Raw Deal with Guest Content Producer Summer Rawson | WWE set to move to ESPN in 2026

Ep. 496: Howse welcomes Media Prodigy Summer Rawson to IYH!

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:03):
Yeah, in your house with no common.

Speaker 2 (00:09):
At your kind of your house house, o your word
of your house upon the society the clouds. You can't
write no kind of allouds wrestling in front of the crowds.

Speaker 1 (00:19):
Parent got holding a doubt? Anybody can anybody can't get it, guys,
just standing on the fi. He is the voice. There
is no choice.

Speaker 2 (00:26):
Here is some choice in your house making wrestling noise
and p fact. It's like cruising wait action.

Speaker 3 (00:31):
Your house is the perfect straction pro see.

Speaker 1 (00:33):
Here's when you attract. You get this work with some
prestling back and spoke. What is up? Guys? What is
cracking is the common man? And I am in your
house and you guys already know the vibes. Any time
to slide on through. We here to give you that
work when it comes to this professional wrestling business. And guys,
it is Wednesday, which means if you're familiar with what

(00:55):
we do here, you know it's time to get raw.
That's right, it's the raw deal with House and O'Neill.

Speaker 3 (01:04):
No, O'Neill, I don't think I got that face card.

Speaker 1 (01:10):
Not on hill. Annie has got a whole lot going on,
so she's going to return next week But you know what,
she's very, very gracious and divinely designed as well, because
she was able to get me an amazing guest here
to come on and talk all things wrestling from a
production standpoint. And let me tell you, guys, if you

(01:34):
guys have been a longtime listener, you know that back
in February, I got a chance to go to the
Royal Rumble and be a part of the big Royal
Rumble weekend that happened in Indianapolis, and it was a
great weekend. I had a blast. I went to the
Royal Rumble, I was there the night before and got

(01:55):
a chance to go to the Wrestling Revolver, got a
chance to see the g W show. It was a
vibe and you know, we had a whole lot of
content that came from this weekend or that weekend. But
you know, I will I'll say this, I met a
lot of amazing people that week in and uh, you know,

(02:17):
so much talent, so much wrestlers or whatever. But you know,
I am a guy who is a producer. I produce,
That's what I do. That's how I contribute. That's that's
one of the things that I one of the hats
that I wear when I'm at a wrestling show. And
you know, I always love to pick the brain of
other producers. And this producer that's here on the show

(02:42):
was doing some work with the Wrestling Revolver And if
you guys don't know Wrestling Revolver, that's a that's a
pretty big promotion as far higher upper echelon indies, and
this this talented person got a chance to be a
part of it. It's Summer Rossen and Media jugger Nott.

Speaker 3 (02:59):
What is up, wow, Con? I mean, hey, there's been
a lot of different times that I have been introduced
on things, but I truly think you set that up perfectly.
You made me sound so cool that I kind of
feel like I need to be even cooler in this interview.
You are setting me up for greatness. First of all,

(03:21):
I just want to say thank you for having me
on the show, and of course thank you to everybody
that is watching the show as well and tuning in
Media Juggernaut. I mean, we met it Revolver. I think
it was an amazing conversation. I truly think we would
not be having this discussion if we didn't meet it Revolver.
So yeah, I just want to say thank you to
you and to everybody for having me on the show.

Speaker 1 (03:40):
Yes, no, not problem at all. We got our man,
the voice Josh Joseph. In the chat, he says, IYH
with the special guests. Let's go. We got my man,
Jordan Bell. He says, Yo, and welcome to the iy
H Family. Summer. Make sure you guys are hitting the
dropkick on that subscribe button and follow everything that we

(04:00):
are doing. So, like I was saying, summer, you were
doing production for the Wrestling Revolver, and you know you
are a young individual, like how old are you?

Speaker 3 (04:17):
I have just turned twenty in just.

Speaker 1 (04:20):
Turn twenty, that is absolutely insane, and already doing you know,
things like production with the Wrestling Revolver. I know you
do so much other stuff, media production. You're very talented
in that. But let me ask you. Let me ask
you for the for the people out there in the
household who don't know, but do know the quality of

(04:40):
talent that the Wrestling Revolver brings in. I want to ask,
what were you doing with the Wrestling Revolver that weekend?

Speaker 3 (04:49):
You know, that is a really funny way to put it,
because sometimes I'm there and I'm looking around, and I'm like,
how did I even get here. It's a very interesting
story because one of my good friends in the wrestling
business is the directorial producer of Revolver, and I had
met him working for a separate company and he pretty

(05:09):
much said, Hey, you do phenomenal work on this media
production side of things, and I would like to kind
of take you under my wing. I was like, this
guy knows what he's doing. I don't think there's anybody
else in this production realm that I could learn from.
Butler Hawkins. I shoot wrestling. He picked me up and went,

(05:30):
how far are you from Dayton, Ohio. I'm right south.
I'm right south of Detroit. So I just went, yeah,
I can be there. And the second I was there,
I didn't know what I was doing there. He told
me to be there. Now he has slotted me in
perfectly for post production and I get to sit right
alongside him in gorilla position and work and be able

(05:53):
to make it look the way it does instant replay wise,
camera cut wise, graphic wise. The way that Revolver is
presented to anybody watching at home is strictly the product
of Luke Hawkins, and now he has taken me under
his wing to start to make product like that. So

(06:15):
I got a really cool hook up with Revolver, and
whenever I am able to be there, I am there
and Luke is teaching me the ropes through Revolver, which
I think is throwing a kitty cat into a lion's
den trump learning.

Speaker 1 (06:31):
That's true, No, but that's great that. Like I was
thinking about what you were saying while you were talking
to I'm like, you're twenty years old. You obviously have
a passion for production and media and whatnot. And yeah,
you could say it's like like throwing a kitten into
a lion's den, But you know, sometimes and it seems
like that's how you are. You know, as far as

(06:51):
what I've seen from you, is that you put you
in the situation where you got to sink or swim,
and it seems like you're going to swim. So that's
you know, that is very cool, especially with the fact
that like not there's I've been listen, I've been to
a lot of indie shows, uh and seeing a lot
of indie shows and help you know, produce a lot

(07:12):
of indie shows. You know, when it comes to like
instant replays and camera cuts and whatnot. That's not something
a lot of indies are doing, you know, So I
can definitely appreciate that because that stuff sticks out to me.
So I want to ask you this because it seems
like you're you were like a prodigy as it were.

(07:33):
I mean to be where you are right now at
the age of twenty and and already be in somewhere
in the midst of somebody of a place like the
Wrestling Revolver, that is, that's real great, I guess I
want to ask you this. How did you start to
realize your passion for production? How did this come about?

Speaker 3 (07:54):
I like to say I popped out of the womb
with a camera in my hand. I very much. I've
been into videography and editing even since I was a kid.
I was forcing my family members to watch ten twenty
minute short films I made when I was seven eight
years old, and they totally didn't want to see there,
but they saw what I was trying to do and

(08:15):
they picked up on it pretty quick. So now starting
to be able to further that into a career. It
went from being a YouTuber making YouTube videos, making short
films on YouTube that actually people started to kind of
get in tune with in my area to the point
where people were starting to know who I was without
me having to note them. And this was happening very

(08:35):
young I started. I hit the Twitch scene right around
twenty twenty one, and right there was when I kind
of realized I had a very distinct love for live
production and it's a different feeling. It's a very different
feeling than going back and editing something after it's done,
although that is something I get joy out of. I
really found my niche through Twitch and now that I'm

(08:57):
here and I'm able to kind of form that into
something that I can be passionate about. With wrestling, it
comes from a place of me also just being a
fan of wrestling at the time, while I was young,
learning I had these media capabilities. It really put things
in perspective. After I started going to college for it.
I am a media arts major and I'm going for
my master's in Arts administration hopefully. So now that I'm

(09:20):
starting to see these things that I thought was just
a hobby, like come to fruition and actually be able
to build a name off of myself with it while
still being in the businesses and passions that I love.
It really was a one to eighty going from this
is a hobby to oh, I can really make this

(09:41):
into something. I can actually make a name for myself
by being the one that captures the art. And honestly,
I think college gave me that realization because on top
of everything I do in the wrestling business, I'm the
head of videography and editing for their theater department, So
I really got some real world experience with deadlines, with

(10:04):
shooting live production, editing it down, following Godlins, and kind
of having to pr my work in a way to
actually give it to people where they can be like, wow,
she kind of has an idea of what she's doing.
This isn't just some kid with a camera. This is
somebody that genuinely is looking to find the perfect way

(10:24):
to capture these things. And that's why I always say
that live production is a different beast. It's something that
is completely like separate than shooting a show and putting
it in post. So I think the passion for it
really came from the realization of this can be a
profession and this isn't just some hopeful dream that a
kid has. This is something that is achievable. And that

(10:45):
is honestly why I do it, because I know that
I can help people realize that it's possible to So
I think it just comes from the realization of professionalism
for sure, and knowing that it can be a business.

Speaker 1 (10:57):
It's something that you yeah, exactly, you said it just right.
You could turn it into a business, turning something that
obviously that you've loved your entire life into something that
you can, you know, have some trajectory, generate some revenue,
and really make a name for yourself off of it.
And you were saying that live production is a totally
different beast. We got the chaos Goblin Kevin Callaway there,

(11:19):
he's saying, I live production and live shows are a
totally different animal. Those those moments are amazing to be
involved in. And yeah, most definitely it's very cool to
see everything that you're doing at such a young age
and obviously handling it well and taking that extra step
by saying, you know what, I can do this. I

(11:41):
can probably because a lot of people can can get
on Twitch, a lot of people can get on YouTube,
and they can, you know, they could, they could do that,
But for you to go ahead and and make the
decision for yourself that hey, I want to make this
a career. I want to take this that I love
to do on my own time and transition it into

(12:01):
something that I can make a career out of. And
I just think that's amazing. Not a lot of people
can figure that out at at at that age. But
I do want to ask you this because you, like
you said you were, you're a young person, very young
young sale, but young young sale. But you're also but
obviously you're a wrestling fans. So I want to ask

(12:23):
and double back to that real quick, where did your
passion for wrestling begin?

Speaker 3 (12:30):
Oh? So, honestly, there's no real cinematic, no cinematic way
to say that. It is accident because I being a kid,
I've always been into shows. I've always been into cartoons.
I've always been one of those kids that was I
was sitting in front of the TV watching whatever was there.
And one day I came along and Monday Night Raw,

(12:53):
funnily enough, was on and I didn't I knew wrestling
existed as a kid, but I never really got into it.
But I very vividly Rember I watched one week, I
watched like back in like twenty thirteen ish. The next
week the shield broke up. So I watched one of
the biggest implosions my second time tuning in. So if

(13:16):
you want to talk about hook, reel and sinker.

Speaker 1 (13:18):
Yeah, they didn't.

Speaker 3 (13:20):
I immediately felt something about it where I was like, wait,
why is he hurting him? What happened between these three? Because,
of course, watching other media at the time as a kid,
you're watching normal moral dilemmas playoff in cartoons, in kids shows,
in Nickelodeon and all of that kind of stuff. But
it's like that was a completely different kind of theme

(13:43):
and the realism of it. So the second I saw that,
I was like, this is crazy. I need to watch
every moment. I need to get completely invested. I need
to go all the way in deep end. And I
sure did, and the next year, surely enough, twenty fifteen,
twenty sixteen starts to roll around. I'm nagging my dad, Dad, Dad,
there's wrestling down the street. There's there's a wrestling show

(14:04):
going on.

Speaker 1 (14:05):
I want to go. I want to go.

Speaker 3 (14:06):
And I annoyed the hell out of this man for
this stuff. But the fact that we were going, and
he was also because he was a wrestling fan. My
dad is watching wrestling, so the fact that he was
watching to do it, he's getting deja vu. So we're
going to these shows as I'm a kid. I'm going
to XICW and going to like DSW and all those

(14:26):
things were around. I'm just hitting shows. I'm like, Wow,
this is crazy. XICW did a lot of fan interaction
at that time.

Speaker 1 (14:33):
Yeah, and.

Speaker 3 (14:36):
To say the least, I won fan commentator and then
proceeded to work as a commentator. I was twelve, that's crazy,
thirteen maybe, And the fact people were looking at me
in a way and I was like, wait, am I
doing this wrong? Am I Am I doing this wrong?
And they're like how how are you doing this right now?

Speaker 1 (14:57):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (14:57):
And I'm like I don't know. Next time, like the
next time I went a fan thing, I'm managing Gavin
Quinton because I had fan manager. I work punched somebody
con I stopped on the ground.

Speaker 1 (15:11):
I was thirteen, that's crazy.

Speaker 3 (15:14):
So you want to talk about a kid just immediately
deepending without even trying to like stop and look at like,
oh this is real, this is this is something that's
actually no. I immediately had to figure out what is
this right and the fact that I was doing that
and having people look at me like, you're supposed to
be You're supposed to be a fan. How are you

(15:35):
doing this right now? I really don't think I am.
I would be treated as seriously if I wasn't as
confident when I was thirteen, fourteen.

Speaker 1 (15:42):
Fifteen, yeah, doing this stuff.

Speaker 3 (15:45):
Because now I'm here. And I really think those moments
in those times, whether it was going to a show
we're watching at home with family, it really showed me
that there is a love, there's a passion, and there
is a way to get there. And I I'm still
getting there. I don't think I'm there. There's still the
moon to get to. But the fact that I'm here

(16:06):
right now, I really think is just a product of
being that eccentric kid and not letting that childhood die
in me.

Speaker 1 (16:14):
So yeah, big facts.

Speaker 3 (16:16):
And a lot of people see that in me. A
lot of people like, oh, holy shit, you're young, like
you are very small, but you can carry yourself like
a professional in the business.

Speaker 1 (16:26):
Yeah yeah, And it's.

Speaker 3 (16:28):
Hard to find. And I think that's why I stick out,
And maybe I'm self aware. I don't want to sound
like an asshole. But I I feel that I feel
that respect because I give it right back to everyone
around me for sure.

Speaker 1 (16:41):
For sure. Yeah, no, I dig that and like being
you know, being self aware like you said, I was
just thinking to myself, like, man, I don't think I
was that self aware when I was twenty for sure,
Like I don't think. I don't think I I In fact,
I know I wasn't. But but the way that the
way that you present you are, you know, you are

(17:01):
very professional, and it makes sense why these opportunities are
coming your way because, like you said earlier, it was
that confidence and not a lot of people that age
twelve thirteen can do those things and feel confident about it.
But obviously there was a passion that it cultivated from

(17:23):
from your the moments that you would have had as
a as a fan manager, as a fan commentator and whatnot.
And I was just thinking because you said, oh, the
second episode that I saw was the Shield breaking up,
and I'm like, man, I'm old because I was there
for the Shield debut. I was there when they debuted together,
I was in.

Speaker 3 (17:43):
The I felt up jet lagged. I was like I
just walked into a house fire. I didn't know what's
going on?

Speaker 1 (17:51):
Yeah, and now I'm like.

Speaker 3 (17:52):
Why is that happening? What started? I need to know?
So then it was I was gone. After that, I
was running the marathon, I was already halfway down the
like and it shows. And I'm honestly it's something I'm
very proud of because it's a passion that never left
me and it still is very strong to this day.

Speaker 1 (18:09):
Yeah, don't let yeah, don't don't let it. Don't let
it leave. I just know so many people in my
age range or and whatnot. You know it, you know,
life will beat you down and and and whatnot, and
you kind of forget about that, uh that that kid
that's inside you and those things that made you feel passionate,
that made you feel alive and whatnot. So definitely, if

(18:29):
I had any advice, go ahead and uh it, make
sure you keep that because it's you. You do you.
You seem very vibrant, you know, and and I can
definitely and I can definitely respect that. It's it's a
good vibe. But I want to keep this going here
because you you obviously have a passion for production. You
obviously have a passion for wrestling, and it shows hearing

(18:52):
you talk about it. I guess with you being so young,
you know, you're in college, you're there for media, arts,
and and things seem to be going in the direction
that you'd like it to go. But I want to
ask you this, what are some plans that you have
for yourself, what your future plans, What would you ultimately
like to get done as as far as everything that

(19:14):
you're doing.

Speaker 3 (19:17):
Yeah, I mean strictly, I'll start with wrestling, because wrestling
is the main focal point here. I would love I'm
an actor at heart. A lot of the stuff I
do comes from a place of performance and entertainment, and
there's always the itch that courses through my body to
one day train yea, and that is something I want
to leave later on down the line, because who knows.

(19:39):
I like what I'm doing and this could be good.
So for sure, I would love to keep furthering in
the production side of things. Would love to I actually
was able to edit my first show that's going to
be released sometime this month, which I'm really excited about.
I was as a production manager for it was called
Wrestling Cancer. It was a leukemia benefit and I was
pretty much behind the whole production side of things. And whatnot,

(20:01):
and that's coming out soon, but I'll speak a little
outside of wrestling as well. Outside of wrestling, I do
a lot of other things, and I'm the goal with
my certifications I'm gonna be getting from school is to
make an entertainment company. I want to start off Boston Entertainment.
I do a lot of events outside of wrestling that
are live events. I've done charity streams, I've done live

(20:23):
D and D events I've done, I've I've done screenings
for documentaries I've made. I've done a ton of different things,
and honestly, the main goal right now is to be
able to tie it all together and put it under
the same banner. Because on top of wrestling, wrestling will
Is will will always be one of my focal points,

(20:44):
but there is so many other creative avenues that I
see in wrestling that aren't even expanded upon. Because I
also have an acting teaching background, and I really think,
and I don't know, I could be a little out
of to say it, but I really think that character
coaching is something that could really benefit in wrestling. I

(21:04):
would love to be the first character coach in wrestling.
And because I say specifically, character coach because I will
never speak on the physicality in a ring. It is
not my place. I don't do that. But what I
can do is I can make you believable with everything
you do outside of it.

Speaker 1 (21:22):
Yep.

Speaker 3 (21:23):
The goal is to do something like that while also
keeping on the production things. But in a long run,
Ross and Entertainment continue streamlining the wrestling production side of
things and continue making cool, unique, different things. It's something
that is so scarce. It is so scarce to find

(21:46):
a creative that puts their one hundred and ten percent
into things. And that is honestly why I'm very specific
about the things I do online and who I go
on shows with and what I do because I look
at you and I can say you have a p
you have something that you're putting out there, and the
fact that we can communicate and relate to each other

(22:07):
on that level scarce.

Speaker 1 (22:08):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (22:09):
So what I will say, I want to keep streamlining
my passions, but the goal is to always uplift other
people with me, because there is so much creativity in
this world that stays under wraps.

Speaker 1 (22:22):
Yeah. So yeah, most most definitely, I mean you you
the way that you are driven. I mean, it really
does remind me of myself in a way. I mean,
I'm just I'm just saying, like you're super driven. You
you know, you really want to you you really want
to drive out there. I really, I really really like
what you said about being a character coach, because what

(22:44):
as far as what I've been in the wrestling business,
which I've you know, been in and out or whatever
since like twenty sixteen, and really some of the stuff
that I've been doing in like Destination six over in
Illinois and then Emerge over in Columbus, Indiana is helping
bring the talent out by doing like probably bring the
talent's charisma out by you know, doing some you know,

(23:07):
doing promos, working with them situational type stuff that will
really force them to kind of think outside the box
instead of just getting in the camera and say, well,
let me tell you something. We're gonna be here at
this day on that time and when I see you.

Speaker 3 (23:21):
But I'm gonna speak in the same cadence every time
I talk, and every time I'm going for a belt.
You are gonna hear me. Yell, bro, we got it
like that.

Speaker 1 (23:32):
We're gonna fight in this town at this time, and
I'll see you then and I'm like, no, like, let's
be a little let's let's think outside the box a
little bit. Let's be a little bit in Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 3 (23:43):
It was something so out of the blue where I go,
I need to watch this. What are they talking about?

Speaker 1 (23:49):
Yeah? Yeah, So if you ever get a chance to
usually it's just because I'm so proud of this. I
went me and uh Sam Knight not you if you're
familiar with Sama, ran into him. Yet a pair of
gone back in like twenty twenty one. We we we
went and we we we did a three show stint
over in Las Vegas. It was the Level Up Expo.

(24:12):
It was really great. Versus Pro presented it. It was
an anime and gaming and wrestling convention. It was very awesome,
a lot of people, a lot of people. Probably one
of the biggest shows that I did. And we did
it for three straight days over there in Vegas, and
you know, it was such a vibe. But what we
did was because I was their manager and they were

(24:33):
the wrestlers. And that's what I you know, what I do.
I manage and do commentaries. A lot of the stuff
that you have that you have done and will continue
to do and whatnot, and we were in I'm big
on storytelling as far as like promos or whatever. Like
I said, I don't like the cookie cutter stuff. So
we was like, what can we do to make to
maximize this trip with our stable we were doing, you know,

(24:55):
we were pretty big and Emerged wrestling and a couple
other promotions at the time. So we did was we
took one of our guys there who also got booked
that weekend, and he was he at the time. He
was part of another faction that we were feuding with,
but he was the only one there for that weekend.
The other they couldn't make it for that weekend. So
what we did was we kind of told a story

(25:18):
where we kind of ran into him randomly in Vegas
and we were like, hey, where's your boys at you
guys they just left you high and dry, but you
know what, we're here, you should join us. So he
turned us down, and obviously we were heels at the time,
so we didn't like that. So that was our first video,
and then in our second video, we did it where
I was kind of like I had the camera in

(25:39):
my hand here with the phone or whatever while they
were walking up on him. And we literally beat this
man up, threw him in the trunk of our rental car,
and drove off with them. And that was the story
we were telling. It was amazing. It was so we
did it so well that when we were done filming
or whatever, we had somebody that was there, just a

(26:00):
random person on the street, and he was like, yo,
I almost called the cops. I thought somebody was giving
the amount of times you have to go no, no,
I'm behind.

Speaker 3 (26:12):
The camera and there's two Like I had to shoot
for Flow in Indiana. One time, I had to shoot
a promo between Ricky Morris and Lee La Hall and
these two are arguing with each other in this resort
as people are like going to their phone.

Speaker 1 (26:25):
Oh yeah yeah.

Speaker 4 (26:27):
So I'm sitting there going like having to tell them like,
hey guys, we're acting like the amount of times I've
scared people on accident. It means you're doing something right.
It means you're doing something right.

Speaker 1 (26:44):
Exact that's all I'll say. Exactly. So that and I
remember when we put that stuff out, we put in
like a four episodes, like a four video series. People
was buzzing for the next video. And that's just the
little stuff there that I'm like, what can we do
to set this wrestler? You know, like you said, you know,
bell to bell between the ropes. I you know, I'm

(27:05):
not speaking on that, you know what I'm saying, just because,
like you said, as you said, not not my place.
But like outside of that, what can I do to
enhance the show? What can I do to enhance your character?
What can I do to pull something out of you
that maybe you didn't even see in yourself? And you know,
as far as hearing you speak, I'm a huge fan.
Like as far as everything that I do, I model everything.

(27:28):
I modeled the way that I helped talent bring stuff out,
the way that I manage, the way that I look
at the business from the viewpoint of Paul Hayman. I'm
a big Paul Hayman guy, big Paul Hayman guy. So
I was watching the Paul Hayman documentary you know, ladies
and gentlemen, name, my name is Paul Hayman, And so

(27:50):
many wrestlers had came out and said like Rhino Rhino
was one of the main ones. He was like, I
didn't know what I was doing. I didn't know what
the saying of promo. Oh, I didn't know how I
should say it. I didn't know the cadence in which
I should say it. But when Paul got with me,
he helped me tie it all together. And that's what

(28:11):
I see in you is somebody that can bring that
out of a talent once again, maybe something that they
didn't see in themselves, and just helped them cultivate a character.
I definitely see a whole lot of Paul Hayman vibes
with you.

Speaker 3 (28:26):
And you know the thing about it too, It's like
a lot of those character choices because I before I
was a media arts major, I was actually studying theater
and acting in university and I actually had almost a
year and a half of straight acting classes where I
was just I was learning like a strict Russian acting
technique and it something I have learned and I guess

(28:47):
this could just be like one of my thoughts when
it comes to character is if you are wanting to
immerse people, you are going to have to feel slightly uncomfortable. Yeah,
there are a lot of people that I think are
limited because they just don't go out of their comfort zone.
And that's what I want to be able to help
with because there are different techniques, there are different plans,

(29:07):
and there's I could assign these guys' homework to do
because there are so many character things that nobody thinks
about that if they knew, their character would now be
three dimensional. There's a lot of two D characters in wrestling.
The second your two D character becomes three dimensional, you

(29:28):
have someone like bray Wyatt. Yep, you have someone like
you have someone like what what Jessica Havoc and what
Gia Miller are doing in Revolver? Yeah, being this they're
the macobs. Like what they were doing at least when
I like, when I was doing my work there somebody
I looked to a lot that was I thought was
doing it was the macabre stable. They immersed people, They

(29:52):
were terrifying Gia and Jessica fully fully pedal to the metal,
that gimmick three dimensional all around.

Speaker 1 (30:02):
Yeah, No, I definitely, I definitely like what you're saying.
Like you say, you find somebody like a bray Wyatt
that breaks through, that becomes from that goes from a
husky Harris to a bray Wyatt, or a Tony Storm
who goes from Tony Storm to a timeless Tony storm,
you know, breaking through and becoming like just like from

(30:23):
Roman Reigns, the big dog to the tribal chief Roman Reigns.

Speaker 3 (30:27):
You watch these characters become three dimensional once they tap
into that. Yep. But it's so rare, it really is,
And that's what I want on top of my production
stuff because a big part of being the part is
presenting the part, is editing it, is making it look
right like me and Pea Pod c j Owen if

(30:50):
you're familiar, Yes, of course Free and Pepod have It's
it's a work in progress. And he might get mad
at me for saying. I don't think he will. But
we actually were starting to plan some sort of I'm
a R to help teach people how to edit videos
in simple ways, edit promos and simple ways. Also what
can you add to a video to amplify the character

(31:10):
you are presenting yourself as. So we are actually in
plans to actually start providing teachings to people that don't
know how to use cap cut, that don't know how
to use Canva, that don't know how to use these
things that could get them ten times more over if
they knew how to put it together correctly. Yeah, So
we actually have a lot of plans for sharing this

(31:31):
knowledge and different means, whether it is acting on like
what I want to do, or the production side, which
is also the other side I do. I want to
be an asset. I want to be something that levels
people up. Yeah, and sure maybe i'll get credit to here,
but I want to level people up. That's what I
want to do.

Speaker 1 (31:48):
I get it. I like very Swiss army knife, like, yes.

Speaker 3 (31:53):
You get it.

Speaker 1 (31:54):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (31:54):
I want to be a silver bullet in the wrestling
business that doesn't touch the ring.

Speaker 1 (31:58):
Yeah that you know. Oh, it's so crazy, because that
is exactly how I am. I love everything about wrestling.
But you know, I personally I never felt compelled to
want to be a wrestler. I wanted to work in
the business, but I never wanted to be a wrestler.
It just wasn't my bag. And like I figured that

(32:19):
out at a young age that if I wanted to
do something I knew and wanted to do, be commentary
or a manager or or you know, do something backstage,
you know, as far as production, because I've you know,
being from La I've been around the glitz and the glamor.
I've been around the cameras, the studios, all that stuff.
I came up in that type of environment, so you know,
it's always been something There's always been something there inside

(32:42):
of me because of my upbringing. But you know, always
wanting to be always wanting to contribute and enhance. That's
deff like somebody like like me or you or Pea Pod.

Speaker 3 (32:57):
You know.

Speaker 1 (32:57):
It's what I would say, like I call people like
that show enhancers, you know, because you can you know,
you can have your you know, you can have your
indie show whatever, and you can have your six match
card and then you know, you can you know, if
you do promos and you know, you have people who
hold the camera like this instead of like this, you know,

(33:17):
and it's like, come on, there's just a certain the little.

Speaker 3 (33:20):
Things, it's very little things that people look at and
it's like this. I don't say this trying to assume
people don't know, but I do truly believe that a
lot of people just don't know how to incorporate those things,
don't know how to don't know how to find a
way to make that work with what they're doing. Because
at the end of the day, it is wrestling based.

(33:41):
It is about the wrestling. What I want to do
is how can I make your art look professional, presentable
and get over your ideas? Yeah, even if you're even
if you're the promoter, If you're the promoter and you
are like, I need this to look a certain way,
but I just don't know how. That is where my
knowledge comes in. I don't want to overstep anything in ring.

(34:05):
I don't want to overstep the art that wrestlers have,
but I do want to be able to pass down
what I know from not only college level classes but
now almost ten years doing content creation in media. And
I feel so weird saying that because that made me
ten so but it's true. I feel very like weird

(34:27):
saying that. But there's only there's only so many reasons
I can say about what I know. How like how
I know what I do? You know? And I just
I have it and I want to be able to
give that to people. I want people to be able
to come to me, Hey, what can I do to
make this more believable? Hey? How should I edit this?
Should I add sound? What kind of sound should I
put in this? Is there any sort of way I
can sound design, set design this promo to get over

(34:51):
the fact that I'm insert gimmick here. I know that stuff,
especially with a theater design and technology minor. I'm learning lighting,
I'm learning sound, I'm learning set design. I'm learning how
to make an interactive stage. Wow, that's what I want.

Speaker 1 (35:08):
Wow. Like that's impressive, And.

Speaker 3 (35:11):
I even want to cross over my businesses like I
do D and D events. Yeah, do you understand? My
beautiful trifecta would be a live produced D and D
show where wrestlers bring their gimmicks and must stay in
gimmick the entire D and D game to not only
one character build them, but two. It would be called

(35:32):
Dungeons and ddts, and the game would run like a
pay per view.

Speaker 1 (35:37):
I like that a lot.

Speaker 3 (35:39):
It gives them their opening to explore their character outside
of the context of wrestling, and that is something that
not a lot of people know how to do. Do
you know how to separate yourself from your character? But
how do you make your character dynamic enough to exist
outside of the banquet hall? Can you make them? Can
you help them go and do a street interview? What

(35:59):
if I put your character on a boat? What would
they do? These are the small things that I think
about for people that have characters that don't exist in
this world, or that don't exist justin wrestling, Like how
are you a king? Show me you're a king? How
are you rich? Show me you're rich. Don't just tell
me how are you crazy? How are you the champion?

(36:21):
Because you can sit there and hit your head as
much as you want, but if you don't make me
believe you're crazy, there's work to do.

Speaker 1 (36:27):
Yep.

Speaker 3 (36:28):
True, That's how I've seen it. So that's why I'm like,
I want to merge my businesses to not only create content,
give people publicity, but even the little shit of having
somebody come on as a gimmick and be able to
stay as the gimmick even when playing D and D
and they're not in character. I want to see Kevin

(36:49):
Calloway walk up onto my D and D table as
the chaos goblin. Hey I'm Kevin Calloway. I want to
play D and D. So now Kevin Calloway is playing
D and D, not the band behind Kevin Callaway. Those
are things I think about all the time because guess what,
I'm gonna put them in scenarios where they have to
be their character, but they're just doing a dice roll
to see if they hit a dropkick or not.

Speaker 1 (37:10):
Yeah, yeah, that's very cool. I love it. I love
that's that's what I like, thinking outside the box, making it,
making things big. This it's always something that I you know,
has aspired to see as far as how can you
enhance an indie show? And you know, all the time
in the business, I I've something once again, like I

(37:32):
said some Paul Haymand vies, because sometimes I'll get with
the promoter or whatever and we'll butt heads because I'll
see like, hey, you could do this and and it'll
it would really help push your social media if you
did this video or posted it at this time. And
you know, sometimes you deal with promoters and they they
you know, they know they feel like they know what's
best for their product. And that's fine, but you know,

(37:53):
you you know, you brought me in to help you,
you know, so like get you know, sometimes those that
have budding happens. But I love the fact that it's
innovative thinking. It's thinking outside the box. That is. I
love that that is, that is that's exactly where we're at.
Where we got some commentary. I want to make sure
I'm acknowledging the chat here, we've got fightings one. What's

(38:15):
up Fightings? He says, I always thought ECW had the
best promos. They had great gorilla style filming, just going
out on the streets and film a race that bit.

Speaker 3 (38:25):
Yeah, Raven's one of my inspirations forever. Okay, okay, I
study Raven like a fiend. I think he is of
the most immersive characters without having to speak very often. Yeah,
he genuinely tore it down with eas CW. And even

(38:47):
when I was thinking about being a wrestler, I was
looking at Raven for Rawson. It's something that I look at,
something that I that exists in my head. But even
what Fighting said about how they were out on the street,
they were showing Raven's life. What is Raven doing when
he's not in the ring, because I don't care unless
he's in the ring, right right, They did that, right.

(39:09):
So that's a great example because I love Raven and
I love the media that came out of ECW with Raven.

Speaker 1 (39:16):
Yeah. The thing about because we do an ECW watch
along every Thursday, it's it's great if you guys are
here and you guys watched the ECW watch along. Remember
next week we're going to be welcoming to Quinn, to
Central stud Muffin, Joe Gertner to the ECW watch along.
He was an ECW announcer and manager and like watching
it every single week. It it was it was very raw,

(39:42):
it was very real and like it didn't feel like
overly produced, if that makes sense, you know, And like.

Speaker 3 (39:51):
He has to have that authenticity exactly exactly because if
you could, we could sit there and plan it and
script it. But I'm always gonna look at them and go,
I want you to say exactly what you think you
want to say before we actually try and script this out.

Speaker 1 (40:04):
Yeah, yeah, like try.

Speaker 3 (40:06):
To you know, was doing a lot of drugs. Sorry,
I'm like, hey, if he was able to do it
that way, maybe I can do it sober.

Speaker 1 (40:15):
There you go, there you go. No, absolutely, I love
it absolutely, and like like I said, very raw, very real,
Like I don't okay, So let me ask you this
because I want to continue to talk and I want
to get some of your thoughts on like current day,
w w W and whatnot, and and we'll have that
discussion on the other side of the break. But like

(40:35):
I guess I want to ask this what do you
prefer as a as a producer as you know, big
on media and in the way that you you know,
view which is a very you know, very good views
as far as like promos and lighting and and uh
and character work and whatnot. What would you prefer, uh,

(40:57):
you know, a grittier promo maybe on the streets even
and whatnot doing what he did in ECW Or do
you prefer like a cleaner, more produced style promo like
maybe in front of the podium over in the NWA
in the in the eighties or something like that.

Speaker 3 (41:16):
You know, I think with something like that and a
question like that, you got to allow a little bit
of nuance. You have to kind of understand that it
really truthfully depends on what you're representing in your media.
Because I could tell you fifty wrestlers that I would
kill to shoot in a grittier way, in a more unorganized,
disheveled way. But there's also another fifty on the other

(41:39):
side that I would want to shoot a very cut, clean,
professional promo where they are responsible for getting themselves over
without needing any of those exterior things. I don't even
see it as a difference in production. If you are
able to go up on a podium authentically be your character.

(42:00):
I don't need to help you. You don't need any
help from anything that's happening outside. So I think one
it's one of those things where it truly depends on
what kind of character you're presenting. But in the nature
of wrestling and what it is, I think there are
so many more promotions that could lean into a grittier
style without being a carbon copy of the other gritty

(42:22):
promotion happening, because grittiness is very cut, clean and dry
in the wrestling business, where a lot of people see
it as the same thing. You see like you see
different camera, darker lighting, different camera angles, fast paced action.
But I'm thinking about it in a sense of would
your character use a VHS camera yeah, or would they
use a professional camera? Because if you are truly seeing

(42:45):
it from the perspective of the character is trying to
get their thoughts out, how do you represent the character
unspokenly through editing choices and surround surrounding choices. So it's
one of those things where if my job is complete,
if I can completely build a promo without the wrestler
in the room, sure does that make sense?

Speaker 1 (43:04):
It does it's weird.

Speaker 3 (43:07):
It feels it feels very nuanced, and that does feel
like a little bit of a vague answer, But I
truly don't see a preference in either unless you're benefiting
a character, right, right, And I think it truly just
defends because you can have a more formal organization, as
like a wrestling promotion that does do the NWA style stuff,
or like the there's an interview sitting sit an interviewer

(43:29):
sitting right in the middle of the two wrestlers that
they're talking. You can do that. That's totally fine, But
does it make sense for what you're putting out? Sure?
If I was like, let's say, it's like, in my opinion,
it's like if GCW put out an NWA type promo,
it's like, GCW, you are the gritty promotion. If you
do that, it should only make sense for whoever is speaking.

Speaker 1 (43:50):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (43:51):
Yeah, So I think it's kind of just a nuanced thing.
I think people need more dynamicism in the way they
do things, and I think a lot of people, a
lot of people are way too worried about a brand
to the point where it doesn't let them expand their
own reach in the way they promote things. So I
really think that it really just depends on you as
a promoter, the wrestler that's a part of it, and
the person producing it how you feel it makes sense.

(44:13):
But I do think a lot of promotions would benefit
by not sticking to a certain brand. You have a name,
you have a title, you have a show. Everything should
look different from the last if you want to retain viewers.
And that could also just be an evolution of business,
because I really think people are itching for something different

(44:34):
and alternative. Every alternative that's came up was either ran
by shitty people or did not know what they were doing.

Speaker 2 (44:41):
Yep.

Speaker 3 (44:42):
And I will say there are current alternatives right now,
but I think even on a more centered in level,
what can you do to be that alternative? And you
could even say alternative as a way to describe the promotion.
But I really think a lot of promotions could lead
into not sticking with the brand.

Speaker 1 (45:00):
Yeah, yeah, no, good points here. We got fightings here
in the chat. Oh, this is a great question. Good question.
What do you think of the Hardy's deletion and broken
storyline type filming of matches similar to aj in Undertaker's
Boneyard match, back during the pandemic.

Speaker 3 (45:19):
Ooh. So I think if you overdo what it loses meaning.
But I don't think it makes promotion straight away from it,
because if you are a promotion, let's say, as you said,
you used Hardy, the Hardy deletion storyline, the way that
Matt Hardy was like doing matches and whatnot. And you
can even say the Boneyard match for Undertaker. But let

(45:39):
me talk about one of the best matches I ever
did that was the Firefly f on house match. It's fun.
It makes sense for bray Wyatt to put Sena through
something like that. Bray Wyatt in canon of the w
w WEE had the power to do so. So I

(45:59):
think should be used as a silver bullet, and only
if the promotion leans on heavily supernatural inhuman characters. And
I honestly think if you were to make a promotion
of all in human supernatural characters like Broken Matt Hardy, Undertaker,
bray Wyatt, all of these people that use those kinds

(46:22):
of things, there are so many different ways you could
probably shoot off that bullet multiple times and use those
kinds of matches to your advantage. But I truly think
that like the style of cinematic matches is something that
should be treated like a silver bullet. You need to
have the perfect setup to do something like that because

(46:43):
the second one thing doesn't make sense because you're watching
it like a movie, not like wrestling. People fallout, Like
even I would even consider, like not even just thinking
about matches that are filmed like that, but I'm even
thinking about like Hangman and Swerve, what they were doing

(47:06):
with the house with the fire, with Randy setting the
Wyatt compound on fire. Those little things that are more
cinematic but aren't specifically matches add so much more dynamicism
to any rival where you are in. Yeah, so what
I would say is treat it like a silver bullet
if you feel like you have the setup for it.

(47:26):
First of all, think of what the fans would want.
Are these supernatural characters over Do people believe that this
person's really undead or not human? Because if so, they're
gonna eat that up. You kind of gotta know who
you have, know what you're doing. But if you feel
like you have two supernatural forces or a overly dominant
supernatural force that can actually bend time and reality like that,

(47:50):
have fun with it and make it because it's gonna
be different. And nine times out of ten if I
see something like that, like I think about I think
about the Kogar promos a lot in the way they
do them. Every single time they're posted, people are like,
nobody's doing this. Zicky Dice is somebody I think about
in the way they promote themselves. Yeah. Yeah, everything he
does is I'm a TV show host. You need to

(48:12):
look at me. All of his promos are shot on
in CRTVHS style. Is one small decision that completely got
Zicky over in my brain. And I haven't even seen
him live since like twenty eighteen.

Speaker 1 (48:25):
Yeah, yeah, that's wild, that's wild. I like what voice
is saying here, a guy in the voice he says
Pillman made me think he killed Austin back in the day,
And that was very innovative at that time, when Brian
pill when you had stone cold breaking in the bar
Brian Pillman's house. I've seen it a million times, breaking
in Pilman's house, Pilman's holding the gun, they fire it off,

(48:47):
the show goes off the air. It's just stuff like
that where I'm like, man, it is these are things
that their moments, their moments, and I like what you
were saying as far like the supernatural and everything like that,
and in the way that you look at it. But man,
it is this. We're having a good conversation here with Summer.

(49:11):
Looks like we lost there for a second, but you
know what, that's the perfect opportunity for us to take
a break, pay a few bills. Then when Week come back,
I'll be coming back with Summer, and I want to
get some of the Summer's thoughts on the current day WWE.
And you know the news that came out, so I'll
go over that real quick, Like if you guys have

(49:32):
not heard, and if you guys are listening or watching
this podcast here, you know that there was a deal
that happened. Apparently ww is going to be moving their
you know, their pls and whatnot over to eesp N.
And it's a whole thing because it has really droven
wrestling fans into a frenzy. And I want to get

(49:55):
some of you guys out there in household thoughts on it.
Are you guys mad about it? Are you guys going
to go from Peacock to ESPN? They're talking about thirty
dollars a month and then if you know they have
their UFC model. Their UFC model is you pay for
the ESPN and then when they have one of their

(50:16):
big events, you pay for that as well, usually about
seventy or eighty bucks. Is that the approach we're going
to be taking with the PLS for wwe Hey, we
will talk about it, and we will get some of
your guys' thoughts, and also we'll get our great guest
summer and everything. Just such such knowledge and such skills

(50:37):
for somebody so young. We're gonna talk about that and
more when we come back from this break. Think, hey, guys,

(52:52):
welcome back to in your house. We're still working on
getting summer back here and on the show, but the
conversation that we've had already has been really really great
and such a talented there their summers.

Speaker 3 (53:09):
Okay, let's look. Look. Oh I'm gonna say I'm a
media arts major. This never happens. I promise, I usually
am really good about this kind of stuff. Literally, my
computer just went problem and I went I'm gone. So
I promise I'm usually good at this these things. I'm
usually very good at these things.

Speaker 1 (53:26):
Oh good, no problem at all.

Speaker 3 (53:28):
We to my girlfriend for coming and saying hi, and
sat telling like saying, what was up? I think he's
hanging out with me, sweet sweet.

Speaker 1 (53:37):
No, that's awesome, hey, And we appreciate that for sure.
But but listen, we were just having a great conversation you.
You've really provided a lot of insights as far as
what you do, the way you see the business, the
unique way that you see the business, which I think
is very cool, very cool, uh and innovative. Now, as

(53:57):
I was saying before we took a break, we're pivoting
here because I want to get some of your thoughts
as far as what you see in current DAYWW. But
of course we had the news that broke and we
got to talk about it here and in your house.
And that's the fact that we had. This deal happened
between ESPN and WWE, and it looks like that in

(54:21):
twenty twenty six there's going to be pivoting from Peacock
going over to ESPN and my gosh, one this news
dropped a lot a lot of different opinions, But mainly
I'd say, like, mainly, I think that it was on
the downslope as far as like what people thought it's
going to be more money there's questions on if you're

(54:41):
going to have to pay sixty seventy dollars for a
pl if they follow the UFC model. We'll definitely talk
about that, But like from your standpoint as far as
production and everything, where are you at with the current
day WWE?

Speaker 2 (54:59):
Oh?

Speaker 1 (54:59):
Man?

Speaker 3 (55:00):
I mean, I will say when I saw that, it
was the first thing I read when I woke up.
I actually literally immediately woke up, and when I got
my phone, I looked over at my girlfriend, I went,
why did ESPN and WWE do this? Because I truly
think they are starting to treat WWE like UFC, which

(55:20):
is not right. You are looking at two very completely
different fan bases with two very completely different accessibility options
to these kinds of things. I think these decisions WWE
is making, going from the network to Peecock to Netflix,
making all of these moves, they are slowly gonna lose

(55:42):
viewership because of the sole reason that if you want
people to watch wrestling, it needs to be accessible for everyone.

Speaker 1 (55:52):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (55:53):
I think bumping up prices, changing networks, making people sign
up for more contracts and more plans for all of
these things is ultimately going to be like what I
ended up doing and going I'll watch the highlights on Twitter. Yeah,
I'll watch the I'll go on Facebook and go look
at like WWE updates group if I really am not

(56:15):
there watching, And truthfully, I think they're going to see
a very interesting dive in passion. And I could just
be me looking at it from a media standpoint. I
could be totally wrong and people could all be buying
ESPN up but I know I'm not buying ESPN for WWE. Yeah,

(56:35):
you're pricing out people who are who are there to
be fans. You are pricing out people. It's like concerts.
I work in the concert business. My shoe is concert
security and venue stuff, so I see it all the time.
People come up to me, Wow, concert ticket prices are
so expensive. People talk about wrestling in that way. WWE

(56:57):
tickets are so expensive, and sure they still sell out,
but that's also because they have two million watching at home.

Speaker 1 (57:06):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (57:07):
It really has a lot to do with one. Do
you know your audience enough that you know that you're
overcharging them? Or are you out of touch and seeing
two hundred and thirty million dollars and signing a deal
and I can't speak because I'm not in that convert.
I'm not in that contract room. I'm not in the
one making I'm not in the room making decisions. But

(57:28):
if it were me, I would fully expect a tank
in viewership because even the way everybody was reacting online
to they trust me. I'm up. I'm just as much
in wrestling everything online as I am in everything else.
Sure people are not happy, they have the same innate
reaction I did by going what the hell are they doing?
And I don't think it's gonna be very good. I

(57:49):
do see them still making money, They're still probably gonna
keep doing exactly what they're doing. But it really tells
me how much they actually know their fans. Because sure,
we could talk about the booking WWE as much as
we want, but the fact that the most fundamental parts
like accessibility to watch are being misguided makes me worried

(58:09):
for the way wrestling is going to be presented, and
honestly makes me think it is even more of a
secluded business now, like nine ninety nine a month to
you had the when you had ten ninety nine for
the ww network. This company is rich as hell and

(58:34):
you still cannot cater to your fans. It makes me
want to stop watching and listen. And I think that
could also be a very universal opinion. But I would
also understand if people think it's.

Speaker 1 (58:44):
A good idea just for sure. But like I want
to say this because I've said that if you guys
are regular, if you guys are regular listeners of the show,
you know that I've said a couple of things and
and one of those things is this, I have have
not seen a grow in viewership in the last one
or two years like I've seen in a very long time.

(59:07):
I mean, I'm meeting new wrestling fans, uh that are
that are young, They're they're enjoying it, and it's like
a new wave of wrestling fans just in like the
last two years. But now, as somebody who's been watching
wrestling since then, since like the mid nineties, uh consistently,
I can tell you I've covered wrestling in a lot

(59:29):
of different ways. I used to write articles for no
dq dot com. You know, I've i YouTube. I was
all on YouTube, given reviews and whatnot before I settled
into doing what I'm doing now, which is ultimately podcasting
and enjoying it. I haven't seen this many people say
I'm just going to stop watching, Like I'm just not

(59:51):
gonna watch anymore. I haven't seen this level. People say
this since like the twenty tens, when the when WW
was like super stale. It was super formulaic. You can
you can. I could tell you exactly who was gonna
win what and who was gonna do. They were just
way too safe. And it was really during that PG
era and that's when a lot of people said I'll

(01:00:11):
stop watching. And then that's when, like for me, I
was in that realm. I stopped watching. So I started
seeking out Ring of Honor, I started seeking out TNA,
you know, and New Japan Pro Wrestling, and so I
just was like, you know, I didn't. I never wanted
to be one of those people that was online complaining
all the time. And then you know what, I'm I

(01:00:33):
hate that the WW did this, but I'm gonna tune
in next week. You know I didn't. I didn't make
a big fuss out of it. I was just like
I'm done, I'm gonna watch something else. And when when
things got better, I came back to it. But you know,
it's just a thing that it concerns me because I
remember back when they were promoting the WWE Network, And

(01:00:56):
in case you didn't know, every single episode, every single
hour of the show, every single half hour of the show,
they had to remind you that the WW network is
nine ninety nine nine nine nine nine ninety nine. It
is nine to ninety nine. So then we had THEW Network,
which I honestly thought was an excellent streaming service. You

(01:01:17):
can you you can, you know, see all things WW wrestling.
You could see all the companies that they had bought out,
you know, whether it be WCW or ECW, and you
can see all their content there in one spot. And
then they opened it up and started pushing towards Peacock
then ultimately now on on Netflix and whatnot, and it's

(01:01:40):
you know, now we have to have two or three
different streaming services to catch all the action if we
want to, you know. And and then after that it's like, okay, ESPN,
are we you know, what's what's to deal with that?
ESPN plus Now you know a lot of people and
I know, I've got mine. Mine's bundled in with my Hulu.
I use Hulu is what it is, you know. So

(01:02:01):
it's but so so we'll see where it goes with that.
But It's like it's just the constant shift that people
are going to have to spend more money and more money.
And it's just like Kevin Calloway said earlier, he had
he had said here he says wrestling has traditionally been
a blue collar entertainment. If you price out the blue collar,
you might run into issues. That's my point, and I

(01:02:23):
absolutely see them running into issues.

Speaker 3 (01:02:26):
You know, and I will say is there is a
very I'm a very very very natural optimist. So I'm
gonna look at this and I'm gonna go I hope
that god more people turn their eyes to independent wrestling. Yeah,
because you have the big head Honcho Megacre pricing you out.
Guess what everyone's gonna look for. Back to my original point, yep,

(01:02:49):
the alternative, yep, exactly. I hope that this actually increases
viewership for independent promotions. And you know what, independent promotions
that don't make you jump through hoops to get their content,
because that is what WWE is doing. And like I'm
thinking about, like Kevin had another good point where it's

(01:03:10):
all for ESPN channels and WWE, which could be worth
it for general sports fans, but not exclusively for wrestling fans.
I think they are muddying waters too much because, like me,
I have two siblings that both played sports. I was
not the sports sibling, right, so I never was really
into those kinds of things. But the sport I found

(01:03:30):
the solace in watching on TV was wrestling. So it
also kind of makes me wonder, are you just trying
to get more eyes on general ESPN content? Is that
the crux of this what motivated them because obviously we
can always go Disney as money, but also what motivated

(01:03:51):
them to make that decision after just deciding this year
and making it such a big deal for Netflix and Peacock. Yep,
it doesn't commute, It doesn't doesn't make sense to me.
I don't understand how you got from point A to
point B and you still are trying to figure out
what's wrong. Yeah, like I don't get it. I don't
get it, And honestly, I think at the end of

(01:04:11):
the day, my hope is that people search for an
alternative and don't give up on the business, because it's
the people that let it go that help it die.
H For sure, the one point six billion dollar deal
one hundred percent. I'm saying money aside because we already know,
We're all they're already thinking about that. We already know.
That's why it's all happening. It's the money. Yeah, but

(01:04:33):
it really tells you, Okay, how in touch are you?
How much do you actually care? Because if wrestlers were
controlling it, this is not the way it would be going.
But media figureheads are going to be the ones that
make these decisions, and that could just be a really
big retrospect. And I could just be speaking from a
really weird standpoint with media, but studying media, studying algorithms,

(01:04:56):
studying content, studying viewership. I've been doing that for a
very long time. They are actively screwing themselves out of
making a unique, separate product, like the WWE has been
to something like UFC or the MLB because it was
its own thing and that's why people were attached to

(01:05:17):
it because they didn't have to watch something else to
get there.

Speaker 1 (01:05:21):
Yeah. Yeah, No, got a lot of good points here. So,
like I was, we have the you know, in your
house group chat or whatever, and I was talking to
we're in there, and like, like I said, you were
very outside the box thinker, and I love outside the
box thinkers. That's why I love working with the guy
named the Voice Jazz Joseph, and we were talking and

(01:05:44):
we were both like, this would be and love. I
absolutely love what you're saying about d n D. Support
the NDI's go out there and support them. This is
a perfect time to do it. It seems like that's
opening up, just like it opened up for me when
I went and I was enamored with Ring of Honor.
But you know, we were thinking, if ae W, we're smart,

(01:06:06):
this would be a perfect opportunity for them to jump
in and maybe make the decision to say, hey, starting
in twenty twenty six, our pay per views, our special events,
they're going to be able to be streamed free if
you have a membership on HBO Max. And I truly

(01:06:28):
think that if they were to make that spin where
to do that, I think they would. I don't think
they will, but I'm saying it.

Speaker 3 (01:06:35):
I don't think they will either.

Speaker 1 (01:06:36):
But once again, I don't think they will, but if
they did, I think it will be a prime opportunity
for them to bring in more viewership.

Speaker 3 (01:06:44):
Fully agree. And I also think with the way AW runs,
I have like even just from like the original point
of this podcast being media production.

Speaker 1 (01:06:55):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:06:56):
I was literally just so my girlfriend is just starting
to get into wrestling. She's just to watch it, Like
my sister's finally getting into it after making fun of
me my whole childhood. So they're watching it together and
they're starting to watch it and get into it. But
I was sitting down with her the other day and
I was like, watch this really quick. I showed her
the fault, like the post MJF Jericho fallout where they

(01:07:19):
did the my shadow in Me Yeah, yeah, where everybody
thought they were gonna be like beefing and then they
pulled this move yeah, and they're like they actually like
each other. AW to anybody could be seen as a
lot more fun. That doesn't make it the best. That
doesn't make it come like. I have my opinions about AW,

(01:07:40):
but at least from the presentation side and the way
they promote their characters unmatch. I always look at the
House of Black, the way they did all of that.
You knew the House of Black was on screen because
of the way their promos were shot. Same thing like
going back to w W the Shield. WWE though did

(01:08:00):
not carry that ball very far. They dropped it. I
think they dropped it the second they started booking Wyatt incorrectly,
But yeah, AW never really faltered in the way they
created things like even with Tony Storm, completely different ballgame.

Speaker 1 (01:08:17):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:08:17):
So I was showing her the clip of the My
Shadow with me and we were talking about it, and
I'm like, this is what more wrestling needs to do.
They need to show that, And that's why I think
AW capitalizing on that, especially with all of the online series.
AW has all of the behind the scenes, the media
scrums they do. You could find a spot to put

(01:08:40):
it somewhere that's affordable and get more viewership from those
angry at WWE. Look, it's a very practical business move.
But I fully agree it's something they can do because again,
a lot of people were picking up on that they
had that alternative like adrenaline when they watched AW, Like

(01:09:01):
they take so many more chances with what they're doing,
and they like like Kevin saying, more chances on characters,
and they actually trust the wrestler to do their work
instead of micromanaging the way they present themselves.

Speaker 1 (01:09:16):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:09:16):
Yeah, no, I well, I think they would be smart
to do something like that, but I just don't think.
I don't I don't think they're going to, and I
really think it's gonna be a major detriment because I
really think it is something that could garner them more viewership.
But at the end of the day, I think it's
a very true mistake on WWE's part to be adding
that kind of thing or implementing that kind of thing.

Speaker 1 (01:09:37):
Yeah. Yeah, I just feel like that if AEW like
this is because here my thing with AEW is it
feels like you they don't capitalize on like their bigger shows.
I just watched All In Texas during that big weekend
where they had a Saturday night main event and then

(01:10:00):
which was just absolutely incredible. Love that evolution paper. The
women are amazing. But I watched that and I'm like,
this show, this All In show itself made me want
to jump back into a w But then here's the
trap that always happens with ae w is. They can

(01:10:21):
really tell you great stories and be up up up
during you know, during their special events, but it's the
weekly shows that I feel like falls.

Speaker 3 (01:10:30):
Hundred, that's exactly where.

Speaker 1 (01:10:32):
It's at, you know. It's it's I just feel like,
if they can write and consistently write more compelling television
on a weekly basis and take that opportunity. Here's the thing,
you don't even necessarily have to you know, make the
you know, make the special events free. You know, But
what this is an opportunity to tell better stories to

(01:10:54):
where I, like you said, people are like, you know what,
I'm just kind of over. I'm exhausted with the w
BE right now. They're they're doing things in a way
that I don't agree with. I you know, I don't
want to have to look at professional wrestling as you know,
just another utility bill, you know, like I don't want
it to be like that. This is a prime opportunity

(01:11:16):
for ae W to tell better stories, build up better
characters and whatnot. And by the time, by the time
w W does what they're doing, and people ultimately have
made the decision by then that they're not going to
continue to follow, you know, they're gonna keep you know, Netflix,
you know, because they watch they'll watch other things besides
Raw on Netflix, and if they want to watch all

(01:11:37):
they can, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:11:38):
But yes, is a weird move. It's weird.

Speaker 1 (01:11:42):
It's a weird move. It's a weird move. But this
gives a EW chance to at least be more juicy
by the time they make that jump, and maybe they
can get a leap in viewership from that.

Speaker 3 (01:11:55):
Could you put Josh's comment that starts with wayfan stay
with watching indies really quick because I want to talk
about that very quickly. So this comment is something I'm
thinking about because you started talking about oh aw aw
has very very strange weekly television. I think the concept

(01:12:16):
of storytelling has been very corrupted by wrestling because of
the content. They write stories and expect the moment to
be the reason why the story is good. Sure CM
punk holding up Mjf's picture as a kid, that's a moment.
Sure it goes viral. But the people that watch every week,

(01:12:39):
they do not know how to pace stories. It lows
my mind. And that's why, like saying the indies they
will actually get viewership by drawing in storylines, tying that
all the way back to production. People don't capitalize on
keeping people invested on social media and there are so

(01:12:59):
many cool few I see in independent wrestling that where
you can see both wrestlers are using raw with it.
But where's where's the recap? What, Where's where's the everything
that's happened before? Where's the vignette yep. Even just like
if you don't even if you're a promotion and you
don't have a screen on your in your setup, posting

(01:13:21):
a vignette of a hype up is gonna do numbers.
And that is something that AW does very well. But
I also think both WWE and AEW have a very
superficial understanding of storytelling that is strictly a applicant to
the wrestling fan. When there are a lot of fans
that aren't wrestling fans and don't know how it works,

(01:13:43):
so you need to tell a story to them the
way a movie does before you pull them into the
more spaced out section story moments that we are used
to in wrestling. And I think maybe looking at storytelling
in a more linear way instead of long term booking
will help with the pacing of shows. People want to

(01:14:03):
see a conclusion, you make them wait too long, they
lose interest.

Speaker 1 (01:14:06):
Yep.

Speaker 3 (01:14:07):
But if you do it right and you actually want
to have months and months and months of build up,
you better know how to pace it. Because I will
tell you something I'm able to tell when it's not
paced right and it feels like we're rushing, we're rushing Okay, okay,
we'll stop. We're stopped, We're not doing anything. Oh now
they're fighting again. Like I need that rivalry to be

(01:14:28):
as loud and as linear as you guys are presenting
it on TV to be, because it doesn't. It doesn't
hit the same way every time it shows up on screen.
And I think that's another big problem with now modern
wrestling in like televised state. They just write the story
and be like, Yep, this is where we're gonna be,
this is the time, and they put it over a branch,

(01:14:48):
which you can see in the new on Reel show,
which I think is very very very glamorous for no
reason and just trying to prove, hey, we're doing work.
But in actuality, you're watching these storylines and you're like
this is still going on or wait, wait didn't that
happen last week?

Speaker 1 (01:15:08):
Though?

Speaker 3 (01:15:09):
Yeah, why are they getting jumped again? Like I feel
like I'm watching the same show. So my big thing
with it is it is something that just thinking about
the one thing that Josh said, I didn't mean to
go on a many tangent, but like a big wrap
up of that would be pace your stories have somebody
who's never watched wrestling, read what you have in the
way that it's paced, and ask them if they can

(01:15:31):
understand it. Yeah, yeah, because there is there are times
where you should do very intricate booking and very little
things and space it out over time. I'm not saying
that's a bad choice, but so many places rely on
it and all of their rivalries, it becomes exhausting to
even try and see an ending.

Speaker 1 (01:15:51):
You know, you know what WWE has done, and I
want to get your thoughts on this with WW has
to me absolutely in a major way, oversaturated as far
as getting their stories across. It's the break apart, it's
the break aparts. I really feel like they've oversaturated the

(01:16:12):
break aparts, like when Shane Helms comes from the back,
when Jason Jordan comes from the back, and then here
comes Adam Pearson like no, no, come on part separate.

Speaker 3 (01:16:21):
And last week exactly.

Speaker 1 (01:16:25):
I feel like we've seen this on a weekly basis.

Speaker 3 (01:16:28):
And there's so many other ways to get stories over
and that's why, Hey, this business is about the wrestling.
It is about what happens in that ring, but all
of the amplifications that will make that get treated even
more seriously is if you take those little steps to
make it realistic, to make it feel that way, because

(01:16:50):
if you have breakuparts happening every single week with the
same guys, like watching I watched Raw the other night,
like I was with my sister, and like they had
you know, Rollin's and Knight Wrestle, and it's like, Okay,
I can tell you exactly what's gonna happen. Here, Here
comes Bronson, ree, here calms braun Breaker. The only part

(01:17:14):
that shocked me was Roman, and they did very good
with that. Yeah, but everything felt very I have seen
this before and that makes me very upset because they
have a very prime heal Seth Rollins. Some of the
best television, in my opinion, was when Seth had the
money in the bank for the first time and he

(01:17:34):
was really a little weasel and he really got people
to hate him. They are there again, and now he's
evolved and they are still doing the same story elements
everyone has seen. But imagine if it happened. Imagine if
you see Seth walking into the venue and all of
a sudden, Roman's not letting him do anything. There's other

(01:17:57):
places to use, there's other scenarios to use, and they're
sure as how many different ways to convey that to
an audience besides the same weekly thing.

Speaker 1 (01:18:07):
Yeah, yeah, no, And I just feel like I just
personally feel like that. You know, this is the biggest
wrestling company in the United States. You get hire what
people would consider to be the best writers and whatnot.
And just why can you not think outside the box
a little bit to where a pull apart is the

(01:18:28):
thing that we're doing every single week?

Speaker 3 (01:18:30):
Just like, like, why am I think? Where are we
thinking about this? We like, and that's good. This could
just be like opinionated things from us. But I feel
like just anybody who takes in a story feels that way,
or knows how to tell a story or read a
story or process a story kind of feels a little
bit dragged along for the ride. Yeah, you should never

(01:18:52):
make anybody feel that way. You need to make them
feel like they are a part of it, whether they
are not or they are.

Speaker 1 (01:18:58):
See, and here's the thing, like I know this is
this is just more like a wrestler thing. I don't
know if like, because you're right, you're writing weekly television
and I can understand that sometimes that's a but it's
still your job, you know, And I understand sometimes it's
a grind, you know. But the thing about it is
is it's like in wrestling, like wrestlers will ask each

(01:19:19):
other and be like, hey, are you fighting in the
crowd tonight and then they say yes, okay, then I
won't do that, you know, or knowing that you know, yeah,
because because they don't want to present the same thing
in the same show twice. And I just feel like
it's a disservice to everybody when once a week on

(01:19:43):
Monday Night Raw, every single week, we see Shane Helms,
you know, we see Adam Pearce, we see Nick Allis
come out and they're having to pull two rival wrestlers apart,
and it's just it's it's way too formulaic, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:19:56):
And honestly, if you have wrestlers, like let's say hypothetically
WWE head every single person on their roster putting in
one hundred and ten percent to their work, their character,
their everything. I'm not saying they don't, but making a scenario,
you have these people that are busting their ass to
convey something to an audience. It's like getting Broadway actors

(01:20:19):
to perform a middle school director's performance. It you have
these superstars. You have people that have the look, have
this character, have the drive, and I mean I could,
I mean I could be the obvious one and say
Carrie and Cross is a very bright example. But they
are also working in a little bit. But I also

(01:20:41):
truly do think that Carri and Cross is somebody that
has that one hundred and ten percent. He is a
character and they don't care. Like there's a lot of
people that really could immersify or wrestling and could really
draw in viewership from all walks of life, but they
are written like a fifth grade play.

Speaker 1 (01:21:00):
Yeah, big facts, big huge facts, because.

Speaker 3 (01:21:04):
It's like having it's like having, you know, like one
of the biggest people in Broadway walk into a theater
workshop and it's ran by eight year olds. Like like
it's one thing if you're a writer and you were
a wrestler, great, you have an idea of what you're doing,
but that doesn't always mean you're right right to the natural,

(01:21:25):
organic once in a lifetime viewer. Yeah, Carrion Cross is
definitely getting worked right now, but it's more so a
thing of I want to see how far he can
go with that character, because what do you mean you
set up a time traveler character or a time bending
character with tarot cards and power and could actually tell people, hey, hey,

(01:21:45):
you're you're gonna lose that title and it's gonna happen
very soon. You have somebody with something to dangle over
people's heads that makes them slightly stronger than a champion,
and you didn't immersify people, right right, I don't care
if he's a shit wrestler. He had a character. You

(01:22:06):
have something that people could like look at and be,
oh my gosh, he is actually inhuman and supernatural and
can do these things and can shake up these champions.
There is no Haymaker like that.

Speaker 1 (01:22:19):
And here's the thing. Here's the thing. Like it's like
you said earlier, they haven't taken the opportunity to move
Carrying Cross from a two dimensional character to a three
dimensional character. It hasn't happened.

Speaker 3 (01:22:34):
And I think and that also like the idea of
being three dimensional doesn't only apply to wrestlers, And I guess,
I guess. I don't mean to straight away from a
modern wrestling topic, but thinking about it, I do commentary
as well. But also me when I do commentary, I'm
summer rals and but I'm also the throwback kid Summer Rawson.

(01:22:56):
There is a character in everything I do, whether it's
the version that people I want people to see or
if it's just me on a hundred, if there's a character, yeah,
me and Peapot I very specifically planned the way we
commentate things together because they want to convey that I'm
I'm this random time traveler that kind of just speaks

(01:23:18):
and like I just here. I want everyone to be friends,
but I'm still conveying the story to the audience.

Speaker 1 (01:23:24):
Yeah, so so me.

Speaker 3 (01:23:25):
You can't get lost in the wrestling, but you also
can't get lost in the character, and you have to find.

Speaker 1 (01:23:30):
Find in between artist think of time. Yeah, find it
in between. And it's funny because I like that because
when I was managing and and and doing commentary, I
was under the name the director Hollywood House, and it
was a gimmick to where I was like a Hollywood director,
but I was like a sleazy director, and like I

(01:23:52):
would tell you that I you know, oh, you know,
I have all these accadades and whatnot, but really like
I was a straight to DVD director. Oh and that
was the joke. That was that was the joke that
I felt like I was bigger than what I am
and like, but when I started doing commentary, it's like
you said, you have to turn yourself up. But still,

(01:24:12):
you know, still tell the state responsibility exactly, you have
a responsibility of telling what's going on in the ring.
So I would still be my character, but I would
be you know, I tell everything that was going on.
I would I could do play by play, I could
do color, you know, and still be my character. It's
pretty much like a Bobby the brain Heenan when he
did commentary, or like a Jerry the King Lawler when

(01:24:35):
he did commentary, or you know, somebody like Taz or something.
There's still themselves, there's still that person, but they're you know,
taking the responsibility of being the lyrics to the song
that is the pro wrestling action going on between the
bell right.

Speaker 3 (01:24:51):
And I think, like I think, there are a lot
of wrestlers that are very phenomenal and they honestly could
be even something better if they understood those kinds of intricacies,
whether they are a manager or an or as, or
a wrestler, or an interviewer or a commentator or a
ring announcer, Like if you are truly just conveying yourself
to that audience. You can do that, but you are

(01:25:14):
a part of the show.

Speaker 1 (01:25:15):
Yep.

Speaker 3 (01:25:18):
You want people to believe just as much as you
do that you are trying to convey to them that
this is real. You have to be able to be
ready to be that character at any time, especially that
wrestling is a business that also consists of a lot
of child fans. Oh yeah, you want people to remember

(01:25:38):
wrestling and maybe not be like, oh, be stuck in
k fabe the whole time. Be stuck. Oh you're a mark.
You don't know what's going on. No, people find solace
in the unreality of wrestling. Yep, why don't Why don't
you lean into that. Make everybody a character, make everybody
a little bit of something.

Speaker 1 (01:25:57):
So guess what.

Speaker 3 (01:25:57):
You can brand them, You can promote them, you can
have them phil shoes, you can have them do whatever
you want because you know they are representing your company
as a character.

Speaker 1 (01:26:07):
Yeah, yeah, I mean it's You're absolutely right. It's just
all about understanding your role for whatever you're booked for
that night. And as long as you understand that role
and and and do that role, you can be whoever
you choose to be, as long as you're filling that role.
So no, I like a lot of I like a

(01:26:29):
lot of what you're saying here. Man, Just I've really
enjoyed this conversation in a way that like I knew
when we talked back in you know, back in February
when when we had met for the first time, I
I knew that it was kind of like, you know,
post show, you know, and and you were still you know,
you're you're busy, You're doing your thing. I've been around

(01:26:51):
that night. So we got like a little what.

Speaker 3 (01:26:54):
A day that day, So I was running around exactly.

Speaker 1 (01:26:57):
So we did like a you know, a little fifteen minutes.
But I'm glad that we expand and was able to
get you back on the show. I really love your
insights and your views on the business. They really align
with my own, and this has really been an interesting
and fun conversation. Definitely, I would not like this to
be the last. But with that being said, guys, we're
going to slide out of here and call this a

(01:27:18):
really great episode. But before we do that, I am
going to give my awesome guest co host here an
opportunity to plug anything that they want to plug upcoming appearances.
Where you're gonna be at next as far as far
as doing production, social media appearances or social media period

(01:27:40):
where can they catch everything that you're doing.

Speaker 3 (01:27:43):
Yeah, So, first of all, of course, thank you for
letting me have the platform to be able to, you know,
promote myself and everything. You know, it is spend such
a fun time talking to you. I would do this
any day of the week with you. You are such
an insightful mind and it feels very nice to feel
a little less crazy. But for me, at least, you
can find me everywhere at Summer Rossen or at Summer

(01:28:04):
Rossen Underscore. Usually it's under the tag of just Rossen
or Summer Rowsen. I stream on Twitch, YouTube, and Instagram.
I have all of that stuff. But I do have
some appearances coming up for the wrestling business and for
my own businesses as well. This upcoming Saturday on the ninth,
I will be at Wrestling Revolver doing post production. So

(01:28:24):
if you guys are, if you guys are in the area,
if you if you're ever near Revolver, I'm a familiar face.
I'm a little hard than miss, So if you want
to say hi, don't be afraid to the following weekend
the fifteenth to the seventeenth, I have the Michigan or
the MotorCity Wrestling Expo, which I'm very excited about. That
Friday is the Ring Review Awards. I am presenting the

(01:28:46):
Women's Wrestler of the Year Award. I'm really excited to
be having that opportunity. There's a red carpet and everything.
If you want to attend, tickets are available now. I'm
a panelist throughout that weekend, so you'll see me around
the con just wandering around doing my and talking to
some WWB legends that are gonna be there, Brooklyn, Brawler, Godfather,
you name it. I'm gonna be able to be having

(01:29:07):
conversations with them. Last thing I'll plug for August Divine
Women's Pro Wrestling on the twenty third goes back to
the Uplift Bar in ann Arbor. Literally, we had such
a fun time the last time we got there, and honestly,
it was a completely new audience of people that I
asked about seven or eight different groups and every single

(01:29:28):
one told me they had never seen anything like it before.
So if you are in the area of ann Arbor
Uplift the twenty third Bell Time seven o'clock door six thirty.
I'm gonna be running a lot of the production there
because the main production cj Olwen will not be there,
so you'll see me running around with the camera, but

(01:29:48):
I will be there representing Divine. So if you guys
are gonna be around for that, I would love to
see you there. And the last thing I'll plug is
if you're ever interested in D and D, I am
officially arding up my D and D events again. I
used to run them with my company, but now I
completely own this event. Rawson's Realms begins in September. Late

(01:30:10):
September live D and D events if you ever want
to try so it's right down in southwest Detroit, right
near the Downriver area, so if you are ever interested,
I will be putting stuff out for that. So that's
kind of what my August and September looks like for wrestling.
I mean, I'm around all the time. If you want
to know more intricately, follow me on social media. I
post pretty much everywhere I'm at. So I'm just thankful

(01:30:33):
to be here. I'm thankful to have this opportunity to
talk about the things that I always feel a little
bit like. I can't talk about. And I hope that
the insight that me and con have head for this
podcast has helped you and feel free to reach out
to me. I love helping people. I love coaching people.
If you ever want to trust me with that, I
will take very good care, very good care of you

(01:30:53):
and your character.

Speaker 1 (01:30:54):
So I could definitely tell. I could definitely tell you
have been such an insightful guests and really learning more
about you has just been so cool. And he always
speaks very very highly of you, and and I knew
I was excited for this episode because I knew that
I feel like I feel like some of our visions

(01:31:17):
like align with as far as we see wrestling in
production and stuff like that. But I got to tell you,
my mind is blown with how much they actually really
do aligne in so many different ways in the way
that we view the business. You are a special talent
and a prodigy in professional wrestling, and it seems like
in media altogether. So this was a very very cool conversation.

(01:31:38):
So thank you for taking your time and coming on
and talking to me and all and all of the
household out there, and guys, this is the quality of
guests that we bring onto in your house. Check out
everything that we're doing. Make sure they.

Speaker 3 (01:31:54):
Better better if you're if you're from my side of things,
you better go check that out. All right, I'm looking.

Speaker 1 (01:31:58):
At exactly Hey, hit an even flow DDT on that
follow button. Make sure you're seeing everything that we're doing.
Follow the YouTube, follow the Twitch and make sure that
you watched and listen to this after we dropped the
podcast version on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. Ladies and Gentlemen,
Summer rosson here and doing amazing things in production. Look

(01:32:20):
out for everything that Summer is going to do, because
I feel like you might see her in companies and
see her production touch in companies above places like Wrestling Revolver.
Wrestling Revolver is great and amazing, but I could definitely
see with the vision, the drive, the talents, you can
be in places in higher places that you probably didn't

(01:32:42):
even see for yourself, but listen, I can see it
for you. So guys, really appreciate you guys coming in
and checking out everything that we are doing and checking
out the great guests that we have here. Follow Summer.
Make sure you follow all her social medias and see
what Summer is going to do next and guys, you

(01:33:04):
can already tell that with somebody like Summer, it's it's
somebody who is dedicated to the work and that's h O,
W S C. And the W stands for work. So
for Summer, Rosson and the entire team here at in
your house, I'm ala the concept house here to remind
you to tell a friend to tell a friend to
tell a friend to hop on this bandwagon.

Speaker 3 (01:33:26):
And also always let in your house.

Speaker 1 (01:33:29):
Ye, Rosson and your house, guys, you have a great day,
great rest of your week piece.

Speaker 3 (01:33:35):
Thank you everyone.

Speaker 1 (01:33:39):
Yet in your house with conn and.

Speaker 2 (01:33:43):
Your kind of your house house, your house clouds creating
kind of louds wrestling in front of the.

Speaker 1 (01:33:52):
Crowds, Harry holding it down. Anybody can't anybody can't get it.
God just standing on the choice, wisdom, choice in your house,
making wrestling, noise, clearing back. It's like cruise await, action
knows is the person distraction you er see, here's when
you attraction. If this work with some prestling back smoke,