New FCS Playoff Model Pitch + Week 4 Recap

On this episode, Sam and Zach discuss:
-A new model pitch for the FCS playoffs is being presented to commissioners. What is it? What are the positives? What are the negatives? Will it happen?
-3 Game Balls and a Flag from Week 4
The podcast is presented by HERO Sports and BetMGM. Visit HERO Sports for FCS coverage and BetMGM for online betting odds.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:14):
All right, welcome in FCS tackle football fans to another
episode of the FCS Football Talk podcast presented by hero
Sports and bet MGM. I'm your host, Sam Herder with
hero Sports, and I'm joined by my co host Zach
mckinnal of FCS Football Central and the blue Bloods. Back
for another episode and changing the cadence.

Speaker 2 (00:35):
A little bit.

Speaker 1 (00:36):
We will definitely get to three game balls in a
flag from week four, and if we have time at
the end, we will also look ahead to some of
the top games for week five.

Speaker 2 (00:47):
But we do want to.

Speaker 1 (00:48):
Kick off this podcast episode talking about some off the
field stuff that could potentially have a massive impact as
far as what happens on the field, and those that
don't know what I'm talking about that, you know, there's
certainly a some listeners that just listen to the podcast
and don't necessarily read, you know, hero sports the article form.

(01:10):
But there was a report we came out with last
night's The headline is could a new entity oversleep oversea
slash finance the FCS Playoffs Commissioners to hear a new
model pitch this week. So if you haven't if you
haven't read this just yet, certainly encourage everyone to go
to hero sports dot com and check out this article.
But we do want to talk about this in podcast form,

(01:34):
just to add a little color to it.

Speaker 2 (01:37):
So, Zach, I don't know how.

Speaker 1 (01:39):
You how we want to go about doing this kind
of we can go through a little bit of what
the reports actually is, and then you could bounce some
questions off of me. Maybe I'll have some some answers
to those questions.

Speaker 2 (01:53):
Maybe not.

Speaker 1 (01:54):
But when you first, I guess overall read this, what
were your thoughts, then I can kind of dive into
more specifics on it.

Speaker 3 (02:01):
Yeah, I know you know, me and you kind of
had a conversation off the show about this, Sam about
how I think we're both still like a little bit
skeptical because there's there's still like a lot of details
that have to be sorted out, and obviously the you know,
the meeting still has to happen, and then there's there's
a long process ahead. But I think both of us
are at least the consensus kind of feeling that I

(02:24):
got from both of us is a little bit optimistic Sam,
where I think the FCS playoffs obviously are great and
everyone likes that we get the crowd a single champion,
but we also at the same time can't overlook some
of the downfalls and the negatives of it in terms
of revenue generated, in terms of the instid of BLAY,

(02:45):
how they keep a lot of the gate bidding for
home games. There's a lot of room for improvement, and
so I think my initial reaction to it, SAM was
a little bit optimistic. And maybe if if the instead
of Blay is not running it and we do shift
more of a model kind of like the CFP, I
think it possibly could increase the ceiling for a lot

(03:07):
of these programs to make some money off a deep
playoff runs and then also incentivize programs to invest in
their athletic programs to compete because there's more financial gain
into making longer and deeper runs into the playoffs. Man,
So that was kind of my first initial thought, but
then I was kind of like, you where still a
little bit skeptical. There's a lot of details that I

(03:27):
would like answers for before I kind of like nail
down my final opinion on it.

Speaker 1 (03:32):
Yeah, and to start with the basics so that the
commissioners FCS commissioners are meeting this week in Chicago this
is kind of an annual meeting among the Collegiate Commissioners Association.
I believe the meeting actually might be today if I
remember correctly, which is Tuesday. And as part of this

(03:52):
meeting agenda, there is a pitch being made to FCS commissioners.
And you know, what I was told from one commissioner
is that there's intrigue and certainly intrigue and a certain
level of excitement about this pitch. And you know, if
this was something where they would go in and not
interested in it, in this at all, like they wouldn't

(04:13):
put this on the agenda. And essentially what the pitch
is is there is a group with strong financial backing.
It is spearheaded by someone who I can't name right now,
but this is a person who is the name isn't
going to be known among fans, probably not even going
to be known among media, but this person is is

(04:35):
certainly well known among college athletic you know, administrative staff.
And so this isn't, you know, some hedge fund billionaire
looking to get an easy penny out of the FCS playoffs,
or it's not some you know, overseas foreign money you
know money lord group, you know, looking to get into America,

(04:57):
looking to get into American football. So there is familiar
with this person making the pitch, and essentially it is
a group that sees value in the FCS playoffs and
they want to run the FCS playoffs similar to how
the College Football Playoff runs the FBS version of their
national Championship bracket. And for those that don't know, the

(05:19):
nc DOUBLEA doesn't operate the FBS playoffs. That's that's the
College Football Playoff its own LLC that operates that. The
pitch here is to take the FCS playoffs away from
the NCUBA oversight and into this group. And this group
would again with strong financial backing, they would inject you know,
money and capital into into the FCS playoffs. They would

(05:43):
fund things, they would manage the playoff structure, you know,
they would they would go all in on pretty much
maximize maximizing the revenue potential within the FCS playoffs, whether
that is you know, a TV deal, whether that is
more sponsorships. They pretty much look at the FCS playoffs
as this is a really good system in place right now,

(06:05):
but it is highly underutilized as far as the amount
of revenue potential in the FCS, and so they want
to not only inject revenue and money into the FCS
playoffs and fund it to operate it that way, but
also find better ways to make money from the FCS playoffs.
So that's kind of the the gist of it right now.

(06:27):
You know, right now, all it is is a pitch
and a presentation commissioners. You know, they're not going to
make a move on it or emotion on it today
or this week. It's certainly information gathering right now, and
then they'll they'll bring it back to ads and presidents
with more discussions and essentially you know, follow up meetings
and all of that. If and it's a big if
right now obviously, but if FCS leaders wanted to move

(06:52):
forward with this, it probably wouldn't take an effect until
twenty twenty eight, maybe twenty twenty seven, but that is
still a pretty quick turnaround time when we're talking about
you know, structuring and TV deals and you know, is
there going to be a committee, how is travel going
to work?

Speaker 2 (07:07):
Like?

Speaker 1 (07:07):
There's a lot of unknown details about it right now,
and that's all going to be a part of this pitch, obviously,
But right now that is kind of the the overall
summary of what this pitch is. And Zach, you probably
experienced this too as you're you know, writing articles like
I want you to kind of put yourself into the
fan shoes and ask me questions about this because you know,

(07:29):
as I was writing it, I knew details of this,
so I'm like, oh, yeah, like this makes sense to me.
Like I know, I know what's going on, but I
know I also understand that when people read it for
the first time, like sometimes there is confusion of like
what does this mean?

Speaker 2 (07:41):
What does that mean?

Speaker 1 (07:41):
So I wanted to give you the opportunity to maybe
be the interviewer in this scenario and just ask me
questions that maybe I'll have an answer to or maybe
I won't.

Speaker 3 (07:52):
Yeah, I mean, I think the first thing I saw
and I was I was kind of the one of
the ones that felt this initially, Sam, because I don't
really believe in coincidences for the most part. And I
know you said you can't reveal kind of who's involved yet,
but I don't think it's a coincidence that this offer
has come about as soon as the IVY League announced.

Speaker 4 (08:14):
Their participation in the postseason.

Speaker 3 (08:18):
And I do wonder how much ties behind the scene
that has to it, because I do know the IVY leagues.
I mean, obviously Sam Me and you know, the alum
and the people tied into those universities, how much money
and how many successful business people come from those universities.
I would imagine that those schools want to make money

(08:39):
with them, you know, going into the postseason. So I
did see a ton of comments about that in terms
of is this any way tied to the IVY League
being involved in the postseason.

Speaker 1 (08:51):
Yeah, so I didn't hear that, you know, specifically that
this is tied to the IVY League. I don't believe
the the persons spearheading this is in a lum of
an IVY League school or anything like that, but you know,
there could be some sort of connections there. I think
it'd be naive to say, like, oh, like the IVY

(09:13):
League being involved in the FCS playoffs has no part
in this at all, because I think, like, as we've
talked about, it does make the FCS playoffs more attractive
when you have uh, not only brand names UH potentially
participated in the FCS playoffs, but you also have you know,
opportunities for large alumni engagement in the FCS Playoffs and

(09:33):
large viewership in the FCS playoffs. And that's another part
of it of this, you know as well, is that
the TV viewership for the FCS playoffs is really really good.
When you look at the quarterfinals, semi finals, especially the
national championship game, you know, it draws more. These individual
games draw more viewership than you know, a decent amount
of Bowl games. And when you lump it altogether, you know,

(09:55):
we're talking millions and millions of viewers. Now if you
add you know, Harvard, you know, to the mix, you know,
and they get a game on national TV in the quarterfinals,
like that's gonna draw that much more eyeballs because their
alumni base is so large. And so I haven't heard
directly that, you know, the IVY League being a part
of the FCS playoffs is is what jumps started this,

(10:15):
But I would imagine it probably helps a little bit
as far as just the the level of how attractive
the FCS Playoffs is to this group.

Speaker 4 (10:25):
Yeah, I agree.

Speaker 3 (10:26):
I mean, like you said, the brand names are so big, right,
and I really do think it's just your one, damn.
And I've talked about this on other shows. Why Timothy
and stuff is just I think once the IVY League
start really becoming successful in the playoffs, if you don't
think some alum at some of these schools are to
be like, man, we need to up our game here

(10:46):
in terms of building a roster. Right, it's gonna take
one North Dakota State blow out of Harvard for some
Harvard it loves to be like, hey, can we get
this together so we don't get embarrassed on ESPN two
on Saturday.

Speaker 4 (10:57):
So I think that's that's one thing.

Speaker 3 (10:59):
The other thing too is I know me and you
had this conversation, is there's going to be a lot
of people scared of change. And I know there was
a ton of people who I think what they did
is misread or article because I want to say, you
interviewed someone who was not involved, but you called them
a europe based venture capitalist. And it seems like there
was a handful of comments from some people who are

(11:21):
pretty big in the FCS space that were kind of
pushing back like why would we let someone outside the country,
you know, get involved.

Speaker 4 (11:28):
I just wanted you.

Speaker 3 (11:29):
To clarify that for people, it's the person who's getting
involved in this is not the European venture capitalist. He
was just interviewed on the outside and just to add
context to the article.

Speaker 4 (11:39):
Correct, Yeah, and that was.

Speaker 1 (11:42):
You know, that was probably phrased not great because again
it's one of those things when you're writing it and
you and you're reading it like you you know what
you're saying, but then when someone asked you a question
about it, then you reread it from their perspective to go, oh, okay,
I could see why maybe wasn't phrased the best, and
so we changed the wording around a little bit. But yeah,

(12:04):
there is a quote early on in the story from
a europe based venture capitalist, and it was pretty much
just adding color to the fact that there is strong
interests from whether it's private capital or private equity, you know,
venture capitalists like overall just interested in getting into college
sports and so this uh a connection here was just

(12:28):
adding you know, color to the fact that, yeah, we
we want in into divisional college athletics in general, just
because we see there are opportunities there where there's more
money you know, to be made, there's more abilities to
maximize revenue in whether it's softball, whether it's basketball, whether
it's FBS whereether it's FCS, so that was just adding

(12:50):
a little more color to you know, for starters. You know,
there is strong interests from outside, you know, wealthy groups
to invest more into college athletics. And so yeah, this
isn't uh you know, our europe based venture capitalists. This
isn't you know, the Saudi governments. You know that, you
know they're getting involved with with golf and you know.

Speaker 3 (13:07):
It does it's no live golf. Uh, no live golf
tournaments going on here.

Speaker 2 (13:12):
Yeah, nothing like that.

Speaker 1 (13:12):
And again I think I I said it before about
reiterate that there is some familiarity with the person making
this pitch.

Speaker 3 (13:20):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (13:20):
So it isn't you know again you know some person
that doesn't necessarily understand FCS football there, you know, it
isn't someone that just has a ton of money and
wants to oh yeah, this will be fun, let's throw
it at the FCS playoffs. Like this is someone that's
commissioners know, associate commissioners know, eighties know. This person just
has you know, a lot of success when it comes
to kind of the business side of college athletics, whether

(13:42):
it's nil and you know, revenue share and uh, you
know they want to uh to inject some life into
the FCS playoffs.

Speaker 3 (13:50):
And I also think kind of building on that and
these last two points that I think we're going to
talk about are can be tied together a bit.

Speaker 4 (13:56):
Sam.

Speaker 3 (13:57):
Obviously, people are going to be afraid to change, and
I understand that, right because they love the FCS playoffs.
And you see this once the FCS playoffs come around,
stay if you see like the Sickos Committee on Twitter,
a bunch of P four Twitter kind of buy into
the playoffs and they're like, man, this reminds me of
the you know, mid two thousands FBS football right where
it like they feel like the P four has gone

(14:19):
a little bit to corporate, right, and it's gotten away
from it. It's just all about the money and this
and that. I understand that to a point, Sam, but
I just want to reiterate then I'll let you throw
in here. I mean, it's just there is still a
lot of improvement for the FCS playoffs to be made.
In my opinion, I think it's a great product. We've
talked about the TV, We've talked about the energy on campus.

(14:40):
I mean, say me and you have been in Frisco
for the past, you know, however many years and the
environment this past year at night for a Monday night
was electric. It felt different, It really did, and I
love it and it's a great product.

Speaker 4 (14:56):
But there's still room for improvement.

Speaker 3 (15:00):
And what would you say to the fan that is
afraid that this could be going down a path where
we end up in a similar place as a CFP,
which makes more money and all this stuff, but the
fans feel like it's starting to stray away from the
true purpose of college football. But then two, what are
some what are some changes that you would like to
see to the FCS playoffs if this is a path

(15:20):
they choose to go down.

Speaker 1 (15:22):
Yeah, so I understand definitely that the FCS is kind
of what college athletics is supposed to be. And I've
I've had numerous FCS administrators say when I've asked them about,
you know, the current financial structure of the FCS playoffs
where you have to bid, you know, to host a game,

(15:44):
even if you're the number one seed, you still need
to submit, you know, seventy thousand dollars bid or whatever
to to host that game, and you also give up
eighty five percent somewhere around their eighty five percent of
your ticket revenue and so because of that, you can
lose money by hosting you know, FCS play games. And
you know, I've brought that up as as a complaint,
and I certainly think that commissioners and ads and you know,

(16:08):
coaches are frustrated with that aspect of it. But you know,
you're also told that, you know, the point of the
FCS playoffs isn't to make money. You know, the point
of the FCS playoffs is the same point as the
baseball tournament, in the softball tournament, in the volleyball tournament,
and you know, National Track and Field. It's not to
make money. It's to give your players an opportunity to
compete in a tournament and win a national title. But

(16:30):
I also kind of get the sense that that opinion
is kind of being morphed into the new age of
college athletics where you're trying to hang on to the past.
But you also have to adjust a little bit because
Division one athletics continues to get more expensive, whether you're
the Pioneer Football League, the NEEC, the Big Sky, the
Mountain West, the SEC, it continues to get more expensive

(16:55):
because of just the operating costs, because of the house
settlement where everyone is.

Speaker 2 (17:00):
Pain, you know, into that.

Speaker 1 (17:02):
And taking less of NT double a distribution, uh from
from the top bottom end division one. And also just
if you want to be competitive, you have to uh
do in house nil and revenue sharing, whether it's you know,
costs of attendance or alsoon payments or you know, to
straight up revenue share. And so things do get more expensive.
And so there are everyone you know is talking about

(17:23):
how do we make more money and whether it's private equity,
whether it's capital, Like these are discussions that group of
five conferences are having, like how can we get into
private equity to to get more revenue? You know, it's
it's conversations among the ACC and and the Big twelve,
and so this isn't just an FCS thing, and uh
we can kind of dive into the positives and the

(17:45):
negatives of this. And the positives you start right there
with money, like it's some people might be turned off
by this and and feel like, you know, this isn't
this isn't what college athletics are supposed to be. But
times are changing, and not only with this influx of
money coming in to help fund and support the FCS playoffs,
but also doing more to get revenue, you know, out

(18:06):
of it, whether it is offering or whether it is
getting more sponsors. And I know you don't there's definitely
a balance of you don't want to get too corporate
of it with it.

Speaker 2 (18:16):
But is the.

Speaker 1 (18:18):
FCS Semi Final round presented by sprite is that the
worst thing in the world, or the FCS National Championship
powered by AT and T or races, like, is that
the worst thing ever? Like, It's not the worst thing
ever to me. And so that's one thing I feel
like one of many things actually that maybe the NCAA
has lacked on is just you know, maximizing these sponsors

(18:39):
and maximizing the revenue you can make out of the
FCS playoffs. And with new money potential, maybe you get
rid of bids so teams don't have to bid anymore,
maybe they get to keep all over most of their
ticket revenue. And if that's the case, just right there.
Take Montana State for example, if they host three playoff games,

(18:59):
that's three million more dollars. That's a ton of money, obviously,
but especially for a mid major athletic department. And in
the best case scenario, if the amount of money, you
know that I hear that could potentially be injected in
the FCS playoffs. Maybe things get more financially incentivizing. Like
you said, to invest into FCS football programs because they

(19:21):
know they can make money going on long playoff runs
where let's say you make the semi finals, you get
x amount of money. You make the national championship game,
you get a little bit more money. You win the
National Championship, maybe you get you know, a million dollars.
And that might sound hyperbole, but I'm pretty sure like
both Celebration Bowl participants get a million dollars each for
playing in that game. And so there are ways to

(19:43):
make the FCS playoffs more financially incentivizing. And if that's
the case, it could stabilize the FCS because a reason
one of the main reasons why FCS teams have jumped
to the FBS is because they need more revenue streams.
Things are getting more expensive, so they need different ways
to generate more revenue. And you don't generate a whole
lot of revenue, if any revenue, participating in the FCS playoffs. Now,

(20:05):
if all of a sudden you can, it makes it
more attractive to stay and you know, potentially it makes
it more attractive for you know, the group some group
of five teams to look at what's going on in
the FCS and say, well, if we're still stuck in
this bowl system, which by the way, a dirty little
secret like a lot of bowl games also don't make
you money and can cost you money depending on how
many tickets you sell. Uh, you know, potentially there's teams

(20:27):
that look at what's going on in the FCS and go,
there's actually money to be made here, whereas in the
bowl system that win right now, you know, we're just
we're not getting you know, the type of money that
we're expecting, and so that is that is the pros
of this, in my opinion, is is you know, just
you know, straight up the money and also just having

(20:47):
just having a group that is fully invested in the
playoffs and you know, it's not necessarily an afterthought and
they're and they're kind of pushing the envelope to make
it the best tournament it can be and just maximize
the revenue opportunities.

Speaker 3 (21:00):
Yeah, and you mentioned the sponsors, like the it's already
on the FCS level, Like you said, it's the Celebration
Ball sponsored by cricket if I'm not mistaken right now,
and so like the bringing sponsors in and other streams
of revenue is good for the schools, and like you said,
maybe it's a thing where it's kind of like the
like it would be really nice to have something similar

(21:22):
to kind of like what March Madness has now. Still
March Madness is under the soble a right, but still
if you remember Sam, like I think, you get a
unit for every single game that your conference plays in,
which in the men's tournament I think is worth a
right around two million dollars that gets paid out over
six years. So let's say the Missouri Valley has five
teams don that make the playoffs. That's a lot of

(21:44):
money to be distributed to the conference. And how and
how much does that promote out of conference scheduling and
trying to get more teams into the playoffs for your
conference to get these units? And now I want to
say the women's basketball tournament still has it. Now it's
not worth two million. I think it's like one fifty
or one hundred thousand or something like that. But still,
at the same time, there's ways to make money. And

(22:04):
understand that people don't want to lose the essence of
what makes the FCS special. But Sam, we just saw
a team, and I know Saint Francis isn't some national
contender or whatever, But Sam, we just watched the team
drop to Division three, and a lot of it has
to do with finances. In today's age of college athletics. Man,
it is really really hard to run a program, and

(22:27):
we've seen a bunch of really really good teams leave
FCS for G five in the past few years. And
I think for the longevity of the FCS, for this
subdivision to be at its healthiest, because it's still going
to lose teams, where's going to add some teams in
the future, I'm sure, And I think me and you
both agree that FCS will always be a thing. But

(22:47):
for this subdivision to be healthy, there has to be
a way for these programs to stay above water and
not drown financially. And this is just step one. And
if we can find a way to maximize revenue in
the play, we also might see some of the Celebration
Bowl contract is up, and I believe twenty twenty seven,
it's going to be very very interesting to see if

(23:09):
maybe those two conferences want to join the playoffs if
it becomes more financially obviously profitable to participate in the
playoffs over the Celebration Bowl. And it's going to be
interesting how that Bowl game might shift not to the
first place teams but for something else in HBCU athletics.
So there's all these things. But sim I think me
and you both agree the old, the old adage that

(23:31):
you mentioned that THEFCS playoffs are just to crown a
national championship or national champion, not to make money, does
not work in twenty twenty five.

Speaker 4 (23:40):
It just doesn't. That is just a that is just
a lame excuse.

Speaker 3 (23:43):
In my opinion, to just keep things how they are
and just act like everything's okay. We have to have
a way to make money, and we have and we
have to find a way to have these programs be
some sort of stabilizing force, like you mentioned, I think
the biggest thing, and I mentioned it to you last
night when we talked about it, is the potential that
some of the G five schools might look at this
as a more efficient option than playing in the bowl system.

(24:07):
Because Sam, let's be honest, the perks of moving up
to G five are you get Bowl game payouts, you
get a little bit increased television revenue. But the sneaky
little secret, Sam is those conferences are getting really really
big right now, which means the slice of the pot
for the TV revenue is not the same as it
once was, and a lot of that TV money is

(24:28):
getting allocated to P four conferences and those G five
deals are not looking that great. And so I think,
when you look at the FCS, if you can make
it profitable to make long runs in the playoffs and
be competitive at this level along with you look at
the opportunity that North Dakota State, I believe Montana, South
Dakota State, Montana State got to go play in Vegas

(24:48):
and get a big payday for that. There's becoming more
ways to find revenue at this level. Does the Louisiana
Monroe say, Man, why are we dying up here in
the Sunbelt or whatever when we could go to the
FCS and maybe be a top twenty five team and
get to the playoffs and make a little bit more money.
Because Sam, the other thing no one talks about it

(25:08):
is they're like, man, we can move up and get
more money in a bowl game. The thing is is
you have to qualify for a bowl game. So if
you're not a very good program, Sam, you're not getting
bullpay out because you're going four and eight at the
FCS level or the FBS level. So that there's so
many moving parts here that I'm really really interested to
see how much better this could make the FCS. And

(25:29):
I would just caution fans, I understand your skepticism, and
me and Sam are with you.

Speaker 4 (25:34):
We want to.

Speaker 3 (25:35):
See all the intricate details, right Sam, to make sure
the money is legit, make sure this is actually making
teams money, make sure they don't just destroy the playoffs,
and that these people are invested. But at the same time,
this really really could improve the subdivision and bring some
much need to stability to the subdivision and could potentially
keep some of those top teams here rather than moving up.

Speaker 1 (25:57):
Yeah, and we'll see specifically know how how the pitch
goes and all that. But there is a chance that
this could be a smooth handoff as well, because I
did hear that the NC double a you know, because
some people say like, oh, the n C double is
like not going to go for this. I mean they
have I can't remember what the TV contract goes through,
but you know, it's all umped together with you know,

(26:18):
FCS and softball and women's basketball and baseball, that's all
themed together in the TV deal. I can't remember how
long that TV contract goes for, but it's certainly you know,
several more years, uh, you know. But there is a
chance that the NC Double A is interested in outsourcing
the playoffs to a third party to run its probably
in exchange for you know, some type of you know, guarantee.

(26:41):
And you know, just because a new entity could potentially
run it doesn't mean that ESPN is out the window.

Speaker 2 (26:47):
You know as well.

Speaker 1 (26:48):
ESPN can just you know pick it up, you know
where they left off and continue to, uh to air
these games. And I mean we see it kind of
with the n T style with with the basketball tournament
that isn't it's parallel to the NC Double A, but
it's not necessarily directly run by the NC DOUBLEA. There's
kind of in the weed stuff like there, So this

(27:09):
would kind of be similar to that. This isn't the
FCS breaking off from the NC Double A. It's just
operating the playoffs separately, similar to the college football playoff.
And so there potentially could be that smooth handoff there,
and we've ben't heard like I haven't really dove into this,
but there's even potential that like college soccer could kind

(27:30):
of separate a little bit similar to this, you know
as well, and maybe like the National Soccer League kind
of like overseas it and runs. So there is a
little bit of precedent of stuff like this happening, you
know in other sports. Any other questions you have, I
certainly want to we touched on all the pros. Certainly
some cons I want to touch on, But any any

(27:52):
other questions you may have before we talk about some
of the cons in question.

Speaker 4 (27:56):
Marks, No, I think I'm good.

Speaker 3 (27:59):
I definitely want to get to the cons because I
think that's another side of this conversation for sure.

Speaker 1 (28:04):
Yeah, I mean we we we talked this up, and
maybe we we sold some fans on this that we're
that were on the fence, and and now we're going
to talk about the cons. And you know, I should
say that to me, there's more excitement and intrigue rather
than skepticism. But one of the first cons is you know,
when I was on the phone hearing about this pitch,
I was both excited at the possibility, especially when you

(28:29):
when you learn you know about you know, the money
coming in the amount and who exactly is spearheading this.
You know, it's a trustworthy name and all that. But
at the same time you also go like, is this
really a road you want to go down getting into
private equity or capital and and kind of because we've
we've heard stories of like private equity and getting into
college athletics, and you know, there's some articles talking about

(28:52):
like this is just a road you don't want to
go down, it's a dangerous game. But there's also articles,
you know, talking about how if you do it the
right way, it can be you know, a huge boost.
And you know, I think maybe I got talked off
the ledge a little bit. Just again when you when
you hear you know the background of who is is
pitching this where maybe it eases that tension a little bit.

(29:13):
Another con or not a com but another question mark
is TV exposure. Uh, you don't want to run the
risk of moving the FCS playoffs A, the NCAA into
a new group they obviously have. This new group obviously
has to work on getting a TV deal. What happens
if ESPN says you know like actually, like our TV

(29:34):
winnows are so tight right now, like we're not going
to re up with this new group. So where do
you go from there? Like CBS maybe like Fox Sports
doesn't have Bowl games, so there's potential there. But you know,
is there a chance that all of a sudden, the
national TV exposure, uh lessons because of this, And I
do think that national TV exposure is absolutely key for

(29:55):
ads and commissioners and so h for this pitch to
I think go over well, they definitely are gonna have
to address uh, you know, the TV, you know exposure
part of this, because if it's if it's if it's
an unknown, and you run the risk of you know,
three of the four quarterfinal games and two in all
two semi final games, in the championship game game getting

(30:15):
really good TV exposure to all of a sudden that
becomes an unknown. I don't know if there are enough
presidents and eighties and commissioners that would run the risk
of saying, well, we can make more money, but our
exposure unless people are watching us. I don't know if
that's going to be a fair exchange for you know,
for these FCS leaders. You know, I did kind of
get the sense that, uh, this wasn't too much of

(30:38):
a worry because there are options, you know, out there
besides just you know, ESPN, and I know a lot
of people throughout there like, oh, guy like his Flow
Sport's gonna throw a ton of money into this as
well as far as the TV partner, I would highly
highly highly highly doubt that. I just don't see even
if we're talking tens of millions of dollars of more money,
I don't see enough administrators being okay with moving the

(31:00):
game from ABC and ESPN to Flow Sports, Like I
just don't see that happening. And with this with this
new group, I'm kind of going along here with the
TV exposure, but it's it's pretty rigid with the NCAA,
right like ESPN you're our partner for baseball, softball, FCS football,
you know all of that. You don't really get to

(31:20):
be creative with it from the FCS perspective and other
opportunities with this new group where let's say the first
and second rounds are on ESPN Plus like they usually are,
but then let's say the quarterfinal round, CBS says, we
actually have a lot of open windows that Saturday, So
CBS gets the quarterfinals and then you know, maybe Fox
takes it, you know, from there, maybe CBS takes it,

(31:42):
you know, the rest of the way. So there are
opportunities to get more creative as far as the amount
of TV partners you have, So that is one con
you know, as well a question mark as far as
the TV disposure. And then my last question mark slash,
you know, con concern whatever you want to call it,
is just a long term outlook this like what is
there a term limit on this? Is this a six

(32:03):
year quote unquote deal where this new group invests in
funds things. What happens after six years? If you know,
they say, you know, that was a good run, but
you know, we're gonna move on.

Speaker 2 (32:14):
Like what happens then?

Speaker 1 (32:15):
Is it easier to just morph the FCS playoffs back
into NCAA oversights? Is that an easy transition?

Speaker 2 (32:21):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (32:22):
And also what happens with realignment. You know, we talked
about how this could stabilize things and make it more
attractive to stay and even potentially attractive for G five
teams to come to the FCS, But you still never
know what happens if this takes into effect in twenty
twenty eight and then in twenty thirty when FBS media
deals and CFP media deal, you know, is kind of

(32:45):
in turn over there. What happens if some of the
top brand names in the FCS, like the Dakotas, Montana's
Tarlton State, What happens if they find themselves into the
Mountain West? Like what happens with the FCS Playoffs in
this group? Then you know, the value and the FCS
Playoffs certainly goes down when you lose brand names. What
happens then? So that is you know, maybe my top

(33:06):
question mark is just like long term, like is this
a five year, six year boost? And then if this
new group kind of goes away and doesn't re up
with their deal, like, does that kind of leave the
the FCS Playoffs and no man's land? Or would it
be pretty easy for the inciduble to just pick it
up and you know, do what they're doing currently?

Speaker 2 (33:23):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (33:24):
So those are kind of the three things for me
where I kind of push back on is is diving
into this money part of it, the TV exposure and
then kind of the long term outlook of this.

Speaker 3 (33:36):
Yeah, I think the second or the you know, the
last concern you hit on is the biggest thing where
it was the future after this if it isn't like
a long term thing, and I do think that it
would be a pretty easy transition to I'm just guessing
off the top of my head, to get back with
the instead of Blade. But then we've run into the
same problems. Right where does it become negative financially to

(33:59):
participate in the playoffs? You're kind of like right back
where you started, I think for the first thing, and
you kind of hit on it is I just think
that right now with TV deals, especially for at the
FCS level, there's just been a lack of creativity. Everybody
just thinks ESPN ESPN plus is to move. I mean,
if you have all this money and we're throwing all

(34:20):
this money into it, why not air some of the
first round games or something other than ESPN Plus. There's
so many options out there, I mean, Sam, we have
games on Peacock, we have games on NBC, which owns Peacock.
We have games on CBS, we have games on Paramount,
we have games on you on Fox. You said, we
have games on Netflix. Now for the NFL, there's so

(34:43):
many options out there that I just think with some
creativity and with the right pitch, I think the FCS
has plenty of options. ESPN isn't the end all be
all in terms of TV money. I agree, if it
was Flow Sports, people would probably lose it. But anything
outside of flows sportsman, I think, as long as it's
a good deal and it makes money, it makes sense

(35:04):
to me in this age of college athletics. If it
doesn't make dollars, it doesn't make sense to me. And
so I think that's the biggest thing with the TV
deal part of it. But the last concern is a
major concern for me as well. It's just like you said,
do we get a little bit of a boost and
then we're right back to where we started, or is
a bridge burned somewhere and then the FCS playoffs ends

(35:25):
up being in a worse place overall. It's all things
that I think the commissioners really have to take into
account over these next you know, a few years as
this all gets sorted out.

Speaker 1 (35:35):
Yeah, and I think the next big question that you know,
maybe maybe FCS fans are yelling at us right now
about it. They just like, is this gonna happen like
just tell us is this gonna happen or not? And honestly,
I don't have a good answer for you. I can't
confidently say yes or no. You know, I it was
just talking on the phone with the commissionery yesterday, and

(35:56):
you know it was it was, you know, off the
record and all that. And I think I I might
be able to get a commissioner or two on the
record talking after the meeting to provide better context. But
my main thing with what the phone call yesterday was
I kind of called it like a vibe check, you know,
check the vibes on this, because if this was something
that like the FCS commissioners took the meeting and immediately

(36:18):
they said, thank you, that's very interested, but like.

Speaker 2 (36:20):
We're good, Like there's something we're not interested in.

Speaker 1 (36:23):
Like I wouldn't have done this story if I felt
that was going to happen, because I would have hyped
it up, hyped it up, and then all of a sudden,
you know, twenty four hours later, Yeah, nothing's gonna happen
with this Like that just wouldn't have been I mean,
it still would have been a story that there I
guess that there was a pitch like this out there,
but I wanted to at least get the sense of, like, hey,
is there interest in this? Is there intrigue in this?

(36:43):
Is their excitements behind this? And I got the feeling
that there was. Now I didn't talk to all thirteen commissioners,
and so there could be five that are excited and
there could be eight that are like this, let's not
go down this path. Let's just we're comfortable with with
what we're doing. You know, we feel like there is
some statement with being under the NCAA umbrella. Let's just
stick with what we're doing. That could certainly be the case.

(37:05):
But you know, it's interesting that Zach Lassiter, who is
the athletic director at Ablaine Christian, he quote to it,
he quote tweeted, you know my story and pretty much
publicly came out and I guess not necessarily supported it,
but was excited to see this come out. And you know,
he his tweet was quote as someone who worked at

(37:26):
the FBS level for twenty years before spending the last
four at the FCS level at a school invested in
football success. Again, that's Abline Christian. I believe, I absolutely
believe FCS is undervalued, especially in the post House era
excited to see where this goes, you know. So there's
one ad out there that is, you know, excited about
this possibility. So I do think it's gonna be a

(37:47):
healthy conversation. Whether it goes through, I really don't know.
But as I don't know if I've said this before,
but as on the podcast, but as one commissioner put it, like,
there's a reason this was put on the agenda. There's
enough intrigue there to at least entertain this.

Speaker 4 (38:04):
Yeah, that's that's the biggest thing.

Speaker 3 (38:05):
Man. I'm just I'm just excited for FCS football that
this opportunity has been presented because I think kind of
bringing our conversation full circle. Man, it shows the value
in the FCS playoffs. And I do agree with the
guy you interviewed in your story. It's that the FCS
playoffs and FCS football overall has been undervalued and underappreciated,

(38:25):
and it's finally good that somebody, even if this doesn't
come to fruition, Sam, that's just a pitch. Maybe at
leads to a better pitch in the future. Right, Because
other people see this interest, it might have their own interest.
I'm just class someone's capitalized on it because I do
think as great as the product is, it can be improved.
And with the right financial backing man that this this

(38:46):
playoff in this subdivision, man really could reach new heights.
And that's what excites me about this whole thing.

Speaker 1 (38:52):
Yeah, And I mean there's obviously I mean some people
might look at some of the first round games and
second round games, second round games, the attendants and be like,
someone really wants to invest in this, But I think
people overall look at it from you know, a macro
perspective it to see the value in it. And especially
when we get to the semi finals, like when you

(39:13):
have NDSU hosting South Dakota State and you have Montana
State hosting, you know, a home playoff game this time
around against South Dakota. You know, sold out crowds, electric environments,
good TV ratings. You know, that's peak FCS football. And
when you get to the championship game and to see
the sold out crowd and you know it's standing room only,

(39:33):
like and you see the television ratings when you put
it on you know, a good network in a good
time slot instead of the middle of the day on
NFL Sunday and you see, you know, the potential there.
To me, it does make sense that there is someone
out there that looks at the FCS playoffs, looks how
it's funded, and says, we could do so much better,
and we can not only make money ourselves, you know,

(39:55):
funding this, but we could also create more revenue opportunities
for these teams and these conferences. And I think I
kind of put a rap on. I want to echo
what you're saying, because you know, it's funny, because I
get accused of being an FCS homer, but I also
get accused of being too negative about the FCS because
I do point out all the lumps in the warts
and some of the ugly things about the FCS, and

(40:18):
certainly the subdivision has taken you know, a lot of
negative hits when it comes to realignment and transfer portal,
and it kind of just seems like, man, what is
the like the future of the FCS, Like, what exactly
is going to happen here? But when you look at
the playoff system itself, there's been a lot of positive
things that have happened over the last couple of years,
whether it's increasing the number of seeds from eight to sixteen,

(40:41):
which has decreased regionality, whether it's better television slots, you know,
especially the championship game being on National TV standalone game
on Monday, whether it's going from Frisco re upped their
contract because no other cities were interested in posting to
recently like four five cities being interested in hosting in

(41:01):
the game moving to Nashville, and Nashville sound sounding like
they're all in and to now potentially you know, getting
some money you know, invested into the SCS playoffs Like
these are all very very exciting things, and I think
it's good for the subdivision. That's you know, frankly needs
need some good need, some good news and some momentum
behind it.

Speaker 3 (41:21):
Yeah, and you talk about some of the look at
some of the new programs you've added to the Subdivision
two with attendants, like right now, I mean, I know
it's only week four, Sam Charleton State's averaging twenty two
thousand people at their games right now.

Speaker 2 (41:34):
Yep.

Speaker 3 (41:34):
That just imagine when they get to like host some
late playoff games and maybe just what if they get
to host South Dakota State. Do you know how insane
that environment's going to be. You see Davis as averaging
seventeen thousand. I mean, Tim, it's been a while, but
we have twenty three, twenty four programs right now averaging
over ten point four at games this year. That's amazing.

(41:57):
And guess what one of those is UTRGV. Can you
imagine when they're finally play off eligible the environment at UTRGV,
if they finally get good enough to get into the
playoffs and host a game. We have some really really
good up and coming programs too that I think is
only going to increase that environment in the playoffs as well.
And it's really good to see programs investing in their programs.

(42:17):
I mean, you look at UTRGV, you look at Tarlton,
and then even look at West Georgia Sam, they're in
the top twenty five year two in the subdivision. I
think the FCS is in a much better place than
a lot of people make it. And like you said,
those environments in the postseason, man, are just different.

Speaker 4 (42:34):
Me and you have both been to them.

Speaker 3 (42:36):
But when you get into the quarters, the simis even
the National Championship game and the environment is unmatched.

Speaker 1 (42:42):
Yeah, yep, absolutely all right, let's put a ball on that.
Let's go into three game balls and a flag. We'll
go through this this quickly as we're shorts on time,
but definitely want to talk about some on field action.
I'll sorry here my first game ball. I'll give to
Applein Christian gets a great ranked win over Austin P.
And you know, Austin P had had a really impressive

(43:04):
defense through their first few games. But for you know,
Able and Christian to put forty five points on that defense,
I thought was very impressive. Stone Earl continues to play
really well at quarterback and yeah, you know, the final
score forty five thirty one. You go, okay, solid win
over a ranked team, but Ablin Christian once led thirty
one to three and was pretty much dominating this game

(43:25):
before Austin P made it. You know, a pretty respectable
final score, I guess. So, you know, a great win
for Ablin Christian, who has an interesting record. There are
two and two, but two of those losses are two
FBS opponents, and then the two wins are over ranked
you know opponents, I mean Austin P and Stephen F.
Austin who was number twenty five at the time. So
Ablin Christian off to a great start.

Speaker 3 (43:47):
Yeah, really really impressive win. I'm gonna go with another
program that had an impressive win. I'm gonna go with mom,
Miss Sam. Listen to top twenty five victory over Villanova.

Speaker 4 (43:55):
A lot of.

Speaker 3 (43:56):
People looked at this as probably their big test on
their schedule because, uh, Villanova always has a really, really
good defense.

Speaker 4 (44:02):
Sam.

Speaker 3 (44:03):
It took forty six seconds for mam if to put
up points and this was Sam, and they never looked back.
Fifty one thirty three win over Villanova. Derrick Robertson just
insane again led the offense over six hundred and thirty
yards to total offense. And your biggest thing, Sam, is
this team. It gets labeled as just like this air
rate attack. They can they have it. They have one

(44:24):
of the better rushing offenses in the country too. Man
Rodney Nelson thirty three carries one hundred and eighty six yards,
and the defense just finds a way to get stops
in key moments.

Speaker 4 (44:34):
Sam.

Speaker 3 (44:34):
I know they're not the best, Listen, They're not going
to rank top thirty in the FCS and total defense,
but they make they make a handful of key stops,
whether it's in the red zone, forcing one or two turnovers,
getting stops to win it really counts. And I think
this mam If team and really really proved that some
of the preseason height was justified. This was a massive
win for the Hawks.

Speaker 1 (44:54):
Yeah, Mamaths built really well. Offensively, they're they're you know there,
their skille as a are kind of like what you
would see like in the Southland. But then they have
the physicality on the offensive line you know of the CIA,
and you know sometimes you see that like the CIA
has great you know, physicality and great size, but maybe
lacks the speed. Meanwhile, Solcon Southland they have the speed,

(45:16):
but maybe they'd lack you know, that size in in
the trenches. And I think Mammoth offensively has a bit
of both there. So that's going to be definitely a
scary outfit for any team that they play. My second
game ball I'll give to Northern Arizona. You know, the
third team that picked up a ranked win in a
ranked versus ranked matchup. They beat UIW thirty one to
twenty three, two good wins in a row. Now for

(45:39):
Northern Arizona, who also beats Southern Utah, they're now sitting
at three and one overall. Three and ollo versus the
FCS Ty Pennington continues to play super well. He throws
for nearly three hundred yards and three touchdowns for the Jacks.
And I know we mentioned it last week, but he
was preseason first team All Conference in the Big Sky.
But some felt like, well, he's just there by default,

(46:00):
Like someone else will emerge, is you know, one or
two guys will emerge it as a better quarterback than
Pennington and the Big Sky that we just we just
don't know who that is yet because everyone else has
new starters. But Pennington is legit and he's playing super
super well.

Speaker 3 (46:13):
Yeah, I love I love his game. Man, he made
he made some insane throws this weekend. Man, I really
beg people to go watch the film on him because
he's just one of those players where like the stat
box doesn't tell the full story of Sam just because
he's gonna make one or two plays that just don't
show up in the stats.

Speaker 4 (46:29):
But my next, my next one. I listen.

Speaker 3 (46:31):
I don't know about you, Sam, and I wish we
had more time because this would be a conversation. I'm
very interested to hear your thoughts on it. But if
the Walter Payton race is over with, how with the
insane start that Darren Robertson is.

Speaker 4 (46:41):
Having right now.

Speaker 3 (46:41):
I mean he's on pace to throw for it feels
like six thousand yards. But a guy that's really caught
my mom, man DJ Williams at Southern Illinois.

Speaker 4 (46:49):
I was really high on him last.

Speaker 3 (46:50):
Year, Sam, before his injury, and I was so excited
to see him fully healthy. And he has absolutely delivered
eighteen or twenty five this weekend, three hundred and forty
two yards through the air four passing touchdowns. Also led
them with one hundred and fifty one rushing yards and
another two scores on the ground. This offense average ten
and a half yards per play. It was another blowout win,

(47:11):
fifty nine to thirty one over Simo in the War
for the Wheel. DJ Williams is playing at an insane level, Salmon.
I know Cole Payton's played well, Chase Mason's been okay,
but it's going to be really, really hard to convince me,
Sam that any quarterback in the Missouri Valley, and really
any quarterback outside of maybe Derrick Robertson has played better

(47:31):
and has a bigger impact on their team than DJ
Williams right now for Southern Illinois.

Speaker 1 (47:35):
Yeah, he's getting it done through the air on the
ground as well, and he's he's looking really good. Has Yeah,
we'll see what the Walter Payton Award. You know, I
do think it's interesting that, you know, Derek Robertson last
year in the regular season, because we do votes after
the regular season, you don't necessarily take playoffs into effect.
Derek Robertson did have fifteen hundred more passing yards in

(47:56):
the in last year's regular season, fifteen hundred more passing
yard than Cam Miller and even more passing yards than
that compared to Tommy Malatt, and yet he still didn't even
make you know, the top three as far as Walter
Payton Ward candidate. So there is, you know, an opportunity
for a quarterback who has lesser stats to win it

(48:17):
over a guy who throws for a million yards. But
I think this isn't I mean, I don't think this
is necessarily Jeremiah Brisco he put up GOUTDI numbers at
Sam Houston, but both times when he got to the playoffs,
he just looked awful when it came to playing you know,
the ndsus of the world. I do think Robertson, when
you watch him play like he's not just you know,

(48:38):
a quarterback that throws it a million times against bad
competition in an offense. You know that is conducive for
big stats like the ball placement and the arm strength
that he puts on it.

Speaker 2 (48:48):
You go, Okay, this guy, this guy is legit.

Speaker 1 (48:52):
Sticking with quarterbacks here Toron Dickens Western Carolina. We finally
get to see him in action after being an l
well for the first few games and after getting a
lot of preseason hype. He makes his debut and I
mean he outlives the hype behind him because he goes
thirty five of forty six five and eighty two yards

(49:14):
six touchdowns. Western Carolina beat Samford fifty to thirty five.
Just a crazy, crazy statistical day for Tehran and I
think he's going to keep on keeping on and keep
on doing that against FCS opponents. But great to see
him in action because he is, like I were just
talking about playmaker and electric players, like he is up

(49:37):
there as far as the most entertaining quarterbacks to watch
in the FCS.

Speaker 3 (49:42):
Man, he's so good and it almost makes me upset, Like,
I know we had some I think it was academic issues.

Speaker 4 (49:48):
Salem or something.

Speaker 3 (49:50):
But man, just imagine the stats that he would have
put up against some of the defenses they faced early. Yeah,
I mean, we've really missed out and it really sets
me that we missed out on potentially three games and
he's probably and there's a lot of people maybe in
the we talked about the Walter Payton race, there's a
lot of people probably glad he didn't play in the
first three games because it could have been his award.

Speaker 2 (50:12):
But my last game offensive numbers too without him.

Speaker 3 (50:15):
Yeah, the the backup played really well, like that Gardner
Web game, but they were up what like thirty five
to seven, Yeah, in that game before before it came apart,
and they were competitive in those first few games that
they lost.

Speaker 4 (50:29):
I made an exception here, Sam.

Speaker 3 (50:31):
I usually don't give game balls to players that lost,
but listen, this guy played LSU. So I don't know
how many people thought Southeast and Louisiana it was gonna
knock off LSU. But we talk about how important it
is for NFL prospects to play well in their P
four games. Sam Caleb Proctor defensive linement for Southeast and Louisiana.
Five tackles for solo, three tackles for loss in two sacks.

(50:52):
He had an absolute magnificent performance. I don't know if
you saw this Sam. After the game, there were multiple
LSU reporters asking if like tagging Southeastern Louisiana fan accounts,
asking how much eligibility he had left yea so he
could go to LSU after the game.

Speaker 4 (51:07):
He played so well.

Speaker 3 (51:09):
In our in house guy, Gerald Huggins, who's a national
scout for the Strom Bowl, said, based on how he's
played this year, he has a ninety plus PFF grade,
which his own pace about what David Walker has. He
can play interior, on the outside of d N two,
play all across the D line. He's probably right now
the number one defensive prospect among all FCS guys. After

(51:31):
the first four games, Man, he's made an absolute impact
and just had an outstanding game against LSU Man, which
is something that really turned a lot of scouts heads
this weekend.

Speaker 1 (51:40):
Yeah, I heard this summer to keep an eye on
Proctor that NFL scouts were very intrigued with him, and
the first film they're going to turn on is what
you do against FBS opponents. And they're going to see
this film and be like all right, This dude can play.
So that's a big time performance from him. Now to
the flag portion of this, honestly a little slim picking,
maybe getting a little nitpicky here, because there wasn't necessarily

(52:02):
any you know, awful upsets or anything that that happened.
I'll throw the flag on Montana States. You know, it
was an odd game in that the Cats led seventeen
to nothing. They led mercy Hurst seventeen nothing at halftime,
and you kind of go, okay, they're gonna they're gonna
win going away. They'll they'll look at this up to
forty two, forty five points and win forty five to ten.

(52:24):
But mercy Hurst, who I mean, this is their second
year in Division one, and they played Youngstown State pretty tough.
They also played Sacramento State pretty tough. Actually led Sack
State for a bit of that game two weeks ago.
And now they you know, they go to Montana State
and kind of just hung arounds, like they got dominated
in the first half, but the final score ended up

(52:46):
being seventeen to nothing, the same as it was at halftime,
and so they hung arounds, kind of pestered, you know,
Montana State, you know, offensively and kind of threw them
off the rhythm, and then for Mercyhurst offense just kind
of tough to slow down because you know, I like
their lefty quarterback and they throw a lot of you know,
crossing routes, and they can move the ball, and you know,
there are a couple of times there where they move

(53:06):
the ball pretty well on Montana State and then the
Cats were able to get off the field. But I
throw this on Montana State similar to how I talked
about him, or if I talked about her. Just wrote
about South Kota State's performance against Drake where yeah, we're
getting nitpicky. Yeah you won, but if you're getting judged
on a national title scale, like you need to do
what NYSU is doing and blowing out these opponents. And

(53:29):
so you know, again, am I worried about South Kota
State or Montana State? Not necessarily because you take their
overall body of work more so than this one game
which could just be a sleepy performance. But you know,
at the same time, you go, Okay, I want to
see more from Montana State than beating Mercerharst by only
seventeen points.

Speaker 4 (53:47):
Yeah, I'll keep on quick.

Speaker 3 (53:49):
Like you said, I've had like because you submitagers first.
This week, I was really really struggling to find a flag.

Speaker 2 (53:54):
But yours is good though. This is a good one.

Speaker 3 (53:57):
Yeah, I'm going to go with Princeton. Man, Theys to
San Diego this weekend. Who could have got a game
ball this week? Man, Listen, san Diego's got some big
wins this year. At a conference, said Sam, So, I've
been really they beat Southern Utah, they beat Princeton now.
But the reason I through the flag here, Sam, I
don't know if many people watch this game. Princeton jumped
out to a twenty one to nothing first quarter lead

(54:18):
and even let at one point thirty five to fourteen
in the first half. They get outscored twenty one to
nothing in the fourth quarter here and give up a
forty two to thirty five loss here to San Diego.

Speaker 4 (54:30):
Man.

Speaker 3 (54:30):
Princeton hasn't won the IVY League since I believe twenty
twenty two, if I'm not mistaken, and this team was
expected to maybe take a step forward this year, Man,
but they started out on the wrong foot on a weekend, Sam,
where the IVY League has some big wins. Dartmouth the
top twenty five win Harvard looked dominant Yale knocks off
a sneaky Holy Cross team, the one of the big

(54:51):
black Eyes. Though, was this loss here to San Diego.
I know the IVY League's going off for scholarships, Sam,
but it's not the same as a non scholarly program
coming out of the Pioneer League. This was this was
a really really bad loss for president.

Speaker 1 (55:02):
Yep, absolutely all right. We will let's wrap it up there.
God buys in sixteen sixty. You calling me pretty soon here,
and so we won't touch on the week five slate,
which is honestly a really really good slate, but I'll
plug the blue bloods.

Speaker 2 (55:15):
You and Timothy.

Speaker 1 (55:16):
We'll dive into these top matchups as good as anyone.
So we'll leave it at that for this podcast episode.
Thank you Zach has always, Thank you everyone for listening,
and we'll catch you guys on the Flippity Flip