Hall of Ephron - 133 - You've Got Mail

Released in 1998 and directed by Nora Ephron, this delightful film not only showcases the remarkable on-screen chemistry between Meg Ryan and Tom Hanks but also explores the evolving dynamics of human connection in the digital age. With its heartwarming storyline, witty dialogue, and timeless themes, "You've Got Mail" continues to resonate with viewers even decades after its release.

Episode Transcript

(00:03):
Welcome to the nerd Party. Welcomeback to Houselights, our director discussion show

(00:24):
here on the nerd Party Network.We've been going through a romantic comedy spell
with the Ephron Hallway. This weekwe're rounding out that trio we started with
with Harry met Sally and Sleepless inSeattle with the nineteen eight hit You've Got
Mail, or What Happens When awell Time Warner makes a movie starring America

(00:44):
online Email, marketed by Time Magazineand produced by Warner Brothers. I'm Darren
Moser and I'm joined again by myfriends, the small Etcy bookstore owner Tristan
Riddell and the big box book magnetJohn on Mill. That's m I L's
gentlemen, connect your modems and prepareto get online. With the most nineties

(01:08):
of nineties movies of You've Gotten Mail. That could have been one of the
meanest things you've ever said to me, What if you were an Etsy bookstore
owners? I was trying to thinkof something modern that was kind of an
equivalent. I'm the well. Wewere joking my wife and I when we

(01:30):
watched this that this is happening now. Is all the big bookstores are going
out of business for Amazon. It'sthe cycle is complete. I still don't
know how Barnes and Nobles held onat all. They're finally folding, and
it's oh they've been They've been foldingfor years around us. No, but
number one comes around, I'm justlike, oh my god, Yes,
a book, a physical book,I can go. But they've been folding

(01:52):
so much more slowly than Borders did. Borders Orders gone, Oh yeah,
Borders took a gun to the head. They were just like, I don't
want to live any more. Yeah, Borders threw themselves into traffic. I
went through Borders that was closing andhaving their like purge sale, and I
picked up a like nineteen ninety eight, nineteen ninety seven copy pre special edition

(02:13):
copy of Star Wars with the tapeon the bottom, had not been opened,
like a trilogy pack, and Iwas like, this is going on
the shelf because I don't know howlong this has been sitting around. But
yes, well, this movie isreuniting Tom Hanks and Meg Ryan again back
from Sleepless in Seattle. A fewyears later, they're a little bit older.

(02:37):
The Internet is a thing now apparently, and my goodness, this is
such a nineties movie, but ina good way, Like it really just
feels like, yeah, this iswhat the end of the millennium was like
for a lot of us. Andthey opened you can't get oh man,

(02:58):
you know much more now. Yeah, from about nineteen ninety six or seven
to two thousand, you had tohave one of those Cranberry songs in there,
because that meant that you got it, like you knew you were weird.
That guitar, that echoe guitar startup. You're like, yeah,
yeah, yeah, I'm weird.Hip, I'm dealing with normal person.
Yeah, you're you're, you're,you're, you're, You're in society,

(03:19):
you know what's going on. There'sa spring in my step despite the sadness
in my heart. I know Igotta keep moving. And it's like that's
when I put the Cranberries on,you know that sort of thing. Well,
and first we have the you know, I guess somebody watched Star Trek
two and really like CG cityscapes orsomething as we slowly, you know,
fly around. I mean, granted, in nineteen ninety eight, this is

(03:42):
great stuff, but I could pullup something one hundred times better on my
phone and Google maps right now.But no. But but that was actually
my thought looking at it was howquaint it is to go back because the
final shot where it goes real,I think to myself, this is pretty
much what it looks like now.I would love to see them like progress
it further, like you know,but I like that, Like I really

(04:03):
liked it. I love the shotwhere it like loads the island and it's
like loading the textures and chunks andyou're like, oh, I remember that.
And I love the final shot whereyou have like this really rudimentary jogger
going through and they're like, whyis there a jogger there? Oh,
he'll be back, he'll be back, and then you see the real jo.
I loved it. I thought itwas great. Oh no, I'm

(04:26):
not saying I don't love it.I'm just saying it is definitely cutting edge
at the time. Well, andwhat I love most about it is the
angsty rant at the beginning from GregKnear where he's oh, see the end
of Western civilization. And I lovesitting there because there's actually, you know,

(04:46):
you work with people and you're friendswith people and everything where we're it's
such every five to ten years thenew technologies. Like right now it's chat
chypts, the end of Western civilizationgonna die and it's like we've been down
this road before, guys, canwe just calm down? There was okay,
so not a lot of people watchthis movie and that's okay, um,
but it's uh. It was aSeth McFarland directed picture. Oh I

(05:09):
thought you were talking about You've gotmail for a second, like Tristed.
It made two hundred and fifty milliondollars. Okay, wait, wait,
I get what you're saying. Ishould give you a picture. And it's
called A Million Ways to Die inthe West and there you know, it
takes place in Western days and yousee Seth McFarlane and Giovanni Ribisi and like
they're walking down the road and there'skids with a hoop and a stick and

(05:32):
they're hitting the hoop and the stickand they're just having a gay old time
and they're both talking to each otherand there's like you know what, you
know, this this is crazy kidsnowadays, Like they're just they they're relying
too much on technology to have funand like, talk to me in ten
years when they have like you know, like a shrunken pleasure center in their
brain from you know, like toomuch you know, like a not sensitivity,

(05:54):
but like too much exposure. Stimulation, stimulation. That's what I was
looking for, too much stimulation.And it just it's it's so funny because
there was even a line and aMadman where they said, like I'm sure
there were some people in the Biblewho said who just stopped what they were
doing and said kids these days,yes, every yes. And the fascinating

(06:15):
thing to me is remembering very clearlythe Y two K freak out. So
nineteen ninety eight were just we're justcresting the hill. The press is just
about to decide to make us worriedabout something else. That's that's a non
issue. So I still have aVHS copy of taped off of television called
Y two K, the movie whereeverything goes wrong and like nuclear power plants

(06:40):
go off and planes fall out.Now I will say, yes, uh,
the the concern was warranted and itthe problem was solved, which is
why things didn't go bad. It'snot a well, things didn't go bad,
so there was no cause to belike, no, there was cause.
No, I'm glad, I'm gladthat you mentioned that because Okay,

(07:01):
I actually know people who have whoworked on it, and they're like,
no, the reason why the worlddidn't explode is because I put an eighty
hour word. Yeah, yes,that's true. But the hysteria around it
was framed as if that work wasn'tgoing to get done, as opposed to
saying, don't worry, some peoplewho have to put some long hours get

(07:21):
some overtime and they're gonna get itsnews. Yeah, yeah, exactly.
I mean just the fact that picturethis one scenario of Okay, imagine Kaiser
all of a sudden doesn't know theage of their members for childhood immunizations and
every child misses their immunizations for liketwo months. You know, bad that

(07:46):
would be like, and how thatwould cascade throughout time. Anyway, this
is not the White UK podcast.That's a different, different movie. That's
the thing that's I think that's acredit to this, to this film is
that it's not because it's trying tobe nineties. It's not like nineties.
It just was. It just was. That's yes, exactly. It's not

(08:07):
nineties in a in a weird,gawky kind of way. It was just
very much of its time, differentthan like clueless, Like clueless is that
era too, but it's kind ofmore like doubling down. Like I don't
feel like people dress up as cluelessif they're going to a nineties party.

(08:30):
People don't dress up as you've gotmail to a nineties party. This is
what it looked like. Well,I mean, clueless is made purpose like
it was very self aware. Yeah, that's time. It was that it
was it was saying we are alwaysthis is this is the time. We're
going to turn it up to eleven. We're going to a snapshot of this
moment in whereas this is this isjust this is this one goes up to

(08:52):
eleven. Thing, right, Butwhat I found extremely interesting about this is
what it what it? The wholepremise of it is something that I witnessed
happen with a lot of people atthe time and even afterward, because when
social media became a big thing aroundthe micenes of people starting to connect with

(09:15):
people outside that they haven't met yetthrough this ambiquitous internet. I'll put it.
I'll put it this way, theemotional infidelities of online life. I
all man clockett. Okay, we'reat nine minutes and John starts talking about
emotional infidelity. Okay, now thatyou know I was going to get bit
too. I'm saying that that Iremember this type of stuff happening like where

(09:41):
where people and I think there isa moment where, um, she's talking
to Yeah, she's talking to oneof her employees, and the employee asks
have you had cybersex yet? Andshe's like, then it's not cheating.
But I'm sitting there, I'm like, but you know, like there there's
there, there's this this wavering emotionallywith her relationship that's already happening here judging

(10:05):
her. But I'm saying, like, I saw this happen with a lot
of people, and it's a reallytricky space for the movie to be in
sort of thing. So yeah,there was. It's been a while since
i'd watched this movie. I meani'd seen it most likely just one of
those movies you see when you're afilm student. Like it's not a bad
movie. I'm not even seen intheaters. It's just you know, it's

(10:28):
got mail. But but on thisrewatch, I was really struck by And
I'm I'm curious of your both opinions. Did Joe Fox and Kathy Kelly need
to be in relationships currently at thebeginning of this movie, because let's just

(10:48):
mean, the first half of thismovie is a hot mess. I mean,
we're gonna get to the Fox familytree in a moment um, dear
lord. But honestly, once itkind of shifts into the second half,
once we have the Joe discovers thatwho she actually is and things like that,
it's kind of like a whole differentmovie. And I almost feel like,

(11:13):
yeah, you could say that thefirst half is we're seeing what they're
like in these bad relationships or whatever. But John, do you feel like
they needed that in this story orthey could have just been two single people
with this connection uh? Through email? Did we need them to be in
the Terrible? I mean, it'snot as bad as uh, what was

(11:35):
it, Wilford? What's his name? Um? Future President of the United
States? From Sleepless? Uh?What do you go by? Sorry?
Sorry, it's not as bad asWalter, but like these like the people
they're in relationship with are terrible people, like on purpose? Uh I take

(11:58):
I take I take offense to thatabout Walter. I'm a staunch defender of
Walter. Moving on, No,well, we know, I mean we
talked last about how he was purposelybad. They well, they they amp
they amped up his his flaw,like, let's put Walter to the side
here, because I know it's avery touchy start. I caught a lot

(12:20):
of heat from from at least oneof our dear listeners who really took issue
with my issues with Walter. Sorighteous heat. But we're moving on,
moving on to the gem that isFrank and who is the Parker posey?
So yes, So no, Idon't think the movie needs them. I

(12:43):
don't. I think that the waythey resolve them is needed simply because of
their existence in the script. SoI think it resolves them cleanly enough,
which I was at the beginning.I was like, oh boy, how
are we going to res this one? And it winds up resolving them cleanly
enough, And I think that itplays into one of the larger story points,

(13:09):
which is both um, you knowboth uh Tom Hanks and Meg Ryan
are being more honest with that screenand I think where they are with right
actual partners. Yeah, yeah,you could have said, well they're they're
just you know, that's the wholeThat was the whole appeal of this and

(13:31):
it's the whole appeal of of youknow, the relationships that strike up on
social media as you don't have thereal world baggage with somebody, right,
there's no can't I'm just sharing aboutmy day. They can't leave the toilet
seat up, they can't forget todo the dishes, they can't fart too
loudly in public. Like, there'snone of those things that go along with
a string of letters on the screen, And you can sort of mold things

(13:54):
and be more open if you chooseto. Uh No, I think that
I think that this is one ofthose ones where I sort of split the
difference and cop out a little bitto say I don't think they're needed.
I think this film could have existedperfectly fine without them. But it resolves

(14:16):
their stories cleanly and detriment not asmuch, not perfectly, but cleanly enough
that Parker Posey exists so that MegRyan can have a positive future presented to
her at the end, and GregKeneer's character serves the purpose of sparking the
conflict between the two characters and ampingthat up to eleven so that it's not

(14:39):
just this abstract you're a big business, you're a small business. We must
be enemies. It's they take itto the mattresses and then makes it much
worse and once he comes into it, you know. I think that's the
thing though. I think, likewhat you just said is a good enough
reason to have them in the picture. Now, they could have been friend
I think great Kneer could have beena friend, you know in that realm

(15:01):
too, like her guy friend thatshe shares about a relationship yeah yeah,
or like the guy that she knowsthe papers, like she goes specifically to
him saying like, hey, Iwant you to write about this, Like
that could have taken place. Ithink. I think between the two of
them, Parker Posey totally could haveI think Tom Hanks didn't need to be
in a relationship. But I reallylike the relationship between Greg Kneer and and

(15:24):
Meg Ryan because of his you know, he has a voice, he has
a perspective, and I really lovetheir yeah yeah, yeah very much an
ego. And I really like theirbreakup scene because it's so civil. Yes,
it's fantasy, it's movies in themaking, but it's I really like
that breakup. They both realize they'renot in love with each other, yes,

(15:46):
and there's no bickering, there's noarguing. It's kind of it's kind
of what I like one of theyou know, speaking of Walter, It's
kind of why I like the endingof the Walter and Meg Ryan relationship in
Sleeps Within Seattle's because Walter kind of, you know, sacks up and realizes
that he doesn't want to be withsomeone who doesn't want to be with him,

(16:07):
and Greg Kneer understands like, well, I don't really love you either,
and you know you don't love me, so let's just shake hands and
and part ways. And I justreally really like that. Yeah, something
I want to hit on though,just because we keep doing this where we
say Greg Kner, Parker, Posey, Tom Hanks, Meg Ryan. Do

(16:29):
you think that there are any performanceshere that step through and you forget that
you're watching somebody playing a part?No rom com John Yeah, this is
a nineties rom comput Johnny Depp orGary Old. But no, I think
you're right, though I don't feellike, like, granted, you know,

(16:51):
Joe Fox is different than um,you know, Sleepless in Seattle.
Like he's a bit more the youknow, of an asshole and a jerk,
and you know, he's but yeah, no, I I think in
this stage, like calling him TomHanks or calling him Joe Fox is interchangeable
at this point, it doesn't.It's not like, well then, let

(17:15):
then let me ask this question asa follow up. Do you think this
movie winds up being successful? Youknow, say they trade talent for talent,
that it's equal levels of talent.Do you think this movie winds up
being more successful and endearing if TomHanks and Meg Ryan aren't in those roles?
Or do you think that it cheatsits way into your heart by using
those two actors, knowing that you'reyou're going to go into the theater saying

(17:37):
oh Tom Hanks and Meg Ryan,Yeah, and you're more receptive to this
whole thing. I want Tristan answerfirst, because I'm going to take it
in a different direction. So Iyeah, I love that question. I
think that's a great question because oneof the first things I thought of or
remembered, I should say when Iwhen I did this rewatch was I remember

(17:57):
having so much many people ask thequestion, wait, so are they the
same people? Are they the samecharacters? And I remember valid questions.
It's a valid question. I remembernews story saying no, they're not the
same people. You know they're there. It's just Tom Hanks and Meg Ryan
being romantic leads in a movie again, because everybody forgets Joe and the Volcano.

(18:21):
That's right. But I I thismovie is not as successful. It's
I mean, nineties rom coms werere great. I missed them. I
cherish them. But there's a reasonwhy we had movie stars for so long
as we did. Like I know, the conversation very much as of right

(18:42):
now is like, you know,who are the remaining movie stars? You
know, is the Rock still aremaining movie star? Definitely, Tom Cruise,
you know, like every everything likethat, Like those those the conversations
that are happening right now, TomHanks, Meg Ryan, Boom. They
put butts in seats. If thiswas just some if they put no names
in there, you'd have no storyfor the media, I should say,

(19:06):
you'd have no you have no anglein promotion. And so I say,
even though this is a good saythat they gave identical performances, but it's
a different phase, different voice,whatever, identical performance the same kind of
charm. This would still be agood movie, but it would not make
two hundred and fifty million dollars innineteen ninety eight money. No, I
agree, and that's the direction Iwanted to take it because I feel just

(19:27):
like you said, Tristan, Yeah, this is a vehicle to put Big
Ryan and Tom Hanks together. Butthe story on its own is a great
story. But so I think thestory could carry itself with other actors.
But I don't think butts would getin the seats because they don't know who
they are. Oh yeah, butbut that is that is the core of

(19:48):
my question. Do you think I'mnot talking about box office? I'm talking
about would it be as warmly receivedby audio offices? All that matters?
John? You know what I forgotthat you're absolutely cur Michael Bay is the
greatest director of all time and oneall those Oscars, and obviously the Fast
Franchise is the greatest film series atthe night. But let's not get carried

(20:10):
away. Obviously we care a littlebit more about the art. But no.
So this is based off of amovie, which was a play and
a story called The Shop around theCorner, which is one of the main
reasons that Meg Ryan, Kathain Kelly'sbookstore is called The Shop around the corner
and she doesn't have the trademark onit, even though you know she's literally

(20:33):
just around the corner. But thismovie is a nineteen forty nine Jimmy Stewart
classic, and I was able torewatch it before doing Givebout Mail because I
wanted to do that. Comparison isvery much the same story. I mean,
obviously a little bit of a differencewhere they are not in previous relationships
before, but pretty much the seeingher at the restaurant and him seeing her

(21:00):
first and making the decision to takeit in that direction is is beat for
beat out of that movie. IsHe's Got He has his friend in this
movie, played by Joe Dave Chappelle, But you know seeing you know,
oh is she there? She beautifuland he's like, oh, well,
she kind of looks like so andso, and it's like, oh,
well who cares about so? So? Well, if you don't like so
and so, you're not gonna likeher because it is so and so Like

(21:22):
that is straight out of that movie. So, oh my gosh, it
is such a fun so for talkabout shop around the corner for a second.
I mean it's black and white.It's again just this little shop and
the people that work there, andagain very same beats of they're kind of

(21:44):
mean and nasty to each other.They in this in the movie, they're
just they're two employees. You know, one's a little higher seniority, one's
not. But it's just it's justsuch a good movie. It's such your
heart feels warm by it. Peopleare just decent to each other the entire
time. Everyone's mister this and missesthis, and the playing on the name.

(22:07):
But the actor who plays the wizardof the Wizard of Oz is the
main owner of the store. Sohighly highly recommended. If you can find
a copy, give it a watch, and you will definitely see the parallels
in You've Got Mail, Not thatit's a copy, but just you could
tell this is the story. Andthis story has been done many times.
It's been There was a Julie Garlandmovie that was also kind of based off

(22:29):
of So this boy meets girl andhate each other, and then boy discover
like with the pen pal, thatthat's an important aspect of it. And
then the boy finds out, oh, I know who you actually are,
and then kind of weaves this newdirection while stringer along obviously email is the
new venue for this story. SoI could totally see the pitch meeting of

(22:52):
like, oh, let's take thismovie where it was pen Pals and let's
we own AOL. So let's let'smake it. It makes sense, but
it works. One of the reallystories. Yeah, yeah, this is
one of those stories that really lendsitself to an update where you're not forcing
it. It's a natural evolution andas a bit of a jump. That's

(23:15):
I think it's it's time. Well, I think that um one of the
things that makes this work. AndI don't I have not seen the shop
around the corner. I plan to, I want to, didn't have the
chance this time. Failed on yourhomework. It's okay, John, Yeah,
you know that's not the first timesomebody said that. And I just
want to go ahead and say thatwhat makes this more successful structure wise than

(23:40):
Sleepless in Seattle is Darren Earlier,you mentioned how it sort of gear shifts
and becomes a little bit of adifferent movie later on, and you're absolutely
right, it does, and itpivots, and I think very much the
movie's credit it has the Tom Hankscharacter do the work to establish a relationship

(24:03):
with Meg Ryan to make sure thatthere's actually a connection there, that there
is a human connection there that isforming. And I think it's also this
would be something where I would givetribute to Hanks where he does an excellent
job of being sly without being smarmyabout planting the clues. He keeps giving

(24:25):
her clues as to who he reallyis, and she just doesn't see past
it, and he never holds itagainst her. He just keeps throwing those
little breadcrumbs there in their scenes andshe just isn't picking up on it.
But then it makes the way itresolves itself because spoilers, it's a romantic
comedy. They get together in theend. But that's why that's a tight

(24:48):
rope. That is an absolute tightrope that Tom Hanks walks at the end
is because this could have been ina this could have been very very creepy
at the end where like he knowsyou know, like in power, the
power, dynamic power, Yeah,exactly, like he could manipulate her in

(25:08):
order to get information, or youcould manipulate her in order to woo her
in a way to lead lead heraway from himself, you know, his
online self. You know, likeit could have been played in a very
creepy, not so nice way whereyou're just kind of like, I don't
know how I feel about that.But he pulls it off with being jokey

(25:33):
about it, where like with thewhole like oh, mister New York who
had one hundred and fifty two face, you know, like that kind of
thing, where like he's when he'smaking a joke about him, he's making
a joke about himself, but he'snot doing it where where it gives him
an edge or an advantage or putsher in a spot where she is devoid

(25:56):
of agency. Yeah, and healso does cut it off from the other
end, where as the online performance, he doesn't say he doesn't start acting
like a jerk to get her too, because eventually if they get together,
like she's gonna know it's him,so he can't like push him onto himself.
But no, they Yeah, likeyou said, Trisan, it's a

(26:18):
tight rope, but it and Ithink vastly better than Sleepless in Seattle,
where you buy it Like by thetime like he is landing this plane,
he's building the plane and landing itat the same time, so when it
touches down at the very end,and you have the meat cute and he's
putting it on the line and herlike I was hoping it was you like,

(26:38):
you believe it. You believe thatshe because that is the plane you
have to land because if you don'tmake that convincing, that's just what she
can say. Whatever, that's howthe script goes. But if we haven't
been taken there through the second halfof this movie to buy like, why
on earth would she love this guywho did run her out of business?

(27:02):
And you know, but we sawhim change and so yeah, it's a
so the second half and again I'mnot bashing on the first half the Fox
family tree again just is it gottroubles and it weirds me out. But
I'm glad you mentioned that. Ithink that, Um, that's the one

(27:22):
part that remains clunky to me,you know, as I revisit it mentally,
and everything is is I love DadneyColeman. He's one of those those
supporting players that I always love seeingshow up. She obviously couldn't get Rob
Ryner, so she got Carl Reiner. Okay Ryner for Reiner shore Shore.
But that is the part that seemsa little too messy to me, is

(27:47):
to simply it. Basically, itcould have been a lot more streamlined and
simply have it be just Dabney Colemanand he's retiring and Tom Hanks is taking
over the company, and you havea couple of conversations where he talks about,
you know, Dad, you weren'texactly the best model for a relationship.
That's why I haven't gotten married toanybody, is because I look at

(28:08):
the what you did, but insteadyou can't even have the three generations,
which I liked. I liked outthey're all on their boats at the end,
and I'll like there was a lotof great material, but the way
they went about it like it wasodd. It just it just seemed a
little clunky to me. Although theexistence of the kids gives a reason for

(28:29):
him to meet her, but thatstill could have been cleaner and just said,
oh, these are mine. Couldalso have a sister and they could
be his niece and nephew. Itdoesn't have to be aunt, but he
could just say this is my sisterand brother. It's like your sister and
brother. It's like, yeah,my dad got married a couple of times,
and she's she's a number three's daughterand he's number four's son. I

(28:51):
as someone who comes from a weirdlike situation or I should say uncommon,
I really appreciated that. Like Iliked seeing that because I have you know,
like I'm thirty six and I haveassist a half sibling who's fifty six,
and I, um, my dadis the oldest and his his uh,

(29:18):
his brother is forty years younger thanhim. And like my grandmother and
my dad's first wife were pregnant atthe same time, and like like my
my great uncle was once engaged tomy grandmother, you know, like it
was it was. I have tonsof different I have tons of interaction between
both sides of my mom's of mymom's side of my dad's side, and

(29:42):
like tons of age differences, andso like somebody's second cousin is also their
uncle, you know, like nono incesty stuff going on, but a
lot of complicated, um you know, branches sideways instead of always up and
down. And so I actually reallyreally liked that because I was an uncle
when I was six years old,you know, and just I just really

(30:06):
like that kind of stuff. I'mnot knocking it because it's for any other
reason than this is a movie.And so I want to see things streamlined
that you get what I'm saying,Like, I think life is complex,
John, it's it's but my moviesdon't mut but their last name is not
Fox, the simplest of last names. I like if I see an opportunity

(30:29):
where a movie or a script orsomething could run at an hour and forty
five instead of two hours, becauseyou have to build in all of this
extra explanation and interplay, because you'vedecided to lean into that complexity. I
might look at it and say,oh, he could tighten that up.
That's a twenty second scene. Itwas a twenty second scene. Okay,
give me a break. But butlike you said, John, it was

(30:52):
a vehicle to get him in thestore. And now he's seeing her,
and he's seeing like, yeah,and the before, which I'm saying,
the before he finds out who shereally is. He's even also kind of
holding the power at that moment becausehe knows he's Joe Fox of this giant
store that's coming around the corner patentpending cut around the corner, and she

(31:15):
doesn't. And so of course she'streating him nicely because she's a nice person.
And I love the subtle like hedoes, you know, he takes
the idea of the printed bags andputs that in a story like he's all
like when he's playing hardball at thebeginning, he is is manipulating and using
her, not to a huge degree, but he is definitely But what do

(31:37):
you guys think about when it goesto the mattresses? Because I guess we
got all quote the Godfather now thatI've seen it, but that turn in
the story where she's now because thiswas very interesting to watch because it was
very much the uh, you know, oh big business coming in, oh
treading on the little guy or likeoh like all your mom and pops and

(32:00):
it's interesting now again removed seeing thebig businesses fall because of the Internet,
Like it's like the next domino hasfallen. But and that's really only because
now it's twenty twenty three and thiswas nineteen ninety eight. But what do
you guys feel like that take onthat David Goliath? Oh if we and

(32:21):
I like kind of how they portrayedit of like, oh, we we
rallied and we petitioned and we didall this and it made no difference to
our bottled mind because at the endof the day, it's a business and
they're cheaper. Yeah, I meanthat pretty much summed it up right there.
Yeah, I think I think it'sa David and Goliath story that will
never get old. I mean,it's it's it's timeless. It's I mean,

(32:44):
we're talking about a biblical story thathas been retold thousands, if not
millions of times in different ways,and this is this is one of those
times where now granted we're talking aboutDavid and Goliath, and David defeated Goliath,
but this one, that's not whathappened. That's true. It's at

(33:05):
the struggle is what they're talking about. But they didn't. It didn't play
out quite like the biblical tale.That's a good point. Well, yeah,
I mean David also didn't have todeal with the zoning committees and city
councils and stuff like that to puthis building in place, and you know,
grease the levers of power with youknow, promises of different sorts of
things that you know, the businessesdue. But like I mean, yeah,

(33:28):
that's slinging a loot, that's allthey needed. Yeah. But but
but that is very apt because ina sense, it doesn't ever call the
audience out on it. But thisthis isn't the movie to do that sort
of thing. But there is thatsort of undercurrent of it made no difference,
And it's that realization of people canget all worked up that they want
to about a situation like this,but you walk into somebody and you say,

(33:52):
hey, here's the same product,and you can go here and get
it for fifteen he sent less,or you can more select her more and
yeah, or you can pay moreand uh, you know, help out
your neighbor. One hundred percent ofthe time, if it's a blind situation,
people will say, oh, I'mgonna pay fifteen percent less, but

(34:14):
I signed a change dot org petitionJohn, Yeah, well yeah, that's
yeah, Okay. You know,besides the fact of how it plays out,
there's also there's two things I reallylike about and because again they didn't
have to be part of the story, but I like how they're they're so
realistic. How she had her friendwho was a publisher who was like at

(34:36):
the beginning, like, oh,I really want you know, to support
you, and then eventually started herbook deal, which again it's her business
too. She has to promote herbook and where is she going to get
more business like and and I lovehow Kathin Kelly wasn't upset, didn't call
her up and say how could youdo this to me? Like she gets
it. She you know, sheunderstands that that her friend had to make

(34:58):
that choice. But then the latermoment when the surget mother old lady I
began don't remember her name but JeanStapleton, you know, when she was
remember Jean Stapleton's name when you're onthe podcasts okay, okay, but when
she's like, you're doing the braverthing because you're choosing to believe in a

(35:20):
world where you aren't just a bookstoreowner, and I'm like, yeah,
she was trying to like pump herup, but it's also kind of true,
like that is a risk, thatis the unknown, that is going
off and doing something else, andespecially something you inherited from your mother,
Like was this ever the thing thatyou really wanted to do? And obviously

(35:42):
she got a lot of joy outof it and was very good at her
job. But what John, whatdid you think of that that not twist,
but just that portrayal of because youknow, we all kind of saw
it coming, like there's no twistat the end where she saves the corner.
It's it's or even if she savedit, it was going to be

(36:02):
a short lived victory sort of thing. Um. I mean, you know,
I mean, honestly, it's thatI don't know how well the movie
really calls it out. That sceneis a good call out of it.
But maybe I would have preferred,I don't know, even more of um,
even more of a moment to land. But you know, we do

(36:25):
get her, you know, seeingher mom playing with her as a kid,
and a vision sort of thing talkingto her. But it is that
sort of um, that realism,that pragmatism about the story where it's like,
you know, the world's going tochange and you're not always gonna like
how it changes. And yes,it is good that Jeane Stapleton has that

(36:46):
moment where she says, you're you'rechoosing to have faith in yourself basically that
this isn't you know, this businessmight go away, but that doesn't mean
that you go away. You justhave you just have to find it different
place for yourself out there, andthat I think is you know, that's
definitely an important lesson for the It'srare in a movie, because usually the

(37:09):
story is conformed to make them winabsolutely. But I mean, but when
they maybe not this kind of movie, not just win, but also when
they lose. Typically in a storylike this, there's this sort of like
righteousness that the audience gets to feel, whereas this is a much softer sort
of you're not going to restart anew bookstore, or you're not gonna work

(37:32):
for him and then take things over. You're not gonna infiltrate the board or
anything. You're just going to acceptit. There's just nothing you could do
here. I mean, in asense, it's it's a lot like Rocky
where it's like, so long asI go the distance, that's all that
matters. I gave it my all, right, doesn't matter whether I want
or not. And if they wantedto stretch this out like Actually, one

(37:53):
thing that really upon this rewatch thatmy wife and I notice was just like,
why would they need that many peopleworking? At that time? I
did think that too. I wasI've gone to a used bookstore when I
was looking for a book. Ididn't realize it was a used bookstore,
but it was. And there wasone man in the front at the counter

(38:14):
that was it, And I'm like, there's quite a like, man,
nineties were pumping. You had likenow businesses were just given away jobs.
I want to say that there wasnear where I went to high school,
there was a beloved institution of aused bookstore called Barbarian Books and Comics,
and everybody went there for their comicbooks. But they had this insane,

(38:37):
insane used book section that was massivelydisorganized and nobody could make any sense of
it and you couldn't find anything.And I still miss it, and I
had some terrific memories in Barbarian.But to your point, when he got
an employee, that was like,wow, hey, days are here,

(39:00):
man, you have somebody working foryou, because typically you would just sit
behind the counter. It was likeI'm looking for this and it's like,
yeah, go over there and findit, you damn self. And then
like he got somebody, I waslike, all right, ray, come
on up, man. I lovethat. Yeah. If this movie was
just a little bit more realistic,like Steve's on would have been fired first,

(39:20):
Yes, then you know Heather Burnsand actually no, probably you know
no, I think it would havebeen Jeane Stapleton's the first one she's independently
wealthy, and she's also carrying themost salary. By that point, I
think there would have been a momentwhen Captain Kelly is trying to make the
decision and Jeane Stapleton bows out becauseshe's like, I don't, yeah,

(39:44):
his job, keep it, keepyour friend a little longer, and then
it's just the two of them leftat the very end. I could see
that happening. I think I kindof wish that would have happened now that
I'm saying it out loud, becauseI feel like it would have kind of
more realistic because they went from it'sgoing to close to the B story not

(40:05):
B story, but like, likeI said, that second half is like
is very different, but it wasvery abrupt too, because like they go
from like she's she's doing news interviewsand she's like she's she's up in front
of a microphone, and then likeit feels like a you know, half
a heartbeat later you know that she'slike, what are you gonna do?
And she's like, oh, well, we're gonna close. Well, I

(40:27):
will say one of the things thatmy wife noticed which I like also about
this movie is it is it talksabout seasons really like it starts in the
fall, like we're pushing through thatleaf branch as we transition inside, and
then it's Winner or it's it's Halloween. At the beginning, we're carving pumpkins,
and then we're putting up Christmas lights. So I do agree it does

(40:49):
feel a bit jarring, but inthe grander scheme, the movie is taking
place over several months and seasons,and it's also reflecting on seasons of your
life as you're kind of positioning through. But yes, it does. It
did kind of feel like and we'redone with that story. Now we're going
to focus on he knows and shedoesn't, and that's going to be the
rest of the movie, which Iwill say, you know, watching this

(41:13):
and it only gets more and moreacute because we are in the you know,
the age of the algorithm, thefalse choice, the hallways that they
shove you down, and everything likethat when you're you know, going through
online and everything. But there isa small pang that I feel seeing you
know, Kathleen's bookstore and thinking ofthose used bookstories and thinking of those small

(41:36):
record shops like Fantasmagoria that that wasnearer again shops or anything that's small and
where specific. But if you wantedto find something unexpected, it was a
lot easier because you could go inand talk to a person and say,
you know, I don't know,I'm kind in the mood for something like
even blocks, just something that youcould just know. Block Buster was the

(42:00):
Fox Books of the world. Iremember the old mom and pop, I
remember the old and stuff like that. You're right, you're yeah, I'm
talking those those old school you knewthe guy that ran the place and or
went in there often enough that likethey knew your parents sort of thing.
You would walk in you like,you know, hey, mister Friday night,

(42:21):
I got something you might like here. No, no copies a Batman
this week. However, over hereI've already remembered once a while you get
a free one where they're just like, you know what, you come in
here all the time. This one'son the house. You know, like
that's not gonna have Fox Books now. Yeah, I remember there was one
time like I like, um,I'm not gonna say what the movie is
because John wald Head will explode.Um, but like there was a movie

(42:44):
that I hadn't seen in a series, and that no one had it.
No one had it in town,like no one was selling it anything like
that. So and like I soI went to a mom in a pop
video shop that I that I knew, and I said, I was like,
how do I get this? So, like, we'll order it for
you coming next week. You know, like you couldn't do that, like
this was before you could order stuff, like before you could order you or

(43:07):
I have to know, I haveto know. This is a podcast full
of honesty, Tristan. I haveto know what this is. It was
the third Highlander film. You know, all of us made that mistake,
Tristan. All of us made themistake, to say, you know what,
they screwed up so bad in thesecond one. I bet they learned
their lessons. You went to avideo store. I made that mistake in

(43:29):
a movie theater. It's okay,there's no judgment here, thank you.
I'd never I'd never seen it before. I'd never seen it before. It's
not like I've seen it and Iloved it so much I needed to own
it. I had never seen itbefore. That's a different conversation. I'm
being very understanding right here. Iget it. I get it. It's
all right. I know there's there'sthere's a twinge in your heart strings when
it comes to Highlanders. So I'msorry you went to No, I'm sorry

(43:52):
you went to that much trouble forHilander three. But you know it's more
of a commiseration sort of thing.He's like, due to ordering, it
is now fifty fifty five, Ihave to rent this. You're like,
wait, wait, wait what noone else is gonna be I'm sorry?
What all right? Well, asher rounding third, here just a few
more little points. I love DaveChappelle's little role. I was forget he's
in this movie, and then it'slike, oh look it's Dave Chappelle's Dave

(44:15):
Chappelle. And he's so great aslike the friend, and and I love
the story behind his casting. Idon't know the story. What was that?
Yeah? He so he was offeredthe role of Bubba in Forrest Gump,
okay, and he turned it down, saying that this movie is gonna
this movie is gonna suck. It'sgonna fay. Forrest Gump, the you

(44:35):
know, the winner of like elevenAcademy Awards. Yeah, and he like
after it swept the Oscars and madeso much money. He's like son of
a rich and um, it's likehey Tom, Hey Tom, Hey buddy,
buddy. Yeah. And that's thething is that, like he told
Tom Tom Hanks he said, he'slike, He's like, man, He's
like, I hate that I didthat. And so Hanks went to Ephron

(44:58):
when this movie came about, hewent to Fron and said, hey,
Chappelle would be great for this role. Let's get him. And Chappelle was
just like, yes, yes,of course, yes, Tom makes movie.
Yes, I will absolutely, don'thave to pay me, I'll just
show up. But I I can't. I cannot see him as Bubba though.
I'm so glad that oh yeah no, Michael T. Williamson was the

(45:21):
perfect casting for absolutely no. Yeahyeah, but he's great with this.
You know that he's the friend youknow, Um, I also love I
can't just little things like because again, you know, we've talked a ton
about Nora f Fron, we talkedabout her work, so maybe not my
name, but I love that,like the fact that he sees her um

(45:44):
or what is it the other wayaround, one of them sees the other
on like the TV. And thatleads to the next moment um oh that's
what it was. Sorry. Sothere's the interview that he's watching while he's
running on the treadmill and she's obviouslywatching it. Two and so that's when
we see Joe Fox again, andthat's when then the next time they meet.

(46:07):
So it's just little things like thatof like when they know who each
other's are. It all kind ofplays out really well, like it's very
smartly written. That was a hilariousscene by the way, when he's on
the treadmill. Like I didn't sayit was eloquent. Yeah, like we
sell cheap books cut and it's likewait, wait, wait, it's like,
well, like, oh yeah,that's that's what the media will do,

(46:27):
is they will totally chop up yoursound bite to fit whatever they wanted
to say. Absolutely absolutely, butat the end it didn't matter. And
one last round around music, Sowe have George Feton coming back, who
we've also heard do Groundhog's Day everAfter, Memphis Bell to name a few.
But I think, I mean itreally is the pop culture songs in

(46:53):
this one. Like you know,Tristan was talking about that that opening song
where you feel like you're either infelicity or you've got mail or so you
are in the nineties, you arerooted deep there. What do you guys
think there's overall just the music cues, because there were there were quite a
few in this one. I loveI loved it. I thought it was

(47:15):
great. I thought this was veryUm. I think the only thing that
really insists insisted upon itself was thewas the Cranberry song. But at the
same time you're like, oh God, it's the cranberries. But then you
catch yourself just kind of jiggle inyour head and you're like, oh,
I love you cranberries. That can'tbe bad at you, No, give

(47:37):
it a try. But I thinkthat, um, yes, but I
think that the soundtrack is good.But what I think is interesting about it
is if I compare this too Sleeplessin Seattle too, You've Got Mail,
I would argue that the Tarantino effecthas happened between ninety three and ninety eight.

(47:57):
So there, I think there's alittle bit more pressure on soundtracks to
have a little bit more of thatkind of flow and feel that to become
a be more soundtrack instead of score, well, to be more of a
you know, like a pop culture. Um, you know, patchwork the

(48:17):
way that Tarantino approaches it, soyou get that that healthy mix of like,
even no matter how you feel aboutthe movie, this is an incredible
mixtape. And so you'll buy thesoundtrack and you'll you'll love it. And
if it works with the scenes,then it works really really well with the
scenes sort of thing. So,uh, you know, I think that's
um yeah, and so so Ithink I think it the music works better

(48:43):
than it did for for Sleepless inSeattle. I want to if you don't
mind, I want to shift gearsjust a little bit because I really wanted
to talk about the cinematography of thisof this film, because I feel like
in makes New York look beautiful.But yes, oh my gosh, yeah
like it. You know, we'vewe've seen so many movies that take place

(49:05):
in New York, and you canreally make New York look however you want
it to, because it's so giganticand so massive, like you can go
and find whatever you want because WestSide of New York, right, I
think they state that a couple oftimes. Yeah. John Lindley is the
one who photographed this, and thisguy owned the nineties and so in eighty

(49:28):
nine he photographed Field of Dreams,and then in the nineties it did Sleeping
with the Enemy, Father of theBride, Sneakers, the good Son,
I Love Trouble, Michael Pleasantville,then You've Got Mail, and oh also
Freedom Song, which was a littlemore color and You've Got Mail than Pleasantville
but good. But it's just whenyou think about the photography styles of Father

(49:53):
of the Bride and Michael and You'veGot Mail, You're like, oh,
of course the same guy clearly photographthese and so I feel like this is
one of those things where Nora Ephronas a director is there for the story
and the acting and then let's otherpeople kind of handle the technical side of

(50:15):
things with editing and cinematography and music. That's just my guess, after you
know, with Hindsight being twenty twentyand everything like that and going through analysis
and I'm not saying this is abad thing. I'm not saying this as
a good thing. It's just athing that is. It's kind of like
we always go back to what doesa Nolan film look like? When when
Wally's gone, we're like, oh, crap, it just looks like a

(50:37):
Nolan film. I don't think thisis that situation. Because Limbley's work is
very distinctive for what he wants atthat time. I mean, like for
the era of its that it existsin, and lots of like shallow depth
of field. There's a lot oftimes and they're on the front and like

(50:57):
the background is just kind of beautiful. It's well, but it's just very
shallow and fuzzy and and also verygood everywhere. Yeah, really really soft
glowy lights that Spielberg and Janus stolefor the early two thousands. They got
a lot of inspiration from that.I think there's like when they're one of

(51:19):
the few times, like when they'restarting to grow together and they're on the
sidewalk and it's a shot reverse shot, and it's again very beautiful because very
long lens because they're in focus.But then everything behind them in both directions
are just a blur, but notin a distracting blur, like they feel
like they're on a bad green screen, but in a you know, I

(51:39):
know where you are, and Iknow where the camera is, but it's
just obviously where I'm supposed to focuson. Even good shots of the computer
screen, computer screens are tricky toshoot and make look good with the little
the diaping and the cursors all that. I remember. There was one time
Fincher actually talked about David Fincher,the director, talked about, oh that

(52:00):
Furey shoot shooting a computer a computerscreen, and he says, he's like,
oh yeah, like a lot ofpeople thought. I was like when
I did Dragon Tattoo that I was, um, just kind of copying myself
from social network. And he's like, you know, and I'm like you
you try to find inventive ways ofto shoot a computer screen, Like there's

(52:22):
two ways and that's it, andeverybody does those two ways. Yeah.
No, that's although when they finallystart to instant message, hearing that chime
of the message, I was Iwas taken back to like two thousand and
two, two thousand and three,when we didn't have smartphones yet. So
your aim was on your computer inyour dorm room and you were away when

(52:45):
you were in class, and whenyou weren't, you were there and you
heard, you heard the chirp kids, you after speakers cranked and you knew
someone was saying hey, and itwas a less connected time. That was.
That was one thing I really likedabout this movie. The straight up
nostalgia and the romantic wild West ofthe Internet. Met in a chat and

(53:09):
talked about things, and yeah nametalked and she kept saying She's like,
oh, I did it as ajoke, and you know, and that's
how we met, you know,Like I was. I went to college
between two thousand and four and twothousand and eight, and I think around
two thousand and five, one ofmy professors said like, oh, yeah,

(53:30):
I met my husband online. Andeverybody had a thousand questions. And
this was in two thousand and five. This is seven years after You've Got
Mail came out, and people werestill like, really, like you're you're
meeting yours? There was way morestigma. Now, a vast majority of
people meet their significant others online.Vast majority of people like if I,

(53:52):
if you, I dare you tofind someone who is of average dating age
who does not have an online dayeating profile on their phone? You know
like that. It's I'm just gladI'm not in the sea anymore. I've
definitely gosh, I can't imagine.Oh my, I'm so happy I'm married
and too old. Yes, butit's a completely different conversation. It's something

(54:15):
that our kids are not gonna havelike they're gonna look at You've got mail
like we look at two thousand andone? Yeah? What or what do
they say? You know? Sorrywhen you have to explain it? But
oh no, I you know,to quote meat wad from Lacteinehager for us,

(54:35):
I get it. It ain't makingme laugh, but I get it.
Hey, you thought it was funnyscrew left on the inside. Yes,
I did, Yes, I did. All right, So John,
looking back in nineteen ninety eight,Well, I'm sorry I didn't ask was
this your first time watching You've gotnone? None of us asked this.

(54:55):
Yeah, okay, yes earlier.But I mentioned her earlier. Darren,
I'm glad you listened to me whenI talked earlier. That's fine that you
watched it, like sixty minutes beforewe record it. You're like one hundred
and thirty two minutes before we record. As long as it's long earlier than
the length of the movie, You'reall good? Yes, well what so

(55:16):
yeah, let's start with you withyour of all rating, but again your
overall imry. I have to interruptbecause Darren, there was one time,
like I was texting you and Isaid, you know, I don't I
think we might have to move recordingtonight because I'm not quite sure if I'm

(55:36):
gonna make it. Things are poppingup here and there. And you said,
Darren, you said to me,They're like, oh yeah, like
we have to record in thirty minutes, and I'm still watching it. I
was like, well, how muchdo you have left? And You're like
eighty minutes And I'm like, Idon't think you're gonna make it either,
Darren. Well, i'd seen thatmovie before and I was just fast forwarding
certain bines. I'm like, Okay, then that happens, and that happens.

(55:57):
Look, just because you can seemy viewing history doesn't mean get to
judge me by it anyway. I'msorry, John, But yes, but
John, first time viewing and youroverall rating on You've got mail, Well,
we all know how I felt aboutSleepless in Seattle and all of the
problems I had, And I thinkyou can tell from this conversation you gave
it a two. So yes,I did, Yes, I did deservedly

(56:21):
so, And I think that thisis this is one of those things where
I went in not with a chipon my shoulder, but I went in
saying nowhere to go but up,nowhere to go but up? Like that,
I felt that Sleepless in Seattle hadgiven me my basement, and I
like, at the worst I wasgoing to be standing in there unless something
absolutely catastrophic happened, like for meto go down to one star level,

(56:45):
this would have had to have beenlike and Tom Hanks was, you know,
he had two different marriages happening atthe same time Philadelphia, and he's
actually have aid, right, hekills me Ryan and it's like, right,
wait what by driving the car offthe bridge and all of that sort
of thing. I've found this toaddress a lot of the problems that I

(57:07):
had with Sleepless in Seattle. Mygeneral impression of it, honestly is somebody
who even though I know Sleepless inSeattle was massively successful, the sense I
have is somebody who learned what torefine between films so that they said,

(57:28):
okay, I'm getting another pass,what could work even better? Even if
they felt it worked fine last time? How could they do it better this
time. I think a lot ofthe relationship stuff is addressed. I think
that a lot of the side characterstuff works better. I think that a
lot of everything works better with thismovie. Is this an instant classic where

(57:51):
I'm going to go out and buythe steel Book four kuhd and get it
signed at a convention to this particularmovie. But well, what a crime
awesome? Shouldn't shouldn't every single versionof Everybody's Not Everything needs to be a
four K steel Book? Okay's amazing? What is that is very Listen,

(58:12):
if you've got mail, if Phantasmcan get a four K remaster, I
always go back to that one.If that, if that damn movie can
get a four K remaster or anythingcan well. I mean there's a criterion
of armacgeddon So hey, hey,you watch it now, we're gonna get
hate mail again now because it risklike it's a great Mott dirt fur and

(58:35):
just come look does a good jobof explaining why you can't just train astronauts
to go into space. Instead youmust send the oil workers. Well let's
let's not let's not train astronauts howto drill. Let's train drillers how to
how to ask astronaut? I meanthose are only two options, so I
yeah, there's you couldn't fire athing at the asteroid, try to knock

(58:57):
it off course. Anyway, Um, they discussed that in a movie.
Now you have me defending them.Okay, You've Got Mail. So anyway,
Yeah, we always had one missile. We could have ever fired at
it. So I think that allof that said, I think that a
lot of those problems I had thefirst time around are addressed here. I
do find I find Tom Hanks andmake charming, big charm Meg Ryan more

(59:22):
charming this time around. And soI'm going to wind up coming in strong
with this one compared to last timeand give it a three and a half
out of five awesome. Well,Tristan, I'm taking this account that this
is not your first time viewing.Is it the first time viewing with the
misses or is it on regular rotation? How is this viewing experience this time?

(59:47):
And overall impression, This is notthe first time I've viewed it.
This is not the first time I'veviewed it with my wife. But this
is not something that's in the regularrotation. Sleeps in Seattle that's in rotation,
but You've Got Mail is not.Even though I very I dig this
movie. I love this movie.This, this is a this is a

(01:00:07):
feel good movie to me. Thisis a movie that I I enjoy.
It's a movie that I think aboutsometimes, Like there's certain moments that pop
into my head, um, youknow, throughout, like when when Tom
Hanks um, like when Meg Ryanbags Tom Hanks to leave, like please
just leep, just sleep, andhe's like, okay, fine, and
then he just sits right behind herso they're back to back. Like that's

(01:00:30):
hilarious to me. Or like whenhe closes the door on the balloon and
says like, oh, thank god, it wasn't the fish. Apparently I
didn't know this, but apparently thatactually that just happened on set, Like
that wasn't scripted or played. Itfelt like an imprompt moment. Yeah,
that was Tom Hanks being funny onset, and they're just like, oh,

(01:00:51):
you know, script we're keeping that. That's hilarious. Um like there,
and like when when Hanks is inthe little car and like you see
the two kids and you see himand he just kind of waves. The
movie is filled with little moments likethat that really make me smile and make
me happy. And when they mentionedThe Godfather the Garnish bit, so I
could go on and on and on. I really like this movie. But

(01:01:13):
sometimes the structure gets me, youknow, I think the structure is a
little weird. Part of me,upon rewatch, part of me is just
like this is this feels very rushedat the end, Like we have five
minutes of them actually developing a realfriendship and relationship in person, and I
know that's five minutes more than whatwe got and sleeps in Seattle. So

(01:01:36):
it's a little I'm a little bitof it. Say it's more like ten
fifteen, but it is short comparedto your rhyme fifteen. I don't know,
man, I don't know if it'sfifteen. I think it might be
less than that. Well again,I would count it after the he finds
out, Like everything after the He'sfind out is him developing devilish. But
I get what you're saying. She'snot really on that train until the very

(01:01:57):
very end. But I get whatyou're saying. Yes, I think I
think that's a very important distinction thatI didn't make, Darren. I think
that's fair. That's very fair.Um. I like this movie. I
love this movie. It's not aperfect movie, so I give it a
strong four. I think this isa strong force, nothing to sneeze at.
I like it, but there's somethings that could change. Yeah,

(01:02:17):
well this is not a new firsttime, you know what for me?
Can I interject here really quick?Anytime, John, I get to do
I get to do this, becausethis is this is a fluid thing.
But I was being a that wastoo harsh. But I was waffling between
three and a half and four,and honestly, I'm going to go up

(01:02:38):
to a four. I'm calling theaudible. I'm going over. I feel
like I accomplished something. I don'tknow what. No, I wasn't I
wasn't really paying it. I wasn'treally paying attention, and I just decided
to do that. So there yougo. But yes, it's so moving
on. So this is not thefirst time I've watched You've got mail,

(01:03:00):
but it has been a little while. I probably watched this early dating,
you know, early marriage time,but it's been a couple couple of years.
Man. So again, it's funnyhow there'll be some moments that will
definitely hit you different in different phasesof your life. So the whole ghostly
image of her dancing with her mother, oh was just like right in the

(01:03:22):
fields. And I'm like, yeah, because you know, you don't know
how long your parents are gonna bearound. And okay, I'm okay,
I'm okay, I'm okay. She'slosing the bookstore and it looks so nice.
Yeah, but no, but Ilove this is a fun movie.
I definitely enjoyed it a lot morethan Sleepless, again just saying because it's

(01:03:42):
a megrand Tom Hanks duo. ButI think again, the front could have
used a little bit of un noddingnot and maybe if that, if that
had entailed moving that tipping point orwhat I like to call like the moment
when he finds out. If theearlier that happens, I think the better
the movie is because it gives youmore of the progression of their relationship.

(01:04:08):
Obviously she cannot find out until thevery end. That's just how this particular
story has to work, of hermaking that choice of it. I wished
it was you like that moment hasto be towards the very very end of
the movie. But the courtship part, like, I love that part.
That's a great phase of the movie. And and you know, again they

(01:04:30):
do a good job of the beginningof you know, because Tom Tom makes
is it like a perfect guy buthe's also not like a irredeemable you know,
asshole. Like it's not like thatkind of a transition. It's more
like, I'm going to take astep back, look at what I've done
in this person's life. And hekind of he calls himself out. He's

(01:04:53):
like, I've been nothing but meanto you since we've met. And it's
like, yeah, dude, likeyou need to step up. So I
also give this movie a solid four. It is it. It's a fun
movie. You're just cheering for himat the end, and you're so glad
they worked through that weird stocking thingthat happened in Seattle. It's all better.

(01:05:15):
I mean, heads and tails.I love. The romantic connection is
by far superior to Sleepless in Seattle, which was practically non existent. But
no, I think they, likewe've talked about, they balanced the tight
rope. You know. Yeah,it's this weird nineties time when the internet
was new and not like superstockery.So like the fact that this guy just

(01:05:39):
walks into your apartment because he didget buzzed in like it. You know,
it could go wrong, but itdoesn't. That scene was a little
weird. If I could change somethinglike he's like sitting on her bed and
like like getting his fingers all close, like he's almost giving her a BackRub,
like he puts like when he putshis hand up to shusher, We're

(01:05:59):
like, okay, a threshold hasbeen crossed. Like this is a moment.
True, it was weird, Andthe real villain of the movie is
the person who clearly saw that hewas talking to someone and just care.
That's that's the real villain of thismovie. It's I thought it was capitalism,
but you're right, it was.No. When you when you go

(01:06:21):
to when you go to a neighborhoodand like there's a gate and like somebody's
just like laying there in wait forsomebody to buzz it, and they're like
they they draft in behind them.I like in the movies where they go
and they push all the buttons becausethey know someone is not going to care
and just buzz in. And notesomeone did that to me at six in
the morning. Oh I I'll neverforgive them. All. Right, Well,

(01:06:45):
we're giving You've got mail a wonderfulfour across the board. And guys,
today is officially two years that we'vebeen podcasting as the three of us
in Oh. So, we've gonethrough a lot of movies, but still
a lot more to come. Andwe all met online and we did we
did. True, I didn't knowwho you were for a while and you

(01:07:10):
know, I'm just kidding you gotit did not happen at all like this
movie. But uh, yeah,I went online looked at your letterbox and
I was like, I don't knowif we can be friends, but I
know, I know we're trying towrap up. But Darren, we met
at Vegas, right, like thefirst time in person we met, Yes,
And John we met when I wenton a business trip to DC,

(01:07:32):
right, Yes, And we alsomet for dinner one time. I met
you halfway between the city where youwere going, uh and where I live,
because your first comment when you walkedoff the plane you told me was,
oh, I can't believe how humidit is, and I said,
oh, no, this is actuallyreally pleasant night where you talked about well.

(01:07:53):
And John and I met when hewas on a business trip down in
sant So, all we have todo is find a central spot that's not
Chicago to gather together. That isthe central spot. That's why I just
call it out. Indianapolis is technicallyeasier to reach from anywhere in the country.
That's what they said during Star Warscelebration too. That's why they picked

(01:08:15):
the city. That's all. Igotta say, yes, because that's how
airplanes work. But but no,you're right, we've all met through online.
Because of online, we've been ableto be able to stream the movies
we watch and talk about them withfriends. And back when web pages would
load an image at a time,you could think that will never happen,

(01:08:38):
but it did. It finally caughtup. So again, as we close
the hallway of Ephron here on houselights, John, where are we going
next? Deep below the surface?Well, we are going to go to
the portico of Peterson and we will. We're not calling it that, Well,

(01:09:01):
yeah we are. We will goin and listen. It's either that
or it's the basement of boat likeit's one of those two things. But
we're going We're gonna look at thethe nineteen eighties work of Wolfgang Peterson and
that to kick that off, Oh, we're gonna go. We're gonna go
with the director's cut, the director'scut of dust Bolt, which clocks in

(01:09:26):
at I believe two hundred eight minutesand eight that we established that we watched
the director's cut. Yeah, youguys, the director's preferred version whenever,
because this is a director's led podcast, and I'm like, oh God,
if only we could bend the rulesthis one time. Yeah, it's too
bad they're not cast edited for timeversion. We can the originals. The

(01:09:51):
original cinema version was one hundred fortynine minutes, and uh, you know,
but at least we're not choosing togo with the original uncut version,
which clocked in at three hundred eightminutes. So God for anybody that wants
to make fun of David Lynch's thirdseason of Twin Peaks, Wolfgang Peterson was
the real trailblazer here, So joinus for dust Bolt the Director's Cut.

(01:10:15):
Next on Houselights, Join the Revolution, Join the Nerd Party.