Matthew Hoffman

Hey everyone!
This week we talk about Matthew Hoffman, a tree-obsessed freak who murdered Stephanie Sprang, Tina Herrmann and Kody Maynard, and kidnapped and assaulted Sarah Maynard in Apple Valley, Ohio in 2010.

Sources:
Excerpts from Matthew Hoffman's confession
Father, stepmother charged with assaulting Knox County kidnap victim
Ohio girl found alive, bound; no word on 3 others - mlive.com

Girl In The Leaves

Episode Transcript

(00:09):
Hi, welcome back to give usmore leave. I'm Megan, and I'm
so sorry it's taking us this long. Yeah, well we only missed one
week, which is like for us, at least we're doing it again.
You know, Usually we're like,ah, you know what, the break
was really nice? Are you proudof us? Guys? We didn't We
didn't take a whole month this time, although this one is kind of last

(00:33):
minute because like today is Friday,the thirty first of March, and you
will be listening to this by theend of today. So random applause from
Megan. I woke up this morningand I was like, yes, day
off work, I get to recordthe podcast because my alarm went off and

(00:53):
I just well, like as soonas alarm goes off, I'm triggered.
Like I'm like, I'm pissed already. Then I ordered my little Starbucks,
which is not empty, but itwas so fucking good. I got um
an iced Oh Bran sugar iced OhShaken espresso. You first of all,

(01:17):
health Queen for the oat milk.Secondly, it doesn't take much to impress
me. Secondly, I wish Icould order. Sorry, I have to
fix my computer so I can seeyou better. I wish I could order
Starbooks to my home, but Ican't because we don't have that in our
tiny little town. Honestly, it'sone of the little pleasures of living here.

(01:41):
I could be like crying about missingmy family and friends. I got
to start boom, but I canorder Starbooks to my home. I have
a question for you, Actually,what do you order when you go to
Starbooks? I do like a bransugar shaken and fucking espresso. It is
chef's kiss and an iced white Smokais also very good, but I haven't

(02:07):
tried it, Like I don't thinkI've tried it. So is it good?
Like is it sweet? And itis sweet? But it is good.
I like it. And then andlisteners at home at home, every
on the radio and listeners at homephone in, what is your Starbucks order?
Tell me? I am I'm notvery adventurous. I won't lie though,

(02:30):
my Like, you know, whenyou don't know what to get,
so you just get kind of likea comfort one that you just know that
you will enjoy. And it isa basic, bitch one. And I'm
well aware that it is very basic. Okay, you don't need to tell

(02:51):
me it is. I know itis. I like an iced caramel macchiato.
Oh, it's got caramel drizzle init. So as you're like sucking
it up, you're getting like littleclumps that You're getting little clumps of caramel
and it's just tasty. Do youknow what? I don't like a pumpkin

(03:12):
spiced latte. I can't remember ifI've ever tried one. I tried one
because I wanted to see what thehype was. You know, m I
am a fall girl. I'm afall girl. I love fall slash autumn.
So I was like, this isthe like autumn drink. I have
to try it? Mm hmm.It was fucking foul. It's like,

(03:38):
the fuck is this shit? Whyare people drinking this fucking sacrilege? You're
gonna be absolutely you're canceled. Hal. I don't think I'm I don't think
I'm allowed to be a fall girlanymore. Also, can I just say
chi chai latte? Chi chi teawhatever? Fuck Chaila? No, I've

(04:00):
never tried it, and I wantedto try it. It tastes like um,
it tastes like winter. You knowwhen you get a piece of fruitcake
at Christmas? Gross? Yeah,that's what it tastes like in my opinion.
Anyway. I don't know if youfollow or see a girl on TikTok
and a star or something like thatis her name, and she does the

(04:24):
she goes to star Bees and she'slike, just give me what you want,
yeah, what you would get,and she always gets these amazing drinks.
But in Ireland we don't have someof those ingredients. We don't have
most of them. To be honest, I see some of those Starbucks orders
and I'm like, what the fuck? But luck listen, I wouldn't be

(04:46):
able to. Actually, I don'thave the confidence to go into a Starbucks
and be like, Hi, canI get a child latte with sweet vanilla,
cold foam? Three pumps vanilla,two pumps chocolate. I just don't
have it in me to go inand be like, Hi, yeah,
can I have this really intense specificorder? To be honest, I feel

(05:12):
like in Ireland, if you askfor cold foam, the barista would hop
over the counter and punch you.Swear in the face, yeah, you
can tell it when you ask foran iced one, when you're like,
Hi, can I get an icedcaramel maccietto they're like, iced, you
fucking dick, thank you, loveyou so much, thank you. Yeah.

(05:33):
So, anyway, tell us whatyour goal to drink is and maybe
we'll try it. But if it'spumpkin, spice, batte or chilte,
we will not be trying it.No, no, we will not.
So two things before we get in, and one of them is, if
you haven't already checked out Megan's episodeswith that's so fucked up, make sure

(05:56):
you do so Gi Little extra GI, Little extra Megan your life Extra Meg.
Why does that sound rose? Doesn'tit sounds fabulous? Yeah, and
go listen to those. And thenthe last thing is the shooting in Nashville.
M let's talk about it. Okay, they were nine years old.

(06:23):
The three students that died, wasit? What was it? Three students
and a teacher. Three students andthree teachers, and all three teachers were
in their sixties and the three kidswere nine years of age. And currently
America is more focused on trying totrying to reverse lgb t Q plus laws,

(06:47):
trying to ban books that talk aboutrace and religion and other books that
talk about LGBTQ plus. And Isaw a TikTok and I have to say
it was a very powerful TikTok andit was of a like a senator or
a politician anyway over in America,and he's arguing about why are we banning

(07:11):
these books? You know, he'sjust like, what home is it going
to do if students read these kindsof books and they're not like out their
books. I don't know what one'sthere, but they're not like like,
hey, you should be trends oryou know, they're just talking. Yeah
he was. He just turned aroundat the end of his argument and was

(07:32):
like, put jokes on you becausedead kids can't read. And you know
what, he has a point likewhen when is it when? Like how
many school shootings? Is too manyschool shootings? When I hear people make
the argument about how they want tokeep their guns in one way, I'm

(07:54):
like, Okay, I see yourpoint, but also it's not a good
enough point for them to be soeasily accessible. That this shooter had something
like seven guns they had brought.I'm not sure. I'm actually not sure.
I'm confused on whether they were.I think she had transitioned to she

(08:16):
to she. I wasn't sure ifshe had transitioned from she to he or
from he to sheep. They wereable to buy something like seven guns from
five different shops, like five differentfirearm stores. Like, how is that
actually legally possible? Do you knowwhat I mean? Because obviously it's like
all over internet. And one politicianwas like, do you know what what

(08:41):
an A or it was like anA or fifteen or something that she used
I believe in one of her gunsanyway that she purchased, And it was
like, do you know what thatdoes to a person? Like you don't
shoot deer with that kind of gunbecause it destroys the deer. There's been
nothing left of the deer. Sowhy does anyone of the public need a

(09:05):
gun like that? Because what's that? Like? Whatever about? You know,
like a shot not a shotgun,a handgun, a handgun that like
you I can like I can getthat, I get it, and I
can I can understand if you arelike a single woman and you live alone
in a rough neighborhood. Now ifyou just want to protect your family,

(09:26):
like if you as long as youkeep that gun and you follow guns safety
protocols and completely understand having a handgunlocked away safely in your home for in
case there was ever in a treaderor anything like that. What do we
what does like a society like thatneed shotguns, rifles, a salt rifle,

(09:50):
AsSalt like assault rifles, Like whatdo they need those kind of weapons
for? I don't know. Thisis not like, let's suppose it is.
I wanted to say that this isnot us giving a political stance.
Obviously we have like no right totalk about really what's going on over there
because it's not our country, we'renot living in it. But at the
same time, as Europeans, Idon't think we can sit here and comprehend

(10:13):
why this needs. These shootings happenso often it just boggles their mind.
So our hearts go out to thevictims of every shooting in Americas so far
this year, obviously, and tothe kids and teachers that were involved in

(10:33):
in any school shot shootings. Ican't remember. I can't like, oh,
I think yeah, I think itwas Monday or Tuesday. Am.
I can't fathom what it would belike as a parent to have Anna in
school. No, like you youjust dropped Anna off to school right now?

(10:54):
Like sorry you cry, no,because I guess actually terrifying, like
you're they're sending kids to school withbackpacks that are bulletproof, and they're on
about like trying to build safe roomsin classrooms so that if this happens,
that they like pull this thing outof the wall and it turns into like

(11:16):
a safe like a panic room.Why are you building that instead of banning
guns? Just banning guns and youdon't need the panic rooms. I'm sorry.
What's more important your right to owna gun or to have your child
alive? See, So, yeah, I just wanted to mention it.
Obviously, it's a true crime podcast. We have a platform to talk about

(11:39):
these kinds of things, and weshouldn't be silent, you know. Obviously
there's nothing we can say that's evergoing to change anything. And I'm sorry
if this conversation is fucking pissed youoff, But I'm sorry, there's a
there's grieving parents. I hope it'spissed you off in the right way that
if you live in America and youhear this and you get riled, I
hope it riles you in the correctmanner that you then are like, let's

(12:03):
go fucking sort these gun laws atYeah, so let's talk about our case
today. Our case today is avery interesting one, and I think I'm
just going to get right into itbecause we don't have a whole pile of
time. On Wednesday, November tenth, twenty ten, Valerie Haythorn called police

(12:26):
to let them know that her coworker at Dairy Queen, Tina Herman,
had not shown up for work.Tina was a thirty two year old mother
of two who was known for herreliability, so this was so when she
didn't show up to work, theywere like, oh, something the fuck
is wrong. And Valerie Haythorne remindsme of do you remember in the Chris

(12:46):
Watts case there was a friend thatcame to the house and immediately knew that
Chris had done something. When Tinamissed her four PM shift, Valerie drove
out to the house in Apple Valley, Ohio. The lights were on and
Tina's car, as well as anothertruck were at the front. It didn't
sit right with Valerie that Tina stillwouldn't answer calls or texts, which is
why she called to the police toask for a wellness check. Smart friend.

(13:09):
Neither of Tina's two children, thirteenyear old Sarah Maynard and eleven year
old Cody Maynard had been in schoolthe next day, Thursday, the eleventh
of November. That same day,Valerie was told by a man named Ron
Metcalf that he had not seen hisgirlfriend, Stephanie Sprange, forty one,
since the morning of the tenth ofNovember, about twenty four hours previous.

(13:30):
This is shrouded in mystery. Iknow. Stephanie Sprange was a neighbor of
Tina's, and her last known movementswere that she was going to Tina's house
to help her move, as Tinaand the kids were living with Tina's then
boyfriend, Greg Borders, who hadleft the house early on Wednesday morning at
about three forty five am to getto his job as a Target warehouse worker

(13:50):
in a town a couple hours away. Oh, Greg, I already something
like the scent of you, PoorGreg. You'll see, I doesn't always
assume as the boyfriend. That's That'sexactly what happens. So then Greg was
going to continue on to meet hisfriend and stay with him for a couple

(14:11):
of days to hang out and playgolf. See, the thing is that
Greg and Tina were actually in themiddle of breaking up. There's been in
all abuse or anything like that.It was as amicable as a breakup can
be. I know it's shocking tothe world, but sometimes just people just
fall out a lot and are like, look, listen, I think it's
best to be separates, and they'relike, yeah, I think it is
best to be separate. Let's go. Yeah, Like I think that there

(14:35):
had been anger, and there hadbeen fights obviously, but it wasn't like
it wasn't it too, Like,yeah, people can get angry and have
fights, but not like getting physicalor abusive. Yeah, exactly. And
that was the same kind of splitthat Tina had when she went through when

(14:56):
she was going through the divorce withthe father of her children, Larry Maynard.
Oh, Larry, I already tilllike the Sunday any man's name.
You're just like, I don't likethe sound at you. Tina and Larry
met when they were both only fifteen. Larry saw Tina when he was at
cycling one day and he tried toset up like a little bit of a

(15:16):
little cute, like a meat cutecute and by just cycling past her repeatedly,
which like adorable. It's like,notice me on my bicycle. I
don't even have stabilizers anymore. Lookat me fifteen. I hope the fuck
he doesn't have stabilizers. Well itmust have worked anyway, like whatever he'd

(15:39):
done, because they did start hangingout, and they eventually started dating a
few months later. Quote. Therewas just something about her that made you
like her. Not just me,but lots of kids at school you hear
about someone lighting up a room.Tina was one of those people. It's
a quote from Larry. Larry.I'm sorry I said it, and like

(16:00):
you earlier. No, it's okay, we can hate Larry, Okay,
never mind Fuqui Larry. They movedin together after school to an apartment in
Columbus, Ohio. When they wereboth only nineteen, Tina gave birth to
Sarah, who came into the worldsix weeks early and weighed only four pounds
and nine ounces. Tiny. Iknow, but they obviously cared for her

(16:25):
super like. They done a reallygood job, and before long she was
a healthy wait for her age,and it says she was just like a
little raised unshine. She was justa happy kid. Sarah was only two
years old when Tina gave birth toCody, her little brother, who also
came prematurely, weighing only five penceand seven ounces. Yea, I know,
But as they had managed before,they got Cody to a normal weak

(16:48):
too. It wasn't long after Cody'sbirth that Tina and Larry's relationship started to
get a little bit strained. Theywere both so intensely focused on building it
a great life for their kids andboth working to achieve that that they kind
of forgot to nurture their actual,their partnership, their relationship. Larry got
a well paying job as a longhaul trucker for a florist, and Tina

(17:11):
was busy picking up shifts at agrocery store called Meyer Major m e I
j e er Yeah. But um, Larry says that it was like the
two were becoming strangers to each other. Like he'd be walking in the door
and she would she'd be walking out. Yeah. They were just like two
passing ships in the niche geez,Okay, that's the thing, is it?

(17:36):
Yeah? For like when you whenyou never see each other, you're
just two passing ships in the night. I kind of like it. Um.
At the time, the family wereliving with Larry's grandmother, but as
the pair drifted apart, and angercame to the surface, as it does
in a breakup or divorce. Tinaand the kids moved out. The divorce
itself was like normal. It wasat first like anger, resentment, the

(18:00):
typical like fuck you, you're nottaking my kids away from me. No,
fuck you, They're living with me. I'm their mother. Well,
this is the thing. They actuallywouldn't use the kids against each other because
because of Harry was a long haultrucker, he knew that he was never
going to be able to have totake really Yeah, so they did go
to live with Tina, and nomatter what they thought about, like,
they never thought about the kids orin front of the kids. And I

(18:25):
think that just speaks to how hardthey were like trying to give the kids
a really good life. Yeah,Like whatever was going on between the two
of them, it never had anythingto do with the kids. And like
if the kids were around and theywere like, oh two dad, Like
that is that is unreal parenting?Yeah, co parenting at its finest.
Honestly, yes, so many peopleneed to learn that. True. And

(18:51):
like I'm sure that they I'm sureI'm sure the divorce affected the children,
but at this stage they were bothdoing really well at school. Boats and
Cody were athletic from a very youngage, and Cody played football at school
and Sarah was a cheerleader for thesame team. Isn't that just adorable?
God team? Can you imagine,Like how nice of a bonding experience that

(19:15):
is to get home from a gameand you're literally both on the same team.
You're both cheering to your same team. You're a boat like on a
high being like, oh my god, we did so wow. Yes,
I'd say it was like really reallynice and something that you can like bond
with your sibling about. When Iwas younger, I so desperately wanted to
be a cheerleader. We don't havecheerleaders in Ireland, by the way,

(19:37):
Like it's not a thing. Somy dream was never gonna happen. Give
me a gee, imagine it todo. Give us Mark take forever,
give me, give me an giveme a give me an m give me
so we're just don't give Mark.Larry said that Cody was the type of

(20:02):
kid who would make friends with theunpopular kid at school, Like if you
saw somebody getting bullied, He's like, no, none of my way.
We're going to be friends. Okay, Flay, I know, and I
think again that speaks to Tina andLarry's parenting. Yeah, you leave nobody
out. M things were going reallywell for everyone, it seemed. Larry

(20:22):
met and married a woman named Tracy, and the two welcome to son Aj
in two thousand and six. Thethree of them would soon become neighbors of
Sarah, Cody, and Tina andTina's new boyfriend Greg. I mean,
I get it being neighbors because it'slike handy for the kids and stuff like
that. But at the same time, I would not want my ex living

(20:44):
right beside me. Yeah, no, I get that, But that's the
same time. I think they werelike still once they've gotten past the bitterness
of the divorce, they were likechill with each other. I get it.
I do get it. I getwhy people do that, just personally
for me. Can you live likein the next estate, Well, I
don't know how close they lived so, because I don't understand that area,

(21:10):
but I'd imagine it's like not toomuch different from like living in our town
and seeing your X or end.And this is an almost perfect situation for
them because, like you said,the kids can see both of their parents
and their new sibling. So sure, yeah, it kind of like does

(21:30):
make sense a little bit. Andthen of course the recession hit and Larry,
Tracy, and Aj ended up movingmiles away to Florida for work.
Tina had found a new job afterlosing hers at the grocery store, and
she did consider following them to Florida, but she decided against it, and
instead she moved into a place calledApple Valley. Apple, And instead she

(21:52):
moved to a place called Apple Valleyin ment Vernon, Ohio, about forty
miles from Columbus. And it's atourist trap and for good reason. Like
I looked at this place up onGoogle Maps and there's like you can't even
on Google Maps, you can't godown like certain roads and stuff. And
it is beautiful. It's kind oflike a small community, like if you

(22:12):
couldn't think in my head, I'mthinking like Gilmore Girls ESK, except a
different setting, yes, okay withme. And there's this big, massive
lake which is the valley, andthen there's like houses and woods kind of
surrounding it. So it's like homely. Yeah, and so is the house
on King Beach Drive. And itlooks normal. It's not that far from

(22:36):
the lake, and it's almost totallysurrounded by woods. My dream, I
know. And when I'm trying tolike fall asleep, or when I'm trying
to relax myself, if I'm feelinganxious or whatever, I close my eyes
and that's where I go. Igo to a house in the woods.
Yeah, like you go to somewherelike that. Yeah, yeah, and

(22:56):
it and now it's it's been solelyyou know what I mean by what happens?
Oh God, Okay. With Tinabeing outgoing and friendly, it didn't
take long for her to make friendswith the neighbors. She got close with
Stephanie Sprang, who lived close byand Maker's Drive with her boyfriend and three
children, Michael, Tricia, andSeth from her previous Marriach, and she

(23:18):
absolutely doted on them. She herselfwas pretty athletic and she ran tracking cross
country before, and people say likeher main priority was always her children,
and she loved nothing more than justlike being around her family and like just
chatting with them, like talking talkingabout anything at any sort of social event
or gathering. Like she's just asout going as Tina was in early twenty

(23:41):
ten, Larry was able to moveback to Ohio and was able to see
the kids more often. Cody wasstarting baseball and Sarah had just joined softball.
And they're doing all of this whilethey're both really focused on their studies
at school. They sound like angelkids. Yeah, they are angel kids.
Yeah. And they even got anew sibling. Larry and Tracy had

(24:03):
another son, who they called Peytonin two thousand and eight. Cute.
And then again, things seemed tobe coming together, rebuilding after the recession,
except for Tina, who, likeI said, was in the middle
of her break up with Greg andTina was currently sleeping on the catch.
I had heard that Greg was like, the bed is mine and the couch
is yours. Like, if we'regoing to do a separation, then that's

(24:27):
what we're doing. Greg. Iknew I didn't like you, but yeah,
that was that's what was going on. Because they had bought the house
together and at this point Tina wasshe wanted to move out and start fresh,
and that's why Stephanie was going overto her house that day on the

(24:48):
tenth, the Wednesday to go ather apartment hunting. So back to the
wellness check, the zone had gonedown Before an officer made his way down
to King Beach Drive for the wellnesscheck, Charles Statler received it's no answer
when he knocked on the door.At this time, there were no cars
in the driveway and it just seemedas if nobody was home. Again,
later that night, he drove byat around eleven pm, and this time

(25:11):
the lights were on and there wasa two thousand and four four pickup in
the drive, so he did notapproach the house again. He didn't complete
his wellness check then, well,because he went to the house before and
he was like, oh, nobody'shome, And then when he went back,
there's a car at the front.Like this town Apple Valley, Like
the crime rate is so small,so I know, yeah, but even

(25:34):
but to complete like a wellness check, like you have to make sure that
the person's fucking alive and himself.But I think they can go to the
house and if nobody answers, theycan't force themselves in. No, Like
that's fair. But the next timehe went back to the house and saw
that someone was home, he shouldhave rung the doorbell and been like,

(25:56):
kay, is everything okay? I'vebeen requested to do a well check.
I mean yeah, but also itwas the end of his shift, so
he was probably like, oh,they were just out, like they're they're
fine right now. At this point, all he knows is that Tina didn't
show up for work. That's allhe knows. The kids had been in
school that day, Wednesday, thetenth, it was just teenage that didn't
show up. So then it's thenext day, the kids don't show up

(26:18):
to school. So that day,the next day is we're talking about November
eleventh, When she still had notshown up for work, Valerie became desperate
and she called the sheriff's office again. The sheriff found out that the kids
hadn't shown up for school on thatday, and Valerie had spoken to Ron,
Stephanie's boyfriend, who assumed that shehad just spent the night la Tina's
because like neighbors. Yeah, yeah, apartment hunting ran late and they got

(26:44):
caught up in time or whatever,so she just fell asleep, Yeah,
which is which is something that youwould especially if they were close friends and
neighbors. I'm sure it's something thathas happened before. So yeah, so
he didn't think too much of it. Again, officers went back out to
Tina's noticed that the Ford pickup thathad been there last night was no longer

(27:07):
there, and again the officer didnot approach the house. Determined fabibly met
ron at the house, and rememberingthat Tina always left a window cracked in
the back, she climbed in.She found a her endless scene which it
was a literal blood bath. Sheimmediately left and called to the police.
When police arrived, they found bloodin almost every room of the home,

(27:30):
including the bathroom, bedrooms, andbasement. In the bath there was a
ring of red indicating that blood hadbeen at least two inches deep in the
tube at one point. Goods alot of ament of blood, like the
bath to hold about two inches ofblood, and then blood in every other

(27:51):
room. That's like draining actual bloodbath. Yeah, you're not surviving.
No, you're not surviving that lostblood. There were drag marks from the
hallway to the bathroom, and bleachingmotor oil had been like kind of like
splashed in different spots of the house, like on the blood marks on the

(28:11):
walls and stuff like. It waslike somebody had tried to clean up and
then they were like, oh,fuck it, and then they got the
motor oil, and we'll see ina bit what they were planning to do
with that motor oil. Oh god, some footprints and blood had been created
by someone wearing air walk shoes,which kind of looked like vans, like
they're like a skate shoe, Andthis actually gave officers hope because they then

(28:33):
found a box for a pair ofair walks for a shoe looking to be
about the same size in Sarah's closet. So Sarah the thirteen year old daughter
of Tina. Oh, okay,so that means that she's walking around in
it at some point. So she'sThey're like, okay, she has to
be alive, because yeah, thefootprints were going out to the garage,
so okay. Yeah, so it'slike she has to be Yeah, she

(28:57):
was at least alive at some stageduring the literal blood, black blood,
black blood bath. Yeah. Sothey'd found all of this blood and all
of this mess, but they didn'tactually find any of the missing people or
the family dog, a pincher namedTanner, not the God. The most

(29:18):
interesting piece of evidence they found wasa Walmart bag, right, a fucking
Walmart bag with a receipt in itfor trash bags, terps, a Halloween
T shirt that was a dollar,and a turkey sandwich. You mean to
tell me that this damn fool purchaseditems to get rid of bodies, a

(29:41):
T shirt and a sandwich, aturkey one. At this point, Greg
had actually not returned back home fromhis trip with his friend, and he
didn't really know what was going on. Like somebody called him and was like,
hey, there's like police outside yourhouse, Like you need to get
back home. So he raises andhe's met at the scene by police.

(30:02):
He gives them like verbal permission toenter the home and to take evidence,
because I think they needed to geta warrant. But verbal permission from him
was like okay at first, somethinglike that, I'm pretty sure you don't
fully need a warrant or you don'tneed scene. If you're a crime scene,
you don't need like a full blownwarrant. If the owner of the

(30:22):
house is like, yeah, no, you can do whatever. M And
they checked him over for like scarsor scratches or anything like that, and
they found none. He was clean, so and his alibi was pretty good.
Like he was hours away. Hewas hours away with a friend that
evening, a patrol car was drivingpast the Coco Saying Gap Trail parking area

(30:44):
when he saw a truck similar toTina's, which was missing from the scene.
Not far from it was a mansitting in a silver Toyota Yarus.
The officer asked this young man behindthe wheel what he was doing, and
the officer was told that this manwas waiting on his friend, who was
called Sarah, and the officers like, okay, what's Sarah's last name?

(31:06):
And he's like, I don't know, because we just started dating. I
don't know. The police officer alsoasked for the idea of this man,
checked it and sent him on hisway. And so I know that the
truck actually being fund here completely sentthings into a frenzy because it was found
near a university and like the highschool is kind of behind the university from

(31:26):
what like Google Maps kind of showedme. So there was a full lockdown
because truck was found there, becausethey were like, there's obviously from the
scene, like there's obviously a fuckingmadman running around, so let's get everybody's
safe and everybody go home. LarryMaynard at this time had actually not been
informed by police, what was goingon? Oh, I mean his two

(31:48):
kids are missing. His two kidsand his ex wife are missing. You'd
think that they would be like,hey, Larry, have you seen down
here? Yeah? Like have youseen your ex wife and your two children?
But it was actually Greg Borders andGreg called him in a friendzy being
like where are they going nuts?And Larry's like, what the fuck are
you talking about? So Greg kindof filled him in and then Larry put

(32:12):
on he had to find out everythingfrom the news more or less. Oh,
that's not nice, Like, no, I'm confused as to who'd done
it. So if Larry is,if you are innocent, Larry, it's
not nice that you found it throughthe news. What about a secret third
option? So even from like so, even if Larry's innocent or whatever,

(32:35):
right, even from the point ofview of the police, you would have
thought that they would have wanted toquestion him. Yeah, I don't know
what was going on there, becauseyou would your your go to, like
in in cases like this, thego to is to the partner or the
like ex partner, m like,they're like the first people that you question.

(32:59):
So Larry was questioned alone as wellas Greg Ron Stephanie's ex Mike and
her son Michael. They were allquestioned anybody that could have close to the
family. Yeah. Now, throughoutall of this, the house and King
Beach Drive is being thoroughly processed,and police were even using like infrared helicopters,
like infrared equipment on helicopters to seeif they could see anything in the

(33:20):
woods below. Yeah, because they'relike, where the fuck of these like
four people gone. Yeah, they'rejust like disappeared. Volunteers came out in
force, searching high and low aswell, so like the community rallied around
too. Yeah. It was acouple of days later, November the thirteenth,
when detectives contacted Walmart for more informationon the receipt that they had uncovered
at the scene, because at firstthey were like, could this be Tina's

(33:43):
or Greg's. Well, let's justcheck it out. Yeah. The person
who purchased the items terp bin bags, Impulse fucking Halloween t shirt, and
a Turkey sandwich paid in cash,so they requested the secure already tapes from
that time. The description of thisman makes me, it sends me.

(34:05):
It's absolutely hilarious. Oh god,So they watched a man about twenty five
to forty. It's like, that'sa that's a big old age gap that
you have a big age range that'stwenty years. You can look so different
in twenty years. But like,I find it hilarious because you know when
you see people and you're like,you're either thirteen or you're sixty, I
have no idea what age you are. Yeah, that's literally what that is.

(34:29):
They're literally like they might as wellhave just said age unknown. That's
not the best part. This guyis wearing a camouflage shirt eyeglasses, so
he's wearing glasses and and I'm notlaughing at people with this, but because
it's this guy, I'm not gonnait's karma and a receding hairline. I

(34:50):
love the way that they added thatinto the description. Yeah, and we
all know how bad CCTV footages.I think that like they're like and a
receding hairline. They watched him makethe purchase and then go into the car
park and get into a silver ToyotaYaris. Sarah's boy. Exactly, I

(35:15):
just did air coat and that's foreverybody. And that's what they were able
to quickly figure out, is theywere able to figure out like who had
a registered silver Toyota Yaris in KnoxCounty, and one man stead stood out
as the same man in the tapeeven were in the same camal shirt the
whole and that man was thirty yearold Matthew Hoffman. Before we get into

(35:38):
who Matthew Hoffman is, we're goingto take a quick ad break. Okay,
we're back, and let's talk aboutMatthew J. Hoffman a bit so.
Matthew J. Hoffman was born onthe first of November nineteen eighty to
his parents, Robert and Patricia.He originally grew up around the Warren area

(35:58):
in northeast Ohio before I moved intoApple Valley in Knox County with his mother
after his parents got divorced. Peoplethat knew him and his adolescence say that
he was a strange kid, buthe just kind of seemed unemotional and just
unhappy and like not fully there,like he would just stare at you,
like just kind of weird. Buthe did really seem to love the outdoors
and he enjoyed spending a lot oftime outdoors, Like he would spend time

(36:22):
in treehouses and like climbing buildings toget to roofs, roofs roofs and stuff
like that. Like he just hewas a kid that liked to be outside.
He was an adoorsy kid, butalso somewhat an unhappy kid. Yeah,
at the same time, there's nothingwild or crazy that stick said about
his childhood, Like it seems relativelynormal. He was just a weird kid.

(36:43):
Yeah. In two thousand, whenhe was about nineteen, Matthew graduated
from Knox County Career Center and movedto Steamboat Springs in Colorado. On the
twenty eighth of August two thousand,Matthews set fire to a condo building after
breaking in to rob it, likehe'd been in the home previously because he
was doing plumbing work. And whenhe was doing that work, he stole

(37:06):
a set of keys from a drawerto get it normal, so it's pre
planned in the first place, andthen really gets there because he knows the
owner is like out of town fora while. He stays for a while,
He relaxes, he eats some food, he watches their TV, he
uses their Kuzy like he's having agrand old time. He caused playing having
a normal life. Right now,Jesus Christ, what's it like to be

(37:28):
rich. I don't know, let'sgo and rob this house and sitting there
jakus in the and then he left. But then he realized, oh fuck,
I probably left a shipload of evidencebehind that I was there, probably
left every single type of DNA behind. Yeah, exactly. So you know
what I'm gonna do. I'm gonnago and buy ten gallons or ten leaders

(37:50):
I think it's the same, Idon't know, a fuel of petrol,
and I'm gonna bring it back,pour it all over the place and set
the fucking place on fire, becausethen nobody will know I was there.
That's that's a lot of it's alot of fuel, you know, Like
you don't need that much, Likeare you trying to set the whole fucking
state on fire? Or Well,it did do quite a bit of damage,

(38:10):
and but luckily nobody was hurt.Sixteen people were evacuated, and he
had caused about two million dollars worthof damages, but nobody got Hurt's well,
thank god nobody got hurt. Twomillion damages? She's christ. Yeah,
Like I think there was smoke damagedtwo of the condos, and then
there was like eight houses or somethingsurrounding that people had to be evacuated from

(38:32):
something like that. Apparently in lateSeptember of the same year, Matthew also
stole some of the ten signs thatsaid Welcome to Steamboat Springs that were also
pretty expensive, and I believe likestealing those signs actually carries a pretty heavy
weight. Why would you steal thatmight be a felony. Why would you
steal them? What do you needthem for? I don't know, Like

(38:54):
we've all seen people that have like, you know, signs hanging up in
their bedroom that they've stolen from likecrossroads since so, I mean, I
guess I just but like I thinkthis is actually a pretty big, hefty
sign. It's like welcome to SteamboatSprings, you know, as you're driving
in probably cause fucking thousands. Andhe's just like that will go nice in

(39:14):
my sitting room. I may nothave making cups, but I have a
welcome to Steamboat Yeah. I don'tknow if his interior decorating skills are very
good, and we'll actually see moreof that later two, but his interior
decorating so he of course was caughtand in two thousand and one he was

(39:34):
given an eight year sentence for thefire, and he was told that he
would need to pay back some ofthe money for restitution. He got out
after only six years for good behaviorand was on parole. He was allowed
to move back to Apple Valley inOhio in two thousand and seven under the
conditions that he lived with his mother. And he had just paid about five
K back. Now somehow, Idon't really know. I think it was

(39:58):
cheap, but my he managed tobuy at home. And it's like,
if you're being ordered to pay backlike two mill how are you getting a
fucking loan? Like, how didyou get the money for this for to
buy at home? His mother probablygot the loan. I was like,
get the fuck out of my HAPs. Probably, I'd say there was some
kind of like I don't know,fucking around that went on there, but

(40:22):
he did. And it was listedas a second address. And I think
the first address that was listed wasbelonging to him in like the DVLA or
whatever the fuck's called, and waslike his mother's address or an address that
belonged to his stepfather. I heardtwo different things, yeah, or not
to his steff father, to hisfather. Anyway, Matthew lived in this
house with his then girlfriend and herchild. It's a normal two story home

(40:45):
in what was reported as being aquote lower middle class neighborhood. The neighbors
said that initially he was nice.He was like absolutely lovely. He'd bring
the kids home for movies and hangout with them and just super chill.
But this actually stopped when he madeone of the neighbor's daughters uncomfortable by bringing
her on a like a long routehome one night, like an out of

(41:06):
the way way. Yeah, andshe was like, yeah, never again,
You're not coming near my fucking kids. Yeah. Then his dogs disappeared.
I believe he too, and theneighbor is convinced that he killed him.
I just girded the fucking dogs.And it wasn't long after that that

(41:27):
it became very apparent that Matthew waskilling squirrels to eat them, because obviously
they're in a wooded area. Yeah, they're very Yeah, why eat Matthew.
Matthew, honey, Okay, thishas to do with him, like
thinking, Ada, he's a hunter. M b. He's quite cheap.
You can buy minutes for cheap.I'm sorry, you can get cheap cheap

(41:50):
meat at the butcher's why, likeeven deer. You you're allowed to hunt
deer. That would be a bitbetter. That would be a bit better.
You want to eat squirrels, It'spretty sure they carry diseases. No,
probably do people say they're like therats of the trees, not as
pigeons, rats of the sky thetrees. That's me. I'm pretty sure

(42:15):
rats of the trees are just rats. Yeah. And then he would get
up and he would just sit intrees for hours. That's not just like
no, he would perch himself upthere and just watch, like out of
all the things that you could havesaid, that is not what I thought

(42:37):
was coming like that. He justwould climb trees and sit there for a
while and be like hey, yeah. So one thing about Matthew is he
really fucking loves trees and he reallyloves leaves. And I don't know if
it's like a sexual thing. Idon't know if he was, like you
know, at this day and age, it probably fucking is in sexual because

(43:00):
he sends like a little fucking freak. Well, there's a name on it.
It's called dendrophilia. Of course,there's a name for it. Yeah,
And I don't know if that's ifthe trees brought him like an innocence
type of comfort, or if theywere a sexual comfort. If I don't
know if the trees gave him wouldeither way, Matthew, there's no need

(43:24):
to go climbing and sitting in them, being like no looking me into the
neighbor's garden too, And it gotto a point where the neighbor was like,
no, kids, you're not allowedoutside. If Matthew is outside,
no way, like that's okay.So I could not find any information on
who Matthew's girlfriend at the time was, and to be honest, I didn't
really look that hard because she's notinvolved. The only thing I will say

(43:46):
is that in October of twenty ten, so a couple of weeks I think
it was like three weeks before Tina'sdisappearance, Tina and the kid's disappearance and
Stephanie's his girlfriend. The X didfile a report against him, stating that
he had assaulted her and when shereturned back to the house because they had
broken up and she went back tothe house to get her car and then

(44:10):
he just lost it. Assaulted her, like he choked her. He used
his forearm and like pushed up againstthe wall and then like jumped on her
basically, and she she genuinely thoughtlike always going to kill me, but
he let her go and he waslike, oh my god, I don't
know what just come over me.And she was like, I'm Eddie here.
Around the same time, Matthew losthis job as a tree trimmer because

(44:34):
he had completely exagger yeah, youknow, he completely exaggerated his experience and
had apparently made the supervisor uncomfortable.And he was probably Triman the leave like,
oh yeah, maybe you like that. Oh no, no, no,
of course he got a fucking job, Triman leaves. Yeah. Yeah.

(44:59):
When you think about it, you'relike, that's like, I don't
know, why would you even comparethat too. That's like it's not as
a stream, it's not as extreme, but it's like a pedophile getting a
job and a fucking crash or somethingI did. I was gonna. I
was thinking that it's like not asextreme obviously because his thing is trees,

(45:20):
but like, so that's Matthew andthat's where we're at right now. Detectives
started to piece things together and realizedthe man an officer had pulled up on
before, like in the arrows saidthat he was waiting on Sarah Yeah in
a silver arrows like next to tenyears car. On November fourteenth, twenty
ten, a swat team descended anOn Hoffman's house on Columbus Road. They

(45:45):
had gotten a no knock warrant andused a battering ram to break in the
door before throwing a flashbang device into stun anyone inside. They found halfman
asleep on the couch in the livingroom. A detective took him outside while
the rest of the house was searched, and they found a lot of questionable
things in this yes, And tostart, the first thing they noticed was

(46:07):
leaves absolutely fucking everywhere. Why isthe leaves inside this man's home? Oh,
my grant, what is wrong?Why? No? Why is he
actually so fucking obsessed with treason ly? That's fucking weird. I don't know.

(46:28):
And can you imagine the fucking bugsand shit that come with that?
Like no smell, sweet baby Jesus, what is wrong with that? When
I tell you there are piles thatare like they look to be like waist
high. That's not even the worstof it. Leaves he had bags,

(46:49):
some of these in grocery bags.And if you go into the bathroom.
His whole all his bathroom was completelylined with grocery bags full of leaves.
It's not normal, it's not it'snot. I guess I can't. And

(47:13):
yeah with you, Matthew, Ican't. And if you think about it,
like the SWAT team through in aflash bang device, they're very fucking
lucky nothing went on fire. ThatI mean, they honestly weren't expecting a
fuck ton of leaves to be insidethis man um. They did also find

(47:36):
an inactive weed firm in one ofthe bedrooms, so like even more like
the store leaves even more different types. Yeah, and you know what,
he probably wasn't even smoking the weed. He probably just wanted to grow it
to look at it. Yeah,Like, I'm imagining this guy like rolling
around and ladies, you know,the way you see dogs running rent and
as tim day and day out,and he's like rolling around in it with

(48:00):
like childish glee. The SWAT teamthen moved a bookcase or kind of cabinet
thing to the side that then uncovereda door to the basement where they found
thirteen year old Sarah Maynard and withthe yellow rope and duct tape wearing a
makeshift nappy over her clothes. OhGod, she's lying. She's also lying
on a bed of leaves by theway, and her first words to officers

(48:22):
were quote, I have to getto school. Oh it's like four days
later, she was immediately taken tothe hospital to be checked over and answer
some questions. She had no ideawhat had happened to the rest of her
family and to Stephanie, but wassure that they had been killed. She
and Larry were reunited here. Larrysaid he remembers, and this broke my

(48:44):
heart. He remembers getting the callthat they had found Sarah, but they
didn't mention Tina and Stephanie or Cody, and he was obviously ecstatic to go
and see Sarah. But he didmake note of that that they didn't mention
anybody else. He was like,oh, you only found like not only
but like pank, God, youfound her, but she's the only one
you found. Yeah. Halfman wastaken to County jail and was charged initially

(49:07):
with kidnapping Detective Joe Deeds and SpecialAgent Kristen Cadell. I believe it's how
you say your second name. We'rethere to question Matthew, who stayed mostly
silent, and he tried to usehis hands to try and communicate, like
he's like knocking on his chest tobe like hurt. And then he was
like making this movement with his handsto be like broken. And Joe's like,

(49:29):
are you trying to tell me thatyour your heart's broken? But Matthew
won't talk. Okay, you're goingto try and play crazy now, Matthew.
Yeah, And they don't have time, Like time is of the essence
because they still have three missing people. They need to know if these three
people are still alive, like they'reobviously because they found Sarah. They're hopeful

(49:52):
that maybe the other three or justsomewhere else. Yeah, exactly. Now,
at the same time they kind ofthat they are likely dead. You
do have to have a certain mentof hope. So no matter what,
they don't try and build a reportdidn't work. And when he did talk,
Hawfman was just talking about how muchof a monster he is if he's

(50:12):
done the things that they're telling himhe's done. Oh, give us a
break. You know exactly what you'vedone, Matthew. He says that he
doesn't know how Sarah got into hishouse, but when he realized that she
was there, that he took reallygood care of her. He led her
shower, he fed her. Didyou did you? That's so kind of

(50:34):
you. What about the fact thatyou fucking murdered her brother, mother and
her mother's friend and her dog.He's like, no, I fed her,
we got we had burgers, Ilet her shower, I washed her
clothes, we played the wee together. I gave her a book. Like,
but Sarah, obviously you know,She's like, no, none of
that happened. He kept me downstairsand he was just really fucking weird.

(50:57):
He offered to give me squirrel tocook me earl, and when I said
no to that, he gave hersour milk and cereal and she was like,
well, I had to fucking eatit, because yeah, because she
was to eat nothing else was comingmy way. Oh god, oh.
On the morning of the sixteenth ofNovember, Hoffman changed his tune. After
his breakfast of a McMuffin and coffee, he asked in the interrogation room if

(51:21):
everything was being recorded. Then heasked if he could go to the bathroom,
quote because this coffee is getting tome, which like same, I
mean, okay, I'll get thathappens to me too, and we'll find
out what happened in the bathroom afterthis quick at break, Okay, and
we're back. So Deats brought himto the bathroom, where Hoffman confided in

(51:44):
him that he had had a nightmarethe night before that he would that he
was at a food processing plant andhe opened a bin bag and saw severed
body parts inside. He said thathe would reveal the location of the bodies
by writing them on a piece ofpaper and giving them to his lawyer.
The lawyer would be instructed to onlyprovide the letter to law enforcement after Hoffman

(52:04):
would be shot to death by policeon an escape attempt. So he's like,
So he's like, I'll tell youwhere the bodies are, but if
you kill me right now and don'tmake me go to trial. Yeah,
he's like, I want you to. I want you to kill me.
I'm going to try and escape andthen you're going to shoot me and I'm
going to die, and then youcan find out where the bodies are.

(52:25):
And obviously this request was refused.Yeah, they're obviously like, no,
we're not going to kill you.No, we're not going to give you
exactly what you want and not evenknow then what happened. And then after
that was refused to Matthew confess thathe just made that whole thing up,
the dream about being at the foodprocessing plant, just so he could get

(52:47):
started on his escape plan. Matthewwas held and on one million dollar bail,
showing up to the hearing in asuicide gown or an anti suicide smock,
which is like a green padded dresswhich doesn't allow for much movement and
it can't be ripped. The gasthing is the tho. I'm sorry,
but there was no way he wasactually ever going to harm himself. He

(53:08):
just wanted to be all like,wait till you hear, Wait till you
fucking hear. Oh my god,you hit the nail on the head.
Because even though at one point Matthewwanted nothing more than to die and be
shot, it was ultimately his willto stay alive that traced police back to
Tina. Cody and Stephanie Hoffman signeda deal that took the death sentence off

(53:30):
the table if he provided their location. See, he doesn't actually really want
to die. He just wants thefucking feel thory for me, because I
feel bad about what I did solike I should. Yeah, toads die.
Please don't give me the death penalty. He's just a fucking master manipulator.
He's just a fucking scumbag, andI don't know. I don't get

(53:54):
him. But on November eighteenth,police were given directions to a spot in
Cocoasing Wildlife Area where they found alarge tree with a whole cut in the
shaft was in a fucking tree yep. Using a flashlight, officers were able
to see the inside of the tree, where there was black plastic bags.
The detectives gently cut a hole outof the tree to make it easy for

(54:16):
them to pull the bags out,and multiple black bin bags were recovered containing
the dismembered body parts of forty oneyear old Stephanie Sprang, thirty two year
old Tina Herman, eleven year oldCody Maynard, as well as Tannered the
dog. Hoffman wrote out a longconfession where he explained what he had done.
He liked to break into people's homes, and he realized that the house

(54:37):
and King Beach Drive did not havea lot of neighbors. He set up
camp on the night of November ninth, sitting in the woods across from the
home, watching the comings and goingsof the house. He slept there that
night, having even brought his ownsleeping bag. I'm going to read and
excerpt from the confession. I parkedmy car and Howard and walked from there

(54:59):
to the house. I got tothe woods across the street from the house
a little after midnight. I sleptacross the street from the house that night
in a sleeping bag. I wokeup at daylight. There were two vehicles
parked at the house during the night, and I saw that the Gray care
had left. I went back tosleep until around nine on Wednesday morning.
I stayed there until a woman leftin a pickup truck. This meant that

(55:20):
there were no vehicles at the house. I walked across the street and tried
to enter the front door, butit was locked. I then went into
the garage door. The garage doorwas not closed all the way, so
I slid under it into the garage. I kicked the door into the house
from the garage. By this timeit was approximately ten thirty am Wednesday morning.
I looked around the house to makesure no one was there. Even
if I did not take anything,there was a certain amount of excitement in

(55:44):
being in someone else's home without thembeing there. I was looking for anything
of value that could be carried outeasily, money, jewelry, etc.
I did not find anything of anyreal value. I was getting ready to
leave, as I had been thereapproximately an hour, but someone pulled into
the driveway. I was back inthe bedroom when she entered the house and
was unable to exit without breaking awindow or trying to jump out. I

(56:07):
had brought my knife for a certainamount of intimidation in case I ran into
someone and needed to make an escape. When she made her way back into
the bedrooms, I confronted her andmade her get onto the bed, lying
face down. I believe that wewere in her bedroom. I had a
blackjack. I was going to tryto knock her out. I hit her
a couple of times in the head, but this would not knock her out.

(56:28):
It was not doing the job,and I started panicking. The next
thing that I knew, her friendcame into the bedroom. I had no
idea when she got there, whatshe was doing there and how she gained
access. This other woman yelled atme. There were now two to deal
with, and I did not knowwhat to do. I grabbed the knife
that I had put inn on thenightstand and stabbed the woman on the bed,
threw her back twice. I chasedthe other woman, den Stephanie,

(56:51):
and stabbed her a couple of timesin the chest. Instead of running out
of the house, she had runinto another bedroom. I believe this bedroom
was for a girl to the contentsof the room. I then went back
to the other bedroom where the firstone was located, and stabbed her a
couple more times. I could tellthat both women were now dead. At
this time, I was in atotal state of shock. I wandered around

(57:14):
the house, slowly coming to therealization of what I had done and how
bad it was. During this time, I killed the dog because it would
not stop barking. After a while, I came to the conclusion that I
was going to dispose of the bodiesand burn the house down. At first,
I thought about loading the bodies intothe vehicle and driving it into the
foundation park pond. I would swimaway as the vehicle sank, but I

(57:35):
felt that it was too cold andI might not make and I might not
be able to make it out ofthe water. I decided to process the
bodies and dispose of them inside atree that I knew was hollow. I
took the bodies into the bathroom andbegin processing the bodies to dispose of them.
I used garbage bags from within thehouse and place the bodies inside.
Once I had finished processing the bodies, I moved the jeep into the guard
to load up the bodies. Istill had a couple of bags into the

(58:00):
jeep when I heard the children comeinto the house. I confronted the children,
and the girl instantly ran to abedroom. I stabbed the boy in
the chest a couple of times.I ran into the bedroom after the girl
to make sure she was not onthe phone for help. I saw the
girl was not on the phone,and I could not bring myself to kill
her. End quote. He thenbrought Sarah back to his hell hole,
where he sexually assaulted her and tiedher up. He was sentenced to life

(58:23):
in prison without the possibility of parole. In court, he stated loudly guilty
for all of his other fucking families, which was like ten, but once
it got to the sexual assault charge, he barely spoke up. Knowing what
happens two men like that in prison, the community really rallied and started to
grieve together, also celebrating the veryfull lies that the victim's led. A

(58:46):
memorial was set up near the house, with people leaving gifts behind. The
dairy Queen that Tina worked at donateda portion of profits from ice cream and
sales to have fun set up forthe surviving children. The tree was cut
down to avoid it becoming a spectacle, to which I thought was great.
Yeah, that's good because it canthere's people out there that would be like,
oh my god, let's go seethe tree, the murder tree.

(59:10):
And in court, Sarah wanted tomake a statement to Matthew to the court,
but they didn't think that it wouldbe good for her to do that.
So she wrote one and then theprosecutor read it out loud, and
it's really nice, she said.Quote. Some memories of Cody. He
was a left handed pitcher and hewas really good. A whole bunch of
people always told him how good aplayer he was. In life, he

(59:32):
wanted to be a helicopter pilot inthe coast Guard. Some memories of Mom.
She always made sure we were happy, and she went out and did
stuff with Cody and me, eventhough she didn't have that much money.
She always made sure we had heatin our house to stay warm, made
sure we had food on our plates, nice clothes on, and that we
had shoes on our feet. Shewas a really caring woman and when someone

(59:53):
needed help, she would take hertime to go help them. I loved
her as a mother, even thoughthere were times we didn't get along.
She loved dolphins and sunflowers. Onething she said to me quote Sarah,
when I die, I want youto send me with the dolphins, and
I will tell you a little bitabout me. I played softball for three
years. I was so good atit. I pulled in the outfield,

(01:00:16):
and I played on the All Starteam over the summer. I loved it.
I'm almost fourteen. I enjoy mynew school and the people there.
Which that was her statement. Soshe's like, fuck, you have not
ruined my life. She's like,what you did is horrible, but it
doesn't change the fact that, likemy family were amazing and like I am

(01:00:37):
amazing. Yeah, right, becausefor like, that's a that's a powerful
statement for thirteen fourteen year old tomake to write in the first place.
It's really amazing and a lot ofthe family statements. They they literally told
him like, I hope you burnin hell. Like it was nothing but
the worst for Matthew, which likehe deserves, you know, he deserves.
Yeah, Like it was literally justlike he didn't even know these people.

(01:01:01):
No, he just literally picked thehouse because it didn't have neighbors and
because it had an easy point ofaccess because the guard shore was broken.
Yeah, that's it. That's it, And just one last thing. Obviously,
Sarah went to live with Larry andTracy after this, but in May
of twenty and thirteen, she actuallyreported them both for abuse, reporting that

(01:01:22):
Larry had punched her in the backand that Tracy had pushed her down the
stairs. Oh my god, Nowshe lives. I think now she lives
with her grandmother. She might alsoI think she's going by a different name
too, which is fair enough.She probably wants to not be associated with
the crime, if you will,so that people that aren't oh my god,
are you the girl that Yeah,like that's changing your name or anything

(01:01:46):
like that. It's not going tochange the fact that you knew these people.
That was your mother and your brotherand your friends. Well, it
just stops people like strangers from askingyou about it, like when you are
trying to move on with your lifeexactly. And I don't believe that,
like Larry and Tracy were prosecuted forthe abuse allegations, but it's a shitty
ass thing to do, and likethey paraded her around doctor Phil and talk

(01:02:12):
shows and shit like that. That'swrong. That's wrong. Hm okay,
but yeah, that's it. It'sa crazy fucking story. That is a
crazy story. And I hope youreally enjoyed it, and we'll I know
next week. Yeah, and don'tforget to check us out on Instagram,

(01:02:32):
Twitter, and Facebook. All areat give us Mork and check us out
on wherever you get your podcasts.If you left us a review, we
would superlue love that. And ifyou want to see who you're listening to,
you can always check out our personalinstagrams which is at Megpile, Underscore
and at life as Eve and checkout some over other stuff if you haven't

(01:02:53):
already done so. And we'll seeyou again, you guys, see you
all eight, have a nice day. Clauncha