June 30, 2025 • 41 mins
My very special guest on this episode of the It's All Possible Podcast is 200 plus Game AFL (Australian Football League) player Lachie Henderson. Originally from the Geelong area, Lachie played with the Brisbane Lions, Carlton and Geelong. He also got to work with three of the greatest AFL Coaches in Leigh Matthews, Mick Malthouse and Chris Scott. After leaving the fast paced, high profile life of an AFL Footballer and elite sports person where you are provided with the structure and guidance to ensure you are at your best for game day, Lachie set out to create the next chapter of his life.
This was something that was not as easy as it sounds and Lachie and I dive into the pitfalls for elite sports people when they leave the sporting world.
Lachie has now reinvented himself today as a successful entrepreneur as a Business Broker and Merger & Acquisition specialist in financial services especially with his business KNCT.
I want to thank Lachie for his openness, honesty and transparency especially concerning the move from sports person to life after sport.
You can more about Lachies new business at www.knct.com.au and on his LinkedIn and Instagram accounts for KNCT.
This was something that was not as easy as it sounds and Lachie and I dive into the pitfalls for elite sports people when they leave the sporting world.
Lachie has now reinvented himself today as a successful entrepreneur as a Business Broker and Merger & Acquisition specialist in financial services especially with his business KNCT.
I want to thank Lachie for his openness, honesty and transparency especially concerning the move from sports person to life after sport.
You can more about Lachies new business at www.knct.com.au and on his LinkedIn and Instagram accounts for KNCT.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
We all have the potential to apply the same strategies
to achieve amazing things in our work and lives. Hi,
I'm Rob Hartnett, and as your chief possibility officer and host,
I'm here to inspire you to become the star of
your world as a person of possibility through learning how
people from all areas of life are thinking big and
(00:20):
chasing down their dreams. We've got someone up in the
warm and sunny areas of the Gold Coast, but he's
also happened to be an AFL legend. He's played for
three Brisbane Lyons, Carlton Geelong. He is also now an entrepreneur.
Welcome Lockie Henderson. Thank you for having me, Ma, I'm
be very excited now. Look I've got now as a
(00:42):
long suffering Essendon supporter lockeye. Is there any chance we
can get you to pull the boots on and end up
at Windy Hill? Is there any chance?
Speaker 2 (00:48):
You definitely don't want me to do that anymore? Last
year off footy, our player was up here and I
was six hamstrings. I think I think I played most
of the year with the hamstring industry in injury.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
The way Eston's going the moment, I think we've got
to be six hamstrings and various so we see the
lost two players matching like the first quarter. So I
don't know. I don't think that rules you out. You know,
I'm still hanging in there. But for this podcast, if
I can convince you to come down. Great AFL career
and one of the things that struck me through this
career you've had, you would have worked with some great
(01:18):
coaches and I do work in a lot of work
in leadership as you know, what makes a great coach?
Do you have any views on that?
Speaker 2 (01:25):
Yeah, I had a lot of coaches. I actually enjoyed
all my coaches I had. I had some from Lee Matthews,
one of the greats of all time, Mick Moldhouse in
there as well, and then I had Brett Ratton, young
ish coach when I got there still and then Scotty
who Scotty Scotty Now he's still going very well with
Geelong and doing what he's done over the last fifteen years.
(01:47):
Fourteen years.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
I think it's incredible.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
I think for me, the simplest way of putting it
is the care factor, especially these days, has got to
be high but been blunt at the same time. So
delivering a message is clear as day and being able
to do it in a way that the person still
feels cared for. I think that's the hardest thing to
(02:10):
try and marry marry up together because everyone takes criticism differently,
everyone wants to be spoken to differently. And understanding the individual, yes,
that's part of it, but on a broader scale, been
able to deliver what he needs to deliver or she
needs to deliver, and deliver it in a way that
that person still feels cared for or spoken to in
(02:30):
the way they need to is the is the hardest
thing I think a coach has got to do, but
one that's so important to keep the culture running strong.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
Yeah, so really get to know the person. But so
when you have that message delivered, it's kind of like
delivered with empathy, but it's also I need to I
need this to happen now.
Speaker 2 (02:47):
So yeah, I think the strong word you just use
that was empathy understanding that you're not always going to
get it right because you're not always going to know
every person as well as what you might know. I
felt like Scotty and I had a really good relationship. Yeah,
and he knew me and he might no a first
year or second year as well. That's fair enough, yes,
but but how to do it with the MP to go, Okay,
I'm about to deliver this message. What do I think
(03:08):
they're going to take from this? And if they get
it wrong following it up, or if they've heard at
all that they've got it wrong through the grapevinecause they're
probably not going to know in the moment following it up.
Because that shows the care factor. You can't just expect
other people to do it, or I suppose you can
in a way if you've got a really strong foundation
of assistant coaches, if we're just talking about footage around
(03:30):
that can follow it up and make sure it's like, hey, no, no,
hang on a second, you're looking at this from the
wrong way, young fella. This is what he actually meant.
Does that make more sense? And been able to follow
it up. So yeah, it's sort of a convoluted answer
to say the care factor is a big one.
Speaker 1 (03:45):
But I think the follow up's really good because the
interpretation can be different and the coaching is on going,
isn't it. It's not just one thing and it's an instruction,
it's actually it's like, Okay, this is the expectation, this
is what we're looking to do. But if they're doing it,
that's crazy. But if they didn't do it, the second
course correction, I think that's a really good I think
that's a really nice piece. You decided to hang up
the boots in twenty twenty one? What was that? What
(04:06):
was it? What was behind that? Uh?
Speaker 2 (04:09):
In the end, it was a bit of a went
both ways. The footy club we are happy to sort
of push me on my way, and I was happy
to go. I remember the phone call. It's sort of
we left the end of the season. It was a
pretty bad end of the year in twenty twenty one
and we got flogged by Melbourn in that prelimb and
I was pretty banged up at that point, my body
(04:30):
and even mentally I was pretty banged up, and I
was thinking about it. I hadn't really come to a decision,
and Matt called me Andrew Mackey and said, mate, we're
not going to offer your contract. I remember that two hours.
There was about two or three hours. I was I shattered,
for one of a better words, I was like, oh,
it's over. And then after three hours I asked myself
the question, I said, well, what would you What would
(04:53):
I have said if he had said here's your contract?
And I went, I would have said no, And I'm like,
oh am I worried about So it was a bit
of a mutual thing. I was physically pretty banged up
at that point and probably and mentally banged up too.
I'd sort of had enough of it all, so I
was happy to go on my merry way.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
Tell me about that when you say I'm beging to
stand the physically, and I think that can probably be
related to mentally as well.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Well.
Speaker 1 (05:18):
When you say you're mentally banged up? What do you
mean by that? Was that just it's so much intensity
for so long or what was? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (05:25):
There was that, and I was I'm a big overthinker.
I was an am a big overthinker more when I
was a footy player. I did a podcast recently and
it was sort of like, what could you tell your
twenty one year old self? And I said, it's easy,
don't worry about what anyone thinks of you. Yeah, I
wouldn't have listened to myself.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
But that's fretey honest.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
Yeah, but that's probably the biggest thing that I look
at and I think over the long period of time,
I just I would just create these scenarios in my
head of how much people talking about me or thinking
about me or things like that. And I think that
was a big part of it as well for me,
and I made footy at times really unenjoyable for myself
and the ones that I would hope that anyone listening.
(06:08):
There's a lot of people out here saying the same
thing is made. There's a lot of people that worry
about still to this day, there's players there that worry
so much and it's a very hard thing not to do.
But yeah, I think once you get a bit older
and you finish and you leave the game, you realize
noone cares about you, really.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
Absolutely right. I was joining the group the other day
about this and even younger group, and I just say, no,
you get to my age, you realize that they only
think about themselves anyway, the actually not thinking about you,
and you don't say because yeah, you can overthink it,
as you said, but it's really tough. I mean, you're
massively in the media spotlight, you know, and this is
the biggest game in this country, I think, and so
(06:44):
there is so much more, but also think the younger
ones coming through, and then the social media stuff which
is massive, probably from you from when you started, it
wouldn't have been there or it's infancy, but now it's
so much bigger. And of course so there's there's post
careers and all this kind of stuff as well, but
so much press shut on those players and the appearances
of who they're with, and there's people snapping all the time.
Basically everyone's a producer, you know, everyone's a producer of
(07:07):
content now as opposed to a consumer. We're producing more
than we're consuming in many ways. So yeah, I think
it's a really interesting point. And banged up physically, what
was what was the main Did you have recurring injuries?
You talk about hamshrints before, but through anything else that
was going wrong?
Speaker 2 (07:21):
Yeah, I had a few in that game, and a
bit going on, which is normal, relatively normal, a bit
more than on that day, but that just that whole
I've had fifteen surgeries. I think i'd had thirteen up
to that point, so I think the body was just
sort of starting to tell me you're hanging on. Maybe
you could go another year, depending on what happens. Yeah,
(07:43):
you really wanted to and then it sort of gelong
said no. So I wasn't really that interested in anywhere
else at that point. So, Yeah, a lot of surgeries,
a lot of banged up, a lot of forten years
doing it is long time, as players have done it
for longer, but fourteen years of doing it with a
banged up body was enough.
Speaker 1 (08:00):
Yeah. Yeah, and the Maturn plus games. You've got to
be really proud of that. And I think your career
and you know, you've got to be proud of that.
It's a fantastic that the two run of games, the
Leeble you did, and when you played Grand File, you
played lots of finals, and it is something I think
that you know, so many people aspire to and you've
done it. I think it's a huge part that will
go for with you with your life, and I think
(08:20):
you've been even more so as you get into your
business side, which you're now transitioning into. I'm a Christian
for you though, because I work with a number of
athletes in football and some of them try to go
into corporate careers and not many last. And I have
my view on that, but you only views why that
(08:40):
sometimes they go into this corporate life, but they don't
seem to last, but they seem to go better as entrepreneurs.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
I think a lot of it because if you if
you've been in a professional sport for a long time, yes,
so much of it is set up for you, scheduled
for you. So that's one of the hard things coming out.
But in a way, you control. You're always in control
of what you're doing. In terms of your own self.
(09:07):
You have a good, strong understanding of yourself because you
know exactly what to do and when to do it.
So when you go strain into the corporate world, it's like, oh, well,
if I didn't know something, someone will just help me.
But I think when you're in the corporate world, and
I haven't fully been in the corporate world, I'm sort
of more the entrepreneurs sort of things. My guess would
be when you go into it, you look at it
(09:29):
and you're just supposed to fend for yourself. And a
lot of the professional athletes, especially football, is so much
that we get done for ourselves, like everything just gets done, yes,
And so that would be probably one of my main reasons.
And where if you go to entrepreneur, you're in control.
You would most likely pick something that you understand, or
you've got a vast understanding far enough down the track
(09:51):
on understanding to be able to jump in and go Okay,
I can get through the first part of this by
learning a few things. I can teach myself what I
don't already know, and I can use other people in
that space, because you're usually going to pick someone that
you might partner with, someone that has already done it before,
something like that. So I think that's where the entrepreneurial
spirit probably comes from. And the easy thing is they've
(10:12):
probably come out with a bit of money that they
can just pumps train into a startup.
Speaker 1 (10:15):
Yeah. Yeah, I think that's the entrepreneurial side of things.
Having having the money to be able to do that,
I think is also a good part. I obviously noticed
that in my life in corporate that in low corporations
there I say that there is a pursuit of mediocrity,
and I think that greats on professional sports people who
are elite, who have always been fifteen years or so
(10:38):
of like I'm pushing the envelope, whether we're in Olympians
or AFL players, and they're always expected to be at
high performance level and they're coming to a corporate where
it's like, yeah, it's interesting, but we just can't need
to do this as someone's one of my friend of
mine who's I speakers, she said to me, you know,
I was running this training course and one of the
team come up to her and said, hey, look it's
going really well, but just realize that we're runing got
(11:00):
ticked the boxes. We know you're the gold standard, but frankly,
just so we could just kind of end it a
bit earlier, we just need to tick the boxes. And
she was just horrified because it's just not the way
shop rates, just going, are you kidding? Is this is
this the I'm here like you're paying me, I'm giving
you the best I can do the versus a Yeah,
I know that, but that time too hard, probably not
worth it. It's like and that and that's a professional athlete
(11:20):
is like, I'm sorry that that's a values challenge, right,
And I think when you start to challenge people's ethics
and values when you're at the high performance level, when
you realize that people just are not interested in doing
that as much. That's why myself, I've seen them go,
you know, I'm going to run my own business to
a startup or grab some of location running.
Speaker 2 (11:37):
I did have.
Speaker 1 (11:38):
Another one was interesting was working a couple of rugby
One was a right rugby union player and one was
a wrote me legal keep their names out of it, but
what they said was fascinating. And they went in working
corporate in business development and they were taking getting lots
of meetings, but not getting much tractions in terms of
being deals done. And I had one of my workshop
(11:58):
and he puts his hand up and he goes says
to me, Hey, I reckon, I reckon people are taking
meetings with me just to meet me. Would you reckon
that's me the case, I reckon, that's a pretty strong chance.
Like you're kind of a household name. So I reckon
that you get a first meeting, you're having trouble on
the second one, because yeah, I'm having trouble getting back
in and I'm having trouble closing deals. But I see
(12:19):
the site a lot of autographs of going, yeah, I
think that is And he was really was an epiphany
moment for him, and he went, you know, I don't
have to get a little more serious what I'm taking
meetings with. I said, yeah, for sure, because you've got
to realize you have this brand, and he just never
kind of worked out. But he was still had a
high personal brand as a player, but they weren't meeting
him where he wanted his career to goo. They were
(12:40):
meeting him from his past. Yeah, and that was and
that's a hard thing.
Speaker 2 (12:43):
You know.
Speaker 1 (12:43):
He wanted to balance both that out, and we had
a great discussion and some strategies around it. And I
know he's been successful now in his business career, so
it's got there. Have you ever come across that though? Today?
Speaker 2 (12:55):
I think maybe early on first coming out, I reckon
if you're a bit higher profile, definitely that would happen
a lot. I could think of a few names straight
off the top of my head that would happen to
I'm lesser of a profile, so maybe not maybe the start, definitely.
I find it. That's an interesting thing to think about though,
because it would definitely happen if you see the names
(13:16):
coming out, like a Chris Chard or someone like that. Yeah,
you just take the take the meeting straight away. I'll
just go and see what happens. I just probably just
want to be friends with him, So yeah, it would
be and creating strategies around it would be a huge
part for someone to do it so right, a couple
of questions early on, just to see if it was
worth being there and not worth the time because you
(13:36):
don't want to waste the time. But that mediocrity piece
you just touched on before is an interesting one as well,
because there would be so much in corporate You're right,
that is mediocre, and that's okay. If they just want
to come in and tick the boxes, that's fine if
that's what they want to do and it makes the
company run straight, run straight, narrow and all good. But yeah,
(13:58):
for a professional athlete coming in, it would be interesting
to watch them as a fly on the wall to
sort of see and go, oh, well, when I did this,
I let the team down if I did mediocre, because
that's a lot of where they would come from, and
you wouldn't even know. You wouldn't even know it was
coming from that because it'd be like, if I don't
do this, I can lose us again. Whereas in a
(14:19):
corporate world, it's probably a lot of the stuff that
doesn't get done. It either gets done by somebody else
that does all the work, or it just gets swept
under the carpet. It doesn't really matter because there's probably
a lot out there that doesn't. So yeah, I haven't
thought about that easither either, which is which would be
very interesting for any professional athlete, whether it's team or not,
to come into.
Speaker 1 (14:38):
It's good in fact, And then I really enjoy working
with professional sports people who are doing successfully corporate well
because I just know what they need, what levels are
going to come to, and they call a Spain space,
especially if they've been coached well and had mentors really
gone to the elite level in whatever sport they choose.
It doesn't matter. They all think the same. But you
(14:59):
get I just get more stuff done and get more
traction because they just like coaching, you know, and I
tell it how it is and they've got great empathy
with it. But this is what we need to do
as a team. I'll find them quite if they do
make you can't do it well. And it's a bit
of adjustment for them to they realize they've got to
meet people where they're at, and most people aren't at
their level, which is sports. Otherwise they'd be elite sports people.
(15:20):
If they do do it, then they can be quite
quite successful at doing it. They talk about switch gears.
You now post a football career, how did you go?
Where are you transitioning, you know with your personal brand
which has been an AFL player now and for a
few years now you're now into it as vegan entrepreneur
and how have you transferred or built your personal brand up?
Speaker 2 (15:41):
I'm doing it right now.
Speaker 1 (15:42):
Yeah, apart from this, Yeah, what's been the switch though? Like,
what's been the strategy to work out your identity is
as it shifted.
Speaker 2 (15:50):
It's taken a while, actually, it's been. I found it
a lot difficult. I thought I was ready, ready is
ready to gap come out of footy and I was
good to go and all that sort of thing. And
it's taken me a while to work it out and
work out how to do it and what to do
and even how hard you've got to push and things
don't just come anymore. You've got to really go and
work for them. That's sort of I sort of alluded
(16:12):
to it before with the things I was saying about
with your guys in the corporate world, you've got to
go get it, whereas when you're a footy player, yes
everything gets done for you. Yes, you've still got to
work hard and got to commit and do all of
those things. But a lot of things will just come
too because you have to turn up a training three
times a week, four times a week to run around
(16:33):
and kick the footy. So you're just going to get
better at kicking the footy, yes, in for the simplest way.
And I think what I've tried to do is surround
myself with some really good people that I can bounce
off and then slowly over time, and it's probably taken
me a bit longer than what I would have hoped
for sure, to get to the point where it's like,
(16:54):
all right, you've got to do this, this and this.
You've got to get X, Y and Z done to
get it done, and you've got to follow up and
you've got to be those things because it was so
set for me for so long. And I think that's
what I think, that's what you get stuck as you
talk about a schedule, and a lot of transitioning out
athletes transition out struggle with the schedule. The schedule isn't
(17:15):
just get up. You've got to train, Get up, You
got to feed the kids, get up, you got to
take them to school. It's okay, what else do I
need to do to actually get for the best way
of saying it, just get shit done, just to get
it done, to close that deal, to do that stuff.
And that's something that's taking me a little bit of
time to get my head around that things won't just happen.
I won't just get better because it's not just going
(17:37):
to be set for me every day like it has been.
I think that that's sort of delving a bit deeper
into the schedule or the having things set up for
you that a lot of athletes sort of look into
a lot. So that's something that I'm just just constantly
working at and then just getting myself back out there again.
I was closed my off, closed myself off to media
for a long time and just sort of I like
(17:59):
doing these. I had two podcasts myself and I enjoy
doing them. So I'm just going to start came back
out and talking to good people and we chadded off
air and You've already got a connection for me, And
that's one of the reasons I do it, just to
create the connections and if it sticks, we'll know it.
If it doesn't, great, I've had a great chat and
I've learned something.
Speaker 1 (18:17):
Yeah, so it's good. I think that's a good point.
I mean that you made a couple of really good
points there for people as well, because I've a lot
of corporate people who listen to the podcast, and I
love that one you just mentioned where you talked about
yet the fact that you go to trade you have
to go to training on three or four times a week,
so you're going to get better at whatever you're training at.
I think that's a big part missing a lot of
people's lives is that you know, and I do a
(18:37):
lot of work with salespeople. I go, well, how many people?
How often do you actually do a role play before
you go and do the meeting with the customer? Oh yeah?
And they go, oh, and I wouldn't do that because
you know, I want to be at one with the
customer like all them, like Zen and salespeople, you know.
I'm like, no, it's like what if you stuff it up?
It's a it's a problem, right, you don't you don't
get a second chance to make a first impression, like
(18:58):
how often are you practicing this? How often you get
in coach? How people? People? So I don't get time
to coach my team. I'm like, well, you know, you
have to coach three times a week. You do it right,
but you're not accountable for that. You're you're told you
have to have your sales forecast in every week. So
everyone does that right, but no one's actually holding you.
Say how many times did you coach your sales team
this week? I didn't get around to any of it.
(19:19):
But you couldn't go. You couldn't go to Scott and
go sorry, mate, look, I'm okay for Saturday to play,
but I just didn't have time this week to turn up.
Just this is negotiable for God's sake, you know. So
I think that was really fascinating, and I think then again, then,
I think the thing you came out about talking about
with structure was now the intentionality. And I think if
you've now got an intentionality to say, well, I don't
have that structure anymore, the structures me, I've got to
(19:41):
be intentional about, you know, making these calls, making this happen,
getting this job done, because that's how the progression means,
you know, get doing the podcast, doing another way over here,
getting media. And I think that's that's really interesting having
that structure around as a pro athlete and then you
come out of it going Okay, haven't got that where
that's going to that's going to come from somewhere. It's
clearly starting.
Speaker 2 (19:59):
And I don't know if this is too honust right now,
but I like to think that I just try to
say it how it is. But even this morning, I
had a bit of stuff going on and I nearly
canceled for no real reason but just the fact that
I was like, oh, can we just push it back
a week? I was like, no, hang on a second.
It sort of goes to what we're talking about here,
which is like no, no, no, set a time. I
(20:20):
can do it. I can make it work, and it
should make it work. And it's a great thing to do,
whether it's a great chat that I'll have with someone
that i'll learn something, I've already learned something, because stuff,
some of the stuff I'm coming out of my mouth
still is like you missed it the other day, We've
got to do it now. It's it's it's I find
it interesting that even I'd like to listen to people
(20:42):
now and go, okay, do you reckon You're actually they're
actually doing that themselves. And I can nearly guarantee that
most of the time they're not. But what they try
to do is say it out loud to then remember
it or then spark their their brain to go, Okay, yeah,
I've got to do that myself. And I'm definitely one
of them because it's already I've already got two things
in my head right now and gon't remember to do this.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
Let's get a couple more in there. Now you've firm,
you've got to now got a business we'll call it
business broping for But I know you're doing mergers and acquisitions,
you're pulling people together. And we were talking off there,
and I matter how much you love about being in
the middle and negotiating, helping two parties come together. You
get a lot of joy clearly from doing that. Well,
where did that come from? Where did the sort of
business advisory? If I can even caught that around, I
(21:25):
guess probably mergers and acquisitions? Where did that come from?
For you?
Speaker 2 (21:28):
Yeah, we're using a bit of the bigger words. My
mental advisor up here, who I've got up here, is reperforming.
And I was going backwards and forwards with him for
a while the first sort of year out, and we
just I was trying a few different things. We were
sort of not really trying, and we're sort of talking through, Okay,
well could what could happen? What could we do? And
(21:48):
it sort of just fell into my lap, to be honest.
He said, look, I think we can find you some
businesses in the financial services that's what it's what he's in.
He's in financial services world. I think we can sell them.
I think you'd be good at it. You've got a
strong network. If you don't have that network, you're lucky
enough that you can find it. You can pretty much
make a few calls and someone will help you somewhere.
(22:10):
That's my lucky part of what I've done for for
ten years. And he said, I think you'd be good
at it, and I sort of just went and did
it that way. I went down the track. I've got
hand delivered a couple of businesses at the start, worked
my way through them, and I just enjoy that. I'm
still learning. I've still got the guys around me that
(22:31):
helped me a lot do it. But as you said,
I enjoy I enjoy making it come together. The actual
sentiment is the great end of the end of the road.
But I enjoy the Okay, you're still interested. Here's the seller.
You're still interested, but you're not really understanding. Okay, how
do we make it work? How do we make it understand?
(22:51):
And that's the bit I do enjoy the most.
Speaker 1 (22:56):
And get your experience in that so far? What makes
it good sale ready business? And any thoughts around that?
What makes business really ready for sale?
Speaker 2 (23:04):
Yeah? Well, I've stuck very niche into the financial plan
at the moment, so I haven't done a lot outside.
Speaker 1 (23:10):
Of that financial planning.
Speaker 2 (23:12):
Yeah, so if it's in financial plan, but what I'm
about to say, we'll go to everything. But they would
just use that as an example. But it's so much
about data with financial planning, and everyone wants it a
certain way, but a little bit of a different way
every time that I found. So the one thing is
just being prepared. And I know one of your follow
up questions will be how long? And I think it
(23:34):
doesn't The time frame doesn't necessarily matter with how long
prepar preparing, but just think about it by what you
would want to see as a seller if you were buying, right,
That's where I think it's the simplest question. But that's
what I think a lot of people don't think about
going into a sale, It's like, Okay, what would I ask?
(23:54):
What are the questions that I would ask for? Because
then even one of the classic things that you say
is why they asking for I'll get asked and I'm like,
well this is why they like, oh, they don't need that.
I'm like, well, would you ask for it? And they're
like oh, yeah, yeah, but but but I'm like, no, no,
would you ask for it? Or something very similar to it,
And the answer is nearly always yes, And I think
(24:16):
you just get caught up. And I think that's where
these guys that are doing the merger's acquisition. The broken
of businesses are so important because a lot of people
don't want to pay the middleman like you pay a
real estate age. And everyone's happy to do that because
I can see the value in it because they can
go find and do all the work a broker, a
m and a guy of exactly the same. But the
big part is is that we try to keep their
(24:37):
emotion out of it, because if you're talking between the two,
one thing gets said the wrong way, something gets taken
the wrong way, and it blows up just like that
when it probably shouldn't have. And in my short career.
I've already seen it, yes, which has been very interesting
for me. And when it happened, I actually got emotional
about it as well and had to rain myself. And
(25:01):
you go, just leave it, don't rune any emails, don't
do anything. Just sit on it for twenty four hours.
Best thing over did.
Speaker 1 (25:07):
Yeah, great advice actually, by the way, for a lot
of things at sit on it for twenty four hours.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
Yeah, I just sleep on it. Someone gave me that
advice a long time ago, which is just sleep. I
think it might have been a psychologist of mine, but
to sleep on it always, just sleep on it, no
matter what it is, just sleep on and see what happens.
I said it three times now, that's how important it is.
Speaker 1 (25:24):
On Yeah, it's so important. I think that's really also
that it also that's the empathy, isn't it saying Okay,
if you're selling it, you know, if you were going
to buy this business, where are the holes in it?
Or and where with? What questions would you ask? But
I like the one about data. There's a great quote
by the US venture capitalist and he said, he said,
(25:46):
if we've got data, let's look at data. If we
don't and we're running game with opinions, Let's go with mine. Right,
So it was a great and he may have been
best in Silicon Valley startups, but his viewers, we've got data, man,
Let's look at the data. Let's deep dive in the data.
But if a we're talking about opinions here, let's go
with mine, because I own more and I got more
at stake, and it's a really good It's sort of
got a bit of an urban myth ab it now,
(26:08):
but it's got called Jim Barkstar is his name, His
next IBM adventured capital guy. And it's a great point
because when you get back the data, data to me
just takes away the emotion. Not everywhere it's impossible we're humans,
but takes away a lot of the emotion. They go, well,
this is the data. This is like, this is how
many you know, this is how many members we've got. Well,
this is how many clients we've got. This is this
is the amount of wealth. Whare we're looking after? These
(26:30):
the funds we manage. It's been growing exit from this
post code, you know that kind of stuff. We go,
that's what it is, like, it is what it is
and we've got a bit on top. But people when
they see that and it takes away a lot of
those questions, and I think that's a It's a good
way to set people up is to think about if
you were buying this, you know, why wouldn't you buy this?
Which has been my experience. It's been a little bit
(26:52):
around the ownership is quite complicated, or we haven't quite
you know, we've got a legal one going down the
track was actually global to and it was looking really good.
Both parties were actually quite excited, and then we found
out that they had a legal suit, you know, a
legal legal challenge in the US. It was still when
someone tracked it down and said, hang on, what about this,
and they went, it should be right. It should be
(27:13):
right because the buyer's gone, why about we wait till
we see if it is right and you can't blame this.
I was like, oh no, what what's going on? We
were going so well, it's just got this little thing
to the side, and for them it was like little
thing to the side to the buyer, you know, you
and I they got a legal hang on second instead
around IP that's kind of a big deal, right, or
it could be it took me a while. I sort
(27:35):
of convinced the salary to go, no, no, if you're
in their issues, this is probably a bit well, this
is this is a red flag, like you need to
sort this out or bring it forward or get it
to resolution. But they're like, oh yeah, yeah, probably from
their point of view.
Speaker 2 (27:49):
Yeah, and that's it, and that's it. And that's a
big one definitely. Like I'm not saying it's not a
big one, but right the way I liked it, I
like to look at it and go, okay, big red flag.
And this is probably about example for what I'm going
to try to say now, but it's still an example
that we'll use because it's in our face. Yes, there
would still be a way to do that deal. Yeah,
(28:11):
there's always a way. That's that's my only point here,
and it is it's just whether one party has got
to take a bit more of a leap than the
other and if that, if you find that person, you'll
still get the deal done. That's what I enjoy. Okay,
red flag. Shit, I don't know if I'm not to
swear on this, but shit, red flag. But are you
still interested if that red flag wasn't there? Yes, Okay,
(28:36):
what about if we can limit the liability or the
damages or whatever in some way. Okay, let's look at that. Now.
Some people don't want to do that because I don't
want to waste their time completely, fine, but my point
is is that you'll always find you can always find,
no matter how long it takes, you'll find someone that
will be able to do that deal somewhere down the track.
And again I say, even in my short career, I've
(28:57):
already seen it. Yes, it's and it's been super interesting
to see because you get told no, no, no, no, no,
it only takes one.
Speaker 1 (29:05):
That's right, you only need one buy.
Speaker 2 (29:07):
You only need one. And that's the thing. And that's
I like to and I'm learning my lessons, but I
like to work with one or two. I don't like
to go to the broad market too much. I don't
believe in it that way. And I'm honest with that
with my clients. I'm very honest. I don't try to
sugarcoat it for them. But yeah, I find those things
interesting because right away I see not opportunity, but I see,
(29:29):
all right, let's see what we can do here.
Speaker 1 (29:30):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, And I think so, And I love
that because if you've got you've got that optimistic view
as well. And I think it's a it's a view
of saying, hey, we know what I mean by it's
not blind optimism. It's like it's like, Okay, we understand
the current situation, but we're also optimistic about a deal
can still be done. Yeah. I think that's actually the
value you bring in that middle part. You know, that
(29:51):
kind of middle that's where the middle person can bring.
I think that's where you're absolutely worth your money because
you can have that you're not really connected on either side,
you can have kind of impartial view and look at
it and say and advise both parties.
Speaker 2 (30:05):
And for the most and for the most part, I
would have liked to know if you're using that example again,
is if that would have come out in the first
or second conversation. Hey, because it might be a small
legal dispute, like it might not be as well, but hey,
we've got a small legal dispute. This is what it is.
What else do you want to know about it? Because
most of the time, and it's easy to say after
the fact, but most of the time a BUI will say, oh,
(30:26):
you should have just been honest and then it would
have been okay, or then we would have been able
to at least progress it that way. And that's the
other thing. It's like, it's really trying to get that
and a lot of people want to hide fair enough
to like, I see both sides of it. Yeah, hope
want to hide it, but just be honest from the
start because it's better because it wastes everyone's time if
you're not.
Speaker 1 (30:47):
Yeah, yeah, one hundred percent. I think so been being
open about it. Yeah, I think that's really interesting. Have
you On the other the thing, I've seen recently people
buying businesses and the like, but this group called entrepreneurs
by acquisitions, So there are ones who don't want to
do a startup. They may be in a corporate or
they maybe come out of a sporting career and they
(31:07):
just go, you know, I want to buy a business
and get straight into it. Have you seen a bit
of that happening.
Speaker 2 (31:13):
I haven't seen it personally in terms of having my
hand in it or seen it close around me, but
I think a lot of that is steming from social media,
and I think it's great. I'm not being negative tools
on very negative social media with other reasons but for
this one, not so much. I think it's great. I
think there's so many out there now, and Cody Sanchez
is one of them. She's from America. There's a lot
(31:33):
of them out there, just showing people what you can do.
Like a lot of people wouldn't even know what vendor
finance is, so and I didn't until a few years
ago either, So I'm not claiming to be better than
everyone else, but they wouldn't even know what that is.
They wouldn't even know that They actually really don't need
cash to get in. They just have to find the
(31:54):
right person to structure a deal the right way. And
that's where all these guys talk about. The negotiation is
the most important thing because it is negotiation understanding what
does that person actually want. Because you can find an
old woman or an old guy that's running a business
and say to them, hey, i'll take it over for it.
I'll take it over over two years. You can slowly
(32:14):
go out. Let's create our relationship over the next three months.
Let's see how we fit together. We won't sign anything yet,
or we might sign something that just sort of gets
this where I don't waste my time and don't get
cash out of it, but you don't either, and then
let's threw down three months down the track. Like, there's
just so many different ways of doing it. And I
think social media helps out a lot now and the
world we live in because you can connect with anyone
(32:37):
and everyone's willing to just give you. You alluded to it before,
just content, just creating content. There's so much of it
out there that you can find a way and something
will stick with that person or a person when they
see it. And I like watching Cody Sanchez is a
good one to use, Like, I think she's really interesting
because she simplifies it and it's not always that simple
(32:57):
to go do it, but she simplifies it when she
explains it to.
Speaker 1 (33:01):
I think that's so true too, because when you think
about that space and a lot of people I know
in corporate world and also from your looking at post
career from sport that I know's what's out there, and
it's it's so much as possible, you know. It's kind
of what we call this podcast is all possible because
there are so many ways of slicing and dicing and cutting,
and if you really want to go do it, it
(33:21):
doesn't mean you have to go to the banking to
get finance. It doesn't mean you have to kind of
borrow from parents and a like or radious super There's
actually many ways to be able to kind of make
these acquisitions these businesses. And I think you were taught
you and I were talking off there beforehand. What we're
seeing now is this. I think over the next five
years is going to be this massive excedness of baby
boomers essentially, and you're just aging out of businesses. Nothing
(33:42):
sinister about it, It's just just how it is with demographics.
So there's going to be this massive opportunity to go
in and talk about taking over a business or acquiring
a business in many different forms. And I think the
saddest form I see is when I see the business
has been going thirty years, just closes the dollars and
then I go, man, where the good will go? Like
you're kidding me, Like there's something still there. It's not
(34:05):
like they're making stage coaches, like some of these businesses
are actually still quite viable and they just close up
because sometimes the seller doesn't know how to approach it.
Either they think that if no one walks up to me,
or I put it on a business broking cycle or
something that's so as a fault sometimes on the buyers
don't know they had to do it. But sometimes also
(34:26):
I find the sellers are a bit naive in terms
of what they can do. If you come across that
with all in your short career in this area.
Speaker 2 (34:32):
I think one thing that gets me. I think in
this day and age is there wouldn't be a lot
of trust either. If you've got a young twenty something
year old roll up to an older person trying to transition,
a boomer trying to transition out, I'm just not sure
they trust with the world we live in and again
(34:53):
fair enough, so I think finding a way to do it,
and there'll be people out there, I'm sure there is.
I'm sure maybe one person listen to this podcast or
say oh yeah, I do this well. I think finding
a way to build that trust is the big one
and say hey, I'm not here to screw you over
to take what you've got, like trying to that's you're
not going to just be able to say that, obviously,
(35:13):
but trying to show them, hey, this is what it is.
I'll get a lawyer and you can pick the lawyer.
Like whatever it is to get them to say, hey,
this is what it is. So yeah, I think it
goes both ways. But I think the trust factor, especially
if that's the way you're going to do it, going
to buy an old fish and chip shop, I don't know,
something like that. I think it'd be difficult because I
(35:34):
think the trust factor at the start would have to
be huge. Ohous, you just have to roll in there
with a briefcase of cash and say there he go. Yeah,
so they actually see the tangible stuff because he'd be selling.
If you want to do an on vendor finance, nothing,
it's seen. Yeah, it just it just it just happens
through some sweat equity. So yeah, yes, and no, I
(35:55):
think trust factor is a huge, huge part of it.
Trying to grow that trust factor is huge.
Speaker 1 (36:00):
Yeah. I think the other industry. I've seen the big
work this year with in the professional hair salon businesses
and one of the big trends there. Definitely, it's well
so met in the US is less about a salono
having five or six stylust work for them, but actually
having red chair. Right. The whole redded chair thing has
been become it's default in the US, but now we're
(36:23):
starting to see it come into Australia's are wanted a
bit of autonomy, but also I don't really want to
work out of their home. So that's really interesting. And
what's actually adapted to that is some of the accounting
systems and the finance systems like a CRM system and
the whole accounting systems are now being built so you
can actually have people have their own silo renda chair
accounts all within the within an umbrella area. So the
(36:45):
systems and technology has adapted to these new models and
that makes it really easy so that owner of the brand,
for example that the overall brand goes to sell, I
can actually go, hey, this is I've got eight Reddit
chairs here, this is who makes more made than the art,
and we can actually do their pricing. And that you
couldn't have done that five years ago. So you're on
the data side. You go for the data. The data
wouldn't show any much, but these days the data is
(37:07):
really clean, very transparent, and I think that also builds
trust when someone can go give us look at your data.
The data is the data, and I think that can
build trust as well as because we're all cynical now
and I think everyone's cynical. Now, no one trust anyoney, right,
So I think that's the that's the key thing. You know,
if we don't trust anyone, how can we build trust fast?
Or data helps build trust fast? And you check with
(37:30):
two or three people you asked you could pick the lawyer.
I love that. That's a great, great tip as well,
because you want to build that fast and go is
there something we can do together here? Because the other
thing is people struggling for staff. And so I'm saying
to people now is when you hire your next higher,
are you thinking about them as just who I can
get in at the last possible cost? Or could this
person buy the business from me? And you say to the
(37:51):
business owners and they go, oh shit, never thought of
it that way. We start thinking that way, you know,
because what's the because there's very two different when you
go do it? Yeah, yeah, fantastic. I had to come
up the name of the business, so it is it
connect it? Did I get that right?
Speaker 2 (38:09):
Yeah? That's how I came up with it. I I
don't even know. I don't even know. I was trying
to get something you really, this is a tough question
for me. I was trying to get something that I
think brings people together, right, but then quick and clean. Yeah,
(38:30):
and then I just came up with K and CT,
I think and connect. So and then the website is
l K and CT, which you could say is lucky,
but it's not. It wasn't meant to be. It was
let's connect. So, but it's just K and CT. I.
I haven't used it that much. I haven't pushed it
from that way. I've sort of been just using me
(38:50):
as an individual to say, like I'm not saying I'm
K and CT, come and work with me. I used
myself as an individual, but I had to have something
there to back myself. And so that's where that's where
it came from. It wasn't anything more than that. Yeah,
I might have to rEFInd that answer a little bit
better than what it is.
Speaker 1 (39:07):
That's a good one. I thought it was COCT. I
was looking at it and I was going, I was
trying to work your initials into it, and we know,
maybe that's a whole company hasn't worked this out.
Speaker 2 (39:14):
I've done I've done my job. Then I've done my job.
Speaker 1 (39:17):
He got me, It got me talking right to become
a subject matter. And I thought, maybe it's just taken
off the registration plates in his car and put that
on there. You should brand it that way. That's really cool. Hey,
like you've been fantastic to chat. So we just talked
about that, that connection that happen. People find out more
about what you're doing and what somebody is. So what's
the web? Give us the website.
Speaker 2 (39:37):
It's www dot l k NCT dot com dot com.
Speaker 1 (39:41):
And social media? What are you on Instagram?
Speaker 2 (39:43):
Good question. I'm not about social any man.
Speaker 1 (39:45):
It is k n C T Business k and City
biz or something like that. But I found it, so,
oh you did find it. The first to say, there's
not much going on there at the moment. I'll keep
it find and then I'm lucky Anderson twenty five as well.
But social media for me, LinkedIn is the one. I'm
trying to do a bit more on LinkedIn. So just
find myself at Lockey Henderson. So that's that's where I've
(40:06):
tried to post a few more things. You're not going
to find me much doing it. I don't think on
the social media platforms maybe here and there, but LinkedIn.
Finding on LinkedIn is.
Speaker 2 (40:14):
The is the most important, I think, because that's where
I'm trying to do a bit more. So you're posting.
Speaker 1 (40:19):
Things and you're based on the Gold Coast, which you
work East coast, East.
Speaker 2 (40:23):
Coast, Yeah, East Coast, East Coast, mainly that Perth.
Speaker 1 (40:27):
Now, of course we love Perth. With what we're saying, people,
we aren't glowing with we love per love.
Speaker 2 (40:32):
No comment. I did actually actually something always happened to
me when I played in Perth. I got a good
doubt twice bad things. Yeah, a couple of I got,
I broke my a, got titanium mesh are through my
I can had a really bad concussion too as well.
So yeah, there's those two things. Had a couple of Yeah.
Speaker 1 (40:49):
Okay, so everybody East coast really happy to go. East
Coast will fly up and down in this coast, but
anything nothing further west than Adelaide. Are we going so exactly,
I'll be fantastic. It's been great, great to chat mate.
Really appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (41:03):
Thanks for having me, no worries.
Speaker 1 (41:08):
I hope you enjoyed this episode of the It's All
Possible Podcast. You can contact me at Rob at Robhartner
dot com or my website Robharton dot com, or on LinkedIn.
Remember to check out the previous seasons and episodes of
the podcast, and the show notes for more details on
this episode's guest. For more inspiration, remember to check out
(41:29):
the All Possibility playlist on spotted By, which contains a
collection upbeat, positive music I use for inspiration through my
live performances until next time, live with passion and a
perspective of possibility.
We all have the potential to apply the same strategies
to achieve amazing things in our work and lives. Hi,
I'm Rob Hartnett, and as your chief possibility officer and host,
I'm here to inspire you to become the star of
your world as a person of possibility through learning how
people from all areas of life are thinking big and
(00:20):
chasing down their dreams. We've got someone up in the
warm and sunny areas of the Gold Coast, but he's
also happened to be an AFL legend. He's played for
three Brisbane Lyons, Carlton Geelong. He is also now an entrepreneur.
Welcome Lockie Henderson. Thank you for having me, Ma, I'm
be very excited now. Look I've got now as a
(00:42):
long suffering Essendon supporter lockeye. Is there any chance we
can get you to pull the boots on and end up
at Windy Hill? Is there any chance?
Speaker 2 (00:48):
You definitely don't want me to do that anymore? Last
year off footy, our player was up here and I
was six hamstrings. I think I think I played most
of the year with the hamstring industry in injury.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
The way Eston's going the moment, I think we've got
to be six hamstrings and various so we see the
lost two players matching like the first quarter. So I
don't know. I don't think that rules you out. You know,
I'm still hanging in there. But for this podcast, if
I can convince you to come down. Great AFL career
and one of the things that struck me through this
career you've had, you would have worked with some great
(01:18):
coaches and I do work in a lot of work
in leadership as you know, what makes a great coach?
Do you have any views on that?
Speaker 2 (01:25):
Yeah, I had a lot of coaches. I actually enjoyed
all my coaches I had. I had some from Lee Matthews,
one of the greats of all time, Mick Moldhouse in
there as well, and then I had Brett Ratton, young
ish coach when I got there still and then Scotty
who Scotty Scotty Now he's still going very well with
Geelong and doing what he's done over the last fifteen years.
(01:47):
Fourteen years.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
I think it's incredible.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
I think for me, the simplest way of putting it
is the care factor, especially these days, has got to
be high but been blunt at the same time. So
delivering a message is clear as day and being able
to do it in a way that the person still
feels cared for. I think that's the hardest thing to
(02:10):
try and marry marry up together because everyone takes criticism differently,
everyone wants to be spoken to differently. And understanding the individual, yes,
that's part of it, but on a broader scale, been
able to deliver what he needs to deliver or she
needs to deliver, and deliver it in a way that
that person still feels cared for or spoken to in
(02:30):
the way they need to is the is the hardest
thing I think a coach has got to do, but
one that's so important to keep the culture running strong.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
Yeah, so really get to know the person. But so
when you have that message delivered, it's kind of like
delivered with empathy, but it's also I need to I
need this to happen now.
Speaker 2 (02:47):
So yeah, I think the strong word you just use
that was empathy understanding that you're not always going to
get it right because you're not always going to know
every person as well as what you might know. I
felt like Scotty and I had a really good relationship. Yeah,
and he knew me and he might no a first
year or second year as well. That's fair enough, yes,
but but how to do it with the MP to go, Okay,
I'm about to deliver this message. What do I think
(03:08):
they're going to take from this? And if they get
it wrong following it up, or if they've heard at
all that they've got it wrong through the grapevinecause they're
probably not going to know in the moment following it up.
Because that shows the care factor. You can't just expect
other people to do it, or I suppose you can
in a way if you've got a really strong foundation
of assistant coaches, if we're just talking about footage around
(03:30):
that can follow it up and make sure it's like, hey, no, no,
hang on a second, you're looking at this from the
wrong way, young fella. This is what he actually meant.
Does that make more sense? And been able to follow
it up. So yeah, it's sort of a convoluted answer
to say the care factor is a big one.
Speaker 1 (03:45):
But I think the follow up's really good because the
interpretation can be different and the coaching is on going,
isn't it. It's not just one thing and it's an instruction,
it's actually it's like, Okay, this is the expectation, this
is what we're looking to do. But if they're doing it,
that's crazy. But if they didn't do it, the second
course correction, I think that's a really good I think
that's a really nice piece. You decided to hang up
the boots in twenty twenty one? What was that? What
(04:06):
was it? What was behind that? Uh?
Speaker 2 (04:09):
In the end, it was a bit of a went
both ways. The footy club we are happy to sort
of push me on my way, and I was happy
to go. I remember the phone call. It's sort of
we left the end of the season. It was a
pretty bad end of the year in twenty twenty one
and we got flogged by Melbourn in that prelimb and
I was pretty banged up at that point, my body
(04:30):
and even mentally I was pretty banged up, and I
was thinking about it. I hadn't really come to a decision,
and Matt called me Andrew Mackey and said, mate, we're
not going to offer your contract. I remember that two hours.
There was about two or three hours. I was I shattered,
for one of a better words, I was like, oh,
it's over. And then after three hours I asked myself
the question, I said, well, what would you What would
(04:53):
I have said if he had said here's your contract?
And I went, I would have said no, And I'm like,
oh am I worried about So it was a bit
of a mutual thing. I was physically pretty banged up
at that point and probably and mentally banged up too.
I'd sort of had enough of it all, so I
was happy to go on my merry way.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
Tell me about that when you say I'm beging to
stand the physically, and I think that can probably be
related to mentally as well.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Well.
Speaker 1 (05:18):
When you say you're mentally banged up? What do you
mean by that? Was that just it's so much intensity
for so long or what was? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (05:25):
There was that, and I was I'm a big overthinker.
I was an am a big overthinker more when I
was a footy player. I did a podcast recently and
it was sort of like, what could you tell your
twenty one year old self? And I said, it's easy,
don't worry about what anyone thinks of you. Yeah, I
wouldn't have listened to myself.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
But that's fretey honest.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
Yeah, but that's probably the biggest thing that I look
at and I think over the long period of time,
I just I would just create these scenarios in my
head of how much people talking about me or thinking
about me or things like that. And I think that
was a big part of it as well for me,
and I made footy at times really unenjoyable for myself
and the ones that I would hope that anyone listening.
(06:08):
There's a lot of people out here saying the same
thing is made. There's a lot of people that worry
about still to this day, there's players there that worry
so much and it's a very hard thing not to do.
But yeah, I think once you get a bit older
and you finish and you leave the game, you realize
noone cares about you, really.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
Absolutely right. I was joining the group the other day
about this and even younger group, and I just say, no,
you get to my age, you realize that they only
think about themselves anyway, the actually not thinking about you,
and you don't say because yeah, you can overthink it,
as you said, but it's really tough. I mean, you're
massively in the media spotlight, you know, and this is
the biggest game in this country, I think, and so
(06:44):
there is so much more, but also think the younger
ones coming through, and then the social media stuff which
is massive, probably from you from when you started, it
wouldn't have been there or it's infancy, but now it's
so much bigger. And of course so there's there's post
careers and all this kind of stuff as well, but
so much press shut on those players and the appearances
of who they're with, and there's people snapping all the time.
Basically everyone's a producer, you know, everyone's a producer of
(07:07):
content now as opposed to a consumer. We're producing more
than we're consuming in many ways. So yeah, I think
it's a really interesting point. And banged up physically, what
was what was the main Did you have recurring injuries?
You talk about hamshrints before, but through anything else that
was going wrong?
Speaker 2 (07:21):
Yeah, I had a few in that game, and a
bit going on, which is normal, relatively normal, a bit
more than on that day, but that just that whole
I've had fifteen surgeries. I think i'd had thirteen up
to that point, so I think the body was just
sort of starting to tell me you're hanging on. Maybe
you could go another year, depending on what happens. Yeah,
(07:43):
you really wanted to and then it sort of gelong
said no. So I wasn't really that interested in anywhere
else at that point. So, Yeah, a lot of surgeries,
a lot of banged up, a lot of forten years
doing it is long time, as players have done it
for longer, but fourteen years of doing it with a
banged up body was enough.
Speaker 1 (08:00):
Yeah. Yeah, and the Maturn plus games. You've got to
be really proud of that. And I think your career
and you know, you've got to be proud of that.
It's a fantastic that the two run of games, the
Leeble you did, and when you played Grand File, you
played lots of finals, and it is something I think
that you know, so many people aspire to and you've
done it. I think it's a huge part that will
go for with you with your life, and I think
(08:20):
you've been even more so as you get into your
business side, which you're now transitioning into. I'm a Christian
for you though, because I work with a number of
athletes in football and some of them try to go
into corporate careers and not many last. And I have
my view on that, but you only views why that
(08:40):
sometimes they go into this corporate life, but they don't
seem to last, but they seem to go better as entrepreneurs.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
I think a lot of it because if you if
you've been in a professional sport for a long time, yes,
so much of it is set up for you, scheduled
for you. So that's one of the hard things coming out.
But in a way, you control. You're always in control
of what you're doing. In terms of your own self.
(09:07):
You have a good, strong understanding of yourself because you
know exactly what to do and when to do it.
So when you go strain into the corporate world, it's like, oh, well,
if I didn't know something, someone will just help me.
But I think when you're in the corporate world, and
I haven't fully been in the corporate world, I'm sort
of more the entrepreneurs sort of things. My guess would
be when you go into it, you look at it
(09:29):
and you're just supposed to fend for yourself. And a
lot of the professional athletes, especially football, is so much
that we get done for ourselves, like everything just gets done, yes,
And so that would be probably one of my main reasons.
And where if you go to entrepreneur, you're in control.
You would most likely pick something that you understand, or
you've got a vast understanding far enough down the track
(09:51):
on understanding to be able to jump in and go Okay,
I can get through the first part of this by
learning a few things. I can teach myself what I
don't already know, and I can use other people in
that space, because you're usually going to pick someone that
you might partner with, someone that has already done it before,
something like that. So I think that's where the entrepreneurial
spirit probably comes from. And the easy thing is they've
(10:12):
probably come out with a bit of money that they
can just pumps train into a startup.
Speaker 1 (10:15):
Yeah. Yeah, I think that's the entrepreneurial side of things.
Having having the money to be able to do that,
I think is also a good part. I obviously noticed
that in my life in corporate that in low corporations
there I say that there is a pursuit of mediocrity,
and I think that greats on professional sports people who
are elite, who have always been fifteen years or so
(10:38):
of like I'm pushing the envelope, whether we're in Olympians
or AFL players, and they're always expected to be at
high performance level and they're coming to a corporate where
it's like, yeah, it's interesting, but we just can't need
to do this as someone's one of my friend of
mine who's I speakers, she said to me, you know,
I was running this training course and one of the
team come up to her and said, hey, look it's
going really well, but just realize that we're runing got
(11:00):
ticked the boxes. We know you're the gold standard, but frankly,
just so we could just kind of end it a
bit earlier, we just need to tick the boxes. And
she was just horrified because it's just not the way
shop rates, just going, are you kidding? Is this is
this the I'm here like you're paying me, I'm giving
you the best I can do the versus a Yeah,
I know that, but that time too hard, probably not
worth it. It's like and that and that's a professional athlete
(11:20):
is like, I'm sorry that that's a values challenge, right,
And I think when you start to challenge people's ethics
and values when you're at the high performance level, when
you realize that people just are not interested in doing
that as much. That's why myself, I've seen them go,
you know, I'm going to run my own business to
a startup or grab some of location running.
Speaker 2 (11:37):
I did have.
Speaker 1 (11:38):
Another one was interesting was working a couple of rugby
One was a right rugby union player and one was
a wrote me legal keep their names out of it, but
what they said was fascinating. And they went in working
corporate in business development and they were taking getting lots
of meetings, but not getting much tractions in terms of
being deals done. And I had one of my workshop
(11:58):
and he puts his hand up and he goes says
to me, Hey, I reckon, I reckon people are taking
meetings with me just to meet me. Would you reckon
that's me the case, I reckon, that's a pretty strong chance.
Like you're kind of a household name. So I reckon
that you get a first meeting, you're having trouble on
the second one, because yeah, I'm having trouble getting back
in and I'm having trouble closing deals. But I see
(12:19):
the site a lot of autographs of going, yeah, I
think that is And he was really was an epiphany
moment for him, and he went, you know, I don't
have to get a little more serious what I'm taking
meetings with. I said, yeah, for sure, because you've got
to realize you have this brand, and he just never
kind of worked out. But he was still had a
high personal brand as a player, but they weren't meeting
him where he wanted his career to goo. They were
(12:40):
meeting him from his past. Yeah, and that was and
that's a hard thing.
Speaker 2 (12:43):
You know.
Speaker 1 (12:43):
He wanted to balance both that out, and we had
a great discussion and some strategies around it. And I
know he's been successful now in his business career, so
it's got there. Have you ever come across that though? Today?
Speaker 2 (12:55):
I think maybe early on first coming out, I reckon
if you're a bit higher profile, definitely that would happen
a lot. I could think of a few names straight
off the top of my head that would happen to
I'm lesser of a profile, so maybe not maybe the start, definitely.
I find it. That's an interesting thing to think about though,
because it would definitely happen if you see the names
(13:16):
coming out, like a Chris Chard or someone like that. Yeah,
you just take the take the meeting straight away. I'll
just go and see what happens. I just probably just
want to be friends with him, So yeah, it would
be and creating strategies around it would be a huge
part for someone to do it so right, a couple
of questions early on, just to see if it was
worth being there and not worth the time because you
(13:36):
don't want to waste the time. But that mediocrity piece
you just touched on before is an interesting one as well,
because there would be so much in corporate You're right,
that is mediocre, and that's okay. If they just want
to come in and tick the boxes, that's fine if
that's what they want to do and it makes the
company run straight, run straight, narrow and all good. But yeah,
(13:58):
for a professional athlete coming in, it would be interesting
to watch them as a fly on the wall to
sort of see and go, oh, well, when I did this,
I let the team down if I did mediocre, because
that's a lot of where they would come from, and
you wouldn't even know. You wouldn't even know it was
coming from that because it'd be like, if I don't
do this, I can lose us again. Whereas in a
(14:19):
corporate world, it's probably a lot of the stuff that
doesn't get done. It either gets done by somebody else
that does all the work, or it just gets swept
under the carpet. It doesn't really matter because there's probably
a lot out there that doesn't. So yeah, I haven't
thought about that easither either, which is which would be
very interesting for any professional athlete, whether it's team or not,
to come into.
Speaker 1 (14:38):
It's good in fact, And then I really enjoy working
with professional sports people who are doing successfully corporate well
because I just know what they need, what levels are
going to come to, and they call a Spain space,
especially if they've been coached well and had mentors really
gone to the elite level in whatever sport they choose.
It doesn't matter. They all think the same. But you
(14:59):
get I just get more stuff done and get more
traction because they just like coaching, you know, and I
tell it how it is and they've got great empathy
with it. But this is what we need to do
as a team. I'll find them quite if they do
make you can't do it well. And it's a bit
of adjustment for them to they realize they've got to
meet people where they're at, and most people aren't at
their level, which is sports. Otherwise they'd be elite sports people.
(15:20):
If they do do it, then they can be quite
quite successful at doing it. They talk about switch gears.
You now post a football career, how did you go?
Where are you transitioning, you know with your personal brand
which has been an AFL player now and for a
few years now you're now into it as vegan entrepreneur
and how have you transferred or built your personal brand up?
Speaker 2 (15:41):
I'm doing it right now.
Speaker 1 (15:42):
Yeah, apart from this, Yeah, what's been the switch though? Like,
what's been the strategy to work out your identity is
as it shifted.
Speaker 2 (15:50):
It's taken a while, actually, it's been. I found it
a lot difficult. I thought I was ready, ready is
ready to gap come out of footy and I was
good to go and all that sort of thing. And
it's taken me a while to work it out and
work out how to do it and what to do
and even how hard you've got to push and things
don't just come anymore. You've got to really go and
work for them. That's sort of I sort of alluded
(16:12):
to it before with the things I was saying about
with your guys in the corporate world, you've got to
go get it, whereas when you're a footy player, yes
everything gets done for you. Yes, you've still got to
work hard and got to commit and do all of
those things. But a lot of things will just come
too because you have to turn up a training three
times a week, four times a week to run around
(16:33):
and kick the footy. So you're just going to get
better at kicking the footy, yes, in for the simplest way.
And I think what I've tried to do is surround
myself with some really good people that I can bounce
off and then slowly over time, and it's probably taken
me a bit longer than what I would have hoped
for sure, to get to the point where it's like,
(16:54):
all right, you've got to do this, this and this.
You've got to get X, Y and Z done to
get it done, and you've got to follow up and
you've got to be those things because it was so
set for me for so long. And I think that's
what I think, that's what you get stuck as you
talk about a schedule, and a lot of transitioning out
athletes transition out struggle with the schedule. The schedule isn't
(17:15):
just get up. You've got to train, Get up, You
got to feed the kids, get up, you got to
take them to school. It's okay, what else do I
need to do to actually get for the best way
of saying it, just get shit done, just to get
it done, to close that deal, to do that stuff.
And that's something that's taking me a little bit of
time to get my head around that things won't just happen.
I won't just get better because it's not just going
(17:37):
to be set for me every day like it has been.
I think that that's sort of delving a bit deeper
into the schedule or the having things set up for
you that a lot of athletes sort of look into
a lot. So that's something that I'm just just constantly
working at and then just getting myself back out there again.
I was closed my off, closed myself off to media
for a long time and just sort of I like
(17:59):
doing these. I had two podcasts myself and I enjoy
doing them. So I'm just going to start came back
out and talking to good people and we chadded off
air and You've already got a connection for me, And
that's one of the reasons I do it, just to
create the connections and if it sticks, we'll know it.
If it doesn't, great, I've had a great chat and
I've learned something.
Speaker 1 (18:17):
Yeah, so it's good. I think that's a good point.
I mean that you made a couple of really good
points there for people as well, because I've a lot
of corporate people who listen to the podcast, and I
love that one you just mentioned where you talked about
yet the fact that you go to trade you have
to go to training on three or four times a week,
so you're going to get better at whatever you're training at.
I think that's a big part missing a lot of
people's lives is that you know, and I do a
(18:37):
lot of work with salespeople. I go, well, how many people?
How often do you actually do a role play before
you go and do the meeting with the customer? Oh yeah?
And they go, oh, and I wouldn't do that because
you know, I want to be at one with the
customer like all them, like Zen and salespeople, you know.
I'm like, no, it's like what if you stuff it up?
It's a it's a problem, right, you don't you don't
get a second chance to make a first impression, like
(18:58):
how often are you practicing this? How often you get
in coach? How people? People? So I don't get time
to coach my team. I'm like, well, you know, you
have to coach three times a week. You do it right,
but you're not accountable for that. You're you're told you
have to have your sales forecast in every week. So
everyone does that right, but no one's actually holding you.
Say how many times did you coach your sales team
this week? I didn't get around to any of it.
(19:19):
But you couldn't go. You couldn't go to Scott and
go sorry, mate, look, I'm okay for Saturday to play,
but I just didn't have time this week to turn up.
Just this is negotiable for God's sake, you know. So
I think that was really fascinating, and I think then again, then,
I think the thing you came out about talking about
with structure was now the intentionality. And I think if
you've now got an intentionality to say, well, I don't
have that structure anymore, the structures me, I've got to
(19:41):
be intentional about, you know, making these calls, making this happen,
getting this job done, because that's how the progression means,
you know, get doing the podcast, doing another way over here,
getting media. And I think that's that's really interesting having
that structure around as a pro athlete and then you
come out of it going Okay, haven't got that where
that's going to that's going to come from somewhere. It's
clearly starting.
Speaker 2 (19:59):
And I don't know if this is too honust right now,
but I like to think that I just try to
say it how it is. But even this morning, I
had a bit of stuff going on and I nearly
canceled for no real reason but just the fact that
I was like, oh, can we just push it back
a week? I was like, no, hang on a second.
It sort of goes to what we're talking about here,
which is like no, no, no, set a time. I
(20:20):
can do it. I can make it work, and it
should make it work. And it's a great thing to do,
whether it's a great chat that I'll have with someone
that i'll learn something, I've already learned something, because stuff,
some of the stuff I'm coming out of my mouth
still is like you missed it the other day, We've
got to do it now. It's it's it's I find
it interesting that even I'd like to listen to people
(20:42):
now and go, okay, do you reckon You're actually they're
actually doing that themselves. And I can nearly guarantee that
most of the time they're not. But what they try
to do is say it out loud to then remember
it or then spark their their brain to go, Okay, yeah,
I've got to do that myself. And I'm definitely one
of them because it's already I've already got two things
in my head right now and gon't remember to do this.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
Let's get a couple more in there. Now you've firm,
you've got to now got a business we'll call it
business broping for But I know you're doing mergers and acquisitions,
you're pulling people together. And we were talking off there,
and I matter how much you love about being in
the middle and negotiating, helping two parties come together. You
get a lot of joy clearly from doing that. Well,
where did that come from? Where did the sort of
business advisory? If I can even caught that around, I
(21:25):
guess probably mergers and acquisitions? Where did that come from?
For you?
Speaker 2 (21:28):
Yeah, we're using a bit of the bigger words. My
mental advisor up here, who I've got up here, is reperforming.
And I was going backwards and forwards with him for
a while the first sort of year out, and we
just I was trying a few different things. We were
sort of not really trying, and we're sort of talking through, Okay,
well could what could happen? What could we do? And
(21:48):
it sort of just fell into my lap, to be honest.
He said, look, I think we can find you some
businesses in the financial services that's what it's what he's in.
He's in financial services world. I think we can sell them.
I think you'd be good at it. You've got a
strong network. If you don't have that network, you're lucky
enough that you can find it. You can pretty much
make a few calls and someone will help you somewhere.
(22:10):
That's my lucky part of what I've done for for
ten years. And he said, I think you'd be good
at it, and I sort of just went and did
it that way. I went down the track. I've got
hand delivered a couple of businesses at the start, worked
my way through them, and I just enjoy that. I'm
still learning. I've still got the guys around me that
(22:31):
helped me a lot do it. But as you said,
I enjoy I enjoy making it come together. The actual
sentiment is the great end of the end of the road.
But I enjoy the Okay, you're still interested. Here's the seller.
You're still interested, but you're not really understanding. Okay, how
do we make it work? How do we make it understand?
(22:51):
And that's the bit I do enjoy the most.
Speaker 1 (22:56):
And get your experience in that so far? What makes
it good sale ready business? And any thoughts around that?
What makes business really ready for sale?
Speaker 2 (23:04):
Yeah? Well, I've stuck very niche into the financial plan
at the moment, so I haven't done a lot outside.
Speaker 1 (23:10):
Of that financial planning.
Speaker 2 (23:12):
Yeah, so if it's in financial plan, but what I'm
about to say, we'll go to everything. But they would
just use that as an example. But it's so much
about data with financial planning, and everyone wants it a
certain way, but a little bit of a different way
every time that I found. So the one thing is
just being prepared. And I know one of your follow
up questions will be how long? And I think it
(23:34):
doesn't The time frame doesn't necessarily matter with how long
prepar preparing, but just think about it by what you
would want to see as a seller if you were buying, right,
That's where I think it's the simplest question. But that's
what I think a lot of people don't think about
going into a sale, It's like, Okay, what would I ask?
(23:54):
What are the questions that I would ask for? Because
then even one of the classic things that you say
is why they asking for I'll get asked and I'm like,
well this is why they like, oh, they don't need that.
I'm like, well, would you ask for it? And they're
like oh, yeah, yeah, but but but I'm like, no, no,
would you ask for it? Or something very similar to it,
And the answer is nearly always yes, And I think
(24:16):
you just get caught up. And I think that's where
these guys that are doing the merger's acquisition. The broken
of businesses are so important because a lot of people
don't want to pay the middleman like you pay a
real estate age. And everyone's happy to do that because
I can see the value in it because they can
go find and do all the work a broker, a
m and a guy of exactly the same. But the
big part is is that we try to keep their
(24:37):
emotion out of it, because if you're talking between the two,
one thing gets said the wrong way, something gets taken
the wrong way, and it blows up just like that
when it probably shouldn't have. And in my short career.
I've already seen it, yes, which has been very interesting
for me. And when it happened, I actually got emotional
about it as well and had to rain myself. And
(25:01):
you go, just leave it, don't rune any emails, don't
do anything. Just sit on it for twenty four hours.
Best thing over did.
Speaker 1 (25:07):
Yeah, great advice actually, by the way, for a lot
of things at sit on it for twenty four hours.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
Yeah, I just sleep on it. Someone gave me that
advice a long time ago, which is just sleep. I
think it might have been a psychologist of mine, but
to sleep on it always, just sleep on it, no
matter what it is, just sleep on and see what happens.
I said it three times now, that's how important it is.
Speaker 1 (25:24):
On Yeah, it's so important. I think that's really also
that it also that's the empathy, isn't it saying Okay,
if you're selling it, you know, if you were going
to buy this business, where are the holes in it?
Or and where with? What questions would you ask? But
I like the one about data. There's a great quote
by the US venture capitalist and he said, he said,
(25:46):
if we've got data, let's look at data. If we
don't and we're running game with opinions, Let's go with mine. Right,
So it was a great and he may have been
best in Silicon Valley startups, but his viewers, we've got data, man,
Let's look at the data. Let's deep dive in the data.
But if a we're talking about opinions here, let's go
with mine, because I own more and I got more
at stake, and it's a really good It's sort of
got a bit of an urban myth ab it now,
(26:08):
but it's got called Jim Barkstar is his name, His
next IBM adventured capital guy. And it's a great point
because when you get back the data, data to me
just takes away the emotion. Not everywhere it's impossible we're humans,
but takes away a lot of the emotion. They go, well,
this is the data. This is like, this is how
many you know, this is how many members we've got. Well,
this is how many clients we've got. This is this
is the amount of wealth. Whare we're looking after? These
(26:30):
the funds we manage. It's been growing exit from this
post code, you know that kind of stuff. We go,
that's what it is, like, it is what it is
and we've got a bit on top. But people when
they see that and it takes away a lot of
those questions, and I think that's a It's a good
way to set people up is to think about if
you were buying this, you know, why wouldn't you buy this?
Which has been my experience. It's been a little bit
(26:52):
around the ownership is quite complicated, or we haven't quite
you know, we've got a legal one going down the
track was actually global to and it was looking really good.
Both parties were actually quite excited, and then we found
out that they had a legal suit, you know, a
legal legal challenge in the US. It was still when
someone tracked it down and said, hang on, what about this,
and they went, it should be right. It should be
(27:13):
right because the buyer's gone, why about we wait till
we see if it is right and you can't blame this.
I was like, oh no, what what's going on? We
were going so well, it's just got this little thing
to the side, and for them it was like little
thing to the side to the buyer, you know, you
and I they got a legal hang on second instead
around IP that's kind of a big deal, right, or
it could be it took me a while. I sort
(27:35):
of convinced the salary to go, no, no, if you're
in their issues, this is probably a bit well, this
is this is a red flag, like you need to
sort this out or bring it forward or get it
to resolution. But they're like, oh yeah, yeah, probably from
their point of view.
Speaker 2 (27:49):
Yeah, and that's it, and that's it. And that's a
big one definitely. Like I'm not saying it's not a
big one, but right the way I liked it, I
like to look at it and go, okay, big red flag.
And this is probably about example for what I'm going
to try to say now, but it's still an example
that we'll use because it's in our face. Yes, there
would still be a way to do that deal. Yeah,
(28:11):
there's always a way. That's that's my only point here,
and it is it's just whether one party has got
to take a bit more of a leap than the
other and if that, if you find that person, you'll
still get the deal done. That's what I enjoy. Okay,
red flag. Shit, I don't know if I'm not to
swear on this, but shit, red flag. But are you
still interested if that red flag wasn't there? Yes, Okay,
(28:36):
what about if we can limit the liability or the
damages or whatever in some way. Okay, let's look at that. Now.
Some people don't want to do that because I don't
want to waste their time completely, fine, but my point
is is that you'll always find you can always find,
no matter how long it takes, you'll find someone that
will be able to do that deal somewhere down the track.
And again I say, even in my short career, I've
(28:57):
already seen it. Yes, it's and it's been super interesting
to see because you get told no, no, no, no, no,
it only takes one.
Speaker 1 (29:05):
That's right, you only need one buy.
Speaker 2 (29:07):
You only need one. And that's the thing. And that's
I like to and I'm learning my lessons, but I
like to work with one or two. I don't like
to go to the broad market too much. I don't
believe in it that way. And I'm honest with that
with my clients. I'm very honest. I don't try to
sugarcoat it for them. But yeah, I find those things
interesting because right away I see not opportunity, but I see,
(29:29):
all right, let's see what we can do here.
Speaker 1 (29:30):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, And I think so, And I love
that because if you've got you've got that optimistic view
as well. And I think it's a it's a view
of saying, hey, we know what I mean by it's
not blind optimism. It's like it's like, Okay, we understand
the current situation, but we're also optimistic about a deal
can still be done. Yeah. I think that's actually the
value you bring in that middle part. You know, that
(29:51):
kind of middle that's where the middle person can bring.
I think that's where you're absolutely worth your money because
you can have that you're not really connected on either side,
you can have kind of impartial view and look at
it and say and advise both parties.
Speaker 2 (30:05):
And for the most and for the most part, I
would have liked to know if you're using that example again,
is if that would have come out in the first
or second conversation. Hey, because it might be a small
legal dispute, like it might not be as well, but hey,
we've got a small legal dispute. This is what it is.
What else do you want to know about it? Because
most of the time, and it's easy to say after
the fact, but most of the time a BUI will say, oh,
(30:26):
you should have just been honest and then it would
have been okay, or then we would have been able
to at least progress it that way. And that's the
other thing. It's like, it's really trying to get that
and a lot of people want to hide fair enough
to like, I see both sides of it. Yeah, hope
want to hide it, but just be honest from the
start because it's better because it wastes everyone's time if
you're not.
Speaker 1 (30:47):
Yeah, yeah, one hundred percent. I think so been being
open about it. Yeah, I think that's really interesting. Have
you On the other the thing, I've seen recently people
buying businesses and the like, but this group called entrepreneurs
by acquisitions, So there are ones who don't want to
do a startup. They may be in a corporate or
they maybe come out of a sporting career and they
(31:07):
just go, you know, I want to buy a business
and get straight into it. Have you seen a bit
of that happening.
Speaker 2 (31:13):
I haven't seen it personally in terms of having my
hand in it or seen it close around me, but
I think a lot of that is steming from social media,
and I think it's great. I'm not being negative tools
on very negative social media with other reasons but for
this one, not so much. I think it's great. I
think there's so many out there now, and Cody Sanchez
is one of them. She's from America. There's a lot
(31:33):
of them out there, just showing people what you can do.
Like a lot of people wouldn't even know what vendor
finance is, so and I didn't until a few years
ago either, So I'm not claiming to be better than
everyone else, but they wouldn't even know what that is.
They wouldn't even know that They actually really don't need
cash to get in. They just have to find the
(31:54):
right person to structure a deal the right way. And
that's where all these guys talk about. The negotiation is
the most important thing because it is negotiation understanding what
does that person actually want. Because you can find an
old woman or an old guy that's running a business
and say to them, hey, i'll take it over for it.
I'll take it over over two years. You can slowly
(32:14):
go out. Let's create our relationship over the next three months.
Let's see how we fit together. We won't sign anything yet,
or we might sign something that just sort of gets
this where I don't waste my time and don't get
cash out of it, but you don't either, and then
let's threw down three months down the track. Like, there's
just so many different ways of doing it. And I
think social media helps out a lot now and the
world we live in because you can connect with anyone
(32:37):
and everyone's willing to just give you. You alluded to it before,
just content, just creating content. There's so much of it
out there that you can find a way and something
will stick with that person or a person when they
see it. And I like watching Cody Sanchez is a
good one to use, Like, I think she's really interesting
because she simplifies it and it's not always that simple
(32:57):
to go do it, but she simplifies it when she
explains it to.
Speaker 1 (33:01):
I think that's so true too, because when you think
about that space and a lot of people I know
in corporate world and also from your looking at post
career from sport that I know's what's out there, and
it's it's so much as possible, you know. It's kind
of what we call this podcast is all possible because
there are so many ways of slicing and dicing and cutting,
and if you really want to go do it, it
(33:21):
doesn't mean you have to go to the banking to
get finance. It doesn't mean you have to kind of
borrow from parents and a like or radious super There's
actually many ways to be able to kind of make
these acquisitions these businesses. And I think you were taught
you and I were talking off there beforehand. What we're
seeing now is this. I think over the next five
years is going to be this massive excedness of baby
boomers essentially, and you're just aging out of businesses. Nothing
(33:42):
sinister about it, It's just just how it is with demographics.
So there's going to be this massive opportunity to go
in and talk about taking over a business or acquiring
a business in many different forms. And I think the
saddest form I see is when I see the business
has been going thirty years, just closes the dollars and
then I go, man, where the good will go? Like
you're kidding me, Like there's something still there. It's not
(34:05):
like they're making stage coaches, like some of these businesses
are actually still quite viable and they just close up
because sometimes the seller doesn't know how to approach it.
Either they think that if no one walks up to me,
or I put it on a business broking cycle or
something that's so as a fault sometimes on the buyers
don't know they had to do it. But sometimes also
(34:26):
I find the sellers are a bit naive in terms
of what they can do. If you come across that
with all in your short career in this area.
Speaker 2 (34:32):
I think one thing that gets me. I think in
this day and age is there wouldn't be a lot
of trust either. If you've got a young twenty something
year old roll up to an older person trying to transition,
a boomer trying to transition out, I'm just not sure
they trust with the world we live in and again
(34:53):
fair enough, so I think finding a way to do it,
and there'll be people out there, I'm sure there is.
I'm sure maybe one person listen to this podcast or
say oh yeah, I do this well. I think finding
a way to build that trust is the big one
and say hey, I'm not here to screw you over
to take what you've got, like trying to that's you're
not going to just be able to say that, obviously,
(35:13):
but trying to show them, hey, this is what it is.
I'll get a lawyer and you can pick the lawyer.
Like whatever it is to get them to say, hey,
this is what it is. So yeah, I think it
goes both ways. But I think the trust factor, especially
if that's the way you're going to do it, going
to buy an old fish and chip shop, I don't know,
something like that. I think it'd be difficult because I
(35:34):
think the trust factor at the start would have to
be huge. Ohous, you just have to roll in there
with a briefcase of cash and say there he go. Yeah,
so they actually see the tangible stuff because he'd be selling.
If you want to do an on vendor finance, nothing,
it's seen. Yeah, it just it just it just happens
through some sweat equity. So yeah, yes, and no, I
(35:55):
think trust factor is a huge, huge part of it.
Trying to grow that trust factor is huge.
Speaker 1 (36:00):
Yeah. I think the other industry. I've seen the big
work this year with in the professional hair salon businesses
and one of the big trends there. Definitely, it's well
so met in the US is less about a salono
having five or six stylust work for them, but actually
having red chair. Right. The whole redded chair thing has
been become it's default in the US, but now we're
(36:23):
starting to see it come into Australia's are wanted a
bit of autonomy, but also I don't really want to
work out of their home. So that's really interesting. And
what's actually adapted to that is some of the accounting
systems and the finance systems like a CRM system and
the whole accounting systems are now being built so you
can actually have people have their own silo renda chair
accounts all within the within an umbrella area. So the
(36:45):
systems and technology has adapted to these new models and
that makes it really easy so that owner of the brand,
for example that the overall brand goes to sell, I
can actually go, hey, this is I've got eight Reddit
chairs here, this is who makes more made than the art,
and we can actually do their pricing. And that you
couldn't have done that five years ago. So you're on
the data side. You go for the data. The data
wouldn't show any much, but these days the data is
(37:07):
really clean, very transparent, and I think that also builds
trust when someone can go give us look at your data.
The data is the data, and I think that can
build trust as well as because we're all cynical now
and I think everyone's cynical. Now, no one trust anyoney, right,
So I think that's the that's the key thing. You know,
if we don't trust anyone, how can we build trust fast?
Or data helps build trust fast? And you check with
(37:30):
two or three people you asked you could pick the lawyer.
I love that. That's a great, great tip as well,
because you want to build that fast and go is
there something we can do together here? Because the other
thing is people struggling for staff. And so I'm saying
to people now is when you hire your next higher,
are you thinking about them as just who I can
get in at the last possible cost? Or could this
person buy the business from me? And you say to the
(37:51):
business owners and they go, oh shit, never thought of
it that way. We start thinking that way, you know,
because what's the because there's very two different when you
go do it? Yeah, yeah, fantastic. I had to come
up the name of the business, so it is it
connect it? Did I get that right?
Speaker 2 (38:09):
Yeah? That's how I came up with it. I I
don't even know. I don't even know. I was trying
to get something you really, this is a tough question
for me. I was trying to get something that I
think brings people together, right, but then quick and clean. Yeah,
(38:30):
and then I just came up with K and CT,
I think and connect. So and then the website is
l K and CT, which you could say is lucky,
but it's not. It wasn't meant to be. It was
let's connect. So, but it's just K and CT. I.
I haven't used it that much. I haven't pushed it
from that way. I've sort of been just using me
(38:50):
as an individual to say, like I'm not saying I'm
K and CT, come and work with me. I used
myself as an individual, but I had to have something
there to back myself. And so that's where that's where
it came from. It wasn't anything more than that. Yeah,
I might have to rEFInd that answer a little bit
better than what it is.
Speaker 1 (39:07):
That's a good one. I thought it was COCT. I
was looking at it and I was going, I was
trying to work your initials into it, and we know,
maybe that's a whole company hasn't worked this out.
Speaker 2 (39:14):
I've done I've done my job. Then I've done my job.
Speaker 1 (39:17):
He got me, It got me talking right to become
a subject matter. And I thought, maybe it's just taken
off the registration plates in his car and put that
on there. You should brand it that way. That's really cool. Hey,
like you've been fantastic to chat. So we just talked
about that, that connection that happen. People find out more
about what you're doing and what somebody is. So what's
the web? Give us the website.
Speaker 2 (39:37):
It's www dot l k NCT dot com dot com.
Speaker 1 (39:41):
And social media? What are you on Instagram?
Speaker 2 (39:43):
Good question. I'm not about social any man.
Speaker 1 (39:45):
It is k n C T Business k and City
biz or something like that. But I found it, so,
oh you did find it. The first to say, there's
not much going on there at the moment. I'll keep
it find and then I'm lucky Anderson twenty five as well.
But social media for me, LinkedIn is the one. I'm
trying to do a bit more on LinkedIn. So just
find myself at Lockey Henderson. So that's that's where I've
(40:06):
tried to post a few more things. You're not going
to find me much doing it. I don't think on
the social media platforms maybe here and there, but LinkedIn.
Finding on LinkedIn is.
Speaker 2 (40:14):
The is the most important, I think, because that's where
I'm trying to do a bit more. So you're posting.
Speaker 1 (40:19):
Things and you're based on the Gold Coast, which you
work East coast, East.
Speaker 2 (40:23):
Coast, Yeah, East Coast, East Coast, mainly that Perth.
Speaker 1 (40:27):
Now, of course we love Perth. With what we're saying, people,
we aren't glowing with we love per love.
Speaker 2 (40:32):
No comment. I did actually actually something always happened to
me when I played in Perth. I got a good
doubt twice bad things. Yeah, a couple of I got,
I broke my a, got titanium mesh are through my
I can had a really bad concussion too as well.
So yeah, there's those two things. Had a couple of Yeah.
Speaker 1 (40:49):
Okay, so everybody East coast really happy to go. East
Coast will fly up and down in this coast, but
anything nothing further west than Adelaide. Are we going so exactly,
I'll be fantastic. It's been great, great to chat mate.
Really appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (41:03):
Thanks for having me, no worries.
Speaker 1 (41:08):
I hope you enjoyed this episode of the It's All
Possible Podcast. You can contact me at Rob at Robhartner
dot com or my website Robharton dot com, or on LinkedIn.
Remember to check out the previous seasons and episodes of
the podcast, and the show notes for more details on
this episode's guest. For more inspiration, remember to check out
(41:29):
the All Possibility playlist on spotted By, which contains a
collection upbeat, positive music I use for inspiration through my
live performances until next time, live with passion and a
perspective of possibility.
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