Episode 264 Matilda Joslyn Gage - Suffragist, Believer in Equality, and Firebrand

There is so much going on in this episode, I almost don't know where to begin.  In his corner, Arthur discusses his new school year, art and Undertales.  Then we settle in to learn about Matilda Joslyn Gage.  Raised in a home that was a stop for the Underground Railroad, she learned lessons early about equality and doing the right thing and translated those messages into a voice for the right of women to vote, to invent, to live on their own terms and not just women.  She beilieved in the sovereignty of indiginous people and the abolishment of slavery.  We need a little of her spirit even now.  We also talk about how she affected Frank L. Baum her son-in-law and how she became the pattern for Glinda the Good Witch in the Wizard of Oz.  All this and sooooo much more in our latest episode of the Family Plot Podcast!!

We also reference:  Clara Barton from Episode 260
The Salem Witch Trials from Episode 80 and 81.
And Sharon Kinne from Episode 251.

Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/family-plot--4670465/support.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:45):
I'm Dean, I'm the dad, I'm Laura.

Speaker 2 (00:49):
I'm Mom, and I'm Arthur, I'm the son.

Speaker 1 (00:54):
And together we are family clauw.

Speaker 2 (00:58):
So nice see the wizard because that feels the sad work.

Speaker 1 (01:04):
That's actually a little appropriate this week. Yeah, yeah, let's
get the housekeeping out of the way before we start
skipping down the yellow brick road. Though, if you'd like
to help us out, there are a few ways you
can do that. For one, you can buy merch from
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Speaker 2 (01:22):
T shirts, coffee months, hoodies.

Speaker 1 (01:26):
And stickers, all featuring our own Arthur's unique and high
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And we make no judgments at all. We have kids.
They eat us out of house and homes, and we understand.
You can always do a dollar or three dollars a

(01:48):
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the show where we leave in the rants that teenage

(02:10):
Arthur does, especially when confronted with silly things like Sharon
Kinney or people who are cheaters. He does not like
either of those things. If you cannot do a monthly donation,
you can always do a dollar or two through you
buy me a coffee. If you enjoy the show, please
share it on social media.

Speaker 2 (02:30):
Share it with friends, share it with family, with every one,
and you could also leave us a five star review.

Speaker 1 (02:39):
If you don't enjoy the show, please keep it to yourselves.

Speaker 2 (02:45):
If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say
anything at all.

Speaker 1 (02:50):
Weird noise goes here. Yes, you can tell them who

(03:34):
we're talking about today. It was your idea.

Speaker 3 (03:38):
Today about Matilda Jocelyn Gage, and you made she was.

Speaker 1 (03:43):
But by the end of the show she was a
firebrand suffragist, an abolitionist, and freethinker whose radical vision pushed
the boundaries of nineteenth century reform. Raised in a home
that doubled as a stop on the underground Railroad, Age
grew up steeped in activism and intellectual rigor. She co

(04:04):
founded the National Woman Suffrage Association alongside Susan B. Anthony
and Elizabeth Katie Stanton, but her views, especially her fierce
critiques of church authority and her advocacy for Native American sovereignty,
eventually made her too radical for the mainstream movement. Gage

(04:27):
championed women inventors, exposed systemic erasure through what's now called
the Matilda Effect, and even influenced her son in law, L.
Frank Baum, author of The Wonderful Wizard of Oz. She
was adopted into the Wolf Clan of the Mohawk Nation
and founded the Woman's n Liberal Union to fight for

(04:48):
civil liberties and secular governance. Her legacy is one of
uncompromising intellect, intersectional justice, and visionary rebellion. So satell upleass
this is the ultimate. She was ahead of the women
who were ahead of their time episode of the Family
Plot podcast. Did I mention that this was Laura's idea

(05:09):
because maybe just maybe just a.

Speaker 3 (05:11):
Little bit, so okay, however it was my idea, And
yet I can't help I intro in today.

Speaker 1 (05:18):
You could have taken it, I said, you could do it, But.

Speaker 3 (05:20):
No, I mean, like like the first like you had
been doing that and now I forgot. I forgot pulling
you around by your week talking and by the way
I am.

Speaker 1 (05:33):
Well, I am Matilda elected Joslin.

Speaker 3 (05:37):
How cool is that name?

Speaker 1 (05:38):
Though pretty cool, I will say that was born on
March twenty fourth, eighteen twenty six, to doctor Hezekiah Joslin,
a physician, and his wife Helen Leslie Jocelyn, a woman
of Scottish descent who passed her love of historical research
onto her daughter. No other records of children exist for

(05:59):
the household, because, suggesting she was either their only child
or their only surviving one, infant mortality was quite high
in the early eighteen hundreds. The family lived in Sister
of New York, and their home was a stop on
the Underground railroad, so she grew up being given examples
of racial equality. Doctor Joslyn Homes schooled his daughter, encouraging

(06:21):
her to learn Greek physiology and mathematics, subjects rarely offered
to girls at the time. She grew up in a
household that actively defied slavery laws and championed intellectual freedom.
Gage developed a lifelong resistance to oppression. Her early exposure
to abolitionism, free thought, and gender equity laid the foundation

(06:44):
for her later life. She later attended the Clinton Liberal Institute,
a school that aligned with her families unique at the
time reformist values. Clearly, this was long before A Clinton
was president and had little or nothing to do with
modern liberalism. The Clinton Liberal Institute was founded in eighteen

(07:05):
thirty one in Clinton, New York as a progressive, co
ed boarding school backed by the Universalist Church. It relocated
to Fort Plain, New York in eighteen seventy eight, and
operated until nineteen hundred, when a fumigation attempt to stop
a scarlet fever outbreak accidentally burned the building to the ground.
The school was never rebuilt, and its legacy now lives

(07:27):
on in historical records and local archives. It doesn't exist
in any form today, though its spirit of liberal education
and religious independence definitely shaped Gage's worldview.

Speaker 4 (07:42):
It is sometimes better to be a dead man than
a live woman.

Speaker 5 (07:46):
It was time to get back to the show.

Speaker 2 (07:48):
Wow wow, so one of those.

Speaker 3 (07:50):
Can you imagine they were that forward of thinking. If
it had continued on through the early nineteen hundreds, the
difference that it could have made on political views.

Speaker 2 (08:04):
At the time, Like political views at the time and
then like the forward making of political views kind of awesome.

Speaker 3 (08:11):
Yeah, kind of wild. So you know, it probably would
be a good time here to go over to one
of our favorite forward thinkers and check out what's going
on in Arthur's corner this week.

Speaker 1 (08:22):
Okay, we're going to corner like that, did you.

Speaker 2 (08:29):
Thinks? Yeah?

Speaker 6 (08:46):
Here ye here ye allow me to present Arthur's corner here.

Speaker 2 (08:52):
Hey, I'm great. What are we doing today?

Speaker 3 (08:56):
How we're you know, have thrown under the bus or
to Hey?

Speaker 2 (09:00):
But it all worked out. I made it work. I
faked it till I maked it.

Speaker 3 (09:06):
Like we do like we do it around here.

Speaker 2 (09:08):
Sometimes you just gotta thin it till you maked it.
That's that's how I That's how I raise you. Right,
what are we trying to figure out? All right? So
I put two on your table? There is that your
old ones?

Speaker 3 (09:22):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (09:22):
This is this is okay. I thought you'd wrangle all
of that already and I was going to wow, I'm impressed.

Speaker 7 (09:28):
No good, okay, okay, there was a drink bottle on
my on my desk here Arthur was a little concern
that I might be overdoing my liquid and tank for
the day.

Speaker 2 (09:41):
Might pants during this recording. But no, it's okay.

Speaker 8 (09:46):
As long as I don't get squirrels in my pants
will begin so was I I'm Sorry, you say squirrels
to me and I say lousy tree reads.

Speaker 3 (09:58):
There's there's there was a whole Candace song Squirrels in
my pants, Squirrels in my pants.

Speaker 2 (10:05):
I got squirrels in my pants.

Speaker 3 (10:07):
Yes, you know he's friends with the one of the
main creators of Phineas and his friends with some people
that we have met through doing the podcast.

Speaker 1 (10:18):
WHOA That is.

Speaker 2 (10:20):
Kind of cool. Anyways, Anyway, Dad, how are you doing?

Speaker 3 (10:24):
How are you?

Speaker 1 (10:26):
I'm good, except this Patty won't get off me.

Speaker 2 (10:28):
Well, have told you not to? Not to?

Speaker 9 (10:32):
We got to insult apollos body positivity on this podcast.

Speaker 3 (10:40):
It's not acceptable.

Speaker 2 (10:41):
Let's just not insult bodies regardless.

Speaker 3 (10:45):
We don't need to call him names.

Speaker 1 (10:47):
Does he look like he thinks he's been called a name? No,
he's laying on me.

Speaker 2 (10:54):
Really not the point.

Speaker 3 (10:56):
He is not sensitive top his daddy's love. And when
you call him names that Sully's the love.

Speaker 2 (11:06):
Yeah, don't he the love? Sully the love? Don't solely
the positivity. Don't Sully the love points?

Speaker 1 (11:13):
Can we stop saying Sully?

Speaker 2 (11:15):
No? Soly so so Sully because.

Speaker 1 (11:18):
I expect a short guy with one eye to pop up.

Speaker 2 (11:24):
At least we're not saying Mike was alski Mike.

Speaker 1 (11:28):
Oh wait yeah, Mike was the little one, the big area.

Speaker 2 (11:32):
He's a very blue and purple dude as well, sir,
fuzzy blue and purple dude.

Speaker 1 (11:39):
Did you say funky blue and purple?

Speaker 2 (11:42):
Okaycuzz he was? He was a bear. Fuzzy was he
was a bear?

Speaker 1 (11:46):
Fuzzy was he had no hair?

Speaker 2 (11:48):
Fuzzy was He wasn't fuzzy, was he?

Speaker 1 (11:49):
And now that we've said all that, why don't we
go back to Arthur's corner corner?

Speaker 3 (11:56):
See his corner actually officially on two corners are today
is in a box?

Speaker 2 (12:04):
Officially I am in a box. Oh look at you.
You're petting your car, room, room, room, Look at that
tail go. He's so joyous. The sound effects in this episode.

Speaker 1 (12:16):
No, this is annoyance. It's dad stopped touching me. I'm
doing stuff.

Speaker 3 (12:20):
It's not He's so not annoyed. He's so happy to
be held by him daddy. Look at this event, such happyes.

Speaker 2 (12:30):
Wow, Hello everybody? So are there?

Speaker 3 (12:32):
You have been in school for one week as on today?

Speaker 2 (12:37):
One week? Who know?

Speaker 4 (12:38):
Who know?

Speaker 2 (12:39):
Not those not single? Not fish?

Speaker 3 (12:42):
No, how are you liking it?

Speaker 2 (12:44):
You know I've never I've I've never done very good
with school. I've I've always not always, But since sixth grade,
I think I've struggled with like focusing on school work,
and I've had like major school burnout in stuff. But
I have some pretty good teachers this year, and I
think I'm gonna make it out of this one alive

(13:06):
with good grades.

Speaker 3 (13:08):
To hear that, I really like to hear that, So
that makes it really.

Speaker 2 (13:12):
Like, mister S. We're not going to say full names
on here. Good that's good. The keeping I like, mister S.

Speaker 3 (13:20):
Keeping it close to the best. That's all good.

Speaker 2 (13:22):
Close to the best.

Speaker 3 (13:24):
Now, have you told any of your teachers that you
do this?

Speaker 2 (13:28):
What the podcast week?

Speaker 3 (13:31):
You haven't mentioned? Have you told me mister S knows,
so do this so some of them knows knows?

Speaker 1 (13:40):
And his creative writing teachers, my creating.

Speaker 2 (13:45):
Writing my creative writing teacher, and my English teachers. That's
the same three. Now I have the same teacher for
two of my classes. I got you.

Speaker 3 (13:55):
And how many teachers do you have altogether?

Speaker 1 (13:58):
Five?

Speaker 2 (13:59):
More than that? Like six? Okay, but one of them
does two classes? Is that still six or is it five?
It's still six? So you have seven classes?

Speaker 10 (14:10):
Yeah, eight classes, eight classes, seven teachers, six teachers. Yes,
So of your six teachers, two of them do two
extra classes no.

Speaker 2 (14:24):
Six, six, one, two, three, four, five, and then the
other the teacher does those two classes, and then there's
the other classes.

Speaker 1 (14:34):
That's only seven.

Speaker 2 (14:35):
So that's seven.

Speaker 3 (14:36):
So what do you have one teacher that does two
classes or do you have two teachers that do two classes?
That would make it eight?

Speaker 2 (14:42):
No?

Speaker 3 (14:43):
No, no six right, and if one of those six
teachers does an extra class, that would be seven. So
do you have another teacher that doesn't know?

Speaker 2 (14:55):
Okay, so you have seven classes, seven classes. I guess
I thought it was eight.

Speaker 3 (15:02):
Well, I mean, I could be wrong. I'm That's why
I'm trying to figure out because I'm after I also,
I mean, you're doing school, and I appreciate that, but
I'm I work at the same time, you know as fuch.

Speaker 1 (15:14):
So thank you, Arthur. You're a good kid.

Speaker 2 (15:17):
I knew you were reaching for It's good.

Speaker 3 (15:20):
You're enjoying, yeah, and you like the teachers, and you're
feeling confident.

Speaker 2 (15:25):
One weekend, you're feeling good.

Speaker 1 (15:27):
I like that, and nobody's picking on my Arthur.

Speaker 2 (15:30):
Well, I mean yeah, because Arthur's cool. Arthur's cool, but
only when he's.

Speaker 3 (15:37):
Arthur feels confident and supported so he can be his
total confident Arthur self.

Speaker 2 (15:43):
I made a bracelet. I made two bracelets. Arthur's been making.

Speaker 11 (15:48):
Some bracelets because in between classes, Harlokay, Carla Kay, Harlokay
gave me bracelet stuff and I have just been making
purty some pretty bracelets.

Speaker 12 (16:03):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (16:03):
I noticed that my bracelet making stuff hasn't come back
out to the living room where it's supposed to live.

Speaker 2 (16:08):
Maybe that could happen, uh yeah soon. I have been
also hyper fixating on on what this undertail?

Speaker 1 (16:21):
Uh oh with Sands and Papyrus and.

Speaker 2 (16:26):
Storio too, I platorio torio o g go, Well, mom,
I could I could share that picture on our Facebook?
You should the one time she costs playtafarri, I don't
will Yeah, okay, job.

Speaker 1 (16:44):
She did a great job and like anybody under the
age of about twenty at that con, got their picture taken.

Speaker 2 (16:52):
I yeah, I was very popular. That's very popular trio
and that was that was a handmade costume too. Did
you made it yourself?

Speaker 1 (17:01):
I did you made the out to our our friend
from Hope it holds cause playing props so fed up.

Speaker 3 (17:11):
Yeah yeah, yeah, were with us at that uh at
that con that I cosplayed.

Speaker 2 (17:18):
Yeah, well was at the time, like the first time
I met That was the.

Speaker 3 (17:24):
First because they did the cosies the year before. Yeah,
like you know, I remember my first time seeing them.

Speaker 2 (17:34):
They were cosplayed as the They costplayed as.

Speaker 1 (17:38):
The Blink the Weeping Angel.

Speaker 2 (17:40):
Yes, Blink the Weeping Angel, which one of my friends
really likes, doctor who is so that cosplay.

Speaker 1 (17:49):
It was hues.

Speaker 2 (17:50):
But the only problem with that was when I saw them,
I was like, you it was a little.

Speaker 5 (17:57):
Oh you were so small in Spritish.

Speaker 1 (18:01):
Well, it could have been worse. She could have caused
way to a nutcracker had definitely better.

Speaker 2 (18:06):
Yeah, that would have been bad at that point in time.

Speaker 1 (18:08):
Also definitely fear of those.

Speaker 2 (18:11):
Yeah, really bad fear. So I had a really bad
fear of it.

Speaker 1 (18:14):
In fact, they had some at a local Dollar General
and you made your mom leave the store my yeah drug.

Speaker 3 (18:21):
At the time, he dragged me out of the store physically.
I was like, it was an impressive feat for a
small child.

Speaker 2 (18:28):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (18:30):
Yeah, And it wasn't even like I like put it
in Arthur's face y'all. Let me just establish that Arthur
saw it from across the store. I had to go
to a decent store to even figure out what he
was scared of.

Speaker 2 (18:48):
What were you scared of? He's a cracker.

Speaker 3 (18:52):
You couldn't tell me because you were only free, You
were wittle, You were a little dude.

Speaker 2 (18:56):
And then I had to deal with it.

Speaker 13 (18:59):
He just you the verd No, it was, yeah, Veronica's
not Victoria's.

Speaker 2 (19:10):
I had to deal with it at Veronica's house because
she has one.

Speaker 3 (19:13):
That's funny because when I renamed her in my story,
it was another Vietnam that I didn't realize there were
that many me names. Veronica, Victoria, Vanessa.

Speaker 2 (19:22):
Yeah. I had to deal with it for a while
because they were we had met them. I'm back in California,
and you hadn't walt with your fear. But she was.

Speaker 3 (19:36):
She she used them in a lot of her holiday decorating.

Speaker 2 (19:41):
You. You sew it up. You were a brave baby.

Speaker 3 (19:47):
And you your big kid pants and.

Speaker 2 (19:51):
But I'm big big kid.

Speaker 3 (19:54):
Your chin like a kiddo doo, and I grabbed it
and I looked at it.

Speaker 2 (19:57):
I was like, he will no longer scare me. That's right,
you faced your fears for the longest time. The reason
I had like those fears are not the reason in particular.
But I used to dream about like nutcrackers, Like I
don't know, but like I used to have this very
vivid dream where I would like see a bunch of
nutcrackers like falling in on me and like starting to

(20:19):
attack me, like the like the it's it's it's a
little security. It's a little like jaw comes down and yeah,
it's like that dim station is the dislocation is just like, eh.

Speaker 3 (20:36):
Why don'tly, especially as a transgender child, I can imagine
that something cracking nuts will be fright.

Speaker 1 (20:44):
I wanted it to mention something here in your corner.
Your mom kind of already knows this, oltho she may
not remember we got I try that.

Speaker 2 (20:54):
Was not know what you're talking about?

Speaker 3 (20:56):
Go ahead.

Speaker 1 (20:56):
We got a voice message from Blue Island Comics on
Twitter thanking us for doing what we do and making
them feel like part of the family, and so they
reached out to thank us for making them feel like
part of ours.

Speaker 3 (21:13):
No, I think that is the highest compliment that I've
heard that we have gotten back from any comments or
any reach outs and one of the bias compliments that
I have gotten that we feel like we're somebody else's family.

Speaker 2 (21:27):
Well, hope, y'all, I love it. Of course we're your family.

Speaker 1 (21:32):
Dude.

Speaker 2 (21:33):
You listen to us, you're here with us. We're all dude,
We're all going through the same society and thus messages.
We're all going through the same world. Right now. Anybody
who listens to this podcast and continues to support us
the way that you guys do is part of the family.
And we have said that since the first day we

(21:54):
started this podcast. Absolutely, So what.

Speaker 1 (21:56):
Else is going on in our first corner.

Speaker 3 (21:58):
Other than your cute cute the anime eyes.

Speaker 2 (22:02):
Drawing a cutsy bear, I'm drawing a bear broke his arm,
excuse me, break anything?

Speaker 1 (22:09):
Sure, Look you broke a foot doing a silly little
dance your foot.

Speaker 3 (22:14):
I'm just saying, guys, something in the wrong way.

Speaker 2 (22:18):
If you don't remember this conversation, Yes, I once broke.

Speaker 3 (22:22):
I think it was this foot broke one foot and
sprang for one because he didn't dance, which.

Speaker 2 (22:30):
I lean dance in the clean room, living room. I
also did a dance recently in my room and Dad said, hey,
don't be doing them dances because you might break your
foot again. And I'm just like, I'm not gonna break
my foot because I didn't do a split in the
living room. I didn't do this foots.

Speaker 3 (22:48):
But you know what he did is lost your footing
and broke your ankle.

Speaker 2 (22:52):
Do you know what I did do?

Speaker 3 (22:53):
Though?

Speaker 2 (22:53):
Yeah, my foot went inwards and it snapped and then
I fell and then I was screaming crying, and y'all went,
what is wrong with you? And I said it hurts,
it hurts. Take it to the urging care and said, hey,
you broke your ankle, And then we raised the other

(23:15):
one and we had to go back because we thought, hey,
this this, this might not just be one ankle, because
my other foot really hurt too. But they were just like, no,
it's just a really bad sprid. I've did some I've
done some more drawing.

Speaker 1 (23:30):
You draw all the time. You're an excellent artist.

Speaker 2 (23:33):
I actually got, oh my god, I got the sweetest,
like genuine compliment from one of my friend's parents.

Speaker 3 (23:41):
You are so deserved of many genuine compliments. My son
hold on, I want to show you guys this, why
okay why?

Speaker 2 (23:49):
Because he loves you. This is the drawing I made.
It's very very nice.

Speaker 1 (23:54):
I like it.

Speaker 2 (23:56):
That's the when you were showing us last week.

Speaker 3 (23:57):
Right, no, oh, this is.

Speaker 2 (23:59):
A new one.

Speaker 3 (23:59):
Sorry of course, okay cool.

Speaker 2 (24:03):
I finished this literallyly and then what that's giving me?
Stink I and then my friend Neptune, they were just
like I showed my dad best. He said he would
be interested in buying art from you. Slash commission. He says,
it's amazing and you're super talented. Oh, by freaking out
for assault minute because I was like, are you kidding me?

(24:27):
Tell him? I said, thank you? Are you serious? So cool?
I'm like I was, I was freaking out, but like, they're.

Speaker 3 (24:35):
Very talented, my child. We are proud of you every day.

Speaker 1 (24:40):
Super proud of my art.

Speaker 2 (24:42):
Well, they're proud of me, guys.

Speaker 1 (24:45):
That's part of what families do is we support each
other and so we support our art.

Speaker 2 (24:50):
I'm being supported.

Speaker 3 (24:52):
You should be.

Speaker 2 (24:53):
Let me think with brom side anyways, let me think
what else? What else have I done? That's cool?

Speaker 3 (25:02):
Do you have an eye octritomentim we're probably right around
the time this episode drops, probably right around that dime.

Speaker 2 (25:09):
Ye, I'm gonna get my eyes checked and they're probably
gonna be like, hey, you kind of need glasses just.

Speaker 10 (25:14):
A little bit, imagine, and you're gonna take excellent care
of these glasses.

Speaker 2 (25:20):
I don't. I will do my best. Yes, No, I'm
just gonna take excellent care of it because if I
break these ones, I'm never getting glasses again. No that's
not true. That is not true. And I mean if
something happens, so then.

Speaker 1 (25:34):
We can get strapped so they stay on your face.

Speaker 2 (25:37):
Oh, we know we're not going to do that.

Speaker 3 (25:38):
Char Chile.

Speaker 1 (25:39):
My mother did it to me. I'm just saying, yeah.

Speaker 2 (25:43):
I.

Speaker 3 (25:44):
Believe that i've met your children. Well, your mom was special. Yeah, yeah,
I'm not not in the special motistic way. No, No,
she just had to be creative and how she dealt
with this one and the others that followed. Yeah, we
appreciate your mom to just not that you're listening, but.

Speaker 2 (26:04):
Not that she is.

Speaker 1 (26:06):
So every week she might we try, we try to
get her to listen. She might be our one listen
on good thoughts every week.

Speaker 2 (26:17):
See I missed when my baby would do that so cute.

Speaker 1 (26:20):
He's so heavy, he's a lump on my chest. Take
a picture.

Speaker 2 (26:24):
So I don't see why you're complaining he's so cute.
At least he's not that Arthur.

Speaker 1 (26:31):
He was a fat lump on my chest.

Speaker 2 (26:33):
Yeah, we'll make sure tomorrow get too much on face.
And because I know.

Speaker 3 (26:36):
How, if you send it to me, I'll post it
on the.

Speaker 2 (26:42):
On the Facebook. Okay, I got I got a good one.
That's okay to send it to my Facebook.

Speaker 1 (26:50):
So what else are we talking about? In our first corner?

Speaker 2 (26:54):
What are you looking for my Facebook? I'm pointing to
the tab. Let me send it, like directly to your Facebook.
I mean, yeah, you have Facebook. I do think that
you could do. I do, but I also have your number,
I know.

Speaker 3 (27:08):
But my poor phone is about today. Oh okay, my
screens even cracked it. Yeah, in the bottom corner you
see it.

Speaker 2 (27:16):
Oh heck no, that's a booby. Yeah, anyways it is.
We're having dinner. We're having pizza for dinner, and I've
been craving pizza for like a week now. I'm gonna
make sure that pepperoni isn't Burt this time.

Speaker 10 (27:31):
Yay, no Burt Pepperoni. Even though I can't eat it,
I just don't. That's why Lexi and I eat cheese.

Speaker 2 (27:37):
I like cheese too, but pepperoni is better because it
just has more season eights. Because of the pepperoni, I'm allergic.
It's very greasy, and Mom's a lord. I'm allergic to
the pepperonis. Unfortunately. Oh sorry, Oh very sad. I'm just
glad that I'm not allergic to pepperoni because the claud
was I'd eat it until I was dead, and that
would be in like five point zero seconds.

Speaker 3 (27:59):
I'm glad that of you got my allergy, allergy, allergy.

Speaker 2 (28:03):
I did. I am allergic to penicillin.

Speaker 3 (28:06):
You you did get that one from me? Yes, Oh,
you're making Daddy's arm falls leap. It's not that, It's
just I got an itch, and.

Speaker 2 (28:14):
It's just saying, he says, He says, Daddy put my
ledge back. Let's see, it was my friend's birthday recently.

Speaker 3 (28:25):
Hey, for friend's birthday.

Speaker 2 (28:27):
You know what? You know what else?

Speaker 3 (28:29):
Before our episode next week, it dad's birthday. We should
say Toppy birthday because it's gonna be his. It's gonna
be his birthday. No, I'm gonna be next episode.

Speaker 1 (28:42):
I'm gonna be fifty seven. No one cares. I can't,
I care, Literally, no one cares.

Speaker 2 (28:48):
We care? We care?

Speaker 3 (28:51):
Oh, the care bearer. Let's sea care you can't you
and the audience you cread?

Speaker 2 (29:01):
Do you? They? My child would get back and bid
me in the boopy let's sing.

Speaker 3 (29:06):
We won't sing to you just because I wouldn't do
that to our listeners.

Speaker 2 (29:11):
I would. I have good scene. Man, Go ahead, Arthur,
you won't missing. Happy birthday to him.

Speaker 14 (29:16):
Yeah, Hay, birthday to you, Happy birthday to you, Happy birthday,
dear father, Happy birthday you.

Speaker 2 (29:32):
That's Arthur. That was well done. Thank you to bring
us to the end of your corner. She's sang my birthday.
She sang my birthday song, and I thought it was
really nice, but she doesn't like singing thank you.

Speaker 3 (29:43):
I forgot to put my phone back on do not disturb.
And that's the second that's the second spam call I've
gotten since we started recording, which is kind of sad.

Speaker 2 (29:54):
Oh wow, that is kind of sad. Yeah, that was
kind of boopy. Wow.

Speaker 3 (29:58):
We're really running our mouth today. We're thirty three minutes
and we're not even finished with Arthur's corner.

Speaker 2 (30:03):
Oh okay, I'm sorry.

Speaker 3 (30:04):
No, you're good.

Speaker 2 (30:05):
That's not a bad thing. Okay, Well, guys, I hope
to see you guys, back back next week with my
more knowledge of undertail.

Speaker 3 (30:17):
And us you will continue to learn and.

Speaker 2 (30:20):
Report back to what's the other? The one's name a
dead Delta room, Delta Room, Delta Room. It's like the
second look, it's continuation of undertail.

Speaker 3 (30:33):
All right, well, you want to take the next section.

Speaker 4 (30:40):
It is sometimes better to be a dead man than
a live woman.

Speaker 5 (30:44):
It was time to get back to the show after
your outro.

Speaker 2 (30:47):
Never go, I was just giving him an tie, making
sure there's enough silence in there. In eighteen forty five,
Matilda Jocelyn married Henry hill Gage and moved to Fayetteville, Fayetteville, Fayetteville,
La Fayette, New York. Wait correction, she did not move

(31:10):
to Gary, Indiana, so Henry could sell music lessons to
global local locals. That's the plot of The Music Man,
not real life. Nice, very nice what you did there.
I don't understand this.

Speaker 3 (31:26):
Well, it's so The Music Man is a musical. It's
a that's Rogers and Hamils thing, isn't it might be,
I believe.

Speaker 5 (31:34):
So.

Speaker 2 (31:35):
I'm just confused because when I read, I read the words,
but I do not process what it means. Okay, that's fine.

Speaker 3 (31:41):
You can you can keep going on, I'll tell you
more about them, or I'll make you watch the movie
or something.

Speaker 2 (31:46):
Well, well, we'll deal with that.

Speaker 1 (31:48):
L short music man. This swindler comes to it town
in Indiana, Gary, Indiana. In fact, they sing a song
about it. It goes on forever and ever and ever.
If I remember correctly. In the film adaptation, a very
young Ron Howard is in it.

Speaker 3 (32:06):
I think that I don't believe that's one of the
few I've never seen.

Speaker 1 (32:10):
But anyway, this music man, Henry Hill is really just
a swindler, but by the end of the movie, he's
really become kind of a music man, and the town
loves him and he's he's changed his ways and turned
over a newly.

Speaker 3 (32:23):
But because of the connection and names, he had to
throw it out there, gotcha, Yeah, God, because his name
is Henry Hill, like the character and the music man.

Speaker 2 (32:32):
Now you're all caught up. Henry Hill Gage was actually
a merchant from Cicero, Cicerol Cicero, Yes, like from the movie,
like from the musical, like Cicero. Like, I don't know
that's the name of the city in New York. Cicero.
I have no idea.

Speaker 3 (32:52):
I see the sides of the hole, just like plummeting
in his little eyes, this little dark brown eyes.

Speaker 2 (32:58):
Just Cesero, New York. After they married, Matilda quickly turned
their Fayetteville Fayetteville home into a stop on the underground railroad.
In eighteen fifty, Congress passed the Fugitive Slave Act, which

(33:18):
made it illegal to help enslaved people escape. Oh wow.
Anyone who did this could be sent to Pridgeon could
be sent to prison. The law became infamous for encouraging
bounty home hunters to roam to roam the North, targeting
black people and claiming they were escaped slaves. These hunters

(33:43):
often hurt anyone who tried to stop them. It was
a lot like the press gangs in seven in the
seventeen hundreds and the eighteen hundreds that forced men into
the navy, or like modern ice raids hashtag ice sucks.
Matilda knew the risks by that was great. By the way,

(34:05):
Matilda knew the risks by helping escape slaves, she was
putting her freedom and possibly her life online. But she
believed the injustice and acted on it. Her first major
public speech was in eighteen fifty two at the National
Women's Rights Convention in Cybercu Syracuse, Syracuse, Okay, whatever there.

(34:33):
She argued that slavery and women's oppression were deeply connected,
two sides of the same coin. Matilda and Henry had
five Henry had five children. Charles Henry Gage died in infancy.
Helen Leslie Gage named after named after Matilda's mother. Not known.

(34:59):
Much is known about out her adult life. Thomas Clarkson
Clarkson Gage, I can't talk today. Okay, it's making me mad.
You're all right, possibly named after the British abolitionist called
Thomas Clarkson. Julia Louise Gage later Carpenter married and took

(35:21):
the last name Carpenter. Mad Gauge later bomb Ba Boum
bomb Bomb. Born in eighteen sixty one. She married L.
Frank Baum, the author of The Wonderful Wizard of oz
Doude That's Sick. Maud was a suffragist and inherited inherited

(35:47):
her mother's strong will and sharp tongue. According to historical amounts,
Matilda's Matilda and Hendry's home becating a meeting place for
reformers and thinkers. Matilda Matilda's parlor hosted Lively debates about abolition,
women's right, women's rights, and even dress reform. Henry didn't

(36:11):
speak out publicly publicly or write about these issues, but
there was There's no record of him opposing Matilda's activism.
His quiet support, especially in a time when outspoken women
were seen as threats to male respectability, says a lot.
That was excellent. Thank you, Arthur. That last bit was,

(36:32):
I don't know what the first no. You did great,
so I stepped.

Speaker 1 (36:37):
It's my fault if I sack a bunch of names
together for some reason, you get all clustered.

Speaker 3 (36:45):
So let's pause here. We want to hear from a
couple of our friends who are also fellow fellow content
creators and our friends over at Murdershop book.

Speaker 1 (36:56):
Club and Chatsunami, So.

Speaker 2 (36:59):
We're gonna hear from them, and then I'll take this
next version heny.

Speaker 15 (37:05):
I'm Jill, the host of the Murdershelf book Club podcast.
Every other week I feature a true crime book by
one of my favorite authors, telling you the story with
respect for the victims and loved ones.

Speaker 3 (37:18):
But I don't stop.

Speaker 15 (37:19):
There A psychology educator who's also studied serial killers. I
analyze the cases and I endeavor to explain the whys.

Speaker 5 (37:29):
Why do people do this?

Speaker 15 (37:31):
Told in Trilogies. Part three is dubbed Second Cast, where
I cast a wider net, going into some surprising, bone
chilling directions. Cold cases, homicides, missing persons, serial killers, and
stories from history. These both fascinate and appall us. This
is a true crime book club, so read with me

(37:53):
or let me read for you. Join the Murdershelf book
Club podcast and see what I'm pulling off the murdershell next.

Speaker 16 (38:05):
Hello, listeners of Family podcast. My name is Nicola Bardon
and I'm a big fan of the podcast. I also
host my own It's called Tiss Yourself Now. It's not
true crime, but if you feel like you need a
break after listen to a particularly gruesome episode, come over
have a little listen. We have lots of fun, lots
of hilarious stories with some of your favorite celebrities. I'm

(38:27):
talking people from Friends, people from the OC, Peaky Blinders, Scrubs,
Brooklyn nine nine, all the TV shows you love. I've
got some of the stars telling me some hilarious and
sometimes heartbreaking stories from their times in the show. So
when you're finished with this episode of Family Plot, Come
and give me a little follow over and tis yourself.
I look forward to seeing you there now back to

(38:48):
Family Plot.

Speaker 12 (38:49):
Welcome to chat Tsunami, a variety podcast that discusses topics
from gaming and films to anime and journal interests.

Speaker 17 (38:57):
Previously on Chattanami, we've analyzed what makes good horror game,
conducted a retrospective on Pierce Brosnan's runs James Bond, and
listen to us take deep dives into both the Sonic
and Halo franchises.

Speaker 18 (39:08):
Also, if you're an anime fan but don't forget, to
check us out on our sub series Chatsu Nani, where
we dive into the world of anime. So far, we've
reviewed things like Death Notes, Princess Manonoke, and the hit
Bay Blade series.

Speaker 12 (39:19):
If that sounds like you're a cup of tea, then
you can check us out with Spotify, iTunes and o
bit podcast stabs.

Speaker 18 (39:25):
As always, they say.

Speaker 17 (39:27):
Stay awesome and most importantly, stay hydrated.

Speaker 4 (39:31):
It is sometimes better to be a dead man than
a live woman.

Speaker 5 (39:35):
It's time to get back to the show.

Speaker 2 (39:37):
All right, cool as always, By the way, guys, keep
it going here.

Speaker 3 (39:42):
I like the snap nice snap guns thing you got.

Speaker 8 (39:46):
Yeah, we'll have to get a picture of that later.

Speaker 3 (39:52):
Ye Gage ran the National Citizen and Ballot Box from
eighteen seventy eight through eighteen eighty one, which she took
over when the previous editor, Sarah R. L.

Speaker 2 (40:06):
Williams retired.

Speaker 3 (40:08):
Originally named Ballot Box, Jade Gauge renamed it and in
one of the first things she published, she said, it's
a special object will be to secure national protection to
women citizens of the women's citizens, in the exercise of

(40:30):
the rights to vote. It will oppose class legislation from
whatever form. Women of every class, condition, rank, and name
will find this paper their frint Matilda Joslyn Gage Prospectus.
She often used quips and other effective written strategems when

(40:54):
commenting on recently on a recently passed law that allowed
men who died to will the guardianship of their children
to anyone they chose, even if it wasn't the mother.
Matilda commented on the law by saying, it is sometimes
better to be a dead man than a live woman.

(41:16):
Isn't that disgusting?

Speaker 2 (41:18):
H What a terrible law.

Speaker 3 (41:22):
Getting served as editor and publisher of this suffrage newspaper,
which was the official organ of the National Women's Suffrage Association.
Each issue featured the motto the pen is Mightier than
the Sword. She used it to spotlight to spotlight women inventors,

(41:45):
challenge religious patriarchy, and advocate for indigen indigenous rights and abolition.
She also ran The Liberal Thinker from eighteen ninety onward.
This was tied to her later work with the Women's
National Liberation Liberal Unit Union, which she founded to push

(42:10):
for separation of church and state and more radical feminist ideas.
Gage wrote several essays and submitted several that were published
in larger collections. Of these, there were The History of
Women's Suffrage Volumes One through three eighteen eighty one to

(42:32):
eighteen eighty seven, which was co authored with Elizabeth Katie
Stanton and Susan B.

Speaker 2 (42:40):
Anthony.

Speaker 3 (42:41):
Gage's essays like Preceding Causes, Women Church and State, and
Women's Patriotism in the War were standouts in the series.
Her newspaper The National Citizen and Ballot Box provide much
of the material for volume three. She also wrote Women

(43:04):
Church and State in eighteen ninety three, which is often
considered her most radical and enduring work, exposing how religious
institutions perpetuated women's oppression. It's a fiery, well researched critique
that still resonates in feminist theology circles. Other essays include

(43:28):
Women as Women as Inventor eighteen seventy, who Planned the
Tennessee Campaign eighteen eighty and Women's Rights.

Speaker 1 (43:37):
And Women's Rights Catechism.

Speaker 3 (43:40):
Women's Rights Catechism eighteen sixty eight. Gage wrote regularly wrote
letters and essays for newspapers across the country. She was
known for her sharp wit, deep research, and refusal to
soften her message for public approval. Her writing style was direct,

(44:02):
often confrontational, and always rooted in justice.

Speaker 10 (44:07):
Die probably my fault, all those allergyly fat going around
and now let's take a word from our sponsors.

Speaker 1 (44:14):
Like that, what can you look?

Speaker 2 (44:15):
What?

Speaker 7 (44:16):
Ooh?

Speaker 2 (44:16):
I feel like the child was giving me the stink eye.

Speaker 1 (44:19):
I feel like facing and I feel like he was
judging you. I do.

Speaker 3 (44:23):
I felt judged.

Speaker 1 (44:24):
I did.

Speaker 2 (44:25):
I'm spacing out what I've felt judged, which is well
you feel I feel very judged all the time when
I look at you, I felt judged, and now I
feel sponsored.

Speaker 4 (44:37):
It is sometimes better to be a dead man than
a live woman.

Speaker 5 (44:41):
It was time to get back to the show.

Speaker 2 (44:43):
Yeah, I also feel sponsored. I don't even know if
she had enough time to feel sponsored. Okay, did you
shame especially.

Speaker 3 (44:50):
If Dad cuts up the part where I felt judged?

Speaker 1 (44:53):
Yeah, I'm probably will Yeah. Eighteen seventy, Matilda Joslyn Gage
published a pamphlet titled Woman as Inventor, which Laura already mentioned,
and that was through the New York State Suffrage Association.
Thirteen years later, she released a separate version of the
same name in the same title through the North American Review.

(45:17):
In both she highlighted overlooked female inventors such as Sarah Mather,
inventor of the Deep Seas telescope, Margaret Maggie Knight, creator
of the machine that produced satchel bottom paper bags, Barbara Uthman,
credited with inventing pillow lace, Angelique de Cordrey, who designed

(45:38):
a stuffed mannequin for midwife retraining, drawing on the ideas
of Deordreus Siculus. And I may be mispronouncing that. My
Greek isn't good. Good, good. My English isn't good either.
Hang on, that was clever.

Speaker 3 (45:53):
I like that.

Speaker 1 (45:54):
Deodorus Siculus, and I'm almost sure I'm pronouncing that because
deodori Is to me, sounds like I'm making a joke
name out of deodorant.

Speaker 3 (46:04):
Sure, then that's usually where we get names for things
nowadays from Greek words.

Speaker 1 (46:10):
But he was an ancient Greek historian. Gauge proposed that
many goddesses began as real women, whose inventions were so
valuable they were later deified. She cited figures like Minerva Isis,
Mama Akro, and Leazu as examples of female's invention inventiveness
across cultures. Gage also argued controversially that ancient Egypt was,

(46:37):
at least in certain points, a matriarchal society, acclaimed modern
historians generally dispute. Her boldest assertion was that Catherine Green,
not Eli Whitney, invented the cotton gin. She was also
credited a woman with inventing the Burden horseshoe machine, though
she did not name her. Beyond listing inventors, Gauge examine

(46:59):
the bear years women faced in securing patents and recognition.
She argued that society discouraged women from pursuing mechanical education,
suppressed their talents, and often forced them to patent inventions
under the names of husbands. Or male associates to avoid
and ridicule.

Speaker 2 (47:19):
Well, I mean.

Speaker 3 (47:20):
Myself that with the nurse, the nurse.

Speaker 9 (47:25):
Clara, Clara though she did everything in New York started
that school went you know, it went through the roof.
And then when they made a bigger school and she
had done everything, they were like, yeah, but we're going
to give the.

Speaker 2 (47:42):
Job a principal to this guy over here.

Speaker 3 (47:44):
That hasn't even been here and from another state, and
blah blah.

Speaker 1 (47:47):
Blahs, and they double his pain in the process. Yeah. No,
And this was around that time, right, So yeah, And.

Speaker 3 (47:56):
We talked about Clara Barton recently on episode I want
to say two sixty two or two sixty three. It's
just been in the last couple of hours.

Speaker 2 (48:05):
Well wait, we actually waited.

Speaker 1 (48:07):
We did.

Speaker 2 (48:08):
Okay, Now dad's gotta find wordhyme the screen.

Speaker 1 (48:13):
See. She also criticized laws that in limited women's control
over their intellectual property. In eighteen eighty three, she wrote,
in not a single state of the Union is a
married woman held to possess a right to her earnings
within the family family, and in not one half of them,
has she a right to their control in a business

(48:34):
entered upon outside of the household. Should such a one
be successful in obtaining a patent, what then would she
be free to do if she pleased with it? Not
at all. She would hold no right, title or power
over this work of her own brain. In response, The
New York Times published an article praise Engage for having
squarely answered the common reproach with which ambitious women are

(48:58):
met that they posss no inventive or mechanical genius. Legal
scholar Paris Swanson argues that Gage's work helped ship public
opinion about women inventors, even if it didn't persuade male
lawmakers that women should vote. So, now let's.

Speaker 3 (49:14):
Take a break and we're going to hear from some
of our sponsors. Keep in mind that if you don't
like having these sponsor breaks, one dollar and three dollars
Patreon subscribers do get ad free episodes of our show,
which you actually received before the show is posted usually,
So we're going to take this break. But if you
don't want to have breaks for sponsors, that's a way

(49:35):
that you can get around.

Speaker 4 (49:39):
It is sometimes better to be a dead man than
a live woman.

Speaker 5 (49:44):
It's time to get back to the show.

Speaker 2 (49:46):
Hey, Arthur, you feel sponsored? I do feel sponsored me too?

Speaker 1 (49:51):
Right?

Speaker 3 (49:51):
So eh, say.

Speaker 1 (49:54):
That's the wonderful radio right there.

Speaker 3 (49:56):
Yeah, straight, Okay, So let's talk a little bit about
women's suffrage and the other beliefs. Gage was a founding
member of the National Women's Suffrage Association in eighteen sixty nine,
alongside Susan B. Anthony and Elizabeth Katie Stanton. She co
authored the first three volumes of the Women of Suffrage

(50:19):
and edited The National Citizen and Ballot Box, a suffrage newspaper.
Her approach was more radical than many of her peers.
She believed suffrage was just the beginning, not the end goal.
When the NWSA merged with the more conservative AWSA in

(50:45):
eighteen ninety, Gage broke away and founded the Women's National
Liberal Union, which advocated for full civil and religious liberty,
including the separation of church and state. Gauge's eighteen ninety
three book, Woman, Church and State was a scathing indictment

(51:07):
of Organized Christianity of Organized Christianity's role in oppressing women.
She argued that religious doctrine had robbed women of autonomy, education,
and legal rights. Her critique was so bold that it
alienated her from more modern suffragists, but it also positioned

(51:32):
her as a pioneering freethinker. Gage also wrote about the
Salem and Other witch.

Speaker 1 (51:39):
Trials, which episode eighty eighty one if you'd like to
check that out. Well.

Speaker 3 (51:44):
Wait Gage saw the witch trials not as isolated hysteria,
but as system systemic gendered violence. She argued that many
of the accused were healers, midwives, and independent women, targets
of patriarchal control. Her writing reframed the trials as a

(52:11):
war on feminine knowledge and autonomy, linking them to broader
patterns of religious and legal oppression, which we did discuss
a little bit of that in those episodes. Gauge also
solidly supported indigenous rights. Gage admired the matriarchal structure of

(52:32):
the Hadanasauni yeah Quoi Confederacy, where women held political power
and landrite. She spent time with these people and was
even adopted into the Wolf clan of the Mohawk Nation

(52:53):
in eighteen ninety three. She used their example to argue
that gender equality was not only possible, it had a
historical precedent. Because she was raised in an alition abolitionist household.
Gage's home was a station on the underground railroad just
As we said at the beginning of the show, her

(53:15):
early activism was shaped by this legacy, and she consistently
linked the fight for racial equality for racial justice to
the fight for women's rights. She believed that true liberation
required dismantling all systems of oppression, not just those based
on gender. Gage also wrote about abortion. While Gage didn't

(53:40):
write extensively about abortion in the modern sense, her broader
advocacy for bodily autonomy and resistance to patriarchal control laid
groundwork for later feminist arguments. Her critique of religious interference
and women's lives certainly resonates with contemporary reproductive rights.

Speaker 1 (54:02):
And now another word from our sponsors, folks, if you
get tired of hearing these ads, you can become even
a one dollar a month member on Patreon. And who
doesn't hate ads really honestly, but you can become one
dollar a month member and not have to hear these ads.
The only ads I leaven those shows are those for
our fellow podcasters, and frankly, some of them need need

(54:26):
the help, and that's because we need it just as bad.
That's why they air are So I'm not trying to
throw anybody under any buses, certainly not any of our
fellow podcasters.

Speaker 4 (54:42):
It is sometimes better to be a dead man than
a live woman.

Speaker 5 (54:46):
It's time to get back to the show.

Speaker 2 (54:48):
Matilda Joscelyn Gauge was not happy when her daughter, Maud,
one of the first, one of the first, one of
the first women accepted to Cornell University, gave up a
rare chance at a legal career to marry a struggling
actor and writer named Frank L. Baum. Gage reportedly got angry,

(55:13):
calling Baum's future uncertain and warning Maud not to be
a darned fool by marrying someone who lived off short
term theater jobs and have little money. But the anger
didn't last. Gauge, who strongly believed in women's right to

(55:34):
make their own choices, saw the irony Maud was using
the very freedom had fought so hard to win her
mother had fought so hard to win, and Bomb didn't
hold a grudge. In fact, he became one of Gage's
biggest fans. He once said she was one of the
best and best educated and most brilliant women of her time.

(56:00):
Gage's influence on Bam went beyond family. She encouraged him
to send his writing to magazines, and even suggested the
story ideas like the cyclone that later appeared in The
Wonderful Wizard of oz Her bold ideas about women's rights, religion,

(56:23):
and the way society treated powerful women shaped the Baum's
characters helped shape the Bamb's characters, especially the witches and
the strong female figures in oz One. Touching connection is
the name of Dorothy Baumb's neath. Dorothy Gage died as

(56:44):
a baby, a loss that deeply affected maud. Gage reportedly
asked Bamb to name his main character Dorothy and her
in her honor, giving the name a special meaning tied
to both family and hope. In many ways, Matilda Joscelyn
Gage was the was the woman behind the curtain. Her beliefs, emotions,

(57:06):
and ideas helped shape not just a political movement, but
a timeless story.

Speaker 1 (57:11):
I hope we got all that with you speaking into
your wrist.

Speaker 2 (57:15):
I hope so too, because it was so sweet. But
if not, we can always make him.

Speaker 1 (57:18):
We could be recorded. Why are you? Why do you
look sad.

Speaker 2 (57:21):
That I was like the closest person to the obviously
should got close to the micro microphone and she should
be fine. I was loud, right, yeah, Army, you got heard.

Speaker 1 (57:32):
And the last we promise word from our sponsors.

Speaker 4 (57:39):
It is sometimes better to be a dead man than
a live woman.

Speaker 5 (57:43):
It was time to get back to the show.

Speaker 1 (57:45):
Matilda Joslyn Gage died in eighteen ninety eight in Chicago.
She spent her last few years living with her daughter
and son in law, but her remains were cremated and
memorialized with a striking headstone in Fayetteville Cemetery, New York.
The stone is rough hewn and engraved with her lifelong motto,

(58:08):
there is a word sweeter than mother, home or Heaven.
That word is liberty. It's not just a memorial, it's
a manifesto. The headstone stands out among more traditional markers,
a bold tribute to a woman whose radicalism was often
erased from mainstream suffrage history. Gage's influence on The Wonderful

(58:31):
Wizard of Oz is increasingly recognized, especially her impact on
Baum's portrayal of powerful women and witches. She's been featured
in feminist documentaries, podcasts, and YouTube history channels. Like a
grave attraction, The Matilda Joslyn Gage Foundation in Fayetteville operates

(58:52):
her former home as a museum and educational Center, highlighting
her work in suffrage, abolition, in digits, rights, and free thought.
While there's no widely documented haunting case tied directly to
Gauge and her fill A home, it has been the
subject of local lore. Visitors have reported cold spots and

(59:15):
unexplained sounds in the former study, feelings of being watched
near her Suffrage Your Artifacts, lights flickering during discussions of
her more radical writings, whether it's paranormal or just the
weight of her legacy. The house carries a palpable energy,
and that's palpable, not Palpatine. We're not doing a Star
Wars reference, except that we did uh oh hashtag Star

(59:38):
Wars sneaking. It's a fitting echo for someone who refused
to be silenced, even in depth, as.

Speaker 3 (59:46):
Rightly she shouldn't be, because Wow.

Speaker 1 (59:50):
I didn't know any of this when I started. I
started with the name, and I figured she was some
local schmuck because there's that Gauge Park in Topeka, No
far from it. She amazing, almost as amazing as Clara Barton,
maybe more amazing in certain ways.

Speaker 3 (01:00:06):
I just so.

Speaker 6 (01:00:08):
I think I think I picked up the name from
either when I read Wicked the book or from something
else when.

Speaker 3 (01:00:19):
I was doing research on the movie that came out,
and a thought just from the few things that I
picked up, I'm like, you've got to talk about this woman,
because oh my goodness.

Speaker 1 (01:00:31):
Yeah, I believe I begin in summary and final thoughts,
Yes you do. And so I am. After having announced
that I thank you, welcome, After having announced that I
did not know this woman, I'm glad I met her,
even if that meeting was, you know, after long after
she was two.

Speaker 2 (01:00:52):
Hundred years after she died.

Speaker 1 (01:00:53):
Yeah, yeah, I worry a lot about our current political situation.
I don't want to go into it, but I will
say a lot of what I see as political theater
where we're going after people that we don't need to
go after for no reason. And again I won't spell
that out. I will say there's no reason to go

(01:01:15):
after trans people. I'll put that right out there. Since
we have one on the show and we get asked
a lot.

Speaker 3 (01:01:22):
Well, we talked about trans rights as a trans child,
talking about our son when he was a young young child.

Speaker 2 (01:01:29):
Yep.

Speaker 19 (01:01:30):
So anyway, and I mean just the way that they're
treating LGBTQ people in general, there's no reason for the
why for how they're treating us, no reason whatsoever.

Speaker 20 (01:01:43):
I agree, I agree that wasn't you, that was me,
because if there was a genuine reason, they would give
off the genuine reason instead of just being you all
are pedophiles or you all do this because you want
to be in relations to the children.

Speaker 2 (01:02:01):
And it's just like no, no, and literally, there is
nothing that is enforcing me to be crans or to
be pan or to be attracted to somebody that isn't
that is the same gender as me. There's no reason
for me to just decide that because of the internet.
The Internet is not gonna impact me that and it

(01:02:24):
might impact some people, because yes, children are impactful, but
you shouldn't be giving children phones at their age. You
shouldn't be giving children, you know, like phones. It makes
sense if they just need to call someone at school
or something, but like you don't need whole iPhones for
them to be on TikTok or for them to be

(01:02:45):
on Instagram. You know, it's there's no reason to attack
us for who we are on the inside. When nobody
is attacking you. We are not attacking you unless you
attack us. And that's the whole thing. You shouldn't be
attacking people. No, just in general you shouldn't attack each other.
But the whole thing is, if you attack other people,

(01:03:08):
they are going to feel the right, the need to
defend themselves. And when they can't defend themselves, they're going
to need to fight because you force them back into
that corner, right, And that's basically what the government is doing.

Speaker 1 (01:03:22):
And that was my point. I don't like what our
current government is doing because, like I said to me,
this is all performative. None of it is actually solving anything. Yeah,
you pick a target, say they're bad, and get everybody
on your train. Well, I just I can't roll with

(01:03:46):
that anymore anyway, not here, not there. Overall, I was
just really impressed with this woman, and it impressed me
mightily how much of her ideology wound up in the
Wizard of Oz. Yeah, and then I just I have

(01:04:09):
a lot of admiration for Matilda Josly Engage. I enjoyed
learning about her, I enjoyed meeting her, even in this
odd historic way. Arthur was that that was my final thought, Yes,
you're a man.

Speaker 2 (01:04:26):
I mean I feel like, yeah, I feel like I
gave most of my thoughts when I interrupted that. But like,
I'm sorry, by the way, I didn't mean to interrupt
with you. I interrupt you, but I wanted to get
it out so I could like remember as much as
I could. But yeah, the just if that had gone

(01:04:47):
on for even a little while on her, if that
had changed people's minds and been like, oh, we're actually
being kind of insensitive here with genuine people, then our
future might have been better. Yeah.

Speaker 21 (01:05:03):
But since that didn't continue on, since that didn't follow through,
we now have to deal with the society that we're
in today, and we have to feel like we need
to protect ourselves twenty four to seven because other people
just don't.

Speaker 2 (01:05:20):
Like us being who we are because a god's a
god quote said so even though he didn't.

Speaker 17 (01:05:29):
Right.

Speaker 3 (01:05:29):
Well, And that's the crazy that's the crazy thing that
it's one hundred and fifty years later and there are
still people who want everyone else to believe that someone's
religious choice, or someone's race, or someone's history, or someone's

(01:05:53):
way that they were born it makes them less of
a human being right than someone else, just because of
their background or because of how they were born. And
it's the same lie that was told one hundred and
fifty years ago. That was told, and that's what coming

(01:06:15):
off of what you're saying. How crazy is it that
she was trying to tell people all the way back,
this is the first time we've done this. This is
in Salem, still going now, and there are still standing
at Congress now saying we've been fighting against this all

(01:06:36):
of this time, and you're still trying to convince the
American people that we are.

Speaker 22 (01:06:41):
Less because we are transgender, we are less because we
are black, we are less because we are women, we
are less because we don't believe in the same God
as you, and.

Speaker 3 (01:06:52):
Not not saying that is a political thing, but tying
it all back into this woman that we're talking about,
who was telling people in the eighteen eighties, in the
eighteen nineties, this is not okay.

Speaker 2 (01:07:05):
Exactly. This is the same person who is trying to
teach them that those thoughts, the way they were treating
the people of their country was not okay because they
are different than you. Absolutely, you can be different, you
can have differing ideas. That's one thing. Another thing is

(01:07:26):
wanting to tear the whole country apart because they are
one slight different than you.

Speaker 23 (01:07:31):
Exactly, we are people, we are humans, and we exist
for a reason. We are a creation, okay, whether you
want to be, whether you think it's God's creation or
whether you think it's just biology or science. We are
creations and we come from other people. Yes, just because

(01:07:56):
we are different, because we are gay, because we are
we are a different gender than you.

Speaker 3 (01:08:02):
We are whatever, different history, a different religion, and a different.

Speaker 2 (01:08:06):
Right, different national creed. Humans are humans. Humans are humans
are if we were to band together as people and
push our differences aside and be like, hey, you know what,
you're human. I respect you regardless of who you are,
unless you're just morally awful, right.

Speaker 1 (01:08:29):
Like Sharon Sharon Kenney.

Speaker 2 (01:08:31):
Why Sharon Kenny? Then put the differences aside and be like,
we are people. We need to treat each other like people,
and regardless of what we are going through, we need
to support each other. And that's what she was trying
to do. She was trying to push that out there,
and I great women for that. Absolutely good for her.

(01:08:53):
I am so glad we had someone back then even
talking about this because the fact that it is still
an issue today in our society and may become an
even worse issue within the next few years. Absolutely vile
and We need more people who talk to speak up
about it, who aren't afraid to be arrested or anything

(01:09:18):
else that the government wants to do to those people.
And that's that's my final thought. Okay, I am so sorry. No,
you're good. It's a little bit of a political ram.
That's okay, that's fine.

Speaker 3 (01:09:30):
I'm trying to speak off of everything that you said there,
not to say any more than what you said, because
everything you said was completely valid. There one thing just
on top of that that I had written myself down
over here. Not only was she ahead of her time,
was she amazing for having the guts to speak out

(01:09:53):
when I mean she could have had any massive number
of things happened to her. She could have been in prison,
she could have been thrown in the looney bin, she
could have been probably.

Speaker 2 (01:10:06):
Hung, yes for all of the things. So many things
could have happened to her.

Speaker 3 (01:10:11):
But on top of that, she didn't just say it's
us against them ever, right, No, it was never only
about women's rights, because never only about indigenous people's rights.

Speaker 2 (01:10:22):
It was never only about religious rights.

Speaker 3 (01:10:24):
Right, And that was another thing my mother raised me up,
thinking that roe versus Wade was really the first separation
of church and state kind of or the first separation
of church and state was something that happened, you know,
in the forties, not something that they were trying to
get done.

Speaker 2 (01:10:45):
Way back in the eighteen eighties.

Speaker 3 (01:10:47):
So outside of that, but she didn't. It wasn't ever
us against them with her. It was a human compassion exactly, passionate, exactly,
a fellow, my fellow individual. There was no gender to it,
there was no race. It was an equality thing that

(01:11:09):
was equal. It wasn't I'm trying to one up you there,
nobody's trying to want to you. Was trying to make
things honest and there, and that was something that she
was raised up with. So even the generation before her
had those same kind of morals. And that's why people

(01:11:29):
say everything it all starts at home. She started, This
started when she was not even old enough to understand
the difference, and it carried through not only through her life,
but also through her child's life, and her daughter, who
chose something that wasn't her choice, she took a step

(01:11:52):
back and she went, you know what, it's not my choice,
but this is her choice.

Speaker 2 (01:11:57):
And even if that choice is.

Speaker 3 (01:11:59):
Something that I wouldn't have been okay with I understand
that this is a choice she's making for herself and
that's the viewpoint and at the end, that's that's where
we should all be.

Speaker 2 (01:12:09):
Absolutely, we shouldn't be disrespecting other people, yep, just because
they have different viewpoint, different choice, different whatever. Absolutely, because
we're all humans, we're all different, we're all going to
make different decisions.

Speaker 3 (01:12:23):
You're right for sure?

Speaker 1 (01:12:24):
Did you have other shows?

Speaker 3 (01:12:26):
That's the end?

Speaker 17 (01:12:26):
Nope, that's it.

Speaker 1 (01:12:27):
Okay, that's our show. Thank you for listening, thank you,
Thanks for keeping us in the good pods, Top one hundred.
Thanks for being members of the fam, especially you who
called in. We love you. But if you listen and
you love us, and then we love you back, and
that makes you a member of the fan. So if

(01:12:49):
you need a family, we're here. Thanks to Blue, Lexi,
Laura and Arthur. Thanks to Bill that is Bill Parents.
Bill does our theme music. If you need music for
a project, you can reach out to Bill Bill Barrant
at SBC global dot net. Thanks to Paige Elmore of
the Reverie Crime podcast, who combines her Canva addiction to

(01:13:13):
her own Arthur's artwork to create some logo art work
for us. Thank you, Paige, thank you page. Thanks to
Aaron Gennerk of The Big Dumb Funchow who continues to
promote us locally and join us next week as we
look into the story of Samuel Langhorne Clemens, better known
as Mark Joyne.

Speaker 3 (01:13:32):
Bye.