October 13, 2025 • 30 mins
Disney has hiked prices again—day tickets, annual passes, parking, and even Lightning Lane. At Disneyland, parking now costs $40 a day and the top-tier Inspire Key annual pass jumps to $1,899, still with blockout dates and reservation limits. In Florida, annual passes are up as well, though one-day tickets remain steadier. Philip and Scott debate whether these moves are a strategy to manage crowd levels or a sign of the parks leaning further into exclusivity—especially as Disney faces stock pressure and boycotts. Are higher prices a reset for quality and capacity, or the next step in making Disney a luxury brand? Listen to weekly BONUS episodes on our Patreon.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2 (00:00):
Okay, from our studios this week in Detroit and Tampa.
This is Green tagt Theme Park and thirty. I'm Philip
and I'm joined as always by my co host Scott
Swinston of Scott Swinson creat Development. On Green Tag, we
look the top news each week and we discuss why
it matters your theme park professionals. And this week we're
gonna talk a little bit about comments from last week's
discussion and then look at Disney prices. And we are
(00:22):
recording this a little bit early because it is Halloween season. Bill,
Scott and I are busy. In this case, it's mostly
my fault. So if there are normally it's mostly my fault,
so this time it is actually Phillip's fault. So if
there is a big news item and you're like, why
didn't they talk about that, obviously that it's probably because
this is in the we're time traveling.
Speaker 1 (00:40):
Yes, yes, yes, yes.
Speaker 3 (00:43):
We're prognosticating, looking into the future.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
From the past from the that's right, okay, good, all right,
I had no coffe yet. Okay, So we want to
just address some comments from last week's show. First, is
a Scott has a fan.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
I have one.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
Yay, I have a fan no at sale Dust. Thank you,
thank you so much. Basically, this person commented and said, hey,
I followed Scott when he did Hellow Scream and I
always liked his work and just really complimentary, nice words,
and I would just like to say thank you at
sale Dust, and I really do appreciate you finding us
(01:23):
here and reaching out and commenting. So I just want
to say thank you and tell you how much I
appreciate it. It's it's, you know, making people happy is
kind of why I do what I do. And when
people are still remembering things that I'm very proud of,
I'm honored and humbled.
Speaker 4 (01:38):
So thank you very much.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
Ah.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
Okay, can probably just save that one for last you know.
Speaker 1 (01:45):
And that's but we but we didn't.
Speaker 4 (01:48):
We'll start on a nice, warm fuzzy. Okay, we'll start
on a nice warm fuzzy.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
The next comment here, I think it says, unfortunately, most
guests don't even pay attention to the ride safety signage
when they enter the queue.
Speaker 1 (02:00):
That's true.
Speaker 4 (02:01):
Well, and keep in.
Speaker 3 (02:02):
Mind, keep in mind this is in comment to This
is a comment about last week's Showhere, we talked quite
a bit about the tragedy that happened at at Epic
Universe on roller coasters STARTUS racers. So that's where these comments.
Just to give you a frame of reference, that's kind
of where these comments are coming from. And you're absolutely right,
(02:22):
Philip and whoever made this comment. Uh, this is one
of those situations where people are so cavalier, especially in
the United States. It's less true in other countries, well,
some other countries, and more true in some other countries
as well, at least based anecdotally on my experience. But
the idea is that you're right.
Speaker 4 (02:45):
They don't read.
Speaker 3 (02:46):
It's just like we don't read all the warnings on
medication that we are taking. It's very rare conditions. Yeah,
how often do we just click yes, I accept? And
it could have you could have just given up your
first born. I mean you have because you never read it.
You have no idea. I will say though, that the
(03:06):
it's kind of a weird double edged sword to me
because that means that you're right, we just don't have
time to read it. We're just going to write it,
and we're going to write it whether it tells us,
you know, we might lose a limb or not.
Speaker 4 (03:16):
We're just going to write it.
Speaker 3 (03:17):
And at the same time, it is nice that the industry.
Speaker 4 (03:23):
Is so powerful and so.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
Really safe that most people don't feel the need to
dive into all the challenges. They don't, you know, recognize
that a coaster can hurt you, so therefore they choose
not to read it. There has to be a point, though,
where somebody takes some sort of personal responsibility for themselves
based on what their abilities are.
Speaker 4 (03:47):
As a person.
Speaker 3 (03:48):
You know, for example, if there is anything that is
remarkably tighteror claustrophobic as a bigger guy, I'm not going
to do it because I'm not going to be comfortable.
I might get hurt, and I'm going to take that
responsibility on myself.
Speaker 4 (04:01):
I'm not going to.
Speaker 3 (04:01):
Make the theme park attraction builders in essence homogenize everything
or dumb everything down so that everybody and their dog.
Speaker 4 (04:11):
Can ride it.
Speaker 3 (04:12):
Now that doesn't mean I'm not all for accessibility, but
I think there are reasonable I think it's a reasonable
a little bit of reasonable wiggle room there. There are
certain things that I can't ride because of my height,
at my height and my combined weight, so but at
the same time, it doesn't matter because nobody reads them anyway,
(04:35):
So what can we do? I mean, we obviously have
to design to the best of our ability, based on
the information that we have, based on best practices, based
on the laws, based on the regulations, based on based
on based on and then hope that people make good
choices on their own.
Speaker 4 (04:54):
Yeah. I don't know what else to say.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
Yeah, well, the this is, this is I don't want
to say it's a uniquely American problem, but it's definitely
different in America.
Speaker 1 (05:05):
I think for any international listeners.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
It just it works differently here because so much of
what we rely to correct behavior is from litigation.
Speaker 1 (05:15):
So it's it's it, you know, well, but but a.
Speaker 3 (05:18):
Lot of the bottom line here in the US, we
are far more interested in punishment than than we are
in finding a solution.
Speaker 2 (05:23):
Yes, yeah, that's that's exactly it. Yeah, we're way more
interested in corrective kind of after the.
Speaker 3 (05:30):
Big corporation, bad big corporation, We're going to make you pay.
That's that's much more of the attitude than well, how
could we find a solution to this?
Speaker 1 (05:38):
That's right.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
Like I think inherent in that comment is maybe the opposite,
where like there are things you could do proactively, you know,
to to be more proactive about this, but.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
That's just not how America work.
Speaker 2 (05:55):
Yeah, but yeah, the next comment here is from miss
my Music, and this is a good one. She said,
she or I think she said the spoilation it's safer. Sure,
they said, they said the spoilation of evidence. Argument is dumb.
They could have gone to court and file a TIRO
to stop the ride from reopening. They didn't, probably because
(06:17):
they knew they wouldn't get it, probably because it is
without merit.
Speaker 1 (06:21):
Yeah, yeah, I.
Speaker 4 (06:22):
Mean we didn't.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
I mean we I guess, you know, we didn't want
to bring that up and when we were because we're
just kind of summarizing what the arguments are on both sides.
But I do agree totally with this one hundred percent, Like, well,
it's one.
Speaker 3 (06:35):
Thing to make it part of the story, and it's
another thing to make it a comment on the story.
If we had made it part of the story, it
would have made us seem a bit more callous, which
you know, we started the story by saying, this is
a terrible thing. We're sad that it happened, you know,
are our hearts go out to the friends and family
of the person that was lost. But but this is
(06:57):
a very good point, and that is if they if
this was truly an issue, they could have stopped it.
They could have stopped it through the courts.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
Yep, yep, yep, that's true. All right, those are I
think the ones we wanted to highlight. Just sure, But
thank you for everyone that did comment, and we always
love to see the discussion on there, especially the discussion
there's discussion about maybe a different type of restraint would
have been helpful, or harnesses and all that. There's just
great discussion in the comments and we always appreciate that.
(07:26):
But we shall move on to a story. We're going
to mention only in passing, just because again we're recording
this early.
Speaker 4 (07:36):
Could you choose a different term? Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 2 (07:39):
Could you just use a different phrase. Well, I didn't
mention it. Briefly, I didn't. I didn't realize it until
you pointed out. Okay, So I'm sure everyone listening has
seen the news about the woman who died after writing
these Land's Haunted Mansion holiday this week, and we're recording
(07:59):
this on the ninth, and at the point of this recording,
there's no information about the cause of death. So were
We assume there's gonna be more news out in the
next several days, so probably by the time that you
all are watching this or probably updates have already been
shared about what the cause was, but there wasn't on
cause now. But we are just mentioning it because it
is big news and it is semi related to the
(08:21):
incident that we just talked about last week and that
we just read the comments on.
Speaker 3 (08:25):
So yeah, and I think it's important for us to
mention it just so that you guys who are listening
don't think, my God, was this not that important to them?
It is important to us, and you know, we're very
sorry to hear this. However, at the time of recording, there's.
Speaker 4 (08:37):
Not a whole lot of info.
Speaker 2 (08:38):
So yeah, yeah, Okay, moving on, there we go. Maybe not,
I don't know, there's no way to say it. Okay,
We're just gonna talk about the next story, which is.
Speaker 4 (08:48):
They shouldn't say passing on.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
That's good, Okay, the next story I am so going
to hell. Yep, I'm just gonna comment on that. We're
gonna stay in Disney though, and discuss how they are
raising prices at both Disneyland and in Florida, and this
is the thing that I have seen all over every
Everyone is talking about this as they always do every
(09:11):
time the prices go up, which they always do.
Speaker 1 (09:14):
They never know, they never go down, but they do
continuously raise.
Speaker 2 (09:18):
I think basically, to summarize all of this, it's a
lot of information. To summarize everything. Prices for literally everything
are going up, so prices for the annual passes, prices
for day tickets, prices for parking, and prices for Lightning Lane,
at least in California, the Lightning LaNese that's gowing up.
So now the things that I think are most interesting
(09:38):
that people seem to be for some reason, the stuff
that the that the guests or the theme park fans
are most upset about is the parking in California, which
is going up to forty dollars a day for regular
cars at Disneyland. And I think, what's I think the
reason that's hitting with so many people is that not
all of the annual passes in California cover parking. It's
(10:00):
only the really high level ones, and those ones are
also increasing in price. So the key that the top level,
the Inspired Key, is raising one hundred and fifty dollars,
and that one doesn't include that one includes parking but
not not all the other ones do, and so a
forty dollars charge to drive there, I think is when
(10:21):
you're trying to encourage people to come multiple days, and
that's what's that's why that's a pain point for a
lot of folks. The lightning lane is going up, but
I think that's less It seems to be less of
a pain point, especially because in California there's more pass
holders and they don't tend to use lightning lanes since
they're locals, so that's not as much of an issue.
But the other big stink is the the sticker shock
(10:44):
of the Tier six, which is the high you know,
the most the most I don't know who they visited
or the highest price. That's going to be two hundred
and twenty four, but that's one part per day. So
if you add the park coroper, that talking almost three
hundred dollars for a one day ticket in a Tier
six time, which is the holiday types of seasons. So
(11:06):
I think that's I think, for some reason, these two
seem to be the thing I keep hearing over and over.
It's like it's like the parking, and then it's it's
this item, and then of course the pass is going up.
You know, no one's ever, no one's ever happy about
annual passes going up. But in California at least they didn't.
They kept the cheapest option the same price. So the
(11:29):
parking did go up for that option, obviously, as it
went up for everybody. But the the resident pass, the
lowest level one that's only weekdays. I think it's like Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday,
or Monday or Monday through Thursday, those days that did
not raise in price. So you will pay five dollars
more each time you go for parking, but not that
amount so well, and that kind.
Speaker 3 (11:51):
Of makes sense as to why the highest the highest
tier of single day ticket and the parking. You're what
you're basically doing, is you're looking these are these are
the points of discomfort or the most obvious points of
discomfort for the two.
Speaker 4 (12:05):
Key groups of people.
Speaker 3 (12:07):
It's the locals who have who have passes, and you know,
the passes. They get the passes, so think go multiple
times and now they're paying five dollars more per time,
assuming that they're driving, and the single day ticket is
is tourists who are like, oh, let's go to Disney.
It's what, it's two hundred and what for a single park?
Speaker 1 (12:27):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2 (12:28):
Now it's interesting because when I'm seeing here, looking at everything,
I'm obviously way more focused on the California one because
that's my home park, even though I'm in Detroit right now,
but that's my home home park. It seems like in
Florida they have not I don't see prices for the
day passes going up very much. It's mostly the annual
(12:51):
passes in Florida as well that have changed.
Speaker 3 (12:55):
So there's more hotels here. Yeah, so more hotels, I
mean they want again, Disney has a much larger pass
base in California. That's right, That's right, exactly, It's it's
just it's all interesting. So basically what we're looking at
(13:16):
is Disney raising the prices for the annual passes on
both coasts, and then one day ticket and parking are
up at California in California, and I think that all
tracks just because of what you just said. I mean,
we know that California has much more, much more pass base,
and so for them, it's basically you're trying to get
a little bit more out of the pass holder. I
guess because the parking price is a little bit up,
(13:37):
and then the passes are up, so you're getting a
little bit more from them. But then the one day
ticket prices are also up, so when you're bringing people
that are visiting for the holidays or whatever, you're going
to pay more for those tickets and then visitors. So
I think, I'm not sure.
Speaker 2 (13:55):
I mean, we talk about this every time there, and
I think it's where we're always having the same argument.
I to me, this this looks like again that they
are just trying to temper demand that the parks are
still full enough in California where they don't need to
really where they're they're just trying I mean again when
(14:16):
basically this is impacting every every group, whether it's a
visitor group or it's the local group. And that that
I mean, the only answer is they're trying to temper
demand a little bit with that. Now that of course,
whenever you say that, then you hear I hear so
many people that say that we that attendance in the
parks is down, and I guess to that point, there
(14:38):
is there is an offer that they have for locals,
that is for this next few months where you can
get a three day pass for two hundred and forty
nine dollars, But that's only on sale December third, and
it's only valid starting from from January to May. So
that seems more like a gimme to make people not
as upset, you know, then it does other items, but
(15:03):
but I.
Speaker 4 (15:04):
Don't know, Well, it could be.
Speaker 3 (15:07):
It could be any who knows, quite honestly, but it
could be. Let's just throw some ideas out there.
Speaker 4 (15:12):
You know.
Speaker 3 (15:12):
You say that it is to temper demand, which would
have been my first guess too. But if attendance is down,
then maybe it's to make up for the lack of
ticket sales, so they have to make sure that the
gate per cap remains constant as opposed to fluctuating down.
(15:32):
Or I mean, this is going to sound crazy, but
it may be something as simple as they have to do
everything they can to make up for all the Disney
Plus subscriptions that they lost during the Jimmy Kimmel incident.
So yep, that's a possibility too. All of these may
be crazy. I admit that none of them. I'm not
reporting any of these as fact. I do not know,
but there's a lot of things that could come into
(15:54):
play here.
Speaker 2 (15:56):
It is just interesting because I think the optics right
now don't look great, right, the optics of just having
the Jimmy Kimmel nonsense and then all of the you know,
toxic boycotts for that, and then you jump right into well,
now we're going to make it more expensive, and especially
targeting the most rabid fans on both coasts and then
on on California, you're just kind of targeting everybody. So
(16:18):
it does make it seem a lot more like that
walled garden idea, you know that that we talk about
a lot where it's it's kind of becoming I mean,
it's it's even and do.
Speaker 3 (16:29):
You still have to do reservations in California.
Speaker 2 (16:32):
Yeah, so we step through reservations and then also that
top pass that you that which is now going to
be ninety nine, so basically nineteen hundred dollars, and that's
a twelve month pass. That's a twelve month pass. It's
a magic key for nineteen hundred dollars. It does include parking,
but it still has blackout dates and you have to make.
Speaker 3 (16:54):
Reservations blackout dates, and you still have to make reservations.
Speaker 2 (16:57):
And you can only hold six at a time for
a year, right, and so yeah, and so again I
don't know. I mean, I guess you know, again I hear.
I get so many feedback from listeners and for people
who text me the Private League or whatever, and they
always say, you know, the attendance is down at Universal
(17:18):
and it's down at Disney, and everyone's panicking. I'm like, well, like, again,
the parks are not releasing these numbers right yet or
right now. We don't have them yet, and it's always
a rolling quarter, right, so it takes a while for
us to see them ahead of time. But I would
say that this type of raising prices seems to me
(17:42):
like they don't think they have an attendance problem, or
maybe they're okay with the dip, like Scott said, they're
okay with the dip in attendance because if you have
a dip, that means you can relax some of your
staffing and if you get more per person, then maybe
it's a better equilibrium for them going forward into twenty
twenty six. Because also, as we've talked about on the
(18:02):
show in the past, twenty twenty six is not shaping
up to be a great year because there's nothing happening.
Nothing new really is opening at any of these parks
in the US. So maybe it's maybe they're just trying
to tamp and demand so they can adjust staffing because
they know that it's going to be a somewhat slower year.
Speaker 1 (18:20):
I don't know, this is who knows.
Speaker 3 (18:22):
Yeah, there's a million different reasons that these could happen.
But again, that's what this show is all about to
get us talking about what could those reasons be and
how do they apply to our attraction or our.
Speaker 4 (18:31):
Little corner of the industry.
Speaker 3 (18:32):
So ask those questions with whoever you're working with and see,
you know, how they would have handled the situation or what,
more accurately, what a price increase like this would have
meant to your attraction? You know, does it mean that
you are trying to curb curb attendance? Does it mean
you are trying to make up for a loss of attendance?
(18:53):
Is it simply a money grab because you've lost something
else in another area of the company. I mean to
be any of these things. I think the bottom line
is we are if I'm going to if I'm going
to just share a radical out there opinion. I think
this is just another nail in the coffin of the
giant theme park. I think it's going to get to
(19:15):
a point where it will only be for the elite rich.
And once it becomes only for the elite rich, then
it won't become it won't be palatable really for anybody,
because even the elite rich like to do the things
that are cool and new and funky, and those are
usually discovered by anyone but the elite rich and then
co opted by the elite rich. So I think that
(19:37):
this is a dangerous as a slippery slope that we're
on right now, and we will see, we will see
where it ends up.
Speaker 4 (19:45):
I don't know for sure, yep.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
I yeah, I definitely can see that argument, like I said,
and especially it being so close to home for me.
I just you know, it's I always think about when
we're making these calculations with friends. Know if it basically
it does become exactly what you're talking about, because I
have my friends that I know have passes, and you're
kind of all relying on the whole group having the
(20:08):
pass because you just can't afford even when my family's visiting.
You know, it's so much money, or if you're trying
to take a partner with you, it doesn't have a
a path. It's oh my god, a ticket like it's
it's it's so.
Speaker 3 (20:22):
It's crazy to even get a reservation.
Speaker 2 (20:25):
That's right, Yeah, it's crazy. It's becoming crazy. And so
you're I think you're right on the right about that.
And also it is pulling ahead significantly. You know, from
the other theme parks in the region. It's so much
more expensive to go to Disneyland is to go to
the competition.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
So uh well, and throughout history, throughout the history, at
least my my history in the in the industry, Disney
has always led the prime price hike lead. They've always
taken the lead on that, and the moment they do it,
then within usually within.
Speaker 4 (20:57):
Six months of the latest parks follow suit.
Speaker 3 (21:01):
But they wait to see how Disney fares, and they figure, well,
if Disney can make good, they're not really at risk
because they're Disney.
Speaker 4 (21:08):
You know. That's the way it's always been.
Speaker 3 (21:10):
I don't think it's gonna be the case much longer,
but that's the way.
Speaker 4 (21:13):
It's always been.
Speaker 1 (21:13):
So we'll see, Yes, there was a.
Speaker 2 (21:21):
We were not scheduled to talk about this, but I'm
just gonna put this out there as a just a
totally random thing. So I was listening to I listened
to several economic podcasts and I read a bunch of
I just read a bunch of random suff and whatever.
Speaker 1 (21:33):
And there's this like.
Speaker 2 (21:33):
Theory and that's been rolling around in the business circles,
in the economic circles about how Netflix should buy Disney.
Interesting and stuff like this makes me think that basically,
if it's like you say, another nail in the coffin
and they're kind of like, you know, there, it's becoming
more difficult for that, it actually potentially could make them
(21:54):
more viable as a as a purchasing you know, but
especially someone like Netflix, who right now now Netflix has
a fifty times earnings, which is absolutely bonkers. And it's
just it's interesting because again you just think about, there's
something new at the parks, and Disney's IP recently has
not been doing great, and then.
Speaker 3 (22:13):
You look at it as a Disney stockholder. Disney Stock's
not doing great.
Speaker 2 (22:16):
So yeah, so all these indicators you're like, eh, and
then you look at Netflix and you're like, Netflix, right now,
is that fifty times earnings? Which I think is overvalued,
just especially because of AI and because of all the competitors.
But you know, what they do have is the strong
ips like Wednesday, they have the one piece stuff.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
Now they're licensing that, they have K.
Speaker 2 (22:36):
Pop Dema Hunters, which is everywhere and going insane, and
they're experimenting with the Netflix houses. So I don't know,
could could be, could be time, you know for this acquisition.
And also how crazy is it that we're in a
position where we're like Netflix is now like so big,
and they're so to me. Netflix is still a new
company right in my brain. They're just like Facebook is
(22:58):
new in my brain, even though it's even though the
but these new, relatively new companies have shaped so much
of our lives now where you know, Disney, that's a
much older company, is just worth less than half of Netflix.
Speaker 4 (23:12):
So yep, even.
Speaker 2 (23:16):
With Disney, plus they could bundle it all together. Can
you imagine just bundling everything together Cable again? Yeah, and
then tap Hop Demon Hunter is the ride?
Speaker 3 (23:25):
Oh yeah, well, I mean there is. You know that
it's just sort of chomping at the bit for so
many of the ips that they hold. Yep, you know,
great British Baking show, the ride. I mean, god knows,
it could be anything. Yeah, it could be incredible.
Speaker 4 (23:41):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (23:41):
But anyway, last data point two is just which in
the economic circle is just to your to Scott's point
about the elite thing, the top ten. We have some
numbers that came out this last month that I talked
about in a different show, but basically it's relevant here
because the top ten percent of earners are driving fifty
percent of the economy in the US, and so that
(24:03):
kind of so I mean, if again, if Disney is
just like Star Cruiser, I feel like we're back to
Star Cruise and we're back to what we talked about
with the Horror Unleashed And they're almost three thousand dollars
VIP package. If you're if that is the game where
you're targeting the top ten percent that have the money,
than great. But then the question is is it sustainable?
(24:23):
Who knows?
Speaker 4 (24:24):
You know?
Speaker 1 (24:24):
Is that enough you know?
Speaker 2 (24:25):
Or do they do they want to go to Scott's point,
do they want to go to the theme parks?
Speaker 1 (24:29):
When when it's just that I don't know.
Speaker 3 (24:31):
And anecdotally, more and more of the new projects that
I'm being contacted to excuse me to it bids in
on or you know, to attempt to sign sign contracts
with more and more of them are what I will
call smaller attractions with very deep pockets. So basically, what's
(24:52):
happening from from my perspective, and I'm looking forward and
I'm guessing, I will be honest, I'm guessing, but it.
Speaker 4 (24:59):
Appears as though.
Speaker 3 (25:01):
We are we are gonna enter into what i'll, for
lack of a better description, the the fec on steroids concept.
So with things like the Netflix Netflix, the Netflix House,
at Las nine, the Theses, other world haunted houses and FECs.
(25:30):
I mean, there's even FECs out there that are looking
to up their game. They are in prime locations and
they're looking to find ways to start playing in the
theme detraction industry as opposed to just buying some games
and some you know, trampolines with neon lights and and
open their doors and then you go to places like
(25:50):
you go to places like Saudi or or even u Ae,
and they're in every mall there is, you know, and
there's multiples in every mall. So it is continuing to
at least from my perspective, it appears to be skewing
smaller because it's affordable, it's repeatable, it's stuff that gives
people something to do rather than just look at there's
(26:13):
a lot there's a lot of elements that are kind of,
you know, perfect storming themselves into into leading people away
from the giant parks.
Speaker 1 (26:23):
That's interesting.
Speaker 2 (26:24):
Exactly what you said is reminding me to something else
I've heard a lot recently, which is people saying that
you have much more, it's much easier to make money
or or I guess the future is going to be
in making stuff for a smaller screen. So like the
smaller the smaller the screen you're making something for, the
more likely you're going to be able to make a
(26:45):
living off of it. So as in like again, like
the movies are becoming the more like elite thing that
like who even has the money the budget for movies
anymore or any of that even to go to movies
or any of those that whole thing, And then versus
you know, if you're just doing like us a podcast,
or you're doing something that's intended for a small screen,
your TikTok's or whatever, it's a much more sustainable and
(27:07):
much more money in that. So interesting, it feels also
like there's several parallel forces here happening.
Speaker 3 (27:15):
Yeah, I think it's I think, and I think what's
going to happen, unfortunately is the people that have if it,
let's assume, just for a hot second, let's assume that
it is. It is the intent of the parks to
start catering to a higher and higher income audience. It's
going to get to a point where instead of wanting
(27:37):
to go to instead of wanting to go to Italy
in Epcot, it's going to be more cost effective and
more interesting to go to Italy.
Speaker 1 (27:47):
That's right. So I always think that's always the danger.
But that's just me. But you know, I don't know.
Speaker 4 (27:53):
I think so too. I think so too.
Speaker 3 (27:56):
Which is I think why we've seen over the last
few years, especially here in Florida with Epcot, you've seen
more and more integration of the Disney held ips. You know, yes,
you can go to you can go to Norway, but
you can't ride the Frozen ride there, you know.
Speaker 2 (28:12):
But then then to your point, though, I mean, to
exactly your point about the FEC expansion, right, the Netflix
Haus is a great example. I mean, they're doing the
k pop DMA Hunter thing there and they have a
Wednesday exhibit and a one piece exhibit. If you care
about those ips more than you care about Frozen, then
you're going to go there. You're go to Disney, that's right,
and it's going to be cheaper and you have to
pay to walk in. You only have to pay to
do the activity.
Speaker 4 (28:33):
Right, there's not like a car card do You don't
even have to pay the park.
Speaker 1 (28:35):
Yeah, it's all my god, Yeah, that's crazy.
Speaker 4 (28:37):
It's take king a pressure mall.
Speaker 3 (28:38):
So you know you park in the in the mall
parking lot.
Speaker 4 (28:42):
Done easy again.
Speaker 3 (28:45):
If here's the takeaway from from my perspective, there are
parks are adding more and more and more and more
and more hurdles you have to jump through before you
can even get in. Yep, take a moment to refresh
and look at how your organization runs and see what
you can see how you can reduce the friction for
the guest to actually put set foot into your parks.
(29:07):
It may mean that you change your ticketing system. It
may mean that you know, instead of offering fifteen different levels,
you offer one or two and then once they get
inside you can upcharge from there. There are disadvantages to
that as well. But I think the big players, many
of the big players, are making it more and more
difficult to actually get into the park. And I'll give
(29:28):
you a perfect example, and this is something that they
do for safety, and I get it, but I don't
want to go to Horrnites in Florida because getting in
takes longer than pretty much any of the cues for
any of the haunts. It's a it's a one level
after another level after another level, and it's it's difficult,
(29:49):
it's uncomfortable, it feels disorganized. I know it's not, but
it feels disorganized and for some people it even feels invasive.
So my first impression of the event.
Speaker 4 (30:01):
Is not a good one. And what do we remember
first and last impressions?
Speaker 3 (30:05):
So anyway, my takeaway from today would be evaluate what
your what your entry is, and what are all the
points of friction for your guests. But we can't talk
about entry points anymore because it's time for our exit
strategy because we're over time already. So we talked about
a lot and again we love starting with your comments,
so please continue to comment. Also, please, if you are
(30:28):
enjoying what you're seeing, please subscribe.
Speaker 2 (30:30):
Subscribers, yes, please, do need those subscribers.
Speaker 3 (30:34):
We need those subscribers, please just please just click on subscribe.
Speaker 4 (30:38):
And other than that, we hope you guys get some takeaway.
Speaker 3 (30:41):
We hope you guys find value, and we will see
all of you, each and every one of you plus
some next week
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2 (00:00):
Okay, from our studios this week in Detroit and Tampa.
This is Green tagt Theme Park and thirty. I'm Philip
and I'm joined as always by my co host Scott
Swinston of Scott Swinson creat Development. On Green Tag, we
look the top news each week and we discuss why
it matters your theme park professionals. And this week we're
gonna talk a little bit about comments from last week's
discussion and then look at Disney prices. And we are
(00:22):
recording this a little bit early because it is Halloween season. Bill,
Scott and I are busy. In this case, it's mostly
my fault. So if there are normally it's mostly my fault,
so this time it is actually Phillip's fault. So if
there is a big news item and you're like, why
didn't they talk about that, obviously that it's probably because
this is in the we're time traveling.
Speaker 1 (00:40):
Yes, yes, yes, yes.
Speaker 3 (00:43):
We're prognosticating, looking into the future.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
From the past from the that's right, okay, good, all right,
I had no coffe yet. Okay, So we want to
just address some comments from last week's show. First, is
a Scott has a fan.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
I have one.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
Yay, I have a fan no at sale Dust. Thank you,
thank you so much. Basically, this person commented and said, hey,
I followed Scott when he did Hellow Scream and I
always liked his work and just really complimentary, nice words,
and I would just like to say thank you at
sale Dust, and I really do appreciate you finding us
(01:23):
here and reaching out and commenting. So I just want
to say thank you and tell you how much I
appreciate it. It's it's, you know, making people happy is
kind of why I do what I do. And when
people are still remembering things that I'm very proud of,
I'm honored and humbled.
Speaker 4 (01:38):
So thank you very much.
Speaker 1 (01:41):
Ah.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
Okay, can probably just save that one for last you know.
Speaker 1 (01:45):
And that's but we but we didn't.
Speaker 4 (01:48):
We'll start on a nice, warm fuzzy. Okay, we'll start
on a nice warm fuzzy.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
The next comment here, I think it says, unfortunately, most
guests don't even pay attention to the ride safety signage
when they enter the queue.
Speaker 1 (02:00):
That's true.
Speaker 4 (02:01):
Well, and keep in.
Speaker 3 (02:02):
Mind, keep in mind this is in comment to This
is a comment about last week's Showhere, we talked quite
a bit about the tragedy that happened at at Epic
Universe on roller coasters STARTUS racers. So that's where these comments.
Just to give you a frame of reference, that's kind
of where these comments are coming from. And you're absolutely right,
(02:22):
Philip and whoever made this comment. Uh, this is one
of those situations where people are so cavalier, especially in
the United States. It's less true in other countries, well,
some other countries, and more true in some other countries
as well, at least based anecdotally on my experience. But
the idea is that you're right.
Speaker 4 (02:45):
They don't read.
Speaker 3 (02:46):
It's just like we don't read all the warnings on
medication that we are taking. It's very rare conditions. Yeah,
how often do we just click yes, I accept? And
it could have you could have just given up your
first born. I mean you have because you never read it.
You have no idea. I will say though, that the
(03:06):
it's kind of a weird double edged sword to me
because that means that you're right, we just don't have
time to read it. We're just going to write it,
and we're going to write it whether it tells us,
you know, we might lose a limb or not.
Speaker 4 (03:16):
We're just going to write it.
Speaker 3 (03:17):
And at the same time, it is nice that the industry.
Speaker 4 (03:23):
Is so powerful and so.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
Really safe that most people don't feel the need to
dive into all the challenges. They don't, you know, recognize
that a coaster can hurt you, so therefore they choose
not to read it. There has to be a point, though,
where somebody takes some sort of personal responsibility for themselves
based on what their abilities are.
Speaker 4 (03:47):
As a person.
Speaker 3 (03:48):
You know, for example, if there is anything that is
remarkably tighteror claustrophobic as a bigger guy, I'm not going
to do it because I'm not going to be comfortable.
I might get hurt, and I'm going to take that
responsibility on myself.
Speaker 4 (04:01):
I'm not going to.
Speaker 3 (04:01):
Make the theme park attraction builders in essence homogenize everything
or dumb everything down so that everybody and their dog.
Speaker 4 (04:11):
Can ride it.
Speaker 3 (04:12):
Now that doesn't mean I'm not all for accessibility, but
I think there are reasonable I think it's a reasonable
a little bit of reasonable wiggle room there. There are
certain things that I can't ride because of my height,
at my height and my combined weight, so but at
the same time, it doesn't matter because nobody reads them anyway,
(04:35):
So what can we do? I mean, we obviously have
to design to the best of our ability, based on
the information that we have, based on best practices, based
on the laws, based on the regulations, based on based
on based on and then hope that people make good
choices on their own.
Speaker 4 (04:54):
Yeah. I don't know what else to say.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
Yeah, well, the this is, this is I don't want
to say it's a uniquely American problem, but it's definitely
different in America.
Speaker 1 (05:05):
I think for any international listeners.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
It just it works differently here because so much of
what we rely to correct behavior is from litigation.
Speaker 1 (05:15):
So it's it's it, you know, well, but but a.
Speaker 3 (05:18):
Lot of the bottom line here in the US, we
are far more interested in punishment than than we are
in finding a solution.
Speaker 2 (05:23):
Yes, yeah, that's that's exactly it. Yeah, we're way more
interested in corrective kind of after the.
Speaker 3 (05:30):
Big corporation, bad big corporation, We're going to make you pay.
That's that's much more of the attitude than well, how
could we find a solution to this?
Speaker 1 (05:38):
That's right.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
Like I think inherent in that comment is maybe the opposite,
where like there are things you could do proactively, you know,
to to be more proactive about this, but.
Speaker 1 (05:52):
That's just not how America work.
Speaker 2 (05:55):
Yeah, but yeah, the next comment here is from miss
my Music, and this is a good one. She said,
she or I think she said the spoilation it's safer. Sure,
they said, they said the spoilation of evidence. Argument is dumb.
They could have gone to court and file a TIRO
to stop the ride from reopening. They didn't, probably because
(06:17):
they knew they wouldn't get it, probably because it is
without merit.
Speaker 1 (06:21):
Yeah, yeah, I.
Speaker 4 (06:22):
Mean we didn't.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
I mean we I guess, you know, we didn't want
to bring that up and when we were because we're
just kind of summarizing what the arguments are on both sides.
But I do agree totally with this one hundred percent, Like, well,
it's one.
Speaker 3 (06:35):
Thing to make it part of the story, and it's
another thing to make it a comment on the story.
If we had made it part of the story, it
would have made us seem a bit more callous, which
you know, we started the story by saying, this is
a terrible thing. We're sad that it happened, you know,
are our hearts go out to the friends and family
of the person that was lost. But but this is
(06:57):
a very good point, and that is if they if
this was truly an issue, they could have stopped it.
They could have stopped it through the courts.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
Yep, yep, yep, that's true. All right, those are I
think the ones we wanted to highlight. Just sure, But
thank you for everyone that did comment, and we always
love to see the discussion on there, especially the discussion
there's discussion about maybe a different type of restraint would
have been helpful, or harnesses and all that. There's just
great discussion in the comments and we always appreciate that.
(07:26):
But we shall move on to a story. We're going
to mention only in passing, just because again we're recording
this early.
Speaker 4 (07:36):
Could you choose a different term? Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 2 (07:39):
Could you just use a different phrase. Well, I didn't
mention it. Briefly, I didn't. I didn't realize it until
you pointed out. Okay, So I'm sure everyone listening has
seen the news about the woman who died after writing
these Land's Haunted Mansion holiday this week, and we're recording
(07:59):
this on the ninth, and at the point of this recording,
there's no information about the cause of death. So were
We assume there's gonna be more news out in the
next several days, so probably by the time that you
all are watching this or probably updates have already been
shared about what the cause was, but there wasn't on
cause now. But we are just mentioning it because it
is big news and it is semi related to the
(08:21):
incident that we just talked about last week and that
we just read the comments on.
Speaker 3 (08:25):
So yeah, and I think it's important for us to
mention it just so that you guys who are listening
don't think, my God, was this not that important to them?
It is important to us, and you know, we're very
sorry to hear this. However, at the time of recording, there's.
Speaker 4 (08:37):
Not a whole lot of info.
Speaker 2 (08:38):
So yeah, yeah, Okay, moving on, there we go. Maybe not,
I don't know, there's no way to say it. Okay,
We're just gonna talk about the next story, which is.
Speaker 4 (08:48):
They shouldn't say passing on.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
That's good, Okay, the next story I am so going
to hell. Yep, I'm just gonna comment on that. We're
gonna stay in Disney though, and discuss how they are
raising prices at both Disneyland and in Florida, and this
is the thing that I have seen all over every
Everyone is talking about this as they always do every
(09:11):
time the prices go up, which they always do.
Speaker 1 (09:14):
They never know, they never go down, but they do
continuously raise.
Speaker 2 (09:18):
I think basically, to summarize all of this, it's a
lot of information. To summarize everything. Prices for literally everything
are going up, so prices for the annual passes, prices
for day tickets, prices for parking, and prices for Lightning Lane,
at least in California, the Lightning LaNese that's gowing up.
So now the things that I think are most interesting
(09:38):
that people seem to be for some reason, the stuff
that the that the guests or the theme park fans
are most upset about is the parking in California, which
is going up to forty dollars a day for regular
cars at Disneyland. And I think, what's I think the
reason that's hitting with so many people is that not
all of the annual passes in California cover parking. It's
(10:00):
only the really high level ones, and those ones are
also increasing in price. So the key that the top level,
the Inspired Key, is raising one hundred and fifty dollars,
and that one doesn't include that one includes parking but
not not all the other ones do, and so a
forty dollars charge to drive there, I think is when
(10:21):
you're trying to encourage people to come multiple days, and
that's what's that's why that's a pain point for a
lot of folks. The lightning lane is going up, but
I think that's less It seems to be less of
a pain point, especially because in California there's more pass
holders and they don't tend to use lightning lanes since
they're locals, so that's not as much of an issue.
But the other big stink is the the sticker shock
(10:44):
of the Tier six, which is the high you know,
the most the most I don't know who they visited
or the highest price. That's going to be two hundred
and twenty four, but that's one part per day. So
if you add the park coroper, that talking almost three
hundred dollars for a one day ticket in a Tier
six time, which is the holiday types of seasons. So
(11:06):
I think that's I think, for some reason, these two
seem to be the thing I keep hearing over and over.
It's like it's like the parking, and then it's it's
this item, and then of course the pass is going up.
You know, no one's ever, no one's ever happy about
annual passes going up. But in California at least they didn't.
They kept the cheapest option the same price. So the
(11:29):
parking did go up for that option, obviously, as it
went up for everybody. But the the resident pass, the
lowest level one that's only weekdays. I think it's like Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday,
or Monday or Monday through Thursday, those days that did
not raise in price. So you will pay five dollars
more each time you go for parking, but not that
amount so well, and that kind.
Speaker 3 (11:51):
Of makes sense as to why the highest the highest
tier of single day ticket and the parking. You're what
you're basically doing, is you're looking these are these are
the points of discomfort or the most obvious points of
discomfort for the two.
Speaker 4 (12:05):
Key groups of people.
Speaker 3 (12:07):
It's the locals who have who have passes, and you know,
the passes. They get the passes, so think go multiple
times and now they're paying five dollars more per time,
assuming that they're driving, and the single day ticket is
is tourists who are like, oh, let's go to Disney.
It's what, it's two hundred and what for a single park?
Speaker 1 (12:27):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2 (12:28):
Now it's interesting because when I'm seeing here, looking at everything,
I'm obviously way more focused on the California one because
that's my home park, even though I'm in Detroit right now,
but that's my home home park. It seems like in
Florida they have not I don't see prices for the
day passes going up very much. It's mostly the annual
(12:51):
passes in Florida as well that have changed.
Speaker 3 (12:55):
So there's more hotels here. Yeah, so more hotels, I
mean they want again, Disney has a much larger pass
base in California. That's right, That's right, exactly, It's it's
just it's all interesting. So basically what we're looking at
(13:16):
is Disney raising the prices for the annual passes on
both coasts, and then one day ticket and parking are
up at California in California, and I think that all
tracks just because of what you just said. I mean,
we know that California has much more, much more pass base,
and so for them, it's basically you're trying to get
a little bit more out of the pass holder. I
guess because the parking price is a little bit up,
(13:37):
and then the passes are up, so you're getting a
little bit more from them. But then the one day
ticket prices are also up, so when you're bringing people
that are visiting for the holidays or whatever, you're going
to pay more for those tickets and then visitors. So
I think, I'm not sure.
Speaker 2 (13:55):
I mean, we talk about this every time there, and
I think it's where we're always having the same argument.
I to me, this this looks like again that they
are just trying to temper demand that the parks are
still full enough in California where they don't need to
really where they're they're just trying I mean again when
(14:16):
basically this is impacting every every group, whether it's a
visitor group or it's the local group. And that that
I mean, the only answer is they're trying to temper
demand a little bit with that. Now that of course,
whenever you say that, then you hear I hear so
many people that say that we that attendance in the
parks is down, and I guess to that point, there
(14:38):
is there is an offer that they have for locals,
that is for this next few months where you can
get a three day pass for two hundred and forty
nine dollars, But that's only on sale December third, and
it's only valid starting from from January to May. So
that seems more like a gimme to make people not
as upset, you know, then it does other items, but
(15:03):
but I.
Speaker 4 (15:04):
Don't know, Well, it could be.
Speaker 3 (15:07):
It could be any who knows, quite honestly, but it
could be. Let's just throw some ideas out there.
Speaker 4 (15:12):
You know.
Speaker 3 (15:12):
You say that it is to temper demand, which would
have been my first guess too. But if attendance is down,
then maybe it's to make up for the lack of
ticket sales, so they have to make sure that the
gate per cap remains constant as opposed to fluctuating down.
(15:32):
Or I mean, this is going to sound crazy, but
it may be something as simple as they have to do
everything they can to make up for all the Disney
Plus subscriptions that they lost during the Jimmy Kimmel incident.
So yep, that's a possibility too. All of these may
be crazy. I admit that none of them. I'm not
reporting any of these as fact. I do not know,
but there's a lot of things that could come into
(15:54):
play here.
Speaker 2 (15:56):
It is just interesting because I think the optics right
now don't look great, right, the optics of just having
the Jimmy Kimmel nonsense and then all of the you know,
toxic boycotts for that, and then you jump right into well,
now we're going to make it more expensive, and especially
targeting the most rabid fans on both coasts and then
on on California, you're just kind of targeting everybody. So
(16:18):
it does make it seem a lot more like that
walled garden idea, you know that that we talk about
a lot where it's it's kind of becoming I mean,
it's it's even and do.
Speaker 3 (16:29):
You still have to do reservations in California.
Speaker 2 (16:32):
Yeah, so we step through reservations and then also that
top pass that you that which is now going to
be ninety nine, so basically nineteen hundred dollars, and that's
a twelve month pass. That's a twelve month pass. It's
a magic key for nineteen hundred dollars. It does include parking,
but it still has blackout dates and you have to make.
Speaker 3 (16:54):
Reservations blackout dates, and you still have to make reservations.
Speaker 2 (16:57):
And you can only hold six at a time for
a year, right, and so yeah, and so again I
don't know. I mean, I guess you know, again I hear.
I get so many feedback from listeners and for people
who text me the Private League or whatever, and they
always say, you know, the attendance is down at Universal
(17:18):
and it's down at Disney, and everyone's panicking. I'm like, well, like, again,
the parks are not releasing these numbers right yet or
right now. We don't have them yet, and it's always
a rolling quarter, right, so it takes a while for
us to see them ahead of time. But I would
say that this type of raising prices seems to me
(17:42):
like they don't think they have an attendance problem, or
maybe they're okay with the dip, like Scott said, they're
okay with the dip in attendance because if you have
a dip, that means you can relax some of your
staffing and if you get more per person, then maybe
it's a better equilibrium for them going forward into twenty
twenty six. Because also, as we've talked about on the
(18:02):
show in the past, twenty twenty six is not shaping
up to be a great year because there's nothing happening.
Nothing new really is opening at any of these parks
in the US. So maybe it's maybe they're just trying
to tamp and demand so they can adjust staffing because
they know that it's going to be a somewhat slower year.
Speaker 1 (18:20):
I don't know, this is who knows.
Speaker 3 (18:22):
Yeah, there's a million different reasons that these could happen.
But again, that's what this show is all about to
get us talking about what could those reasons be and
how do they apply to our attraction or our.
Speaker 4 (18:31):
Little corner of the industry.
Speaker 3 (18:32):
So ask those questions with whoever you're working with and see,
you know, how they would have handled the situation or what,
more accurately, what a price increase like this would have
meant to your attraction? You know, does it mean that
you are trying to curb curb attendance? Does it mean
you are trying to make up for a loss of attendance?
(18:53):
Is it simply a money grab because you've lost something
else in another area of the company. I mean to
be any of these things. I think the bottom line
is we are if I'm going to if I'm going
to just share a radical out there opinion. I think
this is just another nail in the coffin of the
giant theme park. I think it's going to get to
(19:15):
a point where it will only be for the elite rich.
And once it becomes only for the elite rich, then
it won't become it won't be palatable really for anybody,
because even the elite rich like to do the things
that are cool and new and funky, and those are
usually discovered by anyone but the elite rich and then
co opted by the elite rich. So I think that
(19:37):
this is a dangerous as a slippery slope that we're
on right now, and we will see, we will see
where it ends up.
Speaker 4 (19:45):
I don't know for sure, yep.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
I yeah, I definitely can see that argument, like I said,
and especially it being so close to home for me.
I just you know, it's I always think about when
we're making these calculations with friends. Know if it basically
it does become exactly what you're talking about, because I
have my friends that I know have passes, and you're
kind of all relying on the whole group having the
(20:08):
pass because you just can't afford even when my family's visiting.
You know, it's so much money, or if you're trying
to take a partner with you, it doesn't have a
a path. It's oh my god, a ticket like it's
it's it's so.
Speaker 3 (20:22):
It's crazy to even get a reservation.
Speaker 2 (20:25):
That's right, Yeah, it's crazy. It's becoming crazy. And so
you're I think you're right on the right about that.
And also it is pulling ahead significantly. You know, from
the other theme parks in the region. It's so much
more expensive to go to Disneyland is to go to
the competition.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
So uh well, and throughout history, throughout the history, at
least my my history in the in the industry, Disney
has always led the prime price hike lead. They've always
taken the lead on that, and the moment they do it,
then within usually within.
Speaker 4 (20:57):
Six months of the latest parks follow suit.
Speaker 3 (21:01):
But they wait to see how Disney fares, and they figure, well,
if Disney can make good, they're not really at risk
because they're Disney.
Speaker 4 (21:08):
You know. That's the way it's always been.
Speaker 3 (21:10):
I don't think it's gonna be the case much longer,
but that's the way.
Speaker 4 (21:13):
It's always been.
Speaker 1 (21:13):
So we'll see, Yes, there was a.
Speaker 2 (21:21):
We were not scheduled to talk about this, but I'm
just gonna put this out there as a just a
totally random thing. So I was listening to I listened
to several economic podcasts and I read a bunch of
I just read a bunch of random suff and whatever.
Speaker 1 (21:33):
And there's this like.
Speaker 2 (21:33):
Theory and that's been rolling around in the business circles,
in the economic circles about how Netflix should buy Disney.
Interesting and stuff like this makes me think that basically,
if it's like you say, another nail in the coffin
and they're kind of like, you know, there, it's becoming
more difficult for that, it actually potentially could make them
(21:54):
more viable as a as a purchasing you know, but
especially someone like Netflix, who right now now Netflix has
a fifty times earnings, which is absolutely bonkers. And it's
just it's interesting because again you just think about, there's
something new at the parks, and Disney's IP recently has
not been doing great, and then.
Speaker 3 (22:13):
You look at it as a Disney stockholder. Disney Stock's
not doing great.
Speaker 2 (22:16):
So yeah, so all these indicators you're like, eh, and
then you look at Netflix and you're like, Netflix, right now,
is that fifty times earnings? Which I think is overvalued,
just especially because of AI and because of all the competitors.
But you know, what they do have is the strong
ips like Wednesday, they have the one piece stuff.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
Now they're licensing that, they have K.
Speaker 2 (22:36):
Pop Dema Hunters, which is everywhere and going insane, and
they're experimenting with the Netflix houses. So I don't know,
could could be, could be time, you know for this acquisition.
And also how crazy is it that we're in a
position where we're like Netflix is now like so big,
and they're so to me. Netflix is still a new
company right in my brain. They're just like Facebook is
(22:58):
new in my brain, even though it's even though the
but these new, relatively new companies have shaped so much
of our lives now where you know, Disney, that's a
much older company, is just worth less than half of Netflix.
Speaker 4 (23:12):
So yep, even.
Speaker 2 (23:16):
With Disney, plus they could bundle it all together. Can
you imagine just bundling everything together Cable again? Yeah, and
then tap Hop Demon Hunter is the ride?
Speaker 3 (23:25):
Oh yeah, well, I mean there is. You know that
it's just sort of chomping at the bit for so
many of the ips that they hold. Yep, you know,
great British Baking show, the ride. I mean, god knows,
it could be anything. Yeah, it could be incredible.
Speaker 4 (23:41):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (23:41):
But anyway, last data point two is just which in
the economic circle is just to your to Scott's point
about the elite thing, the top ten. We have some
numbers that came out this last month that I talked
about in a different show, but basically it's relevant here
because the top ten percent of earners are driving fifty
percent of the economy in the US, and so that
(24:03):
kind of so I mean, if again, if Disney is
just like Star Cruiser, I feel like we're back to
Star Cruise and we're back to what we talked about
with the Horror Unleashed And they're almost three thousand dollars
VIP package. If you're if that is the game where
you're targeting the top ten percent that have the money,
than great. But then the question is is it sustainable?
(24:23):
Who knows?
Speaker 4 (24:24):
You know?
Speaker 1 (24:24):
Is that enough you know?
Speaker 2 (24:25):
Or do they do they want to go to Scott's point,
do they want to go to the theme parks?
Speaker 1 (24:29):
When when it's just that I don't know.
Speaker 3 (24:31):
And anecdotally, more and more of the new projects that
I'm being contacted to excuse me to it bids in
on or you know, to attempt to sign sign contracts
with more and more of them are what I will
call smaller attractions with very deep pockets. So basically, what's
(24:52):
happening from from my perspective, and I'm looking forward and
I'm guessing, I will be honest, I'm guessing, but it.
Speaker 4 (24:59):
Appears as though.
Speaker 3 (25:01):
We are we are gonna enter into what i'll, for
lack of a better description, the the fec on steroids concept.
So with things like the Netflix Netflix, the Netflix House,
at Las nine, the Theses, other world haunted houses and FECs.
(25:30):
I mean, there's even FECs out there that are looking
to up their game. They are in prime locations and
they're looking to find ways to start playing in the
theme detraction industry as opposed to just buying some games
and some you know, trampolines with neon lights and and
open their doors and then you go to places like
(25:50):
you go to places like Saudi or or even u Ae,
and they're in every mall there is, you know, and
there's multiples in every mall. So it is continuing to
at least from my perspective, it appears to be skewing
smaller because it's affordable, it's repeatable, it's stuff that gives
people something to do rather than just look at there's
(26:13):
a lot there's a lot of elements that are kind of,
you know, perfect storming themselves into into leading people away
from the giant parks.
Speaker 1 (26:23):
That's interesting.
Speaker 2 (26:24):
Exactly what you said is reminding me to something else
I've heard a lot recently, which is people saying that
you have much more, it's much easier to make money
or or I guess the future is going to be
in making stuff for a smaller screen. So like the
smaller the smaller the screen you're making something for, the
more likely you're going to be able to make a
(26:45):
living off of it. So as in like again, like
the movies are becoming the more like elite thing that
like who even has the money the budget for movies
anymore or any of that even to go to movies
or any of those that whole thing, And then versus
you know, if you're just doing like us a podcast,
or you're doing something that's intended for a small screen,
your TikTok's or whatever, it's a much more sustainable and
(27:07):
much more money in that. So interesting, it feels also
like there's several parallel forces here happening.
Speaker 3 (27:15):
Yeah, I think it's I think, and I think what's
going to happen, unfortunately is the people that have if it,
let's assume, just for a hot second, let's assume that
it is. It is the intent of the parks to
start catering to a higher and higher income audience. It's
going to get to a point where instead of wanting
(27:37):
to go to instead of wanting to go to Italy
in Epcot, it's going to be more cost effective and
more interesting to go to Italy.
Speaker 1 (27:47):
That's right. So I always think that's always the danger.
But that's just me. But you know, I don't know.
Speaker 4 (27:53):
I think so too. I think so too.
Speaker 3 (27:56):
Which is I think why we've seen over the last
few years, especially here in Florida with Epcot, you've seen
more and more integration of the Disney held ips. You know, yes,
you can go to you can go to Norway, but
you can't ride the Frozen ride there, you know.
Speaker 2 (28:12):
But then then to your point, though, I mean, to
exactly your point about the FEC expansion, right, the Netflix
Haus is a great example. I mean, they're doing the
k pop DMA Hunter thing there and they have a
Wednesday exhibit and a one piece exhibit. If you care
about those ips more than you care about Frozen, then
you're going to go there. You're go to Disney, that's right,
and it's going to be cheaper and you have to
pay to walk in. You only have to pay to
do the activity.
Speaker 4 (28:33):
Right, there's not like a car card do You don't
even have to pay the park.
Speaker 1 (28:35):
Yeah, it's all my god, Yeah, that's crazy.
Speaker 4 (28:37):
It's take king a pressure mall.
Speaker 3 (28:38):
So you know you park in the in the mall
parking lot.
Speaker 4 (28:42):
Done easy again.
Speaker 3 (28:45):
If here's the takeaway from from my perspective, there are
parks are adding more and more and more and more
and more hurdles you have to jump through before you
can even get in. Yep, take a moment to refresh
and look at how your organization runs and see what
you can see how you can reduce the friction for
the guest to actually put set foot into your parks.
(29:07):
It may mean that you change your ticketing system. It
may mean that you know, instead of offering fifteen different levels,
you offer one or two and then once they get
inside you can upcharge from there. There are disadvantages to
that as well. But I think the big players, many
of the big players, are making it more and more
difficult to actually get into the park. And I'll give
(29:28):
you a perfect example, and this is something that they
do for safety, and I get it, but I don't
want to go to Horrnites in Florida because getting in
takes longer than pretty much any of the cues for
any of the haunts. It's a it's a one level
after another level after another level, and it's it's difficult,
(29:49):
it's uncomfortable, it feels disorganized. I know it's not, but
it feels disorganized and for some people it even feels invasive.
So my first impression of the event.
Speaker 4 (30:01):
Is not a good one. And what do we remember
first and last impressions?
Speaker 3 (30:05):
So anyway, my takeaway from today would be evaluate what
your what your entry is, and what are all the
points of friction for your guests. But we can't talk
about entry points anymore because it's time for our exit
strategy because we're over time already. So we talked about
a lot and again we love starting with your comments,
so please continue to comment. Also, please, if you are
(30:28):
enjoying what you're seeing, please subscribe.
Speaker 2 (30:30):
Subscribers, yes, please, do need those subscribers.
Speaker 3 (30:34):
We need those subscribers, please just please just click on subscribe.
Speaker 4 (30:38):
And other than that, we hope you guys get some takeaway.
Speaker 3 (30:41):
We hope you guys find value, and we will see
all of you, each and every one of you plus
some next week
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