September 25, 2025 • 20 mins
In this episode I spoke with author Jennifer O'Callaghan about her book "Rear Window: The Making of a Hitchcock Masterpiece in the Hollywood Golden Age." The definitive, in-depth look inside Alfred Hitchcock’s Rear Window—the all-time classic of voyeurism, paranoia, and murder that became one of Hollywood’s greatest achievements and turned generations of viewers into “a race of Peeping Toms.” A must-read for film buffs, Hitchock fans old and new, and fans of classic movies and Hollywood insider history.
Out on September 30, 2025.
Forgotten Hollywood is on Facebook and the books are on Amazon! Doug Hess is the host/producer!
Out on September 30, 2025.
Forgotten Hollywood is on Facebook and the books are on Amazon! Doug Hess is the host/producer!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Let's go.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Hello everyone, and welcome back to another edition I've Forgotten Hollywood.
I'm your host, Doug has If you're tuning in Forgot
in Hollywood for the first time, what we do in
this podcast is sure with you pieces of Hollywood that
you may or may not know about. And today we
have a very special guest with us today, Jennifer O'Callahan,
and she is here to talk about her book Rear Window,
(00:26):
the making of a Hitchcock masterpiece in the Hollywood Golden Age. Jennifer,
Welcome to Forgotten Hollywood.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
Hi Doug, thank you so much for having me. It's
an honor to be here.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
Well, thank you, and thank you for spending a few
minutes out of your busy schedule to be with us today.
And you know, what we do with a lot of
our authors is kind of ask them to put it
in their own words what this book is about.
Speaker 4 (00:54):
Of course.
Speaker 3 (00:54):
Yeah, so this book just to give a little bit
of a backstory. I'm I've always you know, I'm a writer.
I've always been a lover of classic Hollywood film, but
and especially of you know the making of film, you know, type.
Speaker 4 (01:12):
Books, and I remember getting my first one.
Speaker 3 (01:16):
I think it was back in twenty ten when I
saw one by Sam Wawson on the on Fifth Avenue,
five AM, the Making of Breakfast at Tiffany's, And then
I devoured that book, and then after that I was
just looking for other books that were similar to that
that I could read. And Rear Window has always been
my favorite Hitchcock film. Big fan of Grace Kelly and
(01:39):
Jimmy Stewart, of course, so I was sort of I
knew that there had been, you know, I'm a very
narrative style booked on you know, on Vertigo and some
of his other ones, but just as a reader myself,
I couldn't find a book on Rear Window that was
(02:00):
in you know, a very storytelling, narrative driven style. So
I thought, well, I'm a writer, why don't I give
it a go. So that that's really where it came from.
And I've always just loved, you know, classic films since
I was a child. I was, I kind of grew
up on a steady diet of it. My dad made
(02:21):
sure of it, you know, he just you know, having
me watch all the MGM Judy Garland musicals and the
thirty nine Steps and all those types of films yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
And once you get hooked to, at least in my opinion,
and I'm a little biased, it's hard to break away
from that habit of digesting those films.
Speaker 4 (02:42):
Absolutely yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (02:44):
I mean it's kind of like a gateway in a way,
because you know, you find out about one director or
an actor or actress that you love and you're like, Okay,
well I loved that film, what other films have they done?
And then it just keeps kind of mushrooming in a
way where you're just discovering more and more from those
eras well.
Speaker 2 (03:03):
And a lot of actor excuse me, directors in today's
environment pay tribute to the Hitchcocks of the world and
some of the other directors that came before them Spilberg, Coppola,
or just a couple that comes to mind that if
you know what you're looking for, you can see a
(03:25):
little bit of hitchcock in their work today.
Speaker 3 (03:28):
Absolutely yeah. And it's funny because I think there are
things that filmmakers you know, have been doing for decades now,
like you know, something as simple as withholding information from
the audience until the end that doesn't even register as
hitchcocky in anymore to people, especially, you know, especially younger
(03:50):
people because you know it's just done so often. But
he was sort of one of the pioneers of doing
that back in the day. So it is just interesting now.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
Well, yes, and you know he was able to do
it when there was a code that you couldn't have nudity,
you couldn't have sex, you couldn't have really violent scenes. Uh. Yeah,
I think a psycho with the shower scene. You know,
all you really see is and it's in black and white,
(04:25):
is water that looks a little red, so you're assuming
it's blood and she is being murdered. But they're doing
all that with you as the audience, kind of knowing
what's happening without actually seeing what's happening, if that makes sense.
Speaker 3 (04:44):
Yeah, and it almost makes it more cringey in a
way that you're not you know that you're not seeing it.
And because it's I think Hitchcock, he really knew how
to tap into our imaginations, yes, and you and the
things that we the stories and the conclusions that we
were coming to in our own minds, and just the
(05:05):
power of that psychology. And so I think he you know,
with the production code, the Hayes or also called the
Hayes Code that that was, you know, was brought in
in nineteen thirty four until it started to kind of
peter out in the sort of going into the late
fifties sixties. It you know, having that code, where as
(05:26):
you mentioned where you couldn't have the gore, the extreme,
the gratuitous sex, gratuitous violence. I think it really he
kind of made he kind of made almost made friends
with that code because it was like he knew how
to work with it, as opposed to have feeling like,
oh God, I have to I have to deal with
(05:46):
this code and just you know, sort of working against it,
and like he kind of knew how to intertwine himself
and his work with it and you know, using it
and doing things that sort of went above the heads
of the sensors, even though you know, when we watch
it now, we kind of understand, like, oh, I see
(06:07):
what he was getting at, but I see why it
passed the sensors because it wasn't obvious.
Speaker 2 (06:12):
Right absolutely, you know in Jennifer. The other thing that's
really kind of crazy for me to think is we're
getting close to seventy years since this movie was first
released out there.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
It's been.
Speaker 3 (06:23):
Yeah, it's been over seven years. The last year was
the seventieth anniversary. Yeah, so I know, so hard to
believe time has gone by so quickly, right.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
Yes, absolutely. But what's interesting, I think to me is
that this movie has really stood this test of time,
and even after seventy years, if you're watching it for
the first time or you're watching it again, it just
really draws you in. And in a way, you could
argue that this film could have been made yesterday and
(06:51):
people will still kind of embrace it.
Speaker 3 (06:56):
Absolutely, And I think that really has to do with
a uni versal themes that we all still as human beings,
we all still go through and we've all felt in
our lives like alienation, loneliness. I mean, we just came
out of, you know, a worldwide pandemic, you know, and
also even with social media being brought in now, like
(07:19):
the whole voyeuristic.
Speaker 4 (07:22):
Part of it.
Speaker 3 (07:23):
I mean, Jimmy Stewart back in nineteen well it was
came on fifty four, but when it was started being
made in fifty three, I mean he could if he
was like sitting there with a broken leg, you know,
if that had happened to him today, you know, he
might not be looking out the window at neighbors per se.
Speaker 4 (07:42):
Maybe he would be scrolling.
Speaker 3 (07:43):
Reddit or Instagram or you know something.
Speaker 1 (07:48):
You know, an app like that, Yeah, and making those
same judgments and coming up with those same nicknames, you know,
like Miss Torso and you know, Miss Lonelyhearts and you know,
and all that kind of thing.
Speaker 3 (08:00):
So, I mean, it's these things, These are still very
prevalent themes today and even you know, even history as
it went on after you know, with the Cold War,
the surveillance, all these types of things that happened in history.
You know, even after Rear Window was almost like Hitchcock
was predicting things that were that were going to happen absolutely.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
And what's interesting is even if we're seventy years later,
people are still, like you said, nosy and spying for
lack of a better word, on what their neighbor is
up to. And what's kind of also fun is, you know,
Jimmy Sturtz's character is kind of coming up with his
own theories, imagining things we find out later that they're true.
(08:48):
But isn't that what the real society is? Kind of
Oh so and so must be up to no good?
Speaker 3 (08:54):
Yeah, and it's like the more information you get thrown
at you sometimes the more confusing it can be. And yes,
and sometimes yeah, it's it's about sometimes believing what we
want to believe. And you know, it just it's like
a whole can of worms. I think that that And
and you know, he happened to be right about thor Wald,
(09:15):
but if he, say, if the movie turned out where
he had been wrong about thor Wald, he would have
been labeled a conspiracy theorist, you know, like you know
what I mean, Like it's such a such an interesting concept.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
Absolutely, absolutely, Jennifer. Doing the writing and the researching of
this book, anything surprise you.
Speaker 3 (09:36):
Yeah, a few things came up that surprised me. I
interviewed the historian Joseph McBride. He's a he's a he's
a film history and he's also a fabulous writer. He's
written some great biographies and books. So he I spoke
to him because he actually, you know, had the opportunity
(09:59):
to no, you know, to speak with Hitchcock, to interview
him on the set of his last film, which was
a family plot. And one thing that he noticed was
that during some of the scenes that he was observing
that were being filmed that were a little more dialogue heavy.
(10:20):
He wasn't really storyboarding, you know, he was he was
kind of improvising, which was not something that Hitchcock was
really known for, I think, especially after the.
Speaker 4 (10:31):
Hitchcock True Faux Book came out.
Speaker 3 (10:34):
I think it was kind of generally believed that he
storyboarded absolutely every single scene in his films. But I
think Joseph he was very surprised to observe that Hitchcock
was actually doing some improvising that wouldn't have necessarily involved
(10:55):
storyboarding for I mean, obviously with the action scenes, I'm
sure he was storyboarding in the end of it still,
but yeah, he just found that to be a surprise,
and I was very surprised by that too. And I
guess another thing I wanted to just bring up about
Grace Kelly. I talked to some of Grace Kelly's family members,
(11:15):
and I think sometimes in the media she wasn't always
given a fair shake, you know, she was seen as
sort of an you know, ice princess or what have you,
and she was really she did so many things behind
the scenes that never made it to the media, like
so many good, wonderful things for people there was, Like,
(11:38):
for example, her cousin told me that there was a crash.
Speaker 4 (11:43):
So this was when she was.
Speaker 3 (11:45):
Had already left Hollywood and was living in Monaco in
the palace, and there was a really bad crash on
the highway close to the palace, and there was a
man who was killed. And she found out that this
man had a wife and eight children, including an infant.
As soon as she found out, she went straight to
(12:06):
the wife's to their home.
Speaker 4 (12:08):
She took the.
Speaker 3 (12:09):
Wife, all the children to the palace. She didn't know
them at all, she took them all to the palace.
She looked after the children in the palace until this woman,
this widow was able to get on her feet again
and just recovered from the shock of losing her husband.
And you know, she did these types of things, and
she you know, she wanted to a lot of the times,
(12:32):
she wanted to make sure they didn't make the media.
Like she just did these things behind closed doors, and
people don't know, like don't necessarily know that about her,
what type of human being she really was. I think
they just see the glamor a lot of the time
and the you know, the beauty and the whole you know,
(12:54):
Hitchcock blonde and you know, and there was that side
of her too, but she but she really was just
finding out these things about what type of person she was.
And you know, she wasn't just helping out her famous
friends and things like that, Like she was helping out
strangers too, so well.
Speaker 2 (13:12):
And those are great stories because it shows the personal
side of the human side of them. And I think when, yeah,
we find out that people are doing this anonymously, that
to me shows just how genuine of an individual they
really were. And it wasn't all about me, me, me
and the glamour and the attention exactly.
Speaker 3 (13:32):
Yeah, it shows you know, what type of down to
earth person she was. She was also a very strong
minded person too, you know, she she was very independent.
Like even when she was in Hollywood, she was very
you know, obviously she was a fashion icon and she
was very she was a fashion icon for a reason
because she followed her own instincts.
Speaker 4 (13:54):
You know. She she came.
Speaker 3 (13:56):
Into Hollywood at a time where you know, very heavy
I'm makeup, very very heavy makeup, was you know, all
the rage and she just said no, you know, like
with like on rear window when you see her with
the exception of her ruby red lips. She really her
makeup is very natural. Or she would never want to
smoke with a lit cigarette on screen because she was
(14:20):
not a smoker. So if you ever see her holding
a cigarette, you know, on screen or anything like that,
you know they they She's always she always said, you know,
I won't smoke a lit cigarette, like, I'll do what
you ask, but I'm not going to inhale it, you know.
Speaker 4 (14:35):
A lit cigarette. So she had certain you know.
Speaker 3 (14:38):
Things about you know that she just said, no, this
is my image, this is my brand, this is who
I am. And I think that's one of the reasons
she was so successful.
Speaker 2 (14:46):
And maybe I know we're getting closer on time, but
maybe talk about the relationship between Hitchcock Stewart and I'm
Kelly Well.
Speaker 3 (14:57):
Hitchcock and and Jimmy Stewart had a fantastic professional relationship.
So I spoke with Jimmy's daughter, Kelly Harcourt or Kelly
Stuart Harcourt, and she said that, you know, they both
had extreme, extreme respect for each other because I think
(15:18):
they really kind of had a similar they worked in
similar ways where you know, Hitchcock wasn't necessarily known for
you know, talking through method styles.
Speaker 4 (15:31):
With actors and things like that.
Speaker 3 (15:33):
He was kind of like, you know, you're an actor,
act you know kind of thing, and yeah, and Jimmy
Stewart kind of liked that, I think, because he liked
to have that independence to just figure out his own
character's journey. And I think he considered acting not necessarily
to be all of that that much of an art,
(15:54):
but more of like a craft.
Speaker 4 (15:56):
You know.
Speaker 3 (15:56):
He was kind of like a like a journeyman of like,
you know, how he figured out his a character when
he was putting when he was in a film. So
I think the two of them just seemed to jive
really well professionally. And of course, as I think it's
pretty well documented, uh, Hitchcock and Grace Kelly got on
(16:19):
very well. I mean he he actually flew to Monaco
to try to convince her to star in Marnie, which
unfortunately didn't work out and the role did go to
Tippy Hedron, who who also who did a fantastic job
in the role. So I think, you know, and then
also as far as a relationship between Grace Kelly and
(16:41):
Jimmy Stewart, they were always they were just buds, like
they were, They were great friends. And that's you know. Kelly,
his daughter told me that, you know, she used to
even when she left Hollywood, she used to send Christmas
cards to the Stewarts and she would check in sometimes
if she saw a performance, but she saw Jimmy and
(17:01):
that you know, had really moved her.
Speaker 4 (17:03):
She'd always let him know.
Speaker 3 (17:04):
So I think, yeah, they all seem to have a
lot of genuine respect for each other.
Speaker 2 (17:09):
Yes. And the reason I brought that up is because
I think you can tell that on the screen in
that film that there was there was that bond, that relationship. Professionalism.
I think there's a lot of different words we could
use to describe the performance, and I really think that
comes out on the screen.
Speaker 4 (17:32):
Great chemistry.
Speaker 2 (17:33):
Yes, absolutely in terms of that. And the other thing
is the professionalism. And that's one thing that I really
have always been really fascinated about actors and actresses and
directors from the Hollywood era or the Golden era, is
their professionalism. They came every day ready to work, They
(17:55):
knew their lines. Yeah, and they were very professional. I'm
not going to say that that's true today. I don't know.
I don't think it is quite as disciplined as it
once was. Yeah, and obviously I'm a little biased because
we have this podcast, but I think it just really
shows in a lot of films.
Speaker 4 (18:16):
Yeah, I think.
Speaker 3 (18:16):
Yeah, with the studio system, it really did work in
a very in a very different way. You know, they
were working I think for the most part, they were
working six days a week. It was very regimented, you know.
And then it was like that for a long time
until I think the new Hollywood.
Speaker 4 (18:34):
Era came in, and then it things became.
Speaker 3 (18:36):
A little more freelance, wild wild west ish.
Speaker 4 (18:40):
And things changed.
Speaker 3 (18:42):
But yeah, it was a very a very different time
where it was. It was sort of like you were
you were sort of like clocking in and clocking out.
It was like you were working for like a corporation
kind of.
Speaker 2 (18:56):
Yeah. Yes, and then when you got done, you didn't
take two years off. You you may went right to
work on Monday for a completely different film.
Speaker 3 (19:05):
Yeah, you probably went across the lot to the to
the other sound stage and then you started on the
next one.
Speaker 2 (19:13):
Ye.
Speaker 4 (19:13):
So yeah, it was I mean.
Speaker 3 (19:15):
It must have been very tiring sometimes, but yeah, I
know Grace Kelly, she she was not in Hollywood very
long and she made eleven films in just a few years.
Speaker 4 (19:27):
Yeah, so I think she was kind.
Speaker 3 (19:28):
Of doing back to back to back films and then
I think but then, you know, at the same time, though,
when she left Hollywood, she really missed it and she
wanted to come back. She missed acting, even though you know,
I'm sure at times she found it very tiring.
Speaker 2 (19:43):
Yes, And I think that's probably a lot of people,
is you kind of get tired of burnout, ready to
go on. But if you truly love something, it probably
never truly leaves you, exactly. That's probably with Grace Kelly exactly.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
Yeah, Well, Jennifer, thank you so much for coming on
spending some time with us. To our listeners. The book
goes on sale September the thirtieth, so go out in
pre order your copy today. We just touched the tip
of the iceberg. When it comes to rear Window, the
(20:20):
making of a Hitchcock masterpiece in the Hollywood Golden Age,
You're not going to be disappointed. Jennifer does a fantastic
job of talking about the movie and giving us some
insight on that, and again, Jennifer, thank you so much
for coming on and spending some time with us. Today.
Speaker 3 (20:40):
Oh, thank you so much, Doug. Thanks for having me
on the show. It's been wonderful.
Speaker 2 (20:45):
Well, thank you and thank you for listening to this
episode of Forgotten Hollywood. Join us next time. As we
released the latest episode, thank you for listening
Let's go.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Hello everyone, and welcome back to another edition I've Forgotten Hollywood.
I'm your host, Doug has If you're tuning in Forgot
in Hollywood for the first time, what we do in
this podcast is sure with you pieces of Hollywood that
you may or may not know about. And today we
have a very special guest with us today, Jennifer O'Callahan,
and she is here to talk about her book Rear Window,
(00:26):
the making of a Hitchcock masterpiece in the Hollywood Golden Age. Jennifer,
Welcome to Forgotten Hollywood.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
Hi Doug, thank you so much for having me. It's
an honor to be here.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
Well, thank you, and thank you for spending a few
minutes out of your busy schedule to be with us today.
And you know, what we do with a lot of
our authors is kind of ask them to put it
in their own words what this book is about.
Speaker 4 (00:54):
Of course.
Speaker 3 (00:54):
Yeah, so this book just to give a little bit
of a backstory. I'm I've always you know, I'm a writer.
I've always been a lover of classic Hollywood film, but
and especially of you know the making of film, you know, type.
Speaker 4 (01:12):
Books, and I remember getting my first one.
Speaker 3 (01:16):
I think it was back in twenty ten when I
saw one by Sam Wawson on the on Fifth Avenue,
five AM, the Making of Breakfast at Tiffany's, And then
I devoured that book, and then after that I was
just looking for other books that were similar to that
that I could read. And Rear Window has always been
my favorite Hitchcock film. Big fan of Grace Kelly and
(01:39):
Jimmy Stewart, of course, so I was sort of I
knew that there had been, you know, I'm a very
narrative style booked on you know, on Vertigo and some
of his other ones, but just as a reader myself,
I couldn't find a book on Rear Window that was
(02:00):
in you know, a very storytelling, narrative driven style. So
I thought, well, I'm a writer, why don't I give
it a go. So that that's really where it came from.
And I've always just loved, you know, classic films since
I was a child. I was, I kind of grew
up on a steady diet of it. My dad made
(02:21):
sure of it, you know, he just you know, having
me watch all the MGM Judy Garland musicals and the
thirty nine Steps and all those types of films yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
And once you get hooked to, at least in my opinion,
and I'm a little biased, it's hard to break away
from that habit of digesting those films.
Speaker 4 (02:42):
Absolutely yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (02:44):
I mean it's kind of like a gateway in a way,
because you know, you find out about one director or
an actor or actress that you love and you're like, Okay,
well I loved that film, what other films have they done?
And then it just keeps kind of mushrooming in a
way where you're just discovering more and more from those
eras well.
Speaker 2 (03:03):
And a lot of actor excuse me, directors in today's
environment pay tribute to the Hitchcocks of the world and
some of the other directors that came before them Spilberg, Coppola,
or just a couple that comes to mind that if
you know what you're looking for, you can see a
(03:25):
little bit of hitchcock in their work today.
Speaker 3 (03:28):
Absolutely yeah. And it's funny because I think there are
things that filmmakers you know, have been doing for decades now,
like you know, something as simple as withholding information from
the audience until the end that doesn't even register as
hitchcocky in anymore to people, especially, you know, especially younger
(03:50):
people because you know it's just done so often. But
he was sort of one of the pioneers of doing
that back in the day. So it is just interesting now.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
Well, yes, and you know he was able to do
it when there was a code that you couldn't have nudity,
you couldn't have sex, you couldn't have really violent scenes. Uh. Yeah,
I think a psycho with the shower scene. You know,
all you really see is and it's in black and white,
(04:25):
is water that looks a little red, so you're assuming
it's blood and she is being murdered. But they're doing
all that with you as the audience, kind of knowing
what's happening without actually seeing what's happening, if that makes sense.
Speaker 3 (04:44):
Yeah, and it almost makes it more cringey in a
way that you're not you know that you're not seeing it.
And because it's I think Hitchcock, he really knew how
to tap into our imaginations, yes, and you and the
things that we the stories and the conclusions that we
were coming to in our own minds, and just the
(05:05):
power of that psychology. And so I think he you know,
with the production code, the Hayes or also called the
Hayes Code that that was, you know, was brought in
in nineteen thirty four until it started to kind of
peter out in the sort of going into the late
fifties sixties. It you know, having that code, where as
(05:26):
you mentioned where you couldn't have the gore, the extreme,
the gratuitous sex, gratuitous violence. I think it really he
kind of made he kind of made almost made friends
with that code because it was like he knew how
to work with it, as opposed to have feeling like,
oh God, I have to I have to deal with
(05:46):
this code and just you know, sort of working against it,
and like he kind of knew how to intertwine himself
and his work with it and you know, using it
and doing things that sort of went above the heads
of the sensors, even though you know, when we watch
it now, we kind of understand, like, oh, I see
(06:07):
what he was getting at, but I see why it
passed the sensors because it wasn't obvious.
Speaker 2 (06:12):
Right absolutely, you know in Jennifer. The other thing that's
really kind of crazy for me to think is we're
getting close to seventy years since this movie was first
released out there.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
It's been.
Speaker 3 (06:23):
Yeah, it's been over seven years. The last year was
the seventieth anniversary. Yeah, so I know, so hard to
believe time has gone by so quickly, right.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
Yes, absolutely. But what's interesting, I think to me is
that this movie has really stood this test of time,
and even after seventy years, if you're watching it for
the first time or you're watching it again, it just
really draws you in. And in a way, you could
argue that this film could have been made yesterday and
(06:51):
people will still kind of embrace it.
Speaker 3 (06:56):
Absolutely, And I think that really has to do with
a uni versal themes that we all still as human beings,
we all still go through and we've all felt in
our lives like alienation, loneliness. I mean, we just came
out of, you know, a worldwide pandemic, you know, and
also even with social media being brought in now, like
(07:19):
the whole voyeuristic.
Speaker 4 (07:22):
Part of it.
Speaker 3 (07:23):
I mean, Jimmy Stewart back in nineteen well it was
came on fifty four, but when it was started being
made in fifty three, I mean he could if he
was like sitting there with a broken leg, you know,
if that had happened to him today, you know, he
might not be looking out the window at neighbors per se.
Speaker 4 (07:42):
Maybe he would be scrolling.
Speaker 3 (07:43):
Reddit or Instagram or you know something.
Speaker 1 (07:48):
You know, an app like that, Yeah, and making those
same judgments and coming up with those same nicknames, you know,
like Miss Torso and you know, Miss Lonelyhearts and you know,
and all that kind of thing.
Speaker 3 (08:00):
So, I mean, it's these things, These are still very
prevalent themes today and even you know, even history as
it went on after you know, with the Cold War,
the surveillance, all these types of things that happened in history.
You know, even after Rear Window was almost like Hitchcock
was predicting things that were that were going to happen absolutely.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
And what's interesting is even if we're seventy years later,
people are still, like you said, nosy and spying for
lack of a better word, on what their neighbor is
up to. And what's kind of also fun is, you know,
Jimmy Sturtz's character is kind of coming up with his
own theories, imagining things we find out later that they're true.
(08:48):
But isn't that what the real society is? Kind of
Oh so and so must be up to no good?
Speaker 3 (08:54):
Yeah, and it's like the more information you get thrown
at you sometimes the more confusing it can be. And yes,
and sometimes yeah, it's it's about sometimes believing what we
want to believe. And you know, it just it's like
a whole can of worms. I think that that And
and you know, he happened to be right about thor Wald,
(09:15):
but if he, say, if the movie turned out where
he had been wrong about thor Wald, he would have
been labeled a conspiracy theorist, you know, like you know
what I mean, Like it's such a such an interesting concept.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
Absolutely, absolutely, Jennifer. Doing the writing and the researching of
this book, anything surprise you.
Speaker 3 (09:36):
Yeah, a few things came up that surprised me. I
interviewed the historian Joseph McBride. He's a he's a he's
a film history and he's also a fabulous writer. He's
written some great biographies and books. So he I spoke
to him because he actually, you know, had the opportunity
(09:59):
to no, you know, to speak with Hitchcock, to interview
him on the set of his last film, which was
a family plot. And one thing that he noticed was
that during some of the scenes that he was observing
that were being filmed that were a little more dialogue heavy.
(10:20):
He wasn't really storyboarding, you know, he was he was
kind of improvising, which was not something that Hitchcock was
really known for, I think, especially after the.
Speaker 4 (10:31):
Hitchcock True Faux Book came out.
Speaker 3 (10:34):
I think it was kind of generally believed that he
storyboarded absolutely every single scene in his films. But I
think Joseph he was very surprised to observe that Hitchcock
was actually doing some improvising that wouldn't have necessarily involved
(10:55):
storyboarding for I mean, obviously with the action scenes, I'm
sure he was storyboarding in the end of it still,
but yeah, he just found that to be a surprise,
and I was very surprised by that too. And I
guess another thing I wanted to just bring up about
Grace Kelly. I talked to some of Grace Kelly's family members,
(11:15):
and I think sometimes in the media she wasn't always
given a fair shake, you know, she was seen as
sort of an you know, ice princess or what have you,
and she was really she did so many things behind
the scenes that never made it to the media, like
so many good, wonderful things for people there was, Like,
(11:38):
for example, her cousin told me that there was a crash.
Speaker 4 (11:43):
So this was when she was.
Speaker 3 (11:45):
Had already left Hollywood and was living in Monaco in
the palace, and there was a really bad crash on
the highway close to the palace, and there was a
man who was killed. And she found out that this
man had a wife and eight children, including an infant.
As soon as she found out, she went straight to
(12:06):
the wife's to their home.
Speaker 4 (12:08):
She took the.
Speaker 3 (12:09):
Wife, all the children to the palace. She didn't know
them at all, she took them all to the palace.
She looked after the children in the palace until this woman,
this widow was able to get on her feet again
and just recovered from the shock of losing her husband.
And you know, she did these types of things, and
she you know, she wanted to a lot of the times,
(12:32):
she wanted to make sure they didn't make the media.
Like she just did these things behind closed doors, and
people don't know, like don't necessarily know that about her,
what type of human being she really was. I think
they just see the glamor a lot of the time
and the you know, the beauty and the whole you know,
(12:54):
Hitchcock blonde and you know, and there was that side
of her too, but she but she really was just
finding out these things about what type of person she was.
And you know, she wasn't just helping out her famous
friends and things like that, Like she was helping out
strangers too, so well.
Speaker 2 (13:12):
And those are great stories because it shows the personal
side of the human side of them. And I think when, yeah,
we find out that people are doing this anonymously, that
to me shows just how genuine of an individual they
really were. And it wasn't all about me, me, me
and the glamour and the attention exactly.
Speaker 3 (13:32):
Yeah, it shows you know, what type of down to
earth person she was. She was also a very strong
minded person too, you know, she she was very independent.
Like even when she was in Hollywood, she was very
you know, obviously she was a fashion icon and she
was very she was a fashion icon for a reason
because she followed her own instincts.
Speaker 4 (13:54):
You know. She she came.
Speaker 3 (13:56):
Into Hollywood at a time where you know, very heavy
I'm makeup, very very heavy makeup, was you know, all
the rage and she just said no, you know, like
with like on rear window when you see her with
the exception of her ruby red lips. She really her
makeup is very natural. Or she would never want to
smoke with a lit cigarette on screen because she was
(14:20):
not a smoker. So if you ever see her holding
a cigarette, you know, on screen or anything like that,
you know they they She's always she always said, you know,
I won't smoke a lit cigarette, like, I'll do what
you ask, but I'm not going to inhale it, you know.
Speaker 4 (14:35):
A lit cigarette. So she had certain you know.
Speaker 3 (14:38):
Things about you know that she just said, no, this
is my image, this is my brand, this is who
I am. And I think that's one of the reasons
she was so successful.
Speaker 2 (14:46):
And maybe I know we're getting closer on time, but
maybe talk about the relationship between Hitchcock Stewart and I'm
Kelly Well.
Speaker 3 (14:57):
Hitchcock and and Jimmy Stewart had a fantastic professional relationship.
So I spoke with Jimmy's daughter, Kelly Harcourt or Kelly
Stuart Harcourt, and she said that, you know, they both
had extreme, extreme respect for each other because I think
(15:18):
they really kind of had a similar they worked in
similar ways where you know, Hitchcock wasn't necessarily known for
you know, talking through method styles.
Speaker 4 (15:31):
With actors and things like that.
Speaker 3 (15:33):
He was kind of like, you know, you're an actor,
act you know kind of thing, and yeah, and Jimmy
Stewart kind of liked that, I think, because he liked
to have that independence to just figure out his own
character's journey. And I think he considered acting not necessarily
to be all of that that much of an art,
(15:54):
but more of like a craft.
Speaker 4 (15:56):
You know.
Speaker 3 (15:56):
He was kind of like a like a journeyman of like,
you know, how he figured out his a character when
he was putting when he was in a film. So
I think the two of them just seemed to jive
really well professionally. And of course, as I think it's
pretty well documented, uh, Hitchcock and Grace Kelly got on
(16:19):
very well. I mean he he actually flew to Monaco
to try to convince her to star in Marnie, which
unfortunately didn't work out and the role did go to
Tippy Hedron, who who also who did a fantastic job
in the role. So I think, you know, and then
also as far as a relationship between Grace Kelly and
(16:41):
Jimmy Stewart, they were always they were just buds, like
they were, They were great friends. And that's you know. Kelly,
his daughter told me that, you know, she used to
even when she left Hollywood, she used to send Christmas
cards to the Stewarts and she would check in sometimes
if she saw a performance, but she saw Jimmy and
(17:01):
that you know, had really moved her.
Speaker 4 (17:03):
She'd always let him know.
Speaker 3 (17:04):
So I think, yeah, they all seem to have a
lot of genuine respect for each other.
Speaker 2 (17:09):
Yes. And the reason I brought that up is because
I think you can tell that on the screen in
that film that there was there was that bond, that relationship. Professionalism.
I think there's a lot of different words we could
use to describe the performance, and I really think that
comes out on the screen.
Speaker 4 (17:32):
Great chemistry.
Speaker 2 (17:33):
Yes, absolutely in terms of that. And the other thing
is the professionalism. And that's one thing that I really
have always been really fascinated about actors and actresses and
directors from the Hollywood era or the Golden era, is
their professionalism. They came every day ready to work, They
(17:55):
knew their lines. Yeah, and they were very professional. I'm
not going to say that that's true today. I don't know.
I don't think it is quite as disciplined as it
once was. Yeah, and obviously I'm a little biased because
we have this podcast, but I think it just really
shows in a lot of films.
Speaker 4 (18:16):
Yeah, I think.
Speaker 3 (18:16):
Yeah, with the studio system, it really did work in
a very in a very different way. You know, they
were working I think for the most part, they were
working six days a week. It was very regimented, you know.
And then it was like that for a long time
until I think the new Hollywood.
Speaker 4 (18:34):
Era came in, and then it things became.
Speaker 3 (18:36):
A little more freelance, wild wild west ish.
Speaker 4 (18:40):
And things changed.
Speaker 3 (18:42):
But yeah, it was a very a very different time
where it was. It was sort of like you were
you were sort of like clocking in and clocking out.
It was like you were working for like a corporation
kind of.
Speaker 2 (18:56):
Yeah. Yes, and then when you got done, you didn't
take two years off. You you may went right to
work on Monday for a completely different film.
Speaker 3 (19:05):
Yeah, you probably went across the lot to the to
the other sound stage and then you started on the
next one.
Speaker 2 (19:13):
Ye.
Speaker 4 (19:13):
So yeah, it was I mean.
Speaker 3 (19:15):
It must have been very tiring sometimes, but yeah, I
know Grace Kelly, she she was not in Hollywood very
long and she made eleven films in just a few years.
Speaker 4 (19:27):
Yeah, so I think she was kind.
Speaker 3 (19:28):
Of doing back to back to back films and then
I think but then, you know, at the same time, though,
when she left Hollywood, she really missed it and she
wanted to come back. She missed acting, even though you know,
I'm sure at times she found it very tiring.
Speaker 2 (19:43):
Yes, And I think that's probably a lot of people,
is you kind of get tired of burnout, ready to
go on. But if you truly love something, it probably
never truly leaves you, exactly. That's probably with Grace Kelly exactly.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
Yeah, Well, Jennifer, thank you so much for coming on
spending some time with us. To our listeners. The book
goes on sale September the thirtieth, so go out in
pre order your copy today. We just touched the tip
of the iceberg. When it comes to rear Window, the
(20:20):
making of a Hitchcock masterpiece in the Hollywood Golden Age,
You're not going to be disappointed. Jennifer does a fantastic
job of talking about the movie and giving us some
insight on that, and again, Jennifer, thank you so much
for coming on and spending some time with us. Today.
Speaker 3 (20:40):
Oh, thank you so much, Doug. Thanks for having me
on the show. It's been wonderful.
Speaker 2 (20:45):
Well, thank you and thank you for listening to this
episode of Forgotten Hollywood. Join us next time. As we
released the latest episode, thank you for listening
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