November 5, 2025 • 31 mins
What does it take to transition from a high-pressure newsroom to the world of mystery novels? And how can personal tragedy shape a writer's voice? Join us as Merry and Cathy dive into these questions with the remarkable John DeDakis, a former CNN senior copy editor turned novelist and writing coach. 🎧
John shares his journey of reinvention, shedding light on how his journalism background influences his gripping Lark Chadwick series. We explore the power of writing from a different gender perspective and the therapeutic magic of turning personal pain into creative fuel. John offers invaluable advice for aspiring writers, encouraging authenticity and courage in storytelling.
Tune in to hear about John's current projects, including a novel collaboration with his wife, and discover how you, too, can embrace reinvention at any age.
About John
Award-winning novelist John DeDakis (pronounced dee-DAY-kiss) is a former editor on CNN's "The Situation Room with Wolf Blitzer." DeDakis is the author of six traditionally published novels in the Lark Chadwick mystery-suspense-thriller series. In his most recent novel, Enemies Domestic, Lark is a White House press secretary forced to make her extremely personal abort-or-not-to-abort decision in a highly toxic and polarized political fishbowl when abortion is a crime and a dictator becomes president. DeDakis is a podcaster, one-on-one writing coach, manuscript editor, and regularly teaches novel writing at literary centers and writers’ conferences nationwide.
Connect with John
Website: www.johndedakis.com
Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLXDV_HPUqtvvV-j0lyb2BsaZNSW3GCcDP
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/john.dedakis
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/dedakisjohn/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/john-dedakis-4b09a34/
AuthorsDen: https://www.authorsden.com/visit/author.asp?id=38787
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Cathy Worthington (00:01):
This is the EWN Podcast Network.
Welcome to Late boomers, our podcast guide
to creating your third act withstyle, power, and impact. Hi.
(00:22):
I'm Kathy Worthington.
Merry Elkins (00:24):
And I'm Merry Elkins. Join us as we bring you
conversations withentrepreneurs, entertainers, and
people with vision who aremaking a difference in the
world.
Cathy Worthington (00:34):
Everyone has a story, and we'll take you
along for the ride on eachinterview, recounting the
journey our guests have taken toget where they are, inspiring
you to create your own path tosuccess. Let's get started.
Welcome to Late boomers,
the podcast where we talk about what's next
(00:55):
for all of us navigating thesecond half of life with
curiosity, humor, and heart. I'mKathy Worthington.
And I'm Mary Elkins. Every week, we bring you
inspiring conversations withpeople reinventing themselves,
finding purpose, and providingand proving, providing
information and proving thatit's never too late to grow, to
(01:19):
change, or to tell your story.
Speaking of stories, today's guest knows a
lot about how to tell them. He'sa former CNN senior copy editor
for The Situation Room with WolfBlitzer, a journalist, a
novelist, and a writing coachwho helps others find their
voice and their confidence onthe page. His name is John
(01:42):
Didakus.
And John's career is really fascinating.
He's covered politics, worldevents, and breaking news at the
highest levels, but he's alsomade a powerful midlife
transition from hard news tofiction writing. And he's the
author of the Lark Chadwickmystery suspense series, and he
(02:02):
teaches writing workshops acrossthe country.
Now what I love about John's story, Mary,
is that it's one of resilienceand reinvention. After a long
and demanding journalism career,he found a whole new career, and
he still uses his storytellingskills, but in a totally
different way.
And that's something so many of us late
(02:24):
boomers can relate to, the ideathat the skills we've built over
decades can transform intosomething new and exciting and
meaningful into our nextchapters.
Plus, John's also passionate about mentoring
younger journalists and writers.He's been teaching at American
University and doing writingretreats and coaching, helping
(02:45):
others navigate the art andsometimes the agony of writing a
book. I
left because, you know, I'm working on one
myself. But we're going to talkto him about how he made that
leap and how his experience innews influences his fiction, and
what advice he has for anyonewho's ever thought, I've got a
story inside me, but I justdon't know where to start.
(03:08):
So grab your coffee or your notebook and join
us for the conversation with thevery inspiring John DeDagus.
Welcome, John. We're so happy to have you
on Late Boomers.
John DeDakis (03:21):
Thank you very much, Mary and Kathy. It's good
to be here. Do need I do need Ido need to I do need to correct
the record on one thing. I'm noSure. I'm no longer at American
University.
I taught there
Cathy Worthington (03:36):
Okay.
John DeDakis (03:36):
For about two semesters, a long time ago. And
I also taught at the Universityof Maryland, College Park
Journalism, but, that was anthat was almost another life.
Cathy Worthington (03:50):
So you're concentrating full time on on
your fiction.
Right. Excellent. Well, you've had a
long and successful career alsoat CNN. And before that, you
were journalist in radio andprint. So what made you decide
to transition to writing novels?
(04:10):
And when did you know it wastime?
John DeDakis (04:13):
I think the I knew it was time when CNN made me an
editor. Had been a I had been areporter before I got to CNN. I
came to CNN in '88 1988 as awriter. And, probably within a
year, they made me an editor,which is tedious. It's fault
finding.
And I needed a creative outlet,and that's when I started to,
(04:36):
play around with fiction. But ittook ten years to get the agent
that I've got, and, themanuscript went through 14 major
revisions, and she's the thirtyninth agent that I queried. So I
tell my writing students, if youtake good notes, I'll save you
nine years in the process.
Cathy Worthington (04:53):
I understand that. Wow.
Yeah. Excellent advice.
Yeah. Really. Your Lark Chadwick series
features a young femalejournalist as the protagonist.
What inspired you to write towrite from that perspective, and
how much of her is in you?
John DeDakis (05:12):
It wasn't a calculated thing. It was one of
those, serendipitous pointswhere I started when I started
writing, someone suggested thatI should write in a way that
stretches who I am. Never been awoman, at least not in this
life, so I gave it a try. Andand what I discovered is that
emotions are not genderspecific. We all have the exact
(05:36):
same emotions.
It's just that the women in mylife tend to be more willing to
share their emotions, andthey're more articulate about
the emotions they share. So Ijust found women fascinating.
And I was at CNN for twenty fiveyears, so that's twenty five
years worth of young women intheir early to mid twenties who
(05:57):
let me ask them questions aboutwhat it's like to be a woman.
And then many of these womenbecame beta readers for me to
give me feedback on whether whatI was doing was working or not.
Cathy Worthington (06:10):
That's fabulous. You
had such an interest.
Yeah. How did your years in news covering real
world stories and breakingevents change, shape your
approach to fiction andstorytelling?
John DeDakis (06:25):
Well, you draw from personal experience, and we
all have that reservoir ofcreativity in us. One of the
things that I think journalism,was really good at helping me to
become a novelist is that, youknow, in journalism, you only
have a certain amount of realestate or time. And so you have
to be you have to write fast.You have to be efficient. But
(06:48):
more than anything, you have tobe clear.
Well, you have to be accuratetoo. But, you know, especially
clear writing tight. And that'strue whether you're writing a
thirty second story or an 80,000word novel. Every word needs to
mean something and be therebecause it's doing, it's doing
(07:09):
the necessary work.
Cathy Worthington (07:10):
Mhmm. Good coaching.
A lot of people in our audience have
really dreamed about writing abook, but they feel intimidated
by the process. What's the firstpiece of advice that you would
like to give to someone whosays, want to write, but I don't
know how to begin? Even thosepeople who have written a book,
(07:33):
and they have a second book intheir head, but they don't know
how to begin?
John DeDakis (07:38):
Well, you you said the right word, and that's
overwhelming. I mean, I thinkthat that I think that that can
really cause a person to freezebecause it is overwhelming. And
a lot of times, and this may bea common experience, you know,
you wake up from a dream oryou're in the shower and this
idea has just plopped itself inyour lap, and you write you
(08:00):
know, you just can't wait to getto the computer and you write
white hot, and then you hit thewall after about 50 pages
because you realize, well, Ihaven't really thought things
through clearly enough. And soone suggestion I I have is do
the spade work. Do the prepwork.
Get to know your characters.Interview them. Try to get a
(08:23):
sense of what the story is. Ifyou see a scene in your in your
head, write it down. Recreateit.
Sort of settings and situationsand just do writing exercises.
That's one way. Another is go towriting conferences. That's
where you'll meet agents. You'llmeet other published authors.
You'll learn about the craft.You'll learn about the business.
(08:44):
Take classes. There are ways toget better, because it's it's
it's very easy to talk yourselfout of the process. You know,
you read a book and you go, oh,I could never do that.
And so we take ourselves out, ofthe running prematurely. Because
if you have that desire towrite, I think you need to fan
that ember of creativity andjust keep going.
Cathy Worthington (09:08):
Fan that ember. Fan that ember. Yeah. I
like that.
John DeDakis (09:13):
Thank you.
Cathy Worthington (09:14):
And you've you've been a writing coach and
mentor to many. So what's one ofthe most common challenges you
see when when new writersstruggle, and how do you help
them overcome that?
John DeDakis (09:31):
There there's there's a lot of psychology
that's involved in writing. AndI think the better you know
yourself, the better yourwriting will be because you'll
be coming from a place ofauthenticity. And one of the
things that I encourage peopleto do and, you know, just about
everybody I know has lost hashas experienced pain and loss
(09:53):
and grief. And it doesn'tnecessarily mean the loss of a
loved one. It can be the loss ofa pet, a job, a loved one, a
relationship, your innocence,all your health.
All of those kinds of things canproduce, you know but it can
feel isolating. And so mysuggestion is mind the pain
(10:16):
because our society tries toanesthetize it. But if you mine
it and write it and get it ontothe page, whether it's
journaling or writing poetry orstorytelling or writing music
or, you know, whatever yourcreative outlet is, you know, I
think that's a that's a greatway to get started. Just go for
what you know best. Write whatyou know.
(10:36):
That's sort of job one. And I'llsay one other thing because I
think another common problem isfear. You know, we're afraid of
being judged. We're afraid offailure. We're afraid of not
being perfect.
And the interesting thing is andbeing rejected, all of those
fears are going to come true.
Cathy Worthington (10:55):
Right.
John DeDakis (10:55):
But what you need to do is face those fears. And
the interesting thing about fearis that courage is a byproduct
of facing your fears. It doesn'tjust show up magically. You have
to actually move toward the thethe fear and go through it. It's
not it's it's it's harnessingthe fear, and that's what I call
(11:20):
fear in action.
That's courage.
Cathy Worthington (11:22):
So how would you how would you harness the
fear? How did you do it?
John DeDakis (11:27):
You just you you recognize what it is you're
afraid of, and you realize that,well, it's it's not like the
guys on nor in Normandy stormingthe beaches on d day. Nobody's
shooting at you. You know? It itit's really we our our emotions
can exaggerate, and and they cantell us things are are gonna be
(11:48):
awful. And we need to just kindatell those emotions to shut up
because they exaggerate.
And you just there comes apoint. There's the fear is sort
of the the common denominator,sort of the fulcrum between
cowardice and courage. Both arefear based. Cowardice is fearful
(12:09):
inaction. We know what we shoulddo, and we freeze.
And there just comes a pointwhere if the desire is strong
enough, you you just must burstthrough. And when you go toward
the pain and go through it, thebyproduct is confidence, and
that makes it easier to do thenext time. You know, you gain
confidence. That's a byproduct.
Cathy Worthington (12:31):
That's very powerful. I
absolutely love the advice to mind the
pain.
I do too. I just wrote that down.
Oh, you did?
Yeah.
Just to dig into that grief that we've all
gone through. Yeah. God knows weall have something.
John DeDakis (12:47):
Oh, man. More than Yeah. One thing
Cathy Worthington (12:50):
And and you know what? On that note, I
understand that you yourselfhave experienced loss and
personal tragedy, and you'vewritten about it with that
courage and with honesty. Sotalk about, if you would, how
that experience shaped yourwriting and your characters and
your teaching.
John DeDakis (13:09):
Sure. The the first experience was when I was
nine years old, and I witnesseda car train collision that
killed three people, including akid my age. And that was that's
stunning when you're facing yourmortality at that young age.
Fast forward a few years, and mysister took her life in 1980 of,
(13:30):
carbon monoxide poisoning. I wason the scene that day.
And so when it came time toactually writing fiction, I
brought those two experiencestogether because I know that. I
know that pain, and so I justmined it. And I went for it. And
it you know what? It really itreally didn't particularly
involve courage, and I'm notsure I understand why, but, it
(13:54):
just seemed that, like, thenatural thing.
This was, for lack of a betterword, good story stuff. And so
and I think the other maybe oneof the reasons I was able to do
it is that when you're doingfiction, you're a stat you're a
tad removed. You know, you'retaking a step back. You're not
necessarily writing your story.You're drawing from personal
(14:17):
experience, but you're puttingit into the lives of people who
aren't really you.
You're creating characters, andso that you're a bit more
detached from it. And I thinkthat might be one of the things
that enabled me to see itthrough.
Cathy Worthington (14:33):
Interesting way to work through your trauma.
Yeah. Yeah. Put it into fiction.It's really interesting.
And and you've reinventedyourself after a major career.
John DeDakis (14:47):
Yeah.
Cathy Worthington (14:47):
So what would you say to people who think it's
too late
John DeDakis (14:51):
Oh, man.
Cathy Worthington (14:51):
To try something new in their fifties
or sixties or beyond? We'retalking to boomers all the time
and we talk to people thatreinvent themselves all the
time. Yeah. But what do you sayto them?
John DeDakis (15:03):
I think part of it may be our generation. I mean, I
don't know if it's the thegreatest generation, but, you
know, I mean, we were forged inthe Vietnam War. Mhmm. You know,
the the women's movement, Therewere there was a lot of major
change that was going on in thecountry in the late sixties and
early seventies, and many of uswere on the forefront of that.
(15:23):
And so that sort of baked intous.
And so I would I mean, the way Ilook at it, I mean, I I retired
from CNN in 2013, but I didn'treally retire. And and I it's
like I can't not keep going. Andit's not like it's work. It's I
have a purpose. My life hasmeaning.
(15:44):
And I think that if you approachlife that way and approach it
with a sense of curiosity, and asense of if if I can horribly
simplify it, it's finding whatyou're good at and what you
love. And when you put those twothings together, you've really
got some purpose in propulsiongoing forward. It's as valid
(16:07):
when you're 65 or when you're15. The same principles apply.
I'm living as if I've gotanother twenty five years.
No guarantees, but, you know, ifit happens, I wanna be there
because we spend most of ourlives regretting the past and
fearing the future, and we're nogood in the moment. And that's
(16:29):
the that's the only place wherewe can really make a difference
is in the moment.
Cathy Worthington (16:33):
That's so true.
Such super advice.
Absolutely. Yeah. And you probably have
imparted that to your students.I know you've taught at
universities, as you mentioned,and you continue to lead
workshops around the world.Right?
John DeDakis (16:50):
That's right. Yep.
Cathy Worthington (16:51):
I'd love to know a little bit about that,
but also what you've learnedfrom your students and workshop
participants over the years.
John DeDakis (17:03):
Well, I have learned a lot from my students,
and and that that keeps youyoung. There was I I teach a
class on how to write a memoir,and one of the students was
keeping a journal when his wifedied. And so years later, he was
writing the story, and he toldme he went back to look at his
(17:23):
journal, and he said, I'dforgotten how angry I was at the
time. You know, the act ofwriting it down siphoned off
those emotions, potentiallytoxic emotions, so that he could
move on and move forward withhis life. And so that was a
lesson that I learned from oneof my students.
(17:44):
And there there there are abunch of them. So, yeah, I I
there was two parts to yourquestion, and I forgot the I
forgot the other part. I'mgetting old.
Cathy Worthington (17:54):
Well, talking about your workshops around the
world and where you go, what youdo there. And
John DeDakis (18:00):
Yeah. I'm I teach at writing centers, and a lot of
these are now online classes. Igo to writers conferences and
teach and speak there. And I'mright now at a point where I'm a
one on one writing coach, amanuscript editor, all those
hats I wear. And now I'm at apoint where I'm taking my
writing and speak my teachingand speaking to a wider
(18:22):
audience.
I'm trying
Cathy Worthington (18:24):
teach gonna ask you if you do it online.
John DeDakis (18:27):
I do a a lot of this is online, but I'm I'm also
looking to speak to corporationsthat have wellness programs to
help help help well, I would Iwould tell them that, you know,
unresolved grief is a majorproblem in a corporation. It
leads to low morale,absenteeism, high turnover. And
(18:50):
I am able to inspire people,whether it's a CEO or the rank
and file, on how to use writingas a way to heal from grief.
It's therapeutic, and that's oneof the things that I'm now
seeking to do on a wider level.
Cathy Worthington (19:08):
That's so interesting to be branching out
like that. Here you are startinganother new thing.
John DeDakis (19:14):
Yeah. My wife thinks I'm crazy, but what does
she
Cathy Worthington (19:17):
It's perfect for our listeners. It's a
perfect idea. Absolutely. Us alittle bit about your current
projects, which you were juststarting to do. And what's next
for you and for Lark Chadwick?
John DeDakis (19:32):
Well, what's next for Lark? My my wife and I
actually wrote book six, enemiesdomestic together. Usually, I
plot them out, but I never plotthem as carefully as I expect.
And so I have to do a lot ofseat of the pants writing just
to kinda fill in the gaps. Butwith enemies domestic, my
protagonist, Lark Chadwick, isWhite House press secretary.
(19:53):
She's pregnant. She's the dad'sdead. She's ambivalent about
becoming a single mom. Abortionis a crime. And the first
question she's asked on herfirst day on the job in the
daily briefing comes from aTucker Carlson type who asks,
are you or are you not planningto abort your unborn child?
(20:13):
And that just puts Lark in themiddle, of this highly toxic and
polarized political fishbowl ata time when a dictator becomes
president. It could neverhappen. But Oh. But and so
Yikes. And so we got the idea.
Cindy and I have coffee everymorning. We read Heather Cox
(20:35):
Richardson and read the paper.And Cindy said, you need to
write about this when theabortion decision was
overturned. And, you know, overthe we've been married forty
seven years. We've had a lot ofintense conversations about
abortion, and I've been all overthe, on the issue.
I've been a reporter coveringit. And so, the process was we
(20:59):
came up with the idea. The Icame down would come down here
and write, sort of you face theblank screen. That's despair. I
would write it.
I'd get my characters talking toeach other. I'd and I'd feel
really good about it. Take itback upstairs to Cindy. She'd
look, and then we're back atdespair again. And that was the
(21:19):
circle that was the circle oflife.
But she really
Cathy Worthington (21:23):
your editor?
John DeDakis (21:24):
She was my editor. She really helped me think
through things and helped lotget Lark out of a lot of
problems, But she was in thevery beginning, my first novel
twenty years ago, it was it wasthis 150,000 word mishmash after
the first draft, and she readit. She was supportive, and she
underlined one word and said,you sure you wanna use that
(21:45):
word? Which is great, but whatabout the other 149,000 other
words? You know?
And she said, I didn't know ifyou were any good. I didn't
wanna break your spirit. Wow. Sonow she's she's earned the right
to be heard, and she's veryconfident and gives me really
good good feedback. So we'redoing that same process for book
seven.
(22:06):
We're not too far into it. It'son the back burner right now
because I've got a lot of otherirons in the fire. Plus, I've
got procrastination nailed,
Cathy Worthington (22:15):
which is part of the process.
John DeDakis (22:16):
Yeah.
Cathy Worthington (22:18):
Do the laundry first.
John DeDakis (22:19):
Yeah. Exactly. You can rearrange your sock drawer.
It's a high
Cathy Worthington (22:23):
priority. Exactly. Is this your writing
process though? You get up inthe morning, you have your
coffee, you go downstairs to Andyour do you outline everything?
You were talking about beingseat of the pants a bit.
John DeDakis (22:37):
I no. Not not so much anymore. I do a little bit.
I like to know kinda what thestory's gonna be and where I'm
gonna go, but I like to be opento the serendipity of letting
the characters kinda decide forme what's gonna happen. Because
I think good plotting emergesfrom the characters.
You asked me what I learned frommy students. There was one
student who said you know, shesaid, I've been writing
(23:00):
political thrillers, and I keepquitting after about 50 pages
because I'm bored. She said, Ijust figured it out. After
taking your class, she said, Irealized that I've been been
imposing plot onto thecharacters instead of having the
plot emerge from the characters.And when you think about it,
that's how we live life.
(23:20):
It's it's cause and effect. Youknow, we're just minding our own
business, something happens, andwe react to it. And our reaction
causes someone else to react andso on down the pike. That's the
way we live life. That's the waywe tell stories.
Cathy Worthington (23:35):
Yeah. Advice for anyone living life and
anyone who wants to tell astory.
John DeDakis (23:43):
There you go.
Cathy Worthington (23:43):
So John, tell our listeners where they can
find your books and how to joinyour workshops and a little bit
more about your coaching andwriting retreats.
John DeDakis (23:55):
Well, thank you. Best place to go is sort of one
stop shopping, and that's my, mywebsite, which is myname.com,
john.com,j0hn,dasindog,e,dasindog,a,ki,sasinsam,johndodakis.com.
(24:16):
You've got thumbnails of mybooks. You've got a look at, my
upcoming, events, which includea lot of online writing classes,
my the speaking that I do, thewriting workshops that I do, the
coaching that I do, andespecially, that's how you'll be
able to send me an email isthrough my website.
Cathy Worthington (24:36):
And what's the nature of the memoir class?
If I can ask. I'm just veryinterested in that.
John DeDakis (24:43):
It's basically just suggestions on how you can
capture your story, and how youcan, you know, stay organized,
how you can, decide what thestory is going to be.
Cathy Worthington (24:57):
How many sessions?
John DeDakis (24:58):
Trying to look at the the all the moving parts.
It's a stand alone. I can dothat as a stand alone. You know,
it just it just depends. And Ialso do, you know, I do week
long classes or some multi weekclasses.
It just depends.
Cathy Worthington (25:13):
And and your retreats?
John DeDakis (25:16):
I don't I don't host retreats, but I've done I I
usually, am involved with,retreats. It just depends on who
the sponsor is. Every year, Iteach for a week at the
Chautauqua Institution inSouthwestern New York State, you
know, two hours every morning,for five days. You know? So
(25:37):
there there are a lot ofdifferent ways that that I meet,
meet people.
Cathy Worthington (25:42):
And then how is your how are your fiction
classes different from memoir?
John DeDakis (25:49):
In many ways, there's an overlap because the
skill sets and the process themoving parts are pretty much the
same. It's just that the maindifference is that one is
nonfiction and the other iscreative. So the the biggest
difference is learning and totap into your creativity and
make things up as opposed to inin nonfiction and memoir
(26:11):
writing. It's just a matter ofof extracting those things that
actually happened and decidingwhich are the things that are
most important and deciding on atheme that will help capture
your story and engage yourreader.
Cathy Worthington (26:26):
And then I have to ask you. A lot of
writers say, oh, it comes to mefrom the universe, and I just
write it down. Does that happento you?
John DeDakis (26:36):
It Do you
Cathy Worthington (26:37):
have to meditate first, or how do you
call on that spirit?
John DeDakis (26:40):
I do I do call it the spooky power of the
subconscious. And one of thethings that I do in my writing
classes is, I'll I'll I'll givean assignment. I'll say, I want
you to interview one of yourcharacters to get to know them.
And this deer in the headlights,you know, reaction is, I don't
even have a book. What are youtalking about?
(27:00):
And I'm saying, this is a jobinterview, and I'm gonna set the
timer for ten minutes, and youare going to ask your potential
character, who are you and whydo you wanna be in my book? And
just write. Listen to the voicethat shows up because when you
ask those questions, that stirsthings up. Writing is like
(27:21):
dipping a straw into yoursubconscious. And when you stir
up those quest questions, theact of writing is like taking a
sip, and it comes through yoursubconscious and through your
fingers and onto the page, andit's spooky.
And the goal here is to be isjust to get it down on paper.
You're not writing to be clearor fancy or writerly. And at the
(27:44):
end of that ten minutes, whichis either longest or the
shortest ten minutes of yourlife, more often than not,
people are stunned thatsomething shows up. And, it's
it's as simple as that becausethere is so much in you already.
It's just a matter of tappinginto that reservoir of
creativity.
Cathy Worthington (28:04):
I wanna take your class.
John DeDakis (28:06):
Yes, you do. I
Cathy Worthington (28:07):
I do too. That's so interesting because I
haven't heard it expressed quitelike that before. We've
interviewed a lot of writers,and I think you're being so much
more clear about it and wherethe inspiration comes in from.
And also very kind, which is important.
John DeDakis (28:26):
You.
Cathy Worthington (28:29):
Well, there's a lot of people who take classes
and their teachers, shall I say,are very critical but not kind,
and you seem to have thatkindness
John DeDakis (28:41):
Thank you. About That's so nice. I I worked I at
CNN, there were a couple ofeditors I worked with who were
not kind. And, and so, you know,part of that is you learn, I'm
not gonna do it that way. AndI've discovered you can say what
you mean without being mean whenyou say it, and that's really
(29:03):
the goal.
You know? It's not criticism,you know, doesn't necessarily
mean you suck as a person. Itjust means you can do better.
Cathy Worthington (29:12):
Yeah. Good way to put it.
John, thank you so much for joining us
today. Your story reminds usthat the creative spark doesn't
fade, it just evolves.
That's so true. And you've shown us how
experience and wisdom andkindness can fuel new kinds of
storytelling and how reinventioncan be both brave and joyful.
(29:35):
To our listeners, check out John's
website, as he said, atjohndidacus.com for his books
and workshops and upcomingevents.
And if you've ever dreamed of writing your own
story, maybe this is the time tostart.
Yeah. We're Kathy Worthington and Mary
Alkins, and this has been LateBoomers. Thank you so much for
(29:58):
listening.
And be sure to subscribe, share, and join us
next week for another inspiringconversation about what comes
next. See you soon.
Thanks again, John.
John DeDakis (30:11):
Thank you.
Cathy Worthington (30:12):
Yes. Thank you, John.
Thank you for joining us on Late Boomers, the
podcast that is your guide tocreating a third act with style,
power, and impact. Please visitour website and get in touch
(30:34):
with us at lateboomers.us. Ifyou would like to listen to or
download other episodes of lateboomers, go to
ewnpodcastnetwork.com.
Merry Elkins (30:46):
This podcast is also available on Spotify, Apple
Podcast, and most other majorpodcast sites. We hope you make
use of the wisdom you've gainedhere and that you enjoy a
successful third act with yourown style, power, and impact.
This is the EWN Podcast Network.
Welcome to Late boomers, our podcast guide
to creating your third act withstyle, power, and impact. Hi.
(00:22):
I'm Kathy Worthington.
Merry Elkins (00:24):
And I'm Merry Elkins. Join us as we bring you
conversations withentrepreneurs, entertainers, and
people with vision who aremaking a difference in the
world.
Cathy Worthington (00:34):
Everyone has a story, and we'll take you
along for the ride on eachinterview, recounting the
journey our guests have taken toget where they are, inspiring
you to create your own path tosuccess. Let's get started.
Welcome to Late boomers,
the podcast where we talk about what's next
(00:55):
for all of us navigating thesecond half of life with
curiosity, humor, and heart. I'mKathy Worthington.
And I'm Mary Elkins. Every week, we bring you
inspiring conversations withpeople reinventing themselves,
finding purpose, and providingand proving, providing
information and proving thatit's never too late to grow, to
(01:19):
change, or to tell your story.
Speaking of stories, today's guest knows a
lot about how to tell them. He'sa former CNN senior copy editor
for The Situation Room with WolfBlitzer, a journalist, a
novelist, and a writing coachwho helps others find their
voice and their confidence onthe page. His name is John
(01:42):
Didakus.
And John's career is really fascinating.
He's covered politics, worldevents, and breaking news at the
highest levels, but he's alsomade a powerful midlife
transition from hard news tofiction writing. And he's the
author of the Lark Chadwickmystery suspense series, and he
(02:02):
teaches writing workshops acrossthe country.
Now what I love about John's story, Mary,
is that it's one of resilienceand reinvention. After a long
and demanding journalism career,he found a whole new career, and
he still uses his storytellingskills, but in a totally
different way.
And that's something so many of us late
(02:24):
boomers can relate to, the ideathat the skills we've built over
decades can transform intosomething new and exciting and
meaningful into our nextchapters.
Plus, John's also passionate about mentoring
younger journalists and writers.He's been teaching at American
University and doing writingretreats and coaching, helping
(02:45):
others navigate the art andsometimes the agony of writing a
book. I
left because, you know, I'm working on one
myself. But we're going to talkto him about how he made that
leap and how his experience innews influences his fiction, and
what advice he has for anyonewho's ever thought, I've got a
story inside me, but I justdon't know where to start.
(03:08):
So grab your coffee or your notebook and join
us for the conversation with thevery inspiring John DeDagus.
Welcome, John. We're so happy to have you
on Late Boomers.
John DeDakis (03:21):
Thank you very much, Mary and Kathy. It's good
to be here. Do need I do need Ido need to I do need to correct
the record on one thing. I'm noSure. I'm no longer at American
University.
I taught there
Cathy Worthington (03:36):
Okay.
John DeDakis (03:36):
For about two semesters, a long time ago. And
I also taught at the Universityof Maryland, College Park
Journalism, but, that was anthat was almost another life.
Cathy Worthington (03:50):
So you're concentrating full time on on
your fiction.
Right. Excellent. Well, you've had a
long and successful career alsoat CNN. And before that, you
were journalist in radio andprint. So what made you decide
to transition to writing novels?
(04:10):
And when did you know it wastime?
John DeDakis (04:13):
I think the I knew it was time when CNN made me an
editor. Had been a I had been areporter before I got to CNN. I
came to CNN in '88 1988 as awriter. And, probably within a
year, they made me an editor,which is tedious. It's fault
finding.
And I needed a creative outlet,and that's when I started to,
(04:36):
play around with fiction. But ittook ten years to get the agent
that I've got, and, themanuscript went through 14 major
revisions, and she's the thirtyninth agent that I queried. So I
tell my writing students, if youtake good notes, I'll save you
nine years in the process.
Cathy Worthington (04:53):
I understand that. Wow.
Yeah. Excellent advice.
Yeah. Really. Your Lark Chadwick series
features a young femalejournalist as the protagonist.
What inspired you to write towrite from that perspective, and
how much of her is in you?
John DeDakis (05:12):
It wasn't a calculated thing. It was one of
those, serendipitous pointswhere I started when I started
writing, someone suggested thatI should write in a way that
stretches who I am. Never been awoman, at least not in this
life, so I gave it a try. Andand what I discovered is that
emotions are not genderspecific. We all have the exact
(05:36):
same emotions.
It's just that the women in mylife tend to be more willing to
share their emotions, andthey're more articulate about
the emotions they share. So Ijust found women fascinating.
And I was at CNN for twenty fiveyears, so that's twenty five
years worth of young women intheir early to mid twenties who
(05:57):
let me ask them questions aboutwhat it's like to be a woman.
And then many of these womenbecame beta readers for me to
give me feedback on whether whatI was doing was working or not.
Cathy Worthington (06:10):
That's fabulous. You
had such an interest.
Yeah. How did your years in news covering real
world stories and breakingevents change, shape your
approach to fiction andstorytelling?
John DeDakis (06:25):
Well, you draw from personal experience, and we
all have that reservoir ofcreativity in us. One of the
things that I think journalism,was really good at helping me to
become a novelist is that, youknow, in journalism, you only
have a certain amount of realestate or time. And so you have
to be you have to write fast.You have to be efficient. But
(06:48):
more than anything, you have tobe clear.
Well, you have to be accuratetoo. But, you know, especially
clear writing tight. And that'strue whether you're writing a
thirty second story or an 80,000word novel. Every word needs to
mean something and be therebecause it's doing, it's doing
(07:09):
the necessary work.
Cathy Worthington (07:10):
Mhmm. Good coaching.
A lot of people in our audience have
really dreamed about writing abook, but they feel intimidated
by the process. What's the firstpiece of advice that you would
like to give to someone whosays, want to write, but I don't
know how to begin? Even thosepeople who have written a book,
(07:33):
and they have a second book intheir head, but they don't know
how to begin?
John DeDakis (07:38):
Well, you you said the right word, and that's
overwhelming. I mean, I thinkthat that I think that that can
really cause a person to freezebecause it is overwhelming. And
a lot of times, and this may bea common experience, you know,
you wake up from a dream oryou're in the shower and this
idea has just plopped itself inyour lap, and you write you
(08:00):
know, you just can't wait to getto the computer and you write
white hot, and then you hit thewall after about 50 pages
because you realize, well, Ihaven't really thought things
through clearly enough. And soone suggestion I I have is do
the spade work. Do the prepwork.
Get to know your characters.Interview them. Try to get a
(08:23):
sense of what the story is. Ifyou see a scene in your in your
head, write it down. Recreateit.
Sort of settings and situationsand just do writing exercises.
That's one way. Another is go towriting conferences. That's
where you'll meet agents. You'llmeet other published authors.
You'll learn about the craft.You'll learn about the business.
(08:44):
Take classes. There are ways toget better, because it's it's
it's very easy to talk yourselfout of the process. You know,
you read a book and you go, oh,I could never do that.
And so we take ourselves out, ofthe running prematurely. Because
if you have that desire towrite, I think you need to fan
that ember of creativity andjust keep going.
Cathy Worthington (09:08):
Fan that ember. Fan that ember. Yeah. I
like that.
John DeDakis (09:13):
Thank you.
Cathy Worthington (09:14):
And you've you've been a writing coach and
mentor to many. So what's one ofthe most common challenges you
see when when new writersstruggle, and how do you help
them overcome that?
John DeDakis (09:31):
There there's there's a lot of psychology
that's involved in writing. AndI think the better you know
yourself, the better yourwriting will be because you'll
be coming from a place ofauthenticity. And one of the
things that I encourage peopleto do and, you know, just about
everybody I know has lost hashas experienced pain and loss
(09:53):
and grief. And it doesn'tnecessarily mean the loss of a
loved one. It can be the loss ofa pet, a job, a loved one, a
relationship, your innocence,all your health.
All of those kinds of things canproduce, you know but it can
feel isolating. And so mysuggestion is mind the pain
(10:16):
because our society tries toanesthetize it. But if you mine
it and write it and get it ontothe page, whether it's
journaling or writing poetry orstorytelling or writing music
or, you know, whatever yourcreative outlet is, you know, I
think that's a that's a greatway to get started. Just go for
what you know best. Write whatyou know.
(10:36):
That's sort of job one. And I'llsay one other thing because I
think another common problem isfear. You know, we're afraid of
being judged. We're afraid offailure. We're afraid of not
being perfect.
And the interesting thing is andbeing rejected, all of those
fears are going to come true.
Cathy Worthington (10:55):
Right.
John DeDakis (10:55):
But what you need to do is face those fears. And
the interesting thing about fearis that courage is a byproduct
of facing your fears. It doesn'tjust show up magically. You have
to actually move toward the thethe fear and go through it. It's
not it's it's it's harnessingthe fear, and that's what I call
(11:20):
fear in action.
That's courage.
Cathy Worthington (11:22):
So how would you how would you harness the
fear? How did you do it?
John DeDakis (11:27):
You just you you recognize what it is you're
afraid of, and you realize that,well, it's it's not like the
guys on nor in Normandy stormingthe beaches on d day. Nobody's
shooting at you. You know? It itit's really we our our emotions
can exaggerate, and and they cantell us things are are gonna be
(11:48):
awful. And we need to just kindatell those emotions to shut up
because they exaggerate.
And you just there comes apoint. There's the fear is sort
of the the common denominator,sort of the fulcrum between
cowardice and courage. Both arefear based. Cowardice is fearful
(12:09):
inaction. We know what we shoulddo, and we freeze.
And there just comes a pointwhere if the desire is strong
enough, you you just must burstthrough. And when you go toward
the pain and go through it, thebyproduct is confidence, and
that makes it easier to do thenext time. You know, you gain
confidence. That's a byproduct.
Cathy Worthington (12:31):
That's very powerful. I
absolutely love the advice to mind the
pain.
I do too. I just wrote that down.
Oh, you did?
Yeah.
Just to dig into that grief that we've all
gone through. Yeah. God knows weall have something.
John DeDakis (12:47):
Oh, man. More than Yeah. One thing
Cathy Worthington (12:50):
And and you know what? On that note, I
understand that you yourselfhave experienced loss and
personal tragedy, and you'vewritten about it with that
courage and with honesty. Sotalk about, if you would, how
that experience shaped yourwriting and your characters and
your teaching.
John DeDakis (13:09):
Sure. The the first experience was when I was
nine years old, and I witnesseda car train collision that
killed three people, including akid my age. And that was that's
stunning when you're facing yourmortality at that young age.
Fast forward a few years, and mysister took her life in 1980 of,
(13:30):
carbon monoxide poisoning. I wason the scene that day.
And so when it came time toactually writing fiction, I
brought those two experiencestogether because I know that. I
know that pain, and so I justmined it. And I went for it. And
it you know what? It really itreally didn't particularly
involve courage, and I'm notsure I understand why, but, it
(13:54):
just seemed that, like, thenatural thing.
This was, for lack of a betterword, good story stuff. And so
and I think the other maybe oneof the reasons I was able to do
it is that when you're doingfiction, you're a stat you're a
tad removed. You know, you'retaking a step back. You're not
necessarily writing your story.You're drawing from personal
(14:17):
experience, but you're puttingit into the lives of people who
aren't really you.
You're creating characters, andso that you're a bit more
detached from it. And I thinkthat might be one of the things
that enabled me to see itthrough.
Cathy Worthington (14:33):
Interesting way to work through your trauma.
Yeah. Yeah. Put it into fiction.It's really interesting.
And and you've reinventedyourself after a major career.
John DeDakis (14:47):
Yeah.
Cathy Worthington (14:47):
So what would you say to people who think it's
too late
John DeDakis (14:51):
Oh, man.
Cathy Worthington (14:51):
To try something new in their fifties
or sixties or beyond? We'retalking to boomers all the time
and we talk to people thatreinvent themselves all the
time. Yeah. But what do you sayto them?
John DeDakis (15:03):
I think part of it may be our generation. I mean, I
don't know if it's the thegreatest generation, but, you
know, I mean, we were forged inthe Vietnam War. Mhmm. You know,
the the women's movement, Therewere there was a lot of major
change that was going on in thecountry in the late sixties and
early seventies, and many of uswere on the forefront of that.
(15:23):
And so that sort of baked intous.
And so I would I mean, the way Ilook at it, I mean, I I retired
from CNN in 2013, but I didn'treally retire. And and I it's
like I can't not keep going. Andit's not like it's work. It's I
have a purpose. My life hasmeaning.
(15:44):
And I think that if you approachlife that way and approach it
with a sense of curiosity, and asense of if if I can horribly
simplify it, it's finding whatyou're good at and what you
love. And when you put those twothings together, you've really
got some purpose in propulsiongoing forward. It's as valid
(16:07):
when you're 65 or when you're15. The same principles apply.
I'm living as if I've gotanother twenty five years.
No guarantees, but, you know, ifit happens, I wanna be there
because we spend most of ourlives regretting the past and
fearing the future, and we're nogood in the moment. And that's
(16:29):
the that's the only place wherewe can really make a difference
is in the moment.
Cathy Worthington (16:33):
That's so true.
Such super advice.
Absolutely. Yeah. And you probably have
imparted that to your students.I know you've taught at
universities, as you mentioned,and you continue to lead
workshops around the world.Right?
John DeDakis (16:50):
That's right. Yep.
Cathy Worthington (16:51):
I'd love to know a little bit about that,
but also what you've learnedfrom your students and workshop
participants over the years.
John DeDakis (17:03):
Well, I have learned a lot from my students,
and and that that keeps youyoung. There was I I teach a
class on how to write a memoir,and one of the students was
keeping a journal when his wifedied. And so years later, he was
writing the story, and he toldme he went back to look at his
(17:23):
journal, and he said, I'dforgotten how angry I was at the
time. You know, the act ofwriting it down siphoned off
those emotions, potentiallytoxic emotions, so that he could
move on and move forward withhis life. And so that was a
lesson that I learned from oneof my students.
(17:44):
And there there there are abunch of them. So, yeah, I I
there was two parts to yourquestion, and I forgot the I
forgot the other part. I'mgetting old.
Cathy Worthington (17:54):
Well, talking about your workshops around the
world and where you go, what youdo there. And
John DeDakis (18:00):
Yeah. I'm I teach at writing centers, and a lot of
these are now online classes. Igo to writers conferences and
teach and speak there. And I'mright now at a point where I'm a
one on one writing coach, amanuscript editor, all those
hats I wear. And now I'm at apoint where I'm taking my
writing and speak my teachingand speaking to a wider
(18:22):
audience.
I'm trying
Cathy Worthington (18:24):
teach gonna ask you if you do it online.
John DeDakis (18:27):
I do a a lot of this is online, but I'm I'm also
looking to speak to corporationsthat have wellness programs to
help help help well, I would Iwould tell them that, you know,
unresolved grief is a majorproblem in a corporation. It
leads to low morale,absenteeism, high turnover. And
(18:50):
I am able to inspire people,whether it's a CEO or the rank
and file, on how to use writingas a way to heal from grief.
It's therapeutic, and that's oneof the things that I'm now
seeking to do on a wider level.
Cathy Worthington (19:08):
That's so interesting to be branching out
like that. Here you are startinganother new thing.
John DeDakis (19:14):
Yeah. My wife thinks I'm crazy, but what does
she
Cathy Worthington (19:17):
It's perfect for our listeners. It's a
perfect idea. Absolutely. Us alittle bit about your current
projects, which you were juststarting to do. And what's next
for you and for Lark Chadwick?
John DeDakis (19:32):
Well, what's next for Lark? My my wife and I
actually wrote book six, enemiesdomestic together. Usually, I
plot them out, but I never plotthem as carefully as I expect.
And so I have to do a lot ofseat of the pants writing just
to kinda fill in the gaps. Butwith enemies domestic, my
protagonist, Lark Chadwick, isWhite House press secretary.
(19:53):
She's pregnant. She's the dad'sdead. She's ambivalent about
becoming a single mom. Abortionis a crime. And the first
question she's asked on herfirst day on the job in the
daily briefing comes from aTucker Carlson type who asks,
are you or are you not planningto abort your unborn child?
(20:13):
And that just puts Lark in themiddle, of this highly toxic and
polarized political fishbowl ata time when a dictator becomes
president. It could neverhappen. But Oh. But and so
Yikes. And so we got the idea.
Cindy and I have coffee everymorning. We read Heather Cox
(20:35):
Richardson and read the paper.And Cindy said, you need to
write about this when theabortion decision was
overturned. And, you know, overthe we've been married forty
seven years. We've had a lot ofintense conversations about
abortion, and I've been all overthe, on the issue.
I've been a reporter coveringit. And so, the process was we
(20:59):
came up with the idea. The Icame down would come down here
and write, sort of you face theblank screen. That's despair. I
would write it.
I'd get my characters talking toeach other. I'd and I'd feel
really good about it. Take itback upstairs to Cindy. She'd
look, and then we're back atdespair again. And that was the
(21:19):
circle that was the circle oflife.
But she really
Cathy Worthington (21:23):
your editor?
John DeDakis (21:24):
She was my editor. She really helped me think
through things and helped lotget Lark out of a lot of
problems, But she was in thevery beginning, my first novel
twenty years ago, it was it wasthis 150,000 word mishmash after
the first draft, and she readit. She was supportive, and she
underlined one word and said,you sure you wanna use that
(21:45):
word? Which is great, but whatabout the other 149,000 other
words? You know?
And she said, I didn't know ifyou were any good. I didn't
wanna break your spirit. Wow. Sonow she's she's earned the right
to be heard, and she's veryconfident and gives me really
good good feedback. So we'redoing that same process for book
seven.
(22:06):
We're not too far into it. It'son the back burner right now
because I've got a lot of otherirons in the fire. Plus, I've
got procrastination nailed,
Cathy Worthington (22:15):
which is part of the process.
John DeDakis (22:16):
Yeah.
Cathy Worthington (22:18):
Do the laundry first.
John DeDakis (22:19):
Yeah. Exactly. You can rearrange your sock drawer.
It's a high
Cathy Worthington (22:23):
priority. Exactly. Is this your writing
process though? You get up inthe morning, you have your
coffee, you go downstairs to Andyour do you outline everything?
You were talking about beingseat of the pants a bit.
John DeDakis (22:37):
I no. Not not so much anymore. I do a little bit.
I like to know kinda what thestory's gonna be and where I'm
gonna go, but I like to be opento the serendipity of letting
the characters kinda decide forme what's gonna happen. Because
I think good plotting emergesfrom the characters.
You asked me what I learned frommy students. There was one
student who said you know, shesaid, I've been writing
(23:00):
political thrillers, and I keepquitting after about 50 pages
because I'm bored. She said, Ijust figured it out. After
taking your class, she said, Irealized that I've been been
imposing plot onto thecharacters instead of having the
plot emerge from the characters.And when you think about it,
that's how we live life.
(23:20):
It's it's cause and effect. Youknow, we're just minding our own
business, something happens, andwe react to it. And our reaction
causes someone else to react andso on down the pike. That's the
way we live life. That's the waywe tell stories.
Cathy Worthington (23:35):
Yeah. Advice for anyone living life and
anyone who wants to tell astory.
John DeDakis (23:43):
There you go.
Cathy Worthington (23:43):
So John, tell our listeners where they can
find your books and how to joinyour workshops and a little bit
more about your coaching andwriting retreats.
John DeDakis (23:55):
Well, thank you. Best place to go is sort of one
stop shopping, and that's my, mywebsite, which is myname.com,
john.com,j0hn,dasindog,e,dasindog,a,ki,sasinsam,johndodakis.com.
(24:16):
You've got thumbnails of mybooks. You've got a look at, my
upcoming, events, which includea lot of online writing classes,
my the speaking that I do, thewriting workshops that I do, the
coaching that I do, andespecially, that's how you'll be
able to send me an email isthrough my website.
Cathy Worthington (24:36):
And what's the nature of the memoir class?
If I can ask. I'm just veryinterested in that.
John DeDakis (24:43):
It's basically just suggestions on how you can
capture your story, and how youcan, you know, stay organized,
how you can, decide what thestory is going to be.
Cathy Worthington (24:57):
How many sessions?
John DeDakis (24:58):
Trying to look at the the all the moving parts.
It's a stand alone. I can dothat as a stand alone. You know,
it just it just depends. And Ialso do, you know, I do week
long classes or some multi weekclasses.
It just depends.
Cathy Worthington (25:13):
And and your retreats?
John DeDakis (25:16):
I don't I don't host retreats, but I've done I I
usually, am involved with,retreats. It just depends on who
the sponsor is. Every year, Iteach for a week at the
Chautauqua Institution inSouthwestern New York State, you
know, two hours every morning,for five days. You know? So
(25:37):
there there are a lot ofdifferent ways that that I meet,
meet people.
Cathy Worthington (25:42):
And then how is your how are your fiction
classes different from memoir?
John DeDakis (25:49):
In many ways, there's an overlap because the
skill sets and the process themoving parts are pretty much the
same. It's just that the maindifference is that one is
nonfiction and the other iscreative. So the the biggest
difference is learning and totap into your creativity and
make things up as opposed to inin nonfiction and memoir
(26:11):
writing. It's just a matter ofof extracting those things that
actually happened and decidingwhich are the things that are
most important and deciding on atheme that will help capture
your story and engage yourreader.
Cathy Worthington (26:26):
And then I have to ask you. A lot of
writers say, oh, it comes to mefrom the universe, and I just
write it down. Does that happento you?
John DeDakis (26:36):
It Do you
Cathy Worthington (26:37):
have to meditate first, or how do you
call on that spirit?
John DeDakis (26:40):
I do I do call it the spooky power of the
subconscious. And one of thethings that I do in my writing
classes is, I'll I'll I'll givean assignment. I'll say, I want
you to interview one of yourcharacters to get to know them.
And this deer in the headlights,you know, reaction is, I don't
even have a book. What are youtalking about?
(27:00):
And I'm saying, this is a jobinterview, and I'm gonna set the
timer for ten minutes, and youare going to ask your potential
character, who are you and whydo you wanna be in my book? And
just write. Listen to the voicethat shows up because when you
ask those questions, that stirsthings up. Writing is like
(27:21):
dipping a straw into yoursubconscious. And when you stir
up those quest questions, theact of writing is like taking a
sip, and it comes through yoursubconscious and through your
fingers and onto the page, andit's spooky.
And the goal here is to be isjust to get it down on paper.
You're not writing to be clearor fancy or writerly. And at the
(27:44):
end of that ten minutes, whichis either longest or the
shortest ten minutes of yourlife, more often than not,
people are stunned thatsomething shows up. And, it's
it's as simple as that becausethere is so much in you already.
It's just a matter of tappinginto that reservoir of
creativity.
Cathy Worthington (28:04):
I wanna take your class.
John DeDakis (28:06):
Yes, you do. I
Cathy Worthington (28:07):
I do too. That's so interesting because I
haven't heard it expressed quitelike that before. We've
interviewed a lot of writers,and I think you're being so much
more clear about it and wherethe inspiration comes in from.
And also very kind, which is important.
John DeDakis (28:26):
You.
Cathy Worthington (28:29):
Well, there's a lot of people who take classes
and their teachers, shall I say,are very critical but not kind,
and you seem to have thatkindness
John DeDakis (28:41):
Thank you. About That's so nice. I I worked I at
CNN, there were a couple ofeditors I worked with who were
not kind. And, and so, you know,part of that is you learn, I'm
not gonna do it that way. AndI've discovered you can say what
you mean without being mean whenyou say it, and that's really
(29:03):
the goal.
You know? It's not criticism,you know, doesn't necessarily
mean you suck as a person. Itjust means you can do better.
Cathy Worthington (29:12):
Yeah. Good way to put it.
John, thank you so much for joining us
today. Your story reminds usthat the creative spark doesn't
fade, it just evolves.
That's so true. And you've shown us how
experience and wisdom andkindness can fuel new kinds of
storytelling and how reinventioncan be both brave and joyful.
(29:35):
To our listeners, check out John's
website, as he said, atjohndidacus.com for his books
and workshops and upcomingevents.
And if you've ever dreamed of writing your own
story, maybe this is the time tostart.
Yeah. We're Kathy Worthington and Mary
Alkins, and this has been LateBoomers. Thank you so much for
(29:58):
listening.
And be sure to subscribe, share, and join us
next week for another inspiringconversation about what comes
next. See you soon.
Thanks again, John.
John DeDakis (30:11):
Thank you.
Cathy Worthington (30:12):
Yes. Thank you, John.
Thank you for joining us on Late Boomers, the
podcast that is your guide tocreating a third act with style,
power, and impact. Please visitour website and get in touch
(30:34):
with us at lateboomers.us. Ifyou would like to listen to or
download other episodes of lateboomers, go to
ewnpodcastnetwork.com.
Merry Elkins (30:46):
This podcast is also available on Spotify, Apple
Podcast, and most other majorpodcast sites. We hope you make
use of the wisdom you've gainedhere and that you enjoy a
successful third act with yourown style, power, and impact.
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