The Greatest Film of All Time

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
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(01:58):
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This that hit me right in the chest when Jane
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I think was here to stay.

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I think, I think so.

Speaker 3 (03:51):
I think so.

Speaker 7 (03:52):
I think the new one, twenty twenty five edition, Humber History.
It feels right, it does feels good. It feels good.
We've got a guest on the show today to talk
about and I'm going to tease this really hard before
we go to a quick early episode commercial break to
talk about the greatest movie of all time and who
was in it and how it was made.

Speaker 5 (04:15):
Bo.

Speaker 3 (04:15):
You know my feelings on the greatest movie of all time?

Speaker 7 (04:18):
That's right, I mean I danced to the song from
this movie at my wedding with my wife. This is
the single greatest film of all And I'm not even
gonna tell him. I'm not even gonna tell him, not yet.

Speaker 5 (04:31):
I was.

Speaker 6 (04:32):
Yeah, I was physically present for you wedding. Mentally by
that point in time, by the time the dancing started.

Speaker 5 (04:39):
Probably not.

Speaker 7 (04:41):
We drank an entire bottle with four roses that morning.

Speaker 5 (04:45):
Yeah, that is true, and I'm pretty sure.

Speaker 7 (04:48):
Well I should. I should preface you drank half a
bottle of four roses and I got a sip.

Speaker 6 (04:56):
Yeah, because I'm almost certain the priest was like, don't
show up wrong, and I'm like, say.

Speaker 7 (05:02):
Boy, I do remember that. I do remember that. So
before we before we bring our guests on, and before
we get started with the episode, let's just let's just
knock out commercials. Yeah, let's just knock that out. You know. Hey,
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I mentioned it right there at the top of the episode.
But here we are yet again, just six minutes later.
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links for more information down in the show notes and
in the description of this episode. But I think right

(07:21):
now what we'll do is we'll go ahead and we'll
bring on our guest. And I think bo, I mean
really truly, I said that we're gonna call this, uh,
you know, Chaz mana and the greatest movie of all time. Ah,
I really think we need to stick with that. I think,

(07:42):
you know, dear Chaz has been a great friend of
the show for a very long time. So it's time
to bring Chas on our guest panel. There, he is
welcome to Welcome to Homber History, Chaz.

Speaker 3 (07:58):
Thank you, guys. It's great to be here. To privilege
and an honor to see your grown up faces now
and become fellow fathers. Welcome to the club.

Speaker 5 (08:08):
Yeah.

Speaker 7 (08:08):
The race home when you called to make sure that
you had to shave or didn't have to shave, that
was the race home from Baton Rouge. I was about
twenty minutes away from the house. Like, yeah, yeah, that's fine, shave,
don't shave whatever. All to try and get a little
fifteen month old through her mop time. So here we are,

(08:32):
Here we are, Chaz. I call it the greatest movie
of all time. I mean, I really seriously believe that
there is no better film than Casablanca. I just it's
so hard to think of something that could even top it,
so hard to think of something that comes close. And

(08:53):
you are, among many other things, a talented actor, you
are a film and kind of sore. You're a wonderful
voice in the historic community, and that you kind of
breathe the present into this moment. Thank you about uh
you think about Casa Balca.

Speaker 3 (09:11):
So many things to talk about. By the way, it's
it's the most talked about film, only second to no
I'm sorry, only Citizen Kane is second to it. Citizen Kane.
The way it's shot, the way it's plotted, the tempo rhythm,
these were innovations from the Buimar Republic's age of film,

(09:35):
which was arguably the most risky filmmaker. And I say
that because as a filmmaker, so it's so easy, even
even with the small budgets that I have. You know,
I don't do anything less than a million bucks, which
is really below the bottom room, you know, to compete

(09:56):
with the big fish.

Speaker 5 (09:57):
What what the what f it's land.

Speaker 3 (10:01):
Did? For instance, and courtiese before he came to the US.
What they were doing was inventing different ways to tell stories,
right bottom shots, tilted shots. These things that we think
were first shown with Citizen Kane were actually developed about
twenty years before. It's just that nobody really appreciated it,

(10:24):
and it needed somebody who had spent some time in Europe,
and that was that was Orson Welles. And I mentioned
that because the only other film that's been written about
maybe competing with it is Citizen Kane. And in fact,
the American Film Institute back in nineteen ninety eight the
end of the twentieth century, asked it's members but also

(10:48):
film professionals, what the top five films in history were,
because by then, of course we had about one hundred
years of history. We had the Luvier brothers working early,
we had The Trip to the Moon I think came
out in like nineteen ninety nine, ninety seven, maybe a

(11:11):
little later, but we had veritably one hundred years a century.
The top films were Citizen Kane at number four, Gone
with the Wind number three, The Wizard of Oz was
number one. Number two was Casablanca, according to the American

(11:33):
Film Institute. Now think about that, this is this was
just another film that was cranked out, you know, like
the sausage machines that were that were the MGMs of
Paramount cr RKO and Warner Brothers. That year Warner Brothers,
it came out with forty nine films, forty nine films

(11:55):
within the span of one year, with eighty seven contract
did actors and about anywhere between one hundred to two
hundred depending on the project crew, you know, people sometimes
that were borrowed from the other from the other studios.
It also included actors. That's remarkable.

Speaker 7 (12:13):
Mh.

Speaker 3 (12:15):
They had about five sound stages right or film stages,
and you just do just multiply that, you know, and
they would turn these out within a month, and actors
would learn their lines, you know, months before they had
to go on and and you know, you would be playing.
For instance, when Humphrey Bogart and Ingrad Bergmann were shooting

(12:38):
on their time off, which was very little, and when
they'd go home, they'd look at the script that were
backloged and then that they have to be shown among them,
of course, famously Maria and for whom the bell tells.
And that's the only reason why we having Igmar Bergman,
Ingrid ingrid Bergmann play play Ill say, because David ol
Sasnik let her be moves He's from MGM, let him,

(13:04):
let him, let her be borrowed by the Warner brothers
to do it, and she agreed to David o' salesnik,
the wanted produced and directed The Gone with the Wind
that broke all records in nineteen thirty nine. She wanted
to play Maria, and during the second day of shooting,

(13:25):
she got the telegram by says Nik and said, Hello, Maria,
how's the shooting going. So she jumped up and down
and she's like, I'm I got Maria. Michael Cortiz, the director,
goes Hungarian, we'll talk about later. He was like, yes,
my deal. But I'm not blaming it, is it? Because
that really put her in her place. Humphrey Bogart was

(13:46):
was was about to after he left Casablanca. I think
he took some weeks off and he went right into Sahara,
you know where he played the sergeant in a Now
was it a light tank? I want to say it's
a Steward tank. That yeah, the movie. Was it a
Steward tank or was it a Sherman maybe a Grand Tang,
one of those early tanks. I think it was a Stewart.

(14:08):
It was a Steward tank, right, and but anyway, that's
that's a fabulous movie. Actually one of the best wartime
films in my homble opinion. But Casablanca is a film
about a current event. Right. It was to open in
April of nineteen forty three, but the premiere was in

(14:29):
New York City Radio City Hall on eleven November twenty six,
nineteen forty two, in time with the invasions of North
Africa one week after Americans. Actually, yeah, about one week
maybe ten days after the Americans had landed in Casablanca,

(14:50):
and I should say faced kernel of resistance there by
the v issue troops. Five hundred dead and about fifteen
hundred casualties, you know, just purely American. So it was
in the news current events. People were scared.

Speaker 5 (15:07):
You know.

Speaker 3 (15:08):
I don't need to remind you that at that time,
in nineteen forty two, the outcome of Guadalcalanal wasn't clear, right,
The US Navy had to retreat and left the Marines
on their own. I suppose we're going to leave people
on their own. You do it to the Marines. The
best light infantry for war. In my opinion, and I'm

(15:29):
not being jinguistic about this, just look at the stats.
The uh you know, Alameine had just happened, but the
Germans were doing rather well in Barbaraosa. Right, it was
some are victory's right, right, The winner had been set
in the of course, Philippines had fallen about ten thousand, No,

(15:55):
actually twenty five thousand US soldiers had died in the
Philippines alone. Okay, when we left Corregador, I remind you
that about I think that's a little under half of
what we lost in Vietnam within weeks. So people forget
the scansion of this war, and people forget that when

(16:16):
people that those that worked in Casablanca had there were
in more time schedules. They had to get there before
seven o'clock in the morning. Everybody was printing. Everyone from
the from the janitor to the sound technician to the actors.
They all had fingerprinted IDs. They had security that was

(16:38):
under the watchful eye of the National Guard, California National Guard.
They couldn't do any outdoor shooting, and that includes the
end of Casablanca. Right, we'll talk about that because it
has to do with the fact that they can only
spend eight thousand dollars per set because PLI it was needed,

(17:01):
nails were needed, everything had to go towards the war effort.
It was strictly a war economy. Let me tell you something.
You know, eight thousand dollars in today's money. I looked
it up some months ago. I think it's in the
order of, like, you know, one hundred and fifty thousand
dollars today one hundred to make a movie for one

(17:22):
hundred and fifty thousand dollars today. You can't build an
interior set and pay the people do in the art department.
So if you're doing this office, half of these books
or most of them, are just the facade, you know,
for instance, right, you're using old wood, you're you know,

(17:42):
but the person and then you've got props and person
comes in. You have to pay them. The art department
in Hollywood, they they anywhere, they anywhere between five thousand,
ten thousand dollars a day. So you're talking about you're
talking about a tenth of their budget was all they
had to build sets. And the thing is, if you

(18:02):
can only do interior sets, what do you do You
bring out bold stocks, you know, so when you're looking
at a wall in Casablanca, like, for instance, a blue
parrot that was used to make Sahara, it's at uh
uh and they were just paint and paint. The painters
were very busy. Costumes you can only use. Now, this
is this is key. Every actor in every film, including

(18:26):
the mimeasly little films, you need to you need to
double their costumes for any contingency. You know, usually it
becomes distressed. You have to play with shots that occur
that night in the script, but you have to shoot
in the morning. So what do you do. You have
to distress it, You send it to the cleaner, and
then you have another costume to go in. They couldn't

(18:46):
afford that.

Speaker 7 (18:48):
Mm hmmm.

Speaker 3 (18:48):
They couldn't do that. I mean, fabrics were under war
rational Uh really, these were debilitating, incapacitating rules. You couldn't
have outdoor shots, you know, yeah, it was it was
impossible and people, Oh here's another thing. Everybody had to

(19:09):
be home by nightfall because the curfew.

Speaker 5 (19:13):
Yeah, so a lot of people came in.

Speaker 3 (19:15):
The crew came in at the crack of dawn or
before if they had a special you know, uh safe
paths uh to get into and and and and and
be ready to admit the actors who would come in
at six o'clock in the morning whenever the sun came up,
you know, and they had that whole day, so they
were rushed, and wonderful things happened. When you're limited, we

(19:39):
forget that excess breeds complacency m hm, right in all things,
and that would be five dollars. That's free.

Speaker 7 (19:49):
Now, what I want you to do is set the
stage for that opening narration because we kind of talked
about it. We put all this in in context, right
is is this is happening right here in the very
early months of the war. You know, we're what five
months for us for us, right, five months for us,
But you know, now we're nineteen thirty nine, so what

(20:13):
three years for the rest of the world, and then
if you're in China even longer. Yeah, but the United States,
we've been in the war less than half of a year,
and yet, as you just mentioned, we're already seeing the
effects of the war effort and the total war mentality
on the filmmaking.

Speaker 3 (20:33):
Industry and the world. So what's that.

Speaker 7 (20:38):
Opening narration? Quite like mister Mayna.

Speaker 3 (20:42):
Well, you know, by the way, you could find this online.
It's so important to us, and reasons that I'd like
to get to later on. But you can find the
script online. It's public. It's considered public access, which is remarkable.
I don't think there are many scripts like guys supposed
Citizen King because it's using studies. But at the beginning,
since it was a current affair, they wanted to bring

(21:04):
people up to speed, especially Americans, as to see what
had happened so far, what was the zeitgeist, to borrow
a term of the enemy at that time and now
and now one of the leaders of the free world
think goodness. So they wanted a movie tone. They wanted
to copy the movie tone narrators.

Speaker 8 (21:26):
If you remember Americans land at Water Canal as far
as the campaign of the you know, of the American War,
blah blah.

Speaker 3 (21:36):
It was that type of and it had to be
that way because the microphones weren't as good as ours.
And that's why what you hear is the top ten
or the top third of a voice. So they had
to hit. They had to put on this in pose
I think an imposing read. So that's what they wanted
at the beginning to and it's like the perfect exposition

(21:56):
because that way you don't have to worry. It's part
of the part and parcel of their audience's life. That's
what they did, right. They had to bring everybody up
to speed. You would go to the movies and find
out how are we doing right, So at the beginning
you get the you get the revolving globe, and then
it it it focuses on the Mediterranean and.

Speaker 8 (22:18):
It goes with the coming of the Second World Far
refugee is streaming from all the quarters of Europe for
the freedom of the New World. All eyes turned toward Lisbon,
great embarkation point, but not everybody could get to Lisbon directly,
so refugee trails sprang up.

Speaker 3 (22:37):
And then you see the.

Speaker 5 (22:41):
Uh, the the.

Speaker 3 (22:42):
Last of the films that the Republic of the Third
Republic of France is showing right where people those long
long walks. You had enough time between the invasion of
Germany to the occupation to give that include that for
these for just these very self same movie tone coverage

(23:06):
from Paris to Marsei across the Mediterranean to Iran, then
by train Rotto on foot across the rim of Africa
to Casablanca in French Morocco. Yeah, they fortune and then.

Speaker 5 (23:20):
You spring to these actual people.

Speaker 3 (23:25):
Who had been refugees.

Speaker 7 (23:27):
Mm hm m h.

Speaker 3 (23:30):
The cast of Casablanca from everything from A Walk In
to Humphrey Bogart one hundred and twelve, there were only
three actors who were native born Americans. Wow, let's think
about that.

Speaker 7 (23:49):
One of them is that guy. Actually, I think that's
two of them right there, right.

Speaker 3 (23:54):
Well, that's that's true, but it was it was Humphrey Bogart.
It was the daughter, the step daughter of of of
Jack Warner, producer, who plays the young wife who has
to give up her honor in order to get uh,
you know, in order to leave Casta blancause she's got
to sleep with Louis Renault, right and uh. And then,

(24:17):
of course, if the famous gambling scene when she gets
out because Rick Casablanc Comfrey Burger's character doctors the gambling
and the roulette wheel as is still done all over
the world, I suppose, and they make their money to
pay for the visas to leave.

Speaker 5 (24:36):
M H. And so these people are looking.

Speaker 3 (24:39):
Up at b roll which were the only flying planes
that civilians could could could fly over. L a uh.
They were the Lockheeds, the early war Lockheeds with a vertical.
That's why you get these these linked vertical because lady

(25:00):
later that design is given to the military. But they're
all looking up air of heartened ones.

Speaker 8 (25:06):
Through money, our influence, our locke obtain exit visas and
scurry to Lisbon and from Lisbon to the Americas. The
others wait in Casablanca and wait and wait and wait,
and then the narrator's voice fades away.

Speaker 3 (25:25):
Boom. We are in the given circumstances. And these these
characters that you see, these featured players that you see
with the accents as bad as you know, as we're
taught in Carnegie, Mellen, we're given phonetics and these people
were talking as well.

Speaker 5 (25:43):
So are you instead of hearing and not say talk
like that you have.

Speaker 3 (25:47):
Conrad By was a German star whose wife, who was
of the Jewish faith, was about to be arrested. She
had lost her job because of the Nuremberg Law. I
was of nineteen thirty three. Conrad Wite was to have
run the German film boomed, asked for Gebels's decree or

(26:09):
decision the Blessing Olde Fiora, and brought him to his
office and offered him the job. Now, his wife had
already lost her job, right, she couldn't work in Germany.
She was a pretty good actor by all, when she
was an upcoming star, someone younger than Conrad Hight, great promise,
but she was Jewish and she couldn't work in Germany.

(26:33):
And he said, well, mister Gerbels, hair gebelts, I will
I need to take this home and speak to my wife.
And he said, yes, yes, we know about your wife
and we can work around that. And he said, well,
I thank you very much. And he goes home to
his wife and he says, start packing. We leave on
a Paris train tonight. Which brings me to my second point,

(26:54):
that description of how refugees left beginning, and if you take,
if you take the war against civility, against civil rights,
and that's the way I like to think.

Speaker 5 (27:05):
Of World War two.

Speaker 3 (27:08):
A country engages in war against its own citizens. I
don't know if that rings a bell now, but in
nineteen thirty three, the Nuremberg laws were such that you
had a whole generation of within those ten years, you
had German artists in painters, writers, actors, especially actors, right
because we're talking about mass media, radio announcers, the whole lot.

(27:31):
They wouldn't go necessarily to Paris that early, you know,
they would go anywhere where there was you know, you
had German speaking the German speaking market. So a lot
of them left for Vienna. But by nineteen thirty eight
the Anschlus, the annexation of Austria happened. Well, no problem, we'll.

Speaker 5 (27:50):
Go to Prague.

Speaker 3 (27:52):
To nineteen thirty eight, nineteen thirty nine, we know what happened.
Then it's a.

Speaker 5 (27:57):
State and land. But that's all right, that's the yop.
You know, they wouldn't dare come to Prague.

Speaker 3 (28:04):
Four months later, for six months later they invade Czechosavakia.
That's it, that's it. You can't work, so you come
to Paris. Some of them know French, some don't. Those
that don't try to make it to England, uh and
or or indeed too after the occupation in nineteen forty, indeed,

(28:29):
a good number of them come to you know v She,
what was the capital of v She under patent doesn't
come to me right now, Well, b she v France,
the capital of the Southern Puppet Republic under the town
and from there to North Africa, who still had links,
and of course America was was you know, at an

(28:52):
embassy in VC, so you could get out, but you
needed to know. Everybody knew you wanted to get out,
so you had to you had a grease pomps. So
everybody in well not practically everybody in that film had.

Speaker 5 (29:04):
Taken similar routes. Right.

Speaker 3 (29:06):
You do have French people, you know, we'll talk of Princess,
the one who sings La Massailler, who's a her last
name was le Beau. She was actually married to the
crew Pa, the man who runs the the the roulette,
and he was a household name in in France. And

(29:29):
what happens is that they they she was seventeen years
old and she marries Marcell Dalio. Marcell Dalio who comes
out in the in the Grand Delusion in a Day's Feast.
You've gotten a chance to see that, No, I'm sorry
to day in the country. You should see that these
are classics of the of cinema. And by then, along

(29:54):
with Luis Gaban, who's considered the Bogart of the French cinema.
These you know, these are these are the hang you
know these these, these are the household names and actors
that everybody know knows. Marcelle Delia was Jewish and his
wife le Beau was not Matt Madeleine le Beau. So
they were able to get out and they come, They
get they board a ship. They come to Mexico, when

(30:17):
they also Vera Cruz in Mexico was another port of
UH entry. So they go to Vera Cruz and it
turns it turns out that the passports they bought were cannifated,
so they couldn't come into Mexico. They found a way
to board a train in Mexico, train all the way
up to Canada. And from Canada they found a way
to come to California and to get work, to get

(30:41):
work and to work on their English. And they would
arrive and there was a thing called the European War
Fund headed by Arcalo Uh who would have.

Speaker 5 (30:57):
Who gave up a house.

Speaker 3 (31:01):
In Hollywood. She had come over in the nineteen twenties
as along with Garbo, she became a writer, the most
well paid woman screenplay writer who wrote Queen Christina of
course for Garble.

Speaker 5 (31:16):
She wrote Garbo is Garbo.

Speaker 3 (31:18):
Because of Saltka of Yartel sarka Be hotel opens her
house to these refugees that come in. She was Czechoslovakian
German speaking, and she offers her house as a network
of you know, to help find these people work write
anything from a stand in for somebody, if you looked

(31:41):
like Gary Cooper, while you could be his stand in
to a big part. Two background actors which were called
extras at that time, a heinous term it's not used now.
And she would have these sundays at Barca's very called
Brett Thomas Mann, these actors that you see in Casablanca,

(32:03):
they would all come there and some of them would
stay and sleep on the floor. I mean, this one
was one of the most generous peoples of people that
these refugees could meet because the government wasn't.

Speaker 5 (32:13):
It was a time of.

Speaker 3 (32:15):
You know, of hard nos but what I like to
call hard nosed studio cinema, where you know, it was
survival of the fittest. Then you had to sleep for
a part and you had.

Speaker 5 (32:25):
To I mean, it was it was.

Speaker 3 (32:28):
It was hard for actors, especially non English speaking actors
and the European Film Fund is in existence from nineteen
thirty three, and that's no coincidence because that's where the
Nuremberg Laws weren't acted by the National Socialists in Germany
until nineteen forty five, the end of the war. Sadly,

(32:49):
a lot of these people that came out later in
the House of on America activities were accused of being
fit columnists for the Eastern Bloc, the Communist Bloc, and
a lot of them had to go back famously bird
Talk brect who then went to Eastern Germany and became
persona and garratto within months. So these these people were

(33:11):
faced from you know to autocratic, stilted and rather perverted.
In my view, you could be fascist of the right
of the left. We're learning that now and they they

(33:33):
they taught us that fascism is actually a pathology. It's
an illness, right, so it creeps into any idealism, and
that's what they lived. That was a if you were
in Central Europe during the nineteen thirties and nineteen fifties,
had a hard time, and it's you know, a lot
of these actors they just wanted to wanted to live
they wanted to act in their profession act sorry for

(33:55):
the fun, and the block is an opportunity for them
to be given roles in line. So a lot of
these people learn their lines phonetically, right. We can talk
about them later. But in this long way, I think
I've covered the fact that the beginning of Casablanca is
a current affair. It tells you how people left Paris

(34:19):
after the occupation, and it neglects to say that that
great migration of artists occurred in nineteen thirty three with
the Narrowberg laws. So chez, and this is something that
I don't know.

Speaker 6 (34:32):
It just kind of makes me laugh a little bit
because I think any artist out there will say that,
you know, specifically like music artists for instance, I say,
you know, I've truly made it as a musical artist.
When weird Al Yankovic makes fun of my song walker,
both of them have pieces in the animated series Family Guy.

(34:56):
They do, and I Family Guy's my comfort show. So
I put it on it right, and I got too
long ago. Actually came across the the episode where they
were kind of poking fun uh at clock uh at
Casa Blanca.

Speaker 9 (35:09):
Uh.

Speaker 5 (35:10):
And there's one one scene where where Peter's uh, he
taps over Citizen Kane.

Speaker 6 (35:17):
And and he tapes over it and somebody gets it,
you know, from a from an old you know, blockbuster store.
They you know, sit down and have family, you know,
movie night, and and you know the opening scene of
Citizen Kane, you know, he's got the snow blobe and
he drops it, you know, and it just brings out
this whole mystery and he stops it right there and
he goes it was his slid. It was his slid

(35:41):
Rose Button. And and the where they make fun of
Casa Blanca, you know, it's just like a bunch of
you know.

Speaker 5 (35:52):
VH.

Speaker 10 (35:52):
Frenchman, you know, smoking cigarettes, you know, and then there's
the yes and then there's the close and scene you know,
and and and Peter Smogan and Lois Is you know,
heading off to the plane.

Speaker 6 (36:05):
You know.

Speaker 11 (36:06):
So so chas, what what is it about Casablanca that
excites you? So my parents were refugees. Yeah, and I
think you have a very very unique story. I actually
had the Joey had forward forwarded me an article that
you had written. Uh, and as I was starting to
read it, I mean I only wish that it was longer.

Speaker 6 (36:28):
I could not put it down to have a family
that you know, went through the Cuban you know, revolution
and just you know, completely life changing things.

Speaker 5 (36:38):
So I mean, I think that's even worth, you know,
bringing up a little bit. I mean, that's very unique.

Speaker 3 (36:42):
Thank you. Actually, I'm in pre I'm in development for
our next movie, which which is adapted from a bad
play I wrote about taking care of my dad. I
was a primary primary caregiver my wife and I for
our parents book sets of parents. But as my daughter,
my dad was dying of cancer went from the hospital

(37:03):
to hospice. It was me and I learned things about
him that I had no idea that later I was
able to corroborate when I went to Cuba as part
of a artistic exchange with the theater company. I was
a member of a repertory theater company I was a
member of in New York and we toured Cuba, and

(37:23):
I on my own, I went to these different places
where my father had been during the revolution. He was
part of the urban guerrillas, which is the they really
copied the French resistance. I mean, each a bunch of
cells in urban areas, and they implies and you would
only have three people in your cell, and everybody had
an on the gears right, so chino in Spanish labera

(37:49):
or the dog, you know, or my dad was My
dad was il moro, the more because he had he
had beautiful curly hair. He's quite a looking, quite quite
a handsome man. I don't know where the looks went.
Probably my sister, but he uh and and AnyWho. So

(38:11):
I learned things as as he was dealing. You know,
he's under palliative care so for months, so he was
out and he would come in and out from the world,
you know, from reality, and he'd grab the corner of
a sheet and say, hey, listen, here are the keys.
The material is inside the trunk. The keys are left

(38:31):
on the inside tower in the hub of the passenger side.
You know, things like that. That these little details he
never told me because he suffered from PTSD, having been
active and having participated in one of the major pitch
battles southakloa.

Speaker 6 (38:47):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (38:47):
And then of course you know he's going to be
sent to a re education camp because he wasn't a
communist and he didn't believe in the centralization Cuban economy,
which led to dire poverty and never got out of Uh,
it never worked, and he saw it. He foresaw it
in economics. Economists all over the world, including Marxist Costs, said,

(39:07):
you know, this can't happen if you simply won't. And
it didn't. And you know, that was enough to get
him about to get him arrested, and somebody found out
and they had to leave overnight. During dinner, he got
a phone call, uh, eight or nine o'clock. He had
come home from teaching class. My daughter was seven My daughter, oh,

(39:28):
that's one of my sister was seven months old, and
an anonymous call said that you know, we're they're listening men,
and they're coming to get They're coming to get to
and send you to a re educacation camp, which could
mean six months, a year to two years re educate.
It was. It was an innocuous term actually to get
rid of your political prisoners. And sometimes they had accidents

(39:48):
in these education camps. So you know, your father he
had just gotten a house, he had bought a house,
he had a small car. I mean, he's starting his life.
He was getting his doctorate and had to leave over
night drive to Havana. Luckily he had a way he
had a visa without anything, you know, no visa. There
was an American called Zimmerman who was a World War Two,

(40:09):
a veteran, very good friend of my father. My father's
an account and worked all over Cuba as well as
study for his doctorate. And that's how my parents got
out on the tourist visa, you know, with twenty five
dollars in their pockets, and they never went back. So

(40:30):
for my father to see this, it was like it
was like political church. Yeah, he identified with all of
these people who were in the film. They weren't acting.
So when mother Line le Beau sings the massa, yeah,
that's the first time she sung it in eighteen months
and she has family there. Wow. And the two the

(40:57):
cute little couple that are coming to America and they're
learning English, and they go, yes, we are learning English
and we are going to get to our new country
and we are learning our English. Before he goes, oh, really,
you know the elderly Cherubic who was also from Vienna
and he had to have left. Waiter says remember him,

(41:20):
what was his name, Franz? And he says, have you
been practicing? He says, yes. For instance, my Darling, what
watch is it? Oh, Papa, it's his ten watch? Such watch,
you know.

Speaker 7 (41:35):
So it made muscol and Ilka Gronny that's right.

Speaker 3 (41:40):
That's right. And Sassel actually was late. I had a
late life career in Hollywood until nineteen fifty four when
he died of a heart attack. And his wife in
the film what's her Name again? I have it in
my that's right, Bernie had it the National Acting Institute

(42:02):
of Vienna. I mean, these were people at the top
of their career, you know. And for my father, who
is considered a wounderkind right, all expenses paid, asked to
come and study at the University of Ana, asked to
give I mean, my father, there's a joke. Well, anyway,

(42:25):
my father identified with them. So when Madeline Leabau sings
the Masaiz, my father, he knew some French would sing it,
and I would sing it with him, and we both
stand up, and my mother would walk on in the room.
She'd say, oh my.

Speaker 5 (42:40):
God, Casablanca again.

Speaker 3 (42:41):
No, no, no, I'm going shopping, and he would leave
it to me. We would mute the volume and we
would put in the lines. My dad would always play
Louis Rena, you know, the scoundrel. And I was, of
course a bogart. And and it was like a ritual.
It was like going again to like political church. I
went to the eightieth anniversary of d Day of Overlord

(43:07):
and in oh God, in can I admit I had
had one too many. And I was in a room
full of of other historians and and just folks from
camp and I can get bye with French. And I
was speaking to them, and I stood up and I

(43:27):
sang the Marseilles. And I can't tell you how moved
I was, because here I am, I was singing from
my father would have upduh. I'm very connected to that song.
And it's it's through my pap that comes the universal
song of the immigrants.

Speaker 7 (43:45):
H Now, let's dive into a couple. I don't know
think we'll have time to do everybody, but let's dive
into a couple of the the kind of the principal actors,
the people that we see on screen who have these
immigrant stories, have these refugee stories. And oddly, I think
we should start with a man who has to play

(44:08):
his opposite number in a sense, in Ludwig Stossel. Right,
here's this a man who's a German actor and now
he has to play he has to play the baddies, you.

Speaker 3 (44:28):
Know he is, and the delicious way he he that's
by the way, that's when he deplanes at at that airport.
It had to One of the things I didn't mention
is that you weren't allowed. You weren't if you were civilian.
You had to have a written permission to come into
any airfield. It was an anti sabotage clause in the

(44:52):
war acts. We had our own war acts. So they
all had ideas and they shot this in a small
all airfield. It's the only outdoor shop that they were
able to make. It was in the middle of the day.
They were surrounded by officials, police and possibly National garden,

(45:13):
I quite sure, and the planes and that's when he
says that that line. Louis Renauld says, welcome to Africa.
I suppose it's a little too hot for you, and
Major says vich. Germans have to get used to all
sorts of climates, right, every single laugh line, and there

(45:34):
are many is we can attribute to that to the
Epstein brothers, you know, Philip and Juliets And that was
certainly that was one of them. And there he is
playing Conrad Wite, famously of the cabinet of doctor Calagary.
He was the Monster, the hypnotized monster again, another major

(45:56):
actor known not only in Germany but all over the world.
He was He started off as he was always famous,
so he was matin a idol in Berlin, all over Germany,
and he almost got in trouble, or at least he
felt he was. He they were going to arrest them
because as he was a matinee idol. The girls of

(46:18):
all these town the young girls thirteen, fourteen and fifteen,
and then these German towns. Each germantown has an opera,
the theater that doubles as live theater back then. Now
they're probably cinemas. A lot of them are cinemas. And
he was, oh, you know, doing had a gobbler, say
Ipsen plays and Stringberg plays and as well as German

(46:39):
romantic plays faust. But he would look out into the
audience and they were all school girls and they were
skipping school. So a couple, you know, the school masters
would come in and and took names to see who
was skipping school. And I was girl's got in trouble

(47:00):
and What he was afraid of is that they would
take him as a pedophile, because these young ladies coming
to see me, can't we do something about that? It's
actually he was a very his he was, he was
a man, He was a product of his father had
died in the First World War. He was he he

(47:22):
was a teenager with that happened when when this happens,
but which means that he understands the cost of war. Again.

Speaker 5 (47:29):
His wife was of the Jewish faith, and he he
was able to get.

Speaker 3 (47:34):
To leave Germany as early as nineteen thirty four. He
he arrives in London, works a bit there, comes to
Hollywood and since he's, you know, in the industry, everybody
knows who he was. He he plays another Nazi and

(47:54):
in a famous movie with Tululah Bankhead, another Warner classic
Chance Escaping Right Underground. And he's delicious of playing these Nazis.
And he's interviewed after Casablanca makes a splash and people
indeed all over the world, uh no, and they said,

(48:17):
how can you possibly play a Nazi so well, being
being a German background, knowing what's happened, He said, but
that's the reason why I played so well, I know
who these people are. They're frustrated. Nobody's that see an
opportunity to make a name for themselves because frankly they're unschooled,
they're hateful, and they can't appreciate the finer things of life,

(48:41):
like humanism. So we're dealing with people who were integous
in it that they were part of the resistance, certainly
the idealistic resistance of Germany and Vienna after the ass
in Prague. Indeed, in France we remember or you know,
France's right was very popular the third of France for better,

(49:09):
better Hitler than Bloom Bloom being the Jewish president of
the Republic that was out voted. It was voted out
in nineteen the elections of nineteen thirty eight, I think
by President Reno, whose wife was a national socialist ideal
bent towards that.

Speaker 5 (49:25):
And.

Speaker 3 (49:28):
It was in it was he again, you know, he
he had to wherewith all to come in early Sadly
he dies on the golf course in nineteen forty four. Yeah,
and he was only forty nine, forty nine.

Speaker 5 (49:46):
It wasn't it wasn't a stroke, was it. No, it's
heart attack? Oh God, God want wah, that's one or
less stroke off his golf game.

Speaker 3 (49:57):
Terrible.

Speaker 5 (49:58):
Yeah, maybe too soon for him. I'm sorry. Sorry, let's talk.

Speaker 7 (50:02):
About his his shadow figure in the movie, because here's
a man who's constantly right behind him. And I'm gonna
guess that's probably right, Hard Ryan.

Speaker 5 (50:13):
That's right, that's what we've been doing your homework. He's down.

Speaker 3 (50:18):
He he actually goes back to Germany after the war
and tries to resuscitate his career. Yes, he made his
He was a philosophy student and when he was about
to take his his final and it reminds me of

(50:41):
Gertrude Stein, who who also are a poet, Gertrude Stein
and writer, who's who simply said, oh, I don't want
to take a philosophy exam today, and she left school.
He was offered a job as a philosophy professor, and
he simply didn't take it. And it became an actor.
He was in amateur theatricals throughout his college career. Actually

(51:06):
published a number of essays on German, on German dialecticism,
on Hagel. He was in the Gaelian Philosopher, and he
saw what was coming. Also he came late. He was
able to get out late. He was under the radar,
never expresses his his views, and he kind of got

(51:29):
out of Germany being an old, crazy philosopher who wants
to study in France and publish something. But he was
able to get out through France, and he didn't have
much of a career. He played bit parts in the
forties and then after the war he goes back to
Germany and he kind of fizzles up, and he was

(51:52):
in the Cross of the Rain in nineteen forty three,
a film about the resistance. But his last he was
performance was in nineteen forty eight in a movie called
The Foreign Affair. He goes back to Germany and ends
up dying in Switzerland and never really recovered. He always
played similar roles like this one in UH in German

(52:15):
national theaters in Vienna and Munich. Also uh, you know
the this, the the clerk, the you know, the bureaucrat,
which is a hateful figure in German. Yeah, in nineteenth
century German and Russian literature.

Speaker 7 (52:31):
Now what about what do Yeah?

Speaker 3 (52:36):
Lottie dies in New York City after having a career
in television with her husband Ziggler. Now she was of
the Jewish faith and she begged her mother and her
father to leave Germany and his her wife's I'm sorry

(52:58):
her her sister and their family to leave whether to
find a way to leave. She gets to she gets
to America, and by nineteen forty five, by the end
of the war, she finds out that they're all dead.
They're wiped out, all of them. She's the only survivor
in her family. She makes a career in New York
City in the nineteen fifties, with the coming of live television,

(53:20):
plays a couple of featured roles in those Hallmark movies
of the Week and the other ones that were was
the Fame of the Westinghouse had a movie of the Week,
and then from there she played I think her last
performance was in Colombo. She's oh, no, forgive me, forgive me.

(53:46):
Her last performance, featured performance is in a little movie
called The Minuteman. She is one of the people who
recognize who did Olivier play? Well, it was a Mangola
like character. And she comes out and she yells that
man tortured us. That man, that man is a Nazi.

(54:09):
He was the doctor of you know, of al Schmidz.
And Olivier runs away and and somebody gets in his way,
and I think Olivier take Tavin knife and kills him.
But she is, She's at the top of the movie
and that's her. That's how she's mostly recognized apart from this.
You know, when she's dying and Ziggler is also dying,

(54:36):
Zizla wants to go back and die in Germany, and
she says, I'm not going back to Germany ever, I'm
dying here sad. So they divorced. I don't know why
they divorced. He went back to Germany. He lived another
year and a half dies This is nineteen seventy five,
and she.

Speaker 5 (54:51):
Dies in nineteen seventy six in New York City.

Speaker 12 (54:56):
Just another actor, man, Yeah, one of the one of
the actors that that caught my eye, caught my interest
was as he cuddles I, I gotta know about this guy.

Speaker 13 (55:07):
How does god, how does one get a nickname like that?
I'm a little scared to ask that question. Salznik had
hired him for a movie that he had a fabulous career.
Now he came with he landed on his feet back
in Germany. He's Czechoslovakian.

Speaker 5 (55:24):
No I beg, I beg your pardon.

Speaker 3 (55:25):
He's Hungarian Hungarian birth, but made a career in Vienna,
in Prague, uh, you know, in the interesting years between
both World wars uh and and Berlin. And he always
played the cute little foreigner, the one who spoke English
not so good, German not so good. But he was

(55:48):
trying very hot, you know.

Speaker 5 (55:50):
And he was known as a comedian.

Speaker 3 (55:51):
He used to, uh, you know, stand up comedy isn't
isn't an American phenomenon. We we had funny monologues being
read aloud and persona is like, this is a story
of my life, this Hungarian immigrant to Germany in nineteen
twenty five and that with no name. But he he

(56:14):
thought he was something else, you know. And he was
just a lowly clerk and he wants so people would
laugh because he was ad of a person.

Speaker 5 (56:21):
He played a person of no importance.

Speaker 3 (56:23):
He brings that to America.

Speaker 5 (56:26):
He is in a movie that's directed by David O.

Speaker 3 (56:30):
Selznik in nineteen thirty eight.

Speaker 7 (56:34):
Oh good god, what was it? It'll come to me?

Speaker 3 (56:39):
And his English is so bad. He keeps messing up
a shot and a line like we have to go,
we must go, we we have to or something to
that effect, and David Saleslink says cot and he goes,
how many takes and he goes, We're in the twentieth
and he goes and he goes, fuck like that. So

(57:04):
he would he would move his jowls and he let
out an expletive and everybody started laughing, and everybody called him,
Oh my god, it's so cuddly.

Speaker 5 (57:13):
Look at those gewls, you know. And he he went on.

Speaker 3 (57:17):
He was in the Anderson's, He played, you know, supporting
roles in Capra films, and you could see him in
a lot of the older films. Diyes in nineteen fifty two.
Devoted to his wife. His wife would go everywhere with him.
In fact, when they were shooting Casablanca, she was a
knitter and she knitted some tea cozies for Inger Berman

(57:43):
and Bogart with their names and everything, and they on
they had to get. All they raised were dogs, and
they were one of those people as dog people, you know.
And his his dog whose name was forget his name, Coolly.
I believe it was a It was a nickname, the

(58:07):
Hungarian nickname. He dies in nineteen fifty two, and of
course his wife is inconsolable, but so is his dog.
His dog dies a week on the same one week later,
on the same day, at the same time in the afternoon.

Speaker 7 (58:27):
Wow.

Speaker 3 (58:28):
So they were a very loving couple. They were childless.
And you know, he was a stand up comic if
you if you want to call it that, some variation
you would write these monologues. Again, the person of no
importance laughed at at his own expense, and he brought
that to America. But what he had, what he found

(58:49):
in comedy, in comedy was a moral fiber. So everything
you see him do is.

Speaker 5 (58:56):
Is a very strong.

Speaker 3 (59:00):
Moral Well. Again, he was given these roles right and
he was the comedy of relief, but always somebody who
tries his best and does the right thing. Never played he.

Speaker 5 (59:10):
Never played a villain.

Speaker 3 (59:10):
I mean, how can you play a villain? Look at him.
You know, it's not like Paul green Street, you know
who plays Uh plays the owner of the Blue Parrot,
and he's the fat man in the Maltese falcon. You know,
some people are just people.

Speaker 5 (59:23):
Some people.

Speaker 3 (59:26):
It's hard to say if you get cast because of
who you are, or you can't become who you are
because you're cast a certain way. You know, in order
to be cast based on who you are, you have
to be very comfortable to play yourself, and gentlemen, that's
very hard to do as an actor, is play yourself.

(59:46):
I have found it a lot easier to play behind
a character. You can repair to the character, even on film.
I just finished playing I don't talk about myself, but
it's a lot easier to There is Paul green Street.
And that's when when when he's yeah, I think that's

(01:00:09):
when he promises to give the no. In fact, he
gives him the visas to lead and and Bo Bogart.
I'm talking Rick. And then Rick goes to Louise's prefecture
and tells him that what he wants to do is
go away. I have him arrest Victor Lazo and then
he can go with what I'll say to the New World.

(01:00:31):
He's leaving Casablanca. Yeah, at that time, Oh, and that's oh,
that's important. That's when he says, what about Louis And
he says, well, I'm not in the habit, I'm not
in the practice of selling human beings. And I'd like
to talk a little bit about the writers, because the
three Riders were the Epstein brothers, if you can call
him a unit. And they were Howard Kotch and Andrew Robinson.

(01:00:55):
Whenever you hear a funny line, it's the Epstein brothers
who were brought in Hawes. They wrote comedy, you know, uh,
and they were nuts. There was they went. They went
to Princeton, both of them they lived together. When one
of them died in the sixties, it was like losing
a wife, is what Julius is how Julius called it.

Speaker 5 (01:01:18):
So where be your funny line.

Speaker 3 (01:01:19):
And whenever you hear a political line, it's Kotch who
wrote radio plays with Orson Wells and Rchao radio. He
he he wrote War of the World, the famous War
of the World with uh. You know. He's responsible for

(01:01:40):
bringing current affairs to the lap of people because he
felt that the American the American people were were just
unempathetic with what was happening now when the love story
the big problem, and that's when they brought in Robinson. Robinson,
Uh was Andrew Robinson was specifically the romance guy. He

(01:02:04):
would always he was always brought in to bring up
the romance volume in if you would on script, the
romance was the problem because they didn't know the ending
of Casablanca up until the seventh week, up until a
week before they shot it, Bogart didn't know if he

(01:02:27):
had won over, if he was staying with in that scene,
if he had won over, Ill say, if Elsa was
going to leave Paul Heinrich, who plays Victor Loslow, if
if Victor Loslow was not was Victor Lasso was always leaving,
but if he was going to leave alone, if she
stays with him in Casablanca, And it was very difficult
for to play those scenes right.

Speaker 5 (01:02:50):
But that's why what you're seeing.

Speaker 9 (01:02:53):
In Ill says in In Victor Loslow in Humphrey Bogart,
the actress behind those characters is the actor who doesn't
know if he's going to be able to win over Ilse.

Speaker 3 (01:03:07):
It's part and parcel of their performance. They're very worried. Famously,
they were worried. And Humphrey Bogart, you know, we'd just
gotten renowned. I mean, he was known for the Petrofied Force,
which he did in Broadway. That was the thing that
brought him to Hollywood with Leslie Howard who said, I'm
only going to do the the this this movie. Frank Capra,

(01:03:28):
if if you don't. If you bring Humphrey Bogart, he's
so good. Fine, he gets a name, he becomes a
studio player, and it's not until and he does these
gangsters to the gangster films. Well, dirty with angels faces
is okay, and he's a very good answer. But he
had to break away from that. And his breakout role
was the detective in in multie Falcon.

Speaker 1 (01:03:48):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (01:03:49):
So he he was on you know, he was on
the upswing and he thought Costa Blanco was going to
murder him. He didn't know how to play it. He
didn't know, you know, there were writing lines the day
before throughout the film, so he didn't. He wasn't sure
about his lines. And that's what brought what he brought
to the what he brought was no acting into the

(01:04:09):
film because he had just gotten the lines and all
he had was the other actor. And that's the way
we work. Now, you know, you don't you don't. You
cater to the script the same way, but you you
don't prepare something at home and bring it in as
they did.

Speaker 7 (01:04:24):
I'm gonna throw myself out there and say that my
second favorite Bogart movie's dark Passage. So you know, I
see him at his greatest moments.

Speaker 5 (01:04:33):
I think.

Speaker 3 (01:04:34):
Now, I know we're running out.

Speaker 5 (01:04:37):
Of time, and I'm sorry, I'm going on and on,
you know. Sorry.

Speaker 7 (01:04:43):
So let's talk about about Claude Rains before we go
to our last featured character.

Speaker 5 (01:04:51):
Claude Rain was born with a lisp.

Speaker 3 (01:04:56):
Was born with a lisp.

Speaker 7 (01:04:58):
But he plays this part so well because it's the
kind of we talked about this when you and I
are talking about do we want to bring this on
to should we do the show like this? He's just
a sneezy, kind of dirty, corrupt and yet still he's likable,
and you almost kind of root for him and Rick

(01:05:20):
throughout the entire movie, right, even though at times they're
against one another, you're almost rooting for for what happens
at the end, which is the beautiful friendship that's.

Speaker 3 (01:05:33):
Right, and you feel because you like him throughout the
movie and you're always saying, why do I like this guy?
The payoff is at the end when he joins the
flight against Nazis and he decides to go with Rake
to Brazaville and join the Free French.

Speaker 5 (01:05:46):
Right.

Speaker 3 (01:05:47):
So the reason why these two are so important to
us still today is that Humphrey Bogart is the typical
American and that we have a sentimental corporate we protected
with cynicism, right and a rough hewn whiskey voiced, you

(01:06:08):
know in exterior.

Speaker 7 (01:06:10):
Oh do your best, Bogart, come on, I'll do it
at the end.

Speaker 3 (01:06:14):
But Claude Rain is born and he's a cockney dire
poverty in London, in South and the South Bank, and
he comes to show this as being a messenger in
the theater. Now this is a time when when you
need messengers going to different places, bodily messengers, you know,

(01:06:36):
going to buy. If something happens in the theater, they
have to go to a fabric store, they have to
get sewing. They if something happens, they have to go
to the pharmacist, or they have to call the actors
five minutes, ten minutes. And usually these were people who
were aspiring actors, and they would come in as young
as twelve years old. Indeed Claude Rain was and Claude
Rain would watch from the wings. But Claude Rain all

(01:06:56):
this and I'm not going to do my cockney yet,
I need to work. But he would say. His name
was Claude Waynes. For the longest time Claude Waynes Waynes,
because he couldn't roll his arms. He couldn't say it
rains or rains with that that medial or initial ar.
He so Claude Waynes. And in fact.

Speaker 5 (01:07:18):
What happens is everybody call him Waynes and what happened.
And he was he was, he was, he was born.

Speaker 3 (01:07:27):
Called you know, rain, like what comes down from the epic,
but he changes it to Wayne to everybody because he
didn't pronounce the r the initial war. So uh. He
does some bit parts in the theater and the theater
manager looks at him and it takes him under his
wing and he says, I'm going to teach you how

(01:07:48):
to speak. So from sixteen years old until he has
to go to the First World War, and we'll talk
about that for a second, he acquires this upper class
you know, posh so he'll say things like, you know,
you know Rick, sometimes I don't know if it's your
sentimentalism that makes you you know that, if you're a

(01:08:11):
sentimentalist or a realist, you know this sort of thing,
which works very well the films of the time. But anyway,
he volunteers for the First World War in d He
sees a lot of action comes in nineteen sixteen.

Speaker 7 (01:08:24):
Before the song he participated.

Speaker 3 (01:08:26):
In the song. He was a butt private right rank
and file. But because of his speech and he lied,
he gets a battlefield commission and leaves the army as
a second lieutenant. I'm sorry as the first and he's
able to eat. They invited him to stay in the army,
but he goes on. He wants to go back into acting.

(01:08:48):
He goes to a pobby, meets an actor who just
got a job and says, when don't you come with me?
Why don't you come with me? At first say of rehearsal,
I'll introduce you, and from that he becomes a mainstay
of the London stage. Plays classics again because you can
learn how to speak, and he stayed with the novelty
of that, of of that that feeling of that challenge

(01:09:12):
that allows you to reach great heights, which is what
I talked about before. When you have restrictions, it's amazing
what you can do. And that that that self feeds
your your confidence in your you can say your ego
but although you have to be egoists when you act.

Speaker 5 (01:09:29):
But he does that.

Speaker 3 (01:09:30):
His daughter becomes an actor later in life and and
but not a very successful one. She goes up to dad,
why can't I make this happen? He goes, Oh, dude,
it's It's very clear to me. He said, don't do anything.
Let the camera record. You don't have to act for
the camera. Let the camera do all the work. And
that's really important for film actors. That's something that took

(01:09:51):
me a number of years to learn. And I'm I
don't know Claude Rains, but uh he comes to America,
I forget his first breakout role. Oh, the Invisible Man,
invisible Man. So the uh the director of Frankenstein, Wesley

(01:10:15):
is it. I'm forgetting things. But the director of Frankenstein
is also directing becomes a monster movie director and Wales,
sorry Wales, w A l E s.

Speaker 5 (01:10:30):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (01:10:30):
He's he's trying to cast the the the Invisible Man,
and that's his breakout role. He's still wonderful. And the
Invisible Man is is apparently a very tall, good looking
man in in in the script he's described that way
and when Wales hears his when they do the the
the audition, for lack of a better word, they would

(01:10:51):
do a film test, and he hears him speak. He says,
that's that's our invisible Man, and his assistant director it
says to mister Wales, he's he's, he's, he's no idol,
He's no movie idol. And he says no, but he's
got the voice and and I'm doing the invisible Man.

Speaker 5 (01:11:11):
So uh, that's that's his breakout rolls.

Speaker 3 (01:11:14):
And from them. From then it was all all straight up,
shot up like a rocket. And after Casablanca he becomes
a fixture in American movies. He becomes an American and
naturalized and uh lives his his life helping other actors,

(01:11:36):
working with screen Actor Guilds, the Screen Actor Guild, He's
one of the founders of Screen Actor Guilds. He's quite
a man, very active and and a lover of actors
and acting all his life. Now there is one Madeline.

Speaker 7 (01:11:55):
Le Beau, and it's I think it is. You know,
you talked a little bit about but what the song
itself means to you. But I think that that scene,
that scene is the movie. Yes, movie is that scene.

Speaker 3 (01:12:13):
Everybody you see standing up, every single person you see
standing up, I could say that every single person sang
that song. Half of them were in tears, half of
them were in tears. There was no acting none, There
was no acting. There was no acting. That was a

(01:12:36):
moment where where a character sometimes has happened in I
studied in Russia, and there's a thing called biddy see
vanye biddy se vanyev, which is a technical term when
the role and the actor actor performing the role meets
and from then on there's no performance, there's just beat vanya.

(01:12:57):
Another way of looking at it is that the actor
acquires the soul of the character, of what the author,
what the playwright, what the screenplaywriter wanted to do with
that role becomes part and parcel of his soul and
the actress anyway, and not to get to hetty, but
every time I see that film, that's an example of

(01:13:17):
bidc vannye uh. You want to live in your role,
especially film. You don't want to you want to be
caught acting because you know the camera can the camera
picks up and that still is wonderful. Thank you for
bringing up. What the camera does is record what you're thinking.

(01:13:38):
You know, exactly what's running through her eyes. She's not
looking at the person at the band waiting for her cue,
look at where her vision field of vision ends. It
ends about maybe ten feet in front of her face,
and she is back in France. She is remembering how
she got out, what family members are left behind, what

(01:14:02):
their life must be, the things, the same things, frankly
that my father felt for one. James Holland is a
good friend of mine, and he brings up a phrase.
He's awfully generous, especially to me, and he brings up
a phrase that came up in conversation. Oh my god,

(01:14:23):
it just name dropped. Excuse me. But in talking to him,
we realized that the twentieth century was the century of
the immigrant, of the refugee. And that's what I get
from that scene because I had it growing up. You know. Anyway,
this isn't about me, but everybody in that shot were
emotional and and you can pick get look at that

(01:14:46):
Look at that scene again. You could see something in
the air, You could, I mean, something palpable. You know
that these people were, I mean, they were suffering the
trauma of having a leave, of having deport I mean,
just think about us having to leave and go to
Germany now or Finland, a place where we don't know
the language, and trying to work in field very.

Speaker 7 (01:15:05):
Difficult now bo You've been awful quiet, which means you
must be thinking about your favorite time.

Speaker 5 (01:15:13):
It's true, that's true, probably since the last time. But
we've all three of us have talked. This is probably
a newer segment, and it's really not new at all.
But Chaz, when it.

Speaker 6 (01:15:24):
Comes to Casablanca, when it comes to the film industry,
there's a term that I've kind of coined here called
boo hicky history.

Speaker 5 (01:15:32):
So is there any sort of boohicky behind Costa Blanca?

Speaker 6 (01:15:35):
Is there something that people misinterpret, people get wrong, something
a myth about Costa Blanca or the film industry you
wish to dispel.

Speaker 3 (01:15:43):
Now, when you watch the film today, you feel like
it's part and parcel of that era. You know, we won,

(01:16:03):
hands down. Everybody wants to come to America.

Speaker 5 (01:16:07):
We won.

Speaker 3 (01:16:08):
America was the only nation that was in bond. America
was the nation. Yes, it went through some hardship. The
people ate very you know, comparatively ate very well. They lived. Yeah,
they couldn't buy tires, they couldn't buy nails, by the way,
you know, Jack Warner used to pick up the nails

(01:16:28):
that people would drop because nails were the most expensive thing,
you know, and he would pick up the nails on
the floor, you know, they had they were able to
make their own nails at one point because they needed them.

Speaker 5 (01:16:42):
You know.

Speaker 3 (01:16:43):
So we went through some hardship, but America is the
when you watch this and you say, well, of course
they wanted to come to America. Were the apex of
human beings, you know, of humanity, the apex of human history,
and we forget that. Other people's felt the same way.
And I think we've become a little bit too complacent,
and I want to get into politics, but you watch that.

Speaker 5 (01:17:05):
When I watched that and and others.

Speaker 3 (01:17:07):
We forget that these these folks didn't know the end
of the war. They they we look back. But when
you're making this the access powers were you can argue
we're winning, you know, and and you know you watch this,
it's not that we're making this confidently like for instance,

(01:17:28):
when we make you know, by nineteen ninety four, you're
making films like Missus Miniver went the day well in Britain,
I was, you know, you're making a film with the
confidence that we're gonna win, it's just a matter of time.
That was not the case. That was not the case
in Casablanca, and the actors were surrounded by wartime rationing

(01:17:52):
and and and I wun't say suffering, but limitations, restrictions.

Speaker 7 (01:18:00):
You know.

Speaker 3 (01:18:01):
So it was in the air. No, we we we
were not winning. We were not winning, not not really, yeah,
you know the other Yeah, really, that's all I have.
I can't think of anything booggie because uh that reason,

(01:18:21):
Okay from a film practitioner. And forgive me if I'm
going on about this, but it is the perfection, the
form of perfection. I mean, look at the lighting in
that looking look at look at those skills that you
just came in the DP for that film. Was was
a portraitist. Okay. He made his living all his life

(01:18:43):
taking pictures of portraits, you know, so he brings that.
He brings that into everything everything he does. The DP,
for heaven's sake, I'm telling you, is it is it grooming? Anyway,
it's it's he was an immorant. He was an imorate.

(01:19:07):
He's a portrait artist. And you could see look at them,
that looks like something done in a Indeed it was
in the studio. But you don't get that, that's the
you get three quarter shots. Have you noticed that you
have very very little full body shots. It's all that's
actually calling the business. Forget me for saying this. But
the tit shot, it's from the tits up, you know,

(01:19:29):
and even today it's actually medium shot. But today you
go tits up and they go yep, tits up, and
then you go, when do you say it? Get yeah,
tits up, and then you know this is a half
and then you get this. But this is a watch
frame by frame, pause it and you see that medium
shot everywhere you go. Why because it gives you also

(01:19:50):
a sense of movement. It helps a tempo rhythm of
the film. It helps the audience say, let's put on
our roll. States. We got to move forward.

Speaker 5 (01:19:58):
We got to move forward in the war effort.

Speaker 3 (01:20:00):
We have to move forward towards victory. Just like the people.
We can't stop. We don't have the indulgence of stopping
in our efforts. And then by the end of.

Speaker 5 (01:20:10):
The war, you know, you have a I'm sorry you
can argue this, you have another.

Speaker 3 (01:20:16):
Terrible ideology that's threatening you. You know, so that that
thing to move forward in the fight. That last scene
when he goes, I don't forget you, oh me ten
thousand Francs, because there's ten thousand Francs will pay our
way to boss people us mm hmm. You know, Louis,

(01:20:38):
this is the beginning, Louis. I think this is the
beginning of a beautiful friendship, you know. And the way
he says that, I just I just the way he
says that is that tough American practicality. By tough, I
mean hard nose rather than tough, the practicality of having
to do this fight. It's enlightened self interest and it's

(01:21:02):
it's essentially saying, the lives of three people don't mount
to a hill of beans around It's it's the it's
really you can go if you want to get union.
It's the universal hero coming from the margins Blancs, the
margins of the French Empire, and come and and and
coming with an idea that that defeats a mechanistic drab

(01:21:30):
uh a culture, which is national socialism, philosophy of the
classification of of of races along accidental uh of birth,
accidents of birth, you know. And in fact, Jack Warner

(01:21:51):
brings out some of the material throughout the war and
says to everybody, please show up at seven o'clock in
the morning, I'm going to do some reading from from
man Komf and we're going to discuss it. And he
did that throughout the war. Do you know how many
how much money? How many war bonds were bought at

(01:22:11):
Warner Brothers theaters alone by war's end, three hundred and
sixty million dollars. That's a lot of doll back then.
We're talking in the billions today, and that was one studio.
So the Warner Brothers, who were victims themselves of early
twentieth century progroms in the Russian Vale, they lost family

(01:22:36):
as well in proms. Know, they were the ones that
created films that enlightened American audiences. They closed shop in
Germany in nineteen thirty four, one year after the Nuremberg Loss. Okay, MGM,
RKO and Paramount left in nineteen thirty eight. I lie,

(01:23:00):
I add some of them in nineteen thirty nine, MGM
in nineteen thirty nine. So we're talking people who saw
what was coming anyway, that ending is became the end.
They didn't know how to end the film. That ending
that you see today were one of two films, I'm sorry,
one of two endings. There was one. They were recorded.

(01:23:23):
The other one ended with you know, of course, you know,
I'll have to arrest you and and Rick is arrested.
Rick is arrested and taken away. This ending. This was
written eight days before they finished eight days. It was
one of the last shots. Some b roll over the

(01:23:44):
last shot, last shot.

Speaker 7 (01:23:46):
It took.

Speaker 3 (01:23:48):
Six weeks to shoot at a time when films like
this ninety minutes were shot in three to four weeks.
So I don't know if they felt there was something
special in this, but they were scared. The actress were
scared for the lives they still and it was a
marvel to them that that it was received the way
it was received. My father first time he saw this film,
and if you don't mind, I'll end with this. There

(01:24:10):
was there was an ongoing joke among the the the
immigrant actors that they said they would say, oh, one
man comes in and goes I you know, in those
sundays at Varka's, they would say what did you do?
He says, well, I run the Institute for Advanced Esthetics

(01:24:35):
in Vienna. And the other guy would say, oh, I
see you were a German shepherd too. In other words,
I was something back then and now I'm a mutt, right,
that was the ongoing joke. I was a German shepherd too.
I'm Later in life, I came across an ongoing joke

(01:24:55):
of Cuban and Central America in the area, and that's
mom and dad. Yeah that when they were that's the
day they became fiancees. Anyway, the ongoing jokes among Cubans were, yeah,
he gets off, he gets off a raft and he's
a mutt. And there's this beautiful French poodle, this American
French poodle, and he's snipping her backside. Excuse me, let

(01:25:18):
me tell you my name, and.

Speaker 5 (01:25:19):
She turns around.

Speaker 3 (01:25:20):
He goes at the French poodle and he says, please,
you're a mutt.

Speaker 5 (01:25:24):
Let go of me. Get away your her.

Speaker 3 (01:25:28):
And he looks at her and he's all beat up scabs,
having been in the ocean for ten days. And he
looks at he goes, yes, I am a ger I
am a mont but in Cuba, I was a German shepherd.

Speaker 5 (01:25:40):
That was a ron going jerk, a joke that was.

Speaker 3 (01:25:45):
A joke exactly the same thing that they said in
the in the late thirties with these people that came over.
That joke was probably said on on set of Costable.
It's not a very funny joke, but it's their way
of making of you know, finding I don't know of self.
There's self deprecation, uh, and finding humor in their situation,

(01:26:08):
you know. Uh, and funny enough. You know, in my
father's culture was the same thing. So I I this
this this similarity of feeling this this I suppose you
can say this empathy that my father had for and
my you know, my parents had and not only then
but all over the world. You know, when this film
came out, it was astounding, you know, and I don't

(01:26:33):
know how a movie, I mean, why not Miss Minerva
or other wartime films like I was a Nazi spot.
I'm sorry, I was. I was, Yeah, it was a
Nazi spy or the One that Got Away, or you know,
there are a lot of films that were that were
war related that that just now passed on. We even
call them propaganda. We don't call this propaganda, do it

(01:26:54):
because it links into the American myth that this is
a place where you can make your life a new
and that the lives of three people in our culture
does amount to a hill of beans.

Speaker 7 (01:27:06):
Yeah, that's a great way to end it right there.
But we can't end it because we still have to
ask what's in your cup?

Speaker 5 (01:27:15):
True? That's true. Well I'm gonna I'm gonna ask Chazz, Chaz,
what you got in that ten couple of years? Well,
I used to have folders. It's eight minutes. I was
gonna say, is that? Is that actually the greatest part
of waking up? No?

Speaker 3 (01:27:34):
But you know where it comes from, good to the
last drop, don't you. It was Teddy Roosevelt who was
given you know you heard this, I think in Chicago.
He's giving a talk.

Speaker 5 (01:27:42):
He was a.

Speaker 3 (01:27:42):
Candidate on the second on the second, you know, after
after he took over McKinley, he had an election, and
somebody handed him a coffee and he was a big
coffee drinker, you know, and he just before he finished this, can.

Speaker 5 (01:27:55):
I have some more of it?

Speaker 3 (01:27:56):
This coffee? It's good to the last drop? Yeah, And
it became part of our of our national parlance. Thank
you so much for the opportunity to talk about my
favorite film. It is also my favorite film. There were others.
The Third Man Is by Carol Reid is phenomenal. Talk
about you know that, and also much loved, but this

(01:28:20):
one hits home and I'm not the only one who
said that, you know, And thank you for the privilege
to talk about. It's great to see you guys. And
and what's in your cop yes, Joey, oh, it's it's
not quite folders. It was the River Road Creole roasted coffee.
So I too, am in the coffee crowd. And in

(01:28:42):
just a little bit, there's some green tea that's waiting
on me. It's blueberries, so antioxidants.

Speaker 7 (01:28:49):
And today, how about you, bro?

Speaker 6 (01:28:51):
Whereas I have become the alcoholic of homebrew history, but
alcoholics go to meetings.

Speaker 5 (01:28:57):
I don't what was what wasn't that cut? My youngest brother, Brady.
Brady has been working at Total Wine, which is basically
a twenty one year in older person's like heaven. The
wines here too, I know what you mean.

Speaker 6 (01:29:18):
A wonderful place. Well, this past actually yesterday, we had
our first crawfish boil of the season here in South Louisiana,
and my brother brought with him this company called scatter Brain.
Scatter Brain made this dark chocolate banana whiskey which I

(01:29:39):
was incredibly hesitant to try because sometimes.

Speaker 5 (01:29:43):
When you put two good things together. It makes a.

Speaker 6 (01:29:45):
Terrible thing like fruit is good, cake is good, fruit
cake nasty crap that my wife says, and it's like,
you take a bite of it, it's like is that
a skittle? You know, it's like, but actually it turns
out this stuff is actually really good.

Speaker 5 (01:30:03):
I would actually highly recommend you put it in some coffee,
so a little kick in the folders or or to
really kick up that river road over there. Wonderful stuff.
Scatter brains, dark chocolate, banana whiskey actually pretty good.

Speaker 3 (01:30:17):
Dang, you should put some some buca in your coffee too.

Speaker 7 (01:30:20):
Yeah, now, bo, you know what I'm You know what
I'm thinking. Because we've gone an hour and a half now,
I think we're gonna end up making these two episodes,
so listeners will get you'll get the first part what
on Monday, and then you'll get the second part on
the following Wednesday. Was one who I don't know, we'll

(01:30:41):
see how much time I can a lot to editing it,
but Chaz, it was a pleasure to have you on, bo.
I know, I always enjoy it when we can get
a guest on who just talks for.

Speaker 5 (01:30:52):
An hour and a half and makes our job a
lot easier.

Speaker 7 (01:30:54):
So sorry, it makes my life easy, it makes yours,
and I think we all feel good. And you know,
to talk about this in this experience with somebody who's
in the film industry and someone who has such an
in depth kind of personal connection to it beyond you know,
it's a great movie and I really love it. You

(01:31:15):
have to have that personal bond with its Yeah, it's incredible.

Speaker 3 (01:31:21):
And Chas, we know.

Speaker 7 (01:31:22):
You know, you've got a film that's now releasing in
North America. Yeah, and it's winning some really great recognition.

Speaker 1 (01:31:31):
You are.

Speaker 3 (01:31:33):
I'm not doing this whole flattery thing, you know me.
I don't.

Speaker 7 (01:31:35):
I don't flatter that. You're a gifted writer, an incredible actor,
and your ability to reach through the screen and to
tell a story is so evident in this film. So
give us, you know, maybe two or three minutes. That way,
we can just add an hour and thirty five minutes.

Speaker 5 (01:31:58):
You want to talk about Bella just second? Yeah?

Speaker 7 (01:32:00):
I mean, where where can people find it? How can
we you know, how can we support you? And how
can we you know, how can we watch it? We
think it'll be more from chasmine, Oh jeer God with
poor people it's it's but my partner is in Puerto Rico.
He's Puerto Rican descent.

Speaker 3 (01:32:17):
But the reason why he's there is because Puerto Rico,
the Film Commission has wonderful thing called film credits, so
we're able to fund our films to help the Puerto
Rican Film Commission. The way it works is that you
basically get a tax credit from from It used to
be like that all over the country, but they've copied
what was nationally. I think believe it was a reagulardministration

(01:32:38):
that ended that ironically because he was an actor. But
you know, it's it's exploded. So a lot of national
and and big the big fish come to Puerto Rico,
but the little fish like us. If we if we
write scripts that are set in Puerto Rico and the
characters are port you're allowed to have one foreign one

(01:32:59):
person doesn't live in Puerto Rico in the cast, you
can shoot. And what what I did is took inspiration
from how we adopted my daughter on a bella when
we call Bella and it's it was a I won't
put into details, and when we got two minutes, I've
spoken entirely too much, but it's it's it's it's very

(01:33:19):
difficult for there's a whole demographic of people who are
older in their lives who had to wait until they
had the economic base to have children. You don't have
to wait, that's my big lesson. You have to have something.
But you know, waited too long. So we found difficult
to children. So luckily we found this this program that

(01:33:41):
allows you to that urges you to adopt, and I
prefer to adopt in America, and we adopted and we
haven't looked back. It's the best thing I ever done
in my life. And you know, she's my she's our daughter.
My father was adopted to incidentally, so always knew I
was going to adopt, So anywhoy. That story that I wrote,

(01:34:02):
I co wrote was simply set in Puerto Rico during
the pandemic because we had to shoot during the pandemic,
so we included the pandemic and the storytelling and it's
made all the difference. We've We were just admitted into
the Buenos Aidre's International Film Festival feather there we're up
for the Platino Awards and Madrid, which is like the Oscars.

(01:34:25):
For Yah his Spanish speaking productions held in Madrid were
we're going to Chicago. Two weeks we were in Atlanta.
We opened with the New York Latino Film Festival. So

(01:34:46):
and but four or five other places don't come out. Rome,
the Rome Film Festival we got into and we're still
waiting on some some of them. Usually our stuff gets
put into the platforms immediately. My my my partner is
very well known in the in the in that in
in in in those platforms, specifically Max. But anyway, so

(01:35:10):
we're taking a new attach. We want to give it
a long tail, go to different festivals so that we
can we can have the platforms pay more money for
that's that's the that's and yeah, so it's and and
we're getting a distributor. Now World is distributor because we
we we wade some waves.

Speaker 7 (01:35:28):
Can I die?

Speaker 3 (01:35:30):
And now we're in pre development for our in development
for our next next piece, which is it's inspired by
my dad story, my mom and dad story.

Speaker 7 (01:35:42):
So that's wait to uh to see that and to
see Bella and to you know, keep seeing the great
stuff that comes from from Uncle Chaz. Uncle Chazz Homebrew
history is original supporter. Originally I think he I think
bo does he get honorary membership as a as a
Homebrew crewmember. I think he does.

Speaker 5 (01:36:02):
I think Chance is invited to the cook out of
home Brew and think, damn, I'm there. Well you should
see the case of Scotch.

Speaker 3 (01:36:07):
I've decided I was going to send you now.

Speaker 7 (01:36:09):
Oh well, but I know where that's going. It's going
straight to book now, Bo, always a pleasure. Chaz enjoyed
this so much. I mean, just I know what. We
went along, We talked a lot. We just got to
dive into this movie. But I think not only is
it a great movie, it's also a great kind of

(01:36:31):
It's an artifact in itself that is a product of
the Second World War, about the Second World War, made
during the Second World War when the outcome was still unknown,
and you yet it remains this beautiful testament to the
refugee to you know, to quote Steven Ambrose, it's like

(01:36:52):
a love song to democracy.

Speaker 3 (01:36:54):
It really is. It's political church, and it's who we're
supposed to be.

Speaker 7 (01:36:58):
Yeah, we're supposed to It happens, it is exactly who
we are supposed to be. And as you said, can
be Bo, I can't think of a better way to
end it. So let's go ahead and uh we'll go
ahead and we'll see you next time.

Speaker 3 (01:37:13):
Uh.

Speaker 7 (01:37:13):
Here on homeber History.

Speaker 3 (01:37:29):
That hole.

Speaker 1 (01:37:32):
Talking about home. Everybody be.

Speaker 2 (01:37:39):
A history pod past, going back to the past with
the little best past.

Speaker 8 (01:37:47):
In might leading you a gaes.

Speaker 1 (01:37:50):
Are you biting spired?

Speaker 6 (01:37:53):
But you'll never get tired up?

Speaker 3 (01:37:57):
Hole?

Speaker 5 (01:38:00):
Oh group talks.

Speaker 3 (01:38:03):
Collars on the show with Joey.

Speaker 1 (01:38:08):
That's whole root, whole room.

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