December 5, 2025 • 52 mins
In this episode, we walk slowly but carefully into Kathryn Bigelow's Oscar-winning film, "The Hurt Locker." We explore the film's gripping portrayal of the Iraq War, its intense cinematography, and the nuanced performances by Jeremy Renner and Anthony Mackie. With a mix of admiration and critique, we discuss the film's lasting impact and its place in cinematic history. Whether you're a fan of war dramas or just curious about what makes this film a standout, this episode offers a thoughtful analysis that will leave you with a new appreciation for Bigelow's work.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
Welcome to the ned Palty.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Welcome back to House Lights, specifically the House of Bigelow,
where we have deployed to look at the works of
Catherine Bigelow, and we are here this week looking at
her oscar winning entry The hurt Locker from two thousand
and eight starring Jeremy Renner, and I am one of
the hosts of this show. I am your grizzled slightly
(00:43):
unstable squad leader, and I am join John Mills, and
I am joined by my two compatriots, the ever stallwart
by the book, Darren Moser, and the person I'm most
likely to shoot in the leg when I'm trying to
save him, Tristan Riddell. Welcome, Hi, everybody.
Speaker 3 (00:59):
I knew before or you even open your mouth. I
was going to be the nervous guy who gets shot
in the lake.
Speaker 2 (01:05):
You know that it's inevitably going to happen, and if
any of the three of us are going to do it,
it's gonna be this guy right here.
Speaker 4 (01:11):
It's true, you know it's true.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
With a three man podcast and a three man EOD team, Yeah,
I was gonna be get the I was gonna be
the one who's.
Speaker 5 (01:19):
Got spit to clean this blood off the giant bullet.
Speaker 2 (01:24):
Yeah, that's a tense scene, a tense scene. So anyway,
here we are with The hurt Locker, the movie that
very famously Jim Cameron's ex wife upset him at the
Oscars by winning Best Picture, won a ton of award.
It's a lot of a steam. It's a very in
depth personal portrait of people in the Iraq War with
(01:49):
a lot of real world vibe to it, and it
got a lot of positive press at the time.
Speaker 4 (01:54):
And here we are.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
It's hard to believe it's almost been two decades since
it came out. Now, Darren, I know that you saw
this previous to this viewing. Did you see this in
the theater or was this one that you watched at
home after all of the esteem and the awards buzz
had washed over you.
Speaker 6 (02:11):
Yeah, this was probably due to the Oscars. Back in
the day when I cared about the Oscars, we would
often watch, you know, movies.
Speaker 5 (02:20):
That were either up for Best Picture or you know,
or if it won, it was like.
Speaker 6 (02:25):
Okay, give this a shake. So usually that was enough
to try it out. So I don't believe I caught
this in theaters, but yeah, it was one of those
where I mean not talking about the first time watching,
but in my recent rewatch, I was streaming it and
this maybe was my something with my earphones, or maybe
(02:45):
it was something in the mix. I want to confirm
with you guys, but for me, the mix kept going
between ears at different times, and I don't know if
that was something weird or special, because it kind of
enhanced it, like when you put the suit off, it
was like holy in what a year and it felt
really claustrophobic, and I'm like, but I don't know if
that's actually the mix.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
So I listened. I listened to headphones too. Now, granted
we probably weren't listen we weren't watching the same streaming source,
but I was listening in headphones too, and I didn't
hear that.
Speaker 6 (03:17):
Okay, I was watching it on Amazon, so it was
probably something with their mix. So I don't want to
give the movie too much credit for Amazon.
Speaker 3 (03:25):
It's mistake, but there was This is a total tangent,
But there was one time I was listening to an
audio book about Connuti and Singh and it was after
I got like halfway through it, and I started talking
to a friend of mine and I said, I was like, man,
this this book is so nonlinear. It's so much fun.
(03:45):
It's so great because it just goes from one time
period to another. It's completely out of order. And I
was like, I'm really enjoying it. And the guy I
was talking to actually had actually read the book. He's like,
that's not a nonlinear book. And the jackass that I
I when I ripped the CD from the library, I
ripped it out of order. And when I made the
(04:06):
audiobook file nice spousing it like I was like, oh,
this is such great nonlinear Taranty.
Speaker 5 (04:13):
Wrong, professor, My way is better.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
You created art, Tristan, you were an AI precursor right there.
Speaker 4 (04:22):
Just so your book's on shuffle there you go. It's
a good idea.
Speaker 2 (04:25):
So you know, Tristan, this is your first time seeing
the hurt locker.
Speaker 3 (04:30):
That's correct.
Speaker 4 (04:31):
How did this one pass by you?
Speaker 2 (04:33):
I mean you know, like, is it something that where
you were just always like I'll get around to it
and it just sort of like faded.
Speaker 4 (04:39):
What was the reason you missed it?
Speaker 3 (04:41):
Yeah? This this was not one of those where Okay, So,
like I put off watching Breaking Bad for many seasons
because people wouldn't shut up about it, Like people would
would not stop talking about Breaking Bad, and it got
to almost like a cult like status where I just
roll my eyes whenever somebody would bring up Breaking Bad.
And so I just refused to watch it because people
(05:01):
were bugging me. I know, it's kind of hipster thing
to do, like, you know, not watch something.
Speaker 4 (05:06):
I thought that was one of the people bugging you.
So I, yeah, that sounds right.
Speaker 3 (05:10):
Oh my god, we've been friends for a long time. Yes,
but this was not that situation. Like, this was not
that situation. It was when I saw that at one
Best Picture, I was I was elated that, you know,
like a the first that a woman finally won Best
Best like a female director one Best Picture, and uh
(05:33):
it only happened, it would be women were only nominated
for Best Picture four times before in the history of
the Academy. But for some reason, I just I just
never got around to it. It was always it was always like, oh, yeah,
hurt Locker, I should watch that. I like Jeremy Rayner,
I should watch that. Catherine Bigelow, Sure, why not? Just
it just completely escaped me all those times. That's fair enough,
(05:55):
I mean, no real reason.
Speaker 6 (05:57):
As a podcasts made us better people because that watch
the things we should have watched.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
There you go missing frame or something.
Speaker 2 (06:05):
Yeah, yeah, it's about say, it's like a missing frames
here on the nerd party.
Speaker 4 (06:09):
Check that out too. But were you familiar with it?
Had you? Was there anything that had been I.
Speaker 3 (06:15):
Feel this was one of those movies that I feel
definitely integrated itself into the zeitgeist, like everybody was mentioning it.
There's pop culture references that, Like the first thing that
pops in my brain is when Jim and Pam come
home with the baby and they're trying to put the crib.
Not the crib, they're trying to put the car seat
into the car, and they keep freaking out because they're
going to wake her up. And He's like, oh my god.
(06:36):
It's like the hurt Walker, you know. Like we kept referencing,
we kept hearing references like that all throughout pop culture,
and I would see certain scenes here and there. I
always hated the poster because the DVD was such a
bad photoshop job of Jeremy Renner. I always thought it
looked like Treat Williams instead of Jeremy Renner, or like
the dude from their first substitute. I know, Treat Williams
(06:58):
using the second substitute, but like the dude from the
first substitute, I can't.
Speaker 4 (07:02):
Remember the bearer.
Speaker 3 (07:03):
Yes, Tom Behringer on the cover. He looks like Tom Behringer.
It's so weird anyway, But yeah, it's one of those
movies you see a blockbuster, you see the poster of
and you just you're like, oh, yeah, that one best picture.
I should get around to it. And also a shot
in sixteen millimeter, and I love movies that are shot
in sixteen millimeter, so I have no excuse.
Speaker 2 (07:23):
So you know, Darren, that's a question I'll throw to you.
Is Tristan mentions it's shot in sixteen millimeter. This movie
is created just you know, it's post digital switchover for
film and stuff like that. But it's definitely got, you know,
it's living in a weird time. It's living during that
transitional time before digital is completely taken over and the
(07:46):
look of things is sort of going back and forth.
Do you feel that there was a visual consistency to
this Do you feel that there was any sort of
a mix of visual like did it look like the
camera and shutter speeds and everything were shifting too much
or did it look very consistent throughout now.
Speaker 6 (08:05):
I think this is one of those movies that, because
it was made at the time it was made, it
would be really not impossible, but it would be much
more difficult to get that look back nowadays, because now
we have the advent of you know, really small cameras,
sports cameras. Things like this totally would have been shot
on a fleet of iPhones or go pros or something
(08:28):
if it was made nowadays. The fact that she's shot
in Jordan, you know, and in the summer, like you're shooting,
so you get a lot of environment. I think by
doing film, yeah, not only do you get the grain
and that kind of.
Speaker 5 (08:44):
Old worldly.
Speaker 6 (08:47):
News interviewer like you know, it's on location shooting a
piece for National DG or something like. It has that
kind of vibe. But apparently it was very, very difficult
because they did a lot of editing in Jordan, like
as they're shooting, because there was just hundreds and hundreds
of hours of footage, so it had to be like
(09:07):
hand curried to London for dailies and ship like because
they didn't want to maybe get it exposed by the
X rays and it was just it sounded like just
one more wrinkle that made production not pleasant besides all
the other parts of this movie.
Speaker 5 (09:26):
But through all that, I.
Speaker 6 (09:28):
Think, like I was saying, you would have to work
harder to get that look. Nowadays, I think something else
would look cleaner, would because I don't I look at
this movie and I don't think shaky cam. I don't
think it like it's very stable, it's very even when
they're running around, it's I mean, yeah, there's there's moments obviously,
(09:50):
like when there's a frenetic but on the whole, you know,
as we've said several times talking about different movies, I
think of like the sniper scene, for example, when they're
pinned down.
Speaker 5 (10:08):
That is an interesting scene.
Speaker 6 (10:09):
Where we know where the snipers are, we know what's
behind them, we know what's to the left of them,
like we're in the middle of nowhere, but we know
where we are, and that it's the visual storytelling is superb,
so very good, Mark.
Speaker 4 (10:23):
So so Tristan.
Speaker 2 (10:25):
You, how strongly do you disagree with Darren about the
camera movement?
Speaker 3 (10:31):
Oh? Like almost completely? Yeah, I know, I mean, okay,
there are there are moments when you're going full on
green grass but there are a lot of times when
you're not. So it's it's not like it's shaky camp
all the time, and there are a lot of Born movie. Yeah,
it's not a Born movie. It's not Green Grass, you know,
it's it's just although there is a moment that made
(10:53):
me feel like it started to become a Born movie.
But we'll get to that. But uh, it was it's
like right off the back you're getting I mean, and
this was so first decade of the two thousands. This
was so two thousands with this documentary style feel where
like like right off the bat like you get that
super zoom, like it's not quite like the seventy zoom
(11:13):
snap zoom, but it's that like, oh we got to
zoom in refocus because I'm there. I'm shaking because I'm
the camera and I'm near the explosion. I'm actually here
with them, but they're not acknowledging my presence. It's kind
of like the Office but not really. Uh it's a
I know, I feel I sound like I'm mocking the cinematography,
but I'm not because of a shot. You if you are,
but but it's just no, just the style of the decade.
(11:37):
It was so it permeated that decade so completely. Like
you like even in the like TV TV shows, like
when you look at Battle Circalactica or Firefly, Like I know,
it just gave two sci fi examples, but it you
have that snap zoom and that like that you see
them focus in real time. That was very much this movie.
Like that was the cornerstone of its action cinematography. But
(11:58):
was it there even when they were in the humy
or when they were just like talking to the barracks.
Speaker 2 (12:02):
No, yeah, I h the thing is to speak to
the you know, you say that goes full green Grass.
Barry Ackroyd, the director of photography, did work with green Grass,
and so it makes sense city he felt very comfortable
with this type of film. But more importantly, you know,
here we are, we've watched all of these Bigelow movies
(12:22):
up to this point. Do you feel that this is
a director fully embracing her true style, her true nature.
Do you feel this is an evolution of Bigelow or
do you feel that this is big Alow adapting for
a certain storytelling style.
Speaker 3 (12:39):
I'm gonna cheat and say both. That is because because
I believe that, like you specifically, John, like You made
a lot of really great points as we as we
went on, because you were very keen in talking about
the cinematography and the geography and the editing and seeing
it progress from Near Dark all the way up to now.
(13:02):
And you talked about the evolution of Bigelow style. And
you can see a clear through line all the way
through from Near Dark to today or I shouldn't say today,
but back tonight in two and nine with hert locker,
and you see the confidence and you see what's going on.
And even though she shot, I think it was something
like a two hundred to one ratio of how much
(13:24):
she shot how much she used.
Speaker 4 (13:26):
That's like Copola level.
Speaker 3 (13:27):
It's insane. Yeah, that's like Heart of Darkness Coppola level
type filming. But unlike Copola, everything that she wanted to
be in the film that was shot was put in there.
Like there was not a single scene that was cut. Now, granted,
I'm sure there were scenes that were trimmed down. I'm
sure there was things that were left out that were
involved in certain scenes, just like any film that you make,
(13:50):
but this movie she had final cut, which is awesome.
And she also she was along in the writing process
and saw what she wanted to do, made it happen,
and then that's what came out like this was this
was her baby, like she like, I think Jim Cameron
gave her the script and said you should direct this,
(14:11):
and she helped fine tune it with boll And I
think that's how you say his name, and they they
storyboarded it out. They're like, this is what we want
to do. This is what we want to make, and
they made the film they wanted to make. This is
this is bigelow at her back, like she she won
Best Picture. This was this was a clear and concise
(14:32):
honoring of her work and effort and craft up until
this moment. It's just like she's been doing this for
decades and boom, this was. This was the result.
Speaker 2 (14:41):
So Darren, you know, with her coming in and being
confident and knowing the story she wants to tell. There
are a couple of names here in the cast where
when you see them you're used to like, oh, well,
that that person will be in this movie for a
little while. You know, David Morse is in it for
like what ten seconds or something like that. I still
like and even on this rewatch, like David Morse walks on.
(15:02):
I'm like, yeah, David Morse, he's really great. Where'd he go?
What's happening? I'm not sure why.
Speaker 3 (15:09):
Point of that. I'm sorry it didn't rerail your question,
but what the was the point of having Morse's care
not just Morse, but like Morse's character in there.
Speaker 2 (15:18):
I think he communicates, uh, sort of like that that
testosterone Leyden machismo, bravado type of character. That's that like
he he has that sort of ara about him. Maybe
Morse was chosen and when the script was earlier on
and it whittled down to just that one scene, I
don't know.
Speaker 6 (15:37):
No, Yeah, this this casting is is really good. I mean,
besides the fact you have your your three, you know,
your little triad of of the unit. But uh, I
think we were choking earlier, like when when Guy Pierce
shows up and you're like, sorry, guy, I don't think
kind of gonna make way for the lead character coming
(15:58):
up rights.
Speaker 3 (16:00):
The moment the moment you see appears, you're like, WHOA,
You're not Jeremy Renner and you're not like a Brad
Pitt name, but you're a big name. And so I
have a feeling this is kind of a glorified cameo
and you're gone.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
As soon as you see him put on the bomb suit,
you're like, oh, okay, cool, cool, I know where this
is going.
Speaker 3 (16:24):
Yeah, yeah, you know what.
Speaker 6 (16:25):
We know who's supposed to be bombsuit guy. We need
a vacancy how to get that?
Speaker 4 (16:32):
Which one of these people is not coming?
Speaker 6 (16:34):
Oh, it's right, But then you have like, uh, you know,
Ralph finds like that was really cool seeing him, although
in that scene he kind of like disappears like he's
there and then like I guess were they waiting out
the stiper.
Speaker 5 (16:48):
But then everyone else just like went home.
Speaker 6 (16:51):
I don't know. It was really weird because we know
he never kept cutting over to the people.
Speaker 2 (16:57):
Well he got he got killed really quick, and and
I think like his other guys got dropped because there's
one guy get that gets dropped. Yeah, he gets shot
while they're while he's trying to draw a beat on
the other people, which I thought. I mean, that was
a really well executed scene because I think that what
that communicated. The tension in that scene reminded me of
(17:20):
the first time I saw Platoon, when I was far
too young to have seen it in the movie theaters
and the Hey, gen X, we loved seeing stuff too.
Speaker 3 (17:30):
You're gonna say, weren't you like ten when Platoon came out?
Speaker 2 (17:33):
It was like twelve when I saw it in the
movie theater or something like that. That's okay. My cousin,
who was four years younger, was sitting next to me. Whatever,
what are you gonna do? Sorry?
Speaker 4 (17:42):
I feel like I feel like all of us.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
Who took him should send an apology note at this point.
But anyway, the scene where they have that standoff and
they're going back and forth actually reminded me very much
of the tension of Platoon where they are on the
night patrol and Charlie she is awake even though he's
not the one on watch, and he's just sitting there
(18:04):
and the camera comes up over and he's like just
sitting there. He's like, I don't know what I'm supposed
to do right now. Like I look at that scene
and I don't know how to play with Uterus, and
like I look at that scene and like I'm so
unnerved because I'm like.
Speaker 4 (18:16):
I don't know what I would do in this situation.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
Like I'm like, I wait, I have to sit here,
and it's just a war of attrition basically at this point, well,
eventually we're everybody on one side or the other is
going to die? Which side am I on? Like, that's
I can't imagine the tension in that moment.
Speaker 6 (18:33):
Yeah, I just want to say first, for that scene,
the thing that drew me in was when they're making
their shots and they're close but they have to like compensate.
Speaker 5 (18:44):
It made me think of like every first person shooter
video game.
Speaker 6 (18:49):
I've ever done, and how in those you take for
granted the fact that your gun will shoot exactly where
you expect it to, and you have an amazing aim
and so bad guys over there, no big deal. But
when all of a sudden you introduce the fact that
I might not actually hit what I'm aiming for and
(19:10):
I only have so many round like it, that itself
added way more tension than anything.
Speaker 2 (19:16):
Yes, Yeah, well yeah, because you know, another big applause
for the movie, because it takes into account the fact that, like, okay,
at the distance that you're at, wind is going to
affect where the bullet goes. There's going to be recoil,
there's going to be like one guy is looking and
telling him where to go, but he's also looking through
a site, but they're off by a couple of you know, inches,
(19:37):
and so that's going to affect the trajectory of the
bullet and everything. Yeah, it's it's a pretty amazing scene.
I think at the very least Tristan did. Was that
a standout scene for you? Do you feel that the
movie was able to get to that tension level with
all of its scenes or was it more of a
slow burn for you.
Speaker 3 (19:56):
I think that one was a little bit of a
slow burn for me because because so many people died
early on, because like the British folk died, and and
so I was just like, Okay, our guys are probably
safe because they killed all the British folk pretty early on.
So just in the realm of storytelling, like if this
(20:17):
was a standalone scene, I probably would be a little
bit more amped up. I'd be a little have a
little bit more anxiety. I think there were there were
scenes in there that I definitely had more anxiety at
the beginning of the movie than I did at the end.
And I think that's probably just a fact of the
of the structure of the film, where it's just like, Okay,
(20:39):
is this a movie, or is this seven scenes where
you diffuse a bomb and by this, you know, by
the you know, fourth, fifth, sixth, and seventh time where
you're diffusing a bomb, the anxiety is kind of gone
because you're just on edge the entire time, like our
body has to, like our mind tells our body, Okay, relax,
it's not real. You cannot sustain this the entire time,
(21:03):
and so you're not going to get that anxiety reaction
that you did in the first two or three times.
And so by the time we got to that scene,
even though it's a good scene, I like how it's shot,
I like how it's acted. I really like that moment
with the juice at the end because I think seeing
Anthony Mackie just kind of shut down a little bit,
(21:24):
like he can't he can't stop, he can't stop paying attention.
He's he's clearly affected by what he just did, and
he's so amped up that he can't take his attention
as away. Renner's like, Okay, just have some juice, you know,
get your sugar level up. You know that that. I
like that moment, but I feel like the anxiety dwindles
(21:45):
as it goes on, and then it kind of peeks
back up again at the very end with the with
the dude in the suit with the with the vest
bomb because you're just like, Okay, who are they going
to kill off this time? Are we going to do
a big bomb where everybody dies? Is it going to
be shait experien or is every good to back away?
You don't actually know, but all this stuff in between,
you know everybody's gonna walk away.
Speaker 2 (22:05):
So, Darren, do you think that the ebb and flow
of the tension and you know, at the very beginning
of the movie, the last three words or four words
that are on screen from you know, it starts with
two lines and then the last four words to sit there,
war is a drug, and it goes on. Do you
think that that tension spike, ebb and flow speaks to
(22:30):
that theme the idea that Tristan is talking about where
it's like you get a little numb and then it's
like you need you need a stronger and stronger hit
to maintain.
Speaker 3 (22:39):
Yeah, well, and that's.
Speaker 6 (22:40):
I mean definitely what's happening to James to Jeremy Renner
Because in the first few Disarmaments, he's it's like another
day at the office, Like he is, so he's too chill,
and he's just like, oh yeah, look cut the red wire, blah.
Speaker 5 (22:56):
Blah blah, here we go. We're do to do, you know.
Speaker 6 (22:59):
And I kind of like the moment where he like
takes off the suit and is all like, there's enough,
Like this, dude's gonna do nothing if this goes off,
like I'm dead, so I might as well be comfortable.
And I'm like, I'm sure that's not you know, standard procedure,
but but I do. Yeah, the EBB and flow, I
think they do. You can tell they're trying to not
(23:20):
one note it. You know, where you have you have
the detonation killing the inter or not interpret the psych officer.
So that's the that's the bomb that no one saw coming.
Then you have like the bomb vest, which is the
one where we get to see our hero not be
able to succeed in disarming it and and someone loses
(23:42):
their life because the other ones are all just just
got to get them all cut before the guy hits
the button. Like that is the same kind of thing,
with slight variations. I mean, that iconic shot of him
tugging on the cord and like five.
Speaker 5 (23:58):
Bomb is so I mean that's why it's on like.
Speaker 6 (24:00):
Half the posters is it's so you're just super unrealistic,
super stupid, but really great shot. But all that to say, yeah,
I like the progression of Renner's character where you can see, Okay,
the cup is full, it's starting to overflow.
Speaker 3 (24:21):
Now.
Speaker 6 (24:21):
I don't know how long he's been on tour, I
don't know how many deployments he's done, but you can
tell it's finally the cracks are showing, and I don't
know what his next door is going to be, like
a whole nother year, but something, you know, hitched up
his boots and he's ready to go back, like he
can't see another world beyond this job, the beyond the herdlocker.
Speaker 2 (24:46):
Speaking of the cracks showing, Tristan to to Darren's point there,
what did you think about the subplot of him mistaking
the dead body for the young boy and basically that
sort of mental break thing he has where it is
affecting him on an emotional level.
Speaker 3 (25:04):
Heyed it. That was my least favorite part of the movie.
Frig and hated it. It completely took me out of
the picture because that's one of the moments where it
kind of stopped being Okay, Okay, I know that movies
aren't documentaries, even though they really wanted to shoot it
like a documentary. Movies are not documentaries. Movies are fun,
(25:26):
movies are interesting. Movies are dramatic, and they're not real life.
But certain movies have a veneer of real life. This
movie had a veneer of real life, just like Saving
Private ryin even though there was a lot that happened
in Private Ryan that was not realistic. This is kind
of had that same tone where you're just like, oh,
I feel like I'm watching something real. Even though people
who have gone through EOD, are gone through the Iraq War,
(25:49):
Afghanistan or something like that can recognize that it's not
real life. Certain things are, like the emotional aspects of
the movie are are real, Like when they get to
the core of what it's like to deployment, what it's
like to go through something like this, that's that's real
and that's cinema. You know this, This isn't a how
to manual, and it shouldn't be. It shouldn't be, and
(26:10):
that's not what I'm saying. But this moment really took
me out because it stopped being a movie. About a
soldier on duty or a soldier going through a rotation,
or a soldier going into a group for EOD and
everything like that, and started becoming more like a Born
movie where this guy is going out on his own.
The entire idea that this this this guy is sneaking
(26:33):
off base to you know, track a lead that he
doesn't know is real, because like that's the thing is
that like he can't he's gonna trust this guy who
sells bootleg DVDs to take him to the right place.
He could he could have been and probably was in
some random person's home, some absolutely random person's home. And
also like when he leaves, he's just a random, short,
(26:57):
white guy, you know, running through bagged. It's just no, no,
and like no, it just it completely took anut of
the film, Like like if he was found out, he
would have been disciplined, he would have been sent home,
like that kind of crap doesn't stand. And it just
it really took me out of it. And I'm really
glad one saving grace and I'm not saying it actually
(27:20):
saved it, but one attempt at saving Grace was that
it was a completely fruitless endeavor that really helped the story.
I think, in my opinion is that it was completely
fruitless because it was a stupid ass decision.
Speaker 2 (27:32):
So Darren, you know, given everything Tristan has just said,
you know, I would offer the counterpoint that that's probably
the scene where the commentary about interventionism and stuff like
that is layered in there. You know, it's a you know,
sort of a comment about like, he doesn't actually know
(27:54):
who quote unquote the enemy is. He's not sure what's
really going on. He mistakes something and he goes, you know,
it sends him over the edge and he goes and
he does something without thinking. You know, given those two
very separate polls that Tristan and I find ourselves at,
where do you find yourself gravitating more toward Yeah?
Speaker 6 (28:15):
I think you know, the middle is kind of the
next him going off book scene when he's like, oh,
this thing was blown up. I know there's a boogeyman
in the dark, so let's go get him. And even
Maggie's like, we got two plitudes of guys who like
their job is to go get right there. That should
(28:36):
have been the end of it, like in the real world.
But yeah, and then they are just like, hey, let's
go off. And I think while he does make choices
and has lack of consequences that do bend from reality,
even when he's doing those choices, there is the ever
(28:56):
presence you're in a war zone. No door is safe,
no corner should be unchecked, like that is present throughout
the entire film, and I think they communicated that, So
I'll give a mark for that. Even if the choices
the characters were making, I mean I was even like,
why are you guys punching each other like that sounds
like a stupid way to get on the you know,
(29:18):
in the medical bay when you should be out just
arm me. It's like, oh, sorry, I can't disarm bombs
on Tuesday because I have you ruptured by spleen when
you punched me in the gut at point break Sure
that sounds like a great idea.
Speaker 2 (29:31):
Yeah, I mean that scene obviously is just more commentary
on sort of like the adrenaline junkie testosterone laden environment
that they're in, just like how it's out of control
and you know, there's no like I find it very interesting.
We made reference to the therapists who or psychiatrist I'm sorry,
(29:54):
who you know blows up because he decides to go
out Oh yeah, I'll try to understand better what you
guys are going through.
Speaker 4 (30:01):
And blows up.
Speaker 2 (30:02):
But it is you know that that is one of
those things where you see sort of what the uphill
battle is like. There is no like I think one
of the core questions of the film is is there
a point to that psychiatrist being there? Like can you
possibly have a quote unquote healthy environment when this is
what you're doing right? Like is having somebody there to
(30:26):
sort of process things like? Is that even possible? And
then you know, and then Renner goes home and it's
like he can't even go back to to a civilian life,
like this is just this bizarre world that they that
they live in, and you know, the bizarre world that
they live in, you know, Tristan, it's easy enough to say, well,
(30:47):
the hurt Locker is the friends we made along the way.
Sorry bad joke, but you know that hurt Locker. What
do you think the title is trying to say? Is
it trying to say that they're the ones trapped in
the locker, that they put the pain in there, they
can't process it adequately. What do you think that title
is trying to say.
Speaker 3 (31:05):
Well, hurt locker is doesn't it mean like in military vernacular,
like when you get yourself in a bad spot and
you get hurt because of it.
Speaker 4 (31:15):
I've never been in the military, so I don't know.
Speaker 6 (31:18):
I'm milang for the bomb suit.
Speaker 5 (31:21):
It's while I was reading it, but I don't know.
Speaker 4 (31:25):
Yeah, I don't. I don't actually know, so now I
need to know.
Speaker 3 (31:30):
So, Okay, here's what it is. Hurt locker is US
military slang meaning a place or situation where someone is
in extreme pain, danger, or serious trouble. It's not specific
to bombs. It predates the Iraq War and was used
in Vietnam. So I feel like this is pretty up. Oh,
I feel like this could be used in a lot
of different variations. So that's what I think it means.
(31:51):
I think it means that. Uh, it's when you're in
the Pooh.
Speaker 2 (31:54):
Well, okay, in the Pooh, Yes, that's a very popular
phrase with the with the soldiers that are deployed.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
Yah, the soldiers use that phrase a lot.
Speaker 4 (32:03):
Yeah, in the Pooh. Definitely in the Pooh.
Speaker 2 (32:06):
So you know we're going through And what's funny is
there's a thing where you know, music obviously is a
big part of the film experience. But you know, Darren,
was there music in this movie? Like where was it
when it happened?
Speaker 6 (32:22):
You know, Actually the music in this one was really good,
but it's a different kind of music where it is
very subtly underscoring certain moments, like when you start to
hear the music, you're like, Okay, it's about to get real.
Either something's gonna go wrong or something's gonna happen. So
it was used very sparingly. But this is the kind
(32:44):
of movie where music and like sound design, like those
are working in harmony because the sound design is the
music of this movie. The sound of an explosion, the
breathing while you're in the vest, you know, the the
(33:04):
five minute long bullet casing shot as it ricochets and
pings off of the.
Speaker 5 (33:10):
Okay, it wasn't five minutes, but I love.
Speaker 3 (33:14):
They shot this, and speaking of early two thousands, they
shot this on the Phantom, which shoots something like two
thousand frames a second. It's insane, it's insane. I loved
the Guy Pier. I loved Guy Pierce dying. I'm just
gonna I'm going on record and I'm saying that I
loved Guy Piers dying because it was shot on Phantom
and I love explosions in slow motion. I just absolutely
(33:38):
love it, and this movie did it so well at
the beginning, like when with the with the rocks just
kind of rising up, and one thing like, even though
this movie only has a veneer of accuracy, one thing
that I really like that it did is that it
didn't look like Hollywood explosions. It looked like actually like
what it looks fireballs like, no firebills wouldn't. Yeah, thank you,
(33:58):
thank you, Darren. That's exactly right.
Speaker 5 (34:00):
Sorry, I'm saying your words before you say them.
Speaker 2 (34:05):
Like any elite team, over time, we can complete each
other's thoughts.
Speaker 4 (34:09):
That's that's very very.
Speaker 5 (34:11):
Give each other's ratings. You know, we're so in tune.
Speaker 2 (34:13):
Sandwiches, and that's what that's why nobody should ever miss
a show, is because their rating will be given for
them and it will be accurate and immovable. That's very
very true. So, you know, I like what you're saying
about the music and the sound design working hand in hand, Darren.
I think that's very true. It's very accurate for this.
But a big part of this as well, you know,
(34:34):
is the ratio of footage shot to footage used and
telling the story and whittling it down. You know, obviously
you have Chris Innis and Bob Morowsky. I think they're
at least at the time they were married, so they're
working on the film. Tristian, I love to throw the
editing question to you at first all the time, but
(34:56):
is this another case of like you said about merch
invisible editing where it doesn't draw attention to itself or
do you feel that this editing does draw attention to itself.
Speaker 3 (35:07):
I think the cinematography does the heavy lifting of drawing
attention to itself. I feel like the editing itself gets
you where you need to go. This is this is
this is more merch than not because you don't think
about the editing. You're you're thinking about the cinematography. Like
people who are you know, cinema fans, film fans, movie fans,
(35:31):
whatever you want to call yourself, Like when you pay
attention to those things, and it's you know, tangent, it's
it's always so strange when I talk to somebody and
like I was talking about how I was like, oh,
that movie was garbage, and they're like oh yeah, but
her performance was so good, so it was a great movie.
And I was like, no, No, the cinematography was garbage,
the editing was garbage, the writing was garbage, the directing
(35:51):
was garbage. They're like, yeah, but Meryl Street was so good.
I was like, I don't care. You know, like, it's
so strange. How often like that is that that's your
general audience right there. But you know that was also
one of the benefits of the movie is that you
have this indie feel but yet it's made. It didn't.
(36:13):
It didn't have that big of a budget actually, but
it had an indie feel, but yet it had that
big promoting it had, it had good people in it,
and it was dealing with a subject that you couldn't
do with just an indie film. But yeah, to answer
your question, the the editing I think was really well
done because it wasn't excessive, like you didn't need that, Like,
(36:33):
this wasn't black Hawk Down. Like if you watch black
Hawk Down, I feel like that's I feel like that's
a fair comparison movie. Right, Yeah, if you're watching black
Hawk Down and this is not a knock on that. Uh.
The editing brings itself to attention a great deal because
it's it's Ridley Scott, you know, like it was Ridley
Scott in that era of Ridley Scott where he wanted
(36:55):
to he was really flashy. This is not a flashy
film in terms of it, but it was in cinematography,
and I feel like it made a lot of really
solid choices in cinematography.
Speaker 2 (37:06):
Darren, you know, speaking of that cinematography and the editing
a movie I can't help but think of I want
to ask you if you've seen it. Have you ever
seen Jarhead with Jake Gillenhall.
Speaker 6 (37:17):
I have not, but it does feel like, you know,
when we have those duo of films, not that they're
exactly the same, but it's like, oh, our minds like
to see patterns of like, oh, look at these two
films that are very similar, but they're obviously also very different.
Speaker 2 (37:33):
I think I think would be very interesting and testing.
I don't know if you've seen Jarhead, but like, I
think it would be very interesting to watch these two
movies side by side, because as I recall Jarhead, it's
it is a more polished, more big studio type of thing,
although it's dealing with the very similar sort of thing
about trying to process, you know, going through these type
(37:57):
of wartime situations and what it does to a person
and how it can change them and divert them. And
you know, it would just be very interesting to see
those two films put against each other.
Speaker 3 (38:10):
Yeah, it definitely deals with the mundane of being a
soldier a little bit more than hurt Locker.
Speaker 4 (38:17):
Yeah, that's true.
Speaker 6 (38:18):
Herlocker is more like we're a specialist team with a
very specific mandate and job description versus like a jar head,
a grunt yea, Yeah, I.
Speaker 2 (38:30):
Just I think it's interesting because hurt Locker is a
movie that instantly jumps to mind when you start talking
about cinema, that that's about dealing with a wartime situation,
a modern wartime situation. But you know, I made reference
to Platoon before there were so many, so so many
(38:51):
Vietnam movies in the eighties, like from the seventies, Like
it was just non stop, it was like one every
six months was coming out. Now, I learned a lot
about war film and film in general by watching all
of them growing up, and it definitely, you know, shapes
your tastes over time. But I mean, Darren, why is
it you think that hurt Locker sticks. You know, we're
(39:14):
almost twenty years in. Why is it, with this very
content rich environment that we're in, why is Hurtlocker the
one that's sticky? Why is that the one that stays
in everybody's brains?
Speaker 6 (39:28):
I think, you know, there's something about it being about
a more modern war, you know, the Iraq War, not
being that far there. It's not like World War two
or Civil war, you know, where it's almost into legend territory.
You know, it's just so far back and all the
stories that have been told. But I think, you know,
(39:50):
Bigelow strikes that balance of a narrative story because you
have to have a narrative, but also you know, root
in an interesting tale, you know, a single man's struggle,
you know, like all the main points, like it's a
well constructed film narratively, uh, even though it does kind
(40:13):
of feel a little vignette like they're different. Each day's
mission is a little like chapter of the Week, because
there's no two things are the same.
Speaker 3 (40:23):
But it isn't bad.
Speaker 6 (40:24):
It's and like Tristan was saying, you know, it's a
film of maybe those five interesting days happened over a year,
but of course for us, they're going to happen in
a weekend because we have to keep the story you know, interesting.
But I think that's the main My main takeaway is
that you know, by setting it in a in a
(40:45):
modern war, going deep enough into the characters and their struggles,
but also keeping it, you know, interesting enough that you're
that it's not an edge of your seat, Like there
are definitely moments, but it's not like The Rock or
some other movie where the percussion hits you and it's
like here we go and you know, we're storming in
(41:09):
or or aliens where we're like, you know, we're merging
satire with like otherworldly invaders.
Speaker 3 (41:17):
I'm surprised, is not surprised that we haven't done House
of Bay Since you bring up The.
Speaker 2 (41:22):
Rock, I'm not surprised we haven't done House of Bay.
That just seems like such dangerous territory to get into.
But Trisan, this is your first viewing. Why do you
think with this first viewing behind you? Now, why is
hurt Locker such a sticky movie? Why is it one
that stays on everybody's brains? I mean AFI selected this actually,
(41:44):
if I recall, yeah, National Film Registry selected it in
twenty twenty for being culturally, historically, or esthetically significant.
Speaker 4 (41:53):
Why do you think hurt Locker lands.
Speaker 3 (41:56):
I think the reason why it lands is because you
could this movie in any war at any time, and
it would still land the same Because in this movie,
it doesn't matter what the backdrop is. It doesn't matter
that it's the Iraq War. It doesn't matter that it's
the Afghan War or Desert Storm Vietnam, World War II,
(42:16):
World War One, it doesn't really matter. It's about the
human experience in war. And you have these archetypes. You
have the cowboy, you have the wild card. You have
the the pup who is innocent and you know, is
concerned about like who's feeling guilty. You have the person
who wants to have a life afterwards, but yet feels responsibility.
(42:39):
It's you have people going home and not knowing how
to interact with the public or interact with their family
because war is all that they know. Now. It has
such universal themes and this is this movie does such
a great job and I don't say this as a knock.
This movie does such a great job being a political
(42:59):
that it's it's about the experience of war and men
through war. And it's not about like, oh, you know
Bush lied, or you know, like we went you know,
we we went to war under false pretenses, or the
Iraqis don't want us there or anything like that. It
has I mean, all the subtext is there, of course,
(43:21):
but it's that's just what it is. It's subtext. This
is about Jeremy and Rinter, Anthony Mackie and forgive me
what's his name about? Jill Garty? Thank you, Brian Garrity,
who I know from True Blood? Who you know he played?
He played. The only thing that I recognize him from
(43:41):
is in True Blood he played a soldier in the
Afghan War.
Speaker 4 (43:45):
See.
Speaker 2 (43:46):
The thing is I actually recall him from Flight was
twenty twenty twelve Za Mecha's film, which I think is
a gorgeous film and absolutely magnificent overlooked film.
Speaker 4 (43:56):
But anyway, we're here to finish talking about it.
Speaker 3 (43:59):
But yeah, that's that's my answer, is that, like it's
it's about the experience. It's about the experience of war
more than the war itself.
Speaker 4 (44:05):
Fair enough, fair enough.
Speaker 2 (44:06):
So I think we've we've gotten some we've gotten our
thoughts out, we've we've we've gone through we've processed this.
I think we're we're here, We're at the moment where
we're going to give our final thoughts and ratings. And uh, Tristan,
since this is your first go round with the hurt Locker,
what are your final thoughts and the rating that you
land at here with Catherine Bigelow's award winning Best Picture
(44:30):
winning hurt.
Speaker 3 (44:31):
Locker, I'm I'm happier that Bigelow one with Best Picture
and that it won so many noms than it is
that I am for it winning Best Picture. I think
this is a great movie. I think it's really good.
I think it has some great performances. It has it
has some it has something to say about the experience.
(44:52):
I think Jeremy Rinner and Anthony Mackie give great performances.
And and and by the way, I didn't get to
talk about this, but I'm very much team Mackie when
it comes to I am very much on Falcon's side
when it comes to who's right and who's wrong. I
would be friggin' pissed as hell. I would punch my
team leader if he did the things that he did
(45:16):
in real life that he did in this movie, like
taking off his headset, not like refusing to give an
answer when he throws us friggin' smoke bomb at the beginning,
like all those things, all those things, I'm like, Jeremy
Rinner in this movie is a friggin' jackass. And some
people might say, like, oh, well, you know, like you know,
(45:36):
he was down to earth and concerned about his campandres
you know, when it mattered. I don't care. That's great
that he does it when it's mattered, when it matters,
But I want him to be a good person the
entire time, not just part of the time. But the
thing is is that I can't remember who said it,
but some famous person said, I've served with the very
best of men, and I've served with the very worst
(45:58):
of men, and that's how you get in the military,
and this is very evocative of that. I think the
cinematography is great, even though it's very two thousands, and
I love that it shot in sixteen millimeter, And like
I said, great performance is great direction, But there's just
certain points here and there where I'm just like it
feels very vignette and it's there were like there were
(46:22):
points that really took me out of it, like the
Born legacy point where he you know, goes rogue and
goes off base. So I give it four stars because
it's a really good movie. It deserved all the accolades,
and Bigelow definitely deserved it. But it's this is not
a perfect film.
Speaker 4 (46:39):
Fair enough.
Speaker 2 (46:40):
I will actually say that, while everybody loves to talk
about the fact that you know, this this one and
she beat Cameron, it was a very packed field in
two thousand and eight, and I will agree with you.
I think that the hurt Locker benefit benefited from that
because just because I pulled it up just out of curiosity,
(47:03):
the hurt Locker wins the two thousand and nine Awards
for two thousand and eight movies. So you have the
hurt Locker, Avatar, the blind Side, District nine in Education,
in Glorious Bastards, Precious a serious man up and up
in the air. That is a crowded field. That isn't
a good year. That's an insane yeah. And somehow the
(47:24):
Dark Knight wasn't in there. But whatever, And you have
a situation here where it's like, I mean, this is
the more everybody wanted more films added cool. I get it.
It makes sense. We don't want it to be just
five that are up there because the one we loved
won't ever get nominated. But you split the vote, and
(47:47):
you split the vote in such a way that the
eventual winner is going to benefit. I mean it's you know,
the following year you have the King's Speech wins, but
that's a year that's got the fighter inception, the kids
are all right, one hundred and twenty seven hours. The
Social Network toy story three True Grit Winners was like,
how like, I'm not trying to take anything away from
(48:09):
Bigelow's victory because I understand why it won. But you know,
I definitely think that in another year, if you whittled
that down to like a true quote unquote top five,
I think hurt Locker has a longer shot, you know,
longer odds at winning. All that to say, I agree
with you, Tristan. This is a four star film. It's
a strong four And while I, while I defend and
(48:32):
I understand what she's saying with his you know, going
off bass cowboy moment, I did, I similarly sort of
like disconnected because I was like, wait, what movie am
I watching?
Speaker 3 (48:44):
Now?
Speaker 2 (48:44):
What's what's happening here? And then at the end when
they go off after the people, I agree. I'm like
the veneer of reality, to use your term. Mackie isn't
just saying no, we got a platoon of guys. It's like,
I'm going off after him. He's tackling him, putting him
in an arm bar and like zip tying him. It's like, Okay,
this guy's had a psychotic breaks. He's trying to do
(49:06):
something completely insane. He's not going off base ever again,
you know, like and they're going to take him off
for evaluation. So four stars, Darren. That brings us to you.
Where do you land with the hurt Locker?
Speaker 4 (49:19):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (49:19):
This was while it's not a movie I had watched
again recently, you know, it's it's been a while. I
did really enjoy going back into this world, into these characters.
You know, I think a lot is to be said
on what was pulled off.
Speaker 5 (49:36):
Like it's not a guarantee. Oh we shot in Jordan.
Speaker 6 (49:39):
Oh we sat in the summer, and it's gonna all
look real and and come together and work, and our
character is going to be likable and interesting, and you know,
the tension is going to be there, Like you have
to build all of that and and she did it,
you know, all the while it was you know, financially
successful and did well. You know, it's not not making
(50:01):
Avatar money, but that's okay, nothing else it does.
Speaker 3 (50:04):
But I mean that's the that's the thing though. I'm
glad you brought that up because that's something that we
didn't talk about. This is the lowest grossing Best Picture
film so far.
Speaker 5 (50:13):
It's like forty nine million, like fifty million, that's it.
Speaker 3 (50:17):
And at the time of its release, it was like
they only counted domestic it made its budget back, not
even marketing costs. That's crazy.
Speaker 6 (50:28):
Well, you know, we could just make an oscar category
the most box office and with I don't know if
that would be worth winning. But no, I'm I'm giving
it a four to two. I think we're all in
agreement fours across the board. And it's it's a fun
like I said, it's a fun film to revisit. It
is nice seeing you know, MACKI and you know when
(50:51):
you see him, because he's he's not the protagonist, but
he is kind of leading the squad a little bit
like you know, he's a little more straight man, a
little more like I'm going to keep you all live
because I'm going to make the right decision. So anytime
seeing him on screen is always a pleasure.
Speaker 2 (51:09):
Now, I will interject really quick that big a low,
I think a few years later is undone by the
number of nominations for Best Picture when Zero Dark thirty
loses to Argo, which I'm taking nothing away from Argo,
love the film, but like that was another one where
it was like that, you know, it was like nine
Insane Movies, and it was like, oh well, zero Dark
(51:32):
thirty actually kind of kinda is better, even better than
the hurt Locker, like you sort.
Speaker 3 (51:37):
Of yeah something what you're up against?
Speaker 2 (51:41):
Huh yeah, yeah. So anyway, there you go. There are
our thoughts on the hurt Locker. We are closing the
doors on this wing of house Lights, which we are
calling House of Bigelow, and uh, it's setting us up
to shift now to look at another director, Darren, Why
don't you let the audience know who that's going to be.
Speaker 5 (52:02):
That's right, We're going to be covering Luke Bisson of
the nineties, starting with lafem Nikita from nineteen ninety here on,
house Lights
Speaker 1 (52:12):
Join the Revolution, Join the Nerd Party.
Welcome to the ned Palty.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Welcome back to House Lights, specifically the House of Bigelow,
where we have deployed to look at the works of
Catherine Bigelow, and we are here this week looking at
her oscar winning entry The hurt Locker from two thousand
and eight starring Jeremy Renner, and I am one of
the hosts of this show. I am your grizzled slightly
(00:43):
unstable squad leader, and I am join John Mills, and
I am joined by my two compatriots, the ever stallwart
by the book, Darren Moser, and the person I'm most
likely to shoot in the leg when I'm trying to
save him, Tristan Riddell. Welcome, Hi, everybody.
Speaker 3 (00:59):
I knew before or you even open your mouth. I
was going to be the nervous guy who gets shot
in the lake.
Speaker 2 (01:05):
You know that it's inevitably going to happen, and if
any of the three of us are going to do it,
it's gonna be this guy right here.
Speaker 4 (01:11):
It's true, you know it's true.
Speaker 3 (01:13):
With a three man podcast and a three man EOD team, Yeah,
I was gonna be get the I was gonna be
the one who's.
Speaker 5 (01:19):
Got spit to clean this blood off the giant bullet.
Speaker 2 (01:24):
Yeah, that's a tense scene, a tense scene. So anyway,
here we are with The hurt Locker, the movie that
very famously Jim Cameron's ex wife upset him at the
Oscars by winning Best Picture, won a ton of award.
It's a lot of a steam. It's a very in
depth personal portrait of people in the Iraq War with
(01:49):
a lot of real world vibe to it, and it
got a lot of positive press at the time.
Speaker 4 (01:54):
And here we are.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
It's hard to believe it's almost been two decades since
it came out. Now, Darren, I know that you saw
this previous to this viewing. Did you see this in
the theater or was this one that you watched at
home after all of the esteem and the awards buzz
had washed over you.
Speaker 6 (02:11):
Yeah, this was probably due to the Oscars. Back in
the day when I cared about the Oscars, we would
often watch, you know, movies.
Speaker 5 (02:20):
That were either up for Best Picture or you know,
or if it won, it was like.
Speaker 6 (02:25):
Okay, give this a shake. So usually that was enough
to try it out. So I don't believe I caught
this in theaters, but yeah, it was one of those
where I mean not talking about the first time watching,
but in my recent rewatch, I was streaming it and
this maybe was my something with my earphones, or maybe
(02:45):
it was something in the mix. I want to confirm
with you guys, but for me, the mix kept going
between ears at different times, and I don't know if
that was something weird or special, because it kind of
enhanced it, like when you put the suit off, it
was like holy in what a year and it felt
really claustrophobic, and I'm like, but I don't know if
that's actually the mix.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
So I listened. I listened to headphones too. Now, granted
we probably weren't listen we weren't watching the same streaming source,
but I was listening in headphones too, and I didn't
hear that.
Speaker 6 (03:17):
Okay, I was watching it on Amazon, so it was
probably something with their mix. So I don't want to
give the movie too much credit for Amazon.
Speaker 3 (03:25):
It's mistake, but there was This is a total tangent,
But there was one time I was listening to an
audio book about Connuti and Singh and it was after
I got like halfway through it, and I started talking
to a friend of mine and I said, I was like, man,
this this book is so nonlinear. It's so much fun.
(03:45):
It's so great because it just goes from one time
period to another. It's completely out of order. And I
was like, I'm really enjoying it. And the guy I
was talking to actually had actually read the book. He's like,
that's not a nonlinear book. And the jackass that I
I when I ripped the CD from the library, I
ripped it out of order. And when I made the
(04:06):
audiobook file nice spousing it like I was like, oh,
this is such great nonlinear Taranty.
Speaker 5 (04:13):
Wrong, professor, My way is better.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
You created art, Tristan, you were an AI precursor right there.
Speaker 4 (04:22):
Just so your book's on shuffle there you go. It's
a good idea.
Speaker 2 (04:25):
So you know, Tristan, this is your first time seeing
the hurt locker.
Speaker 3 (04:30):
That's correct.
Speaker 4 (04:31):
How did this one pass by you?
Speaker 2 (04:33):
I mean you know, like, is it something that where
you were just always like I'll get around to it
and it just sort of like faded.
Speaker 4 (04:39):
What was the reason you missed it?
Speaker 3 (04:41):
Yeah? This this was not one of those where Okay, So,
like I put off watching Breaking Bad for many seasons
because people wouldn't shut up about it, Like people would
would not stop talking about Breaking Bad, and it got
to almost like a cult like status where I just
roll my eyes whenever somebody would bring up Breaking Bad.
And so I just refused to watch it because people
(05:01):
were bugging me. I know, it's kind of hipster thing
to do, like, you know, not watch something.
Speaker 4 (05:06):
I thought that was one of the people bugging you.
So I, yeah, that sounds right.
Speaker 3 (05:10):
Oh my god, we've been friends for a long time. Yes,
but this was not that situation. Like, this was not
that situation. It was when I saw that at one
Best Picture, I was I was elated that, you know,
like a the first that a woman finally won Best
Best like a female director one Best Picture, and uh
(05:33):
it only happened, it would be women were only nominated
for Best Picture four times before in the history of
the Academy. But for some reason, I just I just
never got around to it. It was always it was always like, oh, yeah,
hurt Locker, I should watch that. I like Jeremy Rayner,
I should watch that. Catherine Bigelow, Sure, why not? Just
it just completely escaped me all those times. That's fair enough,
(05:55):
I mean, no real reason.
Speaker 6 (05:57):
As a podcasts made us better people because that watch
the things we should have watched.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
There you go missing frame or something.
Speaker 2 (06:05):
Yeah, yeah, it's about say, it's like a missing frames
here on the nerd party.
Speaker 4 (06:09):
Check that out too. But were you familiar with it?
Had you? Was there anything that had been I.
Speaker 3 (06:15):
Feel this was one of those movies that I feel
definitely integrated itself into the zeitgeist, like everybody was mentioning it.
There's pop culture references that, Like the first thing that
pops in my brain is when Jim and Pam come
home with the baby and they're trying to put the crib.
Not the crib, they're trying to put the car seat
into the car, and they keep freaking out because they're
going to wake her up. And He's like, oh my god.
(06:36):
It's like the hurt Walker, you know. Like we kept referencing,
we kept hearing references like that all throughout pop culture,
and I would see certain scenes here and there. I
always hated the poster because the DVD was such a
bad photoshop job of Jeremy Renner. I always thought it
looked like Treat Williams instead of Jeremy Renner, or like
the dude from their first substitute. I know, Treat Williams
(06:58):
using the second substitute, but like the dude from the
first substitute, I can't.
Speaker 4 (07:02):
Remember the bearer.
Speaker 3 (07:03):
Yes, Tom Behringer on the cover. He looks like Tom Behringer.
It's so weird anyway, But yeah, it's one of those
movies you see a blockbuster, you see the poster of
and you just you're like, oh, yeah, that one best picture.
I should get around to it. And also a shot
in sixteen millimeter, and I love movies that are shot
in sixteen millimeter, so I have no excuse.
Speaker 2 (07:23):
So you know, Darren, that's a question I'll throw to you.
Is Tristan mentions it's shot in sixteen millimeter. This movie
is created just you know, it's post digital switchover for
film and stuff like that. But it's definitely got, you know,
it's living in a weird time. It's living during that
transitional time before digital is completely taken over and the
(07:46):
look of things is sort of going back and forth.
Do you feel that there was a visual consistency to
this Do you feel that there was any sort of
a mix of visual like did it look like the
camera and shutter speeds and everything were shifting too much
or did it look very consistent throughout now.
Speaker 6 (08:05):
I think this is one of those movies that, because
it was made at the time it was made, it
would be really not impossible, but it would be much
more difficult to get that look back nowadays, because now
we have the advent of you know, really small cameras,
sports cameras. Things like this totally would have been shot
on a fleet of iPhones or go pros or something
(08:28):
if it was made nowadays. The fact that she's shot
in Jordan, you know, and in the summer, like you're shooting,
so you get a lot of environment. I think by
doing film, yeah, not only do you get the grain
and that kind of.
Speaker 5 (08:44):
Old worldly.
Speaker 6 (08:47):
News interviewer like you know, it's on location shooting a
piece for National DG or something like. It has that
kind of vibe. But apparently it was very, very difficult
because they did a lot of editing in Jordan, like
as they're shooting, because there was just hundreds and hundreds
of hours of footage, so it had to be like
(09:07):
hand curried to London for dailies and ship like because
they didn't want to maybe get it exposed by the
X rays and it was just it sounded like just
one more wrinkle that made production not pleasant besides all
the other parts of this movie.
Speaker 5 (09:26):
But through all that, I.
Speaker 6 (09:28):
Think, like I was saying, you would have to work
harder to get that look. Nowadays, I think something else
would look cleaner, would because I don't I look at
this movie and I don't think shaky cam. I don't
think it like it's very stable, it's very even when
they're running around, it's I mean, yeah, there's there's moments obviously,
(09:50):
like when there's a frenetic but on the whole, you know,
as we've said several times talking about different movies, I
think of like the sniper scene, for example, when they're
pinned down.
Speaker 5 (10:08):
That is an interesting scene.
Speaker 6 (10:09):
Where we know where the snipers are, we know what's
behind them, we know what's to the left of them,
like we're in the middle of nowhere, but we know
where we are, and that it's the visual storytelling is superb,
so very good, Mark.
Speaker 4 (10:23):
So so Tristan.
Speaker 2 (10:25):
You, how strongly do you disagree with Darren about the
camera movement?
Speaker 3 (10:31):
Oh? Like almost completely? Yeah, I know, I mean, okay,
there are there are moments when you're going full on
green grass but there are a lot of times when
you're not. So it's it's not like it's shaky camp
all the time, and there are a lot of Born movie. Yeah,
it's not a Born movie. It's not Green Grass, you know,
it's it's just although there is a moment that made
(10:53):
me feel like it started to become a Born movie.
But we'll get to that. But uh, it was it's
like right off the back you're getting I mean, and
this was so first decade of the two thousands. This
was so two thousands with this documentary style feel where
like like right off the bat like you get that
super zoom, like it's not quite like the seventy zoom
(11:13):
snap zoom, but it's that like, oh we got to
zoom in refocus because I'm there. I'm shaking because I'm
the camera and I'm near the explosion. I'm actually here
with them, but they're not acknowledging my presence. It's kind
of like the Office but not really. Uh it's a
I know, I feel I sound like I'm mocking the cinematography,
but I'm not because of a shot. You if you are,
but but it's just no, just the style of the decade.
(11:37):
It was so it permeated that decade so completely. Like
you like even in the like TV TV shows, like
when you look at Battle Circalactica or Firefly, Like I know,
it just gave two sci fi examples, but it you
have that snap zoom and that like that you see
them focus in real time. That was very much this movie.
Like that was the cornerstone of its action cinematography. But
(11:58):
was it there even when they were in the humy
or when they were just like talking to the barracks.
Speaker 2 (12:02):
No, yeah, I h the thing is to speak to
the you know, you say that goes full green Grass.
Barry Ackroyd, the director of photography, did work with green Grass,
and so it makes sense city he felt very comfortable
with this type of film. But more importantly, you know,
here we are, we've watched all of these Bigelow movies
(12:22):
up to this point. Do you feel that this is
a director fully embracing her true style, her true nature.
Do you feel this is an evolution of Bigelow or
do you feel that this is big Alow adapting for
a certain storytelling style.
Speaker 3 (12:39):
I'm gonna cheat and say both. That is because because
I believe that, like you specifically, John, like You made
a lot of really great points as we as we
went on, because you were very keen in talking about
the cinematography and the geography and the editing and seeing
it progress from Near Dark all the way up to now.
(13:02):
And you talked about the evolution of Bigelow style. And
you can see a clear through line all the way
through from Near Dark to today or I shouldn't say today,
but back tonight in two and nine with hert locker,
and you see the confidence and you see what's going on.
And even though she shot, I think it was something
like a two hundred to one ratio of how much
(13:24):
she shot how much she used.
Speaker 4 (13:26):
That's like Copola level.
Speaker 3 (13:27):
It's insane. Yeah, that's like Heart of Darkness Coppola level
type filming. But unlike Copola, everything that she wanted to
be in the film that was shot was put in there.
Like there was not a single scene that was cut. Now, granted,
I'm sure there were scenes that were trimmed down. I'm
sure there was things that were left out that were
involved in certain scenes, just like any film that you make,
(13:50):
but this movie she had final cut, which is awesome.
And she also she was along in the writing process
and saw what she wanted to do, made it happen,
and then that's what came out like this was this
was her baby, like she like, I think Jim Cameron
gave her the script and said you should direct this,
(14:11):
and she helped fine tune it with boll And I
think that's how you say his name, and they they
storyboarded it out. They're like, this is what we want
to do. This is what we want to make, and
they made the film they wanted to make. This is
this is bigelow at her back, like she she won
Best Picture. This was this was a clear and concise
(14:32):
honoring of her work and effort and craft up until
this moment. It's just like she's been doing this for
decades and boom, this was. This was the result.
Speaker 2 (14:41):
So Darren, you know, with her coming in and being
confident and knowing the story she wants to tell. There
are a couple of names here in the cast where
when you see them you're used to like, oh, well,
that that person will be in this movie for a
little while. You know, David Morse is in it for
like what ten seconds or something like that. I still
like and even on this rewatch, like David Morse walks on.
(15:02):
I'm like, yeah, David Morse, he's really great. Where'd he go?
What's happening? I'm not sure why.
Speaker 3 (15:09):
Point of that. I'm sorry it didn't rerail your question,
but what the was the point of having Morse's care
not just Morse, but like Morse's character in there.
Speaker 2 (15:18):
I think he communicates, uh, sort of like that that
testosterone Leyden machismo, bravado type of character. That's that like
he he has that sort of ara about him. Maybe
Morse was chosen and when the script was earlier on
and it whittled down to just that one scene, I
don't know.
Speaker 6 (15:37):
No, Yeah, this this casting is is really good. I mean,
besides the fact you have your your three, you know,
your little triad of of the unit. But uh, I
think we were choking earlier, like when when Guy Pierce
shows up and you're like, sorry, guy, I don't think
kind of gonna make way for the lead character coming
(15:58):
up rights.
Speaker 3 (16:00):
The moment the moment you see appears, you're like, WHOA,
You're not Jeremy Renner and you're not like a Brad
Pitt name, but you're a big name. And so I
have a feeling this is kind of a glorified cameo
and you're gone.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
As soon as you see him put on the bomb suit,
you're like, oh, okay, cool, cool, I know where this
is going.
Speaker 3 (16:24):
Yeah, yeah, you know what.
Speaker 6 (16:25):
We know who's supposed to be bombsuit guy. We need
a vacancy how to get that?
Speaker 4 (16:32):
Which one of these people is not coming?
Speaker 6 (16:34):
Oh, it's right, But then you have like, uh, you know,
Ralph finds like that was really cool seeing him, although
in that scene he kind of like disappears like he's
there and then like I guess were they waiting out
the stiper.
Speaker 5 (16:48):
But then everyone else just like went home.
Speaker 6 (16:51):
I don't know. It was really weird because we know
he never kept cutting over to the people.
Speaker 2 (16:57):
Well he got he got killed really quick, and and
I think like his other guys got dropped because there's
one guy get that gets dropped. Yeah, he gets shot
while they're while he's trying to draw a beat on
the other people, which I thought. I mean, that was
a really well executed scene because I think that what
that communicated. The tension in that scene reminded me of
(17:20):
the first time I saw Platoon, when I was far
too young to have seen it in the movie theaters
and the Hey, gen X, we loved seeing stuff too.
Speaker 3 (17:30):
You're gonna say, weren't you like ten when Platoon came out?
Speaker 2 (17:33):
It was like twelve when I saw it in the
movie theater or something like that. That's okay. My cousin,
who was four years younger, was sitting next to me. Whatever,
what are you gonna do? Sorry?
Speaker 4 (17:42):
I feel like I feel like all of us.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
Who took him should send an apology note at this point.
But anyway, the scene where they have that standoff and
they're going back and forth actually reminded me very much
of the tension of Platoon where they are on the
night patrol and Charlie she is awake even though he's
not the one on watch, and he's just sitting there
(18:04):
and the camera comes up over and he's like just
sitting there. He's like, I don't know what I'm supposed
to do right now. Like I look at that scene
and I don't know how to play with Uterus, and
like I look at that scene and like I'm so
unnerved because I'm like.
Speaker 4 (18:16):
I don't know what I would do in this situation.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
Like I'm like, I wait, I have to sit here,
and it's just a war of attrition basically at this point, well,
eventually we're everybody on one side or the other is
going to die? Which side am I on? Like, that's
I can't imagine the tension in that moment.
Speaker 6 (18:33):
Yeah, I just want to say first, for that scene,
the thing that drew me in was when they're making
their shots and they're close but they have to like compensate.
Speaker 5 (18:44):
It made me think of like every first person shooter
video game.
Speaker 6 (18:49):
I've ever done, and how in those you take for
granted the fact that your gun will shoot exactly where
you expect it to, and you have an amazing aim
and so bad guys over there, no big deal. But
when all of a sudden you introduce the fact that
I might not actually hit what I'm aiming for and
(19:10):
I only have so many round like it, that itself
added way more tension than anything.
Speaker 2 (19:16):
Yes, Yeah, well yeah, because you know, another big applause
for the movie, because it takes into account the fact that, like, okay,
at the distance that you're at, wind is going to
affect where the bullet goes. There's going to be recoil,
there's going to be like one guy is looking and
telling him where to go, but he's also looking through
a site, but they're off by a couple of you know, inches,
(19:37):
and so that's going to affect the trajectory of the
bullet and everything. Yeah, it's it's a pretty amazing scene.
I think at the very least Tristan did. Was that
a standout scene for you? Do you feel that the
movie was able to get to that tension level with
all of its scenes or was it more of a
slow burn for you.
Speaker 3 (19:56):
I think that one was a little bit of a
slow burn for me because because so many people died
early on, because like the British folk died, and and
so I was just like, Okay, our guys are probably
safe because they killed all the British folk pretty early on.
So just in the realm of storytelling, like if this
(20:17):
was a standalone scene, I probably would be a little
bit more amped up. I'd be a little have a
little bit more anxiety. I think there were there were
scenes in there that I definitely had more anxiety at
the beginning of the movie than I did at the end.
And I think that's probably just a fact of the
of the structure of the film, where it's just like, Okay,
(20:39):
is this a movie, or is this seven scenes where
you diffuse a bomb and by this, you know, by
the you know, fourth, fifth, sixth, and seventh time where
you're diffusing a bomb, the anxiety is kind of gone
because you're just on edge the entire time, like our
body has to, like our mind tells our body, Okay, relax,
it's not real. You cannot sustain this the entire time,
(21:03):
and so you're not going to get that anxiety reaction
that you did in the first two or three times.
And so by the time we got to that scene,
even though it's a good scene, I like how it's shot,
I like how it's acted. I really like that moment
with the juice at the end because I think seeing
Anthony Mackie just kind of shut down a little bit,
(21:24):
like he can't he can't stop, he can't stop paying attention.
He's he's clearly affected by what he just did, and
he's so amped up that he can't take his attention
as away. Renner's like, Okay, just have some juice, you know,
get your sugar level up. You know that that. I
like that moment, but I feel like the anxiety dwindles
(21:45):
as it goes on, and then it kind of peeks
back up again at the very end with the with
the dude in the suit with the with the vest
bomb because you're just like, Okay, who are they going
to kill off this time? Are we going to do
a big bomb where everybody dies? Is it going to
be shait experien or is every good to back away?
You don't actually know, but all this stuff in between,
you know everybody's gonna walk away.
Speaker 2 (22:05):
So, Darren, do you think that the ebb and flow
of the tension and you know, at the very beginning
of the movie, the last three words or four words
that are on screen from you know, it starts with
two lines and then the last four words to sit there,
war is a drug, and it goes on. Do you
think that that tension spike, ebb and flow speaks to
(22:30):
that theme the idea that Tristan is talking about where
it's like you get a little numb and then it's
like you need you need a stronger and stronger hit
to maintain.
Speaker 3 (22:39):
Yeah, well, and that's.
Speaker 6 (22:40):
I mean definitely what's happening to James to Jeremy Renner
Because in the first few Disarmaments, he's it's like another
day at the office, Like he is, so he's too chill,
and he's just like, oh yeah, look cut the red wire, blah.
Speaker 5 (22:56):
Blah blah, here we go. We're do to do, you know.
Speaker 6 (22:59):
And I kind of like the moment where he like
takes off the suit and is all like, there's enough,
Like this, dude's gonna do nothing if this goes off,
like I'm dead, so I might as well be comfortable.
And I'm like, I'm sure that's not you know, standard procedure,
but but I do. Yeah, the EBB and flow, I
think they do. You can tell they're trying to not
(23:20):
one note it. You know, where you have you have
the detonation killing the inter or not interpret the psych officer.
So that's the that's the bomb that no one saw coming.
Then you have like the bomb vest, which is the
one where we get to see our hero not be
able to succeed in disarming it and and someone loses
(23:42):
their life because the other ones are all just just
got to get them all cut before the guy hits
the button. Like that is the same kind of thing,
with slight variations. I mean, that iconic shot of him
tugging on the cord and like five.
Speaker 5 (23:58):
Bomb is so I mean that's why it's on like.
Speaker 6 (24:00):
Half the posters is it's so you're just super unrealistic,
super stupid, but really great shot. But all that to say, yeah,
I like the progression of Renner's character where you can see, Okay,
the cup is full, it's starting to overflow.
Speaker 3 (24:21):
Now.
Speaker 6 (24:21):
I don't know how long he's been on tour, I
don't know how many deployments he's done, but you can
tell it's finally the cracks are showing, and I don't
know what his next door is going to be, like
a whole nother year, but something, you know, hitched up
his boots and he's ready to go back, like he
can't see another world beyond this job, the beyond the herdlocker.
Speaker 2 (24:46):
Speaking of the cracks showing, Tristan to to Darren's point there,
what did you think about the subplot of him mistaking
the dead body for the young boy and basically that
sort of mental break thing he has where it is
affecting him on an emotional level.
Speaker 3 (25:04):
Heyed it. That was my least favorite part of the movie.
Frig and hated it. It completely took me out of
the picture because that's one of the moments where it
kind of stopped being Okay, Okay, I know that movies
aren't documentaries, even though they really wanted to shoot it
like a documentary. Movies are not documentaries. Movies are fun,
(25:26):
movies are interesting. Movies are dramatic, and they're not real life.
But certain movies have a veneer of real life. This
movie had a veneer of real life, just like Saving
Private ryin even though there was a lot that happened
in Private Ryan that was not realistic. This is kind
of had that same tone where you're just like, oh,
I feel like I'm watching something real. Even though people
who have gone through EOD, are gone through the Iraq War,
(25:49):
Afghanistan or something like that can recognize that it's not
real life. Certain things are, like the emotional aspects of
the movie are are real, Like when they get to
the core of what it's like to deployment, what it's
like to go through something like this, that's that's real
and that's cinema. You know this, This isn't a how
to manual, and it shouldn't be. It shouldn't be, and
(26:10):
that's not what I'm saying. But this moment really took
me out because it stopped being a movie. About a
soldier on duty or a soldier going through a rotation,
or a soldier going into a group for EOD and
everything like that, and started becoming more like a Born
movie where this guy is going out on his own.
The entire idea that this this this guy is sneaking
(26:33):
off base to you know, track a lead that he
doesn't know is real, because like that's the thing is
that like he can't he's gonna trust this guy who
sells bootleg DVDs to take him to the right place.
He could he could have been and probably was in
some random person's home, some absolutely random person's home. And
also like when he leaves, he's just a random, short,
(26:57):
white guy, you know, running through bagged. It's just no, no,
and like no, it just it completely took anut of
the film, Like like if he was found out, he
would have been disciplined, he would have been sent home,
like that kind of crap doesn't stand. And it just
it really took me out of it. And I'm really
glad one saving grace and I'm not saying it actually
(27:20):
saved it, but one attempt at saving Grace was that
it was a completely fruitless endeavor that really helped the story.
I think, in my opinion is that it was completely
fruitless because it was a stupid ass decision.
Speaker 2 (27:32):
So Darren, you know, given everything Tristan has just said,
you know, I would offer the counterpoint that that's probably
the scene where the commentary about interventionism and stuff like
that is layered in there. You know, it's a you know,
sort of a comment about like, he doesn't actually know
(27:54):
who quote unquote the enemy is. He's not sure what's
really going on. He mistakes something and he goes, you know,
it sends him over the edge and he goes and
he does something without thinking. You know, given those two
very separate polls that Tristan and I find ourselves at,
where do you find yourself gravitating more toward Yeah?
Speaker 6 (28:15):
I think you know, the middle is kind of the
next him going off book scene when he's like, oh,
this thing was blown up. I know there's a boogeyman
in the dark, so let's go get him. And even
Maggie's like, we got two plitudes of guys who like
their job is to go get right there. That should
(28:36):
have been the end of it, like in the real world.
But yeah, and then they are just like, hey, let's
go off. And I think while he does make choices
and has lack of consequences that do bend from reality,
even when he's doing those choices, there is the ever
(28:56):
presence you're in a war zone. No door is safe,
no corner should be unchecked, like that is present throughout
the entire film, and I think they communicated that, So
I'll give a mark for that. Even if the choices
the characters were making, I mean I was even like,
why are you guys punching each other like that sounds
like a stupid way to get on the you know,
(29:18):
in the medical bay when you should be out just
arm me. It's like, oh, sorry, I can't disarm bombs
on Tuesday because I have you ruptured by spleen when
you punched me in the gut at point break Sure
that sounds like a great idea.
Speaker 2 (29:31):
Yeah, I mean that scene obviously is just more commentary
on sort of like the adrenaline junkie testosterone laden environment
that they're in, just like how it's out of control
and you know, there's no like I find it very interesting.
We made reference to the therapists who or psychiatrist I'm sorry,
(29:54):
who you know blows up because he decides to go
out Oh yeah, I'll try to understand better what you
guys are going through.
Speaker 4 (30:01):
And blows up.
Speaker 2 (30:02):
But it is you know that that is one of
those things where you see sort of what the uphill
battle is like. There is no like I think one
of the core questions of the film is is there
a point to that psychiatrist being there? Like can you
possibly have a quote unquote healthy environment when this is
what you're doing right? Like is having somebody there to
(30:26):
sort of process things like? Is that even possible? And
then you know, and then Renner goes home and it's
like he can't even go back to to a civilian life,
like this is just this bizarre world that they that
they live in, and you know, the bizarre world that
they live in, you know, Tristan, it's easy enough to say, well,
(30:47):
the hurt Locker is the friends we made along the way.
Sorry bad joke, but you know that hurt Locker. What
do you think the title is trying to say? Is
it trying to say that they're the ones trapped in
the locker, that they put the pain in there, they
can't process it adequately. What do you think that title
is trying to say.
Speaker 3 (31:05):
Well, hurt locker is doesn't it mean like in military vernacular,
like when you get yourself in a bad spot and
you get hurt because of it.
Speaker 4 (31:15):
I've never been in the military, so I don't know.
Speaker 6 (31:18):
I'm milang for the bomb suit.
Speaker 5 (31:21):
It's while I was reading it, but I don't know.
Speaker 4 (31:25):
Yeah, I don't. I don't actually know, so now I
need to know.
Speaker 3 (31:30):
So, Okay, here's what it is. Hurt locker is US
military slang meaning a place or situation where someone is
in extreme pain, danger, or serious trouble. It's not specific
to bombs. It predates the Iraq War and was used
in Vietnam. So I feel like this is pretty up. Oh,
I feel like this could be used in a lot
of different variations. So that's what I think it means.
(31:51):
I think it means that. Uh, it's when you're in
the Pooh.
Speaker 2 (31:54):
Well, okay, in the Pooh, Yes, that's a very popular
phrase with the with the soldiers that are deployed.
Speaker 3 (32:01):
Yah, the soldiers use that phrase a lot.
Speaker 4 (32:03):
Yeah, in the Pooh. Definitely in the Pooh.
Speaker 2 (32:06):
So you know we're going through And what's funny is
there's a thing where you know, music obviously is a
big part of the film experience. But you know, Darren,
was there music in this movie? Like where was it
when it happened?
Speaker 6 (32:22):
You know, Actually the music in this one was really good,
but it's a different kind of music where it is
very subtly underscoring certain moments, like when you start to
hear the music, you're like, Okay, it's about to get real.
Either something's gonna go wrong or something's gonna happen. So
it was used very sparingly. But this is the kind
(32:44):
of movie where music and like sound design, like those
are working in harmony because the sound design is the
music of this movie. The sound of an explosion, the
breathing while you're in the vest, you know, the the
(33:04):
five minute long bullet casing shot as it ricochets and
pings off of the.
Speaker 5 (33:10):
Okay, it wasn't five minutes, but I love.
Speaker 3 (33:14):
They shot this, and speaking of early two thousands, they
shot this on the Phantom, which shoots something like two
thousand frames a second. It's insane, it's insane. I loved
the Guy Pier. I loved Guy Pierce dying. I'm just
gonna I'm going on record and I'm saying that I
loved Guy Piers dying because it was shot on Phantom
and I love explosions in slow motion. I just absolutely
(33:38):
love it, and this movie did it so well at
the beginning, like when with the with the rocks just
kind of rising up, and one thing like, even though
this movie only has a veneer of accuracy, one thing
that I really like that it did is that it
didn't look like Hollywood explosions. It looked like actually like
what it looks fireballs like, no firebills wouldn't. Yeah, thank you,
(33:58):
thank you, Darren. That's exactly right.
Speaker 5 (34:00):
Sorry, I'm saying your words before you say them.
Speaker 2 (34:05):
Like any elite team, over time, we can complete each
other's thoughts.
Speaker 4 (34:09):
That's that's very very.
Speaker 5 (34:11):
Give each other's ratings. You know, we're so in tune.
Speaker 2 (34:13):
Sandwiches, and that's what that's why nobody should ever miss
a show, is because their rating will be given for
them and it will be accurate and immovable. That's very
very true. So, you know, I like what you're saying
about the music and the sound design working hand in hand, Darren.
I think that's very true. It's very accurate for this.
But a big part of this as well, you know,
(34:34):
is the ratio of footage shot to footage used and
telling the story and whittling it down. You know, obviously
you have Chris Innis and Bob Morowsky. I think they're
at least at the time they were married, so they're
working on the film. Tristian, I love to throw the
editing question to you at first all the time, but
(34:56):
is this another case of like you said about merch
invisible editing where it doesn't draw attention to itself or
do you feel that this editing does draw attention to itself.
Speaker 3 (35:07):
I think the cinematography does the heavy lifting of drawing
attention to itself. I feel like the editing itself gets
you where you need to go. This is this is
this is more merch than not because you don't think
about the editing. You're you're thinking about the cinematography. Like
people who are you know, cinema fans, film fans, movie fans,
(35:31):
whatever you want to call yourself, Like when you pay
attention to those things, and it's you know, tangent, it's
it's always so strange when I talk to somebody and
like I was talking about how I was like, oh,
that movie was garbage, and they're like oh yeah, but
her performance was so good, so it was a great movie.
And I was like, no, No, the cinematography was garbage,
the editing was garbage, the writing was garbage, the directing
(35:51):
was garbage. They're like, yeah, but Meryl Street was so good.
I was like, I don't care. You know, like, it's
so strange. How often like that is that that's your
general audience right there. But you know that was also
one of the benefits of the movie is that you
have this indie feel but yet it's made. It didn't.
(36:13):
It didn't have that big of a budget actually, but
it had an indie feel, but yet it had that
big promoting it had, it had good people in it,
and it was dealing with a subject that you couldn't
do with just an indie film. But yeah, to answer
your question, the the editing I think was really well
done because it wasn't excessive, like you didn't need that, Like,
(36:33):
this wasn't black Hawk Down. Like if you watch black
Hawk Down, I feel like that's I feel like that's
a fair comparison movie. Right, Yeah, if you're watching black
Hawk Down and this is not a knock on that. Uh.
The editing brings itself to attention a great deal because
it's it's Ridley Scott, you know, like it was Ridley
Scott in that era of Ridley Scott where he wanted
(36:55):
to he was really flashy. This is not a flashy
film in terms of it, but it was in cinematography,
and I feel like it made a lot of really
solid choices in cinematography.
Speaker 2 (37:06):
Darren, you know, speaking of that cinematography and the editing
a movie I can't help but think of I want
to ask you if you've seen it. Have you ever
seen Jarhead with Jake Gillenhall.
Speaker 6 (37:17):
I have not, but it does feel like, you know,
when we have those duo of films, not that they're
exactly the same, but it's like, oh, our minds like
to see patterns of like, oh, look at these two
films that are very similar, but they're obviously also very different.
Speaker 2 (37:33):
I think I think would be very interesting and testing.
I don't know if you've seen Jarhead, but like, I
think it would be very interesting to watch these two
movies side by side, because as I recall Jarhead, it's
it is a more polished, more big studio type of thing,
although it's dealing with the very similar sort of thing
about trying to process, you know, going through these type
(37:57):
of wartime situations and what it does to a person
and how it can change them and divert them. And
you know, it would just be very interesting to see
those two films put against each other.
Speaker 3 (38:10):
Yeah, it definitely deals with the mundane of being a
soldier a little bit more than hurt Locker.
Speaker 4 (38:17):
Yeah, that's true.
Speaker 6 (38:18):
Herlocker is more like we're a specialist team with a
very specific mandate and job description versus like a jar head,
a grunt yea, Yeah, I.
Speaker 2 (38:30):
Just I think it's interesting because hurt Locker is a
movie that instantly jumps to mind when you start talking
about cinema, that that's about dealing with a wartime situation,
a modern wartime situation. But you know, I made reference
to Platoon before there were so many, so so many
(38:51):
Vietnam movies in the eighties, like from the seventies, Like
it was just non stop, it was like one every
six months was coming out. Now, I learned a lot
about war film and film in general by watching all
of them growing up, and it definitely, you know, shapes
your tastes over time. But I mean, Darren, why is
it you think that hurt Locker sticks. You know, we're
(39:14):
almost twenty years in. Why is it, with this very
content rich environment that we're in, why is Hurtlocker the
one that's sticky? Why is that the one that stays
in everybody's brains?
Speaker 6 (39:28):
I think, you know, there's something about it being about
a more modern war, you know, the Iraq War, not
being that far there. It's not like World War two
or Civil war, you know, where it's almost into legend territory.
You know, it's just so far back and all the
stories that have been told. But I think, you know,
(39:50):
Bigelow strikes that balance of a narrative story because you
have to have a narrative, but also you know, root
in an interesting tale, you know, a single man's struggle,
you know, like all the main points, like it's a
well constructed film narratively, uh, even though it does kind
(40:13):
of feel a little vignette like they're different. Each day's
mission is a little like chapter of the Week, because
there's no two things are the same.
Speaker 3 (40:23):
But it isn't bad.
Speaker 6 (40:24):
It's and like Tristan was saying, you know, it's a
film of maybe those five interesting days happened over a year,
but of course for us, they're going to happen in
a weekend because we have to keep the story you know, interesting.
But I think that's the main My main takeaway is
that you know, by setting it in a in a
(40:45):
modern war, going deep enough into the characters and their struggles,
but also keeping it, you know, interesting enough that you're
that it's not an edge of your seat, Like there
are definitely moments, but it's not like The Rock or
some other movie where the percussion hits you and it's
like here we go and you know, we're storming in
(41:09):
or or aliens where we're like, you know, we're merging
satire with like otherworldly invaders.
Speaker 3 (41:17):
I'm surprised, is not surprised that we haven't done House
of Bay Since you bring up The.
Speaker 2 (41:22):
Rock, I'm not surprised we haven't done House of Bay.
That just seems like such dangerous territory to get into.
But Trisan, this is your first viewing. Why do you
think with this first viewing behind you? Now, why is
hurt Locker such a sticky movie? Why is it one
that stays on everybody's brains? I mean AFI selected this actually,
(41:44):
if I recall, yeah, National Film Registry selected it in
twenty twenty for being culturally, historically, or esthetically significant.
Speaker 4 (41:53):
Why do you think hurt Locker lands.
Speaker 3 (41:56):
I think the reason why it lands is because you
could this movie in any war at any time, and
it would still land the same Because in this movie,
it doesn't matter what the backdrop is. It doesn't matter
that it's the Iraq War. It doesn't matter that it's
the Afghan War or Desert Storm Vietnam, World War II,
(42:16):
World War One, it doesn't really matter. It's about the
human experience in war. And you have these archetypes. You
have the cowboy, you have the wild card. You have
the the pup who is innocent and you know, is
concerned about like who's feeling guilty. You have the person
who wants to have a life afterwards, but yet feels responsibility.
(42:39):
It's you have people going home and not knowing how
to interact with the public or interact with their family
because war is all that they know. Now. It has
such universal themes and this is this movie does such
a great job and I don't say this as a knock.
This movie does such a great job being a political
(42:59):
that it's it's about the experience of war and men
through war. And it's not about like, oh, you know
Bush lied, or you know, like we went you know,
we we went to war under false pretenses, or the
Iraqis don't want us there or anything like that. It
has I mean, all the subtext is there, of course,
(43:21):
but it's that's just what it is. It's subtext. This
is about Jeremy and Rinter, Anthony Mackie and forgive me
what's his name about? Jill Garty? Thank you, Brian Garrity,
who I know from True Blood? Who you know he played?
He played. The only thing that I recognize him from
(43:41):
is in True Blood he played a soldier in the
Afghan War.
Speaker 4 (43:45):
See.
Speaker 2 (43:46):
The thing is I actually recall him from Flight was
twenty twenty twelve Za Mecha's film, which I think is
a gorgeous film and absolutely magnificent overlooked film.
Speaker 4 (43:56):
But anyway, we're here to finish talking about it.
Speaker 3 (43:59):
But yeah, that's that's my answer, is that, like it's
it's about the experience. It's about the experience of war
more than the war itself.
Speaker 4 (44:05):
Fair enough, fair enough.
Speaker 2 (44:06):
So I think we've we've gotten some we've gotten our
thoughts out, we've we've we've gone through we've processed this.
I think we're we're here, We're at the moment where
we're going to give our final thoughts and ratings. And uh, Tristan,
since this is your first go round with the hurt Locker,
what are your final thoughts and the rating that you
land at here with Catherine Bigelow's award winning Best Picture
(44:30):
winning hurt.
Speaker 3 (44:31):
Locker, I'm I'm happier that Bigelow one with Best Picture
and that it won so many noms than it is
that I am for it winning Best Picture. I think
this is a great movie. I think it's really good.
I think it has some great performances. It has it
has some it has something to say about the experience.
(44:52):
I think Jeremy Rinner and Anthony Mackie give great performances.
And and and by the way, I didn't get to
talk about this, but I'm very much team Mackie when
it comes to I am very much on Falcon's side
when it comes to who's right and who's wrong. I
would be friggin' pissed as hell. I would punch my
team leader if he did the things that he did
(45:16):
in real life that he did in this movie, like
taking off his headset, not like refusing to give an
answer when he throws us friggin' smoke bomb at the beginning,
like all those things, all those things, I'm like, Jeremy
Rinner in this movie is a friggin' jackass. And some
people might say, like, oh, well, you know, like you know,
(45:36):
he was down to earth and concerned about his campandres
you know, when it mattered. I don't care. That's great
that he does it when it's mattered, when it matters,
But I want him to be a good person the
entire time, not just part of the time. But the
thing is is that I can't remember who said it,
but some famous person said, I've served with the very
best of men, and I've served with the very worst
(45:58):
of men, and that's how you get in the military,
and this is very evocative of that. I think the
cinematography is great, even though it's very two thousands, and
I love that it shot in sixteen millimeter, And like
I said, great performance is great direction, But there's just
certain points here and there where I'm just like it
feels very vignette and it's there were like there were
(46:22):
points that really took me out of it, like the
Born legacy point where he you know, goes rogue and
goes off base. So I give it four stars because
it's a really good movie. It deserved all the accolades,
and Bigelow definitely deserved it. But it's this is not
a perfect film.
Speaker 4 (46:39):
Fair enough.
Speaker 2 (46:40):
I will actually say that, while everybody loves to talk
about the fact that you know, this this one and
she beat Cameron, it was a very packed field in
two thousand and eight, and I will agree with you.
I think that the hurt Locker benefit benefited from that
because just because I pulled it up just out of curiosity,
(47:03):
the hurt Locker wins the two thousand and nine Awards
for two thousand and eight movies. So you have the
hurt Locker, Avatar, the blind Side, District nine in Education,
in Glorious Bastards, Precious a serious man up and up
in the air. That is a crowded field. That isn't
a good year. That's an insane yeah. And somehow the
(47:24):
Dark Knight wasn't in there. But whatever, And you have
a situation here where it's like, I mean, this is
the more everybody wanted more films added cool. I get it.
It makes sense. We don't want it to be just
five that are up there because the one we loved
won't ever get nominated. But you split the vote, and
(47:47):
you split the vote in such a way that the
eventual winner is going to benefit. I mean it's you know,
the following year you have the King's Speech wins, but
that's a year that's got the fighter inception, the kids
are all right, one hundred and twenty seven hours. The
Social Network toy story three True Grit Winners was like,
how like, I'm not trying to take anything away from
(48:09):
Bigelow's victory because I understand why it won. But you know,
I definitely think that in another year, if you whittled
that down to like a true quote unquote top five,
I think hurt Locker has a longer shot, you know,
longer odds at winning. All that to say, I agree
with you, Tristan. This is a four star film. It's
a strong four And while I, while I defend and
(48:32):
I understand what she's saying with his you know, going
off bass cowboy moment, I did, I similarly sort of
like disconnected because I was like, wait, what movie am
I watching?
Speaker 3 (48:44):
Now?
Speaker 2 (48:44):
What's what's happening here? And then at the end when
they go off after the people, I agree. I'm like
the veneer of reality, to use your term. Mackie isn't
just saying no, we got a platoon of guys. It's like,
I'm going off after him. He's tackling him, putting him
in an arm bar and like zip tying him. It's like, Okay,
this guy's had a psychotic breaks. He's trying to do
(49:06):
something completely insane. He's not going off base ever again,
you know, like and they're going to take him off
for evaluation. So four stars, Darren. That brings us to you.
Where do you land with the hurt Locker?
Speaker 4 (49:19):
Yeah?
Speaker 6 (49:19):
This was while it's not a movie I had watched
again recently, you know, it's it's been a while. I
did really enjoy going back into this world, into these characters.
You know, I think a lot is to be said
on what was pulled off.
Speaker 5 (49:36):
Like it's not a guarantee. Oh we shot in Jordan.
Speaker 6 (49:39):
Oh we sat in the summer, and it's gonna all
look real and and come together and work, and our
character is going to be likable and interesting, and you know,
the tension is going to be there, Like you have
to build all of that and and she did it,
you know, all the while it was you know, financially
successful and did well. You know, it's not not making
(50:01):
Avatar money, but that's okay, nothing else it does.
Speaker 3 (50:04):
But I mean that's the that's the thing though. I'm
glad you brought that up because that's something that we
didn't talk about. This is the lowest grossing Best Picture
film so far.
Speaker 5 (50:13):
It's like forty nine million, like fifty million, that's it.
Speaker 3 (50:17):
And at the time of its release, it was like
they only counted domestic it made its budget back, not
even marketing costs. That's crazy.
Speaker 6 (50:28):
Well, you know, we could just make an oscar category
the most box office and with I don't know if
that would be worth winning. But no, I'm I'm giving
it a four to two. I think we're all in
agreement fours across the board. And it's it's a fun
like I said, it's a fun film to revisit. It
is nice seeing you know, MACKI and you know when
(50:51):
you see him, because he's he's not the protagonist, but
he is kind of leading the squad a little bit
like you know, he's a little more straight man, a
little more like I'm going to keep you all live
because I'm going to make the right decision. So anytime
seeing him on screen is always a pleasure.
Speaker 2 (51:09):
Now, I will interject really quick that big a low,
I think a few years later is undone by the
number of nominations for Best Picture when Zero Dark thirty
loses to Argo, which I'm taking nothing away from Argo,
love the film, but like that was another one where
it was like that, you know, it was like nine
Insane Movies, and it was like, oh well, zero Dark
(51:32):
thirty actually kind of kinda is better, even better than
the hurt Locker, like you sort.
Speaker 3 (51:37):
Of yeah something what you're up against?
Speaker 2 (51:41):
Huh yeah, yeah. So anyway, there you go. There are
our thoughts on the hurt Locker. We are closing the
doors on this wing of house Lights, which we are
calling House of Bigelow, and uh, it's setting us up
to shift now to look at another director, Darren, Why
don't you let the audience know who that's going to be.
Speaker 5 (52:02):
That's right, We're going to be covering Luke Bisson of
the nineties, starting with lafem Nikita from nineteen ninety here on,
house Lights
Speaker 1 (52:12):
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