expectations for sure, But like I'm not ready
to just like give them. The Calves were like I'm
not giving them any slack yet, Like they got they
gotta flame out against teams that Also, I feel like

(48:59):
they shuld probably should have beaten the last like the
next year or two. Like now, if they're the one
seed or the two seed and they go out and
they lose, you know, in the first round, then maybe
it's a different story. But like I also just think
it depends on who the matchup is against Chuck.

Speaker 2 (49:13):
No, I agree with you. I'm on board with that.
I can get behind that, all right.

Speaker 1 (49:17):
Who's falling for you this week?

Speaker 2 (49:19):
Falling for me is going to Patrick Beverly. I don't
know if you've heard, but TEAMZ Sports is reporting that
he's been arrested in Texas for felony assault charges. He
was brought into custody on Friday. According to the records,
it was a charge against Beverly for assault on a
family member household member with impending breath or circulation, which

(49:43):
is a third degree felony. His bail was at forty k.
He's also taken to social media to say, like, the
report that's come out is not the actual story. It
sounded like it had to do something with his sister
and his sister's boyfriend. So you know, make assumptions there
if you want. We'll wait to se see where the
courts handle this. But he has made a point to
say that he's going to come out and tell I

(50:05):
guess his side of the story as to what happened.

Speaker 1 (50:08):
Yeah, I mean, like I said, we don't we don't
want to rush to judgment. There kind of a rough week,
I mean, between that and then pap Bev. Also, I
don't know if you saw this, but like there's a
little bit back and forth with Klay Thompson. They had
had a segment on their on Papev's podcast and they
were kind of talking about Clay slow start and like,
frankly they blamed it on Megan thee Stallion, Like they're
just you know, talking about what a what a woman

(50:29):
can do to guys and use some like kind of
not great language and so you know, Clay kind of
called them out in the Instagram comments and was like, Yo,
this is really disappointing, Like how would you feel if
I talked about your wives? Like that's kind of crazy? Like, which,
good for Clay Man, stick up for your girlfriend, Like
Blake shouts play for that. I respect that. So yeah,
kind of a definitely a weird week for Patrick Beverley

(50:51):
for sure. All Right, fallen for me this week is
Christian Braun. Christian Brown, I should say, excuse me, who's
gonna miss six weeks here with the sprain ankle injury.
Obviously a pretty big loss for the Nuggets here. This
came after James Harden stepped on his foot in the
last game against the Clippers. They've got seventeen games or
scheduled to play during the next six weeks, is what

(51:13):
ESPN is saying. But I mean he's a huge part
of the rotation obviously, Like he's playing twenty nine minutes
a game, you know, has been. He's a fourth leading scorer,
behind the big three obviously of Jokich, Murray and Aaron Gordon. Yeah,
I mean this is you know, thankfully it doesn't look
to be like a high ankle sprain or anything too
too crazy here, but I mean this is not an

(51:34):
insignificant injury. You know, maybe you get a little more
Tim Hardaway, a little more Bruce Brown, Peyton Watson in
the meantime, But yeah, for a guy that's been a
big part of the rotation, and you know, we talk
about starting the season strong, like Denver number two in
the in the Western Conference right now, a team that
you know, we expect to be hanging around for most
of the season and contending and making another run at

(51:54):
this title. Loss. Yeah, this is, this is gonna be
a tough one for to be without him for six weeks.

Speaker 2 (51:59):
Yeah, I mean, you know, like you said, he's he's
been playing well, eleven points per game, almost five rebounds,
three assists for the season so far before the injury.
And even in that game, you know, played about sixteen minutes,
six points, four says four rebounds, was having a really
good game for his own right. So a team that's
obviously going to be battling towards the top of the
division with Oklahoma City, you don't really want to have

(52:22):
any reason to falter. But here we are. So you know,
now you just hope he gets back and ready for
a good playoff run when when, when the time comes?

Speaker 1 (52:31):
Yeah, agree with that, all right? So shall we switch
into grid here a little bit sneak some macular grid
in have played in a few weeks.

Speaker 2 (52:40):
Let's get the tab going.

Speaker 1 (52:42):
Let's see if we uh see if it's heavy stat
based on a Saturday. It is, it is, We've had
a good episode. We can kind of run through real quick.
And I mean, these are these are good. I'd like
the teams involved at least a little bit different, all right.
So again for the podcast listeners, if you want to
watch the Immaculate Grid just search YouTube Driving Dish NBA podcast.

(53:02):
You can see all the videos there. For the podcast listeners, though,
this week, our columns from left to right are the
Spurs all NBA and ten thousand career rebounds are rows
from top to bottom of the Lakers, the Hawks, and
defensive Player of the Year. So I don't think right
off the rip we have any Alford Payton connections. I

(53:23):
can't say he was all NBA or had ten k
rebounds or anything like that. None of the team link
ups work, but definitely pretty good amount of options here.
Already we mentioned Thiago Splitter a little bit earlier.

Speaker 2 (53:38):
I was thinking Splitter, Yeah, Splitter for the Hawks Spurs.
Murray also works. Ye. Who else was involved in that trade?
Was it just that Murray?

Speaker 1 (53:51):
Oh God, I forget now.

Speaker 2 (53:54):
Yeah, I feel like there might have been one more person.

Speaker 1 (53:56):
No, there definitely was. I'm just trying to They're kind
of blank and on me right now. There's somebody with
two that with Hawks and Spurs, Like I don't remember.
He's an immaculate grid Darling. But if Dwayne Deadman was
in I don't remember if he was in Atlanta or not,
and he's definitely in San Antonio.

Speaker 2 (54:14):
Did Tea ever end up there? Schroeder? I feel like.

Speaker 1 (54:18):
Schroeder is definitely in Atlanta. He was, actually he was
definitely Atlanta too. I don't think either of them ever
ended up on San Antonio, Like Schroeder would be the
one I would think would be more likely to end
up there than he definitely did it. Let's go Tiago
though for that. Let's go cause me mentioned him doing
a good job over in Portland earlier in the interim. Wow.

(54:44):
I kind of thought that'd be a little bit, because
you know, he was on some of the finals teams
with San Antonio and in the like early two thousands,
I think he won. He was on the fourteen team.
I believe that won the ring. Yeah, so all right,
I mean, do we want to do Lakers Spurs and
just do all the player connections for sure?

Speaker 2 (55:01):
Didn't I mean Paul Gasol ended up on the Spurs
for a second.

Speaker 1 (55:06):
Yeah, Powell was definitely on the Spurs for a sec.
Dennis Rodman works for both. He was an end of
career guy on both of those teams.

Speaker 2 (55:16):
Did Drummond ever play for the Spurs.

Speaker 1 (55:21):
No, I don't think so. He played for the Lakers
for sure.

Speaker 2 (55:23):
And then Aldridge never went over to the Lakers, right.

Speaker 1 (55:26):
I mean that was that free agency where he ended
up in San Antonio. They were trying to recruit him. Yeah, no,
he never ended up there. I'm trying to think of
guys like I feel like there's a big ones. We're
missing shooters, I guess, like rod I mean Rodman is
a pretty big name.

Speaker 2 (55:47):
Who was with? Who was with the Big Three? Did
they ever end Did anybody on those teams ever end
up going over to the Spur or going over to
the Lakers after.

Speaker 1 (55:54):
No, That's the thing is like they all were they
all were lifers. I mean Duncan was a lifer, Genobli
was a life.

Speaker 2 (56:00):
The guys that would have played with them the other
two positions essentially throughout those years.

Speaker 1 (56:05):
Oh, like all the like supporting cast, Oh no played there. No,
this is one of the bigger ones. I'm thinking of.
For sure, Robert or played for the Lakers and the
Spurs because he won titles there. I don't know if
that's my like number one though, either way, that would
definitely work. I'm like running through the other like usual,

(56:26):
Grid Darlings, like, I don't think this Smith doesn't work there,
lou Will doesn't work there. Green, I don't think Jeff
Green works there?

Speaker 2 (56:34):
Who awesome? I thinking of uh, Derek Fishers Lakers never
went to Spurs.

Speaker 1 (56:45):
No, he never went to Spurs. Iconic shot against them,
obviously that's the best point four second shot.

Speaker 2 (56:50):
Yeah, oh boy, okay, well.

Speaker 1 (57:02):
All right, so who do we have again?

Speaker 2 (57:05):
What say you said?

Speaker 1 (57:06):
Rodman? Gasol Rodman? And who was the third one we
just mentioned?

Speaker 2 (57:10):
You say? Was that right? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (57:11):
Or okay? Yeah? Okay? I'd like Ori out of those three?

Speaker 2 (57:17):
Robert, Yeah, big shot Bob, we can do that.

Speaker 1 (57:21):
I think it's probably gonna be high. But like whatever,
like you just gotta be chalky sometimes.

Speaker 3 (57:26):
He is h h oh yeah h o r r
y Yeah, there he is, okay, yeah, wow forty nine
good lord wow really yeah, I mean I guess ye
Powe was there late, all right, yeah wow forty nine percent?

Speaker 1 (57:41):
Good for good for big shot.

Speaker 2 (57:42):
Bob Ohn't did Chris Paul make it to the Laker.

Speaker 1 (57:47):
No, I don't think he ever know because he got okay.

Speaker 2 (57:49):
Yeah, oh that's right, that's right. All oh no, no, no,
never mind, never never mind, all right, Spurs.

Speaker 1 (57:58):
Defensive Player of the Year. I know, Kawhi Won.

Speaker 2 (58:03):
I feel like, isn't this one where like one of
the bigger ones didn't.

Speaker 1 (58:07):
And we get I don't think Duncan never won. I'm
pretty sure Duncan never won. Where it's like I think
David Robinson, did I know Kawhi did?

Speaker 2 (58:16):
Yeah, yep.

Speaker 1 (58:18):
I feel like it's it is it's the one because
we got burnt by that one time and it stuck
with me because it's like you would think he'd be
the guy to do it. So to that point, I
don't know if there's anybody other than Tim Duncan and Kawhi.
I mean Wemby hasn't won it yet. Like Wemby you
would think will win one at some point, I mean,
might win it this year. But yeah, so I don't know.
You tell me you want to go Kawhi, he's a
little bit younger. Sure, David Robinson we could use for

(58:41):
the well never mind TWI yeah, okay, I mean David's won.
I mean we could use David Robinson for DPO y
and ten K career rebounds. He definitely has that. I
mean there's a lot of people who will have that,
but like I think he'll I think he'll be lower
there because I think a lot of people will use
him for the Spurs DPOY David Robinson, Yeah, okay, all

(59:04):
NBA Defensive Player of the Year.

Speaker 2 (59:06):
Should we go Rodman just to round out? Do you
think do we do Rodman just to round out?

Speaker 1 (59:12):
Had to be all NBA, right, there's no way.

Speaker 2 (59:14):
He wasn't.

Speaker 1 (59:15):
Right, that's the only thing that's holding me up. He
had like, yeah, he has to be, he has to be.
We gotta do it. You're right, my own, I'm psyching
myself out there. But like he had to have made
a third team. There's no way, Denis Robin Okay, three percent. Nice,
good job, I went, big guys. Yeah Rodman did make Yeah, okay,

(59:41):
he was. He was the Oh did he only do
it once?

Speaker 3 (59:45):
No?

Speaker 1 (59:45):
Twice? Okay? He made third team in ninety one ninety
two with Detroit, and he made third team ninety four
ninety five with San Antonio. In the in between years
before he went to the Bulls, I was forgeting Tennis.
Rodman ended his career with the that I definitely forget
every time I remember, like the Spurs and the Lakers.
But all right, yeah, so well, yeah, Rodman would have

(01:00:08):
worked for Lakers all NBA, though I guess he didn't
win it with the Lakers. I mean, I mean Lakers shack,
I mean, how much time. Do you got Kobe Shack,
Jerry west, uh elgend Baylor.

Speaker 2 (01:00:21):
Magic, Derek Fisher ever got like a third team All NBA?

Speaker 1 (01:00:26):
No way. I mean like guys in the eighties. It's like,
you know, James Worthy did, I mean obviously what about it?

Speaker 2 (01:00:34):
I'm trying to think of like random one offs that
would have gotten it like one year.

Speaker 1 (01:00:39):
But All NBA. It's like it's easier with All Star
than it is with All NBA because All NBA is like,
you know, hard to make, Like there's only you know,
fifteen players that get All NBA every year. I mean
even modern guys like Anthony Davis. We haven't mentioned who
we've talked about a bunch of.

Speaker 2 (01:00:55):
This post the Lebron Did you say, yeah, Bron, AD
might be a good one. Yeah, a d might be good.
Let's do AD because I don't.

Speaker 1 (01:01:06):
Thin because I think with him being newer and with
him people like, he's not a guy that I think
people only associated with with the Lakers. Yeah, yes, for
the rebounds of the Lakers. I mean we used Rodman,
so he's off. Shack is an obvious one. Will Chamberlain
is an obvious one. Dwight how Dwight's a good one. Honestly, Dwight.
Dwight might be a good one there. Yeah, I think
I like we could have done Dwight as All NBA too.

(01:01:27):
I didn't even think of that. Yeah, yes, okay, yeah,
good call. I like Dwight there. I think he'd be
a lot.

Speaker 2 (01:01:34):
Do we think Trey Young ever gotten All NBA?

Speaker 1 (01:01:37):
He had to have, right, Like, I'm pretty convinced, like
the year they went to the conference finals or something
like that. I feel like he might have made third
team like.

Speaker 2 (01:01:44):
A Millsap Horford, uh those.

Speaker 1 (01:01:49):
Horford would be the guy of those teams that like,
like you know, Kyle corverd and Demary Carroll and that
whole group. Like Horford would be the guy I would
think would make it. I mean other guys in general,
like the obvious answers, there are more to me obvious
in my opinion, or like Dominique Wilkins, Joe Johnson, Bob
pettittt if you really want to go old school, No,

(01:02:12):
Vince was way Vince was old by the time he
got there. I don't think there's anybody like one off
recently that would have got it, like Tumbo might have
got it. There. I'm not confident enough in that.

Speaker 2 (01:02:26):
What do you do Tumbo ten thousand?

Speaker 1 (01:02:29):
We could do Matumbo in ten thousand there, Yeah, I'm
game with that. D I yeah, d d I K.

Speaker 2 (01:02:38):
Yeah there is Larry Wow wow.

Speaker 1 (01:02:41):
Yeah. I mean they don't have a ton of big men.
Is the thing like that's there? There isn't necessarily that
iconic big man I think about in Atlanta like that
that would that I'd be like, oh yeah, one hundred
percent is ten k where it's like, yeah Matumbo you
know as ten k? Yeah, all NBA. I mean like
Trey definitely try had to have made one that year,
at least one year.

Speaker 2 (01:03:02):
Take a shot on Trey, I think so.

Speaker 1 (01:03:04):
Like I don't think he did recently, but I'm convinced
he's made it one year.

Speaker 2 (01:03:08):
Yeahs okay, okay.

Speaker 1 (01:03:10):
Let's see. I want to I want to look up
Trey Young while you scrolled down in those parts for
the ten I guess they had Dwhite two. Actually Dwight
would have worked there.

Speaker 2 (01:03:19):
May they see if any of these guys stick off.
Dwight Howard, Tim Duncan.

Speaker 1 (01:03:24):
I'm trying to remember Parish played there at all. I'm
not one hundred percent Trey Young. Actually, let me look
at Al Horford made one NBA All NBA Team and
it was with Atlanta. It was in twenty eleven, twenty
twenty eleven, he was he made NBA third team also
only made one. It was, That's what it was. It

(01:03:46):
was that twenty twenty two or twenty twenty one, twenty
twenty two year. He made third team that year. So yeah,
he got one four time All Star All Rookie obviously.
All right, yeah, not bad. So are do you want
to pull up the most popular guesses before we do
our recap artismal Last time we were a little lower

(01:04:06):
or higher on the rarity score whatever. All right, most
popular answers this week for Lakers and Spurs was Robert
or for Lakers. All NBA was Kobe Bryant for Lakers.
Ten k rebounds was Kareem abdul Jabbar for Hawks and
Spurs to john Ty Murray for Hawks All NBA, Dominique
Wilkins for Hawks, ten K rebounds to kem In Matumbo
for Spurs. Defensive Player of the Year it was David

(01:04:27):
Robinson for dp O Y and All NBA Michael Jordan
and for Defensive Player of the year and ten k
career rebounds a keem elajahwan.

Speaker 2 (01:04:36):
Arbridge worked for that. Hold on, I want to just
see Kawhi.

Speaker 1 (01:04:40):
Alvin Alvin Robertson. Okay, yeah, wow, okay, Yeah, that's a
good one to know. That's a good guess. Somebody never
got that in his zillion years. All right, urgrid one
last time. Robert or for Lakers and Spurs, Anthony Davis
for Lakers, All NBA, Dwight Howard for Lakers, ten k rebounds,
Thiago Splitter for Hawks, and Trey Young for Hawks All NBA.

(01:05:02):
To Kembe Matumbo, Hawks, ten k rebounds, Kawhi Leonard for Spurs,
Defensive Player of the Year, Dennis Rodman for Defensive Player
of the Year in All NBA, and David Robinson for
Defensive Player of the Year and ten thousand career rebounds.
Thank you everybody for listening to this episode of the
Driving Dish NBA podcast. Appreciate you guys as always leave
us review on iTunes, good or bad, or read them
on the podcast. If you're not an Apple user, Google Play,

(01:05:22):
stoor Speaker, Spotify, tune in, Amazon Music, player FM, anywhere
you can find a podcast, you can find US and
we're on YouTube.

Speaker 2 (01:05:29):
Just search drive Dish NBA podcast on YouTube. You can subscribe.
Sign up you'll get notifications when we are live and
watch along there. I think we've done my fans today,
so why don't we dance Wednesday?

Speaker 1 (01:05:43):
See the star sign? Okay more.

Speaker 2 (01:05:54):
You are? I think they could