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May 12, 2025 16 mins
The biter, the hitter, the runner, the climber...Why do some adults continue to label children this way? Would you do that to an adult? Join Cindy and Alison for a reflection on why this happens and what we can do.

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Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome to How Preschool Teachers Do It. This is Alison Kenttos.
I am an early childhood educator, and this is Cindy
terror Bush. I am an early childhood consultant.

Speaker 2 (00:12):
This podcast is for parents and early childhood professionals.

Speaker 1 (00:16):
Let our experience and research based knowledge become your guide.

Speaker 3 (00:23):
Welcome back preschool peeps. Hi peeps, if you are on YouTube,
you're seeing a QR code in the corner. We've talked
about it in the last few episodes, so we're done.
Just go ahead and scan it.

Speaker 4 (00:34):
It's there.

Speaker 3 (00:34):
And if you didn't hear us talk about it in
last few episodes where you've been, come back and listen
to the last few episodes. They're really good ones. Yeah,
there you go. So there are people listening to us
from all over the world and the United States. Alison,
why don't we recognize some of those people.

Speaker 2 (00:48):
We are recognizing Taiwan today. Hello, everybody in Taiwan and Louisville.

Speaker 4 (00:53):
Kentucky, UK.

Speaker 3 (00:56):
Now you have a mission, people of Taiwan and Louisville, Kentucky,
spread the word about this podcast. Thank you for being
among our preschool peeps. You have to see when we
look at these stats. We get such a kick.

Speaker 2 (01:08):
I know, because it's quite amazing that people around the
world are listening to us, and people around our country.

Speaker 4 (01:15):
It's amazing.

Speaker 3 (01:16):
I mean, we're just sitting here in my home doing this. Yeah,
I know, we have no idea, but we thank you
for being among our peeps and for listening.

Speaker 2 (01:23):
Yes, an idea that happened at a restaurant.

Speaker 3 (01:25):
Yes, it was an idea that happened at a restaurant.
And here we are, and here we are. What is
it six seven years? Six?

Speaker 2 (01:31):
Almost seven years later? I think it's six and a half.
We started in June.

Speaker 3 (01:35):
Oh no, so this by this what? No, so it's
almost seven years seven years? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. This
episode should be published to the world on May twelfth.
Oh yeah, then almost seven years seven years. Wow. Incredible. Crazy.
In the in the seven years that we've been doing this,
there's some things that have changed which are wonderful. Yeah.

(01:57):
There are some things that are not have not changed
that are wonderful that should stay the way they are. Yes,
there are also things that we just wanted to stop,
and that's what we're here to talk.

Speaker 4 (02:07):
Please stop.

Speaker 3 (02:09):
I don't know if you all have experienced an uptick
in recognizing what I'm gonna describe. But it occurred to
me one day I was visiting an early childhood program
and I'm just hearing so much of this, And when
I talk to people too, I'm just hearing so much
of it. And it is what it says in the
title for this episode. It is basically name calling. It

(02:32):
is people talking about the hitter, the biter, the climber,
the what else scratcher, the the fidgety kid, the nervous nelly,
Oh yeah, the nervous kid, the shy child, the loud one.

Speaker 4 (02:55):
Yeah, the quiet one.

Speaker 3 (02:58):
You know, she's the shy one, he's the loud ones.
Can we please, we just stop please it, you know.
And it occurs to me when Alison and I were
talking about this topic, because it actually has been kind
of a hot topic in the early childhood world, because
it just keeps going. It knows it's never end. It

(03:20):
occurs to me that we do things like this to
children that we would not tolerate as adults like.

Speaker 4 (03:28):
Or we don't.

Speaker 3 (03:28):
Maybe you know, it happens and we don't like it.

Speaker 4 (03:31):
We don't like it, yes.

Speaker 3 (03:34):
Right, I mean I want you to think about the
people you've worked with folks, I'm pretty sure that among
those people there's like the loudmouth, the gossiper, the brown noser.

Speaker 2 (03:49):
Not the words I would use, but yes, the browns.

Speaker 3 (03:53):
Yes what else have we got on your staff's folks?
The I can't say the one I'm thinking of the
you know, there's the and then there's the quiet one,
the anti social, the anti social one. The we all

(04:13):
are different types of people, right. Yes. I don't often
hear people walking in a hallway or attending professional development
or being in a room with other people kind of saying, well,
you know, she's the this one, because if the other
adult hears it, yeah, there's going to be trouble. The

(04:36):
reason we can get away with this with young children
for so many decades now is because we hold some
power over young children. Right, think about it, like we
I can stand somewhere and say, you know this this
bier in my class and they might not know that.

Speaker 4 (04:57):
They're talking, you're talking about them. Even if they do.

Speaker 3 (05:00):
How much power do they have to defend themselves or
even when the children aren't there? Right, And let's say
I am facilitating a professional development session and that session
is about behavior, it often is right, that session is
about behavior. What's interesting to me is that when I'm
talking to professionals, they talk about the bier, they talk

(05:21):
about the hitter, the climber, the runner. I get the
runner a lot. I can't do that because we have
a runner. I hear that a lot from the professionals.
When you talk to the families, that's not how they
talk about the children.

Speaker 4 (05:37):
No, it's even.

Speaker 3 (05:40):
Each other's children. Okay, do you think it's all they'll say,
like she bites, but not ooh.

Speaker 2 (05:45):
She's the Do you think it's kind of now this
is like really wrong, but like do you think it's
kind of like shop talk like how people like you
know what I mean by that, like locker room talk
like that kind of like professionals get together and they're like,
oh that's how I just but it's wrong.

Speaker 3 (06:01):
Well I just think I just want people to remember
that a child who is hitting, biting, they're struggling, and
there's someone's child and that child is struggling because all
behavior is communication, right, So this child who is biting
other children, hitting other children, pushing other children, that child
is struggling. They're not trying to be aggressive. The aggression

(06:26):
communicates that they need help in some way.

Speaker 2 (06:28):
But I don't understand why as a teacher, like you
don't like I always want even if they are biting, hitting, scratuate,
whatever they're doing, whatever the behavior is that they're communicating
to me, why wouldn't I want them to succeed? So
why wouldn't I help them rather than just sit there
and label them and name call them and be like, oh,

(06:48):
we we can't do anything as well because runs or
whatever it is.

Speaker 3 (06:52):
I think there's a situation. I think there are situations
in which the adults have tried strategies and techniques and
it's not working, not working, and so the adults get frustrated.
I totally get that it's very hard when your strategies
are not working, when you've learned strategies, you've taken the
time to try, you've tried over and over, and this
is not working. And I think the adults then can't

(07:12):
figure out what is the struggle cry from these children?
What are they struggling with? When we can't figure it out,
I think it's a natural instinct to go, well, you
know that child is just that child's hit, or that
this child is just there's nothing I can do when
that's never true. There's always something we can do. It
just strikes me we don't do this with adults. We

(07:33):
do this with children. There are so many things that
we do to and with children only because we hold
power over them. We are in a position of power. Okay,
and I think that we would never do to another adult.

Speaker 2 (07:49):
But that's true because I just read something about when
you're in a family, say it's a holiday, say it's Christmas,
and families use some things again, and it's their children
to get a laugh at the dinner table, like oh,
reveal their embarrassing moments, or say stuff that the child
doesn't want revealed because it's a private matter. But to
get a laugh with the adults, that's what they do.

(08:11):
And it's because you, as the adult, have power over
this kid at the Christmas table or the or the
holiday table or whatever it is at the holiday event.

Speaker 4 (08:18):
And like that's wrong.

Speaker 3 (08:21):
Maybe this episode and as we are on here, I
may be changing the title. Yeah, maybe, as we talk
about this, this episode is really about just because we
have power doesn't mean that we should be doing things
that we wouldn't do with another adult.

Speaker 2 (08:37):
You shouldn't be using your power. You shouldn't be using
your power against anyone peer.

Speaker 3 (08:43):
Don't you think it's a natural animal instinct that when
you have some power, you use it.

Speaker 4 (08:51):
The question is how.

Speaker 3 (08:55):
Are we using it. There are things that we say
about children to children, and a tone of voice that
we use sometimes I would never do with an adult.
If you would not speak to another adult that way,
please don't do it with the children. It's just it's
not right to wield our power that way, right, you know,

(09:18):
in order for children to learn what we said on
the last episode, which was moral development, in order for
them to develop good in good ways and their moral development,
they have to have seen it modeled. They have to
have witnessed it.

Speaker 2 (09:33):
Yes, No, well, and I think when you start calling
them names in front of them, right, it becomes their
internal dialogue like oh, I'm the worrier, Oh I'm the
bad one, or I'm the runner, you know, And now
they're like, well, I'll just fulfill that prophecy. Then that's
what I'll be. And that's what they think they are,
and they think they can't change it.

Speaker 3 (09:54):
That's true, you know. I think we have to be
aware when we are doing this, when we are treating
children with less respect than we would treat any adult
right or less caution. I don't want to call it fear.
There are certain adults that I am more cautious with

(10:14):
than others because I've learned about them that they may
be sensitive people. They maybe don't have the same sense
of humor that I do, and so if I say
something that I think is funny, they're going to find
it insulting or offensive in some way, you know.

Speaker 4 (10:32):
I think we need to.

Speaker 3 (10:34):
To realize that we do this too frequently with children.
And no, they are not the hitter, the bi or
the pusher, the runner, the climber climber. They are I
believe young children are always doing their best in the situation,

(10:57):
and sometimes their best isn't what we want to see,
but that's their best right now. The question for us is,
especially when we know the child knows this isn't acceptable behavior,
why in this moment is this the child's best? What
has happened that this is the maximum amount of logic

(11:17):
and behavior and cause and effect that this child can
exhibit to me? Right? What has happened to cause this
to be the top? I think instead of looking at
this is just this behavior today child is abysmal. Instead
of looking at that, we need to say, this is
the child's best behavior today?

Speaker 4 (11:36):
Why is that?

Speaker 3 (11:37):
I like? Okay?

Speaker 2 (11:38):
So, like as an adult, when I see I work
with other adults, I'm like, oh, they're just having a
bad day, do you know?

Speaker 4 (11:46):
No, I don't talk to people.

Speaker 2 (11:48):
But most times when it's an adult, people are like
they're having a bad day. Like if you see somebody
like yelling or whatever, You're like, wow, they're having a
bad day. But when it comes to kids, I'm never
like they're having a bad day today, like maybe this
is if this is their best today, why.

Speaker 3 (12:05):
And why can't I turn their day around somehow?

Speaker 1 (12:07):
Right?

Speaker 3 (12:07):
It's a good day.

Speaker 4 (12:09):
Instead it's just like, eh.

Speaker 2 (12:11):
He's a biter, you know, And there is no even
trying to get him to have a good day.

Speaker 3 (12:16):
There's no trying to get them to do better.

Speaker 4 (12:18):
It's just like that's who they are.

Speaker 3 (12:20):
Why, it's not who they are, But that's what people
are saying, right, that's what they when you label somebody,
when you give them a label like that, it sticks.
When I think about the word label, I think about
how many families are afraid of having their children evaluated
for services because they're afraid of the label. And part
of that fear of the label comes from our own systems,

(12:43):
because they know we label people and we can't.

Speaker 4 (12:46):
We can't do it.

Speaker 3 (12:47):
You're not one thing. No human being is one thing.
These children are not one thing.

Speaker 4 (12:51):
It's just in front of every single person.

Speaker 2 (12:53):
Like I'm not the same with my family as I
am with Cindy. Okay, I'm not the same at work
as I'm necessarily with Cindy.

Speaker 4 (12:59):
Like I'm I'm a different person everywhere I go.

Speaker 3 (13:02):
And the children are not just one thing. They are
not just a runner. This child has gifts and talents
and we have to tap into all that. You know.
I hope that maybe we will leave the title the
way it was. I hope you will think about the
name calling, the labeling, the tone of voice, the approach,

(13:25):
the facial expressions, the gestures, and the things that we do,
either as families or educators in our interactions with children
simply because we're bigger and taller and we have more
power in the space. You know, it's not okay to
do that. I remember teaching when I was a director.
I remember teaching members, especially new members of the staff,

(13:49):
that when a child does something and you need to
talk to them about you need to get down to
their level. Don't tower over them, right, And that's the
sort of a newbie mistake, the towering over them. Always say,
don't tower over them. You can have a much more
productive conversation with these children about their behavior when you
get down to their level. And if you've spent any
time working with young children, you learn that I need

(14:10):
to get down to their level. I need to sit
in the tiny little chair and be sort of a
face to face level with them rather than standing over them,
because standing over them is very intimidating. Like imagine if
you were in a room you did something wrong, which
we all do things wrong. You did something wrong, and
then this giant human being comes in and towers over

(14:32):
you and talks in a loud, deep voice to you.
It would be very scary and intimidating. Yes, right, So
we don't want to intimidate the children that way either, right,
because you want to.

Speaker 2 (14:44):
Have a good, solid discussion about what's going on. When
you're towering and intimidating, they're just going to agree with
anything you say. Just to get them out of your face, right,
just to get out of your out there. I think me,
that's what. Okay, whatever you need, Yeah, like I don't
want you buy me anymore. Right, So if you want
to actually have a discussion to make things better, to

(15:04):
help this child, then you need to be on their level.

Speaker 3 (15:07):
And I think towering over children and intimid towering over them.
Let's let's like sort of keep that image right. It's
not only physical, it's also auditory tone of voice. It's
we tower over children in so many ways, which in
an emergency situation you have to do. Right, if it

(15:28):
is not an emergency, we really need to be more
mindful of it. I think I would love to have
like a month of my work go by with no
one saying things like the climber, the bite or the runner.

Speaker 2 (15:41):
I wonder if you could start keeping track.

Speaker 3 (15:43):
I should start keeping track, and I could start keeping track,
and I could let you all know what was my
longest streak, like log on the website, Yeah, what was
my longest streak? Goodness? All right, folks, We're gonna let
you go ponder that, not only about the children you
work with, because you may know all this, and you

(16:04):
may be thinking, yes, I do all this, doesn't everybody
or I know this, or I act in the right way,
not only for that, but just reflect, Just sit and
reflect and think about your own childhood. How did it
make you feel when people were name calling, towering over
and doing all those things. How did it make you feel?
Because I know, thinking about that helps me to realize

(16:27):
this is not something I want to do, not how
I want to be as a parent or a teacher. Right, Okay, folks,
We're gonna let you go think about that and we
will catch you next time on the podcast.

Speaker 4 (16:40):
Bye peeps.
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