November 7, 2025 • 47 mins
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Monday: Rangers Alliance (Bi-Weekly) Tuesday: A Walk Through the Multiverse (Bi-Weekly) Wednesday: The Animation Nation Thursday: Star Wars Alliance Friday: Marvel Alliance Saturday: DC Alliance
Follow the respective shows on Twitter so when they record live on GeekVerse Podcast Network you can join the chat and add to the conversation!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:12):
Hello, and welcome to the Baxter Broadcast, where we on
Marvel Alliance are going to be looking at the four
films that encompass the Fantastic Four uh filmography at this
point as currently released. At that point, we will be
looking at the four films, one unreleased and three that
(00:34):
have been released at this point. So this is episode
one of the Baxter Broadcasts, and we are going to
be looking at Roger Corman's unreleased The Fantastic Four. So,
as always, I'm the man without.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Fear, Chris, I'm the nerd with mouth David, and so
you know the whole thing, Alliance am so all right
Roger Corman's The Fantastic Four. Now, you know, if you've
been you've been listening at this point. This is the
This is uh an interesting one because I have seen
this before. This is David's first time of seeing this,
(01:12):
and this was this was scheduled to come out in
nineteen ninety four.
Speaker 1 (01:16):
Never did. It's been kind of way. You have to
find it it comor book conventions. I watched it on YouTube.
You watch it on YouTube. You can easily find it
on YouTube. It's for free. You know, we didn't commit
any money to this we just committed time to this,
So there's a lot of backstory for this, and that's
we'll save that for the main part of this discussion.
(01:38):
But I do want to hear first David's non spoiler
thoughts on because usually, as Brench and I have done
these previously, he said, let's talk about like where we
were at the time, what we were feeling about, things
like that. Yeah, there's none of that, So David, go
into exactly your your high level thoughts on this is
(02:00):
cinematic classic.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
Well to quote the movie itself, bring your imaginations, and
above all, have fun.
Speaker 1 (02:09):
This to Tom cru said, having fun making movies, living
the best life, right.
Speaker 2 (02:16):
This was definitely an adventure. I didn't quite know what
to expect. I've seen clips, I've seen gifts of it,
you know, memes and jokes about just how bad it was.
But this one, it was a sign of the times.
It reminded me sometimes of a little film that I
(02:38):
made when I was in high school. So this would
have probably been two thousand and two thousand and one
and I was shooting it on a little canon handicamp,
just not knowing what I was doing. But this was
by a full on studio making the exact same product.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
I will say.
Speaker 2 (02:57):
Ben Grimm's mouth was more jarring than anything that I
ever saw from the live action Ninja Turtles, and that's
saying something.
Speaker 1 (03:04):
It had some very as soon as I again, I
had seen this only one other time, but immediately when
I saw this, saying oh, it's sell Ninja Turtles, Yes.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
It, it was more distracting. And I think it was
more distracting because of the voice along with the mouth
movements and everything about it. I just want to know
was Doctor Doom doing sign language every time he talked,
because he was very emotive with the hands. I've been
accused of talking with my hands a lot, but man,
(03:34):
some of those when he's pointing with the I've got
the laser and it's right. He just like, what is
my guy doing?
Speaker 1 (03:42):
That was done on purpose. I'll go into that it
that was a choice.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
It was so yeah, that's just my overall is that
you it? It looks and feels like this was not
intended for viewership. This looks like what back in the
day used to be the unreleased pilot that they would
(04:09):
use to sell a TV show Before then they went
back and redid the show with better budget after they
got the studio okay to release a full season.
Speaker 1 (04:18):
This looks like that. And I'll say this, David, and
I will not be evaluating this necessarily in comparison to
what the Marvel Studios is today. It's not fair. It's
there is reasons it is not a great movie in
(04:40):
any stretch of the form. There are a lot of
reasons for that, A lot of stuff as we'll go
into behind the scenes, a lot of the stuff I'll
be talking about if you have not seen the documentary Doomed,
which details kind of from beginning to end of this
film and what had gone on and what the truth
is and things like that. What every documentary is always
like what to believe, what not to believe. But it's
(05:04):
when I after watching that, because that was the first
time I'd seen the documentary. This is the second time
I seen the movie. It does put things in perspective,
but there's not a lot of excuse in the sense
of who I don't remember nineties movies necessarily being this,
Like I was not thinking they had gold on their
(05:25):
hands with this, you know. Yeah, it's very campy, very
campy in the sense and I think you say it best,
was like you know, using Doctor Doom as an example,
everything moved to the to move the dial to the
eleven in the sense of like choices and over exaggerations
(05:46):
and who you know and what we'll say this, and
we've said this before. They did not set out to
make a bad movie. They set out with full intentions
for this movie to release theatrically. That was what was understanding,
the actors understanding every everything was moving in that direction.
It was like things are working behind the scenes against them, unfortunately,
(06:08):
but watching it a second time, this was probably the
only other time you were going to get me to
watch this the second time with patrons. So congratulations, you're welcome. So, uh,
you know, where do we let me let me reguard
into like how we got to this point before we
kind of get into the the plot of this movie.
(06:35):
So this kind of this starts dating back to like
nineteen eighty three where Bernard Oniker met with Marvel Studio
Stanley in Los Angeles to get the obtain the rights
to create a movie of the Fantastic Four. This is
how far back the states. So we're we're eleven years
before this movie goes into We're ten years before this
movie goes into production. The option was not available until
(06:57):
three years later, so and he had his come and
he was called Constantine Films, and it was obtained for
a price. The producer called it not enormous, which meant
it was estimated to be about a quarter of a
million dollars. So that's compared today's standards, that's that's cheap.
So despite some interest Warner Brothers Columbia, the budget concerned
(07:21):
precluded any production. With the option schedule to expire in
nineteen ninety two, Constantin asked Marvel for an extension. They
did not give it. So Anaker planned to retain his
option by producing a low budget, fantastic for a film.
So this was already what we're seeing there was done
intentionally because he didn't have the financing to do what
(07:43):
he wanted to do. So in nineteen ninety two he
teamed with B movie specialist Roger Corman Monster Movie B
Movie Extraordinary Roger Corman. I mean, you want to talk
about the era of the monster movies and since the
B movies, yet this guy does it. He agreed to
produce the film on a one million dollar budget, which
(08:04):
was one of the highest budgets that Corman had ever
done for any of his films, Like that was his
highest budget, Like he'd never done anything that expensive before,
and so this is coming out of his own money
to release on another distributor. So production began in nineteen
eighty two because he went because again they were about
to lose the rights. So under the direction of music
(08:26):
video director Ole Seosan for twenty The production lasted for
twenty one to twenty five days. Let me repeat that
this production lasted less than a month. They never had
a table read. No table read was done for this movie.
(08:47):
They started, I believe, I believe, if I remember correctly
from the documentary, they started December twenty eighth on this movie.
In ninety two. Storyboards were drawn out. Movies were shot
on sound stages in Venice, California, Agora, California, Lailah, Marrimount University,
the Pacific Stock Exchange, downtown Los Angeles. Costume We'll get
(09:18):
into costumes later because that those are some choices that
were made. But they were saying, upon explaining to Attast
is that these people in the story just swamped me
and said you're going to be faithful to it. And
I told them, this is why I'm buying these books. So,
and that's what the costume designer said. One of them
was hired as a weapons consultant and they they the
(09:44):
stuntman Carl Krawfro, who wore the rubber suit to portray
the Thing, worked with the work with the actual Ben
Grimm actor Michael Bailey Smith, who played the human self
Ben Grim so that their manners would match. Now that
actor didn't know that he wasn't going to be in
the Thing costume. That's a completely that's the stunt actor.
(10:05):
And here's the thing. The actor who plays Ben Grimm,
Michael Smith, he is way taller than his stuntman. So
when you see thing transform, they had to do some
visual kind of magic to not make it seem like,
wait a minute, did the thing just shrink?
Speaker 2 (10:27):
Yeah, because the the actor who plays him, he has
a very strong presence about him, like the guys.
Speaker 3 (10:35):
He's pretty cut.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
I mean, I've seen him and other things playing bad
guys and stuff like that. So, uh, Michael Bailey Smith
is a big menacing force, and yet he looked smaller
even with the pact on Rock as.
Speaker 3 (10:48):
The thing, So that that makes sense that.
Speaker 2 (10:51):
They didn't really get a stunt actor that matched.
Speaker 1 (10:54):
The bid yep, and he was not he was not
prepared for that. He was ready to get in that.
And so when you talk about the thing, there was
one main body that was made and two heads, one
for fighting and one for the talking. That was it.
So so already Marvel Studios was not necessarily full on
(11:18):
because they were extended the rights. They wanted these rights
to expire, and so they were kind of actively hoping
They're not going to make this movie. They're not going
to make this movie. So that's kind of some of
the behind the scenes that was going on at the time.
Speaker 4 (11:32):
So the plot, I this is there much if you
are looking at if you've ever seen The Incredible Hulk,
like the TV show with Bill Bixby and everything like that.
Speaker 1 (11:51):
I got lots of out when I first saw it.
I got it again like this is like Bill Bixby
the Incredible Hulk.
Speaker 2 (11:57):
Yeah, I will agree to that. It definitely some of
these fight scenes gave me very Loufferigno vibes. With the
placement of everything, the sound effects. It was definitely of
its time. Yeah, So we get read Richards Victor von
(12:18):
Doom college friends, which is not necessarily in the comics.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
They never were friends. In the comics, use the opportunity
of a passing comic called Colossus to as an experiment
and goes horribly wrong, leaving Victor to believe dead, which
was interesting.
Speaker 2 (12:34):
Okay, hold on, I have to comment on the two
guys who pronounced him dead. We see them earlier, and
are they not wearing the most eighties mobster down by
the river with the card again and the hat on,
just dip low sitting at the park like trying not
to look but looking. I'm like, no one can tell
(12:56):
these Yeah, no one can tell that these quote unquote
why guys are up to something over here.
Speaker 1 (13:02):
Yeah, it's and it's like he's dead. It's like, oh, okay,
well we know he's coming back because yeah, doctor Doom
And I never thought that. But here's the other thing
that gets creeps me out a little bit, Like they
go he goes over, like read goes over. I think
I think Victor's with him, if I remember correctly. And
they go over to the storm'shouse and there's Sue's Storm
(13:23):
And I was like, wait a minute, wait a minute,
she's a kid, Like I don't I couldn't remember there
was gonna be a time jump at that point, and
she is I don't know how old she is, but
she is definitely a teenager at that point. I don't
think she's like eighteen. I want to say like she's
she's fifteen or sixteen at that boot, because she she's
and she is. I'm not saying like, this doesn't happen
where teenage girl's falling over the college person. In this case,
(13:46):
she's falling over Oh my god, is that you Bringaba?
It's like, I don't know, did you just not get
to just like an ick, like a real big ick.
Just watching that sequence.
Speaker 2 (13:55):
Knowing their history and knowing what they become, I was like, Okay,
this is weird. And then immediately when we see them
after the time jump, and immediately she's fawning over him
and they're having this stargazy look and she comes Now
he's got the white temples by this point is obvious
he's older and she's this young just coming to maturity
(14:16):
girl and she walks down the steps and they're just
like enamored with each other. And I'm like, this is
weird considering how you two just were two minutes ago
in this film.
Speaker 1 (14:28):
Yeah, And it's a ten year time jump after the
supposed death of Victor, and so a big time jump
with it. And I mean if you when you Watchdom,
like you see later, like you get to see like
the actor, the actors and actors is that portray everyone
(14:49):
at that point, but like the the actress who plays
Alicia and Sue, I don't know how old they were
when they but I mean they've aged gracefully, very gracefully
when you see the documentary, and I was like, wow, Okay,
I would love to know how old you all were,
because I didn't think you were like incredibly old when
(15:10):
you did it, but it was just like, oh, I
expected you to be a little more, you know, aged,
But so yeah. Flashes to ten years later and Reid, Sue,
and Johnny and Ben participate in a mission and experiment
of aircraft as Reid wants to go after the comment again,
and unbeknownst to them, a crucial diamond component designed to
(15:31):
protect them from the cosmic grades has been replaced with
an imitation one by the criminal the Jeweler, leaving them
exposed to radiation. Okay, so you watch this movie and
you're like, I don't remember a villain called the Jeweler.
That's right, There was no villain the Jeweler because this
is supposed to be Mollman.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
Yes, because his first appearance, he's popping out of the sewer.
Now he's got the Jeweler eyeglass on. That's the only
thing that makes you think that this is someone other
than the mole Man.
Speaker 3 (16:01):
Yeah, but everything about.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
Him just screams from the moment he pops on the
screen this moment yep.
Speaker 1 (16:07):
So that is because Marvel, Marvel Studios and Marvel Comics
would not give them the license to use anyone but
the Fantastic fourign Doctor Doom, anyone else, even though it
was just tied to Fantastic for a moment, doesn't really
appear much outside of too much outside of Fantastic Four.
I mean you think, moment I think he's a Fantastic
Four villain, that's usually what it is. Yeah, they wouldn't
(16:28):
allow him use moments. So that's why you get everything
thing Moleman except the mole creatures and him being called Moleman.
Because immediately when I saw the first time, I was like, oh,
that's oh the Jeweler. Oh okay, And now we know
they weren't allowed to use it. So because he took
the jewel, the jewel, the exposed the comics of cosmic radiation.
(16:49):
And that was an interesting sequence. It looked like we're
doing the seventies and sixties and the drug trip's begetting
ready to happen on screen.
Speaker 2 (16:58):
Yeah, the whole cosmic moment. And then also we have
the scene where we meet Alicia and her and Ben
interact for I don't know, ten fifteen seconds tops. Yeah,
and they're both automatically in love at this point, like everything.
Speaker 1 (17:18):
It can't happen. But that was a little ridiculous the way.
Speaker 2 (17:22):
Yeah, and but yeah, the whole going to space, seeing
them in the U, the shiny suits going on, Like, okay,
so someone spent all their budget on these tinfoil suits.
Right now it looks like you guys are dressed for
a sauna, not to go out in space.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
Yeah. Even going back to Alicia, so like, unless you
knew who Alicia is in the comics, Woulch, did you
think they did even a good job of impressing upon
us that she was blind? I don't think they did
a great job like impressed by like later in the
other sequences. I think they made that point, but they
(18:01):
definitely did. I don't think they did a good job
calling attention that she was blind.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
No, in her first interaction, it was more of she
was shocked and she reached out, and then it more
looked like, Okay, she just thought this guy was hot,
so she touched his face.
Speaker 3 (18:17):
A' llah.
Speaker 2 (18:17):
You know, uh, Peggy Carter when she first sees Steve Rogers,
when he comes out, he's.
Speaker 3 (18:24):
All bumping out. Yeah, that's that's the look.
Speaker 2 (18:27):
Now when she's working with the clay, and then she's
really going into the features, Okay, you start to pick
up on it, but there's nothing that implicitly says, Okay,
she's blond, this is what's going on, and here we are.
But anyways, yeah, so then they crashed the land and
then we start seeing like the Infamous, like they get
their powers. You know, Reid's body can stretch, sure, Susan
(18:53):
becomes invisible. Okay, that's easy to do.
Speaker 1 (18:56):
And I wonder because again it's been a bit to
I've seen this. Johnny just like generates fire on demand.
I was like, oh, I forgot, I didn't I'd forgotten saying,
oh man, are we a bunch of just called to
the point where we're never gonna see him totally flame
on at that point they do later on. It's it's
really even more comical later on when he finally gets
to do it. It's so bad. And then the transformation
(19:20):
of bands don't like to that was actually not bad
that for what they were given in the budget, they
actually did that decently.
Speaker 3 (19:27):
Well yeah, yeah, the whole the whole thing was funny.
Speaker 2 (19:35):
Their reactions after the crash, like Johnny is super hype
for having just crashed and everything like that. Yeah, he's
jumping around, He's like, did you guys see that? And
then we get the very bad green screen of Sue
being invisible, Johnny figuring out he has flame powers because
(19:57):
he sneezes like. It's just it is the most campy
thing ever, and.
Speaker 1 (20:05):
Really with that whole whole idea of because they're on
in this old field and they don't know what to do,
and then they get captured by these marines who who
are actually like part of you know, we we see
Doctor Doom finally and we all, you know, comic swise,
who was this Doctor Doom when we know it's Victor,
(20:26):
you know Victor. At that point, now I will say
this about the costume. If you're calling for comic accuracy thing,
comic accurate, perfect done, well, it is what it is
for the time, you know, I think obviously with the
fantastic four first Steps, we've come a long way. God
at LEAs see is better. But for the time, Yes,
(20:46):
it wasn't too it was. It wasn't bad. Doctor Doom
costume spot on, absolutely spot on. No no real notes
necessarily on Doctor Jun's costume. What do you have to
say about that?
Speaker 2 (20:57):
Yeah, the costume itself look great, mask looked great, Everything
about it looked good. They show the shot of the
throne room and everything like that, Like I got very
Doctor Doom vibes. It's just once he began talking and
emoting with his hands, that's when I was like, okay,
we're back to the over the top ness. But him
(21:18):
just standing there as a menacing force and looking like
again at this time, someone who'd be like, yeah, that's
the bad guy that they nailed that perfectly.
Speaker 1 (21:29):
And you know you talked about how the actor who
was playing Victor and Doctor Doom was very much like
up to the up to a very high level of
a moting again just he he did that on purpose
because he actually had seen the comics and just had
he he wanted to go for that whole thing. It
was like this egomatistical like person who thought he was
(21:51):
God's gift and everything, and that's why he's like that.
It's it was his choice, and you know it as
it's a choice. He's not too far off in the
sense of like Doom being an egotistical maniac. But I
think what it became was memeworthy and comical because Doom
is that kind of egotistical maniac, but he's also sinister
(22:15):
and incredibly threatening, like you look at in the sense
of Fantastic Four Villains Slash. I mean, Doom's also an
Avengers villain when it comes down to it as well.
He's definitely on your top five, I say top five
list of biggest threats in the Marvel universe. And really
that's that's he's definitely considered because you don't see it
(22:36):
in this movie, but like he's he dabbles in sorcery
in the occult and uses that to advantage. He's a
genius intellect. He you knows rivals read Richards in many
different ways. So I mean that's I think what was
missed in this portrayal of it, he becomes it becomes
very mustachetorily. Yeah, he definitely becomes the the over the top,
(23:00):
take over the world scheming villain instead of the smart, cold,
calculating menacing force that can take on anyone from a
street level to the Avengers. Yep. So so yeah, so
they he wants to figure out how to get their
superpowers to him, and as always, after they escape and
(23:26):
you know, very easily they decide to Ben gets angry
and leaves and goes out on his own, feeling like
he's become a freak, and finds the Homeless Man, ends
up joining the Layer of the Jewelry aka the mold Man.
That's the whole thing. And then the Jeweler has his
henchmen kidnap Alicia masters, intending to use the stolen power
(23:50):
as a wedding gift to her. Like this was as
this was so random. This is absolutely so random of
how that all went out.
Speaker 2 (23:58):
Yeah, And the entire time they're cutting back and forth
to scenes of Alicia and she is just having all
her memories of Ben, and I'm like, again, you guys
met for five seconds, and ma'am, you are obsessing over
this man, You've made a clay bust of him, and
then you like kiss the you take your fingers after
(24:19):
you form the lips and then kiss them. Like this
is a little bit obsessive here, Like I'm starting to
worry about Alicia's mind state.
Speaker 1 (24:27):
Here, Yeah, especially how she was doing that mostly from memory, Yeah,
of a first interaction that, yeah, that's that's a lot.
And so she's using this as a you know, he
kidnapped her. You want to use the big diamond as
(24:49):
a gift. And then you know, Doom sends his own
henchmen to make a deal. No avail, so Doom takes
the diamond for himself, and a gun battle break out
between the man and the jewelers when Ben editors. Doom
takes Alsha hostage, and Ben threatens to its Clomber in Time,
of which, you know, to be fair, we've not heard
(25:10):
clober in Time or flame on in any of the
trailers for first steps, but we know we're gonna hear
it eventually because probably they say to a comical level
at this point in this movie, because every time it's
Clomber in Time.
Speaker 2 (25:22):
Yeah, Alicia begs him not to risk it and confesses
her love for him. Sure, why not?
Speaker 1 (25:30):
Because again Kupid's love hits, you know, because we needed
to rush through that. Her confession changes. Okay, so her
confession of love changes, bend to human form and Dooms
react do? I can't? Do you remember what he said?
Because he said something's like the line like that, Oh
that's that's that's a double entendre basically what she said there.
(25:54):
I wish I wrote it down because I laughed out
loud with Doom's line to saying, oh, not Somiji anymore.
Speaker 2 (26:03):
Yeah, I don't remember the exact wording, but I mean
I laughed at a lot of this stuff with Ben Grimm.
Like there's the fight scene where it's him versus the
guys in the lab, and all of a sudden, it's
just the camera spins and you hear beat up sounds,
and the next thing you know, there's all these guys
on the floor and they're like, oh, what am I
supposed to do with these guys? And yeah, it's it
(26:26):
just it's it's something different.
Speaker 1 (26:30):
And then who knew? Who knew that? Did you know that?
How you get Ben Grimm to turn back from a
monster to the thing that going to the monster thing?
To human was admitting you love him? What happened to if?
Is it one of these things that you give him
a hug and he turns back. I didn't realize that
(26:52):
that's the weakness and how to stop the thing. I
was like, Wow, totally forgot that. I have to go
back into comics and check that out. Nope, nope, not
there doesn't exist.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
Yeah, that we could have solved sixty years of Bingrim's
problems had someone just given him the hug that.
Speaker 1 (27:11):
He needs, or just giving him Cubid s arrow. That
happens within just meeting someone who gives him the time
of day. So when Ben returns to his friend, Read
has learned that Doom is actually Victor Shock, He's not dead,
and Doom contacts then threatens to use his diamond to
power a laser cannon that will destroy New York City
(27:33):
unless you surrender to doctor to me, Doom, let's be
channeling my inner Uh. Going to the eleven of Doctor Doom, realizing.
Speaker 2 (27:45):
Oh, I found the quote real quick, I found the quote, yeah, Google.
When when he transforms, Doctor Doom says at that point,
he goes, uh, uh, it's well, it seems lover boys
not quite himself anymore today.
Speaker 1 (28:00):
Yeah, we know what you're saying. We so yeah, so,
realizing that they are the only ones that can stop them,
Sue Storm somehow, in a very quick amount of time,
has sewn together these costumes and man, are they combat
acker Yes. Do they look like they fit them at all?
(28:21):
Absolutely not.
Speaker 2 (28:25):
Yeah, the suits, the wide white collar, it's it is
something like, yes, it fits for the look of the
Fantastic Four, like if you were to pull out an
old comic book cover or an old painting of what
the Fantastic Four is supposed to be. These suits matched
them incredibly, but it is still super cheesy and seeing
(28:49):
like read stretched with these suits and some of the
other things, it's just it's interesting.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (28:56):
Oh and Johnny's line when they all come together about yeah,
we can do this because we are the Fantastic Four, right.
Speaker 1 (29:04):
Because that's calling back to before they left to go
on the ship. Suo Storms, Sue and Johnny's mom say, oh,
look at you the fantastic look at you four, the
Fantastic Four. And to the point of I said, all right,
roll credits here we are.
Speaker 2 (29:19):
Yeah, and then uh, right afterwards we get the uh
I call it the Superman a laser scene. Everyone's in
a force field.
Speaker 1 (29:29):
Oh yeah, everyone's in a forest field and Doom's gonna
siphon their power because that's how you get powers. You
literally just drain the power out of them. And what
was how do they get out of there?
Speaker 2 (29:38):
Like read reach reach stretches Somehow he flattens his foot
and stretches underneath the force.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
Field, Like, I guess that's how force fields don't work.
That's all you have to do is slid a piece
of paper.
Speaker 2 (29:53):
The force field was calibrated to go all but two
centimeters short of the ground.
Speaker 1 (30:01):
Well guess, doctor Doom. Guess doctor Doom is not as
smart as he thought.
Speaker 2 (30:05):
He was.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
Not accounting for to.
Speaker 1 (30:13):
All because d he refigured out my force field's weakness
go flat. Yes, And so that's how they get out
of there, and the huge fight ensues. He got a bit,
I guess do Instead of Doom box, you have people
in Doom costumes, you know, loyal to Doom, his henchmen.
Huge fight ensues. Doom somehow manages to you know, launch
(30:36):
his laser and as he clings to the wall, Re
tries to rescue him, but Doom Gauntlet comes loose and
he falls below to probably not his death. But at
the time he's gone is Gauntlet still in the balcony
starts to move on its own for whatever reason. Meanwhile, Johnny,
this is where Johnny actually becomes in like full on.
(30:59):
Looks like it was both lowest CIGI graphics have ever
a s like, oh, this is how we're transforming to
the human. George goes off, flies off and intercepts lays
are deflecting it with his with his flame powers into
outer space.
Speaker 2 (31:14):
The image of him him running up, stopping out, stretching
his hands, and you can see the camera pause for
a minute as they then overlay the CGI and it
is very much the old Simpsons with the Pucci where
the graphic cards just flies away. It was, oh, it
(31:35):
is so hilarious to watch. And when I saw that,
that was the moment I laughed out loud, just watching
the freeze frame of stopping in motion. All right, now
this guy is gonna take over.
Speaker 1 (31:48):
And then Ben frees Alicia and finally introduced himself to her.
I've loved you since I saw you yesterday, yes ago,
whatever it was.
Speaker 2 (31:58):
They're in love, Doctor Dum saying that he's got the
insurance policy of the woman that he cares the most about,
and she's yelling about love and everyone's about love, and
then finally he goes, so I'm gonna formally introduce myself, Mike,
how are you all in love? If you never formally? Yeah,
it's it's no, it's something.
Speaker 1 (32:20):
Yeah. So she feels rocky faced, and as it again,
that's comic. Actor Alicia is not phased by it. Necessarily,
will come to see in our next film that's basically
the same way. And they Sue and Reid get married.
We don't know how much time has happened. They get
(32:40):
married and reads in his costume and Susan and Susan
the wedding dress, and that's also very comic character because
that's what happened. And they drive away just married, and
then you get the bad graphics of Reid's looks like
someone's like operating a puppet arm.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
As the incredible flailing arm man from the car Salesman's.
Speaker 1 (33:01):
Yeah, and they lived happily ever after the end, and
it was like wo and that was I think that
was ninety minutes. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that was ninety minutes,
I think about or it felt like two hours out
of one of the two. Just it was it was
a lot, and I was I was operating that into
(33:24):
at two times speed at that point. Ovitually I did
it at one point five speed, just because this is
all right. If I'm sitting through this movie, I'm putting
it at a higher speed to get through it. So
they made this movie. So let's talk about exactly when
the pup plug was pulled on it. So nineteen ninety
three magazine article gave the tentative release date of Labor
(33:44):
Day weekend, nineteen ninety three during the during the summer,
trailers ran in theaters on the video game release of
Corman's Carnosaur Little Miss Millions. The cast was hired a
publicist at their own expense tell promote it at clips
screenings at the Shrine Auditorium in Los Angeles and at
San Diego Comic Con. So this was at San Diego
(34:04):
Comic Con back then, and the film appeared as a
cover story in the issue of Film Threat magazine. They
were actually on set. They had a reporter on set
during production that was covering this beginning to end because
this was a huge deal. They Sympantastic four was a
huge property in the comics, and this was getting traction
(34:25):
by the time the World Premiere was announced to take
place at the Mall of America in Bloomington, Minnesota, January nineteen,
nineteen eighty four. Let me repeat that the World Premiere
was going to take place at the Mall of America
in Bloomington, Minnesota, with proceeds from the event to be
paying for the Ronald MacDonald and Children's Miracle Network, so
you know, good intentions. Suddenly, though premiere is halted. The
(34:49):
actors received a cease and assist order on all promotion
from the producers in the studio confiscated the negatives. Inneker
then informed Sassoon that the the film would not be released.
Speculation arose the film was never intended for release, but
had gone on into production solely as a way for
Inineker to retain the rights of the characters, which for
(35:11):
the most part screw stan Lee. In two thousand and
five that this was said, this was indeed the case
that the movie was never supposed to be shown to anyone,
and adding a contract to release it, and I had
to be I had to be bought out by the
contract of that contract by eineker Iingar called Lee's version
of events definitely not true. It was not our original
(35:33):
intention to make a B movie, that's for sure, but
when the movies was there, we wanted to release him.
He said that future Marvel Studios founder Avi Rodd at
this point in ninety three as Marvel executives. He said,
Avi a Rod calls me up and says, listen, I
think what she did was great. It shows your enthusiasm
for the movie and property. Now I understand that you
(35:53):
have invested so so much, and Roger has invested so much.
Let's do a deal. Because he really didn't like the
idea of a small movie coming out and maybe ruining
the franchise, so he says to me that he wants
to give me my money back and what we spent
on the movie, and that we should not release it.
A Rod recalled in two thousand and two that while
(36:15):
a shirt to Puerto Rico ninety three, a fan noticing
a Rod's fantastic for shirt express excitement of the film's premiere,
which a Rod did not know about. Concerned how low
budget was, he said he purchased a film for a
couple million dollars in cash not having seen it and
ordered Prince destroyed it and prevent the release. Although never
officially released to the general public, it was exhibited the
Fantastic Four. It has been subject to bootleg record is
(36:38):
because they did get a record. How they think they
got a recording out was I think I can't remember
who it's brought up and doomed that at some point
the recording was made of it. And they really do
think that someone who did the recording saw what it
was recorded one for themselves too, and that's how it
(36:59):
started getting out there. That's been kind of the legend
of how this thing was getting out there at Comic
Con things like that and that, And then that's true,
like Arod had just been named as the head of
the Marvel Studios part and they had just sold the
X Men rights to twentieth Century Fox. So x Men
was already getting ready to be in development. So as
(37:20):
I said, Box had write a refuse I mean, excise me,
Marvel already had write a refusal to shop this to
other places if they weren't happy. So again, they didn't
necessarily break anything down. They were hoping that the movie
was never get made, and when they saw it, well,
we're not letting you release this. This is yeah, you know,
and that was they these actors thought that this was
(37:41):
going to be a launch pad for a lot of
their careers. And it was funny where in the documentary,
the actress who plays Alicia, she said she was at
a party one time and this person came up to
her and like, I recognize you from somewhere, and he said, Alisha,
it's like and she was like, how do you know that.
(38:03):
It's like, I've seen the movie. What do you mean
you've seen the movie? I haven't even seen the movie.
And I think she said she she got to see
the movie because she fail, Oh yeah, I got an
eb so she said after that party, she went on
ebaying bought herself a copy so she could actually see
the movie for the first time. And it's just unfortunate,
you know, was this movie going to be again? The
(38:24):
problem was this wasn't a well funded movie. So, I mean,
the way for a million dollars, this is a glorified fanfic,
you know, with what they were able to do. And
I'll tell you what, for all intensive purposes, it's not
a bad fanfic. It's it's laughable at some points, But
I can't say that they Marvel and stan Lee and
(38:47):
Avia Rodd never wanted this to come out. Everyone else
they were going with the full intentions that they wanted
to put this out. And that's why I always say
when people say why, are like, who's asking for this? Oh,
set out to make a bad movie. They did not
set out to make a bad movie with this. They
operated under the auspices of what they had, So I mean,
(39:09):
it's not a great movie in my sense. I'm ever
gonna recommend this to someone outside of like, if you
really want to see how far we've come with Fantastic
for start here, that is why I will recommend this movie,
to see how far we've come, you know. Yeah, it
doesn't even compare to what we're going to be in
the next one with our two thousand and five of
Fantastic War. They this night and day, you know, and
it took ten years to get to that point.
Speaker 2 (39:31):
Yeah, there are parts of this movie where you could
tell like someone very much cared about the Fantastic for
A franchise, from the costuming to you know, the characters
that they use or were allowed to use. When I
first watched this on YouTube, one of the first comments
was someone who claimed to have been a camera assistant
(39:52):
on the movie, and he talks about how they shot
multiicam for fast coverage and they no one who was
working on the movie, according to this person, knew that
it was never going to see the light of day.
They were all operating that this was going to be
a thing. And you know, he says that for them
(40:16):
at the time, they thought the things costume was impressive.
And when you start looking at it in the gaze
of nineteen ninety four and you think about again teenage mutant,
ninja turtles and other stuff like that, Yeah, it's on
par with some of the cheesiness from those costumes, and
that's what they were working with. He also mentions that
(40:39):
he received a VHS copy, which was usually distributed to
the crew members for their work reels, and so that's
probably why some of this got started to get leaked
a little bit early. But I mean, again, it's not
the most horrible movie that I've ever seen, but it
(40:59):
is a sign of the times. You can tell that
it was done on a lower budget than it could be,
and you know, they had secured the rights for it
for two hundred and fifty thousand dollars and before that
tenure option ran out, and to meet the terms of
the contract, they had to put something together and that
(41:22):
they did and it's satisfied long enough so that they
could make it until their next film that need to
be released, which was the Fantastic Four movie that came
out in two thousand and five. So I mean, without this,
we would have never had that. Without that, we would
never had Rise's Silver Server and Fox just doing its thing.
Speaker 1 (41:43):
Yeah, And like I said, if you, I know, you
hadn't gotten a chance to seeing it, David, But I've
recommended it, you know, I recommend everyone you can find Doomed.
I know, yeah, it was on Prime.
Speaker 3 (41:55):
It's on YouTube.
Speaker 1 (41:56):
Yeah, no, that's why I've watched that. I watched on YouTube.
When you look up Fantastic dooms so you can watch
it for free if you have primary you can find
out on YouTube. It's it's well worth the watch. I
think it gives a lot of context to it. It
is very sad that of everything, because again, like a
million dollars, I don't have a million dollars necessarily that
(42:16):
I can just blow and say like yeah, sure, a
million dollars. I mean again, Roger Corman, that's not what
he's famous for. He's famous for doing B movies and
does him really well at that point, And the fact
I think it's a be fantastic for a movie, well,
that's not what they set out to do. They set
out to say, like what you willing to commit? I'm
willing to commit this. Okay, let's see what we can
operate a for a million dollars plus of what they
(42:38):
operated under. That's impressive. I mean, I'm impressed that you
got that done. And there are tons of problem with this. Well,
I ever watch this movie again, not unless I need
to do something like this. I you know, I'll sooner.
I'd sooner watch the documentary again than this movie. You know. Yeah,
(42:58):
So no surprise. I don't even need to I'll say
this is gonna be at the bottom of my list.
It's just it's not gonna be anywhere close to a top.
And it's it's not even a comparison piece, like even
in a I try to look at this will be Okay,
I already know it's gonna be not great. Let me see
(43:21):
it is what it is. So, David, is this.
Speaker 2 (43:23):
Gonna be number one on your list nowhere near even
through the lens of nineteen ninety four.
Speaker 1 (43:29):
It is.
Speaker 2 (43:31):
You can tell that you know it was a rush production.
You can tell that it was just you know, it
was something put out there. It's not good.
Speaker 3 (43:41):
It's not.
Speaker 2 (43:43):
The absolute worst thing that I've ever watched, but it
is not something that I will be looking to revisit
at any point.
Speaker 3 (43:51):
I believe. I even told my girlfriend that.
Speaker 2 (43:55):
If I was to have someone else watch this, I
feel like I would owe them money for the time
that they spent.
Speaker 1 (44:01):
Now I would say this. What I always composed is
when I watched Son of Mask or How Are the Duck?
Over this? No, I would so I would sooner watch
I would sooner watch this again versus those two movies.
That's what I compare to, because those are some of
the worst movies I've ever seen. Yeah, so, if given
(44:24):
the choices, I would watch Roger Corman. It's a fantastic
four if in compared to How Are the Duck and
The Son of the Mask?
Speaker 2 (44:32):
So I would say so. This release in nineteen ninety four.
Other notable movies that released in were Double Dragon and Hercules,
And you know it's it's not even on their level.
So it it deserves its spot at the bottom of
not only the Marvel and I use that loose quote
(44:56):
Marvel movies, but also just nineteen ninety four movies.
Speaker 1 (45:00):
So all right, So that is our retro review our
first episode of the Baxter broadcast. So next time we
will come to with our next one, the Fantastic Four
from two thousand and five, So we'll see you then,
all right. As always, David, we do our post credits
(45:22):
in our preview of Fantastic Four from two thousand and five,
so just you know, not as in spoiler thoughts, just
like going into this, just kind of talk about like
your hype level for this movie when it did come out,
and did you see it in theaters when it came out.
Speaker 2 (45:39):
I actually did see this in theaters when it came out.
I remember going and seeing it with friends. The main
reason that we all went to go see it was
because of Jessicalva. Now granted dating myself. I was a
freshman in college at the time, so me going and
seeing a movie for justcal but that that tracks at
(46:03):
the time. And this was before Chris Evans the Action Star,
so this was, you know, not another t movie. Chris
Evans this was like the comedic version of him, so
like it seemed like, all right, well, let's let's go,
let's let's give this a shot. So I was actually
(46:23):
really anticipating this movie back when I originally saw it,
and I've watched it a couple of times since then,
even before this past weekend. I'm gonna give it one
more good, fresh watch before our next recording. And it's
not something I run from. But it's definitely not something
I run to.
Speaker 1 (46:44):
Yeah, it's it's been a bit since I've watched it.
I've you know, we've got a few weeks before we
we record this next episode. But it it it is
early two thousand superhero movie. It to your point, I
didn't necessarily go to because of Jessica Alba. I do
do because I'm a big nerd and even though I'm
(47:04):
not the biggest Fantastic Four Gung Ho fan, I was like,
it's another superb movie. Sure, I'll give a shot Jessica album.
We'll help at that point. But from the trailers, Okay
it checks off. Is this a Fantastic Four movie? Yes?
Does it check off some boxes of what this is?
Sure it's got Doctor Doom's got this Okay, I can
kind of it could be paint by numbers, but sure,
(47:26):
let me give it a shot for all to the
purposes you know preview it does set up for what
it needs to do, and it definitely was one where
I was like, Okay, that's a choice that seems better
that Okay, we're hurting. But you know, we will give
our full breakdown of that in a couple of weeks
(47:48):
when we bring you the Fantastic Four from two thousand
and five. So we will see you next time. Patrons,
Hello, and welcome to the Baxter Broadcast, where we on
Marvel Alliance are going to be looking at the four
films that encompass the Fantastic Four uh filmography at this
point as currently released. At that point, we will be
looking at the four films, one unreleased and three that
(00:34):
have been released at this point. So this is episode
one of the Baxter Broadcasts, and we are going to
be looking at Roger Corman's unreleased The Fantastic Four. So,
as always, I'm the man without.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Fear, Chris, I'm the nerd with mouth David, and so
you know the whole thing, Alliance am so all right
Roger Corman's The Fantastic Four. Now, you know, if you've
been you've been listening at this point. This is the
This is uh an interesting one because I have seen
this before. This is David's first time of seeing this,
(01:12):
and this was this was scheduled to come out in
nineteen ninety four.
Speaker 1 (01:16):
Never did. It's been kind of way. You have to
find it it comor book conventions. I watched it on YouTube.
You watch it on YouTube. You can easily find it
on YouTube. It's for free. You know, we didn't commit
any money to this we just committed time to this,
So there's a lot of backstory for this, and that's
we'll save that for the main part of this discussion.
(01:38):
But I do want to hear first David's non spoiler
thoughts on because usually, as Brench and I have done
these previously, he said, let's talk about like where we
were at the time, what we were feeling about, things
like that. Yeah, there's none of that, So David, go
into exactly your your high level thoughts on this is
(02:00):
cinematic classic.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
Well to quote the movie itself, bring your imaginations, and
above all, have fun.
Speaker 1 (02:09):
This to Tom cru said, having fun making movies, living
the best life, right.
Speaker 2 (02:16):
This was definitely an adventure. I didn't quite know what
to expect. I've seen clips, I've seen gifts of it,
you know, memes and jokes about just how bad it was.
But this one, it was a sign of the times.
It reminded me sometimes of a little film that I
(02:38):
made when I was in high school. So this would
have probably been two thousand and two thousand and one
and I was shooting it on a little canon handicamp,
just not knowing what I was doing. But this was
by a full on studio making the exact same product.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
I will say.
Speaker 2 (02:57):
Ben Grimm's mouth was more jarring than anything that I
ever saw from the live action Ninja Turtles, and that's
saying something.
Speaker 1 (03:04):
It had some very as soon as I again, I
had seen this only one other time, but immediately when
I saw this, saying oh, it's sell Ninja Turtles, Yes.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
It, it was more distracting. And I think it was
more distracting because of the voice along with the mouth
movements and everything about it. I just want to know
was Doctor Doom doing sign language every time he talked,
because he was very emotive with the hands. I've been
accused of talking with my hands a lot, but man,
(03:34):
some of those when he's pointing with the I've got
the laser and it's right. He just like, what is
my guy doing?
Speaker 1 (03:42):
That was done on purpose. I'll go into that it
that was a choice.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
It was so yeah, that's just my overall is that
you it? It looks and feels like this was not
intended for viewership. This looks like what back in the
day used to be the unreleased pilot that they would
(04:09):
use to sell a TV show Before then they went
back and redid the show with better budget after they
got the studio okay to release a full season.
Speaker 1 (04:18):
This looks like that. And I'll say this, David, and
I will not be evaluating this necessarily in comparison to
what the Marvel Studios is today. It's not fair. It's
there is reasons it is not a great movie in
(04:40):
any stretch of the form. There are a lot of
reasons for that, A lot of stuff as we'll go
into behind the scenes, a lot of the stuff I'll
be talking about if you have not seen the documentary Doomed,
which details kind of from beginning to end of this
film and what had gone on and what the truth
is and things like that. What every documentary is always
like what to believe, what not to believe. But it's
(05:04):
when I after watching that, because that was the first
time I'd seen the documentary. This is the second time
I seen the movie. It does put things in perspective,
but there's not a lot of excuse in the sense
of who I don't remember nineties movies necessarily being this,
Like I was not thinking they had gold on their
(05:25):
hands with this, you know. Yeah, it's very campy, very
campy in the sense and I think you say it best,
was like you know, using Doctor Doom as an example,
everything moved to the to move the dial to the
eleven in the sense of like choices and over exaggerations
(05:46):
and who you know and what we'll say this, and
we've said this before. They did not set out to
make a bad movie. They set out with full intentions
for this movie to release theatrically. That was what was understanding,
the actors understanding every everything was moving in that direction.
It was like things are working behind the scenes against them, unfortunately,
(06:08):
but watching it a second time, this was probably the
only other time you were going to get me to
watch this the second time with patrons. So congratulations, you're welcome. So, uh,
you know, where do we let me let me reguard
into like how we got to this point before we
kind of get into the the plot of this movie.
(06:35):
So this kind of this starts dating back to like
nineteen eighty three where Bernard Oniker met with Marvel Studio
Stanley in Los Angeles to get the obtain the rights
to create a movie of the Fantastic Four. This is
how far back the states. So we're we're eleven years
before this movie goes into We're ten years before this
movie goes into production. The option was not available until
(06:57):
three years later, so and he had his come and
he was called Constantine Films, and it was obtained for
a price. The producer called it not enormous, which meant
it was estimated to be about a quarter of a
million dollars. So that's compared today's standards, that's that's cheap.
So despite some interest Warner Brothers Columbia, the budget concerned
(07:21):
precluded any production. With the option schedule to expire in
nineteen ninety two, Constantin asked Marvel for an extension. They
did not give it. So Anaker planned to retain his
option by producing a low budget, fantastic for a film.
So this was already what we're seeing there was done
intentionally because he didn't have the financing to do what
(07:43):
he wanted to do. So in nineteen ninety two he
teamed with B movie specialist Roger Corman Monster Movie B
Movie Extraordinary Roger Corman. I mean, you want to talk
about the era of the monster movies and since the
B movies, yet this guy does it. He agreed to
produce the film on a one million dollar budget, which
(08:04):
was one of the highest budgets that Corman had ever
done for any of his films, Like that was his
highest budget, Like he'd never done anything that expensive before,
and so this is coming out of his own money
to release on another distributor. So production began in nineteen
eighty two because he went because again they were about
to lose the rights. So under the direction of music
(08:26):
video director Ole Seosan for twenty The production lasted for
twenty one to twenty five days. Let me repeat that
this production lasted less than a month. They never had
a table read. No table read was done for this movie.
(08:47):
They started, I believe, I believe, if I remember correctly
from the documentary, they started December twenty eighth on this movie.
In ninety two. Storyboards were drawn out. Movies were shot
on sound stages in Venice, California, Agora, California, Lailah, Marrimount University,
the Pacific Stock Exchange, downtown Los Angeles. Costume We'll get
(09:18):
into costumes later because that those are some choices that
were made. But they were saying, upon explaining to Attast
is that these people in the story just swamped me
and said you're going to be faithful to it. And
I told them, this is why I'm buying these books. So,
and that's what the costume designer said. One of them
was hired as a weapons consultant and they they the
(09:44):
stuntman Carl Krawfro, who wore the rubber suit to portray
the Thing, worked with the work with the actual Ben
Grimm actor Michael Bailey Smith, who played the human self
Ben Grim so that their manners would match. Now that
actor didn't know that he wasn't going to be in
the Thing costume. That's a completely that's the stunt actor.
(10:05):
And here's the thing. The actor who plays Ben Grimm,
Michael Smith, he is way taller than his stuntman. So
when you see thing transform, they had to do some
visual kind of magic to not make it seem like,
wait a minute, did the thing just shrink?
Speaker 2 (10:27):
Yeah, because the the actor who plays him, he has
a very strong presence about him, like the guys.
Speaker 3 (10:35):
He's pretty cut.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
I mean, I've seen him and other things playing bad
guys and stuff like that. So, uh, Michael Bailey Smith
is a big menacing force, and yet he looked smaller
even with the pact on Rock as.
Speaker 3 (10:48):
The thing, So that that makes sense that.
Speaker 2 (10:51):
They didn't really get a stunt actor that matched.
Speaker 1 (10:54):
The bid yep, and he was not he was not
prepared for that. He was ready to get in that.
And so when you talk about the thing, there was
one main body that was made and two heads, one
for fighting and one for the talking. That was it.
So so already Marvel Studios was not necessarily full on
(11:18):
because they were extended the rights. They wanted these rights
to expire, and so they were kind of actively hoping
They're not going to make this movie. They're not going
to make this movie. So that's kind of some of
the behind the scenes that was going on at the time.
Speaker 4 (11:32):
So the plot, I this is there much if you
are looking at if you've ever seen The Incredible Hulk,
like the TV show with Bill Bixby and everything like that.
Speaker 1 (11:51):
I got lots of out when I first saw it.
I got it again like this is like Bill Bixby
the Incredible Hulk.
Speaker 2 (11:57):
Yeah, I will agree to that. It definitely some of
these fight scenes gave me very Loufferigno vibes. With the
placement of everything, the sound effects. It was definitely of
its time. Yeah, So we get read Richards Victor von
(12:18):
Doom college friends, which is not necessarily in the comics.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
They never were friends. In the comics, use the opportunity
of a passing comic called Colossus to as an experiment
and goes horribly wrong, leaving Victor to believe dead, which
was interesting.
Speaker 2 (12:34):
Okay, hold on, I have to comment on the two
guys who pronounced him dead. We see them earlier, and
are they not wearing the most eighties mobster down by
the river with the card again and the hat on,
just dip low sitting at the park like trying not
to look but looking. I'm like, no one can tell
(12:56):
these Yeah, no one can tell that these quote unquote
why guys are up to something over here.
Speaker 1 (13:02):
Yeah, it's and it's like he's dead. It's like, oh, okay,
well we know he's coming back because yeah, doctor Doom
And I never thought that. But here's the other thing
that gets creeps me out a little bit, Like they
go he goes over, like read goes over. I think
I think Victor's with him, if I remember correctly. And
they go over to the storm'shouse and there's Sue's Storm
(13:23):
And I was like, wait a minute, wait a minute,
she's a kid, Like I don't I couldn't remember there
was gonna be a time jump at that point, and
she is I don't know how old she is, but
she is definitely a teenager at that point. I don't
think she's like eighteen. I want to say like she's
she's fifteen or sixteen at that boot, because she she's
and she is. I'm not saying like, this doesn't happen
where teenage girl's falling over the college person. In this case,
(13:46):
she's falling over Oh my god, is that you Bringaba?
It's like, I don't know, did you just not get
to just like an ick, like a real big ick.
Just watching that sequence.
Speaker 2 (13:55):
Knowing their history and knowing what they become, I was like, Okay,
this is weird. And then immediately when we see them
after the time jump, and immediately she's fawning over him
and they're having this stargazy look and she comes Now
he's got the white temples by this point is obvious
he's older and she's this young just coming to maturity
(14:16):
girl and she walks down the steps and they're just
like enamored with each other. And I'm like, this is
weird considering how you two just were two minutes ago
in this film.
Speaker 1 (14:28):
Yeah, And it's a ten year time jump after the
supposed death of Victor, and so a big time jump
with it. And I mean if you when you Watchdom,
like you see later, like you get to see like
the actor, the actors and actors is that portray everyone
(14:49):
at that point, but like the the actress who plays
Alicia and Sue, I don't know how old they were
when they but I mean they've aged gracefully, very gracefully
when you see the documentary, and I was like, wow, Okay,
I would love to know how old you all were,
because I didn't think you were like incredibly old when
(15:10):
you did it, but it was just like, oh, I
expected you to be a little more, you know, aged,
But so yeah. Flashes to ten years later and Reid, Sue,
and Johnny and Ben participate in a mission and experiment
of aircraft as Reid wants to go after the comment again,
and unbeknownst to them, a crucial diamond component designed to
(15:31):
protect them from the cosmic grades has been replaced with
an imitation one by the criminal the Jeweler, leaving them
exposed to radiation. Okay, so you watch this movie and
you're like, I don't remember a villain called the Jeweler.
That's right, There was no villain the Jeweler because this
is supposed to be Mollman.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
Yes, because his first appearance, he's popping out of the sewer.
Now he's got the Jeweler eyeglass on. That's the only
thing that makes you think that this is someone other
than the mole Man.
Speaker 3 (16:01):
Yeah, but everything about.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
Him just screams from the moment he pops on the
screen this moment yep.
Speaker 1 (16:07):
So that is because Marvel, Marvel Studios and Marvel Comics
would not give them the license to use anyone but
the Fantastic fourign Doctor Doom, anyone else, even though it
was just tied to Fantastic for a moment, doesn't really
appear much outside of too much outside of Fantastic Four.
I mean you think, moment I think he's a Fantastic
Four villain, that's usually what it is. Yeah, they wouldn't
(16:28):
allow him use moments. So that's why you get everything
thing Moleman except the mole creatures and him being called Moleman.
Because immediately when I saw the first time, I was like, oh,
that's oh the Jeweler. Oh okay, And now we know
they weren't allowed to use it. So because he took
the jewel, the jewel, the exposed the comics of cosmic radiation.
(16:49):
And that was an interesting sequence. It looked like we're
doing the seventies and sixties and the drug trip's begetting
ready to happen on screen.
Speaker 2 (16:58):
Yeah, the whole cosmic moment. And then also we have
the scene where we meet Alicia and her and Ben
interact for I don't know, ten fifteen seconds tops. Yeah,
and they're both automatically in love at this point, like everything.
Speaker 1 (17:18):
It can't happen. But that was a little ridiculous the way.
Speaker 2 (17:22):
Yeah, and but yeah, the whole going to space, seeing
them in the U, the shiny suits going on, Like, okay,
so someone spent all their budget on these tinfoil suits.
Right now it looks like you guys are dressed for
a sauna, not to go out in space.
Speaker 1 (17:41):
Yeah. Even going back to Alicia, so like, unless you
knew who Alicia is in the comics, Woulch, did you
think they did even a good job of impressing upon
us that she was blind? I don't think they did
a great job like impressed by like later in the
other sequences. I think they made that point, but they
(18:01):
definitely did. I don't think they did a good job
calling attention that she was blind.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
No, in her first interaction, it was more of she
was shocked and she reached out, and then it more
looked like, Okay, she just thought this guy was hot,
so she touched his face.
Speaker 3 (18:17):
A' llah.
Speaker 2 (18:17):
You know, uh, Peggy Carter when she first sees Steve Rogers,
when he comes out, he's.
Speaker 3 (18:24):
All bumping out. Yeah, that's that's the look.
Speaker 2 (18:27):
Now when she's working with the clay, and then she's
really going into the features, Okay, you start to pick
up on it, but there's nothing that implicitly says, Okay,
she's blond, this is what's going on, and here we are.
But anyways, yeah, so then they crashed the land and
then we start seeing like the Infamous, like they get
their powers. You know, Reid's body can stretch, sure, Susan
(18:53):
becomes invisible. Okay, that's easy to do.
Speaker 1 (18:56):
And I wonder because again it's been a bit to
I've seen this. Johnny just like generates fire on demand.
I was like, oh, I forgot, I didn't I'd forgotten saying,
oh man, are we a bunch of just called to
the point where we're never gonna see him totally flame
on at that point they do later on. It's it's
really even more comical later on when he finally gets
to do it. It's so bad. And then the transformation
(19:20):
of bands don't like to that was actually not bad
that for what they were given in the budget, they
actually did that decently.
Speaker 3 (19:27):
Well yeah, yeah, the whole the whole thing was funny.
Speaker 2 (19:35):
Their reactions after the crash, like Johnny is super hype
for having just crashed and everything like that. Yeah, he's
jumping around, He's like, did you guys see that? And
then we get the very bad green screen of Sue
being invisible, Johnny figuring out he has flame powers because
(19:57):
he sneezes like. It's just it is the most campy
thing ever, and.
Speaker 1 (20:05):
Really with that whole whole idea of because they're on
in this old field and they don't know what to do,
and then they get captured by these marines who who
are actually like part of you know, we we see
Doctor Doom finally and we all, you know, comic swise,
who was this Doctor Doom when we know it's Victor,
(20:26):
you know Victor. At that point, now I will say
this about the costume. If you're calling for comic accuracy thing,
comic accurate, perfect done, well, it is what it is
for the time, you know, I think obviously with the
fantastic four first Steps, we've come a long way. God
at LEAs see is better. But for the time, Yes,
(20:46):
it wasn't too it was. It wasn't bad. Doctor Doom
costume spot on, absolutely spot on. No no real notes
necessarily on Doctor Jun's costume. What do you have to
say about that?
Speaker 2 (20:57):
Yeah, the costume itself look great, mask looked great, Everything
about it looked good. They show the shot of the
throne room and everything like that, Like I got very
Doctor Doom vibes. It's just once he began talking and
emoting with his hands, that's when I was like, okay,
we're back to the over the top ness. But him
(21:18):
just standing there as a menacing force and looking like
again at this time, someone who'd be like, yeah, that's
the bad guy that they nailed that perfectly.
Speaker 1 (21:29):
And you know you talked about how the actor who
was playing Victor and Doctor Doom was very much like
up to the up to a very high level of
a moting again just he he did that on purpose
because he actually had seen the comics and just had
he he wanted to go for that whole thing. It
was like this egomatistical like person who thought he was
(21:51):
God's gift and everything, and that's why he's like that.
It's it was his choice, and you know it as
it's a choice. He's not too far off in the
sense of like Doom being an egotistical maniac. But I
think what it became was memeworthy and comical because Doom
is that kind of egotistical maniac, but he's also sinister
(22:15):
and incredibly threatening, like you look at in the sense
of Fantastic Four Villains Slash. I mean, Doom's also an
Avengers villain when it comes down to it as well.
He's definitely on your top five, I say top five
list of biggest threats in the Marvel universe. And really
that's that's he's definitely considered because you don't see it
(22:36):
in this movie, but like he's he dabbles in sorcery
in the occult and uses that to advantage. He's a
genius intellect. He you knows rivals read Richards in many
different ways. So I mean that's I think what was
missed in this portrayal of it, he becomes it becomes
very mustachetorily. Yeah, he definitely becomes the the over the top,
(23:00):
take over the world scheming villain instead of the smart, cold,
calculating menacing force that can take on anyone from a
street level to the Avengers. Yep. So so yeah, so
they he wants to figure out how to get their
superpowers to him, and as always, after they escape and
(23:26):
you know, very easily they decide to Ben gets angry
and leaves and goes out on his own, feeling like
he's become a freak, and finds the Homeless Man, ends
up joining the Layer of the Jewelry aka the mold Man.
That's the whole thing. And then the Jeweler has his
henchmen kidnap Alicia masters, intending to use the stolen power
(23:50):
as a wedding gift to her. Like this was as
this was so random. This is absolutely so random of
how that all went out.
Speaker 2 (23:58):
Yeah, And the entire time they're cutting back and forth
to scenes of Alicia and she is just having all
her memories of Ben, and I'm like, again, you guys
met for five seconds, and ma'am, you are obsessing over
this man, You've made a clay bust of him, and
then you like kiss the you take your fingers after
(24:19):
you form the lips and then kiss them. Like this
is a little bit obsessive here, Like I'm starting to
worry about Alicia's mind state.
Speaker 1 (24:27):
Here, Yeah, especially how she was doing that mostly from memory, Yeah,
of a first interaction that, yeah, that's that's a lot.
And so she's using this as a you know, he
kidnapped her. You want to use the big diamond as
(24:49):
a gift. And then you know, Doom sends his own
henchmen to make a deal. No avail, so Doom takes
the diamond for himself, and a gun battle break out
between the man and the jewelers when Ben editors. Doom
takes Alsha hostage, and Ben threatens to its Clomber in Time,
of which, you know, to be fair, we've not heard
(25:10):
clober in Time or flame on in any of the
trailers for first steps, but we know we're gonna hear
it eventually because probably they say to a comical level
at this point in this movie, because every time it's
Clomber in Time.
Speaker 2 (25:22):
Yeah, Alicia begs him not to risk it and confesses
her love for him. Sure, why not?
Speaker 1 (25:30):
Because again Kupid's love hits, you know, because we needed
to rush through that. Her confession changes. Okay, so her
confession of love changes, bend to human form and Dooms
react do? I can't? Do you remember what he said?
Because he said something's like the line like that, Oh
that's that's that's a double entendre basically what she said there.
(25:54):
I wish I wrote it down because I laughed out
loud with Doom's line to saying, oh, not Somiji anymore.
Speaker 2 (26:03):
Yeah, I don't remember the exact wording, but I mean
I laughed at a lot of this stuff with Ben Grimm.
Like there's the fight scene where it's him versus the
guys in the lab, and all of a sudden, it's
just the camera spins and you hear beat up sounds,
and the next thing you know, there's all these guys
on the floor and they're like, oh, what am I
supposed to do with these guys? And yeah, it's it
(26:26):
just it's it's something different.
Speaker 1 (26:30):
And then who knew? Who knew that? Did you know that?
How you get Ben Grimm to turn back from a
monster to the thing that going to the monster thing?
To human was admitting you love him? What happened to if?
Is it one of these things that you give him
a hug and he turns back. I didn't realize that
(26:52):
that's the weakness and how to stop the thing. I
was like, Wow, totally forgot that. I have to go
back into comics and check that out. Nope, nope, not
there doesn't exist.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
Yeah, that we could have solved sixty years of Bingrim's
problems had someone just given him the hug that.
Speaker 1 (27:11):
He needs, or just giving him Cubid s arrow. That
happens within just meeting someone who gives him the time
of day. So when Ben returns to his friend, Read
has learned that Doom is actually Victor Shock, He's not dead,
and Doom contacts then threatens to use his diamond to
power a laser cannon that will destroy New York City
(27:33):
unless you surrender to doctor to me, Doom, let's be
channeling my inner Uh. Going to the eleven of Doctor Doom, realizing.
Speaker 2 (27:45):
Oh, I found the quote real quick, I found the quote, yeah, Google.
When when he transforms, Doctor Doom says at that point,
he goes, uh, uh, it's well, it seems lover boys
not quite himself anymore today.
Speaker 1 (28:00):
Yeah, we know what you're saying. We so yeah, so,
realizing that they are the only ones that can stop them,
Sue Storm somehow, in a very quick amount of time,
has sewn together these costumes and man, are they combat
acker Yes. Do they look like they fit them at all?
(28:21):
Absolutely not.
Speaker 2 (28:25):
Yeah, the suits, the wide white collar, it's it is
something like, yes, it fits for the look of the
Fantastic Four, like if you were to pull out an
old comic book cover or an old painting of what
the Fantastic Four is supposed to be. These suits matched
them incredibly, but it is still super cheesy and seeing
(28:49):
like read stretched with these suits and some of the
other things, it's just it's interesting.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (28:56):
Oh and Johnny's line when they all come together about yeah,
we can do this because we are the Fantastic Four, right.
Speaker 1 (29:04):
Because that's calling back to before they left to go
on the ship. Suo Storms, Sue and Johnny's mom say, oh,
look at you the fantastic look at you four, the
Fantastic Four. And to the point of I said, all right,
roll credits here we are.
Speaker 2 (29:19):
Yeah, and then uh, right afterwards we get the uh
I call it the Superman a laser scene. Everyone's in
a force field.
Speaker 1 (29:29):
Oh yeah, everyone's in a forest field and Doom's gonna
siphon their power because that's how you get powers. You
literally just drain the power out of them. And what
was how do they get out of there?
Speaker 2 (29:38):
Like read reach reach stretches Somehow he flattens his foot
and stretches underneath the force.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
Field, Like, I guess that's how force fields don't work.
That's all you have to do is slid a piece
of paper.
Speaker 2 (29:53):
The force field was calibrated to go all but two
centimeters short of the ground.
Speaker 1 (30:01):
Well guess, doctor Doom. Guess doctor Doom is not as
smart as he thought.
Speaker 2 (30:05):
He was.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
Not accounting for to.
Speaker 1 (30:13):
All because d he refigured out my force field's weakness
go flat. Yes, And so that's how they get out
of there, and the huge fight ensues. He got a bit,
I guess do Instead of Doom box, you have people
in Doom costumes, you know, loyal to Doom, his henchmen.
Huge fight ensues. Doom somehow manages to you know, launch
(30:36):
his laser and as he clings to the wall, Re
tries to rescue him, but Doom Gauntlet comes loose and
he falls below to probably not his death. But at
the time he's gone is Gauntlet still in the balcony
starts to move on its own for whatever reason. Meanwhile, Johnny,
this is where Johnny actually becomes in like full on.
(30:59):
Looks like it was both lowest CIGI graphics have ever
a s like, oh, this is how we're transforming to
the human. George goes off, flies off and intercepts lays
are deflecting it with his with his flame powers into
outer space.
Speaker 2 (31:14):
The image of him him running up, stopping out, stretching
his hands, and you can see the camera pause for
a minute as they then overlay the CGI and it
is very much the old Simpsons with the Pucci where
the graphic cards just flies away. It was, oh, it
(31:35):
is so hilarious to watch. And when I saw that,
that was the moment I laughed out loud, just watching
the freeze frame of stopping in motion. All right, now
this guy is gonna take over.
Speaker 1 (31:48):
And then Ben frees Alicia and finally introduced himself to her.
I've loved you since I saw you yesterday, yes ago,
whatever it was.
Speaker 2 (31:58):
They're in love, Doctor Dum saying that he's got the
insurance policy of the woman that he cares the most about,
and she's yelling about love and everyone's about love, and
then finally he goes, so I'm gonna formally introduce myself, Mike,
how are you all in love? If you never formally? Yeah,
it's it's no, it's something.
Speaker 1 (32:20):
Yeah. So she feels rocky faced, and as it again,
that's comic. Actor Alicia is not phased by it. Necessarily,
will come to see in our next film that's basically
the same way. And they Sue and Reid get married.
We don't know how much time has happened. They get
(32:40):
married and reads in his costume and Susan and Susan
the wedding dress, and that's also very comic character because
that's what happened. And they drive away just married, and
then you get the bad graphics of Reid's looks like
someone's like operating a puppet arm.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
As the incredible flailing arm man from the car Salesman's.
Speaker 1 (33:01):
Yeah, and they lived happily ever after the end, and
it was like wo and that was I think that
was ninety minutes. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that was ninety minutes,
I think about or it felt like two hours out
of one of the two. Just it was it was
a lot, and I was I was operating that into
(33:24):
at two times speed at that point. Ovitually I did
it at one point five speed, just because this is
all right. If I'm sitting through this movie, I'm putting
it at a higher speed to get through it. So
they made this movie. So let's talk about exactly when
the pup plug was pulled on it. So nineteen ninety
three magazine article gave the tentative release date of Labor
(33:44):
Day weekend, nineteen ninety three during the during the summer,
trailers ran in theaters on the video game release of
Corman's Carnosaur Little Miss Millions. The cast was hired a
publicist at their own expense tell promote it at clips
screenings at the Shrine Auditorium in Los Angeles and at
San Diego Comic Con. So this was at San Diego
(34:04):
Comic Con back then, and the film appeared as a
cover story in the issue of Film Threat magazine. They
were actually on set. They had a reporter on set
during production that was covering this beginning to end because
this was a huge deal. They Sympantastic four was a
huge property in the comics, and this was getting traction
(34:25):
by the time the World Premiere was announced to take
place at the Mall of America in Bloomington, Minnesota, January nineteen,
nineteen eighty four. Let me repeat that the World Premiere
was going to take place at the Mall of America
in Bloomington, Minnesota, with proceeds from the event to be
paying for the Ronald MacDonald and Children's Miracle Network, so
you know, good intentions. Suddenly, though premiere is halted. The
(34:49):
actors received a cease and assist order on all promotion
from the producers in the studio confiscated the negatives. Inneker
then informed Sassoon that the the film would not be released.
Speculation arose the film was never intended for release, but
had gone on into production solely as a way for
Inineker to retain the rights of the characters, which for
(35:11):
the most part screw stan Lee. In two thousand and
five that this was said, this was indeed the case
that the movie was never supposed to be shown to anyone,
and adding a contract to release it, and I had
to be I had to be bought out by the
contract of that contract by eineker Iingar called Lee's version
of events definitely not true. It was not our original
(35:33):
intention to make a B movie, that's for sure, but
when the movies was there, we wanted to release him.
He said that future Marvel Studios founder Avi Rodd at
this point in ninety three as Marvel executives. He said,
Avi a Rod calls me up and says, listen, I
think what she did was great. It shows your enthusiasm
for the movie and property. Now I understand that you
(35:53):
have invested so so much, and Roger has invested so much.
Let's do a deal. Because he really didn't like the
idea of a small movie coming out and maybe ruining
the franchise, so he says to me that he wants
to give me my money back and what we spent
on the movie, and that we should not release it.
A Rod recalled in two thousand and two that while
(36:15):
a shirt to Puerto Rico ninety three, a fan noticing
a Rod's fantastic for shirt express excitement of the film's premiere,
which a Rod did not know about. Concerned how low
budget was, he said he purchased a film for a
couple million dollars in cash not having seen it and
ordered Prince destroyed it and prevent the release. Although never
officially released to the general public, it was exhibited the
Fantastic Four. It has been subject to bootleg record is
(36:38):
because they did get a record. How they think they
got a recording out was I think I can't remember
who it's brought up and doomed that at some point
the recording was made of it. And they really do
think that someone who did the recording saw what it
was recorded one for themselves too, and that's how it
(36:59):
started getting out there. That's been kind of the legend
of how this thing was getting out there at Comic
Con things like that and that, And then that's true,
like Arod had just been named as the head of
the Marvel Studios part and they had just sold the
X Men rights to twentieth Century Fox. So x Men
was already getting ready to be in development. So as
(37:20):
I said, Box had write a refuse I mean, excise me,
Marvel already had write a refusal to shop this to
other places if they weren't happy. So again, they didn't
necessarily break anything down. They were hoping that the movie
was never get made, and when they saw it, well,
we're not letting you release this. This is yeah, you know,
and that was they these actors thought that this was
(37:41):
going to be a launch pad for a lot of
their careers. And it was funny where in the documentary,
the actress who plays Alicia, she said she was at
a party one time and this person came up to
her and like, I recognize you from somewhere, and he said, Alisha,
it's like and she was like, how do you know that.
(38:03):
It's like, I've seen the movie. What do you mean
you've seen the movie? I haven't even seen the movie.
And I think she said she she got to see
the movie because she fail, Oh yeah, I got an
eb so she said after that party, she went on
ebaying bought herself a copy so she could actually see
the movie for the first time. And it's just unfortunate,
you know, was this movie going to be again? The
(38:24):
problem was this wasn't a well funded movie. So, I mean,
the way for a million dollars, this is a glorified fanfic,
you know, with what they were able to do. And
I'll tell you what, for all intensive purposes, it's not
a bad fanfic. It's it's laughable at some points, But
I can't say that they Marvel and stan Lee and
(38:47):
Avia Rodd never wanted this to come out. Everyone else
they were going with the full intentions that they wanted
to put this out. And that's why I always say
when people say why, are like, who's asking for this? Oh,
set out to make a bad movie. They did not
set out to make a bad movie with this. They
operated under the auspices of what they had, So I mean,
(39:09):
it's not a great movie in my sense. I'm ever
gonna recommend this to someone outside of like, if you
really want to see how far we've come with Fantastic
for start here, that is why I will recommend this movie,
to see how far we've come, you know. Yeah, it
doesn't even compare to what we're going to be in
the next one with our two thousand and five of
Fantastic War. They this night and day, you know, and
it took ten years to get to that point.
Speaker 2 (39:31):
Yeah, there are parts of this movie where you could
tell like someone very much cared about the Fantastic for
A franchise, from the costuming to you know, the characters
that they use or were allowed to use. When I
first watched this on YouTube, one of the first comments
was someone who claimed to have been a camera assistant
(39:52):
on the movie, and he talks about how they shot
multiicam for fast coverage and they no one who was
working on the movie, according to this person, knew that
it was never going to see the light of day.
They were all operating that this was going to be
a thing. And you know, he says that for them
(40:16):
at the time, they thought the things costume was impressive.
And when you start looking at it in the gaze
of nineteen ninety four and you think about again teenage mutant,
ninja turtles and other stuff like that, Yeah, it's on
par with some of the cheesiness from those costumes, and
that's what they were working with. He also mentions that
(40:39):
he received a VHS copy, which was usually distributed to
the crew members for their work reels, and so that's
probably why some of this got started to get leaked
a little bit early. But I mean, again, it's not
the most horrible movie that I've ever seen, but it
(40:59):
is a sign of the times. You can tell that
it was done on a lower budget than it could be,
and you know, they had secured the rights for it
for two hundred and fifty thousand dollars and before that
tenure option ran out, and to meet the terms of
the contract, they had to put something together and that
(41:22):
they did and it's satisfied long enough so that they
could make it until their next film that need to
be released, which was the Fantastic Four movie that came
out in two thousand and five. So I mean, without this,
we would have never had that. Without that, we would
never had Rise's Silver Server and Fox just doing its thing.
Speaker 1 (41:43):
Yeah, And like I said, if you, I know, you
hadn't gotten a chance to seeing it, David, But I've
recommended it, you know, I recommend everyone you can find Doomed.
I know, yeah, it was on Prime.
Speaker 3 (41:55):
It's on YouTube.
Speaker 1 (41:56):
Yeah, no, that's why I've watched that. I watched on YouTube.
When you look up Fantastic dooms so you can watch
it for free if you have primary you can find
out on YouTube. It's it's well worth the watch. I
think it gives a lot of context to it. It
is very sad that of everything, because again, like a
million dollars, I don't have a million dollars necessarily that
(42:16):
I can just blow and say like yeah, sure, a
million dollars. I mean again, Roger Corman, that's not what
he's famous for. He's famous for doing B movies and
does him really well at that point, And the fact
I think it's a be fantastic for a movie, well,
that's not what they set out to do. They set
out to say, like what you willing to commit? I'm
willing to commit this. Okay, let's see what we can
operate a for a million dollars plus of what they
(42:38):
operated under. That's impressive. I mean, I'm impressed that you
got that done. And there are tons of problem with this. Well,
I ever watch this movie again, not unless I need
to do something like this. I you know, I'll sooner.
I'd sooner watch the documentary again than this movie. You know. Yeah,
(42:58):
So no surprise. I don't even need to I'll say
this is gonna be at the bottom of my list.
It's just it's not gonna be anywhere close to a top.
And it's it's not even a comparison piece, like even
in a I try to look at this will be Okay,
I already know it's gonna be not great. Let me see
(43:21):
it is what it is. So, David, is this.
Speaker 2 (43:23):
Gonna be number one on your list nowhere near even
through the lens of nineteen ninety four.
Speaker 1 (43:29):
It is.
Speaker 2 (43:31):
You can tell that you know it was a rush production.
You can tell that it was just you know, it
was something put out there. It's not good.
Speaker 3 (43:41):
It's not.
Speaker 2 (43:43):
The absolute worst thing that I've ever watched, but it
is not something that I will be looking to revisit
at any point.
Speaker 3 (43:51):
I believe. I even told my girlfriend that.
Speaker 2 (43:55):
If I was to have someone else watch this, I
feel like I would owe them money for the time
that they spent.
Speaker 1 (44:01):
Now I would say this. What I always composed is
when I watched Son of Mask or How Are the Duck?
Over this? No, I would so I would sooner watch
I would sooner watch this again versus those two movies.
That's what I compare to, because those are some of
the worst movies I've ever seen. Yeah, so, if given
(44:24):
the choices, I would watch Roger Corman. It's a fantastic
four if in compared to How Are the Duck and
The Son of the Mask?
Speaker 2 (44:32):
So I would say so. This release in nineteen ninety four.
Other notable movies that released in were Double Dragon and Hercules,
And you know it's it's not even on their level.
So it it deserves its spot at the bottom of
not only the Marvel and I use that loose quote
(44:56):
Marvel movies, but also just nineteen ninety four movies.
Speaker 1 (45:00):
So all right, So that is our retro review our
first episode of the Baxter broadcast. So next time we
will come to with our next one, the Fantastic Four
from two thousand and five, So we'll see you then,
all right. As always, David, we do our post credits
(45:22):
in our preview of Fantastic Four from two thousand and five,
so just you know, not as in spoiler thoughts, just
like going into this, just kind of talk about like
your hype level for this movie when it did come out,
and did you see it in theaters when it came out.
Speaker 2 (45:39):
I actually did see this in theaters when it came out.
I remember going and seeing it with friends. The main
reason that we all went to go see it was
because of Jessicalva. Now granted dating myself. I was a
freshman in college at the time, so me going and
seeing a movie for justcal but that that tracks at
(46:03):
the time. And this was before Chris Evans the Action Star,
so this was, you know, not another t movie. Chris
Evans this was like the comedic version of him, so
like it seemed like, all right, well, let's let's go,
let's let's give this a shot. So I was actually
(46:23):
really anticipating this movie back when I originally saw it,
and I've watched it a couple of times since then,
even before this past weekend. I'm gonna give it one
more good, fresh watch before our next recording. And it's
not something I run from. But it's definitely not something
I run to.
Speaker 1 (46:44):
Yeah, it's it's been a bit since I've watched it.
I've you know, we've got a few weeks before we
we record this next episode. But it it it is
early two thousand superhero movie. It to your point, I
didn't necessarily go to because of Jessica Alba. I do
do because I'm a big nerd and even though I'm
(47:04):
not the biggest Fantastic Four Gung Ho fan, I was like,
it's another superb movie. Sure, I'll give a shot Jessica album.
We'll help at that point. But from the trailers, Okay
it checks off. Is this a Fantastic Four movie? Yes?
Does it check off some boxes of what this is?
Sure it's got Doctor Doom's got this Okay, I can
kind of it could be paint by numbers, but sure,
(47:26):
let me give it a shot for all to the
purposes you know preview it does set up for what
it needs to do, and it definitely was one where
I was like, Okay, that's a choice that seems better
that Okay, we're hurting. But you know, we will give
our full breakdown of that in a couple of weeks
(47:48):
when we bring you the Fantastic Four from two thousand
and five. So we will see you next time. Patrons,
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