April 7, 2023 • 45 mins
This week, we embark on our 3 parter on Peter Sutcliffe, AKA The Yorkshire Ripper.
Peter Sutcliffe hated sex workers, and attacked and murdered many women throughout his killing career.
Sources:
Wiki
RadioTimes.com
BBC.com
TheGuardian.com
TheSun.co.uk
AllThatsInteresting.com
CriminalMinds,fandom.com
News.sky.com
Edition.cnn.com
ShrophireStar.com
IrishMirror.ie
AndrewLowne.co.uk
History.com
TheSun.com
Independent.co.uk
Cosmopolitan.com
Murderpedia.org
Arrest.publishing.service.gov.uk
NickDaves.net
Execulink.com
YorkshireRipper.com
PsychologyToday.com
Standard.co.uk
Yek.me.uk
CrimeAndInvestigation.co.uk
Crimes That shocked Britian Documentary
Yorkshire Ripper netflix documentary and Sky crime
Peter Sutcliffe hated sex workers, and attacked and murdered many women throughout his killing career.
Sources:
Wiki
RadioTimes.com
BBC.com
TheGuardian.com
TheSun.co.uk
AllThatsInteresting.com
CriminalMinds,fandom.com
News.sky.com
Edition.cnn.com
ShrophireStar.com
IrishMirror.ie
AndrewLowne.co.uk
History.com
TheSun.com
Independent.co.uk
Cosmopolitan.com
Murderpedia.org
Arrest.publishing.service.gov.uk
NickDaves.net
Execulink.com
YorkshireRipper.com
PsychologyToday.com
Standard.co.uk
Yek.me.uk
CrimeAndInvestigation.co.uk
Crimes That shocked Britian Documentary
Yorkshire Ripper netflix documentary and Sky crime
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:14):
Hi, welcome back to give usmark me. I'm Megan, and you
were here for probably another three partor three. I believed this was two
NIE's happened. Um, it's alot bigger of a case than I remember.
(00:34):
And I was like, where Iwas looking at? Where to part
it? You know that's why she'swhere Is that what he said? Where
to art? Yeah? Yeah,yeah, um, you know, like
where to end? And I waslike, oh boy, oh boy,
(00:57):
oh boy. M sees she didit again, guys, oopsnief did it
again. She made it three partsthat last in the case. Oh baby,
baby, look listen, it's notmy fault. If these people would
does not be such assholes, Ohwouldn't have so much to write about.
(01:18):
Very true. I have a questionfor you, what is your biggest pet
peeve that is like not a normalpet peeve to have like people that you
know, she with their mouth openslike a normal pet peeve. But what's
one that I have? Okay,I have to think about this. I
have to more so think about likewhat does Cottle do that pisses me off?
(01:41):
But isn't something that should piss meoff? And this is going to
be Um, I hate when hedoes something that I was like, in
my head had scheduled like house wise, house work, like work wise.
(02:04):
Okay, that's my favorite thing.He changed the bed sheets. They're like
two weeks ago. I want tosay, but I have a schedule for
bed sheet changing, Okay, LikeI have a date, like I changed
the beds and I'm like, right, okay, next time I have to
change these bed sheets is on thisdate. M he comes in and it
(02:24):
just fucks up the sheet schedule,and it's like, thank you. I
do super appreciate it. I don'tneed to send like my bithink cleans and
it's so I know it was youknow, I like schedule my cleaning like
I the like first week of everymonth. I like deep clean, like
(02:45):
my bathroom, my like my shower, I change all the sheets, and
I like, you know, Iwish I had that motivation. I'm just
like, I wake up one dayand I have the energy and that's when
it happens. But it happens.It happens. And it was a peppe
for me. What is yours?So I asked that question off the cuff.
(03:07):
So I didn't really have anything prepared, but the first one that I
can think of is like you knowwhen you're talking to somebody and you're like,
oh yeah, and then I gotthis burger and it had a burger
and ketchup and pickles on it,and that person interrupts you to be like
oh no, no, no,no, no, no, couldn't be.
I hate pickles. I hate themso much. They're just gusting.
(03:28):
They're vial, and you're like,look, but this is my story and
I like pickles and it's my burger, so don't interrupt me to tell me
that you don't like pickles. Ido that, but maybe not as aggressively,
but I do know. It happenedto me recently where I was talking
about food. I was saying arecipe and I was like, this thing
is in it and they were likeno, no, no, why you
(03:49):
hell you eat you possibly either youLike they were like disgusted, and it
was it was something like girkins orsomething like that. I always get that
reaction with gerkins and mushrooms. Yeah, yeah, no, Like I don't
like pickles and I don't like mushrooms, but I wouldn't be like like you're
feel fully fully, I'm like,bitch, I wanna better eat this,
(04:10):
like excuse you. Another one ofmine is m is people using the word
therefore. And I might have mentionedit on the podcast before, but when
people are like saying a sentence andto just sound more intelligent, they use
the word there They just use theword therefore, like it's not necessarily needed
(04:30):
for the word yeah, some sentenceexactly like I hit power off on the
laptop. Therefore the power turned offon the lapt I mean you didn't need
to expand on that. I understoodthat you turned the fucking laptop off,
you know. Yeah? Yeah,what else like really grinds my gears,
(04:56):
to be honest with you, It'sjust like people just being stupid, like
doing like stupid shit, Like aisn't like when like you see somebody doing
something that is so obviously stupid,Like it's so obvious that like you should
(05:18):
not be doing that, and you'rewatching them when you're going, how do
you do? That's it? That'slike a normal thing to get that enraged
about. Yeah, I'm an angryperson. So I have a third because
this is what I call me thinkingabout it. I opened up my fridge
and I saw a plate with leftoverson it, you know, the way
(05:38):
as you do you might put someleftovers in the fridge, but there was
a knife and a fork on thatplate. Oh no, oh no,
no no, that stresses me out. It gets my core as all levels
high. I can't deal with it. No, why is there utensils in
my refrigerator? Yeah no, that'sa note from me. Absolutely, that's
a note from me. I'm likedrawing a blank at like what annoys me?
(06:02):
And I wouldn't mind, Like Ido get annoyed quite a lot.
Do you know what I hate iswhen you're like out in public, it's
like me and you, right,which is this is one thousand percent come
to me, me and you nextweek. And you're like giddy, m
because like, yeah, I haven'tseen your friend in a while, or
(06:25):
you haven't been out in a while, and you're like you're feeling good and
you're having a good time, soyou're like giddy. And then there's like
someone and they're just like staring atyou, like giving you the eye,
giving you that I giving you thejudgment. Yeah, and it's like have
(06:46):
you not had fun? I'm sorrythat you're pussy is so fucking dry that
you can't have a bit of fun. Yeah, And like you're not doing
anything, You're not harming anyone,You're not being like obnoxiously loud. You're
just like laughing, having a goodtime. And then somebody is just like
being a cup. You're like,couldn't be you? What? Clearly it
wouldn't be you because you have nofriends. Little loser? Gotcha, you
(07:13):
little loser? What's you guys?As pet peeves? I actually would really
love to know that, because everyonehas so many pet peeves. Obviously,
the big one is chewing with yourmind open. Chewing with cattles is people
who drink tea or coffee. Wealways slurp the first sip, and that
(07:36):
really gets them, you know whenit's like, you know, when you
make a cup of tea, Yeah, and it's still scald and hot.
You've added your milk and all that, but it's still like the steam.
So you give a little a littleblow and then you go to like take
(07:56):
and then you're like to like tastetest it to see how hot is it.
You're like testing how hot it is? So yeah, he hates that.
I'm going to keep that in mind. Why did you always slurp your
tea? I'm like, cause it'stea. See I leave my tea for
like ten minutes before I haven't touchit, so it's always like stone gold
(08:16):
by the time I get to it. I won't lie. I do leave
mine for a good at least fiveminutes anyway, and then I like chug
it. I'm taking gulps. I'mlike as if I've never had a cup
of tea in my life. Butyou know when it's like you're not sure.
You know when you're not sure,like how hot it is, Yeah,
and you don't want to take toobig of a sip in case it's
(08:37):
still hot. Yeah, he reallyhates that. Or like when people get
milkshakes and they're at the end ofthe milkshake. So everything to do,
everything to do with Cauls is likeliquid you can't deal with like liquidy kind
of shit, like like like yeah, moth noises, meth noises. He
(08:58):
call, Do you want to comeedit in the podcast All in Here twenty
seven? Okay, So I thinkwe were going to get started because we
have a long we're all ahead ofus. And so, first of all,
if you haven't listened to last week'sepisode on Matthew Hoffman, if you're
interested in a triple homicide and afucking guy that really wants to fuck trees.
(09:22):
Go listen to that. I'm notgonna lie. The Instagram post deceased
me with his fucking right, isn'tit insane? Like, no matter what
I said, I don't think Icould put it in to anybody's like brain.
How many like you hear there's likebags of leaves and you're just like,
what the fuck? And then yousee the photo of the bags of
(09:43):
leaves and you're like, no,because that's not healthy, Like it wasn't
healthy to begin with, but that'sreally not healthy. No, man's obsessed
with leaves and trees. Yeah,like seriously, And the guys in the
discord apparently really liked the episode.So also, if you want to be
in the discord and you can findthat link anywhere on Instagram, you know
(10:05):
what, maybe we'll just put itin our bio right now. Yeah,
I probably should do. That wouldprobably be the best idea. Okay,
Well, then Nieve has a seriouslyinteresting case for us that I'm actually very
intrigued to hear about. Because thisthis this guy isn't one of those guys
you like hear about a lot.He's not like Ted Bundy. He's not
(10:26):
like Jeffrey Dahmer. No, No, he's a little lesser known. And
I don't know. Maybe it's becausehe's English, like you know, it's
not a Maybe he's well known inEngland, I don't know, but he's
not really everywhere else. And incase you didn't know, it's the Yorkshire
Ripper. He doesn't sound like that. I don't know I to that,
(10:50):
but it worked, it worked,yeah. So. Peter William Sutcliffe was
born June second, nineteen forty sixin Bingley West Riding of Yorkshire, hence
the Yorkshire Ripper. His father wasJohn Sutcliffe. He was a baker and
his mother was Kathleen, and shewas a stay at home man, which
(11:11):
is also a top by the way, it is a hard one. Peter
had five siblings. He had twobrothers and three sisters. They seemed to
be a normal working class family,like nothing really majorly out of the ordinary.
Peter didn't relate to his brothers orhis father's really a lot. When
he was young, he was smart, he was a clever child. He
(11:33):
just never applied himself at school life, to be perfectly honest, but it
wasn't because he wasn't clever. It'sjust because he was nursed. Yeah,
I feel that Peter never showed anyinterest in girls or dating as a teenager,
but he was very good at mechanics. Peter dropped out of school at
(11:56):
the age of fifteen in nineteen sixtyone and got a job as an apprentice
at a local engineering company. Afterless than a year, Peter left the
apprenticeship. Peter then decided to jointhe gym, and he was starting to
become a little bit more confident anda bit more take care of himself.
A self care king, but toomuch of a self care king if he
(12:18):
asked me. He started to makefriends, and it is reported that at
some stage in the nineteen sixties Peterdecided he wanted to try and form a
pop group. Stop it, stopit right now? What were they going
to call each other? I've noidea him, I have no idea.
(12:41):
It's just apparently. It's reported thathe apparently wanted to start some type of
pop group with like some of hisfriends. I am a fully imagining Peter
Sutcliffe in like justin Timberlake, likeanything. I'm I'm thinking like s Club,
seven club, no party, likea nice club party. I'm really
(13:03):
showing my age. Are they thesame people who done screen? If you
want to go best? No,that could have been s Club Junior.
Oh it was Jerry halliwell, shewas the Spice Girls, but just her
(13:24):
when she went out with, notthe rest of the Spice Girls, just
her. I remember going to thatdiner that used to be in the town
Friday Nights or something hard Day's Nights. Yeah, I went to her Day's
Night when we first moved to thetown. I forced my mother to put
that song on the radio on thejukebox. That was the ultimate diner.
(13:46):
Miss it every single day. Yeah, it was devastating when it closed.
Their curly fries and their strawberry milkshakeswere heavenly. I don't remember the food,
I just remember the vibes. Theywere immaculate. The vibes were immaculate.
Absolutely. Anyway, back to Petertrying to start a bad Peter could
(14:07):
not keep a job. He neverapplied himself to anything and he would often
get fired. Because of this,Peter began to become very self obsessed and
was more focused on his looks thankeeping a job. Like that was more
important to him than earning money.He sounds like Luke and mcnata. Yeah.
In nineteen sixty five, Peter gota job as a grave digger.
(14:31):
He was very good at this andhe never really got in trouble, apart
from he was always late relatable.One of his co workers said that at
first he seemed normal, but aseveryone got to know him, they learned
he had a weird obsession with death. This concerned most of his co workers.
(14:52):
It was reported that sometimes before buryinga casket, Peter would open it
up to see the dead body inside. Apparently he would often even steal jewelry
off the dead bodies, and apparentlyhe would touch the dead bodies and then
he would eat lunch without washing hishands. Oh that everything here is terrible,
(15:15):
but I'm sorry. All I canthink of is him as a grave
digger. But like he's imagining himselfas a pop icon. He's like and
he's like Peter and the grave Diggers, and he's like dancing with his fucking
shovel in the middle of the night, like under the moonlight, dancing Peter.
(15:39):
Apparently, the body of a femalepolice officer came in and Peter grabbed
her face and said quote you won'tbe putting anyone else away, now,
will you, you bitch? Andwhat was the need for that, now,
Peter, Peter, that was sounnecessary. I remember when I like
(16:00):
find that in the research, LikeI was just like, why why he's
never at this point, he hasnever been intro with the law. He's
a bad boy, bad boy boy. What mhmm. And Peter was then
(16:25):
fired for always being late in nineteensixty seven. That's what he was fired
for. That's what he was firedfor. That's what tip the bo okay.
They were like, you've been lateone too many times. He got
a new job soon, as anassistant to a mortuary. Like stop getting
(16:48):
jobs with dead people, just youknow, yeah, let's not let's just
your dad is a baker. Howdo you get here? Did you get
here? Peter was still living athome during this time and still didn't have
many friends. He would spend alot of time in his room, and
he began to get weirdly concerned withhis sister's moral well being. Oh no,
(17:15):
nothing good ever comes of a guywho cares about a woman's moral wellbeing.
Do you flash the nikele you wore? Honestly, Peter would get annoyed.
If any man would come and likepick her up for a date or
anything like that, he'd be like, she's such a slot. She's gone.
Hell, it's like she's just goneon a date, Peter, She's
(17:36):
just gone on a date. Ifeel like Peter wants to suck his own
sister. Yeah, he probably did, you know, and to be honest,
wouldn't put it past him. Peter'sonly close friend was a man named
Trevor birds All, and they wouldgo out to the local pubs together and
stuff. The pair would go towatch sex workers in different areas all along
(18:00):
Orkshire, which is weird thing todo with your friend. It's a weird
thing to do, but it's aneven weirder thing to do with a friend.
I mean, I've heard so manystories of men watching porn together and
it's like, why this is weirdto me? No offense, Megan,
I wouldn't want to watch porn withyou. I don't want to watch porn
with you either, thanks, butI'm good. Trevor believed that Peter had
(18:23):
assaulted, quote or worse, twosex workers around Leeds and Bradford. Trevor
soon enough gets married and he's nolonger able to just hang out with Peter
whenever. So they still do hangout occasionally, but then just not as
much as they would have. Sorry, I feel like we kind of brushed
(18:47):
past the whole Peter sexually assaulting ormaybe worse than sex workers, and Trevor
just doing nothing. We'll get intothis, don't you worry. Okay,
don't wear a little head and Peterthen met sixteen year old Sonya Serzma in
nineteen sixty seven at a pub.He is twenty one and she is a
(19:11):
sixteen Peter file. Sonya was avery smart girl, and she wanted to
go off to be a teacher.That's what she like. She felt like
was her like mission in life.Like she just like she was like,
I would be an amazing fucking teacher. Yeah, Sonja, get it,
educate those kids. The pair soonbegan dating after this. In nineteen sixty
(19:36):
nine, Peter found out that hismother was having an affair with the neighbor
scat So when Peter's father found thathis wife was having an affair, he
decided he was going to publicly humiliateher, so he found out where she
was meeting the neighbor on their likescheduled affair knights. He then brought all
(19:59):
of the children with him to bumpinto her on her way to wherever,
like whatever motel she was meeting himat. Then when he saw her,
he grabbed her purse and pulled outthe new nightey that she had bought,
and he started showing it off toall of their children, being like,
look I armat yeah, which I'mlike, I'm one breath. I'm like,
(20:25):
you know what, I get itbecause you can't do the time,
don't do the crime. But atthe in front of your kids, I
get wanting to hurt her and wantingto humiliate her. But they're her children.
And I don't know, if youever think about maybe had this might
fuck up your kids? Maybe maybejust a suggestion. This made Peter lower
(20:52):
his opinion of women in general,and also he never thought of his mother
the same. Again, he neverviewed her the same way he would view
a sex worker, and Peter hada very very low opinion of sex workers.
But Peter is a literal pedophile,and he's like, you know what,
the people who are making a livingout there using what God gave them.
(21:18):
Yeah. The same year, Peter'sbrother told him that he had saw
Sonia cheating on him with a boythat worked at a local ice cream parlor.
Peter went to confront Sonia about therumor, but she would not confirm
or deny if she was seeing someoneelse or not, and this drove him
wild. Is it definitely confirmed thatthey were dating or is just just something
(21:41):
that Peter is like, Oh,Sonia is like my girlfriend. She's like
sixteen, she can't drive or drink, yet it's like totally cool. And
Sonia's actually like, so this guy'sactually a creep and he's following me around,
and I have a real relationship witha boy that's my age. So
at this stage, she's eighteen,and I believe they were seeing each other.
(22:03):
I believe that her and Peter weredating, but they were never like
exclusively dating. Okay, like theyhad been on dates, so it's apparently
then she had also been on afew dates with some other boy. And
then the brother saw and then Iwas like, because obviously I'm sure he
(22:23):
was telling his family like, oh, yes, I have a girlfriend and
she's totally age appropriate. Dad,you don't even get it. The dad
was probably like, yeah, getit to them, that's gross. So
this This really like got Peter going, like he was like, I'm gonna
show you SNYA. And he decidedthat to get revenge on her, he
(22:48):
was going to go pick up asex worker. Oh, that'll do the
trick. Yeah, I'm sure she'llbe so jeckalous with her new boyfriend.
So he did. He goes andhe picks up a sex worker and he's
on his way to her place todo the deed when he decides that it's
probably my actually not the best idea. He's like, hmm, I actually
(23:10):
don't want to go through with this, and the sex worker is like,
you can have your money back,and then he's like, perfect, thank
you. And they get to herplace and she's like, luck, listen,
I just I want to keep thelike bigger bills that you paid me.
So I'm gonna go inside. I'mgonna get you change. Is that
okay? And he's like, yeah, sure, just as long as you
(23:33):
like give me my money back.I don't want you give a fuck what
in what manner? So she goesinside and then she sends out two large
men to beat the crap out ofPeter. Why he didn't see this coming?
I don't know, so they attackhim and then they sent him on
his merry little way without his money. What's on no head? That's what
(23:59):
it's like. A few weeks later, Peter sees the same sex worker at
a pub he's at with Trevor.He goes up to her and he's like,
I remember you. I haven't forgottenwhat you did. You owe me
my money and that's smart. Thewoman laughs in his face, Okay,
yeah, I would do, andthen tells everyone in the pub about how
(24:22):
she absolutely made a holy show ofhim. And this was the last drop
for Peter, and this is whenhe begins his attack on what he believes
are sex workers. Can I justsay, for somebody that had a very
low opinion of sex workers and regardedthem as like scum of the earth,
why did he try to make useof the service? Then you can't say
(24:48):
that they're these disgusting assholes and thenbe like, but if you're busy,
hey, hey girl, like whatyou can't do that? No, No,
So before we get into his attacks, we'll just take a quick little
at birth Welcome back to the fun. In September nineteen sixty nine, Peter
(25:12):
was out drinking with Trevor birds allin Bradford. While the pair were driving
from one pub to another, Petersaw a girl he assumed was a sex
worker. Peter made Trevor pull overso he could follow the girl. Trevor
was waiting in the car, andafter about ten minutes, Peter came running
up to the car, all flusteredand anxious. He jumped in and he
(25:34):
yelled a Trevor to speed off.Trevor asked what happened and he said he
hit the girl over the head.Trevor questioned, like, Trevor was like
was that on purpose or like what? Like? What just happened? Sorry?
But did you kill her accidentally?It's my question. Peter responded that
he put a rock in a sockand he swung it at the girl,
(25:57):
hitting her in the head. Andthen Peter took her rock out of his
pocket and threw it at the carwindow. What the man is running around
with only one stock on manages tofind a rock from somewhere, just uses
that as a weapon because casual,and then brings the murder weapon back with
him and just throws it out ofa car window. After telling his friend
(26:19):
he just killed a sex fare SoTrevor asked if the girl was okay,
and Peter replied, quote, ofcourse she is the old cow. I
just wanted money. I mean,of course she is. You just fucking
attacked her like Jailhease style. Peterwould later go on to say, quote,
I had to do it. Itwas my mission. I was told
(26:40):
sex workers were the scum of theearth, and the guy who wants to
fuck a sister isn't. The womanthat Peter attacked survived and saw Trevor's license
plate, so she went to thepolice and she reported the crime. So
police went to question Trevor because itwas his license plate, and he was
like, yeah, no, luckily, and I was with my friend Peter.
(27:00):
He got out of the car andhe came running back like he like
was like, no, no,I ain't like I did judge it right,
and just to get away driver unintentionallylike I was. I haven't drinks
with my pal. So he likesends them Peter's way and they go and
they questioned Peter, and Peter's justlike, yeah, I hit her.
(27:25):
I wasn't with a rock though,I hit her with my hand, like
I you know, yeah, closedfisted, sure m. Police ask him
some more questions and then they leavelike they don't arrest him. They're just
like, cool, thanks for yourtime. What he like? I think
he like spins some story that likeshe took his money and he was just
trying to get it back and sohe like hit her to get it back,
(27:49):
and the police are just like cool, thanks for your time. Surely
the injury from a rock would bedifferent, it would be different to that
of her. I would am Iand so too. But a few weeks
later, a policeman sees Peter's caron the side of the road. He
decided to go see if everything wasokay, but as he got closer to
the car, Peter just sped off. A little while later, the officer
(28:12):
saw Peter's car again, but thistime it was empty. The officer had
a quick look around and he soonfound Peter hiding in some bushes holding a
hammer. Oh oh, okay,are you okay? In their little guy,
you're right. Peter told the officerthat his hood cap had come off
(28:33):
his car and he needed to hammerit back on. The police officer didn't
believe him, and he arrested him. But the officer never searched like Peter's
body like they never searched him,and if they did. If the officer
had had searched him, they wouldhave found a knife in his pocket.
Peter was fined twenty five pound andcharged with a misdemeanor. I will say
(29:00):
twenty five pound back in nineteen sixtynine would be a lot more than it
is today, but it's still Hewas charged twenty five pound and a misdemeanor.
I guess they didn't catch him actuallydoing any They just caught him hiding
in a bush like little freak.Well, the police report doesn't even mention
that he has a hammer in it, like they left that out. Oh
later, Peter admits that he wasthere to try to kill a sex worker
(29:25):
and the officer interrupted him. Whatthe fuck. Peter and Sonia are still
dating at this stage, but Soniahad moved to London to study to be
a teacher. Sonia had a mentalbreakdown over the stress of school, which
like get it girl. She wasadmitted to the hospital in nineteen seventy two.
(29:45):
Peter was then assigned as her primarycaregiver, and on August tenth,
nineteen seventy four, the couple gotmarried. Sonya was doing better. She
was released from hospital, and herand Peter moved. Her and Peter went
on a honeymoon to Paris. Theythen moved into her parents' home so that
(30:06):
they could save money so like tobuy their own place, and Sonia was
able to return back to the teacherprogram with the help of her parents.
Good for her, Peter became friendlywith their neighbor, Ronald Barker. The
pair would go out drinking together inthe local pubs and they would be out
chasing women. On July fifth,nineteen seventy five, Peter went to Kiley's
(30:36):
red light district and was just watchingthe sex workers. After a while,
Peter saw thirty six year old AnnaRogulski. Anna was walking to her boyfriend's
apartment, and Peter assumed she wasa sex worker as he had seen her
around the area before. As Annawalked past him, Peter asked her if
(30:57):
she was quote in business, andAnnah, like a queen, responds,
not on your life, good woman. Anna got to her boyfriend's house and
she was a little bit shaken upbecause like some strange man was like are
you. So she gets to herboyfriend's apartment and she is banging on the
(31:18):
door and she's shouting to be letin when Peter snuck up behind her and
hit her on the back of thehead twice with a hammer. Peter then
dragged Anna's unconscious body den an alleywayand began cutting her stomach with a knife.
A neighbor had heard the struggle andcame out to see what was going
on, startling Peter into running away. Anna had two skull fractures and had
(31:48):
to have a twelve hour surgery,but she survived. Anna couldn't remember anything
about her attack or who attacked her, unfortunately, but at least she survived.
My god, I'd imagine surviving somethinglike that. Oh God, listener,
discretion is advised. Sorry, Meggan, you have to hear it.
Peter liked to masturbase over his victim'sbodies as they lay dying. No no,
(32:15):
no, no, And there andthere was semen found on Anna's clothes.
That is absolutely the fact that herstomach was like cut open, and
he's no sele so like they didhave a semen, but obviously like he'd
never been arrested, Like they didn'thave his DNA. Do you know what
(32:37):
I mean? It's nineteen fucking seventyfour or whatever. I don't know it
was DNA even a real thing backthen. Like I know they could tell
blood type. I don't even know, but like it's nineteen seventy five,
so like, no, I can'timagine it's a big thing. So it
didn't matter that they had it.To be perfectly honest, On August fifteenth,
(32:59):
nineteen seventy five, Peter and TrevorBirdsall went to a pub in Halifax
for some drinks. Do you thinkthat like Trevor's wife would be like,
hey, I feel like Peter's likenot a good guy. He brought police
to our door and maybe don't hangout with him, or like Trevor would
maybe think that himself, like,hey, Peter's like really sketchy, and
(33:22):
maybe Trevor's a sketchy guy. Maybehe is, I don't know. To
be honest, I will say spoileralert, he will redeem himself in the
very end. I await Trevor's redemptionlooking forward to it. During the night,
Peter got into a disagreement with fortysix year old Olive Smelt. Peter
(33:44):
had accused all of being a sexworker, which she was not. They
both left the pub in different directions. Peter and Trevor were driving home when
Peter saw all of walking down alane and asked Trevor to pull over as
there was someone he needed to speakto. So like Trevor was just driving,
Trevor didn't notice her, and Peterjust happened to be like, that's
(34:06):
that bitch from the pub, andhe was like, hey, will you
pull over for a second, There'ssomeone I need to talk to, and
Trevors was like, cool, okay. As Peter got out of the car,
he reached down to grab something.Peter then went down like the other
side of the lane in an attemptto cush all of off so that like
he would meet her as he passedall of He walked down with his head
(34:30):
down so that she couldn't see him, so like she's coming up the lane
way, he's coming down the lanewaywith his head down so that she won't
cop who he is terrifying, andthen he immediately turns around and he hits
her on the head with his hammer. Olive fell to the ground and Peter
(34:50):
hit her a second time with thehammer. Peter then pulled down Olive's underwear
and pulled out a knife. Hethen proceeded to cut her down there several
times, like on her vagina,yeah, down in that, like,
yeah, pretty much. A couplewere parked nearby and they could hear a
(35:12):
struggle, so they turned on theircar lights to flash, what you know,
to see like what's that noise goingon? And this startled Peter and
he ran away. Olive had toundergo several life saving surgeries and she did
ultimately survive. The next day,Trevor saw the report of all of the
attack, but at first he didn'tput the connection together, Like he didn't
(35:37):
immediately go, oh, my friend, and no, no, no,
I'm sorry, Okay, your friendcomes back. He has to have at
least some amount of blood on him, and he's carrying a fucking hammer.
But it's like the middle of thenight, it's like one am, and
he didn't see the hammer. AndI do think a part of it,
(35:59):
why it's a real case of oh, not my friend, Like, my
friend couldn't do that. Not myfriend Peter, who got with a sixteen
year old when he was twenty one, and who I know for a fact
is already assaulted sex workers in thepast. Not him, Not him,
though he's a good guy. OnOctober thirtieth nineteen seventy five, Peter went
(36:21):
down to a pub in Leeds forsome drinks. After he had a few
drinks, he went driving around becausenow he's obsessed with the idea of killing
a sex worker. He came acrossa young woman hitchhiking along the side of
the road. Twenty eight year oldWilma McCann was recently divorced and had four
young children. They were living ina small apartment and she had become a
(36:45):
sex worker to try and support herchildren if she had to make a living.
Wilma's struggled with alcoholism and these wouldbe the main two things that's sadly
the press would focus on, ofcourse, sing about her case. So
a major problem with this case isthat whilst this case is ongoing, whilst
(37:07):
the Yorkshire Ripper case is ongoing,the press talk awfully about the victims.
They talk about how they were sexworkers, how they were per how they
were drug addicts or alcoholics. Thepress, the media put a very much
(37:29):
emphasis on it was their fault forbeing there, for being sex workers,
straight up victim planning. And itis years later the police departments do eventually
apologize for how first of all,how the cases were handled, and then
(37:50):
secondly, how it was all talkedabout in the press, because it's not
just the press making like these assumptionsas well. It's like the officers who
are like giving interviews to the pressare like, oh, yeah, but
she was a sex worker, solike she deserved it, right, guys,
right, you know, and itis it's an awful thing to like
(38:12):
see in here because you're like,first of all, it's their body.
They can do it with it whatthey want. And a lot of these
people so you're like, the areasthat they're enduring these times are dirt per
and so it's like the only waythat they can make a living and they
have families to support. But atthe same time, there's no supply without
(38:35):
demand. So all of these menthat are like they're disgusting, they are
the demand, you know, theyare the reason why there are sex workers.
Literally. So Peter pulled over andoffered Wilmer a ride home, and
she accepted. While on the wayto her apartment, she asked Peter if
he wanted business, and this lethim know that she was a sex worker.
(39:00):
The pair pulled into Prince Philip's playingfield, which was approximately one hundred
yards from where Wilma lived. Wilmagot out of the car and she lay
in the field while Peter got outof his car and took a hammer from
his trunk. As Wilma began unbuttoningPeter's pants, he took the hammer and
he hid her on the top ofthe head. Peter continued to hit Wilma
(39:22):
on the head with the hammer,quote penetrating the full thickness of her skull.
Peter then took out a knife andbegan stabbing Wilma. He began stabbing
her in the neck and fourteen timesin the torso. The next day,
a local milkman and his ten yearold brother found Wilma's body. Oh my
(39:45):
god, So this is Peter's firstactual murder that he's this is his first,
yes, his first murder, andbefore this he's just been attacking woman,
but he hasn't actually successfully killed anybody. They ran to the nearest house
to call the police, and itdidn't take police long to close off the
scene. However, people in thesurrounding area hired nothing and saw nothing the
(40:08):
night before. Police didn't connect themurder of Wilma to the attacks of Anna
and Olive. I don't even thinkthey connected the attack of Anna and Olive
yet, Like they hadn't connected thosetwo attacks to one another, and then
they didn't attack. They didn't connectthen the murder, which to me is
(40:30):
silly because so far all three womenhave been attacked with fucking hammers and I'll
have like vicious stab or knight wounds. Wounds. Yeah, so like it's
the same m O. It's justthis time he was successful in killing her.
And it's like, how many peopleare being violently attacked in the area
(40:50):
with knives and hammers like this women? I'd like to hope not that many.
Yeah. Same. The medical callexaminer concluded that Wilma was more than
likely unconscious after the head trauma,but would have very would have been still
very much alive during this stabbins.There were traces of semen found on Wilma's
(41:14):
clothing. However, it is believedthat she was not sexually assaulted. That
is where I'm going to end partone. In part two will get more
into his killings. Um, there'sa lot of them. There's a lot
of killings and attacks. So that'swhy I say it will probably be a
three parter to get into him beingcaught in all of that jazz. So
(41:38):
I just I can't like the factthat he masturbates over his victims. And
the sick thing is is he likedoes it whilst they're dying? Yeah,
so it's not even it's like,what does he have an attraction to?
Is it the act itself where hejust feels still rated and he's excited by
(42:00):
that, or is it this siteof blood and stuff because he obviously enjoys
being around the dead as well.Ye're an you know the dead that you're
burying. I don't know. Yeah, so it's a weird thing to like
what is it that's like exciting him? And he's still working as a mortuary
(42:21):
assistant? Is he? And bythis stage I think he is just a
mechanic Now I don't care he amfrom what I remember. M he just
then I think he eventually leaves thatand he just kind of gets a job
M like in like mechanics. Thearea that they're living in isn't the greatest,
(42:45):
so it's kind of more so whateverjob he can get. Yeah,
I know eventually he will go onto get a job as a lorry driver,
right, Um, so he kindof I think is just whatever kind
of job he can get his handson is the kind of job he's working.
He's like he never really keeps ajob for all too long, so
(43:07):
he's like bouncing from job to job. But like him, it's wild because
like him and Sonia are like savingfor a house and then he's just like
out killing people and you're like normal. Yeah, and again it's like the
people who you always think are themost normal, but at the same time,
(43:27):
to the people that were really closeto him, like Trevor knew that
he wasn't an okay guy, andhis other friend also knew that he wasn't
an okay guy. I do thinkproud of them, just like it's like
you choose to ignore these things becauselike there's no way your friend could be
(43:47):
a killer, do you know whatI mean? H It's like they can't
see all the red flags because theirglasses are roastinted. Literally what God don't
So today, today it's gonna bethe day. No, it's not,
because today is the fifth of March. I am flying to Ireland on the
(44:10):
eighth and we're seeing Paramoun on thethirteenth April. That one, yep,
today it's the fifth of April today, of the fifth of April, and
Meggan it's on Saturday. Slay soexcited. So if you perably enjoyed this
(44:30):
week's episode, please go check outany of our other episodes if you haven't
done so already, and you canfind them wherever you get your podcasts such
as Apple Podcasts and Spotify. Pleasedon't forget to rate and review. We
always appreciate it. You can checkus out on Facebook, Instagram, and
(44:52):
Twitter all at give us More andif you want to see who you're listening
to, you can check out ourown personal instagrams which is at megpal undersco
and like a nieve and am yeah, I guess We'll see you on the
flip side and keep your ass fatand you're awa threatening always slay Okay,
Hi, welcome back to give usmark me. I'm Megan, and you
were here for probably another three partor three. I believed this was two
NIE's happened. Um, it's alot bigger of a case than I remember.
(00:34):
And I was like, where Iwas looking at? Where to part
it? You know that's why she'swhere Is that what he said? Where
to art? Yeah? Yeah,yeah, um, you know, like
where to end? And I waslike, oh boy, oh boy,
(00:57):
oh boy. M sees she didit again, guys, oopsnief did it
again. She made it three partsthat last in the case. Oh baby,
baby, look listen, it's notmy fault. If these people would
does not be such assholes, Ohwouldn't have so much to write about.
(01:18):
Very true. I have a questionfor you, what is your biggest pet
peeve that is like not a normalpet peeve to have like people that you
know, she with their mouth openslike a normal pet peeve. But what's
one that I have? Okay,I have to think about this. I
have to more so think about likewhat does Cottle do that pisses me off?
(01:41):
But isn't something that should piss meoff? And this is going to
be Um, I hate when hedoes something that I was like, in
my head had scheduled like house wise, house work, like work wise.
(02:04):
Okay, that's my favorite thing.He changed the bed sheets. They're like
two weeks ago. I want tosay, but I have a schedule for
bed sheet changing, Okay, LikeI have a date, like I changed
the beds and I'm like, right, okay, next time I have to
change these bed sheets is on thisdate. M he comes in and it
(02:24):
just fucks up the sheet schedule,and it's like, thank you. I
do super appreciate it. I don'tneed to send like my bithink cleans and
it's so I know it was youknow, I like schedule my cleaning like
I the like first week of everymonth. I like deep clean, like
(02:45):
my bathroom, my like my shower, I change all the sheets, and
I like, you know, Iwish I had that motivation. I'm just
like, I wake up one dayand I have the energy and that's when
it happens. But it happens.It happens. And it was a peppe
for me. What is yours?So I asked that question off the cuff.
(03:07):
So I didn't really have anything prepared, but the first one that I
can think of is like you knowwhen you're talking to somebody and you're like,
oh yeah, and then I gotthis burger and it had a burger
and ketchup and pickles on it,and that person interrupts you to be like
oh no, no, no,no, no, no, couldn't be.
I hate pickles. I hate themso much. They're just gusting.
(03:28):
They're vial, and you're like,look, but this is my story and
I like pickles and it's my burger, so don't interrupt me to tell me
that you don't like pickles. Ido that, but maybe not as aggressively,
but I do know. It happenedto me recently where I was talking
about food. I was saying arecipe and I was like, this thing
is in it and they were likeno, no, no, why you
(03:49):
hell you eat you possibly either youLike they were like disgusted, and it
was it was something like girkins orsomething like that. I always get that
reaction with gerkins and mushrooms. Yeah, yeah, no, Like I don't
like pickles and I don't like mushrooms, but I wouldn't be like like you're
feel fully fully, I'm like,bitch, I wanna better eat this,
(04:10):
like excuse you. Another one ofmine is m is people using the word
therefore. And I might have mentionedit on the podcast before, but when
people are like saying a sentence andto just sound more intelligent, they use
the word there They just use theword therefore, like it's not necessarily needed
(04:30):
for the word yeah, some sentenceexactly like I hit power off on the
laptop. Therefore the power turned offon the lapt I mean you didn't need
to expand on that. I understoodthat you turned the fucking laptop off,
you know. Yeah? Yeah,what else like really grinds my gears,
(04:56):
to be honest with you, It'sjust like people just being stupid, like
doing like stupid shit, Like aisn't like when like you see somebody doing
something that is so obviously stupid,Like it's so obvious that like you should
(05:18):
not be doing that, and you'rewatching them when you're going, how do
you do? That's it? That'slike a normal thing to get that enraged
about. Yeah, I'm an angryperson. So I have a third because
this is what I call me thinkingabout it. I opened up my fridge
and I saw a plate with leftoverson it, you know, the way
(05:38):
as you do you might put someleftovers in the fridge, but there was
a knife and a fork on thatplate. Oh no, oh no,
no no, that stresses me out. It gets my core as all levels
high. I can't deal with it. No, why is there utensils in
my refrigerator? Yeah no, that'sa note from me. Absolutely, that's
a note from me. I'm likedrawing a blank at like what annoys me?
(06:02):
And I wouldn't mind, Like Ido get annoyed quite a lot.
Do you know what I hate iswhen you're like out in public, it's
like me and you, right,which is this is one thousand percent come
to me, me and you nextweek. And you're like giddy, m
because like, yeah, I haven'tseen your friend in a while, or
(06:25):
you haven't been out in a while, and you're like you're feeling good and
you're having a good time, soyou're like giddy. And then there's like
someone and they're just like staring atyou, like giving you the eye,
giving you that I giving you thejudgment. Yeah, and it's like have
(06:46):
you not had fun? I'm sorrythat you're pussy is so fucking dry that
you can't have a bit of fun. Yeah, And like you're not doing
anything, You're not harming anyone,You're not being like obnoxiously loud. You're
just like laughing, having a goodtime. And then somebody is just like
being a cup. You're like,couldn't be you? What? Clearly it
wouldn't be you because you have nofriends. Little loser? Gotcha, you
(07:13):
little loser? What's you guys?As pet peeves? I actually would really
love to know that, because everyonehas so many pet peeves. Obviously,
the big one is chewing with yourmind open. Chewing with cattles is people
who drink tea or coffee. Wealways slurp the first sip, and that
(07:36):
really gets them, you know whenit's like, you know, when you
make a cup of tea, Yeah, and it's still scald and hot.
You've added your milk and all that, but it's still like the steam.
So you give a little a littleblow and then you go to like take
(07:56):
and then you're like to like tastetest it to see how hot is it.
You're like testing how hot it is? So yeah, he hates that.
I'm going to keep that in mind. Why did you always slurp your
tea? I'm like, cause it'stea. See I leave my tea for
like ten minutes before I haven't touchit, so it's always like stone gold
(08:16):
by the time I get to it. I won't lie. I do leave
mine for a good at least fiveminutes anyway, and then I like chug
it. I'm taking gulps. I'mlike as if I've never had a cup
of tea in my life. Butyou know when it's like you're not sure.
You know when you're not sure,like how hot it is, Yeah,
and you don't want to take toobig of a sip in case it's
(08:37):
still hot. Yeah, he reallyhates that. Or like when people get
milkshakes and they're at the end ofthe milkshake. So everything to do,
everything to do with Cauls is likeliquid you can't deal with like liquidy kind
of shit, like like like yeah, moth noises, meth noises. He
(08:58):
call, Do you want to comeedit in the podcast All in Here twenty
seven? Okay, So I thinkwe were going to get started because we
have a long we're all ahead ofus. And so, first of all,
if you haven't listened to last week'sepisode on Matthew Hoffman, if you're
interested in a triple homicide and afucking guy that really wants to fuck trees.
(09:22):
Go listen to that. I'm notgonna lie. The Instagram post deceased
me with his fucking right, isn'tit insane? Like, no matter what
I said, I don't think Icould put it in to anybody's like brain.
How many like you hear there's likebags of leaves and you're just like,
what the fuck? And then yousee the photo of the bags of
(09:43):
leaves and you're like, no,because that's not healthy, Like it wasn't
healthy to begin with, but that'sreally not healthy. No, man's obsessed
with leaves and trees. Yeah,like seriously, And the guys in the
discord apparently really liked the episode.So also, if you want to be
in the discord and you can findthat link anywhere on Instagram, you know
(10:05):
what, maybe we'll just put itin our bio right now. Yeah,
I probably should do. That wouldprobably be the best idea. Okay,
Well, then Nieve has a seriouslyinteresting case for us that I'm actually very
intrigued to hear about. Because thisthis this guy isn't one of those guys
you like hear about a lot.He's not like Ted Bundy. He's not
(10:26):
like Jeffrey Dahmer. No, No, he's a little lesser known. And
I don't know. Maybe it's becausehe's English, like you know, it's
not a Maybe he's well known inEngland, I don't know, but he's
not really everywhere else. And incase you didn't know, it's the Yorkshire
Ripper. He doesn't sound like that. I don't know I to that,
(10:50):
but it worked, it worked,yeah. So. Peter William Sutcliffe was
born June second, nineteen forty sixin Bingley West Riding of Yorkshire, hence
the Yorkshire Ripper. His father wasJohn Sutcliffe. He was a baker and
his mother was Kathleen, and shewas a stay at home man, which
(11:11):
is also a top by the way, it is a hard one. Peter
had five siblings. He had twobrothers and three sisters. They seemed to
be a normal working class family,like nothing really majorly out of the ordinary.
Peter didn't relate to his brothers orhis father's really a lot. When
he was young, he was smart, he was a clever child. He
(11:33):
just never applied himself at school life, to be perfectly honest, but it
wasn't because he wasn't clever. It'sjust because he was nursed. Yeah,
I feel that Peter never showed anyinterest in girls or dating as a teenager,
but he was very good at mechanics. Peter dropped out of school at
(11:56):
the age of fifteen in nineteen sixtyone and got a job as an apprentice
at a local engineering company. Afterless than a year, Peter left the
apprenticeship. Peter then decided to jointhe gym, and he was starting to
become a little bit more confident anda bit more take care of himself.
A self care king, but toomuch of a self care king if he
(12:18):
asked me. He started to makefriends, and it is reported that at
some stage in the nineteen sixties Peterdecided he wanted to try and form a
pop group. Stop it, stopit right now? What were they going
to call each other? I've noidea him, I have no idea.
(12:41):
It's just apparently. It's reported thathe apparently wanted to start some type of
pop group with like some of hisfriends. I am a fully imagining Peter
Sutcliffe in like justin Timberlake, likeanything. I'm I'm thinking like s Club,
seven club, no party, likea nice club party. I'm really
(13:03):
showing my age. Are they thesame people who done screen? If you
want to go best? No,that could have been s Club Junior.
Oh it was Jerry halliwell, shewas the Spice Girls, but just her
(13:24):
when she went out with, notthe rest of the Spice Girls, just
her. I remember going to thatdiner that used to be in the town
Friday Nights or something hard Day's Nights. Yeah, I went to her Day's
Night when we first moved to thetown. I forced my mother to put
that song on the radio on thejukebox. That was the ultimate diner.
(13:46):
Miss it every single day. Yeah, it was devastating when it closed.
Their curly fries and their strawberry milkshakeswere heavenly. I don't remember the food,
I just remember the vibes. Theywere immaculate. The vibes were immaculate.
Absolutely. Anyway, back to Petertrying to start a bad Peter could
(14:07):
not keep a job. He neverapplied himself to anything and he would often
get fired. Because of this,Peter began to become very self obsessed and
was more focused on his looks thankeeping a job. Like that was more
important to him than earning money.He sounds like Luke and mcnata. Yeah.
In nineteen sixty five, Peter gota job as a grave digger.
(14:31):
He was very good at this andhe never really got in trouble, apart
from he was always late relatable.One of his co workers said that at
first he seemed normal, but aseveryone got to know him, they learned
he had a weird obsession with death. This concerned most of his co workers.
(14:52):
It was reported that sometimes before buryinga casket, Peter would open it
up to see the dead body inside. Apparently he would often even steal jewelry
off the dead bodies, and apparentlyhe would touch the dead bodies and then
he would eat lunch without washing hishands. Oh that everything here is terrible,
(15:15):
but I'm sorry. All I canthink of is him as a grave
digger. But like he's imagining himselfas a pop icon. He's like and
he's like Peter and the grave Diggers, and he's like dancing with his fucking
shovel in the middle of the night, like under the moonlight, dancing Peter.
(15:39):
Apparently, the body of a femalepolice officer came in and Peter grabbed
her face and said quote you won'tbe putting anyone else away, now,
will you, you bitch? Andwhat was the need for that, now,
Peter, Peter, that was sounnecessary. I remember when I like
(16:00):
find that in the research, LikeI was just like, why why he's
never at this point, he hasnever been intro with the law. He's
a bad boy, bad boy boy. What mhmm. And Peter was then
(16:25):
fired for always being late in nineteensixty seven. That's what he was fired
for. That's what he was firedfor. That's what tip the bo okay.
They were like, you've been lateone too many times. He got
a new job soon, as anassistant to a mortuary. Like stop getting
(16:48):
jobs with dead people, just youknow, yeah, let's not let's just
your dad is a baker. Howdo you get here? Did you get
here? Peter was still living athome during this time and still didn't have
many friends. He would spend alot of time in his room, and
he began to get weirdly concerned withhis sister's moral well being. Oh no,
(17:15):
nothing good ever comes of a guywho cares about a woman's moral wellbeing.
Do you flash the nikele you wore? Honestly, Peter would get annoyed.
If any man would come and likepick her up for a date or
anything like that, he'd be like, she's such a slot. She's gone.
Hell, it's like she's just goneon a date, Peter, She's
(17:36):
just gone on a date. Ifeel like Peter wants to suck his own
sister. Yeah, he probably did, you know, and to be honest,
wouldn't put it past him. Peter'sonly close friend was a man named
Trevor birds All, and they wouldgo out to the local pubs together and
stuff. The pair would go towatch sex workers in different areas all along
(18:00):
Orkshire, which is weird thing todo with your friend. It's a weird
thing to do, but it's aneven weirder thing to do with a friend.
I mean, I've heard so manystories of men watching porn together and
it's like, why this is weirdto me? No offense, Megan,
I wouldn't want to watch porn withyou. I don't want to watch porn
with you either, thanks, butI'm good. Trevor believed that Peter had
(18:23):
assaulted, quote or worse, twosex workers around Leeds and Bradford. Trevor
soon enough gets married and he's nolonger able to just hang out with Peter
whenever. So they still do hangout occasionally, but then just not as
much as they would have. Sorry, I feel like we kind of brushed
(18:47):
past the whole Peter sexually assaulting ormaybe worse than sex workers, and Trevor
just doing nothing. We'll get intothis, don't you worry. Okay,
don't wear a little head and Peterthen met sixteen year old Sonya Serzma in
nineteen sixty seven at a pub.He is twenty one and she is a
(19:11):
sixteen Peter file. Sonya was avery smart girl, and she wanted to
go off to be a teacher.That's what she like. She felt like
was her like mission in life.Like she just like she was like,
I would be an amazing fucking teacher. Yeah, Sonja, get it,
educate those kids. The pair soonbegan dating after this. In nineteen sixty
(19:36):
nine, Peter found out that hismother was having an affair with the neighbor
scat So when Peter's father found thathis wife was having an affair, he
decided he was going to publicly humiliateher, so he found out where she
was meeting the neighbor on their likescheduled affair knights. He then brought all
(19:59):
of the children with him to bumpinto her on her way to wherever,
like whatever motel she was meeting himat. Then when he saw her,
he grabbed her purse and pulled outthe new nightey that she had bought,
and he started showing it off toall of their children, being like,
look I armat yeah, which I'mlike, I'm one breath. I'm like,
(20:25):
you know what, I get itbecause you can't do the time,
don't do the crime. But atthe in front of your kids, I
get wanting to hurt her and wantingto humiliate her. But they're her children.
And I don't know, if youever think about maybe had this might
fuck up your kids? Maybe maybejust a suggestion. This made Peter lower
(20:52):
his opinion of women in general,and also he never thought of his mother
the same. Again, he neverviewed her the same way he would view
a sex worker, and Peter hada very very low opinion of sex workers.
But Peter is a literal pedophile,and he's like, you know what,
the people who are making a livingout there using what God gave them.
(21:18):
Yeah. The same year, Peter'sbrother told him that he had saw
Sonia cheating on him with a boythat worked at a local ice cream parlor.
Peter went to confront Sonia about therumor, but she would not confirm
or deny if she was seeing someoneelse or not, and this drove him
wild. Is it definitely confirmed thatthey were dating or is just just something
(21:41):
that Peter is like, Oh,Sonia is like my girlfriend. She's like
sixteen, she can't drive or drink, yet it's like totally cool. And
Sonia's actually like, so this guy'sactually a creep and he's following me around,
and I have a real relationship witha boy that's my age. So
at this stage, she's eighteen,and I believe they were seeing each other.
(22:03):
I believe that her and Peter weredating, but they were never like
exclusively dating. Okay, like theyhad been on dates, so it's apparently
then she had also been on afew dates with some other boy. And
then the brother saw and then Iwas like, because obviously I'm sure he
(22:23):
was telling his family like, oh, yes, I have a girlfriend and
she's totally age appropriate. Dad,you don't even get it. The dad
was probably like, yeah, getit to them, that's gross. So
this This really like got Peter going, like he was like, I'm gonna
show you SNYA. And he decidedthat to get revenge on her, he
(22:48):
was going to go pick up asex worker. Oh, that'll do the
trick. Yeah, I'm sure she'llbe so jeckalous with her new boyfriend.
So he did. He goes andhe picks up a sex worker and he's
on his way to her place todo the deed when he decides that it's
probably my actually not the best idea. He's like, hmm, I actually
(23:10):
don't want to go through with this, and the sex worker is like,
you can have your money back,and then he's like, perfect, thank
you. And they get to herplace and she's like, luck, listen,
I just I want to keep thelike bigger bills that you paid me.
So I'm gonna go inside. I'mgonna get you change. Is that
okay? And he's like, yeah, sure, just as long as you
(23:33):
like give me my money back.I don't want you give a fuck what
in what manner? So she goesinside and then she sends out two large
men to beat the crap out ofPeter. Why he didn't see this coming?
I don't know, so they attackhim and then they sent him on
his merry little way without his money. What's on no head? That's what
(23:59):
it's like. A few weeks later, Peter sees the same sex worker at
a pub he's at with Trevor.He goes up to her and he's like,
I remember you. I haven't forgottenwhat you did. You owe me
my money and that's smart. Thewoman laughs in his face, Okay,
yeah, I would do, andthen tells everyone in the pub about how
(24:22):
she absolutely made a holy show ofhim. And this was the last drop
for Peter, and this is whenhe begins his attack on what he believes
are sex workers. Can I justsay, for somebody that had a very
low opinion of sex workers and regardedthem as like scum of the earth,
why did he try to make useof the service? Then you can't say
(24:48):
that they're these disgusting assholes and thenbe like, but if you're busy,
hey, hey girl, like whatyou can't do that? No, No,
So before we get into his attacks, we'll just take a quick little
at birth Welcome back to the fun. In September nineteen sixty nine, Peter
(25:12):
was out drinking with Trevor birds allin Bradford. While the pair were driving
from one pub to another, Petersaw a girl he assumed was a sex
worker. Peter made Trevor pull overso he could follow the girl. Trevor
was waiting in the car, andafter about ten minutes, Peter came running
up to the car, all flusteredand anxious. He jumped in and he
(25:34):
yelled a Trevor to speed off.Trevor asked what happened and he said he
hit the girl over the head.Trevor questioned, like, Trevor was like
was that on purpose or like what? Like? What just happened? Sorry?
But did you kill her accidentally?It's my question. Peter responded that
he put a rock in a sockand he swung it at the girl,
(25:57):
hitting her in the head. Andthen Peter took her rock out of his
pocket and threw it at the carwindow. What the man is running around
with only one stock on manages tofind a rock from somewhere, just uses
that as a weapon because casual,and then brings the murder weapon back with
him and just throws it out ofa car window. After telling his friend
(26:19):
he just killed a sex fare SoTrevor asked if the girl was okay,
and Peter replied, quote, ofcourse she is the old cow. I
just wanted money. I mean,of course she is. You just fucking
attacked her like Jailhease style. Peterwould later go on to say, quote,
I had to do it. Itwas my mission. I was told
(26:40):
sex workers were the scum of theearth, and the guy who wants to
fuck a sister isn't. The womanthat Peter attacked survived and saw Trevor's license
plate, so she went to thepolice and she reported the crime. So
police went to question Trevor because itwas his license plate, and he was
like, yeah, no, luckily, and I was with my friend Peter.
(27:00):
He got out of the car andhe came running back like he like
was like, no, no,I ain't like I did judge it right,
and just to get away driver unintentionallylike I was. I haven't drinks
with my pal. So he likesends them Peter's way and they go and
they questioned Peter, and Peter's justlike, yeah, I hit her.
(27:25):
I wasn't with a rock though,I hit her with my hand, like
I you know, yeah, closedfisted, sure m. Police ask him
some more questions and then they leavelike they don't arrest him. They're just
like, cool, thanks for yourtime. What he like? I think
he like spins some story that likeshe took his money and he was just
trying to get it back and sohe like hit her to get it back,
(27:49):
and the police are just like cool, thanks for your time. Surely
the injury from a rock would bedifferent, it would be different to that
of her. I would am Iand so too. But a few weeks
later, a policeman sees Peter's caron the side of the road. He
decided to go see if everything wasokay, but as he got closer to
the car, Peter just sped off. A little while later, the officer
(28:12):
saw Peter's car again, but thistime it was empty. The officer had
a quick look around and he soonfound Peter hiding in some bushes holding a
hammer. Oh oh, okay,are you okay? In their little guy,
you're right. Peter told the officerthat his hood cap had come off
(28:33):
his car and he needed to hammerit back on. The police officer didn't
believe him, and he arrested him. But the officer never searched like Peter's
body like they never searched him,and if they did. If the officer
had had searched him, they wouldhave found a knife in his pocket.
Peter was fined twenty five pound andcharged with a misdemeanor. I will say
(29:00):
twenty five pound back in nineteen sixtynine would be a lot more than it
is today, but it's still Hewas charged twenty five pound and a misdemeanor.
I guess they didn't catch him actuallydoing any They just caught him hiding
in a bush like little freak.Well, the police report doesn't even mention
that he has a hammer in it, like they left that out. Oh
later, Peter admits that he wasthere to try to kill a sex worker
(29:25):
and the officer interrupted him. Whatthe fuck. Peter and Sonia are still
dating at this stage, but Soniahad moved to London to study to be
a teacher. Sonia had a mentalbreakdown over the stress of school, which
like get it girl. She wasadmitted to the hospital in nineteen seventy two.
(29:45):
Peter was then assigned as her primarycaregiver, and on August tenth,
nineteen seventy four, the couple gotmarried. Sonya was doing better. She
was released from hospital, and herand Peter moved. Her and Peter went
on a honeymoon to Paris. Theythen moved into her parents' home so that
(30:06):
they could save money so like tobuy their own place, and Sonia was
able to return back to the teacherprogram with the help of her parents.
Good for her, Peter became friendlywith their neighbor, Ronald Barker. The
pair would go out drinking together inthe local pubs and they would be out
chasing women. On July fifth,nineteen seventy five, Peter went to Kiley's
(30:36):
red light district and was just watchingthe sex workers. After a while,
Peter saw thirty six year old AnnaRogulski. Anna was walking to her boyfriend's
apartment, and Peter assumed she wasa sex worker as he had seen her
around the area before. As Annawalked past him, Peter asked her if
(30:57):
she was quote in business, andAnnah, like a queen, responds,
not on your life, good woman. Anna got to her boyfriend's house and
she was a little bit shaken upbecause like some strange man was like are
you. So she gets to herboyfriend's apartment and she is banging on the
(31:18):
door and she's shouting to be letin when Peter snuck up behind her and
hit her on the back of thehead twice with a hammer. Peter then
dragged Anna's unconscious body den an alleywayand began cutting her stomach with a knife.
A neighbor had heard the struggle andcame out to see what was going
on, startling Peter into running away. Anna had two skull fractures and had
(31:48):
to have a twelve hour surgery,but she survived. Anna couldn't remember anything
about her attack or who attacked her, unfortunately, but at least she survived.
My god, I'd imagine surviving somethinglike that. Oh God, listener,
discretion is advised. Sorry, Meggan, you have to hear it.
Peter liked to masturbase over his victim'sbodies as they lay dying. No no,
(32:15):
no, no, And there andthere was semen found on Anna's clothes.
That is absolutely the fact that herstomach was like cut open, and
he's no sele so like they didhave a semen, but obviously like he'd
never been arrested, Like they didn'thave his DNA. Do you know what
(32:37):
I mean? It's nineteen fucking seventyfour or whatever. I don't know it
was DNA even a real thing backthen. Like I know they could tell
blood type. I don't even know, but like it's nineteen seventy five,
so like, no, I can'timagine it's a big thing. So it
didn't matter that they had it.To be perfectly honest, On August fifteenth,
(32:59):
nineteen seventy five, Peter and TrevorBirdsall went to a pub in Halifax
for some drinks. Do you thinkthat like Trevor's wife would be like,
hey, I feel like Peter's likenot a good guy. He brought police
to our door and maybe don't hangout with him, or like Trevor would
maybe think that himself, like,hey, Peter's like really sketchy, and
(33:22):
maybe Trevor's a sketchy guy. Maybehe is, I don't know. To
be honest, I will say spoileralert, he will redeem himself in the
very end. I await Trevor's redemptionlooking forward to it. During the night,
Peter got into a disagreement with fortysix year old Olive Smelt. Peter
(33:44):
had accused all of being a sexworker, which she was not. They
both left the pub in different directions. Peter and Trevor were driving home when
Peter saw all of walking down alane and asked Trevor to pull over as
there was someone he needed to speakto. So like Trevor was just driving,
Trevor didn't notice her, and Peterjust happened to be like, that's
(34:06):
that bitch from the pub, andhe was like, hey, will you
pull over for a second, There'ssomeone I need to talk to, and
Trevors was like, cool, okay. As Peter got out of the car,
he reached down to grab something.Peter then went down like the other
side of the lane in an attemptto cush all of off so that like
he would meet her as he passedall of He walked down with his head
(34:30):
down so that she couldn't see him, so like she's coming up the lane
way, he's coming down the lanewaywith his head down so that she won't
cop who he is terrifying, andthen he immediately turns around and he hits
her on the head with his hammer. Olive fell to the ground and Peter
(34:50):
hit her a second time with thehammer. Peter then pulled down Olive's underwear
and pulled out a knife. Hethen proceeded to cut her down there several
times, like on her vagina,yeah, down in that, like,
yeah, pretty much. A couplewere parked nearby and they could hear a
(35:12):
struggle, so they turned on theircar lights to flash, what you know,
to see like what's that noise goingon? And this startled Peter and
he ran away. Olive had toundergo several life saving surgeries and she did
ultimately survive. The next day,Trevor saw the report of all of the
attack, but at first he didn'tput the connection together, Like he didn't
(35:37):
immediately go, oh, my friend, and no, no, no,
I'm sorry, Okay, your friendcomes back. He has to have at
least some amount of blood on him, and he's carrying a fucking hammer.
But it's like the middle of thenight, it's like one am, and
he didn't see the hammer. AndI do think a part of it,
(35:59):
why it's a real case of oh, not my friend, Like, my
friend couldn't do that. Not myfriend Peter, who got with a sixteen
year old when he was twenty one, and who I know for a fact
is already assaulted sex workers in thepast. Not him, Not him,
though he's a good guy. OnOctober thirtieth nineteen seventy five, Peter went
(36:21):
down to a pub in Leeds forsome drinks. After he had a few
drinks, he went driving around becausenow he's obsessed with the idea of killing
a sex worker. He came acrossa young woman hitchhiking along the side of
the road. Twenty eight year oldWilma McCann was recently divorced and had four
young children. They were living ina small apartment and she had become a
(36:45):
sex worker to try and support herchildren if she had to make a living.
Wilma's struggled with alcoholism and these wouldbe the main two things that's sadly
the press would focus on, ofcourse, sing about her case. So
a major problem with this case isthat whilst this case is ongoing, whilst
(37:07):
the Yorkshire Ripper case is ongoing,the press talk awfully about the victims.
They talk about how they were sexworkers, how they were per how they
were drug addicts or alcoholics. Thepress, the media put a very much
(37:29):
emphasis on it was their fault forbeing there, for being sex workers,
straight up victim planning. And itis years later the police departments do eventually
apologize for how first of all,how the cases were handled, and then
(37:50):
secondly, how it was all talkedabout in the press, because it's not
just the press making like these assumptionsas well. It's like the officers who
are like giving interviews to the pressare like, oh, yeah, but
she was a sex worker, solike she deserved it, right, guys,
right, you know, and itis it's an awful thing to like
(38:12):
see in here because you're like,first of all, it's their body.
They can do it with it whatthey want. And a lot of these
people so you're like, the areasthat they're enduring these times are dirt per
and so it's like the only waythat they can make a living and they
have families to support. But atthe same time, there's no supply without
(38:35):
demand. So all of these menthat are like they're disgusting, they are
the demand, you know, theyare the reason why there are sex workers.
Literally. So Peter pulled over andoffered Wilmer a ride home, and
she accepted. While on the wayto her apartment, she asked Peter if
he wanted business, and this lethim know that she was a sex worker.
(39:00):
The pair pulled into Prince Philip's playingfield, which was approximately one hundred
yards from where Wilma lived. Wilmagot out of the car and she lay
in the field while Peter got outof his car and took a hammer from
his trunk. As Wilma began unbuttoningPeter's pants, he took the hammer and
he hid her on the top ofthe head. Peter continued to hit Wilma
(39:22):
on the head with the hammer,quote penetrating the full thickness of her skull.
Peter then took out a knife andbegan stabbing Wilma. He began stabbing
her in the neck and fourteen timesin the torso. The next day,
a local milkman and his ten yearold brother found Wilma's body. Oh my
(39:45):
god, So this is Peter's firstactual murder that he's this is his first,
yes, his first murder, andbefore this he's just been attacking woman,
but he hasn't actually successfully killed anybody. They ran to the nearest house
to call the police, and itdidn't take police long to close off the
scene. However, people in thesurrounding area hired nothing and saw nothing the
(40:08):
night before. Police didn't connect themurder of Wilma to the attacks of Anna
and Olive. I don't even thinkthey connected the attack of Anna and Olive
yet, Like they hadn't connected thosetwo attacks to one another, and then
they didn't attack. They didn't connectthen the murder, which to me is
(40:30):
silly because so far all three womenhave been attacked with fucking hammers and I'll
have like vicious stab or knight wounds. Wounds. Yeah, so like it's
the same m O. It's justthis time he was successful in killing her.
And it's like, how many peopleare being violently attacked in the area
(40:50):
with knives and hammers like this women? I'd like to hope not that many.
Yeah. Same. The medical callexaminer concluded that Wilma was more than
likely unconscious after the head trauma,but would have very would have been still
very much alive during this stabbins.There were traces of semen found on Wilma's
(41:14):
clothing. However, it is believedthat she was not sexually assaulted. That
is where I'm going to end partone. In part two will get more
into his killings. Um, there'sa lot of them. There's a lot
of killings and attacks. So that'swhy I say it will probably be a
three parter to get into him beingcaught in all of that jazz. So
(41:38):
I just I can't like the factthat he masturbates over his victims. And
the sick thing is is he likedoes it whilst they're dying? Yeah,
so it's not even it's like,what does he have an attraction to?
Is it the act itself where hejust feels still rated and he's excited by
(42:00):
that, or is it this siteof blood and stuff because he obviously enjoys
being around the dead as well.Ye're an you know the dead that you're
burying. I don't know. Yeah, so it's a weird thing to like
what is it that's like exciting him? And he's still working as a mortuary
(42:21):
assistant? Is he? And bythis stage I think he is just a
mechanic Now I don't care he amfrom what I remember. M he just
then I think he eventually leaves thatand he just kind of gets a job
M like in like mechanics. Thearea that they're living in isn't the greatest,
(42:45):
so it's kind of more so whateverjob he can get. Yeah,
I know eventually he will go onto get a job as a lorry driver,
right, Um, so he kindof I think is just whatever kind
of job he can get his handson is the kind of job he's working.
He's like he never really keeps ajob for all too long, so
(43:07):
he's like bouncing from job to job. But like him, it's wild because
like him and Sonia are like savingfor a house and then he's just like
out killing people and you're like normal. Yeah, and again it's like the
people who you always think are themost normal, but at the same time,
(43:27):
to the people that were really closeto him, like Trevor knew that
he wasn't an okay guy, andhis other friend also knew that he wasn't
an okay guy. I do thinkproud of them, just like it's like
you choose to ignore these things becauselike there's no way your friend could be
(43:47):
a killer, do you know whatI mean? H It's like they can't
see all the red flags because theirglasses are roastinted. Literally what God don't
So today, today it's gonna bethe day. No, it's not,
because today is the fifth of March. I am flying to Ireland on the
(44:10):
eighth and we're seeing Paramoun on thethirteenth April. That one, yep,
today it's the fifth of April today, of the fifth of April, and
Meggan it's on Saturday. Slay soexcited. So if you perably enjoyed this
(44:30):
week's episode, please go check outany of our other episodes if you haven't
done so already, and you canfind them wherever you get your podcasts such
as Apple Podcasts and Spotify. Pleasedon't forget to rate and review. We
always appreciate it. You can checkus out on Facebook, Instagram, and
(44:52):
Twitter all at give us More andif you want to see who you're listening
to, you can check out ourown personal instagrams which is at megpal undersco
and like a nieve and am yeah, I guess We'll see you on the
flip side and keep your ass fatand you're awa threatening always slay Okay,
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