FADE to BLACK host: Jimmy Church guest: Trey Hudson

Tonight, author and researcher Trey Hudson joins us to talk about the high strangeness at The Meadow!!!

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Yeah, this Hope Radio for the Nassis headlined the US

(00:37):
July eighth, nineteen forty seven. The Yadi Airport person outstart
applying the pertin found and there's now in the.

Speaker 2 (00:44):
Possession of the Arda.

Speaker 3 (00:46):
The game is really changed.

Speaker 2 (00:47):
The game Gage. I occasionally think how quickly our difference
is worldwide would vanish if we were facing an alien
thread from out Its just work here. This is Today
to Black.

Speaker 4 (01:07):
It's your host, Jimmy Church on the Game Changer Radio Network.
All right, well, well, well, how you doing Fade to Black.
I am your host, Jimmy Church. All Right, Today's Wednesday,
June fourth, twenty twenty five.

Speaker 3 (01:25):
Let's do this.

Speaker 4 (01:27):
Man, another great another great week right here on Fade
to Black.

Speaker 3 (01:32):
Oh Man.

Speaker 4 (01:33):
Monday night, doctor Simeon Hine was here talking about cold
fusion and how it might explain everything. Last night Hugh
Newman was here, Go Beckley and Carahan Teppe. Tonight it's
Trey Hudson. He's back with us. We're gonna be talking
about the high strangeness and his research out at the Meadow.
And then tomorrow night Dale Graff is here. We're gonna

(01:54):
be talking to him about the SI Field pre cog
dream Man.

Speaker 3 (02:01):
That's a week. That's a week. Now.

Speaker 4 (02:03):
I have two major events coming up. I'm going to
Peru next week, well in about ten days. I've got
to fly to Boulder to film tape my TV show.
Then i head to Peru for the INCA Celebration of
the Sun with Brian Forster, and I'll be back on
June twenty seventh. And then that immediately follows up with

(02:26):
the PI Games the Psychic Olympics, and that is August
first through the third, twenty twenty five in Charlottesville, Virginia.
The links for everything in tickets and schedules are below.
I do want to mention that next year, I know
it's it's next year. It's the Monty Python Tour of

(02:49):
Scotland I am going to be doing next August. And
I'm doing this with Hailey Ramsey. It's going to be
so much fun. We're gonna go to the shooting locations
for the film. We're gonna have a screening of the
film the first night of the tour. Of course we
are all right, we got to do that. And then
we're going to head out and we are going to

(03:09):
go to the castles. We're going to go to where
The Bridge of Death was filmed. We're going to hit
a couple of really really old first class distilleries there
too as well. That sounds like a lot of fun.
And we're even going to go to the Castle arg
And we've got a lot of surprises scheduled for this

(03:33):
tour as well. So this is Scotland, so get it
scheduled now. I got to I got a textas morning
from Haley Saint Man. Tickets are selling out, so I'm
just giving everybody the heads up right now. Head over

(03:54):
to haleya Ramsey dot com. The links for that are below,
and come to Scotland with this. It's going to be
a lot of fun. The Monty Python Tour of Scotland.

Speaker 3 (04:05):
All right, all right? Where am I at?

Speaker 4 (04:09):
Did I? I don't know if I told everybody yesterday
that it's been hot it's warming up. I live in
the desert, and yesterday when I woke up, I went
out and I do the same thing every day. I
look at the sky, I look around, I look at

(04:29):
the wind and go okay, today is a good day
to ride my bike and not bicycle by the way.
And so I came in and got stuff done and
had to prep.

Speaker 3 (04:43):
For the news and everything.

Speaker 4 (04:45):
And I went outside to go ride my bike and
I opened up the garage and it was raining.

Speaker 3 (04:51):
I was like, wait a minute.

Speaker 4 (04:52):
An hour ago was bright and sunny. It rained all
day yesterday, and it was hot. It was like that hot.
But it smelled really good today and I wanted it,
and I just wanted to share that with you. I
didn't share it with you this morning.

Speaker 3 (05:09):
I love it.

Speaker 4 (05:09):
After it rains here in the desert, everything comes to life.
And we'll be talking about that tonight with Trey Hudson
in the Meadow, and very excited about every conversation that
I have with Trey, because he is constantly out there.
He's constantly working. He's got a new book out. It's

(05:31):
called Return to the Meadow for the Adventures at the
South's Skinwalker Ranch and all of the strange encounters that
go on out there. We're gonna be talking about that tonight,
how he is approaching the research out there and all
the other paranormal hotspots that he visits. All Right, So

(05:51):
he is the director of the Anomalous Studies an Observation
Group the ASOG, which investigates high strangeness phenomena through out
experience or centered approaches with a multi disciplinary approach to
as well. And I would like to welcome back to
Fate to Black very excited. He's right there, Trey Hudson. Trey,

(06:13):
what's going on?

Speaker 2 (06:14):
Man? How's it going? You got me thinking about Monty
Python now? I know?

Speaker 3 (06:19):
Right?

Speaker 2 (06:20):
Yeah, I just need to tell you don't go to Camelot.
It's a silly place.

Speaker 4 (06:23):
Yeah yeah, right. See, here's the thing with that. All
you have to do is mention it and then that's it.
You're gonna get everybody's favorite quotes. Oh yeah, I mean
it's that film affected all of us, didn't.

Speaker 2 (06:39):
It It did. My wife hates it, and you know,
she's yeah, she's got a stunning sense.

Speaker 3 (06:45):
Of humor that's not even legal. I don't know.

Speaker 2 (06:48):
Yah, I know what you know, who knows? You know?

Speaker 4 (06:53):
That's that's that sounds like good fun to me, Honey.
I ordered a pizza Moni Python night and she attacked
me with those big yeah yeah yeah, big fangs, big
fan yeah yeah.

Speaker 2 (07:08):
Yeah. We're getting sidetracked here. Yeah, but that's what.

Speaker 4 (07:12):
But that's what's so great about that movie. And I
the idea for this Okay, came. It wasn't like, well,
the idea for it popped up like that. But when
you watch the film, I have fantasized and thought about
and dreamed about going to those castles. I dreamt about

(07:35):
building a giant wooden rabbit, you know, yeah yeah, yeah yeah.
And and now to be able to do this, somebody
pinched me right.

Speaker 2 (07:46):
And coconuts will travel?

Speaker 3 (07:49):
Oh man, and I I am.

Speaker 4 (07:54):
I'm thinking about I'm I'm working on this. I think
I'm gonna to do a King Arthur semi costume.

Speaker 2 (08:04):
Oh yeah, with the blazing sun.

Speaker 3 (08:06):
Yea, the sun.

Speaker 4 (08:07):
I'm thinking I don't want to do the whole thing
and and stuff, but with the mail and and but
because his his helmet with the mail coming is so cool.

Speaker 3 (08:17):
But I'm not going to go to that extreme. But
I think I'm going to.

Speaker 4 (08:22):
I gotta, I gotta, I gotta think through this, but
I think that's what I'm gonna do.

Speaker 2 (08:28):
I'm gonna tie Monty Python into Afghanistan in the meadow.
So here we go. Number one. Afghanistan is my executive
officer was a big Monty Python fan, and he made
it a point to uh make sure I had a
copy of the Life of Brian. So I went into
his office one day and I did anti terrorism stuff,

(08:49):
you know, around you know, the theater in the Eastern
Eastern Theater there, and he was decided to give me
my assignment, speaking like Poncha's pilot from the movie The
Life of Brian, and he goes, tway, yeah, I'm going
to send you to Duoa Bad to check out the
televism situation in Juoa Bad.

Speaker 3 (09:10):
And that was hilarious.

Speaker 2 (09:13):
So anyway, it was. It was rather funny. You had
to be there. Oh no, that's early place.

Speaker 3 (09:18):
Yeah, yeah, it's a silly place.

Speaker 4 (09:22):
I I for a while, I only contemplated it. I
didn't take it serious. But for a while I was like,
what's better life for Brian or Holy Grail, you know,
because they are both fantastic, but now Holy Girls better?

Speaker 2 (09:41):
Yeah, Holy Holy Grail is better. And the number two
is my my chief researcher, uh, my lead researcher for a.
Zog is a big Monty Python fan and he's been known,
you know, when you were sitting around a campfire, to
jump into the campfire, you know, unannounced and say nobody.
He expects the Spanish Inquisition, and of course you know,

(10:03):
a few of us will laugh, and the others will just,
you know, kind of look at him with you know,
do in the headlight, kind of look.

Speaker 4 (10:08):
When I was when I was in sixth grade, okay,
so I was ten, Okay, I was ten years old.

Speaker 3 (10:18):
Sixth grade.

Speaker 4 (10:19):
I had a friend named Keith, and uh, every other
week or so I'd sleep over at his house or
he come over to my place. But anyway, one night
over at his house, late night, in the family room,
he dials in Monty Python. I'm ten, I'd never seen.

Speaker 3 (10:43):
It, never heard of it.

Speaker 4 (10:45):
And the Spanish Inquisition, by the way, I was like
one of the first things that I had ever seen
by them. And after that I was just completely and
Benny Hill at.

Speaker 3 (10:57):
The same time, by the way, yeah, Benny Hill.

Speaker 4 (10:59):
And so so there we are in sixth grade doing
Monty Python chokes and.

Speaker 3 (11:09):
Nobody got it. Nobody. It was sixth grade. I get that.

Speaker 4 (11:14):
It was nineteen seventy four, right, and it was just
brand new, but it deeply affected me. Man and that
British humor, which I totally British humors like might be
the best it is.

Speaker 3 (11:32):
And yeah, yeah, and I get it. A lot of
people don't.

Speaker 4 (11:37):
But yeah, yeah, that's how that's how long I've been
checking Monty Python out and I just can't wait.

Speaker 3 (11:46):
So that's what I did.

Speaker 4 (11:48):
And then we'll move on. We'll get to your filming
location of the meadow. But so I'm sitting around with
some friends of ours Scott Walter and Haley Ramsey and
Doug and Cherry, right, and we're playing cards.

Speaker 3 (12:02):
And this was in.

Speaker 4 (12:05):
Wisconsin a couple of months ago, and we're sitting around
last month, last month, it was we just got back.
But anyway, we're sitting around playing cards and we were
talking about Hayley's tours that she does of Scotland and
she goes, Jimmy, would you do something with me over
in Scotland.

Speaker 3 (12:25):
I said, well, you know.

Speaker 4 (12:30):
What we should do is a Mony Python tour. She goes,
I got you just like that. And the next day
she said, she stayed up all night. She sent me
an itinerary. Wow, and she goes, I know all of
these locations already, I lived there, and we can line
all of this up. And she's totally into the film.

(12:53):
And it took like three days. I got back to
La and that was it. She contacted everything lined up
everything and said, Okay, Church, it's go time. It's time
to back up your bullshit, right. I said, Okay, let's go,
let's go. And that's that's how things like this happened.
When you have somebody and you know how how this

(13:16):
is you. There are people in this world that are talkers,
and there's people that get stuff done, and she's one
of those. You know, you you better be careful with
what you say because somebody's gonna come back and call
you out it. Okay, let's go, let's do this. Well
we were just talking. No, let's get it done.

Speaker 2 (13:38):
Yeah, and you know it's go time. Yeah. Well, it
sounds like a great trip, you know, the best, the
best of luck. You know. Just make sure you memorize
the airspeed of a Laddin swallow. Yeah, case you're asking
any questions, and uh, you should be fine.

Speaker 3 (13:56):
I can't wait. It's going to be amazing, really.

Speaker 2 (13:59):
Can nigg it? Yeah?

Speaker 4 (14:00):
Yeah, he says, We've already got one.

Speaker 3 (14:05):
You've already got one, man. See that's what I'm saying.
We could just quote that movie.

Speaker 4 (14:12):
All night long and laugh. I just love it so much.
It's gonna be great going over there.

Speaker 5 (14:17):
But Cathole Anthrax. Make sure you go, oh, we're doing that.
Oh yeah, okay, but see here's the thing. Okay, here's
a little trivia. When they first started setting up production
for the movie, they reached out to Scotland and they
needed like nine eight or nine castles filming locations, and

(14:42):
Scotland said, okay, cool, and they gave them permits. So
they head out and they start filming and Scotland said,
you can't use six of them, you can use three.
So they had to use three castles for all of
the castles. So Camelot and Anthrax, you know what I mean,

(15:08):
those are three castles filmed, one castle filmed on three
different sides, right right, Yeah, So yeah, that's one of
one of the interesting facts about the film. They were
not going to stop the film because of that, and
you've just got to turn around and get creative, and
creative they did, and nobody would have known that unless

(15:29):
they disclosed it in the documentary that came out much
later in the books. How long I want to get
to your books? Speaking of books, Yeah, how long have
you been investigating the meadow?

Speaker 2 (15:41):
The meadow we kind of started brushing across it in
about twenty sixteen, sort of looking into the area and
we really started digging down into the meadow in about
twenty seventeen. That's when we really started focusing in on
the meadow specifically. Is you know, like we talked about before,
it kind of started off as looking at a folklore,

(16:02):
you know, and you know, I was looking at it
from the optics of a ghost guy, looking at a
folklore of haunted locations, you know, in that general area,
and the meadow just seemed like a good place to
the research. After we had a really cool UFO sighting
back at base camp, and you know, it was a
big open area, big open field. We could see anything

(16:24):
moving across it. I was researching with the late Bob Wilson,
the Bigfoot researcher, and you know, we thought, this is
a big open area. We can see tracks, we can
see anything moving across it at night. We've got a
big ridge to the south that we can look down
on it, and we've got a big open, expansive sky.
Because this area has you know reported of UFOs, cryptids,

(16:46):
you know, ghosts type folklore in sighting. So it's you know,
kind of got all this going on, and it just
really you know, in twenty seventeen, it really really started
rocking and rolling for us. And but the cool thing is,
and I go into it in the book, is that evolving.
Is the phenomena that we experienced back in you know,
twenty seventeen twenty eighteen is not the same experience that

(17:09):
we uh, that we we have going on now. The Uh,
it's evolving. It's becoming much more personal, uh if you will.
And you know, one thing that I credit that to
is us becoming more comfortable with the phenomena and the
other whatever the other is. And then another thing is

(17:29):
I credit it to, you know, kind of backing up
and taking it maybe a different perspective. And we've got
our good friend Shay Hudson, you know, is leading us
in that, and he you know, looks at it from
a trans personal perspective at the phenomena. And you know,
since he and his wife have joined the team, we've
had some strangely enough, you were talking about pre cognitive dreams.

(17:50):
You know, we've had pre cognitive dreams, uh, you know,
out of the meadow. So it is is changing, it's evolving,
and you know, as long as whatever it is keeps
interacting with us, we'll continue to research in as long
as we can keep the site as pristine and as
inviolate as possible.

Speaker 4 (18:10):
Let me jump in right there. In twenty seventeen, when
you did the reveal of the meadow on this very program, right,
I tried my best to break you and to get
the location of the metal many others. Yeah, yeah, of course,

(18:34):
of course. And the decision was made back then to
keep this the location well secrets the right word, but
not disclose the location.

Speaker 3 (18:47):
Has that changed?

Speaker 2 (18:48):
No, No, As a matter of fact, I think I actually,
I think I briefed you on the I briefed you
on the meadow location out in Laughlin, Nevada.

Speaker 3 (18:59):
I kept I see, I keep my secrets.

Speaker 2 (19:02):
Yeah, so yeah, you know where it's at.

Speaker 3 (19:04):
I do.

Speaker 2 (19:04):
But no, no, we still keep it. You know, we
still keep it secret. I am in communications with another
production company about something totally different. And you know, my
thing once again is I will talk to your producers
when they sign a non disclosure agreement. Now that that's
a deal breaker. You know, I'm not you know, I'm

(19:27):
not just clamoring for attention. I'm not that guy. H
And that's a deal breaker. And so you know, most
production companies will sign the NDA if they're serious about,
you know, having any kind of interest to what we're doing.
Is so far, you know, knock on wood, we've been
able to keep the location pretty much secret.

Speaker 6 (19:49):
You know.

Speaker 2 (19:49):
I mean people have guessed the general area, and you know,
going back in my you know, my military background and
my federal civil service background is you know, we never
confirm or deny. We just don't talk about it.

Speaker 3 (20:02):
Somebody just has in the chat. Uh.

Speaker 4 (20:05):
Whereas what part of the country I will disclose this.
It's east of the Pacific Ocean.

Speaker 2 (20:15):
Yeah, I will tell people that it's south of the
Mason Dixon line at east of Arizona.

Speaker 3 (20:19):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, there you go.

Speaker 4 (20:21):
It's it's it's it's it's that side of the country.

Speaker 3 (20:26):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (20:29):
Could you imagine and and I get that, Uh, everybody
knows where skin Walker is and with the with the
show like that. Man man, man, I don't know what
it would like to be somebody that owns property up there.

Speaker 2 (20:44):
Oh oh it's yeah, it's really bad. I remember, Uh
when was it two years ago? I think two or
three years ago. I was in Utah and uh I
went out to blind Frog, was invited to go out
to blind Frog Rant.

Speaker 3 (20:59):
I remember, yeah, and uh, you.

Speaker 2 (21:02):
Know, went out there and I remember seeing the holes
that trespassers had come in and dug and talking to
Dwayne about you know, he's just having to fight you know,
these these claim jumpers and trespassers. And once the site
became you know, widely known through the show blind Frog
Ranch that they just had were inundated with you know, trespassers.

(21:25):
And of course, you know Brandon Fugel who now owns
Skinwalker Ranches all, you know, he has a you know,
private security force that has to maintain that site all
the time. And the thing about the meadow that makes
it especially vulnerable is it's on public land. Is you know,
I can't cite somebody for trespassing on public land. It's
you know, it's public land. So we try really really

(21:47):
hard to uh to keep it in violet.

Speaker 6 (21:51):
UH.

Speaker 2 (21:52):
As a matter of fact, UH, the last UH documentary
that we filmed, we finished our principal filming in November,
is not only do the whole team signed non disclosure agreements,
that I wrote an operation security plan, you know, specifically
outlining you know, these are the things that we cannot discuss.
These are the things you can't have in the background
of any frames. You know, these are the things that

(22:13):
may disclose the location because it's it's one of those
special things. I have no problem sharing the experiences when
I have guest researchers come out, you know, like one
that we know, Katie Page, is a guest researcher that's
been out to the meadow several times. The experiences that
these guest researchers have, it's their experience, it's not mine.

(22:33):
It's theirs to do with whatever they wish. All I
asked is they keep the location secret, and most people
agree that's a pretty fair trade off.

Speaker 3 (22:41):
Yeah. I got to get out there one day.

Speaker 2 (22:44):
Yeah you do.

Speaker 4 (22:45):
I got to get out there. There's really no excuse. Okay,
my wheels are turning.

Speaker 3 (22:51):
I might. I might be able to pull that off
this year sometime.

Speaker 2 (22:54):
Okay, Yeah, we can make it happen. Yeah, yeah, now
I will. I will warn you it is very remote.
The team we had out in November, it's like we
don't even have cell singles out here like that. Guys,
I told you it was remote. It's like really really remote.

Speaker 4 (23:08):
All I require is uh a sauna, rain shower, granite,
countertops and and a and a and a bi dat.
So if you've got all of that out there, then
I'm I'm cool.

Speaker 2 (23:23):
Well, we have a creek and I could probably run
up a twelve old pump.

Speaker 3 (23:27):
What did Katie? What did Katie do?

Speaker 2 (23:30):
Katie is a trooper. She is a trooper. She is
she She flew into whatever the airport that's the closest
to it, and she there's some thing where you can
rent r vs, you know, so she rented like a
I think it was like a Honda whatever. Their little
pickup truck thing is some little pickup truck thing, and

(23:51):
it had a tent up on top that folded out.
And also she uh, you know, she swung by the
store and you know ball oh Man Rocks rocks, so
she pulled up and popped out her little tent and
you know, so, yeah, she's done that twice and the
second time. I don't know if you know Jessica Jones,
of course, yeah, she she hung out with Jessica Jones.
They shared a tent, so yeah, she and Jessica are

(24:13):
pretty close.

Speaker 4 (24:13):
You know, what I want to get and I've been
shopping for a couple of years and I'm about ready
to just quit messing around and just do this. I
want to get one of the small tear drop campers.
You know what I'm talking about. There's a small tear
drop trail.

Speaker 2 (24:30):
Yeah. What I did is uh, you know, going all
the way back to you know, being a young you know,
young army officer sleeping in ditches at Fort Benning and
places like that, you know too, you know, living in
very austere circumstances researching the meadow. I just finally, you know,
when I hit sixty years old, I'm like, you know what,
I'm tired of this. And so I went out and

(24:51):
bought a twenty foot camper. So it's small enough with
no popouts. It's real come back. I can back it
into tight areas and you I set up my solar
panels and that's great, you know, so I I kind
of live in luxury now. It was kind of sad
the film crew in November, they they were sleeping in tents.
We had a bad, you know, thunderstorm come through. They

(25:12):
were flooded. Their tents were hanging out on it looked.

Speaker 3 (25:14):
Like and you're sitting in there with your express so.

Speaker 2 (25:17):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, like Daddy Warbuck, you know looking at.

Speaker 3 (25:21):
Yeah, a couple of Cuban cigars.

Speaker 2 (25:23):
Yeah, I sailed. Man, it looks a wee bit soggy
out there.

Speaker 4 (25:26):
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I get that. I do
want to get a tear drop though, And you know,
I have a cheap uh, so I have the ability
to I can drive, so I need I need a
trailer that's small enough. But you can get those tear
drops with off road tires and you know, and and

(25:48):
shocks and stuff, and so I can go and and
and do the things that we're talking about here and
just not even not even think about it. It's just like, okay, man,
I'll see you this weekend and.

Speaker 1 (25:59):
Just go do it.

Speaker 2 (26:00):
So yeah, that's the cool thing is I have my
equipment and my gear and everything in my camp right,
just back my truck up to it, drop it on
the hitch, and off I go.

Speaker 3 (26:07):
Right right.

Speaker 2 (26:08):
We're going to be doing some workout in the l
b L hopefully in November, so you know, I'm trying
to get it all geared up ready for that. So yeah,
I would. I would now definitely get something.

Speaker 4 (26:19):
The Uh let's talk about the book for a second,
and uh, why why the need to write the book. Now,
what was so important to you?

Speaker 1 (26:30):
Uh?

Speaker 2 (26:30):
You know, it was nothing compelling, you know that forced
me to write the book or but I just felt
like it was the right time. You know. I had
a lot of people, you know, contact me saying when
is the second book coming out? When is the second
book coming out? When is the second book coming out?
And at that time, my publisher was Philmntle, you know
from the UK, and he's like, when's the second I

(26:53):
can't do Philmantle anyway, you know, when's the second book
coming out?

Speaker 6 (26:57):
And?

Speaker 2 (26:57):
Uh, I hate to admit this about I'm a lazy writer.
Uh you know, I'm slow. And so I've been pecking
away up with this second book for a few years
and uh so I just finally got to the point
where I was just tired of, you know, fighting with it,
and I just really knuckled down and wrote it. And it's, uh,

(27:17):
it's kind of neat the way I broke it down.
It's in three parts. The first part is called Congruences,
and I talk about and I'm looking at my notes
here because I don't want to forget anything, uh as
I talk about places that are similar to the meadow,
you know here in the common in the United States,
and I have a chapter on the Bradshaw Ranch, you know,
which is pretty well known, Marley Woods, Uh, start Us Ranch,

(27:42):
and then of course Katie's Clearview Ranch. And I had
a chance to go out to Clearview Ranch with Katie
last year.

Speaker 3 (27:49):
So uh and I did you ever go to start Ust.

Speaker 2 (27:54):
I have not been to start Us.

Speaker 3 (27:55):
It's been so it's been sold.

Speaker 2 (27:57):
Now, yeah, that's that's that's in my my uh chapter.
I actually had the real estate listing in it where
it's been sold. And from what I from what I
hear is the people that bought it have not had
any you know, strange experiences.

Speaker 3 (28:09):
The same Yeah, I heard the same thing. Anyway, So
back to Katie.

Speaker 2 (28:14):
Yeah, back so anyway, you know, you know, visited the
Clearview Ranch with Katie. So there's a picture of me
standing jauntily on the cistern cap. You know, theyre at
the Clearview Ranch. So anyway, I look at these different
sites and it's like, Okay, how are these similar? You know,
what kind of phenomena do we see across the site?
So I take those four sights, I do it in depth,

(28:37):
in depth review of all the sites, and then look
at uh, you know, some common common factors. And what
I found was, uh, pull up my table. Here is.
I looked at of course, Marley Woods, Colorado Ranch, Bradshaw,
stardust in the meadow, and then I looked at UFOs,
entitieser aliens, sounds and or voices, moving objects, big foot

(28:57):
of dog man, cubes or boxes, missing time, and all mutilations.
And the thing that's the most common is UFOs and orbs.
All five of these sites have UFOs and orbs, and
three of the sites or two of the sites have
cubes or boxes really yep, and entities are aliens. We're

(29:17):
at four of the five. So you know, you start
seeing some common you know, things that are happening.

Speaker 6 (29:23):
Now.

Speaker 2 (29:23):
Something I've started doing and it was this was recommended
to me by another researcher is actually using AI to
really drill down into the real specifics on it. So
another thing is radiation. You know, some of these sites
have radiation, either of the ionizing or non ionizing type.
So you know, what I'm hoping is if we can

(29:44):
really start sharing data among the researchers and the sites,
not only can we get a better picture of what
these sites are, maybe we can come up with a
predictive model of if we have these indicators, then we
think this is going to happen. You know, if you
have a radiation spike and it could be followed by
an orb or if you have you know, disembodied voices,

(30:05):
then you your odds of seeing a dog man.

Speaker 3 (30:08):
Man, Man, I don't want to know that. No, no, no,
I don't want to know that stuff. Come on, man,
because tray, tray, trade tray.

Speaker 4 (30:18):
I love a good surprise, number one, and I love
the unpredictable that's number two. But number three, I don't
need a precurse of the dog man walking up on
my ass.

Speaker 3 (30:30):
I don't need that.

Speaker 4 (30:31):
Man, I'll be freaked out all night long. Okay, I'm
gonna tell you. I'm gonna tell you my meadows story. Okay,
this is really brief, but I want you to correlate
this with your research. Okay, sure, I'm twenty years old.
I'm sitting in Indianapolis in a meadow where me and

(30:53):
my friends went to go drink and smoke wheed.

Speaker 3 (30:57):
Okay.

Speaker 4 (30:58):
It was off the street, dirt road up behind these trees,
and there was this clear meadow surrounded by cornfields with
electrical transformers. We called it the Electric Company for that reason.
But anyway, this big probably the size of a football field, open, right, okay,
surrounded by cornfields. And we're out there drinking. There's like

(31:20):
six of us. Three in the front seat, three in
the back seat. Windows rolled up, we're in their smoking weed.

Speaker 2 (31:25):
And.

Speaker 4 (31:27):
And this fog rolled in and we couldn't see past
the hood of the car. So we know what's in
front of us. Right, it's a big, open, square, football
field sized grass field meadow surrounded by cornfields. But now
this fog had rolled in and surrounded the car. I'm

(31:48):
at the I'm sitting in the driver's seat, and this
is what happens. And I have witnesses. They've been on
the show. They've been on Fade to Black. This dude
comes out. Now we're surrounded by miles of cornfields. Okay,
no houses, there's nothing there out and from in front

(32:11):
of us, as a matter of fact, behind where this
guy walked out of the fog. The next stop is
like green Field, Indiana, which is forty miles away. Okay,
it's like that cornfields Okay, so there's nothing there. Anyway,
he comes out of the fog and he's dressed in black.
He's got a hood over his head. He comes up

(32:31):
to my driver's window and stands there and he's looking
at me, and everybody's screaming in the car. I think
I screamed to and I rolled down the window about
that far and he leans down and he says, have
you seen my dog?

Speaker 3 (32:52):
And we scribbed roll up the window and what he say, Eh,
we're scribbing. I'm freaked out.

Speaker 4 (33:00):
And he turns around and walks back into the fog
and disappears. I never saw his face had a hood
like the grim Reaper.

Speaker 2 (33:09):
Yeah, you know, that's that's that's really kind of cool,
because what you're talking about is an arc type, you know,
and and you know, many many, many cases of high strangeness,
you know, be they locations or right, you know, you
have you have figures in hoods appearing out of nowhere.
And that's why almost in our primal guts, fog bothers us.

(33:37):
You know, we don't like it because it obscures our vision.
And uh, the man in black, or the the the
shadow person, the hat man, indrid cold, all of these
are arc types of the visitor, okay, And the visitor
will come and sometimes We'll ask you an innoculous question,

(34:00):
and you can go all the way back to the
ferrymen that ferried souls across uh the sticks would ask
the people a question. And so, you know, we have
to wonder is that a manifestation of us creating a

(34:21):
thought form that we interact with you're id yeah, yes,
absolutely and uh and so why is this this figure?
You know, Chris de Burgh back in the eighties sang
a song about it called you know, don't pay the
ferryman Reach of the other side. I always talk about
taking this the souls across the river sticks.

Speaker 3 (34:41):
Don't pick up a hitchhiker.

Speaker 2 (34:43):
Don't pick up a hitchhiker, you know. And so now
you take that and then you spin it forward and
you go and you talk talk to Ryan Burns, you
out there in Vernal, Utah, and he talks about his
experience with the skin Walker, which he thought was a
bunch of clothes laying on the road. And Ryan, if

(35:04):
I'm you know, mess this story up, forgive me that
stands up and it's a person and it's and he
interpreted that as a skin walker. So you have the
skin walker, you know out in the uh. You know,
the Utah area, you have other uh you know, uh
mythology in the Four Corners area, you know further south,
and then you know here in the southeast you have

(35:27):
the uh, the raven mocker. You have the uh, the Spearfinger,
which you have these entities that will I either consume
somebody physically i e. Eat them like the Spearfinger would
eat delver of children, or would consume their souls. So
it's interesting that, you know, have you seen my dog? Okay,

(35:50):
Now that's also interesting because now what we're seeing is
people that have cases of high strangeness. We've had it
at the Meadow. Uh. If you read the book nom
Keller talks about it in Skinwalkers at the Pentagon having
canine creatures appear after encounters with high strangeness. Marley Woods

(36:13):
canines were reported. I had huge canine tracks like six
inches wide, appear forty meters from where I'm sitting right
now one morning, and you know, these other canines that
are somehow associated with high strangeness. So you have a
figure coming out of the fog asking you a question,

(36:34):
and that question had to do with canine.

Speaker 3 (36:36):
It was crazy.

Speaker 4 (36:37):
And the next day and now that was forty years ago,
forty five. That was nineteen eighty eighty one eighty two
when that happened. This is twenty twenty five. But the
next day we went out there during the day, I mean,
the same group of friends, and we parked and I'm
telling you stood there at high noon right with the

(37:02):
clear blue sky, and I've got this view. I mean,
this is my neighborhood. I know where I'm at right.

Speaker 3 (37:09):
But there is nothing there forever on all sides. What
is this? So you start to eliminate a few because
I just remember going, okay, what what where did he
come from? And then maybe so, but maybe he wasn't human.

Speaker 4 (37:37):
Right right right, And to go from the direction that
he came in, which was from the east, there is
back then.

Speaker 3 (37:46):
Now it's different, you know, it's forty years ago. It's
built up.

Speaker 4 (37:49):
But back then that was that was corn and soybean
soybean fields. You know, I don't know one hundred two
hundred three hundred thousand acres of it, I don't know.
It's endless and there was just nothing there.

Speaker 3 (38:02):
So the it was it some lost soul looking for
his dog.

Speaker 2 (38:12):
It could be you know, or let me let me
throw a weird twist on this. You said that he
was somewhere where he shouldn't have been, You wouldn't expect
him to be. What if the inverse is true? What
if you were somewhere you weren't supposed to see? Maybe
why what if you talked into that tpped into his world?

Speaker 3 (38:30):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (38:30):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, He's like, why is this car sitting here,
you know, in the middle of that field, you know,
on my farm with with you know, with these See.

Speaker 3 (38:38):
That's why I don't need you with your gear hanging
out with me at night. I don't That's the part.
You know, what if what if we were the ghosts?

Speaker 2 (38:50):
What? You know?

Speaker 6 (38:51):
What?

Speaker 1 (38:52):
You know?

Speaker 2 (38:53):
Yeah, I mean that's that's that's very possible. You know,
what if what if next week, you know, you're walking
down the street and you see somebody, a man comes
up to you. Have you seen my dog? And it
was actually you quantumly entangled with him in the past,
but in the present time.

Speaker 4 (39:10):
I'll tell you another twist to this. I want your
opinion on this. So everybody that was in the car
minus one person, but everybody that was there, we had
like five of us. We all got together like two
years ago for a party in Indianapolis and wrote my

(39:31):
friend Kurtause who was there. And we all start telling
the story because now they're all married and their wives
have heard the story maybe from but never with all
of us together, right, and so we're all telling the
story and it was great.

Speaker 3 (39:48):
It was awesome to tell the story.

Speaker 4 (39:49):
And everybody's kind of freaking out and things. But one
of the five, his name is Jim, he remembered it differently.
He insisted we were all outside of the car when
he walked up, and the other four of us we

(40:11):
were not.

Speaker 3 (40:11):
We were in the car.

Speaker 4 (40:12):
I was behind the driver's wheel, I rolled down the window.
He said, none of that happened that everybody else remembers
it differently, and he was dude, he stood his ground.

Speaker 3 (40:27):
Now, what do you what do you make of that?
Like an alternative memory screen memory?

Speaker 2 (40:33):
Yeah, okay, a lot of times, you know, and you
can read in the literature people that have encounters with
something very strange, you know, something highly unusual. It's whatever
they're encountering, we'll put a memory in front of them
that seems off, it's not right, it seems weird, but

(40:55):
it's just right on the edge of plausibility and something
of out that memory is very uncanny. And I'll give
you an example that happened to me, and it happened
near the meadow is years ago, and I'm talking back
in the nineties, before we even were researching this area.
A friend of mine, he and I were backpacking in

(41:17):
that area and we had stopped to set up camp.
What happened is his wife drove us, dropped us off
the trail head and I'm sorry, we went and dropped
our vehicles off where we were going to stop our
backpacking trip, and she drove us back and dropped us
off of the trail head so we'd have our vehicles
when we got done. And so she dropped us off.

(41:39):
And usually the way we did this we would we
were working, so we would hike and this guy's an engineer,
you know, very sharp, very smart guy is we would
get in on Friday and we would hike, you know,
maybe two or three miles up into the woods, and
we would set up camp Friday afternoon and just kind
of relaxed, kind of assimilate ourselves to the environment. Get

(42:00):
up early Saturday. We hit it hard, you know, do
about ten or fifteen miles on Saturday, wrap it up
with about three miles on Sunday getting the car and
come home. So she drops us off and we loaded
up all of our gear, put our backpack on, and
we hiked up the trail, probably about maybe a mile
and it was the trail was next to a large,
large creek or small river, which happens to be the

(42:23):
creek or river that runs past the meadow, the same
body of water, and there was probably about fifteen feet
between the edge of the trail in the bank of
the creek. So we decided that's a good place to
set up. You know, we can relax, cook our meals,
you know, talk a little bit, go to sleep, get
up early the next day. So we do all that.

(42:44):
We go to sleep and about three am he wakes
me up and we're in a dome tent, so you know,
we're all zipped up and sealed up in the tent
and he goes, tray, somebody's coming down the trail and
I looked at my watch, I'm like, it's freaking three am.
He goes, something's coming down the trail. So we unzipped

(43:06):
the tent and we unzipped the rainfly and we poke
our heads out. So we have two little heads.

Speaker 3 (43:10):
Are you armed?

Speaker 2 (43:12):
Oh? Absolutely?

Speaker 3 (43:13):
Okay, I mean yeah, I mean that's yeah, yeah, okay.

Speaker 2 (43:17):
And so you know, we look out and this figure
passes us, oh and walks off into the mist upright, upright,
up or upright, and so we kind of look at
each other and we go back in the tent and
we sit down and he goes, Trey, tell me what
you just saw. I said, well, this is going to

(43:39):
sound weird. You know, it always is going to be
good when somebody says this sound is going to sound weird.
But this is what I saw. It was a figure
that was humanoid, but it looked like it was wearing
a skirt or a kilt what some sort of flared
you know, something or other, carrying something in its in

(44:00):
front of it like a bundle, and projected out of
its head was a beam that could have been a headlamp,
but there was a beam coming out of its head,
and it slowly went past the tent and went up
the trail.

Speaker 3 (44:15):
Did he see the same thing?

Speaker 2 (44:18):
And he said, that's weird because that's exactly what I saw, okay.
And it turns out that that the exact place that
happened was probably only three hundred yards from the place
where Katie had her traveling companions hood pulled by an
unseen force when she was out at the meadow researching

(44:38):
with us. Also one of the places we call the
field of Nightmares, you know where we've had some strange stuff.
Not the meadow, but probably about a mile from the meadow.
So so you know, we always look back at that
and said, is that a screen memory? When I was
writing the first book, I asked him to, you know,
write me like a statement of what he recalled, and
he said, I would prefer not to. I would prefer

(45:00):
not to because it was so uncanny.

Speaker 4 (45:03):
Now fast forward, Uh wait, wait, wait, no, no, there's
no fast forward back. What did it look aged? I
mean a vintage did it look you know when you
say when you say kilt or skirt? Now I'm thinking
mony python?

Speaker 2 (45:24):
All right, right, Well, what we jokingly what we called
it was the Wickan Pagan h What do we call
the Wickan pagan? Celtic thru Hikers didn't have that vibe
to it, Yeah it did. It had like an old
oh Man almost like a pagan vibe to it. And
the weird thing about it, it was carrying something in
its arm. Yeah, okay, but then you go back and

(45:45):
you look at the folklore of that area. What did
I talk about just a few minutes before, the spear
finger witch which would eat the livers of children? Which
is a female wearing a dress or some sort of
dress like garment, carrying a child in her arms late
at night. So you know, it makes you wonder was

(46:05):
that a screen memory? Did we somehow drop into another
reality that maybe was linked to the past. The headlamp
is curious, yeah, and I mean headlamps were They weren't
really in big, big use like they are now. But
I mean, you know I had at that time, I
had a headlamp, well had them?

Speaker 4 (46:23):
Well no, what I'm suggesting here is if a headlamp
wouldn't have been around hundreds of years ago, I think
they had them with candles.

Speaker 2 (46:32):
Right, they did the carbide lamp. Yeah, yeah, they did
have carbide lamp. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (46:37):
So, but anything else that would be battery powered or
something more modern. Yeah, and that puts an interesting spin
on it. The kilt puts a spin on it.

Speaker 3 (46:50):
Or was it a dress and was it female right
with a child or a bag of sticks, which would
make it even crazier.

Speaker 2 (46:59):
Wow. Wow, So so that could have we always wanted
is that a stream memory. Did something much stranger happen
to us? And that's a memory that was kind of
put in front of us. And I've talked to other people,
like up in the North Georgia that remember having a
memory of a barefoot runner run past their camp in

(47:22):
the middle of nowhere. And so, you know, your your
normalacy bias kicks in. It's like, oh, well, that must
be like a barefoot trail runner, like in the middle
of nowhere. You know, well, that must have been just
somebody hiking and they decided to carry their backpack and
the most unreasonable form possible carrying it, you know, with
your arms and while wearing something very impractical like a

(47:45):
kilt or a skirt. You know who knows.

Speaker 4 (47:49):
Now, So okay, you've got me thinking back to my experience,
and I want this to reflect back to everybody listening
to the show. Think about your own personal expences that
are similar. Could our experience have been a screen memory?

Speaker 2 (48:10):
Yeah? And you go and you like, you read you
know various uh you know accounts, like one of the
best is Whitley Streemer. You know, he talked about in
communion that he remembers seeing am and I actually quoted
in my book. I'm trying to remember how he describes it.
It's almost like a robot wind up toy kind of figure,

(48:31):
like with a card on the front of it. Yep,
very strange, you know, not like what we would think
an alien would look like. But that's how he interpreted it.
Now fast forward is we had a case during COVID
the campsite we usually stayed at was closed by the
whatever organization runs this public land closed down that particular campsite,

(48:55):
so we had to go find dispersed camping, you know,
somewhere else. So we've stayed about three miles from the meadow,
you know, up the road from it, and we were
we had gone down to the meadow. We were doing
a C five session in the meadow, which had some
very unexpected results, you know, totally out out of left

(49:15):
field on that. But we had a person left in
camp to monitor camp. And he said that he was
in camp and he heard the distinctive sound of a
vehicle driving down the road adjacent to this campsite. Now,
the camps I was probably about forty yards from the roads.
It was back off the ways and he heard that

(49:36):
distinctive gravel crunch and he heard that sound go by
stop and then continuing, but he saw no lights.

Speaker 3 (49:44):
I remember this story.

Speaker 2 (49:47):
This, So we have since done We have since done
test where we'll take our vehicles, will equip them with
infrared headlights and we will drive with night vision. Now
you can do it blacked out, but you've got to
have like a three thousand dollars set of night vision
and special infrared headlamps on your vehicle in order to

(50:08):
do it. So the odds of most normal people, not us,
We're not normal, but most normal people having those capabilities
pretty remote. So what we decided to do is Shaye
and I decided to do a hypnotic regression with this
individual because that sounded like a scream memory. It's brother Shae,
brother Shay. And this is where it gets weird. If

(50:32):
it's not weird enough already, we do a hypnotic regression
with this guy and what he recalled now, I remember
when he recounted it. At the time, he said he
couldn't see anything, it was dark. All he did was
hear something. Now under hypnosis, what he says is he
saw a jeep. Okay, and that jeep had in it

(50:54):
two figures that were completely black, like shadows. They stop,
the shadows get out, they walk around the jeep a
little bit, they get in and they leave. Now the
shadows are very telling because that goes back to the
arch type that you just talked about, you know, like

(51:15):
the shadow coming out of the mist. The jeep is
interesting because he was so hung up on that screen
memory or what I think is a screen memory that
he remembers telling us is sounded like a jeep driving
down a gravel road, and so he remembers it as
a jeep, but he never saw it. And he also

(51:38):
had some missing time back from twenty seventeen that Shay
and I were not able to get through that time,
that missing time block. You know, all he got is said,
I remember nothing, And unfortunately this individual died before we
were able to do any subsequent hypnotic regression. But you know,
it's once again, it's that seems like a screen memory

(51:58):
that's very hard to get through. So I wonder if
that wasn't something that y'all experienced, because if you people
that have uh and I talk about this in my
book too. I look at the Betty and Barney Hill.
UH case is they came to staying outside the car.
You have one person that remembers y'all being outside of
the car, yet some of you remember being inside of

(52:19):
the car.

Speaker 7 (52:20):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (52:21):
The uh Devil's Den incident, you know, talks about memories.
You know, I remember being in the tent. You know,
I remember being out of the tent. People recount different
phases of the experience. So I always wondered, Uh, you know,
what would happen if you reviewed some of this self
in or hypnotic regression. So I know a guy that

(52:42):
we can hypnotically regress you if you really want to
know what happened.

Speaker 3 (52:47):
The uh idea? All right, I just.

Speaker 4 (52:54):
Watched again. I'm just gonna admit it. I bench it's
just two seasons. Uh.

Speaker 3 (52:59):
Over the weekend, I watch People of Earth again. I
love that series.

Speaker 4 (53:03):
It's funny, it's great and if you haven't seen it,
it's a comedy series about UFO experience or group abductees,
and they get together at this church and share their
experiences and one of the things that happens throughout it's
a comedy series too. It's so funny, but they get
the little details about our community, right, all right, don't

(53:28):
call us abductees. That's that's offensive. We are experiencers. So anyway,
the screen memories that everybody has in this group are
hitting deer, Yeah, hitting dear. And they go through the

(53:48):
whole explanation of what a screen memory is. The writers,
the writers of this show. Again it's a comedy show.
It's a comedy, but they get those kind of details, right,
and a really good explanation about what a screen memory is.
And uh, and and and in the case there, it

(54:08):
was a deer. Now, so what if we did have
a screen memory or anybody else that has an experience
like this that you know, it's possible of a screen memory?

Speaker 3 (54:20):
What is it? What? What's the reality that's being blocked?
That's the crazy part, you.

Speaker 2 (54:26):
Know, that's the crazy thing, the you know, the whole
experience or abduction phenomena. I'm you know, I just don't
know what to make of that, you know, Uh, it's
seems to be a real phenomena. You know, enough people
have these common experiences and memories and can recall certain
events that seem to match up with other people, you know,

(54:49):
in different parts of the world. Uh, you know, I
don't know what's what's behind the screen, you know, that's
why we call it a screen memory. Could it be
a natural h PTSD response, that's your your mind is
trying to block out something horrifying. That's something that a
lot of people that suffered from abuse is they will

(55:13):
put up some sort of memory in front of it
that's not nearly as horrifying.

Speaker 6 (55:18):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (55:18):
You know, is it a a psychological or physiological response
to trauma? Is it something that's manufactured? You know, it's
interesting that a lot of people have the same memories,
you know, blocking you know, whatever happened like i e.
The deer you know in the TV show, but one
of the ones that's really common or owls m you know,
give a whot don't pollute? You know, how many licks

(55:40):
does it take to get to the center of a
Tutsi role or Tutsi pop?

Speaker 1 (55:43):
Uh?

Speaker 2 (55:44):
You know, mister owl there is very strange. So that
seems to be a common memory.

Speaker 7 (55:49):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (55:50):
So it's with one of those things where sometimes maybe
the truth is best left hidden, you know, do we
really want to know? And uh? We had one of
our team members that had some unique experiences and she
went through hypnotic regression and her stuff sounds an awful
lot like what has been described as an abduction. I

(56:14):
mean almost textbook.

Speaker 4 (56:15):
Yeah, it's very interesting, and I want everybody listening to
this too just consider some crazy event in your past
and just think about a little bit, because what I'm
presenting to everyone into Trey is a ghost story that
friends share.

Speaker 3 (56:36):
With each other. That's the way we look at it, right,
And it sounds crazy. It happened? Was it a ghost?
Was it not a ghost?

Speaker 4 (56:46):
Was this that was some escape lunatic from the only
thing we didn't have was the hook on the car door?

Speaker 3 (56:52):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's and but but it really happened.

Speaker 4 (56:57):
Now it's for me actually going back on location and
looking at the area there. It doesn't fit what some
skeptic or some debunker would say.

Speaker 3 (57:10):
It was a guy out looking for his lost dog.

Speaker 2 (57:13):
That's all it was.

Speaker 4 (57:15):
If it really happened, that's all it was. It wasn't
a ghost, it wasn't paranormal, it wasn't supernatural, wasn't anything.

Speaker 3 (57:21):
That is the one thing it was not.

Speaker 4 (57:25):
Right now, it doesn't make any sense now unless could
it be a screen memory of something else.

Speaker 3 (57:34):
I'm okay with that. It kind of freaks me out
a little bit. I mean, you know where we all abducted?
Was it some my labs experiment? I don't know, man,
I don't know.

Speaker 4 (57:47):
It was really strange. And watching we had like twenty
fifteen of our friends together. Two years ago we had
our reunion and we were able to share this story.
And watching everybody else's faces reacting to this, it's it's
pretty crazy. The story itself is pretty crazy. It's got

(58:09):
everything but black triangles. You know, it was like it
was way far as far as you know, I know, right,
oh man, ah, And I could still the voice and
I'm saying it correctly.

Speaker 3 (58:24):
Have you seen my dog?

Speaker 2 (58:27):
Just like that?

Speaker 7 (58:28):
Just like that?

Speaker 3 (58:30):
Ah, what do you say? And I rolling up the window,
have we seen his dog?

Speaker 4 (58:35):
Everybody screams again, forget the dog, let's get we did
we did, we did, we did? But yeah, screen memories.
So out at the meadow. Oh, I wanted to ask
you this really quick before we head to the break
the g Yeah. Time flies by the way, Shay and Christy,

(59:00):
the lights are on. They glow, those two. Oh yeah,
they glow. They're probably listening right now. And I love
those two. They glow they got the lights that they're
just they're So.

Speaker 3 (59:14):
Did Shay's say what year?

Speaker 2 (59:19):
What?

Speaker 3 (59:20):
What was the vintage of the jeep? Was it old?
Was it new?

Speaker 6 (59:25):
No?

Speaker 2 (59:25):
Uh no, I mean we recorded it, and I've got
the transcript in the book, you know, verbatim.

Speaker 1 (59:31):
Uh it.

Speaker 2 (59:33):
He didn't say, Bob, who was being regressed, did not
say the year of the jeep. He just said a jeep. Now,
he you know, was a jeep guy from you know,
way back in the seventies, so you know, he probably
was referring to an older jeep. That's you know, kind
of in his mind. I think I think talking to him,

(59:53):
he might have said it was like an old jeep
like he had back in the seventies, which would have
been like a CJ seven maybe. But the weird thing
is is when he recounts it, you know, not under hypnosis.
He didn't ever, you never saw anything. All he did
was hear it. But under hypnosis he recalls a jeep,
which makes no sense at all. So it sounds like

(01:00:13):
another layer of the screen memory.

Speaker 3 (01:00:15):
Except jeeps have a sound, Yeah they do. They have
a sound.

Speaker 4 (01:00:20):
And depending on the vintage, you know what engine it's got,
you know what kind of time. It's got a certain sound.
The wheelbase makes it sound. It's just got a very
unique thing to it, and especially if it's a stick.

Speaker 2 (01:00:36):
Yeah. I'm not a jeep guy, but yeah, I can imagine.

Speaker 3 (01:00:38):
Yeah, they have a very unique sound. Okay, let's take
our break right here. We'll come back. Well, we're talking
to Trey Hudson.

Speaker 4 (01:00:46):
We're talking about the high strangeness going on out at
the meadow. He's got his new book out too as well.
We'll get to all of that. This is Fade to Black.
I'm your host, Jimmy Church.

Speaker 3 (01:00:55):
Stay with us. We'll be right back after this short break.

Speaker 4 (01:01:20):
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Speaker 3 (01:05:02):
Back, Fat to Black. I am your host hummy Church.

Speaker 4 (01:05:04):
Tonight, Trey Hudson is with US author and researcher ex
military as well, and we're talking about his research of
high strangeness out at the Meadow and so let's get
straight back to it, uh, Trey, with locations like the meadow,

(01:05:26):
is it location specific the high strangeness?

Speaker 2 (01:05:31):
Yeah, that's a great question.

Speaker 6 (01:05:33):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (01:05:34):
I'm kind of on the fence about that. Uh. I
think that there are places that are uniquely strange, and
you can often dig into folklore and find out that
there are places that you know, are haunted or are
sacred or you know a gas Glastonbury tour in England.
You know, go back, you know, way back in history.

(01:05:57):
You know it was always a sacred space. You know,
Stonehenge out on the Salisbury Plane has always been a
sacred space. Here in the United States, you have certain
places that have always been a sacred space. You also
go back into folklore and I know probably in your community,
just like in my community, there are places that have
a negative aura about them. You know, plate people talk

(01:06:21):
about don't go there, or you have places where there
have been multiple killings or tragic events. The public land
holding that the meadow is in h two years ago
had a cult murder. You know, there was a cult
camping out in there that murdered somebody. So I mean,

(01:06:42):
you know, these areas, you know, sometimes have a very
negative reputation. So you know, I think that there are
places that are very special and maybe you know, at
the risk of sounding hyperbolic, the veil is thin, you
know that, and they're a factor. Radiation seems to be
a factor, tiny radiation spikes, geomagnetic anomalies, quartz You've always

(01:07:06):
heard about that. I know, we have big balls of
quartz laying on the ground out at the meadow. Running
water seems to be another thing that's common. But you
take people that are tuned in and dialed in, and
then you put them in a place like that, and
then if you start doing things that are supercharging the
individuals and the phenomena. You're doing things like the Estes protocol,

(01:07:29):
you're doing things like guided thought experiments, or you're doing
things with technology like the god Helmet priming the pump
for phenomena to happen. And I think you can take
this witches brew of different preparatory things with the right

(01:07:50):
people at the right place at the right time, with
the right techniques and the right equipment, and you can
really make things rock and roll. And I think that's
what we have at the Meadow. And I think that
really cool thing is if people start really researching the
area around them wherever they're sitting right now, and start
looking at the folklore, start looking at some of the
databases like the National UFO Reporting Center, move on bigfoot

(01:08:12):
research organizations, and they start looking for these clusters of
high strangeness. There might be one of these places within
five miles of where they're sitting right now. You just
have to do the research, and then you have to
be bold enough to come up with a plan and
go out there and research it for yourself. Now, yeah,
I have to say that that's not without a certain
degree of danger. There has been a pretty strong correlation

(01:08:36):
between high strangeness and negative health effects. So you know,
people need to understand what they're getting into. But you know,
I think these things are a lot more common than
people think. I think a lot of times people are
uncomfortable stepping outside of their box, you know, under what
their box is, what they consider normal, And you know,
I think there are a lot more of these out there.

Speaker 4 (01:08:57):
Well, and then there's another thing to consider here, which
is the obvious. What about the neighbors at Skinwalker Ranch?
Are they having crazy shit go down on their property
and the properties adjacent to the meadow.

Speaker 3 (01:09:16):
The property?

Speaker 4 (01:09:17):
Now, well, it seems that all of Sedona is crazy town,
and it's not limited to just the Branshaw Ranch. I've
experienced a lot of stuff out there in Sedona. It's
pretty incredible. But you don't hear about it in flag
Staff right, Well, you had the Phoenix Lights and start

(01:09:37):
Us Ranch is also you know, south in Phoenix, but
you had the areas right around Sedona, you know what
I mean, It's like it's concentrated right there, the meadow
and other locations. Blind Frog Ranch is another example, which
is also very close to Skinwalker.

Speaker 3 (01:09:59):
Too as well.

Speaker 2 (01:10:00):
Right and then space Wolf Research is you know, right
there adjacent to Skinwalker Ranch, which you know, Ryan has
had plenty of weird things going out there. So you know,
I think that there are areas that you know, are
sometimes maybe broader, and then some that are really really tight.
You know, like the Stardust Ranch seemed to be very tight. Now.

(01:10:22):
Everybody talked about strange things going on at that location.
You know, the supposed suicide of a fifteen year old
family member before you know it was bald, you know,
in it being used as a house of prostitution, and
it being owned by a motorcycle gang. You know, all
this weird stuff about the Stardust Range property itself, so

(01:10:45):
you know, maybe like it made people uneasy the property itself,
But as far as the adjacent properties, you know, I
haven't heard of anything, you know, particularly strange. Now the meadow,
you go out a few miles from the meadow, there's
a place we have that we we call Steve. That's
not the name of it, but that's the name we use.
Is we've been out there, We've had UFO sightings out there.

(01:11:07):
The area where the strange screen memory with the jeep
and the figures in black, that's probably about three or
four miles from the meadow. You know, that was a
base camp. And the really cool thing is we don't
even necessarily even have to go out to the meadow anymore.
Shadow people up here at base camp. And to make

(01:11:27):
it even cooler is back about a year and a
half ago, I had another film crew out there that
was filming not a documentary about the meadow, but they
were looking at the meadow as an example of high strangeness.
And I was doing I was doing an ST's session
with the director, so as the director, myself Matt delf

(01:11:50):
who's a bigfoot researcher from Virginia was there. And then
we had the cinematographer and the production assistant and they're
filming the STS session with the director who's blindfolded and
has earbud zone and everything, and they saw the cinematographer
and PA saw shadow figures around us and it was
captured on film, which you know, that's pretty remarkable that

(01:12:14):
we actually captured that on film. That's a base camp
that was just sitting around the fire.

Speaker 4 (01:12:20):
So, you know, what do you when we need to
describe this, because I've experienced the same thing, right, and
I I try to, in a logical sense, uh, try
to figure out what what?

Speaker 1 (01:12:40):
What is this?

Speaker 3 (01:12:41):
What what's ultimately going on?

Speaker 4 (01:12:43):
I'm gonna ask you the same thing when you describe
as shadow figure, it's an infinite realm of possibilities. Yeah,
but what do you what do you have you come
to any conclusions about what you are seeing?

Speaker 2 (01:12:59):
What they are? You know, I will be honest as
far as all of this phenomenon goes. Not only do
I not have the answers, I don't even know the
right questions to ask. Anybody that tells you they know
what's going on, they're probably not being honest with themselves
or with you. You know, shadow figures, You know, some
people believe that that's where the dimensions are thinning and

(01:13:20):
we're seeing, you know, maybe a diminished dimensional representation of
something that's multi dimensional as it bleeds into our dimension
and we're just seeing like glimpses of it. You know,
many people in the paranormal world talk about seeing shadow
people out of the peripheral vision. A few folks, researchers
have actually been able to film it. The one that

(01:13:42):
we captured on film is the director and I were
sitting in front of the camera. We had the the
external lights you know, shining on us, so we were illuminated,
and behind us on a stump. You see a shadow
pass between the back of our chairs in this stump,
but there was nobody. There was nobody behind us, and

(01:14:04):
there was nobody passing in front of the the uh
you know, the studio lights that were set up. So
where did this shadow come from? What was casting this shadow?
And it ties in exactly with what the production assistant
and the cinematographer saw and described, you know, later on
to the director. And it shook up the cinematographer so bad.

(01:14:26):
I had the screening of this film. He was telling
the crowd that, you know, it shook him up so
bad he refuses to ever go back there. He said,
I will never go back there because it bothered me
so much. So you know now that you have stuff
popping off at base camp, so now you know you
really have to start wondering it. Does it have more

(01:14:48):
to do with the people than the location, you know,
is there something about a group of synergistic you know,
gestalt of people being of the right mind, you know,
with right focus actually causing either whatever the phenomena is
to manifest or are we manifesting the phenomena ourselves. And

(01:15:09):
that's something that we're now starting to do. Is we
go through guided meditation, you know, before we go out
on an expedition, and we you know, all start having
the same thoughts, you know, we think about things quietly,
and I saw where Shae and Christy are are watching this,
and you know they guide us through you know, thought exercises,

(01:15:33):
you know, and Shay will say, imagine, you know a whiteboard,
you know, and something is written on it, you know,
and just focus on what's written and remember it. And
then when we all come back and we're talking, all
what did you see? We'll see we'll all talk about
we're all saw the same thing. We're all communicating without communicating.
So when you start getting energy like that, a focus

(01:15:56):
like that, it would almost be unusual if something didn't happen,
wouldn't it be.

Speaker 3 (01:16:04):
Wouldn't it be great? It be freaky too as well.

Speaker 4 (01:16:08):
But wouldn't it be great if science comes forward with
an explanation of a parallel, interdimensional existence that is around us,
and it is coming into focus and into frequency from

(01:16:28):
time to time, and we are seeing the life that
is in that other world that's around us all the time.
And then suddenly some of the explanations are resolved. For ghosts,
for entities, for skinwalkers, for UFOs, for orbs, you know

(01:16:50):
what I mean, all of these cryptids, you know, bigfoot,
right that, And it would probably freak out a lot
of people, but it would also all right, I'm just
going to say it. The people that are experiencing these

(01:17:10):
things can step back and go, see, I'm not crazy.

Speaker 2 (01:17:14):
Right, you know? And that's uh. And forgive me if
I'm wrong on my history. But the first magnifying glass
that was actually capable of seeing microbes I think it
was a van Hook, Yeah, mat Hook. Van Hook who
hook yes to developed the lenses that could actually see microbes.

(01:17:39):
And now people are like, there are these living things
all over us and all over everything we touch. We
never knew that before because we didn't have the technology
to detect it. So here we are sitting up, you know,
all bold in twenty twenty five, thinking we're all that,
you know, we've got you know, rudimentary you know, we
can ask Gronka question and you know you can answer us,

(01:18:00):
and you know, we're just so damned freaking smart. Yeah,
what else is going on? You know? So, if we
can detect living things at the microscopic level, what about
the macroscopic level, what about the macroscopic level par dimensionally.

Speaker 3 (01:18:14):
And these and the rest of the universe su Yeah,
so I you know, and we.

Speaker 2 (01:18:18):
Can perceive just such a narrow frequency with our five senses,
and then we can expand that a bit with technology
you know we have. We can see in the infrared
and ultraviolet, and then we can detect radio waves and
you know, radiation and all this with our equipment. But
we're still limited. So you know, you start thinking about this,
you know, maybe quantum things, spooky action at a distance, uh,

(01:18:41):
you know, uh, massive bodies bending space time into other dimensions.
What if this is actually happening at a macro level?
What if that was what we were experiencing out at
the meadow, Is we're seeing multiple realities existing at the
same time. Can we handle that in the same place.

Speaker 3 (01:18:59):
Can we handle that? I was, I was, well, I
know I could, I could too, I think, I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:19:05):
I don't know.

Speaker 4 (01:19:06):
But I was watching this comedy last week comedy series,
and there was a scene in this and it explains
exactly what we're talking about. It was hilarious. Guy says
to his friend, well, you know, you've got might millions
of them living in your eyebrows, keeping the oil out

(01:19:30):
of your eyelids, feasting on the oil of your skin
all day.

Speaker 3 (01:19:37):
And dude loses his mind. The next day, he shows
up at his house with his eyebrows shape. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:19:46):
Couldn't handle that, you know, can't see it right. And
then suddenly you're exposed to that reality and your mind
sometimes just can't handle these things. And that's and that's
what I'm talking about. Could we handle that kind of reality?

Speaker 3 (01:20:03):
Oh?

Speaker 2 (01:20:05):
I think maybe. And I'm going to go back a
little bit. Is previously I'm talking about pre industrial Revolution,
is most people had a belief system, okay, be it
a religious belief system or some belief system, and part
of that belief system almost universally accepted something else greater

(01:20:31):
than us. You know, something existed out there that we
can't touch or feel, but nevertheless it's there, you know,
call it God, call it carnal, whatever, you know, your
belief system is. And that was very common and that
helped people cope with some of this stuff. Also, we
had a folkloric system where things like the fay. You know,

(01:20:52):
I'm of Celtic descent, you know, you know from Great Britain.
My family is is you talked about the fay, the
willow of the whist, the jack o lantern. You know,
those were very common. Those those were reality. You know,
you know, keep a piece of iron, you know, in
the in your your baby's crib so the fay wouldn't
steal them. You know, that was very common and that

(01:21:14):
was understood. All hallow Eve is when the veil became
very thin, so we would wear masks so the spirits
couldn't couldn't get us, they couldn't identify us. Now we're
so freaking smart. Only dumb people have a belief system,
right you know, you know those ignorant you know, Bible thumpers, right,

(01:21:37):
you know, whatever, have a belief system. You know they're there,
they don't believe, they don't worship it. The mighty altar
of science. I think that people in the past would
have been able to accept this much better than maybe
we can now. Yeah, we're now developing the technology to
detect it, but it creates an existential time bomb that
we may not be able to handle. And I think

(01:21:59):
that's you know, that's the crux of disclosure, you know,
I think that's what is really worrying people. You know,
at Echelon's much higher than I ever was. Is how
do we communicate this to people without them losing their
I don't know if I can say the S word here,
but losing their stuff.

Speaker 3 (01:22:17):
You can say whatever you want, you're an adult.

Speaker 2 (01:22:19):
Without without them losing their shit and going crazy because
of the excidential quandary that this would put them in.
Then those of us that either have a belief system
through our you know, our religious upbringing, or have a
belief system because of our learning, or have a belief
system through certain things we have experienced in our lives,
we could sit back and go, Okay, that's kind of cool.

(01:22:41):
That's kind of what I thought. Anyway, it talks about
it in some of these very old books like you know,
the Bible, the Talmud, you know, the the Quran, you know,
talks about these things, and so all these guys knew
about this stuff before. So why are we acting surprise today.

Speaker 3 (01:22:57):
Well, you bring up a great point, though you've got
to pose during the background. I have the same one.
It's right there.

Speaker 4 (01:23:05):
I want to believe, right, I've got it, sits right
next to me. You've got it in the background, and
that word there. I love the poster and I love
how that brought awareness to millions of people, you know,
Fox Molder's office with the poster in the background. But

(01:23:26):
believe suggest and belief, right, Believe and belief has this
religious First off, it's a religious foundation because it's a
belief system into something that is.

Speaker 3 (01:23:43):
Not tangible. But you have to believe in it.

Speaker 4 (01:23:46):
Okay, all right, But I think that that word that's
on this poster I'm pointing at it that's over here,
is incorrect because I I.

Speaker 3 (01:23:59):
Don't believe.

Speaker 4 (01:24:00):
I know, okay, So what I'm trying to get to
is the facts. I know that the phenomena is real.

Speaker 3 (01:24:12):
I know it.

Speaker 4 (01:24:12):
I've seen it and so of view, but I don't
know what it is, right. That's that's that's the crazy part.
And we and you just said it yourself. We like
to think that we're really smart.

Speaker 3 (01:24:27):
We've gotten really smart, we have, but we're not the
smartest thing in the neighborhood.

Speaker 2 (01:24:34):
No, we're not. No, you know far. And what I
like in it too is uh And I use this analogy,
you know, when I lecture. Is imagine an ant hill
sitting in a forest and the fort Service comes through
and they say, hey, we're going to build a road,
you know, from this campsite of this campsite or whatever.
So they build this road passed right next to this

(01:24:55):
ant hill. So these ants come out and they see
a road, okay, an asphalt road. They have no idea
what a road is. It is so alien to them.
So they go out there and they start trying to
communicate this thing with their little ant pheromones, trying to
you know, talk to it or whatever. And they have

(01:25:16):
no frame of reference. We're the ants.

Speaker 3 (01:25:20):
It's outside of their universe.

Speaker 2 (01:25:23):
We don't even have right, we don't even have a
language for it. So that's uh. So what I want
you to do is I want to believe, and I
want you to take the word belief and I want
you to turn it into something else. And that's called faith.
I have faith that there's something greater than me, and
I might not be able to understand it, but nevertheless,

(01:25:45):
it's there.

Speaker 3 (01:25:46):
So let's start our own cult. Yeah. And and but
you know this is this is the crazy Church.

Speaker 4 (01:25:57):
Yeah yeah, the Church of the Church, the the Church,
the Hudson Church of WU, the Hudson Church of WU.
It has been mentioned so many times, but it's one
of the best analogy, one of the best metaphoric ways to.

Speaker 3 (01:26:14):
Look at this is a fish in a fish bowl.
That's that is there. There is nothing else.

Speaker 2 (01:26:23):
That's their universe.

Speaker 3 (01:26:24):
That's it.

Speaker 4 (01:26:25):
There's nothing else man looking up out of the water
to that that they.

Speaker 3 (01:26:29):
Don't see that, that's another dimension they don't understand. No, no, no,
and and and that's where we are. There's all kinds
of things.

Speaker 6 (01:26:41):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (01:26:41):
Brian Green explains this really well too. And he does
this with ants. You know, an ant.

Speaker 4 (01:26:48):
Walking on a thin string, you know, right walking across
the screen. That that's that's a dimension to that ant.
That's all all it knows, right, that's it. Everything else
beyond that is another dimension to that ant. And it's

(01:27:08):
a really really good way to look at all of this. Now,
So let's talk about the interdimensionality of some of this stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:27:16):
Sure you.

Speaker 4 (01:27:19):
I want to go back. I want to go back
and revisit the cube. And the reason why I wanted to, Well,
first off, it's an amazing experience that happened out at
the meadow. But at the same time, when you first
talked about the cube on this program, the revelation started

(01:27:44):
to happen with pilots seeing cubes right, and very very
strange thing.

Speaker 6 (01:27:53):
And I.

Speaker 4 (01:27:55):
So let's go back, let's talk about take us through
the Cube story. And as you do that, can you
answer one question for me in advance? Did you did
you connect any dots with what was seen off of
the East coast of the United States by those fighter

(01:28:16):
pilots and what you saw in the meadow did things
seem similar to you?

Speaker 2 (01:28:21):
Yeah, that's a great question. First, I'll recount kind of
for the folks that might not have either heard this
before or you know, read the first book is in
twenty seventeen. In February eleventh, twenty seventeen, we were researching
them metal. We had several teams out there with night
vision in thermal and one of the teams that was
on top of a ridge looking down I was on

(01:28:42):
the ridge team. We started detecting man sized heat signatures. Now,
when teams are put on site on station, our teams
in ASAG do not move around. They stay put, so
we know where everybody is. And we started detecting heat
signatures that were about six foot tall about eighteen inches
wide in an area that we know. We knew we

(01:29:03):
had no personnel. This heat signature would get big small, big, small, big,
and then split into two heat signatures and then disappear.
Did not correspond with any heat signatures of animals. I
idea that we had seen in the evening. Earlier in
the evening, so we dropped down into the meadow to
try to follow up on this, and about that time

(01:29:24):
we got a radio call from one of our teams
that were on the east end of the meadow that
they were detecting on their thermals these cube or box
shaped figures that would appear on their thermals and then disappear.
And what was interesting, and they would only appear on
thermal You could not see them with the naked eye.

(01:29:44):
The only way you could detect these is because of
the difference between the cubes and the ambient temperature of
the surrounding woods or forest. So we started working our
way back over to that team, and these cubes are
appearing and disappearing, and then one appears about forty meters
in front of the team as we're working their way

(01:30:05):
over to it, and it dissipates and we get to it,
and we decide we're going to send an element A
team into the area where this cube had been, and
so when they get up to it, we're filming this
on thermal is. When they get up to the edge
of where this cube was, their heat signatures are completely obliterated.

(01:30:27):
They disappear, and they described it as when they went
into this thing is the environment was different. When they
went into it. There were no brambles or bushes fighting
their way into it. They just walked unimpeded into where
the edge of this thing. It was very dark, there
was no sound, it was very still, and it was cold,

(01:30:51):
which corresponds with the fact that this thing had a
colder heat signature than the surrounding forest. They quickly did
a one hundred and eighty degree and walk their way
back out. When they walked out, they started encountering branches
and brier and sticks and stuff that wasn't there when
they walked in, So it's almost like there was a
different reality existing at the same time at the same place,

(01:31:16):
which is kind of like you can have different quantum
states at the same time at the same place another dimension, right,
light can be both a wave and a particle at
the same time. So what if this are quantum effects
on a macro scale, you can have two realities existing

(01:31:36):
at the same time, which you know, that's what this
sounds like. So boxes and cubes. Actually, I wrote the
whole chapter in the second book on cubes, and I
started digging into that because, like you, I started hearing
about the fighter pilots talking about seeing a cube inside
of a sphere, and I thought, damn it, that's a cube.

(01:31:59):
You know, we're we heard about cubes before. And I
started really digging into it. And forgive me if I'm
looking at my notes here, but uh, you know, I
went back to the famous case in uh Hixon, not
Hixon Higden, the Carl Higden case in Wyoming, and that was,

(01:32:23):
you know, years ago, and he talked about being brought
into a cube, a cube shaped spacecraft. And then I
started going back and finding other cases of people describing
cubes taking them to other places, and you know it's
very common. You know, you would think that that's something
kind of obscure, but you go back and I'll actually

(01:32:45):
find a book written specifically about some of the strange
UFO things going on in Brazil. And one of the
things that was going on in Brazil were flying boxes
or cubes. So they called chupa cupas that would shoot
beams and actually injure people. Skinwalker Ranch back in the
first book Hunt for the skin Walker, Caller and Knapp

(01:33:07):
talk about boxes flying through the air. So I went
all the way back into the fifteen hundred and started
looking at early writings of alchemists, and it turns out
there was something called the prima materia, which was supposedly
alchemists believed that that was the material that all matter

(01:33:28):
was made of. That's right, So how do they represent
in their alcymol x etchings? How do they represent the
prima material? It's a black cube. And I actually found
a wood etching of a representation of the prima material
and it's presented as flying black cubes in the sky.

(01:33:52):
So there's something about these cubes. You know, Katie talks
about cubes at the Clearview Ranch, you know, seeing boxes
in quis cubes, So you know, I do I know
what you know what these significances of the boxes cubes
are not really you know, maybe the way human beings
perceive things that when these intermensional things start popping into

(01:34:16):
our dimensions for some reason, they manifest as a cube,
or that's how we perceive them. And that's why the
cube has always been a very magical and sacred shape.
Insofar as when you're reading the Book of Revelation it
talks about the new Jerusalem coming from the clouds. It's
a fourteen hundred mile cube, which represents Jerusalem coming to

(01:34:42):
the crowd right down to the ground, Christ returning, and
that's perfection on earth. Something about the cube being perfect.

Speaker 3 (01:34:51):
Absolutely, there's the prima materia.

Speaker 2 (01:34:53):
Right there, right and you see the very first representation
of the prime material is a cube, a black cube.

Speaker 3 (01:35:04):
Very interesting, very interesting, very interesting. I mean, did you.

Speaker 4 (01:35:16):
I don't want to get two sideways here, but when
it comes to alchemy, and I'm so I'm so in
love with that subject, chasing down real material is part
of that journey. Right But anyway, CERN announced last week
that they transmuted lead into gold.

Speaker 3 (01:35:40):
How crazy is that?

Speaker 2 (01:35:42):
Right? Well, you know, and what I wonder is, so
they transmuted lead into gold of all the things in
the world, why that? Why was that you know one
of their experiments? Because there's maybe something special about it.
I know that maybe the alchemist knew about I know.
And where it gets even weirder. You know what statue

(01:36:04):
is in front of CERN headquarters. It's the god y Shiva.

Speaker 3 (01:36:09):
I know, I know, I know. I talk about that
all the time in the opening ceremonies.

Speaker 1 (01:36:14):
You know.

Speaker 2 (01:36:14):
Oh yeah, woo man.

Speaker 3 (01:36:17):
So I had on This seems to come up a
lot on this show.

Speaker 4 (01:36:23):
But I'll just tell you I had a physicist from
CERN on the show a few months ago. I'm about
to have him back on from CERN from one of
the media rooms at CERN on fade to black right.
Very cool, very cool guy. So I asked him, Tray,

(01:36:43):
I go, so, dude, what's up man? What's up with
the secret stuff?

Speaker 3 (01:36:49):
He goes.

Speaker 4 (01:36:49):
He goes, Look, we hear the same stories that you do,
and the same conspiracy theories that you do. And I'm
still looking for the secret Illuminati room here right, He goes,
I'm looking for the secret door.

Speaker 3 (01:37:06):
I haven't found it yet, and.

Speaker 4 (01:37:09):
And and we kind of laughed it off, but I
was thinking to myself, that's how you hide something, You
just joke about it.

Speaker 3 (01:37:17):
I don't know, I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:37:19):
That that is how uh, that is how special access
programs are deflected. You know in the government as you
it's called perception management or tech protect Uh. You know
there are folks you know, you can talk to in
the community that did that for a living and they

(01:37:40):
will tell you how you know, you would divert people
away from the truth by putting something else in front
of them that seemed plausible.

Speaker 3 (01:37:50):
Has has the Dood approached you about the meadow because
we have don't answer that just yet. We have the
at skin Walker.

Speaker 4 (01:38:02):
We have what you know, the stuff going on around
Chris Bloodsoe and and other locations around the country that
there is, uh, there appears to be an interest with
the agencies and the Department of Defense with these locations.
You are a former member of the military, right, I

(01:38:25):
don't know. Are you still Are you still with the
corporation their trey?

Speaker 2 (01:38:29):
Are you still with the I am I am retired.

Speaker 3 (01:38:32):
You're not with the company anymore? Of course, that's what
you would say.

Speaker 2 (01:38:34):
Though, Well that's what everybody tells me. So yeah, that's
what everybody says.

Speaker 3 (01:38:38):
They're retired fair enough, fair enough have they approached you?

Speaker 2 (01:38:43):
You know, it's it's it's it's kind of funny because
I'm always the government guy and folks are going to say,
IM probab. They're probably talking about right now, how can
we believe what he says? You know? This, this this
thing over my shoulder right here is the US Army
Military Intelligence Corps. If you look, Lou has one of these.
Whenever he's interviewed, there's one over his shoulder to exact

(01:39:05):
same certificate. H So, I'll tell you that you take
this for what it's worth, the truth. I promised the
only involvement. And this this struck me as very weird
because you know, I've been pretty public about this. Is
I have, you know, back professionally, I had several counterintelligence

(01:39:25):
agents that would I would work with on stuff. I'll
just say, you know, they were credential badge carrying kinter
intelligence agents and they we would work on stuff and
you know, just chit chatting back and forth. It's like,
you know, what are you doing? Like hell yeah, I
just published this book. You know, I'm kind of excited
about it. And one of the agents said, oh, well,

(01:39:46):
what's it about? And I told him, I said, you know,
it's about this place and all this, and he goes,
that sounds really cool. How can I get a copy
of it? I said, well, you can order it on Amazon.
He goes, cool, I think I'll do that. So he
ordered a cop and the next time we met, which
was the next month, he had a copy of The
Metal Project. He goes, dude, can you autograph this for me?

(01:40:07):
Because this stuff is fascinating And that is the only
interest that the intelligence community has ever shown in the
Meadow was just one agent's was just interested in this material.
He thought it was neat and he wanted his book autographed.

Speaker 3 (01:40:26):
Can we stay on? Can we stay on this subject?

Speaker 2 (01:40:29):
Sure?

Speaker 3 (01:40:30):
Okay, so you were deployed overseas.

Speaker 2 (01:40:33):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:40:34):
Lots of rumors, stories, some videos, and other things about Afghanistan,
Andy Rock that have come out over the last twenty
or thirty years, about different sites, archaeological sites, things that
were dug up, stuff found in caves, stargates, craft retrievalsings

(01:41:00):
in the sky, sacred places, entities. We've had everything come out? Well,
when you were deployed over there, did you hear about
any of this? And was did any of this actually happen?

Speaker 1 (01:41:16):
Uh?

Speaker 2 (01:41:18):
Okay, Now I do have to say this is your
oath of secrecy does not expire just because you retire, So.

Speaker 3 (01:41:26):
It did happen, Okay, So what kind of what kind
of say that? Okay? So what kind of was it was?
Was it et related? Was it spiritual? Ancient?

Speaker 2 (01:41:37):
This is the honest truth. Now, of course people are
going to say, well, he just said that, So how
do I know this is really the honest truth. I
never encountered anything like that. I heard the same stories
as everybody else, kind of like your cern guy is
you I heard about the red headed giant Candahar. I
was at Kandahar. I didn't see any red headed giants.
The only giant of Kandahar I saw was me because
I'm six foot four and most people are shorter than

(01:41:58):
I am. So that's about it.

Speaker 4 (01:42:01):
So when you were in Canada, her that's when you
first heard the redheaded giant story.

Speaker 2 (01:42:05):
When you were there, I'd heard it somewhere else. I
can't remember where, you know, because I've always been interested
in this stuff but I remember hearing something. You know,
it might've been on a website or something, you know,
or somebody asked me about it. But you know, I
never talk to anybody that directly was involved with that,

(01:42:25):
that knew anything directly about it. And I get to
remember when I was over there, it was two thousand
and eight, two thousand and nine. Things are kind of hairy. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
you know you it was so so hairy that we
didn't travel on ground. We only took helicopters or sea
one thirties when we moved about the country. It was
just it was too dangerous to move around the ground.
So you know, my job was not to go out

(01:42:46):
into the field and do things. My job was basically
to do anti terrorism on the ford operating basis. So
I didn't you go out in Indian country that much.
I pretty much that's why they called a fob it.
I pretty much stayed on the fobs, you know, and
did anti terrorism there. But you know, I heard pretty
much the same stories from everybody else, and I one
thing I wasn't really intrigued with is the uh and

(01:43:09):
I'm gonna throw this out there, is of course, the
the famous jellyfish video out of Iraq, you know, with
that strange and you know, people say, oh, that was
an id a balloon cluster, you know, for the celebration
of E I d id, and you know, they put
up the photograph of the balloons. And what I've been

(01:43:30):
trying to do is that photograph of the cluster of balloons,
what's the source of that? Did that come out before
the video or did that come out after the video?
Because did somebody photoshop a bunch of balloons to look
like this thing? Did discount it? Or was there like
a catalog that had this in it that predates that

(01:43:50):
video being public? So you know, I don't know.

Speaker 3 (01:43:53):
I don't know either. That video didn't impress me.

Speaker 2 (01:43:57):
Well, I thought it was weird.

Speaker 4 (01:43:59):
It was fun to look at. No, I'm not gonna
say it wasn't fun to look at. It was fun
to look at and analyze, but it it. I always
go with my eyeballs and how I feel about something.
I go with my gut, and that one, no, no, no,

(01:44:21):
it just didn't do it for me.

Speaker 3 (01:44:22):
It didn't do it for me. And I'll tell you what,
when videos like that.

Speaker 4 (01:44:30):
That surface with these claims that are behind it, the
claims are extraordinary, all right, flying pyramids, you know, And
I'm okay, if if it was what the claims were saying,

(01:44:52):
then it would be the most famous analyzed video in
the history of the human race. Right, But because they
did they they didn't have, uh, the longevity.

Speaker 3 (01:45:05):
I think that, you know, I think, you know, And
that's that's that's really a drive.

Speaker 4 (01:45:09):
I enjoy watching them, right and trying to figure stuff out.
But the claims are just too extraordinary, you.

Speaker 2 (01:45:18):
Know, there there are And that's that's one thing I
like about, you know, our work is you know, I
have a whole This isn't just one or two people
anecdotally recounting. These are actually people that were there, that
saw this stuff, experienced you know, you can talk to them,
you can listen to their interviews, you know.

Speaker 6 (01:45:37):
And uh.

Speaker 2 (01:45:38):
And the old saying is extraordinary claims require extraordinary data,
you know, And that to a degree is true. But
let's not throw the baby out with the bathwater. Sometimes
extraordinary things do happen and you just have to kind
of take it for face value. One thing I don't
do is I don't discount other people's experience. You can't,
you know, you can't and you can't prove a negative.

(01:46:02):
And so you know, sometimes we just have to meet
people where they're at and say, well, you know that
was interesting, I wasn't there, and leave it at that.

Speaker 4 (01:46:08):
Well, look, I just told a story about a dude
walking out of the fog in the middle of nowhere.
I expect the same courtesy of listening to my experience
that I give to other people. Will I put so
much weight in people's experiences?

Speaker 3 (01:46:30):
I really really do you should? Yeah, I put a
lot of weight on it. You with your cube in
the in the in the meadow, and and and.

Speaker 4 (01:46:41):
I almost said cheap right, the invisible. These are real experiences.

Speaker 2 (01:46:48):
Right right they are? And you know what, you know
way we try to approach that is uh, you know,
Shae and I both went to the same university, and
like I said, it's trans personal. I'm humanistic perspective at
that particular university in psychology, and so you're looking at
that through an experiential lens. Is if people these phenomena

(01:47:11):
are happening and there's no human being there to experience it,
what's the point why bother If human beings aren't experiencing it.
So the empirical is just as important in my point
of view as the experiential. You know, the way the
people experienced it, how did they feel, what did it
make them think? You know, did it impact them? Is

(01:47:33):
just as important as any data I can you know,
record on a thermal or my Geiger counter or you know,
any other equipment I have. It's when you start putting
this two together's where the magic really happens. The empirical
and the experiential.

Speaker 4 (01:47:47):
Now, so much has been put on over the years.
This goes back decades and decades and decades with this community.
And you can even push it further back into ancient
Egypt if you want onto. Consumer But is is consciousness
and what it is? And then we roll that over

(01:48:08):
into modern science today and what the phenomena is showing us.
What do you make of that consciousness connection that that
may be there?

Speaker 2 (01:48:21):
Well, first of all, we don't really have a common
definition of what consciousness is.

Speaker 3 (01:48:25):
That's the problem, isn't it. Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:48:26):
You know, you know this is I'm living my lived
experience and I don't know if anybody else out there
is real or not. It's like the you know, the
thought experiment of Plato's cave I don't know. You know,
all I can do is you speak for myself, you know,
And then you start getting into simulation theory. You know
that the universe is in fact a simulation, you know,
run by somebody else. And then you go back to

(01:48:49):
the ancient text and it's like, well they were talking
about somebody else in these ancient texts, you know, be
a god, yahweh or whatever. So you know, consciousness is
something that is, it's fluid, and it's very subjective. So
that's where it gets really tricky trying to nail down
the subjective nature of consciousness. But we do know through

(01:49:11):
experiments and research and things like remote viewing, telekinesis, precognition,
near death experiences, that this consciousness is expansive and fluid,
and it's not what we always think. It is that
we can expand our consciousness. We can project our being
if you will, you know, you know, you can get

(01:49:34):
really tied up in labels our soul, our being, our mind,
our existence into other places. So then you start looking
at it through that perspective, you know, those optics, and
all this stuff starts becoming very reasonable. You know, maybe
there are things that exist out there that can pop

(01:49:56):
into our dimension that we can detect, you know, in
our consciousnesiness, but it's not always there. Maybe what I
think I experienced I really did. Maybe I can influence
the experiences of others, and then you can start really
starting to unroll that Gordian's knot. It gets really complicated,

(01:50:17):
you know, trying to figure out what truth is and
what isn't. But what you have to be really careful
is truths with a lowercase T does not equal truth
with a capital T is. You can have a bunch
of people looking at the same painting through toilet paper tubes,
and everybody sees a portion of the truth, but nobody

(01:50:37):
has the full picture. One of the things I do
when I lecture is I have a disc it's red
on one side and blue on the other. And I
go in the middle of the auditorium and I say, Okay,
I'm going to hold up something, and I want everyone
to yell out the color they see. And I hold
it up and half of the room yells red and
the other half yells blue. And I said, here's the
cool thing. All of you were right and all of

(01:51:00):
you are wrong at the same time.

Speaker 3 (01:51:02):
Yeah, I love that. Man.

Speaker 4 (01:51:04):
I'm straight up stealing that. I'm straight up stealing that
I'm doing that at the next conference.

Speaker 3 (01:51:10):
That is brilliant. And that's a really good example. Well, okay, is.

Speaker 4 (01:51:18):
They're an interest. There must be deep knowledge in all
of this with the intelligence agencies and the Department of Defense.
There has to be that they understand.

Speaker 3 (01:51:32):
It's just like we do.

Speaker 2 (01:51:33):
Right, Yeah, they do. And my copy of it is
around here somewhere. I think it's over there on the
other side of my office. But it was called A
Psychic Spies Behind the Iron Curtain, which was published in
nineteen seventy six, and in that book it starts talking
about Soviet experiments with SI you know, be it remote viewing, precognition, telekinesis,

(01:51:59):
telekines CASSI, green mirrors. I probably got that wrong. But
all this, all this different stuff, and it really freaked
out the US intelligence community. So then you had visionaries
like Bert Stubblebuying, you know, the former commander of the
US Army Intelligence and Security Command that staring at goats guy,
and General stubble Buying says, you know, we need to

(01:52:20):
get we need to do this, and so he got
people like Colonel Jim Shannon to start looking at the uh,
you know, the Project Jedi. You know, from that perspective,
he started sending people to Robert Monroe's Gateway project. They
enlisted the help of SRI Standford Research Institute to start
developing something that eventually became remote viewing, and moved this

(01:52:43):
forward and through. Since I'm familiar with remote viewing, is
you look through the SRI documents and the d classified
CIA documents. Remote viewing is real. There's no doubt about it.
It is real. It's repeatable, it's measurable. It exists. So
when you move forward into you know, the nineteen nineties
and the CIA says, oh, well, you know we're shutting

(01:53:05):
down Project Stargate, We're not going to do remote viewing.
And the Army says, oh, we gave up Project grill Flame.
We passed that over to de IA, and d I says,
oh no, we passed it over to CIA. Nobody's doing
this anymore. A program exists and it doesn't go away
just because you change the code word on it. So,

(01:53:27):
you know, I think that this is still going on.
These experiments are still going on. I think Department of
Defense is still interested in or we wouldn't have had
DA funding the research through NIDS at Skinwalker Ranch. So
you know, kind of like what you said, is what
else are they looking at? And I will tell you
they're not looking at the meadow. If DA dropped a

(01:53:48):
big chunk of money in my lap, they signed me up.
The only downside of that, and this is something that
Robert Bigelow talks about, is he can't talk about what
NIDS came up with because it was all classified under
a space access program.

Speaker 3 (01:54:02):
So they get they get to keep the data.

Speaker 2 (01:54:07):
Yeah, well they paid for it, they bought it. That's
their data.

Speaker 3 (01:54:09):
That's right.

Speaker 2 (01:54:10):
Yeah, I mean that's that's fair. You know, when you
sign the contract, it's like, yeah, we'll give you the data,
and you know it's it's theirs. You know. The little
bit that comes out, you know, is pretty tantalizing. But
what's behind the veil of secrecy. I think that's where
the real real meat is. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:54:25):
I think that eventually we're going to find out that
it's all very fundamental and fundamentally connected, all of the phenomena,
and I think it could just come down to two
basic things, and that's entanglement and consciousness, you know, and
that and that goes with the reports of consciously controlled craft, yes,

(01:54:51):
or an interdimensional being or an orb or or or
or we can go out remote viewing that it's all
just consciousness and entanglement everything. And once we figure that out,
maybe throw in a little gravity too as well, then

(01:55:11):
we'll be able to achieve our next stage in evolution.

Speaker 2 (01:55:15):
Right, Everything that is, was, or will be exist now
in some form. The Bible talks about the alpha and
the omega existing at the same time. All we have
to do is train ourselves to reach into that realm.

Speaker 3 (01:55:30):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, what are you working on now? Any announcements.

Speaker 2 (01:55:36):
The announcements are, of course, my second book, Return to
the Meadow, and I'm just going to do a shameless
plug here.

Speaker 3 (01:55:41):
Return to the Meadow excellent.

Speaker 2 (01:55:44):
Is it's out. I would love for everybody to get
a copy of it. It's it's I think. I'm very
proud of this book. I'm very excited about it. It's
quite reasonable on ebook form. Also, my first book is
an excellent way to kind of prime the pump going
into the second book, that's The Metal Project. Both are
available on Amazon. My website, tread and researcher dot Com

(01:56:07):
has linked to all of this right now. I hope
to be able to release a trailer for our documentary soon,
very soon. I'm hoping by the end of the week
to release that and maybe start coming out with the dates.
So I'm very excited about that. We're doing some research
with another group, possibly going to going to another location

(01:56:28):
that that's very famous to to do some research, and
I'm going to continue researching the meadow. As long as
you know, whatever the force is out there, you know,
want to interact with us, We'll continue to interact with it.
You know. We're always coming up with new ways and
new techniques to you know, kind of heighten the experience,
you know, be they God helmets or ST's protocols or

(01:56:50):
things like that. So we're, uh, you know, we're still
out there making it happen. So hopefully there'll be another
book in the future if I can generate enough material.

Speaker 4 (01:57:00):
Yeah, yeah, excellent, excellent, And as soon as I get
that tear Drop trailer hooked up to my jeep, I'm
heading east young man.

Speaker 2 (01:57:08):
You know, I can't wait.

Speaker 4 (01:57:09):
Trey, Thank you so much, my friend. Always a great
conversation and I look forward to our next one. Thank
you so much, Trey. Hudson everybody. Trey's links are below
and the moderators have put it up throughout the chat.
We also have Trey Hudson Research dot com over on
our website, throughout social media, and of course in the

(01:57:33):
description below. All right, and I want to remind everybody
that Tomorrow night on the show, I have Dale graf
on and tomorrow night we're going to be talking about
more about this subject, the SI field and pre cog
dreams and a little remote viewing and consciousness thrown in
for good measure. All of that tomorrow night with Dale.

(01:57:57):
But for now, until Tomorrow night, all I've got is
go Beckley Teppy. Fade to Black is produced by Hilton J. Palm,
Renee Newman, and Michelle Free. Special thanks to Bill John Dex,
Jessica Dennis and Kevin Webmaster is Drew the Geek. Music

(01:58:21):
by Doug Albridge intro Spaceboy. Aide to Black is produced
by kJ c R for the Game Changer Network. This
broadcast is owned and copyrighted twenty twenty four by Fade
to Black and the Game Changer Network, Inc. It cannot
be rebroadcast, downloaded, copied, or used anywhere in the known universe.

(01:58:42):
Without written permission from Fade to Black or the Game
Changer Network.

Speaker 3 (01:58:46):
I'm your host, Jimmy church Go, Beckley, Teppy,