May 28, 2025 • 39 mins
Slim Chickens CEO Tom Gordon reveals how Gen Z's snacking behavior is revolutionizing the fast-casual industry and why his 300+ store chicken chain is betting big on AI drive-thru technology. In this explosive Fast Casual Nation episode, Gordon breaks down the shift from traditional dining to all-day snacking, shares insider secrets about achieving $3,000+ hour volumes with hand-battered chicken, and explains why burger brands are scrambling to add chicken while chicken brands stay focused. Plus, discover how Slim Chickens is testing drive-thru-only locations, using AI that's 91% accurate vs humans at 84%, and even building a recording studio to connect with younger consumers.
FastCasual #GenZDining #RestaurantTech
Get Your Podcast Now! Are you a hospitality or restaurant industry leader looking to amplify your voice and establish yourself as a thought leader? Look no further than SavorFM, the premier podcast platform designed exclusively for hospitality visionaries like you. Take the next step in your industry leadership journey – visit https://www.savor.fm/
Capital & Advisory: Are you a fast-casual restaurant startup or a technology innovator in the food service industry? Don't miss out on the opportunity to tap into decades of expertise. Reach out to Savor Capital & Advisory now to explore how their seasoned professionals can propel your business forward. Discover if you're eligible to leverage our unparalleled knowledge in food service branding and technology and take your venture to new heights.
Don't wait – amplify your voice or supercharge your startup's growth today with Savor's ecosystem of industry-leading platforms and advisory services. Visit https://www.savor.fm/capital-advisory
FastCasual #GenZDining #RestaurantTech
Get Your Podcast Now! Are you a hospitality or restaurant industry leader looking to amplify your voice and establish yourself as a thought leader? Look no further than SavorFM, the premier podcast platform designed exclusively for hospitality visionaries like you. Take the next step in your industry leadership journey – visit https://www.savor.fm/
Capital & Advisory: Are you a fast-casual restaurant startup or a technology innovator in the food service industry? Don't miss out on the opportunity to tap into decades of expertise. Reach out to Savor Capital & Advisory now to explore how their seasoned professionals can propel your business forward. Discover if you're eligible to leverage our unparalleled knowledge in food service branding and technology and take your venture to new heights.
Don't wait – amplify your voice or supercharge your startup's growth today with Savor's ecosystem of industry-leading platforms and advisory services. Visit https://www.savor.fm/capital-advisory
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
All right, welcome back in to another episode of Fast
Casual Nation, the podcast that started it all in the
fast casual sector. I'm here with my co host, Miss
share Canceler. How are you.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
I'm doing great. I'm a little tired after a whirlwind
at the National Restaurant Association Show and the Fast Casual
Top one hundred, but I'm back ready to rock and roll.
Speaker 1 (00:18):
You have done it again. We have another top one
hundred list that has come out of the NRAA show
and during the NA show, I should say at the gala,
tell me a little bit about it. How big was
it this year? Can you reveal any of the top
say two or three people?
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Yeah, it was bigger than ever our tenth anniversary. I
think we had about three hundred and forty attendees this year.
Dave's Hot Chicken was our number one winning brand and
Chiba Hutt was our number two brand. The report, the
report is out. You can read all about the all
the brands, the winners, and the top twenty five executives too.
Speaker 1 (00:54):
So you guys visitfascasual dot com. You guys can learn
all about that and get the full Can anyone get
the report if they just down't.
Speaker 2 (01:03):
Just sign dowload it. You just have to give your
email and you know you can get it for free.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
So all right, cool, So you guys check that out.
If you're not over on fastcasual dot com, it's very
easy to get there. Just pipe in fastcasual dot Com.
You'll be in the website and you can kind of
learn a little bit more there. So click read now
and boom you'll be right there on the page going
into it. So check it all out at fastcasual dot com.
(01:31):
And again, one of the things that we do here
on the show as we start to build more content
is we do bring a lot of founders in and brands.
As you've already started to see just the number of
people that have been on this show here recently, and
today is no different. We're going to have another top
one hundred Chicken brand today and we're going to be
(01:52):
breaking down the topic of gen Z and Millennial and
there may be a very interesting shift occurring that we'll
have packed Fast Casual bigger than ever, So stick around
for that. We'll be right back. My name is Paul Baron.
(02:27):
As the early pioneer in fast casual, I've seen the
industry evolve from just a few operators to the most
sought after segment by consumers around the world. Now we're
planning to shape its future. Tap into decades of my
expertise identifying the emerging brands and tech winners in the space.
(02:48):
Saber Capital will be fueling the next generation of fast
casual innovation. All right, we're back here, Sharah, and today's
topic is the shifting landscape of gen Z. And I
call out gen Z specifically because as we've been tracking
sentiment in the business overall, you look at casual dining
(03:13):
which has had the largest slide in sentiment overall, and
that coming from you know, from over on saver FM.
If you'll learn a little bit more about that. We
do deep dive research primarily because we do a lot
of support on the finance side looking at brands. But Cher,
when you look at this market as it pertains right now,
(03:34):
both on Millennial and gen Z, have you started to
see brands shifting their strategy to create two different looks
at Millennial and gen Z as opposed to combining it.
Speaker 2 (03:46):
Yeah, I think so. The gen zs are way more
into snacking. I mean millennials are too, but I think
snacking is becoming, you know, quite trendy for them, and
so that is something that really we're focused on. And
also gen Z doesn't want to ever go hang out
at a casual dining restaurant anywhere, it seems like, so
it's fast casual or QSRs for them these days.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
I like it. Well, listen, we're going to bring on
Tom Gordon, who is the CEO over at Slim Chickens.
He of course is also a top one hundred fast
casual brand. So Tom, how are you?
Speaker 3 (04:19):
I'm great? How are you?
Speaker 1 (04:20):
We're good? Great to have you on the show. Obviously,
we want to learn quickly about where Slim Chickens is today,
what's the size of the brand, give us the latest updates,
maybe the recent openings, what your current strategy is right now.
Speaker 4 (04:36):
Yeah, of course, you know we're we're over three hundred
stores open now. Like we're very busy in the Inner
Mountain West and Carolina's in Florida.
Speaker 3 (04:43):
We have a big business in the UK.
Speaker 4 (04:45):
We have seventy one stores in the UK now and
you know we've found our niche with you know, our
bespoken diffink sauces, tenders, winging sandwiches, salads, wraps and trying
to have the best quality I think for the guests,
and I think we always push that quality first, hospitality first,
and let the guests make sure that they have the
(05:06):
experience they want. I think your topic about how you
know gen Z is shifting. I think you said have
to give an experience, and so we talked about that
quite a bit. And you know, we're happy where we are.
We're working hard and building a lot of restaurants over here.
Speaker 1 (05:22):
You guys have a really great menu that starts to
span across a few different sectors that gives you a
little bit more wide variety. The jar desserts, the waffles
with chicken and waffles. I mean, those are differentiators that
I think separates you from what we've seen in the
traditional Chicken brands. When you started building the menu out
(05:43):
like this, was it specifically targeted at a different demographic
or were you trying to span this across more of
a multi demographic layout.
Speaker 4 (05:53):
I think that we wanted it across a multi demographic layout,
but it wasn't a demographic play like per se.
Speaker 3 (06:00):
It was more, you know, we.
Speaker 4 (06:01):
Thought we could do this type of offering better. We
could do a better breading. We could do better dipping sauces,
we could do better sandwiches. And so the focus for
us is culinary first, like it can be a better
product and it can be a better experience for the
guests if we do it right. And so just doing
it right is a constant theme for us, like listen,
(06:22):
let's not do it wrong, let's do it right. Yeah,
And that theme has permeated through our entire twenty two years.
Speaker 3 (06:28):
And you know, three hundred plus restaurants.
Speaker 1 (06:30):
I'm looking at your Instagram right now. And size wise,
what is the size of a store today that looks
like a big unit.
Speaker 3 (06:40):
It depends.
Speaker 4 (06:40):
I mean we have a twenty seven hundred square foot
unit in a twenty two pro time wel we also
have inline spaces. We have university spaces, free court spaces,
like everything in the UK is just about everything is
an inline space, you know, high street, high traffic. But
we're flexible and I think that if we can deliver
(07:02):
our food and experience in the right way, you know
you can, You're going to be pleased with what the
experience you get, no matter what the physical location is.
I mean I may look at look at brands like Chipolte, Starbucks, Like.
Speaker 3 (07:15):
They're all different, but you walk in, you know you're there.
Speaker 4 (07:18):
So for us, like you got to make sure that
you know you're in the slim chickens and get the
experience and the food that you expect and to have
a great, you know, but an entirely great experience.
Speaker 3 (07:26):
When you're there.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
Are you focused more on opening those smaller locations or
are you still you know, ready to open you know,
the porch swing, you know, season restaurants with poor season,
you know, y'all, I like that.
Speaker 4 (07:43):
I like that Moniker that y'all, the porch swing. I yes,
that's that's kind of that's where it is, you know,
that's where's where we started. Look there, it's not a
state secret that construction is expensive and interest rates are higher.
It's harder to build ground up, and that's like, that's
a fact. We are still doing a lot of ground
up restaurants because we believe that the guest likes that experience.
(08:06):
But we are like the most open of any brand
to also having other types of venus, like the multi
asset strategy or differentiated asset strategy, I should say, is
one that we've embraced and we're going into bigger cities,
within line spaces, with in cap spaces, with doing a
three drive through only prototypes this year to try those out.
(08:29):
We want to make sure that the food's available to communities.
We want to serve communities and so whatever asset type
that requires, that's what.
Speaker 3 (08:36):
We'll try to do.
Speaker 2 (08:38):
Interesting, I didn't know about the drive through concepts. That's
pretty cool. So no in seeing it all just drive
through and delivery we have.
Speaker 3 (08:47):
We have three we're trying right now.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
Yes, cool, Okay, so we'll explain. You can't just drop
that and not explain the time.
Speaker 3 (08:55):
Are they Well? Are they? I'll give you two examples.
Speaker 4 (08:59):
So we have one in US Stark and Stare based
and it was a very our first restaurant we ever
did in fact, but the lot was so little, like
we would never buy a lot this small again. It
was our first one back when we had no anything.
But it really lends itself well to having you know,
two lanes around and escape plane. There's three lanes we
(09:19):
can really service I think you know, drive through guests,
calling guests and third party delivery through this drive through unit.
We're testing it there. We have a franchise partner in
Kentucky who also has a really busy unit in a
town and wants to try to kind of eliminate some
pressure off this first unit and give another county over.
(09:43):
You know, some experienced the brand, so we're going to
test to We got one more coming later in the year,
but we're excited about that venue. It's not going to
be the only thing we do from now on a course,
like we believe in the dining room, but where in
a market you can have a small lot, maybe an
infill spot, we want to create an option for franchisees
(10:03):
and that's what we're doing.
Speaker 1 (10:04):
So it's kind of an express version. I guess.
Speaker 2 (10:07):
Yeah, are those drive throughs where you're testing the AI
as well or is that in all your drive through restaurants.
Speaker 3 (10:14):
No, we're not testing in all of them, but we
are testing it. It's it's a funny thing, you know.
Speaker 4 (10:18):
We like the like the math would tell you that
the AI works like it's it is more accurate.
Speaker 3 (10:26):
I think a person that's eighty four percent accurate the
AI is about.
Speaker 4 (10:30):
Ninety one wo So yeah, this interesting dynamic of the
AI is more accent a person. Maybe that's what the
math would suggest, but we also have this group of
customers that doesn't love it. We have some that do,
some that don't, and you know, so we've got to
be careful. We want to make sure we deploy it
in a way that would make the franchisees profitable. But also,
(10:53):
except in the communities like we the guests who buy
our food are the lifeload of the business. We never
want to have an issue where a guest doesn't want
to come back to a slim chickens. And so, you know,
it's we're going to see how it's received by the guest.
We're going to see how it works with check average
and with you know, speed and the drive through it.
(11:14):
But it's an interesting concept, it's an interesting tool, and
I think that we're going to continue to embrace it
and understand how and the best place is to deploy it.
Speaker 1 (11:24):
You know, this goes back I originally when I first
started in the industry, I was working as a consultant
and I ended up doing some work with McDonald's on
the original tandem and dual lane drive through before they
existed and we had a chance to go. I was
in Romeoville, Illinois at their startup kind of innovation center,
(11:46):
it's like an a warehouse, and they were in there
testing all these variations on drive through models. So the
stacked tandem where you could queue up, which is basically
what Chick fil A uses today, the split lane drive
where it splits out the two orders, and then we
also did a queue lane which was kind of like
(12:08):
some of the restaurants where they pull you off into
spots and then they go deliver to you. When you
look at that time in the variations of drive through,
because that's probably going to be a big part, especially
when you flex in third party delivery as a potential
right function, what are you finding that is working the best,
(12:28):
you know with the models that you guys are using.
Speaker 3 (12:31):
I mean, I you know, I wish I had the answer.
Speaker 4 (12:33):
I obviously don't, but I think that what you see
is you have to be able to quickly service the
third party delivery guys and girls. And but you you know,
you think about a We talked about a frictionless experience
for the guests, like like we wanted to be easy
for anybody to come in the restaurant, a mom of
three kids, an eighteen year old teenager, a dad only
(12:57):
home from work, like the frictionalless experience is critically important.
I tell my team all the time, it's got to
be frictionless for the third party driver too, Like it's
got to be easy for those guys they're going to
get in get out, like they're doing a job to
serve our guests. It's got to be easy. So finding
a way to make a particular lane or pull up
(13:17):
way window or a pull up spot work for the
third party drive through is a critical component of how
we go forward in the future because that channel is
only growing, it'll continue to grow, and we want to
make sure that it's frictionless, not not just for our guests,
for the drivers too to get the food out quickly
to the guest.
Speaker 1 (13:36):
So how okay, So how is AI integration being done?
The Wall Street story gets into a little bit of
how the use case is. But you guys are trying
to extend this beyond just the service capacity. It's more
of the brand placement. I guess for guests to recognize
some chickens, explain.
Speaker 3 (13:55):
Where you're going.
Speaker 4 (13:57):
So we want to make sure that that the guests
know what some Chickens is obviously, and as they look
on any third party app like the whole program, or
some chickens can show up and be a part of
what you see in the third party. But as AI
relates to the direct kind of contact the guests and
the drive through. We're testing that in fifteen or eighteen
(14:19):
stores and you pull up, run the drive through, you
have an AI attendant talk to the talk to the guests,
and you go through the whole scenario.
Speaker 3 (14:28):
You order your food.
Speaker 4 (14:28):
But if you ever want to talk to a person,
all you used to and that's a big sign of
course it says hey, like speak to a team member.
Speaker 1 (14:35):
Yeah, if you.
Speaker 4 (14:36):
Say speak to a team member, it just pops to
a team op and a team member can do it.
But it's two different channels really, It's like it's the
drive through channel to drive to talk through the ordering process,
but also the kind of the machine learning and AI
of where our guests are, what they want to see,
what they want to eat, like, what they want to
view media wized as a critical component of how we
(14:58):
market to the guests and just let them know where
we have and where we are. And as you have
a new store in any town, USA, like you have
to kind of push out the message like look, some
chickens is here. We want to make sure that you
know it and give you a chance to experience brand.
Speaker 1 (15:13):
Right, So Arkansas obviously the base of the brand. How
many units are in Arkansas?
Speaker 3 (15:20):
Now?
Speaker 4 (15:21):
We have ten in northwest Arkansas where I live with
the corporate offices, and another I think twelve across the state.
Speaker 1 (15:28):
Okay, all right? Is that still kind of the hub
and spoke of growth because you mentioned UK. But where
if you look in this in this central Midwest? Is
that primarily the locales?
Speaker 4 (15:42):
I think you when you talk about the US like
we have great partners like I mentioned before in Florida,
the Carolina's, the inner Mountain West, and you know where
we want to focus is where the franchisees are are
want to build the restaurants. When it went a deal
is is worthy, we want to go and deliver and
invest our time and resources to make sure the franchise
(16:07):
has all the support they need. I think generally throughout
the unit the Central United States like we're busy. Uh
you know, I think as we kind of get to
corners of the Northwest and New England and.
Speaker 3 (16:18):
South Florida that that'll that'll come.
Speaker 1 (16:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (16:21):
But the but the central US is a busy market
for us, and we're we're freezing how growth is going.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
I've been to one of your stores and first of all,
the food's amazing. Uh, the service was excellent. It does
have kind of a unique feel that doesn't feel like
Fast casual to an extent. There is a place down
in Austin that's my hometown, and there's a restaurant that
(16:47):
has a similar feel, but it's like a fine dining
chicken house. Okay, I mean they do waffles, chicken and
waffles and a large variety of food, and it reminded
me of that location. And this is a one off
restaurant in Austin, Texas. I'll send you the link to it.
And it's so unique because you guys have almost elevated
(17:08):
this whole experience around chicken, which I think is a
big factor here. But when you look at sentiment falling
right now in casual dining fine dining, but yet QSR
and Fast Casual seem to be holding with gen Z
and Millennial, why do you First of all, why do
you think that is? Is it just the offering, is
(17:28):
it the style, the price? What is it that's drowing
them in?
Speaker 3 (17:32):
Well?
Speaker 4 (17:32):
I think the first thing you have to look at
is the shift. It's just over the last twenty years
from beef to chicken. I mean chicken. Chicken is the
shift in the US. And it's a crowded space. People
love it. I mean, brands that we compete with, who
we respect a lot, you know, do very well because
(17:53):
the chicken industry and that and the space and fast
casual has grown like crazy. Yeah, I guess number one.
I think also with with you know, gen Z and
Amills do for that matter, like it's a it's a
perceived health.
Speaker 3 (18:07):
I mean maybe.
Speaker 4 (18:09):
I think it's it's accurate, but it's you know, it's
eight burgers every day, no chicken every day, yes, and
so you kind of you get the chance to capitalize
on you know, the chicken and you know the industry
in the US that is it's the most modern available
chicken market in the world is the United States. And
(18:31):
the protein is the is the most affordable and easily
accessible protein in the world. So, you know, it's it's
just that several dominoes in the last twenty years have
fallen to create this fast casual chicken industry in the
United States that I think services a need that guests
want to participate in and and they want to have
(18:54):
it as an option to that I experience and are
happy to be part of it.
Speaker 2 (18:59):
You know, is chicken you know? Is it where you're
going to stay? I mean, are you offering any of
vegetarian options or anything testing any of that or is
it you know, any any or just you know, you know,
the imitation chicken and stuff. You know. I don't know.
Speaker 3 (19:15):
Well, i'll tell you. I'll tell you two stories.
Speaker 4 (19:17):
In the UK, they're very serious about, you know, having
a non protein day a week, and so we do
have a plant based tender.
Speaker 3 (19:26):
It's pretty good at a restaurants in the UK.
Speaker 4 (19:29):
We don't have the US yet, maybe someday. But I
also had had a guy I know who's a he's
a tennis coach and he said, Tom, listen, like you
need to do like you know, shrimp fried shrump. And
I said, well, listen, you should you know coach hockey
(19:49):
and he said and he said, I don't think about that.
I said, listen an thing about shrump. So we're not
going to we're not going to do that. Like we
are focused. We we want to make sure that we
do we can know how to do directly. Yeah, and
never because look, if you diversify and do things that
makes the brand water down and weak and maybe diversify, you.
Speaker 1 (20:12):
Know, totally like that. I totally agree with you, Tom.
Speaker 3 (20:16):
Everybody always you.
Speaker 4 (20:17):
Don't do like, you don't deliver the guest experience. Yeah,
if you and if you don't do that, it's like
a slow death. Like you never want a position where
people say, you know, I used to go to Slim's,
but I don't go and I don't know why.
Speaker 2 (20:35):
It's interesting. It's interesting to me because all the burger
guys have added a chicken sandwich, right, most of them,
but the chicken you chicken guys are going on. You
don't see the other way around.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
So I was going to ask you a share on
the list of everybody that was at the event this
last week, how many burger concepts were there versus chicken concepts.
Speaker 2 (20:55):
I don't know the exact number, but overwhelmingly.
Speaker 1 (20:58):
Chicken overwhelming Chicken overwhelmingly. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
I mean there was just a couple burger restaurants that
made the list because chickens where it's at these days.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
Man, that's crazy.
Speaker 3 (21:08):
Yeah, it is.
Speaker 1 (21:09):
You guys do all hand battering is that what I
saw hand battered. So wow, that's a that's a production.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
I ever get any robots to do that hand battering
or people only know.
Speaker 3 (21:21):
I have some guys that have offered me to try
the robots.
Speaker 4 (21:24):
But when you're knocking out the kind of volume we
do at a busy store, like I just I can't
see how it can be possible.
Speaker 3 (21:31):
Yeah, yeah, you're doing three thousand dollars hours. I mean
it's you can't. You can't do that with a robot.
Speaker 1 (21:38):
Holy only man that is cranking. All right, Well, let's okay.
So we've talked about sentiment. I can see why we're
seeing this move. You also look at this unique shift
that seems to be happening also with Gen Z and
millennials to a certain extent. Primarily it's been around this
craze on snacks and drinks. Okay, so that could work
(22:00):
very easily with what you guys are doing. Build in
a snack and a drink model. I mean, obviously you
have these great Mason jar looking desserts. Why not expand
into sonic style mixed drinks or you know, concepts of
around dirty sodas, whatever it might be.
Speaker 4 (22:18):
I mean, I think there's always an option to trial.
To us, right, there's always a reason to try to
attract a new guest, But we don't want to complicate
it for a franchise ease if we don't have to,
Like right, franchise e complication creates issues that we shouldn't.
We want to go down the road of and we
want to make sure that the offering stays true and
(22:39):
crisp and clear for the guests. I mean, but not
to say that it's not a good idea. I think
that as we go down the road of innovation, innovation
needs to be about culinary What can you not get
anywhere exceptalim chickens. Yeah, that that drives traffic, that drives
you know, franchise margin, and that drives success for us.
Speaker 3 (23:00):
I love it.
Speaker 1 (23:00):
I like your attitude though that. You know, I've been
in this space a long time and I've I've watched
brands who have deviated off of their you know, the
core principles. It's kind of like what Elon talks about
with first principles, you know, drilling down into what really
makes differences in the business. And I see so many
brands that have failed because they did just that they
(23:23):
started to deviate and and lost focus on the ball.
Speaker 3 (23:26):
So cool to see as.
Speaker 4 (23:27):
Well, thank you as we have gotten bigger that there's
one thing that we I tell my team we can't do.
Speaker 3 (23:34):
It's like, no food changes unless I taste it.
Speaker 1 (23:38):
There you go, no food.
Speaker 3 (23:40):
No food is offered unless you're the master taster, Like
I just well use Like it's not that.
Speaker 4 (23:46):
I'm that great, but you cannot water down and change
the brand for profitability.
Speaker 3 (23:52):
Yeah, Like you have to have a product that guests
want and if and if you can do that, you
got a chance.
Speaker 1 (24:01):
Man, I would for some of you CEOs that are
out there right now. I feel like we've had this
conversation many times, and it's it's the conversation of the
brand used to do this. I can't tell you what's missing,
but it's not there anymore. And that happens so many times,
and it's unfortunate. It usually happens on a CEO shift
(24:22):
because you get guys that come in and want to
cycle through. I noticed you had Patrick Noon is here?
Is here marketing guy?
Speaker 3 (24:30):
Yeah? Our Yes, Okay, he's new to the brands. Where
do I know Patrick? From? Five months? Checkers and rallies
for a while okay, that's.
Speaker 1 (24:38):
Where yeah, okay, Patrick, I remember him from from there.
Speaker 3 (24:42):
Man.
Speaker 1 (24:43):
That's well, it's good to see that you're going there.
I want to show you a chart real quick and sure,
I want to get your opinion on this too, because
this is big for fast casual and it's really kind
of the topic of today, and that is this chart
right here. So this, this is snacking at fast food restaurants,
all right. You'll notice breakfast still climbing lunch, but it's
(25:08):
really diverse, especially when you get into gen X and
gen Z. All Right. Gen Z is leading all categories
and snacking with exception of lunch, which means, you know,
they just don't use lunch as their primary source their
backfilling in the evening, at dinner, at brunch, at morning.
(25:29):
I mean, it's like they're snacking throughout the whole day.
When of these people stop eating. And the point I'm
getting at is this, if in fact that we are
seeing a shift between millennial and gen Z and gen
zs are sliding toward more snack, not necessarily day part,
(25:49):
how are fast casual brands going to adjust Because that's
a big market. Gen Z is coming and it is
a behemoth. How would you guys go about it?
Speaker 2 (26:00):
Well, I think that I mean a lot of brands
are already kind of getting into that with what you
mentioned earlier, Paul. You know, the smaller portions in the
in the drink, you know. I mean, if I were
if I were to do that, if I had a
you know, had a chicken brand or whatever, maybe it's
like a two or three piece chicken strip in a
small drink, you know, and you're you're driving that at
(26:21):
two or three in the afternoon, because that's you know,
And I think maybe part of it is the kids
are getting out of school, Like what's the first thing
My teenager does when he gets home from school at
three o'clock is eat right? And it's hey, Mom, can
we go up to here? Or can we go up
to there? And I'm like, no, you you know, I'll
get door dashed. Then I'm like, if you want to
pay for it, get door dash. But he doesn't drive yet,
(26:43):
so I think when he drives in six months, he's
going to be added to that cohort where he's not
ready my refriger anymore. He's going up the street to
the well the afternoon and the evening. We have five
minutes away right.
Speaker 1 (26:59):
Now, Tom, do you guys have an afternoon business and
an evening business?
Speaker 2 (27:04):
We do?
Speaker 4 (27:05):
We say up in late at a lot of restaurants
because people, you know, seem to like our product late
at night. I think the snacking question is interesting. But
you hear them the good point, Cheryl, it's it's a
it's a time bound like opportunity to sell, right. It's
it's a it's a it's an afternoon or a late
night yep, and do you want do you want a snack?
(27:25):
But the thing is, typically if you had to give
a snack, you're like, the average snack customer has three
people with them. See, you still sell twenty a bunch
of more stuff, right, But it's it's snacking, a snack
and a snack. And so what you have to do
is tell the message, the media message and the marketing
message to say, listen, we have a product available for
snacking that will satisfy the need at three o'clock. We're
(27:48):
at ten thirty at night. And so it can't be
like I have a snack available, but it came into vacuum,
like you have to push it in the appropriate way
to get people to know that it's available out there
for you and if you do that, If you do that,
I think you're going to be successful with it. I
don't think that it replaces meals. I think that gen
Z just wants to eat and eating is available, Like
(28:11):
it's just it's just available, like you can do on
the door to ass you can do on your phone,
like if you go on the Slim Chickens app, it'll
show up at your house in thirty minutes.
Speaker 3 (28:19):
Like it's yeah, it's just all too easy.
Speaker 4 (28:23):
But if we want to have a frictionless guest experience,
like I don't want my food delivered anywhere, I think
it's the best, you know, right at your table or
right out of the window. But you know, my teenage
boys don't there. They were one hundred bucks from the
Slim Chickens all the time. It shows them in my
house twenty minutes later. And so you have to embrace
(28:45):
the guests. It's what they want. I think today we
see that they want that ability to be flexible, to snack,
to have stuff delivered, and to have all options available
to them at all times. And so us as business owners,
we have to know that that guest is meaningful to
our business and find a way to satisfy them.
Speaker 1 (29:08):
Hey, Tom, I'm looking at your app page over on
the App Store. Obviously we see the skip the line model,
the rewards with this enthusiast locale, all that good stuff.
Are you guys planning anything new for this app in
terms of functionality, especially around this AI integration that you
started to do.
Speaker 3 (29:28):
Well.
Speaker 4 (29:28):
You know, we were very fortunate and invested in the app,
I mean six or seven years ago, back when it
wasn't as you know, cache as it is sad, but
now as you know, it is table stakes like you
have to have it. Yeah, And look, I think there's
updates we should do to the app. I think there's
more functionality that the guest deserves. That takes engineering and
(29:52):
time and money.
Speaker 3 (29:53):
And we're we're.
Speaker 4 (29:54):
Discussions about how we bolster the app because it needs
to be a as good as any competitor. So again
to go back to the whole frictionalist guest experience to
make sure the guests likes to use it. But I
never wanted anybody to say going to slim Chickens is hard. Yeah,
I want people say like, like slim Chickens is awesome
(30:15):
and easy, right, and that's that's what it should.
Speaker 1 (30:18):
Be well, and I think the key here is that
you guys have been able to really build a brand
around such a unique menu component in a in an
area I think demographically that matches well with what Slim
Chickens is doing. I was surprised when you mentioned the UK.
I didn't know about that. What was it that started
up the business enfranchising in the UK?
Speaker 3 (30:40):
You know, they reached out to us.
Speaker 4 (30:41):
I mean we've done some international work in the past
and they connected with us, and you know, we weren't
sure if we should really try to dive into that
internationally at the particular times, like seven years ago. Yeah,
we're very fortunate we did. They are wonderful partners. They've
been a huge driver of our growth and look they
want to do a lot more.
Speaker 2 (31:02):
So we're right that has all of them.
Speaker 4 (31:07):
Yeah, that's right, correct, And I mean that's the subfranchise
rights in like Scotland and Ireland and on the South
coast okay.
Speaker 3 (31:13):
But it's it's a very.
Speaker 4 (31:15):
Organized team of people over there that run the business
and we're very pleased why they do it.
Speaker 1 (31:19):
That's great, that's cool. Let's wrap up on on the
trends and where the industry is going. So obviously you
guys have a good, you know line on where Chicken
is going. But if you look at this demo shift
that's occurring because the gen X and boomers are in
a position gen X is a small demo, Millennials and
Gen Z kind of control the space right now, What
(31:43):
are you looking out for right now? In terms of
how you guys are going to face the next few years.
Speaker 3 (31:49):
I think that we have to focus on, you know, frequency,
like how do you how do you get people in there?
A lot?
Speaker 4 (31:55):
I mean, but that's not a not a state secret
of course, but frequency. Again the strictionalist experience, like if
we're easier than the competitor, like we get the business.
And so we have to be not only great with
food and great with service, but easy to accommodate any guest.
Speaker 3 (32:13):
That wants to show up.
Speaker 4 (32:14):
And we talk about that endlessly in at the office
and with our teams, but just being there for the
guests and if we need to interact to the app
or interact through social media or in any way, in
any way that we have to create an immediate landscape
that helps the guests understand what we're doing and who
we are.
Speaker 3 (32:31):
We have to embrace it.
Speaker 4 (32:32):
Like, you know, I'm fifty years old and I'm not
a young young teenager any where that buyers for food.
Speaker 3 (32:39):
I look at my kids through are teenagers you know,
who know what they're doing.
Speaker 2 (32:45):
So before we wrap up, I want to ask one
more question. I read in the Wall Street Journal about
the recording studio and that seems very unique. So you're
bringing in people to actually record songs. So can we
talk about that, because that, to me is really a
unique US.
Speaker 3 (33:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (33:02):
Well, you know, I think that our CMO Patrick Is
is a very innovative guy, and he wants the brand
to mean, you know, whatever it should mean to everybody,
right and and part of our mantra is always in
music and being with with the sorry guys, you know,
(33:23):
part of the brand has always been like, hey, you know,
how do we how do we embrace communities. We do
a lot of charity work with with the children's hospitals,
but we do a lot of cheerity work also with music.
And we thought, you know, if we could build a
studio in this new office, we have to let let
new musicians you know, record music, and we would listen
(33:45):
to record your album for free, you sell it and
just say that we help you with it. Yeah, Like
that's that would be a great thing to talk about
and and worth whatever dollars we don't get on the
sale of music. And just you know, listen, we we
help somebody that's part of the community. We want to
bring in musicians and people that want to embrace the
brand and if they can do that and help us, like,
(34:06):
we want to be open to that, Like we don't
want to be closed minded. And I think that as
as we all get older and more steep than our businesses,
like not being myopic and just focused here it's critically
important for people my age, but make sure we can
see everybody else and yeah, for sure young people, and
(34:27):
make sure that they know that we're available to them
as a brand as an optional.
Speaker 2 (34:31):
Amazing.
Speaker 1 (34:32):
When is this studio opening up? Is it already open?
Speaker 2 (34:36):
No?
Speaker 4 (34:36):
No, we're we're doing We're building a big mock restaurant
and a test kitchen in the first floor of our
building right now. It's getting finished as we speak. I
think they're going to be able to record music early
follow probably.
Speaker 2 (34:47):
Oh how do people decide? I mean, how are you
going to decide who you who you take theres there
like an application process or you know.
Speaker 3 (34:55):
I don't think we're even there yet. I don't know.
I think that I.
Speaker 4 (35:02):
Well, if you call me and say, hey, listen to record,
I'll say, you know, sure, of course, I was just.
Speaker 1 (35:09):
I was just playing and I'm working on some new riffs,
so I might be visiting.
Speaker 4 (35:16):
But I think Patrick the gate keeper of the studio,
I'm sure I like it, and uh, I'll just have
to make sure his taste in music is appropriate for me,
right the tambourine.
Speaker 1 (35:30):
Well. The point that I think you guys are hitting
on though of right now, Tom, is that brands are
starting to become media powerhouses. This is something I've argued
for many years, is that brands become their own media presence.
There's a handful of brands that have started to do this.
You know, Greg over it crave Worthy or is it?
(35:52):
I mean, I know he's doing his podcast. There's a
handful of other media's companies that or I should say,
brands that have started to go in the direction. It's
funny because I used to coach a lot of fast
casual brands and I'm like, you guys need to start
your own podcast or start your own theme around media
that builds for your customer base, you know, just your
customer base. And it was always a pushback. They didn't
(36:16):
really understand it. So I'm glad to see that you
guys have have kind of connected the dots there.
Speaker 3 (36:20):
Like, I don't think that we should be driving media.
We should be a part of this.
Speaker 4 (36:25):
Yeah, I think if you if hey listen the slimching
Is podcast seems rather transparent in my view, like, hey,
come me with my restaurants, right, but if I can
be on your podcast and tell a story and tell
why I think that we're great and awesome, that is
important to me and I would do that every time.
Speaker 2 (36:42):
Yeah, well we're still needed, We're still needed out here.
Speaker 3 (36:45):
Oh well yeah, untunate, of course you need it for
more of it.
Speaker 1 (36:49):
Just more up, more conversation. Because the key with with
any business I know, for me, I'm sure I don't
know about I'm sure with you share as whenever I
go meet founder and just have a conversation with them,
I come away with so many more ideas about what's
happening because you get a chance to kind of get
into the vision of what everybody else is doing so
(37:11):
very cool. All right, Tom, it's been great having you on.
Thank you so much for coming in today. We appreciate it.
Speaker 3 (37:18):
Hi, thank you, Sorry to mine, Look, I was kind
of off up.
Speaker 1 (37:22):
Fantastic, Thank you for having me.
Speaker 3 (37:23):
I appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (37:24):
You're looking good. All right, We'll see you soon. All right.
Another another great episode coming in here on Fast Casual Nation. Obviously,
the chicken sector has been pretty hot on the show
here recently for good reason, as we can all see.
And I think Tom hit the point dead on their Shara.
This one is a this one could be pretty dangerous
(37:46):
with franchise growth in the future. So what are your thoughts.
Speaker 2 (37:50):
Yeah, I mean they're already They're already out there, Like
like Tom was saying, they're already in the UK. It
sounds like maybe they might be doing some other global expansions.
So yeah, I think it's like I was saying earlier,
we have one five minutes down the street, so it's
always happened, So I'm excited.
Speaker 1 (38:06):
I like the fact that he's stretching the boundary. The
team is stretching the boundaries of what a brand does.
So whether it's AI changing up the express model for
delivery and for drive through, which is going to be
a big factor in Fast Casual whether we like it
or not. And you know this whole concept around content
creation which is very unique, you know, if you get
(38:29):
into that interesting stuff out there. Guys, if you're not
subscribed to this podcast, well that's the first thing you
should do, And if you're listening to the audio version,
I want you to do one thing for me, and
that is just go over to YouTube and search savor Fm.
You'll find us over there. And of course you can
catch this podcast. Many of our other shows share and
I drop up an episode every week on Wednesday, and
(38:53):
we record on Wednesday, so this will go out next week,
so be on the lookout for that. We have a
really good episode drop today on Trends in the Industry,
So you guys should check that one out. And if
you're not subscribed to it now and make sure leave
a comment down below. We'll catch you next time right
here on Fast Casual Nation.
All right, welcome back in to another episode of Fast
Casual Nation, the podcast that started it all in the
fast casual sector. I'm here with my co host, Miss
share Canceler. How are you.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
I'm doing great. I'm a little tired after a whirlwind
at the National Restaurant Association Show and the Fast Casual
Top one hundred, but I'm back ready to rock and roll.
Speaker 1 (00:18):
You have done it again. We have another top one
hundred list that has come out of the NRAA show
and during the NA show, I should say at the gala,
tell me a little bit about it. How big was
it this year? Can you reveal any of the top
say two or three people?
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Yeah, it was bigger than ever our tenth anniversary. I
think we had about three hundred and forty attendees this year.
Dave's Hot Chicken was our number one winning brand and
Chiba Hutt was our number two brand. The report, the
report is out. You can read all about the all
the brands, the winners, and the top twenty five executives too.
Speaker 1 (00:54):
So you guys visitfascasual dot com. You guys can learn
all about that and get the full Can anyone get
the report if they just down't.
Speaker 2 (01:03):
Just sign dowload it. You just have to give your
email and you know you can get it for free.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
So all right, cool, So you guys check that out.
If you're not over on fastcasual dot com, it's very
easy to get there. Just pipe in fastcasual dot Com.
You'll be in the website and you can kind of
learn a little bit more there. So click read now
and boom you'll be right there on the page going
into it. So check it all out at fastcasual dot com.
(01:31):
And again, one of the things that we do here
on the show as we start to build more content
is we do bring a lot of founders in and brands.
As you've already started to see just the number of
people that have been on this show here recently, and
today is no different. We're going to have another top
one hundred Chicken brand today and we're going to be
(01:52):
breaking down the topic of gen Z and Millennial and
there may be a very interesting shift occurring that we'll
have packed Fast Casual bigger than ever, So stick around
for that. We'll be right back. My name is Paul Baron.
(02:27):
As the early pioneer in fast casual, I've seen the
industry evolve from just a few operators to the most
sought after segment by consumers around the world. Now we're
planning to shape its future. Tap into decades of my
expertise identifying the emerging brands and tech winners in the space.
(02:48):
Saber Capital will be fueling the next generation of fast
casual innovation. All right, we're back here, Sharah, and today's
topic is the shifting landscape of gen Z. And I
call out gen Z specifically because as we've been tracking
sentiment in the business overall, you look at casual dining
(03:13):
which has had the largest slide in sentiment overall, and
that coming from you know, from over on saver FM.
If you'll learn a little bit more about that. We
do deep dive research primarily because we do a lot
of support on the finance side looking at brands. But Cher,
when you look at this market as it pertains right now,
(03:34):
both on Millennial and gen Z, have you started to
see brands shifting their strategy to create two different looks
at Millennial and gen Z as opposed to combining it.
Speaker 2 (03:46):
Yeah, I think so. The gen zs are way more
into snacking. I mean millennials are too, but I think
snacking is becoming, you know, quite trendy for them, and
so that is something that really we're focused on. And
also gen Z doesn't want to ever go hang out
at a casual dining restaurant anywhere, it seems like, so
it's fast casual or QSRs for them these days.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
I like it. Well, listen, we're going to bring on
Tom Gordon, who is the CEO over at Slim Chickens.
He of course is also a top one hundred fast
casual brand. So Tom, how are you?
Speaker 3 (04:19):
I'm great? How are you?
Speaker 1 (04:20):
We're good? Great to have you on the show. Obviously,
we want to learn quickly about where Slim Chickens is today,
what's the size of the brand, give us the latest updates,
maybe the recent openings, what your current strategy is right now.
Speaker 4 (04:36):
Yeah, of course, you know we're we're over three hundred
stores open now. Like we're very busy in the Inner
Mountain West and Carolina's in Florida.
Speaker 3 (04:43):
We have a big business in the UK.
Speaker 4 (04:45):
We have seventy one stores in the UK now and
you know we've found our niche with you know, our
bespoken diffink sauces, tenders, winging sandwiches, salads, wraps and trying
to have the best quality I think for the guests,
and I think we always push that quality first, hospitality first,
and let the guests make sure that they have the
(05:06):
experience they want. I think your topic about how you
know gen Z is shifting. I think you said have
to give an experience, and so we talked about that
quite a bit. And you know, we're happy where we are.
We're working hard and building a lot of restaurants over here.
Speaker 1 (05:22):
You guys have a really great menu that starts to
span across a few different sectors that gives you a
little bit more wide variety. The jar desserts, the waffles
with chicken and waffles. I mean, those are differentiators that
I think separates you from what we've seen in the
traditional Chicken brands. When you started building the menu out
(05:43):
like this, was it specifically targeted at a different demographic
or were you trying to span this across more of
a multi demographic layout.
Speaker 4 (05:53):
I think that we wanted it across a multi demographic layout,
but it wasn't a demographic play like per se.
Speaker 3 (06:00):
It was more, you know, we.
Speaker 4 (06:01):
Thought we could do this type of offering better. We
could do a better breading. We could do better dipping sauces,
we could do better sandwiches. And so the focus for
us is culinary first, like it can be a better
product and it can be a better experience for the
guests if we do it right. And so just doing
it right is a constant theme for us, like listen,
(06:22):
let's not do it wrong, let's do it right. Yeah,
And that theme has permeated through our entire twenty two years.
Speaker 3 (06:28):
And you know, three hundred plus restaurants.
Speaker 1 (06:30):
I'm looking at your Instagram right now. And size wise,
what is the size of a store today that looks
like a big unit.
Speaker 3 (06:40):
It depends.
Speaker 4 (06:40):
I mean we have a twenty seven hundred square foot
unit in a twenty two pro time wel we also
have inline spaces. We have university spaces, free court spaces,
like everything in the UK is just about everything is
an inline space, you know, high street, high traffic. But
we're flexible and I think that if we can deliver
(07:02):
our food and experience in the right way, you know
you can, You're going to be pleased with what the
experience you get, no matter what the physical location is.
I mean I may look at look at brands like Chipolte, Starbucks, Like.
Speaker 3 (07:15):
They're all different, but you walk in, you know you're there.
Speaker 4 (07:18):
So for us, like you got to make sure that
you know you're in the slim chickens and get the
experience and the food that you expect and to have
a great, you know, but an entirely great experience.
Speaker 3 (07:26):
When you're there.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
Are you focused more on opening those smaller locations or
are you still you know, ready to open you know,
the porch swing, you know, season restaurants with poor season,
you know, y'all, I like that.
Speaker 4 (07:43):
I like that Moniker that y'all, the porch swing. I yes,
that's that's kind of that's where it is, you know,
that's where's where we started. Look there, it's not a
state secret that construction is expensive and interest rates are higher.
It's harder to build ground up, and that's like, that's
a fact. We are still doing a lot of ground
up restaurants because we believe that the guest likes that experience.
(08:06):
But we are like the most open of any brand
to also having other types of venus, like the multi
asset strategy or differentiated asset strategy, I should say, is
one that we've embraced and we're going into bigger cities,
within line spaces, with in cap spaces, with doing a
three drive through only prototypes this year to try those out.
(08:29):
We want to make sure that the food's available to communities.
We want to serve communities and so whatever asset type
that requires, that's what.
Speaker 3 (08:36):
We'll try to do.
Speaker 2 (08:38):
Interesting, I didn't know about the drive through concepts. That's
pretty cool. So no in seeing it all just drive
through and delivery we have.
Speaker 3 (08:47):
We have three we're trying right now.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
Yes, cool, Okay, so we'll explain. You can't just drop
that and not explain the time.
Speaker 3 (08:55):
Are they Well? Are they? I'll give you two examples.
Speaker 4 (08:59):
So we have one in US Stark and Stare based
and it was a very our first restaurant we ever
did in fact, but the lot was so little, like
we would never buy a lot this small again. It
was our first one back when we had no anything.
But it really lends itself well to having you know,
two lanes around and escape plane. There's three lanes we
(09:19):
can really service I think you know, drive through guests,
calling guests and third party delivery through this drive through unit.
We're testing it there. We have a franchise partner in
Kentucky who also has a really busy unit in a
town and wants to try to kind of eliminate some
pressure off this first unit and give another county over.
(09:43):
You know, some experienced the brand, so we're going to
test to We got one more coming later in the year,
but we're excited about that venue. It's not going to
be the only thing we do from now on a course,
like we believe in the dining room, but where in
a market you can have a small lot, maybe an
infill spot, we want to create an option for franchisees
(10:03):
and that's what we're doing.
Speaker 1 (10:04):
So it's kind of an express version. I guess.
Speaker 2 (10:07):
Yeah, are those drive throughs where you're testing the AI
as well or is that in all your drive through restaurants.
Speaker 3 (10:14):
No, we're not testing in all of them, but we
are testing it. It's it's a funny thing, you know.
Speaker 4 (10:18):
We like the like the math would tell you that
the AI works like it's it is more accurate.
Speaker 3 (10:26):
I think a person that's eighty four percent accurate the
AI is about.
Speaker 4 (10:30):
Ninety one wo So yeah, this interesting dynamic of the
AI is more accent a person. Maybe that's what the
math would suggest, but we also have this group of
customers that doesn't love it. We have some that do,
some that don't, and you know, so we've got to
be careful. We want to make sure we deploy it
in a way that would make the franchisees profitable. But also,
(10:53):
except in the communities like we the guests who buy
our food are the lifeload of the business. We never
want to have an issue where a guest doesn't want
to come back to a slim chickens. And so, you know,
it's we're going to see how it's received by the guest.
We're going to see how it works with check average
and with you know, speed and the drive through it.
(11:14):
But it's an interesting concept, it's an interesting tool, and
I think that we're going to continue to embrace it
and understand how and the best place is to deploy it.
Speaker 1 (11:24):
You know, this goes back I originally when I first
started in the industry, I was working as a consultant
and I ended up doing some work with McDonald's on
the original tandem and dual lane drive through before they
existed and we had a chance to go. I was
in Romeoville, Illinois at their startup kind of innovation center,
(11:46):
it's like an a warehouse, and they were in there
testing all these variations on drive through models. So the
stacked tandem where you could queue up, which is basically
what Chick fil A uses today, the split lane drive
where it splits out the two orders, and then we
also did a queue lane which was kind of like
(12:08):
some of the restaurants where they pull you off into
spots and then they go deliver to you. When you
look at that time in the variations of drive through,
because that's probably going to be a big part, especially
when you flex in third party delivery as a potential
right function, what are you finding that is working the best,
(12:28):
you know with the models that you guys are using.
Speaker 3 (12:31):
I mean, I you know, I wish I had the answer.
Speaker 4 (12:33):
I obviously don't, but I think that what you see
is you have to be able to quickly service the
third party delivery guys and girls. And but you you know,
you think about a We talked about a frictionless experience
for the guests, like like we wanted to be easy
for anybody to come in the restaurant, a mom of
three kids, an eighteen year old teenager, a dad only
(12:57):
home from work, like the frictionalless experience is critically important.
I tell my team all the time, it's got to
be frictionless for the third party driver too, Like it's
got to be easy for those guys they're going to
get in get out, like they're doing a job to
serve our guests. It's got to be easy. So finding
a way to make a particular lane or pull up
(13:17):
way window or a pull up spot work for the
third party drive through is a critical component of how
we go forward in the future because that channel is
only growing, it'll continue to grow, and we want to
make sure that it's frictionless, not not just for our guests,
for the drivers too to get the food out quickly
to the guest.
Speaker 1 (13:36):
So how okay, So how is AI integration being done?
The Wall Street story gets into a little bit of
how the use case is. But you guys are trying
to extend this beyond just the service capacity. It's more
of the brand placement. I guess for guests to recognize
some chickens, explain.
Speaker 3 (13:55):
Where you're going.
Speaker 4 (13:57):
So we want to make sure that that the guests
know what some Chickens is obviously, and as they look
on any third party app like the whole program, or
some chickens can show up and be a part of
what you see in the third party. But as AI
relates to the direct kind of contact the guests and
the drive through. We're testing that in fifteen or eighteen
(14:19):
stores and you pull up, run the drive through, you
have an AI attendant talk to the talk to the guests,
and you go through the whole scenario.
Speaker 3 (14:28):
You order your food.
Speaker 4 (14:28):
But if you ever want to talk to a person,
all you used to and that's a big sign of
course it says hey, like speak to a team member.
Speaker 1 (14:35):
Yeah, if you.
Speaker 4 (14:36):
Say speak to a team member, it just pops to
a team op and a team member can do it.
But it's two different channels really, It's like it's the
drive through channel to drive to talk through the ordering process,
but also the kind of the machine learning and AI
of where our guests are, what they want to see,
what they want to eat, like, what they want to
view media wized as a critical component of how we
(14:58):
market to the guests and just let them know where
we have and where we are. And as you have
a new store in any town, USA, like you have
to kind of push out the message like look, some
chickens is here. We want to make sure that you
know it and give you a chance to experience brand.
Speaker 1 (15:13):
Right, So Arkansas obviously the base of the brand. How
many units are in Arkansas?
Speaker 3 (15:20):
Now?
Speaker 4 (15:21):
We have ten in northwest Arkansas where I live with
the corporate offices, and another I think twelve across the state.
Speaker 1 (15:28):
Okay, all right? Is that still kind of the hub
and spoke of growth because you mentioned UK. But where
if you look in this in this central Midwest? Is
that primarily the locales?
Speaker 4 (15:42):
I think you when you talk about the US like
we have great partners like I mentioned before in Florida,
the Carolina's, the inner Mountain West, and you know where
we want to focus is where the franchisees are are
want to build the restaurants. When it went a deal
is is worthy, we want to go and deliver and
invest our time and resources to make sure the franchise
(16:07):
has all the support they need. I think generally throughout
the unit the Central United States like we're busy. Uh
you know, I think as we kind of get to
corners of the Northwest and New England and.
Speaker 3 (16:18):
South Florida that that'll that'll come.
Speaker 1 (16:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (16:21):
But the but the central US is a busy market
for us, and we're we're freezing how growth is going.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
I've been to one of your stores and first of all,
the food's amazing. Uh, the service was excellent. It does
have kind of a unique feel that doesn't feel like
Fast casual to an extent. There is a place down
in Austin that's my hometown, and there's a restaurant that
(16:47):
has a similar feel, but it's like a fine dining
chicken house. Okay, I mean they do waffles, chicken and
waffles and a large variety of food, and it reminded
me of that location. And this is a one off
restaurant in Austin, Texas. I'll send you the link to it.
And it's so unique because you guys have almost elevated
(17:08):
this whole experience around chicken, which I think is a
big factor here. But when you look at sentiment falling
right now in casual dining fine dining, but yet QSR
and Fast Casual seem to be holding with gen Z
and Millennial, why do you First of all, why do
you think that is? Is it just the offering, is
(17:28):
it the style, the price? What is it that's drowing
them in?
Speaker 3 (17:32):
Well?
Speaker 4 (17:32):
I think the first thing you have to look at
is the shift. It's just over the last twenty years
from beef to chicken. I mean chicken. Chicken is the
shift in the US. And it's a crowded space. People
love it. I mean, brands that we compete with, who
we respect a lot, you know, do very well because
(17:53):
the chicken industry and that and the space and fast
casual has grown like crazy. Yeah, I guess number one.
I think also with with you know, gen Z and
Amills do for that matter, like it's a it's a
perceived health.
Speaker 3 (18:07):
I mean maybe.
Speaker 4 (18:09):
I think it's it's accurate, but it's you know, it's
eight burgers every day, no chicken every day, yes, and
so you kind of you get the chance to capitalize
on you know, the chicken and you know the industry
in the US that is it's the most modern available
chicken market in the world is the United States. And
(18:31):
the protein is the is the most affordable and easily
accessible protein in the world. So, you know, it's it's
just that several dominoes in the last twenty years have
fallen to create this fast casual chicken industry in the
United States that I think services a need that guests
want to participate in and and they want to have
(18:54):
it as an option to that I experience and are
happy to be part of it.
Speaker 2 (18:59):
You know, is chicken you know? Is it where you're
going to stay? I mean, are you offering any of
vegetarian options or anything testing any of that or is
it you know, any any or just you know, you know,
the imitation chicken and stuff. You know. I don't know.
Speaker 3 (19:15):
Well, i'll tell you. I'll tell you two stories.
Speaker 4 (19:17):
In the UK, they're very serious about, you know, having
a non protein day a week, and so we do
have a plant based tender.
Speaker 3 (19:26):
It's pretty good at a restaurants in the UK.
Speaker 4 (19:29):
We don't have the US yet, maybe someday. But I
also had had a guy I know who's a he's
a tennis coach and he said, Tom, listen, like you
need to do like you know, shrimp fried shrump. And
I said, well, listen, you should you know coach hockey
(19:49):
and he said and he said, I don't think about that.
I said, listen an thing about shrump. So we're not
going to we're not going to do that. Like we
are focused. We we want to make sure that we
do we can know how to do directly. Yeah, and
never because look, if you diversify and do things that
makes the brand water down and weak and maybe diversify, you.
Speaker 1 (20:12):
Know, totally like that. I totally agree with you, Tom.
Speaker 3 (20:16):
Everybody always you.
Speaker 4 (20:17):
Don't do like, you don't deliver the guest experience. Yeah,
if you and if you don't do that, it's like
a slow death. Like you never want a position where
people say, you know, I used to go to Slim's,
but I don't go and I don't know why.
Speaker 2 (20:35):
It's interesting. It's interesting to me because all the burger
guys have added a chicken sandwich, right, most of them,
but the chicken you chicken guys are going on. You
don't see the other way around.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
So I was going to ask you a share on
the list of everybody that was at the event this
last week, how many burger concepts were there versus chicken concepts.
Speaker 2 (20:55):
I don't know the exact number, but overwhelmingly.
Speaker 1 (20:58):
Chicken overwhelming Chicken overwhelmingly. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
I mean there was just a couple burger restaurants that
made the list because chickens where it's at these days.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
Man, that's crazy.
Speaker 3 (21:08):
Yeah, it is.
Speaker 1 (21:09):
You guys do all hand battering is that what I
saw hand battered. So wow, that's a that's a production.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
I ever get any robots to do that hand battering
or people only know.
Speaker 3 (21:21):
I have some guys that have offered me to try
the robots.
Speaker 4 (21:24):
But when you're knocking out the kind of volume we
do at a busy store, like I just I can't
see how it can be possible.
Speaker 3 (21:31):
Yeah, yeah, you're doing three thousand dollars hours. I mean
it's you can't. You can't do that with a robot.
Speaker 1 (21:38):
Holy only man that is cranking. All right, Well, let's okay.
So we've talked about sentiment. I can see why we're
seeing this move. You also look at this unique shift
that seems to be happening also with Gen Z and
millennials to a certain extent. Primarily it's been around this
craze on snacks and drinks. Okay, so that could work
(22:00):
very easily with what you guys are doing. Build in
a snack and a drink model. I mean, obviously you
have these great Mason jar looking desserts. Why not expand
into sonic style mixed drinks or you know, concepts of
around dirty sodas, whatever it might be.
Speaker 4 (22:18):
I mean, I think there's always an option to trial.
To us, right, there's always a reason to try to
attract a new guest, But we don't want to complicate
it for a franchise ease if we don't have to,
Like right, franchise e complication creates issues that we shouldn't.
We want to go down the road of and we
want to make sure that the offering stays true and
(22:39):
crisp and clear for the guests. I mean, but not
to say that it's not a good idea. I think
that as we go down the road of innovation, innovation
needs to be about culinary What can you not get
anywhere exceptalim chickens. Yeah, that that drives traffic, that drives
you know, franchise margin, and that drives success for us.
Speaker 3 (23:00):
I love it.
Speaker 1 (23:00):
I like your attitude though that. You know, I've been
in this space a long time and I've I've watched
brands who have deviated off of their you know, the
core principles. It's kind of like what Elon talks about
with first principles, you know, drilling down into what really
makes differences in the business. And I see so many
brands that have failed because they did just that they
(23:23):
started to deviate and and lost focus on the ball.
Speaker 3 (23:26):
So cool to see as.
Speaker 4 (23:27):
Well, thank you as we have gotten bigger that there's
one thing that we I tell my team we can't do.
Speaker 3 (23:34):
It's like, no food changes unless I taste it.
Speaker 1 (23:38):
There you go, no food.
Speaker 3 (23:40):
No food is offered unless you're the master taster, Like
I just well use Like it's not that.
Speaker 4 (23:46):
I'm that great, but you cannot water down and change
the brand for profitability.
Speaker 3 (23:52):
Yeah, Like you have to have a product that guests
want and if and if you can do that, you
got a chance.
Speaker 1 (24:01):
Man, I would for some of you CEOs that are
out there right now. I feel like we've had this
conversation many times, and it's it's the conversation of the
brand used to do this. I can't tell you what's missing,
but it's not there anymore. And that happens so many times,
and it's unfortunate. It usually happens on a CEO shift
(24:22):
because you get guys that come in and want to
cycle through. I noticed you had Patrick Noon is here?
Is here marketing guy?
Speaker 3 (24:30):
Yeah? Our Yes, Okay, he's new to the brands. Where
do I know Patrick? From? Five months? Checkers and rallies
for a while okay, that's.
Speaker 1 (24:38):
Where yeah, okay, Patrick, I remember him from from there.
Speaker 3 (24:42):
Man.
Speaker 1 (24:43):
That's well, it's good to see that you're going there.
I want to show you a chart real quick and sure,
I want to get your opinion on this too, because
this is big for fast casual and it's really kind
of the topic of today, and that is this chart
right here. So this, this is snacking at fast food restaurants,
all right. You'll notice breakfast still climbing lunch, but it's
(25:08):
really diverse, especially when you get into gen X and
gen Z. All Right. Gen Z is leading all categories
and snacking with exception of lunch, which means, you know,
they just don't use lunch as their primary source their
backfilling in the evening, at dinner, at brunch, at morning.
(25:29):
I mean, it's like they're snacking throughout the whole day.
When of these people stop eating. And the point I'm
getting at is this, if in fact that we are
seeing a shift between millennial and gen Z and gen
zs are sliding toward more snack, not necessarily day part,
(25:49):
how are fast casual brands going to adjust Because that's
a big market. Gen Z is coming and it is
a behemoth. How would you guys go about it?
Speaker 2 (26:00):
Well, I think that I mean a lot of brands
are already kind of getting into that with what you
mentioned earlier, Paul. You know, the smaller portions in the
in the drink, you know. I mean, if I were
if I were to do that, if I had a
you know, had a chicken brand or whatever, maybe it's
like a two or three piece chicken strip in a
small drink, you know, and you're you're driving that at
(26:21):
two or three in the afternoon, because that's you know,
And I think maybe part of it is the kids
are getting out of school, Like what's the first thing
My teenager does when he gets home from school at
three o'clock is eat right? And it's hey, Mom, can
we go up to here? Or can we go up
to there? And I'm like, no, you you know, I'll
get door dashed. Then I'm like, if you want to
pay for it, get door dash. But he doesn't drive yet,
(26:43):
so I think when he drives in six months, he's
going to be added to that cohort where he's not
ready my refriger anymore. He's going up the street to
the well the afternoon and the evening. We have five
minutes away right.
Speaker 1 (26:59):
Now, Tom, do you guys have an afternoon business and
an evening business?
Speaker 2 (27:04):
We do?
Speaker 4 (27:05):
We say up in late at a lot of restaurants
because people, you know, seem to like our product late
at night. I think the snacking question is interesting. But
you hear them the good point, Cheryl, it's it's a
it's a time bound like opportunity to sell, right. It's
it's a it's a it's an afternoon or a late
night yep, and do you want do you want a snack?
(27:25):
But the thing is, typically if you had to give
a snack, you're like, the average snack customer has three
people with them. See, you still sell twenty a bunch
of more stuff, right, But it's it's snacking, a snack
and a snack. And so what you have to do
is tell the message, the media message and the marketing
message to say, listen, we have a product available for
snacking that will satisfy the need at three o'clock. We're
(27:48):
at ten thirty at night. And so it can't be
like I have a snack available, but it came into vacuum,
like you have to push it in the appropriate way
to get people to know that it's available out there
for you and if you do that, If you do that,
I think you're going to be successful with it. I
don't think that it replaces meals. I think that gen
Z just wants to eat and eating is available, Like
(28:11):
it's just it's just available, like you can do on
the door to ass you can do on your phone,
like if you go on the Slim Chickens app, it'll
show up at your house in thirty minutes.
Speaker 3 (28:19):
Like it's yeah, it's just all too easy.
Speaker 4 (28:23):
But if we want to have a frictionless guest experience,
like I don't want my food delivered anywhere, I think
it's the best, you know, right at your table or
right out of the window. But you know, my teenage
boys don't there. They were one hundred bucks from the
Slim Chickens all the time. It shows them in my
house twenty minutes later. And so you have to embrace
(28:45):
the guests. It's what they want. I think today we
see that they want that ability to be flexible, to snack,
to have stuff delivered, and to have all options available
to them at all times. And so us as business owners,
we have to know that that guest is meaningful to
our business and find a way to satisfy them.
Speaker 1 (29:08):
Hey, Tom, I'm looking at your app page over on
the App Store. Obviously we see the skip the line model,
the rewards with this enthusiast locale, all that good stuff.
Are you guys planning anything new for this app in
terms of functionality, especially around this AI integration that you
started to do.
Speaker 3 (29:28):
Well.
Speaker 4 (29:28):
You know, we were very fortunate and invested in the app,
I mean six or seven years ago, back when it
wasn't as you know, cache as it is sad, but
now as you know, it is table stakes like you
have to have it. Yeah, And look, I think there's
updates we should do to the app. I think there's
more functionality that the guest deserves. That takes engineering and
(29:52):
time and money.
Speaker 3 (29:53):
And we're we're.
Speaker 4 (29:54):
Discussions about how we bolster the app because it needs
to be a as good as any competitor. So again
to go back to the whole frictionalist guest experience to
make sure the guests likes to use it. But I
never wanted anybody to say going to slim Chickens is hard. Yeah,
I want people say like, like slim Chickens is awesome
(30:15):
and easy, right, and that's that's what it should.
Speaker 1 (30:18):
Be well, and I think the key here is that
you guys have been able to really build a brand
around such a unique menu component in a in an
area I think demographically that matches well with what Slim
Chickens is doing. I was surprised when you mentioned the UK.
I didn't know about that. What was it that started
up the business enfranchising in the UK?
Speaker 3 (30:40):
You know, they reached out to us.
Speaker 4 (30:41):
I mean we've done some international work in the past
and they connected with us, and you know, we weren't
sure if we should really try to dive into that
internationally at the particular times, like seven years ago. Yeah,
we're very fortunate we did. They are wonderful partners. They've
been a huge driver of our growth and look they
want to do a lot more.
Speaker 2 (31:02):
So we're right that has all of them.
Speaker 4 (31:07):
Yeah, that's right, correct, And I mean that's the subfranchise
rights in like Scotland and Ireland and on the South
coast okay.
Speaker 3 (31:13):
But it's it's a very.
Speaker 4 (31:15):
Organized team of people over there that run the business
and we're very pleased why they do it.
Speaker 1 (31:19):
That's great, that's cool. Let's wrap up on on the
trends and where the industry is going. So obviously you
guys have a good, you know line on where Chicken
is going. But if you look at this demo shift
that's occurring because the gen X and boomers are in
a position gen X is a small demo, Millennials and
Gen Z kind of control the space right now, What
(31:43):
are you looking out for right now? In terms of
how you guys are going to face the next few years.
Speaker 3 (31:49):
I think that we have to focus on, you know, frequency,
like how do you how do you get people in there?
A lot?
Speaker 4 (31:55):
I mean, but that's not a not a state secret
of course, but frequency. Again the strictionalist experience, like if
we're easier than the competitor, like we get the business.
And so we have to be not only great with
food and great with service, but easy to accommodate any guest.
Speaker 3 (32:13):
That wants to show up.
Speaker 4 (32:14):
And we talk about that endlessly in at the office
and with our teams, but just being there for the
guests and if we need to interact to the app
or interact through social media or in any way, in
any way that we have to create an immediate landscape
that helps the guests understand what we're doing and who
we are.
Speaker 3 (32:31):
We have to embrace it.
Speaker 4 (32:32):
Like, you know, I'm fifty years old and I'm not
a young young teenager any where that buyers for food.
Speaker 3 (32:39):
I look at my kids through are teenagers you know,
who know what they're doing.
Speaker 2 (32:45):
So before we wrap up, I want to ask one
more question. I read in the Wall Street Journal about
the recording studio and that seems very unique. So you're
bringing in people to actually record songs. So can we
talk about that, because that, to me is really a
unique US.
Speaker 3 (33:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (33:02):
Well, you know, I think that our CMO Patrick Is
is a very innovative guy, and he wants the brand
to mean, you know, whatever it should mean to everybody,
right and and part of our mantra is always in
music and being with with the sorry guys, you know,
(33:23):
part of the brand has always been like, hey, you know,
how do we how do we embrace communities. We do
a lot of charity work with with the children's hospitals,
but we do a lot of cheerity work also with music.
And we thought, you know, if we could build a
studio in this new office, we have to let let
new musicians you know, record music, and we would listen
(33:45):
to record your album for free, you sell it and
just say that we help you with it. Yeah, Like
that's that would be a great thing to talk about
and and worth whatever dollars we don't get on the
sale of music. And just you know, listen, we we
help somebody that's part of the community. We want to
bring in musicians and people that want to embrace the
brand and if they can do that and help us, like,
(34:06):
we want to be open to that, Like we don't
want to be closed minded. And I think that as
as we all get older and more steep than our businesses,
like not being myopic and just focused here it's critically
important for people my age, but make sure we can
see everybody else and yeah, for sure young people, and
(34:27):
make sure that they know that we're available to them
as a brand as an optional.
Speaker 2 (34:31):
Amazing.
Speaker 1 (34:32):
When is this studio opening up? Is it already open?
Speaker 2 (34:36):
No?
Speaker 4 (34:36):
No, we're we're doing We're building a big mock restaurant
and a test kitchen in the first floor of our
building right now. It's getting finished as we speak. I
think they're going to be able to record music early
follow probably.
Speaker 2 (34:47):
Oh how do people decide? I mean, how are you
going to decide who you who you take theres there
like an application process or you know.
Speaker 3 (34:55):
I don't think we're even there yet. I don't know.
I think that I.
Speaker 4 (35:02):
Well, if you call me and say, hey, listen to record,
I'll say, you know, sure, of course, I was just.
Speaker 1 (35:09):
I was just playing and I'm working on some new riffs,
so I might be visiting.
Speaker 4 (35:16):
But I think Patrick the gate keeper of the studio,
I'm sure I like it, and uh, I'll just have
to make sure his taste in music is appropriate for me,
right the tambourine.
Speaker 1 (35:30):
Well. The point that I think you guys are hitting
on though of right now, Tom, is that brands are
starting to become media powerhouses. This is something I've argued
for many years, is that brands become their own media presence.
There's a handful of brands that have started to do this.
You know, Greg over it crave Worthy or is it?
(35:52):
I mean, I know he's doing his podcast. There's a
handful of other media's companies that or I should say,
brands that have started to go in the direction. It's
funny because I used to coach a lot of fast
casual brands and I'm like, you guys need to start
your own podcast or start your own theme around media
that builds for your customer base, you know, just your
customer base. And it was always a pushback. They didn't
(36:16):
really understand it. So I'm glad to see that you
guys have have kind of connected the dots there.
Speaker 3 (36:20):
Like, I don't think that we should be driving media.
We should be a part of this.
Speaker 4 (36:25):
Yeah, I think if you if hey listen the slimching
Is podcast seems rather transparent in my view, like, hey,
come me with my restaurants, right, but if I can
be on your podcast and tell a story and tell
why I think that we're great and awesome, that is
important to me and I would do that every time.
Speaker 2 (36:42):
Yeah, well we're still needed, We're still needed out here.
Speaker 3 (36:45):
Oh well yeah, untunate, of course you need it for
more of it.
Speaker 1 (36:49):
Just more up, more conversation. Because the key with with
any business I know, for me, I'm sure I don't
know about I'm sure with you share as whenever I
go meet founder and just have a conversation with them,
I come away with so many more ideas about what's
happening because you get a chance to kind of get
into the vision of what everybody else is doing so
(37:11):
very cool. All right, Tom, it's been great having you on.
Thank you so much for coming in today. We appreciate it.
Speaker 3 (37:18):
Hi, thank you, Sorry to mine, Look, I was kind
of off up.
Speaker 1 (37:22):
Fantastic, Thank you for having me.
Speaker 3 (37:23):
I appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (37:24):
You're looking good. All right, We'll see you soon. All right.
Another another great episode coming in here on Fast Casual Nation. Obviously,
the chicken sector has been pretty hot on the show
here recently for good reason, as we can all see.
And I think Tom hit the point dead on their Shara.
This one is a this one could be pretty dangerous
(37:46):
with franchise growth in the future. So what are your thoughts.
Speaker 2 (37:50):
Yeah, I mean they're already They're already out there, Like
like Tom was saying, they're already in the UK. It
sounds like maybe they might be doing some other global expansions.
So yeah, I think it's like I was saying earlier,
we have one five minutes down the street, so it's
always happened, So I'm excited.
Speaker 1 (38:06):
I like the fact that he's stretching the boundary. The
team is stretching the boundaries of what a brand does.
So whether it's AI changing up the express model for
delivery and for drive through, which is going to be
a big factor in Fast Casual whether we like it
or not. And you know this whole concept around content
creation which is very unique, you know, if you get
(38:29):
into that interesting stuff out there. Guys, if you're not
subscribed to this podcast, well that's the first thing you
should do, And if you're listening to the audio version,
I want you to do one thing for me, and
that is just go over to YouTube and search savor Fm.
You'll find us over there. And of course you can
catch this podcast. Many of our other shows share and
I drop up an episode every week on Wednesday, and
(38:53):
we record on Wednesday, so this will go out next week,
so be on the lookout for that. We have a
really good episode drop today on Trends in the Industry,
So you guys should check that one out. And if
you're not subscribed to it now and make sure leave
a comment down below. We'll catch you next time right
here on Fast Casual Nation.
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