5PM55: Recapping Final X with Dennis Hall with words from Koontz, Braunagel and Hafizov

A different format is in order for Episode 55 as three members of the 2023 USA Greco-Roman World Team are featured in a series of separate audio clips, most of which revolving around Final X: Newark. Co-host Dennis Hall returns to offer input relative to the athletes' descriptions and perspectives, as well as to provide analysis on several key topics.

Also included are words from US Greco-Roman General Manager Justin Ruiz, who delivers his take on Final X and the upcoming pre-Worlds training block for the Americans.


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Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Hi. I'm Jason Bryant from theShort Time Wrestling podcast and founder of the
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(00:20):
mad stop worrying about stupid procedures anddo pool the sporting of our king self.
Gift Cree, Why are we dedthis podcast and why is it called
the five Point Move? I'm frustratedwith the word Our grecord guys from the
United Stores are true because we're ourgood athletes, y our good fomal dues,

(00:41):
but Grada went. We've got tohelp from get get what I want.
People know me from all of ourresults for everything comes from five point
Move. Hello and welcome to episodefifty five of the Five Point Move Podcast.
I'm sim Hans, founder and senioreditor of five pointmove dot com,
and with me for the first timein a while is my co host.

(01:04):
Nineteen ninety five World champion, nineteenninety six Olympic silver medals debut RTC coach
Dennis Hall, and we are goingto get so at right away because we've
got audio to pour through from threetwo thousand and twenty three World Team members
recorded just for this episode. Wantto try a different format, so we're
going to instead of doing the traditionalkind of like interview style where it's you

(01:30):
know, just questions and answers,question and answers, where I went ahead
and did what was recorded the threeathletes separately, We go ahead play their
audio and react to it, butnot in like the corny like YouTube reaction
video sort of way, just kindof dig in and blood. Hall analyze
some of this a little bit inThe three athletes in question are two and

(01:53):
twenty three World Team members Brady Kootz, who Hall coaches, fifty five kilos
Eldar half he's off sixty kilogram's Armyw cap, multiple time World Team member,
olympian for the United States as wellas Luzbekistan, and eighty seven kilos
Zach Bronagel. All right, soyou're ready to dig into this, yeah,

(02:14):
final X. All right, Well, let me start off by asking
you this and that is like,I mean, this was the third year.
I mean, it's not the thirdyear. It's really the fifth year
of Final X, I guess,or the fourth the fourth Final X series
running because it was eighteen nineteen twentytwo in this year. This was the

(02:38):
third for I guess to include ourstyle. This year's Final X was more
like a regular regular World team trialsor Olympic trials in so far as there
were three mats going at once.There was Greco matt obviously, a women's

(02:58):
freestyle and im men's freestyle on thatright. Yeah, do you think like
having three mats going at once forFinal X took away it all from the
Greco portion of the competition. I'msure it did in some matches. I
mean, you get you know,people I would be watching all the match
as if they were an individual,But you know what, to make it

(03:23):
where it ain't take two days,I think you'll almost have to have it,
you know, on separate match foreach each discipline. Yeah. No,
I don't think it was avoidable,And I don't even how do I
say this. Look, I don'teven mean it in like an ungrateful way
because I love Final X and Ilove Greco being included in it. You

(03:45):
know, Lynlin didn't want to doit in twenty eighteen, the first year,
and his line of thinking at thetime basically was like, well,
we have an opportunity to have ourown trials to where we kind of stand
alone, and that would have almostworked, doubt if they didn't have the
finals on a Friday afternoon at oneo'clock PM. But that's exact notwithstanding anyway,

(04:10):
Yeah, I don't even mean itlike that, like oh, you
know, like, uh oh,well they should have just stopped every other
match so Greco matches could go andnobody else could pay attention to. I
mean obviously, dude, like youknow, you have Burrows and Marstellar going
at the same time as stuff,and like it's gonna it's gonna steal the

(04:32):
spotlight away from everything exactly when FinalX is like normal, like this year
was stream match, but normally it'sjust been one match with one match at
a time and all that, Likepresentation wise, how do you think that
stacks up to the Olympic Trials,because I've I think that Final X when

(04:53):
it's like the normal version, isway better than the Olympic Trials. I
don't really think it's better in Olympictrials. Olympic Trials are. I mean
that's for the nuts of the sports. You know, it's it's crazy,
you know, there's so much rightingon it, you know, I mean

(05:14):
the Olympic medal or the Olympic dreamfor these guys, the stories are great,
and you know, so I thinkthe Olympic Trials is always an overshadow
of Final X presentation just because there'sso much hype on Olympic here. Okay,
so you're putting more of a sentimentalcomponent onto it, whereas I'm talking

(05:38):
about presentation wise, Like presentation wise, I think Final X looks better for
like, I think they present thesport better than NBC Sports Universal does.
Yeah, I could agree with that. I you know, I think they
could do a little bit better stufffor for the Final Olympic Trials, you

(06:01):
know, M introducing and the athletesmaking sure they you know, especially in
the best two out of three.You know, it's just tough because it's
it's just the pinnacle of everybody's careerand there's so much pressure. And that's
what makes the Olympics. I mean, think about it, the Olympic Trials.

(06:24):
How many guys know, what's yourlast chance, so they're going to
give it everything they got to makethat Olympic team, you know, and
I'm not saying, you know,the guys that lost this year, they
got another year for the Olympic Trials. They're okay, you know, but
you know, when when you know, what's your last last time wrestling for

(06:45):
the United States or for USA Wrestling, there's a little bit more pressure and
a little bit more excitement too.I think the stories are presented better during
the Olympic year. There's no questionthat it is. I'm just talking about
a steady X like um, likethe arena, the atmosphere, you know
what I mean. Yeah, butit's nineteen, It's nineteen. A full

(07:10):
crowd too, you know. Imean Olympic Trials is going to be pretty
packed. That will be pretty near. Yeah. Well, I don't know.
That sounds like an undercovered disk toNork, That's what it sounds like.
No, it's not a dish.I just think that, you know.
I mean they're being held in PennState. They've already sold a buttload

(07:30):
of tickets, and so I thinkthat the crowd is going to be there.
I mean I remember going anywhere theyleap the trials and the crowds were
were huge that was twelve and sixteen. Yeah, yeah, it's the old
exactly. I think it's Yeah,it was, it was pasted. Well,

(07:50):
they kept announcing the attendance, butlike, I don't know what the
normal attendance is, and how canyou even tell after five thousand people,
Like, it's not like like YankeeStadium or something like that, where it
holds fifty something thousand, and ifthe right and left wings of the bleachers
upper deck are empty, you cansay to yourself, oh, there's probably

(08:13):
like thirty six thousand people here.Yeah, for sure. There were several
series and nork that well. Obviouslyfive five went to a match three technically
four, but five were supposed to, which means that five others just were
completed in two matches. Of theones that were completed in two matches,

(08:33):
did any of those surprise you?Uh no, not really overall the winners.
You know, you thought that thatday we're going to win. You
didn't appos gonna be two or threematches. But yeah, yeah, the
winners were not any big surprises.I don't think that it's a surprise.

(08:56):
Let's say that Xavier Johnson and one, I think that was a pick him
kind of series. Probably, I'mdefinitely surprised and ended in two straight matches,
like with without Tuma, like gettingsomething going that was a surprise.
You weren't surprised at uh Colton beatingat him twice, just twice in a

(09:22):
row. Not no, no,I mean Colton has been rushing. Well,
I think he has a he hasa good chance at you know,
being able to metal. I meanhe's just got to get a good,
good session of training in before theworld. I mean, he's big,
he's physical, he he moves hisfeet well, you know, he makes

(09:45):
a fuel adjustments. I think he'sthere. Well, I think that was
the problem for Adam, And Ithink the problem for Adam stems long before
last Saturday, and that is,you know, even though Adam going into
this year and okay, like wehave to obviously acknowledge that off. Okay,

(10:05):
so we acknowledged that he took twoyears off or whatever you want to
say, and you'd be crazy tonot include that. At the same time,
like even when he was beating Colton, which he did in two straight
series, he was four and ohagainst twenty nineteen Final X and the Olympic
Trials twenty one. The thing isis that Colton always kind of had the

(10:26):
better of him in the tie ups, and like, I mean, he's
in every match they wrestled, hedid now Adam. You know, Adam
got him out of there from topa couple of times, and a couple
of those matches were close, anda couple of them were not so close.
But on the feet, I meanit was evident, Like I mean,

(10:48):
Colton worked Adam on the feet andthat was something that like required I
thought correction and attention prior to Imean, Adam had to have known,
I'm sure. I mean, it'snot like he didn't know that his chief
obstacle was likely to be Colton,I would think, and like just yeah,

(11:09):
I'm not criticizing him. I'm justsurprised, for a for an adjustment
that was pretty evident to a youknow, a lot a lot of people,
certainly people who pay attention to thisstuff, just surprised that adjustment wasn't
really made. I mean, andI mean, yeah, maybe that's not
his fault, I mean Colton,I'm not that sounds like I'm taking something
away from Colt. Just that Coltonwas able to keep Adam's feet moving where

(11:31):
he wanted Adam's feet to move,and it was pretty surprising that it like
he was able to impose a willthat way. There was a good job
of create pressure and release and pressureand you know it doing like to go
in on guys and get him backand up and you know he's not used
to that pressure release. I don'tgo crazy over it, like there are

(11:52):
people going crazy over it, likein so far as like like as if
it's like they're burying Adam almost.It's like that's a really ridiculous thing to
do. I mean, this washis first year back. Like, I
mean, he's going to regroup.He's got the Olympic year. There's no
doubt now he knows he's gotta becausethe boy has grown into a man.

(12:15):
Colton is not the same as hewas two years ago. I mean two
years ago he was. He's gotcollege experience under his belt. He understands
pressure better because I'm sure to getto angles and attacks in college. He
gotta gotta create those angles and Babelfeel pressure. So I mean the college
rush and guaranteed helps him. Yeah, it has to. He's bigger,

(12:39):
he's stronger, he's competitively sharp.No no rust on that blade, Bro
like it was a tough matchup forAdam. It's a tough matchup, especially
Yeah when you're coming back. Ohyeah, I mean then there's I mean
looking Tanner Farmers serious too. TannerFarmers like a big, giant guy.
He's got He's a fantastic athlete.He wrestled. When he wrestled Adam,

(13:05):
Um when he wrestled at him inthe open, he scored on. Tanner
Farmer made two attempts and got scoredon from his attempts. I mean,
like a couple of years ago thatwas eight nothing for Adam. That would
have been eight nothing, but notno more. So. Yeah, these

(13:26):
guys battle. They're warriors, they'refighters, you know, all our heavyweight
to have one battles there they goout there and punching in the face and
get after it. I think that'syou know, the white Colton's gonna have
to wrestle out the world. He'sgonna have to go out there and create
the fight and then use his speedin his quickness. Well he also has

(13:48):
a weapon they don't have too.Besides his speed in quickness, he has
a weapon they don't have. Hehas one matches this way grandly transitional scores
that far and heavyweights that's not intheir skill set to quickly. For sure,
I agree, so quite formidable.He has a really like solid ledger
against some top heavyweights. He hasn'tbeat Romania yet. To Rario, he

(14:13):
hasn't beaten him yet. But Imean, dude, the first time Cole
never wrestled that guy was his veryfirst senior overseas torment, which was thor
Masters. He lost to him likeon dopey points like five to one or
four to one or something. Thenhe wrestled him again last year he lost
him on criteria. He beat Obasoppianin the first round of the World which

(14:37):
was a significant win as far asI was concerned. And like he's got
credible experience against like some top foreigners, took top foreign heavyweights, So like
Colton doing something in Belgrade, likeI wouldn't take it like as any kind
of like jolt to the system,you know what I mean? Yeah,

(14:58):
for sure, Amaz He's got aton of that time over the last time
in its collegiate seasons. You know, the guy knows how to compete.
He's you know what, It's justabout making adjustments and scouting opponent's knowing what
their goal tos are and learning wheretheir weaknesses are, finding out where they
get scored on. He does hishomework, you'll be just fine. I

(15:20):
mean, obviously we have to talkabout Brady, and we're gonna get to
all these clips. I mean,we got the clips of that I recorded
just for this, just for youreally of Brady, Brady, Koon's,
Jack Brown, Eagle and il Dar. So let's go in order here just
really quick before I start unleashing allof this audio here. Now, it's

(15:41):
tough because like you coach Brady,so it's it's hard for you to think
of that series and an objective light. Yeah, was not difficult for me,
of course, and I was actuallyvery very I was seriously impressed with
aw In Duffield, like he hadn'teven come close to Brady prior not really,

(16:03):
I mean they're their closest run endswere I was in twenty nineteen,
okay, yeah, ever since andthey didn't wrestle a million times. They
wrestle a couple a few times sincethen, and like you know, those
are lopsided wins or Brady, includingin the open right, and so you

(16:25):
know Duffield comes out first off.He looked different, okay, like there
was no timidity, Like he lookeddifferent, and the fact that like him
getting the passive that doesn't you know, I don't, I'm nonplused by that.
But got his shot, he tookadvantage of like from jump and like,
I mean, it was like Iwas walking So when Koons and Duffield

(16:48):
were wrestling match one, I wastrying to walk over to that Matt and
I was on the I was onthe floor, and so like I'm trying
to get a better spot, andbefore I could get there, I hear
there, hear the crowd going crazy, and so I'm figuring, just based
on recent history, I'm thinking,like, I guess Brady rolled him out
already or something, and instead thatI look at the score and it's four

(17:11):
enough in Duffield, I'm like,well, while he lifted him and then
obviously he closed him out in shortorder, Brady obviously comes back, wrestles
a more controlled sort of matching thesecond round, and then in match three,
he second period he needed something andhe got something and he winds up

(17:36):
winning seven to four. So look, I can go in sports talk this
like all the livelong day, youcoach, Brady, what was your perception.
My perception was I'm pissed and Iwanted him to come out swinging right
away. Come out, get thepressure on him and not just move them,

(17:57):
score damned down, get your chanceon top and get tack him.
You know the problem is is whereDoD he win the match? The third
and final decide match. It wason his feet? Why ain't you putting
that pace on him earlier and justcreating angles in attacking like a madman.

(18:18):
And after he lost that first match, I said, I called his dad
and I said I told him exactlywhere he made the mistake on the defense.
And then after that, I said, Brady's got to quit looking for
the passivity. I'm sick of list. I said, he needs to score
takedowns. He needs to go outthere and he needs to be a damn
bowie. I said, he gothe has to go out to him physically

(18:42):
rough him up. And you know, I think he came out a little
more aggressive in that second match,and you know in a third match where
rest good, but I still needI still want him to get more physical.
You sounded like you were about tosay you eat him to get more
physical. Yeah, I mean hehas to you know, I mean,

(19:04):
do you think a foreigners going tobreak position? No, you gotta beat
the hell out of him and breaktheir position. You know, our guys
are thinking technically and you got tothink almost a broader mentality. So um,
you know, right now he's overand Lithuania. When he gets back,
we're going to work. I'm gettinginto the body with guys that are

(19:26):
just kind of stallers and don't reallyattack yet. They or colin rust and
I'm okay, guys attacking it rightnow. Give him an on the hill,
bade him in, rip his headoff, give him, give him
a shadow on the hill, lethim bad in off, balance him,
more more attacks. We got tojust increase our level of attacks about four

(19:48):
or five per minute, legitimate attacks, not a half attack of legitimate attack.
You know, I want to seelevel of changes from them. I
want to see slide guys. Iwant you know, those things right there
are open guys up, So wegotta make adjustments. We've got to continue

(20:10):
to train hard in the room.Um back, We're gonna have a lot
of guys on top of them andjust work on left and then work on
his time on the defense. Isthat you know That's one of our biggest
weaknesses for our whole team in theUnited States is we just don't have,
you know, great defense. Youknow, only we make a mistake and

(20:33):
it costs us a lot of matchesat the world. So we're gonna hammer
that out. We're gonna get guyson top of them, you know,
guys that can left, and youknow he's gonna have to figure it out.
He's you know, you're gonna getthrown over and over until you figure
it out. There's no other wayto do it. You just gotta eat
suck, all right. So whydon't we go ahead to start m raveling

(20:59):
some of this audio here, We'llstart with Brady Brady coats between matches one
and two, what he was thinkingand all that other kind of stuff.
So here we go. Here's BradyMatch one. I would say it as
much as as much caught off guard, it was. I went into it
knowing that I'm gonna get put downat some point at final act. More

(21:22):
of the things I'm working on alot was parts their defense leading up to
it, and what I got putdown I assumed I would, So going
through my head was all right,this is what I trained for I,
so I'm ready to defensive lift andthen I just did little little tiny thing
wrong and my timing wasn't right andhe lifted me twice right away, And

(21:48):
I guess I would lead to leadinto what was going through my head between
match one and two was what Ineed to fix for my card tire defense,
because I knew I was going toget put down at some point during
match. To insert those it wasmore of, all right, what do
I need to adjust? And youdon't like that, right, you know?
I like, I tell you,you know why why are you thinking?

(22:12):
I agree that he needed to makethe adjustment. You know, he
should have went in bat out bactedsome lift defense with his brother. His
brother's got a good lift. Youknow. I don't work on that defense
fix a time. But you knowwhat, if you score a takedown in
the first period, you might notgo down. I've seen seen it over

(22:33):
and over. You know, ifyou're always looking to score points, you
know what, there's a chance youmight not go down. So the mentality
needs to change. The mentality needsto go. I'm gonna beat the piss
out of that guy until I breakhim and score a point on our feet
and you know by do you thinkI ever played bar tare game with guys

(22:59):
from all overseas? Hell? No, because the foreigner foreign reps will get
those guys thirty five forty seconds ontop, and they'll give us ten fifteen
seconds on top. So you knowwhat, what did I have to do.
I had to beat the hell outof the guys, snap them,
get him a completely exhausted. Sothe one they did get on top that
they couldn't move me. And Ithink that's the difference is Brady needs to

(23:26):
take that mentality Danny, but notonly him, everybody in the United States.
You know what, when I talkedto Brady and I told him that
I was going to record audio,I'm obviously that was reduced to me asking

(23:48):
him questions and him providing the answers. I told him what it was for.
But I don't think I don't thinkhe's Maybe he wasn't expecting to get
Lambastad publicly by his coach. Idon't know. Maybe I eat in Lambastad.
I just said, hey, wegotta fix it. I mean,
do you want me to sugar coator don't say hey? I mean,

(24:12):
oh, you did a great job. Hey, let's go win a world
battle and we ain't got a chancein help. No, I'm gonna tell
the truth, you know what.And if you don't want to get I
don't give a shit. I mean, I'm here to help him win a
battle. If I if I'm misternice guy and I don't call out the

(24:33):
deficiencies and what I see, thenI'm not a coach. I might as
well retire myself as a coach.Okay, all right, No, listen,
you're doing fantastic. Um. Imean, he knows I love him,
man, I'm going to do everythingI can do to help him.
And I think, you know what, if you really look steak down and
sign himself and and does some analyze, and he's going to realize I'm right,

(24:55):
you don't want to give those foreignersa chance on top winner in Flash
and the entire this is Brady notworrying about the environment. I try not
to focus on the atmosphere when I'mcompeting, and more just think about my
match, whether it's like a kindof exposed this year with three mats at

(25:15):
the same time, or if itwas like previous years with one center Matt.
I try to just focus on mymatch and not get caught up in
any hype, which would have beenyour attitude. Correct, Yeah, for
sure, I would have just inbetween matches, I would have just been
hanging out by myself and just thinkingthinking about how it ripped the guy's head

(25:37):
off. Sounds about right. Hereis Brady talking about coming off of college
season and then right off the bathaving to get ready for the Open,
and eventually what it led to,I'm so used to wrestling folks style and
then going right into Greco. Wasnot talking to folk style and transition to

(25:59):
Greco, but just the season wisewhen one ends and then I might take
two days off, maybe three tops, and then it's back into training Greco
for the Open. So I'm I'vegotten really used to switching from one to
the other. Right away. Thisis me asking him here, let me
pause it, like, hey,you've knocked on the door a couple of

(26:21):
times already, you know, goingagainst Max twenty nineteen last year and stuff.
It's like, hey, like notyou finally done it? Like you
know what went through your mind?Something that preparation wise, I was mentally
telling myself leading up to New Jerseythat like, I'm going to make this

(26:42):
world team and just to prepare myselfto wrestle up my best. So after
I after match three, it wassomething that I'd already almost gotten used to
that feeling, because I was tellingmyself that like the week leading up to
it. Yeah, no, that'sthat's the right attitude. You know,

(27:04):
if you don't see yourself doing,it's gonna be hard to do. You
gotta visualize yourself for us and mydad getting your hand raised, and then
you know, st visualizing the dayafter about the World Championship. So right,
atta too, Okay, well wemove on. I purposely focused on

(27:25):
three athletes and that was they are, I should say, Brady Eldar half
he's off, and Zach Brown Egeland you know, I'm going to compile
more and we'll talk to more guys. I'm actually in touch with the situation
Lithuania as we speak, but forthis fresh episode, these are the three

(27:48):
I want to focus on. Obviously, we had to do Eldar because Eldar
means Eldar and Dalton, which wasanother kind of it was a it was
a right, Well, it's notonly that, it's like, okay,
here's fourteen matches now that they've hadokay, fourteen, with twelve of them
having taken place in best of threeseries. That's number one, number two.

(28:14):
This was the first series first offwhere il Dar ended a match early,
Dalton ended a match early, andthen in the third round match three,
neither had an offensive point that hadn'thappened before. I didn't even realize
it until Max Nowy pointed it outto me. Yeah, I was like,

(28:37):
Noah, I didn't realizing whatever anyway. So I thought that Dalton Roberts
leading up to it myself, Ithought that Dalton earlier in the year had
looked the best I've I've seen himever look and I don't mean that like
in a pretentious way like I tome, especially going back to Croatia in

(28:59):
February, seemed like he was morepurposeful, I would say, with his
pressure looks stronger. I thought hecarried that through into the spring very well.
I was just expecting three six minutematches where second period something weird happens
and that kind of seals it upfor either guy. We've seen plenty of

(29:21):
those matches and they weren't. Imean, well, match three will yeah,
before I get long winded about it, and il Dark talks about it
himself on the record. If youwatched match three, and I'm going to
go ahead and speak English here,and you know, like, maybe you
don't have to, or maybe youshouldn't because you're a coach of an active

(29:44):
athlete, and I think that you'vealready been involved in the chaos prior.
But the referee in match three,same referee who completely in totally screwed Joe
Rao at the Olympic Trials, isover here in the last twenty seconds desperately
trying to caution Il Dhar And itwas nuts, like it was an atrocity

(30:11):
that that guy. And I'll sayhis name, his name is Jim Spielman.
I'm sure he's a wonderful family man. Maybe he's a terrific guy.
I have no idea should not berefereeing senior level matches, certainly no senior
level matches of intense consequence. Ican't even understand for the life of me,
how he could ever decide to involvehimself in the manner that he did.

(30:33):
You want to go and screw aguy in the first period, You
know what, whatever, it's notgreat if you do it at all,
Holy cow, Like, no Ihear you. You know, I mean,
but those guys figure it out onthe match, don't don't caution that
those guys, those guys battle anddo what they need to figure it out

(30:55):
between themselves. The third match islike ten seconds on the five yard line,
you're gonna go and call a passinterference or something that you could have
called fifty other plays. It's anabsolutely insane thing to do. But the
fact that it was him, Idon't know how much more evidence anybody needs
to see that this guy wants tochange outcomes. What other evidence do you

(31:18):
need to see here, aside fromthe matches during the regular spring season where
nobody's noticing them. Doesn't get morehigh profile for the United States Greco Roman
program than Ildar Half He's off andDalton Roberts in a match three. Yeah,
mind blowing. And I'm sorry tosay it because I do not like

(31:40):
to character assassinate somebody, especially someonewho I have zero personal dynamic with.
But that was just absurd. Nowyou shouldn't say anything because because he could
be refing against I just think thatyou know what, if it's a tight

(32:00):
match, it's it's tough, youknow what. Let the guys baddle out.
I'm let let them figure it outlike men and get on with it.
Yeah. I mean, you know, in two thousand and four with
Posts and and I, they toldus they weren't they weren't gonna caution anybody.
You know. They said, youguys have to score a point.

(32:22):
You know, I don't know.And it's tough guys knowing each other.
They're trained to gather. So it'sall all right, Well, let's let's
run through this and comment on it. Here's Eldar's immediate thoughts following match three,
being very grateful, very happy,living the moment. I think,
first thing, I'm thinking about myfamily, how they cheering for me,

(32:45):
Like um sitting in Calorado WASHINGTV,washing on the phone. It's like my
life washing from pour calling UM.My daughter had competition I like swimming meat
at the same day when I waswrestling, and she was trying to not
skip my matches and not before herhit and trying to run see like her

(33:09):
swimming and my matches. She waslike, it's t you can you finish
in two matches? Like please?Like always always asking me, can you
finish? Get it out of there? Ya? Just for that long,
like she could saying like I knowyou will do it, but like the

(33:32):
way how you do it is likealways makes me like warrior. That's I
was like thinking, like how happythey are, you know? And that
was happy myself too, because youknow, this year is especially this year,
and I was like thinking about it, and it's like not a lot

(33:52):
of world class probably this and likequotefied, wait and you sit it out
and finally act on Phli trust andthen Russell Olympics something it's probably you know,
and and then I was like thinking, I made it, so now,
well we do disqualify weak, youknow. Right there he goes and

(34:14):
let something out publicly that is he'sthinking, he's you know, very likely
walking away after. Yeah. Yeah, you know for him, he's got
a supportive wife, that's that's behindhim and beliege in him, and you
know that's got a pushman in everymatch. So I'm happy for him.

(34:37):
Um. You know, it's it'spretty awesome to hear him talk about her
that way. Well, she knowsthe sport real well. She's like another
coach to him. Yeah for sure, this isn't going to surprise you.
I don't think this is this isme asking el Dar. When did the

(35:02):
idea of qualifying the weight come intoyour head? Yeah? Before it like
plan all along. But the thingis people take domestic competition as for huge
win. For me, this isnot the huge win. This is just

(35:23):
all right time out here. Doyou notice he said like all season long?
When he says before, that's whathe means, like he's been thinking
about qualifying the weight the whole time. Meanwhile, I have to go and
talk about it NonStop because not enoughpeople are talking about it. I mean,

(35:44):
and you know, did you noticehow he said that? You know
that people are thinking about the domesticcompetitions and I'm thinking, basically, I'm
thinking about qualifying the way right hegoes. He goes, If I'm gonna
be good enough to qualify the way, I shouldn't have to be thinking about
domestically. I get it. That'sexactly how I talkt too. I mean,

(36:07):
if I'm training to beat the bestin the world, I'm training to
beat the guys in the United States. That's his mindset. Uh. Here
he goes. He keeps going hereover to world like performance, like I
can teach my dream. You know, my dream is not be here is

(36:28):
like the number one, the numberone being in the US, but not
a big deal, to be honest, not a big deal. I wasn't
meddle. Yeah, the way hesays that, like the way he said
it like've made me laugh. Likelet's be honest, you know, And

(36:51):
this is the goal, like thecomplete goal, like I you know,
like not just to get there towrestle, to get their wrestle and metal.
This is ideal goal. So itwas like not like not vessel,
just wolves, but qualifying weight islike the Worlds twenty twenty one, after

(37:15):
Olympics when I lost the dolt andgoing through she went to wolves and then
I talked to my wife and shewas like, so, well, what
do you think. What do youthink to do? I was like,
I'm after Olympics. I was liketrying to quit wrestling, not doing anything.
And then she was like, okay, what are you going to do

(37:37):
after I was like I need tothink about it. So a couple of
months later, when Dolton lost theworld I was like, no, I
need to get back in shape andjust keep wrestling. Twenty twenty two,
I won Final X when the world'sin bad like health condition, still wrestled

(38:00):
four matches still wrestle more than everybodyelse. And even if they say like
oh, older guy, okay,older guy fine, rustle four matches,
the younger guy wrestle one matches twomatches at most, Max and I did
like the oldest guy in the teamended better than anybody else. So this

(38:22):
year is like the same thing.I hope, like every every step like
what we're taking too for the preparationfor the world. It goes well,
every camp without injury, every competitiongoes like as smooth as possible, like

(38:43):
and then without any like unexpected youknow, thanks, Like if everything goes
smooth, they should be good yearat least. What Like I feel myself.
I feel myself I can do it, and I want to do it.
I think most important thing, andI know why I'm doing it.

(39:07):
People who I haven't stop on there, so why I'm doing it? He
emphasized why I'm doing it, likeI know why I'm doing it. Do
you think that is a pervasive issuein our country that there are guys who
compete but they're not really quite surewhy, because that's kind of something he
seemed to be alluding to. Yeah, I think I think a lot of

(39:31):
guys are competing to get to theworld and he's got it to get to
win the medal. And that's that'sa big difference. Yeah, it's almost
like we're happy making world team.You know. Every time I didn't,
I didn't matter. I put downall these guys around me, you know.

(39:53):
And and he feels the same thing. And that's why he's talking about
trying going after that. And Ialways and he knows that's ultimate price.
That's what sementia legacy in the sport. Well, it goes on. Actually,
there's more. There's more to this. Um. He doesn't seem to

(40:15):
uh gravitate towards domestic competition as thishere before we were don't feel that rest
hard turnment. It wasn't hard,so it was just like making way,
but it wasn't a hard tournament.I'll stop him there real quick. He's
talking about winning the world team trials. He said, it's not hard turn

(40:37):
Yeah, it's like four big tournamentsthis way. He's like, bothers me
like it will be like an internationalterm will be fine, but it's domestic
to wrestle same people. It's notfun. Now it's hard. He gets
harder when you're wresting. The guysounds so many times. I get him.

(41:00):
Here's Elder basically, I think inhis way kind of throwing the gauntlet
down almost like m challenging those behindhim, and so far as like maybe
they need to step up a littlebit. I totally somebody there desking I
decide to quit wrestling and building decidequit wrestling right away. Who's going to

(41:22):
be after you know, not alot they're already. How do you feel
about that? You think they're notready? Yeah? Yeah, yeah,
I mean he's right. We gotthe guys that are underneath Dalton and Eildar.
They gotta make jumps, you know, they gotta figure things out.

(41:44):
They're just they're young, got youknow, I mean not that young,
don't give me wrong, but theyneed the experience and they need to understand
what they don't know, and thenthey need to get to work and fix
those problems that they have. Youknow. And I work with Dylan Toons,

(42:05):
who's number four right now in theUnited States, And you know what,
I'm prim in his mind right nowthat you know what, we've got
a lot of work ahead of us. We got ten months left tell the
Olympic trials and we need to makesome damn big changes and h you know
what the day data start it istoday, So I think he's right.

(42:28):
You know those guys are you know, you gotta new why you're wrestling,
and that why factor is huge becauseif you don't know why you're doing something,
they're not going to put in ourhundred ten percent effort. And you
know what, you better believe whenyou say you want to be an Olympic

(42:50):
champion, any better do what thehell Olympic champions do and they work their
balls off until they figure it out. Well, you know from il Dar's
point of view that coming from Uzbekistan, they treat this differently. Their team
selection is completely different. Obviously youknow that it's not we don't have a

(43:10):
anything even comparable. It's basically committeedriven and ye all that the fact that
performance go out the year or two, it's performance throughout the year, and
it's comparing and contrasting results and watchingwhat goes on in Cash Kent and everything
else. It's like a different mindspace. Man, This is okay.

(43:31):
So now we're going to start toget more into him talking about the issue
at hand. Here from Final Xso him talking about Dalton being in plain
and simple, will playing simply abad matchup. Yeah, I'll go on

(43:52):
a lot with him during the season, like in the matches or something like
on the seat, I'm going toportray with him, um and we'll just
like when we have part there goesbut on the seas like very rare because
he always goes through like well fiftyfive. I like to go a little
bit bigger guys like it's Verigger Sano. It's again. I'm not ticking him.

(44:17):
I just don't want to. Iknow I have to resagat him.
And this is why I'm not tickingas usual. You know, i'd stop
him there for a second. Yeah. You know, it's weird because there's
a lot of sister kissing in ourcountry. You know, it's a real
close knit kind of community. Wehave training centers where guys in the same

(44:42):
way class or workout partners, andyou know, usually it's kind of,
you know, lack of a betterterm, unavoidable armies a little bit different
because they have some depth at fiftyfive and sixty and sixty three and sixty
five, and you kind of mixand match a little bit. I look
as close as I am to theArmy program. I had just assumed that,

(45:06):
like at least a few times aweek they're locking horns over there,
and they're really kind of nod apparently. I mean you just heard him.
He avoids him on the feet,was avoiding wrestling him on the feet,
just parts. I mean, youwrest the guys, guys so many times
up and see they figure out,you know, and it is tough.

(45:27):
You know, the problem is ishe he's smart, he's doing the right
thing. He's going up. You'rewrestling bigger guys, so when he gets
the guy is weight that you canmove them better, you know. And
I agree, it's just insanity whenit wrestle the same guy you got to
compete against all the time. Iwouldn't want to do it. Who's in

(45:52):
charge your old oars careers? UncleSam? I think part of the offense,
I'd say it's Hilda, you know, because Hilda can decide he doesn't
want to wrestle any day. Thenhe just goes down regular army stuff.

(46:13):
Yeah, he'll go to Korea,that's where he'll go. Yeah, But
I you know, I think heunderstands that, and I you know,
I mean, some guys don't havea problem wresting the guy that they gotta
compete against the beat him. Butwhen when you're on top, which Hilder
has been on top more than Dulton, Well I give the guy a chance

(46:37):
to figure ye out. He goeson, here we go. No,
I'm not wrestling him. It's okay, being like a big kind of like
challenges. It's fun with me,Like I'm not afraid to wrestler against anybody.
It's just a little bit like Ifeel like Boos and Marcella has stains

(47:00):
his bad match up with Mark Teller, and I'm like, don't get me
wrong, but I don't think Marstellarget qualified weight. It's not non qualified.
But he's not gonna meddle. ButBorrows could you know, I didn't
have a comment here for him,Like I just let him keep going because
I have no idea what the landslopelooks like at seventy nine kilograms in freestyle

(47:22):
zero cloth. Yeah, but Borrowscan wrestle him at all. Like it's
just that matchup for me and Goldenthe same thing. It's just bad match
up. Just like you see.The first match was like smart, like
easy. The second match, Istarted rushing and I was like okay,
no, I'm gonna throw it.I was like, okay, I paid

(47:42):
for that, Okay, fine andtouch. I talked to the wife,
talked to a couple of friends,and they keep telling like, don't do
anything. Can you just stay inthe middle, done, like not doing
nothing? Just okay, stay there. I can't do that. Yeah I
can't fight. Yeah, why not? You know, I tried to work.
They tried to screw me, butit's still worked. To two other

(48:07):
restles, was like, okay,we're not gonna screw this guy this time.
Fine. What it was like intheir mind, I'm happy they didn't.
I bet you have bad matchup.Yeah. It's a complete and total
styles clash exactly. It's a dollarwith the technician right now. Look he's

(48:32):
just being a straight shooter here.So yeah, his I when I didn't
press him, he said he talkedto a couple of friends in between rounds
and it was like, hey,just don't do anything, you know what
I mean. It's a different,different scenario because someone like Brady, like

(48:59):
you get on, I'm like,you have to do something. Friald are
very different. Don't do anything becausewhen you you know, I guess in
Ildar's mind, it's um why botherbetween stuff that Dalton brings to him and
the way stuff I guess it couldbe called do I agree with? The

(49:22):
third match is just hanging out ye? I mean and being smart and patient.
Yeah, I mean you realized thesecond match is what ended up when
he went for stuff is what endedup given the match way, So I
mean readjusted his game plan and youknow, I mean you take the opportunity

(49:45):
and you score one, you canyou know? Yeah, is this is
where he's talking about head clashing?Oh yeah, coming up off the injury
and I did my surgery off myneck afterwards. Yeah, I really have
that. And then the first competitionfor me was national. You know,

(50:07):
even if I went through the likeum creation camp, it's like campus camp
and competitions competition, you know,it's always different. So the first competition
was national, and I feel likeI could have winn a national as World
took. I just need to.I didn't want to risk my neck and

(50:28):
I didn't like get that hit asmuch as I keep getting hitting when I
wrestled Olden. If you always likeeven if they like on magic on that
fact, Oh he's about to disRobbie. Smith right here, here we
go. Yeah, Robbie was keepsaying like they wrestled in style. No

(50:52):
we're not. I'm down only forone reason. I don't want to like
I brow get like meshed and bleedingout, you know all the time.
That's why I keep my forehead alittle bit lower, so all e tide
goes to my forehead, not onmy eyebrow, because he always goes to

(51:14):
that like eyebrows all the time,and it's always bleeding, you know,
and I know it's like reager spot. So that's why I have to keep
my head a little bit lower,like I don't want it to hear bit
lower. But he make me wrestlethat style, you know. Let's with
the high careers. I think it'shigh difference. Uh. And Dalton is

(51:37):
obviously he's hawkish too. Yeah,he's not coming in with his head.
I don't think even remotely close tobeing on purpose. But I don't think
he minds it being there either,which yeah, I don't think he should,
I agree. The only thing isis at the end of that el
Dar does say like, well hemakes me wrestle that way, which to

(51:59):
me sounds almost like that's I mean, not that it matters, I guess
now, but like, well,then that's a credit to Dawn. If
he's forcing you and you're the onewho's happily adjust Yeah, for sure.
I mean Joshin and Dalcin's forcing themtoo. Comparing opponents, last one for

(52:19):
Ladar, Destitely has always like thatmatch up for me, even if he
wrestled with somebody like say like Left, he was wrestling the one guy when
he injured. Remember on Philip Momhe's talking about the crazy score and Philip
like it was like kind Away orsomething. He almost lost. I wrestle

(52:44):
next day, same guy. Ibeat him. Yeah, it was like
a minute thirty or something. He'slike a zero, like nothing, you
know. And it's every match likethat, like named the guy. And
if he wrestled like tough match,I'm not gonna wrestle and tough match.
I'm gonna just like destroy him.But with Dalton, I feel like he

(53:05):
wrestled me, not like he wrestledeverybody else. I don't know what's going
on, he said, he saidwhen he wrestled me, and like everybody
else on the side, But he'salways tried to wrestle harder or something.
I don't know, yeah, yeah, because it's for a world team.
Well, if we're all going tounanimously agree that as far as the metaphorical

(53:30):
full package goes, Eldar is thefull package. Okay, Like he's the
best wrestle in the country. Sohow do we expect someone to approach the
best wrestler in the Country's gonna wrestlehim harder, get him out, get
him out of his game plan,right, and look at it's it's a

(53:53):
testament to Eldar man. I mean, the dude got up off the deck
from the Nationals, came into FinalLex completely undaunted, you know, caught
everybody a little bit by surprise withthe way match one ended. You know,
he got vsued in match two offof you know, I guess that
little arm throw attempt at Dalton hadan armed yanked, and then you know,

(54:17):
match three both had to kind ofbite down. I mean, you
can't get a series much closer thanthat. But I mean, geez,
dude, I mean it's like Eldar, you know, thirty five and like
he's he's fine, Like he's fine. I don't know, yeah, I
mean, he looked better this time, and he looked better this spring coming

(54:38):
off of a neck procedure than hepractically did the last two years. Yeah,
and then we got eighty seven kilogramsZach brown Agley, who I would
suppose in the eyes of very many, delivered a pretty big upset. I

(54:59):
will tell you. I can tellyou that Brian Medlin was certainly not surprised.
Medlin had basically laid out what hesaw as the blueprint prior to Final
X. I don't know how youdeploy it much better. So Medland compares

(55:22):
braun Egel to like a young Varing, young Brad Varing, and like he
thinks he has that kind of stuffinside of him at this point. And
I've look at I've known Zach fora few years back when Zach was a
junior, like an eighteen year oldjunior. I thought of him, not

(55:43):
even no even younger than that,I just when he first started wrestling.
I mean, like he's a throwbackkind of character for us, you know
what I mean, Like he's gotthat he's a brawler who like actually knows
had to wrestle. He doesn't haveall the Greco Roman nuance yet that you
acquire hopefully at the senior level.But like the way that I describe broun

(56:07):
Aagle is like a more refined versionof John Anderson. Right now, That's
how I see braun Eagle. Yeah, broun Aagle has something in common John
Anderson. Now because twenty fifteen panms that kind of helped put Anderson on
the map in the big way.And had that happened, well, had
happened by him beating Vera, youknow, is that match ended a little

(56:30):
bit differently and stuff like that.But the comparisons are to me anyway pretty
clear. But so braun Eagle,I guess, uh, you know,
to look at when they wrestled USOpen semi final, that was a by
the book win for Alan much asby the book as it gets r Allan.

(56:54):
And the narrative was going into thisgoing into a NORC and braun Agle
make it to the second period becauseif he makes it to the second period,
well that's when he could start hittingbaron the mouth a little bit and
maybe getting him to fade. That'swhat they believed, like that's what the
Illinois people believed. And now lookcomes out after that Alan, well,

(57:20):
I shouldn't say after some of ussaid, no, I mean, Alan
banged his neck up a little whileago, and I guess that was something
who's kind of dealing with. Butbut to give Alan credit, he's not
going around saying that he had aneck injury. It's not like Alan saying
that publicly, but it is somethingthat he's been dealing with. And yeah,
the reason why again wrestle the thirdmatch? Uh yeah, I guess

(57:40):
his neck jacked up on him.I guess, yeah, Zach will tell
the story. I have the clip. It's actually quite compelling. You're giving
Zach Bronagle a summer here, likeso whatever happens, Yeah, that's an
Olympic weight. So we can't makethis completely and totally in consequent bunch,
But you're giving Zach braun Eagel whoI have for And I'm much trying to

(58:05):
sound It's not like I'm patting myselfon the back hall, but I'm telling
you, like I've seen this kindof stuff in this kid for a while.
You're giving him a summer like kindof like you're a crash course my
shuggests name is going over coach andfixed the little thing. Well, he's
a younger guy. You know alot of coaches will try getting their hands

(58:27):
out and teach them a million things. Keep it simple, keep it simple,
look through your attacks around the corn. He's not going to be the
kind of guy in second periods offoreigners want to deal with. Yeah,
so here's Zach talking about the samekind of theme here between matches one and
two. Loses big in match one. How are we going to handle match
too? Took the focus off ofwhat the rest we're doing, you know,

(58:52):
with the finger grabbing and stuff likethat. Like they explained, that
is a rule. It doesn't reallyget called much, but it is a
rule. So can't worry. ButI can't do it in the past.
I lost that match because I letthe part hare get out of hand.
Wait time out here. That's somethingthat not only that I loved. I

(59:15):
loved him fighting the lock. Hewas trying to unpeel it like he was
on bottom referees position practically. Butwe don't do that enough here. Okay,
guys, just the whistle blows andthey clear right away. Take a
second here, okay, mess aroundwith the hands a little bit, mess

(59:36):
around with the like, you know, do a little peeling for let the
referee like make a thing out ofit and then go clear. You know,
everybody else does that we're like goodsoldiers for some reason, just drives
me nuts. All right, herewe go. That was That's kind of
where it was. It was like, all right, you know, you
know what you had to do.You know you could. You had to

(59:57):
minimize his part hare you lost becauseyou got turned like all right, so
you know that that kind of changed. You know, he didn't let me
sit there and you know, getticked off about you know the rest call
me either for the singers. Youknow, he didn't let me get you
know, start thinking or getting drilleddown on myself, like all right,
here's the problem next time, nextmatch, we go out there, you
gotta wrestle harder. You gotta takeit to him. He's gonna do this.

(01:00:20):
You gotta do this, that kindof thing. So he kind of
he was kind of you know,briefly went over it, but switch the
focus on the match too real quick. And there's the same game plan.
You know, go out there,be real physical. Uh he he mentioned
I wasn't physical enough in the firstmatch, which I thought I was being
pretty physical. Pa. Kind ofit worked out for us, and it
was a little bit better with thepart tire game. Um, and that

(01:00:43):
one too, as I almost gota reversal but ended up getting to my
feet and getting out of it.So yeah, it just kind of he
just kind of went over the gameplan. How I didn't execute it as
well in the first match. Sosame game plan, you know, focus
on, focus on what you gottado. Yeah, it's hard of a
weave with that voice. He's ontwenty two, right, he definitely sounds
older than twenty two. All right, So now he had left game plan.

(01:01:06):
I mean he made the justlands coachme did jus after the first match,
and he step two him. Ithought the series sort of changed,
whether Alan's neck was a major issueor not. I thought the series had
a chance to change anyway. Inmatch two when brown Eagle he only got
turned once. He didn't get gotit across the mat, and that gave

(01:01:29):
him legs going into period two.Here's brown Eggle talking about period two of
match two. I don't know,necessarily too focused on what the score was.
I was happy that I made thesecond third, second period because obviously
the first two it was you know, he got on top and ended it,
so you know, for me toget out, I was, you

(01:01:50):
know, I guess happy about that. But you know, there was still
a task to be done. Andyou know, I go to the corner
and meadlands in my ear body.You know, take deep breath, catch
her breath quick. You get backout there. When you get out there,
it's a sprint. You gotta winthis first minute. It's a sprint.
This is where you win the matchif you win the sprint in the
first minute. He's done that kindof thing because we knew the game plan,
Like we've seen him lose before andwe saw it was when people got

(01:02:14):
rough or people got him really tired. So that was kind of the plan
going from the second or the first. The second period was all right,
he's already, he's gonna come out. He might have a sprint here for
thirty seconds, but you gotta winand take the center. You got to
get him put down, you know. So yeah, and I think I
did pretty pretty good job of it. Right off the bat, you know,

(01:02:37):
before we even started, I tookthe center and then immediately just started
taking ground on him. So juststarted that sprint real fast. And then
I mean, once you see somebodybreaking or getting real tired and kind of
giving you what you want, youknow, your energy spikes a little bit.
So it kind of just went fromthere, and you know, I
just sprinted the whole time for thesecond period. Sounds about right, really

(01:02:59):
good game plan, you know,I mean shows that they're watching tape on
them. You know, a lotof our rushers need to do that,
figure out the weaknesses of their opponentsmore. You know, if you don't
have a game plan, you're goingin and you're hoping when you have a
game plan, you have a planof attack, and hopefully that plan is

(01:03:19):
the right plan. Well, andit starts to get bizarre. Okay,
so these next two clips talk aboutit. It was, you know,
Zach coming out right away, goesat Alan what we call effective aggression,
and yeah, he's making Alan dothe moonwalk and just to start to unravel.

(01:03:44):
There's two clips here. There's onejust talking about that in general,
and then after that is when thecautions start coming in. Yeah, so
I felt that a little bit morein the first period. Actually, when
he started getting tired. I know, like even before I get put down,
is like he got he would getinto his under oaks and stuff,
and they weren't as strong. Hewas grabbing my wrist not as hard and

(01:04:06):
then when I got out of parkdtire, he ended up with double unders
in my head in his chest,and I was right on the edge,
and he could have just you know, I feel like if he lowered his
level and just gave it one goodsprint, like one good burst of energy,
he could have pushed me out.He was in no head was My
head was in his chest. Hehad double unders. Um. He's way

(01:04:26):
taller than me, so there wasno real threat of me double over and
there either um. But he justkind of stood there and I felt him,
I was my head was on hisI felt him trying to catch his
breath, and he didn't do anythingand just stood there, you know,
two catch his breath, wanted tobreak so to me that I was in
trying to slow me down, Iwas like, all right, he's tired.
And then coming back out in thesecond period, it was me I

(01:04:49):
immediately able to take to take thecenter of the mat, push him back
real quick. And you know thatdidn't happen as much in the first period,
and you know, he would grabmy just I could get out of
it a lot easier if I tryto drag him. He moved a lot
easier, so it was more doingthe same stuff that I was trying to
do it in the first period,but I felt it, you know,

(01:05:10):
having more of an impact on him. Well see, and this is where
the neck issue is going to comein for some I think if you know,
there's grip strength compromised and stuff likethat, I think that would be
Yeah, what was the score atJen in a period? I want to
say five? Five? Oh,I want to say yeah, No,

(01:05:36):
I I was just curious. Um, I didn't I didn't remember. I
just really remember watching, you know, the push out. I thought he
was going to get cautioned out right, Well, I mean essentially that's kind
of what happened, except there's thatreally, there's that confusion he talks about

(01:05:58):
in a second. You couldn't kindof hell what that what the point the
middle point was for, because whathad happened was like we all thought that
that was a caution in minor whatever, and it wasn't. What had happened
was is that after he got pushedout VERA did on the I guess it

(01:06:18):
was the second or third time inthe second period. Okay, we figured,
okay, that's it, that's acaution caution, But no, what
they did. Was they actually justcalled Alan for passive and yeah, instead
of taking top partire Zach just wantsto stay standing. Except you don't see

(01:06:39):
those gestures. And it's not likethey required a long talk like I guess.
I guess braun Eagle just told theref like coming back to center,
like now we'll just keep it here, yactist. I got two pushouts and
then they gave him two cautions.They came back to the center and I
was paying fighting with him little bitmore again and I almost pushed him out

(01:07:00):
again, and then they called themfor part two. They called them for
passive and put them down or soI got the passive point. I believe
that's how it was, but Ididn't. I didn't. The game plan
was if I got the pass Igot him, you know, got the
passive call, then I wasn't evengonna really take it. I was stay
up, stay at our feet.So I so that's why I pushed him

(01:07:21):
out of bounce, but they didn'tgive me a point for it, and
then they gave me the passive pointinstead, and so he laid on injury
time. Yeah, and I'm justkind of walking there and Medlin's looking at
me, like, you know,the game plan to keep them neutral,
keep them neutral. So the onlything going through my head. And it's
kind of funny that you ask,because like what was going through my head?

(01:07:44):
Which is kind of an inside jokebecause on the college teams team,
we have an inside joke and it'sabout to coach Jeremy Hunter and we'll be
like doing conditioning or something or ifyou do like a good seen a leg
or a good double, he's justright behind you and he says it in
his like he's got such a distinctvoice to us, and he goes like,
do it again, do it again, that kind of thing. And

(01:08:08):
so literally, like while we're whilewe're restling, I swished him ut twice,
you know, two cautions and honestlyI didn't even know if a third
caution. I wasn't even sure ifthe third caution and end the match or
not. And so I just inmy head it was like, all right,
he's let me push him out.Do it again, do it again.
That was the only thing going aheadat that time. Just do it
again, do it again. Butget back to it and do it again,

(01:08:29):
and try not to think too muchinto things, just kind of focus
on what I need to do.Do it again? Well he did it
again. He did it like ninetimes. Oh that was awesome. I
mean that's a good way what coachessaying, Matt see in the resting room
matters, it ficks in their head. That's a good way to look at
it. One more we've got andthat is this is braun Nagel describing when

(01:08:55):
he found out that that was arap. You know, he's your World
team member, and so you know, the first thing I did, obviously,
you know, give him Alan highfive, get coach Poetta high fives,
like, get him a hug.Was like that's awesome, you know,
like that's kind of what's going toahead. This is crazy. Um.
And then I texted my dad andthat's when I kind of kicked in.

(01:09:15):
He because I texted my dad.It was like because he was he
texted me before all my matches,Um, you know, just like good
luck, you know, Russell Hardthat kind of saying love you, but
that kind of that kind of stuffnormal that stuff. Uh. And then
this time, you know, hetexted me and and I texted him back,
and I'm like, you're texting thetwenty twenty three eighty seven kilogram their

(01:09:39):
World Team member. There you go, there's more to it. Yeah,
match three was coming up a lotquicker because there was only a few you
know, bounts that I had togo to a third match. Through a
few matchups, I had to goto third match. So uh, it
was probably I was probably off thematt you know, maybe ten minutes,
just got my cool down done andthey the cold just come back and like,

(01:10:00):
hey, you're wrestling at this time, so like a final act.
There was a sheet of paperback therethat had all the times that people are
going to wrestle walk out, Soit was very nice. Actually, like
you know, if the if theif the started you know at five,
I'm wrestling at at six twenty twois when I'm walking out for my match
six twenty two, you know,thirty seconds and whatever. So that helped

(01:10:21):
out a lot. And so thatthere was a sheet up there and it
told the coaches like what what timeI was going to walk out there for
my third match, and so itsaid twelve or with eight eight forty nine
or I think it was eight fortynine maybe, So I'm back there at
eight thirty warming up and stuff,and Joe Rowag just one, and I

(01:10:42):
think, you know that I've beentraining with Joe Rao for this, so
he came over and helped me warmup, and you know, I was
doing a bunch of pummeling goes andstuff with that, and I kept looking
over and as I'm warming up,you know, we have ten minutes till
we go out. I'm over there, you know, getting my heart rate
up, getting ready, getting alittle sweat in, you know, pummelin
with Joe. We're out, whichis you know, props to Joe,

(01:11:02):
thanks for him because he just wonhis second match. So he at the
spot he was stoked thinking and helpedme warm up, So that's awesome.
Yeah, I looked over and sawthe same mat space and bears over there
in the on the wall where hisstuff was, and he's just still laying
there. He didn't look like hewas, you know, getting ready for
the match. And like I hadseen him earlier in the day too,

(01:11:24):
he didn't like he didn't really getsuper warm for either of the match.
He's kind of stand there, getsa little loose, moves around a little
bit, but he doesn't do asuper long warm up to go out there.
And but like he was just layingthere on the mat this time,
and so he got up started walkingaround by his coaches, and I don't
know, I just tried trying notto focus on it a little bit.

(01:11:44):
And then, you know, inthe middle of one of my you know,
I guess I think I think Iwas gonna pummel go with Joe back
there. It were like five minutesto going out or like we're like the
next match to go out or sohe comes up to me. He says,
um, congratulations, and I'm like, okay. He shakes my hand
and like this is weird, likewe have one more match, but you
know, thanks. He said somethingelse and with coach I'm like looking at

(01:12:10):
Route and I was like, that'ssuper weird. A good close shit to
Medland and he told the thing.He told Medland that he's not wrestling,
and I was like, okay,that this sounded like he said that,
and uh, I obviously I trynot to focus on it a little bit
because I just wanted to be readyfor my match, you know, and
not get my you know, notget into that a little bit. And

(01:12:31):
then h coach Zach Dominguez came upand uh told me that he's not wrestling,
and so at first I was sittingthere, It's like this is a
trick, like are they playing agame on me? But then Zach went
up to Medland and said the samething, And so I wanted to Medlands
like, do you want me,you know, still get ready, like
do you think you think they're playinga game here or whatever? Just because

(01:12:55):
like it never happened to be like, you know, exactly cautious about out
it. Medlen goes that, hegoes coach coach Demingez, so Alan's code,
you're paranoid like that too college.Yeah, I didn't know that.
And so he said that, anduh, he goes, if he lied

(01:13:15):
to me, I'm gonna kick hisass that kind of thing, just like
a friendly banter kind of thing,like a joke, but basically saying like,
no, he's not lying to me. Like and then and then I
watched that go up and tell theguys I cut so I cut it off.
But you get the gist. Onething is is that afterwards, Alan,
you feel bad. You know,nobody wants to see an athlete like

(01:13:39):
That's how it happens for him.He would prefer people to be able to
finish on their feet so to speak. Yeah, so it's unfor sure.
Ye at least the three sh threematch series, multiple things can be true
at the same time, I willI would probably be pretty indignant against those

(01:14:01):
who would even take a shred ofanything away from braun Eagle by leaning on
Alan having a neck injury. Okay, Like I don't get up with that,
Okay, And here's the reason whyAlan may very well have had like
some kind of neck issue on andoff throughout this season. I heard that
he had. But well, thencredit still goes to braun Eagle for freaking

(01:14:30):
reaggravating it and making it so theguy can't continue competing. So, I
mean, this is this is combat. What do you want to do?
You know, like if if somebodyhad told braun Eagle before final X,
hey listen, just so you know, Alan's got a neck injury, probably
you know, try to do tryto do him a solid and you know,

(01:14:53):
don't snap at him at all,you know, don't try to try
to stay off the head. Likeis that how that would have happened?
No, he would have went Imean I don't think it would have if
you knew that your opponent had alegitimate vulnerability would you not try to capitalize
on that? I think you don'tand you're and you don't want to win.

(01:15:13):
I mean, it ain't your fault, like the guy's a little bang
up, didn't go out, oryou're gonna wrestle and what half the job.
That's all I'm saying. That's allI'm saying. Now. Don't mean
that in a bad way towards Allen, of course I don't, But it's
just I had to deal with that. Like it's like, well, hey,
listen, I look at Alan stepAway. I mean people don't.

(01:15:35):
I don't know who knows that,but I mean Alan went out, and
you know, not that you takeeverything that people put on social media as
a banner news and stuff, butlike you know, Alan put on Instagram
that he was he's done, Likeyou know, day after final X,
tears in my eyes, I saygoodbye to the sport. It was something

(01:15:56):
like that. And I was likeinclined to text him because I know the
guy pretty darn well, but Ididn't because you know, like when guys
lose and stuff like that, youknow, I just figured I need to
bat. But like the point isis that do I want to see Alan
Vera like walk away from the sport. No, I would hate I hate
that he would even consider that.I would hope he would just go rehab

(01:16:19):
or whatever he needs to get doneand then be back for an Olympic year.
Push Okay, Like he's a fantastic, fantastic wrestler and he's our best
technical upper weight by about fourteen countrymiles. But like Zach broun Eggle came
out there to do work and hetotally did motion. He had the game

(01:16:43):
play more I'm from broun Egle herethat you're gonna like him what he says
here, and I STI normal dadstuff. And then this time, you
know, he texted me and Itexted him back and I'm like, you're
texting the twenty twenty three eighty sevenkilogram the world team member and he goes,
he goes, are you shitting me? And then I go no,

(01:17:04):
balance just came up, said he'snot wrestling and said he's got he's got
a neck issue from panams and uh, my dad, my dad texted me
and he texted me back. Hegoes, dude, I'm I'm so fff
and happy right now I'm shaking.And that's when it hit because like my
dad doesn't really get very emotional aboutanything. Really. He gets happy when
we win, but like, youknow, I want like a Fargo national

(01:17:27):
title, and my dad, youknow, just sat there and clapped or
you know, like I can knowwhen he's happy about it, but if
some outsider was looking at it,it's like, wow, he doesn't care
that kind of thing. But likejust him telling me he's shaking, it's
like, wow, that kind ofhit. I like, I think I
teared up a little bit because likethat's when it hit. It was like,
you know, when the winning's awesome, but making your parents proud,

(01:17:50):
you know, that's that's even betterthan me. So you know, that's
when it hit. And so Iwas. I was really stoked. And
then I went out there. Youknow, when I got my hand raise
spy, I didn't want to go. At first, I was confused.
I was kind of walking around likea lost dog. Um, everybody had
the cameras on Marstellar, so I'dkind of make my waist through and then

(01:18:10):
I went, I think I'm andyou know, one gave him a hug,
and gave my brother hug, andmy Danny. Danny flew out there
and my aunt nuncle drove down fromBoston with their kids, and so yeah,
it was a really cool moment,you know it. Uh they kind
of made everything worth it, youknow that it felt awesome, It was
it was really cool. What's what'shonestly, what's really cool about this?

(01:18:33):
Like, I'm not I'm not.I don't know Alan very well. I've
trained with him once before, likeGreco in your camp out in Omaha,
Nebraska one year, and I toldhim a little bit, you know,
you know, I probably did twogoals with him, that's it. But
I so I don't know. Alanliked that very much. And uh but

(01:18:55):
he did. He did come backup to me afterward and congratulate me again.
He got like congrat like this time, you know, I knew what
he was saying. It was likecongratulations with the world team and that kind
of stuff like it. And hetold me and my com Medlan that like
he would come out here and helpus train, you know for worlds and
everything, and he would help mewhatever I need wherever, wherever I'm at.

(01:19:16):
If I needed to train with someone, let him know, He'll come
and help me. So that wasactually super cool of him. He's a
and we were actually I talked toMedland. We might actually take him up
on it, you know, bringhim to Illinois or something trained for it.
But that was that's really cool.He came, he came up to
us and offered his help for helpingme out to get to Worlds after.
You know, I just I hadjust beating him. So that was always

(01:19:39):
really cool with him, just asit says something about Island. But yeah,
that's really cool. Yeah, itis really cool. And for anybody
who knows very even the slightest,I mean, it's not even surprising.
Yeah, a good guy sad tohear that might be done. Yeah No,
I mean, look, I don'tknow how how much of that was

(01:20:00):
emotion in the moment, and youknow whatever, I haven't talked to him
yet. I would hate for himto be done. I think that he
still has an awful lot to give. I totally do. I think that
this was just a tough, tough, tough year, well tough year,
tough whatever. Six months and heculminates with a you know, a freaking

(01:20:28):
bad loss, dude, Like Imean, you're going up against somebody like
bron Agle, who like, look, this isn't this isn't like flash in
the pan. To get here,bron Agle had to beat Timothy Young twice
about twice, I mean he beathim twice. Who Timothy Young was Vera's

(01:20:49):
runner up last year at Final Xand then he had to beat Rich Carlton
and Rich Carlson. It's fantastic.He's super strong, he's got he's one
of very few from like like upperweights from the United States where you look
at and you're like, man,like you could picture him being from Sweden,

(01:21:11):
you know, like he's got thatkind of style and like Zach Brown,
Eagle went and beat Carlson twice.I mean, he's the clear,
the clear guy here. I don'tknow what else to say about it.
I just it's just how it unfolded. Is it's tough because we like Allen
a lot, and you know,you don't want to see stuff in that

(01:21:33):
way. But I just I don'twant to hear that it was the Neco
loan or something, because that's that'sgonna that just it rubs me the wrong
way, because, like I said, then credit goes lebron his physical approach
and for causing it to become moreof a problem and a problem enough to
where that helps seal the deal.I mean, it wasn't that alone,

(01:21:56):
because you know, if it were, then he went to live to fight
another day after that first period inmatch too. So no, it's tough.
You know for the neat party isthat he offered to help help him
out. You know that that showsthe character of Alan and you know he
just wants to help help, youknow, in medals, you know,

(01:22:18):
I take it you should take themup and try and get them out there
and keep them on. Yeah,I think they would probably bring Alan up
for It's tough to figure because theygot Lithuania and then they got hungry,
and then they're gonna come back,So I don't know. I mean,
I'll let the people get paid tomake those decisions, make that decision.

(01:22:41):
But um, anyway, so thatwas final X And now they're in Lithuania
and here we go, Here wego, qualifying Worlds. You wake up
tomorrow morning, it's going to bea day one of the Worlds. I
got it. Hopefully this week they'refixing a lot of problems over there,

(01:23:04):
and you know, the guys aregrabbing the formers. You know, I
know a lot of times guys don'twant to grab them, but That's that's
why you figure yourself out. Yeah, you get fig enough, eventually you
figure it out. Okay, Sothat closes the book on the first segment,

(01:23:28):
which obviously featured three twenty and twentythree US World Team members in weight
class order. That's Brady Koontz,Eldor Halfstoff, and Zach Broun Eagle,
and it was their audio clips whichwere recorded just for this episode. And
we still have one more and thatis going to be United States Greco Roman

(01:23:48):
General Manager Justin Ruiz, who Iwant to save for the last segment just
because he's the GM, and Ifigure we'll kind of create a little bit
of a separation there, and soright away we'll start. And this is
Ruiz's take perception on Final X andNORC, just how the event went down
and what he thought of it.Yeah, I mean, I I thought

(01:24:10):
everything went off pretty well. Ithought the presentation was good. There was
a good crowd there, there wasgood energy in the venue, and the
matches were great. So I thinkoverall it was just a good entertaining it.
It's like a good event, youknow, it was like entertaining.
I thought the guys came out andwrestled hard, put points on the board,
and made it fun for fans towatch. So it was it was
just a good, good experience,ha ha ha. And you know what

(01:24:33):
it really was, Final x NORCwas awesome. The presentation in person was
awesome. Place was loud, andI was talking to someone who works at
the arena and they were telling me, like, you know, somebody who's
been working there basically since it opened, I guess, And they were telling
me about the design of the placeand how, and I imagine this isn't
uncommon, but they were telling mehow it was designed just so it would

(01:24:57):
be extra loud. And that's becausethe New Jersey Devil's played there. The
Nets played there before moving to Brooklyn. I think Seaton Hall plays there.
So for those kinds of sports youwanted to be allowed environment. And yeah,
so I had only been there twicebefore I had moved out of the
area. I think either right afterit opened or whatever. Anyway, i'd

(01:25:19):
only been there twice. I wentthere for a UFC one time, and
back in I don't know. Someyears ago, we took our daughter there
to see the poisonous secular right ofpassage known as frozen on ice. Yep,
nobody cares what you're talking about tohim. But anyway, Finlex Nork
was great and I couldn't agree morewith him. But now we move on,

(01:25:41):
and this is about the number ofmatch threes from Finlex North for Greco,
and there were four match threes.There were supposed to be five,
but Braun Aigle and Vera didn't godo a third match. And the question
that Justin was basically like, well, what do you think that says we
haven't had that they match the reasona while for our trials, and so

(01:26:03):
that kind of says something about thecompetitive level. Um. I think I
think it shows that everybody's hungry.Everybody wants to win, you know,
like I think guys if they've ifthey've you know, they're going out and
battling. And if somebody's lost thematch, they're not just laying down and
you know, given up. They'regoing out and they're battling. That's not

(01:26:25):
to say that the guys if ifit only went two matches, that they
weren't fighting just as hard. ButI think it just shows that it's competitive.
You got some guys that are reallyhungry for that top spot, and
so I think that's I think that'sgood for the sport. What also helped
is that all four match threes werepretty tight. Coon's needed a big move
in period two of match three,come away victorious seven to four front headlock.

(01:26:50):
I believe there you go. That'snot a wide march in seven to
four. And it was also thrillingbecause it's late in the second period.
Sixty kilograms was obviously super tight andtense and everything else, and then you
know, hey, maybe this waspart of the plan, but the officials
shore ratchet up the tension with thewanna be cautions towards the end. So

(01:27:13):
sixty was tight. Seventy two kilogramsbetween Patrick Smith and Justice Scott, Yeah,
that was still competitive. Match three, Yeah, eighty two Woods and
Epps. That was a tale oftwo different matches Match one and two and
then all of a sudden Match three. Woods kind of got what he needed
early on and just they bogged itdown a little bit and forced Epps into

(01:27:34):
desperation mode and whatever. But yeah, the match trees were they weren't blowouts,
that's for sure. So that helps. That all helps, and we
keep going here. Here is justinRuiz talking about the Lithuania trip right now,
and we're on June twenty five,so there's only a few more days
of training left for the guys whoare over there and the US guys who
are in Lithuania are koon's il Darand Braun Eagle, three of whom just

(01:28:00):
feature on this very episode. Theone and only Kamal Bay is there,
and we're actually going to do somethingwith Kamal Very shortly, ot R on
the record and Muscle Mike Altimer fundedhimself brought himself over there. Mike Altimer
he qualified for the U twenty Worldsby winning the U twenty Trials. He

(01:28:21):
also won the U twenty three Trials. I don't know for sure if he's
going to be going to that ornot. I don't Maybe he is,
see what the procedures that spot cango to Braun Egles since he is US
national team member, world team member, and if braun Egle wants that spot
at eighty seven, he can haveit, But I don't know if he's

(01:28:43):
going to take it or not.If he does, then then what you
do is you call Muscle Mike theU twenty three national champion. And that's
how they got around that procedure wise. But let's kick it back to Justin
who is talking about how he wantsthe athletes who approach their training in Lithuania
leading up to the Hungarian Grand Prix, their competitive mindset and what he wants

(01:29:05):
them to bring back home with themattitude wise, skill wise and everything else.
Yeah, I mean, I thinkideally just having more experience over there,
getting more matt time, more looks, especially in part tre get things
figured out. I mean, ideallyyou want them to come back with things
to work on that they can focuson in the room, but also like

(01:29:28):
to him come back after having someconfidence, you know, like if they're
able to stay in the fight therewith some guys or you know, score
points be guys in practice, andthen just hold onto those high points to
carry him through the summer and justlook for to net competition. Just having
that belief in themselves. It's like, yeah, you know, whoever I'm
wrestling puts their pants on the sameway, one leg at a time like

(01:29:51):
everybody else does. And just havingthat confidence that they can win at the
international level. So I'd say thoseare the two big things. Just some
definite where they can improve and thenalso coming back with some confidence that they
can compete at the world level.All right, and there you have it.
That's where we talking about training inLithuania leading up to Hungary coming back,

(01:30:12):
and that's the summer training cycle.There you go. It's going to
start quickly and then we'll see hopefullyeverybody can stay healthy throughout the summer.
Let's get to some notes, closingthoughts news. I have paper here,
Let's see here, Let's see whatare my notes. I figure there's shout

(01:30:32):
outs in order. Well, thereis a shout out in order to Jamal
Johnson, my good friend who Ilove, who just qualified for the Beach
Wrestling World Games. Let's see righthere. I'm just like, I feel
like almost compelled to make a snarkycomment, but I will I will not

(01:30:53):
because I love Jamel. I justthis Beach World Games. I don't know.
Why is it the World Games WorldChampionships? How do you had?
He? Well, then again,the military has the Military World Games?
Right? This ism Military World Games. Anyway, here you go Jamal Johnson.
He won at seventy kilograms. Hehad won the nationals already, I
think right after the World team trialsfor Greco. I'm not mistaken, but

(01:31:15):
yeah, he beat Mitchell Cook.An athlete, a fine athlete likely,
but I don't know. Mitchell Cooknot familiar so much at least done off
hand. And Jamel needed three matchesto do this. He won the first
round three to two, lost inmatch two, and then one in match

(01:31:40):
s three, apparently through the guyreally big or something in match street.
I don't know, I haven't seenit, didn't watch it and whatever,
but I love Jamal, so I'mhappy for him, really am. And
yeah, so Jamal going to bewrestling in sand. That's his second career.
Looks like wrestling in the sand.Maybe we'll do something have him on

(01:32:01):
to kind of go over some ofthis and just to talk Greco anyway,
because he was awesome the last twotimes he was on. And then we
had the U seventeen Greco Roman PanAm Championships and the United States came away
with four gold medals. Is justa few days ago. We're recording on
June twenty five, So here yougo. Four gold medalists. Henry as

(01:32:24):
Lakian forty five kilograms, Lincoln Sledzianowskiforty eight kilos, Vince Buzakis all right,
seventy one kilos and Nicholas Sahakian atone ten Saha Kien. That is
an interesting last name if you followsenior International Greco because wrestling for Poland is
greg Or Sahakian and he's a twotime bronze miles sixty three kilograms. Now

(01:32:45):
you obviously wrestle sixty seven and they'rekind of a mess over there in Poland
with those way classes right now atthe moment. But nevertheless, US had
ten medalists. They've done that before, so they have four golds and silver
medalists. They had another four,so Lajah Cortez fifty five kilos, Adam

(01:33:08):
Waters eighty eight and Cooley ninety twokilos okay. That's three athletes and then
three athletes with bronze. Zarkintania atfifty one, Sam Harring Okay sixty kilos,
and Gabriel I'm gonna mess this lastname up. Hardcore boosts Booie Sue

(01:33:29):
Buasu bouy Ssou sixty five kilos atthe US one the team title over Mexico
with two hundred and five points toMexico's one ninety four. Peru right behind
Mexico one oh three and congratulations tothese fine young gentlemen, except for I
would caution them and everyone else.Hey, stick with Greco. Okay,

(01:33:53):
I know you're wrestling freestyle if youhaven't already. I think the rosters stay
the same, don't they for theage group PanAm or they tend to,
don't I don't know. I onlylook at Greco and yeah, I'm gonna
go ahead and be willing to bethere that all of these athletes who I
just mentioned are prospects for college andhey, that's okay. Just don't forget

(01:34:18):
about us over here. That's all. See, if we can read,
everybody thinks it's about recruitment for GrecoRoman, and it's not. It's about
retention in the United States. Alwaysremember that. Okay, if you want
proof, look at Fargo. Fargobrackets for Greco and Cadet and Junior.
They're packed, packed, packed.Now imagine just keeping a fraction of all

(01:34:43):
of those who come out for Fargo, Greco and both age groups. See
you see what I'm talking about here. Everybody thinks it's recruitment. No,
we need to keep those who evenbother to try. And so anyway,
I don't want to go tangential onthat right now, I want to move
on and move on. I willwith social media concerns, Okay, to

(01:35:04):
follow Zach bron Eagle, I'm justgoing with the Instagram's guys. To follow
Zach bron Eagle, it is atbron Agle. That's nice and easy,
at b r A U n Ag e L. To follow Ildar that
is at halfees Off Fildar h Af I z O v I L d
a R. And you follow BradyKoons on Instagram as well at Brady Underscore

(01:35:29):
Koontz k O O n t Z. We'll go with Hall's social media handles.
He's actually starting to grow a littlebit. It looks like with some
of this, believe it or notso. Hall on Instagram, World Gold
Wrestling that's his home base. That'shis home club, World Gold Wrestling and
Twitter. Twitter the source of manyjokes throughout the last bunch of episodes.

(01:35:57):
Hall on Twitter. Yeah at usall WGW and for USA Greclond Roman news
and athlete perspectives, please go tofive point news dot com and as always,
follow along on Twitter at five thenumber five P two movie. That's
it for episode fifty five. Everybody, thanks for listening, and we'll see
you soon.