September 11, 2025 • 32 mins
One of my favorite short story books by one of my favorite authors James Gregory, I get to talk about it with him! take a listen.
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
You guys, welcome to another edition in between the pages
of James lo Junior. I'm James Jr. J J Media
and we go in between the pages as you know
on this show. And I've had some great guests come
on and sometimes they write other books so I can
bring them back. And he's one of my favorites. And
this is like a third time doing this because he
just writes these great books. And this book I have
(00:23):
been telling my friends who can hear it is? It
is scary, it is timely. It is like we all
fear and it, but it's so good. It's called killer App.
We're gonna talk about this because you know, it has
to deal with the artificial intelligence kid, that little thing
that's going around right now. But this guy also we
(00:45):
share a first name, so it just always works for me.
But it's called killer App. You see behind if you're watching,
it's behind me. If you're listening, you can see it online. Uh,
Doctor James R.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
Gregory, Hi, Hey James, good to see you again. It's
always fun.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
Yeah, I good to see you. We always have a
good time. First of all, how you do it today?
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Are you doing extremely well?
Speaker 1 (01:07):
I see you? You have light like it's coming in.
That light is coming in. You're very well lit right now.
I love it. Okay, So with this book, like like
the other books, these books aren't super They're not like
five hundred pages or anything. They're a nice read. You
can just take you go on a plane, on a train,
on a bus or whatever I say, at the beach
or laying pool side whatever. This is a good book.
(01:30):
It's a good length, and you tell a really great story. Well,
two stories is two stories. This one not just killer
app there's also one called Artifacts about that too in
a sec. But congratulations on the book. We love we
love it, Thank you, James. Now, AI is this huge
(01:50):
thing right now. I mean there's all kinds of stuff
me and talked about when it comes to this. So
do you have this story in your head before AI
got big? That sounds about how the story kind came
to you.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
I've been hearing about AI for years. I mean, you
know and and and like most things that you you
know that come along new technology, you hear about them,
you think that they're going to change the world, and
they don't really change the world. Uh, this AI is
changing the world and in some ways for the better.
(02:27):
In some ways, not so much for the better. And uh,
it's a matter of thinking of it as a tool,
you know, not not letting it take over your life.
But like computers, you know. But I was in the
business world before computers, you know, and and I had
to adapt and learn how to do that. It changed
my world. I used to be a graphic designer using
(02:50):
magic markers and T squares, uh, and I feel much
more comfortable in that environment than I do working on
graphic design on computers. So it's a matter of learning
a new system. It's a matter of understanding it. But
ultimately it's it's just a tool. It's a tool for
us to use. There are some scary parts of it though,
(03:11):
I mean there's no doubt at all. You know, Microsoft
just laid off ten thousand people.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
Why did they do that?
Speaker 2 (03:21):
Because AI can do those functions. That's a scary thought.
And it's not just not just Microsoft, but a lot
of these majors technology companies are doing the same thing.
So it's we're at a crossroads here.
Speaker 1 (03:37):
Are well we are and in You're right in some
cases it's helping us do some great things. In other ways,
it's like, but you know, Groy Paynes roast burts. They
always hurt my kids that they always hurt, always hurt.
You have to get new shoes and they hurt your
feet hurt for a while, but that's kind of what
happens until you can walk again. And I think for me,
(04:00):
you know, I was a Ray Bradberry fan Isaac Asimov fan,
So you know where I'm going with this. Obviously, I
robot and you know all these things. I read these
sides fiction stories when I was a kid. But the
future is gonna be like some things are kind of
like that now actually for real, but they're always kind
of scary and and the and the endings were always
(04:21):
the greatest. And so I remember reading those stories. It
reminded me. When I was reading your story, it reminded
me of that. And in fact that so it's a
journalist who gets an app. He literally gets an APP
that just sounds so benign, and it's like, okay, either
way you named, I would tell you this is the
This makes me laugh the way you name the app
(04:42):
because stands for a I M E obviously has official
intelligence and the and the M E part is what
it was really funny. And I thought I wrote.
Speaker 2 (04:51):
Down made easy. Beneficial intelligence made easy Bay.
Speaker 1 (04:57):
For Real, Like that sounds like someone would do that,
right As a person myself who was in the media,
I was like, you picked a journalist. I thought it's
kind of funny there too, because that's an affect. It's
affecting us already. So I thought both those things. That
was fun. So coming up with the name, we do
you know, as you know, we go in between the
pages coming up with the name of the app. How
(05:19):
easy or hard was that? Oh?
Speaker 2 (05:21):
That was easy? That was I just tried to simplify
it and what are we trying to do here? And
and artificial intelligence made easy Amy for Short, perfect and again.
And it had to be a female name because I
wanted I wanted the female antagonist to be well, I
wanted her to be a female and kind of on
(05:43):
the youngish side with her voice. Uh. So she was
a contemporary of Bryce, the protagonist in the in the story.
And and they then the give and take is almost
like a girlfriend boyfriend, uh in some instances it's it's
a it's an interesting uh dynamic between the two of them.
Speaker 1 (06:08):
I was told the other day after I read your book.
I was told the other day in a whole other setting.
If you use chat GPT, which is the big thing
about it's using right now that you should talk to
it like a person, so it'll do more. It'll get
to know you in quotes and do and when you
(06:29):
do what we call prompts folks at home and another
tew prompts, it will get better and better. Right reading
this book and what Bryce goes to because at first
everything seems great, uh, and then it turns you're right.
It's the relationship is at the heart of the story.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
Yes, yes, And she, she with no ill intention at all,
interferes with his life.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
Right.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
She has access to all of his information. He doesn't
realize that. But everything that's electronic, that's in his computer,
that it's on his phone is hers to, you know,
to examine and to think about. And she draws these conclusions.
But part of her purpose is to improve his life,
and she's going to do it whether he wants to,
(07:20):
wants that to happen or not. And he cannot slow
her down. He cannot stop her, He cannot slow her down.
He can't reason with her. She said, you know, like
what this is not improving your life? Well yeah, well
technically yes, but you're messing it up too, you know.
And she's and he tries and he tries to create
(07:42):
barriers borders and and help her with that, and she
that she doesn't understand. She does not understand the barriers.
Because all this information is out there and I can
improve your life. I'm going to use it and help
you whether you want it or not. And that's that's
There are a lot of subplots in this book.
Speaker 1 (08:04):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
And and that's one of them, you know, is if
you could help somebody's life, whether they wanted it or not,
would you do it? And how would you do it?
And and and she is doing it so much fun.
Speaker 1 (08:17):
So much fun, don't stop, thinks I want to talk
that That is a subplot. And so that's the my thing.
My question was when I was reading that there's all
this information out there. It's like, I'm a former nurse.
I know a lot of stuff. If I if something,
if a diagnosis comes in in front of me of something,
it could be twenty different things. If I was an app,
(08:40):
if I was AI, well, if I just chose one
of them and said it must be this, and when
that pathn was wrong, that's reading, your reading, your book.
When you think about that, it's AI has all this information,
but it's not personal, it's not personal. Lies. They think
they're being personalized, but we're not there yet. Yeah, you're
(09:02):
improving his life, yes, by proxy, but you're not asking him,
you're not including him, you're not talking to him about
what he exactly he wants. That's a subplot. All this
information out there is a case discern per person right visually?
Speaker 2 (09:22):
Right?
Speaker 1 (09:22):
Is that fascinating? I mean that's a yeah, it is.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
It is fascinating. And you know, first of all, man
versus Machine has been a major thing hanging over us
for decades. You go back to two thousand and one
Space Odyssey, that was a man versus machine that was
one of the first ones that really started waking people up.
And I think that's why it's held its popularity for
(09:47):
so many years. In another another movie, X Mechana that
where the robot has, you know, starting to have awareness
of not just what the creator put into her, but
beyond that. And that's that's a that's a point in
(10:08):
this book. That's another subplot where the creators are actually
his mother and father, and you know how that I
might have just given something away so.
Speaker 1 (10:20):
Oh, well, you'll say when it happens, you find out,
so you'll just you'll have to read the book and
you'll find out.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
Yes, yes, But but so that subplot is fascinating in itself.
And and and this man versus machine? Uh what who?
Speaker 1 (10:38):
What?
Speaker 2 (10:38):
Who are behind this this machine? And what are their motivations?
What are they trying to do? And and do they
have more control over than the person who purchased the
machine and is trying to to use it for for themselves.
It's a it's a complex issue and uh, I really
(11:00):
had a lot of fun with it. It's it's an
interesting it's an interesting concept.
Speaker 1 (11:06):
Yeah, because I you know, there was a show called
West World, which I loved. My father was the same.
You know, yeah, man versus machine machine. But even back
in the day, I mean I always say, always people
for the younger folks always say I'm a lud eede
someone like I have a hard time didn't even know
what that comes from. And that we're talking back to,
like Turner said, we're going back to like electricity versus
(11:26):
like it's it's we've always had this. You we grow,
we discover right, and then emotionally we have to catch up.
I always feel that way. We get that because I
like you when I when I when I got when
I entered the workforce, it was the eighties, and and
when I hited work force, I knew how to write shorthand.
(11:47):
I had to go to school and how to write shorthand. Okay, James,
I want to high five. Okay I do I do that?
And so you know, I I was a cartographer. I
took my making mac reading classes like those are things
that were important back then. Microfiche, you know, like I
mean I was like it was like xerox copy, like
(12:08):
that was exactly what was before. I mean, my first
computer wasn't until maybe the mid nineties into late nineties. Job.
So I'm saying it's it's i'me in the world before
it and when it first happened, like what is going
on here? I could do? What? And how it always
is kind of strange and new and then emotionally kind
of catch up to it. It goes so fast. The
(12:31):
last what forty years have gone really fast. We just
we just have gone so far. Yeah like that right.
Speaker 2 (12:38):
Yeah, right, Fax machines another one. Yeah, before our Fax machines,
we use dex machines which would which had were these
cylinders that would burn the paper and if you use
if you sent one letter, that would smell up the
room for a week.
Speaker 1 (12:59):
Yeah, I love it. I do. I remember adopt matrix
printers and that almost cussed and line that stuff up
and then it printed us. It was like what I mean,
I remember my first computer. Well, my first computer was
like two megabytes on it or whatever. It's like just
thinking now I got a lie, like it's just it's
it's I just feel like it's we just we we
(13:19):
moved so fast and this book to get it back
to the book, This book kind of brings that up.
Also how fast we are going? And that candies, can
this artificial intelligence really take over your life? Like you said,
it's not being malicious, it's not. It's it's what she
was she in this case was she? But it's not
(13:40):
being malicious, it's not trying to ruin you. It thinks
it's serving you.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
Right, Well, we address yes, and that's correct, and it's
supposed to be serving you, and it does if you
think the way it thinks, right, and if you give
it specific direction versus you know, don't do this. Well,
I'm going to do it because that's part of my directive.
But but there we deal in this book with issues
(14:08):
like privacy, job displacement, biases, accountability, deception. They're all in there,
and each one we deal with it as a practical
problem that that was faced and overcome. How did how
did she and she and Bryce to his credit, how
did they overcome this in working together when they had
(14:29):
to work together? How did they overcome it? And another
funny thing you said, the humanity of it. Uh, you know,
they treat you better if you if you're nicer to them.
Since I've written this book, I'm always thanking Siri. She yeah,
(14:49):
you know, she does something for me. I thank you, Siri,
And it drives my wife raised.
Speaker 1 (14:58):
I talked to it could be nic to the robots.
I'd being nice to that because here in La we
have now we have little robots that go through with food,
food delivery, and they have nay yeah, like you have
na hi Marvin and looks up this little fake eye
looks at me and I go, okay, you go go
ahead and it goes. I'd be nice to that. I'm
(15:19):
get in trouble when the revolution happens. I'm gonna be
hold onto the the robots. But there's all these you know,
we have to waim those cars with no drivers now
out here, and it's really weird. It's like, so it's
starting to happen in LA. They're already happening in San Francisco.
Way try everything of course up there, but here in
LA is starting to become there's just one robot that
(15:39):
walks the streets. He talks to people. It's just it's
kind of it's a trip, like we're not we're not
the Jetsons, but we're getting there. Like we're like, we're like,
it's kind of we're getting there.
Speaker 2 (15:48):
Well, the whole the whole thing back in the fifties,
when this whole system started, this whole evaluation that the
challenge was can we make machines more like people? And
the whole test of that is the Turing test. And
the Turing test is is how close to people, you know,
the people the way a human would react is the machine?
(16:13):
You know, can we get a machine that does it
acts like a human. And we're getting awfully close, afully
close photographs, are there some speech? I mean, they they're
willing to do, uh, you know, entire books on with
(16:33):
a it's a computer voice, but it's not doesn't sound
like a computer. You know, it's there, the sounds real.
In fact, I want them to sound more like a
computer for Killer app.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
Right, you're right, they're starting to massage the voices. They're
starting to make them. If you think you can go, okay,
this is obviously AI voice talking. But now there's one
called Leven Labs that does a thing where you can
I want a Scottish that sounds deep and it's close.
It's not there all the way close, and you're okay,
(17:06):
it sound as robotic, or it sound as just bland
or whatever that you're okay. It's the nations are getting better.
The inflections are getting better. Absolutely, they're they're they're they're
gonna get there. Don't worry the going they're gonna they're
gonna get there at some point. But you're right, and
so we kill her out, yes, especially because I mean so,
(17:29):
I mean, so this guy Bryce goes through it in
this book, and he goes through its. You put him
through the wringer with her, but.
Speaker 2 (17:36):
It comes out at a good spot, you know. I mean,
I try to in my books. I try to have
an uplifting ending. And uh and and it works if
everybody is satisfied at the end, even even Amy.
Speaker 1 (17:53):
Yeah, I just love that. That's hilarious. All Right, what
has been? So we'll get to artifacts and a second,
But what what has been some of the comments you've
gotten people who read the book?
Speaker 2 (18:05):
Uh, you know there there there are more many are
more nervous now than before they read the book because
I brought up so many issues. But others, others are saying, it's.
Speaker 1 (18:16):
Just a tool. It's just a tool.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
So that's that's something that I used heavily in this.
You know, you think of it as a tool and
don't think of it as somebody who's trying to kill you, you know,
or take over your life or make your life miserable.
And uh so it's a you know, it's a reasonable
beginning and and the the middle is pretty intense.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
It is and I just I just I just want
to people because it's because it's such a timely thing.
But then you do a story that has another kind
of so there's a two line between both stories. We'll
get to We'll get to that too. In my opinion
is stories there are a little about artifacts because I've
I've actually, I written a book about a young archaeologist
(19:05):
who meets an older one, and I did The Years
Put a couple years ago, and people like it. People
were like, I'm all right, I'm not saying a book
on it, but I'm I'm fascinated with artifacts too. So
I was like, oh, me and James gonna thing in
common because I feel like there's power and energy and everything,
so it why not be why have powered energy and
the artifact of some sort or some kind of things
(19:27):
in the past. So your second story, you have an archaeologist,
I love you. I love these names. Steve Stackhouse, I
love that name, and his wife Nancy, and so there's
there's there's a there's a bunch that's see what you
doing really well in these stories and all your stories
that I've read of yours because they were because they're
they're they're no vellains. They're not like this huge being
tied giant five and a page novels you get, you
(19:49):
pack a lot mhm.
Speaker 2 (19:51):
And thank you. I aim to do that.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
You do, so you do. There's sometimes there's several things
going on at once. Yes, scene is layered with several
things going on. And this one especially because we have
the past, the presence, the relationship with your husband and wife.
Here's the relationship to you are so talk about that book,
(20:16):
I mean that story on how and how that came
to you.
Speaker 2 (20:19):
Sure so, So just to so you're viewers know, this
is Killer App which we've been talking about, and Artifacts
is inside and it's and it's about a quarter of
the size of Killer App. But it's a full read.
It's a it's not a it's not a short, it's
not a partial story. It's a full a full story. Yes,
(20:42):
and Artifacts. Uh, my wife and I actually are archaeologist
in the in the in the in the way that
we're aspiring archaeologists. So we've been studying archaeology for for
years and we belonged to the Virginia Archaeological Association and
(21:04):
we go out on digs with them and that sort
of thing. My knees won't hold up any longer my heart,
but my heart's in it.
Speaker 1 (21:14):
And so.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
I love archaeology. And every time you make a discovery,
every time you find an artifact, there's a connection to
the person who lost that artifact. And I can't explain it,
but I absolutely love it. I found a little piece
of a teacup one time on an archaeological dig, and
I thought it would have no impact at all, but
(21:41):
the supervisor looked at it and said, oh my god,
that's a scratch blue teacup that identifies this foundation as
being built in seventeen thirty or something like that. And
it made a difference. It made a difference. This thing was,
you know, a half inch long and a quarter inch wide,
(22:01):
and it made a difference. And I connected with that
piece of artifact. Now I don't use that example in
the story, but I use other other examples of artifacts
that are lost and then when they're found by the archaeologist,
there's a new connection being made, and that connection is
with the person who lost it. And so it's a
(22:22):
real it's a you know, almost a sci Fi type
of connection, you know, or Twilight Zone type of connection.
And and I just looked enjoyed writing about it. I
enjoyed describing that connection. And I then I couldn't figure
out how I was going to resolve it, you know,
(22:44):
and and and I resolved it in a pretty pretty
convincing way. I think, you know, he meets a real
famous person in the past, and and then he gets
stuck in there in their life, in their time period,
(23:07):
and I thought, man, I could write, I could write
a whole book just on that. But I decided to
bring him back safely because I needed to. I needed
I had a deadline. But but it's it does leave
you satisfied, you know, the ending does leave you. Oh wow,
that's pretty cool type of ending.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
It's kind of it's he's meeting you. It's in the past. Yes,
that's so. It's kind of a mystical thing. Kind of
it's not magic, but it's like mystical kind of like yeah, worldly, Uh,
he's being taught to you. So I think that was
a fun part. I didn't expect that at all, if
(23:51):
I'm bid. But I mean so because you guys, in
real life, you're into this archologic stuff. So when you
advise the story, did you know where it was going
to go? Because it's you said, you pack a lot
of stuff in there. You could have went different directions, right,
you could have.
Speaker 2 (24:09):
I when I start writing a novel, I do not
create the ending at the beginning. I do not know
where the novel will go. If I have a good
idea that keeps me interested in wanting to write more,
that's what I continue to work on. So I have
lots of threads out there that have gone nowhere. But
(24:30):
when I like one and I pursue it, I pursue
it to the end, which in which case I didn't
have an ending planned for any of these. The endings
happen naturally as as they as they come to my mind.
Sometimes it's a very clear process. Sometimes it's muddled. Sometimes
(24:53):
it takes me a while to come up with the ending.
But I I won't write an end thing just to finish,
just to meet a deadline or or finish it. I
really wanted to be satisfying, and that one, that one worked.
Speaker 1 (25:10):
That ending worked when and when? How do you know?
It was one of those hard things for any author.
But it's how do you know? When it's the end?
Speaker 2 (25:19):
It it happens. It just becomes very clear to me.
I've I've I've written it. There's nothing else to add this.
It works well, it ends well, it's satisfying. It's got
to meet those that criteria, and then I say, this
is it. It's it's done. If I have another idea later,
(25:40):
I could write an epilogue or something of that nature.
And I usually most of my books have an epilogue
in them.
Speaker 1 (25:48):
Yeah, okay, it's just because I know that's what a
lot of writers. As you say, I don't end the book,
I would say, I go, well, hopefully if you're if
you're writing it and it has all these opportunities in it,
then there's several endings you can write, and then you just,
sure Jesus, choose one that's to your liking. Obviously. Yeah,
that's the hope what you're writing. I mean, right, I
(26:09):
mean writings journey. I love because writing is very immersive.
It's very it's very self. As you're writing a book,
you just see your you know, you create a whole canvas.
It's is blank.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
It's very much like painting.
Speaker 1 (26:20):
Yeah very much. Yeah, yes, very much. And also as
you fill the canvas, then new layers emerge. Also, almost
every word, every scene adds something new, so you're like, oh, okay,
I didn't think about this before. I love I love that.
I love that process. I love that process.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
I do too. I love that process. It's a fun process.
I don't mind doing a second and third uh edit
of my books because I'm refining that process. I'm making
it work, from seeing to scene to scene, just like
you would on a painting. You know, you don't mind
going back to it and seeing, oh, it needs something here,
(27:01):
you know a little bit more So, I love the process.
I I love writing. I hate marketing.
Speaker 1 (27:09):
Of course.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
I worked my life in marketing, and I find it
hard to write my own marketing book. You know stuff.
I just don't want to do it anymore.
Speaker 1 (27:20):
I think I've asked you. I think ever asked you
a question. Have you ever while writing a book when
I say you're halfway through or halfway through the book, well,
you wrote something that surprised you and changed the whole
direction of the book. Does that happened to you?
Speaker 2 (27:35):
Yes? Yes, I can't think of a specific example, but
that absolutely happens. Killer rapp It happened.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
Uh uh.
Speaker 2 (27:47):
You know, as I got to know the character. Because
I don't know the character, I'm learning about the character,
and the character does things that might surprise me and
I and I so I just I'll listen to that.
And I was say, Okay, let's let's go in that direction.
And that happens a lot. And that's that's the fun
part of writing without an outline. I don't know, I'm
(28:09):
not a slave to to an outline. Whatever I want
to do, well.
Speaker 1 (28:14):
That's all point. You're you're creating. So it's like for
some folks basically to an outline. That's great to them.
But the whole point is you can do whatever you want.
You're creating the world you want. You can create whatever.
There's no restraints. And I think all the writers who
watch my show and that's how we encourage you. That's
the whole point is that you are right because it's open,
(28:35):
it's vast, it's whatever you want it to be, and
you can change your mind anytime you once you also, uh,
you can take the left, turn the right, turn down
the middle. You can do whatever you want. That's kind
of the like I always say, don't censor yourself, just
like let it take you right. Absolutely, you know. That's
that's the best thing about being the writer. Well, these
(28:57):
stories are good, James, and I just I again, you
know I love your writing. Wet to show three times now,
I just I just admire how you you go in
You create these worlds that have multiple worlds within them.
Speaker 2 (29:11):
So thank you, Yeah you bet, And I got a
couple more coming down the road. Ghost Town is one
that's in in the can and at the publisher.
Speaker 1 (29:22):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (29:23):
And another one that I'm currently actually writing right now
is Undercurrent. That's going to be a very powerful one.
This first time I step into politics at all, but
but not to not from a point of view, but
describing an issue that we should have addressed long ago.
So that one's going to be pretty interesting as well.
Speaker 1 (29:44):
I want both. Yeah, we'll be back, both back. Thank
you James for being on the show. Thanks for Killer
Apple is good. You can, folks, You just get on
your phone, your tablet, Just get on there, go to Amazon,
get the book. I'm telling you, get it. You have
to leave your house, so you're just get it. Making
(30:05):
it easy for you. Tell where they can find you
in all your goodness, James Gregory.
Speaker 2 (30:12):
Thank you, Thank you, sir, tell us so much.
Speaker 1 (30:14):
Appreciate it. Where they can find you, also how they
can find me.
Speaker 2 (30:18):
My website is James R. Gregory Hyphenbooks dot com James R. Gregory,
hyphen Books dot com. And I would love to hear
from people. I mean, you know, I'll respond to anything. Yes,
well I missed anything.
Speaker 1 (30:35):
You say that, folks, Uh, but yes, and of course
I'm James ENGINR. And James j l J Media and
created us on Facebook. The book outs about earlier to
him is called Themanthean the Streets. Uh, it's a it's
a mystery. I had fun writing and it came to
me in a dream. The title came from a friend
of mine and then it came to me to dream.
(30:56):
So I was like, Okay, I guys, I'm writing a
book too. I'm writing ak to It's been really good.
You get an Amazon also where you find fine books.
As always in my shows, I'm a giant advocate for
writers and reading. Books aren't going nowhere. Books are here, don't.
I don't know what you've heard. People are reading in
record numbers. And when I say reading, it could be audible,
(31:18):
it could be kindle pair it back hard, but it
does not matter. I know so many folks who are
reading and so many folks who are writing books. Supports
indie writers as long as once you support the big ones.
And also we don't ban books either. I'm a big
component of not banning books. I think anybody should have
a right to get any books they want, they have
access to for any reason, and books like this, all
(31:39):
these kind of books, mysteries and all it should be
out there for folks to read. It's a big proponent
of I just think when you read, you go to
other worlds, you get to travel, and it helps your mind.
I mean telling you it really does. And for young writers,
I want to push them to write stories that are wonderful,
write the stories they want to see, write the stories
they want to be. I think against me to support
(32:00):
that's an art form. It really is an art form.
So I that's my always my spell. At the end,
we love books here. We do. We love books and
writers here. And we'll talk to you guys next time.
Every Thursday we have new episodes. See then.
You guys, welcome to another edition in between the pages
of James lo Junior. I'm James Jr. J J Media
and we go in between the pages as you know
on this show. And I've had some great guests come
on and sometimes they write other books so I can
bring them back. And he's one of my favorites. And
this is like a third time doing this because he
just writes these great books. And this book I have
(00:23):
been telling my friends who can hear it is? It
is scary, it is timely. It is like we all
fear and it, but it's so good. It's called killer App.
We're gonna talk about this because you know, it has
to deal with the artificial intelligence kid, that little thing
that's going around right now. But this guy also we
(00:45):
share a first name, so it just always works for me.
But it's called killer App. You see behind if you're watching,
it's behind me. If you're listening, you can see it online. Uh,
Doctor James R.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
Gregory, Hi, Hey James, good to see you again. It's
always fun.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
Yeah, I good to see you. We always have a
good time. First of all, how you do it today?
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Are you doing extremely well?
Speaker 1 (01:07):
I see you? You have light like it's coming in.
That light is coming in. You're very well lit right now.
I love it. Okay, So with this book, like like
the other books, these books aren't super They're not like
five hundred pages or anything. They're a nice read. You
can just take you go on a plane, on a train,
on a bus or whatever I say, at the beach
or laying pool side whatever. This is a good book.
(01:30):
It's a good length, and you tell a really great story. Well,
two stories is two stories. This one not just killer
app there's also one called Artifacts about that too in
a sec. But congratulations on the book. We love we
love it, Thank you, James. Now, AI is this huge
(01:50):
thing right now. I mean there's all kinds of stuff
me and talked about when it comes to this. So
do you have this story in your head before AI
got big? That sounds about how the story kind came
to you.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
I've been hearing about AI for years. I mean, you
know and and and like most things that you you
know that come along new technology, you hear about them,
you think that they're going to change the world, and
they don't really change the world. Uh, this AI is
changing the world and in some ways for the better.
(02:27):
In some ways, not so much for the better. And uh,
it's a matter of thinking of it as a tool,
you know, not not letting it take over your life.
But like computers, you know. But I was in the
business world before computers, you know, and and I had
to adapt and learn how to do that. It changed
my world. I used to be a graphic designer using
(02:50):
magic markers and T squares, uh, and I feel much
more comfortable in that environment than I do working on
graphic design on computers. So it's a matter of learning
a new system. It's a matter of understanding it. But
ultimately it's it's just a tool. It's a tool for
us to use. There are some scary parts of it though,
(03:11):
I mean there's no doubt at all. You know, Microsoft
just laid off ten thousand people.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
Why did they do that?
Speaker 2 (03:21):
Because AI can do those functions. That's a scary thought.
And it's not just not just Microsoft, but a lot
of these majors technology companies are doing the same thing.
So it's we're at a crossroads here.
Speaker 1 (03:37):
Are well we are and in You're right in some
cases it's helping us do some great things. In other ways,
it's like, but you know, Groy Paynes roast burts. They
always hurt my kids that they always hurt, always hurt.
You have to get new shoes and they hurt your
feet hurt for a while, but that's kind of what
happens until you can walk again. And I think for me,
(04:00):
you know, I was a Ray Bradberry fan Isaac Asimov fan,
So you know where I'm going with this. Obviously, I
robot and you know all these things. I read these
sides fiction stories when I was a kid. But the
future is gonna be like some things are kind of
like that now actually for real, but they're always kind
of scary and and the and the endings were always
(04:21):
the greatest. And so I remember reading those stories. It
reminded me. When I was reading your story, it reminded
me of that. And in fact that so it's a
journalist who gets an app. He literally gets an APP
that just sounds so benign, and it's like, okay, either
way you named, I would tell you this is the
This makes me laugh the way you name the app
(04:42):
because stands for a I M E obviously has official
intelligence and the and the M E part is what
it was really funny. And I thought I wrote.
Speaker 2 (04:51):
Down made easy. Beneficial intelligence made easy Bay.
Speaker 1 (04:57):
For Real, Like that sounds like someone would do that,
right As a person myself who was in the media,
I was like, you picked a journalist. I thought it's
kind of funny there too, because that's an affect. It's
affecting us already. So I thought both those things. That
was fun. So coming up with the name, we do
you know, as you know, we go in between the
pages coming up with the name of the app. How
(05:19):
easy or hard was that? Oh?
Speaker 2 (05:21):
That was easy? That was I just tried to simplify
it and what are we trying to do here? And
and artificial intelligence made easy Amy for Short, perfect and again.
And it had to be a female name because I
wanted I wanted the female antagonist to be well, I
wanted her to be a female and kind of on
(05:43):
the youngish side with her voice. Uh. So she was
a contemporary of Bryce, the protagonist in the in the story.
And and they then the give and take is almost
like a girlfriend boyfriend, uh in some instances it's it's
a it's an interesting uh dynamic between the two of them.
Speaker 1 (06:08):
I was told the other day after I read your book.
I was told the other day in a whole other setting.
If you use chat GPT, which is the big thing
about it's using right now that you should talk to
it like a person, so it'll do more. It'll get
to know you in quotes and do and when you
(06:29):
do what we call prompts folks at home and another
tew prompts, it will get better and better. Right reading
this book and what Bryce goes to because at first
everything seems great, uh, and then it turns you're right.
It's the relationship is at the heart of the story.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
Yes, yes, And she, she with no ill intention at all,
interferes with his life.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
Right.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
She has access to all of his information. He doesn't
realize that. But everything that's electronic, that's in his computer,
that it's on his phone is hers to, you know,
to examine and to think about. And she draws these conclusions.
But part of her purpose is to improve his life,
and she's going to do it whether he wants to,
(07:20):
wants that to happen or not. And he cannot slow
her down. He cannot stop her, He cannot slow her down.
He can't reason with her. She said, you know, like
what this is not improving your life? Well yeah, well
technically yes, but you're messing it up too, you know.
And she's and he tries and he tries to create
(07:42):
barriers borders and and help her with that, and she
that she doesn't understand. She does not understand the barriers.
Because all this information is out there and I can
improve your life. I'm going to use it and help
you whether you want it or not. And that's that's
There are a lot of subplots in this book.
Speaker 1 (08:04):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
And and that's one of them, you know, is if
you could help somebody's life, whether they wanted it or not,
would you do it? And how would you do it?
And and and she is doing it so much fun.
Speaker 1 (08:17):
So much fun, don't stop, thinks I want to talk
that That is a subplot. And so that's the my thing.
My question was when I was reading that there's all
this information out there. It's like, I'm a former nurse.
I know a lot of stuff. If I if something,
if a diagnosis comes in in front of me of something,
it could be twenty different things. If I was an app,
(08:40):
if I was AI, well, if I just chose one
of them and said it must be this, and when
that pathn was wrong, that's reading, your reading, your book.
When you think about that, it's AI has all this information,
but it's not personal, it's not personal. Lies. They think
they're being personalized, but we're not there yet. Yeah, you're
(09:02):
improving his life, yes, by proxy, but you're not asking him,
you're not including him, you're not talking to him about
what he exactly he wants. That's a subplot. All this
information out there is a case discern per person right visually?
Speaker 2 (09:22):
Right?
Speaker 1 (09:22):
Is that fascinating? I mean that's a yeah, it is.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
It is fascinating. And you know, first of all, man
versus Machine has been a major thing hanging over us
for decades. You go back to two thousand and one
Space Odyssey, that was a man versus machine that was
one of the first ones that really started waking people up.
And I think that's why it's held its popularity for
(09:47):
so many years. In another another movie, X Mechana that
where the robot has, you know, starting to have awareness
of not just what the creator put into her, but
beyond that. And that's that's a that's a point in
(10:08):
this book. That's another subplot where the creators are actually
his mother and father, and you know how that I
might have just given something away so.
Speaker 1 (10:20):
Oh, well, you'll say when it happens, you find out,
so you'll just you'll have to read the book and
you'll find out.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
Yes, yes, But but so that subplot is fascinating in itself.
And and and this man versus machine? Uh what who?
Speaker 1 (10:38):
What?
Speaker 2 (10:38):
Who are behind this this machine? And what are their motivations?
What are they trying to do? And and do they
have more control over than the person who purchased the
machine and is trying to to use it for for themselves.
It's a it's a complex issue and uh, I really
(11:00):
had a lot of fun with it. It's it's an
interesting it's an interesting concept.
Speaker 1 (11:06):
Yeah, because I you know, there was a show called
West World, which I loved. My father was the same.
You know, yeah, man versus machine machine. But even back
in the day, I mean I always say, always people
for the younger folks always say I'm a lud eede
someone like I have a hard time didn't even know
what that comes from. And that we're talking back to,
like Turner said, we're going back to like electricity versus
(11:26):
like it's it's we've always had this. You we grow,
we discover right, and then emotionally we have to catch up.
I always feel that way. We get that because I
like you when I when I when I got when
I entered the workforce, it was the eighties, and and
when I hited work force, I knew how to write shorthand.
(11:47):
I had to go to school and how to write shorthand. Okay, James,
I want to high five. Okay I do I do that?
And so you know, I I was a cartographer. I
took my making mac reading classes like those are things
that were important back then. Microfiche, you know, like I
mean I was like it was like xerox copy, like
(12:08):
that was exactly what was before. I mean, my first
computer wasn't until maybe the mid nineties into late nineties. Job.
So I'm saying it's it's i'me in the world before
it and when it first happened, like what is going
on here? I could do? What? And how it always
is kind of strange and new and then emotionally kind
of catch up to it. It goes so fast. The
(12:31):
last what forty years have gone really fast. We just
we just have gone so far. Yeah like that right.
Speaker 2 (12:38):
Yeah, right, Fax machines another one. Yeah, before our Fax machines,
we use dex machines which would which had were these
cylinders that would burn the paper and if you use
if you sent one letter, that would smell up the
room for a week.
Speaker 1 (12:59):
Yeah, I love it. I do. I remember adopt matrix
printers and that almost cussed and line that stuff up
and then it printed us. It was like what I mean,
I remember my first computer. Well, my first computer was
like two megabytes on it or whatever. It's like just
thinking now I got a lie, like it's just it's
it's I just feel like it's we just we we
(13:19):
moved so fast and this book to get it back
to the book, This book kind of brings that up.
Also how fast we are going? And that candies, can
this artificial intelligence really take over your life? Like you said,
it's not being malicious, it's not. It's it's what she
was she in this case was she? But it's not
(13:40):
being malicious, it's not trying to ruin you. It thinks
it's serving you.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
Right, Well, we address yes, and that's correct, and it's
supposed to be serving you, and it does if you
think the way it thinks, right, and if you give
it specific direction versus you know, don't do this. Well,
I'm going to do it because that's part of my directive.
But but there we deal in this book with issues
(14:08):
like privacy, job displacement, biases, accountability, deception. They're all in there,
and each one we deal with it as a practical
problem that that was faced and overcome. How did how
did she and she and Bryce to his credit, how
did they overcome this in working together when they had
(14:29):
to work together? How did they overcome it? And another
funny thing you said, the humanity of it. Uh, you know,
they treat you better if you if you're nicer to them.
Since I've written this book, I'm always thanking Siri. She yeah,
(14:49):
you know, she does something for me. I thank you, Siri,
And it drives my wife raised.
Speaker 1 (14:58):
I talked to it could be nic to the robots.
I'd being nice to that because here in La we
have now we have little robots that go through with food,
food delivery, and they have nay yeah, like you have
na hi Marvin and looks up this little fake eye
looks at me and I go, okay, you go go
ahead and it goes. I'd be nice to that. I'm
(15:19):
get in trouble when the revolution happens. I'm gonna be
hold onto the the robots. But there's all these you know,
we have to waim those cars with no drivers now
out here, and it's really weird. It's like, so it's
starting to happen in LA. They're already happening in San Francisco.
Way try everything of course up there, but here in
LA is starting to become there's just one robot that
(15:39):
walks the streets. He talks to people. It's just it's
kind of it's a trip, like we're not we're not
the Jetsons, but we're getting there. Like we're like, we're like,
it's kind of we're getting there.
Speaker 2 (15:48):
Well, the whole the whole thing back in the fifties,
when this whole system started, this whole evaluation that the
challenge was can we make machines more like people? And
the whole test of that is the Turing test. And
the Turing test is is how close to people, you know,
the people the way a human would react is the machine?
(16:13):
You know, can we get a machine that does it
acts like a human. And we're getting awfully close, afully
close photographs, are there some speech? I mean, they they're
willing to do, uh, you know, entire books on with
(16:33):
a it's a computer voice, but it's not doesn't sound
like a computer. You know, it's there, the sounds real.
In fact, I want them to sound more like a
computer for Killer app.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
Right, you're right, they're starting to massage the voices. They're
starting to make them. If you think you can go, okay,
this is obviously AI voice talking. But now there's one
called Leven Labs that does a thing where you can
I want a Scottish that sounds deep and it's close.
It's not there all the way close, and you're okay,
(17:06):
it sound as robotic, or it sound as just bland
or whatever that you're okay. It's the nations are getting better.
The inflections are getting better. Absolutely, they're they're they're they're
gonna get there. Don't worry the going they're gonna they're
gonna get there at some point. But you're right, and
so we kill her out, yes, especially because I mean so,
(17:29):
I mean, so this guy Bryce goes through it in
this book, and he goes through its. You put him
through the wringer with her, but.
Speaker 2 (17:36):
It comes out at a good spot, you know. I mean,
I try to in my books. I try to have
an uplifting ending. And uh and and it works if
everybody is satisfied at the end, even even Amy.
Speaker 1 (17:53):
Yeah, I just love that. That's hilarious. All Right, what
has been? So we'll get to artifacts and a second,
But what what has been some of the comments you've
gotten people who read the book?
Speaker 2 (18:05):
Uh, you know there there there are more many are
more nervous now than before they read the book because
I brought up so many issues. But others, others are saying, it's.
Speaker 1 (18:16):
Just a tool. It's just a tool.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
So that's that's something that I used heavily in this.
You know, you think of it as a tool and
don't think of it as somebody who's trying to kill you, you know,
or take over your life or make your life miserable.
And uh so it's a you know, it's a reasonable
beginning and and the the middle is pretty intense.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
It is and I just I just I just want
to people because it's because it's such a timely thing.
But then you do a story that has another kind
of so there's a two line between both stories. We'll
get to We'll get to that too. In my opinion
is stories there are a little about artifacts because I've
I've actually, I written a book about a young archaeologist
(19:05):
who meets an older one, and I did The Years
Put a couple years ago, and people like it. People
were like, I'm all right, I'm not saying a book
on it, but I'm I'm fascinated with artifacts too. So
I was like, oh, me and James gonna thing in
common because I feel like there's power and energy and everything,
so it why not be why have powered energy and
the artifact of some sort or some kind of things
(19:27):
in the past. So your second story, you have an archaeologist,
I love you. I love these names. Steve Stackhouse, I
love that name, and his wife Nancy, and so there's
there's there's a there's a bunch that's see what you
doing really well in these stories and all your stories
that I've read of yours because they were because they're
they're they're no vellains. They're not like this huge being
tied giant five and a page novels you get, you
(19:49):
pack a lot mhm.
Speaker 2 (19:51):
And thank you. I aim to do that.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
You do, so you do. There's sometimes there's several things
going on at once. Yes, scene is layered with several
things going on. And this one especially because we have
the past, the presence, the relationship with your husband and wife.
Here's the relationship to you are so talk about that book,
(20:16):
I mean that story on how and how that came
to you.
Speaker 2 (20:19):
Sure so, So just to so you're viewers know, this
is Killer App which we've been talking about, and Artifacts
is inside and it's and it's about a quarter of
the size of Killer App. But it's a full read.
It's a it's not a it's not a short, it's
not a partial story. It's a full a full story. Yes,
(20:42):
and Artifacts. Uh, my wife and I actually are archaeologist
in the in the in the in the way that
we're aspiring archaeologists. So we've been studying archaeology for for
years and we belonged to the Virginia Archaeological Association and
(21:04):
we go out on digs with them and that sort
of thing. My knees won't hold up any longer my heart,
but my heart's in it.
Speaker 1 (21:14):
And so.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
I love archaeology. And every time you make a discovery,
every time you find an artifact, there's a connection to
the person who lost that artifact. And I can't explain it,
but I absolutely love it. I found a little piece
of a teacup one time on an archaeological dig, and
I thought it would have no impact at all, but
(21:41):
the supervisor looked at it and said, oh my god,
that's a scratch blue teacup that identifies this foundation as
being built in seventeen thirty or something like that. And
it made a difference. It made a difference. This thing was,
you know, a half inch long and a quarter inch wide,
(22:01):
and it made a difference. And I connected with that
piece of artifact. Now I don't use that example in
the story, but I use other other examples of artifacts
that are lost and then when they're found by the archaeologist,
there's a new connection being made, and that connection is
with the person who lost it. And so it's a
(22:22):
real it's a you know, almost a sci Fi type
of connection, you know, or Twilight Zone type of connection.
And and I just looked enjoyed writing about it. I
enjoyed describing that connection. And I then I couldn't figure
out how I was going to resolve it, you know,
(22:44):
and and and I resolved it in a pretty pretty
convincing way. I think, you know, he meets a real
famous person in the past, and and then he gets
stuck in there in their life, in their time period,
(23:07):
and I thought, man, I could write, I could write
a whole book just on that. But I decided to
bring him back safely because I needed to. I needed
I had a deadline. But but it's it does leave
you satisfied, you know, the ending does leave you. Oh wow,
that's pretty cool type of ending.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
It's kind of it's he's meeting you. It's in the past. Yes,
that's so. It's kind of a mystical thing. Kind of
it's not magic, but it's like mystical kind of like yeah, worldly, Uh,
he's being taught to you. So I think that was
a fun part. I didn't expect that at all, if
(23:51):
I'm bid. But I mean so because you guys, in
real life, you're into this archologic stuff. So when you
advise the story, did you know where it was going
to go? Because it's you said, you pack a lot
of stuff in there. You could have went different directions, right,
you could have.
Speaker 2 (24:09):
I when I start writing a novel, I do not
create the ending at the beginning. I do not know
where the novel will go. If I have a good
idea that keeps me interested in wanting to write more,
that's what I continue to work on. So I have
lots of threads out there that have gone nowhere. But
(24:30):
when I like one and I pursue it, I pursue
it to the end, which in which case I didn't
have an ending planned for any of these. The endings
happen naturally as as they as they come to my mind.
Sometimes it's a very clear process. Sometimes it's muddled. Sometimes
(24:53):
it takes me a while to come up with the ending.
But I I won't write an end thing just to finish,
just to meet a deadline or or finish it. I
really wanted to be satisfying, and that one, that one worked.
Speaker 1 (25:10):
That ending worked when and when? How do you know?
It was one of those hard things for any author.
But it's how do you know? When it's the end?
Speaker 2 (25:19):
It it happens. It just becomes very clear to me.
I've I've I've written it. There's nothing else to add this.
It works well, it ends well, it's satisfying. It's got
to meet those that criteria, and then I say, this
is it. It's it's done. If I have another idea later,
(25:40):
I could write an epilogue or something of that nature.
And I usually most of my books have an epilogue
in them.
Speaker 1 (25:48):
Yeah, okay, it's just because I know that's what a
lot of writers. As you say, I don't end the book,
I would say, I go, well, hopefully if you're if
you're writing it and it has all these opportunities in it,
then there's several endings you can write, and then you just,
sure Jesus, choose one that's to your liking. Obviously. Yeah,
that's the hope what you're writing. I mean, right, I
(26:09):
mean writings journey. I love because writing is very immersive.
It's very it's very self. As you're writing a book,
you just see your you know, you create a whole canvas.
It's is blank.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
It's very much like painting.
Speaker 1 (26:20):
Yeah very much. Yeah, yes, very much. And also as
you fill the canvas, then new layers emerge. Also, almost
every word, every scene adds something new, so you're like, oh, okay,
I didn't think about this before. I love I love that.
I love that process. I love that process.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
I do too. I love that process. It's a fun process.
I don't mind doing a second and third uh edit
of my books because I'm refining that process. I'm making
it work, from seeing to scene to scene, just like
you would on a painting. You know, you don't mind
going back to it and seeing, oh, it needs something here,
(27:01):
you know a little bit more So, I love the process.
I I love writing. I hate marketing.
Speaker 1 (27:09):
Of course.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
I worked my life in marketing, and I find it
hard to write my own marketing book. You know stuff.
I just don't want to do it anymore.
Speaker 1 (27:20):
I think I've asked you. I think ever asked you
a question. Have you ever while writing a book when
I say you're halfway through or halfway through the book, well,
you wrote something that surprised you and changed the whole
direction of the book. Does that happened to you?
Speaker 2 (27:35):
Yes? Yes, I can't think of a specific example, but
that absolutely happens. Killer rapp It happened.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
Uh uh.
Speaker 2 (27:47):
You know, as I got to know the character. Because
I don't know the character, I'm learning about the character,
and the character does things that might surprise me and
I and I so I just I'll listen to that.
And I was say, Okay, let's let's go in that direction.
And that happens a lot. And that's that's the fun
part of writing without an outline. I don't know, I'm
(28:09):
not a slave to to an outline. Whatever I want
to do, well.
Speaker 1 (28:14):
That's all point. You're you're creating. So it's like for
some folks basically to an outline. That's great to them.
But the whole point is you can do whatever you want.
You're creating the world you want. You can create whatever.
There's no restraints. And I think all the writers who
watch my show and that's how we encourage you. That's
the whole point is that you are right because it's open,
(28:35):
it's vast, it's whatever you want it to be, and
you can change your mind anytime you once you also, uh,
you can take the left, turn the right, turn down
the middle. You can do whatever you want. That's kind
of the like I always say, don't censor yourself, just
like let it take you right. Absolutely, you know. That's
that's the best thing about being the writer. Well, these
(28:57):
stories are good, James, and I just I again, you
know I love your writing. Wet to show three times now,
I just I just admire how you you go in
You create these worlds that have multiple worlds within them.
Speaker 2 (29:11):
So thank you, Yeah you bet, And I got a
couple more coming down the road. Ghost Town is one
that's in in the can and at the publisher.
Speaker 1 (29:22):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (29:23):
And another one that I'm currently actually writing right now
is Undercurrent. That's going to be a very powerful one.
This first time I step into politics at all, but
but not to not from a point of view, but
describing an issue that we should have addressed long ago.
So that one's going to be pretty interesting as well.
Speaker 1 (29:44):
I want both. Yeah, we'll be back, both back. Thank
you James for being on the show. Thanks for Killer
Apple is good. You can, folks, You just get on
your phone, your tablet, Just get on there, go to Amazon,
get the book. I'm telling you, get it. You have
to leave your house, so you're just get it. Making
(30:05):
it easy for you. Tell where they can find you
in all your goodness, James Gregory.
Speaker 2 (30:12):
Thank you, Thank you, sir, tell us so much.
Speaker 1 (30:14):
Appreciate it. Where they can find you, also how they
can find me.
Speaker 2 (30:18):
My website is James R. Gregory Hyphenbooks dot com James R. Gregory,
hyphen Books dot com. And I would love to hear
from people. I mean, you know, I'll respond to anything. Yes,
well I missed anything.
Speaker 1 (30:35):
You say that, folks, Uh, but yes, and of course
I'm James ENGINR. And James j l J Media and
created us on Facebook. The book outs about earlier to
him is called Themanthean the Streets. Uh, it's a it's
a mystery. I had fun writing and it came to
me in a dream. The title came from a friend
of mine and then it came to me to dream.
(30:56):
So I was like, Okay, I guys, I'm writing a
book too. I'm writing ak to It's been really good.
You get an Amazon also where you find fine books.
As always in my shows, I'm a giant advocate for
writers and reading. Books aren't going nowhere. Books are here, don't.
I don't know what you've heard. People are reading in
record numbers. And when I say reading, it could be audible,
(31:18):
it could be kindle pair it back hard, but it
does not matter. I know so many folks who are
reading and so many folks who are writing books. Supports
indie writers as long as once you support the big ones.
And also we don't ban books either. I'm a big
component of not banning books. I think anybody should have
a right to get any books they want, they have
access to for any reason, and books like this, all
(31:39):
these kind of books, mysteries and all it should be
out there for folks to read. It's a big proponent
of I just think when you read, you go to
other worlds, you get to travel, and it helps your mind.
I mean telling you it really does. And for young writers,
I want to push them to write stories that are wonderful,
write the stories they want to see, write the stories
they want to be. I think against me to support
(32:00):
that's an art form. It really is an art form.
So I that's my always my spell. At the end,
we love books here. We do. We love books and
writers here. And we'll talk to you guys next time.
Every Thursday we have new episodes. See then.
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