Our Updated Top 5 Disney+ MCU Episodes : Marvel Alliance 276

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:12):
Welcome to the Marvel Lions Podcast, recover anything and everything
to do with the Marvel Universe from the comics, TV
and movies. We will go from Earth six one six
at the moto Verse to the TVA in order to
bring the Marvel Unise right to you. I'm the Man
without Fear, Chris, I'm the nerve with the mouth David
Alliance a Symbolble volume two hundred and seventy six, and yes,

(00:34):
welcome to this current era of Marvel Alliance where we
are truly the victims of Marvel, Marvel Studios, and Marvel
just basically saying you know what, Yeah, we're not gonna
pump out news and you know, we're just gonna kind
of lead people hanging in doing some fun stuff. So yeah,
so that's why we took last week off, and we

(00:54):
weren't going to try to take two weeks off unless
we had to. So we've got a kind of an
evergreen topic tonight to uh talk about that David has
not been a part of and I've updated some things
about maybe some of my choices. So yeah, so we're
gonna have a you know, no honest, no big news
in the rumor mill hasn't been strong necessarily, and uh,

(01:16):
you know, David wanted David, and I just said, you
know what, you know, let's let's just have some fun
and basking the the past of what has been marvel
streaming television. So but yeah, so it's been been a
couple of weeks. How you've been, David, I've been pretty good.

Speaker 2 (01:33):
Just work, been busy, life and busy having fun with kids.
And it's been in a lot of time playing video
games and catching up on sleep.

Speaker 1 (01:43):
Yeah, it's it's been. Uh, it's been busy the last
two weeks. Uh, it's you know, work's been good, family
has been good, and soccer season has come to an
end and and then you know it's freed up a
little bit of time. But you know, with Halloween week
this week, it's also you know, for us in the

(02:03):
education world, it's a it's a week of excitement, but
it's also a week of trepidation to see, uh, how
that's gonna go. But thank goodness it's on a Friday
because the kids get to celebrate and don't come back
the next day because they got a weekend to take
some of that sugar out of him.

Speaker 2 (02:18):
So yes, yeah, no, rappers in the hallways or on
seats or in other random places.

Speaker 1 (02:26):
It'll probably happen still a little bit on Monday, but hey,
you know it'll it'll be interesting. But what what are
you all addressing up for Halloween? We gotta we gotta
at least talk a little bit about it.

Speaker 2 (02:36):
Uh, this is the first year in a while I
am not dressing up as anything other than maybe throwing
on a Spider Man mask. One kid is a demon
version of the Scream Guy, and another one is an
inflatable man writing a alien. I think, yeah, it's something
weird and inflatable, and he absolutely had to have it.

(02:58):
And out of all the things that was inside of
the Halloween store, which some of these costumes that they have,
I am surprised that are sold in stores, that's what
he picked. And I was like, oh, it's appropriate, it fits.

Speaker 1 (03:12):
All right, all right? Yeah, yeah, my kids are dressing up.
One is Batman and my daughter is going to be Cinderella.
So it is. The interesting thing is like she hasn't
talked about Cinderella all year. It's basically she's been one
of the all into Wicked, and so I could have

(03:34):
sworn Alphaba, Glinda something. Nope, Cinderella, and I asked her.
The other asked her last time. I said, why Cinderella,
She's like, I don't know. I said, okay, well you'll
be different, all right, yeah, but it'll be fun. I'm
debating whether, depending on how tired I am when I
get home from work, is whether I'm going to my

(03:54):
old reliable Indiana Jones. I've got all the gear for that,
I've done that last couple of years. But if I'm
particularly tired and just want to throw on one thing,
I'm down in that scarlet Spider hoodie because dang, I
love that hoodie so much. Yeah, it's it's a good point.
And those who know are there, the ones you know?

(04:15):
And I would do wear it out at some points
and people say, dude, I love that. I was like,
you know, don't you you know who this is?

Speaker 2 (04:21):
Yeah, it's that has got to be a marvelous choice.
So the Spider Man for me is the old reliable Like,
if I just don't feel like doing anything, I have
the full costume my ward last year, but this year
it's probably just gonna be I'm gonna be more casual
Spider Man, like in his uh button up shirt, just
throw on the mask and swinging out in your regular clothes.

Speaker 1 (04:45):
Yeah, and pipa Jack and they're saying, I'm dressing up
like a Clark. Can't figure it would be easy to
fling fling bail in. Oh yeah it would be. He says.
Kid isn't participating, but again he's seventeen, so he's over it. Yeah.
Well it ebbs and flows. They go out of it
for and then they want to I want to come back.
But yeah. So yeah, if you did notice, we say

(05:06):
we were off, but if you noticed in your feeds
there was a short episode. Mister Travis Snell decided to
come in and I guess he'd taken some umbradge with
what I had said last week in response to his
little quote unquote joke that he tagged me with. And

(05:27):
you know, we've gone back and forth a little bit,
but he wants an answer to his quote unquote challenge. Well,
you know, he responded that he for my call out
to questions that he did have a question and he
hasn't received an answer yet. Well, guess what, there's a
time and place for answers to those, and we call
them the listener feedback section. So if you're hoping Travis

(05:49):
to hear an answer to your challenge, you're not going
to get it right now. You're going to get some
sort of answer in the listener feedback section, so you know,
stay tuned, some sort of answer, keyword, some sort of answer.
But since we've got a show to get on and uh,
you know we you know, we want to move on

(06:10):
to what we do best here at that point, so
let us before we get into that. We have the
lovely network plugs the out of the way. So we
are part of the gig Ultimate Alliance Network with six
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(06:31):
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(06:53):
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We've got the DC Alliance guys doing their DC film
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up his multi verse minutes thirty plus Days of Halloween,
and he also the first in the fifteenes he does

(07:15):
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(08:21):
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(08:44):
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(09:07):
Men Onslought Aftermath Volume two, Brand New Day Spider Man,
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(09:28):
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to thank them for being our official sponsor. All right,
take that down there we go. Yep, I'm definitely teasing
it at that point. You know, again, you gotta gotta
make people wait, you know, especially when they try to

(09:49):
call you out and accuse you of things that you know.
You know, it's funny when you spend information, spin facts.
You know, he's been he's been watching too much of
the American American news media these days.

Speaker 2 (10:00):
Right, Yeah, you's definitely got the spin down.

Speaker 1 (10:04):
An important question, are you snagging that X Men? I
need more clarification. I don't know what you mean. Oh
oh oh, you talked about the book. Yes, I will
be definitely picking up, uh, the that X Men one,
because I have the aftermath all you want, so I've
got to get that. So yeah, but I don't know

(10:26):
how many more I've got. I'm pretty I'm pretty solid
on X Men. There's not been any more I need
left to fill my holes, but fill my holes of
my bookcase. Yeah, I gotta yeah clutch, Yes exactly. I
almost almost almost missed that one. So anyways, all right, So,
like we said at the opening, news has been non
existent in the Marvel Studios land post New York Comic Con,

(10:50):
So we are doing an evergreen topic that Brent and
I had did late last year. Interesting enough, almost the
same timelinelast year, but David wasn't a part of it,
and a lot more shows have come out and we've
added in the Netflix era since technically it is canon
to now the MCU there was questions about it, so

(11:14):
I don't even think we did it. So we are
looking at our updated top five MCU streaming episodes. So
you know, day when day when I brought it up
to David, I asked him, is do you want to
include Netflix? Eson Absolutely, and I figure, knowing how we
both kind of travel in similar circles and certain likes

(11:34):
that we have with certain episodes, I wanted to make
sure that you know, we have some backups because you know,
if you put something out there, I put something out there,
you know, it obviously would be on our list, you know,
so that way it would be interestingly our top five
but also ends up being a top ten list. So
I don't think we necessarily need to have these any
sort of particular order. They're just these are our favorite

(11:56):
five episodes in Marvel streaming.

Speaker 2 (11:59):
Yeah, I was able to collect there's a lot of
good episodes. So we both have a lot of backups
just in case, you know, someone calls out something. We've
got options. We've got so many in the chamber just
in case.

Speaker 1 (12:13):
Yep, So I will I'll start off and there because
I was thinking it was like, man, what's gonna be
my first voice? To what's gonna be that first choice
is gonna be And even looking back and writing my
notes for the episodes, I was like, man, you know,
it just inspires using like you were saying, like you

(12:34):
you watched one of your choices that happened to be
a penultimate episode. You know, I got to finish it
at that point. Man, I wish it makes me want
to go back and watch a number of these series,
particularly this this season, which I even thinking back to
my list, I think this still is my favorite series

(12:55):
of all time on of the you know when the
MC started putting these on Disney plus the the It
is Loki Season two, Episode six, Glorious Purpose. So so
this is this is the season. This is what we're

(13:16):
just basically call it the series finale of Loki. And
what a perfect title for it, because again it is
the line that he has always said, like he is
he is in what does he say? He's burdened with
glorious purpose since the beginning, and it is a full
circle moment for Loki, especially with you know, confronting the

(13:41):
overwhelming responsibility maintaining the multi versus stability. It's deeply moving,
almost mythological kind of ending. To it visually stunning, emotionally
resonant Hidleston's performance, especially as he's going through and having
this Groundhog Day like experience where he's going through trying

(14:01):
to every time he thinks he's got it figured out
to save the time loom and it still blows up
in his face. And then that the confrontation between him
and he who he should not be named, you know,
yeah or excuse me, not huge he you remain excuse me,

(14:22):
and just that conversation and he says, yeah, you're gonna
do this, gonna do this, and then wait a minute,
We've done this before, and then it Loki just kind
of drops that, oh, you got there, and he and
he just the line the callbacks to thor the callbacks
to everything. And this is a villain, a Truan villain

(14:45):
that was introduced to us that has been a thorn
on the side, and the arc that this character goes
to become a fan favorite and to basically now be
you know, the definition of I one can call him
a hero, but I still think we call him an
anti hero because I don't think I think he's got
he's laying more heroic than villain now. But I still

(15:08):
think that calling him an anti hero is not a
knock against him. I think he's definitely one of those
that we can put up as Yeah, he's he's grown,
he's he's changed, and that with the position he's put
himself in. Man, I can't wait to hopefully see him
in Doomsday and Secret Wars because it's he's gonna be
a critical part of this and I mark my words,

(15:29):
he will be a member of this Avengers team.

Speaker 2 (15:32):
Yeah, this was also on my list because it is
a great episode. I was talking to Brent about it today.
Everyone in this episode puts on a stellar performance, including
the actor behind Victor Timeley I, you know, separating the
art from the artists. Like everyone in this episode played

(15:53):
a part and played it so well. And this is
the While it is both the Koleman name of Loki's journey,
it also ends and sets up a way that this
could either be the end of the story or this
can be the bigger branching universe that is set forth.
So like, I'm excited to see where we go with

(16:16):
this character because in every time we've seen Loki, he
has not been a just background character, but this has
taken him from just that villain to a more complex, layered,
deep character where you find yourself at times going He's
still a bad guy, he's still selfish at times, but

(16:37):
this is a man of layers and everything about this
was great. In that final scene, everything coming together, the
whatever budget that they decided to spend on him recreating
the loom, Thank you for breaking the bank on that,
because that entire scene, him sitting on the throne, his

(16:58):
crown rebuilt, as he's going like everything about that, I
was just like, yes, this is an amazing piece of television.

Speaker 1 (17:06):
Yeah, so all right, what's your first one you want
to talk about?

Speaker 2 (17:10):
Okay, so my first one that I want to talk about,
I will get straight into it. It's not the best
of my list, but it's the one that again last
night I watched it, I loved it, and it made
me watch more. And that is Punisher Season one, episode
twelve Home. And that is because in this episode Punisher
goes full Punisher. You get every aspect of both Frank

(17:34):
Castle and the Punisher, like the viciousness of him and
everything else. But it's also juxtaposed with as he's going
in and out of consciousness at times, he's having the
flashbacks to his wife. He's having that moment of do
I be Frank or do I go ahead and be
the Punisher? But then you see just the gruesomeness of

(17:59):
why he's doing what he's doing. He's embraced the Punisher
by this point, He's full on in it, and the
scenes with him. Yes, I've got one.

Speaker 1 (18:13):
We both got him. We both for those that were
held in me. Both David and I got our respective
Frank and Daredevil funkos in the last couple of weeks.

Speaker 2 (18:23):
Yep, they they're here, They're ready. And this episode, yep,
this was to be Punisher at one of his most
at one of his most Punisher moments, and just the
full on accepting of I am no longer Frank the
family man. I'm giving up on that. I'm I love

(18:46):
and here's everything with my wife and my family, but
I'm letting go to fully embrace being the Punisher.

Speaker 1 (18:55):
Yeah, and this is all. This was also as one
of one of my choices. Every episode of The Punisher
stands out for a reason on its own, but when
thinking of the show as a whole, this episode comes
to mind for me for one of the most disturbing reasons.
Eye gouging isn't a method of killing the scene on

(19:16):
TV very often and except for a few notorious circumstances
poor Pedro Bascal and Game of Thrones, But for Marvel
it's essentially unheard of until like you know, fairly recently,
and that was until Punisher delivered one of the most
hard to watch scenes in TV history. But that feeling
of unease, discuss, discomfort, and shock is exactly part of

(19:38):
the why, the reason this episode was so good for
a piece of media to get under the skin so
much as this penultimate episode of this Punisher's first season
proves just how much it had held over its fans
and how much the target audience has come to feel
for these characters. Between it intertwining sequences, clever cuts, and

(19:58):
brewing culmination of the SEASONSTF Home is one of the
best episodes I completely agree of that of the Punisher series,
the most personally incisive look of why Frank does what
he does is Home, the twelfth the you know, the
twelfth episode of this first season. Their viewers, we see

(20:19):
images of a happy family, his military decor seemingly sweet
normalality of life that he had. Like we Frank, we
all we've noticed Frank is grit Now we see him
really as a husband, a father, and it all ends
with an interrogation gone wrong at least for the bad guys,
and Frank getting some much needed revenge on Agent Orange,

(20:40):
another overarching villain. It's the best punsure content out there
with its vulnerable illustration of Frank's purpose. And that's the
thing when it comes down to the Punisher that it
people just say, oh, it's just people like, you know,
a guy that just goes out and kills sings. Then
you're missing the that's that's the most that that's you're

(21:03):
missing the entire idea of what the Punisher is. And
I point to so many different writers that have that
have done Punishers so well, but the besides their create
his creators at that point, you know, the modern run
that that brought Punisher into this kind of like this

(21:23):
is how you can write it is garth Ennis. Garth
Ennis is still to this day my favorite Punisher writer
of all time. Yeah, I know, and this and he
and and the series captures it very well.

Speaker 2 (21:38):
Yeah, this again, it was you get the full scope
of who Frank Castle is as a man, as a father,
as a husband, and then as who he is now
letting literally letting go of his wife in order to say, Nope,
I'm going to finish the mission that I have within myself.

(21:59):
I'm I'm going to go back to this war that
I am in, and the way that he takes down
Asient Orange, and the way that he just fully unleashes
on him, like you've already taken this guy out and
you are just pounding him, and then the moment with
taking out the eyes and everything else, it was just

(22:20):
it shows you, Okay, Frank has embraced who he is
as the Punisher. And I watched it again last night
and I was like, I just have to finish the
series now.

Speaker 1 (22:30):
Yep, I mean it might as well. All right, so
my next one. This series, I every time I go
back and revisit it, every time I think about it
to say it's just quote unquote standard Marvel. There was
so much more going on, and I got into some

(22:50):
pretty heated discussions with friends of mine about it and
why this show was a lot had a lot deeper
things and quote unquote people want to say certain things
about the show, fine, but I think there is a
lot more going on, and I'm so glad they didn't
shy away from certain things and confronted it, and that

(23:15):
would be The Falcon and the Winter Soldier. And I'm
specifically talking about episode five Truth taking the name from
the mini series of the of the same name. Looking
at the first quote unquote the first Captain America or
some people got the first you know, African American Captain America.
Marvel Falcon was sold just often remembered as one of

(23:37):
Marvel's most uneven Disney Plus efforts. Episode five, I truly,
I just I disagree with that. I understand why people
say it, but I think, you know, knowing what the
show is going through behind the scenes, I think what
they bring in with Truth represents everything this year is
is about. You know, Sam Wilson and Bucky Barnes retrieved
Captain America's show from John Marker and his public downfall,

(23:59):
and then that's sequence alone and basically breaking John Walker's
arm to get the shield up. I mean, that was
visceral way to open the episode after we saw the
previously what John Walker did after decapitating someone on live TV.
Reclaiming his shield, Tam grapples with the weight of Captain
America's Mantle and the complicated history of black heroes in America.

(24:21):
The Epistle's absolutely no punches. It delivered emotional, thought provoking
scenes between Sam and Isaiah Bradley, played by expertly to
this day one of the best best supporting characters that
Marvel brought into this I'm so proud that it's so
happy that they did, with Carlo playing Isaiah Bradley, giving
the story of the richest and the residents rarely seen

(24:43):
in superho TV. At the same time, Bucky's arc reaches
a cathartic turning point as he begins making amends for
his past. The pacing sills down to allow the characters
to breathe, making the payoff hit even harder. When Sam
finally steps into his destiny. The subsequent scene quickly became
everything the Falcon Winner Soldier promised it would be. But
that conversation between Isaiah and Sam still gives me goosebumps.

(25:10):
And just when he when Carla Lee as Isaia Bradley
says they will never let a black man be Captain America.
You know you just you hee the pain, you hear
what happened to him, and it's just like everything everything
right there is laid out on the table and his.

Speaker 2 (25:31):
Follow up and nor should you want to like, you know,
they don't want you there. And from my perspective, why
do you want this mantle to celebrate people who did
not want us? Yes, that is an amazing, amazing episode.
Uh we that's also weird. We get the scene with

(25:53):
Zimo and the dor melage. We get don't call her
val saying that, hey, you made the right choice offering him,
you know, his chance to make things right. We get
these scenes with Sam back home in Louisiana and his
sister Sarah having her moments with Bucky. Like, there's just

(26:15):
so many, so many moments that Bill characters in here.
That is jess it. Yeah, that is an amazing episode.

Speaker 1 (26:25):
Yeah, So what's your second pick?

Speaker 2 (26:29):
All right? My second pick is going to be Moonnight
episode five Asylum.

Speaker 1 (26:36):
All right, all right? Also put it put on my list,
And it's a very good choice, I would agree.

Speaker 2 (26:43):
Yeah. From everything from the field of Reeds and how
they did that, and just the beauty and the specter
of no pun intended of everything that is being shown
in this afterlife at the boats, the duot and everything,
it's just it was it was pretty cool just to

(27:06):
see that moment as Okay, you know, Mark Spector, you're dead,
but you're being weighed on the scales of justice to
determine whether you have to go here, whether you get
to go there. And as he's going through all this,
you have doctor Harrow who is trying to convince him

(27:26):
to open up and let him in. But we also
see the moments of Stephen Grant and Mark Spector and
how these two became to be, the breaking of his
brother dying, his mom blaming him for the death, and
just the way that he cracks. So all through this
series we had been seeing him have these missed calls

(27:49):
with his mom, only then to find out that this
was just his two personalities and this is how he
coped with that pain by breaking literally breaking in a moment.
And you watch this break happen in kind of real
time as he's walking down the street, And like, this

(28:11):
was some incredible acting in this episode. So yeah, it
definitely made my lists.

Speaker 1 (28:20):
Yeah, I remember a quote from if you Know from
Mark Spector is played by Oscar Isaac saying, you try
taking a life, see how quickly you forget?

Speaker 2 (28:31):
Yeah, you know?

Speaker 1 (28:33):
And in a series filled with you know the series
looking at the idea of mental illness and of what
happens to a person at this point going through trauma
that's layered on trauma, Asylum goes above and beyond the
rest in exploring you know, Moonnight and Mark, Spector and
Will's also getting deeper into the Egyptian mythology than any

(28:57):
other chapter of the series. Mark and Stevens journey through
the Underworld serves as a very suitable pretext for a
flashback centric episode with that answers questions, raises more because
again it's Moonnight, you can't help but raise more questions,
and sets the stage for a blockbuster finale with a
very interesting conclusion. In my opinion, Asylum reveals to audiences

(29:21):
everything you could want to know about the story of
Mark's life, the origin of the mental health struggles, and
then how he became enslaved by Kanchu, with Specter forced
to relive this tormented pass while Grant discovers it for
the first time. Osgarsy delivers two great, different and compelling
performances in the same episode, with Stephen acting as the

(29:43):
vessel for the viewer to uncover the mystery of who
he is. I agree. I think Asylum shines through the
depth and it gives the main hero the stellar performances,
the sides of the Egyptian mythology dives into, and how
exceptionally it sets up an even bigger end. After all,
there's nothing better than to pre date an action oriented

(30:04):
finale than a profound character piece. And that's what I
think A lot of times we see with Marvel pendultimate episodes, Like,
we don't get a lot of strong finales, but those
penultimate episodes seem to kind of hit home.

Speaker 2 (30:16):
Yeah. Uh, I will say Marvel does good with two things,
penultimate episodes and episode fours.

Speaker 1 (30:23):
Yeah, okay, fair well, I won't throw an episode four
at you. I don't know. I'm looking at my list
right now. Do I have an episode four on here?

Speaker 2 (30:33):
I've got one, two, three, four, more episode four?

Speaker 1 (30:36):
Oh? Okay, well there are you're you're I think you
might Nope, I do have an episode four. I do
have an episode four as one of my choices. We'll see,
if we'll see it may become an honorable mention. But
all right, so yeah, let's take an ad break before
we continue with our list. So listeners use ads help
keep the lights on the GEG Ultimate Alliance Network. We

(30:57):
don't get to choose what ads come on, and they
could be a bit loud to give it recount before
they come on. Three two one, we'll be right back
and we are back, all right. So you know, this
is when you have a lot of choices and it's
just like, uh, you know, could it be on there?
But I this episode. I don't think many of us

(31:21):
thought anything like this of a of a show of
this cop was good. But we were like, oh my goodness,
I can't believe they did this. I can't believe an
episode brought this out there. And it's gonna be not
an episode four, but an episode five from X Men

(31:42):
ninety seven, episode five. Remember it.

Speaker 2 (31:45):
The minute you said episode five, I knew exactly where
you were going.

Speaker 1 (31:49):
It's it's, you know, it's one of those where I
have other choices, but this is one that truly is
is on a list, and I know it's probably would
be really much on your top five, and a lot
of people is just because it's an animated show. I'm
not knocking animation. I'll be the first one to defend
animated movies and animated shows that our quality. But man,

(32:09):
who would have thought that X Men ninety seven would
have delivered the episode that just people said. I mean
I literally when I saw it that morning, I had tears.
I had I was getting welled up. I was having
some tears because it was so powerful. It was so
like I didn't think we were building up to something

(32:31):
like that. It's devastating, unforgettable. That left us, That left us,
as viewers generally be included, shaken. You know, when a
wild sentinel invades Genosha, several mutants leap into action, most
notably Gambo, who finds itself making the ultimate sacrifice during
the desperate battle between Bastian's forces. I mean, we started

(32:53):
picking up by that point, like whoever says previously on
X Men, that's what the episode was going to focus on.
In a minulight saw the title says, oh no, Like
I started thinking about it and saying, no, they won't.
They won't. They won't do that to Gamb, But they won't.
I mean, I know it's comic accurate, but they wouldn't
do that. Yep, there you go, Fifth of Jack. Yes,
that that hits all the fields. The writing gave Remy

(33:16):
an emotional spotlight that he long deserved. It portrayed him
not only as a charming rogue, but a true hero
writing to lay down his life for mute kind. They
have those pacingers, relentless building tension throughout the heartbreaking climax
where he uh meets his end in a blaze of glory,
where he grabs on to the after he gets stabbed
in the in his side, you know, and he just

(33:38):
looks up and grabs on and uses his Connecticut energy
and says, the name's Gambit, remember it. And even prior
to that, like his hole, going back and forth with Rogue,
and there you know, is she or is she gonna
be with Gambit or she gonna be with Magneto. The
animation voice acting combined to deliver one of Marvel's most

(33:58):
emotionally charred moments. Rogues heartbreaking grief is powerful at the
end when she's just a I can't feel you and
you just did the lifeless body that just her holding
his his hand and you just see the tears streaming down.
I can't feel you. It defines it literally is for

(34:19):
the entire series, the best episode of X Men, x
Men the animated series of all time. It really is.

Speaker 2 (34:26):
I agree this it is on my list again. The
minute you said episode five, I knew exactly what you
were talking about. I mean, we can go on and
wax poetically about the Gambit and rogue stuff all day long.
It was It is the heartbeat of the episode. But
there's also other great moments. You have the newscasts interviewing

(34:49):
the X Men, and I will say three words to this.
Cyclops was right his speech when she asks why they're lying?
Why put on the facade? And he's uh. She says,
we gave you a chance to be normal, and so
why did you lie? And he says, because you're normal.

(35:09):
He says, you're ungrateful. We fight risk our lives for you,
evil mutants, robots, crazy aliens. I gave him up. I
gave him up because you can't say thank you, because
I have to stomach your questions and prove that I'm
a person. I lie because the truth is were nothing
like you. And thank God because it's the only reason
you people are still alive.

Speaker 1 (35:31):
I was like, my man, let it out. Then realize,
dang it, I can't believe I said that on it. Yeah,
but there were just so many the gravity of this episode,
the amount of stuff that they packed into this episode
for everyone. Then you had the deaths of the people

(35:52):
from the Council as this whole thing is going on,
like Sebastian Shaw, Madeline Pryor, like all these big names
are going down, and yes, the Gambit part just there
is nothing about that. When he's driving that motorcycle up
there and he's about to make his attack, I'm like, oh,

(36:12):
my man is going full Kamakazi. I'm here for it,
And yeah, he lets through and rogues tears at the end.
Magneto's moments at.

Speaker 2 (36:23):
That point, just everything about that was the fear in
the new mutant's eyes as they feel like they are
about to die, the Morlocks watching the deaths happen around them,
and just the fear and the sadness in their eyes.
Yet it was incredible.

Speaker 1 (36:42):
Yeah, all right, what's your third choice? All right?

Speaker 2 (36:47):
My third choice? I am going to go a lot
more lighthearted with this one and stick to my Episode
four since I just minutced mentioned it, and I'm gonna
go Episode four partners am I right? The most fun episode.
It had LARPing and and it had us falling just

(37:13):
head over heels in love with two characters that going
into this, you did not realize they were gonna just
be the the fun, great episode, The Yolena moments of this,
it's just it's fun. It gave you another layer to
this character that made a lot of people see her
in a different light. Get that, you know, those laughs

(37:37):
with her character, the making macaroni things like that, the
fight in the elevators over pushing the button, things like that.
Like just all those moments between her and Kate Bishop, you,
oh Kate Bishop, those interactions between them, it was just
it was a fun episode. And then yeah, watching the LARPing,

(37:57):
watching Clint have to his stuff back, but having to
go through, Hey, the nerds in the park hab it,
so this is what we got to do in order
to get it, and then just genuinely having fun in
those moments of all the other heated battles that are
going on right now.

Speaker 1 (38:14):
Yeah, Yeah, it's just I would say that it is
the interaction between the whole LARPing sequences that's like it
introduced a whole subculture for people who didn't know what
LARPing was at that point. No, I mean the Hawkeye
itself is just so great. It is one of those
that you know, it's it's in my Christmas rotation now

(38:36):
because it is a Christmas show and it use it
uses kind of the backdrop of it, and it deals
with the idea of what this That part of the
phase of Marvel was post traumatic stress, like how do
you deal with you know, you're the traumatic stress of
what you've been through and getting your family back and
legacy and you know someone that you know, Kate Bishop,

(39:00):
who's trying to find her place and wanting to prove
herself at that point. But yeah, that you know everything
about it. Yeah, it's great choice, Absolutely great choice. Yeah,
all right, I'm gonna bring this also to a Netflix episode.
We're gonna go back to a season two Daredevil season

(39:26):
two not an episode four, an episode three entitled New
York's Finest. So this is the season that introduces Frank
Castle in unforgettable fashion, and New York's Finest solidified him
in this single episode as one of Marvel's television's greatest characters.

(39:47):
After capturing Daredevil, the punish her ties him to a
rooftop and deliver is one of the MCU's most compelling
philosophical debates. Their argument over morality. Just as the nature
of Vigilantism remains the highlight in my opinion of Marvel storytelling.
Charlie Cox and John Burnthal deliver a powerhouse performance of

(40:08):
this character study. The episode master of the balance of
dialogue driven tension and raw action. It culminates in a
brutal Hallway Starewell fight, you know, very infamous for that
show where Daredevil battles gang members while still shackled. Come on,
I mean that right there alone. But the juxtaposition of

(40:29):
intimate character drama and bone crushing combat encapsulates why Daredevil
remains so beloved and why we are both looking forward
to Born Against season two. New York's finance is more
than does a showcase for the Punisher. It is a
searing mediation on what separates a hero from a killer
and why that distinction matters.

Speaker 2 (40:49):
Yeah, this was a great episode. In this episode actually
inspired our post credit scene, so stick around for that.
But there were so many great moments, you know, seeing
Darede Wil like strung up, the gun taped to the hand,
all of that happening, I mean, and this was also
the episode like I begin to just hate Samantha Reyes

(41:13):
and Blake Tower, and I was just like, I you, guys,
everything about this is getting on my nerves. But the
back and forth between Frank and Daredevil, and then the
moment on the rooftop where I believe the gentleman's name
is Jerry comes up to listen to he's the super
and tries to figure out what's going on, and him

(41:35):
and Frank have that moment and talk about their service
in the Marine Corps. But all the while Punishers sitting
there with a gun behind the door, like, all right,
if he tries to press, if this doesn't work, I'm
willing to take him out to continue my mission. But
he's just talking to him like two old Vet marines

(41:55):
and they're bonding over that. And then he instantly turns
and goes back to what they're doing because like he's
just like, I don't want to kill this guy, but
I will because Mike, I need to a keep Daredevil
shrung up and be take out the Dogs of Hell
at their clubhouse. So boom, and yeah, it's just a
great moment. And you have that fight scene between Daredevil

(42:19):
and the Dogs of Hell and them going through and
him with the chain wrapped around his hand. All that's
just amazing.

Speaker 1 (42:26):
Yeah, all right, what's your fourth?

Speaker 2 (42:30):
All right, my fourth? I will uh stick with the
Netflix error and I will go Jessica Jones Season one,
episode nine, The Sin bin Ah.

Speaker 1 (42:44):
Okay, baby, I was gonna put that my next one,
but thank you for.

Speaker 2 (42:49):
So this is kill Grave in the Box and David
Tinnett acts the hell out of this episode for him
being confined the entire time, but he still is the big, bad,
menacing villain. They make you still feel scared of him
and scared of anything he can do. But then also

(43:11):
as you're getting this look into his past, what his
parents put him through, and then what he ends up
doing to his parents as a result. Like everything about
this episode is just it's David Tennant just being full
on kill Grave. And this was the first time that
as watching this entire season because I watched him as

(43:35):
a version of the Doctor, the tenth version of the
Doctor and Doctor Who for years before this, so I
still saw the fun, loving guy until this episode. I
was like, he he is committed to this bit and
I was like, yeah, it was a great There was
great moments with Hogarth, you know, Jessica and her sister

(43:57):
and they're fracturing of listening to each other. So, yeah,
this everything about this and again the moment with him
and his parents where you find out the experiments that
they did to him, the torture that they put him through,
and then him the way that he ends up taking
out his parents as a result. Just it was a

(44:19):
lot of great acting for someone who was trapped in
a jail cell the entire time.

Speaker 1 (44:24):
Yeah, so I will start off my kind of discussion
of this one a good choice. How dangerous is kill Grave,
how terrifying is kill Grave? How brilliant is David Tenant
in this role? Watched this episode and just bear witness
to how terrifying and how great of an actor David

(44:48):
Tennant is as kill Grave, the Purple Man.

Speaker 2 (44:50):
You know.

Speaker 1 (44:51):
Jessica thinks she's got a good plan to take down him,
and it involves kill Grave's parents. Jessica finally has kill Grave.
He's in a cage where he belongs. But in a
world of superheroes, nothing ever goes as planned, and it
doesn't work. And one of the most brutal things and

(45:12):
anything I'm see really, kill Grave orders his mother to
stab herself to death and then orders his father to
cut his own throat. Kill Grave can enthrall anyone until
they comply kill Grave and kill Grave watches Hogarth quickly
is tempted by everything that kill Grave has to offer.
I mean, while Trish gets her hands on drugs to

(45:34):
make Simpson what he is, and Simpson himself is currently
overdosing on the very same drugs becoming nuke later on.
The episode is top in might opinon top ranked. And
this is a good reason. There is simply so much
that happens here, and that's and that's so the writing
of this and all the information changes thrown our way.

(45:56):
This is the reason why Jessica Jones season one is
like nothing. The next two seasons don't even compare to it. Yeah.
I love Kristin Ritter as Jessica Jones, but the next
two seasons just did not do that character any justice.
Everything I point to when I say, if you want
to see something that you never see coming, watch us

(46:17):
gouz Own season one and don't watch anything else from
this show. It's just you'll be coming back saying, oh,
why couldn't it be this good?

Speaker 2 (46:25):
Yeah, and again, just amazing acting. David Tennant, just he
makes this episode and he makes you fear this villain
going through. So when everything happens at the end, you
feel Jessica is rightly justified in the action she took
based upon this episode and other actions like yeah, I

(46:47):
could see why she would come to that conclusion that
this is the only action that you have at this
point because he made you fear a man who all
he does is speak.

Speaker 1 (46:58):
Yeah, all right, So my final one, my number five.
It's always tough. I'll even say, well we can if
we want, we can do an honorable mention, one honorable
mention for both of us. So all right, this one, well, David,
I do have an episode four. I do have an
episode four on here.

Speaker 2 (47:18):
And.

Speaker 1 (47:20):
I'm going back to animation.

Speaker 2 (47:23):
I think I know where this is going.

Speaker 1 (47:26):
And a single episode can do so much, especially in
an anthology series, and just make you feel for a
twist of a character that man, what would you do
in this situation? And what would you do for the
one you consider the love of your life? And I'm
talking about what if episode four? What if Doctor Strange

(47:49):
lost his hands instead of his heart? So, you know,
the MCU has a habit of characters having to fight
themselves through throughout a franchise. You know, Nebula, Captain America, Vision,
and Loki have all had to square off with a
different version of themselves, though none of them can compare

(48:09):
to what Stephen Strange did in this episode. The only
sorcerer strong enough to stop Doctor Strange was Doctor Strange.
What If is always going to be something different for
the MSU and I think it's a series that had
a lot of potential, and I think there are episodes

(48:30):
that stand out amongst others. I think as a whole,
I still think there's there was plenty untapped there. I
hope one day they do come back to it. But
this is the series shows multiple deaths of multiple Avengers,
a world infested with zombies, post apocalyptic futures. But what

(48:51):
was achieved with Doctor Strange having his heartbroken by the
absolute point that was Christine Palmer's death and was overtaken
by desperate depression and grief before bringing the entire universe
to end of around him, realizing that no matter what
he did, Christine Palmer had to die and if he

(49:11):
stopped that everything would collapse around him. In that in
that moment, he didn't care, you know, and became the
monster and drag the power he sought and realizing no
matter what he did, no matter how much power had,
it was never going to go his way and taking

(49:33):
the lighthearted side of what we've known from Doctor Strange
and creating this alternative version where he becomes a villain.
But we all are like, what would we do in
that situation? Even confronted with the fact that you're never
going to change this, when this is an ultimate point
you cannot change it was another one saying wow again,

(49:55):
animation coming out swinging and putting us into this point
saying and that totally just breaks you as as a
viewer of this of this episode.

Speaker 2 (50:09):
Yeah, this starts off with you know, we have the
a version of the driving scene from the original Doctor Strange,
with this time Christine Palmer's in the car and she
in the crash. She ends up dying and he goes
to carmutage to try and figure out a way to
bring her back, and that is his entire journey is

(50:29):
how do I bring back the love of my life?
Including going so far to challenge the ancient one and
getting split in between Strange Supreme and the other side
of Stephen Strange. Having that get up sorb, he gains
all this power, then goes to bring her back, only
for her to be repulsed by the man he's become

(50:51):
in his quest for power and the ability to change everything,
to change this absolute point, to undo this paradox. She
doesn't want anything to do with him at this point,
and it it is an incredibly well written episode and
it's but it is also one of the many episodes

(51:13):
where the watcher does more than just watching.

Speaker 1 (51:17):
Yep.

Speaker 2 (51:19):
So yeah, no, that great, great, great episode, and yeah
that that was on my list of possibles. So the
minute you said animation in episode four, I knew exactly
where you were going.

Speaker 1 (51:29):
Yep. So all right, what's your final choice? All right?

Speaker 2 (51:33):
Uh, got three to choose from. I am going to
go with Daredevil season three, episode thirteen, A New Napkin.
That was the Netflix series finale before we got the comeback.
That was the series finale. That was the I beat
you everything about this episode, the fight between him and Fisk,

(51:59):
everything going on with Bullseye, like, this was an incredible
episode and the way that it ended at the time,
not thinking that we were going to get any more
of this for a very long time, I felt man
that this ended on an absolute banger for us if
we are not going to get this back.

Speaker 1 (52:22):
Yeah, this was. I can't even remember the episode it was.
It was an interesting you know, quote unquote evergreen stream
that Branch and I did was our favorite note and
he came up with the idea. And it's still a
fun episode. I should go back and revisit. But I
remember that this was the episode that we were looking
at where our favorite Marvel non action moments, and this

(52:49):
was and he he first had a question me on this.
He says the scene at the end where you know,
you know Matt as Darable goes like I'd be you
and just said like goes after him and said, I'm
not talking about the fight. I'm talking about the the
the dialogue that he has. You know, technically an action
secrets happened, but this is one where he all the

(53:12):
raw motion him taking off his mask and saying, and
I beat you. I found a way to get after you.
And if you so much as I think that you're gonna,
you know, release this stuff, she is going to go
down and going to go down hard. And remembering what
everything that transpires in that moment informs why things happen

(53:36):
the way they do. In Born Again Season one, like
this is this revenge on that for what he did
to him.

Speaker 2 (53:45):
When they're fighting and I mean, Daredevil's just giving him
hands and Fisk is like, look, I'm never gonna stop
going after you. Karen Page Nelson like I this is
who I am and unless you kill me, I am
going to take you out. And then Daredevil was just
beating him and the blood splattering on the White Rabbit

(54:09):
and the snow painting and everything else like that, and yeah,
it was it. Everything about that was awesome. Fist being
taken to jail and he's like, I just need a
moment to say goodbye to Vanessa and Mahony's like, yeah, no,

(54:29):
you didn't give you know, our people that same you
didn't give Nadine that privilege, so you don't get that privileged.
He didn't get say goodbye to his family, you don't
get say goodbye to yours, and just takes him out
and I'm just like, yeah, at everything about.

Speaker 1 (54:45):
This was.

Speaker 2 (54:48):
It was just a cool episode that ending the scenes
between Bullseye and Nadine and everything that goes on with that,
the showing how Vanessa like she is fully embracing the
evil side of this. So once we see her again
and born again, we know like, yeah, no, she's just

(55:10):
this cutthroat yeah.

Speaker 1 (55:14):
So, but yeah, so those are our our choices, you know.

Speaker 2 (55:19):
Yeah, so what what is your honorable mention? Because I
have to know at this point because I have one,
and yeah.

Speaker 1 (55:30):
All right, I pull up my list and make my
selection for my one honorable mention? All right, looking, damn,
I try to be I want to be very careful.
Hold on, I'm gonna fix my microe. There we go.

(55:50):
All right, Let's see where do I want to go
with this, because I you know, it's one of those
things where you want to spread out, spread the love
a little bit to other shows and other episodes, you know.
M mm hmmm. Let's see, all right, I will go

(56:13):
with where we started with Disney streaming at that point
to WandaVision episode five, on a very special episode, he
went with five with five yeah so uh that was
the moment of series. Her transformed from a quirkulo sitcom

(56:35):
to a full blown MCU epic. The Cracked and One
is idea like West do you begin to widen the prompts?
This prompts Vision to confront her about the increasing disturbing
reality around him. The heated argument is one of the
show's most gripping scenes, forcing Wanda to acknowledge her illusions. Meanwhile,

(56:56):
outside the world closes in a sword make their presence
more aggressive, exposing wand does control of the town. The
episode shocking final twist and the jaw dropping reveal, especially
when we were like, are they really doing it? You
turn on close capting, Oh yeah they did. Evan Peters
appearance as Wanda his brother Peter ignited a theories everywhere

(57:18):
of what's going on. By blending domestic sitcom tropes and
escalating superhero drama, the episodes struck the very perfect balance
in my opinion of mystery and emotional weight. It stands
out of one as Wand does one of Wana Vision's
one of the most defining game changing installments.

Speaker 2 (57:35):
Yeah, it was a great episode. I mean, I have
another episode of that was on my list of possibles,
but man, that was that whole season was good. The
way that they built that. The twist stagnific so confirmed.
Yes that Evan Peters You're not going to give your
freaking brow a hug like that moment right there, and

(57:58):
they're like, she recasts pa true, like all those moments
were good. I personally had episode eight on my list
as a possible because of the vision speech and just
everything with her breakdown. But now this episode was pretty great.

Speaker 1 (58:17):
Yeah, And like you said, the season, this season as
a whole as they were, you know, homaging. Every episode
was an homage to a certain era but also certain
types of a particular show.

Speaker 2 (58:29):
So yeah, my honorable mention is going to be and
it is only because of one scene. It's Daredevil's season
one episode four in the Blood. That is because this
is the episode that made me go they are really

(58:49):
letting Netflix do this character, and that is for the
car door scene involving Wilson Fisk. It was at the
time a shocker for Oh, we're doing this in a
Marvel property. We're we're going this far and at that
point you knew there there were no kid gloves on here.

(59:15):
They were going to allow this to have that maturity.
They were going to allow this character to be the dark,
gritty character that they are. And at that point I
was instantly hooked on the entire Netflix run because I
was like, at this point, if they're willing to do this,

(59:36):
let me see where they take these characters. This isn't
the you know, the fun guy in the suit, that
just the I'm a quote unquote big bad like I
like Michael Clark Duncan, but his version in the Ben
Affleck Daredevil was a tough guy in a suit, where
as this was I this is a formidable opponent.

Speaker 1 (59:59):
Yeah. Think you know, I think you kind of summed
it up right there, you know, not a not a
bad bad choice. I like it, you know. Yeah. So
all right, well, yeah, so that's those are kind of
that's my at least updated list. It's David's list at
that point, so be very uh, be very curious to

(01:00:20):
see what you all are thinking about that, and you know,
feel free to shoot us some of your choices in
our dms. At that point, I see excellent in the
chat saying just getting my best to Batman costume ready
for a Halloween party. Oh yes, you're on the other
side of the world. Halloween has already started for you,
so ye, but uh, I hope you have a good
time with that the party. Look word to see the

(01:00:41):
pictures later in my friend and but yeah, let's take
our final ad break for the evening and looking at
listener feedback uh factor fictions and then diving continuing into
Spider Man A Life Story issue three. So, as you know, listeners,
these ads to help to keep the lights on the
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(01:01:03):
two one, We'll be right back and we are back.
All right, So you've got I believe I put up
the Spidy signal as usual and we got some questions.

Speaker 2 (01:01:19):
Yeah, So I'm going to start with Brent's question and
then we can move on to the other part of feedback.
But let's start. You know, Brent has a question of
I'm hearing other podcasts talk about whether or not the
general audience would be able to understand having a Batman
in the DCU and another in the Reeves verse. There's

(01:01:42):
also talk of Spider Man four with Toby Maguire. People
never seem to bring up that multiple Spider Man could
cause confusion. Do you think people would be confused by
more than one Batman or Spider Man? And if the
answer is different for each.

Speaker 1 (01:01:57):
Character, why, hmm, that's a good question.

Speaker 2 (01:02:07):
I had an answer for this one immediately when I
read it, and that is that Marvel has already set
up the possibility by having them have the crossovers, by
establishing that there are multiple universes, by establishing that Toby
went back to his universe, you can have a Spider

(01:02:28):
Man for and it's well established that it's already over here. DC,
in my opinion, has not done a good job of
establishing this is in else world's. The best that I
did it with was the Flash and where that movie went,
and the fact that there's not going to be any
true fallout of that movie because of factors outside of

(01:02:49):
that movie, they didn't really get a chance to build on. Okay,
there are these separate universes, but because Marvel has set
up and reaffirmed that there are multiple universus, these things
can coexist at the same time. It's easier for you
to say, oh, yeah, we're bringing back him, and this

(01:03:10):
is Spider Man for but that's that universe, this is
universe whatever, whatever, this is not six one six, and
then people go, oh, okay, it's like, yeah, remember you
saw at the end of this movie he went back
to his universe. That's where this is versus DC. That
hasn't really established truly those differentials.

Speaker 1 (01:03:30):
Yeah, I think you bring up a very good point,
and I would agree with that. Where you know, when
you literally had it on screen three different versions of
Spider Man and their own history and their own where
they're currently at at that point, it would be easier
to bring in for them, while you know, one could
say with where DC is right now, you have a Batman,

(01:03:55):
you have a animated silhouette of another DC that DCU
Batman right now, but nothing else really to go along
with that. And I don't know if we've really had
really legitimately more than one live action going on at
the same time for Batman. You know, that was taken seriously,

(01:04:20):
and so it is very much a thing because people
are more there, there's enough clamoring for I want a
conclusion to the Garfield story. You know, we kind of
got one for Toby, but we definitely didn't get one
for Andrew. We don't. We've pretty much for the most

(01:04:42):
I've had conclusions for our Batman in some way, shape
or form, Whether we like it or not, conclusions have
been established. You know, obviously I would like to see
more out of Ben Afflex Batman, but we know we're not,
and so clamoring for something that I know we're not
going to get is fine, I think. Do I honestly
think we're going to get another Spider Man with Andrew

(01:05:05):
or Toby a solo I don't. I don't. I think
that the time, I would love it, but I just
don't think. I think we'd be more prevalent to get
them back in a Doomsday or Secret Wars than we
are for a solo outing. And that's right now where
I think my heart wants it. But I just I

(01:05:26):
think the time, I don't think it's happening. Good ideas,
but I just right now, I don't see enough there
that is going to say that we're a time where
the studios are going to really bank on that.

Speaker 2 (01:05:42):
Yeah, I don't see especially Toby. Like I'm glad that
he had the opportunity to come back, I don't see
him going and doing a full movie. I mean that
whole the joke about my back. I mean, the man
legitimately has back problems. There. There's going to be a
lot to going to an entire movie in holding that

(01:06:04):
franchise up, and there's a lot of weight and expectations.
So if they just bring them back in doomsday or
secret wars and have kind of a here's a flash
into his life and where it's at now, and you
just take a couple of minutes to here's his universe
and here's how he's thriving in that universe. I will
take that over you trying to force a two hour

(01:06:24):
movie and force these high expectations.

Speaker 1 (01:06:30):
Yeah, so, but yeah, not a bad question, so good
good thought at that point. All right, so is it
time for me to answer mister Snell's challenge.

Speaker 2 (01:06:42):
I give you the floor.

Speaker 1 (01:06:45):
Well, Travis, you know, despite despite what uh, you think
that you haven't been thanked enough. You know, there are
receipts out there to being think, I don't know what
more you want. It sounds like I don't think you
were joking necessarily, you know, I think there was a

(01:07:05):
little more of a little more of a serious nick nature.
So you can spin it all you want in the
sense of you know your you're you saying with a
joke or that you you know, deserve all the thanks.
And again I have given you many things, many different ways.
But it sounds like you want more and I don't

(01:07:25):
know what you know. We've tried to communicate and apparently
we both have friends on either side that are I know,
I will take no things for what people have supposedly
come after you and said, uh, definitely not at my
my egging on at any point. You know, people people
do what they do, and you know I don't control that.

(01:07:49):
But you know you you you challenged me for to
confront you in trivia at the geek Verse, you know,
twenty four hour stream that you know you you you've
come out triumphant against Taylor two to one in your
your your trilogy battle with that, and it sounds like

(01:08:12):
you want to start one up with me, you know,
uh for as you get you're using the kids, do
it for the kids at that point, and you know,
you know it's you know, why was it just like
you to put the kids involved into this and to
bait me like this? And you know this is my
wife's birthday weekend to to do this, and so now

(01:08:33):
you're making me choose between putting uh, my wife's birthday
weekend to confront your your way of your ego needs
to be boosted at that point. So you know, I
I've got to think a little bit more about what
I'm going to do and how I'm going to do

(01:08:54):
this and if if it's even possible, you know, I
I want to, you know, confront you on that one.
So you know, we're we're gonna have to see exactly
I'm gonna have to like think around and you know,
you're putting, like I said, you're putting me in between
my wife's birthday weekend, and I don't know how she
would feel about that? How would her wife feel about that?

(01:09:17):
Travis at that point? You know, so you know, we'll
see an ANSWER's coming. As I said, I will give
you some sort of answer. I gave you, you know,
an answer of a we'll see, But an ANSWER's coming.
An answer is coming very soon. Will you see it
coming when it happens? I don't know. We'll just have

(01:09:38):
to see when it comes. But are you paying attention?
Are you watching closely? An answer will be coming. Stay
tuned here we are.

Speaker 2 (01:09:57):
I await the response. My only hope is that he
does not choose the platform of the Gimmick this weekend
to air his responses, because I don't want to be
caught in the middle.

Speaker 1 (01:10:12):
You know, it's it's I just don't appreciate uh being
put in in a place where I have to choose
between uh, celebrating my wife's birthday and uh for the
children of British Columbian Hospital, which is an amazing organization
that does great things. So you know an answer is coming.

(01:10:34):
It does not does not right now, but it's comings.

Speaker 2 (01:10:40):
Stay tuned, listeners, it's it's it's heating up.

Speaker 1 (01:10:44):
Yeah, it's like I said, are you watching closely? So
all right, well, let's get back to uh, you know,
back to the normal episode. Back you know, back to action,
as they would say in another UH another favorite of nerds.
So factor Fiction's factor fiction time, Yes, I would say so.

(01:11:07):
All right, so let me pull back up those from
a couple of weeks ago. I believe these were mine,
and as always I have it pulled up. But if
you don't go back quick enough, it sends you back to,
you know, everything. I gotta fill dead air because Twitter

(01:11:28):
doesn't want to load right now.

Speaker 2 (01:11:30):
I'm excited for the ones that I have chosen this week.
Some of them I've had loaded for the last two weeks,
and then one of them I swapped out on the
fly yesterday.

Speaker 1 (01:11:45):
Oh okay, all right, I'm going back to here we go.
I'll trusty reliable. Ah, there we go, got it all right.
Number one Wanda and Scarlett, which will not appear in
Vision Quest New Footage. Sixty two point five percent said fact.
Thirty seven point five percent said fiction. Number two, Colleen

(01:12:09):
Wing will return in Dareduvil Born Against Season two as
the new Iron Fist. Forty seven point one percent said fact.
Fifty two point nine percent said fiction, you all disappoint
me for shame. Number three, we will see a major
team member of the X Men die in X Men
ninety seven and not be resurrected. Eighty four point six
percent said fact. Fifteen point four percent said fiction, So

(01:12:32):
someone else is on the chopping block. And number four
from our buddy Anthony Turk Barrett will return in Dareduvil
Born Against Season two fifty seven point one percent at
fat forty two point nine per cents at fiction. So
they want a little more Turk action.

Speaker 2 (01:12:50):
Yeah, I mean he is an alunchpin character and has
always provided good laughs.

Speaker 1 (01:12:57):
Yep, So all right, what you got, David? All right?

Speaker 2 (01:13:02):
So the first one is my most far fetched of
them all, and that is DC and Marvel will have
a live action crossover moment within the next two years.

Speaker 1 (01:13:16):
DC and Marvel will have a live action crossover moment.

Speaker 2 (01:13:21):
Crossover moment. This could be. This could be something as
small as them acknowledging, you know, on a character, just
like how we had in was It Peacemaker where they
acknowledged the Spider Man meme, you know, but actually having

(01:13:45):
a moment where we see a character crossover. They technically
they have done it and animation and kudos if you
know what I'm speaking of in particular.

Speaker 1 (01:14:04):
Yeah, it's you know, I know we've heard the you know, well,
is it the wanted Peacemaker to have dared Evil show
up at that point? I get the discussion about that
all right now. I don't see it happening.

Speaker 2 (01:14:24):
It's a far fetched one, but I think with them
having that, they have a comic book crossover happening again.
In the past, stan Lee made a cameo and Teen
Titans Go the movie. Uh so Stanley did a cameo
doing a stan Lee cameo and Teen Titans go the movie.
That's just how meta that they got with it. So

(01:14:47):
it's a hope, but we will see. I don't have
too much faith in it, but I think it is
even a non zero chance.

Speaker 1 (01:14:56):
Yeah, So Yep, I'm still I'm still fiction on it,
just because they very close.

Speaker 2 (01:15:01):
So yeah, fair enough, all right, factor fiction number two.
The events of Daredevil Born Again season two will be
the reason that Punisher meets spider Man.

Speaker 1 (01:15:13):
The event a Daredevil season two. But the question is, hm, hm,
you know, because we're supposed to be getting the the
special before season two, is at our assumption.

Speaker 2 (01:15:32):
Yes, still the still the assumption that that the special
is going to happen.

Speaker 1 (01:15:37):
Okay, well, I think the special is going to happen.
It's just a question.

Speaker 2 (01:15:40):
Well, it's it's going to happen before we get season two.

Speaker 1 (01:15:44):
Yeah, yeah, I mean they've you know, I you know,
I know what Charlie Cox says he's not in it
at that or no, he says he's not in like
Doomsday or Secret Wars at that point, or you know,
Brand New Day as well. Yeah, I think I think
something is going to be you know, alluded to at

(01:16:05):
that point. So yeah, I'll say a fact.

Speaker 2 (01:16:09):
Yeah, I think with that being their their last Surabbie
before the big movie, then we will that that's going
to lead into it. You know, Daredevil has met spider Man,
Dared Devil's met Punisher, that this is how they get
to it, and speaking of Spider Man, I'm gonna go

(01:16:30):
with uh factor fiction number three. In Avengers Secret Wars,
Toby McGuire will be there and reference the who are
the Avengers line with Tom Holland.

Speaker 1 (01:16:44):
So one more time say that and trying to follow it.

Speaker 2 (01:16:47):
In Avengers Secret Wars, Toby McGuire, Spider Man will reference
the who are the Avengers line with Tom Holland Spider
Man because we had that whole I was a part
of the Avengers. He's like, that's awesome. What are the Avengers?

Speaker 1 (01:17:07):
Yeah, it'd be kind of a fun for them to
acknowledge that. I would like it. At that point, Again,
it's a question of whether he's gonna show up or
not for it, but uh yeah, it'd be it'd be
a cool moment, you know that he gets, oh, so
this is the Avengers, this is what you're talking about?

Speaker 2 (01:17:24):
Yeah, like a little callback to that moment of Hey,
this is what I was talking about. These are the Avengers.

Speaker 1 (01:17:32):
Yeah, no, I could buy it. Yeah, I'd be down
with that.

Speaker 2 (01:17:35):
Yeah, all right, so those are my three.

Speaker 1 (01:17:40):
Yeah. Droga in the chat saying Matt Murdocks came here
I No Way Home is still one of the best
cameos of all.

Speaker 2 (01:17:44):
Time because he's a really good lawyer.

Speaker 1 (01:17:48):
Yeah he he knows a thing or two about a
thing or two, right yep. So all right, well I
will make sure that those are posted on Sunday afternoons.
Let your voices be heard with that, and let us
bring this episode to a conclusion by diving back into
Spider Man Life Story episode excuse me, issue number three.

(01:18:14):
So we are in the eighties now, and I love
the the cover of this with him in the black
costume in a tomb, so we know what we're dealing
with with this. So yeah, I love the kind of
you know, time has gone on, and you know he's
obviously with Mary Jane. She's pregnant with twins and you
know may being you know, I don't think we've seen

(01:18:37):
her in this kind of state where she's just basically like,
you know, she's suffering through Alzheimer's with it.

Speaker 2 (01:18:43):
Yeah, she's she's seen all at this point, she's I
think she calls Mary Jane Gwyn she's looking for Peter,
not realizing that he's been gone for weeks. He's supposed to,
you know, be at the library at this point, but
really he is off somewhere else in a gigantic battle.

Speaker 1 (01:19:05):
Yep, we got Secret Wars and you know, I always
interested seeing Peter with this is more like kind of
armored upsuit as he's aged up and realizing that, you know,
he's got to protect himself a little bit more. And
Reid looking as grizzled as ever.

Speaker 2 (01:19:22):
Yeah, read has fallen on some hard times and you know,
Spidey even mentions it, how, you know, like he's appreciative
of all these things he goes. But right now Reid
is a ghost and he of a warning that is
just haunting him. Like that's he's pushed his wife away,
he's pushed everyone away, and that's not who Spidey wants

(01:19:45):
to be.

Speaker 1 (01:19:47):
Yeah, and I love the little like you know, tips
of the hat. We get to the key sequences of
when he gets the Black host, and we don't see
necessary o Secret Wars ends. But you know, if you know,
you know who ends up. You know, in the kind
of before that, as you said, with Reid and Peter
coming to some sort of like amends as it were,

(01:20:07):
but coming back out, you know, in the black costume,
the alien suit, and she come he comes home, they
have embraced He sees the twins and you know how
much he's missed for there. And then what's gone on
in the world with you know, a nuclear weapon being
launched out and you know, this sacrifice that had to

(01:20:28):
be made in order to stop it, with Vision just
being just kind of like a silent specter for the
disaster that happened when the weapon, the nuclear bomb went off.

Speaker 2 (01:20:43):
Yeah, Vision is he tried to save some people, ended
up diverting this nuclear bomb, so you know, things were
still affected. He uh went and phased out and he
just he stayed that way, just stuck in this moment.
And even though he is Vision, he has this this

(01:21:06):
look of fear and this look of sadness just stuck
on on him as he's still phased out, standing in
the wreckage.

Speaker 1 (01:21:18):
Yeah, and you know he you know, he goes back
and talks to Reed and he's like, you know, I've
done have you thought about doing? You know, the symbits
alive and he's like, I know, and you know that's
why I don't wear it full time, so it can
never necessarily take full control. And so that's a difference

(01:21:39):
from the you know, from the main, the main continuity
of it, because he didn't realize it till it was
too almost too late. But he gets that, he gets it.
He says, you know, maybe I should you know, they're
seeing quote unquote spider Man murderers as well, maybe I
should have gone back to my normal uh my normal
threads at that point, but he gets a frantic call

(01:22:00):
from Mary Jane and looks like, aunt, may you know,
was with the kids and got lost or was not
necessarily doing what she needed to do. And I will say,
you put your your kids. What you know is a
person suffering through Alzheimer's with your kids.

Speaker 2 (01:22:18):
A little question that yeah, maybe not the best to
leave the Alzheimer's patient with the baby. She kind of
wanders off, like what tends to happens with a lot
of Alzheimer's patients when left unattended. They after a while,
you know that that happens at wondering golf And Peter
rushes home, and you know, Mary Jane is like, hey,

(01:22:41):
maybe it's time that we put her in a home,
we get her a specialist, and Peter is just he's
not having any of this. But as Mary Jane puts it,
he's not there to take care of Aunt May. He's
not there to take care of Mary Jane or his family.
So he is addicted to the suit and addicted to
the rush said he's getting from the suit.

Speaker 1 (01:23:01):
Yeah, and he says, I'm just gonna go out there
and my my normal costume and gone on patrol and
not have it. And then he runs into some the
impostor and the black costume none other than Craven, who's
going after him, and you know, we get basically Craven's
last hunt going on, and you know, Mary Jane's like, oh,

(01:23:22):
well he's disappeared, you know what was really he's buried
alive like he was. But then the Symbia costume feels
him calling and feels that feels where that you know,
he's in trouble and breaks out, goes into the thing
and breaks it out. So I like the kind of
new way of how he gets out of there, and
it's like, oh, he's a little more bulked up. He

(01:23:44):
is Symbia. It's mad. He's capitalizing on this anger, and
you know, Craven's trying to be Spider Man and beat
up on these foes and these muggers. And then you
get you know, Peter out there in a very like
I would love to have heard what like he sounded
like at that one, you know, in a different way,
like you stabbed me, you shot me, you buried me.
It's over and you get the teeth, you get him

(01:24:06):
turning into this creature. Mary Jane's there and you know,
he kind of gets a snap about it is that
we trained for that, We talked about this. You got it,
you gotta do it. You got to take it down
before it takes fuld of me. And she uses the
sonic thing to get the symbia off of him, but
the cost is already there. She is moving out, she's

(01:24:29):
taking the kids, and yet again another issue where Peter
has lost so much, lost everything. He's there with his
you know aunt may Craven's about to take his own life,
but we see someone something try to stop him.

Speaker 2 (01:24:47):
Yeah, and this is another issue where Peter ends up
sitting disheveled in a chair looking off in the distance
that that seems to be a running thing for him
every ten years.

Speaker 1 (01:24:58):
Yeah. So again the Parker luck keeps on getting worse
and worse and worse.

Speaker 2 (01:25:07):
Yeah. So we're gonna see where this goes with this
version of Craven and you know what saved him from
his attempted suicide. We're going to see what's going to
become of the relationship with him and Mary Jane as
we move into the nineties, which was by a lot

(01:25:27):
of accounts, one of the best eras of things going
on with Spider Man. So we'll see the direction that
they go with going into the nineties.

Speaker 1 (01:25:36):
Yeah, so we'll look at that. I will say next week,
but you know, maybe next week, maybe the week after.
We'll see exactly as news tides to drop. But next
time we drop the next episode, we will cover issue four.
So all right, well, volume two seventy six in the books.
You know, hopefully you guys enjoyed this topic that we

(01:25:58):
got to break down, and we'll see hopefully Marvel starts
up pumping out a little bit of news so we
can get a proper back to what we do best
here at Marvel Lines. But we will see. So David
tell people I think and follow you.

Speaker 2 (01:26:10):
You can follow me on all socials at the Phantom.
You can follow me here on the geek First Network
as part of our wrestling show The Gimmick, where we
come to around twice a month talk all things wrestling,
what's going on. We've got a Saturday Night's main event
pay per view coming up pretty soon, and then we're
gonna be having some other shows after that, so we

(01:26:31):
will get into some more my GM mode, playing some
more wrestling reviews. So yeah, follow me on the gimmick
with s Bubbs and mister Snail. That's why I said,
as you know the scathing wrestling style promo that Chris
cutt earlier, I am scared.

Speaker 1 (01:26:51):
That yet Bromo's still going.

Speaker 2 (01:26:54):
I'm scared that that this feud is going to build up,
and I'm hoping that no still cages get brought out.

Speaker 1 (01:27:02):
Well you know, if you if, if, if you're paying
attention at that point, he did something I didn't expect. Well,
I'm gonna, you know, return the favor. You know, one
one one one one good throw deserves another, right yep.
So but yeah, you can follow me on all the

(01:27:22):
socials at Chris Balga, Jake and I from the Brave
and the Boys are getting ridy to record this weekend
are new The are the new monthly breakdown of all
the pre orders that are coming up on Panel Bound
Comics this weekend and I'll probably drop within the next
week after we record, so check it. Check that out
on the Brave and the Boys YouTube channel.

Speaker 2 (01:27:43):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (01:27:43):
You can follow this podcast on Twitter at Marvel Marvel
a Podcast. You can follow the Geegultimate Alliance Network on
Twitter at guapod Network. You can uh you know, email
the show at Marvel Alliance Podcast at gmail dot com,
and you can reach us on all the dms. All
our dms are open. Give us factor fictions, questions you have,

(01:28:05):
you know, just comments in general, gladly, and we'll put
it on the show and respond to you in kind.
Continue to rate, review marble Line solo feed on Apple Podcast, Spotify,
Amazon Music, graeb you get your podcast, We greatly appreciate it,
and you know, we appreciate you all. You know, we

(01:28:26):
always you know, again, like we said, we wish you
would be as weekly as we used to be. But again,
Marvel Content being as it is, we do appreciate you
sticking around and we want to thank you all for
joining us live in the chat. Stay safe out there, everyone,
and a stand the man would say, excelsior, true believers.
All right, David, what you got for post credits discussion?

Speaker 2 (01:28:47):
All right? Post christ discussion, Marvel has been bringing a
lot of panels and storylines to life. As a reference
earlier with that shot of punish sure and Dared Deevil
just having the moment of being chained up that straight
from the comics. So with that being said, what is
a story or scene that could absolutely not be brought

(01:29:12):
to TVs or movies?

Speaker 1 (01:29:15):
Well, mc has been got you know, we've got rated
our stuff. We got rated our movies from the MCU,
now we've got TVMA shows. I when I saw you
put this in our in our notes, there was you
said a scene. But I have a series that Marvel

(01:29:39):
pretty much wishes they have never they never did, never done,
would rather it never existed. And this is when I
do not see them ever homaging, referencing outside to make
fun of or saying, oh God, what mistakes we made?
And that would be a little known a little mini
series called Trouble. Have you ever read Trouble? David?

Speaker 2 (01:30:04):
I have not read Trouble.

Speaker 1 (01:30:06):
Oh enlighten me, enlighten you. So Trouble was a five
issue limited series written by Mark Miller illustrated by Terry
and Rachel Dotson, published two thousand and three to two
thousand and four, and it was a series that followed
the summer vacation of recent high school graduates May May, May, Mary, Ben,

(01:30:27):
and Richie as subjects of different things of you know,
teenage things. And it was heavily marketed as a new
origin story for Spider Man, with much of the promotion
centered around that has a series primary characters are heavily
suggested to be younger versions of Spider Man's family members
at May, Uncle Ben, Richard, and Mary Parker. So here's

(01:30:49):
the plot. I'll save you the trouble because you also
will not find this on Marvel Unlimited. That's how controversial
this series was. Mary, excuse me. May and her best
friend Mary get a summer jobs at a resort in
the Hamptons, where they begin dating fellow co workers Ben
and his brother Richie, respectively. May and Ben's relationship soon

(01:31:11):
becomes very hot and heavy. I'll leave it at that,
And there is depicted in the book hot and heavy,
you know, basically going as far of not seeing things,
but you know, very close. But Mary tells Richie that
she is abstinent. A very frustrated Richie begins having an
affair with May. Soon after May becomes pregnant. The affair

(01:31:34):
is exposed after May disclosures her pregnancy to Ben and
he responds that he cannot be the father as he
is sterile. Fearing reprisal from her religious parents, May considers
having to dealing with the pregnancy before deciding to run
away from home. A desperate make later contacts Mary, and
despite Mary's continued anger over the affair, she agrees to

(01:31:58):
help her. Mary formulates a play and to claim May's
baby as her own, allowing May to conceal the truth
from her parents and allowing herself to test Richie's commitment
to their relationship. May gives birth and returns to her parents,
and Mary and Richie begin to raise their son Peter
as their child. Yes, yeah, your your look at that

(01:32:20):
one is just like what everyone was saying. Yes, this
was put out as a new origin of Peter Parker's family.
Oh my god, No, treble will never be adapted. But
have fun reading it there if you can find it.

Speaker 2 (01:32:38):
Wow.

Speaker 1 (01:32:39):
Yeah, no, that that that.

Speaker 2 (01:32:43):
My my pick is bad for different reasons.

Speaker 1 (01:32:46):
But yet no, I have not.

Speaker 2 (01:32:52):
All I can think is like, that's that's the side
of Aunt May. That I just I don't need in
my life.

Speaker 1 (01:32:58):
Oh they were there the pan book. Look it up.
The panels in that book are quite enlightening.

Speaker 2 (01:33:03):
Uh huh, yeah that that that is No.

Speaker 1 (01:33:07):
Nope, mistakes, choices were made. Mistakes were made.

Speaker 2 (01:33:12):
Uh. Is this the HBO After Dark version of Marvel?

Speaker 1 (01:33:16):
Oh there's another series called Marville. That's another one to
look up to that Marvel would rather not have done.
So yeah. Yeah, but my choice was Trouble.

Speaker 2 (01:33:27):
Okay, my choice was Ultimatum.

Speaker 1 (01:33:32):
It had.

Speaker 2 (01:33:34):
It's got the flooding of an entire coast and people
just dying left and right. It has Blob eating the
remains of the Wasp in a very just Corey gratuitous
scene that I was not expecting it. I mean, like
they this is full on splash, that this isn't a

(01:33:56):
mini box over in the corner. Just you know, so
many people are are taken out with this, and yeah,
it is something that for the amount of deaths that
happened in there and the people who die, plus the
gruesomeness of it, I mean they were taking this this

(01:34:21):
where where the ultimates line. We're pushing things a little
bit more. You got Magneto killing Professor. Actually you got
him just killing everyone, like the whole reversing the polarity
and you know, doing the flood stuff they kind of
touched on in nex min ninety seven, but not like
this is a grand scale of just death. And I
was like, oh, you guys are just wiping everything out.

(01:34:44):
And I was a fan of The Ultimate's line, but
when it came to ultimatum, I felt like they just
was like, let's just start throwing things to the wall
and see what sticks. And it was a hodge podge
and it was horrible.

Speaker 1 (01:35:00):
Yeah, I would agree it was a very unfortunate ending
to the Ultimate Universe in that current iteration. So yeah, mine,
like you said, was it was bad in one way.
Yours is bad in a different way. But I see
gear Mango saying jamis Spidey's nine to eleven won't get adapted. Yeah,

(01:35:23):
probably right at that point. Inhuman I'm there that too,
so but all right, Well, we will see you hopefully
next week. Uh Marvels dropped some news. If not, we
will see you soon and we'll check you out later again.
Tata see

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