FKN Classics Double Feat! | Preston Dennett - Cryptid Encounters | Wayne McRoy - Cosmic Pandemic - Forbidden Knowledge News

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
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Speaker 2 (00:40):
Today.

Speaker 1 (00:40):
I want to welcome back to the show Preston Dinnitt.
He first began investigating UFOs in nineteen eighty six after
learning his family, friends, and coworkers were having encounters. Since then,
he's interviewed hundreds of people and investigated a wide variety
of cases. He's written over twenty nine books and more

(01:01):
than one hundred articles about UFOs and the pair normal.
He is a frequent guest on radio and TV, and
speaks across the United States. Preston, welcome back. How you doing.

Speaker 2 (01:14):
I'm doing good, Chris doing pretty well. How are you?

Speaker 1 (01:18):
I'm excellent. It's great to have you back. I'm very
much looking forward to the upcoming event that we're going
to be a part of May fifteen through twentieth, the
Befriending Bigfoot Excursion in Blairsville, Georgia. This is put on
buy our friend Brandon Thomas of Expanding Reality, and everyone
listening should go to the website expandingrealitypodcast dot com slash

(01:42):
events to find out more about all of this and
get your tickets. We're looking forward to this. It's going
to be a good time. And today we have Preston.
I wanted to get your insights, Preston, and thoughts about
the high strangeness surrounding Bigfoot and other cryptis that seemed
to have profound connections to extraterrestrial phenomena based on all

(02:07):
of the eyewitnesses and experiences that people have been reporting
on this show. So it's pretty incredible how this could
possibly connect. We're going to get into that, but before
we do, it's been a little while since you've been on.
Remind the audience a little bit about yourself and your work.

Speaker 2 (02:24):
Oh gosh, Well, yeah, I've been in this field of
UFOs and the paranormal and cryptozoology for a pretty long time.
I got involved in nineteen eighty six, when I found
out that my family, co workers and friends were having
experiences and not just UFOs but all kinds of paranormal stuff.

(02:46):
Became a move on and field investigator. A year or
two later, started writing articles, reading every book I could find,
joining every organization, and it just kind of snowballed from there.
I wrote articles for about ten years doing research, put
out my first book in nineteen ninety six, and been

(03:07):
putting out pretty much one per year since then, mostly
on UFOs, but a couple on Bigfoot, one on levitation,
some on ghosts. Talk about the experiences, I mean, you
name it, I've explored it certainly. So yeah, I mean,
as you know that all these subjects are connected to

(03:29):
some degree. Just this field has got rabbit hole after
rabbit hole and layers and layers to it. So it's
endlessly fascinating.

Speaker 1 (03:40):
Just and that's what keeps me going is it seems
the more I learn, the less I really know about this,
and there's always another layer to peel through to try
and understand what's going on. Now. I understand you've had
some personal experiences with Bigfoot. I'd love to hear about them.

Speaker 2 (03:59):
Yeah, you know, Bigfoot was one of the subjects I
really resisted jumping into because I had explored ghosts and
you know, life after death and the OBEs and levitation.
But I'm like, gosh, bigfoot. That sounds like a can
of worms to me. I have a sneaking suspicion it's real,
because you would hear a lot of reports. I'm not

(04:21):
going to go there yet. I'm not ready. And at
one point I had to because I had a taste
come to my way involving a gentleman who had a
ufo land in his backyard. The next day a bigfoot
showed up, and that was followed by a sort of
outbreak of poltergeist activity, and that's how I got pulled

(04:44):
into researching Bigfoot. Very quickly found out of course, it's real,
as I suspected, and I mean, the evidence is overwhelming,
absolutely conclusive. It's not just hearsay and eyewitness testimony. The
foot prince, and I mean, it just goes on as
you know. I'm sure. And I eventually did have my

(05:07):
own experiences because I'm the kind of researcher who well,
I love to interview people and read books about it,
and I do I want to see it. I want
to experience it myself, because you can then move from
belief to experiential knowledge, you know. And I so wanted

(05:27):
that bigfoot just didn't seem like a possibility because I
lived pretty much in La So I found out there's
a lot of bigfoot in the La National Forest. It's
a huge hotspot. I found that out with that first case,
which was in Kenyon Country bordering the La National Forest,

(05:49):
which has like a half million acres, so it's a
pretty wild area. And then I got another report from
a lady who lived on the other side and acted
on the north side of the La National Forest. And
mind you, this is just I mean, she was maybe
two or three miles off a major freeway, the fourteen Freeway,

(06:11):
which is you know, basically the five Freeway running up
through California, and she's like, I'm having big foot encounters.
She's a contact tee as well, so there was that
weird connection again. And I'm like, well, what do you
mean you're having a big foot encounters? She says, well,
you know, I think you know, she felt like she

(06:32):
was in telepathic contact with it and it was really
showing itself to her. She could hear it, she could
smell it. She saw it face to face a couple
of times. Probably the most dramatic time was she was
in her home and looked outside and saw it, and

(06:54):
so did her roommate. It came right up to his
window and looked at it, and so did her son,
who was like five years old. He's like, my mom,
the monkey man was in the tree. So I went
over there and I saw the tree. It cracked a
branch about this thick. I saw alleged footprints. I mean,
you couldn't really see them, but they were depressions in
the ground. And so she had multiple witnesses, is what

(07:18):
I'm saying. It's not just her saying this, and she
had experience after experience. She could hear it screaming that
would drive the animals crazy in her neighborhood. There was
lots of horses around there. She said, it would scream
like a woman being murdered. Egh pitched out in the wash.
By this point, I had many books on the subject,

(07:39):
and this is what really got me to dive deeper
into it. I'm like, yeah, they do that. They also
are really well known for throwing rocks at people. She
woke up one night to hearing this thump on the roof.
She's like, oh gosh, what's it doing? And she didn't
want to go outside. And when she woke up in

(07:59):
the morning there was a bold, a large boulder on
her roof. It took three men to get it off.
She's like, that big quot is, what did it? I'm like, yeah, probably.
She's like, I know where it lives. I can show
you where it lives because I'm didn't tell about the
contact with it. I know it lives in these caverns
or caves down in this valley here, not far from

(08:20):
my house. Would you come up and we can take
a look. Of course, you know. She was a good friend.
She now lives in Australia. Still in touch with her.
She doesn't want her real name to be used, so
I call her Wendy. But I drove up to her
house and it was towards evening and she's like, yeah,

(08:41):
let's go. So we packed up all our camera and
sound equipment and drove down this dirt road near her house.
It was about two or three miles from her house,
but deeper into the forest and it was a little
dirt road by the time we got to it, and
there's there's this very steep valley mark canyon, I guess

(09:04):
would be a better way to describe it. And rising
up to this really steep mountain, I mean forty five
degree angle, covered thick with brush which was probably, I
don't know, eight feet thick. And I was like, well, gosh,
She's like, this is where it lives. I'm telling you,
it's coming from here. I don't know how far deep

(09:24):
down this canyon it goes. This is where it's coming
out from. And it was just dusk when we arrived,
so the stars were not quite out yet but just
starting to come out. And I was driving. I pulled
the car over on the stirt road and she's pointing.
She's like, it lives over there. I'm like, okay, well,
let's get out our equipment. And I mean, we had

(09:47):
just arrived, right, And I got out of the driver's
seat and I stood in front of the car, and
I was just surveilling the scene, like, Okay, there's the canyon,
there's her house several miles this way, and here's just
just looking around. And she went got out of the
right passenger side and opened the back seat and was

(10:09):
pulling out the sound equipment and the camera equipment, and
that's when something roared really loud, and honestly, it was
so loud I couldn't believe it that I thought maybe
there was a jet or a plane coming overhead. There wasn't,
because I looked up and there was nothing there. But

(10:31):
this ror was just sweeping over you for about twenty
thirty seconds. Now I knew instantly this wasn't a bear.
I've got every book on bears, I watch all the
bear shows. I love bears. I've been to the zoo.
I heard a lion roar right next to me. I
knew it wasn't that. As a kid, we grew up

(10:54):
next to cougars. A guy had pet cougar's in a cage,
and I would hear that thing roaring all the time.
Knew it wasn't that. So this was something that had
a multi tonal qualities to it, which some high pitch,
some really low almost sub I'm not sure what the

(11:15):
word is, but really deep levels that you are almost
beyond your level of hearing. I mean it was rumbling
in your chest.

Speaker 1 (11:24):
Yeah, I've heard that, and I've heard that they can
mimic the sound of a baby crying. Have you heard
this before.

Speaker 2 (11:30):
Yeah, they do whistles. If you look into primates terrifying.
They can make all kinds of sounds that are They're
really good at it. And I'm like okay, and it stopped,
and Wendy looks at me, and she is white. She
is petrified because she tells me, you know, I'm afraid
this thing is trying to kidnap me. I'm like Wendy

(11:52):
that they don't do that. Of course I later found
out they do. There are a number of cases of
big foot kidnapping. Yeah, I mean not just a few.
There's twenty thirty well documented cases of men and women
and children and babies, and this does happen.

Speaker 1 (12:11):
I'm going to have to hear about some of these.
Have in any of these cases, do these people go
permanently missing?

Speaker 2 (12:19):
Well, it's hard to say for sure, because yeah, there's
a lot of people do go permanently missing in national
parks and areas of high big foot activity. But twenty
or thirty have you know, escaped or come back or
were let go. Albert Austman is a very well known
case of a gentleman who says he was picked up
and basically, I don't want to say held captive. But yeah,

(12:42):
there's another case of a Native American woman. There's a
case involving two men who are out hunting and a
big foot came running up, grabbed him and carried him
off into the wilderness for you know, four or mile
before dropping them off. I mean, there's case after case
after case of this well known in Native American oral
tradition that they would lift the tp up and steal babies.

(13:06):
So this is nothing new to anyone who's done their
bigfoot research. I was still a little bit new to
it at the time.

Speaker 1 (13:14):
That's interesting. So do you think that just like us humans,
there are bad Bigfoot and good Bigfoot, and some that
may not have good intentions towards humans and some that do.
What do you think.

Speaker 2 (13:29):
I'm not going to go as far as to sit
that Bigfoot is evil, because if you go through the
literature and boy have I there's one or two cases
where people have been quote viciously attacked. I think there's
one possible case of people being killed, which was very
early on and appears to be completely legitimate, but it

(13:51):
can be very hostile and very scary. There's a case
in California where people are in their cabin and it
ransacked the cabin. Chase them out, and if you go
into its territory, it can be very territorial, and we'll
throw rocks right at your head, missing it by that much.
I mean, they're very good at throwing very large rocks,

(14:13):
and they can scare the daylights out of you. They
seem to have. This gets into the paranormal aspect of it,
and I'm a big believer in this because I've heard
personal accounts and I've read quite a bit. It's apparent
that they can telepathically link up with you and impose
fear in a way that you can walk, be fine,

(14:35):
and then suddenly just this dread comes over you. People
you know, person after a person describes this and it's
so bad they can't take another step. I mean, they're
paralyzed with fear for no apparent reason. So it's more
than just well, gosh, I heard something stepping around and
they can make sounds and you don't see them. They

(14:55):
have the ability. This is my assessment based on multiple
cases people I've talked to personally to turn invisible, and
I mean they're very psychic.

Speaker 1 (15:05):
Is it that they're turning invisible? Are they changing our
perception or are they somehow changing their molecular structure. What
do you think is happening there.

Speaker 2 (15:15):
I don't think they're changing their molecular structure. I'm not
sure that they're imposing any hallucinations on a person so
much as slipping into the fourth dimension. And if you
look into it, quote invisibility, it's connected to levitation. By
the way, there are several accounts of people that we

(15:37):
would call saints or Yogi's or enlightened masters who have
achieved that ability to turn invisible and they appear and
levitate and teleport. This is a psychic ability. This is
a natural you know, we call it supernatural paranormal, but
that's just because we don't understand it. But we can

(15:59):
do this, and so can they. Any entity who's psychically
evolved has the ability to do all of these things,
whether it's precognition or healing, or after projection or remote feeling,
or levitation or invisibility. So I don't want to say
that they're shape shifting or anything like this, even though
there are accounts of that. I don't know, but it's

(16:22):
apparent to me that they're very psychically evolved, have been
around forever as long as we have on this planet.
There's been a lot of speculation there, ets and so forth.
But let me just go backpedal here a little bit
and complete my own encounter. Yeah, to the end of that,

(16:43):
because you know, Wendy's there, She's white as a sheet.
She's like, oh my god, did you I'm like, what
do you mean? Did I hear that? She's like, it's here.
I'm like, yeah, I think it is, but I was trying.
I'm like, where the heck is it? Because this sounded
close and then the darn thing roared again, and then
you know what, I can kind of triangulate it because
I'm like, oh my gosh, you know, turning my head.
It was down in that bully or canyon which went

(17:07):
straight down and then straight back up. But it was close.
I mean, I'm gonna say three hundred yards about one
thousand feet away, maybe less. By this point, it's pretty
dark in that gold I mean you can't really see anything,
but it was close. And when it roared that second

(17:28):
time again, like thirty seconds long, which is such an
experience because it waves over you, you know, and you're
getting chills, like, wow, that's different. And I go running
towards it because I want to see it, and she
when I did that, Wendy lost her mind.

Speaker 3 (17:47):
What are you doing?

Speaker 2 (17:48):
We're leaving now, stop get back? What are you doing?
And she, I mean, she was hysterical, and I really
wanted to see it. For whatever reason, stupid or not,
I wasn't. I don't have fear of this whatever. You know,
what better way to die than being assaulted by a
big but I don't. I've had out of my experience

(18:11):
because I know there's life after death. I wanted to
see it. Yeah, but she had completely lost her mind.
Now she says it roared three times. At that point,
I was pretty much trained myself to be a trained
observer and make note of everything I experienced, so I'm
pretty sure it was twice. Maybe she's right, because I

(18:34):
was distracted by her screaming. And by that point, I
mean she had thrown the equipment back in the car,
slammed it within the front seat, and screaming at me
from the window. We get in here now. So I
had to okay, you know, whatever you want to call it, pitulate,

(18:55):
I eat her and just said okay, I'm fine, and
I walked. We'll walk very quickly back to the car
because she was really afraid, and we drove off, and
that was my first one. I would later have another encounter,
but man, oh man, oh man, she that was something
I will never forget. I heard. I'm absolutely one convinced

(19:18):
I heard a big foot. And yeah, I think. I
think they're all over the place. I mean, we know this.
They're in every state pretty much all every area around
the world has their own name for it, even you know, Australia, Russia, Africa.
They're different, you know, some describing it as being very

(19:40):
much human, like Chromagnon or Neanderthal. I'm not sure they
ever went extinct. I'm really not, because.

Speaker 1 (19:49):
They seem to have profound connections to what we are
in certain ways. But it's like, because we have evolved
in a different way with technology and the material world,
and we have pretty much lost a lot of our
connection to what these beings are still connected to and

(20:11):
always have been. So I think that there's something that
is a connection to what we are there. They're more
human than we than we realize.

Speaker 2 (20:21):
Basically, I think they're absolutely sentient, intelligent. They might not
many reports of them using a language. We don't have
reports of them, you know, basically using tools and building houses.
There's big foot nests, of course, but yeah, some people
who have had pounds described their face looks human, though

(20:41):
perhaps with some attributes that are towards no cmates but
one sentient but different. There's so many variations. I mean,
there's the Sasquatch in northern California, which can get up
to twelve feet in some of these reports, I think
it's hard to estimate sometimes because there are people who

(21:02):
say it's even taller than that. I'm not so sure, but.

Speaker 1 (21:06):
Yeah, I've heard people say that they've seen them up
to fifteen foot are more hard to imagine, but there.

Speaker 2 (21:14):
Are giants, you know, in the history of our planet. Yeah,
that's absolutely something I don't think we can fully discount.
But having interviewed a lot of people who you know,
describe UFOs and it was like one hundred feet over
her head and you go there and you're looking, well,
it's probably closer to three hundred. Estimating something that you
don't know how far away it is or how big

(21:35):
it is is very difficult. But there are so many
accounts of these things and absolutely very human looking in
some and people say, well, how can this possibly be?
You know, where are the bodies? How Come no one's
ever been able to produce a body? Well, if you

(21:57):
look into that they have and they are off. I mean,
this evidence is snatched up in the same manner that
UFO evidence is, and you can trace a lot of
these to the Smithsonian Museum or various private collectors. But
there there's a case after case of people who've you know,
gotten hold of a big foot body there. And the

(22:19):
evidence is more more than just footprints. I mean, of
course there's the bigfoot nests, there's scat and hair samples,
there's a lot of genetic testing, and there's all kinds
of really unusual genetics going on here. The problem being
we don't have a baseline, we don't have a lot
of that. Well, we know this is a sasquatch, So

(22:43):
it's really that's where I think there's a lot of questioning.

Speaker 1 (22:47):
And there seemingly also a known cover up. I've heard
of the quote unquote big footmen in black, these shady
gentlemen that show up after people have an ex experience
and either tell them that they saw a bear or
that not to talk about these things. And like you said,
I've heard of people who actually have discovered bigfoot bodies,

(23:10):
but soon after someone or something comes in and does
a cleanup and it's all it disappears. Have you heard
about this, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (23:20):
To some extent, I haven't really heard that term big
footmen in black, but yeah, there's no doubt a cover
up and if you look.

Speaker 1 (23:27):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (23:28):
I was big into anthropology in college, and it was
really interesting because they never really mentioned bigfoot, of course,
which is surprising to me because it's a big part
of what anthropology should be. But they certainly was controversies
all over the place about our own origins. They kept
pushing the age of modern humans back each year that

(23:51):
I was in college. It's like, by the time I
finished college, they're like, well, it's at least or forty thousand. No. No,
of course, if you read like gosh, what's that guy's name?
Forbidden Archaeology by Michael Kremo, Yeah, oh man, that was
a wake up calm. This is the book that they
should be teaching in college, because you'll see that evidence

(24:12):
that doesn't fit the mainstream theory is tossed or covered up,
and it's ridiculous. That's not true science. I was horrified
by the time I finished college, like, well, these guys
are not doing science in a legitimate way and to
ignore the account.

Speaker 1 (24:31):
Well, that's becoming more and more apparent, and I'm grateful
that more people are starting to see what you just
said is very true. So that's encouraging what we're experiencing. Now.
Now I want to hear about your other bigfoot encounter.

Speaker 2 (24:46):
All right, this one is a little less dramatic, but
certainly thrilling for me. I had decided. You know, my
brother and his best friend, my brother Steve and his
best friend Neil, love to go hiking and mountain biking,
and we're always doing and we're dragging me along because
I loved it too, not as much as them. They
do one hundred mile biking, and when they start doing that,

(25:08):
I'm like, okay, I'm stopping. This is too much for me.
But you know, in La there's I think it's Mount Baldy, Yeah,
Mount Baldy. No, it's Mount Baldy, which is just outside
of La Beautiful area. And people don't realize how much
wilderness there is around us. We're largely as humanity, you know,

(25:30):
lives very clustered in cities and coastlines. Most of Earth
is still wilderness, it really is. And there's this huge
wilderness area you have to drive about an hour outside
of quote LA, the megalopolis of La, and there's Mount
Baldy and it's got this beautiful river and all these

(25:55):
trails that lead up. Of course, then being that crazy
backpacker hikers they are, they want to go on the
less used, you know, higher peaks that nobody goes to.
Like fine, I nearly died and I actually they took
me on a trail that was this why and it
was a cliff. I was terrific. I was so mad

(26:15):
at them, Like Neil in particulars like it's see easy,
there's no cliffs because he had done this. I'm fine
as long as there's no cliffs. There was a cliff
and it was a mile long trail Chris crossing up
the mountain that I had nightmares afterwards. You know, I
don't have fear of heights until that I did that.
I'm so mad. It was my birthday. I'm like, I'm
gonna die on my birthday. Okay, but that's another hure.

(26:39):
There people die in that mountain every year. I looked
it up. I'm like I told you guys, this is
like it's not yeah, two or three people die every
year they get lost. It's a huge wilderness area. Really
beautiful though, and pretty crowded at the base, but not
at all once you get up towards these trails that
people don't take because you'd have to be mad man

(27:00):
to do it, and they're crazy. My brother and you know,
and they took me there. But before you know, there's
the ranger station. You have to get your little tags
and stuff to park and so forth. And I looked
and like, oh, yeah, there's big foot here. There's several accounts.
I'm like, go oh, I'm going to keep an eye
out because you never know. And we, you know, you

(27:22):
reach a point of the trail where everyone else stops
and turns around. Of course we're not. We're gonna go up.
We're like six or seven thousand feet at this point,
and I'm like huffing him, pop, oh, oh gosh, we
need to reach the eight thousand foot peak. There's nobody there,
just us. Everyone stopped about three or four miles back,

(27:44):
and I couldn't make it because there was one more
mile to the peak and I'm just out of breath.
This is too hard for me. I'm like, I'm gonna
stay here, or I'll keep walking, and you guys can
go on, come on, come on, just keep walking. I'm like,
I'll keep walking. But I wasn't really, I was just
kind of stepping very slowly because I'm not gonna do

(28:07):
this if it's unpleasant, you know, why am I doing this?
So off they went and my brother, because Neil is
the crazy one. He hikes like I'm crazy, man, He's
got all this energy. My brother had gone a little
bit farther and he starts doing wood knocking. Now, if
you watch Bigfoot shows, he doesn't believe in Bigfoot, and

(28:29):
neither they don't believe those their skeptics. But if you
watch these shows, you know Bigfoot does well, you know,
knocking on trees with sticks. Tom, that's one of the
ways they communicate. And my brother was doing this. Uh
you know, I thought, you know, I didn't see him
doing it, but he went around the trail and I

(28:50):
could hear him and he's throwing these rocks at trees
and knocking on the tree. I'm like, oh, you know this,
And I thought myself, this is how you communicate with Bigfoot.
And right after he does this, you know, there's worth
the top of the mountain. It goes down into absolute
wilderness on the other side, no people there. I heard

(29:11):
a response, knock, knock, knock knock. He did it, knock knock, clock, knock, knock, knock, knock.
I'm like, oh, and I mean this is you know,
my assessment thing was that, yeah, this is something foot responding.
That's what it sounded like to me. I didn't tell
them because, yeah, you know, I already looked like a

(29:32):
crazy man to them with the UFOs and the bigfoot
and odd about experiences and all the stuff that I'm
you know, already known for. So I didn't go there
with them. But I did do my research and found
several bigfoot encounters in that exact area.

Speaker 1 (29:51):
I want to get your insights into the other side
of these experiences, in these encounters where people are seemingly
forming relationships with these beings. I heard that there are
some groups of researchers that have actually not only made contact,

(30:12):
but still make frequent contact. I don't remember the guests
that was telling me about this, but there is apparently
this clandestine group of bigfoot researchers that has made contact
with a group of bigfoot in the wilderness, and they
keep it very secret and they regularly go out and

(30:35):
commune with these creatures. Have you heard anything like this?

Speaker 2 (30:39):
Certainly there's quite a few accounts, and people are very
much private about it because I think they want to
protect the bigfoot. Kawani Lapsarritis I think that's his name,
wrote a book about his own experiences which are very
spiritual and psychic and paranormal. Yeah, case after case of

(30:59):
people forming relationships are in the literature. And while yeah,
sometimes bigfoot will attack and there's people who are driving
down the road and one guy I remember, bigfoot came
up to his truck and grabbed him and tried to
pull him out, and it's like ah, and people being
chased and all kinds of pretty you know, scary, honest
to god scary stuff where they're hands down hostile, not killing,

(31:24):
not hurting, but scaring the pants off of you. But
others that are very much a relationship. One lady had
a big foot and she would put out fish and
vegetables and it would bring back animals for her. And
I know of many cases like that. There was a
case because I wrote a book about this and This

(31:45):
case sticks out in my mind where these people were
having a big foot, so they started leaving fruit on
the picnic table for it and it would take it.
And one day they forgot to do it. Well, that
bigfoot was mad. It came and started banging in their
cab and like, where's my fruit?

Speaker 1 (32:01):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (32:02):
So yeah, people, I've heard of cases where people have
been given crystals and really cool things like that, a
lot of cases where people have been rescued. One guy
had a tree fall on him and a big foot
came and lifted it off. I personally interviewed three people
who got lost in southern California, in the Julian area

(32:25):
where there's lots of a national forest there. And these
are military folks, you know, they normally don't get lost,
they're pretty used to it. Could not find their way out.
It was very foggy, and this bigfoot, you know, they
never saw it, but they could hear it walking ahead
of them, and they had this weird telepathic link. It
wants us to follow it, and it took them right

(32:47):
to a rug. Absolutely convinced to this. And a little
girl was bit by a snake. Bigfoot picked her up
and carried her to camp. There's many cases of absolutely
benevolent bigfoot and it's really a heartwarming and just the
coolest thing to know that these guys are out there

(33:09):
and they're very much linking up telepathically with people and
helping in many many cases. Some people have in their
backyard and they see them regularly. And if you look
at the photographic evidence, it's very controversial these days with
photoshop and CGI, but man, oh man, it's.

Speaker 1 (33:35):
What kind of physical evidence have you heard about? What's
some of the most profound things besides the imprints and
the footprints. And I know that they have been accounts
of hair samples being found, but what else, What other
type of physical evidence has been presented for these beings.

Speaker 2 (33:56):
Yeah, it's very much like UFOs. It's kind of circles
around whole phenomenon. I mean there's pictures and there's hair
samples and footprints. I think the footprint evidence is probably
the most widespread, you know, the most prolific, the most
convincing because there's dermal ridges and you can tell the

(34:16):
weight of something, and super hard to fake because you
can't really use the flat wood prints and make a
convincing footstep. Any anthropologists can tell pretty quickly. And another
problem with that is you know their stride length is
about double of a humans. And there's a really interesting

(34:37):
case of old cripplefoot what's the big foot's nickname, because
you could tell it had a limp and they followed it.
There were footprints that went for almost a mile right
over this barbed wire fence, which was super hard to
fake with this stride length going for so long, right
into a lake or you know, up a mountain and

(34:58):
just and the footprint evidence. I think another type of
evidence that has gotten not enough attention is bigfoot nests
because you see these out in the forest and there
are these kind of structures that are not clearly carefully built,

(35:20):
but sticks kind of like lean tos sort of, or
you can see the depressions where they're dug out or
leaves are gathered around, and bigfoot have a tendency to
snap off sticks and tops of trees, apparently as a
way of marking their territory. We don't know, of course,

(35:40):
but people who are experts in this, trackers and anthropologists
and wilderness ficionatomos have pointed out a lot of these
and it's pretty impressive when you see something you know,
a top of you know, a fifteen foot tree and
it's snapped off.

Speaker 1 (35:58):
It.

Speaker 2 (36:00):
Know, there's some really interesting bigfoot nest evidence and I
think should get a lot more attention. I don't know
if there's a book just on that type of evidence.

Speaker 1 (36:15):
Yeah, Now, going back to the high strangeness aspects for
a bit, what are some of the other occurrences that
surround bigfoot sightings that you've heard about, like orbs or
even portals UFOs that seem to coincide with the the sightings,

(36:35):
things like that.

Speaker 2 (36:38):
Yeah, there's I think you're doing a big disservice to
ignore the paranormal so called paranormal aspects of this, because
it's prominent and there's a lot of you know, kind
of disagreement or debate on all of this because some
people who are you know, not some bolts researchers just say, listen,

(37:00):
this is a primate. It's alved in the wilderness. It's
just like us, probably not that intelligent, where others are like, no, no, no,
this is a spiritual being. And I mean there are
people who go so far as to say it's intelligence
putting on different masks and masquerading and bigfoot is it
what you think it is. I don't. I'm not part

(37:23):
of either of those camps. I think we're dealing with
a being that's very much like us, intelligent, psychic, and
it's been here a very long time, and there are
case affocates where they do turn invisible. I had a
first hand case of a guy who was up in
the Trinity Alps area of northern California standing by a

(37:47):
creek when a bigfoot bunk appeared in front of him.
Didn't walk up, just blink, it was there. He's like,
really startled, and he had a telepathic conversation with it
and said, yes, I can turn invisible. Watch this blank.
There was a female Bigfoot and a baby Bigfoot, a
Bigfoot family. So that's what convinced me to really start

(38:09):
digging deeper into the paranormal aspect of it. Because the
lady Wendy who She's like, I'm telling you, it's in
contact with me, and I'm like, I know, I believe you,
because she had proven to me that she was legit
in terms of her UFO experiences and psychic abilities. I
mean we hung out and stuff would happen. She was

(38:31):
for real.

Speaker 1 (38:32):
So based on a lot of the experiences from people
who had interactions or encounters with what they understand is Bigfoot.
There seems to also be these other intelligences out there,
entities that could be, like you were describing, some sort

(38:54):
of trickster that can shape shift into different entities. Because
this has been reported quite often. And then you have
the stories of things like dogmen, which is incredibly paranormal.
Based on a lot of the accounts that I've heard,
this being seems to be very terrifying and threatening and

(39:17):
has some of these same similar attributes as Bigfoot, can
seemingly just disappear out of nowhere and has these strange
powers at times. But what do you think is happening
with these other beings? Do you think that there are
other supernatural entities? What do you think this dog man is?

Speaker 2 (39:38):
Yeah, I resisted dog Man too, even when I got
my first face, because I thought, you know, I have
not heard of this. This lady must be misperceiving. She
was driving through I think it was Colorado or New
Mexico along the highway and she was in the backseat
of the car and saw something in the forest's looking
at it, and it was, you know, fairly far away

(39:58):
a thousand feet or so, but it stepped out and
she saw it was a dog man, like, im sure
it wasn't a big foot. She's like, listen, it had
a snout, had little ears poking up, it was standing up,
and she was about to say something when you know,
the car basically just kept driving and it was lost
of use. So she's like, well, they're not going to
believe me. I'm not saying anything. So she saw it briefly,

(40:21):
you know, ten twenty seconds or so, and she described
this to me and I'm like, well, okay, and I
put that on the back burn because I'm like this,
this is crazy. She's describing the werewolf type thing and
I'm like, I'm not And then I got another report
and this was still long before dog man had become
a thing, and that The next case was in northern California,

(40:44):
where a lady had one come right up to her
window in her cabin and she said she was face
to face with it. I'm like, are you sure this
wasn't a big foot? And she had a snout it
looked like a dog man, and I'm like okay. So
it was very scary, but didn't do anything. It just
looked at her in a way that scared her real bad,

(41:06):
and she wouldn't go outside. There were no footprints. It
was just pure, you know, her word against the world.
So that's okay, I mean, there's two What am I
going to do with this? And then it was shortly
later that I connected with Linda Godfrey, who wrote The
Beast of Bray Road and had you know, dozens of

(41:26):
accounts of this and popularized this, and that opened the
doors for other people and suddenly, okay, dog man is
having its day. There's no doubt it's real. I've since
talked to other people who had encounters and certainly read
up on it. It's there's a lot of crypto zoological creatures,
and I don't think they're paranormal. I think this is normal.

(41:50):
Paranormal is a misnomer. All it means is we lack
understanding as to how these things can disappear, or communicate
telepathically or do things. People try to say, well, maybe
Bigfoot is an alien, because I know, I mentioned I
had a Bigfoot case which was connected directly to a UFO,

(42:14):
and I would later get others and started reading. I
dug deep into that aspect because there's fifty one hundred
cases where these two and I use the word phenomena
even though that's not really correct, intersect perfectly. Where people
see a bigfoot coming out of a ufo, no kidding,
or walking into one, or Gray's and bigfoot going around together.

(42:38):
What is going on here? And I think the most
popular theory is bigfoot is an et and I entertained
that possibility for some time because it's all else can
you explain this? But here's the problem with that. In
my opinion, these bigfoot have been around forever. They've been

(42:58):
on our planet for as long as we have. We
have Native American oral traditions, indigenous people across the world,
not just Native Americans. We talk about this. It goes
way way way back. Whether it's the Yetti or the
wild man, or the bigfoot of the Sasquatch or the
Yawi or the al mass it goes way back. I'm like, okay, well,

(43:22):
and finally I'm like, well, gosh, these are intelligent beings
or intelligent beings and perhaps, and this is just my
latest assessment. When someone sees a bigfoot coming out of
a ufo or going into it, or in the same
area at the same time. Maybe they are in contact
with ets in the same way a human is, so

(43:46):
bigfoot contact teas. That's my latest assessment. That's what's going
on here.

Speaker 1 (43:52):
Or they have this multi dimensional awareness where they have
a knowing of the other beings in these and like
you said, they are connected with them and they can
interact and communicate with them. Makes perfect sense in a
different way if.

Speaker 2 (44:08):
They're telepathic, and of course with ets, are who better
to you know, why couldn't they communicate? People are like, oh,
I'd love to meet an alien. I'm like, well, you
know what you should do is go visit some dolphins.
That was another intelligent species that is very different from
us and yet clearly intelligent. Boy, when I met dolphins

(44:30):
for the first time, it was amazing. And that same lady, Wendy,
she showed me some stuff with I mean, she could
call them in. She called them in, we'd go down
to the beach and they would come for her. It
was the most amazing thing. And yeah, other experiences with that,
and she got really into that because she had these abilities,

(44:53):
and I mean we all do. No one's not psychic,
even if they don't think they are. We can I'll
do all of this. But I think that's one of
the main connections between the UFO phenomena gosh, I hate
that word, and the Bigfoot phenomena is they're both telepathic
and intelligent and psychic. Yeah, and they can connect in

(45:15):
ways that many humans are still learning how to do.

Speaker 1 (45:20):
These other beings like the dog man, seem to be
telepathic as well. I've had a few experiencers that claim
that they've been in communication with these beings, and however,
many of these experiences are terrifying, are even violent at times.
There are some very rare that claim that even some

(45:44):
dogmen are benevolent and there is a duality with the experiences.
Have you heard any of these experiences of different, maybe
more benevolent types of dogmen.

Speaker 2 (45:56):
Not a lot. It's definitely, like you say, pretty rare.
And I think part of the problem is fear. We
as humans are so fearful generally speaking of anything, and
you know, they're coming out in the dark here at night.
This is where most of the cases occur, out in
the wilderness where people are very feel vulnerable. So I

(46:18):
haven't done, you know, really done a whole lot of
research into dogmen until you know, relatively recently, I've been
hearing more and more about it. I'm like, Wow, it's
amazing to me how many crypto zoological creatures there are.
Because you know, I based my research in California and
did a book Supernatural California. I'm like, Okay, let's dive
deep to the cryptozoology of California. And of course Lake

(46:42):
Tahoe and Lake Elsinore and Lake Elizabeth and all of
these lakes have lake monsters. And if you go into
the history of the coastal California up and down, there
is one hundred percent convincing evidence. I mean, you would
have to be a die hard head in the sand

(47:03):
skeptic to say that people aren't seeing these massive sea
serpents that rise up out of the water, you know,
ten or twenty feet, this huge long neck, a giraffe
like head, eyes the size of dinner plates, a main
down at the crest of its head, and really credible

(47:26):
observers like the guy who invented the cocks fishing reel
and bandini. He was the head of the fishing club
at the time. I mean, these are really legit observers
and multiple I mean, there was a group of witnesses
who were out there off the coast of southern California
in nineteen ten or twenty and saw one of these

(47:47):
things come up out of the water and it's looking around,
and there was lots of swells that day. This darn
thing was not rising and falling with the swells, so
it had to be massive, like an iceberg in the
huns in weight, and yeah, I mean it's these things
are huge. It's not an oar fish as skeptics might

(48:10):
like to say, or a sturgeon as people like to
say that Lake Tahoe Tessie is. There are sightings of
TESSI twenty or so per year. There's no doubt there's
something in Lake Tahoe.

Speaker 1 (48:24):
This is something that even I am skeptical about that
something so large like you're saying, could be so elusive
and we don't witness it more than a handful of
people seeing this thing. Does that mean that it has
some sort of maybe supernatural abilities? What do you think?

Speaker 2 (48:49):
I don't think we can discount it. I'm gonna lean
towards no with the sea monsters because I don't know
of any written account where someone says it turned invisible
or le or even really communicated in a way. But
I think what we're dealing with is a lot more
sightings than are publicly reported, because when someone sees something

(49:11):
like this, they don't who you go to? Move on?
They don't really take those reports. Who do you go to?
The police? You know, air force? Who are you going
to tell? Only recently, you know the Bigfoot is a
different beast literally, no pun intended, because there's many organizations
with that, and there are organizations that deal with the

(49:34):
cryptozoology and seamunsters certainly, but the average person doesn't know
about it. And while Lake Tahoe does receive twenty thirty
reports per year, I bet you could times at by
ten or one hundred, because who are you going to tell?
And people are so skeptical and no one wants to
expose themselves to ridicule. So I think honestly, they're seeing

(49:55):
a lot lot more than we know. In any estimates
is how common it is are vastly underestimated. I mean,
we know this is true with UFOs, We know this.
I always ask people when I interviewed them, did you
report it? To move on? And response is always what's
move on?

Speaker 3 (50:14):
You know?

Speaker 2 (50:14):
Some people have called the police but only rarely. I
mean I've interviewed hundreds of people. I can maybe ten
report to the air force of the police or move on.
And that's especially true if it's a close up, extensive encounter. Yeah,
so ghosts, cryptozoological creatures ets are vastly underreported or underdocumented.

Speaker 1 (50:42):
Going back to the different types of possible bigfoot that
have been witnessed, I think it was Tony Merkle he
made an interesting observation based on the eyewitness testimonies that
he's heard, is that there's so many different kinds of bigfoots,
and some are more animal looking than others. Some look
like baboons, and they have a little bit of an

(51:04):
elongated snout, And he believes sometimes those types of bigfoot
are confused with dog men. But also the level of
aggression seems to coincide with how much of the animalistic
traits that these beings have. What do you think about that.

Speaker 2 (51:23):
Well, there's no doubt there's huge variation. Even in the US.
You have got the Florida Skunkape. The northern California is
a huge hotspot for the very tall sasquatch type beings.
But if you dive to the other countries. I mean,
the Australian Allies are short little things. And in Africa

(51:45):
they've got many accounts of purely wild men, you know,
people who we would probably described as chromagnon. I remember
there was there's a show Paranormal cut on camera. They
caught some foot. Some guy was biking stuff and one
of these some figure ran right in front of him.
He caught it on camera, and I think it's a

(52:07):
legit video. Hard to say for sure. I wasn't there obviously,
but man, oh man, that looked like a person, but different.
I mean, not no clothes except the loincloth, and clearly
I mean the head was wrong. I think there's all
kinds of variations going on here, and it's so interesting

(52:33):
to look into because I'm up in the Himalayas, you know,
the Tibet area and Mount Everest and all of that.
You talk to mountain climbers, but you know, Reinhold Messner
then probably most famous in the world pad encounters, and
a lot of them have described counters in our big

(52:55):
believers in the Yetti, which is completely different than a bigfoot.
So we'd like to think of ourselves as you know,
we're so intelligent and we're the primary species on this planet.
But no, we share it. We absolutely share it. And
if you catalog the bigfoot or wild man or whatever

(53:15):
you want to call it, encounters, they generally are in ridgetops,
river valleys, areas where there's lots of a big food
and water source. And you know, there's some really interesting
maps put together of all the reported sightings and it's
fascinating to see them because it's covered across the US

(53:35):
and the world where these things are appearing, and they're
all different kinds. Up in Canada, I heard it. This
is secondhand, so this is technically hearsay. This is you know,
he said, someone told me that he was told this
story from someone else, but it involved a cryptozoological humanoid

(53:56):
like a bigfoot, but it wasn't a big foot because
this thing had antlers. Oh oh wow. Yeah. I think
the Wind to Go is another Yeah, that which could
have been what they were describing. But I'd never heard
of that, and that's the closest I got to report
of that.

Speaker 1 (54:16):
Well, this gets into the skin Walker shape shifter type territory.
A lot of the strange things that occur in places
like Skinwalker Ranch, the Uintaw Basin there's a few other
places that have been discovered recently that are being studied
that have a concentration of what people are calling skin walkers.

(54:41):
What are your understanding of these things?

Speaker 2 (54:44):
They don't have much understanding of them, to be honest,
because I don't have first hand reports of it. Well,
I've looked into it. I don't know what to say
about that. Very curious. There's still a lot to learn,
and then I try to stick to what I can

(55:06):
people I can interview firsthand, And I've never interviewedd someone
firsthand who's had a quote skinwalker account. But I've talked
to people who've seen some strange stuff for sure, and
there does seem to be some weird clustering of phenomena,
for lack of a better word, hotspots. I talked to
Christopher O'Brien, who really focused on the San Luis Valley

(55:30):
of Colorado, which has an enormous amount of UFO activity,
but also strange little beings that run across the desert
floor that no one can identify, thunderbirds and Bigfoot and
all kinds of you know, religious miracles. Into Pega Canyon.
I grew up there, there's a lot of UFO activity.

(55:51):
I never saw it until I started researching it, but
there's lots of ghost activity there. And this one lady
describes seeing essentially a ghost dog, like, well, what do
you mean, what did you see? And she said this
thing looked like a dog, except it had holes for
eyes that she could see the fence post through it.

(56:12):
And this is the lady, you know, it was very
you know, very reasonable, I should say, very kind of
conservative in her thinking. She didn't want to go there.
It's like, this is what I saw. And if you
look into the history of ghost dogs, I mean in
Ireland and England and these the black dog phenomena where
people will appear before someone perhaps dies, it's this whole

(56:34):
supernatural connection there to all these different.

Speaker 1 (56:38):
There's some strange things that happen with canine type of
entities in these areas. I've heard things as strange as
these beings, these doglike creatures dissipating into dust and turning
into some type of tree or bush and then back
to a dog. So there's some very strange things happening

(57:01):
with that.

Speaker 2 (57:02):
Well, one lady, she wrote a book which I have
somewhere in my bookcase. Her name is Lunetta Woods, I forget,
don't quote me on that, but she wrote this book
about her own experiences with sas a quote shape shifting sasquatch,
and she swears that she had this thing walking around
her house and there were footprints in the snow. I

(57:23):
think that's what it's called. It would make these footprints,
and she's tracking it and the darn thing changed from
a bigfoot to deer prints, is what she said. And
it seems to be a legit book. I mean, she
seems very sincere about it, and there's enough accounts where
I'm like, these definitely deserve to be considered at the

(57:46):
very least. So I think there's a lot more going
on than people realize. We can see this in the
UFO field with people struggling and saying, well, maybe not
all of these are ET's, and I'll agree with that
some are, you know, Jacques Vallet is like, I don't
know if any of this is et I'm not going there.
I think you've got a pretty good handle that most

(58:09):
I think of what people are describing as et are
et s, and Bigfoot is bigfoot, and dog man is
probably dog man, and a near death experience is exactly
what it appears to be. While these all do have
really interesting commonalities and bleed throughs and connections, and because
someone might have a near death experience and boom, they

(58:31):
start having et experiences because they're or it can open
you up psychically and you start having medium ship and
seeing ghosts and shadow people, and so all these things
might come as an avalanche all at once and give
people a tendency to lump them together.

Speaker 1 (58:50):
Based on your research, what do you think is happening?
It seems like there is an awakening happening right now.
People are becoming more aware of a lot of this stuff,
at least more curious about it, and it seems like
people are even having more experiences. And I want to
get your thoughts on that. Do you think people are

(59:10):
becoming more open to this and having more experiences? Do
you think they always have and they're just now coming
out and feeling like they can talk about it because
of everything else that's happening. What do you think is
going on right now?

Speaker 2 (59:24):
I would say both. I would say probably there's an
increase in people who are having these experiences. And I
say that just because it seems like there's we're kind
of in the information age now, which is kind of
also slipping into the disinformation age unfortunately. But with computers
and the ability to do incredible research and all these

(59:46):
civilian organizations popping up to study these things, I think
people are absolutely a lot more comfortable coming forward with
their own experiences. So it's really hard to say, because
if you look at the uf organizations, there's a steady
increase of reported cases. And does that mean more people
are seeing it or does that mean people are now

(01:00:08):
reporting it? Really hard to say, but it seems like
each generation of humans here on Earth they learn a
little more quickly. They've come a little bit more psychic.
We evolve, and our psychic awareness is growing, i'd like
to think.

Speaker 3 (01:00:24):
So.

Speaker 2 (01:00:26):
I think there's a lot of ignorance and disinformation and
a lot of real, you know, push and pull going
on right now, certainly with UFO subject and just people's
ability to think clearly about what's real and what's not.
And we still have flat earthers and I am you know,
in hollow earthers and people saying stuff that's I really

(01:00:51):
wish they'd just step back and do some real, basic
baseline scientific thinking. I'm not a flat Earth, I understand stand. Yeah,
our governments are lying in NASA probably shouldn't be trusted completely,
but it's undeniable that the Earth is basically a spherical

(01:01:12):
in shape, so we need to really just sort of
step back and do some really careful, basic scientific thinking.
But yeah, I think people are also. I mean we
talk here about children and starts to our children and
into our children, and a lot more waking up of
psychic abilities. Perhaps that's just because people are now being

(01:01:35):
exposed to it and becoming more open to it, and
parents are listening and children are more or perhaps they
are actually waking up and more so than the eighteen hundreds.
But yeah, I mean there was a show on children
who have past lives and only ran a couple of seasons. Gosh,
that was so interesting because these children were calling stuff

(01:01:59):
that's amazing, and I'm sure that if we were just
embrace it, we could really accelerate our psychic abilities to
a degree that would be astonishing. But yeah, there's an
evil force this planet. Our governments or secret governments, cabal,
whatever you want to call it, seemed to be working
very hard to fill us up with quote legal drugs.

Speaker 1 (01:02:23):
Yeah, I started encouraging things happening though, even just in
the past year, where people are just realizing the corruption
from the higher ups and they're participating less, they're not
going along with some of the ridiculous agendas that are
trying to be put forward. So there's growth happening right now,

(01:02:44):
and I think the more we collectively become aware of that,
the easier it is to navigate through all the madness
happening right now. But we're definitely in exciting times for
sure at present. This was fantastic. Is there anything that
you've been working on lately? Anything upcoming?

Speaker 2 (01:03:03):
Oh, I'm always keeping busy. I've put out a few
books recently, Symmetry, a true UFO Adventure, one of my
favorite ever, Humanoids and High Strangeness, which really embraces the
whole paranormal aspect of it. I just put out like
last month, Not from Here, volume five, all about the
really unusual UFO encounters, the outlining cases. Going to do

(01:03:27):
another on out of body experiences. I'm super pumped about
what's going on now with people, you know, the interests
in these subjects really accelerating. So yeah, it's a good time.

Speaker 1 (01:03:41):
Excellent, Preston, This was great. I can't wait to see
you at the event upcoming. Everyone, go to expandingrealitypodcast dot
com slash events. Check it out, check out the amazing
lineup presenters and things that we're going to be doing
out there and get your tickets and we will see
you there. Thank you again, Preston. Before you head out,

(01:04:03):
let the audience know where they can find you.

Speaker 2 (01:04:05):
Thanks, Chris. Pretty easy to find you just go on
the internet and punch my name in. But I do
have a website, Prestindnnett, weevely dot com, YouTube channel, UFOs,
and The Paranormal with Preston Donnett. My books are available
on Amazon and other online retailers and you know, Facebook, Twitter, Instagram,

(01:04:26):
all of those. I'm pretty easy to find and always
love hearing from people. So thanks for the opportunity to
be on the show. I love these subjects. They're important.
I wish everyone yes really talk about it.

Speaker 1 (01:04:37):
So it keeps me going for sure. Thank you, Preston.
We'll do it again. I'll see you in May, and
until next time, everyone, have an excellent evening. We'll talk
again tomorrow. See you then. Today, I want to welcome
back to the show Wayne McRoy. He is an author
and researcher who explores the hidden agendas linking modern technologies

(01:04:59):
to their ancient out chemical roots in antiquity. Wayne, Welcome back.
How you doing.

Speaker 3 (01:05:06):
Good, Chris? Thanks for having me back on again, Man.
Always a pleasure to speak to you.

Speaker 1 (01:05:10):
Great having you back.

Speaker 3 (01:05:11):
Man.

Speaker 1 (01:05:11):
Been looking forward to this. I've been wondering just how
many times can conspiracy theories become reality and the truth
strangers in fiction. Since twenty twenty, we've experienced events that
were not only predicted by very brilliant researchers, but also
seem to have a prophetic aspect when compared to certain

(01:05:33):
ancient spiritual texts depending on your interpretation. As I said before,
I told this story that I went to a small
Christian school in junior high and I remember them showing
us a video and it was supposed to depict the
apocalypse would be like, what the end of the world
would be like. And the video proceeds to show pandemics,

(01:05:59):
world war, global psychological operations, and a fake UFO invasion.
Now this was like, Man, had to be very early nineties,
when I was late eighties, when I was when this
was this video was produced, and I would I thought
it was hilarious at the time, you know, I i'd

(01:06:21):
it was such a low quality, cheesy production and me
and my friends would laugh at it. But fast forward
to today and smack me and call me Karen. If
ninety percent of these events portrayed in that film seemed
to be occurring. If that being said, is all this planned?
Are the manifesting this? Are we in some sort of simulation?

(01:06:44):
Is there a divine plan? And some believe the next
big event is going to be a stage UFO invasion.
Now we're gonna get into this. We're get into this
and a lot more so. We've got a lot to
get into. But first remind the audience a little bit
about yourself and your work.

Speaker 3 (01:07:03):
All right, man, Once again, I do appreciate you having
me on here. I could be found over at Alchemictech
Revolution at gmail dot com if anyone wants to contact
me directly. The Alchemical Tech Revolution podcast is now available
out there on Spotify, at Apple Podcasts and pretty much
anywhere else you find podcasts, and that's my main gig nowadays.

(01:07:25):
I also am over on rock and if people want
to check it out over there, that's rkfim dot com.
Backslash Wayne McRoy, And the bulk of my work is
focused on looking back, primarily at the texts of the
Secret Society groups and applying them to things going on today.
And we see so much, so much that's been prophesied

(01:07:46):
in the Bible and other places happening today. And just
as you had let in here with the conversation, we're
at this precipice right now where all of these things
that were once called conjecture or considracy theory or these
types of things are beginning to manifest around us. So
it has to make you wonder what in the world's
going on here. And we're seeing a big push right

(01:08:08):
now for this whole UFO Alien agenda narrative that's been
showing up over and over again in the public. So
that being the case, I see this as being a
manifestation of a thing that has been predicted in the past,
and we're going to go through that very shortly here.
In my estimation from the things I see, they're putting

(01:08:30):
all the tails out there, like they just recently talked
about these congressional hearings on the UAP agenda here, that's
what they call it now, Unidentified aerial phenomena. They've shifted back,
They've shifted back to that description of it. They're trying
to rebrand UFOs essentially. So I find that in and
of itself interesting because I'm a big proponent of taking

(01:08:53):
a part language to understand what's being leveraged in certain ways.
So I've been really taking a lot of time focus
on this whole UFO thing as of late, and much
of my work in research now that's originally where I
started researching, was in the UFO field, when I came
across all kinds of other things that took me down
these other rabbit holes. And I tell people I accidentally

(01:09:14):
became an expert in a cult philosophy because of that.
So that being the case, it's amazing how all these
things tie together at the topmost levels and how they
interconnect in so many ways. And the whole UFO thing
is part and parcel of that. We see it's a
fictional crux for the upcoming events in this world, these
things that have been predicted by ancient texts and also

(01:09:38):
by many people throughout the ages here and we see
it all coming together and at of this relates back
to a notion that came about primarily in nineteen ninety
four at the writing of Surge Monast of a book
called Project Bluebeam, talking about this false alien invasion narrative. Now,

(01:09:58):
to be clear, there is there's no recorded government gram
called Project Blue Bean, and people will make that kind
of an argument all day. It's an acknowledged thing within
the conspiracy culture, isn't it Project Blue Bean being a reality? Now,
certainly these technologies do exist, these projection technologies, hologram technologies,
these kind of things, they do certainly exist, and there

(01:10:20):
are programs that have shown these and demonstrated these in
the public, but there is no acknowledged Project Blue Bean.
So serge Mo nask came out with this writing, and
there's a lot of legends and stuff that have cropped
up around that. I guess he died in nineteen ninety
seven or ninety eight, shortly after coming forward with this information,
and he claimed this was a NASA project, but you

(01:10:42):
can find no such project in the literature anywhere. But
he set up this whole way of thinking for people
since then. So we have this notion of a false
alien invasion, and we also have some other corroborating inform
that's come out from alleged whistleblowers within the various organizations JAZZ, NASA.

(01:11:07):
Carol Rosen came out, you know, after the fact and
said foreigner von Braun had warned her that they were
going to play this whole alien card in the end.
He said, first it would be like terrorists, and then
it would be asteroids, and then it would be the
alien card. And he warned her and urged her to
try to stop the weaponization of space. So a lot

(01:11:29):
of this has to do with the military industrial complex
and those run in the show, within this military industrial
complex trying to set up some type of an infrastructure
based in the technologies around space or space technologies, as
von brunclaimed, So you got to wonder what in the
world are they trying to set up and why are

(01:11:50):
they going to use this alien agenda to push and
promote that. So you're looking into this and you find
many of these different links my research and the things
I've been able to look at, I always, invariably, no
matter where I look at this, I always end up
in one of two places, and it's always both. If

(01:12:11):
you go back as far in time as you can
and trace back a lot of these writings and these ideas.
As far back in time as you can, you always
arrive at what's called the ancient mystery schools and the
secret society groups that have been brought forward from those.
So that being the case, you go back in as
far in history as you can, that's what you find.

(01:12:32):
And if you look forward into the invariable near future,
you always find the end goal thereof which in the
modern age we call transhumanism. So this is the fulfillment
of what these ancient mystery schools called the Great Work
or the Philosopher's Stone, or all these types of ideas,

(01:12:53):
and it relates to attaining immortality and becoming a gods
in this physical realm in which we live. So they
want to do that, know uncertain terms, these powers that
be in this world, these dark occultists who run things
at the top of the power structure, and that's absolutely
what they are, and that's what I call them. We
don't know their names per se. We've heard a lot

(01:13:15):
of names thrown around as to who's actually running things,
but this is the public face of it. Now. Behind
the scenes, there's those that you've probably never even heard
of and don't know who they are, that are running
this whole agenda, and there's a very small few at
the top that are actually putting out different ideas and
agendas that are adopted as policy by many different countries

(01:13:39):
and organizations throughout the world, and it's done through the
auspices of the three. So we have all of these
notions have been introduced into the public mindset for the
longest time, since at least eighteen nineties. So there's a
reason that this whole Project Bluebeam idea was allowed to
circulate out there. And it's been conspiracy culture for decades now,

(01:14:03):
and we're all pretty familiar with the notion. But you
have to wonder what's the end goal. If they really
were going to stage an alien invasion, would they really
allow you to find out about that? Well, some would
argue this is a concept called revelation of the method, right,
which is sometimes known in conspiracy circles as predictive programming,

(01:14:23):
And that's an argument you could make. I don't claim
to know true nature of all of this, but it
seems to me the people, the social engineers who run
things and put these agendas in place, they like to
hit us with a swerve every now and again with
this stuff. So I don't know if this whole thing's
going to manifest as an actual nuts and bolts alien

(01:14:46):
invasion type of a scenario. We might be looking at
something else, and I'll explore avenues of thought that relate
to that a little bit further down the road here
in Joe, because I think that's an allusion to something else.
I think it's an allegory for something else that they're
going to present and that we won't be looking for.

(01:15:06):
And it has everything to do with the events that
have occurred over the course of the past three years.
And we could get a little bit into that here.

Speaker 1 (01:15:16):
Yeah, before we do, I would love to touch on
what you've mentioned a few minutes ago about the the
ideology behind this and the end goal what you would call,
like you mentioned the Great Work, what this ideology is
all about, and it seems to be, in a bateic sense,

(01:15:37):
trying to evolve men through technology into this one androgynist being.
That these are culled groups believe that at one time
we were this one perfect being and the only way
for us to get back to that is through a
forced evolution of technology. Am I close on that?

Speaker 3 (01:15:59):
Yeah, that's actually a pretty good approximation of what we
can denote from looking back at their writings. They harkened
back to a time that they call the Golden Age
or the Golden Period, a world that existed prior to
this one, wherein mankind was dual sext in one body.
He had the aspects of the feminine and the masculine

(01:16:24):
both embodied within him, and he was creative from self.
He could create just from self that way and multiply well.
If you look back at the teachings of the Road
Recrucians and other groups, you see that this was a
period before the modern era. Here, this was a world
that existed prior to this one in a different time.
And some of these teachings get a little convoluted by

(01:16:46):
the secret society groups, but it's all essentially part and
part of the same thing. So they're harkening back to
this age that they refer to as the Saturn period,
where it was the golden age of mankind, where man
existed in a paradisical type date, but he was this
bull sex being. He was able to create in and
of himself bodily. But this was something that didn't have

(01:17:13):
the spiritual connection or connotation at the time that it was,
so this was something man was able to reproduce, much
like a plant does. But at the same token, he
also had consciousness comparable to that of a plant during
this period, so he was not really self aware at
that point. And this is what they teach in some
version or another in the Secret schools. So at one

(01:17:36):
point or another, what they seek to do is go
back to this time where this Golden Age, this paradise
on Earth as they refer to it. But they want
to do so with the intellect of mankind intact. And
that's what they're seeking to do. They want to re
evaluate this world we're in, and in a mystical sense,

(01:17:58):
they want to bring about the fruition of this paradise
with the notion of having our intellect intact. Because at
the end of the day, the big main premise to
these individuals, these dark ocultis who run things that's important
is they believe that through intellect, mankind can ascend to
the next level and deify himself and become gods of

(01:18:21):
this place. Be the gods, be the creators, be the builders,
the master builders of this place. A lot of his
language hearkens to the Secret society groups a lot of it.
Free Masonic people are most familiar with the Freemasons as
a secret society, so we find ourselves referring to many
of in their terms. But essentially, when you go back

(01:18:42):
and you look at the old teachings, this is what
they want to re establish. They want to re establish
man as a being who's able to create just by himself.
He doesn't need a partner to do so. And that
being the case, it's about a form of a hatheosis,
if they also like to call it, and they see

(01:19:03):
that being something that is within their grasp here in
the modern era through the use of high technology and
through this transhumanist notion of things. So what are they
doing with this While they're trying to eliminate variety out
of the equation. They want to merge the two gender
principles back together again in an androgynist type state. And
we see this manifesting in the modern world through things

(01:19:28):
like this transgender ideology and all of that stuff, and
a lot of it aligns with these teachings. And that's
the thing. Much of what's been done is a perversion
of what the original state of things was or has been.
What original intentions of the alchemists were they've taken the

(01:19:49):
inversion principle and applied in this way, always stating that
they have these wonderful or good intentions for mankind as
a whole. But at the end of the day, what's
really happening is it's all about the betterment of these
select few people at the top of the power structure

(01:20:09):
in this world. They want to maintain their ground power.
They want to affirm themselves as the gods and rulers
of this place, and they utilize some of these old,
old chemical principles and ancient sciences to get there. They
leverage that against the masses, and they seek to bring
about this type of state of being wherein they are
the gods of this place and they can achieve this

(01:20:33):
alleged Golden Age or some replication of this type of
Golden age, that's what they're seeking. But what does this
look like? And that's what we're getting to right now,
because like I said, what has happened is through the
course of time and through revisionist history in space, we
see that what's happened is they've taken a lot of

(01:20:55):
these old ideas and inverted them, in perverted them against
the natal order of things, and that's what they're seeking
to do. And they try to put as positive as
spin on this stuff as Pabo and say it's going
to be beneficial for everybody, but when it comes down
to brass tacks, it's really not. It's only for a
select few that are looking to reap the benefits thereof

(01:21:16):
and the rest of us. They're trying to lock into
this type of material paradigm in which we exist right now.
And all of these ideas, although they seem kind of disjointed,
all these things connect together. All these different conspiracy type
topics and ideas, they all join together. So if you're
talking ufbos, if you're talking about even Christian theology and

(01:21:38):
the fulfillment of the Book of Revelation in the end times,
all of these scenarios do tie together in this way.
They most certainly do. And I like to tell people, sorry,
I didn't mean to interrupt. I always tell people, at
the end of the day, when you look at this stuff,
there's one overarching agenda and one granddaddy of all conspiracies

(01:22:03):
going on right now, and that is the transhumanist agenda.
Because all roads lead to Rome in this regard, they
all lead to the same thing. So, like I said,
whatever I look at, no matter what topic it is,
it always ends in one of those two places, back
in the ancient mystery schools and the eccult ties to it,
or in if you look forward to its inevitable ends.

(01:22:27):
It's always this transhumance notion, this posthuman type of an
idea that they're putting together. So one end leads to
the other. You could trace back the roots of this
as far back in time as we could look, and
we can see the culmination of that coming up within
the very near future. If these people get their way,
they see it as being possible now with the modern

(01:22:50):
technologies they have. They want to achieve this goal and
then successfully socially engineering the public to align with their goals.
And people don't even rea liies how they've been manipulated.
And they because they use notions and ideas that most
people are not familiar with in the modern era, because
we've been taught primarily to think of these things as

(01:23:11):
silly or nonsensical. They use tools like astrology and tools
like language, hidden language, what they call in the Freemasons
the green language, also called the phonetic Kabbala, also called
the language of the birds. There's many distinctions for this.
They use hidden language and the language of symbology to

(01:23:33):
communicate ideas and to defer ideas into the public consciousness
through the use of archetypal energies and archetypes are a
huge notion that ties into this, and they leverage off
them all the time, and people don't recognize them on
a conscious level for what they are. So I think
Manly P. Hall said, when man learns to read the

(01:23:54):
language of symbolism, a great veil wall off of his eyes,
or some such notion I may have.

Speaker 1 (01:24:00):
So they're setting up these events, it's up to us
to have an emotional response and reaction to create the
archetypal energy or ed gregork energy that will manifest these
ideas into our reality.

Speaker 2 (01:24:15):
Right.

Speaker 3 (01:24:17):
Well, that's kind of the premise that I've seen when
I'm looking at this. It seems almost undeniable that they
try to inculcate these ideas into the minds of men,
leveraging these old alchemical tools to do so. You see,
they understand something about this reality that we don't. These
darc ocultists at the top of the poor structure and
much of this they've kept hidden within the auspices of

(01:24:39):
the secret societies and occult fraternities through the ages. And
they call this magic, You could call it whatever you want.
Thinking in terms of magic, they've taught us to think
that's a silly notion, that's childish thinking, all of that.
But if you just redefine the term magic as causal engineering,
then un stand what's been done here. They're using different

(01:25:02):
frameworks that the human mind doesn't constantly recognize in the
modern era because we've been taught to think of that
type of a notion as having nothing to it. And
it's an important concept. It's about images, images and symbols.
They invoke this archetypal thought form within the human mind,

(01:25:25):
and these people are masters of manipulating that. Now, what
is this archetypal thought form, Well, it varies from symbol
to symbol and the intention that's embedded in the symbol,
and all of this ties back to what is the
nature of consciousness? And this is wherein we have very
many problems in trying to relate to these things because
you have to think deeply and clearly about this topic

(01:25:46):
to understand some of these concepts, and most people are
not accustomed to doing so. So, in turn, what are
we talking about when we're talking about an archetype. Now,
this is something that the unconscious human mind recognizes because
of inherent experience or inherent genetic predisposition to this. Now

(01:26:07):
they call it in modern terms, they call it epigenetic
memory or genetic memory. It's called in many of the
Shamanic traditions as ancestral memory. It's called very many different things.
It's called the ecashic record some occultics. But essentially everybody
agrees there's this notion there that there's this background information,

(01:26:30):
this information field that we access just based upon our existence,
that it's embedded in our DNA in a sense. So
this whole idea archetype that's where in this lies. Your
unconscious mind will recognize an archetypal energy form and it
will affect you on a subconscious level, which will eventually

(01:26:53):
alter conscious behavior, but you don't recognize it because you
don't recog it. It empowers that idea all the more
so these people that have learned how to leverage these
archetypal thought forms in that way and manipulate the public
into accepting things that they normally wouldn't or doing things
that they normally wouldn't, And this is actually acknowledged in

(01:27:15):
the mainstream. So if anybody's thinking this is like woo
woo stuff, this is acknowledged. I would urge anybody out
there to look up a book called The Changing Images
of Man. This was Stanford Institute's study with researchers like
Margaret Meade and Joseph Campbell in on it. And in
this work they acknowledge that they will use mythology and

(01:27:38):
allegory and things of that nature symbolically to change man's
image of himself and to change man's image of what
the universe really is. So this is something that's acknowledged
in the scientific mainstream, and it's by some movers and
shakers in the social engineering portions of this world. So
there's something to this. They use, they manipulate mythology and

(01:28:02):
these different archetype energies and ideas to change human behavior
mass psychology, and this is acknowledged in that work in particular,
and others as well. But that is the best one
I could point out because it says in there and
know uncertain terms, we understand there's some subjective things about
human behavior that perhaps we don't quite have a full

(01:28:23):
grasp of. But that's why we need subjective things like
mythology and different storytelling motifs and stuff like that to
influence human behavior. So they recognize this a subjective thing
that can't be objectively measured accurately, but they can still
leverage it in certain ways to get a generalized effect.
So this is what's it revealed in that book in particular.

(01:28:46):
So I think, what's going on now? Getting back tying
back to the original topic we're talking about, because I
know this goes all over the place, but.

Speaker 1 (01:28:55):
Well we catch everything go everywhere, right.

Speaker 3 (01:28:58):
I guess so. But going back to the archetype involved here,
we're talking about the archetype of the alien, and there's
just so much that is attached to that idea subtle
nuance that most people don't put up upon because we're
not taking that way. We've been in sort of programmed

(01:29:22):
through science fiction media to look at aliens as a
certain type of thing. Right, We're thinking in terms of
it's an extra terrestrial, it's from another planet in outer space.
So that's what they've been trying to engineer into the
cultural mindset. And I think they've been hugely successful at this.

(01:29:44):
But any thoughts there, Chris, before I go a little
further down the.

Speaker 1 (01:29:47):
Road, Well, that's exactly what I want to get to.
I wanted to explore this psychological operation of UFOs and
extraterrestrials since it really started getting in introduced into the
blick after World War Two that you see very few
accounts of what people would really understand as extraterrestrial encounters

(01:30:11):
before this time period. It was around the forties and
fifties when we really start seeing the flying saucer phenomena
pick up, and it evolved from there based on different
events that would occur that would, just like we were
talking about earlier, shift the public consciousness into a certain direction.
It went saucers to these tic TACs that we see now,

(01:30:34):
and other strange amorphous lights and different types of would
look like plasma entities and things like that. But the
phenomena itself seems to be evolving as we experience these events.
But these events are most likely being manufactured in some

(01:30:56):
way based on a lot of the evidence that we have.
I want to also get your insights into how deep
this goes, How deep of an operation is this do
you believe that the military is actually involved with possibly
abducting people these nefairious groups actually taking people, or other

(01:31:18):
types of mind control techniques like drugs or any maybe
some advanced technology. If you look at the Camello story
by Robert Guffey, even in the nineties, they were employing
some of these very extreme tactics of surveillance and harassment
using extremely advanced technologies. So how far do you think

(01:31:42):
that this goes? How deep is the operation?

Speaker 3 (01:31:46):
Well, I think it's definitely a very deep operation. And
you consider and keep in mind that the special access
programs within the auspices of the military industrial complex are
bare minim thirty to fifty years in advance of what
we consider the most high tech in the mainstream. Then
you have to realize there's technologies that have been operated

(01:32:10):
in secret for a long time that we may be
largely aware of even still, So with that being the case,
we can see that something like that is definitely a possibility.
So I don't discredit the idea of mill labs as
they're known military abductions, and I think a large portion
of the phenomena is related to that. I think a

(01:32:30):
large portion of what we call the UFO phenomena. In
the modern day is largely human tech, and I've been
able to trace back a lot of the linear progression
of this technology all the way back to Nikola Tesla
and even past him when it became more further developed.
It became developed by a gentleman named Tea Townshend Brown. Now,

(01:32:53):
this guy was employed by the Naval Department and was
very highly regarded art in the intelligence community and by
those different groups within this military industrial complex. He was
highly regarded. He was an intelligent guy, and he discovered
something in his youth in the nineteen twenties that's called

(01:33:13):
the Bifield Brown effect. And a lot of this relates
back to electrogravitic propulsion systems that have been developed by
the military and others. At least that's my viewpoint, And
I see the evidence of this everywhere, but can't really
prove it because they until they come out and they say, yeah,
we have ultrogravitic or gravity control device technology that we've

(01:33:37):
been employing within the military complex for a while now,
until they come forward and say that, you can't absolutely
say that with proof positive because the way they've done
this and developed these technologies they've done it in a
way where they bypass the standard protocols of government oversight.
What they do is they subcontract out these projects to CORES,

(01:34:01):
and these corporations take in these projects, and of course
those that work on it within the corporation have to
have special top secret access and clearance and security clearance,
the kind of thing, so they get vetted for that,
and when they have this access, then they're given need
to NOBASIS for certain programs within these corporations that take

(01:34:21):
on these projects. And what happens is because it's a
corporation developing the technologies they're in, this is not something
that can be revealed through FOYA Freedom of Information Act clearance.
So if you go and give a FOIL request to say,
some military agency or some other quasi governmental agency looking

(01:34:44):
for UFO information, you're not going to find it because
they could heide it in the corporation under the auspices
of what they call proprietary information, and thereore, they don't
have to reveal those secrets to the public through FOYA request.
So so there's no accountability and there's no way to
really find out what they've been doing, short of perhaps

(01:35:07):
I don't know the threat of arrest or being tried
for tree reason or some such thing of the United
States Congress if they don't reveal what they have. I
don't see that really happening. But they are pushing for
this UFO disclosure idea because many of these technologies I
think are the key to moving forward here in the future.

(01:35:27):
I think we can alter our world. If these technologies
ever came to the forefront, it would absolutely overnight change
our world in ways we could only begin to imagine.
And I think it would really upset the apple cart
in the beginning, because our entire financial system would collapse
overnight when you're not dependent upon oil as an energy

(01:35:48):
source anymore. Well, that completely rearranges all the deck chairs
on the Titanic in a sense, doesn't it.

Speaker 1 (01:35:57):
Do you think they're going to the extent of interview
hearing in people's lives as far as possible abductions, are
drugging people to perpetuate this agenda.

Speaker 3 (01:36:10):
I think it's been done. I don't know what exactly
is their purpose for doing that, maybe to further the
whole Well, we.

Speaker 1 (01:36:18):
Have plenty of experiencers, quote unquote experiencers and abductees that
have had these incredible experiences that they in turn go
onto to a conference they're getting, they go on the
big talk shows, and they become very well known, and
they are perpetuating a certain UFO narrative. And they have

(01:36:39):
a lot of folks that are former intelligence right now.
They are former military that have become very entrenched in
the UFO community, and they are speaking on behalf of
the UFO community, and they're involved with UFO research, and
some have even admitted that they are still involved with
counter intelligence operations at the same time that they're in

(01:37:01):
the UFO community. So that alone sends up enough red flags.
But I think that people are being inserted into the
community at the least to perpetuate some of these narratives.
But as far as recreating an extraterrestrial experience with an
individual by a nefarious group, I've heard from individuals that

(01:37:26):
they believe that this is happening. I don't know.

Speaker 3 (01:37:30):
I've heard from individuals as well that this is certainly
a thing. You can actually talk to a lot of
people who claim to have been involved with a mill
ab or a military abduction. So of course they're trying
to really push this whole notion of aliens and I
think there's a lot of that. There's a lot of
infiltration in the UFO research community, and a lot of

(01:37:53):
people that claim to be former intelligence operatives are in there.
And if you know anything about the intelligence community, there's
no such thing as a former intelligence operative. They never retire.
They're bound until the day they die to work for
the agency. And here's the thing, and a lot of
people don't necessarily realize this. The intelligence community, where do

(01:38:15):
you think it got its ideas, from its operational standards
from from secret society groups. It's the same ocean that
goes on from there. The original secret society groups were
the original intelligence agencies. It's just been kind of expanded
out and blown out into this whole government funded operation now,

(01:38:35):
and that's where it becomes extremely dangerous. It's created a
situation where you have a group of people with no
accountability out there operating ad hoc however they want. So
this sets up a situation wherein you could have this runaway,
breakaway civilization that's taken hold within the structure in a

(01:38:59):
pair of cidic type fashion of national governments and international governments.
So I think that's largely what's gone on, and who knows.
I mean, all the things you hear about UFOs and
aliens that comes out, it's always a second hand source.
There's never any primary evidence that supports any claims. It's

(01:39:20):
always just, well, I saw a document that says there
were aliens, or I got a glimpse through a dark
hallway through a door at an alien body or some
such thing, that these aliens exist. And you hear about
these underground and labs and stuff like that. We're in
there supposedly genetically engineering different things. And I think that's

(01:39:40):
another science that's largely been covered up in the auspice
of the military industrial complex too, is this whole biological
notion of cloning and genetic engineering that's gone on. That's
probably way further advance than we think. And I think
the only reason we haven't really seen a viable quote
unquote alien yet is because they haven't been able to
engineer one, and that would sufficiently pass the test of

(01:40:02):
the public as far as appearance goes. So we may
be seeing that in the near future. I don't know.
I don't claim to have the answers. I've studied this
phenomenon for a long time, and it's always invariably points
in the two directions, the first of which is always
the occult, there's always occult ties to this stuff, always.

(01:40:23):
And the other direction is to the ends of this
transhumanist control grid that they seek to set up in
the world. And they're well underway in setting up this system.

Speaker 1 (01:40:36):
Let's get into let's get into some of those possibilities
you were talking earlier that you believe that it may
not necessarily be what we understand a traditional fake alien invasion,
that they may have more layers to this than we
could ever be aware of.

Speaker 3 (01:40:54):
Absolutely, And I'm going to go ahead, and we're going
to go back, and we're going to look at the
original War of the World's scenario by Orson Wells and
the Princeton Radio Group that occurred back in nineteen thirty eight,
if memory serves me, thirty eight. Well, this whole operation
caused quite a national stir. And actually it's said that

(01:41:18):
in Grover's Mills they destroyed their water tower thinking it
was one of these Martian walkers. So this was a
psychological test, was an operation, and this is well acknowledged
by the Princeton Radio Group and a gentleman named Hadley
Cantrell that wrote a book based upon this. So they
were collecting data back then to see how the public

(01:41:38):
would react to a day daily an invasion, essentially what
they're thinking would be and at that point they came
to some certain conclusions about that wherein they thought the
public perhaps would panic in such a way just based
upon the evidence that he had seen. And they also

(01:42:01):
in so doing they were gathering some more important information
than that, and this has to do anything to do
with social engineering. They were monitoring what the effects of
radio broadcasts can convince people as being true, and this
was later applied to the notion of television, the Internet,
all the other forms of media that we have now.

(01:42:24):
The initiative they collected from this Princeton Radio Group study
that was the source in Wells broadcast. That's one of
the early things that they used to come to the
realization that hey, we could use this as a programming tool,
and they've since done so, not just with radio and television,
the Internet, everything all across the board. And when you

(01:42:47):
realize that over ninety percent of all media is owned
and controlled by a very small group of corporations and
that the informations all sent through central resources, which are
known as newswire services. Then you could see how they
could do this top down control in this top down

(01:43:09):
dissemination information. So they realized that they could hugely influence
public consciousness using these tools. They've only since doubled down
against that. So here's the whole notion here. So they've
they've come up with this alien archetype, this archetypal thing,
this unknown, this fear of the unknown in the human mind,

(01:43:30):
and this is the archetype they're leveraging against people. Of course,
it's the fear archetype, fear of the unknown. And I
would say that what they've done is they've taken this archetype,
this alien motif and archetype, and they've leveraged it against
the human mind in this way, because what do we know?
Do you remember the story of War of the World.

(01:43:52):
What killed the motions in War of the worlds germs, germs, bacteria. Now,
there's always through all science fiction motifs, when you look
at this whole alien motif, there's always an attachment or

(01:44:15):
a type of inference within the narrative of disease. Disease.
Just prior to the rollout of COVID, we had to
the Stars Academy come out revealing this alien information, and
we're seeing a continuation of that going on now that

(01:44:37):
they've only just recently brought this up after the whole
COVID pandemic situation. Remember, prior to the COVID pandemic situation,
you had to the Stars Academy and Tom DeLonge from
Link one to eighty two out there disseminating this information,
working with former intelligence officials like hal put Off and
why is his name escaping me all over the place?

(01:44:59):
Who's the also? Thank you? Yeah, I don't know. Sometimes
the information escapes, But you have these guys out there
were promoting this at the time, and they came forward
with DeLonge and we're trying to get this information out there.
That's when this whole tic tac Ufo footage and everything surfaced.
So they were laying the foundation. Then, well, here's the thing.

(01:45:21):
We did a program on this on Crow Triple seven Radio.
It was episode number one sixty nine where we took
a part this whole the Star's Academy bit and this
whole notion. And remember this was prior to the pandemic,
wherein I began to notice many of the people that
were on Delange's team that he put together were either virologists, microbiologists,

(01:45:47):
or many of these other things that don't seem to
relate to any type of spacecraft idea or space ideology.
There were several of them on his team. Now I
don't remember their names and positions within to the Stars
a cap to me off the top of my head.
But we did an entire breakdown. We did a whole
episode on this on Grow Triple seven Radio, and then

(01:46:07):
we began to notice this attachment that seems to be
a motif that runs deep with the whole alien narrative,
that attaches to the idea of viruses or bacteria or germs,
and I think there's a definitive connection there. So fast
forward a couple years from when they were starting to

(01:46:29):
roll this out, you roll on UO disclosure, and then
we had the onset of this pandemic, this alleged pandemic
that affected the world in many ways. So now here
we are post pandemic. They finally lifted most of the
restrictions and everything, and it's kind of faded off into

(01:46:49):
the sunset. Now now they're out there rolling out the
alien agenda again and in the meantime, you have other
people out there perhaps pushing thea that there will be
a future pandemic that's coming that will be worse than
this last one. Now, I would caution people pay attention
to this because maybe that's the alien invasion that we're

(01:47:12):
looking at here again, because let's face it, humanity in
reaction to the whole COVID thing pretty much willingly gave
away many of their human rights on a massive scale.
Now it's been said that I think it's sixty nine
percent of the overall world population went out and got

(01:47:34):
at least one of these COVID vaccines at least one dose.
That's a massive number of people, and that screams social engineering.
They tried to coerce people every way they can, almost
forced people in certain situations. Hey, you want to keep
your job, you need to go get this. Look what

(01:47:54):
they've done. Now, think back to the Orson Wells thing.
This is the culmination of what the data that they gathered.
Then they learned the best ways to manipulate a society
with this archetype okay, the alien, which is the archetype
of fear of the unknown. And they put a face

(01:48:17):
or a personification on that, and much of the time
that's what they do with these archetypal ideas. They will
present it as a symbol because see, when they give
you a symbol, or they give you a personification of
a thing, it empowers it and then it can be
leveraged and used by those who understand the intention behind it.

(01:48:38):
This is the whole basis that mythology operates on. You
really think people in the ancient times were thatm really
the way we present them in our modern history books stuff. Oh,
they were backwards and they believe that such and such
a god did this, and a god did that. They
weren't talking about gods. This was a personification of natural

(01:48:58):
energies that people recognized that they gave a name and
a face to which empowered the symbol or the archetype.
And this is why Manly P. Hall says, when man
learns to recognize the language of symbology, I think veil
will fall from his eyes. That's exactly what they mean.
So when you recognize the archetype at play, No, they're

(01:49:22):
ramping up some sort of in fear factor or unknown
thing in fear factor. Do you think that was just
a clever name for a TV show that the Joe
Rogan on prior to him becoming such a big deal. Really,
so you kind of think about these things.

Speaker 1 (01:49:39):
There's always the fear, for we always have to have
the invisible enemy, or we wouldn't need Daddy government and
military industrial complex to protect us from said enemy, or
new modern science as our new religion so that they
can figure out a cure for any type of pandemic

(01:49:59):
or disease that may be threatening us.

Speaker 3 (01:50:01):
Well, I would I'd urge anybody out there go ahead
and just google alien virus and look at all the
returns you're going to get. In fact, there was even
it was even said by some people that perhaps COVID
came from outer space. This is not a new thing.
This is a trope that's been going on for a
long time now. So yes, certainly we can see that

(01:50:23):
perhaps that will be their narrative. Perhaps we will have
quote unquote alien visitating here and then all of a
sudden we'll have a disease outbreak or some such thing
that they'll blame on the inversion of these aliens. Whether
it's a friendly invasion or well, you can't call it
a friendly invasion or a friendly contact we should say,
or an invasion. Perhaps that's the notion they'll go to

(01:50:47):
with this. Now. I do reserve the right to be
totally wrong about all of this, obviously, but it seems
to me there's that inherent connection.

Speaker 1 (01:50:54):
There's present too much time, too much energy. They've put
too much into the psychological operation of the next pandemic
to not take advantage of it. So why not beef
it up and combine it with an alien threat? That
would be the ultimate operation to gain control over humanity?

Speaker 3 (01:51:17):
Right, win or winner in dinner. That's the whole notion
that I think is coming here, Chris. That's my that's
my intuition on all of They think they're going to
concurrently push both of those. And it may not look
like an alien invasion, because that's what they've been talking
about now for at least the past three decades. This

(01:51:37):
idea of a mock alien invasion might not be that,
but it might be just simply contact with an alien
race that perhaps visits are and then all of a sudden,
we have this new disease that's super deadly to mankind,
or at least that's what the claim will be, or
you know, the claim that these are quote unquote extraterrestrials

(01:51:59):
that have visited here that I think is the notion
that we might coming. So I think it's a hugely
important idea for people to consider here.

Speaker 1 (01:52:07):
Do you think that there is an anomalous phenomena that's
occurring with non human intelligences or entities where people are
interacting with something, Where there is something occurring that is
either communicating with humanity, manifesting in some way to certain

(01:52:29):
individuals and causing a causing certain people to have experiences
that they can't explain, where they only understand as they're
communicating or having contact with an extraterrestrial Could there be
these interdimensional Are these entities that reside in different spectrums

(01:52:52):
that we can't perceive, that are attempting to communicate us,
communicate with us that aren't necessarily the terrestrials that were
being told about.

Speaker 3 (01:53:03):
I have one hundred percent think there is definitely a
real phenomenon here. There's absolutely these beings or entities or
whatever you want to call them, intelligences that do sometimes
contact people. I would say it's probably something more akin
to a spiritual thing rather than a physical material world

(01:53:24):
reality here. Maybe sometimes they can manifest in a material
type way here. But there's definitely something to this phenomenon
because it pre dates all of the modern era. It's
been talked about in different ways through the ages here,
spirit manifestations, ghosts, demons, theories, all of these different aspects

(01:53:44):
of things have been attributed to this. I think it's
the same phenomenon or phenomena, a group of phenomena that
has been leveraged heavily upon here in the modern era
by the science fiction of the time and equated back
to this idea of aliens or extraterrestrials. Now, am I
saying that it's not possible that there's extraterrestrials. Well, no,

(01:54:04):
I'm not saying that at all. It's certainly possible. But
I think the nature of the phenomena that we are
seeing points to one of two things. It's either a
man made contrivance that's being inculcated into the minds of
people through various mind control technologies and techniques, and or
there's a spiritual phenomena or extra dimensional type of phenomena

(01:54:27):
that underlies some of it as well. I think a
combination of these different factors certainly plays a role here.
There's a real phenomena. There are real intelligences out there
that have always been ever present here on earth, and
sometimes we see into that other world, if you want
to call it that. And these things have been described

(01:54:49):
by the occultists and by the Secret Society groups in
many ways as far as the different ideas as to
what these things could be, everything from hierarchies of spiritual
entities that maybe begin to manifest here, to elementals, to
various other types of intelligences that guide energetic forces in
this place. There's all of these different notions, and of

(01:55:12):
course you always bring in the idea of the eggrigor
or the tulpa. This is empowered by human thought and
human intention, so you have a.

Speaker 2 (01:55:22):
Lot of this.

Speaker 3 (01:55:23):
This ties back to a lot of the same teachings
as well. So you have manifestations here that begin in
the realm of thought and then they manifest at some
point even physically or materially here. You could look at
these different philosophies from many different perspectives. But the whole
point is, yes, there's a definitive phenomena that is concurrent

(01:55:45):
with this. Now, does it relate to the notion of
this quote unquote alien invasion that we may or may
not see coming. I don't think it does. I think
that's largely a contrivance by those in this world who
want to maintain their power here and push man kind
backwards in his spiritual way of thinking, in his spiritual development,

(01:56:06):
and keep him locked in the hyper materialist paradigm. Here.
Rudolph de Steiner described this as the spirit of Aramon.
I would describe it as a portion of the spirit
of Antichrist in the modern day. Here, this is trapping
people's minds into this material world notion of thinking. This
is why our science will tell us that consciousness and

(01:56:31):
human spirit and all of these things are nothing more
than the byproducts of the electrochemical activity of the brain
and brain stem. And all of these things are an illusion,
that it's just the byproduct of some physical material world
process here. And if that's the case, if that is true,
which in my estimation it is not, it is a lie.

(01:56:51):
But if that is true, if consciousness can be equated
to something little more than the electrochemical byproduct of the
human brain and brain stem, then this can be duplicated
via algorithm. And if this can be duplicated via algorithm,
it can be duplicated and become manifest in a machine,
in a computer, a computer simulation, or some such thing.

(01:57:14):
And then therefore you could transfer your consciousness somewhere else.
And this is what the modern cult of scientism would
like us to believe, that everything can be equated down
to a material world, physical cause and effect relationship between
these various things. But there's something missing. They missed the
whole spiritual concept and connotation to everything with this way

(01:57:36):
of thinking. But that's why they try to steer our
thinking into this material paradigm. And as I said, Rudolph
Steiner describes this as the spirit of Araman. The spirit
of Araman would like you trapped in this material paradigm
and thinking in this sheer material way of thinking.

Speaker 1 (01:57:55):
I want to explore a few theories and concepts with
you based on different conversations I've had with different researchers
with very different views of what's happening. First of all,
the UFO aspect, the possibility that there are encounters occurring
where people are being either experimented on medically or technologically,

(01:58:21):
or even being sexually impregnated physically by some sort of
extraterrestrial being. In turn, making hybrid entities, which this could
be a large scale operation to globally create hybrid entities

(01:58:44):
and in turn gradually change what we are as humanity.
There's that side. Then I had guests like Nathaniel Gillison
the other day who does believe this is a completely
spiritual phenomenon when we're talking about non human intelligences that
also have the ability to somehow affect our reality in

(01:59:05):
ways to where they can impregnate women somehow, what you
would call incubus or sucubis can impregnate women the same
thing as happening in a hybridization sense over a long
period of times, where it's they're attempting to change humanity,
but it's a more of a metaphysical or spiritual nature.

(01:59:26):
What do you think about that?

Speaker 3 (01:59:30):
Well, I think there is a metaphside to it, for certain,
and I also think that maybe there is a real
world physical manifestation of that that can be going on
to some shape, way, shape or form. All you got
to do is look back at the story of Genesis,
chapter six, the incursion of the Watchers in the Book
of Enoch. All these things you see, all these similar
things going on. The fallen angels they came down and

(01:59:52):
unto the daughters of men, they made it with them,
and of them were born, being known as the Nephelim,
which where the hero of old, the great men of renown.
And it says in the Bible that there were giants
in those days and also after that. That's what these were.
This was the incursion of some type of an entity
that doesn't belong in this material world. It was an

(02:00:14):
abomination in the eyes of God, the Creator. And this
is why many theologians and many people who study these
things will say that the great flood occurred. It was
to wipe out this extant group that did not belong here.
They're not something that belongs in this material manifestation, but

(02:00:36):
they seek to be here. And you see this all
across the different occult organizations and fraternities and brotherhoods. The
whole notion that there are these spiritual type entities out
there that seek nothing else than to manifest physically materially
in this place. It's something that's said to be a
great desire of those types of beings, whether they be

(02:00:58):
fallen angelic being, or whether they be some other type
of entity like an elemental spirit or some such thing.
They seek to manifest here and have this physical experience,
and they are jealous of humans because of this. We're
jealous of mankind because we are created in the image
of God and we are here in this material manifestation,

(02:01:21):
and this is where our spirits reside, and they want
nothing more for their spirits to be able to manifest
in this way, and thus they seek to find different
ways who get here wellmation?

Speaker 1 (02:01:34):
Could this also? Could this also be occurring with aspects
of technology, to where somehow these entities are able to
inhabit our technology AI like a Golam type sense.

Speaker 3 (02:01:50):
And I think you were just going the exact place
where I was heading next with this. Essentially, Yes, that's
what my view is AI transhumanism. All of these different
notions I think are a way in which these different
spiritual manifestations can become or step through the gateway here

(02:02:10):
into this place. Now, what you need to understand about this,
just from my research and the things that I know
and I've seen and the things that I've been able
to vet out as well as possible, AI in and
of itself is not a viable framework for a type
of spiritual entity to manifest. They need something more. And

(02:02:31):
this is where things become a little bit more convoluted
and a little bit more turning. This has to do
with this notion of transhumanism. Because we, as human beings
are made and created in the image and likeness of God.
Mankind himself is a composite being of sorts. We have
a physical body, we have a spirit, we have a soul,

(02:02:53):
and we have a mind. All of these things combined
we are a threefold and four square being simultaneously. And
this is acknowledged in different ways by the secrets of
side groups. So in order for a spirit to be
able to fully manifest in this place, in a physical,
material world sense, it needs to have that type of

(02:03:14):
a framework. Now that's missing when it comes to AI.
But here's the kicker humanity, mankind, the body of man
created in the image of God. This is the gateway
between worlds. This is where a spirit can step in
and manifest. So you've heard of things like walk ins.

(02:03:37):
I think there's a very similar phenomena that can occur
once the transhumanist notion of things takes place. They want
to merge your mind and your body with the machine.
In so doing, this creates an artificial form that does
not exist and is not intended to exist in this
material reality or this world in which we live and manifest,

(02:03:58):
and therefore it becomes an abomination to God and to
all of creation. It's completely unatural. It's the inversion of
the whole natural order of things. And at that point
therein can step in my estimation, a spirit into this place,
especially when you consider they are promising mankind that through
this use of transhumanism, you can upload your consciousness into

(02:04:22):
a machine. Well, in my view, this is just a ruse.
Will it actually be the ontological self you that exists there?
I don't think so. I think it will just be
a replica andart officially created replica of your behaviors and
maybe some of your thoughts and this kind of a

(02:04:42):
thing in the machine. So therefore it leaves this void.
So I think it's an advanced form of eugenics. And
this has been admitted by some pro transhumanists that transhumanism
is just something that is eugenics based. In fact, there's
a quote from a protra humanist YouTube channel out there.
I think it's called transhumania if I remember right, is

(02:05:05):
the name of the channel. In one of their videos,
they said that transhumanism is quote unquote eugenics without coercion.
So that being the case, this is just part and
parcel of the whole depopulation campaign that has been talked
about for many years. They'll convince people that if they
go ahead and get these transhumanist implants and they upload

(02:05:27):
their consciousness to the machine, that they'll live forever and
that this will benefit them, But in reality, it's just
a eugenics program to depopulate them. Then their spirit will
go off, they will actually die in the process of
replicating their consciousness in a machine. And you could look
at there's various transhumanist white papers out there talking about this,
how scanning the brain every component of the brain is possible,

(02:05:50):
but it would destroy the brain in the process. So therefore,
what would happen is, you know, the human being, the spirit,
the animus that was in that body leaves and moves
on to the next plane or whatever, and it leaves
a void, a spiritual void in its place. So that's
when you could get the notion of perhaps a walk

(02:06:12):
in of sorts. So a different spirit steps through the gateway,
because remember the human being is the gateway.

Speaker 1 (02:06:20):
Now let's clause on this, Could it be possible that
if enough people become aware of these agendas, if enough
people wake up to this and decide not to participate
or even pay attention to what they're attempting to show us,
could it possible that we skew the inevitable timeline that

(02:06:44):
we could be headed on and prevent a lot of
these events from occurring.

Speaker 3 (02:06:50):
I would say that's immensely possible, and I have a
great deal of hope that we can reject this. That's
the whole notion. You need to be aware of what's
being handed to us by these social engineers who run things,
these dark ocultists at the top of the power structure
that run things, and we need to reject it. We
need to get in right relationship with God, our creator,

(02:07:13):
and you know, there's various ways we can do that.
I am an unapologetic Christian, so I see Christ as
the answer in my view. People, of course, are you know,
free to think whatever they want about that, but I
would harken people draw unto Christ, and this, I think
is the answer that can stab this off, because we

(02:07:35):
do see coming to fruition the very things that were
predicted in the book of revelation and through various places
in the Bible. So that being the case, I think
this is part of answer, but the biggest part of
the answer also is rejecting these things, rejecting these notions,
understanding the path that they put us on, and let's

(02:07:55):
make it harder for these dark occultists at the top
of the power structure to get what they want. Reject
things like central bank digital currencies, which are absolutely part
and parcel of one of the main in constituents to
putting in place their beast system that they want. Let's
reject that. We do not ever want to lose the

(02:08:15):
notion of using some physical form of currency, because the
day that we do so is the day that we
lose the most freedoms ever in human history. Because they're
not just talking about going digital with their currencies. When
you're talking about central bank digital currencies, we're talking about
of all, they're going to centralize all the different types

(02:08:37):
of money systems into one. And then second of all,
they're talking about programmable money, money that you can only
use to buy certain things, or it has an expiration date,
or any factor, any combination of these different factors in play,
including and not limited to a social credits we're attached
thereof So if you are a bad boy and you

(02:08:59):
post something on YouTube that doesn't align with the mainstream narrative,
well they could shut you out of your bank account
until you remove that video, or take back your position
on that or earn your way back into having certain privileges.
Because at that point everything becomes a privilege. And this
is when this whole transhumanist notion of things get goes

(02:09:22):
sour and gouth very fast when you look at this
notion of things. Our rights are derived from God. It's
acknowledged in the Declaration of Independence. We hold these truths
to be self evident, that all men are created equal,
that they are endowed by their creator with certain unalienable rights,
that among these are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. Well,

(02:09:44):
if you do not acknowledge that you have a creator
much like these people, and then religion that is scientism
to first of all, then you have no human rights
in the eyes of the power structure. So I'll bet
are off if you don't believe there's a god. There's
a creator that gave you, that made you, and put

(02:10:05):
in play certain natural laws in this place. If you
don't believe that, well, then you have no rights in
the eyes of the power structure to begin with. So
they will do whatever they want to eat or for
you or against you, whatever they see fit. And in
that way, when you look at it in that perspective,

(02:10:25):
what this does is it takes the idea of rights
away from being something that you are created with, you're
endowed with by your creator, and it hands them over
to government to determine what are your quote unquote rights.
And all rights that are handled by government are privileges.
So they can deny you whatever privilege they want without

(02:10:46):
any more moral recompense on their part for this. This
is from their point of view, of course, as I'm
trying to explain, so they see justification in their actions
that way. So that's my viewpoint is what they want
to do is they would like to instantiate this this
like where you don't acknowledge that you have God given runs,

(02:11:08):
and in so doing everything becomes a privilege. And therefore,
if you have a programmable digital currency that if your
social credit score drops below a certain number, they could
shut you completely out of your bank account. You can't
leave your house, you can't buy an airplane ticket, you
can't travel out of your fifteen minute city. All these
notions come into play, and this is exactly the beast system,

(02:11:30):
the control grid. They want to set up in this
place if we allow them so. The simple act of
rejecting something like central bank digital currencies is a key
component to doing this. Let's make it hard for them
to get what they want, guys.

Speaker 1 (02:11:43):
One hundred percent, Just reject it if it doesn't make sense,
if it doesn't resonate you, which most of this nonsense
that's coming down the pipe, one hundred percent does, Just
don't participate in. It's the easiest answer that we have
so far. Wayne. Thank you so much. This was great. Wait,
can't wait to do it again. Before you head out,
let the audience know where they can find your books

(02:12:05):
and our content.

Speaker 3 (02:12:07):
All right, Thank you again, Chris. Always a pleasure to
be on here with you. The Alchemical Tech Revolution podcast
is available on Spotify or Apple Podcasts or pretty much
any other podcast player out there. I do that once
a week. Usually I have a new free episode that drops.
I do have a subscriber only episode that comes out

(02:12:29):
each week as well, and bonus episodes of another show
that I do called the Alchemical Lantern, which is a
live weekly show that's broadcast on Freeworld dot fm Friday
nights at ten pm Eastern Standard time. Do a replay
of that also on the podcast there through Spotify. But
also I have books available if you just google my name,

(02:12:50):
they'll turn up there, available on Amazon or pretty much
anywhere else can buy books. Also, I do have the
Rockfinn channel, which is kind of my home base for
live streaming and stuff like that. I also have a
YouTube channel, but I don't really do an awful lot
with that anymore except for post the free podcast episode
when it's something that they're not going to take down

(02:13:10):
on me. So I just use that as a tool
to try to reach people to get them over to
the other platforms at this point. Also, I'm a prolific writer,
so I also have the Alchemicalbeacon dot substack dot com.
I love Substack. It's a great platform, Chris, if you
haven't been on there yet and you should get over there.

Speaker 1 (02:13:27):
Yeah, that's to check that out. Definitely, all right, Wayne,
thank you so much, great stuff. We'll definitely do this
again and until next time, everyone have an excellent evening
and we will talk again tomorrow. We'll see all then

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}FKN Classics Double Feat! | Preston Dennett - Cryptid Encounters | Wayne McRoy - Cosmic Pandemic