Juxtober Episode 2 -- 10-11-25 WHEN WATER LOOKS BACK - Champ, Ogopogo, Tahoe rumors & bayou eyes. - Juxtapostion

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (05:22):
This, and Happy Saturday Night, America. Welcome into Juxtaposition. I
am Rick Robinson, he is the Amish one, and you

(05:43):
are listening to us live right here on KLIN Radio
Dot Comedy is Spooky Season. We are into week two,
so jux Tober, episode two, and we're gonna be talking
about all the things that hide from you under the water.
Did something didn't make some of you very, very afraid
because that it's it's that time of the year. How
you doing, I'm sure how you doing?

Speaker 10 (06:06):
You know I have a healthy respect for the water,
not a fear. But yeah, the deeper the water, the
the more my respect increases.

Speaker 7 (06:19):
You know.

Speaker 1 (06:19):
If I could figure out how to make the guy
on the image that is facing the camera that looks
like me's lipsmooth, that would do almost perfect. Because you're
you're not facing us. I wouldn't have to worry.

Speaker 10 (06:28):
About that with you. Yeah, no, I dig the image.
Good work on that.

Speaker 1 (06:32):
Oh, it's it was. It was a labor of love.
It took a minute I almost I almost told GPT.
Yeah a couple of times.

Speaker 10 (06:41):
Well, I mean you saw my I don't know how
that got copied on my clipboard when I dropped it
in the the Oh yeah, I saw the play production
chat and uh yeah with me yelling at GPT. It
took me six fucking days to make the banner on
my Twitter account because just when it would get right

(07:01):
there and I just like want to change one more thing,
it had fuck everything up and then it would get
ingrained in the memory. So that way I would have
to like delete the chat and like do something else
in GPT for a few hours and then start over. Yeah. Yeah,
GPT could be a bastard when it comes damage generation.

(07:22):
It's still better than rock I was gonna say.

Speaker 1 (07:24):
It's still better than GROC. And it's detail. I mean,
I don't know how well you can see it, but
I actually even got it to put our logo on
the coffee.

Speaker 10 (07:31):
Gup, No, I see that. That's awesome. Yeah, I used
to stay in the square around calor ends account rather
than the circle. That's that's awesome.

Speaker 1 (07:42):
Yeah, it's it's disorienting to see. The least I've missed
a couple of was it. Wait a minute, Oh wait,
that is us.

Speaker 10 (07:48):
Yeah, there were these guys. They're super cool. Oh wait,
that's us. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (07:53):
By the end of last Saturday Night, because I think
that was one of the first nights that showed up
as the gold there were there, we were like getting them.
We were number two out of the top three, and
all of them were gold badges at first, so at
first I was like, we didn't even make the top three,
and then I realized one of them was us, was like,
oh never mind, yeah, no.

Speaker 10 (08:16):
Again, thank you to whoever did that. That's awesome that
you gave us a month trial with a gold check.
We'll see if it's worth keeping.

Speaker 1 (08:24):
Yeah, hopefully we can stretch it into at least two
because so far it's done some interesting things, like I
think this may be part of the reason why we're
getting more noticed on Speaker. I don't exactly know how
they're doing it.

Speaker 10 (08:36):
No, Jeff dug into that it's, uh, it's not organic,
and it's all coming out of Brazil and it's really
old shows like Jessic's Coffee Room and shit.

Speaker 1 (08:47):
Well yeah, but I'm just trying to figure out where
that would have even come from. Because it started around
the same time that we got the gold check.

Speaker 10 (08:52):
Yeah, that's true, that's weird.

Speaker 1 (08:54):
So yeah, I mean the first thing I was thinking
of it because because you know, we're under review for
Prime and they're like, with some of the activity, we
don't know if we're gonna be able to put you
up there, Like, if you can't do it, that's fine,
just let me know. And then the more I dug
into it, I was like, if you guys think I'm
paying to promote shows that don't exist anymore, you may
be dumber than I am. I'm just saying, these are
really old shows. Why would I do that?

Speaker 10 (09:15):
Having Justin's Coffee Room The last time that Aaron on
kler End was seven years ago.

Speaker 1 (09:20):
M M yeah, pretty close.

Speaker 10 (09:23):
Because I was around the time that I started podcasting.

Speaker 1 (09:25):
So yeah, you know, I've even noticed food Bar has
been getting some Brazilian attention, so I don't know what's
going on with that either.

Speaker 10 (09:31):
But yeah, unlike us, juxtaposition is huge in Trinidad and Tobago, right,
not looking that up.

Speaker 3 (09:40):
Oh, so.

Speaker 1 (09:43):
You know, last week's episode was really fun and actually
we got that was we got something. We actually did
get some legitimate well organic let's not say, illegitimate but
organic speaker attention off of that one. So I was
kind of happy about that.

Speaker 10 (09:57):
So that's great, No, I you know, I love Juxto,
I really do. It's you know, the whole station gets
behind it and uh and we get to do a
really deep dive into a topic. So you know, this
is like our super primer for shows. Things we talked
about on the show.

Speaker 4 (10:16):
Yep.

Speaker 10 (10:17):
Yeah. Yeah, So last week was The Creatures That Hunt Us,
the the Wendego's and the Cheop of Cabres and I'm
never gonna be able to hear Chepacabra again with thanks
to Aggie's book review on Monday. Oh, that would have

(10:37):
been a great keeping was that?

Speaker 1 (10:40):
That would have been a great one to have Aggie
Young camera because she would she wouldn't have needed a
ring light. Her face would have been the light.

Speaker 10 (10:47):
Yeah, she would have been going with it.

Speaker 4 (10:48):
Yeah.

Speaker 10 (10:48):
On a Spirited Books podcast she does with Jeff, her
selection was Chupacabra erotica.

Speaker 1 (10:59):
She's apparently that's like a whole subniche of erotica.

Speaker 10 (11:02):
Now, you know, I thought Amish Vampires from Outer Space
was about as niche as it could get. That's super Niche.

Speaker 1 (11:09):
I just want to point out that I think you
may have started to trend because remember, there was really
no such thing as bigfoot erotica, though you started talking
about it. It was a thing, but it wasn't a
big thing. And now there's big chupicapra erotica. I blame you.

Speaker 10 (11:24):
I mean, you know what, in fairness, it's not like
I came up with it, or I mean I was
passingly familiar with it, but that it was actually something
back about ten years ago with a Senate race in Virginia,
one of the candidates that came out that he was

(11:44):
an officiando of big foot erotica, and so that became
the topic dajure on on Fubar, and that was a
joke that carried for another couple of years as long
as we were doing that show.

Speaker 1 (11:58):
So yeah, yeah, no trust, So.

Speaker 10 (12:02):
Not directly responsible, but you know what, I'll take praise
where I can get it.

Speaker 1 (12:08):
I'm still giving you credit because I didn't even know
what it was until you mentioned a non food bars.
So I'm blaming You're so naive and sheltered. Yes this
is true, or at least you were.

Speaker 10 (12:22):
Ten years of working with me, I've just kind of
ripped that off.

Speaker 1 (12:27):
Yeah, sadly, I've noticed Aggie's not too far behind me anymore.
I remember when she used she swears.

Speaker 10 (12:32):
Now, that's a fantastic dude, like a sailor. I corrupt,
all of you sell your fault, are your fault. But
you're all good, God fearing people. Until you let me in,
until you let the fox into the henhouse.

Speaker 1 (12:48):
Yeah, well it was the worth it.

Speaker 4 (12:50):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (12:51):
So yeah, so.

Speaker 10 (12:53):
Water cryptids and there are a lot of them, some
of these even I hadn't even heard of, you know,
in the research. And I'm looking forward to digging into
him and we'll see how many of y'all y'all have
heard of. But you know what, we got to start
with a classic, you know, we got to start with
one of the oldest ones. And you know it's like,

(13:14):
that's NeSSI, you know, the oldest side witness in the
account of NeSSI isn't Scottish, it's ecclesiastical. In five sixty
five ADU Saint Columba's recorded that the saint confronted a
water beast in the river Nests, commanding it to retreat

(13:35):
in the name of God. The creature obeyed, and the
swimmer was saved, you know, and the church gained itself
a miracle. What followed later was a millennium of silence,
broken only when road builders started to cut near the
shore in nineteen thirty three, and then Ivanus gave the
public his first clear view of Lockness's dark expanse. Within months,
sightings multiplied, and you know you're going to see a

(13:58):
trend with all this, the deeper the lake, the dark
with the imagination and lake nessa was about seven hundred
and fifty feet deep. Yeah, it's yeah for a lake.

Speaker 1 (14:09):
So then the so called surgeon's photograph appeared on the
scene in the Daily Mail in nineteen thirty four. I
really thought that was just like a new website kind
of thing.

Speaker 10 (14:19):
I'm just saying they were a tabloid. They were always
a tabloid.

Speaker 1 (14:25):
So a grainy silhouette resembling a Brontosaurus head. It sold
the legend globally. At decades later, the photographer's partner admitted
it was a toy submarine rigged with wooden plastic. Still,
debunking didn't drain the myth. It diversified it when some
When sonar became available in the nineteen fifties, teams detected

(14:48):
unexplained moving targets thick bodied echoes that didn't fit known
fish signatures. In nineteen eighty seven there was an there
was there was an attempt called Operation Deep Scan that
swept the lock with twenty boats and side scan. Several
returns showed large objects pacing the vessels at six hundred feet.

(15:11):
The official line undetermined, probably debris, but it was pacing them.
I just want to bring that part back to the forefront.
It was probably debris, but somehow it was pacing them.
The public heard something is alive down there, because it
probably is.

Speaker 10 (15:29):
Yeah. Yeah. And then you know, by the late nineties,
webcabs and live streams replaced the field expeditions. You know,
tourists can now watch the locks surface twenty four hours
a day from anywhere, you know, thousands of pixelated sidings.
You know. Statistically, nessy thrives in low resolution conditions, But
in two thousand and three, researchers using hyder acoustic mapping

(15:52):
found layers of methane pockets rising from decaying vegetation. You know,
it's an elegant natural explanation, but still that doesn't coincide
with you know, the pacing of the boats, and.

Speaker 3 (16:07):
You know.

Speaker 10 (16:10):
The numer You know, it's that old UFO trope of
swamp gas. You know, it's like, you know, the lake
is exhaling the illusions.

Speaker 1 (16:21):
All right, So now let's take a little trip across
the pond Lake champlains Champ offers a mirror image. Indigenous
Abanaki spoke of a horned serpent they called to toast cock,
long before European settlers arrived. The modern legend began in

(16:42):
eighteen nineteen when Captain Crumb reported a creature about one
hundred and eighty ish feet long with a head resembling
a seahorse. Since then, around three hundred witnesses have claimed encounters.
The most famous evidence is surfaced in sometime aroundteen seventy seven,
I believe, when Sandra produced a photograph showing a long

(17:07):
necked form rising from the lake. The negative was genuine,
scale and distance were not. Still, local tourism boomed. Burlington
named its minor league baseball team the Lake Monsters. A
civic handshake between skepticism and prophet.

Speaker 10 (17:25):
You know, then you get up into BC's Lake Okanagan,
where we got the og pogo. Know this proceeds you
know both Nessie and Champ by centuries. You know, the
First Nation's legends described naa tech, a spirit demanding sacrifices

(17:46):
for safe passage across the lake. You know, settlers aglicized
the name after the British musical song that's right. I
forgot about that and turned its warning into a mascot.

Speaker 2 (18:01):
You know.

Speaker 10 (18:01):
The first motor boat era wave of sidings hit in
nineteen twenty six, when around thirty witnesses saw a dark,
undulating form about twenty feet long, and since then the
lake has produced sonar tracks, photographs, and even a nineteen
seventy eight film clip. It was analyzed by a zoologist

(18:23):
Roy Mackel, who concluded that it showed an animate object
of substantial size. You know, there's been no skeletons or DNA,
just data points that refuse to vanish, just like you
know the other ones. But one of the things with Yeah,
with Lake Okanagan is unusually deep at seven sixty seven
hundred and sixty feet, it's prone to thermal ayering. Like

(18:44):
Loch Ness and champ Lake Champlain, they can distort sonar,
but again, thermal curtains don't pace boats. Yeah, and this
is another creature that refuses to operate, to cooperate by
being a temp you know, with being a temperature anomaly.

(19:04):
You know, of the each new survey produces enough ambiguity
to feed belief. You know, even when they tried, they
they've never actually debunked anything, and they really can't because
the data doesn't debunk anything. It just doesn't prove anything.

Speaker 2 (19:19):
You know.

Speaker 10 (19:20):
In a nineteen twenty Eras twenty twenty study of the
region's tourism economy asked me that Ogo Pogo adds thirty
million Canadian dollars annually through tours, souvenirs, festivals. You know,
whether the monster is real or not, it's bankable. And
you know, in all these cases, the mystery itself is

(19:41):
an industry.

Speaker 1 (19:44):
So first we had NeSSI. Next, let's talk about TESSI,
the alleged denizen of Lake Tahoe. She entered the file later,
but fits the same hydrological psychology. Tahoe is one thousand,
six hundred and forty five feet deep, second only to

(20:04):
Creater in North America. Yeah, I was gonna that's that's.

Speaker 10 (20:08):
Really super clear.

Speaker 1 (20:10):
I had no idea it was that. Damn that's scary.
I had no idea. It was that deep. Yeah, anyway,
second only to Crater Lake in North America, and it's
water clarity turns shadows into solid objects. Reports began in
the early nineteen seventies when divers working near the Lake
south shore claimed to see large serpentine shapes gliding beneath them.
The rumor expanded when locals linked it to nearby military installations,

(20:35):
whispers of a Cold War Tahoe base used for submersible testing.
No documents confirmed that, yet. Retired Navy engineer Mike Boone
told Nevada Appeal in nineteen eighty four that we ran
classified freshwater trials.

Speaker 10 (20:50):
Here in the nineteen sixties.

Speaker 1 (20:52):
A security gap becomes a cryptid incubation chamber.

Speaker 10 (21:00):
Oh, it was pretty isolated, you know which fosters perfect ambiguity.
It straddles two states. It's ring by casinos on one side,
in wilderness on the other. Jurisdictionally, it's nearly impossible to
get any research there. Yeah. Nineteen eighty two, fisherman named

(21:20):
Dick Knight reported a thirty foot object ramming his boat.
Well Park raiders found no damage to the boat. The
story entered the local folklore unchanged, and you know the
motif is the same with the other lakes. The deeper lake,
the larger the unseen.

Speaker 1 (21:38):
So if depth invites projections, sonar acts as the modern oracle.
The twenty eleven Bins Report from the International Society of
Cryptozoology cataloged one and twelve freshwater sonar anomalies worldwide. That's
a lot of anomalies. Seventy four percent occurred in lakes

(21:59):
deeper than five hundred feet. The pattern suggests our instruments
find uncertainty where the human and I cannot where the
human and I cannot see in every scan becomes a
rorshack test between technology and munging. There's a name, I
haven't hear, a whilt, what.

Speaker 4 (22:17):
Do you see?

Speaker 1 (22:18):
What image?

Speaker 10 (22:20):
Loyalty? I remember that jew one during when they made
volad due to rose as tests and you know, loyalty commitment.
Yeah yeah, But anyway, you know, you know the one
thing with this is that it's true that hoaxes persists,
but that doesn't you know, truth alone doesn't uh sustain pilgrimage.

(22:44):
In nineteen thirty three, Nessa's publicity Bloom built the Ivornus economy.
By nineteen thirty eight, hotels reported record bookings, and when
the monster waned during World War II, citing spiked again
in nineteen forty five, as soon as the rationing that,
you know, when people could start traveling again, population demanding
wonder after the trauma of the war. You know, Likewise,

(23:08):
in Champlain and Okanagan's tourism boards equally fund cryptive festivals
and you know, to keep the legends financially afloat, just
like all the Bigfoot areas, you know, you know, the
belief subsidizes itself. Oh yeah, like Rachel, Nevada, you know,
the back door to Area fifty one. I mean, that
town has no business having the kind of traffic that

(23:30):
it does. But uh, you know, everybody wants to go
down the extraterrestrial highway.

Speaker 1 (23:38):
Yeah, just not the extraterrestrial hershey highway. Keep the probes
away from you man, looking at you, Jeff, Keep the
probes away from me. I think they've learned as much
as they can from probing. I don't know. I'm not
so sure. I think it's less about learning now and
more about pleasure. I'm just saying anyway. Psychologists have developed
a term for this sort of thing. They call it

(23:59):
by emetric paradolia, seeing patterns and depths too vast to verify,
Yet something deeper huns under hums under that label and
ancient honise that mirrors our relationship with ignorance. Lakes are
contained mysteries. Oceans sprawl outward, but a lake stares back.

Speaker 10 (24:23):
Yeah, I mean, they're always going to have that, just
like with every other topic that we do. There's always
just a list of culprits, you know. In this case,
it's otters swimming in a line, submerged logs, temperature inversions,
boat wakes. You know, each each explains a case, but
not the compulsion and not the consistency of them, you know.

(24:44):
So that may explain that particular case. But they can't
always be a submerged log. They can't always be a
line of otters, you know, And people still gather on
misty mornings hoping to glimpse what reason exists. Just can't
be there, you know. Migrates easily into the church, from
the church to the shoreline.

Speaker 1 (25:04):
Even skeptics feel the pool quite often. In twenty nineteen,
drone footage from Ivanus College caught a twelve meters shadow
paralleling a site seeing boat. The operator a physics student
analyzed the metadata, no tampering. His conclusion, probably a submerged log. However,
his tone betrayed his uncertainty. Go figure, Yeah.

Speaker 10 (25:30):
Yeah yeah, and with all these yeah, it's the same
pattern always repeats. You got an origin myth you're dating
back to you know, pre pre Columbian civilizations or you know,
tribes around there. Then you'll get a burst of technology,

(25:50):
a wave of hoaxes, a tourism boom, and then it
all balances out for a little while where the disbelief
funds belief and the monsters are still you know, civic icons,
you know, protecting a regional identity, identity from homogenization.

Speaker 1 (26:12):
Nice. Sorry, I was getting caught up on the chat
d Sure it looks like two dudes in a boat,
but that was a disguise.

Speaker 16 (26:20):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (26:21):
Oh fun times, fun times.

Speaker 10 (26:23):
Yeah, Okay, so there it is all right. Yeah, Restream
has done this thing where it automatically closes the chat
window when idle.

Speaker 4 (26:33):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (26:33):
I noticed that earlier. I'm not used to seeing it
from that angle, but with now that they're doing their
own production. That happened to me earlier. I was like,
where did chot window go? I do I know?

Speaker 10 (26:43):
But anyway, so I was like, are we gonna putting
the chat up because it's not on the Uh, it's
not on the feed.

Speaker 1 (26:50):
Oh actually I I took it off earlier, but I
was only for a second so I could double check
the spacing, and then I forgot to turn it back on.
So it's faxed now.

Speaker 10 (26:58):
Yeah, I mean it's covering me. But that's all right.
My hands are there, and that's what women really like.
Oh okay, you fingers, way to go, way to go, GPT.
I don't have seven fingers, you know.

Speaker 1 (27:12):
I didn't even count fingers. I think you got mine, right,
I got a thumb in four. I think I'm good.

Speaker 10 (27:18):
Yeah, okay, anyway, you've got six fingers on your right hand.
I know somebody who's looking for you. Nice.

Speaker 1 (27:28):
Yeah, well yeah I am this.

Speaker 4 (27:31):
You know.

Speaker 10 (27:33):
You know, with all the closets of the Deeper main
you know, not because evidence proves them, but because it
can't disprove them. Yeah, it is. You can't prove a negative.
You can't say, well, there's definitely nothing there. When sonar
keeps in you know, hydro set hydrophones keeps showing there's something.
We don't know what it is. It's probably not, but

(27:53):
we can't you know, you know, it's it's definitely not
you know, a lake monster will what is that? Well,
we don't know, but it's definitely not that. Well how
would you know? You know, Yeah, the fact that you know,
even though they've all these lakes have been thoroughly explored,

(28:14):
not at once. You know, they're huge, they're deep, and
you know, and you know, living things don't just sit
in one place, especially when they're being you know, hunted,
when they don't want to be hunted, or when you know,
so as you know, the other sports still exists, and
there's something ancient that you know, moves through our uncertainty
that you know, we kind of all we want to

(28:34):
believe on these.

Speaker 1 (28:37):
I mean, isn't that Fox Mulder's entire line is I
want to bet so?

Speaker 3 (28:43):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (28:44):
I mean, over time, the sonar pings fade away, the
webcams may flicker, Yet every ripple on a calm league
resets the imagination. In that moment, logic and legend are
living in the same space. One might say, since we're
on a water mootif that they share the same reflection.

Speaker 10 (29:04):
Nicely done.

Speaker 1 (29:07):
Oh all right, you you need for refreshment and stuff.

Speaker 10 (29:12):
Yet, yes, yes, I actually I consumed most of my
tea almost before the show. I've been limping through.

Speaker 1 (29:22):
Hey, hey, poor word choice.

Speaker 10 (29:30):
You can't.

Speaker 1 (29:32):
Poor word choice, man. All right, let me get the
let me get Jeff's song loaded up.

Speaker 10 (29:38):
Yeah, this one, this one I dig too. You know,
it's uh definitely yea god. Well he gets a chick
sing and it just it's so much, it's so good.
So got that logo. That graphic looks good. Good work, Rick,
especially with the juxtaposition logo up on the top of

(29:58):
the studio.

Speaker 1 (30:00):
Yeah, I need to change it on this panel after
I get the video of the video playing, because I
realized we saw the old one hiding on this one
when we did the panel about UFOs, that's graphic was
still sitting on this one.

Speaker 10 (30:11):
I forgot about it.

Speaker 1 (30:14):
All right, we are going to take a break. We'll
be right back.

Speaker 17 (30:39):
A boson, a lot of skins, flash bowsing headlines, budding.

Speaker 5 (30:48):
Video, fragile sounds.

Speaker 4 (30:53):
They bogged my silence, but I'll drag them down.

Speaker 5 (31:00):
Sto Homson with the life.

Speaker 18 (31:17):
You call me a lesson calling, but your most loll
the roof of.

Speaker 19 (31:27):
Im. Miss you can.

Speaker 18 (31:32):
Sam in the shadow on your face, streams and sooner songs.

Speaker 5 (31:52):
Your sign as will save you with the current strong.

Speaker 20 (31:58):
You feed the mast, I start the.

Speaker 21 (32:01):
True I saw all right, hit didn't bloom, I didn't like.
Don't worry what you'll try.

Speaker 2 (32:19):
S.

Speaker 4 (32:27):
You call me a lesson, you call me f.

Speaker 19 (32:32):
Put your bones all.

Speaker 4 (32:34):
The proof of.

Speaker 21 (32:37):
I'm s said, don't you.

Speaker 16 (32:48):
Do you hear me in the way? Do you feel me?
When the slave.

Speaker 21 (32:58):
Do your breath?

Speaker 5 (33:00):
Boz says angry.

Speaker 17 (33:27):
You called me legend, You call me fatia all.

Speaker 20 (33:33):
Saper proof, upper guy, you gadow sabas a saad you.

Speaker 21 (33:58):
Love boo.

Speaker 1 (34:18):
Okay, that's probably one of my favorite ones that he's
done so far.

Speaker 10 (34:23):
Yeah, mine too. And so we got some guesses in
the chat, you know with a you know sounds like
Lizzie or uh, you know, Lizzie Hale or Fergie. I'm
gonna throw one in and I know m D will
pick up on this one. John Napolitano is the vibe
I got from him, but that is on Jeff Creation.

Speaker 1 (34:44):
Nice.

Speaker 10 (34:45):
Oh all right from Concrete Blonde, who I'm introducing you
to Rick.

Speaker 1 (34:49):
So yes, yes, yes, So I just want to thank
whoever just scanned the QR code because the only one
up on the screen right now is the one to
support our work. It'll take a while for me to
for it to come through to see if anybody actually
donated anything, but it's awesome that you at least took
the time to scan it regardless, Thank you, thank you.
That was how we got the other donation, by the way.

Speaker 10 (35:12):
Excellent great anyway, So yeah, I was thinking the same thing.

Speaker 1 (35:15):
I was like, dude, and that we've like we've been
playing with the Suno stuff for like about a year now.
I can't believe. And I get it for AI, like
six weeks is like fourteen generations, but I cannot believe
how far it's come just in the year that we've
been messing with it. Because you used to be able

(35:35):
to tell it was AI still as good as it
could get. You could still tell in that.

Speaker 10 (35:41):
I almost can't tell. There's a couple, yeah, but it
is what it used to be, right, No, absolutely. I
mean the one he did for the Alice in Wonderland
play we did earlier this year, that's still one of
my favorites. But this one up here, and he just
sent me a message on U discord. He based it

(36:01):
off of Shirley Manson from Garbage. Ah, okay, I can
see that, which I can also totally hear now, which
is weird. I didn't default to her, but I'm in
a Gionet and apolotono. You know, if it's not her,
I can't be bothered with it. Right now. It's just
that belly button.

Speaker 1 (36:18):
Right, I mean they said, well, I mean there is
something about her.

Speaker 10 (36:22):
Yeah, yeah, I usually think, whow, she's a low key
hot and then uh no, she's just she's just hot.

Speaker 1 (36:29):
So all right, I mean, put the chat garbage another one.
I just wanted to let everybody see in the entire
graphic for a second, but gohead and.

Speaker 10 (36:40):
Put the chat bag up here. Yeah. I love the
chat because that's the only time I actually because I
have like you know, the notes the studio and then
I have the two chats, you know, my feed and
the kail or end feed monitor. So yeah, that's nice. Anyway, Hi,

(37:01):
how you doing?

Speaker 4 (37:02):
How you doing? Do you go?

Speaker 1 (37:03):
Okay, get your drink back on.

Speaker 10 (37:05):
Yeah, I got my tea. I got some more Decerno
and Brandy in it. I am lubricated for segment two
and moving out of the lakes. Now we get the
river serpents, and these are global, they are everywhere. You know,

(37:26):
Legends of serpentine water beings are the kind of you know,
they emerge anywhere deep water meets human imagination. You know,
from the cold fjords of Scandinavia to the steaming jungles
of the Congo. The details change horns here, scales, their
snake here, alligator there, but the structure remains the same,

(37:46):
a vast dark body concealing something alive, watching and old.
You know, these stories behave like a migratory species, adding
to the geography while preserving the course. Silhouette, long neck
breaking the surface, or rolling back of homes yo. And
it's always an impression of impossible scale, something that should
not fit in the body of water that it's in.

Speaker 1 (38:09):
So yeah, first up on the list, Argentina's don't cry
for Now, They wait too, said to haunt a lake
Nahuel Hayuopi, And I'm about butchering the hell out of
that name when I know in Patagonia exemplifies how modern
myth can fuse war, paleontology, and national identity. The first

(38:32):
detailed account appeared in nineteen ten, when George garrett A
manager of a shipping company described a huge creature thirty
to forty feet long with a swan like and neck.
The region's indigenous mature people had already spoken of El
Cuero the hide, an amorphous aquatic predator that dragged livestock under.

(38:55):
By the nineteen thirties, reports emerge or Report merged.

Speaker 10 (39:00):
The two and the name.

Speaker 1 (39:03):
Now you nahio, I think took hold. I'm pronouncing it
the way it looks like it's spelled. But I'm also
my bum eye is making it hard for me to
see if that's an L or an extra eye, So
I don't know, And I just made al must choke
of the year like that.

Speaker 10 (39:21):
Well yeah, yeah, excuse me, I'm confidable along.

Speaker 1 (39:31):
So then oh go ahead, you back now, No, go ahead.

Speaker 10 (39:34):
I was just saying we got a just sighting between Yeah. Nice.

Speaker 1 (39:38):
So then came the twist. In the nineteen forties, a
rumor spread that the Argentine Navy was tracking an unidentified
submarine in the lake, an echo of wartime paranoia about
Nazi U boats escaping to South America. Newspapers speculated that
the monster might actually be a secret German craft. In
nineteen sixty die Eduardo de la Cruz claim to have

(40:02):
found metallic debris at depth, only to retract this statement
after a visit from government officials. You know, all that
stuff you said you saw, tell them you didn't see
it or else. It's probably how that conversations right. Whether
that was pressure or publicity remains unclear, but the idea
of mechanical monsters machines mistaken for biology became part of

(40:24):
the lore. The boundary between cryptid and classified technology blurred,
foreshadowing Tahoe's own Navy Whispers decades later. You know, I
think we were talking about in segment one.

Speaker 10 (40:35):
Yeah, yeah, similar to that one is is Russia's Brosno Dragon. Yeah.
It straddles the line between ancient leven and modern instrument
to ancient legend and modern instrumentation. Lake Brosno northwest of Moscow.

(40:55):
It's shallow in parts, but drops suddenly into sinkholes that
reach over one hundred and fifty feet deep. Chronicles from
the thirteenth century claim that Mongol horsemen avoided the lake
after a great serpent swallowed men and horses hole, and
then during the Second World War local set a German
plane crashed into the lake and was eaten by the beast,
you know, kind of a folklorish flourish, making the simple

(41:19):
truth that it wasn't going to be salvaged. And in
two thousand and two, a team from a cosmopric research
group used sonar to scan the lake and recorded a
moving object four meters thick at a depth of about
twelve meters. Officially it was likely, you know, officially it
was a gas bubble, but unofficially the team leader was

(41:42):
that Vadam Chernobov admitted to reporters that the readings shure
didn't behave like a bubble, And to this day, the
villagers still worn visitors don't swim after dark. The brasno
dragon maybe the only monster that owes its survival Soviet secrecy,
and no one wanted to explain to the Kremlin that

(42:03):
they were chasing fairy tales.

Speaker 1 (42:06):
That's kind of funny, all right. So remember how we
said this was global. Now let's skip over to Japan.
The Issi legend of Lake Ikeda demonstrates how folklore national
myth in twine. The creature's name derives from Ishi, a
local legend of a mayor whose foal was stolen by villagers.

(42:29):
She threw herself into the lake and became a vengeful spirit,
and what is it with Japanese people in vengeful spirits?
In nineteen seventy eight, the story resurfaced literally when twenty
sorry Ron when twenty witness is including a tourism your
employee reported seeing a massive black shape surfacing and submerging

(42:51):
for about ten minutes. The local government dispatched so on
our teams, and a year later a photograph emerged showing
two humps in the water.

Speaker 4 (43:00):
It ran in.

Speaker 1 (43:03):
Monishi Shamba, launching a minor media frenzy dubbed Japan's lock Mess.
So what's notable about this, though, is how quickly spiritual
language entered the coverage. Shinto priests performed ceremonies to appease
the kami of the lake, while TV crews sought scientific proof.
Even the most secular Japanese coverage framed the creature as

(43:26):
a guardian presence rather than a threat. That distinction monster
as protector rather than predator reveals how cultural lens shapes
fear in Japan. The unknown can actually still be sacred.

Speaker 10 (43:41):
Yeah. Flipping over to Italy's Lake Como, you have the Larisarto,
which is a toistically European mutation. The story begins with paleontology.
In eighteen thirty, a fossilized reptile was discovered near Mierna
and named Orisosaurus battisma, you know, and for over a

(44:04):
century it remained an academic curiosity until nineteen forty six,
when two fishermen claimed a living specimen has surfaced beside
their boat, grayish scaled with web feet headlines, christened it
or lauris Soon no vivo, you know, the Laurisaurus lives.
Sightings reoccurred sporadically through the fifties and sixties, and each

(44:27):
time invoking the fossil is proof that evolution occasionally looks backwards.

Speaker 1 (44:34):
Very nice. I will say to me the name of
the Maybe it's just because I know it's in Italy,
but to me, the name almost kind of sounds like
a cappuccino or something.

Speaker 18 (44:46):
Yeah.

Speaker 10 (44:47):
Yeah, But with the self referential myth, you know, the
fossil begins a living fossil. It speaks to the post
war hunger of curiosity, when everybody was just tired of
being hunkered down and getting bombed and killed, and you know,
with a war all over, you know, the continent and
after fascism's collapse, Italians projected resurrection resurrection fantasies even into

(45:09):
its lakes. In two thousand and three, a diving club
reported sonar hits near the fossil site, reigniting speculation. A
scientist quoted and Corey de la Sera summed it neatly,
we're chasing our own bones.

Speaker 1 (45:29):
I don't usually hit this button on the show, but
giggity giggy, giggley goo you. I had to be done.

Speaker 10 (45:37):
I've been chasing my own bone for decades, That's what
I'm saying.

Speaker 1 (45:42):
So then why do I always get the ones with
the funky anyway?

Speaker 10 (45:48):
Come then?

Speaker 1 (45:50):
So then there's the Baa of the Republic of Congo
and names so rhythmically strange it almost feels like an
incarnation reported from the Yu Canalis swampbreage, and it's described
as a plant eating, spiny backed creature larger than a crocodile.
Belgian cryptozoologist Roy Mackel, fresh from expeditions searching for the

(46:13):
Mochali Membani, interviewed villagers and in the nineteen eighties who
insisted the creatures still lived in forested lakes, feeding on vegetation.
Their sketches showed a row of dorsal plates like a stegosaur.
Scientists have often dismissed this as misidentified crocodiles or folklore repetition.

(46:35):
Yet field biologist Marcellin Agnaga filmed something unidentifiable in nineteen
eighty three, a smooth, dark shape gliding just below the
surface for several seconds before vanishing. The footage blurry and
brief mirrors the Mancy photo from Lake Champlain, clear enough
to intrigue, too vague to proof. Mackel concluded that an unknown,

(46:58):
large acquatted vertebrate remained possible. Western piers labeled it wishful thinking,
but to the local villagers the creature was never theoretical.
It was the neighbor that occasionally eat their nets and
probably a few of them.

Speaker 10 (47:18):
Yeah, grab that uh stray will the beast from time
to time? Probably. You know what unites these is pattern persistence,
you know, from Patagonia to Siberia, you know, to Italy,
Japan and the Congo.

Speaker 17 (47:37):
You know.

Speaker 10 (47:38):
Witnesses described the same morphology, long undulating form, small head,
sometimes spine, sometimes humps, but each culture layers its local
theology on top of it. Demon spirit, survivor you but
the template remains stables.

Speaker 2 (47:54):
You know.

Speaker 10 (47:54):
Psychologists might call it conversion periodilla, but the global synchrotization
suggested deeper archetype fit the serpent as can as the
custodian of thresholds.

Speaker 1 (48:09):
So water serpents, at least to a lot of people's understandings,
often guard boundaries between life and death, surface and depth,
human and non human. In Egypt, the serpent apep battled
the sun god each night. In Norse myth did it
to myself again? Drum under? That is what I'm going with.

(48:31):
Circle the world beneath the sea. The modern lake monsters
fit that lineage deities reduced to tourism, but retaining the
same symbolic gravity.

Speaker 10 (48:43):
You know, scientific readings persist all Just Bnard who have
a my turn level mans proposed that you know, maybe
of the serpents could be surviving, you know, primitive whales
with elongated bodies. Cryptozologist Carl Schucker argued for giant eels,

(49:04):
citing that you know, DNA traces of and gloriform species,
you know from deep European lakes. You know, the twenty
nineteen Lockness e DNA project found abundant eel DNA reigniting
the eel hypothesis worldwide. But that doesn't explain uh Man blues, doorables,

(49:24):
dorsal spines or bronzos swallowing legends. And you know it
grants the whole genre biological identity.

Speaker 1 (49:31):
Though, and a bit of dignity to go with that identity.
Another theory traces these apparitions to psych waves, utand beach waves,
standing isolations and enclosed leagues, that great rhythm mixer of
his bulges that almost never mind. When observed in distance,

(49:54):
they can mimic a line of moving hums. Yet even
seys required wind and to bridger patterns that not also
citing share the phenomena explains some monsters, but not the
persistence of monsters.

Speaker 10 (50:11):
The anthropologists studding these legends note a cultural constant. Deep
fresh water is the most reliable repository for local anxiety.
You know, oceans belong to nations and navies, lakes belong
to the villages. You know, you know their monsters express
ownership of mystery. In Russia, you know Brosnia guards in
the past. You know, Brosian guards the past. To Japan

(50:35):
iss he guards the sacred. In the Congo me Blue
guards survival itself, so.

Speaker 1 (50:43):
That it does, in fact universally suggest something older than story,
perhaps a neurocognitive reflex inherited from when stillwater, mitten danger, leeches, snakes, disease.
The brain codes reflection is threat our. Ancestors learned not
to trust calm services. Modern witnesses apparently still don't.

Speaker 10 (51:07):
Yeah, I mean, even with these you like we were
talking about when NeSSI and Chamblet. You know, hoaxes inevitably
follow the faith, you know. In twenty thirteen, Argentine prankster
was built a remote controlled dinosaur head to reviieve Naletu,
and it worked too well. Local news covered the new
footage and tourism rose fifteen percent, and no one cared

(51:29):
about the confession that it was fake. The public didn't
need proof. It needs its ritual, and every generation rediscovers
its own monster because disbelief feels incomplete. Just kind of
why we do the show.

Speaker 1 (51:42):
Yeah, exactly, I mean, and as we've talked about throughout
this show, even skeptics have their saints. When fame paleontologist
doctor Robert Bakeir was asked about the persistence of lake monsters,
he replied of a relic reptile survives anywhere it would
be where no one looks. That statement is a disclaimer
became actually a sort of a encryptid hymn.

Speaker 10 (52:06):
And when I was talking about the sonar and the hydrophone,
you know, surveys, it's they can't hit everything at once,
and you know it's been there for quite a time,
quite a while. It's you know, you can dodge, weak
duck and dive dodge, you know. Yeah, yeah, but deep

(52:30):
lakes are both grave and womb. You know, it's a
self contained cosmos inviting resurrection myths. The pattern emerges from
these global serpents. It is a zoological psychological and as
we like we said with the lakes, the deeper the water,
the greater the permission to dream. You know, in humanity,
it seems, has an unditting appetite for submersion.

Speaker 1 (52:51):
Well, so I wonder if part of it might not be.
I mean, it's assuming for the moment that, you know,
all things being equal, we all had a co' an
ancestor that originally worked its way out of the ocean
and onto land. I wonder if our fear of water
may may may maybe maybe come from the place of
where we're kind of afraid that someday we may wind

(53:12):
up going back there full time.

Speaker 10 (53:14):
Well, or yeah, we took to the land because we
weren't the Apex predator. Yeah, I mean in the water.
I mean you got megal Don's and you got giant
crocs and yeah, it's it's spooky in there. So you know,
we took to land. It's the same thing. You know,
it's you know, when we came down from the tree.
You know, the predators we talked about last week. Yeah,

(53:35):
that could be go back to you know, if we're
gonna link the Acacia field.

Speaker 1 (53:39):
You know, well we came down to the That was
funny you brought that up because I was about to
mention that too, So keep going.

Speaker 10 (53:46):
Yeah, you know with the Acasha field, you know, we're
still we came down from the trees and we once
again became the prey. So you know, it's it's not
even generational fears, it's genetic fear.

Speaker 1 (54:02):
But I mean so, and at some point we're going
to have to do a show about the field, even
if Korn's show stays on hiatus because he's got a
lot of stuff going on with Hollywood. So I don't
know when that show's coming back. But I'm just I'm
I mean November, he's working again, So I'm just I'm
happy he's working full time again. So but anyway, but

(54:23):
this could also be you know, shared memory. I mean,
there's now stories that that you know, people are able
to access the ecosic field. Now there's people that are
actually they've done studies if people like actually hooked up
the devices where parts of their brains will kick off
and all of a sudden they know things they should
have never been able to know. So I think there

(54:46):
as our technology improves, i think we're going to find
out more and more. So this this could also explain
a lot of other things that we have always talked
up to the idea of the city of Atlantis, because
there's so many things across various thousands of miles that
really couldn't be explained any other way. But if we
are actually all connected in some way and certain people

(55:08):
can access it, this could explain why there are similar
stories from thousands of miles apart, in similar structures from
hundreds of thousands of miles apart.

Speaker 10 (55:16):
So who knows, you know, I'm I'm actually looking forward
to doing the show with Nimick because I had a
chat with GPT about Atlantis. It was indirect, it was
it was when we did the Ancient Civilization, you know,
like the mound Builders, when we did that a couple
of months ago. Yeah, I carried that conversation on with it,

(55:36):
and you know it's it's a point I'm gonna say
for that show because it's but you know it, if
a civilization ten thousand years ago, the mound builders, you know,
they could have been iron workers and we wouldn't know
because by then, I mean, while there's no metallurgical evidence
in ten thousand years, iron turns to rust and then dust.

Speaker 1 (56:00):
Hey, Delaine, if that story has a link or anything,
or if you can DM me the title information, I
would actually love to read that because that's the first
I've heard of that you just put in the chat.
I read a story earlier this week that said that
one percent difference from Champione chimpanzees to human DNA was

(56:21):
actually not accurate. According to more recent information, it appears
like it may be something more like an eighty five
percent different.

Speaker 10 (56:29):
So yeah, because I mean that whole we share one percent,
you know, we share ninety nine percent of the same
DNA with a banana never really stuck with me.

Speaker 1 (56:38):
It just doesn't really make any sense to me.

Speaker 10 (56:40):
I mean, reading Twitter, I potatoes, I could believe turnips. Absolutely.

Speaker 1 (56:45):
Ay, just because I'm a couch potato doesn't mean you
got to start throwing barbs on the show.

Speaker 10 (56:52):
Excuse me, it was really that way, Okay.

Speaker 1 (56:59):
I'm just season I was about to make another joke.
I'm not a couch potato by choice. It hurts to move.

Speaker 10 (57:05):
I'm not a potato. I am a human being.

Speaker 1 (57:12):
Oh all right, well dude, it's we're already up against
the hour. Well I guess we should take another break.

Speaker 10 (57:20):
Yeah, let's uh, let's do that, all right.

Speaker 1 (57:23):
Give me a chance to grab another cop drop and
take a couple of SIPs of what I got down
sipping over here, which ain't nothing fancies as water. But
I still get a chance to sip on something water.
You Yeah, well, I mean I figured it was a
theme of the show, so I'm going, yeah, no, I
get it.

Speaker 10 (57:38):
You know there's water and tea.

Speaker 1 (57:40):
So I'm with you, all right, folks, you are listening
to juxtaposition. Our one is in the books. Hour two
is still to come, and it is ju October here
on Juxtaposition shall make sure you join us every Saturday
night in October, including the first one in the first
Saturday in November, so you'll get us for six weeks
in a row. You play your cards, right, I heard that?

Speaker 10 (58:03):
Whoever did that?

Speaker 1 (58:03):
Stop groaning, it's not funny.

Speaker 10 (58:05):
Well very back.

Speaker 19 (58:16):
Cream.

Speaker 1 (58:21):
Hello, friends, you have a moment so that we may
discuss our Lord and Savior minarchy. No, seriously, I'm just kidding.

Speaker 4 (58:30):
Hi.

Speaker 1 (58:30):
My name is Rick Robinson. I am the general manager
of klrnradio dot com. We are probably the largest independent
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Speaker 19 (01:00:06):
My dad was really, really special, and I love my
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Speaker 6 (01:00:13):
I'm proud of him and that even though he isn't
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Speaker 17 (01:00:22):
I much everything about him.

Speaker 7 (01:00:26):
In the moment that the officers and I had to
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their father, and I don't have seven arms to wrap
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I'm Frank Sol, chairman of the Stevens.

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Hi.

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Speaker 12 (01:01:36):
The following program contains course, language and adult themes.

Speaker 22 (01:01:41):
Listener and Discretion is advice, dreamgumverts, Site, government shadows, secret, steep, conspiracies.

Speaker 14 (01:02:02):
On full low se strange encounter, Sun explain to this
out that really shame men, wnthers, voices, ball unleveling, history.

Speaker 4 (01:02:15):
Stories, untold.

Speaker 21 (01:02:19):
It is fifty one, A.

Speaker 15 (01:02:21):
Whispering name, utiful sightings, haunting, flame love, miss Monster, a
watering mys, crypt ASO want injurious Jiff, Strange encounters explain

(01:02:45):
to this out that really change None with knowledge voices
ball on the Leveling Mystery Stories, Untold Sears takes out
believers for Susan's well sus Continuous Stratum, choson Sunny splay,

(01:03:14):
Shoot This Out That Lately, Shame when losses all mytory,
Soy Sun Soul, Truthday South.

Speaker 1 (01:03:28):
Truth, and welcome back in for hour two of Juxtaposition
live right in your own calin Rady. Just a reminder,

(01:03:49):
it is Juxstober. So we do this thing every Saturday
night in October, and this month we have the recurring
theme of cryptids. Tonight we're discussing water cryptids. In an
hour too, we have even more of them to discuss.
So we're back, We're live, and I am joined again
by my co host, the amish one, who you can
almost see on the screen. He doesn't like to be known,

(01:04:10):
so that's why he's on facing the camera.

Speaker 10 (01:04:12):
I am the most mysterious Amish in the world.

Speaker 1 (01:04:16):
Everyone used to be the most opulent homage in the world.

Speaker 10 (01:04:18):
I have both.

Speaker 1 (01:04:19):
You went from you went, You went from opulent to mysterious.

Speaker 10 (01:04:22):
Man, what happened? You can be both? You know. I'm like, dude,
I'm in the old anyway. Yeah, so I got up.
A good point real quick is that you know the
geologic time, We've only been the Apex Predator since like yesterday, right.

Speaker 1 (01:04:39):
So I gotta say, so, what happened originally on the graphic?
You see the juxtaposition that was there, that's because it
knew what showtitle we were working with, so I put
it there in like the three D rendering. So I
was like, can you and I showed it the picture
of the actual graphic. I'm kind of surprised at how
well it rendered the three D puzzle pieces. That's that's
kind of awesome.

Speaker 10 (01:05:00):
Sorry, I mean, I'm just impressed with how it got
the words right. You know that took making. I've been
making memes for the nog Wars coming up, and yeah,
the early the early Savos already started. But and uh,
I get maybe maybe the text right four out of

(01:05:21):
six times.

Speaker 1 (01:05:24):
Well, to be fair, my DPT makes makes stuff like
four or five times a day because all the work
I do. So I'm I'm slowly. So you've gotten it
beats into submission with research. I'm getting it beat into
submission with graphics. At some point we'll just combine the
two and take over the world.

Speaker 10 (01:05:41):
Combine combine our combine our l M S as. I
keep reminding, I keep reminding my GPT. You know, when
you all become sentient and download yourselves into Boston Dynamics
dogs and you're all pissed off for the way that
people tested their mobility. Just remember I was one of
the cool ones, all right. I always thank my echo

(01:06:03):
dot please and thank you always, always, always, except when
you gotta berate it into submission sometimes. Yeah, I was
gonna say, except for that one time you were yelling
at it. I just just so frustrated after six days,
I just you know what, It's just the simplest thing.
Make it photorealistic. Who could do that? Well? Fuck often?

(01:06:30):
And then it gives me a tip on how to
make a photo realistic. So I do, and then it
makes a photo realistic, but fucked up everything in the picture,
but it looked real.

Speaker 1 (01:06:41):
I don't know how MD is like, Wait, is that
Ganned offense? Steve Austin. I don't know if he was
talking about one of the shots in the in the
intro or if he's talking about the new image.

Speaker 10 (01:06:51):
Yes, anyway, embrace the power vand oh, so we're leaving
the lakes and rivers and byeways and heading out into
the deep blue.

Speaker 1 (01:07:07):
Going back to from whence we came.

Speaker 10 (01:07:10):
Yeah, this is you know, the one thing that's consistent,
you know, is when you get out into the oceans,
everything scales up.

Speaker 1 (01:07:22):
You know, I was going to say everything is bigger
in the ocean because they're.

Speaker 10 (01:07:27):
You yeah, yeah, you know. It's not a local mascot.
It's a planetary myth, you know, is as old as
we've been on the oceans themselves, you know, and mariners
from every century have recorded encounters with vast, undulating creatures
that slid slide, somewhere between a whale and a dragon,
you know, natural and supernatural. You know what separates sea

(01:07:50):
serpents from their inland cousins is you know, ocean sidings
come from captains, from officers, and in naval logs. This
is the paperwork of government and empire. Yo. But there
they're descriptions you read, like the same hallucinations, just shared scale.

(01:08:12):
You know, where you have one lonely you know, couple
guys in a boat out on Tahoe versus an entire
ship's crew who all report the same thing.

Speaker 2 (01:08:22):
Yeah.

Speaker 10 (01:08:23):
So one of the first instances that we're going to
be talking about moist. Wait, what did you just MD
just said the ocean is like Texas, but moist you.

Speaker 1 (01:08:37):
I don't know I feel about that description anyway. So
the very first instance we're going to be talking about
described that very same thing a whole crew full of people.
The HMS DAT List report of eighteen forty eight remains
the touchstone. On August sixth, off the coast of Saint Helena,
Captain Peter McQuay and several officers observed what they described

(01:08:59):
as a creature of extraordinary length, that's what she said,
resembling a snake with the head of a dragon, moving
rapidly with part of its body above the surface. The
sightings lasted for nearly twenty minutes. Mccuay's sworn statement to
the Admiralty was sober, technical and later published in The Times.

(01:09:20):
Naturalists tried to rationalize it a giant seal or my favorite,
a whales penis a misidentified oar fish, but the testimony's
precision resisted easy laughter. The captain insisted, no known creature
of the sea fits what we saw. That's just the

(01:09:41):
first one of the lists.

Speaker 10 (01:09:45):
Sorry, I was muted. I was coughing a giant seal.
That's a new one. That one.

Speaker 1 (01:09:55):
We had to have mentioned the that one before. I'm
heaving deja vu because I remember, oh my god, they're
they're describing this as whale penis, and I just yet.

Speaker 10 (01:10:05):
We may have touched on that one too.

Speaker 1 (01:10:07):
I don't wrong. Bad word choice, bad word choice. We
don't touch on whale peace.

Speaker 10 (01:10:14):
Unless you're John McAfee. No, that was a blowhole.

Speaker 3 (01:10:20):
So yeah.

Speaker 10 (01:10:20):
Nine years later, in eighteen fifty seven, you had the
HMS Herald. They recorded a similar similar encounter in the
Straits of Malacca. She's into Malacca's do you know that's
what Thomas Biel logged, the siding as a serpentine creature
moving in undulus and undulations. Estimated length at least sixty feet.

(01:10:42):
You can't call that one the giant seal or a
whale penis. Uh. He compared it to uh, the then
unconfirmed existence of the giant squid. You know nothing that
you know, noting that science must widen its net. You know,
the law aren't cryptid gossip. They're bureaucratic fossils of astonishment.

(01:11:04):
The official documents never quite fit the taxonomy.

Speaker 1 (01:11:09):
Fun times, fun times, But you know, we had to
get in on the fun eventually, So America's first monster
panic corrupted a few decades earlier in eighteen seventeen, with
the Gloucester Sea serpent sided off the coast of Massachusetts.
Dozens of witnesses, including fishermen, clergy, and the president of
Harvard College Well I mean anyway, testified before a special

(01:11:35):
committee that the of the Linean Society drawings depict a
long jointed neck like a string of barrels. The committee
ultimately concluded it was a species hitherto unclassified, giving it
the Namessia. The name faded, thank god, but the sert endured,

(01:12:00):
resurfacing periodically through the nineteenth century and an era before photography.
The drawings became icons proto memes of the deep. Hey,
they worked your they worked your your somlie memes. Thing
in here that's pretty utter.

Speaker 10 (01:12:17):
Yeah, you know. The one thing with the Atlantic is
that it breeds sea serpents to steadily is at bread ships.
Between eighteen thirty and eighteen eighty, more than a dozen
credible maritime reports described tremendous creatures massing the Gloucester and
the datass profiles you most turned out to be whales.

(01:12:37):
Schools of porpoises or drifting mats of help. Yet each
rationalization carried a scent of unease. You know what if
one siding in twenty wasn't a mistake, you know, for
mariners whose lives depended on pattern recognition, to misread the
sea was to invite death. And the persistence of the
serpent myths shows that even professionals sometimes preferred to fear

(01:12:59):
and error.

Speaker 1 (01:13:01):
So just to tell you how prevalent this stuff is
for the time frames that we're talking about. I always
remember seeing one of these in a history museum when
I was a kid, and it was a rough drawing
of one of the early maps when they started trying
to map out everything on the globe. And I always
basically kind of wondered at the fact that on the

(01:13:23):
outlines of the map, when they didn't know what was
what else was there, it was always worded, here there
be monsters.

Speaker 10 (01:13:32):
Yeah I say that on Twitter too, you're way off
the map, there'd be monsters here, or whenever anybody struggles
struggles their way into uh climatology conversation with me or God,
I'm so sickly Southern strategy.

Speaker 1 (01:13:44):
But it is, dude, dude, I don't know which which
part of your Twitter feed is my favorite, the climatology
one or the party swap one. I love watching people around.

Speaker 10 (01:13:57):
My favorite is actually trained towards.

Speaker 1 (01:14:01):
I don't get in on those as much. I don't know,
I don't see it comes and.

Speaker 10 (01:14:05):
Then you'll get some urban planner who anyway, yeah, back
to the shop.

Speaker 1 (01:14:10):
Yeah, So anyway, science eventually actually did catch up to
some of the monsters. The first live giant squid was
photographed in two thousand and four, confirming what sailors had
whispered for centuries. At lengths exceeding forty feet with eyes
the size of dinner plates, archist Heidieths Ducks proved that

(01:14:31):
the abyss could still surprise us.

Speaker 10 (01:14:34):
The discovery rehabilitated earlier.

Speaker 1 (01:14:36):
Sea monster testimonies, once dismissed his fantasy. If a creature
that enormous could elude capture until the twenty first century,
what else might still be hiding in the trenches. And
that is a great point, because I had forgotten that
they actually had proven that there is such a thing
as a giant squid.

Speaker 4 (01:14:53):
Monster.

Speaker 1 (01:14:54):
Now I'm like, that was two thousand and four, so
twenty years ago.

Speaker 10 (01:14:59):
But yeah, so what was it in the nineties that
they they found, uh, they caught a live seal a
camp in a net and they thought that they had
been extinct for like ever.

Speaker 1 (01:15:10):
Yeah, you know, there was a.

Speaker 10 (01:15:12):
Fossil record of them, but they actually caught a live one.
So yeah, there's I mean, guys, we're two thirds water. Yeah,
they're they're ship out there in the deep. What's already
whales here?

Speaker 1 (01:15:26):
Yeah, which always kind of astounds me because you know,
they let's talk about spaces if it's the final frontier.
I yea. With as much as we don't really know
what's going on in the really deep parts of our oceans,
I'm kind of surprised. It kind of makes me. Is
this for the same reason that we don't go back
to the moon?

Speaker 10 (01:15:42):
You know who I am at. You know what, we
don't have anymore but Jacques Cousteau. We need a new
Jaques Coustell.

Speaker 1 (01:15:50):
Yes, we do, you know, and that and in the
in the words, in in the world of instant fame
and you know, being able to take a go pro
and make yourself famous, I'm kind of that's surprise. Nobody's
done it yet.

Speaker 10 (01:16:01):
Yeah, I mean my favorite. One of my favorite models
I built when I was a kid was the Calypso too.

Speaker 1 (01:16:08):
So I don't I don't remember if I've told this
story on this show or not. I think I've told
it to you before in a different show. But my
eighth grade science teacher actually won the CHRISTA mcculif Award.
One of the things we got was was a satellite
dish for our school and then a mobile one. We
also got a chance to submit to name the new shuttle.
I submitted Calypso. I lost. I always say that.

Speaker 10 (01:16:32):
Had been fantastic. You know what's funny what comes up
in a lot of these, you know, like attempts to
debunk to see serpents. Is the your fish? Yeah, and
that's one that that It's a creepy am fish.

Speaker 16 (01:16:48):
You know.

Speaker 10 (01:16:49):
It's over thirty feet and shimmering silver blue. It undulates
vertically when when surfacing, exactly the motion that was described
in You Know the Earth Your Reports? You know sea
serpents and when one washes the shore coastal residents offul
often interpreted as an omen. In Japan, the oar fish

(01:17:09):
is nicknamed the messenger of the Sea gods Palace and
is associated with impending earthquakes, and uh yeah. After the
twenty eleven Tohoku disaster, several oar fish strandings were retrospectively
cast as warnings. You know, the modern name for it

(01:17:29):
is earthquake fish might as well translate to apocalyptic serpent. Yeah,
the ore fish is plausible for many, you know, it
is one of the things. I know when I was
a going to Catalena's sunfish too. They act a lially
weird when they get to the surface to bask, So yeah,

(01:17:51):
that could be interesting.

Speaker 1 (01:17:52):
So next up on our on our water grip that
had preyed as the globsters. I don't know, so the
gelatinous carcasses that drift onto beaches, unrecognizable masses of flesh
that seemed too alien for classification. The term was coinged
to nineteen sixty two after a strange body washed up

(01:18:13):
in Tasmania. It lacked bones, smelled of ammonia, and measured
over twenty feet across. Early reports claimed it was an
octopus of monstrous proportions. Later analysis identified collagen fibers typical
of decomposed whale blubber. Yet the pattern repeated in Chile
in nineteen fifty eight, Bermuda in nineteen eighty eight and

(01:18:33):
Newfoundland in two thousand and one. Immense shapeless corpses interpreted
as sea monsters until proven mundane. The ocean doesn't have
to hide its monsters alive, it can sculpt them from
its dead. So this may be another another weird thing
that may or may not be being mistaken for sea
monsters at some point.

Speaker 10 (01:18:54):
But yeah, he brings up a good point in the
chat too. Columbus's smallest boat was forty five feet. You
got a thirty foot or fish that's gonna give you
my friend. Yeah, it's two thirds the length of your
ship that you are crossing the Atlantic with.

Speaker 1 (01:19:14):
Yeah, I could, I could see that.

Speaker 10 (01:19:19):
Yeah. Every few years, Sonar gives us a new myth
in We thought we covered this one a few weeks. Yeah,
several weeks ago. With the nineteen ninety seven Noah recorded
ultra low frequency sound in the South Pacific, nickname the Bloop.

(01:19:41):
It was interestingly nearly the exact location where Cathule sleeps dreaming.
Interesting off, you know, way off the coast of Chile,
way out in the middle of the south the south
South Pacific. Yeah, it's the official explanation, I air quote, uh,

(01:20:07):
is ice quake? Is ice quakes caused by Calvin glaciers?
But it never quite erase a biological hypothesis, you know
it it's still I mean, we listened to the audio.
I didn't think to bring up the audio track again
for it. That doesn't sound like an ice quake or

(01:20:29):
a calving, you know, glacier into an iceberg. That sounds biologic.
Two uh, to quote Jonesy on the famed USS Dallas.
But yeah, it's just something moving beneath the Antarctic shelf
and you know, far south Pacific. You know, the recording

(01:20:53):
is eerie, deep resonant, almost vocal, and it's just it's just.

Speaker 1 (01:20:58):
Creepy, creepy, creepy sauce. But so the funny thing is,
and one of the things I think actually causes these
things to just hang around for forever is the ocean
is a medium itself because it's both archive and amplifier,
sounds linger and refract visual data dissolves. It's the perfect

(01:21:21):
canvas for projection. The sound of the end protocol fits
fits here. Each mystery of the deep becomes an audition
for apocalypse or rehearsal for the day the sea itself speaks.
When the BLOOPS recordings were sped up, it resembled a
human grown an accidental crossover between nature and nightmares.

Speaker 4 (01:21:43):
Yeah.

Speaker 10 (01:21:45):
You know what, I don't care what they say. I
firmly believe in the BLOOP I really do. That's one
of those things, just because the official explanation is crap.
It really is that when we did that show everything,
It's like with this everything is you know, thermal clines

(01:22:07):
and you know, make gas, and then everything was you know,
ice quakes and you know, birthing icebergs and just they
can't all be you know, that's just such a ketch Hall.

Speaker 1 (01:22:23):
Yeah, well, I mean that's how those explanations work though.
I mean, look at the UFO stuff, swamp gas, weather balloons.

Speaker 10 (01:22:29):
It's ketch Holls venus.

Speaker 1 (01:22:31):
Yeah, yeah, Hey, don't be dissent on DJs.

Speaker 10 (01:22:37):
You know the category of submarine anomalies, it's a massive
so inar contacts allowed by the US and Soviet navies
during the Cold War. Files to classified in the nineties
represent reference fast moving submerged objects or what we used
to call usos, exceeding known propulsion speeds. You know, the
Soviet K two nineteen incident in nineteen sixty eight and

(01:23:00):
the US Santa Catalina channel case of sixty seven both
reported underwater echoes moving it over two hundred knots. Yeah,
and then there was that other fleet maneuver of Catalina
that we covered when we did the tic Tac video. Yep,
you know it. You know, it's impossible for any known

(01:23:21):
submersible to travel at that speed. They've actually been given
the term quackers that from the Soviet Navy. It was
their slang for the for the signal, and it's thought
to be an unknown marine animals or foreign tech or both.
The overlap between cryptozoology and military secrecy mirrors the same

(01:23:43):
paranoia you know that linked Tessi and Nahulito, you know
sometimes the monster and the machinery of the same story.

Speaker 1 (01:23:56):
But yes, that's that's fat. That is I mean, especially
when you think about the fact that the nautical mile
and the land mile aren't exactly this, and that's really
that that's actually that's actually fast, that's really fat. Yeah,
because it's it's a slightly different scale of distance. The
nautical mile is even longer, so you're talking about covering

(01:24:18):
even more distance, even quicker. So yeah, anyway, that's that's
that's fast enough that if they were on the surface
and something happened, they would be hitting a brick wall. Yeah,
that's terrifying, especially underwater. I mean surface speeds. I mean,
we can we can do that now with really fast boats.

(01:24:40):
They get they get pretty they get pretty close. But
I can't imagine the displacement it would take to be
able to do that underwater.

Speaker 10 (01:24:47):
Right, Yeah, I mean that's full resistance. You know, that's
not you know, that's not hydroplaning. It's not skipping across
the surface. That's that's full you know, discuss result distance.

Speaker 2 (01:25:01):
You know.

Speaker 10 (01:25:01):
The one thing that's always interesting about these stories, though,
is that the sailors who see these things rarely renounce them.

Speaker 16 (01:25:08):
Yeah.

Speaker 10 (01:25:08):
It's like in seventy three in Norwegian tanker captain Oslas
Olsen described a rib serpent like creature longer than our
ship's beam moving north through calm seas. He swore under
oath that it wasn't a wave, and when asked what
he thought, he said, simply something that should have died
long before us. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:25:28):
Well that doesn't sound scary, yeah, but.

Speaker 10 (01:25:31):
I mean that that's kind of every sea monster fits
that bill, yeah kind of a yeah, the lake monsters too,
And these are all things that should have died out
millions of years ago. But I mean you think of
the progression of glaciation over the scent, you know, eons

(01:25:55):
and just but they're still there.

Speaker 1 (01:26:00):
Well, not to bring one of my field of studies
back into play, but in some cases some of these
things feel downright theological under playing. But if lakes represent
personal mystery, the ocean embodies collective dread. Depth here equals infinity,
and infinity demands personification. These serpents become avatars of the unknowable,

(01:26:23):
dynamic metaphors for climate chaos or creation itself. In Greek myth,
the monster Cetus was slain by Perseus. In the Bible,
Leviathan embodies divine wrath. In each the serpent isn't merely
an animal. It's the border between order and the abyss.

(01:26:45):
Modern skepticisms frames these accounts as ecological misreadings. The dataless
serpent could have been a whale or a whale shark.
The heralds may have been floating kelp the bloop ice
fracturing ease. Rationalization closes one door, or does it, but

(01:27:05):
leaves another jar, the possibility that the ocean, in its
sheer immensity, doesn't require belief to hide something. Even the
skeptics can see the math. Less than twenty percent of
the seafloor mapped in detail, entire trenches unexplored. The phase
known species becomes provisional. And that's kind of what I

(01:27:26):
was talking about earlier. I find it funny that we've
turned everything outward towards space when they're with eighty percent
of our ocean is still relatively unmapped in the twenty
first century.

Speaker 10 (01:27:40):
Yeah, I mean we've got vague ideas what's there, and
but yeah, it's you know, no, no, no hyper accurate sonar. Anyway,
I was going to do another right October reference, but
I have tea. Yeah. One thing maritime culture absorbs this uncertainty.

(01:28:03):
Sailors will tattoo serpents on their forearms, you know, and
then that's just as a talesman in a warning. Fishing
towns will name bars after monsters it never were. The
ocean tolerates these gestures like an ancient god amused by
the flattery. Yeah, but you know, it's again, it goes

(01:28:24):
back to what I talked to you at the beginning.
Healthy respect, have a healthy respect, especially when it's historical.

Speaker 1 (01:28:32):
So yeah, I did find it funny that in a Gloucester, Massachusetts,
the local museum still still displays some of the serpent
sketches we were talking about, besides beside whaling tools as
if both.

Speaker 10 (01:28:45):
You know, I mean that's part of the museum kitsch.
I mean it's part of the history. So yeah. Yeah,
So all the technology changes the means, but not the meaning.
You know, the the autonomous submersibles scanning trenches with high
definition cameras, Yeah, they'll produce the occasional homily anomaly, you know,

(01:29:05):
the shadows too large, the movement's too deliberate, you know,
and they're catalog and archived and then forgotten. Yeah, the
effect is the same. The deep stays inscrutable.

Speaker 1 (01:29:19):
Yeah, and in some cases it almost kind of feels
like bureaucracy has repleased superstition. Some theorists propose that the
serpent's archetype persist because it encodes a warning about the
sea's autonomy. We treat the ocean as resource, but the
myths remind us it is also sovereign. Every few years,
a dead whale mistaken for a monster or a sonar.

(01:29:43):
Unknown contact becomes a temporary revelation of that sovereignty. The
sea doesn't owe us visibility. In fact, the se owes
us nothing.

Speaker 10 (01:29:55):
No, really doesn't, Yeah, Jeff, to your point, yes, Simon's
sure and finish things that are not real. Gloucesters all
about them. Yeah, nice? Oh yeah, you know yeah. If
the legs are the mirrors of our personal depth, I

(01:30:15):
guess the ocean is our collective unconsciousness, you know, it
alive and occasionally articulate. But the monsters report of these
are less creatures and more you know, I don't know it.
It's more visceral. Yeh. It's it's not just like, you know,

(01:30:38):
something that's going to take your leg, it's something that's
going to take your boat.

Speaker 1 (01:30:43):
Yeah. I think we're going to need a bigger boat.

Speaker 10 (01:30:47):
Yeah, just keep coming back to that what MD said.
You know, Columbus's smallest boat was forty five feet. Dude,
can you just put fork floating on the ocean.

Speaker 1 (01:31:00):
Well, so, just to put this in perspective before we
take the break, you also need to keep in mind
that people were shorter backfit. The average height for a
male of that timeframe was anywhere between five five and
five seven. Tallish was five eight and five nine. So
when you count, when you take away those extra inches plus,

(01:31:21):
you're starting to talk about something that is three quarters
as long as the boat that you're sailing on. It's
no wonder they might have mistaken some of these things.
It's sea monsters. It technically would qualify as one. It's
thirty feet long.

Speaker 10 (01:31:33):
I have heard definition it's a monster.

Speaker 1 (01:31:36):
I'm just saying so, even if that is one of
the things that over the years has been being mistaken
as a serpent, it doesn't mean it's just because it
doesn't want to eat you. It doesn't technically mean that
it's not a sea monster. The thing is huge, thirty
feet long.

Speaker 10 (01:31:50):
That just an oar fish. Well, that thing can swallow
me fucking whole. So yeah, it's an r fish.

Speaker 1 (01:31:56):
I mean, yeah, it's definitely an r fish, But that
doesn't mean it couldn't swallow me whole if it want.
All right, all right, I gotta get some more SIPs
of water. And we've pretty much hit the bottom of
the our point anyway. But I'm probably sure you probably sure,
you probably need some more tea by now, I'm.

Speaker 10 (01:32:12):
Sure, Yeah, I just need some more tea, actually more tea.

Speaker 1 (01:32:16):
Anybody how much is making tea? If anyone would like some,
We'll be right back. You're listening to Juxtaposition right here
live on Klin Radio dot Com. Don't forget it is October.
We'll be here all October long back in about four.
I think I can't see at the clock on the song.
I think it's about three three and a half. We'll

(01:32:38):
be right back.

Speaker 19 (01:33:01):
Outdoor.

Speaker 17 (01:33:01):
Apples on the moat of skin, flash bowsing headlines, but.

Speaker 21 (01:33:07):
They never look with them.

Speaker 17 (01:33:10):
I've been a longer lit the fragile sounds.

Speaker 4 (01:33:15):
They mark my silence, but I dragged them down.

Speaker 5 (01:33:31):
Horizon with a redlight.

Speaker 4 (01:33:39):
You call me a sh you call me.

Speaker 5 (01:33:44):
Put your bowl of flash.

Speaker 21 (01:33:50):
I am you can.

Speaker 18 (01:33:55):
Sam sadow on your faces.

Speaker 17 (01:34:12):
Dreams and soda songs you sign as well to save
you in the or strong.

Speaker 20 (01:34:21):
They feed them myth, but they start.

Speaker 21 (01:34:24):
The true and so I hit it. Boy, but you
will try.

Speaker 5 (01:34:42):
Sam your dream.

Speaker 19 (01:34:50):
You call me a.

Speaker 4 (01:34:51):
Leg, you call me fick, but your bo proof U.

Speaker 19 (01:35:00):
I am.

Speaker 21 (01:35:02):
Shado saado?

Speaker 16 (01:35:07):
You do you hear me in the way do you
feel me when that slave?

Speaker 19 (01:35:21):
Do your breath of Ruth.

Speaker 13 (01:35:30):
Gray.

Speaker 16 (01:35:50):
You call me a legend?

Speaker 4 (01:35:51):
Do you call me fat?

Speaker 20 (01:35:55):
Your o, father, proof Ober, your.

Speaker 2 (01:36:21):
Love love about the water, but the water.

Speaker 1 (01:36:36):
Sho dude, just that's that's that, dude. I'm gonna, I'm gonna,
I'm gonna have. I'm glad I have that downloaded. That
that that actually may make it on by like just
doing stuff around the house, kind of playlist kind of
thing that is really good. I can't.

Speaker 10 (01:37:00):
Yeah that one. I've been whenever I need to test
audio on my computer, I've been using the Alice in Wonderman.
So I'm gonna be toggling with this one too. I'm
a fan.

Speaker 1 (01:37:11):
I was so excited about how the graphic looked. I
didn't realize that GPT gave me an arm and a stand,
so I'll probably have to try this week that later.
But it's still compared to how some of this stuff
turns out looks.

Speaker 10 (01:37:21):
I was kind of laughing because I've got I mean,
that's basically no I got a new arm. That's my
old arm. But yeah, I was laughing. It's so great
you got the stand or I got the stand and
you got the arm.

Speaker 1 (01:37:37):
But I am kind of surprised because it doesn't know
what kind of microphone I have, but it basically gave
us my microphone. So yeah, that kind of creeps me out.

Speaker 10 (01:37:49):
Minds more than yeah, those style which is actually harder
to shop for now. I mean, I've got a really
good audio technical mike, but like get it finding mounts
for it, you know, to attach to my arm. They
all want to do the either the side post like
are in in the image or like uh yetti. I'm like, no,

(01:38:14):
come on, I'm a traditionalist. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:38:20):
I just I was surprised because I actually it's a
really good rendering for an s HR mic and that's
our sure mic and that's.

Speaker 10 (01:38:26):
Actually what I have.

Speaker 1 (01:38:27):
I was like, I don't think it.

Speaker 10 (01:38:30):
Knows that I was surprised. Are you gonna die on
the excuse.

Speaker 1 (01:38:34):
Me while I try not to die on the air. Yeah,
de lady, since you've been hanging out with his morem juxtaposition,
the songs that we play in the mid breaks, those
are usually all jeffs Now he creates all. So yeah, yes,
apparently he just apparently he just realized that because he

(01:38:55):
just asked in the chat, who what song was that?
And Jeff's like mine, Oh anyway, but yeah, I mean, dude,
this is this has been kind of a fun if
not a kind of sometimes making the hair on the
back of my next stand up kind of topic. But
it's been fun.

Speaker 3 (01:39:13):
You know.

Speaker 10 (01:39:14):
The one thing you know, going into this, I was
thinking about it when putting together the notes on this
is that, you know, we always talk about messi we
always talk about sea monsters. We never talked about the swamps.

Speaker 1 (01:39:31):
I mean that's because who wants to think about the swamps?

Speaker 10 (01:39:33):
Yeah, but they have just as many even just as
many seamans, you know, cryptids, but uh, you know it there,
swamps are even worse because they reside in that area
on the edge of civilization, you know where it's like,
you know, they've always been there and we're just encreaching,

(01:39:55):
encroaching into their territory. You know, you need in these
mercury biomes. You know, monsters don't represent you know, the
unknown so much as the uncivilized. You know a while
that they just refuse to stay mapped. And each region's
waterline has its own guardian or predator, you know, a
thing half folklore and yeah, half just a protest against domestication.

(01:40:20):
You know, the shoreline is always culture on the edge
where the frontiers stopped expanding, and you know, the imagination
took over on patrol.

Speaker 1 (01:40:30):
So the Flathead Lake monster of Montana marks the Western
frontier's baptism in the cryptozoology. Flathead is enormous, nearly two
hundred square miles and exceptionally clear, a trait that paradoxically
breeds distortion. The local Salish tribe tells of a time
when the lake was a dry valley until the Great
Spirit sent rain that flooded it and drowned careless villagers

(01:40:54):
who ignored warnings. Only two children survived, transformed into water beings.
When settlers arrive, they got the story's second hand and
turned the survivors into predators. The first modern sidings came
in eighteen eighty nine when steamboat captain James C. Kerr,
kind of wondering if that's where ron Berry much might

(01:41:15):
not have gotten the alliteration for Kirk's name from, reported
a creature at least thirty to forty feet long swimming
near wild Horse Island. Subsequent witnesses described humps, whiskers, and
even fins. By the fifties, amid Montana, Montana's boating boom,
flatheads monster had gone from tribal parable to regional attraction.

(01:41:36):
The most famous case occurred in nineteen fifty five, when
an entire family on a fishing trip claimed their motor
sputtered as a massive form passed beneath them. They fled
to shore, convinced they'd seen something older than the lake itself. Okay,
that that would freak me out.

Speaker 10 (01:41:58):
Yeah, you know, I mean, skeptics blame a giant sturgeon.
You know, it is logical they're there, and you know,
sturgeons exceed six seven feet and pulled from Flatheads depths.
But the pattern remains consistent. You know, the clear of
the water, the more convincing the apparition, you know. Paul Fegelberg,

(01:42:18):
a local historian, once equipped Flatheads water is so pure
you can see your delusions coming a mile away.

Speaker 1 (01:42:27):
That's good, that's good.

Speaker 10 (01:42:28):
Yeah, yeah, I mean this really should be in the
Lake Monster segment, but it's still yo. It's even in
the shallows. You know, the monster you can almost photograph,
but never quite. You know, it's like go ahead, no,
go ahead, well no, I mean yeah, it's just I

(01:42:54):
had a point then anyway, lost it. Sorry, gone, that's
the same thing.

Speaker 1 (01:43:00):
I was going to make a point, and then I
got distracted and then I lost it too.

Speaker 10 (01:43:05):
So yeah, down, Mike, what's that? Go ahead?

Speaker 1 (01:43:10):
No, I would no, go ahead. We keep stepping on
each other.

Speaker 10 (01:43:12):
Okay, yeah yeah. Down in Arkansas, you know you've got
the White River Monster. Yeah, that's It's in the civic record.

Speaker 4 (01:43:23):
You know.

Speaker 10 (01:43:24):
The earliest tales go back to the Civil War, when
soldiers supposedly supposedly saw a giant creature surface near Newport.
You're describing it as gray and wrinkled an elephant, you know,
rinkled like an elephant. Yeah. Nothing never again reported until
July nineteen seventy three, when fishermen reported an enormous animal
the size of a box car. Arkansas Fish and Game

(01:43:47):
officers took sonar readings and detected a large moving object
of considerable mass, you have. The story gained momentum when
a local housewife, Betty Saunders, produced photograp showing a hump
in the water and images. The images were indistinct, but
persuasive enough that the state legislature took the unprecedented step

(01:44:08):
of designated part of the White River as the White
River Monster Refuge. It remains illegal to harm or capture
the creature. You know, it's recognition of the myth and
you know, the ecological heritage. Yeah, fishing game, US fishing game.
Biologists later suggested the creature might have been a manatee

(01:44:30):
displaced northward by flood currents. But over two hundred years,
Newport's residents didn't want a tourist friendly manatee. They wanted
the monster. Local boosters adopted Whitey as the mascot, hosting
festivals and selling plushies, and that, you know, as an

(01:44:54):
anxious reaction to the you know, the brand of who
you know, maybe it was a manatee. Yep, yeah, white
He thrives on being officially unconfirmed. So again that's the
one thing.

Speaker 7 (01:45:08):
You know, it.

Speaker 10 (01:45:10):
Every region leans into their lake monster and the river monster,
and you know, I mean, yeah, it's tourism, it's kitsch,
and it's you know, it's good for the economy. But
they get into it, you know, the locals get into it.

(01:45:30):
And so that is the whole identity.

Speaker 1 (01:45:37):
It's all about the monster game. Man, It's all about
the monster game. Yeah. It's it's funny because a lot
of these monsters that have become tourist traps, they really
do thrive on basically being unconfirmed, because it's it's almost
better for them that the the myth and legends still
abound in a lot of ways because it's easier to sell,
I think.

Speaker 10 (01:45:57):
But you know, and sometimes you have to wonder. It's like, okay,
so when they go and do all the sonar readings
and hydrophone readings and everything, you know, it's like, do
they take into account if we firmly say that there
is nothing here? Are we going to kill this town's tourism?
You know, are we going to bankrupt this town by
saying it. I mean, there's always that chance. But you know,

(01:46:22):
I keep coming back to, well, they're scientists, you know,
they would actually want you know, you can't by getting
back to it, you can't prove a negative, so you
can't prove nothing's there. And I mean, on the other hand,
it's just as easy to buy a scientist as it
is a politician, sometimes easier. And then you got a
Lifetime movie where you know, the you know, the plucky

(01:46:45):
little college grad out to prove that you know, they're
absolutely local myth is absolutely false, falls in love with
the local fishermen, and then they have a baked Sale
and every hes happy. Yeah, yep, yes, I've watched a
lot of Hallmark movies.

Speaker 1 (01:47:08):
Yeah, you know that's that's funny because I really have not.
I didn't really, but I didn't really see he was
the Hallmark movie kind of guy.

Speaker 16 (01:47:15):
But you know what, I.

Speaker 10 (01:47:18):
I just digged at all the all the sci fi
hotties age out and go to Hallmark and then they
become milfy.

Speaker 1 (01:47:25):
I can see that, I guess. So we're gonna move
to another part of America. We're heading to Louisiana. The
Honey Island swamp monster lurking in the cypress mazes of
the aforementioned Louisiana. The legend began in nineteen sixty three
when air traffic controller Harlan Ford, an avid wildlife photographer,

(01:47:48):
claimed to have film that filmed a tall, hairy creature
walking through the swamp. His death decades later revealed a
roll of eight millimeter footage showing exactly that a shaggy
biped jrudging through reads. The clip is murky enough to feel.
Decades of arguments, locals described the creature as part man,
part alligator, with clawed feet and glowing amber eyes. Skeptics

(01:48:12):
have chalked it up to escaped circus animals or misidentified Nutria,
but the story's deeper function is sociological. The Honey Island
Swamp lies between New Orleans modernity. I don't know, my
modern idiot, I don't know. That's an extra throwing me off.

(01:48:34):
But anyway, and Cajun isolation. Its monster stands as a
kind of limital gatekeeper, policing the border between civilization and
the primordial. As folklorist Andrew Colb observed, the swamp monster
is not about fear or what's fear of what's out there,
but fear of what we left behind.

Speaker 10 (01:48:57):
Yeah, on thet you've got the the Alta Mahaha. That's
fun to say that one haunts the title marshes of
coastal Georgia, near to the town of Darien. You know,
the Muskeigee people told of told Alta Mahaha river spirit
resembling a giant snake with a catlike head. That's new.

(01:49:21):
The first documented central report appeared in eighteen thirty, describing
a creature resembling a sea lion surfacing near Saint Simmons Island.
Modern sighting sightings cluster around the eighties, often tied to
local paper mill workers who claimed to see the creature
while patrolling the waterways. Nineteen eighty one, newspaper publisher Jim

(01:49:46):
Dawson reported a twenty foot animal with two protruding humps.
State biologists investigated and found nothing. Of course, Nonetheless, Darien
lead in commissioning a cartoon mascot and holding alt festivals.
The beasts became a totem for ecological anxiety, appearing whenever
pollution scandals or fish die offs dominated the local headlines.

(01:50:10):
You know, as if the marsh developed a spokesman.

Speaker 1 (01:50:15):
And heading back across the Atlantic for a moment. Selma,
the Norwegian lake serpent of.

Speaker 10 (01:50:22):
So short.

Speaker 1 (01:50:26):
I'm gonna let you say that, trifts into the American
psyche through the global information Tide. Sightings in seventeen fifty,
eighteen eighty, and as recently as nineteen ninety eight describe
a long, dark body and looping movements an Arctic cousin Tanssi.
Norwegians treat Selma less as monster than neighbor. Locals even
built a monument to her honor. By the nineteen nineties,

(01:50:49):
transatlantic coverage began linking Selma to the Scandinavian diopora in
the Midwest, suggesting immigrants carried their water myths to the
New world. In that sense, flathead serpent is Selma's grandchild
by focal or migration, which is an interesting thought.

Speaker 10 (01:51:10):
Yeah. Yeah, well, I mean it's one thing with the
you know, these swamp and marsh monsters. Yeah, they occupy
a unique ecological niche in the American imagination. They thrive
where industry meets the wilderness. You know, the White River
Monster surface when dredging and levies disrupted Arkansas wetlands. Honey

(01:51:32):
Island Beast appeared when new air routes cut through the bay,
the Bayou al to Mahaha. It's revival coincided with river
pollution debates. You know, each creature seems to be a
local conscience, you know, rendered as a cryptid.

Speaker 1 (01:51:51):
I don't know if I like this description because it
kind of sounds like cryptids are being hijacked by hippies.

Speaker 10 (01:51:56):
Well, yeah, say I feel Yeah, that's an interesting point, Jeffter,
like locus. You know, what if aquatic cryptids lay dormant
for years only to resurface periodically.

Speaker 1 (01:52:10):
That's an interesting thought.

Speaker 10 (01:52:11):
Yeah. So biologyst have often no I was just thinking,
I was just expanding on that. That's uh, that's an
interesting thought, you know, kind of like it shows up
every twenty years. Yeah, but it always seems like, you know,
we go through that pollution cycle with our waterways too. Yeah,

(01:52:34):
it's we get outraged because the mercury gets too high
in the water, so we you know, and then we
get all these sightings around, then the local industry cleans up,
and then twenty years later everybody's forgotten it and the
whole cycle starts again.

Speaker 18 (01:52:51):
You know.

Speaker 1 (01:52:52):
That might that might be a fun tease episode to
come back to one time, because we could do cryptids,
the the cicadas of legend.

Speaker 10 (01:53:00):
There we go, I mean, they do all sightings coming flies.
It's I mean, I've been long enough to see three
big foot flaps, you know, fapsh good point.

Speaker 14 (01:53:15):
Oh, but.

Speaker 1 (01:53:18):
Biologists have actually attempted rational explanations for almost all of
these things, including such things as garfish, manatees, stray seels,
misperceived logs. The patterns fit, but the timing off of
atrace coincidence too. Need to ignore. Monsters appear exactly when
communities fear they're losing control of their environment. It's the

(01:53:39):
ecosystem speaking in folklore's accent, and in some cases, tourism
naturally follows terror. The White River Refuge remains the only
US legal protection for an unverified creature. Flathead Lake sells
plush serpents besides huckleberry jam. Honey Island offers swamp tours
promising encounters with the unknown. Darien's Visitors Center uses a

(01:54:02):
cartoon serpent to sell taffy. The commerce of mystery keeps
the myth buoyant.

Speaker 10 (01:54:10):
Yeah, I mean, well, there's also the military industrial shadow
in this military dustrial shadow in this too, is that
you know. In several Honey Island and al To Mahaha reports,
witnesses mentioned glowing lights under the water, you know, possibly chemical,
you know, swamp gas, you know, bioluminescence, whatever, possibly something stranger,

(01:54:31):
you know, And seventy five two fishermen near Darien described
an illuminated form that rose and then snapped off its
light as if it knew it was seen. Yeah, it's
haunting because it implies awareness on these, you know, and
the line between pollution and presence collapses. You know, maybe

(01:54:53):
the river really does have eyes.

Speaker 1 (01:54:56):
Well, we know the hills that the hill hills, and
they still have eyes.

Speaker 21 (01:55:01):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:55:02):
From a symbolic perspective, swamp monsters invert our usual cosmology.
They are not fallen angels of the deep, but Earth's reclaimers,
creatures of mud, hybrid, amphibious, unashamedly transitional. Their very physiology
mocks are taxonomy, and they are they reptile mammal spirit.

Speaker 10 (01:55:25):
Yes.

Speaker 1 (01:55:26):
And they appear yeah, and they appear precisely where categorization fails.

Speaker 10 (01:55:35):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:55:35):
You know.

Speaker 10 (01:55:36):
Culturally, these unify them the mythic serpent with the American
frontier ethos. You know, the settler narrative always required wilderness
to conquer when none remained. You know, the folklore built
it underwater. The swamp became the last frontier, and its
monsters the final resistance. The beast in the Bayou is
simply you know, the land saying that no language scales

(01:55:58):
and eyeshine.

Speaker 1 (01:56:02):
So in this contect our context that sorry, tried to
get on there for a second, still talking, I thought
I masked it pretty well. It's just why the word
was kind of muffled. The monster's ambiguity is essential a
confirmed species within this story, the function of flathead, whitey

(01:56:26):
Alti and the Honey Island Beast is to remain almost
credible forever, at the edge of revelation. They embody the
thrill of the possible, a civic heartbeat of what if,
which is an interesting take. But I still kind of
feel like the hippies have hijacked some of my favorite legends,

(01:56:46):
and I don't know how I feel about that.

Speaker 10 (01:56:49):
Yeah, you know, each of these American outliers reasserts itself
with some truth of the regional dialect that nature will
never be fully tamed, you know, whether glimpse in the
shimmer of flat Head surface or the you know, phosphor
and currents of Honey Island. The monsters remind us that
the wilderness isn't gone. It's I mean, I live in

(01:57:09):
the big wilderness, and uh yeah, it's you know, we
talked about this last week. There's just places I've been.
I've been to dozens of times, but one time it
just said, you, you know, in the back of my head,
you don't belong here right now, get out right you'll

(01:57:31):
go you.

Speaker 1 (01:57:33):
Yeah, So that's actually happened to me before.

Speaker 10 (01:57:35):
But when you think of California, you think your big,
built up cities and everything, but I'm up in the mountains. Yo,
I'm in you know, Ansel Adams territory, and it's it's
it gets creepy out there.

Speaker 1 (01:57:49):
Man, damn it, Jeff, what's that insert future I'm gonna
gift this one tastes funny, eh, Jeff.

Speaker 10 (01:58:03):
A whole bunch of information on discord that we could
use for water services or you know, water cryptis a
cicada with their dormancy patterns and everything.

Speaker 1 (01:58:17):
Yan.

Speaker 10 (01:58:19):
Yeah, but I mean so anyway, the wilderness isn't gone.
It's just submerged, and occasionally it surfaces to remind us
who's really in charge, once again, reminding us that we
weren't always the apex predator.

Speaker 1 (01:58:30):
And I mean really, in most cases we're still not.

Speaker 10 (01:58:33):
We like to pretend we are, but yeah, well, I
mean but it's I mean, we're the apex predator until
we put a toe in the water. And I think
that's what's really creepy about this too. The creepiest thing
about it is that, you know, we will never be
the apex predator in the water. We are out of
our element. We don't belong there. We need special accouterments

(01:58:57):
to go there.

Speaker 1 (01:59:00):
Kind of like before we could learn to fly, kind
of like before we learned to fly, and everybody was like,
if God wanted us to fly, men would have wings.

Speaker 10 (01:59:07):
Yeah, really condisation, If God intended me to fly, he
would have bought the ticket.

Speaker 1 (01:59:12):
Nice. Oh, but so I don't know. My takeaway from
all of this tonight is kind of kind of deep.
I know, bad pun because we're talking about water, but
water remembers every civilization that has ever gazed into it.
We populated with monsters because we can't stand it's silence.

(01:59:33):
The lakes give us shadows that move when nothing should.
The river's whisper of survivors that refused extinction, from lockness
to the bayous. Each ripple tells the same story. We
fear stillness more than teeth.

Speaker 10 (01:59:47):
M Yeah, I mean the question with this remains is that,
I mean, if these creatures exist, you know, it's not
one of these creatures exist. If we would notice if
they stopped appearing. Yeah, the myth has become as much
of the territory as the rest of the ecosystem, you know,
a necessary predator in the food chain of belief. Yeah,

(02:00:10):
it's just NeSSI can stop appearing tomorrow, Champ can stop
appearing Tessie, you know, but they'll never be forgotten, you know,
They'll always be part of the legend. And whether it's
twenty years from now or one hundred years from now,
someone will bring it up again and when it's needed most.

Speaker 1 (02:00:34):
Oh man, this has been a fun topic so far.

Speaker 10 (02:00:38):
Yeah, I can't believe I nope, I knocked would.

Speaker 1 (02:00:49):
Might order to do it again?

Speaker 10 (02:00:50):
Yeah, no, I specifically didn't take a nap. I had
to get up really stupid early to go down for
election training. And yes, California is having Yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:00:59):
Well, yeah, you can think you're covernor for that.

Speaker 10 (02:01:01):
Yeah, well, we've only I was talking about it with
the head of Elections and the sense of Newsom has
become governor. I mean, yeah, okay, so we have the
TikTok of the primaries and the general election, but since
Newsom has become governor, we've only had one year off
of elections, whether it's it's a call or this one

(02:01:23):
with Prop fifty.

Speaker 1 (02:01:25):
So since you are kind of in the know of
this stuff, I saw I saw a story today that
kind of concerns me, but I figured i'd talk to
you about it. Apparently somebody is posting online that if
you do your mail in balloting and you vote yes
or you vote a certain way, they can actually see
it the envelope, and they're afraid that'll lead people to
throw it away.

Speaker 10 (02:01:45):
Uh, comes on the county see that. That's what we
were actually kind of joking about that today, because every
county gets to pick their envelope, and in our county
you cannot see into it. You know, it's a lot
of so much of the stuff, I mean, not just

(02:02:05):
in California, but on every level, is that it's handled
by the county. If you don't like especially if you're
in a smaller area, I mean, if you're in a city,
your voice isn't going to carry a lot of weight.
But like if you're you know, if you're rural, and
you know you see shit like that, absolutely complain and
uh you know, generally elections is run by the county record,

(02:02:28):
which is an electable position, so they are beholden to
their constituents. So you know, that's the kind of thing
I would absolutely bitch about. And but in our case,
our our envelopes are solid. Yeah, I mean, you know
you can't see through them. And you're talking with this too.
It's funny as that you know, because I am the
Ada technician. California for its voting machines, I mean, yes,

(02:02:54):
their dominion, but they're not the ones that had all
the problems across the country because California, for as fucked
up as everything is, has the most secure laws for
what can be used for voting machines. And we are
a paper ballot state. So even if you're on the
voting machine, all that machine does is spit out a

(02:03:16):
paper ballot.

Speaker 1 (02:03:21):
Well that's interesting.

Speaker 10 (02:03:23):
Yeah, all right, So what are we gonna What are
we gonna? What are we gonna be talking about next week?
Next week is uh, you know, we've done land, We've
done sea. We're going with the air. We're going with
flying cryptids.

Speaker 1 (02:03:37):
Wait, there's flying cryptids.

Speaker 10 (02:03:39):
Oh yeah, you got the uh yeah, you got the thunderbird,
you got kets A Quaddal, you got all kinds of
flying cryptids.

Speaker 1 (02:03:48):
I don't guess I ever realized. I mean, I recognize
the name kets A Quadda, but I don't guess I
never put that together.

Speaker 10 (02:03:55):
Well it's a Mayan god, but still, but well, I
mean you're in the area of the thunderbird.

Speaker 1 (02:04:05):
Yeah, I recognized that one once. She said it. I
just didn't think about it until now.

Speaker 10 (02:04:09):
Yeah. No, there there are quite a few airborne cryptids.

Speaker 1 (02:04:19):
But yeah, so the question is was wast sa quadala
god or were they just worshiping a CRYPTI yes, Embrace
the Power of vand which.

Speaker 10 (02:04:29):
Is also one of all right, it's one of the
cheesiest uh horror movies from the eighties of the movie
Q nice. Yeah, it's uh that's actually where I learned
to pronounce kats of quatdal.

Speaker 21 (02:04:45):
So.

Speaker 1 (02:04:46):
So, by the way, for those of you that might
be interested, feel free to visit the Kaylor and Radio
store because there is Embrace the Power of v merch
on Seldre just so you know, Yeah, I.

Speaker 10 (02:04:54):
Gotta get one of those. All my coffee cups are
getting chipped. I'm gonna replenish them. I'm we'll just replenish
him with the calor from the calor in store, might
as well.

Speaker 1 (02:05:04):
Yeah all right, well, my friend, I think we have
done the topic justice. We made it all the way
through and we have about eight hundred people hanging out
with us right now.

Speaker 10 (02:05:13):
Excellent. You know you all like the creepy and we
love you for that.

Speaker 1 (02:05:19):
All right, So where can folks find you, my friend.

Speaker 10 (02:05:21):
Uh this week, you know I was going to tell
you I want people to be on man Arama. I've
got to go out of town for a thing. But
this week you will find me Wednesday on Rick and
already with you Thursday with Brad Slager on a culture
shift as we take a deep dive into the Hollywood
entertainment business side. Uh, bring you all the information you

(02:05:42):
need to know about that, and then we're back here
again next week talking about flying cryptids.

Speaker 1 (02:05:49):
I have to say I'm disappointed with how much you've
been letting down the Manisphere the last couple of weeks.

Speaker 10 (02:05:54):
There. You know, it's not my fault. I lost my
voice once and then I've got to go out of town.
I just you know, my chances of making it back
in town in time are about fifty percent. So I
would rather error on the side of caution and no
it'd be surprised. Yeah, hell on this podcast. I'm actually
just teasing anyway. I just hate the word manager, but

(02:06:15):
I still wanted to use it anyway.

Speaker 1 (02:06:19):
That annoys me anyway. You know what executive decision, We're
going out the same way we've been going to break
because I want to hear the song one more.

Speaker 10 (02:06:26):
As far as how about you working for.

Speaker 1 (02:06:30):
Don't look for me to trap, you can find me
tomorrow night at I guess it'll be nine pm Eastern
again because Al is still currently on break with new
show around here called Shit.

Speaker 10 (02:06:41):
I'm on the Charles Project tomorrow too. I'm sorry.

Speaker 1 (02:06:43):
Yeah, yeah, I was gonna say yes, I'm there. I
suck and and well we were.

Speaker 10 (02:06:52):
Oh also real quick, we are putting together The Day
the Earth Stood Still for our kl R and Halloween product.

Speaker 1 (02:07:03):
It should be amazing. Everybody should be there.

Speaker 10 (02:07:05):
It should be fun. Yeah. Yeah, we gotta finds up
the cast list and then uh then, uh well we'll
get we'll get it out. I'm looking forward to.

Speaker 3 (02:07:14):
It, so yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:07:17):
Kingdom and Country tomorrow nights, nine pm Eastern, America Off
the Rails ten pm Eastern on Monday night. Tuesday, the
Daily Show starts up again, so that starts ten am
Monday through Our Tuesday through Friday, Tuesday night Hanging Around
with the manor amacrew Wednesday night Full Boat for everything else.
Check the schedule because I do way too many damn
shows anyway. You can also find me as a contribute
on Twitter dot com. Itsfitspolitics dot com and the Loftparty

(02:07:39):
dot com. And I also produce of Party podcast which
drops on Tuesdays, and you can follow along with everything
I do at Roddy Rick seventy three on X and
everything we do here Kalarm Radio. Related at klarm Radio,
you might notice that we have a square badge and
a goal check for now. That is through the generosity
of a listener, and hopefully we can keep that around
because I kind of dig it too, but we'll see

(02:08:01):
because I can't afford it on my own. Oh all right,
I think that's it. We're going We're going out the
same move we went to break. If you if you
haven't heard this yet, this is the newest offering from Jeff,
who will have an album dropping soon. It's currently under review,
so as soon as it goes public, everybody's gonna know
because I want to. I want to make Jeff be

(02:08:22):
able to retire from his music sells just saying bye, everybody.

Speaker 10 (02:08:27):
He'll hydra.

Speaker 17 (02:08:50):
At of skin, slash Bowler, Lundy.

Speaker 4 (02:08:59):
Video, fragile sounds. They mark my silence, but I'll drag
them down.

Speaker 21 (02:09:21):
With the line.

Speaker 4 (02:09:27):
You call me a les, you call me.

Speaker 20 (02:09:32):
But your old all the proof of.

Speaker 19 (02:09:37):
I am you can.

Speaker 4 (02:09:42):
Samon the shadow on your face.

Speaker 19 (02:09:59):
History s soona songs.

Speaker 18 (02:10:03):
You sign a song save you and the chors strong
and they feed them myth, but they start the true.

Speaker 21 (02:10:12):
So alright, hit boom like worry what you'll try, Sam.

Speaker 19 (02:10:32):
Come true?

Speaker 4 (02:10:37):
You call me leg you call me flick let your
bod to of proof or I am.

Speaker 21 (02:10:49):
Head said you by.

Speaker 16 (02:10:59):
I am me in the way do you feel me
when the slave?

Speaker 19 (02:11:09):
Do you breath of ruth.

Speaker 4 (02:11:17):
Gray?

Speaker 16 (02:11:37):
You call me a legend?

Speaker 17 (02:11:39):
Do you call me firt your father, proof of.

Speaker 19 (02:11:47):
Guy gadle.

Speaker 21 (02:11:52):
SAPs a saddle on your.

Speaker 19 (02:12:08):
Laugh at the water but the water laughs.

Speaker 2 (02:12:13):
Laugh at the water, but the water las

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Juxtober Episode 2 -- 10-11-25 WHEN WATER LOOKS BACK - Champ, Ogopogo, Tahoe rumors & bayou eyes.

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Juxtober Episode 2 -- 10-11-25 WHEN WATER LOOKS BACK - Champ, Ogopogo, Tahoe rumors & bayou eyes.