303: Monstoberfest, FrankenDIE - Lisa Frankenstein

In this horrific episode, Professor Mouse, the Cosmologist, and Teddy discuss Mary Shelley's Frankenstein, as well as Lisa Frankenstein, a movie that has very little to do with that book. 

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
We come out to unfold the story of frank Sign,
a man of science who sought to create.

Speaker 2 (00:07):
A man after his own image. Me shock you, I
think it?

Speaker 3 (00:14):
Well you.

Speaker 4 (00:30):
Hey, everybody, slay everybody. Welcome to another edition of Is
This Just Dead? I'm your host, Professor Mouse, joined us
always by the CEB Cosmologist and Teddy.

Speaker 5 (00:49):
That's CB Necrologists.

Speaker 4 (00:50):
To you, the CB Necrologist and Daddy.

Speaker 6 (00:58):
I like that. I like that a lot.

Speaker 4 (01:01):
And I'm still just a small instructional mouse, the scariest
one of all. U. Yeah, we're in it. We're in Monstoverfestuh.
Colin Franken Die. This is our month devoted to analyzing

(01:24):
Frankenstein through various direct and oblique vantage points. Today's episode,
unlike our Monster Serials, episode will be a very direct
engagement with the myth the story of Frankenstein. And in

(01:48):
order to understand that, we have to start with Frankenstein's creator,
Victor Frankenstein. No, in fact, we have to talk about
this weird little gothic lady who wrote this book several
hundred years ago about a sad boy just kind of

(02:10):
running around in eight after having been created by a
god obsessed man. Because you had some stuff that you
wanted to sort of foreground our discussion of Lisa Frankenstein
and Frankenstein based media with regarding the author of The
Modern Prometheus.

Speaker 5 (02:31):
Yeah, I think Mary Shelley is a fascinating character. And
you had asked, is Frankenstein my favorite monster, and we
talked earlier about no, But Mary Shelley is still one
of my favorite authors, and I think her story is
really interesting, her place, as you know, playing with the
gothic and with science fiction, and specifically this week looking

(02:54):
at Lisa frank and Stein. This engages I like, like
the first twenty minutes of this movie or so, because
it feels like it's engaging with Mary Shelley herself and
this kind of you know, goth girl. And so Mary
Shelley born to at the time really famous parents in

(03:17):
this whirlwind of atheist anarchist Enlightenment philosophers, and has a
truly tragic life. So I'm just gonna read you a
little chronology here. So seventeen ninety seven, this is Mary
Wolfston Craft Godwin. I'm born in London to Mary Wolston

(03:39):
Craft and William Godwin. So Wolstoncraft was this incredible feminist
Wolston Craft dies from a fever like ten days after
Mary's born. So Mary Shelley is already starting in massive tragedy,

(04:00):
brings with her into her life and into her writing
this idea of like guilt over maybe having you know,
feel like she's killed her mom, thinking about the career
her mom could have had but now does not, bringing
with her she's haunted. She's just a truly haunted person.
And then you know, meets the bish himself, Percy Bishelley,

(04:24):
and he's married already and goes on to have a
kid with him and has a series of children who
die either in child birth or immediately after. They do
not last very long. She writes Frankenstein in the wake

(04:46):
of a bunch of this death and her tragedy, and
you can see that sort of obsession with both father
figures and the idea of procreation and the idea of
trying to bring life to something dead, and that kind
of engagement goes around and around and around. What's I

(05:07):
think interesting also is there's another book called Matilda that
she writes that gets buried for a long time because
she sends the manuscript to her father, who freaks out
and does not give it back to her because it's
about incest. It's the Matilda and the main character whose

(05:33):
mother dies and who has this very complex and uncomfortable
relationship with her father. And there's a bunch of Gothic
tragedy and it's people talk about it once it was
rediscovered as the Gothic mirror to Frankenstein. So if you
can imagine a story that is more upsetting and more

(05:54):
Gothic than Frankenstein, but truly has a lot of the
same themes, you know, looking for an absent father, being,
having this sort of obsessive relationship with your creator, having
the creator be horrible to you, abandon you, and then
be weirdly obsessed with you. Also back and forth. Interesting

(06:20):
just backgrounding whenever we get into things like Brides of Frankenstein.
I bring all that up because James Wales Bride of Frankenstein,
the sequel to the Boris Karlov original Doubles, has a
frame narrative with the famous Tristan Geneva where Shelley and

(06:42):
Byron and Shelley are all there to write these stories
in the first place, and the woman who plays Mary
Shelley in that frame narrative also plays the bride. So
this same like doubling and the blurring of boundaries both

(07:07):
in Shelley's life, in Shelley's work and then in adaptations
of her work where you've got the actors playing Shelley
also plays the bride in various depictions and adaptations of Frankenstein.
There's certainly a doubling inherent in the monster kills Victor's

(07:29):
wife then demands that Victor create him a bride. Kenneth
Browna literalizes that in his adaptation and actually has Helena
Bonham Carter play both resurrects the dead wife as the bride,
which feels a little on the nose, But it's important
to kind of look at all of these blurred, uncomfortable boundaries,

(07:51):
and that kind of familial obsession that bleeds into incests
specifically is important, I think understanding why she's so upset
all the time and why there's so much raw emotion
and horror in the family dynamics of Frankenstein and her

(08:17):
other work. So with that said, interesting that the serial
monsters are all cast as familial in attempt to like,
oh yeah, Carmela Creeper and Franken Berry are our cousins

(08:38):
to just like kind of put them all in the
same world and make them friends. But the gothic family
is hell. That's why my supernatural is Gothic. And so
the more related you are, the more dangerous it is,
either really or metaphorically. The call is coming from inside

(09:01):
the house, the horror is coming from inside the family unit.
These are all important symbols, and I think that informs
Lisa Frankenstein in a couple of ways. I'd like to
talk frame our discussion of that movie of where it
succeeds in thinking about the horrors inside the house and
the family unit and adopted family versus not and where

(09:23):
it if it doesn't succeed, is it not horrible enough?

Speaker 2 (09:29):
Hmm?

Speaker 6 (09:30):
Interesting, I would say. And I think that's a really
interesting insight when it comes to specifically talking about because
like with Carmela Creeper and Frankenberry, which we're jumping off point,
we should take a step back and say sometimes in
this podcast we say odd sentences, just just some odd

(09:54):
shit comes out of mind.

Speaker 5 (09:55):
A man, dear listener, If that's not what you're here for,
I don't know what else it would be.

Speaker 2 (10:00):
Thanks for going along the ride.

Speaker 6 (10:03):
It's really interesting having both starting with the idea of
cousins and also going with this idea of family, but
being able to have objectivity of not always having lived
together but coming together that way. I think there's a

(10:25):
really interesting when you specifically the relationship between Lisa and
her sister as not the docs. Myself, I am an
only child, so I've always kind of like viewed like
sibling relationships, being like, y'all have your own thing going on.
But seeing how Lisa and her sister start, like what

(10:48):
their relationship evolves into, and how they both come together
and then split apart throughout the course of the movie
is really a fascinating framework, especially when you start looking
at Mary Shelley's life and kind of the adaptation of Frankenstein,

(11:08):
like various adaptations. I mean, there's an interesting way you
could look at how Victor and Igor in the films
versus Victor kind of on his own in the books,
in the book.

Speaker 5 (11:23):
Yeah you have this, Yeah, yeah, definitely. So let's so starting.
The thing I like most about this film is the
initial goth nature of Lisa and going to the graveyard
and so thinking about Mary Shelley. So these kids keep
dying on her. Then Percy Shelley dies in a boating accident,

(11:49):
and she keeps his like he keeps his heart, right,
he keeps his heart. Yes, So this and she writes
a lot about thinking about herself being basically dead at
this point or feeling like she ought to be dead,
And there's a lot of writing about you know, Percy
is the love of her life and her a lot

(12:12):
of the way she in an intellectual partner and so
not being able to have him that's super depressing and
really sad. So the the scenes of Lisa in the
Graveyard are writing to the dead boy and like idealizing

(12:32):
what that relationship would be like, and being sort of
more dead than alive is the thing that feels kind
of most Shelley like and especially like having Yeah, that
sort of that sort of preoccupation, and then I.

Speaker 4 (12:52):
Start, Yeah. One thing that I also wanted to touch
on is there's something about.

Speaker 2 (13:03):
The the literary depiction of Frankenstein, It's monster.

Speaker 4 (13:14):
Versus the media depiction of Frankenstein that it's weird. The
elements that that they decide to nerve, particularly like the
the juxtaposition between the eloquence of the monster and the
original novel, and not just like an inarticulateness, but a

(13:40):
muteness that the monster sort of assumes in these sort
of popular narratives, Frankenstein becomes Frankenstein's monster becomes Frankenstein. And
I think that is like a pretty grand irony, which

(14:01):
is in the broader context of things, that he just
assumes the name of his creator, who he kind of
you know, whom he loathes.

Speaker 5 (14:10):
And who like specifically refuses to name him.

Speaker 4 (14:14):
Right, Yeah, And and I remember in the novel, like
he learns how to, he learns language. He does a
lot of like really smart shit which kind of weirdlier
echoed in Lisa Frankenstein, like when he frames the servant
for like the murder that he commits, like that kind
of weird shit that he does in the novel. So's

(14:35):
he's capable of like very very complicated thoughts. But like
the media depiction is and I think this is part
of when we talk about universal monsters and how they're
depicted and what was scary the kind of like and
this goes all the way to to Michael Myers, the
kind of like lumbering the thing, the object that moves

(14:59):
and it in a slow way where you can possibly
think that it would catch you, but it always does.
And so it's this like impending doom that is just
moving forward with unstoppably and no matter what you do,
it's going to get you eventually, which is the tagline

(15:21):
where I believe the Goolies that bizarrely gets mapped onto
Frankenstein in this sort of like universal monster lore, and
is also replicated in in Lisa Frankenstein to a degree
where much like the original, I believe he doesn't really

(15:43):
talk until the Brider Frankenstein, which is the sequel to
the original nineteen thirties one, and that is largely because
of his now consummated relationship with the bride or in

(16:04):
this case Lisa, or in the original case. I mean
he's also in that novel like searching for love and
so like, is that like the propulsive force that we're
mapping across all of these like disparate versions of Frankenstein
is that it's just like a sad, lonely man who
wants to find love. And that's kind of the thing

(16:26):
that ties it all together, because all these depictions are
like wildly different.

Speaker 6 (16:33):
I think one of the looking at what unites them
by looking at some of the things that make them differ.
Lisa Frankenstein, she's kind of into it for most of them,
move like at first horrified, but then after a while
she's like, no, actually, I'm kind of down with you,
like framing people for murder and committing more murder. Like

(16:55):
after a while, Lisa's like, oh, actually, this was overall
a good thing that I did and the movie overall,
I mean, one of the driving kind of theses of
the movie at the end was like, oh, Lisa was
able to find more camaraderie when she became a like

(17:17):
parallel creature versus when you see in the books. One
of the biggest things that you see as difference differentiating
between Victor and the creature. Victor is a lot more
like he makes it to school and goes, oh, I'm
not the smartest person in the room anymore, freaks out,

(17:38):
and then decides to create the creature, and he's compared
by his golden retriever bestie, who's like, hey man, what
why are you depressed? And what's happening now? Like I
love that. But the other thing that you start seeing
in depictions of the of Frankenstein, of the Monster of

(17:59):
the creature. He's also like he's described as having golden eyes.
There wasn't like a patchwork framing. He's described as actually
kind of more like mythic and really like built and
talking about like, oh, this is like the pinnacle of creation.
And that's when Victor freaks out because this pinnacle of

(18:20):
creation that doesn't have thought, and he gets even more
pissed off when this monster on his own starts learning.
So it's the reason I bring all that up to
see what the through line is is more I think
outside of the shambling thing coming to get you, it's

(18:40):
more about an idea that you have that is now
run away from your control. And that's what I think
ties all of them together. In every depiction of Frankenstein,
you have this Oh oops, it went way further than
I thought it would.

Speaker 5 (18:58):
Bring it back to schill It, I think you've hit
on the driving force if we think about that as
a parent child relationship of an overbearing, obsessive parent who
cannot let go of a and then gets threatened by
this child who I'm either you both obsessed with but

(19:19):
ignoring watching them there, they've been abandoned, they go off
find start to self actualize and now that's either alluring
or threatening to a parent, as like I wanted to
have control over them forever or I didn't want to
bother with it at all, But now that I can

(19:40):
see them as a fully formed adult, I want to
engage on that level. But there's this like power imbalance.
That idea of going being out of control is I
think closest to Shelley Mary. Shelley's the things that she's
mulling over in all of her work.

Speaker 4 (20:02):
But the difference in Lisa Frankenstein is there's no fucking Frankenstein.
The act of creation is an act of random chance.
It's a lightning bolt that animates a statue. And so
this this movie is interesting because it eliminates something that
I think it's a very contemporary take.

Speaker 2 (20:23):
It eliminates the thing that has supplanted.

Speaker 4 (20:26):
The creator or sorry, it emphasizes the thing that has
supplanted the creator and has has focused in on the
relationship that the monster has to the bride as being
the origin story of the monster rather than him being

(20:48):
created in a lab. That is totally eliminated from this telling.
And the what I think is is fascinating about this
movie is that it's so on the nose about how
the creature needs love that the final piece to put

(21:09):
him together is the chopped off penis of the high
school literary magazine editor editor that he that he attaches
to himself and then jolts himself in a tanning bed,
and then Cole Sprouse comes out and all of his
mediocre glory to be like and I can read now

(21:31):
it's it's this very bizarre subversion. It's this very bizarre
choice that I think is I don't really know what
to make of it. I'm not sure if Diablo Cody
looked at the story and was like, man, it doesn't
really have juice until like love is the tension in

(21:55):
the creature's mind and all this Frankenstein shit and this
obsession with like the questions between like man and God
and man and his creator and the creature as Adam,
and like the discovery of fire and all this, like
all that, like primitivism and the and and the growth

(22:15):
of the monster in the beginning isn't as interesting without
a bridal companion and that dynamic that in this movie
it centralizes that and it shows the first thing that
you see is the surrogate for the bride and how
that relationship is instrumental, and then like realizing a humanity

(22:38):
in the Monster.

Speaker 5 (22:40):
I think that's you're hitting on something really interesting here,
which is it's trying to cut out a lot of
the central anxieties of Frankenstein. And I'm gonna bring it
back to supernatural for a second because I can't help myself.
The God and Adam and God and his creator and

(23:01):
the Fall and all of that paradise lost nature. The
doubling of Sam and Dean and Michael and Lucifer and
John Winchester the absent Father and God the absent Father
is one very specific way to like make that very personal,
in the same way that Victor Frankenstin on the Monster

(23:22):
and God and Adam and Lucifer, like those sort of
like the personal and the mythic get plugged in together.
If you want to centralize love and you are not
comfortable with the necessarily uncomfortable incestuous nature of being obsessed
with your creator, or that you're having your creator abandon
you and then also be obsessed with you, then you

(23:43):
cut all of that out and you try to go
lateral instead and just do more acceptable heteronormative, which is bizarre,
and we're talking about like a reanimated corpse, but it
still is boy meets Girl and the Bride, which is different.

(24:08):
I think my take on it is that that is
part of why this movie's not scary and why it
leans into being more comedic. And it felt to me
this sort of it had like a Disney Halloween vibe
to it. There are lots of reasons for that, and

(24:28):
it's a very intentional choice. But when you stick with
the teen romance movie, the platform that you're gonna work
on and you're not delving into, it's not gothic anymore,
basically because of what you've removed is some of the
family horror. So now it's a different kind of thing,

(24:50):
but it's missing a lot of the dark, unpleasant gothic
energy that family introduces real quick Jennifer's body, there's a
different kind of horror. Also funny stylistically, I remember being
much scarier the first time Jennifer comes home, and again

(25:14):
there's some like very uncomfortable you know, they're best friends,
they're kind of like sisters. There's a obsession there that
blurs boundaries, and then Jennifer comes home is going through
the fridge spinning up black goo. There's almost like a

(25:34):
ring goo like it's shot differently. It's meant to elicit
real suspense and terror, and then like twist that I
didn't get the sense that this movie is trying to
make its audience uncomfortable at that level and instead goes

(25:55):
with like a Tim burtony bugs are gross, will have
bugs and goo? How do you feel about that difference?

Speaker 6 (26:04):
I sort of, so I would look at it in
more the terms of like this is shot more like
a I Know what you did last summer than a
Jennifer's Body in the sense that this is them constantly
trying to cover up their various crimes. So it's more

(26:28):
of a comedy. It's more of that type of dark
comedy than it is a horror. And the entire time
I think you're I think you're right. I think one
of the central conceits which is weirdly meta of it.
And I know I say I say meta way too much.
But this is about not just a resurrection for creating

(26:53):
something new. This is about resurrecting an artist that you're
obsessed with, and specifically interacting with the resurrection of a
thing you're a fan of and that's where it is.
So it's not about necessarily creation. It's a well that

(27:13):
starts getting dicey, but it's more in this is more
about adaptation than it is about creation. So I agree,
I think I agree with you. When it comes to
the goth parts of this movie are all about the
loss of agency, which is something the Ablo Cody really

(27:34):
does excel at writing when it comes to Juno. When
it comes to Jennifer's body, it's all about, all right,
what do you do when it comes to the loss
of your agency? And in this case, instead of making
it a horror, it is a hey, you're dealing with it,
but you're gonna have to deal with the consequences of

(27:55):
the things you just did for probably ever. Yeah, And
in that sense, I don't think she and again not
to put words in someone else's mouth, but I don't
think the thesis of this movie is that that's a
bad thing, like dealing and engaging with them. The ramif

(28:18):
I'll even say ramifications, because consequences has loaded more loaded meaning.
But the ramifications and the things that you the things
that start spiraling out from things that you did, doesn't
have to be a bad thing, whereas Mary Shelley her

(28:38):
view of I mean, her view of Victor is that
Victor starts something and then continually fucks it up more
and more. And that's the horror element. The thing that
he did that he went, oh no, the monster itself
isn't the isn't the thing that he did wrong. The

(29:00):
abandonment was the I'm sweeping this under the rug and
getting married to do a heteronormative thing than that the
consequences of his action, where hey, you did an inaction,
how dare you? And I'll also, I know you've been
obsessed with me and you still pretend that you're not.
Whereas this, I mean, that's a but then when we

(29:25):
have and then I love that bringing up Jennifer's body
because we have this additional The obsession isn't the bad thing.
The engaging with your craft, your obsession or what have
you isn't the bad thing. It is the abandonment and

(29:46):
trying to cover it up with something else. That's when
things start coming going wrong. And in that sense, yeah,
Lisa Frankenstein is more of a dark comedy and celebration
of engaging with the thing that you're working with.

Speaker 4 (30:02):
Well, yeah, and I definitely agree with that, And I
mean there's a degree to which there's a degree to
which and you know, we'll see if Geramo can pull
it off that you just can't make Frankenstein scary in
the way the Jennifer's body is scary. Jennifer's body is
scary in a very sort of traditional type of horror way, and.

Speaker 2 (30:24):
Arguably Jennifer's body is not that scary.

Speaker 4 (30:27):
And that's why that movie was such a box office
failures because they marketed as this weird horror when it
was actually that movie is fucking hysterical. I remember watching
that when it came out with like a group of
people in a dorm, and that is the exact type
of audience for that movie, is like a bunch of

(30:47):
nineteen and twenty year olds crowded around a common room
television watching this absolutely bonkers, crazy, quirky, totally original film
and going into it with a set of expectations and
then realizing that for half of the movie you're laughing

(31:07):
like uproariously at just being so aghast at what's going on,
which I think Diablo Cody and to your point about
this sort of like is there a homo erotic tension
or a homosocial tension that the that the writers and
the and the creators of this movie are sort of

(31:30):
scared to explore.

Speaker 2 (31:31):
If it was.

Speaker 4 (31:31):
Anyone besides Diablo Cody, I might take that reading as probable.

Speaker 2 (31:39):
Because it's Diablo Cody.

Speaker 4 (31:41):
I think that what she's doing is trying to tell
a story of the bride that centralizes the experience of
the bride and then creating a parallel between the Bride
and Frankenstein by removing both of their creators.

Speaker 2 (31:59):
And so the original trauma that.

Speaker 4 (32:03):
Lisa Frankenstein experiences in this film is the ghastly graphic
murder of her mother right in front of her and Frankenstein.

Speaker 2 (32:15):
The creature.

Speaker 4 (32:17):
Inhabits the world through an active random chance and has
no ability to communicate where he came from, has no
ability to communicate who he is, has no ability to communicate,
So he's in He's on Earth without a creator, which
is a much more realistic experience of the creation of man,

(32:42):
because we showed up here and God was already dead, right,
And so it is this weird way in which now
these two characters are inhabiting this kind of Adam and
Eve in the nineteen eighties bit. And this, honestly is
the part of the movie that lost me is just

(33:02):
the eighties setting, and the choice of that I felt
was arbitrary. I feel like they just one of those
needle drops. There's nothing inherent about this period that seems
to warrant or demand of Frankenstein's story. There are other
periods where I could see it very much fitting in,

(33:23):
and so that was what was really kind of selling
it for me, is when these two central figures are
connecting with one another based in their shared traumatic experiences
of losing your creator, nurturer, mother figure, or it just

(33:48):
suddenly being faced with the task of existence non consensually,
which is what we're all doing and the others.

Speaker 2 (34:00):
Here none of us did. And then the other piece
of that too is that, like.

Speaker 4 (34:05):
The the first murder that they commit, and I think
this is probably one of the best scenes in the
movie is Carla Gugino is going off on Catherine Hahn
in the most like she's sorry, Catherine Newton in the
and the most in the most like she's obviously about

(34:28):
to die way that a movie can telegraph like. She
calls her teenage step daughter a whore, wearing like full
eighties jazzer size outfit, and you know there's a monster
in the closet. That's like, that's like a guy that
made a billion dollars talking on his cell phone and
walking backwards into a highway. It's like, it's just like

(34:51):
the movie is telegraphing what's about to happen, and I
think it's I think it's very symbolically important that it
is a mother and that it is an authority figure
and that it is this like, uh, this shared homicide
or this double homicide or whatever. Later she's like, I'm

(35:14):
gonna you made me an accessory to murder or whatever,
and that that sets the wheels in motion, and then
from there it becomes a very slapsticky movie where it's like, oh,
now they're just gonna kill people. Like the one of
the big belly laughs I had is when they're at
the grave site, and this is towards the end of
the film. They're at the grave site he has the

(35:34):
Wiener right before they go back to sew it on.
A cop shows up and then he immediately wordlessly grabs
her and then dregs and carries her over to a
grave and plops her in and at that point it's
just like we're killing everybody and we can't stop, and
it's it's gotten comical. It's like American psycho level comical.

(35:57):
How many people were killing and we can't stop or
help ourselves. And I think that's what the movie is
trying to heighten. And the degree to which is successful
I think is you know, uh, uneven.

Speaker 6 (36:12):
Well, I will say, it's interesting when you bring up
communication in this particular one, he does actually have a
fairly significant way of communicating through music, Like he is
able to like that's how they kind of bond throughout
before they start killing people.

Speaker 2 (36:27):
Together kind of.

Speaker 4 (36:30):
But like she doesn't know he wants to fuck until
the very end of the movie that that was straining believability,
where she's like, oh, you got the wiener for me?
Like he should he should have played a song, he
should have written a song like and I'll get a
Weiener for you or something like. There's the lack of
communication and also Catherine Newton's total obliviousness to all of

(36:56):
his feelings I think is part of their like toxic
dynamic as well. This is not like a this isn't
a relationship that is a flourishing or stable in any way.

Speaker 2 (37:13):
And I think that's that that is partially by design.

Speaker 4 (37:15):
But towards the end of the movie, I was watching
it with my wife and she was like totally aghast
at the notion that at this stage Lisa Frankenstein doesn't
know that the creature is into her, especially because it's
like you're you're making your own boyfriend.

Speaker 5 (37:37):
Yeah, And that feels to me like Diblo Cody trying
to lean really hard into It's like a caricature of
caricatures of eighties characters, Like we're so far removed from this,
like it's cartoony. But I'm not sure to what end
beyond easy laughs. I guess the yeah, the I agree

(38:04):
that it doesn't need to be set in the eighties
for any particular reason. There's no story element that is
eighties specific beyond the like she gets her mother gets
killed by a serial killer, so like it has to
be the eighties or but within't that like the seventies.
I don't Halloween from the seventies, right, So this, I'm

(38:25):
not sure why we're here except to play with the colors,
to play with This came out right at this tail
end of eighties nostalgia in movies, but it doesn't strike
me as having a purpose. But because it's there, there's
a lot of layering on of high school teen movie tropes.

(38:52):
Is it Catherine Newton and Cole Sprouse like we cast
them specifically so we could do like kind of a
send up of these kind of movies, because Chris Evans
is too old to put whip cream on him anymore
for that kind of thing. I don't know where we're
going with that, but it seems like it's on purpose.
I just don't care for it.

Speaker 4 (39:14):
I think the reason it's set in the eighties is
because so this is why I was confused as to
why it wasn't set in the nineties. And this was
possibly a generational thing because Diablo Cody is a gen xer,
and I believe gen xers associate high school goth with

(39:34):
the nineteen eighties, specifically the type of goth who would
be considered a freak. I went to school in the
nineties and the odds, and that type of grunge goth
is a very different esthetic and would demand a different story.

(39:57):
I think because God in the nineties becomes like extremely dark,
like Columbine dark. And it doesn't lend itself to the
kind of poppiness.

Speaker 6 (40:12):
Now there's a.

Speaker 4 (40:13):
Way in which you can ignore all of that and
just kind of make a story set in the nineties
about goths that doesn't like really delve into it.

Speaker 2 (40:22):
But then why would you you know what I mean?

Speaker 5 (40:24):
Like, I totally agree that kind of nineties goth feels
more like Mary Shelley. Yeah, if Lisa is you know,
there's like the shadow of Kurt Cobain like hangs over
this really heavily, but truly, that kind of energy feels
much more like capital are romantic obsessions with death and

(40:49):
suicide and sadness and that kind of pain of being
an outsider and being isolated. Uh, that feels really authentic
to the Gothic in a way that eighties goth by
comparison is more about aesthetic.

Speaker 6 (41:13):
Flannel and a lot of additional deodorant, not necessarily showering,
but definitely a lot of deodorant. That's the nineties to
early aughts Gothis Is that too much? Am I projecting
too much?

Speaker 4 (41:27):
Is that?

Speaker 6 (41:27):
What?

Speaker 2 (41:28):
No? No, this movie is We're flannel.

Speaker 4 (41:30):
You're right, in fact, In fact, I think you're pointing
out some of the huge open I mean even like
I mean not to docs anybody, but like I know
people who have watched movies and graveyards that shit happens
fucking college, and shit, I know this type of goth person.

(41:50):
Like I was friends with these types of god people
still am friends with these types of goth people.

Speaker 2 (41:56):
And it really is so bizarre. Are Yeah, it's.

Speaker 4 (42:02):
So bizarre that you would pick the nineteen eighties to
set this movie in where I think there's something very
ripe and telling about because that's the other thing about
setting and film is what is a setting lending to
the film that is providing both that is doing a
service to the film, but is also saying something about

(42:23):
the setting. And this movie is doing eighties nondescript suburb
and it could be anywhere in the United States, any
suburb in the United States, and it's just set dressing

(42:44):
for the events of the story to unfold, and it does.
It deals with a lot of generalities that are universally resonant,
like losing your mother, like having to contend with your
relationship with God, like having to navigate sexual relationships and

(43:10):
coming into your own kind of sexual being, which is
all evergreen, but again doesn't say anything really about.

Speaker 2 (43:18):
The eighties, where the eighties.

Speaker 4 (43:19):
More repressive less repressive than other periods. Was it more
hostile or less hostile to certain forms of expression?

Speaker 2 (43:27):
It doesn't really deal with that.

Speaker 4 (43:28):
Like the biggest kind of like revelatory thing that Lisa
Frankenstein realizes is a she's in love with the person
that she's obviously been in love with the whole movie,
which is again a send up of movie genres that
don't need send ups anymore, And be that her stepsister
isn't as bad as she thought she was, which is

(43:50):
like a kind of very limited character growth that maybe
it's a Galaxy Brain to Diablo Code thing where it's
like the characters don't really need to grow. And and
sometimes and sometimes people never realize that about like the
Cool Girls is that the cool girls and the goth people,
like everybody would get along if they just.

Speaker 2 (44:10):
Like met each other with good faith. And maybe that's
kind of the point.

Speaker 4 (44:16):
But it is this kind of like lessonless movie that
is just kind of a bunch of gags that I
think it hit her.

Speaker 6 (44:24):
Miss I would say it's earlier in your description you
did just kind of say depeche Mode lyrics.

Speaker 2 (44:36):
Oh so that's what I'm gonna say too.

Speaker 4 (44:38):
Could you imagine the nineties needle drops on this on
a version of this movie.

Speaker 6 (44:46):
I think I would say overall, if we look at
this movie in terms of it's a I I've been
loath to bring it up, but I think this movie
takes more from Franken Hooker than it does from Frankenstein.

Speaker 2 (45:10):
Wait you loath to bring up Franken Hooker. Yeah, well.

Speaker 6 (45:14):
Well, and I think the reason he didn't want to
bring it up specifically was because if we look at
Lisa Frankenstein as a Frankenstein adaptation, it's in very loosely.
You can kind of see it if you look through
the blinds and are wearing sunglasses, like. But if you

(45:36):
look at this movie as more of a all right,
what if we fused Franken Hooker and Heather's then you
then this that's what this movie is. And I think
that might be why I I mean I overall, I
think it was successful in the fact that that's the
source material versus a straight up Frankenstein adaptation, because it's

(46:00):
not it's not even a Glee not Glee. No, yeah,
Glee is an example, but in terms of trying to
take adaptations and monetizing and it's not really a ten
even at ten Things I Hate about You or any
of the Shakespeare adaptations that they turn into teen comedies.

(46:21):
This is a hey, do you want some real niche
like depressed eighties people movies that's a little less depressing
and more fun. That's what Lisa Frankenstein becomes.

Speaker 5 (46:34):
That's a really good comp And the thing is, I
really like Heathers, and Heathers is scarier than this movie
and feels like, I mean, let's see what comes out
nineteen eighty eight, Like it's just at that cusp. But
it's playing with the sorts of things we were just
talking about it. We're leaning, we're starting to get into

(46:56):
a little bit of grunge goth and school Shooter and
some of this much more depressing areas that feel Heathers
feels more Gothic than this. To me, I think that
you're exactly right that this movie is like trying to

(47:20):
take pieces from different places, but it is. It is
It's frank and and it is missing some essential pieces
that it needs to steal from literary magazine editors and
stitch back on. I guess, But Yeah, it's it's hitting
it a very a very different tone, which to me felt,

(47:42):
I don't know, Disney Channel, I need a better word
for that, but that kind of uh yeah, sanitized and
farcical to and to Moss's point, in a in a
way that maybe is it doesn't need farcing. Uh but
but yeah, excellent point. I'm glad you brought up those comps.

Speaker 4 (48:04):
And then there's the other interesting thing about Franken Hooker
is that, like there's also I mean that movie is
basically uh, you know, without comment, but like if you
take the movie seriously more seriously than the movie takes itself.

Speaker 6 (48:27):
That movie begs you not to take it seriously.

Speaker 2 (48:30):
Yeah. Absolutely, But the whole can see of that movie is.

Speaker 4 (48:35):
And I won't say how she dies because it will
take away from the point entirely, but the main character's
the main character's wife dies and he mister freezes her,
like he creates a a version of her by animating

(48:58):
like a dead core. And it is the one thing
about Frankenhooker that is like, well, it's not the one thing,
but it's like the huge deviation from the Frankenstein story
is that instead of man trying to play god By,

(49:19):
you know, animating dead body parts and like creating a person.
Wouldn't a more relatable version of that story be if
somebody was trying to bring back somebody they had lost,
And wouldn't that add a dimension of intention to this story?

(49:42):
And then the movie goes totally off the rails. There's
like super crack developed and like it's nuts, and then
he dies and then so is She has to reanimate him,
but the machine only animates I think women's bodies, and
so at the end of the movie he has like
bobes or something, and it's like like eighties schlock, total garbage,

(50:06):
but also very entertaining.

Speaker 2 (50:09):
But it is this thing of like there there is
a there's a.

Speaker 4 (50:14):
There's a at least there is a presumption that this
story doesn't resonate unless you modernize it, unless you alter
elements of the story, as told by Mary Shelley, to
strike some kind of chord, to introduce a different type

(50:37):
of pathos, that this.

Speaker 2 (50:39):
Kind of.

Speaker 4 (50:43):
A man versus God, man versus nature story doesn't play
with audiences in a way that is compelling. And there
haven't been a ton of straight up Frankenstein movies made,
and this is what we ran into a fucking nos
faroctu as well as like there are so many straight

(51:07):
versions of Dracula that were made that didn't make money.
Nos Faroctu is you know, the exception that proves the rule,
and it is like the best version of the story.
We went through various decades and saw it get progressively
worse and worse and worse. And anytime anyone tried to
do like a this time we're doing Bram Stoker and
we're doing it from the novel, You're like, the fuck

(51:31):
reading the novels better than this shit, and not even
like in a source material is better, always better than
the movie type of thing. But like, man, this is
not it's not hitting like you do, gotta do Vampiro's
lesbos or like you do have to introduce a different
element into this. And it's weird because like they're trying

(51:52):
to figure out how to make frank Kistein relevant and
I think what Germo del Toro is doing is a
straight up Mary Shelley adaptation of Frankenstein, and is within
that novel believes that those themes are resident enough to
adapt fairly almost biblically, and that that will be interesting

(52:15):
enough for people to go and see That is yet
to be determined, but they haven't really tried that on
this scale maybe ever.

Speaker 5 (52:24):
Yeah, and that is I mean, I'm going to go
back to the idea that the reason they folks don't
adapt Frankenstein faithfully is because to do that requires specific
engagement with the Gothic, and that is by its very

(52:45):
nature unpleasant to do and makes people uncomfortable because that's
what the Gothic is for and about, and it works
in horror. But we're in a moment specifically with this
kind of family horror. It's incredibly relevant obsessive, overbearing, patriarchal figures,

(53:08):
but also not something that people are interested in engaging with.
We go through cycles of rediscovering this kind of family trauma,
burying it, unburying it, and Guaramo's body of work speaks
to a more direct engagement with this kind of thing.

(53:33):
Crimson Peak is a good.

Speaker 2 (53:35):
Comp but that is.

Speaker 5 (53:39):
He also likes fairy tale endings, and not like Grim Brothers,
everybody dies fairy tale endings, happy endings, so his work
can have a little bit of he kind of pulling punches,
which makes something like Shape of Water really affirming. I
love the shape of water. It's delightful, but it's not

(54:02):
the lure, and it's like, this is sad and realistic
and it's sort of having to deal with difficult emotions.
Crimson peak is I really like But has could have
been weirder, could have been more unpleasant, could have been
more upsetting, could have been scarier. He loves Frankenstein. He's

(54:25):
been on record talking about how Frankenstein the book is
really really important to him. The question is how far
is he willing to go to lean into the family
horror of it. The farther he goes, the more effective
it's going to be, and maybe the less people are
going to like it.

Speaker 6 (54:46):
Maybe I would say that if we look at A
twenty four and the way some of those films have interacted,
and again not necessarily with Frankenstein, but the interaction with
the Gothic, I think that we can more easily say

(55:08):
there is a horror audience, but it is not a
broad one. So in terms of what success is gonna
look like, this will be a It will be an
interesting experiment to see exactly how much of del Toro's
overall masterclass of storytelling and storytelling through visual and practical

(55:33):
effects like Shape of Water. You learn more and more
about the characters when you explore their space, when you
explore how they dress, how they interact with the world,
and that's part of his cinematic language. I think that
will make things more palatable. But you're right, if anything

(55:57):
in terms of like Maxine, Pearl and X will show
that's not necessarily going to be zeitgeisten popular.

Speaker 4 (56:09):
Yeah, and I would just I would. I would have
to disagree pause on your on your take on Ghirrimo.
And the reason I would disagree is because of Pinocchio
and Pinocchio in the original story, Pinocchio straight up dies
in the middle of that fucking.

Speaker 2 (56:29):
Story, really sad, and they.

Speaker 4 (56:33):
Cut that out of every adaptation of Pinocchio because it's like,
why are we gonna kill the main character in the
middle of the movie. In Ghirrimo's version, he dies and
then he talks to death in the afterlife of this
fucking children's movie, which what a fucking oscar like.

Speaker 2 (56:50):
I think that.

Speaker 4 (56:51):
Of all of the directors in Hollywood, he's the one
who does go there. And I think what has saved
his career is his deal with Netflix, because Crimson Peak
was a massive failure. I know, like it was like,

(57:11):
people don't want to see that shit. They don't want
to go in there and see Jessica Chastain die at
the end of that movie, you know what I mean,
Like that the shit's too fucking sad and people don't
want to see this sad shit. And so his deal
with Netflix, interestingly, he's using it to make that kind
of movie. He's using it to go to the lens

(57:32):
that he wants to go to without you know, being
burdened with the pesky task of having to make money.
I'm looking at the box office returns on Pinocchio. It
made one hundred nine thousand dollars, and that's because it
was released in twelve cities or whatever. And that was
just a play cake Girramo. Netflix has no aspiration beyond
just putting it on their platform, which is the same

(57:54):
thing that's gonna happen with Frankenstein. And whereas a lot
of people are using their deals with Netflix and Apple
TV to make movies that they don't have to edit,
like Marty Scorsese, Girrimo's using it to like, really, you know,
tell these stories that are so formative for him, and
he talks about He talked about both the book Frankenstein,

(58:15):
but he also on his site and sound Polls has
put the nineteen thirty one Frankenstein as one of the
top ten best movies ever made, and The Bride of
Frankenstein from nineteen thirty five as one of the best
movies ever made. So this this man loves Frankenstein, and
so I think this is as close as you're gonna

(58:38):
get to like a filmmaker executing Mary Shelley's vision and
having the capital to do so.

Speaker 2 (58:44):
Now, what is a little bit distressing to me.

Speaker 4 (58:51):
Is the cast of the movie. Because you know, I
trust Germo implicitly. It's weird. It was weird in Lisa Frankenstein.
It's weird here. I don't know, how do you feel
about the cole Sprouses and the Jacob Alordes. They want

(59:14):
heart throbs to play the creature.

Speaker 5 (59:18):
So it's funny. I Andrew Garfield was supposed to be
in this role and then writers strike happened and he
got busy. In many cases, Jacob Elordi physically works for
me as the monster because that is a man who
is huge, built, angular and like a couple of degrees

(59:42):
off from being attractive, like you kind of like turn
your head and like I recognize he's supposed to be
and depending on who you talk to, he is, and
like that's kind of how the monster is described in
the book. So yeah, I know, I don't haven't seen
him in anything other than euphoria. I'm certainly not going

(01:00:04):
to watch that Wuthering Heights thing from Emerald what's her name?
So I don't know about him. As I've watched the trailer,
it sounds like his voice has been retrofitted or dubbed
in some way to be super spooky. He'll probably be fine,

(01:00:24):
but yeah, what do you think, folks.

Speaker 2 (01:00:28):
I don't know. There's oh no, no, no, you go,
you go.

Speaker 6 (01:00:33):
Oh. I I'm a little I don't know. I will
say I'm a little actually bitter about Jacob Alrdie. And
here's why I think it. It rubs me the wrong way,
the same way that there was only one thing about

(01:00:54):
the Penguin that rubbed me the wrong way, you know,
Like in the Penguin, something that really bothered me was
like they made such a big deal about the fact
that they put Colin Ferrell in four hours worth of
makeup to do this movie, and that was just so
they could go, well, don't worry, there's a hot person

(01:01:16):
under here. It's hot and that bothers me. And in
terms of the whole thing about I don't know to
get and hopefully it's not too TMI on this, but
when I first read Frankenstein the novel before, when I
was in high school, before I realized that the monster

(01:01:38):
was an in cell, I was like, oh shit, Like
I kind of resonated with that. In terms of not
that I have a very I have a what I
think a very good relationship with my parents, but in
terms of a I don't always like didn't always know
what was going on. I think I'm actually a little

(01:01:59):
smarter then I might give my credit self credit for.
But a lot of things in the world are responding
with a again, also a large brown teenager in the
aftermath of nine to eleven being like I am also
coming from a Muslim family, So that was one of
those Oh wow, there are pitch forks everywhere. So I
really resonated with the monster and to have Hollywood constantly

(01:02:23):
be like, Hey, don't worry, we cast a hot guy here.
So it's cool for the monster to be there, and
I'm like that bothers me a little bit. And like
even Jacob Elerty, like where we have this guy who's
like I wouldn't say he's even convinced. He's not Peter Lourie,
like you know, you know what I mean, Like Peter

(01:02:44):
Laurie objectively looked kind of weird. Adam Driver is. Yeah,
he's a little funky looking, but the man was a
marine and is still hot, you know what I mean.
So Jacob Elerti is still hot and was in euphoria.
The teenagers think they invented sex TV show. Yeah, so yeah,

(01:03:06):
that's like it sort of bothers me. I will say
he does he his he in Worthering Worthering, Worthering Heights,
I'm thinking too much about candy for some reason, and
comes out but with withering Heights he actually is not

(01:03:27):
a bad actor, so we'll see. I think I hope
that Gammel Detro really focuses in on the monster as
a constantly learning and adapting entity rather than what they

(01:03:50):
have done classically and other adaptations. And also we really
need to go back to making Victor Frankenstein just an asshole.

Speaker 5 (01:04:00):
I mean Oscar Isaac ex mockin. I'm hoping for ex
Machina Oscar Isaac because that's basically the same character.

Speaker 2 (01:04:08):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:04:11):
You know what's weird about it is that like there
are like, I mean, Girmal del Toro has worked with
what is Homeboy's name, Doug Jones. Yeah, that guy is
like Frankenstein. Frankenstein is like eight feet tall, like freaky, grotesque, weird,

(01:04:34):
like long angular face like looks like it's scary. He's
fucking scary, right, And I'm like, you got this guy
that you've worked with a million times, you're making Frankenstein,
and that dude's phone never rang that That motherfucker must
be pissed because he's like I had to do all

(01:04:54):
this shit to my face to play the fucking fish guy.
This one I could just kind of show up. I
already kind of look like this motherfucker. Put me on lists,
do some force perspective. I'm ugly, you know what I mean,
but like ugly in an interesting way. With Jacob Belordi,
it's like, yeah, let's cast like the tallest, youngest, hottest

(01:05:16):
actor and do a lot of prosthetics on him, which
it's just it's weird to me because I was like
convinced when they announced this. I'm like, oh, Doug Jones
got another gig, but they're going with somebody else.

Speaker 2 (01:05:28):
They're going with the Fame play. Even Andrew Garfield is
a Fame play.

Speaker 4 (01:05:31):
That dude is beautiful, Like what But what is interesting
about the cast and maybe they're gonna play on this,
is that Jacoblordi is this like hunkish dude. He's surrounded
by fucking freaks in this movie, like Geirmo put all
of the freaks in Hollywood in this Oscar Isaac is
the is the lead.

Speaker 2 (01:05:53):
Mia goth Earl herself, Maxine herself the Kia's most unsettled
like character actress out right now. They didn't get mess Michelson,
they got his brother to be in this movie. Fucking
Christoph Vaultz is in this movie. They just got. He

(01:06:15):
just cast all the freaks.

Speaker 4 (01:06:17):
Charles Dance, Tywyn Lanister from Game of Thrones is in
the fucking movie they got. He got all the freaks
from Hollywood and then and then the monster, the grotesque,
disgusting one is the hottest dude in the industry right now,
So maybe there's something to that is.

Speaker 6 (01:06:34):
He Actually I've got it, And maybe this is again
telegraphing too much about me, But in the in the novel,
is he actually is the monster ever really described as
grotesque or is it more like mostly Victor is the
one who freaks out. Everybody else kind of freaks out
because he has They only freak out when he has
weird eyes.

Speaker 5 (01:06:54):
Well, from what I remember, we get Victor's perspective on him,
which is I couldn't make him normal sized because I
needed to do macro surgery. So he's huge, and here's
all of these pieces of him that would otherwise be attractive,
but they're not when they're all cobbled together and magnified
and dead that I.

Speaker 6 (01:07:15):
Yeah, I'm part of me. Like going back and maybe
I'll have to reread it, but from my recollection when
I reread it a couple of years ago, uh, just
going off of the descriptions of both Victor and the
uh not not just Victor but the the explorer who

(01:07:36):
first runs into the monster, they're kind of like, well,
that's a dude who's huge and has gold eyes. That
was kind of the extent to which we get a
description of the monster outside of Victor, who was like,
oh yeah, I remember the horrifying, quivering mass that I
made out of electricity and hope or and abject fear.

(01:07:56):
And that's like, you know, also, Victor's breaks not the
most trustworthy author.

Speaker 5 (01:08:02):
True, So well, I'll leave you with this. I'll just
read you the quote. Sure, his limbs were in proportion,
and I had selected his features as beautiful, beautiful, great god.
His yellow skin scarcely covered the work of muscles and
arteries beneath. His hair was of a lustrous black and
flowing his teeth of a pearly whiteness. But these luxuriances

(01:08:24):
only formed a more horrid contrast with his watery eyes
that seemed almost of the same color as the dune
white sockets in which they were set, his shriveled complexion,
and straight black lips. So it's just like it's like but.

Speaker 1 (01:08:40):
It's like a couple of degrees off, like it would
have been hot but isn't. And that's the gothic, right,
that's the like push and pull of I am attracted
to it, but I'm repelled by it. And that's that's
kind of where Yeah, you.

Speaker 6 (01:08:53):
Know, I think black. Look, you just described somebody with
black lipstick, gold bronzer hair and has big limbs.

Speaker 3 (01:09:02):
What that's no but but it's it's a face that's
cobbled together. He just said that his viscera and muscles
are peeking out of his skin, like that's not hot.

Speaker 5 (01:09:16):
And he's stretched and he stretched a little bit.

Speaker 6 (01:09:18):
I mean, you know, people have gotten work done before.
That's not that weird.

Speaker 4 (01:09:24):
This is why it needs to be said in the nineties,
like this kind of God, I think you're I think maybe.

Speaker 6 (01:09:29):
It might just be might be more telling about me
than I think. I'm like, that's the description of leonor
In and Edgar Allan Poe was a little more unsettling
than this, you know what I mean.

Speaker 4 (01:09:44):
Okay, I mean it's it's also like I do remember,
so his tea, he's like he has like veneers, but
then he also has like dead, washed out skin, and
then these black lips.

Speaker 2 (01:09:57):
He looks like gold.

Speaker 6 (01:09:58):
He was like yellow and oh yellow, well okay, yeah,
also a little yellow which is.

Speaker 4 (01:10:03):
Yellow yellow in the in like jaundice. He's like sallow.
He looks sick. So there's like a sick jaundice man
with veneers and black lips running around.

Speaker 6 (01:10:14):
Marilyn Manson.

Speaker 2 (01:10:15):
Yeah, yeah, Marilyn terrifying. Okay, Doug Jones.

Speaker 6 (01:10:21):
You didn't hang out in goth clubs in the early
two thousnds.

Speaker 4 (01:10:24):
I'm just saying, Marilyn Manson famously so hot.

Speaker 6 (01:10:32):
That's a whole other unfortunate conversation of mess up celebrities unfortunately.

Speaker 2 (01:10:39):
Yeah, yeah, I don't know. Is this just hot a.

Speaker 6 (01:10:44):
New we have a spinoff podcast of a.

Speaker 4 (01:10:48):
New segment on the show where I mean we basically
just do the the website hot or not. But I
don't know. It's interesting, it is, It is interesting. I
think at the very least, it's an uncommon appearance. Yeah,
that he has, which is not honestly, Jacob Lordi, Jacob

(01:11:10):
Elorti looks like every leading man in Hollywood, and so
it is that thing where they're gonna do a bunch
of shit to his face where it's like, I mean,
fucking the guy that plays art the clown definitely not
famous enough, but like kind of already looks like Frankenstein. Tall, weird, sallow,
jaundiced guy with like weird teeth and and a and

(01:11:31):
a and a face that looks cobbled together from other faces.

Speaker 2 (01:11:35):
It is probably.

Speaker 4 (01:11:39):
A good way of like, if you're casting Frankenstein, you're
gonna go, Yeah, your face doesn't look like everything about
your face is fine, but put together, it looks all
fucked up.

Speaker 2 (01:11:50):
And that's kind of like what we're going for here.

Speaker 4 (01:11:56):
I Yeah, I think this is a great conversation to
kind of really foreground all of these themes and these elements, and.

Speaker 2 (01:12:10):
It's a great way to sort of also really.

Speaker 4 (01:12:13):
Prep ourselves for And we can't promise that we will
release an episode on Halloween covering Gammel del Tors Frankenstein.
We're gonna try our best. If it doesn't happen, it
doesn't happen, and we'll cover it when it comes out
on Netflix. It'll be the Thanksgiving Special because I think
it comes out on Thanksgiving week, and we'll find yeah,

(01:12:33):
we'll find a way to like, uh like fucking toe Furky.

Speaker 2 (01:12:38):
Uh Frankenstein of Birds.

Speaker 4 (01:12:42):
Yeah, exactly, we'll toe Furky our way into it. But yeah,
any final thoughts on Lisa Frankensider or anything that we've
been talking about, any foreshadowing or or previous shadowing pre shadowing, Yeah.

Speaker 6 (01:13:04):
Oh no, I was just gonna say, support your local
weird indie movie.

Speaker 2 (01:13:12):
Yeah, go do that.

Speaker 5 (01:13:14):
Speaking of goths, you know and graveyards. Support your local
weird theater company. I just went to a play in
a graveyard about Mary Shelley, and so you know, get
it's spooky season, Go get weird, Go do something that
is a little outside your comfort zone to.

Speaker 4 (01:13:33):
Celebrate absolutely, and that'll do it for this episode of
Is This Just Dead?

Speaker 2 (01:13:42):
We'll see you on the next one.

Speaker 7 (01:13:44):
Boo ooh ooh, ooh oh oh