06-07-25 Juxtaposition Lost Civilixations and American Mysteries

Explore the fascinating intersections between ancient native earthworks and mysterious artifacts that hint at pre-Columbian ingenuity or mythic contact. In this episode, we dive into:

• Mound Builder marvels: From Cahokia’s immense earthen pyramids to the enigmatic Serpent Mound
• The Lost Colony of Roanoke & More 

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:03):
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Speaker 2 (00:12):
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The following program contains course language and adult themes, listener
and Discretions.

Speaker 11 (02:57):
Site govern and Shadows, secretstie conspiracies, and full.

Speaker 2 (03:05):
Loose, strange encounters.

Speaker 12 (03:08):
Explain to this out that really shame men mynther choices
ball unleveling history stories untold.

Speaker 13 (03:21):
It is fifty one, a whisper name, beautiful sightings, haunting flame.

Speaker 2 (03:34):
Love, miss monster, a watering myss. I'm also watch injurious
Kiff Strange encounters said.

Speaker 12 (03:46):
Explain to this out that really shame men with knowledge,
voices fall, lovely mystery stories untold.

Speaker 2 (03:59):
See takes out believes for sitting you so well.

Speaker 12 (04:09):
S's continuous son, say Jim Chaunton Sun. Explain to this
South that braly Shae, the windows losses all mystery story
son soul.

Speaker 2 (04:27):
Truth, this outh.

Speaker 14 (04:30):
Truth, This.

Speaker 1 (04:47):
Good evening, America, And welcome to Juxtaposition our every two
week four into the weird, the unusual, the unexplainable. I
am one half of the crew, mister Rick Robinson, he's
the other half, mister this j. Packard, our front for
for Forensics. Screw has the night off. Hopefully they'll be
back next week. But we're here and we're gonna be
talking about some We're talking about an amazing subject. How

(05:10):
you doing a much? How you doing?

Speaker 7 (05:13):
You know what I'm doing?

Speaker 15 (05:15):
Good?

Speaker 7 (05:16):
It's Riot season already but I'm doing great out here
in sunny California where it's fucking hot. How about you,
what's going on in your world?

Speaker 1 (05:25):
Oh, it's been a day. Like I thought I was
gonna have a day to get caught up on all
the work and do all the things that I need
to do behind the scenes. And then everybody started reaching
out about you know, deaths and families and things, and
I'm just like, ugh, so yeah, it's I don't know
what it is, dude. One thing I hate about reaching
this age, it's like every other day I'm talking to
somebody who's lost someone in their family and I'm like,

(05:47):
I don't like this. I want to go back to
being a twenty something when no one I knew was dying.

Speaker 7 (05:54):
Yeah, there's a point in your life, and I'm right
at the uh, I'm right at the where there's you know,
the scales are balanced where you know more dead people
than you know people who are alive, and right now
I'm right at that it's probably a pretty equal number.

Speaker 1 (06:13):
I'm much just over here rocking like this.

Speaker 7 (06:15):
I see dead people just kidding. Yeah, I don't care.

Speaker 1 (06:26):
Sorry that that's that's my dark sense of humor coming
out if I don't find ways to laugh about it,
it is gonna be like muddling over there, rocking in
a corner, because I'm like, Jesus, you know what, you know, what's.

Speaker 7 (06:36):
Weird I've been I've noted in the many years that
I've been on X Twitter, and you know it. Until
Twitter starts respecting me, I'm just gonna call it Twitter,
which is never gonna happen, so it will always be Twitter.
The cycle of loss on Twitter is pretty amazing, where

(06:56):
it's like every us start to notice that it's I mean,
I just don't know if it's because it's heightened and
you know, with you know, but it seems like more
people lose family and pets, like in group in clusters.
It's really something we should investigate for the show.

Speaker 16 (07:13):
We probably shouldn't, you know.

Speaker 7 (07:15):
It just seems like there's always death clusters. It's like
this week, I know about five or six people on
X who have lost pets, a couple of people who Yeah,
it's just yeah, it's weird.

Speaker 1 (07:28):
Speaking of speaking of losing things, our entire topic tonight
is ancient loss civilizations.

Speaker 7 (07:33):
Basically, Yeah, it's kind of weird how that worked out.
What's really funny is that we were kind of bullied
by AI into doing the show. Yeah, I just I
just gave an example for a topic that we were
talking about doing, and it inundated me with enough to
do an entire show on just American ancient civilizations.

Speaker 1 (07:56):
Yeah. And it's funny because I started looking because you
basically we were talking about like ancient mystery. So I
started going in one direction, you started going on the other,
and You're like, I didn't even mean Nicholas one. I
told you GTP about what and it gave me like
twenty five Yeah.

Speaker 7 (08:10):
Yeah, we were going global. So we're gonna do a
global one next time. But we are very amerocentric on
this one as well.

Speaker 1 (08:17):
We should be right now. We are trying to make
America grade again after all. So yes, we're just doing
We're just doing our America.

Speaker 7 (08:25):
You know, everybody says America has no culture, Well we do.
And you know, well, you know a lot of this,
like a couple of these I had never even heard of,
And this is you know kind of like, yeah, I
get it. I was in school in the eighties, so
you know it was more of a regional you know,
we were more taught regional history. But yeah, we would
get the big broad strokes about American history and stuff

(08:46):
like that, but a lot of these I had never
heard of. So it's either Mandela effect or just like
I said, read more of regional things until.

Speaker 1 (08:56):
You know, wait, you mean wait, you mean I get
to say this and raised the power of and amish one.

Speaker 7 (09:01):
Yes, yeah, definitely, yes, it's both. No, I mean I
was just amazed with the depth of the topics that
came out. Like I said, I had heard of a
couple of these, and you know, we've done a Sean
Roanoke in the past too, so you know that that
was that that was well trodden ground. But you know,
Kahokia and a couple of the others I had never

(09:22):
ever heard of. And I was just absolutely fascinated researching
for the show today. And I know if you live
in like, you know, the Saint Louis area, you're like, yeah,
well fuck obviously, but you.

Speaker 16 (09:32):
Know, well, so.

Speaker 1 (09:36):
One of the one of the weirdest ones for me,
and I always mispronounced this is Cookia I think pronounced.

Speaker 7 (09:42):
Yeah the way yeah Coahokia.

Speaker 1 (09:43):
I can't really can't really picture that, like you know,
rocking out like flat Saint Louis. I'm just like, that
doesn't that that doesn't track.

Speaker 7 (09:52):
Especially when you know, I mean, okay, so we might
as well get started on it is that around ten fifty,
during the peak of its civilization, there was a pre
Columbian city that with about twenty to fifty thousand inhabitants
outside of Saint Louis and southern Illinois. And this is

(10:14):
one hundred foot mound pyramid mound, you kind of like
more of what you would see in meso America. And
it's actually the largest prehistoric earthwork in the Americas.

Speaker 1 (10:27):
Yeah, isn't it called Monk's Mound? Different memory serves.

Speaker 7 (10:30):
Yeah, Monks Mount in the center of the in the
center of the city. It's Murphey tall and sprawls over
fourteen acres.

Speaker 1 (10:36):
Well, before we get too far into that, I think
there's another point we need to touch on, because could
we just talk about it being like fifteen to twenty
thousand people like it was nothing? This is like, this
is like ten fifty This would have this would have
rivaled medieval or medieval London or Parish at the time.

Speaker 7 (10:51):
Yeah, it just most European cities didn't have that population,
which think about that.

Speaker 1 (10:58):
Well, think about that from another perspective. By the time
we get By the time we get here, we meaning
Columbus and all the folks that came after, we're largely
looking at nomadic tribal civilizations that move back and forth.
So in some ways, it's almost like they were moving
in a less technologically advanced but parallel destination as we
are right now. But something started driving them to being nomads. Again.

(11:22):
That's something else that I want to start looking into,
because I'm like, what the heck happened between like ten
fifty and fourteen ninety two.

Speaker 7 (11:29):
Well, the other thing to consider in this, too, is
that America does not have domesticatable animals. They don't have oxen,
they don't have horses. This was all done by hand. Ah,
this is true to stand of buffalo. You're for a
bad time, bro.

Speaker 1 (11:50):
Every time anybody says buffalo, I'm reminded of my middle son.
Every time we saw them at the zoo from up
until about age six, when he finally learned how to
say it right, he would call them butlos. It's I
want to go see the buttons, Okay, so we will
take you to go see the buffalo. I even started
trying to I even tried to teach started trying to

(12:10):
teach him the word from Dances with Wolves. Can you
say tatanka better than you can say Buffalo? I'm just
curious because Butler is not really good in the crowd.

Speaker 7 (12:18):
Yeah. Yeah, you're you're embarrassing me, son g the foghord
leg word that you are. You're you're an embarrassment.

Speaker 1 (12:27):
Son Uh, I say, I say an embarrassment.

Speaker 7 (12:33):
Well, and you know, to go with the size of
the city too. They also had Woodhenge, which was a
massive circular arrangement of wooden posts meticulously aligned to astronomical
events solstices and equinoxes, just like Stonehenge.

Speaker 1 (12:49):
So yeah, so so keep that in mind for for
for wood Hinge. I mean these people were like apparently
tracking stars like like rocks. I mean, I don't want
to say rockstar, so I guess masters, so without without
apparently the any type of writing or some big empire
like you know, the one, you know, meso America. So

(13:09):
how exactly did they build all this amish?

Speaker 4 (13:13):
How?

Speaker 1 (13:15):
How?

Speaker 7 (13:18):
And it was just the rapid rise of the urban
center too, because this went from the earliest evidence of
it can be of them being there, Like I said,
it was around ten to fifty current era, and then
in two hundred and fifty years ghost town absolutely gone.
Everybody just left.

Speaker 1 (13:40):
Where'd you go? Can't we all just get along anyway? Uh? Yeah,
I just I don't know. So so there's so many
other like logistical things that just make no sense, because
even scholars have been scratching their head about all this
stuff for a long time. So it's not just how
did they build it? But how did they feed everyone?

(14:05):
How did they manage to pull off a civilization large
enough to rival you know, Europe at the time, and
then like you said, by around thirteen hundred is gone, Yeah,
was it? Yeah?

Speaker 7 (14:19):
I mean it's yeah, it's right in the middle of
the bread basket of America, So I mean, yeah, feeding
themselves and well, the large part of the Native American
population is known to be somewhat nomadic or at least
you know, semi nomadic, where they would move around within
the same you know area. Agriculture wasn't foreign to them,

(14:44):
But on this scale at this time is actually pretty inspiring.
I mean, this is this is a level. Again, to
have a city like London, you had to have the
entire realm of the British Isles, providing you with food.

(15:06):
And so I mean, when you try to think of
Native Americans, you mean, okay, sure this was probably this
would obviously have been a huge trade center in the
region too, and obviously they had agriculture. It's just, you know,
it's not something that you put into your head with
Native American culture.

Speaker 1 (15:26):
Well there's a reason though, because I mean think about
it from this perspective, because it's not like people haven't
tried to study this later in history. It's like the
tribes had no idea who built it or where it
came from. So that's another thing. You know, this is
this is this is this is kind of like and
we're going to get into this one later. This is

(15:46):
like Roanoke on a larger scale. It just vanished. Nobody
seems to know why. Nobody even seems to remember much
about it its existence. It was just there and then
it was gone.

Speaker 7 (15:54):
I don't well, and that's an important point, is that
a lot of the tribes in the area have no
knowledge of the tribe that built it. You know, it's
usually you you know, it's either that they were purposely forgotten,
you know, it's just a race from memory or you know,
whatever you want to attribute it to. But I mean
it's not like, I mean, oral tradition doesn't just vanish

(16:18):
in Okay, So let's see, So you had the French
and the Spanish in the area around that time, or
you know, around what sixteen hundred, so you're talking about
three hundred years all memory of the civilization is gone.
I find that implausible. I mean, unless, like I said,

(16:39):
it was on purpose. You know, why would everybody just
you know, we don't talk about that to the point
that left to the collective knowledge and the verbal traditions.

Speaker 1 (16:49):
I mean, well, that's the weird thing for me, right,
because think about this from this perspective. You're not wrong.
A lot of this stuff was being passed down as
a world orld tradition at that time, so you're in
it's even weird to think about because because think about
how gossip works today.

Speaker 2 (17:06):
Right.

Speaker 1 (17:07):
That's not like it's anything new, that's pretty much how
that's how human society has been for as long as
there's been any form of human society. So the fact
that in like twenty thousand people basically nearly pretty much
vanished overnight and nobody seems to remember who built the city,
where it came from, where it went. I mean, all
the structures were still there, just the people weren't. Where

(17:28):
did they go? I mean, is this one of the
I mean, you know, it is this Jeff's people's fault.
Looking at you. You do this, you do this.

Speaker 10 (17:38):
Well.

Speaker 7 (17:38):
And you know, until recently, a lot of the popular
opinion among archaeologists you've studied in this has been like, oh,
you know, they had crop failure or there was a
drought or you know whatever. It's basically, you know, the
collapse of the infrastructure is what caused them to leave.
But recent investigations by the BLM and the Universe, Washington,

(18:05):
University of Saint Louis, they they dug deep and they
carbonated the soil because you can actually tell the type
of plant and you by what degraded. And they said, no,
the progress hadn't taken over at that time, so it
wasn't like that they were fighting weeds or anything. This
was just pure I mean, they had the ability to
support that population and more.

Speaker 1 (18:32):
Hello, I had to address a question.

Speaker 7 (18:35):
Sorry, okay, so yeah, so yeah, and that and that
just adds to the mystery about about Kahokia is I mean, sure, yeah,
everybody just kind of vanished overnight and nobody remembers them.
But the main driver, the one thing that you know,

(18:55):
archaeologists love to attribute to the fall of the civil
civilization is usually the failure of agriculture, you know, what
they call climate change now, but in this case, recent
archaeological digs showed no evidence of it.

Speaker 1 (19:12):
Yeah, so again I blame Jeff's people. I'm just saying that.
That's my answer, That's what I'm going with. I blame
the Yeah, I blieme.

Speaker 7 (19:24):
It's still a puzzle.

Speaker 10 (19:25):
You know.

Speaker 7 (19:26):
Again, take your parents, take your take your London, take
your roam. This was the size of all of them.
I mean, imagine if London just disappeared overnight in ten sixty,
you know, or in the thirteen hundreds. I mean, well
it kind of did with a plague.

Speaker 1 (19:41):
But still.

Speaker 7 (19:44):
America didn't have a box, America didn't have pegs. Yeah,
at least the Native Americans didn't live like that. CGP.
Gray did a whole series on why there was no
America powks. So, yeah, they didn't live in that manner,
so they wouldn't have had the disease factor like you know,

(20:05):
the Black Death at least no known disease, no, nothing
that they could point to now and say, oh, yeah,
that wiped out the population, because usually that was European
diseases that did that for him.

Speaker 1 (20:20):
Yeah, small pox soaked blankets for the for the wind.
Oh wait, sorry, that wasn't really a win. Well and
he has it depends on your perspective as somebody, as
somebody who has a little bit of each DNA, I
don't really count that as the wind.

Speaker 7 (20:38):
So that so I'm just that one. And like I said,
I had never even heard of the city. Yeah, I'm
sure everybody in southern Illinois and you know Missouri are like, yeah,
you're fucking retarded.

Speaker 1 (20:54):
You know, it's we went field trips there in the school. Okay,
I mean Missouri is not that far from me. I
didn't know about it either, Yeah.

Speaker 7 (21:05):
Okay, so yeah, that would be even be a regional type.
I mean imagine, I mean imagine a major city in
the Midwest where you're at just basically disappearing and then
nobody knowing about it within three hundred years.

Speaker 1 (21:21):
So my question becomes why. And this is one of
the things that I just keeps rattling around in my head.

Speaker 16 (21:28):
Why did they.

Speaker 1 (21:30):
Stop talking about it? There has to be some reason why. No,
within I mean, I mean, granted, you know, generations are
roughly well, they were about twenty years apart. Now they're
shortening them. Most of them seem like they're sixteen now,
so before we know, it'll be like ten or something.
But assuming they use the same rule, I mean, that
is several generations past, that's at least fifteen. But you're

(21:54):
telling me in fifteen generations nobody knew anything about it
at all. There wasn't just there was and even anybody saying,
hey did you hear what happened to that day?

Speaker 2 (22:03):
Hey?

Speaker 1 (22:04):
Kids, this is this is why we travel all the
time and we live a nomads because we tried not
to do that once and everybody disappeared. You know, you
kind of think they kind of think there would be
a teaching moment.

Speaker 7 (22:13):
There well, and that you got to take the cultural
tradition too. So in European culture, in Asian culture, we
would write stuff down so we didn't have to remember.
And I'm not saying that, you know, the Native Americans
didn't have a written language. They totally did, but their

(22:34):
adherence to oral tradition, you know, to the oral tradition
of storytelling, you know, to passing down knowledge through storytelling,
through parables and through you know, legends and mythos and
everything like that. That's very amurocentric in that that that's
very narrative American and none of that, you know, to

(22:55):
lose something in ten generations, fifteen generations. I it's purposeful.
I'm convinced it's purposeful.

Speaker 1 (23:07):
No, you no, it has it has to be purposeful though.

Speaker 7 (23:14):
Yeah, going back to Stargate, drink for the new people.
Whenever we mentioned Stargatest one on the show, you have
to drink. It's like burying the gate. You know, we're
gonna bury the gate. We're never gonna speak of, you know,
our oppress of gods again.

Speaker 1 (23:33):
Yeah, I mean, well that's the That's the closest explanation
that I can think of. The only other thing that
I can think of is that, you know, maybe Kay
and Jane went back in time and gave everybody a neuralizer.

Speaker 7 (23:45):
I don't know there's that too.

Speaker 1 (23:49):
Anyway.

Speaker 7 (23:51):
Yeah, or like like we said, they were taken by
Jeff's people.

Speaker 1 (23:55):
So I'm still believing in Jeff's people. Because aliens are assholes.

Speaker 7 (24:00):
Yeah, but I'm still taking fifty thousand. Oh yeah, except
you know, the size between twenty and fifty thousand. That's
just I mean, obviously they disperse, but still not carrying
any of that oral tradition with them.

Speaker 1 (24:12):
That's a lot of beaming improbing. I'm just saying, yeah,
that's a lot of beaming improving. All right, I think
we've pretty much talked this part of this segment's pretty
much been put to bed. Where you want to go next, Well.

Speaker 7 (24:30):
Let's say I'm looking for a quick hit that we
could do before break.

Speaker 1 (24:35):
We have any real quick ones?

Speaker 7 (24:38):
Yeah, we really don't have any that we could do
in four to ten minutes.

Speaker 1 (24:42):
Why do you go ahead and take the break now?

Speaker 7 (24:44):
Yeah, let's just go ahead and take the break now,
and we'll come back with the Serpent Mountains.

Speaker 1 (24:47):
I'm gonna say it's just a music break anyway, give
me a second and I'll get it cute up.

Speaker 7 (24:50):
Yeah, that's right. My new rule. Music breaks only at
the body end.

Speaker 1 (24:55):
Because you're like the boss or something around here or something.

Speaker 7 (24:57):
Station identification at the top. Hey, you gotta keep the
talent happy. God, it sound like Brad now, you're the talent.

Speaker 1 (25:04):
When did that happen?

Speaker 7 (25:05):
And Sam, when did that happen?

Speaker 1 (25:09):
When did you pick up the talent?

Speaker 7 (25:10):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (25:12):
You were supposed to.

Speaker 7 (25:13):
Be by normal, I'm not. I just make fart noises.
I'm hardly the talent.

Speaker 1 (25:19):
Uh huh mm hmm.

Speaker 7 (25:25):
You know about looking for music.

Speaker 1 (25:28):
Pretty much, Well, I'm struggling because I didn't. Usually I
try to plan out the bumpers and stuff we're going
to use, and I didn't do that today because I've
been on the phone to day much. It's been a day.
It's been a day.

Speaker 7 (25:41):
It has been a day. What's with today today? I'm
just waiting for the firing a peaceful protest to start.

Speaker 16 (25:53):
Dude?

Speaker 1 (25:54):
What dude? That's one thing I did miss by being
on the phone so much, Like I started turning on
the news. There he goes like, you know what, I'm
just turning it off today. I'm not doing a political show.
I'm just not. But in honor of all the crap
that's going on, I figured, you know, because I can't
think of anything else to play right now, We're just
gonna go with this one.

Speaker 16 (26:11):
We'll be right back.

Speaker 1 (26:11):
Stay tuned. This would be a good time in the
reminder to do what this song says too.

Speaker 16 (26:16):
Yes, spend, guess, spend.

Speaker 1 (26:37):
As the watch is staying. So I spent the dad.

Speaker 16 (26:43):
I'm not my side, but I love my bed, and
I recommend that you stop.

Speaker 17 (26:52):
Watching ben.

Speaker 16 (26:55):
Because the news contrives.

Speaker 1 (27:01):
To make you feel small and alone, to make you.

Speaker 18 (27:07):
Feel that your mind isn't your own.

Speaker 16 (27:12):
I'll spend the dame bad.

Speaker 14 (27:15):
It's a consolation when all my dreams are perfectly.

Speaker 7 (27:22):
Legal in sheets for which I pay.

Speaker 16 (27:26):
I am nowaday and my breadorn.

Speaker 19 (27:32):
To all of my friends that they stop watching the
dow because the news to drive, to try to do
to make you feel small and alone, to make you
feel that your mind isn't your own.

Speaker 17 (27:56):
Time.

Speaker 18 (27:56):
There's a wish times I wish time, or as I
wish time, or as I wish time, or as I wish.

Speaker 20 (28:09):
Time, or as I wish time, Do as I wish, do.

Speaker 16 (28:14):
As I wire.

Speaker 1 (28:17):
I spend the day bed.

Speaker 7 (28:21):
You can please yourself, but I spent the day bed.

Speaker 16 (28:26):
Pillows are like pivers, like els, and so there's nothing
wrong with being good to yourself.

Speaker 19 (28:37):
Be good to yourself for once, and no bus, no bus,
but no no rain.

Speaker 14 (28:43):
No trade, no bus, no boss, no no rain, no train,
no bus, no boss, no no rain, no trade, no bear, mastulation.

Speaker 1 (29:19):
And welcome back in ladies and gentlemen. Thank you for
the reminder. I don't know why. It's usually over there automatically,
so I don't know why it wasn't, but I fixed it.
But I fixed it. Okay, yeah, okay, it's usually over
there automatically, so I didn't think about it, and I'm like,
wait a minute, why is it not there? It's supposed
to be there. But they did an update again because
they changed ow the chat and everything works, not as

(29:41):
far as.

Speaker 7 (29:41):
I see it in the chat on my feed, but
I don't see it in the chat on the main feed.

Speaker 1 (29:50):
It's it'll update in a minute, I know.

Speaker 7 (29:52):
You know, because sometimes let me refresh. Okay, there are
this yeah now, because sometimes when I'm running two feeds,
one will take precedence and the other one will freeze.
So a little inside baseball for you all there.

Speaker 1 (30:06):
We have a station identity break. We play it all
the time. It's this one right here.

Speaker 7 (30:13):
Don't do it now, We'll do it at bottom.

Speaker 9 (30:16):
You are listening to k l R and Radio, where
liberty and reason still range.

Speaker 1 (30:23):
The program not a driver, but can you say for
sure you got the best? Yeah, well I forgot to
turn off the auto play, but hey, the programming director
was trying to be a smart but so I had
the program I saw anyway, have one of those it friends.
Usually when we do the ad breaks at least once anyway,

(30:47):
So yeah, fun times, fun times, fun times, good times.

Speaker 7 (30:51):
So we are back and the next weird one of
American heritage.

Speaker 4 (30:59):
You know, a lot of.

Speaker 7 (31:01):
What I find interesting is I mean, aside from you know,
Jeff did a show recently on an increase on the
A SAZI and so that I was just about to say,
you don't really see these on the West coast, but
you do, as those words were coming out of my mouth,
I remember that one. But a lot of these are
really East coast centric, yo is. And I mean, yeah,

(31:24):
you had that one down on the southwest, you know,
southwest border, but a lot of these. The next one
is the Serpent Mounts. Now, this one I knew about.
I think I remember, ah in search of well, Leonard
Nimoy did one. And this has always been this has
always kind of fascinated me too.

Speaker 1 (31:41):
Yeah, I remember that we've actually this is one of
the ones that we have touched on before when we
did this topic a long time ago before we started
streaming Daggs. So it's always nice to kind of come
back and touch on things that we've talked about before.
But yeah, so you're right though, most of these do
seem to be you know, kind of East Coast dish,
early Western, you know, before the major expansion started. It

(32:05):
was okay, it's all kind of right there, which is
weird because that would have really no bearing on anything
that we did because we're talking about hundreds of years
before this one. As a matter of fact, it's even older.

Speaker 7 (32:15):
Yeah, this one's almost two thousand years before.

Speaker 1 (32:18):
Yeah, so this is anywhere between the range of two
fifty to one hundred and fifty BC. And no, I'm
not saying E. I don't fucking care. I hate that.

Speaker 13 (32:28):
Yeah.

Speaker 7 (32:29):
I have to mentally drop the E whenever I see it.
It's unnecessary. I get it, but it's unnecessary.

Speaker 2 (32:38):
Yeah.

Speaker 7 (32:38):
So in southeastern Ohio, this is one of the more
mysterious ones. It's the Great Serpent Mound. It's about thirteen
hundred feet long and depicts say, you know, kind of
a sinulous serpent opening its jaws to swallow an oval
object like you know, an egg, Yet an egg shaped
object could be the sign of the cause, was itself

(33:01):
radiocarbonating sparked. It thinks that the destruction was during the
construction was during the Adena culture or the later fort
Ancient culture, which is around ten seventy around the same
time as goddamn Kahokiah. Sorry, I just absolutely brain farted.

(33:26):
But what's significant about this one is this aligns again,
every bit is precisely with celestial objects and uh timing
as Stonehenge or Woodhenge. And like I said, if it
goes back to the Adena culture, then that's really close

(33:48):
closer to the type of stonehenge.

Speaker 1 (33:52):
So I wonder. I wonder because this just occurred to me.
So they're they're during this time. And the reason we're
all over the place with the timing before I get
into this is because timing is kind of messy. That's
why this thing is anywhere between one fifty BC to
three hundred BC, and even could be somewhere around ten
seventy CE or but I guess it's a I guess

(34:14):
they say CE now instead of eighty So whatever.

Speaker 7 (34:17):
Yeah, BCE is before era a ce is current era
and whatever. I understand it.

Speaker 1 (34:22):
It makes sense, but I mean, I get it, but
you know, it's it's still it's eighty come on, it's
not that hard anyway. But yeah, so something just occurred
to me. So you've got stone hinge, You've got wood hinge,
which would was the most common fuel for fire at
the time. You've got this one which seems to be
made out of earth. If I'm understanding correctly. Is there

(34:47):
a water hinge somewhere.

Speaker 7 (34:50):
If there is, we haven't found it yet.

Speaker 1 (34:53):
Maybe it didn't. Maybe it's in Atlantis.

Speaker 10 (34:56):
See.

Speaker 7 (34:56):
Now, the interesting thing about the Serpent Mound is that
it is on the rim of an ancient meteor strike,
a large one. It's about five miles in diameter, what
they call a crypto explosion, and since there's no volcanic
activity in the area, they assume that it is it's

(35:17):
a meteor asteroids strike. Now, the thing about this area too,
the strike was significant enough to break a significant part
of the mantle. Where this area has its own gravity,
it has its own different magnetism. Everything is just slightly

(35:37):
off from normal in this area.

Speaker 1 (35:45):
Yeah, no, it's all weirdness. So the thing with the
meteor strike. First of all, think about that for a second.
How often has that actually happened to that scale anyway?
I mean, the only other one that I know of
that would be any larger would have been the one
that wiped out the.

Speaker 7 (36:04):
You know, the Arizona craters about that big. It's pretty significant.
But the thing with the strike too, is that it's
two hundred and sixty five million years old. I find
it oddly coincidental that these particular mound builders just happened
to find an area that has its own slight variation
of gravity, slight variation of magnetism, and decided and decided

(36:27):
to build a significant cultural piece there that has very
accurate astronomical progression procession elements too.

Speaker 1 (36:44):
Well, I mean, so well, there's just there's just some
weird vibes going on here, because first you've got you know,
slight variations and gravity and the magnetism that you just
talked about. Then there's you know, all the different things
that going that going that we're going on as far
as what appeared to be ritualistic stuff like you know,
tracking the solstice. Apparently there are uh so apparently with

(37:06):
the crater and the snake shape. There are times when
it actually is it can be seen or picture it
in your head, like it looks like at one point
the sun is actually dipping into the jaws of the snake. Yeah,
the way they sett all right up.

Speaker 7 (37:21):
Yeah, that's the you know which one was it the
summer solstice and it aligns with the with the sun
set on the summer solstice. Now, the thing about this too,
is that the area has become so overgrown with trees
that it's hard to know that the you like going there, say,

(37:45):
you know, you're you know, part of the Great land
Rush or whatever, and you're hitting Ohio, you know, to
build your old homestead. It was completely overgrown at this point,
so you wouldn't have known that. And this I isn't
that big, It's not as big as the other when
we're we talking like a few feet off the ground.
So the fact that it hasn't been washed away or

(38:07):
trampled down or plowed under is pretty amazing in and
of itself. In the you know, two thousand years since
this was made. But yeah, so the whole area was
completely overgrow, so you wouldn't have seen, you know, what
this was actually supposed to be for when you go there. Now,

(38:29):
it's still complete, you know, it's still tree bound.

Speaker 1 (38:34):
Yeah, well, I mean yeah, I mean obviously you're not
gonna be able to see much with it today. But
I don't know. I'm just I'm still you know how
my mind works. I'm picturing like the sun setting into
the mouth of a snake. There's so much symbolism there
when you think about it, I I can't get past
that point.

Speaker 18 (38:54):
Now.

Speaker 1 (38:55):
I realized that their religions are completely different than ours.
But one of the most common conceptions about the sun
is the sun is light, the sun is life, and
snakes are predominantly perceived as evil in a lot of cultures.
I don't necessarily know if it's the same in theirs,
but in that instance, it almost if you're looking at
it through you know, through common conceptions. It's almost as

(39:18):
if for one day out of the year, the bad
guys win or something because the the snake eats.

Speaker 7 (39:25):
The released just an ale and I will bring back
the sun. It didn't help, but do the spies, Like
I said, Yeah, the other thing with this monument too,
is like the Nascal Lines, you wouldn't know what it
was on the ground, So to have that decision. Yeah,

(39:51):
because mean, this thing is thirteen hundred feet long. So yeah,
to have that precision and to like, it's not like
tilted on a hill like you know that horse on
the dover cliffs or anything. It's generally flat and you
know you're walking it. You wouldn't realize you were walking
a snake. You might actually say, hey, this kind of

(40:11):
wind's like a snake. But between the way the tail
is coiled, and then for each of the three coil
not coils, but slithering of the snake we'll call it,
at each point of those is a significant astronomical event. Also,

(40:33):
this monument aligns with the constellation Draco. Now you can say, well,
you know, Draco, that's kind of a you know, very eurocentric,
you know, but the way the constellation lays out it
looks the same no matter what kind of cultural, you know,
implication you throw at it. Yeah, if you look at

(40:55):
the constellation, it's very snake like and the head pointing
to what would have been the uh, the swallowing of
the North Star. So I tried to get fancy and
remember the name of that, and I just couldn't force.

Speaker 1 (41:12):
I'm gonna say an impilaris I think, yeah, so.

Speaker 7 (41:19):
So, yeah, that's kind of weird.

Speaker 1 (41:24):
Yeah, it's definitely definitely Again what trips me out about
all this stuff is and I know we're a Mario
is centric today, but we're talking about with no hint
of any type of modern technologies. We understand it for
everything from stone hinge to wood hinge to this thing
to what we now are starting to see and understand

(41:48):
about what the Pyramids may have been used for instead
of what we thought they were used for. It just
it boggles the mind. And this goes into something that
came up a little bit on BES Show the other
day when Jeff and I were both on there. I
keep coming back to that line from Battle Star Goal ACTIONGA,
this has all happened before, and this will all happen again.
I think there may be different types of not necessarily

(42:11):
I don't want to say technology, but different advancements that
were available at certain times that at least rival what
we're able to do, and in some places even surpass them.
And I think at some point it all gets to
that point where it's about to hit whatever the next
stage is and something just goes poof and it has
to start over because it's like Jeff always says, you know,

(42:31):
there's that scale of when you're about to hit that
point where you become an interplanetary species, and almost no
species ever makes it so, but anyway, I kind of
feel like there's some of that going on here because
it's just weird that these people have been able to
do all these things. And you know, we've talked about
this on other shows, like the connections between the pyramids
that are in the Americas versus the ones in Egypt,

(42:54):
and there's just so many commonalities everywhere. So it its
just I feel like there's there's something that we're not
quite seeing yet, which is why these kind of shows
always fascinate me. Sorry, I'm kind of all over the
place right now, but I'm kind of like, no.

Speaker 7 (43:11):
It's fine.

Speaker 1 (43:12):
Yeah.

Speaker 7 (43:13):
And you know, one of the things to talk about
with this too, the reason why they can't attribute it
to which culture it is is so you have the
fort ancient culture and that.

Speaker 4 (43:20):
These were.

Speaker 7 (43:23):
They were the well known mound builders across Ohio, and
you know they built a lot of their mounds around
ten seventy BC, but it's believed that they actually borrowed these.
Especially the reason why it's called Ford ancient is because

(43:45):
there's a mound building that's kind of a you know
fort like with you know, ramparts and crenels and everything
put into it. But it's also believed that the Ford
Ancient culture adopted it from an earlier culture and that
they were the actual mound builders in the area from

(44:06):
the Hopwell culture, which was about a thousand years before,
so you're talking two thousand BC, and they may have
in fact created the Serpent Mound and the Adena culture,
which was much more recent. While they're believed that they
have may may have been the one to build it,

(44:26):
it's not their style. So and while they were suspected
of making several mounds, they weren't responsible for most of
the mountains in Ohio.

Speaker 1 (44:42):
They It's just all of this is very head scratching
to me.

Speaker 7 (44:49):
Yeah, and the mounds, they've all been used for the
same person as up to as recently as the Allegheny tribes.
So there was rumored that, you know, like with other
ones will be talking about that they pulled uh skeletons
of giants out of the some of the mounds in
the area and what they're referring to as giants, that
it was about the six foot size, but for you know,

(45:12):
then that was quite tall, you know, when you're talking
mid nineteenth century, still pretty tall.

Speaker 1 (45:21):
Yeah, I mean that would rival what everybody thought the
Tower about as falls the Tower of Battle made it
before it got destroyed. But I still think there's more
of that story too, if I'm being honest. But we
may get into that at some point, probably probably that
may be a decent little side note when we do
the apocrypher stuff.

Speaker 7 (45:39):
So yeah, yeah, I was just thinking the same thing
is when we were doing this. When we were researching
this show, Rick and I talked about a lot of
other shows that, you know, one of the things I
don't remember talking about that before. I so, yeah, we
did it when we talked about this show, and then
I wrapped it up wanting to talk about the Book
of judas we need to do an apocryphal show once
and then that's when I clicked and all these other
things started going, Oh yeah, we haven't done that show

(46:00):
we talked about doing too, So yeah.

Speaker 1 (46:02):
Yeah, so at least we kind of know where we're
going for the next few shows, assuming Mother assuming Mother
Nature doesn't you know, eventually calms their kits. Because I
just found out I have storms coming my way again.
So if I drop off rather quickly, y'all will know why.

Speaker 7 (46:17):
Well, there you go for me. It's probably because you know,
rioters took out it in internet thing because we can't
have nice things. And yes, I know I'm doing the political.

Speaker 1 (46:30):
That's all right. There's no way to really get around
it tonight, because what's happening right now in your neck
that will just fucking insane. I'm just gonna say it.

Speaker 7 (46:38):
Well, I mean it is Riot season, so it's right.
We were talking about it the other night. Well, the
Rodney King Riots were in April. I said, well, yeah,
but that was an all media year. It was warmer
Los Angeles. Don't go out of the house if it's
under fifty.

Speaker 1 (46:54):
Nice, all right, So I think we've got time to
sneak in one more before top of the hour looks like,
so you want to do the Grave Creek Mound next?
Or where you want to go next?

Speaker 20 (47:07):
No?

Speaker 7 (47:07):
Yeah, no, that's great. Yeah, let's do that. Let's do
the Grave Creek Mound. That's a that's a quick hit.

Speaker 1 (47:12):
All right. So we're heading to Mountainsville, West Virginia for
the Grave Creek Mound it's America's biggest conical burial mound
and built by the Adena tribe again somewhere between two
fifteen and one fifty BC. It's over seventy feet high
and two hundred and ninety five feet wide. So what

(47:33):
do you think, what's that I was gonna say, So,
what do you think was it for elite burials or
you know, was this like.

Speaker 7 (47:41):
Well, yeah, no, just when they actually in excavations, they
have found very exotic grave goods, not just suggesting that
there was a social hierarchy, but also a pretty vast
trade network, because I mean there were seashells and obsidian
and all kinds of you know stuff not in around

(48:02):
the area. So yeah, the excavation began around in the
nineteenth century and again claiming there were giant human skeletons
on Earth. And this was actually that was a newspaper
selling trick at the time too. A lot of the
stories of ancient giants, some of them you know, they
actually you know, correspond with Native American myths, but in

(48:28):
a lot of cases it was to sell newspapers because
archaeology was hot, and it was the same thing when
they were finding dinosaur skeletons all over the place. So yeah,
it secks it up most.

Speaker 1 (48:41):
You know, I mean that's I mean, everybody thinks that
the seleicious news is new. No, it's always. It's pretty
much always been a thing. The only difference is nobody
really hit it before as much as they've tried to
until they just all got caught with their hands in
the cookie jar not too long ago. So it wasn't
so the giants while it's old papers because that's you know,
they haven't been able to there's no record of any
huge skeletons or anything else. But the one thing that

(49:03):
I will say is kind of impressive again for these
folks is their trade networks. Apparently there is records of
train trade networks for these people reaching hundreds of miles.
And you can think about that with no domesticatable animals.

Speaker 7 (49:18):
Yeah, I mean you want to try and you know,
domesticated an animal that rhymes with lol. I mean that's
just you. You can tame them, you can't domesticate them. Yeah,
that's the uh, that's you know, the great old saying.

(49:39):
The difference between a tame animal and a domesticated one
is the difference between a zoo and a farm.

Speaker 1 (49:45):
Pretty much.

Speaker 7 (49:47):
So, yeah, they got a bunch of tame animals in
the zoo, but none of not many of them are domesticatable.

Speaker 1 (49:51):
Yeah, I mean, try to hook a giraffe up the
pull of cards, you know what that works for?

Speaker 7 (49:57):
Yeah, the gazelle or a deer. You know, you try
to wrangle a deer, You've got a skittish little thing
that's either gonna hop the fence or break its neck
on the rope. So yeah, I mean at least, you know,
with with North American deer reindeer, different reindeer domesticatable. So yeah,

(50:19):
I mean America really had no domesticable animals and all
of them were brought here. So, like you said, all
this on foot, maybe raft, you know, canoe whatever. But yeah,
so that leads to these the mound building. I mean

(50:42):
you think about it, you're just doing it with human hands.
So to pile dirt up that seventy feet high and
two hundred three hundred feet across.

Speaker 1 (50:53):
By hand in basket, yeh, dude?

Speaker 21 (50:59):
Can you that that had to have taken forever? That yeah,
that's a generational project. Yeah, and yeah, the pyramids were
generational projects too. I mean a lot of the Pyramids
are like, Okay, I'm going to commission my tomb now
and get the slave labor on it. So you almost
kind of have to think that the Native American population

(51:19):
was much larger than we've been led to believe through history.

Speaker 1 (51:25):
You would think, I mean you you would think, because
I mean so well this, you know, not to go
back to the the the what we talked about at
the beginning of the show, but this lends even more
credence to the idea of if you were part of
a people that were sophisticated enough to build that, or

(51:45):
even if you even if you were neighbors with people
that were sophisticated enough to build that. You're telling me
nobody knows about it. I mean, think think about it
from another perspective. The only and granted nobody knows for sure,
but the only reason we know about Atlantis is because
of But you're telling me that nobody was around to
tell that story anymore. Nobody nobody, I mean.

Speaker 7 (52:08):
You know, I mean when Plato encountered the story, if
you've ever read the the ever is actually quite interesting.
But even that he heard it secondhand, so that was
you know, it's one of those things that sure, everybody
knew about it, but you know, it's again, this is
one of those things that everybody knew about it. It

(52:30):
was a wives tale. You know, he's just the first
one to write it down. So yeah, but I mean,
you know, it's one of those, you know, cautionary tales
of pride and vengeance and you know, humorous.

Speaker 1 (52:48):
It's just so weird to think about because I mean
until until I started, you know, watching and listening watching
shows like the one you were just talking about with
Lionardy Moy and listening to shows like ar Bell and
everything else, I didn't even know stuff like this existed.
And at first I was like, there's no way. I

(53:08):
mean because and I am from a generation where we
were taught about history at least part of the way
through before they started realizing well, you know, maybe we
don't want to tell them as much as we used to,
but you know, to not. I mean, we were just
we were always told that the Native Americans were simple
agrarian people, and we didn't even know the truth about that.
But you're talking about hundreds of years before we even

(53:32):
came over here, there were civilizations that rivaled medieval Paris.
That's almost impossible to wrap your head around. And then
you go down here and you've got something just about
as vast. I mean, you're talking about a group of
people that were able to trade with people hundreds of
miles away. I mean, think about that from just you know,

(53:54):
the Western era civilization. People didn't want to be more
than a mile outside of and that was forever.

Speaker 16 (54:03):
Well.

Speaker 7 (54:03):
And the thing you have to think of too, is
so you had all of these cultures popping up around
the same time, yeah, in equal size to Europe. But
when we got here, there was no evidence of that.
So what calamity, what continental calamity happened between then and

(54:25):
our arrival in the fourteen hundreds to sixteen hundreds that
basically turned the nation into semi nomatic you know Bedouins for.

Speaker 1 (54:35):
Lack of a better term, I mean, there there has
there has to be something there that then this is
this is once once I figured out where you were
going with this, this this is what got This is
what got stuck in my head all day because I
was like, what happened in less than five hundred years
to completely change the direction of these civilizations because they

(54:58):
were rival Europe at the time, where we didn't. We've
never been taught that. So so what happened what changed
in four hundred years to basically make them, you know,
embrace a simpler life? It kind of it kind of
reminds me of you know, the sci fi stories where

(55:21):
technology goes too far and everybody wants to go backwards
and they just start living as nomads again. I kind
of feel like there had to be something that happened there.
And the reason well, in that vein and the reason
that nobody knows about it and the reason that nobody
talks about it is because they were afraid they were
going to repeat it again. So I'm wondering if maybe
they had a similar situation to the Tower of Babel

(55:45):
moment that was outlined in the Bible where suddenly God
scattered everybody. Maybe maybe something like that happened again, because
and again, by God, I'm saying just about anything at
this point, because because while I am a Christian, I
also understand that most people are agnostic because you know,
we don't know enough, so to them, Gods could have
been just about anything that was more superiorly advanced to

(56:07):
them than they were. So maybe is that what happened?
Did some of deaf people come down and say, hey,
y'all can't do this.

Speaker 7 (56:13):
This is yeah, you're pushing too far.

Speaker 4 (56:17):
You know.

Speaker 7 (56:20):
We're talking about an area as huge as America too.
I mean we always joke about it. When Europe gets
up at Eather, you can fit you know, three of
their largest countries in Texas. So yeah, and I joke
about it is that, you know, I live in a
county that I could fit three Eastern Seaboard states in,
you know. And that's it's the scope of scale of size.

(56:44):
If you and I get you know, almost have to
ask are these actually older? And you know, but and
it kind of dovetails with the collapse of a lot
of the Central and South American cultures too.

Speaker 1 (57:00):
See that's one thing now that we have a virtual
production assistant. In one of these days, I'm going to
start it down its own little rabbit hole and have
to connect all the dots about all the civilizations that
collapsed here around the if we can see if we
can find a common thread, because yeah, you're right that
this is around the same time that the Central American

(57:22):
societies collapse. It's around the same time that the South
American societies collapsed. So this all happened around the same time,
and we've.

Speaker 7 (57:29):
Been a one hundred years of each other. I mean, yeah,
some of them are so yeah, it's but the big ones,
you know, the pyramid builders and uh.

Speaker 1 (57:36):
You know the ol Max and the toll you know,
it's you know, but yeah, we're talking about anywhere between
fifty to a fifty to one hundred, maybe hundred fifty
years apart. All these things just completely fell apart around
the same general time. I mean in this in the
span in the span of eons, one hundred and fifty years,
ain't nothing.

Speaker 7 (57:54):
Yeah, I mean you think about that. You know, it's
just like JT said in a in a chat, is
you know, we're closer to Plato than Plato was to Atlantis,
and you know he had the oral tradition, you know,
kind of the same thing is. I mean, we're closer
to uh, you know, the Civil War than those all.
You know, then all those countries, you know, all those

(58:15):
countries were closer to in the same timeframe. So you know,
in that time in our history between the American revolutions
and today, you have a lot of the cultures on
the America. In the America, you know, in the Western
Hemisphere are all collapsing around that.

Speaker 1 (58:32):
You know, it's just crazy to think about. But my friend,
we have reached the top of the hour.

Speaker 7 (58:39):
Okay, time for station bridge stuff and I need to.

Speaker 1 (58:44):
All right, folks, Our one is in the books, Our
two to come.

Speaker 7 (58:47):
My name is Rick Robinson.

Speaker 1 (58:49):
This is Juxtaposition. We'll be right back. Hello, friends, you
have a moment so that we may discuss our Lord

(59:11):
and Savior minarchy. No, seriously, I'm just kidding.

Speaker 2 (59:16):
Hi.

Speaker 1 (59:16):
My name is Rick Robinson. I am the general manager
of Klrnradio dot com. We are probably the largest independent
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little bit of everything, and by that what I mean
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(59:39):
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You can find us on x under at klr and Radio.
You can find us on our rumble and our YouTube
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at klrnradio dot com and pretty much every podcast catcher
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(01:00:00):
us out any time you like at KLRN Radio.

Speaker 4 (01:00:10):
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Speaker 1 (01:00:51):
My God is really really special and I love my
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Speaker 22 (01:00:59):
I'm proud of it and that even though he isn't
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Speaker 7 (01:01:08):
How much everything about him.

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And the moment that the officers and I had to
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Speaker 9 (01:02:50):
You are listening to k l R and radio where
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Speaker 10 (01:02:58):
The following program can take, of course, language and adult themes.
Listener discretion is advised.

Speaker 16 (01:03:06):
Dream Man test.

Speaker 22 (01:03:11):
Big full grown out of side, Government shadows, secretstine conspiracies
and full low set strange encounter side flame through this
out that really shame Man with knowledge, Voice is born,

(01:03:34):
unleveling History stories untold.

Speaker 13 (01:03:40):
Area fifty one Whispering Name, Beautiful, Sighting, spunting flame.

Speaker 2 (01:03:53):
Love, miss monster, a lottering mess.

Speaker 25 (01:03:59):
Crito, logy injurious Gift, strage, encounter Sun, Explain to this
out that play shade None with knowledge is voices fall
love Lovely.

Speaker 2 (01:04:13):
Mystery stories untold.

Speaker 12 (01:04:18):
S takes dout Believe as your fore answers, hitting into
the flight so logic things such continuous strange encounter. Sun
explain Tooth this out that bravely shape then with know.

Speaker 2 (01:04:39):
Is Fosses fall love, lovely history stories, Untold Trooth this
out there, Troos.

Speaker 1 (01:04:50):
Out and welcome back into hour two of Juxtaposition. And

(01:05:11):
I just saw an update in a chat that Zero
and Sun's trading company got a twelve hours just mentioned
for suggesting that commedies aren't people and shouldn't stand in
front of cars. That's it. That's that's bad because that's
basically well, I don't want to say they're not people.

Speaker 7 (01:05:27):
Controversial at that statement. I have said much about comedies
and but also I mean I did have a seven
day for that got squashed within twelve hours because that
was funny. Yeah yeah, apparently apparently calling to primary people
is violent. That's violence.

Speaker 1 (01:05:46):
Now i'mush that's violence there anyway.

Speaker 7 (01:05:49):
So but yeah, yeah, no, I mean nobody should be
standing in front of cars, especially you know.

Speaker 1 (01:05:56):
I'll see twelve hours, but yeah, no, no, I get it.
I don't you know this.

Speaker 7 (01:06:01):
Because he used to used to wear a bad you know,
it's something that sticks in my head about. You know,
one of my bosses was a cop before he got
into the trade. That he that I worked with him
in and uh, he pointed something out to me that
always just kind of resonated that dogs are property and
cats aren't, because you have to get a license for
a dog. So if you have to slam on the

(01:06:25):
brakes and you know, do it for a dog, because
you will get sued for property. Cats are cats, and
I know cats are pat pets, and I like cats
slightly less than I like dogs. But comedies aren't even cats.

Speaker 1 (01:06:39):
So anyway, there's there's a thoughts.

Speaker 7 (01:06:45):
There was a long round about way to get there,
wasn't it.

Speaker 1 (01:06:47):
Well, you know, that's kind of that's kind of that's
kind of what you do. But I would also like
to remind everybody, you know, I can't speak for in
Comedy Fornia, but pretty much anywhere else, impeding the the
progress of an emergency is actually a crime, So just saying,
really not supposed to do that anyway. But yeah, all right,

(01:07:08):
so anyway, enough about that's just like.

Speaker 7 (01:07:10):
All these guys trying to have their t in the
square a moment and just getting barreled over.

Speaker 1 (01:07:16):
Oh yeah. You know the other thing that I find
absolutely funny is all the Congress creators calling for ice
to be unmasked. I'm like, did you say that about
BLM and Antifa?

Speaker 7 (01:07:25):
You guys just make a whole big fuss about everybody
needing to be masked. I mean, I'm old enough to
remember when you weren't supposed to wear a mask or
a hat in a bank, and then for a few
years we were required.

Speaker 1 (01:07:37):
To, which made that fun. Can you imagine, like, after
all the training of you know, keep an eye out
for people, you know, try to walk in and put
masks on and stuff. Can you imagine all the heart
attacks they were having for the first couple of months
everybody's supposed to be wear those are in how I
can breathe?

Speaker 7 (01:07:53):
Well, who would be funny? I mean, how much of
that has just become so numb to them that if
somebody were to come and wearing a mask and you know,
hat and sunglass, they did like next.

Speaker 1 (01:08:02):
They wouldn't even care anymore. It was like, yeah, next,
all right, So anyway, let's recap our ones and we
can get back on tag on track. So we went
through Kahokia has Lost City, the Serpent Mountains, Cosmic Twist, Grave,
Great Creaks, and Giant Tales, and again, I'm rick, this
is already in his juxtaposition. Our two is gonna be

(01:08:23):
an even deeper dive. We've got three more North American
riddles and we're gonna get into those now.

Speaker 22 (01:08:28):
So U.

Speaker 1 (01:08:30):
Go where you want to go next?

Speaker 26 (01:08:33):
Yeah, this next one was another one that I had
never heard of, and it's just as huge as any
of the others, and even older.

Speaker 7 (01:08:44):
And that is the poverty point in Louisiana.

Speaker 1 (01:08:50):
Ah, So we're so we're going we're going down to Noah,
We're going down to Nola or the Louisiana area, are
we That's fine.

Speaker 7 (01:08:56):
Yeah, we're down on the Bayou. That's what actually was
to buy you.

Speaker 1 (01:09:00):
You're gonna grab some crawfish and stuff while we're down there.

Speaker 7 (01:09:03):
Yeah, drive some airboats and.

Speaker 1 (01:09:06):
Yeah. Okay.

Speaker 15 (01:09:08):
So yeah, So.

Speaker 1 (01:09:11):
So this was, if memory service, anywhere between seventeen hundred
to eleven hundred BC. So, yes, this one is rather ancient.

Speaker 7 (01:09:22):
Yeah, this one's yeah, this one's close to three thousand
years old, it is. Yeah, And for a couple hundred years.

Speaker 18 (01:09:33):
It was.

Speaker 7 (01:09:35):
A massive trade center. It had it had a trade
network spanning one thousand miles. Based off the archaeological evidence there,
nobody actually lived there. It was just a trading hub
and it spanned over three quarters of a mile on
the bayou. Yeah, there's seven concentric rings, which talking about Atlantis.

(01:09:59):
So was Atlantis but with a with a huge mound
in the center and everything here.

Speaker 1 (01:10:11):
Was that just me? Yeah, well that's what I was
talking about the second ago. That's what started the very
beginning of the show. It usually only happens then though.

Speaker 7 (01:10:18):
That's weird, Okay, Yeah, the first time I didn't hear it.
At that time I did. Yeah, And I mean to
put it all in perspective, you know, with the size
of this, uh you know construction, the Stonehenge was only
completed about five hundred years before it and it predates
the Olympic, the Greek Olympic Games by about a thousand years,

(01:10:42):
so just to put it in you know, European context.

Speaker 1 (01:10:47):
Well, so, the weirdest thing about this, and this is
something that didn't occur to me until you mentioned it.
The similarities between how parts of Atlantis were set up
versus this kind of escaped me until you brought them up, and.

Speaker 7 (01:11:01):
Which just was looking at the artist rendition of it
made me realize that looks a lot like the artist
renditions of Atlantis too, just much more native.

Speaker 1 (01:11:10):
Well with the time frames that we're discussing, could that hmm, No.

Speaker 7 (01:11:16):
Because no, because I mean just well no, because this
would have been contemporary to Plato.

Speaker 27 (01:11:24):
Eh.

Speaker 1 (01:11:24):
I guess you got a point there. I think I
always think Plato is a little younger than he is,
So I guess that was my fault. Yeah, so.

Speaker 7 (01:11:34):
Yeah, so I mean, yeah, but looking at the mock up,
it looks surprisingly similar to the uh the rent, you know,
the artist renditions of Atlantis, but instead of big towering
spires and a big bustling city, these are several concentric
rings of you know, with thoroughfares going through them. So
you'd have a mound built up about thirty feet, a

(01:11:57):
gap of what looks you know, significant gap, and then
another one so kind of like an amphitheater. Yeah, without
being raised up.

Speaker 1 (01:12:09):
Well, I mean, and I hate to keep coming back
to this stuff, but we're talking about again, you know,
a potential trade across thousands of miles. But again, here's
that kicker that keeps coming up. No farming to speak of,
no domestic animals, no clear chiefs or kings, So how
did they manage to coordinate all this again.

Speaker 7 (01:12:33):
Yeah, and this whole area has a huge mound about
seventy feet talls standing over it, and for hundreds of
years it was the tallest mound in the country.

Speaker 1 (01:12:47):
Yeah, I mean it's it's just wild because I mean, again,
this is one of the areas where it was predominantly
hunter gatherers at the time, as far as we know
from you know, anthropological folks like miss Aggie who like
to look at people's goals. We thought that was a
weird treat. But anyway, but now it's just you know, again,

(01:13:08):
this is not usually what hunter gatherers do. No, generally, No,
So who gave them the idea? That's the other question
I can't get around. Who gave them the idea to
do this? Because it's antithetical to everything that we know
that hunter gatherers normally do.

Speaker 7 (01:13:30):
Yeah, I mean yeah, this is not I mean again,
getting back to it, this is not the Native Americans
we encountered, your Europeans encountered when they landed here. Yeah,
I mean yeah, some of them were semi agram most
of them were hunter gatherer and uh, you know, or

(01:13:51):
at least semi nomadic. And yeah, you have these massive
structures and these giant congregationaries because like I said, nobody
actually in here. There's no evidence that people live here.
This was a trade spot. Now, the particular bayou that
it's on was much larger at the time, so it
was more of a significant waterway, you know, not quite

(01:14:12):
Mississippi River, but quite large. And you know, it's they've
found rocks and supplies to stretch all the way to
Appalachian Mountains. It's it's another one of those massive trade centers.
And why yeah, and why here? Yeah? Yeah, sippy close.

(01:14:34):
So that gets you, you know, everything along the Mississippi River.
But why go all the way down to Louisiana for
you know, because this was still far enough north or
wasn't coastal Louisiana. This is in you know, the northeastern side,
the northwestern side.

Speaker 1 (01:14:53):
Yeah, I got nothing. Yeah, I mean the only the
only thing I can think of having been the Louisiana recently.
There's lots of swamp land there, so maybe they were
using the waterway somehow.

Speaker 7 (01:15:05):
Sure, But I mean still that's great for getting you know.
But yeah, I'm just trying to think, So you got
the Mississippi, you got them? Yeah? Well okay, but yeah,
I mean, it just seems like, I guess it's easier
to go down river than up, but still they would

(01:15:27):
have to get back up to get to their tribe.
So it just seems like a huge pan of the
ass you go all the way down to northern Louisiana.

Speaker 1 (01:15:36):
But you know they had time then, yeah, I mean
that's pretty much all they end It was time. They
didn't have to do all the things we have to do.
They weren't changed to a desk for forty hours a week.
This was survived. So I don't know, I guess when
I guess, when you put it in that perspective, you
know they did. They didn't have lots of time to

(01:15:56):
get this stuff done because that was how they majored
that they eat and stuff. So ill again, it's just
is so much different than anything that we've been told.
So Chat brought up an interesting point as far as
some of the other stuff that we've been talking about,
is the collapses that we're looking into would have all
coincided with one of the smaller ice ages, so that
may have had something to do with it. Wouldn't explained

(01:16:16):
this one because it was thousands of years before I'd
had to look to see a couple thousand. I'd have
to look to see if there was maybe a corresponding
to other little ice age back then too. Maybe, I mean,
maybe that's part of the reason why all the natives
started to just let's just let's just follow the food
because then the weather changes as we go, so we
don't have to worry about that.

Speaker 7 (01:16:36):
But to have no no verbal tradition for it. And
this was another one around eleven hundred BC. They just
up and vanished again, just pull just proof and multiple
excavations at the site. There's been no human remains found.
So this wasn't a I keep stressing, this wasn't nobody

(01:16:57):
lived here, This wasn't a I mean, this was a
you know, you go to it and you you know, yeah,
we yeah, it's like a shopping mall.

Speaker 1 (01:17:06):
Well, so basically, just to put this into modern perspective
and youse sci fi the jargon that almost everybody would understand,
this is the promenade of DS nine, right pretty much.

Speaker 7 (01:17:17):
But yeah, so another unknown tribe moved into the region.
They built their own mound, but that was stuck around
for a little bit and then they took off too.

Speaker 1 (01:17:27):
I just I wish there was people that you know,
I wish the oral traditions would have survived because I
would love to ask them, Hey, did anybody happen to
carve the word crow atoin anywhere before these people disappeared?

Speaker 7 (01:17:39):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:17:41):
Maybe this disappearing colonies things been going on a lot
longer than we thought. I'm just yeah.

Speaker 7 (01:17:51):
Anyway, yeah, so yeah, so yeah, it's just another one
of those who where'd they go? And that's even you know,
for several hundred years the site was used and then
again they just all up and vanished, no trace. Nobody
knows where they went. But with it not being a

(01:18:13):
huge city so much as just a trade hub, it
seems like why did it suddenly become inconvenient.

Speaker 1 (01:18:24):
To use it? So yeah, I mean maybe there was
some sort of an extended drought or something. I don't
know that.

Speaker 7 (01:18:34):
I mean, the Mississippi moved, you know, new matdresses moved
the Mississippi a few times.

Speaker 1 (01:18:41):
In that timeframe, so maybe.

Speaker 7 (01:18:44):
I just I mean, I mean it the Bayou was
much more of a significant waterway at that time than
it is now, so that may be part of it too.

Speaker 1 (01:18:57):
But still, I mean, this was a huge deal, huge
to use them to use to use the modern you know, inflection.
Now it had to be done, had to be done.

Speaker 7 (01:19:15):
So where you want to go next?

Speaker 18 (01:19:18):
Ah?

Speaker 1 (01:19:19):
Well, I mean we could always want ahead to we
you know, you want to head to Ohio.

Speaker 7 (01:19:23):
Next, Newark, Ohio, back to Ohio, as Christy Hines used
to sing, back to Ohio.

Speaker 1 (01:19:33):
First of all, I was unaware there was a Newark, Ohio.
I was like in the New Jersey.

Speaker 7 (01:19:38):
Yeah, I kept yeah, that's what I was doing the
research on that too. I just I kept putting New
Jersey in my head and would have to correct myself Newark,
Ohio because we needed another one of those.

Speaker 1 (01:19:48):
Yeah, I mean, you know, Newark, New Jersey wasn't bad enough.
Neither nothing other one anyway. So yeah, this is we're
we're currently traveling into Newark, Ohio for in And this
was the eighteen sixties find of the Newark Holy Stones.
They were carved stones with what appeared to be he

(01:20:08):
were like text. So if you're if you're wanting to
try to visualize those, if you know, if you've heard
anything about the Decalogue Stone with the Ten Commandments and
the Keystone artifact, yeah, that's kind of what they would
look like.

Speaker 7 (01:20:22):
Yeah, the the uh, the discovery of these See something
else that was all the rage at the time was
the Lost tribe of Israel, and a lot of people said, well,
of course they went to America, and so there was
a lot of excavation looking specifically for that, because just

(01:20:43):
like with today, sometimes scientists go into it with an agenda,
and in this case, yeah, these artifacts discovered by David Wirik.
He it was another one of those See now, this
is one of those things that's like did he go

(01:21:05):
there looking specifically for that? It's one of those you know,
cart before the horse thing. You know, it's was he
out to specifically prove that or did he just happen
to have that interest? You know, that that that meeting
of you know, when when your hobby finds you know

(01:21:26):
exactly what it's looking for, you know, when you find
that perfect moment in your hobby. Now, some of these
are considered hoaxes.

Speaker 16 (01:21:35):
Some things are not.

Speaker 7 (01:21:39):
They can't be proven to be hoaxes, or they more specifically,
they can't be disproven to be Hebrew and origin.

Speaker 1 (01:21:51):
Yeah, I mean, well it's actually it's kind of a
bit of a showdown because there's believers that they improved
the trans transatlantic contact contact, but a lot of critics
call it a nineteenth century fake, maybe a prank or scam.
But again, there's no real final answer even now because
some of them seemed a little shady, some of them
really can't be disproven. But I just I and again,

(01:22:15):
I know this isn't you know, part of the actual topic,
but the whole thirteenth Trap of Israel kind of thing
just again brought me back to Battle Star Galactica. All
this has happened before, and it will all happen again.
But but yeah, so what what if it's real?

Speaker 7 (01:22:31):
Though?

Speaker 1 (01:22:32):
What if this is in fact ancient travelers from you know,
I mean, we already know this has happened once. You know,
the everybody that everybody calls native came over from a
land bridge hundreds of at least tens of thousands of
years ago.

Speaker 7 (01:22:46):
So and it's believed that the Chinese were in California
in you know, the eleven hundreds. So again, I'm not
just talking about that TV show Marko Pole that was
on Netflix, and that was actually really good show, by
the way, But yeah, this, uh, you know, in the context,
this is part of the Lost Tribes theory. One of

(01:23:07):
the things that makes it. While I said that you
know they could be proven to be hoax, they were,
and this it's actually been well documented that you know,
dovetail to the excavation also excavated at the site is
that these artifacts were found under a wood burial platform,

(01:23:30):
whether it's specifically where the decalog stone was found. And
that's why the decalogue stone is the one that they
can't actually prove may have been a hoax. See and
the carbon testing on this this wooden burial platform is
right around the time of the Hopwell Indians when they
built this mount So it's a two foot diameter I mean,

(01:23:52):
the size of the piece means what have come from
a two foot diameter oak tree, and so that would
have meant that the burial itself was several decades after
it but still not within the timeframe of the eighteen fifties.
So that's why you know, there's some credibility and some

(01:24:15):
not on these artifacts.

Speaker 1 (01:24:20):
Yeah, I don't know. I want to believe it's real
because I think it would be cool to think about,
you know, an ancient Hebrew tribe traveling around the world,
you know, and you know, telling the Italians to suck
it or the Spanish in this case, since technically they
were the ones that funded it, right, And yes, I
know Christopher Columbus was Italian, but it was a Spanish

(01:24:40):
that funded it.

Speaker 7 (01:24:42):
Yeah, but it's weird too because I mean, again, you
go to that one guy on Twitter who did the
whole Yeah, you know, Spain was eighty percent Muslim until
they got driven out by the Christian They got driven
out around the same time that Columbus was able to
you know, Convince Isabelle. Hey, uh, you want to find me.

Speaker 1 (01:25:02):
So so well, that's because there's an alternate history of
the real reason why Columbus was commissioned in the first
place was to find a way to you know, get
over to and basically this is one of the things
that nobody talks about anymore. There's actually an alternate history
where he was actually being used to find new routes

(01:25:25):
to get back to where the Muslims came from so
they could be basically attacked on their homelands.

Speaker 4 (01:25:31):
And then.

Speaker 1 (01:25:33):
Yeah, so probably another reason why there was a weird
coincidence there, weird little coinketing and I don't believe in them.

Speaker 7 (01:25:41):
So anyway, getting back to some of the stones were
written in modern Hebrew, so yeah, that's kind of like
all right, but the decalogue and a couple of the
others weren't. And that's why there's mixed feelings about these artifacts.

Speaker 1 (01:26:05):
Well, I mean, and some of them may have very
well been hoaxes. I mean, you think about the time frame.
This is again, you know when this stuff was discovered.
This was around the same time. I mean, this was
within what a few years of the whole thing with
the giants being found, So, I mean, this is not
uncommon for people to go.

Speaker 7 (01:26:23):
It was also the kind of pilt down man, So
you know, it's it's I mean, there's scientific hoaxes today.
We call it climate change, so.

Speaker 1 (01:26:37):
Not that it's really a joke, because it's the truth.

Speaker 7 (01:26:40):
I still keep joking, but I'm not.

Speaker 1 (01:26:43):
I still keep laughing about the whole thing with the
Antarctic ice and there are all the scientists are like,
we don't understand why it's actually getting bigger.

Speaker 7 (01:26:54):
Oh, I can tell you.

Speaker 1 (01:26:56):
Were you were you rubbing it just right? Maybe? Sorry?

Speaker 7 (01:27:02):
Oh, Giggy on that one.

Speaker 1 (01:27:05):
I know rules, I have to do it.

Speaker 7 (01:27:07):
I have to, that's the rule.

Speaker 1 (01:27:09):
Giggy, Giggy giggley goo there. I followed the rule. Yeah
you know, there we go.

Speaker 27 (01:27:15):
Yes, I am so bottomly Brea can come back with
rowan oak Yep, yep, yep. Right, all right, folks, that's
gonna do it for this part of the show. We've
got one more segment coming after the break. And again,
just for fun, I found something that might be a
little more akin to what we're talking about. I couldn't
really come up with anything from the actual time period,

(01:27:35):
because you know, nobody really knows, but I thought this
would be cool, so and all much is probably gonna
yell about it, and that's half my job is to
make you yell at me about at least one of
my music selections every show.

Speaker 1 (01:27:45):
So we'll be back.

Speaker 17 (01:27:47):
Stay tuned, sea.

Speaker 5 (01:29:22):
Me well, all right, all right, all right, folks, welcome

(01:31:22):
back in.

Speaker 1 (01:31:23):
And apparently I didn't even chat liked my music selection.
I like my native American when flo music. Y'all can
suck it. Anyway, we're back, We're live, and yes that's
actually for my personal collections. Every single one of you
can just anyway, we're back.

Speaker 7 (01:31:36):
I don't know why you thought I'd be mad about it.
I totally vibes with the show. But if I could
be honest for a minute, it sounded exactly like me
circing nineteen eighty four when I got my first cassio
keyboard from Radio Shack and I was just testing out tones.

Speaker 1 (01:31:55):
Same I'm not gonna lie.

Speaker 7 (01:31:57):
I was like, some of them, really, it's just saying
they're just think random keys. You know, Oh, hey, these
two sound good together. But no, I'm vibing with it.
It's cool.

Speaker 1 (01:32:10):
Yeah, no, I didn't know if you'd like it or not.
I was just being a smart act. But then all
the chats started chiming in. Yeah, it's hippie crap. It
sounds like whales mating, and I'm like, yeah, this is
actual music. I like, so, y'all can suck it. Anyway.

Speaker 7 (01:32:22):
It's it's very it's very relaxing. I was cool with it.
It goes with my tea and Brandy and Amaretto.

Speaker 1 (01:32:28):
It's actually some of the stuff I listened to when
during during the you know, if if I finally just
you decide I've had enough with TV, I'll turn off
the TV and turn that on. So yeah, anyway, there's
like two hours of it and it loops, so it's
kind of cool.

Speaker 7 (01:32:44):
It's like a ten hour loop if you are a
pirate pretty much.

Speaker 1 (01:32:48):
Yeah, more like Anya maybe eh never really wasn't really
it's like.

Speaker 7 (01:32:56):
The third time Anya, or you know, than that, it's
like a fifth time NYA or by extension, l A
story that Anya was featured prominently in, has come up
in like the last week, which is funny because Vincent
Charles and Janelle Wahs and I did a breakdown of
l A story like about a month ago.

Speaker 1 (01:33:15):
So that's funny.

Speaker 7 (01:33:18):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:33:20):
All right, so we've got one more mysterious disappearance to
go into before we call it a nights there and.

Speaker 7 (01:33:28):
Yeah, this one's one everybody knows, or at least should.
I mean, this is one of those great American mysteries.
It's it's just so American. Yeah, I mean, even though
it was British, it's it's it's Americana. It's it's one
of our first real mysteries as a country.

Speaker 1 (01:33:48):
And you know, the the sci fi series Haven, based
on a Stephen kingbook, tried to explain it to that
was pretty cool.

Speaker 7 (01:33:57):
Yeah, which is weird because that took place in Maine.
And yeah, and the Rono Colony was a.

Speaker 1 (01:34:11):
Yeah North which South. Yeah, North, it's in the air
in the region of North Carolina. Again, this was fifteen
eighty seven, so this is, you know, almost one hundred
years after Columbus discovered and you could probably make out
the air quotes the Americas. So English settlers started a

(01:34:33):
colony and then by fifteen ninety just gone, just gone.
And the only trace they were ever even there was
the word crow too and carved on a post and
I've actually seen it depicted as a tree too, so
I'm not sure if it was a tree are a post, but.

Speaker 7 (01:34:51):
Yeah, I've heard both. And then you also had the
Darristones that were found, which are u some of them
are believed to be hoaxed of some of them not
where Eleanor Dare which was John White's daughter, he was
the founder of the colony. They were found looking for him.

Speaker 18 (01:35:11):
Uh.

Speaker 7 (01:35:12):
It was stories that can that tells the tale of
their fates and the colonists and you know frisky ancdotes
between her and her father and then that's about it too.
But uh, yeah, they they just up in bed.

Speaker 16 (01:35:29):
No, there was a lot.

Speaker 7 (01:35:30):
I mean it the story we're all told, you know,
it makes it just sound like you know, oh hey,
here's this little fork colony, and then all of a
sudden there wasn't ye when it finally disappeared. This was
the third trip of White John White to found this colony.

Speaker 18 (01:35:50):
And.

Speaker 7 (01:35:52):
I gotta say, and a lot of it the English
were just being English in it, where it's like, you know,
they depend on the local tribes for food for survival,
and then you know, it's like in one instance, they
went up to one of the native villages and yeah,
everybody had a great time. They ate meat, they drank wine,

(01:36:13):
and then they started to go back to the colony
and one of them realized one of their cups was missing,
so they went back, evacuated the village and burned it
to the ground. So you know, it's not to say
that these were just you know, you know, a bunch
of homesteaders. You know, this was the British being the British,
this colonial British being colonial British. They did this everywhere

(01:36:34):
around the world.

Speaker 2 (01:36:34):
So.

Speaker 1 (01:36:37):
I mean, let's not forget this was that the height
of the height of their power too. I mean, this
is when Britain basically ruled the world. So just the
idea that one of their you know, colony policements would
just vanish. And there's just so much speculation about what
may have happened to them too. Did they run out
of food and starved? Did they did they blend in

(01:36:57):
with a native population to serve I've after they ran
out of food.

Speaker 7 (01:37:04):
There were no bodies found.

Speaker 1 (01:37:06):
Because everybody says the word crow and town corresponds to
a nearby tribe. But I don't, I don't know if
I buy that.

Speaker 7 (01:37:16):
Yeah, and you know, and a lot of this too.
It's I mean, you know, it's this whole colony was
just plagued with misfortune from the beginning.

Speaker 18 (01:37:27):
You know.

Speaker 7 (01:37:27):
It's like and on the second on the second sailing there,
you know, because the first time it went off great.
They met the local tribes, they set up some stuff,
they went back, they took a couple of the local
tribesmen with them, taught them English, they taught them their language,
and you know, the the you know, the Native Americans

(01:37:49):
were you know, quite the celebrities in England. So it
wasn't until the third voyage when they came back when
things really started going south, because that's when the British
started to become British. But it's I mean, the second
trip back again this point, they were supposed to go

(01:38:11):
back to get more supplies to come back and help
out the colony. And to put this into historical context,
they weren't able to return for two years because of
the Spanish armada. And in the way back, Drake came
with the expedition, you know, to protect the expedition to
come back, and the ship that was good that they

(01:38:32):
were going to leave with the colonists was damaged in
a hurricane, so they weren't going to leave another one.
So they said, okay, you know, anybody who wants to
come back and come back. You know, some people stayed,
and then they said, okay, we're going to come back
another time. And then when they came back, when John
White came back, his daughter who was pregnant at the time,

(01:38:53):
and the first English baby born in the Americas, they
had all disappeared.

Speaker 1 (01:39:02):
See well, that's that's another part of it though, because
think about that for a second. You know, the first
baby born to the English colonials in America vanished for
the I don't know, the more the more we talk
about this, the more it's just turning in to get
another head scratcher for me because because again, let's let's
say they went off and blended in with another tribe.

(01:39:25):
You're saying at some point they wouldn't have tried to,
you know, reach out to somebody, anybody Bueler, Well, right, I.

Speaker 7 (01:39:32):
Mean at some point. I mean, because it's believed now,
I mean as recently as nineteen ninety eight. It's believed
that they went and joined up with the uh, the
Hatteras tribe, but there was no artifacts with the I mean, yeah,
the Hatter's tribe had some artifacts that showed that they

(01:39:52):
had done trade with you know, the English around that time,
but nothing that would show concise ownership to the colonists themselves.
You know, a lot of stuff that was going on
at the time too. It is like the first tribe
that they met that they were pretty local and friendly with,
they had an enemy tribe on the other side of
the Potomac, and as things started to sour with the

(01:40:15):
local tribes, It's rumored that the chieftain of the first
tribe actually changed his name to be the ever Watchful
because that to show his distrust for the English, and
apparently tried to set up because the other tribe was
much more militaristic and a little more xenophobic, tried to

(01:40:39):
set up a meeting where the English would be wiped
out with them by them. So again, people suck everywhere
all the time.

Speaker 1 (01:40:53):
The one part of humanity that is true. Everyone sucks
everywhere all the time.

Speaker 7 (01:40:59):
People were bad idea.

Speaker 1 (01:41:01):
And yes, I just did a riff on a movie title.
I don't really care.

Speaker 7 (01:41:03):
Yeah, people one out of ten would not recommend.

Speaker 1 (01:41:10):
But no, I just you know, again, just all of
these things, this one probably because it's the it's the
more recent that this one is the one that's still
you know again, let's just assume, all things being equal,
that they did, in fact, you know, for whatever reason,
go join an indigenous tribe. You know, maybe they had

(01:41:31):
a really rough winter, ran out of food or something,
and went and hung out with them to survive. What
happened to them after that? Why is there why? I mean,
it's not like there weren't other English colonies later, you know,
That's what I'm saying.

Speaker 7 (01:41:47):
But within one hundred years you have widespread English colonization
up and down the eastern Syboard. At no point nobody
encountered the Hatters tribe and they said, hey, we got
some of your boys here, or the descend is some
of your boys here, they're they're they're with us now.
But still you know you notice the you know, the
blue hair and the penchant for tea. Yeah, these guys.

Speaker 1 (01:42:10):
Yeah, what's up with all these piercings? Kidding? Yeah, anyway,
but no, it's just again, you know, I don't know.

Speaker 18 (01:42:21):
Well.

Speaker 1 (01:42:21):
The other thing is keep in mind that if people
didn't really just join tribes, they were usually conquered, right.
If they were, in fact, you know, drug off, it
probably wasn't any type of a willing thing. Because this
is and not to get too far into history business,

(01:42:41):
that's basically what this show's about today anyway or tonight.
This is one of the things that isn't taught about
American history, especially anymore, because you know, the the English
or the bad people. Nobody wants to talk about the
fact that the the the original folks who broke the
treaty were the indigenous because Christianity was starting to influence

(01:43:02):
the way that they live their daily lives, because we
had become so intertwined with one another, and the chiefs
of the individual tribes didn't like that, because their whole
we liked to rape and kill and pillage our enemies.
Thing was antithetical to what the tribes were starting to
learn as far as Christian ideology. So they're the ones
that you know, used basically their version of conservatism. We're

(01:43:25):
going to say things how they are now, and we're
gonna go kill all the white people. So yeah, that
was them, not us. That was them. So I would
I would, knowing that, I would be hesitant to believe
that this was some sort of a willing blending, which
might explain why they didn't, you know, when they made
friends with the next group. Maybe why when they started

(01:43:46):
making friends with the next group, why they didn't say, hey,
look what we did in the last group.

Speaker 7 (01:43:51):
Right, Yeah, yeah, well you got a lot more guns
this time. That's we gotta talk about that. Yeah, I mean,
well we've been talking about the impressiveness of the native culture,
you know, for the last three thousand years up till
when it just suddenly, for some reason, all just stopped.

Speaker 1 (01:44:11):
Yeah.

Speaker 7 (01:44:11):
I don't don't think that we're trying to push the
noble savage meme. We're not. I mean, that's God, that's
just so racist. It's I mean, people were the same
everywhere and you know, the Native American tribes were every
bit the you know, the fuck heads slavers, and you

(01:44:33):
know they killed too. They weren't all you know kumbay a.
You know, it's like what God eventually got me blocked
from Lakota man. You know, when he was talking about, oh,
you're on you know, stolen land, I'm like, okay, does
that mean that you're gonna give your the Black Hills
back to the Chikawah?

Speaker 1 (01:44:54):
No, show me exactly what I was just talking about.
And let's not forget that his ancestors came over on
a land bridge. Who knows who was already here that
they conquered.

Speaker 16 (01:45:06):
See, And that's just it too.

Speaker 7 (01:45:08):
I mean, there's not a lot of evidence of pre Clovis,
I mean, but they're starting to become more of a
pre Clovis cultures and that's really a show we got
to do too. But uh yeah, it's the earlier tribal

(01:45:31):
you know is I mean, we're sitting here in awe
of these giant earthworks that are two thousand and three
thousand years old that you know, we knew nothing, really
knew nothing about, you know, and like, wow, these you know,
these were metropolitan areas the size of London. If you
go back further, you're really talking hunter gatherer. I mean,
you know that's unless they had civilizations that rivaled, you know,

(01:45:58):
Mesopotamian at the time, then you're not going to find
a lot of evidence of them. So what you need
to do is find just happened. Is you have to
have a Lucy moment, you know, you know what I'm
talking about with Lucy with the uh, you know, one
of the first Homo sapiens that remains that we're found.

(01:46:20):
You kind of have to you have you have to
stumble across one of those.

Speaker 1 (01:46:24):
Yeah. No, I mean you're you're not wrong, but I
mean it's just the more we look into this stuff,
the more it's just you know, when you think about it,
and you know, back to the whole Lakota man thing again,
the if you really want to get down to it,
no one is indigenous anywhere unless you talk about the
land between two rivers, Because as far as we know,

(01:46:46):
that's pretty much where we all came from, and it's
it's been born out through archaeological studies, et cetera. We
kind of spread out from there, so that's really where
everybody was indigenous to everything. After that, we were just kind.

Speaker 7 (01:46:59):
Of alley in Africa. Yeah, I mean, if you you
really want to go back, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:47:06):
Yeah, but yeah, I mean you know so, I mean,
but yeah, I mean that. But either way, there's really
only a couple of different places that anybody could be
considered indigenous to or from, because we did just kind
of start spreading out everywhere, Which is another reason why
I think the idea of the thirteenth trave of Israel
basically winding up in the America is a cool little

(01:47:26):
subtext because it's just you know, again amazing to think about.
For that time period.

Speaker 7 (01:47:34):
It's not implausible. I mean, you know, is look at
the Polynesian island hoppers, you know, I mean, they they were,
you know, aside from you know, being skilled semen, weren't
really yeah I did it to myself on that one too.

(01:47:56):
Really weren't you know, much higher than you know, society
wise then you know, any other native culture around the time.

Speaker 1 (01:48:06):
Yeah. Yeah, we they really need to with with as
far as society has fallen. They need to come up
with another word for that term, because yeah, I'm just
saying it's it's like it's like, uh.

Speaker 7 (01:48:21):
The bit that Jeff puts on Lost Wanderer from Futurama.
As long as the movie smell the Klingons near Uranus,
I don't get it. Yeah, they changed the name of
that planet to your rectum joke.

Speaker 16 (01:48:36):
Uh yeah.

Speaker 7 (01:48:39):
That was uh wow, that two hours just flew.

Speaker 1 (01:48:44):
That was It was a fun little tour. Though it
was a tour.

Speaker 16 (01:48:49):
It was a two hours which is funny.

Speaker 7 (01:48:52):
I mean, being absolutely bullied by AI into this topic.

Speaker 1 (01:48:57):
That that was the funniest part because I started because
I started looking at stuff today and then I got
sidetracked dealing with other stuff, and then you started showing
me this stuff that you were coming up with, and
I was like, uh, I kind of wound up going
in a different direction that you're like, well, I didn't
really go with this direction either. Chad Gpt was like,
here's all your stuff.

Speaker 7 (01:49:18):
Yeah, you know, it's like I said, I just used
the mound builders as an example of a civilization, you know,
and we were going to touch on globals and it
was just funny how it's just it just hit on
mound builders and just said okay, here's here's here's a
bunch of stuff. Narrow it down and I'm like, well, fuck,

(01:49:39):
it looks like we're going to America tonight. Boys.

Speaker 16 (01:49:42):
So but it was cool.

Speaker 7 (01:49:43):
It's, like I said, doing doing the research for this,
half of these I had never even heard of, never
even heard of. And it really, I mean, I don't
want to say it. I mean, yeah, I'll say it.
It changed my opinion of Native American society. Up until
probably about thirteen hundreds, everything I knew about Native American

(01:50:05):
society has been completely turned on this year.

Speaker 1 (01:50:09):
And again, what what caused the shift that? That's that's
the part that now now I want to do a
deep dive. I won't have time for a few days,
but I'm probably gonna start. I'm gonna see if I
can break rock again.

Speaker 7 (01:50:20):
Yeah, I think I'm Yeah, I'm gonna I'm gonna fire
them both up and see what they both come up with.
Both like, there's only two Ais, but well there's only
there's a Microsoft. I've got broken lenks for Copilot kind
I only use Copilot for solving Microsoft problems.

Speaker 1 (01:50:35):
But there's only two. There's only two that matter because
the rest of them aren't trashing.

Speaker 7 (01:50:39):
Which I don't know if you saw it too. In
the header I used GPT four point five for this one.

Speaker 1 (01:50:47):
I did not, but yeah, it was definitely it's definitely
an improvement. So, yeah, do you realize we've got like
almost eight hundred people hanging out with us right now?

Speaker 7 (01:50:55):
That's awesome. Remember we had twelve and we were stoked, I.

Speaker 1 (01:51:02):
Know, right, But that was just weird because I was
all expected the numbers to be low because normally, you know,
the bump stocks start and then everybody hangs out after them,
and we're getting about the same number we would normally get.
So that makes you happy, and there's there's a lot
of people.

Speaker 7 (01:51:18):
There everyone for indulging us on this little tour through
American history.

Speaker 1 (01:51:22):
Well, we're also currently at least on my X number
one on X, so a lot of other people are
starting to stream in and they're about to be disappointed
with one of the ast seven.

Speaker 7 (01:51:30):
Minutes later, it's over. Sorry, guys, why are you still
two hours ago? We had the meat?

Speaker 1 (01:51:39):
Yeah you know, but no, thank you for stopping by,
even if you've only been here for a few minutes. There.
We'll be a replay available as soon as this ends,
so if you if you do want to check it out,
you can the podcast version will be up sometime tomorrow.
I'm behind on that stuff because I've been doing a
lot of consoling and stuff today, which was on the
list of things that I was going to do today.
But when you get three different phone calls from three

(01:51:59):
different people about death and families and like, anyway, it's been,
it's been in and then you know all the stuff
going on with our own crews and everywhere else, I'm
just like really all at once, really really really And
then my one of my really dear friends lost her
mom around the same time, like a year ago, so

(01:52:20):
that that's that's been hard. She's not doing well. Yeah,
fun I would say fun times, but it's really not.
But anyway, so what you want to start the apocrypha
thing in two weeks? I think we could probably let's
do that.

Speaker 7 (01:52:37):
But let's do that because it's I can't remember where
I actually stumbled across at the first time. Oh no,
it was when we were uh, you know, the topic
you you dropped for us to put in, for us
to put into tonight with the ship the uh John Wayne,
come on, come on, brain brains, start braining. The voyage manuscript.

(01:53:02):
So when we when we did that years ago, I
remember when I stumbling across that. It was when I
stumbled across the Book of Judas, and that was when
we started talking about doing an apocrypher show, you know,
the stuff that isn't in the Bible. So yeah, let's

(01:53:23):
do that.

Speaker 1 (01:53:25):
Well, I mean, you know, apocrypha is not just about that.
I mean there's like also there's also like ancient Judeus
texts that aren't really that are considered frowned upon these
days too, And funny doing the show with Korn, those
come up a lot when we're talking. Yeah, So, speaking

(01:53:45):
of which, there will be a new version. There will
be a new episode of that show tomorrow. It will
not be I mean, and it will run as live,
but it was pre recorded because he's currently hanging out
in Paris, which I thought was cool. I don't know
the time difference. I almost texted it to see if
he was anywhere in the area where like a bunch
of Christians took o repairs today. I thought that was
kind of cool. You know, that's what's happening in Europe. Meanwhile,

(01:54:08):
we have people trying to you know, stop the police.

Speaker 7 (01:54:14):
Well, I don't know if you saw while we're talking
about the Yeah, the LA Riots. One of the LA
Scanner sites popped up with you know, massive looting at
A seven eleven, and I said, okay, it's not gonna
be a rooftop Korean this time. It's going to be
Seek Rooftop seeks.

Speaker 16 (01:54:33):
No Usic the dooth.

Speaker 1 (01:54:35):
Oh.

Speaker 7 (01:54:38):
So anyway, you want me to go first because it's shorter.

Speaker 1 (01:54:42):
You're gonna say you might as well go for first
anymore because yours is shorter, and that way hopefully.

Speaker 7 (01:54:48):
I remember when I used to have ten shows on
this network too. Yeah, you can find me as an
artis packered on Twitter. Surprisingly still though there was a
hiccup this week, you can find me. Let's see, we
don't have a Manorama on Tuesday. You can find me
Wednesday again with you on Rick and Ordy. Thursday you
can find me on the Culture Shift with Brad Sliger.

(01:55:08):
And I think that's it for this week.

Speaker 1 (01:55:13):
Actually, I think we don't. We have a pretty sure
we have a toxic this week.

Speaker 7 (01:55:20):
Is this a toxic week? It is a toxic week,
So yeah, you've got to We've got Toxic Masculinity on
Wednesday as well with you Me, g Aggie Andrew and.

Speaker 1 (01:55:34):
Yeah, because I almost thought about seeing if Jeff and
everybody wanted to do like a hangout on Tuesday night
since we don't really have Manorama, but I was like, yeah,
we're already doing Toxic on Wednesday though.

Speaker 7 (01:55:45):
Yeah, yeah, the one that's actually in the top one
man shows. Done, done, done, shots fired, Love you, Steve, Okay,
yeah that's me. How about you, working people? Oh yeah
that's me, Working people. Find more of your shenanigans.

Speaker 1 (01:56:02):
Well, I'll be running the feed tomorrow night for Corn's
reading Room, and make sure you guys join us for that.
That's at seven pm Eastern. Then I'm off for the
rest of the night. Monday night, I'll be back doing
the America Off the Rail show usually around ten pm Eastern,
usually the lead off before we hand off to our
SHR friends on Monday Night. Our SHR friends are Sean
Lewis for Edge of Liberty Tuesday night. No man Aramas,

(01:56:25):
So I guess I am off off, which means I
could do some writing that evening. But Tuesday Day is
my Monday for the Rick Robinson Show. That is Tuesday
through Friday now ten to one Eastern and on Fridays
last hour. Brad Schlager from Town Hall and Red State
hangs out with me for the hour. We talk about
all the cool stuff for the news. With what's been

(01:56:45):
happening this weekend, I expect that show will be extra fun.
And then Wednesday night, of course, usually this is my
America Off the Rails week, so we'll actually have two
of those this week, and then producing for and being
part of Toxic Masculinity, and then usually Behind the Enemy Lines,
which I'm usually simulcasting. Then it's me and you at

(01:57:08):
ten o'clock, and then after that we head over to
our shr media crew depending on who's available, and I'm
usually working until about one or two in the morning.
And then Thursday night, Jen's been on vacation, but I'm
gonna try to touch base with her this week see
if she's ready to bring Gen and Rick back. And
then Friday night we will see because Aggie's been off
dealing with family related kind of stuff, so I don't know.

(01:57:32):
We'll either have he Said, She Said, a Dude bro
or maybe even another edition of the Watering Hole, depending
on how things pan out. Other than that, I also
contributed to Twitchy the Loftest Party, as well as occasionally
Misfits Politics, and I also produced a Loftest Friday podcast
which drops on Tuesdays. And Yes, in case you're new
around here, my name is Rick and I'm a workaholic.

(01:57:54):
My last meeting was for anever ago.

Speaker 7 (01:57:56):
Hey, real quick, just we were all talking about it
last week. Everybody, listen, listen to Kale right on Sundays.
We've got so many shows that are now it's actually
become our biggest day. Between the Vincent Project show every
other week, you've got Korn's Reading Room, You've got Jeff
with Lost Wanderer or In the Crease, and you've got
Sunday Nights with Alan Ray. It's just become four or

(01:58:19):
five hours of just damn good.

Speaker 1 (01:58:22):
Shows, absolute fun, and I'm glad to be a part
of it, even if usually on nine and I'm just
pushing buttons for somebody else. Also, Jeff, if you can
send me a commercial for In the Crease, that would
be great, so that way I don't keep promoting the
wrong show on the wrong weeks. Yeah, I'm sure you
have one and I don't have one.

Speaker 7 (01:58:41):
So if I have one put together by the time
we wrap up this show in three.

Speaker 1 (01:58:49):
Two one, all right, folks, that's it. It has been
an absolute blast. Again, want to think the over eight
hundred of you now that have been hanging out with us,
if you just here, I know you're like, we just
found you. It's fine. The replay will start again in
a minute, or if you prefer, just an audio only
version that you can basically have in your pocket, that'll
be available tomorrow everywhere you can find podcasts. So again,

(01:59:13):
thanks everybody for hanging out with us. But I'm gonna
call it a night because I have church in the morning.

Speaker 7 (01:59:18):
So okay, I don't.

Speaker 1 (01:59:24):
It's because you're a heathen, but I still love you.
No hailing of the Hydra. We've had this discussion.

Speaker 7 (01:59:32):
Hail them