October 1, 2025 • 31 mins
Have you ever wondered what life is like behind the scenes of Broadway and the opera? Join us as we dive into the mesmerizing world of performers with the insightful Susan Dormady Eisenberg!
Susan, an acclaimed author, takes us on a journey through her novels, The Voice I Just Heard and One More Seat at the Roundtable, which vividly depict the backstage life of performers. Discover how her childhood love for Broadway and rock music fueled her storytelling passion.
We explore the evolution of the performing arts, the rise of jukebox musicals, and the gritty yet rewarding path of pursuing a career in the arts. Plus, Susan shares personal tales, and emphasizes the unmatched magic of live theater.
Don't miss this inspiring episode!
Susan Dormady Eisenberg's Bio:
Susan Dormady Eisenberg is the author of two backstage novels, One More Seat at the Round Table, A Novel of Camelot, published by Atmosphere Press in April 2023, and The Voice I Just Heard, a newly revised edition that was published by Atmosphere Press on September 16. VOICE is the story of an aspiring soprano whose world is shattered when her brother dies in Vietnam.
Susan’s passion for the performing arts is rooted in her first career. After earning a Humanities degree from Michigan State University, she was a publicist for the Goodspeed Opera House in Connecticut, Syracuse Stage, and The Joffrey Ballet in New York.
After moving to Washington, D.C., she became a freelance promotional writer, creating publications for banks, hospitals, and schools for ten years. As an arts journalist, Susan contributed articles to the Hartford Courant, the Albany Times Union, Classical Singer Magazine, Opera News, and Huffington Post. She’s now finishing a novel about American icon, Annie Oakley, the female star of Buffalo Bill’s Wild West show.
Susan lives in Baltimore with her husband Barry, a health care executive. Their hobby is Broadway and they frequently drive to New York for the day to see a show.
Connect with Susan:
Website: www.susandeisenberg.com
Facebook: Susan Dormady Eisenberg
Instagram: @susandeisenberg
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/susan-dormady-eisenberg-51053025/
Thank you for listening. Please check out @lateboomers on Instagram and our website lateboomers.us. If you enjoyed this podcast and would like to watch it or listen to more of our episodes, you will find Late Boomers on your favorite podcast platform and on our new YouTube Late Boomers Podcast Channel. We hope we have inspired you and we look forward to your becoming a member of our Late Boomers family of subscribers.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (00:01):
This is the EWN Podcast Network.
Cathy (00:14):
Welcome to Late Boomers, our podcast guide to creating
your third act with style,power, and impact. Hi. I'm Cathy
Worthington.
Merry (00:24):
And I'm Merry Elkins. Join us as we bring you
conversations with successfulentrepreneurs, entertainers, and
people with vision who aremaking a difference in the
world.
Cathy (00:34):
Everyone has a story, and we'll take you along for the
ride on each interview,recounting the journey our
guests have taken to get wherethey are, inspiring you to
create your own path to success.Let's get started.
Hello. I'm Cathy Worthington. Welcome to the late
(00:55):
boomers podcast. I'm here withmy cohost, Merry Alkins. And you
know, Mary, as baby boomers, wegrew up with music shaping every
part of our lives from Broadwaycast albums spinning on the
record player to rock and rollblasting from our radios.
Merry (01:11):
That is so true, Cathy. And I'm Merry Elkins, and that
music really was the soundtrackof our lives. And because we're
both been singers ourselves, weknow firsthand just how much
work and training, heart, andcourage it takes to step out on
a stage and share your voice.Whether you're singing in a
choir on a Broadway stage or anopera stage or just in the
(01:35):
shower or your living room.
Cathy (01:37):
Yeah. Which is why today's guest is such a joy for
us. Susan Dormity Eisenbergwrites about the world of
singers and performers. She'sthe author of two novels, The
Voice I Just Heard, now out in arevised edition, and One More
Seat at the Roundtable, a novelof Broadway's Camelot.
Merry (01:57):
That's right. And Susan has profiled singers for
publications like ClassicalSinger and Opera News and and
Huff Post. And she's a member ofthe author's guild, and she
spent part of her career in thearts marketing business at
places like Goodspeed OperaHouse, Syracuse Stage, and the
Joffrey Ballet.
Cathy (02:16):
She also studied voice herself, so she knows what it
takes, The discipline, workingwith nerves
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (02:23):
Yeah.
Cathy (02:23):
And the perseverance. And she knows how the demands
differ, whether you're singingVerdi in an opera house or
belting a rock ballad in a club.
Merry (02:33):
And her fiction captures all of that. It takes us behind
the curtain, not just to thedivas in the spotlight, but to
the accompanists, the directors,the stage managers, and all
those unsung heroes who make themagic on stage happen.
Cathy (02:50):
And as boomers, we really appreciate how Susan's stories
remind us of the generations ofsingers and performers who paved
the way and how that legacystill inspires new voices today.
Merry (03:02):
That is so true. And as fellow singers who know what it
feels like to sing in front ofan audience, it's a treat to
have Susan Dormity Eisenberg onour podcast. Welcome to Late
Boomers, Susan. Cathy,
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (03:17):
Merry, thank you so much for having me.
I couldn't have asked for anicer introduction. Everything
you said is exactly what I hopeto do in my work.
Cathy (03:27):
That's great. But, Susan, first, please tell us how the
music you grew up with and thepeople you knew planted the
seeds for your love of singingand your desire to write about
performers.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (03:40):
Well, the music I grew up with is the
exact music you mentioned. It'sthe Broadway show albums of the
late fifties and early sixties.My mother and father subscribed
to the Columbia Record Club, andI remember that.
Cathy (03:56):
Remember that? I remember that.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg: Broadway albums came in the same (03:59):
undefined
pack. My Fair Lady, Camelot,Sound of Music, and a couple
others. Well, I I took them upto my room, and I played them on
my record player.
Merry (04:10):
Uh-huh, right.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (04:11):
I fell in love. I had not seen any
shows at this point. I was alittle too young. My parents
hadn't taken me. I didn't get toBroadway for years, but we had
this summer theater, the ComedyMusical Theater, where I later
worked and which is the scene ofmy novel, and that's the first
time I saw a Broadway stylemusical.
(04:33):
In 1963, I saw Carnival.
Merry (04:36):
Oh, yeah.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (04:37):
Anna Maria Alburghetti's sister.
Cathy (04:41):
Well, what did you have a record or a singer you couldn't
stop playing?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (04:44):
Anna Maria Alburghetti.
Cathy (04:46):
Oh. Oh, really?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (04:47):
And yeah. Yes. In Carnival. And
Julie Andrews. Oh, yes.
Of course. Camelot and My FairLady. Oh, yeah. I could never
get enough of Julie Andrews.
Cathy (05:00):
Oh, sound of music
Merry (05:01):
too. Still can't. She still
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (05:02):
sound of music later in the movie, but
I'm just talking about themovie.
Merry (05:06):
Yeah. Absolutely. That is so true. What about, like, rock
music or I love
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (05:12):
rock music. I mean, yes. Everything
starting with, say, Elvis, I wasa little young, of course, the
Beatles.
Merry (05:20):
Oh, yeah.
Cathy (05:21):
Yeah. That was me.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (05:22):
Right? And then, of course, you have to
know this. I was at homevisiting my I mean, living there
for the summer in college whenWoodstock was happening. Oh,
yeah. I remember going home andtelling my parents, I'm going to
Woodstock.
My parents Did you go? No.You're not.
Cathy (05:41):
Oh, they stopped you from going?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (05:42):
They stopped me.
Cathy (05:43):
Oh. I was way too far away. I was in California.
Merry (05:47):
Yeah. Me too. I couldn't have gotten there.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (05:49):
Well, could you imagine
Cathy (05:50):
I was too young.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (05:52):
What would have happened if I set off
for Woodstock? You probablyremember that the I was in
Upstate New York near all theThe traffic. Wasn't very far.
People were trapped on
Merry (06:01):
the roads for hours. Oh, I bet.
Cathy (06:03):
Yeah. And then it rained, they were in the mud.
Merry (06:05):
And and oh, anyway, that's
Cathy (06:06):
a whole another subject.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (06:08):
That's another story. My mother and
father
Cathy (06:09):
It's a different podcast. Same thing.
Merry (06:11):
Yeah. Right. Right. Right. Well, I have to say that
I saw the Beatles in 1964 at theHollywood Bowl.
Cathy (06:18):
Oh, no.
Merry (06:18):
When they were there. And I sat in the very last row of
the whole place. Couldn't seethem except, you know, they were
the size of an ant, andeverybody was screaming so you
couldn't hear them. But that'skind of like my Woodstock.
Cathy (06:32):
Well, in 1966, I saw them in Dodger Stadium. And '65, I
saw them in a football stadium.My mother went with me. Oh, she
did. I'm awestruck.
Sure did.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (06:45):
I'm struck I'm awestruck. You well,
then I resent Let's
Cathy (06:49):
get back to her subject.
Merry (06:51):
Oh, okay. So let's talk about some of your novels,
because few of them are aboutthe vocal arts. And why did you
write the your last novel andthe first?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (07:03):
Well, it started as my first novel,
and then it became the new novelbecause I put it out first in
2012, and then I completelyrevised it and then putting out
a putting it out again. And Ialways sang and I studied voice
for years. I had eight teachers.
Merry (07:20):
Oh. Wow.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (07:21):
And they'd always say the same thing
when I came in. Oh, you have alovely voice, but you don't have
any technique. And even aftereight teachers, I never had
technique. So I I then I didinterview a lot of very famous
singers, and I thought, you knowwhat? This is an exciting thing,
and I wanna write about it.
I love singing. I don't plan tobe on stage, but I can bring it
(07:44):
to life as a writer.
Merry (07:45):
Ah, and you have. Well, give us some insights into the
backstage world of performing.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (07:52):
Well, of course, it's never glamorous.
It it looks glamorous only outfront, but usually backstage,
it's it's very unglamorous. Idid write a book about Camelot,
One More Seat at the Roundtable,a novel of Broadway's Camelot.
And the whole purpose of thebook was to fictionalize but be
very honest about what happenedin Camelot because Camelot was a
(08:15):
dumpster fire. And from the daythey left New York after
rehearsals, yes, yes, and wentto Toronto and then went to
Boston, it was a mess.
It almost closed in Boston, andit almost closed again after
opening on Broadway. So Iresearched it very carefully. I
talked to many people who Italked to people who were there
(08:36):
who told me what happened.
Merry (08:38):
Had no idea because it was such a great play and
musical and a wonderful movie.
Cathy (08:45):
But it's considered a success on Broadway, isn't Isn't
it?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (08:48):
It took a long time to become one,
though. What it happened was inToronto, they lost their
director, Moss Hart, and thenthere was no director, and it
was a sinking ship. They had nocaptain, and they brought in
Richard Burton's foster fatherto keep him calm, but Burton
Philip Burton kind of undid whatMoss Hart did, And then every
(09:12):
day in Boston, they were therefor five weeks, they were
getting changes to the script.Burton, Andrews, Goulet, Roddy
McDowell, they wondered what'swhat is tonight's script going
to be?
Cathy (09:26):
Oh, well, yeah, you can't have a show like that.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (09:28):
That's They made it back to New York.
They opened to very lacklusterreviews, and then a miracle
happened. They call it the Marchmiracle. The show had opened on
December 3, and on March 19, EdSullivan featured them. In the
meantime
Cathy (09:43):
Oh.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (09:45):
Moss Hart had come back, and he'd
redirected. The show was great.They did excerpts on Ed
Sullivan. The show was a hit.
Cathy (09:53):
Yeah. Think we all saw those.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (09:56):
Does that answer your question about
the backstage walk
Cathy (09:59):
of Yes.
Merry (10:00):
Yeah. Absolutely.
Cathy (10:01):
How have the performing arts like opera changed over the
years? And also tell us how pop,rock, rap, and country are
different from classical.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (10:14):
Well, the way opera's changed is that
in around the seventies andeighties, many American
companies were springing up, anda lot of those companies, such
as, let's say, the Houston GrandOpera, and some in other cities,
many cities, they developedyoung artist programs. So they
(10:36):
were training homegrown singersthat then they were singing they
were sending out into the world,to have starring roles or
starting with smaller roles andworking up. But the problem is
over the years, many, manysingers were training for the
profession, but the operacompanies were not doing as
(10:57):
well. And a few years ago, therewere 8,000 freelance singers.
Wow.
But only 80 I just read this inOpera America. Only 80 were
working steadily.
Cathy (11:08):
Oh, yeah.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (11:09):
So that that's one way it's changed.
Another way it's changed is thatwith the advent of opera in HD
introduced by the Met, peoplehave to look like their role. We
don't want a three hundred poundsinger playing an ingenue, at
least that's what the audienceThat's true. The casting became
(11:29):
really different, and singersbegan to feel pressure of being
ready for their close-up. That'sanother big Yeah.
Well, yeah. That's for sure.Remember how many heavy, lovely
ladies used to be the stars ofthe opera, like Mousserrat
Caballet? It was just huge, butthe most beautiful voice in the
(11:51):
world. I don't know if she woulddo a good get a lot of jobs
today.
Merry (11:57):
Well, there's a, yeah, there's a few beautiful opera
singers these days, though.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (12:02):
You mean large heavyset opera
singer? Of course, there are.
Cathy (12:05):
Yes. Yes. Oh, yes. No. Some some people
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (12:07):
will always break the trend. Mhmm.
I'd rather not name names, butyes.
Merry (12:13):
Yeah. And
Cathy (12:14):
do do you feel that the other categories of music have
changed a lot too?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (12:20):
Well, I'm not an expert on those, but
I do think that that some of themore modern styles have
infiltrated opera because we'renow having much more modern
opera, and we are hearingdifferent styles in that. And of
course, if we want to talk aboutBroadway, we have Hamilton.
Merry (12:40):
Oh, yeah.
Cathy (12:41):
Oh, yeah. Right? Love it. Love it. Love it.
I love it.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (12:44):
And also, the other thing that we
have to talk about is the factthat many people are not writing
Broadway musicals from scratchanymore. What they're using is a
potpourri
Cathy (12:55):
Jukebox.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (12:56):
Yeah. Jukebox musicals. That's that's
very popular.
Merry (13:00):
Yeah. I just saw Anne Julia, and I loved it, and it's
a jukebox musical.
Cathy (13:05):
And Mamma Mia just came back to Broadway. Mamma Mia. I
saw And you've got MJ andBeautiful Noise and all these
ones are just old song books.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (13:14):
Yeah. Just in time with Jonathan
Groff.
Cathy (13:17):
Oh, that's fantastic.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (13:19):
Love to see that.
Cathy (13:20):
That's fantastic. I did I did see it. I did see Is it
wonderful? He's incredible. Oh,he's
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (13:26):
I saw him as
Cathy (13:27):
Merrily We Roll Along. I mean Well, they can't do it
without him because hisbilling's on the outside of the
theater. So, it says JonathanGroff in Just in Time. They
don't do it. He's not missed aperformance.
There's no understudy. They justcan't do it without him.
Merry (13:43):
I wish it would come to LA. It probably will. I don't
But with him.
Cathy (13:49):
Oh. Yeah. You're gonna need him because his like I
said, they mounted the show withhis name attached to it.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (13:56):
I live in Baltimore, and I'm always in
my car with my husband drivingto New York. We see so many
shows. It's unbelievable. Oh,good. It is our mutual passion.
Cathy (14:07):
That's good. Don't miss that one. Don't miss that one.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (14:10):
My husband and I met in a
production of Camelot. I wasGuinevere and he was in the
chorus and neither one of usever set foot on stage again.
Merry (14:18):
Oh. Oh.
Cathy (14:20):
They weren't any good.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (14:22):
Yeah. Yeah.
Merry (14:25):
Well, I'd love to hear more about your novel, A Voice I
Just Heard. And it's a coming ofage story and a tale of love
that encourages us to follow ourhearts and chase our dreams.
It's also about the Vietnam War.Right? Yes.
So talk about your book and whyyou mixed war and the arts in
(14:48):
one to tell a story.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (14:49):
I'd love to. The Vietnam War was the
seminal event of my generation,and it sounds like possibly your
generation too. Yeah. You'reyounger than I am, but it was
pretty amazing. And I lost afriend in the war.
I always knew that I would haveto write about it. But when it
came time for me to write myfirst novel, I thought I would
(15:13):
incorporate that in a novel thatwas coming of age, but I was
also very interested in conceptof vocation. I think vocation is
so important to all of ourlives. If we have a gift, should
we use it to earn a living? Ifwe have two gifts, which one
should we choose?
Important, I mean, and then theold saying, if you love what you
(15:38):
do, you'll never work a day inyour life. And that's part of
vocation. So I wanted to talkabout a person, Nora Costello,
who was a young singer whodidn't get very much
encouragement from her family,but her brother was her North
Star. So The Voice I Just Heardis a novel about Nora, a young
(15:59):
soprano who's struggling withvocal stage fright. She meets an
alluring baritone, that's Bart,at the Summer Tent Theater, but
this is 1970.
It's a few weeks after herbrother's, death in Vietnam, and
she wonders how she will survivewithout her North Star and her
soul family cheerleader. Andwill Barb Wheeler, this singer
(16:21):
who knows a lot about singing,break what's left of her heart?
Those are the questions.
Cathy (16:27):
And so then that leads me to my next question. What's the
price of chasing a dream?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (16:35):
That is the question of the novel. The
price of chasing a dream, Ithink, is that we may wind up
having to alienate people whodon't agree with our dream. That
would be sometimes parents,sometimes mentors, because in in
moving forward toward our dream,sometimes we have to follow what
(16:55):
we want to do and not listen toperhaps naysayers. One choice.
Cathy (17:01):
I agree so much. I had a grandmother that nagged me every
day, You've got to go get yourteaching credential. I said, I
don't want to be a teacher, Iwant to be an actor. And she's
like, No, you need a teachingcredential. I said, But I don't
want to teach.
She just couldn't even fathomthat, like why I wouldn't do
that.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (17:20):
Yeah. In my book, it's really
interesting. Nora Costello has abeautiful soprano a coloratura
soprano, more Beverly Sills thanJulie Andrews. But the few times
that she sung in public and herparents were there, she was not
able to control her stagefright. So they don't know she
(17:41):
sings.
They don't know how well shesings. They don't even they
don't think she has a gift. AndI think one of the biggest
moments of the book for me is ahorrible moment when she goes to
the Metropolitan Opera with Bartand comes back, and she's so
inspired, and she tells herfather she's changed her mind.
She isn't going to Broadway.She's going to become an opera
(18:03):
singer.
And he says, didn't you just goto the opera? Don't you know
that people are born with giftslike that? Oh, it's like it's a
horrible thing.
Cathy (18:14):
Yeah. Is a horrible thing because you aren't born an opera
singer. That's for sure.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (18:19):
No. No. It's years and years.
Cathy (18:21):
It's years of training. Absolutely. And
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (18:24):
so I feel like we have to forge our
own path at all costs, all ofus. I know for myself, my
parents weren't excited that Isaid I wanted to be a writer.
Yeah. I think they were thinkingin order to be a writer, you had
to be Truman Capote.
Merry (18:42):
Not true.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg: Absolutely. You had to have a (18:43):
undefined
Gothic Southern upbringing.
Merry (18:50):
Maybe that's the point. What does theater teach us and
opera teach us about being ahuman being that we can't learn
by attending a sporting event ora lecture or anything else?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (19:04):
Well, at a sporting event or a
lecture, we're more of a passiveobserver, and the emotion comes
from perhaps the lecturer sayssomething that rings true, or we
get excited about watching ourfavorite team. But in opera and
theater, we really see ourselvesin the characters and that we
connect with also the people whoare interpreting the characters.
(19:27):
And so I think we can getobservations about life and we
can grow just from going to thetheater. It's amazing how much
theater affects us.
Merry (19:36):
Yeah. Really is. It really is. And it gives you so
much joy. And the audience isreally a participant.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg: Absolutely. The thing that I've (19:44):
undefined
observed about singing, greatsinging, great acting, is that
and I do cover this in my novelbecause I think it's important
to know. Those people havesomething to give. They're not
standing on stage waiting forapplause. The applause is a
byproduct of their greatness ortheir wonderful performance, but
(20:06):
that's not why they're reallythere.
The great ones are there toshare with us, to give to us.
Mhmm.
Cathy (20:13):
I agree. Is a career in the arts then a worthwhile goal,
and how can artists supportthemselves beyond the stage?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (20:23):
That's a really good question because I
think a lot of them can't, but Ithink it is a number of
compromises that they have tomake. As we've all heard, it's
not funny, but what's anothername for actor? Waiter. They're
out
Merry (20:39):
here in Los Angeles too.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (20:43):
I probably shouldn't give away
this spoiler, but I feel likedoing it because of what we're
talking about. My novel, mycharacter meets this fantastic
singer. He's a washed upBroadway baritone, but really,
he's a plumber.
Merry (20:58):
Oh.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (20:59):
That's how he earns his living. But I
mean, seriously, I think peoplehave to sometimes be really
flexible if they wanna be in thearts about doing other jobs,
maybe not for all time, maybejust for a short time or maybe
all your life, but people thatreally have to be there just do
have to be there. So I know alot of people that have made
(21:19):
compromises to stay in the arts.
Merry (21:21):
Well, price of chasing a dream. Right?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (21:23):
That is the price. Sometimes it is a
financial price, but I think alot of it is an emotional price.
Because if you are still havingto work two jobs to be an actor
or a singer, a dancer, it maymean that you haven't achieved
the level of hireability, ifthat's a word, to sustain you.
(21:46):
It may be that you didn't quiteget to that place. Mhmm.
Merry (21:49):
Yeah. That's that's a big, big disappointment. Yeah.
Cathy (21:54):
You think? It is.
Merry (21:56):
And we've all been there.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (21:57):
I also worked at the Joffrey Ballet. I
was in marketing, and I saw allthe heartache in dance. And, I
mean, those kids, they startdancing when they're very young,
and they could be washed up atage 30. I'm serious with the
level of injuries. They couldbe.
Merry (22:16):
And especially nowadays with the kind of athleticism
that it requires. It's moreathletic. It absolutely is.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (22:24):
I think dance is much more healthy for
for women now, though. SinceGeorge Balanchine passed on and
since the companies havechanged, I see more womanly
figures in dance, which I reallyappreciate.
Cathy (22:36):
Yeah.
Merry (22:37):
That's that's true. Let's talk about where you grew up.
Cohoes? Cohoes, New York. Yes.
And you used it in your novel.Talk about Well,
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (22:50):
I used it as a symbol because Nora's
brother, who died, loved theCahos Falls. Cahos has a
waterfall that's the secondlargest waterfall in New York
State.
Cathy (23:02):
Oh.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (23:03):
It's very beautiful, and it's the
second most famous after thatother waterfall.
Cathy (23:11):
The one in Buffalo.
Merry (23:12):
Yeah, right. So
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (23:15):
I used the Cahos Falls as a metaphor
for just life. He just found somuch solace, the brother going
to the falls. It was somethinghe felt he discovered because in
my day a lot of people didn't goto the falls. They weren't
really running. They werediverted for hydropower, so you
(23:37):
rarely saw them, and I rarelysaw them when I lived there.
So I used them as a symbol oflife and he used them, Liam, as
something that inspired him.Then later after he died, my
protagonist had a song createdto a famous poem about the
(23:58):
Cahoe's Falls. It's an 1804 poemby the bard of Ireland, Thomas
More, and I had it commissionedand had it actually written as a
song so that my heroine couldsing it.
Cathy (24:12):
Oh, I was going to ask you about the song you
commissioned, Laurie Laitman.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (24:17):
Laurie Laitman, she's a wonderful art
song and opera composer.
Cathy (24:21):
So you actually had the song composed, like commissioned
it, that you could let theheroine singer sing it in the
book?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (24:30):
Yes, and then what we did was Lori
has many recordings, so it'sonly one song, so she put the
song on an album called BetweenThese Spaces I believe, and then
it's also free to hear onYouTube. Just Google Lines
written at the Falls. So weoriginally thought that we might
(24:50):
have a CD that went with thenovel, but that's Yeah. No.
Technology has, you know,outpaced that.
Cathy (24:57):
Yeah. Because nobody has a CD player.
Merry (24:59):
That's right.
Cathy (25:00):
Yeah, because years ago my daughter wrote a children's
book when she was a child, shewas seven, and it came out with
a CD of the kids singing thesong that was the book, And it
was very popular because youeverybody had a CD player. You
popped it in fantastic. In yourkid's bedroom. They're reading
the book. You pop the thing in,but can't do that anymore.
(25:24):
When it was they re reissued itlast year on the twenty fifth
anniversary of the book. Theydid. She's now 35. And so
there's you know? But no CD.
No more CDs. Think that's Andit's too bad because
Merry (25:41):
You have to stream it.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (25:43):
Yes. Yes.
Cathy (25:43):
No. But there is no streaming of those kids singing
it. We went in the studio,recorded it with kids that she
knew. Oh, yeah. Bunch of kidssinging.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (25:52):
Yeah. Yeah. My original conception,
and then I Laurie went alongwith it, was that we wanted
people to hear the song and thesoprano. Then in this version of
the book, my own soprano, Nora,couldn't the book ends with her
trying to perform that song, butnot necessarily succeeding
(26:12):
because she's just not trainedenough. She's just bikini, and
she hasn't gone to conservatory.
She's on her way, but she can'treally do justice to the song.
So the the whole purpose of thesong now in the book is not only
to pay tribute to Liam, herbrother, but also to show what
it takes to sing an art song.You can't just interpret one.
(26:34):
You can sing the notes, but youmay not be able to put it
across.
Merry (26:38):
That is really, really true. When you watch all the TV
shows like The Voice andAmerican Idol today, it's all
about the interpretation.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg: Everything's about (26:47):
undefined
interpretation the arts.
Cathy (26:50):
Mhmm.
Merry (26:50):
So on that note, what do you think is the overall value
of performance, going to aperformance versus listening to
it, or even watching it on TV oronline?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (27:01):
Oh, I I feel very strongly about this. I
love singers. I have severalvery famous singers that I fell
in love with. They happen to beopera singers. And I got all
their CDs and I played them, andthen my experience going to the
house, to the MetropolitanOpera, was so different.
(27:22):
Or it could be a car CarnegieHall. It could be a recital hall
in DC. I've heard them atvarious places. What I learned
was the voice, at least at thatlevel, is a fraction of what you
hear in the house. Doesn't havethe depth.
You're only hearing the frontpart. But when you go to the
opera, you're hearing the wholevoice. And no great recording
(27:45):
can give you that. Really?That's what I think.
Merry (27:49):
Yeah. It's interesting.
Cathy (27:51):
You would think the recording could pick up much
more nuance and detail.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (27:57):
Maybe nuance and detail, but the depth
of the voice. And the heart.Yeah. It's just not quite there.
In my opinion, I may be wrong.
It just may be me, or I justfell so in love with those
particular voices that hearingthem live was so exciting. But I
always believe in liveperformance. I subscribe to
(28:17):
Broadway HD, and I've seenmusicals there, but it's it
can't compare to you're in ahouse with a lot of other like
minded people. You're the energyof our audience, the energy of
the audience. That's true.
Right? Plus the energy on stage.It combines to make this
wonderful symbiosis, and thenyou have a wonderful experience
(28:41):
enjoying the performance. Idon't feel that at home when I'm
watching.
Cathy (28:46):
That's absolutely true. You you can't feel it at home.
As somebody who goes to a lot ofBroadway, I go to considering I
live in California, I go toBroadway a couple times a year.
I try to see four or five showswhile I'm there. And by the way,
Susan, don't miss OperationMintzmy.
I wanna see that. It's fabulous.And Susan, what would you like
(29:09):
our audience to have as atakeaway today?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (29:13):
Well, obviously I'd love it if they
buy my book.
Cathy (29:16):
Oh, yeah. Beyond my book, I
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (29:20):
would like to say that you will never
lose by examining your dreamsand pursuing your heart towards
your vocation. You will neverlose even if people oppose you
or don't immediately supportyou. In the end, you want to be
fulfilled.
Merry (29:39):
Oh, that is so true. Thank you so much, Susan. That's
really powerful to You'rewelcome. Honor. Our guest today
on Late Boomers has been singerand author Susan Dormity
Eisenberg.
If you'd like to connect withSusan, you can reach her via her
website, susan d eisenberg, e Is e n b e r g dot com, and you
(30:03):
can buy her book.
Cathy (30:05):
Yeah. And please subscribe to our Late Boomers
podcast on YouTube. Like,follow, send it to all your
friends. Join us next week tomeet another inspiring guest,
Susie Prudin, who's a dynamorunning her own publishing
company, and she's in hereighties. And please share this
(30:25):
episode with a friend who needssome inspiration.
And as always, thank you forbeing part of our Late Boomers
community, and thanks again toSusan Normandy Eisenberg.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (30:37):
Thank you so much.
Cathy (30:47):
Thank you for joining us on Late Boomers, the podcast
that is your guide to creating athird act with style, power, and
impact. Please visit our websiteand get in touch with us at
lateboomers.us. If you wouldlike to listen to or download
other episodes of late boomers,go to ewnpodcastnetwork.podcast
Merry (31:11):
is also available on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and
most other major podcast sites.We hope you make use of the
wisdom you've gained here andthat you enjoy a successful
third act with your own style,power, and impact.
This is the EWN Podcast Network.
Cathy (00:14):
Welcome to Late Boomers, our podcast guide to creating
your third act with style,power, and impact. Hi. I'm Cathy
Worthington.
Merry (00:24):
And I'm Merry Elkins. Join us as we bring you
conversations with successfulentrepreneurs, entertainers, and
people with vision who aremaking a difference in the
world.
Cathy (00:34):
Everyone has a story, and we'll take you along for the
ride on each interview,recounting the journey our
guests have taken to get wherethey are, inspiring you to
create your own path to success.Let's get started.
Hello. I'm Cathy Worthington. Welcome to the late
(00:55):
boomers podcast. I'm here withmy cohost, Merry Alkins. And you
know, Mary, as baby boomers, wegrew up with music shaping every
part of our lives from Broadwaycast albums spinning on the
record player to rock and rollblasting from our radios.
Merry (01:11):
That is so true, Cathy. And I'm Merry Elkins, and that
music really was the soundtrackof our lives. And because we're
both been singers ourselves, weknow firsthand just how much
work and training, heart, andcourage it takes to step out on
a stage and share your voice.Whether you're singing in a
choir on a Broadway stage or anopera stage or just in the
(01:35):
shower or your living room.
Cathy (01:37):
Yeah. Which is why today's guest is such a joy for
us. Susan Dormity Eisenbergwrites about the world of
singers and performers. She'sthe author of two novels, The
Voice I Just Heard, now out in arevised edition, and One More
Seat at the Roundtable, a novelof Broadway's Camelot.
Merry (01:57):
That's right. And Susan has profiled singers for
publications like ClassicalSinger and Opera News and and
Huff Post. And she's a member ofthe author's guild, and she
spent part of her career in thearts marketing business at
places like Goodspeed OperaHouse, Syracuse Stage, and the
Joffrey Ballet.
Cathy (02:16):
She also studied voice herself, so she knows what it
takes, The discipline, workingwith nerves
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (02:23):
Yeah.
Cathy (02:23):
And the perseverance. And she knows how the demands
differ, whether you're singingVerdi in an opera house or
belting a rock ballad in a club.
Merry (02:33):
And her fiction captures all of that. It takes us behind
the curtain, not just to thedivas in the spotlight, but to
the accompanists, the directors,the stage managers, and all
those unsung heroes who make themagic on stage happen.
Cathy (02:50):
And as boomers, we really appreciate how Susan's stories
remind us of the generations ofsingers and performers who paved
the way and how that legacystill inspires new voices today.
Merry (03:02):
That is so true. And as fellow singers who know what it
feels like to sing in front ofan audience, it's a treat to
have Susan Dormity Eisenberg onour podcast. Welcome to Late
Boomers, Susan. Cathy,
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (03:17):
Merry, thank you so much for having me.
I couldn't have asked for anicer introduction. Everything
you said is exactly what I hopeto do in my work.
Cathy (03:27):
That's great. But, Susan, first, please tell us how the
music you grew up with and thepeople you knew planted the
seeds for your love of singingand your desire to write about
performers.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (03:40):
Well, the music I grew up with is the
exact music you mentioned. It'sthe Broadway show albums of the
late fifties and early sixties.My mother and father subscribed
to the Columbia Record Club, andI remember that.
Cathy (03:56):
Remember that? I remember that.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg: Broadway albums came in the same (03:59):
undefined
pack. My Fair Lady, Camelot,Sound of Music, and a couple
others. Well, I I took them upto my room, and I played them on
my record player.
Merry (04:10):
Uh-huh, right.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (04:11):
I fell in love. I had not seen any
shows at this point. I was alittle too young. My parents
hadn't taken me. I didn't get toBroadway for years, but we had
this summer theater, the ComedyMusical Theater, where I later
worked and which is the scene ofmy novel, and that's the first
time I saw a Broadway stylemusical.
(04:33):
In 1963, I saw Carnival.
Merry (04:36):
Oh, yeah.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (04:37):
Anna Maria Alburghetti's sister.
Cathy (04:41):
Well, what did you have a record or a singer you couldn't
stop playing?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (04:44):
Anna Maria Alburghetti.
Cathy (04:46):
Oh. Oh, really?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (04:47):
And yeah. Yes. In Carnival. And
Julie Andrews. Oh, yes.
Of course. Camelot and My FairLady. Oh, yeah. I could never
get enough of Julie Andrews.
Cathy (05:00):
Oh, sound of music
Merry (05:01):
too. Still can't. She still
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (05:02):
sound of music later in the movie, but
I'm just talking about themovie.
Merry (05:06):
Yeah. Absolutely. That is so true. What about, like, rock
music or I love
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (05:12):
rock music. I mean, yes. Everything
starting with, say, Elvis, I wasa little young, of course, the
Beatles.
Merry (05:20):
Oh, yeah.
Cathy (05:21):
Yeah. That was me.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (05:22):
Right? And then, of course, you have to
know this. I was at homevisiting my I mean, living there
for the summer in college whenWoodstock was happening. Oh,
yeah. I remember going home andtelling my parents, I'm going to
Woodstock.
My parents Did you go? No.You're not.
Cathy (05:41):
Oh, they stopped you from going?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (05:42):
They stopped me.
Cathy (05:43):
Oh. I was way too far away. I was in California.
Merry (05:47):
Yeah. Me too. I couldn't have gotten there.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (05:49):
Well, could you imagine
Cathy (05:50):
I was too young.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (05:52):
What would have happened if I set off
for Woodstock? You probablyremember that the I was in
Upstate New York near all theThe traffic. Wasn't very far.
People were trapped on
Merry (06:01):
the roads for hours. Oh, I bet.
Cathy (06:03):
Yeah. And then it rained, they were in the mud.
Merry (06:05):
And and oh, anyway, that's
Cathy (06:06):
a whole another subject.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (06:08):
That's another story. My mother and
father
Cathy (06:09):
It's a different podcast. Same thing.
Merry (06:11):
Yeah. Right. Right. Right. Well, I have to say that
I saw the Beatles in 1964 at theHollywood Bowl.
Cathy (06:18):
Oh, no.
Merry (06:18):
When they were there. And I sat in the very last row of
the whole place. Couldn't seethem except, you know, they were
the size of an ant, andeverybody was screaming so you
couldn't hear them. But that'skind of like my Woodstock.
Cathy (06:32):
Well, in 1966, I saw them in Dodger Stadium. And '65, I
saw them in a football stadium.My mother went with me. Oh, she
did. I'm awestruck.
Sure did.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (06:45):
I'm struck I'm awestruck. You well,
then I resent Let's
Cathy (06:49):
get back to her subject.
Merry (06:51):
Oh, okay. So let's talk about some of your novels,
because few of them are aboutthe vocal arts. And why did you
write the your last novel andthe first?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (07:03):
Well, it started as my first novel,
and then it became the new novelbecause I put it out first in
2012, and then I completelyrevised it and then putting out
a putting it out again. And Ialways sang and I studied voice
for years. I had eight teachers.
Merry (07:20):
Oh. Wow.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (07:21):
And they'd always say the same thing
when I came in. Oh, you have alovely voice, but you don't have
any technique. And even aftereight teachers, I never had
technique. So I I then I didinterview a lot of very famous
singers, and I thought, you knowwhat? This is an exciting thing,
and I wanna write about it.
I love singing. I don't plan tobe on stage, but I can bring it
(07:44):
to life as a writer.
Merry (07:45):
Ah, and you have. Well, give us some insights into the
backstage world of performing.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (07:52):
Well, of course, it's never glamorous.
It it looks glamorous only outfront, but usually backstage,
it's it's very unglamorous. Idid write a book about Camelot,
One More Seat at the Roundtable,a novel of Broadway's Camelot.
And the whole purpose of thebook was to fictionalize but be
very honest about what happenedin Camelot because Camelot was a
(08:15):
dumpster fire. And from the daythey left New York after
rehearsals, yes, yes, and wentto Toronto and then went to
Boston, it was a mess.
It almost closed in Boston, andit almost closed again after
opening on Broadway. So Iresearched it very carefully. I
talked to many people who Italked to people who were there
(08:36):
who told me what happened.
Merry (08:38):
Had no idea because it was such a great play and
musical and a wonderful movie.
Cathy (08:45):
But it's considered a success on Broadway, isn't Isn't
it?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (08:48):
It took a long time to become one,
though. What it happened was inToronto, they lost their
director, Moss Hart, and thenthere was no director, and it
was a sinking ship. They had nocaptain, and they brought in
Richard Burton's foster fatherto keep him calm, but Burton
Philip Burton kind of undid whatMoss Hart did, And then every
(09:12):
day in Boston, they were therefor five weeks, they were
getting changes to the script.Burton, Andrews, Goulet, Roddy
McDowell, they wondered what'swhat is tonight's script going
to be?
Cathy (09:26):
Oh, well, yeah, you can't have a show like that.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (09:28):
That's They made it back to New York.
They opened to very lacklusterreviews, and then a miracle
happened. They call it the Marchmiracle. The show had opened on
December 3, and on March 19, EdSullivan featured them. In the
meantime
Cathy (09:43):
Oh.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (09:45):
Moss Hart had come back, and he'd
redirected. The show was great.They did excerpts on Ed
Sullivan. The show was a hit.
Cathy (09:53):
Yeah. Think we all saw those.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (09:56):
Does that answer your question about
the backstage walk
Cathy (09:59):
of Yes.
Merry (10:00):
Yeah. Absolutely.
Cathy (10:01):
How have the performing arts like opera changed over the
years? And also tell us how pop,rock, rap, and country are
different from classical.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (10:14):
Well, the way opera's changed is that
in around the seventies andeighties, many American
companies were springing up, anda lot of those companies, such
as, let's say, the Houston GrandOpera, and some in other cities,
many cities, they developedyoung artist programs. So they
(10:36):
were training homegrown singersthat then they were singing they
were sending out into the world,to have starring roles or
starting with smaller roles andworking up. But the problem is
over the years, many, manysingers were training for the
profession, but the operacompanies were not doing as
(10:57):
well. And a few years ago, therewere 8,000 freelance singers.
Wow.
But only 80 I just read this inOpera America. Only 80 were
working steadily.
Cathy (11:08):
Oh, yeah.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (11:09):
So that that's one way it's changed.
Another way it's changed is thatwith the advent of opera in HD
introduced by the Met, peoplehave to look like their role. We
don't want a three hundred poundsinger playing an ingenue, at
least that's what the audienceThat's true. The casting became
(11:29):
really different, and singersbegan to feel pressure of being
ready for their close-up. That'sanother big Yeah.
Well, yeah. That's for sure.Remember how many heavy, lovely
ladies used to be the stars ofthe opera, like Mousserrat
Caballet? It was just huge, butthe most beautiful voice in the
(11:51):
world. I don't know if she woulddo a good get a lot of jobs
today.
Merry (11:57):
Well, there's a, yeah, there's a few beautiful opera
singers these days, though.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (12:02):
You mean large heavyset opera
singer? Of course, there are.
Cathy (12:05):
Yes. Yes. Oh, yes. No. Some some people
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (12:07):
will always break the trend. Mhmm.
I'd rather not name names, butyes.
Merry (12:13):
Yeah. And
Cathy (12:14):
do do you feel that the other categories of music have
changed a lot too?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (12:20):
Well, I'm not an expert on those, but
I do think that that some of themore modern styles have
infiltrated opera because we'renow having much more modern
opera, and we are hearingdifferent styles in that. And of
course, if we want to talk aboutBroadway, we have Hamilton.
Merry (12:40):
Oh, yeah.
Cathy (12:41):
Oh, yeah. Right? Love it. Love it. Love it.
I love it.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (12:44):
And also, the other thing that we
have to talk about is the factthat many people are not writing
Broadway musicals from scratchanymore. What they're using is a
potpourri
Cathy (12:55):
Jukebox.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (12:56):
Yeah. Jukebox musicals. That's that's
very popular.
Merry (13:00):
Yeah. I just saw Anne Julia, and I loved it, and it's
a jukebox musical.
Cathy (13:05):
And Mamma Mia just came back to Broadway. Mamma Mia. I
saw And you've got MJ andBeautiful Noise and all these
ones are just old song books.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (13:14):
Yeah. Just in time with Jonathan
Groff.
Cathy (13:17):
Oh, that's fantastic.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (13:19):
Love to see that.
Cathy (13:20):
That's fantastic. I did I did see it. I did see Is it
wonderful? He's incredible. Oh,he's
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (13:26):
I saw him as
Cathy (13:27):
Merrily We Roll Along. I mean Well, they can't do it
without him because hisbilling's on the outside of the
theater. So, it says JonathanGroff in Just in Time. They
don't do it. He's not missed aperformance.
There's no understudy. They justcan't do it without him.
Merry (13:43):
I wish it would come to LA. It probably will. I don't
But with him.
Cathy (13:49):
Oh. Yeah. You're gonna need him because his like I
said, they mounted the show withhis name attached to it.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (13:56):
I live in Baltimore, and I'm always in
my car with my husband drivingto New York. We see so many
shows. It's unbelievable. Oh,good. It is our mutual passion.
Cathy (14:07):
That's good. Don't miss that one. Don't miss that one.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (14:10):
My husband and I met in a
production of Camelot. I wasGuinevere and he was in the
chorus and neither one of usever set foot on stage again.
Merry (14:18):
Oh. Oh.
Cathy (14:20):
They weren't any good.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (14:22):
Yeah. Yeah.
Merry (14:25):
Well, I'd love to hear more about your novel, A Voice I
Just Heard. And it's a coming ofage story and a tale of love
that encourages us to follow ourhearts and chase our dreams.
It's also about the Vietnam War.Right? Yes.
So talk about your book and whyyou mixed war and the arts in
(14:48):
one to tell a story.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (14:49):
I'd love to. The Vietnam War was the
seminal event of my generation,and it sounds like possibly your
generation too. Yeah. You'reyounger than I am, but it was
pretty amazing. And I lost afriend in the war.
I always knew that I would haveto write about it. But when it
came time for me to write myfirst novel, I thought I would
(15:13):
incorporate that in a novel thatwas coming of age, but I was
also very interested in conceptof vocation. I think vocation is
so important to all of ourlives. If we have a gift, should
we use it to earn a living? Ifwe have two gifts, which one
should we choose?
Important, I mean, and then theold saying, if you love what you
(15:38):
do, you'll never work a day inyour life. And that's part of
vocation. So I wanted to talkabout a person, Nora Costello,
who was a young singer whodidn't get very much
encouragement from her family,but her brother was her North
Star. So The Voice I Just Heardis a novel about Nora, a young
(15:59):
soprano who's struggling withvocal stage fright. She meets an
alluring baritone, that's Bart,at the Summer Tent Theater, but
this is 1970.
It's a few weeks after herbrother's, death in Vietnam, and
she wonders how she will survivewithout her North Star and her
soul family cheerleader. Andwill Barb Wheeler, this singer
(16:21):
who knows a lot about singing,break what's left of her heart?
Those are the questions.
Cathy (16:27):
And so then that leads me to my next question. What's the
price of chasing a dream?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (16:35):
That is the question of the novel. The
price of chasing a dream, Ithink, is that we may wind up
having to alienate people whodon't agree with our dream. That
would be sometimes parents,sometimes mentors, because in in
moving forward toward our dream,sometimes we have to follow what
(16:55):
we want to do and not listen toperhaps naysayers. One choice.
Cathy (17:01):
I agree so much. I had a grandmother that nagged me every
day, You've got to go get yourteaching credential. I said, I
don't want to be a teacher, Iwant to be an actor. And she's
like, No, you need a teachingcredential. I said, But I don't
want to teach.
She just couldn't even fathomthat, like why I wouldn't do
that.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (17:20):
Yeah. In my book, it's really
interesting. Nora Costello has abeautiful soprano a coloratura
soprano, more Beverly Sills thanJulie Andrews. But the few times
that she sung in public and herparents were there, she was not
able to control her stagefright. So they don't know she
(17:41):
sings.
They don't know how well shesings. They don't even they
don't think she has a gift. AndI think one of the biggest
moments of the book for me is ahorrible moment when she goes to
the Metropolitan Opera with Bartand comes back, and she's so
inspired, and she tells herfather she's changed her mind.
She isn't going to Broadway.She's going to become an opera
(18:03):
singer.
And he says, didn't you just goto the opera? Don't you know
that people are born with giftslike that? Oh, it's like it's a
horrible thing.
Cathy (18:14):
Yeah. Is a horrible thing because you aren't born an opera
singer. That's for sure.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (18:19):
No. No. It's years and years.
Cathy (18:21):
It's years of training. Absolutely. And
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (18:24):
so I feel like we have to forge our
own path at all costs, all ofus. I know for myself, my
parents weren't excited that Isaid I wanted to be a writer.
Yeah. I think they were thinkingin order to be a writer, you had
to be Truman Capote.
Merry (18:42):
Not true.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg: Absolutely. You had to have a (18:43):
undefined
Gothic Southern upbringing.
Merry (18:50):
Maybe that's the point. What does theater teach us and
opera teach us about being ahuman being that we can't learn
by attending a sporting event ora lecture or anything else?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (19:04):
Well, at a sporting event or a
lecture, we're more of a passiveobserver, and the emotion comes
from perhaps the lecturer sayssomething that rings true, or we
get excited about watching ourfavorite team. But in opera and
theater, we really see ourselvesin the characters and that we
connect with also the people whoare interpreting the characters.
(19:27):
And so I think we can getobservations about life and we
can grow just from going to thetheater. It's amazing how much
theater affects us.
Merry (19:36):
Yeah. Really is. It really is. And it gives you so
much joy. And the audience isreally a participant.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg: Absolutely. The thing that I've (19:44):
undefined
observed about singing, greatsinging, great acting, is that
and I do cover this in my novelbecause I think it's important
to know. Those people havesomething to give. They're not
standing on stage waiting forapplause. The applause is a
byproduct of their greatness ortheir wonderful performance, but
(20:06):
that's not why they're reallythere.
The great ones are there toshare with us, to give to us.
Mhmm.
Cathy (20:13):
I agree. Is a career in the arts then a worthwhile goal,
and how can artists supportthemselves beyond the stage?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (20:23):
That's a really good question because I
think a lot of them can't, but Ithink it is a number of
compromises that they have tomake. As we've all heard, it's
not funny, but what's anothername for actor? Waiter. They're
out
Merry (20:39):
here in Los Angeles too.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (20:43):
I probably shouldn't give away
this spoiler, but I feel likedoing it because of what we're
talking about. My novel, mycharacter meets this fantastic
singer. He's a washed upBroadway baritone, but really,
he's a plumber.
Merry (20:58):
Oh.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (20:59):
That's how he earns his living. But I
mean, seriously, I think peoplehave to sometimes be really
flexible if they wanna be in thearts about doing other jobs,
maybe not for all time, maybejust for a short time or maybe
all your life, but people thatreally have to be there just do
have to be there. So I know alot of people that have made
(21:19):
compromises to stay in the arts.
Merry (21:21):
Well, price of chasing a dream. Right?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (21:23):
That is the price. Sometimes it is a
financial price, but I think alot of it is an emotional price.
Because if you are still havingto work two jobs to be an actor
or a singer, a dancer, it maymean that you haven't achieved
the level of hireability, ifthat's a word, to sustain you.
(21:46):
It may be that you didn't quiteget to that place. Mhmm.
Merry (21:49):
Yeah. That's that's a big, big disappointment. Yeah.
Cathy (21:54):
You think? It is.
Merry (21:56):
And we've all been there.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (21:57):
I also worked at the Joffrey Ballet. I
was in marketing, and I saw allthe heartache in dance. And, I
mean, those kids, they startdancing when they're very young,
and they could be washed up atage 30. I'm serious with the
level of injuries. They couldbe.
Merry (22:16):
And especially nowadays with the kind of athleticism
that it requires. It's moreathletic. It absolutely is.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (22:24):
I think dance is much more healthy for
for women now, though. SinceGeorge Balanchine passed on and
since the companies havechanged, I see more womanly
figures in dance, which I reallyappreciate.
Cathy (22:36):
Yeah.
Merry (22:37):
That's that's true. Let's talk about where you grew up.
Cohoes? Cohoes, New York. Yes.
And you used it in your novel.Talk about Well,
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (22:50):
I used it as a symbol because Nora's
brother, who died, loved theCahos Falls. Cahos has a
waterfall that's the secondlargest waterfall in New York
State.
Cathy (23:02):
Oh.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (23:03):
It's very beautiful, and it's the
second most famous after thatother waterfall.
Cathy (23:11):
The one in Buffalo.
Merry (23:12):
Yeah, right. So
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (23:15):
I used the Cahos Falls as a metaphor
for just life. He just found somuch solace, the brother going
to the falls. It was somethinghe felt he discovered because in
my day a lot of people didn't goto the falls. They weren't
really running. They werediverted for hydropower, so you
(23:37):
rarely saw them, and I rarelysaw them when I lived there.
So I used them as a symbol oflife and he used them, Liam, as
something that inspired him.Then later after he died, my
protagonist had a song createdto a famous poem about the
(23:58):
Cahoe's Falls. It's an 1804 poemby the bard of Ireland, Thomas
More, and I had it commissionedand had it actually written as a
song so that my heroine couldsing it.
Cathy (24:12):
Oh, I was going to ask you about the song you
commissioned, Laurie Laitman.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (24:17):
Laurie Laitman, she's a wonderful art
song and opera composer.
Cathy (24:21):
So you actually had the song composed, like commissioned
it, that you could let theheroine singer sing it in the
book?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (24:30):
Yes, and then what we did was Lori
has many recordings, so it'sonly one song, so she put the
song on an album called BetweenThese Spaces I believe, and then
it's also free to hear onYouTube. Just Google Lines
written at the Falls. So weoriginally thought that we might
(24:50):
have a CD that went with thenovel, but that's Yeah. No.
Technology has, you know,outpaced that.
Cathy (24:57):
Yeah. Because nobody has a CD player.
Merry (24:59):
That's right.
Cathy (25:00):
Yeah, because years ago my daughter wrote a children's
book when she was a child, shewas seven, and it came out with
a CD of the kids singing thesong that was the book, And it
was very popular because youeverybody had a CD player. You
popped it in fantastic. In yourkid's bedroom. They're reading
the book. You pop the thing in,but can't do that anymore.
(25:24):
When it was they re reissued itlast year on the twenty fifth
anniversary of the book. Theydid. She's now 35. And so
there's you know? But no CD.
No more CDs. Think that's Andit's too bad because
Merry (25:41):
You have to stream it.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (25:43):
Yes. Yes.
Cathy (25:43):
No. But there is no streaming of those kids singing
it. We went in the studio,recorded it with kids that she
knew. Oh, yeah. Bunch of kidssinging.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (25:52):
Yeah. Yeah. My original conception,
and then I Laurie went alongwith it, was that we wanted
people to hear the song and thesoprano. Then in this version of
the book, my own soprano, Nora,couldn't the book ends with her
trying to perform that song, butnot necessarily succeeding
(26:12):
because she's just not trainedenough. She's just bikini, and
she hasn't gone to conservatory.
She's on her way, but she can'treally do justice to the song.
So the the whole purpose of thesong now in the book is not only
to pay tribute to Liam, herbrother, but also to show what
it takes to sing an art song.You can't just interpret one.
(26:34):
You can sing the notes, but youmay not be able to put it
across.
Merry (26:38):
That is really, really true. When you watch all the TV
shows like The Voice andAmerican Idol today, it's all
about the interpretation.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg: Everything's about (26:47):
undefined
interpretation the arts.
Cathy (26:50):
Mhmm.
Merry (26:50):
So on that note, what do you think is the overall value
of performance, going to aperformance versus listening to
it, or even watching it on TV oronline?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (27:01):
Oh, I I feel very strongly about this. I
love singers. I have severalvery famous singers that I fell
in love with. They happen to beopera singers. And I got all
their CDs and I played them, andthen my experience going to the
house, to the MetropolitanOpera, was so different.
(27:22):
Or it could be a car CarnegieHall. It could be a recital hall
in DC. I've heard them atvarious places. What I learned
was the voice, at least at thatlevel, is a fraction of what you
hear in the house. Doesn't havethe depth.
You're only hearing the frontpart. But when you go to the
opera, you're hearing the wholevoice. And no great recording
(27:45):
can give you that. Really?That's what I think.
Merry (27:49):
Yeah. It's interesting.
Cathy (27:51):
You would think the recording could pick up much
more nuance and detail.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (27:57):
Maybe nuance and detail, but the depth
of the voice. And the heart.Yeah. It's just not quite there.
In my opinion, I may be wrong.
It just may be me, or I justfell so in love with those
particular voices that hearingthem live was so exciting. But I
always believe in liveperformance. I subscribe to
(28:17):
Broadway HD, and I've seenmusicals there, but it's it
can't compare to you're in ahouse with a lot of other like
minded people. You're the energyof our audience, the energy of
the audience. That's true.
Right? Plus the energy on stage.It combines to make this
wonderful symbiosis, and thenyou have a wonderful experience
(28:41):
enjoying the performance. Idon't feel that at home when I'm
watching.
Cathy (28:46):
That's absolutely true. You you can't feel it at home.
As somebody who goes to a lot ofBroadway, I go to considering I
live in California, I go toBroadway a couple times a year.
I try to see four or five showswhile I'm there. And by the way,
Susan, don't miss OperationMintzmy.
I wanna see that. It's fabulous.And Susan, what would you like
(29:09):
our audience to have as atakeaway today?
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (29:13):
Well, obviously I'd love it if they
buy my book.
Cathy (29:16):
Oh, yeah. Beyond my book, I
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (29:20):
would like to say that you will never
lose by examining your dreamsand pursuing your heart towards
your vocation. You will neverlose even if people oppose you
or don't immediately supportyou. In the end, you want to be
fulfilled.
Merry (29:39):
Oh, that is so true. Thank you so much, Susan. That's
really powerful to You'rewelcome. Honor. Our guest today
on Late Boomers has been singerand author Susan Dormity
Eisenberg.
If you'd like to connect withSusan, you can reach her via her
website, susan d eisenberg, e Is e n b e r g dot com, and you
(30:03):
can buy her book.
Cathy (30:05):
Yeah. And please subscribe to our Late Boomers
podcast on YouTube. Like,follow, send it to all your
friends. Join us next week tomeet another inspiring guest,
Susie Prudin, who's a dynamorunning her own publishing
company, and she's in hereighties. And please share this
(30:25):
episode with a friend who needssome inspiration.
And as always, thank you forbeing part of our Late Boomers
community, and thanks again toSusan Normandy Eisenberg.
Susan Dormady Eisenberg (30:37):
Thank you so much.
Cathy (30:47):
Thank you for joining us on Late Boomers, the podcast
that is your guide to creating athird act with style, power, and
impact. Please visit our websiteand get in touch with us at
lateboomers.us. If you wouldlike to listen to or download
other episodes of late boomers,go to ewnpodcastnetwork.podcast
Merry (31:11):
is also available on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and
most other major podcast sites.We hope you make use of the
wisdom you've gained here andthat you enjoy a successful
third act with your own style,power, and impact.
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