Best Team Futures for the 2025 NFL Season

HELLO WORLD!

The Collective is back to offer up their favorite team futures for the 2025 NFL Season.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:08):
Oh, and welcome back to Great Iirirn Cambell, the only
podcast to put this money where it's mouth is. I'm
your host, rich Ron, and I'm joined by the entire collective,
The Disciple, Brett Colson, Donnie DP Peters, and the Resident

(00:29):
moves himself mo Nowara. If you were watching this on YouTube,
please like the video and subscribe to the channel. Got
some fresh new graphics for you guys this year to
want everybody to enjoy those listeners, Rate and review on
your Podcatcher of choice five stars only like a man
dealing with a bulging disc here in southern California. Matthew Stafford, boys,

(00:56):
it is great to be back.

Speaker 2 (00:58):
Great to be back talking. I'll be honest. One of
the joys of the entire football season is being able
to sit down with you guys once a week talkball, banter, laugh,
and I am very grateful that this is season eleven
where we get to do this. We have an amazing
community in the discord bit dot ly slash discord Mooths.

(01:21):
If you want to get involved, we're having our very
friendly pick five of our own if you want to
join and splash the pot a little bit, but just
very excited to be able to chat with you folks
and talk some football. And Mo, I'm just as worried
as you. Everybody sends me their picks beforehand. They don't

(01:41):
know any of the picks. I know. I need to
organize the show and there are a lot of team
futures that I'm looking at for this week of the
podcast to kick off the season. MO, I'm not seeing
a lot of disagreement, which I don't know if that's
a good thing or a bad thing.

Speaker 3 (01:57):
It's bad for entertainment value. Hopefully it's good for pick value.

Speaker 2 (02:01):
Right, that's right. We this show is is probably that
it's at its peak when we're calling each other idiots,
at least I'm calling Bible idiots. But hopefully for our wallets,
this is a successful show because Yeah, outside of the
the AFC East, which there are some surprises in, there's

(02:25):
a lot of agreeing here. There's some non correlation here
at the top, but there's not any direct disagreement. And
let's start right off the top where there's a ton
of optimism from the collective on a team in the
NFC North. I was surprised to look back at some

(02:48):
of the team figures from last year and see that
the Green Bay Packers finished third in total DVOA finished
fourth in offense. EPA and Moe and Brett are definitely
back on the Lafloor train, nobody as much as Brett,

(03:09):
who likes them not only to win one of the
toughest divisions in football.

Speaker 1 (03:14):
But Brett thinks they're going to be hoisted the LOBARTI
at least at their price.

Speaker 4 (03:19):
Yeah, this is price price price. I'd like them to
win the Super Bowl last year too. I fell in
love with the Packers last year. I liked them to
upset the Eagles in the first round of the playoffs,
which obviously did not happen. But they were in that game.
They had a shot.

Speaker 3 (03:32):
No, they could have been in the game if there
was any consistency in the way fumbles were being treated
in that game. But yeah, none of my business, I guess.

Speaker 4 (03:43):
Yeah, yeah, but they they played, They could have played
with the Eagles. They did play with the Eagles. They
they matched up well with the Eagles. I felt like
this was the top three to four teams certainly in
the NFC. Metrics had them as a top three team
in the entire NFL but they didn't deserve the seventh
seed that they were given. Had to face the Eagles
in Philly. Relatively off quiet offseason for the Packers, but

(04:05):
I don't see that as a bad thing with a
team that's on the rise. You know, they got rid
of a huge distraction in JayR Alexander, great football player,
horrendous locker room guy. That might be a plus overall
because they picked up Nate Hobbs and as a slot corner,
they brought back Razila Douglas. I think the big addition
is came in the draft with Matthew Golden. I think

(04:26):
the one thing that really set them back in the
playoffs last year was the fact that they had nobody
who could separate and catch passes. That was the noticeable
difference between the Packers and the Eagles to me, was
that they just didn't have the weapons for Jordan Love,
and I think Golden gives them that guy. You can
stretch the field now and make plays. So yeah, I
love Green Bay. With the NFC North wide open, I

(04:47):
don't see a clear runaway favorite. So at plus two
seventy five, I liked them to the division, and yet
at twenty two hundred, I like the movement at Super
Bowl as well. I think they could be right there
with anybody in the NFL this year.

Speaker 2 (04:58):
So you'll see as our our show is laid out,
we're going to start with some NFC teams, and generally,
I believe the sentiment amongst us is you have this
trio of teams in the AFC with the Bills, Chiefs,
and Ravens that are kind of sucking the value out
of everything, because it would be a pretty shocking outcome

(05:18):
for any team not named one of those three to
represent the AFC in the Super Bowl. Whereas in the
NFC you've got the Eagles, who obviously returning champions, and
then a wide open field as to who can challenge
them for the conference and then win divisions outside of

(05:39):
the NFC East. So I think you're going to see
a lot of strong opinions from US with regards to
the NFC and MO, how about you pile on you too,
like the Packers to win the division.

Speaker 3 (05:49):
Yeah, plus two fifty I think is really good. I
don't understand why there's a big difference between the Packers
and the Lions. It's not like the biggest difference ever,
Like the Lions are around plus one fifty, but I
still think these teams should basically be dead even to
be honest, I mean, I just have major question marks
about basically all the other teams in the in the division.

(06:12):
I think with the Lions just we know it's the coaching,
but also I think interior offensive line big question mark
there this year. And their schedule is insane. So you
see what the Packers are dealing with in the cross matches,
and it's the Broncos, Cardinals, and Panthers. Is their different

(06:32):
teams that they face compared to the Lions facing the Rams, Chiefs,
and Bucks. So that's that's pretty massive. Like the Packers
still have a pretty tough schedule, like you basically have
to have a tough schedule when you play in that division,
but those cross match differences are pretty huge in favor
of the Packers, so that that's a big differentiator. And

(06:54):
I just like how deep this team is. You just
look at it up and down. They have depth on
the offensive line with literally a first round pick last
year it is listed is on the second team. We
know how many receivers they have. Even some of the
on defense. I don't mind some of the defenders they
have that are in the second second line. And my

(07:17):
main question on the defense is the defensive backs. That's
kind of the main weakness I'm seeing outside of McKinney.
I don't like these defensive backs very much. The corners
especially aren't very good. I will say, unlike Brett. Maybe
I don't know how Brett feels about you're going to
his next team, because maybe it's just a Packers thing
for him. Maybe it's just the relationship got rotten. I

(07:39):
think he's an insane value at one year ten million
for the Ravens, but I understand why the Packers were
sick of him, So I'm not going to dig them
too hard for letting him walk.

Speaker 2 (07:50):
One of the positives to what Brett was saying, where
the Packers don't have that alpha receiver now adding Matthew Golden,
is they just have so much depth at that position
that they can deal with an injury, which they are
right now with Jayden Reid walking around in a walking boot.
So they just have so much depth. That's such an
important position that even though they might not have that

(08:11):
number one standout, there's so many weapons for Laflur and
Love to work with. Let's keep it correlated because DP
is afraid of the brain drain in Detroit Motor City,
and he is laddering the hunders for those Detroit Lions.

Speaker 5 (08:29):
Yeah, I mean, I'm definitely scared of losing both coordinators.

Speaker 1 (08:35):
Mo.

Speaker 5 (08:36):
You mentioned the interior offensive line too. I mean, rag
Now is a beast. That's a big conduit to what
happens on the offensive line. So some question marks there
as in terms of how that fits. I took under
seven and a half. I took under eight and a half,
I took them to miss the playoffs the Lions. I
just think if this goes south, it could go south
pretty bad. So I'll bet on that downside as opposed

(08:59):
to just, you know, taking neander on whatever their the
regular win total is. So I just think there's a
lot of question marks and maybe I'm wrong there. Maybe
this team is just too good from a talent perspective,
and they're gonna be able to figure things out with
these new coordinators. But yeah, I know, at times we've
all kind of jokingly both loved and hated Dan Campbell,
you know, I mean, like I don't I think we

(09:20):
love the fact that he's just an absolute bull in
a China Shop, but we like kind of hate him
as an idiot head coach in a.

Speaker 6 (09:27):
Lot of ways.

Speaker 5 (09:27):
So like that, what if that just all falls apart
with new coordinators? And I could just see going really
really bad in Detroit. And I mean not that I
necessarily think it's gonna last, you know. I think that
they'll probably land on their feet when they find a
coaching staff and whatnot. Maybe that's a one year thing,
maybe it's not. But for this year, yeah, I think
it could go pretty bad.

Speaker 2 (09:47):
I think we're gonna know fairly quickly what a John
Morton is with regards to the offense in aren't you
supposed to know?

Speaker 3 (09:56):
Well?

Speaker 2 (09:56):
I was just about to get to it. This guy
has a very interesting track record in the NFL. Of course,
had a cup of coffee with the New York Jets
in twenty seventeen. Then he fell off the face of
the earth for two years, just didn't coach football. Came back,
was an assistant with the Raiders, then an assistant with
the Lions, and then was the pass game coordinated the

(10:18):
last two years under Sean Payton in Denver. So I
mean he's very much a journeyman. Doesn't have a ton
of pedigree in this league, and with Tanner engstreng gone,
who seemed like he was the next man up. It
was very intentional that they skipped end strength for somebody
outside of the organization. So I'm very curious to see

(10:39):
how that worked out. Where I will give Dan Campbell
some flowers is when they pulled the plug on the
offense initially and ended up going with Ben Johnson. That
was a Dan Campbell move. Dan Campbell saw that the
offense wasn't working, got directly involved, made the change to
Ben Johnson. So can he get his hands dirty again

(11:00):
and have a positive impact on the offense again. Perhaps
they have so much talent on that side of the
ball that it would not surprise me if they kept
it rolling. But I am I'm very dubious of what's
going to happen with this team losing both of their coordinators,
especially with the market respecting Ben Jonson so much in Chicago.

(11:21):
All Right, a little bit of non correlation sticking with you, DP,
you're betting another ladder and you're betting the Vikings wins ladder,
leaning in to JJ McCarthy.

Speaker 5 (11:32):
Yeah, I'll be the first to tell you that the
JJ McCarthy eraic could go entirely wrong. He's a big
freaking question mark. That said, I mean that offensive line
I think is still going to be very good. Kevin O'Connell,
I think is very good, especially with quarterbacks.

Speaker 3 (11:48):
I like the.

Speaker 5 (11:48):
Defensive side of the ball, you know. I think the
Lions can certainly have the potential as I just laid
out to take a step back, and I think the
Vikings can still be pretty darn decent. I don't totally
hate where the other guys are on with the Packers.
I kind of like them too as well, But just
looking at the different ladder options, I was getting a

(12:09):
better price on the Vikings, so I said, you know what,
this is where I'm gonna stick my money. So yeah,
I just think this division is kind of wide open,
but I think it's gonna be between the Vikings and
the Packers at the end of the day. And I
like the price that I'm getting on the Vikings. So
JJ McCarthy, please don't f this up, man, please.

Speaker 2 (12:27):
After watching what KOs did last year, it's hard for
me to denigrate any positive bets or anything in their direction.
But I am the justin Jefferson comments about McCarthy have
me a little worried him coming out and saying it's
gonna take time. That's like the most the nicest receiver

(12:50):
thing that he could have said, is it's gonna take time.
It's again. I think we'll know fairly quickly with how
well they were able to operate last year with a
suboptimal quarterback in Darnold, I think we'll know fairly quickly
whether or not McCarthy has the goods. All right, let's
move South, Mo. We're going to take the lead here

(13:11):
as you like Michael Pennix and the Atlanta Falcons to
not only go over their win total, but at the
price of two fifty to win the NFC South.

Speaker 3 (13:23):
Yeah, and actually, you know, we're not going to go
over any more Super Bowl stuff, I guess. But if
you made me pick one Super Bowl future, it would
probably be Falcons eighty to one. I mean, it would
either be Falcons or Chiefs. I mean, I just think
they're they're live. I mean, a lot of teams are
live in the NFC, and this team's eighty to one,
which seems crazy to me when you know I could
easily see a path to ten eleven wins here. And

(13:46):
then you know, who knows what can happen when you
don't have to face Josh Allen, Patrick Mahomes and Lamar
Jackson in the playoffs until the.

Speaker 6 (13:53):
Very last game.

Speaker 2 (13:54):
Right.

Speaker 3 (13:54):
So I just look at this Falcons team and yeah,
did they do something crazy and likely overpay for trying
to shore up their pass rush?

Speaker 2 (14:03):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (14:03):
I mean that's a future Falcons problem, though that's not
a twenty twenty five Falcons problem that's likely to help
them this year. So we know how bad the defense
was last year. But I still think there's some players here.
I thought Jesse Bates has been a tremendous player ever
since they signed him. He's delivered every dollar of value
that they paid him. So they still have you know,

(14:24):
aj Terrell. So if they can get something like league
average play up front, then I think this offense can
can carry them across the finish line the rest of
the way as far as getting over their win total.

Speaker 6 (14:39):
And you know, they're.

Speaker 3 (14:42):
The divisional future, which is plus two fifty. The Bucks,
I think are slightly more talented than the Falcons, but
the price difference is big enough that I think the
Falcons are the play here. I this offense is one
of the better offenses in the NFL, and it's basically
coming back into hacked everything besides the center, I believe,

(15:03):
and yes he was good, but I think there's still
enough on this offensive line that it should still be
one of the better units. And one thing that's nice
when you're betting a win total over here is there's
no team more insulated from a quarterback injury, at least
until Slash unless they trade Kirk Cousins and the Atlanta Falcons,
they have the best quarter the best backup quarterback in

(15:24):
the NFL. I thought Panic looked, Panics looked good Man.
I didn't think a lot of him coming out of
the draft, but very strong arm, and I thought he
looked pretty comfortable in the pro game. So I'm cautiously
optimistic there. And the Bucks already dealing with obviously Tristan

(15:45):
Wurf's being hurt, and also just having a very thin
team in general. I think the potential for Baker regression,
losing their offensive coordinator, there's definitely some question marks there. Obviously,
the Saints probably the worst team in the NFL, and
then the Panthers are probably still at least another year away.
So the way is definitely clear for the Falcons.

Speaker 5 (16:05):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (16:06):
I thought the coaching staff did a pretty good job
last year, and considering everything they were dealing with. UH,
with Kirk Cousins, how bad he was, I thought they
did their best. And I think I'm still willing to
give this this staff a chance. Rahie Morris, I thought,
I thought he's done okay. So I don't like to
bet on coaches that I don't believe in, but I

(16:27):
don't like believe in this staff. But I don't not
believe in this staff either, So I think there's enough
talent on this team. The biggest problem when I look
at this team honestly is I think they're one injury
away from absolute death. And that's if Drake London got hurt.
They're they're so thin at pass catcher that I just
do not think they could survive a Drake London injury.

(16:48):
But he's been a tank so far, so hopefully that
continues here.

Speaker 6 (16:52):
It's not this isn't the year, this isn't the Kyle
Pits here. It's not happening.

Speaker 3 (16:56):
I've been sending those memes to some people and just
like cause and then and then and then I get
fed more Kyle Pitts memes by the algorithm, so I
get all the Kyle Pitts memes. And because the memes
have become self aware, when what's his name, Pennix went
into the presser and was like, we're getting Kyle Pitts
the ball this year, and then he just started laughing.
You know, the memes have become self aware. It's embarrassing.

Speaker 2 (17:17):
Brett, you laugh, but you too, like the Falcons at
this price to win the NFC shout.

Speaker 4 (17:22):
Yeah, it was right. This offense could just be great.
It was defined last year. Their offense was defined by turnovers.
I mean it was just Cousins throwing the ball all
over the place and handing games away in the second half,
which was super frustrating when you had them.

Speaker 3 (17:37):
Do you remember that Chargers game?

Speaker 6 (17:38):
Oh my god, here's.

Speaker 2 (17:40):
The thing about the Kirk Cousins. I don't know if
you guys watched Quarterback on Netflix, do you guys remember
them disclosing that Kirk Cousins had an elbow injury or
shoulder injury last year. Like we all thought that he
was losing velocity because he wasn't able to push off
off the achilles but in like we I don't know.
Early in the season, he got wrecked on his shoulder

(18:01):
and that's why he couldn't throw the ball. Like in practice,
he had no velocity on his throws, and they just
didn't disclose it.

Speaker 5 (18:10):
You could tell in quarterback that he legitly could not
move his arm.

Speaker 2 (18:13):
He literally could not throw the football. They could barely
grip the ball.

Speaker 3 (18:19):
Well, velocity isn't a problem for the current starter, so
we have that going for us.

Speaker 2 (18:23):
This is true.

Speaker 6 (18:24):
Yeah, he can throw.

Speaker 4 (18:25):
The man, but yeah, I do like the Fuggins a lot.
I mean, and on the defensive side of the ball too.
I mean, they prioritized pass rushers in the off season.
They brought in Leonard Floyd. They drafted two guys in
the first round, which I think they reached, probably on Piers,
but that should give them a much needed We've been
talking for years about how they can't generate pressure, so

(18:47):
maybe this year they finally will be able to do that.
The schedule is relatively soft. They've got twelve games indoors,
which should benefit this offense that we think could fly
and the Bucks. I mean, at some point, I just
think this team's going to take a step back. Age
is going to catch up with them, and it's several positions,
including wide receiver, and the worst injury is huge. I

(19:09):
don't know how long he's going to be out for.
But they did very little. They have very little to
fix that gap. So I like the Bucks to fall
off this year and I think the Falcons are going
to get it done in the division.

Speaker 2 (19:22):
It also helps that they get to play the New
Orleans Saints twice. And I have to talk about this
Saints team because the trio of Chuck, Rattler and Hainer.
We were talking about this in the discord today. If
you were too Frankenstein these three guys and take their
absolute best qualities and put them together, I still don't

(19:45):
think you get a quarterback that meets the threshold to
play in pro football this team, and we see this
every year going into the season, people are like, Oh,
this team might go winless, this might be this team
legitimately could go oh to seventeen with this offensive output
from the quarterback position. On top of that, they were

(20:09):
twenty seventh in way to defense DVOA last year. They
didn't get any better. All they did was get older.
Were de Mario Davis and Nathan Shepherd are integral pieces
to this Saints defense. In twenty twenty five, Saints alt

(20:29):
under four and a half plus one twenty five. I
mean Saints no playoffs. This is the where else you're
getting ten percent Saints no playoffs minus ten fifty In
what universe is this team making the playoffs? I looked
at it. Every year we look at the NFC South
and some team is just barely squeaking in. Since they

(20:52):
expanded to three playoff teams, no NFC South team has
won a wild card. You either win the division or
you're going to Kenkun come January. So yeah, I get
that it's a pretty hefty price minus one thousand, But.

Speaker 1 (21:12):
I mean this team is gonna be so so. Kellen
Moore like has just been a run of the mill
offensive coordinator the last couple of years. He was handed
the keys to a Ferrari last year in Philadelphia and
all he had to do was drive straight, which he
did successfully. So yeah, this just this just seems like

(21:34):
the season from hell for New Orleans.

Speaker 4 (21:37):
Not that it matters, but who do who do we
think they go with a quarterback in Week one?

Speaker 3 (21:42):
Rattler is a big favorite. I think he's like minus
one point fifty or something.

Speaker 2 (21:46):
I mean, which is terrifying. Like I heard.

Speaker 3 (21:51):
Getting his ass kicked in in practice, so I'm not
hearing anything good there. So sounds like Rattler is going
to be the man. So yeah, I mean, I wish
the same good luck, but I don't think things are
gonna go well. I thought this team was the clear
cut worst team, and I was pretty surprised to see
that that's not.

Speaker 6 (22:09):
Really considered to be the case.

Speaker 3 (22:11):
A lot of people have the Browns like right there
with them, I guess, and the I think the Browns
are like pretty clear favorites for least wins, but that's
also because they have the hardest schedule in the NFL,
so that's not a problem for the Saints, and that's
why their win total is I think actually maybe a
hair higher than the Browns.

Speaker 6 (22:30):
I think it's close.

Speaker 2 (22:32):
Right, Let's move to the NFC West, where I mean,
I think this is the most shocking thing. They came
across my desk where Brett seems to be and they
could be off the top talking about Matthew Stafford and
his bulging disc, which is announcers out there be very

(22:54):
careful enunciating disc Brett loves the Cardinals. I don't oh
hell else to put it. I'm like flabbergas that I
can't can't even string words together. Brett loves theaters and
the Gardinals.

Speaker 4 (23:06):
I think this team's due for a bounce back year
that they were actually.

Speaker 2 (23:10):
Do twenty five for the Cardinals.

Speaker 4 (23:14):
Weren't they kind of good last year? Though they faced
a brutal schedule. Six of their first seven games last
year were against playoff teams, and they fought their way
through that and they won eight games. So this year's
schedule is much friendlier and the offense face is one
of the easier schedules in the league, which I think
is going to really give this this passing offense and

(23:35):
Marvin Harrison especially an opportunity to take a huge leap
this year.

Speaker 6 (23:38):
With McBride and Kyler, I think this.

Speaker 4 (23:41):
Is gonna be one of the better passing offenses in
the NFC this year. And an area of weakness we've
talked about, similar to the Falcons, is that this team
has never been able to rush the passer. But they
invested heavily up front and they added multiple defensive linemen
through the draft free agency. They've got bodies up front
now that should be able to. Finally, he creates some

(24:02):
semblance of a pass rush, which is huge in this
division because all the other quarterbacks in this division are
statues they can't move. So yeah, the Stafford thing is
part of this as well. I think with the back injury,
you have to be concerned he didn't practice again today.
I mean, if he misses time, you're getting Stafford light

(24:22):
in Jimmy G. I've been a Jimmy G guy on
this pod for years as it relates to market perception.
But this guy, he's getting so old and he looks
even older when he steps on the field. So I
think the Rams need Stafford. And I think when you
bake in that injury, it prices in some value on
the Cardinals going into the season. And then on top
of that, we'll talk about Seattle. But I think they're

(24:43):
gonna stink with Darnold in a new regime, and the
forty nine ers don't instill any fear into me anymore
with Purdy in this hodge Podge receiving unit. So yeah,
I like the Cardinals quite a bit. I've got them
in my account over nine and a half wins at
plus one twenty five and then plus four to fifty
on the division. I think is stealing. I don't see

(25:04):
why this team is plus four fifty to win the division.

Speaker 2 (25:07):
I hope Kyler's not a big battlefield guy Battlefield six
and beta. Right now, everyone's super hyped about it. I mean,
I guess you're right. The Cardinals did. They finished tenth
in offense, EPA twelve in total DVOA. I guess I
must have just completely rip van winkled through the entire
Cardinal season. All I remember is Trey McBride getting like

(25:28):
fourteen hundred yards and zero touchdowns and everyone freaking out
about touchdown variant speaking out.

Speaker 3 (25:33):
Of I have an insane rushing attack.

Speaker 5 (25:36):
Yeah, James Connor, I want to check Brett's YouTube history
and see how see how many highlight videos of Kyler
Murray he watched as.

Speaker 2 (25:43):
I don't know. I don't know. I won't to know
how many trade McBride shares he has in Best Ball.
That's what I want to know.

Speaker 6 (25:49):
It's actually not that I am way higher on Bobby Bret.

Speaker 5 (25:51):
Brett should really have to disclose his fantasy impact on
all before any takes are given. He probably has a
crap Ton of Atlanta Felca. I can already tell if you.

Speaker 6 (26:01):
Want to know, they are in the Discord.

Speaker 2 (26:04):
That's right, bit that l y slash discord moose in
the Fantasy channel.

Speaker 3 (26:09):
You know what might you know what makes me ill
when I look at this Cardinals roster. Though, I cover
your ears, Brett, but we're gonna talk kickers. Chad Ryland
is your starting kicker. Come on, man, you can't find
somebody better than Chad Ryland. That's gonna cost them some games.

Speaker 2 (26:26):
He was the worst the Jets. Jets brought in forty
one year old Nick Folk to compete with. I don't
even know that we have some like two hundred and
forty pounds the thicker kicker. This guy is the guy's
house went three for three on Saturday, though, so we'll
see how that goes. Moe kick us off. Brett kind

(26:49):
of alluded to his Hawks negativity and MoU two are aligned.
You both have under seven and a half wins for
Sam Darnold and Seattle.

Speaker 3 (27:01):
I want to first say that I love this defense man.
They could be so good, but as we've seen year
after year, how many examples. Rich knows this very well.
If the offense sucks, sometimes the defense quits. Okay, so
that could be in play here. So I'm looking at

(27:23):
this defense and I'm just very excited for it. But
then i just scroll up to the offense and I'm
horrified because I just see problems everywhere.

Speaker 6 (27:32):
Man, I mean Sam Donald.

Speaker 3 (27:35):
The biggest problem here is that we have Sam Donald
coming off an amazing season in ideal conditions. And now, okay,
if you made me pick between you know, Sam Donald
and Gino Smith on a pure talent level, it's probably
within reason that they're pretty close. But one thing you

(27:56):
can never take away from Gino is that man how
to play football under pressure, and I do not think
Sam Donald does. And that is a skill you are
going to need on this Seattle team. Man, I know
that they invested a first round pick in this lineman.
He's still a rookie. He's still probably going to be
average at best because he's a rookie in pro football

(28:19):
and he's playing on the offensive line and that's very hard, okay.
And then Charles Cross is solid. So that's two maybe
decent pieces, and then the rest of the pieces all
look below par. So you have maybe three bad linemen
and two if everything goes right to like decent above
average linemen, I mean, this should be a bottom five

(28:41):
zero line and I do not think Sam Donald is
going to thrive in that situation. We saw what happened
late in the season when the Rams overwhelmed this offensive line.
Detroit put him under a lot of pressure and he
absolutely crumbled. And then you have a receiving core that
I think is much lower anger on name value than talent.

(29:02):
You have Cooper Cup and Jackson Smith and Jigba, who
both I think need to play in the slot. I mean,
I don't know who's playing outside on this team other
than mvs. And if that's the guy who's playing outside
for you and carrying your water from there, I can
tell you that it's not going to go very well

(29:23):
unless Patrick Mahomes is your quarterback. So yeah, question marks
up and down this offense, and we all know that
offense matters more than defense. I believe this defense is
going to be very good. I believe they are going
to do their damnedest to keep the Seahawks in games.

Speaker 6 (29:38):
But I just don't know how long that's going to last.

Speaker 3 (29:41):
And I don't know if the offense is crumbling, if
we could see another Jets situation where the defense just
folds up shop at some point in the season. So yeah,
give me all the Seattle Hunders. I know ODB is
going to be mad at us for believing in Gino
and not believing in Sam Darnold, but the way that
they are going to operate in these circumstances. I mean,

(30:02):
did anyone watch Sam Howell when he came in against
that Packers speaking of? I was at Odb's and that
was horrifying to watch. Gino might have been the only
guy in the league outside of the like superstars, who
could have kept the Seahawks afoot last year for all
we know.

Speaker 2 (30:17):
First ODB mentioned of the season, congrats on yet another
WSFP bracelet, my guy Brett. I don't know if there's
anything left but uh pylon with this Hawks hunter.

Speaker 4 (30:27):
I mean, really, it's just a bet against Sam Darnold
in a new system, behind a terrible offensive line, probably
a BOT of three offensive line without Kosa holding his hand, Like,
how can you trust that? And like most of the
defense should be very good, but downgrade at quarterback, downgrade
at receiver with Metcalf gone, they bringing Cooper cup And yeah,

(30:47):
the offensive line is not going to be able to protect,
which is a nightmare for a guy who can't move
out of the pocket. So I love the under seven
and a half.

Speaker 2 (30:57):
So this isn't This is just a I just want
to throw out there to close out shop in the
NFC West. Everybody's telling me that Kyle Shannan's a genius,
and everyone is telling me that they've got the easiest
schedule since Kingdom Come. So why are the Niners sixth

(31:18):
I believe in the most wins market at plus twelve hundred,
and why is Kyle Shanahan plus two thousand to win
Coach of the Year. Those things don't really job for me.
So if Shanahan is this genius and this schedule is
that easy, these two should be certainly in play for
this Niners team.

Speaker 6 (31:39):
It sets up very well for him.

Speaker 2 (31:40):
Yeah, and then you get Robert Solovac, who's back in
He Peter principled himself into a position that he just
was not prepared to be in as a head coach.
He's back at defensive coordinator, where I mean there are
guys on this team that he developed, right, Quincy Williams
was off the scrap heap from the Jaguars, Jamian Sherwood,

(32:02):
scrap heat player that he turned these two players into
for Quincy and All Pro player for Sherwood, a guy
worth a second contract. He will be able to develop
the defensive players on San Francisco. So if all these
things I'm being told are true, these two bets are
extremely live and I'm very interested in both of them.

(32:25):
Coach of the Year included because usually they try to
give it to the first year guy or the guy
that took his team further than people had anticipated. But
I think if once again he does it with perty
and somehow finds a way to be the top team
in the NFC, I think people will be all the
way back in on Shanahan as a difference maker, and

(32:48):
he might have an opportunity to win this award.

Speaker 3 (32:51):
I mean, historic was the word used to describe the schedule.
So I did look at it, and it is incredibly soft.

Speaker 2 (32:58):
I mean, you look at the Warren Sharp graft and
it's like there's always outliers on both ends, and it's
like it's in a different stratosphere on the top left,
Like how easy the schedule is, allegedly, So show me
your genius Shanahan, show me you truly are one of
the best, and go out line up these Tomaticans and
knock them over. We'll keep it in the West, but

(33:18):
we'll switch conferences and we'll go to DP. Who is
fading Another iconic coach, this one Jim Harbaugh and the
Los Angeles Chargers taking the under on nine and a
half wins.

Speaker 5 (33:33):
I mean, I'm just kind of over Justin Herbert. To
be honest, I can't. I can't. I can't hear anyone
else tell me how great this guy is. I just
I at some point you gotta be elite and make
up for all the other deficiencies around you. I'm sorry.
So I'm done with the freaking excuse making I feel
like this guy is nothing more than Trevor Lawrence. And

(33:54):
we've dumped on Trevor Lawrence a lot recently, so I'm
dumping on Justin Herbert now. So I don't like it.

Speaker 2 (33:59):
Continue you like the under you also like alt unders
on the bolts?

Speaker 3 (34:05):
Yeah, I mean, man, it hurts me to bet against
Justin Herbert. Unlike Donnie, I do still believe in Justin Herbert,
and it hurts me a little bit too. Bet under
on a situation where Harbaugh as the coach, because I
think he does bring probably a decent flour. But I
just think this team got so lucky last year with

(34:26):
their schedule. Man, I was so ready to fade this team.
I think we all were in the playoffs. We all
lined up for Texans plus three. We all know how
that went because the Chargers played a clown schedule. Dude,
this defense had the most absurdly easy set of quarterbacks.
You want to talk about lining up the Tomato Cans.
I don't think this defense is good. I think they're
just decent, and they're gonna have to play a schedule

(34:49):
that actually includes some good quarterbacks this year. I don't
like this defensive line at all. They lost some pretty
key starters there. I think it was a puna. Ford
and and obviously Bosa are out the door. Those are
very good players. This looks like a thin and not
very talented group to me. I looking at the offense,

(35:10):
we know they already took a major blow obviously losing
their left tackle. Well, now that hole is going to
be at right tackle because Joe Alts moving over. But
I still think there's pig holes on this I cannot
believe this team has not found a better tight end
than Will Disley. He was the worst player on the
field last year in that game. I think he's single

(35:33):
handedly caused two of those turnovers. It's incredible to me
that he's still the starter there. And yeah, just like
a second round receiver, you know, Trey Harris from Ole
Miss who knows what's gonna happen there. They need him
to be good right away or this group is going
to be pretty awful. So I just don't think there's
a whole lot around Herbert on that side of the ball.
And yeah, I don't think this deep. I think this

(35:54):
defense was a paper tiger last year. So hey, I'm
just gonna tip my hat if they proved me wrong
and come out and just start dominating people again. But
they played a clown schedule of opposing quarterbacks.

Speaker 2 (36:05):
ODB, get ready to smile my eye, because we not
only have one member of the collective, but two members
of the collective that are bullish on your guy bo
Nicks and we will start with Brett who likes their price. Moe,
cover your ears to win the AFC West.

Speaker 4 (36:30):
I want to get in on Denver before this team
takes that next step, and they already made a huge
step last year. But as you look at this roster,
this has the makings of a team that could compete
in the next couple.

Speaker 6 (36:43):
Years for Super Bowl. I believe that.

Speaker 4 (36:45):
You know, as Kansas City gets older, as these elite
quarterbacks are on the AFC get older, Denver's lurking and
I think they could make some noise, especially in the
regular season this year with the Sleepy Chiefs like they
can't repeat what they did last year, not possible. They
performed at the absolute outlier as far as their regular

(37:06):
season performance last year. I like Denver to end their
streak this season as Casey sleepwalks through the regular season.
Denver schedule is not easy, but they start with a
pretty favorable stretch. I think I saw their favored in
their seven of their first ten games. I love this defense,
ranked number one EPA last season. Front seven talented, They're deep.

(37:28):
They brought in Moe's guy Hufanga. It's safety. They brought
in Gray or Dre Greenlaw from the Niners. If these
guys stay healthy, I think the Broncos have a top
three defense that can just strangle teams and then offensively,
Nicks I hated on him a lot last year, but
he really came through towards the end of the season.
I think he'll only get better in year two behind

(37:50):
an elite offensive line and an upgraded group of weapons.
You know, they're old Evan Ingram and JK. Dobbins, but
they bring in RJ. Harvey could be a fun little
piece to add speed and splash plays to this offense.
I think this is a very balanced offensive attack that's
going to be difficult to stop. And then yeah, around
the rest of the division. I mentioned the Chiefs, but

(38:12):
like the Chargers, the Slater injury is massive, and I
think that defense takes a huge step back. Like most said,
they way overperformed their numbers last year. So I think
the Broncos do have a really good shot to win
the division at plus three ten And I don't hate
a AFC championship bet either. You just don't know. With

(38:37):
these quarterbacks, like the Ravens, the Bills, the Chiefs, they're
all one quarterback away from calling it a season, and
I think Denver could just sneak up on some teams.
So I haven't looked at that price yet actually, but
I do like Denver division and potentially AFC champions.

Speaker 2 (38:54):
Well, I'll give you a chance to retort with regards
to the Chiefs. With first, Donny has to pile on
because he has Bronco's over ten and a half plus
one seventy.

Speaker 5 (39:04):
Yeah, I like the price here. I agree wholeheartedly with
Brett on the defense, the offensive line, the enhanced weapons
around bow Knicks. What I'll add is that, you know,
I don't necessarily think bo Nicks is a world beater,
but I just really am drawn to the fact that
that's who Sean Payton wanted. He went out and got
his guy. He works in whatever system Sean Payton wants

(39:27):
to install, and he really is the perfect fit for
this team. And I think that that can go a
really long way. You know, you're not really trying to
force something with something that you may not have wanted,
or you're handed to a quarterback. I mean, this is
who Peyton wanted and it works. I will also add
that I feel like, personally this is Chalky this year,

(39:48):
so I'm a little bit worried about it. I just
hear a lot of people talking about the Broncos, the Broncos,
the Broncos, so you know that that's kind of give
me a little bit of trepidation, but I do agree
wholeheartedly with Brett on everything that he said.

Speaker 2 (39:58):
I have to agree. This is kind kind of rule
of stubborn. Again, shout out to ode B. I killed
Peyton because of the way he used Russell Wilson trying
to jam a round peg into a square hole when
we know Russ is the deep ball max EPA per play,
low success freight quarterback, and he tried to get him

(40:22):
to play his system unsuccessfully as opposed to calling a
game that would better suit Russell Wilson. But like you said,
he has found a quarterback who better fits his system,
who can run the play action rollout, dink and dump,
you know, multi layered crosser type offense in bow Knicks.

(40:42):
I'm still very dubious when it gets tough that bo
Nicks is going to be the guy. This is still
an offense that finished sixteenth in EPA per play last year.
But I get it. The team around him, the offensive line,
the play calling, the defense is very strong.

Speaker 3 (41:01):
Mo.

Speaker 2 (41:01):
I'd love to hear your thoughts on the Chiefs perhaps
getting dethroned in the division by this broadcasting.

Speaker 3 (41:08):
I mean it could happen, it wouldn't stun me. I
think the Broncos are good. I think it won't happen, obviously.
But I think the Chiefs have the best team in
the NFL.

Speaker 6 (41:18):
Man.

Speaker 3 (41:18):
I mean, I just look up and down this roster,
and I think they've done a good job plugging the holes.
There weren't many holes. There's talent, there's depth. I think
the Chiefs are ready to rock again. But yeah, Denver
has a good team. I still think there's some pretty
major concerns here. Obviously. Anytime you concentrate that much value

(41:38):
in the defense, if things are fragile, right, if the
offense plays well and executes, they're probably going to still
score some points on you, and then it's on your
offense to respond. Ken Denver respond, Maybe I'm not fully
I'm not as convinced as Brett that this group of
weapons is going to be it. I'm concerned about Courtland Sutton.

(42:00):
I thought he was incredible last year. I didn't think
he had that level of play left in him in
all honesty, ever since he tore his ACL, he really
has not been the same player. Until last year he
really bounced back. I am having a hard time buying
that that's more than like a one year spike just
based on the way he has looked the past like
four years. Aside from that year, the depth behind him

(42:22):
is basically non existent. This is another Drake London situation
where if Courtland Sun were to get hurt, I think
the entire operation is basically going to fall apart. I'm
not excited at all about Evan Ingram. I think he's
definitely washed. Yes he is an upgrade, but I think
he's a washed upgrade, So I don't think he's gonna
do as much as his name value might say. So yeah,
I still think. I still think they're at least one

(42:45):
playmaker short when it comes to playing with the big boys.
But yeah, Denver has a good team. So yeah, with
some luck, maybe some things go wrong for the Chiefs. Yeah,
I could see this happening.

Speaker 2 (42:54):
I'm prepared for the Chiefs to definitely come back to reality,
meaning they're going to be a lot more like the
non sleepy Chiefs then we are used to, I mean,
getting rave reviews about Xavier Worthy in camp. It's unbelievable

(43:15):
that Simmons fell to them to just stand in and
play left tackle for them and with all the worries
about this Rashi Rice pending suspension, there are three guys
that my guy JJ komps all his prospects to based
on just straight up data, and one of Jalen Royal's
three comps was Rashi Rice. So if they can get

(43:39):
the rook online quick, if Xavier Worthy can take the step,
if Simmons can step in and protect right away, the
Chiefs could start to look like the Chiefs of old.
But before we get out of the AFC West Mo,
you're bullish on another team which you gave some flyers
to their quarterback earlier. You like over seven and a
half for the raid is at plus one.

Speaker 3 (44:03):
This is probably my least confident pick, But I actually
I think I am gonna have a bit on this one.
I just think this is a relatively solid team, man,
And it's seven and a half with plus to the
over I is it's that hard to imagine the world
where the Raiders are close to five hundred, especially if
the Chargers are not as strong as I think the
market thinks and a lot of people think. And yeah,

(44:26):
I think Gino Smith and Pete Carroll bring a floor
and a level of professionalism to this franchise that they
have not had. We know Pete Carroll has a history
of overachieving. Yes, his lack of tactical acumen makes him
maybe a lower ceiling coach, but he is gonna get

(44:48):
guys to play hard, play together, play to the system.
He's Mike Tomlin, He's Mike Rabel, He's all these raw
ra guys.

Speaker 6 (44:56):
You know.

Speaker 3 (44:57):
Yes, they are probably gonna get out ski by the
Ben Johnsons and Andy Reids of the world. But this
stuff matters too. And I don't think the Raiders are
just like full of holes the way they have necessarily
been in the past. I mean, they brought in reasonable
players like Jeremy Chin. I actually thought Eric Stokes was

(45:18):
good his rookie season with Green Bay. So with Pete
Carroll's history of coaching up DBS, I don't think the
defensive back room maybe is going to be as bad
as it looks on paper. That's definitely. The back seven
is definitely the weak point. Obviously, the pass rush should
be very good, so maybe that can cover up for
some of it. I don't think this team should basically

(45:40):
be world beaters or anything like that, but there's enough
between Geno the offensive line, Jenti Bowers. There's enough here
for this team to be close to five hundred, and
it's like plus one twenty or close to that for
over seven and a half, so I think that's at
least worth a look.

Speaker 2 (45:56):
Okay, I have a question for mister Manati make Majana.
Can the Bills win the AFC East with Mitchell Trubisky
or Mike White a quarterback?

Speaker 6 (46:11):
Probably? Probably?

Speaker 3 (46:13):
I said this about the Chiefs last year, that the
Bills might be quarterback injury proof dude, and they have
a quarterback who never gets hurt, but the other backup
quarterbacks are excellent.

Speaker 2 (46:24):
Mo and I are completely aligned on two picks in
this division. One of them is Bills minus two to
eighty to win the AFC East. Why aren't they being
priced like the prime Patriots? Can somebody help me?

Speaker 3 (46:40):
Yes, they should be minus a thousand, thank you.

Speaker 2 (46:43):
What team in this division is going.

Speaker 5 (46:44):
To I forgot to send you this one, Rich, I
have it too.

Speaker 2 (46:47):
Somebody needs to explain it to me. The other one
correlates with this. I think the Patriots are being massively
overrated right now, and they are the only logical challengers
I think to the Bills where the Dolphins. I think
the Dolphins are going to fire Mike McDaniel before Halloween.
I think that thing is just going to absolutely crater

(47:11):
right off of the bat. I mean, tybe kill he's practicing,
he's not practicing. It just seems like a tinderbox that
is just ready to explode down in Miami. And then
with the Jets, I think the arrow is going to
be pointed up. I think this team's going to play
extremely hard this year. I think they're going to be
really tough on defense, and the offensive line is going

(47:33):
to be a top ten unit. But there's just way
too many question marks at too many important positions quarterback, receiver,
edge for them to take a real step and be
a surprise double digit win team. So MO, who is
I can't. I can't find a path outside of massive

(47:53):
injury where somebody is challenging for this division.

Speaker 3 (47:56):
I got nothing here because I just like, yeah, I'm
looking at the Bills and I'm looking at these other
teams and they're not just not even in the same league.
I Mean, the thing about the Bills is I have
some questions about them, but they're all like top end questions.
How are the Bills gonna beat the Chiefs. How are
the Bills gonna beat the Ravens. They got very lucky
to beat the Ravens last year. I don't believe in

(48:16):
Joe Brady. I hate the way he coaches football. But
the fact of the matter is it works in the
regular season. And the Bills have such a high four
because they have Josh Allen, they have an elite offensive line,
and they run the piss out of the ball when
they get ahead so nobody can come back on them.
But then does that work against the best teams? I

(48:36):
don't think so. So all my questions for the Bills
are when they face good competition, I think they're going
to absolutely steamroll all the bad teams on their schedule,
and there's a lot of them. Again, this team is
plus three twenty five to have the best record for
a reason. They have an incredibly easy schedule.

Speaker 2 (48:56):
It is.

Speaker 3 (48:58):
I mean, okay, there's easy schedules, but you expect those
for the fourth place teams, right The Bills have an
easy schedule and they have a first place schedule, so
things are gonna be quite a bit easier for them
compared to the Chiefs, Ravens, Lions, Eagles, go look at
those teams schedules, and then go look at the Bills schedule.

Speaker 2 (49:18):
Like I said, the only path of resistance without major
injury is probably the New England Patriots. Mo and I
are going to give the bear case for the Patriots
in a moment. But Donnie, I will see the floor
to you, the blinders, the ravel blinders seem to be
on because you like pats overs.

Speaker 5 (49:38):
I do like patsovers. But I will say that there
are no way, shape or form challenging the Buffalo Bills.
I don't care if half the Bill's team gets injured,
like what, so just don't like go too crazy with it.
I mean, I have them over eight and a half wins,
over nine and a half wins. I think they could
possibly get to ten and seven. Yeah, I mean, I
think just the fact that they have a new coaching staff,

(49:58):
because the coaching staff was so god af The offensive
line has to be better. There's no way it can
be worse, no way, and.

Speaker 2 (50:05):
The weapon doesn't happen to be better.

Speaker 5 (50:10):
To stop and we yes, and we are. We've been
through this song and dance a million times before. Okay,
I know you might might have forgotten because you know
he took a year or however the heck long off,
but like Rabel magic, he's got it all figured out. Okay,
there's gonna be like three wins, maybe four wins, where
they had no business winning that damn game, but somehow

(50:31):
Vrabel did it and we're gonna be talking about it.
List Rabel that blah blah blah whatever it happens every
single year.

Speaker 2 (50:37):
I'm very concerned about this offensive line and somebody who
watched Morgan Moses play football recently to pin him as
a starter where it sounds like he's struggling in camp
right now. The entire left hand side of the offensive
line are ungraded rookie players something Campbell with the smallest arms. Ever,

(51:03):
Drake may look a little Zach Wilson ish with the
clueless turnover over the weekends. And then on defense, I
just get this. This feels like.

Speaker 1 (51:16):
The Eagles Redeem team AAU style, just a bunch of
guys cobbled together that they toss money at that I
just I don't people's cat for the team is literally
Drake may arrow up.

Speaker 2 (51:30):
So they're gonna win a bunch of games, But there's
no unit on this team where I feel very comfortable
in backing and digs off the injury something Booty Holland's Douglas. Yeah,
I just think this is going to be your run

(51:52):
of the mill below five hundred teams. I've got the
same bet that moh has under seven and a half
plus one fifty. They have got a lot of work
to do, and outside of Campbell being incredible right away
and this offensive line playing somehow league average, I don't

(52:14):
really see a path to them being very competitive every
week outside of holding on for dear life in some
low scoring games, which Mo we know in twenty five.
It just it just doesn't work that much.

Speaker 3 (52:28):
Yeah, why do people think this defense is good? I'm confused.

Speaker 5 (52:31):
It's just.

Speaker 2 (52:33):
So people see a bunch of names. They see Peppers
and Landry bar More coming back, like, they see all
these big names, Carlton Davis, and they just assume that
it's gonna all mild and it's gonna be awesome. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (52:49):
I mean, the secondary looks like it has enough talent
to me, but the pass rush looks just okay. Upfront
just looks okay in general, I don't know, Like, I
don't know if this team is gonna stops and at
least I know the Seahawks should get stops. I don't
know if this team's getting stops. And then I look
at this offense and I'm like, say, like you, what

(53:10):
if Will Campbell's great?

Speaker 6 (53:11):
Who cares?

Speaker 2 (53:12):
Is that enough?

Speaker 3 (53:13):
I mean there's a third round rookie and one of
the worst centers in the NFL next to him. I mean,
this offensive line looks atrocious to me. And then the
weapons is just like the only person that's you know,
under thirty two is Pop Douglas. I mean, how is
that gonna work? I don't know, man, I just think

(53:34):
I like Drake May, but I just think this team
is being massively overhyped. It's like you said, just everyone
just like Drake May plus Brabel equals eight wins. I
don't know, man, what if the rest of this roster
isn't ready?

Speaker 2 (53:47):
And what if Rabel is just your patented defensive coach,
which yeah, he is for sure a floor raiser. I
think bringing in Mike Rabel raises the floor of your team.
But they're being priced nine wins right now.

Speaker 1 (54:05):
Going from one of the worst teams in the league
to nine wins like that is very aggressive growth year
of a year for a team.

Speaker 3 (54:15):
This looks like offense twenty two and defense sixteen to me,
So I mean, I don't know how that equals nine
eight nine wins.

Speaker 2 (54:24):
All right, donning, time for you and I to align
on fading a man I unfortunately had to root for
last year in Aaron Rodgers. This is the year. This
is the year the Tomlin train goes off of the tracks.
Let me just read some numbers for you guys from

(54:45):
last year for mister Aaron Rodgers. Aaron Rodgers finished twentieth
in EPA per play, twenty fourth in success rate, twenty
fifth in QBR, thirty second in completion percentage over expected,
and that twenty in EPA per play against the Jaguars
last year of the he generated a total of thirty

(55:10):
five EPA across the entire season. Last year against the Jaguars,
who had an historically bad defense, he had twenty one
of his thirty five EPA in that game. He had
six point six EPA on the Lazard Hail Mary against
your Buffalo Bills Brett and for the rest of the

(55:34):
season for the other fifteen games that a Darn Rogers
played quarterback and he had a total of seven EPA
at it over fifteen games. This guy stinks. The Steelers
weapons stink. Roman Wilson looks like he's playing an eleven personnel,
a guy that they tried to basically throw to the

(55:55):
curb last year. They bring in DK Metcalf, who, at
this point seems like the worst pairing possible for Aaron Rodgers,
who just wants to throw close to the line of scrimmage.
DK Metcalf is in outside, beat your defender down the
field type player, which is just not That's just not

(56:15):
the type of player Aaron Rodgers is. Right now, you've
got the second oldest roster in the NFL in Pittsburgh.
I mean, this could be teetering on disaster. If injuries hit,
you just have old bad I mean, Darius Slay and
Jalen Ramsey are the starting cornerback due for a team

(56:36):
in twenty twenty five ninth toughest schedule. Per Vegas win
totals half their games against the Ravens Bengals in the
NFC North. This it just seems like a disaster waiting
to happen in Pittsburgh. And I can't wait to sit
back and watch DP bilin.

Speaker 5 (56:55):
Yeah, I took him to miss the playoffs. I took
under six and a half wins. I took under seven
and a half wain. I mean, I think, well, one,
Aaron Rodgers is a freaking disaster. There's no there's no
way that this works, which is fine, okay, and then
their backups are horrific too, so it's not even like
they'd be like, oh, we're just gonna go to this guy. No,

(57:15):
Mason Rudolph, possibly Skyler Thompson. I mean, who the hell knows.
These guys are horrendous. I don't like the DK metcalf perring.
Like you said, I just feel like, generally speaking, they
are throwing a whole bunch of hal Mary's all over
the place with like kind of flashy names.

Speaker 6 (57:32):
And I mean part of me is one.

Speaker 5 (57:35):
That's just not how you build a team, like it's
just that never works. Two that that seems like such
a disconnect for what Tomlin kind of always is. I
feel like he's a team guy, a foundational guy, you know,
and this, I don't know. I feel like a lot
of this stuff was probably not Tomlin's decision, which I
think is weird, and I just I don't know. I
think at the end of the day. I'm with you, Rich.

(57:56):
I don't see how even Tomlin and his voodoo shout
out to Toman Voodoo can fix this disaster that's gonna happen.
I mean, him and Rodgers are just there's no way
this works. No, there's no way, no way.

Speaker 2 (58:09):
It feels like it feels like the Jets last year
in that the Steelers are just going all in on
these old, unreliable players, like one last shot, win one
for the Gipper, And just like the Jets last year,
it feels like it's just gonna go all wrong and
everything's gonna go pair shaped and Rogers is gonna be
on McAfee throwing low blows at DK metcalf for not

(58:33):
running the red line in a key situation. And I
just feel like I've seen this movie before and there's
a lot of historic precedents that is supporting the Steelers price, which, yeah,
I just think they're gonna have a very tough go
of it this year. Mo, You've got a pair of
picks in the NFC South, and then Brett's got one

(58:54):
click in the NFC East, and then a very fun
parlay and we'll get out of here. So MO, just
give us here two clicks in the NFC sound.

Speaker 3 (59:03):
Okay, let's start with a rare positive thing for me,
And I want to see what Brett thinks, because he
was all in on this team for all the time
the last few years.

Speaker 6 (59:15):
I think it's kind of crazy.

Speaker 3 (59:16):
The Colts are plus three seventy to win a pretty
bad division here. I mean, I know that they have
their problems, mainly at quarterback, but on the other hand,
they have two quarterbacks that are okay and the rest
of the team is pretty good. Like with the weapons
they have, I mean, Pittman downs and then you add

(59:39):
a throwing a hopefully a good tight end with that,
I think that's enough. What the running game they have
and a very good offensive line. The defense is good, man,
I mean, just like pretty good top to bottom. I
really like the signings they made in the secondary. Tarvarius
Ward and Cam Bining them are both quite good. They're
getting older, but they're not ancient yet. They're not in

(01:00:00):
Darius Slayh territory, not even close, so I still think
there's some tread left there. And I just yeah, this
is just an overall pretty good team and a pretty
bad division to me. So if Shane Steichen is the
coach that I think he is, which I think he's
done pretty good job with not a lot of great
around him. They should be right there. I know that Houston, listen,

(01:00:25):
Houston has a great defense, but again we're talking about
similar to what we were talking about with Seattle. If
things go south for the offense, it might not necessarily matter.
I mean, it could be the best defense in the NFL.
I mean, it really could be. But it also could
be the worst offensive line in the NFL. So yeah,
that's a lot to overcome. Man, And I just don't

(01:00:45):
like this Jags team at all. I don't think the
Titans are really all that close to ready, and I
guess that leads me into Jags under seven and a half.
I am looking at this team and I don't understand
why anybody could be optimistic about this team. I really don't.
This is another horrible offensive line. A quarterback that I

(01:01:07):
believed in for a long time. I think he's just fine.

Speaker 6 (01:01:09):
Though.

Speaker 3 (01:01:10):
I don't think Lawrence is like bad or good. I
think he's just a guy who's decent, and you know
when you have a really bad offensive line in front
of that guy, I don't think it's gonna go super well.
Another team that just they haven't gotten a replacement level
tight end. So the weapons are just like I mean,
you have Brian Thomas, he's great, and then whatever after that,

(01:01:33):
Who knows what Travis Hunter is gonna be?

Speaker 2 (01:01:35):
What horrible offensive line or whatever.

Speaker 3 (01:01:39):
Well, he's a rookie trying to learn two positions.

Speaker 6 (01:01:42):
Who knows what he's gonna do. I don't know.

Speaker 3 (01:01:45):
But even if he's good, it's like this offensive line stinks.
You got a first time head coach. I don't know
who Anthony Campanile is. I've never seen that name, and
he's coordinating this defense. So and it doesn't even have
that much talent. It's below partner in that sense. So yeah,
I just the Jags just look like a well below
average team to me, and under seven and a half

(01:02:06):
is plus.

Speaker 6 (01:02:07):
So yeah, give me some of that, dude. That's why
you were the master.

Speaker 2 (01:02:13):
You were the master of AFC South long shots. You
had CJ. Stroud and dem boys to win the division
when Stroud was a rookie.

Speaker 6 (01:02:20):
That's what I thought he was going to be on
my team.

Speaker 2 (01:02:22):
Here there is a rookie in the division, I mean,
is it wouldna be wild if the Titans won this division. Really,
I agree that this this is a heliocentric division where
all the money is being pulled in Houston's direction. And
for what reason? Right, We've seen a quarterback who has

(01:02:44):
regressed since his rookie year, like you said, Moe, an
awful offensive line and a defense that is on paper
looking great. But why why are we penciling in and
the Exans winning this division? Cam Ward? You baby? All right?

(01:03:07):
Another rookie quarterback who might not start this season, but
at some point this guy will be under center for
Big Blue with your guy day Ball. Brett, You like
the Giants for six and a half?

Speaker 6 (01:03:21):
I do?

Speaker 4 (01:03:23):
Look last last year was rough like just three wins,
A lot of questions, especially on offense. The passing game
was abysmal, offensive line allowed way too much pressure, which
just compound compounded problems for the quarterback. But I love
what they've done in the offseason. They focused on the
most critical issues, which is quarterback, and they really bolted

(01:03:46):
up this defensive line. Am I wrong in saying this
might be the best defensive line outside of like maybe Philadelphia,
Like look at look at these guys as far as
like just getting at the quarterback. They add Abdul Carter
to Burns and Thibodeau. I mean, the blueprint, the blueprint
is there. I love what the Giants have done on defense,

(01:04:07):
and I think with Russell Wilson, he you know, he
brings a veteran presence capable of stretching the field. With
Monique Neighbors, I think there's some excitement here. And yeah,
you Adam to do my guy day Ball, who I
think is creative and fearless. This team could just win
eight games, and I honestly I don't hate a bet

(01:04:29):
on them to make the playoffs either.

Speaker 6 (01:04:32):
So it could. It could.

Speaker 3 (01:04:34):
This is the most unhingedha why this entire podcast history?
Why not kidding these guys because their schedule is obs.

Speaker 4 (01:04:42):
It's tough, it's tough. But all they have to do
is when six and a half games, it was you.

Speaker 5 (01:04:49):
Brought up the playoffs, man, I was, I was, I
was on board. I was on board. I was in
the car with you and then you mentioned playoffs and
I threw that F and door open and I jumped
out so f and fast.

Speaker 6 (01:05:01):
Okay, I'm going we.

Speaker 4 (01:05:03):
Get at least one team every year we say no
f in chance this team makes the playoffs with this
defensive line, I'm betting on that team possibly being in
the Giants this year.

Speaker 2 (01:05:13):
So we're also obviously betting on Dallas remaining a dirtbag
organization and Washington perhaps taking a step back. Like the Steelers,
who Dinea and I touted against. They play the NFC East,
plays the NFC North, which is tough, or they just

(01:05:33):
play No, they do play the NFC North. It's funny.
They almost play them all in succession. Shy of Chicago,
Green Bay, Detroit weeks ten through twelve. Look, I'm in
on Dart. Dart looks like the exact type of guy
that you want to bet on. Right, Like everyone was
making the Zach Wilson comparisons during the draft process, the
difference is is that Zach Wilson was playing against Farmers

(01:05:56):
at BYU and Dart was playing in the SEC. Right,
he'd have a lot of easy buttons in the lane
Kiffen offense, There's no doubt about that. And he was
throwing too some demons down there with the Rebels. But
I don't know, He's got the makeup of a guy
that I would want to bet on. And we've seen
what Dabel can do. Previously with some bad quarterback play

(01:06:19):
he couldn't get over the last couple of years, which
was just I mean, they were something the veto just
really wretched quarterback play for the Giants. Now they've got
two veterans and Darts, but yeah, this is it feels
like the Giants are a year away from from being

(01:06:42):
a team that gives some folks some trouble. And it
might not be this year, but Brett, I mean, Brett
is the king of the long shots. So I will
not be shocked to look up in November and see
a scrappy Giants team and then Brett give us your
your fun division parlay to get us out of here
on a on a fun.

Speaker 6 (01:06:59):
Oh do division parlays? I love division parlays.

Speaker 4 (01:07:02):
So I mean, I've I've mentioned my my four favorite
division winners.

Speaker 6 (01:07:06):
I've got to look back and see what.

Speaker 4 (01:07:08):
The number was, but I've got Cardinals, Falcons, Broncos, and.

Speaker 5 (01:07:17):
It was you might as well put the Giants in
there with the way you're talking about them, bro, I mean,
why you're gonna if you're gonna try, if you're gonna
try and go for it, you freaking go for it.

Speaker 4 (01:07:27):
Okay, I mean the number I've already got is insane.

Speaker 2 (01:07:31):
It's like coming full circle the last team.

Speaker 4 (01:07:37):
Packers, That's what it was. Yeah, Falcons, Packers, Cardinals, Broncos
three hundred and sixty to one at MGM with a
thirty three percent Parley boosts without the party boost two
hundred and seventy to one on those four teams all
not favorite to win the division, but it's fun.

Speaker 2 (01:07:57):
So I think the most pression thing to come off
of that insane out is boys and girls out there
when you are in your betting apps and when they
give you these boosts. Please, for the love of everything Holy,
don't put it on the minus three seventy trying to

(01:08:20):
eke out a little bit of profit. Try and break
these guys. Do what Brett did. Take the two seventy
to one, make it three sixty to one if applicable,
and break these guys, okay, please begging.

Speaker 6 (01:08:40):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:08:41):
On most as too, you get like a ten dollars
max bet, but that one in MGM is fifty so
fire away.

Speaker 2 (01:08:47):
Whooh and even still like that's another reason why if
you're if you're getting maxed on your wager amount, stop,
there's no point in doing these small whatever boosted to
minus two twenty. Get out of here, get some stones
and try to break these guys. All right, that was

(01:09:08):
fun an hour of football. We'll be back next week
with some player props, and then the week after that
we will set the table for week one again. Join
the discord bit dot l y slash discord Moose. Follow
these guys on Twitter at Donnie Underscore, Peters at Brakholson
and at Mona Wora and you double woh Rusty and

(01:09:29):
you double war Ah. I'm at rich t Ryan. We'll
be back next week to talk some more football. It's
almost here. Peace out,