June 20, 2025 • 39 mins
Seg 1 – Understanding the Illegal Alien Economy
Seg 2 – What’s the BBB Holdup?
Seg 3 – The High Cost of Illegal Alien Employers
Seg 4 – The Societal Weight of Illegal Immigration
Seg 2 – What’s the BBB Holdup?
Seg 3 – The High Cost of Illegal Alien Employers
Seg 4 – The Societal Weight of Illegal Immigration
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
The views and opinions expressed on the following program are
those of the host and guests and do not necessarily
represent those of any organization, including one generation away.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
No that it was free freedom of speech, freedom of religion, freedom.
Speaker 3 (00:14):
Of enterprise, and freedom is special and read.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
This is Liberty Nation with Markangeldes, a production of Libertynation
dot Com, going after what the politicians really mean and
making it all clear for your freedom and your liberty.
Liberty Nation with Markangeledes.
Speaker 3 (00:34):
Hello, Welcome to the Liberty Nation radio head Coast Coast
on the Radio American Network from a flagship station in
the nation's capital, WWRC in Washington, d C. I'm your host,
Marc Antonides on today's special Illegal Immigration edition. We are
talking economics, budgets, employment and society and how they're all
impacted by the floods of people who enter the country illegally.
(00:55):
It's going to be quite the show. Please remember a
Liberty Nation Radio sponsor bylibert Nation dot Com. You can
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and brilliant shows to whetry uptype for freedom and your
find us for the Great American Constitution. And you're on
Liberty Nation Radio head Coast to coast on the Radio
American Network. I'm your host, Mark Andrew. It was very
fortunate to have with us on this immigration extravaganza. Liberty
(01:17):
Nations economics guru, mister Andrew Moran, Thanks for being here,
Andrew val So, Andrew, it's all systems go in terms
of what's happening with immigration. It's an immigration draw down,
some might say, and what we've seen since Trump came
back to office is a I think it's a more
than ninety percent reduction in border crossings. And then of
(01:40):
course he's he's exempted from the privilege of visa's twelve countries,
with a potential thirty six on the way, and the
deportations of those already in the country illegally appears to
be continuing apace, and that has the folks over at Washington,
(02:01):
DC's most prominent news outlet in a bit of a
fuster because they say that the immigration might be the
lowest number or in reverse for the first time in
fifty years. It gives the outline there, Andrew.
Speaker 4 (02:16):
Yeah, you see the numbers, you know, especially on the
labor fort side of things, that the number of immigrant
workers were foreign born workers, according to the Beer of Labors,
has actually been on the decline this year, which has
been which has been notable because for the last few
years you've seen such a divergence between the number of
employed US born workers and the number of employee foreign
born workers, such a wide gap, and it's been a
(02:37):
wide gap since around late twenty nineteen. So it's been
a really significant sign in the in the US labor market.
And one thing was when that was reading this article,
what Kenyan mine is that during during the Biden years,
people were saying, yeah, well, all this, all this job
gains is because of the illegal immigrants. And if you look
at the Beer of Labors to six methodology, they include
(02:59):
illegal immigrants in that foreign born worker metric. So I
think the timing is interesting whereby you have the clearly
collapse of deported of illegal immigrants across on the border
and all these deportations and then you're all seeing a
decline the number of employed foreign born workers. So it's
not just legal immigrants who are getting jobs.
Speaker 3 (03:19):
Yeah, it was. It's one of the the unspoken open
secrets that you know, the job data it accounts for that.
Now that interestingly, there's a recent report out in the
UK that illegal immigration accounts for a huge it's it's
several orders of billion, which in the in the UK
(03:40):
is a lot of money. Not not in America, of course,
but it's a lot of money in the UK. A
part of the the the black market economy which obviously
doesn't pay taxes, and yet it's still counted in the
overall figures, especially when Britain was part of the European Union,
(04:01):
because the remittances to the European Union they counted. Well,
you've got this much of a black market economy as well,
Well we want our cut of that. It was very
much a mafio. So way forward. So with if the
DC's most prominent paper is correct and there's actually going
(04:21):
to be a reverse in the immigration numbers, what does
that mean economically?
Speaker 4 (04:29):
Well, we should we should differentiate between legal and illegal or.
Speaker 3 (04:32):
Well let's let's start with illegal then okay, well.
Speaker 4 (04:35):
Okay, So so what I find funny comical in this
article was it kept seeing how, oh, if we if
we get rid of all these all these illegal immigrants,
then wages are going to climb for all these different
sectors now terrible and they're going to have higher inflation
as we all the all the higher costs that companies
are are going to be, they're going to be more
onto them or we pass on to the customers. Now,
(04:57):
so far, of course, we have we we have yet
to see the inflation from any thing under this administration,
whether from immigration or tariffs. Now it could be a
lag effect, but who knows. Now on the legal side
of it, that is more concerning because if you look
at let's say, the Jolts Report, that's the monthly survey
conducted by the Bureau of Labor Statistics that shows the
number of job vacancies in the United States. This number
(05:20):
has remained elevated. It's still above seven million, is higher
than it was before the coronavirus pandemic. So the ices
does have a labor shortage, and you know, the Chamber
of Commerce regularly publishes a report identifying this problem. Now,
the White House thinks it can reverse this because the
number of working men is really really is they're out
(05:43):
of work, so therefore they can fill this gap. But
the event they've yet to do this over the last
few years. I think the other side of the equation
is more concerning, is the entitlement spending, because if you
have fewer workers in the United States, then of course
there's be fewer people contributing to the Social Security, Medicare
and men as Liberation is reported for years, this thing,
(06:03):
you know, it's it's running out of money. And if
you have let's say two to one, sorry to two workers,
two employed workers for every retiree, that's not a sustainable program.
So you need legal immigrants to come in to help
fill that gap and to sustain these these these programs.
Now that's who knows if that's going to happen or not.
But if LEO immigrants are really falling for what the
(06:25):
media is saying, then yeah, So Americas aren't having babies.
They're not they're not growing in populations, a lot of
it through immigration, which is, you know, you can debate
the merits of that, but the economics of it shows
that you need immigration if you want to keep everything
intact Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid or the other mandatory spending.
Speaker 3 (06:45):
Yes, you pointed that in a recent article on the
the one big beautiful bill that's currently making its way
through the Senate. That and this is an old sore
for Washington Day say, but it doesn't have a revenue problem.
It has a spending problem. I guess until the spending
gets under control, there's no real way to separate immigration
(07:09):
from the overall economic debate, even though in any sensible,
serious country you shouldn't be reliant on foreign workers. I
think otherwise, what kind of a country is that? What's
your take on that? Yet?
Speaker 2 (07:22):
My opinion, fine, in a perfect role, okay, perhaps, but
that doesn't take the fact way that you need you
need legal immigration today's world, because whether where you are
where I am or the United States, the domestic population
is not having children.
Speaker 4 (07:37):
I mean, there was a slight uptick in the United States,
I think it was last year before, but overall it's
been just a steady decline. And the problem with that
is that, fine, the Americans aren't having babies, but politicians
have made it all these grandiose promises and have been
Santa Claus for the last several decades. And now those bills,
those bills are coming due, and so now you're going
to have to immigrate people from India, You're gonna have
(07:58):
to have people come from you know, Australia, whatever the case.
Speaker 3 (08:03):
It's Yeah, However, I find the reality of that situation
is a very it's a very short term solution, isn't it.
Because as people move to for example, the United States,
they tend to adopt the habits and customs, and they
also don't have the same amount of children they may
have had in their their home country, and they end
(08:24):
up with the two point four, one point eight or
one point nine that the rest of the population is having.
And so it's it's like a Ponzi scheme almost. You're
bringing in people because you need more people to pay
into the social securities people get older, but then these
people will also want to have the social security to
(08:44):
medicaid medicare as they get older, and so you have
to bring in more and more. It's it's the world's
most depressing Ponzi scheme. But let's talk about some more
bride sparks on the horizon, potentially for the middle and
working classes. After this short break, don't go anywhere.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
For your freedom and your liberty. Liberty Nation with Mark
Edge of.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
Ladies Andrew back on Liberty Nation Radio, Romainia host Mark
Anthony's and we're continuing our economics talks with economics guru
mister Andrew Moran. Thanks for sticking around Andrew. Now, we
hinted at the big beautiful bill in its progress. Now
at the time of recording, it's it's really only just
come out of the Senate Finance Committee, so there's gonna
(09:39):
there's likely to be changes further within the Senate, and
then of course it's got to go back to the House.
Uh this. I believe there's a self imposed deadline of
July fourth on that, and I know that Mike Johnson's
pretty keen to if necessary, keep people there during congressional recess,
if if he has to, to get it past. But
(09:59):
I want to talk about the rhetoric and the narrative
that surrounds the I hate calling it the one big
beautiful bill, you know, because it might not be one.
It might not be beautiful. It will certainly be big, and
it's definitely a bill, but we'll see what it comes
out like. Although I do appreciate why they're trying to
get it all into one bill, because you know, otherwise,
(10:23):
though everything they want here is going to take years
and it's going to be into the next presidency whoever
that happens to be. So I get why they're doing
it in one bill, but a lot of the critics
of this are calling it, and specifically Bernie Sanders, because
of course he is once again asking you to believe
everything he says and donate your money to him, of course,
(10:46):
but they're saying that it's essentially it's tax cuts for
the rich and nothing more. And that's the dominant narrative
from Capitol Hill on what one side of Capitol Hill
least and the mainstream legacy media. But that's not quite right,
is it, Andrew.
Speaker 4 (11:04):
I will know you're know you're right, But I'll say
one thing is that it's a thousand pages. And I'll
highly doubt anyone in Congress, whether I mean even marjor
Marjorie Taylor Green admitted that, oh I didn't know about
that artificial intelligence provisions.
Speaker 3 (11:16):
That was a page bill.
Speaker 4 (11:17):
But anyway, so yeah, absolutely, So it's as if there's
only one line of text, and it's that there's only
it's only tax us for billionaires, but all the papers
are citing. So for example, there was a recent congressional
hearing House Ways and Means Committee hearing, and I think
his names Richard Neil, he's in Congress with and he
was saying, oh, this is only for tax cuts for billionaires,
(11:38):
he started setting the Joint Committee and Taxation, he started
setting Congressional budsh Office. But if you read those papers,
it says, yes, there's taxes for billionaires, but the average
tax rate for most Americans is actually going down, uh if.
Speaker 3 (11:50):
From there under the proposed law.
Speaker 4 (11:52):
Yeah, so it's not just you know, everyone is gonna
eat crumbs and everyone and the rich are gonna have
zero Pretend time.
Speaker 3 (12:00):
Is the crow that was Nancy Pelosi? Wasn't it talking
about the original twenty seventeen. Yeah, ten years later, this
is exactly. It's almost as if they were given a
report it will be almost ten years ago now, and
they said, right, this is what you're sticking to and
(12:20):
just keep saying it until everybody believes it. You had
a great article on this call that is the one big,
beautiful bill for bidding it as it came out this week,
and you really dove into the very numbers that the
critics are citing and what is it because they're they're
they're citing research, but the research itself doesn't say what
(12:42):
they say it says. So are they just mistaken? Are
they purposely obscating? Are they trying to get away with
the lies damn life statistics thing and hope that enough
obfuscation on the numbers could be brushed over. And most importantly,
I think the question has to be Andrew is why
(13:04):
would those who oppose the bill now sure that there
could be plenty of things to oppose, as you mentioned
Madri Taylor Green and the the AI embargo on AI regulation.
But regarding the tax cuts, for example, tax on tips
and overtime, why is nobody getting behind that? I thought
(13:25):
that was a fairly well why are they trying to
kill that? Because I thought that that would be fair
popular for everybody.
Speaker 4 (13:31):
Right, Well, it was Washington politics, of course. I mean,
of course it's automatically that the one side I was
going to pose this bill, and that's how they have
to market it. So they have to defend their opposition
by claiming that is only for the ultra wealthy, when
of course it's not the case. But you know that
you're absolutely right. So even if you take away the
average tax re declines across the board except for the
(13:54):
lowest number, which is fifteen to thirty thousand dollars Rose
getting tax cuts. But you look at the no tax
on tips, who does a benefit the working class, no
tax overtime? Who has a benefit the working class? The
one thousand dollars bait bonus, which of course I have
a reservation is about. But overall, who does a benefit
the low and middle income households? So you have all
these goodies here that benefit, you know, the typical person.
(14:16):
So there was another one, I think I think it
was Senator Sanders who was saying, oh, but you have
the two hundred and eighty five billion tax breaks for
the two tenths of the top one percent. Okay, fine,
that may be case, but also what about the person's
making eighty one hundred thousand dollars a year of their
tax rates going down from fifteen point four to thirteen
(14:36):
and a half percent. I think it's also worth pointing out, too,
is that we've had this conversation I think a couple
of years ago, and we argued that one of the
worst consequences of inflation is that you're artificially placed into
a higher tax bracket because yes, you're earning more, but
why you're earning more to keep up with inflation. When
you keep up with inflation, your tax rate goes up.
Serve for the games are negligible. So this is all
(14:59):
the side effects of inflations. For this OBBB is perhaps
somewhat correcting that the inflation the crisis of the last
few years.
Speaker 3 (15:08):
Yes, it's uh, I believe my memory is correct. I'm
not just engaged in like a Golden age thinking issue here.
But the under Trump's first term, the economy was rather good.
There were some dark spots, naturally, because there always are,
but for the working the middle passes, it was a
(15:29):
pretty good economy. And then there were four years of
let's be clear on what it is, it was a
pretty terrible economy overall, especially with the inflation. Now we're
at Trumponomics two point zero, and it it's really just
that a correct is it really just trying to replicate
(15:50):
the exact same conditions, I mean, essentially taking the tax
cut jobs that and then making that permanent and then
putting a couple of extras on top or it was
there's something more substantial at player.
Speaker 5 (16:02):
No.
Speaker 4 (16:02):
No, I think you're right. I think the OBB replicates
somewhat of the TCG. I mean, I mean, I think
this is just this is just one aspect of Trumpenomics
two point h. Of course, the mother load is the
whole terror situation and rebalancing global trade and turning the
ICD to a manufacturing prowess and turning everyone else into consumer.
So I think it's just there's only one, one, one,
one flank of Trump.
Speaker 3 (16:25):
You mentioned tariffs there, Andrew, and another great article that
you wrote for libertination dot com was looking for the
elusive inflationary impact or costs on consumers of Trump's attempt to,
I guess, rejig the entire global economy through mean tweets,
(16:47):
which I found quite entertaining. But it's it's turned out
to be elusive, hasn't it The the data that everybody
warned about. Yeah, you know when.
Speaker 4 (16:56):
When Trump announces April second liberation the tariffs, you know,
economis an apoplectic, and they said, oh, you know, we're
gonna have You know, inflation is the spiral out of control.
But so far all the leading index inflation reports, so
that inflation is yet to rear its ugly head. You know,
you have inflation slightly above two percent. You have the
producer price index, which is the measure of the prices
(17:17):
paid for business services by business, and it can serve
as a precursor to future consumer inflation that that's been
very low. It actually fell I think it was in April.
Speaker 5 (17:28):
Uh.
Speaker 4 (17:29):
The important price inflation that inport sorry import export prices,
that's been minimal even go through true inflation. It's a
it's a popular private running estimate of inflation, and it
uses millions of data points, and it's been again it's
been below two percent. Now I was I will note
that that tariffs operate on a leg so who knows.
(17:49):
Maybe the inflation will show up later in the year
when all the INVENTORYX is all the pre April second
inventory is exhausted and they have to start importing again.
So maybe that's when inflation starts appearing. But for now,
prices aren't aren't aren't accelerating. And I think that's perturbing
a lot of Trump's critics because because they were betting
that tariffs will raise inflation and become ugly as biden onyx.
(18:13):
But I will say one thing that you look at
the University of Michigan's Consumer Sentiment Index and you had
that what your inflation out looks saying going as high
as eight percent. But that thing is just created out
because a lot of a lot of the American people
are realizing okay, so in tariffs will not be that bad.
Trade Paulis will not be that bad. So that actually
trimmed their inflation expectations, which I think that that that's
(18:35):
been that's been the most hilarious part of this expectation
because you look at that, you mish and you sat
just a spish. People thought that inflation go to ten percent.
Speaker 3 (18:43):
Yeah, they thought it'd be the same as under Joe Biden.
That that was yeah, that that wasn't what they voted for.
Andrew Moran, thanks ever so much for being with us,
really to appreciate it. No, that's what was free. Freedom
of speech, freedom of religion, freedom.
Speaker 5 (19:04):
Of enterprise, and freedom is special and ate.
Speaker 1 (19:07):
This is Liberty Nation with Markangeldes, a production of Libertynation
dot Com, going after what the politicians really mean and
making it all clear for your freedom and your liberty.
Liberty Nation with Markangeledes.
Speaker 3 (19:24):
And welcome back to Liberty Nation Radio Ramania host Mark Anthony's.
We're continuing our talk on immigration, this time with the
Liberty Nations enterprise reporter mister Joe Schaefer, Kerry Enterprising Joe Shaffer,
Hi Mark to the Enterprising and entertaining Joe Shafer. Thanks
for being on, Joe, really appreciate it. So we've been
(19:46):
talking earlier in the show. We're talking with Andrew Moran
about the economic impacts of first the migration, illegal migration,
and then the end of illegal migration. What economic impacts
that having With you, Joe, I want to kind of
take this a little bit broader and talk about societal impacts,
(20:07):
impacts on the workforce, and the political ramifications of that.
So we've seen a bit of a ferrari this last
week over discussion about going after employers who employ illegal migrants.
What's your take on that.
Speaker 5 (20:25):
Well, in New York Times had an article, I believe
it was a few days earlier before Trump spoke, in
which he said they quoted, you know, top sources in
the administration saying the administration was going to pivot away
from going after farm and hotel illegal alien workers because
(20:46):
they had been receiving low back from the employers. And
you know, it's New York Times. You can never know
if they're if they're actually reporting the truth. They've got
ACTD to wield. But Trump actually came out and made
up public statement authenticating the story, saying that we have
a lot of good people in the farm and hotel
(21:07):
industry that want to lose their good workers. And you know,
he basically said that they've been a pivot away from this,
and you know it's not just anecdotal all or. I
can tell you my friends who support Trump are angry
about this. Trump supporters are going to be angry about this.
They did not elect him just to deport so called
criminal illegal aliens, which is really a drop in the ocean.
(21:29):
They did not just elect him to deport illegal aliens.
They elected him to go after the employers of illegal aliens,
to change this decades long construct that not only has
helped flood the country with illegals, but has hurt the
hurt the wage power of the American worker. So you know,
(21:53):
they want there's real systemic change, and you can't get
real systemic change on immigration without going after the lawyers.
Speaker 3 (22:01):
So it's interesting you bring that up because there was
a report into the Brexit the potential impacts of Brexit
before the before the vote took place, and I believe
it's a chap called Charlie Rose who was doing their report,
and he had this as a negative. He said, wages
(22:24):
would rise because we'd have less immigration come in. And
he was selling this as well, this is a bad
thing because wages would rise for the average Britain and
he was I mean, he was ripped for that and
still does get ripped for it today for saying that
it's a bad thing that wages would rise for the
(22:44):
average Britain. But I guess the point that he was
making was that it's the it's the businesses that have
to pay this this extra rate to get workers. So
back to what the New York Times said, and that
Donald Trump he seemed to confirm, but I'd push back
(23:05):
a little bit on that. He says we're pivoting away
or towards and I think Tom Holman, the borders are
clean this up fairly. Well, I'm not sure. I guess
there's still a lot of trepidation. Are we going to
have we been sold a pup as it were? A
lot of his supports might be saying. But he said
(23:27):
that we're going after, Yes, the employers, We're going after
the people who work in those industries. But he seemed
to be saying that the priority is the ones that
you describe as a drop in the bucket, the violent
illegal alien criminals. And I want to Joe, maybe I'll
play a bit of Devil's advocate here. Is in terms
(23:49):
of damage to the country, society, and the individuals, don't
you think that prioritizing those who have committed violent crimes
in the country should be the priority?
Speaker 5 (24:03):
Right?
Speaker 3 (24:03):
Should shouldn't that be? Wouldn't that limit the greater damage?
Speaker 5 (24:08):
First priority implies that we're going to take care of
them first, and then we're going to take care of
the rest problem. Now, what Trump said suggested to me
that he's not so interested in taking care of the
rest of the problem, and so I'm not going to
let him off the hook care His words very alarming.
Yet Tom Holman said they're still going to go after employers,
(24:28):
so we you know, it's still up in the air,
I guess. But what Donald Trump said, President Donald Trump
said is we have good people on these farms, these
industrial scale farms, who have these good workers. Well, you know,
it's not a good situation on these big farms. It's
an ugly, ugly, scandalous situation. I've written about it several times,
(24:49):
We've talked about it on Liberty Nation before. Abuses to
these illegal alien workers are horrific including rape, death on
the job of children. There was just a case, a
civil lawsuit at Michigan. I wrote about it on June first,
before the outcome. The outcome has now been reached. A
jury found against hiring service. I guess it is for
(25:13):
legal aliens that come from Guatemala via the H two
A visas you know, the pipeline into America. The jury
awarded five hundred thousand dollars in punitive damages for abusing
their illegal alien workforce. And these people were working one
hundred hour weeks, twenty hour workdays, and they were only
being paid sixty out of the one hundred hours. It
(25:35):
came up to about eight dollars an hour. So and
according to the workers, they said that they were threatened
by they were being charged twenty five hundred dollars or
so to go through that pipeline H TWOA pipeline. This
is a course of grotesque abuse of the system charging
twenty five hundred dollars, which is it is not, in
(25:57):
effect is in ventured service to Okay, what you have
to work off your twenty five hundred dollars fee to
the company. It's like the factory store days it is,
so they use that threat against their cheap worker for
us while while they're underpaying them. So you can't tell
me it's a situation where we value our good workers
(26:18):
and our g Americans just don't do this job. This
is malevolent attempt. This is malevolent intent on the employer's parts.
And so for when President Trump says good people, good workers,
he you know it's not true. We all know it's
not true. If you call the subhead I had on
(26:38):
it was a corder hat Leonard Cohen song. Everybody. Everybody knows.
Everybody knows the dice is loaded. Everybody rolls with their
fingers crossed. That what is those It's a great song.
By the way, what does that line mean? Everybody knows,
everybody rolls with their fingers crossed. We all know it's
a rotten system. But they want to to feel like, hey,
(27:01):
when you get lucky anyway, Hey, you can work out
for us when you have societal outcomes that aren't working anymore.
And this is what you're especially seeing in England, which
is on the point of civil war because their societal
outcomes aren't working. Societal outcomes are not working for the
American people on a basic level. And if we want
to go with farms, look at the obesity crisis, look
(27:23):
at the autoimmune crisis. The output of the actual product
that these illegal alien farm workers are producing is corroded cheap,
unhealthy food. So maybe this whole model needs to be
I would say, blown up, but at least we examined.
And this model feeds absolutely feeds on exploited. It exploited
(27:47):
it of cheap labor imported from Central America.
Speaker 3 (27:51):
Yes, the link between illegal alien employment and human trafficking,
I mean it's it's clear, very very clear pipeline. And
it's not something that's just based in the United States,
either from South to North America, but worldwide. People abusing
(28:11):
the visa systems that are in place through disreputable companies
that hire and the care industry is a prime example
of that in the United Kingdom hiring cares from overseas
because they've got the right to bring in as many
cares as they like under the visa proposals, and really
(28:32):
they're just treated appallingly. But of course we're all supposed
to applaud that, but look at all these people coming
into care for our elderly population, and it's a tragedy
on so many levels. We're going to be back with
Joe Schaeffer after the shortbreak. Don't go Anywhere.
Speaker 1 (28:53):
For your freedom and your liberty. Liberty Nation with.
Speaker 3 (28:57):
Mark Edgelities, and you're back with Mark Antelais and Joe
Schaeffer on Liberty Nation Radio. We're continuing our talk on immigration,
illegal immigration or otherwise. Now. Joe, we talked about the
exploited nature of the illegal micros being employed within the
United States workforce. But there's also a societal detriment I
(29:21):
think too, and you know a lot of people on
the left would disagree with this, but there's a societal
detriment to having a lot of illegal immigration within the
city's towns and communities. And we do here all the time.
These people are part of our community. These people are
part of our town our districts, and I don't think
(29:44):
it's actually entirely true. And I quote none other than
the and this is off the top of my head,
so please do forgive me if I get the year
on a two thousand and seven article in the New
York Times that actually look that you know is diversity,
the strength, the strength, and what they found was and
(30:05):
this was this was by a proponent of one of
the major proponents of diversity and you know, increased immigration.
And what they found was that communities with more diversity
were less trusting of each other, even if it was
diversity among people who are from the same place, then
(30:26):
less trusting of each other. They volunteered less, they engaged
civically less, and were generally less hopeful about life. Joe,
your thoughts, Well, it's a.
Speaker 5 (30:41):
Very philosophical question, and actually it's a very good philosophical question. Paul,
give you my philosophical answer. And it ties back to
what we were talking about with the so called good
employers on the industrial farms. And I believe this is
all representative of an oligarchy when people have learned a
(31:01):
lot a lot. Americans have learned a lot about oligarchy
thanks to the Biden administration.
Speaker 3 (31:08):
If I might just interrupt a recent survey, I believe
it was Neapolitan News survey that there's a vas swath
of Americans don't actually know what the word oligarchy means.
And I'm presuming they're the ones that are attending the
Bernie and aoc oligarchy tours. One. Please carry on, No,
(31:30):
it's true.
Speaker 5 (31:30):
But I think that Joe Biden, really they know the
word at all. His administration illustrated it in such a
way that Americans understand now. It is a bunch of
elites who want a society that works best for them,
and they do not care for the middle class. They
see the middle class as an impediment. And what we
(31:51):
are seeing is more elites, more wealthy people, and a
lot more poorkyeople and nothing in between. And that is
the historical recipe for violent, violent evolution. That's how you
get a French revolution in seventeen eighty nine, That's how
(32:12):
you get a Russian revolution in nineteen seventeen. But you know,
temporarily it works great for these people. So you know,
let's go back to that philosophy of urbanism illegal aliens.
In the Europe, it works in different in several different ways.
The big government that's in the cities, they need people
to justify their budgets, to justify all that. So people
(32:34):
have fleed the cities because the jobs aren't there anymore.
So they're importing illegal aliens for crazy you know, from
half a world away into towns like Utica, New York,
which were once great manufacturing towns turned into ghost towns
and now are just filled with these illegal aliens. They're
(32:55):
taking over the you know, the Catholic churches, the Protestant
churches from the immigrants of over one hundred years ago
are not turning into mosques in Utica. And it's this
profound change. It's not the America we knew. And it
is divisive. It is there is division. But my theory is,
get these these these entitled oligarchs. They want division. They
(33:18):
don't want a homogeneity, a common united society, because that
will question them, that will threaten them. The best form
of citizens in a republic is a middle class land owner.
That's that's the best that's the best kind of person
who will defend the republic. The best kind of person
(33:40):
for an urbanite consumerist democracy, which is their favorite word.
It's not a mistake that they keep using that word.
Democracy is someone who owns no land, owns nothing, lives
in a tiny apartment, barely gets by, has no real power,
even though they're very emotional, get worked up about things,
has no real power because there's no community, there's nothing
(34:02):
tying them together. Never really represents a threat to these
people in the upper Cross who just keep making money.
So to me, it's the big industrial farmers, it's the
big corporations, it's the progressive politicians. That's what I say
when I use the term oligarchy in illegal aliens. Whither
they're in business or big government or just leftist progressive radicals,
(34:25):
they all love illegal aliens because it all furthers that
purpose for them.
Speaker 3 (34:32):
So I think it's very interesting what you say about
middle class liners, because let's be clear, it does work.
It's in the shape of pyramid right there there are
more less wealthy people at the bottom, more wealthy people
at the top, and then there's this huge chunk in
the middle. And that's about social mobility, right, And that's
(34:53):
what I think. That's one of the key things of
successful society is that you can move from the work
to the middle class and as you say, become a
landowner yourself, which is it really gives you a stake
in the game, right in a way that even having
children doesn't, because you can always take your children somewhere else,
(35:14):
you know. But once you have state, once you have
land yourself, and you have that level of comfort that
you're not constantly moving around, that's that's how you build community.
It's a group of people who have decided to stay
in one place and they're tied to that land, and
without that you don't have I mean, sure you can say,
(35:34):
and it's very much the identitarian politics aspect of it.
Say you know, you're part of a group, You're you're
part of this ethnic group, you're part of this sexuality group,
you're part of this, this, that or the other. What
insert whatever adjective you want in there. But it's people
caring about the area that they're in because they are
(35:56):
wedded to that area, you know, and that that goes
beyond race, or sexuality or even in many cases religion.
If you are tied to a piece of land and
you have an interest in everybody else keeping their piece
of land as beautiful as you want to keep yours,
and that's what forms great community. But if you're just
(36:20):
bringing in people who have no ties to the land
and they're consuming resources from that land and then can
move somewhere else, I think that's the problem. Right. Do
you end up with a situation where nobody has a
tie to the land and as you say, they own nothing.
This is when you started saying that they own nothing.
(36:43):
They read Yeah, that's the w ef old idea, wasn't
it from about three or four years ago. You'll own
nothing and you'll be happy. I don't know if that
was a suggestion or a warning, but sorry to wrap
this back up again. So what's happening to the middle
(37:03):
classes in America now?
Speaker 5 (37:09):
Well, it's really what we've discussed well, losing they're losing agency,
they're losing power, their their numbers are dwindling. You're seeing
the numbers of have nots growing, which means that you're
going to see dissatisfaction growing. And you know when they
say that Trump, when the progressive left says that Trump
is like the destroyer of the again their word democracy,
(37:32):
you know, Trump is is the the sane solution to
this problem. If we don't solve this problem, it's going
to be a violent solution within violence from left or right. Again,
when when when you have a majority of people feeling
that they are being oppressed by the system that they
are living under, you're not that system is not going
(37:54):
to survive. So when you look at this, I just
strongly their whole they're trying to hold onto something that
is not sustainable. And when we let's get back to
the elite. The hiring illegal aliens as cheap labor is
not sustainable for all the reasons we just discussed. It's
(38:15):
going to destroy the middle class. It's going to lead
to all this satisfaction, it's going to destroy community harmony,
it's going to lead to more crime. All these things,
all these things lead to a less stable system, which
is going to topple the very people who are exploiting
these illegal aliens in the in the pursuit the temporary
pursuit of as much money as possible. If these people
(38:37):
had any vision, any foresight whatsoever, they would realize that,
you know, this is going to redound onto our heads
at the end. And so this has to be solved.
Speaker 3 (38:48):
This problem.
Speaker 5 (38:49):
We can't keep kicking this down the road for another decade.
And so, you know, just deporting a bunch of MS
thirteen members is not going to solve this problem. If
you're a using workers like this, it's not going to
be sustainable. It's going to topple, and you're going to
be toppled. So you know, let's change this country harmoniously
(39:10):
or we're in trouble. It's going to be a lot.
Speaker 3 (39:13):
Lot more Joe Schaefer, thanks very much for joining us.
Thank you, and that's all we have time for on
this week's edition of Liberty Nation radio head Coast to
coast on the Radio America Network. I've been your host,
Mark Angeli's like to take him out to thank our
guests today, Andrew Moran and Joe Schaeffer, thanks for taking
the time to come in and join us here, and
of course i'd like to thank you the listeners at
home who tune in each and every week to join
(39:35):
us on this journey. Please remember, Limited Nation does not
endorse campaigns, candidates, or legislation, and this presentation is no
endorsement
The views and opinions expressed on the following program are
those of the host and guests and do not necessarily
represent those of any organization, including one generation away.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
No that it was free freedom of speech, freedom of religion, freedom.
Speaker 3 (00:14):
Of enterprise, and freedom is special and read.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
This is Liberty Nation with Markangeldes, a production of Libertynation
dot Com, going after what the politicians really mean and
making it all clear for your freedom and your liberty.
Liberty Nation with Markangeledes.
Speaker 3 (00:34):
Hello, Welcome to the Liberty Nation radio head Coast Coast
on the Radio American Network from a flagship station in
the nation's capital, WWRC in Washington, d C. I'm your host,
Marc Antonides on today's special Illegal Immigration edition. We are
talking economics, budgets, employment and society and how they're all
impacted by the floods of people who enter the country illegally.
(00:55):
It's going to be quite the show. Please remember a
Liberty Nation Radio sponsor bylibert Nation dot Com. You can
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find us for the Great American Constitution. And you're on
Liberty Nation Radio head Coast to coast on the Radio
American Network. I'm your host, Mark Andrew. It was very
fortunate to have with us on this immigration extravaganza. Liberty
(01:17):
Nations economics guru, mister Andrew Moran, Thanks for being here,
Andrew val So, Andrew, it's all systems go in terms
of what's happening with immigration. It's an immigration draw down,
some might say, and what we've seen since Trump came
back to office is a I think it's a more
than ninety percent reduction in border crossings. And then of
(01:40):
course he's he's exempted from the privilege of visa's twelve countries,
with a potential thirty six on the way, and the
deportations of those already in the country illegally appears to
be continuing apace, and that has the folks over at Washington,
(02:01):
DC's most prominent news outlet in a bit of a
fuster because they say that the immigration might be the
lowest number or in reverse for the first time in
fifty years. It gives the outline there, Andrew.
Speaker 4 (02:16):
Yeah, you see the numbers, you know, especially on the
labor fort side of things, that the number of immigrant
workers were foreign born workers, according to the Beer of Labors,
has actually been on the decline this year, which has
been which has been notable because for the last few
years you've seen such a divergence between the number of
employed US born workers and the number of employee foreign
born workers, such a wide gap, and it's been a
(02:37):
wide gap since around late twenty nineteen. So it's been
a really significant sign in the in the US labor market.
And one thing was when that was reading this article,
what Kenyan mine is that during during the Biden years,
people were saying, yeah, well, all this, all this job
gains is because of the illegal immigrants. And if you look
at the Beer of Labors to six methodology, they include
(02:59):
illegal immigrants in that foreign born worker metric. So I
think the timing is interesting whereby you have the clearly
collapse of deported of illegal immigrants across on the border
and all these deportations and then you're all seeing a
decline the number of employed foreign born workers. So it's
not just legal immigrants who are getting jobs.
Speaker 3 (03:19):
Yeah, it was. It's one of the the unspoken open
secrets that you know, the job data it accounts for that.
Now that interestingly, there's a recent report out in the
UK that illegal immigration accounts for a huge it's it's
several orders of billion, which in the in the UK
(03:40):
is a lot of money. Not not in America, of course,
but it's a lot of money in the UK. A
part of the the the black market economy which obviously
doesn't pay taxes, and yet it's still counted in the
overall figures, especially when Britain was part of the European Union,
(04:01):
because the remittances to the European Union they counted. Well,
you've got this much of a black market economy as well,
Well we want our cut of that. It was very
much a mafio. So way forward. So with if the
DC's most prominent paper is correct and there's actually going
(04:21):
to be a reverse in the immigration numbers, what does
that mean economically?
Speaker 4 (04:29):
Well, we should we should differentiate between legal and illegal or.
Speaker 3 (04:32):
Well let's let's start with illegal then okay, well.
Speaker 4 (04:35):
Okay, So so what I find funny comical in this
article was it kept seeing how, oh, if we if
we get rid of all these all these illegal immigrants,
then wages are going to climb for all these different
sectors now terrible and they're going to have higher inflation
as we all the all the higher costs that companies
are are going to be, they're going to be more
onto them or we pass on to the customers. Now,
(04:57):
so far, of course, we have we we have yet
to see the inflation from any thing under this administration,
whether from immigration or tariffs. Now it could be a
lag effect, but who knows. Now on the legal side
of it, that is more concerning because if you look
at let's say, the Jolts Report, that's the monthly survey
conducted by the Bureau of Labor Statistics that shows the
number of job vacancies in the United States. This number
(05:20):
has remained elevated. It's still above seven million, is higher
than it was before the coronavirus pandemic. So the ices
does have a labor shortage, and you know, the Chamber
of Commerce regularly publishes a report identifying this problem. Now,
the White House thinks it can reverse this because the
number of working men is really really is they're out
(05:43):
of work, so therefore they can fill this gap. But
the event they've yet to do this over the last
few years. I think the other side of the equation
is more concerning, is the entitlement spending, because if you
have fewer workers in the United States, then of course
there's be fewer people contributing to the Social Security, Medicare
and men as Liberation is reported for years, this thing,
(06:03):
you know, it's it's running out of money. And if
you have let's say two to one, sorry to two workers,
two employed workers for every retiree, that's not a sustainable program.
So you need legal immigrants to come in to help
fill that gap and to sustain these these these programs.
Now that's who knows if that's going to happen or not.
But if LEO immigrants are really falling for what the
(06:25):
media is saying, then yeah, So Americas aren't having babies.
They're not they're not growing in populations, a lot of
it through immigration, which is, you know, you can debate
the merits of that, but the economics of it shows
that you need immigration if you want to keep everything
intact Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid or the other mandatory spending.
Speaker 3 (06:45):
Yes, you pointed that in a recent article on the
the one big beautiful bill that's currently making its way
through the Senate. That and this is an old sore
for Washington Day say, but it doesn't have a revenue problem.
It has a spending problem. I guess until the spending
gets under control, there's no real way to separate immigration
(07:09):
from the overall economic debate, even though in any sensible,
serious country you shouldn't be reliant on foreign workers. I
think otherwise, what kind of a country is that? What's
your take on that? Yet?
Speaker 2 (07:22):
My opinion, fine, in a perfect role, okay, perhaps, but
that doesn't take the fact way that you need you
need legal immigration today's world, because whether where you are
where I am or the United States, the domestic population
is not having children.
Speaker 4 (07:37):
I mean, there was a slight uptick in the United States,
I think it was last year before, but overall it's
been just a steady decline. And the problem with that
is that, fine, the Americans aren't having babies, but politicians
have made it all these grandiose promises and have been
Santa Claus for the last several decades. And now those bills,
those bills are coming due, and so now you're going
to have to immigrate people from India, You're gonna have
(07:58):
to have people come from you know, Australia, whatever the case.
Speaker 3 (08:03):
It's Yeah, However, I find the reality of that situation
is a very it's a very short term solution, isn't it.
Because as people move to for example, the United States,
they tend to adopt the habits and customs, and they
also don't have the same amount of children they may
have had in their their home country, and they end
(08:24):
up with the two point four, one point eight or
one point nine that the rest of the population is having.
And so it's it's like a Ponzi scheme almost. You're
bringing in people because you need more people to pay
into the social securities people get older, but then these
people will also want to have the social security to
(08:44):
medicaid medicare as they get older, and so you have
to bring in more and more. It's it's the world's
most depressing Ponzi scheme. But let's talk about some more
bride sparks on the horizon, potentially for the middle and
working classes. After this short break, don't go anywhere.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
For your freedom and your liberty. Liberty Nation with Mark
Edge of.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
Ladies Andrew back on Liberty Nation Radio, Romainia host Mark
Anthony's and we're continuing our economics talks with economics guru
mister Andrew Moran. Thanks for sticking around Andrew. Now, we
hinted at the big beautiful bill in its progress. Now
at the time of recording, it's it's really only just
come out of the Senate Finance Committee, so there's gonna
(09:39):
there's likely to be changes further within the Senate, and
then of course it's got to go back to the House.
Uh this. I believe there's a self imposed deadline of
July fourth on that, and I know that Mike Johnson's
pretty keen to if necessary, keep people there during congressional recess,
if if he has to, to get it past. But
(09:59):
I want to talk about the rhetoric and the narrative
that surrounds the I hate calling it the one big
beautiful bill, you know, because it might not be one.
It might not be beautiful. It will certainly be big, and
it's definitely a bill, but we'll see what it comes
out like. Although I do appreciate why they're trying to
get it all into one bill, because you know, otherwise,
(10:23):
though everything they want here is going to take years
and it's going to be into the next presidency whoever
that happens to be. So I get why they're doing
it in one bill, but a lot of the critics
of this are calling it, and specifically Bernie Sanders, because
of course he is once again asking you to believe
everything he says and donate your money to him, of course,
(10:46):
but they're saying that it's essentially it's tax cuts for
the rich and nothing more. And that's the dominant narrative
from Capitol Hill on what one side of Capitol Hill
least and the mainstream legacy media. But that's not quite right,
is it, Andrew.
Speaker 4 (11:04):
I will know you're know you're right, But I'll say
one thing is that it's a thousand pages. And I'll
highly doubt anyone in Congress, whether I mean even marjor
Marjorie Taylor Green admitted that, oh I didn't know about
that artificial intelligence provisions.
Speaker 3 (11:16):
That was a page bill.
Speaker 4 (11:17):
But anyway, so yeah, absolutely, So it's as if there's
only one line of text, and it's that there's only
it's only tax us for billionaires, but all the papers
are citing. So for example, there was a recent congressional
hearing House Ways and Means Committee hearing, and I think
his names Richard Neil, he's in Congress with and he
was saying, oh, this is only for tax cuts for billionaires,
(11:38):
he started setting the Joint Committee and Taxation, he started
setting Congressional budsh Office. But if you read those papers,
it says, yes, there's taxes for billionaires, but the average
tax rate for most Americans is actually going down, uh if.
Speaker 3 (11:50):
From there under the proposed law.
Speaker 4 (11:52):
Yeah, so it's not just you know, everyone is gonna
eat crumbs and everyone and the rich are gonna have
zero Pretend time.
Speaker 3 (12:00):
Is the crow that was Nancy Pelosi? Wasn't it talking
about the original twenty seventeen. Yeah, ten years later, this
is exactly. It's almost as if they were given a
report it will be almost ten years ago now, and
they said, right, this is what you're sticking to and
(12:20):
just keep saying it until everybody believes it. You had
a great article on this call that is the one big,
beautiful bill for bidding it as it came out this week,
and you really dove into the very numbers that the
critics are citing and what is it because they're they're
they're citing research, but the research itself doesn't say what
(12:42):
they say it says. So are they just mistaken? Are
they purposely obscating? Are they trying to get away with
the lies damn life statistics thing and hope that enough
obfuscation on the numbers could be brushed over. And most importantly,
I think the question has to be Andrew is why
(13:04):
would those who oppose the bill now sure that there
could be plenty of things to oppose, as you mentioned
Madri Taylor Green and the the AI embargo on AI regulation.
But regarding the tax cuts, for example, tax on tips
and overtime, why is nobody getting behind that? I thought
(13:25):
that was a fairly well why are they trying to
kill that? Because I thought that that would be fair
popular for everybody.
Speaker 4 (13:31):
Right, Well, it was Washington politics, of course. I mean,
of course it's automatically that the one side I was
going to pose this bill, and that's how they have
to market it. So they have to defend their opposition
by claiming that is only for the ultra wealthy, when
of course it's not the case. But you know that
you're absolutely right. So even if you take away the
average tax re declines across the board except for the
(13:54):
lowest number, which is fifteen to thirty thousand dollars Rose
getting tax cuts. But you look at the no tax
on tips, who does a benefit the working class, no
tax overtime? Who has a benefit the working class? The
one thousand dollars bait bonus, which of course I have
a reservation is about. But overall, who does a benefit
the low and middle income households? So you have all
these goodies here that benefit, you know, the typical person.
(14:16):
So there was another one, I think I think it
was Senator Sanders who was saying, oh, but you have
the two hundred and eighty five billion tax breaks for
the two tenths of the top one percent. Okay, fine,
that may be case, but also what about the person's
making eighty one hundred thousand dollars a year of their
tax rates going down from fifteen point four to thirteen
(14:36):
and a half percent. I think it's also worth pointing out, too,
is that we've had this conversation I think a couple
of years ago, and we argued that one of the
worst consequences of inflation is that you're artificially placed into
a higher tax bracket because yes, you're earning more, but
why you're earning more to keep up with inflation. When
you keep up with inflation, your tax rate goes up.
Serve for the games are negligible. So this is all
(14:59):
the side effects of inflations. For this OBBB is perhaps
somewhat correcting that the inflation the crisis of the last
few years.
Speaker 3 (15:08):
Yes, it's uh, I believe my memory is correct. I'm
not just engaged in like a Golden age thinking issue here.
But the under Trump's first term, the economy was rather good.
There were some dark spots, naturally, because there always are,
but for the working the middle passes, it was a
(15:29):
pretty good economy. And then there were four years of
let's be clear on what it is, it was a
pretty terrible economy overall, especially with the inflation. Now we're
at Trumponomics two point zero, and it it's really just
that a correct is it really just trying to replicate
(15:50):
the exact same conditions, I mean, essentially taking the tax
cut jobs that and then making that permanent and then
putting a couple of extras on top or it was
there's something more substantial at player.
Speaker 5 (16:02):
No.
Speaker 4 (16:02):
No, I think you're right. I think the OBB replicates
somewhat of the TCG. I mean, I mean, I think
this is just this is just one aspect of Trumpenomics
two point h. Of course, the mother load is the
whole terror situation and rebalancing global trade and turning the
ICD to a manufacturing prowess and turning everyone else into consumer.
So I think it's just there's only one, one, one,
one flank of Trump.
Speaker 3 (16:25):
You mentioned tariffs there, Andrew, and another great article that
you wrote for libertination dot com was looking for the
elusive inflationary impact or costs on consumers of Trump's attempt to,
I guess, rejig the entire global economy through mean tweets,
(16:47):
which I found quite entertaining. But it's it's turned out
to be elusive, hasn't it The the data that everybody
warned about. Yeah, you know when.
Speaker 4 (16:56):
When Trump announces April second liberation the tariffs, you know,
economis an apoplectic, and they said, oh, you know, we're
gonna have You know, inflation is the spiral out of control.
But so far all the leading index inflation reports, so
that inflation is yet to rear its ugly head. You know,
you have inflation slightly above two percent. You have the
producer price index, which is the measure of the prices
(17:17):
paid for business services by business, and it can serve
as a precursor to future consumer inflation that that's been
very low. It actually fell I think it was in April.
Speaker 5 (17:28):
Uh.
Speaker 4 (17:29):
The important price inflation that inport sorry import export prices,
that's been minimal even go through true inflation. It's a
it's a popular private running estimate of inflation, and it
uses millions of data points, and it's been again it's
been below two percent. Now I was I will note
that that tariffs operate on a leg so who knows.
(17:49):
Maybe the inflation will show up later in the year
when all the INVENTORYX is all the pre April second
inventory is exhausted and they have to start importing again.
So maybe that's when inflation starts appearing. But for now,
prices aren't aren't aren't accelerating. And I think that's perturbing
a lot of Trump's critics because because they were betting
that tariffs will raise inflation and become ugly as biden onyx.
(18:13):
But I will say one thing that you look at
the University of Michigan's Consumer Sentiment Index and you had
that what your inflation out looks saying going as high
as eight percent. But that thing is just created out
because a lot of a lot of the American people
are realizing okay, so in tariffs will not be that bad.
Trade Paulis will not be that bad. So that actually
trimmed their inflation expectations, which I think that that that's
(18:35):
been that's been the most hilarious part of this expectation
because you look at that, you mish and you sat
just a spish. People thought that inflation go to ten percent.
Speaker 3 (18:43):
Yeah, they thought it'd be the same as under Joe Biden.
That that was yeah, that that wasn't what they voted for.
Andrew Moran, thanks ever so much for being with us,
really to appreciate it. No, that's what was free. Freedom
of speech, freedom of religion, freedom.
Speaker 5 (19:04):
Of enterprise, and freedom is special and ate.
Speaker 1 (19:07):
This is Liberty Nation with Markangeldes, a production of Libertynation
dot Com, going after what the politicians really mean and
making it all clear for your freedom and your liberty.
Liberty Nation with Markangeledes.
Speaker 3 (19:24):
And welcome back to Liberty Nation Radio Ramania host Mark Anthony's.
We're continuing our talk on immigration, this time with the
Liberty Nations enterprise reporter mister Joe Schaefer, Kerry Enterprising Joe Shaffer,
Hi Mark to the Enterprising and entertaining Joe Shafer. Thanks
for being on, Joe, really appreciate it. So we've been
(19:46):
talking earlier in the show. We're talking with Andrew Moran
about the economic impacts of first the migration, illegal migration,
and then the end of illegal migration. What economic impacts
that having With you, Joe, I want to kind of
take this a little bit broader and talk about societal impacts,
(20:07):
impacts on the workforce, and the political ramifications of that.
So we've seen a bit of a ferrari this last
week over discussion about going after employers who employ illegal migrants.
What's your take on that.
Speaker 5 (20:25):
Well, in New York Times had an article, I believe
it was a few days earlier before Trump spoke, in
which he said they quoted, you know, top sources in
the administration saying the administration was going to pivot away
from going after farm and hotel illegal alien workers because
(20:46):
they had been receiving low back from the employers. And
you know, it's New York Times. You can never know
if they're if they're actually reporting the truth. They've got
ACTD to wield. But Trump actually came out and made
up public statement authenticating the story, saying that we have
a lot of good people in the farm and hotel
(21:07):
industry that want to lose their good workers. And you know,
he basically said that they've been a pivot away from this,
and you know it's not just anecdotal all or. I
can tell you my friends who support Trump are angry
about this. Trump supporters are going to be angry about this.
They did not elect him just to deport so called
criminal illegal aliens, which is really a drop in the ocean.
(21:29):
They did not just elect him to deport illegal aliens.
They elected him to go after the employers of illegal aliens,
to change this decades long construct that not only has
helped flood the country with illegals, but has hurt the
hurt the wage power of the American worker. So you know,
(21:53):
they want there's real systemic change, and you can't get
real systemic change on immigration without going after the lawyers.
Speaker 3 (22:01):
So it's interesting you bring that up because there was
a report into the Brexit the potential impacts of Brexit
before the before the vote took place, and I believe
it's a chap called Charlie Rose who was doing their report,
and he had this as a negative. He said, wages
(22:24):
would rise because we'd have less immigration come in. And
he was selling this as well, this is a bad
thing because wages would rise for the average Britain and
he was I mean, he was ripped for that and
still does get ripped for it today for saying that
it's a bad thing that wages would rise for the
(22:44):
average Britain. But I guess the point that he was
making was that it's the it's the businesses that have
to pay this this extra rate to get workers. So
back to what the New York Times said, and that
Donald Trump he seemed to confirm, but I'd push back
(23:05):
a little bit on that. He says we're pivoting away
or towards and I think Tom Holman, the borders are
clean this up fairly. Well, I'm not sure. I guess
there's still a lot of trepidation. Are we going to
have we been sold a pup as it were? A
lot of his supports might be saying. But he said
(23:27):
that we're going after, Yes, the employers, We're going after
the people who work in those industries. But he seemed
to be saying that the priority is the ones that
you describe as a drop in the bucket, the violent
illegal alien criminals. And I want to Joe, maybe I'll
play a bit of Devil's advocate here. Is in terms
(23:49):
of damage to the country, society, and the individuals, don't
you think that prioritizing those who have committed violent crimes
in the country should be the priority?
Speaker 5 (24:03):
Right?
Speaker 3 (24:03):
Should shouldn't that be? Wouldn't that limit the greater damage?
Speaker 5 (24:08):
First priority implies that we're going to take care of
them first, and then we're going to take care of
the rest problem. Now, what Trump said suggested to me
that he's not so interested in taking care of the
rest of the problem, and so I'm not going to
let him off the hook care His words very alarming.
Yet Tom Holman said they're still going to go after employers,
(24:28):
so we you know, it's still up in the air,
I guess. But what Donald Trump said, President Donald Trump
said is we have good people on these farms, these
industrial scale farms, who have these good workers. Well, you know,
it's not a good situation on these big farms. It's
an ugly, ugly, scandalous situation. I've written about it several times,
(24:49):
We've talked about it on Liberty Nation before. Abuses to
these illegal alien workers are horrific including rape, death on
the job of children. There was just a case, a
civil lawsuit at Michigan. I wrote about it on June first,
before the outcome. The outcome has now been reached. A
jury found against hiring service. I guess it is for
(25:13):
legal aliens that come from Guatemala via the H two
A visas you know, the pipeline into America. The jury
awarded five hundred thousand dollars in punitive damages for abusing
their illegal alien workforce. And these people were working one
hundred hour weeks, twenty hour workdays, and they were only
being paid sixty out of the one hundred hours. It
(25:35):
came up to about eight dollars an hour. So and
according to the workers, they said that they were threatened
by they were being charged twenty five hundred dollars or
so to go through that pipeline H TWOA pipeline. This
is a course of grotesque abuse of the system charging
twenty five hundred dollars, which is it is not, in
(25:57):
effect is in ventured service to Okay, what you have
to work off your twenty five hundred dollars fee to
the company. It's like the factory store days it is,
so they use that threat against their cheap worker for
us while while they're underpaying them. So you can't tell
me it's a situation where we value our good workers
(26:18):
and our g Americans just don't do this job. This
is malevolent attempt. This is malevolent intent on the employer's parts.
And so for when President Trump says good people, good workers,
he you know it's not true. We all know it's
not true. If you call the subhead I had on
(26:38):
it was a corder hat Leonard Cohen song. Everybody. Everybody knows.
Everybody knows the dice is loaded. Everybody rolls with their
fingers crossed. That what is those It's a great song.
By the way, what does that line mean? Everybody knows,
everybody rolls with their fingers crossed. We all know it's
a rotten system. But they want to to feel like, hey,
(27:01):
when you get lucky anyway, Hey, you can work out
for us when you have societal outcomes that aren't working anymore.
And this is what you're especially seeing in England, which
is on the point of civil war because their societal
outcomes aren't working. Societal outcomes are not working for the
American people on a basic level. And if we want
to go with farms, look at the obesity crisis, look
(27:23):
at the autoimmune crisis. The output of the actual product
that these illegal alien farm workers are producing is corroded cheap,
unhealthy food. So maybe this whole model needs to be
I would say, blown up, but at least we examined.
And this model feeds absolutely feeds on exploited. It exploited
(27:47):
it of cheap labor imported from Central America.
Speaker 3 (27:51):
Yes, the link between illegal alien employment and human trafficking,
I mean it's it's clear, very very clear pipeline. And
it's not something that's just based in the United States,
either from South to North America, but worldwide. People abusing
(28:11):
the visa systems that are in place through disreputable companies
that hire and the care industry is a prime example
of that in the United Kingdom hiring cares from overseas
because they've got the right to bring in as many
cares as they like under the visa proposals, and really
(28:32):
they're just treated appallingly. But of course we're all supposed
to applaud that, but look at all these people coming
into care for our elderly population, and it's a tragedy
on so many levels. We're going to be back with
Joe Schaeffer after the shortbreak. Don't go Anywhere.
Speaker 1 (28:53):
For your freedom and your liberty. Liberty Nation with.
Speaker 3 (28:57):
Mark Edgelities, and you're back with Mark Antelais and Joe
Schaeffer on Liberty Nation Radio. We're continuing our talk on immigration,
illegal immigration or otherwise. Now. Joe, we talked about the
exploited nature of the illegal micros being employed within the
United States workforce. But there's also a societal detriment I
(29:21):
think too, and you know a lot of people on
the left would disagree with this, but there's a societal
detriment to having a lot of illegal immigration within the
city's towns and communities. And we do here all the time.
These people are part of our community. These people are
part of our town our districts, and I don't think
(29:44):
it's actually entirely true. And I quote none other than
the and this is off the top of my head,
so please do forgive me if I get the year
on a two thousand and seven article in the New
York Times that actually look that you know is diversity,
the strength, the strength, and what they found was and
(30:05):
this was this was by a proponent of one of
the major proponents of diversity and you know, increased immigration.
And what they found was that communities with more diversity
were less trusting of each other, even if it was
diversity among people who are from the same place, then
(30:26):
less trusting of each other. They volunteered less, they engaged
civically less, and were generally less hopeful about life. Joe,
your thoughts, Well, it's a.
Speaker 5 (30:41):
Very philosophical question, and actually it's a very good philosophical question. Paul,
give you my philosophical answer. And it ties back to
what we were talking about with the so called good
employers on the industrial farms. And I believe this is
all representative of an oligarchy when people have learned a
(31:01):
lot a lot. Americans have learned a lot about oligarchy
thanks to the Biden administration.
Speaker 3 (31:08):
If I might just interrupt a recent survey, I believe
it was Neapolitan News survey that there's a vas swath
of Americans don't actually know what the word oligarchy means.
And I'm presuming they're the ones that are attending the
Bernie and aoc oligarchy tours. One. Please carry on, No,
(31:30):
it's true.
Speaker 5 (31:30):
But I think that Joe Biden, really they know the
word at all. His administration illustrated it in such a
way that Americans understand now. It is a bunch of
elites who want a society that works best for them,
and they do not care for the middle class. They
see the middle class as an impediment. And what we
(31:51):
are seeing is more elites, more wealthy people, and a
lot more poorkyeople and nothing in between. And that is
the historical recipe for violent, violent evolution. That's how you
get a French revolution in seventeen eighty nine, That's how
(32:12):
you get a Russian revolution in nineteen seventeen. But you know,
temporarily it works great for these people. So you know,
let's go back to that philosophy of urbanism illegal aliens.
In the Europe, it works in different in several different ways.
The big government that's in the cities, they need people
to justify their budgets, to justify all that. So people
(32:34):
have fleed the cities because the jobs aren't there anymore.
So they're importing illegal aliens for crazy you know, from
half a world away into towns like Utica, New York,
which were once great manufacturing towns turned into ghost towns
and now are just filled with these illegal aliens. They're
(32:55):
taking over the you know, the Catholic churches, the Protestant
churches from the immigrants of over one hundred years ago
are not turning into mosques in Utica. And it's this
profound change. It's not the America we knew. And it
is divisive. It is there is division. But my theory is,
get these these these entitled oligarchs. They want division. They
(33:18):
don't want a homogeneity, a common united society, because that
will question them, that will threaten them. The best form
of citizens in a republic is a middle class land owner.
That's that's the best that's the best kind of person
who will defend the republic. The best kind of person
(33:40):
for an urbanite consumerist democracy, which is their favorite word.
It's not a mistake that they keep using that word.
Democracy is someone who owns no land, owns nothing, lives
in a tiny apartment, barely gets by, has no real power,
even though they're very emotional, get worked up about things,
has no real power because there's no community, there's nothing
(34:02):
tying them together. Never really represents a threat to these
people in the upper Cross who just keep making money.
So to me, it's the big industrial farmers, it's the
big corporations, it's the progressive politicians. That's what I say
when I use the term oligarchy in illegal aliens. Whither
they're in business or big government or just leftist progressive radicals,
(34:25):
they all love illegal aliens because it all furthers that
purpose for them.
Speaker 3 (34:32):
So I think it's very interesting what you say about
middle class liners, because let's be clear, it does work.
It's in the shape of pyramid right there there are
more less wealthy people at the bottom, more wealthy people
at the top, and then there's this huge chunk in
the middle. And that's about social mobility, right, And that's
(34:53):
what I think. That's one of the key things of
successful society is that you can move from the work
to the middle class and as you say, become a
landowner yourself, which is it really gives you a stake
in the game, right in a way that even having
children doesn't, because you can always take your children somewhere else,
(35:14):
you know. But once you have state, once you have
land yourself, and you have that level of comfort that
you're not constantly moving around, that's that's how you build community.
It's a group of people who have decided to stay
in one place and they're tied to that land, and
without that you don't have I mean, sure you can say,
(35:34):
and it's very much the identitarian politics aspect of it.
Say you know, you're part of a group, You're you're
part of this ethnic group, you're part of this sexuality group,
you're part of this, this, that or the other. What
insert whatever adjective you want in there. But it's people
caring about the area that they're in because they are
(35:56):
wedded to that area, you know, and that that goes
beyond race, or sexuality or even in many cases religion.
If you are tied to a piece of land and
you have an interest in everybody else keeping their piece
of land as beautiful as you want to keep yours,
and that's what forms great community. But if you're just
(36:20):
bringing in people who have no ties to the land
and they're consuming resources from that land and then can
move somewhere else, I think that's the problem. Right. Do
you end up with a situation where nobody has a
tie to the land and as you say, they own nothing.
This is when you started saying that they own nothing.
(36:43):
They read Yeah, that's the w ef old idea, wasn't
it from about three or four years ago. You'll own
nothing and you'll be happy. I don't know if that
was a suggestion or a warning, but sorry to wrap
this back up again. So what's happening to the middle
(37:03):
classes in America now?
Speaker 5 (37:09):
Well, it's really what we've discussed well, losing they're losing agency,
they're losing power, their their numbers are dwindling. You're seeing
the numbers of have nots growing, which means that you're
going to see dissatisfaction growing. And you know when they
say that Trump, when the progressive left says that Trump
is like the destroyer of the again their word democracy,
(37:32):
you know, Trump is is the the sane solution to
this problem. If we don't solve this problem, it's going
to be a violent solution within violence from left or right. Again,
when when when you have a majority of people feeling
that they are being oppressed by the system that they
are living under, you're not that system is not going
(37:54):
to survive. So when you look at this, I just
strongly their whole they're trying to hold onto something that
is not sustainable. And when we let's get back to
the elite. The hiring illegal aliens as cheap labor is
not sustainable for all the reasons we just discussed. It's
(38:15):
going to destroy the middle class. It's going to lead
to all this satisfaction, it's going to destroy community harmony,
it's going to lead to more crime. All these things,
all these things lead to a less stable system, which
is going to topple the very people who are exploiting
these illegal aliens in the in the pursuit the temporary
pursuit of as much money as possible. If these people
(38:37):
had any vision, any foresight whatsoever, they would realize that,
you know, this is going to redound onto our heads
at the end. And so this has to be solved.
Speaker 3 (38:48):
This problem.
Speaker 5 (38:49):
We can't keep kicking this down the road for another decade.
And so, you know, just deporting a bunch of MS
thirteen members is not going to solve this problem. If
you're a using workers like this, it's not going to
be sustainable. It's going to topple, and you're going to
be toppled. So you know, let's change this country harmoniously
(39:10):
or we're in trouble. It's going to be a lot.
Speaker 3 (39:13):
Lot more Joe Schaefer, thanks very much for joining us.
Thank you, and that's all we have time for on
this week's edition of Liberty Nation radio head Coast to
coast on the Radio America Network. I've been your host,
Mark Angeli's like to take him out to thank our
guests today, Andrew Moran and Joe Schaeffer, thanks for taking
the time to come in and join us here, and
of course i'd like to thank you the listeners at
home who tune in each and every week to join
(39:35):
us on this journey. Please remember, Limited Nation does not
endorse campaigns, candidates, or legislation, and this presentation is no
endorsement
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