PSIcoactivo - Dan Cleary on UFO Hearings confusion & Dr. Beatriz Villarroel & Dennis Asberg on Transients

On the latest Psicoactivo, we have a wonderful conversation with my friend Dan Cleary, host of the 'Others from Another Mother' podcast, who is very close to the action at the top of the UFO movement. We discuss his work, the upcoming UFO Hearings, the abduction phenomenon, and we discuss the identity of the three people who are considered first-hand witnesses and will testify next week under oath. One of those names came completely out of left field. 

On a fresh Psicoactivo, we get the chance to sit down with Dr. Beatriz Villarroel and Ocean X's Dennis Asberg to discuss a new discovery on the astronomical plates data & new information about the Baltic Sea Anomaly.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:09):
What's up humans? Welcome to a new sequel Deibo. This
is round three of Professor Matt Lastlow, the founder of
Ask a Pole. How you doing, Matt, Welcome back to
the show.

Speaker 2 (00:21):
Man got my pulse, That's all I can ask for.

Speaker 1 (00:25):
Yeah, man, how's it been over there? Like it's it
was a little bit quiet for a while, And suddenly
over the last couple of weeks you got like a
couple of great exclusives with Berlison and another one with Rounds.
How'd that come about? And what's their reaction been like

(00:45):
with those two?

Speaker 2 (00:47):
Well, just like for our audience at Asket Pole, I
have to apologize because the American Congress is really shitty
at congressing.

Speaker 1 (00:56):
Oh jays.

Speaker 2 (00:57):
They had to cancel their last week when they were
supposed to be in session just because shit, it was
such a shit show in the house, like Republicans fighting Republicans.
So once they canceled that week and started their annual
month long August recess, the American Congress is only going
to be in session three weeks between the end of

(01:18):
July and November because they're taking all of October off,
which some people are like, all right, that's good. So
they can't mess anything up, but folks like our community
who actually care about policy, it kind of does screw us.
But I'm also curious with the UAP UFO issue because

(01:40):
it's been so nonpartisan, not even bipartisan, just nonpartisan for
the most part. That's where I think there is a
little bit of sunlight. And from what lawmakers are telling me,
it looks like we might have some hearings. Congressmen Luna
and Paulina Luna, one of the coach here is the
UAP caucus. She told me in one of their last

(02:03):
weeks here that the House is like one hundred percent
according to her, She's like, yep, we're gonna have a hearing.
She said it's going to be chaired by a female
and not by Congressman Grothman this time. And looking at
all the subcommittee chairs on oversight, it looks like it
might be Nancy Mace chairing that hearing.

Speaker 1 (02:24):
We'll see, but she makes sense.

Speaker 2 (02:26):
That and she's been active on the UAP issue. Yeah,
so it could have a different tone. And Ludas also
told us instead of UAPs, they want to look at
usos so under water. So it doesn't seem like it's
going to be one hundred percent focused on USOS, but
that's going to be a big part of it. So yeah,
we'll see. It's intriguing because then send her jilibrand you know,

(02:49):
other side of the Capitol, because the House is a
different universe than the Senate. Gillibrands told me all summer
that she plans to have a hearing or she's talked
to Arrow. She said Arrow agreed to come to a
public hearing. Or she wants them to explain their methodology
and stuff, because she's like, there's so much skepticism about

(03:13):
the stuff that they're saying they identify, so she wants
them to go through and explain it to the public.
But then she also wants them to explain the stuff
that they can't see. Like, this is the funniest thing
about this issue you have, Like these skeptics be like, look, Arrow,
they know like eighty ninety percent of the stuff, Like,
come on, no issue. I'm like, cool, we don't care

(03:35):
about the eighty ninety percent. We're talking about the ten percent,
you know. And so like the stuff that they literally
can't identify, that's what we're intriguing about. And so I'm
interested to see what Errow presents to us. You know,
like we're all rightfully skeptics, especially of Congress and so

(03:58):
and of Arrow so, and I know lawmakers are too,
so that could be interesting. And Jillibrand said, either July
or September. Well, July came and went, I didn't get
an interviewer before they started their recess in the Senate.
So according to what she told me last when the
Senate comes back in September, either then or October, we

(04:19):
should be getting a public UAP hearing in the Senate. Again,
it's an election year, and so I can really imagine
them coming back and gabbling out or just doing bs
hyperpartisan messaging bills in both chambers. But again, because this
issue is so nonpartisan, this might be one of the

(04:40):
few issues where leaderships like, yeah, do a hearing. We'd
rather people be focused on Congress doing an investigation into
something where you all are kind of united, as opposed
to like having more Republican on Republican violence in the House,
where like Republicans are derailing Republicans' agenda, which to me

(05:01):
is glorious.

Speaker 3 (05:02):
Have you not noticed that because we've been talking about
this Christian nye that with the election coming closer. A
lot of this, uh, politicians from both aisles have gotten
a little bit partisan on their like public posts and everything,
and they've been criticized for it by the UFO community

(05:26):
quite a bit.

Speaker 1 (05:27):
What's your read on that? What do you think about
what's happening there.

Speaker 2 (05:31):
Well, so it's been interesting because again it's it's been
funny for me watching some people from the outside kind
of try to like insert politics into the issue. Remember
that Adam Kissinger, he was on the January he was
one of the two Republicans him and Liz Cheney with
the two Republican like never trumpers on the January sixth committee.

(05:55):
Well like he tried to like dunk on the UAP
h U, but dunking on the UAP caucus, being like, look,
a lot of these people in the UAP caucus like
their Freedom Caucus folks, you know, the furthest right people
in the House. There's like bomb throwers. They're like Burchett
and Nancy Mace and Luna was kind of a part

(06:17):
of it, but they are not Luna, but Nancy mas
and Burchette. They were two of the eight votes to
House Speaker McCarthy. You know, so that brought chaos from Republicans,
and Republicans controlled the House, and so when Adam Kissinger
or whatever, people were looking there like, look, these are
the far right folks. We're like, all right, so you're

(06:37):
talking about Burchette Luna, But don't forget when they when
I've like sat outside of the skiff some of the lawmakers,
especially in the second skiff briefing this.

Speaker 1 (06:47):
Year, when more Garcia, right, well.

Speaker 2 (06:50):
No, so we had yes Garcia, but we also had
aoc in there. We had Congressman Jamie Raskin, who's the
top Democrat on over. He was also one of Trump's
impeachment managers. And so the fact that he cares about
the issue along with these people from the far right
does show that this issue is nonpartisan, which makes it

(07:14):
like very rare in a hyperpartisan Congress. But like you
were saying, because it's now an election year, and because
Democrats in the House are just like the minority party
in the House, just the way it's set up, they
have no power. Like in the Senate you have the filibuster,
so every senator is really powerful and really matters. In

(07:36):
the House when you're the minority party, like you're just
screaming at the wind, and that's what they do. They
scream a lot and in the wind, which these days
means on social media. So that's where it was interesting
seeing Garcia kind of insert a little bit of partisanship
into it, which then was like, I guess Republicans kind

(07:57):
of like HITMA a little bit like he also did
it in a policy way, so he introduced the Schumer's
uap DA amendment in the House to try to attach
it to the NDAA. That wasn't from what I know
and what I see, and I've been covering this stuff

(08:17):
eighteen years, that to me wasn't a serious legislative effort,
even though like these days, pr is policy and so
maybe it was, and he could make an argument that
it was, but I'm going to argue he's a professor Laslow,
that it was you know, him playing partisan politics and whatever.
He raised the issue, you know, he got it talked

(08:40):
about because no one was really talking about the UAPDA
because it seems like this year's National Defense Authorization Act
or NDAA, it seems like once again it's going to
be crafted behind closed doors by party leaders. So it
some can say some or Garcia could say look, I
elevated the issue, I got it talked about, and I
want to it offered as an amendment. If he really

(09:03):
wanted it to be an amendment offered, he likely would
have talked to one of the co chairs of the
UAP caucus because they are in the majority party, and
because some of them did out Speaker McCarthy, so Speaker
Johnson's kind of terrified of them. He won't admit it publicly.
But so that's where again Garcia would say, no, it

(09:26):
was a serious policy move, I care about it. Putting
in it smelt like politics. And after that happened, the
House kind of did quickly move on past it. And
maybe that's why Luna and the others are now like, yeah,
we're going to have a UAP hearing. Maybe Garcia is
the one who forced them because they're the majority party
so they get to decide hearings and stuff. So maybe

(09:48):
Garcia's political ploy worked. But yeah, I think it's been
good for the issue to stay away from the hyperpartisan bs,
you know, especially right now, dude, America these days gross
like yeah, book bands, so like books and literature has

(10:10):
become political brunches, you know. Drag Queen brunches. They're now
political everything like sports, you know, after the BLM movement,
it's like everything these partisan hacks try to like make political.
And what I want to do is remind people no

(10:33):
politics or policy is supposed to be people. And so
these politicians, yeah, they're great at selling fear, but all
they're doing is raising money off the fear that they're selling. Like, no,
force them back to policy.

Speaker 1 (10:46):
Just yesterday, psychedelic therapy took a hit, right.

Speaker 2 (10:51):
I did see that FDA.

Speaker 3 (10:53):
Yeah, that was awful, And that's also politicized heavily.

Speaker 2 (11:00):
But that's also an interesting one because that for folks
who don't know, this is like psychedelic assistant therapy stuff,
so like psilocybin the stuff and mushrooms like they've been
using that. And here in Washington, DC, we didn't legalize shrooms,
but voters, via a referendum a couple of years back,

(11:21):
they literally voted to make it, like the least, what
do they do? So they didn't decriminalize it, but they
made it so if officers come and see with a
pound of shrooms, but they also see a broken window,
they legally have to go and deal with like the
broken window, you know, like it's totally been deprioritized and

(11:44):
like the taxpayers said, we just want the politics out
of it, which to me, I'm like a little terrified
by that because I'm like, the last thing we need
is Matt Gaetz eating a fucking eighth of shrooms and
ruining it for all of us.

Speaker 3 (12:00):
Oh man, dude, dude, I have I have, Like I've
been talking about this with my mates from high school
that if all politicians get like a horror trip dose,
everything would change, like overnight.

Speaker 1 (12:14):
Many of them would like quit politics altogether.

Speaker 2 (12:18):
Right, Yeah, they'd seek through their own bullshit, one would hope.
So that's been interesting. And again AOC and Congressman Dan Crenshaw,
a veteran, they've been kind of leading on that. And
when AOC first got here to Congress back in twenty eighteen,
I believe like the squad was just becoming the squad.

(12:41):
She put it up, it's an amendment, uh, and everyone
kind of laughed at her. Well, then all these lawmakers
started getting calls their offices were like, wait, why'd you
oppose that? Like you know, my son who's a veteran,
or my husband who's a veteran, my wife who's a vetter,
they could really use that, And so the next time
it came up, she like doubled the amount of votes,

(13:02):
and so instead of people like rolling their eyes at it,
people then like took it seriously and looked into it.
So I'm a professor at Johns Hopkins our master's program
here in DC, our government public policy program. I need
to get myself to Baltimore, where I guess Johns Hopkins
in Baltimore, like our main campus, We've got like the
world's leading like psilocybin Center. I think it's funded with

(13:25):
like a billion, maybe fifty million, maybe five hundred million bucks.
But they've been doing such cutting edge research. And that's
where lawmakers are still stuck in this stupid war on
drugs mindset, like oh, lock everyone up when it's like, wait,
the stuff that you all declared as drugs, while like

(13:46):
oxy cotton, you all pedal and allow pharma to pedal
all this crap that gets as addicted. It leads to
this opioid crisis. Actually, some of the stuff you were
calling drugs might actually be medicine to a lot of people,
and like even with cannabis. So I used to cover
drug policy for Rolling Stone Playboy, Vice Vice News Tonight,

(14:08):
one of my Rolling Stone pieces leads with like, I
wasn't I gave him the guy an nimity because he's
a federal worker who uses cannabis, so he risks losing
his job every day. He starts with like this guy
he's in a wheelchair because he lost both of his
legs in Afghanistan, lost fingers on one hand, just like

(14:29):
totally nimed in a roadside bomb over there. Ied. What
he tells me in that piece is that he would
rather be blown up again in Afghanistan than go through
Oakwood withdraw again. And he's named he needs help. He
gets that through cannabis and says literally And I asked

(14:51):
him again, and you could he paused when I was
interviewing him, and he thought about it, and he was like, yeah,
I'd rather be blown up again. And then I asked
him again. I'm like, really waited eight seconds and say yeah,
I would literally rather get blown up again and go
through opioid withdrawal.

Speaker 3 (15:10):
The thing is that they don't realize that this withdrawal
from opioids gives you like ten times a PTSD you
have from any traumatic experience.

Speaker 1 (15:21):
So it's and then I don't know why to decide that.

Speaker 2 (15:24):
But then you can't get more oxycont easily, but you
can easily get fucking heroin. And that's where it's bullshit.
It's over there. But I actually just started buying. I'm
giving them out to all my friends, but little test
strips for fentanyl. Literally everyone should have them, like the
whole idea, like just say no. Cool. That's what my

(15:46):
parents told me before I became a raging, homeless coke head,
you know, and it's like no, the war on drugs,
like to just say no, that's bullshit. What do we
have now? Well, for one, we shu have better studies
and research because guys, marijuana sulicidal. That's not for everyone,

(16:06):
like I'm it's worked for me. Everyone's different, and so
this is where you all need to like go out
and talk to experts who areever to feel it out
very slowly for yourselves. But that's where just broad prohibitions
were so dumb. Like I also have like narcan. Oh,
he's in my bag. I just bought another thing of

(16:28):
narcan for the Capitol because I'm just gonna have it.
Like I started a little library in the press gallery
Senate Radio TV gallery, some narcan up on top because
people are like, wait, that's a done problem, Like who,
what do you mean? No one's overdosing in the Capitol
until they do. Yeah, we don't know I've been overdose yet.

(16:49):
But oh my god, there's so many drugs done on
Capitol Hill. Like they're literally pharmacists who for some of
these big political groups, the pharmacy comes in and just
writes them scripts for whatever they want. And his pharmacists
are on retainer ten thousand bucks a month just to
come in and write scripts for whatever they want. So
like it's not in us versus them thing. Guys, we're American.

(17:13):
We all fucking love drugs, Like that is what the
War on drugs proved, as long as we got pharma
or pharma peddling this ship for free or you know,
making billions off it. But the whole system is just
stacked against us. And that's where it is exciting seeing
some of that stuff being challenged again and kind of

(17:36):
you have the bullshit artisanship. But Joe Biden is that
old school just say no mindset. I think his brother
struggled with alcoholism or maybe his dad, so he's just
like never touched alcohol and has always been opposed to
substances like cannabis, and that the parties kind of pulled

(17:58):
him a little bit and moved him on that issue.
Not totally, but even seeing Trump's press conference on Thursday,
I believe Trump was asked about it, and Trump while
he was like, yeah, I'm not really you know, he's
like threatened to kill He's started to do it thette
and like kill drug dealers, you know, which send shivers

(18:21):
down my spine because I've been a drug dealer in
my past and my good friends were drug dealers. Thought so.
But Trump he was like yeah, because he was asked
about marijuana rescheduling, and he was like and it was
so kind of beautiful because he was thinking it through
and he's like, welleah, it doesn't make sense for people

(18:42):
to be in jail for what's legal out here. Hey,
fucking men, amen, you know, and like take the part
of some ship out of it. Like good job Trump,
Like you recognize the humanity and the stupidity of the
fact that I can grow and I have grown my
own marijuana right out in back of my crib. There
are people locked up in jail like two and a

(19:04):
half miles like my neighbors locked up two and a
half miles away for something that I can now grow legally,
and that's just insane, insane.

Speaker 3 (19:14):
Makes no sense, and it's kind of I don't know,
I get I get a little hopeful when I see
issues like this and the UAP getting nonpartisanship. That's that's
really cool. It's it's wild in these times too, because
because of the election year. But yeah, I really love
what you're doing on Ascopol Drugs man. As you know,

(19:36):
the channel is called Sequakdio.

Speaker 1 (19:38):
I started talking.

Speaker 3 (19:39):
The first topic ever I started talking about was this,
and I do have like a like a ten step
guide on which aspects of getting into substances are the
most dangerous ones so you can avoid them.

Speaker 1 (19:56):
And I do love, I do love what.

Speaker 3 (19:59):
You're doing over the there, man, So kudos to you.
I wanted to see if we.

Speaker 2 (20:04):
Can do so real quick on that. If you all
remember last summer after David Grush dropped his bombshell, you know,
for people who don't know, he's the UFO whistleblower who
did the public hearing last July. Well, once he came
out his thing, I think early June or maybe late May,
I was like, wait, this guy just gave a middle

(20:24):
finger to the entire Congress saying like you all are
being lied to. There is shit that is hidden from you.
And for me, I'm a constitutional junkie, So I was like, wait.
Grush had two claims. First claim is that there's like
recovered crafts, and I'm like, all right, that can be
proven or disproven. You know, it's either physically there or

(20:45):
it's not so. But his second claim was that there
are these hidden SAPs or special access programs that are
ultimately funded by Congress because all funding us to come
through Congress, but that it is funded by Congress but
hidden from Congress, that they don't know about these programs.
And so that's a middle finger to every lawmaker. Like

(21:08):
if you are in this Congress and you have a
whistleblower who's been vetted, you know, who comes and testifies
before Congress, and everyone bipartisans is like, yeah, see, thousand
percent credible. Uh you know, so he's trusted, believed across
all ideologies. And then you yeah for this Congress, Like

(21:33):
even though some of them had like rolled their eyaac
Grush or some have like wanted to tamp it down,
like not have that public conversation. He came out publicly
and said, Congress, you are allowing the federal government, you know,
the executive branch apparatus, to lie to your face. And

(21:53):
this Congress has not disproven Grush. So it's either like
proving falls or let's deal with the reality that he's
described that there are programs hidden from you all. And
that's extra constitutional, like that is outside the bounds of
our constitution, which makes every one of these members of

(22:14):
Congress and utter failure unless they either disprove him or yeah,
give a little oxygen and maybe take them a little
more sense.

Speaker 3 (22:22):
And it's and it's been a year already and he's
not in jail. Nobody has sued him for anything. So
what's happening? You know, I wanted to ask you about that.

Speaker 2 (22:35):
I was going to say, so, Yeah, last year I
interviewed all one hundred senators about David Grush. You can
find that at ascapole dot com. It's actually like pinned
to the top of our UAP page. Well, so this summer,
after the DA started moving on rescheduling examining it, I
interviewed all one hundred senators on cannabis and like specifically

(22:57):
the Safer Banking Act, which like die it gets wonky,
but it's a marijuana measure that allows all cash businesses
now to become part of the banking system and stuff.
The beautiful thing about asking Pole is like you all
in our community send me questions and issues that lawmakers
think they don't have to talk about UAPs, MDMA, cannabis. No,

(23:23):
because of us, they have to talk about them, you know,
or at least they get confronted with it because some
are like, wait, I haven't heard of that. So part
of it, I'm going at Aska poles, going and breaking
news through these lawmakers because they just live in their
own stupid silos.

Speaker 1 (23:42):
Breaking news and breaking the stigma.

Speaker 3 (23:44):
Man, that's what you're helping at, right, And it's so
fucking important, man, so important on both issues, the substances
and UAP. But I think that with substances they've gone
through a similar path historically to UAP, and but that
that stigma was more uh strengthened in the sixties when

(24:08):
it all went down, you know, And it's it's been
like that. It's been misinformation campaigns, it's been uh, multiple
talk shows demonizing everything about substances, uh, lumping them on
the same boat, every single one of them, which is
a big ass mistake, Like you cannot put psychedelics and

(24:29):
opioids in the same boat.

Speaker 1 (24:31):
That's stupid.

Speaker 2 (24:34):
It's literally insane. The fact that like what schedule one,
like crack cocaines the same as like LSD and marijuana.
What the fuck you that? Like really, like, I've gotten
really high in my life, and I've eaten a lot
of stuff. Thank I got the lung cheese, you know, Like, guys,

(24:57):
come on, makes no sense, And I don't recommend getting
super super high and obviously don't drive and stuff. But like, guys,
it's a pretty tame fucking drug, if we're even gonna
call it that anymore. I mean, let's really talk about
the problem diet fucking coke. We have an obesity problem

(25:17):
in America, Like hundreds of thousands of US are dying
sugar in general diets and sugar like for addicts, but
summer legal addicts, you know, and like the American government
we subsidize the like our taxpayer dollars go to subsidize
the American sugar industry, where it's like gets long and

(25:37):
convoluted but like kind of as a fuck you to
Cuba with all embargo stuff, we wanted to take over
the sugar industry. So we still give massive price supports
annually that Congress supports to keep us all addicted to
that while they also allow farmer to do whatever it
wants basically, which keeps us all addicted to that shit.

(26:02):
And like I've had three reconstructive risk surgeries, like I had.
There's a cadaver bone after I broke this snowboarding in
Colorado a few years back, pre reconstructive risk surgeries. So
like there was like a metal plate, like twelve screws
and they took them out, but there's a cadaver bone
in here, And uh, I needed opioids. But what did

(26:24):
I do? Because I know that I've been an addict.
I was a coca attic when I was younger. I
went and cut all my pills in half, and like then,
I rolled a bunch of joints before each surgery. And
so when the doctor said, hey, take this oxycon on
one surgery and then percocetes on another, they said take
one of these every four hours. I was able to

(26:47):
cut my own opioid use in half. Just by eating
half a pill and then two hours later smoking half
a joint and then two hours later taking the other half.
So literally me form more addic was able to cut
my own opioid use in half and like I was
in a lot of pain, like I really needed something
heavy like that. That's where, Yeah, FARMA has done some

(27:12):
amazing things with vaccines. I'm not going to get into that,
but you know, like they've done amazing things medically, but
also fuck them Pharma, Like you know, it's both and
where some politicians are like, no, it's all good. It's oh,
you can't paint people with such a broad brush, like

(27:33):
it's complicated. Fuck you, Pharma, thank you, like you saved
my life, Farma.

Speaker 1 (27:38):
You know it's both and yeah, it's love and hate.

Speaker 3 (27:44):
Yeah, I wanted to ask you about those hearings from
the Lady Chair that is coming. Did you get an
ETA or some estimate of that, because you told me
that Jalli Brown was probably September, But that's a different one.

Speaker 1 (28:00):
What about this other one?

Speaker 2 (28:02):
So jilibrand again that Senate and then in the House,
which the UAP Caucus, Congressional UAP Caucus, they're all House
members and so they're well also here, it's either they
have to do September or else it's not going to
happen ahead of the election because they're already at the
start of the year they were slated to have, like annually,

(28:24):
they have the all of August off because it's really
fucking hot in DC and historically there was no ac
in the Capitol so it would get super stuffy. So
like dating back hundreds of years, Congress has always had
August off. These days, when there's an election year, Congress
also gives it South October off. Like, you guys, this

(28:46):
is like set up to be the worst Congress like
in all history when it comes to like passing laws
and some like Freedom Coucus members pushed back on me
for that, but I'm like, no, no, no, there's the
chair of the Freedom Concus, Bob Good. He was like,
that's bad barometer just passing bills. But I'm like, sir,

(29:08):
even in your efforts to unwind the administrative state, you
guys have failed, Like you guys can't even like cut
spending because you're in such like partisan divide and like
nmes are out so much. So I'm like, no, by
every metric, this is their shit Congress, which is why
some people kind of joking, they kind of not are

(29:30):
like that better the less they're in session, you know,
because sometimes they do with the markets on a little
downward spiral. But so that's where I think there'll only
be three weeks in September where either the hearing happens
in the House or it doesn't. But again, so the
last interview we put on ascot Pole was with Congressman Moscowitz,

(29:55):
Florida Democrat, and it's wild. Go on our site as
pull dot com and listen to it. He it's amazing.
He's like even in the midst And the interview was
a couple of weeks back, so like it was before
Kamala Harris became the Democratic nominee for president, with the
whole town, the whole nation, the whole world was looking

(30:17):
and fixated on Joe Biden. You know, is Grandpa gonna die?
Grandpa knew his job, you know, and so everyone was
fixated on that. Then the former president Trump assassination attempt,
like that became even people who don't care about politics
and people hated that man were hopefully like, no, you

(30:38):
don't shoot an American president. We take him out of
the fucking ballot box, like that's the American way, and
so like all that stuff is just consuming everything in
Washington and making everyone kind of just consumed with that.
So we would think what Moscow it says is in
the midst of all that number one issue, he's asked

(31:01):
about this UAPs out of the campaign.

Speaker 1 (31:05):
That's wild.

Speaker 3 (31:06):
When I read that, man, I was like, no way,
So that means that the interest and he really is growing.

Speaker 2 (31:14):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, he's a politician, but he's not a bullshitter,
so I believe him. And he actually seemed a little
bit surprised. So, yeah, your audience, our audience at asket Pole,
like it might feel like y'all are screaming into the wind,
but hey, Congress is taking note. You guys have changed
the conversation.

Speaker 1 (31:35):
Yeah, and other people that were not into him.

Speaker 2 (31:37):
Into the conversation that. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (31:40):
Yeah, and other people just regular folk are becoming way
more interested recently on the topic. I've been asked a
lot here in Tijuana, which is Mexico, but still it's
it's a global issue, it's not just America. I wanted
to ask you also about uh, one specific photo that

(32:02):
I'm gonna put as we speak that you uploaded uh
with you at a pub in DC.

Speaker 2 (32:10):
Oh oh yeah, this author.

Speaker 1 (32:14):
I'm going there.

Speaker 3 (32:17):
So I know that you guys probably talked of the record,
but I can ask you a few circumbending questions. First
of all, what was your impression of Lou Elissando when
you met him?

Speaker 2 (32:31):
Great dude, genuine, Yeah, I think that's part of me,
is like Lou who the picture? But no, that chat
was off the record. He was in town. It's interesting
because he had come and this actually surprised me when

(32:52):
he was interviewing. Ah, is it Ralph Norman. I always
messed up his name because there was a former governor
of Virginia, but I think it's Ralph Norman, South Carolina Congressman,
because he's a member of this group called the Conservative
Opportunity Society, which part of me Ralph Norman. The former

(33:15):
Virginia governor was Northam and I was, yeah, Ralph Norman,
but he is part of this group, the Conservative Opportunity Society.
That was the group that former Speaker Knuke Gingridge back
in the nineties used to like really for one, Republicans
use that group to recapture control of the House for
like first time in fifty or so years from Democrats

(33:37):
back in the nineties, and so this group is like
a long legacy. It's like kind of it's very conservative,
but it kind of cuts across the spectrum because Norman
I think he's also a member of the Freedom Caucus. Well,
so I was just talking to him and he was like, man,
we just had this great session with this guy Lou

(33:58):
Alexandro And I was like what and so oh and
this was like in the spring, I believe for maybe
early summer, but I think it was even April or something.
Again it's on ascapoll dot com. But he was like, man,
and like you said, like he got super engaged in
the issue just after hearing Lou speak. We don't really

(34:19):
know exactly what Lou told them all in there, but
I think that's where I think we're all kind of
excited to see what's in this book. Have you ordered
a copy?

Speaker 3 (34:31):
Yeah, I got the audible one already, ready for ready
for twentieth because I love reading, though, but uh, there's
just not enough time to just stay focused on the book,
so I like to multitask and right. But yeah, well,
when you guys were there, like, did you get like
a sense. Did he give you tips on how to

(34:53):
ask better questions? What was that exchange like and what
was your impression right after?

Speaker 1 (35:00):
Like, uh, based on what he's doing.

Speaker 2 (35:04):
Him and I enjoyed nice cold pacific O's. Ah. My
brother in law is half Cuban, half Colombian, so we
talked about that a lot. To answer your question, listen
to askipoll dot com and if my questions seem a

(35:28):
little bit better, that's all I gotta say about that.

Speaker 3 (35:34):
Does he have like this revolutionary spirit as the Cubans do?

Speaker 2 (35:39):
Uh, he's got a genuine Oh he's a fucking badass.
Like the first thing you see is his goddamn arms,
and you're like, wow, he can snap my goddamn neck
very quickly. But he's not like and intimidating figure at all,
you know, which I just kind of love, Like this

(36:00):
seems like a cool, genuine dude who can take out
a lot of people if needed. There's one nothing mess with. Well,
he's supposed to be sending me a copy of the
book and then we're hoping to have him on for
me to uh interview ask apoll dot com, So stay

(36:21):
tuned for that and that might answer some of your
questions because that's where all these folks. And again this
like taking it back to Arrow, this is why Arrow
fucked up so royally because they're mandate from Congress. And
like Senator Rubio in one of our exclusives with him
at ask A Pole, he was just kind of like

(36:43):
so frustrated with Kirkpatrick when he's been on this like
redemption tour in the media, you know, blah blah blah
shitting on the issue, like Kirkpatrick, shut the fuck up,
like you have no pedestal, like no BOLLI pulplic to
talk from. You were an utter failure, Like I think
you were maybe even pushed out of Arrow because don't

(37:06):
forget this, folks. We've got all the interviews at Askepool.
At the end of last year, before Kirkpatrick announced to
his early retirement, Jilibrand met with him one on one.
Senator Rounds met with him one on one, pushing him, saying,
you're failing. All these whistleblowers say they don't trust you.
The whistleblowers were supposed to be coming to your agency

(37:29):
are coming to us and saying they don't trust you.
And then it wasn't just jilib Brandon Rounds, who had
one on one meetings with Kirkpatrick, saying that it was
also Senator Warner and Rubio, the chair and the vice
chair of the Senate Intelligence Committee. I don't know if
Kirkpatrick came to the Capitol. It seems like they might
have went to his office. But the two of them

(37:52):
literally were like, Hey, you have to create an environment
for these whistleblowers to feel safe. He didn't. He utterly failed,
and like again the spring, Rubio was kind of like
and you could tell because like senators, they got so
much like they cover it like education, local potholes, you know,

(38:16):
like everything that happens in your state is on the
lap of a US senator, where like a House member,
they've got a smaller district blah blah blah. So senators
they've got a ton of issues on their plates, which
is why they really empowered their staffs and hire, you know,
really smart people to handle this issue, this issue. Sometimes

(38:38):
they also set up agencies like Arrow because of the issue.
Again from the community, y'all made it percolate to the top.
There's all these sightings of UAPs that they just can't
The government doesn't have a good answer for So Congress
set up Arrow, and Rubio's like, why are you asking

(39:02):
me these questions? He's like, that's why they set up Arrow.
He's like, I literally it's like they outsourced their thinking
on this topic to Arrow. And so senators are like,
he's not just failing Arrow's not just failing whistleblowers. It's
failing Congress. Because Congress wanted to wash their hands of
this issue, you know, and present it to us in

(39:23):
a way to like take care of some of the skepticism,
answer some of the questions. It hasn't worked, you know,
like the whole community is basically like, we don't believe
anything Arrow says. Then whistleblowers are like, we don't trust
Arrow with the secrets we want to tell, and so
we'll see what happens with that. It'll actually be interesting
if Jillibrand does have Arrow in for you know, Kirkpatrick's replacement,

(39:48):
Timothy Phillips. If she has them in to explain their
methodology and then explain what they don't know, that's really
going to be like what pardon my French with like
shit or get off the pot. Because Arrow has a
lot to prove and thus far they haven't done it.

Speaker 3 (40:07):
Do you think do you think they're like this monolith
or the incompetence with was just from Kirkpatrick, or do
you think, uh, do you think there's really good people
in there?

Speaker 1 (40:18):
What you read on on on them.

Speaker 3 (40:20):
As a whole, because I've heard that people people want
to I've heard doctor Gary Nolan saying that they should
be disbanded altogether.

Speaker 1 (40:28):
What do you think about that?

Speaker 2 (40:31):
I don't. I don't really know them much outside of
Kirkpatrick and Phillips a little bit. What I've been so
curious of because it's interesting, Like when I talked to
Jim Hines, the top Democrat on the House Intel Committee,
He's like, Arrow says this, They've like done away with

(40:51):
all these blah blah blah UAPs, you know, and they
put out their report. He's got like so much faith
in them that it is laughable because I'm like, wait,
you think one new, tiny little government agency is literally
getting all the information from every other agency, like Colman

(41:15):
is a bunch of lif fiefdoms and silos, And like
the way different administrators in different agencies have power is
kind of like through their secrets, through the stuff that
only they have that makes them powerful when it comes
to like lawmakers or even flexing against another agency. You know,

(41:36):
like this is our jurisdiction, Like this is our purview.
So like it blows my mind. With someone like Hims
just like believes Arrow, I'm like, wait, Arrow, they might
have all the secrets from the Pentagon. Might they might,
but they probably don't. Like literally, there's a lot of

(42:00):
people in the Pentagon, and there's a lot of generals
who don't know all the secrets. You know, again, the
government siloed on purpose. And so then let alone if
we talk about Department of Energy, where Department of Energy
is out it like area fifty one in other spots,
you know which members of the UA peacock has pushed

(42:24):
the Secretary of Energy on for Chat and Luna And
so wait, does Arrow have any claim or jurisdiction over
what the Department of Energy has? It seems like not.
So that's where I have a lot of questions about.
I mean, because agencies wouldn't have subpoena power, but something

(42:47):
like subpoena power where like if you get a letter
from the FBI or CIA and your Department of Education,
yeah you got to respond to that. You know, if
you get a letter from air who you know. And
so that's where especially knowing that Senior Pentagon Brass for one,

(43:09):
didn't want it, didn't think it was necessary, didn't think
these issues were like worthy of talking about with the
American people, or these issues were things that they should
hide from the American people, like it's one or the other.
So like just because Congress started this new group, you
now think they know everything and have all the secrets.

(43:30):
And like that's where Jillibrand again in this year's NDAA,
well to look at our interviews with Jillibrand and Center
Rounds on this issue, because I asked some kind of
point blank like hey, so Jill brand her amendment last
year to the NDA was trying to smoke out kind
of what Grush was saying. There's these SAPs, these hidden programs,

(43:53):
and her amendment like very explicitly said, if there are
any programs that are using fund from this measure, Congress
has to know about him, you know, So they're trying
to smoke it out. When I go back this year
and like, hey, do you think that amendment worked? In
both her and Senator Rounds, like round said it so wonderfully.

(44:15):
He's like, we don't know what we don't know. He's like,
he's pretty certain that there are SAPs hidden from Congress,
but he can't say it definitively because he's wise. He's like,
we don't know what we don't know. And so that's
where thank God for your audience and our audience at

(44:37):
ask a pole, Like Congress loves moving past these issues
and like the only reason it really got on their
radar last year before Grush that his middle finger to
Congress in a polite way, but before he blew the whistle,
American airspace was invaded by that Chinese and after that,

(45:01):
one balloon went from Montana to South Carolina. Then the
air Force shot down three objects in like three days
in three different states. Media was all over those incidents.
You know, oh, missiles shooting. American media loves missiles. You know,
we support the media or the military industrial complex because like,

(45:25):
if America's shooting, we like cover that and then we
ask questions months later, if we even ask questions, you know,
we are terrible what we do. So that's where these
lawmakers were able to quickly move on past all of that,
because again, the media is so schizophrenic and just hops

(45:46):
from stupid you know, pop political story to pop political story.
The beauty of askopols. We don't let them forget, No,
we remind them. And for the last year, each month,
I've been asking people, Hey, who gutted Senate Majority Leader
Chuck Schumer's UAPDA amendment in last year's NDAA, And literally

(46:13):
no one was able to answer that question, like even
sponsors co sponsors of the measure, like Center Rounds, the
lead Republican co author was Schumer of the UAPDA, didn't
know definitively who gutted Schumer's amendment, which is wild. He's
the Senate Majority leader. He's one of the most powerful people, yeah,

(46:38):
in the world. He controls the US Senate and his
amendment was gutted.

Speaker 1 (46:45):
Did you ask Mike Turner about this?

Speaker 2 (46:48):
He won't talk to me, But I really like Jim Hins.
Him and I know each other well. So this is
where I'm curious. Hins told me point blank numerous times,
He's like, no, UAPs never came up an NDAA talks.
He goes, no, we're not doing any investigation. I doe that. So,

(47:08):
like what Rounds in our latest Askepole exclusive with him?
What he said, was what I've been looking for for
a year, because he's like, yeah, the people were negotiating
with now on Schumer's NDAA amendment, the UAPDA, his House
Intelligence and so we've invited I've invited hims On, asked

(47:31):
Pole to do a live session with me because my
question is, sir, either you lied to me or wait,
you do not know what's going on in your committee and.

Speaker 1 (47:41):
You have to go on the show.

Speaker 2 (47:43):
I haven't really put my foot on the gas yet.
I'm gonna you know, we'll see. Yeah, I bet he will,
So we'll see. But the interesting thing is, I think
so Hyme's either lied to me or I think what's
more problem is he doesn't care about this issue. He
thinks it's a non issue. Oh you know, you're looking

(48:06):
at little green man ha roll his eyes. So if
because he doesn't care about it. And remember times replaced
Congressman Adam Schiff. Schiff was kicked off the committee by
Republicans when they got the majority, so he was the chairman,

(48:26):
got booted off. Like if Democrats win in November, Jim
Hines becomes chair of HIPSKI, the House Permanent Select Committee
on Intelligence. So right now, because he doesn't see it
as an issue. He laughs it off. I kind of
believe him when he says, I've never talked to Turner
about this, which means Turner might be like super powerful

(48:52):
and super empowered because he can go it alone, where
like if your ranking member doesn't care about the issue,
but you come as the committee, you can flex and
make it seem like Hymes is there too, you know,
use official letterhead, but because it's classified, uh, you know,
it doesn't hit the light of day. No one's questioning it.
And so like, I'm curious if Turner cares about the issue,

(49:17):
or if one of Turner's donors, you know, cares about
the issue, or not even donors, maybe one of Like
so each committee, there's different agencies that are kind of
the constituency for that committee. So what FAA you know
that the people on Commerce Committee, I believe anyway, like

(49:44):
the people overseeing that, like, hey, FAA, they're not going
to come and talk to the Armed Services Committee. You know,
that's the military committee. And so like all the armed forces,
they lobby and fight for their issues with the Armed
services folks, and they need to maintain and establish good
relationships with those lawmakers because they're very powerful. And so

(50:07):
that's where I'm curious if there's some fiefdom in the
federal government that really cares about the issue and has
Turner's ear, or whether it's the military industrial complex, you know,
and the contractors and some of his donors who had
his ear, or it honestly could be maybe he's got
one staff member who cares about the issue. And if

(50:32):
Turner doesn't care, we know Hines doesn't care, that staff
member might be gutting Sugar's amendment to his face on
behalf of an agency. And again, if Turner doesn't give
a shit about the issue, but his committee's working on it,
some of these chiefs of staff are more powerful than
the lawmakers in this I.

Speaker 1 (50:51):
Think let's just remind me.

Speaker 3 (50:54):
Let's just remind the people where Mike Turner is a
congressman from Ohio, and which Air Force Air Force base
is in there.

Speaker 2 (51:06):
Right, Patterson, that's right? So and he was there, what
do we learn? It's on asket Pole. He was there
with Speaker McCarthy last year before McCarthy lost his job
due to a Republican recession in the House. Yeah, but

(51:30):
that was interesting because I'm like, wait, are they just
not asking these questions. Or when they had a classified
briefing at right Patterson, did they see the jewels? You know,
even if there are no jewels in the jewel chamber? Like,
what did you do at right Patterson? Did you go

(51:53):
to every facility there? Yeah, that's where I mean Turner
because I used to interview him regularly. I used to
be the correspondent for his local NPR station in Dayton, Ohio,
and so he used to talk to me like ten
years ago. Like when I approached him last year, he

(52:13):
was like, I don't do ambush interviews. I'm like, what
the fuck you're talking about? Ambush? Right, that's that's very right.
But then you see him on Fox News and Newsmax,
so like he goes to like the friendly spots to
do interviews. I've been killing him with kindness because I've
been like standing outside of the skiff for these UAP

(52:37):
briefings or whatever. Turner will like see me and instead
of me like always having a question for him, the
last it is like methodical one night and I just go, hey, Congressman,
how are you? And he'll give me like a hearty
like hy and then it'll like catch himself like, wait,
I'm supposed to scowl. I'm like, no, No, I'm just

(53:00):
treating you like i've been.

Speaker 1 (53:03):
Like, that's good, that's good.

Speaker 2 (53:05):
I know. I think we're gonna get exclusive with him
fairly soon. Here.

Speaker 1 (53:09):
Let's hope. Let's helpe you do man.

Speaker 2 (53:12):
Everyone out there, especially if any inspiring journalists don't do
what you're seeing Santa or Fox.

Speaker 1 (53:18):
Shouting the question, be polite.

Speaker 2 (53:22):
Them? What kindness? Yeah, five dimensional chess.

Speaker 3 (53:26):
That's the best advice you can give to any journalist information.
I wanted to the main reason that I wanted you
on the show.

Speaker 1 (53:36):
Again is because I've seen you liking some my smile.

Speaker 3 (53:42):
Besides that, I've seen you liking some of my my
posts on the more the more deep cuts of this issue.
And I know that you you're focused on Congress and
asking politicians questions, but I wanted to ask you how
deep you have gone on the subject, given that you're
talking about it and writing about it all the time

(54:05):
with your exclusives, have you gathered some interest on any
specific topics over the last few months?

Speaker 2 (54:13):
Dude? The beautiful thing about ascapole dot com is we're
only gonna be as good as our community and our
community is really fucking stout. Now, I got like about
four thousand subscribers, a handful of them paid, So you
can subscribe for free, then you get the audio. If

(54:33):
you do the paid tier and support our work, there's
some perks in it, but thank you for the support.
With that. Like in that group of four thousand, it's
interesting because I'll see like, oh, mailed that House dot
gov now following us you know, obviously not a paid subscription,

(54:54):
but I'm like, wait, who's that a staffer for? You know,
so like different agencies or wash US. Also, you will
never know their names. I don't know their names. But
we have some amazing people who are current all and
former military who were feeding me some great questions. And

(55:20):
I literally we are your conduit to Congress, so you
give us your questions. We bounce them off lawmakers and
sometimes that debunks rumors. Sometimes that actually informs lawmakers. Oh
I never knew about that. Like if you actually listen
to our last Moskowitz interview at Asket Pole. I go

(55:41):
up to Moskowitz and I you know, he knows like
these lawmakers when they see me, they're like, shit, we're
we're into our homework. We're out UAP questions and he's like,
I'm like, hey, so that you ain't p hearing and
he goes, you got to talk to Luna and I
was like, no, no, no, I just did. She confirmed it.
You all are having a public hearing after August and

(56:02):
he goes, oh, good. So the first time a member
of the UAP caucus heard about the UAP hearing in
the House was we broke the news and has a
pull to the wallmaker the first time all this like
eighty percent of US senators the first time they heard
David Gresh's name. What's when I asked him about it,

(56:24):
you know? And so that's where I love it. You all.
I'm going to my grave with lots of secrets. So
I'm on all the encrypted apps, WhatsApp, signal, I got
my proton mail, email, dm me or whatever, get my info.

(56:45):
This guy trusts you. I trust you, so you can
pass you my contact. But yeah, through our community, I
am gaining a lot of knowledge. And because Congress and
the government has been uh so secretive, secretive to indifferent

(57:06):
about the issue, sometimes there's just a quick debunking of
a rumor, which is great, and people would be like,
why are you asking that because it's good to have
rumors debunked.

Speaker 1 (57:21):
You cross it out, you know, right, Yeah, that's.

Speaker 2 (57:24):
Where they get these folks to take us seriously, and
because they've been so secretive and then pretended like there's
no there there even though they are secretive about like
there's got to be something there. I guess we're chetting
them say, because like wait, why are they telling us
this is bullshit? But they're protecting the bullshit, you know,

(57:47):
Like yeah, So that's where Yeah, even though it feels like, oh,
nothing's happening on this issue, like people are still writing
it off, like there's a lot of progress being made,
there's a lot of progress this community has made. Just
in the past like three years, Congress has already had

(58:09):
three public UAP hearings, first in the House in twenty
twenty two under Adam Shift. I think Andre Carson hosted
that or chaired that hearing. Remember that was the big
like first one in fifty years. Then the next year
you had Grush, and then now it seems like there'll

(58:31):
be another one and like three skiff briefings just in
the one hundred and eighteenth Congress, at least three on the issue.
Like yeah, This is definitely on many lawmakers radars, and
it'll be super interesting because Adam Shift, he's running for
Senate in California. He's basically the next senator from California.

(58:53):
Unless like Trump landslide like Nixon wins like forty nine states,
then we might not have a Shift, but it seems
like we will Senator Shift, Congressman Shift if he gets
to the Senate, he comes in or respected by Democrats.
Remember he also led one of the Trump impeachments, So

(59:16):
you'll have worked to do with Republicans who are going
to like treat him like the partisan hackenany kind of is.
But he cares about this issue and so that's where
it's been night and day between him and Hymes as
the top Democrat on the House Intelligence Committee. I mean
having a senator who really is passionate about answering these questions,

(59:41):
Like he doesn't roll his eyes, he doesn't have all
the answers, but he takes it seriously that we haven't
seen that in the Senate since Harry Reid and against
Shift comes in with a lot of power.

Speaker 3 (59:53):
Yeah, based on the things you've been told, including secrets,
do you have now like a better grasp or a
better idea of what might be going on.

Speaker 2 (01:00:04):
So I pardon me, And this is where I've got
a lot of questions, and I always have more questions.
And let me put it this way. I cover Congress.
I Congress constitutionally, I suppose, but like they're always going

(01:00:25):
to be inept and because I interview, you know, I said,
I interview five hundred and thirty five liars for a living, Like, yeah,
some of them I really trust, but they're politicians, you know,
And so politicians are going to be political. So that's
where the power of ask a poll is that you know,

(01:00:46):
our sources whatever are come some are in the administration,
some are in the military or whatever they them, and
you all feeding us those questions kind of lets Congress
nowhere to sniff sometimes, you know. And that's where again
I don't think Congress. Yeah, I don't think answers are

(01:01:08):
really lying in you know, a room in the basement
of one of the House Office buildings, you know. So
we as the community to get our answers, or should
get our questions answered, we need Congress to be asking
the right questions to the administration. And so that's where

(01:01:30):
I don't think you know, I'm not going to get
a pulitzer for like solving anything, but it's going to
be kind of It has been beautiful watching Congress kind
of take the lead of our community and like, oh,
sniff around on this thing, sniff around on this thing,
because yeah, according to like this Congress. Well, a lot
of the Uapacaucus members coming out of some of the

(01:01:53):
Skift briefings were like, oh, now we actually know some
locations to look into. So they're slowly gaining more knowledge
and you know, sharpening their questions because that's what they've
said with Arrow under Kirkpatrick especially, like if you asked

(01:02:13):
the question the wrong way, boom you They're like, no,
so you have to be very precise. And even I've
messed up with some of our interviews where I so
what Senator Jillibrand I asked her when she's just gotten
back from a Nevada trip where on her public schedule

(01:02:34):
it said classified meetings with Arrow, Northrop Gumen, and Blackheed
Martin in Nevada. And when I first asked her about it,
I was like, oh, so you on that trip, did
you guys discuss UAPs or whatever? And she's like, it
was classified so she can't talk about it, literally five

(01:02:59):
minutes later, and then she goes in and votes on
the Senate floor. And remember this is classified information. So yeah,
some of these senators and House members, especially the Gang
of Eight folks, you know, top of the Intel committees,
and like the Speaker and minority leaders, they should have
the same knowledge that the administration does if they're asking

(01:03:21):
the right questions. But that doesn't mean the rank and
file will know that stuff because they just have a
higher top secret clearance or whatever. And so that's where
seeing Congress or so anyway, with Jilligran, I asked her
about the classified trip and she's like, can't talk about it.
It's classified. And I'm like, hell, that makes sense. You

(01:03:42):
can go to jail if you talk about what happens
in the skiff, you know, because it's classified. Five minutes later,
she comes off the Senate floor and I was like, oh,
you know, how wasn't avatus I didn't even have my
mic on, but I was like, oh, hi, Nan, you know,
like that was your trip on she goes, oh, it's
really good, and she starts talking about the stuff that

(01:04:06):
she did in the classified a portion just naturally, but
she wasn't divulging classified information, but there was a lot
of that information that she was willing to talk about
when I came at it, when I didn't even ask
a question, but because I started the first question with hey, classified,

(01:04:28):
she can't talk about. So that's where lawmakers again are
learning because it's night and day like all right, But
so that's where it's been interesting seeing lawmakers, for one,
helping each other out sharpening their questions, but also kind

(01:04:51):
of learning like, wait, maybe Ero doesn't have access to
this stuff, or when Burchett and Luna push the Energy secretary,
or like again, doesn't seem like Arrow their portfolio includes
the Department of Energy. And if this all makes the

(01:05:11):
question how much power does Congress actually have over the
contracting the military contractors, you know, the military industrial complex,
And so Congress, because they're finally, after fifty years asking
these questions, we're kind of seeing like this toddler Congress
grow up in front.

Speaker 1 (01:05:31):
Of our eyes.

Speaker 2 (01:05:32):
You know, they might be at a second grade level. Now,
Oh you send me that, send me your responses ask
apoll dot com. Where do you think? Where do you
grade this Congress? Kindergarten, preschool, high school, middle school, I
know right where would you put them.

Speaker 3 (01:05:53):
Bro, I would probably preschool, No, probably elementary.

Speaker 1 (01:06:00):
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:06:01):
I want to just to close out, man, what do
you think UH is going to happen over the next
couple of months in terms of.

Speaker 2 (01:06:11):
The u A PDA?

Speaker 1 (01:06:12):
Do you think it will be gutted again?

Speaker 3 (01:06:14):
U based on what you've talked to Congress people about
do you have do you have hope?

Speaker 2 (01:06:21):
Well, so this one is interesting because again, you know,
this community, the UFO UAP community, UH has given me
like great questions throughout the year, Like ever since they
wrapped up last year's nd a A, I've been asking
about this year's n d a A, And for months

(01:06:43):
and months and months there is just crickets asking center
rounds like hey, is your amendment like Schumer's amendment? Are
you guys gonna like tweak it? Finally, after like six
months in the asking, like I think may Or June
is like, yeah, it's come up and we're doing some tweaks.

(01:07:05):
I was like, what so, like it was progress for
them even to talk about it, because like when the
House did their NDAA this year, UAPs didn't even come up,
and like this the NDAA is the National Defense Authorization
Act the American military, like their presence is global, like

(01:07:26):
they were fucking Titan for ill and for good from
our perspective. So like the every year Congress has to
pass this Authorization Act, it doesn't fund so they have
to do a separate funding measure. This is the authorization measure,
Like we don't really know what would happen if it
didn't pass, Like would the military just like cease. I

(01:07:49):
guess they wouldn't have orders from Congress US, Like it
just never happens. So because it's such a must must
pass bill, but Congress is willing to like shut down
the government every once in a while, every like five
six years. I've covered Congress eighteen years. I think I've
covered five shutdowns. So like they're fine playing a little

(01:08:10):
bit of politics with shutting, like the face of the
federal bureaucracy down. They have not played with fire with
allowing the military to be unauthorized, which means kind of
like we're seeing because again Congress is in the House,
are just going to be back three weeks before the election.

(01:08:34):
They have to pass the NDAA, Like on one level,
that really empowers party leaders and people with these fief jums,
you know, because all the negotiations or you know, every
year portion of that bill is classified, so like they're
already like secret conversations going on about it, and so

(01:08:58):
it's going to be interesting saying so when we interviewed
Centatra Rounds two weeks ago, he was like, I actually
think this according to Rounds and again, listen for yourself
at askapoll dot com. But Rounds was kind of like,
you know what, I think we actually might get our

(01:09:21):
UAP amendment and our tweaks, the Schumer Amendment. We might
get it in because he's like the House, they're gonna
send us their bill, and then in the Senate they're
gonna have what it's called like a manager's amendment, but
it's like they're gonna have their own package, so they
might like negotiations will already have taken place. But because

(01:09:43):
again this is Schumer's amendment, it sounds like it is
getting more of a focus than last year, when this
was like the first time in half a century that
the issue like even you know, came up in this area.
So that's where it feels like Rounds and Schumer are like,

(01:10:04):
all right, last year we started the conversation, got the
ball rolling this year, they're hoping to get some tweaks in,
but Rowns thinks that they might. So again, this is
where it comes up with a House intel Rounds and
Schumer they're now negotiating with it seems like Mike Turner

(01:10:25):
and his people or the people they represent in the
Pentagon or wherever. So that's where Rowns thinks they're having
better conversations this year. And so yeah, he says he's hopeful,
but like not in like a he wouldn't put money

(01:10:45):
on it, but he's like there's a chance, you know,
because of how convoluted this is and because there's not
going to be like the democratic way of doing it,
where Senate passes a bill, House passes a bill they're different,
then the two meet together and hammer out their differences. No,
that's schoolhouse rock stuff. That ain't happening. This is going

(01:11:09):
to be closed those in secret. But again, y'all, especially
any horse state side, let your lawmakers know you care
about the issue, and that the more voices bringing it
up at least puts it on folks radars. So yeah,
I'm very curious to see what happens because remember y'all,

(01:11:32):
Senate Majority leader truck. Schumer's own an amendment was gutted
last year. That's wild, and so part of me is like, wait,
did he allow that to be gutted? Like was this
just a pr move? You know, because you're the Senate
majority leader. If you really are passionate about something, you

(01:11:54):
can kind of do it. Yeah, but then let me
put this out there twenty twenty four politics. And so
you also have in the NDAA like abortion restrictions, you know,
like social policy thrown in, which happened last year, which
was kind of the first time because this used to

(01:12:15):
be a nonpartisan issue. House Republicans last year put in
some social policy I think maybe some transgender like restrictions
and abortion stuff that instantly tied Schumer and Senator's hands
because when they first started negotiations, they instantly were like, hey,

(01:12:40):
these ten provisions have to go. Well. So if you
start negotiations and Senate Democrats are like, all right, these
ten have to go well, you know, Republicans are really
passionate about, you know, abortion restrictions, and that Schumer already
like lost some power. So that's possibly how his men

(01:13:00):
was gutted. Yeah, it'll be interesting now, Yeah, to see
if Schumer cares about this baby or not. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:13:11):
Last couple of questions though, based on that what you
just told me, because there's there seems to be a
lot of discouragement because of how slow it seems to
be going, I don't. I don't think it is really
you've told me that. Uh, there's a lot of proverbs being.

Speaker 1 (01:13:30):
Made, but it's not a hair. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:13:33):
But I wanted to ask you, though, do you think,
based on what you spoke to Lua, Lisandle about, do
you think he's supportive of this government disclosure effort or
do you think he doesn't believe it can happen.

Speaker 2 (01:13:51):
I didn't, We didn't really again refreshing. My biggest takeaway
from that was like, oh, I claim Cuban heritage because
my godson, you know, my brother in law is Cuban,
have Colombian, and so yeah, I really enjoyed getting to
know him as a person. We didn't get into the

(01:14:12):
dot entitle, but I think generally he seems like he's
supportive of disclosure. Taking a step away from lou just broadly,
it seems like what was I gonna say? But it

(01:14:37):
seems like, well, let me put it this way, there's
a lot the uap community has a lot of faith
in the Schumer uap d A amendment. I'm curious. I
think Schumer sees it very differently than the community sees

(01:14:59):
it now, but that it is for him. It's yeah,
he's fulfilling his promise to Harry. That's what his staff
told me last year, because I asked, point blank, hey,
does this have anything to do with David Grush? You know,

(01:15:19):
I even asked Schumer last year, Hey, David Grush, and
he is like grimased at me, growled, but he knew
Brush his name. Go listen to that interview and ask
a poll. And so Schumer and the other co sponsors
told me last year that David Grush didn't come up
at all in their talks. So it feels to me

(01:15:42):
like Schumer and them Schumer's fulfilling his promise to Harry Reid,
because Harry Reid, from a Nevada Senator and majority leader,
was very passionate about the issue. And so I'm curious, like,
is there stuff in that text that the community, you know,
the experts in the community wisely see like, oh, even

(01:16:04):
if Schumer doesn't give a shit about the issue, And
it's just like blowing smoke up reads dead ass? Is
he accidentally passing something that could like actually give a
sunshine And that's where like an imminent domain and a
domain and then some of the other provisions, even like

(01:16:28):
seeing the pushback and how it was tweaked and changed
and got it last year. You're like, all right, did
Schumer carefully craft the amendment with Rounds? And it seems
like they did because Rounds told us the non human
intelligence or whatever. There was a debate about the language

(01:16:50):
that they used, and so it seems like they took
it seriously. That's where I'm curious, the fact that they
didn't negotiate it so much. It seems like last year
Schumer and Rounds and why did Schumer lie down and
let the house you know, roll over him. It might
just be smart legislative strategy, Like last year they cracked

(01:17:14):
the door open. Boom. Once you get your foot in
the door, oh, it's a lot easier to get your
kneecap through the door. To get your kneecap through, it's
a lot easier to start getting some of your thigh through.

Speaker 1 (01:17:25):
That's how the legislation has worked forever.

Speaker 2 (01:17:29):
Like yeah, and so that's where remember Schumering round to
that call a qui askbull dot com. But I think
last maybe November, September, summer October, November, December fitted a
call a qui when the NDAA was finally going through,

(01:17:49):
and so it was still on their minds, like looking forward,
and so I think legislatively they can call it a
win just passing that newter version last year, because again,
now you're through. And what I say is like with presidents,
once one president opens the door a crack and like

(01:18:11):
drives a little preus through, watch out, because the next
president's going to drive a fucking semi truck through that
same hole. You know, they don't like retreat. And so
once something like that has passed, now they can go
and say, look, this guy didn't fall last year. Hey,
now you had a year to think about it. This

(01:18:33):
is what we're trying to say with this. And so
again listen to Rounds because he's like, we're having it
seems like they're having better discussions and negotiations than they
did last year because last year, Rounds and Schoomer's office
they didn't know because it was so convoluted the process,

(01:18:53):
they didn't even know. And I think they were genuine
and not really knowing who they were negotiating against. Well,
this year, Rounds tells us it's House Intel. So last
year no one on the UAP caucus knew so because
no one knew where to take their questions, no one
in the community knew. Hey really pound on House Intel's

(01:19:15):
door and Mike Turner's door. They were given a cloac
as secrecy last year. That I said, Aska Pole just
pulled that veil away and it turns out House Intel's
the culprit.

Speaker 1 (01:19:30):
And that was good man. Yeah took me damn the year.

Speaker 2 (01:19:34):
Yeah, I did like thirty interviews. Somebody didn't even like
put out just because it was so depressing, like all right,
they don't know, they don't know, and but just going
down the list, Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:19:49):
You're the only one doing this man, So god damn.
I want to thank you Matt for being here. I
wanted to ask you if you could tease us with
anything you got going on over the next couple of
weeks or something, Any new interviews or exclusives.

Speaker 2 (01:20:07):
Yeah, we'll be dropping some new stuff, nothing too groundbreaking,
but not this coming week. The week after I'll be
in Chicago for the DNC the Democratic Convention. What Moscow,
it's there, Garcia, So hopefully, yeah, I'll try to hit

(01:20:28):
up Burchette get some info on coming hearing and then
ask them about it and see, can you ask.

Speaker 3 (01:20:34):
Him something for me if you get to talk to him, Yeah,
what's that? Can you ask him what if he could
reveal to you something or anything that he spoke with
Jimi Malsan because they met recently, and it would be
nice if.

Speaker 1 (01:20:49):
We could get his perspective on what he talked about
with Malsan.

Speaker 2 (01:20:55):
Nice who met with him?

Speaker 1 (01:20:58):
Jimi Malsan with Burchette overchet Nice Nice.

Speaker 2 (01:21:02):
Yeah, no, I need to touch base with him. But
then yeah, we'll see and hopefully I also hopefully at
the Democratic Convention, I get Gillibrand and we get an
update on the Senate one. And again this is one
where that hearing might not happen except for I keep

(01:21:24):
reminding her, and so she does feel a little indebted
to the and she feels like she takes the community seriously,
even if she's really like pissed off to annoyed, to
like hurt the community's feelings. Because she's like waffled a
little bit seems to knock the issue, but like she
does take you all seriously, she's just working at Senate speed,

(01:21:48):
you know, and and she doesn't know what she doesn't know.
And so that's where again that's what it's going to
be super interesting once all right, this time, I'm gonna
look for Adam schiff on it too. At the convention,
like having another voice of a senior Democrat, you're seen
as a serious lawmaker, even if Republicans roll their eyes

(01:22:11):
like oh he's a partisan hack, Like he's good at
being what he is. And I think in the Senate
he's going to grow up a little bit. Like in
the House, you're supposed to throw bombs, and he was
kind of like one of Pelosi's like top attack dogs.
So like he did his job. He's getting awarded with
the Senate seat. Hey, bro, once you become a US senator,

(01:22:36):
chill the fuck out. I think a little bit like
you don't got to go on CNN all the time,
like maybe you know, read some classified documents. But I
think it's going to be really empowering to jill a
brand and roundsn't even Schumer because right now in the
Senate you just can look at our list of all
one hundred interviews about David Brush with one hundred senators.

(01:23:00):
It's a depressing frank In list because like only and
at fifteen or twenty had heard of him, ish five
did six were taking him seriously. The rest had heard
about him like look, either couldn't talk about himcause classified
or hadn't looked into him. So again having shift just

(01:23:24):
there taking the issue seriously or at least like so
this is interesting. Diane Feinstein, who he's running for her seat,
she served, but I think she died when she was
eighty nine, longest serving female in Congress or senator whatever.
She was just there for decades and decades, California senator.

(01:23:48):
I think like I looked all over the internet because
I didn't want to, like ask her something that was
common knowledge. She came up with UFOs like a little bit,
but it was I could not find her asked about
the topic. That's where all these lawmakers have gotten a

(01:24:08):
pass on these issues, which is where it's again interesting
hearing the Moskowitz is hearing from constituents on this, Like
when they hear from their constituents, they're responsive to that,
even if it's like blowing smoke up your rear like
they their constituents are their voters, and they're nothing without

(01:24:30):
their voters and their donors. So that's where, Yeah, it's
I think shift could really start a different conversation in
the Senate, and I think kind of empowered Jillibrand because
she seems like she's serious about the issue. But she

(01:24:54):
also again, so she's on Senate Armed Services and Senate Intel.
A lot of the other members on there that we've
talked to roll their eyes at the issue, and so
she has to walk and like, hell, we have to
do this at Askepole. People like hims will roll their
eyes at us, which is where I have to like

(01:25:14):
change my terminology and like meet them where they're at.
Jilibrandt these are her colleagues, you know, this is the Senate, Like, guys,
even though this is a weighty, hufty topic, like uh,
what happened like the war with Israel and Palestine, Like

(01:25:35):
that's a big fucking global issue. You know, they're unrest
in the Middle East, like that should be pressing on
every Senator and that's like people dying daily, Like that's
on their plate. People dying daily in Ukraine, you know, Like,
so there's in this election you know, if you believe
the rhetoric of these politicians, like November is going to

(01:25:58):
like make or break them there according to them again.
So that's where I think Juli Brand will get more space,
we'll cover more power. Want shift is there and he
he came from it was the chair of House Intel.
It's rare for a freshman senator to get a seat

(01:26:21):
on Senate Intel. But that's where Finestein was like, there's
a chance he goes instantly the intel, so which could
be a game changer, could be all right.

Speaker 3 (01:26:35):
Matt, Well, thank you very much for being on on
the show again.

Speaker 1 (01:26:39):
I hope we can do a round four later ye
this year.

Speaker 3 (01:26:43):
Maybe maybe if if a hearing happens in September, we
can schedule something right after that'd be.

Speaker 1 (01:26:49):
Cool, right, all right, man, all right, thank you, Matt.

Speaker 3 (01:26:53):
You have a great weekend, man, and please visit ask
Apall dot com.

Speaker 1 (01:26:58):
Subscribe to ask a Ball dot com.

Speaker 3 (01:27:00):
He's doing the most important work on the UFP topic
in Congress, so please guys go visit ask a Pole
and he has all the excuses.

Speaker 2 (01:27:09):
Beat us your questions. I don't know who you are,
but find me on the signal WhatsApp or just d
m us, but uh, like on our subscriber chat, beat
us your questions because there's so much power in your voice.
Like I'm the media. They roll their eyes at me
when I come and I say, hey, someone is asking

(01:27:31):
you this. There's power in that that I just don't
have because fuck the media.

Speaker 1 (01:27:37):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:27:37):
Man, okay, Matt, take care man, Thank you later, guys,
take care.

Speaker 2 (01:27:44):
Appreciate your boss.

Speaker 1 (01:27:45):
Bye,