November 20, 2025 • 33 mins
What if retirement isn’t the finish line—it’s the riskiest part of the journey?
Erik Brenner is a 30-year financial veteran who’s helped thousands of clients navigate the second half of wealth: how to safely come down the financial mountain. As CEO of Hilltop Wealth & Tax Solutions, Erik serves as a “Personal CFO” for successful individuals— integrating investment, tax, and legacy planning under one roof.
Today, he’s here to talk about why your parents’ retirement won’t work for you—and what to do instead. Erik Brenner, CFP®, is the President and CEO of Hilltop Wealth & Tax Solutions, a fiduciary firm that integrates advanced financial planning with in-house tax strategy. With over 30 years of experience, Erik specializes in helping high-net-worth individuals—including pre- retirees, business owners, and medical professionals—transition from saving and building to preserving and distributing wealth with confidence. Through his firm’s “Personal CFO” approach, Erik delivers the simplicity, clarity, and strategic guidance clients need to navigate complex financial decisions. He and his team act as the central hub for clients’ retirement income planning, tax mitigation, and wealth preservation, so clients can focus on what matters most.
Erik's upcoming book, The Personal CFO Revolution: A Comprehensive Guide to Navigating Your Retirement, reflects the heart of his mission—to be the trusted guide when the stakes are highest.
Business: Hilltop Wealth & Tax Solutions
Website: https://hilltopwealthtax.com/
Free Book: https://hilltopwealthtax.com/podcast
Social Media:
LinkedIN - https://www.linkedin.com/in/erikbrenner/
Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/hilltopwealthtax/
Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/hilltopwealthtax/
Remember to SUBSCRIBE so you don't miss "Information That You Can Use." Share Just Minding My Business with your family, friends, and colleagues. Engage with us by leaving a review or comment. https://g.page/r/CVKSq-IsFaY9EBM/review Your support keeps this podcast going and growing.
Visit Just Minding My Business Media™ LLC at https://jmmbmediallc.com/ to learn how we can help you get more visibility on your products and services.
Erik Brenner is a 30-year financial veteran who’s helped thousands of clients navigate the second half of wealth: how to safely come down the financial mountain. As CEO of Hilltop Wealth & Tax Solutions, Erik serves as a “Personal CFO” for successful individuals— integrating investment, tax, and legacy planning under one roof.
Today, he’s here to talk about why your parents’ retirement won’t work for you—and what to do instead. Erik Brenner, CFP®, is the President and CEO of Hilltop Wealth & Tax Solutions, a fiduciary firm that integrates advanced financial planning with in-house tax strategy. With over 30 years of experience, Erik specializes in helping high-net-worth individuals—including pre- retirees, business owners, and medical professionals—transition from saving and building to preserving and distributing wealth with confidence. Through his firm’s “Personal CFO” approach, Erik delivers the simplicity, clarity, and strategic guidance clients need to navigate complex financial decisions. He and his team act as the central hub for clients’ retirement income planning, tax mitigation, and wealth preservation, so clients can focus on what matters most.
Erik's upcoming book, The Personal CFO Revolution: A Comprehensive Guide to Navigating Your Retirement, reflects the heart of his mission—to be the trusted guide when the stakes are highest.
Business: Hilltop Wealth & Tax Solutions
Website: https://hilltopwealthtax.com/
Free Book: https://hilltopwealthtax.com/podcast
Social Media:
LinkedIN - https://www.linkedin.com/in/erikbrenner/
Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/hilltopwealthtax/
Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/hilltopwealthtax/
Remember to SUBSCRIBE so you don't miss "Information That You Can Use." Share Just Minding My Business with your family, friends, and colleagues. Engage with us by leaving a review or comment. https://g.page/r/CVKSq-IsFaY9EBM/review Your support keeps this podcast going and growing.
Visit Just Minding My Business Media™ LLC at https://jmmbmediallc.com/ to learn how we can help you get more visibility on your products and services.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
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Speaker 1 (01:26):
Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, I appreciate you being here and let
me just ask you this question. What if retirement isn't
the finish line, it's the riskiest part of the journey.
Today I have Eric Brenner, who is a thirty year
financial veteran who's held thousands of clients navigate second half
(01:52):
of wealth how to safely come down a financial mountain
as CEO of Hilltop Wealth and so and Tech Solutions.
I'm sorry. Eric serves as personal CFO for Successful Individuals,
integrating investment, text and legacy planning planning under one root.
(02:16):
Today he is here to talk about why your parents'
retirement won't work for you and what to do instead.
I am so happy to have you.
Speaker 4 (02:26):
Yeah, well, I'm glad to be here. Ida.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
Let's just get right into the nitty gritty. Why is
climbing the mountain is easy? Descending it is the real risk?
Why is that a risk?
Speaker 4 (02:38):
Well, when you think about the last let's call it
thirty years and you know retirement, So someone working in
their working career saving investing, you know, probably the generation
like my grandparents' generation. A lot of those had pensions,
they had full health benefits and they knew that as
long as they were they became vested. They could retire
(03:04):
have full pension, full health benefits, even if they were
sixty years old. And so when they retired, they made
some decisions, but they took their pension, their health care
was covered and maybe they had a little savings and
they were fine. Well, that has changed obviously, pensions have
gone away. Very few people have pensions. Very few people
(03:24):
carry health insurance into retirement. Once they leave what they're doing,
the health benefits are over. And when they get into retirement,
what happens is that journey we call it down the
mountain can be treacherous because now they have to choose
from when do they take their social security? Where do
they take, what investments? When, what order do they take?
(03:48):
How is it taxed? And so I often tell people,
you know, you could have four or five different income sources,
all of them are taxed differently, and so coordinating that,
you know, can be a real challenge. And they're not
one time decisions. Where again grandparents' generation, it was a
(04:08):
one time decision. They chose their pension and that was it.
Now they need to coordinate this on a year to
year and during the year basis.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
Wow, and that's a bit much for most.
Speaker 4 (04:24):
It is a bit much. Yeah, And you know, even
though we do this, this is all we do. We
do it day in and day out. It's hard for
us to keep up. There's been many, many major legislative
and law changes just over the last few years, and
so you have to keep up with it. And if
you have a career on your own, I would say
(04:44):
it's near impossible to keep up with all those changes.
Speaker 1 (04:47):
Oh, you are so right, because things especially now. So Eric,
what is climbing the mountain? Talk about climbing the mountain
is easy, but the sending the real risks. What does
that mean?
Speaker 4 (05:02):
Yeah, I would say, you know, it might not be
easy climbing them mountain. You have to be committed to
savings and so forth. But if you think about your
grandparents' generation, my grandparents' generation, you know, they worked obviously,
they had their career. Many of those folks had pensions,
and they knew that if they worked for a company
(05:23):
for so many years, they're vested. When they retired, they
had full health benefits didn't matter when you retired, as
long as you were fully vested. You chose your pension option,
you had your health insurance, and a way you go
into retirement. Nowadays, that's not the case. Many do not
have pension or most do not have pensions, and so
they have to save for themselves. They save in a
(05:44):
retirement plan, they get a match along the way, so
the companies give them a match. They get into retirement,
and there is no health benefits for almost all that
carry forward. So they have to make those decisions, especially
if they're before Medicare age and then coming down the
mountain now, which means you know, retirement, and then during
(06:04):
retirement they could have several different income streams four or
five that are taxed differently. You have some that are
fully taxed, maybe some that are partially taxed, maybe some
that are tax free. And that's a navigation that's a
year to year basis, because chances are many people that
(06:25):
are listening to the podcast, their biggest expense in retirement
will not be healthcare. It will be tax m.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
And that's not what most people think.
Speaker 4 (06:40):
That's what most people think. You know, as we see
it and work with a lot of people in retirement,
you know, Medicare, along with good supplements, has really really
good coverage. UH. People pay very little out of pocket
UH and tax is a bigger bigger issue, and it
will become bigger over the next decade, two decades, three
(07:01):
decades because people have assets now, they have assets that
were saved in plans that have yet to be taxed.
Speaker 1 (07:11):
Oh yeah, yeah, because this seems like and one of
the things that I always thought, and you can correct
me that when you get a retirement age like seventy
what is it, whatever your retirement age, your full one
K will be text in a different text back bracket.
(07:31):
Is that true?
Speaker 4 (07:33):
So maybe what you're talking about is when you have
to take out from your qualified assets or iras four
oh one KSE So that age has changed over some
tax legislation that's happened over the last few years. And
so somebody that is born after nineteen sixty, that required
age is seventy five. Now somebody prior to that then
(07:57):
it would be sooner seventy three, and many people are
drawing it now. Those when you have to take that
money out, whether you need it or not, it is
not at a different tax rate. It comes in to
your taxable situation just like other income that as of
ordinary income, and that can push people to other tax
(08:21):
brackets that they're not aware of.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
Oh okay, Okay, okay, all right, So you just explained
the text situation being the biggest threat in retirement and wow,
that's definitely huge to say the least, because a lot
of people don't think that way. So how does the
(08:46):
family office model become accessible to us?
Speaker 4 (08:54):
Yeah, So the family office and you know strategy and
model has been a for a long time for the
ultra wealthy. So the ultra wealthy many many years ago
saw the need that they need to have, you know,
a team working with them that's really looking at all
aspects financial and that includes taxes. And so what we
(09:18):
saw is that that type of model we felt was
needed for more middle income America because of the complexities
that has happened and continues to happen. And so we
call it being a chief financial officer for a client
or a CFO. You know, we want to be a
CFO for our client, so that from the simple questions
(09:42):
on buying releasing a car to the big questions of retirement,
we want to have. We want to be a resource
that's an independent. We don't get paid commissions and we
can talk about our structure, but someone that's on their
side and making all of the decisions and then we
saw the need need to wrap in the tax and
tax advice. Many advisors say they do tax planning, but
(10:06):
they really are not allowed to be able to dive deep.
We have a whole tax division. We don't hide behind taxes.
Taxes is real and we take it seriously. As I said,
it could be the most expensive or the most cost
in someone's retirement, and so we want to help people
through that from a tax perspective, from tax planning to
(10:29):
even tax mitigation. So that's how we bring the family
office into how we work with folks, and we say, look,
we want to be your chief financial officer and guide
you along your financial journey.
Speaker 1 (10:43):
Yeah, and that's important because as you age, and not
only that, if that's not your mind, you don't have a.
Speaker 4 (10:51):
Clue that's correct. And like I said, there's been some
major legislation just in the last few years and we
have hard time, full time in it doing it to
keep up. And so somebody that you know is in
a career or even retired, it takes a lot to
kind of understand it and make sure that you're doing
(11:14):
what's best for yourself.
Speaker 1 (11:16):
Okay, So I mean I get we all living in
the world today, and we see all the different legislature
and all that kind of stuff that's happening. So I'm
sure you guys, your tax department and all your people
are constantly involved with the different changes. So can you
kind of bring us to right now what changes you've
(11:38):
seen thus far?
Speaker 4 (11:41):
So I'll take us back to twenty twenty. Twenty twenty,
there was a large piece of retirement legislation called the
Secure Act that came out. The Secure Act was the
biggest piece of retirement legislation in more than a decade,
and it changed the way that or ira money, your
(12:01):
retirement money, when do you take it out? It changed
the way that you need to think about it. It
changed the way that your beneficiaries will receive the money.
So often what we do is it may not be
in this year from a tax impact, but it could
be in three, four, five, six years. That's the projection.
(12:23):
So we had the Secure Act. Then in twenty twenty three,
Secure Act two point zero came out. Even though there
were some of the laws that we still weren't clear
on from twenty twenty now we have two point zero
in twenty twenty three, that in addition added complexity and
(12:44):
the importance that we feel in planning, and then come
this year. Of course the tax laws that were just signed,
so those are more relevant as far as tax brackets, right,
itemized deductions, things of this nature that will affect people
or may affect people. So when you kind of combine
(13:05):
all that it's here and now twenty twenty five, how
does it affect you? And then also going forward, how
does it affect you? All those things combined is what's important.
Speaker 1 (13:17):
Yes, yeah, So if clients want to work with you,
how did they connect with you?
Speaker 4 (13:22):
Yeah? So obviously our website is the best place. I
actually wrote a book. It's called The Personal CFO Guide
to Your Financial Journey, talking about and navigating these things,
and they can go to Hilltop Wealth Tax dot com
slash podcast. That's Hilltop Wealth Tax dot com slash podcast
and they can get a free copy of the book
(13:45):
if they have an interest. We set up fifteen minute
introductory calls. Allows us to find out a bit more
about the client. We find out, you find out about
the firm and really see if there may be a possibility,
and if there is, we can match them up with
a wealth advisor. But the book's a great thing. I
think and I have been told that it really helps
people think about it, not just this year, it helps
(14:08):
them think about their transition and guiding down this mountain.
Do you realize that, I think this is an interesting
statistic that eighty percent plus of all mountain climbing fatalities
happen on the way down. Wow, they don't happen on
the way up. Well, why is that? Maybe they don't
(14:30):
have a good guide, Maybe they slip on a rock, right,
maybe they run in, they don't take the right path down.
So we think about it. In what we do is
we help people guide where your guide down the mountain
and making sure that you know you are making the
right decisions in retirement. You know what you're making and
(14:51):
gross incomes one thing. What you're actually putting in your
pocket net is a whole different. Yes.
Speaker 1 (15:00):
Yes, And that's started from the very first job exactly,
so we know we don't get it all. Wow, I am.
So I'm excited about the book that might that we
can get for free because that's really important. And not
only that, like you said, it gets people thinking.
Speaker 4 (15:24):
And that's correct, you think.
Speaker 1 (15:27):
Wow. So let's talk a little bit about the costly
blonde spots of hogh income earnest and how to avoid them.
Speaker 4 (15:37):
So a couple of things I think about. One is
when they're saving and their higher income earners, are they
saving in the right places. So an example, simple example
is putting into a retirement plan through workplace that you're
able to deduct today, so it feels good because you're
in a higher tax bracket, and twenty five years ago
(15:58):
we would talk about you're going to be in a
lower tax bracket in retirement, and that may not be
the case. So saving in a pre tax you're saving
it today. Well, if you're saving it today, that means
you're deferring it. That means that at some point tax
is going to be due. And we don't know what
(16:19):
the tax brackets are going to be twenty years from now.
I mean, no one knows. What I know is we
are in a forty plus year low as it relates
to the tax brackets, and so most people think they're
probably going to go up at some point. So where
do you save it? It's not just put it somewhere.
How do you save it? Then another kind of roadblock,
(16:42):
and that a lot of people don't realize, is there
is differences in the planning, particularly tax. There's tax deferral,
which is deferring the tax ode till some point in
the future. There's tax mitigation. Tax mitigation means you eliminate
the tax in the year you're in and you don't
(17:04):
owe it back at all. So there are strategies that
have been utilized by the ultra wealthy within the family
office environment for decades and there's multiple strategies that can
mitigate tax and so that means bring down what you
(17:24):
owe this year. So we do a lot of planning,
tax strategy and mitigation and how does that all work
into the overall financial plan and what we're able to
do Since we're an independent fiduciary firm and we have
the tax business as well that's integrated, we're able to
(17:48):
take that from step one all the way through and
then help people every year along the way.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
Wow, that's amazing. I like that. Now, let me ask you,
do you do anything with trust?
Speaker 4 (18:04):
We do. So we do a state planning for clients.
You know, will help clients a just kind of bug
them to do an estate plan. You know, we see
a lot of people that come to us new and
even our current clients. Some of them you got to
get in a state plan. We see a lot of
clients that come to us initially and they don't have
an estate plan at all, so we'll do We'll help
(18:25):
them with that, and then we have the capability through
some of our partners in making sure that all those
document documents get done. You know, do you need a
trust or not? You know what happens with your estate
right also title, So getting the documents done and you're
a state plan done, that's a step that does not
(18:46):
mean you're done. You want to make sure things are
titled properly, your assets are titled properly to make sure
that they're passing the most efficient and that's really what
that's about. Estate planning is about making sure that you're
taken care of. Also, if you're incapacitated, it doesn't necessarily
mean you have to pass away, but if you cannot
(19:09):
take care of your finances or your health, making sure
you have somebody that will designate to do that. But
then once you pass away, do you have two choices
where it goes? You can leave it to the ones
you love, the charities you care about, or you can
leave it to the I R. S.
Speaker 1 (19:26):
Nobody wants to do that.
Speaker 4 (19:27):
Nobody wants to do that. I've never seen in thirty
two years of doing this, I've never seen the I
R S as a beneficiary. No, So we you know,
we help people also in that aspect to make sure
that it gets passed along, you know, properly.
Speaker 1 (19:44):
Yeah, because that's a big thing, especially in the retirement age,
because most retirees have homes, you know, and that probate
thing is a bear.
Speaker 4 (19:57):
It's a bear, and a lot of people will have
two homes in different states, yes, so which complicates it.
So probate is Yeah, if you can minimize or avoid
it most of the time, that is the best because
otherwise it's just costs that you wouldn't your state would
not have had to pay.
Speaker 1 (20:17):
Right exactly exactly. Wow, So waiting the plane you exit,
how can that cost you?
Speaker 4 (20:27):
Well, what can happen is that if you don't have
a good plan in place and you're looking ahead, and
you're not looking ahead, well, then what can cost you
is you now have savings and you might look at
your overall savings and what you have saved and you
have enough. But okay, it might be in the wrong
(20:50):
positioning or not quite in the best positioning for yourself
when you go to take it out. So therefore, that's
why I mentioned the taxes. So one of the things
I share with people is, you know, I could have
two different couples that are retired that each have one
hundred thousand dollars a year in retirement income. One couple
(21:13):
has twenty thousand in tax, eighty thousand net, that's their
take home. I could have another couple that also has
one hundred thousand dollars of gross income and have zero
in tax, and they take home one hundred both of them.
If we're asked and they shared, willing to share, Say
(21:34):
I have one hundred thousand dollars of income, what's your
take home? That take home can swing drastically, and it
swings because it was not planned for their exit strategy
and during their retirement wasn't properly planned for.
Speaker 1 (21:52):
Wow, And when should you start planning?
Speaker 4 (21:56):
Well, really, you should start early, right when you're young.
You know you want to start early. You want to
start putting away. One of the one of the questions
we get a lot from younger folks is how much
should I put in wroth? Compared to traditional deductible roth.
You don't get to deduct it today, but as it grows,
(22:17):
it's tax deferred. When you take it out, it's all
tax free. We really like tax free. Tax free is around,
it's going to be around. Okay. The law and what
they've done in some of the laws they have stated
basically with the changes, we love tax free. Why because
they get the money today, because you're not saving it,
(22:39):
they get their tax money today. So early on it's important.
But then for retirement, you know, you want to have
savings pattern. But really once you get into typically people
into their early fifties later forties, then you really need
to start looking at projections. What's going on, how is
it going on on? You know, what are what's going
(23:01):
to be, what's the income stream is going to be?
You know those kinds of things, so that you're not
one year out, two years out.
Speaker 1 (23:09):
Okay, now what if you already there? How do we
correct mistakes?
Speaker 4 (23:17):
That's for the question. Yeah, so if you're already there
that that's okay. You still can make shifts changes and
so forth. Uh. You it's just a different way of
approaching it. But I wouldn't look at it as too late.
The other thing is that longevity, right, people are living longer.
I mean the average life expectancy. People are living longer.
(23:40):
So it's not something where someone retires and you know,
hopefully you know they only have two or three years.
So just because you're in retirement doesn't mean that it's
too late.
Speaker 1 (23:51):
Okay, good, good, because I know some people may be
listening to this and like I'm already retired. Well this
worked for me, you know what I'm saying. What can
I do? You know, how do I know at least
have somebody to look at what they're currently working with
and direct them to the best planned for them. Yes, yes, indeed, Wow,
(24:12):
this is amazing, Eric, I've learned a lot about you know,
even broke some myths for me in terms of the taxes,
because I always thought that and I think I've read
that somewhere, but you just dismantled it that when you
become a certain age, you automatically fall on a certain
(24:33):
tax bracket. But I can see that there's a lot
of variables attached to that.
Speaker 4 (24:40):
That's correct. Yeah, the brackets don't change whether you're working
or not. You know, if you're married filing jointly, the
brackets are the same, so that doesn't change for folks,
and therefore, as we're talking about with the different streams
of income and how they're tax that's where it really
(25:01):
comes in and really matters.
Speaker 1 (25:03):
Yes, yes, so yeah, so from running out to balance,
and you've explained that so eloquently, But let's just some
of the you know, in terms of being having wealth
strategy for the long haul.
Speaker 4 (25:19):
Yeah, if I would sum it up a couple things.
One is that if you're in planning, So if the
listeners are in the planning mode and there are a
few years off, you want to have a game plan
on a do you have enough have a goal? When
do you want to retire? Do you have enough assets?
And then the second piece of that is is it
in the right positioning you want to have that? Is
(25:42):
it in the right positioning? And then as they get
closer right, it's a continuation of is it in the
right positioning? Is there anything we can do? Obviously there
will be changes in the future. We've had tax law
changes over the last few years, so that'll continue to
adapt and change. And then as you get into retirement,
(26:02):
then it's a matter of where does it come from
and what's the most efficient and those kinds of things.
Speaker 1 (26:08):
Okay, Now with all of the changes that have happened
to medicare, are you.
Speaker 2 (26:16):
Do you keep.
Speaker 1 (26:19):
What I'm looking forward? Do you keep up on that
as well?
Speaker 4 (26:23):
Yeah? We do. We we we certainly help people with medicare.
We don't sell medicare, We don't sell Medicare supplements, but
we do have partners that we work with that specialize
in that that has gotten to a point with the
supplements that it needs a specialist because they need to
keep up with what's changing and so forth. But what
we do provide is we provide that again, we're we're
(26:48):
you know, we're we're there for them. We're there for
the client that they can when they're in the selection mode,
they can help, you know, we can help them through it.
What are the decisions you need to think about based
on your situation, So we help them with that and
get it, get things set up. Uh. The other thing
about medicare is people have to be careful of a
(27:11):
thing called irma. Irma is when you make more money,
there are thresholds that once you reach a threshold and
income in retirement, you will pay more on your Medicare,
So you pay more than what your stated rates are
and so I can tell you that folks don't like
(27:32):
paying irma uh, and so that that can sneak in
on you. The other thing that is really important nowadays
is social security and social security timing. So I always
say it's not Grandma's social security anymore, meaning it's not
nine hundred dollars a month typically if people have been working,
(27:55):
if they're both are working, if they're married and have
a spouse and they're both working, it can be substantial, substantial,
and so it is a huge decision. And it's really
a pension. So even though pensions have gone away for most,
almost all people have social security. Well, guess what, you
have a pension? Yes, so deciding when to take it again,
(28:19):
if you have a spouse, when they should take and
you take. Coordinating all of that benefit. We find people
find it helpful. And again it matters on these income streams, yes.
Speaker 1 (28:31):
Because all of this stuff is so confusing. Even the
application is confusing, so the whole I don't know why
they make it like that, but they do. But yeah,
it's just what you know. So having somebody that can
(28:55):
help you through your finances, it's probably the most the
smartest thing anywhere can do. Because most people don't understand
the language, and I know, unless you're in the text industry,
you definitely don't understand that that's correct.
Speaker 4 (29:17):
And I think there's two things to think about with that.
The tax You know, there's preparation, which is taking the
numbers that are reported right and put them in in
the proper place on your tax forms, what tax forms
you need to file and all of that. Okay. Then
there's planning. So unfortunately a lot of prepare CPA's tax professionals.
(29:39):
You know, they can do the preparation side, and they
understand that what forms changed and so forth. What they
what what really comes in and people are missing is
the planning piece.
Speaker 1 (29:53):
Yes, and and the people that work in your office
are they like texts uh, attorneys what what? What are they?
Speaker 4 (30:05):
Yeah? So we have you know, we have advisors, wealth
advisors and they have professional designations in the industry. And
then we also on the tax side, have enrolled agents.
We have CPAs, and we even engage in a CPA
firm uh that we work with very closely when we
have high net worth, high income on on multiple strategies.
(30:29):
That's all they do. So there we consider them on
our team all they do is mitigation tax strategies, and
so we work with them closely to come up with
a tax plan, uh for that particular individual. And typically
that's not a one time a year, right or once
(30:49):
in a lifetime, it's every year. Let's let's work through
a tax plan and make sure that you know you're
not paying more than your fair share.
Speaker 2 (30:58):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (30:59):
Yeah, so you have a whole, like you said, a
team of experts.
Speaker 4 (31:04):
We do, and we lined up a team and we
have a team in you know, supporting us. And that's
really the family Office, the CFO. Uh, how we go
about it. We're here to make sure that everything gets coordinated.
Speaker 1 (31:18):
Yes, and that's perfect. So again, how do clients connect
with you and get that book?
Speaker 4 (31:28):
Yeah, they get the book by going to Hilltop Wealth
Tax dot com slash podcast. That's Hilltop Wealth Tax dot
com slash podcast. They can grab a free copy of
the book. They can also grab a fifteen minute consultation
with one of our one of our team members. They'll
get they'll find out more about you, you find out
(31:49):
more about the firm and see if it even makes
sense to have a conversation. And we would be glad
to talk to somebody if they've got additional questions.
Speaker 1 (31:58):
Yes, so, Eric, I mean you have really drop some
gems today, and I know my audience is really really
happy about this because this is important stuff. This is
your money, This is what you work for all of
your life, and you want to really when you're at
(32:18):
that place, well before you get to that place, you
want to make sure when it's time for you to retire.
Speaker 4 (32:27):
It's right. Yeah, I think you summed it up. It's
very important. I mean typically we see next to your health,
someone's health money. You know, whether they need a lot
or they don't need as much. It is important because
you're you were as Americans are more responsible for ourselves
(32:47):
now than ever. Yes, and so we have to we
have to go through and sift through all of this
information and make sure that it fits for your particular situation.
Speaker 1 (32:58):
Absolutely, I definitely appreciate you, Eric taking time out to
share all this good stuff with us. And we have
definitely have to do this again because I believe that
people need to hear stuff more than one time, So
we should definitely plan on another collaboration and audience, we
(33:21):
want to thank you as well for tuning in. So Eric,
thank you so much.
Speaker 4 (33:27):
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (33:28):
Absolutely, thank you to our guests and you our values audience.
Let's stop you by. We truly appreciate you. Many blessings
to you and yours
Welcome to Just Minded My Business Media, LLC, where you
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Speaker 1 (01:26):
Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, I appreciate you being here and let
me just ask you this question. What if retirement isn't
the finish line, it's the riskiest part of the journey.
Today I have Eric Brenner, who is a thirty year
financial veteran who's held thousands of clients navigate second half
(01:52):
of wealth how to safely come down a financial mountain
as CEO of Hilltop Wealth and so and Tech Solutions.
I'm sorry. Eric serves as personal CFO for Successful Individuals,
integrating investment, text and legacy planning planning under one root.
(02:16):
Today he is here to talk about why your parents'
retirement won't work for you and what to do instead.
I am so happy to have you.
Speaker 4 (02:26):
Yeah, well, I'm glad to be here. Ida.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
Let's just get right into the nitty gritty. Why is
climbing the mountain is easy? Descending it is the real risk?
Why is that a risk?
Speaker 4 (02:38):
Well, when you think about the last let's call it
thirty years and you know retirement, So someone working in
their working career saving investing, you know, probably the generation
like my grandparents' generation. A lot of those had pensions,
they had full health benefits and they knew that as
long as they were they became vested. They could retire
(03:04):
have full pension, full health benefits, even if they were
sixty years old. And so when they retired, they made
some decisions, but they took their pension, their health care
was covered and maybe they had a little savings and
they were fine. Well, that has changed obviously, pensions have
gone away. Very few people have pensions. Very few people
(03:24):
carry health insurance into retirement. Once they leave what they're doing,
the health benefits are over. And when they get into retirement,
what happens is that journey we call it down the
mountain can be treacherous because now they have to choose
from when do they take their social security? Where do
they take, what investments? When, what order do they take?
(03:48):
How is it taxed? And so I often tell people,
you know, you could have four or five different income sources,
all of them are taxed differently, and so coordinating that,
you know, can be a real challenge. And they're not
one time decisions. Where again grandparents' generation, it was a
(04:08):
one time decision. They chose their pension and that was it.
Now they need to coordinate this on a year to
year and during the year basis.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
Wow, and that's a bit much for most.
Speaker 4 (04:24):
It is a bit much. Yeah, And you know, even
though we do this, this is all we do. We
do it day in and day out. It's hard for
us to keep up. There's been many, many major legislative
and law changes just over the last few years, and
so you have to keep up with it. And if
you have a career on your own, I would say
(04:44):
it's near impossible to keep up with all those changes.
Speaker 1 (04:47):
Oh, you are so right, because things especially now. So Eric,
what is climbing the mountain? Talk about climbing the mountain
is easy, but the sending the real risks. What does
that mean?
Speaker 4 (05:02):
Yeah, I would say, you know, it might not be
easy climbing them mountain. You have to be committed to
savings and so forth. But if you think about your
grandparents' generation, my grandparents' generation, you know, they worked obviously,
they had their career. Many of those folks had pensions,
and they knew that if they worked for a company
(05:23):
for so many years, they're vested. When they retired, they
had full health benefits didn't matter when you retired, as
long as you were fully vested. You chose your pension option,
you had your health insurance, and a way you go
into retirement. Nowadays, that's not the case. Many do not
have pension or most do not have pensions, and so
they have to save for themselves. They save in a
(05:44):
retirement plan, they get a match along the way, so
the companies give them a match. They get into retirement,
and there is no health benefits for almost all that
carry forward. So they have to make those decisions, especially
if they're before Medicare age and then coming down the
mountain now, which means you know, retirement, and then during
(06:04):
retirement they could have several different income streams four or
five that are taxed differently. You have some that are
fully taxed, maybe some that are partially taxed, maybe some
that are tax free. And that's a navigation that's a
year to year basis, because chances are many people that
(06:25):
are listening to the podcast, their biggest expense in retirement
will not be healthcare. It will be tax m.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
And that's not what most people think.
Speaker 4 (06:40):
That's what most people think. You know, as we see
it and work with a lot of people in retirement,
you know, Medicare, along with good supplements, has really really
good coverage. UH. People pay very little out of pocket
UH and tax is a bigger bigger issue, and it
will become bigger over the next decade, two decades, three
(07:01):
decades because people have assets now, they have assets that
were saved in plans that have yet to be taxed.
Speaker 1 (07:11):
Oh yeah, yeah, because this seems like and one of
the things that I always thought, and you can correct
me that when you get a retirement age like seventy
what is it, whatever your retirement age, your full one
K will be text in a different text back bracket.
(07:31):
Is that true?
Speaker 4 (07:33):
So maybe what you're talking about is when you have
to take out from your qualified assets or iras four
oh one KSE So that age has changed over some
tax legislation that's happened over the last few years. And
so somebody that is born after nineteen sixty, that required
age is seventy five. Now somebody prior to that then
(07:57):
it would be sooner seventy three, and many people are
drawing it now. Those when you have to take that
money out, whether you need it or not, it is
not at a different tax rate. It comes in to
your taxable situation just like other income that as of
ordinary income, and that can push people to other tax
(08:21):
brackets that they're not aware of.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
Oh okay, Okay, okay, all right, So you just explained
the text situation being the biggest threat in retirement and wow,
that's definitely huge to say the least, because a lot
of people don't think that way. So how does the
(08:46):
family office model become accessible to us?
Speaker 4 (08:54):
Yeah, So the family office and you know strategy and
model has been a for a long time for the
ultra wealthy. So the ultra wealthy many many years ago
saw the need that they need to have, you know,
a team working with them that's really looking at all
aspects financial and that includes taxes. And so what we
(09:18):
saw is that that type of model we felt was
needed for more middle income America because of the complexities
that has happened and continues to happen. And so we
call it being a chief financial officer for a client
or a CFO. You know, we want to be a
CFO for our client, so that from the simple questions
(09:42):
on buying releasing a car to the big questions of retirement,
we want to have. We want to be a resource
that's an independent. We don't get paid commissions and we
can talk about our structure, but someone that's on their
side and making all of the decisions and then we
saw the need need to wrap in the tax and
tax advice. Many advisors say they do tax planning, but
(10:06):
they really are not allowed to be able to dive deep.
We have a whole tax division. We don't hide behind taxes.
Taxes is real and we take it seriously. As I said,
it could be the most expensive or the most cost
in someone's retirement, and so we want to help people
through that from a tax perspective, from tax planning to
(10:29):
even tax mitigation. So that's how we bring the family
office into how we work with folks, and we say, look,
we want to be your chief financial officer and guide
you along your financial journey.
Speaker 1 (10:43):
Yeah, and that's important because as you age, and not
only that, if that's not your mind, you don't have a.
Speaker 4 (10:51):
Clue that's correct. And like I said, there's been some
major legislation just in the last few years and we
have hard time, full time in it doing it to
keep up. And so somebody that you know is in
a career or even retired, it takes a lot to
kind of understand it and make sure that you're doing
(11:14):
what's best for yourself.
Speaker 1 (11:16):
Okay, So I mean I get we all living in
the world today, and we see all the different legislature
and all that kind of stuff that's happening. So I'm
sure you guys, your tax department and all your people
are constantly involved with the different changes. So can you
kind of bring us to right now what changes you've
(11:38):
seen thus far?
Speaker 4 (11:41):
So I'll take us back to twenty twenty. Twenty twenty,
there was a large piece of retirement legislation called the
Secure Act that came out. The Secure Act was the
biggest piece of retirement legislation in more than a decade,
and it changed the way that or ira money, your
(12:01):
retirement money, when do you take it out? It changed
the way that you need to think about it. It
changed the way that your beneficiaries will receive the money.
So often what we do is it may not be
in this year from a tax impact, but it could
be in three, four, five, six years. That's the projection.
(12:23):
So we had the Secure Act. Then in twenty twenty three,
Secure Act two point zero came out. Even though there
were some of the laws that we still weren't clear
on from twenty twenty now we have two point zero
in twenty twenty three, that in addition added complexity and
(12:44):
the importance that we feel in planning, and then come
this year. Of course the tax laws that were just signed,
so those are more relevant as far as tax brackets, right,
itemized deductions, things of this nature that will affect people
or may affect people. So when you kind of combine
(13:05):
all that it's here and now twenty twenty five, how
does it affect you? And then also going forward, how
does it affect you? All those things combined is what's important.
Speaker 1 (13:17):
Yes, yeah, So if clients want to work with you,
how did they connect with you?
Speaker 4 (13:22):
Yeah? So obviously our website is the best place. I
actually wrote a book. It's called The Personal CFO Guide
to Your Financial Journey, talking about and navigating these things,
and they can go to Hilltop Wealth Tax dot com
slash podcast. That's Hilltop Wealth Tax dot com slash podcast
and they can get a free copy of the book
(13:45):
if they have an interest. We set up fifteen minute
introductory calls. Allows us to find out a bit more
about the client. We find out, you find out about
the firm and really see if there may be a possibility,
and if there is, we can match them up with
a wealth advisor. But the book's a great thing. I
think and I have been told that it really helps
people think about it, not just this year, it helps
(14:08):
them think about their transition and guiding down this mountain.
Do you realize that, I think this is an interesting
statistic that eighty percent plus of all mountain climbing fatalities
happen on the way down. Wow, they don't happen on
the way up. Well, why is that? Maybe they don't
(14:30):
have a good guide, Maybe they slip on a rock, right,
maybe they run in, they don't take the right path down.
So we think about it. In what we do is
we help people guide where your guide down the mountain
and making sure that you know you are making the
right decisions in retirement. You know what you're making and
(14:51):
gross incomes one thing. What you're actually putting in your
pocket net is a whole different. Yes.
Speaker 1 (15:00):
Yes, And that's started from the very first job exactly,
so we know we don't get it all. Wow, I am.
So I'm excited about the book that might that we
can get for free because that's really important. And not
only that, like you said, it gets people thinking.
Speaker 4 (15:24):
And that's correct, you think.
Speaker 1 (15:27):
Wow. So let's talk a little bit about the costly
blonde spots of hogh income earnest and how to avoid them.
Speaker 4 (15:37):
So a couple of things I think about. One is
when they're saving and their higher income earners, are they
saving in the right places. So an example, simple example
is putting into a retirement plan through workplace that you're
able to deduct today, so it feels good because you're
in a higher tax bracket, and twenty five years ago
(15:58):
we would talk about you're going to be in a
lower tax bracket in retirement, and that may not be
the case. So saving in a pre tax you're saving
it today. Well, if you're saving it today, that means
you're deferring it. That means that at some point tax
is going to be due. And we don't know what
(16:19):
the tax brackets are going to be twenty years from now.
I mean, no one knows. What I know is we
are in a forty plus year low as it relates
to the tax brackets, and so most people think they're
probably going to go up at some point. So where
do you save it? It's not just put it somewhere.
How do you save it? Then another kind of roadblock,
(16:42):
and that a lot of people don't realize, is there
is differences in the planning, particularly tax. There's tax deferral,
which is deferring the tax ode till some point in
the future. There's tax mitigation. Tax mitigation means you eliminate
the tax in the year you're in and you don't
(17:04):
owe it back at all. So there are strategies that
have been utilized by the ultra wealthy within the family
office environment for decades and there's multiple strategies that can
mitigate tax and so that means bring down what you
(17:24):
owe this year. So we do a lot of planning,
tax strategy and mitigation and how does that all work
into the overall financial plan and what we're able to
do Since we're an independent fiduciary firm and we have
the tax business as well that's integrated, we're able to
(17:48):
take that from step one all the way through and
then help people every year along the way.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
Wow, that's amazing. I like that. Now, let me ask you,
do you do anything with trust?
Speaker 4 (18:04):
We do. So we do a state planning for clients.
You know, will help clients a just kind of bug
them to do an estate plan. You know, we see
a lot of people that come to us new and
even our current clients. Some of them you got to
get in a state plan. We see a lot of
clients that come to us initially and they don't have
an estate plan at all, so we'll do We'll help
(18:25):
them with that, and then we have the capability through
some of our partners in making sure that all those
document documents get done. You know, do you need a
trust or not? You know what happens with your estate
right also title, So getting the documents done and you're
a state plan done, that's a step that does not
(18:46):
mean you're done. You want to make sure things are
titled properly, your assets are titled properly to make sure
that they're passing the most efficient and that's really what
that's about. Estate planning is about making sure that you're
taken care of. Also, if you're incapacitated, it doesn't necessarily
mean you have to pass away, but if you cannot
(19:09):
take care of your finances or your health, making sure
you have somebody that will designate to do that. But
then once you pass away, do you have two choices
where it goes? You can leave it to the ones
you love, the charities you care about, or you can
leave it to the I R. S.
Speaker 1 (19:26):
Nobody wants to do that.
Speaker 4 (19:27):
Nobody wants to do that. I've never seen in thirty
two years of doing this, I've never seen the I
R S as a beneficiary. No, So we you know,
we help people also in that aspect to make sure
that it gets passed along, you know, properly.
Speaker 1 (19:44):
Yeah, because that's a big thing, especially in the retirement age,
because most retirees have homes, you know, and that probate
thing is a bear.
Speaker 4 (19:57):
It's a bear, and a lot of people will have
two homes in different states, yes, so which complicates it.
So probate is Yeah, if you can minimize or avoid
it most of the time, that is the best because
otherwise it's just costs that you wouldn't your state would
not have had to pay.
Speaker 1 (20:17):
Right exactly exactly. Wow, So waiting the plane you exit,
how can that cost you?
Speaker 4 (20:27):
Well, what can happen is that if you don't have
a good plan in place and you're looking ahead, and
you're not looking ahead, well, then what can cost you
is you now have savings and you might look at
your overall savings and what you have saved and you
have enough. But okay, it might be in the wrong
(20:50):
positioning or not quite in the best positioning for yourself
when you go to take it out. So therefore, that's
why I mentioned the taxes. So one of the things
I share with people is, you know, I could have
two different couples that are retired that each have one
hundred thousand dollars a year in retirement income. One couple
(21:13):
has twenty thousand in tax, eighty thousand net, that's their
take home. I could have another couple that also has
one hundred thousand dollars of gross income and have zero
in tax, and they take home one hundred both of them.
If we're asked and they shared, willing to share, Say
(21:34):
I have one hundred thousand dollars of income, what's your
take home? That take home can swing drastically, and it
swings because it was not planned for their exit strategy
and during their retirement wasn't properly planned for.
Speaker 1 (21:52):
Wow, And when should you start planning?
Speaker 4 (21:56):
Well, really, you should start early, right when you're young.
You know you want to start early. You want to
start putting away. One of the one of the questions
we get a lot from younger folks is how much
should I put in wroth? Compared to traditional deductible roth.
You don't get to deduct it today, but as it grows,
(22:17):
it's tax deferred. When you take it out, it's all
tax free. We really like tax free. Tax free is around,
it's going to be around. Okay. The law and what
they've done in some of the laws they have stated
basically with the changes, we love tax free. Why because
they get the money today, because you're not saving it,
(22:39):
they get their tax money today. So early on it's important.
But then for retirement, you know, you want to have
savings pattern. But really once you get into typically people
into their early fifties later forties, then you really need
to start looking at projections. What's going on, how is
it going on on? You know, what are what's going
(23:01):
to be, what's the income stream is going to be?
You know those kinds of things, so that you're not
one year out, two years out.
Speaker 1 (23:09):
Okay, now what if you already there? How do we
correct mistakes?
Speaker 4 (23:17):
That's for the question. Yeah, so if you're already there
that that's okay. You still can make shifts changes and
so forth. Uh. You it's just a different way of
approaching it. But I wouldn't look at it as too late.
The other thing is that longevity, right, people are living longer.
I mean the average life expectancy. People are living longer.
(23:40):
So it's not something where someone retires and you know,
hopefully you know they only have two or three years.
So just because you're in retirement doesn't mean that it's
too late.
Speaker 1 (23:51):
Okay, good, good, because I know some people may be
listening to this and like I'm already retired. Well this
worked for me, you know what I'm saying. What can
I do? You know, how do I know at least
have somebody to look at what they're currently working with
and direct them to the best planned for them. Yes, yes, indeed, Wow,
(24:12):
this is amazing, Eric, I've learned a lot about you know,
even broke some myths for me in terms of the taxes,
because I always thought that and I think I've read
that somewhere, but you just dismantled it that when you
become a certain age, you automatically fall on a certain
(24:33):
tax bracket. But I can see that there's a lot
of variables attached to that.
Speaker 4 (24:40):
That's correct. Yeah, the brackets don't change whether you're working
or not. You know, if you're married filing jointly, the
brackets are the same, so that doesn't change for folks,
and therefore, as we're talking about with the different streams
of income and how they're tax that's where it really
(25:01):
comes in and really matters.
Speaker 1 (25:03):
Yes, yes, so yeah, so from running out to balance,
and you've explained that so eloquently, But let's just some
of the you know, in terms of being having wealth
strategy for the long haul.
Speaker 4 (25:19):
Yeah, if I would sum it up a couple things.
One is that if you're in planning, So if the
listeners are in the planning mode and there are a
few years off, you want to have a game plan
on a do you have enough have a goal? When
do you want to retire? Do you have enough assets?
And then the second piece of that is is it
in the right positioning you want to have that? Is
(25:42):
it in the right positioning? And then as they get
closer right, it's a continuation of is it in the
right positioning? Is there anything we can do? Obviously there
will be changes in the future. We've had tax law
changes over the last few years, so that'll continue to
adapt and change. And then as you get into retirement,
(26:02):
then it's a matter of where does it come from
and what's the most efficient and those kinds of things.
Speaker 1 (26:08):
Okay, Now with all of the changes that have happened
to medicare, are you.
Speaker 2 (26:16):
Do you keep.
Speaker 1 (26:19):
What I'm looking forward? Do you keep up on that
as well?
Speaker 4 (26:23):
Yeah? We do. We we we certainly help people with medicare.
We don't sell medicare, We don't sell Medicare supplements, but
we do have partners that we work with that specialize
in that that has gotten to a point with the
supplements that it needs a specialist because they need to
keep up with what's changing and so forth. But what
we do provide is we provide that again, we're we're
(26:48):
you know, we're we're there for them. We're there for
the client that they can when they're in the selection mode,
they can help, you know, we can help them through it.
What are the decisions you need to think about based
on your situation, So we help them with that and
get it, get things set up. Uh. The other thing
about medicare is people have to be careful of a
(27:11):
thing called irma. Irma is when you make more money,
there are thresholds that once you reach a threshold and
income in retirement, you will pay more on your Medicare,
So you pay more than what your stated rates are
and so I can tell you that folks don't like
(27:32):
paying irma uh, and so that that can sneak in
on you. The other thing that is really important nowadays
is social security and social security timing. So I always
say it's not Grandma's social security anymore, meaning it's not
nine hundred dollars a month typically if people have been working,
(27:55):
if they're both are working, if they're married and have
a spouse and they're both working, it can be substantial, substantial,
and so it is a huge decision. And it's really
a pension. So even though pensions have gone away for most,
almost all people have social security. Well, guess what, you
have a pension? Yes, so deciding when to take it again,
(28:19):
if you have a spouse, when they should take and
you take. Coordinating all of that benefit. We find people
find it helpful. And again it matters on these income streams, yes.
Speaker 1 (28:31):
Because all of this stuff is so confusing. Even the
application is confusing, so the whole I don't know why
they make it like that, but they do. But yeah,
it's just what you know. So having somebody that can
(28:55):
help you through your finances, it's probably the most the
smartest thing anywhere can do. Because most people don't understand
the language, and I know, unless you're in the text industry,
you definitely don't understand that that's correct.
Speaker 4 (29:17):
And I think there's two things to think about with that.
The tax You know, there's preparation, which is taking the
numbers that are reported right and put them in in
the proper place on your tax forms, what tax forms
you need to file and all of that. Okay. Then
there's planning. So unfortunately a lot of prepare CPA's tax professionals.
(29:39):
You know, they can do the preparation side, and they
understand that what forms changed and so forth. What they
what what really comes in and people are missing is
the planning piece.
Speaker 1 (29:53):
Yes, and and the people that work in your office
are they like texts uh, attorneys what what? What are they?
Speaker 4 (30:05):
Yeah? So we have you know, we have advisors, wealth
advisors and they have professional designations in the industry. And
then we also on the tax side, have enrolled agents.
We have CPAs, and we even engage in a CPA
firm uh that we work with very closely when we
have high net worth, high income on on multiple strategies.
(30:29):
That's all they do. So there we consider them on
our team all they do is mitigation tax strategies, and
so we work with them closely to come up with
a tax plan, uh for that particular individual. And typically
that's not a one time a year, right or once
(30:49):
in a lifetime, it's every year. Let's let's work through
a tax plan and make sure that you know you're
not paying more than your fair share.
Speaker 2 (30:58):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (30:59):
Yeah, so you have a whole, like you said, a
team of experts.
Speaker 4 (31:04):
We do, and we lined up a team and we
have a team in you know, supporting us. And that's
really the family Office, the CFO. Uh, how we go
about it. We're here to make sure that everything gets coordinated.
Speaker 1 (31:18):
Yes, and that's perfect. So again, how do clients connect
with you and get that book?
Speaker 4 (31:28):
Yeah, they get the book by going to Hilltop Wealth
Tax dot com slash podcast. That's Hilltop Wealth Tax dot
com slash podcast. They can grab a free copy of
the book. They can also grab a fifteen minute consultation
with one of our one of our team members. They'll
get they'll find out more about you, you find out
(31:49):
more about the firm and see if it even makes
sense to have a conversation. And we would be glad
to talk to somebody if they've got additional questions.
Speaker 1 (31:58):
Yes, so, Eric, I mean you have really drop some
gems today, and I know my audience is really really
happy about this because this is important stuff. This is
your money, This is what you work for all of
your life, and you want to really when you're at
(32:18):
that place, well before you get to that place, you
want to make sure when it's time for you to retire.
Speaker 4 (32:27):
It's right. Yeah, I think you summed it up. It's
very important. I mean typically we see next to your health,
someone's health money. You know, whether they need a lot
or they don't need as much. It is important because
you're you were as Americans are more responsible for ourselves
(32:47):
now than ever. Yes, and so we have to we
have to go through and sift through all of this
information and make sure that it fits for your particular situation.
Speaker 1 (32:58):
Absolutely, I definitely appreciate you, Eric taking time out to
share all this good stuff with us. And we have
definitely have to do this again because I believe that
people need to hear stuff more than one time, So
we should definitely plan on another collaboration and audience, we
(33:21):
want to thank you as well for tuning in. So Eric,
thank you so much.
Speaker 4 (33:27):
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (33:28):
Absolutely, thank you to our guests and you our values audience.
Let's stop you by. We truly appreciate you. Many blessings
to you and yours
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