June 19, 2025 • 37 mins
In today’s conversation, where we dive deep into the art and science of managing substantial ad spend in an unpredictable market.
Our guest, Borja Cuan, isn’t just a seasoned leader in the performance advertising world—he’s seen nearly every twist and turn this industry can throw at you. Having started his journey way back in 1998, Borja brings hard-earned wisdom and fresh insights to the conversation, sharing how adaptability and resilient mindsets separate fleeting trends from truly great businesses. We explore how Borja’s strategic business solutions have shaped client teams and sparked sustainable growth—focusing on what it really takes to scale up, maintain momentum, and build trust.
You’ll hear candid stories of transformation, the challenges of staying results-driven at scale, and why the unicorn mentality is less about luck and more about relentless innovation and fierce attention to detail.
Expect to learn: The real challenges of stewarding significant marketing budgets without losing sight of ROI and efficiency.
Practical strategies for building unicorn companies, from high-impact campaign fixes to people-first leadership.
How adaptability is the ultimate skill—and how Borja weaves it into Four15’s daily culture.
Subtle shifts in the industry, and why an unwavering commitment to client experience remains a game-changer.
If you’re keen to unpack the creative, sometimes chaotic journey behind today’s most successful marketing initiatives, join us for an honest look behind the curtain with someone who’s lived it, shaped it, and continues to redefine what’s possible in performance advertising.
Contact Details:
LinkedIN: https://www.linkedin.com/in/borjacuan/
Website: four15digital.com
Remember to SUBSCRIBE so you don't miss "Information That You Can Use." Share Just Minding My Business with your family, friends, and colleagues. Engage with us by leaving a review or comment. https://g.page/r/CVKSq-IsFaY9EBM/review Your support keeps this podcast going and growing.
Visit Just Minding My Business Media™ LLC at https://jmmbmediallc.com/ to learn how we can help you get more visibility on your products and services. #BorjaCuan #PerformanceAdvertising #DigitalMarketing #AdTech #ClientSuccess #BusinessGrowth #MarketingStrategy #Four15Digital #Leadership #advertisingindustry
Our guest, Borja Cuan, isn’t just a seasoned leader in the performance advertising world—he’s seen nearly every twist and turn this industry can throw at you. Having started his journey way back in 1998, Borja brings hard-earned wisdom and fresh insights to the conversation, sharing how adaptability and resilient mindsets separate fleeting trends from truly great businesses. We explore how Borja’s strategic business solutions have shaped client teams and sparked sustainable growth—focusing on what it really takes to scale up, maintain momentum, and build trust.
You’ll hear candid stories of transformation, the challenges of staying results-driven at scale, and why the unicorn mentality is less about luck and more about relentless innovation and fierce attention to detail.
Expect to learn: The real challenges of stewarding significant marketing budgets without losing sight of ROI and efficiency.
Practical strategies for building unicorn companies, from high-impact campaign fixes to people-first leadership.
How adaptability is the ultimate skill—and how Borja weaves it into Four15’s daily culture.
Subtle shifts in the industry, and why an unwavering commitment to client experience remains a game-changer.
If you’re keen to unpack the creative, sometimes chaotic journey behind today’s most successful marketing initiatives, join us for an honest look behind the curtain with someone who’s lived it, shaped it, and continues to redefine what’s possible in performance advertising.
Contact Details:
LinkedIN: https://www.linkedin.com/in/borjacuan/
Website: four15digital.com
Remember to SUBSCRIBE so you don't miss "Information That You Can Use." Share Just Minding My Business with your family, friends, and colleagues. Engage with us by leaving a review or comment. https://g.page/r/CVKSq-IsFaY9EBM/review Your support keeps this podcast going and growing.
Visit Just Minding My Business Media™ LLC at https://jmmbmediallc.com/ to learn how we can help you get more visibility on your products and services. #BorjaCuan #PerformanceAdvertising #DigitalMarketing #AdTech #ClientSuccess #BusinessGrowth #MarketingStrategy #Four15Digital #Leadership #advertisingindustry
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
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Speaker 1 (01:52):
I hope you are having an amazing day and welcome.
Welcome to Just Minding My Business and I'm excited to
bring to you today mister Kwan, who joined the performance
advertising industry in nineteen ninety eight and has built a
career in the industry providing strategic business solutions for teams
(02:15):
and clients. His track record of helping growth, stable successful
organizations is underpinned by a career long personal commitment to
great client experiences. Mister Kwan combines big picture perspective with
exacting attention to make sure four fifteen clients and team
(02:40):
members get value out of their work every day. Wow,
welcome mister Kwan. How are you this day?
Speaker 2 (02:49):
I am doing well. Thank you for having me on
the podcast.
Speaker 1 (02:54):
Appreciate you being here. So tell us all about four
fifteen Digital.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
Yeah, we are an eight year old performance marketing agency
that specializes in helping businesses across different verticals scale grow
through digital marketing. So we are investing our clients dollars
(03:22):
on various online channels, specifically Google, Microsoft, being meta LinkedIn
TikTok to help them acquire customers.
Speaker 1 (03:36):
Okay, okay, so let me ask you what all goes
into that.
Speaker 2 (03:43):
Yeah, it's a it's a process. So typically we're looking
for advertisers that are currently investing at least eighty to
one hundred thousand dollars a month in digital advertising across
the channels that I mentioned. It could be one of
the channels, it could be numerous channels, but typically someone
(04:07):
that is investing currently in digital marketing who's looking to
scale and take their paid marketing campaigns to the next level.
So we come in and our area of expertise is
media buying, So that means we understand each of the
platforms very intimately. Intimately, we understand how to leverage those
(04:29):
platforms to help businesses find the right audiences i e.
The right customers that are that they are looking for,
which will then translate into generating leads for them, sales,
really whatever the conversion event is that they're looking for.
So media buying is a big part of that, which
(04:51):
means we're buying on Facebook, we're buying on Google, we're
buying on TikTok. Depending on the client and where their
customers are. But in addition to media buying, we're also
helping customers design ads to support the marketing campaigns, helping
them design landing pages, We're helping them come up with
(05:13):
the right offers, the right messaging, and so creative design
is a big part of what we do to support
media buying. And then lastly, you can't manage what you
can't measure in business, so we spend a lot of
time helping customers build the right tracking infrastructure that supports
(05:35):
the marketing campaigns and allows them to report on all
the key performance indicators that they look at for their
particular business.
Speaker 1 (05:45):
So when you say, you know, I'm really into analytics,
I need to know what I'm doing is doing something.
So when you say building that, what does that involve?
Speaker 2 (05:57):
Yeah, I mean it's letting up the right tracking for
each of the platforms that we're buying on and implementing
the tracking links on websites, on you know, conversion pages.
You know, there's there are technicalities to it that are
are not something that I'm as knowledgeable of, but the
(06:21):
most important thing to know that we want for all
of our customers who invest money in the different digital
marketing platforms is that we want to be able to
know where every sell comes from, right, So if we're
spending money on Google, we want to know how many
sales we generated through Google. If it's Facebook, how many
(06:43):
sales generated from Facebook. We want to be able to
look at that data on a channel basis and then
tie it back to what the investment was so that
we can calculate what the return was. You know, how
efficient was this media. So we don't want to we
don't want to just have one number that represents multiple
platforms because that doesn't help you look at things on
(07:05):
a very individual basis. So the tracking that we do
is really on a channel basis. But even within a channel,
we do different levels of tracking. So within a particular channel,
you might be targeting different geographies, right, so we want
to look at performance at the geo level. So there
are different ways to kind of break out tracking, but
(07:29):
really the most simple way to think about it is
we want to be able to attribute a sale on
a very specific platform basis, so that you as a
client know how much money you're spending and then what
you are getting in return.
Speaker 1 (07:45):
And I would assume that it would also lend to
itself to where you're getting the most activity and where
you're not.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
It basically is exactly that it allows. It's how data
is what in warms our decision making process. Right, so
when we have the right tracking, that enables us to
report on the activities and then make decisions based on
the data that we're seeing. So high integrity data is
really important at what we do, which is why we
(08:17):
start with what is not very sexy, which is, hey,
I know this isn't launching ads and going live with campaigns,
but we have to take a step back and evaluate
the current tracking infrastructure to make sure it has a
level of sophistication. We need to support the investment. We
have clients that are investing millions of dollars on a
monthly basis in digital advertising, and so if we don't
(08:39):
have the right tracking infrastructure, we're really operating very blindly.
So we really need to spend time doing that thoroughly
and making sure that before we start investing dollars that
we have that setup correctly.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
Absolutely, so this is want to work with you? How
did they connect with you?
Speaker 2 (09:00):
Yeah, the various ways that we can connect with perspective clients,
but you know, four to fifteen Digital is our website
fo your one five digital dot com. There you can
see a variety of information around the services that we
offer clients. We also feature case studies for some of
the work we've done for companies in different verticals, companies
(09:23):
of different sizes and stages, and then also tells you
a little bit about kind of our culture, values, mission statement,
job opening. So really, if you're someone looking to get
into the digital marketing world and you're looking to work
for an agency, there's a lot of information there. If
you're a perspective client who's interested in learning more about
(09:45):
our services, there's plenty of information for you to read there.
Gay awesome.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
So when you are working, let's say you are selecting
a client. Okay, a client comes out to you and
want you're services. What is the criteria? What are some
of the things that you ask and look forward?
Speaker 2 (10:07):
Yeah, so one of the things is are you currently
investing in digital marketing? That's important because that directly correlates
with them being able to afford us. You know, we
have fees that we charge advertisers that are we have
minimum fees. So for example, our minimum fee is eight
thousand dollars a month. Regardless of how much you're spending
(10:31):
and advertising. So that's why we typically are looking for
someone who's spending at least eighty to one hundred thousand
dollars in digital marketing because as a percentage, that's when
it really makes sense for them a percentage of the
media spend. So one we're looking for, you know, a
minimum spend online. We do make exceptions to that for
(10:55):
companies that maybe are earlier stage or companies in the
B to B space business to business space, because they
typically have a smaller audience that they're trying to reach
and because of that, we know that there are fewer
impressions out there, and therefore we know that their investment
will be capped mostly because their audience is very small.
(11:18):
So there are exceptions to that rule where we say, oh,
you're a B to B company, you're only spending twenty
thousand dollars a month, that's okay, we'll still talk to you.
But in general, we're looking for someone that's spending in
that range. Like I said, in addition to that, it's
really not so much category specific. We have a broad
set of companies that we work with, so a lot
(11:39):
of diversity in the portfolio in terms of B to
B companies B two C within the B to B
segment true SMBs to enterprise sized companies. We work with startups,
We work with small businesses that are generating five ten
million dollars a month, to publicly traded companies that are
(12:00):
doing six billion dollars a year in revenue, and then
everything in between. So I think in terms of the
type of business, we're really ideally looking for someone that
is a national business versus someone that is selling a
product or service in a very sort of specific geography.
So the more the wider net we can cast, the better.
(12:24):
And it's also we look at before we work with
any client, we take some time to look under the
hood at their AD accounts. We do an extensive audit
at a very deep level to understand kind of what
they're doing, and then we present that to the client
and we say, hey, you know, these are the things,
(12:44):
not based on an opinion, but based on math and experience,
that we think you're doing well. And conversely, these are
the things you're not doing well. And most importantly, this
is what we would do if we were in the
driver's seat managing your investment. And then through that process,
we get to know the client better and they get
to know us. So it's really important that you know.
(13:08):
At this stage in our kind of evolution, we're looking
for also personalities in chemistry. So it's not just can
you afford us, it's do we think we can bring value?
And do we think we're aligned in terms of the
direction we want to take your business, Because if there's misalignment,
it could be a major friction point. Right, If our
(13:30):
personalities are not gelling, it's probably going to be a problem, right,
So we're also looking out to see if it's a
good match from a strategy perspective, from a way we
think about business perspective, because we know that the journey
will be a series of ups and downs. It's not
always upward, and so when the going is going to
(13:52):
get tough, is this something that we're going to sort
of work on together. Is it going to be very
kind of adversarial? So we're kind of looking for those
things as well.
Speaker 1 (14:01):
Yes, yes, that was my first thought. Can we get
along's all money and good money.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
It's not all the same. I agree with you, it's
not worth it, right some cases, just because you can
afford us doesn't mean you can, you know, treat our
team badly or doesn't mean you can place excess demands
on us. They're just you know, we're looking to work
with reasonable people that are smart, that are in this
(14:33):
with us. They understand the definition of a partnership. Even
though we are the provider and they are our customer,
it doesn't matter. This is still a partnership and it
requires us each to have rules and responsibilities and for
us to each be accountable to things because unfortunately we
do not control everything. So in the areas that we
(14:55):
don't control, we need them to step up and deliver,
otherwise the outcomes will be less than favorable. Yes, and I.
Speaker 1 (15:02):
Like the word that you use partnership because that's really critical.
You know, even in my business, it's a partnership. We
sit here, we talk about your business. I create some
marketing for you. I expect you to share. I'm a shit,
you know, a great partnership. You know, it's you know,
(15:25):
my time and your time, and it's important that we
have that understanding before we even start.
Speaker 2 (15:34):
Yeah, I think I think that's Uh, it's really important.
And I always tell my customers, the team is working
very hard and you're the way you are with them
either motivates them or or demotivates them, right. And I
see this even myself when I go to a restaurant
or hotel and I see really happy or a retail
(15:56):
store and I see really happy employees. I always survey
on my own because I'm curious, and I say, this
must be a great place to work, because the way
you treat me. The experience I have here is excellent.
And to me, that means that you're happy and they
treat you well, they train you, they invest in you,
they take care of you, because that's directly sort of
(16:19):
reflected in the way that you deliver the service to me.
So I've always felt that like the employer has a
role in treating the team well, investing in them, and
that will sort of be on display with the customer,
but also the customer and the way that they treat
the employee. You know, in this case, we're a vendor,
(16:40):
so it's not like we're in house, but we're still
a part of the team. Really makes the difference between
someone wanting to work hard for you or not work
hard for you. So I think that's always something that
you know, people need to remember. It's very easily forgotten
because we're all dealing with a lot of to dos.
But you can't lose sight of that even when it's
(17:00):
an agency relationship, because people are still you know, influenced
by how you treat them and how you make them feel.
Speaker 1 (17:09):
Absolutely number one ingredient for sure. Wow Wow wow Wow.
Let's talk a little bit about cut your clients and
you just went over how you select them. Okay, Now,
(17:29):
once you get into the situation with them, and let's
say they say things are slow, you know, because as
we know, marketing is repetitious actions and they want quickness.
How do you handle that?
Speaker 2 (17:50):
Yeah? I mean I think people want speed and we
understand that, and we also operate at you know, we
operate with a sense of urgency and the way we
do business because we understand that people are under a
lot of pressure. A lot of the customers that we
work with, a lot of the contacts that we have
(18:10):
within these organizations, they're under a lot of pressure from
the folks above them, and so it just ends up
sort of coming to us right as a result of that.
So I think we want to operate as fast as
we can, but be thoughtful along the way and make
sure that we're making the right decisions, and sometimes that
(18:31):
does require us to say, hey, you hired us as
the experts, and while we understand you want to move quickly,
there are certain things we need to do before we
can move that quickly, so it's important for us to
identify those and talk through them. So we're always going
to be the fastest ones moving, but sometimes we are
relying on the client to do something in order for
(18:51):
us to move to the next stage, right, so we
are oftentimes blocked. But I think when someone wants us
to move fast, the answer is we will move as
fast as we can, but be thoughtful along the way,
because at the end of the day, speed is important,
but we also have to be sort of sort of
(19:11):
aware of not rushing things without really having think thought
them through. Right. Could be like a decision related to
creative or it could be a decision related to an
offer or messaging. So yeah, we understand that people want
to move quickly, but it's up to us to sort
of set the pace and explain what is realistic versus
(19:32):
not realistic. So as long as we're aligned there, that's fine.
And we tend to be very direct in our way
of communicating with clients because we want them to know
that we want to do what's best for them and
we want them to trust us. But it's on us
to really explain things and really make sure that we
are sort of setting the tone. Now. Ultimately, they're the customer,
(19:56):
they decide, but we absolutely are being hired to not
always tell them what they want to hear, but instead
tell them what we think is the best course of
action for their business.
Speaker 1 (20:05):
Absolutely absolutely, And they came to you.
Speaker 2 (20:08):
All that, yes, yeah, that's what they're paying us for.
And I think the worst relationship you can have is
one where you do everything you're told, even when you
don't agree. Sometimes they'll test us and they'll say, you know,
should we you know, I want to do this, and
they're expecting us to push back because they may think
that's not a good thing. So I always tell the
(20:29):
team is always give your sue assessment of things, and
ultimately the client can override you because they are the customer.
They can disagree with you. They can say no, we're
doing this even if you've told me you don't think
it's the right decision. We should absolutely document what our
recommendation is. But at the end, of the day. They
(20:50):
can override our decision because they are the customer, but
we should always at a minimum give them what we
think is the best thing to do.
Speaker 1 (20:58):
And absolutely absolutely, because I mean in your spirit and
as a company, when you know it's not the right
thing to do, your gut is telling you this is
not the right thing to do, and it is your
job at that point to let the customer know this
is not the right thing to do because of these
(21:20):
things exactly.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
Yeah, I mean that's really the value we bring, right,
and we have to be looking out for the customer.
We are the experts. It's what we do for a living,
it's why we exist. So I think being silent is
not an option. I think we have to be vocal.
We have to be clear in our communications. We need
to document things to make sure that with everybody having
(21:44):
such a busy scheduled things can be forgotten. Right. So yeah,
for sure.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
So let's talk a little bit about AI.
Speaker 2 (21:54):
And your business.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
I mean, now just about every business is using AI
to help them, So how do you use A.
Speaker 2 (22:03):
Yeah, we are with respect to AI, embracing AI and
uh recognizing it's here to stay and we'll only get better.
So we view AI not as a way to displace
employees instead, uh, support their efforts in delivering customer service
(22:25):
uh and and and delivering sort of performance for our client.
So yes, it's it's sort of built into a lot
of the sort of team's work and we use it,
you know, a lot for coming up with you know, uh,
messaging for ads, coming up with sort of you know,
(22:47):
creating ads at scale. So for design work, it's been
very useful just you know, putting you know a lot
of ads out with relatively low effort versus having a
designer do it one by one. AI allows us to
create ads at scale. Also, you know, just you know,
working through various business sort of challenges, right like, Hey,
(23:11):
I have this situation, I have this, you know, offer
this promotion that want to run. What are some good
ideas as ways to kind of market this? So a
lot of just like it's a lot around content creation,
messaging on ads, you know, creating ads things like that
is how the team is using it.
Speaker 1 (23:32):
In media buying, Yes, yes, Neil, do you do anything
with television.
Speaker 2 (23:39):
No, everything we do at the moment is really online
using the channels that I had mentioned. So we do
some postal mail that we're starting to do with some
of our clients direct mail, which is really effective for
some of the companies that we work with, but we've
not done really that's not the same. We wouldn't sort
of move into that direction. But it's all been digital.
Speaker 1 (24:01):
Okay, okay, yes, because that's definitely another market, you know, indeed,
and you know, I'm a TV person. Sometimes I like
it for company when I'm working, but sometimes in the
back of your mind you're still listening to some of
the things that's coming on even though you're working.
Speaker 2 (24:24):
So yeahp wow.
Speaker 1 (24:27):
So again, how can people businesses get in contact with you?
Speaker 2 (24:33):
Yeah, I would say connect with me on LinkedIn? Borha
kwan that's b O R J A c U A N.
I write a lot on LinkedIn. I post a lot
of content on LinkedIn, So feel free to connect me.
Connect with me on LinkedIn. Also, you can go directly
to our website four fifteen digital dot com. That's f
(24:55):
O U R one five digital dot com. There's a
contact ust form. If you fill that out, we'll be
in touch with you very soon.
Speaker 1 (25:03):
Okay, this is more of a personal question. How did
you arrive here? How did you what sparked your interest
in this field.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
I think it was because I was introduced to online
marketing when I was right out of college back in
nineteen ninety eight. I didn't know much about the Internet.
It was a relatively new concept, and it was at
my first job right out of college that I was
introduced to the Internet, and specifically it was affiliate marketing,
(25:35):
and I ended up sort of staying at that first
company for eight years and then going on to another
company for six years. So it was really nineteen ninety eight.
I joined Number as Number twenty nine, an early internet startup,
and never left. So it was there that really left
a memorable experience for me, learning a lot, meeting a
(25:56):
lot of great people, having been mentored and coached by
really really solid leaders, and I was given a lot
of opportunity and kind of moved up the ranks and
you know, never looked back.
Speaker 1 (26:09):
So that's great. So you fan your sweet spot.
Speaker 2 (26:12):
Early on, I did, just by chance, not by design.
It just was kind of one of those things where
I got an interview and wasn't really looking for that
type of opportunity, but I ended up taking the interview
and here I am today.
Speaker 1 (26:24):
Yes, and you never know how it's going to show up.
That's one thing you cannot.
Speaker 2 (26:29):
Predict exactly exactly for sure.
Speaker 1 (26:34):
Wow. Wow, I'm just trying to think about everything that
you talked about. I hope the audience has definitely taken
notes because you know, and you know, getting your message
out is really really how you grow your business. There's
no other way. And you know, so let's talk quickly
(26:58):
about messaging, as a lot of people have a problem
with that.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
Yeah, messaging is tough. I mean, I think it requires
a lot of experimentation. I think you have to consider
who the advertiser is, who their audiences, who are they
trying to get in front of, who are they trying
to get engage with their offer, their product or service,
and it's testing, right. I think messaging a lot of
(27:27):
people are looking for a very specific call to action. Right.
If you're in e commerce, obviously promotions are really appealing
to consumers, right, free shipping, five dollars off, ten percent off,
limited time offers. If you're more of a B to
B company, it could be hey, access this white paper
(27:50):
on employee benefits. Right. So I think we do a
lot of experimentation because ultimately you have to test. In
this business, even with ads, right at your top performing ad,
you're always looking to iterate upon that to find the
next best ad that will take that over. Right, So
(28:13):
things become stagnant, they have a shelf life like anything,
and you always have to be experimenting with messaging with
you know, the actual ads, font color, things like that.
So messaging is just you know, obviously because we've done this,
we kind of have some understanding of what works depending
on the client, but a lot of times it's really
(28:36):
a lot of experimentation and constant pushing of boundaries, you know,
balancing between being too aggressive and too conservative. Right, depending
on the client and the brand, they may have more
limitations and what you can do from a marketing standpoint
because they want to be compliant, or they're regulated, or
we can't make claims. So every customer is different depending
(28:59):
on what what type of business they're in. But yeah,
in general, it's uh, it requires a lot of experimentation
and testing.
Speaker 1 (29:07):
Yes, because at the end of the day, the public
is the judge.
Speaker 2 (29:12):
Exactly, and and you're dealing with a lot of different
types of people that you know, each respond to different things.
So it's you know, it's just one of those things
where you just have to you know, uh, do a
very good job of coming up with new ideas, pushing
the boundaries, reporting on it, making sure you're looking at
the metrics, and then you know, adjusting based on what
(29:36):
you're seeing in terms of what is working and not working.
Speaker 1 (29:39):
Now, in your experience, how often do you have to
run an ad before you get a bite so speak?
How often I mean will have to see it?
Speaker 2 (29:54):
I think it's it's We typically say you want to invest,
let's say, in a campaign, a couple thousand dollars right
on Meta or on Google. You want to generate enough
sort of enough views for that person to you know,
for that customer to kind of get a sense for
if it's working or not. So we usually go by
(30:16):
spend how much money should I spend on Meta running
this ad before I decide if it works or it
doesn't work. So a lot of it is driven by spend,
and then you look at, well, how many people looked
at the ad, how many people clicked on the ad,
how many people converted right, how many people actually purchase
the product or filled out this form. So it's usually
(30:36):
a couple thousand dollars that we want to at a
minimum test and we'll test it over two to three
weeks testing different ad concepts. So maybe not one ad concept,
will maybe test a few different concepts within that two
to three week period with different messaging right to see
what is best in terms of performance. So usually, you know,
(31:00):
for any advertiser that we work with, we always say
to work with us, we want you to spend a
minimum of fifteen thousand dollars within a thirty day period
to really test things, and do that for at least
three to four months, because you know, we need to
make sure that we have a lot of sort of
data under our belt before we can make any decisions,
(31:23):
you know, like in terms of what the opportunity size is. Otherwise,
if you're just throwing a couple hundred bucks at it,
it's not enough to really make any conclusive sort of
decisions on what the opportunity is for that customer on
that channel.
Speaker 1 (31:38):
Yeah, and you're right, because I mean, as small businesses,
you know, they don't have thousands dollars to spend, and
there's many complaints that they spend a couple hundred dollars,
they typically don't get anything. Yep, that's right, so you've
just defined why.
Speaker 4 (32:00):
Yeah exactly, yeah, yeah, So you definitely have to have
a budget for marketing for sure, and if you don't
have one, you need to be well, I say you
don't have one, what are some recommendations to get you
to a place to be able to afford your company?
Speaker 2 (32:21):
Well, I think you need to you know, the bottom
line is you need to come up with that budget,
which means you need to either have the capital or
raise it. Right, if you don't have any dollars to invest,
then it's going to be very different difficult to scale, right.
So I think if you are not making money on
the business to then be able to set that money
aside the profits of that money to then reinvest, maybe
(32:44):
you have to raise money. But eventually you have to
have capital. It's a capital intensive thing, which again you
don't need millions of dollars, but you do need some
amount of money to test and you need to have patience, right,
So you kind of you have to earmark amount of
money into advertising, and it's not for everybody. It may
(33:06):
not be something you can do out of the gates,
but eventually I think, you know, you really need to
allocate some amount of advertising dollars to test on these channels,
and the key is doing it with a company that
knows what they're doing, because if you only have one chance,
you want to make sure that you're setting yourself up
for success or giving yourself the highest probability of succeeding,
(33:29):
which means do it with a company that knows what
they're doing, because it's not worth taking the chance.
Speaker 1 (33:37):
Yes, yes, yes, wow. This has been very educational, mister Kwan,
to say the least, you know, because I mean that's
the biggest thing in any company is marketing and coming
up with a budget to get it done and selecting
the right.
Speaker 2 (33:53):
Person to do the job exactly.
Speaker 1 (33:57):
Yep, so's a lot nail. Let's talk a little bit
about that in terms of businesses selecting the right representation
for their marketing.
Speaker 2 (34:10):
Yeah, you mean in the employee side, No, I mean.
Speaker 1 (34:13):
When people are out looking for somebody to support them marketing,
what should they be looking for?
Speaker 2 (34:20):
Yeah? I mean I think you should really understand how
much experience a company has. Right, who are the clients
that they've worked with pastor present or both? What channels
are they specializing in, and do those channels align with
the channels that you want to invest in. How long
(34:42):
has the agency been in business, how much media have
they managed over that time period, look at their success stories,
right case studies. The most importantly, after doing all those things,
make sure that they bring you value before you sign
a contract, meaning do what we do, which is do
(35:05):
an audit. Have them do an audit of your business
and have them sort of evaluate your business from a
digital standpoint and then give you their point of view
on what they believe is needed to take it to
the next level. It really requires them to spend time
looking at the ad accounts, putting pen to paper, coming
(35:27):
up with their thoughts and outlining what their strategy would be,
and then talking to you about it and making sure
that there's alignment. So I think you can do all
the stuff I said, because you need to do all
that stuff as part of the due diligence, but then
really have them do an audit of your business and
make sure you're able to hear from them firsthand on
how they would take your business at the next level.
(35:49):
To make sure that you are in agreement with that strategy.
I think is a very important part in the process
because no matter what you read in a website no
matter what they tell you about their custom that they've
worked with. At the end of the day, if it
were me, I'd want to know what are you going
to do for me and how can you help my
business to make it the most relevant and productive? Yes?
Speaker 1 (36:11):
Absolutely so again, how do businesses connect with you?
Speaker 2 (36:17):
Foure one five digital dot com is our website, a
lot of information there in a forum you can fill
out will be in touch and then also through LinkedIn.
Borja Kwan b O R j A c U A
N feel free to connect with me there. Wow.
Speaker 1 (36:34):
Thank you so much mister Kwan for meeting with us today.
We definitely appreciate all the nuggets you just dropped on us,
and ladies and gentlemen, if you need marketing and you
have the budget, please visit mister Kuak because he's definitely
serious about taking your business to the next level.
Speaker 2 (36:57):
So thank you so much, Thank you for having me.
I enjoyed the conversation absolutely.
Speaker 1 (37:06):
Thank you to our guests and you our values audience.
Let's stop you by.
Speaker 2 (37:13):
We truly appreciate you.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
Many blessings to you and yours
Welcome to Just Minded My Business Media LLC, where you
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Speaker 1 (01:52):
I hope you are having an amazing day and welcome.
Welcome to Just Minding My Business and I'm excited to
bring to you today mister Kwan, who joined the performance
advertising industry in nineteen ninety eight and has built a
career in the industry providing strategic business solutions for teams
(02:15):
and clients. His track record of helping growth, stable successful
organizations is underpinned by a career long personal commitment to
great client experiences. Mister Kwan combines big picture perspective with
exacting attention to make sure four fifteen clients and team
(02:40):
members get value out of their work every day. Wow,
welcome mister Kwan. How are you this day?
Speaker 2 (02:49):
I am doing well. Thank you for having me on
the podcast.
Speaker 1 (02:54):
Appreciate you being here. So tell us all about four
fifteen Digital.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
Yeah, we are an eight year old performance marketing agency
that specializes in helping businesses across different verticals scale grow
through digital marketing. So we are investing our clients dollars
(03:22):
on various online channels, specifically Google, Microsoft, being meta LinkedIn
TikTok to help them acquire customers.
Speaker 1 (03:36):
Okay, okay, so let me ask you what all goes
into that.
Speaker 2 (03:43):
Yeah, it's a it's a process. So typically we're looking
for advertisers that are currently investing at least eighty to
one hundred thousand dollars a month in digital advertising across
the channels that I mentioned. It could be one of
the channels, it could be numerous channels, but typically someone
(04:07):
that is investing currently in digital marketing who's looking to
scale and take their paid marketing campaigns to the next level.
So we come in and our area of expertise is
media buying, So that means we understand each of the
platforms very intimately. Intimately, we understand how to leverage those
(04:29):
platforms to help businesses find the right audiences i e.
The right customers that are that they are looking for,
which will then translate into generating leads for them, sales,
really whatever the conversion event is that they're looking for.
So media buying is a big part of that, which
(04:51):
means we're buying on Facebook, we're buying on Google, we're
buying on TikTok. Depending on the client and where their
customers are. But in addition to media buying, we're also
helping customers design ads to support the marketing campaigns, helping
them design landing pages, We're helping them come up with
(05:13):
the right offers, the right messaging, and so creative design
is a big part of what we do to support
media buying. And then lastly, you can't manage what you
can't measure in business, so we spend a lot of
time helping customers build the right tracking infrastructure that supports
(05:35):
the marketing campaigns and allows them to report on all
the key performance indicators that they look at for their
particular business.
Speaker 1 (05:45):
So when you say, you know, I'm really into analytics,
I need to know what I'm doing is doing something.
So when you say building that, what does that involve?
Speaker 2 (05:57):
Yeah, I mean it's letting up the right tracking for
each of the platforms that we're buying on and implementing
the tracking links on websites, on you know, conversion pages.
You know, there's there are technicalities to it that are
are not something that I'm as knowledgeable of, but the
(06:21):
most important thing to know that we want for all
of our customers who invest money in the different digital
marketing platforms is that we want to be able to
know where every sell comes from, right, So if we're
spending money on Google, we want to know how many
sales we generated through Google. If it's Facebook, how many
(06:43):
sales generated from Facebook. We want to be able to
look at that data on a channel basis and then
tie it back to what the investment was so that
we can calculate what the return was. You know, how
efficient was this media. So we don't want to we
don't want to just have one number that represents multiple
platforms because that doesn't help you look at things on
(07:05):
a very individual basis. So the tracking that we do
is really on a channel basis. But even within a channel,
we do different levels of tracking. So within a particular channel,
you might be targeting different geographies, right, so we want
to look at performance at the geo level. So there
are different ways to kind of break out tracking, but
(07:29):
really the most simple way to think about it is
we want to be able to attribute a sale on
a very specific platform basis, so that you as a
client know how much money you're spending and then what
you are getting in return.
Speaker 1 (07:45):
And I would assume that it would also lend to
itself to where you're getting the most activity and where
you're not.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
It basically is exactly that it allows. It's how data
is what in warms our decision making process. Right, so
when we have the right tracking, that enables us to
report on the activities and then make decisions based on
the data that we're seeing. So high integrity data is
really important at what we do, which is why we
(08:17):
start with what is not very sexy, which is, hey,
I know this isn't launching ads and going live with campaigns,
but we have to take a step back and evaluate
the current tracking infrastructure to make sure it has a
level of sophistication. We need to support the investment. We
have clients that are investing millions of dollars on a
monthly basis in digital advertising, and so if we don't
(08:39):
have the right tracking infrastructure, we're really operating very blindly.
So we really need to spend time doing that thoroughly
and making sure that before we start investing dollars that
we have that setup correctly.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
Absolutely, so this is want to work with you? How
did they connect with you?
Speaker 2 (09:00):
Yeah, the various ways that we can connect with perspective clients,
but you know, four to fifteen Digital is our website
fo your one five digital dot com. There you can
see a variety of information around the services that we
offer clients. We also feature case studies for some of
the work we've done for companies in different verticals, companies
(09:23):
of different sizes and stages, and then also tells you
a little bit about kind of our culture, values, mission statement,
job opening. So really, if you're someone looking to get
into the digital marketing world and you're looking to work
for an agency, there's a lot of information there. If
you're a perspective client who's interested in learning more about
(09:45):
our services, there's plenty of information for you to read there.
Gay awesome.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
So when you are working, let's say you are selecting
a client. Okay, a client comes out to you and
want you're services. What is the criteria? What are some
of the things that you ask and look forward?
Speaker 2 (10:07):
Yeah, so one of the things is are you currently
investing in digital marketing? That's important because that directly correlates
with them being able to afford us. You know, we
have fees that we charge advertisers that are we have
minimum fees. So for example, our minimum fee is eight
thousand dollars a month. Regardless of how much you're spending
(10:31):
and advertising. So that's why we typically are looking for
someone who's spending at least eighty to one hundred thousand
dollars in digital marketing because as a percentage, that's when
it really makes sense for them a percentage of the
media spend. So one we're looking for, you know, a
minimum spend online. We do make exceptions to that for
(10:55):
companies that maybe are earlier stage or companies in the
B to B space business to business space, because they
typically have a smaller audience that they're trying to reach
and because of that, we know that there are fewer
impressions out there, and therefore we know that their investment
will be capped mostly because their audience is very small.
(11:18):
So there are exceptions to that rule where we say, oh,
you're a B to B company, you're only spending twenty
thousand dollars a month, that's okay, we'll still talk to you.
But in general, we're looking for someone that's spending in
that range. Like I said, in addition to that, it's
really not so much category specific. We have a broad
set of companies that we work with, so a lot
(11:39):
of diversity in the portfolio in terms of B to
B companies B two C within the B to B
segment true SMBs to enterprise sized companies. We work with startups,
We work with small businesses that are generating five ten
million dollars a month, to publicly traded companies that are
(12:00):
doing six billion dollars a year in revenue, and then
everything in between. So I think in terms of the
type of business, we're really ideally looking for someone that
is a national business versus someone that is selling a
product or service in a very sort of specific geography.
So the more the wider net we can cast, the better.
(12:24):
And it's also we look at before we work with
any client, we take some time to look under the
hood at their AD accounts. We do an extensive audit
at a very deep level to understand kind of what
they're doing, and then we present that to the client
and we say, hey, you know, these are the things,
(12:44):
not based on an opinion, but based on math and experience,
that we think you're doing well. And conversely, these are
the things you're not doing well. And most importantly, this
is what we would do if we were in the
driver's seat managing your investment. And then through that process,
we get to know the client better and they get
to know us. So it's really important that you know.
(13:08):
At this stage in our kind of evolution, we're looking
for also personalities in chemistry. So it's not just can
you afford us, it's do we think we can bring value?
And do we think we're aligned in terms of the
direction we want to take your business, Because if there's misalignment,
it could be a major friction point. Right, If our
(13:30):
personalities are not gelling, it's probably going to be a problem, right,
So we're also looking out to see if it's a
good match from a strategy perspective, from a way we
think about business perspective, because we know that the journey
will be a series of ups and downs. It's not
always upward, and so when the going is going to
(13:52):
get tough, is this something that we're going to sort
of work on together. Is it going to be very
kind of adversarial? So we're kind of looking for those
things as well.
Speaker 1 (14:01):
Yes, yes, that was my first thought. Can we get
along's all money and good money.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
It's not all the same. I agree with you, it's
not worth it, right some cases, just because you can
afford us doesn't mean you can, you know, treat our
team badly or doesn't mean you can place excess demands
on us. They're just you know, we're looking to work
with reasonable people that are smart, that are in this
(14:33):
with us. They understand the definition of a partnership. Even
though we are the provider and they are our customer,
it doesn't matter. This is still a partnership and it
requires us each to have rules and responsibilities and for
us to each be accountable to things because unfortunately we
do not control everything. So in the areas that we
(14:55):
don't control, we need them to step up and deliver,
otherwise the outcomes will be less than favorable. Yes, and I.
Speaker 1 (15:02):
Like the word that you use partnership because that's really critical.
You know, even in my business, it's a partnership. We
sit here, we talk about your business. I create some
marketing for you. I expect you to share. I'm a shit,
you know, a great partnership. You know, it's you know,
(15:25):
my time and your time, and it's important that we
have that understanding before we even start.
Speaker 2 (15:34):
Yeah, I think I think that's Uh, it's really important.
And I always tell my customers, the team is working
very hard and you're the way you are with them
either motivates them or or demotivates them, right. And I
see this even myself when I go to a restaurant
or hotel and I see really happy or a retail
(15:56):
store and I see really happy employees. I always survey
on my own because I'm curious, and I say, this
must be a great place to work, because the way
you treat me. The experience I have here is excellent.
And to me, that means that you're happy and they
treat you well, they train you, they invest in you,
they take care of you, because that's directly sort of
(16:19):
reflected in the way that you deliver the service to me.
So I've always felt that like the employer has a
role in treating the team well, investing in them, and
that will sort of be on display with the customer,
but also the customer and the way that they treat
the employee. You know, in this case, we're a vendor,
(16:40):
so it's not like we're in house, but we're still
a part of the team. Really makes the difference between
someone wanting to work hard for you or not work
hard for you. So I think that's always something that
you know, people need to remember. It's very easily forgotten
because we're all dealing with a lot of to dos.
But you can't lose sight of that even when it's
(17:00):
an agency relationship, because people are still you know, influenced
by how you treat them and how you make them feel.
Speaker 1 (17:09):
Absolutely number one ingredient for sure. Wow Wow wow Wow.
Let's talk a little bit about cut your clients and
you just went over how you select them. Okay, Now,
(17:29):
once you get into the situation with them, and let's
say they say things are slow, you know, because as
we know, marketing is repetitious actions and they want quickness.
How do you handle that?
Speaker 2 (17:50):
Yeah? I mean I think people want speed and we
understand that, and we also operate at you know, we
operate with a sense of urgency and the way we
do business because we understand that people are under a
lot of pressure. A lot of the customers that we
work with, a lot of the contacts that we have
(18:10):
within these organizations, they're under a lot of pressure from
the folks above them, and so it just ends up
sort of coming to us right as a result of that.
So I think we want to operate as fast as
we can, but be thoughtful along the way and make
sure that we're making the right decisions, and sometimes that
(18:31):
does require us to say, hey, you hired us as
the experts, and while we understand you want to move quickly,
there are certain things we need to do before we
can move that quickly, so it's important for us to
identify those and talk through them. So we're always going
to be the fastest ones moving, but sometimes we are
relying on the client to do something in order for
(18:51):
us to move to the next stage, right, so we
are oftentimes blocked. But I think when someone wants us
to move fast, the answer is we will move as
fast as we can, but be thoughtful along the way,
because at the end of the day, speed is important,
but we also have to be sort of sort of
(19:11):
aware of not rushing things without really having think thought
them through. Right. Could be like a decision related to
creative or it could be a decision related to an
offer or messaging. So yeah, we understand that people want
to move quickly, but it's up to us to sort
of set the pace and explain what is realistic versus
(19:32):
not realistic. So as long as we're aligned there, that's fine.
And we tend to be very direct in our way
of communicating with clients because we want them to know
that we want to do what's best for them and
we want them to trust us. But it's on us
to really explain things and really make sure that we
are sort of setting the tone. Now. Ultimately, they're the customer,
(19:56):
they decide, but we absolutely are being hired to not
always tell them what they want to hear, but instead
tell them what we think is the best course of
action for their business.
Speaker 1 (20:05):
Absolutely absolutely, And they came to you.
Speaker 2 (20:08):
All that, yes, yeah, that's what they're paying us for.
And I think the worst relationship you can have is
one where you do everything you're told, even when you
don't agree. Sometimes they'll test us and they'll say, you know,
should we you know, I want to do this, and
they're expecting us to push back because they may think
that's not a good thing. So I always tell the
(20:29):
team is always give your sue assessment of things, and
ultimately the client can override you because they are the customer.
They can disagree with you. They can say no, we're
doing this even if you've told me you don't think
it's the right decision. We should absolutely document what our
recommendation is. But at the end, of the day. They
(20:50):
can override our decision because they are the customer, but
we should always at a minimum give them what we
think is the best thing to do.
Speaker 1 (20:58):
And absolutely absolutely, because I mean in your spirit and
as a company, when you know it's not the right
thing to do, your gut is telling you this is
not the right thing to do, and it is your
job at that point to let the customer know this
is not the right thing to do because of these
(21:20):
things exactly.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
Yeah, I mean that's really the value we bring, right,
and we have to be looking out for the customer.
We are the experts. It's what we do for a living,
it's why we exist. So I think being silent is
not an option. I think we have to be vocal.
We have to be clear in our communications. We need
to document things to make sure that with everybody having
(21:44):
such a busy scheduled things can be forgotten. Right. So yeah,
for sure.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
So let's talk a little bit about AI.
Speaker 2 (21:54):
And your business.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
I mean, now just about every business is using AI
to help them, So how do you use A.
Speaker 2 (22:03):
Yeah, we are with respect to AI, embracing AI and
uh recognizing it's here to stay and we'll only get better.
So we view AI not as a way to displace
employees instead, uh, support their efforts in delivering customer service
(22:25):
uh and and and delivering sort of performance for our client.
So yes, it's it's sort of built into a lot
of the sort of team's work and we use it,
you know, a lot for coming up with you know, uh,
messaging for ads, coming up with sort of you know,
(22:47):
creating ads at scale. So for design work, it's been
very useful just you know, putting you know a lot
of ads out with relatively low effort versus having a
designer do it one by one. AI allows us to
create ads at scale. Also, you know, just you know,
working through various business sort of challenges, right like, Hey,
(23:11):
I have this situation, I have this, you know, offer
this promotion that want to run. What are some good
ideas as ways to kind of market this? So a
lot of just like it's a lot around content creation,
messaging on ads, you know, creating ads things like that
is how the team is using it.
Speaker 1 (23:32):
In media buying, Yes, yes, Neil, do you do anything
with television.
Speaker 2 (23:39):
No, everything we do at the moment is really online
using the channels that I had mentioned. So we do
some postal mail that we're starting to do with some
of our clients direct mail, which is really effective for
some of the companies that we work with, but we've
not done really that's not the same. We wouldn't sort
of move into that direction. But it's all been digital.
Speaker 1 (24:01):
Okay, okay, yes, because that's definitely another market, you know, indeed,
and you know, I'm a TV person. Sometimes I like
it for company when I'm working, but sometimes in the
back of your mind you're still listening to some of
the things that's coming on even though you're working.
Speaker 2 (24:24):
So yeahp wow.
Speaker 1 (24:27):
So again, how can people businesses get in contact with you?
Speaker 2 (24:33):
Yeah, I would say connect with me on LinkedIn? Borha
kwan that's b O R J A c U A N.
I write a lot on LinkedIn. I post a lot
of content on LinkedIn, So feel free to connect me.
Connect with me on LinkedIn. Also, you can go directly
to our website four fifteen digital dot com. That's f
(24:55):
O U R one five digital dot com. There's a
contact ust form. If you fill that out, we'll be
in touch with you very soon.
Speaker 1 (25:03):
Okay, this is more of a personal question. How did
you arrive here? How did you what sparked your interest
in this field.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
I think it was because I was introduced to online
marketing when I was right out of college back in
nineteen ninety eight. I didn't know much about the Internet.
It was a relatively new concept, and it was at
my first job right out of college that I was
introduced to the Internet, and specifically it was affiliate marketing,
(25:35):
and I ended up sort of staying at that first
company for eight years and then going on to another
company for six years. So it was really nineteen ninety eight.
I joined Number as Number twenty nine, an early internet startup,
and never left. So it was there that really left
a memorable experience for me, learning a lot, meeting a
(25:56):
lot of great people, having been mentored and coached by
really really solid leaders, and I was given a lot
of opportunity and kind of moved up the ranks and
you know, never looked back.
Speaker 1 (26:09):
So that's great. So you fan your sweet spot.
Speaker 2 (26:12):
Early on, I did, just by chance, not by design.
It just was kind of one of those things where
I got an interview and wasn't really looking for that
type of opportunity, but I ended up taking the interview
and here I am today.
Speaker 1 (26:24):
Yes, and you never know how it's going to show up.
That's one thing you cannot.
Speaker 2 (26:29):
Predict exactly exactly for sure.
Speaker 1 (26:34):
Wow. Wow, I'm just trying to think about everything that
you talked about. I hope the audience has definitely taken
notes because you know, and you know, getting your message
out is really really how you grow your business. There's
no other way. And you know, so let's talk quickly
(26:58):
about messaging, as a lot of people have a problem
with that.
Speaker 2 (27:05):
Yeah, messaging is tough. I mean, I think it requires
a lot of experimentation. I think you have to consider
who the advertiser is, who their audiences, who are they
trying to get in front of, who are they trying
to get engage with their offer, their product or service,
and it's testing, right. I think messaging a lot of
(27:27):
people are looking for a very specific call to action. Right.
If you're in e commerce, obviously promotions are really appealing
to consumers, right, free shipping, five dollars off, ten percent off,
limited time offers. If you're more of a B to
B company, it could be hey, access this white paper
(27:50):
on employee benefits. Right. So I think we do a
lot of experimentation because ultimately you have to test. In
this business, even with ads, right at your top performing ad,
you're always looking to iterate upon that to find the
next best ad that will take that over. Right, So
(28:13):
things become stagnant, they have a shelf life like anything,
and you always have to be experimenting with messaging with
you know, the actual ads, font color, things like that.
So messaging is just you know, obviously because we've done this,
we kind of have some understanding of what works depending
on the client, but a lot of times it's really
(28:36):
a lot of experimentation and constant pushing of boundaries, you know,
balancing between being too aggressive and too conservative. Right, depending
on the client and the brand, they may have more
limitations and what you can do from a marketing standpoint
because they want to be compliant, or they're regulated, or
we can't make claims. So every customer is different depending
(28:59):
on what what type of business they're in. But yeah,
in general, it's uh, it requires a lot of experimentation
and testing.
Speaker 1 (29:07):
Yes, because at the end of the day, the public
is the judge.
Speaker 2 (29:12):
Exactly, and and you're dealing with a lot of different
types of people that you know, each respond to different things.
So it's you know, it's just one of those things
where you just have to you know, uh, do a
very good job of coming up with new ideas, pushing
the boundaries, reporting on it, making sure you're looking at
the metrics, and then you know, adjusting based on what
(29:36):
you're seeing in terms of what is working and not working.
Speaker 1 (29:39):
Now, in your experience, how often do you have to
run an ad before you get a bite so speak?
How often I mean will have to see it?
Speaker 2 (29:54):
I think it's it's We typically say you want to invest,
let's say, in a campaign, a couple thousand dollars right
on Meta or on Google. You want to generate enough
sort of enough views for that person to you know,
for that customer to kind of get a sense for
if it's working or not. So we usually go by
(30:16):
spend how much money should I spend on Meta running
this ad before I decide if it works or it
doesn't work. So a lot of it is driven by spend,
and then you look at, well, how many people looked
at the ad, how many people clicked on the ad,
how many people converted right, how many people actually purchase
the product or filled out this form. So it's usually
(30:36):
a couple thousand dollars that we want to at a
minimum test and we'll test it over two to three
weeks testing different ad concepts. So maybe not one ad concept,
will maybe test a few different concepts within that two
to three week period with different messaging right to see
what is best in terms of performance. So usually, you know,
(31:00):
for any advertiser that we work with, we always say
to work with us, we want you to spend a
minimum of fifteen thousand dollars within a thirty day period
to really test things, and do that for at least
three to four months, because you know, we need to
make sure that we have a lot of sort of
data under our belt before we can make any decisions,
(31:23):
you know, like in terms of what the opportunity size is. Otherwise,
if you're just throwing a couple hundred bucks at it,
it's not enough to really make any conclusive sort of
decisions on what the opportunity is for that customer on
that channel.
Speaker 1 (31:38):
Yeah, and you're right, because I mean, as small businesses,
you know, they don't have thousands dollars to spend, and
there's many complaints that they spend a couple hundred dollars,
they typically don't get anything. Yep, that's right, so you've
just defined why.
Speaker 4 (32:00):
Yeah exactly, yeah, yeah, So you definitely have to have
a budget for marketing for sure, and if you don't
have one, you need to be well, I say you
don't have one, what are some recommendations to get you
to a place to be able to afford your company?
Speaker 2 (32:21):
Well, I think you need to you know, the bottom
line is you need to come up with that budget,
which means you need to either have the capital or
raise it. Right, if you don't have any dollars to invest,
then it's going to be very different difficult to scale, right.
So I think if you are not making money on
the business to then be able to set that money
aside the profits of that money to then reinvest, maybe
(32:44):
you have to raise money. But eventually you have to
have capital. It's a capital intensive thing, which again you
don't need millions of dollars, but you do need some
amount of money to test and you need to have patience, right,
So you kind of you have to earmark amount of
money into advertising, and it's not for everybody. It may
(33:06):
not be something you can do out of the gates,
but eventually I think, you know, you really need to
allocate some amount of advertising dollars to test on these channels,
and the key is doing it with a company that
knows what they're doing, because if you only have one chance,
you want to make sure that you're setting yourself up
for success or giving yourself the highest probability of succeeding,
(33:29):
which means do it with a company that knows what
they're doing, because it's not worth taking the chance.
Speaker 1 (33:37):
Yes, yes, yes, wow. This has been very educational, mister Kwan,
to say the least, you know, because I mean that's
the biggest thing in any company is marketing and coming
up with a budget to get it done and selecting
the right.
Speaker 2 (33:53):
Person to do the job exactly.
Speaker 1 (33:57):
Yep, so's a lot nail. Let's talk a little bit
about that in terms of businesses selecting the right representation
for their marketing.
Speaker 2 (34:10):
Yeah, you mean in the employee side, No, I mean.
Speaker 1 (34:13):
When people are out looking for somebody to support them marketing,
what should they be looking for?
Speaker 2 (34:20):
Yeah? I mean I think you should really understand how
much experience a company has. Right, who are the clients
that they've worked with pastor present or both? What channels
are they specializing in, and do those channels align with
the channels that you want to invest in. How long
(34:42):
has the agency been in business, how much media have
they managed over that time period, look at their success stories,
right case studies. The most importantly, after doing all those things,
make sure that they bring you value before you sign
a contract, meaning do what we do, which is do
(35:05):
an audit. Have them do an audit of your business
and have them sort of evaluate your business from a
digital standpoint and then give you their point of view
on what they believe is needed to take it to
the next level. It really requires them to spend time
looking at the ad accounts, putting pen to paper, coming
(35:27):
up with their thoughts and outlining what their strategy would be,
and then talking to you about it and making sure
that there's alignment. So I think you can do all
the stuff I said, because you need to do all
that stuff as part of the due diligence, but then
really have them do an audit of your business and
make sure you're able to hear from them firsthand on
how they would take your business at the next level.
(35:49):
To make sure that you are in agreement with that strategy.
I think is a very important part in the process
because no matter what you read in a website no
matter what they tell you about their custom that they've
worked with. At the end of the day, if it
were me, I'd want to know what are you going
to do for me and how can you help my
business to make it the most relevant and productive? Yes?
Speaker 1 (36:11):
Absolutely so again, how do businesses connect with you?
Speaker 2 (36:17):
Foure one five digital dot com is our website, a
lot of information there in a forum you can fill
out will be in touch and then also through LinkedIn.
Borja Kwan b O R j A c U A
N feel free to connect with me there. Wow.
Speaker 1 (36:34):
Thank you so much mister Kwan for meeting with us today.
We definitely appreciate all the nuggets you just dropped on us,
and ladies and gentlemen, if you need marketing and you
have the budget, please visit mister Kuak because he's definitely
serious about taking your business to the next level.
Speaker 2 (36:57):
So thank you so much, Thank you for having me.
I enjoyed the conversation absolutely.
Speaker 1 (37:06):
Thank you to our guests and you our values audience.
Let's stop you by.
Speaker 2 (37:13):
We truly appreciate you.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
Many blessings to you and yours
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