August 23, 2022 • 51 mins
Have you ever been to therapy? Have you thought about going but your nerves got the best of you? I’m telling y’all about the first time I went to therapy, what prompted me to seek therapy and what I learned from the process. I’m also sharing tips for where to start if you’ve never been to therapy but would like to begin. Please enjoy this episode from the HER Archives.
To get transcripts, links, and details from each episode, check out the show notes. To continue your support of the podcast and my work, become a member of my Patreon community where you can get access to archived episodes, bonus episodes, and behind the scenes content. Follow me on Instagram and Twitter, for podcast clips, poetry quotes and random quips. For information on how to book me to speak or perform at an event, visit amenabrown.com. Thanks for listening and thanks for your support!
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:12):
That time, I'm at India Ire. That time I went
on a really bad date. That time I was directed
by Robert Townend. That time I got Mono on Thanksgiving.
That time I went on a really bad Christmas tour.
(00:33):
That time I'm I, Hey, y'all, welcome back to Her
with Amina Brown. And I feel like this episode, last episode,
and possibly the next two episodes all just feel like
a series of me telling y'all my business. So hey,
(00:54):
if that's what you come to this podcast for, if
you come here because you wanted to know my business,
then you have entered here at a good time, because
apparently something in my spirit is bringing up episode ideas
that me not need to come in here and tell
you all my business. But truthfully, that's what the Her
living room is for, right, That's how I come to
(01:15):
the living room with my girlfriends. I arrive, you know,
at their houses, you know, of course, in the before times.
But now like slowly but surely, as like I'm now
fully vaccinated and my friends are getting fully vaccinated, we're
able to get back to having our in personal living room,
which is so wonderful, and we just show up. If
you dress cute, okay, if you're not okay if you
(01:38):
just you know, in your sweatpants and your dirty sneakers
and you've got half a thing of hummus and I got,
you know, a third of a bell pepper. Then we
bring what we got to the table, to the couch,
to wherever we are, We light a candle and we
start talking. And so that's what I hope these episodes
are like for you. Also, thank you for listening. Today
(01:59):
we are talking about that time I went to therapy,
and specifically I'm talking today about the first time I
ever went to therapy. I was talking with someone recently
that has never been to therapy, and it sort of
made me go back in my own journey of thinking
about what it was that led me to actually go
to therapy, what that experience was like. So maybe you're
(02:22):
listening and you've never been to therapy and you've kind
of been thinking about going, and I'm hoping that things
I say don't discourage you. I'm hoping that things I
say encourage you to go to therapy. So I went
to therapy for the first time when I was twenty
five years old, and I'll tell you the interesting story
of what led to me going to therapy. So if
(02:42):
you've been listening to this podcast for a while, you
have heard me tell you the story of how I
got hired to work in Corporate America at twenty five
years old. And I thought that was going to be
super amazing because it was the first time that I
was getting paid to be a writer. And I discovered
within six months of being there that I hated that job.
And so around this time in my life, there were
(03:03):
a lot of things swirling. I was working my first
what felt like my first real job. It wasn't quite
my first real job. I had some real jobs before
this one, but this was what I felt like my first,
you know, grown up job where I went and bought
my first suits to where to work. Around this time,
I had also left a church for the first time.
(03:24):
And any of you that grew up in church or
that may have attended church may have had this experience,
which is a terrible one. I'm not gonna lie about it.
I had started going to a church when I first
moved to Atlanta for college, and attended that church all
through college and right up into my mid twenties, and
at the early parts of that it was what felt
(03:46):
like a wonderful and beautiful experience. It was a church
full of so many young people and had so much energy.
We were all, you know, wanting to be a part
of this movement for God type of things. And then
things over time just got more and more and more
unhealthy with the leadership there, to the point that it
(04:07):
caused me and a lot of other people that were
going to the church to have to leave it. And
this is all happening around the same time. I think
I left the church within a few months I got
this new job. So I'm just kind of out of
my element. Really, I am very much a church girl.
I'm sure if you've been listening to this podcast for
a while, you have gotten those vibes. I grew up
(04:28):
in church most of my life, so at this time
in my mid twenties, this is the first time that
I'm just not really attending church. I just decided to
take a complete break from church because prior to that
I have been very busy in church. I mean I
was almost at church to the point that that could
have been like another job or another part time job
(04:51):
that I had in addition to my regular job, and
so I just took a break. It was my first
time since I was twelve or thirteen years ole, that
I didn't attend church, that I wasn't in leadership at church,
that I didn't have church meetings to go to. And
so I think I'm giving you all of this to
tell you sort of what was swirling around at the
(05:13):
time that I actually start going to therapy. Another thing
that I realized at this moment is that I really
want to start dating. And I didn't really date in
high school. I think I went on one date in
high school and that was not including prom I didn't
date at all in college. And so by the time
(05:34):
I got to be especially when I started working this job,
that was my first time being around other people who
were my same age and hearing their dating stories, their
dating exploits, and realizing that I was not having that
(05:54):
experience at all. And I felt very inexperienced as far
as dating was concerned, right, And so I'm like, okay,
here I am, I'm like a grown woman. I have
been going to a church that was very patriarchal, right,
So it was basically like, as a single woman at
the church at the time, if I had decided to
(06:14):
date someone, I needed to bring this man I was
dating to my college ministry leader and he had to approve,
and then I was supposed to bring this man I
was dating to another leader of the church, and then
to the pastor. And if they all three of these
men said that it was okay for me to date
(06:34):
this man, then I could date him. And what that
robbed me of that I didn't realize at the time,
is it robbed me of my own ability to discern
from myself, my own ability to discern is this man
a safe man to be around? Is this man someone
who wants to be committed to me or even wants
to be in a relationship. Like before I take you
(06:57):
through all this, you know, whatever, what do I feel
about it? What do I think about it when I
go in my own spirituality and talk to God? What
am I feeling is the right thing for me to
do to move forward? So giving you all of this
to say, I am feeling very much fish out of
water in this moment. I'm working my first what feels
like my first grown job. I'm out of my church
(07:19):
bubble right and as I'm meeting people at work and
other places, I'm starting to go out and have social
activities with people that I don't go to church with.
And I know to some of you this just sounds
completely strange, you know, but I want to express to
you how much of a bubble church had been for me.
That church was not just the place where I was,
(07:41):
you know, practicing my religion or being encouraged in my faith.
It was also pretty much the center of my social life. Right.
So at the moment that I'm leaving this church environment,
I'm not just you know, having to walk away from
a place that I thought was going to be good
from my faith. I'm also walking away from my social
life as well. So I am just out with people
(08:06):
I work with, out with friends I've met online at
happy hours when I was coming from a church where
we weren't even allowed to drink, right. So I'm starting
to meet some guys and just almost feeling very stunted
inside myself, feeling like my age is twenty five, but
(08:27):
my reaction to dating men is as if I'm like
fourteen dating a boy for the first time, you know.
And I was trying. I was trying. I was going
on different dates. Sometimes they were going well, most times
they weren't. I was very uncomfortable even with the thought
of like sitting across the table at coffee or at
(08:49):
dinner with a man that I found attractive. And to
give you some context, I had also been raised as
a child in church environments that basically sort of gave
you two extremes. You know that you either were, in
my case, having a guy that was more like a
brother to you, or you were getting married. It was
(09:09):
sort of like there was no there was no middle ground.
There was no conversation about how you casually date someone.
It's basically like you do these two things, and you know,
if you don't do it this way, it's dangerous or
it's sinful or all of those types of thoughts. So
I really had no middle ground, no nuance as it
(09:32):
related to dating. But I wanted to date and I
wanted to be in a good and healthy relationship with
a man. I really did, so I would go out
on dates and have crushes. And the job where I
was working, there were three other women that were hired
in that same position in the company, and so we
all four of us kind of became two peas in
a pod. We were very like, you know, it felt
(09:55):
like we were like the United Colors of been Aton
you know, there was one other black woman. There was
a career and a woman, and then there was a
white woman. There's four of us. We would hang out,
and each of us at different stages. None of us
were married, but each of us at different stages between
some of us having been in very committed dating relationships
for a long time and some of us still out
there casually dating. And there was one coworker in particular
(10:17):
of the four of us, the other black woman. She
and I our cubicles were closest to each other. And
I can't remember exactly the circumstances, y'all, but I remember
I met a guy and we were just starting to
talk on the phone, and I it was just making
me very nervous talking to him. And I was coming
(10:38):
in her cube a lot to talk to her about
it and processing and processing and processing and overprocessing and
couldn't figure out what to do about this, what to
do about that. And this is not the first dating
situation she's heard me kind of try to process. And
I just remember one afternoon she looked at me and
she said, you know what, I don't really think I
can help you figure this out. I think what you
(10:59):
need is to go to therapy, and I remember sitting
in her cubicle, sitting across from her. I remember my
face just feeling hot because I felt embarrassed because I
couldn't tell what it was I had said to her
that made her feel like I needed to go to therapy.
(11:20):
And I was somewhere between feeling embarrassed and insulted and
really thankful and helped. I talked to her a little
bit longer, and then I went right to my cubicle
and started googling options of therapists to find, and I
(11:42):
looked up a couple of them. I think after work,
I called a couple of the ones that I picked
out and I talked to Remember I talked to a man,
I talked to a woman, and the woman she was
an older, white woman, and I don't know, I just
felt the most comfortable with her, and so I made
(12:04):
my first therapy appointment with her. After we talked on
the phone for maybe ten or fifteen minutes. She had
a very soothing voice, and I don't know, it just
felt like safe and right to me. So I made
an appointment with her. And one of the things that
she asked for before my first appointment is she asked
(12:24):
me to write her a letter, and in the letter,
she wanted me to write what were the areas of
my life where I hoped to grow during therapy? And
I remember getting home. I was in my apartment, my
first apartment, all by myself. I didn't have any roommates
(12:45):
or housemates or anything. So I was really proud of
that little apartment. I was proud of my little full
granted countertops in there. And I remember being in that
apartment and I think, y'all, I think I actually I'm
trying to remember did I handwrite that letter. I think
I may have handwritten that letter, and I remember handwriting
(13:06):
it and crying while I was handwriting it. Because just
sort of sitting down to think about what are areas
I hope to experience healing in what are areas that
have been painful to me that I really haven't had
(13:26):
time or the tools to process. And it just all
started coming out at once, everything about the church, about God,
about my parents divorced, about things that I was, you know,
processing from my family of origin. I just wrote and
wrote and wrote and wrote, and then I think this
(13:47):
is so old school now, y'all. I could have typed
it up, but for some reason, I think I handwrote it,
and I think I I actually think I handwrote it,
and she either asked me to send a copy to
her or I scanned it and sent the coffee to
her that way. Now I'm just like, why wouldn't you
just email this? But anyways, I sent all that to her,
(14:09):
and I can't even remember actually all of what we
talked about in that first session, but I remember being
nervous about it because it is a very weird feeling
to just start talking about such intimate things with a stranger.
But I made this commitment to myself too, you know,
(14:32):
come and see her every other week. That was the schedule.
And honestly, I was at what I now know was
such a pivotal time in my development because there was
so much of my life that had been built around
Church and around what Church had told me that I
had to be as a woman, as a young woman,
(14:52):
as a black woman. There were a lot of layers
to that, and she was helping me work through a
lot of that very early on. And when I think
back on it, the idea that you would have a
friend that would look at you and say, I think
you need to go to therapy. It's like, depending on
(15:13):
where you are, you know, your first instinct could be
to be defensive, to be like, why why would you
say that about me? What's wrong with me? I mean,
any of you that are fans of Insecure, and if
you're not, I hope you watch it. But there is
a scene between two characters between Issa and Molly in
one of the seasons where Issa is trying to convince
(15:38):
Molly that she needs to go to therapy and Molly
doesn't take it very well at first. And when I
watched that scene, I totally felt her on that, you know,
and the coworker that had this moment with me, you know,
we've lost touch outside of seeing her on Facebook every
now and then. But I am so thankful that she
(15:59):
had the courage to say that to me because it
really did change my life for the better because I
don't know if I ever would have pushed myself to
do it. But when she said it, even though I
felt embarrassed, I also felt like she wasn't telling a lie.
I felt like it was true. So you know, you
may have a friend in your life that you are
(16:19):
close to you're watching them go through some hard things.
You're watching them struggle, You're watching them maybe have some
unhealthy patterns. And it can be the most loving thing
to suggest to someone therapy, and it can be the
most loving thing you can do for yourself to submit
to the process of therapy. But it can also be hard.
(16:42):
I think you have to prepare yourself. If you are
talking to a friend or a family member and you
suggest to them therapy, not everyone is going to respond with, oh,
thank you so much. I I have always longed for
someone to tell me that I have problems enough that
I need to see a professional. But that's the thing, right.
I think sometimes we have this stigma about therapy, like like, well,
(17:04):
I'm air quotes normal or you know, I'm fine. Therapy
is for those people that are going through this, or
those people that have this diagnosis or whatever, and therapies
for those people, But therapies for you too. Even when
you feel you may feel like your life is going
pretty well overall. You know, you may feel almost guilty,
like why do I why should I go to therapy
(17:26):
and complain about my life or whatever? But therapy is
not about that, I learned. It's really about giving yourself
the space and time to heal and sometimes, honestly, we
go through things, or we experience things in our upbringing
or in different times of our life, and they are
very hard things, they're very traumatic things, but they become
(17:49):
normal to us, so we don't think about it like
I maybe I ought to go to therapy based on
my relationship with this person, or maybe I should go
to therapy and process this thing that happened when I
was a kid, because that was just your family growing up,
or that was just what happened. You don't always see
yourself in the same way that someone else can see
(18:09):
you from the outside looking in. So it was totally
a very humbling and somewhat embarrassing moment that led me
to therapy. But I'm glad that I went ahead and
took that initiative and looked into it for myself. How
did I grow from therapy? I think one of the
things Actually my first therapist, I saw her every other
(18:32):
week for a year and a half, so she walked
me through a lot of life. I mean, we were
obviously sort of having to deal with a lot of
things from the past because it was my first therapy
session at years old. And then once we had talked
about a lot of sort of these pent up things
that I really hadn't had a healthy way to process before.
(18:52):
With a professional then I was able to kind of
let her in on things that were going on in
my life, you know, man, I was dating or decisions
I was trying to make about my career and different
things like that. And I think one of the things
that therapy helped me to do was therapy helped me
to find my voice. You know, I am a classic
oldest kid. I am very much a person that can
(19:16):
lean towards people pleasing and going to therapy helped me
to really separate myself and my desires from the expectations
and feelings of other people, and that was really really hard.
I remember a lot of our sessions were about me
saying to my therapist, well, here's the conversation I had
(19:36):
where here's what they said. And I don't want to
make them feel angry or I don't want to make
them feel hurt. I don't want to make them feel
like I don't care. So even though I don't want
to do this, or even though this isn't the best
thing for me, I'm going to do that because I
don't want this person to feel like that. And I
remember the first time my therapist said, but you realize
(19:58):
that you don't make anyone feel anything, right, She was like,
you realize that people feel their feelings and make their
own choices, that you deciding to do something that's healthy
for you, it's not you making someone angry because you
doing what's healthy for you doesn't meet their expectation. She
(20:20):
was like, it's them choosing to be angry that you
holding up your healthy boundary means you're not doing what
they expected of you or what they selfishly wanted from you.
And I will tell y'all that sometimes, you know, I've
now had quite a few therapists over the years, and
I'll tell you that sometimes my initial gut response to
(20:43):
the things my therapist says in session is like super
skeptical that I basically end up being like, yeah, girl,
I hear what you're saying, but I'm not sure if
like you actually went to the proper cool for this,
Like I feel like maybe they didn't give you the
(21:04):
education that you needed because I thought you were supposed
to come in here and just tell me what I
want to hear, not like challenge me to grow and
stuff like I don't. I'm not sure that's what I
signed up for here. So I have definitely been the
person that enters a therapy session my therapist starts kicking
the truth to me, and then then I'll be like, okay, girl,
(21:28):
well I don't think you really understand what it's like
to be me. And then by the end of the session,
I'm like, you're right. The first thing you say because
about feelings, they are her and not like that's totally me,
like starts off super super skeptical, super like you don't know,
and then like thirty minutes later, when she's trying to
tell me it's about time for us to end the session,
(21:50):
like crying my eyes out because the first thing she
said was actually true. So I feel like therapy helped
me in that way. Even though it's challenging right to
hear someone saying those things to you, therapy helped me
to learn how to say no. Saying no it still
can be hard for me sometimes, but back then it
was very very hard for me to say no, especially
(22:10):
if they were people that I really loved and cared about.
I would rather say no to myself and say yes
to them, And it's therapy that helped me begin the
rhythm of learning that sometimes I need to say yes
to myself and that saying yes to myself, even if
it means no to other people, is one of the
healthiest things I can do. And I was not coming
(22:32):
into therapy with that kind of rhythm. I basically felt like,
you know, I needed especially if people are you know,
important to me or I value you know, their thoughts
or opinions, I need to I need to really do
what they say they probably know better than me. And
I'm not saying you shouldn't have people in your life
that our wise can advise you, can you know, give
(22:55):
you feedback on things. But I think going to therapy
is what really taught me to make sure that in
the process of me gaining you know, wisdom and advice
from other people, that I'm not silencing the wisdom that's
inside of me. That no one else knows me better
than I know myself, and of course in my spirituality,
(23:15):
it's like the only person know me better than myself
is God. There's no human being that's gonna know me
better than I know myself. And if I honor my
own voice and my own feelings and desires. That's me
being loving towards myself. That's me being kind and gentle
to myself. I'll also say one of the things that
(23:35):
therapy helped me with is giving me the tools on
what it means to have to have hard conversations. And
I think because you know, I was growing up in
a home without my dad, I was growing up, you know,
coming from divorced parents. You know, I think that brought
up a lot of fears of doing something that would
(23:56):
make the people that love me leave me. I think
that was like a thought under their but I didn't
realize that until I was sitting there in therapy, And
so I would avoid conflict because I would feel like,
if we have conflict, then the results of us having
conflict will be you're going to leave. And therapy taught
(24:16):
me it's okay to have those kinds of hard conversations
with people you love. And the people who love you,
the people who really want the best for you, like
they're gonna dig in on those hard conversations with you
because they don't want to leave. They want you to
be well, They want you to have what you needn't want,
and they want to have what they needn't want in
(24:36):
the relationship or friendship or family relationship, whatever it is,
or even work relationships too. I think therapy helped me
to realize I can speak up for myself. I can
assert myself if something happens and I don't like it,
or if I'm in a relationship or a situation and
someone is treating me in a way that I don't
(24:57):
like that, I am empowered to say I don't like it,
I don't want this, this doesn't feel good to me.
Here's what I'd rather do instead. And it took me
being in therapy to get to the point where I
could do those things and not feel bad about it
or not feel like I was being demanding. I think
that was my thing. It was almost like asserting my
(25:19):
own boundaries. Just healthy boundaries felt like being demanding to me,
when an actuality, it wasn't being demanding at all. It
was just asking for what I deserve as another human being.
You know, since this time after I had that initial
(25:55):
therapy session, I have gone on to have other therapists
sense and I just kind of ebb and flow out
of that. I go through some seasons where I'm in
therapy on a much more consistent basis. I go through
some seasons where I would go to therapy once a month.
I go through some seasons where I didn't go to
therapy at all. I've done in person therapy, I've done
(26:17):
online therapy, so I've had a lot of different experiences.
I have had some funny ones, though, and sometimes when
funny things happened to me, it's like, I can't tell
if those things happen to me because I'm because I
have like that, you know, ignorant part of my brain
that people who are comedians or who perform on stage
(26:39):
have or what. But I did participate in online therapy
for a while, and those of you that have been
listening to this podcast know that I actually returned back
to therapy around in the beginning of and I talked
more about this and actually talk a little bit about
it in the previous episode of my for the a
(27:00):
f Story. But I also talked about this at length
in my behind the Poetry episode on Here Breathing, and
at this time I want to talk a little bit
too about therapy being expensive. I've definitely had some seasons
of life where I really wanted to be in therapy.
I felt like I needed it, but I just couldn't
afford it, you know. And in that way, it is
(27:22):
important to acknowledge that therapy, therapy, I will say, it
shouldn't be a luxury, because we need a therapist in
our life the same way we need access to health
care and being able to make sure our bodies are
cared for. We need that for our mental state, our
mental health as well, you know. But I've gone through
seasons like that where I really needed a therapist, but
(27:47):
I couldn't afford to have one. When I first started therapy,
I was working in corporate America, I was living alone,
you know, I was really making more money than I
needed to live at that time, and so going to
therapy every other week, or if I wanted to go
every week, I could afford to do it at that time.
And then when I quit working corporate and started doing
(28:09):
writing and performing full time, there would be seasons I
could and then there would be seasons I couldn't afford therapy.
And that's also a hard thing too. That's the thing
that I hope changes. I hope that and we're you know,
seeing some ways that there are organizations and different ways
they were trying to make therapy truly accessible to all,
(28:31):
because we can all look at our own lives and
think of things that we need to talk about it.
You know, we need a professional to help us process
through this, you know, and we all know other people
that we wish they had therapy that was accessible to
them to help them heal through some of their own things.
But one of my funniest therapy experiences I was doing
(28:53):
online therapy, one of these services where like, you sign
up and you know, you're able to either do phone
calls or video calls with your therapist, but you can
also write to them or text to them, right, And
so I had signed up for one of these and
it was a little different than the way they are now.
Back then, the price point was actually saving me money,
(29:14):
Like I could afford it more easily than I, you know,
could have afforded just the therapy sessions one on one.
So I signed up for this, and at this point
and ever since, I've been very determined that my therapist
should be a black woman, especially after having worked in
all white spaces or predominantly white spaces, I've realized, you know,
(29:35):
I need a therapist that I can talk to about
how white supremacy affects me talk to about, you know,
how I'm processing being a black woman, you know, having
my hair being in my body and my skin in
the world. And there's just been something very healing to
me to be talking about that with another black woman
who understands a lot, you know, in her own way
(29:57):
of what it's like to walk in the world this way.
So I had my first assigned therapist. It was assigned
to me through this online service, and you know, she
really helped me. Actually, if you listen to the last episode,
I was telling this story about grief, and she was
really one of the first people to alert me that
(30:18):
a lot of what I was experiencing when my mental
health was not in a good place was because I
had a lot of unprocessed grief. And she was the
first UH therapist to really name that for me and
helped me to start thinking through that. But the downside
to her is whenever we had our sessions, she was
always busy doing a little bit of something else. Like
(30:41):
one of our sessions, someone rang the doorbell to give
her a package. But I'm like hearing the whole thing.
So apparently, of course she's doing her sessions from home.
So I'm hearing her like, oh, is that at the door?
Who is that? I was not expecting anybody while I'm
like spilling my guts here, So I'm listening to her
like open the door, talk to the delivery person, sign whatever.
(31:06):
So I was like, Okay, you know she's at home.
She can't control of the package got delivered. You know,
I'm gonna try to like move on and try another session.
So the next session that I tried, y'all, I'm gonna
try to demonstrate for y'all what it sounded like. So
I'm spilling my guts about whatever, and in the background,
I want you all to know that I hear something
(31:26):
that sounds like this. I hear that in the background, y'all,
while I'm trying to share my feelings. Okay, So after
a while, I kind of get quiet, just because I
don't know what's going on, and she finally says, oh,
(31:50):
I'm sorry, I'm babysitting my grandson and he normally doesn't
keep this type of noise. And at that moment, I
was like, Okay, this lady seems very week, but she
cannot be my therapist. You cannot be babysitting your grandson
and will have in therapy with me while I'm trying
to tell you about all my woes and whatever is
going on with me, Like, girl, I can't, I can't
(32:11):
deal with this. No. So I did have some very
comical times of experiencing various therapists, for sure. But one
thing that I also will say that therapy has taught
me over the years is you know, it's wonderful to
have just a great support system overall. You need that too,
(32:32):
And I have to say, I'm just very thankful, very
blessed to have, you know, a wonderful and supportive spouse.
I have a wonderful, supportive family. I have great friends
in my life, Like my community is wonderful. And there
are times that you're going to go through something, experience something,
(32:52):
have something resurface that your friends or your family, or
your spouse like may not have the capac city to
really help you in the way that you need help.
And that's what my coworker was trying to tell me.
I think she was trying to say, like, girl, how
can process this with you in the cubicle. You know,
we can talk it over, girl, But you're reaching beyond
(33:16):
what I have The expertise to help you with and
even though it can feel strange going to like this
stranger to talk to them about these really deep and
personal things, it's also nice to talk to someone that
doesn't have any skin in the game, right, Like, if
you're going there to talk about some stuff you're going through.
You might have people in your life that love you,
(33:37):
but they have strong opinions about what they think you
ought to do about this, or they have strong opinions
about why they think you ended up in this situation.
And when you go into your therapist, especially if your
therapist is healthy and professional and you know doing the
things that they should do, you're going to somebody who
has no skin in the game. If you buy the
(33:59):
house or not, they have no skin in the game.
If you break up with that person or not, they
have no skin in the game. If you have kids,
if you don't have kids, if you get married, if
you don't get married, they don't have skin in the game.
On that. They are there to be a sounding board
for you to help you continue on in your healing process.
And I learned that from being in therapy too. What
(34:22):
would be my tips for anyone going to therapy for
the first time. So if you're listening and maybe you've
been on the fence, maybe you've talked to some other
folks about their experiences going to therapy, but you've never
been yourself. What would be my tips are going to
therapy for the first time. I think one of the
most daunting things about going to therapy for the first time,
(34:44):
or even if you've been to therapy before and you're
no longer seeing your previous therapist and you need a
new therapist, I think one of the most daunting things
is finding a therapist that works for you. And it
can just feel like you have a thousand options. Where
do you begin? Where do you start? How do you know?
Do you just sign up and just go pay somebody?
(35:05):
And what if you don't like them, or what if
you feel like they're not the best fit for you
or whatever. So my first tip that I would say is,
first of all, make a commitment to yourself to find
a therapist and give yourself some patients that it may
take you some time to find someone. I remember when
I was looking for a gynecologist. I know we're not
(35:26):
talking about that on this episode. I'm just using this
as an example. I realized a couple of years ago,
you know, I really need to have I know some
of y'all like this is basic, but I'm explaining it
to you how you know, we can have these types
of appointments or things that we need, and we just
kind of keep pushing it back, keep pushing it back,
and eventually just have to decide like, Okay, this is
(35:48):
what I need to do now. So I remember when
I was like, okay, like I've you know, been to
a family practitioner doctor. You know, I've had some surgeries,
I've done this, I've done that. You know, it's certain
other parts of the body have been looked at. But hey,
I need a gynecologist. And there's a lot of factors
of what I want to find in a gynecologist. And
so I just had to make it my part time
(36:10):
job for a week or two that I would spend
a certain amount of time just you know, looking through
our insurance website to see who was in network and
then go into their websites and cross reference with the help.
I know it's a lot, but this is what I
do so I can be sure about it, okay. And
so when it comes to finding a therapist, I think
it's okay that it may take you time to find
(36:31):
someone that you're a good fit with. And thankfully, there
are a lot more resources out there. There are lots
and lots of resources, but I'm just gonna name some
that I know of and that have been helpful to me,
And maybe these will even give you ideas of other
things that you may be able to search and find
and don't worry about remembering all of this. These links
will be in the show notes on Amina brown dot
(36:53):
com slash her with Amina so that you can check
out all these links. Um. One of the places I
found one of my first therapist was on the Psychology
Today website and they do have this database there where
therapist and counselors can register to be listed. There. You
can search by their specialty. So you may be looking
(37:16):
for a family counselor you may be looking for a
therapist for a teenager in your life. You may be
looking for someone that specializes in trauma informed therapy. You
may be looking for someone that specializes in divorce right
or specializes in working with folks who are in the
l g B t Q plus community right. There are
(37:37):
all sorts of different things you can search there according
to what your comfort level is, according to what you
know you're looking for. So psychology today can be a
really great resource for that. I want to give a big,
big shout out to Therapy for Black Girl. This is
actually where I found My current therapist is on Therapy
for Black Girls, and so they do have a database
(37:58):
Black women. If you're listening and you're looking for therapists
that are really specialized in being able to give this
type of care to black women, that has been a
very helpful site for me. And honestly, just scrolling through
there and seeing the beautiful faces of other Black women
just even that by itself was so wonderful. And I
(38:20):
would also check out Therapy for Latin X. You can
check out their website as well as their Instagram. They
can be a great beginning place to find folks who
are going to be really uh educated and thoughtful about
giving this type of care to the Latin X community
as well. And these are just a couple of things
(38:40):
I'm listening. I know that there are probably even more
resources out there, but these are good places to start
and give you some ideas of other things you can google.
Right you may find some other places that would give
you information like this also want to give a shout
out to Open Path Collective. A friend of mine also
hipped me to this because, as I was saying earlier,
(39:01):
therapy can be cost prohibitive for some folks. I'm shouting
out Open Path Collective because they do also have a
database of therapists on their site who have agreed to
take on a certain number of clients at a discounted rate.
You may also have a local places where you live
that are taking clients but are taking them at a
(39:22):
sliding scale based on income. So we have a lot
more work to do to make therapy accessible, but there
are some ways that you can get the help that
you need, even if you're at a place where you
know money is not really a thing that you have
to give to this, so it may require a little
bit of searching. And if you find that you're in
(39:45):
a in a space inside yourself where even the googling
the looking is difficult for you, this could be something
where if you have a close friend or family member
that would be willing to sit with you maybe while
you're searching, or you know, they might be able to
pull up their phone too and look for some things.
You know, it's okay to ask for help when you
need it, and it's okay to ask for the kind
(40:07):
of support that you need as well. Uh. The other
tip that I would give if it's your first time
going into therapy is I would say that it's okay
to do some therapist interviews. I know the first times
I went to different websites of therapists and I would
just get really nervous, like what if I click on
this and I pay this money for this session and
(40:27):
then I don't really, you know, gel with the therapist.
So one of the things that I did the last
couple of times I was looking for a therapist is
once I found them, I would go to their website,
and a lot of therapists already have these types of
requests on their site where you can request just an
informational interview. It's not a therapy session, it's not a
(40:47):
mini therapy session or anything like that. They're not giving
you any sort of counsel or therapy in this interview
call that you have. It's typically free of charge, and
it gives you an opportunity to ask them some question
stions and gives them an opportunity to get to know
you a little bit, to get to know what is
bringing you to want therapy, And so that's been really
(41:08):
helpful for me because normally, if I walk away from
that conversation feeling like I don't know, then that normally
means that person is probably not the best fit for me.
But even if you go to a therapist website and
they don't have any like free uh conversations or consultations
that are normally pretty short fifteen or thirty minutes, you
can also write in and request and say, you know,
(41:28):
I'm in the process of looking for a therapist, I
would like to schedule an informational interview with you. And
in that interview, what would typically happen is you would
bring your questions that you have questions like, maybe you
want to know how they typically begin their work with
new clients. Maybe you want to know what you can
expect from a session. Maybe you want to know if
(41:48):
there is certain prep that you should do before a session.
Maybe you want to know what their education is or
what their background is, what they specialize in, the types
of patients that they or types of clients that they
typically see. Um depending on what your needs are, you
may want to know, are they in the type of
field where they can prescribe medication to you if you
(42:11):
need that or not. Um those are important things to
differentiate as well if you are in need of a
psychologist or if you are in need of a psychiatrist. Right,
So it's just about you knowing what your needs are.
But there are a lot of professionals that are interested
in you feeling comfortable and getting a chance to you know,
answer your own get your own questions answered rather and
(42:33):
also uh, they can get some answers from you. You know,
get to know a little bit about you, get to
know a little bit about what your expectations are, what
your needs and wants might be at the moment. So
don't be afraid to do that. That's sort of a
no cost way for you to kind of get a
vibe for who you might like to actually have as
your therapist. And that has brought me a lot of
(42:53):
peace of mind and help me to decide between a
couple of therapists. Lastly, what in ouragement would I want
to give you regarding therapy, especially if this is your
first time or it could be your first time in
a long time. And I think therapy can be scary.
I think it's scary because we are thinking about how
(43:16):
it's going to feel to sort of drudge up some
of the things that therapy may bring up. It can
be scary because of the unknown factor. You know, here
we are talking to this person that we're just now
meeting about stuff that we wouldn't even talk to a
lot of people that we know about. You know, it
can be scary, and I think there is a lot
of unknown in the healing process. But my biggest encouragement
(43:39):
to you is therapy is it's one of the best
things that you can do to pour back into yourself.
And I want to specifically speak to those of you
that are listening right now that are the people that
give out to everyone else. You're the person that other
people come to for advice. You're the one that drops
everything to go help out this or that family member
(44:00):
or and when you commit to that hour or so
of that therapy session, it's one way that you're communicating
to yourself that I am worth giving this time to myself.
I'm worth allowing myself to heal and to process things,
even if they're painful, and it can be hard to
face our pain. There's nothing easy about that. There's nothing
(44:20):
fun about that. But if facing your pain and facing
the hard things that have happened to you, or the
hard things that you may have done in your life,
whatever it is that you have to face, you know
it can be hard to face it. But on the
other side of facing it and beginning to process it
and getting the tools for how to walk through your life,
(44:41):
you'll find that you are a healthier person. On the
other side of it, you'll find that your heart is
more open to love and to be loved. And that
love starts with you. It starts with how you love yourself.
You giving that kindness to yourself, You're giving the same
energy that you may give to other people, you returning
that energy to yourself also. So will it be scary?
(45:04):
Could it be hard at times going through the healing process? Absolutely?
But is it worth it? It is absolutely worth it.
And the tough thing but also uh, the important thing
I think to remember is none of us as human
beings are ever going to be fully done with issues
to deal with. That's just a part of our humanity.
(45:25):
We're always going to have something that we're healing from,
you know, and so therapy and whatever other you know
things you have in your life that can help you
in healthy ways to process your life, to process the pain,
but also to process the joy and process the good
things that happens to UM. I think it's important to
(45:46):
have that space. It's good and it can be really
helpful to remember that, so that way you're not putting
pressure on yourself, like you've got to complete this plan
that's going to be thirty three steps, and at the
end of the thirty three steps you'll be done with this.
You know, there'll be some things in life you may
never be done with it, but you'll find yourself incrementally growing,
(46:06):
becoming more whole, experiencing more peace, sleeping better at night,
and so on. So, even though there's been a lot
of shame and stigma to therapy, there's been some shame
and stigma attached to medication and and certain diagnoses and
all those things. I want to be a part of
us removing that shame and that you should do whatever
(46:28):
you need to do to take care of yourself, whether
it's therapy or medication or exploring different types of therapy.
You have a lot of options. But if you're hearing me,
then you're on the fence about this. I hope you
feel encouraged to do what you can to take care
of yourself because we want you here, and we want
you here healthy and whole and being kind and loving
(46:48):
to yourself. That's my that time I went to therapy,
and y'all, I'm still going. I'm still gonna be going.
I'm not gonna be done with therapy. The rest of
my life. I will still be going. And if that's
something you need in your life right now, I hope
you will too. For this week's edition of Give Her
(47:13):
a Crown, I want to shout out Dr Shaniqua Walker Barnes.
Dr Shaniqua is a clinical psychologist, public theologian, and ecumenical
minister whose work focuses upon healing the legacies of racial
and gender oppression. She's the author If I Bring the
Voices of My People, A Womanist Vision for Racial Reconciliation,
(47:34):
and Too Heavy a Yoke, Black Women and the Burden
of Strength. You should read both of these books because
they are necessary. But I want to talk a little
bit about Too Heavy a Yoke. I've talked here on
this podcast about just some of the health challenges I
have having been someone that was diagnosed with fibroids around
(47:56):
ten years ago, and I spoke in my last episode
Owed by fort a f story telling you all a
little bit about what that moment of my life was
like having to have a very invasive and complicated fibroid
removal surgery. And I had a long recovery. And during
that recovery I read three books. I read Edna Lewis's
(48:16):
cookbooks Slash Memoir, The Taste of Country Cooking. I read
Sisters of the Yam by Bell Hooks, and I read
Dr Shinique's book Too Heavy a Yoke. And I just
have a lot of feelings about Too Heavy a Yoke
because it really started a journey with me of understanding
(48:36):
that it's not that it's bad for me to be
strong as a black woman. It's that as a black woman,
I will enter so many spaces that people expect me
to be air quote strong through things and take certain
things that I don't need to take, and that it's
(48:56):
okay for me to be also weak. Sometimes it's okay
for me to not have the answers. It's okay for
me to make sure that I'm not doing other people's
work for them, whether that's their emotional work, their vocational work,
their work as it relates to racism and white supremacy.
(49:18):
Too Heavy a Yoke really got me to a place
of really reevaluating my life. And after reading that book,
I made a lot of different choices. I said no
to a lot of people and a lot of things
in an effort to remind myself that being a black
woman doesn't mean I need to be some sort of superhero.
It means I need to be human and beautiful and flawed,
(49:41):
and that I want to be healthy and that I
want to be here living as long as I can be.
But it will be detrimental to my health if I
feel like I have to be strong for everybody. So
if you're a black woman listening, this is a book
you need in your library. Too Heavy a Yoke, And
if you are working with black women, you are serving
or walking alongside black women in any capacity. I really
(50:04):
really recommend this book because it is very wonderful and
very important. I want to thank you Dr Shaniqua for
caping for black women the way you do, for reminding
us that we can be healthy and whole, that we
deserve healing, rest love, and restoration. Dr Shaniqua Walker Barnes
(50:26):
give her a crown. That time I met India Are,
That time I went on a really bad date. That
time I was directed by Robert Townsend. That time I
got Mono on Thanksgiving. That time I went on a
(50:50):
really bad Christmas tour. That time I'm with Amina Brown
is produced by Matt Owen for Solo Graffiti Productions as
a part of the Seneca Women Podcast Network and partnership
with I Heart Radio. Thanks for listening and don't forget
to subscribe, rate, and review the podcast.
That time, I'm at India Ire. That time I went
on a really bad date. That time I was directed
by Robert Townend. That time I got Mono on Thanksgiving.
That time I went on a really bad Christmas tour.
(00:33):
That time I'm I, Hey, y'all, welcome back to Her
with Amina Brown. And I feel like this episode, last episode,
and possibly the next two episodes all just feel like
a series of me telling y'all my business. So hey,
(00:54):
if that's what you come to this podcast for, if
you come here because you wanted to know my business,
then you have entered here at a good time, because
apparently something in my spirit is bringing up episode ideas
that me not need to come in here and tell
you all my business. But truthfully, that's what the Her
living room is for, right, That's how I come to
(01:15):
the living room with my girlfriends. I arrive, you know,
at their houses, you know, of course, in the before times.
But now like slowly but surely, as like I'm now
fully vaccinated and my friends are getting fully vaccinated, we're
able to get back to having our in personal living room,
which is so wonderful, and we just show up. If
you dress cute, okay, if you're not okay if you
(01:38):
just you know, in your sweatpants and your dirty sneakers
and you've got half a thing of hummus and I got,
you know, a third of a bell pepper. Then we
bring what we got to the table, to the couch,
to wherever we are, We light a candle and we
start talking. And so that's what I hope these episodes
are like for you. Also, thank you for listening. Today
(01:59):
we are talking about that time I went to therapy,
and specifically I'm talking today about the first time I
ever went to therapy. I was talking with someone recently
that has never been to therapy, and it sort of
made me go back in my own journey of thinking
about what it was that led me to actually go
to therapy, what that experience was like. So maybe you're
(02:22):
listening and you've never been to therapy and you've kind
of been thinking about going, and I'm hoping that things
I say don't discourage you. I'm hoping that things I
say encourage you to go to therapy. So I went
to therapy for the first time when I was twenty
five years old, and I'll tell you the interesting story
of what led to me going to therapy. So if
(02:42):
you've been listening to this podcast for a while, you
have heard me tell you the story of how I
got hired to work in Corporate America at twenty five
years old. And I thought that was going to be
super amazing because it was the first time that I
was getting paid to be a writer. And I discovered
within six months of being there that I hated that job.
And so around this time in my life, there were
(03:03):
a lot of things swirling. I was working my first
what felt like my first real job. It wasn't quite
my first real job. I had some real jobs before
this one, but this was what I felt like my first,
you know, grown up job where I went and bought
my first suits to where to work. Around this time,
I had also left a church for the first time.
(03:24):
And any of you that grew up in church or
that may have attended church may have had this experience,
which is a terrible one. I'm not gonna lie about it.
I had started going to a church when I first
moved to Atlanta for college, and attended that church all
through college and right up into my mid twenties, and
at the early parts of that it was what felt
(03:46):
like a wonderful and beautiful experience. It was a church
full of so many young people and had so much energy.
We were all, you know, wanting to be a part
of this movement for God type of things. And then
things over time just got more and more and more
unhealthy with the leadership there, to the point that it
(04:07):
caused me and a lot of other people that were
going to the church to have to leave it. And
this is all happening around the same time. I think
I left the church within a few months I got
this new job. So I'm just kind of out of
my element. Really, I am very much a church girl.
I'm sure if you've been listening to this podcast for
a while, you have gotten those vibes. I grew up
(04:28):
in church most of my life, so at this time
in my mid twenties, this is the first time that
I'm just not really attending church. I just decided to
take a complete break from church because prior to that
I have been very busy in church. I mean I
was almost at church to the point that that could
have been like another job or another part time job
(04:51):
that I had in addition to my regular job, and
so I just took a break. It was my first
time since I was twelve or thirteen years ole, that
I didn't attend church, that I wasn't in leadership at church,
that I didn't have church meetings to go to. And
so I think I'm giving you all of this to
tell you sort of what was swirling around at the
(05:13):
time that I actually start going to therapy. Another thing
that I realized at this moment is that I really
want to start dating. And I didn't really date in
high school. I think I went on one date in
high school and that was not including prom I didn't
date at all in college. And so by the time
(05:34):
I got to be especially when I started working this job,
that was my first time being around other people who
were my same age and hearing their dating stories, their
dating exploits, and realizing that I was not having that
(05:54):
experience at all. And I felt very inexperienced as far
as dating was concerned, right, And so I'm like, okay,
here I am, I'm like a grown woman. I have
been going to a church that was very patriarchal, right,
So it was basically like, as a single woman at
the church at the time, if I had decided to
(06:14):
date someone, I needed to bring this man I was
dating to my college ministry leader and he had to approve,
and then I was supposed to bring this man I
was dating to another leader of the church, and then
to the pastor. And if they all three of these
men said that it was okay for me to date
(06:34):
this man, then I could date him. And what that
robbed me of that I didn't realize at the time,
is it robbed me of my own ability to discern
from myself, my own ability to discern is this man
a safe man to be around? Is this man someone
who wants to be committed to me or even wants
to be in a relationship. Like before I take you
(06:57):
through all this, you know, whatever, what do I feel
about it? What do I think about it when I
go in my own spirituality and talk to God? What
am I feeling is the right thing for me to
do to move forward? So giving you all of this
to say, I am feeling very much fish out of
water in this moment. I'm working my first what feels
like my first grown job. I'm out of my church
(07:19):
bubble right and as I'm meeting people at work and
other places, I'm starting to go out and have social
activities with people that I don't go to church with.
And I know to some of you this just sounds
completely strange, you know, but I want to express to
you how much of a bubble church had been for me.
That church was not just the place where I was,
(07:41):
you know, practicing my religion or being encouraged in my faith.
It was also pretty much the center of my social life. Right.
So at the moment that I'm leaving this church environment,
I'm not just you know, having to walk away from
a place that I thought was going to be good
from my faith. I'm also walking away from my social
life as well. So I am just out with people
(08:06):
I work with, out with friends I've met online at
happy hours when I was coming from a church where
we weren't even allowed to drink, right. So I'm starting
to meet some guys and just almost feeling very stunted
inside myself, feeling like my age is twenty five, but
(08:27):
my reaction to dating men is as if I'm like
fourteen dating a boy for the first time, you know.
And I was trying. I was trying. I was going
on different dates. Sometimes they were going well, most times
they weren't. I was very uncomfortable even with the thought
of like sitting across the table at coffee or at
(08:49):
dinner with a man that I found attractive. And to
give you some context, I had also been raised as
a child in church environments that basically sort of gave
you two extremes. You know that you either were, in
my case, having a guy that was more like a
brother to you, or you were getting married. It was
(09:09):
sort of like there was no there was no middle ground.
There was no conversation about how you casually date someone.
It's basically like you do these two things, and you know,
if you don't do it this way, it's dangerous or
it's sinful or all of those types of thoughts. So
I really had no middle ground, no nuance as it
(09:32):
related to dating. But I wanted to date and I
wanted to be in a good and healthy relationship with
a man. I really did, so I would go out
on dates and have crushes. And the job where I
was working, there were three other women that were hired
in that same position in the company, and so we
all four of us kind of became two peas in
a pod. We were very like, you know, it felt
(09:55):
like we were like the United Colors of been Aton
you know, there was one other black woman. There was
a career and a woman, and then there was a
white woman. There's four of us. We would hang out,
and each of us at different stages. None of us
were married, but each of us at different stages between
some of us having been in very committed dating relationships
for a long time and some of us still out
there casually dating. And there was one coworker in particular
(10:17):
of the four of us, the other black woman. She
and I our cubicles were closest to each other. And
I can't remember exactly the circumstances, y'all, but I remember
I met a guy and we were just starting to
talk on the phone, and I it was just making
me very nervous talking to him. And I was coming
(10:38):
in her cube a lot to talk to her about
it and processing and processing and processing and overprocessing and
couldn't figure out what to do about this, what to
do about that. And this is not the first dating
situation she's heard me kind of try to process. And
I just remember one afternoon she looked at me and
she said, you know what, I don't really think I
can help you figure this out. I think what you
(10:59):
need is to go to therapy, and I remember sitting
in her cubicle, sitting across from her. I remember my
face just feeling hot because I felt embarrassed because I
couldn't tell what it was I had said to her
that made her feel like I needed to go to therapy.
(11:20):
And I was somewhere between feeling embarrassed and insulted and
really thankful and helped. I talked to her a little
bit longer, and then I went right to my cubicle
and started googling options of therapists to find, and I
(11:42):
looked up a couple of them. I think after work,
I called a couple of the ones that I picked
out and I talked to Remember I talked to a man,
I talked to a woman, and the woman she was
an older, white woman, and I don't know, I just
felt the most comfortable with her, and so I made
(12:04):
my first therapy appointment with her. After we talked on
the phone for maybe ten or fifteen minutes. She had
a very soothing voice, and I don't know, it just
felt like safe and right to me. So I made
an appointment with her. And one of the things that
she asked for before my first appointment is she asked
(12:24):
me to write her a letter, and in the letter,
she wanted me to write what were the areas of
my life where I hoped to grow during therapy? And
I remember getting home. I was in my apartment, my
first apartment, all by myself. I didn't have any roommates
(12:45):
or housemates or anything. So I was really proud of
that little apartment. I was proud of my little full
granted countertops in there. And I remember being in that
apartment and I think, y'all, I think I actually I'm
trying to remember did I handwrite that letter. I think
I may have handwritten that letter, and I remember handwriting
(13:06):
it and crying while I was handwriting it. Because just
sort of sitting down to think about what are areas
I hope to experience healing in what are areas that
have been painful to me that I really haven't had
(13:26):
time or the tools to process. And it just all
started coming out at once, everything about the church, about God,
about my parents divorced, about things that I was, you know,
processing from my family of origin. I just wrote and
wrote and wrote and wrote, and then I think this
(13:47):
is so old school now, y'all. I could have typed
it up, but for some reason, I think I handwrote it,
and I think I I actually think I handwrote it,
and she either asked me to send a copy to
her or I scanned it and sent the coffee to
her that way. Now I'm just like, why wouldn't you
just email this? But anyways, I sent all that to her,
(14:09):
and I can't even remember actually all of what we
talked about in that first session, but I remember being
nervous about it because it is a very weird feeling
to just start talking about such intimate things with a stranger.
But I made this commitment to myself too, you know,
(14:32):
come and see her every other week. That was the schedule.
And honestly, I was at what I now know was
such a pivotal time in my development because there was
so much of my life that had been built around
Church and around what Church had told me that I
had to be as a woman, as a young woman,
(14:52):
as a black woman. There were a lot of layers
to that, and she was helping me work through a
lot of that very early on. And when I think
back on it, the idea that you would have a
friend that would look at you and say, I think
you need to go to therapy. It's like, depending on
(15:13):
where you are, you know, your first instinct could be
to be defensive, to be like, why why would you
say that about me? What's wrong with me? I mean,
any of you that are fans of Insecure, and if
you're not, I hope you watch it. But there is
a scene between two characters between Issa and Molly in
one of the seasons where Issa is trying to convince
(15:38):
Molly that she needs to go to therapy and Molly
doesn't take it very well at first. And when I
watched that scene, I totally felt her on that, you know,
and the coworker that had this moment with me, you know,
we've lost touch outside of seeing her on Facebook every
now and then. But I am so thankful that she
(15:59):
had the courage to say that to me because it
really did change my life for the better because I
don't know if I ever would have pushed myself to
do it. But when she said it, even though I
felt embarrassed, I also felt like she wasn't telling a lie.
I felt like it was true. So you know, you
may have a friend in your life that you are
(16:19):
close to you're watching them go through some hard things.
You're watching them struggle, You're watching them maybe have some
unhealthy patterns. And it can be the most loving thing
to suggest to someone therapy, and it can be the
most loving thing you can do for yourself to submit
to the process of therapy. But it can also be hard.
(16:42):
I think you have to prepare yourself. If you are
talking to a friend or a family member and you
suggest to them therapy, not everyone is going to respond with, oh,
thank you so much. I I have always longed for
someone to tell me that I have problems enough that
I need to see a professional. But that's the thing, right.
I think sometimes we have this stigma about therapy, like like, well,
(17:04):
I'm air quotes normal or you know, I'm fine. Therapy
is for those people that are going through this, or
those people that have this diagnosis or whatever, and therapies
for those people, But therapies for you too. Even when
you feel you may feel like your life is going
pretty well overall. You know, you may feel almost guilty,
like why do I why should I go to therapy
(17:26):
and complain about my life or whatever? But therapy is
not about that, I learned. It's really about giving yourself
the space and time to heal and sometimes, honestly, we
go through things, or we experience things in our upbringing
or in different times of our life, and they are
very hard things, they're very traumatic things, but they become
(17:49):
normal to us, so we don't think about it like
I maybe I ought to go to therapy based on
my relationship with this person, or maybe I should go
to therapy and process this thing that happened when I
was a kid, because that was just your family growing up,
or that was just what happened. You don't always see
yourself in the same way that someone else can see
(18:09):
you from the outside looking in. So it was totally
a very humbling and somewhat embarrassing moment that led me
to therapy. But I'm glad that I went ahead and
took that initiative and looked into it for myself. How
did I grow from therapy? I think one of the
things Actually my first therapist, I saw her every other
(18:32):
week for a year and a half, so she walked
me through a lot of life. I mean, we were
obviously sort of having to deal with a lot of
things from the past because it was my first therapy
session at years old. And then once we had talked
about a lot of sort of these pent up things
that I really hadn't had a healthy way to process before.
(18:52):
With a professional then I was able to kind of
let her in on things that were going on in
my life, you know, man, I was dating or decisions
I was trying to make about my career and different
things like that. And I think one of the things
that therapy helped me to do was therapy helped me
to find my voice. You know, I am a classic
oldest kid. I am very much a person that can
(19:16):
lean towards people pleasing and going to therapy helped me
to really separate myself and my desires from the expectations
and feelings of other people, and that was really really hard.
I remember a lot of our sessions were about me
saying to my therapist, well, here's the conversation I had
(19:36):
where here's what they said. And I don't want to
make them feel angry or I don't want to make
them feel hurt. I don't want to make them feel
like I don't care. So even though I don't want
to do this, or even though this isn't the best
thing for me, I'm going to do that because I
don't want this person to feel like that. And I
remember the first time my therapist said, but you realize
(19:58):
that you don't make anyone feel anything, right, She was like,
you realize that people feel their feelings and make their
own choices, that you deciding to do something that's healthy
for you, it's not you making someone angry because you
doing what's healthy for you doesn't meet their expectation. She
(20:20):
was like, it's them choosing to be angry that you
holding up your healthy boundary means you're not doing what
they expected of you or what they selfishly wanted from you.
And I will tell y'all that sometimes, you know, I've
now had quite a few therapists over the years, and
I'll tell you that sometimes my initial gut response to
(20:43):
the things my therapist says in session is like super
skeptical that I basically end up being like, yeah, girl,
I hear what you're saying, but I'm not sure if
like you actually went to the proper cool for this,
Like I feel like maybe they didn't give you the
(21:04):
education that you needed because I thought you were supposed
to come in here and just tell me what I
want to hear, not like challenge me to grow and
stuff like I don't. I'm not sure that's what I
signed up for here. So I have definitely been the
person that enters a therapy session my therapist starts kicking
the truth to me, and then then I'll be like, okay, girl,
(21:28):
well I don't think you really understand what it's like
to be me. And then by the end of the session,
I'm like, you're right. The first thing you say because
about feelings, they are her and not like that's totally me,
like starts off super super skeptical, super like you don't know,
and then like thirty minutes later, when she's trying to
tell me it's about time for us to end the session,
(21:50):
like crying my eyes out because the first thing she
said was actually true. So I feel like therapy helped
me in that way. Even though it's challenging right to
hear someone saying those things to you, therapy helped me
to learn how to say no. Saying no it still
can be hard for me sometimes, but back then it
was very very hard for me to say no, especially
(22:10):
if they were people that I really loved and cared about.
I would rather say no to myself and say yes
to them, And it's therapy that helped me begin the
rhythm of learning that sometimes I need to say yes
to myself and that saying yes to myself, even if
it means no to other people, is one of the
healthiest things I can do. And I was not coming
(22:32):
into therapy with that kind of rhythm. I basically felt like,
you know, I needed especially if people are you know,
important to me or I value you know, their thoughts
or opinions, I need to I need to really do
what they say they probably know better than me. And
I'm not saying you shouldn't have people in your life
that our wise can advise you, can you know, give
(22:55):
you feedback on things. But I think going to therapy
is what really taught me to make sure that in
the process of me gaining you know, wisdom and advice
from other people, that I'm not silencing the wisdom that's
inside of me. That no one else knows me better
than I know myself, and of course in my spirituality,
(23:15):
it's like the only person know me better than myself
is God. There's no human being that's gonna know me
better than I know myself. And if I honor my
own voice and my own feelings and desires. That's me
being loving towards myself. That's me being kind and gentle
to myself. I'll also say one of the things that
(23:35):
therapy helped me with is giving me the tools on
what it means to have to have hard conversations. And
I think because you know, I was growing up in
a home without my dad, I was growing up, you know,
coming from divorced parents. You know, I think that brought
up a lot of fears of doing something that would
(23:56):
make the people that love me leave me. I think
that was like a thought under their but I didn't
realize that until I was sitting there in therapy, And
so I would avoid conflict because I would feel like,
if we have conflict, then the results of us having
conflict will be you're going to leave. And therapy taught
(24:16):
me it's okay to have those kinds of hard conversations
with people you love. And the people who love you,
the people who really want the best for you, like
they're gonna dig in on those hard conversations with you
because they don't want to leave. They want you to
be well, They want you to have what you needn't want,
and they want to have what they needn't want in
(24:36):
the relationship or friendship or family relationship, whatever it is,
or even work relationships too. I think therapy helped me
to realize I can speak up for myself. I can
assert myself if something happens and I don't like it,
or if I'm in a relationship or a situation and
someone is treating me in a way that I don't
(24:57):
like that, I am empowered to say I don't like it,
I don't want this, this doesn't feel good to me.
Here's what I'd rather do instead. And it took me
being in therapy to get to the point where I
could do those things and not feel bad about it
or not feel like I was being demanding. I think
that was my thing. It was almost like asserting my
(25:19):
own boundaries. Just healthy boundaries felt like being demanding to me,
when an actuality, it wasn't being demanding at all. It
was just asking for what I deserve as another human being.
You know, since this time after I had that initial
(25:55):
therapy session, I have gone on to have other therapists
sense and I just kind of ebb and flow out
of that. I go through some seasons where I'm in
therapy on a much more consistent basis. I go through
some seasons where I would go to therapy once a month.
I go through some seasons where I didn't go to
therapy at all. I've done in person therapy, I've done
(26:17):
online therapy, so I've had a lot of different experiences.
I have had some funny ones, though, and sometimes when
funny things happened to me, it's like, I can't tell
if those things happen to me because I'm because I
have like that, you know, ignorant part of my brain
that people who are comedians or who perform on stage
(26:39):
have or what. But I did participate in online therapy
for a while, and those of you that have been
listening to this podcast know that I actually returned back
to therapy around in the beginning of and I talked
more about this and actually talk a little bit about
it in the previous episode of my for the a
(27:00):
f Story. But I also talked about this at length
in my behind the Poetry episode on Here Breathing, and
at this time I want to talk a little bit
too about therapy being expensive. I've definitely had some seasons
of life where I really wanted to be in therapy.
I felt like I needed it, but I just couldn't
afford it, you know. And in that way, it is
(27:22):
important to acknowledge that therapy, therapy, I will say, it
shouldn't be a luxury, because we need a therapist in
our life the same way we need access to health
care and being able to make sure our bodies are
cared for. We need that for our mental state, our
mental health as well, you know. But I've gone through
seasons like that where I really needed a therapist, but
(27:47):
I couldn't afford to have one. When I first started therapy,
I was working in corporate America, I was living alone,
you know, I was really making more money than I
needed to live at that time, and so going to
therapy every other week, or if I wanted to go
every week, I could afford to do it at that time.
And then when I quit working corporate and started doing
(28:09):
writing and performing full time, there would be seasons I
could and then there would be seasons I couldn't afford therapy.
And that's also a hard thing too. That's the thing
that I hope changes. I hope that and we're you know,
seeing some ways that there are organizations and different ways
they were trying to make therapy truly accessible to all,
(28:31):
because we can all look at our own lives and
think of things that we need to talk about it.
You know, we need a professional to help us process
through this, you know, and we all know other people
that we wish they had therapy that was accessible to
them to help them heal through some of their own things.
But one of my funniest therapy experiences I was doing
(28:53):
online therapy, one of these services where like, you sign
up and you know, you're able to either do phone
calls or video calls with your therapist, but you can
also write to them or text to them, right, And
so I had signed up for one of these and
it was a little different than the way they are now.
Back then, the price point was actually saving me money,
(29:14):
Like I could afford it more easily than I, you know,
could have afforded just the therapy sessions one on one.
So I signed up for this, and at this point
and ever since, I've been very determined that my therapist
should be a black woman, especially after having worked in
all white spaces or predominantly white spaces, I've realized, you know,
(29:35):
I need a therapist that I can talk to about
how white supremacy affects me talk to about, you know,
how I'm processing being a black woman, you know, having
my hair being in my body and my skin in
the world. And there's just been something very healing to
me to be talking about that with another black woman
who understands a lot, you know, in her own way
(29:57):
of what it's like to walk in the world this way.
So I had my first assigned therapist. It was assigned
to me through this online service, and you know, she
really helped me. Actually, if you listen to the last episode,
I was telling this story about grief, and she was
really one of the first people to alert me that
(30:18):
a lot of what I was experiencing when my mental
health was not in a good place was because I
had a lot of unprocessed grief. And she was the
first UH therapist to really name that for me and
helped me to start thinking through that. But the downside
to her is whenever we had our sessions, she was
always busy doing a little bit of something else. Like
(30:41):
one of our sessions, someone rang the doorbell to give
her a package. But I'm like hearing the whole thing.
So apparently, of course she's doing her sessions from home.
So I'm hearing her like, oh, is that at the door?
Who is that? I was not expecting anybody while I'm
like spilling my guts here, So I'm listening to her
like open the door, talk to the delivery person, sign whatever.
(31:06):
So I was like, Okay, you know she's at home.
She can't control of the package got delivered. You know,
I'm gonna try to like move on and try another session.
So the next session that I tried, y'all, I'm gonna
try to demonstrate for y'all what it sounded like. So
I'm spilling my guts about whatever, and in the background,
I want you all to know that I hear something
(31:26):
that sounds like this. I hear that in the background, y'all,
while I'm trying to share my feelings. Okay, So after
a while, I kind of get quiet, just because I
don't know what's going on, and she finally says, oh,
(31:50):
I'm sorry, I'm babysitting my grandson and he normally doesn't
keep this type of noise. And at that moment, I
was like, Okay, this lady seems very week, but she
cannot be my therapist. You cannot be babysitting your grandson
and will have in therapy with me while I'm trying
to tell you about all my woes and whatever is
going on with me, Like, girl, I can't, I can't
(32:11):
deal with this. No. So I did have some very
comical times of experiencing various therapists, for sure. But one
thing that I also will say that therapy has taught
me over the years is you know, it's wonderful to
have just a great support system overall. You need that too,
(32:32):
And I have to say, I'm just very thankful, very
blessed to have, you know, a wonderful and supportive spouse.
I have a wonderful, supportive family. I have great friends
in my life, Like my community is wonderful. And there
are times that you're going to go through something, experience something,
(32:52):
have something resurface that your friends or your family, or
your spouse like may not have the capac city to
really help you in the way that you need help.
And that's what my coworker was trying to tell me.
I think she was trying to say, like, girl, how
can process this with you in the cubicle. You know,
we can talk it over, girl, But you're reaching beyond
(33:16):
what I have The expertise to help you with and
even though it can feel strange going to like this
stranger to talk to them about these really deep and
personal things, it's also nice to talk to someone that
doesn't have any skin in the game, right, Like, if
you're going there to talk about some stuff you're going through.
You might have people in your life that love you,
(33:37):
but they have strong opinions about what they think you
ought to do about this, or they have strong opinions
about why they think you ended up in this situation.
And when you go into your therapist, especially if your
therapist is healthy and professional and you know doing the
things that they should do, you're going to somebody who
has no skin in the game. If you buy the
(33:59):
house or not, they have no skin in the game.
If you break up with that person or not, they
have no skin in the game. If you have kids,
if you don't have kids, if you get married, if
you don't get married, they don't have skin in the game.
On that. They are there to be a sounding board
for you to help you continue on in your healing process.
And I learned that from being in therapy too. What
(34:22):
would be my tips for anyone going to therapy for
the first time. So if you're listening and maybe you've
been on the fence, maybe you've talked to some other
folks about their experiences going to therapy, but you've never
been yourself. What would be my tips are going to
therapy for the first time. I think one of the
most daunting things about going to therapy for the first time,
(34:44):
or even if you've been to therapy before and you're
no longer seeing your previous therapist and you need a
new therapist, I think one of the most daunting things
is finding a therapist that works for you. And it
can just feel like you have a thousand options. Where
do you begin? Where do you start? How do you know?
Do you just sign up and just go pay somebody?
(35:05):
And what if you don't like them, or what if
you feel like they're not the best fit for you
or whatever. So my first tip that I would say is,
first of all, make a commitment to yourself to find
a therapist and give yourself some patients that it may
take you some time to find someone. I remember when
I was looking for a gynecologist. I know we're not
(35:26):
talking about that on this episode. I'm just using this
as an example. I realized a couple of years ago,
you know, I really need to have I know some
of y'all like this is basic, but I'm explaining it
to you how you know, we can have these types
of appointments or things that we need, and we just
kind of keep pushing it back, keep pushing it back,
and eventually just have to decide like, Okay, this is
(35:48):
what I need to do now. So I remember when
I was like, okay, like I've you know, been to
a family practitioner doctor. You know, I've had some surgeries,
I've done this, I've done that. You know, it's certain
other parts of the body have been looked at. But hey,
I need a gynecologist. And there's a lot of factors
of what I want to find in a gynecologist. And
so I just had to make it my part time
(36:10):
job for a week or two that I would spend
a certain amount of time just you know, looking through
our insurance website to see who was in network and
then go into their websites and cross reference with the help.
I know it's a lot, but this is what I
do so I can be sure about it, okay. And
so when it comes to finding a therapist, I think
it's okay that it may take you time to find
(36:31):
someone that you're a good fit with. And thankfully, there
are a lot more resources out there. There are lots
and lots of resources, but I'm just gonna name some
that I know of and that have been helpful to me,
And maybe these will even give you ideas of other
things that you may be able to search and find
and don't worry about remembering all of this. These links
will be in the show notes on Amina brown dot
(36:53):
com slash her with Amina so that you can check
out all these links. Um. One of the places I
found one of my first therapist was on the Psychology
Today website and they do have this database there where
therapist and counselors can register to be listed. There. You
can search by their specialty. So you may be looking
(37:16):
for a family counselor you may be looking for a
therapist for a teenager in your life. You may be
looking for someone that specializes in trauma informed therapy. You
may be looking for someone that specializes in divorce right
or specializes in working with folks who are in the
l g B t Q plus community right. There are
(37:37):
all sorts of different things you can search there according
to what your comfort level is, according to what you
know you're looking for. So psychology today can be a
really great resource for that. I want to give a big,
big shout out to Therapy for Black Girl. This is
actually where I found My current therapist is on Therapy
for Black Girls, and so they do have a database
(37:58):
Black women. If you're listening and you're looking for therapists
that are really specialized in being able to give this
type of care to black women, that has been a
very helpful site for me. And honestly, just scrolling through
there and seeing the beautiful faces of other Black women
just even that by itself was so wonderful. And I
(38:20):
would also check out Therapy for Latin X. You can
check out their website as well as their Instagram. They
can be a great beginning place to find folks who
are going to be really uh educated and thoughtful about
giving this type of care to the Latin X community
as well. And these are just a couple of things
(38:40):
I'm listening. I know that there are probably even more
resources out there, but these are good places to start
and give you some ideas of other things you can google.
Right you may find some other places that would give
you information like this also want to give a shout
out to Open Path Collective. A friend of mine also
hipped me to this because, as I was saying earlier,
(39:01):
therapy can be cost prohibitive for some folks. I'm shouting
out Open Path Collective because they do also have a
database of therapists on their site who have agreed to
take on a certain number of clients at a discounted rate.
You may also have a local places where you live
that are taking clients but are taking them at a
(39:22):
sliding scale based on income. So we have a lot
more work to do to make therapy accessible, but there
are some ways that you can get the help that
you need, even if you're at a place where you
know money is not really a thing that you have
to give to this, so it may require a little
bit of searching. And if you find that you're in
(39:45):
a in a space inside yourself where even the googling
the looking is difficult for you, this could be something
where if you have a close friend or family member
that would be willing to sit with you maybe while
you're searching, or you know, they might be able to
pull up their phone too and look for some things.
You know, it's okay to ask for help when you
need it, and it's okay to ask for the kind
(40:07):
of support that you need as well. Uh. The other
tip that I would give if it's your first time
going into therapy is I would say that it's okay
to do some therapist interviews. I know the first times
I went to different websites of therapists and I would
just get really nervous, like what if I click on
this and I pay this money for this session and
(40:27):
then I don't really, you know, gel with the therapist.
So one of the things that I did the last
couple of times I was looking for a therapist is
once I found them, I would go to their website,
and a lot of therapists already have these types of
requests on their site where you can request just an
informational interview. It's not a therapy session, it's not a
(40:47):
mini therapy session or anything like that. They're not giving
you any sort of counsel or therapy in this interview
call that you have. It's typically free of charge, and
it gives you an opportunity to ask them some question
stions and gives them an opportunity to get to know
you a little bit, to get to know what is
bringing you to want therapy, And so that's been really
(41:08):
helpful for me because normally, if I walk away from
that conversation feeling like I don't know, then that normally
means that person is probably not the best fit for me.
But even if you go to a therapist website and
they don't have any like free uh conversations or consultations
that are normally pretty short fifteen or thirty minutes, you
can also write in and request and say, you know,
(41:28):
I'm in the process of looking for a therapist, I
would like to schedule an informational interview with you. And
in that interview, what would typically happen is you would
bring your questions that you have questions like, maybe you
want to know how they typically begin their work with
new clients. Maybe you want to know what you can
expect from a session. Maybe you want to know if
(41:48):
there is certain prep that you should do before a session.
Maybe you want to know what their education is or
what their background is, what they specialize in, the types
of patients that they or types of clients that they
typically see. Um depending on what your needs are, you
may want to know, are they in the type of
field where they can prescribe medication to you if you
(42:11):
need that or not. Um those are important things to
differentiate as well if you are in need of a
psychologist or if you are in need of a psychiatrist. Right,
So it's just about you knowing what your needs are.
But there are a lot of professionals that are interested
in you feeling comfortable and getting a chance to you know,
answer your own get your own questions answered rather and
(42:33):
also uh, they can get some answers from you. You know,
get to know a little bit about you, get to
know a little bit about what your expectations are, what
your needs and wants might be at the moment. So
don't be afraid to do that. That's sort of a
no cost way for you to kind of get a
vibe for who you might like to actually have as
your therapist. And that has brought me a lot of
(42:53):
peace of mind and help me to decide between a
couple of therapists. Lastly, what in ouragement would I want
to give you regarding therapy, especially if this is your
first time or it could be your first time in
a long time. And I think therapy can be scary.
I think it's scary because we are thinking about how
(43:16):
it's going to feel to sort of drudge up some
of the things that therapy may bring up. It can
be scary because of the unknown factor. You know, here
we are talking to this person that we're just now
meeting about stuff that we wouldn't even talk to a
lot of people that we know about. You know, it
can be scary, and I think there is a lot
of unknown in the healing process. But my biggest encouragement
(43:39):
to you is therapy is it's one of the best
things that you can do to pour back into yourself.
And I want to specifically speak to those of you
that are listening right now that are the people that
give out to everyone else. You're the person that other
people come to for advice. You're the one that drops
everything to go help out this or that family member
(44:00):
or and when you commit to that hour or so
of that therapy session, it's one way that you're communicating
to yourself that I am worth giving this time to myself.
I'm worth allowing myself to heal and to process things,
even if they're painful, and it can be hard to
face our pain. There's nothing easy about that. There's nothing
(44:20):
fun about that. But if facing your pain and facing
the hard things that have happened to you, or the
hard things that you may have done in your life,
whatever it is that you have to face, you know
it can be hard to face it. But on the
other side of facing it and beginning to process it
and getting the tools for how to walk through your life,
(44:41):
you'll find that you are a healthier person. On the
other side of it, you'll find that your heart is
more open to love and to be loved. And that
love starts with you. It starts with how you love yourself.
You giving that kindness to yourself, You're giving the same
energy that you may give to other people, you returning
that energy to yourself also. So will it be scary?
(45:04):
Could it be hard at times going through the healing process? Absolutely?
But is it worth it? It is absolutely worth it.
And the tough thing but also uh, the important thing
I think to remember is none of us as human
beings are ever going to be fully done with issues
to deal with. That's just a part of our humanity.
(45:25):
We're always going to have something that we're healing from,
you know, and so therapy and whatever other you know
things you have in your life that can help you
in healthy ways to process your life, to process the pain,
but also to process the joy and process the good
things that happens to UM. I think it's important to
(45:46):
have that space. It's good and it can be really
helpful to remember that, so that way you're not putting
pressure on yourself, like you've got to complete this plan
that's going to be thirty three steps, and at the
end of the thirty three steps you'll be done with this.
You know, there'll be some things in life you may
never be done with it, but you'll find yourself incrementally growing,
(46:06):
becoming more whole, experiencing more peace, sleeping better at night,
and so on. So, even though there's been a lot
of shame and stigma to therapy, there's been some shame
and stigma attached to medication and and certain diagnoses and
all those things. I want to be a part of
us removing that shame and that you should do whatever
(46:28):
you need to do to take care of yourself, whether
it's therapy or medication or exploring different types of therapy.
You have a lot of options. But if you're hearing me,
then you're on the fence about this. I hope you
feel encouraged to do what you can to take care
of yourself because we want you here, and we want
you here healthy and whole and being kind and loving
(46:48):
to yourself. That's my that time I went to therapy,
and y'all, I'm still going. I'm still gonna be going.
I'm not gonna be done with therapy. The rest of
my life. I will still be going. And if that's
something you need in your life right now, I hope
you will too. For this week's edition of Give Her
(47:13):
a Crown, I want to shout out Dr Shaniqua Walker Barnes.
Dr Shaniqua is a clinical psychologist, public theologian, and ecumenical
minister whose work focuses upon healing the legacies of racial
and gender oppression. She's the author If I Bring the
Voices of My People, A Womanist Vision for Racial Reconciliation,
(47:34):
and Too Heavy a Yoke, Black Women and the Burden
of Strength. You should read both of these books because
they are necessary. But I want to talk a little
bit about Too Heavy a Yoke. I've talked here on
this podcast about just some of the health challenges I
have having been someone that was diagnosed with fibroids around
(47:56):
ten years ago, and I spoke in my last episode
Owed by fort a f story telling you all a
little bit about what that moment of my life was
like having to have a very invasive and complicated fibroid
removal surgery. And I had a long recovery. And during
that recovery I read three books. I read Edna Lewis's
(48:16):
cookbooks Slash Memoir, The Taste of Country Cooking. I read
Sisters of the Yam by Bell Hooks, and I read
Dr Shinique's book Too Heavy a Yoke. And I just
have a lot of feelings about Too Heavy a Yoke
because it really started a journey with me of understanding
(48:36):
that it's not that it's bad for me to be
strong as a black woman. It's that as a black woman,
I will enter so many spaces that people expect me
to be air quote strong through things and take certain
things that I don't need to take, and that it's
(48:56):
okay for me to be also weak. Sometimes it's okay
for me to not have the answers. It's okay for
me to make sure that I'm not doing other people's
work for them, whether that's their emotional work, their vocational work,
their work as it relates to racism and white supremacy.
(49:18):
Too Heavy a Yoke really got me to a place
of really reevaluating my life. And after reading that book,
I made a lot of different choices. I said no
to a lot of people and a lot of things
in an effort to remind myself that being a black
woman doesn't mean I need to be some sort of superhero.
It means I need to be human and beautiful and flawed,
(49:41):
and that I want to be healthy and that I
want to be here living as long as I can be.
But it will be detrimental to my health if I
feel like I have to be strong for everybody. So
if you're a black woman listening, this is a book
you need in your library. Too Heavy a Yoke, And
if you are working with black women, you are serving
or walking alongside black women in any capacity. I really
(50:04):
really recommend this book because it is very wonderful and
very important. I want to thank you Dr Shaniqua for
caping for black women the way you do, for reminding
us that we can be healthy and whole, that we
deserve healing, rest love, and restoration. Dr Shaniqua Walker Barnes
(50:26):
give her a crown. That time I met India Are,
That time I went on a really bad date. That
time I was directed by Robert Townsend. That time I
got Mono on Thanksgiving. That time I went on a
(50:50):
really bad Christmas tour. That time I'm with Amina Brown
is produced by Matt Owen for Solo Graffiti Productions as
a part of the Seneca Women Podcast Network and partnership
with I Heart Radio. Thanks for listening and don't forget
to subscribe, rate, and review the podcast.
Popular Podcasts
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com